WEBVTT - Jim's Grill [5]

0:00:00.360 --> 0:00:03.240
<v Speaker 1>Welcome to the MLK Tapes, a production of I Heart

0:00:03.320 --> 0:00:07.040
<v Speaker 1>Radio and Tenderfoot TV. The views and opinions expressed in

0:00:07.120 --> 0:00:10.159
<v Speaker 1>this podcast are solely those of the podcast author for

0:00:10.320 --> 0:00:14.000
<v Speaker 1>individuals participating in the podcast, and do not represent those

0:00:14.040 --> 0:00:18.439
<v Speaker 1>of I Heart Media, Tenderfoot TV, or their employees. Listener

0:00:18.480 --> 0:00:25.560
<v Speaker 1>discretion is advised. He looked like he had stuck his

0:00:25.640 --> 0:00:29.520
<v Speaker 1>friend in his socket. Lord however, standing up and even

0:00:29.600 --> 0:00:32.159
<v Speaker 1>like somebody had drained all the good his body. He

0:00:32.280 --> 0:00:35.880
<v Speaker 1>was so white. Oh, he was so Whitey. He ain't

0:00:35.880 --> 0:00:38.120
<v Speaker 1>been on his knee. How do you know he's been

0:00:38.159 --> 0:00:39.960
<v Speaker 1>on I know he had been on his knee and

0:00:40.000 --> 0:00:43.120
<v Speaker 1>coast the ground with that, because one the ground was

0:00:43.159 --> 0:00:46.360
<v Speaker 1>down and he's in his knees was dirty. And when

0:00:46.360 --> 0:00:49.600
<v Speaker 1>he came in there and went behind the counting and

0:00:49.880 --> 0:00:53.280
<v Speaker 1>uh put the gun on account it was a brand

0:00:53.280 --> 0:00:58.400
<v Speaker 1>new trick. Black. The para was black, but it was

0:00:58.440 --> 0:01:02.880
<v Speaker 1>shy lack. It been wax the hamlet of the dal brown. Yeah,

0:01:02.920 --> 0:01:08.520
<v Speaker 1>he's black, ditap was? This is Betty Spates telling Attorney

0:01:08.560 --> 0:01:11.839
<v Speaker 1>William Pepper that just moments after Martin Luther King was shot,

0:01:12.280 --> 0:01:14.760
<v Speaker 1>she saw a man she knew come running in the

0:01:14.800 --> 0:01:18.400
<v Speaker 1>back door with a smoking rifle. Betty was working as

0:01:18.400 --> 0:01:21.360
<v Speaker 1>a waitress at Jim's Grill on South Main Street, the

0:01:21.440 --> 0:01:23.920
<v Speaker 1>back door to which opened onto a brush covered yard

0:01:24.240 --> 0:01:27.560
<v Speaker 1>directly opposite the room at the Lorraine Motel where Dr

0:01:27.680 --> 0:01:31.360
<v Speaker 1>King was staying. The grille was owned by Lloyd Jowers,

0:01:31.400 --> 0:01:35.480
<v Speaker 1>and he and Betty had an ongoing sexual relationship. Lloyd

0:01:35.600 --> 0:01:44.880
<v Speaker 1>was white, Betty was black and she was seventeen. I

0:01:45.040 --> 0:01:48.520
<v Speaker 1>call the Union Hall, says matter of life and death.

0:01:49.160 --> 0:01:51.600
<v Speaker 1>I said, I thank these people are planning to kill

0:01:51.760 --> 0:01:56.200
<v Speaker 1>Dr King. The authorities were parade all we found a

0:01:56.480 --> 0:01:59.400
<v Speaker 1>gun the James al Ray board in Birmingham that killed

0:01:59.480 --> 0:02:03.800
<v Speaker 1>Dr King. Except it wasn't the gun that killed Dr Key.

0:02:04.320 --> 0:02:10.760
<v Speaker 1>James Lvey was upon or the official story from My

0:02:10.840 --> 0:02:14.519
<v Speaker 1>Heart Radio in Tender for TV. The plan was to

0:02:15.480 --> 0:02:18.960
<v Speaker 1>get King to the city because they wanted it handled

0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:22.440
<v Speaker 1>in Memphis. Were dead in incl Hamlet, and I've lived

0:02:22.440 --> 0:02:25.760
<v Speaker 1>with it along my sire, and they they scared for me.

0:02:26.280 --> 0:02:29.280
<v Speaker 1>The Lord told me to not the word. I've been

0:02:29.360 --> 0:02:32.280
<v Speaker 1>wanting to tell it all my life. I'm Bill Claiburg

0:02:33.160 --> 0:02:47.680
<v Speaker 1>and this is the MLK tapes. At the time of

0:02:47.680 --> 0:02:51.000
<v Speaker 1>his conversation with Betty SPADs. Bill Pepper had been working

0:02:51.040 --> 0:02:53.800
<v Speaker 1>on the King murder for over a decade, but he

0:02:53.840 --> 0:02:57.120
<v Speaker 1>had been representing James Earl Ray as his attorney for

0:02:57.200 --> 0:03:00.480
<v Speaker 1>just a few years, and that only after he's satisfied

0:03:00.520 --> 0:03:05.000
<v Speaker 1>himself that Raisin folvement was not voluntary. Although the official

0:03:05.120 --> 0:03:07.520
<v Speaker 1>version of the crime had the fatal shot coming from

0:03:07.520 --> 0:03:11.160
<v Speaker 1>the bathroom window above Jim's grill, there were people who

0:03:11.160 --> 0:03:14.480
<v Speaker 1>thought the shot had come from the yard below the bathroom.

0:03:14.520 --> 0:03:17.200
<v Speaker 1>The best access to this yard was by way of

0:03:17.240 --> 0:03:19.840
<v Speaker 1>the back door of the grill, and of course nothing

0:03:19.880 --> 0:03:22.799
<v Speaker 1>could have happened through that door without the cooperation of

0:03:22.840 --> 0:03:25.960
<v Speaker 1>the grill's owner, Lloyd Jowers, so he was always on

0:03:26.000 --> 0:03:30.120
<v Speaker 1>Bill Pepper's suspect list. Showers was in the frame right

0:03:30.160 --> 0:03:32.440
<v Speaker 1>from the beginning because he was the one who ran

0:03:32.600 --> 0:03:37.960
<v Speaker 1>Jim's grill. He owned it, and he ran it, and

0:03:38.200 --> 0:03:43.440
<v Speaker 1>he clearly had some role to play, which which eventually

0:03:44.240 --> 0:03:50.280
<v Speaker 1>started to become defined by Betty's spades. When I eventually

0:03:50.360 --> 0:03:53.040
<v Speaker 1>was able to get her to talk. What brought you

0:03:53.080 --> 0:03:56.720
<v Speaker 1>to Betty space, I guess it's local People said that

0:03:56.920 --> 0:04:02.680
<v Speaker 1>Showers girlfriend was was Betty's face, since she worked part

0:04:02.760 --> 0:04:06.440
<v Speaker 1>time for him and her sister worked also in the grill,

0:04:06.600 --> 0:04:10.560
<v Speaker 1>and so I started talking to them. Betty was not

0:04:10.720 --> 0:04:16.240
<v Speaker 1>willing to disclose anything, uh that was going to incriminate

0:04:16.320 --> 0:04:18.800
<v Speaker 1>Lloyd for quite a long period of time because she

0:04:18.920 --> 0:04:23.279
<v Speaker 1>actually thought Lloyd was the shooter who did the shooting,

0:04:23.320 --> 0:04:28.120
<v Speaker 1>because she saw him carrying the rifle smoking rifle into

0:04:28.560 --> 0:04:32.839
<v Speaker 1>into the kitchen. Lloyd kept her under wraps to the

0:04:32.920 --> 0:04:36.719
<v Speaker 1>extent that he could. Lloyd Jowers had grown up in

0:04:36.839 --> 0:04:40.440
<v Speaker 1>rural Dyersboro, Tennessee, and after his discharge from the Navy,

0:04:40.760 --> 0:04:45.599
<v Speaker 1>he came to Memphis in newly married to his first wife, Dorothy.

0:04:45.920 --> 0:04:48.000
<v Speaker 1>With no training at all, he got a job as

0:04:48.000 --> 0:04:51.120
<v Speaker 1>a Memphis police officer. This was back in the day

0:04:51.320 --> 0:04:54.840
<v Speaker 1>when Edwin Hull Crump, better known as Boss Crump, ran

0:04:54.960 --> 0:04:58.760
<v Speaker 1>most everything in and around Memphis. Here's what Jowers said

0:04:59.000 --> 0:05:11.440
<v Speaker 1>at nine civil trial. The audio quality is so poor

0:05:11.760 --> 0:05:15.600
<v Speaker 1>we've taken the liberty of using a voice actor. Crump

0:05:15.640 --> 0:05:17.920
<v Speaker 1>is the one who got me the job. I went

0:05:17.960 --> 0:05:20.800
<v Speaker 1>in to see him on a Monday, and on Thursday,

0:05:20.800 --> 0:05:23.240
<v Speaker 1>I was riding a squad car with the thirty eight

0:05:23.279 --> 0:05:26.159
<v Speaker 1>hanging on my side. That is the way things operated

0:05:26.200 --> 0:05:30.320
<v Speaker 1>back then. Now Johnny Barger was my partner. He's the

0:05:30.320 --> 0:05:33.280
<v Speaker 1>one who introduced me to Frank Liberto. They were real

0:05:33.360 --> 0:05:36.599
<v Speaker 1>good friends. Of course, I gotta be pretty good friends

0:05:36.600 --> 0:05:39.320
<v Speaker 1>with Frank myself, because he could do you a lot

0:05:39.400 --> 0:05:44.600
<v Speaker 1>of good in Memphis, especially if you're with police. Policemen

0:05:44.600 --> 0:05:48.039
<v Speaker 1>were often seen stopping by Frank Liberto's produce market, but

0:05:48.120 --> 0:05:50.799
<v Speaker 1>they were rarely seen coming out with lettuce or tomatoes.

0:05:51.360 --> 0:05:53.680
<v Speaker 1>Word was the cops would do favors for Frank and

0:05:53.720 --> 0:05:56.119
<v Speaker 1>his friends, and he would make sure there was something

0:05:56.200 --> 0:05:59.320
<v Speaker 1>in it for them. In those days, getting a job

0:05:59.360 --> 0:06:01.640
<v Speaker 1>as a cop was easy enough if you were white,

0:06:02.120 --> 0:06:04.799
<v Speaker 1>but the pay was bad, so after a few years,

0:06:04.920 --> 0:06:07.279
<v Speaker 1>Jowers quit the police and began working for a local

0:06:07.320 --> 0:06:11.080
<v Speaker 1>cab company. Around the same time, Jowers also quit his

0:06:11.160 --> 0:06:14.760
<v Speaker 1>marriage with Dorothy and soon married another woman. That marriage

0:06:14.839 --> 0:06:17.920
<v Speaker 1>also ended in divorce. In a short while after that,

0:06:18.240 --> 0:06:20.880
<v Speaker 1>he married his first wife, Dorothy for a second time.

