Speaker 1: Heads up, this series contains graphic descriptions of violence. That's
Speaker 1: why by Kab will be charged as per your international
Speaker 1: plan to continue.
Speaker 2: Please hold.
Speaker 1: After several of my emails to journalist Tom Mangold went unanswered,
Speaker 1: I found his phone number and gave him a call
Speaker 1: in March of twenty twenty five. Hi is this Tom Mangold?
Speaker 1: I tell him I'm a journalist working on the Jessica
Speaker 1: Current case. Yes, sir, so you did a series of
Speaker 1: stories about it. I say I'm covering how the prosecution's
Speaker 1: case against Quincy Cross seems to be falling apart, and
Speaker 1: that according to emails my team and I have reviewed,
Speaker 1: it's clear he knew that the state's main witness, Victoria Caldwell,
Speaker 1: had recanted parts of the story against Quincy Cross, yet
Speaker 1: he still chose to publish his final piece without any
Speaker 1: mention of her changing narratives and admitted lies. He tells
Speaker 1: me he hasn't seen my emails. Thank you so much, sir. Bye.
Speaker 1: Tom Mangold did write back shortly after we hung up.
Speaker 3: So he emails, Yeah, I have a credits I'm made
Speaker 3: to folk in my computer and I called up my
Speaker 3: producer Rebecca with the update.
Speaker 4: What does he say?
Speaker 1: The email says, Maggie, thanks for your note.
Speaker 5: The Quincy Cross's Innocent movement in quotes has been running
Speaker 5: in Mayfield for many years. People have jumped on and
Speaker 5: off that bandwagon ever since Susan received her reward from
Speaker 5: the State of Kentucky. I suggest you take the time
Speaker 5: and trouble to discuss the case with Bob O'Neil first,
Speaker 5: then go and get the transcripts of the court case
Speaker 5: and read the entire prosecution case. If you sol think
Speaker 5: Cross is innocent, that's your conclusion as a journal.
Speaker 1: Okay, Bob O'Neil is the KBI agent who is still
Speaker 1: in touch with Victoria and who declined my interview request.
Speaker 1: I replied to Tom and tell him I actually found
Speaker 1: his suggestion that I hadn't read all the documents patronizing,
Speaker 1: and then I offer him the opportunity to reflect on
Speaker 1: his work twenty years later, to which he shoots back.
Speaker 6: Any publication or broadcast in the United States which infers
Speaker 6: I may have behaved unprofessionally in the current murder will
Speaker 6: of course be instantly sued for both libel, both myself
Speaker 6: and the BBC. Now please don't pester me any further.
Speaker 6: All you batty conspiracy theorists are the same.
Speaker 1: When I was first approached with Quincy Cross's case, many
Speaker 1: of the people fighting on his behalf told me that
Speaker 1: Susan Galbreath had played a key role in Quincy's conviction,
Speaker 1: that an everyday citizen helped craft the theory the prosecution
Speaker 1: used at trial and helped find their most important witness.
Speaker 1: And by Tom Mangled's own reporting, he played a big
Speaker 1: role in Susan's journey from his very first trip to Kentucky.
Speaker 7: We use my room at the somewhat humble Mayfield Super
Speaker 7: eight motel as an office. We lived off toxic coffee,
Speaker 7: fried food, and some smuggled in Sauvignon Blanc. I became
Speaker 7: her news editor. She became my trainee cub reporter. I
Speaker 7: taught her my trade from the bottom up.
Speaker 3: I learned quite a bit from him. I learned how
Speaker 3: to not follow every rumor. I learned better from him
Speaker 3: how to distinguish rumor from fact. But it was a
Speaker 3: hard call in this case. We started a friendship and
Speaker 3: we became a team, and I felt an equal part
Speaker 3: of that team.
Speaker 1: Tom spoke publicly about how there was a lot of
Speaker 1: interest in making a movie about the odd couple who
Speaker 1: helped solve a murder, and according to the emails obtained
Speaker 1: by the Kentucky Innocence Project, Tom was pursuing a movie
Speaker 1: deal until at least twenty eighteen. When Susan Golbreeth died.
Speaker 1: That year, her sister took over her estate for a
Speaker 1: few months. She wrote Tom about Susan's last days and
Speaker 1: about business. She talked about handling any future film deals,
Speaker 1: and Tom told Susan's sister that he would fight to
Speaker 1: keep the project alive, but eventually studios lost interest. That
Speaker 1: was probably for the best, because knowing what we know today,
Speaker 1: it's fair to say they got this whole murder story wrong.
