Speaker 1: Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind from how Stuff
Speaker 1: Works dot Com. Yea, Hey, welcome to Stuff to Blow
Speaker 1: your Mind. My name is Robert Lamb and I'm Julie Douglas. Julie.
Speaker 1: We often think about ourselves as as a whole, and
Speaker 1: we've we've discussed that before in the past, and sort
Speaker 1: of the fallacy that we think of ourselves as this
Speaker 1: one body, this one autonomous thing, but of course we
Speaker 1: are also a host of smaller creatures living inside us.
Speaker 1: You can say, you can also go far to say
Speaker 1: that our our cellular communities are nothing more than than
Speaker 1: just that communities of individuals that make up this whole.
Speaker 1: And in this episode of stuff Will in your mind,
Speaker 1: we're gonna throw another log onto that fire that illuminates
Speaker 1: the the multiple aspects of who we are. That's right.
Speaker 1: It is the chimera, which is this idea that comes
Speaker 1: from Greek mythology. We're talking about a fire breathing creature
Speaker 1: that was part serpent, part lion, and part goat. And
Speaker 1: in many ways, when we talk about being host and
Speaker 1: and having some sort of micro biome in us, that
Speaker 1: perhaps gaming the way that we work physically and mentally,
Speaker 1: we are these kind of part line goat Chimera. Yeah.
Speaker 1: According to Homer, Um it just had the body of
Speaker 1: the gigantic goat, the hind parts of the serpent, the
Speaker 1: head of a lion, other depictions. You see, it is
Speaker 1: having head of all three. Really, it's kind of train
Speaker 1: wreck of a monster. It's not it's not not the
Speaker 1: most elegant. Uh. It was said to be the progeny
Speaker 1: of two other monsters, um a kidney beautiful woman up top,
Speaker 1: serpent down below, and Typhon, which is a nebulous gigantic
Speaker 1: form composed of hundreds of dragons, heads and serpent, arms
Speaker 1: and legs, breathe fire and love. And it was created
Speaker 1: by Gaya after the defeat of the Titans to assail
Speaker 1: the forces of the gods. And in the Chimera had
Speaker 1: all these monsters siblings, including Cerebus, the Ninian Lion, the Hydra,
Speaker 1: and the Sphinx. Is eventually slain by Bellerophon Astride the Pegasus,
Speaker 1: and in medieval already comes to symbolize the complex na
Speaker 1: nature of evil. Okay, and we we wanted to bring
Speaker 1: up the Chimera in both its mythological form and in
Speaker 1: the form of animals because we're going to get to it.
Speaker 1: But there's some really cool things going on on a
Speaker 1: celegular level that sort of brings into question who we are.
Speaker 1: We always bring this up, like, am I really me?
Speaker 1: Am I? Parts of me? Um? What is mean? What's this?
Speaker 1: My brain and my body? Am I a brain? Body?
Speaker 1: Am I the me that I think I am? Or
Speaker 1: am I to me that exists under the surface of
Speaker 1: conscious thought? Well? Or am I the me that is
Speaker 1: really accumulation of actually other people in other people's cells?
Speaker 1: How could that be? Yes, we'll find out. But first
Speaker 1: let's talk about some naturally occurring chimeras. We're talking about slime, mold,
Speaker 1: and corals. Those are far less ominous than the fire
Speaker 1: breathing kind, right and um. Chimeric can also refer to
Speaker 1: an animal that has two or more different sets of
Speaker 1: genetically distinct cells working together. So we have a couple
Speaker 1: of man made examples. One is a pig that researchers
Speaker 1: at the Mayo Clinic in Minnesota had created a pig
Speaker 1: with human blood pumping through its veins, and some of
Speaker 1: the cells merged together, creating pig human cell hybrid cells. Here.
