Speaker 1: UM, I know I I don't normally talk about the
Speaker 1: fact that I have another podcast on I Heart which
Speaker 1: is called I Hear Voices christ to Carlson. But we're
Speaker 1: doing something super cool that's launching right when this episode
Speaker 1: is gonna air. So I just want two seconds to
Speaker 1: talk about it because it's really neat. UM will give you. Okay,
Speaker 1: that's it, all right, moving on to other appreciations, other things,
Speaker 1: onto literary distance. UM. Yes, so uh. We talked to
Speaker 1: all the greatest voice over actors in the country. We
Speaker 1: love it. I love animation so much. But our number
Speaker 1: one goal when we met up with I Heart and
Speaker 1: I Heart was like, let's go do it is we
Speaker 1: wanted to do an American Idol style contest. We're blanketing
Speaker 1: the country with a contest call all the super awesome
Speaker 1: contests become the next big voice actor. And so it
Speaker 1: is open for everybody over the age of eighteen who's
Speaker 1: a US resident. We are getting everyone who can be
Speaker 1: involved to enter. We are going to find a colleague,
Speaker 1: and the prizes are ridiculous. So I just wanted to
Speaker 1: what do people have to do, like send in a
Speaker 1: two minute clip that's either video or audio. You send
Speaker 1: it to I hear voices at I Heart radio dot
Speaker 1: com between January nine and February nine, and you could
Speaker 1: do whatever you want your own voices ad reads. If
Speaker 1: you think you've got the good you know in a
Speaker 1: world like whatever kind of voice you can do, do
Speaker 1: that and the prizes are insane. First you get flown
Speaker 1: out to Los Angeles where you have lunch with Christie
Speaker 1: and I. You get a thousand dollar spending money. But
Speaker 1: if that's not cool enough, which it isn't obviously, at
Speaker 1: that lunch, you also meet with your new agent, because
Speaker 1: you are signing with my voiceover agency C E. S
Speaker 1: Day for a year. Like you get a break, you
Speaker 1: get a big break. And then I called my friends
Speaker 1: a Critical Role, which is, you know, obviously a huge
Speaker 1: juggernaut around the world. And you are also getting a
Speaker 1: private session with Emmy Award winning director Sam Regal who's
Speaker 1: one of the cast members of Critical Role, and Emmy
Speaker 1: Award winning UH Emmy nominated Mary McGlenn, who's the director
Speaker 1: of their new show box Makina. It's really cool. It
Speaker 1: is a ton of fun. If you think you can
Speaker 1: do voices, you've grown up watching cartoons, you want to
Speaker 1: try it. This is really an opportunity. I mean, any
Speaker 1: time I tell an actor you win an actual agent,
Speaker 1: they're like, you've got to be KIDDI makes it's one
Speaker 1: of the hardest things to do in this one of
Speaker 1: the hardest things. It's it's such a hard world to
Speaker 1: break into, um, you know, mostly because it's so competitive.
Speaker 1: I think a lot of people think they can do this.
Speaker 1: You know, it's a heart it's such a difficult art form,
Speaker 1: and but it's it's so fun too, you know, It's
Speaker 1: it's difficult, but it's so fun. And when you watch
Speaker 1: cartoons or you listen to stuff, you're always like, I
Speaker 1: think I could do cool voices, you know, like everybody
Speaker 1: kind of has that. Not everybody, but I think a
Speaker 1: lot of people have that in the back of their mind,
Speaker 1: like this is fun. That's so enter because we're picking
Speaker 1: sixteen people and then you're gonna go head to head
Speaker 1: against each other until we get down to the final
Speaker 1: two where we have a big show and then the
Speaker 1: final the finalist you're picked, you win, flown out to
Speaker 1: l a, the cut, the agent, the whole thing. So
Speaker 1: we're super excited. I hear voices at i heart radio
Speaker 1: dot Com between January nine and February nine, US residents
Speaker 1: over the age of eighteen. We can't wait. That is
Speaker 1: my selfish plug. If you know anybody who's like at
Speaker 1: your bank, your uncle, your aunt, anybody who's like, oh
Speaker 1: they do funny voices, tell them to enter. It's gonna
Speaker 1: be a ton of fun. That's it. I'm done with
Speaker 1: what I have to say? Can we move on to
Speaker 1: something more amazing? Daniel? Yeah, I I have something I
Speaker 1: would like to confess. So for the last like at
Speaker 1: least several weeks, people have been hitting me up about
Speaker 1: this very important topic and I'm being tagged in it,
Speaker 1: and I I've like not wanted to say anything about it,
Speaker 1: but it's recently come to like such ahead that I
Speaker 1: just I can't avoid it anymore. And so I would
Speaker 1: like to say that I do, in fact love cush lings,
Speaker 1: and I just cush lings are amazing. They have fun
Speaker 1: to have pizza parties with, They are fun to go
Speaker 1: roller bleeding with. You can eat birthday cake with goush lings.
Speaker 1: And they bounce. Can you bounces? Sure you can? Why not? Yeah?
Speaker 1: You can? Some of them are just possibly get framed
Speaker 1: portraits of my cush lings and put them on the
Speaker 1: wall in my bedroom. You could, you could, you could
Speaker 1: go swiggles n swiggles around my portraits of Mike. I'm
Speaker 1: not sure I trust you, Danielle. You you're a little
Speaker 1: thing with the truth. Is there any proof that you're
Speaker 1: right there? Right? You know what? Eastern Roll the proof? Wow, Danielle,
Speaker 1: you really loves Yeah, Jodia, they're cool. Guess what. Yeah,
Speaker 1: there's wild Times. Wait cool, they're's are the same stuff
Speaker 1: we are? Yeah, Larissa, let's roll. Hey, he's ticklish, party down, Peter,
Speaker 1: Time for some ease wild skateboarding. Tug didn't really want
Speaker 1: a wild time. You want wild time, Suisling Wild Times.
Speaker 1: I had no idea this thing existed, and you somehow
Speaker 1: came up on our private chat thread. I think Will
Speaker 1: found it and Alexa Bliss just being wrestler. Alexa Bliss
Speaker 1: had it up on her Instagram, and I just got
Speaker 1: all I know is that I thought, because Danielle and
Speaker 1: I did a inline skating, I have grinders in line,
Speaker 1: so do I. I thought that was the most ninetiest
Speaker 1: thing ever. But this takes the cake, just unbelievable. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I love it so much and had no idea you
Speaker 1: did this and then I had no idea Jodi and Larissa,
Speaker 1: like what Jodi, Jody Sweeten is in it with me
Speaker 1: and Larissa Olank and and filming this commercial was one
Speaker 1: of the like, honestly one of the funniest days of
Speaker 1: my life, because I remember when the offer for the
Speaker 1: commercial came through. It was like, hey, we're getting you know,
Speaker 1: we're hoping to get Danielle, Jody Sweeten and Larissa Olank
Speaker 1: together for this wild Time cuch Ling's commercial and uh,
Speaker 1: you know, here's whatever the money was. And I don't
Speaker 1: I don't even think I really knew what a wild
Speaker 1: times kouch Ling was. It was just like, I don't
Speaker 1: call me crazy, but you know, thirteen years older. I mean,
Speaker 1: I think my hair is cut. I'm I'm sixteen and
Speaker 1: that my hair is cut. So I remember getting the
Speaker 1: offer and and being in solely on the idea that
Speaker 1: Jodi and Larissa were in it with me, and being like, cool,
Speaker 1: that sounds great. We'll go have a day where we'll
Speaker 1: shoot a commercial for this product I'm in and and
Speaker 1: didn't get a storyboard beforehand, didn't get anything, just showing
Speaker 1: up on the day, and I remember vividly Jody on
Speaker 1: one side of me, and Larissa on the other side
Speaker 1: of me, and the director walking us through the storyboard
Speaker 1: for the commercial and being like, what what the koush
Speaker 1: lings skateboard down at the skateboard, and and the and
Speaker 1: the dialogue Danye, you're really into Kouchlings, and being like,
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, and and all of us being like
Speaker 1: U huh, and then the three of us walking off
Speaker 1: the stage and just dying laughing like what are we doing?
Speaker 1: This is gonna be a nightmare, And and it was
Speaker 1: just for the rest of the day. We couldn't stop laughing.
Speaker 1: We laughed so hard. I have memories of people paying
Speaker 1: their pants and I have been told explicitly that that
Speaker 1: did not happen, so it must just be like in
Speaker 1: my head it happened. I'm sorry, So somebody their pants,
Speaker 1: is what you're saying, because they were laughing so hard. Yes,
Speaker 1: because we laughed so hard. Well, what for one thing
Speaker 1: for sure that happened. Oh my god, I can't wait
Speaker 1: to talk to Larissa too. We need to have Jody
Speaker 1: onto um. I know for sure what happened is one
Speaker 1: of the times we were jokingly making fun of what
Speaker 1: we were doing. Jody did a high kick in the
Speaker 1: like white pants she was wearing, and she was like, oh,
Speaker 1: like couch langs and kicked her kicked her leg up
Speaker 1: by and her pants ripped, fully ripped, I mean just
Speaker 1: and everybody heard it. And she put her leg down
Speaker 1: and she was like, you need to go change my pants.
