WEBVTT - COVID-19 Chapter 10: Schools 0:00:01.360 --> 0:00:04.560 Hi, I'm Vanessa. I am a seventh grade language arts 0:00:04.600 --> 0:00:08.159 teacher at a middle school just outside of Seattle. We 0:00:08.320 --> 0:00:11.920 have over eight hundred students. About eighty percent of our 0:00:12.039 --> 0:00:15.280 students are on free year reduced lunch, which in the 0:00:15.520 --> 0:00:19.880 education field is how we indicate low income status. Also, 0:00:20.480 --> 0:00:24.760 about seventy percent of students are English language learners. The 0:00:24.760 --> 0:00:28.560 first reported case for US was in late January, but 0:00:28.680 --> 0:00:31.560 we really didn't start feeling the impact of the virus 0:00:31.760 --> 0:00:34.960 until the first death was reported on February I think 0:00:35.000 --> 0:00:38.080 twenty ninth. That was in the northern part of our county. 0:00:38.600 --> 0:00:41.400 Seattle Public Schools announced that they'd be closing for two 0:00:41.479 --> 0:00:46.040 weeks around that time, and we assumed we'd be following suit. 0:00:46.400 --> 0:00:49.479 What actually happened, though, was that school closed officially for 0:00:49.560 --> 0:00:53.760 six weeks on March sixteenth, per the governor's order. We 0:00:53.840 --> 0:00:58.319 got the official announcement about an hour before school let 0:00:58.360 --> 0:01:05.319 out on the twelfth. That was really horrible. We worry 0:01:05.360 --> 0:01:10.000 about our kids during breaks, especially when you work in 0:01:10.160 --> 0:01:16.440 a lower income neighborhood, because poverty leads to a lot 0:01:16.480 --> 0:01:20.160 of things that impacts the way our kids come to 0:01:20.240 --> 0:01:24.000 school and the things they face at home. First, we 0:01:24.440 --> 0:01:26.800 were told by the state not to do distance learning 0:01:26.840 --> 0:01:30.160 with new material unless we can make it completely equitable. 0:01:30.840 --> 0:01:36.000 Because of the way our community is, it was really 0:01:36.080 --> 0:01:39.800 impossible to make that equitable at the time, and so 0:01:40.640 --> 0:01:43.520 before we could really start doing anything, we had to 0:01:43.560 --> 0:01:45.640 make sure kids had their chromebooks. We had to make 0:01:45.680 --> 0:01:47.800 sure they worked, We had to get chromebooks to the 0:01:47.800 --> 0:01:51.120 elementary students, and we had to figure out how to 0:01:51.160 --> 0:01:56.480 get our low income family's internet because that's, you know, 0:01:56.800 --> 0:01:59.000 part of distance learning, and a lot of our kids 0:01:59.000 --> 0:02:01.880 didn't have it. Now that school's been closed to the 0:02:02.000 --> 0:02:04.760 end of the year, the state has changed its guidance 0:02:05.000 --> 0:02:09.919 and were required to teach new material an issue pass 0:02:10.320 --> 0:02:14.680 or incomplete grades instead of the A through F, but 0:02:14.919 --> 0:02:19.320 they're still required to do the material. I think everyone's feeling, 0:02:19.360 --> 0:02:22.520 but maybe our kids more so, is that our students 0:02:22.560 --> 0:02:28.120 are struggling. Beyond just the academics. The district was working 0:02:28.120 --> 0:02:31.120 to get meals provided and figure out the tech situation. 0:02:32.280 --> 0:02:35.840 As a teacher, I was contacting families, making sure they 0:02:35.880 --> 0:02:39.760 had enough to eat, enough money to get by, if 0:02:39.919 --> 0:02:43.400 they had computers or internet, if they needed help with 0:02:43.480 --> 0:02:47.720 any of these things, I'd refer them to community organizations 0:02:47.840 --> 0:02:51.519 to help with food, rent, utilities. We have a no 0:02:51.639 --> 0:02:54.600 eviction role place in now, but of course people are 0:02:54.600 --> 0:03:00.120 worried about back rent when that ends. Some of our 0:03:00.120 --> 0:03:05.880 families have undocumented family members and don't qualify for some 0:03:06.000 --> 0:03:09.960 of the aid, so we're working again with community partners 0:03:10.000 --> 0:03:13.880 to get