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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Bloomberg Markets Podcast. I'm Paul Sweeney, alongside

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Speaker 1: my co host Matt Miller. Every business day we bring

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Speaker 1: you interviews from CEOs, market pros, and Bloomberg experts, along

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Speaker 1: with essential market moving news. Find the Bloomberg Markets Podcast

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Speaker 1: on Apple Podcasts or wherever you listen to podcasts, and

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Speaker 1: at Bloomberg dot com slash podcast. Well. In a reopening economy,

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Speaker 1: one of the businesses that are really looking to aggressively

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Speaker 1: reopen is the physical fitness business. The gym's out there um.

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Speaker 1: People get off their pelotons and get back into the

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Speaker 1: gym's um. That is certainly happening across the United States

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Speaker 1: is more and more folks get vaccinated, So perhaps it's

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Speaker 1: a good time to consider investing in that business. Karl

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Speaker 1: die Keller, he's the co founder, chairman, and chief executive

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Speaker 1: officer of the Beach Body Company. Uh. He joins us

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Speaker 1: here in the Beach Body Company today. Uh. They're gonna

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Speaker 1: start trading as a public company on the n y

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Speaker 1: s C under the Tickler sign Body b O d

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Speaker 1: Y as its exp to the closest to street strategic

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Speaker 1: transaction of the three Way merger among the beach Body Company,

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Speaker 1: far Throwed Acquisition Corps, I E. S Back and my

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Speaker 1: ex fitness Carl, thanks so much for joining us here.

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Speaker 1: Talk to us about what I'm just gonna call this

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Speaker 1: new code, this new company of putting these three entities together.

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Speaker 1: What do I have at the end of the day. Well,

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Speaker 1: what's really exciting about it is everything that you just said,

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Speaker 1: um is what we're not seeing. Is what we're not

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Speaker 1: seeing is people who discovered in home fitness during the

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Speaker 1: pandemic are actually loving the convenience of working out at home.

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Speaker 1: And that's what's such a great business opportunity for us

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Speaker 1: to take this company out to the public markets with

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Speaker 1: this merger with Mixed Fitness and their their commercial grade

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Speaker 1: indoor bike. You know, beach Body has been around for

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Speaker 1: two decades. We have three point two million subscriptions, the

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Speaker 1: largest UH subscription business in the health and fitness space.

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Speaker 1: But now we bring this indoor bike with this transaction,

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Speaker 1: and we're going to serve literally tens of millions and

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Speaker 1: more customers who are ready to get their work got

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Speaker 1: done first thing in the morning, and then get on

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Speaker 1: with their day. So, Carl, let's talk about how you

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Speaker 1: came to the public markets. Doing this through through a

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Speaker 1: merger with a spack why that instead of a traditional

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Speaker 1: I P O. Yeah, I totally get it. Well. Obviously,

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Speaker 1: the ability to do this as I'm merger, so bringing

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Speaker 1: mix into the fold at the same time, at a

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Speaker 1: point in time that we could really get to the

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Speaker 1: market more quickly was just really fortuitous. Honestly, the I

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Speaker 1: T O path is it's a great path, but it

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Speaker 1: does take quite a bit of time. It would have

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Speaker 1: been appropriate for a company like Beach Body because we've

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Speaker 1: been around and profitable for twenty years. But um, we

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Speaker 1: had the opportunity because of the f r X fact

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Speaker 1: which brought Kevin Mayer, who is you know, the Disney

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Speaker 1: superstar who really built Disney Plus and Hulu. He's joining

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Speaker 1: our board because we did this deal with f r X,

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Speaker 1: So it it really helps the company, which is a

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Speaker 1: digital platform for content see around corners that I don't

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Speaker 1: think we would have seen around if we didn't have

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Speaker 1: an expert like that on our board to help us

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Speaker 1: take this to the next level. So Carl talk to

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Speaker 1: us about I mean people the way they have trained,

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Speaker 1: as you'd be pointed out, has really changed during this

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Speaker 1: pandemic and you know, obviously Peloton is probably the story

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Speaker 1: that investors no most notably here and the growth numbers

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Speaker 1: that they've been able to put up. Talk to us

