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Speaker 2: It's very difficult to keep the line between the past.

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Speaker 5: And the PRIs you believe that someone out of the

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Speaker 5: past can enter and take possession of a living.

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Speaker 1: We may be through with the past, but the past

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Speaker 1: is not through with us.

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Speaker 6: Welcome back to the next picture show A movie the

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Speaker 6: Week podcast devoted to a classic film in the way

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Speaker 6: it shaped our thoughts in a recent release, I'm Scott

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Speaker 6: Tobias here again with Genevievekowski and Keith Tups. Tasha Robinson

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Speaker 6: is off somewhere hating on Wally Brando, which she'll be

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Speaker 6: back soon. On the first half of this episode, we

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Speaker 6: looked at Babe Chris Noonan and George Miller's sweet storybik

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Speaker 6: Fantasy about a runty pig who makes himself useful as

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Speaker 6: a sheepdog. Now we turn to the new Netflix's original

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Speaker 6: film Okja from Bong June Ho, the gifted Korean director

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Speaker 6: of the Host and snow piercer in stark contrast to Babe,

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Speaker 6: Oakja is Gigantic, a hippo sized super pig that's been

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Speaker 6: genetically designed by a giant corporation to serve as a

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Speaker 6: delicious source of jerky and other pork products. Oakja is

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Speaker 6: the most spectacular of the twenty six super pigs raised

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Speaker 6: in various locations around the world, and the head of

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Speaker 6: the company, played by Tilda Swinton, wants to take it

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Speaker 6: from the Korean mountains where it was raised to New

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Speaker 6: York City. But Mejia, the fourteen year old girl who's

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Speaker 6: been Oakja's closest companion all these years, has other ideas.

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Speaker 6: She goes on an adventure to bring Oakja back home,

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Speaker 6: which brings her up against Swinton and her minions, as

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Speaker 6: well as a radical environmental group led by Paul Dano

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Speaker 6: that wants to make an audacious point about animal abuse.

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Speaker 6: Oakja resembles the Host in many respects. Both are films

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Speaker 6: about supernatural creatures born of American disregard for nature, but

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Speaker 6: the film is its own strange animal, combining fantasy, corporate's

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Speaker 6: attire and a surprising number of fa Wow, we'll talk

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Speaker 6: about Oakja and how it relates to Babe.

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Speaker 5: After the break.

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Speaker 7: Last week, we sent the twenty six superpiglets to the

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Speaker 7: twenty six countries.

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Speaker 8: Where the Miranda offices are located. Each one was given

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Speaker 8: to an esteemed local farmer. I am asked each farmer

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Speaker 8: to raise their special.

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Speaker 7: Guest, honoring traditional techniques unique to their respective cultures. My

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Speaker 7: top scientists in the Miranda Branch offices will be on

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Speaker 7: hand to offer whatever support is required.

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Speaker 9: These little piggies will be the ancestors.

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Speaker 8: Of the whole new species.

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Speaker 7: Mama Nature's gift a revolution in the livestock industry.

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Speaker 8: But now we have a competition.

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Speaker 5: So Okja, what an odd movie? What did you all

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Speaker 5: think of it? Genevieve, odd is a.

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Speaker 10: Good word for it. I was really looking forward to Okja,

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Speaker 10: and maybe I got my expectations a little too high

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Speaker 10: because I enjoyed it, but I ran into the problem

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Speaker 10: that I've run into with Bong's previous films that I've

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Speaker 10: seen snow Piercer in the Host, which is that, like

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Speaker 10: the tone is just kind of a hard nut to crack,

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Speaker 10: and I want to like it. I want to like

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Speaker 10: like the tonal mix, but it kind of prevents me

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Speaker 10: from emotionally engaging with the film to the extent that I.

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Speaker 5: Would like to.

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Speaker 10: And I think that was less of a problem for

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Speaker 10: me with both snow Piercer and The Host, because I

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Speaker 10: think that those films are doing something that is less

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Speaker 10: reliant on an emotional connection. But I think that the

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Speaker 10: satirical point that Oakcha is revolving around is one that

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Speaker 10: is really couched in emotion. And your emotional connection to

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Speaker 10: this animal and the girl who loves that animal, and

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Speaker 10: the kind of whiplashing tonal style of the film I

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Speaker 10: think kind of prevented me from feeling that emotion to

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Speaker 10: the extent I probably needed to to love this movie.

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Speaker 5: What about You, Keith, I was into it.

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Speaker 11: I think it helped to have seen Bong films in

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Speaker 11: the past. In some ways, this is most approachable film.

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Speaker 11: It's certainly I think it's probably the film that will

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Speaker 11: be seen by the most number of people, but already,

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Speaker 11: but it already it kind of feels like an advanced

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Speaker 11: study for for for for Bong. But no, I've really

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Speaker 11: enjoyed it, and I don't know that the tone was

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Speaker 11: felt all over the place. It just felt complex to me.

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Speaker 11: I feel like we started with it from a fairly

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Speaker 11: dark place.

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Speaker 10: We start from a very slapstick place, I think, with

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Speaker 10: the Tolda Swinton's character like kind of introducing the whole concept.

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Speaker 11: Yeah right, but I think I think there's sinister undertones

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Speaker 11: there from from the beginning. I think we get those

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Speaker 11: wonderful scenes of Misia and Oaksha bonding and which you know,

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Speaker 11: gets you into this relationship, and then it kind of

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Speaker 11: returns to darker places, or returns to places that were

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Speaker 11: perhaps the darkness wasn't quite as evident before. It worked

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Speaker 11: for me. It is an odd mix of elements and

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Speaker 11: performance styles, which I'm sure we'll get food into, but

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Speaker 11: I was there for the right and I actually I

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Speaker 11: found it quite affecting by the end. The slaughterhouse scenes

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Speaker 11: and the Daniu mont was such a lovely contrast. And

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Speaker 11: I'm sure we'll goodness as well. But I thought the

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Speaker 11: super pig creations were really masterfully made and emotionally moving,

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Speaker 11: in large part because they're so animal like. These are

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Speaker 11: super pigs in the sense that they are genetically engineered,

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Speaker 11: as you say, hippo sized pigs, but theyre behave very

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Speaker 11: much like real animals.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, it's does cry. She does cry.

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Speaker 6: Though Okay, tone is obviously the big thing here, and

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Speaker 6: this gets me into the entire history of Bunging Host films,

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Speaker 6: which I just wrote about for The New York Times

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Speaker 6: as watching section, because five of his six films are

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Speaker 6: available streaming right now for free much which one was

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Speaker 6: not the best one, Memories of Murder, that's but I

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Speaker 6: mean Memories of Murder is a perfect example. I mean,

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Speaker 6: Memories of Murder is a very dark film about Korea's

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Speaker 6: first serial killer, but it's also a low browse lapstick comedy,

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Speaker 6: and those two elements exist side by side. And if

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Speaker 6: you think about something like The Host, you know, there's

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Speaker 6: a scene in The Host where a family is grieving

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Speaker 6: over a loved one who's been lost, and it starts

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Speaker 6: with almost this this sort of tragic sad tone and

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Speaker 6: then ends with them sort of wriggling on the floor comically.

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Speaker 6: And that's that is not just exclusive to Bong. That

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Speaker 6: is the Korean touch to to allow this tone to

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Speaker 6: just completely lurch back and forth and for you to

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Speaker 6: just roll with it, you know. And that's not to

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Speaker 6: excuse Okja Oak's flaws or claim as a perfect film,

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Speaker 6: which I would not. I would not in the Bong filmography.

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Speaker 6: I would not put it near the top at all

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Speaker 6: for a lot of the reasons that you mentioned, Genevieve,

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Speaker 6: But I find that there's been kind of an interesting,

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Speaker 6: almost Kurrasawa like attempt on Bong's part to reconcile his

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Speaker 6: national cinema, at least in New Korean cinema with Hollywood

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Speaker 6: and with the Spielbergian touch oftentimes. I mean that if

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Speaker 6: you're talking about like one major American influence on Bob,

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Speaker 6: it would be Spielberg.

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Speaker 5: You know.

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Speaker 6: So you have this director who very much appreciates effects driven,

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Speaker 6: family oriented to an extent, fantastical, you know, filmmaking, with

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Speaker 6: a lot of nice reaction shots of people's eyes and

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Speaker 6: extraordinary daylight special effects. Me all that is there in

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Speaker 6: this movie. So I just I think, I mean, it

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Speaker 6: is not a perfect film, is. It is a rambling,

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Speaker 6: shambling ride of a movie, even more so than his

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Speaker 6: other films for me, But I kind of appreciated that

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Speaker 6: quality about it and kind of liked that sense of

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Speaker 6: what the hell is going to happen next. It's a

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Speaker 6: very surprising movie, and for that I really appreciate it.

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Speaker 10: Again, I don't want to overstate my issues with this film,

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Speaker 10: which I did generally enjoy, Nor do I want to

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Speaker 10: understate my understanding of South Korean cinema and the paradigm

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Speaker 10: within that he is working within. The mix of tonal

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Speaker 10: styles is definitely a feature, not a bug. I just

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Speaker 10: don't know that it's like a feature that I wanted

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Speaker 10: in this particular story. I really loved it in the

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Speaker 10: Host and kind of in Snow Piercer, but here just

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Speaker 10: it didn't work for me more than it did work

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Speaker 10: for me.

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Speaker 6: I could see that for sure, and I you know,

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Speaker 6: and it's more disorienting than Snow Piercer tonally for me,

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Speaker 6: and certainly Mother Mother is actually pretty I mean, I

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Speaker 6: guess is straightforward a film as he's made, and a

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Speaker 6: really wonderful movie if you haven't.

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Speaker 5: Seen that one.

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Speaker 6: But yeah, but it's it's odd too, it is, and

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Speaker 6: it's that one is about mother whose sort of special

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Speaker 6: needs son is accused of murder and who kind of

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Speaker 6: goes out of her way to exonerate him of this crime.

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Speaker 6: And that movie he certainly goes to some dark and

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Speaker 6: discomforting places.

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Speaker 5: But I just I really like just being in.

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Speaker 6: The space of a Bong production just because they're so unpredictable,

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Speaker 6: you know, and anything can happen, and he's he's very

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Speaker 6: accomplished technically to given them the resources that he's been

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Speaker 6: given here, which are significant but modest compared to Holly's

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Speaker 6: significant What was it fifty million, sixty million in this production?

