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Speaker 1: What kind of a show you guys.

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Speaker 2: Putting on here today?

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Speaker 1: You're not interested in art?

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Speaker 3: Now?

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Speaker 1: No, Look, we're going to do this thing.

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Speaker 4: We're going to have a.

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Speaker 2: Conversation from Chicago. This is Film Spotting celebrating our twentieth year.

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Speaker 2: I'm Adam Kempenar.

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Speaker 1: And I'm Josh Larson. In the material I'm probably not

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Speaker 1: someone you want to date, because the next person I

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Speaker 1: date I'm going to marry. Are you hitting on me?

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Speaker 1: That's Dakota Johnson maybe hitting on Pedro Pascal in Materialists.

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Speaker 1: The ram not so Calm from director Selene Song. It's

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Speaker 1: her follow up to twenty twenty three's Past Lives.

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Speaker 2: Our Review, plus the Stephen King adaptation The Life of

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Speaker 2: Chuck starring Tom Hiddleston. That and more. Who's Chuck Ahead

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Speaker 2: on Film Spotting, Welcome to Film Spotting. The audience award

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Speaker 2: winner at last year's Toronto International Film Festival, The Life

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Speaker 2: of Chuck is now in theaters. Seems like it might

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Speaker 2: be having a hard time fighting an audience. It was

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Speaker 2: buried in my Multiplex, in the very end of the aisle,

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Speaker 2: in the smallest theater.

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Speaker 1: Josh, Yeah, I saw it with maybe three or four

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Speaker 1: other people, but it was a mid day, weekday showing,

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Speaker 1: so I don't know, it wasn't aware that it was struggling,

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Speaker 1: and maybe that's too bad. I guess we'll discuss.

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Speaker 2: We will a review of that later in the show,

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Speaker 2: and we'll get your thoughts on Pixar's Elo, which is

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Speaker 2: new in theaters this weekend. Plus we will have a

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Speaker 2: little massacre theater, but first materialists. Selene Song's Past Lives

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Speaker 2: was one of the stand up films of twenty twenty

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Speaker 2: three and an incredibly promising debut. Her latest, which is

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Speaker 2: now in wide release, is a love and money triangle

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Speaker 2: with Dakota Johnson as a Manhattan matchmaker who's caught between

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Speaker 2: rich guy Pedro Pascal and her broke former bow Chris Evans.

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Speaker 2: Here's Johnson and Pascal.

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Speaker 5: You look about six feet tall. How much money do

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Speaker 5: you make?

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Speaker 1: Just straight up like that? I make eighty grand a

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Speaker 1: year before Texas?

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Speaker 5: Do you make more or less than that?

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Speaker 1: More?

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Speaker 4: I know?

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Speaker 1: Finance right, private equity?

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Speaker 4: Do you want to drink?

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Speaker 3: Sure?

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Speaker 1: What do you want?

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Speaker 5: Cochin beer?

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Speaker 2: About a week ago on its Instagram, A twenty four

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Speaker 2: posted Selene Song's email list of films that were references

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Speaker 2: for Materialists. On it you will find multiple movies by

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Speaker 2: James Ivory, James L. Brooks, Mike Lee, Mike Nichols, Jane Campion,

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Speaker 2: Robert Altman, Joe Wright, Yeah, Both Pride and Prejudice and Atonement,

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Speaker 2: a Pta, A Yang, and a few others. Under the

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Speaker 2: heading movie about similar job as matchmakers were Jerry Maguire, Hale,

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Speaker 2: Caesar and Money, A section that may require its own

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Speaker 2: show at some point. Curiously not on the list, well

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Speaker 2: curious to me anyway, any mention of Woody Allen, I know,

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Speaker 2: I might as well be summoning Voldemort. And while I

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Speaker 2: know there are Alan films you appreciate, Josh, my hunch

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Speaker 2: is that over the course of your sinophile life you

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Speaker 2: may not have been as big a fan of his

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Speaker 2: work as I am. This prompt may then be quite dissatisfying. Nevertheless,

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Speaker 2: the initial level on which Materialists satisfied me was the

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Speaker 2: same as many Woody Allen movies, watching smart talkie characters

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Speaker 2: saying smart things do each other against the beautiful backdrop

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Speaker 2: of New York City. With deference to David Wayne, it

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Speaker 2: is almost another character, after all, and from the late

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Speaker 2: seventies through the eighties, Allen's films, like Materialists, were mostly introspective,

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Speaker 2: women centered movies about navigating love and desire and disappointment.

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Speaker 2: Annie Hall, Hannah and Her Sisters, September, Another Woman, Purple Rosa,

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Speaker 2: Cairo Broadway, Danny Rose, Alice. I might even be skipping

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Speaker 2: one or two. I would not say everyone in Allen's

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Speaker 2: films are bad people, just as I wouldn't say everyone

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Speaker 2: in Songs film are bad people. But there's enough solipsism

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Speaker 2: to go around, and sometimes both filmmakers are even in

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Speaker 2: on the joke, taking shots at their fellow New Yorkers,

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Speaker 2: such as the couple montages we get in Materialists, where

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Speaker 2: Dakota Johnson's Lucy the matchmaker, her clients, with no hint

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Speaker 2: of self awareness whatsoever, tell her exactly what type of

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Speaker 2: man or woman they want and deserve. Now, Josh, I'm

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Speaker 2: not expecting you to go all in on the song

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Speaker 2: Alan model I've attempted to establish here, though, of course

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Speaker 2: you're free to accept or reject it. Mostly, I want

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Speaker 2: you to tell me the level on which you appreciated Materialists,

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Speaker 2: and how you felt about the movie. Overall.

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Speaker 1: The Allen comparison is interesting. You are probably right. I'm

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Speaker 1: not the person to ask about the validity of that

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Speaker 1: have seen you know, some of his more important movies.

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Speaker 1: He was a filmmaker when I first encountered him many

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Speaker 1: many years ago before a lot of a lot of

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Speaker 1: a lot of hell and stuff I just didn't immediately

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Speaker 1: click with. And so by the time I, you know,

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Speaker 1: felt like I need to give some films second chances

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Speaker 1: or explore other ones, he kind of fell back to

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Speaker 1: the bottom of the list of of you know, priorities.

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Speaker 1: That said, I have seen Manhattan and immediately recognized it

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Speaker 1: as brilliant, And I think that maybe one of the

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Speaker 1: key comparison techs if you were going to do that exercise,

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Speaker 1: I'll let you tell me Hannah and her Sisters I've

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Speaker 1: also seen, but seems a little less a little less

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Speaker 1: of a fruitful comparison point. What I think you know

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Speaker 1: you're probably onto is one of the things, for sure,

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Speaker 1: you said, the smart dialogue Materialists is so sharply written,

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Speaker 1: maybe too sharply written for some of its cast, which

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Speaker 1: will get to but I definitely think that's one of

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Speaker 1: the strengths, and that's surely a strength of Allen's movies.

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Speaker 1: I think the view of New York is cynically romantic,

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Speaker 1: and you describe those montages well, of the New Yorkers

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Speaker 1: exposing themselves and their vapidity in a way that Alan

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Speaker 1: frequently would expose his own faults as a narcissistic pseudo

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Speaker 1: intellectual in many ways. So they have that in common

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Speaker 1: as well, the one key divergence, and maybe this can

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Speaker 1: bring us more towards materialists that from the few Allen

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Speaker 1: films New York sete Allen films I've seen is that

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Speaker 1: I do think over two films now Song has established

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Speaker 1: herself as a romantic and I think that impulse is

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Speaker 1: there in the Allen rom coms, if you want to

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Speaker 1: say that I've seen, But ultimately his characters are incapable

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Speaker 1: of sustaining romance. They want it, they desire it, and

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Speaker 1: they may find it fleetingly. Again, I'm mostly thinking of

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Speaker 1: Manhattan here, but I don't know that we ever believe

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Speaker 1: they'll find it. And I think that past lives, while

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Speaker 1: acknowledging the messiness and complexities in the same way Alan

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Speaker 1: does of relationships, while acknowledging those things, still deeply believes

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Speaker 1: in a romantic endpoint Materialists, I think brings us there

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Speaker 1: in a way that I didn't find quite as convincing

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Speaker 1: as Past Lives did. I think it's a good movie.

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Speaker 1: I think it's worth seeing, and there are some limitations

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Speaker 1: to it. Why for me it's not on the level

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Speaker 1: of Past Lives for that matter, not in the level

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Speaker 1: of Manhattan either.

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Speaker 2: No, that's interesting. That take on Allan is interesting too,

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Speaker 2: because Manhattan for me has maybe as conventionally a romantic

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Speaker 2: ending as you could possibly have. And I might believe

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Speaker 2: that ending actually more than I believe the ending here

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Speaker 2: with material.

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Speaker 1: That's key, right, do you believe in it? It's less

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Speaker 1: about plotting and what we're left with? And Okay, do

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Speaker 1: we believe this couple has a chance, do they deserve

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Speaker 1: a chance? Can they possibly make it well?

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Speaker 2: And beyond that, do I care? Really? Do I care?

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Speaker 2: Is the key question? And this is one of those

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Speaker 2: cases I will say, And this is the fun part

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Speaker 2: of talking this out. Unlike you, who ninety five percent

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Speaker 2: plus of the time you have written out your review

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Speaker 2: before you come to the conversation, so you already have

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Speaker 2: rated the movie. I have never done that. I have

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Speaker 2: a rating in mind, and I usually stick to it,

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Speaker 2: but I haven't had that occasion or that reason to

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Speaker 2: do so. I usually know how I feel about the

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Speaker 2: movie before the conversation, and like I said, I stick

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Speaker 2: to that kind of gut reaction that I left the

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Speaker 2: theater with. Here's the case, Josh, where overall I feel

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Speaker 2: like I'm mildly positive about the movie, and that's how

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Speaker 2: I felt coming out of the theater. But all of

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Speaker 2: my notes, everything that I have to articulate about the film,

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Speaker 2: it's all thoughts about why I'm not more positive about

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Speaker 2: the film. And I've got a few negative comments here

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Speaker 2: and there, not from critics, but just a few commenters

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Speaker 2: on social media who mostly seem upset that they got

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Speaker 2: sold or expected. Who knows what the marketing was. I

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Speaker 2: didn't see the trailer for the film, but they expected

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Speaker 2: a rom com and they didn't get one. I have

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Speaker 2: no issue with that. Again, I didn't see the marketing.

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Speaker 2: I guess I do have a little issue though, with

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Speaker 2: not having much rom I don't know. This goes back

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Speaker 2: to what we were talking about. I don't know that

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Speaker 2: at any point I ever cared whether Lucy ended up

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Speaker 2: with either one of these guys. And part of that

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Speaker 2: is because we're going to talk about other parts of it.

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Speaker 2: But The first one I'll go with is part of

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Speaker 2: that is that I never got the sense that Lucy

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Speaker 2: herself felt much anguish about that. She never seemed to

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Speaker 2: have much anguish about who she ended up with or

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Speaker 2: whether she needed to end up with any one at all.

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Speaker 2: It really felt more like the plot needed her to

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Speaker 2: end up with someone. That's clearly the course the movie

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Speaker 2: charted for her. This is partly I think to go

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Speaker 2: to Johnson's performance too. But there's a coolness to her,

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Speaker 2: There's a detachment to her that that does make her

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Speaker 2: kind of mysterious and interesting, one of those kind of

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Speaker 2: cool New Yorkers who I don't mind listening to. When

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Speaker 2: she's having a conversation with someone, you are drawn to her,

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Speaker 2: and it somewhat does heighten the emotional breakdown she has

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Speaker 2: later over something that has no connection to her relationships,

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Speaker 2: but that whole math thing that she always talks about.

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Speaker 2: It makes her very clinical as a character and not

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Speaker 2: so romantic, and I found that character in general. I

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Speaker 2: think I like Johnson's performance. I found the character a

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Speaker 2: bit hard to get a read on. And some of

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Speaker 2: this I will acknowledge it could be me wanting to

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Speaker 2: simplify a character that actually on the page and on

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Speaker 2: the screen is more complex, but she comes off as thisticated,

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Speaker 2: very smart New Yorker who's been on the job so long,

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Speaker 2: and she's all knowing and she's got that cynicism down.

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Speaker 2: And then when she's in Pedro Pascal's apartment, that penthouse

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Speaker 2: for the first time, this multimillion dollar penhouse, she acts

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Speaker 2: like she's Cinderella who can't get over the chandeliers when

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Speaker 2: she steps into Prince Charming's castle. You know, I didn't.

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Speaker 2: I couldn't quite.

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Speaker 1: Reconcile that this is fascinating because it's something I've been

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Speaker 1: wrestling over thinking about materialists in comparison to past lives.

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Speaker 1: Because the lead there, Greta Lee, I appreciated that performance

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Speaker 1: quite a bit, but it was much more removed and

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Speaker 1: in some ways clinical, than the performance of one of

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Speaker 1: the male leads, Tail You, who played Heysong. I fell

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Speaker 1: head and over heels for Heysong, but he was more

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Speaker 1: of the pining, romantic figure, right, And Greta Lee playing

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Speaker 1: the main character, Nora, she was a little more hesitant

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Speaker 1: about their potential relationships, a little more mercy. I think

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Speaker 1: I described her even as mercenary and so in a

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Speaker 1: way we're describing two different types of people who have

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Speaker 1: anchored past lives now and materialists. You know, so both

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Speaker 1: of these films by Celine Song have women at their

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Speaker 1: center who have some similarities. At least as you're describing it,

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Speaker 1: I'm recognizing it, and it's starting to help me work through.

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Speaker 1: I think that was part of my remove as well,

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Speaker 1: with the character of Lucy in Materialists. But then you

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Speaker 1: pair that and here's where I think we do differ.

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Speaker 1: As I said, I thought Greta Lee gave a very

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Speaker 1: good performance. I have long struggled with Dakota Johnson, and

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Speaker 1: to my mind, I think why it doesn't work for

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Speaker 1: me here in Materialists is because I don't think she

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Speaker 1: has the ability to take a character that's a little

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Speaker 1: more clin, little maybe more mercenary, a little more removed,

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Speaker 1: and hint at the full human underneath, which Greta Lee

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Speaker 1: was able to do. And I know some people love Johnson,

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Speaker 1: and to me here I just found that the thinness

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Speaker 1: that has always existed in her screen presence for me

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Speaker 1: was especially stark when she was given such great dialogue

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Speaker 1: and you could just hear how it should. In my mind,

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Speaker 1: there are some lines she has here, including one I

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Speaker 1: won't give away, but it's really the key line in

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Speaker 1: the movie where I could hear in my head how

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Speaker 1: it should be affecting me, but just Johnson's delivery, it

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Speaker 1: was not landing. Now. I know people have defended her as,

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Speaker 1: you know, a master of underplane, and I usually appreciate

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Speaker 1: that type of acting style, you know, more than the

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Speaker 1: in your face obviousness. But for me, she's somewhere in

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Speaker 1: between those two, and there's just there's just not Here's

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Speaker 1: the way I kind of thought about It's not so

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Speaker 1: much about thinking about what she might be doing wrong here,

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Speaker 1: but what a few other actors and materialists are doing right. Yes,

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Speaker 1: Pascal and Evans, I mean they almost carry her through

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Speaker 1: this thing, they're so charming. But how about two smaller

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Speaker 1: parts of women. These are both Lucy's clients. They only

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Speaker 1: get brief scenes in Zoe Winters as a skiddish No,

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Speaker 1: it's Louisa Jacobson, I should say, plays a skittish bride,

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Speaker 1: and then Zoe Winters plays a client who gets a

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Speaker 1: few more scenes than one because it's more complicated subplot.

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Speaker 1: But really she's only on the screen. I think in

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Speaker 1: maybe three scenes. Both of them. They pop on the

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Speaker 1: screen immediately, and their characters you can imagine their entire

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Speaker 1: lives with what they're giving you in those scenes. They

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Speaker 1: are interesting, they're complicated, they're compelling, they're messy. You want

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Speaker 1: to know more about their stories. To your point, I

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Speaker 1: don't know that I ever was equally invested in Lucy's story,

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Speaker 1: even though Materialist is ostensibly her story.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't. I see what you're saying. But I

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Speaker 2: also don't think that's completely fair because I think that comparison.

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Speaker 2: When you have a part that really gives you one

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Speaker 2: or two key scenes to dig into, and you know

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Speaker 2: that that's all you have on screen, you're going to

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Speaker 2: bring everything you have to that scene, and especially in

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Speaker 2: the case of one of those scenes, it's it's the

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Speaker 2: most emotional scene in the film. Dakota Johnson obviously can't

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Speaker 2: bring that to every scene, but could she bring It's

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Speaker 2: almost in could bring it to the key So that

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Speaker 2: that might be the part where we disagree a little bit.

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Speaker 2: But but I think overall, we're we're seeing we're seeing

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Speaker 2: a failing in the film. I'm just attributing it a

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Speaker 2: little more, maybe to a Thinness I see overall in

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Speaker 2: the film, and you're seeing it in Johnson. And the

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Speaker 2: reason why I'm attributing it less to Johnson is just

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Speaker 2: because overall as a performer, I have seen her in

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Speaker 2: other parts, and I've given her credit in other parts

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Speaker 2: for having such an easily accessible well of emotion. I

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Speaker 2: think she is such an intelligent performer usually, and also

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Speaker 2: her comedic chops she is such here again, She's such

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Speaker 2: a smart performer. I think she can just so easily

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Speaker 2: tap in. She has such good instincts usually that I've

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Speaker 2: seen on screen. So I'm hesitant. I'm hesitant to put

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Speaker 2: that blame for the thinness on her. And this is why,

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Speaker 2: because other I have other aspects of that lack of

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Speaker 2: romance and the lack of my investment that I think

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Speaker 2: go back to maybe just something in the screenplay and

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Speaker 2: the direction. And I think we may even get at

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Speaker 2: the line. I don't know what line you're referring to,

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Speaker 2: but I have an idea that well, we'll get to

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Speaker 2: here in a second. So you mentioned Evans and Pascal

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Speaker 2: here again. Is it a question, josh of is that

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Speaker 2: the performers, Is that the script itself? When I said

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Speaker 2: that I had no investment in this romance and this

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Speaker 2: love try in these relationships. Neither of these men on

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Speaker 2: their own are interesting beyond what they represent.

