1 00:00:01,120 --> 00:00:06,440 Speaker 1: Conversations on life, style, beauty and relationships. It's the Velvet's 2 00:00:06,480 --> 00:00:08,240 Speaker 1: Edge podcast with Kelly Henderson. 3 00:00:08,480 --> 00:00:09,559 Speaker 2: Katie Horwich is here. 4 00:00:09,640 --> 00:00:14,080 Speaker 3: She is a writer, speaker, mindset coach, and women's empowerment activist. 5 00:00:14,360 --> 00:00:17,439 Speaker 3: She is the founder of WANT Women Against Negative Talk, 6 00:00:17,520 --> 00:00:21,720 Speaker 3: a platform that gives women tools, tips, motivation, and inspiration 7 00:00:21,800 --> 00:00:25,120 Speaker 3: to move forward in their lives fearlessly by shifting their 8 00:00:25,160 --> 00:00:29,360 Speaker 3: negative self talk patterns. She's also the host of want Cast, 9 00:00:29,480 --> 00:00:33,760 Speaker 3: the Women against Negative Talk podcast, and now an author 10 00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:38,280 Speaker 3: of the book Want Yourself, Shift, Shift of Self with 11 00:00:38,440 --> 00:00:40,440 Speaker 3: shift your I'm missing a word here. 12 00:00:41,320 --> 00:00:43,479 Speaker 2: Shift yourself talk? Where is that? 13 00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:46,199 Speaker 3: Yeah? Shift yourself talking, Unearth the strength and who you 14 00:00:46,280 --> 00:00:47,199 Speaker 3: were all along? 15 00:00:47,280 --> 00:00:49,080 Speaker 2: There we go, there, we go. 16 00:00:48,840 --> 00:00:52,760 Speaker 3: Out to Sorry for that little uh iffy intro there, 17 00:00:52,800 --> 00:00:53,960 Speaker 3: but hi Katie, thank you? 18 00:00:54,120 --> 00:00:58,560 Speaker 2: No are you k I thought it was a wonderful intro. 19 00:00:59,280 --> 00:01:02,240 Speaker 2: It's a mouse because you know it's a big It's 20 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:05,280 Speaker 2: a big subject, which is why I wrote a book 21 00:01:05,280 --> 00:01:07,920 Speaker 2: on it instead of making an Instagram post and calling 22 00:01:07,920 --> 00:01:08,360 Speaker 2: it a day. 23 00:01:08,680 --> 00:01:13,000 Speaker 3: Yes, well, we were talking before the podcast and the 24 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 3: theme this month here on Velvet's Edge is cobwebs. We 25 00:01:16,040 --> 00:01:18,160 Speaker 3: pick a word every month that we picked the word cobwebs. 26 00:01:18,200 --> 00:01:21,720 Speaker 3: Obviously it's October spooky season. There's a lot of different 27 00:01:21,720 --> 00:01:24,440 Speaker 3: meanings there. But you are the perfect guest for me 28 00:01:24,560 --> 00:01:28,880 Speaker 3: for this topic because, as you mentioned, negative self talk, 29 00:01:29,000 --> 00:01:32,160 Speaker 3: it's a huge topic, right, but to me, it's also 30 00:01:32,240 --> 00:01:35,080 Speaker 3: the thing that just kind of lurks in the shadows, 31 00:01:35,200 --> 00:01:38,440 Speaker 3: like it's the thing driving most things that we do, 32 00:01:38,840 --> 00:01:41,480 Speaker 3: yet we don't even know that it exists, right. 33 00:01:42,000 --> 00:01:45,600 Speaker 2: One hundred percent. It's like, you know, what's so funny 34 00:01:45,800 --> 00:01:49,800 Speaker 2: is that throughout not just my work of you know, 35 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:54,720 Speaker 2: fifteen years or so studying and researching and generally obsessing 36 00:01:55,000 --> 00:01:59,680 Speaker 2: over self talk, especially during this book process and this 37 00:01:59,760 --> 00:02:05,440 Speaker 2: book I guess media process, there have been people who 38 00:02:05,440 --> 00:02:08,680 Speaker 2: have said, you know, I actually thought that I didn't 39 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:13,399 Speaker 2: have negative self talk anymore, and so I thought, well, 40 00:02:13,440 --> 00:02:16,079 Speaker 2: this doesn't apply to me, and then as they got 41 00:02:16,080 --> 00:02:20,200 Speaker 2: into the work, they realized, oh wow, I actually have 42 00:02:20,400 --> 00:02:23,080 Speaker 2: more of that in me than I thought I did. 43 00:02:23,120 --> 00:02:26,919 Speaker 2: And when people say that, I sort of say, that's 44 00:02:26,960 --> 00:02:30,480 Speaker 2: amazing if you don't feel like negative self talk runs 45 00:02:31,000 --> 00:02:33,600 Speaker 2: your life. But to say that you have no negative 46 00:02:33,639 --> 00:02:37,160 Speaker 2: self talk, so to speak, is kind of like saying, well, 47 00:02:37,240 --> 00:02:41,560 Speaker 2: I never get tired. You're a human, You're not a robot. 48 00:02:41,600 --> 00:02:44,520 Speaker 2: You're going to get tired, which you know in this case, 49 00:02:44,600 --> 00:02:46,520 Speaker 2: you are a human, not a robot. So you're going 50 00:02:46,600 --> 00:02:50,959 Speaker 2: to have all different types of self talk that comes up. 51 00:02:51,040 --> 00:02:55,000 Speaker 2: But you are so right that it really can be 52 00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:58,480 Speaker 2: so deceptive and so sneaky and be lurking in the 53 00:02:58,520 --> 00:03:03,320 Speaker 2: background of consciousness, and sometimes that can come out in 54 00:03:03,360 --> 00:03:07,639 Speaker 2: ways that we don't expect, in really harmful ways. Yeah. 55 00:03:07,720 --> 00:03:09,720 Speaker 3: Well, let's talk about that a little bit, because in 56 00:03:09,840 --> 00:03:13,880 Speaker 3: Want Yourself, you dive into ways to shift your negative 57 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:17,959 Speaker 3: self talk patterns. But this is more than just speaking 58 00:03:18,080 --> 00:03:21,160 Speaker 3: nicely to yourself, right, Can you talk about the difference there. 59 00:03:22,080 --> 00:03:27,080 Speaker 2: Yeah. So there is some research that I am just 60 00:03:27,600 --> 00:03:30,440 Speaker 2: completely obsessed with that I put right at the beginning 61 00:03:30,480 --> 00:03:33,160 Speaker 2: of the book. There's this study that was done with 62 00:03:33,280 --> 00:03:37,080 Speaker 2: two different groups of people. One group had pre existing 63 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:39,680 Speaker 2: low self esteem and then the other group had pre 64 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:43,400 Speaker 2: existing high self esteem, and both of the groups thought 65 00:03:43,560 --> 00:03:47,120 Speaker 2: that positive. They were calling it in the study positive 66 00:03:47,160 --> 00:03:51,000 Speaker 2: self statements, what we might think of as positive affirmations 67 00:03:51,080 --> 00:03:54,400 Speaker 2: or positive self talk. Both of them believed, okay, these 68 00:03:54,760 --> 00:03:57,680 Speaker 2: these work wonders, and so they gave each of the 69 00:03:57,720 --> 00:04:02,600 Speaker 2: groups pieces of positive self statements to repeat to themselves, 70 00:04:03,080 --> 00:04:05,640 Speaker 2: and what they noticed over time is that the people 71 00:04:05,720 --> 00:04:12,160 Speaker 2: who had pre existing high self esteem it actually kept 72 00:04:12,200 --> 00:04:14,880 Speaker 2: them there made them feel better, and the people who 73 00:04:15,120 --> 00:04:18,480 Speaker 2: had low self esteem, it actually made them feel worse 74 00:04:18,560 --> 00:04:21,800 Speaker 2: because what was going on was a form of cognitive 75 00:04:21,839 --> 00:04:26,800 Speaker 2: dissonance where they felt like they were lying to themselves, 76 00:04:26,960 --> 00:04:31,840 Speaker 2: and then they had feelings about those feelings. So that 77 00:04:32,080 --> 00:04:37,080 Speaker 2: combined with the fact that not everybody's negative self talk 78 00:04:37,160 --> 00:04:40,000 Speaker 2: or self talk in general, let's forget about negative for 79 00:04:40,040 --> 00:04:44,080 Speaker 2: a second, not everybody's self talk actually shows up as 80 00:04:44,480 --> 00:04:47,240 Speaker 2: talk and words to begin with. Some people experience it 81 00:04:47,320 --> 00:04:50,760 Speaker 2: through like visuals. They'll say it's like a movie playing 82 00:04:50,760 --> 00:04:53,120 Speaker 2: out in their mind, or they have these abstract feelings. 83 00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:56,440 Speaker 2: If you put those two together, then it's sort of 84 00:04:56,560 --> 00:05:01,880 Speaker 2: like a, oh, I understand now, why maybe I've been 85 00:05:01,960 --> 00:05:07,000 Speaker 2: saying these so called positive things to myself and they 86 00:05:07,040 --> 00:05:09,799 Speaker 2: haven't been making a difference in my life. Because maybe 87 00:05:09,800 --> 00:05:13,040 Speaker 2: that isn't where you were even starting. And even if 88 00:05:13,080 --> 00:05:17,400 Speaker 2: you were starting with words, then maybe you weren't in 89 00:05:17,440 --> 00:05:20,440 Speaker 2: a place where you had that seed of belief in 90 00:05:20,480 --> 00:05:23,279 Speaker 2: what you're saying to actually take it forward. So I 91 00:05:23,360 --> 00:05:26,760 Speaker 2: like to get behind the talk which is symptomatic and 92 00:05:26,880 --> 00:05:32,000 Speaker 2: get to the bottom of the self part of the equation. Yeah. 93 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:34,560 Speaker 3: So what I'm hearing you say it's so interesting because 94 00:05:34,600 --> 00:05:36,840 Speaker 3: the people with the low self esteem, it's almost as 95 00:05:36,839 --> 00:05:40,479 Speaker 3: if it was creating this like shame spiral internally that 96 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:41,680 Speaker 3: they weren't even aware of. 97 00:05:42,240 --> 00:05:44,599 Speaker 2: Totally one thousand percent. 98 00:05:45,200 --> 00:05:49,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, so how are they catching that in the moment, 99 00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:52,360 Speaker 3: like if or how did y'all figure that out? I guess, 100 00:05:52,480 --> 00:05:54,039 Speaker 3: or in that study, how did they figure it out? 101 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:57,400 Speaker 2: Yeah? In the study, the I mean the way that 102 00:05:57,440 --> 00:06:02,240 Speaker 2: they figured it out is sort of like taking the 103 00:06:02,279 --> 00:06:05,799 Speaker 2: stock of like, Okay, well, how are these people feeling 104 00:06:06,160 --> 00:06:09,640 Speaker 2: about themselves? And I reference the study in the book 105 00:06:09,640 --> 00:06:11,840 Speaker 2: and people can read like the pages and pages of it. 106 00:06:13,080 --> 00:06:15,719 Speaker 2: But you know, it's so interesting because when you mentioned 107 00:06:15,720 --> 00:06:17,719 Speaker 2: the shame spiral, like I don't want to double click 108 00:06:17,760 --> 00:06:22,680 Speaker 2: into that. Yeah, it made me think about myself and 109 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:24,520 Speaker 2: my own life and the people that I work with, 110 00:06:24,600 --> 00:06:29,560 Speaker 2: who are usually very not only high achievers, but they're 111 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 2: people who are already somewhat familiar with this type of 112 00:06:35,880 --> 00:06:40,000 Speaker 2: let's just call it mindset work. And so what can 113 00:06:40,160 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 2: happen is we can get these narratives that develop of well, 114 00:06:46,240 --> 00:06:49,040 Speaker 2: I should be over this by now. I thought that 115 00:06:49,080 --> 00:06:52,679 Speaker 2: I was past this. And then there's, like you said, 116 00:06:52,720 --> 00:06:56,200 Speaker 2: that sort of shame spiral that comes in that is 117 00:06:56,400 --> 00:06:59,000 Speaker 2: going to take you along, like I think of a 118 00:06:59,080 --> 00:07:01,920 Speaker 2: roller coaster. It's going to take you on that ride 119 00:07:02,320 --> 00:07:06,400 Speaker 2: the second that you decide to dip your toe into it. 120 00:07:07,360 --> 00:07:12,920 Speaker 2: Because we are hard wired to recognize the things that 121 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:19,440 Speaker 2: feel dangerous or not or incongruent to us. We're hardwired 122 00:07:19,480 --> 00:07:21,960 Speaker 2: to see those things, and so of course we're going 123 00:07:22,000 --> 00:07:26,000 Speaker 2: to have feelings about them when those times come up. 124 00:07:26,400 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 2: It's just it's more about what we do with those 125 00:07:29,200 --> 00:07:34,640 Speaker 2: feelings that's what matters, versus how we feel about Well, 126 00:07:35,320 --> 00:07:37,400 Speaker 2: I thought that I should be over I was over 127 00:07:37,440 --> 00:07:41,720 Speaker 2: this by now, and I'm not, you know, totally. 