Speaker 1: Um god, So hold on. I just love that you guys.
Speaker 1: So you guys were because the realities, you're just too
Speaker 1: old to be commercial for like six year olds, ten
Speaker 1: year olds, and you were teenagers, okay, so you were
Speaker 1: feeling this sort of like oh, this is just the
Speaker 1: weirdest thing we're going to be a part of. But
Speaker 1: you turned that, Like I see, if I had been
Speaker 1: in that situation, I would have like cried and like
Speaker 1: gone to my dressing room and like maybe tried to
Speaker 1: get out of the job. Just why I didn't do commerce,
Speaker 1: Like I never did commercial site was so terrified of
Speaker 1: that situation. The fact that you guys were able to
Speaker 1: spin it into like let's just have fun and laugh
Speaker 1: is so awesome and admirable and like you so much
Speaker 1: healthier because like, who gives a crap, Like you just
Speaker 1: do this, you get paid. The people that want couch
Speaker 1: lens are gonna love it, and no one else was
Speaker 1: going to notice until thirty years later when it's on
Speaker 1: the internet, when it's going viral on the internet and
Speaker 1: people are tagging you in it. Yeah. No, I mean honestly,
Speaker 1: had I been doing the commercial alone, I probably would
Speaker 1: have had the reaction that you're talking about. Writer. I
Speaker 1: would have felt like, this is a career ender. Why
Speaker 1: did I yes? Because I did other projects like that
Speaker 1: where I was like what am I doing? How did
Speaker 1: I get here? Um? And this commercial I think because
Speaker 1: Jodi and Larissa were there and we were like, well,
Speaker 1: all three of us can't like we've all agreed to
Speaker 1: do this. We're all in the same boat, like, let's
Speaker 1: just have fun. We had true, I mean we had
Speaker 1: a blast. It was all. It was just one of
Speaker 1: those days where you're like, well, we're here and they
Speaker 1: paid us, and this is what we agreed to do.
Speaker 1: Let's just do it. Can I ask an important question
Speaker 1: and I'd like to say, yes, I still have the
Speaker 1: couch links? No? No, yeah, exactly, UM, And I think
Speaker 1: it needs to be asked and get the bleep button
Speaker 1: ready because it needs to be asked this way. What
Speaker 1: the is akusch Ln What you remember balls? Do you
Speaker 1: remember couch balls? There were, but yeah, those are those.
Speaker 1: There were couchh balls with they're like rubber, you know,
Speaker 1: hairy thing like don't they're like basically the rubber like
Speaker 1: a like a shredded rubber band, so shred rubber band
Speaker 1: with colors. And they became very popular like throw and
Speaker 1: toss or I don't know, but yeah, that's all they
Speaker 1: could do. And so it seems like the next evolution
Speaker 1: was to put a face and legs in our where
Speaker 1: they do things now, like you saw the one that
Speaker 1: had the was on a skateboard and so it rolled down. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's a couche link, I said, of just a couchh ball,
Speaker 1: it's perfection. I not speaking for rider, but I watched
Speaker 1: it fifty times in a few times, and like I said,
Speaker 1: when I when I noticed that there was framed cush
Speaker 1: ling photos Danny his bedroom wall, like portraits of couse
Speaker 1: Lan's and then not as if that wasn't enough, they
Speaker 1: had added animation squiggles around them like perfection spinning camera
Speaker 1: with you guys lying on the ground that the spinning
Speaker 1: camera had me every time like looking up like awesome,
Speaker 1: it was the best. But I mean, I know that
Speaker 1: feeling because I remember, you know, we used to do
Speaker 1: t J. I have promos and stuff on the set
Speaker 1: constantly where somebody would show up and be like, hey,
Speaker 1: guess here's what we're gonna do. It would always be
Speaker 1: some over energetic director if it was poor job. I'm
Speaker 1: sure it was awful to have to like come on
Speaker 1: and tell all these young actors to like stay energetic
Speaker 1: and promote this thing. And we would be under contract
Speaker 1: to have to do it, and we would be miserable
Speaker 1: and like that feeling of just like one of them
Speaker 1: all the time with the jump he jump, Remember that's
Speaker 1: want to jump, but want to jump. Because every time
Speaker 1: we get a photo shoot for Boy Meets World, every season,
Speaker 1: we would have to do a new photo shoot, multiple
Speaker 1: photo shoots, I feel like, but they wanted new, fick
Speaker 1: pictures of us that because we've gotten older or whatever,
Speaker 1: and inevitably they would hand us a globe, either in
Speaker 1: inflatable globe, a giant globe would be leaning on a globe,
Speaker 1: so there are so many globe photos it's always and
Speaker 1: then Ben and I would always have to do a
Speaker 1: back to back photo at some point you know, oh
Speaker 1: my arm on bench on ben shoulder. I always had
Speaker 1: you next. I was the older and you know, we
Speaker 1: would go through these different photographers every year, and sometimes
Speaker 1: they would be amazing and nice, and then other times
Speaker 1: they would be very condescending and not know how to
Speaker 1: work with children or just bizarre. And there was one
Speaker 1: season where some guy I just remember he didn't know
Speaker 1: what he was doing in the I think he had
Speaker 1: a New York accident. At least he has in my if.
Speaker 1: We and and we we were joking around, you know,
Speaker 1: basically mocking the entire process that we were in. And
Speaker 1: we were like, what if we all jumped in the
Speaker 1: air and like high five, thinking it was the cheesiest
Speaker 1: thing ever. And this guy overheard us and was like, oh, oh,
Speaker 1: the kids want to jump, all right, the kids are
Speaker 1: gonna jump, everybody, the kids are gonna jump. And then
Speaker 1: we ended up doing it like he took us completely
Speaker 1: at phase value. So for years afterwards, we were just
Speaker 1: always the kids wanted up quick, quick, figure out how
Speaker 1: we can make the kids jump. This is also exactly
Speaker 1: why that commercial is. It proves why every craft service
Speaker 1: table was just full of candy and soda because they
Speaker 1: try to pump you up on sugar and then get
Speaker 1: you out there. Come on, be be energetic. Oh man,
Speaker 1: that was so that was it was just marvelous, Daniel,
Speaker 1: it was marvelous. You're welcome. Thank you for letting me
Speaker 1: make this admission. I feel much better, So document for
Speaker 1: the ages, so good. Welcome to Pod Meets World. I'm
Speaker 1: Daniel Fishel, I'm right or Strong, and I'm Wilfred ll Hi. Christy. Hey, well,
Speaker 1: I have some unbelievable news. Oh there's a Kim Possible
Speaker 1: Rounstoppable reunion in the works. No, no, no, that would
Speaker 1: be great, but no, I have other big news. We
Speaker 1: just launched the Super Awesome Contest to become the next
Speaker 1: Big Voice Actor. That's right. We want to give an
Speaker 1: amateur voice actor an opportunity to win a one year
Speaker 1: contract with my voice over agency c s D. They
Speaker 1: are amazing. I've been with them for over twenty years
Speaker 1: and that's not all. A trip to l A to
Speaker 1: meet Will and myself and some amazing prizes as well. Yeah. So,
Speaker 1: how do people enter the Super Awesome Contest to become
Speaker 1: the next Big Voice Actor? Christie? Send a two minute
Speaker 1: or less video or audio file. Showcasing your best voices. Okay,
Speaker 1: well it's time do your announcer voice for the rest.
Speaker 1: Oh yes, no purchase necessary. Submit your entry it I
Speaker 1: Hear Voices that I Hear Radio dot com Between January
Speaker 1: nine and February nine. Entries will be judged. The contest
Speaker 1: is open to legal residents of the United States who
Speaker 1: are eighteen and older. Official rules can be found by
Speaker 1: going to our Instagram page and I Hear Voices podcasts
Speaker 1: for complete details. Listen to I Hear Voices on the
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio app or wherever you listen to podcasts. Hey,
Speaker 1: I'm Lance Bass, host of the new I Heart podcast
Speaker 1: Frosted Tips with Lance Bass. The hardest thing could be
Speaker 1: knowing who to turn to when questions arise, or times
Speaker 1: get tough, or you're at the end of the road. Okay,
Speaker 1: I see what you're doing. Do you ever think to yourself,
Speaker 1: what advice would Lance Bass and my favorite boy bands
Speaker 1: give me in this situation? If you do, you've come
Speaker 1: to the right place, because I'm here to help this.
Speaker 1: I promise you. Oh good, seriously, I swear, and you
Speaker 1: won't have to send an S O S because I'll
Speaker 1: be there for you. And so my husband Michael. Um Hey,
Speaker 1: that's me. Yea. We know that Michael and a different
Speaker 1: hot sexy teen crush boybander each week to guide you
Speaker 1: through life step by step, not another one. Kids, relationships,
Speaker 1: life in general can get messy. You may be thinking,
Speaker 1: this is the story of my life just now. If so,
Speaker 1: tell everybody, yeah, everybody about my new podcast and make
Speaker 1: sure to listen so we'll never ever have to say
Speaker 1: bye bye bye. Listen to Frosted Tips with a Lance
Speaker 1: Bass on the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast or
Speaker 1: wherever you listen to podcasts. So today's guest is another
Speaker 1: example of us just going out there and becoming amateur
Speaker 1: sleuths to track someone down because her her name is
Speaker 1: a name that came up twice during our season one
Speaker 1: recaps and we really wanted to know more about her.
