1 00:00:06,400 --> 00:00:06,840 Speaker 1: Pushkin. 2 00:00:13,920 --> 00:00:21,040 Speaker 2: My name is Margaret Lambert. I was born a name 3 00:00:21,160 --> 00:00:24,840 Speaker 2: that I hate, Gretel it's too Teutonic. I hate that 4 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:30,720 Speaker 2: name and Gretel Bergmann. And I was born i Bohn twelfth, 5 00:00:30,800 --> 00:00:34,680 Speaker 2: nineteen fourteen in a very small town in the south 6 00:00:34,720 --> 00:00:38,760 Speaker 2: of Germany. And it was a great life. 7 00:00:39,000 --> 00:00:42,360 Speaker 3: In nineteen ninety six, Margaret Lambert sat down for an 8 00:00:42,360 --> 00:00:46,800 Speaker 3: interview with the United States Holocaust Memorial Museum. She was 9 00:00:46,840 --> 00:00:50,000 Speaker 3: eighty two years old. She looked at least fifteen years younger. 10 00:00:50,760 --> 00:00:53,199 Speaker 3: Being an Olympic level athlete will do that to you. 11 00:00:54,040 --> 00:00:56,880 Speaker 3: She started out talking about her childhood in a little 12 00:00:56,920 --> 00:00:59,000 Speaker 3: German town called Laupim. 13 00:00:59,320 --> 00:01:04,800 Speaker 2: That was this club in that town. You just went there. 14 00:01:04,880 --> 00:01:08,160 Speaker 2: I could go there and unescorted because it was close 15 00:01:08,200 --> 00:01:10,839 Speaker 2: to my house. And I'm as happy as a lark. 16 00:01:11,319 --> 00:01:15,240 Speaker 2: What did you like about sports? I just loved it, 17 00:01:15,959 --> 00:01:17,520 Speaker 2: and you were good at it, and that was good 18 00:01:17,560 --> 00:01:21,000 Speaker 2: at it. There was nothing different at that stage about 19 00:01:21,040 --> 00:01:24,040 Speaker 2: being a Jewish athlete, none whatsoever. 20 00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:27,960 Speaker 3: By the nineteen thirties, Lambert's sport of choice was the 21 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:31,759 Speaker 3: high jump, one of the more graceful Olympic sports. You've 22 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:34,120 Speaker 3: probably seen it. It's the one where the jumper runs 23 00:01:34,200 --> 00:01:37,560 Speaker 3: up to an impossibly high bar and then rises effortlessly 24 00:01:37,640 --> 00:01:38,040 Speaker 3: above it. 25 00:01:39,640 --> 00:01:42,720 Speaker 2: Great success in it thanks to my long legs and 26 00:01:42,880 --> 00:01:44,520 Speaker 2: my big feet, I suppose. 27 00:01:45,240 --> 00:01:47,760 Speaker 3: In nineteen thirty three, the year Hitler came to power, 28 00:01:48,000 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 3: she jumped a little higher than one and a half 29 00:01:50,040 --> 00:01:53,560 Speaker 3: meters that's like four feet and nine inches. It was 30 00:01:53,600 --> 00:01:57,040 Speaker 3: one of the highest jumps in the country. She would 31 00:01:57,040 --> 00:01:58,840 Speaker 3: be a shoe in for the German Olympic team. 32 00:01:59,600 --> 00:02:04,800 Speaker 2: Except once Hitler became chancellor. You started to worry a 33 00:02:04,840 --> 00:02:08,920 Speaker 2: little bit, you know, But everybody thought this is going 34 00:02:08,960 --> 00:02:11,160 Speaker 2: to blow over. He's not going to last. 35 00:02:12,160 --> 00:02:14,960 Speaker 3: But it soon became very clear that this was not 36 00:02:15,040 --> 00:02:19,120 Speaker 3: going to blow over. Four days after becoming chancellor, Hitler 37 00:02:19,200 --> 00:02:22,800 Speaker 3: was already censoring the press. Things developed quickly from there, 38 00:02:23,040 --> 00:02:26,160 Speaker 3: and then later that year Lambert got a letter from 39 00:02:26,160 --> 00:02:27,000 Speaker 3: her sports club. 40 00:02:29,720 --> 00:02:35,320 Speaker 2: You are no longer welcome here because you're Jewish, hil Hitler, 41 00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:37,600 Speaker 2: and that was the end of that. So they just 42 00:02:37,639 --> 00:02:41,480 Speaker 2: threw me out of the club and everybody commiserated, you know, 43 00:02:41,560 --> 00:02:43,760 Speaker 2: what are we going to do? What's going to happen here? 44 00:02:43,880 --> 00:02:46,399 Speaker 2: And it was a horrible life. 45 00:02:47,200 --> 00:02:50,679 Speaker 3: But there was still one way that Margaret Lambert might 46 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:53,040 Speaker 3: have a chance to compete at the nineteen thirty six 47 00:02:53,080 --> 00:02:56,680 Speaker 3: Olympic Games. The chance that had a lot to do 48 00:02:56,960 --> 00:03:03,600 Speaker 3: with one man, Avery. 49 00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:09,920 Speaker 1: Welcome to Revisionist History, my show about things overlooked and misunderstood. 50 00:03:10,440 --> 00:03:14,399 Speaker 1: I'm Malcolm Gladwell. Today on the show, Ben the daf 51 00:03:14,440 --> 00:03:18,080 Speaker 1: Haffrey and I are back with Avery Brundage, the apostle 52 00:03:18,200 --> 00:03:22,280 Speaker 1: of Olympia, the kingpin of cognitive dissonance, the man who 53 00:03:22,320 --> 00:03:27,200 Speaker 1: made the modern Olympic Games happen. Brundage believed above all 54 00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:32,360 Speaker 1: in the values of the Olympic religion, amateurism, total equality 55 00:03:32,360 --> 00:03:37,280 Speaker 1: of opportunity, the only true meritocracy. Brundage wanted to become 56 00:03:37,320 --> 00:03:40,480 Speaker 1: an Olympic official, and by nineteen thirty four he had 57 00:03:40,520 --> 00:03:42,640 Speaker 1: almost done it. He was up for a seat on 58 00:03:42,680 --> 00:03:46,280 Speaker 1: the International Olympic Committee, something he must have wanted more 59 00:03:46,320 --> 00:03:51,320 Speaker 1: than anything else. And then Adolf Hitler got in the way. 60 00:03:52,080 --> 00:03:55,320 Speaker 1: So Avery Brundage had to make a choice to resolve 61 00:03:55,360 --> 00:03:58,920 Speaker 1: the dissonance of whether his pure games could be held 62 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:04,119 Speaker 1: in an impure place. Today in the show Avery Brundage's 63 00:04:04,680 --> 00:04:06,360 Speaker 1: very consequential. 64 00:04:05,680 --> 00:04:14,839 Speaker 3: Resolution, things started changing for Margaret Lambert and the rest 65 00:04:14,880 --> 00:04:17,600 Speaker 3: of Germany's Jewish population. As soon as Hitler came to. 66 00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:22,800 Speaker 2: Power, you were banned for more public places. No theaters, 67 00:04:22,920 --> 00:04:27,400 Speaker 2: no restaurants, no swimming pools. You couldn't go any place, 68 00:04:27,600 --> 00:04:30,440 Speaker 2: and you could not associate with non Jewish people. 69 00:04:31,240 --> 00:04:35,080 Speaker 3: Fitness was really important to the Nazi project, so important 70 00:04:35,120 --> 00:04:38,560 Speaker 3: that eventually, in the elite Adolf Hitler schools, students would 71 00:04:38,560 --> 00:04:41,320 Speaker 3: spend about as much and sometimes even more time playing 72 00:04:41,320 --> 00:04:46,719 Speaker 3: sports than they did on academics. Sports had a military function. 