1 00:00:01,680 --> 00:00:04,200 Speaker 1: Welcome to Wellness on Mass I'm doctor Nicole Safire and 2 00:00:04,240 --> 00:00:05,960 Speaker 1: we are going to dive right in. It has been 3 00:00:06,559 --> 00:00:09,399 Speaker 1: a really busy week the last couple of weeks, between 4 00:00:09,480 --> 00:00:11,959 Speaker 1: the two days worth of ACIP meetings with the CDC 5 00:00:12,240 --> 00:00:16,360 Speaker 1: and also the big press conference with President Trump and 6 00:00:16,640 --> 00:00:20,040 Speaker 1: essentially the entire HHS standing behind him. We have a 7 00:00:20,040 --> 00:00:24,479 Speaker 1: lot to cover, and I mean we only have thirty minutes, 8 00:00:24,560 --> 00:00:27,040 Speaker 1: so it's a lot to cover, but we're going to 9 00:00:27,120 --> 00:00:31,640 Speaker 1: do it. I am always very honest with everyone my opinions. 10 00:00:32,080 --> 00:00:34,879 Speaker 1: People sometimes get mad at me because they feel like 11 00:00:34,920 --> 00:00:37,240 Speaker 1: I'm not a loyalist, whether one way or the other. 12 00:00:37,320 --> 00:00:39,199 Speaker 1: But at the end of the day, I think my 13 00:00:39,440 --> 00:00:43,320 Speaker 1: role as a physician, as a human, as an American 14 00:00:43,560 --> 00:00:46,200 Speaker 1: is to kind of just tell you what I'm thinking 15 00:00:46,240 --> 00:00:48,920 Speaker 1: and kind of make some sense of all this mess. 16 00:00:49,680 --> 00:00:51,680 Speaker 1: We did that throughout COVID and we're going to keep 17 00:00:51,680 --> 00:00:54,600 Speaker 1: doing that right now. So the good news is during 18 00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:56,840 Speaker 1: the White House press conference, they kind of talked about 19 00:00:56,880 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 1: what those ACT meetings were all about, so we can 20 00:00:59,280 --> 00:01:01,760 Speaker 1: combine them all. One of the big things that came 21 00:01:01,800 --> 00:01:05,400 Speaker 1: out of the ACIP meeting was that the formal recommendation 22 00:01:05,680 --> 00:01:09,560 Speaker 1: is to separate the MMR vaccine that measles, mumps, and 23 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:14,360 Speaker 1: rubella from the vericella vaccine. Aricella is chicken pox. It 24 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:17,840 Speaker 1: was a formal recommendation saying for kids under four, so 25 00:01:17,880 --> 00:01:21,720 Speaker 1: that first dose of the vaccine they should be separated 26 00:01:21,800 --> 00:01:26,200 Speaker 1: into two separate injections. Well, this isn't really groundbreaking news. 27 00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:29,840 Speaker 1: In fact, that was already the recommendation from ASIP from 28 00:01:29,840 --> 00:01:33,760 Speaker 1: about a decade ago. They're just now saying insurance companies 29 00:01:33,800 --> 00:01:37,080 Speaker 1: are not going to cover it if you want to 30 00:01:37,160 --> 00:01:40,839 Speaker 1: choose to have that combined dose. The reason they recommend 31 00:01:41,240 --> 00:01:45,080 Speaker 1: having those two doses separated is because when they found 32 00:01:45,160 --> 00:01:49,560 Speaker 1: that they combined the four different vaccines, the measles, lumps, rubella, 33 00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:53,520 Speaker 1: and aricella, there was a slightly higher risk of febrile 34 00:01:53,560 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 1: and aphebrile post vaccination caizures and that's real. Thankfully, the 35 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:02,040 Speaker 1: majority of children cover without incident from the seizures, but 36 00:02:02,080 --> 00:02:04,960 Speaker 1: they're still scary and if we can avoid seizures, I 37 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:06,600 Speaker 1: think that would be the right thing to do. So 38 00:02:06,640 --> 00:02:09,640 Speaker 1: it makes sense they found children over the age of 39 00:02:09,639 --> 00:02:12,840 Speaker 1: four didn't have this risk of seizures following it, so 40 00:02:13,080 --> 00:02:15,880 Speaker 1: after the age of four, you can combine the vaccines. 41 00:02:16,360 --> 00:02:19,400 Speaker 1: So for about eighty five percent of all children for 42 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:22,360 Speaker 1: the last eight to ten years or so, they've already 43 00:02:22,360 --> 00:02:25,280 Speaker 1: had these vaccines separated, meaning they have to come back 44 00:02:25,320 --> 00:02:28,320 Speaker 1: for two different doctor's appointments to get two different vaccines. 45 00:02:29,200 --> 00:02:32,560 Speaker 1: Fifteen percent of kids were still getting that combined dose, 46 00:02:33,160 --> 00:02:36,520 Speaker 1: even knowing there was a slightly higher risk of seizures. 47 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:40,280 Speaker 1: So the pediatricians who were administrating the combined dose for 48 00:02:40,400 --> 00:02:42,960 Speaker 1: kids under four, they did this knowing there was a 49 00:02:42,960 --> 00:02:46,880 Speaker 1: slightly increased risk of seizures, but they were concerned, whether 50 00:02:47,480 --> 00:02:49,480 Speaker 1: they were concerned the parents wouldn't come back for the 51 00:02:49,520 --> 00:02:52,520 Speaker 1: second dose or whatever, the reasons being, they had to 52 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:56,000 Speaker 1: weigh that risk with potential benefit of the vaccine. This 53 00:02:56,200 --> 00:02:58,800 Speaker 1: latest ACEIP is saying that is no longer an option. 