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Speaker 1: Right.

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Speaker 2: Pascal is a really good actor, and I think he

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Speaker 2: probably does everything he can with this character. But after

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Speaker 2: his big scene in the restaurant where he gets to

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Speaker 2: push back on Lucy and he gets to make his

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Speaker 2: pitch to her to see her more seriously, does he

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Speaker 2: have does he actually have another Well, except for the

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Speaker 2: scene at the end, there are other big scenes. Does

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Speaker 2: he have another scene of substance in the rest of

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Speaker 2: the film. I don't think he does. He mostly is

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Speaker 2: the guy who picks up the beer tab or picks

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Speaker 2: up another tab, or is the guy watching Chris Evan's

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Speaker 2: play that he doesn't get, or he's just laying in

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Speaker 2: bed the entire rest of the film. He doesn't do

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Speaker 2: anything else of substance. The rest of the film. He's

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Speaker 2: the guy doing all those things I said, or the

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Speaker 2: guy offering to take her to ice. He is a

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Speaker 2: stereotypical finance bro, and the only thing that makes him interesting,

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Speaker 2: as the film puts him forward, is that he doesn't

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Speaker 2: seem interested for being a finance bro. He doesn't seem

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Speaker 2: interested in dating supermodels, even though, of course Dakota Johnson

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Speaker 2: is kind of a supermodel. He is rich guy. He

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Speaker 2: is a rich guy, and that's it. And Evans, of

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Speaker 2: course is poor guy who happens to be an actor.

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Speaker 2: And I suppose that inherently makes him a little bit

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Speaker 2: more interesting, right to me and probably to you than

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Speaker 2: finance dude. But that's just my bias. We don't really

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Speaker 2: know much about him other than that he's poor and

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Speaker 2: he's an actor, and that he loves Lucy and the

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Speaker 2: other thing we know about him. And I think this

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Speaker 2: is where Song stacks the deck a little bit and

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Speaker 2: also really removes any potential for suspense, if there was any.

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Speaker 2: Is that when Lucy gets into some trouble, she doesn't

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Speaker 2: go to Harry, she doesn't say anything to him. She

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Speaker 2: calls John. And is that really because John is so

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Speaker 2: much of a better listener. Would Harry not listen? What

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Speaker 2: Harry not offered advice if she was seeking it? Don't know.

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Speaker 2: Maybe she's just more comfortable with John, so that's who

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Speaker 2: she turns to, right But the fact that she turns

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Speaker 2: to him tells us everything we need to know about

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Speaker 2: where this is going.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I had a little hiccup over that decision, but

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Speaker 1: I do think I think because immediately preceding it, she

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Speaker 1: has a conversation with John that is about the same

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Speaker 1: topic and he's not on the same wavelength as.

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Speaker 2: Ants, and that he's not perfect.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yes, And so I did hesitate over that, but

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Speaker 1: I do think it makes sense. This is part of

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Speaker 1: her processing of what she feels about Harry, and so

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Speaker 1: even if it doesn't make necessarily logical emotional sense, it

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Speaker 1: makes like the deeper level of emotional sense to her

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Speaker 1: to reach out to him. So it was a little

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Speaker 1: bit of a hiccup scene. And it's interesting because, you know,

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Speaker 1: just to go back real brief that I don't have

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Speaker 1: a ton to say about this, but this whole question

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Speaker 1: of it's not a rom com, what are they doing

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Speaker 1: to us? You know? I think one of the strengths

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Speaker 1: of Materialists is the way it bends any romantic comedy expectations,

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Speaker 1: not just not just by becoming this serious drama, but

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Speaker 1: by bending our expectations towards something more serious. And this

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Speaker 1: little moment we're discussing right now as an example of that,

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Speaker 1: because that's how we usually watch rom coms, right they're

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Speaker 1: very judgy movies. We as the audience are very judgy.

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Speaker 1: We're always asking, you know, why should she choose him?

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Speaker 1: She should choose him? Wait, why is she doing making

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Speaker 1: this decision? Why is she making that decision? And I

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Speaker 1: believe that song is after something more subtle and complicated,

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Speaker 1: and so she's bending those expectations in little choices like that. Okay,

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Speaker 1: I've got to defend these two though, I do want to.

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Speaker 1: I know we've referenced their names, but now I do

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Speaker 1: want to look on their IMDb page and see if

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Speaker 1: they're credited as just rich guy. They could be.

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Speaker 2: Harry and John are pretty boring names too. Sorry, tell

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Speaker 2: the Harry and John's out there.

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Speaker 1: You're not wrong. I think they are types for sure,

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Speaker 1: but it's those types are bent in the same way

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Speaker 1: the genre is being bent. And here I will credit

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Speaker 1: again the writing. I think some of the dialogue is

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Speaker 1: pretty exquisite, that each men are given in certain scenes

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Speaker 1: and the performances here is where maybe I didn't believe

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Speaker 1: in Harry as like a real human in the real

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Speaker 1: world or John necessarily, but I wanted to spend more

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Speaker 1: time with them. I wanted to see how they did

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Speaker 1: respond to Lucy and which relationship would go where? And

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Speaker 1: I think, you know, I think you're under selling the

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Speaker 1: two key scenes that Pascal has his introduction, which is fantastic,

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Speaker 1: That whole the whole meat. It's not even cute, it's

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Speaker 1: just meat. Charming at the wedding, I think works and

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Speaker 1: establishes him as something more than just rich guy. Okay,

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Speaker 1: he does have these other interests, why does he passop

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Speaker 1: these opportunities that he has that you're mentioning. There's curiosity

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Speaker 1: there at least for me. And then the later scene,

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Speaker 1: which does give away a lot, so we don't want

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Speaker 1: to get too much into it, but I think that's

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Speaker 1: where Harry just opens up into You're right, this guy

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Speaker 1: who we thought we had pegged is so much more.

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Speaker 1: And in between, is it a lot of you know,

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Speaker 1: Richard gear and pretty woman montage? Yes, that's the thing.

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Speaker 1: It's a little too late, but you know what, I

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Speaker 1: was having fun in that montage. I wanted to see

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Speaker 1: what restaurant he was going to take us to next.

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Speaker 1: Now Evans. For Evans, I think his character is maybe

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Speaker 1: even more thinly written. But there's something about the way

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Speaker 1: Evans looks at Dakota Johnson, that makes you believe I

401
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Speaker 1: agree with that something there, and b we want to

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Speaker 1: know what's going to happen to the two of them.

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Speaker 1: So that's just charisma of a sort that this movie

404
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Speaker 1: is is demanding, and I think he delivers. Yeah.

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Speaker 2: I guess for me, there was there was hope with Pascal,

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Speaker 2: especially after that fun introduction, the meet cute, whatever you

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Speaker 2: want to call it. As you said that, I really

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Speaker 2: hoped that the first thing he'd say to her after

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Speaker 2: he finally does convince her and after they do take

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Speaker 2: their relationship to the next level, that the first thing

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Speaker 2: he would say to her isn't let me take you

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Speaker 2: to Iceland. That basically he wouldn't just continue to buy her,

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Speaker 2: which is really what he's doing, you know, And it

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Speaker 2: just me suggested to me, Yeah, money, the movie's called Materialists,

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Speaker 2: I get it. I know what the central conflict is.

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Speaker 2: I wish that that character had a chance to show

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Speaker 2: that there was something more to him than that. You

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Speaker 2: said you wanted to spend more time with him. I

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Speaker 2: did too, but mainly because I wanted to see I

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Speaker 2: wanted the movie to prove to me that there was

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Speaker 2: something more to them.

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Speaker 1: But that scene between I'm near.

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Speaker 2: And not saying the one at the end, and I'm

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Speaker 2: saying I'm saying yes at that point, just two little

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Speaker 2: so you said subtlety. So that's the other. That's the

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Speaker 2: other thing that I want to talk about a little bit.

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Speaker 2: And up to this point I haven't really made the

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Speaker 2: comparison to Pass Lives, though. Both of the key things

429
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Speaker 2: I've brought up could be comparisons to Pass Lives, right,

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Speaker 2: not feeling that there was enough of a romantic connection

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Speaker 2: between the three main characters, not feeling that there was

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Speaker 2: enough of a conflict over who she would end up

433
00:24:22,040 --> 00:24:24,119
Speaker 2: with or who she should end up with, not feeling

434
00:24:24,119 --> 00:24:27,160
Speaker 2: that the characters had enough depth on their own. Those

435
00:24:27,200 --> 00:24:31,040
Speaker 2: were not issues with Past Lives for me, certainly. The

436
00:24:31,080 --> 00:24:35,359
Speaker 2: other non issue with Past Lives that I struggled with

437
00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:39,520
Speaker 2: here a little bit is that was a movie, maybe

438
00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:43,439
Speaker 2: because of everything else that I just mentioned, that was

439
00:24:43,440 --> 00:24:48,720
Speaker 2: a movie that mined the spaces in between, the physical

440
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:55,160
Speaker 2: spaces in between characters, the space between what said and unsaid.

441
00:24:55,800 --> 00:24:58,679
Speaker 2: We got to do a lot of observing and a

442
00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:01,840
Speaker 2: lot of filling in of blanks. And maybe that's even

443
00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:04,359
Speaker 2: why I didn't mind the detachment so much. Of Greta

444
00:25:04,440 --> 00:25:08,320
Speaker 2: Lee's character in her performance, because that, for me, was

445
00:25:08,680 --> 00:25:11,080
Speaker 2: where I was able to do some of the.

446
00:25:11,000 --> 00:25:13,439
Speaker 1: Fillings the record. I thought, I think Greta's great in

447
00:25:13,440 --> 00:25:14,280
Speaker 1: past last yeah.

448
00:25:14,160 --> 00:25:17,960
Speaker 2: Yeah, So so many of those blanks felt to me

449
00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:21,600
Speaker 2: like they were filled in here and characters told us

450
00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:25,000
Speaker 2: what the takeaways are or what the takeaways were supposed

451
00:25:25,000 --> 00:25:27,760
Speaker 2: to be. There is a key scene early on with

452
00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:30,920
Speaker 2: Lucy and one of her matches, a bride who is

453
00:25:30,960 --> 00:25:33,920
Speaker 2: getting married, and she has to go in and save

454
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:37,320
Speaker 2: the day and convince her to get married, and she

455
00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:41,240
Speaker 2: performs what I think, I think the movie believes is

456
00:25:41,280 --> 00:25:44,479
Speaker 2: both a bit of a parlor trick that she's pulling

457
00:25:44,840 --> 00:25:48,240
Speaker 2: and the truth in that I think Lucy believes what

458
00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:53,160
Speaker 2: she's selling anyway, and as viewers, we don't know it then,

459
00:25:54,040 --> 00:25:57,800
Speaker 2: but we do come fairly quickly to realize that this

460
00:25:57,960 --> 00:26:01,200
Speaker 2: is going to be a recurring theme in the movie.

461
00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:03,359
Speaker 2: This is actually kind of the theme of the movie,

462
00:26:04,080 --> 00:26:06,320
Speaker 2: and I like the idea behind it, which is this

463
00:26:06,400 --> 00:26:10,880
Speaker 2: idea of value. What do we value in relationships? Goes

464
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:12,920
Speaker 2: back to the title of the movie. Obviously, how much

465
00:26:13,000 --> 00:26:16,199
Speaker 2: value do we place on material things, things that have

466
00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:19,919
Speaker 2: a practical or market value versus things that don't that

467
00:26:19,920 --> 00:26:22,400
Speaker 2: you can't actually put a price tag on. What does

468
00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:25,879
Speaker 2: it say about about how we then value ourselves? And

469
00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:28,520
Speaker 2: this all ties together what Lucy keeps saying, which is

470
00:26:28,520 --> 00:26:30,679
Speaker 2: that it's all math, right, And I'm gonna come back

471
00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:32,720
Speaker 2: to this maybe here a little bit later too, But

472
00:26:33,080 --> 00:26:35,119
Speaker 2: this this idea that what she does is really just

473
00:26:35,160 --> 00:26:37,880
Speaker 2: all math. You know that there there isn't there isn't

474
00:26:37,920 --> 00:26:41,400
Speaker 2: some alchemy, really, that it's all just about checking boxes.

475
00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:43,439
Speaker 2: She keeps saying over and over again that you know,

476
00:26:43,960 --> 00:26:47,800
Speaker 2: you checked several boxes, so of course they ended up together.

477
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:50,560
Speaker 2: It's all a really interesting idea, I think, to explore

478
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:53,280
Speaker 2: in a movie. But Josh, how many times in this

479
00:26:53,359 --> 00:26:57,159
Speaker 2: movie does a character keep bringing up the idea of

480
00:26:57,160 --> 00:26:59,520
Speaker 2: what they're worth and even keep using the same phrases

481
00:26:59,560 --> 00:27:01,760
Speaker 2: over and over again. There's actually there's actually a part

482
00:27:01,760 --> 00:27:04,800
Speaker 2: in the movie where Evans near the end says, do

483
00:27:04,840 --> 00:27:07,720
Speaker 2: you think I'm that disposable? And I loved it. I

484
00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:09,879
Speaker 2: was about ready to stand up and cheer. I loved

485
00:27:09,920 --> 00:27:13,200
Speaker 2: the phrase. It was such a perfect evocation of this idea.

486
00:27:13,920 --> 00:27:15,840
Speaker 2: And then he says, is that all I'm worth to you,

487
00:27:15,920 --> 00:27:18,840
Speaker 2: and I thought, just just put the pen down. You know,

488
00:27:18,920 --> 00:27:21,000
Speaker 2: it's such a it was such a great line on

489
00:27:21,040 --> 00:27:23,159
Speaker 2: its own. There was a bit for me, there was

490
00:27:23,240 --> 00:27:26,159
Speaker 2: there was overwriting with this film following a movie with

491
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:28,280
Speaker 2: Past Lives that I felt was just you know, it

492
00:27:28,880 --> 00:27:32,480
Speaker 2: just had so much, so much great use of space.

493
00:27:33,200 --> 00:27:36,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think in comparison to Past Lives that is true,

494
00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:39,320
Speaker 1: though as you just pointed out, there are some great

495
00:27:39,359 --> 00:27:42,000
Speaker 1: lines here as well. Yes, so it might just be

496
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:44,639
Speaker 1: a point of emphasis, especially for you. I mean I

497
00:27:44,720 --> 00:27:46,679
Speaker 1: found that scene that's that's one of the ones I

498
00:27:46,720 --> 00:27:49,280
Speaker 1: cited with one of the supporting actors who I thought

499
00:27:49,280 --> 00:27:51,840
Speaker 1: was so good, Louisa Jacobson as that bride and the

500
00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:55,840
Speaker 1: line you know, she's asked what makes you most happy

501
00:27:55,880 --> 00:27:59,280
Speaker 1: about your husband? And she says something about that her

502
00:27:59,320 --> 00:28:01,800
Speaker 1: sister's jealous that I have. Yes, that is why she

503
00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:04,800
Speaker 1: would marry him. And I think the phrase she says

504
00:28:04,880 --> 00:28:07,600
Speaker 1: is like that makes me feel like I've won. And

505
00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:10,320
Speaker 1: this gets back to like your Woody Allen thing about

506
00:28:10,359 --> 00:28:14,919
Speaker 1: the complications and the messiness and the cynicism. This is

507
00:28:14,960 --> 00:28:18,600
Speaker 1: where there is some of Allan's cimicism in Materialists, and

508
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:21,960
Speaker 1: I think that is to its credit. I do want

509
00:28:21,960 --> 00:28:25,520
Speaker 1: to say that one thing I appreciated that song brings

510
00:28:25,560 --> 00:28:29,879
Speaker 1: over from Past Lives is and this has something to

511
00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:35,160
Speaker 1: do with the spaces you're describing for contemplation. Yes, there's

512
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:37,119
Speaker 1: not nearly as much of that here as there is

513
00:28:37,160 --> 00:28:42,920
Speaker 1: in Past Lives, but she does find some moments to

514
00:28:43,080 --> 00:28:47,000
Speaker 1: give us that, and the camera work is part of it.

515
00:28:47,040 --> 00:28:51,200
Speaker 1: Here she's working with Schabier Kirchner again from Past Lives,

516
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:55,040
Speaker 1: and there's a very there's a softness to the cinematography

517
00:28:55,080 --> 00:28:58,000
Speaker 1: and also an unhurried camera I think to many of

518
00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:01,960
Speaker 1: the scenes that I found to be contemplative compared to

519
00:29:02,040 --> 00:29:05,479
Speaker 1: what here's another rom com expectation. Rom Coms move very fast,

520
00:29:05,760 --> 00:29:11,320
Speaker 1: right very fast, and here even the montages of Harry

521
00:29:12,000 --> 00:29:15,680
Speaker 1: as Richard gear in Pretty Woman, those aren't hurried. Those

522
00:29:15,680 --> 00:29:19,560
Speaker 1: aren't fast. It's we're able to sit with them quietly

523
00:29:19,720 --> 00:29:23,920
Speaker 1: in these gorgeous soft and yes, maybe it's all a

524
00:29:24,000 --> 00:29:27,600
Speaker 1: play on the same idea that he's spoiling her, but

525
00:29:27,680 --> 00:29:29,400
Speaker 1: I think there's a lot of back and forth between

526
00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:32,080
Speaker 1: them in those scenes too, exactly what are we doing here?