0:06:21.680 --> 0:06:25.520
<v Speaker 1>In nineteen sixty seven, Jowers bought Jim's grill, and he

0:06:25.640 --> 0:06:28.840
<v Speaker 1>hired two sisters, Bobby and Betty, to cook and service

0:06:28.880 --> 0:06:33.240
<v Speaker 1>waitresses for decades. Jowers had said that the afternoon King

0:06:33.279 --> 0:06:36.360
<v Speaker 1>was shot, he was working the tables by himself, and

0:06:36.400 --> 0:06:41.920
<v Speaker 1>that Betty Space was not there when actually knowed when

0:06:41.920 --> 0:06:48.360
<v Speaker 1>off I was gone a bellers all headed about head

0:06:48.400 --> 0:06:52.039
<v Speaker 1>gone and went off and quit. I went back to

0:06:52.080 --> 0:06:57.000
<v Speaker 1>the kitchen door like I was in the kitchen. I

0:06:57.040 --> 0:06:59.080
<v Speaker 1>looked inside of the kitchen when I was there, ill

0:06:59.240 --> 0:07:05.280
<v Speaker 1>going back to finished all there. Jowers told this his

0:07:05.360 --> 0:07:08.920
<v Speaker 1>standard story to Bill Pepper as part of an extensive

0:07:09.000 --> 0:07:14.240
<v Speaker 1>legal deposition he was required to give. In in the

0:07:14.320 --> 0:07:17.960
<v Speaker 1>nineteen nineties, things regarding the murder of Martin Luther King

0:07:18.000 --> 0:07:21.720
<v Speaker 1>were playing out in different venues on TV, in the

0:07:21.800 --> 0:07:25.080
<v Speaker 1>Office of the Attorney General, with a Shelby County grand jury,

0:07:25.120 --> 0:07:28.760
<v Speaker 1>and eventually in the States court system. The trigger for

0:07:28.800 --> 0:07:34.080
<v Speaker 1>all this was the mock trial, televised on HBO, which

0:07:34.120 --> 0:07:38.680
<v Speaker 1>brought together lawyers, a real judge, and an impartial jury, which,

0:07:38.760 --> 0:07:42.120
<v Speaker 1>after hearing evidence from both sides, found James Earl Ray

0:07:42.280 --> 0:07:46.600
<v Speaker 1>not guilty of murdering Martin Luther King. Lloyd Jowers testified

0:07:46.640 --> 0:07:49.400
<v Speaker 1>at this trial, but he didn't say much beyond what

0:07:49.480 --> 0:07:52.800
<v Speaker 1>you just heard. Pepper started to ask Jowers if he

0:07:52.840 --> 0:07:55.480
<v Speaker 1>had played any role in the murder of King, but

0:07:55.560 --> 0:07:59.600
<v Speaker 1>the judge scolded him and disallowed the question. I had

0:08:00.000 --> 0:08:05.440
<v Speaker 1>a number of altercations with Judge Frankel, who was was

0:08:05.560 --> 0:08:10.760
<v Speaker 1>known as a fairly conservative United States District Court judge

0:08:10.760 --> 0:08:13.920
<v Speaker 1>when he was on the court. He started off with

0:08:13.960 --> 0:08:18.120
<v Speaker 1>a degree of skepticism that waned as we went on

0:08:18.280 --> 0:08:21.840
<v Speaker 1>with the trial. I think he began to accept that

0:08:22.920 --> 0:08:26.560
<v Speaker 1>there was an actual case being made before him that

0:08:26.720 --> 0:08:30.960
<v Speaker 1>he didn't have any idea about. Pepper had good reason

0:08:31.000 --> 0:08:34.520
<v Speaker 1>to ask Jowers about his involvement because Betty Spates had

0:08:34.559 --> 0:08:37.440
<v Speaker 1>recently confessed to him that she had seen Jours with

0:08:37.480 --> 0:08:42.040
<v Speaker 1>a smoking gun. After trying for two or three years,

0:08:42.080 --> 0:08:44.960
<v Speaker 1>eventually got her to tell me what had happened that

0:08:45.120 --> 0:08:49.880
<v Speaker 1>afternoon with respect to Lloyd Jowers looking for him. Think

0:08:49.960 --> 0:08:52.560
<v Speaker 1>he was playing around with some women out in the bushes,

0:08:53.400 --> 0:08:58.040
<v Speaker 1>and she going into the grille, seeing the kitchen door closed,

0:08:58.640 --> 0:09:02.959
<v Speaker 1>which was unusual, but then seeing the back door open,

0:09:03.480 --> 0:09:07.199
<v Speaker 1>which also was unusual. So she went to the back door,

0:09:07.360 --> 0:09:11.840
<v Speaker 1>and on our way there she heard the shot. And

0:09:11.880 --> 0:09:15.520
<v Speaker 1>as she got to the back door, already here comes

0:09:15.559 --> 0:09:19.880
<v Speaker 1>Lloyd running in with the rifle still smoking, and him

0:09:19.920 --> 0:09:23.720
<v Speaker 1>as white as a sheet, and he brushes past her,

0:09:24.360 --> 0:09:27.720
<v Speaker 1>starts to break down the rifle and said to her.

0:09:28.160 --> 0:09:30.520
<v Speaker 1>He would never do anything to hurt me, Betty, would you?

0:09:31.120 --> 0:09:34.319
<v Speaker 1>She said, no, of course not. Then he wrapped it

0:09:34.600 --> 0:09:38.120
<v Speaker 1>the rifle put it on a shelf, where eventually he

0:09:38.160 --> 0:09:42.760
<v Speaker 1>showed it to McGraw, his friend, and a local taxi driver.

0:09:44.040 --> 0:09:47.520
<v Speaker 1>Betty's Spates was scheduled to testify the mock trial, but

0:09:47.600 --> 0:09:51.520
<v Speaker 1>she became frightened and didn't show. But Jowers may have

0:09:51.559 --> 0:09:54.959
<v Speaker 1>heard that she had been called, and perhaps this unnerved him,

0:09:55.480 --> 0:09:59.400
<v Speaker 1>for when he was under oath at his deposition, he

0:09:59.520 --> 0:10:03.439
<v Speaker 1>lied the simplest things. Was he aware Bill Pepper asked

0:10:03.440 --> 0:10:06.240
<v Speaker 1>that doctor King was coming to town? No, he hadn't

0:10:06.280 --> 0:10:09.200
<v Speaker 1>heard a thing about that. Did he have any contact

0:10:09.200 --> 0:10:12.199
<v Speaker 1>with a guy named Frank Liberto, No, none at all.

0:10:12.960 --> 0:10:15.840
<v Speaker 1>Had Betty Space worked at the grill that day? No,

0:10:16.000 --> 0:10:19.400
<v Speaker 1>not that day. Had he had a romantic relationship with

0:10:19.440 --> 0:10:24.440
<v Speaker 1>Betty Spaces, No, he hadn't. Pepper patiently plotted through his

0:10:24.559 --> 0:10:29.720
<v Speaker 1>questions without challenging jowers most obvious lies. None of it

0:10:29.760 --> 0:10:33.720
<v Speaker 1>made any sense. Why would you Owers, under oath revert

0:10:33.800 --> 0:10:36.640
<v Speaker 1>to his former see no evil here, no evil approach

0:10:36.679 --> 0:10:40.120
<v Speaker 1>to the killing of King, when just months before he

0:10:40.160 --> 0:10:43.960
<v Speaker 1>had been on national TV on ABC Prime Time with

0:10:44.000 --> 0:10:47.280
<v Speaker 1>Sam Donaldson, where he had confessed to having played a

0:10:47.400 --> 0:10:50.800
<v Speaker 1>role in this very murder. Did James Earl Ray killed

0:10:50.880 --> 0:10:54.200
<v Speaker 1>Dr Martin Luther King? No, he did not. Do you

0:10:54.320 --> 0:10:57.319
<v Speaker 1>know who killed Dr King? I know who was paid

0:10:57.400 --> 0:11:01.000
<v Speaker 1>to do it. From the outside, it is difficult to

0:11:01.080 --> 0:11:05.959
<v Speaker 1>understand jowers motivation for going on national TV and confessing

0:11:05.960 --> 0:11:09.400
<v Speaker 1>to some part in the murder of doctor King, but

0:11:09.559 --> 0:11:12.600
<v Speaker 1>knowing that Betty's space testimony was loose in the world

0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:16.240
<v Speaker 1>may have made Jowers worry about being prosecuted for his

0:11:16.320 --> 0:11:20.559
<v Speaker 1>part in the crime, or perhaps something else did. Looking

0:11:20.600 --> 0:11:25.760
<v Speaker 1>for relief, jowers attorney Lewis Garrison approached the Attorney General

0:11:25.880 --> 0:11:30.400
<v Speaker 1>John Parotti. He asked for immunity from prosecution for Jowers

0:11:30.679 --> 0:11:33.600
<v Speaker 1>in exchange for coming forward with what he knew about

0:11:33.600 --> 0:11:37.600
<v Speaker 1>the crime. That kind of deal is common in criminal cases.

0:11:39.760 --> 0:11:43.040
<v Speaker 1>What Jowers and Garrison had perhaps overlooked was that in

0:11:43.080 --> 0:11:46.560
<v Speaker 1>this case, the authorities, the police in the AGES Office,

0:11:46.920 --> 0:11:50.120
<v Speaker 1>were heavily invested in the lone assassined version of the

0:11:50.200 --> 0:11:53.959
<v Speaker 1>King murder. At the time of Race conviction, the a g.

0:11:54.160 --> 0:11:57.840
<v Speaker 1>S Office loudly proclaimed that if any information surface that

0:11:57.920 --> 0:12:01.160
<v Speaker 1>indicated others were involved, they would take vigorous action and

0:12:01.240 --> 0:12:03.720
<v Speaker 1>chase those guilty parties to the ends of the earth.

0:12:04.440 --> 0:12:07.480
<v Speaker 1>But now that that information had arrived, they didn't want

0:12:07.520 --> 0:12:10.920
<v Speaker 1>to act on it. Rather, the investigators tried to get

0:12:10.920 --> 0:12:15.600
<v Speaker 1>witnesses to change their stories or discredit them altogether. So

0:12:15.679 --> 0:12:19.760
<v Speaker 1>Garrison's attempts to negotiate immunity hit a wall, and Jowers

0:12:19.800 --> 0:12:23.320
<v Speaker 1>consent to come out on ABC Prime Time might be

0:12:23.400 --> 0:12:27.120
<v Speaker 1>seen as an attempt to force the AG's hand. Indeed,

0:12:27.320 --> 0:12:30.520
<v Speaker 1>when Donaldson asked ours on Live TV to name the

0:12:30.559 --> 0:12:34.000
<v Speaker 1>actual shooter, Garrison jumped in and said that Jowers would

0:12:34.000 --> 0:12:37.560
<v Speaker 1>do that as soon as he was granted immunity. But

0:12:37.720 --> 0:12:40.320
<v Speaker 1>why would Garrison allow us client to go public with

0:12:40.360 --> 0:12:43.760
<v Speaker 1>such a confession. I asked Bill Pepper if he knew

0:12:43.760 --> 0:12:48.160
<v Speaker 1>whether Garrison had recommended that Jowers go on TV. I

0:12:48.200 --> 0:12:51.760
<v Speaker 1>don't think he opposed it. I think Lewis knew that

0:12:51.920 --> 0:12:55.160
<v Speaker 1>his client was guilty, and he believed this was a

0:12:55.200 --> 0:12:59.440
<v Speaker 1>horrendous crime and that the truth should be out. And

0:12:59.520 --> 0:13:02.240
<v Speaker 1>while he was trying to protect the interests of his

0:13:02.400 --> 0:13:06.800
<v Speaker 1>client to the extent that he could, he nevertheless, I

0:13:07.000 --> 0:13:10.360
<v Speaker 1>did not want to get in the way of the

0:13:10.520 --> 0:13:14.480
<v Speaker 1>unfolding truth and what did Garrison have to say about it.

0:13:15.040 --> 0:13:18.400
<v Speaker 1>This audio comes from a twelve interview of Garrison by

0:13:18.440 --> 0:13:23.440
<v Speaker 1>court reporter Brian Dominski. Well, they had contact me at

0:13:23.480 --> 0:13:25.240
<v Speaker 1>bath and I don't know where mister Jarns want to

0:13:25.240 --> 0:13:27.040
<v Speaker 1>do it, and I it didn't matter to me because

0:13:27.280 --> 0:13:31.080
<v Speaker 1>he won't pay anything, but a right, uh. He told

0:13:31.080 --> 0:13:33.720
<v Speaker 1>me one day, you know, he said, well for second history,

0:13:33.720 --> 0:13:35.600
<v Speaker 1>if it will help out, you know, I'll do it.

0:13:35.760 --> 0:13:38.480
<v Speaker 1>And Ms Dalson came and talked to us or once

0:13:38.480 --> 0:13:40.439
<v Speaker 1>to twyfore you had to you know where we actually

0:13:40.480 --> 0:13:43.240
<v Speaker 1>filmed anybody? So I think, I mean, I didn't lead

0:13:43.280 --> 0:13:46.360
<v Speaker 1>Lord into this thing. They a great to it. And

0:13:46.960 --> 0:13:48.280
<v Speaker 1>the only thing I wanted, you know, I don't want

0:13:48.480 --> 0:13:51.839
<v Speaker 1>I'm getting in died anything like that. So Jowers had

0:13:51.840 --> 0:13:55.160
<v Speaker 1>been on TV saying he had been involved in the murder,

0:13:55.600 --> 0:13:59.000
<v Speaker 1>but now with Pepper asking him questions while under oath,

0:13:59.600 --> 0:14:02.080
<v Speaker 1>Jower just wanted to go back to the story that

0:14:02.160 --> 0:14:04.360
<v Speaker 1>he was just drawn a picture of beer when King

0:14:04.440 --> 0:14:08.480
<v Speaker 1>was killed. After having let the charade go on for

0:14:08.640 --> 0:14:12.520
<v Speaker 1>over an hour, Bill Pepper handed Jowers a transcript of

0:14:12.559 --> 0:14:15.280
<v Speaker 1>what he had said to Sam Donaldson and asked him

0:14:15.320 --> 0:14:19.760
<v Speaker 1>to look at the first page, Donaldson saying asking you

0:14:19.880 --> 0:14:23.200
<v Speaker 1>a question. Right on that first paragraph there he is

0:14:23.240 --> 0:14:27.000
<v Speaker 1>saying that James ear already killed Martin Luther King. You

0:14:27.040 --> 0:14:30.640
<v Speaker 1>see your answer to that question as it appeared from transcript.