128 00:07:41,800 --> 00:07:43,640 Speaker 3: And the other thing I hear you saying, it's just 129 00:07:43,680 --> 00:07:46,040 Speaker 3: like paying the word awareness in my mind, because I 130 00:07:46,080 --> 00:07:49,680 Speaker 3: know you say, because self talk isn't positive or negative. 131 00:07:49,720 --> 00:07:52,320 Speaker 3: It's the story you're telling yourself. So you have to 132 00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:55,120 Speaker 3: start there, right And I think so much of those 133 00:07:55,120 --> 00:07:57,920 Speaker 3: shame spirals are this from my experience with them, I 134 00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:00,400 Speaker 3: guess it's like I want to attach to the feeling 135 00:08:00,440 --> 00:08:03,320 Speaker 3: like you're saying, like I feel terrible right now. But 136 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:06,800 Speaker 3: isn't it such a thing that if you're actually just 137 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:10,520 Speaker 3: recognizing it, like the awareness, like oh look, how I'm 138 00:08:10,880 --> 00:08:13,920 Speaker 3: I'm doing that thing again? Like that's the first step, right, 139 00:08:14,920 --> 00:08:15,680 Speaker 3: hundred percent. 140 00:08:15,960 --> 00:08:21,560 Speaker 2: I think that just paying attention, I mean paying attention 141 00:08:21,680 --> 00:08:25,480 Speaker 2: and getting curious. I believe that it could make so 142 00:08:26,080 --> 00:08:29,800 Speaker 2: much change happen in the world. However, that can be 143 00:08:29,880 --> 00:08:34,880 Speaker 2: really really uncomfortable. Yeah, then there's also you know, there's 144 00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:38,640 Speaker 2: this idea that we should be able to first of all, 145 00:08:38,640 --> 00:08:41,040 Speaker 2: we should be able to pay attention like it's easy too, 146 00:08:42,240 --> 00:08:46,319 Speaker 2: and that we should be able to flip the switch 147 00:08:46,559 --> 00:08:50,720 Speaker 2: right in the moment and just jump straight to the 148 00:08:51,080 --> 00:08:54,320 Speaker 2: story that you want to write over whatever you're saying. 149 00:08:54,760 --> 00:08:59,200 Speaker 2: But if we are going with the framework of self 150 00:08:59,240 --> 00:09:03,680 Speaker 2: talk is inherently neither good or bad. It's information. It's 151 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:07,679 Speaker 2: actually about not just about paying attention about when this 152 00:09:08,280 --> 00:09:11,720 Speaker 2: stuff comes up in us, but going and digging and 153 00:09:11,760 --> 00:09:16,360 Speaker 2: figuring out, Okay, well what's underneath this? And there might 154 00:09:16,400 --> 00:09:21,040 Speaker 2: be some tough information under there. But if we go 155 00:09:21,160 --> 00:09:26,480 Speaker 2: into our own relationship with ourself, like we would go 156 00:09:26,640 --> 00:09:31,680 Speaker 2: into a relationship with anybody who we love and care 157 00:09:31,760 --> 00:09:36,720 Speaker 2: for deeply in our lives. And you know, I don't 158 00:09:36,720 --> 00:09:39,280 Speaker 2: know about you or people listening, but for me, with 159 00:09:39,360 --> 00:09:42,199 Speaker 2: the people that I care deeply about in their lives, 160 00:09:43,200 --> 00:09:45,320 Speaker 2: when they're telling me things, I want to say, tell 161 00:09:45,360 --> 00:09:49,640 Speaker 2: me more like, let's talk, let's dig in, Let's dig 162 00:09:49,679 --> 00:09:54,720 Speaker 2: in if you're ready. I'm not going to bypass their emotions. 163 00:09:54,840 --> 00:09:57,679 Speaker 2: I'm not going to tell them to just think positive 164 00:09:57,840 --> 00:10:02,920 Speaker 2: when they're in a really, really tough place. We're able 165 00:10:03,000 --> 00:10:06,000 Speaker 2: to take that type of relationship that we have with 166 00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:08,959 Speaker 2: others and turn it back on ourselves. I mean, imagine, 167 00:10:09,559 --> 00:10:14,880 Speaker 2: imagine the change that could happen, right right, Well, let's 168 00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:15,560 Speaker 2: talk a little bit. 169 00:10:15,559 --> 00:10:18,320 Speaker 3: You mentioned earlier the woman that said to you, well, 170 00:10:18,400 --> 00:10:21,400 Speaker 3: I just didn't think that I had any negative self talk. 171 00:10:21,600 --> 00:10:24,480 Speaker 3: So let's actually talk about maybe what is self talk 172 00:10:24,600 --> 00:10:27,000 Speaker 3: and how do you shift that? So maybe could you 173 00:10:27,040 --> 00:10:29,680 Speaker 3: give us some examples of things that you've heard or 174 00:10:29,720 --> 00:10:32,720 Speaker 3: that people may not be even recognizing within themselves, and 175 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:35,040 Speaker 3: then tell us some ways to start shifting it. 176 00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:39,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, So that's I love that question because I will 177 00:10:39,440 --> 00:10:42,720 Speaker 2: also say when I first started I mean, I thought 178 00:10:42,720 --> 00:10:46,120 Speaker 2: of the idea for want, which is my platform women 179 00:10:46,160 --> 00:10:48,520 Speaker 2: against negative talk. I thought of that back in two 180 00:10:48,520 --> 00:10:52,280 Speaker 2: thousand and seven initially, and even you know, there was 181 00:10:52,280 --> 00:10:54,200 Speaker 2: a little lag, there was a little break. I sort 182 00:10:54,240 --> 00:10:57,640 Speaker 2: of went into the onto the back burner of my 183 00:10:57,679 --> 00:10:59,160 Speaker 2: life for a while, and I brought it back in 184 00:10:59,200 --> 00:11:06,360 Speaker 2: twenty fifteen. Twenty fifteen, this phrase self talk was something 185 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:09,800 Speaker 2: that a lot of people weren't actually familiar with. So 186 00:11:10,480 --> 00:11:13,520 Speaker 2: I describe self talk as the story that we tell 187 00:11:13,520 --> 00:11:17,440 Speaker 2: ourselves twenty four to seven as we walk through the world, 188 00:11:17,880 --> 00:11:21,400 Speaker 2: And that's the story of who we believe ourselves to 189 00:11:21,480 --> 00:11:26,680 Speaker 2: be and how we sort of belong in the world 190 00:11:26,720 --> 00:11:30,600 Speaker 2: in general. So what that story does, it's it informs 191 00:11:30,640 --> 00:11:33,400 Speaker 2: what we do next and next and next and next. 192 00:11:33,880 --> 00:11:39,680 Speaker 2: So self talk could be everything from positive to negative 193 00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:44,040 Speaker 2: to completely neutral. A lot of people jump straight to 194 00:11:44,320 --> 00:11:48,200 Speaker 2: the positives or the negatives, but I think it's worthwhile 195 00:11:48,559 --> 00:11:53,560 Speaker 2: to recognize that our self talk story is going on 196 00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:57,400 Speaker 2: all of the time, and it could be objective, right. 197 00:11:57,480 --> 00:12:01,360 Speaker 2: It could be I think I am going to go 198 00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:05,840 Speaker 2: to the market right now, or I want to go outside, 199 00:12:06,040 --> 00:12:09,200 Speaker 2: Like we don't think of that as self talk, but 200 00:12:09,760 --> 00:12:13,880 Speaker 2: if those are the words that if you're a an 201 00:12:13,920 --> 00:12:16,840 Speaker 2: eternal monologue person like I am, because the words that 202 00:12:16,880 --> 00:12:20,240 Speaker 2: are in your brain or the visuals that you're having, 203 00:12:20,679 --> 00:12:23,720 Speaker 2: that's your self talk. But what we pay attention to 204 00:12:24,200 --> 00:12:28,520 Speaker 2: usually is the positive or negative self talk, particularly the 205 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:32,120 Speaker 2: negative self talk. So negative self talk is sort of 206 00:12:32,200 --> 00:12:35,160 Speaker 2: where I say, the self talk story takes a dark turn. 207 00:12:35,880 --> 00:12:40,520 Speaker 2: It's where the story is one that belittles us, demeans us, 208 00:12:40,679 --> 00:12:44,520 Speaker 2: makes us feel small, and keeps us in a reactive 209 00:12:44,520 --> 00:12:49,120 Speaker 2: state versus a proactive state. So everything from I'm not 210 00:12:49,240 --> 00:12:54,080 Speaker 2: good enough, smart enough, talented enough, not enough is a 211 00:12:54,080 --> 00:12:58,360 Speaker 2: big one that many people struggle with or you know, 212 00:12:58,440 --> 00:13:01,360 Speaker 2: taking an example, a very an example from my own life, 213 00:13:01,960 --> 00:13:06,120 Speaker 2: I did for my book launch here in New York City. 214 00:13:06,280 --> 00:13:12,680 Speaker 2: I did a cabaret and I sang, I performed. It 215 00:13:12,840 --> 00:13:16,600 Speaker 2: was so much fun. I have not performed like that 216 00:13:16,960 --> 00:13:21,040 Speaker 2: on a stage professionally for a very very long time. 217 00:13:21,720 --> 00:13:24,280 Speaker 2: And you know, I've been doing this work for a 218 00:13:24,280 --> 00:13:26,520 Speaker 2: really long time, so I was able to catch it 219 00:13:26,559 --> 00:13:29,080 Speaker 2: really quickly. But when I first thought of the idea 220 00:13:29,280 --> 00:13:32,280 Speaker 2: of maybe I want to do a book launch cabaret, 221 00:13:33,200 --> 00:13:37,679 Speaker 2: there was a thought that came in of, well, I 222 00:13:37,720 --> 00:13:42,000 Speaker 2: haven't sung on a stage in like almost fifteen years, Like, 223 00:13:43,880 --> 00:13:46,960 Speaker 2: am I allowed to do that? I'm I'm an author, 224 00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:49,640 Speaker 2: I'm a coach, I do all of these things. I'm 225 00:13:49,640 --> 00:13:52,760 Speaker 2: not a performer air quotes. And then I was able 226 00:13:52,760 --> 00:13:55,560 Speaker 2: to catch that and be like, Okay, cool, you're feeling 227 00:13:55,640 --> 00:14:01,160 Speaker 2: uncomfortable and you're also feeling you're feeling that excitement around it, 228 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:03,920 Speaker 2: and you don't really know how to reconcile the two, 229 00:14:03,960 --> 00:14:06,600 Speaker 2: and so that's what's coming up. Was able to recognize 230 00:14:06,600 --> 00:14:10,240 Speaker 2: that really fast because I've been doing this for a really, 231 00:14:10,280 --> 00:14:15,400 Speaker 2: really really long time. But there's stuff that comes up 232 00:14:15,480 --> 00:14:19,680 Speaker 2: like that every day for people that makes us believe 233 00:14:19,760 --> 00:14:23,680 Speaker 2: that we are ready or not ready, or good enough 234 00:14:23,760 --> 00:14:27,520 Speaker 2: or not good enough or whatever situation. It can be 235 00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:31,760 Speaker 2: as small as going, I don't know, walking down the 236 00:14:31,800 --> 00:14:37,280 Speaker 2: street and giving somebody a compliment and then being like, 237 00:14:37,560 --> 00:14:40,760 Speaker 2: in your head, oh, that was so weird. I made 238 00:14:40,800 --> 00:14:44,920 Speaker 2: that so awkward because you feel uncomfortable because maybe you 239 00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:49,040 Speaker 2: were in a newer, vulnerable situation. So self talk and 240 00:14:49,160 --> 00:14:52,560 Speaker 2: negative self talk, like you said at the very beginning, 241 00:14:52,600 --> 00:14:54,480 Speaker 2: I mean, you really hit the nail on the head. 242 00:14:54,600 --> 00:15:00,360 Speaker 2: It is. These are cobwebs that just are in the 243 00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:03,920 Speaker 2: backgrounds of our lives, and much like cop webs or 244 00:15:03,960 --> 00:15:09,080 Speaker 2: spider webs, sometimes you don't always see that they are there, right. 