1 00:00:07,000 --> 00:00:10,120 Speaker 1: And will commend to see all ball podcasts. I'm Doug Gottlieb, 2 00:00:10,280 --> 00:00:13,680 Speaker 1: and uh, this is part two of our talk with 3 00:00:13,760 --> 00:00:16,119 Speaker 1: Nico met that when we last spoke with Niko, we 4 00:00:16,200 --> 00:00:18,800 Speaker 1: got kind of background how he got into coaching, how 5 00:00:18,800 --> 00:00:21,439 Speaker 1: we started to climb the ladder, and I wanted to 6 00:00:21,480 --> 00:00:25,439 Speaker 1: talk to Colorado State because what's interesting about Nico is, 7 00:00:25,840 --> 00:00:27,760 Speaker 1: as you've heard of you listen to part one, you 8 00:00:27,800 --> 00:00:30,160 Speaker 1: know he's now the head coach at the second place 9 00:00:30,160 --> 00:00:33,280 Speaker 1: in which he's once upon a time been assistant. And uh, 10 00:00:33,760 --> 00:00:37,680 Speaker 1: I that's just interesting, right. Obviously that means when he 11 00:00:37,760 --> 00:00:40,720 Speaker 1: left somewhere, he left a good impression on people. But 12 00:00:40,800 --> 00:00:45,159 Speaker 1: still it's it's very unique. Um, do you want to 13 00:00:45,159 --> 00:00:49,199 Speaker 1: talk a little bit about what we've seen specifically in 14 00:00:49,280 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 1: college basketball so far? You know, the super senior thing 15 00:00:53,159 --> 00:00:58,040 Speaker 1: is really interesting, right, doesn't work for everybody, and uh, 16 00:00:58,080 --> 00:01:01,760 Speaker 1: and won't work for everybody because it's not poor of everybody. 17 00:01:01,840 --> 00:01:05,200 Speaker 1: But if you look at that's, um, say the w 18 00:01:05,440 --> 00:01:09,160 Speaker 1: c C, it's impossible to not point out that super 19 00:01:09,200 --> 00:01:14,040 Speaker 1: seniors are a big reason why. And you know they old, 20 00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:17,480 Speaker 1: get old and stay old. It's just get old. But 21 00:01:18,400 --> 00:01:20,880 Speaker 1: you're seeing some moneven results. Obviously, the Big East has 22 00:01:20,880 --> 00:01:24,520 Speaker 1: been fantastic. You know, if I was, if I'm really 23 00:01:24,560 --> 00:01:29,640 Speaker 1: being analyticals, I would tell you that not only uh 24 00:01:29,760 --> 00:01:31,160 Speaker 1: is the Big East doing well, but you know, some 25 00:01:31,280 --> 00:01:32,720 Speaker 1: of it is things that go bump in the night, 26 00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:35,160 Speaker 1: right like Marquette they were dead to write beat and 27 00:01:35,200 --> 00:01:37,720 Speaker 1: they came back and beat Illinois, and Illinois doesn't have 28 00:01:37,760 --> 00:01:40,640 Speaker 1: their best play, right, so like, let's be fair a 29 00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:44,640 Speaker 1: little bit. Uh, there's some other matchups where Rutgers to Paul, 30 00:01:44,720 --> 00:01:47,440 Speaker 1: great game, that game is played at Rutgers Ruschers. But 31 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:50,400 Speaker 1: you can't take away from the overall success of the 32 00:01:50,480 --> 00:01:52,960 Speaker 1: league for the thought that the league and like Michigan, say, 33 00:01:53,000 --> 00:01:55,320 Speaker 1: comes in and just kicks the crap out of Butler. 34 00:01:55,640 --> 00:01:59,120 Speaker 1: Butler couldn't sport. Let's seeing all big Michigan at Michigan 35 00:01:59,520 --> 00:02:02,120 Speaker 1: and Michigan being picked in the league. That was a 36 00:02:02,160 --> 00:02:05,720 Speaker 1: fair clean, good woman, a great win. But I do 37 00:02:05,840 --> 00:02:08,080 Speaker 1: think it's interesting that the w c C and the 38 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:10,960 Speaker 1: Big East, who at their respective levels, right, like the 39 00:02:11,080 --> 00:02:13,880 Speaker 1: w c C at the midmuth major level has been 40 00:02:13,919 --> 00:02:16,360 Speaker 1: Gonzaga and then those of the bottom of the league 41 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:19,480 Speaker 1: has come up. Still a dramatic jump step back down. 42 00:02:19,800 --> 00:02:24,760 Speaker 1: Usually the Mountain West is better as like a quasi 43 00:02:24,840 --> 00:02:28,320 Speaker 1: Hi Major than the w CC Mountain West. I saw 44 00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:31,000 Speaker 1: the Vata struggle last night. Now they're gonna get better 45 00:02:31,040 --> 00:02:33,799 Speaker 1: as they get hold. They've also lost some of their 46 00:02:33,840 --> 00:02:37,560 Speaker 1: core kind of solid pieces, which I think hurt their depth, 47 00:02:38,200 --> 00:02:41,200 Speaker 1: you know, to transfer. But I you know, like a 48 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:44,080 Speaker 1: blind mag in the w c C with the addition 49 00:02:44,120 --> 00:02:46,760 Speaker 1: of transfers and the consistency of some of the guys 50 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:50,519 Speaker 1: they have returning, it's not just Gonzaga v y U 51 00:02:50,680 --> 00:02:54,079 Speaker 1: kick the crap out of Oregon. And then you know, 52 00:02:54,120 --> 00:02:56,520 Speaker 1: I saw San Francisco, that's the good club. San Diego 53 00:02:56,560 --> 00:02:59,400 Speaker 1: has got some surprise when Santa Clara has beaten Avada 54 00:02:59,480 --> 00:03:01,440 Speaker 1: and stands and I mean like the WCC is doing 55 00:03:01,440 --> 00:03:05,560 Speaker 1: a good year so far, so we'll keep tracking it. Um, 56 00:03:05,680 --> 00:03:08,840 Speaker 1: they don't really know what to make of the Big twelve. 57 00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:11,320 Speaker 1: I think the Big ten that's usually ahead of the 58 00:03:11,360 --> 00:03:16,320 Speaker 1: curve because they have traditionally older players. Um, we haven't 59 00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:19,200 Speaker 1: seen you know, Iowa against big time competition yet. We 60 00:03:19,280 --> 00:03:24,560 Speaker 1: have seen Michigan beat Butler lose to Kansas, Missigan, Michigan State. 61 00:03:24,600 --> 00:03:27,840 Speaker 1: We've seen Michigan and how they've played. So there's still 62 00:03:27,880 --> 00:03:30,480 Speaker 1: some work in progress teams that we're trying to figure out. 63 00:03:30,760 --> 00:03:35,080 Speaker 1: But the net net takeaway from the first couple of 64 00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 1: weeks is, boy, the Big East has been impressive. Boy, 65 00:03:37,520 --> 00:03:40,360 Speaker 1: the WCC has been impressive. The Back twelve has been 66 00:03:40,360 --> 00:03:42,160 Speaker 1: the opposite of that. Outside of u c. L A 67 00:03:42,200 --> 00:03:45,680 Speaker 1: will see them against Gonzaga, the Big Twelve has been 68 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:48,200 Speaker 1: kind of up and down. At Oklahoma State, losing to 69 00:03:49,120 --> 00:03:53,160 Speaker 1: Oakland but then beating NC State, Kansas State out of 70 00:03:53,160 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 1: the prey. We've seen Texas lose the Gonzaga. They're still 71 00:03:55,800 --> 00:03:59,760 Speaker 1: a new team. I don't want to make every story 72 00:03:59,800 --> 00:04:03,000 Speaker 1: of about every conference. I hate that crap because it 73 00:04:03,120 --> 00:04:06,320 Speaker 1: doesn't it's not really real. Right. We can said the 74 00:04:06,320 --> 00:04:09,040 Speaker 1: Mounta must has been disappointing, but the Colorado State we're 75 00:04:09,040 --> 00:04:11,640 Speaker 1: talking about Nicole bead, that has been great. You know, 76 00:04:12,240 --> 00:04:15,360 Speaker 1: Sandy State had one disappointing loss, but then they go 77 00:04:15,480 --> 00:04:18,279 Speaker 1: be the Arizona's who's had a couple of disappointed loss. 78 00:04:18,440 --> 00:04:24,760 Speaker 1: So anyway, um, the point very much is I'm impressed 79 00:04:24,760 --> 00:04:27,120 Speaker 1: by the Bay East, impressed by the w CC, but 80 00:04:27,200 --> 00:04:29,359 Speaker 1: it's not the end all be all. After just a 81 00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:33,720 Speaker 1: couple of weeks of the nonconference that decides who's the 82 00:04:33,760 --> 00:04:36,560 Speaker 1: best and who's not the best. All right, let's get 83 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:41,520 Speaker 1: to Nicole bead Bet. Here's part two. Yeah, okay, take 84 00:04:41,560 --> 00:04:44,440 Speaker 1: me back to Colorado State. How did you guys turn it? Like? 85 00:04:44,680 --> 00:04:48,520 Speaker 1: It's how did it turn from like O n sixteen 86 00:04:48,640 --> 00:04:50,520 Speaker 1: to two straight n c A tournaments? I think, you 87 00:04:50,560 --> 00:04:53,400 Speaker 1: know it was I remember this and maybe it's just 88 00:04:53,520 --> 00:04:57,360 Speaker 1: my We had had such a terrible APR situation, or 89 00:04:57,560 --> 00:05:00,400 Speaker 1: our athletic director Paul kawal Check at the time, because 90 00:05:00,400 --> 00:05:02,720 Speaker 1: we were about ready to to, you know, incurse some 91 00:05:02,839 --> 00:05:05,080 Speaker 1: major n c double A penalties for a p R, 92 00:05:06,000 --> 00:05:08,360 Speaker 1: and he said, hey, we we just we can't recruit 93 00:05:08,400 --> 00:05:11,480 Speaker 1: any more junior college guys, at least for for the 94 00:05:11,560 --> 00:05:13,520 Speaker 1: for the next year or two because at that point 95 00:05:13,520 --> 00:05:16,240 Speaker 1: in time, UM a lot of those guys were going 96 00:05:16,320 --> 00:05:20,360 Speaker 1: over to UM having some academic issues. And there's nothing 97 00:05:20,360 --> 00:05:22,800 Speaker 1: against junior college players, is just that's what he said. 98 00:05:22,839 --> 00:05:26,080 Speaker 1: We needed to do well and ended up being UM 99 00:05:26,120 --> 00:05:28,000 Speaker 1: the best thing that happened to us in this sense 100 00:05:28,040 --> 00:05:29,920 Speaker 1: that we had to go out and we had to 101 00:05:30,000 --> 00:05:33,719 Speaker 1: find a crew of high school guys that we could 102 00:05:33,880 --> 00:05:35,800 Speaker 1: build with and and so it kind of forced our 103 00:05:35,839 --> 00:05:39,120 Speaker 1: hand and we went out in that class of Dorrian 104 00:05:39,279 --> 00:05:45,279 Speaker 1: Green um Um, Pierce Horning, Greg Smith. I mean, all 105 00:05:45,279 --> 00:05:48,160 Speaker 1: these guys that we got ended up being the foundation 106 00:05:48,240 --> 00:05:50,320 Speaker 1: and the core what we did. And then at that 107 00:05:50,360 --> 00:05:53,719 Speaker 1: point in time, not everybody was taking transfers. We took 108 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:58,000 Speaker 1: west Aikemeyer UM from Iowa State UM, you know, Colton 109 00:05:58,080 --> 00:06:01,880 Speaker 1: Iversa and Daniel bay Arrow from from from Arizona, UM 110 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:04,320 Speaker 1: and all these guys. That that's what turned it in 111 00:06:04,360 --> 00:06:07,360 Speaker 1: that class. Our third year, we were playing these young 112 00:06:07,440 --> 00:06:10,600 Speaker 1: guys and you could finally start to see a spark. Now, 113 00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:15,880 Speaker 1: didn't you red shirt those guys the freshman the Horning? No, 114 00:06:16,440 --> 00:06:19,200 Speaker 1: they ended up they ended up coming in and starting 115 00:06:19,200 --> 00:06:21,359 Speaker 1: as for as freshman. They ended up bringing right away 116 00:06:21,400 --> 00:06:24,920 Speaker 1: for us UM. But you could just feel it, Doug 117 00:06:25,000 --> 00:06:28,400 Speaker 1: like they had a certain spirit and a toughness about 118 00:06:28,480 --> 00:06:32,120 Speaker 1: them um Um that we had not had and and 119 00:06:32,200 --> 00:06:34,160 Speaker 1: you could feel it in that year. We ended up 120 00:06:34,200 --> 00:06:36,160 Speaker 1: think we ended up with a winning record that year 121 00:06:36,640 --> 00:06:40,800 Speaker 1: and you could start to feel it turn um and 122 00:06:40,800 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 1: and so that and then you know guys like Andyoga Day, 123 00:06:43,200 --> 00:06:46,440 Speaker 1: Travis Franklin, guys that we had taken, you know, as transfers. 