Speaker 1: Tom is ninety years old now. He's had a storied
Speaker 1: career as a war correspondent, an investigative journalist. He's faced
Speaker 1: down known gangsters and heads of state. I'm not looking
Speaker 1: to drag his life's work in the mud, but the
Speaker 1: story of Quincy Cross as the ringleader in this heinous
Speaker 1: crime is simply not born out by the evidence, and
Speaker 1: the main witnesses to this alleged crime are now all
Speaker 1: on the record saying they lied. Perhaps none of This
Speaker 1: is enough for Tom Mangel to say Quincy Cross shouldn't
Speaker 1: be in prison, But if he had agreed to talk
Speaker 1: to me, I would have asked him, shouldn't it take
Speaker 1: more than the word of a few girls or the
Speaker 1: theories of an amateur sleuth for a journalist to make
Speaker 1: such ruinous accusations against everyday citizens. Shouldn't it take more
Speaker 1: for the state to put a man in prison for life,
Speaker 1: to take a mother from her children and a father
Speaker 1: from his family. How far are cops and prosecutors allowed
Speaker 1: to go in their pursuit of justice? And who do
Speaker 1: we hold accountable when their whole case falls apart? These
Speaker 1: are questions that Tom refuses to answer, but that Jeff Burton,
Speaker 1: Tamra Caldwell, and Quincy Cross live with every day.
Speaker 8: For me personally, from two thousand and seven and until now,
Speaker 8: this whole thing is my whole Life's been like an
Speaker 8: everybody experience. I can't even explain, like an emotional fucking
Speaker 8: wreck that I have not been able to overcome.
Speaker 7: No, my trust in people is.
Speaker 9: Like a loved one.
Speaker 4: Now I don't trust anybody.
Speaker 1: I don't trust nobody really, you know, since.
Speaker 9: I've been incarcerated, you know, I've been further educating myself
Speaker 9: on different things, but what I really want.
Speaker 10: To do is start with family business and all they
Speaker 10: care of my family.
Speaker 11: Mostly.
Speaker 10: I'm family oriented.
Speaker 6: I was raised that way.
Speaker 10: So that's what hurts the most out of do in
Speaker 10: prison time for something you didn't do, being away from
Speaker 10: the people that you love.
Speaker 1: And what about Tom's heroine, Susan Galbreath. According to Tom's
Speaker 1: own reporting, she didn't get a triumphant ending. Sure she
Speaker 1: got recognized by the Attorney General's office, but the people
Speaker 1: of Mayfield didn't hold her up as a hero. Susan
Speaker 1: ended up having to carry a gun for her own protection,
Speaker 1: and she even contemplated leaving Mayfield for good, moving back
Speaker 1: to Chicago, but she never did. This is Graves County,
Speaker 1: chapter six, something Rotten. Before telling you what the future
Speaker 1: may hold for Quincy Cross, I'd like to take you
Speaker 1: back one last time to the summer of two thousand
Speaker 1: in Mayfield, Kentucky, because even though I never set out
Speaker 1: to solve Jessica's case, I wanted to at least understand
Speaker 1: how the investigation went so wrong. And in trying to
Speaker 1: answer that question, believe it or not, I found a
Speaker 1: common line of reporting with journalist Tom Mangled. Tom didn't
Speaker 1: just zero in on Quincy Cross. He also went after
Speaker 1: Mayfield law enforcement. Earlier in the season, you heard about
Speaker 1: Tim Fortner, the rookie Mayfield police detective who led and
Speaker 1: bungled the first investigation into Jessica's death. He's the man who,
Speaker 1: according to Jessica's father, said this to his family.
Speaker 12: Told us me and my wife did he had no
Speaker 12: clue what he was doing. He didn't know what he
Speaker 12: was doing.
Speaker 1: But Joe Kern says Fortner didn't just admit incompetence. He
Speaker 1: went on to imply that he'd been set up to fail.
Speaker 12: He said, I don't know what I'm doing. Place I go,
Speaker 12: it's like somebody's already been there before me. That's his words.
Speaker 12: So before his four tenure ended, they promoted him to
Speaker 12: assistant chief. And when he saw my wife at Walmart,
Speaker 12: he saw her and he started crying and he said,
Speaker 12: I'm afraid for my life. And he said, I'm gonna move,
Speaker 12: and he moved to Murray. He moved a few miles
Speaker 12: down the road to another place and got a job there.
Speaker 1: What do you think he was afraid of?
Speaker 12: I don't know who you're afraid of When you're a
Speaker 12: police chief and have a badge and a gun. I
Speaker 12: don't know who you're afraid of. How could you be afraid?
Speaker 1: From what I've been able to gather, one of the
Speaker 1: people Fortner was afraid of was the assistant chief of
Speaker 1: police at the time of Jessica's death, Ronnie Lear. Ronnie
Speaker 1: Leir was the man who appointed Tim Fortner as lead
Speaker 1: detective in the case. Even though Fortner didn't know the
Speaker 1: first thing about investigating a homicide, and even though Fortner
Speaker 1: declined my interview request, I do have him on tape
Speaker 1: talking about his disdain for his former boss.
Speaker 13: What's your opinion of Ronnie Lee right now?
Speaker 1: This is from a two thousand and seven interview with
Speaker 1: the Kentucky Bureau of Investigation or KBI.
Speaker 14: My opinion of Ronnie is that he's which it's the
Speaker 14: same opinion as it has been, that he's the son
Speaker 14: of a itch for even given this to me. Because
Speaker 14: it's been a total nightmare and I've just never done
Speaker 14: anything such as investigated anything like, especially this horrendous.
