Speaker 1: The following here's a production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com
Speaker 1: and the Dallas Cowboys Football Club. Cowboys, Let's go. Are
Speaker 1: you ready for a break? Yes? Are you ready for
Speaker 1: a break? Absolutely? Ready for a break? Yeah? And so
Speaker 1: much for that. It's time for The Break on Dallas
Speaker 1: Cowboys dot Com with Nick Eatman, David Hellman, and bar
Speaker 1: Garcia and Derek Eagleton this Wednesday, May fourth, two thousand
Speaker 1: and twenty two, Seasons eighteen, Episode number seven. Welcome to
Speaker 1: the latest edition of The Break. We are fresh off
Speaker 1: the twenty twenty two NFL Draft, so we've got a
Speaker 1: full show of opinions and thoughts coming out of that draft,
Speaker 1: and a lot to talk about a lot of picks
Speaker 1: for the Cowboys. A lot of different people have different opinions,
Speaker 1: so we'll get these guys a pain to get them
Speaker 1: on the red. Tyler Smith taught us that absolutely and
Speaker 1: it can be on a lot all the way across
Speaker 1: the spectrum, right from great pick to not so great pick.
Speaker 1: All right, so let's actually do that. Let's start first
Speaker 1: with Tyler Smith. He was the Cowboys first round pick,
Speaker 1: number twenty four overall. Obviously, there's some people out there,
Speaker 1: I think it was a reach. Others think it was
Speaker 1: a great pick. Let's go around the table. What were
Speaker 1: your thoughts on the first pick? Nic, We'll start with
Speaker 1: you today. I thought it was the It filled their
Speaker 1: need and it was their best player on their board
Speaker 1: to fill a need. So I think when that happened,
Speaker 1: I mean they maybe they would have taken other guards,
Speaker 1: but this guy could come in. He can play guard,
Speaker 1: and I think if he just plays guard and starts,
Speaker 1: I think this is what I wrote yesterday. I think
Speaker 1: he would be a solid pick if he comes in
Speaker 1: and plays just like Connor Williams. If he's better than that,
Speaker 1: it's a really good guard. I think it's gonna be
Speaker 1: a good pick. If he eventually goes to tackle, I
Speaker 1: think it's a great pick. Well, you know, my initial
Speaker 1: thought was like who is this guy? You know, I'm
Speaker 1: having to look up pictures, look up for highlights and
Speaker 1: put all this content out, and when you're having a
Speaker 1: hard time finding anything content wise, you're like, Okay, well
Speaker 1: then he's not that great. That's what your initial assumption is.
Speaker 1: So after looking more, like reading more about him, looking
Speaker 1: at footage and all that. One of the things that
Speaker 1: I think most people like at this point is his size,
Speaker 1: how big he is, how heavy he is. He has
Speaker 1: the size that they kind of need in the old line.
Speaker 1: One of my biggest concerns, and it's been brought up
Speaker 1: to everybody's attention, the penalties, you know him, the holding penalties.
Speaker 1: And my thing is like, what do you do when
Speaker 1: you bring in a player like that that you say, okay,
Speaker 1: well you can teach that, you can improve that. But
Speaker 1: when you look at the track wrecker so far that
Speaker 1: you've had players like Connor Williams, a veteran guy, You've
Speaker 1: had Lyle Collins, You've had even Tyrn Smith having holding calls.
Speaker 1: So when it's really like a problem on its own here,
Speaker 1: it makes me wonder how he's actually going to be
Speaker 1: able to improve in that aspect and be able to
Speaker 1: contribute as much as he can on the field without
Speaker 1: creating additional problems that the Cowboys already have to deal with.
Speaker 1: I think what I've settled on is I believe two
Speaker 1: things at the same time, which like kind of what
Speaker 1: you just said, I mean, I knew who Tyler Smith was.
Speaker 1: I knew that he was an O line prospect that
Speaker 1: might go in the back half of the first round,
Speaker 1: but I didn't know a ton about him, to be
Speaker 1: perfectly blunt, like he was not a name that we
Speaker 1: got two two in depth with on the Draft show.
Speaker 1: I think the Cowboys did a better job than usual
Speaker 1: of kind of hiding him from us, Like he didn't
Speaker 1: come to the facility. He wasn't a Dallas day guy,
Speaker 1: even though he could have been, which is interesting, probably
Speaker 1: on purpose, if I had to guess. So, once I
Speaker 1: really started to dive into who he was, I was like,
Speaker 1: I see the I can see the appeal here. Talking
Speaker 1: about a guy that just turned twenty one. He's absolutely enormous.
Speaker 1: He's certainly athletic. He's like a raw piece of clay.
Speaker 1: You know, you can mold him into whoever you want.
Speaker 1: And like Nick said, if you can turn him into
Speaker 1: a franchise left tackle, then this will be incredible value.
Speaker 1: But in the immediate all of that stuff is true
Speaker 1: that I think that there's going to be some work here,
Speaker 1: like I would imagine like this, I think this guy's
Speaker 1: going to have a steeper learning curve than some of
Speaker 1: the other guys we've seen come in like a Zach
Speaker 1: Martin or even like a sounds silly to say about
Speaker 1: a guy that was so young, even a Micah Parsons
Speaker 1: and a CD Lamb, like, I think Tyler Smith is
Speaker 1: good enough to start as a rookie, but I think
Speaker 1: it's optimistic to think that he's going to come in
Speaker 1: and dominate from the get, which he could, and I'll
Speaker 1: eat that crow later. But that's just how I feel
Speaker 1: right now, and so I just have this nagging feeling
Speaker 1: like this looks like it could be a great pick
Speaker 1: in the big picture, but if I'm trying to be
Speaker 1: better in twenty twenty two, we'll see. And so both
Speaker 1: of those things are kind of true at the same time.
Speaker 1: And that's why my overall impression of this draft classes
Speaker 1: I'm like, I like what you're doing, but I don't
Speaker 1: think the team is better for this season after this draft,
Speaker 1: at least not significantly. You know. The one thing I
Speaker 1: will say about that, when you talk about better for
Speaker 1: this season, if I'm making the evaluation on what we
Speaker 1: think Tyler Smith can be this year, and you look
Speaker 1: at the guy that he would have replaced if he's
Speaker 1: at guard, if he's at left guard, and Connor Williams, well,
Speaker 1: I look at that is my biggest problem with Connor Williams.
Speaker 1: Outside of the penalties, which are kind of the same
Speaker 1: thing if you want to just say you kind of
Speaker 1: compare a person to person, the other part to it
Speaker 1: is really just about his ability to move people in
Speaker 1: the run game. I always thought the problem for Connor
Speaker 1: Williams is he just wasn't strong enough in the middle
Speaker 1: of that offensive line to be able to get much push.
Speaker 1: The one thing we know about this guy is he's big,
Speaker 1: he's strong, and he's me. That's what we've been told.
Speaker 1: He plays me and for me. I look at that,
Speaker 1: and I think that gives you an immediate improvement in
Speaker 1: the run game if he is what they say he
Speaker 1: is as of right now. And yeah, there are a
Speaker 1: lot of things are going to have to improve, and
Speaker 1: I think that's really about getting him to tackle. But
Speaker 1: I think at guard, if you're asking him to see
Speaker 1: this guy move this guy, I kind of have some
Speaker 1: optimism that he may be able to do that. I think.
Speaker 1: I mean, I said that at the end of our
Speaker 1: last draft show yesterday, is I'm if I'm looking for
Speaker 1: an optimistic viewpoint on this guy right now. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: think the one thing we know he does great according
Speaker 1: to all the evaluators is run block ninety nine percentile
Speaker 1: according to PFF. Like he can get in there and
Speaker 1: mall and what makes the Cowboys offense as effective as possible,
Speaker 1: generating success in the run game. And that's awesome and
Speaker 1: I hope that works out. I think it has the
Speaker 1: potential too. But you also think a guy playing a
Speaker 1: new position. He was a college tackle, was not a guard,
Speaker 1: and pass pro is a big part of this. We've
Speaker 1: also seen Dak having a guy right on top of
Speaker 1: him in the pocket is a recipe for disaster and
Speaker 1: get you talk about steep learning curve, think about some
Speaker 1: of the guys this guy is going to have to
Speaker 1: go up against. I mean, we know the problems that
Speaker 1: the d tackles in Washington present. We know what Philly
Speaker 1: just did drafting Jordan Davis, Jeffrey Simmons, and Tennessee is
Speaker 1: on the schedule this year, Vita Vea's back on the schedule,
Speaker 1: Aaron Donald's on the schedule. Like that's what When I
Speaker 1: say steve learning curve, I just mean, yes, I think
Speaker 1: this guy can help in the run game. But it's
Speaker 1: a lot to ask for this guy to hit the
Speaker 1: ground running. And so I think that's more of a
Speaker 1: realistic viewpoint, Nick, when we think about an amber had
Speaker 1: mentioned it. But when you look at the penalties, how
Speaker 1: much of a problem do you think that is? Because
Speaker 1: there are a lot of fans out there that that
Speaker 1: was the first thing they read about this guys, he
Speaker 1: has a ton of penalties from last year, Connor Williams,
Speaker 1: one of the reasons fans wanted him out was because
Speaker 1: he had a ton of penalties. What are your thoughts
Speaker 1: on on the penalties? Well, I mean I think that
Speaker 1: you know, certainly something that's an issue because your first
Speaker 1: question is who who in the American Athletic Conference is
Speaker 1: such a badass that you can't walk that you can't
Speaker 1: that you're havn't hold that, you know, you would think
Speaker 1: you would be able to just you know, you know
Speaker 1: stop um. You know, I think if he wanted to
Speaker 1: take the flip side. You know that they play a
Speaker 1: lot of snaps. It plays a lot more snaps. They
Speaker 1: play at a faster pace. To explain it a little
Speaker 1: bit more, because we talked about that, Yeah, the offense
Speaker 1: that Tulsa uses is this you know that high pace
Speaker 1: where they Chris Beam looked it up the other day
Speaker 1: I mean nine hundred and nine snaps when some of
Speaker 1: the other guards were in the seven thirty seven forty range.