124 00:06:46,440 --> 00:06:49,320 Speaker 1: Early on, they started to come into their own UM, 125 00:06:49,440 --> 00:06:51,560 Speaker 1: and we started to develop a little bit of an identity. 126 00:06:51,680 --> 00:06:53,719 Speaker 1: You know who we wanted to beat. Jesse Carr was 127 00:06:53,760 --> 00:06:56,080 Speaker 1: another kid. UM, one of the first guys that we 128 00:06:56,160 --> 00:06:59,640 Speaker 1: recruited there. Um they could all shoot, UM, they could pass. 129 00:06:59,760 --> 00:07:02,839 Speaker 1: They were great guys. UM. And again we started to 130 00:07:02,839 --> 00:07:04,880 Speaker 1: develop a little bit of an identity. And then I 131 00:07:04,960 --> 00:07:06,919 Speaker 1: was like, Wow, we're gonna have these guys here for 132 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:10,160 Speaker 1: a few years. And that's really what turned it. I 133 00:07:10,200 --> 00:07:14,840 Speaker 1: thought in year three, those guys that crew, especially the freshman, like, 134 00:07:15,560 --> 00:07:20,600 Speaker 1: does that still exist in that they played right away? 135 00:07:20,640 --> 00:07:22,920 Speaker 1: But none of them left, you know, I mean the 136 00:07:23,160 --> 00:07:27,840 Speaker 1: the that's what's really hard about your job is you've 137 00:07:27,880 --> 00:07:30,680 Speaker 1: always had to rerecruit your own players, but now you 138 00:07:30,880 --> 00:07:33,240 Speaker 1: really have to rerecruit your own play like on a 139 00:07:33,800 --> 00:07:37,200 Speaker 1: on an almost weekly basis. Um. Is that what that 140 00:07:37,240 --> 00:07:39,080 Speaker 1: crew was? That crew just all in and they just 141 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:43,400 Speaker 1: liked it and it wasn't a managing process or was 142 00:07:43,440 --> 00:07:45,720 Speaker 1: there something a guy that kind of held everything together 143 00:07:45,760 --> 00:07:48,880 Speaker 1: and kept them in you know what? Not really just 144 00:07:49,000 --> 00:07:51,400 Speaker 1: it kind of felt like these guys, they they were 145 00:07:51,600 --> 00:07:55,280 Speaker 1: unbelievable friends off the court, they were connected on it. 146 00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:58,000 Speaker 1: They're still really close today. I mean, there's still the 147 00:07:58,040 --> 00:08:00,680 Speaker 1: closest of friends today and he's that's kind of the 148 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:02,600 Speaker 1: way that you would want it to be. That's about 149 00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:04,920 Speaker 1: the kind of the college experience right when you look 150 00:08:04,960 --> 00:08:08,600 Speaker 1: back on it. Um. But what's funny for me and 151 00:08:08,640 --> 00:08:11,360 Speaker 1: I know we've got to evolve here, Doug, But that's 152 00:08:11,360 --> 00:08:13,960 Speaker 1: how I did it at ferman And to be honest, 153 00:08:14,200 --> 00:08:16,560 Speaker 1: that's really how we're doing it right now. You know 154 00:08:16,600 --> 00:08:18,840 Speaker 1: at CSU, you know, we we we've kind of got 155 00:08:19,040 --> 00:08:21,600 Speaker 1: the classes and you know, can we keep all these guys? 156 00:08:21,640 --> 00:08:23,920 Speaker 1: I don't know. I mean, you you recruit him every day, 157 00:08:24,000 --> 00:08:27,440 Speaker 1: you treat him well. But but I think that to me, 158 00:08:27,560 --> 00:08:30,440 Speaker 1: the secret sauce in college hoops is nobody says, oh, 159 00:08:30,440 --> 00:08:33,760 Speaker 1: you gotta get older and get old and stay old. Yeah, 160 00:08:33,840 --> 00:08:35,800 Speaker 1: but I think the real secret sauces can you do 161 00:08:35,840 --> 00:08:39,160 Speaker 1: that while still having continuity? And if you can have 162 00:08:39,160 --> 00:08:41,640 Speaker 1: a little bit of continuity and you get older, to me, 163 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:45,200 Speaker 1: that's what the really good teams have see. I think 164 00:08:45,720 --> 00:08:50,280 Speaker 1: I think that, Um, it's it's a fascinating thing that transferred, 165 00:08:50,440 --> 00:08:55,000 Speaker 1: even the grad transfer thing is amazing because consider the 166 00:08:55,040 --> 00:08:58,400 Speaker 1: experience that guys have a Colorado State, you know, and 167 00:08:58,440 --> 00:09:02,080 Speaker 1: then you know pick up player. But the idea of 168 00:09:02,200 --> 00:09:05,160 Speaker 1: leaving that behind for one year to play at a 169 00:09:05,200 --> 00:09:09,640 Speaker 1: super high major, Like, it's just weird because I don't 170 00:09:09,679 --> 00:09:12,960 Speaker 1: think that enough people who either cover it and definitely 171 00:09:12,960 --> 00:09:17,120 Speaker 1: fans don't understand what you're leaving behind. You know, Like 172 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:20,240 Speaker 1: a guy who comes in for one season is not 173 00:09:20,320 --> 00:09:23,520 Speaker 1: going to get invited to all the all the motor games, right, 174 00:09:23,559 --> 00:09:25,199 Speaker 1: and you're not going to go back to the place 175 00:09:25,240 --> 00:09:28,679 Speaker 1: that you left, so you kind of have And I'm 176 00:09:28,720 --> 00:09:31,240 Speaker 1: a transfer and the Notre Dame guys, I'm so close 177 00:09:31,280 --> 00:09:34,000 Speaker 1: to my teammates. I only played there one year, but like, 178 00:09:35,200 --> 00:09:37,000 Speaker 1: no nobody says like, hey, you should come back to 179 00:09:37,040 --> 00:09:39,440 Speaker 1: this alumni thing another day, right, And part of it, 180 00:09:39,640 --> 00:09:41,800 Speaker 1: I'm sure it's the way would because of why I left. 181 00:09:42,400 --> 00:09:44,440 Speaker 1: But the good is the best portion of it is 182 00:09:44,520 --> 00:09:47,920 Speaker 1: like my junior year, I had a rough patch with 183 00:09:48,000 --> 00:09:50,240 Speaker 1: coach and I was like, man, my brother just gotten 184 00:09:50,240 --> 00:09:52,600 Speaker 1: on a San Diego State and before my senior year, 185 00:09:53,200 --> 00:09:55,760 Speaker 1: and I contemplated, maybe I'll go play for him, you know, 186 00:09:55,840 --> 00:09:58,640 Speaker 1: But but you don't just leave that program behind. You 187 00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:03,280 Speaker 1: leave all those relationships behind and the basketball family behind. 188 00:10:03,840 --> 00:10:06,679 Speaker 1: And I don't know how you relate that, how you 189 00:10:06,720 --> 00:10:11,360 Speaker 1: explain that to parents and people that that make help 190 00:10:11,520 --> 00:10:15,040 Speaker 1: these kids make these decisions which are sometimes accurate in 191 00:10:15,160 --> 00:10:18,640 Speaker 1: terms of basketball. Right, basketball, it might make sense, but 192 00:10:18,800 --> 00:10:20,959 Speaker 1: there's a whole rest of your life that you're you're 193 00:10:21,000 --> 00:10:23,719 Speaker 1: not taking into account. I couldn't agree more. And I 194 00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:26,000 Speaker 1: talked to the guys about that all the time. Is 195 00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:28,839 Speaker 1: that's the missing And again I'm not guys. Coaches take 196 00:10:28,880 --> 00:10:31,680 Speaker 1: different jobs. Sometimes transferring is the best thing for for 197 00:10:31,760 --> 00:10:34,000 Speaker 1: a young man. But the things that you're describing, I 198 00:10:34,040 --> 00:10:36,600 Speaker 1: think that's what gets lost in the shuffle. It's it's 199 00:10:36,640 --> 00:10:40,800 Speaker 1: the network that you have in this short window four years, UM, 200 00:10:41,160 --> 00:10:45,200 Speaker 1: all the relationships you make in your community, at your university. UM, 201 00:10:45,280 --> 00:10:47,880 Speaker 1: that network and all of a sudden, sometimes I feel 202 00:10:47,920 --> 00:10:49,800 Speaker 1: really bad for these guys who have been at three 203 00:10:49,840 --> 00:10:53,960 Speaker 1: different schools. They graduate, Um, the pro career doesn't materialize 204 00:10:53,960 --> 00:10:55,760 Speaker 1: like it doesn't for most people. They're gonna have to 205 00:10:55,800 --> 00:10:59,280 Speaker 1: go work for somebody someday. They've got no network. You've 206 00:10:59,280 --> 00:11:01,439 Speaker 1: got no network if they've got no place to go. 207 00:11:02,280 --> 00:11:05,120 Speaker 1: Whereas you know, when you do it right, UM. Hopefully 208 00:11:05,160 --> 00:11:08,960 Speaker 1: if you go, you win, UM, you develop relationships, UM, 209 00:11:09,080 --> 00:11:12,280 Speaker 1: your disentrench in that community. You have a place, UM 210 00:11:12,360 --> 00:11:14,079 Speaker 1: that helps take care of you, you know. And I've 211 00:11:14,080 --> 00:11:15,720 Speaker 1: got some guys. I've got a guy in my staff 212 00:11:15,760 --> 00:11:19,080 Speaker 1: that played here, several guys that were on that team before. 213 00:11:19,360 --> 00:11:21,600 Speaker 1: They're always going to have a place in four Collins. 214 00:11:21,600 --> 00:11:24,120 Speaker 1: Those people love them, and I think that's the thing 215 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:26,560 Speaker 1: that gets lost in this whole deal. And you know, 216 00:11:26,600 --> 00:11:30,280 Speaker 1: you make a short term decision without understanding the consequences 217 00:11:30,320 --> 00:11:33,439 Speaker 1: of that decision. And so you know, I I still 218 00:11:33,559 --> 00:11:36,439 Speaker 1: maybe I'm old fashioned. I get at times have changed. 219 00:11:36,600 --> 00:11:39,199 Speaker 1: We have to evolve with that. But there's still our 220 00:11:39,280 --> 00:11:41,360 Speaker 1: places for people that they want to go and stay 221 00:11:41,400 --> 00:11:44,559 Speaker 1: someplace for four years. Come on. So it's not the worst. 222 00:11:44,559 --> 00:11:47,280 Speaker 1: It's not the worst thing. Oh it's great. As anybody 223 00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:49,400 Speaker 1: who gets done playing like right now, like me, I'm 224 00:11:49,440 --> 00:11:52,240 Speaker 1: forty five years old, and somebody goes like, hey, listen, 225 00:11:52,240 --> 00:11:53,840 Speaker 1: you can do up everything you have and go back 226 00:11:53,840 --> 00:11:59,480 Speaker 1: and play one season at Okaha State Like okay, absolutely right, 227 00:12:00,040 --> 00:12:02,320 Speaker 1: Well I'll do it in a s Okay. So you 228 00:12:02,320 --> 00:12:06,360 Speaker 1: get the fermit. Now you have to establish your own basketball. 