1 00:00:09,680 --> 00:00:12,879 Speaker 1: I started to realize that not being an expert isn't 2 00:00:12,920 --> 00:00:16,640 Speaker 1: a liability, it's a real gift. If we don't know 3 00:00:16,680 --> 00:00:18,920 Speaker 1: something about ourselves at this point in our life, it's 4 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:22,439 Speaker 1: probably because it's uncomfortable to know. If you can die 5 00:00:22,520 --> 00:00:25,880 Speaker 1: before you die, then you can really live. There's a 6 00:00:25,920 --> 00:00:30,480 Speaker 1: wisdom at death's door. I thought I was insane. Yeah, 7 00:00:31,040 --> 00:00:32,479 Speaker 1: and I didn't know what to do because there was 8 00:00:32,479 --> 00:00:36,000 Speaker 1: no internet. I don't know, man, I'm like, I feel 9 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:41,480 Speaker 1: like everything is hard. Hey, y'all, my name is Kat. 10 00:00:41,920 --> 00:00:45,080 Speaker 1: I'm a human first and a licensed therapist second. And 11 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:48,440 Speaker 1: right now I'm inviting you into conversations that I hope 12 00:00:48,520 --> 00:00:53,960 Speaker 1: encourage you to become more curious and less judgmental about yourself, others, 13 00:00:54,080 --> 00:00:58,080 Speaker 1: and the world around you. Welcome to You Need Therapy. 14 00:00:59,320 --> 00:01:01,840 Speaker 1: Hi guys, and welcome to a new episode of Eating 15 00:01:01,920 --> 00:01:04,399 Speaker 1: Therapy podcast. My name is Kat. I am the host, 16 00:01:04,440 --> 00:01:07,759 Speaker 1: and quick reminder before we get into today's episode that 17 00:01:07,959 --> 00:01:10,920 Speaker 1: although I am a therapist, this podcast is called You 18 00:01:10,959 --> 00:01:14,400 Speaker 1: Need Therapy. This podcast does not serve as a replacement 19 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:17,760 Speaker 1: or substitute for any actual mental health services. However, we 20 00:01:17,800 --> 00:01:20,200 Speaker 1: always hope that it can help you in some way. Somehow, 21 00:01:20,240 --> 00:01:23,280 Speaker 1: wherever you are on whatever kind of journey you are 22 00:01:23,280 --> 00:01:26,760 Speaker 1: on in life. Now, before we get into today's episode, 23 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:29,039 Speaker 1: two things I have to say that are on my mind. One, 24 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:32,760 Speaker 1: there is a fly that I cannot kill that is 25 00:01:32,840 --> 00:01:36,280 Speaker 1: buzzing around me, and there's nothing more. Well, I'm sure 26 00:01:36,280 --> 00:01:38,360 Speaker 1: there are plenty of things more frustrating than this, but 27 00:01:38,440 --> 00:01:41,640 Speaker 1: right now in my life, there's nothing more frustrating than 28 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:46,240 Speaker 1: flies that won't let you kill them or will not 29 00:01:46,800 --> 00:01:50,080 Speaker 1: exit when you open the door window. And the other 30 00:01:50,120 --> 00:01:51,640 Speaker 1: thing I wanted to say, just because I'm looking at 31 00:01:51,680 --> 00:01:54,680 Speaker 1: it right now, and this might not really be of 32 00:01:54,800 --> 00:01:56,960 Speaker 1: interest to a lot of you, but in the small 33 00:01:57,000 --> 00:01:58,600 Speaker 1: case that is the interest of some of you, I 34 00:01:58,640 --> 00:02:02,440 Speaker 1: wanted to share this. So I got married in February, 35 00:02:02,480 --> 00:02:04,720 Speaker 1: so a little over, I guess that's like ten months ago. 36 00:02:05,280 --> 00:02:08,760 Speaker 1: And I had been seeing everybody with their wedding bouquets, 37 00:02:08,760 --> 00:02:11,640 Speaker 1: getting them like pressed in like picture frames, and it 38 00:02:11,639 --> 00:02:15,040 Speaker 1: was really pretty. But I wanted something different, Like I 39 00:02:15,080 --> 00:02:18,560 Speaker 1: wanted the three D version of my flowers. And I 40 00:02:18,639 --> 00:02:22,400 Speaker 1: found this company called Rejoice and Blossom Art. You can 41 00:02:22,440 --> 00:02:25,600 Speaker 1: look them up on Instagram, and I think I found them. 42 00:02:25,720 --> 00:02:27,720 Speaker 1: I really want to say, I found them on TikTok, 43 00:02:28,400 --> 00:02:33,480 Speaker 1: but they do the resin molds and you can get 44 00:02:33,520 --> 00:02:35,840 Speaker 1: all kinds of shapes. I got like a I think 45 00:02:35,880 --> 00:02:38,680 Speaker 1: it's a hexagon for like my main piece, and there's 46 00:02:39,320 --> 00:02:41,760 Speaker 1: versions of almost every flower my bouquet, the ones that 47 00:02:41,800 --> 00:02:44,120 Speaker 1: I sent her in there and it set out really pretty. 