WEBVTT - The Big Deal About Drones

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<v Speaker 1>Get in test with technology with text Stuff from stuff

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<v Speaker 1>dot com. Heathen and welcome to Text Stuff. I'm Jonathan

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<v Speaker 1>Strickland and I'm Lauren Bo. Today we're going to talk

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<v Speaker 1>about some unmanned aerial vehicles you a v s, also

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<v Speaker 1>known as drones drones. So, drones have been in the

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<v Speaker 1>news a lot for multiple reasons. Some of them are

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<v Speaker 1>fun reasons and some of them are not so fun recently. Right,

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<v Speaker 1>they are a really interesting development in robotics that has

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<v Speaker 1>a lot of very positive applications and unfortunately a lot

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<v Speaker 1>of negative ones as well. Right, So we're going to

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<v Speaker 1>cover kind of the whole spectrum. Right, We're gonna look

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<v Speaker 1>at everything from the silly and sublime to the pretty serious,

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<v Speaker 1>pretty serious and scary really uh, and and also talk

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<v Speaker 1>about why is there a debate about drones. But so,

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<v Speaker 1>to start off, Jonathan, what actually is a U A

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<v Speaker 1>b okay so unmanned aerial vehicle? You can essentially say

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<v Speaker 1>that this is any sort of flying device that doesn't

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<v Speaker 1>carry a passenger in it, that is used for some

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<v Speaker 1>other purpose. Usually we go one step beyond what would

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<v Speaker 1>be a typical r C airplane or RC helicopter. You

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<v Speaker 1>wouldn't really call that a drone because there's not really

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<v Speaker 1>anything on there other than the fact that this is

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<v Speaker 1>something for you to pilot around and have fun with.

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<v Speaker 1>So like a remote control air shark, maybe maybe not

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<v Speaker 1>a drone. Yeah, probably not a drone. But if you

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<v Speaker 1>were to put say a camera in that remote controlled

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<v Speaker 1>air shark and you could actually spy on people, that

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<v Speaker 1>would be a air shark drone. Probably not the most

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<v Speaker 1>subtle of unmanned drones that you've ever seen. But maybe

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<v Speaker 1>you were to create something like a camera on it,

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<v Speaker 1>and also to have some sort of fabric display, which

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<v Speaker 1>is a possibility. Let's say you have a fabric display

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<v Speaker 1>and then on the underside it can actually show you pictures.

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<v Speaker 1>That would be like a crazy kind of art experiment

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<v Speaker 1>that I would expect to see it burning man or

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<v Speaker 1>dragon con. I really want that now, actually totally something

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<v Speaker 1>that could be a possibility. And so when we're talking

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<v Speaker 1>about drones, were usually talking about something that does something

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<v Speaker 1>on top of just flying around. Now that might mean

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<v Speaker 1>that it's got some cameras and sensors on it that

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<v Speaker 1>allow it to do some things like navigate through spaces

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<v Speaker 1>or give you a look at a particular area. Maybe

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<v Speaker 1>it doesn't have those sensors. Maybe it just carries stuff.

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<v Speaker 1>And we'll talk about some of the crazy delivery drones

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<v Speaker 1>that have popped up, sometimes literally across the globe. But

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<v Speaker 1>usually these are controlled remotely by a pilot using some

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<v Speaker 1>sort of interface that connects via radio signal to the

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<v Speaker 1>vehicle's navigation and control systems, or the vehicles themselves are autonomous,

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<v Speaker 1>meaning that they can use their own sensors. Yeah, exactly,

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<v Speaker 1>you have to program what it's going to do ahead

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<v Speaker 1>of time. It's not like they have artificial intelligence. And

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<v Speaker 1>can you know, it's not RoboCop on wings, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>I suppose it could could hypothetically be one day, One

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<v Speaker 1>day we might get there. But right now we're talking

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<v Speaker 1>about devices that you you give it a pre program

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<v Speaker 1>set of parameters. Perhaps it's to fly to a specific

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<v Speaker 1>coordinate and then fly back, and it's using things like

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<v Speaker 1>the GPS sensor to navigate to where it needs to go. Uh.

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<v Speaker 1>But otherwise, once once you've said in motion, it takes

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<v Speaker 1>control of itself. I think most drones tend to be

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<v Speaker 1>under human control. Although we have drastically increased that capability,

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<v Speaker 1>it used to be that it was all line of sight.

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<v Speaker 1>In other words, the controller had to be able to

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<v Speaker 1>see the the drone in order to maintain control. That's

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<v Speaker 1>not the case now. Increases in miniaturization and GPS technology

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<v Speaker 1>has has really pushed that field force certainly. Yeah, satellite

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<v Speaker 1>communications has made it possible for us to have ridiculous

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<v Speaker 1>kinds of control over unmanned aerial vehicles. So they can

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<v Speaker 1>often stay in the air for longer than a day,

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<v Speaker 1>particularly when we start talking about some of the ones

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<v Speaker 1>that are used in scientific research and military applications, they

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<v Speaker 1>can go for up to up I've heard up to

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<v Speaker 1>forty eight hours and without refueling in some cases. Yeah, exactly,

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<v Speaker 1>so you can have forty eight hours of consistent flight time.

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<v Speaker 1>And now, obviously, if you're talking about a manned control situation,

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<v Speaker 1>you then are also talking about having shifts switching off

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<v Speaker 1>teams of pilots, right, And there's there's usually for for

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<v Speaker 1>this kind of thing to pilots, one to actually do

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<v Speaker 1>the controlling assumed assuming that it's not being autonomously controlled,

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<v Speaker 1>and a second watching the sensory readouts and helping the

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<v Speaker 1>pilot there, right, And then some some cases you're talking

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<v Speaker 1>about even larger teams. But we'll talk about some of

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<v Speaker 1>the more complex ones in a bit. So they also

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<v Speaker 1>can very pretty widely in size and sophistication. So a

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<v Speaker 1>typical tiny little drone you might think of like the

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<v Speaker 1>parrot drone, which is a quadrocopter drone. It's the kind

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<v Speaker 1>of has the rotors on the four corners, so it

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<v Speaker 1>gives it a very stable flight path, and you can

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<v Speaker 1>even do some crazy trips tricks. Rather, you can do

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<v Speaker 1>crazy trips too if you wanted to, but crazy tricks

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<v Speaker 1>letting it do things like barrel rolls, although it's more

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<v Speaker 1>like a very quick flip because obviously you lose stabilization

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<v Speaker 1>once those those uh, those those blades go vertical as

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<v Speaker 1>opposed to horizontal, and then you can control that with

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<v Speaker 1>an iPhone, So you can actually use a smartphone to

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<v Speaker 1>control a parrot drone. I was talking earlier today about

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<v Speaker 1>how I had a really crazy schedule today. So today

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<v Speaker 1>Jonathan schedule included a phone call with FEMA uh A

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<v Speaker 1>talk about electronics in the f a A, which was

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<v Speaker 1>an episode that we recorded earlier today, although when it

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<v Speaker 1>publishes is a mystery, and then also talking about drones,

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<v Speaker 1>and so a friend of mine said, oh, so is

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<v Speaker 1>that is this all in preparation for talking about how

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<v Speaker 1>FEMA could control a drone with a an iPhone because

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<v Speaker 1>the Apple event was also the day that we're recording

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<v Speaker 1>this and said, you know, you're making a joke, but

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<v Speaker 1>that's totally possible. But as the parent drone allows you

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<v Speaker 1>to control it with an iPhone, absolutely, and uh yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>these are small, you know, commercial devices. You can you

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<v Speaker 1>can go out and buy something. Yeah, yeah, you can

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<v Speaker 1>actually buy one right now. And I remember the first

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<v Speaker 1>time I saw one at ce S several years ago,

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<v Speaker 1>maybe twenty ten or maybe even earlier, and I was

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<v Speaker 1>really impressed. And it included a little camera on the

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<v Speaker 1>device itself, so it could allow you to look around

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<v Speaker 1>and you were you were able to play games with

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<v Speaker 1>other people who had parent drones and do kind of

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<v Speaker 1>a virtual shoot him up type thing that would be

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<v Speaker 1>reflected with your actual drones real world location. So it's

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<v Speaker 1>kind of neat stuff. But if you want to talk

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<v Speaker 1>about the other end of the spectrum, now, that's on

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<v Speaker 1>the simple side, right, that's that's a very small, portable

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<v Speaker 1>device that the average person can use and you're using

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<v Speaker 1>a very simple interface to control it. The other end

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<v Speaker 1>of that spectrum is drones that are the size of

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<v Speaker 1>an actual like manned aircraft, like a small business jet

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<v Speaker 1>or so I think is the size that which I

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<v Speaker 1>think are the largest military drone and predators are both

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<v Speaker 1>pretty big. Yeah, because a predator. If you see a

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<v Speaker 1>picture of a predator drone, you might think, what's the

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<v Speaker 1>size of that? Is that like maybe you know, half

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<v Speaker 1>the size of a car? No, those are much bigger

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<v Speaker 1>than cars, but they if from casual glance, if you

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<v Speaker 1>were near one, you might think, well, that's an interesting jet.

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<v Speaker 1>Where's the cockpit because I don't see where the person

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<v Speaker 1>would look out because it looks blank. Yeah, but it's

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<v Speaker 1>in fact a drone, and so you end up flying

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<v Speaker 1>it using all the different sensors and cameras that are

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<v Speaker 1>on it as the guidance. Although for aerodynamic purposes it's

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<v Speaker 1>still shaped more or less the way that a passenger

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<v Speaker 1>airplane would be, right, I mean, and that just makes

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<v Speaker 1>sense for pure physics, right, I Mean, it's not like

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<v Speaker 1>theoretically we could have it shaped anything that would fly,

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<v Speaker 1>But why would you change it up so much if

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<v Speaker 1>that's the most efficient shape. I kind of want them

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<v Speaker 1>to paint just just go ahead and paint like a

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<v Speaker 1>cylon toaster, have like a little led that goes back

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<v Speaker 1>and forth and it just constantly chanced by your command.

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<v Speaker 1>That's from the nineteen superior version of Bellstar Galatica. Um,

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<v Speaker 1>we're really gonna have to have a geek fight about

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<v Speaker 1>that same day, Chaathan. Anyway, there will be a reckoning.

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<v Speaker 1>So with those kind of military style drones are the

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<v Speaker 1>ones that scientific endeavors are using. These large, large drones,

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<v Speaker 1>those are the ones that need multiple people to really

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<v Speaker 1>control it. And also they usually have a link up

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<v Speaker 1>where you can control it from quite a far away away.

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<v Speaker 1>But we'll get into that a little bit later. Uh. Now,

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<v Speaker 1>there's some rules about drones though, right, Yes, some some

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<v Speaker 1>countries China for example, and this will become important in

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<v Speaker 1>a moment. Uh. It's it's basically legal to operate commercial

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<v Speaker 1>drones anywhere that you want, as long as you get

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<v Speaker 1>local authorization. Here in the US, um, drones are authorized

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<v Speaker 1>in some military airspace and patroller borders. Also there's some

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<v Speaker 1>three public agencies that can use them at low altitudes

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<v Speaker 1>away from airport. Right. It's essentially the same sort of

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<v Speaker 1>rules that the Guide r C h r C flight

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<v Speaker 1>vehicles like anything like a remote control plane and remote

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<v Speaker 1>controlled helicopter. There are specific rules that that are dictated

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<v Speaker 1>by the US government and most of them are the

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<v Speaker 1>same as for the drones. Sure, sure, And now, um,

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<v Speaker 1>the f a A. H the Federal Administration, thank you.