229 00:12:06,400 --> 00:12:09,200 Speaker 1: Then this is the first team time it's your team. Yeah, 230 00:12:09,679 --> 00:12:11,240 Speaker 1: how do how do you decide to build it in 231 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:14,800 Speaker 1: terms of you know, did you do the offense and 232 00:12:14,880 --> 00:12:17,199 Speaker 1: the defense? Do you have an offense coat or defense 233 00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:20,880 Speaker 1: coordinator who handles a recruiting how do you how do 234 00:12:20,920 --> 00:12:24,160 Speaker 1: you put it all together? Uh? You know, obviously with 235 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:26,240 Speaker 1: with recruiting, you know you wanted to go out and 236 00:12:26,280 --> 00:12:28,240 Speaker 1: find I thought I wanted to do it in the 237 00:12:28,320 --> 00:12:30,840 Speaker 1: same fashion we had done it at CSC, with finding 238 00:12:31,240 --> 00:12:33,480 Speaker 1: a class of guys that I thought would really buy 239 00:12:33,520 --> 00:12:35,880 Speaker 1: in and really wanted to be at Ferman for for 240 00:12:35,960 --> 00:12:38,400 Speaker 1: what we were selling. And I thought we started to 241 00:12:38,400 --> 00:12:40,800 Speaker 1: be able to do that. I think one of the 242 00:12:40,960 --> 00:12:44,040 Speaker 1: not mistakes, but you learn you become a head coach 243 00:12:44,080 --> 00:12:45,880 Speaker 1: and it's like, well, all right, I'm gonna I'm gonna 244 00:12:45,880 --> 00:12:47,760 Speaker 1: try to do the basketball piece kind of what we 245 00:12:47,800 --> 00:12:50,880 Speaker 1: had done at CSU, even though I had already been 246 00:12:50,960 --> 00:12:53,120 Speaker 1: establishing in my mind kind of some of the things 247 00:12:53,120 --> 00:12:56,640 Speaker 1: I wanted to do, particularly offensively, even as an assistant, 248 00:12:56,679 --> 00:12:59,199 Speaker 1: I had been kind of trying to formulate my own identity. 249 00:13:00,000 --> 00:13:02,360 Speaker 1: Whatever reason, I didn't do that my first year and 250 00:13:02,400 --> 00:13:05,280 Speaker 1: a half, and I anyway, I got what did you do. 251 00:13:05,360 --> 00:13:07,440 Speaker 1: You just took kim stuff. I kind of tried to 252 00:13:07,440 --> 00:13:09,840 Speaker 1: do motion and all this stuff, and I didn't for 253 00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:12,640 Speaker 1: whatever reason. It was like, why was I afraid to 254 00:13:12,720 --> 00:13:14,440 Speaker 1: go out and do it the way that I wanted 255 00:13:14,440 --> 00:13:16,080 Speaker 1: to do it? And I remember I went and I 256 00:13:16,120 --> 00:13:18,520 Speaker 1: spent I got introduced to Dick Ben and I went 257 00:13:18,559 --> 00:13:21,000 Speaker 1: up to Wisconsin. I spent two days with him, just 258 00:13:21,080 --> 00:13:23,920 Speaker 1: he and I in his house. Um and you know, 259 00:13:23,960 --> 00:13:26,400 Speaker 1: I are just developed a really close by and he 260 00:13:26,520 --> 00:13:28,319 Speaker 1: told me so many great things. But he said, you 261 00:13:28,360 --> 00:13:30,880 Speaker 1: know what, Nico, the one thing is, you know you 262 00:13:30,880 --> 00:13:32,679 Speaker 1: only get a shot, you know, one shot to do this. 263 00:13:32,720 --> 00:13:34,720 Speaker 1: You better do it your way. You know, you better 264 00:13:34,760 --> 00:13:37,199 Speaker 1: do it the way that you want to do it. UM. 265 00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:41,000 Speaker 1: And I thought that really helped empower me. And you know, 266 00:13:41,080 --> 00:13:43,640 Speaker 1: we ended up after my second year there, we had 267 00:13:43,640 --> 00:13:46,120 Speaker 1: a great run in the conference tournament. Second year, we 268 00:13:46,200 --> 00:13:49,800 Speaker 1: lost to Wafford in the championship game. Um um went 269 00:13:49,880 --> 00:13:51,800 Speaker 1: right down to the wire. That really ended up turning 270 00:13:51,840 --> 00:13:54,280 Speaker 1: our program. That next year, I went right away and 271 00:13:54,280 --> 00:13:57,240 Speaker 1: I changed offensive systems. I went to start to do 272 00:13:57,320 --> 00:13:59,719 Speaker 1: the spread, um, which is what I wanted to do, 273 00:14:00,280 --> 00:14:02,520 Speaker 1: and we took off. I mean, we took off, we 274 00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:06,840 Speaker 1: were terrific offensively, um um, and we never looked back. 275 00:14:06,880 --> 00:14:08,839 Speaker 1: And again we went from three thirty six out of 276 00:14:08,880 --> 00:14:11,440 Speaker 1: three fifty one in the RPI to you know, time 277 00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:15,080 Speaker 1: for the least championship in year four. Um. And I'm 278 00:14:15,120 --> 00:14:17,199 Speaker 1: gonna tell you what else. Boy, You know, losing is 279 00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:19,880 Speaker 1: a great mentor. And I'm in the I'm in the 280 00:14:19,920 --> 00:14:23,200 Speaker 1: Southern Conference. And you've got you know, Bob Hoffman was 281 00:14:23,200 --> 00:14:25,400 Speaker 1: a mercer, you know, who had just taken Duke to 282 00:14:25,640 --> 00:14:27,440 Speaker 1: you know, beating Duke in the n C Double A tournament. 283 00:14:27,600 --> 00:14:30,280 Speaker 1: Steve Forbes is at East Tennessee State, will wait is 284 00:14:30,320 --> 00:14:34,000 Speaker 1: that Chattanooga? Mike Young is at Wafford, Larry Hunters at 285 00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:38,240 Speaker 1: Western Carolina. I mean there are some dudes in that league. 286 00:14:38,680 --> 00:14:41,360 Speaker 1: And I'm this new young schmuck you know, at Fermanut 287 00:14:41,360 --> 00:14:43,520 Speaker 1: and I'm like, I better figure this thing out quickly 288 00:14:43,640 --> 00:14:45,760 Speaker 1: or I'm gonna be out of a job. And I 289 00:14:45,800 --> 00:14:49,840 Speaker 1: think going against those guys every day really taught me 290 00:14:49,960 --> 00:14:54,080 Speaker 1: how to coach and and and that's is the best 291 00:14:54,080 --> 00:14:57,880 Speaker 1: experience I ever went through. You said, spread, So you're 292 00:14:58,120 --> 00:15:02,440 Speaker 1: talking about just four out one in where's whether you 293 00:15:02,480 --> 00:15:06,280 Speaker 1: call it dribble drive what I'm just playing with rules? Right? Well, So, 294 00:15:06,360 --> 00:15:08,920 Speaker 1: I when I was at an assistant at firm, and 295 00:15:08,920 --> 00:15:10,840 Speaker 1: I remember we were gonna go out and play Creighton. 296 00:15:11,560 --> 00:15:13,960 Speaker 1: Dane Altman was that creating and I had the scout 297 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:16,640 Speaker 1: and I started watching. They had Kyle Korver and they 298 00:15:16,640 --> 00:15:19,120 Speaker 1: were running you know the old Johnny or spread, you know, 299 00:15:19,200 --> 00:15:22,080 Speaker 1: first cut, second cut, play to the backs. And I 300 00:15:22,080 --> 00:15:24,400 Speaker 1: started watching it. I was just I couldn't get enough that. 301 00:15:24,440 --> 00:15:27,120 Speaker 1: I just kept watching more games, more games. And then 302 00:15:27,160 --> 00:15:29,720 Speaker 1: we went out and we played them. And I love 303 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:32,080 Speaker 1: the way they played. I love the spacing, I love 304 00:15:32,160 --> 00:15:34,120 Speaker 1: the cutting, I love the ball movement. I thought it 305 00:15:34,160 --> 00:15:37,000 Speaker 1: was a way that they could recruit at Creighton at 306 00:15:37,000 --> 00:15:38,880 Speaker 1: the time when they were in the valley that would 307 00:15:38,880 --> 00:15:42,600 Speaker 1: allow them to to win and be successful. And I 308 00:15:42,680 --> 00:15:45,320 Speaker 1: started to study it and and I started to learn 309 00:15:45,360 --> 00:15:47,680 Speaker 1: it and study it. And when I was an assistant 310 00:15:47,680 --> 00:15:50,440 Speaker 1: at Ferman in our last couple of years, when um 311 00:15:50,480 --> 00:15:53,160 Speaker 1: we actually started to get good, Larry Davis let me 312 00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:56,400 Speaker 1: kind of start to run with it. And then that 313 00:15:56,480 --> 00:15:59,160 Speaker 1: year we finally beat Davidson. Once Davidson and US were 314 00:15:59,200 --> 00:16:02,320 Speaker 1: the two best offense. Some teams in our league. Um. 315 00:16:02,360 --> 00:16:05,040 Speaker 1: And then for whatever reason, I went through my old transition. 316 00:16:05,080 --> 00:16:07,240 Speaker 1: I went to Ferman and I didn't do it. And 317 00:16:07,240 --> 00:16:08,880 Speaker 1: then finally when I was like, what am I doing, 318 00:16:08,920 --> 00:16:11,600 Speaker 1: I gotta do it by way and sure enough and 319 00:16:11,640 --> 00:16:14,480 Speaker 1: then from there it's it's really evolved into you know, 320 00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:17,440 Speaker 1: my own kind of deal. Um. But it all started 321 00:16:17,520 --> 00:16:20,760 Speaker 1: with with learning to to run that spread offense. How 322 00:16:20,880 --> 00:16:23,360 Speaker 1: how is it too? So you know, we call it 323 00:16:23,400 --> 00:16:25,960 Speaker 1: pin wheel motion when we played against we played against 324 00:16:26,520 --> 00:16:29,240 Speaker 1: creating when I was at Oklahoma State, and you know 325 00:16:29,400 --> 00:16:31,880 Speaker 1: it was my dad had coached at Kansas State and 326 00:16:31,960 --> 00:16:36,240 Speaker 1: Jack Hartman had run a version of it as well. Um, 327 00:16:36,280 --> 00:16:40,400 Speaker 1: But how is it to implement offenses that you didn't 328 00:16:40,400 --> 00:16:44,240 Speaker 1: play it? Like? I think? Like I think, you know, 329 00:16:44,560 --> 00:16:47,000 Speaker 1: everybody says, coach what you know, right, And that's what 330 00:16:47,480 --> 00:16:50,200 Speaker 1: I think a lot of point guards they play, they 331 00:16:50,280 --> 00:16:53,320 Speaker 1: run exactly what they ran. Maybe they put some new 332 00:16:53,640 --> 00:16:55,080 Speaker 1: new twists on it. But the exactly what you know 333 00:16:55,600 --> 00:17:00,280 Speaker 1: and the reason that you coach, which knows you also know. Um, 334 00:17:00,400 --> 00:17:03,840 Speaker 1: kind of the all of the uh, all the counters, 335 00:17:04,000 --> 00:17:07,800 Speaker 1: the pressure as well, how hard is that to get 336 00:17:08,320 --> 00:17:10,560 Speaker 1: kind of when you're you're putting together, you're watching somebody 337 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:13,280 Speaker 1: you're how many does it take a whole season? Does 338 00:17:13,320 --> 00:17:15,520 Speaker 1: it take a couple of games to you figure out 339 00:17:15,960 --> 00:17:18,399 Speaker 1: there's something I forgot to tell them, you know, like, 340 00:17:18,600 --> 00:17:20,919 Speaker 1: oh God, I forgot to tell them that. Um, I 341 00:17:20,920 --> 00:17:23,679 Speaker 1: think it was. You know, that's a great question, and 342 00:17:23,720 --> 00:17:26,159 Speaker 1: I think all those things continue to evolve over time. 343 00:17:26,160 --> 00:17:27,960 Speaker 1: I mean, it takes this season. There's gonna be trial 344 00:17:27,960 --> 00:17:29,680 Speaker 1: and are when you're putting in a system and you've 345 00:17:29,680 --> 00:17:31,919 Speaker 1: got to learn what you like, what you don't like, 346 00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:34,280 Speaker 1: and ultimately it's going to evolve into your own thing. 