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Speaker 1: Welcome to Good Game with Sarah Spain. Do you really

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Speaker 1: want to know where we were April twenty ninth.

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Speaker 2: We were reading.

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Speaker 1: Tailor's New York Times interview, obviously, and prepping for today's celebration.

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Speaker 1: It's our four hundred and fiftieth episode, y'all. It's Thursday,

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Speaker 1: April thirtieth. The On today's show, Big Citrus gets together

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Speaker 1: to celebrate four fifty. We'll take a look back at

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Speaker 1: the Good Game archive, analyze how the women's sports landscape

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Speaker 1: has changed, even just since the show started in the

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Speaker 1: summer of twenty twenty four.

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Speaker 2: Talk about how.

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Speaker 1: To discuss the highs and lows of the current women's

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Speaker 1: sportspoon and why we're so worried about WNBA Commissioner Katy

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Speaker 1: Engelbert's comments about quote unquote fragility. Then, of course, we

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Speaker 1: got to manifest what we want for the next four

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Speaker 1: hundred and fifty episodes, and we've got a little contest

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Speaker 1: we're cooking up too, plus a stunning upset in Spain,

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Speaker 1: another acl bites the dust, and one WNBA star says cheers.

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Speaker 1: It's all coming up right after this Welcome back slices.

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Speaker 1: Here's what you need to know today. Let's start with

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Speaker 1: the PWHL, where the Walter Cup playoffs get underway tonight

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Speaker 1: with number two Boston hosting number four Ottawa for Game

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Speaker 1: one of their best of five semi final series. That's

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Speaker 1: a seven pm Eastern puck drop. Recent history tells us

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Speaker 1: it might be a long one. During the regular season,

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Speaker 1: all four games between Boston and Ottawa went into overtime,

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Speaker 1: with the Charge ultimately winning three of the four. Ottawa's

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Speaker 1: looking at clinch a spot in the PWHL finals for

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Speaker 1: a second straight year, while Boston is looking to make

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Speaker 1: it back to the finals for the first time since

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty four. Meantime, Game one of the other semi

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Speaker 1: final series between number one Montreal and number three Minnesota

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Speaker 1: isn't till Saturday. In both semi final series, Boston and

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Speaker 1: Montreal will be looking to shake the PWHL's higher seed

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Speaker 1: playoff curse. During the first two years of the league,

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Speaker 1: the lower seeded team has won all four playoff semi finals.

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Speaker 1: To tennis, where world number the thirty Haley Baptiste continued

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Speaker 1: her stunning run at the Madrid Open on Tuesday, upsetting

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Speaker 1: world number one Arena sabaleaka two six six two, seven

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Speaker 1: to six. In the quarterfinals, the twenty four year old

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Speaker 1: American snapped Sabalaka's fifteen match win streak and she saved

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Speaker 1: six match points en route to her first ever win

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Speaker 1: over a top five opponent. She'll play in a WTA

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Speaker 1: one thousand semi final for the first time, taking on

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Speaker 1: world number nine Mira Andreva today at ten am Eastern.

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Speaker 1: Anastasia Potapova takes on Marte Kostyuk in the other quarterfinal

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Speaker 1: at three thirty pm Eastern to soccer. FIFA announced new

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Speaker 1: rules on Wednesday that will allow the Afghan women's refugee

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Speaker 1: team to compete as an official national team. The team,

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Speaker 1: called Afghan Women United, was created for Afghan women who

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Speaker 1: obtained refugee status abroad following the Taliban's return to power

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Speaker 1: in Afghanistan in twenty twenty one. Upon regaining power, the

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Speaker 1: Taliban banned women's sports across the nation and the Afghan

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Speaker 1: Football Federation stopped acknowledging the women's team. The new team

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Speaker 1: was formed after three selection camps were held across Europe

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Speaker 1: and Australia. US based refugees were not allowed to take

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Speaker 1: part after FIFA cited safety concerns as a reason for

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Speaker 1: not making a similar camp available. In a FIFA press release,

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Speaker 1: former Afghanistan captain Khalida Popol said, in part quote for

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Speaker 1: these players, representing Afghanistan is about identity, dignity, and hope.

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Speaker 1: This moment also shows that when we stand united, we

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Speaker 1: can achieve more.

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Speaker 2: End quote.

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Speaker 1: Friend at the show, Hailey Carter, president of Soccer ops

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Speaker 1: for the Washington Spirit, also wrote a FIFA's decision, saying

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Speaker 1: on Instagram quote, I had the privilege of coaching the

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Speaker 1: Afghan women, and I also helped coordinate their evacuation. I've

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Speaker 1: thought about those players a lot over the last four years.

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Speaker 2: Today is a good day.

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Speaker 1: Permitted to compete in FIFA competitions isn't a ceremonial gesture.

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Speaker 1: It's a legitimate pathway. It means the next generation of

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Speaker 1: Afghan women has somewhere to play, and that matters more

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Speaker 1: than people realize to every Afghan woman, whoever put on

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Speaker 1: that kit, whether you got one cap or twenty, whether

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Speaker 1: the world was watching or no one was, you kept

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Speaker 1: the program alive by refusing to disappear.

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Speaker 2: This victory is yours.

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Speaker 1: Sport doesn't fix geopolitics, but it can outlast them. Afghan

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Speaker 1: Women United proved it and FIFA finally caught up end quote.

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Speaker 1: FIFA will now fund a training camp for the Afghan

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Speaker 1: team this summer in New Zealand. More soccer, The NWSL

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Speaker 1: confirmed on Wednesday that the league will continue to operate

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Speaker 1: under its current spring to fall format through the twenty

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Speaker 1: thirty season. Now, we previously mentioned some reporting that the

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Speaker 1: league was set to vote on whether to flip its

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Speaker 1: schedule to be fall to spring, which would align with

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Speaker 1: most international leagues, but in a statement on Wednesday, the

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Speaker 1: league pointed to the strong momentum and growth they've achieved

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Speaker 1: with the current structure, noting that they'll continue to assess

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Speaker 1: the decision down the line. Per ESPN's Jeff Ksoof, the

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Speaker 1: decision to stick with the current schedule was made during

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Speaker 1: a board meeting on Tuesday, but a vote wasn't held

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Speaker 1: because it was clear that the proposal to flip didn't

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Speaker 1: have the required numbers to pass. We'll link to Jeff's

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Speaker 1: story in the show notes, which includes additional details on

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Speaker 1: the process to college softball, where Oklahoma softball is back

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Speaker 1: in the number one spot, at least according to a

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Speaker 1: couple of softball's many national pools. The Sooners leapfrog now

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Speaker 1: number two Nebraska and this week's Softball America rankings after

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Speaker 1: sweeping number fifteen Georgia last weekend, and they're also now

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Speaker 1: sitting in first in the SEC conference standings with the

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Speaker 1: regular season concluding this weekend and the conference tournament beginning

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Speaker 1: next Tuesday. Oklahoma freshman Kendall Wells also made a little

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Speaker 1: history over the weekend, hitting a first pitch home run

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Speaker 1: to break the Sooners single season home run record, her

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Speaker 1: thirty sixth of the season. Wells is also now just

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Speaker 1: one home run short of tying the NCAA's all time

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Speaker 1: single season home run record, a record set by Arizona's

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Speaker 1: Laura Espinoza back in nineteen ninety six. Wells could tie

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Speaker 1: or break that record as soon as tonight. Oklahoma has

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Speaker 1: a three game series against number Texas A and M

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Speaker 1: this weekend, with Game one getting underway tonight at nine

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Speaker 1: pm Eastern. Oh, sorry, what ranking is Texas A and M.

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Speaker 2: Twelve slash fourteen? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: There are so many conflicting college softball rankings that teams

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Speaker 1: use more than one, like number six slash eight Florida,

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Speaker 1: or even number seventeen slash fourteen Georgia. It's not confusing

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Speaker 1: at all toops. We mentioned earlier this week that some

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Speaker 1: training camp comments from the Indiana Fever's Kelsey Mitchell made

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Speaker 1: it unclear if she would actually play for International League

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Speaker 1: Project B this fall. The league said she would, but

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Speaker 1: Mitchell sounded like she wanted to stay stateside. The Indiana

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Speaker 1: Fever guard has now clarified her statements, telling Front Office

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Speaker 1: Sports that playing for Project B, a touring league with

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Speaker 1: seven two week long tournaments around the world, isn't the

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Speaker 1: same as her previous experience playing for pro teams based

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Speaker 1: in Egypt, Israel, Spain, and China. Mitchell said, quote, there's

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Speaker 1: a big difference, and I think people recognize what that

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Speaker 1: difference is. Project B gives you a chance to do both,

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Speaker 1: go in and come out, whereas with the overseas basketball

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Speaker 1: you got to be over there eight months or seven

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Speaker 1: months just to get everything you want.

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Speaker 2: End quote.

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Speaker 1: Speaking of Mitchell, the five eight guard will likely take

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Speaker 1: the court tonight in the Indiana Fever's second preseason game,

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Speaker 1: this one against the Dallas Wings, and it's the King's

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Speaker 1: first preseason game with their new lineup editions, including first

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Speaker 1: round draft pick Asy Fudd and last year's co Defensive

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Speaker 1: Player of the Year Elana Smith, who came to Dallas

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Speaker 1: from the Minnesota Links. Tip Off is at seven pm

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Speaker 1: Eastern more hoops. The New York Liberty announced on Tuesday

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Speaker 1: they've resigned guard Marine Johannes. The French player has played

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Speaker 1: off and on for the Liberty since twenty nineteen, taking

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Speaker 1: a few seasons off for covid or to focus on

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Speaker 1: national team play and overseas commitments. She reportedly signed a

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Speaker 1: one year minimum contract worth two hundred and seventy seven

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Speaker 1: thousand dollars more w and some tough news for two players.

