Speaker 1: Comeback Stories is a production I've Inflection Network and iHeartRadio.
Speaker 2: What's going on, everyone, My name is Darren Waller. I'd
Speaker 2: love to welcome you back to season three of Comeback Stories.
Speaker 2: If this is your first time joining us, We're honored
Speaker 2: to have you here. If you've been sticking with us
Speaker 2: since day one, we love you, we appreciate you. For
Speaker 2: those that are new, I'm Darren Waller. I'm going into
Speaker 2: my eighth season in the NFL. You may know me
Speaker 2: as a tie end that place for the New York Giants.
Speaker 2: More on that and more on my journey to this
Speaker 2: point later, but most importantly this comeback Story. This podcast
Speaker 2: is about resiliency and about responding to adversity, and I
Speaker 2: can't wait to dive into that with my friend, my brother,
Speaker 2: my partner, my boy, Donnie Starkins. How you doing, man,
Speaker 2: doing well?
Speaker 3: What's up everyone? I'm Donnie Starkins. I'm a yoga and
Speaker 3: meditation teacher and a personal development coach and Darren and
Speaker 3: I started this podcast a few years ago to with
Speaker 3: the mission of just reaching as many people as possible
Speaker 3: to remind them that they're not alone and that we
Speaker 3: all have a comeback story. Within us, So we're excited
Speaker 3: for you to join in with us dive into season three.
Speaker 3: You ready to get started, big.
Speaker 2: D We're about four years of being friends and brothers
Speaker 2: and just on the same journey together from the hard
Speaker 2: knocks and you reaching out to me, and it's just
Speaker 2: been a beautiful journey ever since. It's literally our conversations
Speaker 2: in person, me having coaching sessions with you that turned
Speaker 2: into what was the vision for this show? So I
Speaker 2: feel like it's important to get people that context and
Speaker 2: they like, Hey, we're really doing life together. You know,
Speaker 2: this man was a groom's been in my wedding. You know,
Speaker 2: just really beautiful life moments unfolding just from conversations that
Speaker 2: we've been able to have and when we're lucky to
Speaker 2: share it with you.
Speaker 4: Guys.
Speaker 3: Man, I can't tell you how many times I've told
Speaker 3: the story of how we've connected and what it's transpired into,
Speaker 3: and I've had multiple people have the same response and
Speaker 3: they'll say, what a beautiful love story, And it really is.
Speaker 3: It's like just the connection, the brotherly love that we
Speaker 3: have and how it started maybe coach, but has evolved
Speaker 3: into something way more meaningful than that. And then just
Speaker 3: being aligned in so many ways, both sharing our story
Speaker 3: publicly you on a way larger platform but with the
Speaker 3: same mission, and to have the vision of the podcast
Speaker 3: and starting it a few years ago during COVID and
Speaker 3: we really didn't know what we were doing. I don't
Speaker 3: know if we still do, but we know the message
Speaker 3: that we want to share and we'd love to have
Speaker 3: meaningful conversations. And selfishly for us having this podcast and
Speaker 3: how many I think back to all of the guests
Speaker 3: that we've had and being so immersed in those moments,
Speaker 3: with these deep, meaningful conversations with some of the people
Speaker 3: that I've looked up to my whole life, and now
Speaker 3: we've got them on our platform, We're friends with them,
Speaker 3: They're showing up at your wedding. It's just such a
Speaker 3: beautiful thing.
Speaker 2: Yeah, No, it's incredible, man. It's and I feel like
Speaker 2: to really paint a picture of where we are now
Speaker 2: in this journey and where we're going with it, I
Speaker 2: feel like it's important for us to go back and
Speaker 2: you know, revisit some of our stories, especially for some
Speaker 2: of the new lists that may be coming in. So
Speaker 2: to start off with with my journey, you know, I
Speaker 2: was an after I played all sports growing up, football, basketball, baseball,
Speaker 2: baseball is my favorite. Played a little bit of tennis
Speaker 2: when I was younger. You know that that wasn't really
Speaker 2: the issue. That that always seemed to work for me.
Speaker 2: I always had a feel for it, But when it
Speaker 2: came to just my internal situation, what was going on
Speaker 2: the inside of me, it was very confusing. From from
Speaker 2: early on. You know, I grew up in a really
Speaker 2: nice community just north of Atlanta, Georgia, had no external problems.
Speaker 2: Nothing about my upbringing was rough. I had both parents
Speaker 2: and the home loving parents, parents that wanted to see
Speaker 2: bring the best out of me without being abusive in
Speaker 2: any type of way, and good schools, good environment. So
Speaker 2: there was all these circumstances there for me to succeed,
Speaker 2: and in most in most forms, in most realms, I
Speaker 2: did succeed. But when it came to the social aspect
Speaker 2: and just inside of me, it was rough. And it
Speaker 2: was people of my skin color were telling I wasn't
Speaker 2: black enough, and that was a wound that I can
Speaker 2: trace back to my childhood and realized that really hurt me.
Speaker 2: That was really tough and hard to deal with because
Speaker 2: I can't just go anywhere and change my skin color,
Speaker 2: like I can change my clothes, like I'm in this
Speaker 2: black skin, and so just the narrative that began to
Speaker 2: form my mind of like I'm black, but I'm not black,
Speaker 2: so inherently I am wrong. Inherently there's something messed up
Speaker 2: about me, and I need to try to fix it
Speaker 2: in different ways by people pleasing, by performing in sports,
Speaker 2: by just trying to put on masks everywhere that I went,
Speaker 2: to try to fit into different environments, because really it
Speaker 2: was just a cover up for me feeling lost, confused,
Speaker 2: and lonely. And that's something that I carried through and
Speaker 2: carried into sports. There was a beginning of my sports
Speaker 2: journey where I didn't I was riding a bench on
Speaker 2: a football.
Speaker 4: Team my freshman year.
Speaker 2: Sophomore year, I had a coach telling me I should
Speaker 2: maybe try a non contact sport for anybody out there
Speaker 2: that may be struggling early in their football journey. And
Speaker 2: those were things that hurt me, and I carried my
Speaker 2: people pleasing into sports, and it took the joy out
Speaker 2: of it. By the end of my junior year, beginning
Speaker 2: of my senior year of high school, there was no
Speaker 2: joy in the sports. It was just anxiety around. I
Speaker 2: gotta be this, I gotta be ranked this, I gotta
Speaker 2: have scholarship offers. I only ended up with six scholarship offers.
Speaker 2: There's so many more people with so many more offers
Speaker 2: than me. I'm not doing something right, you know. And
Speaker 2: that narrative just became the constant in my life. And
Speaker 2: the only way that I felt like I could get
Speaker 2: rid of that and numb that out and just feel better,
Speaker 2: feel sense of peace was through getting high and drinking,
Speaker 2: which started with painkillers for me, went to smoking weed,
Speaker 2: drinking santix, cocaine.
Speaker 4: I mean, whatever would.
Speaker 2: Give me a feeling, you know, and it would just
Speaker 2: take me out of the present moment and take me
Speaker 2: somewhere else, you know. I went through college, played football
Speaker 2: at Georgia Tech and started getting into a lot of trouble.
Speaker 2: Got arrested for the first time my junior year of
Speaker 2: high school, been arrested three times, been kicked off of
Speaker 2: or suspended from every team on every level. I kicked
Speaker 2: off my basketball team in high school, spending multiple times
Speaker 2: at Georgia Tech, spending multiple times with the Baltimore Ravens ace.
Speaker 4: I got into the NFL. You could see the.
Speaker 2: Addiction, because none of these consequences deterred me even a
Speaker 2: little bit from my habits, from wanting to use, from
Speaker 2: wanting to escape, Like nothing materialistic, nothing external, was going
Speaker 2: to be able to fill this internal void that I had.
Speaker 2: But I didn't have the knowledge or the vocabulary or
Speaker 2: the emotional intelligence to be able to be aware of
Speaker 2: that or even like voice that at the time, and
Speaker 2: I just thought success was all that mattered, performing, getting
Speaker 2: to a certain point, graduating from a great institution, getting
Speaker 2: drafted into the NFL. You know, I checked every box
Speaker 2: from when I was a kid what success was presented
Speaker 2: to me as but I was as miserable as I
Speaker 2: could possibly be, And so you started asking yourself why,
Speaker 2: like how did.