Speaker 1: Um In addition to writing two of our standout favorites
Speaker 1: from the first season, Boys to Mensa and the show
Speaker 1: We shot Last it wasn't the actual finale, but the
Speaker 1: finale we shot last of Boy Meets a Girl, she
Speaker 1: also wrote episodes of Webster, Living Single and an episode
Speaker 1: of For Your Love In, but she did not return
Speaker 1: to Boy Meets World for season two, and because her
Speaker 1: episodes are so beloved and really good, we wanted to
Speaker 1: hear from her. So please welcome to the show. Jeannette
Speaker 1: could teach us. Hi. Hi guys, Hi, Oh my god.
Speaker 1: You guys look so grand so you and you're not
Speaker 1: in your pajamas at all. You wonderful. Thanks you too.
Speaker 1: You guys haven't changed a bit, well except thirty years. Yeah. Um,
Speaker 1: thank you so much for agreeing to do this. I
Speaker 1: don't know when we to you. When I reached out
Speaker 1: to you on Instagram? Did you have any sort of
Speaker 1: hesitation about coming on the pod? Absolutely, I'm usually behind
Speaker 1: the cameras, um the writer. At one time I did
Speaker 1: a show and we all showed all the writers showed
Speaker 1: up as monks with like hoods on. But that was
Speaker 1: the closest I came to be writing. Well, thank you
Speaker 1: for being here, and I'd love to start with you
Speaker 1: in the same place we start with with everyone we
Speaker 1: have on I would like to know your origin story.
Speaker 1: But before we even get to your origin story on
Speaker 1: boy Meat's World, I want to talk to you about, Um,
Speaker 1: where did your love for writing come from? And how
Speaker 1: did you end up writing in Hollywood? Tell us your story. UM,
Speaker 1: let's see. Well, I came across my first play and
Speaker 1: I had written it when I was fourteen. UM, and
Speaker 1: it's so cute because I do these little pictures and everything. UM.
Speaker 1: And as I grew up and went through school in college,
Speaker 1: I found that, UM, I could write my way out
Speaker 1: of a brown bag. Like if the three question was
Speaker 1: you know what what happened in the Civil War, I
Speaker 1: would take the word the and just extrapolate on it,
Speaker 1: getting an A in the in the class. So UM
Speaker 1: television came about really coincidentally and synchronicity. I think what
Speaker 1: I really wanted to do was right for the Rolling
Speaker 1: Stone because I was a rocker when I was younger. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I really wanted to do that. But UM, I ended
Speaker 1: up writing a countdown radio show. I don't think they
Speaker 1: have those anymore, but you UM do the top forty
Speaker 1: hits exactly, exactly exactly. And UM I wrote that with
Speaker 1: my best friend. She was producing this show. It went
Speaker 1: out to a hundred and sixty four radio stations across
Speaker 1: the United States. Um not Chicago, not New York or
Speaker 1: Los Angeles, said Francisco. But you know maybe Yeah, So
Speaker 1: when didn't monsec got canceled, and my best friend and
Speaker 1: I went over to Lucy's l Adobe across the street
Speaker 1: from Yes, and we sat there and we're like, we're
Speaker 1: in the entertainment industry. Now got canceled it. Yeah, So
Speaker 1: then I was temping all over the place and she
Speaker 1: had referred me to a TV show that, wait for it,
Speaker 1: April Kelly was producing. Okay, there's my foray into television. Yes,
Speaker 1: which show? Remember it was a pilot and it was
Speaker 1: it might have been an hour of trivial Pursuit. Okay,
Speaker 1: you remember that game? Of course you'll of course, so
Speaker 1: that game, they did it in a studio and they
Speaker 1: had like three or four stars who were from that
Speaker 1: time period who were sitting in a couch while playing
Speaker 1: the game. But then they would do all these cameos.
Speaker 1: So we would go out on these cameos shoots. So
Speaker 1: we had William Shatner and we had Betty White and
Speaker 1: different people, and they would ask a question and then
Speaker 1: we would like being William Shatner onto the stage and
Speaker 1: then he would answer the Star Trek question. She has
Speaker 1: been the funniest person I've ever met. Yeah, we really
Speaker 1: connected because we both were pretty um rabby. I guess,
Speaker 1: I don't know. We were we dropped a lot of
Speaker 1: f bombs and just you know, we're making our way
Speaker 1: through as women, and uh. I ended up hooking up
Speaker 1: with her for a couple other gigs. I ended up
Speaker 1: on Webster Great, Great Show Yet and it was the
Speaker 1: last season and another I was a writer's assistant and
Speaker 1: I was working with another prediction secretary and she and
Speaker 1: I just used to hang out at lunch and come
Speaker 1: up with story ideas. So we came up with a
Speaker 1: story idea for Webster, and we knew if we ever
Speaker 1: got to pitch it, we would have to make it work.
Speaker 1: So one night, April's leaving and and she's collecting all
Speaker 1: the story ideas. They were like four or five episodes
Speaker 1: needed for the syndication deal. And she's like, nobody's coming
Speaker 1: up with ideas, and Tina goes, let have a Jeanette
Speaker 1: and I have an idea, and April goes, I'll take it.
Speaker 1: I'll hear it. And she gave us a pitch meeting
Speaker 1: and let us pitch it. And she asked all these questions,
Speaker 1: and of course we knew we had one shot, so
Speaker 1: we had figured out every single beat, and so we
Speaker 1: nailed it and we got it and then the network
Speaker 1: lie did better than the than some of the others,
Speaker 1: so they bumped ours up into first run and put
Speaker 1: someone else's story into the syndication. Wow. And so were
Speaker 1: you like freaking out at this time, like you had
Speaker 1: just been writing for radio and now you meet April
Speaker 1: Kelly and she's giving you a shot, and you've prepared
Speaker 1: and you kill it? Are you now just like, Oh
Speaker 1: my gosh, I'm a TV writer? No? I was like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, I am this is not happening. I'm
Speaker 1: not going to believe it until it actually happens industry right,
Speaker 1: and then the contract comes out and I'm like And
Speaker 1: so April took us along with Judy p Oli. I
Speaker 1: don't know if you know her, but she was with
Speaker 1: the Fons Happy Days. She was one of Fonzie's chicks.
Speaker 1: I don't know, Wait she she was. Was she leather
Speaker 1: Pinky Tusky Darrow? That's what it was. Okay, that's what
Speaker 1: I thought she. I think she's Leather Tusca Darrow. Yes.
Speaker 1: So um. Judy Peeley and April Kelly were both producers
Speaker 1: on Webster, and they took Tina and me out to
Speaker 1: dinner at the Palm. Oh nice. That was pretty exciting,
Speaker 1: and then we had to write the script, which was
Speaker 1: a whole another thing. So you form this relationship with April,
Speaker 1: and then I'm assuming you just continue to kind of
Speaker 1: go with her from show to show until you get
Speaker 1: to boy Meets World and ye, and so how did
Speaker 1: that come about? How did what did she talk to
Speaker 1: you about Boy Meets World? Tell us about that conversation
Speaker 1: where then you ended up joining boy Meat's World. Um,
Speaker 1: let's see. So I remember we went out to dinner
Speaker 1: at Iroha, which is a Japanese do you yes, Danielle
Speaker 1: knows restaurants like I know TV exactly. You talk to
Speaker 1: me about food. I'm there, We're sitting in a rohan.
Speaker 1: She goes, Okay, we're not going to get all excited yet,
Speaker 1: Like we're both like that, And she said, um, but
Speaker 1: you know, I pitched an idea to Disney and I
Speaker 1: think they're gonna go with it. They're gonna pare me
Speaker 1: up with this other producer and if it does, of
Speaker 1: course you're coming with me. And um, I'll give you
Speaker 1: the opportunity to pitch stories. We were We've all been
Speaker 1: told the same story about somebody was, you know, Ben
Speaker 1: Savage was sitting on a desk with with Michael Jacobs,
Speaker 1: and Michael knew instantly that we're going to do a
Speaker 1: show together. And here's the show I've come up with.
Speaker 1: So that's the story we've been told from the beginning.
Speaker 1: This is I'll be honest with you, You writer, Daniel,
Speaker 1: You guys might have heard of this. This is the
Speaker 1: first time I heard that it was really April that
Speaker 1: went in and pitched Boyan's world. I hadn't heard that before.
Speaker 1: This is the first we've heard that. But um, I'm
Speaker 1: that it all makes sense. Obviously, we've had other writers
Speaker 1: on the show who have come on, and we had
Speaker 1: kind of gathered the impression that in that first season
Speaker 1: it was really like a very divided room where there
Speaker 1: was like the Michael camp and the April camp. Is
Speaker 1: that a fair assessment? Absolutely? The mean girls and then
Speaker 1: April and her two or three and so who else
Speaker 1: was there on the April side besides you. I was
Speaker 1: trying to think of that now. It was definitely ken Kuda.
