1 00:00:11,760 --> 00:00:14,760 Speaker 1: Good morning, peeps, and welcome to WOKP Daily with me 2 00:00:14,960 --> 00:00:18,479 Speaker 1: your Girl Danielle Moody, recording from the home bunker. 3 00:00:18,840 --> 00:00:19,280 Speaker 2: Folks. 4 00:00:19,480 --> 00:00:26,440 Speaker 1: With so much just shitty news these days, I'm really 5 00:00:26,480 --> 00:00:32,080 Speaker 1: excited to bring today's interview to you. Lee Sounders, the 6 00:00:32,120 --> 00:00:37,879 Speaker 1: president of ask Me, the one of the largest organizations 7 00:00:37,920 --> 00:00:42,320 Speaker 1: that represents unions in the country. Him and I got 8 00:00:42,320 --> 00:00:48,879 Speaker 1: into a conversation about the importance of unions of quality jobs, 9 00:00:49,120 --> 00:00:53,920 Speaker 1: of jobs that provide not only a living wage, but 10 00:00:54,080 --> 00:00:59,040 Speaker 1: dignity and full disclosure. As you all may know if 11 00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:01,760 Speaker 1: you've been listening to the show for a while, is 12 00:01:01,800 --> 00:01:07,000 Speaker 1: that last year I had the wonderful pleasure. There's not 13 00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:10,600 Speaker 1: a lot that I get to do sometimes outside of 14 00:01:10,760 --> 00:01:14,800 Speaker 1: direct and that political analysis, which is just becoming so 15 00:01:15,240 --> 00:01:21,480 Speaker 1: fucking draining. I cannot express to you all enough. But anyway, 16 00:01:22,280 --> 00:01:25,640 Speaker 1: last year I had the pleasure of doing some wonderful 17 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:30,640 Speaker 1: storytelling workshops and media training for members of Ask Me, 18 00:01:31,640 --> 00:01:37,360 Speaker 1: and it was such a fucking joy. I cannot express 19 00:01:37,360 --> 00:01:43,119 Speaker 1: it enough. To talk with janitors and you know, and 20 00:01:43,280 --> 00:01:51,640 Speaker 1: teachers and optometrists and you know, the people who make 21 00:01:52,000 --> 00:01:57,640 Speaker 1: our communities tick that don't get the respect and the 22 00:01:57,720 --> 00:02:05,560 Speaker 1: pay that they deserve and to talk with real people, right, 23 00:02:05,920 --> 00:02:12,799 Speaker 1: some of which were quote unquote essential workers, and talking 24 00:02:12,800 --> 00:02:17,880 Speaker 1: to them about their experience of working, you know, going 25 00:02:17,919 --> 00:02:21,320 Speaker 1: to work during COVID while so many of us were 26 00:02:22,200 --> 00:02:27,560 Speaker 1: quarantining at home, and what that experience was like. And 27 00:02:27,880 --> 00:02:32,040 Speaker 1: while we love to say that these folks are essential, 28 00:02:32,919 --> 00:02:35,480 Speaker 1: we treat them in many ways in our society like 29 00:02:35,560 --> 00:02:40,200 Speaker 1: they are disposable while lifting up the fucking you know, 30 00:02:40,520 --> 00:02:44,480 Speaker 1: billionaires and millionaires that make money off of their backs 31 00:02:44,560 --> 00:02:50,320 Speaker 1: and our backs. So this conversation with President Saunders today 32 00:02:51,080 --> 00:02:55,080 Speaker 1: was just you know, a little bright light, you know, 33 00:02:55,600 --> 00:03:03,560 Speaker 1: in really increasingly just exhausting and dark times. I've said 34 00:03:03,560 --> 00:03:09,840 Speaker 1: this to you all before that it is imperative, imperative 35 00:03:10,960 --> 00:03:16,080 Speaker 1: to look for the light daily so that you do 36 00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:21,440 Speaker 1: not succumb to darkness. And I hope that today's conversation 37 00:03:21,960 --> 00:03:27,760 Speaker 1: is and can provide a bright light. Coming up next 38 00:03:28,000 --> 00:03:36,680 Speaker 1: my conversation with President Lee Sounders, folks, I am very 39 00:03:36,720 --> 00:03:42,080 Speaker 1: excited to welcome back to WOKF Daily President Lee Saunders, 40 00:03:42,120 --> 00:03:45,240 Speaker 1: who is the president of the American Federation of State, 41 00:03:45,560 --> 00:03:49,960 Speaker 1: County and Municipal Employees. Ask me, you have heard me 42 00:03:50,240 --> 00:03:55,200 Speaker 1: talk about this organization which represents about one point four 43 00:03:55,480 --> 00:04:01,800 Speaker 1: million people across the country in a mirror of different occupations, 44 00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:07,400 Speaker 1: including nurses to correction officers, childcare providers. It runs the 45 00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:12,040 Speaker 1: gamut and President Lee Saunders is the first African American 46 00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:16,919 Speaker 1: to serve as ask Me's president. President Saunders talk to 47 00:04:17,000 --> 00:04:24,920 Speaker 1: me about the importance of ask ME and how unions, 48 00:04:24,960 --> 00:04:29,120 Speaker 1: and particularly your union, impact communities. 