Speaker 4: I get here?
Speaker 2: And then you feel feel so powerless because the addiction
Speaker 2: is so deep that you can't get out of it.
Speaker 2: And that just turned me into a master of just
Speaker 2: self sabotage and lying and hiding and essentially using people,
Speaker 2: using women, using using people to make me feel better
Speaker 2: about myself, because I always needed you to tell me
Speaker 2: about that I was good in order for me to
Speaker 2: believe it, because I couldn't inherently say I was good.
Speaker 2: From that five year old kid that wasn't black enough,
Speaker 2: and then all the things that I'm doing, getting arrested
Speaker 2: and screwing people over and like, all those things build
Speaker 2: up and it's just You're a piece of shit, is
Speaker 2: the narrative, you know what I'm saying. So all that
Speaker 2: stuff followed me, and you know, I crashed and burned
Speaker 2: pretty hard, and the biggest moment probably would be an
Speaker 2: overdose in twenty seventeen on what I thought was, you know,
Speaker 2: the oxyes that I'm usually picking up, but ended up
Speaker 2: being fentanyl. And by the grace of God, since that
Speaker 2: next day forward, it's been almost six years of sobriety
Speaker 2: and just an unfolding spiritual journey that's been amazing and
Speaker 2: the best, the best thing that ever could happen to me.
Speaker 2: Nobody would look back on moments like that and think
Speaker 2: that's the I'm so grateful for that moment, you know
Speaker 2: what I'm saying. But I truly am because it took
Speaker 2: me off of this path of achieving, proving, accumulating and
Speaker 2: put me onto this path of looking inward first and
Speaker 2: finding value, finding richness, finding wealth on the inside before
Speaker 2: I try to find it on the outside, and It's
Speaker 2: been such a rewarding journey. I never even wanted to
Speaker 2: go back into playing football, but God had other plans
Speaker 2: for me. And here I am, six years after my suspension,
Speaker 2: and people want me around. People think I'm a pro,
Speaker 2: people think I work hard and set a good example,
Speaker 2: and somebody that they want on their team. And now
Speaker 2: I find myself, you know, on the Giants as one
Speaker 2: of the old heads on the team. Like I'm one
Speaker 2: of the top few oldest guys on the team. So
Speaker 2: I'm literally setting an example with all my habits and
Speaker 2: everything that I do and the energy that I bring
Speaker 2: and the attitude that I bring. And none of that
Speaker 2: happens without my moments of adversity that I had to
Speaker 2: overcome and be vulnerable in and just grow for myself,
Speaker 2: not just to get back to football, not just to
Speaker 2: get back to being a name in society, but for myself.
Speaker 2: And yeah, and my story continues to unfold. You know,
Speaker 2: it's resulted in great moments, amazing times with the Raiders.
Speaker 4: It's really successful.
Speaker 2: Seasons, really on pace to be you know, I was
Speaker 2: having visions of being one of the best players in
Speaker 2: that that organization that has ever seen and you know,
Speaker 2: things don't always go that way. I feel like, you know,
Speaker 2: in a way, God was trying to see if if
Speaker 2: I was clinging to the success again once I got
Speaker 2: back to being in the limelight. He's like, well, if
Speaker 2: I take this away, like this, is this your priority?
Speaker 2: Is this what makes you use this your identity? So
Speaker 2: that's why I feel like twenty twenty one, the last
Speaker 2: half of twenty twenty one, and the twenty twenty two
Speaker 2: sets with the Raiders are things I can look back
Speaker 2: on and be like, those are the most valuable seasons
Speaker 2: to me as a man. Not be those are my
Speaker 2: least yardages in a season since being a starter. But
Speaker 2: the lessons that I learned spiritually, mentally, emotionally are are
Speaker 2: incredible and it leads me to where I am today,
Speaker 2: ready to take on new challenges that come my way.
Speaker 2: But Donnie, go ahead and bless the people with your
Speaker 2: amazing story.
Speaker 3: Yeah, before I do, I just man, I love you
Speaker 3: so much and I love your story and I could
Speaker 3: hear it every day for the rest of my life
Speaker 3: and still be inspired and hear something new and take
Speaker 3: away so much and just to watch your evolution over
Speaker 3: these last few years, there's so much to unpack and
Speaker 3: what you said. One of the things I took away
Speaker 3: was people people think I work hard, people want to
Speaker 3: be around me, But I don't think that ever would
Speaker 3: have happened or that perspective if you didn't think that
Speaker 3: about yourself. And I think some of the beautiful work
Speaker 3: we've done over the years is really just to chip
Speaker 3: away at all the shit that was getting in the
Speaker 3: way of that, all the old stories, the old you know,
Speaker 3: universal not enough story that I believe all of us
Speaker 3: have to some form to be able to chip away
Speaker 3: at that and really just practice loving yourself every single day,
Speaker 3: which I still just love the fact that we talk
Speaker 3: about this. It brings a smile to my face when
Speaker 3: people see you, the masculine of all masculine, a football
Speaker 3: player like you know, to many people, a giant, I
Speaker 3: mean six ' six and you know, and I always
Speaker 3: tell people like, we're not talking about sports on the podcast.
Speaker 3: We're talking about real stuff. We're talking about our emotions,
Speaker 3: what we're afraid of, our vulnerabilities. I mean, we we
Speaker 3: dive deep, and we're not gonna ask anybody to go
Speaker 3: where we're not willing to go. And I think that's
Speaker 3: the beauty of the platform where we create a safe
Speaker 3: space for other people to open up because we're just
Speaker 3: We've learned that sharing our story, our past has become
Speaker 3: our best asset and that's how that's how we connected.
Speaker 3: So yeah, I guess I'll say way into mind, and
Speaker 3: I'll bring us back to that point. Up in Phoenix, Arizona.
Speaker 3: Grew up playing baseball my whole life. I played baseball
Speaker 3: and football, but played baseball all the way up until
Speaker 3: my senior year in college at Arizona State, where I
Speaker 3: had what was my fifth knee operation on my left knee,
Speaker 3: and it was a big one. It was pretty traumatic,
Speaker 3: to say the least. It was a cadaver transplant of
Speaker 3: my meniscus. I was the first person in Arizona to
Speaker 3: ever have this surgery. The doctor assured me that if
Speaker 3: all went well, it would be like having a new
Speaker 3: knee and I could possibly even play again. And so
Speaker 3: I put my trust in the hands of the doctors
Speaker 3: because he was the head orthopedic surgeon at Arizona State,
Speaker 3: and I said, Okay, let's do this. And the day
Speaker 3: I woke up from that surgery, I remember waking up
Speaker 3: in that hospital bed all alone. It was like all
Speaker 3: dark in there. I had a morphine drip, and that
Speaker 3: morphine drip would go off every ten minutes, and I
Speaker 3: just remember every eight minutes, nine minutes just hitting it
Speaker 3: because I was in so much pain. I looked down
Speaker 3: at my leg and my whole leg from the top
Speaker 3: of my hip bone to my ankle or my foot
Speaker 3: was one big bruise. So just from the massive signs
Speaker 3: and scars of trauma, I knew baseball was over for me.
Speaker 3: And it was from that day and for many years
Speaker 3: after where my role got turned upside down from a
Speaker 3: life of an addiction. Yes, it started with painkillers. I
Speaker 3: was prescribed eighty percoset a week for a month straight
Speaker 3: after the surgery and still getting no reprieve from the pain.
Speaker 3: My knee was swollen bent, so they have to take
Speaker 3: off your patella. They have to break it off to
Speaker 3: go in and do the procedure. And a month after
Speaker 3: the surgery, I'm like, eighty percoset a week, still dying
Speaker 3: in pain. I'm like, the doctor had to have messed
Speaker 3: this up? What is going on? A month and a
Speaker 3: half later, I turned the corner pain wise, but I
Speaker 3: had to drop out of all my classes, My senior year,
Speaker 3: I would get up to go take a shower like
Speaker 3: every third day because it was so exhausting just to
Speaker 3: crutch up and get my leg over the bathtub into
Speaker 3: the shower, where I was just wiped out. And so
Speaker 3: about eight months later, the cadaver piece that they put
Speaker 3: in my body ended up rejecting the piece, so the
Speaker 3: whole surgery was a wash. By that time, I was
Speaker 3: walking around and not really doing much other than partying
Speaker 3: popping pills, and you know, pills are really what had
Speaker 3: its grip on me. But like Darren, I also did
Speaker 3: a lot of other drugs, but it would be the
Speaker 3: drugs or the pain pills that would really I wasn't
Speaker 3: taking to get fucked up. It was about feeling normal.