Speaker 1: So not only is it a lot of snaps, but
Speaker 1: you're playing a lot of snaps of the same amount
Speaker 1: of game fast race. He's like quick, quick, quick, and
Speaker 1: that's going to lead to some of that. I talked
Speaker 1: to his college coach, Philip Montgomery. He says, yeah, he
Speaker 1: had some problems with his hands outside a little bit.
Speaker 1: He keeps his hands inside and really locks in. He'll
Speaker 1: be fine. He also mentioned and he said, you know,
Speaker 1: he admits he's biased. He said his strength of absolutely
Speaker 1: throwing guys to the ground is what led to almost
Speaker 1: half of the penalties. He said, there's times when that
Speaker 1: is absolutely not a penalty. It was just he just
Speaker 1: crushes this guy to the point where they're like, well
Speaker 1: that that looks like a wrestling move. That's got to
Speaker 1: be a flag. Whether or not that's just coach speak,
Speaker 1: I don't know, but you know, he said that that
Speaker 1: strength kind of leads to some of that. People on
Speaker 1: the personnel side of the building said the same thing
Speaker 1: is like, go actually watch the tape and you will
Speaker 1: see that some of these are like flags. Of domination,
Speaker 1: Like it's it's not a guy reaching for somebody that
Speaker 1: got past him as much as it's like, well, your
Speaker 1: body slammed him, which I mean, it's still penalty. I
Speaker 1: get it. But I think the Cowboys think that they
Speaker 1: can coach that out of him, or at least maybe
Speaker 1: maybe he can get away with it a little bit
Speaker 1: better in the NFL. I mean, if you Tyrn Smith
Speaker 1: has had that problem over the years as well. Jason
Speaker 1: Garrett used to get so mad and be like, you
Speaker 1: tell me where that's a penalty. Tyron Smith has just
Speaker 1: grown manning this guy, and I mean, it is what
Speaker 1: it is. I guess it's still a flag, so it's
Speaker 1: not like you can just write it off as something
Speaker 1: you don't have to work on. But if it's not,
Speaker 1: they're not concerned that he like doesn't have the athleticism
Speaker 1: like he's lunging and grabbing. It's more like if he
Speaker 1: takes Dan killing Pete, If he takes Darn Pain and
Speaker 1: throws him to the ground and gets called for a penalty,
Speaker 1: that to me will be the qu event of one
Speaker 1: of those like goaltending calls when they fly they lay
Speaker 1: it in and you just swatted into the sixth row.
Speaker 1: You can have the two points, but just know it's
Speaker 1: going to be like this all day long, so like
Speaker 1: kind of take that one. I'll take it. Yeah, all right,
Speaker 1: question though, you know we keep talking. He's a tackle,
Speaker 1: he's coming out of a tackle, and he's expected to
Speaker 1: move to guard position. And know a lot of old
Speaker 1: line man have that kind of flexibility where you can
Speaker 1: kind of switch them around a little bit. But I've
Speaker 1: also seen the type of players that they do struggle
Speaker 1: a lot more when you switch them from position to position.
Speaker 1: So are you guys, just Dave Nick like in general,
Speaker 1: kind of expecting that to really be a transition and
Speaker 1: a great learning curve to happen here, or is he
Speaker 1: going to be really a guy that can come in
Speaker 1: and actually help at the guard position right away. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's a bad pick if he doesn't start a guard Honestly,
Speaker 1: let's just people about it. It's a bad pick if
Speaker 1: he's not ready to do that. If he loses the
Speaker 1: job to a guy that got benched last year, that's
Speaker 1: not what you want. UM. But again, you talk about
Speaker 1: the youth and the athleticism and the size, Um, I
Speaker 1: definitely think he has that potential. I do think it's
Speaker 1: a good question because it's like, this kid's twenty one,
Speaker 1: and we feel like this is gonna be a learning
Speaker 1: curve anyway, and now you're going to cross train him
Speaker 1: at both positions. It feels like a lot to ask, um,
Speaker 1: Micah did it, And that's rough. I know, that's rough
Speaker 1: to compare them. That is not a statement I ever
Speaker 1: expect to come from you. Like, that's a really optimistic
Speaker 1: statement when you say, well, Michael did it, Well, yeah,
Speaker 1: he was the best de physic player in the league
Speaker 1: this year. Maybe, but I mean I don't, I don't.
Speaker 1: I mean, they're probably going to need him. Let's be honest.
Speaker 1: It's six years running that Tyrone has been unavailable for
Speaker 1: some reason or another, and they did. They've got Josh
Speaker 1: Ball and they drafted a tackle. I'm sure we'll get
Speaker 1: to it. But again, that's optimistic too. Is like guys
Speaker 1: that have never played in the regular season, So it's
Speaker 1: kind I mean to some degree in the NFL. The
Speaker 1: NFL is kind of about getting thrown in the pool
Speaker 1: at some point, so I mean, it's maybe not it's
Speaker 1: not ideal, yeah, but this happens a lot though, and
Speaker 1: and where the tack. You know, you play tackle in college,
Speaker 1: but he probably could have played guard in college. It's
Speaker 1: just that he's good enough to play left tackle in
Speaker 1: that conference and really in other conferences. If we were
Speaker 1: gonna get down to it, it sounds like that you
Speaker 1: want well, yeah, I mean like fans would have a
Speaker 1: much better feeling about this guy if they knew the
Speaker 1: colleges and the coaches that were calling to get him
Speaker 1: to transfer. Let's be clear, maybe it wasn't the colleges.
Speaker 1: Maybe it's people that represent the colleges, or maybe it
Speaker 1: was people that would just informally in fire. If he
Speaker 1: wanted to go to the transfer portal, he could have
Speaker 1: gone to a lot of schools. And some of these
Speaker 1: schools big times. Some of these schools are are playing
Speaker 1: for national championships every year Texas. Yeah yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: well maybe this year though. So I'm just saying, I
Speaker 1: guess tampering in college football is that a thing? Do
Speaker 1: we have to worry about that? I mean for them,
Speaker 1: I mean now that you got in, now that you
Speaker 1: got in l Yes, I think it is a part
Speaker 1: of it is a part of college. Yeah. I actually
Speaker 1: asked what the rules are, and the rules are you
Speaker 1: cannot contact other players when they are not in the portal,
Speaker 1: but that still happens. You say, I mean I'll pull
Speaker 1: a neck, and so I mean the tide could have
Speaker 1: turned on that guy, could have been a whole different story.
Speaker 1: Here you go. But you know, the other thing to
Speaker 1: think about here, so careful. The other thing to think
Speaker 1: about here is that. And this is my understand you guys,
Speaker 1: tell them if you think I'm wrong on this. But
Speaker 1: to me, it's an easier transition going from tackle to guard.
Speaker 1: If they were saying this year, you had this guy
Speaker 1: that played guard in college, and now we're going to
Speaker 1: move them to tackle in the NFL. Expect him to
Speaker 1: play this year, I would be a lot more like
Speaker 1: an I don't trust that. I think going from tackle
Speaker 1: to guard, though, it's a little easier, especially if you
Speaker 1: got the strength that he has, which is the power,
Speaker 1: Like if you can play if you got the power,
Speaker 1: And I actually think it might help with some of
Speaker 1: the penalties too. When you're in tackle, you're kind of
Speaker 1: out on an island, so sometimes holding can be about
Speaker 1: you kind of get beat, you kind of have to recover.
Speaker 1: You grab a guy guard, you got a little tighter
Speaker 1: box there between the center and the tackle, so there
Speaker 1: isn't as much need necessarily to sometimes whole. So all
Speaker 1: those things being considered, I think the transition's actually easier.
Speaker 1: But let's say let's say you pin him down at
Speaker 1: Guardiams did the same thing. Just throw that out Connord.
Speaker 1: Williams may not be as good a player, I know,
Speaker 1: I maybe, just maybe he's not as good a player
Speaker 1: as guy. Say go ahead. He started he did because
Speaker 1: they had to put him in there. But I was
Speaker 1: just gonna ask, looking at what they currently have right now.
