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Speaker 1: Now I'm Bloomberg with about the government. What are the

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Speaker 1: political reality the president has increasingly frustrated. I want to

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Speaker 1: try to cut through the noise politically. This is devastating

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Speaker 1: sound off with Ken insiders, the influencers, insiders. There is

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Speaker 1: no secret that I care a lot about the consumers.

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Speaker 1: There are real questions about big tech. We still have

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Speaker 1: more leverage to me. As Ricket's harraffs, I think we

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Speaker 1: could do with a little less drama from the white

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Speaker 1: of This is sound on with Kevin's really on Bloomberg

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Speaker 1: nine one and one oh five point seven a m

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Speaker 1: h D two Boltimore one A day, very cold outside,

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Speaker 1: and the prospects are chili of another government shutdown. The

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Speaker 1: back and forth continuing today between lawmakers up on Capitol Hill.

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Speaker 1: It seems Republicans want to make a deal, trying to

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Speaker 1: make a deal, but Democrats are saying, Okay, where is

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Speaker 1: the deal. We're going to dive into all of the

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Speaker 1: policy implications of that, plus the situation in Venezuela and

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Speaker 1: Mr Balton leaving notes to be found about potential troops

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Speaker 1: in Columbia. We're going to dive into that, and of

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Speaker 1: course also the Chinese delegation set to me in town

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Speaker 1: tomorrow and what it all means with the backdrop of

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Speaker 1: Chinese telecommunications from Huawei getting those new charges. It's not

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Speaker 1: just Roger Stone who is in legal trouble. All Star

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Speaker 1: Panel today, let of course by our senior White House

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Speaker 1: reporter Shannon Petty Pieces with me for the A Block,

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Speaker 1: as well as Mark Latter, a former special assistant to

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Speaker 1: President Trump and former Press secretary for Vice President Mike Pence.

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Speaker 1: And David Litt because it was supposed to be the

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Speaker 1: State of the Union tonight, but he's with us anyway,

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Speaker 1: It's coming next week. We hear David Litt is a

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Speaker 1: former speechwriter for former President Barack Obama, what he thinks

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Speaker 1: of all the jockeying with Democrats with just less than

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Speaker 1: three weeks to go until the government shuts down once again,

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Speaker 1: and already it seems we're at a stalemate between Republicans

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Speaker 1: and Democrats in the back and worth up on Capitol Hill.

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Speaker 1: Shannon Petty piece covers the White House for Bloomberg News

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Speaker 1: and Shannon, you and I were talking earlier today just

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Speaker 1: about it really feels like a rerun? Yes, well, like

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Speaker 1: have we seen this episode before? Well, I think that's

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Speaker 1: gonna make it easier for us who covered these things.

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Speaker 1: As you know, I do these shutdowns over and over again,

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Speaker 1: and or you know, I see someone fired over and

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Speaker 1: over again. I say, Okay, well, now this is my

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Speaker 1: first rodeo. I know how this goes an unfold. I

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Speaker 1: know how to call you know, I know what the

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Speaker 1: next beat is gonna be on this. So this shutdown

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Speaker 1: I'll be very well experienced, like a veteran of It's

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Speaker 1: like another snowstorm. Um. Yeah, but it's kind of off

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Speaker 1: to a slow start yet, which isn't a great sign

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Speaker 1: because they don't really have that much time. Um. I mean,

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Speaker 1: Democrats can't use this um argument anymore that they're not

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Speaker 1: going to negotiate seriously until the government's reopened. So that

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Speaker 1: sort of prevented them from having to, um, you know,

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Speaker 1: put a stake in the ground and and put some

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Speaker 1: real firm positions down because they were able to say,

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Speaker 1: reopen the government and then we'll talk. So now they

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Speaker 1: actually have to talk, they have to come up with

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Speaker 1: a deal. I mean, it's not that there's not a

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Speaker 1: deal that can be had here. There's a lot of

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Speaker 1: pieces that can be traded for each other there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of cards people can put on the table. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, dreamers, DOCTA, the TPS population, it's the same.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't It doesn't seem like there's a major, major breakthrough.

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Speaker 1: Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell addressing reporters earlier today, and

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Speaker 1: he was optimistic. Take a listen to what Senate Majority

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Speaker 1: Leader Mitch McConnell had to say for whatever works, which

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Speaker 1: means avoiding a shotdown and avoiding as the president feeling

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Speaker 1: he should declare a national emergency. Exactly how to do that,

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Speaker 1: as you all know, has been quite challenging. So that

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Speaker 1: was Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell. He said he's for

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Speaker 1: whatever works, really not staking out too firm of a

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Speaker 1: position in terms of how he's willing to negotiate this.

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Speaker 1: Within the last of five days or so, we've seen

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Speaker 1: the base of the Conservative Party criticized President Trump for

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Speaker 1: striking that. But Dammy Duckworth, well she had a different take.

