1 00:00:01,680 --> 00:00:06,400 Speaker 1: Cool Zone Media. Hello, and welcome to Cool People Who 2 00:00:06,440 --> 00:00:09,200 Speaker 1: Did Cool Stuff. You're a weekly reminder that whenever there's 3 00:00:09,240 --> 00:00:11,720 Speaker 1: bad things happening in the world, there's people trying to do 4 00:00:11,760 --> 00:00:14,480 Speaker 1: good things. And I'm your host, Margaret Kildroy, and this 5 00:00:14,560 --> 00:00:17,640 Speaker 1: week I would also say that this is the podcast 6 00:00:17,680 --> 00:00:21,000 Speaker 1: I record. Well, I have a cold and I'm sleepy 7 00:00:21,239 --> 00:00:23,680 Speaker 1: because I just woke up and I'm about to drive 8 00:00:23,920 --> 00:00:29,760 Speaker 1: for like fourteen hours. But that's okay. And what you 9 00:00:29,840 --> 00:00:34,519 Speaker 1: might have noticed is that it is not Wednesday, but 10 00:00:34,600 --> 00:00:37,199 Speaker 1: in fact Monday. Well it's actually whatever day of the 11 00:00:37,200 --> 00:00:39,400 Speaker 1: week you listen to this, but if you listen to 12 00:00:39,440 --> 00:00:42,000 Speaker 1: it on the day it comes out, it's Monday, not Wednesday. 13 00:00:42,040 --> 00:00:45,400 Speaker 1: And yet I left you recently with a cliffhanger saying 14 00:00:45,400 --> 00:00:48,240 Speaker 1: that I would talk to you on Wednesday, and here 15 00:00:48,320 --> 00:00:54,680 Speaker 1: it is a Monday. And all that is to say, 16 00:00:54,760 --> 00:00:57,360 Speaker 1: this episode came out late, and for that I apologize. 17 00:00:57,640 --> 00:00:59,400 Speaker 1: Some people I care about and had to deal with 18 00:00:59,440 --> 00:01:02,560 Speaker 1: some hard things in rapid secession, and then I went 19 00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:05,479 Speaker 1: and got sick in the middle of that. And everyone 20 00:01:05,560 --> 00:01:08,280 Speaker 1: is as okay as could be given the circumstances. And 21 00:01:08,360 --> 00:01:11,680 Speaker 1: here I am back at work talking into a microphone 22 00:01:12,160 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 1: while sleepy as sick. I'm not supposed to tell you 23 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:19,280 Speaker 1: I'm sleepy. I'm high energy. Welcome to First Thing in 24 00:01:19,280 --> 00:01:22,040 Speaker 1: the Morning with Margaret Kiljoy. I think that's what I'm 25 00:01:22,040 --> 00:01:25,039 Speaker 1: supposed to do. I am telling you the story of 26 00:01:25,080 --> 00:01:28,320 Speaker 1: the alter Globalization movement right now as best as I can, 27 00:01:28,720 --> 00:01:31,640 Speaker 1: and I'll probably start interjecting my own story into it 28 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:35,320 Speaker 1: soon here and there, because, as I've probably said at nauseum, 29 00:01:35,560 --> 00:01:39,640 Speaker 1: this is the movement that radicalized me. Where we last 30 00:01:39,760 --> 00:01:44,080 Speaker 1: left our nameless heroes, they'd built up people's global action 31 00:01:44,319 --> 00:01:47,520 Speaker 1: out of the encounters called for by the Zapatistas. They'd 32 00:01:47,560 --> 00:01:50,360 Speaker 1: had a sort of trailer episode for the alter globalization 33 00:01:50,440 --> 00:01:54,360 Speaker 1: movement in London with the Carnival against Capitalism. Then, as 34 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:57,000 Speaker 1: we covered in some earlier episodes, the big entrance to 35 00:01:57,040 --> 00:02:00,160 Speaker 1: the global stage happened in November nineteen ninety nine, the 36 00:02:00,160 --> 00:02:05,560 Speaker 1: famed Battle of Seattle, which happened in well, you guessed it, Seattle. 37 00:02:06,320 --> 00:02:10,520 Speaker 1: After Seattle, activists were like, oh, fuck, yeah, okay, let's 38 00:02:10,560 --> 00:02:13,320 Speaker 1: do the next big thing. And the answer to what 39 00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:16,760 Speaker 1: the next big thing was was that the International Monetary 40 00:02:16,800 --> 00:02:19,880 Speaker 1: Fund and the World Bank were meeting in April two 41 00:02:19,960 --> 00:02:24,560 Speaker 1: thousand in Washington, DC. And I have talked a lot 42 00:02:24,600 --> 00:02:27,400 Speaker 1: about the IMF and the World Bank on this show 43 00:02:27,639 --> 00:02:31,040 Speaker 1: a couple months ago during my home Why Neoliberalism Is 44 00:02:31,120 --> 00:02:35,119 Speaker 1: Bad episodes. But the shortest version is that the IMF 45 00:02:35,160 --> 00:02:38,640 Speaker 1: and the World Bank are very very similar institutions that 46 00:02:38,720 --> 00:02:43,560 Speaker 1: both lend money at predatory rates to developing countries, and basically, 47 00:02:43,560 --> 00:02:47,320 Speaker 1: after they loan you some money, they demand that those 48 00:02:47,360 --> 00:02:52,960 Speaker 1: countries adopt structural adjustment programs, which got the environmental legislation 49 00:02:53,040 --> 00:02:55,760 Speaker 1: and labor rights of those countries in order for those 50 00:02:55,800 --> 00:02:59,040 Speaker 1: countries to repay the interest on those loans. And it 51 00:02:59,120 --> 00:03:03,720 Speaker 1: basically traps into predatory situations and takes all of the 52 00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:05,560 Speaker 1: money from the poor people and gives it to the 53 00:03:05,639 --> 00:03:08,040 Speaker 1: rich people, and just does all of the things that 54 00:03:08,080 --> 00:03:13,000 Speaker 1: capitalism does, but just at like this wild frantic pace. 55 00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:17,120 Speaker 1: It's kind of like if an entire country borrowed money 56 00:03:17,120 --> 00:03:20,200 Speaker 1: from organized crime and then the mafia was like, all right, 57 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:23,079 Speaker 1: now you're going to restructure your entire life to pay 58 00:03:23,200 --> 00:03:26,360 Speaker 1: us back. Like if you've ever seen a crime movie 59 00:03:26,440 --> 00:03:29,079 Speaker 1: where the crime man is stuck doing the dirty work 60 00:03:29,080 --> 00:03:31,520 Speaker 1: for the bosses because he owes them more money than 61 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:34,440 Speaker 1: he can ever earn back. Oh, what was the recent one. 62 00:03:35,040 --> 00:03:39,280 Speaker 1: There's a really good Pedro Pescal killing Nazis movie that 63 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:42,320 Speaker 1: came out recently that was super kind of indie that 64 00:03:42,800 --> 00:03:45,280 Speaker 1: I think got into this stuff. Unless I'm getting my 65 00:03:45,320 --> 00:03:51,000 Speaker 1: movies mixed up, which happens more than I would like anyway. Okay, 66 00:03:51,080 --> 00:03:53,280 Speaker 1: So a movie like that, crime man is stuck doing 67 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 1: the dirty work for the bosses because he owes them 68 00:03:55,840 --> 00:03:58,840 Speaker 1: money that he can ever pay back. That is what 69 00:03:58,880 --> 00:04:02,160 Speaker 1: the IMF in the World Bank or up to, at 70 00:04:02,240 --> 00:04:06,920 Speaker 1: least according to the activist position, the ANTIIMF and World 71 00:04:06,920 --> 00:04:09,440 Speaker 1: Bank position, which is a position that I think is 72 00:04:09,480 --> 00:04:13,840 Speaker 1: a reasonable analysis of the situation. So the IMF and 73 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:16,880 Speaker 1: the World Bank were meeting up in DC and protesters 74 00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:21,360 Speaker 1: were like, well, we were already planning. Like I was 75 00:04:21,480 --> 00:04:23,839 Speaker 1: going to say, like after Seattle, they were like, what's next, 76 00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:25,919 Speaker 1: and they would go and do this thing. And that's true, 77 00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:29,520 Speaker 1: but they were already planning this as well, and they 78 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:31,800 Speaker 1: were like, all right, we're going to do this thing 79 00:04:31,839 --> 00:04:35,760 Speaker 1: in April after Seattle. It just that after Seattle there 80 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:39,640 Speaker 1: was just so so much more energy for that to happen, 81 00:04:39,760 --> 00:04:44,400 Speaker 1: so much more inertia because people had actually protested the 82 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:48,160 Speaker 1: IMF meetings in DC the year before, actually the day 83 00:04:48,400 --> 00:04:51,480 Speaker 1: of that Carnival against Capitalism that we talked about a 84 00:04:51,520 --> 00:04:54,640 Speaker 1: couple weeks ago, that was a much bigger deal in London. 