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Speaker 1: The Golden State Valkyrie announced Tuesday that Kate Martin has

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Speaker 1: been diagnosed by the team's medical staff with a Grade

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Speaker 1: two quad strain.

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Speaker 2: Now, the Valks don't have any.

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Speaker 1: More preseason games, but their season opens next Friday, May eighth,

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Speaker 1: So depending on what the evaluation early next week says,

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Speaker 1: the twenty five year old Martin could be at risk

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Speaker 1: of missing the season opener. Will keep you posted over

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Speaker 1: At the Phoenix Mercury, forward Katherine Westbell tore her right

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Speaker 1: acl while playing overseas in Hungary. She'll miss the entire

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty sixth season. We're sending her up are best

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Speaker 1: wishes and fast healing. Finally some fun off court w

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Speaker 1: News Indiana Fever Guard Caitlin Clark is adding published author

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Speaker 1: to her resume. She's announced an upcoming children's book about

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Speaker 1: her life called Extraordinary, A Little Extra to Reach Big Dreams.

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Speaker 1: It'll feature a rhyming message about quote the foundation of

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Speaker 1: her success on and off the basketball court that love

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Speaker 1: and joy matter most end quote.

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Speaker 2: It's set to be published by Random House.

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Speaker 1: Books for young readers on November third, and for the

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Speaker 1: adult w fans, Kelsey Plum's Got You Covered. The Los

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Speaker 1: Angeles Sparks Guard is teamed up with Makers Mark to

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Speaker 1: create a custom private selection bourbon called Yam Jam, said

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Speaker 1: to open with aromas of bright chili, spice and citrus,

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Speaker 1: followed by notes of sweet potato pie, toasted pecan, and

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Speaker 1: soft baking spices. It'll be available beginning May seventh that

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Speaker 1: select retailers in LA and a portion of the sales

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Speaker 1: to benefit the LA Fire Department. Now there's a bit

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Speaker 1: of a personal connection for Plum there. Her brother Daniel,

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Speaker 1: is a firefighter for the nearby Ocean Side Fire Department. Now,

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Speaker 1: if you're listening, Kelsey or Makers mark that matter. Bianca

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Speaker 1: would love to be an official Taste tester.

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Speaker 2: We got to take a break. When we come back,

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Speaker 2: Big Citrus.

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Speaker 1: Celebrates four hundred and fifty and looks ahead to five

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Speaker 1: hundred and beyond. Stick around, Welcome back Slices, Alex Bianca,

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Speaker 1: get in here.

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Speaker 2: Hey, hi there.

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Speaker 1: Can you guys believe that in less than two years,

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Speaker 1: our little baby pod has reached four hundred and fifty episodes.

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Speaker 1: We blew past Mary Tyler Moore and Three's Company, We

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Speaker 1: cruised past the office and friends. We gave cheers in Dallas,

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Speaker 1: the old Yusain Bolt head turn, and now we're right

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Speaker 1: up there with Gray's Anatomy, and we're chasing down Law

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Speaker 1: and Order and of course always the Goat Saturday Night Live,

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Speaker 1: which actually passed one thousand episodes in January.

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Speaker 2: But I mean they had just a little little head start,

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Speaker 2: little head start.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, decades and maybe one day someday we'll catch up

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Speaker 1: to Terry Gross. She's only done, you know, somewhere between

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Speaker 1: fifteen thousand and eighteen thousand interviews during her fifty years

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Speaker 1: of posting Fresh Air. I can't decide if I actually

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Speaker 1: want to try to achieve eighteen thousand episodes, but for now.

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Speaker 2: We'll say yes, we're enjoying it for now.

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Speaker 3: My favorite part of that is that to not have

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Speaker 3: a set number between fifteen thousand and eighteen thousand, like

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Speaker 3: a three thousand episode.

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Speaker 4: Wiggle room is crazy to me.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, So do you think that we are anybody's comfort

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Speaker 5: show like Grey's Anatomy or Law and Order? You know,

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Speaker 5: it's hard because I feel like a comfort show is

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Speaker 5: usually a rewatch.

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Speaker 2: Ooh, that's a hot take. That's how I usually hear it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I mean to think that you can have something

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Speaker 1: that you go to that's pure and enjoyable, and you

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Speaker 1: watch when you need to be in a good mood,

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Speaker 1: and even if you haven't seen the episode, you still

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Speaker 1: expect that. But I think the term comfort show usually

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Speaker 1: is like a show you've already watched that you go

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Speaker 1: back to in the need.

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Speaker 2: And I'm wondering if we are that for any anybody else. Oh,

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Speaker 2: I would love that.

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Speaker 1: I have heard people say they've gone back to listen

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Speaker 1: to episodes that they'd already heard before. So maybe that's

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Speaker 1: the case, And certainly hopefully there are many of you

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Speaker 1: that haven't emailed us that agree that we're your first

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Speaker 1: listen every morning, because we certainly get a lot of

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Speaker 1: those emails people who say that.

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Speaker 2: That's how they start their day, which we love.

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Speaker 1: I mean, not one thousand, not eighteen thousand, but four

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Speaker 1: hundred and fifty is still impressive, to be honest. Though

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Speaker 1: more impressive is those folks who have told us that

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Speaker 1: they've listened to every single one.

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Speaker 2: We salute you, we thank you. We frankly exist because

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Speaker 2: of you, So thank you.

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Speaker 1: Slices Alex Bianca, any recent episodes you want to shout out, like,

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Speaker 1: obviously we've done a couple of little mini celebrations for

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Speaker 1: two hundred and two fifty and stuff, But what about

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Speaker 1: more recently.

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Speaker 2: Well, I have to be transparent.

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Speaker 5: I've only been here for seventy eight of the four

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Speaker 5: hundred and fifty episodes.

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Speaker 2: That is a measly seventeen percent.

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Speaker 5: But I would say Fish's monologue about Transjoy on trans

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Speaker 5: Day of Visibility stood out to me as just such

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Speaker 5: a well done kind of a comfort show. Speaking of

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Speaker 5: comfort shows, I think that's one that I've gone back

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Speaker 5: to listen to. I listened to it in the episode.

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Speaker 5: I listened to it on social media. That is an

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Speaker 5: evergreen message for sure. Sarah, your conversation at the end

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Speaker 5: of the Cheryl strad episode where you were talking about

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Speaker 5: your presidential campaign absolutely killed me. And then Swin cash

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Speaker 5: Is episode back at the beginning of this year was

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Speaker 5: such a good listen. If you haven't listened to it,

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Speaker 5: I implore you to get a notebook out and a

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Speaker 5: pen and press play.

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Speaker 2: Swins Got Bars.

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Speaker 1: For sure, I'm gonna jump in just because I want

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Speaker 1: to build on what you said about Cheryl Strad, Like,

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Speaker 1: two of my faves were definitely Cheryl Straight and Kristen Kish,

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Speaker 1: which I think tells you that as much as I

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Speaker 1: love straight up sports, I also just really like talking

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Speaker 1: to clever, interesting, smart, thoughtful people. And I also love charlie'

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Speaker 1: ledger Walker just found her so joyful.

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Speaker 2: And then all the Olympics.

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Speaker 1: Episodes for me, like that was a bucket list thing

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Speaker 1: to get to cover and then to get to do

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Speaker 1: it with Alex and like learn so much about all

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Speaker 1: the things while we were seeing them in person.

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Speaker 2: That to me was also really special.

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Speaker 3: What about you, el, Yeah, obviously the Olympics were a highlight. Honestly,

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Speaker 3: the other day I was having some like Olympic nostalgia.

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Speaker 3: I was like, I wish I was back in Italy

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Speaker 3: walking up the side of the road with a suitcase

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Speaker 3: and trying not to get hit by a car.

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Speaker 4: Like it was still a little scary.

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Speaker 3: In the moment, but like I would give a lot

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Speaker 3: to be back there right now.

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Speaker 1: That's why they always say it's either a good day

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Speaker 1: or a good story exact.

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Speaker 5: Maybe it wasn't a good time in the moment, but

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Speaker 5: it's always a good story later exactly.

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Speaker 3: Or attitude is the difference between an ordeal and an adventure.

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Speaker 2: There you go, Alex that Yeah, I.

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Speaker 3: Love that you mentioned Charlie Sledger Walker though that was

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Speaker 3: a favorite of mine. In fact, I think all of

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Speaker 3: the college basketball ones. I love Shay Ralph and michaeleb Blakes.

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Speaker 3: You know, I have a soft spot for any time

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Speaker 3: that you have a coach coming on and talking about

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Speaker 3: how much they love the player in front of that player.

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Speaker 4: And then also Rory Harmon Rory.

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Speaker 2: We all loved Rory.

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Speaker 3: As of this recording on Wednesday at three o'clock, she

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Speaker 3: is still hanging on that Mystics roster, and that's how

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Speaker 3: it's going to start.

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Speaker 2: You had some news.

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Speaker 4: I was like, no, not our girl.

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Speaker 2: Well, I do have an honorable mention. Let's hear it.