347 00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:36,399 Speaker 1: You know, what do you believe in and what can 348 00:17:36,520 --> 00:17:38,000 Speaker 1: it's yeah, it's not what you know, it's what you 349 00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:40,040 Speaker 1: can teach, you know. I think a lot of people 350 00:17:40,119 --> 00:17:42,159 Speaker 1: make that, make that mistake. But when I was an 351 00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:45,440 Speaker 1: assistant at Furman, I remember we were so bad offensively, 352 00:17:45,560 --> 00:17:47,639 Speaker 1: and Larry said, we gotta do something different, and we 353 00:17:47,760 --> 00:17:50,000 Speaker 1: just I put it in and we started doing it. 354 00:17:50,040 --> 00:17:52,440 Speaker 1: And but it was kind of a there was kind 355 00:17:52,440 --> 00:17:55,440 Speaker 1: of some freedom in that because you know, it's like, well, 356 00:17:55,480 --> 00:17:58,440 Speaker 1: we were bad offensively anyway, so we just started to 357 00:17:58,520 --> 00:18:00,320 Speaker 1: run with it, and you start to write, you start 358 00:18:00,359 --> 00:18:03,000 Speaker 1: to learn on the fly. You know, of what you 359 00:18:03,080 --> 00:18:05,159 Speaker 1: can do, and and I had done a lot of 360 00:18:05,200 --> 00:18:07,199 Speaker 1: studying and it talked to a lot of people, and 361 00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:11,480 Speaker 1: but there's nothing like actually coaching it and teaching it. Um. 362 00:18:11,640 --> 00:18:14,000 Speaker 1: But but yeah, it's just something that became really really 363 00:18:14,000 --> 00:18:16,280 Speaker 1: comfortable to me. And then obviously I really love what 364 00:18:16,359 --> 00:18:18,800 Speaker 1: John bee Line was doing, um, you know when he 365 00:18:18,840 --> 00:18:21,639 Speaker 1: was at Richmond, you know, in particular, and then started 366 00:18:21,640 --> 00:18:24,440 Speaker 1: to evolve throughout his coaching here at West Virginia and Michigan, 367 00:18:24,480 --> 00:18:26,720 Speaker 1: and he and I are actually have become friends too, 368 00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:29,680 Speaker 1: because I think he's a genius on that end of 369 00:18:29,720 --> 00:18:32,120 Speaker 1: the floor. And it's kind of you know, I love 370 00:18:32,200 --> 00:18:34,879 Speaker 1: to shuffle stuff. I love the two guard front. I 371 00:18:34,880 --> 00:18:37,119 Speaker 1: love some of the spread stuff. Um, I love some 372 00:18:37,160 --> 00:18:39,520 Speaker 1: of the five out stuff that everyone's doing. And then 373 00:18:39,520 --> 00:18:43,320 Speaker 1: it's just kind of morphed into the deal. That's interesting 374 00:18:43,359 --> 00:18:46,000 Speaker 1: because I do think I when I watch you, I 375 00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:48,919 Speaker 1: think be Line. Because when I was at ESPN, I 376 00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:51,040 Speaker 1: did a breakdown of his offense and they're like, what 377 00:18:51,200 --> 00:18:53,760 Speaker 1: offense is you running? And I go all of them? Yeah, 378 00:18:54,920 --> 00:18:57,240 Speaker 1: I go, well, I mean he took some aspects of Princeton, 379 00:18:57,640 --> 00:19:00,119 Speaker 1: took some aspects you know, almost all of his with 380 00:19:00,200 --> 00:19:03,200 Speaker 1: obviously the the five high because he has a five 381 00:19:03,240 --> 00:19:05,320 Speaker 1: you can pick and popping, and also it opens up 382 00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:09,000 Speaker 1: the floor. Um, he has some elements of shuffle, you know, 383 00:19:09,480 --> 00:19:13,120 Speaker 1: and and there's elements of it's like, oh, I took this, 384 00:19:13,400 --> 00:19:14,840 Speaker 1: and I took this, and how I put it kind 385 00:19:14,840 --> 00:19:16,679 Speaker 1: of all together. And when I watch you, you know, 386 00:19:16,800 --> 00:19:20,199 Speaker 1: like I see some shuffle, you know, I see some spread. 387 00:19:20,760 --> 00:19:23,560 Speaker 1: I see a little pistol action as well. It's kind 388 00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:25,960 Speaker 1: of all sort of in there. It's all kind of 389 00:19:26,000 --> 00:19:28,840 Speaker 1: in there. But how you teach it, that's always amazing, 390 00:19:29,280 --> 00:19:32,000 Speaker 1: because you know, there's you've got four other dudes there 391 00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:35,040 Speaker 1: in suits, and you have to they have to know 392 00:19:35,080 --> 00:19:36,679 Speaker 1: what's in your brain because in your body it all 393 00:19:36,720 --> 00:19:38,720 Speaker 1: makes sense. You're like, well, yeah, here we go, here 394 00:19:38,840 --> 00:19:42,639 Speaker 1: we go here, man see and they're like huh, Like okay, 395 00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:45,040 Speaker 1: how hard is that to get them to see what's 396 00:19:45,160 --> 00:19:47,399 Speaker 1: all going on in there? It is for the For 397 00:19:47,440 --> 00:19:49,360 Speaker 1: the new guys that came on staff, I think their 398 00:19:49,400 --> 00:19:51,399 Speaker 1: heads were spinning a little bit. In the summer. We 399 00:19:51,440 --> 00:19:53,920 Speaker 1: did a ton of offense this summer for a lot 400 00:19:53,920 --> 00:19:55,359 Speaker 1: of we had a couple of new players. But I 401 00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:57,359 Speaker 1: think I really wanted those guys to get a feel 402 00:19:57,440 --> 00:20:01,399 Speaker 1: for our terminology, how we teach it UM, and it 403 00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:04,480 Speaker 1: continues to evolve, you know. And another guy that's been 404 00:20:05,080 --> 00:20:07,199 Speaker 1: a guy that I really love is Lenny Acuff, you know, 405 00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:10,000 Speaker 1: who's at Alabama Huntsville and he's now at Lipscomb. But 406 00:20:10,280 --> 00:20:12,960 Speaker 1: he was a D two genius and he's a he's 407 00:20:12,960 --> 00:20:14,800 Speaker 1: an offensive genius and he runs a lot of the 408 00:20:14,800 --> 00:20:18,040 Speaker 1: Princeton stuff, and UM, it does. It takes time, but 409 00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:19,720 Speaker 1: the guys have been with me. I mean, they know 410 00:20:19,800 --> 00:20:22,280 Speaker 1: it just as well as I do now. And UM 411 00:20:22,400 --> 00:20:25,240 Speaker 1: always comes up with great ideas. And your players teach 412 00:20:25,280 --> 00:20:27,240 Speaker 1: you a ton Doug, like you're doing this stuff and 413 00:20:27,280 --> 00:20:30,240 Speaker 1: it maybe looks more complex than it is, UM, but 414 00:20:30,359 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 1: your players teach you a lot UM, so you have 415 00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:35,680 Speaker 1: a system. But man, wow, David Roddy got that looks 416 00:20:35,720 --> 00:20:37,840 Speaker 1: pretty good. Maybe we should name that something, you know, 417 00:20:37,840 --> 00:20:41,000 Speaker 1: How can we get to that particular action more often? 418 00:20:41,440 --> 00:20:44,640 Speaker 1: Just in our motion? And I think that's how those things, 419 00:20:44,640 --> 00:20:47,080 Speaker 1: those things evolved. But it it kind of becomes your own. 420 00:20:47,119 --> 00:20:49,480 Speaker 1: And that's what I love about John Belon. You're exactly right. 421 00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:52,639 Speaker 1: You watch follow his career and he just keeps finding 422 00:20:52,680 --> 00:20:54,920 Speaker 1: ways to take things that he likes and trying to 423 00:20:54,960 --> 00:20:57,680 Speaker 1: stay ahead of the defense. And it's just morphed into 424 00:20:57,720 --> 00:20:59,800 Speaker 1: his own deal. And that's kind of what we're trying 425 00:20:59,800 --> 00:21:07,040 Speaker 1: to do here. Um ra thing, What did I thought, 426 00:21:07,160 --> 00:21:08,639 Speaker 1: kind of like when I was at firm and I 427 00:21:08,640 --> 00:21:11,240 Speaker 1: thought Drake was a was a really good academic school 428 00:21:11,840 --> 00:21:14,240 Speaker 1: UM in the Midwest. It was a recruiting base that 429 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:16,600 Speaker 1: I had known really really well. They had just built 430 00:21:16,600 --> 00:21:20,600 Speaker 1: a brand new practice facility there, um, they had new leadership, 431 00:21:20,680 --> 00:21:23,400 Speaker 1: you know, president UM, and I thought they were really 432 00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:26,919 Speaker 1: committed to being good at basketball. The valley had changed 433 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:29,560 Speaker 1: a little bit, you know, with Wichitan Creighton leaving. I 434 00:21:29,600 --> 00:21:31,679 Speaker 1: thought that Drake was poised. I thought it could be 435 00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:35,040 Speaker 1: a really good job. They love basketball there. And people 436 00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:37,080 Speaker 1: thought I was nuts, But I thought it was a 437 00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:39,840 Speaker 1: job that really fit me and and uh, you know, 438 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:42,280 Speaker 1: and and again without getting into the details of things 439 00:21:42,320 --> 00:21:44,560 Speaker 1: that were going on at Fermant at the time, but 440 00:21:44,920 --> 00:21:47,320 Speaker 1: I decided to do it. People thought I thought that, 441 00:21:47,400 --> 00:21:49,760 Speaker 1: you know, you're crazy, what are you doing? UM? But 442 00:21:49,840 --> 00:21:51,920 Speaker 1: I think it's proven to be right. I think obviously 443 00:21:51,960 --> 00:21:53,560 Speaker 1: we had a really good year with that group of 444 00:21:53,560 --> 00:21:55,800 Speaker 1: guys that were coming back and Deering's just done an 445 00:21:55,880 --> 00:21:58,640 Speaker 1: unbelievable job there at Drake and I think people are 446 00:21:58,640 --> 00:22:00,320 Speaker 1: seeing now that that can be one of the best 447 00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:03,920 Speaker 1: programs in the valley. What is that like for you though? Too? 448 00:22:04,560 --> 00:22:09,159 Speaker 1: You're you're fun, nice person, right, there's not doesn't feel 449 00:22:09,200 --> 00:22:12,080 Speaker 1: like any interaction I've had with you or what anyone 450 00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:14,760 Speaker 1: knows you there was just like, well, a sneaky bad guy. Right. 