73 00:04:47,240 --> 00:04:49,640 Speaker 3: If Germany wanted to go to war again, a strong, 74 00:04:49,720 --> 00:04:53,760 Speaker 3: healthy population was going to be really important. Strength also 75 00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:55,920 Speaker 3: matters if you're trying to prove you're the master race, 76 00:04:56,560 --> 00:05:00,560 Speaker 3: so just emphasizing the weakness of outsiders you could make 77 00:05:00,600 --> 00:05:03,080 Speaker 3: week in part by denying them access to the same 78 00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:04,320 Speaker 3: training the arians had. 79 00:05:05,120 --> 00:05:09,320 Speaker 2: But sports, for me, of course, was the thing I 80 00:05:09,440 --> 00:05:13,839 Speaker 2: wanted the most. Next to the Jewish school there was 81 00:05:14,480 --> 00:05:17,560 Speaker 2: a yard, and we tried to straighten that out, but 82 00:05:17,760 --> 00:05:23,200 Speaker 2: we had to fight the teacher's chickens, and they used 83 00:05:23,240 --> 00:05:26,719 Speaker 2: that same place for their activities and it was not 84 00:05:26,880 --> 00:05:30,040 Speaker 2: very appetizing, so we gave up on that pretty fast. 85 00:05:30,920 --> 00:05:34,080 Speaker 3: While Margaret Lambert was chasing chickens around a bumpy field. 86 00:05:34,320 --> 00:05:37,960 Speaker 3: The Nazis were realizing just how badly they wanted the 87 00:05:37,960 --> 00:05:42,160 Speaker 3: Olympics for money and propaganda power are sure, but also 88 00:05:42,279 --> 00:05:46,720 Speaker 3: I think for a much stranger reason they worshiped the 89 00:05:46,760 --> 00:05:51,840 Speaker 3: ancient Greeks. When Gebels Hitler's fame Nazi minister of Propaganda, 90 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:54,600 Speaker 3: goes to Sparta in the nineteen thirties, he says that 91 00:05:54,640 --> 00:05:57,240 Speaker 3: to him, it was just as if he were in 92 00:05:57,279 --> 00:06:00,559 Speaker 3: a German city. It's why leading brand and of German 93 00:06:00,640 --> 00:06:05,000 Speaker 3: sunscreen was called Sparta Crown. As the scholar Helen Rosch writes, 94 00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:09,640 Speaker 3: Nazi fascism was seeking the rebirth of a past so 95 00:06:09,880 --> 00:06:14,480 Speaker 3: mythic and so ancient that it predates the nation entirely. 96 00:06:15,839 --> 00:06:18,440 Speaker 3: So what better way to prove your connection to that 97 00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:22,760 Speaker 3: mythic in ancient past than to host the Olympic Games. 98 00:06:23,360 --> 00:06:28,440 Speaker 2: Adolf Hitler tried to use these Olympics as his propaganda 99 00:06:28,520 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 2: vehicle to show the world how powerful he was, to 100 00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:40,160 Speaker 2: show the world how unified a Germany was, And I 101 00:06:40,200 --> 00:06:46,080 Speaker 2: think he tried to scare the world into not standing 102 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:49,320 Speaker 2: up against him somehow. And he wanted, of course, the 103 00:06:49,400 --> 00:06:51,840 Speaker 2: United States and all the big nations to be there. 104 00:06:52,760 --> 00:06:56,520 Speaker 3: So the crucial question for our purposes is, well, Hindsight's 105 00:06:56,520 --> 00:06:59,359 Speaker 3: twenty twenty, how much of all this could Avery Brandage 106 00:06:59,360 --> 00:07:02,240 Speaker 3: in the IOC have really known in nineteen thirty three. 107 00:07:03,040 --> 00:07:06,119 Speaker 3: The answer is not everything, but enough. 108 00:07:07,200 --> 00:07:09,320 Speaker 4: The news parade goes forward. 109 00:07:12,800 --> 00:07:15,600 Speaker 3: I mean, this is a national radio broadcast in the 110 00:07:15,760 --> 00:07:19,320 Speaker 3: US from March nineteen thirty three. That's just two months 111 00:07:19,320 --> 00:07:20,840 Speaker 3: after Hitler became Chancellor. 112 00:07:21,120 --> 00:07:24,760 Speaker 4: At prosodies not being enacted daily in Germany by the Nazis. 113 00:07:24,840 --> 00:07:28,160 Speaker 4: Domed troops of Hitler, numerous Jewish citizens have been brutally 114 00:07:28,240 --> 00:07:32,280 Speaker 4: taut us. Horrified citizens in America look on in astonishment 115 00:07:32,520 --> 00:07:36,040 Speaker 4: as ruthless adult Hitler continues a savage campaign of anti 116 00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:37,080 Speaker 4: submitting brutality. 117 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:41,480 Speaker 3: That summer, a New York Times journalist read a report 118 00:07:41,560 --> 00:07:45,040 Speaker 3: on Germany put out by the American Jewish Committee and wrote, 119 00:07:45,520 --> 00:07:48,320 Speaker 3: it is impossible to read it without carrying away the 120 00:07:48,360 --> 00:07:52,080 Speaker 3: conviction that the Nazi leaders are guilty of something more 121 00:07:52,240 --> 00:07:58,400 Speaker 3: than employing violence and terror. Meanwhile, the Consul General for 122 00:07:58,440 --> 00:08:01,360 Speaker 3: the United States in Berlin was writing back home to 123 00:08:01,400 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 3: the State Department about how Germans were pushing an anti 124 00:08:04,560 --> 00:08:08,760 Speaker 3: Jewish sport agenda, how Berlin wasn't safe, and how even 125 00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:11,200 Speaker 3: if the Nazis had told Charles Cheryl they'd give the 126 00:08:11,240 --> 00:08:16,280 Speaker 3: Jews equal opportunity, they really weren't doing that. A movement 127 00:08:16,400 --> 00:08:19,239 Speaker 3: for the US to boycott the thirty six Olympics began 128 00:08:19,280 --> 00:08:23,160 Speaker 3: to gather momentum. Other countries were thinking about boycotting too. 129 00:08:23,920 --> 00:08:26,720 Speaker 3: But by then Avery Brandage was the president of the 130 00:08:26,880 --> 00:08:30,600 Speaker 3: US Olympic Committee, and he'd grown fond of saying things 131 00:08:30,680 --> 00:08:31,239 Speaker 3: like this. 132 00:08:31,880 --> 00:08:35,440 Speaker 5: All the participants are equal before the starter's pistol, and 133 00:08:35,480 --> 00:08:40,600 Speaker 5: there are no social distinctions or family distinctions. 134 00:08:41,360 --> 00:08:44,080 Speaker 3: That same year, he wrote to a colleague that the 135 00:08:44,240 --> 00:08:47,840 Speaker 3: very foundation of the modern Olympic revival will be undermined 136 00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:52,480 Speaker 3: if individual countries are allowed to restrict participation by reason 137 00:08:52,520 --> 00:08:58,560 Speaker 3: of class, creed, or race. The very foundation. So by 138 00:08:58,600 --> 00:09:02,120 Speaker 3: this logic, Mark A. Lambert that German Jewish high jumper 139 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:07,240 Speaker 3: should have been Avery Brandage's ideal athlete, right, unpaid, highly skilled, 140 00:09:07,400 --> 00:09:10,800 Speaker 3: and obsessed with sport. If someone like her wasn't going 141 00:09:10,840 --> 00:09:13,080 Speaker 3: to get a fair shot at the Nazi Olympics, then 142 00:09:13,640 --> 00:09:16,080 Speaker 3: surely Avery Brundage would have to try and stop the 143 00:09:16,160 --> 00:09:20,240 Speaker 3: Nazi Olympics. But first he had to figure out if 144 00:09:20,240 --> 00:09:25,040 Speaker 3: the rumors about Germany were true. We'll be right back. 145 00:09:36,920 --> 00:09:41,760 Speaker 5: I always start all my speeches with the statement that 146 00:09:41,920 --> 00:09:46,640 Speaker 5: the Olympic moment today is the most important social force 147 00:09:47,200 --> 00:09:51,040 Speaker 5: in the world. The word Olympic is the magic word. 148 00:09:52,600 --> 00:09:55,319 Speaker 3: The year after Hitler came to power, Avery Brandage had 149 00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:59,080 Speaker 3: almost made it to the International Olympic Committee, his ticket 150 00:09:59,160 --> 00:10:02,120 Speaker 3: back to the most rarefied part of Olympia where he 151 00:10:02,160 --> 00:10:04,880 Speaker 3: could rub shoulders with all the princes and aristocrats in 152 00:10:04,880 --> 00:10:09,160 Speaker 3: that particular gentleman's club. And this is something I think 153 00:10:09,280 --> 00:10:11,000 Speaker 3: Avery Brandage really wanted. 