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Speaker 5: Honorable mention to Serving Daddy an Unhinged, unrivaled draft preview

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Speaker 5: with r fight Master and Aaron Foley that aired before

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Speaker 5: I joined the team, and I was listening to it

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Speaker 5: in public on the sidewalk and I just doubled over laughing.

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Speaker 2: I just love that episode. Thank you for bringing that up.

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Speaker 1: That is also, by far one of my favorites. And

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Speaker 1: I like everyone in a while to take the training

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Speaker 1: wheels off and ride downhill.

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Speaker 3: I also love hearing from people when they're like, I

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Speaker 3: was listening to your episode this morning and I started

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Speaker 3: laughing in public, and I'm like, that's all I want

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Speaker 3: in life is to make you laugh in an uncomfortable position.

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Speaker 5: That's what we want, speaking of as we continue to evolve,

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Speaker 5: we do want to hear what makes you laugh in public,

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Speaker 5: what makes you think, what makes you cry, what makes

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Speaker 5: you happy.

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Speaker 2: We want to tell the stories you want to hear.

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Speaker 2: We want to cover the leagues and sports that you're

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Speaker 2: interested in.

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Speaker 1: So there will be a survey coming your way soon

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Speaker 1: to help guide what the next four to fifty looks

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Speaker 1: like we did a survey way back early when the

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Speaker 1: show started, but we want to do that again and

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Speaker 1: get your feedback in the meantime before the survey goes

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Speaker 1: out as we're still sort of making it. You're always

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Speaker 1: welcome to send us your thoughts via email, so good

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Speaker 1: game at wondermedianetwork dot com if you want to chime

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Speaker 1: in on what the next few episodes look like.

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Speaker 2: But you know, before we look ahead.

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Speaker 1: I think we should look back because the summer of

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty four isn't that long ago, and yet the

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Speaker 1: women's sports space has seen some major changes. Just a

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Speaker 1: couple of things we all brainstormed and came up with.

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Speaker 1: The PWHL had just wrapped its very first season. There

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Speaker 1: were still only twelve WNBA teams and fourteen NWSL teams.

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Speaker 1: Unrivaled was just being announced months away from first tip off.

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Speaker 2: None of us really knew what it was going to

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Speaker 2: be or if it was going to work.

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Speaker 1: NWSL expansion team cost was still less than one hundred

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Speaker 1: million dollars. There was no Women's Across League, no Northern

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Speaker 1: Super League, no Love Pro Volleyble, no MLV. The WPBL

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Speaker 1: wasn't even on our radar. Asy Fud was still recovering

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Speaker 1: from our acl tair. They hadn't won the title, she

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Speaker 1: hadn't graduated and gotten drafted. There's just so much growth,

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Speaker 1: and it's interesting sometimes to be in this space where

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Speaker 1: we know about all of it, but to be talking

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Speaker 1: to people outside of it and they'll be like, wait what,

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Speaker 1: there's going to be a baseball league, or wait what

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Speaker 1: there's a lacrosse league. Like there's still so much growth

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Speaker 1: that can happen even in those spaces that have seen

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Speaker 1: this leap in the last two years.

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Speaker 2: So that's really exciting.

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Speaker 1: And I also feel like we're all just kind of

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Speaker 1: in a different place from when the show started.

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Speaker 2: I mean, Bianco wasn't even with us. No, I was

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Speaker 2: still covering men's sports. That's how long ago it was, Alex.

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Speaker 1: Before I came into Brighton every moment of your life.

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Speaker 3: I mean, hey, it's sad that the first thing I

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Speaker 3: thought of was, oh, my National Parks past still had

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Speaker 3: a picture of nature on the front of it.

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Speaker 4: But that's where we were folks.

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Speaker 1: Oh no, we used to put like a bison on

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Speaker 1: our National Park announcestead we put a human face, and

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Speaker 1: that has created an entire economy of like little sleeves

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Speaker 1: that you could put your pass in that cover just

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Speaker 1: part of it so that you don't have to see

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Speaker 1: I don't know a person's face when you're enjoying our

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Speaker 1: national wonders.

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Speaker 2: What was I doing?

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Speaker 1: I was still toiling away on my first book, trying

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Speaker 1: to finish writing it while we launched this show, which

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Speaker 1: was a good time, and now it's about to be

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Speaker 1: in paperback, so there we go. Yeah, a lot has changed,

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Speaker 1: and I have to say, like, it's been a real

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Speaker 1: delight getting to spend so much time in the women's

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Speaker 1: sports space, surrounded by people who I always say this,

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Speaker 1: but you know, I was built to swim upstream, but

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Speaker 1: it's been really nice the last couple of years to

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Speaker 1: swim with everyone in the same direction and follow the

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Speaker 1: flow like a little lazy river instead after many, many years.

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Speaker 2: Of having to swim upstream.

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Speaker 1: I think as we look around the space, we feel super,

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Speaker 1: super super excited about the continued growth and investment. The

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Speaker 1: NCAA space may be a little bit murkier. There's some

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Speaker 1: real fears, I think about the pipeline for Alympic Sports

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Speaker 1: and threats to Title nine.

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Speaker 2: So we're going to continue to address that on.

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Speaker 1: The show and cover it, and of course we'll continue

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Speaker 1: to talk about the ever evolving policies impacting trans athletes

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Speaker 1: and inclusion or lack thereof, But it does feel like

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Speaker 1: in the women's pro leagues were on steadier ground in

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Speaker 1: almost every way. Investment, engagement, awareness, coverage, all of it

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Speaker 1: is up.

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Speaker 2: Which is why it really stood out.

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Speaker 1: To us and Alex in particular, when we were listening

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Speaker 1: to WNBA commission Kathy Engelbert to the presser on the

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Speaker 1: CBA negotiations and seem to reveal a mindset that's very antiquated.

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Speaker 1: It had us kind of worried about league leadership. Take

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Speaker 1: a listen to the part we're talking about. Kathy was

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Speaker 1: asked what she learned from the negotiations, and here's part.

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Speaker 2: Of her answer.

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Speaker 6: Ultimately, we wanted to kind of strike this great balance

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Speaker 6: between significant increases and player salaries and benefits with the

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Speaker 6: economic sustainability of the league.

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Speaker 2: Because women's sports is.

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Speaker 6: Very fragile and can be very fragile, and we wanted

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Speaker 6: to make sure we were setting this leaku up not

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Speaker 6: just for the next six seven years under the CBA,

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Speaker 6: but for the next CBA, which is why you know,

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Speaker 6: you saw some things games going up over time, housing

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Speaker 6: phasing out over time, things like that to set up

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Speaker 6: the professionalism of the league.

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Speaker 2: So of course there's a lot of things we learned.

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Speaker 1: Okay, fragile, Alex, I'm going to give you the floor

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Speaker 1: here because when you heard that, I thought I saw

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Speaker 1: a little steam.

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Speaker 2: Coming out of your head.

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Speaker 3: Oh, one hundred percent boiling water was underneath the surface.

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Speaker 2: No.

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Speaker 3: I actually could not believe that she said that, and

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Speaker 3: it took me a while. Actually, I haven't watched her

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Speaker 3: press conference in full. People were talking about the comments

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Speaker 3: that she had made about her adult children and their

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Speaker 3: housing expenses, about her pulling the gender card out when

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Speaker 3: asked about the future of her job, and so I

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Speaker 3: think there were some other headlines from it. But wow,

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Speaker 3: when I tell you, I could write a book about

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Speaker 3: how the word fragility has been used in women's pro

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Speaker 3: sports history.

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Speaker 4: It goes back a really long time.

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Speaker 3: And the first story that actually came to mind is

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Speaker 3: one from Megan Burke, now the executive director of the

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Speaker 3: NWSL Players Association, and she has a story that she's

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Speaker 3: told I think maybe even on this show, but back

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Speaker 3: when she was playing in the WUSA, there was a

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Speaker 3: day when the players basically came in for a meeting

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Speaker 3: and were told that they had to take a twenty

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Speaker 3: five percent pay cut by five o'clock that day or.

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Speaker 4: Else the league was going to fold.

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Speaker 3: And if they didn't say yes to that, then they

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Speaker 3: shouldn't even bother coming to training the next day. So

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Speaker 3: they agreed to take the pay cut, and you know

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Speaker 3: what happened. Anyway, the league folded later that year. Because

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Speaker 3: anytime that we have seen a league make that type

440
00:20:29,920 --> 00:20:33,400
Speaker 3: of proposition to the players, it is a sign of instability.

441
00:20:33,600 --> 00:20:36,639
Speaker 4: And we saw it too with the Yates Report.

442
00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:39,320
Speaker 3: I think this is why I have such a strong

443
00:20:39,359 --> 00:20:41,639
Speaker 3: reaction to the use of the word fragility. Is just

444
00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:44,680
Speaker 3: reading through the Yates Report, which, for those folks who

445
00:20:44,680 --> 00:20:47,639
Speaker 3: are newer to the space, was the report in twenty

446
00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:51,000
Speaker 3: twenty two that Sally Yates did into the NWSL and

447
00:20:51,119 --> 00:20:54,960
Speaker 3: the allegations of abuse against coaches and other leaders in

448
00:20:54,960 --> 00:20:57,960
Speaker 3: that league. And I'm going to read a section of

449
00:20:58,000 --> 00:20:59,560
Speaker 3: it actually because I think it will kind of get

450
00:20:59,560 --> 00:21:02,760
Speaker 3: at the point trying to make here quote. Players were

451
00:21:02,800 --> 00:21:05,720
Speaker 3: also repeatedly enlisted in the effort to keep the league

452
00:21:05,760 --> 00:21:08,199
Speaker 3: afloat by protecting it from scandal, and were told to

453
00:21:08,200 --> 00:21:10,840
Speaker 3: be grateful that they had an opportunity to play professional

454
00:21:10,840 --> 00:21:13,359
Speaker 3: soccer at all. The threat of the team or league

455
00:21:13,359 --> 00:21:16,840
Speaker 3: failure was acute and persistent. The NWSL was the third

456
00:21:16,840 --> 00:21:19,600
Speaker 3: attempt to field a women's professional league and was established

457
00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:22,880
Speaker 3: with low capital requirements to ensure the league had eight teams.