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Speaker 1: Take a listen to what this. Democrats have Stop threatening

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Speaker 1: to shut down government again just to gain points with

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Speaker 1: your base. We are better than that. So that was

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Speaker 1: Senator Tammy Duckworth, the Democrat from Illinois Shannon Pete piece

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Speaker 1: who covers all things White House for Bloomberg News. Shannon,

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Speaker 1: So right there you have the snapshot. It's it is

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Speaker 1: a rerun, I mean. And and the backdrop to all

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Speaker 1: of this is that once again, eight hundred thousand federal

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Speaker 1: employees the economic impacts point two percent of GDP growth

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Speaker 1: shaved off of the first quarter alone. This ranked by

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Speaker 1: the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office. Meanwhile, the outside noise and

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Speaker 1: really not noise policy implications several of which we're going

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Speaker 1: to touch on later this hour, from the situation in

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Speaker 1: Venezuela as well as the ongoing trade talks with US

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Speaker 1: and China which begin and earnst tomorrow, all of which

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Speaker 1: it would appear this is a White House that seems

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Speaker 1: poised to to to have another brinksmanship battle. Well, I

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Speaker 1: don't know, because you hear McConnell's statement where he says,

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Speaker 1: I'm for whatever works, and I've heard other people saying today,

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Speaker 1: you know, we don't want another shutdown. No one wants

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Speaker 1: another shutdown. There were a lot of people at the

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Speaker 1: beginning of this who didn't really know what a shutdown was,

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Speaker 1: hadn't really felt that, which makes me kind of depressed

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Speaker 1: that these new lawmakers don't people in the White House,

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Speaker 1: people in the administration, and that's that's okay. They don't

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Speaker 1: happen that often luckily, Um, but now they know now

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Speaker 1: it's real. Now they know what they're signing up for,

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Speaker 1: what they're getting in for. And so I think that

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Speaker 1: could make both sides more flexible here, because yes, no

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Speaker 1: one really wants to go through this again. They have

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Speaker 1: other bigger policy agendas. Democrats have a lot of things

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Speaker 1: they want to be investigating. The White House has you know,

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Speaker 1: there's trying to get into mode. This does not help

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Speaker 1: with any of that. Mark Lawter is a former special

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Speaker 1: assistant to President Trump and a former press secretary for

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Speaker 1: Vice President Mike Pence. Does President Trump want another shutdown? Mark? No?

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Speaker 1: And I think you heard Sarah Sanders say that yesterday

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Speaker 1: at the podium, and I was at an event last

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Speaker 1: night where the President and Vice president spoke and he

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Speaker 1: reiterated that that he does not want another government shutdown.

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Speaker 1: He wants but he wants border security. And I think

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Speaker 1: what we're seeing now is this is this is the

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Speaker 1: three week window where Congress can do its job finally

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Speaker 1: or if not, I think the President's got a pin

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Speaker 1: in his pocket and he's ready to use it. This

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Speaker 1: is what I just, I truthfully do not understand. Mark Lauter,

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Speaker 1: former special assistant to President Donald Trump and former spokesman

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Speaker 1: to the Vice President. There's thirty seven percent, according to

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Speaker 1: the latest NBC News poll, supports the wall. That's about

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Speaker 1: almost three in four Intan Americans. A little less than

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Speaker 1: four Insan Americans support the wall. So that's not nobody.

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Speaker 1: I mean, that's a that's a pretty hefty large amount.

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Speaker 1: So if he's listening to the base, if he wants

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Speaker 1: the wall, why threaten using declaring a national emergency? Why

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Speaker 1: not just do it and save? And if that's the

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Speaker 1: conclusion that you're gonna get to, why not just do it? Well,

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Speaker 1: I think to mill and he has said this on

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Speaker 1: many occasions, he would like to see this go through

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Speaker 1: normal order because we both know that if he signs

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Speaker 1: a national emergency or uses some of the other legal

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Speaker 1: powers he could use to get the funding to build

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Speaker 1: the enhanced fencing there, it's gonna go through the court battles,

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Speaker 1: and it's going to be two years or so of

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Speaker 1: back and forth with a district court doing this and

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Speaker 1: then the Ninth Circuit, of course, ruling in favor of

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Speaker 1: you know, against the president. Supreme Court is gonna uphold

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Speaker 1: the president's powers to do these things. And two years

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Speaker 1: will have been wasted if we can get Congress to

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Speaker 1: do its job. And the president is not listening to

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Speaker 1: the public opinion polls on this, He's actually listening to

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Speaker 1: the experts. The people from Customs and Border Patrol say

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Speaker 1: this works. There are areas where we need it. Former

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Speaker 1: President Obama's former head cub said, walls work, we need

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Speaker 1: this is No one is disputing that that. I mean

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Speaker 1: a lot of I mean I remember covering Democrats, and

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Speaker 1: I remember the oh eight primary before I got into

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Speaker 1: when I was still in school dating myself, uh where

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Speaker 1: Quinton was for driver's license up for for illegal memos.

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Speaker 1: But Martin Ladder, you a former special assistant to President Trump.

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Speaker 1: Shannon Petty pieces also with us in studio of bloom

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Speaker 1: Burgener's White House Reporter, and we both looked at each

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Speaker 1: other when you just said something, because you said special

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Speaker 1: hand in hand hands fencing enhanced. You are very good

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Speaker 1: at messaging. Master. Um. You know the I mean the

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Speaker 1: back walking from the wall. You know the wall, the

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Speaker 1: steel flats, the steel wall, the see through steel, the

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Speaker 1: you know, call it whatever you want. So and it's

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Speaker 1: also not two thousand miles anymore, it's not two hundred

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Speaker 1: with us. Why aren't you saying now enhanced fencing is that?

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Speaker 1: Does that play better to Democrats? To independence? I mean,

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Speaker 1: what's with the what's what we've seen. We've seen We've

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Speaker 1: seen where Stinny Hoyer and others have said fences, barriers, fencing,

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Speaker 1: they work. We we could be open to some of

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Speaker 1: those things. And the President said it, he said it

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Speaker 1: last night again, He's like, I don't care what we

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Speaker 1: call it, if if, if we need to call it

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Speaker 1: steal slats, He's like, those work the best. They're better

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Speaker 1: than concrete. They're a little more expensive, or but they

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Speaker 1: need to be see through. These are the kinds of things.

