Speaker 1: Yeah, fine podcast.
Speaker 2: Would you stop talking over our intro?
Speaker 1: It's half the fun guys.
Speaker 2: The gang's all here.
Speaker 1: The gang's all here, We're all back.
Speaker 2: Yay, Mark Easton, Mike and Janna, just the whole crew.
Speaker 3: That's the wrong order, I think, is it?
Speaker 2: No? I mean, it's okay, it's fine. We're back in Nashville,
Speaker 2: we're back from New Iberia, Louisiana.
Speaker 1: We are two episodes there. Yeah, yeah, wow.
Speaker 2: Last one was just basically you in Easton holding it down,
Speaker 2: which I started to listen to it, and then you
Speaker 2: were kind of talking bad about me. So I was
Speaker 2: just like, I'm not gonna talk. I'm not gonna listen
Speaker 2: to this.
Speaker 1: I didn't talk anything bad about you. You gotta listen
Speaker 1: to it in its entirety, Okay, right, Easton?
Speaker 4: Yeah, you're very complimentary and and i'd like to say
Speaker 4: we got some rave reviews from that episode.
Speaker 2: Oh by the way, I was sitting in bed last
Speaker 2: night and Mike starts laughing and I said, what's so funny?
Speaker 2: And he goes. Easton just texted me saying that someone
Speaker 2: appreciated our nerd talk.
Speaker 1: The email was so good.
Speaker 4: They wanted us to break down the Spider man, stuff
Speaker 4: going on, that's not did.
Speaker 1: You, Jana, did you get any feedback from any of
Speaker 1: the episodes?
Speaker 2: Yeah? They really liked y'all's perspective on things. Really yeah,
Speaker 2: which is I do want to listen. It's just so
Speaker 2: funny the timing in which I listened to it, because
Speaker 2: I fast forwarded some of the stuff to get to
Speaker 2: where you were at right, and then it was just like,
Speaker 2: you know, Jane and I have been and she's been.
Speaker 2: I was like, man, just right to just like.
Speaker 1: It because it had none of it was about what's
Speaker 1: Jana doing wrong? M there's more about what I'm doing wrong. Actually,
Speaker 1: that's true. I want to be honest here.
Speaker 2: It was just funny though, But I really truly wanted
Speaker 2: to listen. But it's been a little busy, but I'm
Speaker 2: excited to get in the car. I should have listened
Speaker 2: to it today, but I was listening to the new
Speaker 2: Taylor Swift CD album so really good. You know what
Speaker 2: I've never been? How do I say this?
Speaker 1: I I'll say it for us. Okay, Usually from a
Speaker 1: first listen within like a new t O Swift song,
Speaker 1: Jane and I are in the same boat where usually
Speaker 1: it's like I'm not a big fan of it, but
Speaker 1: then after we listen to it several times, we're like, actually,
Speaker 1: this is a really good song. So usually we don't
Speaker 1: like a T Swift song from the initial listen, but
Speaker 1: with everything she's had recently.
Speaker 2: We're jamming, jamming, Like today, Jolie was being a monrat
Speaker 2: in the car and I was like, you need to
Speaker 2: calm down, you're being too loud. I'm just like, uh oh,
Speaker 2: and then I started putting it out and she starts
Speaker 2: screaming at me. But I just am like jamming to
Speaker 2: Tea Swift right now. All of a sudden. It's just
Speaker 2: I don't think I could ever be in her squad
Speaker 2: per se because I think we're not. I don't think
Speaker 2: we have a lot in common, but I do think.
Speaker 2: But I am like, I love her music. And it
Speaker 2: was so cool because I saw Demi Levado tweet out
Speaker 2: to her Instagram's story like, hey, no matter what, girls
Speaker 2: got to support girls and this music. This girl's putting
Speaker 2: out amazing music. And it's true. I'm like, yeah, I don't.
Speaker 2: I don't think I could ever be friends with her,
Speaker 2: but damn, she's got a really good album right now.
Speaker 3: Yeah, what are you any tracks standing out to you
Speaker 3: that you love, Like, I have a.
Speaker 2: Couple that I love, The Dixie Chicks one.
Speaker 3: That I cannot. I have a hard time with that one. Really,
Speaker 3: it makes me cry.
Speaker 2: Oh, I haven't listened to It's intense. I mean it
Speaker 2: was the first time. I mean I was, let me
Speaker 2: pull up the album right now, but it was the
Speaker 2: first listen because I was stuck in the car for
Speaker 2: a long time. So I really liked that one.
Speaker 3: Soon You'll get better.
Speaker 2: Oh my god, that one just like slayed me. I
Speaker 2: really liked Cruel Summer.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's that.
Speaker 3: There's rumors that's the next single that the tailor says.
Speaker 2: That I could hear that. So I was thinking either
Speaker 2: Cruel Summer was going to be in the next one
Speaker 2: or there was another one that I was listening to
Speaker 2: that was I was like, Okay, this could be another
Speaker 2: single too.
Speaker 3: It seemed like a single.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that one does too. I I was, and I
Speaker 2: liked it. Was weird because I didn't think I would
Speaker 2: like the Miss Americana and the Heartbreak prints. Loved that.
Speaker 3: That's growing on me big time.
Speaker 2: The man obsessed with.
Speaker 3: Yes that's a big one.
Speaker 1: Did when the album come out, like a couple weeks ago.
Speaker 2: Yeah, the man, I'm like loving The Archer. You know,
Speaker 2: first listen, I was like, okay, spoppin' I'm not like
Speaker 2: obsessed with London boy.
Speaker 3: No, that was a little weird, you know what I
Speaker 3: love And The Archer is a good example of this.
Speaker 3: And as a songwriter, maybe you can help me, because
Speaker 3: I'm not a songwriter. I feel like her bridges are
Speaker 3: so much better than anybody else's bridges. Like most people,
Speaker 3: bridges seem like an afterthought, but for her, she sees
Speaker 3: it as the absolute build up to the final chorus.
Speaker 3: Like so it just peaks to this pinnacle and she's
Speaker 3: so good at that, and.
Speaker 2: That's what I think makes her a really good songwriter.
Speaker 2: Not to like go on this like Tee Swift run
Speaker 2: right now, but like usually whenever I'm writing, writers hate bridges.
Speaker 2: They just hate it. They're like they don't think it's necessary.
Speaker 2: A lot of them don't write bridges, And most of
Speaker 2: times I'm like, well, let's just repeat the chorus, do
Speaker 2: a breakdown course, and that's usually what ends up being
Speaker 2: the bridge. And just to your point, she takes advantage
Speaker 2: of the bridge and like knocks it out of the Park.
Speaker 1: So for those of us who have no idea what
Speaker 1: you're talking.
Speaker 2: About, after the second chorus is the bridge. So like
Speaker 2: after the first verse, second verse, you know, first first verse,
Speaker 2: then it comes the first chorus, then the second verse,
Speaker 2: second chorus, and then there's the bridge.
Speaker 1: But after the second carrier the chorus, is there another
Speaker 1: version then the bridge.
Speaker 2: No, it would go go verse chorus and then end.
Speaker 2: That's born So but most people just but then most
Speaker 2: people just will do like like if you listen to
Speaker 2: any of my songs that I write, I'm like, just
Speaker 2: do a breakdown chorus and then go into the chorus
Speaker 2: and then.
Speaker 3: The hard parts the chorus. Right, that's the really, that's
Speaker 3: what you put the most effort into.
Speaker 2: Yeah, because you wanted to be super hit, like super cooky,
Speaker 2: catchy sing along. But man, I mean, she just she
Speaker 2: she freaking slayed that album. And again, first listen there
Speaker 2: was I haven't listened. I didn't. I wasn't able to
Speaker 2: listen to two of the songs, like I didn't hear
Speaker 2: False God or Daylight. But yeah, it was just it
Speaker 2: was good. And it's funny because we haven't genuinely loved
Speaker 2: everything she's put out. I mean I loved her back
Speaker 2: in the country days for sure, but even Michael and
Speaker 2: I both were like, hey, babe, I like me.
Speaker 1: I was like I do do or even we were
Speaker 1: listening to Alexa the other night with Jolie dancing around
Speaker 1: making dinner and mean came on. Yeah, I forgot how
Speaker 1: that that song's so old, but it's so good.
Speaker 2: I love all of our country stuff. A lot of
Speaker 2: people my friend, well, my friend, our friend Sarah thought
Speaker 2: she was making a country album.
Speaker 1: Sir he Gretzky. She thought that this recent album was
Speaker 1: going to be a country I.
Speaker 2: Just kept thinking it was gonna be a counry album,
Speaker 2: which would be an interesting But I like the fact
Speaker 2: that she kind of got the Dixie Chicks on there. Anyways,
Speaker 2: I know we just like went off on a major
Speaker 2: tea swifferent but so yeah, now you got to listen
Speaker 2: to it. I will mark what's been up with you?
Speaker 2: Because I feel like we haven't wind down with you lately.
Speaker 3: Everything's fine. We spend Labor Day up in Ohi at
Speaker 3: this resort up there that every year Ryan Seacrest, that's
Speaker 3: the one gets me a weekend there with my family.
Speaker 3: That's the greatest gift anyone's gotten me, and but now
Speaker 3: there is competition as of this year, until this year,
Speaker 3: it's the greatest year.
Speaker 2: He's like, it's the greatest gift ever. I mean, I'm sorry, Mike,
Speaker 2: thank you for your present.
Speaker 1: I see Ryan Seacrest's game arm right.
Speaker 2: Next month.
Speaker 3: I have all these bruises on my upper arm. Here
Speaker 3: you can't see them, but Easton can see those bruises. Easton,
Speaker 3: Oh god, what happened? It because we were playing in
Speaker 3: the pool and this nine year old girl made friends
Speaker 3: with my kids, and then I kind of joined them.
Speaker 3: We were playing. I had this ball and that their
Speaker 3: job was to get the ball away from me, and
Speaker 3: this girl thought it'd be good to slow me down
Speaker 3: by pinching my inner arm. And this was like the
Speaker 3: random girl, This random girl just to just crawl all
Speaker 3: over me and my arm. And so now I got
Speaker 3: bruises all over my arm. But her to stop, I
Speaker 3: mean a little bit, but.
Speaker 2: That she needs to calm down.
Speaker 1: She does, she.