0:14:31.320 --> 0:14:34.600
<v Speaker 1>What was your response to that question? Mr? Donaldson asked

0:14:34.680 --> 0:14:38.960
<v Speaker 1>you no, and then he said do you know who

0:14:39.080 --> 0:14:45.920
<v Speaker 1>killed Martin Luca King? And the answer, the answer Jowers

0:14:45.960 --> 0:14:48.920
<v Speaker 1>gave to Donaldson was I know who was paid to

0:14:48.960 --> 0:14:53.360
<v Speaker 1>do it. These were important words for Bill Pepper because

0:14:53.400 --> 0:14:56.560
<v Speaker 1>his client, James Earl Ray, had been in jail for

0:14:56.600 --> 0:14:58.800
<v Speaker 1>over twenty five years for a murder he said he

0:14:58.840 --> 0:15:02.600
<v Speaker 1>didn't commit. And now here was testimony from someone with

0:15:02.800 --> 0:15:06.200
<v Speaker 1>presumed inside knowledge who was saying that James Earl Ray

0:15:06.600 --> 0:15:08.880
<v Speaker 1>had not, in fact been the killer of Martin Luther King.

0:15:09.720 --> 0:15:12.360
<v Speaker 1>Pepper was trying to reopen the case in the courts,

0:15:12.840 --> 0:15:15.360
<v Speaker 1>and here was the can opener that might do the job.

0:15:16.040 --> 0:15:18.840
<v Speaker 1>But Lloyd Jowers didn't like this new turn in the questions.

0:15:20.240 --> 0:15:22.880
<v Speaker 1>I think I've got to take care of the man rowan.

0:15:24.480 --> 0:15:27.680
<v Speaker 1>So Jowers pled the fifth He refused to answer Pepper's

0:15:27.760 --> 0:15:31.880
<v Speaker 1>question by asserting his right to not incriminate himself. Pepper

0:15:31.960 --> 0:15:34.480
<v Speaker 1>kept on and asked you Owers if he had any

0:15:34.520 --> 0:15:39.200
<v Speaker 1>business dealings with Frank Liberto take pare Mary known if

0:15:39.200 --> 0:15:46.320
<v Speaker 1>they're going to read no um? Have you ever set

0:15:46.360 --> 0:15:50.480
<v Speaker 1>your eyes on a man who has comes be known

0:15:51.120 --> 0:15:54.880
<v Speaker 1>as many of us as Raoul I have to be

0:15:55.080 --> 0:16:00.240
<v Speaker 1>the fast man? Question? Have you ever had in your

0:16:00.320 --> 0:16:06.200
<v Speaker 1>possession any weapon that might have been associated with the

0:16:06.320 --> 0:16:11.680
<v Speaker 1>murder at Martin? LUs King built the man well that question?

0:16:12.960 --> 0:16:15.920
<v Speaker 1>And so it went a few more questions that Jowers

0:16:15.920 --> 0:16:19.880
<v Speaker 1>wouldn't answer, and Pepper said he was finished. But chowers

0:16:19.960 --> 0:16:23.320
<v Speaker 1>awkward confession and then is taking the fifth would be

0:16:23.480 --> 0:16:25.760
<v Speaker 1>enough for Pepper to get his motion for an evidentiary

0:16:25.840 --> 0:16:29.880
<v Speaker 1>hearing before a sympathetic judge. We will follow that story

0:16:29.920 --> 0:16:33.720
<v Speaker 1>in another episode. But what happened to Betty Spates and

0:16:33.800 --> 0:16:36.840
<v Speaker 1>her story of seeing Jowers running back into Jim's grill

0:16:37.280 --> 0:16:54.800
<v Speaker 1>rifle in hand. Betty Spates didn't work the afternoon shift

0:16:54.840 --> 0:16:58.080
<v Speaker 1>at Jim's Grill. She worked the morning and the evening shifts,

0:16:58.160 --> 0:17:00.560
<v Speaker 1>and in between she'd go across the street and work

0:17:00.600 --> 0:17:04.480
<v Speaker 1>her second job at Seabrook Wallpaper. Years later, she told

0:17:04.520 --> 0:17:07.399
<v Speaker 1>Bill Pepper that on the day Martin Luther King was killed.

0:17:07.920 --> 0:17:11.000
<v Speaker 1>Seabrook let out early, so she returned to the grill

0:17:11.080 --> 0:17:15.720
<v Speaker 1>around three thirty, just in time to run into Jowler's wife, Dorothy,

0:17:15.920 --> 0:17:19.560
<v Speaker 1>who didn't much care for Betty spaces what happened when

0:17:19.600 --> 0:17:25.320
<v Speaker 1>she came in because he slept. She came right up

0:17:25.359 --> 0:17:30.880
<v Speaker 1>to here and was calling her name. How slept about company?

0:17:31.920 --> 0:17:35.199
<v Speaker 1>And then she can learned the lower I want her

0:17:37.280 --> 0:17:42.000
<v Speaker 1>and then would say to get the hand here, and

0:17:42.119 --> 0:17:47.160
<v Speaker 1>he told her and now she's name you are, you'll

0:17:47.200 --> 0:17:51.639
<v Speaker 1>get adding that man he didn't help him and nothing.

0:17:52.880 --> 0:17:56.320
<v Speaker 1>Second she left, she didn't say anything. She's just left.

0:17:58.560 --> 0:18:01.080
<v Speaker 1>A short time after her run in with Jour's wife,

0:18:01.440 --> 0:18:04.119
<v Speaker 1>Betty Speech recalled seeing Charlie Stevens put out of the

0:18:04.200 --> 0:18:07.520
<v Speaker 1>grill so drunk he was becoming a danger to himself.

0:18:08.240 --> 0:18:11.000
<v Speaker 1>This was the same Charlie Stevens who would become the

0:18:11.080 --> 0:18:14.840
<v Speaker 1>state's star witness, saying he saw James ol Ray run

0:18:14.960 --> 0:18:16.960
<v Speaker 1>from the bathroom on the second floor of the rooming

0:18:17.040 --> 0:18:20.680
<v Speaker 1>house after the shot was fired. Betty didn't think much

0:18:20.720 --> 0:18:25.359
<v Speaker 1>of that story. Was nothing right? When did when was

0:18:25.440 --> 0:18:29.440
<v Speaker 1>he put out of the grill? Cappain though his wife there, Yeah,

0:18:29.440 --> 0:18:32.160
<v Speaker 1>I can put out, you know, he came before them,

0:18:32.160 --> 0:18:36.240
<v Speaker 1>but he would say about him, who would put it out? Bobby.

0:18:37.040 --> 0:18:43.560
<v Speaker 1>Bobby told him to believe that would be massive. He

0:18:43.680 --> 0:18:47.760
<v Speaker 1>was a bouncer. So it was a busy afternoon in

0:18:47.840 --> 0:18:50.879
<v Speaker 1>the grill for Lloyd Jowers, and the little scene between

0:18:50.960 --> 0:18:53.440
<v Speaker 1>Betty and Dorothy had played out just an hour and

0:18:53.480 --> 0:18:57.040
<v Speaker 1>a half before Dr King was to be murdered, and

0:18:57.080 --> 0:18:59.840
<v Speaker 1>there were still things that needed doing. Betty said that

0:19:00.040 --> 0:19:03.080
<v Speaker 1>Jowers disappeared on a handful of short errands that didn't

0:19:03.119 --> 0:19:06.480
<v Speaker 1>make much sense. Out the door, back in ten minutes,

0:19:07.040 --> 0:19:10.040
<v Speaker 1>out the door and back in five And then near

0:19:10.160 --> 0:19:13.000
<v Speaker 1>six o'clock she noticed Jowers was again not in the

0:19:13.080 --> 0:19:16.320
<v Speaker 1>dining room and she hadn't seen him leave, so she

0:19:16.400 --> 0:19:19.720
<v Speaker 1>went into the kitchen and Jowers wasn't there either, but

0:19:19.800 --> 0:19:23.280
<v Speaker 1>the back door was open. Then she heard of popping noise,

0:19:23.560 --> 0:19:26.199
<v Speaker 1>and Jowers came running through the back door, white as

0:19:26.240 --> 0:19:29.400
<v Speaker 1>a sheet and carrying a gun. And over the next

0:19:29.480 --> 0:19:32.720
<v Speaker 1>thirty years that image would follow her like a ghost.

0:19:33.960 --> 0:19:36.879
<v Speaker 1>And what about Lloyd Jowers, What was life like for

0:19:37.000 --> 0:19:40.680
<v Speaker 1>him in the years following King's murder. According the Jowers attorney,

0:19:40.720 --> 0:19:44.199
<v Speaker 1>Lewis Garrison, it wasn't too bad because Jowers had come

0:19:44.240 --> 0:19:47.000
<v Speaker 1>into some heavy money right after the murder of Dr King.

0:19:48.160 --> 0:19:52.000
<v Speaker 1>He purchased a cab company sometime oh here six days

0:19:52.080 --> 0:19:54.840
<v Speaker 1>sixty nine, but anyway is the second larger cab gun

0:19:54.920 --> 0:19:57.720
<v Speaker 1>in Memphis. Stad Sam had over a hundred card colled

0:19:57.760 --> 0:20:01.560
<v Speaker 1>ahead pocket when Dr English FASSINYI you got this money,

0:20:02.080 --> 0:20:03.680
<v Speaker 1>but I mean, I mean, I can't tell you. What

0:20:03.720 --> 0:20:04.920
<v Speaker 1>do you tell me? A personally? But I don't know

0:20:05.000 --> 0:20:09.000
<v Speaker 1>for sure? Under town very fat with other witnesses for

0:20:09.080 --> 0:20:13.760
<v Speaker 1>sad messia. According to Jowers, he closed down Jim's grill

0:20:13.880 --> 0:20:17.439
<v Speaker 1>in July of nineteen seventy one. The neighborhood was changing,

0:20:17.920 --> 0:20:20.520
<v Speaker 1>and for some reason, the cops and cab drivers who

0:20:20.560 --> 0:20:23.280
<v Speaker 1>had been as regulars no longer felt like sitting around

0:20:23.320 --> 0:20:27.440
<v Speaker 1>the old place. Sometime before he closed the grill, Jowers

0:20:27.520 --> 0:20:31.840
<v Speaker 1>bought what he told Bill Pepper was of Southland Cab Company.

0:20:32.720 --> 0:20:35.760
<v Speaker 1>It was as an owner of south Land that Jowers

0:20:35.800 --> 0:20:39.280
<v Speaker 1>would meet Attorney Lewis Garrison first on the posing sides

0:20:39.320 --> 0:20:43.520
<v Speaker 1>of an injury lawsuit. But Jowers liked Garrison's relaxed style,

0:20:44.240 --> 0:20:47.440
<v Speaker 1>so Garrison became jowers attorney for the odd things that

0:20:47.560 --> 0:20:52.440
<v Speaker 1>befall anyone in life like a divorce. Jowers divorced his wife,

0:20:52.520 --> 0:20:55.520
<v Speaker 1>Dorothy for the second time in nineteen seventy five, and

0:20:55.600 --> 0:20:59.719
<v Speaker 1>in nineteen seventy six he married Donna Turner, but Turner

0:21:00.000 --> 0:21:05.160
<v Speaker 1>worst Jhowers before their second anniversary, so Jowers, unfazed, turned

0:21:05.200 --> 0:21:08.080
<v Speaker 1>around the same year and married Dorothy for the third time.

0:21:09.000 --> 0:21:12.320
<v Speaker 1>All the while, Lloyd Jowers and Betty Spaces kept up

0:21:12.320 --> 0:21:15.200
<v Speaker 1>an occasional relationship that would go on for twenty years.