Speaker 1: So what we're talking about is this idea that you
Speaker 1: can have an experiment that could give scientists bet our
Speaker 1: understanding of how viral infections can pass from one animal
Speaker 1: to humans, like HIV. It's not just like, hey, let's
Speaker 1: cross a pig's blood with a humans blood and have
Speaker 1: some fun here, you know. It kind of sounds like
Speaker 1: it's a way to to create a ready source of
Speaker 1: human blood and then you just mark the pigs in
Speaker 1: when it's time for a transfusion. That would work too. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's kind of monstrous on all fronts. But I mean,
Speaker 1: but again, we get into this idea that we're dealing with,
Speaker 1: this initial idea that chimera as a monster, that any
Speaker 1: kind of form that involves bits of others is a hybrid,
Speaker 1: and it's weird and it's gross and probably against God's
Speaker 1: natural order. But it's we discussing here. Hybrids do occur
Speaker 1: within the natural limits of life, and in a sense,
Speaker 1: we are all chimeras. It's right, micro chimers, which we'll
Speaker 1: talk about in a moment. But I wanted to bring
Speaker 1: up this particularly uh pure form of chimera in the
Speaker 1: form of humans. And uh, this became known because in
Speaker 1: a woman named Jane found out that she needed a
Speaker 1: kidney transplant. An amazing story, all right, So she has
Speaker 1: her son, she has three sons, and uh, they give
Speaker 1: some blood samples to see if she would be a
Speaker 1: good match to be a kidney downer. Well what comes
Speaker 1: back is that, okay, um, what you know, miss Jane
Speaker 1: or whatever your full name is, because that's never actually
Speaker 1: told obviously for her privacy. But what comes back is,
Speaker 1: miss Jane, we want to tell you that you could
Speaker 1: not possibly be the biological mother of these two of
Speaker 1: your three sons, which to her is sort of like,
Speaker 1: what are you talking about? Because that it either means oh,
Speaker 1: I'm not who I think I am or the children
Speaker 1: were swapped out in the hospital. You can just imagine
Speaker 1: the various scenarios that would roll around in your head
Speaker 1: and wrestle with each other when the doctors telling you that, yeah,
Speaker 1: and she's saying, no, I'm the biological mother these children.
Speaker 1: Trust me. I had them. They came out of my uterus.
Speaker 1: I have this memory of it. And they keep saying, well,
Speaker 1: are you sure you know? Maybe they were switched at birth?
Speaker 1: And it took the researchers two years to figure this out.
Speaker 1: But Margot Crestfall, she was a daughter. She is a
Speaker 1: doctor at Beth Israel Deaconess Medical Center in Boston figured
Speaker 1: out that Jane is a chimera, a mixture of two individuals,
Speaker 1: and what we're talking about are non identical twin sisters
Speaker 1: who fused in the womb and grew into a single body. Yes,
Speaker 1: she dwight shrewded her twin. Well, it's it's almost crazier
Speaker 1: than that. It's like, it's not just like she be.
Speaker 1: Those two people became one, you know. It's like it's
Speaker 1: like the fly Jeff Goldbloom in a telepod with a fly,
Speaker 1: and they emerged, the one being on the other end,
Speaker 1: essentially a chimera. And here we have in the telepod
Speaker 1: of the womb, these two individuals merged together and become
Speaker 1: a single organism, a single individual. Yes, so I mean
Speaker 1: she is She's technically a tetra game medic chimera, and
Speaker 1: that is a person whose body is made up from
Speaker 1: two genetically distinct lines of cells derived from a total
Speaker 1: of four gamme eats, eggs, and sperm. So the cells
Speaker 1: from only one twin have come to dominate and Jane's blood,
Speaker 1: so the tissue used in the tissue typing in the
Speaker 1: test for her kidney. That's what we're talking about here.
Speaker 1: In her other tissues, including her ovaries, cells of both
Speaker 1: types of lived alongside each other. And that accounts for
Speaker 1: the genetics of her three sons, because one came from
Speaker 1: an egg derived from the twin who cells dominate Jane's blood,
Speaker 1: while the two brother the other two brothers came from
Speaker 1: eggs derived from the other twin cells. Wow. So it's
Speaker 1: so even though one of the twins ended up being
Speaker 1: dominant in the individual, the other twin managed to have children.