154 00:10:11,920 --> 00:10:14,439 Speaker 1: Why does he want to hang out with these kind 155 00:10:14,520 --> 00:10:16,640 Speaker 1: of Pots's. 156 00:10:17,240 --> 00:10:21,600 Speaker 3: Malcolm and I once again psychoanalyzing Avery Brandage talking about 157 00:10:21,640 --> 00:10:24,480 Speaker 3: a letter he wrote to the IOC. There's one moment 158 00:10:24,520 --> 00:10:26,200 Speaker 3: that's quite telling in one of these when he's writing 159 00:10:26,240 --> 00:10:29,160 Speaker 3: to Edstrom, one of the members of the IOC, and 160 00:10:29,240 --> 00:10:33,480 Speaker 3: you see his typewritten note, anything may happen in these 161 00:10:33,600 --> 00:10:36,800 Speaker 3: perilous days, and then he crosses out perilous and he 162 00:10:36,880 --> 00:10:40,240 Speaker 3: handwrites in parlous, And there's a kind of like for Avery. 163 00:10:40,240 --> 00:10:43,679 Speaker 3: Brundage is not saying the word parless like he's second 164 00:10:43,720 --> 00:10:46,959 Speaker 3: guessing his own vocabulary to fit in with these guys. 165 00:10:47,400 --> 00:10:49,360 Speaker 1: Yeah, and that is the world of the IOC, right. 166 00:10:49,360 --> 00:10:53,200 Speaker 1: The IOC is a fundamently nineteenth century institution. It's just 167 00:10:53,320 --> 00:10:56,280 Speaker 1: one count and baron after another kind of living out 168 00:10:56,280 --> 00:10:59,800 Speaker 1: the glory days of there. And then Brundage comes along 169 00:11:00,280 --> 00:11:03,360 Speaker 1: and he is an entirely different animal. 170 00:11:03,480 --> 00:11:05,880 Speaker 3: He's like, yes, I may have done all these things 171 00:11:05,920 --> 00:11:07,680 Speaker 3: that you guys can never even dream of. I built 172 00:11:07,679 --> 00:11:09,920 Speaker 3: these buildings, I made my own fortune. I trained in 173 00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:12,160 Speaker 3: a ditch until I was good enough to compete in 174 00:11:12,200 --> 00:11:17,560 Speaker 3: the Olympics. But I still think Princess rock and I'll 175 00:11:17,559 --> 00:11:19,280 Speaker 3: go on the record as saying as much. 176 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:22,760 Speaker 5: And what kind of a world is this when it's 177 00:11:22,760 --> 00:11:24,560 Speaker 5: come to the point where being a prince is a 178 00:11:24,559 --> 00:11:25,800 Speaker 5: handicapped I ask. 179 00:11:25,679 --> 00:11:29,040 Speaker 1: You, it's very gruteal MUCKs. I don't want to belong 180 00:11:29,080 --> 00:11:30,000 Speaker 1: to a club that would happen. 181 00:11:32,120 --> 00:11:34,600 Speaker 3: But like he knows that the only way he's going 182 00:11:34,679 --> 00:11:36,440 Speaker 3: to get in that club is if he, as the 183 00:11:36,480 --> 00:11:39,920 Speaker 3: president of the American Olympic Committee, brings the Americans to 184 00:11:40,040 --> 00:11:40,560 Speaker 3: the Games. 185 00:11:41,080 --> 00:11:43,240 Speaker 1: So why is that so? 186 00:11:43,640 --> 00:11:46,240 Speaker 3: He he is at that point the most powerful man 187 00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:49,160 Speaker 3: in amateur sport in America, so he really like he 188 00:11:49,200 --> 00:11:52,880 Speaker 3: holds the cards, and the United States is both the 189 00:11:52,920 --> 00:11:55,280 Speaker 3: most significant participant in the Olympics. They're going to bring 190 00:11:55,320 --> 00:11:57,400 Speaker 3: a huge team. There's going to be a medals race 191 00:11:57,400 --> 00:12:01,400 Speaker 3: between them and the Germans that will be extremely dramatic 192 00:12:01,440 --> 00:12:04,880 Speaker 3: and make for really good viewing. But also they have 193 00:12:04,920 --> 00:12:07,480 Speaker 3: a lot of moral authority, and if the United States 194 00:12:07,520 --> 00:12:11,600 Speaker 3: substains from the Olympics, it majorly undermines the Olympic project. 195 00:12:11,679 --> 00:12:15,640 Speaker 1: Has it been made explicit to Brundage that his future 196 00:12:15,679 --> 00:12:19,000 Speaker 1: in the IOC is contingent on him bringing Americans to Berlin. 197 00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:22,800 Speaker 3: I haven't seen anything that states it explicitly, but I 198 00:12:22,840 --> 00:12:25,080 Speaker 3: think it is very clear that the members of the 199 00:12:25,120 --> 00:12:28,600 Speaker 3: IOC want the Olympics to happen. They want them to 200 00:12:28,600 --> 00:12:32,719 Speaker 3: happen in Germany. But as Americans learn more about what 201 00:12:32,760 --> 00:12:35,720 Speaker 3: the Nazis were up to, as the last traces of 202 00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:39,800 Speaker 3: Weimar Democracy vanished, the pressure in the US to boycott 203 00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:44,320 Speaker 3: the Games got really intense, and avery Rundage was right 204 00:12:44,360 --> 00:12:47,680 Speaker 3: in the middle of it. Publicly, he was pro going 205 00:12:47,679 --> 00:12:50,720 Speaker 3: to the Games, but he expressed at least some concern 206 00:12:50,800 --> 00:12:54,760 Speaker 3: about what was happening in Germany. And yet in his archives, 207 00:12:54,840 --> 00:12:57,920 Speaker 3: I've found private letters to the IOC from as early 208 00:12:58,000 --> 00:13:02,000 Speaker 3: as nineteen thirty three, and in them he frames the 209 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:06,000 Speaker 3: boycott campaign as a Jewish plot to sabotage the Olympics, 210 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:09,200 Speaker 3: and from the beginning he knew what crowd he was 211 00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:13,280 Speaker 3: playing to the President of the International Committee, count Enri 212 00:13:13,440 --> 00:13:17,360 Speaker 3: de bayer LeTour wrote to Avery Brundage saying they should 213 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:20,880 Speaker 3: work together hand in hand while we are handling this 214 00:13:20,920 --> 00:13:24,720 Speaker 3: difficult question. I am not personally fond of Jews and 215 00:13:24,760 --> 00:13:27,920 Speaker 3: of the Jewish influence, but I will not have them molested. 216 00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:32,720 Speaker 3: So that's a clue. But then there's also the matter 217 00:13:32,840 --> 00:13:37,280 Speaker 3: of Brandage's lengthy correspondence with Siegfried Edstrom. Edstrom was sort 218 00:13:37,280 --> 00:13:40,480 Speaker 3: of like the Swedish Avery Brundage, an engineer who'd made good. 219 00:13:40,960 --> 00:13:44,200 Speaker 3: He was a member of the IOC. The two were friends. 220 00:13:44,840 --> 00:13:46,520 Speaker 3: He's the one who wrote the letter we talked about 221 00:13:46,559 --> 00:13:49,599 Speaker 3: in the last episode, suggesting that he nominate Brundage for 222 00:13:49,640 --> 00:13:54,320 Speaker 3: a seat on the IOC, and Brundage of course responded enthusiastically. 