Speaker 1: The following episode was recorded before the WGA sag Aftra
Speaker 1: strikes of twenty twenty three.
Speaker 2: You know, theater is something that has really been important
Speaker 2: to me in my life. I moved to New York
Speaker 2: and was really really tapped into the New York theater
Speaker 2: scene off Broadway. Still go to theater all the time,
Speaker 2: see as many shows as I can.
Speaker 3: And today's guest is something that I have never been,
Speaker 3: which is a major, major Broadway star. So whether you've
Speaker 3: sung the song Defying.
Speaker 2: Gravity or let it go on repeat, there's no doubt
Speaker 2: that you have heard her name, Adina Menzel.
Speaker 3: This is going to be a good one. I'm glad
Speaker 3: you're here. I want to introduce Dina Menzel, who is
Speaker 3: an incredible performer, a giant of Broadway, of all entertainment.
Speaker 3: Thank you so much for coming out and hanging out
Speaker 3: with me today.
Speaker 4: Thank you for that incredible introduction. I'm so I'm one
Speaker 4: of your I'm been a fan of yours since forever.
Speaker 4: So just to hear you say all that and then
Speaker 4: be included in this is is is such a gift.
Speaker 4: Thank you.
Speaker 3: Hey, listen, we don't I got I have. I'm embarrassed
Speaker 3: to say this we were chatting before we broll. But
Speaker 3: you know, I am I'm getting to the age where
Speaker 3: I start to forget who I've worked with and who
Speaker 3: I haven't worked with, And so.
Speaker 4: I have not worked with you.
Speaker 3: We have not worked together, yes, but I want I'm
Speaker 3: embarrassed to say that I've just I've figured out a
Speaker 3: way that I can avoid getting into a situation with
Speaker 3: someone that I'm meeting for the first time and saying
Speaker 3: nice to meet you, and then they turned around and said,
Speaker 3: you know, we did a love scene, yeah, ten years ago.
Speaker 3: So there's a thing called the call sheet for people
Speaker 3: that don't know. And it's this piece of paper that
Speaker 3: you that you can look at your on your way
Speaker 3: to the work if it's a movie or a television show,
Speaker 3: and it tells you all the people that you're about
Speaker 3: to work with. And I go onto this website and
Speaker 3: I'm not going to mention the name of the website
Speaker 3: because they're not paying me anything. But there's this website
Speaker 3: where you can put people's names in. I can put
Speaker 3: my name in. Then I can click on this little
Speaker 3: button that says connections, and it will actually tell me
Speaker 3: the connection to the person. In other words, it's almost
Speaker 3: playing the Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon game for you
Speaker 3: or for anybody else. So I clicked on it, and
Speaker 3: here are our connections. Maybe you know or maybe you
Speaker 3: don't know. The first one that popped up was that
Speaker 3: you were in a movie called Just a Kiss with
Speaker 3: Kira Sedgwick. Yeah, so that is our connection. And the
Speaker 3: other one I also have to mention, which is a
Speaker 3: little bit more obscure, but all so super cool is it?
Speaker 3: In nineteen seventy seven, I was in acting school with
Speaker 3: Winnie Holtzman.
Speaker 4: Huh oh really that's a great one.
Speaker 3: Yeah, great connection. Who you can tell people what Whatny
Speaker 3: Holtzman did.
Speaker 4: Winnie Holtzman, she wrote the was in his screenplay. She
Speaker 4: is writing that too. She wrote the book to Wicked
Speaker 4: the musical, and she's did my so called life and
Speaker 4: tons of things Wicked. She gave the voice, the speaking
Speaker 4: voice to Alphaba and Glinda. And yeah, she's a friend,
Speaker 4: had a great actress. She's actually in she's in Jerry Maguire.
Speaker 4: She's one of those women's sitting in the living room
Speaker 4: where they're all doing that like men bashing thing, and
Speaker 4: she's one of those women.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that's right. That's right. Well, for those of
Speaker 3: you that don't know, Adina was in Wicked in an
Speaker 3: incredible She was wicked and wicked and just me, it
Speaker 3: was such age and.
Speaker 4: You were nice. I don't know if you remember, and
Speaker 4: it's totally okay. It's about it's for me to remember
Speaker 4: because I was new and upcoming, and anytime celebrities came
Speaker 4: backstage that's a big deal for me. And you probably
Speaker 4: did it like every day of your life. But you
Speaker 4: and Kira and all the kids came backstage after Wicked
Speaker 4: and said hi to me.
Speaker 3: Oh, I had a feeling we might have, but I
Speaker 3: didn't want to embarrass myself and say that I had
Speaker 3: done that when I hadn't.
Speaker 4: Oh, that's awesome, And I want you to know also
Speaker 4: that probably because I was meeting you, I still want
Speaker 4: to be respectful of your wife, but because you're cute
Speaker 4: and sexy, I probably wanted to get my green makeup
Speaker 4: off before I met you so I could meet you
Speaker 4: like as myself and not as a green witch, which
Speaker 4: which was probably was one of the the occupational hazards
Speaker 4: was when I meet like the cute men, I'd have
Speaker 4: to like either I'd have to run in the shower
Speaker 4: and try to get the green off quickly and then
Speaker 4: like look pretty, or I just meet you as the
Speaker 4: wicked witch and then you never knew who I was
Speaker 4: when I meet you in other places.
Speaker 3: That's so funny. So we waited like four hours to
Speaker 3: meet you?
Speaker 4: Then, No, I didn't make you wait four hours.
Speaker 3: But oh, that's really interesting. Okay, So did you always
Speaker 3: take did you always take everything off? I mean like
Speaker 3: if the president came or.
Speaker 4: Something, you wouldn't yet, well know, because I didn't want
Speaker 4: to keep people waiting, So maybe weren't as important because
Speaker 4: it's there you go.
Speaker 3: Okay, So I didn't make the I didn't make the
Speaker 3: met or in the makeup list.
Speaker 4: No, it's all about vanity and looks and putting on
Speaker 4: a good, you know face for you. How do you know?
Speaker 3: I feel about that backstage thing, Like I'm kind of
Speaker 3: conflicted about it sometimes because I kind of feel like,
Speaker 3: I don't know, you know, when we go to the theater.