49 00:04:30,200 --> 00:04:34,240 Speaker 2: Well, we consider our one point four million members everyday 50 00:04:34,279 --> 00:04:38,919 Speaker 2: heroes who provide important and crucial public services to the 51 00:04:38,920 --> 00:04:43,320 Speaker 2: citizens of this country and communities across this country. You 52 00:04:43,440 --> 00:04:47,479 Speaker 2: mentioned just a few of the occupations, but if you 53 00:04:47,480 --> 00:04:51,240 Speaker 2: look at public service and the occupations within public service, 54 00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:56,120 Speaker 2: whether it's a sanitation worker, whether it is a correction 55 00:04:56,200 --> 00:05:02,200 Speaker 2: officers you stated, a social worker, childcare worker, home care workers. 56 00:05:03,080 --> 00:05:07,839 Speaker 2: We represent those members across the country and they provide 57 00:05:08,120 --> 00:05:12,600 Speaker 2: essential public services to all of us. And sometimes they 58 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:14,960 Speaker 2: work in the background and you don't even know they're there. 59 00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:19,520 Speaker 2: Sometimes you forget about the public services that are provided, 60 00:05:19,640 --> 00:05:23,000 Speaker 2: whether you're drinking clean water or having your trash picked up, 61 00:05:23,720 --> 00:05:28,400 Speaker 2: or protecting one another. And that's what our members do 62 00:05:28,560 --> 00:05:31,599 Speaker 2: every single day, and that's why it's very important for 63 00:05:31,640 --> 00:05:34,440 Speaker 2: them to have a seat at the table and a 64 00:05:34,520 --> 00:05:37,799 Speaker 2: voice on the job, and the union provides that for them. 65 00:05:38,560 --> 00:05:42,360 Speaker 1: And I appreciate that work so very much. My mother 66 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:47,400 Speaker 1: is a retired nurse and so was a part of AFSME, 67 00:05:47,760 --> 00:05:51,440 Speaker 1: a part of the union, and I have spent last 68 00:05:51,600 --> 00:05:56,200 Speaker 1: year working with some of your wonderful members in helping 69 00:05:56,680 --> 00:05:59,839 Speaker 1: tell their incredible stories of the work that they do 70 00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:03,839 Speaker 1: and why it's so important. And I think that one time, 71 00:06:03,880 --> 00:06:07,440 Speaker 1: when I was in a training someone had said, you know, 72 00:06:07,640 --> 00:06:11,720 Speaker 1: these are the jobs that no one recognizes when they're 73 00:06:11,760 --> 00:06:14,679 Speaker 1: done well, but they always recognize when they're not done 74 00:06:14,960 --> 00:06:17,960 Speaker 1: or when something goes wrong and you need it. And 75 00:06:18,040 --> 00:06:23,679 Speaker 1: these are jobs that are integral to how our communities function. 76 00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:27,360 Speaker 1: And so why do you think that it is so important, 77 00:06:27,400 --> 00:06:30,400 Speaker 1: particularly in this day and age where we're seeing so 78 00:06:30,520 --> 00:06:35,880 Speaker 1: many union battles, that unions exist well. 79 00:06:35,960 --> 00:06:40,000 Speaker 2: It provides the opportunities for workers to make a choice, 80 00:06:40,600 --> 00:06:43,440 Speaker 2: and that choice is to try to deal with things 81 00:06:43,480 --> 00:06:46,200 Speaker 2: on your own, or operate in an environment where you 82 00:06:46,279 --> 00:06:50,080 Speaker 2: have come together with other workers at the same workplace, 83 00:06:50,120 --> 00:06:52,680 Speaker 2: the same work site, and to have that seat at 84 00:06:52,720 --> 00:06:56,920 Speaker 2: the table to negotiate wages and benefits and working conditions, 85 00:06:57,520 --> 00:07:00,880 Speaker 2: and that's extremely important. And you see that there is 86 00:07:00,920 --> 00:07:03,160 Speaker 2: a change going on in this country right now as 87 00:07:03,200 --> 00:07:07,120 Speaker 2: far as workers wanting to be a part of unions 88 00:07:07,120 --> 00:07:11,600 Speaker 2: and wanting to organize into unions. And you especially see it, Danielle, 89 00:07:12,360 --> 00:07:15,800 Speaker 2: with young people wanting to come together and understanding the 90 00:07:15,880 --> 00:07:18,360 Speaker 2: importance of doing this. They want to have some control 91 00:07:18,480 --> 00:07:20,680 Speaker 2: over their lives. They want to have that seat at 92 00:07:20,720 --> 00:07:23,880 Speaker 2: the table to talk about their wage increases or their wages. 