1 00:00:07,240 --> 00:00:12,000 Speaker 1: Welcome to the Crime Roundup. I'm Cheryl McCollum and I'm 2 00:00:12,160 --> 00:00:17,680 Speaker 1: here with the one and only Nancy Grace Heyne. 3 00:00:18,079 --> 00:00:21,320 Speaker 2: Good morning. Here we are again, and what a week 4 00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:26,239 Speaker 2: it has been. From coburger to Sean Combs. I can 5 00:00:26,280 --> 00:00:27,440 Speaker 2: hardly keep up with it all. 6 00:00:27,840 --> 00:00:31,680 Speaker 1: Well, you know, last Friday when we were talking, we 7 00:00:31,840 --> 00:00:36,040 Speaker 1: both said, look, his bond has been denied twice. There 8 00:00:36,080 --> 00:00:40,800 Speaker 1: will be more victims. But we went from eleven to 9 00:00:41,000 --> 00:00:42,599 Speaker 1: one hundred and twenty. 10 00:00:43,000 --> 00:00:46,519 Speaker 2: Can you believe that? And listen to this? Cheryl, the lawyer, 11 00:00:46,720 --> 00:00:50,960 Speaker 2: last name Busby, b brother you z zebra Bee brother 12 00:00:51,080 --> 00:00:56,480 Speaker 2: wife Busby said that he had gotten over three thousand 13 00:00:56,760 --> 00:01:00,800 Speaker 2: people that were claiming to be victims of comes. Do 14 00:01:00,840 --> 00:01:05,360 Speaker 2: I believe there's been that many? Probably? Not? But actually, 15 00:01:05,400 --> 00:01:07,479 Speaker 2: when you think about it, Cheryl, if this has been 16 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:12,000 Speaker 2: going on for well well over a decade, think about 17 00:01:12,040 --> 00:01:14,520 Speaker 2: it like this. When people ask me, how many cases 18 00:01:14,520 --> 00:01:18,120 Speaker 2: have you handled? Okay, not counting the three years that 19 00:01:18,240 --> 00:01:22,040 Speaker 2: was a fed All right, let's see ten years, every 20 00:01:22,160 --> 00:01:26,400 Speaker 2: arrayment calendar would have well well over one hundred people. 21 00:01:27,080 --> 00:01:31,959 Speaker 2: We had an arrayment calendar once a week, okay, so 22 00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:36,640 Speaker 2: conservatively it was usually like one hundred and sixty one 23 00:01:36,680 --> 00:01:38,960 Speaker 2: hundred and thirty people. Let's just go with one hundred. 24 00:01:39,319 --> 00:01:44,200 Speaker 2: That's four hundred new cases a month times twelve times 25 00:01:44,280 --> 00:01:49,160 Speaker 2: ten plus the load I got when I moved into 26 00:01:49,200 --> 00:01:51,840 Speaker 2: the courtroom, you know, the war five hundred cases that 27 00:01:51,880 --> 00:01:54,960 Speaker 2: had not yet been resolved. So when you add it 28 00:01:55,040 --> 00:01:58,120 Speaker 2: up like that, it really could be. Because think about 29 00:01:58,120 --> 00:02:01,040 Speaker 2: those parties he had, and he was partying all the time. 30 00:02:01,080 --> 00:02:04,840 Speaker 2: Will there be two three hundred people there to say 31 00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:09,920 Speaker 2: he had five to ten victims at one party, and 32 00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:13,200 Speaker 2: then you add that up. I mean, it's feasible. It 33 00:02:13,240 --> 00:02:16,680 Speaker 2: doesn't sound feasible, but it is when you look at 34 00:02:16,760 --> 00:02:19,400 Speaker 2: the fact this has been going on allegedly for a 35 00:02:19,440 --> 00:02:20,919 Speaker 2: couple of decades. 36 00:02:20,919 --> 00:02:24,040 Speaker 1: It's feasible. And I tell you, I say it all 37 00:02:24,080 --> 00:02:27,919 Speaker 1: the time. There is no such thing as a part 38 00:02:28,040 --> 00:02:32,480 Speaker 1: time rapist. There's no such thing. And he had not 39 00:02:32,760 --> 00:02:37,240 Speaker 1: just these parties that would last for days, but he 40 00:02:37,440 --> 00:02:42,000 Speaker 1: had people helping him, meaning people that brought people to 41 00:02:42,080 --> 00:02:46,800 Speaker 1: the party, that found these victims. He coordinated with bodyguards 42 00:02:46,840 --> 00:02:49,840 Speaker 1: and staff and other people to say, hey, i'll make 43 00:02:49,880 --> 00:02:51,840 Speaker 1: a record deal with you, meet me at this place 44 00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:55,960 Speaker 1: at this time. It was a setup and Nancy. I'm 45 00:02:55,960 --> 00:02:59,280 Speaker 1: going to say again we talked Friday for him not 46 00:02:59,480 --> 00:03:02,480 Speaker 1: to be worried about being beat up. He's not worried 47 00:03:02,480 --> 00:03:05,959 Speaker 1: about being stabbed in prison, He's not worried about somebody jumping. 48 00:03:06,720 --> 00:03:10,960 Speaker 1: He's worried about being poisoned. If that's what's in his head, 49 00:03:11,600 --> 00:03:16,200 Speaker 1: that's what he's coming from, meaning I believe that's what 50 00:03:16,280 --> 00:03:19,120 Speaker 1: he did to the majority of these victims before he 51 00:03:19,240 --> 00:03:20,359 Speaker 1: videotaped them. 52 00:03:20,560 --> 00:03:24,280 Speaker 2: There's also the issue now according to Busby, the lawyer, 53 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:28,120 Speaker 2: he's vetted it down to about one hundred and twenty 54 00:03:28,200 --> 00:03:32,320 Speaker 2: victims with him, he's proceeding, but it's hard for me 55 00:03:32,400 --> 00:03:38,560 Speaker 2: to believe that what about three thousand victims were all lying. 