48 00:02:44,160 --> 00:02:47,120 Speaker 1: And then you can add like add on things. And 49 00:02:47,160 --> 00:02:51,240 Speaker 1: I got a little pendant necklace with little pieces of 50 00:02:51,280 --> 00:02:53,680 Speaker 1: the petals for my flowers, for my wedding flowers, and 51 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:58,760 Speaker 1: then a jewelry box with individual petals and flowers in 52 00:02:59,040 --> 00:03:01,799 Speaker 1: the resin mold, and it is so cool. I am 53 00:03:01,919 --> 00:03:04,000 Speaker 1: so glad that I did this. It's something that I 54 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:07,120 Speaker 1: almost didn't do when I was trying to budget, but 55 00:03:07,160 --> 00:03:09,359 Speaker 1: I'm so glad I did it because this is something 56 00:03:09,360 --> 00:03:12,960 Speaker 1: that I will have forever. And I don't know if 57 00:03:12,960 --> 00:03:15,320 Speaker 1: I'm gonna have kids and if I will have girls, 58 00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:18,800 Speaker 1: but I just imagine myself giving like my daughter the 59 00:03:18,880 --> 00:03:21,760 Speaker 1: necklace with the little flower pedals. It's so cute, and 60 00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 1: then having that jewelry box forever that I can keep 61 00:03:24,680 --> 00:03:26,960 Speaker 1: my wedding rings in. I mean, she has all kinds 62 00:03:26,960 --> 00:03:28,600 Speaker 1: of add ons. You can get like a purse you 63 00:03:28,639 --> 00:03:32,040 Speaker 1: can get smaller shapes, you can get letters like the 64 00:03:32,200 --> 00:03:34,000 Speaker 1: I could have gotten like a V for Van Buren. 65 00:03:34,840 --> 00:03:36,440 Speaker 1: So there's all kinds of stuff. But I just wanted 66 00:03:36,480 --> 00:03:40,680 Speaker 1: to shout them out because they did such a fantastic 67 00:03:40,720 --> 00:03:42,600 Speaker 1: job and I just think it is such a cool 68 00:03:42,760 --> 00:03:45,680 Speaker 1: way to keep your flowers and to be able to 69 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:47,760 Speaker 1: dry them. Some people do the pressing all of that. 70 00:03:48,120 --> 00:03:50,200 Speaker 1: This is I just thought was a really fun and 71 00:03:50,240 --> 00:03:52,520 Speaker 1: different way to do that, and it gets to be 72 00:03:52,600 --> 00:03:54,240 Speaker 1: a piece of art in my home now, so I'm 73 00:03:54,280 --> 00:03:58,160 Speaker 1: really pumped about that. Her instagram is at Rejoice and Blossom, 74 00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:01,240 Speaker 1: so if that is of interesting you to you, I 75 00:04:01,280 --> 00:04:04,200 Speaker 1: would check her out. She also just makes fun, pretty 76 00:04:04,240 --> 00:04:06,800 Speaker 1: reels with all of her creations, so you might just 77 00:04:06,840 --> 00:04:09,480 Speaker 1: like following them in general. But I wanted to share 78 00:04:09,520 --> 00:04:11,720 Speaker 1: that because that was something really special to me and 79 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:13,520 Speaker 1: I'm looking at it right now and it's just bringing 80 00:04:13,520 --> 00:04:19,760 Speaker 1: a smile to my face. Now let's get into today's episode. 81 00:04:19,839 --> 00:04:25,880 Speaker 1: It is Halloween week. I currently am in Italy traveling 82 00:04:25,920 --> 00:04:28,960 Speaker 1: my first trip to Europe, my first trip to Italy, 83 00:04:29,040 --> 00:04:31,520 Speaker 1: my first trip. Well, actually this is the longest flight 84 00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:33,520 Speaker 1: that I will ever be on. I'm saying I'm in 85 00:04:33,560 --> 00:04:36,640 Speaker 1: there there now. I'm actually not there yet now because 86 00:04:36,640 --> 00:04:38,840 Speaker 1: I'm recording this before I leave. But as you listen 87 00:04:38,880 --> 00:04:42,760 Speaker 1: to this, I will probably be in Italy not celebrating Halloween. 88 00:04:42,880 --> 00:04:45,039 Speaker 1: I don't believe we will be doing that, but in 89 00:04:45,080 --> 00:04:47,599 Speaker 1: the off case, you guys will be. And because I 90 00:04:47,600 --> 00:04:49,240 Speaker 1: won't be doing that, I thought we would do a 91 00:04:49,240 --> 00:04:54,560 Speaker 1: little my version of a spooky episode. And this time 92 00:04:54,600 --> 00:04:58,960 Speaker 1: of year is historically engulfed in ghost stories and just 93 00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:02,719 Speaker 1: all things scary, hanted trail rides, haunted houses, all the things. 94 00:05:02,960 --> 00:05:05,919 Speaker 1: And while I don't really find it appropriate for me 95 00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:09,200 Speaker 1: to create a podcast on this particular platform full of 96 00:05:09,440 --> 00:05:11,680 Speaker 1: scary stories, I'm sure there are plenty of those right 97 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:14,080 Speaker 1: now that you could go listen to. Probably isn't the 98 00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:15,839 Speaker 1: best for our mental health. I don't want to be 99 00:05:15,880 --> 00:05:21,240 Speaker 1: promoting scaring ourselves and freaking ourselves out and giving ourselves anxiety. However, 100 00:05:21,800 --> 00:05:24,800 Speaker 1: I was recently reminded of a scary trip that I 101 00:05:24,839 --> 00:05:29,520 Speaker 1: took with a past boyfriend that in retrospect I really 102 00:05:29,640 --> 00:05:33,560 Speaker 1: learned a lot from and is somewhat fitting for the 103 00:05:33,560 --> 00:05:37,960 Speaker 1: theme of the week of Halloween. And I wish I 104 