93 00:07:23,920 --> 00:07:26,240 Speaker 2: They want to talk about pensions, they want to talk 94 00:07:26,280 --> 00:07:29,760 Speaker 2: about healthcare, they want to talk about working conditions, all 95 00:07:29,760 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 2: of those kinds of things. The way that you do 96 00:07:31,480 --> 00:07:34,720 Speaker 2: that is not through one on one conversation, but it's 97 00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:40,000 Speaker 2: through an aggressive, proactive choice of belonging to a union 98 00:07:40,280 --> 00:07:43,120 Speaker 2: to fight for these things at the table. And you 99 00:07:43,200 --> 00:07:44,720 Speaker 2: see it happening all over the country. 100 00:07:45,320 --> 00:07:48,600 Speaker 1: Why do you think that we dip and kind of 101 00:07:48,720 --> 00:07:51,480 Speaker 1: we go up and then we go down in terms 102 00:07:51,560 --> 00:07:55,920 Speaker 1: of how society as a whole either is celebrating unions 103 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:59,840 Speaker 1: or demonizing them. Right, And I look at essentially where 104 00:08:00,120 --> 00:08:03,120 Speaker 1: some of the big headlines in the last couple of 105 00:08:03,200 --> 00:08:06,840 Speaker 1: years have been around Starbucks employees, and have been around 106 00:08:06,920 --> 00:08:10,920 Speaker 1: Amazon employees and the auto workers as well as the 107 00:08:11,160 --> 00:08:18,360 Speaker 1: ups right workers who we see these everyday. People take 108 00:08:18,440 --> 00:08:20,560 Speaker 1: on what I will say. I'm not putting words in 109 00:08:20,600 --> 00:08:24,400 Speaker 1: your mouth, but these are my words. Very greedy corporations 110 00:08:25,000 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 1: who have forgotten why they have received so much wealth 111 00:08:29,080 --> 00:08:35,199 Speaker 1: over the years. Right and unions then are demonized because 112 00:08:35,200 --> 00:08:38,360 Speaker 1: they say, well, corporations, they can't be regulated because then 113 00:08:38,440 --> 00:08:41,400 Speaker 1: they'll lose money and people will lose jobs. What do 114 00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:43,319 Speaker 1: you say to that, Well. 115 00:08:43,320 --> 00:08:45,880 Speaker 2: First of all, let me just give you some very 116 00:08:46,679 --> 00:08:50,960 Speaker 2: important statistics as far as the way that people feel 117 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 2: currently about about union. Sixty seven percent of the American 118 00:08:56,679 --> 00:09:01,439 Speaker 2: public support unions and what they stand for just as important, 119 00:09:01,440 --> 00:09:04,559 Speaker 2: if not more important. Eighty eight percent of young people 120 00:09:04,679 --> 00:09:09,520 Speaker 2: understand the importance of union. So those people have got 121 00:09:09,559 --> 00:09:11,880 Speaker 2: to understand this. And now I'm going to give you 122 00:09:11,880 --> 00:09:17,400 Speaker 2: another statistic. Okay, in nineteen sixty five, CEOs were making 123 00:09:17,440 --> 00:09:22,920 Speaker 2: twenty one times as much as the typical worker, union 124 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:28,719 Speaker 2: and non union. Okay, today, as we speak, CEOs are 125 00:09:28,720 --> 00:09:33,199 Speaker 2: making three hundred and fifty times more than the average worker. 126 00:09:33,679 --> 00:09:37,920 Speaker 2: People understand that that is wrong, that that's not a 127 00:09:38,000 --> 00:09:41,000 Speaker 2: level playing field, and the way to combat that, the 128 00:09:41,080 --> 00:09:43,760 Speaker 2: way to get in the game and put skin in 129 00:09:43,760 --> 00:09:46,720 Speaker 2: the game is to join a union and fight for 130 00:09:46,800 --> 00:09:48,319 Speaker 2: your rights at the bargaining table. 131 00:09:48,920 --> 00:09:52,600 Speaker 1: How has that been able to happen? President Saunders? Where 132 00:09:52,640 --> 00:09:57,520 Speaker 1: you go from such an extraordinary jump over sixty years, 133 00:09:57,880 --> 00:10:02,760 Speaker 1: where at one time it was twenty one times what 134 00:10:02,800 --> 00:10:05,240 Speaker 1: a worker was and now it's three hundred. How does 135 00:10:05,280 --> 00:10:05,920 Speaker 1: that happen? 