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Speaker 1: Oh hey, another episode of th HC coming at this

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Speaker 1: episode number seventy six. As we enter into September pretty soon,

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Speaker 1: elk white tails everything, and to help you get prepared

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Speaker 1: for that, I've got Janice but tell us a lot.

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Speaker 1: Being Eagle and Spencer new Hearth, we have to give

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Speaker 1: him a nickname, the Baritone Bastion, Baritone Bastard, something like that.

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Speaker 1: You'll hear. We'll figure that out when we get in

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Speaker 1: the podcast. And they're gonna give you their tips for

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Speaker 1: white tail gear and elk gear, kind of like must

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Speaker 1: have pieces of gear as you get into those seasons.

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Speaker 1: That will be fun that we have filled the engineer

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Speaker 1: reading more mean comments, This one is is exceptional. I

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Speaker 1: feel like the most exceptional mean comment I've ever read.

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Speaker 1: It references what I am to the underpants a mediator incorporated,

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Speaker 1: which I I find very good. And then we're gonna

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Speaker 1: have Rachel Vanderboard, a good friend of mine and the

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Speaker 1: director of outdoor recreation for the state of Montana. She

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Speaker 1: has a pretty interesting job where she kind of lives

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Speaker 1: in a band down by the river and promotes outdoor

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Speaker 1: recreation in the state of Montana and I imagine everywhere else. Uh,

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Speaker 1: in the world through her job. So she's a super interesting,

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Speaker 1: super fun person. Man, I'm privileged to know her and

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Speaker 1: have her on the show. But before we get to that,

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Speaker 1: we're gonna talk about the First Light Flash Sail. Now,

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Speaker 1: this is important that you listen to this and get

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Speaker 1: the dates right and get the discounts right before you

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Speaker 1: get to first Light dot com. The First Light Flash

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Speaker 1: Sails going on Tuesday and Wednesday, September three and fourth,

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Speaker 1: or at first leg dot com. There's a lot of

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Speaker 1: details to remember here, but the big hitters are there's

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Speaker 1: up the thirty percent off on things like the men's guidelight,

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Speaker 1: the Killing Quarter zip, the Wicked Boxer short. You gotta

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Speaker 1: get those boxer shorts. I was wearing those the other

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Speaker 1: day in Antelope Camp. Got a lot of compliments from

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Speaker 1: the boys. Now there's all kinds of things, All women's

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Speaker 1: gears off. There's a few things that are tempercent off,

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Speaker 1: including the Solitude jacket and bib, the Catalyst jacket and bib,

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Speaker 1: kinds of brooks Down sweater, which is another favorite of mine.

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Speaker 1: All Logo wears temper cent off. The Saltbuck pants are

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Speaker 1: temper cent off. Everything else is off. Given a few

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Speaker 1: other items that are not on sale, but most of

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Speaker 1: the things first light are on sale September three and fourth,

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Speaker 1: So you need to get over there at first like

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Speaker 1: dot Com and take advantage of the two thou nineteen

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Speaker 1: Harvest flash sale, which is a must if you're going

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Speaker 1: to be We're in first like this fall. So get

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Speaker 1: over there, get the discount when you I don't know

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Speaker 1: if you could ever tell him I sent you. Tell

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Speaker 1: him better, Brian sent you. I don't know how you

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Speaker 1: do that, but if you see somebody works the first leg,

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Speaker 1: just tell him better. Brian sent you over there for

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Speaker 1: the discount. It's gonna be a good one. So get

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Speaker 1: there and without further ado episode, let's go. I guess

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Speaker 1: I grew up on an older road to the medal.

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Speaker 1: I always did what I told until I found out

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Speaker 1: that my brand new clothes a game second hand from

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Speaker 1: the rich kids next door, and I um bath Like

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Speaker 1: It's like, well, I mean, they have a thousand things

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Speaker 1: that side in my head I wish I ain't seen,

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Speaker 1: and now I just wanted to a real bad dream

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Speaker 1: of being a lack. I'm coming abot of the scene,

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Speaker 1: but thank you Jack Daniels. Hey, everybody, and welcome. It's

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Speaker 1: another episode of the Hunting Collective. Of course, Ben O'Brien,

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Speaker 1: you can see this in your iTunes and all your

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Speaker 1: other platforms. One, we're in the Mediator studio. We're joined

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Speaker 1: by a lot of you, an eagle honest tell us, Hello, Ben,

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Speaker 1: thanks for having me on. Well, thank you Joannie for

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Speaker 1: coming on, and Spencer new Heart, which we don't really have.

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Speaker 1: I was saying, like the baritone bastard, something like some

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Speaker 1: awesome nickname for you. I'll take that. It sounds like

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Speaker 1: something from Game of Thrones. Yeah, that could be. That

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Speaker 1: could be. Take it alright, cool. Phil is never gonna

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Speaker 1: get a nickname. That's fine, You're just Phil. So take that.

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Speaker 1: Yanni's upset of me, you're upset. Yeah, I was saying

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Speaker 1: that it was love sex. I feel like you didn't

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Speaker 1: defend our podcast studio and art within it when what's

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Speaker 1: his name, West West Siler about sil was saying that

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Speaker 1: it looks like hotel art in here forced perspective. Hotel

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Speaker 1: art is how he described it, that force perspective. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: maybe he knows more about art, because I don't even

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Speaker 1: know what that means. I don't know what it means

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Speaker 1: that sounds like he knows too much. Can you tell

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Speaker 1: me what force perspective means? I think he's talking about

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Speaker 1: the Griffin grins are like forced perspective. Force perspective is

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Speaker 1: to use like depth of field and certain angles to

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Speaker 1: make things look larger than they actually are. Like, for example,

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Speaker 1: this mountain was shot with like a really long lens

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Speaker 1: from far away, so it kind of compresses everything. I

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Speaker 1: went to film school. What do you want for me?

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Speaker 1: I took? I took photo one on one? All right? Yeah.

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Speaker 1: I thought that maybe it was the fern, because I

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Speaker 1: if he was, if that's what tipped him off, I'd say,

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Speaker 1: you know what, I've personally said something to stew about that.

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Speaker 1: I think the fern should go myself. Yeah, but it wasn't.

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Speaker 1: I mean, he was just I asked him to come

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Speaker 1: and you just describe the ambiance in here, and that's

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Speaker 1: what he came up with. Now you're correct. I don't

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Speaker 1: know that I defended it. I think I've had some

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Speaker 1: issues with the cluttered look. But now that Phil Phil

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Speaker 1: has this new table in here, it's like felt, It's

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Speaker 1: like this feels nice and it's starting to come together.

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Speaker 1: I will admit, start to come together. And you know,

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Speaker 1: if you're part of the team, is a little part

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Speaker 1: of our whole team on these walls, now, you know,

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Speaker 1: I like the way that makes me feel. Yeah, we're

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Speaker 1: all here together inside this room. And some of this,

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Speaker 1: these big giant pictures are acoustic panels. Instead of just

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Speaker 1: having a blank blue or yellow panel, we decided to

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Speaker 1: put a picture on it. Well, maybe one day we'll

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Speaker 1: like put put a three sixty video up of of

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Speaker 1: the room and let people judge for themselves what's coming.

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Speaker 1: We're gonna be filming some things in here, apparently top

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Speaker 1: secret mission. But Yanni's upset and and I formally apologize

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Speaker 1: accepted that he said off fair that he's going to

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Speaker 1: write a bad review. Yeah, he's gonna write a bad

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Speaker 1: review of the show. He's going to go home on

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Speaker 1: the Latvian Hawk is out there just ripping on c oh.

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Speaker 1: All right, we got lots to talk about here, but

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Speaker 1: we're gonna have Rachel van Devoort, the director um about

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Speaker 1: the recreation for the state of Montana coming up before

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Speaker 1: too longs to stick around for that, But before we

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Speaker 1: get to that. She's great, she's awesome, fun. Definitely stick

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Speaker 1: around for that. She's fun. Yeah, my only critics always impressed.

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Speaker 1: She can't be completely fun as a as a state

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Speaker 1: employee works for the governor, she can't have all the

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Speaker 1: fun in the public forum that she probably does when

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Speaker 1: we're just hanging out having a beer. But I bet

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Speaker 1: she keeps everybody loose she gets, she gets loose, sufice

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Speaker 1: to say she's a fantastic human all together. Um, it's

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Speaker 1: almost September, and we'll think about lots of things, and

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Speaker 1: we've got I got a couple of emails last week,

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Speaker 1: about four or five emails of people saying that there's

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Speaker 1: a lack of gear coverage. I think a meat eat overall,

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Speaker 1: but then also on this podcast, a lack of like

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Speaker 1: what to use and when to use it and all

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Speaker 1: those types of things. So I figured we would start

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Speaker 1: by appeasing those people and going through, um, specifically for

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Speaker 1: Spencer and for Yanni, what it is we can't live without?

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Speaker 1: So Joannice, would you like to start with a couple

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Speaker 1: of pieces of gear you can't live without in the

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Speaker 1: Elk Woods or the Elk Mountains probably better described. Yes, Um,

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Speaker 1: the list is long, but off the top of my head,

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Speaker 1: i'd probably say an external read cal call like the

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Speaker 1: Phelps easy estris or the one that I like better

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Speaker 1: is his new mini astris um easy to blow loud,

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Speaker 1: you can make it quiet kind of one call does

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Speaker 1: all kind of a thing? How um yeah, where where

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Speaker 1: do you add on that? As far as I mean

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Speaker 1: the external everybody knows some of these, you know, easy

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Speaker 1: to use cal calls over the years that have become cliches,

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Speaker 1: like you can hear them coming, like the rookie hunter

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Speaker 1: blowing on the Oh man, what was that one? I'll

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Speaker 1: call that? Everybody always blows on. Yeah, there's a Hugie

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Speaker 1: Mama is one of them. But you can't even blow

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Speaker 1: on that one. They squeeze, yeah, I mean squeeze it.

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Speaker 1: And so there's always there's always that going on. So

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Speaker 1: that's been a cliche, Like I can hear that coming

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Speaker 1: from by the way, so that was probably good too.

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Speaker 1: But you feel like those external recalls they are easy

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Speaker 1: to use, but you can still manipulate the sounds enough

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Speaker 1: to oh yeah yeah, and I have just as much

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Speaker 1: success with those as they do A diaphragm. Awesome. That's

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Speaker 1: good to hear from pressure. A lot of hunters feeling

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Speaker 1: pressure to use a diaphragm. Really yeah, oh gosh no,

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Speaker 1: if I did choose one or the other, definitely be

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Speaker 1: walking into the woods with those external reads. I like that. Like,

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Speaker 1: what's another what's something in your pack that that people

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Speaker 1: might don't think of? Because I think that's probably one

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Speaker 1: of them. Well, I was gonna go with binoculars. Everybody

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Speaker 1: should be carrying those. Can't leave at home with that.

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Speaker 1: I'd rather leave my rifle at home than my binoculars.

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Speaker 1: Do you run? Here's a good question. Do you run

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Speaker 1: a range finding by? Now? I do not? Is there

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Speaker 1: any reason for that? Mm hmm? This the range finding

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Speaker 1: binoculars still seem to all be a little bit like

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Speaker 1: bigger bier. I like to have those. I just like

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Speaker 1: to feel the slimness of those, the razors the way

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Speaker 1: they are, especially with elk when you're calumn to you,

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Speaker 1: you don't really need to be if there are thousand

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Speaker 1: yards away, it doesn't really matter what the range is.

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Speaker 1: I should probably mess around with some some more and

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Speaker 1: get more experience with one under my belt. Hey, lo,

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Speaker 1: should I do that? On a Hunters vortex has the

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Speaker 1: Fury HD five thousand that's ten by forty two, And

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Speaker 1: you're right they are like sitting on a in a

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Speaker 1: binal hearts on your chest. They're heavier, bulkier, tougher to

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Speaker 1: to wield. As we're you know, on archery elk hunt.

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Speaker 1: If when they are getting in close and I'm trying

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Speaker 1: to just pink some clothes stuff, I'd probably rather have

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Speaker 1: something light like the in one hand, you know, usable

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Speaker 1: with one hand, like a small range finder. That would

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Speaker 1: require a little this movement maybe and would just be

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Speaker 1: a little more subtle than trying to hold up binoculars

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Speaker 1: to my face to get it range. I found myself,

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Speaker 1: I was animal upon this weekend. I found myself doing

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Speaker 1: exactly that I always carry. You know, I'll just have

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Speaker 1: my harness with the range finder pouch and then range

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Speaker 1: finding binders also. But the only time I'm using the

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Speaker 1: range finding binders to actually range is when I'm trying

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Speaker 1: to range, like, oh, there's a hay bale, it's a

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Speaker 1: hundred yards from the antelope right now as I stalk in.

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Speaker 1: But once I'm in an actual stalk, I might as

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Speaker 1: well not have on my chest at all, because I'm

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Speaker 1: switching to that handheld the ranger. And so yeah, that

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Speaker 1: makes a whole lot of sense. Especially when you're running

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Speaker 1: a gun in the mountains. Less way the better. Anything

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Speaker 1: else you before we leave the because we're we're here, man,

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Speaker 1: we got like a week ten days, um, I don't know.

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Speaker 1: The Make sure you've got a sharp knife, maybe a sharpener,

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Speaker 1: have a plan to carry out a quarter so he

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Speaker 1: saves you a trip. Might be a game bag, might

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Speaker 1: be like a load cell from stone Glacier. I always

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Speaker 1: carry a pack, even though it might be empty. I'll

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Speaker 1: carry a pack that can carry out a quarter when

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Speaker 1: I go. Would you rather go with a folding knife

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Speaker 1: or a fixed blade and a sharpener or a replaceable

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Speaker 1: blade knife, because that's kind of like the two versions

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Speaker 1: of those things, you know. I like those replaceable blades, man.

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Speaker 1: They're always sharp and you can carry twenty blades probably

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Speaker 1: for the weight of one fixed blade. But they're just

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Speaker 1: not that sturdy durable, so you can't quite trust them.

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Speaker 1: So even though sometimes I would carry those out, always

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Speaker 1: carry a fixed blade. This year, I'm gonna try carrying

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Speaker 1: the Grizzly ridge from bench made um, which is like

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Speaker 1: a little bit bigger folder. It's like bigger than when

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Speaker 1: I carry for like my everyday pocket knife, and trying

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Speaker 1: to just carry one knife because I used to always

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Speaker 1: carry a pocket knife and a fixed white in my

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Speaker 1: back and now I'm just going to go into the

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Speaker 1: woods just with that grizzly ridge and a sharpener. I

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Speaker 1: always go to is one like headlamps. Knife. It's a

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Speaker 1: couple of other things too, is one one is none

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Speaker 1: is where I'm at, Like I'll carry to headlamps. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like somewhere where if I lose one, I can always

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Speaker 1: pick the other one. I'm same with a knife. I

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Speaker 1: mean if I was on a big trip. But I'm

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Speaker 1: talking like day trips. Yeah, day trips where you know,

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Speaker 1: the worst comes the worst. Maybe who I'm with is

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Speaker 1: gonna have a knife, or if I had to, I

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Speaker 1: could walk out in the dark if I lost that

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Speaker 1: head lamp. You know, I like it. I like it.

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Speaker 1: I like to run, man, when it's time ago, I

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Speaker 1: like to go to run. We're still running Mount Baldy

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Speaker 1: by the way. You know, it's been a couple of

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Speaker 1: weeks unfortunately. Um we've been having busy schedules, my wife

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Speaker 1: and I. So I've been solo with kids and it's

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Speaker 1: they're they're not ready for ball lead trips. Yeah, Well,

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Speaker 1: Cal and I went to the Vortex Challenge and Douglas Wyoming,

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Speaker 1: which if you don't know what that is, where you

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Speaker 1: run around in the mountains and shoot long range targets

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Speaker 1: with your rightful it's a competition their time and you

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Speaker 1: got hit with waited the time versus the hits. We didn't.

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Speaker 1: We didn't really participate in the scoring part for many

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Speaker 1: many reasons. Um, but you have to like so if

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Speaker 1: you're timed out, you stop shooting. So the time really

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Speaker 1: just regulates the amount of so you can get positive

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Speaker 1: score or if you're I think it's eight minutes. If

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Speaker 1: you're eight minutes is up and you haven't shot the targets,

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Speaker 1: then you get no points. Um. Oh, so the running

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Speaker 1: between shots, there's that's not what There's an overall time

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Speaker 1: component of the score as well. So though, so what

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Speaker 1: they do is when you get sometimes there's a line

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Speaker 1: at each station. You will run up to the station

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Speaker 1: and they mark your time when you arrived and then

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Speaker 1: your time when you started shooting, and then they use

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Speaker 1: that to tabulate the final score. So there's a bunch

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Speaker 1: of stuff in there that that goes to your final score.

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Speaker 1: Cal and I, um weren't real good petitive, say that

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Speaker 1: in a lot of ways, we you know, we just

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Speaker 1: there to learn, have fun. There were some guys there

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Speaker 1: that were legit long range masters, snipers, snipers, you know,

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Speaker 1: and they would run from it, you know, run from

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Speaker 1: station to station, sit down the community, you know, spot

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Speaker 1: or shooting. Communication was dialed in and so it was

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Speaker 1: it was really cool to see just like when you

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Speaker 1: shoot like total archery challenge or some something with someone

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Speaker 1: who really knows what they're doing and this is their game. Um,

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Speaker 1: we shot a three gun thing Wireman Governs matched the

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Speaker 1: week before that. There again like I'm just there messing around,

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Speaker 1: trying to learn. You see the pros do it, and

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Speaker 1: you just know what you could be if you devoted

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Speaker 1: your home, all your waking moments to those things. So,

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Speaker 1: but Spencer, we gotta get to the white tail. We

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Speaker 1: always talk about elk season now, but we're in the West.

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Speaker 1: There's a lot of people, I think we think about

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Speaker 1: eight million people that are white tail honors, and um,

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Speaker 1: we gotta talk about what they might need, and so

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Speaker 1: can you regale us with your must haves for white tails.

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Speaker 1: Let's just let's just go and say we haven't discussed this,

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Speaker 1: but let's just say you're in a tree stand. So

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Speaker 1: one of my favorite things is as a hunter who layers,

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Speaker 1: and you park your pickup and you walk like a

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Speaker 1: mile and a half to a tree stand and then

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Speaker 1: you sit there for three hours and it's really cold.

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Speaker 1: Layers are crucial, and so one of my favorite layers

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Speaker 1: is having a base layer with a hoodie. For example,

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Speaker 1: First Light has the Killing hoodie and I love that

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Speaker 1: thing for like mid October all the way until the

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Speaker 1: beginning of January, basically entire white tail season that you're hunting.

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Speaker 1: It's just perfect music. Can wear it to your tree

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Speaker 1: stand so low. Then you throw your jacket on over

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Speaker 1: It's got the built in hood uh for keeping wind

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Speaker 1: out or keeping you warmer. Just having that hood on

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Speaker 1: a base layer is ideal. Favorite thing is a white

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Speaker 1: tail hunter. That's like as much as white tail or

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Speaker 1: as much as layering matters in the elk woods, if

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Speaker 1: you're spot and stalking meal there, it matters just as much,

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Speaker 1: especially if you're public land white toil. I have found

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Speaker 1: because you're traveling long ways and your stand, you're getting sweaty.

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Speaker 1: Then you're gonna sit there in the cold most of

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Speaker 1: the time all damn day. Long, so you gotta get

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Speaker 1: dried off, you gotta get fresh layers on and be

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Speaker 1: ready to sit. So that's a that's a damn important

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Speaker 1: part of it. Yeah, and just as a white deal

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Speaker 1: hunter so much if it's she's like being comfortable sitting

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Speaker 1: still and having that hood is a must for me.

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Speaker 1: I get really annoyed if I buy a jacket or

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Speaker 1: something like that that doesn't have a hood on it.

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Speaker 1: I hunt in sal Dakota mostly it's like one of

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Speaker 1: the windy est states there is. Having that hood is crucial.

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Speaker 1: I got a question for your layering system that do

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Speaker 1: you layer hoods then? Yeah, it's cold enough, and it

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Speaker 1: often is a layer hoods for sure. You like, I'll

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Speaker 1: be like a hood and then a stocking hat and

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Speaker 1: then a hood triple hood. Yeah, there's nothing like there's

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Speaker 1: just not never gonna be too much gear. I mean,

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Speaker 1: obviously the point of first light performance gear like that

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Speaker 1: is to to slim down. That's not be wearing like

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Speaker 1: the old coveralls that are all bulky you'd barely walk in.

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Speaker 1: I remember when I was a kid, we'd pack like giant,

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Speaker 1: really heavy coveralls for cold sits. And the idea is

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Speaker 1: not to have to do that with wind stopper material

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Speaker 1: and things of that nature. But the more of the

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Speaker 1: merrier when you're sitting up in a tree. Yeah. Another

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Speaker 1: like piece of crucial gear is I want to wear

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Speaker 1: the smallest, like thinnest gloves possible, like fingerlist ones, even

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Speaker 1: no matter if it's late September or like late November,

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Speaker 1: no matter what the temperature is. And then I have

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Speaker 1: a handmuff with I am love it because in my

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Speaker 1: hands are always functional no matter what. They stay warm

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Speaker 1: because I've got that muff. Uh, And I like first light.

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Speaker 1: It's gone to the point where even I think it's

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Speaker 1: a sanctuary jacket has the built in hand muff like

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Speaker 1: in the pockets, which is perfect. Then I don't have

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Speaker 1: to take them off with me. But if you don't

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Speaker 1: have a jacket like that, having them off and then

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Speaker 1: wearing super thing gloves. One pair of gloves can get

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Speaker 1: you basically through the entire year, especially when you're bow hunting.

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Speaker 1: If an encounter happens real fast in early November, you

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Speaker 1: don't want to have to to be pulling gloves off and

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Speaker 1: stuff like that. Or if you gotta get your range

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Speaker 1: find or whatever it is, if you gotta if your

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Speaker 1: phone goes off, you gotta mute your phone. All of

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00:18:03,080 --> 00:18:06,680
Speaker 1: that is, uh is ideal for those fingerless gloves if

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Speaker 1: you've got them off. Plus like working your release no

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Speaker 1: one where that is like have an access to whether

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Speaker 1: you're using a back tension or a thumb where you

358
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Speaker 1: gotta strapped your wrist whatever. I mean, you have to

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Speaker 1: have real easy access so you can't peel off a

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Speaker 1: mitten and get to your I used to be a

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Speaker 1: glomet guy, one of the fingerless and yeah, yeah, no more,

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Speaker 1: no more since I started, I feel like I feel

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Speaker 1: like for hardcore white till hunters nowadays, the mof is

364
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Speaker 1: the way. It's a trend and I like to put

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Speaker 1: some snacks in my mouf. It's like a grab bag

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Speaker 1: you Yeah, because if you have your snacks in your

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Speaker 1: backpack and it's actually a cold day when you go

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Speaker 1: to when I have a snack, you're gonna bust out

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Speaker 1: your feelings, that's right, Yeah, so you want to warm

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Speaker 1: them snacks up. Yeah. I find that it's like the

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Speaker 1: easiest place to grab stuff from as well, so I'll

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Speaker 1: keep like whatever is a must grab, like if it's

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Speaker 1: early November, the grunt tube and arrange finder in there

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Speaker 1: and that's it and they're super accessible. Yeah, Phil, Phil,

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Speaker 1: ready for a good segue. Yeah, let's watch this. So

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Speaker 1: when like, yeah, ship Spencer, Spencer. Damn it, Phil, you

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Speaker 1: got me all rouled up. Spencer does a lot of

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Speaker 1: typing for the Mediator dot com and I think maybe

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Speaker 1: this fall he might be using his muff at his

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Speaker 1: desk to keep his fingers warm and flexible during all

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Speaker 1: the writing that he does. Dot com. We do keep

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00:19:28,320 --> 00:19:30,200
Speaker 1: it playing cold in here, but it is cold. Yeah,

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00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:32,480
Speaker 1: we have to turn Yeah, this is a this is

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Speaker 1: a cold box that we're sitting right now. We do

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00:19:34,680 --> 00:19:36,919
Speaker 1: turn the air off. But that segue leads us to

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Speaker 1: what specifically what Spencer has done for the Mediator dot com.

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00:19:41,080 --> 00:19:43,480
Speaker 1: Go there if you're not there, and read all the

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00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:47,439
Speaker 1: things and the stuff, specifically a thing called fact checker,

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Speaker 1: and uh, Spencer is gonna regale us with some of

390
00:19:51,040 --> 00:19:53,160
Speaker 1: the coolest fact checkers and things that he's written about

391
00:19:53,200 --> 00:19:56,320
Speaker 1: because he's doing all the work and all the learnings,

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00:19:56,520 --> 00:19:59,800
Speaker 1: so we can we can get that concise and clear

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00:19:59,800 --> 00:20:02,560
Speaker 1: and for nation an article for him, So thank us.

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00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:04,600
Speaker 1: What's the first one you want to talk about? So

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Speaker 1: the fact checkers a series. We started this summer kind

396
00:20:08,480 --> 00:20:12,119
Speaker 1: of grabbing um. Some of these maybe old lives tales

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00:20:13,320 --> 00:20:18,960
Speaker 1: or suspect yarns, beliefs, rumors that many outdoor folks have,

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00:20:19,200 --> 00:20:22,760
Speaker 1: and then looking at whether or not it is factual.