85 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:57,320 Speaker 1: And the reason we didn't talk about the DC version 86 00:04:57,360 --> 00:05:00,960 Speaker 1: of it is that it was like fifty people holding 87 00:05:01,080 --> 00:05:04,600 Speaker 1: signs and marching around and they briefly tried to get 88 00:05:04,640 --> 00:05:09,760 Speaker 1: into the street. And I mean, those protests happen every 89 00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:13,120 Speaker 1: single day all over the world, and we don't usually 90 00:05:13,160 --> 00:05:17,920 Speaker 1: cover them. Sorry, fifty person protests. I certainly have organized 91 00:05:17,960 --> 00:05:21,640 Speaker 1: more than my share of those, but they don't get 92 00:05:21,640 --> 00:05:25,040 Speaker 1: cool people did cool stuff episodes. Although that said, fifty 93 00:05:25,080 --> 00:05:28,240 Speaker 1: people can accomplish an awful lot. It's just when you're 94 00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:31,240 Speaker 1: at the like, you know, I wish this was a 95 00:05:31,279 --> 00:05:34,120 Speaker 1: bigger protest stage. You're usually not getting that much done. 96 00:05:35,640 --> 00:05:38,360 Speaker 1: But that I'd been nineteen ninety nine. Now it's a 97 00:05:38,440 --> 00:05:42,839 Speaker 1: new millennium. It is the year two thousand. Oh my god, 98 00:05:42,880 --> 00:05:45,080 Speaker 1: do you remember when people argued about whether it was 99 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:46,880 Speaker 1: two thousand or two thousand and one that was the 100 00:05:46,880 --> 00:05:50,800 Speaker 1: new millennium? What a terrible argument I have. My position. 101 00:05:51,600 --> 00:05:54,320 Speaker 1: My position is that Pluto is a planet, and bronosauruses 102 00:05:54,320 --> 00:05:57,640 Speaker 1: are real, and the year two thousand is the new 103 00:05:57,680 --> 00:06:02,200 Speaker 1: millennium because the number changed, it is the year two thousand. 104 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:05,839 Speaker 1: It is the new millennium. And the wind is at 105 00:06:05,920 --> 00:06:10,320 Speaker 1: their back. Their collective back momentum was with them. The 106 00:06:10,520 --> 00:06:15,040 Speaker 1: organizers were organized. The way that you make these protests 107 00:06:15,120 --> 00:06:18,160 Speaker 1: happen is you don't just say, like, show up in DC, 108 00:06:18,360 --> 00:06:23,960 Speaker 1: let's go, everyone will just magically self organize. Calling for 109 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:28,159 Speaker 1: a protest and then being like it'll just work is 110 00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:34,880 Speaker 1: like that magical thinking where some people of some genders 111 00:06:35,880 --> 00:06:38,760 Speaker 1: think that the dishes just wash themselves, or that the 112 00:06:38,800 --> 00:06:42,600 Speaker 1: stuff that they leave on the coffee table just disappears. No, 113 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:50,719 Speaker 1: it takes work. Organizing is work. Also, you can't just 114 00:06:50,960 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 1: organize a protest based on the idea of everyone should 115 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:57,480 Speaker 1: just make fun signs and wear silly hats and show up. 116 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:00,280 Speaker 1: I mean you can, and you can get numb Muer's 117 00:07:00,279 --> 00:07:05,480 Speaker 1: that with that, you just can't change anything by doing that. 118 00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:10,360 Speaker 1: That's not how change works. You have to organize protests 119 00:07:11,080 --> 00:07:19,600 Speaker 1: that are disruptive. That's the idea of protests. So the 120 00:07:19,760 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 1: organizers organized, They organized their asses off the protests were 121 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:26,640 Speaker 1: the result of spokes council meetings, which we talked about before. 122 00:07:26,680 --> 00:07:28,640 Speaker 1: It's where one person you have a big group and 123 00:07:28,680 --> 00:07:31,880 Speaker 1: you send one person to a spokes council to go 124 00:07:31,920 --> 00:07:34,920 Speaker 1: and make decisions collectively and or just share information and 125 00:07:35,280 --> 00:07:38,160 Speaker 1: come back and report back. The protests were the result 126 00:07:38,200 --> 00:07:41,360 Speaker 1: of spokes council meetings all over the country to determine 127 00:07:41,400 --> 00:07:45,520 Speaker 1: tactics and messaging and to coordinate everything. And they were 128 00:07:45,600 --> 00:07:49,240 Speaker 1: drawing upon a long legacy of activism. We're going to 129 00:07:49,280 --> 00:07:52,520 Speaker 1: talk about that in a second part of how the 130 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:56,920 Speaker 1: movement spread, This Ulter globalization movement, Oh, I most did it. 131 00:07:57,400 --> 00:08:00,160 Speaker 1: I grew up calling it the anti globalization movement. I 132 00:08:00,200 --> 00:08:03,600 Speaker 1: just understand and retrospect why that was bad framing that 133 00:08:03,640 --> 00:08:05,920 Speaker 1: the media gave us and we probably shouldn't have embraced. 134 00:08:07,560 --> 00:08:10,240 Speaker 1: Part of how this movement spread is that anyone who 135 00:08:10,240 --> 00:08:13,280 Speaker 1: went to Seattle from this or that town, they would 136 00:08:13,360 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 1: go home and do a report back event. You know. 137 00:08:16,080 --> 00:08:18,320 Speaker 1: It was hard to get people out to Seattle, right, 138 00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:20,760 Speaker 1: and so you have big groups like DC. You had 139 00:08:20,760 --> 00:08:22,880 Speaker 1: this affinity group that was like, all right, we're sending 140 00:08:22,880 --> 00:08:28,000 Speaker 1: one person to Seattle, you know, but maybe you're from Toledo, 141 00:08:28,240 --> 00:08:31,000 Speaker 1: and you're like, all right, I went to Seattle and 142 00:08:31,040 --> 00:08:33,080 Speaker 1: you didn't get sent as part of an affinity group, 143 00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:35,560 Speaker 1: but you just like got your shit together, got on 144 00:08:35,600 --> 00:08:37,760 Speaker 1: a bus or a plane or whatever. I went to Seattle. 145 00:08:38,320 --> 00:08:41,839 Speaker 1: You come back and you just give a report back. 146 00:08:42,280 --> 00:08:45,920 Speaker 1: You put an event together, a physical, in person event, 147 00:08:46,640 --> 00:08:49,520 Speaker 1: and this is a model we should bring back. Someone 148 00:08:49,559 --> 00:08:53,240 Speaker 1: will just go and explain their experiences and this or 149 00:08:53,280 --> 00:08:56,840 Speaker 1: that social movement that happened elsewhere in a report back. 150 00:08:57,160 --> 00:09:00,960 Speaker 1: You don't have to be the anarchist speaker or whatever. 151 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:03,600 Speaker 1: You know, you don't have to be some special person. 