Speaker 1: Like that's just like almost almost like a ghostly sense,
Speaker 1: almost like from beyond the grave. Well, that's what's so
Speaker 1: amazing about this, this idea that you could carry with
Speaker 1: you someone else's cells and that Yeah, there's just this
Speaker 1: ghostly like sort of association that that would be informing
Speaker 1: also your children, your children's genetics. Uh so that that
Speaker 1: is an extreme case of this. Imagine your your siblings
Speaker 1: and you both have the same mother, but you have
Speaker 1: two different biological mothers, but those two biological mothers are
Speaker 1: the same mother. It. Wow, it's really confusing. It's a
Speaker 1: bit of a head trip. But now um ivf in
Speaker 1: vitro fertilization increases the odds of having for tunnel twins
Speaker 1: about thirtyfold and is also associated with an increased risk
Speaker 1: of chimera. So it may not be I mean, they
Speaker 1: don't have a ton of research on on this so far,
Speaker 1: but it may not just be so crazy going forward,
Speaker 1: since IVF has been a pretty good option out there
Speaker 1: for a couple of decades. Now. Yeah, but this is
Speaker 1: an extreme example of cells dominating your body. But it
Speaker 1: turns out that all of us have cells from someone
Speaker 1: else hanging out, which seems like an incredible statement, but
Speaker 1: it is true. And in this we're getting into the
Speaker 1: realm of microchimerism. Yeah. So this is when you possess
Speaker 1: a small number of cells in your body that are
Speaker 1: not genetically your own. And this was first noticed in
Speaker 1: nine when a researcher at Stanford University found a few
Speaker 1: cells with Y sex chromosomes and a pregnant woman's blood
Speaker 1: and those cells had to have come from her son
Speaker 1: since women have only X chromosomes. She had male chromosomes
Speaker 1: in her body even though she's a pregnant female, right,
Speaker 1: So that that was the first inkling that something was
Speaker 1: going on. Um, so it turns out that all pregnant
Speaker 1: women carry some these are called fetals els by the way,
Speaker 1: and DNA. Up to six percent of the free floating
Speaker 1: DNA in the mother's blood plasma comes from the fetus,
Speaker 1: and after the baby is born, those numbers plummet, but
Speaker 1: some cells remain and they actually just don't hang out there.
Speaker 1: They they do things in the body. And we'll talk
Speaker 1: a little bit more about that. Yeah, there's a wonderful
Speaker 1: quote in this New Scientists article by Nancy Shoot Beyond Birth,
Speaker 1: and it goes as follows. She says, mother and child
Speaker 1: are engaged in a silent chemical conversation throughout pregnancy, with
Speaker 1: bits of genetic material and cells passing not only from
Speaker 1: mother to child, but also from child to mother. That's
Speaker 1: right in that two way street is the pacenta, right um.
Speaker 1: The pacenta is an organ it's built of cells from
Speaker 1: both the mother and the fetus, and it serves just
Speaker 1: as a reminder for everybody as a conduit for the
Speaker 1: exchange of nutrients, gases, and waste. And so it's porous,
Speaker 1: and so you do have the cells um from from
Speaker 1: mother and child passing between each other. That's one of
Speaker 1: the ways that you can pass cells to each other,
Speaker 1: kind of a cellular backwash. I like that. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: you're backwash. After cells crossover, some get rounded up and
Speaker 1: killed by the new host immune system, but some of
Speaker 1: them take root in the body. They burrow into the heart, liver, kidneys,
Speaker 1: spleen skin, pancreas, gall bladdering testines, among other places. They're
Speaker 1: kind of like squatters, really like they are clearly and
Speaker 1: not supposed to be there. Police round up the ones
Speaker 1: they can, but communities begin to take root in certain
Speaker 1: you know, abandoned buildings and back alleys. Yeah, and some
Speaker 1: of them become really productive members of body society. And
Speaker 1: this will discuss somebody not um Now. The fetal cells
Speaker 1: can also be passed through mother to infant, through nursing,
Speaker 1: and also through transfusions and transplants. We're talking about bone
Speaker 1: marrow transplants and organ transplants, and that sort of brings
Speaker 1: up into question, you know, well, how do these cells
Speaker 1: figure into someone who's not even related to the person
Speaker 1: who you know, the organ was transplanted in. And we
Speaker 1: cannot answer these questions right now. In fact, this discovery
Speaker 1: of microchimerism actually brings up a lot more questions than answers.