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Speaker 11: Yeah, I would say so. I mean it's the point

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Speaker 11: of things like that chase scene. I mean, chasing is

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Speaker 11: really a centerpiece of the film, but it is obviously

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Speaker 11: it's it's going to be storyboarding and choreographed, but it

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Speaker 11: looks like, you know, a super pig cutting loose in.

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Speaker 5: An underground mall and it's and it's amazing.

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Speaker 10: There's a studied sloppiness to it, you know, like just

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Speaker 10: the way that the camera moves and like how you

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Speaker 10: you sort of see certain things but sort of miss ours.

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Speaker 10: And there's just like wonderful little touches wo went throughout it,

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Speaker 10: Like I love the girl taking a selfie video of

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Speaker 10: being chased by this super pig, and like just the

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Speaker 10: express sit on her face, the way it fluctuates between

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Speaker 10: terror and posing for the camera, Like it's such a

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Speaker 10: wonderful just a little grace note in a sequence. It's

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Speaker 10: full of those.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, and you can think of like a touch like

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Speaker 6: that being so similar to like Spielberg shooting the approach

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Speaker 6: of the dinosaur through that you know, objects and mirror

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Speaker 6: closer than they appear, so you know, he's definitely a

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Speaker 6: good student. And really, my favorite moment in the whole movie,

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Speaker 6: and maybe my favorite moment in any movie I've seen

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Speaker 6: this year, is at the end of this scene where

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Speaker 6: suddenly this John Denver song kicks in.

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Speaker 5: It's any song? Is that the name of it? Yes?

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Speaker 6: Oh my god, It's so beautiful. It's so touching and

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Speaker 6: again weird and unexpected at the same time. And you

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Speaker 6: get this great close up on Paul Dano's face. You know,

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Speaker 6: this animal has been injured, and like in this frantic moment,

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Speaker 6: he is really focused on that and is affected by

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Speaker 6: it in a very sincere way. I thought that was great.

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Speaker 6: It's just something nobody else would really think to do.

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Speaker 6: It's fun that it's out there for people to watch.

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Speaker 5: For for free. I guess if they have Netflix.

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Speaker 11: This is really the first time I felt myself thinking, well,

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Speaker 11: I can't wait until list on Netflix. I can watch it.

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Speaker 11: First time I really felt like a real anticipation for

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Speaker 11: something that was going to premiere on Netflix at the

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Speaker 11: same time. There really wasn't a moment when I didn't

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Speaker 11: wish I was watching this on the big screen. I

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Speaker 11: know it's playing on thirty five millimeter at the New

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Speaker 11: Beverly in Los Angeles, and it's screened some places, but

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Speaker 11: you know, we live in Chicago and there's no way to.

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Speaker 5: See this on the big screen.

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Speaker 11: It's a movie that I always feel like you should

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Speaker 11: see on the big screen. Is kind of a cliche.

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Speaker 11: I mean, I've certainly had very powerful movie experiences watching

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Speaker 11: movies at home, but you know, given the choice, I'd

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Speaker 11: always have to see things on the big screen. And

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Speaker 11: we don't have it with this one. We do not

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Speaker 11: We do not know a new film for a major director,

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Speaker 11: and it's not really playing theaters.

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Speaker 10: Yeah, but as you point it out, it's probably going

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Speaker 10: to be seen by more people than any of that

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Speaker 10: director's other films, So yeah, I know worthy trade off.

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Speaker 6: You know, maybe if you're something des Moins might always

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Speaker 6: go to example uh and UH don't have access to

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Speaker 6: these types of films. Maybe you're struck by how strange

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Speaker 6: it is and inspires you to see more films by

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Speaker 6: him and which are available and other stuff you haven't

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Speaker 6: seen before.

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Speaker 11: I'm just trying to You're right, I mean, I'm always

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Speaker 11: I'm always a fan of anything that democratizes really great

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Speaker 11: pieces of filmmaking or anything. I mean, for all the

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Speaker 11: pros and cons of Borders and Barnes and Noble like

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Speaker 11: you could you could walk into the middle of a

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Speaker 11: small town and let's sa a good wine or not.

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Speaker 11: We're smaller towns ahead of Borders, and you could pick

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Speaker 11: up a copy of Ulysses if you wanted to have

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Speaker 11: important Iowa Blockbuster are the same thing, and maybe that's

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Speaker 11: the best selection. But you know, you can certainly get

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Speaker 11: started down a road of watching interesting movies at a blockbustertainly.

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Speaker 5: See The Rapids for example, Sure, Rapids. So I was

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Speaker 5: a very.

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Speaker 6: Cultured save I know, I just I don't know why

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Speaker 6: I was always going to go to example of people.

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Speaker 11: Who let's say a suburb of Dayton, Ohio, a hick

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Speaker 11: suburb of Dateton, Ohio.

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Speaker 5: What's the name of that, to Englewood where Heith is

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Speaker 5: born group.

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Speaker 11: I mean, that's part of my story.

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Speaker 6: But this isn't my podcast, this isn't your podcast. So

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Speaker 6: let me make one more argument in Netflix's favor here.

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Speaker 6: There are two really big productions recently, this film in

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Speaker 6: War Machine, which is less successful than Oakcha, but similarly unclassifiable,

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Speaker 6: not quite a sattire, you know, not quite a historical document.

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Speaker 6: It doesn't really work completely well, but it is the

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Speaker 6: sort of thing that you can't put it in a

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Speaker 6: box that Hollywood would never go out of its way

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Speaker 6: to finance for that for that reason, and make.

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Speaker 10: A misleading trailer about to get people in the field.

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Speaker 11: Like what if you made a horror movie that wasn't

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Speaker 11: really quite a horror movie and had an odd ending

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Speaker 11: people unsatisfied.

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Speaker 5: I mean, that might that might fit on Netflix. But

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Speaker 5: if you're.

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Speaker 6: Running a conventional Hollywood studio, are you really going to

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Speaker 6: accept Oakja as it is with Because this is a

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Speaker 6: film that is what appear to be for children about

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Speaker 6: the relationship between a girl and her super pig.

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Speaker 11: It's really not.

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Speaker 5: I mean, it doesn't turn into that, but I think

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Speaker 5: you could It could be.

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Speaker 6: Sold as that, right sure, sure, and it has elements

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Speaker 6: of that before things kind of go haywire. But then

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Speaker 6: it's got all sorts of f bombs and and disturbing

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Speaker 6: slaughterhouse sequences, and it takes you to those places, and

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Speaker 6: so I I'm you know, as flawed as it might be,

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Speaker 6: and as really flawed as war Machine is, I am

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Speaker 6: grateful that there seems to exist this studio, this strange

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Speaker 6: little streaming studio that that is willing to bank rope

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Speaker 6: productions that don't really fit anywhere else.

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Speaker 11: For all my protestations, it's it's probably the future. And

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Speaker 11: I think I think everyone's going to be very happy

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Speaker 11: when the next Martin Scorsese movie comes out.

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Speaker 5: On no, no, no, Okay, now you've gone too far,

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Speaker 5: you've gone too far.

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Speaker 11: Not to get too far afield. But I mean, how

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Speaker 11: Scorsas movies will fall into that same category of difficulty

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Speaker 11: classify financial risks? What if you made a movie about priests?

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Speaker 7: Yeah?

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Speaker 10: I was actually just gonna say, what if Silence had

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Speaker 10: been a Netflix exclusive and people had seen it would

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Speaker 10: have had been a less wonderful film.

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Speaker 6: It would have been really depressing. I saw that movie

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Speaker 6: twice in the theater.

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Speaker 5: I can't.

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Speaker 6: Yeah, this is all this is all too much for

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Speaker 6: me to handle it right now. I thought experts are fun,

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Speaker 6: and I know it wasn't. It wasn't like late next

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Speaker 6: film is supposed to be, is it Netflix. Oh yeah, okay,

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Speaker 6: I'll get used to it. I've had months to get

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Speaker 6: used to it. But let's go back to the actual

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Speaker 6: film Oka. Where does everyone stand? If you talk about

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Speaker 6: you know there there are a lot of performances competing

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Speaker 6: for our in this In this movie, there's till This Swinton,

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Speaker 6: there is uh, well, there's Jake gelen Hall. Where are

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Speaker 6: we at on Jake gelen Hall's performance in this movie?

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Speaker 11: That was fun? I mean I thought it was. It

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Speaker 11: was kind of Jake gelen Hall doing Jack Hannah Cross

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Speaker 11: with Jeans Shallatte Cross with Richard Simmons, and it's a big, broad,

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Speaker 11: silly performance. But when it got to the darker sort of,

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Speaker 11: you know, more statistic side of that character, it followed

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Speaker 11: logically for me, this.

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Speaker 9: Is speakable place.

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Speaker 12: I know, I know.

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Speaker 8: There are worse rooms out there. Lucy Mirando says, I'm.

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Speaker 5: Not supposed to harm you in here, at least not physically.

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Speaker 9: She wants you perfect her big telecast. But what a

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Speaker 9: woman humiliates a man in front of his own columns

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Speaker 9: on there?

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Speaker 2: Is it kind to make.

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Speaker 12: His own decisions?

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Speaker 5: I think less?

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Speaker 10: So yeah, it is, and it's not. I didn't hate it.

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Speaker 10: It's not a performance I hate it. It's a very

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Speaker 10: showy performance, obviously, and it's a performance that aligns with

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Speaker 10: the character, but I think ultimately kind of detracts from

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Speaker 10: that character's arc, which I think is I think that

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Speaker 10: the Jake Gillenhall character and the Paul Dano character are

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Speaker 10: sort of mirrors of each other, and their performances really

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Speaker 10: reflect that. Mirrors reflect you get it. Paul Daniel's performance

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Speaker 10: is so sincere, I think is the word you used

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Speaker 10: to describe that character, and it is not flashy in

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Speaker 10: the way that jillen Hell's performance is. But I mean

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Speaker 10: those characters are both animal lovers who have gone astray

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Speaker 10: in some way or another. Obviously, gillen Hell's character, to

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Speaker 10: a buch grosser extreme and it's kind of ruined him

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Speaker 10: as a person. But I mean the arc of that

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Speaker 10: character is that he is a naturalist of some sort

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Speaker 10: who has ended up in bed with corporate farming interests

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Speaker 10: and it has eaten him up inside and turned him

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Speaker 10: into kind of a monster. And I really like that

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Speaker 10: character arc, and I think that jilln Hall's performance, while

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Speaker 10: expressing that character arc, ultimately kind of detracts from the

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Speaker 10: impact of it. It kind of. It just goes back

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Speaker 10: to my issues with the tone of this movie that

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Speaker 10: I think, while I respect the oddness of it, I

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Speaker 10: think it ultimately takes away from a lot of my

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Speaker 10: emotional connection to the characters and the story.