527
00:29:32,240 --> 00:29:35,280
Speaker 1: What do you want? What are you looking for? Both

528
00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:37,800
Speaker 1: of them are realists and cynics, to the point that

529
00:29:38,520 --> 00:29:41,080
Speaker 1: at the end of the day they both understand I

530
00:29:41,120 --> 00:29:44,480
Speaker 1: think his wealth is not going to seal the deal,

531
00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:47,600
Speaker 1: so what else is going on here? And I think

532
00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:51,000
Speaker 1: in moments like that, even the camera work allows us

533
00:29:51,040 --> 00:29:54,280
Speaker 1: to sit and think about those questions in a way

534
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:57,280
Speaker 1: that is more complicated and more patient then you'd get

535
00:29:57,320 --> 00:29:59,480
Speaker 1: in a traditional rom com and more in tune with

536
00:29:59,520 --> 00:30:01,080
Speaker 1: something that we get in past lives.

537
00:30:01,280 --> 00:30:04,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that's fair and I noticed it as well,

538
00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:09,000
Speaker 2: especially in that conversation scene between them where she kind

539
00:30:09,040 --> 00:30:12,680
Speaker 2: of lays out her philosophy and he counters that. And

540
00:30:13,560 --> 00:30:18,320
Speaker 2: the camera is a single shot, a long shot, right.

541
00:30:18,400 --> 00:30:20,640
Speaker 2: We see their whole bodies, We see the table, we

542
00:30:20,680 --> 00:30:24,200
Speaker 2: see the chef's cooking in the kitchen. It's very elegant,

543
00:30:24,240 --> 00:30:26,360
Speaker 2: it is very soft, it's beautiful to look at. It

544
00:30:26,440 --> 00:30:29,440
Speaker 2: matters that we see that entire space and we see

545
00:30:29,760 --> 00:30:32,680
Speaker 2: them existing in that space. And I felt all of

546
00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:34,880
Speaker 2: that and everything you said watching it, And then there

547
00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:36,680
Speaker 2: was also a part of me, Josh, I have to

548
00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:39,200
Speaker 2: admit there was a part of me, a small part

549
00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:42,880
Speaker 2: of me, that also felt a little bit like it

550
00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:49,920
Speaker 2: was giving Pascal's character short shrift because songs withholding from

551
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:53,520
Speaker 2: him in a way, right as a viewer, the close up,

552
00:30:54,000 --> 00:30:57,640
Speaker 2: the fact that we don't ever get to see him fully,

553
00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:02,560
Speaker 2: you know, use everything in his toolbox on her felt

554
00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:05,880
Speaker 2: like something that we missed out on. Now she uses

555
00:31:06,000 --> 00:31:08,239
Speaker 2: she only uses a close up, as I recall, with

556
00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:11,720
Speaker 2: one of those men later in the film. It's a

557
00:31:11,760 --> 00:31:14,360
Speaker 2: scene with Chris Evans and her in one of the

558
00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:17,160
Speaker 2: big scenes near the end of the movie, and it's

559
00:31:17,200 --> 00:31:20,240
Speaker 2: actually a very it's a very clunky cut, and it's

560
00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:24,720
Speaker 2: completely ineffective, and the movie functions so much better when

561
00:31:24,720 --> 00:31:27,720
Speaker 2: she allows those characters to just be both in the

562
00:31:27,720 --> 00:31:30,760
Speaker 2: frame together. That's my sense anyway.

563
00:31:30,880 --> 00:31:33,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm trying to remember if if Pascal gets any

564
00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:37,000
Speaker 1: close ups in that opening wedding meeting scene. There may

565
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:40,120
Speaker 1: be one or two there, But yeah, and the other

566
00:31:40,440 --> 00:31:42,239
Speaker 1: moment we haven't touched on. But I do think as

567
00:31:42,280 --> 00:31:45,760
Speaker 1: key as as far as the John relationship goes, we

568
00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:51,520
Speaker 1: do get an instructive flashback moment. Now maybe too Lucy

569
00:31:51,560 --> 00:31:54,680
Speaker 1: and John's previous relationship. Now, maybe you could say that's

570
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:58,320
Speaker 1: short cutting because it's not a motif where we get

571
00:31:58,360 --> 00:32:00,160
Speaker 1: more of these later, right, I think it's my a

572
00:32:00,160 --> 00:32:04,440
Speaker 1: standalone flashback. I believe this I'm misremembering, but I did

573
00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:08,520
Speaker 1: think it was quite effective in deepening his character and

574
00:32:08,600 --> 00:32:11,480
Speaker 1: chipping away at the type, you know, the poor guy

575
00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:13,160
Speaker 1: romantic type that he's playing.

576
00:32:13,560 --> 00:32:16,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, I did want to bring this up. I said,

577
00:32:16,440 --> 00:32:18,680
Speaker 2: I was gonna maybe come back to this idea. Of course,

578
00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:20,200
Speaker 2: this wasn't in my mind at all as I was

579
00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:22,360
Speaker 2: watching the movie, or even as I left the theater,

580
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:25,440
Speaker 2: because I hadn't yet seen the Life of Chuck. We're

581
00:32:25,440 --> 00:32:28,200
Speaker 2: going to talk about that movie a little bit later.

582
00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:32,760
Speaker 2: And sometimes this happens, right we see two movies. It

583
00:32:32,880 --> 00:32:35,120
Speaker 2: sort of randomly happens that two movies open at the

584
00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:37,959
Speaker 2: same time, and there's a connection between them. And it

585
00:32:38,000 --> 00:32:40,120
Speaker 2: only occurred to me as I was preparing for our

586
00:32:40,160 --> 00:32:48,160
Speaker 2: conversation today. All this talk in materialists about math. She

587
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:50,760
Speaker 2: brings it up over and over again. The math, the math, math,

588
00:32:50,800 --> 00:32:53,600
Speaker 2: it's all math. Love is just checking the boxes if

589
00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:57,640
Speaker 2: the math works out. The Life of Chuck being an accountant,

590
00:32:58,600 --> 00:33:01,200
Speaker 2: the grandfather character will tell talk about it near the

591
00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:03,240
Speaker 2: end of the film. A great deal of attention is

592
00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:06,360
Speaker 2: paid to this idea of math, and I'm not spoiling anything,

593
00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:09,120
Speaker 2: Nor am I sort of jumping ahead of our conversation.

594
00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:11,800
Speaker 2: I'm just making this connection here. A character in that

595
00:33:11,840 --> 00:33:13,840
Speaker 2: film says, math is truth. It won't lie to you,

596
00:33:13,920 --> 00:33:16,560
Speaker 2: it doesn't factor in your preferences. It's pure that way

597
00:33:16,640 --> 00:33:22,640
Speaker 2: math can be art. So obviously that direct parallel to materialists.

598
00:33:23,080 --> 00:33:26,280
Speaker 2: But what strikes me, and I'm just curious whether or

599
00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:28,800
Speaker 2: not you see what I'm saying here or am I

600
00:33:28,960 --> 00:33:34,840
Speaker 2: just overcomplicating something. She keeps saying that matchmaking and love

601
00:33:34,960 --> 00:33:38,040
Speaker 2: is just math math math? And my question then is,

602
00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:40,840
Speaker 2: so why is she good at her job? Why do

603
00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:44,680
Speaker 2: you even need a matchmaker? Then why doesn't the movie acknowledge, actually,

604
00:33:44,960 --> 00:33:47,400
Speaker 2: like the Life of Chuck does, that math is math,

605
00:33:47,560 --> 00:33:52,080
Speaker 2: but math can also actually be art. If math is

606
00:33:52,120 --> 00:33:54,800
Speaker 2: just math and love is just math, then why not

607
00:33:54,920 --> 00:33:57,239
Speaker 2: just have an algorithm do it? Why not have the

608
00:33:57,280 --> 00:34:01,320
Speaker 2: computer literally just check the boxes and connect people. I

609
00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:05,600
Speaker 2: saw Hollywood Reporter headline for this movie where a matchmaker

610
00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:10,239
Speaker 2: was praising the movie for how it portrays the profession,

611
00:34:10,640 --> 00:34:12,759
Speaker 2: and I was kind of confused. Josh, Actually, I mean

612
00:34:12,760 --> 00:34:15,239
Speaker 2: I get it, but also I was confused because I

613
00:34:15,239 --> 00:34:18,000
Speaker 2: think the movie is a very confused portrayal at minimum,

614
00:34:18,000 --> 00:34:21,560
Speaker 2: because the movie says, or it seems to suggest that

615
00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:23,960
Speaker 2: you need a human being, that she's really great at

616
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:28,160
Speaker 2: her job, and people like this who care. But then

617
00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:32,560
Speaker 2: the character the human being who's the matchmaker says, basically,

618
00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:34,560
Speaker 2: a machine can do it. It's all just math. Why

619
00:34:34,600 --> 00:34:36,719
Speaker 2: does the movie allow for the art of it.

620
00:34:37,280 --> 00:34:41,799
Speaker 1: I didn't see that gap between her respect for her

621
00:34:41,960 --> 00:34:47,759
Speaker 1: job and the idea of math. I did understand that

622
00:34:47,800 --> 00:34:51,120
Speaker 1: she felt to be able to articulate it to it.

623
00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:54,319
Speaker 2: She never articulates that to anyone else, though. When she

624
00:34:54,400 --> 00:34:56,480
Speaker 2: talks about her job and what she does mean, she

625
00:34:56,680 --> 00:34:59,239
Speaker 2: only frames it in terms of I read that six

626
00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:01,200
Speaker 2: foot tall, two hundred thousands.

627
00:35:01,719 --> 00:35:05,760
Speaker 1: I know that has heard, you know, down plane her contributions,

628
00:35:05,800 --> 00:35:10,080
Speaker 1: because those were like humble brags to me. She's being

629
00:35:10,160 --> 00:35:12,680
Speaker 1: celebrated at the start of the film for what nine

630
00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:16,680
Speaker 1: weddings she's responsible for. She's presented as the star of

631
00:35:16,719 --> 00:35:20,040
Speaker 1: this industry, and that suggests that there is some art

632
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:22,440
Speaker 1: to it. That you can't just hire someone, plug them in,

633
00:35:22,520 --> 00:35:25,480
Speaker 1: give them the profiles, and they'll add up to get

634
00:35:25,480 --> 00:35:29,040
Speaker 1: the right equation. I always just assumed that it's accepted

635
00:35:29,120 --> 00:35:32,959
Speaker 1: she's the artist of this of this realm, and when

636
00:35:32,960 --> 00:35:35,600
Speaker 1: she was denying that, I felt it was like, you know,

637
00:35:36,120 --> 00:35:38,200
Speaker 1: kind of like it's accepted. You know, I'm good. I

638
00:35:38,239 --> 00:35:41,319
Speaker 1: know I'm good. Just let's not let's not talk about it.

639
00:35:41,719 --> 00:35:45,239
Speaker 1: And and that is where to me, the romanticism is

640
00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:49,279
Speaker 1: still there in the movie, because ultimately it pushes back

641
00:35:49,600 --> 00:35:52,319
Speaker 1: on the math idea, even if she's the one, even

642
00:35:52,360 --> 00:35:54,840
Speaker 1: if she's the one who's constantly touting.

643
00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:59,440
Speaker 2: But that's like the movie ultimately rejects the idea that

644
00:35:59,520 --> 00:36:03,000
Speaker 2: it's all, so she has to hold that idea for

645
00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:04,040
Speaker 2: the movie to reject it.

646
00:36:04,480 --> 00:36:06,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think I think she she has to

647
00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:08,880
Speaker 1: come to that realization if there's you know, and I've

648
00:36:08,920 --> 00:36:11,320
Speaker 1: already I don't think there's much of an interior journey

649
00:36:11,400 --> 00:36:15,040
Speaker 1: for this character. But if there is one, I think

650
00:36:15,080 --> 00:36:18,719
Speaker 1: it's that it's it's the realizing that, you know, there

651
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:21,080
Speaker 1: is more to the math, which is something she kind

652
00:36:21,120 --> 00:36:25,200
Speaker 1: of already knows, doesn't want to admit, and has to

653
00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:30,279
Speaker 1: at the end if she wants to pursue what she

654
00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:31,799
Speaker 1: thinks will make her happy. Yeah.

655
00:36:31,800 --> 00:36:36,040
Speaker 2: For me, it's it's just emblematic of a character who

656
00:36:36,120 --> 00:36:39,720
Speaker 2: for me overall is a little bit Confused from the beginning.

657
00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:43,959
Speaker 2: Materialists is currently playing in wide release. If you see

658
00:36:43,960 --> 00:36:46,040
Speaker 2: it and agree or disagree with our takes, you can

659
00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:48,520
Speaker 2: email us feedback at film spotting dot net.

660
00:36:49,360 --> 00:36:51,360
Speaker 1: Listening is the number one thing you can do to

661
00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:55,000
Speaker 1: support an independently produced show like ours. A couple more

662
00:36:55,040 --> 00:36:56,840
Speaker 1: things you can do. Take a minute to give us

663
00:36:56,840 --> 00:36:59,759
Speaker 1: a rating or a review on Apple Podcasts or Spotify.

664
00:37:00,160 --> 00:37:02,080
Speaker 1: Doesn't matter if you're a first time listener or you've

665
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:05,400
Speaker 1: been listening for twenty years. Every new review helps us

666
00:37:05,440 --> 00:37:09,440
Speaker 1: reach new listeners. We want to say thanks to Nahal

667
00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:14,400
Speaker 1: VK for his recent review on Apple Podcasts. Here's Nihal.

668
00:37:14,840 --> 00:37:16,919
Speaker 1: I was a film student years back, but life took

669
00:37:16,960 --> 00:37:19,239
Speaker 1: me on a different track. Listening to the show has

670
00:37:19,280 --> 00:37:21,200
Speaker 1: brought me back on track, as the show is a

671
00:37:21,239 --> 00:37:24,319
Speaker 1: guiding light on what interesting films are out and worth

672
00:37:24,360 --> 00:37:26,799
Speaker 1: the time investment. So thanks to both of you, I

673
00:37:26,880 --> 00:37:29,279
Speaker 1: have lit up my movie passion once again and I'm

674
00:37:29,320 --> 00:37:33,040
Speaker 1: always looking for the next film to enjoy after listening

675
00:37:33,120 --> 00:37:34,680
Speaker 1: to your fabulous lists.

676
00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:37,960
Speaker 2: Thank you very much, Nahal. This is also the spot

677
00:37:38,000 --> 00:37:41,400
Speaker 2: where we typically feature a member of the film Spotting family,

678
00:37:41,400 --> 00:37:43,920
Speaker 2: but Josh, as we have been over the past few weeks,

679
00:37:43,960 --> 00:37:48,160
Speaker 2: we're highlighting some of those twentieth anniversary messages that have

680
00:37:48,280 --> 00:37:51,600
Speaker 2: come in from Film Spotting listeners. We're going to share

681
00:37:51,640 --> 00:37:55,359
Speaker 2: a few more over the next several weeks, and we

682
00:37:55,760 --> 00:37:58,799
Speaker 2: offered a few different prompts like my favorite show memory is,

683
00:37:59,160 --> 00:38:01,919
Speaker 2: or the thing I value about film Spotting, or maybe

684
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:04,520
Speaker 2: if you wanted to get really high falutint film Spotting

685
00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:07,280
Speaker 2: kind of changed my life when or of course, listeners

686
00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:10,799
Speaker 2: could just start it however they wanted to and take

687
00:38:10,840 --> 00:38:13,920
Speaker 2: it wherever they wanted to go. We've got a couple

688
00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:18,760
Speaker 2: here from longtime listeners and friends of the show, Devin

689
00:38:19,200 --> 00:38:19,800
Speaker 2: and Amy.

690
00:38:19,960 --> 00:38:21,880
Speaker 4: Hi, I am Sam and Josh. This is Devin and

691
00:38:22,040 --> 00:38:24,960
Speaker 4: Long Island City, Queens, New York. Just wanted to say

692
00:38:24,960 --> 00:38:28,400
Speaker 4: congratulations on twenty years of podcasting. You've been my go

693
00:38:28,440 --> 00:38:32,160
Speaker 4: to podcasts since twenty eleven and I just want to

694
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:35,839
Speaker 4: thank you for bringing me insightful analysis, some very good

695
00:38:35,880 --> 00:38:40,680
Speaker 4: friends here in New York, and of course constant creative inspiration.

696
00:38:41,120 --> 00:38:43,120
Speaker 4: Here's to twenty more years, guys, Hey.