136 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:13,440 Speaker 2: I think that corporations and CEOs have the ability to 137 00:10:13,520 --> 00:10:19,080 Speaker 2: slant their story so it impinges upon, infringes upon what 138 00:10:19,320 --> 00:10:21,480 Speaker 2: unions are trying to do. They've got a bunch of 139 00:10:21,480 --> 00:10:25,240 Speaker 2: money and they've got a bunch of power, and they 140 00:10:25,320 --> 00:10:32,680 Speaker 2: will talk and spread rumors misinformation about unions, and people 141 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:35,720 Speaker 2: were believing that. But now I think that it's kind 142 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:37,959 Speaker 2: of reversed. Even though they've still got all that money 143 00:10:38,280 --> 00:10:40,640 Speaker 2: and I'm trying to do the same thing. People are 144 00:10:40,640 --> 00:10:45,600 Speaker 2: standing up and saying no way. I mean, you mentioned Starbucks, right, 145 00:10:45,840 --> 00:10:49,040 Speaker 2: I mean you mentioned what happened with the UAW strike 146 00:10:49,120 --> 00:10:53,280 Speaker 2: and with the Teamsters, with us organizing absently organizing childcare 147 00:10:53,280 --> 00:10:57,800 Speaker 2: and home care workers. People are saying, get real, get real, 148 00:10:58,160 --> 00:11:01,120 Speaker 2: and people are willing to stand up and fight for it. 149 00:11:01,320 --> 00:11:05,520 Speaker 2: People also understand this when you look at our history, 150 00:11:06,240 --> 00:11:12,360 Speaker 2: labor unions have stood tall, especially in the sixties, and 151 00:11:12,559 --> 00:11:17,560 Speaker 2: connecting ourselves with progressive movements that fight for workers' rights. 152 00:11:18,240 --> 00:11:21,800 Speaker 2: Look the March on Washington. The original topic of that 153 00:11:21,920 --> 00:11:27,000 Speaker 2: was March on Washington for Jobs right. And you look 154 00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:30,880 Speaker 2: who helped plan that along with doctor King and his people. 155 00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:34,280 Speaker 2: But it was a guy named a Philip Randolph, and 156 00:11:34,320 --> 00:11:36,920 Speaker 2: it was a guy named bayart Rustin who came out 157 00:11:36,960 --> 00:11:43,000 Speaker 2: of unions. They understood the connection between civil rights and 158 00:11:43,120 --> 00:11:46,199 Speaker 2: labor rights. And it's so important that we remind your 159 00:11:46,320 --> 00:11:49,000 Speaker 2: listeners of this, especially in African American history month Black 160 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:52,920 Speaker 2: is Free Month, where there is a direct connection in 161 00:11:53,000 --> 00:11:58,080 Speaker 2: developing the necessary alliances between labor and communities of color 162 00:11:59,000 --> 00:12:02,000 Speaker 2: and folks who believe that working people should have a 163 00:12:02,040 --> 00:12:05,400 Speaker 2: shot at that American dream to come together and fight 164 00:12:05,480 --> 00:12:08,920 Speaker 2: for it. You know, we're a union that came out 165 00:12:08,920 --> 00:12:11,240 Speaker 2: of a major struggle in nineteen sixty eight, and you're 166 00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:16,679 Speaker 2: aware of this. When thirteen hundred sanitation workers in Memphis, Tennessee, 167 00:12:16,920 --> 00:12:19,480 Speaker 2: decided that they were sick and tired of being sick 168 00:12:19,480 --> 00:12:25,320 Speaker 2: and tired, and they went on strike on strike February 169 00:12:25,360 --> 00:12:30,200 Speaker 2: twelfth of nineteen sixty eight because two of their co 170 00:12:30,320 --> 00:12:34,079 Speaker 2: workers were crushed in the back of a sanitation truck 171 00:12:34,320 --> 00:12:38,240 Speaker 2: trying to get out of bad weather. And this problem 172 00:12:38,360 --> 00:12:41,720 Speaker 2: had been brought to the management's attention on many times 173 00:12:41,720 --> 00:12:44,040 Speaker 2: that they were dealing with faulty equipment, and guess what, 174 00:12:44,120 --> 00:12:45,959 Speaker 2: they didn't listen to them. They just told them to 175 00:12:46,040 --> 00:12:48,040 Speaker 2: get back out there and work as hard as you can. 176 00:12:48,120 --> 00:12:51,360 Speaker 2: We don't care what happens to you. There's a history 177 00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:54,360 Speaker 2: there and there is a struggle there that people have 178 00:12:54,440 --> 00:12:57,360 Speaker 2: got to connect with today. I mean, that struggle is 179 00:12:57,440 --> 00:13:01,559 Speaker 2: real today as well, especially in the African American community. 