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Speaker 1: If if we need to change it from a wall

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Speaker 1: because they made it a four letter word, then we'll

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Speaker 1: call it steal slats or a barrier. This is just

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Speaker 1: so interesting to me. We're much more ahead on on

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Speaker 1: the situation with the partial government shutdown, and we do

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Speaker 1: want to touch on these other major policy developments economically speaking,

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Speaker 1: including the US China trade talks, which begin really in

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Speaker 1: earnest this week and the situation in Venezbela. My thanks

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Speaker 1: to Shannon Petty Peace, Bloomberger News White House reporter, a

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Speaker 1: close friend. Appreciate you stopping in getting away from your

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Speaker 1: desk as you're writing a million stories. Mark Lodder days

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Speaker 1: former special assistant. It's a President Trump. And David Litt

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Speaker 1: joins the panel. He is a former Obama speech writer,

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Speaker 1: and we're gonna get his take on what Mark just

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Speaker 1: said about enhanced fencing, enhanced build, enhanced fence. I'm Kevin Sereli.

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Speaker 1: You're listening to Bloomberg. You're listening to Sound On with

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Speaker 1: Kevin Surreally on Bloomberg one and one oh five point

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Speaker 1: seven m HD two Boltomore, Welcome back. I'm Kevin Serelli,

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Speaker 1: Chief Washington correspondent for Bloomberg News. Mark Lotter is a

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Speaker 1: former special assistant to President Trump and the former press

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Speaker 1: secretary for Vice President Mike Pence. He's my guest for

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Speaker 1: the hour. Mark. You also have a firm in town

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Speaker 1: now right, Ah? Yeah, and LLC lot of Communications, Uh,

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Speaker 1: doing consulting work both for the RNC and outside candidates corporations,

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Speaker 1: things like that. And David Littz is a former Obama

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Speaker 1: speech writer, and he he was listening. You were listening, David,

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Speaker 1: to what Mark said before the break about uh, the

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Speaker 1: wall and the shutdown and the Republicans and Democrats going

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Speaker 1: back and forth less than three weeks to go to

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Speaker 1: strike a deal. The bickerning continued amongst party lines today.

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Speaker 1: But Mark said something interesting in the segment, which was

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Speaker 1: quote unquote enhanced fencing. I believe Marcus what you said, enhancedcing.

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Speaker 1: So why from your perspective, David, as a as a

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Speaker 1: democratic strategist, as someone who has been crafting policy and

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Speaker 1: comedic speeches and and nose messaging democratic messaging just as

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Speaker 1: well as anyone in Washington, why do you think enhanced

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Speaker 1: fencing will will be able to be sold better to

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Speaker 1: Democrats than the wall? Well, I mean, I remember the

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Speaker 1: two thousand sixteen campaign and the the cheers of build

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Speaker 1: that enhanced fencing, Build that enhanced fencing, the auditoriums throughout

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Speaker 1: high school gyms throughout America. UM, I think that the

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Speaker 1: issue with border security, and Democrats have said this, and

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Speaker 1: I think it got pointed out earlier on this program,

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Speaker 1: is Democrats have always been fine with border security in

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Speaker 1: fact before border security generally speaking as a party, if

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Speaker 1: you look at the immigration compromise that seventy senators supported

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Speaker 1: Democrats and Republicans when Obama was president, it had a

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Speaker 1: lot of border security. I guess you could call it

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Speaker 1: enhanced fencing. You could call it twenty one century border security,

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Speaker 1: you could you could apply a lot of names to it.

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Speaker 1: The question is to me whether I think it's interesting

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Speaker 1: mark that that you're sort of as a messaging concept,

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Speaker 1: ready to abandon the idea of a physical barrier and

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Speaker 1: to enhanced fencing. No, not a I mean it will

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Speaker 1: still be a barrier. And as the President has said,

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Speaker 1: and they've shown the prototypes of the steel slats that

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Speaker 1: you can see through, because we need that from a

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Speaker 1: security standpoint, but you're not going to be able to

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Speaker 1: just easily climb over a fence like is what we've

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Speaker 1: got going on right now in many areas. So enhanced

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Speaker 1: fencing is just another name for steel slats. Is that

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Speaker 1: the idea? You can call it whatever it needs to

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Speaker 1: be called, as long as we can say see what

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Speaker 1: you're saying. Yeah, I don't think that's gonna I don't

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Speaker 1: think that Democrats are going to buy that I don't

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Speaker 1: think they really have a reason to. It's it's a

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Speaker 1: very unpopular position, and I don't think that we don't

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Speaker 1: we don't reframe it's going govern policy based on public

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Speaker 1: opinion polls. We need to listen to what the experts say,

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Speaker 1: and the Customs and Border Protection officials, both current and former,

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Speaker 1: even under President Obama, say we need border barriers or

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Speaker 1: enhanced fencing or whatever you want to call it in

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Speaker 1: certain areas. There's two hundred and thirty five miles that

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Speaker 1: they have identified where it is needed, and the President

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Speaker 1: is offering not only to do that, but he's also

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Speaker 1: saying I will increase personnel and technology and resources at

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Speaker 1: the ports of entry in order to stop it and

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Speaker 1: coming across there as well. And Mark Lauter, former special

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Speaker 1: assistant to President Trump and former Press secretary Press secretary

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Speaker 1: for Vice President Mike Pence, as well as David let

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Speaker 1: a former Obama speech writer, here with me for the hour. Uh,