451 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:16,960 Speaker 1: But when you're not only at a place for a year, 452 00:22:17,920 --> 00:22:20,960 Speaker 1: people talk, you know, people people will say like, well, 453 00:22:21,000 --> 00:22:22,840 Speaker 1: he just you know, he just left for more money 454 00:22:22,920 --> 00:22:25,760 Speaker 1: or whatever. And there it's left with that, even though 455 00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:29,000 Speaker 1: you turn the program you know and help Darren, who 456 00:22:29,160 --> 00:22:32,399 Speaker 1: I agree, he's a great dude, he's an amazing job, right, 457 00:22:32,600 --> 00:22:35,320 Speaker 1: but there's some negative feelings there. How do you how 458 00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:39,040 Speaker 1: do you process that? You know, listen, Doug, I mean 459 00:22:39,040 --> 00:22:41,000 Speaker 1: a nice guy and so on and so forth. But 460 00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:43,520 Speaker 1: you know, you that's part of the job. I mean, 461 00:22:43,520 --> 00:22:45,240 Speaker 1: you're gonna have to when you're in this business. You 462 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:47,919 Speaker 1: better have some some thick skin. Man. You're gonna you're 463 00:22:47,920 --> 00:22:51,560 Speaker 1: gonna take bullets and um. You know, people who know 464 00:22:51,680 --> 00:22:54,320 Speaker 1: me and know that this job at CSU for a 465 00:22:54,359 --> 00:22:56,560 Speaker 1: lot of different reasons. Was a place that was really 466 00:22:56,560 --> 00:22:59,320 Speaker 1: special to me. I never anticipated this job was going 467 00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:01,400 Speaker 1: to be been in the timing I did. We don't 468 00:23:01,400 --> 00:23:04,040 Speaker 1: get to choose those things, and it was difficult. I 469 00:23:04,040 --> 00:23:06,480 Speaker 1: didn't have I had no ill feelings at all towards 470 00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:08,760 Speaker 1: anyone at Drake. Those people were awesome. Me and I 471 00:23:08,880 --> 00:23:11,240 Speaker 1: had a huge belief and what we were doing, and 472 00:23:11,320 --> 00:23:14,800 Speaker 1: you went there thinking that that's where I was gonna be. Um, 473 00:23:14,840 --> 00:23:17,040 Speaker 1: but this thing happened, and I just felt like it 474 00:23:17,080 --> 00:23:19,199 Speaker 1: was something I couldn't say no to, you know, for 475 00:23:19,240 --> 00:23:21,800 Speaker 1: me and my family, and UM, that's what I did. 476 00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:24,800 Speaker 1: And I understand the people being upset, and that's fine. 477 00:23:24,840 --> 00:23:27,320 Speaker 1: I totally get that, and I don't have to live 478 00:23:27,359 --> 00:23:29,880 Speaker 1: with that. But ultimately, I guess what I would say, 479 00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:31,960 Speaker 1: I think it worked out for both parties. I think 480 00:23:32,000 --> 00:23:35,440 Speaker 1: Drake's doing just fine. More than just fine, you know. 481 00:23:35,480 --> 00:23:37,399 Speaker 1: I think it worked out well for them, and I 482 00:23:37,440 --> 00:23:39,600 Speaker 1: think it's worked out well for us, And you know, 483 00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:41,359 Speaker 1: you hate that it went down the way that it did, 484 00:23:41,480 --> 00:23:44,040 Speaker 1: but I think that both programs are in great shape, 485 00:23:44,080 --> 00:23:45,840 Speaker 1: and so I think people just need to move forward, 486 00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:47,720 Speaker 1: right and and they have, which is great. They have 487 00:23:47,920 --> 00:23:50,680 Speaker 1: I think. Look, I think Larry Stacy is an amazing 488 00:23:50,680 --> 00:23:52,680 Speaker 1: basketball coach. We played against his best team, so I 489 00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:55,879 Speaker 1: was taping he said, but it did not end well. 490 00:23:56,520 --> 00:23:59,320 Speaker 1: You know, it didn't end well. And Larry's a guy 491 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:02,479 Speaker 1: who will tell you exactly how he's feeling when he's feeling. 492 00:24:02,920 --> 00:24:06,080 Speaker 1: So I'm guessing that when you got there, your styles 493 00:24:06,119 --> 00:24:10,320 Speaker 1: are completely different offensive, south defensive, and personality very different. 494 00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:12,639 Speaker 1: That it was a breath of fresh air. But you 495 00:24:12,720 --> 00:24:16,680 Speaker 1: weren't a great basketball team, right, um? And I remember, 496 00:24:17,560 --> 00:24:19,800 Speaker 1: I remember I called a game. You guys played Kansas 497 00:24:19,840 --> 00:24:22,879 Speaker 1: State in Denver. Your your first year, so I remember this. 498 00:24:23,080 --> 00:24:24,680 Speaker 1: What was a freshman remember all these guys? Well, I 499 00:24:24,720 --> 00:24:26,240 Speaker 1: think that was your your first year, wasn't it. That 500 00:24:26,320 --> 00:24:29,160 Speaker 1: was actually Larry's last Larry's last year. Yeah, I wasn't 501 00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:31,399 Speaker 1: there yet. It was the next I actually I actually 502 00:24:31,400 --> 00:24:34,280 Speaker 1: got all kinds of flight issues and I literally landed 503 00:24:34,320 --> 00:24:36,720 Speaker 1: like an hour and a half before they and I 504 00:24:36,800 --> 00:24:39,160 Speaker 1: got there and they're all warming up and I put 505 00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:42,080 Speaker 1: my time. It was not a great Okay, So you 506 00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:44,240 Speaker 1: you take over CS. You you hadn't been there in 507 00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:49,600 Speaker 1: what seven eight years or so? What what what was 508 00:24:49,720 --> 00:24:52,879 Speaker 1: different from the last time. So you know what, when 509 00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:54,800 Speaker 1: I remember the most is when I had left here 510 00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:56,879 Speaker 1: in the last couple of years, that the Mobile Arena 511 00:24:57,000 --> 00:24:59,399 Speaker 1: was packed. I mean, the energy was awesome, and I 512 00:24:59,440 --> 00:25:01,600 Speaker 1: remember walking out for the first game and I was 513 00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:05,400 Speaker 1: stunned at where the attendance had gone in just six years. 514 00:25:05,440 --> 00:25:07,760 Speaker 1: I mean, nobody was there at the games. I mean 515 00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:10,640 Speaker 1: that the apathy was, you know, off the charts and 516 00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:13,280 Speaker 1: whatever the reasons are, whatever doesn't really matter. And I'm like, 517 00:25:13,320 --> 00:25:15,560 Speaker 1: oh my gosh, like We're gonna have to build this 518 00:25:15,640 --> 00:25:18,680 Speaker 1: fan base back again because nobody was coming to the games. 519 00:25:18,800 --> 00:25:21,159 Speaker 1: And that's what stood out to me the most. I 520 00:25:21,240 --> 00:25:23,560 Speaker 1: knew we were gonna have to make some some changes 521 00:25:23,600 --> 00:25:25,760 Speaker 1: in personnel, and obviously the way we were going to 522 00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:28,240 Speaker 1: do things maybe it wasn't gonna vibe with a lot 523 00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:30,040 Speaker 1: of the guys that were there. And so I knew 524 00:25:30,040 --> 00:25:31,760 Speaker 1: that I had been prepared for that because I've been 525 00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:34,119 Speaker 1: in these jobs before as an assistant and head coach 526 00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:36,479 Speaker 1: and um and and and we did. And then I 527 00:25:36,520 --> 00:25:39,160 Speaker 1: think because of that and having a lot of confidence 528 00:25:39,200 --> 00:25:40,800 Speaker 1: in your vision and what we were able to do, 529 00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:43,000 Speaker 1: we quickly turned it year too. You know, we got 530 00:25:43,000 --> 00:25:45,880 Speaker 1: the great group of freshmen and uh Carvaccio had stuck 531 00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:48,399 Speaker 1: around and a guy like Chris Martin hyron Edwards and 532 00:25:48,640 --> 00:25:50,280 Speaker 1: we're able to have a pretty good you know, Dane 533 00:25:50,320 --> 00:25:53,480 Speaker 1: good year in year two and um, it's obviously you know, 534 00:25:53,520 --> 00:25:55,320 Speaker 1: continue to move forward here. And I mean you were 535 00:25:55,359 --> 00:25:57,320 Speaker 1: at the game the other night, Doug. I mean, Bobi 536 00:25:57,359 --> 00:25:59,159 Speaker 1: Arena is a pretty dang cool place now when you 537 00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:03,679 Speaker 1: get a crowd in there. Fox Sports Radio has the 538 00:26:03,760 --> 00:26:06,679 Speaker 1: best sports talk lineup in the nation. Catch all of 539 00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:10,200 Speaker 1: our shows at Fox sports Radio dot com and within 540 00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:12,720 Speaker 1: the I Heart Radio app search f s R to 541 00:26:12,840 --> 00:26:18,120 Speaker 1: listen live. Okay, so you go from that to consecutive 542 00:26:18,119 --> 00:26:22,440 Speaker 1: twenty win seasons, you know, and now you're the preseason 543 00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:26,760 Speaker 1: favorite to win the league. Um, and it's again it 544 00:26:27,080 --> 00:26:31,600 Speaker 1: does follow the Tim Miles. You guys build programs kind 545 00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:36,639 Speaker 1: of over over time. Um, let's let's kind of like 546 00:26:37,040 --> 00:26:40,000 Speaker 1: I'm there, John Tanjit, who I shared the story like 547 00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:44,000 Speaker 1: freshman B team when he's in Omaha as a kid, 548 00:26:44,760 --> 00:26:49,320 Speaker 1: right soccer background, you know, but slowly evolved and then 549 00:26:49,359 --> 00:26:50,720 Speaker 1: I think it was like it was like you guys 550 00:26:50,720 --> 00:26:54,600 Speaker 1: in Uno a right to go, you know, crating sniffed 551 00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:56,439 Speaker 1: a little bit at the end, like you know, he 552 00:26:56,480 --> 00:26:58,240 Speaker 1: had had a huge senior year. But yeah, I mean 553 00:26:58,280 --> 00:26:59,840 Speaker 1: that was it. It was us in you and O 554 00:27:00,080 --> 00:27:02,240 Speaker 1: and we just loved him. We're like, now I don't 555 00:27:02,280 --> 00:27:04,360 Speaker 1: care who's recruiting this guy. We think he can play 556 00:27:04,480 --> 00:27:06,399 Speaker 1: and he's a great kid and he wants to work 557 00:27:06,480 --> 00:27:08,920 Speaker 1: and um yeah, but it was just us And you know, 558 00:27:10,119 --> 00:27:12,520 Speaker 1: it's amazing, like your whole team is. It's just it's 559 00:27:12,560 --> 00:27:16,440 Speaker 1: really an interesting kind of built together. My one thought is, 560 00:27:16,560 --> 00:27:18,159 Speaker 1: you have too many guys. You have a lot of 561 00:27:18,160 --> 00:27:21,960 Speaker 1: guys that can play. We do how do you manage that? 562 00:27:21,960 --> 00:27:23,560 Speaker 1: That's a great question, you know. I think the other 563 00:27:23,600 --> 00:27:24,840 Speaker 1: thing for us is, you know, a lot of these 564 00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:26,879 Speaker 1: guys have got minutes here the first three games, but 565 00:27:26,920 --> 00:27:30,800 Speaker 1: you know Kendall Moore got hurt, so minutes. Yeah, you know, 566 00:27:31,000 --> 00:27:33,399 Speaker 1: now he's gonna come back. And it is I mean, 567 00:27:33,480 --> 00:27:36,120 Speaker 1: I think, like everybody says, it's it's a great problem 568 00:27:36,160 --> 00:27:38,240 Speaker 1: as far as we've got a lot of depth and talent, 569 00:27:38,680 --> 00:27:41,159 Speaker 1: but you know, not everybody's gonna gonna get minutes you 570 00:27:41,200 --> 00:27:43,119 Speaker 1: know the way that they wanted. That's gonna be a 571 00:27:43,119 --> 00:27:45,000 Speaker 1: work in progress for us. As we get through, you know, 572 00:27:45,080 --> 00:27:47,240 Speaker 1: start going through the season here and trying to figure 573 00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:50,680 Speaker 1: out rotations. You know, who plays, who doesn't. It's gonna 574 00:27:50,720 --> 00:27:52,560 Speaker 1: be game the game, maybe a little bit. And I 575 00:27:52,600 --> 00:27:55,280 Speaker 1: know that that's not easy, but something we have to 576 00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:57,919 Speaker 1: buy into as a team. And um, I think you know, 577 00:27:57,960 --> 00:27:59,600 Speaker 1: and like in that game the other night or a 578 00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:02,040 Speaker 1: Robert you were at so kind of gets hurt, David 579 00:28:02,119 --> 00:28:05,200 Speaker 1: Roddy gets hurt. Um, But I thought our depth allowed 580 00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:07,720 Speaker 1: us to play the way that we did, you know, 581 00:28:07,840 --> 00:28:10,879 Speaker 1: that game, and so hopefully you know, game one, the 582 00:28:10,960 --> 00:28:13,119 Speaker 1: players can see it that, Hey, this has got to 583 00:28:13,119 --> 00:28:16,360 Speaker 1: be a strength of ours moving forward, no question. Um. 584 00:28:16,359 --> 00:28:20,240 Speaker 1: You mentioned rebuilding the fan base whatever. Um, it's interesting. 