Speaker 1: I was gonna say, we've heard that ken Kuda was
Speaker 1: was was a good friend of April's as well, and
Speaker 1: still a laugh that we remember to this day. Ken
Speaker 1: Kuda's laugh was intoxicating and it was the one you
Speaker 1: could hear during runthrough like you knew you'd hit a
Speaker 1: joke when you heard ken Kuda go, it was great.
Speaker 1: He is another one man. He is just a really
Speaker 1: good writer. April Um. He was April's assistant at the
Speaker 1: very beginning of his career and she became his mentor.
Speaker 1: I think April loves to mentor because I came in
Speaker 1: on Webster with Tina and she mentored us. We wrote
Speaker 1: a couple we were We ended up writing three scripts
Speaker 1: as um partners. What is Tina's last name? Wong Tina?
Speaker 1: Tina and I wrote her three shows for TEENA, three
Speaker 1: different scripts for April and got them produced. It was
Speaker 1: a show that nobody heard of. It was called Santa
Speaker 1: Zabella and yes, Ken was on it as a writer,
Speaker 1: and Um, we just always had a lot of fun. Um.
Speaker 1: They're both hysterical. April is an amazingly generous human. I
Speaker 1: should just be her pr person. That's so grateful to
Speaker 1: her because I did go on Um Sanchezabell Air with
Speaker 1: her and then when Boy Meets World came up, Like
Speaker 1: I said, we talked about it and um, yeah, and
Speaker 1: then when it came about we came in, April was allowed,
Speaker 1: not allowed, but April was given the opportunity to bring
Speaker 1: a couple of writers in. Tricia Forrester. She was another
Speaker 1: woman that was there in season one was Patricia Forrester.
Speaker 1: Someone else that came with April Kelly. No, I don't
Speaker 1: think so, okay, maybe I mean was there she would
Speaker 1: like find writers, like yeah, one of one of the
Speaker 1: producers that you guys interviewed said, April found this writer,
Speaker 1: Bill Lawrence and was trying to you know, that's the
Speaker 1: little writer guy. Yeah, yeah, poor Bill exactly. Everyone has
Speaker 1: what it takes to make it in the business. Didn't
Speaker 1: get his shot on Boy Meats World. Poor guy, well
Speaker 1: did he? I thought he had one show? He did,
Speaker 1: he did. We heard that he wrote an episode, turned
Speaker 1: it in and he wasn't allowed to be in the
Speaker 1: writer's room. So his episode was picked apart and completely
Speaker 1: rewritten by the writer's room. And then when it actually
Speaker 1: got to tape night, he didn't recognize that it was
Speaker 1: even his script because there wasn't even one you know,
Speaker 1: last day thing that had stuck around. Just a hack
Speaker 1: that guy. So what were your experiences during that first
Speaker 1: season in the writer's room. Um. Yeah, it was definitely divisive.
Speaker 1: Only I didn't think. I mean, I didn't realize that
Speaker 1: going into it. I didn't know it was going to
Speaker 1: be that divided. Um, but it really was. There was
Speaker 1: there was a lot of snarkiness on the other side. Um,
Speaker 1: And that's okay. I mean, you know, obviously I didn't
Speaker 1: know that they had gotten this story that April was
Speaker 1: this monster. April, it's an amazing human being and so generous.
Speaker 1: I mean, I want to counteract that, because you know,
Speaker 1: the head mean Girl had a huge overall deal at Disney.
Speaker 1: And here's an example, like our p s would come
Speaker 1: in around four or five I think, and get ready
Speaker 1: for the evening because it was back in the day
Speaker 1: where they were delivering a lot of scripts and they
Speaker 1: had to copy all the scripts or at the very
Speaker 1: least they had to go pick them up from the
Speaker 1: copy or so they were up rather late into the night,
Speaker 1: and the mean Girl wouldn't buy them dinner. April just
Speaker 1: pulls out her heart and says, give us to the
Speaker 1: kids and let them order dinner. So she has a
Speaker 1: generous heart, and she really saw something in us and
Speaker 1: made it possible that if I came on the show
Speaker 1: as a writer's assistant or at the time, was a
Speaker 1: script coordinator on Boie Meat's World, then she would give
Speaker 1: us a chance, like she gave me a shot to pitch.
Speaker 1: So again, I knew I had one shot, and I
Speaker 1: went in with six stories and she loved four of them,
Speaker 1: and they ended up choosing to Wow. Yeah, those are
Speaker 1: two of the best of the first season. Frankly, so
Speaker 1: we've talked about. I mean, they really were two of
Speaker 1: the most well received. The ones we liked the best.
Speaker 1: I mean we you know Rider had Again I've said
Speaker 1: this before that Rider just found out he was on
Speaker 1: Boy Meets World like a week ago. Um, so he
Speaker 1: hasn't seen the shows ever, and Danielle and I haven't
Speaker 1: seen him since they were on. And I mean that
Speaker 1: first season is now thirty years ago, so watching it
Speaker 1: again it was watching a brand new show for all
Speaker 1: three of us. And collectively, your two episodes were two
Speaker 1: of our favorites. I mean they just and the ones
Speaker 1: that I do remember actually like it's so funny, especially
Speaker 1: you know, Boy Meets Girl was just like indelible. Um.
Speaker 1: But yeah, Boys to Mensa too. It's like they were
Speaker 1: both like the ones that the second we started watching
Speaker 1: was like, well I think I remember these lines actually
Speaker 1: this story. Yeah, yeah, they were very important in the
Speaker 1: first in the in the overall building of the first season.
Speaker 1: I mean, especially boy meets Girl you go back to
Speaker 1: you know what that started? It was, you know, it
Speaker 1: created the show. I mean it really did. It helped.
Speaker 1: It helped to push the show in the direction it
Speaker 1: was supposed to go. And that's why it was I
Speaker 1: think Danielle who was like, where the hell is this woman?
Speaker 1: Where we gotta go find her? What? These are easily
Speaker 1: two of the best episodes and the fact that then
Speaker 1: we lost your voice going into season two just felt
Speaker 1: so painful to think about. So it's to you guys,
Speaker 1: really sweet. Where did the ideas for those episodes come from?
Speaker 1: And then I also want to know, do you remember
Speaker 1: the two other ideas that April loved that I searched
Speaker 1: my house for those. I want to know all six
Speaker 1: of them. But it was back when I don't know.
Speaker 1: I I was just doing my job, do you know
Speaker 1: what I mean? Like I was in the writer's room
Speaker 1: all day and then I would go home and I
Speaker 1: would never want to just disappoint April like I had to.
Speaker 1: I wrote spec scripts that she read and gave me
Speaker 1: notes on to get agents and stuff like that, and
Speaker 1: I just never wanted to make her look bad or
Speaker 1: disappoint her on that show. I mean, it was finally
Speaker 1: really her baby, And so I it on my off hours,
Speaker 1: just sit in the room, come up with stuff talking
Speaker 1: about boy Meets Girl and what a fantastic memory an
Speaker 1: episode that is for for us when we when we
Speaker 1: watched it, did you like I'm trying to I'm trying
Speaker 1: to get to It wasn't until I think it's you know,
Speaker 1: significantly later in the show, maybe even season three, that
Speaker 1: to Panga and Corey actually become a couple like we
Speaker 1: were we're you know, we've just started season two and
Speaker 1: Corey already is kind of starting to date somebody new, Wendy. Um.
Speaker 1: He does ask to Panga out, but to Panka says, no,
Speaker 1: they can't really, they're not going to go through life together. Uh.
Speaker 1: And so did you on like, was there a thing
Speaker 1: in the writer's room about let's do an episode where
Speaker 1: Corey gets feelings for a girl and let's set it
Speaker 1: up where it's going to be to Panga was Topanga
Speaker 1: and Corey gonna be long game no matter what by
Speaker 1: that time? Or was that kind of an original idea
Speaker 1: you had, And I wouldn't say it's an original idea.
Speaker 1: I would say that it was a logical step for
Speaker 1: the progession of the show. I mean, the Sean character
Speaker 1: was a little older or a more mature, and so
Speaker 1: it just seemed logical that he was going to get
Speaker 1: the girls and first, and he was gonna he was
Speaker 1: going to take this more mature stance, and Corey wanted
Speaker 1: to wanted to keep up right. I mean, he's like,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna do it. I'm gonna I'm gonna ask a
Speaker 1: girl out. And then he asks to pay out, which again,
Speaker 1: you know, you guys were the core of the show.
Speaker 1: And he's gonna ask to paying it out and then
Speaker 1: he flips, He's like, what the heck did I do? There?
Speaker 1: Really wasn't ready. Um No, I didn't see the long term.
