WEBVTT - Believe in Yourself (with Brandi Carlile and André De Shields) 0:00:00.680 --> 0:00:03.680 You and Me Both is a production of I Heart Radio. 0:00:06.000 --> 0:00:09.320 I'm Hillary Clinton, and this is You and Me Both. 0:00:10.200 --> 0:00:13.040 Believe in yourself. You know, it's a piece of advice 0:00:13.119 --> 0:00:15.880 we hear a lot, but for many of us, it 0:00:15.960 --> 0:00:19.480 takes years, if not a lifetime, to actually get there. 0:00:20.239 --> 0:00:24.240 And then there are those rare folks, immensely talented and 0:00:24.440 --> 0:00:38.920 hard working, who somehow always knew that they would be somebody. Today, 0:00:38.960 --> 0:00:41.720 I have the pleasure of speaking with two people who 0:00:41.760 --> 0:00:45.840 believed in themselves from the get go. Later we'll hear 0:00:45.920 --> 0:00:52.040 from the incredibly talented actor, director, and choreographer Andre de Shields. 0:00:52.680 --> 0:00:57.800 But first I'm talking to multiple Grammy Award winning singer 0:00:57.960 --> 0:01:03.520 and songwriter Brandy Carlisle. I first discovered Brandy back in 0:01:04.640 --> 0:01:08.440 when she performed her song The Joke at the Grammy Awards. 0:01:09.319 --> 0:01:13.880 That year, she was nominated four six, yes six Grammys 0:01:14.360 --> 0:01:18.399 for her album By the Way I Forgive You. I 0:01:18.400 --> 0:01:21.399 immediately tracked down as much of her music as I could, 0:01:21.560 --> 0:01:25.200 and I've been a fan ever since. Brandy grew up 0:01:25.240 --> 0:01:29.600 in rural Washington State with very young parents who struggled 0:01:29.640 --> 0:01:33.240 to make a living and provide a stable home, but 0:01:33.360 --> 0:01:36.720 she was also surrounded by a lot of love and 0:01:36.920 --> 0:01:40.920 a lot of music. She's drawn on those roots to 0:01:41.040 --> 0:01:45.039 build a beautiful family of her own with her wife 0:01:45.120 --> 0:01:50.840 Catherine and their two daughters, Evangeline and Elijah. Brandy writes 0:01:50.880 --> 0:01:54.280 about all of this in her memoir titled Broken Horses, 0:01:54.920 --> 0:01:58.000 and that's where I wanted to start our conversation by 0:01:58.120 --> 0:02:02.280 asking her what it was like to pull up those memories, 0:02:02.400 --> 0:02:08.359 the good, the bad, the wonderful and right this incredibly open, 0:02:08.560 --> 0:02:13.440 revealing and compelling book. I had always kind of mind 0:02:13.560 --> 0:02:16.239 my past for experience and songwriting and things like that, 0:02:16.840 --> 0:02:19.959 but just in a little random bursts without the detail, 0:02:20.080 --> 0:02:22.200 you know. But when I actually really sat down and 0:02:22.280 --> 0:02:25.760 kind of meditated on it, everything came back smells and 0:02:25.840 --> 0:02:29.679 floral prints on couches and you know, whatever vehicle we 0:02:29.800 --> 0:02:32.600 happened to have at that time, and just my childhood 0:02:32.639 --> 0:02:35.959 became really clear and really vivid, and it poured out 0:02:35.960 --> 0:02:38.600 of me. I didn't hesitate. I didn't worry about what 0:02:38.639 --> 0:02:41.000 I was saying about mom or Dad or you know, 0:02:41.080 --> 0:02:42.960 my brother and sister, or the way that we lived 0:02:43.040 --> 0:02:45.480 or what was going on and our lives at that time. 0:02:45.520 --> 0:02:47.280 I didn't think about embarrassment because I think in the 0:02:47.320 --> 0:02:48.920 back of my mind, I knew I could always go 0:02:48.919 --> 0:02:52.240 and take anything out, I could edit anything, and then 0:02:52.240 --> 0:02:56.320 I just didn't from what I read um not only 0:02:56.320 --> 0:03:01.440 about your parents, but your grandparents aunts uncle's. Yeah, there 0:03:01.480 --> 0:03:03.600 was a lot of love, there was a lot of fun, 0:03:04.000 --> 0:03:07.760 and there was a lot of unpredictability, instability and chaos. 0:03:08.880 --> 0:03:12.560 That's true. How would you describe your mom and your dad? 0:03:12.800 --> 0:03:16.880 You emphasize how young they were. Yeah, they were, and 0:03:17.280 --> 0:03:19.919 in some ways and that I mean, this is a compliment. 