697
00:38:42,960 --> 00:38:46,080
Speaker 5: Film Spotting. Ames Sullivan here, I've been listening to the

698
00:38:46,160 --> 00:38:49,719
Speaker 5: podcast since Adam first started talking about brick On. Just

699
00:38:49,800 --> 00:38:53,800
Speaker 5: about every episode from the first podcast, I've been struck

700
00:38:53,880 --> 00:38:55,880
Speaker 5: by how the hosts seemed to be including me in

701
00:38:55,880 --> 00:38:58,879
Speaker 5: their conversation. It didn't matter that I didn't know much

702
00:38:58,920 --> 00:39:01,400
Speaker 5: about movies. They just wanted to welcome me into what

703
00:39:01,520 --> 00:39:05,520
Speaker 5: eventually they called the film spawning family and film Spotting

704
00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:08,760
Speaker 5: really is an extension of my family. When I encouraged

705
00:39:08,840 --> 00:39:11,360
Speaker 5: Kat to applied for the PA job, I felt like

706
00:39:11,440 --> 00:39:13,879
Speaker 5: I was sending her to ask a favor of two

707
00:39:14,000 --> 00:39:17,320
Speaker 5: Chicago uncles she didn't know she had. She was worried

708
00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:20,400
Speaker 5: she didn't know enough about movies, but quickly learned that

709
00:39:20,480 --> 00:39:24,200
Speaker 5: at film Spotting it's all about that shared enthusiasm and

710
00:39:24,280 --> 00:39:28,680
Speaker 5: great conversations. For me, trivia Spotting is where I feel

711
00:39:28,680 --> 00:39:32,400
Speaker 5: that sense of family the most. From those quiet, introverted

712
00:39:32,480 --> 00:39:35,880
Speaker 5: newbies to the trivias evants to those of us with

713
00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:40,200
Speaker 5: randomly niche knowledge, everyone gets greeted with that warm welcome,

714
00:39:40,280 --> 00:39:43,440
Speaker 5: like we've known each other forever. I guess my favorite

715
00:39:43,440 --> 00:39:46,160
Speaker 5: thing is that when you listen to film Spotting, your

716
00:39:46,239 --> 00:39:51,160
Speaker 5: family happy twentieth anniversary Film Spotting from the movie Mom.

717
00:39:51,600 --> 00:39:55,360
Speaker 2: Both family members and Devin is someone who I recently

718
00:39:55,400 --> 00:39:58,680
Speaker 2: saw part of that new York Mafia, who I was

719
00:39:58,680 --> 00:40:01,360
Speaker 2: able to catch up with on my recent trip into

720
00:40:01,440 --> 00:40:04,520
Speaker 2: New York City and have a drink with. Also, just

721
00:40:04,560 --> 00:40:07,840
Speaker 2: a big thanks to Devin. We haven't shared these yet

722
00:40:08,320 --> 00:40:11,000
Speaker 2: because we've just been too busy behind the scenes, but

723
00:40:11,160 --> 00:40:13,880
Speaker 2: at some point, not only have we been sharing a

724
00:40:13,920 --> 00:40:16,640
Speaker 2: lot of the audio over the past several months from

725
00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:21,520
Speaker 2: Film Spotting Fest, Devin was part of the video crew

726
00:40:21,560 --> 00:40:24,480
Speaker 2: and he was really volunteer. He just loves the show

727
00:40:24,520 --> 00:40:28,120
Speaker 2: and he's got the production skills and background. He offered

728
00:40:28,120 --> 00:40:31,319
Speaker 2: to help and he brought his camera. We have the

729
00:40:31,520 --> 00:40:36,719
Speaker 2: Koganata conversation, the Ryan Johnson conversation. Actually I think there

730
00:40:36,800 --> 00:40:40,360
Speaker 2: was Devon's camera at least for maybe all the Q

731
00:40:40,480 --> 00:40:44,160
Speaker 2: and as. So I don't know exactly yet what we're

732
00:40:44,160 --> 00:40:46,799
Speaker 2: going to show, but at least Ryan and Koganata we're

733
00:40:46,800 --> 00:40:49,080
Speaker 2: going to put at some point on the Film Spotting YouTube,

734
00:40:49,360 --> 00:40:52,040
Speaker 2: and Devin's a big reason why that's going to happen.

735
00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:54,759
Speaker 2: So thank you, Devin. And then the movie Mom josh

736
00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:56,600
Speaker 2: Amy Sullivan as we call her, who was such a

737
00:40:56,640 --> 00:41:00,239
Speaker 2: treat to have on Trivia Spotting all that time. I'm

738
00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:03,880
Speaker 2: and also the movie Mom because she's Cats Mom, and

739
00:41:03,960 --> 00:41:08,600
Speaker 2: Kat's a long time pa. So such kind words from Amy,

740
00:41:08,640 --> 00:41:08,959
Speaker 2: and it's.

741
00:41:08,840 --> 00:41:10,359
Speaker 1: Always thank you for sharing that.

742
00:41:11,160 --> 00:41:13,759
Speaker 2: In addition to keeping us doing what we're doing, your

743
00:41:13,840 --> 00:41:16,920
Speaker 2: support comes with perks. If you remember the film Spotting Family,

744
00:41:16,960 --> 00:41:18,919
Speaker 2: you get to listen early in ad free, you get

745
00:41:18,920 --> 00:41:23,919
Speaker 2: our weekly newsletter, and you get exclusive opportunities, including checking

746
00:41:23,960 --> 00:41:27,160
Speaker 2: out the film Spotting Family discord, and you get to

747
00:41:27,200 --> 00:41:30,200
Speaker 2: hear monthly bonus shows. Right after we get done taping

748
00:41:30,280 --> 00:41:33,960
Speaker 2: this episode, we are going to record our June Bonus,

749
00:41:34,000 --> 00:41:36,920
Speaker 2: which is our performances of the year so far. Now,

750
00:41:36,920 --> 00:41:39,080
Speaker 2: we did agree we were going to be fairly loose

751
00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:43,400
Speaker 2: about this, maybe not structured lists per se. But you

752
00:41:43,440 --> 00:41:45,399
Speaker 2: want to give me a hint. How did you come

753
00:41:45,400 --> 00:41:45,640
Speaker 2: at it?

754
00:41:45,719 --> 00:41:48,480
Speaker 1: Josh, Yeah, it's just, you know, going back to this

755
00:41:48,600 --> 00:41:51,680
Speaker 1: ongoing list. I keep I start January one every year,

756
00:41:51,880 --> 00:41:54,160
Speaker 1: and if there's a performance that jumps out at me,

757
00:41:54,480 --> 00:41:57,160
Speaker 1: I just make a little note, put that person's name

758
00:41:57,239 --> 00:42:01,040
Speaker 1: down in the categories, and we'll be sharing. At least

759
00:42:01,080 --> 00:42:03,520
Speaker 1: I'll be sharing a couple of those. I think some

760
00:42:03,719 --> 00:42:07,359
Speaker 1: people will not be surprised by because we've gushed over

761
00:42:07,400 --> 00:42:10,000
Speaker 1: these performances and shared reviews. But I have a couple

762
00:42:10,239 --> 00:42:11,520
Speaker 1: smaller choices as well.

763
00:42:12,280 --> 00:42:17,400
Speaker 2: My ritual annually is every year in January, I say

764
00:42:17,600 --> 00:42:19,920
Speaker 2: I'm going to start that list, and then I actually

765
00:42:20,040 --> 00:42:22,480
Speaker 2: start that list. I put all the categories on it

766
00:42:23,360 --> 00:42:25,760
Speaker 2: on a little notepad, and then I start seeing movies

767
00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:29,160
Speaker 2: and I never write any down, and then it's time

768
00:42:29,400 --> 00:42:31,360
Speaker 2: to do the end of year thing and I'm starting

769
00:42:31,360 --> 00:42:32,560
Speaker 2: from scratch. Every time.

770
00:42:32,880 --> 00:42:35,319
Speaker 1: It's awesome. It's so much good. It feels good to

771
00:42:35,360 --> 00:42:38,560
Speaker 1: create the document. But it requires a little more than that.

772
00:42:38,560 --> 00:42:39,000
Speaker 1: That's right.

773
00:42:39,160 --> 00:42:42,279
Speaker 2: Film spotting Family dot Com is where you can learn more.

774
00:42:44,239 --> 00:42:45,840
Speaker 1: This is Elliot Planet Earth.

775
00:42:47,320 --> 00:42:49,840
Speaker 3: All I ever wanted was to find a place to

776
00:42:49,880 --> 00:42:53,960
Speaker 3: fit in. So is there any aliens listening?

777
00:42:54,040 --> 00:42:58,400
Speaker 2: Please come get me here. That's from the trailer for

778
00:42:58,680 --> 00:43:01,280
Speaker 2: Pixar's l e O, which is new in theaters. Eleo

779
00:43:01,520 --> 00:43:05,600
Speaker 2: is a space obsess loaner whose extraterrestrial transmission is received,

780
00:43:05,640 --> 00:43:09,440
Speaker 2: sending him on an intergalactic adventure. Josh Ello is co

781
00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:13,400
Speaker 2: directed by Domi She who made Pixar's very good Turning Red.

782
00:43:13,840 --> 00:43:17,000
Speaker 2: Is Elo any good? And please tell me for town

783
00:43:17,040 --> 00:43:17,720
Speaker 2: makes a cameo?

784
00:43:18,120 --> 00:43:21,960
Speaker 1: Oh wow? I mean that would be amazing, except that

785
00:43:22,080 --> 00:43:26,279
Speaker 1: this movie probably has too much going on already. I

786
00:43:26,320 --> 00:43:29,880
Speaker 1: did like it. It has a lot of those Pixar

787
00:43:30,000 --> 00:43:33,719
Speaker 1: qualities you look for. There's a nice patience for storytelling,

788
00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:38,560
Speaker 1: especially as this movie begins. It settles into itself quietly

789
00:43:38,600 --> 00:43:41,759
Speaker 1: and calmly, compared to some of the other animated and

790
00:43:41,840 --> 00:43:44,680
Speaker 1: nantich kids films we get these days. Of course, it

791
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:49,319
Speaker 1: has the astonishingly tactile digital animation. I enjoyed the score too,

792
00:43:49,400 --> 00:43:52,680
Speaker 1: by Rob Simonson, so there's some good stuff going on here.

793
00:43:52,719 --> 00:43:56,640
Speaker 1: I did like it, but it is man, it's just

794
00:43:57,040 --> 00:44:01,080
Speaker 1: so packed and works its way, and this might be

795
00:44:01,080 --> 00:44:03,799
Speaker 1: better for you than me. Into like a junior sized

796
00:44:03,840 --> 00:44:06,800
Speaker 1: Guardians of the Galaxy movie. There's just a ton going

797
00:44:06,840 --> 00:44:12,200
Speaker 1: on in terms of interstellar conflict and negotiations. And I

798
00:44:12,320 --> 00:44:16,000
Speaker 1: found that the more characters we got, the more narrative,

799
00:44:16,200 --> 00:44:19,840
Speaker 1: the more the narrative expanded, it was harder to find

800
00:44:19,840 --> 00:44:22,040
Speaker 1: that emotional center that we also look for. And a

801
00:44:22,040 --> 00:44:25,120
Speaker 1: Pixar film, it goes for it, and it might land

802
00:44:25,280 --> 00:44:28,160
Speaker 1: for others more than me. But it didn't quite as

803
00:44:28,239 --> 00:44:31,239
Speaker 1: much as I might have hoped. It's interesting, you know,

804
00:44:31,640 --> 00:44:35,239
Speaker 1: to mention Domichi as one of the directors here. You know,

805
00:44:35,280 --> 00:44:39,440
Speaker 1: I Turning Red is incredible, I think, and that was

806
00:44:40,080 --> 00:44:43,280
Speaker 1: largely you know, she was the only director on that project,

807
00:44:43,280 --> 00:44:45,759
Speaker 1: and here here we have her as well as Madeline

808
00:44:46,160 --> 00:44:51,320
Speaker 1: Sharrafian and Adrian Molina. Molina was a co director of Coco,

809
00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:54,200
Speaker 1: and I know Pixar, you know, films have had multiple

810
00:44:54,200 --> 00:44:56,160
Speaker 1: directors here and there, and it's not to say that

811
00:44:56,200 --> 00:44:58,399
Speaker 1: it doesn't ever work out, but this one you sort

812
00:44:58,440 --> 00:45:01,560
Speaker 1: of feel that maybe just again in terms of the

813
00:45:01,680 --> 00:45:04,800
Speaker 1: scope and what it's trying to do and slightly different

814
00:45:04,840 --> 00:45:08,719
Speaker 1: sensibilities in a given scene. My favorite thing about it though,

815
00:45:08,880 --> 00:45:11,640
Speaker 1: and maybe I'll save this for I will I'll save

816
00:45:11,680 --> 00:45:15,680
Speaker 1: this for our bonus episode for film spotting family members.

817
00:45:15,760 --> 00:45:19,359
Speaker 1: We're doing, as we've mentioned, our performances of the year

818
00:45:19,440 --> 00:45:23,200
Speaker 1: so far, and there is a vocal performance in l

819
00:45:23,239 --> 00:45:26,840
Speaker 1: EO that's just incredible. At this early point, I'll probably

820
00:45:26,880 --> 00:45:29,280
Speaker 1: you know, put it on my list as an honorable

821
00:45:29,280 --> 00:45:31,319
Speaker 1: mention to just remember towards the end of the year,

822
00:45:31,719 --> 00:45:34,839
Speaker 1: and I'll share more on that bonus episode, but it is.

823
00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:37,520
Speaker 1: It is one of the reasons why I would give

824
00:45:37,560 --> 00:45:39,520
Speaker 1: a recommendation to Alio. Okay.

825
00:45:39,640 --> 00:45:42,400
Speaker 2: El EO is out wide. If you see it, and

826
00:45:42,520 --> 00:45:45,760
Speaker 2: have a differing take than Josh, or you agree with Josh.

827
00:45:45,800 --> 00:45:46,399
Speaker 1: That's fine too.

828
00:45:46,440 --> 00:45:49,320
Speaker 2: We'd love to hear from you feedback at Filmspotting dot Net.

829
00:45:49,800 --> 00:45:52,600
Speaker 2: Next week on the show, we'll have a review of

830
00:45:52,719 --> 00:45:58,720
Speaker 2: Danny Boyle's twenty eight Years Later, which also opens this weekend.

831
00:45:58,800 --> 00:46:00,800
Speaker 2: We will share a top five along with that that

832
00:46:00,920 --> 00:46:04,319
Speaker 2: we did back in twenty seventeen with Danny Boyle. I mean,

833
00:46:04,400 --> 00:46:08,680
Speaker 2: he is, after all responsible for the namesake of our show.

834
00:46:09,000 --> 00:46:12,680
Speaker 2: We shared our top five Danny Boyle characters. And you know,

835
00:46:12,680 --> 00:46:15,360
Speaker 2: if it's been long enough for me to forget my picks,

836
00:46:15,480 --> 00:46:18,600
Speaker 2: never mind Danny Boyle's picks, then it's probably worth replying.

837
00:46:18,640 --> 00:46:19,600
Speaker 1: Sure makes sense.

838
00:46:20,000 --> 00:46:23,000
Speaker 2: I looked at the list this morning actually just to

839
00:46:23,080 --> 00:46:28,640
Speaker 2: remind myself, and yeah, I probably remembered one of those choices, Josh.

840
00:46:28,680 --> 00:46:32,960
Speaker 2: So we look forward to resharing that. Where are you at, Josh?

841
00:46:33,040 --> 00:46:38,399
Speaker 2: As far as rewatching twenty eight days later, we all

842
00:46:38,480 --> 00:46:42,160
Speaker 2: recently revisited, or maybe you didn't because you had revisited

843
00:46:42,200 --> 00:46:46,799
Speaker 2: twenty eight weeks later for your book. I revisited that

844
00:46:46,880 --> 00:46:51,000
Speaker 2: for recent film Spotting Family bonus content along with producer

845
00:46:51,040 --> 00:46:54,800
Speaker 2: Sam because we did a we were wrong once bonus show.

846
00:46:54,960 --> 00:46:58,040
Speaker 2: But I haven't seen Twenty eight Days Later, the movie

847
00:46:58,080 --> 00:47:01,120
Speaker 2: that started at all since it came out or shortly after.

848
00:47:01,120 --> 00:47:02,680
Speaker 2: I didn't see it in the theater. I saw it

849
00:47:03,000 --> 00:47:07,279
Speaker 2: on DBD or maybe even VHS if Blockbuster, you know,

850
00:47:07,640 --> 00:47:11,360
Speaker 2: VHS was still a thing then. So it's been probably

851
00:47:11,400 --> 00:47:14,280
Speaker 2: twenty years wow since I've seen that film, and maybe

852
00:47:14,320 --> 00:47:17,520
Speaker 2: it's worth revisiting before I watched the sequel. Here the

853
00:47:17,600 --> 00:47:18,120
Speaker 2: latest scene.

854
00:47:18,160 --> 00:47:21,400
Speaker 1: It's great, it's pretty Both are pretty fresh for me

855
00:47:21,640 --> 00:47:24,600
Speaker 1: because I wanted to rewatch them both for the book

856
00:47:24,640 --> 00:47:27,080
Speaker 1: For fear Not, I have a zombies chapter there, and

857
00:47:27,160 --> 00:47:29,920
Speaker 1: yes I consider these zombie movies. We won't get into that.

858
00:47:30,360 --> 00:47:32,799
Speaker 1: So yeah, I think twenty twenty two maybe is when

859
00:47:32,800 --> 00:47:35,480
Speaker 1: I lassed last watched twenty eight days Later, and then

860
00:47:35,480 --> 00:47:37,840
Speaker 1: weeks would have been around the same time at least.

861
00:47:37,880 --> 00:47:40,600
Speaker 1: So very excited for the new one.

862
00:47:40,680 --> 00:47:42,080
Speaker 2: If you would like to see what we have on

863
00:47:42,160 --> 00:47:45,680
Speaker 2: tap for future episodes, go to filmspotting dot Net and

864
00:47:45,719 --> 00:47:49,359
Speaker 2: click on episodes. We do have that twenty eight years

865
00:47:49,440 --> 00:47:51,520
Speaker 2: Later show coming up, and then our best of the

866
00:47:51,600 --> 00:47:54,520
Speaker 2: year so far. We have a top five Jack Nicholson

867
00:47:54,640 --> 00:47:57,000
Speaker 2: scenes coming up. We're going to revisit One Flew Over

868
00:47:57,040 --> 00:48:01,160
Speaker 2: the Cuckoo's Nest for its anniversary? What anniversary is that

869
00:48:01,440 --> 00:48:06,200
Speaker 2: seventy five? So that makes it seventy, It makes it fifty.

870
00:48:06,320 --> 00:48:07,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's what it is.