Speaker 1: Why wouldn't the assistant chief of police set this case
Speaker 1: up for success? It was Mayfield's first murder in more
Speaker 1: than a year. Jessica was a teenager, a new mom,
Speaker 1: and Lear knew Jessica's family. He came up in Mayfield
Speaker 1: with Joe Curran.
Speaker 12: Actually we had been playing basketball together a year or
Speaker 12: so before all of this, and he knew me. He
Speaker 12: knew me for a long time. And I worked at
Speaker 12: the fire department, he worked at the police department, and
Speaker 12: we kind of, you know, see cases together and a
Speaker 12: lot of times they go to it.
Speaker 1: From the second I started investigating this case, I've heard
Speaker 1: Ronnie Lear's name, like in one of my first interviews
Speaker 1: with private investigator Nobel Faulkner.
Speaker 15: Let me tell you something, these police around here are
Speaker 15: so corrupt it's not even funny.
Speaker 1: And Tamra Caldwell, I've been here in his name ever
Speaker 1: since we got to Mayfield in ninety three. Everybody was
Speaker 1: scared to talk about him. Scared, you know, everybody brought
Speaker 1: up his name. He was just known to be corrupt.
Speaker 1: Ronnie Lear is mentioned in records about the case from
Speaker 1: the Kentucky State Police and even the Kentucky Bureau of Investigation.
Speaker 1: Mostly people were saying he's crooked or worse. That's what
Speaker 1: Tim Fortner told the KBI in two thousand and seven.
Speaker 16: And I don't know how.
Speaker 14: It's just my good feeling, but I just feel luck
Speaker 14: in some way. And I'll say it from a long
Speaker 14: time that he's involved in it.
Speaker 13: I've told him a why they're involved in this case?
Speaker 12: Yes, because Mark, Yes?
Speaker 1: Especially why would Tim Fortner believe that, you know?
Speaker 11: Still emotionally is a red hot case in Mayfield.
Speaker 1: Michael Grice served a very short stint as chief for
Speaker 1: the Mayfield Police Department from two thousand and four to
Speaker 1: two thousand and five, years after Ronnie Lear's tenure, Mayfield
Speaker 1: officials hired Grice after searching the country for months. He
Speaker 1: was a law enforcement veteran from Illinois with almost two
Speaker 1: decades of experience. He had legitimacy Mayfield police desperately needed,
Speaker 1: especially after the failure with the Jessica Current investigation.
Speaker 2: When I started there, that was a past issue that
Speaker 2: nobody would talk about, and anybody that had anything to
Speaker 2: do with it denied having anything to do with it.
Speaker 2: It was over time that I got some people to
Speaker 2: tell me, oh, yeah, I was there that night, or
Speaker 2: or I did this, or I did that, But they
Speaker 2: don't want to admit anything to do with the investigation.
Speaker 2: They didn't want to admit to having any part of
Speaker 2: the case itself. Why because it turned into such a shambles.
Speaker 1: After Mayfield detectives bungled the case, Gryce says, the town
Speaker 1: was a buzz with rumors of a police cover up.
Speaker 1: He spoke to my producer, Rebecca, there was.
Speaker 11: All kinds of stories going round at the time, and
Speaker 11: just nothing good. Nothing good for the Mayfield.
Speaker 1: Police Department who was telling Bee's stories general.
Speaker 11: Public, you know, just not people in the field. You know,
Speaker 11: people would say I heard that. I said, oh, yeah,
Speaker 11: where did you hear that? Well, you know, I'm my
Speaker 11: cousin's friend's uncle. You know, you get down the line
Speaker 11: of things, and there was no finite source that could
Speaker 11: ever be located to say yeah, that's true.
Speaker 1: In listening back to old police interviews from Jessica's case,
Speaker 1: there was a sense around town that the cops had
Speaker 1: something to do with her death.
Speaker 14: Somebody said, it's a police sent them word beause someone
Speaker 14: don't know.
Speaker 8: But mostly it was about that the cops was involved
Speaker 8: in it, that she was messing with one of the cops,
Speaker 8: they got her pregnant.
Speaker 14: There's something in this town somebody knows, and people are
Speaker 14: afraid to talk.
Speaker 1: I don't know why, but I might know why. The
Speaker 1: top brass of Mayfield law enforcement had a reputation. People
Speaker 1: said they were involved in illegal dealings with some of
Speaker 1: the local drug runners. There were whispers that they sexually
Speaker 1: harassed local women and teens. Jessica, on the other hand,
Speaker 1: was dating a known drug dealer, and there were rumors
Speaker 1: that she was a drug informant, though that was later refuted.