0:21:15.960 --> 0:21:18.639
<v Speaker 1>Betty gave birth to five children, two of which she

0:21:18.680 --> 0:21:22.040
<v Speaker 1>said were fathered by Jowers. As she told Bill Pepper,

0:21:22.560 --> 0:21:26.040
<v Speaker 1>all through the seventies and into the eighties, Jowers kept

0:21:26.080 --> 0:21:30.560
<v Speaker 1>tabs on her. He came right to my house back

0:21:30.600 --> 0:21:36.159
<v Speaker 1>for came okay, Loah called me like we was bud buds.

0:21:37.680 --> 0:21:40.000
<v Speaker 1>It was a week or he was calling once more.

0:21:40.640 --> 0:21:42.639
<v Speaker 1>And whenever you changed jobs, he went to see you.

0:21:43.480 --> 0:21:45.920
<v Speaker 1>When have I changed? Is left them up? So I

0:21:46.080 --> 0:21:49.119
<v Speaker 1>was watching me r and b Dan market. Who year

0:21:49.119 --> 0:21:53.160
<v Speaker 1>I want? She said, I wouldn't be there a month,

0:21:53.760 --> 0:21:57.359
<v Speaker 1>and suddenly he was there. Of course, Jowers knew what

0:21:57.520 --> 0:22:00.320
<v Speaker 1>Betty had seen the day King was killed, and this

0:22:00.440 --> 0:22:03.680
<v Speaker 1>may have caused him some anxiety, and at times he

0:22:03.760 --> 0:22:06.159
<v Speaker 1>apparently felt the need to push some of it in

0:22:06.280 --> 0:22:10.200
<v Speaker 1>her direction, and he didn't always do it himself. Jowers

0:22:10.280 --> 0:22:13.200
<v Speaker 1>had a friend named Willie Aikins who would sometimes come

0:22:13.280 --> 0:22:17.240
<v Speaker 1>by Betty's house. On one particular visit, Aikins pulled a

0:22:17.320 --> 0:22:20.240
<v Speaker 1>gun and fired three bullets into the couch on which

0:22:20.320 --> 0:22:23.800
<v Speaker 1>she was sitting. He knocked on my back door, came

0:22:23.920 --> 0:22:27.160
<v Speaker 1>in my house ful of the three fifty seven magnis

0:22:27.720 --> 0:22:31.680
<v Speaker 1>and shot three times in my captain, I have sitting

0:22:31.760 --> 0:22:36.399
<v Speaker 1>right there, adn't jump adenfra adam me hey work A

0:22:36.480 --> 0:22:41.280
<v Speaker 1>sixty was a sleep. Sometimes the lessons would be in

0:22:41.359 --> 0:22:43.960
<v Speaker 1>the form of a story, like the one about Aikins

0:22:44.000 --> 0:22:47.080
<v Speaker 1>and Jowers murdering the wife of some doctor who gave

0:22:47.160 --> 0:22:50.200
<v Speaker 1>the money to do it. And when Agins told me

0:22:50.320 --> 0:22:53.240
<v Speaker 1>there was a doctor I had a wife and paid

0:22:53.800 --> 0:22:56.520
<v Speaker 1>load to get rid of it and him and lower

0:22:56.720 --> 0:23:00.879
<v Speaker 1>feel this one on State manually embar with her. She

0:23:01.040 --> 0:23:03.639
<v Speaker 1>owned a pink CALLI and I asked me, don't you

0:23:03.760 --> 0:23:06.720
<v Speaker 1>remember reading in the paper? And that stuck in my

0:23:06.840 --> 0:23:11.520
<v Speaker 1>head because it's so unusual pink can I. As the

0:23:11.640 --> 0:23:15.200
<v Speaker 1>years passed, the games to frighten Betty died away, but

0:23:15.359 --> 0:23:20.359
<v Speaker 1>you ours still kept contact. I never bobbed Lloyd. I

0:23:20.480 --> 0:23:24.600
<v Speaker 1>always stayed way from Lord. I knew he knew where

0:23:24.640 --> 0:23:27.880
<v Speaker 1>I was, and if he wanted me, I knew he would. Secondly,

0:23:28.600 --> 0:23:31.120
<v Speaker 1>wherever he said for me, I always when where you are.

0:23:32.119 --> 0:23:34.920
<v Speaker 1>It's not that I loved it, Lotte, It's not that

0:23:35.000 --> 0:23:36.399
<v Speaker 1>I was afraid of a little I guess I was

0:23:36.440 --> 0:23:39.960
<v Speaker 1>different fool you, but I failed whenever he said for me,

0:23:40.000 --> 0:23:43.200
<v Speaker 1>if I was always there, he would hurt me. And

0:23:43.280 --> 0:23:45.520
<v Speaker 1>that's why I did it it. But I do always

0:23:45.520 --> 0:23:50.359
<v Speaker 1>do it anymore. Over the years, Attorney Lewis Garrison and

0:23:50.520 --> 0:23:54.320
<v Speaker 1>Lloyd Jowers kept on with their business relationship, but people

0:23:54.359 --> 0:23:57.560
<v Speaker 1>would sometimes say strange things to Garrison about you Owers,

0:23:58.119 --> 0:24:01.480
<v Speaker 1>allusions to some secret that everyone else seemed to know about,

0:24:02.040 --> 0:24:04.600
<v Speaker 1>or sometimes they might just say it. They might write

0:24:04.600 --> 0:24:07.080
<v Speaker 1>out ask if Garrison knew that Jowers was in on

0:24:07.160 --> 0:24:10.360
<v Speaker 1>the murder of Dr King. What a strange thing to say,

0:24:10.760 --> 0:24:15.520
<v Speaker 1>unless there was some truth to it. Finally, Garrison summoned discourage.

0:24:16.480 --> 0:24:19.080
<v Speaker 1>So one day I said, Lord, I said, you know,

0:24:19.480 --> 0:24:22.080
<v Speaker 1>they've been a lot of discussion about the fact you

0:24:22.160 --> 0:24:25.000
<v Speaker 1>may have been involved in the Martin Luther King assassination.

0:24:25.080 --> 0:24:27.320
<v Speaker 1>And he said, well that a lot of people talking

0:24:27.320 --> 0:24:29.120
<v Speaker 1>about he said, and one thing share that Blanket Black

0:24:29.160 --> 0:24:31.320
<v Speaker 1>is not coming back. I said, no, we coming back.

0:24:31.920 --> 0:24:34.640
<v Speaker 1>But that's that's when we first started, the very first

0:24:34.680 --> 0:24:37.840
<v Speaker 1>time we've we've probably talked about it very much. Lewis

0:24:37.920 --> 0:24:41.240
<v Speaker 1>Garrison is a Southern gentleman and blankety blank is as

0:24:41.280 --> 0:24:43.399
<v Speaker 1>close as he will come to saying the words that

0:24:43.560 --> 0:24:47.760
<v Speaker 1>Jowers actually said, but they probably weren't nice words, and

0:24:47.920 --> 0:24:51.800
<v Speaker 1>Garrison understood right away that Jowers had not denied the rumors.

0:24:52.720 --> 0:24:56.960
<v Speaker 1>Garrison and Jowers talked further on subsequent occasions, and soon

0:24:57.440 --> 0:25:00.680
<v Speaker 1>Garrison was not the attorney defending his Liliant and Cab

0:25:00.760 --> 0:25:04.840
<v Speaker 1>related lawsuits. He was the attorney representing a man who

0:25:04.920 --> 0:25:07.720
<v Speaker 1>had admitted to him that he was involved in the

0:25:07.800 --> 0:25:15.880
<v Speaker 1>murder of Dr Martin Luther King. The appearance with Sam

0:25:16.000 --> 0:25:19.280
<v Speaker 1>Donaldson a National TV may have been an attempt to

0:25:19.359 --> 0:25:22.240
<v Speaker 1>force the d a's hand as far as granting immunity

0:25:22.320 --> 0:25:25.160
<v Speaker 1>to Jours, but there may have been something else in play.

0:25:26.080 --> 0:25:29.160
<v Speaker 1>Bill Pepper had worked with an English TV producer named

0:25:29.200 --> 0:25:33.240
<v Speaker 1>Jack Saltman on the HBO Mock Trial. When the trial

0:25:33.520 --> 0:25:36.680
<v Speaker 1>ended with a surprise not guilty verdict in raised favor.

0:25:37.400 --> 0:25:41.520
<v Speaker 1>Saltman apparently imagined a movie about the assassination that would

0:25:41.560 --> 0:25:45.480
<v Speaker 1>reveal what really happened without telling Pepper a thing about it.

0:25:45.840 --> 0:25:49.800
<v Speaker 1>He took on Pepper's former investigators Ken Herman and John Billings,

0:25:50.400 --> 0:25:53.680
<v Speaker 1>and they began to put the pieces together. I think

0:25:53.680 --> 0:25:58.240
<v Speaker 1>I got launched very early on after the HBO trial.

0:25:58.840 --> 0:26:01.920
<v Speaker 1>I think they saw off ffortunity to make some serious money.

0:26:03.040 --> 0:26:06.600
<v Speaker 1>Herman had been um an investigator on the case, as

0:26:06.760 --> 0:26:10.320
<v Speaker 1>was Billings, and they got sucked into this arrangement with

0:26:11.119 --> 0:26:14.080
<v Speaker 1>with Saltman, who was a producer from England, of course,

0:26:14.680 --> 0:26:18.280
<v Speaker 1>and they thought they could put together a a script

0:26:18.680 --> 0:26:23.200
<v Speaker 1>and launch a private project and make money on it.

0:26:24.520 --> 0:26:27.639
<v Speaker 1>But Chowers was the key player, so he was brought in.

0:26:28.600 --> 0:26:31.159
<v Speaker 1>But further to be a movie, they needed to know

0:26:31.280 --> 0:26:36.000
<v Speaker 1>who shot King, and Jowers, now seeing dollar signs, was

0:26:36.080 --> 0:26:38.480
<v Speaker 1>happy to say that it was a guy named Frank Holt,

0:26:38.960 --> 0:26:41.600
<v Speaker 1>a big black fellow that Jowers knew way back when,

0:26:42.280 --> 0:26:45.400
<v Speaker 1>but no one had seen him for years. So jowers

0:26:45.520 --> 0:26:50.040
<v Speaker 1>confession on ABC Prime Time may have been not only

0:26:50.200 --> 0:26:52.600
<v Speaker 1>a play to pry an immunity deal out of a

0:26:52.720 --> 0:26:56.440
<v Speaker 1>g Paroti, but also perhaps a play to get a

0:26:56.520 --> 0:27:00.440
<v Speaker 1>major studio interested in doing a movie. But to get

0:27:00.480 --> 0:27:03.720
<v Speaker 1>a movie studio involved, they needed to flesh out the story,

0:27:04.080 --> 0:27:07.080
<v Speaker 1>and they wanted Betty Space to help. She would say

0:27:07.280 --> 0:27:10.240
<v Speaker 1>that she listened in on jowers phone conversation where some

0:27:10.359 --> 0:27:13.920
<v Speaker 1>produce guy named Liberto told Showers about money that was

0:27:14.000 --> 0:27:17.280
<v Speaker 1>to arrive in a box of lettuce, and Jowers now

0:27:17.400 --> 0:27:19.720
<v Speaker 1>wanted Betty to tell her story about what she saw

0:27:19.760 --> 0:27:22.840
<v Speaker 1>at the back door, except she would say that she

0:27:22.920 --> 0:27:26.480
<v Speaker 1>saw a man hand ours the gun, a large black man.

0:27:28.760 --> 0:27:32.040
<v Speaker 1>He told me, I want you always be noticed him

0:27:32.760 --> 0:27:34.960
<v Speaker 1>and whenever I get on the phone, n and to listen,

0:27:35.720 --> 0:27:39.280
<v Speaker 1>and I want you to eat that. And here Frank

0:27:39.400 --> 0:27:44.520
<v Speaker 1>Liberto telling me from that produce from the end today

0:27:45.119 --> 0:27:48.040
<v Speaker 1>they would be an extra order. And when the produce

0:27:48.160 --> 0:27:51.360
<v Speaker 1>came in, I was supposed to have a nose enough

0:27:51.440 --> 0:27:53.960
<v Speaker 1>to open a box that I thought was a box

0:27:54.000 --> 0:27:56.960
<v Speaker 1>and maze, but it was a box bear with mode.