00:05:37,960 --> 00:05:41,560 Speaker 1: could say that after this trip I was able to 105 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:47,400 Speaker 1: leave this relationship immediately and find something more fitting for 106 00:05:47,480 --> 00:05:51,359 Speaker 1: my needs. I can't say that, but this trip, in 107 00:05:51,400 --> 00:05:56,320 Speaker 1: this experience, did leave me knowing that I wanted things 108 00:05:56,320 --> 00:06:00,760 Speaker 1: to change, and I first I had to force those 109 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:03,560 Speaker 1: changes in the relationship. And then, you know, long story short, 110 00:06:03,600 --> 00:06:05,159 Speaker 1: we didn't work out. I don't think that's a spoiler 111 00:06:05,200 --> 00:06:08,680 Speaker 1: because I married Patrick, but I wanted to share this nonetheless. 112 00:06:08,720 --> 00:06:10,960 Speaker 1: So in twenty nineteen, I took a trip to Charleston 113 00:06:11,480 --> 00:06:15,160 Speaker 1: with a past boyfriend. And some of you might know 114 00:06:15,200 --> 00:06:17,360 Speaker 1: this if you've been to Charleston or you just know 115 00:06:17,400 --> 00:06:21,320 Speaker 1: about Charleston. It's rich in haunted houses, it's haunted stories, 116 00:06:21,400 --> 00:06:24,039 Speaker 1: scary stories. It's a big part of the culture and 117 00:06:24,040 --> 00:06:27,680 Speaker 1: the tourism culture. And less of you may know that. 118 00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:31,640 Speaker 1: I am someone who is scared very easily. I can 119 00:06:31,680 --> 00:06:34,360 Speaker 1: barely watch someone get in a fight on TV, much 120 00:06:34,440 --> 00:06:40,200 Speaker 1: less watch a scary movie or listen to a haunted story. 121 00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:43,760 Speaker 1: A lot of TV that I watch with anybody, including 122 00:06:43,800 --> 00:06:46,839 Speaker 1: my now husband, ends up being with my eyes closed 123 00:06:46,839 --> 00:06:49,839 Speaker 1: if it's a scary show, or if there is any 124 00:06:49,920 --> 00:06:53,360 Speaker 1: kinds of fighting, or I don't even like watching the 125 00:06:53,440 --> 00:06:58,520 Speaker 1: suspenseful stuff. I close my eyes and I oftentimes will 126 00:06:58,520 --> 00:07:01,120 Speaker 1: also close my ears and then ask the person I'm 127 00:07:01,120 --> 00:07:02,440 Speaker 1: watching it with to let me know when it's over, 128 00:07:02,480 --> 00:07:03,880 Speaker 1: and then I asked them to tell me what happened. 129 00:07:04,320 --> 00:07:07,279 Speaker 1: I just do not like being forced to be scared. 130 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:09,039 Speaker 1: It's not a comfortable feeling for me. It's not a 131 00:07:09,080 --> 00:07:12,080 Speaker 1: fun feeling for me. And I say all of this 132 00:07:12,160 --> 00:07:16,360 Speaker 1: because of what we did on this trip so previously. 133 00:07:16,400 --> 00:07:18,000 Speaker 1: Before this trip, I think maybe I had been to 134 00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:20,280 Speaker 1: one haunted house in my life, like the kind that 135 00:07:20,320 --> 00:07:22,880 Speaker 1: you like pay and they like jump out and scare you, 136 00:07:22,960 --> 00:07:26,200 Speaker 1: not like an actual haunted house, but like a man 137 00:07:26,200 --> 00:07:29,880 Speaker 1: made haunted house. And after I did that, I vowed 138 00:07:29,880 --> 00:07:31,880 Speaker 1: to never do it again. It was like, why would 139 00:07:31,880 --> 00:07:34,640 Speaker 1: I pay to do this? This is to me not 140 00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:39,040 Speaker 1: worth it. I need to like have therapy and do 141 00:07:39,160 --> 00:07:42,080 Speaker 1: a complete like meditation debriefing session after something like that, 142 00:07:42,120 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 1: it just is not worth it for me. And I 143 00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:47,720 Speaker 1: think it was pretty where it should have been a 144 00:07:48,120 --> 00:07:50,080 Speaker 1: parent that I was not destined to be with this 145 00:07:50,120 --> 00:07:53,840 Speaker 1: person that I won this trip with, because we both 146 00:07:53,920 --> 00:07:56,200 Speaker 1: took turns picking things that we wanted to do on 147 00:07:56,240 --> 00:07:59,480 Speaker 1: that trip, and out of all the activities we could 148 00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:02,840 Speaker 1: do and exp mind you, I just went to Charleston 149 00:08:02,880 --> 00:08:06,400 Speaker 1: with Patrick, my now husband. We did not choose any 150 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:09,640 Speaker 1: type of haunted anything. There's plenty of other stuff to 151 00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:11,400 Speaker 1: do there. But out of all the things that we 152 00:08:11,440 --> 00:08:16,480 Speaker 1: could have done there, this person chose a nighttime haunted 153 00:08:16,840 --> 00:08:21,000 Speaker 1: jail tour. And I don't remember much of that tour. 154 00:08:21,600 --> 00:08:25,040 Speaker 1: I remember, of course, it rained that