54 00:02:59,440 --> 00:03:02,360 Speaker 1: You have to separate the doses. I don't see anything 55 00:03:02,400 --> 00:03:05,079 Speaker 1: wrong with this. In fact, I agree with it. If 56 00:03:05,080 --> 00:03:07,560 Speaker 1: we can avoid a risk of seizures, we should be 57 00:03:07,600 --> 00:03:11,079 Speaker 1: doing it. So this is great news. I think that's fine. 58 00:03:11,160 --> 00:03:13,000 Speaker 1: The other big issue that came out of the AST 59 00:03:13,080 --> 00:03:15,560 Speaker 1: meetings was what to do with the birth dose of 60 00:03:15,600 --> 00:03:19,480 Speaker 1: the hepatitis B vaccine. Should all children be given this 61 00:03:19,600 --> 00:03:23,480 Speaker 1: vaccine before they leave the hospital, the birth dose. You know, 62 00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 1: this is something that I've talked about a lot. I 63 00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:28,320 Speaker 1: don't necessarily think it's necessary. I think this is one 64 00:03:28,360 --> 00:03:31,240 Speaker 1: of those vaccines that should be done based on risk. 65 00:03:31,960 --> 00:03:36,720 Speaker 1: Since the nineteen eighties nineteen nineties, when the hepatitis B 66 00:03:36,840 --> 00:03:41,160 Speaker 1: vaccine became available, yes, we saw cases of hepatitis B 67 00:03:41,280 --> 00:03:44,240 Speaker 1: go down. Another thing that was also happening during this 68 00:03:44,360 --> 00:03:49,000 Speaker 1: time was we started testing pregnant women for hepatitis B 69 00:03:49,160 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 1: virus to know what their status was. That could also 70 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:56,640 Speaker 1: have contributed to the decrease in babies being born with 71 00:03:56,680 --> 00:04:01,240 Speaker 1: hepatitis B. For me, my opinion is if a woman 72 00:04:01,560 --> 00:04:05,000 Speaker 1: recently tested negative for hepatitis B and they're living a 73 00:04:05,240 --> 00:04:09,960 Speaker 1: low risk lifestyle, no IV drug use, not a sex worker, 74 00:04:10,320 --> 00:04:13,640 Speaker 1: they don't have it hepatitis BE positive person living in 75 00:04:13,680 --> 00:04:17,720 Speaker 1: the home, then the newborn probably doesn't need this vaccine 76 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:19,800 Speaker 1: and we can have a conversation about whether or not 77 00:04:19,839 --> 00:04:22,719 Speaker 1: they should get the vaccine later in life. What the 78 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:25,720 Speaker 1: ACIP was wanting to vote on was saying we're not 79 00:04:25,760 --> 00:04:28,200 Speaker 1: going to give that dose at birth. We just want 80 00:04:28,200 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 1: to give it at one month when the baby's slightly older. 81 00:04:31,600 --> 00:04:35,200 Speaker 1: The problem with that is there's no data that supports 82 00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:38,880 Speaker 1: or goes against the birth dose versus one month, So 83 00:04:38,880 --> 00:04:42,279 Speaker 1: how can you really have that conversation or even put 84 00:04:42,279 --> 00:04:45,320 Speaker 1: it forth a recommendation. The reality is you can't, which 85 00:04:45,320 --> 00:04:47,559 Speaker 1: is why they decided not to. There was a motion 86 00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:51,760 Speaker 1: to postpone the conversation indefinitely, so they didn't even vote 87 00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:55,919 Speaker 1: on that. President Trump brought that back up at the 88 00:04:55,920 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 1: press conference. I'm going to get to that. I just 89 00:04:57,680 --> 00:04:59,800 Speaker 1: want to mention the third thing that came out of 90 00:04:59,839 --> 00:05:02,880 Speaker 1: the ACIP meetings before we move on to the press conference. 91 00:05:03,760 --> 00:05:06,320 Speaker 1: The third thing that came out was all about the 92 00:05:06,320 --> 00:05:08,200 Speaker 1: COVID vaccine and this is what we were all kind 93 00:05:08,200 --> 00:05:11,440 Speaker 1: of waiting for what are going to be the formal recommendations. 94 00:05:11,480 --> 00:05:15,800 Speaker 1: And the big thing was ACIP finally is saying no 95 00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:20,760 Speaker 1: more universal recommendation for COVID vaccines and boosters. What was 96 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:24,560 Speaker 1: the mantra of the entire Biden administration of every baby 97 00:05:24,680 --> 00:05:28,320 Speaker 1: six months and older to adulthood until the day you die, 98 00:05:28,680 --> 00:05:32,400 Speaker 1: you should be getting the full vaccine series of COVID 99 00:05:32,560 --> 00:05:38,160 Speaker 1: plus one, maybe even two boosters every single year into perpetuity. Obviously, 100 00:05:38,480 --> 00:05:41,080 Speaker 1: that makes no sense, as we have gone on to 101 00:05:41,200 --> 00:05:44,520 Speaker 1: show that the virus itself has starting to decrease in 102 00:05:44,600 --> 00:05:48,240 Speaker 1: severity and virulence. You have so much natural immunity, we 103 00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:51,120 Speaker 1: have a lot of vaccine induced immunity. And really this 104 00:05:51,160 --> 00:05:55,359 Speaker 1: should also be one of those risk vaccines. The higher 105 00:05:55,440 --> 00:05:58,120 Speaker 1: risk you are, the more you should consider the boosters, 106 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:02,480 Speaker 1: and especially in the low risk populars like specifically adolescents 107 00:06:02,720 --> 00:06:06,400 Speaker 1: and school age kids, the risk benefit scenario with the 108 00:06:06,400 --> 00:06:09,159 Speaker 1: COVID vaccine just may not make sense. And that's essentially 109 00:06:09,200 --> 00:06:12,719 Speaker 1: what ACIP said. Now they did not go as far 110 00:06:12,880 --> 00:06:16,360 Speaker 1: to say that you can't access the vaccine if you 111 00:06:16,400 --> 00:06:18,680 Speaker 1: are a healthy young adult or a healthy adolescent. They 112 00:06:18,680 --> 00:06:21,159 Speaker 1: didn't say that at all. In fact, they tried to 113 00:06:21,279 --> 00:06:24,760 Speaker 1: vote saying you needed a prescription, and they tried to 114 00:06:25,080 --> 00:06:28,680 Speaker 1: decrease access to the vaccines, but