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Speaker 1: about how you think it's emerging on the other side

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Speaker 1: of this, because again we've seen Jim's reopening, a lot

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Speaker 1: of folks are just you know, they're tweeting out how

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Speaker 1: they're getting back to the gym. But give us a

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Speaker 1: sense of how you think this is going to develop

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Speaker 1: over the next several years. Well, honestly, you know, beach body,

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Speaker 1: that the very premise of this company has has come

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Speaker 1: from my own problem. I do not like to work out,

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Speaker 1: I do not like to eat healthy and uh and

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Speaker 1: it's ironic, but it's like we have been trying to

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Speaker 1: solve my problem for two decades, and like, if I

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Speaker 1: have an extra half hour to get a workout done,

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Speaker 1: I'm not gonna spend that half hour driving to the gym.

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Speaker 1: So there are Jim goers, sixty two million of them

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Speaker 1: in North America, but there's another hundred fifty million of

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Speaker 1: us like me, who are not members of gyms, who

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Speaker 1: are looking for really gratifying, an effective content that we

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Speaker 1: can just access on our iPad on our phone. On

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Speaker 1: our TV and that's what Beach Body has been doing.

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Speaker 1: We have two platforms. We have beach Body on Demand

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Speaker 1: and Open Fit. And then the most important thing that

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Speaker 1: people are looking for, like me, are results. So the

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Speaker 1: thing that they know Beach Body for like P ninety

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Speaker 1: X or Insanity or twenty one Day Fix, is the

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Speaker 1: fact that we don't just give you a workout, we

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Speaker 1: also give you the nutrition plan to do with it.

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Speaker 1: So people get results with this thing. And look, they're

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Speaker 1: always gonna want to socialize in the gym, and I

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Speaker 1: totally get that. Like the gym is a great component

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Speaker 1: of it. But there's nothing nothing beats rolling out of bed.

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Speaker 1: You don't have to put on fancy clothes, You take

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Speaker 1: your pre workout, and you get your got done in

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Speaker 1: twenty to thirty minutes. And that's the way I like

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Speaker 1: to roll. See, Carl, I don't like it when people

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Speaker 1: socialize with me in the gym. I want nobody to

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Speaker 1: look at me. I'm just doing my thing, leave me alone. Um,

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Speaker 1: but you were talking about, Yes, people have been looking

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Speaker 1: for ways to work out at home and they have

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Speaker 1: had ways to do that. Competition in theory to Beach Body,

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Speaker 1: like Peloton, how do you position yourself against that kind

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Speaker 1: of competitive landscape. First off, it's not a zero some game.

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Speaker 1: The obesity problem is just enormous. And you know, frankly,

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Speaker 1: even in the pandemic, the people who were hit the

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Speaker 1: hardest for the people who are aren't making the kind

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Speaker 1: of choices that help their body fight off whatever viruses

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Speaker 1: or bacteria is in the world. So just just being

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Speaker 1: healthier is something that that everybody in the world needs

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Speaker 1: to be more proactive about. And that's just not common, right, Like,

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Speaker 1: that's not the common thing. So our job, Frankly, you

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Speaker 1: know you mentioned Peloton. You know, I consider myself in

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Speaker 1: partnership with them in helping people achieve their goals lead

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Speaker 1: to healthy, weplfilling lives. You know, it's we have a

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Speaker 1: long way to go before we're fighting over the last

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Speaker 1: customer who's thinking about choose making a fitness choice. But

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Speaker 1: I will say what Beach Body has specialized in for

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Speaker 1: years is creating content that lets somebody do it on

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Speaker 1: a budget. We're the mass market company and that's what

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Speaker 1: I'm proud of, and we're gonna help a lot more people.

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Speaker 1: All right, Carl, thanks so much for joining us. We

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Speaker 1: appreciate it. No, it's a big day for you guys

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Speaker 1: with this listing here carled die Keller, co founder, chairman

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Speaker 1: and chief executive officer of the Beach Body Company. We

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Speaker 1: appreciate that this is Bloombert Well. The fviction moratorium. We

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Speaker 1: got some news on that it was set to expire June,

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Speaker 1: but was extended for another four weeks until the end

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Speaker 1: of July. So that's good news. But there's still bankruptcy

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Speaker 1: filings out there resulting from the economic disruptions of COVID,

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Speaker 1: medical debt piling up, as well as a lot of

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Speaker 1: hurt out there. Let's talk to Jonathan Carson, CEO and

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Speaker 1: founder of stratt Oh. Jonathan, thanks for joining us here.