152 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:06,600 Speaker 1: You just need to have done a thing and then 153 00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:08,679 Speaker 1: want to tell your friends about it. I mean, it's 154 00:09:08,720 --> 00:09:11,120 Speaker 1: the equivalent of like when the people would go on 155 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:15,240 Speaker 1: vacation and have put together slide shows in there. Maybe 156 00:09:15,280 --> 00:09:17,640 Speaker 1: you all are old enough to remember people doing that, 157 00:09:18,440 --> 00:09:20,719 Speaker 1: Maybe you're not. That's the thing people used to do. 158 00:09:22,720 --> 00:09:26,600 Speaker 1: I remember, early on in my activism, I was in 159 00:09:26,640 --> 00:09:29,760 Speaker 1: Portland and I went to this report back at the 160 00:09:29,800 --> 00:09:32,760 Speaker 1: Red and Black Cafe, just an anarchist cafe. You can 161 00:09:32,800 --> 00:09:35,840 Speaker 1: probably guess by the name where some American anarchists had 162 00:09:35,840 --> 00:09:38,839 Speaker 1: spent the summer squatting in Barcelona, and what is that 163 00:09:38,920 --> 00:09:43,440 Speaker 1: other than their vacation trip, right, But they came back 164 00:09:43,679 --> 00:09:48,520 Speaker 1: with photos and did a presentation discussing all the tactics 165 00:09:48,559 --> 00:09:53,760 Speaker 1: that people used there, and this just helps create an 166 00:09:53,760 --> 00:09:57,880 Speaker 1: international culture. If you're sitting somewhere in Portland, you haven't 167 00:09:57,920 --> 00:10:00,200 Speaker 1: left the country as an adult or maybe at all, 168 00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:04,200 Speaker 1: and someone is just saying to you, like, hey, this 169 00:10:04,280 --> 00:10:09,480 Speaker 1: is what our comrades are doing in Chile, this is 170 00:10:09,520 --> 00:10:12,880 Speaker 1: what our comrades are doing in Japan. You know that 171 00:10:13,040 --> 00:10:17,200 Speaker 1: is a good thing to do. And so yeah, after Seattle, 172 00:10:17,679 --> 00:10:20,000 Speaker 1: lots of people who couldn't go to Seattle went and 173 00:10:20,080 --> 00:10:22,719 Speaker 1: saw people from their own towns talk about what they 174 00:10:22,760 --> 00:10:26,680 Speaker 1: saw there and tell their stories and to just break 175 00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:30,679 Speaker 1: the idea of I don't know that you need to 176 00:10:30,720 --> 00:10:34,560 Speaker 1: be someone special to go do that. I hate to 177 00:10:34,559 --> 00:10:36,920 Speaker 1: get in my rocking chair and talk shit, but this 178 00:10:37,120 --> 00:10:40,360 Speaker 1: was probably a more effective recruitment tactic than just posting 179 00:10:40,360 --> 00:10:42,960 Speaker 1: about what you've done to Instagram. But do you know 180 00:10:43,000 --> 00:10:49,240 Speaker 1: what else is more effective than Instagram? Podcast ads? I 181 00:10:49,280 --> 00:10:52,360 Speaker 1: suspect they're more effective than Instagram ads. Actually I don't 182 00:10:52,360 --> 00:10:54,320 Speaker 1: know if that's true. Both of them are probably effective 183 00:10:54,600 --> 00:10:57,160 Speaker 1: what I usually do with Instagram ads. They're very good 184 00:10:57,200 --> 00:10:58,960 Speaker 1: at showing me things that it looked like the things 185 00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:01,080 Speaker 1: that I want to buy, and then I just google 186 00:11:01,120 --> 00:11:03,160 Speaker 1: that product plus Reddit and then I read the Reddit 187 00:11:03,200 --> 00:11:05,720 Speaker 1: reviews where they're like, that's a fake product, this is garbage. 188 00:11:05,800 --> 00:11:07,960 Speaker 1: Don't buy that weird dress. And then I don't buy 189 00:11:08,000 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 1: the weird dress, and then I don't have the articles 190 00:11:10,760 --> 00:11:13,320 Speaker 1: of my clothing in my closet that are left over 191 00:11:13,440 --> 00:11:16,680 Speaker 1: from before I did that that I never wear. But 192 00:11:17,640 --> 00:11:26,080 Speaker 1: here's our ads and we're back, okay. Although the ultra 193 00:11:26,160 --> 00:11:30,360 Speaker 1: globalization movement itself was very international and people were coming 194 00:11:30,400 --> 00:11:33,480 Speaker 1: from all over and it's spread all over the place, 195 00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:36,600 Speaker 1: and I'm sure I will be doing episodes specifically talking 196 00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:39,520 Speaker 1: about like the South Korean farmers and all of these 197 00:11:39,520 --> 00:11:43,360 Speaker 1: movements that were happening elsewhere in the world. Each local 198 00:11:43,520 --> 00:11:47,720 Speaker 1: area had its own protest culture. You throw a protest 199 00:11:47,760 --> 00:11:50,800 Speaker 1: in Seattle, you're going to get the Seattle people on 200 00:11:50,840 --> 00:11:53,640 Speaker 1: some level and the West Coast people on some level, right, 201 00:11:54,000 --> 00:11:57,880 Speaker 1: which means you're going to get fucking environmentalists. I say this, 202 00:11:57,920 --> 00:11:59,319 Speaker 1: I mean spent a lot of time as a West 203 00:11:59,320 --> 00:12:03,600 Speaker 1: Coast environment the East Coast activists came from a slightly 204 00:12:03,640 --> 00:12:08,240 Speaker 1: different lineage. Folks were coming out of all sorts of campaigns, 205 00:12:08,920 --> 00:12:11,960 Speaker 1: like the anti apartheid movement that was pushing countries to 206 00:12:12,120 --> 00:12:16,800 Speaker 1: divest from apartheid South Africa. The support movement for Leonard 207 00:12:16,840 --> 00:12:19,679 Speaker 1: Peltier was a big part of it. Leonard Peltier is 208 00:12:19,679 --> 00:12:22,319 Speaker 1: an American Indian movement activist we've talked about on this 209 00:12:22,440 --> 00:12:28,120 Speaker 1: show who spent decades upon decades in prison and as 210 00:12:28,120 --> 00:12:31,800 Speaker 1: a result of being accused of shooting and killing a 211 00:12:31,840 --> 00:12:36,200 Speaker 1: federal agent who was rating a reservation. Even though other 212 00:12:36,240 --> 00:12:39,080 Speaker 1: people admitted to doing that crime and got off on 213 00:12:39,120 --> 00:12:42,720 Speaker 1: self defense, he spent most of his life in prison 214 00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:46,280 Speaker 1: and that's not great, and so people were trying to 215 00:12:46,280 --> 00:12:49,880 Speaker 1: work to support him. There was also the support movement 216 00:12:49,920 --> 00:12:53,440 Speaker 1: for Mumia Abu Jamal we haven't covered on this show yet. 217 00:12:53,440 --> 00:12:55,319 Speaker 1: He's on the cover of people I will be talking 218 00:12:55,360 --> 00:12:59,160 Speaker 1: about on this show. Mumiya is a black journalist who 219 00:12:59,160 --> 00:13:01,680 Speaker 1: has been in prison since nineteen eighty two and he 220 00:13:01,720 --> 00:13:04,520 Speaker 1: spent much of that time on death row. His sentence 221 00:13:04,559 --> 00:13:08,000 Speaker 1: was later changed to life without parole. He's convicted of 222 00:13:08,080 --> 00:13:11,000 Speaker 1: killing a cop in Philly, a cop who had shot 223 00:13:11,080 --> 00:13:15,240 Speaker 1: him and nearly killed him. And this is another moment 224 00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:17,280 Speaker 1: of a black man being in prison for the crime 225 00:13:17,320 --> 00:13:20,760 Speaker 1: of refusing to die. He also maintains his innocence that 226 00:13:20,800 --> 00:13:24,320 Speaker 1: he didn't shoot that police officer at all, and that's 227 00:13:24,320 --> 00:13:28,040 Speaker 1: completely possible, and you know what, I would be supporting 228 00:13:28,080 --> 00:13:30,960 Speaker 1: him either way. It's okay for people to refuse to 229 00:13:31,040 --> 00:13:35,599 Speaker 1: die when the state wants to kill you. His supporters 230 00:13:35,640 --> 00:13:38,760 Speaker 1: generally argue that the reason he was framed was that 231 00:13:39,720 --> 00:13:42,440 Speaker 1: he worked as a journalist who investigated the police, and 232 00:13:42,480 --> 00:13:46,240 Speaker 1: in particular he was associated with the move movement in Philly, 233 00:13:46,240 --> 00:13:48,280 Speaker 1: which is a whole different story I need to tell 234 00:13:48,320 --> 00:13:50,679 Speaker 1: you one day. But if you ever think to yourself, 235 00:13:51,240 --> 00:13:54,000 Speaker 1: I wonder if the police have ever firebombed a neighborhood 236 00:13:54,040 --> 00:13:57,120 Speaker 1: in the US from a helicopter, destroying sixty five houses 237 00:13:57,400 --> 00:13:59,679 Speaker 1: just because of some Black power activists and killed a 238 00:13:59,679 --> 00:14:03,199 Speaker 1: lot of children in a way that is oddly reminiscent 239 00:14:03,200 --> 00:14:06,000 Speaker 1: of the Waco Siege, yet doesn't get talked about because 240 00:14:06,040 --> 00:14:10,120 Speaker 1: it wasn't right wing white people. The answer is yes, 241 00:14:10,559 --> 00:14:12,800 Speaker 1: and you should look up the move bombing of nineteen 242 00:14:12,840 --> 00:14:15,320 Speaker 1: eighty five if you want to be angry at the government. 243 00:14:16,200 --> 00:14:20,640 Speaker 1: Mumiya supported those folks. He supported them before the bombing. 