56 00:03:38,680 --> 00:03:40,600 Speaker 1: Right, I don't believe that either, No, ma'am. 57 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:43,000 Speaker 2: I think the correct number somewhere in between one and 58 00:03:43,040 --> 00:03:48,000 Speaker 2: twenty and over three thousand. Because it's not just victims 59 00:03:48,040 --> 00:03:51,720 Speaker 2: at these parties. There were many times where a woman 60 00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:54,680 Speaker 2: would be invited to come over to ditties and next 61 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:57,200 Speaker 2: thing you know, she wakes up with pain in her 62 00:03:57,320 --> 00:04:00,440 Speaker 2: vagina or rectum. She has no memory of it happened. 63 00:04:00,440 --> 00:04:04,320 Speaker 2: That wasn't at a party a free call, that was 64 00:04:04,560 --> 00:04:08,240 Speaker 2: just her and how many victims have fallen prey like that? 65 00:04:08,920 --> 00:04:10,880 Speaker 2: The first time I had to stand in front of 66 00:04:10,880 --> 00:04:14,880 Speaker 2: the jury and say the P word, the F word, 67 00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:17,280 Speaker 2: or the sea word. There's so many to choose from. 68 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:20,800 Speaker 2: I almost you know, I couldn't say it. I did 69 00:04:20,839 --> 00:04:24,359 Speaker 2: say it, but I was, you know, reading from what 70 00:04:24,720 --> 00:04:28,599 Speaker 2: a defendant said. You know, and members of the jury 71 00:04:28,640 --> 00:04:33,200 Speaker 2: you will hear that he said. And I quote, after 72 00:04:33,240 --> 00:04:37,440 Speaker 2: you pee, you f and see blah blah blah whatever 73 00:04:37,640 --> 00:04:40,760 Speaker 2: you know he may have said. But guess what the 74 00:04:40,880 --> 00:04:43,920 Speaker 2: second time I did it, you know, it was so easy, 75 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:48,279 Speaker 2: just rolls off your tongue. So my point is the 76 00:04:48,320 --> 00:04:51,920 Speaker 2: first time he ever did this, he may have had 77 00:04:52,000 --> 00:04:54,160 Speaker 2: qualms like, am I going to get in trouble? You know? 78 00:04:54,279 --> 00:04:57,560 Speaker 2: Did I heard her blah blah? Second time it gets eesier. 79 00:04:57,880 --> 00:05:01,400 Speaker 2: By the end, he's running down the hotel hallway wearing 80 00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:04,279 Speaker 2: nothing but a table beaten the HG double l out 81 00:05:04,279 --> 00:05:05,240 Speaker 2: of Cassie Venturo. 82 00:05:05,760 --> 00:05:07,640 Speaker 1: That's right, bolder and. 83 00:05:07,560 --> 00:05:11,599 Speaker 2: Bolder and bolder, less and less to no concern about 84 00:05:11,600 --> 00:05:15,600 Speaker 2: the victim, which makes it easy for somebody like him 85 00:05:16,080 --> 00:05:20,279 Speaker 2: to do it over and over and over. My point 86 00:05:20,400 --> 00:05:23,320 Speaker 2: is there could very well be three thousand victims. I 87 00:05:23,360 --> 00:05:23,680 Speaker 2: don't know. 88 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:28,360 Speaker 1: And Nancy, the level of depravity we're talking about, the 89 00:05:28,360 --> 00:05:33,680 Speaker 1: prosecutor said, the youngest victim so far is nine. 90 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:37,480 Speaker 2: You know, I was looking at that instrument, and Cheryl, 91 00:05:37,640 --> 00:05:40,680 Speaker 2: the first time I heard allegations that there was a 92 00:05:40,839 --> 00:05:46,440 Speaker 2: minor victim of Sean Combs, I'm like, well, it doesn't 93 00:05:46,520 --> 00:05:51,000 Speaker 2: really fit the profile. The mo modus operator, no method 94 00:05:51,000 --> 00:05:56,039 Speaker 2: of operation. You don't typically see rapists too, rapes adult 95 00:05:56,080 --> 00:06:02,360 Speaker 2: women then suddenly start molesting little boys age nine. That's 96 00:06:02,440 --> 00:06:07,560 Speaker 2: just not the proclivity. However, now, Cheryl, there are twenty 97 00:06:07,680 --> 00:06:12,000 Speaker 2: five such claims, separated in time and space. They don't 98 00:06:12,080 --> 00:06:15,800 Speaker 2: know each other, and their stories are startlingly similar. Now 99 00:06:15,880 --> 00:06:20,440 Speaker 2: I know, I'm gonna just drop a think bomb right now, 100 00:06:20,480 --> 00:06:24,600 Speaker 2: a turd in the punch bowl, so to speak. Oh, 101 00:06:24,760 --> 00:06:28,240 Speaker 2: let's just see I fly in the ointment, says Shakespeare. 102 00:06:29,080 --> 00:06:31,560 Speaker 2: I kind of like turn in the punch bowl better. 