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Speaker 1: So some examples are like our daddy long legs venomous.

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Speaker 1: The answers, now, can you did you know that? Not

401
00:20:32,359 --> 00:20:35,000
Speaker 1: until I read Spencer's piece, did you feel like they

402
00:20:35,080 --> 00:20:39,320
Speaker 1: might be venomous? Because that's the wall. I had the

403
00:20:39,400 --> 00:20:42,040
Speaker 1: understand that everybody else does too, that they are, but

404
00:20:42,119 --> 00:20:44,480
Speaker 1: that that they can't they don't have the ability to

405
00:20:44,520 --> 00:20:47,160
Speaker 1: bite you and give you the venom. Yeah, they can't.

406
00:20:47,160 --> 00:20:49,239
Speaker 1: They don't have the they can't inject it. Phil, did

407
00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:52,119
Speaker 1: you learn something there? Oh? Yeah, yeah, I grew up

408
00:20:52,119 --> 00:20:55,080
Speaker 1: thinking the same thing. Good. Well, that's what this series

409
00:20:55,119 --> 00:20:57,840
Speaker 1: is for. Some other ones are like, is it unsafe

410
00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:03,159
Speaker 1: to eat a rabbit before the frost? John? Yes? Or no?

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00:21:03,800 --> 00:21:07,000
Speaker 1: It's totally safe. Totally safe, it is. But that's something

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00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:10,399
Speaker 1: that I think we've probably all heard Old Feller at

413
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Speaker 1: the coffee shop. So every time we have them rabbits

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Speaker 1: in October, every time I have Charles the Rabbitman Rodney

415
00:21:17,080 --> 00:21:20,920
Speaker 1: on here, people right in exactly those questions. Well, I've

416
00:21:20,920 --> 00:21:24,240
Speaker 1: never I've never cooked rabbit, but I can't. Yeah, it's

417
00:21:24,359 --> 00:21:29,359
Speaker 1: they have disease, right, some do. But my favorite one

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00:21:29,359 --> 00:21:32,240
Speaker 1: that we've covered it was fact checking the great and

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00:21:32,280 --> 00:21:36,480
Speaker 1: powerful Joe Rogan on was there actually a ceasefire during

420
00:21:36,520 --> 00:21:39,600
Speaker 1: World War One? Let me throw an anecdote on top

421
00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:41,280
Speaker 1: of this one, because it's it's something that Joe has

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00:21:41,320 --> 00:21:43,680
Speaker 1: talked about for years and I met. When I first

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00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:48,600
Speaker 1: met the guy, um Steve Ranella introduced us and I

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00:21:48,680 --> 00:21:50,920
Speaker 1: was interviewing him for a piece or a magazine article

425
00:21:51,040 --> 00:21:54,240
Speaker 1: was writing. Joe and I must have talked for I

426
00:21:54,320 --> 00:21:55,840
Speaker 1: didn't know the guy, never met him, just to him

427
00:21:55,840 --> 00:21:59,280
Speaker 1: as like a fear factor. Dude, Musta's are for forty

428
00:21:59,280 --> 00:22:02,560
Speaker 1: five minutes about wolves and a And a big portion

429
00:22:02,560 --> 00:22:04,400
Speaker 1: of that was that he had just learned or at

430
00:22:04,400 --> 00:22:06,640
Speaker 1: some point in the in the like the near term,

431
00:22:06,960 --> 00:22:10,720
Speaker 1: learned about this crazy story about wolve the ceasefire during

432
00:22:11,280 --> 00:22:14,920
Speaker 1: World War where they had to stop fighting and kill

433
00:22:15,000 --> 00:22:17,479
Speaker 1: all the bulls and then get back to fighting. So

434
00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:19,880
Speaker 1: he's been on that for years. I don't know how

435
00:22:19,880 --> 00:22:22,080
Speaker 1: many times a man that has done that many podcasts

436
00:22:22,080 --> 00:22:26,360
Speaker 1: has repeated that, but he's probably repeated it dozens of times. Yeah,

437
00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:28,760
Speaker 1: and and I want everyone to go look at the

438
00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:30,720
Speaker 1: fact checker seediars on the website. But I'm gonna spoil

439
00:22:30,840 --> 00:22:33,520
Speaker 1: something for you right now. This is the first one

440
00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:36,960
Speaker 1: that was actually true. The claim is that during World

441
00:22:37,000 --> 00:22:40,639
Speaker 1: War One, the Germans and Russians took a decided to

442
00:22:40,640 --> 00:22:44,119
Speaker 1: have a temporary ceasefire, and they banded together to hunt wolves.

443
00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:46,600
Speaker 1: And these wolves moved into the front lines and they

444
00:22:46,600 --> 00:22:50,960
Speaker 1: were scavenging on like dead soldiers and wounded soldiers and

445
00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:55,160
Speaker 1: these incapacitated people that they could get to, And uh,

446
00:22:55,359 --> 00:23:00,000
Speaker 1: it's all actually true. This was reported in multiple play

447
00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:03,880
Speaker 1: races in nineteen seventeen, the El Paso Herald, Oklahoma City Times,

448
00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:08,600
Speaker 1: New York Times, etcetera. Um, And it's been repeated by

449
00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:11,800
Speaker 1: a lot of you know, amateur historians and history buffs

450
00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:15,160
Speaker 1: like Joe Rogan, and it just sounds like such bull crap,

451
00:23:15,960 --> 00:23:19,440
Speaker 1: but it's true. It's true. Have you found any firsthand

452
00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:23,120
Speaker 1: accounts of those things from people who were there? So

453
00:23:23,320 --> 00:23:27,639
Speaker 1: there were some There was a dispatch in Berlin that

454
00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:31,000
Speaker 1: noted that large packs of wolves were kind of moving

455
00:23:31,000 --> 00:23:34,760
Speaker 1: into the war zone because they had been displaced from

456
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:37,199
Speaker 1: the forests of I think it was like Lithuania and

457
00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:39,800
Speaker 1: some other places where the war was also taking place,

458
00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:43,000
Speaker 1: and it caused these wolves to move into areas that

459
00:23:43,080 --> 00:23:47,280
Speaker 1: they previously weren't And there are some firsthand accounts of

460
00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:51,160
Speaker 1: like rural villagers talking about how these wolves were picking

461
00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:54,040
Speaker 1: off their livestock and in two cases they were actually

462
00:23:54,040 --> 00:23:57,920
Speaker 1: picking off kids that they attacked UH in nineteen seventeen,

463
00:23:58,280 --> 00:24:01,240
Speaker 1: And like I said, these wolves figured out that where

464
00:24:01,240 --> 00:24:03,879
Speaker 1: a lot of the shooting was coming from and explosions,

465
00:24:03,920 --> 00:24:07,560
Speaker 1: that there was also some humans that were easy to

466
00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:09,320
Speaker 1: get to you, And so they moved into the front lines.

467
00:24:09,800 --> 00:24:13,480
Speaker 1: Both sides recognized this and they had an agreed upon

468
00:24:13,600 --> 00:24:18,240
Speaker 1: ceasefire to hunt wolves. And it said that they used poison,

469
00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:22,280
Speaker 1: rifle fire, hand grenades, and machine guns. This was from

470
00:24:22,320 --> 00:24:27,560
Speaker 1: the v New York Times article and it said, um,

471
00:24:27,600 --> 00:24:31,879
Speaker 1: nowhere like Russia are wolves quite so large and powerful.

472
00:24:32,119 --> 00:24:36,040
Speaker 1: They were desperate in their hunger. How long did that

473
00:24:36,080 --> 00:24:40,200
Speaker 1: ceasefire last? So it seems like this happened a few times.

474
00:24:40,200 --> 00:24:42,200
Speaker 1: Like the first time it happened, they kind of agreed, like,

475
00:24:42,200 --> 00:24:45,200
Speaker 1: all right, if this happens again, we're stopped we're gonna

476
00:24:45,200 --> 00:24:47,680
Speaker 1: stop shooting at each other and shoot at the wolves.

477
00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:50,959
Speaker 1: And uh, what I found was that there was hundreds

478
00:24:51,000 --> 00:24:53,880
Speaker 1: of wolves. Was the estimation, a few hundred wolves killed

479
00:24:53,960 --> 00:25:01,760
Speaker 1: during the war by soldiers during these couple ceasefires. Yeah, yeah,

480
00:25:01,760 --> 00:25:04,199
Speaker 1: it seems more. It seems incredibly morbid to say that,

481
00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:08,040
Speaker 1: like in during war, there's a lot of you know,

482
00:25:08,880 --> 00:25:11,320
Speaker 1: fresh meat laying around if you look at it from

483
00:25:11,359 --> 00:25:14,080
Speaker 1: the from the eyes of a wolf. And so it

484
00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:15,960
Speaker 1: makes a whole lot of sense. It always did to me,

485
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:19,600
Speaker 1: make sense that it screams for a movie of some kind,

486
00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:24,359
Speaker 1: probably Liam Neeson. Yeah, and you already made a movie

487
00:25:25,320 --> 00:25:27,760
Speaker 1: hunts Wolves. Yeah, so yeah, i'd follow right up, and

488
00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:31,440
Speaker 1: follow right up Lean Neeson, maybe Nicholas Cage. During research

489
00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:33,359
Speaker 1: for this article, I also came across some stuff that

490
00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:36,080
Speaker 1: talked about wolves during World War Two, and it was

491
00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:39,560
Speaker 1: quite the opposite experience then. And so what I had

492
00:25:39,600 --> 00:25:42,760
Speaker 1: found was that during World War Two, a lot of

493
00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:48,120
Speaker 1: these I think rural villages in like Russia, Uh, all

494
00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:51,680
Speaker 1: of the men and the guns were called to the war,

495
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:56,679
Speaker 1: and so all of a sudden, these villages, uh didn't

496
00:25:56,760 --> 00:26:01,760
Speaker 1: have any firearms or hunters around to stop these wolves,

497
00:26:01,760 --> 00:26:03,359
Speaker 1: and these wolves kind of figured it out and they

498
00:26:03,400 --> 00:26:06,479
Speaker 1: started picking off livestock, and I think there was like

499
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:09,560
Speaker 1: ten cases of them attacking kids and stuff because there

500
00:26:09,600 --> 00:26:13,159
Speaker 1: was this absence of threat there and the wolves figured

501
00:26:13,200 --> 00:26:15,480
Speaker 1: it out pretty quickly. Yeah, it seems in cities, but

502
00:26:15,520 --> 00:26:18,560
Speaker 1: it's generally just conditioning their conditioned not to be afraid

503
00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:20,080
Speaker 1: of the thing they're going for, and they're picking off

504
00:26:20,119 --> 00:26:25,080
Speaker 1: the easy targets. That's what wolves do. Um, that's pretty

505
00:26:25,119 --> 00:26:27,880
Speaker 1: that's incredible. And then did Rogan ever write you back

506
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:30,280
Speaker 1: on that, as you said, Um, no, he went as

507
00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:32,240
Speaker 1: far as to retweet it, so he was proud that

508
00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:35,840
Speaker 1: he was correct on it, for sure, but he did

509
00:26:35,880 --> 00:26:39,600
Speaker 1: acknowledge it. That's good. That's good. What else? What else

510
00:26:39,640 --> 00:26:41,760
Speaker 1: is there? I know we cover whales in the Great

511
00:26:41,800 --> 00:26:45,040
Speaker 1: Salt Lake. You discuss that on other podcasts. But there's

512
00:26:45,119 --> 00:26:48,400
Speaker 1: the famous hole in the Hornbuck, yeah, he talked about.

513
00:26:48,520 --> 00:26:50,520
Speaker 1: So this is a different series on the website that

514
00:26:50,560 --> 00:26:55,160
Speaker 1: we also started, the Summer's Barroom Banter, And uh, that

515
00:26:55,520 --> 00:26:58,840
Speaker 1: is where I'm kind of the curator for this interesting

516
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:01,879
Speaker 1: stuff that will make you seem educated from a bar stool,

517
00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:05,359
Speaker 1: which is my favorite kind of knowledge. I feel like

518
00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:09,400
Speaker 1: both these series will make you seem educated from a barstool, definitely,

519
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:11,879
Speaker 1: because you should. Everybody should read this the prep themselves

520
00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:14,560
Speaker 1: for like whether it's not maybe it won't be the barstool,

521
00:27:14,560 --> 00:27:17,040
Speaker 1: but deer Camp. Yeah, the deer camp, because you're gonna

522
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:18,960
Speaker 1: have that buddy, it's gonna tell you that story again.

523
00:27:19,400 --> 00:27:22,680
Speaker 1: And you're like, you know what, Actually, it makes you

524
00:27:22,680 --> 00:27:28,439
Speaker 1: a good podcast, daddy, long legs aren't venomous. Goddamn it

525
00:27:28,440 --> 00:27:30,360
Speaker 1: gonna seem smart and interesting if you go and read

526
00:27:30,400 --> 00:27:32,639
Speaker 1: all of these. I wanted to call any material. I

527
00:27:32,640 --> 00:27:35,800
Speaker 1: wanted to call it in your face, but nobody, nobody,

528
00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:38,480
Speaker 1: the fact checkers a better ring to it. So one

529
00:27:38,480 --> 00:27:42,000
Speaker 1: of the barroom banters was looking at the source of

530
00:27:42,040 --> 00:27:44,320
Speaker 1: the whole in the hole in the hornbuck. Are you

531
00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:46,360
Speaker 1: familiar with the hole in the hornbuck? I am not.

532
00:27:46,920 --> 00:27:50,719
Speaker 1: I know I know of one. My brother in law

533
00:27:50,800 --> 00:27:52,480
Speaker 1: has a hole in the hornbuck, but I was playing

534
00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:54,800
Speaker 1: ping pong underneath just the other day, but not this

535
00:27:54,840 --> 00:27:59,720
Speaker 1: hole in ther buck. That one. I believe this is

536
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:03,320
Speaker 1: like the second biggest white tail in the US, and

537
00:28:03,359 --> 00:28:06,920
Speaker 1: it's besides like all that has going on on its rack,

538
00:28:07,359 --> 00:28:10,520
Speaker 1: and these ridiculous points and spurs. Yea, let's let's stop

539
00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:13,320
Speaker 1: here and how you describe, because I would like to

540
00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:17,840
Speaker 1: see how you can just the ability to describe this specimen.

541
00:28:18,000 --> 00:28:21,800
Speaker 1: So this buck looks like like a main frame four

542
00:28:21,880 --> 00:28:24,240
Speaker 1: by four. I would say, like, if you got rid

543
00:28:24,280 --> 00:28:26,639
Speaker 1: of all the bonus stuff, you'd have a four. I

544
00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:31,080
Speaker 1: don't see anything main frame four by four. I'm getting there.

545
00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:34,600
Speaker 1: So the fact that it has like branched antlers, you

546
00:28:34,680 --> 00:28:37,119
Speaker 1: started off on the wrong foot. I'll get there. So

547
00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:38,880
Speaker 1: if you strip away everything, you've got like a main

548
00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:41,800
Speaker 1: frame four by four. But then you'd like give him

549
00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:45,719
Speaker 1: all this palmation, all this palmation between you know, it's

550
00:28:45,760 --> 00:28:47,719
Speaker 1: G two and his G three and G three G

551
00:28:47,880 --> 00:28:51,200
Speaker 1: four and uh, you've got like the beginning of the

552
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:54,080
Speaker 1: hole in hornbuck. But then after that you give him

553
00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:56,160
Speaker 1: like twenty more points because I think this buck had

554
00:28:56,200 --> 00:28:59,040
Speaker 1: a total of thirty three points or something. Uh and

555
00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:03,920
Speaker 1: basically every point is split and then I think three

556
00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:07,400
Speaker 1: of his uh may like three of his points have

557
00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:11,160
Speaker 1: their own drop times or more. There's just so much

558
00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:13,640
Speaker 1: going on. Let's give you a shot at the title.

559
00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:19,440
Speaker 1: How would you describe this big buck? It's more like

560
00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:26,560
Speaker 1: a moose and a white tail had sex, and then

561
00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:31,280
Speaker 1: somehow like an octopus got into his antlers as they

562
00:29:31,280 --> 00:29:35,000
Speaker 1: were forming and spread his tentacles there in all the

563
00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:39,640
Speaker 1: crazy different directions. Yeah, it was the octopus involved in

564
00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:44,400
Speaker 1: the sex. No, sort of like inserted into the later on. Yeah,

565
00:29:45,840 --> 00:29:49,200
Speaker 1: so you're gonna you're gonna like this party this. This

566
00:29:49,440 --> 00:29:52,640
Speaker 1: deer was killed by a train. It was hit by

567
00:29:52,640 --> 00:29:56,840
Speaker 1: a train, and these railroad workers in Ohio found this

568
00:29:56,920 --> 00:30:00,280
Speaker 1: book shortly after he was killed. And not like one

569
00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:03,640
Speaker 1: of them there knew much about hunting or wildlife or deer.

570
00:30:04,200 --> 00:30:06,200
Speaker 1: And here's a quote from one of the guys on

571
00:30:06,240 --> 00:30:09,440
Speaker 1: the scene. He said, one of the men said, it's

572
00:30:09,440 --> 00:30:12,520
Speaker 1: an elk. Then another one said, no, it's a moose.

573
00:30:12,880 --> 00:30:15,719
Speaker 1: I'd seen dear before but really wasn't sure if this

574
00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:19,000
Speaker 1: was one or not. So that's how ridiculous its rack looks.

575
00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:20,840
Speaker 1: And yahn, he just said. One guy was like, looked

576
00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:23,800
Speaker 1: like a moose and the white til had sex. An

577
00:30:23,840 --> 00:30:26,560
Speaker 1: octopus came in later on and got in the mix.

578
00:30:27,360 --> 00:30:30,320
Speaker 1: That's what's going on. I like it. So this famous

579
00:30:30,360 --> 00:30:34,520
Speaker 1: buck discovered in after we saved by the train, he

580
00:30:34,520 --> 00:30:38,480
Speaker 1: had three hundred twenty eight inches of antler, and he

581
00:30:38,680 --> 00:30:43,560
Speaker 1: basically was taxidermyed up and he sat at this little

582
00:30:43,560 --> 00:30:47,360
Speaker 1: watering hole in this little town in Ohio for like

583
00:30:47,880 --> 00:30:52,600
Speaker 1: thirty years before some antler collecting bought him. You know.

584
00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:55,040
Speaker 1: In word, it spread that this enormous white table was

585
00:30:55,080 --> 00:30:59,480
Speaker 1: just hanging in this smoke filled bar until somebody bought it.

586
00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:02,640
Speaker 1: And uh after it was bought, it went on displaying

587
00:31:02,680 --> 00:31:06,160
Speaker 1: all these places and pictures started circulating, and everyone noticed

588
00:31:06,240 --> 00:31:11,640
Speaker 1: the hole in the drop time on its right main beam.

589
00:31:11,680 --> 00:31:14,400
Speaker 1: So it was named the hole in the horm Buck.

590
00:31:14,680 --> 00:31:18,360
Speaker 1: And there was a lot of theories and curiosities around

591
00:31:18,680 --> 00:31:26,120
Speaker 1: that hole in its handler is that whole measure point three?

592
00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:31,120
Speaker 1: So one of the theories. One of the theories was

593
00:31:31,200 --> 00:31:34,680
Speaker 1: that when this buck was crushed by this train, it

594
00:31:34,800 --> 00:31:37,880
Speaker 1: was thrown into a chain link fence where these rail

595
00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:41,800
Speaker 1: road workers discovered it, and that the impact was so

596
00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:46,040
Speaker 1: strong that like if you can imagine the bottom of

597
00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 1: a chain link fence or hurricane fence, is that what

598
00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:51,960
Speaker 1: you call him? Well, you know, funny, somebody sent me

599
00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:56,640
Speaker 1: a d M of a picture of a chain link

600
00:31:56,720 --> 00:32:01,920
Speaker 1: fence which had a the sign of the maker of

601
00:32:01,960 --> 00:32:04,200
Speaker 1: that channeling fence on it, and it was made by

602
00:32:04,360 --> 00:32:09,080
Speaker 1: Hurricane Man factory. So to bring that full circle, it's

603
00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:16,040
Speaker 1: like calling tissue cleanex fence hurricane there's another fact checker. Yeah,

604
00:32:16,120 --> 00:32:17,760
Speaker 1: So if you can imagine the bottom of this fence

605
00:32:17,800 --> 00:32:20,320
Speaker 1: and then this deer's andlers got lodged underneath there, and

606
00:32:20,360 --> 00:32:22,640
Speaker 1: that's what created the whole in this drop time. That

607
00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:26,360
Speaker 1: was like one theory and one of the most widely accepted.

608
00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:30,120
Speaker 1: Another one was that uh many hunters had claimed to

609
00:32:30,120 --> 00:32:31,840
Speaker 1: have seen this book and they had shot at it

610
00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:36,480
Speaker 1: and some unlucky guy put you know, to seventies shell

611
00:32:37,200 --> 00:32:39,200
Speaker 1: right through its drop time, missed the buck but hit

612
00:32:39,200 --> 00:32:41,000
Speaker 1: the drop time. So that was the other theory, and

613
00:32:41,000 --> 00:32:43,040
Speaker 1: it was kind of those two things that were accepted

614
00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:48,400
Speaker 1: for a long long time and it was until like

615
00:32:48,840 --> 00:32:53,840
Speaker 1: twenty fifteen or something that this one old man from Dayton, Ohio.

616
00:32:54,600 --> 00:32:56,720
Speaker 1: U not Danton, Ohio, I don't remember what the small

617
00:32:56,760 --> 00:33:00,520
Speaker 1: town was. Some some old man from Ohio step forward said, nope,

618
00:33:00,880 --> 00:33:03,920
Speaker 1: I know the real answer to how that buck got

619
00:33:03,960 --> 00:33:07,720
Speaker 1: the hole in its antler. And his answer was that

620
00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:12,440
Speaker 1: the bar where this deer was mounted on the wall,

621
00:33:13,000 --> 00:33:17,160
Speaker 1: he had worked there and the antlers were so enormous

622
00:33:17,600 --> 00:33:21,440
Speaker 1: that even putting this taxidermy buck like in a stud

623
00:33:21,480 --> 00:33:24,640
Speaker 1: in the wall wasn't sufficient enough to keep it from

624
00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:28,120
Speaker 1: like falling forward or tilting a little bit. And so

625
00:33:28,200 --> 00:33:30,479
Speaker 1: they had to do something else. And his manager told him,

626
00:33:30,520 --> 00:33:32,920
Speaker 1: he says, I got a drill in my car, I'll

627
00:33:32,920 --> 00:33:35,760
Speaker 1: go get it. They took a drill bit, put it

628
00:33:35,800 --> 00:33:38,280
Speaker 1: through its drop time ransom wire through there, and then

629
00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:40,360
Speaker 1: a fix that to the ceiling to keep it from

630
00:33:40,400 --> 00:33:42,880
Speaker 1: moving anymore. And that is the source of the hole

631
00:33:42,880 --> 00:33:45,400
Speaker 1: in the Hornbuck. That is the source of the whole

632
00:33:45,960 --> 00:33:47,960
Speaker 1: in the Hole in the Hornbuck. It's kind of a

633
00:33:48,040 --> 00:33:53,120
Speaker 1: letdown though, after like seventy years of speculation and excitement

634
00:33:53,240 --> 00:33:56,240
Speaker 1: around some poor hunter missed this, you know, trophy white

635
00:33:56,280 --> 00:33:59,480
Speaker 1: sail or or a chain length fence put it there

636
00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:02,320
Speaker 1: all to be some bartender. Yeah, we don't always the

637
00:34:02,320 --> 00:34:07,680
Speaker 1: truth doesn't always set us free, especially on the whole

638
00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:14,120
Speaker 1: wasn't really keeping me up at night. It's still the

639
00:34:14,200 --> 00:34:16,719
Speaker 1: story of its origin. Yeah, if you want to see

640
00:34:16,719 --> 00:34:19,760
Speaker 1: the Hole in the Hornbuck, it's It's been replicated many times,

641
00:34:19,760 --> 00:34:22,600
Speaker 1: but the original sits at the Wonders of Wildlife Museum

642
00:34:22,719 --> 00:34:29,400
Speaker 1: in Springfield. Missouri. Yeah, well, I mean, not all of

643
00:34:29,440 --> 00:34:34,360
Speaker 1: your revelations have been super interesting, but that one is

644
00:34:35,000 --> 00:34:38,000
Speaker 1: that one is go to the website, read that stuff.

645
00:34:38,000 --> 00:34:41,160
Speaker 1: Spencer is kicking ass over there. Every week there's at

646
00:34:41,200 --> 00:34:42,920
Speaker 1: least one or two new tidbits that are gonna make

647
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:46,799
Speaker 1: it seem smarter, even if you're only repeating his words.

648
00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:50,319
Speaker 1: That's the way to go. Now, we've got a lot

649
00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:52,440
Speaker 1: of people right and in before we get to Rachel.