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Speaker 1: you know, I hearing the back and forth in terms

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Speaker 1: of the wall, build the wall, don't build the wall,

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Speaker 1: enhanced fencing still starts, call it what you want. It's

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Speaker 1: still quite remarkable though, I mean, just that we're still

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Speaker 1: here and that we hit upon And I said this

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Speaker 1: on last week on Friday, I said it throughout the

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Speaker 1: weekend that it really wasn't for Speaker Pelosi. I mean,

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Speaker 1: she won a political battle, but it was just a

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Speaker 1: pause button. And so even if you look at the polling,

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Speaker 1: uh David Lett, former Obama speech trader here with us,

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Speaker 1: is it problematic at all for Democrats to engage? And again,

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Speaker 1: if you want to blame Republicans, blame Republicans. If you

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Speaker 1: want to blame Democrats, blame democrats. But is it is

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Speaker 1: it disadvantageous to House Democrats with this new majority to

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Speaker 1: have another prolonged shutdown? It's disadvantageous to America. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I know we're talking politics, but the politics affects the country.

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Speaker 1: And I think that's the there's kind of a an

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Speaker 1: assumption underlying all of this that President Trump doesn't really

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Speaker 1: care what happens to eight hundred thousand Americans who didn't

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Speaker 1: get their paychecks. Um and and no, not just amongst Democrats,

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Speaker 1: including when amongst independence as well. But I mean, but

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Speaker 1: there's a large base, there's about thirty seven percent of

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Speaker 1: the country who wants him to keep doing But let me,

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Speaker 1: but let me ask my question a different way because

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Speaker 1: I hear what you're saying. But is it a problematic?

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Speaker 1: I mean, the longer that a shutdown goes on, regardless

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Speaker 1: of who gets blamed, wouldn't House Democrats if they don't

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Speaker 1: strike a deal, wouldn't they rather be able to to

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Speaker 1: to try to get new policy? I guess is there

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Speaker 1: an endangerment in terms of just engaging in a political

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Speaker 1: battle on President Trump's wall? Well, I think one way

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Speaker 1: to think about this. You're sort of asking, uh, let's

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Speaker 1: use the phrase it takes two to tango, right, if

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Speaker 1: someone decides to stop tangoing, that only takes one person.

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Speaker 1: So House Democrats, I think would love the government to function. Um,

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Speaker 1: we love the government to stay open. This was also

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Speaker 1: true when Obama was president and wanted the government to

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Speaker 1: stay open. The challenges Donald Trump is the president. If

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Speaker 1: he wants to shut down the government again, he can

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Speaker 1: all right, let's and in the idea of the takes

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Speaker 1: two to tango, though, where is the Democrats proposal? The

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Speaker 1: President has come out on many occasions, including the week

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Speaker 1: ago Saturday from the from the White House and offered

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Speaker 1: a proposal which included funding for a barrier, but also

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Speaker 1: included things that were identified by Democrats as their project.

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Speaker 1: I just don't understill haven't even gotten. I just don't understand.

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Speaker 1: I just don't. I just don't understand, like like truthfully

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Speaker 1: and and Mrs naive maybe, but seriously, just like, get

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Speaker 1: in a room, I'll moderate, get in a room. Republicans, Democrats,

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Speaker 1: you know, Majority Leader McConnell, Minority Leader, uh, Schumer there

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Speaker 1: it is, Speaker Pelosi, President Trump, Vice President, Pencil bossmart

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Speaker 1: Just getting a room and figure this out. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I just think I personally, I think Independence are looking

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Speaker 1: at this and it'll be interesting to see, uh, just

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Speaker 1: the longer this goes on, where Independence boiled down on this,

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Speaker 1: because I think Washington is a whole. I think people

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Speaker 1: are frustrated with Washington as a whole. I do want

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Speaker 1: to get uh much more on this, and we'll wait

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Speaker 1: till the next box to talk trade policy coming up

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Speaker 1: with our with our panel David Litt, former Obama speech writer,

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Speaker 1: as well as Mark Lauder, former special assistant to President Trump.

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Speaker 1: I'm Kevin's really you're listening to Bloomberg nine one. You're

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Speaker 1: listening to sound On with Kevin Surreally on Bloomberg one

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Speaker 1: and one oh five point seven of m h D

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Speaker 1: two Baltimore. Welcome back. I'm Kevin's really Bloombergner's chief. Washington

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Speaker 1: corresponded with me for the hour David Litt, former Obama

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Speaker 1: speech writer and the author of Thanks Obama, My Hope,

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Speaker 1: changee White House Years. We're gonna get into all of that, David,

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Speaker 1: tell us about what other special projects you're working on

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Speaker 1: later on in the hour. Also with me is Mark lauder.

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Speaker 1: He is a former special assistant to President Trump and

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Speaker 1: former press secretary for Vice President Mike Pence. And we

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Speaker 1: were talking a lot about the shutdown earlier in the

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Speaker 1: I don't have a book deals Thanks so you were

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Speaker 1: you did not write Thanks Obama, My Hope He Changed

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Speaker 1: you right now? But I look forward to reading. Yes, okay, Uh,

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Speaker 1: what is your favorite political Bookmark? Oh, that's a really

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Speaker 1: good question. Um, you know, I always made it my

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Speaker 1: my I had a book that and I can't remember

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Speaker 1: the name of it off top of my head. It

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Speaker 1: was James Baker's biography and it was like the size

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Speaker 1: of a phone book. And I think it took me

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Speaker 1: multiple years because I could only like read it in

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Speaker 1: small you know, because it was like really very weighty material.