Speaker 1: But it's pretty fascinating stuff. Let's take a quick break
Speaker 1: and when we get back, we're going to talk about
Speaker 1: how those fetal cells hang out in your body and
Speaker 1: what they do. All right, we're back. Microchimerism. It's pretty nutty,
Speaker 1: it yeah. In fact, last year it was found that
Speaker 1: male DNA was discovered in the female brain, and this
Speaker 1: led everybody to understand that fetal cells are able to
Speaker 1: cross the blood brain barrier. Now, this is that that
Speaker 1: sort of membrane that keeps out sort of the bad
Speaker 1: things that make sure that you don't get toxic chemicals
Speaker 1: that are traveling to your brain and and messing up
Speaker 1: the works in there um. But this fetal cell being
Speaker 1: able to cross the blood brain barrier was found in
Speaker 1: Researchers at the Department Biochemistry at the University of Alberta
Speaker 1: examined brain autopsy specimens from fifty nine women. They had
Speaker 1: died between the ages of thirty two and a hundred
Speaker 1: and one. Now, male microcomerism, as it's called in this case,
Speaker 1: was detected in sixty three percent of the subjects and
Speaker 1: was distributed in multiple brain regions and was potentially persistent
Speaker 1: throughout the human lifespans. Of the sixty percent of the subjects,
Speaker 1: the oldest female in whom male fetal DNA was detected
Speaker 1: in the brain was ninety four years old. Now this
Speaker 1: is kind of a huge thing because they had known
Speaker 1: that had migrated to different parts of the body, but
Speaker 1: they did not know what it was doing in the
Speaker 1: brain and if it even acted on the brain, and
Speaker 1: that is still a big question mark. But they have
Speaker 1: looked at Alzheimer's disease because they know that it's more
Speaker 1: common in women who have had multiple pregnancies, and they
Speaker 1: thought that they would find that the number of fetal
Speaker 1: sales would be a lot greater in women with Alzheimer's
Speaker 1: compared to those who had no evidence for any sort
Speaker 1: of neurological disorders or disease. But this is the weird
Speaker 1: thing that the opposite was true of what they thought
Speaker 1: was going to happen. There were fewer fetal derived cells
Speaker 1: and women with Alzheimer's. So they're still trying to figure
Speaker 1: out what sort of connection that might have. And you know,
Speaker 1: long term, there might be some sort of information about
Speaker 1: how those how those cells act on the brain, and
Speaker 1: you know, you have to also consider that in animal
Speaker 1: studies that microchimerate cells were found in maternal brains where
Speaker 1: they became nerve cells, it became active members of that
Speaker 1: brain society, suggesting that they might have a functionality integrated. Now,
Speaker 1: of course, in all this you have to avoid the
Speaker 1: temptation to fall into a magical understanding of what's happening.
Speaker 1: When when we were researching this, I kept finding people
Speaker 1: talking about some of these studies on message boards and
Speaker 1: getting a little sentimental and at times a little goofy
Speaker 1: about what it meant. Uh. And certainly you see that
Speaker 1: even with with ideas of organ transplants and limb transplants
Speaker 1: and mean sort of the idea that you know, go
Speaker 1: back to the little horror movie with Michael Caine. You
Speaker 1: get a hand transplanted onto your body and it's the
Speaker 1: hand of a criminal, and suddenly you're gonna do criminal
Speaker 1: things because it's the criminal's body part, that's the criminals hand,
Speaker 1: and now it's part of you. So you have to again,
Speaker 1: you have to put that out of your head. Um.
Speaker 1: And there's plenty of weird, almost magical seeming stuff that's
Speaker 1: going on anyway, without bringing all of that nonsense and
Speaker 1: the equation. It's true, and you know, at some level though,
Speaker 1: it is symbolic and it's kind of nice to think that,
Speaker 1: you know, your mom is always carrying a bit of
Speaker 1: you around, and you're always carrying around some of your mom.
Speaker 1: But then but but again, it's just it's selves, it's
Speaker 1: not it sells. But here's this just a complicated Like
Speaker 1: there's a little her in your flesh pocket on your side,
Speaker 1: and she's looking up at you like telling you to
Speaker 1: eat your piece. Totally is right now my flesh pocket. Thanks, Yeah,
Speaker 1: hey mom um. So here's here's something to complicated. There's
Speaker 1: a possibility that sells from an older sibling residing in
Speaker 1: the mother may find their way back across the placenta
Speaker 1: to a younger sibling. Now that's where it just gets
Speaker 1: kind of gross. Like, here's the weird thing, Like, it's
Speaker 1: very possible that that I have not only my mom
Speaker 1: cells floating around, but my brothers and my daughters. Which
Speaker 1: is fine, I mean, obviously it's all working out. But
Speaker 1: with your daughter, I mean obviously there's a stronger connective.