650
00:34:53,239 --> 00:34:57,439
Speaker 1: Um sitting here in this this studio about two weeks ago,

651
00:34:58,040 --> 00:35:01,440
Speaker 1: before we get to Rachel, we have a recurring segment

652
00:35:01,480 --> 00:35:04,000
Speaker 1: that's about to become recurring because this is the second

653
00:35:04,000 --> 00:35:09,200
Speaker 1: time that it's happened on the show. Um, Phil the

654
00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:12,760
Speaker 1: engineer over here, sitting in his new perch. He's perched

655
00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:18,799
Speaker 1: himself above us, if only symbolically think he might think

656
00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:23,000
Speaker 1: he's better than us. It's gonna start. We're gonna call

657
00:35:23,040 --> 00:35:26,719
Speaker 1: this segment some things considered, got it? I like it?

658
00:35:26,920 --> 00:35:29,520
Speaker 1: Like that? Yeah, it's good. And that's where Phil just

659
00:35:29,600 --> 00:35:36,000
Speaker 1: reads mean comments about this show. The first one made

660
00:35:36,040 --> 00:35:38,920
Speaker 1: me giggle like a little girl. It made a lot

661
00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:42,000
Speaker 1: of people that wrote into the email very very happy.

662
00:35:42,280 --> 00:35:44,680
Speaker 1: For a myriad a number of different reasons. I had

663
00:35:44,800 --> 00:35:48,760
Speaker 1: read it before, but just reading it again out loud,

664
00:35:49,800 --> 00:35:52,839
Speaker 1: it was it was sorry, what's it called? It's called

665
00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:57,040
Speaker 1: some things considered, some things can get it, get it,

666
00:35:57,160 --> 00:35:59,359
Speaker 1: get it. I just now came up with that right

667
00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:02,000
Speaker 1: on the flying out of myself. Um. But I think

668
00:36:02,040 --> 00:36:04,640
Speaker 1: it's just a worthy segment and it made a lot

669
00:36:04,719 --> 00:36:06,560
Speaker 1: of people laugh, and so we're gonna return to it.

670
00:36:06,840 --> 00:36:08,719
Speaker 1: Please continue to let us know if you like it

671
00:36:08,800 --> 00:36:13,239
Speaker 1: or not. So Phil, are you? Are you ready? Everybody ready?

672
00:36:13,280 --> 00:36:16,399
Speaker 1: I'm excited for this. You guys have not heard this yet.

673
00:36:17,640 --> 00:36:29,799
Speaker 1: Phil title hard to listen to, a little nervous. This

674
00:36:29,880 --> 00:36:34,040
Speaker 1: is a self serving and direction list podcast. It offers

675
00:36:34,040 --> 00:36:39,240
Speaker 1: neither wisdom nor entertainment to the contemplative outdoorsman. His arrogance

676
00:36:39,280 --> 00:36:42,239
Speaker 1: with guests and lack of ability to direct the podcast

677
00:36:42,560 --> 00:36:48,440
Speaker 1: is irritating. His overall attitude towards hunting does not represent

678
00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:57,040
Speaker 1: the American sportsman for sports sportsman forward slash sports woman. Additionally,

679
00:36:57,560 --> 00:36:59,759
Speaker 1: it is clear that much of his hunting has been

680
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:03,800
Speaker 1: on private land and or with a guide. Ben O

681
00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:09,600
Speaker 1: Ben O'Brien is the skid mark in the underpants of

682
00:37:09,719 --> 00:37:15,960
Speaker 1: meat Eater, Inc. Let's take a moment when something is

683
00:37:16,000 --> 00:37:19,279
Speaker 1: considered to reflect on what we've heard from Phil, just

684
00:37:19,320 --> 00:37:24,360
Speaker 1: take a quick moment, everybody, just think about it, and

685
00:37:24,480 --> 00:37:31,399
Speaker 1: we're back, and we're back. Yeah, what do you think

686
00:37:31,400 --> 00:37:35,480
Speaker 1: they're John? What areat the feeling right now? Just talk

687
00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:38,759
Speaker 1: to me, Just spill your emotions album to the podcast.

688
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:43,399
Speaker 1: That person you don't want to say that first name,

689
00:37:43,600 --> 00:37:46,200
Speaker 1: we want we have his handle, we want to share.

690
00:37:46,360 --> 00:37:51,759
Speaker 1: Give his handle. His handle is old Gus Montana. It's

691
00:37:51,800 --> 00:38:00,840
Speaker 1: even better, crotchety, old Gus Montana. Um. Yeah, he sounds

692
00:38:00,880 --> 00:38:07,520
Speaker 1: unhappy in general, very mad, very mad, Spencer feeling you're

693
00:38:07,560 --> 00:38:11,000
Speaker 1: feeling already little sad, maybe kind of sad. Yeah, I'm

694
00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:13,560
Speaker 1: disappointed to hear that he thinks it doesn't have any wisdom.

695
00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:16,120
Speaker 1: You should listen to this episode. Yeah, maybe we're changing that.

696
00:38:16,200 --> 00:38:19,320
Speaker 1: We just dropped all kinds of wisdom. I'm also glad

697
00:38:19,360 --> 00:38:21,920
Speaker 1: to hear him call you the skid mark, because then

698
00:38:21,960 --> 00:38:25,719
Speaker 1: I'm not the skid mark. Oh that's we all think

699
00:38:25,719 --> 00:38:28,200
Speaker 1: about this every day, like, all right, somebody's somebody's gotta

700
00:38:28,200 --> 00:38:32,520
Speaker 1: be a skid markid mark around here. Somebody, somebody's gotta

701
00:38:32,520 --> 00:38:34,000
Speaker 1: be the low man on the total point, you can't

702
00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:36,680
Speaker 1: have a team without a skid mark. You can't have

703
00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:42,080
Speaker 1: underwearver that a skid mark? Right right? Phil? Uh? Sure bad?

704
00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:45,120
Speaker 1: Write that down, Write that down, that'll be That'll be

705
00:38:45,160 --> 00:38:53,600
Speaker 1: the new THHC without a skid mark. Some Things considered.

706
00:38:53,600 --> 00:38:57,720
Speaker 1: Thanks Phil, really appreciate you stepping up. It was nice prosy,

707
00:38:58,120 --> 00:39:01,000
Speaker 1: I mean thoughtful. I'll give him that, Like he put

708
00:39:01,040 --> 00:39:03,520
Speaker 1: together a nice, nice string of words there. It was

709
00:39:03,560 --> 00:39:05,600
Speaker 1: clear that he had sat down, like he had listened

710
00:39:05,600 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 1: to an episode and then sat down and thought, because

711
00:39:07,680 --> 00:39:09,560
Speaker 1: that wasn't just like he didn't just fire that off.

712
00:39:09,640 --> 00:39:11,680
Speaker 1: He spent like an evening talking to his wife about that,

713
00:39:12,480 --> 00:39:15,520
Speaker 1: like to lick the tip of his panty. He spent

714
00:39:15,600 --> 00:39:18,439
Speaker 1: in the evening like, honey, I'll tell you what, listen

715
00:39:18,440 --> 00:39:21,919
Speaker 1: to this guy, this fairy guy, hipster man. I don't

716
00:39:21,920 --> 00:39:24,600
Speaker 1: know what he's doing, but you know, all feedback is

717
00:39:25,360 --> 00:39:28,480
Speaker 1: I appreciated here on Some things considered. How many episodes

718
00:39:28,480 --> 00:39:30,239
Speaker 1: do you think one has to listen to you to

719
00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:32,359
Speaker 1: then leave a review like that, because it doesn't seem

720
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:34,600
Speaker 1: like he used like dropped in on episode thirty one

721
00:39:35,239 --> 00:39:37,799
Speaker 1: and it's like here are my thoughts, don't know, like

722
00:39:37,920 --> 00:39:43,839
Speaker 1: he was deeply, deeply, something turned him. He was kind

723
00:39:43,880 --> 00:39:46,520
Speaker 1: of like it's an anti hero in a superhero movie.

724
00:39:46,560 --> 00:39:50,160
Speaker 1: He was good for a while and something turned him

725
00:39:50,400 --> 00:39:53,759
Speaker 1: to hatred. Maybe that's how he feels about you, because

726
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:56,759
Speaker 1: he was probably listening for weeks. Then you said one

727
00:39:56,840 --> 00:40:01,440
Speaker 1: thing that maybe you became the villain and his own story,

728
00:40:01,600 --> 00:40:05,799
Speaker 1: his own story, his daily life. What an effect if

729
00:40:05,840 --> 00:40:07,359
Speaker 1: you get to be bad enough, maybe you can just

730
00:40:07,400 --> 00:40:11,240
Speaker 1: people get people to hate. Listen how you yell sometimes

731
00:40:11,280 --> 00:40:14,480
Speaker 1: like on social media, hate follow people just because like

732
00:40:14,640 --> 00:40:16,920
Speaker 1: that's my favorite you enjoy Let's get to that conversation

733
00:40:17,000 --> 00:40:20,120
Speaker 1: is my favorite conversation. Where guys have like troll pages

734
00:40:20,120 --> 00:40:22,319
Speaker 1: on the internet and all they do is spend time

735
00:40:22,480 --> 00:40:24,960
Speaker 1: looking at things they hate and talking about them. I'm like,

736
00:40:25,000 --> 00:40:28,440
Speaker 1: that must be the worst. That must be the worst existence.

737
00:40:28,680 --> 00:40:31,520
Speaker 1: You really like, accelerate this podcast to what that guy

738
00:40:31,640 --> 00:40:34,400
Speaker 1: was talking about. You're gonna get some good hate downloads.

739
00:40:34,480 --> 00:40:37,799
Speaker 1: Do you guys hate follow? I don't know, I don't,

740
00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:41,000
Speaker 1: I don't Spencer Spencer does. He's the one. He's one

741
00:40:41,080 --> 00:40:43,680
Speaker 1: to set up. Now. I feel like it more naturally

742
00:40:43,760 --> 00:40:47,880
Speaker 1: happens on something like Facebook, where you still have a

743
00:40:47,920 --> 00:40:50,359
Speaker 1: lot of connections with like people you at school with,

744
00:40:50,719 --> 00:40:55,440
Speaker 1: or like family members that you now like have your

745
00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:58,799
Speaker 1: own political views and see that there's are are this way.

746
00:40:58,800 --> 00:41:01,440
Speaker 1: And now I'm just like looking forward to you if

747
00:41:01,440 --> 00:41:03,279
Speaker 1: I open up like Facebook and get to see what

748
00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:05,960
Speaker 1: they're posting or sharing. That's what it is for me,

749
00:41:06,000 --> 00:41:07,640
Speaker 1: where it would be so easy for me to just

750
00:41:07,719 --> 00:41:11,520
Speaker 1: click that unfollowed button. But there's something about I get

751
00:41:11,560 --> 00:41:17,360
Speaker 1: to silently judge these people. I hate fellow about two people,

752
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:19,879
Speaker 1: and I just I was just talking to my wife

753
00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:22,719
Speaker 1: about this the other day. I was like, I don't

754
00:41:22,719 --> 00:41:24,800
Speaker 1: know why I do it, Like I can can stop,

755
00:41:24,960 --> 00:41:30,319
Speaker 1: but I can't. Yeah, it's bad, it's unhealthy. Well let's

756
00:41:30,400 --> 00:41:32,919
Speaker 1: keep it healthy, everybody. And that's this is the world

757
00:41:32,920 --> 00:41:35,960
Speaker 1: we're living in. Some people like it. Some people have

758
00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:41,480
Speaker 1: deep seated hatred. You can't please everybody, No, no, what

759
00:41:41,520 --> 00:41:44,520
Speaker 1: do you? What do you always say? Johnnie? Keep smiling,

760
00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:48,319
Speaker 1: keep smiling, smile through it all, everybody. All right, now

761
00:41:48,320 --> 00:41:50,319
Speaker 1: we're gonna get you to We're gonna get you do

762
00:41:50,360 --> 00:41:55,320
Speaker 1: a fun conversation with Rachel van Voort. Enjoy that and

763
00:41:55,320 --> 00:41:57,880
Speaker 1: and try to get over this. If you didn't get

764
00:41:57,920 --> 00:42:01,400
Speaker 1: any wisdom here's she's gonna dropped some wizdemonia. I know

765
00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:03,359
Speaker 1: this is very emotional for everybody, but let's move on

766
00:42:04,200 --> 00:42:13,280
Speaker 1: to Rachel Enjoy. I guess may Ben, what's going on? Um,

767
00:42:13,320 --> 00:42:15,879
Speaker 1: just hanging out in Bozeman. Super pumped to finally make

768
00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:18,280
Speaker 1: it in here and hang out with you. You've invited

769
00:42:18,280 --> 00:42:20,680
Speaker 1: me months and months and yeah, I've been trying months ago.

770
00:42:20,960 --> 00:42:23,920
Speaker 1: You're the only guests that's been ducking me other than

771
00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:27,960
Speaker 1: all those guys at the n r A. No, not ducan.

772
00:42:28,080 --> 00:42:29,960
Speaker 1: But you know, Montana is a big state. There's a

773
00:42:29,960 --> 00:42:31,880
Speaker 1: lot of fun things to do. But I've got a

774
00:42:31,960 --> 00:42:34,680
Speaker 1: couple of hours. So do you have one of the

775
00:42:34,680 --> 00:42:39,680
Speaker 1: coolest jobs ever? I think that that could be appropriate. Yes.

776
00:42:39,719 --> 00:42:41,880
Speaker 1: When you first told me about this job, I thought

777
00:42:42,000 --> 00:42:44,840
Speaker 1: it maybe was a joke, and then you saw my

778
00:42:44,840 --> 00:42:46,480
Speaker 1: business card and we both were like, good was a

779
00:42:46,880 --> 00:42:51,960
Speaker 1: fancy for you? Is that a boss? Holy shit, that's

780
00:42:51,960 --> 00:42:55,719
Speaker 1: the governor's seal on that. Yeah, that was real nice. Um.

781
00:42:55,760 --> 00:43:00,040
Speaker 1: It's kind of like a government position. Are we to

782
00:43:00,120 --> 00:43:02,240
Speaker 1: be carefully to get us in trouble with the taxpayers,

783
00:43:02,280 --> 00:43:06,200
Speaker 1: but a government position where you have one time you

784
00:43:06,280 --> 00:43:09,319
Speaker 1: lived in a van, I lived in a camper by

785
00:43:09,320 --> 00:43:12,480
Speaker 1: a reservoir, which I think qualifies as similar to in

786
00:43:12,480 --> 00:43:14,400
Speaker 1: a van by a river because it used to be

787
00:43:14,440 --> 00:43:17,399
Speaker 1: a river and I just didn't have a van. It's

788
00:43:17,400 --> 00:43:19,640
Speaker 1: the same joke. Camper by a reservoir. Yeah, I camper

789
00:43:19,640 --> 00:43:21,239
Speaker 1: by a reservoir. Well, and that's how I started the

790
00:43:21,320 --> 00:43:22,680
Speaker 1: you know, the position up. I mean, I guess we

791
00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:27,919
Speaker 1: should say so I oh, yeah. So I'm the director

792
00:43:27,960 --> 00:43:31,280
Speaker 1: for the Montana Governor's Office about derecreation. I was appointed

793
00:43:31,280 --> 00:43:34,680
Speaker 1: by Governor Steve Bullock, who is currently governor UM in

794
00:43:34,760 --> 00:43:38,759
Speaker 1: two thousand, late two seventeen, and um, I travel all

795
00:43:38,760 --> 00:43:40,719
Speaker 1: over the state and so I am one of the

796
00:43:40,760 --> 00:43:42,880
Speaker 1: Governor's staff that does not live in Heleno, which is

797
00:43:42,880 --> 00:43:45,360
Speaker 1: where our state capital is, and but needed to be

798
00:43:45,400 --> 00:43:47,840
Speaker 1: there for the first you know, two months or so

799
00:43:47,920 --> 00:43:50,160
Speaker 1: of the job to kind of get the lay of

800
00:43:50,200 --> 00:43:52,640
Speaker 1: the land in the capital, life and all that kind

801
00:43:52,640 --> 00:43:55,640
Speaker 1: of stuff. And so, in an order to save money

802
00:43:55,680 --> 00:43:58,160
Speaker 1: and not spend money, I lived in my camper by

803
00:43:58,200 --> 00:44:02,719
Speaker 1: the reservoir. It's really funny too, because you know, coming

804
00:44:02,719 --> 00:44:04,880
Speaker 1: in it's a it's a it was a brand new office.

805
00:44:04,920 --> 00:44:07,000
Speaker 1: It's never existed. So as appointed by the governor to

806
00:44:07,040 --> 00:44:09,400
Speaker 1: create it and direct it, and so a lot of people,

807
00:44:09,680 --> 00:44:11,319
Speaker 1: you know, in and out of government are kind of like,

808
00:44:11,360 --> 00:44:14,880
Speaker 1: what is this? What are you doing? And actually the

809
00:44:14,920 --> 00:44:17,080
Speaker 1: amount of street crowd I probably got from saying well,

810
00:44:17,239 --> 00:44:20,200
Speaker 1: such and such and I'm living in my camper by

811
00:44:20,200 --> 00:44:23,840
Speaker 1: the reservoir. They're like, really, really, that's pretty that's pretty cool.

812
00:44:24,160 --> 00:44:28,920
Speaker 1: Do you have internet down there? No sales service? I

813
00:44:29,040 --> 00:44:31,080
Speaker 1: like it? Yeah. And I was reading on your website

814
00:44:31,080 --> 00:44:33,880
Speaker 1: there that of Montana and say out of recreation is

815
00:44:33,920 --> 00:44:36,399
Speaker 1: important to their quality of life. Yeah, that's what we are.

816
00:44:36,680 --> 00:44:39,400
Speaker 1: Outdorecreation is the way of life in Montana. It's in

817
00:44:39,480 --> 00:44:45,160
Speaker 1: a girl to every facet of everybody's um life. Good. Yeah, Well,

818
00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:47,239
Speaker 1: before we get to more of that, you're saying, you

819
00:44:47,280 --> 00:44:49,920
Speaker 1: have a we have a these microphones that fill the

820
00:44:49,960 --> 00:44:55,120
Speaker 1: engineer acquired and they are they have these like large studios.

821
00:44:55,160 --> 00:44:58,120
Speaker 1: Great you guys, thank you. It's it's wonderful. I've been

822
00:44:58,120 --> 00:45:01,040
Speaker 1: hearing you all talk about it and it's great. It's wonderful.

823
00:45:01,120 --> 00:45:05,440
Speaker 1: It's very fancy, kind of golden bossed headsets, pretty snazzy.

824
00:45:05,480 --> 00:45:07,319
Speaker 1: Feeling pretty good about it. Yeah, I like it. If

825
00:45:07,400 --> 00:45:09,239
Speaker 1: I like it, we're working on the decorations that we'll

826
00:45:09,280 --> 00:45:12,600
Speaker 1: be honest, it's been Rannella is not open to feedback.

827
00:45:12,719 --> 00:45:16,000
Speaker 1: I heard, yeah, but we're working on it. But you're not.

828
00:45:16,040 --> 00:45:18,360
Speaker 1: You don't like styrofoam or this is the what we

829
00:45:18,400 --> 00:45:22,240
Speaker 1: call us here, Phil, it's a windscreen. It's a specific

830
00:45:22,320 --> 00:45:24,920
Speaker 1: type of the windscreen, a windscreen foam, And you're not

831
00:45:25,040 --> 00:45:27,840
Speaker 1: you're not a big fan of that, um any um,

832
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:29,880
Speaker 1: so yeah, any sort of. And I was doing a

833
00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:34,560
Speaker 1: really good job ignoring it and just looking at you.

834
00:45:35,719 --> 00:45:38,800
Speaker 1: I don't, I know, it's really it's really gross, and

835
00:45:38,920 --> 00:45:41,400
Speaker 1: especially when people put like for podcasting and there's a

836
00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:44,160
Speaker 1: little mix you know that kind of like stick the

837
00:45:44,160 --> 00:45:47,000
Speaker 1: little foam thing right to your lips. You can't do it?

838
00:45:48,280 --> 00:45:50,600
Speaker 1: All right, Well, we have to take any breaks and

839
00:45:50,640 --> 00:45:53,400
Speaker 1: just like yeah, it's yell at the phone, tell it

840
00:45:53,480 --> 00:45:56,160
Speaker 1: to calm down. Everybody has a kryptonite though, right we do.

841
00:45:56,360 --> 00:46:00,320
Speaker 1: Mine is mine is very well, doctor yours? Is it peased? Peace?

842
00:46:00,440 --> 00:46:05,040
Speaker 1: It's peace? Yeah, equally as ridiculous. Somebody sent me in

843
00:46:05,080 --> 00:46:08,080
Speaker 1: the mail, I'd have to I looked up who it was.

844
00:46:08,120 --> 00:46:10,200
Speaker 1: Like there was a p air freshener, like a p

845
00:46:10,880 --> 00:46:13,239
Speaker 1: that somebody send me one of them. So thanks to

846
00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:14,880
Speaker 1: I can't remember the name of the person who sent up,

847
00:46:14,880 --> 00:46:17,759
Speaker 1: but thank you Dan. I'm going I need to get

848
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:21,799
Speaker 1: some of the hobbies. Air freshener. That's life, because it's

849
00:46:21,840 --> 00:46:24,960
Speaker 1: probably better than the opening the jar of hoppies everyone around.

850
00:46:26,080 --> 00:46:30,400
Speaker 1: Just rub it in on yourself, a little bit of perfume. Yeah,

851
00:46:31,360 --> 00:46:34,120
Speaker 1: anyway out the recreation. Ya. I was just telling you

852
00:46:34,160 --> 00:46:38,120
Speaker 1: before we hit recorded, I'm feeling a little bit whimsical.

853
00:46:38,680 --> 00:46:41,800
Speaker 1: Great if you will. Well, that's that's magical about the office,

854
00:46:41,800 --> 00:46:45,160
Speaker 1: about the recreation. It's all positive, it's fabulous, it's all

855
00:46:45,239 --> 00:46:48,680
Speaker 1: late and just it's awesome. Yeah. I've had a couple

856
00:46:48,719 --> 00:46:51,080
Speaker 1: of real I've had a couple of days of real

857
00:46:51,440 --> 00:46:55,960
Speaker 1: intense interaction around like intense subjects. So I was feeling like,

858
00:46:56,040 --> 00:46:58,440
Speaker 1: this will be nice to just talk about why we

859
00:46:58,520 --> 00:47:02,759
Speaker 1: love being outside. Yeah, and that makes me comfortable. It

860
00:47:02,760 --> 00:47:06,759
Speaker 1: calls me down, de stresses me. So you're you had

861
00:47:06,800 --> 00:47:09,680
Speaker 1: a job that no one else has ever had before. Correct,

862
00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:12,360
Speaker 1: you're living in a camp or down by the reservoir.

863
00:47:13,640 --> 00:47:15,279
Speaker 1: What are you saying this is a good choice or

864
00:47:15,320 --> 00:47:18,480
Speaker 1: were you scared for your life? No, it's a fantastic choice.

865
00:47:18,520 --> 00:47:21,400
Speaker 1: So I mean, I guess maybe I should give I

866
00:47:21,440 --> 00:47:23,239
Speaker 1: give a little context of kind of where I've come

867
00:47:23,280 --> 00:47:25,879
Speaker 1: from place and what I've done. You and I have

868
00:47:25,920 --> 00:47:28,000
Speaker 1: had the opportunity to each other for gosh five six

869
00:47:28,080 --> 00:47:31,160
Speaker 1: years now thanks to my previous job. Um. So, I'm

870
00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:34,919
Speaker 1: from Montana, I grew up here. Um most people say

871
00:47:34,920 --> 00:47:36,920
Speaker 1: I'm a little bit rabid about being a Montana and

872
00:47:37,800 --> 00:47:40,279
Speaker 1: I've been told I'm embedded like a tick. Those are

873
00:47:40,280 --> 00:47:43,920
Speaker 1: all accurate things to say about me, are Um So,

874
00:47:44,080 --> 00:47:46,719
Speaker 1: I you know, I graduated from the University Montana, had

875
00:47:46,719 --> 00:47:50,319
Speaker 1: a degree and resource conservation watership management fisheries. And they

876
00:47:50,360 --> 00:47:52,480
Speaker 1: told me, hey, you know, you you got some jobs

877
00:47:52,480 --> 00:47:54,759
Speaker 1: in Oklahoma, Nebraska in those places open, you should go

878
00:47:54,840 --> 00:47:56,919
Speaker 1: take those. And it was like, oh no, no, I'm

879
00:47:56,920 --> 00:48:00,040
Speaker 1: not leaving Montana. UM and so at that point, and

880
00:48:00,160 --> 00:48:02,120
Speaker 1: it was just you know, you you get your degree.

881
00:48:02,160 --> 00:48:04,840
Speaker 1: And I've chalked my degree up to an over educated

882
00:48:04,880 --> 00:48:08,480
Speaker 1: fly fishing degree, like that's kind of way. I was

883
00:48:08,480 --> 00:48:09,840
Speaker 1: thinking about going back to college and get one of

884
00:48:09,880 --> 00:48:12,120
Speaker 1: those myself. Yeah, just an over educated fly fisherman is

885
00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:14,520
Speaker 1: really what it is. I know that I can't catch

886
00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:16,200
Speaker 1: the fish, and I know why And I know I'm failing,

887
00:48:16,360 --> 00:48:19,320
Speaker 1: and so I guess that I have peace with that. UM.

