WEBVTT - Is Polyamory For You? 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:02.720 Hey, fam I'm Jada Pinkett Smith and this is the 0:00:02.759 --> 0:00:06.600 Red Tabletop podcast, all your favorite episodes from the Facebook 0:00:06.600 --> 0:00:10.440 Watch show in audio produced by Westbrook Audio and I 0:00:10.560 --> 0:00:13.760 Heart Radio. Please don't forget to rate and review on 0:00:13.880 --> 0:00:17.480 Apple Podcasts. Could you imagine being in a group and 0:00:17.600 --> 0:00:21.880 loving everyone equally? No, It's being called the new relationship 0:00:22.000 --> 0:00:27.200 revolution polyamory engaging in multiple intimate relationships at the same time. 0:00:27.360 --> 0:00:30.640 With nearly half of marriages ending in divorce, the main 0:00:30.760 --> 0:00:34.600 reasons why divorces happen is infidelity. Less couples are saying 0:00:34.640 --> 0:00:37.960 I do, and more young people are experimenting with a 0:00:38.000 --> 0:00:40.400 new kind of love. How did you feel when I 0:00:40.479 --> 0:00:44.640 told you that I was polyamorous. It feels like it's 0:00:44.640 --> 0:00:48.839 really all just centered around sex. Don't get frustrated. Will 0:00:49.159 --> 0:00:52.920 redefining relationships? All right? We brought your boyfriend with you. 0:00:53.240 --> 0:00:56.920 Remodeling romance. How many other relationships are you involved in 0:00:57.040 --> 0:01:01.640 right now? Rewriting the rules? You consider yourself a polymuby? 0:01:01.760 --> 0:01:04.679 Is traditional marriage a thing of the past? The history 0:01:04.680 --> 0:01:09.199 of marriage really irks me. Stay tuned because I am 0:01:09.280 --> 0:01:16.560 struggling here. I am struggling, Willow, I got the table 0:01:18.360 --> 0:01:24.920 Willow and her polyamory explorations. I love it. Do you 0:01:25.000 --> 0:01:28.840 believe in monogamy being with one person romantically and sexually 0:01:28.880 --> 0:01:31.759 till death? Do us part? Honey? For many younger people 0:01:31.920 --> 0:01:37.640 like Willow answers no. Instead, they are choosing polyamory, which 0:01:37.680 --> 0:01:42.360 means having multiple emotional and romantic partners at the same time. 0:01:42.640 --> 0:01:45.400 This has been a journey for you, miss Willow. How 0:01:45.400 --> 0:01:48.880 did you make this decision with polyamory? I feel like 0:01:48.920 --> 0:01:52.840 the main foundation is the freedom to be able to 0:01:53.080 --> 0:01:56.360 create a relationship style that works for you and not 0:01:56.480 --> 0:01:59.440 just stepping into monogamy because that's what everyone around you 0:01:59.480 --> 0:02:01.600 says it's the right thing to do. So I was like, 0:02:01.640 --> 0:02:05.200 how can I structure the way that I approach relationships 0:02:05.400 --> 0:02:09.560 with that in mind? Also doing research into polyamory. The 0:02:09.600 --> 0:02:15.080 main reasons why monogamous relationships or why marriage, why divorces 0:02:15.120 --> 0:02:19.200 happen is infidelity. For somebody like me, it feels like 0:02:19.440 --> 0:02:21.880 it's really all just centered around I mean, I'll give 0:02:21.919 --> 0:02:24.360 you an example. Let's say you haven't always been the 0:02:24.440 --> 0:02:26.280 kind of person that wanted to have sex all the time, 0:02:26.520 --> 0:02:28.920 but your partner is Are you going to be the 0:02:28.919 --> 0:02:31.680 person to say you know, just because I don't have 0:02:31.760 --> 0:02:35.120 these needs, you can't have them either. And so that's 0:02:35.200 --> 0:02:37.720 kind of one of the reasons why I actually was 0:02:37.760 --> 0:02:42.240 interested in Polly, because I was introduced to it through 0:02:42.400 --> 0:02:46.160 kind of a non sexual lens. In my friend group, 0:02:46.320 --> 0:02:49.080 I'm the only polyamorous person and I have the least 0:02:49.120 --> 0:02:52.239 sex out of all of my friends. So how did 0:02:52.280 --> 0:02:55.079 you feel when I told you that I was polyamorous? 