Speaker 1: If you got Tyler Smith pinned down a guard and
Speaker 1: for some reason something happens again and Tyron Smith has
Speaker 1: to come out of the game, who's your guy right now?
Speaker 1: It comes down wonderful question. Sorry, go ahead. It comes
Speaker 1: down to who's better at at your backup option? Is
Speaker 1: Connor McGovern you're better guard? Um then you know, and
Speaker 1: then Tyler Smith can slide out? Or is is Matt
Speaker 1: will Esco or Josh Ball a better option at tackle?
Speaker 1: And are they better than Tyler Smith at tackle as well?
Speaker 1: Which I would hope not, but they might be. There
Speaker 1: isn't an answer to that question right now. There just
Speaker 1: isn't because we I know how good Tyler is. Josh
Speaker 1: Ball played two weeks of training camp football before he
Speaker 1: got hurt and red shirted, and well, let's go to
Speaker 1: a rookie too. I would one of those three because
Speaker 1: Jerry Jones made it perfectly clear that he doesn't think
Speaker 1: they need a veteran tackle, which I thought was interesting. Yeah, actually,
Speaker 1: you know, I was going to talk about that a
Speaker 1: little later, but let's let's talk about that real quick,
Speaker 1: because I do think these conversations go together. Well, let's go.
Speaker 1: Was was drafting fifth round, one hundred and fifty fifth overall,
Speaker 1: And I think the question really is when you start
Speaker 1: looking at these offensive linemen. They threw out those names,
Speaker 1: but they got a lot of young guys, and particularly
Speaker 1: when you start talking about Ball and farniok, and now
Speaker 1: well let's go and even Tyler Smith, none of them
Speaker 1: have really taken snaps, and so they're relying on them.
Speaker 1: Do you think that they will go into this season
Speaker 1: expecting that one of those guys will be their swing tackle,
Speaker 1: knowing that Tyron Smith may not play all the games
Speaker 1: if history holds true. Let's get to oxin Arn't. I mean,
Speaker 1: let's get to that drill where they you know, it's
Speaker 1: just that one on one. Let's see how bad that
Speaker 1: they are there. Let's see either either Chauncey Golston is
Speaker 1: going to be the next LT or you know, these
Speaker 1: guys are awesome or they can't block, you know what
Speaker 1: I mean. Let's figure that out because that's when they'll
Speaker 1: go into it and to the into the season, into
Speaker 1: the heading into the season goal we need a trade
Speaker 1: for a veteran, or we need to add a veteran.
Speaker 1: But I think for now they're gonna they're gonna be optimistic.
Speaker 1: What's that Mike Tyson adage. Everybody's got a plan until
Speaker 1: they get punched in the face, punched in the mouth.
Speaker 1: I mean, that's their plan right now, is for these
Speaker 1: young guys. And from what we hear, like Farnioks working
Speaker 1: a lot at center, like they want competition at the
Speaker 1: center spot. They brought in two undrafted centers, so like
Speaker 1: they're sitting here right now thinking they've got a bunch
Speaker 1: of young guys. They're gonna push for spots. Hopefully that's true,
Speaker 1: but maybe they can maybe Labor Day weekend, we'll be like,
Speaker 1: oh my god, they gotta come on we'll spend send
Speaker 1: a sixth round pick to somebody. I mean, let's say
Speaker 1: that there's there's twenty practices at training camp. I mean,
Speaker 1: how many do we think Tyrant Smith will be playing?
Speaker 1: Practicing ten or less? Hopefully right, So, the left tackle here,
Speaker 1: the backup tackle, is going to get a lot of
Speaker 1: snaps in the in the preseason games and in practice.
Speaker 1: So you know, whoever that is, if it's Wilesco, if
Speaker 1: it's Josh Ball, if it's a combination or both, maybe
Speaker 1: Terrence Steele gets some reps at the left side. So
Speaker 1: and going against one's going against one, yeah, going against
Speaker 1: you know, maybe Micro rushes out of there too. So
Speaker 1: I think I think that whoever it is is going
Speaker 1: to get a lot of work at camp. I bet
Speaker 1: that's a wonderful point. And I mean, maybe Tyler Smith
Speaker 1: is such a stud that he can just kick out
Speaker 1: to tackle and move seamlessly. If not, I wonder if
Speaker 1: they would try to ask Steele to be their emergency
Speaker 1: left tackle and Ball or well, let's go can be
Speaker 1: a right right tackle. Yeah, you know, I actually was
Speaker 1: wondering about that. They made it. They made it sound
Speaker 1: like during the press conference that they were going to
Speaker 1: try to during camp, give him some opportunities to kind
Speaker 1: of flip out to tackle and play some some tackle.
Speaker 1: I don't actually think that's the greatest idea if you
Speaker 1: want to be your starting guard this year. My thought is,
Speaker 1: as a rookie, get let him focus on guard, let
Speaker 1: those other guys look at look at those other guys
Speaker 1: that swing tackles, and give him the opportunity to be
Speaker 1: the best guard he could possibly be. Do you guys
Speaker 1: agree with that? Yes, it's easy to say until DeMarcus
Speaker 1: Lawrence breaks his foot and Randy Gregory gets sick, and
Speaker 1: all of a sudden, you're like, all the week I'm
Speaker 1: making and I'm making a comparison to last year. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and Micah didn't play edge and training camp through, so
Speaker 1: we keep comparing this guy to Mica though I don't
Speaker 1: like that. I'm sorry, I'm not comparing him. I'm saying
Speaker 1: the asks of a guy like this are similar, though.
Speaker 1: I mean, they liked him enough to draft him. There
Speaker 1: were other guys on their board, There were defenders on
Speaker 1: their board they could have taken, and they said this
Speaker 1: is the one. So that comes with a certain degree
Speaker 1: of expectation. But there's also a difference in a guy
Speaker 1: that's drafted what was it thirteen and this guy this
Speaker 1: draft twelve twelve, and guy this draft at twenty four.
Speaker 1: Sorry about you know? I mean Mia Micah had a
Speaker 1: first round grade. Tyler didn't. So I think there's a
Speaker 1: difference between those and what you can expect from them
Speaker 1: coming out. They're not giving the sky a position. By
Speaker 1: the way, this is all projection on our parts, So
Speaker 1: that's how I'm going to operate. I don't I want
Speaker 1: to see what he can do whatever. All right, let's
Speaker 1: take our first break. When we come back, we're gonna
Speaker 1: keep going through this list, get to the second round
Speaker 1: pick Sam Williams slots to talk about there. We'll when
Speaker 1: we come right back. This das Cowboys dot Com Radio.
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Speaker 1: Welcome back, second segment of The Break. Life in the
Speaker 1: SWBC Morgage studios at the Star. We're talking about the
Speaker 1: two twenty two draft Cowboys just finished. Let's get to
Speaker 1: the second round pick. Sam Williams he is an age.
Speaker 1: He was the number fifty six pick. Overall thoughts on
Speaker 1: the pick, Let's start with you, David. I keep saying it,
Speaker 1: and I'm sorry if I'm ever can record if you
Speaker 1: listen to the Draft show, but this, it just reminds
Speaker 1: me of the DeMarcus Lawrence pick. To be honest with you,
Speaker 1: and I know they didn't trade up to get him,
Speaker 1: but I think that they identified him as one of
Speaker 1: a very small number of edges that can do that
Speaker 1: can bend the way they want, plays with the explosiveness
Speaker 1: they want. Is that the old miss Sack record? Um,
Speaker 1: hell like go? I mean that. The cool thing about
Speaker 1: Sam Williams is you can go find I heard like
Speaker 1: he wants maybe he wants to be called D. I
Speaker 1: feel like I've heard that on the internet. I need
Speaker 1: to do some homework on that D. His mental name
Speaker 1: is de Eric. I believe Derek de Eric. I think
Speaker 1: I need to. I don't know he'll be let's go,
Speaker 1: he'll be here next week and I'm sure he'll talk
Speaker 1: about it. But maybe maybe he wants to be called D. Anyway,
Speaker 1: D Williams. That's I believe basketball, all right, D Brown
Speaker 1: Billy will Billy d Williams, Lando Calrissian maybe the ft
Speaker 1: with you you uh, Any, I'm sorry, I always do
Speaker 1: that way. You'll know Lando. Huh, you'll know Lando, And
Speaker 1: I'm sorry. Listeners. Um, they're fine. Um, it's better than
Speaker 1: talk about that than talk about like the issues with
Speaker 1: this guy. Well, that's the thing we're gonna get to that.
Speaker 1: Tell me, what do you think of him as a player.
Speaker 1: You can go find tape of him holding his own
Speaker 1: and kicking ass against the guys that got drafted at
Speaker 1: the top of this draft, like Evan Neil and Charles Cross.
Speaker 1: It's a very it's a very typical cowboys pick. Like
Speaker 1: I'm not saying he's better than the Cavon Thibodeaus and
Speaker 1: Aidan Hutchinson's, but like he's on the short list of
Speaker 1: like the four to six guys that can do that.