Speaker 3: It was about once I would take them, to be
Speaker 3: able to let all the fear go away, so I
Speaker 3: could step foot outside my door and feel normal for
Speaker 3: a couple hours until the pill started wearing off. And also,
Speaker 3: like Darren, I also had an overdose. But that overdose
Speaker 3: that I had in Mexico wasn't even my bottom. I
Speaker 3: wasn't ready. I mean I remember my parents, my brother,
Speaker 3: my brother, and my brother in law had to drive
Speaker 3: to Mexico and come pick me up out of an
Speaker 3: emergency room. And the next day they tried to do
Speaker 3: an intervention, and I'm like, I'm not going to rehab.
Speaker 3: I'll go to meetings. And I would go to twelve
Speaker 3: Step meetings just to keep my family off my back,
Speaker 3: because I didn't want to stop my life for thirty
Speaker 3: days and go into rehab as if I had a
Speaker 3: lot going on in my life. So when I finally
Speaker 3: got in and my life got so bad, I got
Speaker 3: into rehab and I just remember sitting on my knees
Speaker 3: and saying, God, just tell me what I need to
Speaker 3: do to get it right this time. I tried so
Speaker 3: many times, and it was in that first night where
Speaker 3: they bring in twelve Step meetings, where the guys came
Speaker 3: in and they said things like go to meetings, get
Speaker 3: a sponsor, work the steps with that sponsor, and I
Speaker 3: heard it for the first time. Now, remember I've been
Speaker 3: going to meetings prior to that, but never heard the message.
Speaker 3: It's kind of like when the student is ready, the
Speaker 3: teacher will appear. And so I had the prayer and
Speaker 3: it was like a foxhole prayer because I had the
Speaker 3: gift of desperation. To actually hit my knees and be like, please, God,
Speaker 3: just tell me. And it was through the mouths of
Speaker 3: those two men that brought in that meeting where I
Speaker 3: heard the message, and so I knew what I needed
Speaker 3: to do this time. Once I got out of rehab,
Speaker 3: there was plenty of work I had to do, and
Speaker 3: that's where I got exposed into just my first therapy
Speaker 3: session and how powerful that was and so an important
Speaker 3: part of my message. My story also is that after
Speaker 3: three years of sobriety, I stopped doing the work. I
Speaker 3: stopped going to meetings, I stopped working with others, I
Speaker 3: stopped being of service. I straight away from the middle
Speaker 3: of the herd, and I got picked off. I had
Speaker 3: another operation on my right knee. It was like a
Speaker 3: minor arthroscopic surgery, like nothing compared to these other surgeries.
Speaker 3: But I remember waking up from that surgery and loving
Speaker 3: the way that I felt. And six days later I
Speaker 3: was back back in the doctor's office, lying about the
Speaker 3: pain level so that I could get more pills. And
Speaker 3: that sent me into about a year long relapse and
Speaker 3: since then, I just celebrated ten years of sobriety on
Speaker 3: May fifth. So May fifth twenty thirteen is my sobriety date.
Speaker 3: But that relapse is one of the most important parts
Speaker 3: of my story because it reminded me. I'm so grateful
Speaker 3: for it. And in the beginning it wasn't fun, like
Speaker 3: having to stand up in meetings and be a newcomer,
Speaker 3: and the shame of just like going back out and
Speaker 3: all of that coming up. But today it is the
Speaker 3: most important part of my story because it's just reminded
Speaker 3: me that the work will never stop. And thank god
Speaker 3: it happened three years in to my sobriety and not
Speaker 3: now ten years in, where there's so much more at stake.
Speaker 3: And through that process when I was at my rock bottom,
Speaker 3: my mom, My mom was the one trying to help
Speaker 3: me anyway that she could, and she was doing yoga.
Speaker 3: I always say, way before yoga was school, and she
Speaker 3: kept telling me, you need to do to yoga because
Speaker 3: my body was so banged up five surgeries on my
Speaker 3: left leg. I had three before I graduated high school,
Speaker 3: and so my right hit my low back. I was
Speaker 3: just dying physically and dying spiritually. And I would always
Speaker 3: tell her yoga's for girls and hippies. I'm not doing
Speaker 3: that shit. Like, that was my mindset at the time,
Speaker 3: but I finally went with her once and after that
Speaker 3: one class, I knew I would do yoga for the
Speaker 3: rest of my life just from a physical standpoint, but
Speaker 3: little did I know what it would do for the
Speaker 3: mind and the soul. And so I ended up going
Speaker 3: to teacher training and got out of teacher training, I'm like,
Speaker 3: I want to quit my corporate job and go teach
Speaker 3: yoga full time. And I got humbled pretty quick, and
Speaker 3: there was a slow progression. About five years later, slowly
Speaker 3: working my way out of corporate America, and five years
Speaker 3: into teaching yoga, became a coach. I've done a lot
Speaker 3: of work with Lululemon and led their internal personal development program,
Speaker 3: and it just really allowed me to fall in love
Speaker 3: with coaching and self development, self love, personal development, whatever
Speaker 3: you want to call it. And so becoming a coach
Speaker 3: has just been a great compliment to the yoga and
Speaker 3: the meditation. It's like the mind, body, soul work that
Speaker 3: we all need. And it's so cool to be able
Speaker 3: to coach somebody like Darren or it could be a
Speaker 3: stay at home mom, but honestly, the work that we
Speaker 3: do is it's the same work, the work I do
Speaker 3: with Darren. It's not about the on the field stuff,
Speaker 3: it's everything else. It's giving him tools, techniques and practices
Speaker 3: to be able to find his center. We're all getting
Speaker 3: pulled in a thousand different directions by the world's to
Speaker 3: demand for the attention of our mind. Now a pro
Speaker 3: athlete or someone in the limelight probably has even more
Speaker 3: of that, which is why it's so important to provide
Speaker 3: these tools and to carry this message. And you know,
Speaker 3: it's a lot of this stuff I learned in recovery,
Speaker 3: and I believe we're all recovering from something, and so
Speaker 3: we get to carry the message of recovery, even though
Speaker 3: people listening might not be, or someone in a yoga
Speaker 3: class might not be in recovery from a substance, but
Speaker 3: it's the same message. And you know, going through and
Speaker 3: working the twelve steps, you know, it's become the path
Speaker 3: of freedom more than anything. And freedom that word runs
Speaker 3: so deep to me today because it's like I remember
Speaker 3: how free I was not and how bound I to
Speaker 3: the drugs and to my addiction, and so I don't
Speaker 3: want to shut the door on it. I want to
Speaker 3: remember that because those are the days where I might
Speaker 3: not be feeling it. That can kind of get me
Speaker 3: off my butt and keep me inspired because I always say, like,
Speaker 3: how free do you want to be? And just talking
Speaker 3: about it. I think there's a lot of shameful things
Speaker 3: that I did in my past in my addiction, but
Speaker 3: what frees me from the shame is just sharing my story.
Speaker 3: And it blows my mind that all of the terrible
Speaker 3: decisions that I made and the pain I put my
Speaker 3: family and friends through is actually what sets me free
Speaker 3: today if I just talk about it, and the fact
Speaker 3: that that can actually help somebody else, like I truly
Speaker 3: feel there, like we are the luckiest. We are the
Speaker 3: luckiest to find a way out, but then also to
Speaker 3: find purpose through all the pain, much of it self inflicted,
Speaker 3: Like we know that once we take ownership. And I
Speaker 3: believe my life changed when I really started to take
Speaker 3: ownership for my life and stop blaming the doctor that
Speaker 3: screwed me over and my family that didn't understand, Like,
Speaker 3: that's when things really started to change for me. And yeah,
Speaker 3: I shared my story about a year into my sobriety
Speaker 3: teaching a yoga event and from that day sharing my
Speaker 3: story what used to bury me in guilt and shame
Speaker 3: my past. Today it's my best asset. And then seeing
Speaker 3: Darren share his story on HBO Hard Knox, I'm sitting
Speaker 3: there watching it at home, and I'm like, who is
Speaker 3: this dude? He's doing what I did, but like way
Speaker 3: bigger platform. And so I reached out to him on
Speaker 3: Instagram when he had about two thousand followers and nobody
Speaker 3: knew who he was because he hadn't really played. He
Speaker 3: was just coming off a year long suspension. And I'm
Speaker 3: just so grateful that he saw my message, and I
Speaker 3: just told him, I'm like, I work with other athletes.