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Speaker 1: How important is extending uh that eviction moratorium out there

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Speaker 1: for a lot of folks. Thanks for having me. The

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Speaker 1: extensions certainly will be helpful in terms of having more

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Speaker 1: time for many people that are under this dynamic, but

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Speaker 1: it really doesn't do much more than the can further

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Speaker 1: down the road millions of Americans. So we'll be in

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Speaker 1: limbo now at the end of July as opposed to

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Speaker 1: the end of June. Unless there is a clear online

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Speaker 1: process and play something. We're hoping to see over the

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Speaker 1: course of the coming weeks. When we think about the

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Speaker 1: eviction moratorium, at least for me, I think a lot

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Speaker 1: about the tenants, the people who would in theory be

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Speaker 1: losing their homes if this weren't in place. But there

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Speaker 1: is also the other side of the equation, and that's

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Speaker 1: the landlords. And in many cases these aren't you know,

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Speaker 1: big mega landlords, They're just people who have income properties.

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Speaker 1: What about that side of the equation, How are those

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Speaker 1: people doing? It's a great question. The landlords as well

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Speaker 1: as the tenants both find themselves in a situation of

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Speaker 1: uncertain to right now, and some guidance would be helpful

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Speaker 1: on both sides. Exactly as you mentioned, tenants have some

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Speaker 1: uncertainty regarding what might happen when this moratorium comes to

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Speaker 1: an end. Not only is the uncertainty regarding whether they

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Speaker 1: can make the upcoming rent payment, but of far more significances.

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Speaker 1: What about the last ten, eleven, twelve, whatever number of

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Speaker 1: months of forgiveness this tenant has had. What happens to

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Speaker 1: that back rent? And that back rent clearly is of

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Speaker 1: primary focus to the landlords. We just don't quite know

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Speaker 1: how we'll be managed yet. And hopefully we'll see some

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Speaker 1: clear direction come out and some clear rules from the

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Speaker 1: administration as we approach the end of the moratorium now

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Speaker 1: set for the end of July. So as it relates

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Speaker 1: to this eviction moratorium, Jonathan, do we have a sense

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Speaker 1: of how many people were talking about how big of

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Speaker 1: a problem is this? How widespread is it? Sure, it's

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Speaker 1: a great question. And there's one recent data point I

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Speaker 1: saw was more than six million renters behind on rent payments.

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Speaker 1: Of course it is doesn't apply to all renters in

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Speaker 1: the country and apply to renters that we're able to

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Speaker 1: find their way into this program as long as they

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Speaker 1: do so, um, they have this forbearance or this this

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Speaker 1: forgiveness that the others have as well. So certainly lots

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Speaker 1: of people out there. It's a large subset for sure.

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Speaker 1: Let's talk about bankruptcies, because we when we talk about

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Speaker 1: the pandemic, we often talk about the extraordinary fiscal and

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Speaker 1: monetary policies that have come along with it to combat

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Speaker 1: the crisis. And on the monetary side, you have really

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Speaker 1: cheap borrowing costs. Companies can get their hands on money.

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Speaker 1: Therefore they don't necessarily have to file for bankruptcy and

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Speaker 1: on the fiscal side, Americans had more cash in their

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Speaker 1: pockets that they wouldn't necessarily have had. Has that overall

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Speaker 1: led to fewer bankruptcies than you would have expected in

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Speaker 1: a crisis like this. It certainly has led to fewer bankruptcies,

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Speaker 1: and you're exactly having the right path in terms of

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Speaker 1: the thought process. Bankruptcy filings have plummeted during the pandemic,

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Speaker 1: thanks in large parts of the efforts of federal and

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Speaker 1: state governments for putting in place programs like this eviction

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Speaker 1: moratorium or like deferral programs first student loans or from mortgages,