871
00:48:07,760 --> 00:48:10,920
Speaker 2: It makes it fifty nineteen seventy five. Yeah, that should

872
00:48:11,000 --> 00:48:13,560
Speaker 2: be pretty easy for me to do, considering I was

873
00:48:13,600 --> 00:48:17,080
Speaker 2: born in nineteen seventy five and I had to carry

874
00:48:17,080 --> 00:48:20,560
Speaker 2: the one there live on air for everyone to hear.

875
00:48:20,760 --> 00:48:24,400
Speaker 2: How how not bright I am? Let's let's just end

876
00:48:24,400 --> 00:48:26,759
Speaker 2: it here. Filmspoting dot net slash episodes.

877
00:48:27,480 --> 00:48:31,880
Speaker 3: So what's the story twenty five words or less? Okay?

878
00:48:33,520 --> 00:48:36,680
Speaker 3: Movie exec calls rider, Writer's girlfriend says, is that the movies.

879
00:48:36,760 --> 00:48:39,319
Speaker 3: Exec goes to the movies, meets Rider, drinks with writer,

880
00:48:39,560 --> 00:48:42,480
Speaker 3: Writer gets comped and dies in four inches of dirty water.

881
00:48:43,239 --> 00:48:47,359
Speaker 3: Movie exec is in deep shit? What do you think

882
00:48:48,800 --> 00:48:51,360
Speaker 3: that's born? In twenty five words? And it's bullshit.

883
00:48:51,800 --> 00:48:55,480
Speaker 1: That's Tim Robbins and Fred Ward in nineteen ninety Two's

884
00:48:56,120 --> 00:48:59,319
Speaker 1: the Player? So The Player is going to be part

885
00:48:59,360 --> 00:49:02,480
Speaker 1: of the Robert Altman Centennial that's ongoing this summer over

886
00:49:02,520 --> 00:49:06,239
Speaker 1: at the Gene Cisco Film Center here in Chicago, and

887
00:49:06,960 --> 00:49:09,440
Speaker 1: as part of that. Coinciding with that, The Player is

888
00:49:09,480 --> 00:49:13,759
Speaker 1: also going to be our title for Cinema interrupt Us,

889
00:49:13,880 --> 00:49:16,600
Speaker 1: which I'm doing again at the Cisco Film Center. Really

890
00:49:16,640 --> 00:49:20,480
Speaker 1: thrilled after doing Phantom Thread in the winter at the

891
00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:22,640
Speaker 1: ciscle to be teaming up with them again for this,

892
00:49:22,840 --> 00:49:25,880
Speaker 1: and we were talking about titles Adam that might work.

893
00:49:26,000 --> 00:49:28,800
Speaker 1: Looking at their summer schedule, we kind of pinpointed August

894
00:49:28,880 --> 00:49:30,920
Speaker 1: as the time to do this, and I saw they

895
00:49:30,960 --> 00:49:34,400
Speaker 1: had this Altman centennial and thought, what if we just

896
00:49:34,480 --> 00:49:37,239
Speaker 1: kind of piggyback on that. People will be thinking about

897
00:49:37,239 --> 00:49:39,800
Speaker 1: Altman watching a bunch of his movies over the summer,

898
00:49:39,800 --> 00:49:43,640
Speaker 1: and maybe towards the end we will spend four days

899
00:49:43,719 --> 00:49:46,839
Speaker 1: as interrupt Us is watching a day one, digging into

900
00:49:46,880 --> 00:49:49,520
Speaker 1: it scene by seeing anyone can interrupt ask a question

901
00:49:49,560 --> 00:49:51,640
Speaker 1: at any time over the next three days. Let's do

902
00:49:51,719 --> 00:49:54,759
Speaker 1: that with the Player. And I have since watched it.

903
00:49:54,760 --> 00:49:57,000
Speaker 1: It's totally gonna work. It's going to be so much fun,

904
00:49:57,560 --> 00:49:59,880
Speaker 1: not just the cameos and the movie references, but that

905
00:50:00,120 --> 00:50:02,959
Speaker 1: opening single take. I forget how many minutes it is now,

906
00:50:03,239 --> 00:50:06,120
Speaker 1: but a lot of filmmaking stuff to dig into. Is

907
00:50:06,160 --> 00:50:09,480
Speaker 1: the Player one you've seen since it came out at him,

908
00:50:09,560 --> 00:50:11,319
Speaker 1: or do you think it's for me? It was. This

909
00:50:11,440 --> 00:50:13,200
Speaker 1: was the first time I'd watched it since ninety two.

910
00:50:13,719 --> 00:50:17,120
Speaker 2: Well, you again, were a better cinephile than me, or

911
00:50:17,200 --> 00:50:21,120
Speaker 2: you started earlier in me, because I, in ninety two

912
00:50:21,760 --> 00:50:24,960
Speaker 2: was not seeing movies like The Player in the theater.

913
00:50:25,320 --> 00:50:29,960
Speaker 2: They were not playing in my hometown in nineteen ninety two,

914
00:50:29,960 --> 00:50:32,360
Speaker 2: and I wasn't ready for movies like that in nineteen

915
00:50:32,400 --> 00:50:35,680
Speaker 2: ninety two. I still needed maybe about two years before

916
00:50:35,760 --> 00:50:38,520
Speaker 2: I was digging into the films of Robert Altman. So

917
00:50:38,560 --> 00:50:41,600
Speaker 2: I was watching The Player on VHS, you know, I

918
00:50:41,680 --> 00:50:44,520
Speaker 2: was driving tojoin and having to go to like the

919
00:50:45,040 --> 00:50:48,600
Speaker 2: Art House Video store to rent movies like The Player

920
00:50:48,680 --> 00:50:50,880
Speaker 2: and watching them on my TV at home. And so

921
00:50:51,000 --> 00:50:53,760
Speaker 2: it was ninety four ninety five before I saw The Player,

922
00:50:53,800 --> 00:50:56,320
Speaker 2: and of course loved it. And when I was watching

923
00:50:56,360 --> 00:50:59,160
Speaker 2: a movie like that, I understood. I kind of just

924
00:50:59,200 --> 00:51:02,360
Speaker 2: got instinctively that they were up to something with a

925
00:51:02,480 --> 00:51:06,920
Speaker 2: movie reference talking about Wells with that opening take. But

926
00:51:06,920 --> 00:51:09,320
Speaker 2: but I didn't I hadn't seen Touch of You. I

927
00:51:09,360 --> 00:51:11,759
Speaker 2: wouldn't have known the reference right, and that that of

928
00:51:11,760 --> 00:51:15,239
Speaker 2: course sends you down the rack you watch such Yeah.

929
00:51:15,400 --> 00:51:18,120
Speaker 1: Yeah, for me, it was probably like my introduction to Altman,

930
00:51:18,400 --> 00:51:21,160
Speaker 1: like had obviously heard of the name, this would have

931
00:51:21,160 --> 00:51:23,160
Speaker 1: been because it was such it put him back on

932
00:51:23,200 --> 00:51:25,799
Speaker 1: the map essentially, right. It was like, this is a

933
00:51:25,840 --> 00:51:29,040
Speaker 1: major filmmaker who's made you know, after you know, being

934
00:51:29,080 --> 00:51:32,520
Speaker 1: somewhat gone for a while, still working, but not in

935
00:51:32,520 --> 00:51:36,319
Speaker 1: the level of you know, attention. Now he's back, and

936
00:51:36,400 --> 00:51:39,839
Speaker 1: so I certainly glombed onto that and started to think

937
00:51:39,840 --> 00:51:42,799
Speaker 1: about Altman a little more seriously. And we're definitely going

938
00:51:42,840 --> 00:51:44,680
Speaker 1: to do that at interrupt us really excited for this.

939
00:51:45,200 --> 00:51:47,799
Speaker 1: The dates I can give you tickets aren't available yet,

940
00:51:47,800 --> 00:51:50,800
Speaker 1: but the dates we know. It's going to be Monday,

941
00:51:51,400 --> 00:51:54,880
Speaker 1: August eleven for that full screening of the Player, and

942
00:51:54,920 --> 00:51:58,360
Speaker 1: then August twelveth through fourteen will go back and start

943
00:51:58,400 --> 00:52:01,000
Speaker 1: working our way through it. You can follow me on

944
00:52:01,080 --> 00:52:03,280
Speaker 1: social and I'll put the word out there when tickets

945
00:52:03,320 --> 00:52:06,080
Speaker 1: do become available, hopefully in a couple of weeks. So yeah,

946
00:52:06,320 --> 00:52:09,160
Speaker 1: just follow me at Larsen on Film.

947
00:52:08,760 --> 00:52:11,600
Speaker 2: This week over on our sister podcast, The Next Picture Show,

948
00:52:11,800 --> 00:52:14,399
Speaker 2: Looking at Cinemas Present via It's Passed. It's part two

949
00:52:14,440 --> 00:52:19,360
Speaker 2: of their musical nautobiography pairing Pavements, which I recommended strongly

950
00:52:19,480 --> 00:52:22,400
Speaker 2: last week. They are pairing that with Todd Haynes. I'm not.

951
00:52:22,640 --> 00:52:25,600
Speaker 2: Their new episodes of the Next Picture Show drop every

952
00:52:25,640 --> 00:52:27,920
Speaker 2: Tuesday wherever you get your podcasts.

953
00:52:28,120 --> 00:52:30,800
Speaker 1: Time now for Massacre Theater, where we perform a scene

954
00:52:30,840 --> 00:52:33,480
Speaker 1: and you get a chance to win a film spotting prize.

955
00:52:33,800 --> 00:52:35,640
Speaker 1: Last time we massacred this scene.

956
00:52:36,120 --> 00:52:38,480
Speaker 6: I realized that when I met you at the Turkey

957
00:52:38,719 --> 00:52:42,640
Speaker 6: curry buffet that I was unforgivably rude and wearing a

958
00:52:42,800 --> 00:52:46,400
Speaker 6: reindeer jumper that my mother had given me the day before.

959
00:52:47,960 --> 00:52:53,840
Speaker 6: But the thing is, what I'm trying to say, very inarticulately,

960
00:52:53,960 --> 00:53:05,520
Speaker 6: is in fact, despite appearances, I like you very much.

961
00:53:06,520 --> 00:53:09,640
Speaker 2: Apart from the smoking and the drinking and the volcal

962
00:53:09,719 --> 00:53:13,600
Speaker 2: mother and the verbal diary, I like you very much

963
00:53:14,920 --> 00:53:15,480
Speaker 2: just as you are.

964
00:53:16,080 --> 00:53:18,680
Speaker 1: That was Colin Firth and Renee Zellwegger in two thousand

965
00:53:18,680 --> 00:53:22,040
Speaker 1: and one's Bridget Jones Diary, written by Richard Curtis and

966
00:53:22,040 --> 00:53:25,719
Speaker 1: Andrew Davies, based on the novel by Helen Fielding and

967
00:53:25,760 --> 00:53:28,800
Speaker 1: directed by Sharon Maguire. So, Adam, that was a masker

968
00:53:28,840 --> 00:53:31,520
Speaker 1: I missed out on I hate it when I miss

969
00:53:31,560 --> 00:53:34,640
Speaker 1: a show and you guys do massacre theater. But you

970
00:53:34,640 --> 00:53:36,960
Speaker 1: know what, Yeah, it was so much fun getting to

971
00:53:37,000 --> 00:53:40,319
Speaker 1: hear guest host Ayisha Harris who joined you.

972
00:53:40,440 --> 00:53:42,319
Speaker 2: A little gender switch there, no.

973
00:53:42,520 --> 00:53:45,279
Speaker 1: I know, and that some accent work even, I mean

974
00:53:45,680 --> 00:53:48,680
Speaker 1: you didn't let her off easy. You guys know, No,

975
00:53:49,880 --> 00:53:52,040
Speaker 1: you guys for that show. It was the thirtieth anniversary

976
00:53:52,080 --> 00:53:54,919
Speaker 1: review of Clueless. You also did the top five movie

977
00:53:54,960 --> 00:53:59,200
Speaker 1: quotes in our lexicon, And so why did you do

978
00:53:59,239 --> 00:54:00,880
Speaker 1: that scene from Bridge Jones's Diary.

979
00:54:01,120 --> 00:54:05,640
Speaker 2: Well, here's Ross in Wokingham or Wokingham. I always screw

980
00:54:05,719 --> 00:54:08,799
Speaker 2: that up, UK. I'm sure the latest acting masterclass is

981
00:54:08,800 --> 00:54:12,000
Speaker 2: Bridget jones Diary. The combination of a turkey curry buffet

982
00:54:12,080 --> 00:54:15,120
Speaker 2: and poor taste Christmas jumper is so immersed in British

983
00:54:15,120 --> 00:54:18,680
Speaker 2: psyche I'm immediately transported to the film's toe curling portrayal

984
00:54:18,719 --> 00:54:22,320
Speaker 2: of forced Christmas festivities. However, I'm struggling for the connection.

985
00:54:22,680 --> 00:54:25,080
Speaker 2: Clueless was released in nineteen ninety five, when I would

986
00:54:25,080 --> 00:54:27,920
Speaker 2: have been reading the Helen Fielding Weekly newspaper column that

987
00:54:28,000 --> 00:54:31,319
Speaker 2: preceded the book in film, But that's a tad Niche yes,

988
00:54:31,360 --> 00:54:33,759
Speaker 2: that's not where we're going. We'll hear from some other

989
00:54:33,800 --> 00:54:34,960
Speaker 2: listeners who nailed it though.

990
00:54:35,080 --> 00:54:38,800
Speaker 1: Josh, here's Peter Dockrel from Lura, Australia. You had me

991
00:54:39,040 --> 00:54:42,120
Speaker 1: at turkey curry buffet. As soon as I heard those words,

992
00:54:42,160 --> 00:54:44,960
Speaker 1: I knew this week's Massacre theater scene was from Bridget

993
00:54:45,000 --> 00:54:47,759
Speaker 1: jones Diary. The connection with the episode is, of course,

994
00:54:47,840 --> 00:54:51,440
Speaker 1: Jane Austen. Bridget Jones was loosely inspired by Austin's Pride

995
00:54:51,440 --> 00:54:54,720
Speaker 1: and Prejudice, while Clueless was a somewhat more faithful update

996
00:54:54,760 --> 00:54:57,960
Speaker 1: of Emma. A slightly more obscure connection is the fact

997
00:54:58,000 --> 00:55:01,600
Speaker 1: that Bridget jones Diary has my family favorite movie quote.

998
00:55:01,800 --> 00:55:05,040
Speaker 1: Whenever we want someone to do something, we yell go go, go,

999
00:55:05,040 --> 00:55:08,319
Speaker 1: go go, just like the hapless production assistant trying to

1000
00:55:08,320 --> 00:55:11,000
Speaker 1: get Bridget Jones to slide down a pole during a

1001
00:55:11,040 --> 00:55:12,680
Speaker 1: remote broadcast from a fire station.

1002
00:55:13,080 --> 00:55:16,640
Speaker 2: There you go movie quotes in our lexicon. And of

1003
00:55:16,680 --> 00:55:20,920
Speaker 2: course now I'm hearing Aisha's rendition of Colin Firth in

1004
00:55:20,960 --> 00:55:24,160
Speaker 2: my head, and it's turkey curry buffet. You can't say

1005
00:55:24,160 --> 00:55:27,479
Speaker 2: buffet like we say it. Yes, that's true. Yes, Chris

1006
00:55:27,520 --> 00:55:30,520
Speaker 2: George in Chicago says, I'm pretty sure that's Bridget Jones's Diary,

1007
00:55:30,560 --> 00:55:33,640
Speaker 2: another mid nineties female centric movie with voiceover.

1008
00:55:33,920 --> 00:55:36,640
Speaker 1: That's true. Jenny Mackie from Seattle weigh in with this,

1009
00:55:37,200 --> 00:55:39,279
Speaker 1: just like Clueless was a modern retelling of a Jane

1010
00:55:39,280 --> 00:55:42,440
Speaker 1: Austin classic. Bridget jones Diary is a modern retelling of

1011
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:45,520
Speaker 1: pride and prejudice. Colin Firth even replays mister Darcy from

1012
00:55:45,560 --> 00:55:47,719
Speaker 1: the nineteen ninety six BBC mini.

1013
00:55:47,520 --> 00:55:52,560
Speaker 2: Series Little Little Added Connection there. Finally, Jessica Klein in Saskatoon,

1014
00:55:52,719 --> 00:55:55,839
Speaker 2: Saskatchewan says, it's rare that I know the Masacre Theater

1015
00:55:55,920 --> 00:55:58,440
Speaker 2: within the first few words. Yes for me, Turkey Curry

1016
00:55:58,480 --> 00:56:01,719
Speaker 2: Buffe was indeed a dead giveaway. Bridge jones Diary is

1017
00:56:01,719 --> 00:56:03,560
Speaker 2: one of my formative movies and was a part of

1018
00:56:03,600 --> 00:56:06,080
Speaker 2: my Story VHS collection. In fact, I used to watch

1019
00:56:06,080 --> 00:56:08,400
Speaker 2: it every time I had relationship troubles and needed a

1020
00:56:08,400 --> 00:56:10,279
Speaker 2: little pick me up. Now that I'm going on ten

1021
00:56:10,360 --> 00:56:12,239
Speaker 2: years married to the one who loves me just the

1022
00:56:12,239 --> 00:56:14,479
Speaker 2: way I am, I haven't had the occasion to watch

1023
00:56:14,480 --> 00:56:16,600
Speaker 2: it recently, but hold a soft spot in my heart

1024
00:56:16,600 --> 00:56:20,279
Speaker 2: for silly little Bridget in her romantic misadventures. Keep up

1025
00:56:20,280 --> 00:56:22,560
Speaker 2: the great work. This podcast is one of my absolute

1026
00:56:22,640 --> 00:56:25,000
Speaker 2: favorites and I look forward to it every week. I

1027
00:56:25,040 --> 00:56:27,799
Speaker 2: think Jessica is saying she loves us just the way

1028
00:56:27,840 --> 00:56:28,120
Speaker 2: we are.