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<v Speaker 1>I always want to say aeronautics, and that's not quite

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<v Speaker 1>the right word. Um, it does is working on new

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<v Speaker 1>regulations right now. They're supposed to come out in and

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<v Speaker 1>at that point we're probably going to see a lot

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<v Speaker 1>more commercial and private drones flying around. Yeah, it's going

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<v Speaker 1>to be one of those those things where they'll be

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<v Speaker 1>there may be some more specific rules to guide this

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<v Speaker 1>sort of thing. You know. This is again another one

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<v Speaker 1>of those examples of how technology evolves faster than the

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<v Speaker 1>laure because I don't know if you've ever noticed, but

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<v Speaker 1>the government does not move in the speed of night,

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<v Speaker 1>certainly not by Morris law. No, no, no, no no.

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<v Speaker 1>So so we see these developments happen faster than the

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<v Speaker 1>way agencies can legislate them. But that is coming. The

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<v Speaker 1>two thousand fifteen will be interesting to see exactly how

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<v Speaker 1>the f a A handles that and and how, you know,

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<v Speaker 1>is it going to be really restricted? Is it going

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<v Speaker 1>to open things up. Will there be specific agencies that

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<v Speaker 1>people who operate drones will have to report to? We

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<v Speaker 1>don't know. We have to wait. It's a it's it's

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<v Speaker 1>part of a larger like sixty three point four billion

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<v Speaker 1>dollar initiative for the f A to to update traffic

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<v Speaker 1>control systems and expand airspace. So that's important stuff. So

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<v Speaker 1>let's talk about some uses fun uses of some drones,

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<v Speaker 1>like scientific research. So there are a lot of organizations

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<v Speaker 1>out there that are using drones in some way or

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<v Speaker 1>another to conduct scientific research, and that includes NASA and Noah.

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<v Speaker 1>Those organizations are both using drones to study inhospitable environments

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<v Speaker 1>here on Earth, right, you know, lots of places that

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<v Speaker 1>it would either be uh overly expensive or difficult or

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<v Speaker 1>dangerous to get humans out to to take a look at. Right, Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>if we can get an unmanned aerial vehicle to fly by,

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<v Speaker 1>say a giant crater that's remote and difficult to access otherwise, oh,

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<v Speaker 1>to say, or in a volcano or at an oil

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<v Speaker 1>spill or exactly. Yeah. So here's some of the examples,

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<v Speaker 1>and we've mentioned a couple of them. Oil spills, volcanic ash,

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<v Speaker 1>that kind of stuff. Looking at these sort of things

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<v Speaker 1>that's that can be hazardous, but also they using UH

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<v Speaker 1>drones to explore repositories of ice in Greenland, Antarctica, and Alaska.

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<v Speaker 1>In other words, trying to get a real look at

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<v Speaker 1>what how how these giant areas of ice are doing

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<v Speaker 1>because the melt off is happening pretty quick quickly, but

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<v Speaker 1>it's hard to get a good look at it because

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<v Speaker 1>these are pretty remote areas. U a v s can

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<v Speaker 1>give us a much closer look at that. NASA is

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<v Speaker 1>using them to study hurricanes, so we're looking at the

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<v Speaker 1>way hurricanes develop and sort of the paths they take,

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<v Speaker 1>and also how hurricanes how storms can change when they

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<v Speaker 1>start to encounter different types of land masses. This hurricane

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<v Speaker 1>season in particular, NASA is using a lot of drones

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<v Speaker 1>to um to just watch the way storms are developing

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<v Speaker 1>and and send information back. Yeah, they're using what are

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<v Speaker 1>called global Hawk drones, which are the same type of

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<v Speaker 1>drones that are used in some military surveillance operations. Global

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<v Speaker 1>Hawk is not the most prevalent of the drones that

0:12:25.880 --> 0:12:27.680
<v Speaker 1>the military uses, but it's sort of one of the

0:12:27.760 --> 0:12:31.360
<v Speaker 1>precursors to what we tend to use today. We've also

0:12:31.440 --> 0:12:35.520
<v Speaker 1>seen agencies use these drones to study wildfires and to

0:12:35.640 --> 0:12:39.280
<v Speaker 1>get an idea of where the wildfire is spreading. Again,

0:12:39.400 --> 0:12:43.520
<v Speaker 1>obviously a very dangerous situation to send people into. And

0:12:43.640 --> 0:12:47.440
<v Speaker 1>you know, the worst case scenario with a drone in

0:12:47.480 --> 0:12:50.360
<v Speaker 1>this kind of situation is that you lose an expensive

0:12:50.400 --> 0:12:52.800
<v Speaker 1>piece of equipment. But the worst case scenario in other

0:12:52.840 --> 0:12:56.720
<v Speaker 1>situations is that you lose human life. So that's obviously

0:12:56.760 --> 0:13:00.000
<v Speaker 1>one of those reasons why it's very attractive for science.

0:13:00.040 --> 0:13:02.720
<v Speaker 1>Diffic study also is a bonus. These things can can

0:13:02.720 --> 0:13:06.560
<v Speaker 1>fly lower, slower, and more quietly than um than a

0:13:06.600 --> 0:13:09.679
<v Speaker 1>typical manned aircraft, right, so you can get a longer

0:13:09.760 --> 0:13:12.480
<v Speaker 1>look at things. And perhaps if you're using it even

0:13:12.520 --> 0:13:17.439
<v Speaker 1>to study things like wildlife, it's not as likely. Uh.

0:13:17.480 --> 0:13:21.120
<v Speaker 1>And and these research vehicles can vary, just like the

0:13:21.240 --> 0:13:22.760
<v Speaker 1>U A v's we talked about at the top of

0:13:22.760 --> 0:13:25.520
<v Speaker 1>the show. And and Lauren, I think you found an

0:13:25.520 --> 0:13:28.439
<v Speaker 1>interesting U A V that's being used in scientific research,

0:13:28.520 --> 0:13:32.640
<v Speaker 1>something that's actually using solar power. Right, there's something called

0:13:32.640 --> 0:13:36.199
<v Speaker 1>a pathfinder that was built in the nineties for civilian

0:13:36.200 --> 0:13:40.000
<v Speaker 1>purposes like collecting data on on weather and the climate. UM.

0:13:40.040 --> 0:13:43.160
<v Speaker 1>It's it's reached. It's it's reached a record of of

0:13:43.240 --> 0:13:50.600
<v Speaker 1>height for solar powered aircraft, which is what's that sixty feet? Yeah,

0:13:50.640 --> 0:13:55.480
<v Speaker 1>which is something like twenty kilometers kilometers. That's that's pretty

0:13:55.480 --> 0:13:59.200
<v Speaker 1>incredible elevation for an unmanned vehicle, right and you know

0:13:59.280 --> 0:14:03.640
<v Speaker 1>not not too and that kind of data is is important.

0:14:04.280 --> 0:14:09.120
<v Speaker 1>Yep yep. Uh. So other uses for drones include things

0:14:09.160 --> 0:14:12.720
<v Speaker 1>like historic research. I came across an article that was

0:14:12.760 --> 0:14:16.840
<v Speaker 1>interesting was talking about Peruvian archaeologists who were using drones

0:14:16.920 --> 0:14:20.840
<v Speaker 1>to explore ancient ruins without disturbing the area with actual

0:14:20.920 --> 0:14:23.960
<v Speaker 1>vehicle or foot traffic. So they didn't want to disturb

0:14:24.040 --> 0:14:28.440
<v Speaker 1>an area that had a lot of cultural and historical significance. Also,

0:14:28.680 --> 0:14:33.600
<v Speaker 1>they want to use drones as a way of monitoring

0:14:33.640 --> 0:14:35.880
<v Speaker 1>a site, so not just mapping a site, which has

0:14:35.960 --> 0:14:38.480
<v Speaker 1>turned out to be incredibly useful. In fact, I read

0:14:38.480 --> 0:14:41.760
<v Speaker 1>one archaeologist report that said that they were able to

0:14:41.800 --> 0:14:43.800
<v Speaker 1>do in a few days the same sort of work

0:14:43.840 --> 0:14:46.960
<v Speaker 1>that normally would take them years to map out a site.

0:14:47.600 --> 0:14:49.520
<v Speaker 1>But they also want to use it in order to

0:14:49.600 --> 0:14:54.000
<v Speaker 1>monitor a site and keep people from taking advantage of it.

0:14:54.040 --> 0:14:58.880
<v Speaker 1>There are examples of people who have squatted on land

0:14:58.920 --> 0:15:02.360
<v Speaker 1>that's directly a adjacent to historic sites, either as a

0:15:02.400 --> 0:15:06.080
<v Speaker 1>means of trying to monetize that or just because they

0:15:06.120 --> 0:15:08.440
<v Speaker 1>figure that by being close to something like that they

0:15:08.480 --> 0:15:12.000
<v Speaker 1>are less likely to be displaced. So it's kind of, uh,

0:15:12.600 --> 0:15:15.360
<v Speaker 1>it's this idea of trying to protect the area before

0:15:15.880 --> 0:15:19.960
<v Speaker 1>people try and leverage that in some other way. You

0:15:20.000 --> 0:15:23.160
<v Speaker 1>also have a note about using using this for pest control. Yeah,

0:15:23.280 --> 0:15:26.160
<v Speaker 1>Florida is looking at using drones for pest control. Now

0:15:26.160 --> 0:15:29.200
<v Speaker 1>they're not actually talking about arming drones with some sort

0:15:29.240 --> 0:15:33.760
<v Speaker 1>of pesticide and then blasting it at laser mosquitoes, app

0:15:33.880 --> 0:15:36.640
<v Speaker 1>or something like that. They're outfitting all the drones with

0:15:36.680 --> 0:15:39.680
<v Speaker 1>these two giant robot arms that come together in a

0:15:39.800 --> 0:15:42.920
<v Speaker 1>slapping motion and then they're just gonna squish them one

0:15:42.960 --> 0:15:46.400
<v Speaker 1>by one. So that's not true. Now, it's Florida's using

0:15:46.560 --> 0:15:49.080
<v Speaker 1>looking at using drones in a way of controlling the

0:15:49.080 --> 0:15:52.720
<v Speaker 1>mosquito population. Now, mosquitoes obviously can carry lots of different

0:15:52.720 --> 0:15:56.240
<v Speaker 1>diseases that can be very harmful to animals and people,

0:15:56.440 --> 0:15:59.120
<v Speaker 1>and they mostly they must be breed in very shallow

0:15:59.160 --> 0:16:02.520
<v Speaker 1>pools of water. Still shallow pools of water. That's where

0:16:02.520 --> 0:16:04.760
<v Speaker 1>you get the mosquitoes breeding, you get all the mosquito

0:16:04.840 --> 0:16:07.840
<v Speaker 1>larva and uh, I don't know if you're familiar with

0:16:07.840 --> 0:16:11.240
<v Speaker 1>Florida having lived there for so long, only four years.