those votes failed. The 115 00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:32,159 Speaker 1: only votes that passed in ACIP regarding the COVID vaccine 116 00:06:32,200 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 1: is just to change the recommendations that it should be 117 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:39,920 Speaker 1: risk based and anyone else considering the vaccine should have 118 00:06:40,440 --> 00:06:43,920 Speaker 1: a conversation with their doctor about the risks and benefits 119 00:06:44,080 --> 00:06:47,360 Speaker 1: of this vaccine. And I think how could anybody argue 120 00:06:47,360 --> 00:06:49,480 Speaker 1: with that of course you should always have that conversation, 121 00:06:49,960 --> 00:06:54,040 Speaker 1: and physicians should be forthcoming with the you know, perhaps 122 00:06:54,480 --> 00:06:58,560 Speaker 1: very low benefit of vaccines in a healthy individual and 123 00:06:58,600 --> 00:07:03,640 Speaker 1: the very real risk, especially an adolescent boys, with this vaccine. 124 00:07:03,760 --> 00:07:07,080 Speaker 1: I think these conversations, this information, these are all good things. 125 00:07:07,160 --> 00:07:10,920 Speaker 1: I think it's great that the votes didn't pass restricting access. 126 00:07:11,440 --> 00:07:15,400 Speaker 1: If the vote for requiring a prescription for this vaccine 127 00:07:15,440 --> 00:07:18,200 Speaker 1: would have passed, it would have been a logistical nightmare, 128 00:07:19,120 --> 00:07:21,760 Speaker 1: but it didn't, so there's really nothing bad you can 129 00:07:21,760 --> 00:07:25,400 Speaker 1: say about. I think everything that happened was good. It 130 00:07:25,440 --> 00:07:27,920 Speaker 1: was very frustrating to watch some of the ASIP meetings. 131 00:07:28,040 --> 00:07:30,080 Speaker 1: Clearly a lot of the people who are putting together 132 00:07:30,120 --> 00:07:33,160 Speaker 1: the votes and some of the talking points have no 133 00:07:33,280 --> 00:07:36,680 Speaker 1: idea what it's like practicing medicine. They have only worked 134 00:07:36,720 --> 00:07:40,240 Speaker 1: in a lab or have only been surrounded by data, 135 00:07:40,600 --> 00:07:42,560 Speaker 1: which you need those people. You need people who are 136 00:07:42,640 --> 00:07:44,800 Speaker 1: very good at data, but you also have to balance 137 00:07:44,880 --> 00:07:47,960 Speaker 1: that with the practicality of what it's like working in 138 00:07:48,000 --> 00:07:50,680 Speaker 1: real world healthcare. Didn't feel like we had much of 139 00:07:50,680 --> 00:07:54,080 Speaker 1: that balance. Definitely felt like a lot of ideology was 140 00:07:54,120 --> 00:07:58,600 Speaker 1: being presented, a lot of flawed data that in the 141 00:07:58,640 --> 00:08:02,400 Speaker 1: real world of academia. We would never even consider because 142 00:08:02,400 --> 00:08:05,200 Speaker 1: a lot of it was not legitimate. Some of it was, 143 00:08:05,320 --> 00:08:08,880 Speaker 1: but a lot of it was not. It was very frustrating. 144 00:08:08,920 --> 00:08:11,640 Speaker 1: But we don't need to get into the details of that, 145 00:08:11,680 --> 00:08:14,320 Speaker 1: you know, I because the granular details don't even matter 146 00:08:14,400 --> 00:08:17,200 Speaker 1: because the results were fine. And I think all of 147 00:08:17,200 --> 00:08:19,680 Speaker 1: those results are fine, and anybody who's causing an uproar 148 00:08:19,720 --> 00:08:24,239 Speaker 1: over it don't really understand the implications. Nothing major has changed. 149 00:08:24,440 --> 00:08:27,679 Speaker 1: It's all going to be okay. Now, let's fast forward 150 00:08:27,720 --> 00:08:32,720 Speaker 1: to the big White House press briefing or announcement that 151 00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:37,440 Speaker 1: just came Monday night. This was this was a big deal, 152 00:08:38,120 --> 00:08:41,320 Speaker 1: and let me tell you, it was really painful to watch. 153 00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:45,480 Speaker 1: President Trump came out. He was flagged behind him by 154 00:08:46,200 --> 00:08:51,960 Speaker 1: HHS Secretary RFK Junior FDA Commissioner Marty McCarey, NIH director 155 00:08:52,080 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 1: Jay Bodicharia, and CMS director Memet Oz. There was a 156 00:08:56,720 --> 00:09:02,440 Speaker 1: lot of information presented at this press conference. Some of 157 00:09:02,440 --> 00:09:06,360 Speaker 1: it was factually correct, some of it was factually incorrect. 158 00:09:06,800 --> 00:09:09,720 Speaker 1: The problem I had was it was full of hyperbole. 159 00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:14,400 Speaker 1: And not only do facts matter, but the messaging matters too. 160 00:09:14,520 --> 00:09:16,760 Speaker 1: And I can only say this so many times. The 161 00:09:16,840 --> 00:09:21,640 Speaker 1: overarching message of this press conference is that autism rates 162 00:09:21,640 --> 00:09:24,920 Speaker 1: are on the rise. They are. Yes, some of that 163 00:09:24,960 --> 00:09:28,160 Speaker 1: has to do with the expanded diagnostic criteria of autism 164 00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:32,360 Speaker 1: spectrum disorder and including Aspergers and others. So yes, that 165 00:09:32,440 --> 00:09:35,920 Speaker 1: contributes to it. You can't deny that that absolutely contributes 166 00:09:35,960 --> 00:09:38,679 Speaker 1: to it. But something more is going on. There are 167 00:09:38,720 --> 00:09:44,320 Speaker 1: more children being born with neurodegenerative diseases than before. That's 168 00:09:44,360 --> 00:09:48,320 Speaker 1: also undeniable. So the question is why is that? The 169 00:09:48,360 --> 00:09:54,320 Speaker 1: conversation about acetaminifin commonly known as paracetamol or thailool, but 170 00:09:54,400 --> 00:10:00,559 Speaker 1: acetaminifin in pregnancy and associated with ADHD and the baby 171 00:10:00,679 --> 00:10:04,040 Speaker 1: or autism spectrum disorder. This is not a new conversation. 