those families what they need when they need it. 0:03:14.960 --> 0:03:20.080 Figuring out the best format to deliver instruction has been really, 0:03:20.600 --> 0:03:27.840 really difficult, because it's so important to make those personal 0:03:27.880 --> 0:03:31.880 connections and keep those relationships going to keep kids motivated 0:03:31.919 --> 0:03:36.200 to learn, and it's hard to do that through a 0:03:36.240 --> 0:03:41.280 computer screen or through email. Honestly, some days I answer 0:03:41.320 --> 0:03:44.960 more questions about mental health than I do assignments. Our 0:03:45.000 --> 0:03:48.720 families are also terribly impacted. Many are out of work 0:03:48.920 --> 0:03:52.840 or working essential, low paying jobs. They're worried about rent 0:03:52.880 --> 0:03:56.640 and food and utilities. They're really worried about kids falling 0:03:56.680 --> 0:04:01.720 behind in school. Luckily, we are a very connected community 0:04:02.680 --> 0:04:06.000 and we help each other out, and we've got some 0:04:06.120 --> 0:04:11.440 fantastic community organizations that are really really working with us 0:04:11.480 --> 0:04:15.120 as schools and Moving Mountains to help our families and 0:04:15.200 --> 0:04:20.120 help our students through this time. I feel lucky to 0:04:20.200 --> 0:04:27.119 have landed in such a fantastic, close, loving community during 0:04:27.120 --> 0:04:27.719 this time. 0:04:29.440 --> 0:04:31.560 Oh no, I think you can hear my parents in 0:04:31.600 --> 0:04:32.159 the background. 0:04:32.240 --> 0:04:32.760 It's fine. 0:04:33.440 --> 0:04:37.320 Hi, I'm no Talia Kintana. I'm sixteen and a junior 0:04:37.360 --> 0:04:40.719 in high school. Before this pandemic began, my life was 0:04:40.760 --> 0:04:44.560 busy but simple. Monday through Friday, I had school, followed 0:04:44.560 --> 0:04:47.480 by rehearsals for my musical, getting home late and doing 0:04:47.480 --> 0:04:50.920 my work, going to bed at some ungodly hour, then 0:04:50.960 --> 0:04:52.680 waking up early in the morning to do it all 0:04:52.720 --> 0:04:57.800 over again. It was fun. Stressful, yes, but fun. I 0:04:57.839 --> 0:05:00.839 was planning for my college applications, study for the SAT 0:05:01.080 --> 0:05:03.120 and making sure my grades were as high as I 0:05:03.160 --> 0:05:06.440 could get them. I first heard about Sar's KOV two 0:05:06.520 --> 0:05:09.400 at the end of January, when the situation in Wuhan, 0:05:09.560 --> 0:05:12.760 China started to be all over the news. Then my 0:05:12.839 --> 0:05:15.400 school and other schools in the area started talking about 0:05:15.400 --> 0:05:18.120 the possibility of closing for a week or two. That 0:05:18.360 --> 0:05:21.120 was worrying. I loved school and didn't know what an 0:05:21.200 --> 0:05:24.159 online version of that would be like. But at the 0:05:24.200 --> 0:05:26.920 start of March it became my reality. As the pandemic 0:05:27.000 --> 0:05:30.279 was officially a pandemic, my school got shut down, and 0:05:30.400 --> 0:05:32.640 case numbers in my city began to rise at a 0:05:32.720 --> 0:05:36.760 rapid pace. When my school was shut down, my anxiety 0:05:36.839 --> 0:05:40.120 was fueled. We've now moved to online classes, and I've 0:05:40.120 --> 0:05:40.799 been struggling. 0:05:41.440 --> 0:05:42.039 I'm usually a. 0:05:42.120 --> 0:05:45.320 Very engaged student, but online it's harder to do everything. 0:05:45.920 --> 0:05:48.920 I find myself less attentive. I can't ask for help. 0:05:49.400 --> 0:05:52.120 If I do, the whole class knows, and my anxiety 0:05:52.160 --> 0:05:54.919 won't let that happen. So I can only listen to 0:05:54.960 --> 0:05:57.159 so many lecturers and look at a computer for so 0:05:57.320 --> 0:06:00.520 long before my mind becomes mush. I just can't seem 0:06:00.560 --> 0:06:02.840 to drum up the passion for school I used to have. 0:06:03.880 --> 0:06:06.599 My days now go like this. I wake up early 0:06:06.640 --> 0:06:09.159 and get ready for school, move into my dad's office, 