Speaker 3: I loved your story. I got you if you need anything,
Speaker 3: and he responded and that's kind of where the love
Speaker 3: story began.
Speaker 2: Yes, sir man, that's such an amazing testimony. Man, Just
Speaker 2: the similarities between our journeys have just it's just been
Speaker 2: years of character development, man, years of spiritual development that
Speaker 2: has been building something in us. You know, it's brought
Speaker 2: hope back into our lives. You know, it's bought integrity
Speaker 2: into our lives. It's brought courage into our lives. You know,
Speaker 2: it's brought the willingness and the open mindedness to look
Speaker 2: towards new paths and to be teachable, be coachable. It's
Speaker 2: allowed us to make amends to other people and start
Speaker 2: doing right by those people, and to keep taking inventory
Speaker 2: of ourselves into you know, wanting to serve. And these
Speaker 2: are things that you know that hold us down through
Speaker 2: no matter what kind of storms come through our life. Now,
Speaker 2: it's not what happens to us, it's more so, you know,
Speaker 2: our response to what happens to us. You know, you
Speaker 2: don't know when things are gonna happen. You don't know
Speaker 2: the purpose behind a storm coming your way. It could be,
Speaker 2: you know, like I just said, for your character development.
Speaker 2: But that's how we can often view change as storms.
Speaker 2: And you know, Donnie and I we spent a lot
Speaker 2: of time talking about change, how to embrace it, how
Speaker 2: to just a proper way to look at it. And Donnie,
Speaker 2: you have so many good quotes on on change that
Speaker 2: just allow you to just approach it in a simplified manner.
Speaker 2: So I don't want to I don't want to steal
Speaker 2: your thunder on that. I want to let you go
Speaker 2: ahead and attack it.
Speaker 3: No, I love, I mean it's the perfect topic with
Speaker 3: you know, everything going on in your life. Right now
Speaker 3: and the shift that's happened. But yeah, I always say
Speaker 3: that change is not part of the process, it is
Speaker 3: the process. And I think so many people there's a
Speaker 3: part of the brain that does not like change, and
Speaker 3: there's a part of the brain that likes to it's
Speaker 3: trying to keep us safe and stay with what's familiar.
Speaker 3: And in my experience in my own life and also
Speaker 3: and in my life in sobriety and when I wasn't
Speaker 3: in when I wasn't sober, how much we can fear
Speaker 3: change and stepping into the unknown. But in order to
Speaker 3: really step into the unknown, we have to we have
Speaker 3: to die to the way we thought our life was
Speaker 3: going to be. Like one of them only there's a few,
Speaker 3: but one of the only constants in this life is
Speaker 3: is change and also sacrifice, meaning we have to let
Speaker 3: go of something in order to invite anything else new
Speaker 3: in right, we have to make space like surrender daily.
Speaker 3: That's why I love yoga. You can go to your
Speaker 3: just chip away at all the shit that's in the way,
Speaker 3: whether it's a you know, tension in the body, which
Speaker 3: ultimately is coming from our thinking and coming from stress,
Speaker 3: and all stress really is is wanting the moment to
Speaker 3: be something that it's not. So it comes back to
Speaker 3: when we resist change. Yeah, it's it's add on pain.
Speaker 3: And I know there's people out there that have had
Speaker 3: terrible things happen to them and lots of loss and tragedy.
Speaker 3: But acceptance doesn't mean that we need to like it.
Speaker 3: Acceptance doesn't mean that it's it wasn't fair, it wasn't
Speaker 3: fucked up that it happened, but we do have to
Speaker 3: accept that it's happened. And I know sometimes there can
Speaker 3: be a process, there can be grief, but we have
Speaker 3: to have tools to actually go through that process. If not,
Speaker 3: and we're resisting change, it just becomes add on pain.
Speaker 3: So even though it's painful whatever it might be in
Speaker 3: your life, if we're not, if we're resisting it, it
Speaker 3: just creates more suffering. And you know, there's a quote
Speaker 3: out there suffering is optional, but it does take awareness, right,
Speaker 3: And that's like the beauty of all of these conversations
Speaker 3: that we have. And just to see how much awareness, Darren,
Speaker 3: that you've cultivated in your life from the consistency of
Speaker 3: the work that you've done, like is it is the
Speaker 3: coolest thing ever to sit back and watch your revolution,
Speaker 3: but even more so your discipline on certain practices that
Speaker 3: you have, you know, a year under our coaching, I'm
Speaker 3: seeing the things you're doing, and I'm your coach, and
Speaker 3: I'm like, dude, I got to step up my game
Speaker 3: because you were so dialed in and you had your
Speaker 3: non negotiables and your prayer and meditation and your journaling
Speaker 3: game is off the charts. And I think what I've seen,
Speaker 3: and if we're talking about change, what that's allowed you
Speaker 3: to do is just have this completely different perspective that
Speaker 3: it is all happening for us and not to us, right,
Speaker 3: and that this is God's will, not our will, and
Speaker 3: when we can surrender to that and accept the things
Speaker 3: that we can not change, like, that's really what sets
Speaker 3: us free.
Speaker 2: No question, man, Because I mean you're looking at a
Speaker 2: guy that is I'm experiencing the most change that I've
Speaker 2: ever had to take on in my life, especially in
Speaker 2: this new life. You know, since the last time we
Speaker 2: been putting out comeback stories episodes, I've become a married man,
Speaker 2: changed teams, gone from the West Coast to the East coast.
Speaker 2: I'm adjusting to living in New Jersey. I'm currently in Vegas,
Speaker 2: as we record this, but for the most part, I'll
Speaker 2: be in New Jersey now. So it's a lot of
Speaker 2: things that I never would have expected to happen, but
Speaker 2: things that I have the character to embrace. Now I
Speaker 2: have the I have the wisdom and the knowledge to
Speaker 2: embrace it and not resist it, because if I don't,
Speaker 2: If I look back far enough, when I was at
Speaker 2: Baltimore Raven and there was an opportunity for me to
Speaker 2: go to the Raiders, if I would have resisted that change,
Speaker 2: I would have been blocking myself from an immense amount
Speaker 2: of blessing, an immense amount of opportunities. And so who's
Speaker 2: to say that things can't continue to change, to work
Speaker 2: in my favor, to continue to expand and unfold a
Speaker 2: life that I never dreamed was possible. So it's a
Speaker 2: I think embracing change starts with realizing that a lot
Speaker 2: of the things that we hold in high value in
Speaker 2: this world are fleeting. Like success is fleeting. You're not
Speaker 2: going to be successful all the time, trust me. Like
Speaker 2: I've been successful in my career, I'll still drop a pass.
Speaker 2: I'll still you know, if you look at the entirety
Speaker 2: of my journey, I mean, we can roll. Well, I
Speaker 2: look like one of those dudes that's rolling the scroll
Speaker 2: out and the papers rolling on the ground. If we're
Speaker 2: talking about mistakes, if we're talking about moments where I
Speaker 2: didn't show up as my most authentic self, and that's
Speaker 2: a part of it, man Like, we we have to
Speaker 2: embrace that journey is not going to be perfect, but
Speaker 2: moments like that is what makes everything worth it. Man Like,
Speaker 2: I'm grateful to be where I'm at. Yeah, I'm distant
Speaker 2: from my wife, but this is an opportunity for me
Speaker 2: to continue to, you know, take my career as far
Speaker 2: as it could possibly go and maximize that. And I'm
Speaker 2: supported in that by my wife being in this new place.
Speaker 2: Like I'm here on assignment, I'm not here by accident.