585 00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:22,320 Speaker 1: I love for Collins and I had never been there 586 00:28:22,400 --> 00:28:25,800 Speaker 1: until I think you mentioned that mobile arenas. One of 587 00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:28,280 Speaker 1: it might have been. I don't know if Tim was 588 00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:31,359 Speaker 1: gone then I think Tim was gone. But they had 589 00:28:31,359 --> 00:28:35,400 Speaker 1: a great game against Sandau Stat and Orange out Yeah 590 00:28:35,480 --> 00:28:39,680 Speaker 1: and yes, yes, and um, and so I like, I've 591 00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:42,520 Speaker 1: seen it and there's a lot of stillwater to it, right, 592 00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:45,080 Speaker 1: there's a lot of college town America. It's like do 593 00:28:45,240 --> 00:28:48,520 Speaker 1: water with mountains. It's beautiful. Um, But how do you 594 00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:52,720 Speaker 1: what do you personally do? Like, are you at about town? Guy? 595 00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:55,440 Speaker 1: You just do your deal? Like what is the secret 596 00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:58,840 Speaker 1: to building the connection between the community and the and 597 00:28:58,880 --> 00:29:01,520 Speaker 1: the school of the team. I always tell people, I said, 598 00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:03,720 Speaker 1: you know, if you want people to invest, you have 599 00:29:03,840 --> 00:29:06,400 Speaker 1: to connect. I think you get investment through connection. And 600 00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:08,360 Speaker 1: I think that some of those things are organic. I 601 00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:10,920 Speaker 1: am in a round town, guy. Um, we've we've more 602 00:29:10,960 --> 00:29:14,520 Speaker 1: than tripled membership in our our our round ball club, 603 00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:17,240 Speaker 1: our booster club here, fundraising has gone through the roof. 604 00:29:17,920 --> 00:29:20,160 Speaker 1: My staff is the same way, our players are the 605 00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:23,120 Speaker 1: same way, you know, being really intentional about being welcoming 606 00:29:23,280 --> 00:29:25,440 Speaker 1: anyone who wants to come to a practice, bring their 607 00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:28,320 Speaker 1: kids to practice, do whatever. We We have an open 608 00:29:28,360 --> 00:29:31,560 Speaker 1: door policy that way. And I think over time, guys 609 00:29:31,600 --> 00:29:34,120 Speaker 1: get to people get to know you, Um, they get 610 00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:36,800 Speaker 1: to know your players. Um, they like what you're doing. 611 00:29:36,800 --> 00:29:39,239 Speaker 1: They're people that they want to cheer for. And this 612 00:29:39,280 --> 00:29:41,320 Speaker 1: town will support it. And I think you saw that 613 00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:43,520 Speaker 1: on opening night. I mean, we had a great crowd, 614 00:29:43,640 --> 00:29:46,000 Speaker 1: you know for Oral Roberts. And we came out the 615 00:29:46,040 --> 00:29:48,680 Speaker 1: next night again Arkansas Pine Bluff. The student section was 616 00:29:48,720 --> 00:29:52,000 Speaker 1: packed again, and so I think over time those things 617 00:29:52,000 --> 00:29:53,920 Speaker 1: that both and honestly, Doug, it had not been for 618 00:29:53,960 --> 00:29:55,600 Speaker 1: COVID last year, I think we would have had great 619 00:29:55,600 --> 00:29:58,320 Speaker 1: crowds last season two. And so I do think you 620 00:29:58,360 --> 00:30:01,000 Speaker 1: have to be intentional about that it. I think people 621 00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:03,800 Speaker 1: can sense that you're genuine, that you really care. You 622 00:30:03,840 --> 00:30:05,800 Speaker 1: want to put a product out there that people can 623 00:30:05,880 --> 00:30:08,160 Speaker 1: can cheer for, and and that's what we're doing and 624 00:30:08,200 --> 00:30:10,840 Speaker 1: hopefully that continues to allow us to have great crowds 625 00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:13,040 Speaker 1: this year because Mostly is a tough place to play 626 00:30:13,080 --> 00:30:16,400 Speaker 1: when it's packed. It's absolutely, I mean most any place 627 00:30:16,480 --> 00:30:18,720 Speaker 1: is tough on us packed, right, But you know you've 628 00:30:18,720 --> 00:30:21,040 Speaker 1: got some altitude working for you too. You have got 629 00:30:21,040 --> 00:30:24,520 Speaker 1: a lot of a lot of things you're you're working. Um, okay, 630 00:30:24,560 --> 00:30:30,440 Speaker 1: here's our question. Tim leaves and takes Nebraska and you know, 631 00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:33,840 Speaker 1: retirement type money. But it is one of those like 632 00:30:34,080 --> 00:30:36,480 Speaker 1: look sometimes to lead. You know, you don't leave the 633 00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:39,560 Speaker 1: best job in your league for the middle of the 634 00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:42,800 Speaker 1: road job. And they've got great facilities and they wanted 635 00:30:42,840 --> 00:30:45,960 Speaker 1: to work, they just didn't work long term. Is that 636 00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:50,160 Speaker 1: a warning sign to coaches like yourself who have it 637 00:30:50,240 --> 00:30:53,960 Speaker 1: going perfectly happy, but at some point in time, somebody's 638 00:30:53,960 --> 00:30:55,440 Speaker 1: gonna throw a lot of money at you to go 639 00:30:55,480 --> 00:30:57,320 Speaker 1: and fix their program the way you fixed helor out 640 00:30:57,360 --> 00:31:00,080 Speaker 1: of state. Yeah, I mean, I you know, I I 641 00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:03,440 Speaker 1: think you make a great point. It's it's why I messed. 642 00:31:03,440 --> 00:31:05,240 Speaker 1: I mean, I came here for a reason. You know 643 00:31:05,360 --> 00:31:07,640 Speaker 1: why why I messed with Happy. I I feel like 644 00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:10,000 Speaker 1: we can win here. We can recruit the right kinds 645 00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:12,720 Speaker 1: of players. We love living here, we love our staff, 646 00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:17,520 Speaker 1: and you know, I I really am envious of coaches 647 00:31:17,560 --> 00:31:19,400 Speaker 1: when I look around that are able to go to 648 00:31:19,440 --> 00:31:22,640 Speaker 1: a place and have long term success, um, and to 649 00:31:22,760 --> 00:31:25,200 Speaker 1: be there and to really establish their you know, a 650 00:31:25,280 --> 00:31:29,160 Speaker 1: culture and identity, UM, their family becomes you know, entrenched 651 00:31:29,200 --> 00:31:32,160 Speaker 1: in the community. And I love what we're doing here, 652 00:31:32,160 --> 00:31:36,120 Speaker 1: and I feel like you can really build a big 653 00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:39,440 Speaker 1: time winner here, in a consistent winner, and UM, you know, 654 00:31:39,480 --> 00:31:41,160 Speaker 1: it's it's no different, you know than some of the 655 00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:45,360 Speaker 1: transfer stuff, and UM, you know, every situation is different. 656 00:31:45,400 --> 00:31:48,240 Speaker 1: Things change so quickly in this business, Doug. It's crazy. 657 00:31:48,280 --> 00:31:51,120 Speaker 1: I've never seen a time where college athletics has changed 658 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:52,800 Speaker 1: more in the last two to three years, and it 659 00:31:52,800 --> 00:31:55,480 Speaker 1: has now and so you never know what tomorrow brings. 660 00:31:55,520 --> 00:31:58,320 Speaker 1: But I agree with you. I think that sometimes if 661 00:31:58,320 --> 00:32:02,120 Speaker 1: you feel like you can win someplace and you're happy, 662 00:32:02,280 --> 00:32:04,480 Speaker 1: that's a hard thing to mess with. No, i'man I 663 00:32:04,520 --> 00:32:06,520 Speaker 1: can tell you that my own perfect professional career that 664 00:32:06,600 --> 00:32:10,480 Speaker 1: you know, messing with happy is is a very dangerous thing. 665 00:32:10,560 --> 00:32:11,760 Speaker 1: And then you go and you're like, man, I wish 666 00:32:11,800 --> 00:32:14,120 Speaker 1: I had that back like you had it and you 667 00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:18,160 Speaker 1: don't have it anymore. Um, okay. Part of being in 668 00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:21,320 Speaker 1: the Upper Midwest, part of being in for Collins, is 669 00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:24,840 Speaker 1: given me a lot of driving. Right, you can can 670 00:32:25,000 --> 00:32:27,320 Speaker 1: drive to Denver when you want to fly, it's gonna 671 00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:29,200 Speaker 1: be a lot of driving in terms of going. What 672 00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:31,760 Speaker 1: what do you like on the road and you're driving, 673 00:32:31,800 --> 00:32:34,440 Speaker 1: you're recruiting. You always want to have somebody with you? 674 00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:36,800 Speaker 1: You always want to be by yourself. Are you always 675 00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:40,520 Speaker 1: a phone guy? Are you a podcast guy? You don't 676 00:32:40,520 --> 00:32:44,040 Speaker 1: have to what what do you like? Love podcasts? You know, 677 00:32:44,080 --> 00:32:47,120 Speaker 1: I'll listen to your podcasting. Podcasts are are are the thing? 