888
00:48:19,360 --> 00:48:22,680
Speaker 1: But yeah, and UH stayed in Montana and UM had

889
00:48:22,680 --> 00:48:25,280
Speaker 1: a stint in the organic produce industry. I was actually

890
00:48:25,280 --> 00:48:28,360
Speaker 1: brokering organic produce on the national market, you know, field

891
00:48:28,400 --> 00:48:32,880
Speaker 1: to table ish style UM, which was a very interesting,

892
00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:36,960
Speaker 1: interesting job right out of college. Vegetable broker. Yeah, organic

893
00:48:37,000 --> 00:48:40,480
Speaker 1: produce and all over North America, UM, some in South America.

894
00:48:40,600 --> 00:48:43,960
Speaker 1: Imports exports, really really interesting UM. And it's a small

895
00:48:44,040 --> 00:48:45,800
Speaker 1: little company and but it was all based out of

896
00:48:45,800 --> 00:48:48,120
Speaker 1: white Fish. So I was back there doing that. But

897
00:48:48,160 --> 00:48:50,240
Speaker 1: then someone knocked on my door and they were like, hey,

898
00:48:50,320 --> 00:48:53,839
Speaker 1: and I'm more talking. I'm twenty twenty four, I guess

899
00:48:53,800 --> 00:48:56,440
Speaker 1: twenty four at the time. Like, hey, we heard you're

900
00:48:56,440 --> 00:49:00,279
Speaker 1: really good at sales and marketing, and we of a

901
00:49:00,440 --> 00:49:03,640
Speaker 1: job as a regional sales manager for big mountain ski

902
00:49:03,680 --> 00:49:06,360
Speaker 1: resort and it would be your job to kind of

903
00:49:06,400 --> 00:49:10,919
Speaker 1: travel all over sell the mountain, party, eat ski and

904
00:49:11,000 --> 00:49:13,399
Speaker 1: once and you have a ski and skied office. So

905
00:49:13,840 --> 00:49:17,480
Speaker 1: I think I could do that. And uh. So it

906
00:49:17,520 --> 00:49:18,960
Speaker 1: was in the ski industry for a while and then

907
00:49:19,400 --> 00:49:21,600
Speaker 1: UM had a couple of kids, did some kind of

908
00:49:21,640 --> 00:49:24,640
Speaker 1: special project work sales and marketing for an adventure rafting

909
00:49:24,680 --> 00:49:27,560
Speaker 1: fly fishing company, and then you know, decided to go

910
00:49:27,600 --> 00:49:30,000
Speaker 1: back to work full time. And I, um have always

911
00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:32,840
Speaker 1: grown up hunting. I've always hunted as a competitive rifle shooter.

912
00:49:33,360 --> 00:49:35,920
Speaker 1: And so I was actually with my family drinking probably

913
00:49:35,920 --> 00:49:38,400
Speaker 1: too much beer at a Rocky Mount Elk Foundation banquet

914
00:49:38,400 --> 00:49:39,680
Speaker 1: and turned around and I saw all the guys that

915
00:49:39,719 --> 00:49:41,960
Speaker 1: worked for Kimber, because Kimber is actually the sales and

916
00:49:42,000 --> 00:49:44,919
Speaker 1: marketing customer service and a lot of that's located in

917
00:49:45,000 --> 00:49:47,640
Speaker 1: Montana here. So I turned around and I was like, Oh,

918
00:49:47,680 --> 00:49:50,280
Speaker 1: there's you know guys. I was like, oh wait, guns.

919
00:49:51,040 --> 00:49:56,040
Speaker 1: It's like I could sell guns. That's amazing. And so

920
00:49:56,160 --> 00:49:58,520
Speaker 1: one thing led to another, and I spent almost eight

921
00:49:58,600 --> 00:50:01,840
Speaker 1: years with Kimber, first in sales and then ending up

922
00:50:01,840 --> 00:50:04,279
Speaker 1: at trade relations management UM doing a lot of the

923
00:50:04,320 --> 00:50:05,960
Speaker 1: marketing and all that stuff, which is where we got

924
00:50:05,960 --> 00:50:09,279
Speaker 1: to me. Absolutely, I think you're still programmed into my phone,

925
00:50:09,320 --> 00:50:12,360
Speaker 1: ben On ranguing, I think you think I programmed it

926
00:50:12,360 --> 00:50:16,240
Speaker 1: in at the bar and hold on, hold on a minute,

927
00:50:16,440 --> 00:50:18,600
Speaker 1: let me show you how you're in my phone. And

928
00:50:18,640 --> 00:50:21,520
Speaker 1: I've believe it this way because I don't change your either.

929
00:50:22,360 --> 00:50:26,279
Speaker 1: We was our numbers in the phone. Look what you

930
00:50:26,320 --> 00:50:33,640
Speaker 1: are totally spelled Rachel Kimber's how she's in my phone.

931
00:50:33,640 --> 00:50:36,440
Speaker 1: But Rachel has spelled r A H E A L,

932
00:50:37,200 --> 00:50:40,000
Speaker 1: which is that's not even not even anywhere close. And

933
00:50:40,040 --> 00:50:41,480
Speaker 1: that's been in there for many, many years. I just

934
00:50:41,520 --> 00:50:44,560
Speaker 1: never changed sides. It's like it works, It totally works.

935
00:50:44,640 --> 00:50:49,359
Speaker 1: Its yeah. Yeah, it's just this super broad, ridiculous kind

936
00:50:49,360 --> 00:50:51,200
Speaker 1: of background that you kind of can't make up and

937
00:50:51,440 --> 00:50:54,799
Speaker 1: just one path leads to another. And it was you know,

938
00:50:54,840 --> 00:50:57,240
Speaker 1: I was still working for Kimber and you know, honestly,

939
00:50:57,239 --> 00:51:01,280
Speaker 1: I mean just the most great company, great and awesome products,

940
00:51:01,400 --> 00:51:04,080
Speaker 1: and really had I mean kind of what I consider

941
00:51:04,160 --> 00:51:07,719
Speaker 1: like the unicorn amazing job in the industry because it

942
00:51:07,760 --> 00:51:12,400
Speaker 1: was the opportunity to just talk about brand, talk about content,

943
00:51:13,000 --> 00:51:16,200
Speaker 1: um work with media, work with all that kind of stuff,

944
00:51:16,239 --> 00:51:19,160
Speaker 1: and we got to travel the world like shooting and hunting,

945
00:51:19,239 --> 00:51:22,560
Speaker 1: and it was really fantastic and UM loved, love, love

946
00:51:22,640 --> 00:51:24,880
Speaker 1: the job, still love all those people. But you know,

947
00:51:24,880 --> 00:51:27,440
Speaker 1: I opened the paper one day and in Montana and

948
00:51:27,960 --> 00:51:30,400
Speaker 1: Governor Bullock was running for re election and we're super

949
00:51:30,440 --> 00:51:33,000
Speaker 1: fortunate to have a governor that's I mean, passionate to

950
00:51:33,040 --> 00:51:37,760
Speaker 1: the core about public lands and access an opportunity. And

951
00:51:37,840 --> 00:51:40,920
Speaker 1: so he when he was running for reelection um create

952
00:51:40,960 --> 00:51:43,080
Speaker 1: he was going to create the Office about Derecreation, and

953
00:51:43,120 --> 00:51:46,080
Speaker 1: at the time, Montana was the fourth state to create

954
00:51:46,080 --> 00:51:48,799
Speaker 1: an office about derecreation. So I literally was just looking

955
00:51:48,800 --> 00:51:50,319
Speaker 1: at the paper and I was like, I don't even

956
00:51:50,360 --> 00:51:52,880
Speaker 1: know what that means. I don't even know what is

957
00:51:52,920 --> 00:51:55,000
Speaker 1: an office about director. I don't even know what it means.

958
00:51:55,000 --> 00:51:58,160
Speaker 1: But that sounds amazing, right, I don't get excited. I wasn't,

959
00:51:58,200 --> 00:52:00,360
Speaker 1: you know, not really into politics and not really into government.

960
00:52:00,560 --> 00:52:03,200
Speaker 1: I you know, it's just not it's in my world.

961
00:52:03,239 --> 00:52:05,000
Speaker 1: But I just kind of sat out loud, like this

962
00:52:05,040 --> 00:52:06,880
Speaker 1: is something that's amazing. I don't know what it means,

963
00:52:06,920 --> 00:52:08,839
Speaker 1: but I feel like I could probably do something like that.

964
00:52:09,239 --> 00:52:12,160
Speaker 1: And just literally just all of a sudden, six months

965
00:52:12,360 --> 00:52:14,799
Speaker 1: past and I find out that my name had been

966
00:52:14,800 --> 00:52:18,600
Speaker 1: thrown in for that. Everybody that knows you, it's there's

967
00:52:18,600 --> 00:52:22,680
Speaker 1: no this isn't serendipity. Like your personality, like people love

968
00:52:22,719 --> 00:52:26,520
Speaker 1: you and you're outgoing and you can sell water to fish,

969
00:52:26,560 --> 00:52:29,240
Speaker 1: I believe, But that's not because you're a salesman, because

970
00:52:29,239 --> 00:52:32,920
Speaker 1: you're passionate and you choose things that you're passionate about. Well,

971
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:34,600
Speaker 1: that's the thing that is everybody said, Oh, you're a

972
00:52:34,640 --> 00:52:37,920
Speaker 1: really great salesperson. No, I'm a great educator because if

973
00:52:37,960 --> 00:52:41,239
Speaker 1: you're not selling lemons, you're not selling bad things. You're

974
00:52:41,280 --> 00:52:45,440
Speaker 1: literally educating people about amazing, amazing things. And if you

975
00:52:45,480 --> 00:52:48,800
Speaker 1: can articulate and educate people about these amazing things that

976
00:52:48,800 --> 00:52:51,799
Speaker 1: you're very passionate about, that's you know, that's where that

977
00:52:51,840 --> 00:52:55,480
Speaker 1: comes across. Yeah, before we get into the full outdoor

978
00:52:55,560 --> 00:52:59,359
Speaker 1: wreck conversation, I think we should cover off on the

979
00:52:59,400 --> 00:53:04,279
Speaker 1: dichotomy of like promoting a place and then loving a

980
00:53:04,320 --> 00:53:07,040
Speaker 1: place to death. Like, what's You've got to be thinking

981
00:53:07,080 --> 00:53:09,440
Speaker 1: about that in your job all the time every day,

982
00:53:10,120 --> 00:53:11,840
Speaker 1: So what's how do you explain that to people And

983
00:53:11,880 --> 00:53:13,960
Speaker 1: they're like, Okay, your job is to promote this this

984
00:53:14,200 --> 00:53:18,720
Speaker 1: giant economy, seven point one billion dollar thing that's happening.

985
00:53:20,320 --> 00:53:22,880
Speaker 1: How do we preserve we don't? You know, Colorado, I

986
00:53:23,239 --> 00:53:25,200
Speaker 1: feel like some stories I've heard from that state, they're

987
00:53:25,239 --> 00:53:30,160
Speaker 1: loving their rivers and there, you know, their mountains to death.

988
00:53:30,200 --> 00:53:32,960
Speaker 1: In a lot of ways, So I hate the I

989
00:53:33,000 --> 00:53:36,000
Speaker 1: don't like the phrase loving something to death because I

990
00:53:36,040 --> 00:53:37,879
Speaker 1: think if you're loving something to death, and that means

991
00:53:37,880 --> 00:53:41,480
Speaker 1: you are fully invested and you're investing all the resources

992
00:53:41,560 --> 00:53:45,160
Speaker 1: you have to take care of it while you're you're

993
00:53:45,239 --> 00:53:49,319
Speaker 1: using it. And I don't see nearly that kind of

994
00:53:49,360 --> 00:53:52,960
Speaker 1: support and love for these natural resources that we're recreating on.

995
00:53:53,280 --> 00:53:54,880
Speaker 1: So once we get to the point where like we

996
00:53:54,960 --> 00:53:57,280
Speaker 1: can't take care of it any better, we can't invest

997
00:53:57,360 --> 00:53:59,600
Speaker 1: any more money in it, we can't do those things,

998
00:54:00,040 --> 00:54:04,120
Speaker 1: then maybe I'll accept that. Um. But UM, yeah, it's

999
00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:08,640
Speaker 1: for sure. So UM the outdoor Office of Outdorecreation. So

1000
00:54:08,640 --> 00:54:11,160
Speaker 1: I'm housed in the Office of Economic Development for the governor.

1001
00:54:11,600 --> 00:54:14,399
Speaker 1: And so oftentimes, especially in the state like Montana, where

1002
00:54:14,440 --> 00:54:16,239
Speaker 1: people love to come here and they like to visit

1003
00:54:16,239 --> 00:54:18,080
Speaker 1: and they like to recreate in a lot, ten percent

1004
00:54:18,200 --> 00:54:22,640
Speaker 1: Montana jobs are based in outdorecreation. Um, we're not just

1005
00:54:22,800 --> 00:54:26,480
Speaker 1: talking about tourism. We're not just talking about UM service

1006
00:54:26,520 --> 00:54:30,319
Speaker 1: related industries. We're talking about that core industry, which meat

1007
00:54:30,360 --> 00:54:33,240
Speaker 1: eater and Bozeman would be a core segment of that industry.

1008
00:54:33,680 --> 00:54:37,200
Speaker 1: And so it's this this industry, the core industry whether

1009
00:54:37,239 --> 00:54:43,600
Speaker 1: it be manufacturers, UM, retailers, guides and outfitters, media surrounding it.

1010
00:54:43,640 --> 00:54:45,839
Speaker 1: Obviously that's kind of core industry. And then you have

1011
00:54:45,920 --> 00:54:50,759
Speaker 1: that peripheral economy around it that is related to tourism, recreation,

1012
00:54:50,840 --> 00:54:54,200
Speaker 1: service based, you know items. So you've got the industry itself,

1013
00:54:54,200 --> 00:54:57,920
Speaker 1: and then you've got the economy around it. And so oftentimes,

1014
00:54:58,040 --> 00:55:00,399
Speaker 1: especially in Montana, you know, office about direcreation is very

1015
00:55:00,400 --> 00:55:03,560
Speaker 1: new and people really are like, oh, just more tourism,

1016
00:55:03,600 --> 00:55:06,920
Speaker 1: more tourism, more tourism. Well it's like, okay, well, resident

1017
00:55:06,920 --> 00:55:09,400
Speaker 1: and nonresident tourism and visitation is a good thing, and

1018
00:55:09,400 --> 00:55:11,040
Speaker 1: it's a huge part of our economy. But that's not

1019
00:55:11,160 --> 00:55:14,200
Speaker 1: just what this is about. That is a piece of

1020
00:55:14,239 --> 00:55:19,040
Speaker 1: what is our ourdorecreation economy. UM. So to help people

1021
00:55:19,120 --> 00:55:22,280
Speaker 1: kind of understand, and it's not a perfect um parallel,

1022
00:55:22,320 --> 00:55:25,640
Speaker 1: it's not a perfect you know illustration to show, but gosh,

1023
00:55:25,680 --> 00:55:28,160
Speaker 1: like hundred years ago, you know, maybe in Montana or

1024
00:55:28,200 --> 00:55:30,920
Speaker 1: other places or so, we all decided that agriculture was

1025
00:55:30,960 --> 00:55:34,360
Speaker 1: a really really important of our part part of our economy,

1026
00:55:34,520 --> 00:55:37,400
Speaker 1: and um it's still a really part important part of

1027
00:55:37,400 --> 00:55:40,399
Speaker 1: our economy. And so back then we developed what's called

1028
00:55:40,440 --> 00:55:43,880
Speaker 1: the Department of Agriculture in Montana and in other states

1029
00:55:44,200 --> 00:55:46,680
Speaker 1: there's Department of Livestock. There's all these different segments and

1030
00:55:47,400 --> 00:55:49,879
Speaker 1: what they're designed to do, and what the Office about

1031
00:55:49,880 --> 00:55:52,440
Speaker 1: Direct is designed to do is you look at everything

1032
00:55:52,480 --> 00:55:55,640
Speaker 1: that everyone is doing, whether it's state, federal, private, you

1033
00:55:55,760 --> 00:55:59,040
Speaker 1: name it. You look at everything from that foot level,

1034
00:55:59,560 --> 00:56:02,640
Speaker 1: oh through the lens of outdorecreation and how it affects

1035
00:56:02,640 --> 00:56:05,080
Speaker 1: and impacts. So we can make sure we know where

1036
00:56:05,120 --> 00:56:07,279
Speaker 1: things are going off the rail, where things are going well,

1037
00:56:07,280 --> 00:56:09,440
Speaker 1: and we can do more of So it's just, uh,

1038
00:56:09,640 --> 00:56:13,040
Speaker 1: it's making sure that we're just looking at that specifically.

1039
00:56:13,080 --> 00:56:15,239
Speaker 1: So it's not just the Office of Tourism, which often

1040
00:56:15,239 --> 00:56:19,680
Speaker 1: people get confused with. I'm not just out promoting the state. UM.

1041
00:56:19,719 --> 00:56:21,920
Speaker 1: In that way, we have an Office of Tourism and

1042
00:56:21,960 --> 00:56:23,920
Speaker 1: that is their sole purpose, which they're doing a great

1043
00:56:24,000 --> 00:56:26,239
Speaker 1: job of. UM. But you know, there are some of

1044
00:56:26,239 --> 00:56:28,920
Speaker 1: the people that I'm working with. But it's thinking about, Okay,

1045
00:56:28,920 --> 00:56:31,920
Speaker 1: how is the off of Office of Tourism collaborating with

1046
00:56:32,000 --> 00:56:35,880
Speaker 1: safe fish well life and parks on something? UM? You know,

1047
00:56:35,960 --> 00:56:38,960
Speaker 1: how can the Office of Tourism help fish well life

1048
00:56:39,000 --> 00:56:41,560
Speaker 1: and parks and other land management agencies, promote leave no

1049
00:56:41,640 --> 00:56:45,359
Speaker 1: trace ethics, promote responsible use of resources. Right, so those

1050
00:56:45,400 --> 00:56:48,200
Speaker 1: are just really small little things, you know, like how

1051
00:56:48,239 --> 00:56:51,000
Speaker 1: are we doing it? Can we do it better? So

1052
00:56:51,239 --> 00:56:54,359
Speaker 1: it's it's a much more it's a bigger picture. And

1053
00:56:54,400 --> 00:56:56,440
Speaker 1: so specifically when you talk about like loving it to

1054
00:56:56,480 --> 00:56:59,560
Speaker 1: death and having more people and how do you balance that,

1055
00:56:59,760 --> 00:57:04,440
Speaker 1: this is we are now setting the stage and making

1056
00:57:04,520 --> 00:57:09,120
Speaker 1: space and priority for conversations like that in a much

1057
00:57:09,200 --> 00:57:14,440
Speaker 1: more um substantial, substantial way um than we have. And

1058
00:57:14,480 --> 00:57:17,480
Speaker 1: so that's it's just elevating the conversation, having you know,

1059
00:57:17,520 --> 00:57:20,680
Speaker 1: broader conversations about it. Yeah, and I think that's you know,

1060
00:57:21,880 --> 00:57:24,560
Speaker 1: one thing that we always get from being Bosman based

1061
00:57:24,600 --> 00:57:27,600
Speaker 1: and being talking every week about things is you promote

1062
00:57:27,680 --> 00:57:31,520
Speaker 1: you're saying too many nice things about Montana O'Brien, like,

1063
00:57:31,600 --> 00:57:33,919
Speaker 1: calm it down, let's get out of when I first

1064
00:57:33,920 --> 00:57:39,640
Speaker 1: moved to get out of Montana, like I just I'm no, Um,

1065
00:57:39,800 --> 00:57:42,480
Speaker 1: how much do you deal with that? If any? Oh? Well,

1066
00:57:42,600 --> 00:57:45,440
Speaker 1: so for sure, I mean people struggle in Montana is amazing,

1067
00:57:45,600 --> 00:57:49,120
Speaker 1: Like what so we have more people, you know there

1068
00:57:49,160 --> 00:57:51,960
Speaker 1: there are worse things to have than a lot of

1069
00:57:52,000 --> 00:57:55,840
Speaker 1: people who love your space and your place as much

1070
00:57:55,840 --> 00:58:00,160
Speaker 1: as you do. There are worse problems to have, and um,

1071
00:58:00,200 --> 00:58:03,160
Speaker 1: the opposite of that is actually worst case scenario. And

1072
00:58:03,200 --> 00:58:06,080
Speaker 1: so in my mind, I was born here, fifth generation

1073
00:58:06,160 --> 00:58:10,080
Speaker 1: on one side in Montana, and being a Montana is

1074
00:58:10,120 --> 00:58:14,280
Speaker 1: not a time frame. It's a state of mind, and

1075
00:58:14,400 --> 00:58:16,080
Speaker 1: it's you know, how do you love and care for

1076
00:58:16,120 --> 00:58:18,240
Speaker 1: the space, um, and how do you want to be

1077
00:58:18,280 --> 00:58:20,640
Speaker 1: a part of it? Um. So yeah, you do run

1078
00:58:20,640 --> 00:58:22,680
Speaker 1: into that all the time, but understanding you know that

1079
00:58:22,760 --> 00:58:24,480
Speaker 1: is one of the number one things that you know.

1080
00:58:24,680 --> 00:58:27,560
Speaker 1: I spent last summer I partnered with a Montana brewis

1081
00:58:27,600 --> 00:58:30,440
Speaker 1: association and we made I think five or six stops

1082
00:58:30,480 --> 00:58:34,880
Speaker 1: around the state and just had kind of open let's

1083
00:58:35,760 --> 00:58:41,040
Speaker 1: nothing together than breweries and recreation, let's be clear, um.

1084
00:58:41,080 --> 00:58:42,880
Speaker 1: And so the number one thing that you know, most

1085
00:58:42,920 --> 00:58:45,919
Speaker 1: Montana's are saying like, oh my gosh, like we want

1086
00:58:46,000 --> 00:58:49,960
Speaker 1: to make sure that we don't lose what we have said. Great,

1087
00:58:50,160 --> 00:58:51,919
Speaker 1: you know how amazing it is that we are having

1088
00:58:51,920 --> 00:58:55,360
Speaker 1: this conversation right now, that we can be proactive, that

1089
00:58:55,480 --> 00:58:59,680
Speaker 1: we can learn from other spaces and places and times, um,

1090
00:58:59,680 --> 00:59:03,919
Speaker 1: that we can be thoughtful and moving forward because you know, no,

1091
00:59:04,440 --> 00:59:06,960
Speaker 1: I hate to break to everybody in Montana is amazing

1092
00:59:07,480 --> 00:59:10,440
Speaker 1: and people are moving here, and outdoor recreation is corded

1093
00:59:10,520 --> 00:59:12,640
Speaker 1: to our way of life here. As you know when

1094
00:59:12,640 --> 00:59:14,640
Speaker 1: you mentioned in the beginning is you know other people

1095
00:59:14,680 --> 00:59:17,440
Speaker 1: have mentioned, studies have mentioned, UM, it's our way of

1096
00:59:17,480 --> 00:59:20,720
Speaker 1: life and whether it's contributing to just our enjoyment and

1097
00:59:20,720 --> 00:59:23,760
Speaker 1: well being. So it's um the amenities that we want

1098
00:59:23,880 --> 00:59:26,960
Speaker 1: to live. UM, it's contributing to our health and wellness

1099
00:59:27,120 --> 00:59:30,120
Speaker 1: as individuals and communities. UM. And then as far as

1100
00:59:30,160 --> 00:59:33,960
Speaker 1: business goes, our recreation opportunities can't be manufactured like they

1101
00:59:34,000 --> 00:59:37,320
Speaker 1: are here and that's it's not a it's not a Disneyland.

1102
00:59:37,400 --> 00:59:40,640
Speaker 1: And so we have what businesses are looking for. We

1103
00:59:40,760 --> 00:59:42,440
Speaker 1: have what companies are looking for, and not just in

1104
00:59:42,480 --> 00:59:45,040
Speaker 1: the outdoor recreation space. A lot of tech firms want

1105
00:59:45,040 --> 00:59:47,440
Speaker 1: to relocate to Montana because we have the way of

1106
00:59:47,480 --> 00:59:50,480
Speaker 1: life that their employees want. It helps them with job retention,

1107
00:59:50,560 --> 00:59:56,640
Speaker 1: employee tension retention, and so yeah, it's it's it's great.

1108
00:59:56,720 --> 00:59:59,680
Speaker 1: And so we need to do incorporating that stewardship and

1109
00:59:59,720 --> 01:00:05,960
Speaker 1: concert ovation you know concept in with UM outdore Recreation

1110
01:00:06,000 --> 01:00:08,520
Speaker 1: economy and the nuts symbol, it's about it, and that's

1111
01:00:08,520 --> 01:00:10,840
Speaker 1: where it is. It's we're talking about this economy in

1112
01:00:10,840 --> 01:00:12,680
Speaker 1: a different space. It's not just a bunch of people

1113
01:00:12,720 --> 01:00:16,600
Speaker 1: running around hugging trees. Um, we're talking two point two

1114
01:00:17,200 --> 01:00:21,080
Speaker 1: of g d P as calculated by the US government.