244 00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:23,720 Speaker 1: They were being targeted a lot before the bombing as well. 245 00:14:24,240 --> 00:14:27,680 Speaker 1: Mumia was in prison the time of up. The reason 246 00:14:27,680 --> 00:14:30,560 Speaker 1: that Mumia was moved from death row and given life 247 00:14:30,560 --> 00:14:35,040 Speaker 1: in prison was that there was and is a massive 248 00:14:35,120 --> 00:14:39,240 Speaker 1: movement supporting him, a movement that has continued for decades. 249 00:14:39,920 --> 00:14:43,600 Speaker 1: For example, in nineteen ninety five, when the execution timeline 250 00:14:43,680 --> 00:14:47,120 Speaker 1: was moved up to kill Mumia sooner, protests kicked off 251 00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:52,240 Speaker 1: across the country, and Mumia protests were often spicy affairs, 252 00:14:52,720 --> 00:14:56,440 Speaker 1: as are frankly most protest parches that accomplish anything. There 253 00:14:56,480 --> 00:14:58,920 Speaker 1: was a torchlit march and I think San Francisco, but 254 00:14:58,960 --> 00:15:00,560 Speaker 1: it might have been the East Bay. I have somehow 255 00:15:00,600 --> 00:15:03,240 Speaker 1: moved between the two. I just read both and whatever. 256 00:15:04,720 --> 00:15:07,120 Speaker 1: There was a torchlit march in nineteen ninety five where 257 00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:10,000 Speaker 1: people barricaded the streets and all these folks from food 258 00:15:10,080 --> 00:15:12,640 Speaker 1: out bombs and the Chicano Youth Center. I think often 259 00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:15,360 Speaker 1: the same people were fighting against cops who are throwing 260 00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:19,120 Speaker 1: concussion grenades and all that shit. In nineteen ninety nine, 261 00:15:19,160 --> 00:15:22,040 Speaker 1: on April twenty fourth, there was a millions from Mamea March, 262 00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:24,440 Speaker 1: one of the first black bloc protests in the US, 263 00:15:25,000 --> 00:15:28,080 Speaker 1: and a lot of East Coast activists were coming out 264 00:15:28,080 --> 00:15:31,120 Speaker 1: of support for Mameia for support for move for support 265 00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:34,760 Speaker 1: for the American Indian movement, the anti apartheid movement, and 266 00:15:34,800 --> 00:15:38,720 Speaker 1: they also came out of punk. We've talked a lot 267 00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:42,400 Speaker 1: about the anarcho punk movement in the UK, especially when 268 00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:45,960 Speaker 1: we talked about bands like Crass and Tumbawamba and how 269 00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:49,200 Speaker 1: that movement was an actual counterculture and how it had 270 00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:52,880 Speaker 1: actual real world impacts on the political and cultural landscape 271 00:15:52,920 --> 00:15:56,000 Speaker 1: of England and the world. And we've talked a little 272 00:15:56,040 --> 00:15:58,320 Speaker 1: bit about punk in the US during the eighties. You 273 00:15:58,320 --> 00:16:01,040 Speaker 1: can go back and listen to our episodes about Anti 274 00:16:01,200 --> 00:16:05,000 Speaker 1: Racist Action, which was the group that kind of dealt 275 00:16:05,200 --> 00:16:08,880 Speaker 1: successfully dealt with the Nazi punk problem. But we haven't 276 00:16:08,920 --> 00:16:13,440 Speaker 1: talked as much about US punk and politics yet more broadly, 277 00:16:14,880 --> 00:16:17,240 Speaker 1: and it'll probably get its own episodes. But I'm gonna 278 00:16:17,280 --> 00:16:21,880 Speaker 1: do a little side quest real quick. Hardcore punk, which 279 00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:23,880 Speaker 1: is not just people who are really into punk, but 280 00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:27,960 Speaker 1: a specific subgenre of punk that I frankly don't like 281 00:16:28,000 --> 00:16:30,440 Speaker 1: as much as the other subgenres. I feel really bad. 282 00:16:30,600 --> 00:16:33,840 Speaker 1: I have this friend who's a singer of a hardcore band, 283 00:16:34,440 --> 00:16:37,320 Speaker 1: and at one point he was like, Magpie, do you 284 00:16:37,400 --> 00:16:40,200 Speaker 1: like my band? And I was like, it's all right, 285 00:16:40,280 --> 00:16:42,560 Speaker 1: but I don't really like hardcore all that much. And 286 00:16:42,600 --> 00:16:44,240 Speaker 1: he looks at me and he goes, well, what don't 287 00:16:44,280 --> 00:16:47,080 Speaker 1: you like about hardcore? And I looked at him and 288 00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:50,080 Speaker 1: I decided to be honest, and I was like, the vocals. 289 00:16:50,120 --> 00:16:52,840 Speaker 1: I don't like the vocals. This is not a way 290 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:55,000 Speaker 1: to endear yourself to your friend who's the vocalist of 291 00:16:55,000 --> 00:16:59,040 Speaker 1: a hardcore band. I have since learned, Sorry, my friend, 292 00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:02,720 Speaker 1: if you're listening, I actually like your band. I just 293 00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:08,040 Speaker 1: am not a huge hardcore fan. Whatever. Hardcore in many 294 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:10,200 Speaker 1: ways developed. A lot of it comes out of DC, 295 00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:13,879 Speaker 1: and hardcore is a cool and interesting scene. It has 296 00:17:13,880 --> 00:17:18,639 Speaker 1: always been very political. One source I use all the 297 00:17:18,720 --> 00:17:21,720 Speaker 1: time on this show, including this week, is the anarchist 298 00:17:21,760 --> 00:17:24,960 Speaker 1: news and analysis group crime Think, who've been around since 299 00:17:25,000 --> 00:17:28,720 Speaker 1: the nineties, and they're closely fafiliated with the anarchist hardcore scene, 300 00:17:28,840 --> 00:17:32,399 Speaker 1: especially in their early development. Because that's the thing is 301 00:17:32,440 --> 00:17:38,160 Speaker 1: that punk was among the other was among the groups 302 00:17:38,640 --> 00:17:43,440 Speaker 1: that kept anarchism and certain types of anti authoritarian leftism 303 00:17:43,680 --> 00:17:47,960 Speaker 1: alive during a period when not as many groups were 304 00:17:48,000 --> 00:17:52,400 Speaker 1: keeping that alive. Anyway, I just saw the Crime Think 305 00:17:52,480 --> 00:17:55,040 Speaker 1: published band Catharsis play a show like two weeks ago, 306 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:59,000 Speaker 1: and they have such good political banter. They're up there 307 00:17:59,000 --> 00:18:01,560 Speaker 1: reminding everyone that the point of the music isn't just 308 00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:05,159 Speaker 1: emotional release, which is ironic to their name Catharsis, but 309 00:18:05,280 --> 00:18:07,640 Speaker 1: to build community with one another so that people can 310 00:18:07,680 --> 00:18:11,320 Speaker 1: work together to challenge the police and the state. It's 311 00:18:11,400 --> 00:18:14,400 Speaker 1: good shit, and they have a new album out and 312 00:18:14,560 --> 00:18:16,760 Speaker 1: I actually really like their new music. I take it 313 00:18:16,800 --> 00:18:20,560 Speaker 1: all back. I'm a fan anyway. Hardcore punk has a 314 00:18:20,560 --> 00:18:23,119 Speaker 1: fuck ton of roots in DC, especially in the eighties 315 00:18:23,119 --> 00:18:26,679 Speaker 1: and nineties. Straight edge culture comes out of hardcore punk. 316 00:18:27,240 --> 00:18:30,880 Speaker 1: You've got Minor Threat and there's Fugazi and shit who 317 00:18:30,880 --> 00:18:33,919 Speaker 1: are like always keeping it real about making sure that 318 00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:36,720 Speaker 1: music is anti capitalist, and you've got a bunch of 319 00:18:36,720 --> 00:18:40,480 Speaker 1: people doing activism in DC built around hardcore punk and 320 00:18:40,520 --> 00:18:45,639 Speaker 1: also Riot Girl under the banner positive Force. I think 321 00:18:45,680 --> 00:18:47,720 Speaker 1: this is where posi punk comes from, but I'm not 322 00:18:47,760 --> 00:18:53,280 Speaker 1: sure which is like punk but positive. I'm such a hater. 