Speaker 1: From what I can piece together, people took this information
Speaker 1: and let their imaginations fill in the blanks. And it
Speaker 1: didn't help that some of the rumors against the cops,
Speaker 1: including Ronnie Lear, turned out to be true. Sometime after
Speaker 1: Jessica's murder, Ronnie Lear was suspended without pay for selling
Speaker 1: a VCR and stereo from the evidence room and pocketing
Speaker 1: the money. A dispatcher at the precinct had also claimed
Speaker 1: that Lear and one of his colleagues were misus using
Speaker 1: city funds, including money confiscated from drug arrests. The same
Speaker 1: dispatcher also claimed that Lear had coerced her into a
Speaker 1: sexual encounter and then threatened her to stay silent. Then,
Speaker 1: several months after Jessica's death, Lear resigned. He told the
Speaker 1: press that he was leaving because his heart just wasn't
Speaker 1: in the job anymore. But the Mayfield mayor at the time,
Speaker 1: Wayne Potts, said Ronnie Lear tendered his resignation shortly after
Speaker 1: Potts confronted him about the dispatcher's sexual harassment claims. And
Speaker 1: when officers cleared Lear's desk they found around eighty baggies
Speaker 1: and foils of suspected crack cocaine, a few bags of
Speaker 1: suspected marijuana, and handguns that weren't police weapons or registered
Speaker 1: into evidence. And all this malfeasance raised red flags for
Speaker 1: Tom Mangled too.
Speaker 7: Half the top echelon of Mayfield Police that imploded with
Speaker 7: grubby little fiddles and corrupt practices. But it got worse
Speaker 7: for Lea mayor.
Speaker 1: Potts died in twenty nineteen, but Tom spoke to him
Speaker 1: a few years before about Lear's reputation and the drugs
Speaker 1: in his desk.
Speaker 13: My guess would be that he had taken them away
Speaker 13: from some of the street runners and said, hey, you
Speaker 13: know you got drugs. I'm gonna put you in jail
Speaker 13: for five years, or give me that bag of drugs
Speaker 13: and you hit the road run and don't ever come back.
Speaker 1: Lear claimed that he was using the confiscated material for
Speaker 1: show and tell visits in the public schools, but Mayor
Speaker 1: Potts said he didn't buy it.
Speaker 13: That's enough drugs to do half of Mayfield. The state
Speaker 13: police sent a special investigator in. He had worked with
Speaker 13: drug investigations for years. He got into the accounting the money,
Speaker 13: and he found where there was thousands of dollars taken.
Speaker 1: Lear and his boss, the Mayfield Chief of Police, were
Speaker 1: eventually indicted on felony charges of misusing public funds, but
Speaker 1: Lear cut a deal with prosecutors. He didn't get prison time,
Speaker 1: and because he stayed out of trouble for a few years,
Speaker 1: the felony has been erased from his permanent record. That
Speaker 1: means nosy journalists like me and Tom will never get
Speaker 1: the full story on the extent of his malfeasance. When
Speaker 1: Lear left his job as assistant chief of police, he
Speaker 1: apologized to the community, paid some of the money back,
Speaker 1: and eventually moved to Alabama. He left law enforcement altogether
Speaker 1: and got a job at an insurance company. But Ronnie
Speaker 1: Lear's presence and the failures under his leadership lingered on.
Speaker 1: In Jessica's case. When the Kentucky State Police took over
Speaker 1: the investigation, they actually asked Ronnie Lear if he ever
Speaker 1: concealed information or was in any way connected to Jessica's death.
Speaker 1: Ronnie Lear denied any involvement. He even agreed to take
Speaker 1: a polygraph, but that appears to never have happened.
Speaker 4: Okay, so we got a big box.
Speaker 9: In the mail.
Speaker 1: Rebecca and I requested Ronnie Lear's personnel file from ninety
Speaker 1: seven to two thousand and three. Maybe we'd find a
Speaker 1: smoking gun connecting leir to Jessica. Lear joined Mayfield Police
Speaker 1: in nineteen ninety and worked his way to assistant chief
Speaker 1: after a stint with the Army National Guard.
Speaker 4: Is six' to, two brown, hair blue. Eyes he's got
Speaker 4: a high school degree and an.
Speaker 1: Associates he's married with, kids a, churchgoer.
Speaker 4: Member Of rotary, club president Of mayfield And Graves county
Speaker 4: Child advocacy.
Speaker 1: Program there's a lot of everyday paperwork in the. Box
Speaker 1: this is a. Payroll there's for seats for, travel, reimbursements
Speaker 1: certificates of completion from courses like leadership for The New,
Speaker 1: century insurance. Documents there's record of his disciplinary hearings that
Speaker 1: match up with what has been reported in the, press
Speaker 1: like stealing A vcr from the evidence room and a
Speaker 1: spattering of complaints going back to ninety. Seven but what
Speaker 1: catches our eye is what isn't There no mention of
Speaker 1: the piles of drugs reportedly confiscated from his, desk or
Speaker 1: the reported sexual harassment claim against, him and no mention Of.