458
00:21:23,440 --> 00:21:26,240
Speaker 3: Many teams seemed to be one bad season away from shuddering.

459
00:21:26,720 --> 00:21:29,960
Speaker 3: Players reported being told by federation leadership and certain team

460
00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:32,760
Speaker 3: owners that the league was not commercially successful enough to

461
00:21:32,840 --> 00:21:35,880
Speaker 3: warrant for their financial investment, and that the only way

462
00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:37,920
Speaker 3: to ensure the league's survival.

463
00:21:37,520 --> 00:21:40,680
Speaker 2: Was for players to support the league. End quote.

464
00:21:41,000 --> 00:21:44,240
Speaker 3: And one of the themes that came out after the Yates

465
00:21:44,320 --> 00:21:48,480
Speaker 3: report was players talking about how this fear of fragility,

466
00:21:48,560 --> 00:21:51,159
Speaker 3: this fear of failure, was one of the reasons that

467
00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:53,159
Speaker 3: they didn't speak up. They didn't want to be the

468
00:21:53,160 --> 00:21:54,840
Speaker 3: one to raise their hand and say, hey, there are

469
00:21:54,840 --> 00:21:57,800
Speaker 3: major problems here, and next thing you know, the league

470
00:21:57,840 --> 00:22:01,000
Speaker 3: goes under. So to hear Kathy you the word fragility,

471
00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:04,000
Speaker 3: I just found it shocking because, don't get me wrong,

472
00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:10,480
Speaker 3: it's completely appropriate to have sound financial figures guiding you forward.

473
00:22:10,960 --> 00:22:14,600
Speaker 3: But if she thinks that the WNBA is fragile with

474
00:22:14,760 --> 00:22:18,280
Speaker 3: all of the MNBA owners, that she has gotten a board,

475
00:22:18,720 --> 00:22:22,720
Speaker 3: that's bad. And I don't think it's accurately depicting the reality.

476
00:22:22,840 --> 00:22:25,000
Speaker 4: I think it's just one of the negotiation.

477
00:22:24,600 --> 00:22:26,960
Speaker 3: Tactics that we saw the league use in order to

478
00:22:27,040 --> 00:22:29,840
Speaker 3: keep players from demanding more in the latest CBA.

479
00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:32,200
Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean it feels like something we were talking about.

480
00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:33,400
Speaker 2: I remember back when we talked.

481
00:22:33,200 --> 00:22:37,000
Speaker 1: To Alicia Clark as the negotiations were underway at the

482
00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:40,040
Speaker 1: end of last season. The conversation was, how do you,

483
00:22:40,119 --> 00:22:43,000
Speaker 1: out of one side of your mouth, tell these prospective

484
00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:45,680
Speaker 1: owners that they should be battling for expansion team rights

485
00:22:45,680 --> 00:22:48,639
Speaker 1: in the hundreds of million dollars while simultaneously saying that

486
00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:50,639
Speaker 1: the league is not a good investment and that it

487
00:22:50,720 --> 00:22:53,000
Speaker 1: is on unsteady footing.

488
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:56,360
Speaker 2: And that's what this feels like. Right during negotiations.

489
00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:59,560
Speaker 1: Let's tell everybody that we can't possibly afford to stay

490
00:22:59,560 --> 00:23:01,720
Speaker 1: afloat if we give the players all the demands they're

491
00:23:01,720 --> 00:23:05,800
Speaker 1: asking for. But at the same time, those billionaires who

492
00:23:05,840 --> 00:23:09,040
Speaker 1: are invested in a million spaces are seeing this space

493
00:23:09,040 --> 00:23:10,880
Speaker 1: as one where they want to put their money. They're

494
00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:14,120
Speaker 1: seeing this space as one with exponential growth, and it

495
00:23:14,160 --> 00:23:17,160
Speaker 1: is frustrating for all the reasons that you mentioned, Alex,

496
00:23:17,200 --> 00:23:18,920
Speaker 1: I would say you could also go back even further

497
00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:22,080
Speaker 1: the word fragility, referring obviously to our uteruses and what

498
00:23:22,119 --> 00:23:24,920
Speaker 1: will happen to them if we play sport, but specifically

499
00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:29,600
Speaker 1: when it comes to financial standing and future success. It's

500
00:23:29,960 --> 00:23:35,479
Speaker 1: something we always talk about with men's potential, investing in

501
00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:38,480
Speaker 1: what's next, investing in a belief that people will show

502
00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:40,880
Speaker 1: up and care about it and like it even when

503
00:23:40,960 --> 00:23:45,359
Speaker 1: proved otherwise. Whereas on the women's side, not letting the

504
00:23:45,400 --> 00:23:48,080
Speaker 1: success of say the US women's national teams selling out

505
00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:51,280
Speaker 1: major stadiums for their own friendly tour that they had

506
00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:53,640
Speaker 1: to put on for themselves after the ninety nine ers,

507
00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:56,840
Speaker 1: one like those moments didn't make you say, ooh, if

508
00:23:56,840 --> 00:23:58,840
Speaker 1: we put a little bit more into this, we'll be

509
00:23:58,920 --> 00:24:02,480
Speaker 1: able to keep, you know, building, instead always falling back

510
00:24:02,520 --> 00:24:05,199
Speaker 1: on antiquated ideas that there wasn't enough there to grow on.

511
00:24:05,600 --> 00:24:08,040
Speaker 1: And I do agree with you, it is really upsetting

512
00:24:08,040 --> 00:24:11,359
Speaker 1: for the person in charge to be the one putting

513
00:24:11,400 --> 00:24:12,399
Speaker 1: that narrative out there.

514
00:24:12,680 --> 00:24:14,840
Speaker 2: Yeah, for sure, And I think too.

515
00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:18,120
Speaker 3: That's not to say that even in a successful league

516
00:24:18,320 --> 00:24:20,600
Speaker 3: that there can't be financial instability.

517
00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:21,399
Speaker 2: Right.

518
00:24:21,440 --> 00:24:23,359
Speaker 3: That's something that we've known about men's sports for a

519
00:24:23,400 --> 00:24:25,679
Speaker 3: long time, which is that a lot of these teams

520
00:24:25,680 --> 00:24:28,399
Speaker 3: that have massive valuations, that doesn't mean that they're bringing

521
00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:31,159
Speaker 3: in a profit every year. It is expensive to operate

522
00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:34,199
Speaker 3: a team, It is expensive to operate a league. And

523
00:24:34,280 --> 00:24:36,520
Speaker 3: yet what we saw in the early years of women's

524
00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:39,800
Speaker 3: sports was that they expected people to show up to

525
00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:43,760
Speaker 3: games without any marketing budget, without any type of promotional opportunities,

526
00:24:43,800 --> 00:24:46,200
Speaker 3: and then when folks didn't, they blamed the players.

527
00:24:46,600 --> 00:24:48,800
Speaker 4: And so thankfully we have seen these.

528
00:24:48,800 --> 00:24:52,160
Speaker 3: Leagues spend more money, invest more money on the things

529
00:24:52,200 --> 00:24:53,920
Speaker 3: that you need to do in order to get butts

530
00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:55,639
Speaker 3: and seats. And so I think that's also why the

531
00:24:55,640 --> 00:24:59,040
Speaker 3: fragility argument stuck with me, was because if you think

532
00:24:59,040 --> 00:25:00,879
Speaker 3: of it as fragile, than what are you not willing

533
00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:01,639
Speaker 3: to spend money on?

534
00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:03,679
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I mean I think a key point in

535
00:25:03,680 --> 00:25:06,760
Speaker 1: that is when men's leagues take a step back, or

536
00:25:06,800 --> 00:25:10,600
Speaker 1: when specific teams in a league struggle, the immediate answer

537
00:25:10,720 --> 00:25:11,879
Speaker 1: isn't blame the product.

538
00:25:11,880 --> 00:25:12,360
Speaker 2: Shut it down.

539
00:25:12,359 --> 00:25:15,600
Speaker 1: This isn't going to work, whereas in women's leagues much

540
00:25:15,680 --> 00:25:19,080
Speaker 1: much smaller losses are pointed to as a reason not

541
00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:22,320
Speaker 1: to believe in the future of the sport, or fan

542
00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:25,399
Speaker 1: showing up or anything else. And yeah, we'll keep an

543
00:25:25,400 --> 00:25:28,439
Speaker 1: eye on whether that was just her having that stuck

544
00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:31,159
Speaker 1: in her head from months of using it in negotiations,

545
00:25:31,520 --> 00:25:34,240
Speaker 1: or whether it's something that will actually inform her behavior

546
00:25:34,280 --> 00:25:36,680
Speaker 1: and decision making as she continues to be at.

547
00:25:36,560 --> 00:25:37,720
Speaker 2: The top of this league.