323 00:18:53,840 --> 00:18:57,840 Speaker 1: I'm so sorry everyone. It's not a political judgment at all. 324 00:18:57,920 --> 00:19:00,560 Speaker 1: I'm just a weird old goth and I used to 325 00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:04,800 Speaker 1: be a young, weird goth. I once went to a 326 00:19:04,800 --> 00:19:07,639 Speaker 1: Positive Youth fest in DC and felt ancient when I 327 00:19:07,640 --> 00:19:09,840 Speaker 1: was like twenty four and there were people giving each 328 00:19:09,840 --> 00:19:13,520 Speaker 1: other jumping double high fives in the pit, and that's 329 00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:16,240 Speaker 1: actually really cool. It was a cool thing to witness. 330 00:19:16,280 --> 00:19:17,560 Speaker 1: I just didn't feel like I was part of it. 331 00:19:17,600 --> 00:19:20,320 Speaker 1: I feel a little outside of when I was twenty four, 332 00:19:20,359 --> 00:19:24,119 Speaker 1: I was feeling a little outside of POSI life. Positive 333 00:19:24,119 --> 00:19:27,680 Speaker 1: Force threw punk shows that were all ages and sober, 334 00:19:28,000 --> 00:19:31,720 Speaker 1: and every show was a fundraiser for anarchists and progressive causes. 335 00:19:32,480 --> 00:19:36,120 Speaker 1: All sorts of bands, famous and forgotten alike played Positive 336 00:19:36,160 --> 00:19:40,720 Speaker 1: Force fundraisers. Fugazi headlined like fifty shows for them, Bikini 337 00:19:40,800 --> 00:19:43,800 Speaker 1: Killed played shows for them, Dave Grohl played shows for 338 00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:46,959 Speaker 1: them before his Nirvana era. And you'll be proud of 339 00:19:47,000 --> 00:19:49,439 Speaker 1: me for not doing a long aside here about my 340 00:19:49,520 --> 00:19:54,160 Speaker 1: theory that Kurt Cobain was an anarchist and probably well, 341 00:19:54,200 --> 00:19:58,800 Speaker 1: I hate to transvestigate super hard, I just like Kurt. 342 00:20:01,280 --> 00:20:03,600 Speaker 1: Positive Force was also a big part of the riot 343 00:20:03,600 --> 00:20:05,639 Speaker 1: girl scene. Like mostly it gets talked about from a 344 00:20:05,640 --> 00:20:07,560 Speaker 1: hardcore scene point of view, but a lot of the 345 00:20:07,640 --> 00:20:10,679 Speaker 1: idea of women being like, no, we're going to do 346 00:20:10,720 --> 00:20:14,040 Speaker 1: some separate organizing within this larger structure, and you're just 347 00:20:14,080 --> 00:20:16,359 Speaker 1: going to put up with that, which was an important 348 00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:21,720 Speaker 1: part of social movements. A lot of that comes out 349 00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:24,120 Speaker 1: of the riot girl scene, and some of it comes 350 00:20:24,119 --> 00:20:28,120 Speaker 1: out of Positive Force. So you've got these people throwing shows, 351 00:20:28,160 --> 00:20:31,200 Speaker 1: and at all these shows, people are talking about political issues. 352 00:20:31,400 --> 00:20:34,879 Speaker 1: There's free literature everywhere, and it radicalized just a ton 353 00:20:34,920 --> 00:20:38,080 Speaker 1: of people. As of ten years ago. I read an 354 00:20:38,160 --> 00:20:41,840 Speaker 1: article from twenty fifteen. The Collective is still around, though 355 00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:43,960 Speaker 1: they were gentrified out of their collective house in the 356 00:20:44,040 --> 00:20:48,680 Speaker 1: year two thousand. Anyway, Positive Force was a big part 357 00:20:48,680 --> 00:20:51,000 Speaker 1: of the DC organizing scene as well. So you have 358 00:20:51,040 --> 00:20:55,520 Speaker 1: this like really positive take on punk and anarchism. And 359 00:20:55,600 --> 00:20:59,000 Speaker 1: I think that that I'm now conjecturing, I'm now doing original, 360 00:20:59,680 --> 00:21:03,840 Speaker 1: not really search putting together my own dots. I think 361 00:21:03,880 --> 00:21:06,600 Speaker 1: the fact that it's this positive punk scene is a 362 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:11,400 Speaker 1: big part about why well the Black Block in particular 363 00:21:11,440 --> 00:21:14,080 Speaker 1: behave the way it did during DC. And I don't 364 00:21:14,119 --> 00:21:19,600 Speaker 1: know that that's I'm just guessing now. One youth that 365 00:21:19,720 --> 00:21:23,880 Speaker 1: Positive Force did not recruit was a young Margaret Killjoy. 366 00:21:24,280 --> 00:21:26,880 Speaker 1: I grew up roughly in the DC area. I don't 367 00:21:26,880 --> 00:21:29,359 Speaker 1: want to say too much more specifically than that, because 368 00:21:29,480 --> 00:21:34,080 Speaker 1: they all are parasocial. Sometimes I love you Sometimes. I 369 00:21:34,160 --> 00:21:37,239 Speaker 1: didn't go to these protests because they sounded sort of 370 00:21:38,160 --> 00:21:41,320 Speaker 1: nonsensical to me based on what I'd seen in the media. 371 00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:44,080 Speaker 1: This is not speaking well of me this particular part. 372 00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:47,680 Speaker 1: What didn't help me is that the most radical kid 373 00:21:47,680 --> 00:21:51,199 Speaker 1: in my friend group, who blasted rage against the machine 374 00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:54,480 Speaker 1: all the time, his mom worked for the IMF, and 375 00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:57,760 Speaker 1: he told us that the IMF was good. Actually, so 376 00:21:57,800 --> 00:22:01,320 Speaker 1: I didn't go to the A sixteen protests. The main 377 00:22:01,440 --> 00:22:05,040 Speaker 1: group organizing the A sixteen protests have I mentioned that 378 00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:08,800 Speaker 1: I hate this method of naming protests enough, Yet they 379 00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:11,160 Speaker 1: were to happen on April sixteenth, so they were called 380 00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:15,040 Speaker 1: A sixteen in a long lineage of naming method that 381 00:22:15,080 --> 00:22:19,440 Speaker 1: annoys Margaret. The main organizing group was this coalition called 382 00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:23,679 Speaker 1: Mobilization for Global Justice. It was a big coalition, not 383 00:22:23,760 --> 00:22:27,320 Speaker 1: a single group, and it brought together unions, NGOs and 384 00:22:27,480 --> 00:22:34,199 Speaker 1: scrappier more DIY and anarchic activists. There was understandably a 385 00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:37,760 Speaker 1: tension between these groups, but sometimes that tension is what 386 00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:43,040 Speaker 1: produced the most beautiful results. You've got the dropout anarchists 387 00:22:43,240 --> 00:22:46,320 Speaker 1: who are sometimes some of them are the summit hoppers 388 00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:49,720 Speaker 1: who would like ride freight trains and live in squats 389 00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:53,440 Speaker 1: and eat out of dumpsters and do a ton of organizing. 390 00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:56,639 Speaker 1: They weren't just there for a good time. The idea 391 00:22:56,680 --> 00:22:59,440 Speaker 1: is that you don't need a full time job if 392 00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:03,240 Speaker 1: you eat and live outside, so you can dedicate yourself 393 00:23:03,280 --> 00:23:08,760 Speaker 1: to unpaid activism. This is in contrast to the professional 394 00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:12,760 Speaker 1: activists who worked for NGOs and would fly to protests 395 00:23:12,800 --> 00:23:16,720 Speaker 1: and collect a paycheck for organizing. And both sides of 396 00:23:16,760 --> 00:23:20,800 Speaker 1: this debate or way of living whatever they sometimes got 397 00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:23,200 Speaker 1: along and sometimes thought the other was full of shit. 398 00:23:23,880 --> 00:23:28,159 Speaker 1: The professional activists were called helicopter activists or swoopers for 399 00:23:28,240 --> 00:23:31,960 Speaker 1: showing up from California or wherever and telling locals how 400 00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:37,040 Speaker 1: to do things. There was endless critiques of the traveler kids, 401 00:23:37,080 --> 00:23:39,720 Speaker 1: the broke ones, the summit hoppers, and how they would 402 00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:44,119 Speaker 1: drain local resources and not give enough back. I have 403 00:23:44,240 --> 00:23:47,239 Speaker 1: a lot of thoughts about this dichotomy