172 00:10:04,559 --> 00:10:08,079 Speaker 1: In fact, we've been having it for decades. Why is that? 173 00:10:08,120 --> 00:10:11,000 Speaker 1: Because there have been a lot of observational studies that 174 00:10:11,040 --> 00:10:13,520 Speaker 1: have looked at women who have taken a stamnifin and 175 00:10:13,720 --> 00:10:17,440 Speaker 1: the potential risk of autism. There have been a good 176 00:10:17,440 --> 00:10:20,720 Speaker 1: amount of observational studies looking at women who have taken 177 00:10:20,800 --> 00:10:24,199 Speaker 1: a staminifin during pregnancy and a slight increased risk of 178 00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:28,839 Speaker 1: autism spectrum diagnosis and ADHD in their babies. Now these 179 00:10:28,880 --> 00:10:31,719 Speaker 1: are what we call observational studies. Meaning one of the 180 00:10:31,720 --> 00:10:34,680 Speaker 1: bigger ones was I think twenty nineteen from Johns Hopkins. 181 00:10:34,679 --> 00:10:36,920 Speaker 1: They looked at cord blood analysis, you know, the blood 182 00:10:37,040 --> 00:10:41,760 Speaker 1: in an umbelical cord, and they found higher metabolites from 183 00:10:41,800 --> 00:10:45,079 Speaker 1: a staminifin in the children who were born with autism. 184 00:10:45,679 --> 00:10:51,839 Speaker 1: So does that correlation mean that the acetaminifhin cause the autism? Well, again, 185 00:10:52,000 --> 00:10:55,720 Speaker 1: correlation does not mean causation. And I think you're probably 186 00:10:55,720 --> 00:10:57,400 Speaker 1: going to hear that a lot of times. We heard 187 00:10:57,400 --> 00:10:58,880 Speaker 1: a lot of that during COVID and you're going to 188 00:10:58,920 --> 00:11:04,160 Speaker 1: hear it now. But it's true. Correlation means that, Okay, 189 00:11:04,240 --> 00:11:07,679 Speaker 1: there was a staminifin there and now the child has autism. 190 00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:10,320 Speaker 1: So it's a corelate. But was it the acetaminifin that 191 00:11:10,440 --> 00:11:14,360 Speaker 1: caused the autism? And that's what the studies haven't proven 192 00:11:14,440 --> 00:11:18,480 Speaker 1: yet Because why are people taking acetaminifit? Well, yes, we 193 00:11:18,559 --> 00:11:21,319 Speaker 1: take it for a pain reliever. We also take it 194 00:11:21,360 --> 00:11:24,400 Speaker 1: for fever. So if a woman, a pregnant woman gets 195 00:11:24,440 --> 00:11:27,520 Speaker 1: an infection and then she gets all that inflammation and 196 00:11:27,559 --> 00:11:30,720 Speaker 1: that inflammation causes the fever, it's the body's natural response 197 00:11:30,800 --> 00:11:34,840 Speaker 1: to try and fight off that infection. Oftentimes they'll take 198 00:11:35,120 --> 00:11:38,360 Speaker 1: taileanol to reduce that fever. So what is it exactly 199 00:11:38,400 --> 00:11:41,400 Speaker 1: that's causing autism? Is it the infection, is it the inflammation, 200 00:11:41,880 --> 00:11:44,160 Speaker 1: or was it the tileanol? All of these things are 201 00:11:44,160 --> 00:11:48,080 Speaker 1: potential correlates. They have not actually figured out what is 202 00:11:48,120 --> 00:11:51,360 Speaker 1: the cause. You're listening to Wellness and Mass. We'll be 203 00:11:51,480 --> 00:11:57,959 Speaker 1: right back with more. At this press conference, no new 204 00:11:58,080 --> 00:12:03,079 Speaker 1: data was presented. Yes, they highlighted this recently published study 205 00:12:03,320 --> 00:12:07,200 Speaker 1: just last month that included some Harvard professors in it 206 00:12:07,360 --> 00:12:10,679 Speaker 1: public health, and what that was was a meta analysis. 207 00:12:10,760 --> 00:12:14,280 Speaker 1: It wasn't new data. They just said, look at all 208 00:12:14,320 --> 00:12:17,320 Speaker 1: of these studies. All of these studies have shown that 209 00:12:17,360 --> 00:12:20,319 Speaker 1: there may be a correlate between a set of menifin 210 00:12:20,480 --> 00:12:25,120 Speaker 1: use and autism. That's undeniable. You cannot deny that that exists. 211 00:12:25,800 --> 00:12:28,080 Speaker 1: But you also can't deny the flip side of that, 212 00:12:28,440 --> 00:12:32,480 Speaker 1: which is there have been studies, specifically a very large 213 00:12:32,480 --> 00:12:35,560 Speaker 1: one out of Sweden that included about two point five 214 00:12:35,720 --> 00:12:40,199 Speaker 1: million kids where they tried to control for that correlation. 215 00:12:40,360 --> 00:12:42,920 Speaker 1: They looked at siblings, and they looked and they tried 216 00:12:42,920 --> 00:12:46,320 Speaker 1: to remove some of those confounding factors and what they 217 00:12:46,400 --> 00:12:50,320 Speaker 1: found was before they removed those confounding factors, there was 218 00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 1: about a five percent increased risk of a child being 219 00:12:53,559 --> 00:12:58,520 Speaker 1: born with autism spectrum disorder ADHD if tylinol was used, 220 00:12:58,559 --> 00:13:02,200 Speaker 1: but when they removed some of those other factors, that 221 00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:05,160 Speaker 1: risk went down to zero. So they found there was 222 00:13:05,320 --> 00:13:11,520 Speaker 1: no causal link of acetamnifin and autism spectrum disorder. So 223 00:13:12,280 --> 00:13:16,440 Speaker 1: no one has been able to prove causative link between 224 00:13:16,559 --> 00:13:21,520 Speaker 1: aceta minifin and autism spectrum disorder. FDA Commissioner Marty mckarey 225 00:13:22,600 --> 00:13:26,720 Speaker 1: quoted this Harvard study and he said that they were 226 00:13:26,720 --> 00:13:29,880 Speaker 1: able to find a causal link, but I have to 227 00:13:29,880 --> 00:13:32,920 Speaker 1: be honest with you if you read the study, No 228 00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:36,480 Speaker 1: they didn't, and they say they didn't. They said, and 229 