223 00:13:55,160 --> 00:13:59,199 Speaker 3: But how did he begin that letter accepting this most 224 00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:04,000 Speaker 3: precious of all prizes. He didn't lead with his enthusiasm. Instead, 225 00:14:04,480 --> 00:14:09,520 Speaker 3: he started by complaining about the boycotts. Undoubtedly, the International 226 00:14:09,600 --> 00:14:12,960 Speaker 3: Olympic Committee will be swamped with protests from Jews and 227 00:14:13,040 --> 00:14:17,160 Speaker 3: Jewish organizations from many different countries. I assume that the 228 00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:20,280 Speaker 3: IOC will take the same stand as the American Olympic 229 00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:23,880 Speaker 3: Committee will, to it that it is concerned with athletic 230 00:14:23,920 --> 00:14:27,840 Speaker 3: affairs only and that it will not be drawn into political, religious, 231 00:14:28,120 --> 00:14:33,600 Speaker 3: sociological or racial controversies of any kind. Then he said 232 00:14:34,080 --> 00:14:35,840 Speaker 3: how much he'd like to be on the IOC. 233 00:14:38,080 --> 00:14:42,800 Speaker 1: Inside, deep inside that kind of engineer, self made man's 234 00:14:42,880 --> 00:14:47,080 Speaker 1: brain is this romantic streak. I want to be part 235 00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:53,040 Speaker 1: of this grand you know, sporting amateur enterprise. And it's 236 00:14:53,160 --> 00:14:55,760 Speaker 1: beautiful and it speaks to me, and it's you know, 237 00:14:55,800 --> 00:14:58,520 Speaker 1: it's this pure thing in an impure world. I really 238 00:14:58,520 --> 00:15:00,960 Speaker 1: do think that what how happens to him in nineteen 239 00:15:01,000 --> 00:15:06,600 Speaker 1: twelve at the Olympics, that failure remains with him for 240 00:15:06,640 --> 00:15:10,520 Speaker 1: the rest of his days. It's the thing that drives 241 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:14,280 Speaker 1: him to save in his own mind, save the Olympics. 242 00:15:14,840 --> 00:15:18,360 Speaker 1: That is, he had failed once to live up to 243 00:15:18,400 --> 00:15:20,640 Speaker 1: the Olympic spirit, and he's not going to fail again. 244 00:15:22,360 --> 00:15:25,720 Speaker 3: But the concerns weren't going away. Hitler had already made 245 00:15:25,760 --> 00:15:30,080 Speaker 3: himself a dictator, Germany was re arming, and war was 246 00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:33,440 Speaker 3: once again on the horizon in Europe. So the American 247 00:15:33,480 --> 00:15:36,680 Speaker 3: Olympic Committee decided they needed to send someone to Berlin 248 00:15:36,760 --> 00:15:40,720 Speaker 3: to figure out for themselves what was going on. They chose, 249 00:15:40,960 --> 00:15:48,840 Speaker 3: of course, Avery Brandage. On September twelfth, nineteen thirty four, 250 00:15:49,240 --> 00:15:52,880 Speaker 3: two days after the Nuremberg rally that year, Avery Brandage 251 00:15:52,960 --> 00:15:56,280 Speaker 3: arrived in eastern Germany. His plan was to meet with 252 00:15:56,360 --> 00:15:59,120 Speaker 3: Jewish sports officials to suss out just how bad things 253 00:15:59,120 --> 00:16:03,320 Speaker 3: had actually gotten. There was, however, one problem. He didn't 254 00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:08,240 Speaker 3: speak German, so he did this whole trip with Nazi interpreters, 255 00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:13,120 Speaker 3: including the head of all Nazi sports, the Reichschportfior, Hans 256 00:16:13,280 --> 00:16:17,280 Speaker 3: von Schamer and Austin von Schamer. And In Austin was 257 00:16:17,320 --> 00:16:21,160 Speaker 3: a rather severe looking Nazi official, a small man with thinning, 258 00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:25,040 Speaker 3: slit hair and a paralyzed right hand. He was meant 259 00:16:25,040 --> 00:16:28,360 Speaker 3: to assure every Brandage that the Nazis weren't discriminating against 260 00:16:28,440 --> 00:16:31,760 Speaker 3: Jewish athletes, which maybe would have been easier had all 261 00:16:31,800 --> 00:16:34,760 Speaker 3: the sports clubs in Nazi Germany not recently received a 262 00:16:34,800 --> 00:16:38,120 Speaker 3: copy of a book called the Spirit of Sport in 263 00:16:38,160 --> 00:16:44,240 Speaker 3: the National Socialist Ideology, which included passages like this, there 264 00:16:44,320 --> 00:16:47,240 Speaker 3: is no room in our German land for Jewish sports 265 00:16:47,280 --> 00:16:51,239 Speaker 3: leaders and their friends infested with the Talmud, for pacifists, 266 00:16:51,480 --> 00:16:55,680 Speaker 3: political Catholics, pan Europeans and the rest. They are worse 267 00:16:55,760 --> 00:16:59,280 Speaker 3: than cholera and syphilis, much worse than famine, drought and 268 00:16:59,320 --> 00:17:03,200 Speaker 3: poison gas. Do we want them in the Olympic Games 269 00:17:03,240 --> 00:17:07,119 Speaker 3: in Germany? Yes, we must have them. We think they 270 00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:11,200 Speaker 3: are important for international reasons. There could not be better 271 00:17:11,240 --> 00:17:16,679 Speaker 3: propaganda for Germany. What does it mean? It means they 272 00:17:16,720 --> 00:17:19,119 Speaker 3: would pretend that Jews could be allowed at the Games 273 00:17:19,200 --> 00:17:21,399 Speaker 3: in hopes that it would help the Nazis hoodwink the 274 00:17:21,440 --> 00:17:24,960 Speaker 3: world about how they were actually treating the Jews. You'd 275 00:17:25,000 --> 00:17:28,560 Speaker 3: think that Avery Brandage, champion of Olympic ideals like no 276 00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:31,800 Speaker 3: politics in sport, would hate to see the Olympics used 277 00:17:31,880 --> 00:17:36,879 Speaker 3: that way. Instead. Here's our second warning sign about this trip. 278 00:17:37,800 --> 00:17:42,200 Speaker 3: Brundage quickly saw von Schamer and Austin as a friend. 279 00:17:42,720 --> 00:17:46,880 Speaker 3: He spent six days exploring Germany with his various Nazi counterparts. 280 00:17:47,440 --> 00:17:50,199 Speaker 3: I have to imagine that he also visited the Reichs Sportsfeld, 281 00:17:50,560 --> 00:17:53,000 Speaker 3: the site of the giant new stadium being built for 282 00:17:53,040 --> 00:17:56,480 Speaker 3: the Games. Brundage new construction, after all, it was his 283 00:17:56,560 --> 00:18:00,280 Speaker 3: business in This stadium would be epic, big enough to 284 00:18:00,320 --> 00:18:02,439 Speaker 3: fit more than one hundred thousand people. 285 00:18:03,880 --> 00:18:05,760 Speaker 1: This is what I can't get over. Every one of 286 00:18:05,760 --> 00:18:09,359 Speaker 1: the characters we've met so far have a meeting with 287 00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:14,159 Speaker 1: the Nazis. It's like Dorothy Thompson goes, you know, Charles 288 00:18:14,200 --> 00:18:17,399 Speaker 1: Cheryl has this big meeting with Hitler. Each makes this 289 00:18:17,520 --> 00:18:19,760 Speaker 1: pilgrimage to the Promised Land. 290 00:18:19,960 --> 00:18:20,120 Speaker 2: Right. 291 00:18:20,240 --> 00:18:24,440 Speaker 1: We don't know in thirty four exactly what Brundage is thinking. 292 00:18:25,080 --> 00:18:27,440 Speaker 1: He's playing his cards pretty close to his chest. 293 00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:32,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, we actually not a lot is known about these meetings, 294 00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:37,560 Speaker 3: but we did find an archival account from a dentist 295 00:18:37,880 --> 00:18:40,600 Speaker 3: and Jewish sport official who is president at one of 296 00:18:40,640 --> 00:18:43,480 Speaker 3: these meetings at the hotel Kaiserhoff in nineteen thirty four. 297 00:18:43,640 --> 00:18:44,840 Speaker 3: We had it translated. 