180 00:13:01,720 --> 00:13:05,800 Speaker 2: That's why we put out a podcast called I Am 181 00:13:06,120 --> 00:13:08,960 Speaker 2: which talks about the struggle in nineteen sixty eight, but 182 00:13:09,200 --> 00:13:12,400 Speaker 2: what we must do today to continue that fate. If 183 00:13:12,520 --> 00:13:17,160 Speaker 2: thirteen hundred sanitation workers in the Deep South African Americans 184 00:13:17,520 --> 00:13:20,439 Speaker 2: could fight back with their union and they were members 185 00:13:20,440 --> 00:13:23,640 Speaker 2: of Local seventeen thirty three ass me and be successful 186 00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:28,720 Speaker 2: and win, then you know what, we can overcome any obstacle. 187 00:13:29,160 --> 00:13:31,000 Speaker 2: And that's what the story is that we've got to 188 00:13:31,040 --> 00:13:34,760 Speaker 2: continue to tell folks. So when people are organizing, you 189 00:13:34,840 --> 00:13:37,040 Speaker 2: look back at that nineteen sixty eight strike or other 190 00:13:37,080 --> 00:13:40,160 Speaker 2: strikes that we've had across the country and saying it 191 00:13:40,200 --> 00:13:43,160 Speaker 2: can be done. It can be done when we're bringing 192 00:13:43,240 --> 00:13:47,800 Speaker 2: our communities together and talking about the injustices that exist, 193 00:13:48,160 --> 00:13:50,680 Speaker 2: the fact that corporations are making so much money, the 194 00:13:50,760 --> 00:13:53,079 Speaker 2: CEOs are making so much money, and they don't want 195 00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:58,040 Speaker 2: to share in those profits. Then people relate to that. 196 00:13:58,480 --> 00:14:00,800 Speaker 2: And that's why it's such an exciting time for labor 197 00:14:00,880 --> 00:14:04,320 Speaker 2: right now, because you've got young people organizing within our union. 198 00:14:04,600 --> 00:14:08,880 Speaker 2: We're organizing cultural workers like never before, and museums and 199 00:14:09,320 --> 00:14:12,520 Speaker 2: libraries and zoos and they're coming and you know what, 200 00:14:13,440 --> 00:14:16,800 Speaker 2: they're coming to us asking us to help them provide 201 00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:20,280 Speaker 2: support so they can organize at the workplace. And so 202 00:14:20,400 --> 00:14:22,560 Speaker 2: we've got to make all of these kinds of connections 203 00:14:22,560 --> 00:14:24,720 Speaker 2: and understand that we've come a long way, but we've 204 00:14:24,720 --> 00:14:26,960 Speaker 2: still got a long way to go, and we've got 205 00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:29,120 Speaker 2: to take advantage of the moment. And this moment is 206 00:14:29,160 --> 00:14:31,480 Speaker 2: that people understand the importance of organizing. 207 00:14:36,440 --> 00:14:41,280 Speaker 1: When you think about nineteen sixty eight, right, and how 208 00:14:41,760 --> 00:14:45,040 Speaker 1: that's relatively right in the grand scheme of things, small 209 00:14:45,120 --> 00:14:50,440 Speaker 1: group of black workers were able to make real change, 210 00:14:50,800 --> 00:14:56,120 Speaker 1: and we kind of look at COVID nineteen, right, was it? 211 00:14:56,280 --> 00:14:58,560 Speaker 1: I think, and I want to get your thoughts, was 212 00:14:58,600 --> 00:15:02,600 Speaker 1: a very big wake up in terms of how people 213 00:15:03,080 --> 00:15:06,400 Speaker 1: were treated in various industries. We don't have a caste 214 00:15:06,480 --> 00:15:09,640 Speaker 1: system in the United States, but we very well were 215 00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:15,320 Speaker 1: aware of the economic caste and class system that was 216 00:15:15,440 --> 00:15:19,800 Speaker 1: so hard to ignore during COVID. How do you think 217 00:15:19,840 --> 00:15:23,640 Speaker 1: that that, particularly as it was affecting more black and 218 00:15:23,800 --> 00:15:29,239 Speaker 1: brown workers that were in the quote unquote essential roles, 219 00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:32,520 Speaker 1: how do you think that that helped to reshape our 220 00:15:32,880 --> 00:15:36,560 Speaker 1: vision and thought around workers and unions because. 