0:27:58.000 --> 0:28:00.800
<v Speaker 1>But it's not in her. That's true. No rose treat

0:28:00.800 --> 0:28:03.040
<v Speaker 1>and not end of that is tream. I don't know

0:28:03.119 --> 0:28:06.240
<v Speaker 1>anything about a phone call. I don't know anything about

0:28:06.240 --> 0:28:09.480
<v Speaker 1>no lettuce and no money, no box, and I never

0:28:09.560 --> 0:28:12.720
<v Speaker 1>heard of front Lberto before. That's what Lord wanted me

0:28:12.880 --> 0:28:15.560
<v Speaker 1>to say. He wanted me to tell the truth about

0:28:15.840 --> 0:28:19.479
<v Speaker 1>seeing him with the rifle. He just wanted me change

0:28:19.520 --> 0:28:23.040
<v Speaker 1>it just a little bit by saying I saw him

0:28:24.040 --> 0:28:28.040
<v Speaker 1>standing in the back door and a black man passing

0:28:28.160 --> 0:28:31.960
<v Speaker 1>him a right and that's not true. And he said,

0:28:33.000 --> 0:28:35.919
<v Speaker 1>if I didn't say it, I will lose my share

0:28:35.960 --> 0:28:39.440
<v Speaker 1>of three hundred thousand dollars. Trust Roy, it is to

0:28:39.600 --> 0:28:42.680
<v Speaker 1>a book. And I told him I can't lose you nothing.

0:28:42.720 --> 0:28:46.680
<v Speaker 1>I never hate it. So Lloyd Gawers was saying that

0:28:46.760 --> 0:28:49.800
<v Speaker 1>a black man named Frank Holt, whom he had hired,

0:28:50.240 --> 0:28:52.680
<v Speaker 1>had handed him the rifle that day while he was

0:28:52.720 --> 0:28:56.080
<v Speaker 1>at the back door of his restaurant. Perhaps Saltman and

0:28:56.160 --> 0:28:59.800
<v Speaker 1>Hermann believed this story, but when Bill Pepper found out

0:28:59.880 --> 0:29:02.640
<v Speaker 1>about the whole movie intrigue and that the fall guy

0:29:02.800 --> 0:29:08.120
<v Speaker 1>was to be this Frank Halt, he jumped on it. Well.

0:29:08.200 --> 0:29:10.360
<v Speaker 1>I thought it was important to find him and to

0:29:11.040 --> 0:29:14.200
<v Speaker 1>interview him, and I hired a private investigator in Florida

0:29:14.280 --> 0:29:17.400
<v Speaker 1>to locate him because I understood that's where he was.

0:29:17.480 --> 0:29:21.560
<v Speaker 1>Where he was, we found him, Pepper flew down to

0:29:21.760 --> 0:29:24.800
<v Speaker 1>Orlando and met with a penniless Frank Holt, who had

0:29:24.840 --> 0:29:28.000
<v Speaker 1>been living in a series of homeless shelters. Holt was

0:29:28.120 --> 0:29:31.440
<v Speaker 1>surprised to hear that Jowers was now accusing him of

0:29:31.560 --> 0:29:35.400
<v Speaker 1>murdering Martin Luther King. It was apparent to Pepper, after

0:29:35.520 --> 0:29:38.600
<v Speaker 1>asking three questions that Holt didn't no thing about it.

0:29:39.480 --> 0:29:43.000
<v Speaker 1>Why would Jowers name you? He asked, Halt, I don't know,

0:29:43.200 --> 0:29:46.760
<v Speaker 1>The man replied, maybe he thought I was dead, And

0:29:46.920 --> 0:29:50.120
<v Speaker 1>that made sense to Pepper because to him, Frank Holt

0:29:50.160 --> 0:29:53.800
<v Speaker 1>alive did not make a very convincing killer. So with

0:29:53.920 --> 0:29:56.560
<v Speaker 1>Betty Space ready to say that the story wasn't true,

0:29:57.040 --> 0:30:00.360
<v Speaker 1>and Halt turning up alive, the movie idea died a

0:30:00.520 --> 0:30:05.440
<v Speaker 1>quiet death, but it had done damage. Anytime someone looks

0:30:05.440 --> 0:30:08.560
<v Speaker 1>into the murders of the Kennedy's or King, the charge

0:30:08.680 --> 0:30:11.360
<v Speaker 1>is almost always levied that they are just doing it

0:30:11.480 --> 0:30:14.560
<v Speaker 1>for a quick buck. It's an easy way to dismiss

0:30:14.680 --> 0:30:17.600
<v Speaker 1>an honest effort to look at the evidence. But now

0:30:18.200 --> 0:30:21.320
<v Speaker 1>here was someone actually trying to make money by telling

0:30:21.360 --> 0:30:24.680
<v Speaker 1>a story about the murder of King. It became the

0:30:24.840 --> 0:30:27.920
<v Speaker 1>easy way to dismiss Bill Pepper and Jowers and the

0:30:28.040 --> 0:30:31.840
<v Speaker 1>substantial evidence that the assassination was run out of his grill.

0:30:32.640 --> 0:30:37.680
<v Speaker 1>They were all just trying to make a movie. As

0:30:37.760 --> 0:30:41.240
<v Speaker 1>for Betty Spaces, she would endure a great deal of harassment.

0:30:42.000 --> 0:30:44.840
<v Speaker 1>In the beginning, Jack Saltman and a few others showed

0:30:44.920 --> 0:30:47.680
<v Speaker 1>up at her door. Then they appeared at the restaurant

0:30:47.720 --> 0:30:50.640
<v Speaker 1>where she worked. They wanted her in on the story.

0:30:51.320 --> 0:30:54.040
<v Speaker 1>So did Willie Aikins, who was angry that she was

0:30:54.120 --> 0:30:56.040
<v Speaker 1>going to cost them all a lot of money if

0:30:56.120 --> 0:31:00.200
<v Speaker 1>she didn't follow their script. And ABC host Sam Donaldson

0:31:00.400 --> 0:31:03.240
<v Speaker 1>himself showed up in the company of Aikin's who that

0:31:03.400 --> 0:31:06.400
<v Speaker 1>day presumably left this three fifty seven magnum at home.

0:31:07.200 --> 0:31:10.240
<v Speaker 1>When Betty told Pepper that Donaldson had come to her house,

0:31:10.760 --> 0:31:17.000
<v Speaker 1>he was surprised. Did Donaldson come over there? And at

0:31:17.080 --> 0:31:19.680
<v Speaker 1>to hear him on a point? And he was dinging

0:31:20.200 --> 0:31:22.320
<v Speaker 1>when Aidan was beena on the winning doors and he

0:31:22.440 --> 0:31:24.520
<v Speaker 1>was damaged. If this lady don't want to talk, I

0:31:24.560 --> 0:31:28.040
<v Speaker 1>don't want to bother her. Those were nice sentiments spoken

0:31:28.120 --> 0:31:32.160
<v Speaker 1>by Donaldson, but it didn't keep ABC Prime Time from

0:31:32.240 --> 0:31:35.160
<v Speaker 1>turning Betty's life upside down When they did their special

0:31:35.240 --> 0:31:38.480
<v Speaker 1>on Lloyd Showers and his confession, because right in the

0:31:38.560 --> 0:31:41.560
<v Speaker 1>middle of things, they showed a blurry video of Betty

0:31:41.720 --> 0:31:44.800
<v Speaker 1>leaving work and getting into her car like she was

0:31:44.920 --> 0:31:47.760
<v Speaker 1>part of some drug deal, and while that was playing,

0:31:48.000 --> 0:31:50.800
<v Speaker 1>they said that Betty could confirm the story told by Jowers.

0:31:51.720 --> 0:31:54.760
<v Speaker 1>Now lots of people wanted to talk to Betty, journalists,

0:31:55.000 --> 0:31:57.880
<v Speaker 1>people posing as journalists, guys in suits flashing I D.

0:31:58.800 --> 0:32:01.560
<v Speaker 1>Betty didn't want to talk to any of them. Sometimes

0:32:01.600 --> 0:32:05.160
<v Speaker 1>she had and pretended she wasn't home. As for Jowers,

0:32:05.400 --> 0:32:08.240
<v Speaker 1>things weren't great for him either. With a movie deal

0:32:08.360 --> 0:32:11.720
<v Speaker 1>dying and the Attorney General not offering immunity, he felt

0:32:11.800 --> 0:32:15.560
<v Speaker 1>more exposed than ever, And now the King family had questions.

0:32:16.000 --> 0:32:18.920
<v Speaker 1>They wanted to speak to him, and when the possibility

0:32:19.000 --> 0:32:21.880
<v Speaker 1>of a meeting was proposed, Jowers said he was willing.

0:32:22.440 --> 0:32:25.240
<v Speaker 1>He apparently hoped that he might find some shelter in

0:32:25.320 --> 0:32:28.400
<v Speaker 1>a meeting with a King family, So one was arranged

0:32:28.440 --> 0:32:31.040
<v Speaker 1>in a room at a motel out on the highway.

0:32:31.880 --> 0:32:34.800
<v Speaker 1>At the meeting was Lloyd Jowers and his attorney Lewis Garrison,

0:32:35.200 --> 0:32:39.360
<v Speaker 1>Martin King's son Dexter, and Ambassador Andrew Young. They also

0:32:39.400 --> 0:32:56.880
<v Speaker 1>brought a tape recorder. When Martin Luther King was shot

0:32:57.000 --> 0:33:00.280
<v Speaker 1>on the balcony of the Lorraine Motel, King's lute, ennant

0:33:00.320 --> 0:33:03.760
<v Speaker 1>and confidant Andrew Young, was standing below in the parking lot.

0:33:04.560 --> 0:33:07.400
<v Speaker 1>Young heard a popping noise and then suddenly realized that

0:33:07.520 --> 0:33:11.480
<v Speaker 1>King was down. After King's death, Young stayed on for

0:33:11.560 --> 0:33:15.040
<v Speaker 1>a time with the SCLC. Then he entered politics and

0:33:15.120 --> 0:33:19.160
<v Speaker 1>served two terms in Congress. In nineteen seventy seven, he

0:33:19.360 --> 0:33:22.400
<v Speaker 1>was made Ambassador to the United Nations by President Carter,

0:33:23.080 --> 0:33:26.840
<v Speaker 1>and following that he won two consecutive terms as mayor

0:33:26.920 --> 0:33:32.040
<v Speaker 1>of Atlanta. Three decades after King's death, Andrew Young would

0:33:32.080 --> 0:33:34.960
<v Speaker 1>return to Memphis and take the witness stand in the

0:33:36.160 --> 0:33:40.320
<v Speaker 1>civil trial. Under the questioning of Bill Pepper, attorney for

0:33:40.400 --> 0:33:44.200
<v Speaker 1>credit Scott King, Young explained that his energies after King's

0:33:44.320 --> 0:33:48.240
<v Speaker 1>murder were directed towards carrying forward with King's work, rather

0:33:48.360 --> 0:33:51.600
<v Speaker 1>than answering the questions that still lingered about his death.

0:33:52.440 --> 0:34:00.719
<v Speaker 1>But eventually that changed. Did you and recent years, and said, um,

0:34:00.800 --> 0:34:04.640
<v Speaker 1>the events of April four from the assassination on your friends,

0:34:04.680 --> 0:34:09.960
<v Speaker 1>and you prob gain again. I did investing. As a

0:34:10.040 --> 0:34:14.920
<v Speaker 1>result of UM, the families knew awareness and concern, and

0:34:15.000 --> 0:34:18.319
<v Speaker 1>where you asked to participating in a meeting with an

0:34:18.360 --> 0:34:22.040
<v Speaker 1>individual who who was a dependent came Mr Royal Johns.

0:34:22.520 --> 0:34:27.240
<v Speaker 1>Yes I was. I was told that that Mr Jarros

0:34:27.280 --> 0:34:31.440
<v Speaker 1>will getting older, he wasn't very well and it was

0:34:31.520 --> 0:34:36.000
<v Speaker 1>almost like he wanted to get right with dogs before

0:34:36.080 --> 0:34:38.880
<v Speaker 1>he died. But when we met with him, that was

0:34:39.160 --> 0:34:41.640
<v Speaker 1>still impression that I had that he was a man

0:34:42.360 --> 0:34:44.239
<v Speaker 1>who had a lot on his mind and a lot

0:34:44.360 --> 0:34:47.920
<v Speaker 1>on his conscience and who wanted to confess it and

0:34:48.040 --> 0:34:51.960
<v Speaker 1>be free of couldn't you in the time remaining summarized

0:34:52.000 --> 0:34:55.360
<v Speaker 1>for us what Mr Jarros told you? And next you

0:34:55.560 --> 0:34:59.640
<v Speaker 1>came as I beat well. He said that he was

0:34:59.719 --> 0:35:06.040
<v Speaker 1>a Ryan Jim's grill and that he was a retired

0:35:06.160 --> 0:35:09.520
<v Speaker 1>Members police officer and that a lot of police officers

0:35:09.640 --> 0:35:14.880
<v Speaker 1>hung out at his place. He said he hadn't lived

0:35:15.560 --> 0:35:19.280
<v Speaker 1>such a good life. He had a lot of drinking

0:35:19.360 --> 0:35:23.200
<v Speaker 1>and gambling problems, and that he was in debt to

0:35:24.400 --> 0:35:28.640
<v Speaker 1>somebody that he identified as the head of the mafia

0:35:29.080 --> 0:35:34.240
<v Speaker 1>who called him up, and that he was nervous about

0:35:35.080 --> 0:35:37.719
<v Speaker 1>him and afraid that he was calling the collective money

0:35:37.800 --> 0:35:41.680
<v Speaker 1>which he didn't have. The guy said, I'll forget about that.