298 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:48,320 Speaker 1: Kaiserhoff. I would point out the same hotel where Dorothy 299 00:18:48,359 --> 00:18:53,199 Speaker 1: Thompson interviewed Adolf Hitler. Oh Man, I missed that this 300 00:18:53,240 --> 00:18:54,920 Speaker 1: is where it's all happening in Berlin. This is where 301 00:18:54,960 --> 00:18:58,119 Speaker 1: you when you have to do your Nazi meet and greets, 302 00:18:58,520 --> 00:18:59,439 Speaker 1: you go to the kaiser Off. 303 00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:03,199 Speaker 3: The point is this was not friendly territory for the 304 00:19:03,280 --> 00:19:09,240 Speaker 3: Jewish sports officials. The Hotel kaiser Off was a grand 305 00:19:09,320 --> 00:19:13,480 Speaker 3: luxury hotel on Wilhelm Plotz, directly opposite the Chancellor's office. 306 00:19:13,840 --> 00:19:17,560 Speaker 3: Remember Hitler once had an office there. There were marble floors, 307 00:19:17,960 --> 00:19:20,920 Speaker 3: a dining room in a three story glass roofed atrium. 308 00:19:22,040 --> 00:19:24,399 Speaker 3: Brundage is in the lap of luxury at the seat 309 00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:28,480 Speaker 3: of Nazi power. Sigfried Edge from Brundage's IOC friend is 310 00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:31,560 Speaker 3: there with them. They were joined by a Nazi German 311 00:19:31,720 --> 00:19:34,760 Speaker 3: Organizing Committee member who was already a friend of Brundage's 312 00:19:34,760 --> 00:19:38,879 Speaker 3: from the nineteen twelve Olympics. The Deputy reichs sportsfure was 313 00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:44,120 Speaker 3: also there, dressed in full SS black boots and all. 314 00:19:45,640 --> 00:19:47,240 Speaker 1: So what do we know about what happens at the meeting? 315 00:19:48,040 --> 00:19:50,600 Speaker 3: So he begins to ask them a series of questions 316 00:19:50,920 --> 00:19:55,840 Speaker 3: about Jewish participation in sport. So he asks, are Jewish 317 00:19:55,880 --> 00:19:59,680 Speaker 3: boys allowed to play sport in large numbers? And the 318 00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:04,280 Speaker 3: right sport funer says yeah, absolutely, and the Jewish leaders 319 00:20:04,280 --> 00:20:07,440 Speaker 3: have to sit there and nod but then they say 320 00:20:07,480 --> 00:20:09,960 Speaker 3: they make a caveat. They're like, well, you know, maybe 321 00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:12,399 Speaker 3: they can play in large numbers, but there's a problem. 322 00:20:12,520 --> 00:20:15,640 Speaker 3: We don't actually have any municipal sports fields. And Brandage 323 00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:18,119 Speaker 3: immediately dismisses this and says, well, in the US, we 324 00:20:18,160 --> 00:20:20,439 Speaker 3: don't have municipal sports fields either. We just have our 325 00:20:20,480 --> 00:20:25,480 Speaker 3: own fields for each each athletic association. If you imagine 326 00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:28,200 Speaker 3: this from the perspective of the Jewish sports leaders, it's 327 00:20:28,200 --> 00:20:31,960 Speaker 3: a high wire act. Here sitting before them is Brandage 328 00:20:32,119 --> 00:20:35,040 Speaker 3: the man best position to put pressure on the Nazis 329 00:20:35,240 --> 00:20:38,000 Speaker 3: who are also seated at the table. But the Jewish 330 00:20:38,000 --> 00:20:41,000 Speaker 3: sports leaders have no sense really a Brandage's position on 331 00:20:41,040 --> 00:20:43,720 Speaker 3: all this. How could they? 332 00:20:43,840 --> 00:20:43,919 Speaker 6: So? 333 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:47,000 Speaker 3: What do they do? They have to try and read 334 00:20:47,080 --> 00:20:51,760 Speaker 3: between the lines of every question he's asking. Then he 335 00:20:51,840 --> 00:20:56,040 Speaker 3: asks can Jews join the associations? They say yes, but 336 00:20:56,160 --> 00:20:59,359 Speaker 3: only if they're Jewish associations, and he's like, well, in 337 00:20:59,400 --> 00:21:02,000 Speaker 3: my club back in Chicago, we don't allow Jews either. 338 00:21:02,480 --> 00:21:06,800 Speaker 3: Next question, they say like, oh, well, you know, we 339 00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:09,440 Speaker 3: have our own sports fields, but they keep getting closed 340 00:21:09,480 --> 00:21:12,200 Speaker 3: down because the Nazi party is shutting down our sports fields. 341 00:21:12,320 --> 00:21:15,399 Speaker 3: They're breaking into our games. They're beating people up, and Brandage, 342 00:21:15,440 --> 00:21:18,439 Speaker 3: according to this account of the meeting, which I have 343 00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:21,320 Speaker 3: to believe is reliable, just seems kind of bored by 344 00:21:21,359 --> 00:21:25,000 Speaker 3: this and doesn't ask follow up questions about this this report. 345 00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:28,080 Speaker 3: But this dentist rites of Brandage is that it was 346 00:21:28,160 --> 00:21:30,800 Speaker 3: clear that Brundage wanted to save the Olympics in Berlin. 347 00:21:32,880 --> 00:21:35,359 Speaker 3: And there's one sort of glimmer of hope towards the 348 00:21:35,480 --> 00:21:39,520 Speaker 3: end where Brandage asks if a Jewish athlete runs one 349 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:42,560 Speaker 3: hundred meters in ten point three seconds, would he then 350 00:21:42,640 --> 00:21:46,000 Speaker 3: be able to participate in the Olympics? And the Jewish 351 00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:49,000 Speaker 3: sport leaders reply, how is he supposed to do that 352 00:21:49,080 --> 00:21:51,920 Speaker 3: without having had the opportunity to train the rex sport? 353 00:21:52,000 --> 00:21:54,680 Speaker 3: Fewer says, we'll allow him to compete. Brandage sort of 354 00:21:54,720 --> 00:21:56,280 Speaker 3: times and then says, but how can he compete if 355 00:21:56,280 --> 00:21:58,480 Speaker 3: he doesn't have an opportunity to train the right sport? 356 00:21:58,520 --> 00:22:02,160 Speaker 3: Fewer says, Oh, don't worry, will definitely have Jewish people 357 00:22:02,200 --> 00:22:04,000 Speaker 3: on the teams, which is just kind of just like 358 00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:08,440 Speaker 3: blanket assurance that everything has shown is nonsense. It's a whitewash, Yeah, 359 00:22:08,520 --> 00:22:12,000 Speaker 3: it's a whitewash. And Brundage accepts this and moves on 360 00:22:12,040 --> 00:22:16,440 Speaker 3: from the meeting and declares that there's no problem. Soon 361 00:22:16,520 --> 00:22:19,639 Speaker 3: after that meeting, Avery Brendage heads back to the United 362 00:22:19,640 --> 00:22:24,680 Speaker 3: States with his verdict all good. So the day after 363 00:22:24,720 --> 00:22:28,800 Speaker 3: he gets back, the American Olympic Committee meets and votes 364 00:22:29,000 --> 00:22:34,560 Speaker 3: unanimously to go to Berlin. Brundage stuck to his guns. 365 00:22:36,200 --> 00:22:40,520 Speaker 6: Participation in these games must not be construed to be 366 00:22:40,560 --> 00:22:44,560 Speaker 6: an endorsement of the policies or practices of the Nazi government. 