Speaker 3: Did, but it's fine, But everything's good.
Speaker 1: Thank you for asking good?
Speaker 2: Are you okay?
Speaker 3: But I should say the gift joking that we were
Speaker 3: doing that jan and Might got me a pretty fantastic
Speaker 3: gift for my birthday.
Speaker 2: It was all Mike, I'm really bad with birthdays.
Speaker 3: That's honestly, it's from the two of you.
Speaker 1: It's from us, it is, it's from you, it's from us.
Speaker 1: If it's from you, it's from us.
Speaker 3: They know that I'm a big Milwaukee Brewers fan. They
Speaker 3: got me a baseball bat autograph, no idea robbing you
Speaker 3: out the greatest brewer of all time. That was pretty cool,
Speaker 3: really above and beyond, because I expected nothing. I mean,
Speaker 3: why would you get me anything?
Speaker 2: Because Here's where I'm stressing though, is now Easton's birthday
Speaker 2: is coming up. But now I feel like it's like,
Speaker 2: that's the thing with gifts, you.
Speaker 1: Know, I love I love it though.
Speaker 2: Oh I love giving gifts, you know me, I'd rather
Speaker 2: give gifts to everybody. But my thing is is like
Speaker 2: it's just you know, it's a lot.
Speaker 1: Not It's not about the amount. It's about knowing what
Speaker 1: that person appreciates and loves more. I feel like the
Speaker 1: most is easy.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you just buy him like an Avengers T shirt.
Speaker 3: He's so passionate about a number of things.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 4: The greatest gift is just being a part of this podcast.
Speaker 2: That's really it Easton. By the way, I loved seeing
Speaker 2: you on set the other day. Oh, you just were
Speaker 2: like chumming it up. Although I was very upset you
Speaker 2: didn't say bye.
Speaker 4: Well, you were in the middle of you were making
Speaker 4: a major motion picture. I didn't want to interrupt there
Speaker 4: for a lifetime.
Speaker 2: Guys, let's calm down with the major motion thing.
Speaker 1: It's gonna be fantastic.
Speaker 4: And November sixteenth, Oh wow, oh yeah it is.
Speaker 1: Yeah, November sixteenth.
Speaker 2: Christmas and Louisiana.
Speaker 1: I can't wait to watch.
Speaker 2: It's funny tho because if you go on my IMDb,
Speaker 2: it's like Christmas in Mississippi, Christmas and Louisiana. We said,
Speaker 2: let's do it. I'm really excited about the guests we
Speaker 2: have on today.
Speaker 1: It's gonna be awesome.
Speaker 2: She's a doctor.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's it.
Speaker 2: Well, no, she's I just like with this up that
Speaker 2: she talks about.
Speaker 1: No, it's gonna be awesome. We're gonna have doctor Judy
Speaker 1: Hoe on the podcast later today. She has a new
Speaker 1: book out called Stop Self Sound Abitage, Six Steps to
Speaker 1: Unlock Your True Motivation. I have a lot of questions
Speaker 1: about that.
Speaker 2: I have a lot of questions about the last name
Speaker 2: like would you change your last name? Like would you
Speaker 2: not get married to someone because their last name was Hell?
Speaker 2: Just a valid question.
Speaker 1: That's like al blessings, but that.
Speaker 2: Is true Michael's best friend al Butt because that sounds.
Speaker 2: But so I'm like, when you meet a guy, I mean,
Speaker 2: I know I do. Like when I'm in middle school
Speaker 2: high school and you're doing the hearts like Janna, you
Speaker 2: know Thomas or whatever, It's like Janna, but Janna hoe
Speaker 2: be interesting.
Speaker 3: You got to factor that in when you meet someone.
Speaker 2: What I'm saying I think you do is that rude
Speaker 2: to factor in? And okay, here I come the emails.
Speaker 2: I'm not being you know, I'm not being mean. I'm
Speaker 2: just saying, is it is it something where you're just like,
Speaker 2: I just love the person so much. My last name
Speaker 2: is Penis.
Speaker 1: I think I think some people definitely look into that.
Speaker 1: I mean, you hate our last name just.
Speaker 2: Because I'm not a fan of it. But it's only
Speaker 2: because people can't understand. I literally say I on the
Speaker 2: phone coffin c A U S S as in Sam
Speaker 2: I N. They're like, okay, miss Coffin, and I'm like,
Speaker 2: I literally just spelled it out for you.
Speaker 4: Mike is still Mike Kramer in my phone.
Speaker 1: As I should be.
Speaker 2: Oh, I love it.
Speaker 3: I didn't think of the Coffin element.
Speaker 2: It's so and I the part that bothers me is
Speaker 2: that I go out of my way to spell it
Speaker 2: out for them.
Speaker 3: Hates our last name too, and that's kind of molenit skim.
Speaker 3: It's just cumbers.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, I guess to a degree.
Speaker 3: But I also am a little insulted when she hates
Speaker 3: it so much?
Speaker 2: Are you insulted when I hate yours? Ours?
Speaker 1: Exactly my case. I think that's why Ja doesn't even
Speaker 1: consider it her last name, even though legally it is.
Speaker 2: It's but I'm just because it's just it is frustrating, though,
Speaker 2: like when when you when you go out of your
Speaker 2: way to say s S as in super or Sam,
Speaker 2: and people still say, Okay, miss Coffin, I get.
Speaker 1: It, I've dealt with it my whole life, or they
Speaker 1: add an Ellen there for claws in which I never
Speaker 1: even mentioned.
Speaker 2: So then why would you be offended if we went
Speaker 2: to Kramer?
Speaker 1: Because the best thing is is a lot of times
Speaker 1: Jana still books things under Jana Kramer because it's just easier,
Speaker 1: and so Janna would give me crap like all the
Speaker 1: time about my last name and the issue. So she
Speaker 1: booked something Kramer. We show up to this resort for
Speaker 1: a vacation and they say, oh, welcome, mister and missus Premier.
Speaker 1: And I was one time that's all I need, That's
Speaker 1: all I needed was one person to pronounce it incorrectly.
Speaker 2: But I always say, this is actually his last names Cosson.
Speaker 2: Let's say cossin places like when we go to a hotel.
Speaker 1: I don't care. Maybe early on I was a little
Speaker 1: bit more self conscious. Now I'm like, yo, say your
Speaker 1: last name, let's get hooked up. I was like, I'll
Speaker 1: be mister Kramer.
Speaker 2: A free ice cream, it's about it.
Speaker 1: I'll take it.
Speaker 3: I met a family over the weekend whose last name
Speaker 3: was Hamburger. If Mike had been Mike Hamburger, would you
Speaker 3: be Jenna Hamburger.
Speaker 2: See that is just where That's exactly my point. And
Speaker 2: I'm curious that I want. I truly want people to
Speaker 2: because I'm not trying to be vain. This isn't this
Speaker 2: is just a fun topic conversation. I'm truly not trying
Speaker 2: to be at any Yeah, and at the end of
Speaker 2: the day, I would love him no matter what, I
Speaker 2: just think it's funny. So I'm just curious if anyone
Speaker 2: else has any funny last names or what they could
Speaker 2: have married.
Speaker 1: And there's got to be someone that listens.
Speaker 2: Name mister Seaman was our swim coach, and I'm like,
Speaker 2: in high school, I'm like, would I be a missus Seman?
Speaker 2: I don't know, Like again, if your last name was Semen,
Speaker 2: it's just it's just you got you have to have
Speaker 2: real like you know, hello mister Seman and shout out
Speaker 2: to my swim coach.
Speaker 4: My wife, Aliston could not wait to change her name.
Speaker 4: Her last name was Drinker and when she was in
Speaker 4: college her first name is Alison. Her email address was
Speaker 4: a drinker You see and see that you and she
Speaker 4: hated it. It cuts you off after.
Speaker 2: Sell like I would never actually ask doctor Hoe if
Speaker 2: she is that it? Yeah, doctor Howe see again, Like
Speaker 2: I would never actually ask her.
Speaker 3: You're not going to I thought this was all a
Speaker 3: part of setup to you.
Speaker 2: Because I'm not. I'm actually not rude. Contrary for popular
Speaker 2: popular opinions, I would never actually ask. But I'm just curious.
Speaker 2: What's our email address? Again?
Speaker 4: It's wind downradio dot com.
Speaker 2: So please send me like the best last name you've
Speaker 2: heard for real. I just really want to know because
Speaker 2: I think it's funny.
Speaker 3: Call out of the morning show named worm and that's
Speaker 3: why he was calling his wife or his fiance didn't
Speaker 3: want to take his last name really yeast Morning show.
Speaker 1: Yes, so it's definitely happens.
Speaker 3: Definitely happens.
Speaker 2: I mean, if you guys were to take it, let's say,
Speaker 2: I know guys don't take names, but if you were,
Speaker 2: I mean, was it something where I mean, would you
Speaker 2: like your last name to be vagina?
Speaker 3: Yes?
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, I'll change my first name.
Speaker 2: I just asked guy, Oh my god, Michael, a lot
Speaker 2: of vagina would.
Speaker 1: Be really bad.
Speaker 3: Your last name is vagina. And it wasn't spelled the
Speaker 3: traditional way of spelling it. It was like V A
Speaker 3: J H, Y and E. And then you're like every
Speaker 3: time you have to say it's vagina V Y g H.
Speaker 2: You know, maybe I asked a guy a wrong question.
Speaker 2: I shouldn't say. Let's say it was your last name
Speaker 2: was scrotum, would never be you know, let's see, let's
Speaker 2: google it.
Speaker 1: Last name.
Speaker 3: Are more guys going to be taking women's names?
Speaker 1: Is it? I don't think it's going to be that.
Speaker 1: I think it's just going to be. I don't think
Speaker 1: it's gonna be men taking the women's I think that
Speaker 1: the women just may decide not to take the men
Speaker 1: man's last name, but.
Speaker 2: Then scro are someone's last name.
Speaker 3: That too. I think we googled the same things.
Speaker 2: Did you just say scrot them last name?
Speaker 1: Did?
Speaker 2: Yeah? And it came up with tesccles and scrotum last name,
Speaker 2: the Scrotum family. Like, here's the thing, Zoe, Zoe Saldano's
Speaker 2: husband took her last name, right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, this time has come. It's just a matter of
Speaker 3: when it will become one of the tipping point happened
Speaker 3: where it's a regular thing. It's still I think.