0:02:55.160 --> 0:02:57.160 When you were like, Hey, this is my get down, 0:02:57.280 --> 0:03:00.280 I was like, I totally wanting to set up your 0:03:00.320 --> 0:03:04.080 life in a way that you can have what it 0:03:04.160 --> 0:03:07.960 is that you want. I think anything goes as long 0:03:08.320 --> 0:03:14.160 as the intentions are clear. Ever, to end yourself really 0:03:14.160 --> 0:03:17.360 more to yourself than anything right, And I know that 0:03:17.440 --> 0:03:22.120 there's a lot of beauty that sits outside of the 0:03:22.160 --> 0:03:28.440 conventional boxes. Let's not negate just the simple um because 0:03:28.480 --> 0:03:33.480 there there are people that still enjoy marriage as it 0:03:33.639 --> 0:03:38.160 is today. I happen to enjoy being married, even though 0:03:38.200 --> 0:03:42.000 I've been married several times that I've been through it's wrong. 0:03:42.160 --> 0:03:47.440 This isn't about changing paradigm that works for people. This 0:03:47.520 --> 0:03:49.920 isn't about that. It's about able to have the freedom 0:03:49.960 --> 0:03:54.800 to create a relationship. I'm good. It's almost like you're born, 0:03:54.920 --> 0:03:56.920 you go to school, you go to college, you can 0:03:56.960 --> 0:03:59.240 get married, kids. Do you have to take offense? But 0:03:59.320 --> 0:04:01.960 a lot of people have done that and felt unfulfilled 0:04:01.960 --> 0:04:04.200 in their lives. But I also think you have to 0:04:04.240 --> 0:04:07.360 be careful in these particular dynamics because they can be 0:04:07.360 --> 0:04:15.000 a little distracting. Meaning. But here's here's the difference between 0:04:15.200 --> 0:04:19.920 monogamous relationships. When you have those monogamous boundaries, you're actually 0:04:19.960 --> 0:04:24.680 forced to have to just listen to what I'm saying. Okay, 0:04:24.760 --> 0:04:26.640 just take a minute. Just listen to what I'm saying. 0:04:27.440 --> 0:04:30.719 When you have those boundaries that are put in and 0:04:30.960 --> 0:04:37.880 you aren't giving yourselves the opportunity to go call Jane 0:04:38.160 --> 0:04:41.280 or to go call Robert when things aren't going well 0:04:41.839 --> 0:04:46.920 within your right in your relationship right, it makes you 0:04:47.000 --> 0:04:51.159 have to confront and look at things in a different manner. 0:04:52.200 --> 0:04:55.159 So all I'm saying is that in these kinds of 0:04:55.240 --> 0:04:59.280 dynamics and just being careful that we're not trying to 0:04:59.360 --> 0:05:02.560 dodge the rain drops. There's comfort in that it provides 0:05:03.200 --> 0:05:07.640 to almost like a social order yes to life in 0:05:07.720 --> 0:05:14.520 setting boundaries and commitments. Most people are practicing monogamy because 0:05:14.560 --> 0:05:17.080 they feel like they have no other choice. We all 0:05:17.120 --> 0:05:21.320 know that most people out here do an unethical nonmonogamy 0:05:21.480 --> 0:05:27.440 an damn ways, that's the whole that's called cheating, y'all. 0:05:28.000 --> 0:05:31.120 That most people's out here just acting a food. But 0:05:31.240 --> 0:05:34.720 that's also why it's important to be able to have 0:05:34.880 --> 0:05:38.640 the discussion beforehand, which is where I think people fall short, 0:05:38.880 --> 0:05:42.080 especially today, because let me tell you something, haven't been 0:05:42.080 --> 0:05:45.520 married four times. Rodney and I had something. No, Rodney 0:05:45.520 --> 0:05:49.359 and I had some serious conversation. You have to about 0:05:49.400 --> 0:05:53.120 what does this mean to you, even even outside of 0:05:53.200 --> 0:05:55.559 the counseling that you get from your past or before 0:05:55.640 --> 0:05:57.599 you can get married, because most people that get married, 0:05:57.960 --> 0:05:59.960 you know, we'll get counseling from their from their past 0:06:00.000 --> 0:06:02.479 masters because there is a religious aspect to it, a 0:06:02.560 --> 0:06:05.520 god aspect to it. James, Yeah, for sure. And we 0:06:05.680 --> 0:06:10.840 had deep conversation about what does this mean to us? 0:06:11.800 --> 0:06:14.520 What do we want to create for for ourselves? And 0:06:14.600 --> 0:06:18.200 we actually talked about Polly Amory. It was that something 0:06:18.240 --> 0:06:21.320 that we wanted to explore. We had that conversation. But 0:06:21.400 --> 0:06:23.400 see the difference is is that you and Rodney have 0:06:23.480 --> 0:06:26.039 lived so much life, right, so when you're talking to 0:06:26.120 --> 0:06:30.239 a twenty year old who is thinking about being married. 