Speaker 3: On one hand, if I if I really appreciate some
Speaker 3: someone's performance, you know, I I want to go back
Speaker 3: and tell them. On the other hand, I feel like
Speaker 3: sometimes it like the backstage hang can become a performance
Speaker 3: of its own and it and it is it's it's
Speaker 3: like asking too much, do you know. I mean even
Speaker 3: like vocally right, you know, it's you know, your your
Speaker 3: instrument is like so tired and to keep and talking,
Speaker 3: as we know, is really much harder on your voice
Speaker 3: than singing is. So yes, like to have to chat
Speaker 3: it up with KB and KS and they're annoying kids.
Speaker 4: I mean, yeah, that was my pleasure, and it was
Speaker 4: probably it was one of the highlights, I will say,
Speaker 4: but I hear you. It's it's all part of the job.
Speaker 4: Like I find. Yeah, it's hard because you don't want
Speaker 4: to talk too much and you're trying to do eight
Speaker 4: shows a week, or when I'm on tour in a concert,
Speaker 4: you know, I try to do the meet and greets after,
Speaker 4: not before. But but then you'll also have to enjoy it,
Speaker 4: you know. I mean it's just it's so isolating, especially Broadway,
Speaker 4: when you have a big taxing role and then you're
Speaker 4: just you know, you're not socializing and you're going home
Speaker 4: or you're just seeing a movie or you know, and
Speaker 4: so you got to take in those moments when people
Speaker 4: like you I've looked up to my whole life, you know,
Speaker 4: are coming backstage and I've seen my performance. I have
Speaker 4: to take those moments in and I think I started
Speaker 4: realizing more. I realized that more when I had walked
Speaker 4: orod my son, who's now twelve. You know, having a
Speaker 4: baby helped me just chill out a little bit more
Speaker 4: as far as the performance and the perfectionism part of things,
Speaker 4: because it was like, I'm not going to hit that
Speaker 4: no one, but he had a fever. I was up
Speaker 4: all night. I wasn't gonna like not be with my
Speaker 4: son when he was sick. So I'm gonna sound shitty
Speaker 4: and that's it. And then I'd end up sounding actually
Speaker 4: really good because I was just more out of my
Speaker 4: head and just happy I showed up. And you know,
Speaker 4: so the expectation changed of myself and would that I
Speaker 4: became more more liberated. I found so the more I
Speaker 4: tried to just enjoy and not think of oh my god,
Speaker 4: you know, I mean, I'm smart and I don't drink
Speaker 4: and smoke and all that in the middle of a run.
Speaker 4: But that allowed myself to have a life.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Well that's interesting because a lot of people, I
Speaker 3: think have the misconception that when you have children that
Speaker 3: now you have given up the fire in your belly
Speaker 3: in some kind of fig and that you can't and
Speaker 3: that you can't make these two things exist in one
Speaker 3: perfect sort of combination, or that you will lose somehow,
Speaker 3: you know, the edge. They feel the same way oftentimes
Speaker 3: about you know, getting married or or you know, other
Speaker 3: other sort of normal kind of things. And and to
Speaker 3: hear that you actually feel more relaxed as a performer
Speaker 3: once you once you have a child and and the
Speaker 3: balance of your problems kind of shifts and you start
Speaker 3: to appreciate that. That's a that's really cool. But by
Speaker 3: the way, I don't know if there is a note
Speaker 3: that you can't hit, so oh.
Speaker 4: You can find them, uh, and they're out there, especially
Speaker 4: with social media, and they're not fun, but yeah, thank
Speaker 4: you for saying that, but they're definitely out there. Because
Speaker 4: the other thing is that I'm not from the auto
Speaker 4: tune generation, so which I'm not judging by the way,
Speaker 4: because there's some great stuff you can do, and that
Speaker 4: actually is a we can get into that after. But
Speaker 4: the point being is that because I'm from the theater too,
Speaker 4: and I was a wedding singer when I was when
Speaker 4: I was like teenager before I got, you know, my
Speaker 4: first professional job. I just I'm all about, you know,
Speaker 4: being real and being live, which means that if you're
Speaker 4: in New Year's Eve in Times Square and it's zero
Speaker 4: degrees weather, lip syncing might be a good thing for you,
Speaker 4: you know, because then you just sound great. You don't
Speaker 4: have to worry that your voice closes up when you
Speaker 4: hit the heiha at the end of the song. But no,
Speaker 4: I had to just you know, I knew that all
Speaker 4: the all the fans in the theater would be want
Speaker 4: to know if I hit it, if I sang it
Speaker 4: in the original key, So I kept it in the
Speaker 4: original key. I mean, so much ego involves, Like sometimes
Speaker 4: my ego gets the best of me, and I think
Speaker 4: I have to sing it in the original key and
Speaker 4: want to do it for Brila and be the real deal,
Speaker 4: and then I end up, you know, screwing it up,
Speaker 4: and then people say horrible things about me. So well,
Speaker 4: where are a lot of people out there that use
Speaker 4: it as a tool so that they can keep going.
Speaker 3: And I think that you have a certain you know,
Speaker 3: you've got a certain kind of pressure on you because
Speaker 3: you have such an incredible instrument and such a range
Speaker 3: that you know, and and and and and and the
Speaker 3: ability to sing with such force and such such you know,
Speaker 3: volume and passion that people tend to, uh, you know,
Speaker 3: want something from you technically, you know what I mean,
Speaker 3: and and and that you know that like I I mean,
Speaker 3: I'm someone that can really appreciate a voice like yours
Speaker 3: and admire it and also appreciate Bob Dylan, you know,
Speaker 3: I mean I exactly.
Speaker 4: There are times where I wish I was I I
Speaker 4: enjoy I wish the people that I listen to are
Speaker 4: the people that have those textures to their voices that
Speaker 4: maybe aren't as acrobatic as me, that tell a story
Speaker 4: just with one note because the sound of living in
Speaker 4: their voice. And I actually try to counteract some of
Speaker 4: my technical aspects and the technician and me. And also
Speaker 4: have found that those times when I've been performing under
Speaker 4: the weather, really bad argument with someone in my life,
Speaker 4: you know, something whatever, something going on that first of all,
Speaker 4: people won't realize half the time unless it's New Year's even,
Speaker 4: but they don't. They still feel, they still feel the
Speaker 4: emotion of the performance, and they don't need all that stuff.
Speaker 4: And so that it's something I've had to learn that's not.
Speaker 4: I'm not wrapped up. That's not my identity, you know,
Speaker 4: all wrapped up in these high notes, like you're saying that.