1029
00:56:28,320 --> 00:56:29,400
Speaker 1: I'll check you, Jessica.

1030
00:56:29,840 --> 00:56:33,520
Speaker 2: Indeed, thank you to everyone who entered a much more

1031
00:56:33,560 --> 00:56:37,200
Speaker 2: brimming hat than the week before, the two weeks before

1032
00:56:37,320 --> 00:56:40,680
Speaker 2: for Strangers on a Train Josh, which was nice to

1033
00:56:40,719 --> 00:56:43,400
Speaker 2: see reach into the hat and pick out this week's winner.

1034
00:56:43,400 --> 00:56:46,160
Speaker 1: That would be Evelyn So from New York, New York.

1035
00:56:46,440 --> 00:56:49,319
Speaker 2: Evelyn, who has been a listener since at least two

1036
00:56:49,360 --> 00:56:53,520
Speaker 2: thousand and six, first time winning Mascer Theater. Congratulations, Evelyn,

1037
00:56:53,760 --> 00:56:56,480
Speaker 2: email us you know the address and claim your prize.

1038
00:56:56,480 --> 00:56:58,560
Speaker 2: You get the tote bag, you get the t shirt,

1039
00:56:58,800 --> 00:57:01,520
Speaker 2: or I'd say you get a trial membership for the

1040
00:57:01,520 --> 00:57:07,160
Speaker 2: film Spotting Family, but Evelyn's already a member. Congrats. That

1041
00:57:07,360 --> 00:57:09,640
Speaker 2: was the greatest acting I have ever seen. I just

1042
00:57:09,680 --> 00:57:10,560
Speaker 2: don't know how you do it.

1043
00:57:10,640 --> 00:57:10,920
Speaker 1: Gary.

1044
00:57:11,120 --> 00:57:13,200
Speaker 6: How do you make yourself so somber and emotional to

1045
00:57:13,200 --> 00:57:14,400
Speaker 6: make everybody cry like that?

1046
00:57:14,880 --> 00:57:18,320
Speaker 1: It's not that hard, really, I just think about the

1047
00:57:18,400 --> 00:57:20,160
Speaker 1: saddest moment in my life.

1048
00:57:21,000 --> 00:57:25,040
Speaker 2: We move on to this expedition of Massacre Theater, and yeah,

1049
00:57:25,040 --> 00:57:26,840
Speaker 2: this is some real acting here by two.

1050
00:57:26,920 --> 00:57:31,320
Speaker 1: Really good for punishment for criticizing Da Cody Johnson not

1051
00:57:31,400 --> 00:57:37,160
Speaker 1: being able to pull off the romantic delivery that Materialists required.

1052
00:57:38,040 --> 00:57:40,840
Speaker 1: Now I've been given that job movie.

1053
00:57:40,880 --> 00:57:41,280
Speaker 2: That's right.

1054
00:57:41,800 --> 00:57:44,680
Speaker 1: I'm gonna be not nearly as good as she is.

1055
00:57:45,440 --> 00:57:48,600
Speaker 2: I know we are doing this over video. Thankfully. We

1056
00:57:48,680 --> 00:57:52,400
Speaker 2: never show this part to listeners, and I'll let them

1057
00:57:52,400 --> 00:57:56,160
Speaker 2: in on a little secret. We never actually do the

1058
00:57:56,360 --> 00:58:00,520
Speaker 2: non verbal stuff because of course we're terrible actors. My

1059
00:58:00,600 --> 00:58:04,240
Speaker 2: part requires an amazing bit of nonverbal acting here near

1060
00:58:04,280 --> 00:58:06,960
Speaker 2: the end that I definitely cannot deliver, So I'm not

1061
00:58:07,000 --> 00:58:07,560
Speaker 2: going to try.

1062
00:58:08,000 --> 00:58:10,919
Speaker 1: That's we're already in our heads trying to keep track

1063
00:58:10,960 --> 00:58:13,440
Speaker 1: of the words. Let's not think about mutians.

1064
00:58:14,400 --> 00:58:17,800
Speaker 2: And I'm definitely going to ruin the scene even more

1065
00:58:17,880 --> 00:58:21,640
Speaker 2: by taking out the names. To change it up a

1066
00:58:21,680 --> 00:58:26,280
Speaker 2: little bit, I have inserted pretend names that are gonna

1067
00:58:26,280 --> 00:58:29,240
Speaker 2: mess with the flow even more so. It is what

1068
00:58:29,280 --> 00:58:31,200
Speaker 2: it is. That's my excuse. I'm messing with the flow.

1069
00:58:31,280 --> 00:58:33,360
Speaker 1: Josh. Well, that's why I won't be any good either.

1070
00:58:35,000 --> 00:58:38,000
Speaker 2: Okay, are you ready? I'm gonna start it off. You're

1071
00:58:38,040 --> 00:58:42,760
Speaker 2: gonna give me the action and action. Hey Einstein, I

1072
00:58:42,840 --> 00:58:43,920
Speaker 2: think you're the devil.

1073
00:58:44,200 --> 00:58:48,000
Speaker 1: No, I'm not, how because I think we have the

1074
00:58:48,080 --> 00:58:50,479
Speaker 1: kind of friendship where if I were the devil, you'd

1075
00:58:50,520 --> 00:58:51,680
Speaker 1: be the only one I would tell.

1076
00:58:52,800 --> 00:58:55,560
Speaker 2: Well, you were awfully quick to run after Ned's help

1077
00:58:55,640 --> 00:58:56,959
Speaker 2: when you wanted help.

1078
00:58:57,000 --> 00:59:00,800
Speaker 1: Oh right, fine, yes, and if things have gone well

1079
00:59:00,840 --> 00:59:03,160
Speaker 1: for you tonight that I probably wouldn't be saying any

1080
00:59:03,200 --> 00:59:07,240
Speaker 1: of this. I grant you everything, but give me this.

1081
00:59:08,000 --> 00:59:11,640
Speaker 1: He personifies everything that you've been fighting against. And I'm

1082
00:59:11,640 --> 00:59:14,800
Speaker 1: in love with you. How do you like that I

1083
00:59:14,920 --> 00:59:21,439
Speaker 1: bury the lead and scene? Well, I went to three

1084
00:59:21,480 --> 00:59:24,000
Speaker 1: different registers in that last bet. I don't thought they

1085
00:59:24,000 --> 00:59:25,080
Speaker 1: were the correct ones.

1086
00:59:26,160 --> 00:59:30,200
Speaker 2: I mean, your your guy, though he really brings it down, Josh,

1087
00:59:30,280 --> 00:59:33,000
Speaker 2: I think I think you almost got too high. Hi, Yeah,

1088
00:59:33,080 --> 00:59:35,560
Speaker 2: you almost didn't get down into the almost whisper.

1089
00:59:35,560 --> 00:59:38,320
Speaker 1: Now, wow, this too bad? But I still a few

1090
00:59:38,360 --> 00:59:39,760
Speaker 1: second takes I felt something.

1091
00:59:40,040 --> 00:59:43,160
Speaker 2: Yeah, we don't If you know what film we just massacred.

1092
00:59:43,200 --> 00:59:45,600
Speaker 2: Email the movie's title and your name and location to

1093
00:59:45,640 --> 00:59:49,400
Speaker 2: feedback at filmspotting dot net. The deadline is Monday, June thirtieth.

1094
00:59:49,680 --> 00:59:52,480
Speaker 2: We'll select the winner randomly from all the correct entries

1095
00:59:52,560 --> 00:59:54,840
Speaker 2: and announce it in a couple of weeks.

1096
00:59:55,400 --> 01:00:00,720
Speaker 4: When you look up at the night sky, it can

1097
01:00:00,760 --> 01:00:11,400
Speaker 4: tell your stuff about your future. It won't lie to you.

1098
01:00:13,960 --> 01:00:14,720
Speaker 1: It's pure.

1099
01:00:15,000 --> 01:00:22,920
Speaker 4: That way, you might see a lot more than you wanted.

1100
01:00:25,160 --> 01:00:27,600
Speaker 1: That's from the trailer for the Life of Chuck, which

1101
01:00:27,600 --> 01:00:31,040
Speaker 1: is currently playing in Whiteish release. The tagline for Mike

1102
01:00:31,040 --> 01:00:35,280
Speaker 1: Flanagan's adaptation of the Stephen King novella is an extraordinary

1103
01:00:35,320 --> 01:00:39,600
Speaker 1: story about an ordinary man. Tom Hiddleston is that ordinary man,

1104
01:00:39,760 --> 01:00:42,920
Speaker 1: Chuck Krantz. As we mentioned at the top, the film

1105
01:00:42,960 --> 01:00:46,720
Speaker 1: won the Audience Award at last year's Toronto International Film Festival.

1106
01:00:47,240 --> 01:00:51,040
Speaker 1: That's often a bellweather for maybe not box office success,

1107
01:00:51,160 --> 01:00:55,600
Speaker 1: but usually awards success. Now, just about every Audience Award

1108
01:00:55,600 --> 01:00:58,480
Speaker 1: winner for the last twenty years has been nominated for

1109
01:00:58,560 --> 01:01:02,120
Speaker 1: a Best Picture Oscar and several half one A Midsummer

1110
01:01:02,200 --> 01:01:06,040
Speaker 1: release from neon On about a thousand screens doesn't seem

1111
01:01:06,200 --> 01:01:10,840
Speaker 1: to be playing into those Oscar expectations. What do you think, Adam,

1112
01:01:11,080 --> 01:01:13,760
Speaker 1: is this one we need to we need to reclaim

1113
01:01:14,040 --> 01:01:17,080
Speaker 1: for people to tell them to rush out and see.

1114
01:01:17,160 --> 01:01:18,800
Speaker 2: I don't know if they need to rush out to

1115
01:01:18,840 --> 01:01:22,840
Speaker 2: see it. I guess I do hope more people see it.

1116
01:01:23,760 --> 01:01:26,720
Speaker 2: But I already made one connection to our earlier review

1117
01:01:26,880 --> 01:01:32,120
Speaker 2: of Materialists, this notion of math and math as art.

1118
01:01:32,400 --> 01:01:36,080
Speaker 2: I'm going to make another connection, which is my conflicted

1119
01:01:36,320 --> 01:01:38,720
Speaker 2: reaction to it and the fact that I walked out

1120
01:01:38,760 --> 01:01:43,880
Speaker 2: of the theater feeling mostly positive. And the more I

1121
01:01:43,960 --> 01:01:47,960
Speaker 2: process my reaction, the more I found myself just writing

1122
01:01:47,960 --> 01:01:50,440
Speaker 2: down a bunch of negativity. And I don't know why

1123
01:01:50,920 --> 01:01:53,840
Speaker 2: that is. It's a pretty easy movie, or I thought

1124
01:01:53,880 --> 01:01:56,320
Speaker 2: it was a pretty easy movie, Josh to recommend to people,

1125
01:01:56,680 --> 01:02:00,920
Speaker 2: But after working on my notes, my thumb isn't just teetering,

1126
01:02:00,960 --> 01:02:03,480
Speaker 2: it's kind of fallen. So I'm gonna see if you

1127
01:02:03,520 --> 01:02:06,720
Speaker 2: can nudge it either farther down or you're gonna help

1128
01:02:06,760 --> 01:02:09,240
Speaker 2: boost it back up. In terms of what I liked,

1129
01:02:09,920 --> 01:02:16,400
Speaker 2: Hittleston's spontaneous dance sequence is as alive and exhilarating as

1130
01:02:16,440 --> 01:02:19,880
Speaker 2: the movie needs it to be. It works, but I

1131
01:02:19,960 --> 01:02:23,360
Speaker 2: like it more than that. But once The Pocket Queen's

1132
01:02:23,680 --> 01:02:27,800
Speaker 2: rhythm fades, the film never quite regains its momentum. The

1133
01:02:27,840 --> 01:02:30,360
Speaker 2: Pocket Queen is a reference to the drummer that's her

1134
01:02:30,400 --> 01:02:33,720
Speaker 2: real name, what she goes by the performer in that scene,

1135
01:02:34,000 --> 01:02:36,240
Speaker 2: and I'll get into that a little bit more later.

1136
01:02:36,280 --> 01:02:38,360
Speaker 2: I think that's the high point of the film. That's

1137
01:02:38,400 --> 01:02:42,200
Speaker 2: how much I liked it. I really love seeing MIAs

1138
01:02:42,200 --> 01:02:47,400
Speaker 2: Sarah as the grandmother. She's done Sloan, She's done a

1139
01:02:47,440 --> 01:02:50,240
Speaker 2: fair amount of TV work. I haven't seen any of it,

1140
01:02:50,640 --> 01:02:53,440
Speaker 2: but not much film work since playing Sloan Peterson in

1141
01:02:53,480 --> 01:02:56,480
Speaker 2: Ferris Fieler's Day Off. And she just has such a

1142
01:02:56,520 --> 01:02:59,280
Speaker 2: regal performance, just such a regal presence, and she gives

1143
01:02:59,280 --> 01:03:03,800
Speaker 2: such a regals here she is, and going back to

1144
01:03:03,840 --> 01:03:08,000
Speaker 2: that Hittleston number, watching it, I was so keenly aware

1145
01:03:08,080 --> 01:03:12,080
Speaker 2: of how they shoot it appropriately, like a really good

1146
01:03:12,200 --> 01:03:16,840
Speaker 2: musical number. And then it only makes sense when her

1147
01:03:16,960 --> 01:03:21,160
Speaker 2: character in the next act starts busting out the classical

1148
01:03:21,240 --> 01:03:25,080
Speaker 2: musical films to show Chuck as a younger boy as

1149
01:03:25,120 --> 01:03:28,080
Speaker 2: she's teaching him how to dance. So I really loved

1150
01:03:28,080 --> 01:03:30,320
Speaker 2: her presence. I loved her performance, and just seeing me

1151
01:03:30,400 --> 01:03:35,000
Speaker 2: as Sarah again. Here's the other thing I liked. What

1152
01:03:35,080 --> 01:03:38,720
Speaker 2: a coincidence that last week we were talking about the

1153
01:03:38,760 --> 01:03:42,640
Speaker 2: Phoenician scheme and the extent to which it was or

1154
01:03:42,920 --> 01:03:48,760
Speaker 2: wasn't Wes Anderson and the most he has dealt with

1155
01:03:48,960 --> 01:03:54,360
Speaker 2: or he's dealing with our present circumstances. Well, Mike Flanagan said,

1156
01:03:54,640 --> 01:03:59,240
Speaker 2: hold my flaming bottle of milort. Many many of us

1157
01:03:59,280 --> 01:04:01,640
Speaker 2: have said many times over the past ten years, but

1158
01:04:01,720 --> 01:04:05,400
Speaker 2: especially the past five and really heightened over the past

1159
01:04:05,520 --> 01:04:07,560
Speaker 2: year or so, that we feel like the world is

1160
01:04:07,600 --> 01:04:10,640
Speaker 2: completely unraveled, that if we're not already in the midst

1161
01:04:10,640 --> 01:04:13,400
Speaker 2: of catastrophe, it feels like it's right around the corner.

1162
01:04:13,800 --> 01:04:16,680
Speaker 2: Karen Gillian, her character's name is Felicia. I think she's

1163
01:04:16,800 --> 01:04:19,360
Speaker 2: quoting I know she's quoting from Yates The Second Coming.

1164
01:04:19,520 --> 01:04:24,080
Speaker 2: The Center cannot hold Stephen King in the Life of

1165
01:04:24,160 --> 01:04:28,920
Speaker 2: Chuck Here. Obviously, Flannagan, adapting plays out that thought experiment

1166
01:04:29,160 --> 01:04:34,640
Speaker 2: in the opening act, starting with part of California just

1167
01:04:34,760 --> 01:04:39,960
Speaker 2: falling off and then the Internet going away. And it

1168
01:04:40,080 --> 01:04:46,360
Speaker 2: was handled harrowingly but delicately enough, because when I say harrowingly,

1169
01:04:46,440 --> 01:04:49,400
Speaker 2: it's not like it's not like we see it occurring right.