0:03:19.960 --> 0:03:24.520 Are very young, and there's an energy about them and 0:03:24.560 --> 0:03:29.639 that endless opportunities for adventure and fun and honestly mostly chaos. 0:03:30.880 --> 0:03:34.240 There was always this kind of undercurrent of like, well, 0:03:34.280 --> 0:03:36.440 we're different and we don't have to do things the 0:03:36.480 --> 0:03:38.960 way other people do them. And it was like a 0:03:39.000 --> 0:03:41.480 little bit like that film, you know, Captain Fantastic. There 0:03:41.520 --> 0:03:44.560 was a lot of late night discussion and I was 0:03:44.600 --> 0:03:46.240 privy to a lot of things that I don't know 0:03:46.280 --> 0:03:48.200 if I needed to be privy to. But I was 0:03:48.240 --> 0:03:52.280 also given great wisdom and insight at a really young age, 0:03:52.400 --> 0:03:55.440 and for some reason, I just feel like I knew 0:03:55.440 --> 0:03:59.120 what to do with it, and that kind of narrative 0:03:59.120 --> 0:04:02.120 of like we're different, it we live different was what 0:04:02.320 --> 0:04:04.600 made not being at the same schools or having a 0:04:04.640 --> 0:04:07.320 lot of different houses, or a little bit of upheaval 0:04:08.400 --> 0:04:10.560 not just okay, but what I thought would be a 0:04:10.640 --> 0:04:15.280 preferable way to grow up. And looking back on it, 0:04:15.320 --> 0:04:17.200 I don't know that. I don't feel that way now. 0:04:17.760 --> 0:04:20.440 I feel a pull all the time to raise my 0:04:20.520 --> 0:04:22.920 kids eccentrically with a little bit of chaos, a little 0:04:22.920 --> 0:04:24.599 bit of spontaneity, a little bit and we don't know 0:04:24.680 --> 0:04:28.440 what's going to happen. And um my wife makes me resistant. 0:04:30.040 --> 0:04:32.120 But I don't want to leave your childhood yet because 0:04:32.160 --> 0:04:37.440 you also describe the very serious illness you had as 0:04:37.440 --> 0:04:41.280 what a four year old? Can you talk about that? Yeah, 0:04:41.279 --> 0:04:46.080 when I was four years old, I contracted meninji kockumaningitis 0:04:46.640 --> 0:04:50.600 and presented as really, really sick. But my mother was 0:04:50.839 --> 0:04:52.919 really young, I want to say, like twenty at the time, 0:04:53.800 --> 0:04:56.280 and I knew right away that something was wrong. But 0:04:56.520 --> 0:04:58.160 she was the kind of mom where she thought something 0:04:58.240 --> 0:05:00.320 was wrong all the time. You know, she had the 0:05:00.480 --> 0:05:02.640 speed dial if they even had that, you know, in 0:05:02.720 --> 0:05:08.680 night what would two four nurse? And she told my 0:05:08.760 --> 0:05:11.000 dad that something was really wrong, and you know, he 0:05:11.040 --> 0:05:13.719 didn't believe her, and my mom was on the phone 0:05:13.760 --> 0:05:16.520 with two four nurse and two foreign nurse asked my 0:05:16.560 --> 0:05:18.400 mom to have me touch my chin to my chest, 0:05:18.400 --> 0:05:20.880 which I guess is like the telltale sign that somebody 0:05:20.880 --> 0:05:23.800 could have meningitis, and it made me pass out and 0:05:23.839 --> 0:05:26.640 I just remember waking up in the backseat of the 0:05:26.640 --> 0:05:29.719 car on my way to the emergency room and wound 0:05:29.760 --> 0:05:32.160 up being in the hospital in a coma for um 0:05:32.320 --> 0:05:35.160 quite some time before I came to and didn't get 0:05:35.160 --> 0:05:39.440 out of there until after my fifth birthday, and um, 0:05:39.520 --> 0:05:42.080 there's still a bit of trauma, I think for both 0:05:42.080 --> 0:05:45.400 my parents, but mostly I think my mother about thinking 0:05:45.400 --> 0:05:47.719 that I wasn't going to pull through that, and it 0:05:47.760 --> 0:05:51.599 gave me a sense of specialness. You know, I was 0:05:51.600 --> 0:05:54.520 the first grandchild on both sides of the family, and 0:05:54.520 --> 0:05:57.320 and everybody had this kind of Brandy's got a mission thing, 0:05:57.440 --> 0:05:59.720 and it gave me a quite inflated sense of selving. 