245 00:15:09,200 --> 00:15:12,160 Speaker 3: I was just thinking when you were talking about that 246 00:15:12,280 --> 00:15:14,920 Speaker 3: story of like even hitting running into the person on 247 00:15:14,960 --> 00:15:17,640 Speaker 3: the street. It's those things that we have in our head, right, 248 00:15:17,680 --> 00:15:20,440 Speaker 3: Like the thing that you believe about yourself and maybe 249 00:15:20,480 --> 00:15:23,200 Speaker 3: you're like, oh no, this isn't true, or like let's 250 00:15:23,200 --> 00:15:25,480 Speaker 3: say you're getting into a new relationship. You have a 251 00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:29,240 Speaker 3: narrative about relationships, so it's like you're happy, you're happy, 252 00:15:29,240 --> 00:15:31,920 Speaker 3: you're happy, and then that one thing happens, right, and 253 00:15:31,960 --> 00:15:34,480 Speaker 3: you're like, see, I knew you were just like every 254 00:15:34,480 --> 00:15:38,080 Speaker 3: other man. Like it's that stuff that's constantly going on. 255 00:15:38,200 --> 00:15:40,240 Speaker 3: I'm actually starting to recognize some of those things in 256 00:15:40,280 --> 00:15:43,160 Speaker 3: my life after a decade of therapy, you know, Like 257 00:15:43,200 --> 00:15:47,160 Speaker 3: it's like these things are so sneaky and subtle sometimes 258 00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:50,680 Speaker 3: that you just don't fully have the awareness. 259 00:15:50,880 --> 00:15:53,680 Speaker 2: But I love what the book talks about because. 260 00:15:53,400 --> 00:15:56,920 Speaker 3: You really dove into how much of this is really 261 00:15:56,960 --> 00:16:01,520 Speaker 3: connected to like our relationship with ourselves and the knowledge 262 00:16:01,520 --> 00:16:04,440 Speaker 3: of you know, the narratives going on, but also just 263 00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:08,560 Speaker 3: how much we like ourselves, know ourselves, and you describe 264 00:16:08,560 --> 00:16:11,160 Speaker 3: it as self like versus self love and kind of 265 00:16:11,160 --> 00:16:13,880 Speaker 3: talk about those differences. So there was one quote I 266 00:16:13,880 --> 00:16:15,680 Speaker 3: wanted to say. You say, what holds us back from 267 00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:18,520 Speaker 3: the idea of true self love is the idea that 268 00:16:18,520 --> 00:16:21,120 Speaker 3: we're supposed to love ourselves one hundred percent of the time, 269 00:16:21,160 --> 00:16:24,000 Speaker 3: because chances are that's not going to be the case. 270 00:16:24,800 --> 00:16:26,800 Speaker 3: And I want to really just talk about what are 271 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:31,200 Speaker 3: the differences and then how do we learn to have 272 00:16:31,240 --> 00:16:34,600 Speaker 3: this kind of unconditional love that maybe we offer other people, 273 00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:37,800 Speaker 3: but we really seem to struggle as humans to offer ourselves. 274 00:16:38,880 --> 00:16:43,520 Speaker 2: Yeah. I love talking about the difference between self like 275 00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:48,280 Speaker 2: and self love because you know, we are told many 276 00:16:48,320 --> 00:16:52,120 Speaker 2: times that we've we've just got to love ourselves for 277 00:16:52,240 --> 00:16:56,720 Speaker 2: exactly who we are. But that's really really hard when 278 00:16:56,760 --> 00:17:03,000 Speaker 2: we haven't been taught that it is okay to both 279 00:17:03,240 --> 00:17:09,080 Speaker 2: love yourself and not like parts of you know, parts 280 00:17:09,080 --> 00:17:13,200 Speaker 2: of yourself, parts of how you're showing up. We conflate 281 00:17:13,240 --> 00:17:15,600 Speaker 2: the two and we think, well, if I don't like 282 00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:18,520 Speaker 2: how I'm acting or how I'm feeling right now, I 283 00:17:18,520 --> 00:17:21,919 Speaker 2: don't like parts of my body whatever it is that 284 00:17:22,000 --> 00:17:25,719 Speaker 2: must mean that I don't love myself. But I always 285 00:17:25,720 --> 00:17:31,000 Speaker 2: suggest to people to think of someone or some entity. 286 00:17:31,520 --> 00:17:37,199 Speaker 2: I always think of my dog, Frankie. Think of someone 287 00:17:37,240 --> 00:17:40,359 Speaker 2: in your life who you would say, oh, yeah, I 288 00:17:41,200 --> 00:17:45,640 Speaker 2: love them unconditionally, and then you think about it and 289 00:17:45,720 --> 00:17:50,679 Speaker 2: you think, okay, well, do I always like how they're acting? 290 00:17:51,240 --> 00:17:56,639 Speaker 2: Do I always agree with their choices? Am I never 291 00:17:56,760 --> 00:18:00,720 Speaker 2: once annoyed with them? I mean, if we're too. It 292 00:18:00,840 --> 00:18:03,960 Speaker 2: sounds maybe like a silly example, but it's actually I think, 293 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:08,600 Speaker 2: especially if you're a person who has a dog or cat, 294 00:18:08,920 --> 00:18:11,400 Speaker 2: that you have that unconditional love for it, it actually 295 00:18:11,560 --> 00:18:16,040 Speaker 2: actually can make this this even more clear that yeah, 296 00:18:16,080 --> 00:18:20,760 Speaker 2: sometimes my dog's barking annoys me. Sometimes I don't like 297 00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:26,400 Speaker 2: that she doing that. I love her so unconditionally, And 298 00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:33,080 Speaker 2: why aren't we using that unconditional love lens on ourselves 299 00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:39,359 Speaker 2: as well? Because we are also in a relationship with ourself. 300 00:18:40,080 --> 00:18:44,119 Speaker 2: And so if you think about how you build unconditional 301 00:18:44,200 --> 00:18:49,800 Speaker 2: love with someone, you don't just say, you know, okay, 302 00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:54,200 Speaker 2: I met you and I love you unconditionally. I think 303 00:18:54,320 --> 00:18:57,320 Speaker 2: that the times where I have heard that happen, it's, 304 00:18:57,359 --> 00:18:59,600 Speaker 2: you know, in a situation where it's a parent with 305 00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:04,440 Speaker 2: their with their childs. But let's say that you have 306 00:19:05,760 --> 00:19:10,959 Speaker 2: someone that you are dating, right, you are going to 307 00:19:11,480 --> 00:19:15,960 Speaker 2: go through a process with them of learning who they 308 00:19:15,960 --> 00:19:21,080 Speaker 2: are and getting curious and figuring out like what makes 309 00:19:21,119 --> 00:19:23,680 Speaker 2: them tick, And then you're going to start to develop 310 00:19:23,880 --> 00:19:27,840 Speaker 2: that connection with that person. And then you're going to 311 00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:32,440 Speaker 2: start to develop that respect and that trust throughout time, 312 00:19:33,320 --> 00:19:36,080 Speaker 2: and all of the sudden, one day you're like, Wow, 313 00:19:36,320 --> 00:19:41,320 Speaker 2: I love this person unconditionally. So it does take time. 314 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:45,639 Speaker 2: And if you're taking that same framework and turning it 315 00:19:45,680 --> 00:19:51,000 Speaker 2: back onto yourself, really hard to love yourself unconditionally if 316 00:19:51,000 --> 00:19:55,040 Speaker 2: you haven't spent time getting to know who you are 317 00:19:55,240 --> 00:20:00,439 Speaker 2: and finding yourself underneath all of the cobwebs to begin with. 318 00:20:00,720 --> 00:20:04,919 Speaker 2: So it's why I believe that that's what's the beginning 319 00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:09,879 Speaker 2: of the book. I really wanted to give people. I 320 00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:12,399 Speaker 2: give them a framework of First, I tell them like, 321 00:20:13,160 --> 00:20:16,040 Speaker 2: here's why you need a sense of self, and then 322 00:20:16,080 --> 00:20:18,640 Speaker 2: the book takes you through this roadmap of finding yourself, 323 00:20:18,720 --> 00:20:24,359 Speaker 2: being yourself, staying yourself, and wanting yourself, and that finding 324 00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:27,240 Speaker 2: your self part. A lot of people think that it's 325 00:20:27,280 --> 00:20:31,639 Speaker 2: a search out there, but it's actually a dig in here, 326 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:34,600 Speaker 2: and I believe that I actually talk about that part 327 00:20:34,640 --> 00:20:37,480 Speaker 2: in the same breath that I talk about self love 328 00:20:37,560 --> 00:20:41,480 Speaker 2: and self like in the book. Yeah, because that's that 329 00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:46,720 Speaker 2: is the base of the majority of the unpetitional love 330 00:20:46,760 --> 00:20:47,800 Speaker 2: in our lives. 331 00:20:50,440 --> 00:20:52,480 Speaker 3: Well, you did the perfect transition for me because I 332 00:20:52,480 --> 00:20:55,320 Speaker 3: wanted to move to this for pillars that you talk 333 00:20:55,359 --> 00:20:58,440 Speaker 3: about the four steps of self, will you explain a 334 00:20:58,480 --> 00:21:00,320 Speaker 3: little more about each one? I know you did just 335 00:21:00,400 --> 00:21:02,280 Speaker 3: kind of dive into the finding. 336 00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:04,040 Speaker 2: What does that look like? Though? 337 00:21:04,280 --> 00:21:08,080 Speaker 3: Like I always love to give the listeners tangible tips 338 00:21:08,119 --> 00:21:12,320 Speaker 3: and it's like, okay, finding yourself that sounds overwhelming to me, 339 00:21:12,520 --> 00:21:13,959 Speaker 3: Like that seems like you need to go on and 340 00:21:13,960 --> 00:21:17,080 Speaker 3: eat prey love journey. You need to like be able 341 00:21:17,119 --> 00:21:19,760 Speaker 3: to you know, have that kind of experience in Aha, 342 00:21:20,119 --> 00:21:21,560 Speaker 3: there I am, But what. 343 00:21:21,480 --> 00:21:22,879 Speaker 2: Does it actually look like? 344 00:21:23,720 --> 00:21:23,920 Speaker 1: Right? 