103 00:06:31,560 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 2: But anyway, just like Michael Jackson there, I said, Okay, everybody, 104 00:06:35,560 --> 00:06:38,880 Speaker 2: go ahead and get mad. He was a child molester, yes, 105 00:06:39,560 --> 00:06:42,520 Speaker 2: also one of the greatest musical talents to ever live, 106 00:06:43,040 --> 00:06:46,920 Speaker 2: but a child molester, nonetheless, And when you look at 107 00:06:47,200 --> 00:06:52,880 Speaker 2: those boy victim statements that didn't know each other again 108 00:06:52,920 --> 00:06:57,320 Speaker 2: that were separated in time in space. They said generally 109 00:06:57,360 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 2: the same thing, the Jesus Jews whole thing you know here, 110 00:07:02,400 --> 00:07:08,039 Speaker 2: same thing these twenty five miners say, essentially the same thing. 111 00:07:08,600 --> 00:07:11,960 Speaker 2: I wanted to break into the recording business. He wanted 112 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:14,960 Speaker 2: my parents to bring me to him, then he separated 113 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:19,360 Speaker 2: me from my parents. Then he demanded oral sex and says, 114 00:07:19,360 --> 00:07:21,520 Speaker 2: you know what happens all the time. Industry is just 115 00:07:21,560 --> 00:07:26,920 Speaker 2: one of those things. You know. One performer, one young 116 00:07:26,960 --> 00:07:29,960 Speaker 2: guy saying he left the business and he never tried, 117 00:07:30,360 --> 00:07:32,960 Speaker 2: and he gave a statement says, you know what, I 118 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:37,160 Speaker 2: think I could have done something great, but I quit 119 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:41,920 Speaker 2: after Combs, and that just really hurt me. It hurt 120 00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:46,120 Speaker 2: me because you know, when you got you have a dream, 121 00:07:46,480 --> 00:07:49,440 Speaker 2: and that dream is squelched, that follows you the rest 122 00:07:49,480 --> 00:07:54,440 Speaker 2: of your life. You may get beyond the molestation, but 123 00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:58,320 Speaker 2: having that dream destroyed. I want to tell you, Cheryl, 124 00:07:58,680 --> 00:08:02,880 Speaker 2: if I had not gotten into law school with my 125 00:08:03,040 --> 00:08:06,840 Speaker 2: one recommendation from my Sunday school teacher to that Jathan, 126 00:08:08,560 --> 00:08:11,680 Speaker 2: if I had not gotten into law school, if Mercery 127 00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:14,120 Speaker 2: University had not had pity on me and let me in. 128 00:08:15,440 --> 00:08:18,040 Speaker 2: I don't really know what I would have done after 129 00:08:18,160 --> 00:08:21,080 Speaker 2: Keith's murder. I just didn't think I could be a 130 00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:23,400 Speaker 2: school teacher. I didn't think I could. I had to 131 00:08:23,400 --> 00:08:25,640 Speaker 2: be wild and free. Okay, I don't know what that 132 00:08:25,680 --> 00:08:28,240 Speaker 2: even means, but that's just all I how can subscribe it. 133 00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:31,680 Speaker 2: If it had not been for my law degree at 134 00:08:31,720 --> 00:08:35,360 Speaker 2: Mercer and then of course later at NYU, my dream, 135 00:08:35,600 --> 00:08:38,040 Speaker 2: my mission would have been ruined. And I don't know 136 00:08:38,080 --> 00:08:41,560 Speaker 2: that I could have lived with myself now this boy 137 00:08:41,800 --> 00:08:44,320 Speaker 2: and probably others like Camra like in it, I just 138 00:08:44,400 --> 00:08:47,120 Speaker 2: dropped out. I just couldn't go forward. And that is 139 00:08:47,600 --> 00:08:52,000 Speaker 2: another type in my mind of crime. But I can't 140 00:08:52,000 --> 00:08:56,479 Speaker 2: prosecute that. I can't prosecute the others. So it's disturbing. 141 00:08:57,960 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 2: You got twenty five so far alleged child victims, and 142 00:09:02,679 --> 00:09:07,400 Speaker 2: you have also you have this investigation now going international 143 00:09:08,240 --> 00:09:11,679 Speaker 2: because at least one woman that I know of right 144 00:09:11,720 --> 00:09:14,560 Speaker 2: now that I can comment upon, others I haven't been 145 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:16,960 Speaker 2: able to corroborate, and I can't comment on it just yet. 146 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:20,080 Speaker 2: But one moment says she was more lested picked up. 147 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:23,000 Speaker 2: I think this is the correct one picked up in 148 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:26,640 Speaker 2: an suv and there, of course armed guards like how 149 00:09:26,679 --> 00:09:28,800 Speaker 2: are you gonna get out? And then she wakes up 150 00:09:28,840 --> 00:09:32,640 Speaker 2: with pain in her vagina and anus. Okay in London. 151 00:09:33,679 --> 00:09:38,560 Speaker 2: So I've been told, for my belief a reliable source 152 00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:42,440 Speaker 2: that investigators have flown to the UK from the US 153 00:09:43,600 --> 00:09:47,720 Speaker 2: looking for other victims. So as they told us on 154 00:09:47,840 --> 00:09:50,800 Speaker 2: day one, Now there are Feds that lie. There are 155 00:09:50,880 --> 00:09:53,520 Speaker 2: prosecutors that lie. I'll never get over the deep look across. 