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Speaker 6: Well, and if you think, if you one, I mean

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Speaker 6: I'm a fan of it too, because again I'm fine

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Speaker 6: with the film kind of jerking me around a little bit.

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Speaker 6: But in contrast, Paul danel in that whole element of

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Speaker 6: the film is interesting because of it is an agenda

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Speaker 6: that is a sincere agenda, and people who are committed

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Speaker 6: to animal rights and committed to exposing animal abuse, but

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Speaker 6: who wind up having an agenda that is not media's agenda,

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Speaker 6: and not an agenda that's about returning things to their

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Speaker 6: natural state or this or their unnatural natural state. I

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Speaker 6: guess since this is a genetically enhanced creature, they defy

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Speaker 6: her wishes in order to pursue their own agenda, which

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Speaker 6: makes them, you know, share a little bit more in

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Speaker 6: common with tild This Witnen and her gang, then you

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Speaker 6: might think.

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Speaker 11: I think also for all the ore touches that most

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Speaker 11: people maybe bring to their performances, the actress plane Mesia

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Speaker 11: Antio human and Oakcha herself are so grounded and they

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Speaker 11: kind of give it a still center in a way,

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Speaker 11: and that that grounds some of the madness.

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Speaker 5: Going on around them.

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Speaker 10: Yeah, I mean, grounding it is one way to look

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Speaker 10: at it. Being overshadowed by it is another. And I

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Speaker 10: think that's just your mileage maybe everything. But I mean,

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Speaker 10: like those scenes of Mejia and Oakja are my favorites,

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Speaker 10: you know, and they do have that resonance that I

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Speaker 10: feel is missing from a lot of the other aspects

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Speaker 10: of this film. I slightly resents the fact that when

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Speaker 10: I think of Oakcha, the first image that springs to

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Speaker 10: mind is Jake Gillenhall screaming in a funny voice, and

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Speaker 10: not that beautiful connection between Oakcha and Mesha.

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Speaker 5: I did sort of or.

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Speaker 10: Till the Swinton with a funny haircut, you know, either

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Speaker 10: of those.

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Speaker 5: Hats.

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Speaker 6: I did anticipate, you know, the movie being a different

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Speaker 6: movie than it ended up happening, just from those that

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Speaker 6: early sequence with Mesia and Oakcha running around and uh

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Speaker 6: being free, and then I mean you could you could

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Speaker 6: picture this different movie that's just about them and the

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Speaker 6: father and and and nothing else.

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Speaker 10: Has a studio Ghibli movie.

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Speaker 6: Happens right a studio a studio ghibli movie where they

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Speaker 6: go on little adventures and uh and you know, and

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Speaker 6: there's something great about too about Another little favorite moment

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Speaker 6: in the movie is when the father is asked what

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Speaker 6: they did to make this super pig so incredible, and

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Speaker 6: the philosopher.

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Speaker 5: Was, we just let it run around. I love that

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Speaker 5: if you want to.

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Speaker 6: Just attribute to just a very natural way of doing things. Though,

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Speaker 6: even though again this is not a natural creature by

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Speaker 6: any stretch, you know, it celebrates that way of life

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Speaker 6: and much the way that Babe does. So perhaps maybe

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Speaker 6: now's the time to go to connections. So we'll be

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Speaker 6: right back for that after the break.

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438
00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:55,520
Speaker 3: That's money you keep for you and your family. Because

439
00:22:55,560 --> 00:22:58,520
Speaker 3: a friend always has your back, Shame Company, your friend

440
00:22:58,560 --> 00:22:59,080
Speaker 3: and jeweler.

441
00:23:05,040 --> 00:23:08,800
Speaker 12: Oh, Johnny, if you're skating on thin ice, watch how

442
00:23:08,880 --> 00:23:10,000
Speaker 12: you don't fall in and brown.

443
00:23:10,640 --> 00:23:11,360
Speaker 8: Don't worry.

444
00:23:11,520 --> 00:23:13,119
Speaker 12: I'm not here to put you to sleep with some

445
00:23:13,400 --> 00:23:15,679
Speaker 12: corporate speech like my boring sister might have.

446
00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:27,200
Speaker 8: Nope, I'm here to introduce you to.

447
00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:28,600
Speaker 2: A real superstar.

448
00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:33,040
Speaker 12: Maybe you've already seen her on YouTube enjoying her little

449
00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:38,000
Speaker 12: shopping spree in that underground ball and so so let's

450
00:23:38,160 --> 00:23:41,440
Speaker 12: all welcome an extraordinary.

451
00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:43,040
Speaker 8: Little girl, a local farmer.

452
00:23:42,720 --> 00:23:46,520
Speaker 12: Who raised her beloved super big in Wild and the

453
00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:52,120
Speaker 12: Beautiful Nature, the fearless big writer from across the globe.

454
00:23:52,760 --> 00:23:55,439
Speaker 4: Please welcome mit ya.

455
00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:00,400
Speaker 6: Now it's time for connections, when we bring these two

456
00:24:00,400 --> 00:24:03,199
Speaker 6: films together and talk about the things they have in common,

457
00:24:03,400 --> 00:24:06,200
Speaker 6: Babe and Oakja. One thing we could start with, I

458
00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:10,359
Speaker 6: guess is how both films reveal how we engage with

459
00:24:10,480 --> 00:24:15,960
Speaker 6: animals and promote certain maybe vegetarianism or a consciousness about.

460
00:24:15,760 --> 00:24:16,280
Speaker 5: How we eat.

461
00:24:16,640 --> 00:24:18,959
Speaker 10: Yeah, I mean, I think Oakjah in particular is much

462
00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:22,960
Speaker 10: more strident in its messaging around the consumption of meat.

463
00:24:23,080 --> 00:24:26,360
Speaker 10: Babe definitely touches on it, but is a little more

464
00:24:26,400 --> 00:24:28,920
Speaker 10: in the camp of like, this is how things work,

465
00:24:29,040 --> 00:24:31,159
Speaker 10: you know, and we should be respectful of it. But

466
00:24:31,200 --> 00:24:34,600
Speaker 10: it's the way that things work. Whereas Oakja is really

467
00:24:34,600 --> 00:24:38,840
Speaker 10: engaging not so much, I think, with eating meat entirely,

468
00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:42,639
Speaker 10: but particularly with factory farming, and the eating meat is

469
00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:47,600
Speaker 10: what sustains this harmful system of factory farming. What I

470
00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:52,479
Speaker 10: really like about Babe's approach in particular is the acknowledgment that,

471
00:24:52,640 --> 00:24:55,840
Speaker 10: like how you engage with it animal is all about

472
00:24:55,880 --> 00:25:00,600
Speaker 10: the context. It's not about that specific animal or animals generally.

473
00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:03,640
Speaker 10: You can have animals as pets, you can have animals

474
00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:07,720
Speaker 10: as working animals, you can eat animals, and there's no

475
00:25:08,000 --> 00:25:12,080
Speaker 10: universality of like this is what animals are for and

476
00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:13,679
Speaker 10: this is how we should treat them. It's like we

477
00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:16,160
Speaker 10: treat them based on the context in which we are

478
00:25:16,200 --> 00:25:17,400
Speaker 10: engaging with these animals.

479
00:25:17,840 --> 00:25:20,639
Speaker 11: Yeah, I thought Babe would create a whole generation of

480
00:25:20,800 --> 00:25:23,720
Speaker 11: vegetarian kind of I think probably has had that influence

481
00:25:23,760 --> 00:25:24,720
Speaker 11: in some in some quarters.

482
00:25:24,720 --> 00:25:26,080
Speaker 10: But you do what you're just saying during the break

483
00:25:26,119 --> 00:25:28,119
Speaker 10: that it made Cromwell a vegetarian.

484
00:25:28,160 --> 00:25:29,040
Speaker 5: Yeah, well, I.

485
00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:31,880
Speaker 11: Bring in some extra textuals. Cromo did become a vegetarian

486
00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:34,040
Speaker 11: after making Babe, because he felt like he couldn't honestly

487
00:25:34,080 --> 00:25:36,560
Speaker 11: represent the film without becoming a vegetarian. And you listen

488
00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:38,680
Speaker 11: to the audio commentary and Miller is a little more

489
00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:41,679
Speaker 11: where you're coming from Genevie, which is basically, you know

490
00:25:41,680 --> 00:25:43,600
Speaker 11: you could eat animals, but you need to be aware

491
00:25:43,640 --> 00:25:46,400
Speaker 11: and respectful of what it is. And I'm not sure

492
00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:49,080
Speaker 11: where Oak just coming from. I think, you know, the

493
00:25:49,440 --> 00:25:52,080
Speaker 11: Animal Liberation Front or ALPH it seems very much on

494
00:25:52,119 --> 00:25:55,159
Speaker 11: their side. They're not a perfect vessel for the message.

495
00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:57,639
Speaker 11: They make mistakes and there, and they're deceptive, but there

496
00:25:57,680 --> 00:26:00,720
Speaker 11: is that long post credit sequence kind of like setting

497
00:26:00,760 --> 00:26:03,560
Speaker 11: it up for the further adventures of the Animal Liberation Front,

498
00:26:03,720 --> 00:26:07,960
Speaker 11: and it seemed pretty on their side at the very

499
00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:11,400
Speaker 11: least against factory farming and as you say, the situation

500
00:26:11,480 --> 00:26:14,919
Speaker 11: that creates and for all the horrors we witness in

501
00:26:14,960 --> 00:26:18,679
Speaker 11: the slaughterhouse here, there really are just literally what happens

502
00:26:18,680 --> 00:26:20,879
Speaker 11: in a slaughterhouse on a bigger scale. And it's kind

503
00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:22,960
Speaker 11: of hard enough to think about that. Watching this film,

504
00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:26,240
Speaker 11: it didn't make me give up eating meat, which I

505
00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:27,879
Speaker 11: was vegetarian for a long period and I'm not a

506
00:26:27,920 --> 00:26:30,320
Speaker 11: vegetarian now. And there might be someday, but this was

507
00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:32,160
Speaker 11: a movie that pushed me over the top. It certainly

508
00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:33,719
Speaker 11: got me thinking about that.