345 00:21:24,119 --> 00:21:27,399 Speaker 2: It's sort of like when people say just like be 346 00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:34,600 Speaker 2: true to yourself, know yourself, yeah, and it's like, oh, okay, sure, 347 00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:37,280 Speaker 2: And then you know, it's such a simple phrase that 348 00:21:37,480 --> 00:21:40,320 Speaker 2: again we think that there's something wrong with us that 349 00:21:40,359 --> 00:21:44,720 Speaker 2: we can't just know ourselves, our love ourselves. And when 350 00:21:44,760 --> 00:21:49,880 Speaker 2: I think of finding yourself, it is really about developing 351 00:21:50,080 --> 00:21:55,000 Speaker 2: first that base of trust and truth to begin with, 352 00:21:56,480 --> 00:22:00,320 Speaker 2: and being able to learn how what it means for 353 00:22:00,400 --> 00:22:05,080 Speaker 2: you to stay with an integrity within yourself, so also 354 00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:08,960 Speaker 2: figuring out what is yours and what did you sort 355 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:12,760 Speaker 2: of pick up along the way. So I talk about 356 00:22:12,760 --> 00:22:16,760 Speaker 2: this a little bit earlier in the book, but there 357 00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:20,160 Speaker 2: is a concept that the phrase was actually created by 358 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:24,040 Speaker 2: a performance coach named Judy Wilkins Smith called emotional DNA, 359 00:22:24,520 --> 00:22:29,639 Speaker 2: And it's basically the blueprint that is within us that 360 00:22:30,520 --> 00:22:34,040 Speaker 2: you know, informs the way that we think and act 361 00:22:34,240 --> 00:22:37,800 Speaker 2: and interact. And the thing about emotional DNA is that 362 00:22:38,280 --> 00:22:40,520 Speaker 2: we don't just pick it up from the people who 363 00:22:40,560 --> 00:22:43,399 Speaker 2: have come before us, right like, we're getting that and 364 00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:47,680 Speaker 2: building those DNA strands all around us in this moment 365 00:22:47,760 --> 00:22:50,439 Speaker 2: and doing the same for other people as well. And 366 00:22:50,520 --> 00:22:53,840 Speaker 2: so a lot of times people can say, Okay, I 367 00:22:53,840 --> 00:22:58,560 Speaker 2: want to shift myself talk, but I don't know where 368 00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:02,560 Speaker 2: to start. And I always tell people to start with 369 00:23:03,840 --> 00:23:06,720 Speaker 2: start with their self talk origin story, if there's a 370 00:23:06,720 --> 00:23:11,440 Speaker 2: a certain belief or phrase, if you will, that they 371 00:23:11,520 --> 00:23:15,679 Speaker 2: want to shift. Getting curious as to when did I 372 00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:18,760 Speaker 2: first notice this popping up in my life? Was this 373 00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:22,080 Speaker 2: because somebody else said this to me, was this because 374 00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:26,679 Speaker 2: I was trying to fit into a situation and not 375 00:23:26,840 --> 00:23:29,000 Speaker 2: judging it and not trying to shift it right away, 376 00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:34,639 Speaker 2: but just getting curious where it freaking came from, where 377 00:23:34,680 --> 00:23:38,000 Speaker 2: it began. And then after that then you can start 378 00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:43,880 Speaker 2: to get curious around the sort of deeper meaning behind 379 00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:48,600 Speaker 2: your self talk. So, okay, well, if I am let's 380 00:23:48,640 --> 00:23:54,160 Speaker 2: take a complaint for example, if I am complaining about something, 381 00:23:54,920 --> 00:23:59,480 Speaker 2: do I actually like the reality of solving this problem, 382 00:23:59,560 --> 00:24:03,960 Speaker 2: reality the shift, or do I just like the feeling 383 00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:07,480 Speaker 2: that I'm constantly figuring it out so to speak. When 384 00:24:07,480 --> 00:24:09,520 Speaker 2: you're not, you're keeping yourself in the loop. And that's 385 00:24:09,560 --> 00:24:13,520 Speaker 2: all really good information to figure out. Okay, well, how 386 00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:17,560 Speaker 2: do I function? How do I interact with the world, 387 00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:21,520 Speaker 2: how do we interact with myself? And then after that 388 00:24:21,880 --> 00:24:28,000 Speaker 2: it's really about figuring out what your version of things 389 00:24:28,080 --> 00:24:30,959 Speaker 2: that we sort of take for granted and don't I'm 390 00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:33,520 Speaker 2: going to use the phrase again, don't double click into 391 00:24:34,359 --> 00:24:40,680 Speaker 2: like positivity, Like what does real deal positivity mean to you? 392 00:24:41,359 --> 00:24:45,959 Speaker 2: And that's really important because if you are looking to 393 00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:50,359 Speaker 2: find yourself so to speak, can be really tempting to 394 00:24:50,520 --> 00:24:55,720 Speaker 2: put on let's just call it a confidence costume and 395 00:24:56,320 --> 00:25:00,760 Speaker 2: put on someone else's version of positivity. So it's about 396 00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:06,200 Speaker 2: redefining these phrases and these concepts like self love to 397 00:25:07,200 --> 00:25:09,719 Speaker 2: really make them work for us. And so it's not 398 00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:12,000 Speaker 2: so much about Okay, well what do they say or 399 00:25:12,040 --> 00:25:16,040 Speaker 2: what do they think? It's well what do I think? 400 00:25:16,600 --> 00:25:20,639 Speaker 2: And some people have never done that before and never 401 00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,760 Speaker 2: really been able to get to that place where they 402 00:25:24,000 --> 00:25:30,520 Speaker 2: can figure out, like where do I actually want to 403 00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:33,320 Speaker 2: go and what do I want to bring with me 404 00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:36,560 Speaker 2: as I go there? Because so often we want to 405 00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:40,320 Speaker 2: skip to the very last part, the want yourself part 406 00:25:40,440 --> 00:25:44,320 Speaker 2: of the equation. But you can't want yourself if you 407 00:25:44,359 --> 00:25:48,600 Speaker 2: don't know who that self is that you've brought along 408 00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:49,879 Speaker 2: the way. Does that make sense? 409 00:25:50,119 --> 00:25:53,280 Speaker 3: It makes total sense. And it's such a bigger conversation. 410 00:25:53,400 --> 00:25:55,200 Speaker 3: When as you were talking, I was just thinking, this 411 00:25:55,240 --> 00:25:59,440 Speaker 3: ties into everything because we create such a constructor. I 412 00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:02,560 Speaker 3: believe this at least in this world that you know, 413 00:26:02,600 --> 00:26:04,439 Speaker 3: you kind of have to fit in a certain box 414 00:26:04,480 --> 00:26:07,679 Speaker 3: and success looks a certain way or happiness looks a 415 00:26:07,720 --> 00:26:10,639 Speaker 3: certain way. And on this journey of life, the older 416 00:26:10,680 --> 00:26:13,520 Speaker 3: I get, the more I'm I guess getting to know 417 00:26:13,640 --> 00:26:17,160 Speaker 3: myself and realizing all of the things I was trying 418 00:26:17,200 --> 00:26:19,760 Speaker 3: on in my twenties and in my thirties. There were 419 00:26:19,800 --> 00:26:24,200 Speaker 3: all things that I thought other people would deem successful 420 00:26:24,480 --> 00:26:27,280 Speaker 3: or happy or positive or any of the things, you know, 421 00:26:27,359 --> 00:26:30,679 Speaker 3: like you just explained. And it's just interesting because I 422 00:26:30,680 --> 00:26:34,639 Speaker 3: think a lot of this accepting yourself, finding yourself, being 423 00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:38,480 Speaker 3: yourself comes with like getting to know yourself, but also, 424 00:26:38,640 --> 00:26:41,720 Speaker 3: like you're saying, laying down all these other narratives we've 425 00:26:41,760 --> 00:26:45,320 Speaker 3: picked up along the way and saying what is mine? 426 00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:48,639 Speaker 3: What is someone else's? And where do I want to 427 00:26:48,720 --> 00:26:53,560 Speaker 3: go with this, like truly honestly authentically as myself? 428 00:26:54,000 --> 00:26:54,399 Speaker 2: Which is it? 429 00:26:54,560 --> 00:26:57,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's not necessarily something I think we can just be, 430 00:26:57,800 --> 00:27:00,040 Speaker 3: you know, when we're fifteen, be like here, I I 431 00:27:00,119 --> 00:27:02,240 Speaker 3: am world, you know, because you don't have the life 432 00:27:02,280 --> 00:27:04,840 Speaker 3: experience yet, Like it does kind of just seem like 433 00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:07,640 Speaker 3: one of those things that might come with some time 434 00:27:07,680 --> 00:27:08,840 Speaker 3: and awareness. 435 00:27:09,200 --> 00:27:11,879 Speaker 2: Yeah, And it's I love that you brought that up 436 00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:15,000 Speaker 2: because people always ask me about, you know, how can 437 00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:19,400 Speaker 2: we start to talk to kids and teens about this stuff? 438 00:27:19,600 --> 00:27:25,320 Speaker 2: And you know, it's it's really it's difficult work to do, 439 00:27:25,640 --> 00:27:29,440 Speaker 2: but at the end of the day, it's actually way 440 00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:32,960 Speaker 2: easier than we give it credit for. The toughest part 441 00:27:33,240 --> 00:27:38,880 Speaker 2: oftentimes is number one. Many times, we haven't made any 442 00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:41,520 Speaker 2: of this work habit, so it doesn't feel habitual. So 443 00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:43,920 Speaker 2: it feels new, and it feels scary, and it feels 444 00:27:43,960 --> 00:27:45,960 Speaker 2: a little bit uncomfortable because we haven't been in the 445 00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:51,679 Speaker 2: habit of it. And then there's also again the feelings 446 00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:56,919 Speaker 2: that we sometimes have been taught that we need or 447 00:27:57,000 --> 00:28:02,359 Speaker 2: should need to feel around the uncomfortable stuff. And so yeah, 448 00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:05,719 Speaker 2: it just becomes like this this big mess. And I 449 00:28:05,760 --> 00:28:10,720 Speaker 2: think that there's a way to have these conversations with 450 00:28:11,040 --> 00:28:16,159 Speaker 2: kids and with teens where it's actually it's actually really 451 00:28:16,920 --> 00:28:20,200 Speaker 2: meaningful and can be really impactful because even though they're 452 00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:25,320 Speaker 2: going through different things than you know, full grown adults are, 453 00:28:25,600 --> 00:28:28,000 Speaker 2: and yes their brains are still forming, and yes they 454 00:28:28,000 --> 00:28:31,720 Speaker 2: have different life experiences in that point, and maybe not 455 00:28:31,880 --> 00:28:36,159 Speaker 2: as many life experiences, there is still you know, so 456 00:28:36,240 --> 00:28:39,360 Speaker 2: many people when they think of their self talk origin stories. 