156 00:09:53,559 --> 00:09:56,840 Speaker 2: Prosecutor lie and people write about it. Why did you 157 00:09:56,920 --> 00:09:59,800 Speaker 2: say that about it? Do you look across? And I'm like, oh, 158 00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:02,600 Speaker 2: to even read it because I feel so bad about it. 159 00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:06,319 Speaker 2: But the prosecutor lied. Do I think these prosecutors arely 160 00:10:06,320 --> 00:10:09,600 Speaker 2: like no, I don't. And they told us this investigation 161 00:10:09,760 --> 00:10:13,360 Speaker 2: is not over, and I believe them. I think they're 162 00:10:13,360 --> 00:10:17,160 Speaker 2: amassing more victims. I think they're trying to find victims 163 00:10:17,480 --> 00:10:21,080 Speaker 2: that are still within the statute of limitations. I think 164 00:10:21,120 --> 00:10:26,079 Speaker 2: that they are building their witness list of accomplices and 165 00:10:26,160 --> 00:10:30,559 Speaker 2: they're on the search right now for medics. Yes, medical 166 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:38,360 Speaker 2: personnel that helped administer iv intravenous drips two women after 167 00:10:39,000 --> 00:10:41,679 Speaker 2: the three and four day free coughs. I hate to 168 00:10:41,679 --> 00:10:43,520 Speaker 2: even say free cough, because what it is is just 169 00:10:43,640 --> 00:10:46,120 Speaker 2: rape on video. But I don't want to forget this point. 170 00:10:46,880 --> 00:10:53,840 Speaker 2: Also reportedly a porn take with cones and apparently a 171 00:10:53,920 --> 00:10:56,560 Speaker 2: celeb I'm not even going to venture who that might 172 00:10:56,600 --> 00:11:01,760 Speaker 2: be is being shopped around. I bet somebody's quaking in 173 00:11:01,800 --> 00:11:02,760 Speaker 2: their boots right now. 174 00:11:03,600 --> 00:11:11,480 Speaker 1: I probably think there's about one hundred people be least. Yeah, 175 00:11:11,880 --> 00:11:14,600 Speaker 1: when you talk about rape, we all know in this 176 00:11:14,679 --> 00:11:20,400 Speaker 1: business it's the most underreported crime, Nancy. So again, this 177 00:11:20,480 --> 00:11:23,480 Speaker 1: one twenty is going to get to three hundred, is 178 00:11:23,520 --> 00:11:25,920 Speaker 1: going to get to seven hundred. And the ones that 179 00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:29,840 Speaker 1: you know have fallen off for statural limitations, I think 180 00:11:29,880 --> 00:11:34,280 Speaker 1: they're going to become witnesses for the similar transactions. And 181 00:11:34,360 --> 00:11:36,520 Speaker 1: I just want to say one thing with people saying, well, 182 00:11:36,559 --> 00:11:40,200 Speaker 1: I just find it hard to believe that there's children perversion. 183 00:11:40,240 --> 00:11:42,160 Speaker 1: Don't have no walls, honey. 184 00:11:42,080 --> 00:11:46,320 Speaker 2: Speaking up perversion. I had a big long talk or 185 00:11:46,360 --> 00:11:48,800 Speaker 2: you and I can go on forever about perversion, Gaul, 186 00:11:50,559 --> 00:11:54,880 Speaker 2: a big long talk with a drink yesterday, not my 187 00:11:55,040 --> 00:11:57,560 Speaker 2: private drink. I don't have one for all of yous 188 00:11:57,600 --> 00:11:59,880 Speaker 2: that you that want me to go into therapy. At media, 189 00:12:00,720 --> 00:12:05,600 Speaker 2: we discussed of voyeurism because Tom's I mean he would 190 00:12:05,840 --> 00:12:10,600 Speaker 2: take part in raping the victims. According to them, he's 191 00:12:10,600 --> 00:12:13,199 Speaker 2: still in a stuntil proving guilty. But what he really 192 00:12:13,320 --> 00:12:16,040 Speaker 2: like to do is sit back and watch. Is hence 193 00:12:16,160 --> 00:12:22,360 Speaker 2: people rape and unconscious or semi conscious women and video. 194 00:12:22,080 --> 00:12:26,640 Speaker 1: It the term freak all. What that is actually telling 195 00:12:26,720 --> 00:12:31,720 Speaker 1: you is each session you had to outdo the other one. 196 00:12:32,000 --> 00:12:36,120 Speaker 1: So again, this level of perversion, when it comes out, 197 00:12:36,480 --> 00:12:39,760 Speaker 1: is going to be like nothing we've ever heard. And 198 00:12:39,800 --> 00:12:43,360 Speaker 1: the folks that have been involved, the folks that participated 199 00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:48,680 Speaker 1: stood there and watched it, you know, took video, sent 200 00:12:48,800 --> 00:12:52,040 Speaker 1: the video. You're talking about hundreds and hundreds of people. 