0:06:02.480 --> 0:06:06.839 What was your earliest memory of making or listening to music, 0:06:06.920 --> 0:06:09.320 because the other part of the book, which I love 0:06:09.400 --> 0:06:13.480 is that you had a somewhat musical family, and I 0:06:13.520 --> 0:06:16.359 see pictures in the book of you as a really 0:06:16.480 --> 0:06:20.240 little kid, all dressed up, You're on stage, you're singing. 0:06:20.279 --> 0:06:23.640 What are your earliest memories. There's music on both sides 0:06:23.640 --> 0:06:26.840 of my family, country music and blue grass mostly. My 0:06:26.920 --> 0:06:32.080 dad's father played dobro and followed blue grass bands around 0:06:32.400 --> 0:06:34.400 in his RV, and I didn't get to spend much 0:06:34.400 --> 0:06:38.080 time with him musically. He was a quiet guy that 0:06:38.320 --> 0:06:40.640 you know. But on my mom's side of the family, 0:06:40.920 --> 0:06:43.320 her dad was a cigar salesman and a country music 0:06:43.360 --> 0:06:46.960 singer and yodeler, and he was a very outward personality, 0:06:47.360 --> 0:06:49.880 big influence that I think about in here in my 0:06:49.920 --> 0:06:51.920 head all the time to this day. But he died 0:06:51.920 --> 0:06:54.359 really young, of a l s which is the worst 0:06:55.560 --> 0:06:59.080 season the world. And uh, when he died, kind of 0:06:59.120 --> 0:07:01.080 the last thing he in, whether he knew it or not, 0:07:01.320 --> 0:07:05.360 was light a fire in my mother to continue on 0:07:05.600 --> 0:07:07.880 the music. And she did. She took all that grief 0:07:08.120 --> 0:07:10.560 and that little bit of money and got a p 0:07:10.720 --> 0:07:15.560 a system and put together a band and started singing 0:07:15.720 --> 0:07:19.360 and thought to include me and my brother. And so 0:07:19.440 --> 0:07:21.080 I was like seven or eight years old the first 0:07:21.120 --> 0:07:24.000 time I got on stage and sang a Roseanne Cash song. 0:07:24.120 --> 0:07:26.920 Tennessee flat top box at this place called the Northwest 0:07:26.920 --> 0:07:29.080 grand Ole Opry And I just want to be a cowgirl. 0:07:30.320 --> 0:07:33.960 I love that. Well. I also really love your mother's 0:07:33.960 --> 0:07:37.440 gutsiness that she got that p a system and put 0:07:37.440 --> 0:07:40.680 herself up there. That is really making yourself vulnerable. And 0:07:40.800 --> 0:07:44.640 I think it's another real tribute to her as a 0:07:44.760 --> 0:07:47.680 mom that she knew to include you. Yeah, and she 0:07:47.800 --> 0:07:51.080 was really good. She looked great, huge hair, you know, 0:07:51.280 --> 0:07:53.960 she fixed my hair and put our clothes together and everything, 0:07:54.000 --> 0:07:56.560 and she just yeah, she'd always tell me she'd be 0:07:56.560 --> 0:07:58.480 sit in the front or I just going move, Brandy, 0:07:58.520 --> 0:08:01.000 move your body, stop wrapping them cord around your hand. 0:08:01.520 --> 0:08:07.560 Oh god, we're taking a quick break. Stay with us. 0:08:17.040 --> 0:08:20.840 The other thing about your upbringing is that you know 0:08:21.040 --> 0:08:26.000 you grew up in a religious family and a religious community. Um. 0:08:26.000 --> 0:08:32.280 And I really like the way that faith and spirituality 0:08:32.920 --> 0:08:37.920 run through your story like yours. Yeah, like mine exactly, 0:08:37.960 --> 0:08:43.120 and how it evolves. And it was so touching to 0:08:43.240 --> 0:08:49.760 me and heartbreaking to read your description about a pastor 0:08:49.920 --> 0:08:54.320 refusing to baptize you. I guess because he knew you 0:08:54.360 --> 0:09:00.440 were gay and insisted that you renounce, literally renounce your self. 0:09:00.520 --> 0:09:04.040 In order to be baptized, and you rightly refused to 0:09:04.080 --> 0:09:06.560 do that. Can you tell that story? Yeah, he really 0:09:06.640 --> 0:09:09.240 knew I was gay. Like That's really one of the 0:09:09.240 --> 0:09:12.760 hardest nuances about that stories, that he really knew I 0:09:12.800 --> 0:09:15.679 was gay. Like I was totally unapologetic about it. I 0:09:15.760 --> 0:09:18.280 presented that way. I brought my little girlfriend to church 0:09:18.559 --> 0:09:23.720 for some reason. I don't know why. I didn't expect that. Um, 0:09:23.840 --> 0:09:26.120 it was in the sermons, it was in the subtext. 