0:16:11.320 --> 0:16:15.240
<v Speaker 1>So there's some some there's like a little puddle called

0:16:15.280 --> 0:16:19.640
<v Speaker 1>the Everglades that's out there where there could that's a

0:16:19.640 --> 0:16:21.720
<v Speaker 1>lot of It's a large area, right, We're talking like

0:16:21.880 --> 0:16:25.080
<v Speaker 1>lots and lots of square miles or kilometers if you prefer,

0:16:25.520 --> 0:16:29.520
<v Speaker 1>that could potentially have this kind of shallow water where

0:16:29.520 --> 0:16:32.960
<v Speaker 1>mosquitoes could breed. Now, traditionally what would happen is Florida

0:16:33.000 --> 0:16:36.960
<v Speaker 1>would send out people to go and cover this ground

0:16:37.000 --> 0:16:40.000
<v Speaker 1>and look for places that would be mosquito breeding grounds

0:16:40.040 --> 0:16:43.680
<v Speaker 1>and then treat those areas so that they could control

0:16:43.720 --> 0:16:48.680
<v Speaker 1>the mosquito population somewhat. But that's time consuming and expensive,

0:16:48.840 --> 0:16:51.360
<v Speaker 1>and it's it's hard. It's hard to send people out

0:16:51.440 --> 0:16:55.000
<v Speaker 1>and really, you know, covered all that ground, because it

0:16:55.040 --> 0:16:58.160
<v Speaker 1>really is a great deal of ground. There's alligators and

0:16:58.840 --> 0:17:02.400
<v Speaker 1>sometimes crocodiles if you get far enough towards the coast. Anyway,

0:17:02.440 --> 0:17:05.200
<v Speaker 1>the point being that there are many things that could

0:17:05.240 --> 0:17:09.520
<v Speaker 1>potentially cause someone harm or just be difficult to navigate around.

0:17:10.000 --> 0:17:13.360
<v Speaker 1>Um and uh not to mention things like boa constrictors

0:17:13.359 --> 0:17:17.280
<v Speaker 1>and anacondas. But more importantly, drones can be used to

0:17:17.400 --> 0:17:20.920
<v Speaker 1>deliver cakes. Okay, yes, alright, so we're going beyond past

0:17:20.960 --> 0:17:24.960
<v Speaker 1>control here, we're going into using drones to deliver things,

0:17:25.040 --> 0:17:28.520
<v Speaker 1>including possibly cake, although that may or may not also

0:17:28.680 --> 0:17:32.160
<v Speaker 1>be a lie. Uh no, no. Drone delivery is something

0:17:32.160 --> 0:17:34.480
<v Speaker 1>that has popped up a few places, and it's mostly,

0:17:34.520 --> 0:17:37.800
<v Speaker 1>I would argue, a kind of us A publicity stunts,

0:17:37.840 --> 0:17:41.200
<v Speaker 1>the marketing. It's not not meant as actual like here

0:17:41.200 --> 0:17:46.080
<v Speaker 1>here's service because it is so much more expensive and unreliabing,

0:17:46.400 --> 0:17:48.879
<v Speaker 1>and it's still very werek intensive because you still have

0:17:48.920 --> 0:17:51.720
<v Speaker 1>to have someone navigating the drones and in most of

0:17:51.760 --> 0:17:55.800
<v Speaker 1>these cases the drones are remote controlled, so there's actually

0:17:55.800 --> 0:17:58.160
<v Speaker 1>you have to have a car or a person following

0:17:58.200 --> 0:18:00.760
<v Speaker 1>the drone right when you could just have that person

0:18:00.800 --> 0:18:03.560
<v Speaker 1>deliver whatever it is. But that's not nearly as cool

0:18:03.600 --> 0:18:07.560
<v Speaker 1>as having this rhodocopter thing dropped from the sky and

0:18:07.640 --> 0:18:09.919
<v Speaker 1>deliver your pizza. And by the way, pizza is one

0:18:09.960 --> 0:18:13.040
<v Speaker 1>of the things in fact Domino's Pizza, the doma coopter

0:18:13.640 --> 0:18:16.160
<v Speaker 1>demacopter this is this is in the UK right, Yeah,

0:18:16.160 --> 0:18:18.320
<v Speaker 1>as in the UK. It was a joint effort between

0:18:18.359 --> 0:18:20.840
<v Speaker 1>Aero Site, which was the company that built the drone,

0:18:21.280 --> 0:18:24.200
<v Speaker 1>a company called Big Communications, in another company called T

0:18:24.680 --> 0:18:30.880
<v Speaker 1>Plus Biscuits. It's cute that very very British. Um. And

0:18:30.920 --> 0:18:33.879
<v Speaker 1>so this was a sort of a publicity stunt where

0:18:33.920 --> 0:18:38.119
<v Speaker 1>they showed a a quad copter very similar to something

0:18:38.160 --> 0:18:40.960
<v Speaker 1>like the Parrot drone that you could you could look

0:18:41.040 --> 0:18:44.800
<v Speaker 1>up online. There's a quad copter that could carry a

0:18:44.840 --> 0:18:48.920
<v Speaker 1>bag that would contain pizzas. Um, there's a heat bag,

0:18:49.000 --> 0:18:51.119
<v Speaker 1>you know. It's one of those that is lined with

0:18:51.200 --> 0:18:53.200
<v Speaker 1>a reflective material on the inside to try and keep

0:18:53.200 --> 0:18:55.879
<v Speaker 1>as much heat in as possible. And I saw a

0:18:56.000 --> 0:18:58.520
<v Speaker 1>video where they loaded one up with two pizzas and

0:18:58.520 --> 0:19:02.400
<v Speaker 1>then flew it over some fields into a different, uh

0:19:02.440 --> 0:19:06.399
<v Speaker 1>like neighborhood and landed it near a guy who pulled

0:19:06.400 --> 0:19:09.639
<v Speaker 1>his pizzas out, and then it flew off again. Very clever,

0:19:09.800 --> 0:19:12.960
<v Speaker 1>but again mostly just a marketing kind of stunt here.

0:19:13.160 --> 0:19:15.840
<v Speaker 1>It's not something you're not going to get robot delivery

0:19:15.840 --> 0:19:17.920
<v Speaker 1>of pizzas because, like you were saying, Lauren, you had

0:19:17.920 --> 0:19:20.840
<v Speaker 1>to have a human pilot who had to have a

0:19:20.880 --> 0:19:24.400
<v Speaker 1>line of sight on this to make sure that they

0:19:24.560 --> 0:19:28.840
<v Speaker 1>were not going to pilot into a tree or or

0:19:28.920 --> 0:19:31.240
<v Speaker 1>drop the pizza in the wrong place. I mean, nothing

0:19:31.359 --> 0:19:33.639
<v Speaker 1>is more irritating. I think you'll agree that when you

0:19:33.760 --> 0:19:36.600
<v Speaker 1>order pizza and you find out that you know you're

0:19:36.400 --> 0:19:38.880
<v Speaker 1>you're my pizza drone has delivered to the next house

0:19:38.920 --> 0:19:41.560
<v Speaker 1>over right. Yeah, like all those people who listen to

0:19:41.720 --> 0:19:43.960
<v Speaker 1>fish all night long at all your pizza, you know

0:19:44.000 --> 0:19:46.200
<v Speaker 1>what I'm talking about, Lauren. Anyway, so all the time

0:19:46.240 --> 0:19:50.439
<v Speaker 1>with those pizza drones. Also in Shanghai, China, a company

0:19:50.480 --> 0:19:53.600
<v Speaker 1>called in Cake was was delivering cakes in a very

0:19:53.600 --> 0:19:57.320
<v Speaker 1>similar way. Yeah. Another delivery company in China called SF

0:19:57.359 --> 0:20:00.920
<v Speaker 1>Express was using drunes to deliver packages. The packages could

0:20:00.920 --> 0:20:03.880
<v Speaker 1>weigh up to six point six pounds or just under

0:20:03.920 --> 0:20:06.760
<v Speaker 1>three kilograms, and the drones themselves could fly at an

0:20:06.800 --> 0:20:10.320
<v Speaker 1>elevation of three thirty feet or just over one which

0:20:10.320 --> 0:20:12.320
<v Speaker 1>is pretty high for one of those old quad copters.

0:20:12.720 --> 0:20:15.720
<v Speaker 1>Supposedly that that in Cake company got got shut down,

0:20:15.800 --> 0:20:18.479
<v Speaker 1>or the drone delivery system anyway got shut down by

0:20:18.520 --> 0:20:22.439
<v Speaker 1>Shanghai police when they got worried calls in from the

0:20:22.480 --> 0:20:26.320
<v Speaker 1>populace saying like I am in danger from this cake Drone.

0:20:26.720 --> 0:20:30.159
<v Speaker 1>There are from this cake drone aliens flying over the

0:20:30.200 --> 0:20:33.640
<v Speaker 1>city and they're dropping confectionery on us. Uh, I think

0:20:33.640 --> 0:20:36.320
<v Speaker 1>we're like three D cakes. I'm still I'm a little

0:20:36.320 --> 0:20:39.840
<v Speaker 1>bit obsessed with this. Yeah, I need some flying cake.

0:20:40.440 --> 0:20:43.440
<v Speaker 1>So in Philadelphia there was a cleaner, a dry cleaner.