0:06:09.200 --> 0:06:11.800 and sit in the same chair for four hours. Then 0:06:11.839 --> 0:06:13.200 I have the rest of the day to do my 0:06:13.240 --> 0:06:17.240 homework or anything else. Even though I have time to 0:06:17.240 --> 0:06:21.120 do things like exploring new hobbies or exercising, I get 0:06:21.120 --> 0:06:24.080 these waves of anxiety and depression where all I can 0:06:24.120 --> 0:06:27.240 do is lay in bed and cry. I've always struggled 0:06:27.240 --> 0:06:32.119 with anxiety and occasionally depression, but I was doing better 0:06:32.120 --> 0:06:36.000 before all this. I worry about my mental health worstening. 0:06:36.600 --> 0:06:39.160 Nothing is certain. My school has yet to say if 0:06:39.160 --> 0:06:41.960 we can or can't return to school this year, but 0:06:42.080 --> 0:06:44.599 it doesn't look like we will. I don't even know 0:06:44.640 --> 0:06:47.359 if I'll go to school in the fall. When I 0:06:47.360 --> 0:06:50.240 think about college, I don't know what I see. I 0:06:50.320 --> 0:06:53.240 had a plan I'd visit colleges over spring break and 0:06:53.279 --> 0:06:56.120 then i'd get back and study, but needless to say, 0:06:56.160 --> 0:06:59.760 my trip got canceled. This pandemic has also made me 0:07:00.040 --> 0:07:02.920 question my plan to study out of state. Should I 0:07:03.040 --> 0:07:06.400 stay close to home? What if my family gets sick. 0:07:06.880 --> 0:07:08.919 I want to be there to take care of them. 0:07:09.520 --> 0:07:13.480 Beyond the educational part of school, I'm isolated. I talk 0:07:13.520 --> 0:07:15.800 to my friends as often as I can, but we're 0:07:15.800 --> 0:07:17.880 all working really hard and it's not like we have 0:07:17.960 --> 0:07:21.120 much to talk about. For my friends who are seniors, 0:07:21.320 --> 0:07:24.680 I may not see them again for years. Their graduation 0:07:24.800 --> 0:07:27.880 has been canceled, and their prom has also been For me, 0:07:27.960 --> 0:07:30.880 it's just junior prom. I'll have another one, but it's 0:07:30.920 --> 0:07:34.880 not for seniors. So I set up an online problem 0:07:34.880 --> 0:07:39.120 with my friends. It went well enough. It was only 0:07:39.120 --> 0:07:41.040 a bit of a mess, but that didn't stop me 0:07:41.080 --> 0:07:44.400 from at least trying to connect with my friends because 0:07:44.400 --> 0:07:46.600 I know that life won't be the same for a while. 0:07:47.520 --> 0:07:49.600 I don't know how I'm going to cope, but right 0:07:49.640 --> 0:07:52.040 now all I want is to get through this year. 0:07:52.720 --> 0:07:56.080 I'll stress about the other stuff. Then everyone I talk 0:07:56.160 --> 0:07:59.200 to about school has said the same thing. They just 0:07:59.280 --> 0:08:02.440 want to go back, but we know why we can't, 0:08:03.000 --> 0:08:04.520 and we're willing to give up a lot. 0:08:06.560 --> 0:08:09.640 I'm currently in my second year of teaching science at 0:08:09.640 --> 0:08:13.720 a high school in regional Victoria, Australia. Overall, like many 0:08:13.760 --> 0:08:17.120 regional areas, we struggle with keeping up with our metropolitan 0:08:17.160 --> 0:08:22.560 counterparts in literacy, numeracy, and curricular concerns. Even in my classes, 0:08:22.560 --> 0:08:24.320 there can be as much as a ten year gap 0:08:24.360 --> 0:08:29.560 in ability levels, which poses its own challenges. Enter COVID nineteen. Now, 0:08:29.560 --> 0:08:32.320 coronavirus was something that we were aware of since the 0:08:32.320 --> 0:08:36.240 beginning of our school year, which for us was late January. However, 0:08:36.280 --> 0:08:39.720 it felt distant and foreign, overshadowed by the domestic bushfire 0:08:39.760 --> 0:08:43.480 crises that were still raging on. Now, COVID nineteen continued 0:08:43.480 --> 0:08:46.600 to grow and it's influenced locally as gyms and shops closed, 0:08:46.840 --> 0:08:50.120 cafes were only allowing takeaway food, and coffees and all 0:08:50.160 --> 0:08:54.160 of the students' activities outside of school war shut down, 0:08:54.600 --> 0:08:58.840 but schools were kept open. Large gatherings were banned, sports events, assemblies, 0:08:58.920 --> 0:09:02.880 and school camps were canceled, but school continued business as usual. 