night, so it 155 00:08:25,080 --> 00:08:29,320 Speaker 1: made it even spookier, and I remember being so scared 156 00:08:29,520 --> 00:08:31,800 Speaker 1: and wanting to leave for the majority of the tour, 157 00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:35,840 Speaker 1: while I also at that same time remember feeling stuck 158 00:08:35,880 --> 00:08:39,600 Speaker 1: and like I could not leave. And I also starkly 159 00:08:39,640 --> 00:08:41,959 Speaker 1: remember that the person I was with at the time 160 00:08:42,480 --> 00:08:44,400 Speaker 1: got annoyed with me because I was being too clingy 161 00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:45,839 Speaker 1: when I was trying to hold his arm or hold 162 00:08:45,920 --> 00:08:48,720 Speaker 1: his hand throughout the tour. I was scared and wanted 163 00:08:48,760 --> 00:08:53,600 Speaker 1: some like calmness and some safety, and he saw that 164 00:08:53,840 --> 00:08:59,240 Speaker 1: as me being embarrassing and not cool. Again, another reason 165 00:08:59,280 --> 00:09:01,560 Speaker 1: I should have been like, h this person probably isn't 166 00:09:01,600 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 1: the person for me. They're bringing me to something that 167 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:07,360 Speaker 1: I really don't want to do, and also are not 168 00:09:07,400 --> 00:09:12,080 Speaker 1: consoling me when I am not feeling things or I 169 00:09:12,080 --> 00:09:14,679 Speaker 1: am feeling a lot of things. Actually, And while this 170 00:09:14,760 --> 00:09:16,960 Speaker 1: isn't a ghost story, it is somewhat of a scary 171 00:09:17,000 --> 00:09:18,960 Speaker 1: story for me when I look back on it. When 172 00:09:19,040 --> 00:09:21,520 Speaker 1: I think about this experience in that time, I just 173 00:09:22,120 --> 00:09:25,520 Speaker 1: somewhat cringe, and I also feel really sad for that 174 00:09:25,640 --> 00:09:28,040 Speaker 1: version of me. And I think a lot of us 175 00:09:28,120 --> 00:09:32,840 Speaker 1: have had an experience that somewhat mimics the theme of 176 00:09:33,360 --> 00:09:36,000 Speaker 1: what I was going through at that time. It's really 177 00:09:36,000 --> 00:09:38,600 Speaker 1: frightening to remember versions of yourself that feel stuck in 178 00:09:38,679 --> 00:09:43,360 Speaker 1: places that you don't belong, especially when you weren't actually 179 00:09:43,360 --> 00:09:48,520 Speaker 1: stuck there. Rather, you were choosing to be there. You 180 00:09:48,559 --> 00:09:52,319 Speaker 1: were choosing to stay rooted in something that felt almost 181 00:09:52,360 --> 00:09:55,800 Speaker 1: borderline miserable. And it's also a common experience to look 182 00:09:55,840 --> 00:09:58,840 Speaker 1: at the situations that someone else is in and rationalize 183 00:09:58,880 --> 00:10:01,720 Speaker 1: that you would make more reasonable choice in there and making. 184 00:10:02,200 --> 00:10:04,959 Speaker 1: The easiest example is when it comes to dating. You 185 00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:07,640 Speaker 1: wouldn't let somebody treat you like that. You'd walk out, 186 00:10:07,800 --> 00:10:10,839 Speaker 1: you'd walk away, you'd stand up for yourself. It could 187 00:10:10,840 --> 00:10:13,040 Speaker 1: also span across all kinds of situations. You would leave 188 00:10:13,080 --> 00:10:15,200 Speaker 1: the job, you would stand up for the right cause, 189 00:10:15,280 --> 00:10:18,000 Speaker 1: you wouldn't let your kids roll around in dirt, or 190 00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:21,600 Speaker 1: you wouldn't be so overprotective, you wouldn't fight about money 191 00:10:21,679 --> 00:10:24,840 Speaker 1: leftover from your parents, will you would not get mad 192 00:10:24,880 --> 00:10:28,000 Speaker 1: about silly things that don't matter. Like, it's really easy 193 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:30,880 Speaker 1: for us to sit back and act like we would 194 00:10:30,920 --> 00:10:34,760 Speaker 1: do something that is the obvious, logical, reasonable choice that 195 00:10:34,800 --> 00:10:36,960 Speaker 1: you would want to make us your best self. But 196 00:10:37,040 --> 00:10:39,280 Speaker 1: I don't think that we can say any of those 197 00:10:39,320 --> 00:10:42,240 Speaker 1: things for certain. We really can't say that. We can't 198 00:10:42,240 --> 00:10:46,000 Speaker 1: say what we would do. In my opinion, we can 199 00:10:46,040 --> 00:10:48,080 Speaker 1: say what we would want to do, and I think 200 00:10:48,120 --> 00:10:52,480 Speaker 1: that is really important for offering self compassion for ourselves. 