0:20:43.880 --> 0:20:46.240
<v Speaker 1>The men a young cleaners and I'm sure I'm this

0:20:46.480 --> 0:20:49.880
<v Speaker 1>pronouncing that, but any kind of Native American names from

0:20:49.920 --> 0:20:54.960
<v Speaker 1>the Northeast are completely beyond my ability to pronounce. But anyway,

0:20:55.119 --> 0:20:57.040
<v Speaker 1>this was a dry cleaners that used a drone to

0:20:57.400 --> 0:21:01.080
<v Speaker 1>deliver dry cleaned clothing to cut to mers. But that

0:21:01.119 --> 0:21:04.520
<v Speaker 1>one required two operators, and it required someone who was

0:21:04.720 --> 0:21:09.000
<v Speaker 1>holding the controller and also a spotter. There was no camera, right,

0:21:09.160 --> 0:21:13.159
<v Speaker 1>most most of these rigs have included cameras, right, But

0:21:13.280 --> 0:21:15.400
<v Speaker 1>like the one the Dominoes, one had a camera bill

0:21:15.480 --> 0:21:17.480
<v Speaker 1>it so if you watch the video you can actually

0:21:17.480 --> 0:21:20.000
<v Speaker 1>see it from the the drones point of view as

0:21:20.000 --> 0:21:26.080
<v Speaker 1>it flies across the English countryside delivering pizza by by

0:21:26.200 --> 0:21:30.960
<v Speaker 1>by flight. But there's also the Taco copter, which I

0:21:31.080 --> 0:21:34.320
<v Speaker 1>really hope this becomes a thing because I want if

0:21:34.359 --> 0:21:37.160
<v Speaker 1>I could get my tacos delivered by robot I don't

0:21:37.160 --> 0:21:40.720
<v Speaker 1>think I'd ever leave the house. Um to San Francisco

0:21:40.800 --> 0:21:44.240
<v Speaker 1>area Bay Area invite only app where you can order

0:21:44.280 --> 0:21:47.239
<v Speaker 1>tacos and have them delivered via drone. Although it's more

0:21:47.359 --> 0:21:50.399
<v Speaker 1>or less just a concept right now, it's not really

0:21:50.440 --> 0:21:52.360
<v Speaker 1>a service. And again, this is one of those things

0:21:52.359 --> 0:21:54.760
<v Speaker 1>where they are talking about waiting for the f a

0:21:54.760 --> 0:21:57.560
<v Speaker 1>a S regulations to really you know, it doesn't make

0:21:57.600 --> 0:21:59.840
<v Speaker 1>sense to pour a lot of money into a business

0:21:59.840 --> 0:22:02.560
<v Speaker 1>that might not be able to operate depending upon what

0:22:02.600 --> 0:22:05.280
<v Speaker 1>the FAA's regulations are. Right. Sure that goes along with

0:22:05.320 --> 0:22:07.960
<v Speaker 1>your next note, which is for a burrito bomber. Yes,

0:22:08.200 --> 0:22:11.959
<v Speaker 1>Darwin Arrow spaces burrito bomber. It's a drone that drops

0:22:12.000 --> 0:22:16.040
<v Speaker 1>burritos on you. But the burritos also have little little parachutes. Yeah,

0:22:16.040 --> 0:22:20.480
<v Speaker 1>so you get parachute dropped burritos. I would also be

0:22:20.880 --> 0:22:24.640
<v Speaker 1>I would welcome I would welcome a delivery of burritos

0:22:24.680 --> 0:22:28.000
<v Speaker 1>by a parachute over my place. UM, I do not

0:22:28.160 --> 0:22:30.720
<v Speaker 1>welcome people just pelting my place with burritos. I want

0:22:30.720 --> 0:22:33.000
<v Speaker 1>to be clear about this. I want to go home

0:22:33.000 --> 0:22:35.760
<v Speaker 1>and find a bunch of burritos splatted against my house.

0:22:36.280 --> 0:22:38.280
<v Speaker 1>You guys, I have to admit, I think that would

0:22:38.280 --> 0:22:43.280
<v Speaker 1>be hilarious. Yeah, what's your address, Lauren? So yeah, these

0:22:43.320 --> 0:22:46.720
<v Speaker 1>are these are some of those kind of gimmicky, clever

0:22:46.840 --> 0:22:50.040
<v Speaker 1>things that we're seeing. But I don't think that it's

0:22:50.080 --> 0:22:54.840
<v Speaker 1>necessarily going to become a real delivery service anytime soon

0:22:54.920 --> 0:22:59.760
<v Speaker 1>beyond just the the curiosity. Certainly not until here in

0:22:59.800 --> 0:23:02.960
<v Speaker 1>the U s. The f A passes this new regulation.

0:23:03.080 --> 0:23:05.960
<v Speaker 1>The China one, I can almost understand because at least

0:23:05.960 --> 0:23:08.840
<v Speaker 1>the SF Express one was all about delivering in a

0:23:08.880 --> 0:23:13.439
<v Speaker 1>city in China that was known for its massive traffic congestion. Right,

0:23:13.480 --> 0:23:15.800
<v Speaker 1>it's a city of about eight million. I think that

0:23:15.800 --> 0:23:21.560
<v Speaker 1>that was on relatively small territory and uh, and it

0:23:21.640 --> 0:23:23.800
<v Speaker 1>was in the testing phases as of the last time

0:23:23.800 --> 0:23:26.160
<v Speaker 1>that I read an article about it, but it seemed

0:23:26.240 --> 0:23:30.240
<v Speaker 1>like it was operating within parameters as of yet. So

0:23:30.400 --> 0:23:33.600
<v Speaker 1>and since and since it is legal in China, basically, yeah,

0:23:33.800 --> 0:23:35.879
<v Speaker 1>in that case, I can kind of see it happening

0:23:35.880 --> 0:23:39.320
<v Speaker 1>in the sense that, well, there are some use case

0:23:39.320 --> 0:23:42.760
<v Speaker 1>scenarios where it would actually be more efficient to have

0:23:42.840 --> 0:23:46.640
<v Speaker 1>someone who perhaps is on like a fairly tall building

0:23:46.680 --> 0:23:50.400
<v Speaker 1>and can navigate something that way. But even then it's

0:23:50.440 --> 0:23:53.720
<v Speaker 1>you know, it's a little it's a little weird. Um.

0:23:53.880 --> 0:23:58.080
<v Speaker 1>So that kind of covers the civilian and corporate uses

0:23:58.359 --> 0:24:01.120
<v Speaker 1>of drones, as well as the re search institute uses

0:24:01.160 --> 0:24:03.960
<v Speaker 1>of drones. But there's another use that we need to cover,

0:24:04.000 --> 0:24:06.800
<v Speaker 1>and that of course is military. But that's a huge,

0:24:07.000 --> 0:24:10.520
<v Speaker 1>huge topic. So before we get into that, let's take

0:24:10.600 --> 0:24:14.040
<v Speaker 1>a quick break to thank our sponsor. All Right, so

0:24:14.119 --> 0:24:16.639
<v Speaker 1>here's the part of our our conversation where we really

0:24:16.800 --> 0:24:21.200
<v Speaker 1>do get pretty serious and talk about a controversial use

0:24:21.320 --> 0:24:24.159
<v Speaker 1>of of drones. And there are a couple of different

0:24:24.200 --> 0:24:28.120
<v Speaker 1>ways that the military uses them, um and and one

0:24:28.240 --> 0:24:31.280
<v Speaker 1>is certainly far more controversial than the other. But first

0:24:31.359 --> 0:24:34.119
<v Speaker 1>let's look at sort of the history of unmanned aerial

0:24:34.240 --> 0:24:39.080
<v Speaker 1>vehicles in the military, because yeah, in fact, the first

0:24:39.119 --> 0:24:42.160
<v Speaker 1>one is arguably you can argue this is the first

0:24:42.240 --> 0:24:44.920
<v Speaker 1>use of u a v s in military. The first

0:24:44.920 --> 0:24:49.280
<v Speaker 1>one actually pre dates powered manned flight, and that would

0:24:49.280 --> 0:24:53.320
<v Speaker 1>be on August twenty two, eighteen forty nine. And I

0:24:53.359 --> 0:24:55.320
<v Speaker 1>know what you're all thinking, like, how could there be

0:24:55.880 --> 0:24:59.400
<v Speaker 1>a drone in eighteen forty nine. It wasn't so much

0:24:59.440 --> 0:25:02.440
<v Speaker 1>a drone as it was this concept of I want

0:25:02.480 --> 0:25:06.160
<v Speaker 1>to be able to UH to attack a certain target,

0:25:06.760 --> 0:25:08.320
<v Speaker 1>and I want to do it in a way that's

0:25:08.320 --> 0:25:12.040
<v Speaker 1>going to minimize risk to my resources. How do I

0:25:12.080 --> 0:25:16.520
<v Speaker 1>do that? Well, the Austrians figured during the First Italian

0:25:16.560 --> 0:25:19.080
<v Speaker 1>War of Independence, which was a war that was fought

0:25:19.119 --> 0:25:23.840
<v Speaker 1>between the Kingdom of Sardinia and the Austrian Empire for control,

0:25:23.920 --> 0:25:27.520
<v Speaker 1>really they figured, well, we want to attack Venice, but

0:25:27.560 --> 0:25:29.760
<v Speaker 1>we don't want to risk our own resources. We're going

0:25:29.800 --> 0:25:33.320
<v Speaker 1>to use two hundred balloons, and each balloon is going

0:25:33.400 --> 0:25:38.320
<v Speaker 1>to carry a bomb, and those bombs will have some

0:25:38.400 --> 0:25:42.159
<v Speaker 1>method of detonation. I have read different reports, nothing that

0:25:42.280 --> 0:25:45.479
<v Speaker 1>was completely confirmed, but one was that there was actually

0:25:45.840 --> 0:25:49.080
<v Speaker 1>a wire that would come back that they would apply

0:25:49.720 --> 0:25:51.879
<v Speaker 1>an electric charge too, and that would detonate the bombs.

0:25:51.920 --> 0:25:54.880
<v Speaker 1>Others said it was just a fuse, but at any rate,

0:25:55.240 --> 0:25:58.359
<v Speaker 1>the balloons were meant to float over towards Venice and

0:25:58.400 --> 0:26:01.679
<v Speaker 1>then detonate their UH. From why I understand it was

0:26:01.720 --> 0:26:05.879
<v Speaker 1>not a very successful attack. I think only a handful

0:26:05.880 --> 0:26:08.320
<v Speaker 1>of balloons actually made it towards Venice, but a shift

0:26:08.320 --> 0:26:10.600
<v Speaker 1>in the wind meant that some of them just started

0:26:10.640 --> 0:26:13.760
<v Speaker 1>floating right back toward the Austrian lines, which is not

0:26:13.880 --> 0:26:16.080
<v Speaker 1>what you want to see when you're launching an attack.

0:26:16.119 --> 0:26:18.040
<v Speaker 1>Of course, if they had complete control of when those

0:26:18.080 --> 0:26:21.439
<v Speaker 1>bombs detonated, then that would be that would just mean

0:26:21.440 --> 0:26:24.159
<v Speaker 1>it would be a failed attack as opposed to accus danger.

0:26:24.440 --> 0:26:27.199
<v Speaker 1>Right um. During the American Civil War, a patent was

0:26:27.240 --> 0:26:31.159
<v Speaker 1>filed for a similar time delay fuse mechanism balloon based

0:26:31.240 --> 0:26:34.600
<v Speaker 1>bomber that I don't think ever went into use because

0:26:34.640 --> 0:26:37.000
<v Speaker 1>they couldn't ever quite figure out how to make that

0:26:37.560 --> 0:26:41.399
<v Speaker 1>fuse work proper rate in a non hazardous way right

0:26:41.400 --> 0:26:43.879
<v Speaker 1>where you you know, you're not just as likely to

0:26:44.000 --> 0:26:47.199
<v Speaker 1>blow up yourself as you are your target. Sure. In

0:26:47.240 --> 0:26:49.879
<v Speaker 1>the eighteen eighties, cameras were used on kites during the

0:26:49.880 --> 0:26:53.919
<v Speaker 1>Spanish American War for reconnaissance purposes. Right uh. The British

0:26:54.040 --> 0:26:58.040
<v Speaker 1>Royal Navy began to experiment with radio controlled Queen b

0:26:59.000 --> 0:27:03.919
<v Speaker 1>This was this was a drone of radio controlled drone

0:27:03.960 --> 0:27:08.240
<v Speaker 1>for mostly for target practice. But but but it could

0:27:08.280 --> 0:27:11.680
<v Speaker 1>fly like a hundred miles per hour, which I feel

0:27:11.680 --> 0:27:15.400
<v Speaker 1>like it is a pretty impressive drone capacity for the time. Um.