0:06:30.560 --> 0:06:35.880 So let's see, I got married at twenty five, one 0:06:35.920 --> 0:06:40.000 of those Jesus. And the problem is if you go 0:06:40.080 --> 0:06:44.640 into a relationship thinking that this is going to be 0:06:44.720 --> 0:06:49.159 exactly how it is today till the day that you die, 0:06:49.440 --> 0:06:55.640 I die, you're in trouble, sadly mistaken, sadly mistaken now 0:06:55.800 --> 0:06:59.560 regardless what the dynamic of the love is going to be. 0:06:59.640 --> 0:07:05.279 So there five people, like it's just two people, you know, 0:07:05.680 --> 0:07:10.320 and whatever it is, it's going to change. And that's 0:07:10.360 --> 0:07:14.920 where the conversation comes in exact. The practicing monogamy has 0:07:14.960 --> 0:07:17.720 to be a choice that you make, just like practicing. 0:07:19.760 --> 0:07:22.400 So that's the thing that's the only part about marriage 0:07:22.440 --> 0:07:26.240 today and monogamy that I think is antiquated. That monogamy 0:07:26.360 --> 0:07:30.800 has to be your deef choice. It can't be because 0:07:31.080 --> 0:07:33.760 I'm told I'm supposed to do it this way. That 0:07:33.960 --> 0:07:37.880 my dear is deeply antiquated and no longer works. I 0:07:37.880 --> 0:07:41.680 guess I'm not really clear on what it offers. You. 0:07:42.080 --> 0:07:46.160 Could you imagine being in a group and loving everyone equally, 0:07:46.360 --> 0:07:50.120 know whether it be platonic or not. Wow, Well, then 0:07:50.160 --> 0:07:52.400 I don't know what to say that's because of GAM's 0:07:52.640 --> 0:07:55.400 ideas around love. Here's the one thing I want to 0:07:55.440 --> 0:07:58.000 talk to you about. This has really been something that 0:07:58.320 --> 0:08:02.120 has been a personal journey you. What are your feelings 0:08:02.120 --> 0:08:06.400 and ideas around marriage as you know it today? The 0:08:06.520 --> 0:08:10.040 history of marriage really irks me, y um, just the 0:08:10.200 --> 0:08:12.920 history of marriage as a whole and what it has 0:08:12.960 --> 0:08:16.520 represented over the years for women in particular. I feel 0:08:16.560 --> 0:08:19.720 like the only way that I would get married is 0:08:19.920 --> 0:08:22.760 let's say me and my partner are partners wants to 0:08:22.800 --> 0:08:25.920 help people, and we need to put our finances together 0:08:26.320 --> 0:08:30.520 in order to make that vision happen. That's the only 0:08:30.920 --> 0:08:33.800 way I could see myself getting married. So there has 0:08:33.840 --> 0:08:37.240 to be a common purpose. Yeah, there has to be 0:08:37.280 --> 0:08:40.040 a purpose beyond I think you're killing And that goes 0:08:40.120 --> 0:08:45.000 for any relationship. So whether it's whether it's a relationship 0:08:45.080 --> 0:08:48.880 just with yourself, it needs to be connected to something 0:08:48.960 --> 0:08:52.000 greater than you, because I think the reason why so 0:08:52.040 --> 0:08:55.440 many relationships are not working is because it's steeped in 0:08:56.000 --> 0:09:00.160 self gratification, and that is going to get you in 0:09:00.240 --> 0:09:05.040 trouble every single time. I feel like, if you're going 0:09:05.120 --> 0:09:07.080 to be married, I think one of the things that 0:09:07.200 --> 0:09:10.839 has to change is the idea that I need a husband. 0:09:10.840 --> 0:09:13.959 We're gonna have no, no, no no. What are you 0:09:14.040 --> 0:09:17.199 planning to build together? What are you planning to do together? 0:09:17.320 --> 0:09:22.439 What is the purpose of your togetherness? Because it has 0:09:22.480 --> 0:09:25.640 to be bigger than the two of you. When I 0:09:25.679 --> 0:09:29.720 look at Justin and Haley, I really they're beautiful couple. 