00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:38,600 Speaker 1: I want to actually just quote it here because I 230 00:13:38,600 --> 00:13:40,280 Speaker 1: don't want to give you my opinion. I want to 231 00:13:40,360 --> 00:13:45,160 Speaker 1: quote exactly what the study says. Our analysis demonstrated evidence 232 00:13:45,240 --> 00:13:48,559 Speaker 1: consistent with an association between exposure to a state of 233 00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:53,120 Speaker 1: minifin during pregnancy and offspring with neurodegenerative disorders including a 234 00:13:53,520 --> 00:14:01,360 Speaker 1: SD and ADHD, though observational limitations preclude definitive causation. So 235 00:14:01,960 --> 00:14:06,400 Speaker 1: again there are studies showing there's a correlation, but there 236 00:14:06,440 --> 00:14:09,959 Speaker 1: is not a strong study showing causation. And even though 237 00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:12,640 Speaker 1: what was said at the press conference yesterday was that 238 00:14:12,679 --> 00:14:15,840 Speaker 1: they have found a study pointing to causation, that's just 239 00:14:15,920 --> 00:14:19,680 Speaker 1: not true. Now the takeaway isn't, well, we should just 240 00:14:19,720 --> 00:14:22,680 Speaker 1: take as much, say to minefit as we want in pregnancy. No, 241 00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:27,240 Speaker 1: absolutely not. There are still enough studies there, there's enough 242 00:14:27,280 --> 00:14:30,560 Speaker 1: correlation that we have to err on the side of caution. 243 00:14:31,200 --> 00:14:33,280 Speaker 1: And that is really what the message should be. It 244 00:14:33,280 --> 00:14:37,640 Speaker 1: should be that for minor aches and pains, you have 245 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:43,000 Speaker 1: to try other things. You want to try, massage, acupuncture, aromatherapy, anything, 246 00:14:43,720 --> 00:14:47,520 Speaker 1: just trying to relax. Don't grab for the tit bottle 247 00:14:48,080 --> 00:14:50,880 Speaker 1: anytime you want. But we have to really do away 248 00:14:50,880 --> 00:14:54,600 Speaker 1: from that paternalistic culture where the President came out and said, 249 00:14:54,640 --> 00:14:57,600 Speaker 1: you just have to toughen it out. It's really hard, 250 00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:00,320 Speaker 1: I'll be honest for a woman to hear as, oh, 251 00:15:00,360 --> 00:15:02,480 Speaker 1: we can't toughen it out. I'll be honest. I think 252 00:15:02,560 --> 00:15:05,400 Speaker 1: women are much more tough than men, specifically when it 253 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:09,880 Speaker 1: comes to physical ailments. But it's not about toughing it out, 254 00:15:10,000 --> 00:15:13,520 Speaker 1: certainly not when pregnancy when we're talking about pregnancy, there 255 00:15:13,560 --> 00:15:16,800 Speaker 1: are a lot of physiological changes that occur. And while 256 00:15:16,840 --> 00:15:20,320 Speaker 1: I think for the majority of aches and pains, we 257 00:15:20,400 --> 00:15:23,240 Speaker 1: can toughen it out, and we should, especially because there's 258 00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:26,800 Speaker 1: a potential correlative link of neurodegenerative disorder and a set 259 00:15:26,840 --> 00:15:29,440 Speaker 1: of minifin. However, I can also tell you when it 260 00:15:29,440 --> 00:15:32,080 Speaker 1: comes to high fever, there should be no amount of 261 00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:36,000 Speaker 1: toughing it out, because when women have fever and pregnancy, 262 00:15:36,240 --> 00:15:38,480 Speaker 1: they have up to a forty percent risk of a 263 00:15:38,600 --> 00:15:42,960 Speaker 1: child with neurodegenerative disorder. If they have multiple fevers during pregnancy, 264 00:15:43,080 --> 00:15:46,720 Speaker 1: especially in that second and third trimester, that risk triples. 265 00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:50,840 Speaker 1: That is significantly higher than any risk that has ever 266 00:15:50,880 --> 00:15:53,280 Speaker 1: been reported using a set of minifin when it comes 267 00:15:53,360 --> 00:15:57,280 Speaker 1: to neudegenerative disorder. So my biggest fear is that the 268 00:15:57,280 --> 00:16:01,640 Speaker 1: message at this press conference was women should not consider 269 00:16:01,680 --> 00:16:04,560 Speaker 1: a set of minefit in pregnancy no matter what. They 270 00:16:04,600 --> 00:16:08,080 Speaker 1: have more fear now from that medication, and they don't 271 00:16:08,080 --> 00:16:11,080 Speaker 1: have the fear of a high fever, which is a 272 00:16:11,200 --> 00:16:13,800 Speaker 1: much bigger risk for not only than mother, but that 273 00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:16,760 Speaker 1: baby that's forming too. So the messaging was wrong in 274 00:16:16,800 --> 00:16:19,760 Speaker 1: my opinion. The President continued to come out and saying 275 00:16:19,800 --> 00:16:23,440 Speaker 1: tailan all's bad, tialan all is bad. The message should 276 00:16:23,480 --> 00:16:27,040 Speaker 1: have been tilanyl should be used sparingly in pregnant women. 