201 00:10:52,520 --> 00:10:54,640 Speaker 1: And also it's really important to help us not be 202 00:10:54,840 --> 00:10:58,839 Speaker 1: as judgmental or hateful or cruel to people who are 203 00:10:58,840 --> 00:11:02,240 Speaker 1: moving through things that seem obvious to the outside world 204 00:11:02,240 --> 00:11:05,960 Speaker 1: but probably feel different to somebody on the inside experiencing it. 205 00:11:07,040 --> 00:11:10,400 Speaker 1: Until we are actually in that situation, that specific situation, 206 00:11:11,200 --> 00:11:13,480 Speaker 1: we can't know for certain what we would do. We 207 00:11:13,559 --> 00:11:16,640 Speaker 1: can't just assume that our highest selves would always be 208 00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:20,520 Speaker 1: the version that would show up, because our highest selves 209 00:11:20,880 --> 00:11:24,320 Speaker 1: are not always the version that shows up, and that 210 00:11:24,480 --> 00:11:28,880 Speaker 1: is not a character defect, that is not something's wrong 211 00:11:28,920 --> 00:11:33,439 Speaker 1: with you. It is just how humanity works. It's easier 212 00:11:33,480 --> 00:11:36,200 Speaker 1: when we are not feeling the intense emotions of something 213 00:11:36,240 --> 00:11:39,240 Speaker 1: to make a more logical decision, to make a decision 214 00:11:39,679 --> 00:11:42,160 Speaker 1: that would lead us closer to what we truly want, 215 00:11:42,800 --> 00:11:46,480 Speaker 1: when there's no fears, sadness and shame, guilt, any of 216 00:11:46,520 --> 00:11:51,560 Speaker 1: that involved in our decision making. And I think that's 217 00:11:51,600 --> 00:11:54,800 Speaker 1: really scary, knowing that our highest self isn't always the 218 00:11:54,880 --> 00:11:58,120 Speaker 1: version that's going to show up, and sometimes we do 219 00:11:58,200 --> 00:12:01,360 Speaker 1: things that we look back on. I wish that I 220 00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:03,079 Speaker 1: would have made a different choice. Now we can have 221 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:06,600 Speaker 1: acceptance and say, well, it is what led us to hear. 222 00:12:06,760 --> 00:12:09,760 Speaker 1: But if our highest self actually showed up in that situation, 223 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:11,199 Speaker 1: I think a lot of us at times would be 224 00:12:11,200 --> 00:12:13,360 Speaker 1: like I would have phrased that differently. I would have 225 00:12:13,360 --> 00:12:15,360 Speaker 1: said that differently, I would have been kindered to that person. 226 00:12:16,360 --> 00:12:19,160 Speaker 1: And I really do think the wise choice is often 227 00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:23,520 Speaker 1: the hardest choice to make. We aren't all martyrs out 228 00:12:23,520 --> 00:12:27,000 Speaker 1: here walking the path of most resistance all the time. 229 00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:29,640 Speaker 1: We tend to move with ease if possible and when 230 00:12:29,679 --> 00:12:33,120 Speaker 1: it's possible, and that makes sense. I wouldn't understand somebody 231 00:12:33,120 --> 00:12:36,040 Speaker 1: who wants to take the easier road. I mean, we 232 00:12:36,080 --> 00:12:39,560 Speaker 1: want to avoid pain as much as we can. That's 233 00:12:40,200 --> 00:12:43,480 Speaker 1: a pretty normal thought to have. I want to avoid 234 00:12:43,600 --> 00:12:46,839 Speaker 1: pain as much as possible, So whether that ease is 235 00:12:46,880 --> 00:12:49,240 Speaker 1: avoiding pain for as long as we can avoid pain, 236 00:12:49,520 --> 00:12:53,840 Speaker 1: or avoid confrontation, as long as we can avoid confrontation. 237 00:12:54,040 --> 00:12:57,280 Speaker 1: A lot of times we are taking that path for 238 00:12:57,400 --> 00:13:01,080 Speaker 1: a period of time, and we tell ourselves a version 239 00:13:01,120 --> 00:13:03,240 Speaker 1: of a story that allows us to stay where we are, 240 00:13:04,000 --> 00:13:06,640 Speaker 1: somewhat making us victims when we're actually the ones choosing 241 00:13:06,679 --> 00:13:10,480 Speaker 1: to stay in that chaos. And I'm not talking about 242 00:13:10,520 --> 00:13:12,880 Speaker 1: when we don't have the resources or ability to leave 243 00:13:12,920 --> 00:13:15,360 Speaker 1: places because we are afraid of our well being, We're 244 00:13:15,400 --> 00:13:18,520 Speaker 1: afraid of our lives, our families' lives. I'm not talking 245 00:13:18,559 --> 00:13:22,440 Speaker 1: about experiences when nobody is reaching out a hand to 246 00:13:22,480 --> 00:13:24,560 Speaker 1: help and there isn't a part of you that knows better. 247 00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:27,320 Speaker 1: I want to make that very clear, because I never 248 00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:30,520 Speaker 1: want to create a culture of victim blaming on this 249 00:13:30,640 --> 00:13:34,040 Speaker 1: show and in my environment at all. What I am 250 00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:37,760 Speaker 1: talking about is taking accountability for the insight that we 251 00:13:37,920 --> 00:13:42,800 Speaker 1: choose to have or not have. And this idea brings 252 00:13:42,800 --> 00:13:47,000 Speaker 1: me to a story that Laurie Gottlieb writes about in 253 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:49,160 Speaker 1: her book, maybe you should talk to someone. It's a 254 00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:51,840 Speaker 1: fantastic book. If you guys have not read it, it's 255 00:13:51,840 --> 00:13:54,240 Speaker 1: so good. I read it during the pandemic and I 256 00:13:54,280 --> 00:13:57,520 Speaker 1: tried to prolong that book as much as I could. 