but mostly I 404 00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:50,120 Speaker 1: think that discourse and its consequences have been a disaster 405 00:23:50,240 --> 00:23:53,080 Speaker 1: for the human race. I think that people just do 406 00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:55,640 Speaker 1: things differently, and it's okay to be critical of each other, 407 00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:59,359 Speaker 1: but it's also better to figure out what our mutual 408 00:23:59,400 --> 00:24:03,960 Speaker 1: strengths are and how we can encourage each other to 409 00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:08,800 Speaker 1: play to our strengths Together. All these disparate activists put 410 00:24:08,840 --> 00:24:12,200 Speaker 1: on trainings and recruited people and did consensus based organizing 411 00:24:12,240 --> 00:24:15,160 Speaker 1: across the country to bring people together to shut down 412 00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:18,439 Speaker 1: the IMF and the World Bank. They called for a 413 00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:21,320 Speaker 1: whole week of protests. Another reason that calling at a 414 00:24:21,400 --> 00:24:23,639 Speaker 1: sixteen is nonsensical is that it was a whole week, 415 00:24:24,040 --> 00:24:26,200 Speaker 1: and more or less they were like, all right, let's 416 00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:28,720 Speaker 1: do what worked in Seattle, you know, specifically this idea 417 00:24:28,760 --> 00:24:33,320 Speaker 1: of organizing where everyone was going to break into affinity 418 00:24:33,359 --> 00:24:35,920 Speaker 1: groups that were going to organize into clusters and people 419 00:24:35,960 --> 00:24:38,600 Speaker 1: would pick different intersections and things like that to shut 420 00:24:38,600 --> 00:24:41,880 Speaker 1: down the IMF. From a grand strategy point of view, 421 00:24:41,920 --> 00:24:45,160 Speaker 1: these protests were very successful. From the immediate strategy point 422 00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:47,720 Speaker 1: of view of shutting down the IMF meeting, they were 423 00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:52,720 Speaker 1: not as successful. Activists did another newspaper rap where you 424 00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:55,439 Speaker 1: print up a fake front page of a newspaper and 425 00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:57,560 Speaker 1: then go around and put it on the newspapers and 426 00:24:57,600 --> 00:24:59,879 Speaker 1: the boxes and the stands. They did this at like 427 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:03,000 Speaker 1: four in the morning one night, probably dozens of people 428 00:25:03,119 --> 00:25:06,640 Speaker 1: I don't actually know, because they wrapped twenty thousand copies 429 00:25:06,640 --> 00:25:10,320 Speaker 1: of the Washington Post to talk about the IMF. Crews 430 00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:14,000 Speaker 1: went out night after night to wheat paste anti IMF 431 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:17,520 Speaker 1: flyers all over town. And this is a good example 432 00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:20,480 Speaker 1: of the solidarity between NGOs and the scrappy air activists 433 00:25:20,880 --> 00:25:23,800 Speaker 1: because the material costs for these things was paid for 434 00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:27,480 Speaker 1: by someone who presumably had an organization's funds behind them, 435 00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:31,160 Speaker 1: but probably not all of the people doing this were 436 00:25:31,240 --> 00:25:36,159 Speaker 1: professional activists. Folks set up a convergence center with a 437 00:25:36,200 --> 00:25:40,200 Speaker 1: garage area for giant puppet assembly. See our episodes about 438 00:25:40,200 --> 00:25:44,399 Speaker 1: bread and Puppet for lots about giant puppets. Churches opened 439 00:25:44,440 --> 00:25:47,200 Speaker 1: up their doors for protesters to sleep on the floor. 440 00:25:47,320 --> 00:25:50,479 Speaker 1: This is another thing that people are like. There's always 441 00:25:50,480 --> 00:25:54,720 Speaker 1: been solidarity between religious activists and non religious activists, at 442 00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:57,439 Speaker 1: least as long as I've been involved in anything, and 443 00:25:57,480 --> 00:26:00,199 Speaker 1: that gets forgotten about all the time I've slept on 444 00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:05,760 Speaker 1: some church floors. Marching bands showed up. Radical cheerleading squads 445 00:26:05,800 --> 00:26:09,119 Speaker 1: were there with pom poms and cheers. Food not Bombs 446 00:26:09,119 --> 00:26:12,160 Speaker 1: set up a flying brigade passing out food from shopping 447 00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:16,240 Speaker 1: carts to protesters. Indie media was there, The National Lawyer's 448 00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:19,400 Speaker 1: Guild was there. Everyone we've been talking about was there. Everyone, 449 00:26:19,520 --> 00:26:21,840 Speaker 1: but Margaret, I don't have FOMO. I don't know what 450 00:26:21,880 --> 00:26:25,840 Speaker 1: you're talking about. On Saturday, April fifteenth, the day before 451 00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:29,400 Speaker 1: the big day of action, police shut down the Convergon Space. 452 00:26:29,920 --> 00:26:33,840 Speaker 1: They also arrested. Look, I read a report that says 453 00:26:33,880 --> 00:26:37,760 Speaker 1: they arrested thirteen hundred and fifty people that day on 454 00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:40,639 Speaker 1: the fifteenth, in a rain of tear gas and pepper spray. 455 00:26:41,119 --> 00:26:43,520 Speaker 1: But I suspect that's conflating with the next day. They 456 00:26:43,560 --> 00:26:47,439 Speaker 1: certainly arrested a bunch of people on the fifteenth. I 457 00:26:47,520 --> 00:26:51,000 Speaker 1: just couldn't tell you about the numbers on the level 458 00:26:51,000 --> 00:26:52,920 Speaker 1: of research that I was able to do this week. 459 00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:57,200 Speaker 1: But yeah, they came and they shut down the Conversion space. 460 00:26:58,040 --> 00:27:00,680 Speaker 1: But you know what, the cops can't shut down. In fact, 461 00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:02,679 Speaker 1: you know what, the cops don't even want to shut 462 00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:09,119 Speaker 1: down advertising. That's right. Advertising. This podcast is brought to 463 00:27:09,160 --> 00:27:19,639 Speaker 1: you by advertising, and we're back. So this still didn't 464 00:27:19,640 --> 00:27:23,080 Speaker 1: stop the protests. All of these arrests as more people 465 00:27:23,119 --> 00:27:26,119 Speaker 1: flooded into the city for the big day. Not me. 466 00:27:26,960 --> 00:27:29,080 Speaker 1: I went into the city that day, but I went 467 00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:32,960 Speaker 1: to go to a youth pride festival that was entirely unrelated, 468 00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:35,359 Speaker 1: And while I was on the subway, a woman dressed 469 00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:37,119 Speaker 1: up like a fairy asked me if me and my 470 00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:40,560 Speaker 1: friends were going to the protests against the IMF. I asked, 471 00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:44,040 Speaker 1: what's the IMF and she said basically, they loan money 472 00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:48,919 Speaker 1: to developing countries and it's bad. And I was like, yeah, whatever, lady. 473 00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:52,080 Speaker 1: It took me two more years before I joined the movement. 474 00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:54,919 Speaker 1: This is not actually the person dressed up like a 475 00:27:54,960 --> 00:27:58,199 Speaker 1: fairy's fault, but she probably could have had her talking 476 00:27:58,240 --> 00:28:02,600 Speaker 1: points down a little better. I've probably met her since. 