277 00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:30,240 Speaker 1: There's research there, but it's unfinished research. We need to 278 00:16:30,240 --> 00:16:32,400 Speaker 1: put more time and effort into this because we have 279 00:16:32,480 --> 00:16:35,080 Speaker 1: to make sure that pregnant women have something safe to 280 00:16:35,120 --> 00:16:38,400 Speaker 1: take during pregnancy, and the constellation of research right now 281 00:16:38,400 --> 00:16:42,400 Speaker 1: tells us that using thailan al sparingly at the lowest 282 00:16:42,560 --> 00:16:47,280 Speaker 1: possible effective dose is what's safest for the mother and baby, 283 00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:51,160 Speaker 1: especially in cases of high fever. That message was lost 284 00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:55,600 Speaker 1: at the press conference yesterday, and I think that it 285 00:16:55,640 --> 00:16:58,400 Speaker 1: was un very unfortunate because when we're in a time 286 00:16:58,720 --> 00:17:04,959 Speaker 1: of chaos and public public trust erosion, messaging matters. It 287 00:17:05,040 --> 00:17:09,280 Speaker 1: really does. Now there's a firestorm across the country that 288 00:17:09,520 --> 00:17:12,879 Speaker 1: is just creating this massive divide, and the reality is 289 00:17:13,720 --> 00:17:15,720 Speaker 1: it shouldn't have been. This was a great message that 290 00:17:15,760 --> 00:17:17,879 Speaker 1: came out of the White House. What it was was 291 00:17:17,920 --> 00:17:22,399 Speaker 1: reinforcing and already existing warning when it came to a 292 00:17:22,480 --> 00:17:26,240 Speaker 1: sayamnifin use and pregnancy, that there are some concerns there, 293 00:17:26,640 --> 00:17:30,320 Speaker 1: but still it remains the safest medication when it comes 294 00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:34,320 Speaker 1: to treating high fevers full stop. That should have been 295 00:17:34,640 --> 00:17:39,040 Speaker 1: the message. It tumbled a bit throughout, and like I said, 296 00:17:39,040 --> 00:17:43,800 Speaker 1: there were some factual interacuracies that were presented. Moving on 297 00:17:43,960 --> 00:17:47,520 Speaker 1: from tilnal more was said, and it kind of just 298 00:17:47,600 --> 00:17:51,240 Speaker 1: evolved from there. The President also mentioned hepatitis B. He 299 00:17:51,400 --> 00:17:53,600 Speaker 1: said that maybe hepatitis B should be given at the 300 00:17:53,640 --> 00:17:56,440 Speaker 1: age of twelve, that vaccine that we had kind of 301 00:17:56,480 --> 00:17:59,720 Speaker 1: heard about during ASIP. That was a first. I havn't 302 00:17:59,760 --> 00:18:02,399 Speaker 1: heard anybody else mentioning twelve. I haven't seen any data 303 00:18:02,480 --> 00:18:05,439 Speaker 1: showing that twelve is the right age. My guess is 304 00:18:05,520 --> 00:18:09,520 Speaker 1: maybe that is because hepatitis B can be sexually transmitted 305 00:18:10,040 --> 00:18:13,840 Speaker 1: and that is the time pre prereessence where maybe sexual 306 00:18:13,840 --> 00:18:18,320 Speaker 1: activity is starting. So maybe that's the mindset behind that recommendation. 307 00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:21,320 Speaker 1: We haven't heard from the CDC or the ASIP about it, 308 00:18:21,440 --> 00:18:24,520 Speaker 1: or the FDA or really anybody, so it was kind 309 00:18:24,520 --> 00:18:27,120 Speaker 1: of off the cuff by the President. I'm sure we'll 310 00:18:27,119 --> 00:18:31,000 Speaker 1: be hearing more about that in the future. Maybe age 311 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:33,960 Speaker 1: twelve makes more sense than a birth those. For me 312 00:18:34,080 --> 00:18:37,280 Speaker 1: that it sounds a little bit more reasonable because if 313 00:18:37,320 --> 00:18:40,480 Speaker 1: it's sexually transmitted, then maybe that's it. More. Coming up 314 00:18:40,560 --> 00:18:46,800 Speaker 1: on Wellness Unmasked with doctor Nicol Sapphire and he mentioned 315 00:18:46,840 --> 00:18:50,520 Speaker 1: the MMR vaccine and the vericellas separating them. That also 316 00:18:50,680 --> 00:18:53,280 Speaker 1: makes sense. I already said that, But then he kind 317 00:18:53,280 --> 00:18:56,520 Speaker 1: of got into he brought the tilent all back, saying 318 00:18:57,160 --> 00:18:59,479 Speaker 1: and don't give talent all to your babies after your 319 00:18:59,560 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 1: vaccine means. This was very confusing because that had nothing 320 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:06,760 Speaker 1: to do with what the FDA was talking about. The 321 00:19:06,800 --> 00:19:10,200 Speaker 1: FDA was specifically talking about talinl and pregnant women and 322 00:19:10,280 --> 00:19:14,480 Speaker 1: its role in brain development. So it would be nice 323 00:19:14,560 --> 00:19:17,600 Speaker 1: if the FDA kind of clarified a little bit more 324 00:19:17,680 --> 00:19:20,320 Speaker 1: what they were meaning. As the President saying that the 325 00:19:20,320 --> 00:19:23,600 Speaker 1: formal recommendation is not to give talinol at all and 326 00:19:23,720 --> 00:19:27,119 Speaker 1: infants and toddlers and school age children, I think that 327 00:19:27,840 --> 00:19:31,159 Speaker 1: left a lot of people very confused, and so it 328 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:33,959 Speaker 1: would be great to have some clarification there on what 329 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:36,439 Speaker 1: they were talking about and if there was actually some 330 00:19:36,600 --> 00:19:41,560 Speaker 1: data to support what was being said. They didn't point 331 00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:44,520 Speaker 1: to any. Another big thing that did came out, which 332 00:19:44,600 --> 00:19:50,760 Speaker 1: I was very excited about, was the conversation around treating 333 00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:56,000 Speaker 1: children born with autism spectrum disorder with something called luco 334 00:19:56,119 --> 00:20:02,000 Speaker 1: vorren or which is essentially a reduced version of folate folate. 335 00:20:02,080 --> 00:20:04,840 Speaker 1: If you think of folic acid, that's the big thing, 336 00:20:04,880 --> 00:20:08,760 Speaker 1: and all the prenatal vitamins. We already know that folate 337 00:20:08,840 --> 00:20:12,520 Speaker 1: and fullic acid is extremely important for the development of 338 00:20:12,560 --> 00:20:15,760 Speaker 1: the fetus in a pregnant patient, which is why prenatal 339 00:20:15,840 --> 00:20:20,760 Speaker 1: vitamins are so strongly recommended. Children born with autism spectrum 340 00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:24,640 Speaker 1: disorder oftentimes are found to have low folate levels. They're 341 00:20:24,680 --> 00:20:29,040 Speaker 1: also found to have autoimmune antibodies against folate receptors in 342 00:20:29,080 --> 00:20:32,600 Speaker 1: the brain, and several studies have shown when you increase 343 00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:37,760 Speaker 1: folate in the mother, you actually decrease the risk of autism. 