1115
01:00:21,360 --> 01:00:24,400
Speaker 1: We're talking about nine almost nine hundred billion dollars in

1116
01:00:24,400 --> 01:00:27,560
Speaker 1: consumer spending across the United States. That's twice as much

1117
01:00:27,600 --> 01:00:30,440
Speaker 1: as the US pharmaceutical market is just in outdoor recreation.

1118
01:00:31,000 --> 01:00:33,560
Speaker 1: And so if we're going to be talking about, you know,

1119
01:00:34,440 --> 01:00:39,000
Speaker 1: our sector of the economy like everyone else, whether it's jobs, taxation, dollars,

1120
01:00:39,000 --> 01:00:41,960
Speaker 1: since we talk about I also say, hey, you know,

1121
01:00:42,080 --> 01:00:44,440
Speaker 1: key to every segment of the economy is the infrastructure

1122
01:00:44,440 --> 01:00:48,120
Speaker 1: that supports it. And what's that kind of unique infrastructure

1123
01:00:48,120 --> 01:00:51,600
Speaker 1: that supports us. It's our spaces, it's our it's our

1124
01:00:51,600 --> 01:00:55,320
Speaker 1: recreation opportunities. And it's not just the trails and the

1125
01:00:55,360 --> 01:01:00,320
Speaker 1: trailheads and the campgrounds. It's habitat, it's view sheds, it's

1126
01:01:00,360 --> 01:01:03,880
Speaker 1: open spaces, and so that is part of the infrastructure

1127
01:01:03,920 --> 01:01:07,200
Speaker 1: that is two point two percent of our GDP. So

1128
01:01:07,920 --> 01:01:11,080
Speaker 1: that's where it's like, Okay, it's not just doing the

1129
01:01:11,160 --> 01:01:14,080
Speaker 1: right thing, because it is doing the right but it's

1130
01:01:14,120 --> 01:01:16,520
Speaker 1: doing the right thing for our well being of our economy.

1131
01:01:16,880 --> 01:01:20,720
Speaker 1: So that's where we're trying to add and make a broader,

1132
01:01:21,080 --> 01:01:23,280
Speaker 1: you know, picture for our conversation. Yeah, and I think

1133
01:01:23,280 --> 01:01:25,479
Speaker 1: that's there's a bunch to unpack there. I was thinking

1134
01:01:25,600 --> 01:01:28,680
Speaker 1: lots of questions while you're talking. Um one of the

1135
01:01:28,680 --> 01:01:36,280
Speaker 1: main questions, Well, I was just like thinking, that's like, Um,

1136
01:01:36,320 --> 01:01:38,080
Speaker 1: the first one is I saw this one. I was

1137
01:01:38,120 --> 01:01:40,840
Speaker 1: living in Austin too, Like you said, these tech companies

1138
01:01:40,880 --> 01:01:44,000
Speaker 1: moved into Austin, and there was a stat I read

1139
01:01:44,000 --> 01:01:46,040
Speaker 1: when I lived there that a hundred Californians a day

1140
01:01:46,040 --> 01:01:48,880
Speaker 1: we're moving to Austin at some point in time. I

1141
01:01:48,960 --> 01:01:53,160
Speaker 1: may have butchered that stat, but something in that realm,

1142
01:01:53,680 --> 01:01:55,760
Speaker 1: same thing here. I mean, we've hired some some positions

1143
01:01:55,760 --> 01:01:57,960
Speaker 1: of this company. I've talked to a lot of businesses

1144
01:01:58,000 --> 01:02:00,320
Speaker 1: locally that it's not hard to get people to to

1145
01:02:00,920 --> 01:02:04,560
Speaker 1: locate relocate here from l A specifically or New York,

1146
01:02:04,720 --> 01:02:07,160
Speaker 1: but a lot, I mean a lot of it's Los Angeles.

1147
01:02:07,520 --> 01:02:09,760
Speaker 1: And so how do you feel like we're just talking

1148
01:02:09,800 --> 01:02:12,920
Speaker 1: about you watch Yellowstone, I watch Yellowstone. And there's a

1149
01:02:13,040 --> 01:02:16,240
Speaker 1: thing where in the show Yellowstone, like the one of

1150
01:02:16,240 --> 01:02:18,120
Speaker 1: the guys was sitting on the bench with his son

1151
01:02:18,200 --> 01:02:20,919
Speaker 1: in the first season, and what were they were talking about,

1152
01:02:20,920 --> 01:02:22,640
Speaker 1: like alt of towners. What is the term they used?

1153
01:02:22,680 --> 01:02:27,320
Speaker 1: Remember this scene? Am I totally missing it? Transplants? He's like, Daddy,

1154
01:02:27,360 --> 01:02:30,680
Speaker 1: what's a transplant? He's like, Son, that's when somebody moves

1155
01:02:30,760 --> 01:02:32,680
Speaker 1: your town that tries to make it like where they

1156
01:02:32,720 --> 01:02:37,760
Speaker 1: came from. And I was like, Okay, it's a good definition. Um,

1157
01:02:37,800 --> 01:02:40,120
Speaker 1: how do you see that change in this economy? Because

1158
01:02:40,120 --> 01:02:42,760
Speaker 1: it is I mean, it's real. It's because this place

1159
01:02:42,840 --> 01:02:45,720
Speaker 1: is attractive, because it's lifestyle is attractive because it's a

1160
01:02:45,720 --> 01:02:48,600
Speaker 1: wide open spaces and big sky is attractive to people.

1161
01:02:49,000 --> 01:02:51,840
Speaker 1: It has this I'm sure there's a fear of that

1162
01:02:51,840 --> 01:02:53,360
Speaker 1: it's going to change the culture, but it is going

1163
01:02:53,400 --> 01:02:56,800
Speaker 1: to change the culture just because of the influx of

1164
01:02:56,800 --> 01:02:58,600
Speaker 1: people that aren't from here. Then there's no such thing

1165
01:02:58,640 --> 01:03:02,560
Speaker 1: as no change period. End of story. And you know,

1166
01:03:02,640 --> 01:03:05,800
Speaker 1: people ask me, I live in Whitefish, that's in the

1167
01:03:05,840 --> 01:03:09,120
Speaker 1: northwest corner of the state, and my parents were born

1168
01:03:09,160 --> 01:03:11,160
Speaker 1: there and my grandparents were born there on one side,

1169
01:03:11,520 --> 01:03:14,840
Speaker 1: so that's I mean, that's kind of you know, turn

1170
01:03:14,880 --> 01:03:17,480
Speaker 1: of the century when the railroads were coming through, and

1171
01:03:17,520 --> 01:03:22,760
Speaker 1: so for people you know all the time, Um, I was,

1172
01:03:23,200 --> 01:03:25,920
Speaker 1: I should say I was. I am very well traveled.

1173
01:03:26,240 --> 01:03:28,800
Speaker 1: I have traveled my entire life for work in and

1174
01:03:28,800 --> 01:03:30,840
Speaker 1: out of the country. And every time I get off

1175
01:03:30,840 --> 01:03:33,480
Speaker 1: the plane in Montana, I take a deep breath and

1176
01:03:33,840 --> 01:03:35,800
Speaker 1: know that, Yep, I live in the best place on

1177
01:03:35,800 --> 01:03:38,880
Speaker 1: the planet. And so people that find out that I'm

1178
01:03:38,920 --> 01:03:41,440
Speaker 1: from Whitefish and I still live in Whitefish and I

1179
01:03:41,520 --> 01:03:44,800
Speaker 1: have seen the changes, are like, oh, man, I bet you,

1180
01:03:45,000 --> 01:03:48,720
Speaker 1: I bet you can't stand seeing those changes. And I

1181
01:03:48,760 --> 01:03:50,440
Speaker 1: actually look at them and I say, no, no, no,

1182
01:03:50,840 --> 01:03:53,560
Speaker 1: because the opposite of what is happening right here is

1183
01:03:53,600 --> 01:03:59,640
Speaker 1: the death of communities, and um, just the natural progression

1184
01:04:00,000 --> 01:04:03,480
Speaker 1: of the economy of the West and the transition and

1185
01:04:03,800 --> 01:04:08,240
Speaker 1: or the diversification of communities. Maybe not even just the

1186
01:04:08,280 --> 01:04:11,280
Speaker 1: loss of something, but the the understanding that communities need

1187
01:04:11,320 --> 01:04:14,280
Speaker 1: to evolve and the communities need to diversify just as

1188
01:04:14,320 --> 01:04:18,480
Speaker 1: the economy changes. Yeah, I mean, the white Fish that

1189
01:04:18,760 --> 01:04:20,720
Speaker 1: I knew as a kid is still the white Fish

1190
01:04:20,760 --> 01:04:23,000
Speaker 1: that my kids know. We just have five more stop

1191
01:04:23,080 --> 01:04:27,200
Speaker 1: lights and All of the old stick houses that the

1192
01:04:27,280 --> 01:04:29,640
Speaker 1: railroad put up in the railroad district have all been

1193
01:04:29,640 --> 01:04:32,120
Speaker 1: torn down as they should be because they would blow

1194
01:04:32,120 --> 01:04:35,640
Speaker 1: over in the wind. And they've built new houses. Um,

1195
01:04:35,680 --> 01:04:38,440
Speaker 1: you know, it's yeah, it has changed. But if you

1196
01:04:38,440 --> 01:04:41,120
Speaker 1: look at the other you know, my you know, my

1197
01:04:41,240 --> 01:04:44,640
Speaker 1: fellow Montana's a lot of spaces and places on eastern

1198
01:04:44,680 --> 01:04:49,440
Speaker 1: Montana which are amazing, beautiful, gorgeous, um just awesome, awesome communities.

1199
01:04:49,760 --> 01:04:53,840
Speaker 1: You know, their economies are around agriculture, and in Whitefish's

1200
01:04:53,960 --> 01:04:58,040
Speaker 1: economy was around railroading. In Timber, we just looked out

1201
01:04:58,080 --> 01:05:00,960
Speaker 1: that we have We had some vision Harris in the fifties,

1202
01:05:01,040 --> 01:05:03,640
Speaker 1: my grandpa being among them, that created a ski hill

1203
01:05:03,880 --> 01:05:06,160
Speaker 1: in Whitefish that's now Big Mountain skier. You know white

1204
01:05:06,160 --> 01:05:08,680
Speaker 1: Fish Mountain skiers are on Big Mountain. And then we

1205
01:05:08,760 --> 01:05:11,520
Speaker 1: have a big lake right there. And so as this

1206
01:05:11,640 --> 01:05:14,760
Speaker 1: shift of the economy was taking place in the seventies

1207
01:05:14,760 --> 01:05:18,360
Speaker 1: and eighties and into the nineties, um from Timber on

1208
01:05:18,360 --> 01:05:21,840
Speaker 1: a slow decline, there was also this recreation industry that

1209
01:05:21,920 --> 01:05:25,000
Speaker 1: came in. And it was not it wasn't necessarily coming

1210
01:05:25,000 --> 01:05:27,080
Speaker 1: in and taking the place of but it was a

1211
01:05:27,120 --> 01:05:31,160
Speaker 1: diverse slow diversification of and so as a result of that,

1212
01:05:31,200 --> 01:05:34,160
Speaker 1: we've continued to be able to thrive. But community is

1213
01:05:34,160 --> 01:05:37,120
Speaker 1: like Whitefish, Um communities like Bozeman, communities like Big Sky,

1214
01:05:37,200 --> 01:05:40,280
Speaker 1: the like we're the places that this diversification has happened.

1215
01:05:40,400 --> 01:05:43,320
Speaker 1: That tourism, you know, is a real thing. These four

1216
01:05:43,400 --> 01:05:48,840
Speaker 1: second homeowners, et cetera. But these are spaces where people

1217
01:05:48,880 --> 01:05:51,280
Speaker 1: are having very grown up conversations and like, how do

1218
01:05:51,400 --> 01:05:56,200
Speaker 1: we balance what our economy looks like now with our

1219
01:05:56,600 --> 01:05:59,040
Speaker 1: you know, as just residents. How do we balance those

1220
01:05:59,040 --> 01:06:02,560
Speaker 1: things are you know, and the community standard and aesthetic

1221
01:06:02,600 --> 01:06:04,880
Speaker 1: for living. Like if if you come to the state

1222
01:06:04,920 --> 01:06:08,680
Speaker 1: and you go for to example, to broad Est and

1223
01:06:08,800 --> 01:06:11,600
Speaker 1: you look around, and then you go to Whitefish and

1224
01:06:11,640 --> 01:06:14,760
Speaker 1: look around, you're seeing, Like you said that the difference

1225
01:06:14,760 --> 01:06:17,240
Speaker 1: between those two places, the difference between the core of

1226
01:06:17,280 --> 01:06:19,760
Speaker 1: the economy of those two places, what's driving them to

1227
01:06:19,800 --> 01:06:23,080
Speaker 1: where they are? Broadest? If you've never been there, I'm

1228
01:06:23,080 --> 01:06:24,800
Speaker 1: not even really sure how to describe. It's a one

1229
01:06:24,840 --> 01:06:28,320
Speaker 1: horse town. And then and there's you know, and there's

1230
01:06:28,320 --> 01:06:30,040
Speaker 1: a time in a space in a place for everything,

1231
01:06:30,080 --> 01:06:32,920
Speaker 1: and and you know, eastern Montana is super beautiful, and

1232
01:06:33,320 --> 01:06:37,720
Speaker 1: but just the natural progression of agriculture and mechanization, and um,

1233
01:06:37,760 --> 01:06:40,840
Speaker 1: you know, they're the populations aren't necessarily growing as much.

1234
01:06:41,320 --> 01:06:44,480
Speaker 1: It's it's not about coming in and replacing, you know,

1235
01:06:44,600 --> 01:06:47,680
Speaker 1: it's not about not being an agricultural town anymore. But

1236
01:06:47,800 --> 01:06:50,800
Speaker 1: where are the opportunities to just diversify. And it's not

1237
01:06:50,840 --> 01:06:53,520
Speaker 1: even diversification, it's you know, how do we add outdoor

1238
01:06:53,520 --> 01:07:00,360
Speaker 1: recreation amenities perhaps to your community, not even necessarily for tourism,

1239
01:07:00,400 --> 01:07:03,600
Speaker 1: it's recreation amenities for the residents that live there. How

1240
01:07:03,640 --> 01:07:07,680
Speaker 1: do you live a happier, healthier life in these areas?

1241
01:07:07,800 --> 01:07:09,960
Speaker 1: And then that's going to lead to your kids or

1242
01:07:09,960 --> 01:07:13,560
Speaker 1: your grandkids, you know, one more reason for them to

1243
01:07:13,640 --> 01:07:15,360
Speaker 1: love and want to stay there and maybe start a

1244
01:07:15,400 --> 01:07:19,640
Speaker 1: new business there. So it's not taking place of replacing

1245
01:07:19,680 --> 01:07:21,600
Speaker 1: in many places, it's just you know, the opportunity to

1246
01:07:21,640 --> 01:07:24,440
Speaker 1: understand that no recreation economy is a thing. It can

1247
01:07:24,520 --> 01:07:27,760
Speaker 1: help diversify areas. And and that's part of what I'm doing,

1248
01:07:27,880 --> 01:07:30,360
Speaker 1: is how do we find the tools to help any

1249
01:07:30,400 --> 01:07:32,480
Speaker 1: community that wants to have it be a part of

1250
01:07:32,480 --> 01:07:34,560
Speaker 1: who they are. How do we find them the tools

1251
01:07:34,600 --> 01:07:36,960
Speaker 1: to help them do that? In a in an efficient

1252
01:07:36,960 --> 01:07:40,560
Speaker 1: and effective way. What's the balance between when you talk

1253
01:07:40,600 --> 01:07:44,280
Speaker 1: about that economy resident dollars and non resident dollars. Yeah,

1254
01:07:44,320 --> 01:07:46,720
Speaker 1: and in Montana we're super lucky because we have um

1255
01:07:46,800 --> 01:07:48,600
Speaker 1: kind of two points of verification for this kind of

1256
01:07:48,600 --> 01:07:52,040
Speaker 1: statistic UM. So Outdoor Industry Association holds a lot of

1257
01:07:52,040 --> 01:07:56,440
Speaker 1: consumer spending data as a trade organization. That's pretty spot on.

1258
01:07:57,040 --> 01:07:59,240
Speaker 1: We also in Montana have the Institute for Tourism and

1259
01:07:59,280 --> 01:08:03,640
Speaker 1: Recreation Research, which actually produces similar but oftentimes totally different

1260
01:08:03,640 --> 01:08:07,439
Speaker 1: studies or or um groups of data. They both did

1261
01:08:07,440 --> 01:08:10,840
Speaker 1: a study on resident versus nonresident and they came up

1262
01:08:10,880 --> 01:08:12,560
Speaker 1: with about the same thing on just what you said.

1263
01:08:13,040 --> 01:08:15,720
Speaker 1: So if at seven point one billion ish right in

1264
01:08:15,840 --> 01:08:20,400
Speaker 1: consumer spending Montana residents, we're have we made a million?

1265
01:08:20,479 --> 01:08:22,960
Speaker 1: Yet are we a million people? I don't even think

1266
01:08:22,960 --> 01:08:26,880
Speaker 1: we're a million, Maybe we're a million two hundred we're

1267
01:08:26,880 --> 01:08:31,280
Speaker 1: spending half of that. So it's it's residents spending money

1268
01:08:31,320 --> 01:08:34,080
Speaker 1: on their way of life. So a million Montana residents

1269
01:08:34,160 --> 01:08:38,360
Speaker 1: spending about you know, a little under probably three billion dollars.

1270
01:08:39,760 --> 01:08:42,320
Speaker 1: So it's us spending money on our way of life

1271
01:08:42,320 --> 01:08:46,320
Speaker 1: in our communities. We live on even it's our resident tourism.

1272
01:08:46,479 --> 01:08:48,679
Speaker 1: I mean, like my boys and I love nothing more

1273
01:08:48,760 --> 01:08:51,599
Speaker 1: than to just doodle our way across the state and

1274
01:08:51,760 --> 01:08:54,680
Speaker 1: stop wherever and do whatever and so. But a lot

1275
01:08:54,680 --> 01:08:56,599
Speaker 1: of that, of course, is new money coming in. That's

1276
01:08:56,640 --> 01:09:00,240
Speaker 1: nonresident visitation we have. I tell Wyoming all the time,

1277
01:09:00,280 --> 01:09:02,400
Speaker 1: I have no idea why they claim Yellowstone Park because

1278
01:09:02,400 --> 01:09:06,200
Speaker 1: it's in Montana. Right, So if you ever have an

1279
01:09:06,200 --> 01:09:09,160
Speaker 1: opportunity to visit with the office aboutdoor wreck and um

1280
01:09:09,160 --> 01:09:12,920
Speaker 1: in Wyoming reminded Yellowstones in Montana, I don't know why

1281
01:09:13,000 --> 01:09:15,960
Speaker 1: you anyway, So we have Yellowstone Park is an anchor south,

1282
01:09:15,960 --> 01:09:18,760
Speaker 1: and we've got Glacier Glacier Park as a as an

1283
01:09:18,760 --> 01:09:22,400
Speaker 1: anchor up north. And it's so many people are coming in,

1284
01:09:22,479 --> 01:09:25,320
Speaker 1: millions and millions of people to visit. I mean, let's

1285
01:09:25,360 --> 01:09:29,200
Speaker 1: be honest, the two most amazing national parks. I'm biased.

1286
01:09:29,240 --> 01:09:31,240
Speaker 1: Whatever they can. I'm sure you're going to get some

1287
01:09:31,280 --> 01:09:35,559
Speaker 1: emails that woman our National parks way better whatever she

1288
01:09:35,640 --> 01:09:40,879
Speaker 1: works for the Montana Outdoor Recreation Department. Yes, she's biased.

1289
01:09:41,120 --> 01:09:43,840
Speaker 1: So you know, it's um some times of people are

1290
01:09:43,840 --> 01:09:46,200
Speaker 1: coming in. But it's also too I mean again, there's

1291
01:09:46,200 --> 01:09:48,240
Speaker 1: so many other opportunities too, and we're trying to figure

1292
01:09:48,240 --> 01:09:50,559
Speaker 1: out how best to communicate, you know, those little hidden

1293
01:09:50,600 --> 01:09:53,880
Speaker 1: gems that would appreciate some visitation. Yeah, I'm gonna keep

1294
01:09:53,920 --> 01:09:57,160
Speaker 1: hitting you with hard, hard things to to think of.

1295
01:09:57,800 --> 01:10:03,599
Speaker 1: These are hard, You're not not hard for you issues.

1296
01:10:04,240 --> 01:10:05,680
Speaker 1: I thought You're going to ask me how many more

1297
01:10:05,680 --> 01:10:10,160
Speaker 1: fish I've caught than you have this year? All of them? Um.

1298
01:10:10,439 --> 01:10:12,760
Speaker 1: I got some questions about fishing at the end of this,

1299
01:10:13,360 --> 01:10:16,720
Speaker 1: and why why I suck so bad? Um? What do

1300
01:10:16,800 --> 01:10:20,080
Speaker 1: you think of when you think of the outdoor economy,

1301
01:10:20,160 --> 01:10:21,679
Speaker 1: you think of your job, and you think the stateum

1302
01:10:21,680 --> 01:10:23,280
Speaker 1: on Tandlers. A lot of people listening to this as you,

1303
01:10:23,400 --> 01:10:26,519
Speaker 1: as you mentioned, that don't live here, that have maybe

1304
01:10:26,560 --> 01:10:29,960
Speaker 1: never been here, and we discussed in the podcast I

1305
01:10:29,960 --> 01:10:32,599
Speaker 1: think you listened to about this kind of public private.

1306
01:10:33,160 --> 01:10:35,719
Speaker 1: It's really it's really not public versus private? What really

1307
01:10:35,680 --> 01:10:37,760
Speaker 1: is not That's why I'm like, oh my god, where

1308
01:10:37,760 --> 01:10:40,200
Speaker 1: where on the planet? When did this turn into an

1309
01:10:40,200 --> 01:10:42,760
Speaker 1: oar thing? Yeah, but it's it's not bad, not even

1310
01:10:42,800 --> 01:10:46,280
Speaker 1: at all. What I learned from from from the dozens

1311
01:10:46,320 --> 01:10:49,280
Speaker 1: and of emails and dozens more of messages I got

1312
01:10:49,320 --> 01:10:51,800
Speaker 1: in different places about what that really is. It's really

1313
01:10:51,840 --> 01:10:54,800
Speaker 1: to me, it's about a core value system and a

1314
01:10:54,880 --> 01:10:59,559
Speaker 1: perspective on what the outdoors can can bring to your life.

1315
01:10:59,600 --> 01:11:01,360
Speaker 1: You know, there's lot of people that are from the South,

1316
01:11:01,760 --> 01:11:05,200
Speaker 1: from the East. They live they live in very confined spaces,

1317
01:11:06,240 --> 01:11:08,519
Speaker 1: not in not in their dwellings, but in where they

1318
01:11:08,520 --> 01:11:10,519
Speaker 1: can go. Right when I lived in Illinois, when I

1319
01:11:10,560 --> 01:11:13,479
Speaker 1: lived in Texas, even when I lived in Maryland, there

1320
01:11:13,600 --> 01:11:16,200
Speaker 1: was very few, very few opportunities for me to get

1321
01:11:16,280 --> 01:11:18,120
Speaker 1: up in the morning and do what you what you

1322
01:11:18,160 --> 01:11:20,519
Speaker 1: just describe that you do with your sons. And so

1323
01:11:20,600 --> 01:11:23,680
Speaker 1: it kind of compartmentalizes is not only what you can

1324
01:11:23,680 --> 01:11:26,200
Speaker 1: do outside, but also your value systems around what it

1325
01:11:26,240 --> 01:11:28,360
Speaker 1: all means. And so I think that it's not public

1326
01:11:28,479 --> 01:11:31,880
Speaker 1: versus private. Really, what it really is is one set

1327
01:11:31,920 --> 01:11:35,639
Speaker 1: of ideals that are structured around what people can do outside,

1328
01:11:35,680 --> 01:11:38,840
Speaker 1: and then another set of ideals that structure around the

1329
01:11:39,000 --> 01:11:42,160
Speaker 1: vast array of things you can do outside in Montana.

1330
01:11:42,360 --> 01:11:43,800
Speaker 1: And so I don't know if it's jealousy is the

1331
01:11:43,880 --> 01:11:45,280
Speaker 1: right word for it. I wouldn't put it that way.

1332
01:11:45,320 --> 01:11:46,760
Speaker 1: I would just say it's just a really it's a

1333
01:11:46,760 --> 01:11:49,120
Speaker 1: different way of living it's different worldview, and it's a

1334
01:11:49,120 --> 01:11:52,760
Speaker 1: different way of of recreating outside, whether you're hunting or

1335
01:11:52,800 --> 01:11:55,920
Speaker 1: fishing or whatever. Um, so how have you? I mean,

1336
01:11:55,920 --> 01:11:57,880
Speaker 1: you're you grew up in that I live in, and

1337
01:11:57,880 --> 01:11:59,599
Speaker 1: I mean we could ski here, we could fish here,

1338
01:11:59,600 --> 01:12:02,000
Speaker 1: we can water raft here, like all these things we

1339
01:12:02,040 --> 01:12:06,280
Speaker 1: can do with near the population centers that you really

1340
01:12:06,280 --> 01:12:09,000
Speaker 1: can't do in other places. So I'm pretty pretentious sometimes.