457 00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:43,280 Speaker 2: They begin in childhood, they begin in teendom. And so 458 00:28:44,120 --> 00:28:49,400 Speaker 2: even even practicing with the kids and the young people 459 00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:54,200 Speaker 2: in your life, asking like genuinely asking, not a rhetorical 460 00:28:54,320 --> 00:28:58,520 Speaker 2: question asking oh, well, where where did you Where did 461 00:28:58,560 --> 00:29:00,680 Speaker 2: you hear that from? Or when did you start to 462 00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:05,560 Speaker 2: believe that? Or oh you said that you aren't good 463 00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:08,320 Speaker 2: enough for this or that they don't like you? What 464 00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:12,400 Speaker 2: made you feel that way? That is the beginning of 465 00:29:12,520 --> 00:29:16,280 Speaker 2: starting to practice the habit. And I think so often 466 00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:19,640 Speaker 2: we want to jump to the solving everything. But if 467 00:29:19,640 --> 00:29:23,160 Speaker 2: we can view the work of shifting our self talk 468 00:29:23,960 --> 00:29:29,360 Speaker 2: less as a stop and start and more of a 469 00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:33,760 Speaker 2: shift that happens over time with habits, and those habits 470 00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:38,000 Speaker 2: getting stronger and like I said, more habitual, then we 471 00:29:38,200 --> 00:29:41,959 Speaker 2: end up setting ourselves up for long term success. Like 472 00:29:42,600 --> 00:29:45,120 Speaker 2: I mean, I am a baby of the eighties and 473 00:29:45,240 --> 00:29:48,200 Speaker 2: child of the nineties, and this was not the conversation 474 00:29:48,360 --> 00:29:52,040 Speaker 2: that was happening back then. But can you imagine, you know, 475 00:29:52,080 --> 00:29:55,520 Speaker 2: if in the eighties and nineties, if we had these 476 00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:59,320 Speaker 2: types of conversations that were actually pragmatic and not just 477 00:29:59,440 --> 00:30:02,840 Speaker 2: pie in this guy right in our lives you know, right? 478 00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:06,960 Speaker 3: Well, yeah, because I do think as you were saying that, 479 00:30:07,000 --> 00:30:09,280 Speaker 3: I'm thinking, okay, yeah, if I had been taught that's 480 00:30:09,320 --> 00:30:12,440 Speaker 3: maybe some of those narratives weren't real because in my brain. 481 00:30:12,640 --> 00:30:15,040 Speaker 3: The things I've realized about the negative self talk or 482 00:30:15,080 --> 00:30:18,080 Speaker 3: the narratives, it just appears to be fact to me, 483 00:30:18,760 --> 00:30:20,960 Speaker 3: do you know what I mean? Like, it's like this 484 00:30:21,080 --> 00:30:23,720 Speaker 3: thing that I'm saying, I think that that is just 485 00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:26,320 Speaker 3: the fact, that's the truth. But if someone was to 486 00:30:26,360 --> 00:30:28,480 Speaker 3: ask me, well, where did that come from? And I 487 00:30:28,560 --> 00:30:30,440 Speaker 3: go back and trace it, it's like, no, that was 488 00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:32,920 Speaker 3: a negative experience when I hadn't know the eleven that 489 00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:36,920 Speaker 3: made me start believing that about myself or whatever it was. 490 00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 3: And so it would be an interesting thing to start 491 00:30:39,600 --> 00:30:42,600 Speaker 3: teaching kids to kind of be conscious of what they're 492 00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:45,360 Speaker 3: picking up as fact or is that actually true? Where 493 00:30:45,400 --> 00:30:48,240 Speaker 3: does that come from? So that you can kind of pinpoint, 494 00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:51,360 Speaker 3: like you're saying, the origin. And I do think that 495 00:30:51,360 --> 00:30:53,920 Speaker 3: that would help maybe shift some of the narratives as 496 00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:56,720 Speaker 3: you go through life and have your life experiences and 497 00:30:56,760 --> 00:30:59,960 Speaker 3: grow and evolve. And you've kind of touched on the optimism, 498 00:31:00,800 --> 00:31:03,400 Speaker 3: which in the book you call dead end optimism, but 499 00:31:03,560 --> 00:31:07,120 Speaker 3: you also mentioned casual negativity. So can you talk about 500 00:31:07,120 --> 00:31:09,800 Speaker 3: what both of those mean and how those things can 501 00:31:09,800 --> 00:31:10,480 Speaker 3: hold us back. 502 00:31:11,600 --> 00:31:14,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, So a lot of times we when I talk 503 00:31:14,880 --> 00:31:18,400 Speaker 2: about dead end optimism, it's sort of a let's just 504 00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:22,320 Speaker 2: it's called a cousin of toxic positivity. Okay. Dead End 505 00:31:22,320 --> 00:31:29,360 Speaker 2: optimism is to be very blunt with this metaphor, like 506 00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:32,959 Speaker 2: it is optimism that is going nowhere. Yeah, like it 507 00:31:33,040 --> 00:31:36,040 Speaker 2: hits a dead end, but there's nowhere where it to go, 508 00:31:36,200 --> 00:31:38,040 Speaker 2: so it just keeps. So, you know, I tell a 509 00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:42,719 Speaker 2: story about carousels and so, and I love carousels, and 510 00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:46,800 Speaker 2: it's very easy to just stay on and keep on going. 511 00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:50,960 Speaker 2: And the thing that happens is eventually, if you just 512 00:31:51,080 --> 00:31:54,400 Speaker 2: keep on going around on that carousel, carousel's going to 513 00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:58,400 Speaker 2: break down. You're going to get really dizzy and disoriented, 514 00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:02,120 Speaker 2: or people are going to be like, oh, well, that's 515 00:32:02,760 --> 00:32:05,160 Speaker 2: what is that person doing, you know, like it's going 516 00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:08,600 Speaker 2: to feel like fake and contrived that Oh I'm I'm 517 00:32:08,640 --> 00:32:11,440 Speaker 2: just staying on these sort of plaster ponies that are 518 00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:14,800 Speaker 2: going nowhere. And that's the way that I view dead 519 00:32:14,880 --> 00:32:20,560 Speaker 2: end optimism, where it's not necessarily in the same exactly 520 00:32:20,560 --> 00:32:24,840 Speaker 2: the same as toxic positivity, where toxic positivity will be 521 00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:30,320 Speaker 2: just love and light over a negative situation. That is 522 00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:33,800 Speaker 2: a form of dead end optimism. But I think the 523 00:32:33,840 --> 00:32:39,720 Speaker 2: dead end optimism is a little more similar to casual negativity, 524 00:32:39,760 --> 00:32:42,440 Speaker 2: which we'll talk about in a second, which it's the 525 00:32:42,520 --> 00:32:46,360 Speaker 2: stuff that we don't even realize that we are doing, 526 00:32:47,000 --> 00:32:50,520 Speaker 2: to that we think that we're doing with the goal 527 00:32:50,800 --> 00:33:00,320 Speaker 2: of keeping ourselves happy, positive, and that can be as 528 00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:03,200 Speaker 2: simple as people ask how you're doing, and do you 529 00:33:03,200 --> 00:33:08,200 Speaker 2: always say I'm great, great, great, And it can be 530 00:33:08,240 --> 00:33:11,320 Speaker 2: more of like the toxic positivity, where you're talking to 531 00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:15,080 Speaker 2: other people and you're saying everything happens for a reason, 532 00:33:15,200 --> 00:33:19,560 Speaker 2: which you know it's if I never heard that phrase again. 533 00:33:19,600 --> 00:33:22,640 Speaker 2: I think there are so many other wonderful phrases that 534 00:33:22,680 --> 00:33:26,600 Speaker 2: we can use, and it really it can get us 535 00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:31,320 Speaker 2: in this loop of feeling like we need to be 536 00:33:31,600 --> 00:33:37,520 Speaker 2: searching for happiness all the time, but happiness is pleading, 537 00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:45,000 Speaker 2: happiness is oftentimes circumstantial. You mentioned casual negativity. It's the 538 00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:49,560 Speaker 2: flip side of dead end optimism. Casual negativity is the 539 00:33:50,040 --> 00:33:54,440 Speaker 2: negative talk and particularly self talk that we use that 540 00:33:54,880 --> 00:34:01,760 Speaker 2: is as automatic and as emotionless as we say the 541 00:34:01,800 --> 00:34:05,680 Speaker 2: sky is blue. So with dead end optimism, maybe someone 542 00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:08,719 Speaker 2: is asking how you're doing, and you're really not doing fantastic, 543 00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:12,799 Speaker 2: but you're like, I'm great, right, and that's just you know, 544 00:34:12,840 --> 00:34:19,279 Speaker 2: your your default reaction. Casual negativity is saying like, ugh, 545 00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:22,680 Speaker 2: I hate my body, or oh that was that was 546 00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:29,880 Speaker 2: so that was so silly of me, without any emotion attached. 547 00:34:30,080 --> 00:34:34,440 Speaker 2: This often comes up. I notice it with people in 548 00:34:36,560 --> 00:34:42,879 Speaker 2: with self deprecation. And sometimes many times self deprecation can 549 00:34:42,920 --> 00:34:45,720 Speaker 2: come from a real place, but a lot of times 550 00:34:45,920 --> 00:34:49,240 Speaker 2: it can come from just a desire to connect with people. 551 00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:52,879 Speaker 2: And that is a form of casual negativity that if 552 00:34:52,880 --> 00:34:55,640 Speaker 2: we're going back to earlier in the conversation we're talking 553 00:34:55,640 --> 00:34:57,520 Speaker 2: about the people who say, oh, I thought that I 554 00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:01,879 Speaker 2: should be over this right now. I think of self 555 00:35:01,920 --> 00:35:04,600 Speaker 2: talk like a language that we are teaching ourselves all 556 00:35:04,719 --> 00:35:11,080 Speaker 2: the time. And so if in the emotionless moments, that's 557 00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:15,239 Speaker 2: the language that we're using that oh I hate this, 558 00:35:15,520 --> 00:35:19,399 Speaker 2: or this is bad, or I'm so this whatever, then 559 00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:23,560 Speaker 2: how can we ever ever imagine to shift it in 560 00:35:23,600 --> 00:35:27,080 Speaker 2: those times when we really do not feel good or 561 00:35:27,160 --> 00:35:31,279 Speaker 2: we really don't believe in ourselves. If we're practicing it 562 00:35:31,360 --> 00:35:35,680 Speaker 2: in the easy moments, then that's what we're gonna go 563 00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:38,840 Speaker 2: back to, not necessarily because we believe it, but because 564 00:35:39,400 --> 00:35:42,480 Speaker 2: it's easy. It's what we're fluent in. It's what we've 565 00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:43,280 Speaker 2: already been speaking. 