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Speaker 1: and as a result, as plus relief checks. As a

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Speaker 1: result of these benefits, we've seen personal bankruptcies decrease quite

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Speaker 1: a bit. Is from the second half of two thousand

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Speaker 1: in the second half of two thousand twenty when you

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Speaker 1: compare them. What that means, though, is we could very

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Speaker 1: well see a wave of filings that come when we

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Speaker 1: see some of these pandemic moratoriums dissipate. And that's why

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Speaker 1: many of us involved in the system or hoping we

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Speaker 1: see some clear rules come out for how the end

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Speaker 1: of that will will be about so we can manage

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Speaker 1: and prepare accordingly. Is there? So, what do you expect

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Speaker 1: to get from the Biden administration in terms of maybe

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Speaker 1: a longer term policy here. Will there be forgiveness of

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Speaker 1: these issues or or will people at some point have

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Speaker 1: to come to reckon with it. Yeah, I think it's

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Speaker 1: a great question, and I think we'll probably see different

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Speaker 1: results in different in each of these separate issues. Right.

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Speaker 1: We are talking about, on the one hand, the eviction

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Speaker 1: moratorium I mentioned earlier, student loans and mortgages. Those are

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Speaker 1: different programs on the eviction side. Now that we have

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Speaker 1: one more month to wait before it comes to an end,

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Speaker 1: I think what we're hoping to see is some direction

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Speaker 1: not only on here is the firm end date, but

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Speaker 1: also what are the rules regarding back pay? How are

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Speaker 1: we going to treat that. We need to give the

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Speaker 1: landlords and the tenant some clarity so we don't see

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Speaker 1: a rush to the bankruptcy court and lots of people

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Speaker 1: who all of a sudden have to come up with

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Speaker 1: back pay, large numbers have to file bankruptcy because they

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Speaker 1: don't have a plan around that. That's what we're hoping

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Speaker 1: to see, all right, Jonathan, thanks so much for joining us.

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Speaker 1: Lots of issues out there to think about as this

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Speaker 1: economy reopens and some of these federal programs start to sunset.

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Speaker 1: Jonathan Carson, CEO and founder UH Stretto talking to us

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Speaker 1: about again the eviction moratorium. The news there is it

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Speaker 1: was set to expire June three. It's in just a

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Speaker 1: couple of days, but it has been extended for another

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Speaker 1: four weeks until the end of July. That's good news,

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Speaker 1: UH for everyone involved. But Johnson Carson kind of turned it.

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Speaker 1: It's just kind of kicking the can down the road.

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Speaker 1: The the issues, the underlying economic issues remained both for

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Speaker 1: the tenant UH and for the apartment owner as well,

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Speaker 1: So we have to see how that plays out over

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Speaker 1: the next coming weeks. Well. One of the more widely

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Speaker 1: read stories on the Bloomberg today is one entitled ubs

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Speaker 1: will allow two thirds of employees to adopt hybrid work,

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Speaker 1: and that kind of brings to the for the discussion

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Speaker 1: I think many corporations are having about how do we

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Speaker 1: get people back to work? Who should come back to work?

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Speaker 1: Should we do, you know, a hybrid approach? Uh? So

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Speaker 1: a lot of decisions being made in the boardrooms across

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Speaker 1: corporate America. Gil Borak, President and chief executive officer of

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Speaker 1: Collier's US, joins us to talk real estate. Gil. Thanks

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Speaker 1: ver much for taking the time here. I love to

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Speaker 1: get your outlook on office space and in the vacancies

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Speaker 1: and and kind of where we are now and how

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Speaker 1: you think it's going to evolve. Yeah, Hi, good morning, Paul. Um.

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Speaker 1: I would say that, you know, we've been on a

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Speaker 1: roller coaster over the last year in terms of sentiment

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Speaker 1: and in terms of various ideas that folks have had.