Speaker 1: We're still left on the board at the time that
Speaker 1: they picked. Or was it on a situation where if
Speaker 1: you're gonna get one of those guys, this is your
Speaker 1: last chance? And to nixt point, uh, he was probably
Speaker 1: still available for a reason that wasn't about how well
Speaker 1: he bends the corner. Um. You said to Marcus Lawrence,
Speaker 1: I think Randy Gregory is also a guy you can
Speaker 1: compare him to in this pick because they which I
Speaker 1: didn't mean to say, like DeMarcus fell for character concerns.
Speaker 1: I just like they went up and got him aggressively
Speaker 1: because they were like, this is the last guy we
Speaker 1: got to get him, or else we're not getting an
Speaker 1: edge rusher. And that's how they felt about this as well. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I think the reason why he fell is for
Speaker 1: the same reason maybe as Randy Gregory. It's just they're
Speaker 1: just so teams are probably so concerned about his his
Speaker 1: off the field uh issues that he's had, and there's
Speaker 1: a lot of them, and also his his character is
Speaker 1: demeanor is you know, just there's a lot of things
Speaker 1: about him that are that are scary. The tape has
Speaker 1: to be really really good to offset that. I guess
Speaker 1: y'all are looking at tape. Sorry, yeah, I'm actually looking
Speaker 1: at him. He's got some really good highlights. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean you watch him. No, that's Liberty. I got this
Speaker 1: for Lamar. Maybe he's gonna have a few from that game. Yeah,
Speaker 1: what are you saying about Liberty? It ain't It ain't Alabama. Well,
Speaker 1: my initial again, I always like to go from my
Speaker 1: initial thought to where I'm at now. My initial thought
Speaker 1: was like, what's up with these second round picks that
Speaker 1: the Cowboys always make? That with them they bring in
Speaker 1: some kind of issue, whether it's injury related or off
Speaker 1: the field related. Now I decided to put that aside
Speaker 1: after listening to the press conference and say, okay, well,
Speaker 1: they clearly say that they've done their investigation. They've talked
Speaker 1: to many other people to get their input on this
Speaker 1: guy's demeanor, personality, and him as a person. So they've
Speaker 1: done their homework and felt confident enough to bring in
Speaker 1: bringing him here to the building. But watching him as
Speaker 1: a player and watching highlights and all that, he looks
Speaker 1: like he's a pretty good player. He has the size,
Speaker 1: he has the build for it, he looks and good
Speaker 1: thing we have numbers that's gonna defferent shape players and
Speaker 1: all that and their names. Because he has a similarity
Speaker 1: face wise with Mica Parsons, I don't know if you
Speaker 1: kind of actually think, yes, some of a build, Yeah,
Speaker 1: the build too, believe in the face. I saw this thing.
Speaker 1: I'm scrolling down and I'm like, why is Mica wearing
Speaker 1: a fifty two at fifty four number? Jersey, and that
Speaker 1: was Sam just posting the number that he's gonna be wearing.
Speaker 1: But yeah, physically he looks like he's pretty good. So
Speaker 1: I'm excited to actually see him play and see what
Speaker 1: he can do here because as a player, he looks
Speaker 1: like he definitely has talent. The other thing, too, is
Speaker 1: old Miss asked him to do a lot of dirty work,
Speaker 1: Like he gave an interview recently where he talked about
Speaker 1: like they had him playing a four inside technique where
Speaker 1: you're like head up on a tackle or in between
Speaker 1: the tackle and guard more so than like playing out wide,
Speaker 1: which not that it affects the Cowboys, but Trayvon Walker
Speaker 1: out of George is a very similar story where Georgia
Speaker 1: just asked him to do a lot of stuff as
Speaker 1: an edge setter and a rundefender, so he did. He
Speaker 1: definitely did do some of that stuff. But Sam Williams,
Speaker 1: he did more than just play the edge and just
Speaker 1: go after the quarterback. So I think there's even more
Speaker 1: that you could probably tap into purely from a football standpoint,
Speaker 1: I think it's a very good pick. But one year
Speaker 1: after doing something very similar and you already sort of
Speaker 1: have misgivings about it. You know, it's totally fair to
Speaker 1: question that logic because I think Nick, you and I
Speaker 1: have talked about it. I mean, I think we all
Speaker 1: liked Randy as a person and he did do some
Speaker 1: amazing things. But like, over the course of seven years,
Speaker 1: did you get your bang for the buck in terms
Speaker 1: of how often he was on the field? Probably not,
Speaker 1: Jalen Smith, did it work out the way you wanted
Speaker 1: it to? Definitely not? Kelvin Joseph, You're already feeling not
Speaker 1: wonderful about it, and now this and like, for as
Speaker 1: smart as they feel when they do this stuff, the
Speaker 1: return on investment hasn't been great. Has Let me ask
Speaker 1: you guys this question, though, is this an across the
Speaker 1: league thing? Because I would think for a lot of
Speaker 1: teams the second round is about guys, we have first
Speaker 1: round potential, but for whatever reason in the second round,
Speaker 1: and that can be for off the field, that can
Speaker 1: be for injury concerns like that would seem to me
Speaker 1: like that would be across the league a trend that
Speaker 1: a lot of teams do. Is that the case? And
Speaker 1: maybe just because we cover the Cowboys, that's what we
Speaker 1: see from the Cowboys, But really this is every team
Speaker 1: that deals with this. I think it depends. I mean
Speaker 1: there's that many guys that have character issues like that
Speaker 1: at or injury issues or whatever it is. Right, Yeah, again,
Speaker 1: I say it all the time. It's about stealing value,
Speaker 1: and that's what they're trying to do. They try to
Speaker 1: steal the value of a really good player that doesn't
Speaker 1: look like a second round pick. But there's probably half
Speaker 1: the league that's like, we're not messing with this guy.
Speaker 1: And honestly, if you read some of the stuff from
Speaker 1: their reports, from their internal reports, you would have never
Speaker 1: drafted him. So like the Cowboys, they are fully aware
Speaker 1: of everything. They're just like, we feel like he can
Speaker 1: be a better player than that. What would you say
Speaker 1: when you look at it all those players that have
Speaker 1: come in with some kind of issues and other Cowboys
Speaker 1: decided to take a risk and bet on them, what
Speaker 1: would you say, be like the percentage success rate of
Speaker 1: situations like this? I just think I laid out all
Speaker 1: the ones that that have happened since I've been here, right,
Speaker 1: I mean since you've been here? Yeah? Well, I mean
Speaker 1: are we being are we being a little bit? Like
Speaker 1: if you go back and look the last several second
Speaker 1: round picks. Not all of them fit in that category.
Speaker 1: Most of them don't fit in that category of either
Speaker 1: injured or off the field concerns. Yeah, Kelvin Joseph, Treyvon Diggs,
Speaker 1: Triston Hill, Kelvin Joseph does right, Yes, Yeah, Okay, I'm
Speaker 1: naming all the second round picks, and I'm like, not
Speaker 1: all of them fall in that category. You know, Tristan Hill,
Speaker 1: Connor Williams, Like, these are not guys that you that
Speaker 1: you say fell for a reason other than just they
Speaker 1: were second round pick. I want to I want to
Speaker 1: be clear. Tristan came with no like legal concerns, but
Speaker 1: there were definitely questions about his maturity and his coachability,
Speaker 1: which again which Rod Marinelli made a big deal about,
Speaker 1: like I'll get it out of him. But is that
Speaker 1: most like? Is that a lot of second round picks
Speaker 1: to where there are reasons why they're in a second
Speaker 1: round and it may not be because of play. It
Speaker 1: maybe because there's another thing that's in their character that's
Speaker 1: just not right. Every second round pick there is a
Speaker 1: reason why they're not a first round pick. And you
Speaker 1: could say that pretty much about every round, two or
Speaker 1: three rounds and everybody you just named, I mean Trey
Speaker 1: Von Diggs. I mean, he's not going to be able
Speaker 1: to cover that well because all of his guys around
Speaker 1: him are making the plays at Alabama. He's not the
Speaker 1: one really making it plays, okay, which is wrong. I mean,
Speaker 1: say Connor Williams, He's gonna have to make this transition
Speaker 1: to guard and Canny do it. So there's a reason
Speaker 1: why every second round pick. And some of it's off
Speaker 1: the field, some of its stuff. That's my point. You're
Speaker 1: always trying to steal value. You know, you're just thinking
Speaker 1: I can handle it. But I think I mean the Cowboys.
Speaker 1: So again, in the time I've been here, Jalen is
Speaker 1: probably the biggest one. People just didn't know if he
Speaker 1: was going to play again. Kelvin no legal issues, but
Speaker 1: sort of what we talked about it just like this
Speaker 1: is a guy that you never know when you're gonna yeah,
Speaker 1: you're gonna get you might get a phone call about
Speaker 1: this guy. Kelvin Yeah, or sam Is or Kelvin Kelvin
Speaker 1: oh Kell Yeah. And then in between that, Um, who
Speaker 1: am I blanking on me? R Randy? Yeah, Randy. I
Speaker 1: would put two behind Jalen and then how would you
Speaker 1: put Sam. I don't know, but those those are the four.
Speaker 1: Those are the four. Yeah. In the last how many years?
Speaker 1: Greg Gregory was what eight years? Seven years ago? Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean before that, I just know, was it twenty eleven?