Speaker 2: It's a lot of girls now are not taking the
Speaker 2: man's name at all and just having separate right.
Speaker 1: Which I don't necessarily have a problem with. For me,
Speaker 1: it's just about the kid.
Speaker 2: It's about which is why ultimately, which is right?
Speaker 1: Right, which is ultimately why you did it because on paper,
Speaker 1: legally I just wanted.
Speaker 2: I want the same last name as Miche.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I want the kid. I want the whole family
Speaker 1: to be where the cautions.
Speaker 3: It's weird, it's weird. To have mom and dad her
Speaker 3: last names.
Speaker 5: Yeah.
Speaker 2: See, that's I've always thought that was and I just
Speaker 2: I want my last name to be the same as
Speaker 2: Jolie's at the end of the day. But I think
Speaker 2: it's also something where that is probably what's changing now.
Speaker 2: And it's just like, all right, this is my last name,
Speaker 2: that's your last name.
Speaker 1: Right, which is taking book as we as generations can
Speaker 1: you on. This is going to be the issue with
Speaker 1: that is Okay, women are gonna start keeping their last name. Fine,
Speaker 1: then give it some more time, like twenty more years,
Speaker 1: and then it's gonna be like women be like, well,
Speaker 1: why do the kids have to take your name?
Speaker 2: What I would want you lay to take my name?
Speaker 2: That's that's just what's with that?
Speaker 1: And that what I'm just saying, this is going to
Speaker 1: be a debate, probably sooner than later. Just the way
Speaker 1: the trend of society is going right now is well,
Speaker 1: why does it Why do we have to take the
Speaker 1: man's last name? Why do the kids have to take
Speaker 1: the man's last name? Why can't they take the women's?
Speaker 1: Why equality?
Speaker 2: Are you mocking equality?
Speaker 1: Michael, Oh, I'm just saying. I'm just saying there's gonna
Speaker 1: be it's gonna become some sensitive thing now because society's
Speaker 1: over freaking sensitive to everything and no one can accept us.
Speaker 1: Certain things are just the way they are. And I
Speaker 1: don't see there's anything being wrong with a tradition of
Speaker 1: that sort.
Speaker 3: I think it's for the whole family to have the
Speaker 3: same name, whether it's his or hers. I think it's
Speaker 3: weird to have mom one name, dad one name. Some
Speaker 3: some families have the boy takes dad's name, the girl
Speaker 3: takes mom's name, to make the kids hyphen the names,
Speaker 3: which just gets cumbersome.
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's weird.
Speaker 1: All right, let's take a break and we will come
Speaker 1: back with doctor how Sweet. All right, I'm excited. Jane
Speaker 1: is excited. Let's bring in doctor. You're incited. I'm excited.
Speaker 1: Jana is incided. I'm excited. Jana is excited. Let's bring
Speaker 1: in doctor Judy Howe.
Speaker 5: I'm really great, guys, I'm doing great. How about you, guys,
Speaker 5: We're good.
Speaker 2: We're so excited to talk to you.
Speaker 1: Yes, I honestly going into this, I didn't really know
Speaker 1: much about you, think reading the rundown. Let me just
Speaker 1: give this to our listeners. You are a Triple Board
Speaker 1: certified clinical and forensic neuropsychologist and co host of CBS's
Speaker 1: show Face the Truth with Vivocate a box.
Speaker 2: Wow, and you have a book called Stop Self Sabotage.
Speaker 2: Six Steps to unlock your true motivation, harness your willpower,
Speaker 2: and get out of your own way. And we were
Speaker 2: actually just at our son's nine month well visit appointment
Speaker 2: and Mike was, you know, reading down the rundown, and
Speaker 2: I said, Wow, this is such a good topic for
Speaker 2: for both of us. But I think Mike kind of
Speaker 2: wants to kick it off because he's he's interested to
Speaker 2: learn more about that.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I too. Yeah, let me let me just start
Speaker 1: you off with this.
Speaker 2: With you, we have very we have two very different scenarios.
Speaker 1: So yeah, let me start you off with this question,
Speaker 1: doctor Judy, what is the fine line? Because to me,
Speaker 1: there's there's a line between being realistic and being self sabotaging,
Speaker 1: So like, what does that look like in your your
Speaker 1: professional opinion? Like, what's the difference?
Speaker 5: That's an awesome question, actually, and no one's got to
Speaker 5: ask me that. So this is a great time to
Speaker 5: kind of talk about that distinction, because you know, there's
Speaker 5: some people who are just so driven, they have so
Speaker 5: many goals and maybe they falter on one or two,
Speaker 5: or maybe they're just a little bit slow in getting
Speaker 5: to wherever they want it to be. But their vision
Speaker 5: is really big, and so is that self sabotage? I
Speaker 5: would say no, because self sabotage is actually repeatedly getting
Speaker 5: in your own way despite your best intention. So that's
Speaker 5: when you say I have this goal, and then you
Speaker 5: start to work towards that goal. But you are the
Speaker 5: why you stop your own progress. Not because you know
Speaker 5: the world, not because well it just takes time to
Speaker 5: get there, because this is a big dream of yours. No,
Speaker 5: It's like a good example of this might be somebody
Speaker 5: who says, okay, I'm going to finally lose you know,
Speaker 5: those twenty pounds. My doctors said it would be good
Speaker 5: for me, let me get healthier, and they're so close,
Speaker 5: you know, they've been doing so well for two months,
Speaker 5: and all of a sudden they just go on a
Speaker 5: crazy binge over a vacation for a week when they
Speaker 5: didn't have to do that. You know, that would be
Speaker 5: self sabotaged. Whereas somebody who's saying, well, I want to
Speaker 5: be you know, the next elite triathlete and they train
Speaker 5: for a year's like, okay, I'm still not an elite triathlete.
Speaker 5: Well that's okay if you're making progress, because that's a
Speaker 5: huge goal and that takes time sometimes years to get there.
Speaker 2: Right, but also realizing that like, Okay, I'm not going anywhere,
Speaker 2: So is that okay to then stop? When you to
Speaker 2: what his questions like, Okay, well, obviously you know that
Speaker 2: you're not going to be the next American idol if
Speaker 2: you're completely toned off. But yeah, if you keep going
Speaker 2: and it's like you can do it, like you've got to,
Speaker 2: it's like when.
Speaker 5: Do you right?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Again, when's realistic? Because I feel like people in
Speaker 1: general can talk themselves out of something, and so it's
Speaker 1: you know, especially for someone like me, and our listeners
Speaker 1: have heard me say this a lot, just issues with
Speaker 1: not feeling good enough or never really satisfied with something
Speaker 1: where I look back in my professional career or sports
Speaker 1: or this or that and I'm like, did I work
Speaker 1: as hard as I could even though I know I did,
Speaker 1: Even though I know that I do, but now after
Speaker 1: the fact, I question it. So I'm like, you know
Speaker 1: what that battle is? Just it drives me.
Speaker 5: Nuts on well, totally. And I think that that is
Speaker 5: you know, much as we talk about like precursors to
Speaker 5: self davatize, It doesn't mean that you're going to step
Speaker 5: in it. It just means that these are certain traps
Speaker 5: that you know, it can sometimes get people into more
Speaker 5: risky situations where they might self sabotage, or they will
Speaker 5: on occasion. And you know that sort of self talk
Speaker 5: or like thoughts is a huge part of it, you know,
Speaker 5: because we don't have feelings or actions without thoughts first.
Speaker 5: And sometimes who just don't notice the thoughts. We notice
Speaker 5: it that we feel better or we do something. We're like, ah,
Speaker 5: why don't we do that? But there's always like a
Speaker 5: thought process that precedes it. And so in my book,
Speaker 5: I talk about my theory where self sabotage can come
Speaker 5: from like one or four places, and people can say
Speaker 5: that they see themselves in a little bit of each one,
Speaker 5: or they see themselves in all four. It doesn't mean
Speaker 5: they self sabotage all the time, but it just means
Speaker 5: that these are your particular triggers. And so I put
Speaker 5: it into an acronym called life because that's how I
Speaker 5: remember things, as like make acronyms and so life, each
Speaker 5: of them stands for a different factor. And so to
Speaker 5: your point, Mike, you know what you are talking about
Speaker 5: could be something like you know, so there's the four acronyms.
Speaker 5: They stand for L stands for lower shapy self esteem.
Speaker 5: I stands for internalized belief You know, things that you
Speaker 5: might have, you know, even started to learn from childhood,
Speaker 5: and as an adult you start to adopt them yourself.
Speaker 5: And then F it's fear of change or the unknown,
Speaker 5: and E is a sessive need for control. And so
Speaker 5: sometimes when you like wonder did I do my best
Speaker 5: even though you know you did, but that thought is
Speaker 5: still there, it could be part of life, for example,
Speaker 5: an internalized beliefs, where like maybe you just learn from
Speaker 5: a very young age that like you've got to keep
Speaker 5: trying and like you're not good enough until you keep going,
Speaker 5: Like there's these messages that you get from parents or
Speaker 5: coaches or teachers, and then as an adult you start
Speaker 5: beating on yourself with those messages even when you have
Speaker 5: had your best.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, I mean that that resonates, resonates completely with me
Speaker 1: is definitely part of my story. And I have one
Speaker 1: more situation I want to bring up just personally. And again,
Speaker 1: Jane and I are very open the show. So if
Speaker 1: something for me is like Jana always encouraged me when
Speaker 1: I was done with my NFL career and everything like that,
Speaker 1: and even people around me they're like, oh, you should
Speaker 1: try you know, sportscasting and this and that, and you'd
Speaker 1: be really good at it, and and me, I, I
Speaker 1: guess you could call them excuses, but I always told myself,
Speaker 1: was like, yeah, that'd be great. But almost every player
Speaker 1: that retires, that's the first thing they want to get into.
Speaker 1: And every time that some guy that played for ten
Speaker 1: plus years is a first you know, first ballot Hall
Speaker 1: of Famer and multiple Pro Bowls, a Super Bowl, this
Speaker 1: and that, they get bumped to the top of the
Speaker 1: list every year those guys retire. So I'm like, you know,
Speaker 1: maybe I'm not confident in my accolades that I achieved
Speaker 1: in my career or whatever it may be, But to me,
Speaker 1: I've thought of it as being realistic and to me
Speaker 1: and my.