0:09:03.840 --> 0:09:06.439 The stance of the government was that students education should 0:09:06.480 --> 0:09:10.520 not be disrupted. Unfortunately, by this point, education was already 0:09:10.559 --> 0:09:14.240 being disrupted. Students were gradually staying at home as their 0:09:14.280 --> 0:09:17.920 parents felt uneasy about sending them out. We finished school 0:09:17.920 --> 0:09:20.880 abruptly four days early to allow teachers to prepare for 0:09:20.920 --> 0:09:23.760 the next term of remote learning. I, along with many 0:09:23.760 --> 0:09:26.480 other teachers, spent most of our extended break planning out 0:09:26.520 --> 0:09:31.079 online lessons, along with producing hard copy versions and resources 0:09:31.080 --> 0:09:34.800 for families without computer and internet access. We're now stepping 0:09:34.800 --> 0:09:37.679 into our second week of remote learning, and my role 0:09:37.720 --> 0:09:41.360 as a teacher has shifted dramatically. I'm still waiting to 0:09:41.400 --> 0:09:44.440 hear back from over fifty percent of my students. Our 0:09:44.480 --> 0:09:47.000 state government is in the process of rolling out laptops 0:09:47.000 --> 0:09:50.559 to students who need them and providing access to Wi Fi. However, 0:09:50.600 --> 0:09:53.320 this will take the next few weeks to make sure 0:09:53.360 --> 0:09:56.079 all families are readily equipped for remote learning and can 0:09:56.080 --> 0:09:59.400 get online I've done my best so far to make 0:09:59.480 --> 0:10:02.480 videos and couraging students to engage with online learning, and 0:10:02.559 --> 0:10:07.000 have set online classroom check ins for our platforms, but 0:10:07.240 --> 0:10:09.440 I'm still figuring out the best way to approach this. 0:10:10.520 --> 0:10:14.319 Remote learning does provide an opportunity for students to grow 0:10:14.400 --> 0:10:17.480 in their resilience and to figure out how they best learn, 0:10:17.679 --> 0:10:20.760 and I guess it gives teachers a chance to develop 0:10:20.800 --> 0:10:24.040 skills in diversifying content and making sure it's actually clear 0:10:24.040 --> 0:10:28.520 for us students. There are plenty of students who will 0:10:28.559 --> 0:10:32.360 really benefit from the independence that remote learning provides. Without 0:10:32.400 --> 0:10:34.679 the distraction of a classroom, students will be able to 0:10:34.720 --> 0:10:39.120 get through so much more. However, for some students who 0:10:39.160 --> 0:10:42.760 are already struggling with face to face lessons, they won't 0:10:42.800 --> 0:10:46.120 have the constant encouragement and support that teachers can provide. 0:10:47.320 --> 0:10:52.360 Online interactions are clunky and difficult, especially if you can 0:10:52.440 --> 0:10:56.600 even get online, so the gaps in our classrooms have 0:10:56.640 --> 0:11:00.640 the potential to grow enormously with some students getting lit behind, 0:11:00.720 --> 0:11:03.640 and that is a serious concern for so many teachers. 0:11:04.240 --> 0:11:06.680 We're putting in as much effort as we can to 0:11:06.800 --> 0:11:12.040 make these lessons valuable for students as they're stuck at home. 0:11:12.360 --> 0:11:16.720 But there's only so much that we can do. The 0:11:16.760 --> 0:11:20.360 COVID nineteen pandemic is sweeping through every aspect of society, 0:11:20.440 --> 0:11:23.959 exposing many vulnerabilities in its wake, and one of which 0:11:24.120 --> 0:11:28.200 is the concerning lack of scientific and health literacy among 0:11:28.240 --> 0:11:32.480 the general population. I guess if we're lucky, it'll make 0:11:32.559 --> 0:11:35.120 us reassess the way we approach education as a whole. 