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Speaker 1: People a lot smaller than me that no real estate,

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Speaker 1: very deeply owners, large users, and people that that really

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Speaker 1: um are in it every day. And I think where

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Speaker 1: we've landed, what we have come from is everybody's going

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Speaker 1: to work remotely to what I thought would happen, which

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Speaker 1: is sort of a reversion to the mean. There are

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Speaker 1: things that you miss when you're not in the office,

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Speaker 1: like collaboration and human interaction and spur of the moment

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Speaker 1: conversations and decisions, creativity and so forth that are proving

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Speaker 1: to be very strong factors as a draw back to

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Speaker 1: the office. And balancing that with what we've learned during

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Speaker 1: the pandemic, which is that people want more flexibility and

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Speaker 1: hence the sort of compromise position seems to be some

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Speaker 1: type of hybrid is what most companies are adopting, a

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Speaker 1: mix of working remotely and working in the office. So

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Speaker 1: what does that mean If companies are having more people

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Speaker 1: work from home some of the time, some are saying

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Speaker 1: we're not going to need as large of a footprint

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Speaker 1: going forward. What are the implications for commercial real estate? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think that's easier said than done. Look, there may

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Speaker 1: be a slight diminution in the need for space, but

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Speaker 1: in my mind, um, it's very hard if you're gonna

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Speaker 1: let people work from home, let's say two days a week.

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Speaker 1: I know we haven't quite figured this out for ourselves. Uh,

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Speaker 1: to reduce space, you have to know which days people

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Speaker 1: aren't going to be coming in. Otherwise you've got to

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Speaker 1: be able to accommodate them in some fashion. And if

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Speaker 1: you tell people which days they shouldn't come in, then

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Speaker 1: you're sort of deceeeding the purpose of giving them flexibility.

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Speaker 1: So I think it's not going to be a big

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Speaker 1: decrease in office space, as there was certainly a large

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Speaker 1: amount of subway space they came on during the pandemic.

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Speaker 1: That's slowly receiving, and we may take a little while

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Speaker 1: to work through that inventory. But I think when all

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Speaker 1: is said and done, we're not going to see a

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Speaker 1: significant reduction in the need for office space. Well, how

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Speaker 1: about I guess distributing geographically your workforce as opposed to

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Speaker 1: perhaps concentrating them in you know, big cities like a

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Speaker 1: New York or San Francisco, Chicago. We did see, you know,

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Speaker 1: this pandemic rolled on a lot of companies said, oh,

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Speaker 1: we're going to relocate some are all of our people

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Speaker 1: to Florida, for example, lower tax regions. Is that something

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Speaker 1: that will remain a permanent part of kind of the workforce.

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Speaker 1: It certainly seems that way, and and that's fact the

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Speaker 1: correct whether it was you know, in particular, if you

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Speaker 1: use New York as an example, you saw migration of

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Speaker 1: some large financial institutions migrating some of their workers to Connecticut. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you certainly saw a move down to Florida that those

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Speaker 1: are real leases have been signed, and so I think

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Speaker 1: that definitely was during the pandemic sort of a shift

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Speaker 1: to this what they call a hub and spoke model,

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Speaker 1: which I think then means, you know, to some degree,

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Speaker 1: it means the reduction in use of space in New

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Speaker 1: York City and the example I'm using, and an increase

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Speaker 1: in space in other areas. And I definitely think that

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Speaker 1: that we are seeing some of that. When we talk

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Speaker 1: about the return to the office and commercial real estate,

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Speaker 1: we largely do so through the lens of office buildings,

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Speaker 1: but there's also everything that exists around those office buildings,

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Speaker 1: the restaurants, the coffee shops, retail, and here in New

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Speaker 1: York anecdotally, there's a lot of people returning back to

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Speaker 1: the offices, but there's vacant spaces underneath. That's true right

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Speaker 1: here at Bloomberg headquarters. What about that side of commercial

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Speaker 1: real estate. Yes, so now we sort of moved into

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Speaker 1: and I understand what you said, we sort of moved

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Speaker 1: into more of the retail category, which you know, along

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Speaker 1: with hospitality, was probably hardest hit in the pandemic because

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Speaker 1: people stopped shopping, they had to stay home, they weren't

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Speaker 1: traveling and so forth. And you're right, in the city

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Speaker 1: like New York, when the office workers stopped coming in,

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Speaker 1: there's no need for those restaurants, or less need for

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Speaker 1: those restaurants, and they can't pay, they aren't and they

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Speaker 1: can't afford to stay open and so they close. I

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Speaker 1: do think that and some of that will be permanent.