367 00:22:45,520 --> 00:22:48,240 Speaker 6: Measures have been adopted to ensure that there will be 368 00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:51,399 Speaker 6: no violation of the fundamental principles of fair play and 369 00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:56,280 Speaker 6: good sportsmanship, all the Olympic standards of freedom and equality 370 00:22:56,320 --> 00:22:56,800 Speaker 6: to all. 371 00:22:58,200 --> 00:23:02,080 Speaker 3: Later. Margaret Lambert Hewish high jumper had this to say 372 00:23:02,080 --> 00:23:03,520 Speaker 3: about Avery Brandage's trip. 373 00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:10,480 Speaker 2: He just let himself being lulled into some false security 374 00:23:10,520 --> 00:23:13,880 Speaker 2: by these Nazis saying everything is fine, We're doing everything 375 00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:16,439 Speaker 2: we would saying we said we would do. And he 376 00:23:16,520 --> 00:23:18,960 Speaker 2: came back to the United States and said everything is 377 00:23:19,040 --> 00:23:22,000 Speaker 2: fabulous over there, and we'll be going. 378 00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:37,320 Speaker 3: We'll be right back. There are two ways of understanding 379 00:23:37,320 --> 00:23:40,359 Speaker 3: what Avery Brandage did in nineteen thirty four. The first 380 00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:42,959 Speaker 3: in a chain of his actions that would lead irrevocably 381 00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:47,639 Speaker 3: to us participation in the Berlin Games. The most charitable 382 00:23:47,680 --> 00:23:51,280 Speaker 3: interpretation is basically what Margaret Lambert, the high Jumper said, 383 00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:56,040 Speaker 3: He let himself be lulled into some false security picture Brandage, 384 00:23:56,040 --> 00:23:59,399 Speaker 3: the hoodwinked idealist who maybe just believed so firmly that 385 00:23:59,440 --> 00:24:01,800 Speaker 3: the Olympics were a world apart from the universe of 386 00:24:01,840 --> 00:24:04,840 Speaker 3: politics and money that it didn't matter if they were 387 00:24:04,840 --> 00:24:09,359 Speaker 3: held in Nazi Germany. But another way to understand what 388 00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:12,520 Speaker 3: he did is to consider that his visit to Germany, 389 00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:15,879 Speaker 3: and his time with the Nazis, it may all have 390 00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:21,280 Speaker 3: seemed a little familiar to him. Remember Dorothy Thompson's nineteen 391 00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:24,639 Speaker 3: forty one essay Who Goes Nazi? The first time we 392 00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:27,879 Speaker 3: read it, we recognized Charles Cheryl as her mister B. 393 00:24:28,800 --> 00:24:36,720 Speaker 3: But Avery Brundage is the perfect incarnation of Thompson's mister C, do. 394 00:24:36,680 --> 00:24:38,600 Speaker 1: You have in front of you? Her description of his 395 00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:40,040 Speaker 1: kind of fascist? 396 00:24:40,520 --> 00:24:43,480 Speaker 3: Here we go. Mister C is a brilliant and a 397 00:24:43,560 --> 00:24:46,960 Speaker 3: bittered intellectual. He was a poor white, trash Southern boy, 398 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:52,360 Speaker 3: or in our case, Midwestern boy, a scholarship student at 399 00:24:52,359 --> 00:24:55,320 Speaker 3: two universities, where he took all the scholastic honors, but 400 00:24:55,480 --> 00:24:58,000 Speaker 3: was never invited to join a fraternity. He has always 401 00:24:58,080 --> 00:25:01,119 Speaker 3: moved among important people, and all always been socially on 402 00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:05,000 Speaker 3: the periphery. His colleagues have admired his brains and exploited them, 403 00:25:05,200 --> 00:25:07,920 Speaker 3: but they have seldom invited him or his wife to dinner. 404 00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:11,800 Speaker 3: He is a snob, loathing his own snobbery, that's brandage. 405 00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:15,280 Speaker 3: He despises the men about him. He despises, for instance, 406 00:25:15,320 --> 00:25:18,320 Speaker 3: mister b because he knows what he has had to 407 00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:21,160 Speaker 3: achieve by relentless work. Men like Bee have won by 408 00:25:21,200 --> 00:25:24,639 Speaker 3: knowing the right people. But his contempt is inextricably mingled 409 00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:27,200 Speaker 3: with envy. Even more than he hates the class into 410 00:25:27,240 --> 00:25:29,879 Speaker 3: which he has insecurely risen does he hate the people 411 00:25:29,960 --> 00:25:32,679 Speaker 3: from whom he came. He hates his mother and his 412 00:25:32,720 --> 00:25:36,359 Speaker 3: father for being his parents. He loaths everything that reminds 413 00:25:36,440 --> 00:25:39,440 Speaker 3: him of his origins and his humiliations. He is bitterly 414 00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:43,359 Speaker 3: anti Semitic because the social insecurity of the Jews reminds 415 00:25:43,440 --> 00:25:47,399 Speaker 3: him of his own psychological insecurity hity. He is utterly 416 00:25:47,440 --> 00:25:50,240 Speaker 3: erased from his nature and enjoy He has never known. 417 00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:53,000 Speaker 3: He has an ambition bitter and burning. It is to 418 00:25:53,119 --> 00:25:55,880 Speaker 3: rise to such an eminence that no one can ever 419 00:25:55,920 --> 00:25:58,720 Speaker 3: again humiliate him. Not to rule, but to be the 420 00:25:58,760 --> 00:26:01,720 Speaker 3: secret ruler. He is courteous, the commands a distant in 421 00:26:01,760 --> 00:26:04,280 Speaker 3: cold respect, but he is a very dangerous man. Where 422 00:26:04,280 --> 00:26:06,760 Speaker 3: he primitive and brutals, he would be a criminal, a murderer, 423 00:26:06,880 --> 00:26:09,160 Speaker 3: but he is subtle and cruel. He would rise high 424 00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:12,040 Speaker 3: in a Nazi regime. It would need men just like him, 425 00:26:12,160 --> 00:26:13,520 Speaker 3: intellectual and ruthless. 426 00:26:13,760 --> 00:26:18,360 Speaker 1: That's him, that is him. 427 00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:21,080 Speaker 3: And this is the key part quote. But mister c 428 00:26:21,480 --> 00:26:24,840 Speaker 3: is not a born Nazi. He is the product of 429 00:26:24,880 --> 00:26:30,840 Speaker 3: a democracy hypocritically preaching social equality and practicing a carelessly 430 00:26:30,920 --> 00:26:35,800 Speaker 3: brutal snobbery. Averybrndage may have thought he had found himself 431 00:26:35,840 --> 00:26:39,239 Speaker 3: in Stockholm in nineteen twelve at the Olympics, but I 432 00:26:39,280 --> 00:26:42,959 Speaker 3: think he really found himself in nineteen thirty four at 433 00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:49,600 Speaker 3: the kaiser Off Hotel. Hundreds of thousands of people protested 434 00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:53,320 Speaker 3: the decision to go to the games. Avery Brandage didn't care. 435 00:26:54,680 --> 00:26:57,879 Speaker 3: He became even more convinced that the whole boycott was 436 00:26:58,000 --> 00:26:59,919 Speaker 3: just a Jewish plot to use the Olympics for their 437 00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:04,680 Speaker 3: their own political purposes. He kept a file of antisemitic propaganda. 