201 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:57,160 Speaker 1: And I will say this again, I cannot fathom how 202 00:12:57,240 --> 00:13:00,480 Speaker 1: you could be in a situation like that. And if 203 00:13:00,520 --> 00:13:03,959 Speaker 1: you didn't believe immediately and you didn't call the police, 204 00:13:04,240 --> 00:13:06,640 Speaker 1: if you saw a nine year old at that type 205 00:13:06,640 --> 00:13:10,000 Speaker 1: of party, that you weren't losing your mind. So when 206 00:13:10,040 --> 00:13:13,040 Speaker 1: you've got these folks that are famous that have not 207 00:13:13,200 --> 00:13:15,280 Speaker 1: gone to one of these parties, but have gone to 208 00:13:15,400 --> 00:13:19,240 Speaker 1: twelve and twenty of them, well there's a witness list 209 00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:23,319 Speaker 1: right there. If not additional charges, I think we will. 210 00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:27,680 Speaker 2: See additional charges. I do not believe that a plea 211 00:13:28,000 --> 00:13:31,280 Speaker 2: deal is out of the question, although we're having a 212 00:13:31,280 --> 00:13:34,520 Speaker 2: lot of bluster and carrying. 213 00:13:34,080 --> 00:13:36,840 Speaker 1: On that we're going to go to trial, blah blah blah. 214 00:13:37,520 --> 00:13:40,000 Speaker 2: You know, if they go to trial, the sentence will 215 00:13:40,040 --> 00:13:44,240 Speaker 2: be much more severe. And he's looking at, you know, 216 00:13:44,440 --> 00:13:47,040 Speaker 2: at least twenty on each of these charges, twenty years 217 00:13:47,080 --> 00:13:51,000 Speaker 2: behind bars, and in a if I prosecuted him, I 218 00:13:51,000 --> 00:13:53,720 Speaker 2: would be asking for consecutive twenty on top of twenty, 219 00:13:53,800 --> 00:13:56,800 Speaker 2: on top of twenty on top of twenty. What they're 220 00:13:56,840 --> 00:13:58,360 Speaker 2: going to ask for the You know, the FEDS have 221 00:13:58,440 --> 00:14:02,320 Speaker 2: their sentencing guidelines. Yeah, I don't know that they would 222 00:14:02,400 --> 00:14:07,240 Speaker 2: do that, But that said, when you're steering down the 223 00:14:07,280 --> 00:14:11,560 Speaker 2: wrong end of a barrel translation a jury seated, a 224 00:14:11,559 --> 00:14:14,200 Speaker 2: lot of times defendants will tee in their pants and take. 225 00:14:14,040 --> 00:14:17,480 Speaker 1: A police What is your thought about other famous people 226 00:14:17,559 --> 00:14:21,240 Speaker 1: being charged because they participated or stood by and did nothing. 227 00:14:21,600 --> 00:14:24,000 Speaker 2: If they stood by and did nothing, then they're not 228 00:14:24,040 --> 00:14:28,360 Speaker 2: going to be prosecuted. Under our jurisprudence. It is not 229 00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:33,840 Speaker 2: a criminal act not to be a good samaritan. You 230 00:14:33,880 --> 00:14:38,800 Speaker 2: can stand by and watch all sorts of diabolical behavior 231 00:14:39,000 --> 00:14:44,120 Speaker 2: performed on victims, innocent and helpless victims, and do nothing, 232 00:14:44,560 --> 00:14:48,760 Speaker 2: not call nine one one, do nothing. You know, you 233 00:14:48,840 --> 00:14:52,400 Speaker 2: don't have to take a piss on a fire Cheryl. 234 00:14:53,040 --> 00:14:55,600 Speaker 2: And of course we don't say the pyword, but if 235 00:14:55,640 --> 00:14:59,840 Speaker 2: we did, that's what I would have said, and it's 236 00:15:00,080 --> 00:15:04,240 Speaker 2: you can't be prosecuted. But if you do one thing. 237 00:15:04,880 --> 00:15:09,680 Speaker 2: For instance, this victim said that Tom's raped her with 238 00:15:09,720 --> 00:15:14,400 Speaker 2: an inanimate object. Okay, if you handed him the object, 239 00:15:14,880 --> 00:15:19,360 Speaker 2: you're going down. Standing by watching, sorry, you're going to 240 00:15:19,400 --> 00:15:22,720 Speaker 2: be a witness, and you do one over at one thing, 241 00:15:24,240 --> 00:15:28,360 Speaker 2: and you're going down. So the celebs are probably shaking 242 00:15:28,400 --> 00:15:30,080 Speaker 2: in their boots right now if they stood by and 243 00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:35,240 Speaker 2: watched this filming going on attending a party. Let me 244 00:15:35,280 --> 00:15:42,520 Speaker 2: just say, Hillary Trump, Obama, you're safe, Oprah. For Pete's sake, 245 00:15:43,560 --> 00:15:47,120 Speaker 2: everybody got invited these parties, all these major and minor 246 00:15:47,160 --> 00:15:51,600 Speaker 2: stars and celebs, politicians, you name it. Eric Adams, he's 247 00:15:51,640 --> 00:15:53,720 Speaker 2: got his handful, right the mayor New York with all 248 00:15:53,720 --> 00:15:57,560 Speaker 2: of his indictments. But they're safe now. If they did 249 00:15:57,720 --> 00:16:03,040 Speaker 2: attend the free call, end the quote inner sanctum, they 250 00:16:03,120 --> 00:16:05,160 Speaker 2: may be up the creek without a paddle. 251 00:16:06,200 --> 00:16:09,360 Speaker 1: You know, last week you mentioned Lucy saw a video, 252 00:16:10,280 --> 00:16:14,720 Speaker 1: and I saw one recently. Did He shows up at 253 00:16:14,800 --> 00:16:19,880 Speaker 1: what looks like to be some big time auction and 254 00:16:20,200 --> 00:16:21,920 Speaker 1: I don't know what they're raising money for. I just 255 00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:24,520 Speaker 1: saw the video where Diddy gets up and takes the 256 00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:27,600 Speaker 1: mic and he says, Hey, I just want to offer 257 00:16:28,080 --> 00:16:30,720 Speaker 1: three things, and you can choose from these three things 258 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:34,600 Speaker 1: to the highest bidder. One you can have my house 259 00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:37,680 Speaker 1: in the Hampton's fully staffed, everything right on the beach. 