Speaker 4: I get it. But I can still move people and
Speaker 4: just tell a story with my voice. I don't have
Speaker 4: to sing these crazy high long notes. I don't have
Speaker 4: to impress that all the time.
Speaker 3: And let me just say that, you know, very impressive
Speaker 3: is your own uh songwriting and you're singing of your
Speaker 3: own stuff because Broadway is nothing. You know, you're you're
Speaker 3: delivering someone else's, uh your spin on someone else's material.
Speaker 3: But they're but correct me if I'm wrong. You know,
Speaker 3: the notes are very specific. They're they're they're they're written,
Speaker 3: and you're supposed to sing them the way that the
Speaker 3: component wrote them. There's no there's no really for improvisation
Speaker 3: in a in a Broadway score. But I mean I
Speaker 3: listened to okay, I mean I really I'm sort of
Speaker 3: feeling bad about this because we were just talking about it.
Speaker 3: But uh uh Queen of Swords, which I think did
Speaker 3: you write that one?
Speaker 4: I co wrote it?
Speaker 3: I can't write yeah, no, oh, I love that. I
Speaker 3: love that song and there is that quick but what
Speaker 3: is that note? There is a crazy note in there.
Speaker 3: I mean, I'm sorry, sorry to bring it back to that,
Speaker 3: but that was me.
Speaker 4: Yeah, those are moments where I'm like, I'm going to
Speaker 4: try to emulate what Chaka Khan would do. At the
Speaker 4: end of this, I usually give myself little in the studio. Yeah,
Speaker 4: people go, how do you bel to Dina teach it?
Speaker 4: I'm like, oh, I just listened to shakakanor Areta and
Speaker 4: then I try to imitate them and whatever comes out
Speaker 4: close to that.
Speaker 3: But it's a really super cool song. I love that.
Speaker 3: It kind of reminds me a little of like Toto.
Speaker 3: I don't want to get too much in the weeds
Speaker 3: on yeah, on the on on your your songs, But
Speaker 3: I mean there are a couple more that I just
Speaker 3: want to mention that I also love, which is, uh,
Speaker 3: I do did you write that one too?
Speaker 4: Yeah? I can't believe you're picking up these cool songs
Speaker 4: that people do not know and that I'm very proud of.
Speaker 3: Well that you don't know them, you should check them out.
Speaker 3: I mean, uh, Dina, you know the.
Speaker 4: Truth that it's your making the songs that have a
Speaker 4: kind of an edgier vibe, and that's you know, like
Speaker 4: if a Dell Disese put out an album, she would
Speaker 4: put out some crazy efanescence like rock headbanging. I mean
Speaker 4: there's a side of me that wants because I can't
Speaker 4: seem to shed the Broadway just to digress for you know,
Speaker 4: no matter what music I put out, it will always
Speaker 4: have like Broadway people. If you listen to these people,
Speaker 4: then you would like this music. And I'm like, this
Speaker 4: is a like a funky ass rock to And now
Speaker 4: you're putting you know, Carol Channing as a listening let
Speaker 4: me go, let me reply, you know, so thank you
Speaker 4: for picking those songs that have some edge too.
Speaker 3: But I can just mention one more and that is
Speaker 3: a perfect story and the reason that I love this song.
Speaker 3: I think about this song. I mean, you know, if
Speaker 3: you go to I think it should be required listening.
Speaker 3: You know, when you go to a wedding, it's you know,
Speaker 3: selling very good time or having a gel or you
Speaker 3: know whatever it is. And then there's that's that's that
Speaker 3: green Day song that they always play graduations and and
Speaker 3: this song should be required for children of divorced parents.
Speaker 3: It is such a touching, moving the story about what
Speaker 3: sort of how to how to handle that I mean,
Speaker 3: I you know, my my wife is a child of
Speaker 3: divorced parents, and and uh she thought the song was
Speaker 3: beautiful and and uh, I'm not. But I just think
Speaker 3: it's I think it's just think it's a gem.
Speaker 4: Thank you. It's funny that whenever I go to the
Speaker 4: studio to work on new music, my son walk Girls goes,
Speaker 4: could you write me like a happy song? Only something
Speaker 4: you wrote for me is sad divorced song to writes
Speaker 4: something about me being like a powerful boy and good
Speaker 4: at basketball. I'm like, I'll try, I'll try to fit that.
Speaker 4: But yeah, it's us. It gets better for anyone out
Speaker 4: there going through it. And and my ex husband, Tay
Speaker 4: and I are good friends. And he is in that
Speaker 4: movie with Kira that're talking about, and there's probably he's
Speaker 4: probably you guys have probably done something together. I don't know,
Speaker 4: but it's hard. It's just the most important thing. I
Speaker 4: really just stressed to people because I watch friends doing
Speaker 4: it even now. It's just not speaking badly, disparagingly about
Speaker 4: each other to in front of the kids. It's just
Speaker 4: whatever you do, it's just and that's and that's no
Speaker 4: matter what differences we had. He's been really incredible about
Speaker 4: both of us, about respecting each other in that way,
Speaker 4: but just yeah, just like kind of failing and not
Speaker 4: that I came from divorced parents, so I had sworn
Speaker 4: I wasn't going to do that, you know, and that
Speaker 4: idyllic perfects upbringing whatever that means, quote unquote and failing
Speaker 4: my son and not giving that to him. Of course,
Speaker 4: now he's twelve, and I realize what a cool kid
Speaker 4: he is, and he's got this great dad and a
Speaker 4: great step dad and they love each other, and he's
Speaker 4: got like two rooms and lots of two things and
Speaker 4: lots of love, and he's going to be a really
Speaker 4: cool person, probably grown up because he's experienced this in
Speaker 4: his life. So I wish I would have let myself
Speaker 4: off the hook back then, but I just felt so
Speaker 4: like such a failure, you know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and you're also trying to I mean I think that,
Speaker 3: you know, I can't speak for a woman's experience, but
Speaker 3: I would think that also trying to have a career
Speaker 3: and be a mom at the same time is a
Speaker 3: I mean, I've seen it, you know secondhand that it
Speaker 3: is a very very challenging life.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's wanting things for yourself when you're supposed to
Speaker 4: be giving everything to your family. You know, it's so contradictory.
Speaker 4: They're just contradicting terms and it doesn't need to be,
Speaker 4: but it just it's constant, just feels it's constant guilt,
Speaker 4: and you know, being away and how long and is
Speaker 4: that okay? And or just being in my home and
Speaker 4: not giving them all my time and you know working
Speaker 4: and yeah, so.