438 00:27:05,200 --> 00:27:09,720 Speaker 3: It's labeled in his archives Jewish problem. Then, really, it's 439 00:27:09,760 --> 00:27:12,800 Speaker 3: not that surprising, because we know now from reading his 440 00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:16,000 Speaker 3: letters that while he was questioning Jewish sports leaders in 441 00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:19,520 Speaker 3: front of the Nazis at the Kaiserhoff, Averyrundage knew that 442 00:27:19,560 --> 00:27:23,840 Speaker 3: he was also being assessed by Sigfried Edstrom, the IOC 443 00:27:23,960 --> 00:27:27,320 Speaker 3: official sitting in the room with him, who had earlier 444 00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:32,240 Speaker 3: that year sent this note to Brundage. The Nazis' opposition 445 00:27:32,320 --> 00:27:34,719 Speaker 3: to the influence of Jews can only be understood if 446 00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:37,560 Speaker 3: you live over in Germany. In some of the more 447 00:27:37,560 --> 00:27:40,719 Speaker 3: important traits, the Jews governed the majority and stopped all 448 00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:43,879 Speaker 3: others from coming in. In the hospitals, most of the 449 00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:47,000 Speaker 3: doctors were Jews, and the Jews had preference in the 450 00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:50,200 Speaker 3: law courts. It was the same Many of these Jews 451 00:27:50,240 --> 00:27:53,960 Speaker 3: were of Polish or Russian origin, with minds entirely different 452 00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:58,640 Speaker 3: from the Western mind. An alteration of these conditions were 453 00:27:58,640 --> 00:28:04,040 Speaker 3: absolutely necessary if Germany should remain a white nation. The 454 00:28:04,200 --> 00:28:07,640 Speaker 3: only objection I have is that they made the alterations 455 00:28:07,680 --> 00:28:11,119 Speaker 3: so rashly and thereby caused a great deal of opposition. 456 00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:15,399 Speaker 3: I am not an anti Semite myself. On the contrary, 457 00:28:15,760 --> 00:28:18,720 Speaker 3: some of my best friends are Jews. But I try 458 00:28:18,760 --> 00:28:22,960 Speaker 3: to look upon the question from both sides. That is 459 00:28:23,000 --> 00:28:26,359 Speaker 3: why I have written this letter to you. It was 460 00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:30,840 Speaker 3: like Avery Brundage have been handed a script. A year 461 00:28:30,880 --> 00:28:33,800 Speaker 3: after that trip, Brundage wrote his own letter to the 462 00:28:33,840 --> 00:28:38,640 Speaker 3: president of the IOC quote, the picture of conditions in 463 00:28:38,680 --> 00:28:42,000 Speaker 3: Germany obtained from reading our newspapers is entirely different from 464 00:28:42,040 --> 00:28:45,320 Speaker 3: that gained by an inspection of the country. The great 465 00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:48,400 Speaker 3: Jewish merchant advertisers may have something to do with this. 466 00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:52,640 Speaker 3: The public mind has been poisoned against Germany, and highly 467 00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:56,760 Speaker 3: organized minorities are extremely effective on questions which are decided 468 00:28:56,800 --> 00:29:03,120 Speaker 3: by popular vote. Nobody fools, Avery Brandage. Avery Brandage knew 469 00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:12,320 Speaker 3: exactly what he was doing. He'd gone Nazi. Margaret Lambert, 470 00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:15,240 Speaker 3: the High Jumper, had been contacted again by the Nazis 471 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:18,479 Speaker 3: a few months before Brandage's visit. According to that interview 472 00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:21,800 Speaker 3: she did with the Holocaust Museum, the Nazis had begun 473 00:29:21,880 --> 00:29:25,040 Speaker 3: threatening her family, trying to force her to try out 474 00:29:25,080 --> 00:29:27,080 Speaker 3: for the games so they could show how open they 475 00:29:27,080 --> 00:29:29,400 Speaker 3: were to having Jews on the team. 476 00:29:29,080 --> 00:29:33,320 Speaker 2: To compete in the Olympic Games is trill of a lifetime, 477 00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:36,680 Speaker 2: I mean, and it doesn't happen to everybody. On the 478 00:29:36,720 --> 00:29:42,160 Speaker 2: other hand, I was so afraid supposing I am allowed 479 00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:47,320 Speaker 2: to compete, Supposing I win, and I was convinced that 480 00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:50,840 Speaker 2: I would win a medal and possibly the gold. Supposing 481 00:29:50,920 --> 00:29:53,280 Speaker 2: I do this, What do I do? I'm going to 482 00:29:53,360 --> 00:29:57,240 Speaker 2: stand on that podium and say, hile Hitler like all 483 00:29:57,280 --> 00:30:00,760 Speaker 2: the others, and this to do for Jewish girl would 484 00:30:00,800 --> 00:30:05,240 Speaker 2: never do. I was scarce, stiff, and this was going 485 00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:07,480 Speaker 2: around in my head day and night, day and night, 486 00:30:07,560 --> 00:30:10,560 Speaker 2: day and night. Well, what's going to happen? Am I 487 00:30:10,640 --> 00:30:13,320 Speaker 2: going to compete? Am I not going to compete? How 488 00:30:13,360 --> 00:30:17,360 Speaker 2: do I conduct myself if I do compete? I was 489 00:30:17,400 --> 00:30:22,080 Speaker 2: so torn apout about it. I didn't know what to do. 490 00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:25,320 Speaker 3: The Nazis put Margaret Lambert, who was unnamed gretel Bergmann 491 00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:28,360 Speaker 3: on the provisional Olympic team trying out for the Games. 492 00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:32,680 Speaker 3: Vonshaimer Undastan wrote about this in a quite unconvincing letter 493 00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:36,040 Speaker 3: to Charles Cheryl. You will find from this that we 494 00:30:36,080 --> 00:30:40,000 Speaker 3: work entirely in the spirit of the Olympic statutes as before, 495 00:30:40,280 --> 00:30:44,040 Speaker 3: Miss Bergmann is being treated like all Olympic candidates in 496 00:30:44,080 --> 00:30:47,800 Speaker 3: spite of being a Jewish, in spite of being a Jewish, 497 00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:52,080 Speaker 3: pretty much covers it. The invitation was nonsense, but the 498 00:30:52,120 --> 00:30:56,600 Speaker 3: IOC knew that she had poor facilities to train in I. 499 00:30:56,760 --> 00:30:59,360 Speaker 2: Still jew was not allowed to use any of this. 500 00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:02,000 Speaker 3: But you could frame it as a kind of classic 501 00:31:02,040 --> 00:31:06,360 Speaker 3: Olympic story, right, like poor young Avery Brandage practicing with 502 00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:09,680 Speaker 3: his own discus in an abandoned lot, and Lambert didn't 503 00:31:09,680 --> 00:31:12,160 Speaker 3: even have anybody to compete against to make her sharper. 