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Speaker 1: The degree to which it's permanent, you know, is sort

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Speaker 1: of a guess at this point, but I think some

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Speaker 1: of those will come back, whether they come back or

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Speaker 1: whether news stores or restaurants take over the space that

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Speaker 1: has been shuttered. I do think some of that will

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Speaker 1: come back, and we are seeing some of that. We

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Speaker 1: are seeing an improvement in retail. It is slow and

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Speaker 1: there's a long way to go, but it will reverse,

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Speaker 1: I believe, as the fate of office reverses as well.

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Speaker 1: Just real quickly here, Gil, Aside from the Floridas of

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Speaker 1: the world, where are the strong markets, um, the secondary markets?

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Speaker 1: So when you think of of markets that are not

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Speaker 1: you know, and that's been the case the last twelve months.

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Speaker 1: When you think of markets not San Francisco, not Chicago,

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Speaker 1: not New York, anything secondary with lower rise buildings and

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Speaker 1: more space, uh, those are all hot markets that have

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Speaker 1: been in the demand for for space on the capital markets,

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Speaker 1: on the on the on the sales side even has

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Speaker 1: been quite strong in those secondary markets. All right, Gil,

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Speaker 1: thank you so much for joining us. Fascinating discussion here,

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Speaker 1: gil Borrock, President and chief executive officer of Collier's US.

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Speaker 1: And Kaylee, you brought it up here on fifty eight Street.

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry, Lection Town Avenue between fifty Other than the

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Speaker 1: chocolate shop, they're all empty. No more Starbucks. And I

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Speaker 1: was just broken the news by our very on John

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Speaker 1: Tucker that home Depot is leaving our building. Yeah. So

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Speaker 1: they had a big piece of commercial rules state on

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Speaker 1: the ground level, which is common in Manhattan. And uh

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Speaker 1: so a lot of those folks uh left during the pandemic.

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Speaker 1: Question is will they come back? A lot more coming up?

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Speaker 1: This is Bloomberg looking at bitcoin today. The volatility continues,

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Speaker 1: is up about six point seven. Uh To's called thirty

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Speaker 1: four thousand, eight hundred had another wild weekend too. I

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Speaker 1: think on the weekends it trades a little bit more more.

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Speaker 1: It never closes. And you come back in on Monday

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Speaker 1: and you're like, wait a minute, where was on Friday?

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Speaker 1: And then you know you have to remember, oh yeah,

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Speaker 1: those trade on the weekends. Right, let's dive into crypto, bitcoin,

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Speaker 1: all that good stuff. We do that with Milton Demers.

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Speaker 1: We really appreciate her giving us her time. She's chief

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Speaker 1: strategy officer four coin shares group. They've got three point

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Speaker 1: nine billion dollars in assets under management here, So Malton,

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Speaker 1: thanks so much for joining us. I know we're supposed

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Speaker 1: to get used to this volatility um, but can we

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Speaker 1: should we get used to this volatility? Look, it's great,

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Speaker 1: great to need back, and it's it's no secret that

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Speaker 1: it has been a volatile time in bitcoin. We started

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Speaker 1: the year around thirty three thousand, ran all the way

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Speaker 1: up to sixty five thousand. Now we're trading and around

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Speaker 1: thirty four thirty five thousand. Volatility here is part of

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Speaker 1: the price of opportunity in the digital assets space, and

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Speaker 1: in particular with bitcoin UM. There are smaller, shorter term cycles,

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Speaker 1: but the broader secular trend that we're focused on is

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Speaker 1: really a five to ten year investment time horizon, and

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Speaker 1: within that short term volatility if you zoom out, the

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Speaker 1: context here is the trend has really been a much

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Speaker 1: longer term secular trend that's up and into the right.