548
00:25:38,080 --> 00:25:40,520
Speaker 1: It's worth noting, by the way, that we can push

549
00:25:40,600 --> 00:25:44,840
Speaker 1: back on the quote unquote fragile narrative without ignoring that

550
00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:47,560
Speaker 1: there is room for growth and a real need, as

551
00:25:47,560 --> 00:25:49,680
Speaker 1: you mentioned Alex, for the data and revenue to catch

552
00:25:49,720 --> 00:25:52,800
Speaker 1: up to investment and enthusiasm. I think we had MLV

553
00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:55,080
Speaker 1: commissioner Jamie Weston on and she had the perfect phrase

554
00:25:55,119 --> 00:25:55,359
Speaker 1: for it.

555
00:25:55,400 --> 00:25:57,359
Speaker 2: Don't confuse momentum with maturity.

556
00:25:57,760 --> 00:25:59,880
Speaker 1: It's great that everything is headed in this positive direction,

557
00:26:00,200 --> 00:26:02,399
Speaker 1: but that doesn't mean that we're at a place necessarily

558
00:26:02,640 --> 00:26:04,720
Speaker 1: where we can keep up with men's leagues. And I think,

559
00:26:04,880 --> 00:26:07,800
Speaker 1: you know, Christina Ltz of the NSL Northern Super League,

560
00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:10,679
Speaker 1: Canada's league said the same thing, like we want to

561
00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:13,680
Speaker 1: do all the things our fans want us to and

562
00:26:13,720 --> 00:26:16,440
Speaker 1: also the expectation that we're already on par with leagues

563
00:26:16,440 --> 00:26:19,000
Speaker 1: that have one hundred year head start is kind of unfair, right,

564
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:21,080
Speaker 1: We still need some time to build up to that.

565
00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:25,159
Speaker 1: So how do we talk about the lows during this

566
00:26:25,800 --> 00:26:28,159
Speaker 1: extremely high time? How do we talk about things like

567
00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:32,000
Speaker 1: empty seats in stadiums or ratings numbers that we wish

568
00:26:32,000 --> 00:26:36,600
Speaker 1: were higher? Super Slice Amanda Vallo, also our chief accessibility officer,

569
00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:38,840
Speaker 1: brought up this very issue in a recent email, and

570
00:26:38,880 --> 00:26:40,880
Speaker 1: she wrote, in part quote, after listening to the show

571
00:26:40,880 --> 00:26:43,040
Speaker 1: with Andrea Brimmer, it seems pretty clear the business of

572
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:46,679
Speaker 1: women's sports is expanding exponentially and sponsors are showing up

573
00:26:46,680 --> 00:26:50,320
Speaker 1: thanks to greater accessibility, social media presence, values, alignment, popularity,

574
00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:52,880
Speaker 1: et cetera. I was flying high, getting in the game,

575
00:26:52,960 --> 00:26:55,680
Speaker 1: doing my slice work, tuning into the evening Love playoff match,

576
00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:58,040
Speaker 1: and then needed my crash out jar.

577
00:26:58,600 --> 00:26:59,840
Speaker 2: Lots of empty seats.

578
00:27:00,200 --> 00:27:02,600
Speaker 1: These are elite athletes and competitors, and the arena is

579
00:27:02,640 --> 00:27:06,639
Speaker 1: only half full. I experienced something similar coming off an

580
00:27:06,680 --> 00:27:10,000
Speaker 1: amazing Denver Summit kickoff event and later tuning into an

581
00:27:10,080 --> 00:27:12,240
Speaker 1: Orlando Pride match where I was able to spot and

582
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:15,240
Speaker 1: pick out my friend in her seat only two seasons

583
00:27:15,240 --> 00:27:17,879
Speaker 1: removed from a championship, MARTA's on the pitch and the

584
00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:20,640
Speaker 1: crowd is dead. My question is, how do I talk

585
00:27:20,680 --> 00:27:23,040
Speaker 1: intelligently about this? How do I reconcile what I know

586
00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:25,600
Speaker 1: to be true that women's sports are awesome and amazing,

587
00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:28,960
Speaker 1: and at times the hype or reported data doesn't pass

588
00:27:29,000 --> 00:27:30,000
Speaker 1: the eyeball test.

589
00:27:30,600 --> 00:27:31,200
Speaker 2: End quote.

590
00:27:31,840 --> 00:27:36,480
Speaker 1: Amanda is our best emailer. Everyone else is amazing, but

591
00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:40,480
Speaker 1: she always comes through funny, smart, thoughtful with all the references,

592
00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:43,320
Speaker 1: and she's so spot on here, and it's something that

593
00:27:43,440 --> 00:27:46,000
Speaker 1: I think we do have to acknowledge. And in that

594
00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:48,920
Speaker 1: conversation with Andrew, I think we wanted to pivot from

595
00:27:48,960 --> 00:27:50,320
Speaker 1: just celebrating.

596
00:27:49,720 --> 00:27:52,400
Speaker 2: Their fifty to fifty to what does that look like next?

597
00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:54,400
Speaker 1: And how will we keep fans from getting phased out

598
00:27:54,400 --> 00:27:57,359
Speaker 1: and priced out, and how will we keep investment and

599
00:27:57,520 --> 00:27:59,800
Speaker 1: revenue and profit and everything up on.

600
00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:03,720
Speaker 5: The same level with the enthusiasm so bianco Yeah, I mean,

601
00:28:03,760 --> 00:28:06,879
Speaker 5: I think women's sports, despite being as Amanda said, looking

602
00:28:06,960 --> 00:28:11,840
Speaker 5: awesome and amazing, they're up against real world challenges of

603
00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:17,119
Speaker 5: unemployment rates and people not having funds to spend on

604
00:28:17,359 --> 00:28:21,080
Speaker 5: leisure activities and the money that people do have, they

605
00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:25,159
Speaker 5: are putting what they can toward women's sports. But I

606
00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:28,920
Speaker 5: think that it's just a reality of where this country

607
00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:32,280
Speaker 5: in particular is right now because of everything else going on.

608
00:28:32,920 --> 00:28:37,200
Speaker 5: Even though more teams are getting investments and we are

609
00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:40,720
Speaker 5: seeing this amazing growth, there's also this reality of you

610
00:28:40,800 --> 00:28:43,120
Speaker 5: got to have money in your pocket to be able

611
00:28:43,160 --> 00:28:44,440
Speaker 5: to get your button the seat.

612
00:28:44,640 --> 00:28:44,880
Speaker 2: Yeah.

613
00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:47,520
Speaker 3: I always think of the context here, like one, I

614
00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:49,800
Speaker 3: call it out when you see it, like I don't

615
00:28:49,840 --> 00:28:54,959
Speaker 3: think that we can be supporters of women's sports without

616
00:28:55,040 --> 00:28:59,280
Speaker 3: acknowledging the reality that sometimes they fall short, whether that's

617
00:28:59,320 --> 00:29:01,400
Speaker 3: it in how many people show up to a game.

618
00:29:01,320 --> 00:29:02,640
Speaker 4: Or how many people are tuning in.

619
00:29:03,040 --> 00:29:05,080
Speaker 3: For me, I always want to know the context though,

620
00:29:05,120 --> 00:29:07,800
Speaker 3: because again a lot of times in history, we've seen

621
00:29:07,880 --> 00:29:12,880
Speaker 3: people blame the product versus how much was the marketing budget?

622
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:15,440
Speaker 3: What else is going on in this city today? What

623
00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:18,160
Speaker 3: network was it put on or is it just on streaming?

624
00:29:18,240 --> 00:29:20,520
Speaker 3: Like there are all of these other factors that can

625
00:29:20,800 --> 00:29:25,640
Speaker 3: result in awareness, and so call it out when you

626
00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:28,040
Speaker 3: see it, but also ask why did.

627
00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:28,520
Speaker 4: This come to be?

628
00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:30,920
Speaker 3: Because I don't think it's inherent that only two thousand

629
00:29:30,960 --> 00:29:32,840
Speaker 3: people show up to a game, right, Like, there's a

630
00:29:32,880 --> 00:29:34,600
Speaker 3: reason only two thousand people showed up.

631
00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:36,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, the Orlando Pride are a tough one because I

632
00:29:36,600 --> 00:29:38,880
Speaker 1: think a lot of us are watching from afar.

633
00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:41,600
Speaker 5: Like it's smarta, Like, look at all the talent that

634
00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:43,680
Speaker 5: you have. It's Barbara Banda, get out there.

635
00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:47,400
Speaker 1: But yeah, there's so many factors to take into account, Alex,

636
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:50,280
Speaker 1: and I'm in particular, I'm not super knowledgeable about the

637
00:29:50,280 --> 00:29:52,760
Speaker 1: stadium and the area and all the other factors that

638
00:29:52,840 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 1: go into play there. But one thing I'll say is

639
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:58,160
Speaker 1: that I do have a little bit of panic when

640
00:29:58,200 --> 00:30:00,320
Speaker 1: I turn on the TV and I see empty seats

641
00:30:00,320 --> 00:30:02,480
Speaker 1: for games in a way that I don't for things

642
00:30:02,520 --> 00:30:05,560
Speaker 1: like Major League Baseball. And yet there are so many

643
00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:11,280
Speaker 1: Major League Baseball teams that have entire sections completely empty,

644
00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:15,360
Speaker 1: and they've had a eighty ninety year head start. So

645
00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:17,800
Speaker 1: it's not something to be ignored when somewhere doesn't have

646
00:30:18,120 --> 00:30:20,520
Speaker 1: full seats and people aren't showing up. But it is

647
00:30:20,680 --> 00:30:23,440
Speaker 1: not something to panic over. It's a part of a

648
00:30:23,520 --> 00:30:27,000
Speaker 1: larger conversation about how these leagues will continue to grow.