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Speaker 1: I finally got my way all the way through it.

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Speaker 1: So it was kind of like one of those dreams

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Speaker 1: of getting through that book. But it was long, and

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Speaker 1: it was very it was very insightful. Sound on with

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Speaker 1: Kevin's Relis Book Club. Now, let's talk foreign policy, UM,

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Speaker 1: in terms of the developments, very serious developments happening in Venezuela.

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Speaker 1: The President has announced his support for interim President of Venezuela,

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Speaker 1: Juan Guayido. UH. This is also a decision that is

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Speaker 1: backed by Speaker Nancy Pelosi. There has been some criticism

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Speaker 1: amongst so I would say that even in the on

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Speaker 1: the left and the right, UM criticis using this. But

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Speaker 1: it is a very very serious situation. Mark, and I

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Speaker 1: know that you were working for Vice President Mike Pence

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Speaker 1: when he traveled just uh to Veneze, not to Venezuela,

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Speaker 1: but rather to Colombia. And earlier today we got reports

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Speaker 1: that the administration UH is considering sending troops to to Columbia. Uh. No,

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Speaker 1: there was there was apparently some notes caught on on

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Speaker 1: Ambassador Bolton's notepad when he came out yesterday. UH. And

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Speaker 1: here's the thing that we know, I mean, what has

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Speaker 1: happened in Venezuela is a is a is a calamity.

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Speaker 1: It is a humanitarian crisis. We've had millions of people

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Speaker 1: flee that country. UH. The refugee problem that is affecting

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Speaker 1: the countries around Venezuela is very severe. US is providing

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Speaker 1: a lot of support trying to help offset and help

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Speaker 1: those countries deal with the immigration crisis. What we need

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Speaker 1: is for the dictator and former president to peacefully turn

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Speaker 1: over power to the people. It's what I was. I

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Speaker 1: was struck that uh of Venezuela for any I mean

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Speaker 1: Venezuela's relationship with Russia, with North with North Korea to

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Speaker 1: some extent, Iran China, also making Cuba. And I was

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Speaker 1: struck by Russia President Vladimir Putin picking up the phone

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Speaker 1: the same day that President Trump and the U. S

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Speaker 1: Government backed Interim President Huangway, you know, after he is

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Speaker 1: the National Assembly chair UH and and called Medoro. I

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Speaker 1: thought that was a glaring sign. I also would note

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Speaker 1: were talking about Venezuela, and we weren't able to talk

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Speaker 1: about this yesterday. So I'm glad we have an opportunity

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Speaker 1: to today. ZTE in particular a major Chinese UH telecommunications

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Speaker 1: firm had had brought all of their infrastructure telecommunications wise

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Speaker 1: in Venezuela. And in fact, when I interviewed Senator Marco Rubio,

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Speaker 1: Republican from Florida last week, he said that Huangwaido said essentially,

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Speaker 1: that's not gonna happen. That's not going to be the case.

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Speaker 1: So there's been assurances made that z T E will

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Speaker 1: not be at least according to Senator Rubio, will not

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Speaker 1: be UH working like they did with Madoro's regime. So

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Speaker 1: with all of that said, if we're not talking about

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Speaker 1: z T there's another major Chinese tele communications firm with

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Speaker 1: Huawei and the administration announcing charges really against this other

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Speaker 1: major Chinese tele communications firm. And we heard this from

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Speaker 1: President Trump earlier this year in a Reuter's interview where

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Speaker 1: he essentially said, yeah, Huawei, z ET that that might

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Speaker 1: impact the trade deals. Mark. So, as this Chinese delegation

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Speaker 1: gets ready to come to the US and you have

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Speaker 1: the situation with ZTE and Huawei bubbling and boiling over,

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Speaker 1: how do you think these trade negotiations are going to

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Speaker 1: go When the crown jewels of China's telecom giants are

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Speaker 1: are you know, being targeted by by us UH prosecutors. Well,

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Speaker 1: and I think this is this is a this is

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Speaker 1: another example of the president using maximum leverage and in

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Speaker 1: a case where we do have very serious concerns about

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Speaker 1: what's going on with those companies. We also on the

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Speaker 1: ZTE side of it, we have seen too many cases

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Speaker 1: around the world, particularly in Africa, South America and in

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Speaker 1: some of the developing nations in the Asia, in the

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Speaker 1: India Pacific, where China is going in promising the world,

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Speaker 1: building out a lot of infrastructure, and then when these

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Speaker 1: company these countries can't make their payments, they're basically taking over.

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Speaker 1: We need to stop that. And that's one of the

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Speaker 1: reasons why you see the focus on Chinese influence in Venezuela,

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Speaker 1: because it will prop up Maduro and it will also

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Speaker 1: provide China with a strong entry point. There's a lot

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Speaker 1: of things going and that and you say you say

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Speaker 1: it like that, I mean and and That's what I

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Speaker 1: want to be clear here is that it's easy to

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Speaker 1: get lost in z t E and Huawei and Venezuela

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Speaker 1: and China, but they're all different pieces to the puzzle.