Speaker 1: Jessica the Allegations i've heard Against Ronnie lear go beyond
Speaker 1: misuse of funds and stealing, evidence yet many of them
Speaker 1: have been made by the same unreliable witnesses that first
Speaker 1: Implicated Jeremy adams and the murder and Then Quincy. Cross
Speaker 1: according to the emails obtained by The Kentucky Innocence, Project
Speaker 1: Victoria caldwell made a formal complaint Against lear to The
Speaker 1: Attorney general's, office And Tom mangled followed up on our
Speaker 1: claims to no. Avail The AG's office eventually told him
Speaker 1: That victoria dropped the, complaint And tom did not Publish victoria's.
Speaker 1: Claims we've reached out to The Kentucky Attorney general and
Speaker 1: The Kentucky State police for any records they may have On,
Speaker 1: lear hoping to confirm any further. Allegations of, misconduct but
Speaker 1: they either don't have them or haven't made them available to,
Speaker 1: us And Ronnie lear hasn't agreed to an.
Speaker 7: Interview casefully, Solved SOMETIMES i wonder whether there's still something
Speaker 7: rotten In.
Speaker 1: Mayfield In tom's final, piece broadcast in twenty, Twelve tom
Speaker 1: says he was left with the sense that something was
Speaker 1: rotten In, mayfield even if he could never get to
Speaker 1: the bottom of. It i've grappled with all of this
Speaker 1: in my many calls with my trusted, Source daryl Woman.
Speaker 16: Lear From Jump. Straight that's ALL i heard Was, Lear Lear,
Speaker 16: lear AND i was, like.
Speaker 1: Okay but.
Speaker 17: Everyone has tried to make him happy that there he's
Speaker 17: the wizard brought in the, curtain AND i don't believe.
Speaker 1: It what if all of this shit About Ronnie lear
Speaker 1: is just made? Up like what if this is all
Speaker 1: just rumor.
Speaker 8: Just a?
Speaker 16: Rumor like that's WHY i told you that gossip is
Speaker 16: the gospel in his, ath baby or? All and so
Speaker 16: everyone for so long has told themselves the same story
Speaker 16: and the same story and the same. Story this is
Speaker 16: a crime that wasn't meant to be, solved.
Speaker 1: And Joe curran has had to reckon with these rumors
Speaker 1: surrounding his daughter's. Death do you think he could be?
Speaker 12: Involved most people THAT i talk to that's around here
Speaker 12: feel like he, is.
Speaker 11: BUT i don't.
Speaker 1: Know my team AND i have gone back and forth
Speaker 1: on whether to present the details of these. Allegations but
Speaker 1: if there's something that has been made clear in my
Speaker 1: reporting of this case is that the stories we tell
Speaker 1: matter in our, communities in the, courts and in the.
Speaker 1: Press there's a danger in trying to write a neat
Speaker 1: ending for a murder case, that in many ways seems so,
Speaker 1: senseless and the need to find someone to blame can
Speaker 1: come at a great cost to the lives of people
Speaker 1: Like Tamra, Caldwell Jeff, burton And Quincy. Cross but WHAT
Speaker 1: i do know is that the incompetence and corruption From
Speaker 1: Ronnie lear and his police department tainted the investigation Into
Speaker 1: jessica's death from the. Start it added to the countless
Speaker 1: allegations that law enforcement had to parse through in order
Speaker 1: to separate fact from. Fiction it bred mistrust around, town
Speaker 1: leaving the doors wide open for someone Like Susan gallbreath
Speaker 1: to come in and test her, theories and it meant
Speaker 1: prosecutors under pressure to close an eight year old, case
Speaker 1: pushed to get a conviction at all, costs ignoring the
Speaker 1: fact that the truth may actually be impossible to. Find and,
Speaker 1: so after twenty five years of looking for, Answers Joe
Speaker 1: kurrn has, none just daily reminders of the void his
Speaker 1: daughter's death has left in his. Life how do you feel?
Speaker 12: Now you survive, It you never get over. It, now
Speaker 12: don't let nobody ever tell you you get, closure because
Speaker 12: you'll always miss a person like that the rest of your.
Speaker 12: Life there is no such thying as.
Speaker 1: Closure more after the, BREAK i end this investigation with
Speaker 1: more questions than answers about who may have Killed Jessica
Speaker 1: curran and. Why but my goal was to find out
Speaker 1: if there was any truth To, Tamra jeff And quincy's
Speaker 1: claims of. Innocence AND i THINK i could say with certainty,
Speaker 1: that based on all the Evidence i've presented to, YOU
Speaker 1: i do not believe they're guilty of the crime the
Speaker 1: prosecution accused and convicted them. Of Still quincy lingers in.
Speaker 1: Prison getting out has been a slow moving, fight riddled with.
Speaker 1: Setbacks in late twenty twenty, Four Miranda, Hellman quincy's, attorney
Speaker 1: left The Kentucky Innocence. PROJECT i, mean, okay so many,
Speaker 1: questions are you? Okay so do you.
Speaker 18: Want the kind of quick as version of the.
Speaker 1: Story WHILE i was surprised by the, news the discontent
Speaker 1: leading To miranda leaving had been building for a. Minute
Speaker 1: miranda became frustrated by the lack of resources to properly
Speaker 1: work her, cases big ones Like. Quincy's miranda says this
Speaker 1: was further complicated by how entangled The Kentucky Innocence project
Speaker 1: is with the state.