1341
01:12:09,479 --> 01:12:13,519
Speaker 1: Um I have a sticker on most of my yetti coolers, which,

1342
01:12:13,880 --> 01:12:15,760
Speaker 1: what did you enjoyed my yetty bruise? Oh? Is that

1343
01:12:15,800 --> 01:12:17,800
Speaker 1: a yet bruise? I have a two ten and I

1344
01:12:17,800 --> 01:12:19,719
Speaker 1: put all my drinks in it while we're camping overfore

1345
01:12:19,720 --> 01:12:22,040
Speaker 1: the dry and every time a forty pound lid falls

1346
01:12:22,080 --> 01:12:23,760
Speaker 1: on your arm and leaves a bruise. So I mean,

1347
01:12:23,920 --> 01:12:28,080
Speaker 1: just this hardcore recreating. Don't drink in the yet or do?

1348
01:12:28,160 --> 01:12:30,160
Speaker 1: I mean you probably? So, I have the sticker and

1349
01:12:30,160 --> 01:12:33,000
Speaker 1: it says my life is better than your vacation. Super pretentious,

1350
01:12:33,040 --> 01:12:35,840
Speaker 1: superstick But it is that I live in a place

1351
01:12:35,880 --> 01:12:38,240
Speaker 1: I learned very very young. My dad was a guide,

1352
01:12:38,640 --> 01:12:40,920
Speaker 1: and I had never been to any of the places

1353
01:12:41,000 --> 01:12:43,080
Speaker 1: that you know I would go. He was a rafting guide.

1354
01:12:43,080 --> 01:12:44,759
Speaker 1: I'd sit in there, There'll be eight people from across

1355
01:12:44,800 --> 01:12:47,200
Speaker 1: the US. They were having a through our experience done

1356
01:12:47,200 --> 01:12:49,519
Speaker 1: a wild and senior gripper that was literally changing their

1357
01:12:49,560 --> 01:12:51,799
Speaker 1: lives in front of my face. And as a young person,

1358
01:12:52,400 --> 01:12:54,800
Speaker 1: I knew I could see that that was happening, but

1359
01:12:54,840 --> 01:12:56,680
Speaker 1: I didn't have context to put it in in the

1360
01:12:56,680 --> 01:12:59,240
Speaker 1: sense that I didn't know where they came from. And

1361
01:12:59,320 --> 01:13:03,280
Speaker 1: so I just knew that evidently what I have is remarkable,

1362
01:13:03,600 --> 01:13:06,480
Speaker 1: and people are planning their lives around coming and recreating.

1363
01:13:06,840 --> 01:13:08,800
Speaker 1: But okay, so take it into a broader sense, and

1364
01:13:09,160 --> 01:13:12,759
Speaker 1: I am passionate about public lands. Yeah, I'm very passionate

1365
01:13:12,800 --> 01:13:14,800
Speaker 1: about Let me just let me before you going for

1366
01:13:14,960 --> 01:13:16,840
Speaker 1: let me just say that that it's that is real

1367
01:13:17,000 --> 01:13:20,280
Speaker 1: because I came here, I grew up Montana. Was this,

1368
01:13:20,880 --> 01:13:23,760
Speaker 1: you know, shining star on the hill that I one

1369
01:13:23,840 --> 01:13:26,800
Speaker 1: day I hope to visit. You just filled water, don't

1370
01:13:26,880 --> 01:13:30,760
Speaker 1: left shoot yourself. Yeah, you're all the way you get

1371
01:13:30,840 --> 01:13:34,680
Speaker 1: You're all bruised up. Man, it's rough here. That's one thing.

1372
01:13:34,920 --> 01:13:39,360
Speaker 1: Anna bruise you up, you probably get the water down. Um.

1373
01:13:39,479 --> 01:13:41,360
Speaker 1: Whatever I was talking about, it was gonna be good.

1374
01:13:41,560 --> 01:13:44,439
Speaker 1: Whatever I was saying, what was I saying? Film fills

1375
01:13:44,439 --> 01:13:49,080
Speaker 1: on his phone. It's a real life changing experience. We're

1376
01:13:49,120 --> 01:13:51,200
Speaker 1: just saying that it's for real. It's a shining star.

1377
01:13:51,280 --> 01:13:54,320
Speaker 1: It's but I've almost thought that that I'm here, like, yeah,

1378
01:13:54,360 --> 01:13:56,920
Speaker 1: I've got all this public land and it's not. I'm

1379
01:13:56,920 --> 01:13:59,640
Speaker 1: just like, hey, dude, hey, everybody in the US, we

1380
01:14:00,000 --> 01:14:02,320
Speaker 1: will own this together. I happen to be living in

1381
01:14:02,360 --> 01:14:05,040
Speaker 1: the middle of it, which does not give me any

1382
01:14:05,120 --> 01:14:09,120
Speaker 1: greater um right to be on it than you who

1383
01:14:09,240 --> 01:14:11,280
Speaker 1: have never been to it before. But just you all

1384
01:14:11,280 --> 01:14:14,240
Speaker 1: know you own all of this with me. Come here

1385
01:14:14,280 --> 01:14:16,840
Speaker 1: whenever you want and experience it and love it with

1386
01:14:16,960 --> 01:14:18,840
Speaker 1: That's the most powerful point, I would say, the most

1387
01:14:18,880 --> 01:14:20,679
Speaker 1: powerful thing about if you're living in the East Coast

1388
01:14:20,720 --> 01:14:22,720
Speaker 1: or the South or somewhere or wherever, Texas, what does

1389
01:14:22,760 --> 01:14:25,920
Speaker 1: it matter. The most powerful thing to remember is that

1390
01:14:26,360 --> 01:14:29,080
Speaker 1: this is yours, right it is it's yours and ours

1391
01:14:29,120 --> 01:14:31,599
Speaker 1: we we we own it together. You can take your

1392
01:14:31,640 --> 01:14:34,360
Speaker 1: money and lease a hunter acre property and hunted every

1393
01:14:34,360 --> 01:14:35,880
Speaker 1: weekend with your kids. Or you can take that same

1394
01:14:35,920 --> 01:14:38,519
Speaker 1: amount of money and travel to Montana and travel to

1395
01:14:38,560 --> 01:14:40,920
Speaker 1: Colorado and travel to other places and go hunt and

1396
01:14:40,960 --> 01:14:42,360
Speaker 1: go fish and do what you want to do. And

1397
01:14:42,560 --> 01:14:45,759
Speaker 1: you have that choice. So public lands provides you a choice.

1398
01:14:46,080 --> 01:14:49,360
Speaker 1: It provides you an option that's there, that's always there

1399
01:14:49,400 --> 01:14:51,960
Speaker 1: for you. Continuing on your public private conversation that you had,

1400
01:14:51,960 --> 01:14:54,440
Speaker 1: which I thought that gentleman you visited with was fantastic

1401
01:14:54,640 --> 01:14:59,280
Speaker 1: at Berkeley, the professor Luke Luke McCauley Luke. Anyway, but um,

1402
01:15:00,040 --> 01:15:02,120
Speaker 1: you know, one of the things, so like we can

1403
01:15:02,120 --> 01:15:03,479
Speaker 1: touch on it more. But we have what's called the

1404
01:15:03,479 --> 01:15:06,720
Speaker 1: Confluence of States, and there are now gosh, there's ten

1405
01:15:06,760 --> 01:15:09,080
Speaker 1: offices about derecreation across the US, probably thirteen by the

1406
01:15:09,160 --> 01:15:10,400
Speaker 1: end of the year, but eight of us have signed.

1407
01:15:10,439 --> 01:15:12,240
Speaker 1: We drafted for nine months and signed what we call

1408
01:15:12,280 --> 01:15:14,800
Speaker 1: the Confluence Accords. And and part of that conversation is

1409
01:15:14,920 --> 01:15:18,320
Speaker 1: establishing where our common goals and visions are and how

1410
01:15:18,600 --> 01:15:21,320
Speaker 1: you know, to broadly define like what our offices about derecreation,

1411
01:15:21,400 --> 01:15:24,280
Speaker 1: and it helps us to find where we can work together, um,

1412
01:15:24,400 --> 01:15:26,160
Speaker 1: share best practices, and where we can work to go

1413
01:15:26,360 --> 01:15:29,559
Speaker 1: nationally to help the direcreation economy, et cetera. But as

1414
01:15:29,560 --> 01:15:31,680
Speaker 1: part of that conversation, you know public you know it

1415
01:15:31,760 --> 01:15:34,519
Speaker 1: was oftentimes you know public you know, talking about public land,

1416
01:15:34,520 --> 01:15:38,240
Speaker 1: public land, but in Montana here you might think like,

1417
01:15:38,280 --> 01:15:41,320
Speaker 1: oh public land state, Yeah, public land state. Two thirds

1418
01:15:41,360 --> 01:15:43,320
Speaker 1: of Montana might do I have that right is private

1419
01:15:43,680 --> 01:15:47,599
Speaker 1: and talk about So another reason that Montana is better

1420
01:15:47,600 --> 01:15:50,040
Speaker 1: than any other state in the United States. I just

1421
01:15:50,120 --> 01:15:54,360
Speaker 1: said that, yes I did, um very inclusive, but we

1422
01:15:54,479 --> 01:15:57,240
Speaker 1: well so Montana has the gold standard for water access,

1423
01:15:57,360 --> 01:15:59,839
Speaker 1: got like a hundred and seventy thousand miles of streams

1424
01:15:59,840 --> 01:16:03,800
Speaker 1: and rivers alone, and that the public has access to

1425
01:16:03,800 --> 01:16:06,280
Speaker 1: that and that is something that sportsmen and women you

1426
01:16:06,320 --> 01:16:08,200
Speaker 1: know in the days have come back and you know,

1427
01:16:08,360 --> 01:16:10,240
Speaker 1: we're the ones that made that happen, et cetera. But

1428
01:16:10,320 --> 01:16:12,559
Speaker 1: another thing that really is important to talk about is

1429
01:16:12,960 --> 01:16:14,760
Speaker 1: we are the envy of a nation as far as

1430
01:16:14,800 --> 01:16:18,840
Speaker 1: block management. So it's that state private land partnership for

1431
01:16:19,080 --> 01:16:23,280
Speaker 1: hunting and fishing, mostly access and at any given time,

1432
01:16:23,280 --> 01:16:25,200
Speaker 1: depending on the year, we have between six and eight

1433
01:16:25,320 --> 01:16:30,519
Speaker 1: million acres of Montana that is privately owned ranching and

1434
01:16:30,560 --> 01:16:35,040
Speaker 1: farming communities with and I praised the private landowners of

1435
01:16:35,080 --> 01:16:38,200
Speaker 1: Montana just kick butt and they work with our fish

1436
01:16:38,240 --> 01:16:42,519
Speaker 1: walife from Parks Department to open up those lands for

1437
01:16:42,600 --> 01:16:45,800
Speaker 1: access for bird hunting, for elk hunting, like you name it.

1438
01:16:45,800 --> 01:16:48,600
Speaker 1: It's all over the place. And then I mean and

1439
01:16:48,640 --> 01:16:51,280
Speaker 1: then that just even touches more on these and you know,

1440
01:16:51,360 --> 01:16:54,400
Speaker 1: most states have different versions of them, but these amazing

1441
01:16:54,520 --> 01:16:58,840
Speaker 1: collaborative habitat conservation programs, so fish realife from parks. You know,

1442
01:16:58,880 --> 01:17:01,960
Speaker 1: our wildlife is the state and people, we own that.

1443
01:17:02,439 --> 01:17:05,840
Speaker 1: But um, so there's great collaboratives for habitat um work

1444
01:17:05,960 --> 01:17:10,120
Speaker 1: on private lands. Um. And so that's why, gosh, you know,

1445
01:17:10,240 --> 01:17:12,479
Speaker 1: even for a Western state. You know, when we are

1446
01:17:12,560 --> 01:17:14,960
Speaker 1: drafting those accords, I made it a point, hey guys,

1447
01:17:15,040 --> 01:17:17,759
Speaker 1: this is not just about public land. This is about

1448
01:17:17,760 --> 01:17:22,240
Speaker 1: recreational opportunity across and public private partnership and private um.

1449
01:17:22,320 --> 01:17:25,160
Speaker 1: And and you know, of course my counterparts in the East,

1450
01:17:25,200 --> 01:17:28,439
Speaker 1: so Vermont, and they were like hair hair exactly. And

1451
01:17:28,479 --> 01:17:31,000
Speaker 1: so because they are the opposite, they do the most

1452
01:17:31,040 --> 01:17:33,679
Speaker 1: of their work on private lands with bits of public

1453
01:17:33,760 --> 01:17:36,439
Speaker 1: land mixed in. But as a result, we have so

1454
01:17:36,479 --> 01:17:38,760
Speaker 1: much opportunity to really learn from from each other and

1455
01:17:39,000 --> 01:17:41,560
Speaker 1: share best practices. And how do we incorporate that recreation

1456
01:17:41,760 --> 01:17:45,800
Speaker 1: in on all aspects. Yeah, another big thing that you know,

1457
01:17:45,920 --> 01:17:47,840
Speaker 1: often in the hunting world. There's I think there's two

1458
01:17:47,840 --> 01:17:49,879
Speaker 1: big things. I know you've dealt a lot with outfit

1459
01:17:49,960 --> 01:17:54,000
Speaker 1: or outfitting associations and those types of things. How do

1460
01:17:54,040 --> 01:17:58,280
Speaker 1: you find that part of the economy. Does it conflict

1461
01:17:58,320 --> 01:18:02,639
Speaker 1: with public land hunting and pub land use? Is there

1462
01:18:02,680 --> 01:18:05,479
Speaker 1: any anything to be had there? I know it doesn't

1463
01:18:05,520 --> 01:18:07,559
Speaker 1: have to be in Every state works different, and I'll

1464
01:18:07,600 --> 01:18:10,320
Speaker 1: be danged. I mean, for as much hunting as we've

1465
01:18:10,360 --> 01:18:13,479
Speaker 1: all done around, I can't keep every state, you know.

1466
01:18:13,680 --> 01:18:15,960
Speaker 1: I mean, it's like hunting laws over here and how

1467
01:18:15,960 --> 01:18:18,960
Speaker 1: they work resident versus non resident versus landowner tags, and

1468
01:18:19,000 --> 01:18:21,120
Speaker 1: who has this and that, and there's just a million

1469
01:18:21,120 --> 01:18:23,120
Speaker 1: different examples, and I don't think that there's one out

1470
01:18:23,120 --> 01:18:27,200
Speaker 1: there that's perfect. UM guiding and outfitting isn't really important

1471
01:18:27,240 --> 01:18:30,840
Speaker 1: part of the recreation industry, right because if we think about,

1472
01:18:31,000 --> 01:18:34,360
Speaker 1: you know, the manufacturers of gear, there's also manufacturers of

1473
01:18:34,400 --> 01:18:39,120
Speaker 1: experience and both of those so so so specifically, UM

1474
01:18:39,160 --> 01:18:43,160
Speaker 1: rely on our outdorecreation infrastructure and Opportunity and access UM

1475
01:18:43,200 --> 01:18:47,120
Speaker 1: in Montana for nonresident expenditures, Guiding and outfitting is the

1476
01:18:47,160 --> 01:18:52,360
Speaker 1: fourth largest expenditure for UM for nonresident visitors, and it's

1477
01:18:52,400 --> 01:18:55,719
Speaker 1: not UM and I'm very very quick to remind everybody,

1478
01:18:55,720 --> 01:18:57,800
Speaker 1: and I'll be up front. I was a fishing guide.

1479
01:18:58,120 --> 01:18:59,600
Speaker 1: I grew up with a dad who's a hunting and

1480
01:18:59,640 --> 01:19:02,320
Speaker 1: fishing gu and I've been around and in that industry

1481
01:19:02,360 --> 01:19:05,479
Speaker 1: for a very long time and done work. But this

1482
01:19:05,560 --> 01:19:08,560
Speaker 1: isn't about people coming in with a bunch of money,

1483
01:19:08,600 --> 01:19:11,720
Speaker 1: like just to buy in the access. So many of

1484
01:19:11,720 --> 01:19:14,799
Speaker 1: these people coming in they don't know where to start.

1485
01:19:15,200 --> 01:19:17,160
Speaker 1: They want the experience, they don't know where to start,

1486
01:19:17,439 --> 01:19:18,840
Speaker 1: or they kind of have a clue, but they want

1487
01:19:18,840 --> 01:19:22,960
Speaker 1: to stay safe. They don't This is just about people

1488
01:19:23,000 --> 01:19:27,000
Speaker 1: offering a service to help people have the access most

1489
01:19:27,040 --> 01:19:28,800
Speaker 1: of the time, I mean, especially if it's like a

1490
01:19:28,800 --> 01:19:32,839
Speaker 1: public lands hunt to something that's already there's and there

1491
01:19:32,840 --> 01:19:36,120
Speaker 1: there are systems, there's licensing, there's permitting, like it's it

1492
01:19:36,120 --> 01:19:38,200
Speaker 1: all comes into plane, so there doesn't need to be

1493
01:19:38,240 --> 01:19:43,280
Speaker 1: any conflict. Um, it's just you know, these these so

1494
01:19:43,400 --> 01:19:47,200
Speaker 1: often it's just everyday people learning how to and or

1495
01:19:47,280 --> 01:19:49,240
Speaker 1: getting the access that they want to do all of that.

1496
01:19:49,840 --> 01:19:51,719
Speaker 1: And I think it's interesting. I mean, it's just shows

1497
01:19:51,800 --> 01:19:53,719
Speaker 1: kind of a different, you know, kind of a shift

1498
01:19:53,760 --> 01:19:56,599
Speaker 1: in the way people are. So I said that that's

1499
01:19:56,640 --> 01:19:59,360
Speaker 1: the fourth largest expenditure in the state. It used to

1500
01:19:59,439 --> 01:20:02,880
Speaker 1: be retail l you know, just buying stuff, and it's

1501
01:20:02,920 --> 01:20:06,679
Speaker 1: like the shift of priorities and people are so now

1502
01:20:06,960 --> 01:20:11,000
Speaker 1: becoming more focused on the experiential opportunities versus the tangible

1503
01:20:11,040 --> 01:20:14,519
Speaker 1: take home. Um. So it's really interesting to see that shift,

1504
01:20:14,840 --> 01:20:16,920
Speaker 1: and it is very important. And you look at the

1505
01:20:16,960 --> 01:20:19,439
Speaker 1: amount of dollars that are you know, revenue within the

1506
01:20:19,479 --> 01:20:22,639
Speaker 1: state just around hunting and fishing, and obviously my brain

1507
01:20:22,840 --> 01:20:25,080
Speaker 1: falls there because I mean it's not that I don't

1508
01:20:25,120 --> 01:20:27,320
Speaker 1: do everything else too, but I mean hunting and fishing

1509
01:20:27,360 --> 01:20:28,960
Speaker 1: is a core part of what I do, but it's

1510
01:20:28,960 --> 01:20:32,320
Speaker 1: so important to the economy. Yeah, now that's I remember

1511
01:20:32,320 --> 01:20:35,120
Speaker 1: you talking about meeting with the Guides and Outfit Association

1512
01:20:35,120 --> 01:20:39,559
Speaker 1: in Montana and understanding the impacts of that and and

1513
01:20:39,600 --> 01:20:41,880
Speaker 1: knowing that and I We've had a couple conversation in

1514
01:20:41,880 --> 01:20:43,680
Speaker 1: this podcast where people have kind of thrown those things

1515
01:20:43,720 --> 01:20:47,240
Speaker 1: against each other. Dyre's a guide and I'm like, man, whatever,

1516
01:20:47,760 --> 01:20:51,599
Speaker 1: whatever you have time for, whatever you can afford for everybody, whatever,

1517
01:20:51,880 --> 01:20:55,080
Speaker 1: for everybody at the table. And yeah, sometimes people butt heads.

1518
01:20:55,680 --> 01:20:58,559
Speaker 1: It's gonna happen. There's no such thing as utopia. But

1519
01:20:58,640 --> 01:21:00,679
Speaker 1: if we can have I mean, if we and continue

1520
01:21:00,680 --> 01:21:03,719
Speaker 1: to try and establish these foundations, you know, to base

1521
01:21:03,760 --> 01:21:07,599
Speaker 1: our conversations on to find those common um, the common

1522
01:21:07,680 --> 01:21:10,680
Speaker 1: values that we all share. If we can just if

1523
01:21:10,720 --> 01:21:12,519
Speaker 1: we can just focus on those things. And that's why

1524
01:21:12,600 --> 01:21:14,880
Speaker 1: often you know, in my office and all the offices

1525
01:21:14,920 --> 01:21:17,240
Speaker 1: about direct across the US, we really try and focus

1526
01:21:17,240 --> 01:21:19,920
Speaker 1: on We need to elevate that conversation to whether it's

1527
01:21:19,960 --> 01:21:23,519
Speaker 1: the ten fift foot level, we need to elevate the

1528
01:21:23,520 --> 01:21:26,360
Speaker 1: conversation where we can all look at each other and say, oh,

1529
01:21:26,560 --> 01:21:31,120
Speaker 1: we all care about this, we all, um, this impacts

1530
01:21:31,120 --> 01:21:33,760
Speaker 1: all of us. Let's start working together on what we

1531
01:21:33,800 --> 01:21:36,000
Speaker 1: all can work on together. And if we can take

1532
01:21:36,040 --> 01:21:37,720
Speaker 1: care of all of that and then get down to

1533
01:21:37,720 --> 01:21:41,040
Speaker 1: where all that's left or those small little bickers back

1534
01:21:41,120 --> 01:21:45,280
Speaker 1: and forth between maybe two things, Wow, we are winning. Well,

1535
01:21:45,280 --> 01:21:47,160
Speaker 1: that's what the public way and movement has done for

1536
01:21:47,520 --> 01:21:49,360
Speaker 1: It's kind of I always you always thought like there's

1537
01:21:49,400 --> 01:21:52,320
Speaker 1: inherent value in being a guide outfitter because to the land,

1538
01:21:52,439 --> 01:21:55,879
Speaker 1: the water, to natural resource, to the to the wildlife resource,

1539
01:21:56,000 --> 01:21:58,840
Speaker 1: however you would would count one and out there needs

1540
01:21:58,840 --> 01:22:01,439
Speaker 1: to do business that that's their business, that's their value.

1541
01:22:01,439 --> 01:22:04,600
Speaker 1: They're not going to overuse or destroy habitat or a

1542
01:22:04,640 --> 01:22:06,920
Speaker 1: wild life resource that they need to stay in business.

1543
01:22:07,840 --> 01:22:10,800
Speaker 1: And so there's inherent is baked into the idea of

1544
01:22:10,800 --> 01:22:12,960
Speaker 1: what what they're doing. It wasn't always baked in the

1545
01:22:13,000 --> 01:22:16,720
Speaker 1: public lands, though it is now pardon but so, and

1546
01:22:16,760 --> 01:22:19,960
Speaker 1: that's the bad part is that there's assholes everywhere, of course,

1547
01:22:20,400 --> 01:22:23,959
Speaker 1: and so those couple little bad apples in whatever community

1548
01:22:23,960 --> 01:22:27,720
Speaker 1: we're talking about, it could be any user group. Unfortunately,

1549
01:22:27,960 --> 01:22:30,439
Speaker 1: those are the ones that then elevate the crud. And

1550
01:22:30,479 --> 01:22:32,960
Speaker 1: that's just such a small minute part of it. And

1551
01:22:33,040 --> 01:22:34,840
Speaker 1: so trying to get everybody like, okay, can we not

1552
01:22:34,880 --> 01:22:38,360
Speaker 1: focus on, you know, building the structured framework around the

1553
01:22:38,439 --> 01:22:41,920
Speaker 1: two percent of whatever bad apples? Can we just try

1554
01:22:41,960 --> 01:22:45,240
Speaker 1: and focus on the positive? Oh my gosh. In Montana,

1555
01:22:45,280 --> 01:22:47,519
Speaker 1: I mean, you have guiden outfitter associations that are putting

1556
01:22:47,520 --> 01:22:51,479
Speaker 1: together continuing education programs and further education programs for guides

1557
01:22:51,640 --> 01:22:55,559
Speaker 1: in the states, like building in conservation ethos and ethics,

1558
01:22:56,200 --> 01:22:58,840
Speaker 1: helping educate them so then they can in turn, you know,

1559
01:22:59,360 --> 01:23:03,240
Speaker 1: impart the correct information regarding habitat or fish or whatever

1560
01:23:03,320 --> 01:23:08,160
Speaker 1: conservation movements to their clients and guests and sharing that information. UM.