Speaker 3: Speaking of parents, were your parents how did they feel
Speaker 3: about you choosing this life? Was there like a day
Speaker 3: when you told them?
Speaker 4: Or was it just just I was always saying how
Speaker 4: about you? I was always singing, you know, jumping up
Speaker 4: from behind the couch. And uh, my dad was a
Speaker 4: little bit more uh hesitance, you know, made sure you
Speaker 4: mine are in business. My mom was always do what
Speaker 4: you love, got me the lessons, told me she didn't
Speaker 4: want me to work as a kid. Kid. How young
Speaker 4: were you when you started? Were you really young or
Speaker 4: just wow? Teens?
Speaker 3: Well, I mean professionally, I kind of guess I kind
Speaker 3: of started when I got out of high school.
Speaker 4: Okay, but yeah, she didn't want me doing it before then,
Speaker 4: so which I'm glad. I'm glad about that because uh,
Speaker 4: you know, I went to summer camp and had pretty
Speaker 4: normal life and was in the school plays. And because
Speaker 4: it comes in Long Island, says at Long Island. Yeah,
Speaker 4: and then I went to n y U and that
Speaker 4: was even hard to be. And I went there to
Speaker 4: tish and everything for theater. But it's even hard to be.
Speaker 4: I know, everyone loves at school, but it's hard to
Speaker 4: be in Manhattan studying. You feel like everyone's doing something
Speaker 4: and you got it's like I'm ready to be I
Speaker 4: was ready to be out instead of just being some
Speaker 4: we're on a campus somewhere and just enjoying learning and
Speaker 4: studying and being in the school place. You know, a
Speaker 4: clock already. And so I always tell people go somewhere more.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a lot of distractions in New York. Yeah,
Speaker 3: and you have You've got you know, Broad Broadway there
Speaker 3: just screaming at you.
Speaker 4: You know, yeah, you should be doing something, you should
Speaker 4: be going in Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3: I mean, I mean, on the other hand, I would
Speaker 3: think that that became, you know, a kind of a
Speaker 3: driving force for you, you know, at a pretty young age, right.
Speaker 4: And the diversity and outside of school, like just being
Speaker 4: surrounded by so many people with different passions and that
Speaker 4: I mean, I think being in Manhattan is the education
Speaker 4: itself at that age, you know, coming out of that
Speaker 4: very homogenized white neighborhood and Long Island and being able
Speaker 4: to see the rest of the world there. So that
Speaker 4: was the the education really. Yeah, but yeah.
Speaker 3: That's a great education. Uh you know, but you know,
Speaker 3: I like to I like to say that we one
Speaker 3: of the things that is important to in terms of like, uh,
Speaker 3: living your life and trying to expose yourself to a
Speaker 3: lot of different kinds of people is that that's what
Speaker 3: you're gonna have. Those are the people you're gonna have
Speaker 3: to play. You know, You're you're you're probably not going
Speaker 3: to be asked to play, uh, you know, a Broadway
Speaker 3: singer too often, you know, so you have to you
Speaker 3: have to go and and uh make yourself available and
Speaker 3: keep your heart open and and and and that's one
Speaker 3: of the great things that I found about. Yeah. I
Speaker 3: moved to New York when I was seventeen, and that
Speaker 3: whole giant I mean, even though I grew up in
Speaker 3: the in Philly and the city, but that whole world
Speaker 3: was so influential on me in terms of the people
Speaker 3: that I was going to have to play and continues to.
Speaker 4: But you've played such a variety and so then it
Speaker 4: makes you probably the empathed person that you are because
Speaker 4: you've you've played people from all sides of politics and
Speaker 4: spectrum of you know, people's morality and I mean everything.
Speaker 4: So you've really you're forced to really look at life
Speaker 4: from so many different through so many different lenses. That
Speaker 4: makes you That's why, like what you're saying in your introduction,
Speaker 4: with these six degrees and everybody sort of seeing something
Speaker 4: in one another, that's probably why you're the perfect one
Speaker 4: to do this because as an actor, I mean, as actors,
Speaker 4: we we can get typecasts, but you don't. You play everybody,
Speaker 4: and so you've had to like really do research.
Speaker 3: And I try, I try, just keep doing shit against
Speaker 3: the wall to see what sticks. So when you talk
Speaker 3: about I mean, I'm so many people have mentioned this
Speaker 3: to you before, but you happen, you don't happen. You've
Speaker 3: been in these incredibly iconic sort of UH projects and
Speaker 3: roles like Wicked and Rent uh which which by the way,
Speaker 3: we also loved that we probably didn't come backstage, or
Speaker 3: did we You might.
Speaker 4: Have had and and I want to remember it if
Speaker 4: you did.
Speaker 3: I mean I think I I think I probably went
Speaker 3: to so I read probably four times. But uh Frozen obviously,
Speaker 3: I mean, wow, what what you talk about? Iconic piece
Speaker 3: of pop culture? Uh, Glee, all these things. I don't
Speaker 3: think it's obviously there's no coincidence that you keep bending
Speaker 3: up in these things. You are obviously a big part
Speaker 3: of what makes those things explode in the way that
Speaker 3: they do. Do you ever like that has your career
Speaker 3: journey or where you've ended up. Does it ever take
Speaker 3: you by some prize? Do you ever stop and go
Speaker 3: I'm surprised, like something like something really surprises you.
Speaker 4: Yeah, all the time. Well, first of all, let me
Speaker 4: bring it down here. Yes, I'm very proud of those
Speaker 4: zeitgeist moments that I'm a part of, but they are
Speaker 4: like once each decade, So in between them, there's a
Speaker 4: lot of uh am I going to work again, obscurity moments,
Speaker 4: getting dropped from record deals, you know, different things that
Speaker 4: maybe are the things that give us the enduring, you know,
Speaker 4: the endurance that we need to stay afloat and keep
Speaker 4: wanting to be in this business. Maybe, so that's not
Speaker 4: all like it happens to me, and then it goes away.
Speaker 4: So then I have to appre I appreciate where I've
Speaker 4: been and that I had to work myself back up
Speaker 4: to get there. And so yeah, but but yes, I'm
Speaker 4: starting to say to myself, now, oh there's a nice
Speaker 4: there's a nice pattern. They're of these these beautiful roles
Speaker 4: that are all sort of all connect with like a
Speaker 4: young audience, no matter how much older I keep getting.