0:35:41.920 --> 0:35:45.239
<v Speaker 1>I just need you to do me a favor. So

0:35:45.400 --> 0:35:48.960
<v Speaker 1>what was the favor? The mafia guy to whom Jowers

0:35:49.040 --> 0:35:53.000
<v Speaker 1>owed a large debt, Frank Liberto, who we've spoken about before,

0:35:53.600 --> 0:35:56.920
<v Speaker 1>wanted jowers grill for use as the staging ground for

0:35:57.000 --> 0:36:00.239
<v Speaker 1>the murder of Martin Luther King. It was the thick

0:36:00.280 --> 0:36:03.960
<v Speaker 1>place if King were staying ethel Lorraine Motel. But when

0:36:04.040 --> 0:36:07.600
<v Speaker 1>Jowers met with King's son Dexter, he wasn't quite ready

0:36:07.680 --> 0:36:10.279
<v Speaker 1>to let it all hang out, so he told a

0:36:10.360 --> 0:36:14.719
<v Speaker 1>more limited but rather unbelievable story to Dexter King and

0:36:14.840 --> 0:36:18.919
<v Speaker 1>Andy Young. In this telling, Jowers did not know Martin

0:36:19.040 --> 0:36:22.040
<v Speaker 1>Luther King was to be murdered. All Jowers knew was

0:36:22.120 --> 0:36:24.080
<v Speaker 1>that he was supposed to receive a large amount of

0:36:24.120 --> 0:36:27.880
<v Speaker 1>money hidden in a box supposedly containing vegetables, and that

0:36:28.040 --> 0:36:30.040
<v Speaker 1>he was supposed to hand this money over to a

0:36:30.160 --> 0:36:33.840
<v Speaker 1>Spanish looking guy named Raoul, who would bring Jowers a package.

0:36:34.680 --> 0:36:37.279
<v Speaker 1>Jowers claimed the man brought the package, which was a

0:36:37.400 --> 0:36:41.480
<v Speaker 1>long box that presumably contained a rifle, But Jowers told

0:36:41.520 --> 0:36:44.400
<v Speaker 1>Dexter King and Andy Young that he never looked in

0:36:44.520 --> 0:36:47.600
<v Speaker 1>the box. But he did give this Raoul guy the money.

0:36:48.560 --> 0:36:52.160
<v Speaker 1>Then crazy day that this was. Jowers said he got

0:36:52.200 --> 0:36:54.000
<v Speaker 1>a phone call telling him to be at the back

0:36:54.080 --> 0:36:57.040
<v Speaker 1>door of his grill at six o'clock someone would give

0:36:57.120 --> 0:37:00.560
<v Speaker 1>him something. He didn't know what, and asad Or Young

0:37:00.680 --> 0:37:04.879
<v Speaker 1>tells what happened next. According to Jowers, but he said

0:37:04.960 --> 0:37:08.279
<v Speaker 1>when he went to the back door, just as he

0:37:08.400 --> 0:37:11.839
<v Speaker 1>got to the door, shot rang out and somebody came

0:37:11.920 --> 0:37:15.640
<v Speaker 1>out of the bushes and handed him a Smogan rifle.

0:37:16.400 --> 0:37:18.719
<v Speaker 1>And he broke it down and wrapped it in a

0:37:19.800 --> 0:37:23.399
<v Speaker 1>table ball and put it back in the store room.

0:37:24.120 --> 0:37:27.480
<v Speaker 1>He said. The guy who handed him the rifle was

0:37:27.560 --> 0:37:30.319
<v Speaker 1>the Vello who had been on his police force with him.

0:37:30.840 --> 0:37:34.480
<v Speaker 1>That was a friend of his who he used to

0:37:34.560 --> 0:37:39.359
<v Speaker 1>go hunting with. It was quite a good box. Bill

0:37:39.440 --> 0:37:42.120
<v Speaker 1>Pepper asked the court for permission to play the recording

0:37:42.160 --> 0:37:45.760
<v Speaker 1>of the meeting between Ambassador Young, Dexter King, and Lloyd Jowers.

0:37:46.400 --> 0:37:49.279
<v Speaker 1>The judge agreed, and the jury then heard the entire

0:37:49.400 --> 0:37:52.319
<v Speaker 1>tape of that meeting, selections from which we will play

0:37:52.400 --> 0:37:55.360
<v Speaker 1>for you. Here should be noted that this was the

0:37:55.440 --> 0:37:59.680
<v Speaker 1>second such meeting. The first included Jowers, Garrison King, and

0:37:59.800 --> 0:38:03.600
<v Speaker 1>Bill Pepper, so there is a more relaxed informality here

0:38:03.880 --> 0:38:06.520
<v Speaker 1>than one might expect for a meeting where one man

0:38:06.640 --> 0:38:10.040
<v Speaker 1>confesses to killing the other man's father. And while the

0:38:10.160 --> 0:38:15.520
<v Speaker 1>evidence strongly suggests that the basic underlying story here is true, many,

0:38:15.640 --> 0:38:17.759
<v Speaker 1>if not most, of the pieces of this story as

0:38:17.800 --> 0:38:20.719
<v Speaker 1>told by Jowers, are not true, and we will try

0:38:20.760 --> 0:38:23.480
<v Speaker 1>to point these out as they occur. As we heard

0:38:23.520 --> 0:38:26.920
<v Speaker 1>Attorney Garrison say before, Jowers did not speak well of

0:38:27.040 --> 0:38:30.960
<v Speaker 1>King and private company, But now in meeting with Dexter King,

0:38:31.600 --> 0:38:34.759
<v Speaker 1>Jowers wanted not only forgiveness from the King family, but

0:38:34.920 --> 0:38:38.160
<v Speaker 1>their support in his bid for immunity from prosecution. In

0:38:38.280 --> 0:38:41.800
<v Speaker 1>return for his coming forward. The King family, on their side,

0:38:42.160 --> 0:38:45.680
<v Speaker 1>was grateful to finally here after thirty years some version

0:38:45.760 --> 0:38:50.040
<v Speaker 1>of the truth from someone inside the conspiracy. Because of this,

0:38:50.600 --> 0:38:53.600
<v Speaker 1>they were not inclined to challenge Jowers or make things

0:38:53.680 --> 0:38:57.000
<v Speaker 1>difficult for him when he made absurd claims such as

0:38:57.080 --> 0:38:59.640
<v Speaker 1>he did not know it was Martin Luther King who

0:38:59.719 --> 0:39:03.720
<v Speaker 1>was to be murdered. It's an odd trade off. Also,

0:39:04.120 --> 0:39:07.160
<v Speaker 1>after the civil trial, the original tape of this meeting

0:39:07.320 --> 0:39:10.319
<v Speaker 1>appears to have been lost, so what we have now

0:39:10.760 --> 0:39:13.440
<v Speaker 1>is what was made when the original tape was played

0:39:13.680 --> 0:39:17.080
<v Speaker 1>and re recorded in open court with all its distortion

0:39:17.239 --> 0:39:26.840
<v Speaker 1>and background noise. So instead of playing the courtroom recording,

0:39:27.200 --> 0:39:30.600
<v Speaker 1>we're going to recreate the exchange between Dexter and Showers

0:39:30.920 --> 0:39:37.040
<v Speaker 1>heard on that tape with voice actors. We appreciate your

0:39:37.080 --> 0:39:40.480
<v Speaker 1>willingness to open up and come forward. As you know,

0:39:40.800 --> 0:39:44.360
<v Speaker 1>we continue to support immunity for you, but the district

0:39:44.400 --> 0:39:47.399
<v Speaker 1>attorney doesn't seem to want your story to come out,

0:39:48.000 --> 0:39:51.959
<v Speaker 1>so it appears that they are shutting everything down. Yeah,

0:39:52.719 --> 0:39:56.120
<v Speaker 1>I think that would be a major tragedy. Well, we

0:39:56.160 --> 0:40:01.000
<v Speaker 1>would be definitely. Dexter then brings the conversation back to

0:40:01.080 --> 0:40:04.200
<v Speaker 1>where it had been the last time they met. When

0:40:04.239 --> 0:40:06.480
<v Speaker 1>we had last met, you had pretty much taken us

0:40:06.600 --> 0:40:09.280
<v Speaker 1>I think, up to a point where you had received

0:40:09.360 --> 0:40:12.560
<v Speaker 1>the rifle from Lieutenant Clark. I couldn't swear it was

0:40:12.680 --> 0:40:15.239
<v Speaker 1>Clark that I took it from, but I believe it was.

0:40:15.760 --> 0:40:18.360
<v Speaker 1>Now say it happened just about that quick. I was

0:40:18.400 --> 0:40:20.200
<v Speaker 1>in the back door at six o'clock like I was

0:40:20.239 --> 0:40:22.960
<v Speaker 1>supposed to be. How many seconds did it take him

0:40:23.000 --> 0:40:25.360
<v Speaker 1>to hand me the rifle and got going? That was

0:40:25.480 --> 0:40:29.360
<v Speaker 1>just a split second. Here again, Jowers being at the

0:40:29.400 --> 0:40:32.960
<v Speaker 1>back doors six for a mysterious handoff is a ludicrous

0:40:33.040 --> 0:40:36.120
<v Speaker 1>fabrication to support the notion that he really didn't know

0:40:36.200 --> 0:40:39.600
<v Speaker 1>what was going down, and Jowers tries to pretend that

0:40:39.760 --> 0:40:42.399
<v Speaker 1>the handoff was so quick that he really couldn't say

0:40:42.440 --> 0:40:44.879
<v Speaker 1>for sure that it was his friend Earl Clark, dead

0:40:44.960 --> 0:40:47.239
<v Speaker 1>for some years now, who had handed him the gun.

0:40:47.880 --> 0:40:50.480
<v Speaker 1>It was just like that, he said, snapping his fingers.

0:40:51.239 --> 0:40:54.920
<v Speaker 1>But a little while later Andy Young asked again, but

0:40:54.960 --> 0:40:57.000
<v Speaker 1>are you pretty sure that it was Clark who handed

0:40:57.040 --> 0:41:01.040
<v Speaker 1>you the rifle? This time Jowers is more certain. I'm

0:41:01.080 --> 0:41:04.919
<v Speaker 1>sure it was Clark, he says, of course. Jowers saying

0:41:05.000 --> 0:41:08.320
<v Speaker 1>so doesn't mean that Lieutenant Earl Clark, an m b D.