Speaker 19: Legislature so while we have our own independent structure and
Speaker 19: we don't necessarily have to answer for everything we do
Speaker 19: or the cases we take or how we litigate.
Speaker 18: Them we're completely funded by the.
Speaker 19: State so what legislators see and what judges, see.
Speaker 18: And what people with power see matters when we ask for.
Speaker 1: Money it especially matters when people Like miranda are accusing
Speaker 1: top law, enforcement like the prosecutors who Tried quincy's case of.
Speaker 19: Malfeasance they see that someone that they signed off on
Speaker 19: a salary is saying that the prosecutors at the highest
Speaker 19: level are committing perjury and committing felonies and are putting
Speaker 19: people in prison and lying about why they put them,
Speaker 19: there and so at the end of the, day.
Speaker 18: My boss's boss's boss's boss has to.
Speaker 19: Answer to, that either publicly at a legislative hearing or
Speaker 19: just in an informal meeting where they're sitting there talking
Speaker 19: to the heads of these other departments.
Speaker 1: Like The department Of corrections or The Kentucky State, police
Speaker 1: which are all run under the same umbrella as The
Speaker 1: Kentucky Innocence. Project and While miranda is never told point
Speaker 1: blank to drop her, accusations she says the funding for
Speaker 1: her cases slowly.
Speaker 19: Dwindled they start taking your purse strings, away they start
Speaker 19: taking your positions.
Speaker 18: Away we haven't had an investigator in nearly a. Year you.
Speaker 18: Know as they start taking your, resources there's just nothing
Speaker 18: that you can.
Speaker 1: Do it makes the uphill battle of proving a wrongful
Speaker 1: conviction even. Steeper but even Without, Miranda quincy's case carries,
Speaker 1: on and The Kentucky Innocence project is still fighting to
Speaker 1: get his conviction. Overturned in early twenty twenty, Five quincy's
Speaker 1: new attorney got results from ink testing on the diary
Speaker 1: That victoria read from at, trial the diary the prosecutors
Speaker 1: used as evidence that she had been an accomplice to
Speaker 1: the crime and That victoria later said was. Fake the
Speaker 1: results aren't a slam dunk, yet but they're. Promising according
Speaker 1: to an affidavit from a forensic chemist of over twenty,
Speaker 1: years there is no evidence that the ink used to
Speaker 1: write the key diary entries read at trial was available
Speaker 1: for use before two thousand and, seven years After jessica's.
Speaker 1: Death this same, expert who currently serves with The department
Speaker 1: Of Homeland, security was actually called as a witness at
Speaker 1: the first trial by the, prosecution but now is working
Speaker 1: With quincy's defense. Team THEN dna test results came in
Speaker 1: From harris found On jessica's body at, autopsy which hadn't
Speaker 1: been previously, tested and the results completely Exclude, Quincy tamra
Speaker 1: Or jeff from all testing. Done this means nothing forensically
Speaker 1: tested from the scene at the middle school or From
Speaker 1: jessica's body, itself has ever Linked, Quincy tamra Or jeff
Speaker 1: to the. Crime there's no.
Speaker 15: Evidence there's no physical evidence that Put quincy nowhere near this.
Speaker 1: Girl none of this comes as a surprise To quincy's,
Speaker 1: Dad David, cross and the other.
Speaker 15: People they didn't know each. Other i've never heard of.
Speaker 15: Such i'm seventy years, old AND i Don't i've never
Speaker 15: heard of three people that didn't know each other get
Speaker 15: convicted of a hainus crime like.
Speaker 1: This and none of this comes as a surprise To.
Speaker 9: Quincy, WELL i knew they ain't really have nothing on,
Speaker 9: me SO i ain't really the. Move i'm feeling the
Speaker 9: same WAY i always. FEEL i ain't, ever you, KNOW
Speaker 9: i ain't committed the. Crime so it's just something glad
Speaker 9: that the truth is coming, out you.
Speaker 15: Know What i'm.
Speaker 9: Saying that does me some good my heart to know,
Speaker 9: that you, know a lot of things that they were
Speaker 9: saying was just last to put in front of a.
Speaker 1: Junny quincy has had a lot of time to think
Speaker 1: about what and who landed him behind. Bars but when
Speaker 1: it comes To Venetia's Double fields And Victoria, Caldwell quincy
Speaker 1: says there's no ill will them.
Speaker 9: Being keens at the. Time she you, KNOW i don't
Speaker 9: hold no goods with. Them it's just it's the people
Speaker 9: that they told to last. For it's what having a
Speaker 9: problem with What i'm, Saying i'm having the problem with
Speaker 9: the state Of.
Speaker 1: Kentucky quincy's attorneys have presented all their findings in, court
Speaker 1: and now he waits for the same judicial system that
Speaker 1: put him behind bars to decide if he deserves a
Speaker 1: second chance at proving his, innocence And quincy's loved, ones Including,
Speaker 1: dara wait with.