566 00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:46,080 Speaker 3: That makes so much sense to me, and I think 567 00:35:46,120 --> 00:35:48,879 Speaker 3: it's so rap but then negative more to me than 568 00:35:49,040 --> 00:35:50,680 Speaker 3: I mean, I'm sure that that positive I do. I'm 569 00:35:50,760 --> 00:35:52,600 Speaker 3: not even thinking of examples, but you're right, it's like, 570 00:35:52,640 --> 00:35:55,640 Speaker 3: I'm great, I'm this. It's like even when you're having 571 00:35:55,640 --> 00:35:57,319 Speaker 3: a really hard day, and not that you should dump 572 00:35:57,320 --> 00:35:59,560 Speaker 3: all your stuff on a stranger, but like, but you 573 00:35:59,560 --> 00:36:00,960 Speaker 3: care your answers. 574 00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:04,200 Speaker 2: I always say mine. If people are like, okay, Katie, 575 00:36:04,200 --> 00:36:06,640 Speaker 2: like that's great, but what do you say? People are like, 576 00:36:06,800 --> 00:36:11,919 Speaker 2: how are you doing? I'm like I'm doing. Yeah, that's 577 00:36:11,960 --> 00:36:14,160 Speaker 2: a good one. Yeah yeah. And it sort of like 578 00:36:14,200 --> 00:36:17,319 Speaker 2: makes people giggle because that's not an answer that many 579 00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:20,040 Speaker 2: people give. So I gift that to your listeners right now. 580 00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:26,320 Speaker 2: And it's also allowing me within myself to stay congruent 581 00:36:26,400 --> 00:36:28,560 Speaker 2: and to stay I mean, it sounds like it's a 582 00:36:28,600 --> 00:36:31,680 Speaker 2: small example, but that's an example of staying with an 583 00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:35,960 Speaker 2: integrity in myself because I've got my own back and 584 00:36:36,000 --> 00:36:39,960 Speaker 2: I'm not lying to myself, you know, back to that study, 585 00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:44,320 Speaker 2: I am not saying I'm great and then walking away 586 00:36:44,440 --> 00:36:49,720 Speaker 2: and saying, oh well, now I feel really bad because 587 00:36:49,719 --> 00:36:52,520 Speaker 2: I'm not great. I know that I'm not great, just 588 00:36:53,640 --> 00:36:55,879 Speaker 2: if you don't want to get into it, or if 589 00:36:55,880 --> 00:36:58,800 Speaker 2: it's not the place or time or whatever, an answer 590 00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:02,040 Speaker 2: to how are you doing saying I'm doing or you know, 591 00:37:02,200 --> 00:37:05,920 Speaker 2: it's it's a lot right now or something like that. 592 00:37:07,160 --> 00:37:09,239 Speaker 2: It can be as simple as that. But I think 593 00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:14,680 Speaker 2: that it's so important for us to give ourselves the 594 00:37:14,840 --> 00:37:19,160 Speaker 2: grace and space to meet ourselves exactly where we are 595 00:37:19,520 --> 00:37:23,480 Speaker 2: over and over because what then also ends up happening 596 00:37:23,520 --> 00:37:26,640 Speaker 2: If we're going back to the language metaphor, like we 597 00:37:26,760 --> 00:37:29,320 Speaker 2: learn a language not just by practicing in our heads, 598 00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:34,640 Speaker 2: but by practicing with other people, And when we practice 599 00:37:34,680 --> 00:37:39,600 Speaker 2: that language with other people, then they also get to 600 00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:42,880 Speaker 2: practice the language. So then just becomes this ripple effect. 601 00:37:43,040 --> 00:37:46,480 Speaker 2: If you are giving yourself permission to meet yourself where 602 00:37:46,520 --> 00:37:49,960 Speaker 2: you're at, that might give someone else permission to meet 603 00:37:50,120 --> 00:37:55,280 Speaker 2: themselves where they're at, Like you have no idea how 604 00:37:55,719 --> 00:37:58,920 Speaker 2: you are rickicheting off of all of the people in 605 00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:02,560 Speaker 2: your life every single day, and that I view it 606 00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:06,960 Speaker 2: as something that is really amazing and incredible, and it 607 00:38:06,960 --> 00:38:10,359 Speaker 2: could go in multiple directions, but I believe that there 608 00:38:10,400 --> 00:38:15,920 Speaker 2: is so much beauty and real change that can be 609 00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:21,080 Speaker 2: made on a personal and more mapro level if just 610 00:38:21,200 --> 00:38:22,240 Speaker 2: more people did. 611 00:38:22,080 --> 00:38:28,560 Speaker 3: That, I do feel like the more honest I am 612 00:38:28,640 --> 00:38:31,239 Speaker 3: with others, it's interesting to see the honesty I get 613 00:38:31,280 --> 00:38:33,600 Speaker 3: back because I think it's once we set that, like 614 00:38:33,640 --> 00:38:36,400 Speaker 3: you're saying, we set that foundation up, it kind of 615 00:38:36,440 --> 00:38:38,439 Speaker 3: gives people a safety and that like, oh okay, cool, 616 00:38:38,480 --> 00:38:41,400 Speaker 3: we're doing this, like we're not just like gonna fuzz 617 00:38:41,440 --> 00:38:43,680 Speaker 3: through this. The other thing I wanted to point out, 618 00:38:43,719 --> 00:38:45,359 Speaker 3: and I've always heard this, and I wish I had 619 00:38:45,360 --> 00:38:49,960 Speaker 3: the study to reference, but that our body recognizes a 620 00:38:50,120 --> 00:38:53,480 Speaker 3: joke or a serious statement as the same thing. So like, 621 00:38:53,520 --> 00:38:55,399 Speaker 3: if you know, one of my things, and I think 622 00:38:55,400 --> 00:38:57,840 Speaker 3: a lot of women probably struggle with this is the 623 00:38:57,880 --> 00:39:00,960 Speaker 3: way I talk about my body like I feel fat today, 624 00:39:01,000 --> 00:39:03,439 Speaker 3: or oh I feel bloated, or you know, like these 625 00:39:03,480 --> 00:39:05,880 Speaker 3: pants look terrible or blah blah blah whatever it is 626 00:39:05,920 --> 00:39:09,359 Speaker 3: that day. But I know I've really tried to start 627 00:39:09,480 --> 00:39:13,000 Speaker 3: changing that because my body's amazing, like the things that 628 00:39:13,040 --> 00:39:14,880 Speaker 3: it does, and you know, even if I feel like 629 00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:17,120 Speaker 3: I'm in my best shape or my worst shape, it's 630 00:39:17,120 --> 00:39:21,520 Speaker 3: still functioning every day in a way that is truly miraculous. 631 00:39:21,560 --> 00:39:23,520 Speaker 3: Like the fact that our bodies do all the things 632 00:39:23,520 --> 00:39:27,080 Speaker 3: that they do is insane, you know, And so really 633 00:39:27,160 --> 00:39:31,879 Speaker 3: just trying to shift small things like that because over 634 00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:34,360 Speaker 3: over time, like you don't realize, like you're cutting yourself 635 00:39:34,400 --> 00:39:37,880 Speaker 3: down constantly, even if it's a quote unquote joke or 636 00:39:37,880 --> 00:39:40,719 Speaker 3: if you're playing into the joke, like, oh, I'm just crazy. 637 00:39:41,040 --> 00:39:43,600 Speaker 3: That's another big one I hear with women is like, oh, 638 00:39:43,640 --> 00:39:46,040 Speaker 3: she's crazy or whatever, and it's like, no, she's not. 639 00:39:46,360 --> 00:39:48,759 Speaker 3: She's having a reaction or a feeling or something, And 640 00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:49,840 Speaker 3: I just don't like that word. 641 00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:53,239 Speaker 2: Yeah. Well, and there's so much historical I mean, that's 642 00:39:53,280 --> 00:39:55,160 Speaker 2: like a whole other podcast, but there's so much like 643 00:39:55,320 --> 00:40:00,000 Speaker 2: historical context around that, right it's a hysterical woman. Yeah, 644 00:40:00,160 --> 00:40:05,680 Speaker 2: And and you know, women like being put into hospitals and 645 00:40:05,680 --> 00:40:12,840 Speaker 2: being institutionalized, for getting their periods, for having feelings, for 646 00:40:12,960 --> 00:40:17,960 Speaker 2: being honest. I mean, there is so much that if 647 00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:23,040 Speaker 2: we really really were to zoom the lens out, we'd 648 00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:25,960 Speaker 2: be like, oh, of course, so many of us are 649 00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:27,919 Speaker 2: in the position we are right now when it comes 650 00:40:27,920 --> 00:40:31,960 Speaker 2: to our self talk. Because this isn't just something that 651 00:40:32,600 --> 00:40:36,759 Speaker 2: we one day woke up with this is that environment 652 00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:39,960 Speaker 2: that we were born into that has been built over, 653 00:40:40,800 --> 00:40:42,799 Speaker 2: you know, decades, centuries. 654 00:40:43,239 --> 00:40:45,560 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, it's the same for men. It's just different 655 00:40:45,640 --> 00:40:47,279 Speaker 3: narratives exactly. 656 00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:49,120 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. 657 00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:51,239 Speaker 3: And it's interesting and I talk about this a ton 658 00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:53,080 Speaker 3: on the podcast that the listeners are probably like, oh, 659 00:40:53,120 --> 00:40:54,440 Speaker 3: here she goes again, but. 660 00:40:55,160 --> 00:40:56,520 Speaker 2: I'm hearing it for the first time. 661 00:40:57,800 --> 00:41:01,200 Speaker 3: But I think that it all ties in the way 662 00:41:01,239 --> 00:41:03,640 Speaker 3: we're talking to ourselves and the narratives that we say 663 00:41:03,680 --> 00:41:06,880 Speaker 3: in general. Like the big place that I've noticed it 664 00:41:06,920 --> 00:41:08,719 Speaker 3: in my life is when I really started to switch 665 00:41:08,800 --> 00:41:12,480 Speaker 3: narratives around dating, like the discussion between my friends as 666 00:41:12,520 --> 00:41:16,960 Speaker 3: always there are no men in Nashville. Men suck men, 667 00:41:17,160 --> 00:41:19,600 Speaker 3: you know, just like those kind of negative things, and 668 00:41:19,640 --> 00:41:21,440 Speaker 3: I just one day was like, I'm not going to 669 00:41:21,480 --> 00:41:24,680 Speaker 3: believe that anymore, and I'm going to start saying there 670 00:41:24,760 --> 00:41:27,200 Speaker 3: are good men out there. There are men who are 671 00:41:27,239 --> 00:41:29,239 Speaker 3: willing to do whatever it is that I wanted or 672 00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:32,280 Speaker 3: whatever it was. And the more that I said it, 673 00:41:32,280 --> 00:41:34,640 Speaker 3: it was just so interesting to watch what I was 674 00:41:34,760 --> 00:41:39,000 Speaker 3: drawing in and it completely changed. So I can only 675 00:41:39,040 --> 00:41:41,719 Speaker 3: imagine if we're doing that to ourselves constantly, if we 676 00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:45,560 Speaker 3: change the narratives within ourselves, like what kind of things 677 00:41:45,560 --> 00:41:49,360 Speaker 3: we're attracting and bringing into our lives with the shift 678 00:41:49,360 --> 00:41:50,000 Speaker 3: of the narrative. 679 00:41:50,880 --> 00:41:53,640 Speaker 2: I love that you just brought that up because I 680 00:41:53,680 --> 00:41:56,680 Speaker 2: think that that's something that many of us have said 681 00:41:56,800 --> 00:41:59,960 Speaker 2: at some point in time, right. But that's great example 682 00:42:00,200 --> 00:42:03,120 Speaker 2: of you shifting because I'm sure that you have whether 683 00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:08,879 Speaker 2: they are friends, relatives, colleagues, I'm sure you know some 684 00:42:09,040 --> 00:42:13,359 Speaker 2: great men period in your life. So you saying that 685 00:42:13,520 --> 00:42:19,040 Speaker 2: to yourself, that's you're telling yourself something that you already believe. 