Speaker 4: It's about really helping people embody and and and be uh,
Speaker 4: their their strength and the you know, celebrating the the
Speaker 4: unsung hero, the the maybe the marginalized person or whatever.
Speaker 4: What is that about? What is it about for me?
Speaker 3: That?
Speaker 4: And so chicken or the egg? Of course, I don't know.
Speaker 4: I'm just I don't look at gift horse in the mouth.
Speaker 4: I'm just I'm happy because I don't know. I don't
Speaker 4: know why I have I'm just very seekful. I mean, yeah,
Speaker 4: maybe I have a way of recording, I have a
Speaker 4: way my voice has something in it, you know. I
Speaker 4: don't know. I just I know that when the understudy
Speaker 4: comes on, nobody they all still come in and watch
Speaker 4: the show. They don't leave, they don't all return their tickets.
Speaker 4: So it's obviously this I always see is my way
Speaker 4: of putting myself down. And like Kevin Bagin's, give me
Speaker 4: a couple of it. Just take it, you know, just
Speaker 4: shut up. Yes, I'm amazing. I don't know why.
Speaker 3: It's because you have the ability to find the humanity
Speaker 3: in a witch, you know. I mean, like, so that's
Speaker 3: that's really what it's about, you know, for for an
Speaker 3: audience to sit there and and you know, see a
Speaker 3: witch and find humanity or or an animated character and
Speaker 3: you know, bring it to life. I think that's really
Speaker 3: to me that that's what that's what that's what I
Speaker 3: would I feel. Thank you, you know, and thank you
Speaker 3: for pointing out that we do have peaks and valleys
Speaker 3: in our careers, because so often people just look from
Speaker 3: afar and you know, I think that at a certain point,
Speaker 3: not everyone thinks that the struggle is over. And I
Speaker 3: don't think I've ever talked to an actor that just goes, okay,
Speaker 3: that's it now. I can just ca I did it.
Speaker 3: I can just kick back, you know. It's it's we're
Speaker 3: we're we're because we've all been unemployed and because we
Speaker 3: well I can't talk for everybody, I can tell you
Speaker 3: for myself. If I'm when a job ends, that's not
Speaker 3: a vacation, that's like the beginning of the hunt for
Speaker 3: the next day. So like I've tried to learn in
Speaker 3: my life.
Speaker 4: To enjoy that time a.
Speaker 3: Week, no, not really, but to take a week to
Speaker 3: actually call something a vacation, right, because I know that
Speaker 3: the time in between is not it's I mean, I'm
Speaker 3: getting a little better at it, but but but I
Speaker 3: do think that, you know, I'll mention to people, well,
Speaker 3: you know, that was a really kind of a rough time,
Speaker 3: and you know, in my career, they're like, what what,
Speaker 3: why are you what are you talking about? Because they
Speaker 3: just don't nobody can really like understand that there are
Speaker 3: these peoples and valleys and that, as you pointed out,
Speaker 3: we are oftentimes very very hard in ourselves.
Speaker 4: But even within the job, even within the I'm sorry, no, no, no,
Speaker 4: and in the job and for me, I'm going back
Speaker 4: and forth to theater and film and TV and record
Speaker 4: it in a studio which is a very solitary place,
Speaker 4: and then being on tour in front of lots of
Speaker 4: people singing myself, you know, like I feel like I
Speaker 4: never my Like right now I'm doing a film and
Speaker 4: I always feel like it's the first time because I'm
Speaker 4: going back and forth to different medium. So the muscle
Speaker 4: I'm flexing is always I'm like, wait, what camera is
Speaker 4: as closed as this?
Speaker 3: What?
Speaker 4: You know? I just I never feel experienced when I
Speaker 4: go back to something, even the same with going back
Speaker 4: to do the stage thing, and it's like, and that's
Speaker 4: beautiful that there's I'm not it's not predictable, but I
Speaker 4: also like to feel like an expert once in a while,
Speaker 4: and I never do.
Speaker 3: You know, Wow, I just want want to ask you
Speaker 3: one more, uh show biz question, and that is about
Speaker 3: Uncut Gems, which is one of my favorite movies. I
Speaker 3: absolutely love that movie. I loved you in the movie,
Speaker 3: you know, Adam Sandler was fantastic and and Kevin Garnett,
Speaker 3: Oh my god, what a what a what a performance
Speaker 3: uh ag gave. I mean I just was like not
Speaker 3: knocked out by that. I'm not expecting it, and uh,
Speaker 3: I just wanted to, you know, ask what that what's that?
Speaker 3: What is that like with the Softy Brothers, Like, I mean,
Speaker 3: it just the movie has such a like a crazy
Speaker 3: energy fanaticism.
Speaker 4: Yeah he as, It's not as chaotic as it feels
Speaker 4: because I was actually trying to think about that when
Speaker 4: I was on set, like how did they Once I
Speaker 4: saw them, was thinking, how did they achieve this? What
Speaker 4: is it? Is it the steady cam?
Speaker 3: Is the thing?
Speaker 4: Is it the environment? They said on set? I mean
Speaker 4: for Will has two of them, right, and Ben Benny
Speaker 4: Saffie holds the boom really so he's yeah, so he's
Speaker 4: like holding them boom. By the way, he's an amazing actor.
Speaker 4: People probably don't realize that he's starting to do more
Speaker 4: and more, but he's an incredible actor. You know, you're
Speaker 4: starting to see him in a lot of things. But
Speaker 4: he holds the boom and gives you direction right there
Speaker 4: and then good yeah. And then you have his brother
Speaker 4: behind the monitor and they're both yelling out things to you.
Speaker 4: Most of the time they're in sick Sometimes they're and
Speaker 4: they're contradicting one another.
Speaker 3: But faster slower, faster slower.
Speaker 4: Yeah, or it's more like, okay, leave the script alone
Speaker 4: and it just improvise it and then they're like, okay,
Speaker 4: go back to the lines. I'm like, what the fuck
Speaker 4: are the lines anymore? But that's why Anam was just
Speaker 4: I just want him to get his his his due.
Speaker 4: I think he is now, but he's just God. It's
Speaker 4: just really easy, you know. I mean it would be
Speaker 4: the same with you. I mean people that are just
Speaker 4: inhabit the character and the world. All you have to
Speaker 4: do is to listen and then I sort of relaxed myself.