0:09:30.000 --> 0:09:32.239 But not to say that they won't have their difficulties, 0:09:32.280 --> 0:09:34.600 because they will. But here's the thing that I love 0:09:34.640 --> 0:09:38.679 about how they've started their relationship. They agree on God. 0:09:39.440 --> 0:09:41.839 They want to serve God, and they want to love 0:09:41.920 --> 0:09:46.280 God together, and so that is always their north star. 0:09:47.440 --> 0:09:50.640 So coming to the table is a polyamorous young woman 0:09:50.679 --> 0:09:55.080 who's in a relationship with a married man. Meet Gabrielle Smith. 0:09:55.960 --> 0:10:00.480 She practices solo polyamory, meaning she has multiple partner and 0:10:00.559 --> 0:10:03.520 doesn't consider any of them more important than the others. 0:10:05.720 --> 0:10:10.720 Aaron is her platonic life partner, Doug is her sexual partner, 0:10:11.160 --> 0:10:15.920 Alex is her boyfriend. Alex has a wife. Alex's wife 0:10:15.960 --> 0:10:19.280 has a boyfriend, Jeff, and they're all down with that. 0:10:21.000 --> 0:10:24.280 Gabrielle has been very open about her relationships and has 0:10:24.320 --> 0:10:31.280 become a leading voice in the ethical nonmonogamy community. It 0:10:31.400 --> 0:10:37.560 seems extremely confusing to me. I don't understand it. Yeah, 0:10:37.880 --> 0:10:40.640 I need to hear everything you got to say. I 0:10:40.679 --> 0:10:42.199 just want to say I'm so happy that you're here 0:10:42.240 --> 0:10:46.120 because I see a lot of you know, white people 0:10:46.160 --> 0:10:50.400 talking about this specific content. And when I came across 0:10:50.440 --> 0:10:54.080 your page, I was like, oh my gosh, up, young 0:10:54.160 --> 0:10:57.280 black woman speaking her truth about this. That was my 0:10:57.320 --> 0:11:00.600 whole big thing. The face of polyamory is lessley white people, 0:11:00.880 --> 0:11:03.720 and that's not my reality. And I knew other people 0:11:04.000 --> 0:11:07.080 felt the same way. And the more you see that 0:11:07.120 --> 0:11:09.320 this is something that exists and this is something that's 0:11:09.360 --> 0:11:12.439 possible for you, the more people feel like empowered. How 0:11:12.440 --> 0:11:16.959 did you come to understanding you wanted a polyamorous relationship? 0:11:17.080 --> 0:11:18.520 And the first time I had heard about it, I 0:11:18.559 --> 0:11:21.160 was reading fan fiction. The main character was in a 0:11:21.200 --> 0:11:24.079 love triangle. The two guys were supposed to do get 0:11:24.080 --> 0:11:27.160 out to figure out who would be her love at 0:11:27.200 --> 0:11:31.280 the end, so very Barbara. It was like a thing 0:11:32.320 --> 0:11:34.440 at the end, they kind of got an equal score, 0:11:34.520 --> 0:11:37.440 so she just picked both of them, and I was like, wait, 0:11:38.360 --> 0:11:42.240 this is so much better, Like this is possible. And 0:11:42.280 --> 0:11:44.040 then I was in my first relationship, and I was 0:11:44.080 --> 0:11:47.079 like seventeen to nineteen and a year and a half 0:11:47.120 --> 0:11:49.760 in I was noticed I was like looking at other 0:11:49.800 --> 0:11:52.000 people and that kind of opened the idea of like, Okay, 0:11:52.040 --> 0:11:54.079 maybe we can do a polyamorous relationship. And then I 0:11:54.160 --> 0:11:56.560 met Alex and that kind of solidified things for me. 0:11:56.679 --> 0:11:59.560 All Right, she brought your boyfriend with you, and he 0:11:59.760 --> 0:12:04.280 is married and also has other romantic partners. Besides, I 0:12:04.320 --> 0:12:06.520 want to just start getting a little bit of background 0:12:06.720 --> 0:12:10.720 from the force, because if we were deeply intrigued, right, um, 0:12:10.760 --> 0:12:17.720 intrigued and confused, let's pull the curtain back. Yeah, yeah, 0:12:18.160 --> 0:12:22.200 back a little bit. So you're married to bridget So 0:12:22.240 --> 0:12:24.600 how did this lifestyle come up for the both of you. 0:12:24.920 --> 0:12:28.280 We've been together almost ten years and we've been open 0:12:28.400 --> 0:12:30.920 for about half of that time. Okay, we're about five 0:12:30.960 --> 0:12:33.360 years into our relationship and you know, there's lots