Speaker 2: Wife and as his wife, I'm like, Okay, first of all,
Speaker 2: you don't have a face for radio. You've got a
Speaker 2: face for TV. You're so charming, you are so like
Speaker 2: you ask amazing questions. You're so charming and you like
Speaker 2: you would be and everyone has met him. It's like,
Speaker 2: you need to do sports broadcasting and I'm like, babe,
Speaker 2: I can link you with the right people. We can.
Speaker 2: Like it's going to be worth a lot of hard work,
Speaker 2: but like you can do it. And it's just it's
Speaker 2: been so frustrating to stand the sidelence and I'm like, Okay,
Speaker 2: I can't push for a dream that maybe he just
Speaker 2: doesn't want, but I think he does want. So it's
Speaker 2: like it's hard for me because I'm like, does he
Speaker 2: want it? Does he not want it? Like when should
Speaker 2: I stop pushing him? Because I want him to be
Speaker 2: so happy. I'm like, if you want to be a garbage,
Speaker 2: I don't care what you do.
Speaker 1: I just want you to be happy, happy.
Speaker 2: But it's like, but I also know, but I just
Speaker 2: also know, like what he's capable of and what he's
Speaker 2: walking away from when he has an opportunity, and he
Speaker 2: could have those opportunities. So it's frustrating as like a
Speaker 2: biastander to be like, why wouldn't you want to try? Right?
Speaker 5: Well, not that's not only as a vicegander, but obviously,
Speaker 5: like that's the one who loves him, and you're like,
Speaker 5: come on, like, I can see so much more that
Speaker 5: could happen, but we want to make sure that it's
Speaker 5: what might want, right, And so that's obviously the struggle
Speaker 5: that you're having. But you know, I do think that, Mike.
Speaker 5: Sometimes maybe your thoughts do get in the way. And
Speaker 5: like there's these categories of thought that we all have,
Speaker 5: you know, and everybody has them in different amounts. But
Speaker 5: you know, one type of thought though is discounting the positives.
Speaker 5: And I can definitely see that that might be part
Speaker 5: of your thinking that you know, even when you've achieved
Speaker 5: a lot, Yeah, but that's not really anything that I
Speaker 5: should have done more. And it's almost the same thing
Speaker 5: when you compare yourself to some of these other guys, like, well,
Speaker 5: but they've got like five, ten, fifteen years on me,
Speaker 5: So maybe I'm just not there yet. Maybe if I
Speaker 5: even want to do that, I can't even do that
Speaker 5: for another ten years. And you know, while that's really
Speaker 5: awesome because it sounds like you're a very humble person
Speaker 5: who's like grateful for your opportunities, you can see how
Speaker 5: those thoughts can get in your own way, right, because,
Speaker 5: for example, like Sianna was saying, maybe there are people
Speaker 5: who are just like dying to get to know you
Speaker 5: and put you on air. But if you don't go
Speaker 5: for it, and if you don't like say yes to
Speaker 5: the meeting, then that wouldn't happen until you say yes, right,
Speaker 5: And so that wouldn't be a place where you could
Speaker 5: slip up and self davotage, is it?
Speaker 1: I mean, you guys just talking about it something that's
Speaker 1: coming up for me. Maybe it's I do have a
Speaker 1: fear around my concern is that my fears get validated? Right, yes?
Speaker 1: So so yeah, I say, I do put myself out there,
Speaker 1: and the reason that it doesn't work out is are
Speaker 1: for the exact reasons why I was hesitant in the first.
Speaker 5: Place, totally right, Because you're afraid that that might like
Speaker 5: you know, validate or confirm like these deep fears that
Speaker 5: you have, and like what does that mean about you?
Speaker 5: Then if you don't get it, and I think, again,
Speaker 5: this is like where our thoughts can get us in
Speaker 5: the loop, right, because what's happening in this case would
Speaker 5: be that if you don't get it, there could be
Speaker 5: a million reasons it could be, well, this is just
Speaker 5: not the time where we already had a person we
Speaker 5: were already talking to, so that spot was already held
Speaker 5: and that person said yes, and so we're not even
Speaker 5: entertaining any other offers, even though yours was a really
Speaker 5: close second. You know, all these things could happen, but
Speaker 5: like your own interpretation though of that if it were
Speaker 5: to happen is oh see, I wasn't good enough and
Speaker 5: I shouldn't have even done it. And you know, I
Speaker 5: talk all the time with people I work with, my
Speaker 5: friends and my family and my clients. You know about
Speaker 5: the things that we tell ourselves when a situation happens.
Speaker 5: Like two of the same situations could happen to the
Speaker 5: two different people, and they could have completely different reactions
Speaker 5: to it. Like, for example, if two separate people were
Speaker 5: laid off, one person could have a thought like, oh
Speaker 5: my gosh, like what am I going to do for money?
Speaker 5: What am I going to tell my family? This is
Speaker 5: still in arsa, and you can see how they was spiral.
Speaker 5: They would have negative emotions, they would probably go and isolate.
Speaker 5: But then the other persons who gets laid off, they're like,
Speaker 5: thank goodness, I didn't like this job that much in
Speaker 5: the first place. So while it's stuck to not have
Speaker 5: a job, like this is my time to recent let
Speaker 5: me think about what I want to do next, and
Speaker 5: you can see how that person can have a totally
Speaker 5: different cascade of emotions and actions after that. They may
Speaker 5: even be looking up a little freefacation, you know, They
Speaker 5: may you know, make dinner plans with their friends. And
Speaker 5: so that's kind of the power of thoughts right as
Speaker 5: human beings. I mean, it's like our greatest achievement and
Speaker 5: our greatest downfall that we have thoughts and we have language.
Speaker 5: I guess what leads us to be the top of
Speaker 5: the food chain. But it's also like what leads us
Speaker 5: to have suffering. And that's I think the interesting piece
Speaker 5: of the puzzle is that the thoughts are what leads
Speaker 5: us to oftentimes our suffering most definitely.
Speaker 1: And let me just ask this too on the opposite
Speaker 1: side of this, like if you're in Jan's shoes, just
Speaker 1: in our situation, for instance, like what do you say
Speaker 1: to those people, the loved ones, the friends, the supporters
Speaker 1: of somebody that see this person that they love and
Speaker 1: care for self sabotaging themselves, Like at what point, like
Speaker 1: for Jenna for instance, or somebody else. How much should
Speaker 1: they push until they just realize there's no more. I
Speaker 1: can't push anymore, you know what I mean?
Speaker 5: Yeah, yeah, I know it can be so frustrating. I
Speaker 5: think for a loved one to see, oh my gosh,
Speaker 5: I feel like you want this, but I'm not sure
Speaker 5: if you're just not saying it. And I know that
Speaker 5: you can even do more than what you're doing, but
Speaker 5: they just want you to be happy. I think coming
Speaker 5: from an external place, all you have to do is
Speaker 5: support and validate the person. But at the same time,
Speaker 5: that person it has to come from themselves. So you
Speaker 5: can say that and you can support them and validate them.
Speaker 5: But sometimes it almost even gets like irritating, like okay,
Speaker 5: I understand, you know, like it makes you feel almost frustrated,
Speaker 5: even though they're coming from such a good place. And
Speaker 5: so I always tell people it's a really good thing
Speaker 5: as a loved one to remind the person that you
Speaker 5: love to refocus on their values or their value system
Speaker 5: as a way to get them out of that thinking.
Speaker 5: So values are very different from goals, the thing that
Speaker 5: you can check off the list, right, I can run
Speaker 5: a marathon that can check it off. But values are
Speaker 5: things that you want your life to stand for. It's
Speaker 5: what you want to be remembered by when you die.
Speaker 5: I mean, it's like what people what you want people
Speaker 5: to know you for. So there are things that can't
Speaker 5: be checked off. They're usually things that you want to
Speaker 5: pursue for most of their life, things like integrity, or
Speaker 5: a sense of adventure, or community or spirituality. You know,
Speaker 5: these types of things are examples of common values.
Speaker 1: And I feel like.
Speaker 5: If everybody reshifted and focus on what their values are
Speaker 5: and then derive their goals from their values, not only
Speaker 5: will they find the goal pursue more fulfilling, but they
Speaker 5: might also be willing to take more chances and like
Speaker 5: tolerate the discomfort, whether it's just your negative self talk
Speaker 5: or like you know, like negative emotions because you're like wait,
Speaker 5: but it's in the service of something really important. So,
Speaker 5: for example, if one of your values was honesty, you're
Speaker 5: not going to have an easy road. You know, sometimes
Speaker 5: when you're honest with people, they get mad at you
Speaker 5: and they stop being your friends. But it's in your
Speaker 5: heart you believe that honesty is really important to you,
Speaker 5: then you're more willing to like withstand the distress that
Speaker 5: might come from it. So I feel like that might
Speaker 5: be a really good way for loved ones to like
Speaker 5: help the people that they care about see like something
Speaker 5: different from the kind of thought patterns that they've been in.
Speaker 2: Yeah that makes sense. Yeah, absolutely, What about the people
Speaker 2: like I do this and I know I do this.
Speaker 2: There are so many times and I'm like, I know
Speaker 2: I'm holding myself back. Yeah, I don't know how to
Speaker 2: fix it.
Speaker 5: Yes, I think that that is really common that you
Speaker 5: have that acknowledgment like huh, I'm holding myself back, but like,
Speaker 5: how come I can't get out of it? I think
Speaker 5: that's Yeah, that's part of why I wrote this book
Speaker 5: because people keep saying that, like I'm so frustrated, like
Speaker 5: we need a plan, and so I think the plan
Speaker 5: is always to be able to like check out what
Speaker 5: thoughts you had before you had that feeling of like
Speaker 5: I'm holding myself back, Like once you recognize I know
Speaker 5: I'm holding myself back, but why is it? Like what
Speaker 5: was your thinking before that? Like what was the thought
Speaker 5: that you had just before that? Was it? Well, I
Speaker 5: don't want people to criticize me. Well, I don't want
Speaker 5: to be like a note of know it all and
Speaker 5: show off. I feel like people might not be happy
Speaker 5: for my success, like what was the thought that preceded it.