686 00:42:19,719 --> 00:42:23,400 Speaker 2: But what I hear is you not only telling yourself that, 687 00:42:23,880 --> 00:42:26,960 Speaker 2: but you deciding that you are going to then look 688 00:42:27,000 --> 00:42:30,360 Speaker 2: for it. So the subtext that I hear is there 689 00:42:30,440 --> 00:42:33,319 Speaker 2: are good men, so I'm going to go find them. 690 00:42:34,080 --> 00:42:39,720 Speaker 2: And that is that is like the perfect example of 691 00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:44,960 Speaker 2: a way to make a shift that is sustainable because 692 00:42:45,000 --> 00:42:51,239 Speaker 2: you are starting with that seed of well, yeah, there 693 00:42:51,239 --> 00:42:54,440 Speaker 2: are good men out there because I know them. They 694 00:42:54,520 --> 00:42:56,680 Speaker 2: might not be available to me right now to date, 695 00:42:56,760 --> 00:42:59,480 Speaker 2: I might not want to date that there are good 696 00:42:59,800 --> 00:43:04,799 Speaker 2: men out there. Versus I think sometimes people can say 697 00:43:04,880 --> 00:43:11,440 Speaker 2: things like you know, my person, my person is coming 698 00:43:11,440 --> 00:43:14,520 Speaker 2: to me, They will be to me soon and that 699 00:43:14,560 --> 00:43:18,120 Speaker 2: can be really hard because if you don't have something 700 00:43:18,680 --> 00:43:22,480 Speaker 2: in your life that is starting that little seed of 701 00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:25,680 Speaker 2: beliefs to be huge. But if you don't have that 702 00:43:25,760 --> 00:43:28,400 Speaker 2: seed of belief that's started, which I think with that 703 00:43:28,480 --> 00:43:31,800 Speaker 2: phrase in particular, that can be really hard for people. 704 00:43:33,640 --> 00:43:37,680 Speaker 2: Then it's going to feel really tough and really really 705 00:43:37,880 --> 00:43:42,120 Speaker 2: really really discouraging. You're saying this to someone who did 706 00:43:42,239 --> 00:43:46,239 Speaker 2: not like to date whatsoever. And actually, my husband and 707 00:43:46,280 --> 00:43:49,080 Speaker 2: I met when we were on one of the dating 708 00:43:49,160 --> 00:43:52,560 Speaker 2: apps and I found a loophole in the app where 709 00:43:52,560 --> 00:43:56,240 Speaker 2: I could start to block people. So it was people 710 00:43:56,239 --> 00:43:59,440 Speaker 2: that I hadn't been matched with yet that they were just, 711 00:43:59,719 --> 00:44:02,319 Speaker 2: you know, the if the app was matching me with 712 00:44:02,400 --> 00:44:06,799 Speaker 2: maybe ninety eight percent and above pect a perfect fit 713 00:44:06,960 --> 00:44:10,120 Speaker 2: if you will. These were the people who were ninety 714 00:44:10,160 --> 00:44:14,080 Speaker 2: eight percent below ninety eight percent. So I was like, well, 715 00:44:14,719 --> 00:44:17,880 Speaker 2: if I just cycle through these jokers, there's going to 716 00:44:17,960 --> 00:44:19,880 Speaker 2: be no one on this app for me to talk to, 717 00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:22,440 Speaker 2: and like, I am working the system. So I was 718 00:44:22,480 --> 00:44:26,640 Speaker 2: just blocking, blocking, blocking, blocking, blocking, And I mentioned this 719 00:44:27,160 --> 00:44:30,680 Speaker 2: story in the book. I got to my husband Jeremy's profile, 720 00:44:30,760 --> 00:44:33,120 Speaker 2: and I had this feeling that was just the subjective 721 00:44:33,120 --> 00:44:36,399 Speaker 2: feeling of oh, I know him, and I had never 722 00:44:36,520 --> 00:44:39,280 Speaker 2: met him in my life. I obviously know that now, 723 00:44:40,480 --> 00:44:45,000 Speaker 2: but I was in a place where, after being single 724 00:44:45,080 --> 00:44:47,799 Speaker 2: for a very long time and after going on some 725 00:44:49,320 --> 00:44:52,440 Speaker 2: not great dates, where I was just like, this is 726 00:44:52,480 --> 00:44:56,600 Speaker 2: not for me. I was like, I'm not I'm not 727 00:44:56,680 --> 00:45:01,359 Speaker 2: getting into something unless it's really something that I want 728 00:45:01,400 --> 00:45:04,520 Speaker 2: to get into, unless it's really really worth my while 729 00:45:05,800 --> 00:45:09,280 Speaker 2: because I have other wonderful things going on in my life, 730 00:45:09,280 --> 00:45:15,000 Speaker 2: Like this person needs to enhance my life more than anything. 731 00:45:15,719 --> 00:45:18,480 Speaker 2: I'm looking for someone to complete me. I'm looking for 732 00:45:18,520 --> 00:45:22,200 Speaker 2: a teammate, and like, I know those exist because I 733 00:45:22,280 --> 00:45:25,160 Speaker 2: have friends and family members who have that type of 734 00:45:25,200 --> 00:45:30,080 Speaker 2: relationship with their partner. And also like I know that 735 00:45:30,160 --> 00:45:32,520 Speaker 2: it's it's a little harder to find that person, but 736 00:45:33,239 --> 00:45:36,399 Speaker 2: I don't really I don't really want to go out 737 00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:39,200 Speaker 2: and seek them out. So I'm just going to cycle 738 00:45:39,239 --> 00:45:41,680 Speaker 2: through these people. And it's just it's so funny because 739 00:45:41,680 --> 00:45:44,720 Speaker 2: when he popped up on the app and it actually 740 00:45:44,760 --> 00:45:49,360 Speaker 2: turned out that we did have a very odd mutual 741 00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:54,760 Speaker 2: connection where his older brother was my ex boyfriend slash 742 00:45:54,800 --> 00:45:59,040 Speaker 2: friend's best friend growing up when they were when they 743 00:45:59,040 --> 00:46:02,480 Speaker 2: were kids. So I texted my friend and I was like, so, 744 00:46:02,600 --> 00:46:06,160 Speaker 2: what know about this Jeremy person. He's like a lot, 745 00:46:06,239 --> 00:46:11,160 Speaker 2: that's Josh's younger brother. But I had that sense of objectively, 746 00:46:11,680 --> 00:46:15,919 Speaker 2: oh I know him, Oh this like you should look 747 00:46:16,000 --> 00:46:20,480 Speaker 2: into this. And I couldn't ignore that. I mean even 748 00:46:20,480 --> 00:46:22,279 Speaker 2: if I wanted to, I couldn't ignore that. But it 749 00:46:22,400 --> 00:46:28,240 Speaker 2: wasn't it wasn't fueled by any other sort of narrative 750 00:46:28,440 --> 00:46:31,759 Speaker 2: that I had had going on in my life. I 751 00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:34,160 Speaker 2: just knew that I was looking for someone to enhance 752 00:46:35,200 --> 00:46:38,680 Speaker 2: my life and whose life I could hopefully enhance. And 753 00:46:38,960 --> 00:46:41,960 Speaker 2: I was like, well, when I feel something, I'll feel something, 754 00:46:43,040 --> 00:46:45,400 Speaker 2: and when I don't, I don't, I won't. And so 755 00:46:45,520 --> 00:46:49,759 Speaker 2: I felt something and I followed that feeling. I feel 756 00:46:49,800 --> 00:46:55,440 Speaker 2: like dating is a really really great not always the easiest, 757 00:46:55,440 --> 00:47:00,879 Speaker 2: but a really great example of places to shift your 758 00:47:00,960 --> 00:47:01,560 Speaker 2: self talk. 759 00:47:01,760 --> 00:47:01,920 Speaker 3: You know. 760 00:47:02,080 --> 00:47:05,240 Speaker 2: Oh yes, there's so much self worth stuff that goes 761 00:47:05,400 --> 00:47:06,680 Speaker 2: that's tied into all of that. 762 00:47:06,960 --> 00:47:10,000 Speaker 3: Oh yeah, when you were saying the thing about the 763 00:47:10,080 --> 00:47:12,600 Speaker 3: subtext behind well there are men, there are good men 764 00:47:12,640 --> 00:47:16,680 Speaker 3: out there, and changing that narrative, the subtext subtext would 765 00:47:16,719 --> 00:47:20,680 Speaker 3: be and I deserve that, and I am worthy of that, 766 00:47:20,719 --> 00:47:23,000 Speaker 3: you know, like it did tie back into my own 767 00:47:23,080 --> 00:47:26,800 Speaker 3: relationship with what I thought I was worthy of, which 768 00:47:26,960 --> 00:47:29,279 Speaker 3: again ties into my negative self talk And where did 769 00:47:29,320 --> 00:47:32,799 Speaker 3: that that narrative come from? And really diving into all 770 00:47:32,840 --> 00:47:35,040 Speaker 3: of that with my relationship with myself and once I 771 00:47:35,080 --> 00:47:38,080 Speaker 3: did shift those things, the things that I were drawing 772 00:47:38,120 --> 00:47:40,400 Speaker 3: in just as far as the guys that I was dating, 773 00:47:40,520 --> 00:47:45,000 Speaker 3: was completely different, Like just completely. It's just so interesting 774 00:47:45,080 --> 00:47:48,719 Speaker 3: how much of our outer world really is a projection 775 00:47:48,840 --> 00:47:50,160 Speaker 3: of what's happening internally. 776 00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:54,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, do you think that that was mostly because of 777 00:47:55,800 --> 00:47:57,560 Speaker 2: you know, what we've talked about, or do you think 778 00:47:57,560 --> 00:48:02,000 Speaker 2: it's partially because of like the I forget what the 779 00:48:02,200 --> 00:48:06,280 Speaker 2: actual study is. But like when people talk about seeing 780 00:48:06,280 --> 00:48:08,480 Speaker 2: the color red, if they say, okay, the color red 781 00:48:08,520 --> 00:48:11,160 Speaker 2: is everywhere, then the only thing, oh yea is the 782 00:48:11,200 --> 00:48:13,960 Speaker 2: color red? Like I want to raze it because is 783 00:48:14,000 --> 00:48:16,120 Speaker 2: it because you were looking for those people or do 784 00:48:16,160 --> 00:48:18,440 Speaker 2: you think that it was you know, that was what 785 00:48:18,480 --> 00:48:20,520 Speaker 2: you were attracting or like a little bit of both. 786 00:48:21,200 --> 00:48:24,759 Speaker 3: I would say probably both, because I Mean for me, 787 00:48:24,880 --> 00:48:27,680 Speaker 3: it's I'm just such an energy like person. I believe 788 00:48:27,760 --> 00:48:30,600 Speaker 3: so heavily and that everything is energy. And I know 789 00:48:30,760 --> 00:48:32,960 Speaker 3: that there have been times in my life where I 790 00:48:33,120 --> 00:48:36,759 Speaker 3: just really have believed and this was because of certain experiences. 791 00:48:36,800 --> 00:48:40,000 Speaker 3: But I had a really bad relationship with men and 792 00:48:40,040 --> 00:48:43,239 Speaker 3: like did not like them. It felt very angry or 793 00:48:43,280 --> 00:48:46,399 Speaker 3: betrayed or whatever it was. And so the more I 794 00:48:46,440 --> 00:48:50,080 Speaker 3: carried that narrative, even if I would try to move 795 00:48:50,080 --> 00:48:52,680 Speaker 3: out of it, I was just having the same experience 796 00:48:52,760 --> 00:48:55,239 Speaker 3: over and over mirrored back to me, you know. And 797 00:48:55,560 --> 00:48:58,640 Speaker 3: I don't know if that's subconscious or if it's again 798 00:48:58,680 --> 00:49:01,200 Speaker 3: like you're saying, like we just raw in whatever it 799 00:49:01,280 --> 00:49:05,280 Speaker 3: is we're focused on. But the minute I changed the narrative, 800 00:49:05,400 --> 00:49:06,799 Speaker 3: and a lot of that had to do with the 801 00:49:06,880 --> 00:49:10,719 Speaker 3: narrative with myself, it really did shift my whole entire 802 00:49:10,800 --> 00:49:11,799 Speaker 3: dating experience. 803 00:49:12,560 --> 00:49:15,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, I love that. I'm so happy that you shared 804 00:49:15,560 --> 00:49:16,120 Speaker 2: that story. 