0:41:08.440 --> 0:41:12.080
<v Speaker 1>Sharpshooter was out in the bushes behind Jim's grill, just

0:41:12.280 --> 0:41:14.320
<v Speaker 1>as they say so didn't mean that Frank Holt was

0:41:14.400 --> 0:41:18.000
<v Speaker 1>out there. But there is other testimony that we will

0:41:18.080 --> 0:41:20.680
<v Speaker 1>hear later that says that Earl Clark was out in

0:41:20.760 --> 0:41:24.239
<v Speaker 1>the yard, and the muddy knees on jowers pants says

0:41:24.280 --> 0:41:27.040
<v Speaker 1>that he was also out there, along with evidence of

0:41:27.080 --> 0:41:30.239
<v Speaker 1>a third man. But Jowers says that he got a

0:41:30.280 --> 0:41:33.560
<v Speaker 1>smoking rifle handed to him moments after doctor King was

0:41:33.640 --> 0:41:37.239
<v Speaker 1>shot Dexter King then asked you Owers if he knows

0:41:37.280 --> 0:41:41.960
<v Speaker 1>of any evidence determining what rifle killed his father. To

0:41:42.120 --> 0:41:45.600
<v Speaker 1>my knowledge, I don't know of anyone that has scientific

0:41:45.760 --> 0:41:49.280
<v Speaker 1>evidence of which rifle did actually kill him. I definitely

0:41:49.360 --> 0:41:52.120
<v Speaker 1>don't believe it was one of the police found. I'll

0:41:52.200 --> 0:41:55.160
<v Speaker 1>never believe that in a million years. So is it

0:41:55.239 --> 0:41:58.719
<v Speaker 1>your feeling that James Earl Ray did not know? He

0:41:58.800 --> 0:42:03.080
<v Speaker 1>didn't no more kill him and you killed your own dad? No? No, no,

0:42:03.840 --> 0:42:06.680
<v Speaker 1>I'd never believe that in a million Even if he

0:42:06.840 --> 0:42:10.320
<v Speaker 1>told me, I wouldn't believe it. You could be forgiven

0:42:10.400 --> 0:42:13.279
<v Speaker 1>for smiling as you listen to how certain Jowers is

0:42:13.400 --> 0:42:17.120
<v Speaker 1>that neither Ray nor Ray's rifle kill King? If Jowers

0:42:17.200 --> 0:42:20.080
<v Speaker 1>were out in the bushes when the fatal shot was fired,

0:42:20.520 --> 0:42:24.040
<v Speaker 1>as it appears he was, of course he's certain. How

0:42:24.120 --> 0:42:28.680
<v Speaker 1>could he not be? Dexter then has another question, So

0:42:28.880 --> 0:42:32.440
<v Speaker 1>why was he set up his own fault? They got

0:42:32.520 --> 0:42:35.800
<v Speaker 1>him out of jail, they furnished him money, they furnished

0:42:35.880 --> 0:42:38.640
<v Speaker 1>him with passports. Now they come up at that tale

0:42:38.640 --> 0:42:41.160
<v Speaker 1>about him setting up a gun deal, But that wasn't true.

0:42:41.800 --> 0:42:44.600
<v Speaker 1>They may have told him that, you know, So is

0:42:44.680 --> 0:42:47.239
<v Speaker 1>it possible that he was doing things that appeared to

0:42:47.360 --> 0:42:51.120
<v Speaker 1>be stalking, but maybe he didn't realize it. They probably

0:42:51.160 --> 0:42:54.080
<v Speaker 1>didn't even realize it. Yeah, I'm sure that's the way

0:42:54.120 --> 0:42:56.759
<v Speaker 1>it went down. He was doing what he was told

0:42:56.840 --> 0:43:01.560
<v Speaker 1>to do. So Jowers is certain that Ray was set up,

0:43:02.080 --> 0:43:03.879
<v Speaker 1>and he seems to know more than just a little

0:43:03.880 --> 0:43:06.640
<v Speaker 1>bit about it. He knows about the phony gun deal

0:43:06.960 --> 0:43:09.440
<v Speaker 1>were according to Ray, he was asked to buy a

0:43:09.600 --> 0:43:13.319
<v Speaker 1>rifle to present to a prospective customer. And Jowers also

0:43:13.440 --> 0:43:17.200
<v Speaker 1>says that they got Ray out of jail, strongly suggesting

0:43:17.239 --> 0:43:19.880
<v Speaker 1>that Ray was sprung so he would be available for

0:43:19.960 --> 0:43:23.960
<v Speaker 1>future service, perhaps Ay as a full guy. And how

0:43:24.120 --> 0:43:27.080
<v Speaker 1>Ray escaped from prison has always been a mystery because

0:43:27.120 --> 0:43:30.560
<v Speaker 1>he needed help and probably high level permission on the inside,

0:43:31.239 --> 0:43:34.200
<v Speaker 1>and once out, Ray had the use and protection of

0:43:34.320 --> 0:43:38.799
<v Speaker 1>several false identities. Jowers refers to them as passports identities

0:43:38.880 --> 0:43:41.160
<v Speaker 1>that he could never have come up with by himself.

0:43:41.880 --> 0:43:44.640
<v Speaker 1>And so now here's Jowers, who, on the one hand

0:43:44.719 --> 0:43:47.040
<v Speaker 1>is saying that he didn't know King was to be killed,

0:43:47.600 --> 0:43:49.680
<v Speaker 1>but on the other seems to know a lot of

0:43:49.760 --> 0:43:53.239
<v Speaker 1>inside details about how Ray was moved about and brought

0:43:53.280 --> 0:43:57.400
<v Speaker 1>to Memphis. So what to make of all this? With

0:43:57.560 --> 0:44:01.080
<v Speaker 1>Lloyd Jowers and Betty Spades. Over the years, Jowers has

0:44:01.200 --> 0:44:04.400
<v Speaker 1>changed his story many times, like the absurd claim that

0:44:04.520 --> 0:44:06.560
<v Speaker 1>he didn't know who was to be murdered or who

0:44:06.640 --> 0:44:08.880
<v Speaker 1>supposedly handed him the gun at the back door to

0:44:08.960 --> 0:44:11.840
<v Speaker 1>the grill, And of course, at one point he was

0:44:11.960 --> 0:44:14.760
<v Speaker 1>clearly chasing the prospect of making money from his story.

0:44:15.480 --> 0:44:18.480
<v Speaker 1>So after this many lies, is there any reason to

0:44:18.600 --> 0:44:22.080
<v Speaker 1>believe that some part of jowers story is true? The U.

0:44:22.239 --> 0:44:25.120
<v Speaker 1>S Department of Justice doesn't think so. In the year

0:44:25.200 --> 0:44:28.520
<v Speaker 1>two thousand report, they carefully list out all of jowers

0:44:28.600 --> 0:44:33.120
<v Speaker 1>prevarications and conclude that every facet of his story is false.

0:44:33.760 --> 0:44:37.320
<v Speaker 1>The totality of the evidence, the report concludes, suggests that

0:44:37.440 --> 0:44:42.000
<v Speaker 1>Jowers fabricated his allegations, hoping to promote a sensational account

0:44:42.320 --> 0:44:46.279
<v Speaker 1>of a conspiracy to murder Dr Martin Luther King while

0:44:46.320 --> 0:44:49.800
<v Speaker 1>acknowledging the many lies told. My own view is that

0:44:49.920 --> 0:44:52.880
<v Speaker 1>it's a stretch to imagine someone making up an entirely

0:44:53.000 --> 0:44:56.560
<v Speaker 1>untrue story about being part of a horrific murder in

0:44:56.640 --> 0:44:59.520
<v Speaker 1>the hope of making some money out of it. Seems

0:44:59.560 --> 0:45:01.839
<v Speaker 1>like a out of trouble to invite into your life

0:45:02.160 --> 0:45:05.439
<v Speaker 1>for an unlikely reward. And of course, the short lived

0:45:05.520 --> 0:45:08.720
<v Speaker 1>chase for the movie deal arrived with producer Jack Saltman

0:45:08.920 --> 0:45:13.280
<v Speaker 1>after the HBO mock trial. But Betty's Space had already

0:45:13.360 --> 0:45:16.800
<v Speaker 1>told Bill Pepper about Jowers and the rifle before Jowers

0:45:16.960 --> 0:45:21.040
<v Speaker 1>or Space had ever met Jack Saltman. An attorney, Louis Garrison,

0:45:21.120 --> 0:45:24.680
<v Speaker 1>spent some long hours preparing a proposed immunity deal for

0:45:24.840 --> 0:45:27.800
<v Speaker 1>Jowers for a crime that he had confessed to Garrison

0:45:28.280 --> 0:45:32.560
<v Speaker 1>again before he met Jack Saltman. Until his recent death,

0:45:32.960 --> 0:45:37.360
<v Speaker 1>Lewis Garrison maintained a respected law practice in Memphis. He

0:45:37.560 --> 0:45:40.359
<v Speaker 1>was horrified by the murder of King, and he would

0:45:40.400 --> 0:45:43.239
<v Speaker 1>not have abused the legal system with a phony immunity

0:45:43.280 --> 0:45:46.200
<v Speaker 1>proposal so that as client might make some money on

0:45:46.280 --> 0:45:52.400
<v Speaker 1>a movie deal. He wasn't that kind of man. The

0:45:52.520 --> 0:45:55.919
<v Speaker 1>Department of Justice also concluded that Betty Space was lying,

0:45:56.600 --> 0:45:59.720
<v Speaker 1>but the motive here is hard to find. They assert

0:45:59.800 --> 0:46:01.920
<v Speaker 1>that Space's name does not appear on the list of

0:46:02.000 --> 0:46:05.120
<v Speaker 1>people in Jim's grill made right after the shooting, but

0:46:05.239 --> 0:46:08.200
<v Speaker 1>her account of her spat with jowers wife, the drunk

0:46:08.320 --> 0:46:10.880
<v Speaker 1>Charlie Stevens, being escorted out of the place by her

0:46:10.920 --> 0:46:14.680
<v Speaker 1>sister Bobby and Jowers short errands before the murder, ring

0:46:14.760 --> 0:46:17.160
<v Speaker 1>true to me, and I feel the same about her

0:46:17.200 --> 0:46:20.040
<v Speaker 1>account of Jowers coming through the back door with hair

0:46:20.160 --> 0:46:22.760
<v Speaker 1>standing on end and the knees of his pants muddy.

0:46:23.880 --> 0:46:26.280
<v Speaker 1>The d O j would also refer to a statement

0:46:26.400 --> 0:46:31.160
<v Speaker 1>that the AGS investigators got in January with Betty's space's

0:46:31.160 --> 0:46:34.400
<v Speaker 1>signature on it, saying that she had not seen Jowers

0:46:34.480 --> 0:46:36.799
<v Speaker 1>with a rifle. But a little more than a month

0:46:36.880 --> 0:46:39.440
<v Speaker 1>after that, Betty signed a statement in the presence of

0:46:39.520 --> 0:46:42.560
<v Speaker 1>Bill Pepper where she once again affirmed in detail her

0:46:42.600 --> 0:46:45.200
<v Speaker 1>original account of seeing Jowers coming through the back door

0:46:45.320 --> 0:46:48.040
<v Speaker 1>with the gun, saying, in part as read by a

0:46:48.120 --> 0:46:52.239
<v Speaker 1>voice actor, I will not retract the truthful accounts of

0:46:52.360 --> 0:46:56.040
<v Speaker 1>the events which I witnessed around six pm on April

0:46:56.080 --> 0:47:02.320
<v Speaker 1>fourt which confirms Mr jowers involvement based on everything I know,

0:47:02.920 --> 0:47:05.920
<v Speaker 1>James Earl Ray was not the person who shot Dr. King.

0:47:06.719 --> 0:47:09.400
<v Speaker 1>Other persons have tried to get me to change my story,

0:47:09.880 --> 0:47:12.759
<v Speaker 1>saying that if I did so, I would benefit financially.

0:47:13.280 --> 0:47:16.520
<v Speaker 1>I refused to do so and continue to refuse. I

0:47:16.680 --> 0:47:19.400
<v Speaker 1>was in any attempts by the attorney general or his

0:47:19.520 --> 0:47:22.839
<v Speaker 1>investigators to imply that I am telling lives for money.

0:47:24.120 --> 0:47:26.759
<v Speaker 1>So the Attorney General of the State of Tennessee has

0:47:26.800 --> 0:47:30.239
<v Speaker 1>a statement signed by Betty Space saying one thing, and

0:47:30.400 --> 0:47:34.439
<v Speaker 1>Bill Pepper has one saying something entirely different. Both things

0:47:34.520 --> 0:47:37.040
<v Speaker 1>can't be true. How to make sense out of this?

0:47:38.200 --> 0:47:41.239
<v Speaker 1>In my investigation of the murder of Robert Kennedy, I

0:47:41.360 --> 0:47:44.200
<v Speaker 1>came across recordings that have been hidden for twenty years,

0:47:44.760 --> 0:47:48.719
<v Speaker 1>recordings of dozens of police interviews of witnesses who had

0:47:48.840 --> 0:47:52.000
<v Speaker 1>inconvenient accounts of what they saw the knight of Kennedy's murder,

0:47:52.440 --> 0:47:55.760
<v Speaker 1>accounts that didn't fit with the official version of the crime.