Speaker 2: It's only like when I'm like, when I'm acting or
Speaker 2: something a cintimes, I'll be like, why don't I just
Speaker 2: let myself? Like I know I'm holding west Like I
Speaker 2: know I am, like, I know that I'm getting in
Speaker 2: the way of my job, but I'm like, but I
Speaker 2: still can't let go. And I don't know if it's
Speaker 2: because I'm afraid to feel, if I'm afraid to do you.
Speaker 1: Want to dive into that, because I would love to hear,
Speaker 1: like what you're how you're holding yourself back?
Speaker 2: I mean because John always tells me, He's like, why
Speaker 2: do you use Like if you let go, you would
Speaker 2: book NonStop And I will start crying immediately because I'm like,
Speaker 2: I but I'm like, I know that, but I don't
Speaker 2: know how to let go. That's the thing. I don't
Speaker 2: know what that piece is. I don't know if it's fear.
Speaker 2: I don't know if I'm afraid of feeling. I don't
Speaker 2: know if I'm afraid of like, I don't know. I'd like,
Speaker 2: I genuinely don't know, and I know it like every
Speaker 2: time I'm even like auditioning, I'm like, I know, I'm
Speaker 2: like holding myself back right now, and I'm like, why
Speaker 2: am I doing this to myself? But I can out
Speaker 2: physically let go, And the times that I have, I've
Speaker 2: done it maybe twice. Remember when I was on a
Speaker 2: tree hill and I baled afterwards because I was just
Speaker 2: like it was such a I just and I don't
Speaker 2: know why. I don't know. I literally don't.
Speaker 1: Have the answer.
Speaker 5: It's actually say, I'm glad that Mike asked you to
Speaker 5: dive into it more because it kind of gives some
Speaker 5: context to it, and I think we have to kind
Speaker 5: of shift back to that whole life acronym and see
Speaker 5: what is really getting in the way there. And as
Speaker 5: I'm hearing you talk about it, it almost feels a
Speaker 5: little bit like that the E it stands for excessive
Speaker 5: needs for control. I mean, these are like the overachievers,
Speaker 5: you know, people who are like you know, they're I mean,
Speaker 5: they've gotten where they are because they were in control,
Speaker 5: like because that's what set them apart and it's what
Speaker 5: made them achieve as much as they did. But also
Speaker 5: that part of them can also hold themselves back, especially
Speaker 5: in like a creative in a creative environment, Like that's
Speaker 5: an actor. Like if you let it go, I mean,
Speaker 5: like you're putting your whole self out there. You're so vulnerable,
Speaker 5: and it's like almost that sense of like if I
Speaker 5: let go of control, like what might happen? I mean, yes,
Speaker 5: something amazing could happen, or maybe not, what if it
Speaker 5: isn't good, or like what if somebody says something? And
Speaker 5: like maybe those types of things could could potentially get
Speaker 5: in the way of you doing something that you know
Speaker 5: you have the capacity for. I mean, does that sound
Speaker 5: like similar like something that you felt before?
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, for sure.
Speaker 1: So it's just kind of be purely fear based, right,
Speaker 1: just self sabotaging in general.
Speaker 5: Well, it's a good question because I always look at
Speaker 5: self sabotage as a very universal phenomenon. Like when people
Speaker 5: are like, oh, I don't self sabotage, I'm like, I
Speaker 5: think everybody does sometimes, and then they'll find like maybe
Speaker 5: one area of their life where they're holding themselves back,
Speaker 5: like maybe it's not love, but it's their career, or
Speaker 5: maybe it's not their career, but it's their diet, you know,
Speaker 5: whatever it is. It's usually it's one or two areas.
Speaker 5: Not everybody self sabotages everything, and in fact what nobody does,
Speaker 5: and so it is in some ways fear based because
Speaker 5: there is a very biological and evolutionary aspect of self
Speaker 5: sabotage in my opinion, You know, when we think about
Speaker 5: human being, like what's led to our survival is only
Speaker 5: two things. It's either attaining rewards or avoiding threat, and
Speaker 5: we kind of have to do both in balance, right,
Speaker 5: we have to keep going for the rewards, but we
Speaker 5: also have to avoid threats well. In our modern day
Speaker 5: threat is not a saber tooth tiger. For most of us,
Speaker 5: we're lucky enough that it's not a physical threat. But
Speaker 5: it's more of like an emotional or psychological threat. It's
Speaker 5: like the fear of failure, or like the fear that
Speaker 5: you won't get to where you need to go, or
Speaker 5: the fear that you might be ridiculed, or you know what,
Speaker 5: if you try really hard and you still don't get
Speaker 5: to your goal, then what does that mean about you
Speaker 5: as a person. And those types of things when they
Speaker 5: take over and when that switch happens where you prioritize
Speaker 5: fear reduction more than attaining rewards. That's when you self sabotage.
Speaker 2: Interesting, what's like, I mean, obviously the first step would
Speaker 2: be to read your book, but in the immediate fix, Yes,
Speaker 2: what is.
Speaker 5: The first Well, I think the first thing you know
Speaker 5: is again recognize that it's biological and universal, because if
Speaker 5: you're like ashamed about it or you think is just
Speaker 5: you are more likely not to tackle the problem. So like,
Speaker 5: just know that and accept that everybody does it and
Speaker 5: that you're not alone, so it's all good. And know
Speaker 5: that there's a fix. You know, know that there is
Speaker 5: a fix. I think that that's really the most important step.
Speaker 5: And then the second step is to look at your thoughts.
Speaker 5: You know, what are the thoughts that precede a negative
Speaker 5: emotion or an action that you wish you didn't take
Speaker 5: or when you didn't realize your self sabotage, Like what
Speaker 5: was the thought that you had before that? And once
Speaker 5: you locate that thought, you'll probably start to see patterns
Speaker 5: to it that, like this thought has come up before.
Speaker 5: Then you can start to work with it. And so
Speaker 5: one thing that you can do after that is to
Speaker 5: try to reshift your thinking. And so there's two ways
Speaker 5: to reshift your thinking, and I talk about it in
Speaker 5: my book, and one way to reshift it is to
Speaker 5: try to have a more balanced thought. Most of the
Speaker 5: signs are automatic thoughts are very like critical and that
Speaker 5: they only look at one side of the picture. So
Speaker 5: there's a really quick technique that I have called yes
Speaker 5: but and it means that you acknowledge the happy part
Speaker 5: of this situation, but you also acknowledge this other thing
Speaker 5: that you know you're already making progress, that you're already
Speaker 5: doing something to improve. So for example, you know, somebody,
Speaker 5: you know, somebody that I was working with in my
Speaker 5: private practice, was saying that they don't think that they're
Speaker 5: ever going to reach their fitness goals. And then you
Speaker 5: know they're like, I'm never going to reach my fitness goals.
Speaker 5: I'm like, well that is a very black and white thought,
Speaker 5: So like, how can we change is to recognize how
Speaker 5: you feel, but like also recognize what you're doing, So
Speaker 5: then you change the thought too. Yes, this is taking
Speaker 5: much longer than I thought it was, but I'm making
Speaker 5: progress every day. Case in point, today I went for
Speaker 5: a run for thirty minutes before I came to the session, right,
Speaker 5: I mean, so it's almost like saying yes to the
Speaker 5: part that isn't so great right now, but also saying,
Speaker 5: but what is better? You know what has been shifting,
Speaker 5: and just recognizing that and that balanced thought will just
Speaker 5: change the way that you feel. But sometimes it's just
Speaker 5: in such a crappy mood that you're not even going
Speaker 5: to want to do the yes butt You're like, I
Speaker 5: know the yes, but but I can do it and
Speaker 5: my heart's not in it, and that's fine. Sometimes you
Speaker 5: can change the thoughts, but you can change your relationship
Speaker 5: to it. So oftentimes we have a and we automatically
Speaker 5: think it's true because that's like the power of thoughts,
Speaker 5: Like you have it and you're like, oh my god,
Speaker 5: it's happening, you know. So what I encourage people to
Speaker 5: do is to use a technique called labeling. And labeling
Speaker 5: just means that you're labeling the thought just as it is.
Speaker 5: It's all it is is a mental event. It's just
Speaker 5: an event. It's not saying that's true or not. So
Speaker 5: if you have a thought, for example, like oh my gosh,
Speaker 5: I'm never going to find a better job. Instead of
Speaker 5: just leaving that thought as it is or even trying
Speaker 5: to change it, one alternate way to do this is
Speaker 5: just to put a little just tack a little sentence
Speaker 5: before that, and that sentence is I'm having the thought that,
Speaker 5: So then that becomes I'm having the thought that I'm
Speaker 5: never going to find a better job, and it does
Speaker 5: take the win out of the sales a little bit
Speaker 5: of that original thought like, oh, I'm just having a
Speaker 5: thought that that's happening, doesn't mean that it is, you know,
Speaker 5: and even that small, little quick substitution can really help people.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, And do you mentioned the whole the life acronym.
Speaker 1: And I have one last question for you. Is there
Speaker 1: any kind kind of test or evaluation that just anyone
Speaker 1: could take to be like, all right, what kind of
Speaker 1: sabotaging am I doing?
Speaker 5: Yes, there is. So I actually have this up on
Speaker 5: my website and it's free to take. And my website
Speaker 5: is doctor judyho dot com and the actual website link
Speaker 5: for the quiz it's doctorg dot com and then it's
Speaker 5: backplast stop self Sabotage quiz and so definitely go and
Speaker 5: check it out. So quiz takes like five minutes and
Speaker 5: you can identify your primary life factor right there and
Speaker 5: then know how to move forward from.
Speaker 1: There perfect well, Jane and I are definitely probably going
Speaker 1: to do that today.
Speaker 2: Thank you.
Speaker 1: And besides your website, where else can our listeners find you?
Speaker 5: Well, you can find me on social media on Instagram
Speaker 5: and Twitter at doctor Judy host. So that's d R
Speaker 5: j U d y h O. And I just want
Speaker 5: to encourage everybody to start watching season twelve of The Doctors.
Speaker 5: I'm a co host for season twelve and we got
Speaker 5: really cool topics coming up. Yeah, yay.
Speaker 2: I love the Doctor. I was on there when I
Speaker 2: was pregnant last year. I was They're so sweet.
Speaker 5: Oh, I know, there's like a delight to work with.
Speaker 5: It's crazy. It's like you get exactly what you see.
Speaker 5: They're really amazing people.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I love them. Well, congratulations and again, seriously, thank
Speaker 2: you so much. This has been eye opening.