of 0:12:33.400 --> 0:12:37.719 challenging scenarios that happened in monogamy. Yeah, commitment is a 0:12:37.800 --> 0:12:41.800 learning experience. Yes, since the beginning, we're always really candid 0:12:41.880 --> 0:12:44.360 with our relationships. When it came to being attracted to 0:12:44.360 --> 0:12:46.760 other people, and we woulda socialized of parties, we'd be 0:12:46.760 --> 0:12:49.600 a little Ferty, and we kind of dug that about 0:12:49.600 --> 0:12:53.360 each other. So one thing lent to another and her 0:12:53.400 --> 0:12:55.920 and I decided to try to open things up. And 0:12:56.080 --> 0:12:58.000 I don't think we did it to try to fix 0:12:58.120 --> 0:13:01.720 our relationship. I've always had the strong feeling of commitment, 0:13:01.880 --> 0:13:04.880 Like I really cherished commitment a lot. So for me, 0:13:04.960 --> 0:13:07.360 it was a little complicated first to wrap my head 0:13:07.360 --> 0:13:09.400 around it. But I was in because I thought that 0:13:09.440 --> 0:13:13.280 it would be like a journey. So how did the 0:13:13.320 --> 0:13:18.360 two of you meet? We went out Tinder? Anything crazy? 0:13:18.600 --> 0:13:21.240 We went on our first date. It was you were 0:13:21.320 --> 0:13:23.680 he was coming from dinner with his wife and a 0:13:23.760 --> 0:13:26.240 friend of theirs and we got a drink. Did everybody 0:13:26.280 --> 0:13:29.520 come or did you just Yeah, it was just that. 0:13:31.559 --> 0:13:35.559 We waited a month, we clicked. We clicked. Do you 0:13:35.640 --> 0:13:40.680 and his wife have a relationship relationship? Yeah, we don't. 0:13:41.480 --> 0:13:45.559 We don't have to because it's pretty much a requirement 0:13:45.640 --> 0:13:48.560 if I'm like dating someone with a partner. Um, we 0:13:48.679 --> 0:13:51.600 practice what is called kitchen table Polly. I'm right where 0:13:51.720 --> 0:13:54.480 like I at the very minimum need to meet someone's 0:13:54.480 --> 0:13:57.040 partner because I need to kind of know what energy 0:13:57.080 --> 0:13:59.440 you have going on at home. I need to make 0:13:59.440 --> 0:14:01.880 sure is are Okay. I think we're all very lucky 0:14:02.040 --> 0:14:06.800 because we get along so well. Alex's wife Bridget shared 0:14:06.920 --> 0:14:11.840 why your relationship works for her. Alex is one of 0:14:11.840 --> 0:14:15.000 the most loyal people I've ever met, Like more than 0:14:15.040 --> 0:14:18.199 I could ever even hope to be. Alex is so loyal, 0:14:18.559 --> 0:14:21.240 Like if we do skip a date night, or if 0:14:21.320 --> 0:14:24.080 he sees somebody like three nights a week and we 0:14:24.120 --> 0:14:26.400 haven't had dinner together yet. Like, I know this sounds 0:14:26.600 --> 0:14:29.360 maybe crazy some people, but it really doesn't bother me 0:14:29.960 --> 0:14:32.160 because I just know at the end of the day 0:14:32.200 --> 0:14:36.800 that Alex isn't going anywhere. Yeah, and I love that 0:14:36.880 --> 0:14:40.000 she has her own boyfriend because I feel like there's 0:14:40.120 --> 0:14:43.280 this trend where it's like the men can have all 0:14:43.280 --> 0:14:46.280 the parts, yes, and then it's like, oh, once the 0:14:46.320 --> 0:14:48.840 woman wants to have a partner, it's like, oh wait, 0:14:48.840 --> 0:14:51.000 now we're going a little too far here. But it's 0:14:51.040 --> 0:14:55.960 also specifically you can't date other men. Yeah, I'm with 0:14:56.000 --> 0:14:58.440 women because a woman can't stay on my girlfriend me, 0:14:58.520 --> 0:15:04.160 which like which exactly, Okay, so I have because I 0:15:04.200 --> 0:15:11.360 am struggling and I want to feel like I am ready. 0:15:11.400 --> 0:15:14.600 I just don't understand it. It still sounds to me, 0:15:14.720 --> 0:15:19.240 like the major motivation is sexual. It's not about, oh, 0:15:19.320 --> 0:15:21.800 I want to have all these partners. I want to 0:15:21.840 --> 0:15:24.080 do all of these things. It's just like my sexuality. 