678 00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:49,239 Speaker 1: You know? People you like to read books. It's hard 679 00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:51,240 Speaker 1: to find time to read books the way that you want, 680 00:32:51,240 --> 00:32:53,560 Speaker 1: but you can always have you know, your truck lined 681 00:32:53,640 --> 00:32:56,120 Speaker 1: up with podcasts. You know, airplanes you can listen to 682 00:32:56,200 --> 00:32:59,040 Speaker 1: so many interesting people and things. I think that's an 683 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:02,440 Speaker 1: awesome deal. But Doug, really you think about it, Probably 684 00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:05,520 Speaker 1: the biggest challenge of our job is, Okay, you've got Denver, 685 00:33:05,600 --> 00:33:08,080 Speaker 1: you've got Colorado. There's a few guys you can recruit here. 686 00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:09,880 Speaker 1: But from where I sit in my office, if I 687 00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:12,240 Speaker 1: get in the car and drive five hours any direction, 688 00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:15,160 Speaker 1: I'm in the middle of nowhere. So so you're on 689 00:33:15,240 --> 00:33:17,800 Speaker 1: airplanes all the time recruiting here there. There isn't that 690 00:33:17,800 --> 00:33:20,360 Speaker 1: place where you know, you don't have as many unofficial 691 00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:23,200 Speaker 1: visits here because you don't have all these metropolitan areas 692 00:33:23,280 --> 00:33:25,320 Speaker 1: that guys can drive in here, So you're always on 693 00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:28,280 Speaker 1: an airplane. So you have to be really intentional about 694 00:33:28,360 --> 00:33:30,800 Speaker 1: where you go recruit, where you spend your time and 695 00:33:30,840 --> 00:33:35,080 Speaker 1: your resources. And so when we go out, we're on airplanes. Um, 696 00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:37,320 Speaker 1: and we found you know, we recruit the Midwest, we 697 00:33:37,400 --> 00:33:40,239 Speaker 1: recruit out West. Texas has been really good to us 698 00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:43,280 Speaker 1: do a little bit of stuff internationally, but we got 699 00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:45,200 Speaker 1: to be careful not to get spread out too thin 700 00:33:45,320 --> 00:33:48,320 Speaker 1: in my opinion, But um, I like, I don't mind. 701 00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:49,960 Speaker 1: I'll do it either way. I'll go by myself. And 702 00:33:50,080 --> 00:33:52,240 Speaker 1: like going with our staff. But I think what we 703 00:33:52,320 --> 00:33:54,720 Speaker 1: try to do is be really intentional about the guys 704 00:33:54,760 --> 00:33:57,560 Speaker 1: that we like and really infest in those guys. And 705 00:33:57,560 --> 00:34:00,280 Speaker 1: and uh um, that's what we do. Because you're on 706 00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:02,240 Speaker 1: an airplane all the time and you're trying to spin 707 00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:05,720 Speaker 1: your wheels too many directions. Uh, that's gonna be a problem. 708 00:34:05,920 --> 00:34:07,800 Speaker 1: Give me a guy, Give me one who got away. 709 00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:10,200 Speaker 1: The kid that you thought you were gonna get you 710 00:34:10,239 --> 00:34:12,240 Speaker 1: didn't get, turned out to be a really good player. 711 00:34:12,320 --> 00:34:15,279 Speaker 1: And man, I thought I had him. You know, I 712 00:34:15,719 --> 00:34:18,279 Speaker 1: remember the one. I remember my last year here at 713 00:34:18,280 --> 00:34:20,680 Speaker 1: Colorado State when I was an assistant and we were 714 00:34:20,760 --> 00:34:23,680 Speaker 1: up in uh um, Illinois. We recruiting a kid named 715 00:34:23,680 --> 00:34:27,040 Speaker 1: Ben Moore um and he Ben Moore ended up playing 716 00:34:27,080 --> 00:34:29,160 Speaker 1: with the Pacers a little bit in the NBA. But anyway, 717 00:34:29,320 --> 00:34:32,399 Speaker 1: I was at Larry Stage, had time Larry Brown's at SMU. 718 00:34:32,560 --> 00:34:34,399 Speaker 1: This kid started to get everyone in the Big ten 719 00:34:34,480 --> 00:34:37,280 Speaker 1: recruiting him. But it came down to Larry Brown, Larry Stage, 720 00:34:37,320 --> 00:34:41,200 Speaker 1: she myself and and Um and those guys, and I 721 00:34:41,239 --> 00:34:43,840 Speaker 1: mean we took God, we went out there, you know, 722 00:34:44,000 --> 00:34:47,480 Speaker 1: six seven times, a private plane, the whole deal. And 723 00:34:47,520 --> 00:34:49,319 Speaker 1: I thought we were getting this kid. We thought he 724 00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:50,759 Speaker 1: was gonna be great, and end up he ended up 725 00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:53,960 Speaker 1: going to s m U UM had had a great 726 00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:57,000 Speaker 1: career there um for Larry Brown and ended up playing 727 00:34:57,000 --> 00:34:58,960 Speaker 1: in the league for a little bit. And that was 728 00:34:59,000 --> 00:35:01,120 Speaker 1: a guy that I really thought we were gonna beat 729 00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:03,239 Speaker 1: all these people and get and he went on to 730 00:35:03,280 --> 00:35:05,480 Speaker 1: have a great, great career and he's a great dude. 731 00:35:05,480 --> 00:35:08,200 Speaker 1: And there's so many that that get away. It's funny though. 732 00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:10,759 Speaker 1: I remember John Beeline always told me this, and it's true. 733 00:35:10,800 --> 00:35:12,839 Speaker 1: It's like, you know what, because Niko, I never worried 734 00:35:12,840 --> 00:35:15,120 Speaker 1: about who we didn't get, you know, I just never worried. 735 00:35:15,160 --> 00:35:17,960 Speaker 1: I only worried about who who who we got? And Um, 736 00:35:18,000 --> 00:35:20,560 Speaker 1: sometimes no matter how hard you recruited, guy I just 737 00:35:20,600 --> 00:35:22,120 Speaker 1: doesn't want to come to your place. He wants to 738 00:35:22,160 --> 00:35:24,120 Speaker 1: go someplace else. So what do you do? All right, 739 00:35:24,160 --> 00:35:26,880 Speaker 1: should give me a guy who you had to be 740 00:35:26,920 --> 00:35:30,960 Speaker 1: convinced of mice by some of your staff. And he 741 00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:33,920 Speaker 1: shows up and you're like, I had no idea. This 742 00:35:34,000 --> 00:35:37,080 Speaker 1: kid's way better than I thought. That's a that's a 743 00:35:37,120 --> 00:35:39,239 Speaker 1: great one too. We had a kid at we had 744 00:35:39,239 --> 00:35:41,799 Speaker 1: a kid at Ferman. We recruited Devin Sibley. He ended 745 00:35:41,840 --> 00:35:44,160 Speaker 1: up being freshman of the year. Uh, he was player 746 00:35:44,160 --> 00:35:45,799 Speaker 1: of the year as a junior. And we went up 747 00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:48,680 Speaker 1: to Knoxville and nobody was recruited. And I remember watching 748 00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:51,279 Speaker 1: this kid and he was a little aloof kind of 749 00:35:51,360 --> 00:35:53,719 Speaker 1: and you know, Bob Ritchie is the assistant, you know, 750 00:35:53,760 --> 00:35:56,319 Speaker 1: the head coach at ferman now was my my assistant there, 751 00:35:56,360 --> 00:35:59,160 Speaker 1: and uh kind of legiment. I grew to like him, 752 00:35:59,160 --> 00:36:01,239 Speaker 1: but at first I'm like, man, I don't know, is 753 00:36:01,239 --> 00:36:03,920 Speaker 1: that my personality? And when we got him his freshman year, 754 00:36:03,920 --> 00:36:06,520 Speaker 1: in his first five or six games, he was so awful, 755 00:36:06,640 --> 00:36:09,359 Speaker 1: I mean just and then Cheris Hackey turned it out 756 00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:10,880 Speaker 1: and he end up being Freshman in the year in 757 00:36:10,920 --> 00:36:13,279 Speaker 1: the league. And so those guys maybe had to sell 758 00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:15,560 Speaker 1: me a little bit. But I'll tell you what, we 759 00:36:15,600 --> 00:36:18,880 Speaker 1: wouldn't have one the way we did without him. Um, 760 00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:21,719 Speaker 1: you mentioned Larry Stacey, you work for He he had 761 00:36:21,760 --> 00:36:25,040 Speaker 1: some there's something very basketball coach. Now. He used to 762 00:36:25,080 --> 00:36:27,600 Speaker 1: squeeze ball screens right like you you push up and 763 00:36:27,640 --> 00:36:30,799 Speaker 1: go under yep to under. It's called two under yep. 764 00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:33,800 Speaker 1: I No one does that, and I think it's because 765 00:36:33,840 --> 00:36:36,240 Speaker 1: it's almost impossible to now. I know guys have greater 766 00:36:36,360 --> 00:36:38,600 Speaker 1: range now, but you're still if you do it right, 767 00:36:38,640 --> 00:36:41,080 Speaker 1: you're shooting over the big guy who's sit in the 768 00:36:41,120 --> 00:36:44,400 Speaker 1: ball screen, and like you're shooting over bodies. It's still 769 00:36:44,719 --> 00:36:46,719 Speaker 1: it's a difficult shot. But how come no one plays 770 00:36:46,760 --> 00:36:49,719 Speaker 1: that way? Um? I mean, that's a great question. I 771 00:36:49,800 --> 00:36:52,160 Speaker 1: think people are running more ball screens on the move 772 00:36:52,280 --> 00:36:54,879 Speaker 1: and screening into ball screens. That sometimes makes it harder 773 00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:57,759 Speaker 1: for the bag to get up and to under and attached. 774 00:36:58,040 --> 00:36:59,960 Speaker 1: I do agree with you. I think what I always 775 00:37:00,040 --> 00:37:03,120 Speaker 1: remember about that year though, Um, we come in here 776 00:37:03,120 --> 00:37:04,920 Speaker 1: and I'm of the game is I still talked to 777 00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:07,920 Speaker 1: Alford about it. But we have to beat New Mexico 778 00:37:08,080 --> 00:37:10,880 Speaker 1: at home to win the regular season Mountain West championship 779 00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:13,920 Speaker 1: outright in Colorado. State's never won the regular season Mountain 780 00:37:13,960 --> 00:37:16,840 Speaker 1: West since they've been in the league. Here, and we 781 00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:20,920 Speaker 1: go in there and Kendall Williams makes ten freaking threes 782 00:37:21,040 --> 00:37:25,360 Speaker 1: against us, and seven of them were behind the ball screen, 783 00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:28,680 Speaker 1: and and Larry's that's one of the beauty, beautiful things 784 00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:30,239 Speaker 1: about Larry. It's like, no, we're not gonna just we're 785 00:37:30,239 --> 00:37:32,400 Speaker 1: gonna do what we do better. Um, but he just 786 00:37:32,480 --> 00:37:34,919 Speaker 1: kept making it. He made ten freaking threes that game, 787 00:37:35,000 --> 00:37:37,400 Speaker 1: and we end up losing, right, you know at the buzzer, 788 00:37:37,680 --> 00:37:40,879 Speaker 1: you know down there cost us the Mountain West championship. Um. 789 00:37:41,239 --> 00:37:43,560 Speaker 1: And I mean maybe we just should have switched or 790 00:37:43,840 --> 00:37:48,279 Speaker 1: done something there in the last But once you get 791 00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:51,640 Speaker 1: to seven, well let's do yeah. But but you're right. 