Speaker 1: I mean it was like Bruce Carter, you know, the
Speaker 1: guy that had torn acl and Sean counts as a hit. Yeah,
Speaker 1: although Sean was not like the way they're structured and
Speaker 1: the way they do it, like, Sean's not a Will
Speaker 1: guy if you want to break it up into eras
Speaker 1: or whatever, like Will didn't run that draft. Um. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean no, they've they've hit. Sean's definitely a hit
Speaker 1: in my book. Yeah, no, in anybody's book, he's a hit. Um.
Speaker 1: But yeah, just recently it hasn't worked out as well
Speaker 1: as you would you would have hoped, considering how willing
Speaker 1: they are to do it. And obviously the story is
Speaker 1: still to be written on Sam's still to be written
Speaker 1: on Kelvin Joseph, Like, we don't know about them just yet. Obviously,
Speaker 1: you know there are things that you that you're concerned about,
Speaker 1: but they hasn't been written yet. There were there were
Speaker 1: off field character concerns about Micah and he has been
Speaker 1: nothing like, nothing of that sort has really followed him
Speaker 1: in his NFL career at this point. He's been a
Speaker 1: model NFL player as far as I'm aware. All Right,
Speaker 1: let's move on. Let's go to the third round. A
Speaker 1: pick that I think across the board everywhere I've looked
Speaker 1: and seen people writing or talking about the Cowboys draft,
Speaker 1: they point to this pick as one of the best,
Speaker 1: if not the best value pick that the Cowboys got.
Speaker 1: At the eighty eighth overall pick, they get Jalen Tilbert,
Speaker 1: wide receiver out of South Alabama. What are your thoughts
Speaker 1: on that pick? Nicholas start with you. I think that,
Speaker 1: you know, he was probably the guy that they had,
Speaker 1: you know, rated as their best receiver at the time
Speaker 1: and a player that wanted to draft in the second round. Um,
Speaker 1: you know, Jerry Jerry wins you know some of these debates,
Speaker 1: and I think he won that one with Sam Williams. Um.
Speaker 1: But but Tober was on their board for the second round,
Speaker 1: so give him the third. I mean, I think that
Speaker 1: they're really excited about that, uh, small, smaller school guy,
Speaker 1: but showed, you know, showed up against you know, some
Speaker 1: of the better competition at the Senior Bowl that also
Speaker 1: against like Tennessee. That's what you're looking for. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: feel that this guy is um. He's gonna be the
Speaker 1: player that I feel is going to be able to
Speaker 1: give you the most out of all the draft picks
Speaker 1: that the Cowbi see liked it, So I'm excited to
Speaker 1: see him. He has talent. He based on his position
Speaker 1: and the current situations that the Cowbis are dealing with
Speaker 1: at the wide receiver, He's the one that that's gonna
Speaker 1: be able to contribute right away and I think he
Speaker 1: will do a good enough job for it to turn
Speaker 1: out well at least this year. So I'm excited to
Speaker 1: see him. And that's my favorite one, just as most
Speaker 1: people that he has been the favorite one in this draft.
Speaker 1: There were important voices in the war room that wanted
Speaker 1: to take him at fifty six, like meaningful people that
Speaker 1: thought it was a good idea. He's yeah, he's versatile.
Speaker 1: I just I love his skill set. I think I
Speaker 1: think he's the most ready made player of anyone they drafted.
Speaker 1: I'm not saying he's going to take the league over,
Speaker 1: but I expect him to be a starter. Michael Gallup
Speaker 1: caught thirty three balls for five hundred and something yards
Speaker 1: as a rookie. I think he's capable of that type
Speaker 1: of contribution right away. So let me ask you, I
Speaker 1: want to further that question on the fact of him
Speaker 1: being NFL ready. Is he NFL ready enough to be
Speaker 1: able to start the season contributing maybe even more than
Speaker 1: will be will be expected of him in the second
Speaker 1: half of the season due to the fact that you're
Speaker 1: probably not gonna have Michael Gallop. Michael Gallup did it
Speaker 1: as a rookie because they cut Deaz and they signed
Speaker 1: a bunch of guys that weren't long term answers. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean I think he can do something. I think
Speaker 1: he'll be in the starting lineup week one. I mean
Speaker 1: guessing just of course, we can always be wrong, but
Speaker 1: I think so. Yeah. I mean we'll see how much
Speaker 1: how you know, quickly he picks it up, But I
Speaker 1: think so. I mean, you know, they they this is
Speaker 1: a guy that they had targeted, they wanted and you know,
Speaker 1: they wanted Dak to call him to see, you know,
Speaker 1: and that let them kind of create some chemistry, which
Speaker 1: I think, you know, they were able to do that.
Speaker 1: So that's a good start, and we'll see I mean
Speaker 1: they don't have a lot of options at receiver. I
Speaker 1: mean it's gonna be CD and James Washington and you know,
Speaker 1: I'm talking about a training camp, and he'll get a
Speaker 1: lot of reps. If it's not told her, it'll be Noah,
Speaker 1: or we throw Jake Ferguson in there and just go
Speaker 1: twelve personnel all day. Let's go to Jake Ferguson. He
Speaker 1: was a fourth round pick, number twenty nine overall tight end.
Speaker 1: Do you think he can immediately come in and maybe
Speaker 1: make them kind of flip their model from last year
Speaker 1: they were mostly an eleven team to maybe going back
Speaker 1: to some of the stuff when Jason was here where
Speaker 1: they did a lot more twelve. Do you think that's
Speaker 1: possible for him in his rookie year. I hope he
Speaker 1: doesn't flip their philosophy as a team. I think receiver
Speaker 1: is still a strength of vault of this when it's
Speaker 1: all said and done. But I mean early in the season,
Speaker 1: let's say, before Gallup is back. I'll be disappointed if
Speaker 1: he doesn't win the backup job, and I don't know
Speaker 1: if he will. But again, like Nick said this about
Speaker 1: Tyler Smith, like I don't care what they say, I
Speaker 1: think they tilted their board toward their needs, and that's
Speaker 1: fine if you're right, But it was I think it
Speaker 1: was Jake Ferguson at one twenty nine all day. Once
Speaker 1: some of the other tight ends got taken. I think
Speaker 1: they had interest in Trey McBride at fifty six. He
Speaker 1: got taken before they picked anyway, so it didn't matter.
Speaker 1: They really liked Kadotton out of Washington. He was the
Speaker 1: first pick of the fourth round, and like, from that
Speaker 1: point on, I think they were like, this is our guy.
Speaker 1: It's Jake Ferguson, so to target him and really like,
Speaker 1: I don't even think they debated that pick the way
Speaker 1: that they debated the Sam Williams pick or whatever. And
Speaker 1: so yeah, that puts a certain degree of expectation that
Speaker 1: he can play meaningful snaps as a rookie. Was that
Speaker 1: also maybe because I like, as you said in the
Speaker 1: second round with Sam Williams, was it at a point
Speaker 1: in the draft where all those tight ends that they liked,
Speaker 1: we're starting to come off the board and they were
Speaker 1: down to, hey, we gotta get this guy here because
Speaker 1: we've already missed on two others that we really liked,
Speaker 1: and that's why there wasn't a debate. Maybe yeah, I
Speaker 1: think there was a some talk about trading back into
Speaker 1: the third round to get to getting a guy maybe
Speaker 1: Oden or Rucker, and then Rucker went off the board
Speaker 1: and then Otten went early in the fourth on the
Speaker 1: next day, So uh yeah, at that point you have
Speaker 1: to get you know, you get what you want. But
Speaker 1: but they you know, the thing about it is is
Speaker 1: what they need. That backup tight end has to be
Speaker 1: a blocker. I mean, and he has to be a
Speaker 1: guy you could play on the line. And I would
Speaker 1: hope being at Wisconsin, I would hope that that that's
Speaker 1: you know, they run the ball a lot. He gets
Speaker 1: on the field. It's a first team All Big Ten.
Speaker 1: So if your first team All Big Ten, you're obviously
Speaker 1: getting your stats, but you're on the field a lot
Speaker 1: because they're running the football. So he's doing that. We're
Speaker 1: showing blocking. Yeah no, we're just we're not showing the blocking,
Speaker 1: but we're showing him kind of catching passes. But that
Speaker 1: was obviously pretty good. Yeah. That was actually the first
Speaker 1: thing I thought about with any tight end prospect was
Speaker 1: I'm Kenny block because that's been the thing I think
Speaker 1: they've missed more than anything else at the tight end position,
Speaker 1: probably going back to when Martellis Bennett was here. Like,
Speaker 1: I don't know that they've had a really good blocking
Speaker 1: tight end in a long time, and I really think
Speaker 1: that's necessary for them. They're gonna get their running game going.
Speaker 1: Colleges don't put out blocking tight ends the way that
Speaker 1: they used to, but it's like fullbacks, right. If I'm
Speaker 1: looking for something to be optimistic about, this, dude's coming
Speaker 1: out of one of the like three or four programs
Speaker 1: that really still does ask their tight ends to do that.
Speaker 1: I mean Wisconsin Power Eye run the ball down their throats.