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Speaker 1: David Litt is former Obama speech writer. And I take

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Speaker 1: it that you disagree with with the Trump foreign policy

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Speaker 1: but putting it mildly, well, certainly aspects of it. I

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Speaker 1: mean to me the issue here, right, I'm not a

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Speaker 1: foreign policy expert. I didn't write foreign policy speeches. Most

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Speaker 1: Americans are not foreign policy experts. Um. You mentioned uh,

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Speaker 1: Mark Um maximum leverage uh. And it just feels like

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Speaker 1: the guy who wrote the Art of the Deal is

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Speaker 1: not very good at deal making. It's a it's a

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Speaker 1: little bit at this point, like if you went into

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Speaker 1: Marie Condo's house and it was a mess, you would

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Speaker 1: be worried. I got about reference. Mark, I think that

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00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:39,520
Speaker 1: one over your head. Well. So the point that I

429
00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:41,520
Speaker 1: just want to make is this, and and I don't

430
00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:43,639
Speaker 1: say this, you know, obviously as a Democrat, I have

431
00:23:43,720 --> 00:23:46,879
Speaker 1: my feelings, but the president, as an American, you want

432
00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:50,399
Speaker 1: competent people running the show. There's not a ton of

433
00:23:50,440 --> 00:23:54,480
Speaker 1: evidence from the recent shutdown crisis, UM, or from John

434
00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:57,720
Speaker 1: Bolton's long career bringing us such hits of the Iraq War,

435
00:23:58,240 --> 00:24:00,560
Speaker 1: that we have the best people in the best jobs.

436
00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:02,960
Speaker 1: And I think that's really worrisome. All Right, I know, Mark,

437
00:24:03,000 --> 00:24:05,000
Speaker 1: you disagree, but we're up against the break, so I

438
00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:09,040
Speaker 1: take you to disagree, So thanks for thanks for keeping

439
00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:10,840
Speaker 1: that simple. I'm coming up. We're gonna talk much more

440
00:24:10,880 --> 00:24:15,080
Speaker 1: about uh all of this, including the partial government shutsown.

441
00:24:15,119 --> 00:24:19,000
Speaker 1: I do want to note UH some bipartisanship. Senator Mark Warner,

442
00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:22,639
Speaker 1: a Democrat from Virginia, as well as Senator Marco Rubio,

443
00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:25,800
Speaker 1: a Republican from Florida, putting forth a piece of legislation

444
00:24:25,840 --> 00:24:27,800
Speaker 1: they want to create a new office within the White

445
00:24:27,800 --> 00:24:31,679
Speaker 1: House that would allow there to be an office that

446
00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:36,360
Speaker 1: would look at all of these different telecommunication giants, international

447
00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:39,879
Speaker 1: cybersecurity issues to streamline the process for whomever is in

448
00:24:39,880 --> 00:24:42,680
Speaker 1: the White House, a Republican or a Democrat. Panel stays,

449
00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:50,199
Speaker 1: I'm Kevin Sirelli. You're listening to Bloomberg. You're listening to

450
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:55,080
Speaker 1: sound On with Givens. Really on Bloomberg one and one

451
00:24:55,119 --> 00:24:57,280
Speaker 1: oh five point seven f M H D two Bolt

452
00:24:57,280 --> 00:25:02,520
Speaker 1: them over, I P protection and UH no more forced

453
00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:06,800
Speaker 1: joint ventures and the enforcement are three of the most

454
00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:10,760
Speaker 1: important issues on the agenda. That was Treasury Secretary Stephen

455
00:25:10,800 --> 00:25:14,720
Speaker 1: Manutian yesterday at the White House outlining the case for

456
00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:18,640
Speaker 1: what UH the administration will be making to the Chinese

457
00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:23,080
Speaker 1: UH group of economic officials let a course by Chinese

458
00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:27,360
Speaker 1: Vice Premier Lui Hua, who are visiting Washington this week

459
00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:32,160
Speaker 1: to to continue negotiations between the US and China. Could

460
00:25:32,160 --> 00:25:36,960
Speaker 1: get interesting because if no deal is made by March first,

461
00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:40,800
Speaker 1: President Trump has said he's going to increase tariffs by

462
00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:45,360
Speaker 1: about fift on some ten percent on others on two

463
00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:49,640
Speaker 1: hundred billion dollars worth of Chinese goods that are being

464
00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:54,520
Speaker 1: h imported into the US. So all of this just

465
00:25:54,560 --> 00:25:58,639
Speaker 1: the economic backdrop as the negotiations domestically between Republicans and

466
00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:01,480
Speaker 1: Democrats continue. You we're breaking all of that down with

467
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:06,200
Speaker 1: David Litt, former Obama speech writer, and Mark Lottery, former

468
00:26:06,240 --> 00:26:09,320
Speaker 1: special assistant to President Trump and a former press secretary

469
00:26:09,359 --> 00:26:11,480
Speaker 1: for Vice President Mike Pence. You know, and earlier in

470
00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:14,800
Speaker 1: the program we were talking about, uh, the messaging, and

471
00:26:14,840 --> 00:26:16,080
Speaker 1: we kind of made light of it. And if you're

472
00:26:16,080 --> 00:26:19,720
Speaker 1: a Republican, you'll agree with Mark saying enhanced fencing or

473
00:26:19,760 --> 00:26:23,880
Speaker 1: steel slats. Uh, and UH, if you're a Democrat you'll disagree,

474
00:26:24,320 --> 00:26:27,480
Speaker 1: uh or maybe you'll like it, who knows. But in

475
00:26:27,560 --> 00:26:29,840
Speaker 1: the break, the three of us were talking about both

476
00:26:29,880 --> 00:26:34,080
Speaker 1: of you have been inside when a principal or a

477
00:26:34,200 --> 00:26:40,159
Speaker 1: lawmaker is crafting a message, albeit for very different leaders. Um,

478
00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:44,000
Speaker 1: you Mark for candidate Donald Trump, President Trump, as well

479
00:26:44,000 --> 00:26:47,960
Speaker 1: as Vice President Mike Pence. You, David, uh for former