0:09:26.720 --> 0:09:28.760 You know, I did have a sense of audacity that 0:09:28.920 --> 0:09:32.840 I can't I would love to reconnect with actually, um, 0:09:32.880 --> 0:09:35.120 but yeah he did. And there was like a well, 0:09:35.160 --> 0:09:37.920 the Baptists are very big by the way on public 0:09:37.960 --> 0:09:43.800 declarations converting to possible public humiliation. And I already liked 0:09:43.840 --> 0:09:46.640 being on stage. So you know, I went up to 0:09:46.679 --> 0:09:48.559 the front of the church and on one Sunday and 0:09:48.600 --> 0:09:52.400 said I'd like to be baptized, was applauded and hugged 0:09:52.440 --> 0:09:55.319 and given a schedule of you know, going to lunch 0:09:55.320 --> 0:09:57.319 with the pastor and learning the things I need to 0:09:57.400 --> 0:10:00.840 learn in the scriptures and understanding what going to take place, 0:10:01.120 --> 0:10:04.439 inviting people, and then got to the church that day 0:10:04.480 --> 0:10:07.480 to be baptized. And our talent and our family and 0:10:07.480 --> 0:10:09.720 our friends kind of filled the church. And the pastor 0:10:10.800 --> 0:10:13.400 at the last minute asked me, which was I thought 0:10:13.440 --> 0:10:18.360 was really strange, asked me if I, quote unquote practiced homosexuality, 0:10:19.520 --> 0:10:21.640 and I just remember this furrowed brow looking at him. 0:10:21.679 --> 0:10:23.680 I said, you know, I'm I'm gay. I'm coming to 0:10:23.760 --> 0:10:25.440 church with my girlfriend, you know, and that we go 0:10:25.600 --> 0:10:27.920 we go into pizza Hut yesterday, like you know, you know, 0:10:28.559 --> 0:10:30.760 and chose that moment to tell me that he wasn't 0:10:30.800 --> 0:10:32.320 going to baptize me. And I had to kind of 0:10:32.400 --> 0:10:34.959 run out the church in front of everyone. And it's 0:10:34.960 --> 0:10:40.600 probably one of the biggest humiliations in my life. Without 0:10:40.600 --> 0:10:43.800 trying to wrap it up into a attractive box and 0:10:43.840 --> 0:10:47.920 say that everything's fine now, without that experience, I wouldn't 0:10:47.960 --> 0:10:51.320 have known how much support actually had, how upset the 0:10:51.360 --> 0:10:54.000 people that came to see that happen for me. We're 0:10:54.320 --> 0:10:58.400 help set, my dad was, and I always felt I 0:10:58.480 --> 0:11:01.280 was kind of gay ninety is accepted, you know, kind 0:11:01.280 --> 0:11:03.240 of like we accept this, but don't put it into 0:11:03.280 --> 0:11:07.200 our face kind of thing. Until that day and everybody 0:11:07.240 --> 0:11:10.720 becoming so upset, I felt, you know, more seen in 0:11:10.760 --> 0:11:13.160 that way than I ever had before, also more rejected 0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:16.320 than I ever had before. But um, it pushed me 0:11:16.400 --> 0:11:20.079 into another life that I needed to be pushed into. 0:11:20.880 --> 0:11:24.840 But also from that time forward, you really threw yourself 0:11:24.880 --> 0:11:29.120 into your music. And thinking back to being put on 0:11:29.160 --> 0:11:32.880 the stage as this, you know, little girl, three decades 0:11:33.200 --> 0:11:37.880 of performing and of writing, how has your relationship to 0:11:38.160 --> 0:11:43.520 music evolved over that period of time. Well, I don't know. 0:11:43.559 --> 0:11:46.040 I mean, I think that's the moment that music became 0:11:46.080 --> 0:11:50.280 mine and I just I had to really separate my 0:11:50.320 --> 0:11:53.520 soul from some things, you know, And so I started 0:11:53.520 --> 0:11:58.240 getting interested in getting on airplane. I started getting interested 