0:11:36.080 --> 0:11:38.679 If anything, this pandemic has given me a strong answer 0:11:38.760 --> 0:11:41.400 to the question I often get in class, why do 0:11:41.480 --> 0:11:42.760 we even need to know this? 0:12:27.480 --> 0:12:30.920 Thank you so so much to the providers of those 0:12:30.960 --> 0:12:35.200 first hand accounts. They were fantastic and we really really 0:12:35.240 --> 0:12:37.880 appreciate you taking the time to send in your stories. 0:12:38.840 --> 0:12:42.200 We love them so much. Thank you to every single 0:12:42.240 --> 0:12:44.559 person who has sent in a story. We absolutely love 0:12:44.600 --> 0:12:46.880 hearing from you. We wish that we could put every 0:12:47.120 --> 0:12:50.280 single firsthand in these episodes we do. 0:12:51.240 --> 0:12:53.600 Hi, I'm erin Welsh. 0:12:52.920 --> 0:12:54.719 And I'm erin omen Updike. 0:12:54.720 --> 0:12:56.720 And this is this podcast will kill you. 0:12:57.520 --> 0:13:03.320 Oh my gosh, Welcome to the tenth episode I'm Shocked, 0:13:05.559 --> 0:13:09.640 the tenth episode of our Anatomy of a Pandemic series. Yes, 0:13:10.080 --> 0:13:14.640 this week we are again outside of our wheelhouse, talking 0:13:14.720 --> 0:13:18.400 about education and the impact that the pandemic has had 0:13:18.440 --> 0:13:22.160 on how learning takes place, the inequalities that have been 0:13:22.679 --> 0:13:26.840 so starkly revealed through these massive school closures, and what 0:13:26.960 --> 0:13:30.320 the future may hold for the public school system in 0:13:30.360 --> 0:13:30.880 the US. 0:13:31.880 --> 0:13:35.560 And because this is such a massive topic already, we 0:13:35.600 --> 0:13:38.880 are mostly restricting our discussion to the impact that this 0:13:39.000 --> 0:13:42.560 pandemic is having on schools in the US. But I 0:13:42.600 --> 0:13:45.520 do think that a lot of the larger issues that 0:13:45.559 --> 0:13:49.840 we discuss in this interview can be pretty broadly relevant 0:13:49.880 --> 0:13:50.319 as well. 0:13:51.200 --> 0:13:54.960 Yeah, definitely, But before we get to that interview, we 0:13:55.000 --> 0:13:58.240 do have a few pieces of business. First of all, 0:13:58.520 --> 0:14:00.560 we said already thank you to every one who has 0:14:00.600 --> 0:14:03.679 been sending in your first hand accounts. If you would 0:14:03.720 --> 0:14:06.680 like to share your story about what you've been going 0:14:06.720 --> 0:14:09.800 through during this pandemic, you can find the link on 0:14:09.840 --> 0:14:14.160 our website under COVID nineteen Firsthands to submit a Google 0:14:14.200 --> 0:14:17.400 form to send us your story. Also, on our website 0:14:17.440 --> 0:14:21.320 you'll find alcohol free episodes of all of our episodes, 0:14:21.360 --> 0:14:23.480 so you can use those as you wish. 0:14:23.800 --> 0:14:29.160 And Aaron and we have an affiliate page on bookshop 0:14:29.200 --> 0:14:31.360 dot org. You've heard us talking about it before in 0:14:31.400 --> 0:14:34.560 this podcast. If you haven't Google Bookshop, it's a really 0:14:34.560 --> 0:14:40.440 cool website. And one final piece of business it is. 0:14:40.400 --> 0:14:41.760 It's Quarantin any Time. 0:14:41.760 --> 0:14:47.000 Quarantin any time. We are drinking quarantine ey ten. 0:14:48.440 --> 0:14:50.360 We're so creative with these titles. 0:14:50.520 --> 0:14:54.880 I know, I know it's about as bad as hepatitis ABCD. 0:14:55.400 --> 0:14:58.960 I know, actually that's a really good comparison. 0:15:00.480 --> 0:15:03.360 But I finally can understand and empathize, and I'm like, oh, 0:15:03.440 --> 0:15:05.360 I feel bad for criticizing them. 0:15:07.040 --> 0:15:08.479 That's really funny. 