480
00:26:48,000 --> 00:26:52,520
Speaker 1: President Barack Obama. And I'm just interested in that dynamic

481
00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:55,400
Speaker 1: because both of you have experience as as funny as

482
00:26:55,440 --> 00:27:00,359
Speaker 1: this is writing comedy speeches for Donald Trump, Mark and

483
00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:03,239
Speaker 1: Barack Obama. David, So, what tell us a little bit

484
00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:06,520
Speaker 1: about your history David in terms of uh, you writing

485
00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:10,040
Speaker 1: comedic speeches? Just just to clear right, never wrote comedic speech,

486
00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:15,600
Speaker 1: didn't you do the Vice president? Yeah? So what was

487
00:27:15,640 --> 00:27:17,760
Speaker 1: that like for you? Mark? Well, go ahead, David at first,

488
00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:21,880
Speaker 1: but I wanted to clarify, Well, well, for me, I, Um,

489
00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:25,080
Speaker 1: I had interned at the Onion, the comedy newspaper, when

490
00:27:25,080 --> 00:27:26,760
Speaker 1: I was in college, and when I moved to d C.

491
00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:29,840
Speaker 1: You know, that was basically a comedy background for a

492
00:27:29,920 --> 00:27:32,200
Speaker 1: d C person. So when I got to the White House,

493
00:27:32,240 --> 00:27:35,320
Speaker 1: I started writing some jokes and then by twelve I

494
00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:37,679
Speaker 1: was kind of the token funny person inside the building

495
00:27:38,160 --> 00:27:41,480
Speaker 1: and my job every year it was a lot of pressure.

496
00:27:41,520 --> 00:27:43,200
Speaker 1: I mean, it was probably a lot less pressure than

497
00:27:43,240 --> 00:27:47,439
Speaker 1: being somebody you know, negotiating relations with Cuba, but it

498
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:49,680
Speaker 1: was still it was a lot of pressure just because

499
00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:52,320
Speaker 1: you know, people are paying attention and everything the president

500
00:27:52,359 --> 00:27:55,560
Speaker 1: says is gonna be part of his record as president.

501
00:27:55,600 --> 00:27:58,200
Speaker 1: And so but you know the thing about jokes, they're

502
00:27:58,359 --> 00:28:00,520
Speaker 1: at least in the Obama White has to much more

503
00:28:00,520 --> 00:28:02,920
Speaker 1: of a team effort than most speeches. So my job

504
00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:05,119
Speaker 1: was to both right but also to curate from people

505
00:28:05,600 --> 00:28:08,639
Speaker 1: in the building outside the building, um, kind of picking

506
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:11,160
Speaker 1: the best ones and then bringing those to the president. Okay,

507
00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:13,360
Speaker 1: so you have to make Vice president Mike Pen's funny, Mark,

508
00:28:13,560 --> 00:28:16,919
Speaker 1: he's actually very fun Okay, Well, his public persona is

509
00:28:16,960 --> 00:28:19,040
Speaker 1: that he is anything but right. I mean, I mean,

510
00:28:19,040 --> 00:28:21,479
Speaker 1: I'm not saying anything that you don't know, Marshall, but

511
00:28:21,760 --> 00:28:23,520
Speaker 1: he is a very he is a very dry wit.

512
00:28:23,680 --> 00:28:25,760
Speaker 1: Tell us about that, because I don't think that comes

513
00:28:25,800 --> 00:28:28,960
Speaker 1: through at all, to be honest. Well, and he but

514
00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:30,600
Speaker 1: he is funny. And now there are a lot of

515
00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:32,040
Speaker 1: dad jokes in there, and I think he'd be the

516
00:28:32,040 --> 00:28:34,280
Speaker 1: first one to probably make fun of that and say

517
00:28:34,320 --> 00:28:37,160
Speaker 1: and he's very big into self deprecating humor. He knows

518
00:28:37,200 --> 00:28:39,240
Speaker 1: that obviously that is something that worked. It's a medium,

519
00:28:39,320 --> 00:28:43,440
Speaker 1: especially for politicians that works, and it was very similar.

520
00:28:43,480 --> 00:28:47,280
Speaker 1: I remember before the the Gridiron speech, in which is

521
00:28:47,280 --> 00:28:51,280
Speaker 1: a big correct uh you know, it was a Saturday

522
00:28:51,360 --> 00:28:53,720
Speaker 1: night I think it was a Saturday night speech, and

523
00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:57,880
Speaker 1: my phone went off like late Friday, Saturday morning with

524
00:28:58,000 --> 00:29:01,120
Speaker 1: basically just you're gonna come to the Vice President's residents

525
00:29:01,120 --> 00:29:03,480
Speaker 1: in like two hours and we're going to like rework

526
00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:06,800
Speaker 1: the speech. And there wasn't We didn't, but so there

527
00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:08,440
Speaker 1: was like five or six of us and we were

528
00:29:08,480 --> 00:29:11,400
Speaker 1: bouncing ideas back and forth. There were some things he liked,

529
00:29:11,480 --> 00:29:13,120
Speaker 1: there were things he didn't like. There were things that

530
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:16,040
Speaker 1: were in the speech that he didn't actually deliver because

531
00:29:16,240 --> 00:29:18,320
Speaker 1: you have to read the audience and go, yeah, that's

532
00:29:18,360 --> 00:29:20,720
Speaker 1: not gonna work. So well, is it awkward when you're

533
00:29:20,760 --> 00:29:23,960
Speaker 1: pitching a joke, either Mark or David Lett and and

534
00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:26,200
Speaker 1: like the guy who's gonna read it or the woman

535
00:29:26,240 --> 00:29:29,360
Speaker 1: who's going to read it doesn't laugh. Like if I

536
00:29:29,440 --> 00:29:31,840
Speaker 1: was making a joke about Vice President Mike Pence Pence

537
00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:34,400
Speaker 1: and he didn't laugh at it, I mean, is that awkward?