Speaker 1: I couldn't. Once we weren't on the show. It was painful,
Speaker 1: pinful to watch. I personially think boy Meet's world could
Speaker 1: have gone ten years if they had slowed the role
Speaker 1: a little bit. Like I remember when they were taping
Speaker 1: my episode. Michael was pitching to the director to say
Speaker 1: like kind of have her, you know, walk up to
Speaker 1: him and you know, turn his collar and I'm like,
Speaker 1: you mean more like more flirtatiously saltry set okay and um,
Speaker 1: and we all kind of cringe. Do you remember we
Speaker 1: would be in the back of the stage in a
Speaker 1: room and we would be pitching. I think we were
Speaker 1: the I think it wasn't the main girls. I think
Speaker 1: it was just April and maybe like check Mannell in
Speaker 1: my opinion was it was so nice. He is one
Speaker 1: of the nicest people. Yes, for the For the record,
Speaker 1: I would like to say that the experience that you
Speaker 1: all had in the writer's room was very different than
Speaker 1: the experience we had with the writers. There are most
Speaker 1: are not all the writers I can think of. We're
Speaker 1: super sweet to me, I will speak just for me,
Speaker 1: very nice to me. We always got the best side
Speaker 1: of everybody. That's why we're so interested in capturing these
Speaker 1: stories because we were really insulated from everything going on there.
Speaker 1: So Jeff Minnell, Jeff Sherman, all of the ken Kuda,
Speaker 1: all the people from the first season, second season and on.
Speaker 1: We always had a great relationship with the writers. They
Speaker 1: were always wonderful people to us, April everybody, So that's
Speaker 1: why hearing a lot of these stories at first was
Speaker 1: so jarring. And then we're kind of getting into it
Speaker 1: because whoever it was, whether it was April, I'm guessing
Speaker 1: with her instincts it was more April than anyone else,
Speaker 1: but who knows. Um, somebody was protecting us from seeing
Speaker 1: any of this happen. So were the minnell Sherman, all
Speaker 1: the people we've had on They're all wonderful people to us.
Speaker 1: We're still close friends with a lot of them. Um.
Speaker 1: So the experiences that you went through are very different
Speaker 1: than the experiences that we went through, which is why
Speaker 1: we're so interested to see the other side of it,
Speaker 1: because as kids, we didn't get any of that. Yeah
Speaker 1: we didn't. We didn't know what the what was going
Speaker 1: on in the room. Um, and I do think, yeah,
Speaker 1: we were very well protected from it, which is what
Speaker 1: probably what you guys wanted. You didn't want your adult
Speaker 1: um issues coming onto the set with kids, which is
Speaker 1: the responsible thing to do. So it's only now that
Speaker 1: we're going I wonder what was going on for them,
Speaker 1: But your instincts are correct. Jeff Minnell is one of
Speaker 1: the nicest people you'll ever meet in your life. He's
Speaker 1: a wonderful man. So yeah, he's a great guy. And
Speaker 1: April looked him and he would come sit in the
Speaker 1: room like there was there were two rooms essentially, right,
Speaker 1: and so even on set it was separated really that much.
Speaker 1: There were two rooms. That's how the two camps were.
Speaker 1: Not the whole time, right, but a lot, you know,
Speaker 1: there were two like two separate rooms. Certainly by the
Speaker 1: time we got to Boy Meets Girl, which was the
Speaker 1: last episode of the season, so definitely by the end
Speaker 1: of the season there had been enough divisiveness that there
Speaker 1: were now two rooms. But keep in mind, everybody would
Speaker 1: come together in the room to do like final pitches
Speaker 1: and you know, make it funnier. But a lot of times,
Speaker 1: you know, the other team was we don't I don't
Speaker 1: know what they were doing, but we would all come
Speaker 1: together in the room. When I turned in one of
Speaker 1: my drafts, he in April met me in Michael's office
Speaker 1: and um, Michael had notes. Well, they were going to
Speaker 1: give me notes on my script, and Michael just like goes.
Speaker 1: I didn't even know what to say. I don't know,
Speaker 1: I don't know, and he throws my script across the
Speaker 1: room and goes, this is a piece of blank like
Speaker 1: that is right, And I'm sitting there like what And
Speaker 1: April says, Okay, Michael, it's cool, Like let's just sit
Speaker 1: down and go through the script and give Jeanette notes.
Speaker 1: Let's fix it, because you know, he's all like like
Speaker 1: he was kind of nervous, a nervous energy, and he's
Speaker 1: just like I don't even know what to say, you know,
Speaker 1: and he April looked at me and she goes, I'm devastated.
Speaker 1: And she goes, Janet, go back to your desk. I
Speaker 1: will work with Michael and I'll get you notes. He said, okay,
Speaker 1: and I left the room. And so she was even
Speaker 1: protecting you. Absolutely, oh, absolutely absolutely. He was just a
Speaker 1: dramatic energy, you know. So anyway, yeah, I there. So
Speaker 1: there were times everybody was in the room and Michael
Speaker 1: as well. They were definitely different. I mean, April was
Speaker 1: really a calm force, and we talked about stories or
Speaker 1: we you know, punched up with script or whatever we did. Hi,
Speaker 1: I'm Christine Taylor and I'm David Lasher. David and I
Speaker 1: started in a little show in the nineties called Hey Dude,
Speaker 1: and now we're teaming up once again. The host of
Speaker 1: a new I Heart podcast, Hey Dude the Nineties called
Speaker 1: do you remember the motor rolla flip phone? Do you
Speaker 1: remember going to Blockbuster? Do you remember Nintendo sixty four?
Speaker 1: Do you remember getting frosted tips? Was that a serial? No?
Speaker 1: Its hair? Do you remember a O L instant Messenger
Speaker 1: and the dial up sound like Poltergeist? Do you remember
Speaker 1: when we dated? Okay, save that for the podcast. We're
Speaker 1: going to use Hey Dude as our jumping off point,
Speaker 1: but we are going to unpack and dive back into
Speaker 1: the decade of the nineties. We lived it, and now
Speaker 1: we're calling on all of our friends to come back
Speaker 1: and relive it. Each episode will rival the feeling of
Speaker 1: taking out the cartridge from your game boy, blowing on it,
Speaker 1: and popping it back in as we take you back
Speaker 1: to the nineties. So listen to Hey Dude the Nineties
Speaker 1: called on the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts or
Speaker 1: wherever you listen to podcasts. Did you have any memory
Speaker 1: of of April tell and not to not to tell
Speaker 1: April story, but do you have any memory of April
Speaker 1: telling you that she wasn't coming back to the show.
Speaker 1: This story breaks my heart. So April had a really
Speaker 1: handsome boyfriend and that two of them were going to
Speaker 1: after this long year and a half. Because remember there
Speaker 1: was the pilot that they were working, and I worked
Speaker 1: on the pilot with Michael and and um April in
Speaker 1: the sense of only of course typing it. I was, yeah,
Speaker 1: I didn't have anything to do with the writing on
Speaker 1: the pilot, but I was brought in to get it
Speaker 1: ready and just need the writer's assistanners on it and
Speaker 1: do that thing. So anyway, at the end of the season,
Speaker 1: Um Mike Um, after a year of working, April was
Speaker 1: ready to take a vacation with her lovely boyfriend and
Speaker 1: she set up to go to France. She'd always wanted
Speaker 1: to go to France or go back with her boyfriend.
Speaker 1: And I go, April, I just don't feel good about this.
Speaker 1: She goes, Jeanette, I've given Michael the list of writers
Speaker 1: and you and Kennor on it. You're gonna get finally
Speaker 1: like I been with April ten years. And she's like,
Speaker 1: You're finally going to get your bump up to staff writer.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, like, well, you don't believe it until
Speaker 1: the contract comes over, and I'm like, I just wish
Speaker 1: you weren't going to France. I wish you'd wait to
Speaker 1: the contracts. No, no, this is all worked out. Michael
Speaker 1: has agreed to it. Your names are on the list
Speaker 1: on his desk, and I said, okay, And you've got
Speaker 1: to believe April because she knows her stuff. I mean absolutely,
Speaker 1: So she goes away and I'm probably cleaning up for
Speaker 1: the season, like getting all the first dress and everything
Speaker 1: in order, getting all the files in order, doing all
Speaker 1: the computer stuff, whatever put to We got let go,
Speaker 1: and we're not on the show. And I sent April
Speaker 1: a telegram in France to her hotel saying we've been cut,
Speaker 1: and I'm sure her agent did too. We just got cut.
Speaker 1: You and April, you mean and Cancuta. So we were
Speaker 1: cut and that's it, just that simple. That's simple, man.
Speaker 1: We weren't broke back, so essentially anybody team April was gone. Correct. Wow, brutal.
Speaker 1: I hate to keep harping on this, but I just
Speaker 1: I keep trying to picture it because it's, um, it's
Speaker 1: so sad to me. But you you were cleaning up,
Speaker 1: getting the season one scripts in order. And then who
Speaker 1: actually came to you to say, pack up your stuff
Speaker 1: and don't come back. I don't remember very well. Could
Speaker 1: have been Michael, It could have been I don't know.
Speaker 1: I don't remember. All I remember was sending April a telegram.
Speaker 1: It was traumatic for me. It was I loved the
Speaker 1: show and I liked what we were doing with it.