0:15:24.120 --> 0:15:26.640 I'm not specifically attracted to men, and I'm not specifically 0:15:26.680 --> 0:15:30.560 attracted to women or any other gender. It's that I'm 0:15:30.600 --> 0:15:34.240 open to anything. I want to be able to take 0:15:34.320 --> 0:15:37.480 opportunities if I feel like they're natural to me. You 0:15:37.520 --> 0:15:42.240 also have a platonic different relationships, Like we're just friends, 0:15:42.440 --> 0:15:45.080 but it was deeper than like a normal friendship. It 0:15:45.160 --> 0:15:47.600 was very intimate, and I think that's what makes the difference, 0:15:47.600 --> 0:15:49.440 and that's why I consider her like a life partner. 0:15:49.480 --> 0:15:51.680 I jokingly call her my wife. We did try to 0:15:51.760 --> 0:15:55.320 like have sex ones and it didn't work. Yeah, like 0:15:55.400 --> 0:15:59.760 we run into it, never like literally mutually decided we're good. 0:16:00.080 --> 0:16:02.920 She is so special to me, and like our relationship 0:16:03.000 --> 0:16:06.080 has like a lot of debts. Romantic and platonic relationships 0:16:06.120 --> 0:16:09.040 can be equal. To me, Alex, why did you decide 0:16:09.080 --> 0:16:11.400 to get married in the first place? Because I deeply 0:16:11.440 --> 0:16:14.480 loved Bridget and the show with our commitment to tell 0:16:14.520 --> 0:16:16.720 each other like this is our journey together. But there 0:16:16.800 --> 0:16:19.160 was a familial element too, like we wanted our whole 0:16:19.160 --> 0:16:23.000 family to be there together, like celebrate our love. And 0:16:23.120 --> 0:16:26.160 the wedding was amazing, it was beautiful. What kind of 0:16:26.280 --> 0:16:30.960 rules of boundaries did you and Bridget create for yourselves? 0:16:31.240 --> 0:16:34.160 As we progressed of the boundary, it was less about 0:16:34.160 --> 0:16:39.640 boundaries and more about being completely honest and communicative, communicative 0:16:39.680 --> 0:16:42.120 with each other about our intentions, about our expectations of 0:16:42.120 --> 0:16:46.120 one another. That actually strengthened our relationship. Because polyamory forces 0:16:46.200 --> 0:16:48.800 you to make or break either you figure it out 0:16:49.560 --> 0:16:52.120 or you don't. There are times when we're the only 0:16:52.160 --> 0:16:58.480 people that can host, in which case I get sex siled. Yeah. 0:16:58.720 --> 0:17:01.520 Sex siling is when you look at the calendar, oh tomorrow, 0:17:02.200 --> 0:17:05.359 uh so and says coming over and Bridget is hosting. 0:17:05.400 --> 0:17:07.080 That means that I need to find something to do, 0:17:07.280 --> 0:17:09.040 either work late, or go see a movie, or hang 0:17:09.040 --> 0:17:12.600 out with a friend or go to the bar. To 0:17:12.680 --> 0:17:15.720 be quite frank, we didn't have too many boundaries at first. 0:17:16.200 --> 0:17:20.320 We were just interested in exploring and meeting new people 0:17:20.440 --> 0:17:25.040 and having new experiences at sexual experiences as well. I 0:17:25.080 --> 0:17:26.760 know what you're thinking, so, and the other thing is 0:17:27.520 --> 0:17:30.720 the other thing is, yes, there's a sexual element I 0:17:30.800 --> 0:17:33.240 do enjoy novel sex, and I don't think there's anything 0:17:33.440 --> 0:17:35.879 shameful about that. If you're being honest with the other 0:17:35.880 --> 0:17:39.480 partners about Gaby also enjoys sex. So it is my way, 0:17:39.720 --> 0:17:41.560 it's it's and that's a part of who we are 0:17:41.600 --> 0:17:43.560 and we're not ashamed of it. Well, I think that's 0:17:43.600 --> 0:17:47.240 great and meaning at least you can be honest about 0:17:47.240 --> 0:17:52.399 it both, because I think there's a lot of non consensual, 0:17:54.480 --> 0:17:59.600 non monogamy going on. People will not just be on 0:18:00.720 --> 0:18:02.480 if the numbers add up with all these two tickets, 0:18:02.520 --> 0:18:04.480 everyone's thrown around about marriage and how it fails and 0:18:04.520 --> 0:18:06.880 how it doesn't, then we're all thinking about it. Yeah, 0:18:06.960 --> 0:18:10.480 you have to talk about the more exactly. It's like, yo, 0:18:10.880 --> 0:18:14.480 if you're already thinking about it in your monogamous relationship, 0:18:15.119 --> 