257 00:13:57,559 --> 00:13:59,560 Speaker 1: I would like not let myself read it because they 258 00:13:59,559 --> 00:14:01,560 Speaker 1: didn't want it to end. And I actually got to 259 00:14:01,600 --> 00:14:03,440 Speaker 1: interview her a couple of years ago on the show. 260 00:14:03,480 --> 00:14:06,000 Speaker 1: So if you Search you need therapy Lori Gottlieb, you 261 00:14:06,040 --> 00:14:09,240 Speaker 1: can hear that interview as well. But specifically, this idea 262 00:14:09,400 --> 00:14:12,640 Speaker 1: of choosing to acknowledge inside or not reminds me of 263 00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:14,720 Speaker 1: a story that she talks about in the book, and 264 00:14:14,760 --> 00:14:25,200 Speaker 1: I wanted to share a little bit of that. If 265 00:14:25,200 --> 00:14:27,840 Speaker 1: you Search you Need therapy, Lrii Gottlieb, you can hear 266 00:14:27,880 --> 00:14:31,960 Speaker 1: that interview as well. But specifically, this idea of choosing 267 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:34,640 Speaker 1: to acknowledge inside or not reminds me of a story 268 00:14:34,680 --> 00:14:36,720 Speaker 1: that she talks about in the book, and I wanted 269 00:14:36,760 --> 00:14:40,440 Speaker 1: to share a little bit of that because she also 270 00:14:40,880 --> 00:14:44,520 Speaker 1: wrote a Psychology Today article about that same story, and 271 00:14:44,520 --> 00:14:47,240 Speaker 1: I think took just excerpts from the book and compiled 272 00:14:47,320 --> 00:14:49,960 Speaker 1: an article so in this part of the book and 273 00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:54,760 Speaker 1: in this article, Laurie tells a story about her therapist Wendell, who, 274 00:14:55,480 --> 00:14:58,760 Speaker 1: during one of their sessions, tells her about a cartoon 275 00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:01,520 Speaker 1: that he's reminded of from her story and her particament 276 00:15:01,600 --> 00:15:04,480 Speaker 1: that she is in at that moment. And the cartoon 277 00:15:04,560 --> 00:15:07,560 Speaker 1: is of a prisoner who is shaking the prison bars 278 00:15:07,800 --> 00:15:10,800 Speaker 1: and he's trying to get out, but to his left 279 00:15:10,840 --> 00:15:14,320 Speaker 1: and right there are no bars, and he explains that 280 00:15:14,360 --> 00:15:16,600 Speaker 1: all the prisoner has to do is to walk around 281 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:19,560 Speaker 1: to the other side and just walk out, he'd be free. 282 00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:23,440 Speaker 1: But he still just is shaking those bars frantically trying 283 00:15:23,480 --> 00:15:26,280 Speaker 1: to get out. And he talks about how that is 284 00:15:26,320 --> 00:15:29,640 Speaker 1: most of us, how we oftentimes feel very stuck. We 285 00:15:29,680 --> 00:15:34,360 Speaker 1: feel very trapped in these cells we've created. But there 286 00:15:34,440 --> 00:15:37,440 Speaker 1: is a way out, as long as we are willing 287 00:15:38,280 --> 00:15:40,840 Speaker 1: to see it. And I'm going to read directly from 288 00:15:40,880 --> 00:15:44,040 Speaker 1: the article and from the book. As she's explaining this, 289 00:15:44,160 --> 00:15:47,840 Speaker 1: Lori writes, then most of us come to therapy feeling trapped, 290 00:15:48,600 --> 00:15:53,720 Speaker 1: imprisoned by our thoughts, behaviors, marriages, jobs, fears, or past. 291 00:15:54,600 --> 00:15:58,320 Speaker 1: Sometimes we imprison ourselves with a narrative of self punishment. 292 00:15:59,440 --> 00:16:02,800 Speaker 1: If we have a choice between believing one of two things, 293 00:16:03,080 --> 00:16:07,480 Speaker 1: both of which we have evidence for. I'm lovable, I'm unlovable, 294 00:16:08,440 --> 00:16:10,840 Speaker 1: often we choose the one that makes us feel bad. 295 00:16:12,000 --> 00:16:14,200 Speaker 1: Why do we keep our radios tuned to the same 296 00:16:14,280 --> 00:16:18,360 Speaker 1: static written stations? The everyone's life is better than mine station, 297 00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:22,040 Speaker 1: The I can't trust people station nothing works out for 298 00:16:22,120 --> 00:16:25,760 Speaker 1: me station. Instead of moving the dial up or down, 299 00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:30,600 Speaker 1: change the station, walk around the bars. Who is stopping 300 00:16:30,680 --> 00:16:35,240 Speaker 1: us but ourselves? And now I'm going to read what 301 00:16:35,280 --> 00:16:38,400 Speaker 1: I believe is one of the most helpful and one 302 00:16:38,400 --> 00:16:42,359 Speaker 1: of the most frustrating parts of I think the experience 303 00:16:42,560 --> 00:16:47,400 Speaker 1: of therapy, and also her book, She writes insight is 304 00:16:47,440 --> 00:16:50,760 Speaker 1: the booby prize of therapy is my favorite maxim of 305 00:16:50,840 --> 00:16:54,880 Speaker 1: the trade, meaning you can have all the insight in 306 00:16:54,920 --> 00:16:58,200 Speaker 1: the world, but if you don't change when you're out 307 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:02,240 Speaker 1: in the world, the insight and the therapy is worthless. 