649
00:30:27,200 --> 00:30:29,920
Speaker 1: I do think Bianca's point is spot on, not just

650
00:30:30,000 --> 00:30:32,280
Speaker 1: the cost of tickets and concessions and everything else, but

651
00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:35,400
Speaker 1: gas now to get to the game that you're going

652
00:30:35,440 --> 00:30:39,800
Speaker 1: to right, And I think the facility is being owned

653
00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:42,800
Speaker 1: by the teams will help with all of this when

654
00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:45,560
Speaker 1: they can profit off parking and food and beverage and

655
00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:48,600
Speaker 1: everything else, as opposed to giving a massive cut to

656
00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:51,200
Speaker 1: somebody else before they can even start to make money

657
00:30:51,200 --> 00:30:53,720
Speaker 1: back off of all the fans showing up. That's going

658
00:30:53,760 --> 00:30:56,080
Speaker 1: to make it easier, I think, to not be quite

659
00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:58,280
Speaker 1: so freaked out about whether they hit a certain number

660
00:30:58,400 --> 00:31:01,360
Speaker 1: for each game, but you're leading for everything even when

661
00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:02,240
Speaker 1: it's not good.

662
00:31:02,760 --> 00:31:05,080
Speaker 2: Isn't the answer, And for a long time it felt

663
00:31:05,120 --> 00:31:05,680
Speaker 2: like it was.

664
00:31:05,840 --> 00:31:09,840
Speaker 1: We had to counteract such toxicity in the space by

665
00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:12,720
Speaker 1: promoting all the good stuff and highlighting the great stories

666
00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:14,920
Speaker 1: and the players and everything else. Now we're in a

667
00:31:14,920 --> 00:31:18,400
Speaker 1: position where this will be more professionalized and more well

668
00:31:18,440 --> 00:31:21,360
Speaker 1: received if we're willing to acknowledge when things aren't done

669
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:23,800
Speaker 1: right at the very highest levels, all the way down

670
00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:26,120
Speaker 1: to the marketing and the people not showing up. And

671
00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:31,000
Speaker 1: I think the sign of a solid foundation is when

672
00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:33,800
Speaker 1: a league will be able to start to hold teams

673
00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:37,400
Speaker 1: accountable for not reaching certain metrics. The NWSL's new deal

674
00:31:37,800 --> 00:31:42,080
Speaker 1: has in place expectations for certain things by a certain date.

675
00:31:42,120 --> 00:31:45,200
Speaker 1: The WNBA has demands to its teams that you have

676
00:31:45,240 --> 00:31:48,560
Speaker 1: to hit this level of facility and this level of

677
00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:51,880
Speaker 1: resources by this date, and they'll start holding teams to

678
00:31:51,920 --> 00:31:55,160
Speaker 1: account and that will eventually make a much better environment

679
00:31:55,200 --> 00:31:55,600
Speaker 1: for everyone.

680
00:31:55,640 --> 00:31:57,400
Speaker 2: But in the meantime, it'll.

681
00:31:57,240 --> 00:31:59,520
Speaker 1: Be a little sticky, especially in the places that aren't

682
00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:03,240
Speaker 1: spending on their marketing and aren't you know, telling fans

683
00:32:03,440 --> 00:32:06,640
Speaker 1: why to come and where to be. And we should

684
00:32:06,680 --> 00:32:08,920
Speaker 1: call those places out because they're letting their fan bases

685
00:32:08,920 --> 00:32:12,040
Speaker 1: down and they're letting their players down. But Amanda, in

686
00:32:12,080 --> 00:32:14,960
Speaker 1: the meantime, you asked, how do I talk intelligently about this? Well,

687
00:32:15,000 --> 00:32:16,520
Speaker 1: one way to shut up people who seem to use

688
00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:18,800
Speaker 1: a different metric for women's sports and men's is to

689
00:32:18,800 --> 00:32:20,640
Speaker 1: bring up some of the numbers from the men's teams

690
00:32:20,640 --> 00:32:22,480
Speaker 1: that also struggle to put butts in seats.

691
00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:26,080
Speaker 2: You know, MLS attendants. FC Dallas, the least.

692
00:32:25,840 --> 00:32:28,360
Speaker 1: Attended team in the league last year, had an average

693
00:32:28,400 --> 00:32:31,360
Speaker 1: of eleven thousand fans. Or if you want to go

694
00:32:31,640 --> 00:32:34,560
Speaker 1: to something with a much much, much, much longer head

695
00:32:34,600 --> 00:32:37,680
Speaker 1: start the Oakland A's Now, to be fair, there's a

696
00:32:37,720 --> 00:32:40,680
Speaker 1: lot going on with Oakland and the removal of the team,

697
00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:43,800
Speaker 1: but they had the lowest total attendance at MLB last year.

698
00:32:43,840 --> 00:32:46,680
Speaker 1: They only averaged about eleven five hundred and twenty eight fans.

699
00:32:46,920 --> 00:32:51,280
Speaker 1: So you're looking at a team that has decades decades

700
00:32:51,320 --> 00:32:55,240
Speaker 1: to build and the Tampa Bay Rays barely beat them

701
00:32:55,240 --> 00:32:57,440
Speaker 1: out by just a couple hundred people.

702
00:32:57,960 --> 00:33:00,360
Speaker 2: And so those are mlbts.

703
00:33:00,680 --> 00:33:03,360
Speaker 1: So I think you can point to places that are

704
00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:06,720
Speaker 1: also struggling from the same issues with getting fans, butts

705
00:33:06,720 --> 00:33:09,520
Speaker 1: and seats and the fact that no one's calling for

706
00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:12,040
Speaker 1: MLS or MLB or any of these men's leaks to

707
00:33:12,040 --> 00:33:14,720
Speaker 1: shut down. So let's wrap this up on our four

708
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:17,120
Speaker 1: hundred and fiftieth episode. And I like to end on

709
00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:19,080
Speaker 1: a positive, So let's start with the things we are

710
00:33:19,120 --> 00:33:19,640
Speaker 1: worried about.

711
00:33:19,680 --> 00:33:20,640
Speaker 2: Let's not cheerlead.

712
00:33:20,800 --> 00:33:23,520
Speaker 1: Let's also discuss some of the realistic things to worry about.

713
00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:26,040
Speaker 1: For me, I've been talking about them, you know, the

714
00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:29,080
Speaker 1: last week or two, in particular with the Columbus expansion

715
00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:31,720
Speaker 1: team on the NWSL side, I'm a little worried about

716
00:33:31,720 --> 00:33:34,640
Speaker 1: male led ownership groups and NFL ownership groups coming into

717
00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:37,280
Speaker 1: the women's space, people who don't have that same touch

718
00:33:37,320 --> 00:33:40,360
Speaker 1: point with the women's space and women athletes, and also

719
00:33:40,640 --> 00:33:44,200
Speaker 1: with US dominance waning when it comes to global sports

720
00:33:44,280 --> 00:33:46,959
Speaker 1: soccer and other sports where other countries are catching up

721
00:33:47,000 --> 00:33:49,880
Speaker 1: to us. Does some of the enthusiasm that stems from

722
00:33:49,920 --> 00:33:54,240
Speaker 1: intense patriotism and love of our dominance mean that the

723
00:33:54,480 --> 00:33:58,360
Speaker 1: interest will wane if we are getting beaten in Olympic

724
00:33:58,640 --> 00:34:01,920
Speaker 1: and World Cup and World Championship level events.

725
00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:03,840
Speaker 2: So that's something to keep an eye. I hope that's

726
00:34:03,840 --> 00:34:06,200
Speaker 2: not the case. We like to win stuff here in America,

727
00:34:06,480 --> 00:34:07,000
Speaker 2: that's true.

728
00:34:07,560 --> 00:34:09,319
Speaker 3: I think we should also just call out that, like

729
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:14,520
Speaker 3: waning interest is natural in a way, you know, we

730
00:34:14,600 --> 00:34:17,719
Speaker 3: saw it with a WNBA still to this day, the

731
00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:20,719
Speaker 3: high watermarks for the WNBA in terms of attendance and

732
00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:24,000
Speaker 3: viewership are from those very early seasons in the nineties,

733
00:34:24,680 --> 00:34:29,399
Speaker 3: and so do we expect that the league's current level

734
00:34:29,400 --> 00:34:33,680
Speaker 3: of momentum is going to hold on forever? Probably not.

735
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:37,480
Speaker 3: And so I think like what is being done intentionally

736
00:34:37,560 --> 00:34:40,080
Speaker 3: behind the scenes to make sure that things are being

737
00:34:40,120 --> 00:34:42,480
Speaker 3: done to keep people tuning in, to keep people showing

738
00:34:42,560 --> 00:34:44,360
Speaker 3: up to games and to not kind of hit the

739
00:34:44,400 --> 00:34:47,480
Speaker 3: panic button if we see those decreases.