0:15:08.840 --> 0:15:13.360 Okay, So what is in quarantine E ten? You may ask, 0:15:13.920 --> 0:15:17.440 I do ask, and I will tell you that it 0:15:17.520 --> 0:15:22.040 is guava simple syrup, which sounds very complicated, but it's 0:15:22.040 --> 0:15:27.120 actually not. I promise you can make just by if 0:15:27.160 --> 0:15:31.680 you have guava frozen pulp. So like Goya brand frozen pulp. 0:15:31.720 --> 0:15:32.960 They have a ton of different seas. 0:15:34.520 --> 0:15:37.240 We just all have freezers full of fruit pulp. Erin, 0:15:37.640 --> 0:15:38.360 I had. 0:15:38.200 --> 0:15:43.400 Some from when we made the Dancing Plague Quarantine eight, 0:15:43.960 --> 0:15:46.760 the fever fever. Yeah, and I had because if we 0:15:46.840 --> 0:15:49.640 used guava juice and so I had guava pulp from then, 0:15:50.560 --> 0:15:51.960 and so anyway, I was like, what am I supposed 0:15:51.960 --> 0:15:55.440 to do with this leftover honk of guava, and so 0:15:56.080 --> 0:15:58.920 I made guava simple syrup. So you just make two 0:15:58.920 --> 0:16:01.520 to one simple syrup, so like two cups of sugar 0:16:01.560 --> 0:16:05.120 one cup of water, and then you do whatever quantity 0:16:05.160 --> 0:16:09.960 that produces. You do equal amounts guava pulp and that. Anyway, 0:16:10.120 --> 0:16:13.600 it's fantastic. It's really good. So it's not just guava 0:16:13.600 --> 0:16:20.040 simple syrup. It also has lemon juice, vodka, and grapefruit 0:16:20.040 --> 0:16:20.680 club soda. 0:16:21.600 --> 0:16:26.400 Yum, pretty tasty. I think this is probably our fanciest 0:16:26.480 --> 0:16:28.960 of these COVID quarantinies. 0:16:29.520 --> 0:16:32.240 But I mean genuinely, I had all of these things, 0:16:32.280 --> 0:16:33.720 so like, I don't. 0:16:33.560 --> 0:16:35.239 Know, it's still a pandemic quarantini. 0:16:35.880 --> 0:16:38.800 Yeah, you could also just use whatever simple syrup you 0:16:38.880 --> 0:16:39.720 want to make out. 0:16:39.560 --> 0:16:40.240 Of a fruit juice. 0:16:40.280 --> 0:16:40.920 So there you go. 0:16:41.720 --> 0:16:43.160 There you go. Yeah, And we will. 0:16:43.040 --> 0:16:46.040 Post the recipe to the quarantini and the non alcoholic 0:16:46.080 --> 0:16:48.680 Placy Brita on our website This podcast will kill You 0:16:48.760 --> 0:16:49.400 dot com. 0:16:50.240 --> 0:16:55.880 Yes, all right, so all right, let's get into this episode, 0:16:55.880 --> 0:16:56.240 shall we. 0:16:56.520 --> 0:16:57.080 Let's do it. 0:16:58.080 --> 0:17:00.360 This is the second time in the series that we 0:17:00.520 --> 0:17:04.199 ventured outside of the public health arena that we are 0:17:04.280 --> 0:17:07.680 most comfortable in to talk about the impact of COVID 0:17:07.760 --> 0:17:11.879 nineteen on other aspects of life and society. Just like 0:17:11.920 --> 0:17:15.080 we talked about in our economics episode, in this current pandemic, 0:17:15.119 --> 0:17:18.680 we're seeing how public health and disease intersect with basically 0:17:18.720 --> 0:17:23.440 every single aspect of our lives, and education and schooling 0:17:23.520 --> 0:17:25.840 is one of those aspects that has really felt the 0:17:26.000 --> 0:17:28.200 massive impact of this pandemic. 0:17:28.840 --> 0:17:32.000 But again, even though we really want to ask and 0:17:32.160 --> 0:17:35.480 learn about the effects of COVID nineteen on public schools, 0:17:35.680 --> 0:17:39.159 we Aaron and I don't have the expertise to answer 0:17:39.160 --> 0:17:42.960 those questions or to even be jour out Nope, But 0:17:43.280 --> 0:17:48.920 do you know who does? Journalist Jennifer Berkshire, an education historian, 0:17:49.040 --> 0:17:53.879 doctor Jack Schneider hosts of the Have You Heard Podcast, 0:17:54.000 --> 0:17:58.680 which is an awesome, awesome podcast on educational policy and politics. 0:17:59.240 --> 0:18:02.080 And we were four enough to pick their brains on 0:18:02.119 --> 0:18:05.840 some of the biggest issues facing public schools today during 0:18:05.920 --> 0:18:09.879 this COVID nineteen pandemic, and also kind of exploring the 0:18:10.000 --> 0:18:15.119 historical context of these issues. It was such an interesting 0:18:15.520 --> 0:18:16.760 and enlightening interview. 0:18:16.920 --> 0:18:18.680 It was so fun, it was so good. 0:18:19.240 --> 0:18:22.240 Okay, so we will let them introduce themselves right after 0:18:22.320 --> 0:18:59.440 this break. 