221 00:15:36,240 --> 00:15:40,600 Speaker 2: People, I think shared their experiences and talked about the 222 00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:44,280 Speaker 2: injustices it existed during COVID. You look at the United 223 00:15:44,320 --> 00:15:47,880 Speaker 2: food and commercial workers and they were forced to work 224 00:15:48,560 --> 00:15:51,960 Speaker 2: in unhealthy plants, They were told to come to work 225 00:15:52,000 --> 00:15:55,280 Speaker 2: when they were sick, I mean, and there were so 226 00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:57,600 Speaker 2: many things happening to them, and they finally stood up 227 00:15:57,640 --> 00:16:01,280 Speaker 2: and said this is wrong. I mean, this is absolutely wrong. 228 00:16:01,400 --> 00:16:05,560 Speaker 2: This is we're living in the richest country in the world, 229 00:16:06,320 --> 00:16:10,600 Speaker 2: that we're being forced to work under slave labor, to 230 00:16:10,760 --> 00:16:15,480 Speaker 2: work under situations that are not healthy. And people said 231 00:16:15,560 --> 00:16:18,520 Speaker 2: enough was enough. And you had this happening in each industry. 232 00:16:18,520 --> 00:16:20,440 Speaker 2: You had it happening in the public sector, in the 233 00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:23,920 Speaker 2: public service with healthcare workers having to go to those 234 00:16:23,920 --> 00:16:28,680 Speaker 2: hospitals because they were short staffed, having to wear garbage 235 00:16:28,720 --> 00:16:33,320 Speaker 2: bags as gowns. Right, yeah, okay, because the employer didn't 236 00:16:33,320 --> 00:16:38,440 Speaker 2: provide them with the necessary equipment and masks. And so 237 00:16:38,960 --> 00:16:42,120 Speaker 2: I think that there was a storm brewing and all 238 00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:46,000 Speaker 2: of it came together where folks said, Okay, this is crazy, 239 00:16:46,280 --> 00:16:51,280 Speaker 2: We've had enough, and people rallied around the importance of 240 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:56,640 Speaker 2: coming together and make your collective voice heard. And we've 241 00:16:56,680 --> 00:16:59,080 Speaker 2: got to take advantage of this moment. And you see 242 00:16:59,120 --> 00:17:03,040 Speaker 2: it happening, especially in the African American community. I mean, 243 00:17:03,280 --> 00:17:06,600 Speaker 2: if you look at the last BLS statistics, three hundred 244 00:17:06,600 --> 00:17:09,040 Speaker 2: and nine thousand workers of color joined the labor movement 245 00:17:09,119 --> 00:17:12,919 Speaker 2: last year. I mean, that's a good number. But we 246 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:15,200 Speaker 2: can do better, and we can do more, and we've 247 00:17:15,240 --> 00:17:18,560 Speaker 2: got to we've got to continue the level of excitement 248 00:17:19,440 --> 00:17:22,040 Speaker 2: that exists right now, and we've got to continue to 249 00:17:22,080 --> 00:17:25,840 Speaker 2: talk to workers and talk about the importance of unions 250 00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:28,280 Speaker 2: and to have that seat at the table. And they 251 00:17:28,320 --> 00:17:33,760 Speaker 2: will come. Now I will say this, we will continue 252 00:17:34,000 --> 00:17:40,280 Speaker 2: and labor is committed to organizing new workers, people of color, 253 00:17:40,480 --> 00:17:43,600 Speaker 2: and all workers. But we've got to have a change 254 00:17:43,720 --> 00:17:46,000 Speaker 2: in the labor laws in this country because the level 255 00:17:46,080 --> 00:17:48,880 Speaker 2: the playing field is not level. And if you look 256 00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:51,879 Speaker 2: at the Amazon workers, for example, where they organized what 257 00:17:52,760 --> 00:17:55,800 Speaker 2: two years ago in New York, they haven't even had 258 00:17:55,840 --> 00:17:58,360 Speaker 2: a chance to sit at the table. Yet. You look 259 00:17:58,400 --> 00:18:01,560 Speaker 2: at the Starbucks workers, they've been at the table, but 260 00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:03,760 Speaker 2: a number of them have been fired and they have 261 00:18:03,920 --> 00:18:07,600 Speaker 2: not resolved any or come to an agreement on a 262 00:18:07,640 --> 00:18:12,560 Speaker 2: contract because the employer can spend billions of dollars stalling 263 