Speaker 4: He's just incredible that way. So, I it was so
Speaker 4: much fun. Plus it was a darker film for me.
Speaker 4: You know, it's like, it's not it's not a Disney princess.
Speaker 4: So I'm trying to break out once in a while.
Speaker 4: I mean, I'm trying to access the other parts of
Speaker 4: my character and my personality that people aren't aware of
Speaker 4: when you play a Disney princess. And uh, so that
Speaker 4: was fun to just do something a little darker.
Speaker 3: Well, you were fantastic in the movie, And for people
Speaker 3: that haven't seen it, go check out in uncut gems.
Speaker 3: It's it's a really good movie and it's it is dark,
Speaker 3: but but she's awesome in it, and uh and and
Speaker 3: definitely not a Disney princess, so it's it's good.
Speaker 4: Disney Jersey no long Island Princess.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, it's great.
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Speaker 3: Now, I want to talk about a broader way, which
Speaker 3: is the foundation that you started. So we're going to
Speaker 3: bring out your executive director, Tori. Yourbeard is here, so
Speaker 3: tell me how did you guys meet?
Speaker 4: We have a mutual friend named Philip McAdoo, right, who
Speaker 4: is in Lion King and Toy is in Lion King. Yes,
Speaker 4: how did I meet Philip? Philip through Tay my ex. Anyway,
Speaker 4: we we met and Janine too? Sorry wait is that how? Yeah?
Speaker 4: So Geno stories as as most of you out there,
Speaker 4: I know, very wonderful and very successful Broadway composer and
Speaker 4: and so okay, I had this vision. I had gone
Speaker 4: to summer camp for the six years of my life.
Speaker 4: I was very lucky to do that. It was a
Speaker 4: very bunch of entitled girls in a camp. And as
Speaker 4: I got older and I started to have some of
Speaker 4: these roles that were and that were really connecting me
Speaker 4: to young women, mostly young boys too, or theys as
Speaker 4: we would say now, but kids really searching for themselves
Speaker 4: in our identity. I found that I wanted kids to
Speaker 4: have this experience of going into getting out of the city,
Speaker 4: going up into the country, being able to rewrite them
Speaker 4: the themselves, rediscover themselves as young people during the summer,
Speaker 4: and use the arts to help them do that. So
Speaker 4: I called, actually called George Wolf and said, will you
Speaker 4: help me with this? And he said no, but you
Speaker 4: should call Janine And he said no in a lupping way,
Speaker 4: he was busy at the time, that you should call Jeanine.
Speaker 4: And then Janine brought in Toria and this whole team
Speaker 4: of wonderful, beautiful people that are now my good friends
Speaker 4: that run that run this with us. And so what
Speaker 4: we had started with thirty girls from mostly Harlem on
Speaker 4: the Lower East Side, and now we're not going on
Speaker 4: a twelfth yere door. Yes we are young. The youngest
Speaker 4: girls have now come around and are going to be
Speaker 4: counselors and are taking sort of ownership of the foundation. Itself.
Speaker 4: And that's always kind of what we hoped for, that
Speaker 4: we would sort of be able to step back a
Speaker 4: little and let let them do their thing.
Speaker 3: Is it well, is it in the summer or all
Speaker 3: the time?
Speaker 5: Be a round the campus in the summer every summer
Speaker 5: the program is on year round.
Speaker 4: It's grown. Yeah, because we realized that sorry, after the
Speaker 4: like ten days of being together, that it wasn't you
Speaker 4: know how like after a film you have a you crash,
Speaker 4: you could come down from all these wonderful people and
Speaker 4: this incredible experience you've had. And then so especially with
Speaker 4: these young people that we were with, I mean they
Speaker 4: were going back, some of them going back into environments
Speaker 4: that were challenging for them, and we just we wanted
Speaker 4: to stay connected, and so we had to keep raising
Speaker 4: money in order to keep the the programs throughout the year.
Speaker 3: So tell me what the experience would Let's just start
Speaker 3: with the camp. Let's say what would what would the
Speaker 3: experience be for for the for for the girl who
Speaker 3: goes through that?
Speaker 4: Yeah, do you want to go a Dina? Do you
Speaker 4: do it? So?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's ever changing.
Speaker 5: Yes, it is that. I guess I'll tell you about
Speaker 5: what it's like first, and then we'll talk about this
Speaker 5: ever changing aspect because is that is that's like one
Speaker 5: of the coolest parts of it to me. But camp
Speaker 5: is the beginning of the broader way journey. So you
Speaker 5: start camp, you would start camp between in the summer
Speaker 5: between fifth and sixth grade, and be welcomed by a
Speaker 5: whole bunch of people who are super excited to meet you,
Speaker 5: who feel like they know you already because they've been
Speaker 5: staring at your photos or your audition submissions, speaking to
Speaker 5: your parents, speaking to you, and trying as best as
Speaker 5: you know they can to get to know you. And
Speaker 5: then we do an orientation, a lot of like contract
Speaker 5: building with the community, our community to say, like what
Speaker 5: languages do we what language do we want to use,
Speaker 5: how do we want to treat each other? All of
Speaker 5: those things, and then much fun ensues after that. Many
Speaker 5: classes and what we used to call fundamentals, but that
Speaker 5: has so have expanded over the years, Like they take
Speaker 5: many many classes and many creative disciplines, filmmaking, choreography, dance,
Speaker 5: vocal music, what else, theater, spoken word.
Speaker 4: A lot of fine arts stuff they have. We we've
Speaker 4: moved around, but the facilities that were able to lease
Speaker 4: the space from usually have these great, great facilities so
Speaker 4: they can they do a lot of like painting as well.
Speaker 3: And it's an overnight. It's an overnight in summer.
Speaker 4: Like ten days over. And yeah, and we should say that,
Speaker 4: we say audition, but we are first thirty girls. All
Speaker 4: we had what thirty girls audition and we took.
Speaker 3: All thirty that's audition only kind.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, because we're finding that it's the arts. It's
Speaker 4: not just about what your quote talents are. The arts are,
Speaker 4: like we were talking about before Toy came on, Kevin,
Speaker 4: you know, it's about empathy. It's about walking to someone
Speaker 4: else's footsteps and understanding other people's experience in life. And
Speaker 4: for a lot of these young women, I keep saying,
Speaker 4: I keep hesitating toward because I want to we're struggling
Speaker 4: with how we how do we say it because we
Speaker 4: want to be inclusive of everyone.