Speaker 1: But you're you've discussed before how you and your brother
Speaker 1: are kind of different organisms, right, I mean you're rather different. Well, yeah,
Speaker 1: of course we're different in many ways. But it is
Speaker 1: kind of interesting to me as at the second born.
Speaker 1: It's always like, man, seriously, you always get like, you know,
Speaker 1: second banana hand me down cells, right, thanks a lot.
Speaker 1: Uh No, twins, of course, identical twins can also exchange
Speaker 1: micro comeric cells through the sheriff of sentence, so us
Speaker 1: I don't think anything that's shocking, especially since we've already
Speaker 1: stablished they can merge together into one organism. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: I don't put anything past them, exactly. You gotta watch
Speaker 1: out for the twins. They'll do it before you're born.
Speaker 1: If there are any twins out there listening, don't do
Speaker 1: it later. So much hard to absorb each other or
Speaker 1: across cells. Absorb each other or across cells. I mean,
Speaker 1: both are a little more difficult and a little more
Speaker 1: problematic if you do it as adults. It's true outside
Speaker 1: the womb, that is, there's a menial logistics there. Um.
Speaker 1: So here's some also interesting thing. There's evidence for competition
Speaker 1: between cells from from grandmother in infant within the mother. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So that's where it gets a little dicey, and that's
Speaker 1: when we start to talk about autoimmune issues. Yeah, because
Speaker 1: we have. One of the problems with the autoimmune situation
Speaker 1: is that there's the theory is that you have essentially
Speaker 1: alien cells in the body. In the immune system detects
Speaker 1: alien cells, they're going to fight against them in the
Speaker 1: same way that they would have destroyed a number of
Speaker 1: them immediately following the birth of the child. So you
Speaker 1: get that, you know, the problem of an autoimmune defense
Speaker 1: network attacking the body itself and all the complications that
Speaker 1: arise from that. Yeah, I mean because some autommune diseases,
Speaker 1: which current women three times more than in men, are
Speaker 1: thought to be associated with this problem, right, this sort
Speaker 1: of they're not assimilating, right, um, the Civil War in
Speaker 1: the Yeah, they're trying to figure out like why are
Speaker 1: you here? Should you be here? Um? And that's when
Speaker 1: you see sort of things like multiple multiple sclorious as
Speaker 1: being exacerbated by this issue of fetal cells. Now, the
Speaker 1: good news is that, um, these fetal cells can kind
Speaker 1: of act like stem cells depending on where they are, Uh,
Speaker 1: they can actually help to repair damage tissue. And they're
Speaker 1: essentially a transplant of younger, healthier cells in depleted organs,
Speaker 1: So they might help protect against certain types of cancer.
Speaker 1: So women with breast cancer, for instance, they generally have
Speaker 1: lower levels of microclimerrism than women who don't develop disease,
Speaker 1: and the suggests a possible role for fetal cells and
Speaker 1: helping to detect and destroy tumors because if you think
Speaker 1: about it, uh, those microclimeric cells from a pregnancy, they're
Speaker 1: recognized by the mom's immune system is belonging to the
Speaker 1: mother since they're genetically half identical to the mother, so
Speaker 1: they get a pass. So they're they're sort of foreign
Speaker 1: to the immune system, but you know, because of the
Speaker 1: father's contribution. But they also this is the idea, they
Speaker 1: may prime the immune system to be alert for cells
Speaker 1: that are similar to the self but with genetic differences.