344 00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:40,280 Speaker 1: So the fact that the conversation around that is now 345 00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:43,800 Speaker 1: being amplified, that's an incredible thing. Lucoborin is a prescription 346 00:20:43,920 --> 00:20:47,359 Speaker 1: medication that can potentially treat these children who are born 347 00:20:47,960 --> 00:20:52,560 Speaker 1: with the autoantibodies to the leucovorin receptor or just low 348 00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:56,920 Speaker 1: folate acid fullic acid levels. Studies have shown that it 349 00:20:56,960 --> 00:21:00,439 Speaker 1: does help improve some of the verbal communication obvious. These 350 00:21:00,440 --> 00:21:03,160 Speaker 1: are small studies and more studies will need to be done, 351 00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:05,439 Speaker 1: but at this point I think any parent who has 352 00:21:05,480 --> 00:21:09,840 Speaker 1: a child born with autism spectrum disorder, they just want anything. 353 00:21:10,040 --> 00:21:12,560 Speaker 1: They want anything that might be able to help. So 354 00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:15,440 Speaker 1: I think it's wonderful to amplify this. And then doctor 355 00:21:15,480 --> 00:21:17,880 Speaker 1: Oz came out and said CMS will cover it as well, 356 00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:20,800 Speaker 1: because obviously it's great to have a medication, but if 357 00:21:20,840 --> 00:21:23,320 Speaker 1: you can't afford it and you can't access it, that's 358 00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:26,120 Speaker 1: a big problem. Marty McCarey said that they've already talked 359 00:21:26,160 --> 00:21:29,440 Speaker 1: to the drug manufacturer and they are going to increase production, 360 00:21:29,960 --> 00:21:32,440 Speaker 1: and then Mema Oz said CMS is going to cover it. 361 00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:36,879 Speaker 1: Half of our children are on Medicaid or CHIP programs, 362 00:21:36,920 --> 00:21:40,360 Speaker 1: so they get their medications and healthcare through government assisted 363 00:21:40,400 --> 00:21:43,119 Speaker 1: program so at least half a children are going to 364 00:21:43,160 --> 00:21:45,760 Speaker 1: have access to it and have it be covered. I'm 365 00:21:45,800 --> 00:21:49,119 Speaker 1: sure private insurers will follow suit, as they tend to 366 00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:52,040 Speaker 1: do so, I'm sure with lobbying efforts that'll happen. So 367 00:21:52,359 --> 00:21:57,280 Speaker 1: these are great things. Again, if we could just take 368 00:21:57,440 --> 00:22:02,840 Speaker 1: the press conference and say you need to use tilan 369 00:22:02,920 --> 00:22:07,120 Speaker 1: all sparingly during pregnancy and only under the advice of 370 00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:10,880 Speaker 1: your obstetrician if you have a high fever. These are 371 00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:13,760 Speaker 1: the times to consider taking tilent all if you have 372 00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:17,840 Speaker 1: minor aches and pains, try everything else first. This should 373 00:22:17,840 --> 00:22:21,680 Speaker 1: have been the messaging when it comes to the vaccines. 374 00:22:22,440 --> 00:22:24,159 Speaker 1: I think they should have left this one out. I 375 00:22:24,200 --> 00:22:27,080 Speaker 1: don't understand why there was much conversation about vaccines in 376 00:22:27,119 --> 00:22:29,199 Speaker 1: this press conference. It really didn't have much to do 377 00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:32,080 Speaker 1: with anything that they were talking about. There is a 378 00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:36,399 Speaker 1: succent way to talk about what the conclusions were at 379 00:22:36,400 --> 00:22:39,480 Speaker 1: the AST meeting last week. This press conference did not 380 00:22:39,560 --> 00:22:44,040 Speaker 1: do it. It created more fear, more doubt, and really 381 00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:47,280 Speaker 1: riled up the whole back and forth when it comes 382 00:22:47,320 --> 00:22:49,840 Speaker 1: to people who are pro vaccines and those who are 383 00:22:49,840 --> 00:22:53,960 Speaker 1: against vaccines. The reality is there's a happy medium there, 384 00:22:54,240 --> 00:22:55,919 Speaker 1: and we need to make sure that we're harnessing that 385 00:22:55,960 --> 00:23:00,280 Speaker 1: happy medium because the country is already divided enough. And 386 00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:02,600 Speaker 1: when it comes to luc O varn again, this is 387 00:23:02,600 --> 00:23:05,040 Speaker 1: a great thing. This is a potential treatment for autism. 388 00:23:05,160 --> 00:23:08,080 Speaker 1: If you're not promising it's going to cure all autism, 389 00:23:08,280 --> 00:23:11,000 Speaker 1: but just to have the conversation around it, it's really important. 390 00:23:11,920 --> 00:23:15,159 Speaker 1: So I will tell you I walked away from that 391 00:23:15,200 --> 00:23:19,199 Speaker 1: press conference very disheartened, very disappointed. I think there's a 392 00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:21,800 Speaker 1: lot of great things happening in the White House and 393 00:23:21,840 --> 00:23:25,440 Speaker 1: the AHHS right now. I think that the messaging is crucial, 394 00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:28,360 Speaker 1: and I think that they're failing miserably at the messaging. 