Speaker 5: Yeah, we it's every evolving as we get more information
Speaker 5: back from the folks in our community. But we were
Speaker 5: saying young women and films or female identifying young folks,
Speaker 5: and now really I think we're moving towards saying young
Speaker 5: women and people on the gender expansion or gender expression spectrum.
Speaker 3: That's awesome, that's fantastic.
Speaker 4: But the point being that they that they all we
Speaker 4: all need to find our voice and like and that,
Speaker 4: you know, I relate to it because I feel like
Speaker 4: everyone thinks I have this huge voice and that means
Speaker 4: I can find a way to express myself on my
Speaker 4: own personal life because I have to speak voice. But
Speaker 4: it's not true. I'm constantly searching that voice and how
Speaker 4: to you know, challenge tackle things in the world. And
Speaker 4: and and you assume I made them. I made the
Speaker 4: misconception of assuming that these girls were from really tough neighborhoods,
Speaker 4: so to speak, which was a misconception to begin with,
Speaker 4: and then assuming they were going to come in and
Speaker 4: be loud and often they were actually really shy and insecure,
Speaker 4: and we needed to help them even just be proud
Speaker 4: of saying their name and introducing themselves. So it's the art.
Speaker 4: I'm not doing a good job at this tour. I'm
Speaker 4: a little out of practice, but like using these the
Speaker 4: arts are so much more than just for the kid
Speaker 4: that can kick their leg up to their head or
Speaker 4: sing out some great no you know, it's they help
Speaker 4: these our young and really find who they are. And
Speaker 4: experiment was all different kinds of it was all different
Speaker 4: kinds of creative outlets to do that.
Speaker 3: Toria, let me ask you, you are a performer, and
Speaker 3: what was it about your own experience. I don't know
Speaker 3: a whole lot about your history, but that made you
Speaker 3: think that this was something that you wanted to get
Speaker 3: involved with, because obviously, whenever anybody is out there doing
Speaker 3: good work, there's always a million other things that you
Speaker 3: could be doing. Was there something in your life that
Speaker 3: kind of drove you towards this? And also sort of
Speaker 3: two poor question, what is it that you get out
Speaker 3: of it?
Speaker 5: Okay, Well, first, I started my artistic journey as a dancer,
Speaker 5: and I had wonderful mentors, but I was also in
Speaker 5: small dance companies or smaller regional dance companies at in
Speaker 5: the beginning, and we had to do a lot of outreach.
Speaker 4: It was part of how the.
Speaker 5: Companies made money or earned, you know, money or grants
Speaker 5: or whatever to exist to sustain themselves. So I started
Speaker 5: teaching at a very young age, and I had teaching
Speaker 5: modeling to me at a young age.
Speaker 4: So from that once.
Speaker 5: I began to develop my own practice as an educator
Speaker 5: and also deep in my practice as an artist.
Speaker 4: It was it became very important to.
Speaker 5: Me for really using teaching dance specifically as a way
Speaker 5: of connecting with young people and as a way of
Speaker 5: expanding all of our like our vision about what life
Speaker 5: can be. So, like Adina said, I had been working
Speaker 5: with Philip to develop some programs with young folks around
Speaker 5: New York and in South Africa at the time, and
Speaker 5: it was just part it's part of my personal mission.
Speaker 4: I love spending time with young people.
Speaker 5: I have grown so much, like my world has completely
Speaker 5: opened up because of this opportunity to partner with Adina
Speaker 5: and everyone else at a broader way, including the young folks.
Speaker 5: I have seen myself change. I've seen the way I
Speaker 5: think about myself and my place in the world has
Speaker 5: changed because of a broader way. I understand accountability in
Speaker 5: a very different way. And I also learned at a
Speaker 5: certain point, maybe like a little bit more than halfway
Speaker 5: through my time out of Bay, which started in the beginning,
Speaker 5: that as much as I think I'm teaching, if I
Speaker 5: will just stop talking, I can.
Speaker 4: Actually learn a lot.
Speaker 5: So I have learned so much from the young folks
Speaker 5: that I am in collaboration with, even as a mentor.
Speaker 5: You know, now I have a different idea of what
Speaker 5: that can be. I think peer mentorship is important. I
Speaker 5: think it's important to allow ourselves to be mentored by
Speaker 5: people who are younger and maybe less experienced in certain
Speaker 5: ways than we are. So and it's been so wonderful
Speaker 5: to continue to work with Adina as your I mean,
Speaker 5: I feel like we're so different now than we were
Speaker 5: in the beginning, but we've you know, sometimes people grow apart,
Speaker 5: and I feel like we've continued to grow together, which
Speaker 5: is so beautiful.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you know, I think that you've You've what I've
Speaker 3: been working on a lot in my life in the
Speaker 3: past few years is just shutting up and listening. That's
Speaker 3: and you can imagine, as you can imagine, that's been
Speaker 3: very challenging for a guy like me. But it really,
Speaker 3: it really is a really really uh I think that's
Speaker 3: a really good lesson. That's really uh the inspiring to
Speaker 3: hear you hear you say that, and tell me a
Speaker 3: little bit, Torri about the about the impact that you've
Speaker 3: seen on some of these uh people that that that
Speaker 3: have attended the program or or continue to come back
Speaker 3: or or I think I think you mentioned that they
Speaker 3: sometimes end up working there.
Speaker 4: Wow, let me think about that. I mean, I've seen.
Speaker 5: Young people go from being very shy and withdrawn to
Speaker 5: being fierce advocates for themselves and other people. I've seen
Speaker 5: the realization that, you know, if I am the first
Speaker 5: person in my family to go to college, I don't
Speaker 5: have to pick like a safe career, or I don't
Speaker 5: have to follow the path that I've seen other people follow.
Speaker 4: I can chart my own course. I can do something different.
Speaker 5: And most recently, one of our original campers we call
Speaker 5: them the ogs, joined our board of directors. Oh wow,
Speaker 5: that's a massive and we have many that are counselors
Speaker 5: and that work with us in other capacities, But that
Speaker 5: that was the mark I think we were we've all
Speaker 5: been waiting for. And to have her voice in there,
Speaker 5: like guiding the organization is incredible.
Speaker 3: Are the counselors. Are the counselors people that are professionals
Speaker 3: in the industry or people that you know that people
Speaker 3: come up and do sort of like drop in seminars.