0:18:18.280 it's gonna be the same anious relationship. You have to 0:18:18.320 --> 0:18:22.119 be saying more. Shouldn't be thinking about everybody, right, But 0:18:22.160 --> 0:18:25.200 people are like, I shouldn't and I but I want 0:18:25.200 --> 0:18:28.240 to also put One day, I'm gonna wake up and 0:18:28.280 --> 0:18:30.119 a miracle is going to happen, and I'm just gonna 0:18:30.119 --> 0:18:32.640 be monogon this guy. I know you aren't putting too 0:18:32.880 --> 0:18:38.239 too much on on the negative side of monogamy. It's 0:18:38.320 --> 0:18:40.680 not right, so we don't we don't want to put 0:18:40.760 --> 0:18:44.560 that out. We all established that we don't get frustrated. 0:18:44.600 --> 0:18:48.000 Will Oh, don't get frustrated because I just want to 0:18:48.040 --> 0:18:53.000 be clear that some people like monogamy. Monogamy itself is fine, 0:18:53.160 --> 0:18:55.880 but when you form a poonamorous relationship, instead of rules, 0:18:56.000 --> 0:19:00.639 let's think about boundaries and then agreements, because maybe are 0:19:00.920 --> 0:19:04.119 very much like you can't do that. The boundary is 0:19:04.400 --> 0:19:06.840 this is something that I would not like. I think 0:19:06.880 --> 0:19:09.600 the only real agreement we have this fluid funding, which 0:19:09.640 --> 0:19:12.879 is like comdo musage with other people, which makes a 0:19:12.920 --> 0:19:14.840 lot of sense because health is it a health factor 0:19:15.320 --> 0:19:20.240 health here. So when Alex did have another partner, I asked, 0:19:20.720 --> 0:19:23.880 you know, I don't want to hear unsolicited sexual details 0:19:23.960 --> 0:19:27.399 about what's going on, because that was like for my comfort. 0:19:27.520 --> 0:19:30.440 It's really interesting because I keep hearing you referring back 0:19:30.520 --> 0:19:33.840 to Alex for everything. It seems more like he is 0:19:35.119 --> 0:19:39.639 more your partner than you think, because he's like an 0:19:39.680 --> 0:19:42.760 anchor for me essentially, like I have dated other people 0:19:43.640 --> 0:19:46.360 and I would maybe not right now, but I lean 0:19:46.520 --> 0:19:49.040 later I would like to have another partner. Nobody really 0:19:49.119 --> 0:19:51.800 like fully measures up to the level of commitment I 0:19:51.840 --> 0:19:54.600 get from Alex. Would do holidays look like for you guys? 0:19:56.080 --> 0:19:59.040 Christmas again? Yeah we did for the first time, or 0:19:59.400 --> 0:20:01.920 yeah we So that's beautiful. It was me you and 0:20:02.040 --> 0:20:05.440 Bridget did did Jeff come? They did come from us? Yeah? 0:20:05.560 --> 0:20:09.480 So Jeff is Bridget's boyfriend, Jeff Bridge. So we all 0:20:09.560 --> 0:20:12.800 hung out for years and my roommate came with us. 0:20:12.960 --> 0:20:15.920 So holidays I think we would like them to be 0:20:16.080 --> 0:20:19.440 like that. Alex. When your girlfriend and your wife don't 0:20:19.480 --> 0:20:25.320 get along, tell me what that looks like. Oh, I mean, 0:20:25.359 --> 0:20:28.280 it doesn't happen a lot, but it has happened, so 0:20:28.320 --> 0:20:31.560 I want to know what that looks like. It challenges 0:20:31.640 --> 0:20:37.080 my mediation skills. When your partners get along, it's easier 0:20:37.160 --> 0:20:40.000 to manage your time because they can do things together. 0:20:40.640 --> 0:20:44.520 The Google calendar is red hot if your partners don't 0:20:44.560 --> 0:20:49.159 get along, Holley, memory is not for everybody. Disclaimer, I 0:20:49.200 --> 0:20:53.720 would think that that would be extremely challenging. It doesn't 0:20:53.880 --> 0:20:58.560 have to be such a laborious task if you understand 0:20:58.640 --> 0:21:02.200 and you believe that low is not a limited resource. 0:21:02.320 --> 0:21:05.040 Nobody can take Alex away from me. And he's married. 0:21:06.520 --> 0:21:08.160 A lot of people will be like, well, what if 0:21:08.280 --> 0:21:10.800 Bridget decides that she just doesn't want to do this anymore. 