0:11:58.400 --> 0:12:01.880 in going to a big city, meeting different kinds of people, 0:12:02.280 --> 0:12:05.959 and less and less interested in country music. I remember 0:12:05.960 --> 0:12:10.920 that night of my botched baptism. I call it putting 0:12:11.320 --> 0:12:15.520 my little CD player Jeff Buckley's Grace on repeat on Hallelujah, 0:12:15.559 --> 0:12:18.040 just over and over and over and over again, and 0:12:18.880 --> 0:12:22.000 occurring to me like I want to leave, and I 0:12:22.040 --> 0:12:23.560 want to write. I want to write a song like this. 0:12:23.600 --> 0:12:27.720 I don't care if it's a twelve minute song, a 0:12:27.760 --> 0:12:32.200 longer song for a longer story. But I also love 0:12:32.280 --> 0:12:37.960 the way that you found some extraordinary music icons that 0:12:38.400 --> 0:12:43.920 became mentors. I mean the kind of relationship that you 0:12:44.080 --> 0:12:47.760 describe with Alton John from a far, far distance. There 0:12:47.800 --> 0:12:51.600 you are in Washington State, Alton's you know, in England 0:12:51.760 --> 0:12:55.520 or Atlanta or wherever you might be, and you are 0:12:55.640 --> 0:13:00.360 discovering this extraordinary human being, to say nothing of his 0:13:01.120 --> 0:13:04.560 you know, almost cosmic talent. I fall in love with 0:13:04.600 --> 0:13:07.840 Elton John over a six fifth sixth grade book report 0:13:08.120 --> 0:13:11.920 about Ryan White, never hearing a note. I loved him 0:13:11.960 --> 0:13:17.200 because of his contribution to this boy's life. Who died 0:13:17.280 --> 0:13:20.439 I think it was it's in the nineties. He died 0:13:20.480 --> 0:13:23.640 of AIDS. He had hemophilia. He contracted AIDS through a 0:13:23.640 --> 0:13:26.160 blood transfusion. I did a book report on him in school. 0:13:26.160 --> 0:13:28.360 I chose the book myself. You didn't even know what 0:13:28.400 --> 0:13:30.680 the book was about. I just saw a cute boy 0:13:31.360 --> 0:13:32.800 on the book and I picked it up in the 0:13:32.800 --> 0:13:35.079 school library and I did a book report. And in 0:13:35.120 --> 0:13:38.000 the end of the book, he befriends this British gay 0:13:38.080 --> 0:13:41.520 rock star. He's being politicized, He's being asked to become 0:13:41.520 --> 0:13:45.320 the poster child for the church as a person affected 0:13:45.360 --> 0:13:47.920 by you know, sin in the world created by home 0:13:47.960 --> 0:13:50.959 sexual men. And this was a subtext that I had 0:13:51.000 --> 0:13:53.800 been taught in church, and was was thinking about this 0:13:53.920 --> 0:13:55.720 and talking about this a lot in my own home. 0:13:56.679 --> 0:14:00.679 And here's this new perspective in a book the God. 0:14:00.920 --> 0:14:03.320 And in the end he meets this rock star, and 0:14:03.320 --> 0:14:04.760 this rock star has got a couple of songs that 0:14:04.800 --> 0:14:06.440 are mentioned in the book, and he sings a song 0:14:06.480 --> 0:14:09.800 at this kid's funeral called Skyline Pigeon. And I went 0:14:09.840 --> 0:14:12.840 to the King County Library and checked out the CD 0:14:12.960 --> 0:14:15.200 here and now Elton John c D a couple other 0:14:15.200 --> 0:14:17.280 Elton John c ds in a book by Philip Norman 0:14:17.280 --> 0:14:20.600 Elton John, Elton John, and I dove into this rock star. 0:14:20.640 --> 0:14:22.280 And before I ever heard him saying, I was already 0:14:22.280 --> 0:14:24.960 obsessed with him. And then I heard Skyline Pigeon. And 0:14:25.000 --> 0:14:26.800 then I heard Funeral for a friend and Benny and 0:14:26.840 --> 0:14:30.280 the Jets, and I just I went in to everything 0:14:30.320 --> 0:14:33.160 Elton John. By the time I was like fourteen, there 0:14:33.200 --> 0:14:35.240 wasn't a square inch of my bedroom walls that weren't 0:14:35.240 --> 0:14:40.960 covered with Elton John memorabilia. I made homemade Elton John jewelry, 0:14:41.200 --> 0:14:45.160 and um I began playing piano. My parents got me 0:14:45.200 --> 0:14:49.120 an eighty dollar toys, rus Cassio