0:47:56.520 --> 0:47:59.320
<v Speaker 1>When the investigators made it clear that they wanted a

0:47:59.440 --> 0:48:02.880
<v Speaker 1>change of ory, they often got it. Because it is

0:48:03.000 --> 0:48:06.120
<v Speaker 1>very intimidating to be visited by men in suits who

0:48:06.200 --> 0:48:08.680
<v Speaker 1>suggest that if you don't change your story, they will

0:48:08.719 --> 0:48:12.400
<v Speaker 1>have to return with more questions to discover what reason

0:48:12.520 --> 0:48:16.120
<v Speaker 1>you might have to obstruct a murder investigation by putting

0:48:16.200 --> 0:48:19.399
<v Speaker 1>forward an untrue story, which would be a very serious crime.

0:48:20.080 --> 0:48:22.600
<v Speaker 1>They might need to talk to your employer. Have you

0:48:22.680 --> 0:48:24.800
<v Speaker 1>ever been in trouble with the law, How are you

0:48:24.920 --> 0:48:27.880
<v Speaker 1>doing drugs. Perhaps you told the story to cover up

0:48:27.880 --> 0:48:31.960
<v Speaker 1>an affair. For any normal person under this kind of pressure,

0:48:32.200 --> 0:48:35.279
<v Speaker 1>where the men asking the questions have no interest in

0:48:35.400 --> 0:48:38.160
<v Speaker 1>what you saw, but only in what they want you

0:48:38.239 --> 0:48:41.400
<v Speaker 1>to say you saw, the easiest thing to do is

0:48:41.520 --> 0:48:44.560
<v Speaker 1>sign what they want you to sign and have them leave.

0:48:45.160 --> 0:48:47.880
<v Speaker 1>And this is Bill Pepper's understanding as to what happened

0:48:48.000 --> 0:48:54.000
<v Speaker 1>with Betty Spaces. Well. Betty Spates obviously was a very

0:48:54.080 --> 0:48:58.320
<v Speaker 1>important witness to the events that took place at the

0:48:58.400 --> 0:49:01.879
<v Speaker 1>time of the assassination, and so they had to try

0:49:02.000 --> 0:49:05.279
<v Speaker 1>to discredit her in every way that they could and

0:49:05.800 --> 0:49:10.240
<v Speaker 1>to try to get her to collaborate with a false story.

0:49:11.200 --> 0:49:14.879
<v Speaker 1>So they went to visit her, and they intimidated her.

0:49:15.160 --> 0:49:18.040
<v Speaker 1>They used some pressures they had on one of her children,

0:49:18.280 --> 0:49:22.080
<v Speaker 1>one of her sons. They were determined to get her

0:49:22.239 --> 0:49:26.480
<v Speaker 1>to provide a different story. But that was not the truth,

0:49:26.640 --> 0:49:31.920
<v Speaker 1>and Betty, of course told me the truth to actually tearfully.

0:49:33.160 --> 0:49:36.800
<v Speaker 1>Some time later. He wanted to tell the truth, he

0:49:36.920 --> 0:49:40.960
<v Speaker 1>wanted it out there, and she held nothing back. She

0:49:41.120 --> 0:49:45.520
<v Speaker 1>taught to her relationship with Jowers and what happened on

0:49:45.640 --> 0:49:50.759
<v Speaker 1>that afternoon exactly the way that she recalled it. I

0:49:51.000 --> 0:49:55.880
<v Speaker 1>was very, very proud of her. In the process of

0:49:55.960 --> 0:49:59.320
<v Speaker 1>trying to discredit Spats as a witness, the Department of

0:49:59.440 --> 0:50:04.000
<v Speaker 1>Justice port reveals two other instances where Betty Spates made

0:50:04.040 --> 0:50:07.719
<v Speaker 1>allegations about the murder of Dr King, and this might

0:50:07.800 --> 0:50:10.759
<v Speaker 1>be the most telling evidence of all, because this was

0:50:10.840 --> 0:50:13.920
<v Speaker 1>back in early nineteen sixty nine, less than a year

0:50:14.000 --> 0:50:18.279
<v Speaker 1>after King was killed. The first instance is short on details,

0:50:18.680 --> 0:50:21.400
<v Speaker 1>but according to the report, Betty is supposed to have

0:50:21.560 --> 0:50:24.840
<v Speaker 1>told someone that her boss, presumably Jours, was in on

0:50:24.920 --> 0:50:29.360
<v Speaker 1>the murder. This person told the police, and Space was questioned.

0:50:29.960 --> 0:50:33.160
<v Speaker 1>She denied having said any such thing. In the second,

0:50:33.480 --> 0:50:36.480
<v Speaker 1>Space was arranging bail for her brother. When she remarked

0:50:36.520 --> 0:50:39.640
<v Speaker 1>the two bailed bondsmen that she knew who shot Dr

0:50:39.800 --> 0:50:43.440
<v Speaker 1>King and that Ray was innocent. The bondsman notified the

0:50:43.520 --> 0:50:48.440
<v Speaker 1>AG's office and two investigators were sent to question Spates again.

0:50:48.719 --> 0:50:51.200
<v Speaker 1>She denied the allegation and said she didn't know a

0:50:51.280 --> 0:50:58.240
<v Speaker 1>thing about the assassination. In reviewing alleged crimes that happened

0:50:58.239 --> 0:51:01.400
<v Speaker 1>many years before, like a sexual saul, what a victim

0:51:01.520 --> 0:51:03.720
<v Speaker 1>or witness said at the time to a third party

0:51:04.080 --> 0:51:08.040
<v Speaker 1>is regarded as strong evidence, but to the Department of Justice.

0:51:08.320 --> 0:51:12.399
<v Speaker 1>The fact that Spates twice denied her reported accusations when

0:51:12.480 --> 0:51:16.120
<v Speaker 1>confronted by law enforcement proved to them that her murder

0:51:16.239 --> 0:51:19.279
<v Speaker 1>stories were untrue. Of course, one might well see it

0:51:19.400 --> 0:51:22.440
<v Speaker 1>the other way. One might perceive a woman who saw

0:51:22.560 --> 0:51:25.080
<v Speaker 1>something so disturbing that she lets it out in an

0:51:25.200 --> 0:51:28.800
<v Speaker 1>unguarded moment, but when the lawman show up, she becomes frightened,

0:51:28.920 --> 0:51:31.920
<v Speaker 1>so she denies she ever said it. And if Jowers

0:51:32.040 --> 0:51:35.000
<v Speaker 1>came through that door with a smoking rifle, as Space

0:51:35.040 --> 0:51:37.600
<v Speaker 1>said he did, and as he said he did, and

0:51:37.719 --> 0:51:40.239
<v Speaker 1>as lawyer said he did, then you can put away

0:51:40.280 --> 0:51:42.440
<v Speaker 1>most of what you've been told about the murder of Dr. King.

0:51:43.480 --> 0:51:46.600
<v Speaker 1>And remember, Betty Space was never part of the movie scheme.

0:51:47.040 --> 0:51:49.399
<v Speaker 1>She didn't want to be on TV, and she never

0:51:49.600 --> 0:51:52.440
<v Speaker 1>at any time asked for a single thing for her story.

0:51:53.480 --> 0:51:55.680
<v Speaker 1>I want to play again what she said about what

0:51:55.800 --> 0:51:58.479
<v Speaker 1>Jowers and the movie bunch had wanted her to say.

0:51:59.560 --> 0:52:02.080
<v Speaker 1>They want me to tell the truth about seeing him

0:52:02.160 --> 0:52:05.560
<v Speaker 1>with the rifle. He just wanted to change it just

0:52:05.719 --> 0:52:10.480
<v Speaker 1>a little bit by saying I saw him standing in

0:52:10.560 --> 0:52:14.239
<v Speaker 1>the back door and a black man passing him a

0:52:14.320 --> 0:52:19.719
<v Speaker 1>right and that's not true, and he said if I

0:52:19.800 --> 0:52:23.520
<v Speaker 1>didn't say it, I will lose my share of three

0:52:23.600 --> 0:52:28.120
<v Speaker 1>hundred thousand dollars plus royalties to do it. And I

0:52:28.239 --> 0:52:30.360
<v Speaker 1>told him, I can't love me nothing. I never hate it.

0:52:31.520 --> 0:52:34.600
<v Speaker 1>I believe that Betty Spits saw what she said she saw.

0:52:35.320 --> 0:52:37.759
<v Speaker 1>I don't believe the men in suits. I've seen what

0:52:37.880 --> 0:52:48.400
<v Speaker 1>they do next time on the Emilk tapes. Memphis is

0:52:48.800 --> 0:52:52.840
<v Speaker 1>an interesting reputation of being the first degree murder capital

0:52:53.000 --> 0:52:56.440
<v Speaker 1>of America, and in that context we're not talking about

0:52:56.600 --> 0:53:01.920
<v Speaker 1>street crime, but organized hitch. I heard some noise, and

0:53:02.120 --> 0:53:06.239
<v Speaker 1>I was sitting in my kitchen, and I'm be getting

0:53:06.239 --> 0:53:09.720
<v Speaker 1>aware of some shadows out back, in some out front.

0:53:09.880 --> 0:53:12.800
<v Speaker 1>And to make a long story short, two people tried

0:53:12.920 --> 0:53:15.279
<v Speaker 1>to break in the front, three in the back at

0:53:15.360 --> 0:53:19.400
<v Speaker 1>the same time. More scientific tests may be conducted on

0:53:19.600 --> 0:53:22.319
<v Speaker 1>James Earl Ray's rifle to see if it was used

0:53:22.360 --> 0:53:26.759
<v Speaker 1>to kill Martin Luther King. Tests described Friday were inconclusive,

0:53:26.840 --> 0:53:29.600
<v Speaker 1>though a build up of material and the rifle barrel

0:53:29.680 --> 0:53:33.359
<v Speaker 1>could be to blame. Did you attempt to determine from

0:53:33.400 --> 0:53:38.040
<v Speaker 1>outside the skin the structure of that bullet under the skin? Yes?

0:53:38.160 --> 0:53:41.200
<v Speaker 1>Or I did, and you could take your finger and

0:53:41.560 --> 0:53:44.600
<v Speaker 1>pinch and feel and roll that bullet under the skin.

0:53:45.239 --> 0:53:48.160
<v Speaker 1>You're saying, what you all saw taking out of Dr

0:53:48.280 --> 0:53:50.960
<v Speaker 1>King looked like that. We felt like we found a

0:53:51.000 --> 0:53:58.360
<v Speaker 1>piece of gold when we found a bullet. Thanks for

0:53:58.400 --> 0:54:00.919
<v Speaker 1>listening to the MLK Tapes for auction of iHeart Radio

0:54:01.040 --> 0:54:04.799
<v Speaker 1>and Tenderfoot TV. This podcast is not specifically endorsed by

0:54:04.840 --> 0:54:07.400
<v Speaker 1>the King Family or the King of State. The Email

0:54:07.480 --> 0:54:10.399
<v Speaker 1>K Tapes is written and hosted by Bill Claper. Matt

0:54:10.480 --> 0:54:13.400
<v Speaker 1>Frederick and Alex Williams are executive producers on behalf of

0:54:13.480 --> 0:54:16.800
<v Speaker 1>I Heart Radio with producers Trevor Young and ben Keebrick.

0:54:17.320 --> 0:54:20.400
<v Speaker 1>Donald Albright and Payne Lindsay are executive producers on behalf

0:54:20.440 --> 0:54:24.320
<v Speaker 1>of Tenderfoot TV with producers Jamie Albright and Meredith Stepman.

0:54:24.840 --> 0:54:28.359
<v Speaker 1>Original music by Makeup and Vanity Set. Cover art by

0:54:28.480 --> 0:54:33.280
<v Speaker 1>Mr Soul to six with photography by Artemus Jenkins. Special

0:54:33.360 --> 0:54:36.120
<v Speaker 1>thanks to Owen Rosenbaum and Grace Royer at u t A,

0:54:36.560 --> 0:54:40.719
<v Speaker 1>The Nord Group, back Median Marketing, Envisioned Business Management, and

0:54:40.840 --> 0:54:44.480
<v Speaker 1>Station sixteen. If you have questions, you can visit our website,

0:54:44.719 --> 0:54:47.960
<v Speaker 1>The Email K Tapes dot com. We posted photos and

0:54:48.120 --> 0:54:50.960
<v Speaker 1>videos related to the podcast on our social media accounts.

0:54:51.200 --> 0:54:53.400
<v Speaker 1>You can check them out at the email k tapes.

0:54:54.040 --> 0:54:56.759
<v Speaker 1>For more podcasts from I Heart Radio and Tenderfoot TV,

0:54:57.080 --> 0:55:00.319
<v Speaker 1>please visit the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever

0:55:00.480 --> 0:55:01.680
<v Speaker 1>you listen to your favorite shows,