509
00:26:33,800 --> 00:26:34,080
Speaker 5: Again.

510
00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:38,720
Speaker 6: I can't necessarily fault Oakshaw for being stride, because I

511
00:26:38,760 --> 00:26:41,240
Speaker 6: think it is, you know, a satire, among other things,

512
00:26:41,280 --> 00:26:43,840
Speaker 6: and it has as satires, they do have a certain

513
00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:47,080
Speaker 6: point that they're trying to make, and it's a nuanced

514
00:26:47,160 --> 00:26:50,200
Speaker 6: point because I don't think you come to the conclusion

515
00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:53,040
Speaker 6: watching the film that we mustn't eat meat, though, I

516
00:26:53,040 --> 00:26:55,160
Speaker 6: think we can be aware not just of the way

517
00:26:55,240 --> 00:26:58,720
Speaker 6: animals are processed, by the way food period is processed,

518
00:26:58,840 --> 00:27:00,760
Speaker 6: you know, in an in terms of babe, but we

519
00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:04,919
Speaker 6: can see that contrast between an ordinary farm or what

520
00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:07,960
Speaker 6: would be ordinary if the animals weren't talking to each

521
00:27:07,960 --> 00:27:09,439
Speaker 6: other and behaving your weird ways.

522
00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:12,120
Speaker 10: But animals talking probably don't.

523
00:27:11,920 --> 00:27:14,840
Speaker 5: Eat it, just go there, yeah, right, So.

524
00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:19,280
Speaker 6: Yeah, you know, you could see them doing things that

525
00:27:19,400 --> 00:27:22,040
Speaker 6: you know, the Hoggets are doing things the right way,

526
00:27:22,960 --> 00:27:26,440
Speaker 6: in a responsible way, and in a very old fashioned way.

527
00:27:26,480 --> 00:27:28,480
Speaker 6: I mean, when you think about farms now, they're not

528
00:27:28,520 --> 00:27:30,119
Speaker 6: the same. I mean that you know that you have

529
00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:32,919
Speaker 6: companies that own vast swaths of land or or you know,

530
00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 6: harvest fish or pigs or what have you in large facilities,

531
00:27:37,880 --> 00:27:41,080
Speaker 6: specifically to develop them into food that is going to

532
00:27:41,119 --> 00:27:43,400
Speaker 6: appear in your grocery store. So to be a little

533
00:27:43,400 --> 00:27:46,040
Speaker 6: more conscious of that that. I was happy with that

534
00:27:46,040 --> 00:27:48,720
Speaker 6: message and kind of pleased in this context with the

535
00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:52,320
Speaker 6: contrast between Oakcha and Babe about how.

536
00:27:52,200 --> 00:27:53,119
Speaker 5: We get our food.

537
00:27:53,440 --> 00:27:56,280
Speaker 10: Here's my thing. There's like a lot of arguments you

538
00:27:56,320 --> 00:27:59,680
Speaker 10: can make against eating meat, generally in factory farming, and

539
00:28:00,440 --> 00:28:02,560
Speaker 10: there are a lot of approaches you can take to

540
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:05,920
Speaker 10: that argument, but I think they kind of divide into

541
00:28:05,960 --> 00:28:08,560
Speaker 10: the emotional approach and the sort of logical approach, Like

542
00:28:08,600 --> 00:28:12,399
Speaker 10: you can make it a very convincing argument against eating

543
00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:14,760
Speaker 10: meat based entirely on climate change and the effect that

544
00:28:14,800 --> 00:28:18,600
Speaker 10: eating meat has on our planet, and that can also

545
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:22,840
Speaker 10: be very convincing. But the tac Okja chooses to take

546
00:28:23,000 --> 00:28:26,439
Speaker 10: is the emotional one, which is that isn't it terrible

547
00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:29,280
Speaker 10: that we eat animals and how animals are treated, and

548
00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:32,800
Speaker 10: isn't that sad? Isn't that upsetting? And that is a

549
00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:36,679
Speaker 10: very effective argument to make, and depending on the person,

550
00:28:36,840 --> 00:28:39,920
Speaker 10: it is the only argument to make. But going back

551
00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:42,120
Speaker 10: to I was saying earlier in this episode about like

552
00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:45,080
Speaker 10: missing that emotional connection with Okja. I think that is

553
00:28:45,120 --> 00:28:49,040
Speaker 10: sort of the fatal flaw in the argument or the

554
00:28:49,160 --> 00:28:51,800
Speaker 10: attire that Oakja is making is that it is trading

555
00:28:51,840 --> 00:28:56,479
Speaker 10: on this emotional connection to how animals are treated and

556
00:28:56,520 --> 00:29:00,320
Speaker 10: the whatever the animal equivalent of humanity is. But the

557
00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:03,680
Speaker 10: for me anyway, the tone of the film doesn't really

558
00:29:03,760 --> 00:29:04,400
Speaker 10: support that.

559
00:29:04,960 --> 00:29:06,840
Speaker 5: Even at the end.

560
00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:09,160
Speaker 10: I mean, they're all very cute. It's also not real

561
00:29:09,280 --> 00:29:11,760
Speaker 10: going back to what we were saying about Cgi, you know,

562
00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:13,920
Speaker 10: but like it all goes back to what I was

563
00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:16,680
Speaker 10: saying about just the context with which she engaged in animals.

564
00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:19,200
Speaker 10: Like we're sitting here with my dog Hugo, who I

565
00:29:19,240 --> 00:29:21,400
Speaker 10: love and treat like a child. He is my pet

566
00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:24,600
Speaker 10: in a different context if he was a working dog

567
00:29:24,680 --> 00:29:27,080
Speaker 10: and I was depending on him from my livelihood, Like

568
00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:31,640
Speaker 10: our relationship would be very different if if this was

569
00:29:31,680 --> 00:29:34,320
Speaker 10: the apocalypse and I was starving and Hugo wasn't my

570
00:29:34,920 --> 00:29:37,600
Speaker 10: longtime pet and we didn't live in a society where

571
00:29:37,640 --> 00:29:40,320
Speaker 10: eating dogs is frowned upon, I might consider eating him.

572
00:29:41,080 --> 00:29:45,200
Speaker 10: I'm sorry, Hugo, It's true that that too, you know.

573
00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:50,520
Speaker 10: So like applying an emotional logic to just how we

574
00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:54,840
Speaker 10: engage with animals universally. I think is fundamentally flawed in

575
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:57,920
Speaker 10: that regard because it's all about the context.

576
00:29:58,000 --> 00:29:58,240
Speaker 5: Man.

577
00:29:58,680 --> 00:30:01,600
Speaker 10: Yeah, a I love my dog. I'm not going to

578
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:02,040
Speaker 10: eat my dog.

579
00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:05,920
Speaker 6: Yeah, I want to focus more on Genevieve eating her dog.

580
00:30:06,360 --> 00:30:08,160
Speaker 6: You just went to such a dark place so fast,

581
00:30:08,400 --> 00:30:13,560
Speaker 6: very very long. Like ave to go off on that amountologue,

582
00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:16,120
Speaker 6: but it's a really good point. I mean a lot

583
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:19,680
Speaker 6: of this discussion, this comparing contrast between Babe and Oakcha,

584
00:30:19,800 --> 00:30:22,040
Speaker 6: is more about the contrast than the compare.

585
00:30:22,240 --> 00:30:24,720
Speaker 5: I think you could see that Babe.

586
00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:27,640
Speaker 6: Had an influence on Oakcha, and I think maybe Babe

587
00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:30,400
Speaker 6: Big in the city even more so. But a lot

588
00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:32,680
Speaker 6: of it was just as a jumping off place to

589
00:30:32,720 --> 00:30:34,320
Speaker 6: do to go somewhere.

590
00:30:34,040 --> 00:30:36,320
Speaker 5: Else in somewhere a little bit darker.

591
00:30:36,880 --> 00:30:38,480
Speaker 6: But I want to talk about some other places where

592
00:30:38,480 --> 00:30:41,000
Speaker 6: the two films contrast, and that that would be the

593
00:30:41,040 --> 00:30:44,480
Speaker 6: you know, the time period and the setting, Jenner.

594
00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:45,400
Speaker 5: You had some thoughts on that.

595
00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:49,200
Speaker 10: Yeah. I suggest this comparison because I think it's interesting

596
00:30:49,240 --> 00:30:53,680
Speaker 10: how both films kind of exist in a fantasy slash

597
00:30:53,880 --> 00:30:58,120
Speaker 10: storybook setting, but they do it through very different approaches

598
00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:00,920
Speaker 10: where as we talked about in the first half, Babe

599
00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:04,000
Speaker 10: is kind of like situated out of time and out

600
00:31:04,040 --> 00:31:06,920
Speaker 10: of place and exists in this sort of like generalized

601
00:31:07,200 --> 00:31:12,360
Speaker 10: storybook arena. Oakcha has a very specific time and a

602
00:31:12,440 --> 00:31:14,680
Speaker 10: very specific place like it starts in two thousand and seven,

603
00:31:14,760 --> 00:31:16,960
Speaker 10: and then the main action of the film is ten

604
00:31:17,040 --> 00:31:20,440
Speaker 10: years later in twenty seventeen in New York City and

605
00:31:20,760 --> 00:31:22,880
Speaker 10: Korea and other are there points in between.

606
00:31:22,960 --> 00:31:24,280
Speaker 5: I think New.

607
00:31:24,200 --> 00:31:28,640
Speaker 10: Jersey like a place in time that is our own.

608
00:31:28,680 --> 00:31:31,800
Speaker 10: And so therefore we know that this is an imagined story.

609
00:31:31,840 --> 00:31:34,280
Speaker 10: It is a fable in a way, And so I

610
00:31:34,280 --> 00:31:37,400
Speaker 10: think it's interesting how both films have that same effect

611
00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:41,360
Speaker 10: of creating a sort of storybook fable atmosphere, but one

612
00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:43,840
Speaker 10: does it through a highly specific time and place and

613
00:31:43,880 --> 00:31:46,320
Speaker 10: one does it through a very vague time and place.

614
00:31:46,600 --> 00:31:51,480
Speaker 6: And then there's also the aspect where Babe is set entirely,

615
00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:55,680
Speaker 6: almost entirely in one location that is that is very

616
00:31:55,680 --> 00:31:58,920
Speaker 6: carefully realized, this little ecosystem and.