504 00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:15,480 Speaker 2: You don't have any competition. It's you have to only 505 00:31:15,520 --> 00:31:16,320 Speaker 2: fight yourself. 506 00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:20,680 Speaker 3: She made the nazison to her opponent. She pushed herself 507 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:22,960 Speaker 3: to beat an idea that was so much bigger than her, 508 00:31:23,720 --> 00:31:25,600 Speaker 3: and at a meat just before the games. 509 00:31:26,720 --> 00:31:30,200 Speaker 2: It worked, but it made me better because I was 510 00:31:30,240 --> 00:31:33,280 Speaker 2: so full of rage. The madder I got, the better 511 00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:36,840 Speaker 2: I jumped. When I was so mad that I equaled 512 00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:40,360 Speaker 2: the German record. I must have cleared it by fifteen 513 00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:41,360 Speaker 2: inches at the time. 514 00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:44,240 Speaker 3: She left that meet and went home, waiting to hear 515 00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:47,520 Speaker 3: whether she'd made the team, and wondering what would happen 516 00:31:47,520 --> 00:31:48,120 Speaker 3: if she had. 517 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:50,880 Speaker 2: I looked for the mail every day. What's going to happen, 518 00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:53,480 Speaker 2: you know? And I was really scared. An't they going 519 00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:55,720 Speaker 2: to break my leg? What they gonna do to to 520 00:31:55,840 --> 00:32:00,400 Speaker 2: eliminate me? But it was very simple. One day letter 521 00:32:00,440 --> 00:32:04,480 Speaker 2: came and it said, in view of the fact that 522 00:32:04,560 --> 00:32:07,720 Speaker 2: you have been doing very poorly lately, we did not 523 00:32:07,960 --> 00:32:12,000 Speaker 2: select you for the Olympic team highlight. And that was 524 00:32:12,040 --> 00:32:12,760 Speaker 2: the end of it. 525 00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:19,600 Speaker 3: To be clear, Margaret Lambert had not been doing poorly. 526 00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:23,000 Speaker 3: The Nazis were just keeping her off the team. I mean, 527 00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:25,040 Speaker 3: just think about how it would have looked to have 528 00:32:25,080 --> 00:32:28,880 Speaker 3: a Jewish woman win gold at the Nazi Olympics. 529 00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:32,120 Speaker 2: And I sat I remember me sitting outside in the 530 00:32:32,240 --> 00:32:36,200 Speaker 2: stoop and I got this letter, and I must have 531 00:32:36,400 --> 00:32:40,400 Speaker 2: used every profanity I knew, and I knew a lot 532 00:32:40,440 --> 00:32:45,120 Speaker 2: of them. I think that was the first time I 533 00:32:45,200 --> 00:32:52,680 Speaker 2: really realized that my candidacy for as an Olympic athlete 534 00:32:53,120 --> 00:32:55,600 Speaker 2: was really all a shame I was. It was just 535 00:32:55,720 --> 00:33:01,440 Speaker 2: something that the Germans did to to fool the whole world. 536 00:33:03,000 --> 00:33:07,959 Speaker 3: Of course, Avery Brundage hadn't needed fooling. I do believe 537 00:33:07,960 --> 00:33:11,360 Speaker 3: that he loved the idea of the Olympics. Amateurism and 538 00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:15,520 Speaker 3: pure competition, using sports to prove your worth a kind 539 00:33:15,520 --> 00:33:18,760 Speaker 3: of utopia, protected from the corruption of the real world. 540 00:33:19,840 --> 00:33:23,600 Speaker 3: But Margaret Lambert should have been his reality check. If 541 00:33:23,640 --> 00:33:26,880 Speaker 3: someone like her couldn't win in Nazi Germany, that should 542 00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:30,880 Speaker 3: have made him sit up and pay attention. Instead, in 543 00:33:30,920 --> 00:33:33,520 Speaker 3: that room at the kaiser Off Hotel when the worst 544 00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:39,640 Speaker 3: had come out, he just seemed bored. It's that indifference 545 00:33:39,880 --> 00:33:43,040 Speaker 3: that got him his seat on the International Olympic Committee 546 00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:47,479 Speaker 3: just a month before the Berlin Games. He took it 547 00:33:47,520 --> 00:33:50,600 Speaker 3: from the only IOC member who'd resisted having the Games 548 00:33:50,640 --> 00:33:53,960 Speaker 3: in Nazi Germany, who'd written in his last months on 549 00:33:54,000 --> 00:33:58,000 Speaker 3: the IOC, if our committee permits the Games to be 550 00:33:58,080 --> 00:34:02,120 Speaker 3: held in Nazi Germany, there will be nothing left to 551 00:34:02,200 --> 00:34:07,880 Speaker 3: distinguish it from the Nazi ideal. He was forced to resign. 552 00:34:11,040 --> 00:34:14,279 Speaker 3: On August first, nineteen thirty six, the Olympic torch was 553 00:34:14,320 --> 00:34:17,240 Speaker 3: carried by relay for the first time ever from Olympia 554 00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:20,720 Speaker 3: in Greece all the way to the Reichschwartzfeld in Berlin. 555 00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:24,400 Speaker 3: When it got to the stadium, Avery Brandage was in 556 00:34:24,400 --> 00:34:28,040 Speaker 3: the audience. The Olympic bell inscribed with the words I 557 00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:32,480 Speaker 3: call the youth of the world rang out. Meanwhile, Margaret 558 00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:35,160 Speaker 3: Lambert was applying for a visa that would allow her 559 00:34:35,200 --> 00:34:38,160 Speaker 3: to leave Germany. She would never again live in her 560 00:34:38,160 --> 00:34:43,040 Speaker 3: home country. Brundage had what he always wanted, a seat 561 00:34:43,040 --> 00:34:47,239 Speaker 3: in the ruling class of his perfect Olympia, just in 562 00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:50,680 Speaker 3: time to watch Adolf Hitler give the opening speech at 563 00:34:50,719 --> 00:34:52,000 Speaker 3: the Olympic Games. 564 00:34:54,160 --> 00:35:01,120 Speaker 4: To speed it from fire, Noel tide rag. 565 00:35:05,400 --> 00:35:06,720 Speaker 2: Hit I announcing it opened. 566 00:35:07,040 --> 00:35:09,200 Speaker 6: Now that old kiddy him and I hope pad of 567 00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:10,080 Speaker 6: ragged the right Arm. 568 00:35:22,680 --> 00:35:26,640 Speaker 3: Revisionist History is produced by me Bennattaphaffrey, Tolly Emlin, and 569 00:35:26,719 --> 00:35:30,359 Speaker 3: Nina Bird Lawrence. Our editor is Sarah Nix. Fact checking 570 00:35:30,440 --> 00:35:33,960 Speaker 3: by Arthur Gomberts and J. L. Goldfine. Original scoring by 571 00:35:34,040 --> 00:35:38,600 Speaker 3: Luis Gara, Mastering by FLAONN Williams, Sarah Roguer, and Jake Gorsky. 572 00:35:39,200 --> 00:35:44,520 Speaker 3: Engineering by Nina Bird Lawrence. Our executive producer is Jacob Smith. 573 00:35:45,160 --> 00:35:48,080 Speaker 3: Special thanks on this episode to Karen schakerji to the 574 00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:52,000 Speaker 3: United States Holocaust Memorial Museum into Alexander Wells for his 575 00:35:52,160 --> 00:35:55,799 Speaker 3: translation of the Kaiserhoff meeting. I'm ben Nataphaffree 576 00:36:06,400 --> 00:36:06,440 Speaker 2: S