0:19:00.200 --> 0:19:02.800 My name is Jack Schneider. I'm an assistant professor of 0:19:02.880 --> 0:19:07.280 education at UMass Lowell. I live in Somerville, Massachusetts, with 0:19:07.320 --> 0:19:09.960 my wife and daughter. My wife is a teacher who 0:19:09.960 --> 0:19:14.600 has been moved into the world of online instruction for 0:19:14.600 --> 0:19:17.119 the last several weeks. My daughter is a student, a 0:19:17.160 --> 0:19:21.600 fourth grader, who has been moved into the strange hybrid 0:19:21.680 --> 0:19:26.520 world of homeschooling and online schooling. And we are all 0:19:26.640 --> 0:19:29.600 doing our best to make sense of the world right now. 0:19:29.920 --> 0:19:33.199 I also co host the Education Policy podcast Have You 0:19:33.280 --> 0:19:36.080 Heard with Somebody who does more work on it than 0:19:36.119 --> 0:19:36.359 I do? 0:19:38.080 --> 0:19:42.040 And I'm Jennifer Berkshire. I am a writer. I write 0:19:42.080 --> 0:19:46.040 about education. I worked for half a dozen years for 0:19:46.119 --> 0:19:49.880 one of the teachers' unions in Massachusetts, editing a statewide newspaper, 0:19:50.359 --> 0:19:52.440 and as a result of that, I got to visit 0:19:52.520 --> 0:19:55.640 all kinds of urban schools and became what some people 0:19:55.680 --> 0:19:58.800 would call obsessed with the issue. So I started a 0:19:58.840 --> 0:20:01.800 podcast and I are also the co authors of a 0:20:01.800 --> 0:20:04.880 book that's going to be coming out this fall called. 0:20:04.960 --> 0:20:08.879 A Wolf at the Schoolhouse Door. It's a pretty great title. 0:20:09.080 --> 0:20:10.359 So that's my story. 0:20:11.320 --> 0:20:19.600 That's a very great title. That's excellent, awesome. Okay, so 0:20:19.640 --> 0:20:23.119 thank you guys again for joining us. So one of 0:20:23.119 --> 0:20:26.080 the things that we wanted to ask you about sort 0:20:26.080 --> 0:20:28.720 of to start off with, was kind of the historical 0:20:29.000 --> 0:20:31.760 precedence of what we're seeing right now in terms of 0:20:31.800 --> 0:20:35.800 these massive school closures. Have we ever seen anything like 0:20:35.880 --> 0:20:39.360 this before, maybe during the nineteen eighteen influenza pandemic or 0:20:39.720 --> 0:20:42.280 other epidemics that have happened since then. 0:20:43.600 --> 0:20:47.200 Yeah, So, in nineteen eighteen, you're absolutely right, schools were 0:20:47.240 --> 0:20:50.919 closed all across America. In fact, they were closed across 0:20:50.920 --> 0:20:55.120 the world. And these closures ranged from a few weeks 0:20:55.280 --> 0:20:58.480 to a few months, maybe even longer. Records aren't great, 0:20:59.440 --> 0:21:03.720 and there was really no uniformity there. That's largely because 0:21:04.160 --> 0:21:06.840 school boards and local authorities were the ones who made 0:21:06.880 --> 0:21:11.040 the determination to close schools. One question that I had 0:21:11.080 --> 0:21:13.399 when Jennifer and I were researching this for one of 0:21:13.440 --> 0:21:18.360 our shows was did it work? And interestingly, scholars studied 0:21:18.359 --> 0:21:22.119 how forty three cities across the US responded to the 0:21:22.160 --> 0:21:25.040 so called Spanish flu and found that the cities that 0:21:25.119 --> 0:21:28.960 acted early to adopt non pharmaceutical interventions like school closures 0:21:29.320 --> 0:21:34.000 actually had a lower peak mortality and lower overall morbidity. 0:21:34.800 --> 0:21:39.760 That's fascinating and it also, I mean makes sense. And 0:21:39.960 --> 0:21:41.959 so you know, I want to shift a little bit 0:21:41.960 --> 0:21:44.399 to talking about the role of schools and how the 0:21:44.480 --> 0:21:47.159 role of schools now is much bigger than just a 0:21:47.200 --> 0:21:51.480 place to learn, just a place to become educated. So 0:21:52.359 --> 0:21:55.800 over the past fifty years this has changed substantially, and 0:21:55.880 --> 0:21:59.200 so now schools provide many services that go beyond just 0:21:59.240 --> 0:22:02.119 simply education. So can you talk a little bit about 0:22:02.160 --> 0:22:05.800 what some of those services are, and also can you 0:22:06.000 --> 0:22:10.600 address a little bit how this pandemic is revealing this 0:22:10.800 --> 0:22:13.240 the role of schools being more than just this place 0:22:13.240 --> 0:22:13.640 to learn. 