617
00:31:59,040 --> 00:32:01,520
Speaker 10: Hamlet that be a hamlet where they live.

618
00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:04,080
Speaker 5: I don't know, I'm not even sure hamble. It might

619
00:32:04,160 --> 00:32:07,360
Speaker 5: be too metropolitan for for a yeah, a little yeah,

620
00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:09,480
Speaker 5: it's a little less populous. But and then of course

621
00:32:09,840 --> 00:32:11,800
Speaker 5: Oakcha has got sprawled to it.

622
00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:13,920
Speaker 6: I mean, you start in the Korean mountains year in

623
00:32:14,000 --> 00:32:17,400
Speaker 6: Soul for a pretty spectacular chase scene, then you go

624
00:32:17,440 --> 00:32:21,600
Speaker 6: halfway across the world. So you get a sense that

625
00:32:21,760 --> 00:32:25,200
Speaker 6: perhaps Bong and his co writer on this, John Ronson,

626
00:32:25,400 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 6: decided to just take a Babe like fantasy concept and

627
00:32:28,280 --> 00:32:30,000
Speaker 6: then just blow it up and put it in the

628
00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:34,040
Speaker 6: real world and make it sprawling where the earlier film

629
00:32:34,440 --> 00:32:37,200
Speaker 6: is really set in the one place it's I feel

630
00:32:37,240 --> 00:32:40,200
Speaker 6: it's starring in a good way to throw this creature

631
00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:42,320
Speaker 6: and this girl who's who's a fish out of water

632
00:32:42,560 --> 00:32:44,720
Speaker 6: into a modern setting where they're off to the races,

633
00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:48,800
Speaker 6: and it's just it's a shambling, tonally wild movie. But

634
00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:51,840
Speaker 6: again that's something I think is, you know, more to

635
00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:52,640
Speaker 6: the positive than.

636
00:32:52,560 --> 00:32:56,240
Speaker 10: Not and just another like little tangential connection related to

637
00:32:56,280 --> 00:32:58,760
Speaker 10: something you just said. We talked briefly about Babe's relationship

638
00:32:58,760 --> 00:33:02,400
Speaker 10: to modernity. Basically, most of Okja takes place in modern

639
00:33:02,440 --> 00:33:05,120
Speaker 10: industrialized world, but in the beginning, when it's Mesia and

640
00:33:05,120 --> 00:33:08,960
Speaker 10: Oakcha in their home, you know, in the woods, you know,

641
00:33:09,200 --> 00:33:11,840
Speaker 10: they seem very removed from that world. But there are

642
00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:15,120
Speaker 10: little touches of modernity that are in their life, like

643
00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:17,800
Speaker 10: when when Mundo comes to the farm and she's like

644
00:33:17,840 --> 00:33:21,520
Speaker 10: renta display, you know, you know, and they're and they're

645
00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:25,680
Speaker 10: watching TV, and she knows who Jake Jillenhall's character is,

646
00:33:25,720 --> 00:33:27,720
Speaker 10: like she recognizes him, you know, like they are not

647
00:33:28,280 --> 00:33:32,320
Speaker 10: completely isolated from the modern world. I just think that's

648
00:33:32,360 --> 00:33:35,000
Speaker 10: an interesting touch that both films kind of have that

649
00:33:35,040 --> 00:33:38,560
Speaker 10: little acknowledgment of modernity in the setting that is otherwise

650
00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:41,520
Speaker 10: completely removed from our concept of the modern world.

651
00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:44,000
Speaker 11: It doesn't like the create equivalent of Hawkett's farm doesn't.

652
00:33:44,200 --> 00:33:44,720
Speaker 10: Yeah, it does.

653
00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:48,040
Speaker 11: The place for times has not quite touched, but it

654
00:33:48,120 --> 00:33:50,240
Speaker 11: is still as she's saying, you know, President.

655
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:53,320
Speaker 6: And maybe you know, there's a sense that Mesia is

656
00:33:53,480 --> 00:33:56,200
Speaker 6: a little bit obviously she doesn't want Oakja to go

657
00:33:56,280 --> 00:33:59,560
Speaker 6: away and pursues her friend to the far end of

658
00:33:59,560 --> 00:34:02,640
Speaker 6: the world. But but she's different than her grandfather. She

659
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:05,680
Speaker 6: I think she is a little more willing to embrace

660
00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:08,000
Speaker 6: the modern than he is, in a little bit more,

661
00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:11,239
Speaker 6: but maybe not to the extent that Tilda Swinton.

662
00:34:11,480 --> 00:34:14,080
Speaker 11: Kind of sense you're running back though her taste of

663
00:34:14,080 --> 00:34:16,440
Speaker 11: the outside world puts her in retreat by the end

664
00:34:16,440 --> 00:34:16,879
Speaker 11: of the movie.

665
00:34:17,040 --> 00:34:18,040
Speaker 5: That is true.

666
00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:20,120
Speaker 6: So one of the other things that these two films

667
00:34:20,440 --> 00:34:23,359
Speaker 6: have in common is that they're a reconciliation of sort

668
00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:27,440
Speaker 6: of a collaboration of sort between different cultures. There international

669
00:34:27,480 --> 00:34:31,560
Speaker 6: co productions between Hollywood and Australia and One and Babe,

670
00:34:31,640 --> 00:34:36,080
Speaker 6: and then Hollywood and Korea with Oakja. I was curious

671
00:34:36,120 --> 00:34:40,520
Speaker 6: about what you all might think that that signifies, because

672
00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:42,840
Speaker 6: I had talked about it a little bit before earlier

673
00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:47,239
Speaker 6: about how Bong is very corosaw alike and having an

674
00:34:47,360 --> 00:34:53,319
Speaker 6: interest in both representing a very distinct national cinema and

675
00:34:54,000 --> 00:34:57,400
Speaker 6: finding ways to square that with an equally strong interest

676
00:34:57,440 --> 00:35:02,400
Speaker 6: in Hollywood. And Oakja is a pretty significant step in

677
00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:04,800
Speaker 6: that direction, just because so many people are going to

678
00:35:05,480 --> 00:35:08,120
Speaker 6: see it. The host was kind of the breakthrough, but

679
00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:10,759
Speaker 6: this one has a lot in common with that.

680
00:35:11,200 --> 00:35:11,480
Speaker 5: Baby.

681
00:35:11,520 --> 00:35:14,880
Speaker 6: I'm not sure about what the significance of that collaboration

682
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:19,520
Speaker 6: might be, you know, other than just Hollywood perhaps bankrolling

683
00:35:19,920 --> 00:35:21,520
Speaker 6: you know, a more homegrown production.

684
00:35:21,760 --> 00:35:23,480
Speaker 11: Well, Babe, I think it just kind of contributes to

685
00:35:23,480 --> 00:35:25,560
Speaker 11: the sense that this could be any time in any place,

686
00:35:25,600 --> 00:35:28,040
Speaker 11: And you know, I was you know, I think between

687
00:35:28,040 --> 00:35:30,120
Speaker 11: this and Nelly Confidential, I don't think I really knew

688
00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:32,640
Speaker 11: that James Cromwell wasn't an American for a long time,

689
00:35:33,680 --> 00:35:36,279
Speaker 11: because I you could just he's sort of flexible and

690
00:35:36,320 --> 00:35:38,840
Speaker 11: there's no real It's not like he's doing an Australian

691
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:40,560
Speaker 11: accent in this, but it's a little kind of any

692
00:35:40,560 --> 00:35:44,240
Speaker 11: place country accident in some ways with Oakcha, the culture

693
00:35:44,280 --> 00:35:46,680
Speaker 11: clash is kind of hardwired into the film in some ways,

694
00:35:46,680 --> 00:35:49,759
Speaker 11: and I think that works in its favor. You can

695
00:35:49,760 --> 00:35:52,520
Speaker 11: sometimes get with the international co production and you get

696
00:35:52,560 --> 00:35:55,640
Speaker 11: things like scenes shot just for the Chinese market and

697
00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:58,959
Speaker 11: Iron Man, and I think these films designed to peel

698
00:35:58,960 --> 00:36:01,360
Speaker 11: across national banks are very much a part of a

699
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:05,239
Speaker 11: movie's future, and I thought it was. It was gracefully

700
00:36:05,280 --> 00:36:06,840
Speaker 11: done in this, and I think as you as you

701
00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:10,239
Speaker 11: pointed out, it is part of Bong's mission or or

702
00:36:10,360 --> 00:36:14,359
Speaker 11: or approach of melting Korean styles and Hollywood styles. And

703
00:36:14,400 --> 00:36:18,840
Speaker 11: you can't ask for someone better to put a bracing

704
00:36:18,880 --> 00:36:21,239
Speaker 11: performance in the middle of the movie than tell us

705
00:36:21,280 --> 00:36:24,160
Speaker 11: what either. You know, she kind of translates across borders

706
00:36:24,160 --> 00:36:25,560
Speaker 11: and so interesting one.

707
00:36:25,520 --> 00:36:27,920
Speaker 6: I know she is the most I didn't think about

708
00:36:27,920 --> 00:36:29,680
Speaker 6: that she is such an I mean, she's been in

709
00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:33,239
Speaker 6: like a Bellatar movie, She's obviously in this thing.

710
00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:35,000
Speaker 5: She's been in Hollywood movies like that.

711
00:36:35,000 --> 00:36:39,160
Speaker 11: She's plays an Asian character, Michael, She's done with.

712
00:36:39,160 --> 00:36:40,120
Speaker 5: Jar she does.

713
00:36:40,160 --> 00:36:43,120
Speaker 6: She is very much the definition of an international star.

714
00:36:43,440 --> 00:36:47,239
Speaker 6: So I find it interesting that the difference between a

715
00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:52,759
Speaker 6: harmonious mingling of cultures or like that. You know, how

716
00:36:53,120 --> 00:36:56,440
Speaker 6: we talked about Babe being like not particularly specific to

717
00:36:56,520 --> 00:36:59,759
Speaker 6: any area or region of the world, and then you

718
00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 6: know Oakja being almost like a globalist conflict writ large.