Speaker 2: I didn't just get thrown to New Jersey. I got
Speaker 2: placed in New Jersey for a reason. I got placed
Speaker 2: in New Jersey for a purpose, leading men on this team,
Speaker 2: continuing the impact that my foundation has had, bringing that
Speaker 2: to the East Coast, trying to save lives, give people
Speaker 2: opportunities to recover. But once I realize what's fleeting like money, success,
Speaker 2: what people are saying about me, and realize that what
Speaker 2: isn't fleeting is my spirit. What isn't fleeting is my
Speaker 2: heart in my mind. Like those are constants that are
Speaker 2: going to go with me everywhere that I go, and
Speaker 2: I stay disciplined in those things, That's what's going to
Speaker 2: allow me to be anywhere and not just feel peace,
Speaker 2: but be the piece where in the middle of the storm,
Speaker 2: be the piece when it's chaos all around me, where
Speaker 2: there is real no foundation for me. I'm living in
Speaker 2: a new spot, I'm transitioning apartments, I'm you know, missing
Speaker 2: the most important person in my life to me, Like
Speaker 2: all those things are kind of like it's a little
Speaker 2: bit shaky ground. But when I know that it starts
Speaker 2: from me just being myself everywhere that I go and
Speaker 2: just being and not having to do, not having to perform,
Speaker 2: not placing unneeded pressure on myself, That's when I'm free
Speaker 2: enough to respond to change in the best way that
Speaker 2: I know that I can. And I can't do that
Speaker 2: when I'm stressed, Like you said, Like, what do you
Speaker 2: say about stress is when you want the moment to
Speaker 2: be something that is not Like a lot of times,
Speaker 2: a lot of times that change is not going to
Speaker 2: be what you wanted because as you may have been
Speaker 2: comfortable in your previous situation, in the previous circumstances, but
Speaker 2: this is bringing you out of your comfort zone. But
Speaker 2: I feel like we all know by now is stepping
Speaker 2: outside your comfort zone is the only way any type
Speaker 2: of growth is going to happen.
Speaker 3: Man, you know, just thinking about you going to New
Speaker 3: York City and us speaking this out to the universe
Speaker 3: and to God and to this platform of we're on
Speaker 3: a mission to reach as many people as possible, and
Speaker 3: here God places you in New York City, the media
Speaker 3: capital of the world, Like, well, of course it aligns
Speaker 3: with it aligns with your mission, Like there's a reason
Speaker 3: why you're here, and it's way way bigger than catching
Speaker 3: touchdowns and we know that. And I think that's another
Speaker 3: direct reflection of the work that you've done. And I
Speaker 3: think what's cool for me my core wound. Darren talked
Speaker 3: about his of being different where mine was just baseball
Speaker 3: was my identity, it was everything. It was the love
Speaker 3: of my life. It was like that was the plan.
Speaker 3: I didn't have a plan B. So when that was
Speaker 3: taken away from me, I didn't know what to do.
Speaker 3: And yes, I had some physical injuries, but at the
Speaker 3: core I was taking drugs and alcohol because I didn't
Speaker 3: want to feel the emotional pain of the loss of
Speaker 3: my purpose of baseball. And so immediately when Darren and
Speaker 3: I started working together, it's like, you better know who
Speaker 3: you are beyond the sport. And this isn't just for athletes.
Speaker 3: This can be for the parent, to someone who puts
Speaker 3: all of their identity into their job, that you better
Speaker 3: know who you are because it's going to end one
Speaker 3: day for you and if you don't, if you don't
Speaker 3: have something bigger, it's going to get messy. That literally
Speaker 3: almost killed me. And so to see the evolution of
Speaker 3: Darren beyond the sport with rap music, you know, being
Speaker 3: a musician, a very talented musician, having the podcast, having
Speaker 3: the foundation, becoming a husband, like all of these things.
Speaker 3: I say this all the time, and I speak for Darren,
Speaker 3: but I'm very confident like football could and for him
Speaker 3: tomorrow and he's going to be good and he's not
Speaker 3: going to fall down that path that so many other
Speaker 3: athletes might fall down because his purpose is something bigger
Speaker 3: than just you know, on the field stuff. So, yeah,
Speaker 3: that was another thing I wanted to mention with what
Speaker 3: you said is just yeah, that lesson of the lesson
Speaker 3: of impermanence, where nothing lasts forever, and that can be good.
Speaker 3: I mean, that can work for us and against us. Right,
Speaker 3: So when all the good stuff is happening, that's not permanent,
Speaker 3: and then when the bad stuff, if you're in a
Speaker 3: valley right now and you're feeling like you know, there's
Speaker 3: no light at the end of the tunnel, nothing is permanent.
Speaker 3: So that lesson of impermanence is a great reminder that like,
Speaker 3: we will come out of it. It's like just learning
Speaker 3: how to ride the waves. And that's so much of
Speaker 3: the work that we do and Darren, that you continue
Speaker 3: to do is just trying to continue to find your center,
Speaker 3: keep the non negotiables, keep the practices that allow us
Speaker 3: to embrace change, to not resist, to see that like
Speaker 3: this is all working for us, right. And the other
Speaker 3: thing I wanted to cover was you talking about being
Speaker 3: the peace in the storm or the calm and the storm,
Speaker 3: and so now being in New York City, I remember
Speaker 3: teaching a yoga class in Bryant Park in New York
Speaker 3: City and it was like the coolest moment ever because
Speaker 3: here we were doing this yoga class outside sirens NonStop sirens,
Speaker 3: all kinds of noise, and we were the calm and
Speaker 3: just like you know, you and Vegas. I feel like
Speaker 3: Vegas has a lot of bright lights, but as we know,
Speaker 3: there's a lot of darkness in that town too. For
Speaker 3: you to come in and be the light in a
Speaker 3: town that certainly could use it. And now coming into
Speaker 3: New York City and being the calm and being that
Speaker 3: rock and being that center in the midst of the chaos,
Speaker 3: like this is what's going to help you, you know,
Speaker 3: deal with manage. So I guess my question to you
Speaker 3: is like, how are you managing? How has the transition
Speaker 3: been for you on a psychological level?
Speaker 2: So far, It's been a good transition. There's been a
Speaker 2: lot of great that's come from it. I feel like
Speaker 2: everything that's been happening with the team and and and
Speaker 2: immersing myself in that environment, that culture has been outstanding.
Speaker 2: And even even the new place that I'm living in
Speaker 2: New Jersey. It's just like it's a different way, different
Speaker 2: than Las Vegas, way different than Georgia. But I've really
Speaker 2: enjoyed it. But I feel like going into it, uh,
Speaker 2: maybe like a lot of people would because I'm human,
Speaker 2: I'm thinking like and there's there of course there's media
Speaker 2: covering my transition. I can't transition like a like a
Speaker 2: normal person. But so it makes me think like, okay,
Speaker 2: like I have to like this is a transition, but no,
Speaker 2: this is gonna this isn't gonna be hard.
Speaker 4: This is gonna be fine.
Speaker 2: This is gonna be I have the tools, I have,
Speaker 2: the the practices I got, the discipline, like this is,
Speaker 2: this is gonna be fine. I'm gonna handle it the
Speaker 2: best way possible and that's that. But I feel like
Speaker 2: I had allowed myself to accept that, you know, this
Speaker 2: is this is difficult, This is a lot, this is.
Speaker 4: You know, we're coming out into.
Speaker 2: The wilderness per se, if anybody, if anybody reads the Bible,
Speaker 2: but just allowing it to allowing it to be hard,
Speaker 2: like not like self pitying in it, not wallowing in it,
Speaker 2: not being like being overridden by like asking myself why
Speaker 2: and all this, but just like, hey, like this is
Speaker 2: I'm gonna make the most of it. But this is difficult.
Speaker 2: This is difficult for anyone. These are three different things
Speaker 2: that are probably the top five things that stress people out,
Speaker 2: and they happen to me at all at once. So
Speaker 2: it's just accepting that and moving forward. You talk about
Speaker 2: finding your ciner. You know, I do that in a
Speaker 2: multitude of ways, but just the idea of finding the center.
Speaker 2: It's like you kind of think of it as like
Speaker 2: a rope's trying to pull you in each direction. And
Speaker 2: one is like the change is trying to get you
Speaker 2: to latch onto the past and how good that was
Speaker 2: and romanticizing that and how you don't want to leave it.