keyboard and totally changed 0:14:49.120 --> 0:14:51.960 my life. And yeah, now he's like, he's my friend, 0:14:53.040 --> 0:14:56.440 he is your friend. But Ryan White died in nineteen nine, 0:14:56.960 --> 0:15:03.120 and he had such a an amazing effect on so 0:15:03.280 --> 0:15:07.120 many people. You know, there eventually was a piece of legislation, 0:15:07.200 --> 0:15:11.640 the Ryan White Act, to provide more support resources for 0:15:11.720 --> 0:15:17.320 people living with HIV AIDS, and Alton just connected so 0:15:18.360 --> 0:15:22.480 immediately with this, you know, young boy from Indiana. But 0:15:22.640 --> 0:15:27.200 neither Ryan nor his mother ever allowed people if they 0:15:27.200 --> 0:15:31.160 could stop it using them in a negative way. I mean, 0:15:31.920 --> 0:15:37.040 they were bighearted, they were open minded. And I want 0:15:37.040 --> 0:15:40.320 to just make one other point. You got that book 0:15:40.360 --> 0:15:44.840 about Ryan White in your school library. There are people 0:15:45.640 --> 0:15:48.280 right now who want to take a book like that 0:15:48.480 --> 0:15:53.600 out of public school libraries. You know, impressionable children shouldn't 0:15:53.640 --> 0:15:56.920 be learning about Ryan White. You know, it's just another 0:15:57.320 --> 0:16:01.560 perfect example among countless examples of why, you know, we 0:16:01.680 --> 0:16:04.400 have to stand up for the right of kids to 0:16:04.840 --> 0:16:07.840 you know, seek out and find information, and obviously your 0:16:07.840 --> 0:16:10.840 school library is one of the best ways to do that. 0:16:11.280 --> 0:16:13.800 When and how did you finally meet Elton in person? 0:16:14.040 --> 0:16:16.960 First of all, that's a really really good point. And 0:16:17.280 --> 0:16:19.400 books like that that I had access to in my 0:16:19.440 --> 0:16:21.520 school sculpted a lot of things about my life. And 0:16:21.560 --> 0:16:24.000 that's just one of the many that gave me, you know, 0:16:24.160 --> 0:16:27.760 the worldview that propelled me forward in really really big ways. 0:16:28.680 --> 0:16:30.760 I love that you made that point. What was this 0:16:30.800 --> 0:16:33.200 was the second question? So when and where did you 0:16:33.240 --> 0:16:37.040 meet Elton? Okay? So I met Elton, just like you'd 0:16:37.080 --> 0:16:41.120 hope I would, in a Las Vegas casino basement recording studio. 0:16:44.080 --> 0:16:46.080 He called me like ten years prior to that, or 0:16:46.280 --> 0:16:47.920 it gives me five years prior to that when I 0:16:47.920 --> 0:16:50.240 put out put out the story, but I hadn't met 0:16:50.280 --> 0:16:52.000 him yet, and I always wanted to meet him. I 0:16:52.000 --> 0:16:54.000 wrote him a letter when I made my album give 0:16:54.080 --> 0:16:56.400 Up the Ghost and asked him to play piano in 0:16:56.440 --> 0:16:58.880 one of my songs, and he just he called me 0:16:58.960 --> 0:17:01.080 up and said, yeah, can you get to Vegas? So 0:17:01.320 --> 0:17:04.879 I did, and I just never forget it because I 0:17:04.880 --> 0:17:07.040 remember coming down this corridor and I could hear him 0:17:07.040 --> 0:17:11.200 talking and I had all of the every live VHS 0:17:11.280 --> 0:17:14.280 tape that he had ever recorded, every interview, and I'm like, 0:17:14.320 --> 0:17:16.600 oh my god, that's Elton. I'm gonna walk around the 0:17:16.600 --> 0:17:20.080 corner and I'm gonna see Elton John sitting there, And 0:17:20.160 --> 0:17:22.040 I did, and he was sitting there in a track suit, 0:17:22.080 --> 0:17:24.240 and he just gave me an enormous hug and then 0:17:24.280 --> 0:17:26.480 stayed with me all day for four hours, just talk 0:17:26.520 --> 0:17:29.720 to me about music. Just gave me everything that I 0:17:29.720 --> 0:17:33.160 could have ever hoped to be given by meeting my 0:17:33.480 --> 0:17:36.720 very worthy hero. By the time I got home, he'd 0:17:36.720 --> 0:17:43.360 sent me a hundred CDs with sticky notes. Oh, talk 0:17:43.440 --> 0:17:46.639 about the day that you found out you were the 0:17:46.680 --> 0:17:51.280 most nominated woman of the nineteen Grammys. Described that because 0:17:51.400 --> 0:17:54.080 to me, it just blended so much about what your 0:17:54.119 --> 0:17:57.159 life is like right now. I mean it was the 0:17:57.160 --> 0:17:58.959 middle of the night because we're on the West Coast, 0:17:59.359 --> 0:18:03.280 and I just the phone call that from relative obscurity 0:18:03.280 --> 0:18:07.560 in terms of the Grammys, I have been nominated for 0:18:07.680 --> 0:18:10.640 six of them, and I was just in total disbelief. 