477 00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:05,639 Speaker 1: If you're listening person dressed up like a fairy at 478 00:28:05,680 --> 00:28:08,040 Speaker 1: a sixteen who tried to convince some kids on the subway. 479 00:28:08,800 --> 00:28:16,000 Speaker 1: Sorry anyway, twenty thousand people were there, at least tons 480 00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:19,480 Speaker 1: of people locked down in intersections, once again hoping to 481 00:28:19,480 --> 00:28:22,480 Speaker 1: shut down enough of DC to prevent the meetings from happening. Again. 482 00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:25,840 Speaker 1: This wasn't as successful this time from that point of view. 483 00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:29,560 Speaker 1: After getting their asses kicked in Seattle, people wore more 484 00:28:29,720 --> 00:28:34,160 Speaker 1: padding and armor. I read one story about a protester 485 00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:37,680 Speaker 1: getting his junk run over by a police scooter and 486 00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:41,040 Speaker 1: the reason that his junk survived as he was wearing 487 00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:45,440 Speaker 1: a cup. Critical mass was there, which are bike protesters. 488 00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:48,240 Speaker 1: They were kind of everywhere. Many of them were arrested 489 00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:52,040 Speaker 1: for riding bikes on city streets. Comms teams went around 490 00:28:52,080 --> 00:28:55,800 Speaker 1: with year two thousand era cell phones and lots of radios, 491 00:28:55,840 --> 00:28:59,920 Speaker 1: helping everyone know what was happening. And the Black Block 492 00:29:00,120 --> 00:29:04,200 Speaker 1: picked a different tactic this time. Rather than roving to 493 00:29:04,280 --> 00:29:07,320 Speaker 1: break things while the police were sort of busy elsewhere, 494 00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:11,760 Speaker 1: they kind of inverted that idea. A spokes council of 495 00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:15,400 Speaker 1: several hundred Black Block folks agreed that the block would 496 00:29:15,440 --> 00:29:19,040 Speaker 1: work more actively in solidarity with the lockdowns. They would 497 00:29:19,040 --> 00:29:22,200 Speaker 1: look to draw police away from the more vulnerable people. 498 00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:27,040 Speaker 1: To quote one lockdowner, Leela from an oral history that 499 00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:28,880 Speaker 1: I'll link to in the show notes put together by 500 00:29:28,880 --> 00:29:34,320 Speaker 1: Crime Think quote, I'd seen police violence previously, and I'm 501 00:29:34,320 --> 00:29:37,560 Speaker 1: familiar with police violence that's worse than this but I'd 502 00:29:37,600 --> 00:29:40,360 Speaker 1: never before seen police walk into a crowd of people 503 00:29:40,400 --> 00:29:44,600 Speaker 1: and slug people like that, just with abandon. The Black 504 00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:47,440 Speaker 1: Block came at that moment when blood was streaming down 505 00:29:47,480 --> 00:29:51,959 Speaker 1: people's faces and essentially pushed the police out of our intersection. 506 00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:55,720 Speaker 1: They were just this wall of bodies that pushed them 507 00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:59,360 Speaker 1: out and saved our intersection from any further police abuse. 508 00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:03,000 Speaker 1: I've forever been grateful to that Black Block for hearing 509 00:30:03,080 --> 00:30:05,920 Speaker 1: on the walkie talkies that we needed help and coming 510 00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:10,120 Speaker 1: so powerfully to our aid. And I think about that 511 00:30:10,200 --> 00:30:12,400 Speaker 1: all the time. I think about the sort of heroic 512 00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:16,840 Speaker 1: mode of the Black Block, and I think about, well, 513 00:30:17,120 --> 00:30:21,320 Speaker 1: nothing gets to me more than moments of solidarity like this. 514 00:30:22,320 --> 00:30:25,000 Speaker 1: You're thinking, Margaret, can you turn this into a Lord 515 00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:28,360 Speaker 1: of the Rings reference? I can. I think of the 516 00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:33,080 Speaker 1: Ride of the Rohim when the people of Rohan come 517 00:30:33,160 --> 00:30:35,920 Speaker 1: to Gondor in their moment of aid. That's what I 518 00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:40,720 Speaker 1: think about. And the Block, instead of being on horseback 519 00:30:40,960 --> 00:30:45,480 Speaker 1: with swords, they were like behind entire chain link fences. 520 00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:48,200 Speaker 1: There's photos of this. They went to a construction site 521 00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:50,560 Speaker 1: and they pulled up these like huge chunks of chain 522 00:30:50,600 --> 00:30:53,880 Speaker 1: link fence and we're just charging police lines to push 523 00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:58,040 Speaker 1: them back. A participant talked about their strategy that they 524 00:30:58,040 --> 00:31:00,000 Speaker 1: didn't want to do what they'd done in Seattle again, 525 00:31:00,200 --> 00:31:04,400 Speaker 1: but that also quote, we're not going to get voluntarily arrested, 526 00:31:05,240 --> 00:31:06,960 Speaker 1: or we're not going to sit in the street while 527 00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:09,640 Speaker 1: they put pepper spray in her eyes. We are going 528 00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:13,880 Speaker 1: to fight back against police abuse if needed end quote. 529 00:31:14,560 --> 00:31:17,280 Speaker 1: The strategy of shutting down the meeting didn't work, not 530 00:31:17,320 --> 00:31:20,440 Speaker 1: like it had in Seattle. Most people realized that early 531 00:31:20,480 --> 00:31:22,440 Speaker 1: on that it wasn't going to work, but decided they 532 00:31:22,440 --> 00:31:24,840 Speaker 1: were going to make such a fuss that the whole 533 00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:27,760 Speaker 1: thing would draw endless attention to the IMF and its horrors, 534 00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:31,120 Speaker 1: and people did block delegates wherever they could, and again, 535 00:31:31,240 --> 00:31:34,480 Speaker 1: on a grand strategy level, this was a very successful protest. 536 00:31:35,160 --> 00:31:38,320 Speaker 1: The police just attacked wherever and however they wanted, just 537 00:31:38,400 --> 00:31:41,040 Speaker 1: wading in and smashing people in the face with batons 538 00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:44,360 Speaker 1: and shit. They ran people over with police scooters, and 539 00:31:44,400 --> 00:31:47,680 Speaker 1: the street medics had their work cut out for them. 540 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:51,920 Speaker 1: Many of the lockdowns and many intersections lasted all day. 541 00:31:52,760 --> 00:31:54,200 Speaker 1: At the end of the day, the way that they 542 00:31:54,360 --> 00:31:56,800 Speaker 1: got the lock boxes out and then disappeared into the 543 00:31:56,800 --> 00:31:59,920 Speaker 1: crowd to not get arrested. Was that when a mark 544 00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:02,040 Speaker 1: came by with like giant banners and puppets and shit, 545 00:32:02,080 --> 00:32:04,040 Speaker 1: they were like, hey, come over here, and then they 546 00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:07,760 Speaker 1: like kind of disassembled everything and smuggled it out in 547 00:32:07,840 --> 00:32:12,360 Speaker 1: the crowd. And that's pretty cool. And the police actually 548 00:32:12,360 --> 00:32:14,280 Speaker 1: did most of the work to shut down DC. That's 549 00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:15,920 Speaker 1: the other thing is like some people shut down a 550 00:32:15,920 --> 00:32:19,840 Speaker 1: few intersections, the police shut down way way more of DC. 551 00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:25,400 Speaker 1: Around twelve hundred people were arrested, or thousands of people 552 