719
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:10,319
Speaker 6: So so there may be something you know, harmonious and

720
00:37:10,400 --> 00:37:13,480
Speaker 6: exciting about the mix of styles and the mix of

721
00:37:13,640 --> 00:37:17,880
Speaker 6: cultures from a cinematic standpoint, But the film is also

722
00:37:18,040 --> 00:37:21,920
Speaker 6: engaged in how there's so much misunderstanding and a difference

723
00:37:21,920 --> 00:37:24,840
Speaker 6: in values between nations. That was a subject of the

724
00:37:24,880 --> 00:37:27,880
Speaker 6: host as well, which starts with an American pouring for

725
00:37:28,000 --> 00:37:30,239
Speaker 6: malde hyde down the sink and ends up in the

726
00:37:30,560 --> 00:37:35,920
Speaker 6: Han River and creates this genetically enhanced a sea creature.

727
00:37:36,080 --> 00:37:39,680
Speaker 6: So I think bong Is is interested. He is he

728
00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:44,400
Speaker 6: is in American culture and Hollywood. He is also aware of,

729
00:37:44,880 --> 00:37:47,719
Speaker 6: you know, America's toxic influence.

730
00:37:47,800 --> 00:37:48,680
Speaker 5: On the rest of the world.

731
00:37:49,080 --> 00:37:51,880
Speaker 6: So you can find Oakja and Babe on Netflix. You

732
00:37:51,880 --> 00:37:53,800
Speaker 6: can also find Babe on Blu Ray if you prefer

733
00:37:53,840 --> 00:37:56,040
Speaker 6: to watch it that way as Keith. Keith did, right,

734
00:37:56,080 --> 00:37:58,799
Speaker 6: I did, Yeah, So you can get that for the

735
00:37:59,080 --> 00:37:59,720
Speaker 6: a nice price.

736
00:37:59,719 --> 00:38:03,400
Speaker 5: I think Babe. Pig in the City is also on Netfolks.

737
00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:04,120
Speaker 10: I get that last plug in.

738
00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:05,400
Speaker 5: That's right, I have to.

739
00:38:05,880 --> 00:38:08,480
Speaker 6: If you don't mind a little darkness in your family entertainment,

740
00:38:08,520 --> 00:38:10,719
Speaker 6: I implore you to check it out. We'll be right

741
00:38:10,760 --> 00:38:24,880
Speaker 6: back with our usual recommendation segment, Your Next Picture Show. Finally,

742
00:38:24,920 --> 00:38:26,920
Speaker 6: it's time to catch each other up on films or

743
00:38:26,960 --> 00:38:29,160
Speaker 6: film related items we've seen in the interim since our

744
00:38:29,200 --> 00:38:32,200
Speaker 6: last podcast. We call it Your Next Picture Show in

745
00:38:32,239 --> 00:38:33,960
Speaker 6: the hopes that it will put some interesting choices on

746
00:38:34,000 --> 00:38:36,880
Speaker 6: your radar. Keith, what in the film world has been

747
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:37,560
Speaker 6: good for you lately?

748
00:38:37,640 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 11: I mean, I hate to just be the person like,

749
00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:42,279
Speaker 11: here's the last Criterion I watched, But here's the last

750
00:38:42,320 --> 00:38:44,919
Speaker 11: Criterion I watched. They put out very good blue rays

751
00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:47,880
Speaker 11: and that was They Live by Night, which is Nicholas

752
00:38:47,960 --> 00:38:51,440
Speaker 11: Ray's first film, based on the same novel that Robert

753
00:38:51,440 --> 00:38:53,920
Speaker 11: Albin filmed many years later. For the great movie Thieves

754
00:38:53,960 --> 00:38:57,080
Speaker 11: Like Us, and this is in some ways a very

755
00:38:57,120 --> 00:39:01,799
Speaker 11: different film than that. It's definitely more influenced by noir.

756
00:39:02,440 --> 00:39:05,680
Speaker 11: It's I'm not gonna'm gonna say more conventional film, but

757
00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:08,239
Speaker 11: everything is more conventional than Altmans in some ways. But

758
00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:11,480
Speaker 11: at the heart it's still the same story of two

759
00:39:12,200 --> 00:39:18,239
Speaker 11: people who fall in love and are doomed by criminality

760
00:39:18,400 --> 00:39:20,480
Speaker 11: that they participate in, but also just sort of a

761
00:39:20,560 --> 00:39:24,080
Speaker 11: system that's stacked against the people. Probably granger is it

762
00:39:24,120 --> 00:39:26,840
Speaker 11: plays at this kid who's fallen into life of crimes,

763
00:39:26,880 --> 00:39:29,880
Speaker 11: out of prison, gets right back into crime. Kathy O'Donnell

764
00:39:30,360 --> 00:39:33,000
Speaker 11: plays his love interests, who's the daughter of a gas

765
00:39:33,239 --> 00:39:36,120
Speaker 11: station owner who kind of puts them up and they

766
00:39:36,120 --> 00:39:39,960
Speaker 11: are the sort of the first occasion of exact exorbitant

767
00:39:40,000 --> 00:39:42,200
Speaker 11: fee from from the thieves for covering for them, and

768
00:39:42,320 --> 00:39:46,080
Speaker 11: which leads to the title of the book that he's

769
00:39:45,880 --> 00:39:47,960
Speaker 11: He's They're Thieves Like Us, And it's sort of this

770
00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:50,479
Speaker 11: world of which, like a lot of noirs, the whole

771
00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:53,520
Speaker 11: system is corrupt and goodness and love is going to

772
00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:56,000
Speaker 11: get stuffed out, but it's it's sort of lovely wild

773
00:39:56,160 --> 00:39:59,440
Speaker 11: last and and it ends with this you know, wonderful,

774
00:39:59,480 --> 00:40:02,239
Speaker 11: tragical end and it's beautifully shot. You know, it's in

775
00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:05,600
Speaker 11: many ways a very different film from Without a Cause,

776
00:40:05,640 --> 00:40:08,800
Speaker 11: but piry nicely. If we were doing some kind of podcast,

777
00:40:08,840 --> 00:40:10,319
Speaker 11: I want to repair of movies that would put them

778
00:40:10,320 --> 00:40:12,719
Speaker 11: together because there is this sort of sense of young

779
00:40:12,760 --> 00:40:16,040
Speaker 11: innocence in the world does not want to sustain it.

780
00:40:16,120 --> 00:40:18,520
Speaker 11: And yeah, so highly recommend it. It's a really nice

781
00:40:18,880 --> 00:40:21,720
Speaker 11: extra features on, including a two thousand and seven commentary

782
00:40:21,760 --> 00:40:24,240
Speaker 11: that feature is a very late in life Barlie Granger.

783
00:40:24,360 --> 00:40:27,600
Speaker 6: Yeah, I really, it's like a massive whole. I've seen

784
00:40:28,200 --> 00:40:31,359
Speaker 6: really all of the major Nicholas Rainy movies, but not

785
00:40:31,560 --> 00:40:34,560
Speaker 6: this one, in which everyone loves and which i've just

786
00:40:35,080 --> 00:40:37,240
Speaker 6: I know it's on film Struck now or was on films.

787
00:40:37,280 --> 00:40:39,600
Speaker 5: Yeah, it should be, so I have no excuse.

788
00:40:39,640 --> 00:40:41,240
Speaker 11: Now it's short too. I don't know what's wrong short

789
00:40:41,280 --> 00:40:43,480
Speaker 11: and that he's wrong. It's it's very much to your

790
00:40:43,520 --> 00:40:45,799
Speaker 11: taste as I understand it. And once again, the movie

791
00:40:45,840 --> 00:40:47,920
Speaker 11: is that they live by Night, not to be confused

792
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:49,799
Speaker 11: with the Dry by Night, which is also a great movie.

793
00:40:49,760 --> 00:40:52,480
Speaker 11: I'd probably recommend it some future date, but they live

794
00:40:52,520 --> 00:40:55,359
Speaker 11: by day at night Nicholas Ray's first film, Scott, how

795
00:40:55,360 --> 00:40:55,839
Speaker 11: about You?

796
00:40:56,400 --> 00:40:58,840
Speaker 6: I want to recommend a film called The Rehearsal. This

797
00:40:58,920 --> 00:41:01,879
Speaker 6: is a new film by Alison McLean, a Canadian born

798
00:41:02,239 --> 00:41:04,760
Speaker 6: New Zealand director who hasn't made a feature since nineteen

799
00:41:04,800 --> 00:41:06,080
Speaker 6: ninety nine, Jesus Son.

800
00:41:06,200 --> 00:41:09,400
Speaker 5: Do you remember Jesus Son? Terrific a?

801
00:41:10,440 --> 00:41:13,400
Speaker 11: There's a great scene abandoned drive in that's really stuck

802
00:41:13,400 --> 00:41:13,840
Speaker 11: with I know.

803
00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:17,720
Speaker 6: I mean it was a really tough bar across because

804
00:41:17,719 --> 00:41:20,560
Speaker 6: it was an adaptation of a Dennis Johnson short story

805
00:41:20,600 --> 00:41:24,640
Speaker 6: collection and it was acclaimed, but apparently it wasn't enough

806
00:41:25,400 --> 00:41:29,040
Speaker 6: to get McLean much more than occasional TV work. But

807
00:41:29,160 --> 00:41:33,000
Speaker 6: McLean returns to New Zealand for The Rehearsal, which follows

808
00:41:33,040 --> 00:41:36,120
Speaker 6: a character named Stanley who was a timid student entering

809
00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:39,360
Speaker 6: his first year in drama school. And when Stanley and

810
00:41:39,560 --> 00:41:42,239
Speaker 6: four of his fellow students are grouped together for this

811
00:41:42,360 --> 00:41:45,719
Speaker 6: big end of the year original performance, he draws on

812
00:41:46,040 --> 00:41:49,400
Speaker 6: a public sex scannel involving his girlfriend's underage sister and

813
00:41:49,440 --> 00:41:52,319
Speaker 6: her tennis instructor. The Rehearsal's a film with a lot

814
00:41:52,360 --> 00:41:55,840
Speaker 6: of insight into the vanity, ambition and human weakness that

815
00:41:55,880 --> 00:41:58,520
Speaker 6: goes into the craft of acting. But for me, it's

816
00:41:58,560 --> 00:42:03,520
Speaker 6: especially notable for Carrie Fox's performance as an instructor slash administrator,

817
00:42:03,560 --> 00:42:07,239
Speaker 6: which resembles in many ways JK. Simmons performance in Whiplash

818
00:42:07,280 --> 00:42:11,280
Speaker 6: for its unsparing intensity. Fans of Jane Campion will remember

819
00:42:11,600 --> 00:42:14,880
Speaker 6: Carrie Fox's Janet Frame and an Angel at My Table.