0:18:10.680 --> 0:18:12.600 I knew it was going to be a watershed moment. 0:18:12.600 --> 0:18:14.800 I knew it was going to change my life, and 0:18:14.880 --> 0:18:18.040 it really did. It was my my publicistant friend, Osha, 0:18:18.119 --> 0:18:20.439 She's just like they just kept saying your name. You know. 0:18:20.920 --> 0:18:22.679 I wasn't even awake. It was pitch dark, and I 0:18:22.680 --> 0:18:25.280 woke up everybody in my house. And but you know, 0:18:25.640 --> 0:18:29.080 I mean, you know because you're a Grammy winner, right, Yeah, 0:18:29.200 --> 0:18:32.280 that's right for the spoken word, that's true. Where's your 0:18:32.280 --> 0:18:34.520 brily I'm looking for in the background. I don't see it. 0:18:35.600 --> 0:18:41.080 I have it in our our library. It's part of history. Okay, Well, 0:18:41.119 --> 0:18:43.679 before we go, I have to ask you. I know 0:18:43.760 --> 0:18:47.560 you love fishing, and you know you you write in 0:18:47.600 --> 0:18:51.840 the book nothing's really ever got ahold of me the 0:18:51.880 --> 0:18:58.680 way fishing and music cab. Okay, what is the biggest 0:18:58.760 --> 0:19:02.240 fish you've ever caught? And was it the same feeling 0:19:02.280 --> 0:19:05.119 you had when you got all those Grammys? It was 0:19:05.160 --> 0:19:10.000 the same feeling, I mean nearly identical, because, as I 0:19:10.040 --> 0:19:13.800 said in the book, fishing is merely an attempt to 0:19:13.840 --> 0:19:15.879 connect to something that you know is there but but 0:19:16.040 --> 0:19:21.000 can't see a perpetual series of occasions for hope. The 0:19:21.000 --> 0:19:25.040 biggest fish I ever caught was in Alaska on the 0:19:25.119 --> 0:19:29.520 Kenai River. It's a forty three pound king salmon. That's 0:19:29.560 --> 0:19:32.840 one big fish. You know. I've actually fished for salmon 0:19:33.480 --> 0:19:38.840 in Alaska and those fish are big. They are big, 0:19:39.800 --> 0:19:42.359 and they're delicious too. Did they pack your fish and 0:19:42.400 --> 0:19:44.520 prepare it so that you could go and eat it later. 0:19:44.640 --> 0:19:49.679 I prepared it. You prepare it, no, girl, But you 0:19:49.720 --> 0:19:53.119 know something about that. Huh. Oh my gosh. But I 0:19:53.160 --> 0:19:55.840 also love I mean your your definition of fishing is 0:19:55.880 --> 0:19:58.720 almost like a perfect definition of faith. I'm gonna I'm 0:19:58.720 --> 0:20:00.960 gonna remember that. I think that that's exactly what I 0:20:01.040 --> 0:20:04.840 parallel it with. Well, Brandy Carlisle, I cannot thank you enough. 0:20:04.880 --> 0:20:08.400 This was such a true delight. Do you have any 0:20:08.480 --> 0:20:12.320 parting words or any yeah I singing words or anything 0:20:12.359 --> 0:20:14.320 you want to leave us with. I cannot tell you 0:20:14.320 --> 0:20:17.919 how much talking to you today has has meant to me. 0:20:18.160 --> 0:20:20.520 And I almost can't do anything else for the rest 0:20:20.560 --> 0:20:22.840 of the day now. I just I think that you 0:20:22.880 --> 0:20:25.359 are such a special person. You're such a gift to 0:20:25.400 --> 0:20:27.600 the world. You've been a gift in my life. You 0:20:27.600 --> 0:20:29.919 know the song we keep skimming over, the joke that 0:20:30.000 --> 0:20:33.200 I sang at the Grammys. I wrote that first line 0:20:33.240 --> 0:20:36.879 in the second verse about you. Oh I'm getting over 0:20:36.960 --> 0:20:41.040 a colt, So I'm gonna do my best. You get discouraged, 0:20:41.240 --> 0:20:46.640 don't you. Girl. It's your brother's world for a little while, longer, 0:20:48.560 --> 0:20:53.680 a little while, just a little while, not too much 0:20:54.080 --> 0:21:05.280 Thank you, Thank You. Randy Carlyle's memoir is Broken Horses. 