308 00:17:03,160 --> 00:17:06,720 Speaker 1: Insight allows you to ask yourself, is this something that's 309 00:17:06,760 --> 00:17:09,240 Speaker 1: been done to me? Or am I doing it to myself? 310 00:17:10,320 --> 00:17:12,639 Speaker 1: The answer gives you choices, but it's up to you 311 00:17:12,680 --> 00:17:16,480 Speaker 1: to make them. Typically, therapists are several steps ahead of 312 00:17:16,480 --> 00:17:19,919 Speaker 1: our patients, not because we're smarter or we're wiser, but 313 00:17:19,960 --> 00:17:23,200 Speaker 1: because we have the vantage point of being outside their lives. 314 00:17:24,080 --> 00:17:25,960 Speaker 1: I'll say to a patient who has brought their ring 315 00:17:26,040 --> 00:17:27,959 Speaker 1: but can't seem to find the right time to propose 316 00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:30,560 Speaker 1: to his girlfriend, I don't think you're sure you want 317 00:17:30,600 --> 00:17:34,360 Speaker 1: to marry her, And he'll say, what, of course I am, 318 00:17:34,880 --> 00:17:37,520 Speaker 1: I'm doing it this weekend. And then he goes home 319 00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:39,879 Speaker 1: and he doesn't propose because the weather was bad and 320 00:17:39,920 --> 00:17:42,080 Speaker 1: he wanted to do it on the beach. We'll have 321 00:17:42,119 --> 00:17:45,160 Speaker 1: the same dialogue for weeks, until one day he'll come 322 00:17:45,200 --> 00:17:47,680 Speaker 1: back and say, maybe I don't want to marry her. 323 00:17:48,840 --> 00:17:52,800 Speaker 1: Many people who say no, that's not me find themselves 324 00:17:52,840 --> 00:17:56,680 Speaker 1: a week or a month or a year later saying, yeah, 325 00:17:56,920 --> 00:18:01,560 Speaker 1: that's actually me, feeling that Wendell has been storing up 326 00:18:01,560 --> 00:18:04,119 Speaker 1: this question, waiting for just the right moment to float 327 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:07,720 Speaker 1: it out there. Therapists are always weighing the balance between 328 00:18:07,880 --> 00:18:11,560 Speaker 1: forming a trusting alliance and getting to the real work. 329 00:18:11,680 --> 00:18:15,120 Speaker 1: So the patient doesn't have to continue to suffer from 330 00:18:15,119 --> 00:18:18,520 Speaker 1: the outset. We move both slowly and quickly, slowing the 331 00:18:18,560 --> 00:18:23,480 Speaker 1: content down, speeding up the relationship, planting seeds strategically along 332 00:18:23,480 --> 00:18:26,720 Speaker 1: the way as in nature. If you plant the seeds 333 00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:29,960 Speaker 1: too early, they won't sprout. If you plant too late, 334 00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:33,280 Speaker 1: they might make progress, but you've missed the most fertile ground. 335 00:18:33,760 --> 00:18:35,800 Speaker 1: If you plan it just the right time, though, they'll 336 00:18:35,840 --> 00:18:38,480 Speaker 1: soak up the nutrients and grow. Our work is an 337 00:18:38,480 --> 00:18:43,720 Speaker 1: intricate dance between support and confrontation. In the last sentence, 338 00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 1: this is me talking the last sentence of that ough, 339 00:18:47,560 --> 00:18:50,959 Speaker 1: the intricate dance between support and confrontation. I love that. 340 00:18:51,880 --> 00:18:54,639 Speaker 1: I think that we can apply that relationship with ourselves 341 00:18:54,640 --> 00:18:57,240 Speaker 1: as well, and not just with the relationship of a therapist. 342 00:18:57,720 --> 00:19:01,159 Speaker 1: That we can both be supportive and confortation with ourselves 343 00:19:01,880 --> 00:19:05,000 Speaker 1: as we navigate the parts of our lives that we 344 00:19:05,040 --> 00:19:07,439 Speaker 1: are in charge of, the choices, that we're in charge of, 345 00:19:07,560 --> 00:19:11,320 Speaker 1: our own jail cells. We can acknowledge that maybe we 346 00:19:11,400 --> 00:19:14,520 Speaker 1: are our own jailer, and also taking that insight to 347 00:19:14,560 --> 00:19:17,399 Speaker 1: heart will be challenging. We won't snap our fingers as 348 00:19:17,440 --> 00:19:19,840 Speaker 1: soon as the insight hits. You may have insight, and 349 00:19:19,880 --> 00:19:22,919 Speaker 1: then you might take some time to make some decisions. 350 00:19:24,400 --> 00:19:27,240 Speaker 1: Sometimes we ignore reality. We choose not to see because 351 00:19:27,280 --> 00:19:29,160 Speaker 1: we don't want to then have to make a decision 352 00:19:29,280 --> 00:19:31,199 Speaker 1: or a big change. We aren't ready to do our 353 00:19:31,240 --> 00:19:34,080 Speaker 1: own part. Yet we are still getting something out of 354 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:37,880 Speaker 1: being in that jail cell, and that's okay. That can 355 00:19:37,920 --> 00:19:39,919 Speaker 1: be part of our process. That can be part of 356 00:19:39,960 --> 00:19:43,840 Speaker 1: the process. I can acknowledge I'm not happy and work 357 00:19:43,880 --> 00:19:47,040 Speaker 1: towards moving out of something that's hurting me. I don't 358 00:19:47,080 --> 00:19:50,240 Speaker 1: have to do everything all at once. I could be 359 00:19:50,320 --> 00:19:53,560 Speaker 1: able to acknowledge that I can leave the haunted house 360 00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:56,920 Speaker 1: before saying, Okay, this really isn't fun anymore, I'm gonna leave. 