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Speaker 1: So volatility is just part of the ride. And I

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Speaker 1: wonder how regulation plays into that as well, Malta, because

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Speaker 1: for a while there was this narrative that more regulation

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Speaker 1: was a good thing, the market needed, that to kind

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Speaker 1: of organize itself. It showed that you know that you

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Speaker 1: could have institutional adoption and it was mature. Then regulation

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Speaker 1: became really scary, and then we saw what happened over

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Speaker 1: the weekend with the UK banning binance markets in the market,

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Speaker 1: totally taking that in stride. So as regulation now a

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Speaker 1: good thing again, I don't think it's ever been regulation

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Speaker 1: good or bad. I think a lot of it's really

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Speaker 1: around sentiments and how sentiment translates into demand. On the

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Speaker 1: sentiment side, we've had really mixed sentiment over the last

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Speaker 1: two months. Obviously, we've had a number of more negative sentiments,

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Speaker 1: especially around China. So China has cracked down on mine

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Speaker 1: bitcoin mining activity in the country. There's also been a

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Speaker 1: reduced ability for commercial banks to interact with crypto platforms

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Speaker 1: and reduce leverage available on some of the popular retail

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Speaker 1: trading platforms in China. On top of that, over the

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Speaker 1: weekend on Friday, Japan issued a warning around finances operations

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Speaker 1: in Japan. The FDA issued a warning around Finance Markets Limited,

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Speaker 1: but interestingly that entity does not engage with retail buyers

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Speaker 1: buying and selling bitcoin. That's actually not regulated by the FDA.

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Speaker 1: But at the same time we have folks like Stanley Dreckon,

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Speaker 1: Miller Gott, the nerd at Guggenheim and others coming out

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Speaker 1: in support of bitcoin and articulating a long term investment thesis.

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Speaker 1: So sentiment has really been mixed. But we need to

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Speaker 1: look at demand. So if we look at demand, we've

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Speaker 1: seen our fourth consecutive week of outflows and digital asset

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Speaker 1: investment products, and this outflow has been underway since mid May.

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Speaker 1: We've seen about one percent of global assets under management,

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Speaker 1: around three hundred million dollars loan out of crypto e tps.

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Speaker 1: So we're waiting to see you turn around and to

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Speaker 1: see a week of net inflows, which I think will

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Speaker 1: be signal that demand is back. So meltem in terms

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Speaker 1: of the use cases and the validation of bitcoin in

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Speaker 1: particular by crypto in general. Yeah, I guess we've seen

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Speaker 1: a corporate validation where you had Tesla by the company

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Speaker 1: actually buy and put on their balance sheets some bitcoin

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Speaker 1: and then it can be used. I guess now was on,

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Speaker 1: then off, and then ow it's on again. You can

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Speaker 1: actually you know, use it as a currency to buy it,

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Speaker 1: you know, a Tesla vehicle. What's the next step along

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Speaker 1: the validation path. Uh do you think for crypto? And

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Speaker 1: we have the biggest validation which happened two weeks ago.

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Speaker 1: Al Salvador um As a country has chosen to that

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Speaker 1: bitcoin as it's legal tender. Paraguay is now contemplating that.

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Speaker 1: Zimbabwe and a number of other countries are now also

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Speaker 1: looking at that. Again, what bitcoin represents, Yes, it's an asset,

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Speaker 1: but more than anything, Bitcoin is a mon atarry movement

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Speaker 1: um and there are no number of countries around the

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Speaker 1: world we are looking at the dollar and saying bitcoin. Sorry,

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Speaker 1: just to jump in here. Then you think the use

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Speaker 1: case for crypto is to replace fiat currencies to be

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Speaker 1: used as currency, not just you know, a store of

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Speaker 1: value or an inflation hedge. I think the word replaces

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00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:25,520
Speaker 1: probably a strong word choice. I would say more about

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Speaker 1: being a compliment to fiat currencies. For the last three

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Speaker 1: thousand millennia, humans have not had um the separation of

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Speaker 1: state and money. Bitcoin is an experiment in the separation

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00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:38,480
Speaker 1: of state and money. And as we live our lives

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00:23:38,520 --> 00:23:41,640
Speaker 1: increasingly online and in the digital domain, and where physical

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00:23:41,720 --> 00:23:45,800
Speaker 1: jurisdiction is less and less relevant, Bitcoin represents a new