Speaker 2: And there's another side that's like, okay with change. It
Speaker 2: is trying to pull you into the future, trying to
Speaker 2: line up every single thing, trying to get everything planned out,
Speaker 2: trying to make sure everything goes perfectly so I don't
Speaker 2: have to stress out.
Speaker 4: But neither of those.
Speaker 2: Make me effective right where I'm at in the present
Speaker 2: moment and the things that keep me to the present
Speaker 2: moment or meditation something I'm a I'm almost six years
Speaker 2: into on a journey with journaling therapy, seeing like seeing
Speaker 2: a therapist. I've done group therapy, I still do when
Speaker 2: I want therapy, Like my life doesn't change without me
Speaker 2: consistently being in vulnerable settings for me to share and
Speaker 2: to talk. So it's that it's having a sponsor. It's
Speaker 2: making sure that i'm you know, I'm reading. I'm continuing
Speaker 2: to try to expand my relationship with God. I'm still creating,
Speaker 2: making music like things that fill my cup, that bring
Speaker 2: me joy, and not just because it's easy in my
Speaker 2: stage to focus on I got to perform like these
Speaker 2: last couple of years, the injury, the injuries and the
Speaker 2: time is taken away from what I was doing before,
Speaker 2: like I gotta perform.
Speaker 4: I gotta perform now, I gotta do this, and it.
Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, I want to be excellent at what I do,
Speaker 2: but me trying to me being in a performance mode
Speaker 2: is not healthy for Darren Waller, who goes home and
Speaker 2: who has a soul and a spirit at the end
Speaker 2: of the night and is a human being. I want
Speaker 2: to be excellent and be great at everything that I
Speaker 2: do and uh and leave a legacy, leave a powerful legacy.
Speaker 2: But you know, I I perform my best when I'm
Speaker 2: just being you know, we're not We're not human doings.
Speaker 2: We're human beings. Like when I'm being the best version
Speaker 2: of myself, just being who I am, that's when things
Speaker 2: line up. That's when all these opportunities that I have,
Speaker 2: I feel worthy of them, and I maximize them and
Speaker 2: I do great things with them. But it's all about
Speaker 2: just practicing and keeping myself in this space of like
Speaker 2: each and every moment that comes, I'm gonna be there
Speaker 2: for it. I'm not gonna be anywhere else and be
Speaker 2: right where my feet are and just staying in my practices.
Speaker 2: It's fundamentals. It's you know, waking up and like how
Speaker 2: people go to the gym and do certain things, Like
Speaker 2: I'm hitting these fundamentals every day because it allows when
Speaker 2: something comes and may hit me out of nowhere and
Speaker 2: surprise me or shock me, I can come back to
Speaker 2: exactly who I am, come back to my center and
Speaker 2: be like, Okay, We're going to find a way to
Speaker 2: not only to survive this, but thrive in this, because
Speaker 2: I'm not meant to just be here to just exist
Speaker 2: and survive and get by, like we're meant to live
Speaker 2: life and live life to the full.
Speaker 3: I would love anybody that's listening, maybe a new listener,
Speaker 3: to go back and listen to episode one, which is
Speaker 3: Darren sharing his comeback story and just noticing the shift
Speaker 3: in these last few years in his voice and in
Speaker 3: his clarity, and it's not just like it doesn't just
Speaker 3: magically appear. I'm telling you it's a direct reflection of
Speaker 3: the work that he's committed to. There's so many things
Speaker 3: that came up to me, came up for me when
Speaker 3: you were just sharing. One of them was I remember
Speaker 3: when during COVID playing in an empty Raiders stadium, right
Speaker 3: and asking you like, how was it? How was it
Speaker 3: like not having fans and that external noise and validation
Speaker 3: that you can just but you can feel energetically and
Speaker 3: hear by the sounds. And I remember you saying it
Speaker 3: was peaceful, and I was like, wow, how many people
Speaker 3: would say that? And how many guys on you know,
Speaker 3: throughout the NFL were struggling because they didn't have that,
Speaker 3: because they needed something outside of them. So that was
Speaker 3: when I was like, man, this dude is different. But
Speaker 3: it came with It wasn't like, again, you were just
Speaker 3: handed this stuff. You've done a lot of work to
Speaker 3: get to this place to have the perspective that you have,
Speaker 3: and it's just it's inspired. How do you feel like
Speaker 3: your recovery had helped you in the transition in the
Speaker 3: physical move from Vegas to New York.
Speaker 2: It's helped tremendously. It's you know, just starting with the
Speaker 2: the realization of like I don't have to manage everything.
Speaker 2: I don't have to have everything, you know, be overseen
Speaker 2: by me, and like every single detail of this transition
Speaker 2: has to be like lined up in a particular way
Speaker 2: in order for it to go well. Like I can,
Speaker 2: I can come out here and it can be rough sometimes,
Speaker 2: it can be scary, it can be exciting, it can
Speaker 2: be lonely, like it could be all of these things.
Speaker 2: And I don't have to try to make sure that
Speaker 2: I have to be happy at all times. I have
Speaker 2: to be upbeat at all times. And you know, I
Speaker 2: also don't have to be sad and down in the dumps,
Speaker 2: you know, because I'm also in a position in a
Speaker 2: way to where I'm leading and setting the tone in
Speaker 2: my marriage and it requires me to bring a certain
Speaker 2: level of energy and intentionality to it. So yeah, I mean,
Speaker 2: recovery helps tenfold. It. It doesn't allow me to bottle
Speaker 2: things up. It doesn't allow me to isolate, It doesn't
Speaker 2: allow me to just sit into things that are bothering me.
Speaker 2: It forces me to bring those to another person. It
Speaker 2: forces me to make sure that you know, I'm operating
Speaker 2: in a healthy manner because when I keep things in,
Speaker 2: those things eat at me on the inside, and my
Speaker 2: brain can go left in a heartbeat, you know. Like
Speaker 2: that's the thing about alcoholism and addiction. It's like it's
Speaker 2: the thinking aspect of it more so than it is.
Speaker 4: Like the drinking.
Speaker 2: Like sure, like I haven't had a drink or a
Speaker 2: pill in almost six years, but it's the mind that
Speaker 2: still operates like it's an addict or an alcoholic, and
Speaker 2: it tries to enforce its will on all types of
Speaker 2: different situations and relationships. And it's just if I'm not
Speaker 2: doing these if I'm not praying, if I'm not meditating,
Speaker 2: if I'm not going to meetings, being in these environments,
Speaker 2: then something small in my day or is going to
Speaker 2: start eating away at my piece. And it's gonna be
Speaker 2: little things over time, and then you look up and
Speaker 2: be like, oh man, I'm depressed or I'm just angry,
Speaker 2: or I'm resentful. And it wasn't just one major thing happening.
Speaker 2: It was just little things that started to add up.
Speaker 2: And I can't afford to allow those little things to
Speaker 2: add up. It's a constant state of awareness, constant state
Speaker 2: of mindfulness that allows me to continue to approach this
Speaker 2: thing one day at a time. It's as cliche as
Speaker 2: it sounds, that philosophy. That perspective changed my career because
Speaker 2: I don't have to go and I learned I don't
Speaker 2: have to go into a season and say I need
Speaker 2: twelve hundred yards. I can go into a season and say, hey,
Speaker 2: I got practice today. Each and every period, each and
Speaker 2: every drill, each and every rep of practice, I'm going
Speaker 2: to be present for and try to maximize that one
Speaker 2: rep and one rep start to stack. You know, people
Speaker 2: want to we want to get there, we want to
Speaker 2: get to the endpoint, but there ultimately is here, like
Speaker 2: the word here is in there. So it's like, if
Speaker 2: I'm maximizing each and every moment, I don't even have
Speaker 2: to check the stat sheet, I don't even got to
Speaker 2: check none of that. It's gonna add up. But the
Speaker 2: end of the year you can look up and be like, Wow,
Speaker 2: this is what I accomplished by staying in the moment
Speaker 2: as much as I possibly could. And that's what recovery
Speaker 2: is doing for me. Man. It's approaching things from a
Speaker 2: spiritual perspective, not going into environments and situations and locker rooms,
Speaker 2: demanding that things be about me, demanding about me getting
Speaker 2: my performance, me getting my shine. No, it's about being
Speaker 2: a part of a greater whole, a greater good, and
Speaker 2: serving that greater good, and knowing that all I've wanted
Speaker 2: all along, when I was trying to get high and
Speaker 2: trying to get drunk, was just to be a part
Speaker 2: of something that was meaningful and be a part of
Speaker 2: something that was bigger than myself, because the traps and
Speaker 2: the prisons that I was setting around me were self centered,
Speaker 2: and they were by you know, we were self inflicted,
Speaker 2: like you said earlier.