0:21:07.840 --> 0:21:11.320 One of my favorite shows on Broadway in recent years 0:21:11.640 --> 0:21:16.920 is the Tony Award winning Best Musical Hades Town. In 0:21:16.920 --> 0:21:22.040 this modern retelling of Orpheus and Eriticy, the character of 0:21:22.080 --> 0:21:26.960 Herme's messenger to the gods carries us through the entire show, 0:21:27.600 --> 0:21:30.960 and who better to play a god than the larger 0:21:31.000 --> 0:21:36.560 than life personality Andrea de Shields. Following a shutdown during 0:21:36.560 --> 0:21:41.040 the pandemic, Hades Town is up and running again with 0:21:41.119 --> 0:21:44.880 Andrea at the Helm. But this is just the latest 0:21:44.960 --> 0:21:50.800 chapter in his long and glorious history. At age seventy six, 0:21:51.400 --> 0:21:56.400 Andre has been performing in the theater for over fifty years, 0:21:57.000 --> 0:22:01.560 starting with his professional debut in the hit rock musical 0:22:01.720 --> 0:22:06.240 Hair back in nineteen sixty nine and I hate to 0:22:06.280 --> 0:22:10.200 tell you that I actually saw it way back then. 0:22:11.000 --> 0:22:14.600 But since then he's appeared on film and TV and 0:22:14.640 --> 0:22:19.280 in more musicals like The Whiz and Ain't Misbehavior. Three 0:22:19.320 --> 0:22:24.360 Tony Award nominations and one win later, He's truly a 0:22:24.440 --> 0:22:28.679 living legend of the stage. Andre was born in the 0:22:28.760 --> 0:22:32.840 nineteen forties and grew up in Baltimore as the ninth 0:22:33.119 --> 0:22:37.560 of eleven siblings. His mother was a domestic worker, his 0:22:37.720 --> 0:22:41.640 father was a tailor. The stories he tells of how 0:22:41.680 --> 0:22:47.080 he got from there to hear always believing in himself 0:22:47.160 --> 0:22:52.000 along the way, or an inspiration to anyone with a 0:22:52.119 --> 0:22:56.119 dream of making it, of making something that you really 0:22:56.160 --> 0:22:59.560 can be proud of. I was so delighted to speak 0:22:59.600 --> 0:23:04.920 with him. Good morning, Oh, good morning. I love your 0:23:05.119 --> 0:23:10.240 red background. Wow. We may not know this, it's my aura. 0:23:10.720 --> 0:23:15.639 I can understand that, my friend. You know, I was privileged, 0:23:15.720 --> 0:23:18.399 as you know, to see you in Hades Town for 0:23:18.480 --> 0:23:24.000 which you won a Tony in as you marked your 0:23:24.359 --> 0:23:29.320 fiftieth anniversary of working on the stage. And I want 0:23:29.320 --> 0:23:31.360 to go back to the beginning because I want our 0:23:31.400 --> 0:23:35.080 listeners to have a little idea of where you know 0:23:35.160 --> 0:23:39.560 you come from, what your roots are. I think it's 0:23:39.600 --> 0:23:42.600 really a great American story, but it's more a tribute 0:23:42.640 --> 0:23:46.439 to your energy and your resilience and your determination in 0:23:46.480 --> 0:23:49.080 your aura. So what type of kid were you? Andre? 0:23:49.760 --> 0:23:54.720 Were you shy? Were you somebody who liked attention? I 0:23:54.760 --> 0:23:57.719 know you were one of eleven kids. My roots are 0:23:57.720 --> 0:24:03.080 in Baltimore, Maryland, and I would not describe myself as shy, 0:24:03.480 --> 0:24:10.040 m I would describe myself as secretly ambitious. I come 0:24:10.119 --> 0:24:17.960 from meager beginnings and that was my impetus to achieve. 0:24:19.160 --> 0:24:22.320 There were very few of us who lived in the 0:24:22.359 --> 0:24:27.359 inner most of the inner cities in Baltimore who dared 0:24:27.560 --> 0:24:32.280 to dream. We were not encouraged to dream. We were 0:24:32.320 --> 0:24:36.760 not encouraged to be ambitious. We were not encouraged to 0:24:36.960 --> 0:24:41.359