395 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:32,320 Speaker 1: And it's not that they're failing because we all know 396 00:23:32,400 --> 00:23:35,520 Speaker 1: how President Trump is and why people vote for him 397 00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:38,439 Speaker 1: is because they trust him to just say what he's thinking, 398 00:23:38,880 --> 00:23:43,439 Speaker 1: not be reserved, and not bend to anyone else. I 399 00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:45,800 Speaker 1: get that, and by the way, that's one of the 400 00:23:45,800 --> 00:23:49,760 Speaker 1: things I like about him too. My concern is that 401 00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:54,120 Speaker 1: these are very complicated topics. Lives are on the lines, 402 00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:57,560 Speaker 1: and nuance really matters, and I think it is really 403 00:23:57,600 --> 00:24:02,639 Speaker 1: important to have strong messages that is fact base and 404 00:24:02,680 --> 00:24:06,639 Speaker 1: that's delivered in an understandable manner when you're going to 405 00:24:06,680 --> 00:24:11,320 Speaker 1: have these conversations. And I think that, unfortunately, that press 406 00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:14,320 Speaker 1: conference failed to do pretty much all of that, even 407 00:24:14,359 --> 00:24:18,240 Speaker 1: though the messaging was strong, as demonstrated by my ex 408 00:24:18,560 --> 00:24:25,360 Speaker 1: account immediately following the press conference. If I say anything 409 00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:32,520 Speaker 1: that goes against or even gently criticizes the administration, people 410 00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:38,159 Speaker 1: automatically think that, oh, I am anti Trump, anti RFK Junior, 411 00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:41,560 Speaker 1: you know, anti Maga, anti Maha. But the reality is 412 00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:48,280 Speaker 1: I am pro human I am pro Americans. I am 413 00:24:48,400 --> 00:24:51,560 Speaker 1: pro healthy living, pro science, pro whatever it is that 414 00:24:51,600 --> 00:24:54,560 Speaker 1: you want it to be. And the only way for 415 00:24:54,640 --> 00:24:58,320 Speaker 1: me to be honest with myself and with those who 416 00:24:58,800 --> 00:25:01,639 Speaker 1: are listening to me is to push back when I 417 00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:04,879 Speaker 1: see it. I will always criticize when I think something 418 00:25:05,000 --> 00:25:07,399 Speaker 1: is handled incorrectly. That doesn't mean that I think that 419 00:25:07,440 --> 00:25:10,080 Speaker 1: I'm perfect. I mess up all the times. I mean, 420 00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:12,439 Speaker 1: look at what happened through COVID. I got some stuff wrong, 421 00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:15,360 Speaker 1: I got a lot right. And when I was speaking 422 00:25:15,359 --> 00:25:19,080 Speaker 1: out against people, I got criticized then too. So I'm 423 00:25:19,119 --> 00:25:22,960 Speaker 1: okay being criticized as long as I know that what 424 00:25:23,040 --> 00:25:28,320 Speaker 1: I am saying is fact based, then your criticism can 425 00:25:28,400 --> 00:25:30,959 Speaker 1: be whatever it is you want it to be. I 426 00:25:31,000 --> 00:25:33,840 Speaker 1: think that the message from the White House about using 427 00:25:33,880 --> 00:25:37,639 Speaker 1: tailanol sparingly in pregnancy is a great thing. The messaging failed. 428 00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:42,960 Speaker 1: I think having the conversation about hepatitis B vaccines being 429 00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:46,080 Speaker 1: risk based and potentially not having it be a birth dose, 430 00:25:46,160 --> 00:25:49,080 Speaker 1: I think that's a great conversation. The messaging has failed. 431 00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:52,200 Speaker 1: The MMR plus B vaccines, I think it's a good 432 00:25:52,200 --> 00:25:54,439 Speaker 1: thing to separate them, ASIP did too, which is why 433 00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:57,280 Speaker 1: they did it. Ten years ago, the messaging has failed. 434 00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:00,640 Speaker 1: I think that when it comes to public health, messaging 435 00:26:00,680 --> 00:26:03,639 Speaker 1: is crucial. It's just as crucial as the science that 436 00:26:03,680 --> 00:26:06,760 Speaker 1: it's supposed to be communicating. And that's what I ask 437 00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:10,439 Speaker 1: for this administration is to focus on the messaging. Focus 438 00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:12,240 Speaker 1: on someone who can get in front of the camera, 439 00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:16,040 Speaker 1: who can take what's being done behind the scenes and 440 00:26:16,119 --> 00:26:20,200 Speaker 1: communicate it in an effective way that decreases the amount 441 00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:23,080 Speaker 1: of fear and decreases the amount of confusion. That's all 442 00:26:23,119 --> 00:26:26,880 Speaker 1: I'm asking. Thanks for listening to Wellness Unmasks on America's 443 00:26:26,960 --> 00:26:30,640 Speaker 1: number one podcast network, iHeart. Follow Wellness unmass with doctor 444 00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:33,760 Speaker 1: Nicole Safire and start listening on the free iHeartRadio app 445 00:26:33,840 --> 00:26:36,000 Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts, and we will catch 446 00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:36,640 Speaker 1: you next time.