361 00:19:57,720 --> 00:20:00,320 Speaker 1: I can talk about why I'm staying in the relationship 362 00:20:00,400 --> 00:20:02,600 Speaker 1: even though it's not going well before I have to 363 00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:05,800 Speaker 1: break up with somebody. And I think the fear of 364 00:20:05,960 --> 00:20:11,440 Speaker 1: having to make that move immediately keeps us from allowing 365 00:20:11,480 --> 00:20:15,439 Speaker 1: ourselves to acknowledge that there are no bars on the 366 00:20:15,520 --> 00:20:18,320 Speaker 1: other sides of our jail cells. Acting as if we 367 00:20:18,359 --> 00:20:20,879 Speaker 1: don't have choices in our lives and we're stuck doesn't 368 00:20:20,920 --> 00:20:24,680 Speaker 1: actually make things easier. It more so kind of twists 369 00:20:24,760 --> 00:20:29,680 Speaker 1: pain that we're feeling into suffering. So today this episode 370 00:20:30,080 --> 00:20:34,760 Speaker 1: is dedicated towards us looking to our left and looking 371 00:20:34,800 --> 00:20:38,560 Speaker 1: to our right and allowing ourselves to notice if the 372 00:20:38,600 --> 00:20:43,600 Speaker 1: doors are open? Is there another way? Am I the 373 00:20:43,600 --> 00:20:47,399 Speaker 1: one that's in charge of the experience I'm having right now? 374 00:20:48,440 --> 00:20:50,920 Speaker 1: And if so, let's marinate it on it a little bit. 375 00:20:51,080 --> 00:20:54,439 Speaker 1: Let's talk about why I'm sitting where I'm sitting, and 376 00:20:54,480 --> 00:20:57,480 Speaker 1: then find support to get me to where I want 377 00:20:57,480 --> 00:20:59,600 Speaker 1: to be. You don't have to do the action part 378 00:21:00,119 --> 00:21:01,439 Speaker 1: all at once, and you don't have to do it 379 00:21:01,440 --> 00:21:05,760 Speaker 1: completely alone. Small changes are possible, and you're allowed to 380 00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:09,400 Speaker 1: have help. That still counts. I think we can also 381 00:21:09,440 --> 00:21:12,480 Speaker 1: apply this to our feelings. Oftentimes we don't want to 382 00:21:12,480 --> 00:21:14,640 Speaker 1: acknowledge our feelings. We don't want to have insight into 383 00:21:14,680 --> 00:21:17,280 Speaker 1: our feelings because if we acknowledge what we're really feeling, 384 00:21:17,280 --> 00:21:18,679 Speaker 1: then that means that we then have to get rid 385 00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:21,399 Speaker 1: of that feeling. And the majority of the time, the 386 00:21:21,480 --> 00:21:26,119 Speaker 1: purpose of acknowledging our feelings is to allow them to 387 00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:29,600 Speaker 1: be used as tools. Sitting in our feelings does not 388 00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:34,000 Speaker 1: force us to do something. It actually is a tool. 389 00:21:34,080 --> 00:21:36,520 Speaker 1: It's a hint. They are guides that help lead us 390 00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:39,520 Speaker 1: to where we want to go. And so maybe we 391 00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:42,360 Speaker 1: need to acknowledge if the doors are on the jail cell, 392 00:21:42,440 --> 00:21:44,679 Speaker 1: maybe we need to acknowledge what we're feeling in this moment, 393 00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:48,119 Speaker 1: and that insight can then lead us to something that 394 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:50,840 Speaker 1: more aligns with what we want in our lives and 395 00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:54,720 Speaker 1: for our lives and for ourselves. Again, I highly recommend 396 00:21:54,880 --> 00:21:57,320 Speaker 1: Laurie's book. Maybe you should talk to someone. I want 397 00:21:57,320 --> 00:21:59,680 Speaker 1: to read it again. It was such a beautiful story, 398 00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:02,040 Speaker 1: like it was just a good book. And also I 399 00:22:02,119 --> 00:22:04,440 Speaker 1: learned so much without even knowing that I was learning 400 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:08,400 Speaker 1: along the way. If you guys have any questions, feedback, comments, anything, 401 00:22:08,440 --> 00:22:10,440 Speaker 1: you can send them to Katherine at you Need Therapy 402 00:22:10,600 --> 00:22:13,959 Speaker 1: podcast dot com. You can follow me Kat van Buren 403 00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:18,960 Speaker 1: and at you Need Therapy Podcast on Instagram. And until 404 00:22:19,000 --> 00:22:21,400 Speaker 1: next time, I hope you guys are having the day 405 00:22:21,560 --> 00:22:22,320 Speaker 1: that you need to have.