792 00:37:51,719 --> 00:37:53,520 Speaker 1: For most of the year, I thought that was really 793 00:37:53,560 --> 00:37:56,520 Speaker 1: effective for us, you know, making people shoot threes off 794 00:37:56,520 --> 00:37:58,719 Speaker 1: the dribble or shoot shots off the dribble. Kids are 795 00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:01,040 Speaker 1: better at that now than they were probably even back then. 796 00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:03,719 Speaker 1: They practice that all the time. That's the other thing. Um, 797 00:38:03,840 --> 00:38:06,919 Speaker 1: kids are really good at shooting off the dribble. Um. Well, 798 00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:09,279 Speaker 1: he he always had guy sprint to the paint right 799 00:38:09,360 --> 00:38:12,120 Speaker 1: and so and so one of the things you could 800 00:38:12,160 --> 00:38:14,160 Speaker 1: do against his team if you if you got them 801 00:38:14,280 --> 00:38:16,520 Speaker 1: off the court, you could get quick threes in transition. 802 00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:18,719 Speaker 1: And then of course you also you know, squeeze under 803 00:38:18,760 --> 00:38:21,160 Speaker 1: those two on the ball screen. So there was you know, 804 00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:23,520 Speaker 1: and and a lot of that is stuff is stuff 805 00:38:23,560 --> 00:38:25,279 Speaker 1: has changed. And as you are you playing all right, 806 00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:28,880 Speaker 1: last thing, what would it mean to you to be 807 00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:31,520 Speaker 1: the guy that could win that Matt like you've been. 808 00:38:31,680 --> 00:38:34,720 Speaker 1: You've been there with Tim, You've been there with Larry. 809 00:38:35,160 --> 00:38:37,680 Speaker 1: You're there. I mean this is almost twenty years now, 810 00:38:38,160 --> 00:38:41,279 Speaker 1: a span your fifteen years whatever at the school oh 811 00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:45,879 Speaker 1: seven two two right with Furman and Drake in the middle. Um, 812 00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:48,040 Speaker 1: what would mean to be that guy and have this 813 00:38:48,080 --> 00:38:51,360 Speaker 1: team win the Mountain? West Man, I'll tell you what 814 00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:54,719 Speaker 1: like it just you feel not so much for me. 815 00:38:55,239 --> 00:38:58,040 Speaker 1: It's just the players who believed in us, you know, 816 00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:00,560 Speaker 1: the vision to come here and be where we are 817 00:39:00,680 --> 00:39:02,640 Speaker 1: right now, when we were you know, very good when 818 00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:05,560 Speaker 1: we recruited him. All the people here in this community 819 00:39:05,640 --> 00:39:09,359 Speaker 1: I know who've been CSU fans forever. Um, you know, 820 00:39:09,440 --> 00:39:12,359 Speaker 1: people who believe in your hiring you. It would mean 821 00:39:12,400 --> 00:39:15,320 Speaker 1: the world to do something that nobody's ever done before 822 00:39:15,320 --> 00:39:17,480 Speaker 1: because they can never take that away from you, you know. 823 00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:19,960 Speaker 1: And that's that's a beautiful thing about a legacy like 824 00:39:20,000 --> 00:39:23,120 Speaker 1: your players, and Um, if you're able to do something 825 00:39:23,160 --> 00:39:26,399 Speaker 1: like that, you've got that banner up there. Um, those 826 00:39:26,400 --> 00:39:28,680 Speaker 1: guys can go there twenty thirty years from now their 827 00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:31,359 Speaker 1: family and nobody can ever take that, you know, from them. 828 00:39:31,400 --> 00:39:33,839 Speaker 1: And so that would mean the world. But as you know, 829 00:39:34,280 --> 00:39:36,640 Speaker 1: I mean great, we're picked to win the league. The 830 00:39:36,640 --> 00:39:40,600 Speaker 1: only happier person is Dutch, right, like Dutch and offered 831 00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:43,120 Speaker 1: you know what I mean? Like and uh, we do 832 00:39:43,200 --> 00:39:45,680 Speaker 1: all hard. This league is gonna be There's so many teams, 833 00:39:45,920 --> 00:39:48,319 Speaker 1: um that could win this thing. The depth is great. 834 00:39:48,320 --> 00:39:50,480 Speaker 1: You've got to stay healthy, Um, you gotta with The 835 00:39:50,600 --> 00:39:52,680 Speaker 1: margins are so small. It's gonna come down to a 836 00:39:52,719 --> 00:39:55,239 Speaker 1: few games. But I like our team. If we can 837 00:39:55,280 --> 00:39:57,120 Speaker 1: stay healthy, I feel like we can compete. But I 838 00:39:57,160 --> 00:39:58,919 Speaker 1: know there's a lot of teams that feel the same way. 839 00:40:00,000 --> 00:40:01,879 Speaker 1: You've been more than generous with your time and how 840 00:40:01,880 --> 00:40:04,480 Speaker 1: busy you are. And what was it that you want 841 00:40:04,480 --> 00:40:07,040 Speaker 1: to You're talking about players that you want to that focus? 842 00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:09,680 Speaker 1: Was that your intention? Right? You want to like set? 843 00:40:09,680 --> 00:40:12,480 Speaker 1: You're a big set? Your intention? That right? So what 844 00:40:12,680 --> 00:40:15,800 Speaker 1: you it is a Monday morning? What is your intention? 845 00:40:15,880 --> 00:40:17,600 Speaker 1: Do you have to do? You have an intention for today? 846 00:40:17,640 --> 00:40:19,920 Speaker 1: What is your intention for the day? Attention? Today? We 847 00:40:19,960 --> 00:40:21,880 Speaker 1: finally have a day off. We had just played you know, 848 00:40:21,960 --> 00:40:23,799 Speaker 1: three two and under forty hours. We have a day 849 00:40:23,800 --> 00:40:25,920 Speaker 1: off today, will leave tomorrow to start to travel to 850 00:40:25,960 --> 00:40:28,600 Speaker 1: the Virgin Islands. Today is more about these guys, the 851 00:40:28,640 --> 00:40:31,920 Speaker 1: intention of will start. I'll start turning my attention to Bradley. UM. 852 00:40:31,920 --> 00:40:33,680 Speaker 1: We're gonna meet here as the staff a little bit 853 00:40:33,719 --> 00:40:36,359 Speaker 1: and start to start to do that. UM. And then 854 00:40:36,400 --> 00:40:39,000 Speaker 1: for our guys, it's just the intention is to manage 855 00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:41,320 Speaker 1: your academics, to take care of your your things. We 856 00:40:41,400 --> 00:40:43,640 Speaker 1: got to fill out a travel portal thing to get 857 00:40:43,640 --> 00:40:45,680 Speaker 1: to the Virgin Islands. But try to take care of 858 00:40:45,719 --> 00:40:47,799 Speaker 1: all the for the players, all the off the court 859 00:40:47,880 --> 00:40:50,640 Speaker 1: stuff today. To to make sure your business is taken 860 00:40:50,640 --> 00:40:53,680 Speaker 1: care of. So we show up tomorrow morning, uh to 861 00:40:53,719 --> 00:40:55,359 Speaker 1: get in the weight room a little bit and watch 862 00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:57,440 Speaker 1: a little bit of film before we get on that plane. 863 00:40:57,520 --> 00:40:59,560 Speaker 1: But for me as a staff, it's to turn our 864 00:40:59,560 --> 00:41:02,319 Speaker 1: attention into uh to Bradley. And that's what I'll do 865 00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:06,520 Speaker 1: next year. Well, listen, it's a trip well deserved to 866 00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:08,960 Speaker 1: the version and some of these kids who's traveled right 867 00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:11,480 Speaker 1: in the last year and after years two years, So 868 00:41:11,719 --> 00:41:15,160 Speaker 1: enjoy it, be safe, bring home a championship. And I 869 00:41:15,200 --> 00:41:18,399 Speaker 1: really appreciate your time. Appreciate you man. You are great 870 00:41:18,440 --> 00:41:23,080 Speaker 1: at what you do. Thanks Nico, we'll talk soon. Thanks. Yeah, 871 00:41:24,520 --> 00:41:26,759 Speaker 1: that was that was great. It was really interesting. I 872 00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:29,360 Speaker 1: love people's journeys. I like his team a lot. Do 873 00:41:29,520 --> 00:41:32,280 Speaker 1: I think they have NBA players, I don't. I think 874 00:41:32,480 --> 00:41:35,359 Speaker 1: the Mountain West this year is still in kind of transition. 875 00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:39,239 Speaker 1: Obviously New Mexico is going to be, you know, a 876 00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:41,920 Speaker 1: year away. I would say un l V kind of 877 00:41:42,000 --> 00:41:44,719 Speaker 1: same thing when that league gets going, if New Mexico 878 00:41:45,600 --> 00:41:48,000 Speaker 1: and U and l V. If ul V has pros 879 00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:49,759 Speaker 1: and New Mexico has a good team and it's a 880 00:41:49,840 --> 00:41:53,279 Speaker 1: great home court advantage. State know he lose three three 881 00:41:53,320 --> 00:41:55,360 Speaker 1: thousand points. Course believe he's gonna be a little bit 882 00:41:55,400 --> 00:41:58,240 Speaker 1: down this year, but I think it's like a year away. 883 00:41:58,400 --> 00:42:01,520 Speaker 1: It feels like the Mountain West. If anybody remembers when 884 00:42:01,520 --> 00:42:04,279 Speaker 1: the SEC started to really pay some money and open 885 00:42:04,320 --> 00:42:07,040 Speaker 1: some new rangs and Bruce Purl comes in and um 886 00:42:07,120 --> 00:42:09,880 Speaker 1: Yuko to Tennessee has has done you know, you change 887 00:42:09,920 --> 00:42:11,640 Speaker 1: coaches and you get some of the guys that have 888 00:42:11,719 --> 00:42:15,120 Speaker 1: done it multiple places, and you really invest. It took 889 00:42:15,160 --> 00:42:18,080 Speaker 1: a couple of years before the SEC started to pump 890 00:42:18,080 --> 00:42:22,200 Speaker 1: out a depth of high quality teams. The WCC has 891 00:42:22,239 --> 00:42:24,680 Speaker 1: done the same. I think that's where the Mountain West is. 892 00:42:24,880 --> 00:42:26,759 Speaker 1: I think Brian Dutcher's got that thing rolling. I think 893 00:42:26,800 --> 00:42:28,560 Speaker 1: they'll be good. You just you lost a lot of 894 00:42:28,560 --> 00:42:31,839 Speaker 1: scoring from last year. Um New Mexico, I think Richard 895 00:42:31,840 --> 00:42:34,080 Speaker 1: Partino is gonna be great, it's probably a year away. 896 00:42:34,160 --> 00:42:36,239 Speaker 1: I think Kevin Krueger is gonna do great. I think 897 00:42:36,239 --> 00:42:40,399 Speaker 1: it's probably a year away. Meanwhile, Colorado State, I think 898 00:42:40,440 --> 00:42:43,080 Speaker 1: boys is better than they played, and I think the 899 00:42:43,120 --> 00:42:47,280 Speaker 1: rest of that league will be even better. The second 900 00:42:47,480 --> 00:42:50,320 Speaker 1: that those core teams New Mexico, you and l V 901 00:42:50,400 --> 00:42:53,040 Speaker 1: and Danny State are all rolling, and I think New 902 00:42:53,080 --> 00:42:56,120 Speaker 1: Mexico and U and l V are a year away. 903 00:42:56,320 --> 00:42:57,640 Speaker 1: I'm done, Gottlie. This is all