1561
01:23:08,360 --> 01:23:12,040
Speaker 1: So there's great work going on. Yeah, absolutely, And and

1562
01:23:12,120 --> 01:23:14,559
Speaker 1: that's what happened when the public land movement really took hold,

1563
01:23:14,640 --> 01:23:18,200
Speaker 1: is when we started to realize the similar values in

1564
01:23:18,240 --> 01:23:21,320
Speaker 1: our public lands and that wildlife resource. Like it's now

1565
01:23:21,439 --> 01:23:23,559
Speaker 1: it's not universal, but it's way more universal than it

1566
01:23:23,600 --> 01:23:28,240
Speaker 1: used to be. UM. Super aggressive about it. We always say,

1567
01:23:28,280 --> 01:23:31,240
Speaker 1: I mean, this is you know, offices about derecreation um

1568
01:23:31,240 --> 01:23:34,400
Speaker 1: and the derecreation economy. It's not a partisan thing. It's

1569
01:23:34,400 --> 01:23:38,519
Speaker 1: an every one thing, like we all agree on this.

1570
01:23:39,439 --> 01:23:42,280
Speaker 1: And I'm really I mean you see offices created by

1571
01:23:42,320 --> 01:23:47,639
Speaker 1: Democrats or by Republicans, Republican legislators or democratic legislatures. Um,

1572
01:23:47,800 --> 01:23:50,080
Speaker 1: you know it just it just doesn't matter what party

1573
01:23:50,120 --> 01:23:52,439
Speaker 1: system or anything anyone comes from. This is where we

1574
01:23:52,479 --> 01:23:55,640
Speaker 1: actually do come together and can have conversations that we

1575
01:23:55,680 --> 01:23:58,160
Speaker 1: all agree on stuff. Which that's why I mean, I

1576
01:23:58,280 --> 01:24:00,720
Speaker 1: just love the public land community because it is such

1577
01:24:00,720 --> 01:24:04,559
Speaker 1: a diverse, diverse group of people. Um. And then around

1578
01:24:04,560 --> 01:24:08,920
Speaker 1: these recreation opportunities, so I'm constantly pushing us like let's

1579
01:24:09,080 --> 01:24:11,240
Speaker 1: put our recreation where our mouth is and let's show

1580
01:24:11,320 --> 01:24:14,280
Speaker 1: where this can bring people together. Let's put our recreation

1581
01:24:14,280 --> 01:24:15,639
Speaker 1: in your mouth. Well, you know it's put your money

1582
01:24:15,640 --> 01:24:18,439
Speaker 1: where your mouth is. Is mouth is saying, put your

1583
01:24:18,439 --> 01:24:21,679
Speaker 1: recreation where your mouth is. Does it work? Not? Really,

1584
01:24:21,760 --> 01:24:24,040
Speaker 1: I'm thinking about it. Does it work? Fill? Put your

1585
01:24:24,040 --> 01:24:26,439
Speaker 1: recreation in your mouth? No, not in your mouth where

1586
01:24:26,439 --> 01:24:32,640
Speaker 1: your mouth is. Those lick your recreations? Did it? Just

1587
01:24:32,760 --> 01:24:34,800
Speaker 1: making stuff up as I go, but just seeing if

1588
01:24:34,800 --> 01:24:38,920
Speaker 1: it sticks. Not sticking yet it's not, so it's not

1589
01:24:38,960 --> 01:24:42,000
Speaker 1: real sticky with what was the original one. We'll put

1590
01:24:42,040 --> 01:24:44,200
Speaker 1: your money where your mouth is. Put your recreation where

1591
01:24:44,240 --> 01:24:49,280
Speaker 1: your mouth is. Boy, just let that marinate for a minute.

1592
01:24:49,720 --> 01:24:54,120
Speaker 1: Spunder that. Put your recreation where your mouth is. I

1593
01:24:54,160 --> 01:24:57,600
Speaker 1: think the recreation of mouth being in the same vicinity,

1594
01:24:59,640 --> 01:25:02,880
Speaker 1: it's not something I can do. We're moving on, moving on.

1595
01:25:03,720 --> 01:25:05,360
Speaker 1: I was gonna do women in the outdoors next, but

1596
01:25:05,479 --> 01:25:09,080
Speaker 1: we'll skip that and we're gonna go to Yes, that

1597
01:25:09,400 --> 01:25:11,320
Speaker 1: was actually that's the point I'm gonna make. So let's

1598
01:25:11,360 --> 01:25:13,800
Speaker 1: let's get that. We're going to kick that. This is

1599
01:25:13,840 --> 01:25:15,920
Speaker 1: like the last time we're gonna mention. That's what was

1600
01:25:16,000 --> 01:25:17,400
Speaker 1: the point I was gonna make. But we're gonna leave

1601
01:25:17,400 --> 01:25:20,920
Speaker 1: that to the end. Another thing, the Outdoor Industry Association

1602
01:25:20,960 --> 01:25:26,200
Speaker 1: you mentioned, Um, there has been and probably will always

1603
01:25:26,200 --> 01:25:29,200
Speaker 1: be tensioned between what we would call the outdoor recreation

1604
01:25:29,200 --> 01:25:31,640
Speaker 1: industry and what we would call the you know, what

1605
01:25:31,680 --> 01:25:34,000
Speaker 1: we call the hunting and fishing industry. A lot of

1606
01:25:34,000 --> 01:25:36,080
Speaker 1: people called the hook and bullet crowd. I mean there

1607
01:25:36,080 --> 01:25:38,880
Speaker 1: has been consumptive versus non consumpting hook of the bullet

1608
01:25:38,960 --> 01:25:41,840
Speaker 1: not well. So we're all part of the recreation industry.

1609
01:25:42,760 --> 01:25:47,840
Speaker 1: There's just there's, by the way, different camps. So you're like,

1610
01:25:47,880 --> 01:25:50,599
Speaker 1: you're in a position. Yeah, you're working. Hunters and anglers

1611
01:25:50,640 --> 01:25:53,280
Speaker 1: for a hundred fifty years have been waging this conservation

1612
01:25:53,320 --> 01:25:55,920
Speaker 1: stewardship battle. We've got Pittman, Robert Tinkle Johnson. That's where

1613
01:25:55,920 --> 01:25:58,160
Speaker 1: we're going, right, Yes, that's where we're going. You know

1614
01:25:58,240 --> 01:26:01,599
Speaker 1: me too well, you know these issues too well too.

1615
01:26:02,040 --> 01:26:05,400
Speaker 1: That's that's where we're going. There's I think part of

1616
01:26:05,439 --> 01:26:08,640
Speaker 1: what you know, our mutual friend Ryan cal Callahan of

1617
01:26:08,680 --> 01:26:11,840
Speaker 1: Cow's Weaken Review, I know the man downloaded, listen to it.

1618
01:26:12,479 --> 01:26:15,920
Speaker 1: Um him and I his relationship with the company like Patagonia,

1619
01:26:16,560 --> 01:26:19,600
Speaker 1: my relationships well at this company and prior to a

1620
01:26:19,680 --> 01:26:21,080
Speaker 1: YETI A lot of what we want to do is

1621
01:26:21,120 --> 01:26:25,920
Speaker 1: bridge those gaps between the ethos of that community in

1622
01:26:25,960 --> 01:26:28,400
Speaker 1: the ethos of our community. I think there is these

1623
01:26:28,680 --> 01:26:31,599
Speaker 1: um through lines that we've built, these these parallel three

1624
01:26:31,600 --> 01:26:34,160
Speaker 1: lines were weath in the hunting community. We're always pointing

1625
01:26:34,200 --> 01:26:35,640
Speaker 1: over there, being like, look at all the money that

1626
01:26:35,760 --> 01:26:40,120
Speaker 1: we're putting putting forth and ex size dollars in tag

1627
01:26:40,160 --> 01:26:43,040
Speaker 1: fees and license fees. We're always throwing that in their face,

1628
01:26:43,240 --> 01:26:46,360
Speaker 1: and they're throwing back the economy right. It was a

1629
01:26:46,439 --> 01:26:50,200
Speaker 1: hundred and seventeen billion was the number. I believe the

1630
01:26:50,280 --> 01:26:53,599
Speaker 1: last official number was eight hundred and eighties six billion dollars,

1631
01:26:54,880 --> 01:26:59,040
Speaker 1: So it's spent a couple of years ago. So there's that.

1632
01:26:59,120 --> 01:27:02,080
Speaker 1: And then the outre Industry Association itself is built up

1633
01:27:02,080 --> 01:27:05,320
Speaker 1: of a lot of companies who who um who have

1634
01:27:05,400 --> 01:27:08,160
Speaker 1: opposed in the past things like the backpack tax, which

1635
01:27:08,240 --> 01:27:10,880
Speaker 1: would be a similar excise tax to that of Pittman

1636
01:27:10,960 --> 01:27:16,040
Speaker 1: Robertson to outdoor recreation manufactured goods. So there there there

1637
01:27:16,040 --> 01:27:21,400
Speaker 1: are these tensions, whether they're perceived, whether they're real, they're there.

1638
01:27:21,439 --> 01:27:23,839
Speaker 1: And I've worked in both of the industries and I've

1639
01:27:23,920 --> 01:27:27,160
Speaker 1: seen it. I've seen I've seen some very welcoming conversations

1640
01:27:27,160 --> 01:27:29,240
Speaker 1: around hunting in that world, and I've seen some others

1641
01:27:29,280 --> 01:27:31,519
Speaker 1: that are just that seemed to me very pretentious and

1642
01:27:31,720 --> 01:27:34,559
Speaker 1: and um, so how do you in your position? I mean,

1643
01:27:34,560 --> 01:27:36,000
Speaker 1: you get to see all of it. Like you said,

1644
01:27:36,000 --> 01:27:39,120
Speaker 1: we are all in the same in the same boat here,

1645
01:27:39,800 --> 01:27:41,280
Speaker 1: So how do you see it in your spot? So

1646
01:27:41,320 --> 01:27:44,120
Speaker 1: it is very undeniable that hunters and anglers have with

1647
01:27:44,320 --> 01:27:49,280
Speaker 1: the bill and created the foundation of what we consider recreation.

1648
01:27:50,360 --> 01:27:53,280
Speaker 1: There's you can't deny that period, end of story. Whether

1649
01:27:53,320 --> 01:27:55,240
Speaker 1: it's you look in Montana and you see that we

1650
01:27:55,280 --> 01:27:59,160
Speaker 1: have fishing access sites. Those are no longer fishing access sites.

1651
01:27:59,200 --> 01:28:02,000
Speaker 1: Those are recreation and access sites. In fact, probably eighty

1652
01:28:02,040 --> 01:28:04,360
Speaker 1: percent of the people using fishing access sites that are

1653
01:28:04,360 --> 01:28:08,200
Speaker 1: funded with primarily you know, fishing dollars or whatever, the

1654
01:28:08,200 --> 01:28:12,840
Speaker 1: state whatever, their recreational users, and they don't pay in

1655
01:28:12,880 --> 01:28:16,439
Speaker 1: the system by and large. Um, And let me just

1656
01:28:16,479 --> 01:28:18,759
Speaker 1: say before we get into that, because it can sound

1657
01:28:19,680 --> 01:28:21,400
Speaker 1: I don't know, it can sound accusatory, but it's not.

1658
01:28:21,520 --> 01:28:24,479
Speaker 1: It was a fact. Fact. It's a fact because here's

1659
01:28:24,520 --> 01:28:27,000
Speaker 1: one of the biggest for me. I grew up in Montana.

1660
01:28:27,600 --> 01:28:30,160
Speaker 1: As far as I knew, there have been fishing access

1661
01:28:30,200 --> 01:28:33,320
Speaker 1: sites on our rivers since dinosaurs roamed the earth, and

1662
01:28:33,439 --> 01:28:36,639
Speaker 1: by Gali, I have a right to those and they

1663
01:28:36,680 --> 01:28:39,960
Speaker 1: will be there. And I didn't have a clue how

1664
01:28:40,000 --> 01:28:42,160
Speaker 1: they got there, who put them there, who's taking care

1665
01:28:42,200 --> 01:28:44,200
Speaker 1: of them, and who's making sure they're there. It's just

1666
01:28:44,280 --> 01:28:46,439
Speaker 1: a fact, and I think so many people just don't

1667
01:28:46,479 --> 01:28:48,880
Speaker 1: understand where it comes from. And it's they're they're just

1668
01:28:49,000 --> 01:28:51,400
Speaker 1: purely the facts. There's very few thirteen year old are like,

1669
01:28:51,400 --> 01:28:53,800
Speaker 1: you know how this gets here. Here's the excise tax

1670
01:28:53,920 --> 01:28:55,960
Speaker 1: that goes to here's the state game agy the way,

1671
01:28:56,040 --> 01:28:58,280
Speaker 1: and so there is there is this and the reason

1672
01:28:58,280 --> 01:29:00,639
Speaker 1: why I think people should get off of this topic,

1673
01:29:00,760 --> 01:29:03,599
Speaker 1: not get off of like the productive you know, economic portion,

1674
01:29:03,640 --> 01:29:05,479
Speaker 1: Who should be paying for what? And how should that

1675
01:29:05,520 --> 01:29:09,520
Speaker 1: all go into funding what needs to be funded? Um,

1676
01:29:09,560 --> 01:29:12,000
Speaker 1: just the idea of us versus them in that way

1677
01:29:12,880 --> 01:29:16,040
Speaker 1: I didn't come up with. I just kind of fell

1678
01:29:16,080 --> 01:29:19,880
Speaker 1: into our system or North American model wildlife conservation and

1679
01:29:19,920 --> 01:29:22,160
Speaker 1: how we pay for things I didn't. I don't get

1680
01:29:22,200 --> 01:29:23,960
Speaker 1: a choice. If I'd like to go hunting, I must

1681
01:29:24,000 --> 01:29:27,200
Speaker 1: pay into it, and so it's I feel like it's

1682
01:29:27,320 --> 01:29:30,400
Speaker 1: my responsibility to know as much about its history, how

1683
01:29:30,400 --> 01:29:31,760
Speaker 1: it got to be the way it is, how we

1684
01:29:31,800 --> 01:29:34,040
Speaker 1: can make it better. I feel like that's my responsibility,

1685
01:29:34,720 --> 01:29:37,000
Speaker 1: But I don't. As a hunter, you get to hold

1686
01:29:37,000 --> 01:29:38,880
Speaker 1: that up and be like, look what we did. It

1687
01:29:39,040 --> 01:29:42,720
Speaker 1: was generations ago. I mean, it has worked for our country,

1688
01:29:43,200 --> 01:29:45,920
Speaker 1: but it only works if our generation understands it and

1689
01:29:45,960 --> 01:29:48,360
Speaker 1: pushes it forward in a way that makes sense. Similar

1690
01:29:48,360 --> 01:29:52,320
Speaker 1: for the outdoor recreation folks, they didn't. They many of

1691
01:29:52,360 --> 01:29:55,439
Speaker 1: them would happily pay an excise tax, happily pay an

1692
01:29:55,439 --> 01:29:58,200
Speaker 1: excise tax and speak like that, and you know, in

1693
01:29:58,200 --> 01:30:00,639
Speaker 1: in their community and also in public. So I think

1694
01:30:00,680 --> 01:30:03,920
Speaker 1: there's the way the system is built, like you said,

1695
01:30:04,280 --> 01:30:07,920
Speaker 1: from an economic sample, in favors the contribution of hunters

1696
01:30:07,960 --> 01:30:10,519
Speaker 1: and anglers. But there's a way to fix that. And

1697
01:30:10,560 --> 01:30:12,840
Speaker 1: if your hunter an angler, you might want to think

1698
01:30:12,880 --> 01:30:15,599
Speaker 1: about there's a lot of power in what we do

1699
01:30:15,720 --> 01:30:18,280
Speaker 1: because a lot of our dollars, a lot of dollars

1700
01:30:18,280 --> 01:30:21,120
Speaker 1: for state game agencies come from hunters. Names if you

1701
01:30:21,160 --> 01:30:23,920
Speaker 1: were to dilute that with dollars from the outdoor recreation space,

1702
01:30:24,040 --> 01:30:27,200
Speaker 1: our power in those conversations would be a lot less

1703
01:30:27,320 --> 01:30:30,000
Speaker 1: and that you know, every time we'd like to ring

1704
01:30:30,000 --> 01:30:32,200
Speaker 1: that bell and say how much money we give that

1705
01:30:32,200 --> 01:30:34,920
Speaker 1: bill is not gonna be so loud. Yeah, get the

1706
01:30:34,960 --> 01:30:37,720
Speaker 1: whole power thing though. I mean again, let's elevate the conversation.

1707
01:30:37,880 --> 01:30:40,360
Speaker 1: We have everything to lose an alter game, period, end

1708
01:30:40,400 --> 01:30:42,760
Speaker 1: of story. And I am trying to absolutely put an

1709
01:30:42,800 --> 01:30:45,640
Speaker 1: end to this conversation where it's like consumpt versus non consumptive.

1710
01:30:45,680 --> 01:30:48,479
Speaker 1: I have zero tolerance for that, and I will stop

1711
01:30:48,520 --> 01:30:52,040
Speaker 1: somebody in their tracks. You consume, you are consumptive, and

1712
01:30:52,040 --> 01:30:54,920
Speaker 1: you are having an impact regardless of who you are

1713
01:30:55,040 --> 01:30:57,880
Speaker 1: or what you're doing. Period, end of story. So we

1714
01:30:57,920 --> 01:31:01,880
Speaker 1: got to stop that conversation too. And as far as that, like, yeah, absolutely,

1715
01:31:02,240 --> 01:31:05,360
Speaker 1: the outer recreation industry as a whole, there there have

1716
01:31:05,520 --> 01:31:08,679
Speaker 1: been segments that have been paying in in various different

1717
01:31:08,720 --> 01:31:12,520
Speaker 1: ways to accomplish things. And these are very old forms

1718
01:31:12,760 --> 01:31:15,920
Speaker 1: of recreation. In fact, they were just court to the

1719
01:31:15,920 --> 01:31:18,040
Speaker 1: existence of human beings at one point and it became

1720
01:31:18,240 --> 01:31:23,120
Speaker 1: you know, and so I and I work with all areas,

1721
01:31:23,120 --> 01:31:26,479
Speaker 1: whether it's motorized non motorized, whether it's hunting, fishing, or camping,

1722
01:31:26,560 --> 01:31:30,880
Speaker 1: hiking whatever, like I work with everybody and just having

1723
01:31:30,920 --> 01:31:34,240
Speaker 1: the conversation of hey, yes, this is just how it's

1724
01:31:34,240 --> 01:31:37,160
Speaker 1: been for a while. That has been very valuable, and

1725
01:31:37,360 --> 01:31:42,000
Speaker 1: extending our hands and having conversations just saying hey, like

1726
01:31:42,240 --> 01:31:44,759
Speaker 1: we are all using this, how can we all together

1727
01:31:44,920 --> 01:31:48,479
Speaker 1: support this? And I think that these conversations everyone's having

1728
01:31:48,479 --> 01:31:49,800
Speaker 1: and the work that you guys have been doing to

1729
01:31:49,920 --> 01:31:53,519
Speaker 1: have conversations are really important. And I'm here to support

1730
01:31:53,680 --> 01:31:56,400
Speaker 1: and help educate anyone what they want to do. I

1731
01:31:56,760 --> 01:32:00,880
Speaker 1: the segment of the industry that does not pay in

1732
01:32:01,080 --> 01:32:03,479
Speaker 1: like the hunting and angling, great, if they want to

1733
01:32:03,520 --> 01:32:09,080
Speaker 1: explore opportunities and figure out their own way, awesome, Let's

1734
01:32:09,200 --> 01:32:12,439
Speaker 1: let's have a conversation. Let's but you know, there is

1735
01:32:12,479 --> 01:32:15,680
Speaker 1: no silver bullet um. I don't want people to think that,

1736
01:32:15,760 --> 01:32:17,800
Speaker 1: oh you know that, oh gosh, if there was an

1737
01:32:17,800 --> 01:32:20,640
Speaker 1: exercise tax put on everybody, that it would be the

1738
01:32:20,640 --> 01:32:23,880
Speaker 1: silver bull and answer all of our problems. That's not true. Yeah,

1739
01:32:23,920 --> 01:32:25,880
Speaker 1: I'm never I never want to get on the stump

1740
01:32:25,920 --> 01:32:28,640
Speaker 1: for more taxes. I'm not. I don't do that, but

1741
01:32:28,720 --> 01:32:30,760
Speaker 1: I do. I think we can celebrate the thing we

1742
01:32:30,840 --> 01:32:34,639
Speaker 1: have right the thing that that has lasted for many

1743
01:32:35,280 --> 01:32:38,760
Speaker 1: generations now and has you know, our North American model

1744
01:32:38,760 --> 01:32:41,760
Speaker 1: of will life conservation are our American system of conservation

1745
01:32:41,800 --> 01:32:46,880
Speaker 1: funding moreover is remarkable, and it's in both its longevity

1746
01:32:46,960 --> 01:32:50,479
Speaker 1: and its value. Like we can celebrate that without without

1747
01:32:50,800 --> 01:32:53,759
Speaker 1: looking over to any group that's not in that system

1748
01:32:53,760 --> 01:32:56,320
Speaker 1: and saying, why aren't you in here? We can celebrate that.

1749
01:32:57,040 --> 01:32:59,040
Speaker 1: We can set that aside and not why aren't you

1750
01:32:59,080 --> 01:33:01,280
Speaker 1: in here? Would you link to please? We said that

1751
01:33:01,320 --> 01:33:03,120
Speaker 1: a time, like what else can we What else can

1752
01:33:03,200 --> 01:33:05,000
Speaker 1: we build? What other programs can we build that will

1753
01:33:05,040 --> 01:33:08,240
Speaker 1: be as valuable as and have the same amount of longevity?

1754
01:33:08,360 --> 01:33:10,439
Speaker 1: Is what we've already built. This thing that we've built

1755
01:33:10,439 --> 01:33:13,080
Speaker 1: all together doesn't give us the right to point fingers

1756
01:33:13,120 --> 01:33:16,040
Speaker 1: than anybody. It's the only thing it should do is

1757
01:33:16,320 --> 01:33:19,080
Speaker 1: give us the want and like the innate want to

1758
01:33:19,120 --> 01:33:21,559
Speaker 1: grow it and bring people, as you said, into it

1759
01:33:21,880 --> 01:33:23,920
Speaker 1: and find a way to give you more dollars. Not

1760
01:33:24,040 --> 01:33:25,880
Speaker 1: in doesn't have to be in the same way, doesn't

1761
01:33:25,880 --> 01:33:27,760
Speaker 1: have to be for the same things. But I mean,

1762
01:33:27,800 --> 01:33:30,200
Speaker 1: this whole fabric that we call recreation is a huge fabric,

1763
01:33:30,320 --> 01:33:32,080
Speaker 1: and there are a lot of different areas that we

1764
01:33:32,120 --> 01:33:35,000
Speaker 1: can all work on and and help with, whether it's

1765
01:33:35,080 --> 01:33:38,519
Speaker 1: manpower or money. So again doesn't have to be done

1766
01:33:38,640 --> 01:33:41,000
Speaker 1: the same way one group did. It can be owned

1767
01:33:41,000 --> 01:33:43,960
Speaker 1: and can done completely different. But you know, definitely continuing

1768
01:33:44,000 --> 01:33:47,200
Speaker 1: that conversation of how we can all, whether it's an

1769
01:33:47,240 --> 01:33:50,439
Speaker 1: individual or corporation or a state or a federal government,

1770
01:33:50,760 --> 01:33:53,519
Speaker 1: how can we do more because this is important and

1771
01:33:53,560 --> 01:33:56,479
Speaker 1: it's not just economic. It's health and well being. It's

1772
01:33:56,479 --> 01:33:58,479
Speaker 1: the health of our land, it's our health of our country.

1773
01:33:58,560 --> 01:34:04,160
Speaker 1: It's um it's this awesome like billion angles self served,

1774
01:34:04,200 --> 01:34:06,040
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, It's just good no matter

1775
01:34:06,120 --> 01:34:10,000
Speaker 1: how you look at it. Yeah, I mean, they're there.

1776
01:34:10,040 --> 01:34:11,960
Speaker 1: There's for point of fact, that's like the Outdoor Industry

1777
01:34:11,960 --> 01:34:14,280
Speaker 1: Association made up of a lot of large companies, right,

1778
01:34:14,320 --> 01:34:17,360
Speaker 1: It's made up of the Patagonia, is the Keynes, the

1779
01:34:18,200 --> 01:34:20,400
Speaker 1: on and on you go companies that you know from

1780
01:34:20,479 --> 01:34:24,680
Speaker 1: r I and things like that that that association has

1781
01:34:24,720 --> 01:34:28,720
Speaker 1: pushed back on exercise taxes in the past, similar to

1782
01:34:28,720 --> 01:34:31,120
Speaker 1: those of Pip and Robertson Dingle Johns. They in fact,

1783
01:34:31,280 --> 01:34:33,479
Speaker 1: I feel my feeling on that organization is that it

1784
01:34:33,600 --> 01:34:36,200
Speaker 1: was created in some sense to to push back I

1785
01:34:36,240 --> 01:34:39,479
Speaker 1: believe it was in the mid nineties on the original

1786
01:34:39,520 --> 01:34:44,840
Speaker 1: backpack tax legislation that was proposed. But but I don't

1787
01:34:44,880 --> 01:34:47,080
Speaker 1: agree with that part. But what I do when you

1788
01:34:47,120 --> 01:34:49,120
Speaker 1: look at that association as a whole, there's a lot

1789
01:34:49,200 --> 01:34:52,960
Speaker 1: of stuff that they do that is absolutely beneficial. Absolutely

1790
01:34:53,160 --> 01:34:55,280
Speaker 1: So you know, I've I've had a lot of conversations

1791
01:34:55,280 --> 01:34:57,639
Speaker 1: within our world of people that are aware of kind

1792
01:34:57,640 --> 01:34:59,960
Speaker 1: of those machinations that would throw the baby out with

1793
01:35:00,000 --> 01:35:03,120
Speaker 1: the bathwater. I'm not that guy. I don't believe in that,

1794
01:35:03,280 --> 01:35:06,120
Speaker 1: but I do believe that that that conversation about the

1795
01:35:06,120 --> 01:35:08,559
Speaker 1: backpack tax and what kind of excise revenue can be

1796
01:35:08,600 --> 01:35:11,040
Speaker 1: drawn away from all those goods, and and there's billions,

1797
01:35:11,120 --> 01:35:14,559
Speaker 1: billions of dollars that are being made from those goods.