0:22:14.720 --> 0:22:17.840 So you guys probably recall that in the sort of 0:22:17.880 --> 0:22:22.159 agonizing days leading up to these mass school closures, you know, 0:22:22.240 --> 0:22:25.879 you had all these big urban districts grappling with what 0:22:26.080 --> 0:22:28.439 to do about the fact that so many of their 0:22:28.440 --> 0:22:33.119 students rely on schools to eat basically, right, that we 0:22:33.200 --> 0:22:36.879 kept seeing the figure twenty two million students tossed around. 0:22:36.960 --> 0:22:39.200 It's probably even higher than that, but this is the 0:22:39.320 --> 0:22:42.840 number of kids who who get consume most of their 0:22:42.880 --> 0:22:45.640 calories at school. This is something that makes the US 0:22:45.840 --> 0:22:49.960 really different from other industrial countries that have more robust 0:22:50.040 --> 0:22:53.480 welfare programs. And basically what happened is that in the 0:22:53.560 --> 0:22:57.359 Johnson administration we made a pretty dramatic turn away from 0:22:57.400 --> 0:23:01.879 that path, and that instead of going more towards Northern 0:23:01.880 --> 0:23:05.120 European welfare state, we did something really different. We went 0:23:05.240 --> 0:23:08.359 all in for trying to solve poverty through the schools. 0:23:09.040 --> 0:23:12.480 And that's made to the extent that we have welfare programs, 0:23:12.480 --> 0:23:14.480 they're in and around the schools and made them more 0:23:14.520 --> 0:23:18.800 palatable for people who maybe don't approve of welfare programs otherwise. 0:23:19.440 --> 0:23:23.119 But it's put schools in this very weird position where 0:23:23.160 --> 0:23:27.080 they are essentially playing the role of the safety net. 0:23:27.280 --> 0:23:30.439 And so when suddenly something happens like a pandemic and 0:23:30.480 --> 0:23:33.359 we have to close schools down in mass we're left 0:23:33.440 --> 0:23:37.920 with this sort of social disaster where kids who rely 0:23:38.040 --> 0:23:40.879 on schools for food and counseling and all sorts of 0:23:40.920 --> 0:23:45.199 other services no longer have access to them. 0:23:45.520 --> 0:23:49.680 It's also important to think about the process of school 0:23:50.480 --> 0:23:55.800 and how schooling is really about far more than content delivery. 0:23:55.960 --> 0:24:01.359 So Jennifer was just talking about how, particularly for disadvantage students, 0:24:01.400 --> 0:24:06.240 access to basic necessities like food and medical services which 0:24:06.280 --> 0:24:10.040 many students receive through the schools, or language instruction which 0:24:10.040 --> 0:24:13.480 many students and their parents receive through the schools. In 0:24:13.480 --> 0:24:17.080 addition to these things, all students are getting a whole 0:24:17.119 --> 0:24:21.440 lot more from school than just basic instruction in core 0:24:21.520 --> 0:24:26.200 content areas. And I think that when school works, there's 0:24:26.480 --> 0:24:29.040 so much happening there that we really take for granted 0:24:29.080 --> 0:24:32.679 that we're beginning to recognize more now. I overheard a 0:24:32.680 --> 0:24:36.680 student say that right now, school for her is being 0:24:36.800 --> 0:24:40.280 passed through a sieve with all of the enjoyable parts 0:24:40.320 --> 0:24:45.080 filtered out. And if we think about an ordinary school 0:24:45.160 --> 0:24:48.639 day now compared with what young people are getting in 0:24:48.680 --> 0:24:53.440 the online hybrid homeschooling environment, we can think about all 0:24:53.480 --> 0:24:56.439 of these questions that we might ask about schools that 0:24:56.640 --> 0:25:00.560 ordinarily we don't like. Do kids feel cared for? Are 0:25:00.560 --> 0:25:03.520 they happy? Are they motivated? Are they trying? Do they 0:25:03.560 --> 0:25:06.280