Speaker 1: So again, like I hate to say, Ready made about
Speaker 1: a fourth round pick, but I would hope he knows
Speaker 1: how to do a lot of the stuff that they
Speaker 1: would ask of him as the second tight end. And
Speaker 1: you're not asking to tight end to be a dominating blocker.
Speaker 1: You're asking a tight end to be a getting the
Speaker 1: way blocker. Are willing getting the way blocker? Who I
Speaker 1: would love it if position his body? Yeah, But I
Speaker 1: just don't think that's like you said, they're not creating
Speaker 1: those guys. They're not developing those guys in college. These
Speaker 1: days buying large. If you can get someone who's willing
Speaker 1: and knows how to position his body in the right
Speaker 1: way to just create creases and to be able to
Speaker 1: maintain where they are, I think that that's all you
Speaker 1: really need. You don't need somebody's getting pancakes. Some of
Speaker 1: the scouting reports that I've read, I mean, some of
Speaker 1: the things that they highlighted on there was just that
Speaker 1: he's a decent, pretty good blocker. And after I started
Speaker 1: watching some of the highlights too. He might not be
Speaker 1: the guy that just holds up the guy there forever
Speaker 1: or anything like that, but he will buy you those
Speaker 1: extra seconds that you might definitely need on a play.
Speaker 1: So at least that's a positive and something to look
Speaker 1: forward to this year at the tight end position, I'm
Speaker 1: just watching him there. Absolutely, he has a good size
Speaker 1: to got some Witten to him at the end. I'm
Speaker 1: talking about his career Witten in the way that like
Speaker 1: there's not a lot of there's not a lot of
Speaker 1: like yards after the contact, you know what I mean,
Speaker 1: Like he's not breaking a lot of tackles kind of
Speaker 1: goes down right then, and his blocking is kind of
Speaker 1: a in the way type of blocker but I mean,
Speaker 1: you know, that's not the that's not the worst comparison
Speaker 1: you could have. Well, yeah, I didn't think Jason was
Speaker 1: a great blocker, but at the height of his career,
Speaker 1: I thought he was a very effective blocker. Um, And
Speaker 1: if you can get again, if you can get somebody
Speaker 1: who's effective at it, that's really the key. I bet
Speaker 1: I bet he probably gets other than Tyler Smith, I
Speaker 1: bet he probably gets the most snaps of anybody on
Speaker 1: the tiber. That'll be close. That'll be close. And if
Speaker 1: Tilbert helps you on special teams like a punt returner,
Speaker 1: then maybe maybe Tilbur and then Devin Harper. I think
Speaker 1: it's also gonna get a lot of snaps. All Right,
Speaker 1: we're gonna take our final break. We're gonna come back.
Speaker 1: We're gonna talk about those last few picks Bland, Clark, Ridgeway,
Speaker 1: and Harper. Uh and then just kind of get some
Speaker 1: overall thoughts on the draft from these guys when we
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Speaker 1: Welcome Back. Final segment of the break left in s
Speaker 1: WBC Mortgage Studios at the Star, and we got to
Speaker 1: the first of four or fifth round picks when we
Speaker 1: talked about Matt we let's go, let's talk about those
Speaker 1: other three picks, and none of them to Dave Chagrin
Speaker 1: was a kicker. But my chagrin went out the window
Speaker 1: when I saw what Cleveland did. I mean, they drafted
Speaker 1: kid York ahead of Jake Ferguson. I'm fourth rounds too
Speaker 1: soon for me. I just yea, So I felt okay
Speaker 1: about that, and then the rest of them fell out
Speaker 1: of the draft. I still would have liked them to
Speaker 1: get one. Just you know, I would have drafted York.
Speaker 1: I mean, how can you argue with the strategy when
Speaker 1: they had their I mean, Dicker went. Dicker went an
Speaker 1: undrafted free agency like everybody else. You didn't get it.
Speaker 1: You didn't get him. I don't know if they would try.
Speaker 1: I mean they didn't want yea, maybe they didn't want
Speaker 1: to get him. Maybe they want to try. I heard
Speaker 1: I would have loved to have him get some kicker
Speaker 1: to bring just to compete. They brought in one that
Speaker 1: was undrafted, did the Gary Bay. I'm not telling you.
Speaker 1: I'm not telling you that he's the truth or that
Speaker 1: you have to trust it. But I heard reliably that
Speaker 1: Jonathan Garabay is the one that John Fossil wanted, Like,
Speaker 1: that's the guy he liked. Just telling you, I'm just
Speaker 1: telling you, he's just telling you. Sixteen fifteen out of
Speaker 1: sixteen inside of fifty perfect inside of fifty fifteen, six
Speaker 1: fifteen out of sixteen on the season, fourteen out of
Speaker 1: fourteen inside of fifty right, and he hit a sixty
Speaker 1: two yarder to win the game. And have you ever
Speaker 1: been to Lobbick No, Twindy, don't think I ever will Swindy.
Speaker 1: I heard Fossil went to lobby You loved him. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that'sn't worked out again? Six or two yards to win
Speaker 1: the gate. Look, look, I'm four and a half and
Speaker 1: you know to win it. Yeah, I'm not gonna argue that.
Speaker 1: I mean, but but I will say he's only I
Speaker 1: want him my guy. Okay, your guy, Your guy went
Speaker 1: to a team that has a Pro Bowl kicker. I
Speaker 1: know understand that kicking competitions are weird. Wondering why and
Speaker 1: that that said to me, the Cowboys and a lot
Speaker 1: of other teams probably weren't trying to get him, because
Speaker 1: if you go somewhere like that, you're probably like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm probably not gonna make the team. But it's weird
Speaker 1: with kickers though, like because you're even when you're on
Speaker 1: another team, you're auditioning for another team's job, and they
Speaker 1: have Matt Gay he's a pro bowler, Dicker's probably gonna
Speaker 1: get a lot of run in the preseason, and if
Speaker 1: he does a good job, he could wind up somewhere else.
Speaker 1: Like it seems counterintuitive, but I I sort of get
Speaker 1: it in a weird way. I just think I would
Speaker 1: have thought that he would try to look for a
Speaker 1: team with there's at least less of a of a
Speaker 1: like dominant guy there, and then you might have a
Speaker 1: chance of not having to go audition for somebody else.
Speaker 1: You literally stay where you are. But who knows, I mean,
Speaker 1: that might have been the only opportunity he had. Who knows.
Speaker 1: I was gonna say, like, it's it's weird, man, because
Speaker 1: a great example is Mattterraza, the San Diego State punter.
Speaker 1: People call him punk God. Yeah, he was the third
Speaker 1: punter drafted and outsiders are like, what the hell's going on?
Speaker 1: Why doesn't anybody want this guy? And meanwhile the NFL
Speaker 1: is like, we're good. They're like, he's got a great leg,
Speaker 1: that's awesome. He outkicks his coverage all the time. His
Speaker 1: directional punting isn't amazing. We like these other guys better
Speaker 1: because they do what we ask him to. I don't
Speaker 1: give a damn if you punt it ninety yards. If
Speaker 1: you give the punt returner fifteen yards of free space
Speaker 1: to return the ball, yeah, he's wild thing. And so
Speaker 1: you know, maybe it could be a similar situation with
Speaker 1: a guy like Dicker, where the John Fossils of the
Speaker 1: world are like, I don't like his mechanics. I like
Speaker 1: this other guy better. Not saying they're right, ye, not
Speaker 1: saying they're right. All right, let's talk about these three
Speaker 1: fifth round picks. You got Deron Bland of cornerback. You've
Speaker 1: got Damon Clark, a linebacker that a lot of people
Speaker 1: really love the pick. And you got John Ridgeway, who
Speaker 1: dave I just the way y'all were going on on
Speaker 1: the draft show, like I was like, y'all are in
Speaker 1: love with this dude, because his interview was really good.
Speaker 1: If you hadn't heard, he probably ought to go back
Speaker 1: and listen to a good interview. Talk to me about
Speaker 1: those fifth round picks. I didn't you know, I'm on
Speaker 1: the Draft show, but I'm very open about the fact,
Speaker 1: like I don't watch five hundred players. I didn't know
Speaker 1: anything about John Ridgeway other than that he went to
Speaker 1: Arkansas and was a big guy and he got on
Speaker 1: the with us. He blew my socks off. Man. He's
Speaker 1: just he's like, you think I played with an edge
Speaker 1: in college, Wait till I'm in the league. And then
Speaker 1: I was like, how do you like, you know, tell
Speaker 1: us a little bit about your game. He's like, I'm
Speaker 1: just trying to get out there and break some necks
Speaker 1: and hit some people. I was like, okay, well, if
Speaker 1: you play like you talk, this is awesome. Like I
Speaker 1: don't not only like I'm out because two picks ago,
Speaker 1: we just drafted a guy neck injuries and y'all both
Speaker 1: were at the Senior Bowl. So what was going on?
Speaker 1: Yeah for Senior Bowl? Yeah, yeah, this guy. Nick? You,
Speaker 1: I mean, you obviously watched Arkansas a lot of Arkansaft football.