Speaker 1: So the idea is that having the presence of microchlimeric
Speaker 1: cells and the body could kind of ferret out cancer
Speaker 1: cells and then stem the growth of any tumors. Sort
Speaker 1: of like, hey, we're on the alert for you, but
Speaker 1: we're also and you're fine, you get a pass, but
Speaker 1: these other guys they're not passing the test. So sometimes
Speaker 1: hand me down. That stuff is really good stuff. That's
Speaker 1: the thing. Sometimes you can really make something out of it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I mean, it's really cool and Nancy shoot, you had
Speaker 1: mentioned before in her Beyond Birth article says that fetal
Speaker 1: cells also appeared to migrate to injury sites and have
Speaker 1: been found in patients with thyroid and liver damage where
Speaker 1: they had morphed into organ cells. Wow, so like you can, Yeah,
Speaker 1: you can, on a very soular level, you can get
Speaker 1: into this idea that my daughter is healing me, my
Speaker 1: my my son is healing my body well. And it's
Speaker 1: interesting that you say that because there was one account
Speaker 1: I can't remember which article, but one of them had
Speaker 1: said that there was someone who was going through cancer
Speaker 1: treatments and they kept that in mind. My son is
Speaker 1: helping to heal me through this. His cells are combating
Speaker 1: the cancer cells. And yes, there's a bit of magical
Speaker 1: thinking to that, but it's sort of lovely. Yeah, just
Speaker 1: don't let it fill into like full on cannibalism, because
Speaker 1: I'd be like, I'm feeling at they're on a little
Speaker 1: thick here. But I bet if I ate the kid's arm,
Speaker 1: then I maybe get a replenishment. It won't work. Messy defects. Okay. Yeah, Um,
Speaker 1: so of course we have to to start thinking about
Speaker 1: this in a future sense and One of the ways
Speaker 1: that researchers and scientists are is to actually look at dogs,
Speaker 1: because it turns out microchimerism is present in some dogs,
Speaker 1: and now makes setting the condition a lot easier because
Speaker 1: you're talking about lifespans ten to twenty years as opposed
Speaker 1: to seventy eighty years. So they begin to kind of
Speaker 1: look at what that might mean, um, to have these
Speaker 1: cells acting like stem cells, or even acting against the museum,
Speaker 1: acting against museums, acting about against the immune system, and
Speaker 1: then how does this affect the world of human cloning. Well,
Speaker 1: it's not as straightforward as we thought, right, yeah, because
Speaker 1: it's it's one thing. Because again, we we have this
Speaker 1: this notion that we get in our heads that that
Speaker 1: I am this one product and if you distole me
Speaker 1: down on these cells, on this DNA, on this person,
Speaker 1: and then if we can just recreate that data, then
Speaker 1: we can recreate, at least in a bodily sense, we
Speaker 1: can recreate ourselves. But now you're having to take into account.
Speaker 1: I mean, we've discussed, um, you know, all the microbes
Speaker 1: that live inside us, and now we have to take
Speaker 1: into account different cellular communities from other individuals that make
Speaker 1: up who we are, how do you replicate that in
Speaker 1: a awning scenario? Right, and not to mention the microbiota
Speaker 1: that exists within everyone that is also again influencing how
Speaker 1: we moved through the world and what sort of diseases
Speaker 1: we may or may not get. Also have the genetics, right, Yeah, Well,
Speaker 1: it's like with with cloning. It's um it reminds me
Speaker 1: of the movie The Boys from Brazil based on the book,
Speaker 1: where you had a plot to clone Hitler and it's
Speaker 1: the plot really has a has some fun with the
Speaker 1: idea of well, you would have to not only have
Speaker 1: a genetic duplicate, you would have to then recreate all
Speaker 1: the circumstances that made that person who they were. And
Speaker 1: uh in the film sort of operates on the idea that, well,
Speaker 1: the genetic side is simple to genetic side is just
Speaker 1: pretty straightforward. But it's that conditioning that's where the problem lies.
Speaker 1: But we're saying more and more that the genetic side
Speaker 1: of things, the cellular side of things is almost equally
Speaker 1: complicated if you were actually trying to replicate an individual. Right,
Speaker 1: So this idea that we're just unique and we're just
Speaker 1: sort of preset with this program at birth, it's following
Speaker 1: away away, because now we all realize that we really
Speaker 1: truly are chimeras. Yeah, an innocence kind of ephemeral, I mean,
Speaker 1: rather ephemeral. Yeah, all right, I just checked my pocket
Speaker 1: of flesh and mom says it's time to wrap it up. Okay,
Speaker 1: all right, well, uh well pocket of flesh mom, or
Speaker 1: we will call it an episode then. But we'd love
Speaker 1: to hear from all of you guys and gals out there.
Speaker 1: What do you think about this information? Um? How does
Speaker 1: it make you think about your relationships with with your parents,
Speaker 1: with your children, with strangers, you know, sibling, your sibling,
Speaker 1: you know? How does it make you feel that your older,
Speaker 1: younger brother maybe a part of who you are on
Speaker 1: a solar level? Does that creep you out? Or does
Speaker 1: it give you hope? I don't know? And then how
Speaker 1: do you and then you know, to what extent do
Speaker 1: you draw thin magical interpretations of this into your indual world?
Speaker 1: Few we'd love to hear from you. You You can find
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