260 00:16:38,760 --> 00:16:41,720 Speaker 1: Or you can have me produce a record for you 261 00:16:41,840 --> 00:16:46,480 Speaker 1: or your child. Or Third, you can party with me 262 00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:52,720 Speaker 1: in New York Saturday night. And this is the quote, 263 00:16:52,960 --> 00:16:56,880 Speaker 1: and I promise you'll wake up Wednesday next to me. 264 00:16:57,680 --> 00:17:01,760 Speaker 1: And I thought, that's a freaking confession. You're telling people 265 00:17:02,560 --> 00:17:05,240 Speaker 1: I'm gonna knock you out for a couple of days 266 00:17:05,440 --> 00:17:06,960 Speaker 1: and you're gonna wake up next to me. 267 00:17:08,119 --> 00:17:10,880 Speaker 2: You know. Another thing that hurt me is to hear 268 00:17:11,359 --> 00:17:16,600 Speaker 2: these victim stories like you know, I'm projecting as you know, 269 00:17:16,800 --> 00:17:19,320 Speaker 2: and I will not bore you with the details. I 270 00:17:19,320 --> 00:17:22,080 Speaker 2: grew up on a red dirt road, drinking. 271 00:17:21,800 --> 00:17:22,920 Speaker 1: Red water. 272 00:17:24,320 --> 00:17:29,240 Speaker 2: The well. My grandfather, Doug was a diviner, which you 273 00:17:29,280 --> 00:17:33,600 Speaker 2: know divine where the water is, and a school bus 274 00:17:33,720 --> 00:17:37,080 Speaker 2: driver and an ice truck driver at a farmer. My 275 00:17:37,160 --> 00:17:41,440 Speaker 2: grandmother worked in a factory, standing on her feet all 276 00:17:41,600 --> 00:17:47,240 Speaker 2: day long on a cement floor, arranging mosaics in tiles 277 00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:50,600 Speaker 2: for rich people to buy. And they ran a farm. 278 00:17:51,920 --> 00:17:56,679 Speaker 2: I can remember Cheryl getting the turnips and tying a 279 00:17:56,720 --> 00:18:00,240 Speaker 2: string around and to make a mess to sell the 280 00:18:00,240 --> 00:18:03,200 Speaker 2: farmer's market. But on the back of the truck pick 281 00:18:03,280 --> 00:18:06,520 Speaker 2: and pecans the whole shebang. Where am I going with this? 282 00:18:07,200 --> 00:18:09,600 Speaker 2: I didn't know what was beyond that red dirt road. 283 00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:14,600 Speaker 2: I had no idea. Okay, when these young women get 284 00:18:14,600 --> 00:18:18,919 Speaker 2: an invite to go to Sean Puffy Cohn's party aka Diddy, 285 00:18:19,440 --> 00:18:21,560 Speaker 2: and they go to this party, they see all these 286 00:18:21,600 --> 00:18:25,360 Speaker 2: famous celebrities they've only seen on the big screen in movies. 287 00:18:26,040 --> 00:18:28,840 Speaker 2: They think, oh, my stars, this is my chance. I'm 288 00:18:28,880 --> 00:18:32,000 Speaker 2: in the big league. What's going to happen next? Well, 289 00:18:32,040 --> 00:18:35,679 Speaker 2: the next thing happens is they wake up bleeding from 290 00:18:35,680 --> 00:18:39,480 Speaker 2: their vagina and the rector and they're like, what happened? 291 00:18:40,960 --> 00:18:44,280 Speaker 2: And it destroys, you know, not just their body but 292 00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:44,800 Speaker 2: their soul. 293 00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:48,080 Speaker 1: They feel stupid, They feel like people are going to 294 00:18:48,160 --> 00:18:50,240 Speaker 1: blame them. What did you think was going to happen? 295 00:18:50,359 --> 00:18:51,120 Speaker 1: That sort of thing. 296 00:18:51,800 --> 00:18:54,680 Speaker 2: I just hate it. I hate it for these victims, 297 00:18:55,280 --> 00:18:56,880 Speaker 2: you know, that thought they were getting into the big 298 00:18:56,920 --> 00:18:58,439 Speaker 2: time or what they did was get wrecked. 299 00:19:02,359 --> 00:19:05,880 Speaker 1: You've got folks that have their plan. They do these 300 00:19:05,920 --> 00:19:10,120 Speaker 1: crimes and they use what works you mentioned Michael Jackson 301 00:19:10,160 --> 00:19:12,440 Speaker 1: meant to go. Well, you know how they always tell 302 00:19:12,520 --> 00:19:15,119 Speaker 1: children late. Look, if somebody says they've got puppies in 303 00:19:15,160 --> 00:19:18,359 Speaker 1: a van, you know that's just a ruse they're using 304 00:19:18,359 --> 00:19:20,720 Speaker 1: to get you to come to the van. Well, Michael 305 00:19:20,800 --> 00:19:23,360 Speaker 1: Jackson did the same thing, but instead of a van 306 00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:27,440 Speaker 1: and a puppy, he had a mansion with a giraffe 307 00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:31,919 Speaker 1: and a monkey. It's the same mo exactly. It's just money. 308 00:19:32,400 --> 00:19:35,280 Speaker 1: And just like Tolmes, what did he do, he used, 309 00:19:35,440 --> 00:19:38,560 Speaker 1: I'll produce a record for you. Well, that would set 310 00:19:38,640 --> 00:19:41,520 Speaker 1: you up right there. Well, he used it at that auction. 