00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:17,160 Speaker 2: those negotiations instead of putting those dollars into the pockets 264 00:18:17,160 --> 00:18:20,760 Speaker 2: of workers who are providing those functions and those services 265 00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:24,920 Speaker 2: across the country. So we've got to attack this from 266 00:18:25,000 --> 00:18:28,280 Speaker 2: a variety of points. We've got to continue to organize, 267 00:18:28,880 --> 00:18:31,560 Speaker 2: we've got to change labor laws in this country. And 268 00:18:31,600 --> 00:18:33,640 Speaker 2: the way you do that is through the political process 269 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:37,000 Speaker 2: in the public sector. In the private sector, you've got 270 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:39,760 Speaker 2: the National Labor Relations Act that must be changed. And 271 00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:42,199 Speaker 2: the public sector, we're pushing for something called the Public 272 00:18:42,240 --> 00:18:45,280 Speaker 2: Service Freedom to Negotiate Act because we are not covered 273 00:18:45,359 --> 00:18:48,439 Speaker 2: under the national law. Where there is a level playing 274 00:18:48,480 --> 00:18:52,520 Speaker 2: field for workers to organize and to reach fair contracts, 275 00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:58,040 Speaker 2: or there will be impeditiments put on and we'd have 276 00:18:58,160 --> 00:19:00,560 Speaker 2: to figure out how to deal with the employer. Different fact, 277 00:19:00,680 --> 00:19:03,600 Speaker 2: they try to block those kinds of efforts. So we're 278 00:19:03,600 --> 00:19:05,720 Speaker 2: going to continue to organize, but we really need labor 279 00:19:05,760 --> 00:19:08,480 Speaker 2: law change, in labor law reform in this country as well. 280 00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:11,680 Speaker 1: How do you think you know, you mentioned politics, and 281 00:19:11,680 --> 00:19:14,520 Speaker 1: then obviously this is all deeply rooted in politics as 282 00:19:14,560 --> 00:19:18,560 Speaker 1: well as in policy. How do you think that we 283 00:19:18,640 --> 00:19:23,880 Speaker 1: need to have a conversation about labor and democracy. How 284 00:19:23,920 --> 00:19:29,640 Speaker 1: does labor in your mind, the labor movement strengthen our 285 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:34,240 Speaker 1: conversation around a secure democracy. 286 00:19:36,080 --> 00:19:37,720 Speaker 2: Well, first of all, I think you have to look 287 00:19:37,760 --> 00:19:40,280 Speaker 2: at the way that we operate internally. I mean, labor 288 00:19:40,359 --> 00:19:46,040 Speaker 2: unions are democracy in action. People take votes, We elect 289 00:19:46,160 --> 00:19:51,680 Speaker 2: our leaders within the local union leadership. You establish processes 290 00:19:51,720 --> 00:19:54,560 Speaker 2: to decide what's going to be bargained for, having that 291 00:19:54,680 --> 00:19:58,760 Speaker 2: bargaining committee set up. When a tentative agreement is reached, 292 00:19:58,760 --> 00:20:02,159 Speaker 2: and you saw that with the UAW and with the 293 00:20:02,200 --> 00:20:05,240 Speaker 2: Teamsters and with all of us, then we take those agreements, 294 00:20:05,280 --> 00:20:09,960 Speaker 2: those tentative agreements back to the members to vote it 295 00:20:10,000 --> 00:20:12,439 Speaker 2: up or to vote it down. So we are democracy 296 00:20:12,480 --> 00:20:15,760 Speaker 2: in action. But we also understand that there's a threat 297 00:20:15,760 --> 00:20:18,639 Speaker 2: to our democracy with all the kinds of things that 298 00:20:18,680 --> 00:20:21,760 Speaker 2: we have fought for and stand for every single day. 299 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:28,359 Speaker 2: Whether it's voting rights, okay, that's one, whether it's labor rights, 300 00:20:28,920 --> 00:20:33,440 Speaker 2: whether it's economic justice, whether it's women's rights. I mean, 301 00:20:33,560 --> 00:20:38,360 Speaker 2: we support those efforts all the time, and not only 302 00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:41,280 Speaker 2: support it by talking about it, but many times supporting 303 00:20:41,320 --> 00:20:45,240 Speaker 2: it through our resources that we have. Because even if 304 00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:49,040 Speaker 2: you may not be a union member, you care about 305 