0:27:15.480 --> 0:27:18.280
<v Speaker 1>During World War Two, the Nazis developed what was called

0:27:18.320 --> 0:27:21.040
<v Speaker 1>the Revenge Weapon one or or V one more commonly,

0:27:21.080 --> 0:27:24.560
<v Speaker 1>which was an unmanned bomber that was responsible form for

0:27:24.640 --> 0:27:30.000
<v Speaker 1>over nine British civilian deaths. And that was when ah, wait,

0:27:30.119 --> 0:27:33.240
<v Speaker 1>what bomb wielding bats? Am I reading this note? Right?

0:27:33.640 --> 0:27:38.840
<v Speaker 1>So so Franklin D. Roosevelt approved research into releasing bomb

0:27:38.840 --> 0:27:42.000
<v Speaker 1>wielding bats from airplanes. And ideally with the way this

0:27:42.040 --> 0:27:44.399
<v Speaker 1>would work would be that the bats would seek shelter

0:27:44.480 --> 0:27:48.000
<v Speaker 1>and buildings too through the strings separating themselves from the devices,

0:27:48.320 --> 0:27:50.919
<v Speaker 1>and then the device would detonate, you know, blowing up

0:27:50.960 --> 0:27:55.320
<v Speaker 1>the enemy's buildings. In In the only test that ever

0:27:55.400 --> 0:27:59.280
<v Speaker 1>happened that I've heard about, um, a bunch of hibernating

0:27:59.359 --> 0:28:02.200
<v Speaker 1>bomb ladin acts were dropped to their deaths from an airplane.

0:28:02.640 --> 0:28:05.600
<v Speaker 1>So the bats were asleep and then just were dropped

0:28:06.040 --> 0:28:13.639
<v Speaker 1>and then they splatted. Wow, well we salute you splatted bats.

0:28:14.480 --> 0:28:17.440
<v Speaker 1>So in the sixties and seventies, the US used the

0:28:17.640 --> 0:28:21.320
<v Speaker 1>a q M thirty four Ryan fire bees and elect

0:28:21.400 --> 0:28:26.600
<v Speaker 1>and lightning bugs. So what these are re reconnaissance robots? Yeah, yeah,

0:28:26.640 --> 0:28:28.920
<v Speaker 1>they were. They were controlled from a host plane. Um

0:28:28.920 --> 0:28:32.680
<v Speaker 1>those lightning bugs where were joystick controlled? Actually? And those

0:28:32.680 --> 0:28:35.159
<v Speaker 1>were used for reconnaissance in China and Vietnam. They had

0:28:35.160 --> 0:28:38.760
<v Speaker 1>a lot of problems with these reconnaissance vehicles, particularly in

0:28:38.760 --> 0:28:41.280
<v Speaker 1>in harsh weather conditions, and that was one of the

0:28:41.360 --> 0:28:45.840
<v Speaker 1>things that would uh really spur the military to try

0:28:45.880 --> 0:28:51.520
<v Speaker 1>and develop more robust, unmanned aerial vehicles. It also was

0:28:51.720 --> 0:28:54.280
<v Speaker 1>one of the things that critics would point out as saying,

0:28:54.320 --> 0:28:56.760
<v Speaker 1>this is kind of a fool's errand like, we're spending

0:28:56.800 --> 0:28:59.600
<v Speaker 1>a lot of money developing and building these things, but

0:28:59.680 --> 0:29:02.280
<v Speaker 1>if they crash just as frequently as they come back,

0:29:02.360 --> 0:29:04.640
<v Speaker 1>and it's not because of enemy encounters, it is just

0:29:04.720 --> 0:29:07.360
<v Speaker 1>because of the weather, then there have to be better

0:29:07.440 --> 0:29:11.200
<v Speaker 1>use for our resources. So uh, in fact, you could

0:29:11.280 --> 0:29:14.400
<v Speaker 1>argue that drone technology isn't as far along as it

0:29:14.400 --> 0:29:17.720
<v Speaker 1>could be because of things like this. Sure Israel, in fact,

0:29:17.800 --> 0:29:22.560
<v Speaker 1>is was the first country to to develop very modern

0:29:22.640 --> 0:29:26.000
<v Speaker 1>advanced drones in the in the seventies and eighties. They

0:29:26.080 --> 0:29:29.600
<v Speaker 1>developed gliders along the same the same concept as the

0:29:29.680 --> 0:29:32.680
<v Speaker 1>quadrocopters and octocopters that we have these days, called the

0:29:32.720 --> 0:29:36.320
<v Speaker 1>Scout and the Pioneer. The Scout had live video and

0:29:36.680 --> 0:29:40.880
<v Speaker 1>like three sixty degree views views, so I could see

0:29:40.920 --> 0:29:43.600
<v Speaker 1>an entire like all the way around the actual vehicle

0:29:43.600 --> 0:29:47.200
<v Speaker 1>itself right right, and Um, the pioneers the US acquired

0:29:47.280 --> 0:29:50.959
<v Speaker 1>from Israel for use in the Gulf War, gotcha. So now,

0:29:51.680 --> 0:29:55.480
<v Speaker 1>one of the main uses the military has for these

0:29:55.560 --> 0:29:58.760
<v Speaker 1>drones is for surveillance and reconnaissance, and in those cases

0:29:59.240 --> 0:30:02.600
<v Speaker 1>you don't have to necessarily have weapons aboard the drones.

0:30:02.680 --> 0:30:05.719
<v Speaker 1>So absolutely not. And I think that the development of

0:30:05.800 --> 0:30:09.600
<v Speaker 1>most of these in in the US anyway, has has

0:30:09.640 --> 0:30:14.960
<v Speaker 1>been for reconnaissance purposes, and and that weaponizing them has

0:30:15.040 --> 0:30:18.680
<v Speaker 1>been a secondary step taken afterwards, right right, And I

0:30:18.720 --> 0:30:21.880
<v Speaker 1>think I think when it comes to the controversy, while

0:30:22.600 --> 0:30:25.480
<v Speaker 1>reconstance and surveillance of course has its own set of

0:30:27.240 --> 0:30:29.800
<v Speaker 1>I would argue that I think most people when they

0:30:29.840 --> 0:30:33.120
<v Speaker 1>hear about drones are specifically thinking of the weaponized versions.

0:30:33.160 --> 0:30:36.040
<v Speaker 1>We'll talk about those in a minute. Um. And obviously

0:30:36.080 --> 0:30:41.520
<v Speaker 1>those have their own set of really big issues that

0:30:41.640 --> 0:30:44.360
<v Speaker 1>I think merit debate. In fact, and I think all

0:30:44.400 --> 0:30:46.720
<v Speaker 1>of it merits debate, but I think those in particular

0:30:46.840 --> 0:30:48.640
<v Speaker 1>ones that we really got to take a very close

0:30:48.640 --> 0:30:51.440
<v Speaker 1>look at and ask some very tough questions and maybe

0:30:51.680 --> 0:30:54.440
<v Speaker 1>finally get some answers, because that's that's part of the problem.

0:30:54.640 --> 0:30:56.640
<v Speaker 1>That would be good too, But but so so these

0:30:56.720 --> 0:30:59.800
<v Speaker 1>these drones these days, thanks to satellite umplinks have you know,

0:30:59.840 --> 0:31:02.200
<v Speaker 1>you can get live video of a place that would

0:31:02.240 --> 0:31:05.440
<v Speaker 1>be dangerous to send manned forces into, right. And not

0:31:05.440 --> 0:31:08.200
<v Speaker 1>only that, but you can have real time control of

0:31:08.240 --> 0:31:11.400
<v Speaker 1>a drone by someone who is nowhere near that actual

0:31:11.760 --> 0:31:14.880
<v Speaker 1>that actual zone. So, for example, if you need to

0:31:15.040 --> 0:31:17.120
<v Speaker 1>run a drone through a war zone so that you

0:31:17.120 --> 0:31:20.160
<v Speaker 1>can get real time look at what the conditions are

0:31:20.200 --> 0:31:22.640
<v Speaker 1>on the ground, you can send one of these drones

0:31:22.640 --> 0:31:24.640
<v Speaker 1>out and the pilot maybe on the other side of

0:31:24.640 --> 0:31:27.479
<v Speaker 1>the world. Uh. In fact, in the United States, there's

0:31:27.600 --> 0:31:31.280
<v Speaker 1>a desert in Nevada where you can find some of

0:31:31.320 --> 0:31:34.640
<v Speaker 1>the trailers that that the US Air Force uses. And

0:31:34.760 --> 0:31:38.520
<v Speaker 1>the CIA also has its own drone program where the

0:31:38.680 --> 0:31:43.400
<v Speaker 1>pilots are nowhere near where the the actual drone is,

0:31:43.760 --> 0:31:46.840
<v Speaker 1>which means that the risk to pilot life is is

0:31:46.840 --> 0:31:49.479
<v Speaker 1>completely negated. You don't have to worry about the pilot

0:31:49.520 --> 0:31:52.600
<v Speaker 1>being put in danger. Uh if even if the drone

0:31:52.640 --> 0:31:56.680
<v Speaker 1>flies into a truly hot spot of dangerous activity, and

0:31:56.720 --> 0:32:00.840
<v Speaker 1>you can hypothetically save military lives um out in those

0:32:00.840 --> 0:32:04.320
<v Speaker 1>areas by you know, getting information about what what what's

0:32:04.320 --> 0:32:10.840
<v Speaker 1>out there. Yeah, so it's you know, really meant to

0:32:10.960 --> 0:32:15.080
<v Speaker 1>maximize data while minimizing risk to human life. And these

0:32:15.080 --> 0:32:20.440
<v Speaker 1>are less expensive than military aircraft or satellites, so it's

0:32:20.480 --> 0:32:24.200
<v Speaker 1>considered to be a better, uh you know, better investment

0:32:24.240 --> 0:32:26.240
<v Speaker 1>in that sense as well. And not only are you

0:32:26.440 --> 0:32:29.400
<v Speaker 1>minimizing the risk to human life, but it's not as

0:32:29.440 --> 0:32:32.240
<v Speaker 1>expensive as something like a YouTube spy plane or a

0:32:32.280 --> 0:32:38.440
<v Speaker 1>spy satellite. Now there's the weaponized version, which is the

0:32:38.560 --> 0:32:41.880
<v Speaker 1>truly problematic one. Not that not that surveillance again is

0:32:42.200 --> 0:32:43.880
<v Speaker 1>you know, we can't give it a free pass. But

0:32:44.200 --> 0:32:46.960
<v Speaker 1>the weaponized ones are the ones that really come under

0:32:47.000 --> 0:32:51.000
<v Speaker 1>scrutiny recently. Um. These are battle drones, so they're armed

0:32:51.080 --> 0:32:53.880
<v Speaker 1>for combat. They actually carry weapons, usually in the form

0:32:53.920 --> 0:32:56.719
<v Speaker 1>of either missiles or bombs or some combination thereof, and

0:32:56.840 --> 0:33:00.000
<v Speaker 1>usually more lightweight missiles or bombs than you would find

0:33:00.320 --> 0:33:05.120
<v Speaker 1>on on manned aircraft. However, yeah, like hell fire missiles.