Speaker 1: What did you think of Ridgeway four or five players
Speaker 1: that I remember. I mean, something's got to give here,
Speaker 1: you know, he's not that good of a player or
Speaker 1: Arkansas's defensive line coaches needed to be playing this guy
Speaker 1: a little bit more. He didn't stand out too much
Speaker 1: much to me. And like you said, watch every game,
Speaker 1: there's a few plays here and there. But then by
Speaker 1: the way, they were drafted for traits. When they get
Speaker 1: to this point, it's not so much about necessarily production
Speaker 1: as much as traits. Isn't this dominant player in college
Speaker 1: that Yeah, we're watching some plates. I do remember game
Speaker 1: in Texas, Yeah, I do remember. I remember that this
Speaker 1: was his first game he played. They won, Oh they won? Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: But I mean, you know he plays definitely with the nattitude.
Speaker 1: Yeah he has at same play, same play, But that's okay.
Speaker 1: I remember this was because of the first game of
Speaker 1: the season, he had like a pendicitis, so he didn't play.
Speaker 1: So everybody, you know, was like, there's Ridgeway, there's Ridgeway.
Speaker 1: You know, this is the first game he'd play. He
Speaker 1: was a transfer from Western Illinois, one of the Illinois
Speaker 1: Southern Illinois maybe yeah, he got one in every direction. Yep, yeah.
Speaker 1: So the east one was from Romo. The west one
Speaker 1: was a guy named we drafted the third round pick,
Speaker 1: remember him, Western Illinois linebacker Illinois State. I'm sorry, Illinois
Speaker 1: State got six six three twenty. I don't. We didn't
Speaker 1: talk about that at the jump, but pretty much everybody
Speaker 1: they drafted as a big boy. Yeah, and in a
Speaker 1: lot of cases with a nasty attitude, which I think
Speaker 1: was done on on design. Yeah. Absolutely, And we talked.
Speaker 1: We talked about that weeks leading up to the draft
Speaker 1: that there was a lot of thoughts around this building
Speaker 1: that they needed to get tougher. You need to get
Speaker 1: a little mean or get a little more attitude and uh.
Speaker 1: And so it wasn't a shock when when you started
Speaker 1: reading about all the guys they were drafting and in
Speaker 1: their bios it said things like considered to be a
Speaker 1: mean player. Like I think that was by design. I
Speaker 1: think cowboys were looking for a little meanness, a little toughness.
Speaker 1: Um good rest itself. Oh no, was he gonna say
Speaker 1: When he gets up and does his little like celebration thing,
Speaker 1: it reminds me of Antone Woods. It's funny it is
Speaker 1: he does the exact same thing like he has but
Speaker 1: I was gonna say one thing that this surprised me.
Speaker 1: I guess I shouldn't have been expecting that, but for
Speaker 1: some reason, I was a little surprised to see how
Speaker 1: many players they drafted on the defensive side of the ball,
Speaker 1: like I was expecting to see a more on the offense.
Speaker 1: But also surprising was the fact that they did not
Speaker 1: make any traits We've been talking about them trading up
Speaker 1: or doing whatever. They kept all their picks, all of
Speaker 1: their positions overall picks, and I think they had a
Speaker 1: few targets in mind in a few spots, and those
Speaker 1: didn't materialize, like tight End in the third round being
Speaker 1: one of them. I think the guys that they really
Speaker 1: liked didn't fall far enough the first round. Prospects that
Speaker 1: they were really in love with the play had opportunity
Speaker 1: to trade back in the first round. That was an
Speaker 1: interesting one, and mainly because of the player that the
Speaker 1: team was trying to get up to get in Tennessee,
Speaker 1: was trying to get Tyler Smith. Yea, so yeah, And
Speaker 1: then I think I'm like fighting off a sneeze. I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: when you get to this point where you have five
Speaker 1: or four fifth round picks, excuse me, Steven said, it
Speaker 1: is like their grades were really well favored starting in
Speaker 1: like the fourth round going through there, and I think
Speaker 1: they were just like, why not pick four of these
Speaker 1: guys that we have really good grades on and hopefully
Speaker 1: we'll hit on at least a couple of them. Which
Speaker 1: I don't mind that strategy at all. That's why I
Speaker 1: don't have super strong opinions about any of the Day
Speaker 1: three guys, because you're just throwing darts, and the more
Speaker 1: picks you make, I think the more likely it is
Speaker 1: one of them will be a good player. Your guy.
Speaker 1: To Moan Clark, they got in the fifth round one
Speaker 1: hundred and seventy sixth overall in this tape that Dean Clark. Oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: no doubt, because the thing about him is everybody, I
Speaker 1: think across the board everybody believes this guy's way better
Speaker 1: than a fifth round pick. But because he had to
Speaker 1: have surgery on his spine here back in March, I
Speaker 1: think there are a lot of teams had obviously allowed
Speaker 1: him to slide down their board. Do you think this
Speaker 1: was a good investment for the Cowboys? I think from
Speaker 1: a value standpoint that this is the best pick that
Speaker 1: they made. Just because there's no risk. I mean, if
Speaker 1: this doesn't work out, it's a fifth round pick, it's
Speaker 1: go look at their history with fifth round picks. It's fine,
Speaker 1: But this guy should have gone in the top one hundred.
Speaker 1: I think I think, if healthy, he would have been
Speaker 1: drafted higher than Jabril Cox was last year. Um, so
Speaker 1: give me. I know everybody says, like, you know, top
Speaker 1: one hundred. So is this a guy that could have
Speaker 1: been a late first round? Is he a guy that's
Speaker 1: more like a second round? Is this a guy that's
Speaker 1: really more a third round? I peg his range somewhere
Speaker 1: between fifty and eighty, and there's I mean, teams feel
Speaker 1: differently about different guys. There's no real way to know
Speaker 1: late second, early third, second or third, Yeah, second or
Speaker 1: third round pick. I really believe that he's a tackling machine.
Speaker 1: He had one hundred and thirty five tackles last year.
Speaker 1: He's that what he does best. Yes, he does like
Speaker 1: I mean, he doesn't miss tackles or he didn't. The
Speaker 1: funny which, just as a biased LSU fan, it was
Speaker 1: so much fun watching his growth because most guys that
Speaker 1: come into LSU are highly recruited and through two oh
Speaker 1: they just are I mean, it's the same thing at
Speaker 1: Texas And he didn't really hit that ceiling his first
Speaker 1: like three years, and you were like, Okay, I guess
Speaker 1: this Damon Clark is just a guy. And then in
Speaker 1: twenty twenty one he just hit his stride and became
Speaker 1: that dude. Uh there's some pass rush element to his game.
Speaker 1: He had six sacks last year. He literally he sacked
Speaker 1: there in him twice to win the game. Last year,
Speaker 1: two plays in a row. He's like, I'm ending this game.
Speaker 1: I don't care. I'm going to get this guy. Um.
Speaker 1: Coverage is not his forte but he's not. But like, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: yeah he did do this down the field. No, I
Speaker 1: mean he's just an all around good play from what
Speaker 1: I see from here. His awareness is really off the chart.
Speaker 1: I mean like he recognizes where the play is going
Speaker 1: to be and he goes and gets it. No, yeah,
Speaker 1: coverage is not his forte as he makes an interception
Speaker 1: twenty five yards down field. But but I guess the
Speaker 1: you know, it's the elephant in the room, like like, okay, oh,
Speaker 1: did you see him just like run that guy down?
Speaker 1: I'm sorry, No, No, that's fine. Were is he? Are?
Speaker 1: We going to see this guy. If we see this
Speaker 1: guy ever, then yeah it's gonna be great. But can
Speaker 1: he I mean neck fusion surgery on a linebacker that's scary,
Speaker 1: which but just yeah, just to be blunt about it though,
Speaker 1: that's that's what makes it such a great pick. Is No,
Speaker 1: that doesn't make no. But when you spend it. But
Speaker 1: the way you said is like as if that was
Speaker 1: he had it last year and he played throughout this
Speaker 1: this past year. So when you spend when you spend
Speaker 1: pick thirty four on a guy who might not never
Speaker 1: be the same, it's scary. And with all due respect
Speaker 1: to Damon, it's not scary when it's picked one seventy
Speaker 1: eight because again, go look through the history or one
Speaker 1: seventy six, I'm sorry, look through the history of what
Speaker 1: they've done. Like you odds are you were just going
Speaker 1: to spend it on a guy that you cut in
Speaker 1: a year or two anyway, who even if it was healthy,
Speaker 1: and it's like, oh no, he's not going to play
Speaker 1: this year. Well, Semi Pohoko did like got a jersey
Speaker 1: like three times last year. So this is low risk,
Speaker 1: very high reward. And if I know anything, he's wearing
Speaker 1: number eighteen. That means something at LSU. That means that
Speaker 1: you're like a football first, high character tea leader that
Speaker 1: the classic like Jason Garrett, right kind of guy. Will
Speaker 1: McClay told me yesterday he was like, I was blown
Speaker 1: away by his approach. They met with him at the
Speaker 1: Senior Bowl and he was like, this dude's just all
Speaker 1: business like there's no there's not to say he doesn't
Speaker 1: know how to have fun, but like he's dialed in
Speaker 1: on the job. And so if somebody's going to overcome
Speaker 1: this and come back as good as or better than
Speaker 1: he was, I feel fine betting on this guy. Yes, yes,
Speaker 1: I like it. Yeah, So, I mean there is no
Speaker 1: downside to this pick as far as I'm concerned. The
Speaker 1: good thing about that too, is when it comes to rehab, No,
Speaker 1: you can't rush injuries back, especially next you know they're
Speaker 1: not cowboys, wouldn't allow you to do that. But you
Speaker 1: know he's going to be diligent in the work, in
Speaker 1: the rehab into you know everything it takes to get
Speaker 1: back and to get back as quickly as you can
Speaker 1: um and and that's what that's what I like about,
Speaker 1: especially when you're dealing with an injury you know, are
Speaker 1: you gonna be dialed in or you're gonna be locked
Speaker 1: in even though you're not practicing, are you going to
Speaker 1: be able to to be up to speed? And it
Speaker 1: sounds like he would do that. So when it, you know,
Speaker 1: comes time for him to play, he should be ready
Speaker 1: because if football really matters to him, he'll make sure
Speaker 1: that he does that. We heard Stephen Jones say that
Speaker 1: that you can't they don't completely count out the fact
Speaker 1: that he could play this year. You guys buying that.