Speaker 17: HIM i believe that he is innocent with my whole.
Speaker 17: Art if, SO i would have left y'all and everybody
Speaker 17: else the fuck alone a long time. Ago i'm ready
Speaker 17: to move on with my, life BUT i. Can't i'm
Speaker 17: going to love this family too. Much and regardless of
Speaker 17: his innocence or, guilt he didn't have a fair. Trial
Speaker 17: and that's WHAT i stand behind is if we don't
Speaker 17: have a correct judicial, system then we have nothing but.
Speaker 1: Anarchy And dara waits because she says she's honor bound
Speaker 1: To David.
Speaker 17: Cross, david whenever we originally got in, TOUCH i was,
Speaker 17: LIKE i promise you and offer you nothing at all
Speaker 17: except for maybe a little bit of hope and persistence
Speaker 17: and a lot of fun. Personality that's. It that's ALL i,
Speaker 17: offer and the fact THAT i won't quit until we
Speaker 17: get to the. End whatever the end looks. LIKE i
Speaker 17: have no fucking, clue But i'm not going. Anywhere AND
Speaker 17: i got you and that's what my family. Says as
Speaker 17: opposed TO i love, you we always SAY i got,
Speaker 17: You and to, me that's the most important thing.
Speaker 1: IS i got. Them tamra And jeff have both been
Speaker 1: out of prison for more than a, decade but their
Speaker 1: convictions hang over them every, day souring their. Freedom Jeff
Speaker 1: burton works at his family, cafe serving chicken casseroles And
Speaker 1: western omelets alongside his.
Speaker 8: Mom so, yes it's the greatest. Woman it, truly truly.
Speaker 1: Is getting a good job with a serious felony, conviction
Speaker 1: or even getting a job at, all is nearly.
Speaker 8: Impossible this is a, Blessing it really truly, is BECAUSE
Speaker 8: i mean it is hard to get a.
Speaker 1: Job Before jeff got caught up in this, case he
Speaker 1: was a young husband and a dad of. THREE i
Speaker 1: was straight and.
Speaker 8: NARROW i wasn't doing. NOTHING i was trying to be
Speaker 8: a good.
Speaker 1: Father getting his life in, order trying to.
Speaker 8: Be a family. Man just trying to do. That that's
Speaker 8: ALL i really focused. On make sure the kids had
Speaker 8: to create Good christmas or stuff like.
Speaker 1: That But jeff's marriage didn't survive his prison. Sentence and
Speaker 1: as he's talking about that, time his hands get shaky
Speaker 1: and his voice, quivers BECAUSE.
Speaker 8: I, mean, man that shit really fucked my life. Up
Speaker 8: it really, did and uh you, KNOW i was in
Speaker 8: prison like seven, years and it really. Did it ruled my.
Speaker 8: Life so that's WHY i get, all you, know all
Speaker 8: because some girls. Lied there's no nothing to prove anything
Speaker 8: except for the they, said and that's.
Speaker 1: Bullshit Like, Quincy jeff's family has stood by him all.
Speaker 8: Along they sacrificed a lot WHEN i was in the.
Speaker 1: Penitentiary especially his.
Speaker 8: Mom you, know she'd always come see me if my
Speaker 8: ex wife and kids can, come or Make she'd make
Speaker 8: SURE i had to, visit kept money on the, phone,
Speaker 8: everything you know WHAT i. Mean she was, there, man
Speaker 8: so Which i've always been pretty close to my.
Speaker 1: Mama tamera also struggles with life after. Prison if you
Speaker 1: go back to two thousand and, six two thousand and
Speaker 1: five and you never got wrapped up in, this what
Speaker 1: do you think your life would be like? TODAY i
Speaker 1: wouldn't be in may for, You, yep. YEP i sure
Speaker 1: wouldn't be In. Kentucky you. Wouldn't tamara has had a
Speaker 1: hard time getting a job because of her, conviction but Like,
Speaker 1: jeff she's got support today at forty, Five she cleans
Speaker 1: and paints houses for a friend's.
Speaker 15: Company mainly the projects they have the, Authorities, okay, yes
Speaker 15: mainly when they move, OUT i clean them firth and
Speaker 15: THEN i paint.
Speaker 1: Them she's close with her, Mom, brenda and her. Children
Speaker 1: the last TIME i Visited tamra Was december twenty twenty
Speaker 1: four and they were getting ready For. Christmas they always
Speaker 1: want me to. Cook they ain sweet. Potatoes oh you're
Speaker 1: making the sweet. Potatoes. Yes it's a simple, life a
Speaker 1: good and honest. One but if tam could have written
Speaker 1: her own, ending she, says maybe she would have gone
Speaker 1: back to school after her three kids were. Grown she
Speaker 1: would have liked to be a nurse or a weather.
Speaker 1: Person but despite all she's been, Through tamra has told
Speaker 1: me a few times that she's. Lucky even though you
Speaker 1: had five and a half years of your life taken,
Speaker 1: away you still think you're. Lucky, yep, yep sure.