740
00:34:47,680 --> 00:34:49,520
Speaker 1: Worth noting, by the way, the drop in interest after

741
00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:52,160
Speaker 1: the earliers of the w was because of suppression, right,

742
00:34:52,280 --> 00:34:55,600
Speaker 1: So making sure that first of all, there isn't intentional

743
00:34:55,600 --> 00:34:58,640
Speaker 1: suppression by moving it to lesser networks or giving it,

744
00:34:58,719 --> 00:35:02,640
Speaker 1: you know, worse time slots, but also to continue to

745
00:35:02,680 --> 00:35:05,839
Speaker 1: increase and work on driving engagement and growth so that

746
00:35:05,840 --> 00:35:07,600
Speaker 1: there isn't a free gat or panic if there is

747
00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:10,240
Speaker 1: a wane and interest after this big boom around the CBA.

748
00:35:10,600 --> 00:35:13,800
Speaker 5: Yeah, and should we even be looking at TV viewership

749
00:35:13,920 --> 00:35:16,200
Speaker 5: numbers and comparing them to the nineties.

750
00:35:16,400 --> 00:35:17,200
Speaker 2: I mean, if you want to.

751
00:35:17,200 --> 00:35:20,600
Speaker 5: See three point how many people watch Survivor finalees twenty

752
00:35:20,680 --> 00:35:22,799
Speaker 5: years ago versus now and they still call that show

753
00:35:22,880 --> 00:35:24,920
Speaker 5: number one show? Why don't we get that kind of

754
00:35:24,960 --> 00:35:26,480
Speaker 5: treatment here in women's sports?

755
00:35:26,800 --> 00:35:29,400
Speaker 2: Okay, really quick? What are we most excited about?

756
00:35:29,560 --> 00:35:32,360
Speaker 5: Well, speaking of Marta, if you're not watching her on

757
00:35:32,400 --> 00:35:36,319
Speaker 5: the field, here is an amazing opportunity to potentially end

758
00:35:36,360 --> 00:35:38,719
Speaker 5: her career watching her at the World Cup next year

759
00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:43,320
Speaker 5: in Brazil. I am so excited to see how Brazilians

760
00:35:44,239 --> 00:35:47,960
Speaker 5: South America large, the world at large react to seeing

761
00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:49,120
Speaker 5: her on the pitch.

762
00:35:49,480 --> 00:35:52,800
Speaker 1: Wow, you're really leaning into that story. I hope that's true.

763
00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:54,120
Speaker 1: I hope that's true.

764
00:35:54,239 --> 00:35:56,719
Speaker 2: Are you dadding Marta Sarah? Well, she hasn't said for

765
00:35:56,800 --> 00:35:57,799
Speaker 2: sure she's coming back.

766
00:35:57,840 --> 00:36:00,440
Speaker 1: She just retired and then unretired to play in a

767
00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:01,319
Speaker 1: game last year.

768
00:36:01,880 --> 00:36:03,200
Speaker 2: So listen.

769
00:36:03,239 --> 00:36:07,080
Speaker 3: If Marta and Alison Felix aren't there respective country's flag

770
00:36:07,080 --> 00:36:10,279
Speaker 3: bearers at LA twenty twenty eight, then yeah, we're doing

771
00:36:10,360 --> 00:36:10,959
Speaker 3: something wrong.

772
00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:13,160
Speaker 5: I feel like Lindsay Vaughn needs to start a consulting

773
00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:15,560
Speaker 5: company where she just advises all the people who watched

774
00:36:15,560 --> 00:36:17,480
Speaker 5: her and we're like, wait a minute, hold up, we

775
00:36:17,560 --> 00:36:18,239
Speaker 5: can come back.

776
00:36:18,680 --> 00:36:23,480
Speaker 2: Let's let's do it. Old Knees Incorporated. There we go. Yeah,

777
00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:24,640
Speaker 2: I mean summer games in LA.

778
00:36:24,719 --> 00:36:26,640
Speaker 1: I'm excited about the idea of it, But every time

779
00:36:26,640 --> 00:36:28,840
Speaker 1: I think about it, I think about like an opening

780
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:32,040
Speaker 1: ceremony with Kid Rock and like Trump and a throne,

781
00:36:32,080 --> 00:36:36,320
Speaker 1: and I'm like, ugh, like, what's our Like Olympic anthem

782
00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:39,800
Speaker 1: gonna be like an AI generated country music song about

783
00:36:39,800 --> 00:36:41,320
Speaker 1: like trucks and hot dogs.

784
00:36:41,840 --> 00:36:44,360
Speaker 2: I just it's hard to get as excited as.

785
00:36:44,160 --> 00:36:47,719
Speaker 1: I would be if if instead, you know, Madam President

786
00:36:47,960 --> 00:36:49,600
Speaker 1: was up there representing the best of.

787
00:36:49,600 --> 00:36:52,279
Speaker 3: Us, I couldn't have said it better myself, Sarah. People

788
00:36:52,360 --> 00:36:54,120
Speaker 3: keep asking me like, oh, are you guys gonna go

789
00:36:54,120 --> 00:36:57,319
Speaker 3: cover the LA Olympics, And I'm like, uh, I'm like

790
00:36:57,360 --> 00:37:00,319
Speaker 3: thinking of like riding around these like nice little waying

791
00:37:00,320 --> 00:37:03,040
Speaker 3: to Italian villages, and I'm like trying to imagine that

792
00:37:03,080 --> 00:37:06,080
Speaker 3: in LA and just not feeling the vibes quite as much.

793
00:37:06,239 --> 00:37:08,120
Speaker 2: But we'll see, all right, Well.

794
00:37:08,000 --> 00:37:12,600
Speaker 1: We tried to end on a positive note, and Oh,

795
00:37:12,800 --> 00:37:15,359
Speaker 1: I'm excited about the thirtieth season for the WNBA. I'm

796
00:37:15,360 --> 00:37:18,000
Speaker 1: excited about all the throwback opportunities. I'm excited about the

797
00:37:18,000 --> 00:37:20,719
Speaker 1: new rosters. I'm excited to see what happens in the

798
00:37:20,960 --> 00:37:25,040
Speaker 1: Love Volleyball MLV Professional Volleyball space. I'm really excited to

799
00:37:25,040 --> 00:37:26,600
Speaker 1: see Allison Felix's come back.

800
00:37:26,920 --> 00:37:28,239
Speaker 2: I'm really excited for.

801
00:37:28,200 --> 00:37:31,239
Speaker 1: The PWHL playoffs and the expansion teams, hopefully one of

802
00:37:31,239 --> 00:37:33,880
Speaker 1: which is in Chicago. There is a ton I'm excited

803
00:37:33,880 --> 00:37:36,839
Speaker 1: for the first women's professional Baseball League action. So there's

804
00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:39,480
Speaker 1: just it's almost like we take it for granted because there's.

805
00:37:39,280 --> 00:37:41,319
Speaker 2: So much good stuff.

806
00:37:42,239 --> 00:37:45,400
Speaker 5: Alex Bianca, thank you for hopping on to talk four fifty.

807
00:37:45,800 --> 00:37:47,920
Speaker 1: We got to take a break. When we get back,

808
00:37:48,480 --> 00:37:50,920
Speaker 1: get your soapbox ready. As if we weren't just on one,

809
00:37:51,160 --> 00:37:52,600
Speaker 1: we found another one to jump on.

810
00:37:52,840 --> 00:38:03,520
Speaker 2: Stick around. Welcome Max Slices.

811
00:38:03,560 --> 00:38:04,880
Speaker 1: We love that you're listening, but we want you to

812
00:38:04,880 --> 00:38:06,560
Speaker 1: get in the game every day too, So here's our

813
00:38:06,560 --> 00:38:09,279
Speaker 1: good game play of the day. We know y'all make

814
00:38:09,360 --> 00:38:12,000
Speaker 1: up the bedrock of women's sports fan groups and communities

815
00:38:12,040 --> 00:38:14,920
Speaker 1: across the country. You're out at games and watch parties

816
00:38:14,920 --> 00:38:17,080
Speaker 1: every weekend, whether you're repping the team just down the

817
00:38:17,120 --> 00:38:19,360
Speaker 1: road or you're crossing state lines to go see a

818
00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:22,720
Speaker 1: particular team or star in action. You know which cities

819
00:38:22,719 --> 00:38:24,960
Speaker 1: are doing women's sports best, and you know which ones

820
00:38:25,000 --> 00:38:26,120
Speaker 1: are still trying to catch up.

821
00:38:26,320 --> 00:38:28,160
Speaker 2: So as we see spots across.

822
00:38:27,840 --> 00:38:30,480
Speaker 1: The US state claim to being the quote epicenter of

823
00:38:30,480 --> 00:38:35,440
Speaker 1: women's sports, like multiple reps for cities using that exact language.

824
00:38:35,000 --> 00:38:37,680
Speaker 2: We started to wonder who actually deserves that title.

825
00:38:37,960 --> 00:38:39,960
Speaker 1: So we actually discovered that friend of the show, Meg

826
00:38:40,000 --> 00:38:43,400
Speaker 1: Lenahan of The Athletic recruited the sites women's sports reporters

827
00:38:43,400 --> 00:38:46,080
Speaker 1: to deliver their list of the top women's sports cities

828
00:38:46,120 --> 00:38:48,440
Speaker 1: in America. But we want to hear from the people

829
00:38:48,440 --> 00:38:52,600
Speaker 1: in the seats, not press row. So you slices will

830
00:38:52,640 --> 00:38:55,759
Speaker 1: help us decide which US city actually is the epicenter

831
00:38:55,800 --> 00:38:58,120
Speaker 1: of women's sports. Now, we're going to put together a

832
00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:00,880
Speaker 1: bracket to settle this, but we need your missions first.