311 00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:44,480 Speaker 1: He used it with the nine year old victim. That 312 00:19:44,680 --> 00:19:47,439 Speaker 1: was his stick, that was his mo. That's how he 313 00:19:47,600 --> 00:19:50,280 Speaker 1: got you to come to the mansion. He got the 314 00:19:50,359 --> 00:19:52,359 Speaker 1: victims to come to him. 315 00:19:52,680 --> 00:19:54,840 Speaker 2: You know, I just want to clear something up. My 316 00:19:54,920 --> 00:19:58,000 Speaker 2: law school class, for the most part, There are pretty 317 00:19:58,040 --> 00:20:01,440 Speaker 2: decent people trying really hard to get through three years 318 00:20:01,480 --> 00:20:04,760 Speaker 2: of pain. But why is it always the jackasses that 319 00:20:04,800 --> 00:20:07,400 Speaker 2: are the loudest. Those are the ones you really remember. 320 00:20:09,600 --> 00:20:12,000 Speaker 2: Can you imagine Alex and murdaug in law school? Oh, 321 00:20:12,040 --> 00:20:16,040 Speaker 2: I bet he was intolerable. Oh, because you knew that 322 00:20:16,119 --> 00:20:18,240 Speaker 2: he knew he was going to get out, probably with 323 00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:21,080 Speaker 2: a low D average and then make millions and millions 324 00:20:21,119 --> 00:20:25,720 Speaker 2: of dollars because of his legal dynasty family. Just some 325 00:20:25,880 --> 00:20:29,520 Speaker 2: people seem to have all the power, and that goes 326 00:20:29,560 --> 00:20:35,000 Speaker 2: back to Combs, all the power I had on a 327 00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:40,720 Speaker 2: lawyer yesterday. Oh gosh, she's just beautiful, articulate. She's representing 328 00:20:41,800 --> 00:20:46,800 Speaker 2: a new alleged victim. Now listen to this, Cheryl. This victim, 329 00:20:46,880 --> 00:20:51,199 Speaker 2: it happened years ago, and she was sex assaulted, of 330 00:20:51,240 --> 00:20:55,240 Speaker 2: course by Comes. According to her, she runs out of 331 00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:58,760 Speaker 2: Comes's house and runs to the neighbor's house that starts 332 00:20:58,760 --> 00:21:01,679 Speaker 2: bamming on the door and follows a police report. But 333 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:04,399 Speaker 2: she was too afraid to say two words saw Combs. 334 00:21:05,080 --> 00:21:08,439 Speaker 2: But she she went back and amended it finally. But 335 00:21:10,440 --> 00:21:15,000 Speaker 2: I'm sure that police, excuse me, Feds, federal agents are 336 00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:21,200 Speaker 2: amassing any outcry statements. You know that sex victims make 337 00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:25,320 Speaker 2: an outcry I hope they do, where they either tell police, 338 00:21:25,520 --> 00:21:27,920 Speaker 2: they call a counselor they call a hotline, they tell 339 00:21:27,920 --> 00:21:29,800 Speaker 2: a friend, they tell their mother, or that they tell 340 00:21:29,840 --> 00:21:33,040 Speaker 2: their husband, they tell somebody. That is called an outcry witness. 341 00:21:33,080 --> 00:21:37,119 Speaker 2: And it is invaluable because Tomas's defense is going to 342 00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:40,200 Speaker 2: claim these are all lies, These are all whogey mamas 343 00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:42,320 Speaker 2: that just want to get my money, They just want 344 00:21:42,359 --> 00:21:45,160 Speaker 2: to settle. None of this is true. But if there 345 00:21:45,240 --> 00:21:50,040 Speaker 2: is an outcry at the time, before there's any lawsuit, 346 00:21:50,160 --> 00:21:54,560 Speaker 2: before there's a prosecution, that really corroborates the story, it 347 00:21:54,680 --> 00:21:57,320 Speaker 2: really does. I'm sure they're amassing all of that right now, 348 00:21:57,320 --> 00:21:58,480 Speaker 2: and that takes a lot of time. 349 00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:01,720 Speaker 1: You know what three or people might lie about you, 350 00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:04,119 Speaker 1: not one hundred and twenty. And I'm going to tell 351 00:22:04,160 --> 00:22:08,920 Speaker 1: you I believe somebody substantial is going to flip, either 352 00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:13,280 Speaker 1: a bodyguard or an assistant. Somebody is going to make 353 00:22:13,359 --> 00:22:16,240 Speaker 1: that deal because they know they're going down. 354 00:22:16,520 --> 00:22:19,760 Speaker 2: They know what about that madic giving ivs rips. 355 00:22:20,040 --> 00:22:22,200 Speaker 1: Absolutely, I can tell you this much. 356 00:22:22,760 --> 00:22:25,840 Speaker 2: How's that federal prosecutor? I would be dropping down those 357 00:22:25,920 --> 00:22:28,560 Speaker 2: halls at the courthouse in my office on the war 358 00:22:28,680 --> 00:22:33,040 Speaker 2: path till I got every shred of evidence. I don't 359 00:22:33,080 --> 00:22:35,320 Speaker 2: know that I would let him plead. If he wanted 360 00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:37,719 Speaker 2: to plead, be a blind