1170
01:04:49,560 --> 01:04:53,800
Speaker 2: The people on screen aren't experiencing any of this pain

1171
01:04:53,920 --> 01:04:57,720
Speaker 2: directly where they are. It's the East Coast. They are

1172
01:04:57,760 --> 01:05:01,160
Speaker 2: relatively isolated so far, their homes aren't the ones that

1173
01:05:01,200 --> 01:05:03,880
Speaker 2: are falling into the ocean. They aren't the ones who

1174
01:05:03,880 --> 01:05:06,880
Speaker 2: are dying of starvation. We hear about some people at

1175
01:05:06,880 --> 01:05:09,800
Speaker 2: one point whose cars have fallen into a sinkhole on

1176
01:05:09,880 --> 01:05:12,320
Speaker 2: Main Street, and they're probably not coming back from that,

1177
01:05:12,520 --> 01:05:15,160
Speaker 2: but we don't see that. We don't see any of

1178
01:05:15,200 --> 01:05:17,640
Speaker 2: our main characters directly suffer in that way, but we

1179
01:05:17,680 --> 01:05:21,080
Speaker 2: do see their lives completely upended. We see their exhaustion,

1180
01:05:21,440 --> 01:05:24,840
Speaker 2: we see the fear that they're living with, the dread,

1181
01:05:24,960 --> 01:05:27,160
Speaker 2: the sense of inevitability, and that's really what this film

1182
01:05:27,200 --> 01:05:30,440
Speaker 2: was about, the sense of inevitability and fear, and the

1183
01:05:30,440 --> 01:05:35,040
Speaker 2: fear of death, the waiting for it, and for most

1184
01:05:35,080 --> 01:05:38,520
Speaker 2: of us, fortunately that's what it is. Right These very

1185
01:05:38,520 --> 01:05:42,360
Speaker 2: clear dangers may feel imminent but not be present, or

1186
01:05:42,360 --> 01:05:45,480
Speaker 2: they're present but for other people around the world and

1187
01:05:45,520 --> 01:05:50,480
Speaker 2: haven't come for us yet. And Josh, watching that opening

1188
01:05:50,640 --> 01:05:52,880
Speaker 2: act of the film, I felt like I felt like

1189
01:05:52,920 --> 01:05:56,360
Speaker 2: I was watching an instructional video for the Apocalypse and

1190
01:05:56,440 --> 01:05:59,640
Speaker 2: it sucks, but I needed to process it along with

1191
01:05:59,680 --> 01:06:02,360
Speaker 2: these care characters, and I wanted to see how King

1192
01:06:02,920 --> 01:06:06,640
Speaker 2: and Flanagan were going to play this all out. I

1193
01:06:06,720 --> 01:06:09,360
Speaker 2: wanted to see how they were going to resolve this

1194
01:06:10,200 --> 01:06:15,920
Speaker 2: fantastic but not so fantastic, way too realistic seeming scenario.

1195
01:06:16,160 --> 01:06:17,920
Speaker 2: I wanted to see how they were going to resolve it,

1196
01:06:18,880 --> 01:06:23,920
Speaker 2: how they did ultimately resolve it is part of my

1197
01:06:23,960 --> 01:06:28,440
Speaker 2: disappointment with the film, But that is my initial at

1198
01:06:28,520 --> 01:06:31,400
Speaker 2: least in my main list of things that I did

1199
01:06:31,640 --> 01:06:34,120
Speaker 2: really like about this movie. And so I'm going to

1200
01:06:34,160 --> 01:06:36,600
Speaker 2: stop there. I want to know what you also appreciated

1201
01:06:36,600 --> 01:06:37,240
Speaker 2: about the film.

1202
01:06:37,360 --> 01:06:40,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that opening section is I would almost

1203
01:06:40,880 --> 01:06:43,440
Speaker 1: call it a red herring. I mean, it does there

1204
01:06:43,520 --> 01:06:46,360
Speaker 1: is a reason for it that's deeply related to the

1205
01:06:46,400 --> 01:06:51,840
Speaker 1: film's central concerns. But coming into this knowing nothing about it,

1206
01:06:52,160 --> 01:06:55,160
Speaker 1: haven't read the Stephen King novella, didn't even know the plot,

1207
01:06:55,600 --> 01:06:59,080
Speaker 1: and am sorely for a horror fan, sorely ignorant of

1208
01:06:59,120 --> 01:07:02,800
Speaker 1: the work of my Flannagan both need too, his television

1209
01:07:02,880 --> 01:07:06,040
Speaker 1: work and the features he's made. So really came into

1210
01:07:06,080 --> 01:07:09,240
Speaker 1: this not knowing what I was getting, and I thought, Wow,

1211
01:07:09,320 --> 01:07:11,080
Speaker 1: is this going to be like a you know, no

1212
01:07:11,200 --> 01:07:13,520
Speaker 1: bomb box, White Noise or so, you know, something like

1213
01:07:13,560 --> 01:07:17,600
Speaker 1: that that's really interested in commenting on these times filtered

1214
01:07:17,600 --> 01:07:21,320
Speaker 1: through King's work, and it's not that at all. It is.

1215
01:07:22,840 --> 01:07:26,080
Speaker 1: I can't say what it is because I don't want

1216
01:07:26,120 --> 01:07:27,920
Speaker 1: to spoil that, but I do think it's important to

1217
01:07:27,920 --> 01:07:30,800
Speaker 1: point out that that's not what this movie. That plot

1218
01:07:31,320 --> 01:07:33,880
Speaker 1: is not what this movie is interested in. It am

1219
01:07:33,960 --> 01:07:37,440
Speaker 1: I compelled by what it is interested in. I would

1220
01:07:37,440 --> 01:07:41,200
Speaker 1: say We've had similar experiences with both of these movies

1221
01:07:41,200 --> 01:07:44,360
Speaker 1: this week. Appreciated them while I was watching them, came

1222
01:07:44,400 --> 01:07:46,720
Speaker 1: out of them thinking, you know about some of the

1223
01:07:46,720 --> 01:07:50,360
Speaker 1: things that just nagged me a little bit. But I'm

1224
01:07:50,360 --> 01:07:53,000
Speaker 1: still coming away saying, give it a shot, because there's

1225
01:07:53,080 --> 01:07:55,640
Speaker 1: enough goodness here. I think you referenced, you know, a

1226
01:07:55,680 --> 01:07:59,280
Speaker 1: couple of those things already. The performances for me are

1227
01:08:00,080 --> 01:08:04,400
Speaker 1: our key there is we meet Chuck eventually as a boy,

1228
01:08:04,560 --> 01:08:07,440
Speaker 1: a young boy of maybe I don't know, fourth grade,

1229
01:08:07,480 --> 01:08:10,439
Speaker 1: fifth grade, something like that, played at this point by

1230
01:08:10,480 --> 01:08:14,320
Speaker 1: Benjamin Pajack. That kid just steals your heart. I mean

1231
01:08:14,560 --> 01:08:18,320
Speaker 1: in this extended sequence where we get to see where

1232
01:08:18,360 --> 01:08:24,080
Speaker 1: some of Chuck's passions but also neuroses are formed, and

1233
01:08:24,160 --> 01:08:27,880
Speaker 1: I think that is very movingly handled. This is a

1234
01:08:27,920 --> 01:08:30,880
Speaker 1: movie that some people are going to find deeply philosophical

1235
01:08:31,360 --> 01:08:34,519
Speaker 1: and thought provoking and others are probably going to find

1236
01:08:35,120 --> 01:08:39,799
Speaker 1: sappy and sentimental. I would say that I'm a little

1237
01:08:39,960 --> 01:08:43,439
Speaker 1: in the middle, but more forgiving of it. Overall. For me,

1238
01:08:43,560 --> 01:08:47,280
Speaker 1: the movie had this. It has a generosity and earnestness

1239
01:08:47,320 --> 01:08:50,720
Speaker 1: to it that gives it enough good will that I

1240
01:08:50,800 --> 01:08:54,679
Speaker 1: wanted to like it, if that makes any sense. Yeah,

1241
01:08:54,920 --> 01:08:57,360
Speaker 1: and you know I'm not the easiest guy to get

1242
01:08:57,400 --> 01:08:59,679
Speaker 1: to shed a tear in a movie. And I will

1243
01:08:59,720 --> 01:09:03,120
Speaker 1: say that happened here. It's related not so much to

1244
01:09:03,120 --> 01:09:05,719
Speaker 1: the dance sequence, but to something you were talking about

1245
01:09:05,760 --> 01:09:10,799
Speaker 1: when we learn exactly why that dance was so crucial

1246
01:09:10,840 --> 01:09:13,519
Speaker 1: to Chuck as an adult. The reveal of that I

1247
01:09:13,560 --> 01:09:17,360
Speaker 1: thought was so beautifully handled, performed, and presented that I

1248
01:09:17,400 --> 01:09:21,000
Speaker 1: found it genuinely Touching back to the performances, real quick,

1249
01:09:21,040 --> 01:09:24,519
Speaker 1: I think Mark Hamill as Chuck's grandfather, though he gives

1250
01:09:24,520 --> 01:09:27,080
Speaker 1: a very long, long, long, long speech about math, which

1251
01:09:27,120 --> 01:09:30,120
Speaker 1: you referenced. Yes, and what I've read, I have edited

1252
01:09:30,160 --> 01:09:34,000
Speaker 1: some pieces on Flanagan's television work, and from that I've

1253
01:09:34,080 --> 01:09:37,360
Speaker 1: learned apparently monologues are a Flanagan thing for me.

1254
01:09:37,680 --> 01:09:40,519
Speaker 2: And I've heard too, Josh, real quick, it's a king thing.

1255
01:09:40,600 --> 01:09:42,920
Speaker 2: A lot of Oky monologues here. They come straight out

1256
01:09:42,960 --> 01:09:43,920
Speaker 2: of the novella.

1257
01:09:43,560 --> 01:09:46,280
Speaker 1: Which is maybe why he's so enamored with King exactly

1258
01:09:46,400 --> 01:09:49,160
Speaker 1: why you know that could be something that maybe doesn't

1259
01:09:49,200 --> 01:09:53,439
Speaker 1: work for you. Hammill's performance overall worked for me. And yeah,

1260
01:09:53,439 --> 01:09:55,360
Speaker 1: I think I'll just go back to this idea of

1261
01:09:55,439 --> 01:10:00,400
Speaker 1: the goodwill the movie generates made it to me scene.

1262
01:10:00,439 --> 01:10:01,360
Speaker 1: I'm glad I did see it.

1263
01:10:01,600 --> 01:10:05,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's where I am too, though I missed if

1264
01:10:05,280 --> 01:10:08,160
Speaker 2: it's there, and I assume it is. I assume in

1265
01:10:08,200 --> 01:10:11,880
Speaker 2: fact that Hamil is given the like with so and

1266
01:10:11,920 --> 01:10:14,840
Speaker 2: so and Mark Hamill credit or whatever, but I missed

1267
01:10:14,840 --> 01:10:19,160
Speaker 2: it in the credits, and I spent the entire time

1268
01:10:19,240 --> 01:10:23,240
Speaker 2: Mark Hamill is on here, he was looking at him going,

1269
01:10:23,720 --> 01:10:27,160
Speaker 2: I know, I know who it is, and it is

1270
01:10:27,280 --> 01:10:30,200
Speaker 2: killing me. You know, you can even tell the voice,

1271
01:10:30,200 --> 01:10:32,759
Speaker 2: even though he's putting on a voice, you can tell.

1272
01:10:33,320 --> 01:10:36,439
Speaker 2: And it was just driving me crazy the entire film.

1273
01:10:36,560 --> 01:10:38,320
Speaker 2: But I want to go back to something you said

1274
01:10:38,360 --> 01:10:40,800
Speaker 2: a little bit for a movie that you know won

1275
01:10:40,840 --> 01:10:43,920
Speaker 2: this audience award, and that every time it's brought up

1276
01:10:44,080 --> 01:10:46,000
Speaker 2: in any context, and I haven't heard a lot about it,

1277
01:10:46,040 --> 01:10:48,839
Speaker 2: but anytime it's brought up, you hear the words life affirming,

1278
01:10:49,520 --> 01:10:53,759
Speaker 2: you hear sentimental or schmaltzy associated with it. It's sadder

1279
01:10:54,240 --> 01:10:57,639
Speaker 2: and sometimes darker, and actually even weirder than I thought

1280
01:10:57,640 --> 01:10:59,360
Speaker 2: it would be. And I don't I don't mean weird

1281
01:10:59,400 --> 01:11:02,400
Speaker 2: like David Lynn weird or weird like. It leaves you

1282
01:11:02,479 --> 01:11:04,880
Speaker 2: with a lot of ambiguities that you have to parse,

1283
01:11:04,920 --> 01:11:09,600
Speaker 2: but structurally taking what I understand to be the novella's structure,

1284
01:11:10,120 --> 01:11:14,479
Speaker 2: and it goes in reverse chronological orders. So act it

1285
01:11:14,479 --> 01:11:17,479
Speaker 2: starts with act three, it says, and goes to Act two,

1286
01:11:17,920 --> 01:11:20,080
Speaker 2: and then to act one, and so just to avoid

1287
01:11:20,160 --> 01:11:23,720
Speaker 2: confusion from here on out, it's reverse chronology starting with

1288
01:11:23,760 --> 01:11:25,360
Speaker 2: act three. I'm going to refer to them in the

1289
01:11:25,439 --> 01:11:27,960
Speaker 2: order we experience them, so I'll say, like the first act,

1290
01:11:28,000 --> 01:11:31,519
Speaker 2: second act, third act. Right, there's that part of it.

1291
01:11:31,560 --> 01:11:34,320
Speaker 2: The structure is nonlinear. It's a little weird, right. The

1292
01:11:34,360 --> 01:11:38,560
Speaker 2: movie is also, and maybe my cism meter is calibrated

1293
01:11:38,600 --> 01:11:43,840
Speaker 2: differently than others, but it's not as blatantly heartwarming.

1294
01:11:44,120 --> 01:11:47,000
Speaker 1: It's dark, lifting or yeah or.

1295
01:11:47,000 --> 01:11:51,160
Speaker 2: Insert synonym for chaltzy here, cloying, as I guess I

1296
01:11:51,160 --> 01:11:54,080
Speaker 2: imagined it would be. And I am basing that off

1297
01:11:54,120 --> 01:11:56,920
Speaker 2: the little bit of buzz that I heard the Tiff

1298
01:11:56,920 --> 01:12:01,479
Speaker 2: Award the poster though as well, and the tagline, the

1299
01:12:01,520 --> 01:12:05,760
Speaker 2: tagline every life is a universe all its own, that

1300
01:12:05,880 --> 01:12:08,400
Speaker 2: kind of sounds and I'm not saying it's a bad tagline.

1301
01:12:08,439 --> 01:12:11,120
Speaker 2: I'm not taking any issue whatsoever with the marketers of

1302
01:12:11,120 --> 01:12:13,360
Speaker 2: this film. Marketing of the film is not something I

1303
01:12:13,479 --> 01:12:15,840
Speaker 2: spent any time thinking about. I am just saying, based

1304
01:12:15,880 --> 01:12:18,439
Speaker 2: on that tagline, it sounds like a terrible movie. It

1305
01:12:18,520 --> 01:12:21,439
Speaker 2: sounds like a schmaltzy movie. So based on that, I

1306
01:12:21,520 --> 01:12:24,360
Speaker 2: had this sense of it and that's not really the movie.

1307
01:12:24,439 --> 01:12:27,479
Speaker 2: I felt like, I got I understand if people have

1308
01:12:27,560 --> 01:12:29,880
Speaker 2: that criticism, but I didn't feel that watching it.

1309
01:12:29,960 --> 01:12:35,240
Speaker 1: Okay, it's I would say, it's a somewhat sentimental confrontation

1310
01:12:35,360 --> 01:12:39,120
Speaker 1: of mortality, and you need both sides of that. It's

1311
01:12:39,240 --> 01:12:43,400
Speaker 1: not trying to paper over anything horrifying about the fact

1312
01:12:43,400 --> 01:12:46,639
Speaker 1: that everyone will die, but it's finding a way towards

1313
01:12:46,680 --> 01:12:51,360
Speaker 1: that realization that is maybe somewhat comforting.

1314
01:12:51,800 --> 01:12:55,640
Speaker 2: Yes, And in going for that sense of comfort it

1315
01:12:55,720 --> 01:12:57,439
Speaker 2: is to use some of the words you use, there

1316
01:12:57,520 --> 01:13:00,800
Speaker 2: is a sincerity, there's an earnestness and those things sometimes

1317
01:13:01,400 --> 01:13:06,360
Speaker 2: in film can can be a little uh discomforting. We're

1318
01:13:06,360 --> 01:13:09,680
Speaker 2: not used to seeing them on screen, sometimes with the

1319
01:13:09,800 --> 01:13:13,320
Speaker 2: level of sincerity we see them with. Right here, there

1320
01:13:13,720 --> 01:13:17,080
Speaker 2: is a moment, the dance sequence that is there on

1321
01:13:17,120 --> 01:13:20,120
Speaker 2: the poster that we're referring to. A character does something

1322
01:13:20,160 --> 01:13:24,080
Speaker 2: that if we saw a character do in our everyday life,

1323
01:13:24,320 --> 01:13:28,360
Speaker 2: almost every one of us would walk by and actually

1324
01:13:28,520 --> 01:13:30,800
Speaker 2: actively try to walk as fast as we could to

1325
01:13:30,880 --> 01:13:33,760
Speaker 2: get away from. Okay, I think that's how most of

1326
01:13:33,840 --> 01:13:37,559
Speaker 2: us think, and this movie asks us to take time

1327
01:13:37,600 --> 01:13:41,799
Speaker 2: out and pause and take it in as a truly

1328
01:13:41,880 --> 01:13:45,160
Speaker 2: magical type of moment. So so I bring up that

1329
01:13:45,720 --> 01:13:49,679
Speaker 2: weirdness in the structure, but also in how it doesn't

1330
01:13:49,720 --> 01:13:52,040
Speaker 2: go for the syrup the way I thought it might,

1331
01:13:52,520 --> 01:13:55,479
Speaker 2: because I think I think it relates to something that

1332
01:13:55,680 --> 01:13:58,040
Speaker 2: I respect it for that. And then also there's something

1333
01:13:58,360 --> 01:14:00,880
Speaker 2: about it where I wasn't able to connect with it

1334
01:14:00,960 --> 01:14:03,800
Speaker 2: quite as much as I wish I could have. Typically,

1335
01:14:04,120 --> 01:14:06,840
Speaker 2: a narrative is going to I don't want to get

1336
01:14:06,880 --> 01:14:09,920
Speaker 2: into lame screenwriting one oh one stuff here. I like

1337
01:14:09,960 --> 01:14:12,639
Speaker 2: when movies take chances, right, But a narrative is typically

1338
01:14:12,640 --> 01:14:15,479
Speaker 2: gonna build to its its emotional moment, the CLIMACX and

1339
01:14:15,840 --> 01:14:17,960
Speaker 2: you might say we get it here. We have a

1340
01:14:18,000 --> 01:14:21,360
Speaker 2: really wonderful moment. The scene that I think effectively serves

1341
01:14:21,360 --> 01:14:25,040
Speaker 2: that function here is really lovely, but it is part

1342
01:14:25,080 --> 01:14:28,040
Speaker 2: of an act that for me, follows the middle act

1343
01:14:28,400 --> 01:14:33,479
Speaker 2: with Hiddleston, that is such an expression of pure joy

1344
01:14:34,160 --> 01:14:36,200
Speaker 2: that I think it's a tough sorry for the phrase,

1345
01:14:36,200 --> 01:14:38,439
Speaker 2: a tough act to follow, and the movie knows it

1346
01:14:38,479 --> 01:14:42,120
Speaker 2: because the voiceover, the voiceover that concludes and Nick Offerman

1347
01:14:42,160 --> 01:14:44,760
Speaker 2: does the voice over here, the line that concludes that

1348
01:14:44,880 --> 01:14:50,080
Speaker 2: middle act with Hiddleston, it sums it up. It says

1349
01:14:50,120 --> 01:14:51,400
Speaker 2: what that it's.