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00:23:45,840 --> 00:23:49,560
Speaker 1: type of monetary reality, and I think that's extremely attractive

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00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:53,159
Speaker 1: to a number of different audiences, starting with people in

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Speaker 1: tech and people interested in the growth of the digital

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00:23:55,920 --> 00:23:58,840
Speaker 1: finance sector, but also people in parts of the world

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Speaker 1: who have historically been looted from the financial system or

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00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:06,919
Speaker 1: a space persistent inflation or monetary basement. Do you think

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Speaker 1: that in the near to intermediate term, over the number

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Speaker 1: of years, we'll see a kind of a G seven

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00:24:13,080 --> 00:24:16,120
Speaker 1: or even you know, like a G twenty type. Um,

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00:24:16,359 --> 00:24:22,000
Speaker 1: government embrace bitcoin. That is certainly my aspiration, and that

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00:24:22,160 --> 00:24:25,520
Speaker 1: coin shares. We're working very hard to make that happen.

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Speaker 1: But I think again, um, it's a compliment to the

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Speaker 1: existing SIAT ecosystem, and I do think the growth of

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Speaker 1: central bank digital currencies are putting FIAT on blockchain rails

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00:24:37,320 --> 00:24:40,600
Speaker 1: is a trend that's not going anywhere and over time. Again,

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Speaker 1: I think, you know, as you alluded to the start

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Speaker 1: of the segment, markets in the crypto space are open

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Speaker 1: seven three, six, five, and they're global in nature. There's

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Speaker 1: no reason in our view that markets around the world

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Speaker 1: of all types can operate in that manner that global

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Speaker 1: commerce should be bound. By nine thirty two, four pm

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Speaker 1: Eastern time, and so I think again, we're entering into

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Speaker 1: a new world. Everyone's increasingly online transactions, UM exchange. Everything

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00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:11,080
Speaker 1: is happening online, so we need money for the internet,

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Speaker 1: and that is the coin effectively melt them just quickly.

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Speaker 1: Because you were talking about the outflows and some of

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00:25:16,160 --> 00:25:18,639
Speaker 1: the e t p s out there, When do you

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Speaker 1: think the US will actually approve a bitcoin ETF. That's

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Speaker 1: such a great question, Kaylee Um, that is the question

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Speaker 1: on everyone's mind. The Valkyrie et F decision, which was

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Speaker 1: the first in the docket of the thirteen open et

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Speaker 1: F filings that are pending with the SEC, was just

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00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:38,760
Speaker 1: postponed again to October. Given the tone coming from Gary

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00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:42,359
Speaker 1: Gensler in the SEC, I am a I am not

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Speaker 1: very optimistic on the prospects of an ets being approved.

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Speaker 1: And again I think some of the volatility over the

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Speaker 1: last few months certainly hasn't bolstered confidence when it comes

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Speaker 1: to US regulators and and their temperament towards the U

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Speaker 1: s C t F. But let's not forget we have

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Speaker 1: micro strategy which has effectively become a defect so bitcoin HF.

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Speaker 1: Hey Melton, thank you so much for joining us. Once again.

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Speaker 1: We always love getting your perspective on bitcoin and all

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Speaker 1: things crypto. Melton Demier's Chief Strategy Officer UH strategy officer

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Speaker 1: for coin Shares Group. They about three point nine billion

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Speaker 1: dollars in assets under management. Again, UH continue to see

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Speaker 1: volatility in the bitcoin space. It is up today about

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Speaker 1: six and a half percent. It did test that thirty

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Speaker 1: level again and bounced back, so very interesting to see.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to the Bloomberg Markets podcast. You can

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00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 1: subscribe and listen to interviews with Apple Podcasts or whatever

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00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:37,240
Speaker 1: podcast platform you prefer. I'm Matt Miller. I'm on Twitter

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00:26:37,520 --> 00:26:41,320
Speaker 1: at Matt Miller. Pen On fal Sweeney I'm on Twitter

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00:26:41,400 --> 00:26:44,240
Speaker 1: at pt Sweeney. Before the podcast, you can always catch

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00:26:44,280 --> 00:26:45,840
Speaker 1: us worldwide at Bloomberg Radio