Speaker 1: We were taking it slow. What how old are you
Speaker 1: in Bend at the time, ten or twelve? Yeah, So
Speaker 1: what's news to me is that I guess in my mind,
Speaker 1: I always thought April left. Yeah, I always thought that
Speaker 1: she was fed up with the show and left, you know,
Speaker 1: because of the politics and whatnot. I didn't realize that
Speaker 1: it was actually a a move that had been made,
Speaker 1: uh you know, putting you know. I mean, I'm assuming
Speaker 1: that that means that there was a decision made at
Speaker 1: the network level or Michael just suddenly got more power
Speaker 1: than he had before and was able to, you know,
Speaker 1: take over the show. That's so interesting. I never knew that.
Speaker 1: Oh it's my opinion, and from kind of looking at
Speaker 1: his past shows that it's sort of a have it
Speaker 1: just like takes over the show. And as I said,
Speaker 1: I think when I Meets World could have gone ten
Speaker 1: years easily if if that, you know, ten eleven year
Speaker 1: old sweetness twelve got to carry on and play through
Speaker 1: a little longer and have kid issues rather having been
Speaker 1: hiding in cause it's wanting to kiss girls and stuff.
Speaker 1: But that's so funny because that's sort of our experience
Speaker 1: right now watching the second season, which you know, I've
Speaker 1: never seen, and we're sort of like, oh, like I
Speaker 1: think Danielle said, you know, I want the warm, comfy
Speaker 1: blanket of season one, and I feel the same way.
Speaker 1: And it's it's jarring. It seems like the show just
Speaker 1: went from you know, a kids show, a very sweet
Speaker 1: family show, to something you know, very teenage and adolescent quickly. Um.
Speaker 1: And then I heard a great I heard a great
Speaker 1: saying that so encapsulates what we've been talking about. It's perfect,
Speaker 1: you know, see. And I watched that show alone, and
Speaker 1: all of the contestants talk about right when they're first
Speaker 1: put into the wilderness by themselves, they call it drop shock,
Speaker 1: and so I think we have drop shock from finishing
Speaker 1: season one and starting and starting season two. It is
Speaker 1: we're just we're it. It's very jarring. But it seemed
Speaker 1: like there was a mandate somewhere to clean house. April
Speaker 1: isn't here. April hasn't hasn't come on the podcast. She's
Speaker 1: she's declined. We asked her, of course, Um, she declined.
Speaker 1: But she isn't here to tell us whether or not
Speaker 1: for a fact, she was let go. Um. She did
Speaker 1: write us a letter. We read it. We this is
Speaker 1: from Jeanette's experience. Um, and from you know, what Jeanette
Speaker 1: saw and witnessed her was a part of herself. But
Speaker 1: without hearing it directly from April, we don't know for
Speaker 1: sure that she was let go and didn't just walk away.
Speaker 1: But from experiences, it seems as though she may have
Speaker 1: been let go, But we don't know that for for
Speaker 1: a fact. And in all fairness to also say this,
Speaker 1: we have to we we are getting one side of
Speaker 1: the story. Unpacking people, unpacking nikes. We thought the suitcases
Speaker 1: were empty, and oh my god, there's another bag that
Speaker 1: was just delivered, just been dropped. I'm curious, though, do
Speaker 1: you think the listeners care about this stuff? Rearely because
Speaker 1: because it seems so snarky, you know, it just seems
Speaker 1: like ide saying you know what, I don't think I
Speaker 1: don't think it comes across as snarky. I think the
Speaker 1: reason it's come up is not because we are a
Speaker 1: gossip podcast. We're absolutely not. It has come up because
Speaker 1: we have been asking these questions about, so, what happened?
Speaker 1: You wrote this amazing episode, where did it go? Why
Speaker 1: did that happen? And then when we would interview other writers,
Speaker 1: there would be things that were said like, well, you know,
Speaker 1: April was very political, and April was very this, and
Speaker 1: we'd go, huh interesting. So then now we've heard that,
Speaker 1: let's go see, so we're it's literally investigative more than snark.
Speaker 1: We're not trying to gossip or expose anyone. Like Will said,
Speaker 1: we were very insulated. So this is like really educational
Speaker 1: for us. And we also are now looking at the
Speaker 1: show from the adult eyes perspective, and now we relate
Speaker 1: so much more to the adults who were on the
Speaker 1: show and had the real the real work of it,
Speaker 1: and so it's we're just fascinated by how it all worked.
Speaker 1: I think I think there's something also that needs to
Speaker 1: be said, which is we probably would not have any
Speaker 1: of these questions, any of this knowledge if it was
Speaker 1: not a show co created by Michael Jacobs and April Kelly.
Speaker 1: It's literally the fact that she has that credit that
Speaker 1: this question, because we probably would barely remember April honestly.
Speaker 1: But but but but all throughout we were always like, wait,
Speaker 1: why is the show created by Michael and this other
Speaker 1: person who we don't wear that and we have vague
Speaker 1: memories of it. And so we would ask that question
Speaker 1: regularly of the writers of and it was always sort
Speaker 1: of shoved under the rug or played off as like no, no, no,
Speaker 1: you know, and on. Like my impression was there was
Speaker 1: this crazy lady who disappeared, and it was always minimized
Speaker 1: and always made to be like this person was unusual
Speaker 1: and weird and didn't actually do anything and didn't actually
Speaker 1: bring anything to the table. That was always my impression.
Speaker 1: And it wasn't until we started this podcast that we
Speaker 1: started going like that can't be the whole story, right,
Speaker 1: Like she wasn't you know, I just we have this
Speaker 1: image of you know, we've been told she drove a
Speaker 1: ferrari and she was crazy, and and like when you
Speaker 1: look at her record, you're like, well, she actually had
Speaker 1: an incredible track record in television and the things that
Speaker 1: you know, the things that she did bring to the
Speaker 1: show seemed to be really important that we're learning now
Speaker 1: and so yeah, so it's it's really about, you know,
Speaker 1: revising the narrative that we've lived with all our all
Speaker 1: our adults, all our childhood and all our adulthood. And
Speaker 1: it's kind of important. You know, it feels important to
Speaker 1: me at least, it doesn't feel snarky. It feels like
Speaker 1: this is kind of the real history. Um. And I
Speaker 1: have to say, like, thank god she got that credit, right, Like,
Speaker 1: if she didn't have that credit, we literally wouldn't know
Speaker 1: she exists. I don't think. I think it would just
Speaker 1: be like, oh, you know, because it's hard for us
Speaker 1: to remember. We don't know all that. We barely knew
Speaker 1: the writing staff. You know, we know that people that
Speaker 1: stayed all seven years, um, and we know the people
Speaker 1: that made themselves important to us who expressed to them.
Speaker 1: You know, I'm the creator, I did everything. You know
Speaker 1: that happened a lot. There was a lot of self
Speaker 1: aggrandizing going on, and um, you know, it's it's just
Speaker 1: interesting now to be to to to be revising the
Speaker 1: narrative and realizing like, okay, that was just one person story.
Speaker 1: Um yea and yeah, so we we also we also
Speaker 1: said to each other when we started this, we're gonna
Speaker 1: you know, there's a lot of rewatch podcasts out there,
Speaker 1: that's a big thing. We're not going to be one
Speaker 1: of those people that just sit there and watch our
Speaker 1: show and talk about how awesome it was all the time.
Speaker 1: We're gonna have the conversations we always have. We're just
Speaker 1: gonna happen to record them. We're gonna bring on guests,
Speaker 1: we're gonna talk, and where the conversation leads us is
Speaker 1: where it's going to lead us. And you know, David
Speaker 1: Trainer came on and let us in one direction, and
Speaker 1: other writers came on and let us in another direction.
Speaker 1: So we're gonna go wherever it goes. And it's one
Speaker 1: of those things where I think, like any fandom out there,
Speaker 1: some fans are gonna love it, some fans are gonna
Speaker 1: hate it. Some fans are gonna think we're ruining the show,
Speaker 1: some fans are gonna think we're enhancing the show, and
Speaker 1: it's really just we're we're finding out as much as
Speaker 1: as we can about the things we didn't know about
Speaker 1: the show, as well as the audience. So we're just
Speaker 1: going where it leads us. Frankly, Yeah, and I think,
Speaker 1: you know, having people on to talk about their experiences
Speaker 1: is um. You know, not everybody gets a platform, not
Speaker 1: everybody gets to have it, gets a chance to have
Speaker 1: their voice heard and to share their experiences. And we
Speaker 1: understand why some people have said no, thank you, I
Speaker 1: don't want the opportunity. And then, you know, we're so
Speaker 1: grateful to people like you who say, yes, I'm scared,
Speaker 1: I'm nervous, but I do. I want to come on
Speaker 1: and I want to talk about my experiences. And I
Speaker 1: think it gives it certainly is helpful for all of us,
Speaker 1: and I think it helps, um give the listeners a
Speaker 1: better understanding of what taking TV is really like. Yeah.
Speaker 1: It's also we constantly say we love Boy Meets World.