805 00:49:18,080 --> 00:49:20,040 Speaker 3: Well, we did talk about the book, but I want 806 00:49:20,040 --> 00:49:21,600 Speaker 3: to talk about you have a podcast too that we 807 00:49:21,719 --> 00:49:23,719 Speaker 3: mentioned at the beginning. It's called the want Cast. So 808 00:49:23,800 --> 00:49:26,560 Speaker 3: tell the listeners what they can find on want Cast. 809 00:49:27,239 --> 00:49:29,399 Speaker 2: Oh, they can find well, first of all, they can 810 00:49:29,440 --> 00:49:34,400 Speaker 2: find eight years worth of the long standing podcast. By 811 00:49:34,440 --> 00:49:37,000 Speaker 2: the way, it is a freaking long standing podcast. And 812 00:49:37,040 --> 00:49:40,280 Speaker 2: I will say, I don't know if anybody who's listening 813 00:49:41,360 --> 00:49:44,440 Speaker 2: is interested in starting their own podcast, but I will 814 00:49:44,480 --> 00:49:48,080 Speaker 2: say when I first started the Want Cast, I was 815 00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:52,520 Speaker 2: working a full time job. I was also teaching fitness 816 00:49:52,560 --> 00:49:56,480 Speaker 2: before and after my full time job. I was also 817 00:49:57,120 --> 00:50:00,880 Speaker 2: you know, I had just launched Want Again in fifteen 818 00:50:01,000 --> 00:50:05,720 Speaker 2: and I looked at my schedule and I was like, okay, 819 00:50:05,840 --> 00:50:08,520 Speaker 2: what is going to be able to be sustainable? I 820 00:50:08,560 --> 00:50:13,960 Speaker 2: started with the long view, and I started by publishing 821 00:50:14,239 --> 00:50:18,719 Speaker 2: every three weeks because I was like, this is I'm 822 00:50:18,719 --> 00:50:20,239 Speaker 2: not going to be able to do every single week, 823 00:50:20,320 --> 00:50:21,920 Speaker 2: and I actually don't think I'm going to be able 824 00:50:21,960 --> 00:50:25,399 Speaker 2: to do every other week, but every three weeks sounds good. 825 00:50:25,480 --> 00:50:28,880 Speaker 2: And over the course of those eight years, the cadence 826 00:50:28,880 --> 00:50:33,760 Speaker 2: has changed. But I think that I have always put 827 00:50:33,920 --> 00:50:37,640 Speaker 2: a priority on I want to be able to give 828 00:50:37,840 --> 00:50:49,279 Speaker 2: people the most quality most like robust set of tips, tools, motivation, inspiration, 829 00:50:50,000 --> 00:50:54,120 Speaker 2: possible to shift their negative self talk and to move 830 00:50:54,160 --> 00:50:57,360 Speaker 2: forward fearlessly in their lives through you know, solo episodes 831 00:50:57,400 --> 00:51:01,399 Speaker 2: that I do, amazing incredible guests that we have on 832 00:51:01,480 --> 00:51:06,760 Speaker 2: the Wantcast. And I found that the times during which 833 00:51:07,200 --> 00:51:12,600 Speaker 2: I changed the cadence or changed, honestly, really anything about 834 00:51:12,719 --> 00:51:16,840 Speaker 2: the podcast based on what I saw other people doing 835 00:51:17,280 --> 00:51:20,480 Speaker 2: to sort of fit into the podcast space. That's when 836 00:51:20,520 --> 00:51:23,439 Speaker 2: the quality from and you know, maybe other people didn't 837 00:51:23,480 --> 00:51:25,880 Speaker 2: notice it, but I noticed and I felt it. I 838 00:51:26,040 --> 00:51:31,040 Speaker 2: felt like the quality was either starting to decline or would. 839 00:51:31,760 --> 00:51:33,799 Speaker 2: It was sort of at that tipping point, and I 840 00:51:33,880 --> 00:51:35,960 Speaker 2: was like, no, no, no, there is no way I 841 00:51:36,000 --> 00:51:39,440 Speaker 2: am not sacrificing this. And so if you go to 842 00:51:39,600 --> 00:51:43,920 Speaker 2: the wantcast, you know, we just released episode one sixty four, 843 00:51:44,200 --> 00:51:48,520 Speaker 2: which for eight years, one sixty four can be like. 844 00:51:49,160 --> 00:51:51,360 Speaker 2: People might be like, oh, there's there's only one hundred 845 00:51:51,360 --> 00:51:54,880 Speaker 2: and sixty four, but it's because it's gone on and off. 846 00:51:55,040 --> 00:51:58,480 Speaker 2: And I think that whether it's a podcast or anything 847 00:51:58,480 --> 00:52:00,560 Speaker 2: that you want to bring to life that has meaning 848 00:52:01,000 --> 00:52:05,040 Speaker 2: for you, it's so important to really get clear on 849 00:52:05,200 --> 00:52:10,520 Speaker 2: how you want to affect other people and what you 850 00:52:10,520 --> 00:52:12,759 Speaker 2: want to give to other people, and what you're going 851 00:52:12,840 --> 00:52:17,200 Speaker 2: to what you need to do to get that feeling 852 00:52:17,239 --> 00:52:19,680 Speaker 2: that you want to feel, both within yourself and with 853 00:52:19,840 --> 00:52:20,480 Speaker 2: other people. 854 00:52:20,600 --> 00:52:24,120 Speaker 4: So I know you didn't ask about the scheduling, and 855 00:52:24,239 --> 00:52:27,200 Speaker 4: that matters, though it does the whole part of knowing 856 00:52:27,239 --> 00:52:30,239 Speaker 4: yourself again going circling back to that piece that we 857 00:52:30,239 --> 00:52:34,600 Speaker 4: were talking about knowing yourself, trusting yourself, really listening to 858 00:52:34,640 --> 00:52:37,239 Speaker 4: what will work for you, and being authentic and true 859 00:52:37,280 --> 00:52:37,760 Speaker 4: to yourself. 860 00:52:37,800 --> 00:52:41,960 Speaker 2: I think that's huge. Yeah, it's you know. And I 861 00:52:41,960 --> 00:52:46,560 Speaker 2: think that the best part of that is that my 862 00:52:46,640 --> 00:52:50,520 Speaker 2: dad once described integrity to me as being able to 863 00:52:50,680 --> 00:52:52,319 Speaker 2: come home at the end of the day and look 864 00:52:52,360 --> 00:52:55,360 Speaker 2: at yourself in the mirror and say, I stayed true 865 00:52:55,440 --> 00:52:59,319 Speaker 2: to myself. And I think that something that is just 866 00:53:00,280 --> 00:53:03,000 Speaker 2: so important to me from a personal other level but 867 00:53:03,160 --> 00:53:07,360 Speaker 2: also an interpersonal level, is being able to make those 868 00:53:07,400 --> 00:53:12,040 Speaker 2: decisions and stay true to those decisions in the big moments, 869 00:53:12,040 --> 00:53:17,640 Speaker 2: but in those micro moments that are true to the 870 00:53:17,680 --> 00:53:21,879 Speaker 2: intention and true to the impact that I hope to have, 871 00:53:22,120 --> 00:53:26,440 Speaker 2: and constantly working to make that not a ven diagram 872 00:53:26,520 --> 00:53:30,320 Speaker 2: but a circle. And I think that that is something 873 00:53:30,400 --> 00:53:34,719 Speaker 2: that it's very easy. I mean, published a book is 874 00:53:34,840 --> 00:53:37,680 Speaker 2: very easy in book publishing to get very wrapped up 875 00:53:37,840 --> 00:53:42,200 Speaker 2: in what you think you are supposed to be doing 876 00:53:42,480 --> 00:53:46,120 Speaker 2: in whatever project or field you are in. But the 877 00:53:46,160 --> 00:53:51,680 Speaker 2: more you you are out loud, the more it gives permission, 878 00:53:51,880 --> 00:53:55,120 Speaker 2: like we talked about before, for others to do the 879 00:53:55,239 --> 00:54:01,080 Speaker 2: exact same thing, and so we end up creating way 880 00:54:01,200 --> 00:54:05,000 Speaker 2: more of an impact than we even realized just by 881 00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:10,080 Speaker 2: staying true to that core of self. 882 00:54:11,200 --> 00:54:13,279 Speaker 3: To me, that's just practicing what you preach. So good 883 00:54:13,320 --> 00:54:15,000 Speaker 3: on you. Oh yeah, thank you. 884 00:54:15,200 --> 00:54:17,799 Speaker 2: Thank you. I do my best. I don't. I don't 885 00:54:17,840 --> 00:54:20,160 Speaker 2: always get it right, because again I am a human 886 00:54:20,280 --> 00:54:23,399 Speaker 2: and not a robot. But I think that the good 887 00:54:24,160 --> 00:54:28,040 Speaker 2: the good part that I'm probably like the most proud of, 888 00:54:28,320 --> 00:54:29,920 Speaker 2: or one of the things that I'm most proud of, 889 00:54:30,040 --> 00:54:35,520 Speaker 2: is that I really do work to catch myself in 890 00:54:35,680 --> 00:54:40,120 Speaker 2: the moments when I maybe don't practice what I preach, 891 00:54:40,800 --> 00:54:45,719 Speaker 2: and I really do my best to either avoid that 892 00:54:45,800 --> 00:54:47,760 Speaker 2: shames spiral. So to bring it back to the beginning 893 00:54:47,800 --> 00:54:53,160 Speaker 2: of our conversation or saying, okay, you're spiraling, what's the 894 00:54:53,200 --> 00:54:57,560 Speaker 2: information underneath, And maybe that information underneath is, oh, you 895 00:54:57,560 --> 00:55:01,520 Speaker 2: didn't do something that felt like thank you. That's great 896 00:55:01,600 --> 00:55:04,279 Speaker 2: information to have because then next time I'm in a 897 00:55:04,320 --> 00:55:07,600 Speaker 2: situation like that, then I'll do what feels like me 898 00:55:07,760 --> 00:55:11,160 Speaker 2: and see what happens. Fun So I really do try 899 00:55:11,200 --> 00:55:13,000 Speaker 2: and stay true to that. So thank you for bringing 900 00:55:13,000 --> 00:55:16,040 Speaker 2: that up. Of course, I'm gonna put the description I'm sorry. 901 00:55:16,080 --> 00:55:18,400 Speaker 3: I'm gonna put the link to that podcast and the 902 00:55:18,480 --> 00:55:20,520 Speaker 3: link to the book and the description of this podcast. 903 00:55:20,760 --> 00:55:22,640 Speaker 3: But if people want to stay in touch with you 904 00:55:23,000 --> 00:55:25,560 Speaker 3: or follow along on your journey, Katie, where else can 905 00:55:25,560 --> 00:55:26,200 Speaker 3: they find you? 906 00:55:27,040 --> 00:55:30,080 Speaker 2: Yes, so they can find the book at want yourself 907 00:55:30,120 --> 00:55:35,000 Speaker 2: dot com. It is, as they say, available wherever books 908 00:55:35,040 --> 00:55:37,800 Speaker 2: are sold. Also, you can request it at your local library. 909 00:55:38,360 --> 00:55:42,080 Speaker 2: They can find me on social media. I'm everywhere at Kadiehorwich. 910 00:55:42,160 --> 00:55:46,160 Speaker 2: That's h O R. Witch, just my name. And then 911 00:55:46,200 --> 00:55:48,719 Speaker 2: they can also find me on the wantcast wherever they 912 00:55:48,719 --> 00:55:51,880 Speaker 2: listen to podcasts. They can find me at katihorwitch dot com. 913 00:55:51,920 --> 00:55:55,280 Speaker 2: And then they can find Women Against Negative Talk want 914 00:55:55,520 --> 00:55:58,359 Speaker 2: at Women Against Negative Talk dot com. And that's sort 915 00:55:58,400 --> 00:56:02,800 Speaker 2: of the the hub for all of the tips, tools resources, 916 00:56:03,880 --> 00:56:08,200 Speaker 2: and it is a It is a wonderful fulfilling place 917 00:56:08,280 --> 00:56:10,319 Speaker 2: to be, at least for me, so I hope it 918 00:56:10,360 --> 00:56:12,239 Speaker 2: is for people as well. Well. 919 00:56:12,280 --> 00:56:13,480 Speaker 3: I guess that I'll put all of that in the 920 00:56:13,520 --> 00:56:15,319 Speaker 3: description of the podcast for you guys, so you have 921 00:56:15,440 --> 00:56:17,520 Speaker 3: easy links to it. Katie, thank you so much for 922 00:56:17,560 --> 00:56:18,080 Speaker 3: being here. 923 00:56:18,840 --> 00:56:23,239 Speaker 2: This was absolutely wonderful. I am so so thrilled to 924 00:56:23,280 --> 00:56:26,239 Speaker 2: be here and I am just so thrilled that kind 925 00:56:26,280 --> 00:56:29,279 Speaker 2: of very personal and selfish note. I'm so thrilled that 926 00:56:29,320 --> 00:56:30,160 Speaker 2: we're now connected. 927 00:56:30,520 --> 00:56:30,759 Speaker 3: Yeah. 928 00:56:30,960 --> 00:56:34,400 Speaker 2: Same, Thank you guys for listening. 929 00:56:35,160 --> 00:56:38,160 Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to The Velvet's Edge podcast with Kelly Henderson, 930 00:56:38,360 --> 00:56:40,840 Speaker 1: where we believe everyone has a little velvet in a 931 00:56:40,880 --> 00:56:45,040 Speaker 1: little edge. Subscribe for more conversations on life, style, beauty 932 00:56:45,080 --> 00:56:48,799 Speaker 1: and relationships. Search Velvet's Edge wherever you get your podcasts.