00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:27,840 Speaker 1: are arrested, or thirteen hundred and fifty people were arrested 553 00:32:27,840 --> 00:32:30,680 Speaker 1: on a fifteen alone. I don't know, and I'm really 554 00:32:30,680 --> 00:32:32,440 Speaker 1: annoyed that I don't know, because this is the kind 555 00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:35,920 Speaker 1: of information I used to track about every single protest 556 00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:39,120 Speaker 1: because my brain works a certain way. A lot of 557 00:32:39,120 --> 00:32:42,000 Speaker 1: people were arrested, at least twelve hundred. That's the lowest 558 00:32:42,080 --> 00:32:44,720 Speaker 1: number I've seen. Thousands. It is another number I've seen. 559 00:32:45,920 --> 00:32:49,160 Speaker 1: The Legal Peaceful Labor March at Loane had four hundred 560 00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:52,640 Speaker 1: arrests at it. A group called the Midnight Special Legal 561 00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:57,440 Speaker 1: Collective stayed in DC to help everyone out, and activists 562 00:32:57,560 --> 00:33:00,680 Speaker 1: camped outside the jail for four or five days in 563 00:33:00,720 --> 00:33:04,160 Speaker 1: the pouring April rain, hiding under tarps. This is actually 564 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:06,800 Speaker 1: also a very effective strategy, as if they mass arrest 565 00:33:06,840 --> 00:33:09,200 Speaker 1: your friends as you just camp outside the jail, it 566 00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:12,680 Speaker 1: puts a ton of pressure on the state to get 567 00:33:12,760 --> 00:33:18,080 Speaker 1: those people out sooner. As for what people faced in prison, 568 00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:22,920 Speaker 1: one group of prisoners wrote quote, we were denied contact 569 00:33:22,920 --> 00:33:25,720 Speaker 1: with our lawyers for consecutive periods of more than thirty 570 00:33:25,760 --> 00:33:28,959 Speaker 1: hours at a time, left handcuffed and shackled for up 571 00:33:28,960 --> 00:33:32,160 Speaker 1: to eight hours, moved up to ten times from holding 572 00:33:32,200 --> 00:33:35,280 Speaker 1: cell to holding cell. Many of us were denied food 573 00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:38,239 Speaker 1: for more than thirty hours and denied water for up 574 00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:40,720 Speaker 1: to ten hours at a time, though many of us 575 00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:44,480 Speaker 1: were soaking wet after Monday's protest, we were refused dry 576 00:33:44,560 --> 00:33:48,480 Speaker 1: clothing and left shackled and shivering on very cold floors 577 00:33:48,840 --> 00:33:51,440 Speaker 1: for no apparent reasons. Some of us were physically attacked 578 00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:55,000 Speaker 1: by US marshals. We were forcefully thrown up against the wall, 579 00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:58,360 Speaker 1: pepper sprayed directly in the face, or thrown on the 580 00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:01,960 Speaker 1: floor and beaten. At least two individuals were forced against 581 00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:06,440 Speaker 1: the wall by their necks and strangulation holds. About one 582 00:34:06,520 --> 00:34:09,880 Speaker 1: hundred and fifty of the arrested people practice jail solidarity, 583 00:34:10,000 --> 00:34:13,440 Speaker 1: which is where you refuse to identify yourself, which helped 584 00:34:13,480 --> 00:34:16,440 Speaker 1: force the state to drop everyone's misdemeanors to a five 585 00:34:16,560 --> 00:34:20,560 Speaker 1: dollars violation. Basically, you make certain demands like we're not 586 00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:24,240 Speaker 1: going to give you our names until you know, treat 587 00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:26,799 Speaker 1: us the following way, and don't single people out, and 588 00:34:26,800 --> 00:34:31,680 Speaker 1: all this kind of stuff. And these arrests, when I 589 00:34:31,800 --> 00:34:35,000 Speaker 1: say that they were unlawful, we know that because six 590 00:34:35,160 --> 00:34:38,400 Speaker 1: hundred and eighty people eventually won a lawsuit for about 591 00:34:38,440 --> 00:34:43,319 Speaker 1: thirteen million dollars against DC cops for illegal arrests. There's 592 00:34:43,320 --> 00:34:45,800 Speaker 1: an awful lot of people I know who own houses 593 00:34:45,840 --> 00:34:50,520 Speaker 1: in the Rust Belt because of their settlements from alter 594 00:34:50,600 --> 00:34:54,920 Speaker 1: globalization RA protests. Not me. I lost my lawsuit, but 595 00:34:54,960 --> 00:34:58,919 Speaker 1: I'll talk about that some other time. And so, yeah, 596 00:34:59,400 --> 00:35:02,000 Speaker 1: Seattle was a big coming out party for the movement, 597 00:35:02,400 --> 00:35:06,120 Speaker 1: but April sixteenth brought in so so many more people 598 00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:10,560 Speaker 1: and it opened up new conversations. Before Seattle, everyone had 599 00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:13,320 Speaker 1: assumed that nonviolence was the only way to do things. 600 00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:17,360 Speaker 1: But as the movement kicked in and people saw people 601 00:35:17,719 --> 00:35:20,880 Speaker 1: push the police back from peaceful protesters by wielding a 602 00:35:20,960 --> 00:35:25,560 Speaker 1: chain link fence. People started thinking about things differently, and 603 00:35:25,640 --> 00:35:30,200 Speaker 1: the global movement was also you know global. And as 604 00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:33,840 Speaker 1: for what happened next, I'll talk about that soon, but 605 00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:36,800 Speaker 1: for now I'll talk about this isn't a pivot to ads, 606 00:35:36,880 --> 00:35:38,520 Speaker 1: although there is always the ads at the end of 607 00:35:38,520 --> 00:35:41,040 Speaker 1: the show, which is honestly why sometimes I stopped listening 608 00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:43,719 Speaker 1: during the plugs. But you shouldn't. You should listen to 609 00:35:43,760 --> 00:35:46,040 Speaker 1: my plugs. They're like mini ads, but they're for me. 610 00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:49,160 Speaker 1: I have a substack. I talk about a lot of stuff. 611 00:35:49,200 --> 00:35:51,879 Speaker 1: On my substack. I often talk more about the things 612 00:35:51,880 --> 00:35:56,520 Speaker 1: that I'm talking about on this show, and like just recently, 613 00:35:56,640 --> 00:36:01,319 Speaker 1: I posted one about how I've quote de escalate all 614 00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:03,960 Speaker 1: conflict that isn't with the enemy that I really believe in, 615 00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:06,759 Speaker 1: and it gets misused a lot, and I get sad 616 00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:08,879 Speaker 1: about that, and so I talk about some of its 617 00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:11,759 Speaker 1: misuse and what counts as the enemy. So if you 618 00:36:11,800 --> 00:36:14,400 Speaker 1: want to know who Margaret Kiljoy defines as an enemy, 619 00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:16,239 Speaker 1: you're gonna have to go over to my substack. And 620 00:36:16,280 --> 00:36:18,759 Speaker 1: the answer is a little bit that it should be 621 00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:23,920 Speaker 1: fewer people, and sometimes it's not because I'm grouching anyway, 622 00:36:24,360 --> 00:36:26,399 Speaker 1: I'll talk to you all soon, and I hope you're 623 00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:31,600 Speaker 1: doing as well as you can. Bye. Cool People Who 624 00:36:31,640 --> 00:36:34,160 Speaker 1: Did Cool Stuff is a production of Cool Zone Media. 625 00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:37,360 Speaker 1: The more podcasts and Cool Zone Media, visit our website 626 00:36:37,480 --> 00:36:40,560 Speaker 1: Foalzonemedia dot com, or check us out on the far 627 00:36:40,640 --> 00:36:44,400 Speaker 1: Medio app, pp A Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.