Speaker 1: It has been.
Speaker 5: Oh it's been a real plague of talking to you guys,
Speaker 5: and I hope to keep in touch with you both.
Speaker 1: Absolutely. Thank you, Doctor Judy, appreciate it.
Speaker 2: Thank you.
Speaker 5: Okay, talk to you I soon.
Speaker 1: Bye, all right, bye.
Speaker 2: Bye bye, Mark Easton, Jenna, Janna, Where are you guys
Speaker 2: holding back in your life? Where are you self sabotaging?
Speaker 3: I've thought of this, I mean professionally, things have gone
Speaker 3: well for me, but there are all kinds of things
Speaker 3: I would have liked to have done in my life,
Speaker 3: and the fact that I speak of it that way
Speaker 3: is a form of self test sabotage.
Speaker 2: Like I'm not you still have time.
Speaker 3: I don't have to say, oh I could have been there,
Speaker 3: I could have done this. I could still go out
Speaker 3: and do those things. But I don't see myself doing that.
Speaker 3: Why not because I'm comfortable, you know what I'm saying, Like, like,
Speaker 3: I got my routine, I enjoy my job, I'm paid well,
Speaker 3: Like I feel like this is I feel like I'm
Speaker 3: a comfort level, like this is it. But then I think, oh,
Speaker 3: that'd be so cool to do that, But like, do
Speaker 3: you really jump from something that's working?
Speaker 2: Like what? Like what would you want to know?
Speaker 3: I've always wanted to do baseball. I've always wanted to
Speaker 3: do play by play baseball on the radio.
Speaker 2: Oh, I thought you meant like professionally, I'm.
Speaker 3: Like, Mark, I've always wanted to be a baseball announcer,
Speaker 3: and I think i'd be really good at it, but
Speaker 3: you'd be so wait let.
Speaker 2: Me hear, Okay, Mark, this is your audition for a
Speaker 2: baseball announcing six.
Speaker 3: Yeah, there you go go ahead. Let me hear swinging
Speaker 3: the ground all the short for the second for one
Speaker 3: off the first. It's a double play. That's what I meant.
Speaker 1: Absolutely, it's perfect at it.
Speaker 3: It's it's always going in my head. I'm watching a
Speaker 3: baseball game.
Speaker 1: How you would how you would kind of come yeah.
Speaker 2: So let's do it. I mean, why can't you do both?
Speaker 3: I mean there's there's because I think that involves climbing
Speaker 3: a ladder like any other job. I have zero experience
Speaker 3: doing it. So I'd have to move to I don't know, Birmingham,
Speaker 3: Alabama or in West Virginia and start there and climb
Speaker 3: the minor league ladder.
Speaker 1: And I'm not doing that. I got kids.
Speaker 2: But you got Seacrest.
Speaker 3: I got Seacrest.
Speaker 2: Couldn't he help you out? Can he make a few calls?
Speaker 2: I mean you have to also, you know, use your
Speaker 2: context you have.
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, that's true.
Speaker 1: It's still different worlds.
Speaker 2: I understand that, but it's.
Speaker 3: Still I think that Will just have to have made
Speaker 3: a dream.
Speaker 2: See that's what bothers me.
Speaker 1: But but I think mark mark dream is very similar
Speaker 1: to what I, Yes, what I'd love to do sports
Speaker 1: casting A that'd be fantastic, but it's the same kind
Speaker 1: of deal you'd have to start out we're commentating the game.
Speaker 1: Guess what I'll begin in the garbage games? You know,
Speaker 1: d two games somewhere somewhere.
Speaker 2: How would be you sound right?
Speaker 1: But we have but we have two young kids. That
Speaker 1: means traveling during the fall to traveling every weekend.
Speaker 2: If it's your dream and what you want to do,
Speaker 2: you can't You're not going to be Meryl Streep tomorrow,
Speaker 2: you know what I mean?
Speaker 3: Would you be fine with Michael being gone Thursday, no,
Speaker 3: Sunday or Monday every single week.
Speaker 2: If it's something if look at he what he said
Speaker 2: when he retired, He's like, I want to be a
Speaker 2: police officer. And I said, whatever you want to do
Speaker 2: that will make you happy? Sure what, I love him
Speaker 2: doing shift work. No, I mean it would really suck
Speaker 2: for the family. But at the same time, if it
Speaker 2: would make him happy, I'm not going to like be
Speaker 2: moping around the house if it's something that he truly
Speaker 2: wants to do. And he was like, so he went
Speaker 2: to the the orientation to be a cop, you.
Speaker 1: Know, and he he ended up with the ultimate goal
Speaker 1: of going into the FBI.
Speaker 2: But and that's something where you know, I was totally
Speaker 2: behind him because I just I want him so badly
Speaker 2: to do what he wants to do and love what
Speaker 2: he wants to do.
Speaker 1: Well, look, those dreams are gone because I can't be
Speaker 1: a secret agent when all of our life is already
Speaker 1: out there and publicized, so I can't. I can't do
Speaker 1: that anyway.
Speaker 2: I'm the reason why I.
Speaker 3: Dreams you'd be a great color commentator.
Speaker 2: I think you would be amazing at sports broadcasting. I
Speaker 2: think you'd be incredible. And there's so many things where
Speaker 2: it's like and I'm like, yeah, you're not going to
Speaker 2: go to you know, the top one right away. You're
Speaker 2: not going to be freaking right.
Speaker 1: But I also know this. It isn't just messed up myself.
Speaker 1: It's also because I don't want to necessarily be away
Speaker 1: from the kids, like like Mark said, Thursday probably till
Speaker 1: Sunday morning every single week during the fall, like literally
Speaker 1: that that's how it have to be, because I would
Speaker 1: be on the road from Thursday to Sunday every single
Speaker 1: week during the fall and if summer beginning through the fall,
Speaker 1: because I would have to be doing these games all
Speaker 1: over the country. Yeah. So it's like, do I do
Speaker 1: I personally want to be away from my family that much?
Speaker 2: I mean, I get that. Yeah, I get that. And
Speaker 2: that is exactly what I was gonna say, is like
Speaker 2: I don't enjoy touring anymore because I'm away from you guys.
Speaker 1: Right, and so we can bring the whole family on
Speaker 1: the bus, liked Jolie early on.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And it takes the fun away from it. And
Speaker 2: then I'm like, I'm miserable. I have fun when I'm
Speaker 2: playing my show, but I'm miserable in my bus sitting
Speaker 2: there all day, you know, missing my family.
Speaker 1: Right exactly.
Speaker 3: So, Mike, it sounds like, I mean, it's something you
Speaker 3: would enjoy doing, but it sounds like the negatives outeigh
Speaker 3: the positives at this point.
Speaker 2: Yes, unless he is on like Game day. Yeah, and
Speaker 2: that's what I call from Fox Sports and the Yeah,
Speaker 2: which again.
Speaker 1: Come sit with Howie Long and the Terry Bradshaw and
Speaker 1: the rest of the crew. Sure, I guess I can
Speaker 1: do that.
Speaker 2: I heard Torri it would be good.
Speaker 3: I mean, that's the thing is she'd be so good here.
Speaker 3: You're funny, You've got a good voice.
Speaker 2: You know, And I get that he's not, you know,
Speaker 2: I mean the guys that I'm sure Andrew luck is
Speaker 2: going to be the next dude sitting.
Speaker 1: There, but he doesn't have the person that I'm just.
Speaker 2: Saying, like, those guys will get that opportunity first. The
Speaker 2: same time.
Speaker 1: Walked straight off the field into a booth. Tony Romo
Speaker 1: struck straight off the field.
Speaker 2: Somehow to Seacrest. So you've got Seacrest to but we
Speaker 2: got Seacrest. Oh lord.
Speaker 1: I have some emails if you'd like, or we have
Speaker 1: one thing we want to bring up though.
Speaker 2: We put time out before that.
Speaker 1: Though.
Speaker 2: We are going on a wine down tour, which we're
Speaker 2: very excited about, and you can get your tickets Jana
Speaker 2: Cramer dot com. We're going to Chicago, Michigan, Louisville, filled Up, Pennsylvania, Philadelphia, Boston.
Speaker 2: Are we going to Boston and that was last year?
Speaker 1: I don't know.
Speaker 2: Just go on Jana Cremer dot com. We're coming to
Speaker 2: you see you. We're so excited.
Speaker 3: The brewery.
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, we're coming there on Saturday. Stry I'm so.
Speaker 3: Excited Irwindale Brewery.
Speaker 2: I'm so pumped about that. I'm so excited to see you.
Speaker 2: I know, I'm excited to see you too. I texted
Speaker 2: Toy yesterday and I was I'm so excited to see you.
Speaker 2: She's like, I'm I'm hosting. I have my wine glass,
Speaker 2: I'm ready to roll. I did. I was super pumped,
Speaker 2: and I'm super pumped.
Speaker 1: It's gonna be so much fun. We're gonna have a blast.
Speaker 2: It's gonna be fun. It's gonna be so much fun.
Speaker 1: Real quick. Yeah, So we promised what do we promise
Speaker 1: the listeners?
Speaker 2: The listeners?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, so we mentioned to the listeners that we
Speaker 1: were going to sit that you forgot it. I've been waiting.
Speaker 2: It's called the five minute breakdown, okay, of.
Speaker 1: A new segment that we're going to be doing every week. Yeah,
Speaker 1: we have homework. Every week is the five minute breakdown
Speaker 1: of the One Tree Hill episode that we just watched.
Speaker 2: So I've we have never I've never seen One Tree Hill.
Speaker 2: Michael's never seen One Tree Hill. And from being on
Speaker 2: the show for three years, I feel quite bad that
Speaker 2: I've never even watched an episode the.
Speaker 1: Best Have any of you watched it? Tory Easton, No Business?
Speaker 1: Love it?
Speaker 2: Okay, So we're yesterday, Okay, sorry.
Speaker 1: So we started the first episode okay, and I don't
Speaker 1: remember the actors' names. I know Chad Michael Murray, but
Speaker 1: then the other one that plays Nathan Scott, Nathan Scott,
Speaker 1: Lucas Scott, Nathan Scott.
Speaker 6: So by the way that the show starts, the show
Speaker 6: starts and they show Nathan Scott and Lucas Scott, and
Speaker 6: then once you realize their brothers, Janna goes, wait, their brothers.