Speaker 1: I buy that it's possible, but I don't know how
Speaker 1: likely it is because again, like so the timetable is
Speaker 1: six months, which suggests that he could be ready by
Speaker 1: like November or December. But then you think a guy
Speaker 1: that no camp, no no, no, OTA's no training camp,
Speaker 1: no getting your feet wet. And that's also the time
Speaker 1: of the year where if things are going the way
Speaker 1: that you hope they are, that you're sort of trying
Speaker 1: to gear up and get ready for big boy football,
Speaker 1: which maybe he could come in and give you the shot,
Speaker 1: give you a shot in the arm, or maybe you're
Speaker 1: like or maybe just a special teams guy, give you
Speaker 1: a little support on special right, Yeah, you don't have
Speaker 1: to close the door right now, So you don't have
Speaker 1: to close the door. But I'm not setting super high
Speaker 1: expectations for year one. Everything I just said about it
Speaker 1: making sure he's you know, he's locked in and all that.
Speaker 1: Like if you just said you're out of football this year,
Speaker 1: maybe he won't be that way. Let's just see, let's
Speaker 1: see what happened. Yeah, he seems like he would be
Speaker 1: the type to be like he's like the hell I am. Yeah. Yeah. Actually,
Speaker 1: you know, they said the same thing about Jalen Smith.
Speaker 1: If you remember, they didn't close the door on Jalen
Speaker 1: Smith playing year when everybody, every everybody else was like,
Speaker 1: he's not playing this year for Jerry didn't do that.
Speaker 1: Tell me about durn Bland because he's a guy that um,
Speaker 1: as you started kind of looking for information, there wasn't
Speaker 1: a lot of information out there about him, but he
Speaker 1: was taken in the fifth round one hundred and sixty seven. Overall,
Speaker 1: What are your thoughts on darn Bland cornerback? He fits
Speaker 1: the type, has long arms. I've seen his tape, I
Speaker 1: mean haven't seen much, but one thing that did stand
Speaker 1: out to me was how freaking long his arms are. Like,
Speaker 1: it's not your fro. Like you know those stinky hands
Speaker 1: that you little kids play with, It's like they just
Speaker 1: extend and are able to. He just has a really
Speaker 1: great reach. So that's about the only thing I really
Speaker 1: noticed because I couldn't find much about him. But yeah,
Speaker 1: you think that white tape makes it look longer, you know,
Speaker 1: the tape on the back of his arms. I mean, no,
Speaker 1: I like I like that play right there a lot,
Speaker 1: because you know, he's getting turned and he recognizes the
Speaker 1: ball at the same time. A lot of times when
Speaker 1: you getting turned, you're you're just trying to make sure
Speaker 1: you stay with the guy. Um. But but you know
Speaker 1: what I like about him, and you know, Dave, they
Speaker 1: probably studied him more or talked about him a lot more.
Speaker 1: But what I like about him is is that he's
Speaker 1: a big, physical guy. He's also a track guy. He's
Speaker 1: run he's a long jump and a and a sprinter.
Speaker 1: So I mean like he's a he's a track guy type.
Speaker 1: He's just an athlete. But no, I mean you have
Speaker 1: to like the skills that you see there. They had
Speaker 1: their eye on him for a while. He was a
Speaker 1: thirty visit guy. I think obvious. I mean, dan Quinn
Speaker 1: obviously really likes him, or else you don't draft him.
Speaker 1: I just I think you talk to her, you talk
Speaker 1: about the traits like good size, good athleticism, good measurables.
Speaker 1: Is he score off of this play? Yeah, this is
Speaker 1: one of the greatest highlights I've ever seen. It's a
Speaker 1: really good turn. Yeah. You think about everything that happened
Speaker 1: on that play. He probably ran forty yards just to
Speaker 1: chase and get the interception in range traffic, a few
Speaker 1: broken tackles. Okay, I have I have a backup kick
Speaker 1: returner here with Umny. I was gonna say, maybe he
Speaker 1: can be a return man, right, Seriously, that's the heck
Speaker 1: of a play because you get that interception a lot
Speaker 1: of times and you're like, okay, let go out of bounce.
Speaker 1: But he's like, so I can celebrate. Yeah, I love
Speaker 1: the idea. I mean, there might not be a position
Speaker 1: on the team where there's less pressure to contribute right away,
Speaker 1: at least as long as we're assuming Calvin Joseph is
Speaker 1: going to be around, which I am right now, then
Speaker 1: you're like automatically sixth on the depth chart, and this
Speaker 1: can be a year. You know, dan Quinn's probably gonna
Speaker 1: just try to mold you and contribute on special teams.
Speaker 1: Like I don't see a huge game. I don't see
Speaker 1: a huge defensive role for this guy right away. But
Speaker 1: the traits give you a real chance to grow. Absolutely,
Speaker 1: a lot of people are listening to us. They listen,
Speaker 1: you know that they're not watching the video, they're just
Speaker 1: uh listening to the audio only. What game was that
Speaker 1: that he intercepted that ball? And do you know it
Speaker 1: was a blue team and he plays for Fresno. I
Speaker 1: was gonna guess Air Force, but yeah, Boise State, Okay,
Speaker 1: that was That was Fresno versus Boise Probably a ninety
Speaker 1: nine hundred yard interceptor journey. That was a heck of
Speaker 1: a play. Yeah, all right, we appreciate you, guys, Joannis.
Speaker 1: We'll be back next week. Next week we'll get into
Speaker 1: a little more big picture of no love for Devin Harper. Hunh,
Speaker 1: I want to tell me real quick about Devin Harper.
Speaker 1: I'll tell I'm stealing this from Nick's thing yesterday. Like,
Speaker 1: I mean, that's a guy that can play a lot
Speaker 1: of special teams for you. Probably right away he's probably
Speaker 1: is he thirty years old? Yet he like twenty five
Speaker 1: he's like, he was at Oklahoma State for at least
Speaker 1: six years. He redshirted, got four, got us COVID year,
Speaker 1: so he was there for six years. And so he's
Speaker 1: he's twenty four. He's like the super super senior. But
Speaker 1: but he runs a four four and he's a he's
Speaker 1: a he's a running hit type of guy. That's what
Speaker 1: Will McClay told me. He's like, this guy runs, he
Speaker 1: hits and last year get eleven tackles for loss on defense.
Speaker 1: That's a lot of it. That's a lot. Yeah, So
Speaker 1: that's just last year alone. So he he's he gonna
Speaker 1: getting me burned at linebacker this year, you think, yeah,
Speaker 1: I think so. I mean, I think that's why they
Speaker 1: took another linebacker, knowing that Demon Clark's not gonna be
Speaker 1: able to play right now. He'll play some backup linebacker
Speaker 1: but play special teams. I feel a lot more confident,
Speaker 1: which I mean, they protect their draft picks anyway, but
Speaker 1: for being pick one ninety three, I feel more confident
Speaker 1: than usual that he would make the team because Demon
Speaker 1: Clark's a pup guy for sure, and um, and they
Speaker 1: don't have a ton of like special teams type of
Speaker 1: guys on their linebacker course, so never like write it
Speaker 1: in sharpie. But for being pick one ninety three, I
Speaker 1: think he's got a very clear path to the active roster. YEA,
Speaker 1: all right, we appreciate you guys. Jonas back next week.
Speaker 1: We'll get into some big picture stuff around this draft,
Speaker 1: from what it means holes that may still exist that
Speaker 1: they may need to fill. Talk about that next week
Speaker 1: till they for Nick Eatman, Dave Helmont, and Amber Garcia.
Speaker 1: I am Derek Eagleson. This has been the Break Alive
Speaker 1: on Dallas Cowboys dot Com Radio. This has been a
Speaker 1: production of Dallas Cowboys dot Com and the Dallas Cowboys
Speaker 1: Football Club.