0:21:10.840 --> 0:21:13.280 I asked him this like at one point, and he 0:21:13.480 --> 0:21:15.439 was like, it's just not gonna happen. And it's because 0:21:15.680 --> 0:21:18.960 me and Bridget always talk about are issues before they 0:21:19.080 --> 0:21:21.520 become issues. Can you give me an example of what 0:21:21.640 --> 0:21:25.080 you're talking about. Sure, if I know I'm going to 0:21:25.119 --> 0:21:28.119 be late and with somebody else, but Bridge is expecting 0:21:28.200 --> 0:21:30.479 me to be home at a certain time, I got 0:21:30.600 --> 0:21:32.359 to warn her ahead of time. I can't just let 0:21:32.400 --> 0:21:33.920 her assume and be home on time, going to show 0:21:34.000 --> 0:21:37.040 up late and disappoint her. You have to manage your 0:21:37.040 --> 0:21:40.320 expectations with your partners. Monogamous people can't even do that. 0:21:41.600 --> 0:21:43.879 I know what I mean, It's like, fine, that's my 0:21:44.000 --> 0:21:47.320 main point at that level of honesty and being able 0:21:47.359 --> 0:21:49.359 to have the courage to explore in this way so 0:21:49.480 --> 0:21:52.720 that you can actually get to a more authentic, exactlyship. 0:21:53.160 --> 0:21:56.520 I can currently can manage multiple relationships, just like I 0:21:56.560 --> 0:22:01.000 can manage multiple friendship exactly Previously three partners at one time. 0:22:01.240 --> 0:22:03.280 How did that work out? I mean, how did that 0:22:03.400 --> 0:22:07.440 work for you? I mean it was challenging. I do 0:22:07.600 --> 0:22:10.400 run my own business, so that's like almost like another commitment. 0:22:11.800 --> 0:22:17.040 It was challenging for surely had four partners. They couldn't 0:22:17.080 --> 0:22:20.840 see myself going past two outside of It's a lot. 0:22:21.200 --> 0:22:24.000 How many other relationships are you involved in? Right now? 0:22:24.280 --> 0:22:27.600 It's just my wife and Gavy. But now after the pandemic, 0:22:27.840 --> 0:22:31.639 I'm still excited about opening up my relationship to other people, 0:22:31.720 --> 0:22:34.280 but not in the same committed way that I am. 0:22:34.320 --> 0:22:38.359 A bridget and okay got it. So joining the table 0:22:38.440 --> 0:22:42.440 as someone who just started exploring polyamory. A couple of 0:22:42.520 --> 0:22:46.800 years ago, twenty eight year old Gabrielle Alexa Nowel came 0:22:46.840 --> 0:22:51.080 out as bisexual after a strict religious upbringing. Now she's 0:22:51.119 --> 0:22:56.320 opening herself up to the polyamorous lifestyle. Hi, today we 0:22:56.440 --> 0:23:01.159 have Gavin gab the two Gas. You consider yourself a 0:23:01.280 --> 0:23:05.719 Polly Newbie? I am. I was just single, but then 0:23:05.840 --> 0:23:08.879 dating polyamorous people, and then I guess I thought one day, like, 0:23:09.040 --> 0:23:10.879 I mean, I could just have this for myself. How 0:23:11.000 --> 0:23:14.959 does your family feel about you being a Polly Newbie? Um? 0:23:15.000 --> 0:23:19.480 And they have no idea. There's I was very indoctrinated 0:23:19.520 --> 0:23:21.359 into the church and they had me signed like a 0:23:21.520 --> 0:23:24.080 purity packed and there was like a lot of measures 0:23:24.119 --> 0:23:26.280 of control that were baked into the way that I 0:23:26.400 --> 0:23:29.320 was raised to look at relationships. I just know that 0:23:29.440 --> 0:23:32.240 they would not understand it, and I would love for 0:23:32.400 --> 0:23:34.439 them to come to that understanding. And I think when 0:23:34.520 --> 0:23:37.400 they will, they just figured the By thing out. They're 0:23:37.440 --> 0:23:40.040 just like okay, like science says, that's okay, I guess, 0:23:40.119 --> 0:23:42.879 And you do have to pick your battles. Sometimes you 0:23:42.960 --> 0:23:44.480 can't come out as By, and then you go and 0:23:44.560 --> 0:23:46.640 I'm polly An, you gotta be like I'm By. Let's 0:23:46.640 --> 0:23:50.000 work on this for a couple of years. And well, 0:23:50.119 --> 0:23:51.639 I mean, you think it the net go see you 0:23:51.720 --> 0:23:54.720 on this show. I was right, they get my friend 0:23:55.720 --> 0:23:58.159 better be ready. If they did ask me, I'd be 0:23:58.200 --> 0:24:00.840