00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:52,400 Speaker 2: those values that we care about, we believe and what 306 00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:54,439 Speaker 2: we've got to do is show that there is a 307 00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:58,560 Speaker 2: bigger picture and that we are involved in a movement 308 00:20:59,280 --> 00:21:02,760 Speaker 2: within labor and among our allies and friends in our 309 00:21:02,760 --> 00:21:06,080 Speaker 2: communities across the country to make our voices heard together 310 00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:08,800 Speaker 2: and fight for the things we really believe in. And 311 00:21:08,840 --> 00:21:11,560 Speaker 2: we're doing that every single day. And that's why the 312 00:21:11,600 --> 00:21:15,040 Speaker 2: political environment right now is so important. Where we fight 313 00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:18,960 Speaker 2: for what we believe in, and we vote for what 314 00:21:19,080 --> 00:21:23,119 Speaker 2: we believe in, and we're educating and mobilizing and organizing 315 00:21:23,160 --> 00:21:25,679 Speaker 2: our members and our communities across the country not to 316 00:21:25,760 --> 00:21:27,960 Speaker 2: tell them how to vote who to vote for. We 317 00:21:28,000 --> 00:21:30,639 Speaker 2: should never do that, but we try to educate our 318 00:21:30,680 --> 00:21:33,639 Speaker 2: folks about Okay, who's going to improve your lives and 319 00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:36,040 Speaker 2: the lives of your families and who wants to destroy 320 00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:36,600 Speaker 2: your life? 321 00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:46,320 Speaker 1: Final question for you, what can our listeners do? Who 322 00:21:46,359 --> 00:21:49,080 Speaker 1: would love to get involved, who would love to support? 323 00:21:49,200 --> 00:21:53,200 Speaker 1: Ask me what can they do in order to get involved? 324 00:21:53,560 --> 00:21:56,960 Speaker 2: Well, if you see that there's an organizing campaign, not 325 00:21:57,000 --> 00:22:01,280 Speaker 2: only asks me, but with any union in your sitting, 326 00:22:03,760 --> 00:22:07,120 Speaker 2: give support. Give support when you see a picket line. 327 00:22:07,520 --> 00:22:09,639 Speaker 2: Don't just drive by that picket line and act like 328 00:22:09,680 --> 00:22:13,320 Speaker 2: it doesn't exist. Stop your car and get out and 329 00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:15,879 Speaker 2: thank the workers for what they're doing, for standing up 330 00:22:15,880 --> 00:22:20,160 Speaker 2: for themselves. Be vocal and be educated about the issues 331 00:22:20,160 --> 00:22:24,600 Speaker 2: that confront working families, because I guarantee you it affects 332 00:22:24,600 --> 00:22:29,720 Speaker 2: members of your own families. Everyone is impacted by the 333 00:22:29,760 --> 00:22:33,520 Speaker 2: policies that are being established by federal and state government 334 00:22:33,800 --> 00:22:37,160 Speaker 2: regarding workers having a better life or having a light 335 00:22:37,240 --> 00:22:40,040 Speaker 2: that is not so good. So you've got to stand 336 00:22:40,119 --> 00:22:43,320 Speaker 2: up in coalition and make your voices heard every single day. 337 00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:45,679 Speaker 2: We can't run from this battle. We can't run from 338 00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:48,600 Speaker 2: this fight, and we've got to be very vocal and 339 00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:53,440 Speaker 2: active about working with folks to have a better life 340 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:54,320 Speaker 2: across the country. 341 00:22:55,119 --> 00:22:58,600 Speaker 1: President Lee Sounders, thank you so much for making the 342 00:22:58,600 --> 00:23:01,480 Speaker 1: time to join WKP. I really appreciate your work, I 343 00:23:01,520 --> 00:23:05,320 Speaker 1: appreciate your organization, and it has been a pleasure to 344 00:23:05,400 --> 00:23:06,360 Speaker 1: talk to you today. 345 00:23:06,920 --> 00:23:07,760 Speaker 2: Thank you very much. 346 00:23:13,200 --> 00:23:16,200 Speaker 1: That is it for me today. Dear friends on wok 347 00:23:16,600 --> 00:23:20,280 Speaker 1: f as always, power to the people and to all 348 00:23:20,600 --> 00:23:24,480 Speaker 1: the people. Power, get woke and stay woke as fuck.