0:33:05.160 --> 0:33:09.720
<v Speaker 1>I mean, these are still weapons designed to damage. The

0:33:09.800 --> 0:33:15.880
<v Speaker 1>very first use of armed drones were in the Balkans War. UM.

0:33:15.920 --> 0:33:18.600
<v Speaker 1>The Predator drone is an example of a U S

0:33:18.640 --> 0:33:24.160
<v Speaker 1>military unmanned aerial vehicle capable of firing weapons. So it's

0:33:24.200 --> 0:33:26.960
<v Speaker 1>not the only one the UK has the Reaper drone,

0:33:27.000 --> 0:33:29.240
<v Speaker 1>which also can be weaponized, and and we do use

0:33:29.280 --> 0:33:33.440
<v Speaker 1>Reapers in the US as well. That the Predator. Predator

0:33:33.520 --> 0:33:38.000
<v Speaker 1>was originally met for surveillance and was later added. Yeah.

0:33:38.040 --> 0:33:39.640
<v Speaker 1>In fact, the first thing that was added to it

0:33:39.680 --> 0:33:42.200
<v Speaker 1>were targeting lasers and that was before it even had

0:33:42.240 --> 0:33:45.360
<v Speaker 1>weapons on the Predator. It was just sort of a

0:33:45.560 --> 0:33:48.360
<v Speaker 1>next step in the evolution of the Predator from surveillance

0:33:48.440 --> 0:33:50.640
<v Speaker 1>drone to battle drone. And keep in mind that the

0:33:50.720 --> 0:33:55.400
<v Speaker 1>military and the CIA both use these different variations. It's

0:33:55.400 --> 0:33:58.560
<v Speaker 1>not that all drones are weaponized. Uh, that's not the case.

0:33:58.640 --> 0:34:01.080
<v Speaker 1>Some of them are and some of them aren't. UM.

0:34:01.200 --> 0:34:03.400
<v Speaker 1>It all depends upon the parameters of the mission and

0:34:03.520 --> 0:34:06.240
<v Speaker 1>uh and what it is you are trying to actually achieve.

0:34:07.320 --> 0:34:11.520
<v Speaker 1>So usually the way this works is that you've got

0:34:12.120 --> 0:34:16.200
<v Speaker 1>three operators who are controlling the drone. One of them

0:34:16.239 --> 0:34:19.120
<v Speaker 1>is controlling the flight systems, another one, like you said, Lauren,

0:34:19.239 --> 0:34:22.680
<v Speaker 1>is monitoring those cameras and sensors. The third acts as

0:34:22.680 --> 0:34:25.240
<v Speaker 1>a communications officer between the flight crew and the ground

0:34:25.239 --> 0:34:28.439
<v Speaker 1>operations that are closer to the actual war zone, so

0:34:28.560 --> 0:34:31.719
<v Speaker 1>that to keep that line of communication open, so that

0:34:31.840 --> 0:34:35.080
<v Speaker 1>if you notice something with the drone where it's going

0:34:35.120 --> 0:34:37.160
<v Speaker 1>to affect operations in the ground. You can get that

0:34:37.200 --> 0:34:40.319
<v Speaker 1>information to the people who need it immediately and they're

0:34:40.320 --> 0:34:45.760
<v Speaker 1>not going to be surprised by it. UM. So perhaps

0:34:45.760 --> 0:34:47.560
<v Speaker 1>the best known bell drone I guess would be the

0:34:47.640 --> 0:34:50.719
<v Speaker 1>at least in the United States, is the Predator. UM.

0:34:50.880 --> 0:34:54.799
<v Speaker 1>You've probably seen pictures of it. It's it's pretty spooky looking, uh,

0:34:54.800 --> 0:34:56.600
<v Speaker 1>and it is larger, like I said, than you would

0:34:56.600 --> 0:34:58.320
<v Speaker 1>think if you see just a picture of it flying,

0:34:58.520 --> 0:35:01.279
<v Speaker 1>you don't really have anything necessarily to give you the

0:35:01.320 --> 0:35:04.120
<v Speaker 1>scale of this thing. But I've seen pictures of a

0:35:04.160 --> 0:35:06.080
<v Speaker 1>person standing next to them, and it does look like,

0:35:06.120 --> 0:35:11.440
<v Speaker 1>you know, like a fairly small but normal manned vehicle.

0:35:11.480 --> 0:35:13.120
<v Speaker 1>I mean, it was like there could be a pilot

0:35:13.120 --> 0:35:15.920
<v Speaker 1>in there, if there were a cockpit. Who just isn't

0:35:17.120 --> 0:35:21.040
<v Speaker 1>it's it's it's weird because the c i A was

0:35:21.120 --> 0:35:25.160
<v Speaker 1>able to really develop a predator program. And when I

0:35:25.200 --> 0:35:26.959
<v Speaker 1>say weird, I mean that you would think that would

0:35:26.960 --> 0:35:31.000
<v Speaker 1>normally fall under the purview of the United States military, right,

0:35:31.040 --> 0:35:35.000
<v Speaker 1>and the Department of Defense did spend some three billion

0:35:35.239 --> 0:35:39.200
<v Speaker 1>in drone research in the nineteen nineties. However, since the

0:35:39.239 --> 0:35:43.319
<v Speaker 1>CIA basically since since the bombings of two thousand one,

0:35:43.800 --> 0:35:46.799
<v Speaker 1>the World Trade Center and attacks. I suppose you you

0:35:46.800 --> 0:35:50.680
<v Speaker 1>would say, since then the CIA kind of took over.

0:35:51.239 --> 0:35:53.560
<v Speaker 1>You kind of used a loophole. Yeah, what what really

0:35:53.600 --> 0:35:56.960
<v Speaker 1>was happening was that the military had run into kind

0:35:56.960 --> 0:35:59.839
<v Speaker 1>of you know, they had consolidated a lot of departments,

0:36:00.400 --> 0:36:03.400
<v Speaker 1>and so the whole drone program now fell under a

0:36:03.440 --> 0:36:06.120
<v Speaker 1>sub department of a sub department of a department, and

0:36:06.120 --> 0:36:07.719
<v Speaker 1>it was one of those things where it is really

0:36:07.719 --> 0:36:11.080
<v Speaker 1>hard to get any kind of funding for the drone program.

0:36:11.280 --> 0:36:14.759
<v Speaker 1>The CIA could sort of sidestep that, and because they're

0:36:14.800 --> 0:36:19.000
<v Speaker 1>not a military organization, they could end up requesting under

0:36:19.040 --> 0:36:21.720
<v Speaker 1>their budget their own drone program. And so that's exactly

0:36:21.760 --> 0:36:24.960
<v Speaker 1>what they did. Um, and that's that's part of the

0:36:24.960 --> 0:36:28.960
<v Speaker 1>reason why it started as a reconnaissance issue and since

0:36:29.160 --> 0:36:34.719
<v Speaker 1>since two thousand one, developed into a targeted strike program. Yeah.

0:36:34.880 --> 0:36:40.040
<v Speaker 1>So these predator drones can hover for forty hours before

0:36:40.080 --> 0:36:44.399
<v Speaker 1>needing to refuel. Um, they are kind of uh there.

0:36:44.480 --> 0:36:47.280
<v Speaker 1>They were kind of the evolution of earlier drones developed

0:36:47.840 --> 0:36:51.960
<v Speaker 1>called Amber and NAT. These were drones that were used

0:36:52.080 --> 0:36:55.920
<v Speaker 1>previously but had had their own limitations, including things like

0:36:56.000 --> 0:36:59.440
<v Speaker 1>weather issues with a you know, inclement weather, So the

0:36:59.440 --> 0:37:02.479
<v Speaker 1>Predator was meant to withstand that sort of stuff. UH.

0:37:02.600 --> 0:37:06.439
<v Speaker 1>It was built by a company called General Atomics, and

0:37:06.560 --> 0:37:09.759
<v Speaker 1>UH it uses a SAT calm link up. So that's

0:37:09.760 --> 0:37:12.040
<v Speaker 1>why you can control these all the way out in

0:37:12.080 --> 0:37:15.719
<v Speaker 1>Nevada while the drones themselves are flying around perhaps in

0:37:15.719 --> 0:37:20.759
<v Speaker 1>Afghanistan or Pakistan or something like that. UH. They were

0:37:20.800 --> 0:37:25.440
<v Speaker 1>first flown in June n in the Balkans under Operation

0:37:25.520 --> 0:37:31.480
<v Speaker 1>Nomad Vigil and then in Operation Deliberate Force. And in

0:37:31.520 --> 0:37:35.200
<v Speaker 1>those initial phases it was just surveillance, like we had said.

0:37:35.880 --> 0:37:39.200
<v Speaker 1>But the Air Force and CIA both began to develop

0:37:39.239 --> 0:37:42.399
<v Speaker 1>their Predator piloting programs. The Air Forces is called the

0:37:42.440 --> 0:37:46.760
<v Speaker 1>eleventh Reconnaissance Squadron at Indian Springs Auxiliary Airfield in Nevada,

0:37:47.000 --> 0:37:51.040
<v Speaker 1>which later became known as Creech Air Force Base UH

0:37:51.040 --> 0:37:57.319
<v Speaker 1>and tends to concentrate on on missions in places like Afghanistan. UH.

0:37:57.360 --> 0:38:00.120
<v Speaker 1>In two thousand one, the military began to test the

0:38:00.120 --> 0:38:03.319
<v Speaker 1>Predator drone as a weapon, and by October seventh, two

0:38:03.320 --> 0:38:06.880
<v Speaker 1>thousand one, armed Predator drones were deployed in the Middle East,

0:38:06.880 --> 0:38:09.520
<v Speaker 1>and that was very much in response to the September

0:38:09.560 --> 0:38:13.319
<v Speaker 1>eleventh attacks in two thousand one. UH. Prior to that,

0:38:13.520 --> 0:38:16.200
<v Speaker 1>they were just being used as reconnaissance. But those attacks

0:38:16.280 --> 0:38:20.080
<v Speaker 1>kind of spurred the development of weaponized drones and put

0:38:20.120 --> 0:38:22.799
<v Speaker 1>them on the fast track. And on February four, two

0:38:22.800 --> 0:38:25.680
<v Speaker 1>thousand two, we had the first use of a CIA

0:38:25.840 --> 0:38:30.080
<v Speaker 1>controlled Predator drone using a weapon. And what had happened

0:38:30.160 --> 0:38:34.920
<v Speaker 1>was a drone operator had identified a potential target. They

0:38:34.960 --> 0:38:38.840
<v Speaker 1>saw a tall man in robes and UH it seemed

0:38:38.880 --> 0:38:41.880
<v Speaker 1>to fit the description of Osama bin Laden, which obviously

0:38:42.000 --> 0:38:45.400
<v Speaker 1>was a top target of the c I A. And

0:38:45.760 --> 0:38:49.120
<v Speaker 1>so they the believing that to be Osama bin Laden,

0:38:49.200 --> 0:38:53.280
<v Speaker 1>the drone the pilot of the drone and they fired

0:38:53.360 --> 0:38:59.200
<v Speaker 1>a hellfire missile and it was actually three civilians. UM.