1798
01:35:14,640 --> 01:35:16,400
Speaker 1: It's we need to continue to elevate that and see

1799
01:35:16,400 --> 01:35:18,960
Speaker 1: where we get um. They have there. You can go

1800
01:35:19,040 --> 01:35:22,080
Speaker 1: to the Outdoor Industries Association's website and you can read

1801
01:35:22,479 --> 01:35:25,560
Speaker 1: their reasoning for why they would would prefer not to

1802
01:35:25,560 --> 01:35:29,080
Speaker 1: to introduce any new exercise taxes. And so I would

1803
01:35:29,400 --> 01:35:31,680
Speaker 1: just encourage everybody just to go and read that and

1804
01:35:31,680 --> 01:35:34,679
Speaker 1: be aware of that, because that's that's what that's their stance.

1805
01:35:35,479 --> 01:35:37,679
Speaker 1: I don't know if I agree or not, but it's there.

1806
01:35:38,640 --> 01:35:41,160
Speaker 1: There's there's lots of different ways to help. And that's

1807
01:35:41,280 --> 01:35:43,439
Speaker 1: there's the conversation. It doesn't you don't have to do

1808
01:35:43,479 --> 01:35:45,960
Speaker 1: exactly what everyone else does. But and we've and you've

1809
01:35:45,960 --> 01:35:47,160
Speaker 1: been a part of this. I haven't a part of this.

1810
01:35:47,280 --> 01:35:49,639
Speaker 1: Cow I always you know, reference Cow when it comes

1811
01:35:49,680 --> 01:35:51,639
Speaker 1: to patagon because he has a good relationship with those guys.

1812
01:35:51,840 --> 01:35:54,200
Speaker 1: You know, we've we've seen the founder of how to

1813
01:35:54,200 --> 01:35:55,960
Speaker 1: Go and you're walking to the b h A rendezvous

1814
01:35:56,000 --> 01:35:58,720
Speaker 1: and celebrate hunters and tell them his story, and you

1815
01:35:58,720 --> 01:36:02,160
Speaker 1: know you'veon Sinnard has embrace that group and then great

1816
01:36:02,320 --> 01:36:05,479
Speaker 1: embrace its power. And so there are people out there

1817
01:36:05,520 --> 01:36:08,599
Speaker 1: with with great influence in the outdoor community that are

1818
01:36:08,640 --> 01:36:11,760
Speaker 1: walking across the line whatever if there even is one

1819
01:36:12,160 --> 01:36:14,720
Speaker 1: walking across that line. And it's so funny, like I mean,

1820
01:36:14,760 --> 01:36:17,760
Speaker 1: I remember before the first lights or you know, any

1821
01:36:17,800 --> 01:36:21,320
Speaker 1: of this, you know, all these hunting brands. I guess

1822
01:36:21,360 --> 01:36:24,639
Speaker 1: what I hunted in. I hunted in Pedagonia clothing because

1823
01:36:24,680 --> 01:36:28,000
Speaker 1: that was what there was. That's you know, it's just

1824
01:36:28,040 --> 01:36:29,680
Speaker 1: so funny too, Like now we think about it and

1825
01:36:29,720 --> 01:36:33,519
Speaker 1: it's also supposedly like divide it and everything, but I don't.

1826
01:36:33,680 --> 01:36:36,960
Speaker 1: There are no one trick ponies anymore, no every time.

1827
01:36:38,000 --> 01:36:41,240
Speaker 1: So let's let's end that, and let's kill the conversation

1828
01:36:41,240 --> 01:36:44,519
Speaker 1: about women and hunting forever forever. I mean it may

1829
01:36:44,520 --> 01:36:47,040
Speaker 1: not be forever, not forever, but for for just like

1830
01:36:47,080 --> 01:36:50,160
Speaker 1: the next couple of podcasts until another, because I feel,

1831
01:36:50,200 --> 01:36:53,400
Speaker 1: I feel there's been enough of that conversation around that

1832
01:36:53,439 --> 01:36:55,760
Speaker 1: every time I have a female in the podcast, you

1833
01:36:55,760 --> 01:36:57,679
Speaker 1: almost have to talk about it. And I hate that feeling.

1834
01:36:58,120 --> 01:37:00,160
Speaker 1: I hate that feeling. I don't I don't want to.

1835
01:37:00,400 --> 01:37:03,439
Speaker 1: It's pandering, it's bullshit. I hate it. But it's there

1836
01:37:03,439 --> 01:37:06,760
Speaker 1: in the air for sure. So you know, you're have

1837
01:37:06,800 --> 01:37:08,640
Speaker 1: You've been in the industry, very successful, You've done a

1838
01:37:08,640 --> 01:37:11,240
Speaker 1: lot of cool shit. It doesn't matter if you're female

1839
01:37:11,320 --> 01:37:15,240
Speaker 1: or miserable, don't matter. All that matters is, uh, what

1840
01:37:15,400 --> 01:37:19,559
Speaker 1: you got inside, Like, it doesn't matter if you're female

1841
01:37:19,640 --> 01:37:22,880
Speaker 1: or male, what you got you know what I mean,

1842
01:37:22,920 --> 01:37:27,000
Speaker 1: That's just that's what dictates like where you go. It

1843
01:37:27,040 --> 01:37:28,400
Speaker 1: is annoying to you as it is to me to

1844
01:37:28,439 --> 01:37:31,479
Speaker 1: have to to think about these things, but well it's

1845
01:37:31,520 --> 01:37:34,000
Speaker 1: annoying to me in the sense that I don't think

1846
01:37:34,040 --> 01:37:37,200
Speaker 1: about it because I don't. I haven't spent a lot

1847
01:37:37,240 --> 01:37:41,960
Speaker 1: of time. But it's I'm a product of being in hunting,

1848
01:37:42,080 --> 01:37:44,360
Speaker 1: as most men are a product of being in hunting.

1849
01:37:44,840 --> 01:37:47,360
Speaker 1: I am an only I'm an only child for all

1850
01:37:47,400 --> 01:37:49,720
Speaker 1: intensive purposes, I am a girl. I grew up in

1851
01:37:49,720 --> 01:37:53,320
Speaker 1: a hunting family. Like no one's business. Hunting is what

1852
01:37:53,400 --> 01:37:56,800
Speaker 1: you do. It's not a which you'll like to do this.

1853
01:37:57,560 --> 01:37:59,840
Speaker 1: It's like you have no memory of not doing it.

1854
01:38:00,479 --> 01:38:03,400
Speaker 1: I was butchering animals when I was too young to

1855
01:38:03,439 --> 01:38:05,280
Speaker 1: be given a sharp knife and cutting you know what

1856
01:38:05,360 --> 01:38:08,720
Speaker 1: I mean. Like, it's just I so, and I was

1857
01:38:08,840 --> 01:38:11,080
Speaker 1: never put in a situation, and I was never put

1858
01:38:11,120 --> 01:38:13,840
Speaker 1: in a situation where someone said girls don't do that.

1859
01:38:14,680 --> 01:38:17,840
Speaker 1: I just never. It wasn't until I was in high

1860
01:38:17,840 --> 01:38:19,320
Speaker 1: school that all of a sudden people are like, oh,

1861
01:38:19,360 --> 01:38:22,080
Speaker 1: you hunt, and be like, well, yeah, like it kind

1862
01:38:22,080 --> 01:38:24,880
Speaker 1: of didn't think about you know, So I just so,

1863
01:38:24,960 --> 01:38:28,120
Speaker 1: I don't have the same perspective that the vast majority

1864
01:38:28,160 --> 01:38:30,360
Speaker 1: of women do. Come in here, so it is harder

1865
01:38:30,400 --> 01:38:32,120
Speaker 1: for me to it is harder for me to think

1866
01:38:32,160 --> 01:38:34,439
Speaker 1: about it. And but I get it, and I'm like

1867
01:38:34,520 --> 01:38:37,040
Speaker 1: open to hearing, you know, whatever there's to say about it,

1868
01:38:37,080 --> 01:38:40,880
Speaker 1: but I just so unfortunately it's it's hard for me

1869
01:38:41,000 --> 01:38:45,080
Speaker 1: to put myself, yeah, in any other space. It seems

1870
01:38:45,080 --> 01:38:46,760
Speaker 1: like we have It's like the conversations you have to

1871
01:38:46,800 --> 01:38:48,719
Speaker 1: have because you want to make sure every it's equal

1872
01:38:48,760 --> 01:38:51,440
Speaker 1: footing for everyone. You want to make sure everybody feels

1873
01:38:51,640 --> 01:38:54,519
Speaker 1: welcome and is welcome. Of course they are welcome, Like

1874
01:38:54,640 --> 01:38:56,360
Speaker 1: you want to do that, but you don't want to

1875
01:38:56,439 --> 01:38:58,479
Speaker 1: artificially create that, you know, you don't want to pand

1876
01:38:58,560 --> 01:39:00,800
Speaker 1: or you want to generalize someone's mode ovations. You don't

1877
01:39:00,800 --> 01:39:02,519
Speaker 1: want to, Like you said, your motivation get in the

1878
01:39:02,520 --> 01:39:05,439
Speaker 1: honey was the same as mine. My dad hunted and

1879
01:39:05,760 --> 01:39:08,040
Speaker 1: that's what we did. If I didn't do that, it

1880
01:39:08,080 --> 01:39:10,599
Speaker 1: would have been boring. It is, but again it's just

1881
01:39:10,800 --> 01:39:14,120
Speaker 1: you know, perhaps like it just I don't know if

1882
01:39:14,120 --> 01:39:16,280
Speaker 1: I tried to get into motorsports, if I tried to

1883
01:39:16,280 --> 01:39:19,720
Speaker 1: get into motorcycle writing, what kind of experience would I have?

1884
01:39:19,960 --> 01:39:21,880
Speaker 1: You know, Like I have two boys, and one is

1885
01:39:21,960 --> 01:39:24,360
Speaker 1: just a rabbit about he's going to be a motorcycle

1886
01:39:24,400 --> 01:39:26,559
Speaker 1: like dirt by Grater, And I'm like, oh my God,

1887
01:39:26,560 --> 01:39:28,200
Speaker 1: that means that I need to go and be on

1888
01:39:28,240 --> 01:39:29,960
Speaker 1: a motorcycle, you know what I mean. Like, so, okay,

1889
01:39:30,000 --> 01:39:33,240
Speaker 1: there's a different experience, but um no, it's everybody is welcome.

1890
01:39:33,280 --> 01:39:36,799
Speaker 1: And the cool part is is I mean I feel

1891
01:39:36,800 --> 01:39:39,240
Speaker 1: like I've I haven't moved on. I'm still can be

1892
01:39:39,479 --> 01:39:41,600
Speaker 1: you know, a little self righteous or whatever. But you

1893
01:39:41,600 --> 01:39:43,200
Speaker 1: know when you move behind it and you're like, dude,

1894
01:39:43,880 --> 01:39:46,200
Speaker 1: you can have this experience anyway you want to serve

1895
01:39:46,200 --> 01:39:49,559
Speaker 1: it up. It's awesome. No one has to tell you

1896
01:39:49,720 --> 01:39:52,759
Speaker 1: how to have this experience. You can write your own book.

1897
01:39:53,640 --> 01:39:56,679
Speaker 1: Um there, there is no just because you've seen something

1898
01:39:56,720 --> 01:39:59,479
Speaker 1: a certain way does not mean that it can't be

1899
01:39:59,560 --> 01:40:03,800
Speaker 1: your way. It's and you know, however, we can communicate that.

1900
01:40:03,920 --> 01:40:06,559
Speaker 1: Come on in, do it how you want to do it. Communicate.

1901
01:40:07,640 --> 01:40:10,160
Speaker 1: That's exactly how I can think. And the most important

1902
01:40:10,200 --> 01:40:14,000
Speaker 1: part is and I and I'm I'm saddened that you know,

1903
01:40:14,080 --> 01:40:16,320
Speaker 1: maybe the invitation needs to be made, but man, there

1904
01:40:16,360 --> 01:40:19,200
Speaker 1: is an invitation. It is a standing invitation. It's nice.

1905
01:40:19,240 --> 01:40:23,120
Speaker 1: It's very nice to see marketing featuring women because it

1906
01:40:23,320 --> 01:40:25,479
Speaker 1: wasn't always that way. So it's nice, but that's normal

1907
01:40:25,520 --> 01:40:27,000
Speaker 1: now it's not like I don't. I don't look at

1908
01:40:27,000 --> 01:40:30,600
Speaker 1: that like cool, that's nice. It's like, oh yeah, another know,

1909
01:40:30,600 --> 01:40:32,240
Speaker 1: another cool piece of gear for some way to wear.

1910
01:40:32,320 --> 01:40:35,240
Speaker 1: That's a great I remember putting the first Timber advertisement

1911
01:40:35,320 --> 01:40:38,240
Speaker 1: for rifles hunting rifles together with a woman in It's

1912
01:40:38,280 --> 01:40:41,760
Speaker 1: a remarkable picture of this just badass chick who is

1913
01:40:41,800 --> 01:40:44,080
Speaker 1: a hunter. And she was up in Alaska and she

1914
01:40:44,240 --> 01:40:49,320
Speaker 1: was in chest deep snow covered brush like trudging through

1915
01:40:49,920 --> 01:40:52,760
Speaker 1: and like holding her rifle up as she's like going

1916
01:40:52,760 --> 01:40:55,120
Speaker 1: through all of this. And I do remember if you

1917
01:40:55,120 --> 01:40:57,439
Speaker 1: you know, the guys in the room saying, oh, if

1918
01:40:57,439 --> 01:40:59,120
Speaker 1: it's a woman in the picture, it's not going to

1919
01:40:59,160 --> 01:41:02,080
Speaker 1: mean men won't want to buy it, just like this

1920
01:41:02,120 --> 01:41:04,120
Speaker 1: man is more or this woman is more badass, you

1921
01:41:04,200 --> 01:41:06,960
Speaker 1: know what I mean? Like so um, But now it's

1922
01:41:07,000 --> 01:41:09,760
Speaker 1: just not even no one even bats an eye on it.

1923
01:41:09,880 --> 01:41:11,880
Speaker 1: So I do see the shift. I don't. And I've

1924
01:41:12,120 --> 01:41:14,880
Speaker 1: run into many women that could walk me up and

1925
01:41:14,880 --> 01:41:17,160
Speaker 1: down the mountain, and I could, like you know, Rachel

1926
01:41:17,200 --> 01:41:19,280
Speaker 1: Attila and Glenn to Groad and people that I have have

1927
01:41:19,400 --> 01:41:22,360
Speaker 1: hunted with up north that they lived the life. It

1928
01:41:22,360 --> 01:41:25,599
Speaker 1: doesn't matter their leaders in their community, like their leaders

1929
01:41:25,600 --> 01:41:27,479
Speaker 1: in the hunting community. There are people that are to

1930
01:41:27,560 --> 01:41:29,400
Speaker 1: be looked up, to be looked up to, so it

1931
01:41:29,400 --> 01:41:32,160
Speaker 1: doesn't I mean, then that's there. I'm envious of their

1932
01:41:32,160 --> 01:41:34,599
Speaker 1: relationship with horses. I just don't get along with horses

1933
01:41:34,640 --> 01:41:36,479
Speaker 1: like they do, and I always are just like God,

1934
01:41:36,600 --> 01:41:38,800
Speaker 1: love it. I didn't grow up around horses really at

1935
01:41:38,800 --> 01:41:40,920
Speaker 1: all either. I did a little bit, and I've just

1936
01:41:41,080 --> 01:41:45,720
Speaker 1: always been in arguments with them. I just not enough

1937
01:41:45,760 --> 01:41:49,760
Speaker 1: good experiences. It's not good. All right, Well, we better

1938
01:41:49,800 --> 01:41:53,320
Speaker 1: get back to Wena, have lunch, um, and then you're

1939
01:41:53,320 --> 01:41:56,559
Speaker 1: gonna get back to promoting out their recreation state of Montana. Yeah.

1940
01:41:56,560 --> 01:41:59,840
Speaker 1: I headed out the door, headed to Missoula, another fantastic towned.

1941
01:42:00,000 --> 01:42:02,720
Speaker 1: I love Missoulough. It's even the proximity of public lands

1942
01:42:02,800 --> 01:42:05,320
Speaker 1: is even better than it is here. Emboza. If you

1943
01:42:05,360 --> 01:42:08,759
Speaker 1: can ever believe that, I feel it's we're just lucky people.

1944
01:42:09,040 --> 01:42:11,960
Speaker 1: We are. We're very lucky people. Well, thanks for rage. Yeah,

1945
01:42:12,000 --> 01:42:14,599
Speaker 1: thanks for having me on to chat any time about

1946
01:42:14,680 --> 01:42:18,080
Speaker 1: any of these goodies. They're all good topics. Thanks for

1947
01:42:18,720 --> 01:42:22,040
Speaker 1: Like I said, I had a few heavy podcasts in

1948
01:42:22,040 --> 01:42:29,599
Speaker 1: a row, so I feel sometimes your performances is just like,

1949
01:42:29,680 --> 01:42:31,840
Speaker 1: it's just like baseball. Sometimes you hit a home run,

1950
01:42:31,920 --> 01:42:35,719
Speaker 1: sometimes you just well, hey, outer recreation is an awesome,

1951
01:42:35,800 --> 01:42:38,040
Speaker 1: good light topic. And you carried this is what I'm

1952
01:42:38,040 --> 01:42:40,200
Speaker 1: trying to tell you. Hey, I'm here for you. You

1953
01:42:40,280 --> 01:42:48,280
Speaker 1: carried this, You carried me, and I appreciate that anytime. Bye.

1954
01:42:48,840 --> 01:42:54,280
Speaker 1: I guess that's all Episode seventy six in the books.

1955
01:42:54,920 --> 01:42:57,680
Speaker 1: Thank you all for following me along, Thank you all

1956
01:42:57,720 --> 01:43:00,880
Speaker 1: for writing in your emails and your calm sense about

1957
01:43:00,960 --> 01:43:05,240
Speaker 1: last week's episode. We're great talking about William Perry Penley.

1958
01:43:05,280 --> 01:43:07,800
Speaker 1: Some of you were a little off put by our

1959
01:43:08,760 --> 01:43:11,120
Speaker 1: making fun of his appearance. Others thought it was hilarious.

1960
01:43:11,160 --> 01:43:13,559
Speaker 1: So I think that just shows you where we are

1961
01:43:13,640 --> 01:43:16,160
Speaker 1: in our society. Some people love a thing, some people don't.

1962
01:43:16,600 --> 01:43:19,120
Speaker 1: I will say that I enjoyed the conversation. I take

1963
01:43:19,160 --> 01:43:21,240
Speaker 1: it seriously, but also wanted to have a little fun

1964
01:43:21,840 --> 01:43:24,120
Speaker 1: with that conversation. So if you haven't listened, go back

1965
01:43:24,120 --> 01:43:25,680
Speaker 1: and listen and let us know which think at th

1966
01:43:25,880 --> 01:43:27,960
Speaker 1: h C at the meat eater dot com. That's th

1967
01:43:28,160 --> 01:43:31,280
Speaker 1: h C at the meat eater dot com. Keep sending

1968
01:43:31,360 --> 01:43:36,200
Speaker 1: in your audio clips and all that stuff. Again, I

1969
01:43:36,200 --> 01:43:38,960
Speaker 1: want to reiterate because there's not it's not that often

1970
01:43:38,960 --> 01:43:42,720
Speaker 1: that there's big fat sales over at first light dot com.

1971
01:43:42,760 --> 01:43:44,679
Speaker 1: But if you listen to the opening this show, you'll

1972
01:43:44,680 --> 01:43:47,599
Speaker 1: know that there is a two thousand nineteen harvest flash

1973
01:43:47,640 --> 01:43:51,400
Speaker 1: sale over there this Tuesday and Wednesday of next week,

1974
01:43:51,880 --> 01:43:55,000
Speaker 1: September three and fourth. So you go over there, there's

1975
01:43:55,320 --> 01:43:57,640
Speaker 1: a myriad of discounts of all shapes and sizes and

1976
01:43:57,680 --> 01:44:00,439
Speaker 1: all types of heeter um. All women is gear. If

1977
01:44:00,479 --> 01:44:04,120
Speaker 1: you're out there, ladies is discounted. So just as a

1978
01:44:04,160 --> 01:44:06,600
Speaker 1: public service announcement once again, let me cover off on

1979
01:44:06,760 --> 01:44:09,800
Speaker 1: that you should go first leg dot com September three

1980
01:44:09,880 --> 01:44:13,120
Speaker 1: and four. So, however, you have to remind yourself, set

1981
01:44:13,200 --> 01:44:16,439
Speaker 1: something up on your calendar, set of phone alarm, tell

1982
01:44:16,560 --> 01:44:19,360
Speaker 1: your wife, tell your kids, tell your brother, tell your mother.

1983
01:44:20,360 --> 01:44:22,519
Speaker 1: That's the time where you're gonna have some savings over

1984
01:44:22,680 --> 01:44:24,960
Speaker 1: first late dot com. And when you're done with that

1985
01:44:25,040 --> 01:44:26,720
Speaker 1: and you're still in buying mood, go over to the

1986
01:44:26,720 --> 01:44:29,599
Speaker 1: meat Eater dot com and head up all the THC

1987
01:44:29,840 --> 01:44:34,880
Speaker 1: merch pro nuanced anti bullshit shirts. There's the auto Freaking

1988
01:44:34,960 --> 01:44:39,040
Speaker 1: Loop old shirt. There is logo hoodies, logo hats, all

1989
01:44:39,120 --> 01:44:41,599
Speaker 1: kinds of stuff, and then when you're there, you're gonna

1990
01:44:41,640 --> 01:44:45,519
Speaker 1: be right in front of all the media to merch everything.

1991
01:44:45,520 --> 01:44:47,519
Speaker 1: Steve Ronell has ever come up with some stuff for

1992
01:44:47,600 --> 01:44:52,080
Speaker 1: old cal Ryan Callahan and everything else. We make here

1993
01:44:52,560 --> 01:44:54,760
Speaker 1: a meat eater. The only other public service announced that

1994
01:44:54,800 --> 01:44:56,960
Speaker 1: I have is that you should be watching doss Boat.

1995
01:44:57,120 --> 01:45:01,679
Speaker 1: Toss Boat is uh in production of our new mediator

1996
01:45:01,720 --> 01:45:04,080
Speaker 1: fishing Department run by my man Miles and Olte. You

1997
01:45:04,360 --> 01:45:07,479
Speaker 1: heard last week on the show he's running doss Boat,

1998
01:45:07,760 --> 01:45:10,760
Speaker 1: which is a series that's on YouTube right now. The

1999
01:45:10,840 --> 01:45:14,120
Speaker 1: first two episodes are up, the third one coming this week,

2000
01:45:14,240 --> 01:45:16,439
Speaker 1: and they're more to follow. And so if you're not

2001
01:45:16,479 --> 01:45:20,120
Speaker 1: subscribe to our YouTube channel, go subscribe to it and follow.

2002
01:45:20,760 --> 01:45:23,040
Speaker 1: You're gonna enjoy it. It's a great show. Some of

2003
01:45:23,040 --> 01:45:26,200
Speaker 1: my favorite anglers are on there, including j T, van

2004
01:45:26,280 --> 01:45:30,559
Speaker 1: ZANDT including Alvin Dido and Jesse Griffiths, who can cook

2005
01:45:30,640 --> 01:45:33,920
Speaker 1: up a mean anything really, So go over there and

2006
01:45:33,960 --> 01:45:38,439
Speaker 1: watch that. Thanks for listening to all those. Please go

2007
01:45:38,560 --> 01:45:41,800
Speaker 1: out there and have a good weekend. September is coming,

2008
01:45:42,240 --> 01:45:45,560
Speaker 1: get ready and we'll see you next week. TC. Thank you.

2009
01:45:45,960 --> 01:45:51,440
Speaker 1: Jack Daniels Number seven, Tennessee Whiskey got me drinking heaven

2010
01:45:51,560 --> 01:45:54,920
Speaker 1: and and just stopped to look good to me. They're

2011
01:45:54,920 --> 01:46:01,719
Speaker 1: gonna have to department to the pardy. Oh, the Fiery

2012
01:46:01,840 --> 01:46:08,440
Speaker 1: D can drinking in the far Dah. On the Fiery

2013
01:46:08,560 --> 01:46:22,160
Speaker 1: d drinking in heaven be Dodd St.