Speaker 7: Do i'm here for a. Reason he ain't through with me.
Speaker 1: Yet he's not through with me. Yet quincy's, Dad, david
Speaker 1: shares this, Sentiment there ever a time during this last
Speaker 1: decade that you've lost hope at?
Speaker 15: All, no, no, No WELL i CAN'T i can't imagine losing.
Speaker 15: HOPE i have to think that something good is gonna
Speaker 15: come out of. This his life is worth if worth,
Speaker 15: That if it's not, worth nothing else is worth something
Speaker 15: good coming out of. It, NO i can't imagine losing.
Speaker 1: Hope But david seems to have whethered SINCE i first
Speaker 1: met him in twenty twenty. Three he's grown older waiting
Speaker 1: for his, son and the last time we spoke in,
Speaker 1: person the reality of that was on his.
Speaker 15: Mind the only FEAR i got THAT i won't live
Speaker 15: to See quincy walk out of. Prison that's my only
Speaker 15: fear in.
Speaker 2: Life you, know.
Speaker 13: That's my goal.
Speaker 1: Until he's free. Again quincy's family lives on hope and,
Speaker 1: memories do it so. Sor WHEN i first Met quincy's,
Speaker 1: family his Sister rochelle was. There she's one Of quincy's six,
Speaker 1: sisters and she was beaming at the chance to tell
Speaker 1: the world about her, brother about their childhood running free
Speaker 1: in Rural. Tennessee we you, know we're from the.
Speaker 6: Style So grandma's backyard was the, playground, trees, swings jumping.
Speaker 1: DITCHES i Think rochelle, remembers we can dance parties in
Speaker 1: a house full of kids in. Life we enjoyed, It.
Speaker 12: We Loved we was a family that loved to get
Speaker 12: together On saturday mornings and just get in the living
Speaker 12: room and just dance and have fun and cut.
Speaker 1: Up that was our.
Speaker 4: Thing R V wraps was, on And i'm gonna tell you.
Speaker 12: Something quincy.
Speaker 1: W pop lock great.
Speaker 7: Dance it would turn on his head and you know.
Speaker 1: We can do. That like what kind of music were?
Speaker 1: Doing quincy was her ride Or Die Rochelle's ho's whatever
Speaker 1: it came to.
Speaker 4: Be quincy was. THERE i need a babysitter BECAUSE i
Speaker 4: want to go to the. Club quincy was. There that's
Speaker 4: type people we. Are you, know we come from, nothing.
Speaker 2: But we had.
Speaker 1: Love this Year quincy turned forty, nine another birthday away from,
Speaker 1: home nineteen of. Them one, Day quincy would like to
Speaker 1: Leave kentucky move back To. TENNESSEE i picture him on
Speaker 1: the porch of his childhood, home sitting next to his,
Speaker 1: father all quiet and still except for the sound of
Speaker 1: cicadas and the occasional laughter of his nieces and nephews running,
Speaker 1: by playing with, tadpoles just like he used to years
Speaker 1: ago in those very same. Fields but for, Now quincy
Speaker 1: is content that you got to hear his.
Speaker 10: STORY i want the world to see AND i want
Speaker 10: them to look at the fag that. AGAIN i want
Speaker 10: them to look at everything about this, case because you,
Speaker 10: Know i'd have been through some hele trying to get
Speaker 10: the truth, out and now THAT i got an opportunity
Speaker 10: to get it, out it.
Speaker 9: Makes everything a whole lot. Better, yeah it makes everything
Speaker 9: a whole lot better for. Me that's WHAT i want the.
Speaker 4: World thank you for Ucing.
Speaker 1: Securist. Goodbye Graves county is a production Of lava For
Speaker 1: good in association With Signal Company Number. One this show
Speaker 1: is written and produced by Me Maggie freeling and senior
Speaker 1: Producer Rebecca. Ibarra Jason, Flamm Jeff, kempler And Kevin burtis
Speaker 1: are executive. Producers our editor Is martina Abraham's. Ilunga Dania
Speaker 1: suleiman is our fact. Checker sound design and mixing By Joe.
Speaker 1: Plored music created By. Wrench our theme song is the
Speaker 1: gangsta grass version Of The One Who's holding The star
Speaker 1: By Leo schofield And Kevin. Herrick Darrel woolman is investigative.
Speaker 1: Producer our head Of marketing And operations Is Jeff. Cliburn
Speaker 1: Is Ismay guarderama is our social media, director and Our
Speaker 1: Social media manager Is Sarah. Gibbons Andrew nelson is art,
Speaker 1: director with additional production help From Jackie, Paully Kara kornhaber
Speaker 1: And Kathleen. Fink be sure to follow us On, instagram, TikTok,
Speaker 1: facebook and threads At lava For good and follow me
Speaker 1: At Maggie. Freeling and we know there's a lot of
Speaker 1: names for you to keep up with in this, series
Speaker 1: so for a detailed list of, characters please go to
Speaker 1: our show notes.
Speaker 3: By a
Speaker 9: Gold bad