0:38:59.320 --> 0:39:02.520
<v Speaker 1>None of them are were identified as being connected to

0:39:03.200 --> 0:39:07.000
<v Speaker 1>any enemy forces whatsoever. UM. They had been gathering scrap

0:39:07.040 --> 0:39:09.680
<v Speaker 1>metal at the time. Now, they had been gathering scrap

0:39:09.680 --> 0:39:13.080
<v Speaker 1>metal that were from old pieces of missiles, but they were,

0:39:13.280 --> 0:39:15.759
<v Speaker 1>from what I understand, trying to sell those in Pakistan

0:39:15.800 --> 0:39:19.000
<v Speaker 1>for about fifty cents. So it turned out that these

0:39:19.080 --> 0:39:22.880
<v Speaker 1>were appeared to be innocent victims. Although the United States

0:39:22.880 --> 0:39:26.960
<v Speaker 1>government continued to say that that they felt that they

0:39:27.000 --> 0:39:30.280
<v Speaker 1>got that the that firing on the targets were justified.

0:39:30.320 --> 0:39:32.520
<v Speaker 1>They just didn't know who they were, which I thought

0:39:32.560 --> 0:39:35.279
<v Speaker 1>was a weird way of putting it. That seems like

0:39:35.320 --> 0:39:38.600
<v Speaker 1>a poor justification to me personally, and that that is

0:39:38.719 --> 0:39:42.160
<v Speaker 1>kind of what was said by many people afterwards, right,

0:39:42.200 --> 0:39:45.680
<v Speaker 1>And this is this is illustrating very clearly, and you'll

0:39:45.719 --> 0:39:47.520
<v Speaker 1>keep in mind, this is the first use of the

0:39:47.520 --> 0:39:50.000
<v Speaker 1>CIA using a predator drone as a weapon, and the

0:39:50.080 --> 0:39:55.080
<v Speaker 1>very first use is a misidentification, a tragic mistake, and

0:39:55.120 --> 0:39:58.600
<v Speaker 1>that that illustrated very much the criticism that a lot

0:39:58.640 --> 0:40:03.080
<v Speaker 1>of people had. It's that multiple on multiple fronts. One

0:40:03.960 --> 0:40:05.920
<v Speaker 1>uh in this case that they were in a zone

0:40:05.960 --> 0:40:09.440
<v Speaker 1>that had been under contention in the past. So perhaps

0:40:09.560 --> 0:40:11.719
<v Speaker 1>the war zone question will put aside for a moment.

0:40:11.760 --> 0:40:15.960
<v Speaker 1>But the real question is that if you have a

0:40:16.000 --> 0:40:20.800
<v Speaker 1>weapon where you are in no danger at all, that

0:40:21.120 --> 0:40:23.279
<v Speaker 1>the operator of the weapon is in no danger, right,

0:40:23.320 --> 0:40:26.080
<v Speaker 1>there's no risk to the operator whatsoever, does that lower

0:40:26.200 --> 0:40:29.279
<v Speaker 1>the bar to using the weapon because you don't have

0:40:29.320 --> 0:40:32.520
<v Speaker 1>to worry about anything, you know, any kind of direct

0:40:32.600 --> 0:40:37.160
<v Speaker 1>consequences as far as a life or death situation, meaning

0:40:37.200 --> 0:40:39.520
<v Speaker 1>that are you more likely to fire a gun if

0:40:39.560 --> 0:40:41.799
<v Speaker 1>it means that there's absolutely no way the other person

0:40:41.920 --> 0:40:45.239
<v Speaker 1>is going to fire back, and that furthermore, are you

0:40:45.360 --> 0:40:48.759
<v Speaker 1>not going to take time to assess the situation responsibly?

0:40:48.960 --> 0:40:50.719
<v Speaker 1>Right if you think that you have a target, are

0:40:50.760 --> 0:40:54.200
<v Speaker 1>you going to act rapidly because you think that you

0:40:54.280 --> 0:40:57.239
<v Speaker 1>have the opportunity to take the target out rather than

0:40:57.320 --> 0:41:00.440
<v Speaker 1>to take the time you would need to assess the situation.

0:41:00.480 --> 0:41:02.360
<v Speaker 1>If your life was at risk, obviously you would be

0:41:02.400 --> 0:41:05.600
<v Speaker 1>assessing the situation very carefully to try and determine your

0:41:05.600 --> 0:41:09.279
<v Speaker 1>best chance of success and survival of that event. And

0:41:09.400 --> 0:41:12.600
<v Speaker 1>maybe in that process you might notice if someone is

0:41:12.640 --> 0:41:14.680
<v Speaker 1>not who you thought they were, in which case you

0:41:14.680 --> 0:41:18.720
<v Speaker 1>would abort the mission and no one would die. Um.

0:41:18.760 --> 0:41:21.440
<v Speaker 1>So there these were some of the objections that were raised,

0:41:21.480 --> 0:41:23.720
<v Speaker 1>saying that this is making it too easy to kill people.

0:41:24.080 --> 0:41:26.080
<v Speaker 1>And then on top of that, if it's outside a

0:41:26.080 --> 0:41:29.760
<v Speaker 1>war zone, because the CIA was essentially given carte blanche

0:41:30.160 --> 0:41:33.239
<v Speaker 1>to go and go after what a lot of people

0:41:33.280 --> 0:41:36.239
<v Speaker 1>have called the kill list, a list of people that

0:41:36.280 --> 0:41:39.080
<v Speaker 1>the United States government had identified as top level threats.

0:41:39.719 --> 0:41:42.720
<v Speaker 1>UH if the CIA were to use an unmanned aerial

0:41:42.840 --> 0:41:45.520
<v Speaker 1>vehicle to take out one of those targets in a

0:41:45.560 --> 0:41:47.680
<v Speaker 1>place that's not a war zone. So this is not

0:41:47.760 --> 0:41:50.319
<v Speaker 1>someone who is a soldier fighting a war in the

0:41:50.360 --> 0:41:55.879
<v Speaker 1>traditional sense. Does that not amount to assassination? So how

0:41:55.960 --> 0:41:58.960
<v Speaker 1>is that any different than say, sending out somebody with

0:41:59.120 --> 0:42:02.000
<v Speaker 1>a sniper right full to take another person out in

0:42:02.000 --> 0:42:05.080
<v Speaker 1>the middle of a city. Uh. And and you know

0:42:05.280 --> 0:42:08.080
<v Speaker 1>there's they have no benefit of any sort of trial

0:42:08.239 --> 0:42:11.759
<v Speaker 1>or formal charges. It's just it's just a political assassination.

0:42:12.120 --> 0:42:14.359
<v Speaker 1>In this case, Instead of a sniper with a rifle,

0:42:14.400 --> 0:42:17.759
<v Speaker 1>you're talking about a pilot using a Predator drone and

0:42:17.800 --> 0:42:21.080
<v Speaker 1>that in reality, that's not any difference. So wouldn't that

0:42:21.120 --> 0:42:25.080
<v Speaker 1>mean that this is under international law illegal? And and furthermore,

0:42:25.520 --> 0:42:29.160
<v Speaker 1>isn't it something that shortly before the attacks of September eleventh,

0:42:29.320 --> 0:42:32.080
<v Speaker 1>the the US came down on Israel for for using

0:42:32.360 --> 0:42:36.759
<v Speaker 1>drones for assassinations. Yeah, and so this is I mean,

0:42:37.360 --> 0:42:40.600
<v Speaker 1>this is very tricky. We've got we've we've got government

0:42:40.640 --> 0:42:42.640
<v Speaker 1>officials on record as saying this is not something we

0:42:42.640 --> 0:42:48.120
<v Speaker 1>should do and then immediately authorizing it. Um. And you know,

0:42:48.800 --> 0:42:53.440
<v Speaker 1>certainly the fear of terrorism at that time and continually

0:42:53.600 --> 0:42:59.319
<v Speaker 1>is an understandably serious. It's a powerful motivator. Absolutely, it's

0:42:59.320 --> 0:43:02.400
<v Speaker 1>a powerful motive later, and sometimes that means going to

0:43:02.520 --> 0:43:05.919
<v Speaker 1>a course of action that perhaps, in hindsight we would

0:43:05.960 --> 0:43:09.280
<v Speaker 1>say this was not the right choice. UH. The American

0:43:09.320 --> 0:43:12.200
<v Speaker 1>Civil Liberties Union the a c l U condemns these

0:43:12.239 --> 0:43:16.360
<v Speaker 1>actions and have said all right that they are essentially assassinations,

0:43:16.360 --> 0:43:18.719
<v Speaker 1>that people are being killed when they are are not

0:43:18.840 --> 0:43:21.800
<v Speaker 1>in war zones, and that's without charge or trial. And

0:43:21.840 --> 0:43:25.040
<v Speaker 1>they've submitted several Freedom of Information Act requests to the

0:43:25.080 --> 0:43:27.840
<v Speaker 1>government regarding missile strikes and various targets throughout the world,

0:43:28.280 --> 0:43:32.080
<v Speaker 1>and they've cited that in many of these cases, civilians

0:43:32.080 --> 0:43:34.759
<v Speaker 1>have died, children have died as a result of these

0:43:35.040 --> 0:43:39.919
<v Speaker 1>UH these strikes, and they also have kind of met

0:43:39.960 --> 0:43:42.719
<v Speaker 1>with a lot of non answers from the government. They

0:43:43.200 --> 0:43:46.080
<v Speaker 1>await the responses, you know, they're they're going through the

0:43:46.160 --> 0:43:50.160
<v Speaker 1>official government channels and not getting much response. In March,

0:43:51.280 --> 0:43:54.319
<v Speaker 1>Pitch Interactive released a report they they had gotten their

0:43:54.400 --> 0:44:00.600
<v Speaker 1>information from the UH New America Foundation, this saying that

0:44:00.760 --> 0:44:05.160
<v Speaker 1>UM the casualties from from drones in Pakistan alone totaled

0:44:05.239 --> 0:44:09.200
<v Speaker 1>some three thousand, hundred and five people since two thousand four,

0:44:09.600 --> 0:44:13.680
<v Speaker 1>and that that of that UM hundred, seventy five deaths

0:44:13.680 --> 0:44:18.680
<v Speaker 1>were children, five thirty five were adult civilians, over two

0:44:18.680 --> 0:44:22.080
<v Speaker 1>thousand were this gray area of of other they had

0:44:22.080 --> 0:44:26.439
<v Speaker 1>been deemed a military age appropriate men who had been

0:44:26.560 --> 0:44:30.239
<v Speaker 1>termed military combatants, but whether or not they were actually

0:44:30.280 --> 0:44:35.400
<v Speaker 1>involved in in any nefarious military wrongdoing was kind of