Speaker 3: I mean, tell me about the staff.
Speaker 5: Both they're both professionals and some people drop in. Adina's
Speaker 5: brought in many incredible guest artists, and then we have
Speaker 5: a roster of creative team members that say we know
Speaker 5: or anybody knows that wants to come and work with
Speaker 5: the young person. Thing is is that once they do
Speaker 5: it one year, they typically always want to do it,
Speaker 5: so the roster doesn't rotate as much as it as
Speaker 5: it could, I suppose. But the counselors are usually young
Speaker 5: people who are studying social work or social justice or nursing,
Speaker 5: you know, people who really have the desire to work
Speaker 5: with young people in this capacity because you know, it's
Speaker 5: hard to be away from home. Like Adina was saying
Speaker 5: in the beginning, some of these young people have never
Speaker 5: been away from home, or they they've never been outside
Speaker 5: of the city environment. So you know, the bugs, the darkness,
Speaker 5: there's a lot.
Speaker 3: Sure, sure, sure, yeah, yeah, wow, that's amazing. So then
Speaker 3: in the rest of the year, tell me about the
Speaker 3: other programs that happened outside of the summer camp.
Speaker 4: Mhm.
Speaker 5: We so we have a school year program for the
Speaker 5: younger participants and they do many of their workshops, but
Speaker 5: we we most like they'll do like choreography workshops, and
Speaker 5: we meet up every month to do like what what
Speaker 5: we call a workshop. But it's really like a long
Speaker 5: check in and we usually have a topic that are
Speaker 5: something that's happening that we are gathering around and discussing.
Speaker 5: We have guest artists come in and just guest speakers.
Speaker 5: And then we started a program named after Jeanine Tasori,
Speaker 5: which is is an authorship program, so they make work
Speaker 5: mentored by professionals in choreography, songwriting, filmmaking and spoken work.
Speaker 4: So that's been really important to Torri and myself, especially
Speaker 4: that we weren't just this camp in the beginning and
Speaker 4: this organization that the kids were doing a bunch of
Speaker 4: revivals of shows that they don't even have a connection
Speaker 4: to or you know, And so for us, it was
Speaker 4: about how can we allow them to create and help
Speaker 4: them execute their own visions. So Janine would have them
Speaker 4: write a lot in the beginning. We found that their
Speaker 4: writing turned into their spoken word or so while someone
Speaker 4: was performing their spoken word their poem, someone else was
Speaker 4: choreographing a modern piece behind them, and then someone else
Speaker 4: would compose music to going to neither that kind of thing,
Speaker 4: and then we'd have more of like a recital where
Speaker 4: we felt was the celebration of all of their work
Speaker 4: and teaching them that theyre authors of their own lives
Speaker 4: and you know as well, and that they have that
Speaker 4: we want to we want to hear and see what
Speaker 4: they have to offer.
Speaker 3: So it sounds like you're not doing a production of
Speaker 3: Footloose there.
Speaker 4: Not out of the rol up possibility.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's not, but it could use a little bit
Speaker 3: of an update, I think.
Speaker 4: But yeah, we would just su mess with it a little.
Speaker 3: I think you'd have to. Well, that is really incredible.
Speaker 3: I mean, Adina, I know that from myself, stepping into
Speaker 3: this world was like of you know, trying to figure
Speaker 3: out how to in some way give back or use
Speaker 3: whatever kind of celebrity you have to do something in
Speaker 3: a positive way. Was a little like was overwhelming, and
Speaker 3: actually sometimes continues to be kind of overwhelming. But it's
Speaker 3: but it feels as though you found something that's just
Speaker 3: very much a natural fit with you and where your
Speaker 3: your heart lives. And certainly to find Toria, you know,
Speaker 3: and and for you guys to get connected and be
Speaker 3: able to put this thing together is you must feel
Speaker 3: really good about it.
Speaker 4: I do. She she and the whole our whole group.
Speaker 4: They've made me a better person. Honestly, I've learned. I
Speaker 4: learned more from Toria, the our staff, and our young campers.
Speaker 4: I've learned more about myself through them than they probably
Speaker 4: have learned from me. But yes, it is very rewarding
Speaker 4: and and we I think what we pride ourselves on
Speaker 4: is that we are malleable and that we are learning
Speaker 4: and growing. And we we always had this uh illustration
Speaker 4: of a of a tree that we sort of have
Speaker 4: these roots that we all need, you know, in the ground,
Speaker 4: that hold us strong and steadfast, and then we have
Speaker 4: our branches. But branches can't be brittle otherwise we break.
Speaker 4: So we have to be able to move and grow
Speaker 4: and evolve. And it's kind of something that we take
Speaker 4: an image we take with us and I think as
Speaker 4: an organization we're doing that as well. And so we
Speaker 4: so tell us how hold each other accountable.
Speaker 3: Tell us thank you, tell us how people can help out,
Speaker 3: how they can where they go to find out what
Speaker 3: you're doing, to to donate or to volunteer, or how
Speaker 3: they can get involved.
Speaker 5: W w W do people even still say that BroaderWay
Speaker 5: dot org a broader Way dot org?
Speaker 4: Yeah, And you can, like just you could you could
Speaker 4: sponsor a camper just to get started, like one camper
Speaker 4: for the summer would be amazing help.
Speaker 3: You know the greatest idea. I love that.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so they can get in touch and it will
Speaker 4: help them, will make it easy for them to help.
Speaker 3: That is awesome. Yes, ser well, thank you guys so much.
Speaker 4: Amazing you for having us on and allowing us to
Speaker 4: shine light on this organization and just letting me hang
Speaker 4: out and talk with you is a big buffet list
Speaker 4: thing for me.
Speaker 3: It was really fun, I really really fun, And thank
Speaker 3: you both and I will see you down the road.
Speaker 2: Hey, guys, thanks for listening to another episode of six Degrees.
Speaker 2: And if you want to learn more about A Broader
Speaker 2: Way and all the good work that they are up to,
Speaker 2: head to our website, a Broader Way dot org.
Speaker 3: You can find all the links in our show notes, and.
Speaker 2: If you like what you hear, make sure you subscribe
Speaker 2: to the show and tune into.
Speaker 3: The rest of our episodes. You can find six Degrees
Speaker 3: with Kevin Bacon on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or
Speaker 3: wherever you get your podcasts. We'll see you next time.
Speaker 4: M