Speaker 2: Had no idea that they were brothers. Lying, swear you're lying. No,
Speaker 2: I swear the whole storyline. But I told you I
Speaker 2: knew nothing about the show. When I got on the show,
Speaker 2: I knew nothing, And I was like, they're brothers, Like
Speaker 2: he would wipe out the back of his jersey because
Speaker 2: their both names Scott, Well, we don't know.
Speaker 1: So the whole team staring him down, like what up?
Speaker 3: Wow?
Speaker 2: So we've got three four more minutes left this talk.
Speaker 2: So I was very shocked about that. Also, I'm when
Speaker 2: he walks into the to the auditorium. Do you think
Speaker 2: that James Lafferty's character was his name Nathan? Do you
Speaker 2: think that Nathan called him? You know what I mean?
Speaker 1: No, I don't think no, why not? I think because
Speaker 1: Lucas realized he's a Baller.
Speaker 2: It's just so weird because I know, like, I'm like Hailey,
Speaker 2: why is Hailey, like, like what he shouldn't be dating
Speaker 2: that other Peyton girl, Like he's married to Haley. It's
Speaker 2: very interesting married. Sorry, no, it's a roller coaster to ride.
Speaker 2: It's okay, So I'm And then what else happened in
Speaker 2: the first episode? Moira Kelly who by the way Cutting
Speaker 2: Edge she was played my mom and the Christmas Christmas movie.
Speaker 2: I was just in had no idea that she was
Speaker 2: the everyone always had Karen, so I was like Karen,
Speaker 2: But now I know who Karen is. Karen's his mom.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it starts the whole show.
Speaker 2: It's fascinating.
Speaker 1: What I think is fascinating to is when TV shows
Speaker 1: do like sports games. I thought it was good, though
Speaker 1: I was I was actually somewhat impressed because I was like,
Speaker 1: usually it's a lot worse than that. Yeah, there's genuine
Speaker 1: like athleticism on the court. It looked like but usually
Speaker 1: because like the production is a lot smaller production budget
Speaker 1: everything like that for like a TV show where it
Speaker 1: just looks like a joke, like even from like Fresh
Speaker 1: Prince of bel Air Days where when Will Smith's playing basketball.
Speaker 1: The court, the full size court is the size of
Speaker 1: like half of an actual basketball court, so it takes
Speaker 1: like one step. He's already on the other side of
Speaker 1: the court. Like it was ridiculous. It was like five
Speaker 1: year olds played on it.
Speaker 2: But when they played the game against each other, I
Speaker 2: didn't know who was going to win. They won on
Speaker 2: one game, they won a one game.
Speaker 1: I truly I can'tnot have Lucas win.
Speaker 2: I don't know, because it was almost like maybe he
Speaker 2: was gonna let him win because.
Speaker 1: That's my favorite character right now. After season one, episode one,
Speaker 1: Lucas Scott is my favorite character.
Speaker 2: Don't tell Sophia on the show ninety seconds for mad
Speaker 2: ninety seconds. I don't know. She came on after the
Speaker 2: next I think she's in the next episode because they
Speaker 2: brought her and she originally wasn't in the pilot, but
Speaker 2: then they wanted another female to come in and bruce
Speaker 2: stuff up, and she brewed it up.
Speaker 1: Got it.
Speaker 2: We need to have her on eventually. I'd love to
Speaker 2: have her on.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 2: So so that was our five minute one to Tree
Speaker 2: Hill wrap up.
Speaker 3: There are one hundred and eighty seven episodes that you really.
Speaker 1: Committing to watch it all Jane said last night. She
Speaker 1: was like, because these episodes going.
Speaker 2: Into it, thought, dude, twenty two episodes.
Speaker 1: I thought the episodes were like thirty minutes. She's like, no,
Speaker 1: there is an hour show, so they're like forty five minutes.
Speaker 1: There's twenty something episodes in each season. There's nine seasons.
Speaker 1: I'm like, good god, we're not watching anything for like
Speaker 1: the next three months.
Speaker 2: We just have to commit to more than that.
Speaker 3: Enjoy.
Speaker 2: Let us know. If you guys like this, let us
Speaker 2: know it. Whine down the deal. Here's the deal, though,
Speaker 2: we can stop. It's fine.
Speaker 1: I was.
Speaker 2: We were genuinely just doing this for you guys. So
Speaker 2: if you guys don't like us a recapping the five minutes,
Speaker 2: we can take it out. Just give us an email.
Speaker 2: Let us know.
Speaker 3: Maybe we go with three minutes.
Speaker 2: I like three, three is healthy, Three is good, all right.
Speaker 2: Mark's like, let's just cut it.
Speaker 3: No, not yet, I'm not there yet. I like it
Speaker 3: so far. How many seasons until we get to you?
Speaker 2: We've got six years, I know, but it's.
Speaker 1: Like, we need the backstory now to.
Speaker 2: Actually season freaking seven.
Speaker 1: You know what I do love. I'm not sure about
Speaker 1: One Tree Hill yet, not so on it yet. But
Speaker 1: what I do love are.
Speaker 2: Me and oh you are You're my favorites with me.
Speaker 1: And for me, like three.
Speaker 2: Years ago, time out, it was your sister.
Speaker 1: It was my sister.
Speaker 3: First.
Speaker 2: Your sister goes, hey, I know this is kind of weird,
Speaker 2: but like I got you friend likes underwear, so I'm
Speaker 2: gonna get you underwear. I know it's weird for a
Speaker 2: sister to get brother underwear. And since then, you have
Speaker 2: every shade every I got the ones.
Speaker 1: With roses on it, I got the ones with like
Speaker 1: the kiss lips on it. I got polka dot, I
Speaker 1: got blue.
Speaker 2: Yeah, like everything. And they also have me undies for
Speaker 2: girls too. I've got the the like sweat sweat.
Speaker 1: I was gonna say. And we got the pajama pants yeah,
Speaker 1: which are amazing.
Speaker 2: You can finish it.
Speaker 1: Oh thanks, Sonny.
Speaker 2: Welcome.
Speaker 1: So if you ever thought about getting in some new underwear,
Speaker 1: I'm telling you try me Undis. I love them. Jana
Speaker 1: actually even steals mine to wear at night. You love
Speaker 1: to wear those at night, and do we like to.
Speaker 4: Wear I'm I've been a subscriber since like twenty eleven.
Speaker 4: I was an early adopter. Wow, I'm wearing them right now.
Speaker 1: I had a boy but good thing about them. They
Speaker 1: are super soft, like we said, from sustainable Fabric, and
Speaker 1: they're available in every size from extra small to UH
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Speaker 1: slash wind down. That's me undies dot com slash wine.
Speaker 2: Down by Hey Mark, we got any emails.
Speaker 3: Shanne wants to thank you. She says, thank you for
Speaker 3: the advice you gave me on the Mommy Issues episode
Speaker 3: here in my email out loud gave me so much
Speaker 3: clarity and on top of the fact that you're both
Speaker 3: unbiased bystanders, I was reminded of the feelings of hurt
Speaker 3: and disrespect from him. I'm standing up for myself, I'm
Speaker 3: remembering who I am, and I'm walking the hell away
Speaker 3: from the Toxic Relations Girl.
Speaker 2: Yes Queen Yes also shout out to our nurse today
Speaker 2: because she listens to wind down. She's like, I love you, guys.
Speaker 1: Jason's nurse said the pediatrician. She's fantastic. She's awesome, TI
Speaker 1: because she gave me a shot.
Speaker 3: That's ab Katie's twenty five. He's lived with a guy
Speaker 3: for two and a half years. They have two dogs.
Speaker 3: They lived together, she says, after we essentially planned our
Speaker 3: life together. He broke it off. He told me I
Speaker 3: was a hard person to love. That's a phrase I
Speaker 3: hear every day of my life. This past year, I've
Speaker 3: made some bad decisions with guys, my eating, my overall mood.
Speaker 3: Do you have any advice how to get out of
Speaker 3: this funk? Oh, Katie, I feel like.
Speaker 2: This is very similar to the email we did last time,
Speaker 2: went hard to Love. I said, maybe it's not about
Speaker 2: like the guy kept telling her she's hard to love,
Speaker 2: and I'm like, well, actually that's something where I think
Speaker 2: the guy has his own personal issues. But with this
Speaker 2: and I don't know, it's hard to get out of funk.
Speaker 2: You're kind of in a funk me, haven't you.
Speaker 6: No?
Speaker 1: I was, I'm good now I'm Gucci.
Speaker 3: So what did you to get out of it?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Honestly, for me, he was reading reading.
Speaker 2: Yeah, did you read that book?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I've been reading more of that book really. Yeah. Wow.
Speaker 1: And I have my like touchstone self meditation for men
Speaker 1: like daily Morning. I read those like every morning kind
Speaker 1: of gives you like a purpose for the day. Oh yeah.
Speaker 1: So honestly, that's something I've been doing more of and
Speaker 1: I think it's really helped me.
Speaker 2: Oh wow, babe, because.
Speaker 1: A few weeks ago, I was really in a funk.
Speaker 1: Mm hmm. You know, I shared in the podcast whatever
Speaker 1: a week or so ago how we were in a funk.
Speaker 1: But since we've since been way out of that. And yeah,
Speaker 1: for me personally, it took for us to get out
Speaker 1: of funk. It also took me to get out of
Speaker 1: a funk and out of my own head and is
Speaker 1: doing something like taking contrary action? You know me, I'm
Speaker 1: not a huge reader, never have been, but I have
Speaker 1: a lot of books that I want to read. It's
Speaker 1: just like my eighty D kicks in and I can't
Speaker 1: just sit there and read.
Speaker 2: Is it the book that had to be adult?
Speaker 3: Uh?
Speaker 1: Huh?
Speaker 2: Wow?
Speaker 1: Had to be an adult? In a relationship.
Speaker 2: I love it. I'm so proud of you.
Speaker 1: Thank you.
Speaker 2: So I think getting out of it. So maybe try meditating,
Speaker 2: getting to get your funk every day?
Speaker 1: Yeah, do something, do something. The whole point is do
Speaker 1: something different that's healthy that you don't normally do. So
Speaker 1: if you don't normally work out, go work out. If
Speaker 1: you don't normally read, go read. If you never really
Speaker 1: just go for a walk, go for a walk.