0:44:35.440 --> 0:44:39.839
<v Speaker 1>like um and that only forty seven um one point

0:44:39.920 --> 0:44:43.440
<v Speaker 1>five percent of those deaths were high profile targets, and

0:44:45.480 --> 0:44:49.040
<v Speaker 1>there there had been somewhat under a hundred high profile

0:44:49.120 --> 0:44:53.320
<v Speaker 1>targets from what I understand, and so having forty seven

0:44:53.320 --> 0:44:58.480
<v Speaker 1>deaths from that list is is huge. And and however,

0:44:59.000 --> 0:45:02.759
<v Speaker 1>oh my goodness, gracious, that's that is just so many people. Yeah,

0:45:02.840 --> 0:45:07.160
<v Speaker 1>it's this is this is an incredibly you know, emotionally

0:45:07.239 --> 0:45:10.319
<v Speaker 1>charged topic obviously, and and should be I mean, this

0:45:10.400 --> 0:45:13.120
<v Speaker 1>is again why we say there should be debate about this,

0:45:13.360 --> 0:45:16.280
<v Speaker 1>and that there needs to be very close scrutiny over

0:45:16.320 --> 0:45:19.239
<v Speaker 1>when it's appropriate or if it ever is appropriate to

0:45:19.320 --> 0:45:22.560
<v Speaker 1>use this. I mean, obviously, anytime we're talking about warfare

0:45:22.800 --> 0:45:26.640
<v Speaker 1>in any capacity, uh, we're talking about the tragic loss

0:45:26.640 --> 0:45:28.799
<v Speaker 1>of human life that kind of comes hand in hand

0:45:28.800 --> 0:45:32.920
<v Speaker 1>with warfare. The problem is that warfare itself has changed

0:45:33.040 --> 0:45:37.560
<v Speaker 1>dramatically since the you know, early twentieth century, when we

0:45:37.600 --> 0:45:40.560
<v Speaker 1>had two sides line up on trenches and shoot at

0:45:40.560 --> 0:45:44.560
<v Speaker 1>each other. Now, identifying who your enemy is and where

0:45:44.600 --> 0:45:48.399
<v Speaker 1>that your enemy happens to be is much more complicated.

0:45:48.560 --> 0:45:52.839
<v Speaker 1>We don't necessarily have huge battalions of soldiers that we're

0:45:53.440 --> 0:45:56.319
<v Speaker 1>having to to aim at. It's it's it's gotten to

0:45:56.480 --> 0:46:00.080
<v Speaker 1>be a very messy situation, and so we've try to

0:46:00.120 --> 0:46:02.520
<v Speaker 1>come up with some solutions to address that. The problem

0:46:02.600 --> 0:46:06.120
<v Speaker 1>is that the solutions may not truly be addressing the

0:46:06.200 --> 0:46:09.000
<v Speaker 1>issue and in fact could be causing far more harm

0:46:09.040 --> 0:46:11.600
<v Speaker 1>than good. And that's where we have to sit there

0:46:11.640 --> 0:46:15.560
<v Speaker 1>and really look and how we're using the technology, who

0:46:15.680 --> 0:46:19.160
<v Speaker 1>is being affected? Are we causing more harm than good?

0:46:19.280 --> 0:46:22.440
<v Speaker 1>And if so, then what can we do instead of that?

0:46:22.520 --> 0:46:26.080
<v Speaker 1>Because obviously that's a course of action. You cannot, you cannot,

0:46:26.080 --> 0:46:29.879
<v Speaker 1>in any good conscience continue that and hope that there's

0:46:29.920 --> 0:46:31.759
<v Speaker 1>going to be a positive outcome. How can there be

0:46:31.800 --> 0:46:33.879
<v Speaker 1>a positive outcome if you're not hitting who you want

0:46:33.920 --> 0:46:36.600
<v Speaker 1>to hit and the people you are hitting are completely innocent,

0:46:36.640 --> 0:46:39.279
<v Speaker 1>you're really there's or or if you've got such a

0:46:39.360 --> 0:46:43.359
<v Speaker 1>high loss of innocent life connected to your targets. Yeah,

0:46:43.440 --> 0:46:48.040
<v Speaker 1>I mean that's how can you criticize another government or

0:46:48.080 --> 0:46:51.080
<v Speaker 1>regime or however you want to find it, for their

0:46:51.120 --> 0:46:55.440
<v Speaker 1>behaviors if your own behaviors appear at least as if

0:46:55.440 --> 0:46:57.680
<v Speaker 1>you considered an acceptable loss of life to kill the

0:46:57.800 --> 0:47:01.200
<v Speaker 1>entire family someone who your target. Yeah. So, I mean,

0:47:01.200 --> 0:47:03.520
<v Speaker 1>obviously this is and this is obviously, like we said,

0:47:03.680 --> 0:47:06.200
<v Speaker 1>very tricky. It's not. It's not like we're trying to

0:47:06.239 --> 0:47:10.080
<v Speaker 1>say that there is some easy solution that cost not

0:47:11.080 --> 0:47:16.680
<v Speaker 1>and these these hope high profile targeted people were committing atrocities. Absolutely,

0:47:16.880 --> 0:47:21.160
<v Speaker 1>and so so it's you know, obviously by international law,

0:47:21.760 --> 0:47:24.319
<v Speaker 1>the the argument is that what should happen is that

0:47:24.400 --> 0:47:28.000
<v Speaker 1>every effort should be made to apprehend the individuals, put

0:47:28.000 --> 0:47:30.840
<v Speaker 1>them on trial, and then have them face their crimes

0:47:30.880 --> 0:47:34.720
<v Speaker 1>in a court of law, as opposed to uh kind

0:47:34.719 --> 0:47:38.920
<v Speaker 1>of striking out and trying to to eliminate them. Uh,

0:47:39.000 --> 0:47:43.000
<v Speaker 1>whether it's in a war capacity or otherwise. Um, whether

0:47:43.080 --> 0:47:45.239
<v Speaker 1>or not that's correct, also, I guess, is a matter

0:47:45.239 --> 0:47:48.000
<v Speaker 1>of debated. It has to be answered by all the

0:47:48.000 --> 0:47:51.360
<v Speaker 1>different countries involved. And like I said, this is pretty

0:47:51.480 --> 0:47:54.080
<v Speaker 1>pretty sticky stuff. It goes pretty far outside the realm

0:47:54.080 --> 0:47:57.520
<v Speaker 1>of just talking about how drones work. But we really

0:47:57.520 --> 0:47:59.200
<v Speaker 1>wanted to talk about this because it's one of those

0:47:59.239 --> 0:48:02.160
<v Speaker 1>topics that had has had a lot of conversation around

0:48:02.160 --> 0:48:05.600
<v Speaker 1>it over the last year or so. Absolutely, and I

0:48:05.640 --> 0:48:08.040
<v Speaker 1>did want to say that in addition to to those

0:48:08.080 --> 0:48:11.760
<v Speaker 1>military uses, UH, drones have also been used, for example,

0:48:11.800 --> 0:48:16.640
<v Speaker 1>to detect detect bombs, which is wonderful and terrific, and

0:48:16.920 --> 0:48:18.759
<v Speaker 1>you know, in in the future they could possibly be

0:48:18.880 --> 0:48:22.439
<v Speaker 1>used to create wireless networks and disaster areas that will

0:48:22.480 --> 0:48:27.760
<v Speaker 1>significantly improve disaster relief. Sure, yeah, there, So it's nothing again,

0:48:27.840 --> 0:48:30.000
<v Speaker 1>just like any technology. We We've said this a lot

0:48:30.120 --> 0:48:32.440
<v Speaker 1>on the on various episodes of tech stuff. It's not

0:48:32.520 --> 0:48:35.160
<v Speaker 1>the technology that's good or bad, it's how we put

0:48:35.239 --> 0:48:39.440
<v Speaker 1>to use. We have to be responsible users of technology,

0:48:39.440 --> 0:48:42.040
<v Speaker 1>and that goes all the way from the individual in

0:48:42.040 --> 0:48:44.680
<v Speaker 1>the case of a parent drone that has a camera

0:48:44.760 --> 0:48:48.000
<v Speaker 1>attached to it, you know what I'm talking about, or

0:48:48.040 --> 0:48:51.520
<v Speaker 1>whether we're talking about a military program or CIA program.

0:48:52.160 --> 0:48:56.240
<v Speaker 1>That level of responsibility is something that we cannot ignore

0:48:56.400 --> 0:48:59.080
<v Speaker 1>or take for granted. I really do believe that, And

0:48:59.080 --> 0:49:01.839
<v Speaker 1>now I'm going to respon honsibly tie up the end

0:49:01.880 --> 0:49:04.239
<v Speaker 1>of this podcast by letting you guys know that if

0:49:04.280 --> 0:49:06.319
<v Speaker 1>you have anything you want to share with us. You

0:49:06.400 --> 0:49:09.160
<v Speaker 1>have a topic that you think we should tackle. Maybe

0:49:09.160 --> 0:49:11.920
<v Speaker 1>you have your own thoughts about the way that drones

0:49:11.960 --> 0:49:15.080
<v Speaker 1>are being used throughout the world. Maybe you want a pizza.

0:49:15.640 --> 0:49:18.080
<v Speaker 1>Let us know. We probably can't get a pizza to you,

0:49:18.120 --> 0:49:20.960
<v Speaker 1>but we're happy to listen and then chat back with you.

0:49:21.280 --> 0:49:24.719
<v Speaker 1>Send us a line over at tech Stuff at Discovery

0:49:24.760 --> 0:49:27.640
<v Speaker 1>dot com, or drop us a note on Facebook or Twitter.

0:49:27.680 --> 0:49:29.920
<v Speaker 1>You can find our handle there tech Stuff hs W.

0:49:30.520 --> 0:49:34.520
<v Speaker 1>And there's something else I always forget. It's oh right,

0:49:34.640 --> 0:49:36.920
<v Speaker 1>because I don't do that one. We has a tumbler

0:49:37.440 --> 0:49:39.480
<v Speaker 1>you did You did start it and then promptly forgot

0:49:39.480 --> 0:49:42.440
<v Speaker 1>that it even existed. Yes, ore tumbler handle is also

0:49:42.600 --> 0:49:46.520
<v Speaker 1>tex Stuff HSW. Alright, so track us down and h

0:49:46.760 --> 0:49:48.960
<v Speaker 1>take us gently by the shoulder, look us in the eye,

0:49:49.000 --> 0:49:50.640
<v Speaker 1>and tell us what it is you want us to

0:49:50.640 --> 0:49:53.520
<v Speaker 1>to cover next, because we generally want to know. And

0:49:53.600 --> 0:49:55.719
<v Speaker 1>Lauren and I will talk to you again really sick,

0:49:56.520 --> 0:49:58.359
<v Speaker 1>by the way, just do that virtually. We don't really

0:49:58.360 --> 0:50:03.239
<v Speaker 1>want you coming up to us for more on this

0:50:03.440 --> 0:50:12.759
<v Speaker 1>and thousands of other topics. Visit how stuff works dot com.