833
00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:03,480
Speaker 1: We need to know if your city should make the bracket.

834
00:39:03,920 --> 00:39:06,640
Speaker 1: Did you recently visit another city that totally wowed you

835
00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:08,880
Speaker 1: with its women's sports. We want to hear about the

836
00:39:08,920 --> 00:39:11,640
Speaker 1: big cities that might be obvious contenders and the smaller

837
00:39:11,680 --> 00:39:13,560
Speaker 1: towns that may still be a hidden gem.

838
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:16,000
Speaker 2: The place is with amazing college.

839
00:39:15,560 --> 00:39:18,680
Speaker 1: Teams and traditions, the spots with incredible history we might

840
00:39:18,719 --> 00:39:21,240
Speaker 1: not know, and the towns that are building the future

841
00:39:21,280 --> 00:39:23,880
Speaker 1: and setting the standard. This is your chance to be

842
00:39:23,960 --> 00:39:27,600
Speaker 1: the pr team, the agent that every athlete deserves. So

843
00:39:27,640 --> 00:39:29,600
Speaker 1: get out there and hustle to make sure your city

844
00:39:29,640 --> 00:39:32,560
Speaker 1: makes the cut. So send us an email good game

845
00:39:32,560 --> 00:39:35,239
Speaker 1: at wondermedianetwork dot com or leave us a voicemail at

846
00:39:35,239 --> 00:39:38,120
Speaker 1: eight seven two two oh four fifty seventy to share

847
00:39:38,160 --> 00:39:40,840
Speaker 1: your thoughts and your reasons for your city or a

848
00:39:40,840 --> 00:39:42,759
Speaker 1: city you've been to and We're going to collect them

849
00:39:42,760 --> 00:39:45,239
Speaker 1: all and put them in a big old bracket. Now

850
00:39:45,280 --> 00:39:47,759
Speaker 1: we'll save the format for how the cities advance for

851
00:39:47,840 --> 00:39:51,880
Speaker 1: another show. For now, you've got your marching orders. Speaking

852
00:39:51,920 --> 00:39:55,040
Speaker 1: of marching orders, don't forget to subscribe, Rate and review.

853
00:39:55,239 --> 00:39:59,080
Speaker 1: It's real easy watch funding the potential of men while

854
00:39:59,120 --> 00:40:03,080
Speaker 1: ignoring the perform or of women. Rating sixty out of

855
00:40:03,080 --> 00:40:07,040
Speaker 1: one hundred cents review. Cassidy Licktmann, friend of the show,

856
00:40:07,120 --> 00:40:10,240
Speaker 1: former Team USA Volleyball player and current VP of Volleyball

857
00:40:10,239 --> 00:40:13,719
Speaker 1: and Athlete Engagement and Athletes Unlimited, recently wrote a fascinating

858
00:40:13,719 --> 00:40:16,680
Speaker 1: post on LinkedIn. She wrote about an NIL stat she

859
00:40:16,760 --> 00:40:18,400
Speaker 1: learned at a conference, and I'm going to read in

860
00:40:18,400 --> 00:40:21,480
Speaker 1: full because I think Cassidy nailed it. She wrote quote,

861
00:40:21,680 --> 00:40:23,799
Speaker 1: I'm at the Peak Sports Tech conference this week and

862
00:40:23,920 --> 00:40:26,439
Speaker 1: was listening to Open Door CEO Stephen Denton talk about

863
00:40:26,480 --> 00:40:29,000
Speaker 1: the state of NIL when it comes to actual NIL

864
00:40:29,040 --> 00:40:33,680
Speaker 1: deals ie money from brands, not schools. Female NCAA athletes

865
00:40:33,719 --> 00:40:37,480
Speaker 1: received sixty cents on every dollar spent. Brands are recognizing

866
00:40:37,520 --> 00:40:40,520
Speaker 1: the value of female athletes, the intention with which they

867
00:40:40,560 --> 00:40:44,320
Speaker 1: approach content creation and their platforms, and the engagement of

868
00:40:44,360 --> 00:40:47,560
Speaker 1: their fans over the same from male athletes, and this

869
00:40:47,680 --> 00:40:50,400
Speaker 1: tracks with data from properties like CrossFit or snow League

870
00:40:50,440 --> 00:40:52,640
Speaker 1: that had athletes of both genders from the start and

871
00:40:52,640 --> 00:40:55,160
Speaker 1: saw the female athletes garner larger followings.

872
00:40:55,760 --> 00:40:57,040
Speaker 2: Here's the other side of it, though.

873
00:40:57,320 --> 00:41:00,239
Speaker 1: The money coming from the schools through revenue share is

874
00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:03,920
Speaker 1: obviously going overwhelmingly to male athletes who play in revenue

875
00:41:03,960 --> 00:41:06,560
Speaker 1: generating sports, and you might say that's fair.

876
00:41:06,880 --> 00:41:09,480
Speaker 5: But this brings me to two thoughts. Why do women

877
00:41:09,560 --> 00:41:11,960
Speaker 5: have to work for money but men just have to

878
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:12,520
Speaker 5: play for it.

879
00:41:13,040 --> 00:41:15,920
Speaker 1: If female athletes are more marketable than male athletes, and

880
00:41:16,000 --> 00:41:18,720
Speaker 1: yet men's sports are bringing in more revenue than women's sports,

881
00:41:19,120 --> 00:41:22,120
Speaker 1: maybe the problem is we're just not marketing women's sports.

882
00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:24,840
Speaker 1: Maybe if we put the same kind of resources behind

883
00:41:24,840 --> 00:41:28,080
Speaker 1: women's sports as men's, they'd actually be more popular. The

884
00:41:28,200 --> 00:41:30,480
Speaker 1: question now, though, is if we'll even be allowed to

885
00:41:30,560 --> 00:41:33,640
Speaker 1: test that theory in the NIL and revenue share era,

886
00:41:33,719 --> 00:41:36,600
Speaker 1: As schools triple down on revenue sports, the growth of

887
00:41:36,640 --> 00:41:39,919
Speaker 1: most women's sports and men's Olympic sports is more likely

888
00:41:39,920 --> 00:41:42,840
Speaker 1: to be stunted due to lack of investment. It's great

889
00:41:42,880 --> 00:41:45,800
Speaker 1: that NIL money is coming from brands to female athletes.

890
00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:48,000
Speaker 1: But how much more money might be coming to female

891
00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:51,239
Speaker 1: athletes and in revenue to schools if we invested in

892
00:41:51,280 --> 00:41:55,799
Speaker 1: women's sports like men's end quote. Now, this is the

893
00:41:55,840 --> 00:41:58,720
Speaker 1: story we've been telling for decades. Men got a century

894
00:41:58,719 --> 00:42:01,680
Speaker 1: plus head start and continue to be invested in, covered,

895
00:42:01,719 --> 00:42:04,879
Speaker 1: and promoted based on that, while women aren't even given

896
00:42:04,920 --> 00:42:07,560
Speaker 1: the chance to prove that they can compete for eyeballs

897
00:42:07,560 --> 00:42:10,480
Speaker 1: and interest and revenue. And on the occasions where they

898
00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:13,040
Speaker 1: succeed in spite of industry forces like I don't know,

899
00:42:13,040 --> 00:42:15,720
Speaker 1: the US women's national team or Caitlin Clark versus angel

900
00:42:15,719 --> 00:42:18,560
Speaker 1: Rees and the ncaattorney, it's often seen as a fluke,

901
00:42:18,960 --> 00:42:22,160
Speaker 1: not a sign that more marketing, investment and attention could

902
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:25,800
Speaker 1: produce more of the same. So good on you, Cassidy

903
00:42:25,800 --> 00:42:28,840
Speaker 1: for calling out just the latest iteration of a decade's

904
00:42:28,840 --> 00:42:32,400
Speaker 1: old problem. Now it's your turn, slics, rate and review.

905
00:42:33,000 --> 00:42:36,799
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening, See you tomorrow. Good game, Alex and Bianca,

906
00:42:36,920 --> 00:42:40,480
Speaker 1: Good game, Amanda Valo. You anyone who says four point

907
00:42:40,480 --> 00:42:43,319
Speaker 1: fifty is kind of a random number to celebrate. We

908
00:42:43,320 --> 00:42:45,120
Speaker 1: missed four hundred because we were at the Olympics and

909
00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:52,520
Speaker 1: we don't feel like waiting for five hundred. Good Game

910
00:42:52,560 --> 00:42:55,080
Speaker 1: with Sarah Spain is an iHeart women's sports production in

911
00:42:55,120 --> 00:42:58,080
Speaker 1: partnership with Deep Blue Sports and Entertainment. You can find

912
00:42:58,160 --> 00:43:01,319
Speaker 1: us on the iHeartRadio app, Apple, or wherever you get

913
00:43:01,320 --> 00:43:05,600
Speaker 1: your podcasts. Production by Wonder Media Network, our producers are Alex.

914
00:43:05,400 --> 00:43:06,680
Speaker 2: Azzi and Bianca Hillier.

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00:43:07,000 --> 00:43:10,400
Speaker 1: Our executive producers are Christina Everett, Jesse Katz, Jenny Kaplan

916
00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:13,479
Speaker 1: and Emily Rudder. Our editors are Emily Rutterer, Lucy Jones,

917
00:43:13,520 --> 00:43:17,360
Speaker 1: Britney Martinez and Gianna Palmer. Production assistant from Avery Loftus

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00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:19,040
Speaker 1: and I'm Your Host Sarah Spain