Speaker 4: So it's a it's.
Speaker 2: A culmination of all those things, man, and just continuing
Speaker 2: to put one foot in front of the other and
Speaker 2: allow myself to be taught, allow myself to be coached.
Speaker 2: And I feel like I have everything figured out, because
Speaker 2: I don't. I'm not even close.
Speaker 3: I love that beginner's mindset which you've always had, and
Speaker 3: you've always been so humbled, I always say, sometimes humble
Speaker 3: to a fault where I felt my part time job
Speaker 3: has been your hype man for the last few years,
Speaker 3: which I love, and I'll and I'll be I'll be
Speaker 3: that person forever for you. Yeah, you said the small things.
Speaker 3: The small things add up, and that can work for
Speaker 3: us and it can work against us. It's like the
Speaker 3: relapse doesn't happen the day we relapse. It was for
Speaker 3: me the moment I decided to not go to that
Speaker 3: meeting or not go call my sponsor, and then that
Speaker 3: just turned into probably four months later on actual relapse.
Speaker 3: But in the same way, those small that compounding effect,
Speaker 3: just like pound interest, you know, the small shifts. It's
Speaker 3: like if you are out in the ocean and you
Speaker 3: change your location or your route one degree, you'll end
Speaker 3: up in a completely different location. So if you're out
Speaker 3: there and you're struggling and you don't see the light
Speaker 3: at the end of the tunnel, just know like that
Speaker 3: one little win, that one little thing, the promise that
Speaker 3: you keep to yourself if you say you're going to
Speaker 3: do something and get out of bed the next day
Speaker 3: and maybe just take ten deep breaths, not try to
Speaker 3: start some twenty minute meditation practice, but just take ten
Speaker 3: deep breaths, or write down a couple things that you're
Speaker 3: grateful for. If writing it down feels like too much,
Speaker 3: think of a couple things that you're grateful for. But
Speaker 3: the most self confident people in the world are the
Speaker 3: ones that keep the promises that they make to themselves,
Speaker 3: and so we want to be impeccable with our word
Speaker 3: like the like the Four Agreements talks about, which Darren
Speaker 3: and I reference all the time, which if you haven't
Speaker 3: read that book, read it is it will change your
Speaker 3: life forever. It's something that I wish we would have
Speaker 3: read in elementary school and high school. Things would be
Speaker 3: a lot different. So yeah, it's I'm just so proud
Speaker 3: of you, and I'll never forget. One of the greatest
Speaker 3: days of my life was probably the greatest day of
Speaker 3: your life was your wedding day. And from my perspective,
Speaker 3: to get to sit back and just watch a man
Speaker 3: like heartbusted wide open, which wasn't always the case, so
Speaker 3: in love, but at the same time at your wedding,
Speaker 3: which it was such an epic wedding, you having so
Speaker 3: much clean fun, performing dan scene so happy like that
Speaker 3: was just one of the greatest moments. To be able
Speaker 3: to bear witness to that was such an honor and
Speaker 3: such a gift. But so that's a big change for you.
Speaker 3: How has Like what's the energetic or emotional change of
Speaker 3: now being a married man.
Speaker 4: It's a shift that is.
Speaker 2: Indirect, like contradiction to the man I was in like
Speaker 2: my previous life, you know, like the addict, Like the
Speaker 2: thinking behind it is like completely self centered, right, whereas
Speaker 2: being married is the complete opposite. It's about really being
Speaker 2: in service, you know, Like I feel like my recovery
Speaker 2: journey has prepared me for this in ways that I
Speaker 2: wasn't even realizing before. It's serving without all, without needing
Speaker 2: ah a standing ovation. It's it's doing little things. It's
Speaker 2: being aware of how another person gives and receives love
Speaker 2: and making sure that their needs are met in that capacity,
Speaker 2: and just being intentional, intentional with time, intentional with just
Speaker 2: spending quality time and in physical touch. You know, we're
Speaker 2: we're two very busy people, so we probably have to
Speaker 2: be a lot more intentional than the average. And not
Speaker 2: to mention being on separate coasts, you know, it's it's
Speaker 2: it's really forced me to and challenge me to be
Speaker 2: intentional with you know, the every other weekend, I was
Speaker 2: flying to where she was, whether she had a game
Speaker 2: or on the road, or you know, drove to Connecticut
Speaker 2: for a game. From Jersey. It was like three and
Speaker 2: a half hours. So it's like doing whatever it takes
Speaker 2: to let that person know that you're there with them
Speaker 2: and that we're on a team, and how we communicate
Speaker 2: with each other, how we interact with each other. You know,
Speaker 2: we start, we started as friends and you know, remain
Speaker 2: friends throughout that process, and you know we're you know, partners, lovers.
Speaker 2: But at the end of the day, it's just like
Speaker 2: enjoying being around somebody, and we enjoy being around somebody
Speaker 2: and you are not bringing a ton of emotional baggage
Speaker 2: into the picture. It allows you to have a really
Speaker 2: healthy and just an experience that the joy continues to
Speaker 2: expand each and every each and every day that we're
Speaker 2: involved in it, you know. And I feel like doing
Speaker 2: pre marital counseling, counseling beforehand allowed us to prepare for
Speaker 2: that as well. That's something that I would recommend because
Speaker 2: I don't if a lot of people are doing and
Speaker 2: that it allows you, it really allows you to separate
Speaker 2: the petty you know. It's like a lot of things
Speaker 2: that petty things that people may get mad about, and
Speaker 2: couples get frustrated over a sock that's on the floor
Speaker 2: or dishes in the dishwasher or things like that. It
Speaker 2: allows you to move above that, like we need to
Speaker 2: go to a different level with our marriages and not
Speaker 2: looking and not looking to be offended and looking for
Speaker 2: these little things, but overseeing those and really get into
Speaker 2: the depths of the matter, like what have you been through?
Speaker 2: What are some wounds that you're still trying to heal from.
Speaker 2: How can I be there for you? How can I
Speaker 2: create a safe space for you and allow you to
Speaker 2: feel like you can continue to grow to the best
Speaker 2: version of yourself. So those are those are some things
Speaker 2: that since being married that continue to unfold them, continuing
Speaker 2: to learn and you know, I'll be four months into
Speaker 2: marriage here pretty soon, and it's you know, I don't
Speaker 2: have the handbook on this thing by any means, but
Speaker 2: I feel like if I continue to continue to show
Speaker 2: up and love myself health the practice that I do,
Speaker 2: it allows me to be able to love her. Because
Speaker 2: I can't love myself first, then it's going to be
Speaker 2: impossible for me to continue to show up with that
Speaker 2: level of energy for her. So it's an ongoing journey,
Speaker 2: just like everything else we're discussing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that last thing you said is the
Speaker 3: key thing to remember that we can only love somebody
Speaker 3: else as much as we're willing to love ourselves. And oftentimes,
Speaker 3: like we went through with drugs and alcohol, there was
Speaker 3: a void, a god shaped hole, if you will, inside
Speaker 3: of us, and so we seek we looked outside of
Speaker 3: ourselves to fill that void where It's the same thing
Speaker 3: with love. If you cannot truly love yourself wholeheartedly, you know,
Speaker 3: you will look to the external and ultimately, like when
Speaker 3: we place expectations or all of our validation through the outside,
Speaker 3: we're always going to be disappointed. So you know, when
Speaker 3: we can love ourselves first, you know, let's just say
Speaker 3: you truly have that, and then you find to partner,
Speaker 3: it's like you know how to hold your heart in
Speaker 3: your hand, and then when somebody else comes and also
Speaker 3: holds your heart, it's great. But if that person lets go,
Speaker 3: you're okay because you're still holding your heart. And if
Speaker 3: you don't have that piece, breakups and change like we're
Speaker 3: talking about, can be an absolute disaster. So loving yourself
Speaker 3: has to be priority number one, and then doing so,
Speaker 3: everybody else wins. So I'm glad you brought that up.