820
00:42:15,080 --> 00:42:17,720
Speaker 6: She was also one of the main characters in Danny

821
00:42:17,719 --> 00:42:21,960
Speaker 6: Boyle's Shallow Grave, and hear her ferocious wit really just

822
00:42:22,040 --> 00:42:26,040
Speaker 6: overwhelms the main characters extreme passivity and gives the film

823
00:42:26,080 --> 00:42:29,200
Speaker 6: a spark whenever it needs one. So it's called the rehearsal.

824
00:42:29,200 --> 00:42:32,040
Speaker 6: It's not I wish it were. It's much stronger when

825
00:42:32,080 --> 00:42:34,240
Speaker 6: it when it stays in the school and deal deals

826
00:42:34,280 --> 00:42:38,239
Speaker 6: with creative expression and all of the you know, some

827
00:42:38,320 --> 00:42:41,359
Speaker 6: moral issues that are raised. It's stronger there than it

828
00:42:41,400 --> 00:42:44,399
Speaker 6: is outside of the school. But if you want to

829
00:42:44,440 --> 00:42:48,080
Speaker 6: see something that's like Fame but like realer, this would

830
00:42:48,080 --> 00:42:48,840
Speaker 6: be it the rehearsal.

831
00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:51,280
Speaker 5: Genevieve, all right.

832
00:42:51,200 --> 00:42:53,479
Speaker 10: Well, I've seen a lot of really good movies lately,

833
00:42:53,520 --> 00:42:55,560
Speaker 10: and I came prepared with like a bunch of options

834
00:42:55,600 --> 00:42:58,400
Speaker 10: in case you guys overlapped with my recommendation, and you didn't,

835
00:42:58,440 --> 00:43:01,920
Speaker 10: so now I'm left choosing between them. So I think, Yeah,

836
00:43:01,960 --> 00:43:03,439
Speaker 10: I think I'm just going to do a quick drive

837
00:43:03,520 --> 00:43:06,279
Speaker 10: by of three movies that I really liked that you

838
00:43:06,440 --> 00:43:09,400
Speaker 10: can and should watch. The first of which probably be

839
00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:12,239
Speaker 10: no surprise to anyone who knows this group, but Edgar writes,

840
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:15,600
Speaker 10: Baby Driver is in theaters and it is wonderful. I

841
00:43:15,640 --> 00:43:19,120
Speaker 10: reviewed it for Vox. I loved it. It's an amazing

842
00:43:19,239 --> 00:43:25,239
Speaker 10: kind of mashup of crime picture car action sort of

843
00:43:25,320 --> 00:43:27,200
Speaker 10: movie musical. I've had a lot of debates about whether

844
00:43:27,239 --> 00:43:31,600
Speaker 10: it actually constitutes a musical, and after hearing myself debate

845
00:43:31,640 --> 00:43:34,239
Speaker 10: about it for a long time, I am of the

846
00:43:34,239 --> 00:43:36,400
Speaker 10: mind that yes it does. It does constitute a musical.

847
00:43:37,520 --> 00:43:40,400
Speaker 10: But you're mild Tiberia. But it's in theaters now. I

848
00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:43,120
Speaker 10: did really well and it's opening weekend. It's probably going

849
00:43:43,160 --> 00:43:45,600
Speaker 10: to be Right's biggest hits. So but that doesn't mean

850
00:43:45,640 --> 00:43:48,760
Speaker 10: you shouldn't see it if you haven't already. The second

851
00:43:48,840 --> 00:43:51,680
Speaker 10: recommendation I have is for The Big Sick, which is

852
00:43:51,719 --> 00:43:54,719
Speaker 10: a new film from Michael Showalter, written by a comedian

853
00:43:54,760 --> 00:43:57,400
Speaker 10: who I have loved for a long time. You probably

854
00:43:57,400 --> 00:44:00,200
Speaker 10: know him from Silicon Valley named Kamil nan Gianni. He

855
00:44:00,280 --> 00:44:03,279
Speaker 10: co wrote it with his wife Emily Gordon, and it

856
00:44:03,360 --> 00:44:09,600
Speaker 10: is an autobiographical story of their unusual romance in the

857
00:44:09,640 --> 00:44:13,520
Speaker 10: circumstances that led to them getting together and almost not

858
00:44:13,880 --> 00:44:16,279
Speaker 10: staying together, and then well, I won't spoil it, but

859
00:44:16,280 --> 00:44:19,640
Speaker 10: they get together. They're married, guys. But it's if you

860
00:44:20,239 --> 00:44:23,120
Speaker 10: like romantic comedies, and if you don't like romantic comedies,

861
00:44:23,200 --> 00:44:25,400
Speaker 10: this is this is like the epitome of what a

862
00:44:25,480 --> 00:44:27,719
Speaker 10: romantic comedy can be. And I think it's just like

863
00:44:27,760 --> 00:44:31,279
Speaker 10: a complete validation of the form. Like the emotion on

864
00:44:31,320 --> 00:44:33,279
Speaker 10: this movie is just cranked to ten the entire time.

865
00:44:33,320 --> 00:44:37,520
Speaker 10: You're either cracking up or sobbing, but it's such a

866
00:44:37,560 --> 00:44:41,000
Speaker 10: wonderful combination that it just translates to like pure emotion.

867
00:44:41,719 --> 00:44:43,960
Speaker 10: That was probably one of just the most purely pleasurable

868
00:44:43,960 --> 00:44:46,640
Speaker 10: film going experiences I've had in a long time. So

869
00:44:46,840 --> 00:44:50,560
Speaker 10: highly highly recommend The Big Sick. And then lastly I

870
00:44:50,600 --> 00:44:54,799
Speaker 10: want to recommend Logan Noir, which is a the black

871
00:44:54,840 --> 00:44:58,680
Speaker 10: and white version of James Mangold's Logan, which played briefly

872
00:44:58,760 --> 00:45:00,759
Speaker 10: here in Chicago at the music by theater, but as

873
00:45:00,800 --> 00:45:03,400
Speaker 10: I understand, it is available on the Blu ray of Logan.

874
00:45:03,920 --> 00:45:05,960
Speaker 10: I'm really kind of into this new trend of like

875
00:45:06,080 --> 00:45:08,600
Speaker 10: doing black and white versions of modern blockbusters. I mean,

876
00:45:08,640 --> 00:45:11,440
Speaker 10: there was the mad Max Fury Road like the was

877
00:45:11,480 --> 00:45:14,440
Speaker 10: it the Chrome edition, you know, and now there's the

878
00:45:14,480 --> 00:45:18,560
Speaker 10: noir edition of Logan. And I missed Logan when it

879
00:45:18,600 --> 00:45:20,520
Speaker 10: came through theaters the first time, so this is my

880
00:45:20,640 --> 00:45:23,480
Speaker 10: first exposure to it was seeing it in black and white,

881
00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:24,799
Speaker 10: and at first I was like, is this like the

882
00:45:24,800 --> 00:45:27,000
Speaker 10: best way to see it? And I really think it

883
00:45:27,040 --> 00:45:28,799
Speaker 10: is the best way to see Logan. And I say

884
00:45:28,840 --> 00:45:31,040
Speaker 10: that having not seen it in its colorized version, but

885
00:45:32,040 --> 00:45:35,479
Speaker 10: it was really a great format in which to see

886
00:45:35,480 --> 00:45:38,279
Speaker 10: the story for two reasons. I think one because it's

887
00:45:38,320 --> 00:45:40,719
Speaker 10: sort of served to separate it from the greater X

888
00:45:40,760 --> 00:45:44,520
Speaker 10: Men universe because it does star Hugh Jackman's Wolverine and

889
00:45:44,600 --> 00:45:47,880
Speaker 10: Patrick Stewart's Professor X, and like, there is that connection

890
00:45:48,080 --> 00:45:52,120
Speaker 10: to a long lineage of X Men films that I

891
00:45:52,120 --> 00:45:55,120
Speaker 10: think by being black and white and also being like

892
00:45:55,160 --> 00:45:59,720
Speaker 10: a hard R movie kind of serves to separate Logan

893
00:46:00,120 --> 00:46:02,560
Speaker 10: from that lineage in a way that I thought was

894
00:46:02,640 --> 00:46:05,759
Speaker 10: very beneficial to the movie. And also it's a really

895
00:46:05,800 --> 00:46:08,520
Speaker 10: bloody gory movie, and I kind of like my blood

896
00:46:08,560 --> 00:46:12,080
Speaker 10: and gore and black and white it's much easier to

897
00:46:12,080 --> 00:46:16,279
Speaker 10: to disassociate from it that way. So both of those

898
00:46:16,280 --> 00:46:20,040
Speaker 10: aspects kind of contributed to me really really enjoying Logan

899
00:46:20,160 --> 00:46:22,359
Speaker 10: in black and white. So if you have access to

900
00:46:22,600 --> 00:46:25,440
Speaker 10: the Blu ray, I would definitely recommend checking out the

901
00:46:25,480 --> 00:46:28,879
Speaker 10: Noir edition of Logan. In addition to The Big Sick

902
00:46:29,120 --> 00:46:30,120
Speaker 10: and Baby Driver.

903
00:46:30,200 --> 00:46:31,480
Speaker 5: It's a lot of movies it is.

904
00:46:31,600 --> 00:46:35,560
Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, definitely, I've seen Baby Driver and can back

905
00:46:35,600 --> 00:46:37,560
Speaker 6: you up. And you know, whether you want to classify

906
00:46:37,560 --> 00:46:39,799
Speaker 6: as a musical or not, it is certainly influenced by

907
00:46:39,840 --> 00:46:43,240
Speaker 6: it and has a musicality to it that extends beyond

908
00:46:43,239 --> 00:46:45,919
Speaker 6: the soundtrack. It really is incorporated in a much more

909
00:46:45,960 --> 00:46:48,000
Speaker 6: sophisticated way than.

910
00:46:48,360 --> 00:46:52,640
Speaker 10: It's choreographed to music. It's action that's being choreographed, not humans.

911
00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:54,080
Speaker 10: But it's I.