plea and just see what 361 00:22:37,760 --> 00:22:38,520 Speaker 2: the judge does. 362 00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:41,119 Speaker 1: That'd be smart. But you know, Nancy, you and I 363 00:22:41,280 --> 00:22:44,240 Speaker 1: both were hotlines. And when I was at the Grady 364 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:47,879 Speaker 1: Ereate Crisis Center, I worked from seven pm to seven 365 00:22:48,000 --> 00:22:55,000 Speaker 1: am as a volunteer. That phone rang every night, over 366 00:22:55,080 --> 00:22:58,800 Speaker 1: and over. And it's amazing to me to think that 367 00:22:58,880 --> 00:23:03,640 Speaker 1: somebody in his position, with his money, with his staff, 368 00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:08,720 Speaker 1: you know, the number of people that he could have hurt, 369 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:13,320 Speaker 1: and he did it in front of others. Wiley video 370 00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:16,440 Speaker 1: taped it, so to your point, the people that were 371 00:23:16,520 --> 00:23:21,080 Speaker 1: hurt in private without the video, I can't imagine. 372 00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:23,399 Speaker 2: That gave me another flush. Back to man on the 373 00:23:23,400 --> 00:23:26,200 Speaker 2: phones at the Battery Women's Center, and the phone rang 374 00:23:26,440 --> 00:23:30,359 Speaker 2: and rang and rang and rang. My banner which I 375 00:23:30,400 --> 00:23:32,240 Speaker 2: came up with in the middle of the night. I 376 00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:34,280 Speaker 2: started with one eight hundred, but I found out it 377 00:23:34,320 --> 00:23:36,840 Speaker 2: was a real phone number, so confuse it, so we 378 00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:41,840 Speaker 2: went with one nine hundred. Did he molest you? Question Mark? Okay, 379 00:23:42,680 --> 00:23:45,199 Speaker 2: they had to have a toll free number, which is 380 00:23:45,920 --> 00:23:51,400 Speaker 2: on a giant I guess banner behind Attorney Busby as 381 00:23:51,400 --> 00:23:54,359 Speaker 2: he's making his press conference. You know you're in trouble 382 00:23:54,440 --> 00:23:57,320 Speaker 2: when you have a one eight hundred number for people 383 00:23:57,320 --> 00:23:58,880 Speaker 2: to call that were your victims. 384 00:23:59,359 --> 00:24:01,960 Speaker 1: Well, I think that number has got a triple and 385 00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:05,040 Speaker 1: then it might quadruple by the end of next week. 386 00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:07,800 Speaker 2: Okay, sot's see what happened. I got to worry about 387 00:24:07,800 --> 00:24:10,840 Speaker 2: Coburger now. Yes, so I guess we're going to Boise. 388 00:24:11,560 --> 00:24:14,240 Speaker 1: We're going to Boise, and we got to be in 389 00:24:14,320 --> 00:24:15,359 Speaker 1: del five pretty soon. 390 00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:18,960 Speaker 2: I know they say they're going forward. Are they really 391 00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:23,080 Speaker 2: this delayed? Delayed delays the defense attorney's best friend. 392 00:24:23,480 --> 00:24:27,080 Speaker 1: Those poor families. I just pray that they don't stall 393 00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:28,119 Speaker 1: another time. 394 00:24:29,160 --> 00:24:33,440 Speaker 2: Another thing that's heartbreaking is that the victims' families in 395 00:24:34,200 --> 00:24:39,879 Speaker 2: Coburger's trial are having to raise money to relocate to 396 00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:43,520 Speaker 2: Boise to attend the trial. And there is nothing like 397 00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,920 Speaker 2: going to a trial where your loved one is the 398 00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:51,040 Speaker 2: murder victim. I can remember Cheryl, my mom, I remember 399 00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:53,359 Speaker 2: my dad driving me, but my mom says she also 400 00:24:53,440 --> 00:24:55,200 Speaker 2: joined me, and I can't even remember that. I was 401 00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:59,159 Speaker 2: just all a horrible blur. Really, I would be in 402 00:24:59,200 --> 00:25:02,159 Speaker 2: the backseat of the car. Can't even remember any of 403 00:25:02,200 --> 00:25:04,200 Speaker 2: the trip, you know. I'd look up once in a while, 404 00:25:04,240 --> 00:25:07,640 Speaker 2: and that's all I can remember. We would drive over 405 00:25:07,720 --> 00:25:11,840 Speaker 2: two hours one way to the courthouse every day for 406 00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:16,040 Speaker 2: the trial of the guy that murdered key h And 407 00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:19,639 Speaker 2: I can't imagine these poor families having to raise money 408 00:25:20,119 --> 00:25:24,520 Speaker 2: to relocate to boys. He just ugh, Okay, I gotta go, 409 00:25:24,640 --> 00:25:27,720 Speaker 2: Bye buddy, Bye honey.