Speaker 2: You know what I learned about Mike guys, he doesn't
Speaker 2: like to be encouraged when he works out.
Speaker 3: Go on the same way. I don't like that either.
Speaker 2: I was like, we worked out the other day and
Speaker 2: I was like, come on, babe, you got this, Come on,
Speaker 2: you got it? Only two more like come on, get up.
Speaker 2: He's like stop and I was like ooh.
Speaker 1: And then I told Jana story where every off season
Speaker 1: in the NFL there's always like local college strength coach
Speaker 1: interns or guys that are doing, you know, getting credits
Speaker 1: for college classes that are in the strength program, and
Speaker 1: they would come in trying to you know, it's the
Speaker 1: first time they're nervous in an NFL facility and trying
Speaker 1: to kind of prove themselves. So they get all loud
Speaker 1: and try to pump everybody up, and I've had a
Speaker 1: mf a lot of them because I hate that. So
Speaker 1: they all come in young's let's go, you could do it.
Speaker 1: And I've gotten pretty mean with some of those young
Speaker 1: kids from time to time because.
Speaker 2: If you hate it, what would you like me to do?
Speaker 1: Babe?
Speaker 2: Like when we're stretching, he's like, don't say anything kindly
Speaker 2: because I love working out with him. So I was
Speaker 2: so excited when he came out to work out with
Speaker 2: me and my trainer, and then I was just like, okay,
Speaker 2: all right.
Speaker 3: Next day, Mairl Madison says, my boyfriend and I've been
Speaker 3: together for three years and we're moving in together in
Speaker 3: a few months. He's twenty seven and twenty six. However,
Speaker 3: he doesn't believe in anxiety. I'm working on it, but
Speaker 3: I think part of it is just my personality and
Speaker 3: I don't know if it'll ever be fully fixed. How
Speaker 3: do I deal with your How do you deal with
Speaker 3: your anxious thoughts?
Speaker 2: How could I even forget about this topic?
Speaker 1: Let's answer that question.
Speaker 3: No no, no, no, no.
Speaker 2: No, We're going to answer it, and okay, fine, they
Speaker 2: don't understand it. Until they've had it and they think
Speaker 2: it's all in their head. And this is the best
Speaker 2: example I will give you right now. Michael had an
Speaker 2: anxiety attack. You guys, Oh I did, Yes, you did.
Speaker 2: We were we were in fabrication. No, it's not you guys.
Speaker 2: We were in New Orleans and we were sitting down.
Speaker 2: And this is about the second or third time this
Speaker 2: has happened recently. What just let me finish my story.
Speaker 2: We're sitting down for our date night, like you know,
Speaker 2: we let the nanny. We took the kids to New
Speaker 2: Orleans when I was filming. We decided to have a
Speaker 2: date night. We go to this date night and I
Speaker 2: can just tell he's getting pale, he's getting clammy. You know.
Speaker 2: He had some bread, took a little sip, a little
Speaker 2: teeny weeny sip of his Manhattan on the rocks with
Speaker 2: bullet or no, I didn't have bullet that night anyways,
Speaker 2: and he started to like look down, and I was like,
Speaker 2: are you good. He's like, yeah, I just I don't
Speaker 2: feel good. And I was like okay. And then he said,
Speaker 2: I think I think I need to go outside and
Speaker 2: just get some fresh air. And I was like all right.
Speaker 2: And so he comes back in. I said, babe, you
Speaker 2: know we can leave if you want to leave. Are
Speaker 2: you okay? I please know that it's okay. If you
Speaker 2: don't feel good, we can go right now. We can
Speaker 2: take the food to go. It's okay. And I said,
Speaker 2: can you just tell me your symptoms? And he goes,
Speaker 2: my heart's racing, I'm hot. I I'm like I was
Speaker 2: going to throw up, you know, I feel like I
Speaker 2: need some fresh air. My heart's like yeah, like pounding,
Speaker 2: and I just feel like and I go, babe, that's
Speaker 2: an anxiety attack. Nope, and he will refuse to admit
Speaker 2: that was an anxiety attack. And he goes, but it
Speaker 2: just came out nowhere. I go, babe, this is what
Speaker 2: you don't understand. Mine comes out of nowhere. We can
Speaker 2: be sitting here on a date night and I can
Speaker 2: just but that's the thing.
Speaker 1: I've never had that happen to me before.
Speaker 2: But there was something when we were talking about something
Speaker 2: too that somehow subconsciously triggered that, and he had an
Speaker 2: anxiety attack. And I was like, he goes, well, how
Speaker 2: do you know? I was like, hello, I'm like the
Speaker 2: epicenter of anxiety. I know what this is. And I
Speaker 2: was like, everything you just told me is a symptom
Speaker 2: of anxiety. Yeah, you're not catch you're not trying to
Speaker 2: catch your breath. And but if that is, that's not
Speaker 2: There's different types of anxiety attacks. And that anxiety attack
Speaker 2: that you just had was exactly the one that I
Speaker 2: had when I was with my girlfriends at dinner and
Speaker 2: I was and I was having a great day nor
Speaker 2: with my friends, and all of a sudden, I was like,
Speaker 2: oh God, I don't feel good. I feel I'm gonna
Speaker 2: throw up. My my hands are sweating. You know. I'm
Speaker 2: sweating now, you know, and I need to go outside
Speaker 2: and get some fresh air to be able to breathe, like,
Speaker 2: and he's just he refuses to amiss, it's not coincidental's
Speaker 2: He's like, I'm like refusing to admit that he had
Speaker 2: an anxiety attack.
Speaker 3: Why Linelike, he said, it's so dead set against that.
Speaker 2: I don't because he thinks he can control an anxiety
Speaker 2: attack because.
Speaker 1: I've never had. Well, here's the thing too, and I've
Speaker 1: told Jane this recently over the last several months. I
Speaker 1: know my body very well. My body was my business
Speaker 1: for years, so I'm very in tune with how my
Speaker 1: body feels on what's going on with it. And for
Speaker 1: the last few months, I've just felt out of whack,
Speaker 1: like I'm gonna go to our local physician, get a physical,
Speaker 1: just get my levels checked. I just feel like something
Speaker 1: is off. Something just has to be off. There's no
Speaker 1: way I should be as fatigued or feel as sick
Speaker 1: as I do something times or or or whatever it is.
Speaker 2: And he's even on depression medicine.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mom on, I take an antidepressant. I'm on adderall, Like,
Speaker 1: there's no reason I should be as fatigue. You're tired
Speaker 1: as I am some days when I take Adderall, and
Speaker 1: there's no way I should be. So it's just there's
Speaker 1: just something's off, And so I attribute it to that.
Speaker 1: I'm like, whatever is.
Speaker 2: Going on in my boy, cause that anxiety, that's the thing.
Speaker 2: That's something. Whatever is going on with you cause that
Speaker 2: anxiety right.
Speaker 1: So so well, regardless of whether that moment was an
Speaker 1: anxiety attack or not, I don't I don't consider it
Speaker 1: as like me having anxiety. I just think whatever's going
Speaker 1: on my body is just reallyffing me up right.
Speaker 2: Now, and which caused you to have an anxiety? Attack
Speaker 2: that wasn't an episode of an anxiety attack, and he
Speaker 2: I think he refuses to admit it because he thinks
Speaker 2: that he's more powerful over and I think that's what
Speaker 2: maybe to go back to Madison's email, is we it's
Speaker 2: hard to like people think you can control it.
Speaker 1: Well guys in general, right right, Yeah, we talked about
Speaker 1: our mentality. So I would say, from a god's perspective, Madison,
Speaker 1: if you talk to him, where coming from a place
Speaker 1: like if if Jenef you and I if it was
Speaker 1: from the at the beginning again and you told me
Speaker 1: you had anxiety and you came from a place of
Speaker 1: instead of maybe in the moment that she's having an
Speaker 1: anxiety attack, she stays ahead of it and just get
Speaker 1: And Madison goes to her boyfriend's like, look, I know
Speaker 1: you don't understand this. I don't understand this. This is
Speaker 1: what happens to me sometimes, and I'm it sucks. I'm
Speaker 1: really sorry, But would help What would help me is
Speaker 1: if I had your support and empathy during situations like
Speaker 1: this and like.
Speaker 2: Knowing that not make me feel crazy, right, not make.
Speaker 1: Me feel crazy, and like maybe having your support will
Speaker 1: help them subside or whatever because you know you and
Speaker 1: I early on, I was definitely like, what the hell
Speaker 1: is going on? Like just stop basically, but anyway, So
Speaker 1: if she's able to kind of stay ahead of it
Speaker 1: and just and just bring him in, like be vulnerable
Speaker 1: when it's not going on in that situation, in that
Speaker 1: in that moment, I think as a man, I would
Speaker 1: be able to receive that a little bit better and
Speaker 1: it would make me feel like I can I can
Speaker 1: be like a support for you, you know what I mean?
Speaker 2: Or night in shining, right.
Speaker 1: I can be your your hero a little bit.
Speaker 3: That's that's good advice because she needs to tell him
Speaker 3: exactly what she needs from him in that situation when
Speaker 3: it's not going on. That's something I had to learn
Speaker 3: and Mike you had to learn. So I think if
Speaker 3: you guys are really going to move in together after
Speaker 3: these three years, he's going to have to come around
Speaker 3: on that and and and be empathetic and understand what
Speaker 3: you need from him.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and we and as guys, we love to be needed,
Speaker 1: right Mark, So it's like knowing that our woman needs.
Speaker 2: Us and you hate to feel helpless, which in anxiety,
Speaker 2: you feel helpless because you don't know how to help
Speaker 2: and that makes us defensive.
Speaker 1: Yes, absolutely, Yes, we have one more.
Speaker 2: Yeah, we got a show, guys.
Speaker 1: I think great show.
Speaker 2: I think we got a show guys. That was really fun, good,
Speaker 2: good topics, great topics. I'm excited to see everyone in
Speaker 2: California this weekend at the brief Ast. It's going to
Speaker 2: be a good time, me and my belie, the Brewery,
Speaker 2: so cal contrary, the Brewery will see you there. And
Speaker 2: if you I want to see us live anywhere else,
Speaker 2: go to Janacramer dot com and we'll wind down again
Speaker 2: next week.
Speaker 5: Bye by
Speaker 2: M HM.