1350
01:14:51,280 --> 01:14:53,040
Speaker 1: The heart of the Fray line.

1351
01:14:53,120 --> 01:14:56,719
Speaker 2: It's the key line of the movie. And so when

1352
01:14:56,720 --> 01:14:59,599
Speaker 2: that's sandwich right in the middle of the film, it's

1353
01:14:59,600 --> 01:15:03,040
Speaker 2: hard for movie, I think, to really build from that.

1354
01:15:03,200 --> 01:15:06,000
Speaker 2: It's tough when the when the most entertaining and i'd

1355
01:15:06,040 --> 01:15:08,200
Speaker 2: argue most emotional part of the film happens at the

1356
01:15:08,200 --> 01:15:10,920
Speaker 2: halfway point. What makes it even tougher, though, Josh, is

1357
01:15:10,920 --> 01:15:14,240
Speaker 2: when you've got that entertaining, emotional second act right in

1358
01:15:14,280 --> 01:15:17,839
Speaker 2: the middle, and the one as we were talking about earlier,

1359
01:15:17,960 --> 01:15:21,080
Speaker 2: for me, the one on the front end with Karen Gillan,

1360
01:15:21,320 --> 01:15:25,240
Speaker 2: and she would tell Edgy four is probably the most

1361
01:15:25,520 --> 01:15:29,360
Speaker 2: inherently fascinating and the one on the back end. Although

1362
01:15:29,400 --> 01:15:32,040
Speaker 2: it has its moments, it really does some really tender,

1363
01:15:32,560 --> 01:15:34,880
Speaker 2: lovely moments. I think I know which one you're referring to,

1364
01:15:34,920 --> 01:15:38,200
Speaker 2: the one that maybe got you teared up a little bit,

1365
01:15:38,240 --> 01:15:40,680
Speaker 2: And I agree with you with with Mia, Sarah and

1366
01:15:40,720 --> 01:15:43,880
Speaker 2: Mark Hamill. Overall though, I felt like that was the

1367
01:15:43,920 --> 01:15:46,559
Speaker 2: weakest and so the trajectory isn't isn't really the one

1368
01:15:46,600 --> 01:15:48,840
Speaker 2: you like to follow with the movie where it's progressively

1369
01:15:49,200 --> 01:15:52,479
Speaker 2: getting to its weaker and weaker stuff. And then the

1370
01:15:52,560 --> 01:15:55,040
Speaker 2: last thing I'll say, Josh is that although that first

1371
01:15:55,040 --> 01:15:58,760
Speaker 2: act that we take in is the most fascinating, going

1372
01:15:58,800 --> 01:16:01,800
Speaker 2: back to the very beginning of this conversation, it doesn't

1373
01:16:02,000 --> 01:16:04,479
Speaker 2: it doesn't deliver on its potential at all.

1374
01:16:04,560 --> 01:16:08,280
Speaker 1: I mean, it depends on how satisfied you are with

1375
01:16:09,040 --> 01:16:15,600
Speaker 1: what that apocalyptic or cataclysmic opening section represents for the

1376
01:16:15,640 --> 01:16:19,559
Speaker 1: movie that the movie becomes. And I appreciated that. I

1377
01:16:19,600 --> 01:16:22,280
Speaker 1: did think that was an interesting way to think about.

1378
01:16:22,520 --> 01:16:24,560
Speaker 1: To go back to the movie's tagline, you know, the

1379
01:16:25,400 --> 01:16:28,040
Speaker 1: you know one person's life is universe unto itself. And

1380
01:16:28,479 --> 01:16:30,960
Speaker 1: you know, this is a very literary minded movie that

1381
01:16:31,160 --> 01:16:34,599
Speaker 1: the Walt Whitman is all over this about you know,

1382
01:16:34,800 --> 01:16:38,920
Speaker 1: I contain multitudes. It's referenced multiple times, and that's very

1383
01:16:39,040 --> 01:16:41,559
Speaker 1: much that notion is something the movie is invested in.

1384
01:16:41,680 --> 01:16:44,400
Speaker 1: I think I did. I totally understand what you're saying

1385
01:16:44,400 --> 01:16:47,599
Speaker 1: about the structure. Clearly, Hidleston is being sold as the star.

1386
01:16:47,960 --> 01:16:50,879
Speaker 1: That's the showcase sequence, the dance scene, so I understand

1387
01:16:50,920 --> 01:16:53,479
Speaker 1: that is sort of meant to be the high point.

1388
01:16:53,720 --> 01:16:55,519
Speaker 1: I think I was just way more invested in that

1389
01:16:55,520 --> 01:16:58,360
Speaker 1: third section than you with the younger Chuck. I think

1390
01:16:58,360 --> 01:17:00,360
Speaker 1: partly because of the performance, is partly becase because that's

1391
01:17:00,360 --> 01:17:04,240
Speaker 1: where the emotion hit me, and and so the structure

1392
01:17:05,120 --> 01:17:07,040
Speaker 1: was not quite as much of a hurdle for me.

1393
01:17:08,400 --> 01:17:11,679
Speaker 2: Well, I think another struggle I had with the third

1394
01:17:11,720 --> 01:17:15,800
Speaker 2: act is that obviously we won't spoil it, but it

1395
01:17:16,040 --> 01:17:21,680
Speaker 2: seems to culminate with a reveal. But I can't imagine

1396
01:17:21,880 --> 01:17:24,240
Speaker 2: that it's any kind of surprise to anyone watching it.

1397
01:17:24,240 --> 01:17:27,799
Speaker 1: So it's a reveal for the character though I suppose.

1398
01:17:28,080 --> 01:17:31,040
Speaker 2: I suppose, but the way the movie, it's one of

1399
01:17:31,040 --> 01:17:34,720
Speaker 2: these conflicted things again or moments for me watching it

1400
01:17:34,760 --> 01:17:37,200
Speaker 2: as a viewer, where it's kind of a non reveal reveal,

1401
01:17:37,640 --> 01:17:40,400
Speaker 2: I want to argue that Flannigan isn't trying to surprise us,

1402
01:17:40,400 --> 01:17:44,240
Speaker 2: But then the movie gives that moment enough enough weight.

1403
01:17:45,120 --> 01:17:47,840
Speaker 2: I understand that it's about the character, but it's also

1404
01:17:47,960 --> 01:17:52,000
Speaker 2: the movie. The movie still seems to invest in enough

1405
01:17:52,040 --> 01:17:54,360
Speaker 2: time that it's it's kind of like the character is

1406
01:17:54,520 --> 01:17:58,919
Speaker 2: learning something fundamentally about that space that I think we've

1407
01:17:59,000 --> 01:18:01,200
Speaker 2: caught on too. Ask you so early on.

1408
01:18:01,200 --> 01:18:04,360
Speaker 1: In ask you this, did you have a clear idea

1409
01:18:04,400 --> 01:18:06,280
Speaker 1: of what he was going to see in there? But

1410
01:18:06,720 --> 01:18:09,400
Speaker 1: I thought, so see and that's where I was. I

1411
01:18:09,479 --> 01:18:14,400
Speaker 1: had not figured that out. So it was a reveal

1412
01:18:14,479 --> 01:18:17,639
Speaker 1: for me exactly what he was going to see, even

1413
01:18:17,720 --> 01:18:20,600
Speaker 1: though it was not a reveal in the larger trajectory

1414
01:18:20,600 --> 01:18:23,400
Speaker 1: of the narrative, like it, it totally makes sense. So

1415
01:18:23,520 --> 01:18:26,800
Speaker 1: I think I was a little more than invested in

1416
01:18:27,680 --> 01:18:30,880
Speaker 1: how momentous that was for the character in the moment.

1417
01:18:31,320 --> 01:18:35,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, I didn't feel that momentousness. And the thing for

1418
01:18:35,760 --> 01:18:38,439
Speaker 2: me that here we're talking around, unfortunately because we don't

1419
01:18:38,439 --> 01:18:42,040
Speaker 2: want to spoil anything, is what you said you felt

1420
01:18:42,080 --> 01:18:45,719
Speaker 2: like the payoff of the connection between what we see

1421
01:18:45,720 --> 01:18:48,479
Speaker 2: in that first act and the way it connects to

1422
01:18:48,520 --> 01:18:51,200
Speaker 2: the things we see after it, the connection the movie makes,

1423
01:18:52,200 --> 01:18:55,400
Speaker 2: really that is I think we can say it comes

1424
01:18:55,439 --> 01:18:58,880
Speaker 2: back to its tagline that that was something you found

1425
01:18:59,080 --> 01:19:03,800
Speaker 2: compelling enough, and for me, I wanted I'm asking maybe

1426
01:19:03,800 --> 01:19:06,280
Speaker 2: for too much, Josh, but I was really hoping I

1427
01:19:06,360 --> 01:19:09,200
Speaker 2: was going to get something that movies have given me,

1428
01:19:09,800 --> 01:19:12,320
Speaker 2: movies have given me before. Certainly I was going to

1429
01:19:12,360 --> 01:19:15,240
Speaker 2: get an epiphany. I was going to get something that

1430
01:19:15,320 --> 01:19:18,599
Speaker 2: hit me on, hit me like like a stomach punch,

1431
01:19:18,640 --> 01:19:22,160
Speaker 2: but also gave me that intellectual type response where it

1432
01:19:22,200 --> 01:19:24,640
Speaker 2: made me, It made me think about something in a

1433
01:19:24,640 --> 01:19:27,280
Speaker 2: way I had never thought about it before. Yeah, and

1434
01:19:27,360 --> 01:19:31,240
Speaker 2: it felt it didn't give me Again. The movie carries disappointment.

1435
01:19:31,280 --> 01:19:33,479
Speaker 1: It carries itself as if it will, so I can

1436
01:19:34,040 --> 01:19:36,120
Speaker 1: see if it doesn't deliver on that front, it might

1437
01:19:36,120 --> 01:19:36,800
Speaker 1: be disappointing.

1438
01:19:37,080 --> 01:19:38,960
Speaker 2: But it is a sweet movie and it sounds like

1439
01:19:39,200 --> 01:19:42,200
Speaker 2: we are both ultimately recommending the Life of Chuck. Currently

1440
01:19:42,240 --> 01:19:45,080
Speaker 2: playing in wide release. If you see it, email us.

1441
01:19:45,120 --> 01:19:49,759
Speaker 2: We'd love to hear your thoughts. Feedback at filmspotting dot net. Josh,

1442
01:19:49,920 --> 01:19:50,639
Speaker 2: that's our show.

1443
01:19:50,880 --> 01:19:53,679
Speaker 1: You can find Adam and the show on Instagram, Facebook,

1444
01:19:53,720 --> 01:19:57,160
Speaker 1: and letterboxed at film spotting. I'm at those places as well.

1445
01:19:57,240 --> 01:20:00,439
Speaker 1: You can find me Larson on film. We are prependently

1446
01:20:00,479 --> 01:20:03,240
Speaker 1: produced and listener supported. You can support the show by

1447
01:20:03,320 --> 01:20:06,360
Speaker 1: joining the film Spotting Family over at film spotting family

1448
01:20:06,520 --> 01:20:09,320
Speaker 1: dot com. You can listen early and ad free. You'll

1449
01:20:09,360 --> 01:20:13,160
Speaker 1: also get a weekly newsletter, monthly bonus episodes, and access

1450
01:20:13,200 --> 01:20:16,240
Speaker 1: to the entire show archive. For show t shirts and

1451
01:20:16,280 --> 01:20:19,960
Speaker 1: other merch go to film spotting dot net slash shop.

1452
01:20:19,880 --> 01:20:24,479
Speaker 2: In those archives. Maybe a little bit less Stephen King

1453
01:20:24,680 --> 01:20:28,200
Speaker 2: adaptation talk than I expected, But then again, Josh, you know,

1454
01:20:28,560 --> 01:20:31,519
Speaker 2: there's been a fair amount of not very good Stephen

1455
01:20:31,640 --> 01:20:35,519
Speaker 2: King adaptation work the Mist, going way back to episode

1456
01:20:35,520 --> 01:20:38,920
Speaker 2: one eight eight, The Shining and Room two three seven,

1457
01:20:39,200 --> 01:20:41,880
Speaker 2: along with our top five Terrifying characters, and of course

1458
01:20:42,320 --> 01:20:46,280
Speaker 2: there was some Stephen King originated characters on that top

1459
01:20:46,280 --> 01:20:49,519
Speaker 2: five list. Episode four nineteen six forty eight. We did

1460
01:20:49,640 --> 01:20:52,920
Speaker 2: it in our Top five Stephen King scares. That was

1461
01:20:52,960 --> 01:20:55,640
Speaker 2: a fun on screen, That was a fun one and

1462
01:20:55,720 --> 01:20:59,120
Speaker 2: a scary one seven forty three. It Chapter two and

1463
01:20:59,160 --> 01:21:03,400
Speaker 2: then recently a Sacred Cow review our discussion of the

1464
01:21:03,400 --> 01:21:06,720
Speaker 2: Shawshank Redemption at thirty. Of course, that started as a

1465
01:21:06,760 --> 01:21:09,640
Speaker 2: Stephen King novella, just like the Life of Chuck That

1466
01:21:09,720 --> 01:21:13,120
Speaker 2: was episode nine eighty three. In limited release, you can

1467
01:21:13,160 --> 01:21:17,040
Speaker 2: see a Photographic Memory. This is a film from filmmaker

1468
01:21:17,120 --> 01:21:20,200
Speaker 2: Rachel Elizabeth Seed, who constructs a narrative of her celebrated

1469
01:21:20,360 --> 01:21:23,519
Speaker 2: photographer mother's life with the archive she left behind when

1470
01:21:23,520 --> 01:21:25,760
Speaker 2: she died suddenly at forty one, when Seed was just

1471
01:21:25,800 --> 01:21:28,080
Speaker 2: a toddler. This sounds right up, my Ali. It's playing

1472
01:21:28,120 --> 01:21:31,639
Speaker 2: at the Cisco Theater in Chicago. Our friend Robert Daniels

1473
01:21:31,640 --> 01:21:34,839
Speaker 2: calls it a haunting portrait, nimble and execution and startling

1474
01:21:34,880 --> 01:21:38,320
Speaker 2: in its poignancy that introduces her mother to a new generation.

1475
01:21:38,680 --> 01:21:42,000
Speaker 2: In wide release, you can see Bride Hard. Rebel Wilson

1476
01:21:42,040 --> 01:21:44,080
Speaker 2: is an undercover agent who has to take out a

1477
01:21:44,120 --> 01:21:49,000
Speaker 2: group of mercenaries who crash a destination wedding con air.

1478
01:21:49,120 --> 01:21:54,200
Speaker 2: Director Simon West helms Bride Hard. Pixar's l e O,

1479
01:21:54,360 --> 01:21:57,280
Speaker 2: which Josh does recommend, is out wide as well as

1480
01:21:57,320 --> 01:22:00,479
Speaker 2: twenty eight years later. Yes, the boys are back. The

1481
01:22:00,560 --> 01:22:04,360
Speaker 2: zombies are back too. Danny Boyle, writer Alex Garland, and

1482
01:22:04,760 --> 01:22:07,639
Speaker 2: what's left of Zombie Killee and Murphy. We will talk

1483
01:22:07,680 --> 01:22:09,720
Speaker 2: about that next week on the show and share our

1484
01:22:09,720 --> 01:22:12,479
Speaker 2: top five Danny Boyle characters that we did with Danny

1485
01:22:12,479 --> 01:22:13,919
Speaker 2: Boyle back in twenty seventeen.

1486
01:22:13,920 --> 01:22:16,519
Speaker 1: Film Spotting is produced by Golden Joe Desso and Sam

1487
01:22:16,640 --> 01:22:19,800
Speaker 1: van Holgren. Without Sam and Golden Joe, this show wouldn't go.

1488
01:22:20,280 --> 01:22:23,920
Speaker 1: Our production assistant is Sophie Kempinar. Special thanks to everyone

1489
01:22:24,000 --> 01:22:27,360
Speaker 1: at wb e Z Chicago. More information is available at

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Speaker 1: wbeazy dot org for film Spotting, I'm Josh Larson.

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Speaker 2: And I'm Adam Kempinar. Thanks for listening.

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Speaker 4: This conversation can serve no purpose anymore.

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Speaker 1: The burn.

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Speaker 2: Film Spotting is listeners supported. Join the film Spotting Family

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Speaker 2: at film spottingfamily dot com and get access to add

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Speaker 2: free episodes, monthly bonus shows, our weekly newsletter, and, for

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Speaker 2: the first time, all in one place, the entire film

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Speaker 2: Spotting archive going back to two thousand and five. That's

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Speaker 2: a Film Spotting Family dot com panibly