Speaker 1: Yeah we do. We love Boy Meets World. We love
Speaker 1: the relationships, we love the show, we love the fans,
Speaker 1: we love everything they brought to the show. This doesn't
Speaker 1: diminish my love for Boy Meats. I'll speak for myself
Speaker 1: in any way, shape or form knowing this. It was
Speaker 1: the seven greatest years of my life. It gave me
Speaker 1: two of my best friends ever. You know, I love
Speaker 1: Boy Meats world. Learning about it, learning, you know, growing
Speaker 1: up and learning that your parents are real people that
Speaker 1: have a past, doesn't make me love them any less. Um,
Speaker 1: in a way, it makes me love them more because
Speaker 1: they're they're real. It's it's it's an experience that certain
Speaker 1: people at a wonderful time, certain people at a terrible time,
Speaker 1: certain people were friends, certain people weren't. It makes it
Speaker 1: more real to me. It doesn't, in any way, shape
Speaker 1: or form, diminish my love for the show. Um, so yeah,
Speaker 1: we're going where it goes, because I you know, I
Speaker 1: don't want it to look like I'm just like no, no,
Speaker 1: of course not. This was your experience. Yeah, and it was.
Speaker 1: It was. It was really heartbreaking. It was it was
Speaker 1: said we loved the show as well. It was April's baby. Um,
Speaker 1: she'd done a lot of writing and you know, I'm
Speaker 1: I can't really speak for her, but but I know
Speaker 1: how much she loved the show. I'm she like I said,
Speaker 1: she'd done a lot of writing on other people's shows,
Speaker 1: and it was finally her opportunity to have a show
Speaker 1: produced and then she was let up. How heartbreaking was
Speaker 1: that I heard several times coming out of the writer
Speaker 1: room talking to my own experience, I heard several times
Speaker 1: come of the rider room. Not gonna say anybody's name,
Speaker 1: but I heard this quote several times. Women ain't funny.
Speaker 1: I heard that several times coming out of our writer's room.
Speaker 1: So it shows in the lack of voice that was given. Again,
Speaker 1: we we remember two women. One woman that was there
Speaker 1: the whole time, Susan Jansen almost. I don't think she
Speaker 1: was there till seven season. She was there till five. Yeah,
Speaker 1: really she she didn't finish it out. I don't the
Speaker 1: whole show for some reason. I think she and then
Speaker 1: these incredibly funny women coming in, like Laura Renalds and
Speaker 1: Patty Carr, Erica Montalfo, Judy Toll, they came and kind
Speaker 1: of went, um, I think uh, Laura Reynolds and um uh.
Speaker 1: Laura and Patty I think finished out the show, and
Speaker 1: I think Erica Maltafo did as well. But I think
Speaker 1: Judy kind of came and went Judy told, who was
Speaker 1: you know a phenomenal writer? Uh so there's yeah, but
Speaker 1: women ain't funny. I heard that several times coming out
Speaker 1: of that room. And April is so funny. I mean, yeah,
Speaker 1: I guess I've said that a hundred times, but she
Speaker 1: she was so back to April, so she drives the rip. Ferrari.
Speaker 1: April had wanted a Ferrari from as long as I can,
Speaker 1: Like I already met her as a Ferrari person. But
Speaker 1: she told me she'd always wanted one, and when she
Speaker 1: finally made enough money in Hollywood, she was a good
Speaker 1: violin and it's good for her for that. I did
Speaker 1: exactly the same thing. But no, no, it was I
Speaker 1: wanted a Ferrari, and when I was twenty three, I
Speaker 1: bought myself one. Nobody know what. He looked at me
Speaker 1: crazy because I bought my It was like, hey, good
Speaker 1: for you. Awesome job, kid, Look at that. I can't
Speaker 1: believe what you got. I wasn't weird for that. I
Speaker 1: was awesome for that. So it's, you know, that same thing,
Speaker 1: A total double standard. Um so yeah, it's very strange.
Speaker 1: Did you I'm sure you did, but I'm gonna ask anyway,
Speaker 1: did you feel a specific like, um, you had to
Speaker 1: be scrappier because you were a woman in the room. Absolutely.
Speaker 1: April taught me that. She's like, hang because I remember
Speaker 1: I got I got with her back in the eighties,
Speaker 1: So it was a different world. But it's like, if
Speaker 1: you're going to hang with these comedy writers, you got
Speaker 1: to be like you've got to be able to stand
Speaker 1: up and hang with them. So I could be pretty crass,
Speaker 1: I must say. So let's talk about what happened after
Speaker 1: you were fired? What did you do next? What? What
Speaker 1: was your what was your next move? I took a
Speaker 1: good I think I took a good year and a
Speaker 1: half off of doing any shows. Um in ve I
Speaker 1: guess it was only yeah, it was a bet of
Speaker 1: here anyway. In the fall of nine, I worked on
Speaker 1: a show called Grand I worked with another brilliant woman producer,
Speaker 1: Nancy Lee miyatt Um. She created a show called Social
Speaker 1: Studies and it was very short lived. Um, but I
Speaker 1: was her script coordinator and she went on to Living Single,
Speaker 1: and it was the last season of Living Single. And
Speaker 1: by this time, I'm I'm going to choot my own horn.
Speaker 1: I'm an amazing script coordinator. Like I said, I could
Speaker 1: box in the back in my mind, I could hear
Speaker 1: the writer's pitching and I could you know, work type
Speaker 1: on in ten wards minutes, so I could really keep
Speaker 1: up with their banter. Right, So, um, I got pretty confident,
Speaker 1: shall we say? And I said to that a dowser,
Speaker 1: I said, yeah, okay, I'll come on a show, but
Speaker 1: I want a writing assignment. And and then I had
Speaker 1: another producer on another line, and they said, well, we'll
Speaker 1: give you a writing an assignment. So I go back
Speaker 1: to him that and I go that, so they'll give
Speaker 1: me a writing assignment too, And she goes, well, listen,
Speaker 1: that likes to win. That Lee Bowser, she's brilliant. She goes,
Speaker 1: all right, if we get a back nine on the
Speaker 1: last season, we'll give you a second script. I'm like
Speaker 1: another person, all right, came down. There was going on
Speaker 1: living single, so I spent I think we only did
Speaker 1: thirteen episodes for the final year. But um, Queen Latifa
Speaker 1: Kim feels like some really funny, realiant women. Lovely lovely,
Speaker 1: Queen Latifa so lovely. And then if that created another
Speaker 1: show called for Your Love on the Warner Brothers Network,
Speaker 1: and I went on there. That was my last show.
Speaker 1: I wrote an episode for that, and then that was
Speaker 1: my last show of the year of my tenure. Um.
Speaker 1: By then I was over forty, and nobody's funny over forty.
Speaker 1: But women, like said, are never funny. So um, so
Speaker 1: I just left. I had my eyes on Boulder, Colorado
Speaker 1: for a long time, so I just said, that's it.
Speaker 1: I'm moving to Boulder, Colorado. Are you retired now? I
Speaker 1: am retired now? Good for you make jewelry and for fun.
Speaker 1: I don't sell it and I you don't sell it.
Speaker 1: You're walking away from tons of money, Like, I'll sell
Speaker 1: it for you. Let me see. Well know what I
Speaker 1: was thinking is I want to buy some And I'm like,
Speaker 1: what do you mean? You don't sell it. I haven't
Speaker 1: seen my jewelry yet. It doesn't matter. I want a
Speaker 1: piece of you. I'll send you. That's Stair, Daniel. I
Speaker 1: love it. I'm still unpacking. I'm still unpacking in my
Speaker 1: head from this whole episode. I've got to be honest
Speaker 1: with you. I've got drop shock again. Hey there, I'm
Speaker 1: Hollen Rowden and I am the host of a new
Speaker 1: podcast called Holler Back Now. Moons Full and Beacon Hills
Speaker 1: and the Wolves are coming out again. You know me
Speaker 1: as Lydia Martin from teen Wolf, and on this podcast,
Speaker 1: we will rewatch every episode from the beginning. So join
Speaker 1: me and my favorite teen Wolf stars and friends as
Speaker 1: we reunite the cast, the crew, and the heroes and
Speaker 1: the villains. We'll be sharing every gory detail with you
Speaker 1: because as if a hundred episodes wasn't enough, I am
Speaker 1: bringing you all the behind the scenes. There's gonna be
Speaker 1: so much more from each episode. Nothing is off limits.
Speaker 1: And oh that's right, we'll be talking about teen Wolf
Speaker 1: the movie. I cannot wait. The Wolves are hellen once again.
Speaker 1: What can I say? So holler back now and join
Speaker 1: us each week listen to Holler Back Now on the
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast or wherever you listen
Speaker 1: to podcasts. I'm gonna bring up a subject that is
Speaker 1: so overdone on this show, so not like a bad thing.
Speaker 1: I'm seeing like it comes up because it's like this
Speaker 1: big mystery and and it just comes up, like who
Speaker 1: came up with the name to do you remember? Yes,
Speaker 1: it was not Michael Okay, And I asked Ken Couda
Speaker 1: about it, but he um. I love him. I called
Speaker 1: him Cuda Bear because I you know, I grew up
Speaker 1: with him in television basically because he was on Webster
Speaker 1: and I was on Webster, and then we were on
Speaker 1: Santizoville Air and then we were on Boy Meets World.