912
00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:57,600
Speaker 6: Think his performance an soil El Gowart's performance is so

913
00:46:57,719 --> 00:47:00,719
Speaker 6: much a physical for sure performance too. What a joy

914
00:47:00,880 --> 00:47:03,560
Speaker 6: pure filmmaking. Love it and I'm looking forward the Big

915
00:47:03,600 --> 00:47:07,040
Speaker 6: Six and The Big Sick, I should say, and of

916
00:47:07,040 --> 00:47:09,680
Speaker 6: course Logan I've only I've seen twice, both in.

917
00:47:09,640 --> 00:47:12,160
Speaker 5: Color, so I don't know. I don't know if your

918
00:47:12,200 --> 00:47:13,080
Speaker 5: black and white.

919
00:47:13,080 --> 00:47:16,960
Speaker 10: Version, but it's a really good film on it talked

920
00:47:16,960 --> 00:47:19,839
Speaker 10: about doing it for the show, appearing out with Shane Right,

921
00:47:20,040 --> 00:47:20,680
Speaker 10: how much is it?

922
00:47:20,800 --> 00:47:21,040
Speaker 5: Yeah?

923
00:47:21,160 --> 00:47:23,840
Speaker 11: Almost too obvious of that. Yeah, yeah, that kind of

924
00:47:23,880 --> 00:47:24,799
Speaker 11: spells it out for you there.

925
00:47:24,840 --> 00:47:27,160
Speaker 5: I love that it can be that in either form.

926
00:47:27,200 --> 00:47:28,920
Speaker 6: It would make sense to be black and white, and

927
00:47:28,960 --> 00:47:32,160
Speaker 6: just it's so different than what we've been seeing from

928
00:47:32,239 --> 00:47:34,319
Speaker 6: superhero movies and from X Men movies. So that that

929
00:47:34,440 --> 00:47:36,319
Speaker 6: was that's a great thing about it too, so so

930
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:43,000
Speaker 6: lots of good things to check out. And that's it

931
00:47:43,040 --> 00:47:45,160
Speaker 6: for this week's edition of The Next Picture Show. Our

932
00:47:45,200 --> 00:47:48,640
Speaker 6: next episodes come out July twenty fifth and twenty seventh. Genevieve,

933
00:47:49,120 --> 00:47:50,120
Speaker 6: what do we have lined up?

934
00:47:50,320 --> 00:47:53,120
Speaker 10: A car crash, a mystery, and a dreamy fantasy atmosphere

935
00:47:53,200 --> 00:47:56,800
Speaker 10: figure prominently in David Lowry's new indie film A Ghost Story,

936
00:47:56,960 --> 00:47:59,440
Speaker 10: which premiered at sun Dance in January to huge buzz,

937
00:48:00,200 --> 00:48:02,080
Speaker 10: got picked up for release by A twenty four and

938
00:48:02,280 --> 00:48:05,800
Speaker 10: just reached theaters. Those same three things also feature prominently

939
00:48:05,840 --> 00:48:09,200
Speaker 10: in HERK Harvey's nineteen sixty two horror fantasy Carnival of

940
00:48:09,239 --> 00:48:12,840
Speaker 10: Souls one of the great cult classic indie success stories.

941
00:48:13,320 --> 00:48:17,120
Speaker 10: Both films deal with the unreal, unsettling experience of the afterlife,

942
00:48:17,239 --> 00:48:19,720
Speaker 10: in the way the dead process time and emotion differently

943
00:48:19,719 --> 00:48:22,880
Speaker 10: from the living. Both films play with simple images. A

944
00:48:22,880 --> 00:48:25,520
Speaker 10: Ghost Story finds deep pathos and Casey Affleck wearing a

945
00:48:25,560 --> 00:48:28,440
Speaker 10: simple sheet with holes cut for the eyes basically a

946
00:48:28,520 --> 00:48:31,840
Speaker 10: cheapy kid's Halloween costume taken to a serious level, and

947
00:48:31,920 --> 00:48:34,760
Speaker 10: Carnival of Souls pulls a similar pathos from the spectacle

948
00:48:34,800 --> 00:48:37,239
Speaker 10: of an abandoned carnival. These are films made on a

949
00:48:37,280 --> 00:48:40,719
Speaker 10: micro shoe string budget, but they're both spectral haunting experiences,

950
00:48:40,800 --> 00:48:43,640
Speaker 10: if you'll pardon the pun. Our next pairing reminds us

951
00:48:43,680 --> 00:48:45,680
Speaker 10: that filmmakers don't need much of a budget to do

952
00:48:45,760 --> 00:48:48,080
Speaker 10: horror right. They just need to be able to create

953
00:48:48,120 --> 00:48:51,800
Speaker 10: a convincing, moody atmosphere. We'll dive into the quiet terrors

954
00:48:51,840 --> 00:48:54,759
Speaker 10: of the afterlife on the next Next Picture Show Podcasts.

955
00:48:55,120 --> 00:48:56,960
Speaker 6: In the meantime, we'd love to hear your feedback on

956
00:48:56,960 --> 00:48:59,520
Speaker 6: this week's discussion of Babe and Oakcha and anything else

957
00:48:59,520 --> 00:49:02,080
Speaker 6: film related. We want to include your thoughts on future

958
00:49:02,120 --> 00:49:04,600
Speaker 6: episodes of the show. You can leave a short voicemail

959
00:49:04,640 --> 00:49:08,239
Speaker 6: at seven seven three two three four nine seven three

960
00:49:08,320 --> 00:49:10,879
Speaker 6: zero or email us at comments at Next Picture Show

961
00:49:10,920 --> 00:49:15,200
Speaker 6: dot net. Finally, before closing out this week's episode, where

962
00:49:15,200 --> 00:49:16,720
Speaker 6: can we find everyone these days?

963
00:49:16,920 --> 00:49:17,480
Speaker 5: Keith Phipps.

964
00:49:17,880 --> 00:49:20,160
Speaker 11: You can find me on Twitter at KFIPS three thousand.

965
00:49:20,200 --> 00:49:22,759
Speaker 11: You can find me at uprocks dot com, where I

966
00:49:22,800 --> 00:49:25,960
Speaker 11: work as the film and TV editor at Genevieve.

967
00:49:26,200 --> 00:49:28,759
Speaker 10: I am the deputy culture editor at Vox dot com,

968
00:49:28,760 --> 00:49:31,000
Speaker 10: and you can find me on Twitter at Genevieve Koski

969
00:49:31,600 --> 00:49:32,880
Speaker 10: Scott I.

970
00:49:32,719 --> 00:49:35,640
Speaker 6: Am on Twitter at at Scott Underscore Tobias, and you

971
00:49:35,640 --> 00:49:41,680
Speaker 6: can find my work in New York Times, Washington Post, NPR, Vulture, Variety, Uprocks,

972
00:49:41,280 --> 00:49:44,200
Speaker 6: and and one more publication I can now add the

973
00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:47,760
Speaker 6: Los Angeles Times. I did a piece for them about

974
00:49:48,160 --> 00:49:51,640
Speaker 6: Amanda Cournell, who is the Swedish Sammy director of a

975
00:49:51,960 --> 00:49:53,000
Speaker 6: film called Sammy Blood.

976
00:49:53,040 --> 00:49:55,280
Speaker 5: That's quite good, and that was my.

977
00:49:55,160 --> 00:49:58,919
Speaker 11: First You have not written the liner notes for any

978
00:49:58,960 --> 00:49:59,959
Speaker 11: forthcoming film.

979
00:50:01,160 --> 00:50:01,960
Speaker 5: Oh that's right.

980
00:50:02,000 --> 00:50:03,719
Speaker 6: Well, I think we mentioned on a show before, but

981
00:50:03,760 --> 00:50:06,400
Speaker 6: by the time this drops are close to when it drops.

982
00:50:06,560 --> 00:50:09,960
Speaker 6: The end of July is when Lost in America is

983
00:50:10,320 --> 00:50:11,560
Speaker 6: coming out on a criterion.

984
00:50:11,640 --> 00:50:14,319
Speaker 5: So of course that is the biggest feather of.

985
00:50:14,280 --> 00:50:17,520
Speaker 6: All feathers in my cap So I'm excited about that,

986
00:50:17,560 --> 00:50:18,200
Speaker 6: And there may.

987
00:50:18,200 --> 00:50:23,319
Speaker 5: Be another criterion down the line watch this space.

988
00:50:23,360 --> 00:50:26,520
Speaker 6: Of space, so I'm pretty excited about that association, to

989
00:50:26,680 --> 00:50:29,359
Speaker 6: say the least. You can find our absent co host

990
00:50:29,360 --> 00:50:32,280
Speaker 6: Tasha Robinson on Twitter at Tasha Robinson and at the Verge,

991
00:50:32,480 --> 00:50:35,279
Speaker 6: where she serves as the Movies and TV editor. You

992
00:50:35,280 --> 00:50:37,520
Speaker 6: can stay updated on the Next Picture Show by visiting

993
00:50:37,520 --> 00:50:40,880
Speaker 6: Next Picture Show dot Net, via Twitter at Next Picture Pod,

994
00:50:41,160 --> 00:50:44,399
Speaker 6: and via Facebook at Facebook dot com slash Next Picture Show.

995
00:50:44,719 --> 00:50:46,480
Speaker 6: And if you haven't subscribed to the show on Apple

996
00:50:46,520 --> 00:50:50,800
Speaker 6: Podcasts already, please consider it. Apple podcast subscriptions are important

997
00:50:50,800 --> 00:50:53,880
Speaker 6: part of getting podcasts more prominence and more listeners. And

998
00:50:53,920 --> 00:50:57,000
Speaker 6: while you're there, we appreciate every rating and review. Every

999
00:50:57,040 --> 00:50:59,400
Speaker 6: thumbs up helps us find new listeners and keeps the

1000
00:50:59,400 --> 00:51:02,000
Speaker 6: show going. Thanks to Colin the Animal Griffith for his

1001
00:51:02,040 --> 00:51:05,160
Speaker 6: assistants producing the show, and thanks to Geneviev Kasi for

1002
00:51:05,239 --> 00:51:09,040
Speaker 6: bribing recording space at her home base. Genevieve Koski's apartment.

1003
00:51:09,640 --> 00:51:11,440
Speaker 6: The Next Picture Show is proud to be part of

1004
00:51:11,440 --> 00:51:14,200
Speaker 6: the Film Spotting family of podcasts and the Pampley Network.

1005
00:51:14,440 --> 00:51:15,600
Speaker 6: Please tune in the next time