Speaker 3: And yeah, just hearing you talk about Kelsey. If you
Speaker 3: have not heard the episode with Kelsey as our guests,
Speaker 3: go back and check that one out. We will definitely
Speaker 3: be having Kelsey on for round two because it's gonna
Speaker 3: be a it's gonna look and sound a lot different
Speaker 3: than it did in episode one where they were friends
Speaker 3: at the time, but they were not lovers yet or partners.
Speaker 3: But that that episode is what activated everything. And if
Speaker 3: you go back and you watch it on YouTube or
Speaker 3: listen to it, you will hear magic happening and kind
Speaker 3: of having You can kind of feel God's hands going
Speaker 3: to work in this beautiful connection. So we've come a
Speaker 3: long way, my.
Speaker 4: Man, no doubt. Man, it's a life. Life continues to
Speaker 4: get better.
Speaker 2: I don't know if somebody I feel like needs to
Speaker 2: hear that that may be in uh, just just in
Speaker 2: shit man, in the mess and like not seeing any
Speaker 2: kind of hope and feeling like we felt at one
Speaker 2: point in time. They just need to hear that life
Speaker 2: gets better. Like my life is only continuing to get better.
Speaker 2: It's not free from adversity, it's not free of difficult
Speaker 2: moments that I need to find ways to work through
Speaker 2: and solutions for But as I continue to work through
Speaker 2: those things and walk in the direction of my fear
Speaker 2: as opposed to running from them, this thing just keeps
Speaker 2: getting better. This ride just keeps getting more meaningful and fulfilling.
Speaker 4: As I go along. Man, So this is a this
Speaker 4: is cool dog. It's a lot.
Speaker 2: It may be a lot for people to take in
Speaker 2: if this is their first time listening to us. If
Speaker 2: you could give somebody like one thing to take away
Speaker 2: that they don't need to miss when they take their
Speaker 2: headphones off when they close out this podcast, Like, what
Speaker 2: do you think that one takeaway would be for you?
Speaker 3: I mean, the only story that matters is the one
Speaker 3: you tell yourself. Right, this is like the comeback stories
Speaker 3: that were we thought of the podcast name. I mean,
Speaker 3: this is what we wanted to We wanted people to
Speaker 3: share their comebacks. But come back story, you know, coming back.
Speaker 3: The essence of meditation is to come back, come back home,
Speaker 3: come back to your breath, come back to your heart.
Speaker 3: But also it's the stories that we tell ourselves. So
Speaker 3: if you have that story, which in my experience as
Speaker 3: a coach and just speaking and talking to everyone, there
Speaker 3: is a not enough story that so many of us,
Speaker 3: almost all of us I believe have, whether it's not
Speaker 3: good enough, not pretty enough, not skinny enough, whatever it is,
Speaker 3: that if that story is running the show, it doesn't
Speaker 3: matter what you acquire, receive, achieve, it's never going to
Speaker 3: be enough. So we have to change the narrative. And
Speaker 3: it does come with work, but we can't do it alone.
Speaker 3: And the work, I promise you, is still an easier,
Speaker 3: softer way than continuing to do things the same old way,
Speaker 3: because nothing changes if nothing changes. So it has to
Speaker 3: start with how we feel about ourselves and then you know,
Speaker 3: the belief system that we have and how we see
Speaker 3: ourselves in the world and how we see the world,
Speaker 3: and from there the internal dialogue and the thoughts can
Speaker 3: start to change.
Speaker 4: But you know, it.
Speaker 3: Comes back to each day doing the work to chip
Speaker 3: away at all the shit that's in the way and
Speaker 3: just honoring that that is going to be the work,
Speaker 3: and the work will become a labor of love eventually,
Speaker 3: like it is work. But it's still the easier, softer way.
Speaker 3: And I think we have to change. The story that
Speaker 3: we're telling ourselves is the most important thing that matters.
Speaker 4: It's powerful.
Speaker 3: What do you got and answer your own question?
Speaker 2: Oh, yeah, I got to I would tell somebody, I
Speaker 2: would reinforce what I said earlier. It's not about what happens,
Speaker 2: it's about your response to what happens. Made clear and
Speaker 2: evident by our own two stories. I got banned from
Speaker 2: the league for over a year for drugs and alcohol.
Speaker 2: If I continue to wallow in self pity and thinking
Speaker 2: that using was going to continue to bring me some
Speaker 2: sort of peace that was long gone, there's no way
Speaker 2: I'm sitting here. But the way that I responded each
Speaker 2: and every day and continue to respond allows me and
Speaker 2: sets me up for life where being a platform, being
Speaker 2: a voice, being somebody, a person of impact is a
Speaker 2: possibility just by the way that I responded and said,
Speaker 2: this thing that happened in my life, this thing that
Speaker 2: I take ownership for, is not going to define me.
Speaker 2: Somebody may be listening to this. They spent time in
Speaker 2: a sale. That doesn't have to define you. Somebody may
Speaker 2: have been abused that's listening to this, that doesn't have
Speaker 2: to define you. It's all about your response to that,
Speaker 2: a loving response, and you respond to that with the
Speaker 2: story that you tell yourself. That's the only thing that's
Speaker 2: going to allow you to put one foot in front
Speaker 2: of the other, just leaving a crack of the door
Speaker 2: open towards faith and hope in whatever it is that
Speaker 2: you believe in. That's the only way is responding to circumstances,
Speaker 2: because things are going to happen that are out of
Speaker 2: your control and that may have been totally in your control.
Speaker 2: But there's no one event, there's no one circumstance, there's
Speaker 2: no one day or moment that can define you good
Speaker 2: or bad. It's all about our consistent response and our
Speaker 2: consistent approach to the adversity that comes our way. So
Speaker 2: if you need one nugget to take with you on
Speaker 2: the road, please take that, don't let it go, and
Speaker 2: please remember what Donnie just said, because this is powerful stuff,
Speaker 2: this stuff that has changed our lives, and we're excited
Speaker 2: to watch your lives change as well on this journey
Speaker 2: with us. So we're grateful, grateful that you guys are
Speaker 2: rejoining us this season for this show. Like I said,
Speaker 2: what was your first time where you've been with us
Speaker 2: since day one. We're grateful that you're coming back. We're
Speaker 2: going to keep coming back. Go tell somebody else that
Speaker 2: we've come back for season three. This is going to
Speaker 2: be an amazing ride. We've got some amazing guests. Can't
Speaker 2: wait for you guys to take in all that we're
Speaker 2: going to create and all that we're going to talk about.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I just echo all of those same things. And
Speaker 3: if you're out there and you still don't know where
Speaker 3: to start, hopefully you have maybe a little bit more
Speaker 3: awareness or something that Darren and I spoke today that
Speaker 3: maybe spoke to your heart. One of the best things
Speaker 3: you can do is just talk about it. If there's
Speaker 3: someone out there and you want to share our podcast
Speaker 3: and have some downloads with the person you know, one
Speaker 3: of your friends or mentors, to just talk about these
Speaker 3: new AHAs that you're having. You know, it has to
Speaker 3: start somewhere. You can't do it alone. And it just
Speaker 3: goes back to our mission to remind people that you're
Speaker 3: not alone. And the only story that matters is the
Speaker 3: one you tell yourself. But we do this work together.
Speaker 3: We cannot do it alone. And I'll just keep reminding
Speaker 3: our listeners and I have to remind myself that often too.
Speaker 3: But this is the power of the collective and why
Speaker 3: we're here.
Speaker 2: Powerful stuff. So we can't wait for you guys to
Speaker 2: join us. Next week got special guests, someone that you
Speaker 2: may have noticed from ESPN back in the day, but
Speaker 2: a man who.
Speaker 4: Is a storyteller, a podcast host.
Speaker 2: A man by the name of Michael smith Man that
Speaker 2: we can't wait to talk to and share that conversation
Speaker 2: with you. So we hope you guys have a blessed
Speaker 2: week and we're gonna catch it in.
Speaker 1: Comeback Stories is a production of Inflection Network and iHeartRadio.
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Speaker 1: or wherever you get your podcasts.