Speaker 1: I asked him, I said, can that was you who
Speaker 1: came up with Topanga? And he didn't right back. So um,
Speaker 1: he's busy with his life and he still writes and stuff.
Speaker 1: So um, I don't know for sure, but I always
Speaker 1: thought it was it was him. But the truth be told,
Speaker 1: whatever episode you were in the first time, is the
Speaker 1: writer that gets credit for it, Patricia Forrester, So she's
Speaker 1: probably still getting my understanding. Remember this is just as
Speaker 1: I recall from the writer's guild, Um, when the character
Speaker 1: first occurs and then recurs, that person who came up
Speaker 1: with the name, or that person who first, you know
Speaker 1: he's going to get the character credit throughout the life
Speaker 1: of the show. It doesn't always happen, but yeah, and
Speaker 1: I wonder if she did, because as I recall, she
Speaker 1: was another really nice person, very um, low key, not
Speaker 1: a big you know, I want all the acclamates and
Speaker 1: stuff like that. Yeah. So, looking back now thirty years later,
Speaker 1: what are your overall feelings about your short time on
Speaker 1: Boy Meets World. Any time I worked with April, I
Speaker 1: had a good time, and I learned a lot like
Speaker 1: we and we and we took it very seriously and
Speaker 1: we were in the back on show nights writing rewriting
Speaker 1: jokes that fell on the stage because things fall. You
Speaker 1: can you can go through all the run throughs, but
Speaker 1: then when it hits the audience, yeah, right, So we
Speaker 1: would be back there pitching jokes just in Kate, you know,
Speaker 1: like if the joke didn't work, and then April would
Speaker 1: come out and give the the new joke and try it. Then.
Speaker 1: I loved every minute I'm up, every minute of my
Speaker 1: time on in television. Every I loved it. I mean,
Speaker 1: I have stories endlessly that nobody cares about, but I
Speaker 1: had such a good time. It's such part. It's like
Speaker 1: you start with a script on Monday, and it's shot
Speaker 1: on Friday, and there's all these rewrites in between, and
Speaker 1: then there's also next week scripting punched up and last
Speaker 1: week scripts being edited, and six months from now we've
Speaker 1: got it all blocked out, and I mean it's fascinating,
Speaker 1: so much fun and exhausting. So another reason we've really
Speaker 1: enjoyed doing this podcast is because we have been able
Speaker 1: to shine a light on people who don't always get
Speaker 1: the light. You know, it's very easy for actors to
Speaker 1: seem like Wow, the stars and yet the people doing
Speaker 1: the real work, um aren't the ones who end up
Speaker 1: with the platform. So we have been really enjoying asking
Speaker 1: people like you to come on and share your experiences
Speaker 1: and share your stories with us, and let us tell
Speaker 1: you how appreciative we are for all of the blood,
Speaker 1: sweat and tears you put into it and your love.
Speaker 1: Your love for the show was felt, um in in
Speaker 1: at the very least the two episodes that have your
Speaker 1: name on them, and um, we just are so appreciative
Speaker 1: that you're here. It's really kind of thank you so much.
Speaker 1: It was a pleasure. I'm scared to death, but it was.
Speaker 1: And that by the way, this was just the rehearsal.
Speaker 1: We're going to record the next one and take care
Speaker 1: of yourself. You too, being wonderful. Thank you you too.
Speaker 1: And it's so great to Sue by Jeanette. I mean,
Speaker 1: I don't even know what to say. Well, you know,
Speaker 1: it's it's so funny, Will, when we were talking to her,
Speaker 1: you said something about, you know, finding out your parents
Speaker 1: are real people. It does. It's a very similar process
Speaker 1: for us. You know. It's like, yeah, there's just always
Speaker 1: myth making uh when you're a kid, you know, and
Speaker 1: you participate in it, whether it's Santa Claus or the
Speaker 1: Tooth Fairy or the incredibly healthy writing dynamic. That was
Speaker 1: no politics that's going on in your writing staff on
Speaker 1: your show, which you know we should have been protected from,
Speaker 1: and we were, and that was great because we all
Speaker 1: just had so much fun. Um. But I definitely, you know,
Speaker 1: became aware of this possibility working on Girl Meets World,
Speaker 1: you know, when I was directing and finally able to
Speaker 1: see as much as I understood the directing side of
Speaker 1: things by that point, it was very eye opening to
Speaker 1: see that the way the writing side of things and
Speaker 1: the producing side of things, and the network side of things,
Speaker 1: it's so much more complicated. It's so much more brutal.
Speaker 1: It is very political. It's a political machine. Had Girl
Speaker 1: Meets World never happened, I wouldn't know or suspect any
Speaker 1: of the stuff, any of it, I would. But I
Speaker 1: agree that the amount that you were, you saw a lot.
Speaker 1: I needed a week in the I was like, I'm out,
Speaker 1: so it's yeah, no, it's um. And again, I I
Speaker 1: hate I hate that we constantly have to remind people
Speaker 1: that we love the show. I hate having to do
Speaker 1: that because we do we we I mean, we love
Speaker 1: Boy Meets World. And I hate that we keep having
Speaker 1: to reiterate that because we're learning all this stuff too.
Speaker 1: And I don't like that we keep having to convince
Speaker 1: people that we're not here to destroy anything. I think
Speaker 1: so too. It's just it annoys me that we have
Speaker 1: to keep going. We love. This is something we love.
Speaker 1: It's a hugely important and wonderful part of our lives. Um,
Speaker 1: but that doesn't mean you don't look at it differently,
Speaker 1: especially when you're an adult, that you go back and
Speaker 1: you you know, and again it's as Ryder said, it's
Speaker 1: it's great that we were insulated from all this we
Speaker 1: needed to be. It would have destroyed our performances. It
Speaker 1: would have, you know, destroyed our childhoods. It would have
Speaker 1: been harmle So the adults in this sense did exactly
Speaker 1: the right thing. They you know, had their adult thing
Speaker 1: and we had our kids thing. But um, hearing it
Speaker 1: now can be tough, It really can. Yeah, there's so
Speaker 1: many changes going into season two, you know, like the
Speaker 1: show getting older, the sort of nineteen fifties five we've
Speaker 1: talked about, the complete just discarding of Topanga's character. Um,
Speaker 1: there are a lot of choices that I now wonder
Speaker 1: how much of you know, how much of them were
Speaker 1: a you know, a result of just this purge, how
Speaker 1: much of them were just you lost a lot of voices.
Speaker 1: And you know, it's and you know, I'm sure we
Speaker 1: have a lot of listeners who love season two and forward,
Speaker 1: and maybe we will love it too for various reasons.
Speaker 1: But right now it feels like a real shock and
Speaker 1: I think that that's this is probably indication or it's
Speaker 1: it's a result of what was going on behind the scenes.
Speaker 1: Um so it's gonna be interesting to see how how
Speaker 1: that develops and how it settles. And you know, but
Speaker 1: I think we will. I was thinking about this. I
Speaker 1: think we will start to like season two because I
Speaker 1: remember certain things like the Nancy Carrigan episode and stuff
Speaker 1: like that that I think are going to be really
Speaker 1: like season two. I think I'm just uncomfortable with how
Speaker 1: it aged up so quickly. And then of course i'm
Speaker 1: you know, there are things that we've talked about, like
Speaker 1: that sort of uh, male perspective, you know, like where
Speaker 1: I'm flirting with the teacher, you know, teenage boy. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but it does seem like the perspective of uh, season
Speaker 1: two is is a different one. The show is the
Speaker 1: show has been united around, you know, told through a
Speaker 1: different lens. Yeah, yeah, well not to not to mix metaphors,
Speaker 1: but it seems like the mommy's gone now and Daddy's
Speaker 1: in charge of the show. M hm. So that's just
Speaker 1: kind of what it what it seems like a little
Speaker 1: bit to me, so huh. Well, thank you for joining
Speaker 1: us for this episode of Pod Meets World. Join us
Speaker 1: for the next one. But you can also follow us
Speaker 1: on Instagram pod Meets World Show. We you can send
Speaker 1: us your emails pod meets World Show at gmail dot
Speaker 1: com and we have merched that's merchandising for sale pod
Speaker 1: meets the World show dot com. And yeah, thanks for
Speaker 1: being with us for all the unpacking. Well send us out.
Speaker 1: We love you all. Pod dismissed. Pod Meets World is
Speaker 1: an I heart podcast produced and hosted by Daniel Fishel
Speaker 1: Wilford l and Ryder Strong. Executive producers Jensen Carp and
Speaker 1: Amy Sugarman, Executive in charge of production, Daniel Romo, producer
Speaker 1: and editor, Tara sup box producer, Jackie Rodriguez, engineer and
Speaker 1: Boy Meets World super fan Easton Allen our theme songs
Speaker 1: by Kyle Morton of Typhoon, and you can follow us
Speaker 1: on Instagram at Pod meets World Show or email us
Speaker 1: at Pod Meets World Show at gmail dot com.