538
00:29:34,840 --> 00:29:37,440
Speaker 1: Take us in that moment? Well, he's I mean, typically

539
00:29:37,640 --> 00:29:40,480
Speaker 1: he's he'll be the first one to offer the self

540
00:29:40,520 --> 00:29:43,120
Speaker 1: deprecating humor. Usually it's just kind of a quick one

541
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 1: liner and then we would all laugh and then he's like, well,

542
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:50,280
Speaker 1: we'll write that down that David, go ahead. Yeah. I

543
00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:53,320
Speaker 1: think the uh, the way I put it is sort

544
00:29:53,320 --> 00:29:55,040
Speaker 1: of we would go through the jokes who have maybe

545
00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:56,680
Speaker 1: let's say forty by the time we got in the

546
00:29:56,760 --> 00:29:59,640
Speaker 1: room with President Obama. Um, you know when he laughed

547
00:29:59,640 --> 00:30:02,080
Speaker 1: and make a small check mark, and when he didn't,

548
00:30:02,120 --> 00:30:05,520
Speaker 1: I would have a small heart attack. And is your

549
00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:07,680
Speaker 1: job on the line? You know? I mean in just

550
00:30:07,760 --> 00:30:09,680
Speaker 1: in the sense of year if you if you work

551
00:30:09,680 --> 00:30:11,520
Speaker 1: in the White House, you take your job seriously, even

552
00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:13,280
Speaker 1: if it's writing jokes. You want to do it really well.

553
00:30:13,480 --> 00:30:14,880
Speaker 1: I know that's not a funny thing to say, but

554
00:30:14,920 --> 00:30:17,440
Speaker 1: it is true. And one of the things that we

555
00:30:17,440 --> 00:30:19,160
Speaker 1: were talking about this earlier is that, I mean, the

556
00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:23,040
Speaker 1: speech writing teams, the policy teams. I mean, this is

557
00:30:23,040 --> 00:30:26,120
Speaker 1: a normal function regardless of White House. You do this.

558
00:30:26,520 --> 00:30:30,360
Speaker 1: There's a there's a process, there is a pattern writing.

559
00:30:30,480 --> 00:30:34,360
Speaker 1: But writing humor is so subjective and it's outside of

560
00:30:34,440 --> 00:30:37,680
Speaker 1: the norm. It's not something you do every day every week.

561
00:30:37,680 --> 00:30:40,720
Speaker 1: It's probably once or twice a year. Uh, And it's

562
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:42,920
Speaker 1: in many ways. I think it's much more difficult than

563
00:30:43,040 --> 00:30:46,640
Speaker 1: to do your standard policy speech or rally, you know,

564
00:30:46,800 --> 00:30:49,360
Speaker 1: something like that, because you're just so attuned to doing it.

565
00:30:49,400 --> 00:30:52,040
Speaker 1: Was was, David, you know how to well? You know,

566
00:30:52,080 --> 00:30:54,400
Speaker 1: I was going to say, I think that is It's true.

567
00:30:54,440 --> 00:30:58,480
Speaker 1: And there's a vulnerability in humor. Um if people don't laugh.

568
00:30:58,520 --> 00:31:01,240
Speaker 1: I mean I I think about uh, you know, President

569
00:31:01,240 --> 00:31:03,720
Speaker 1: Obama he had a good sense of comic timing, others

570
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:06,280
Speaker 1: maybe not so much. And if people don't laugh, it

571
00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:09,360
Speaker 1: does go after your ego in a very specific way.

572
00:31:09,400 --> 00:31:12,520
Speaker 1: And it's a reason why some politicians really don't want

573
00:31:12,560 --> 00:31:16,000
Speaker 1: to try telling jokes, because you build up this. If

574
00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:19,520
Speaker 1: you don't have an actual strong ego and you have

575
00:31:19,600 --> 00:31:22,120
Speaker 1: kind of a thin shell, it can break through. Who

576
00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:25,560
Speaker 1: do you think the funniest of all the Democratic contenders?

577
00:31:26,640 --> 00:31:29,520
Speaker 1: Who's the funniest, David, That's a good question. I actually

578
00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:33,200
Speaker 1: don't know. I don't think that any of them. I

579
00:31:33,200 --> 00:31:36,120
Speaker 1: haven't heard any of them kind of tell jokes in

580
00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:40,000
Speaker 1: a particular forum. And frankly they're not. Um so they

581
00:31:40,000 --> 00:31:43,440
Speaker 1: were serious with those policy proposals. Wow, that's that that

582
00:31:43,560 --> 00:31:48,560
Speaker 1: that there's that Mike Pennce. Hum. But the thing that

583
00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:50,440
Speaker 1: I would say is, you know, and I do think

584
00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:53,440
Speaker 1: to a to a more relevant point, these these are

585
00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:56,920
Speaker 1: serious times. I think that Democrats are probably less uh.

586
00:31:56,960 --> 00:31:58,840
Speaker 1: They're not really looking for someone to go out and

587
00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:02,000
Speaker 1: wow you with jokes all the time. Later who gives Okay?

588
00:32:02,040 --> 00:32:03,680
Speaker 1: First of all, I wish that there was a camera

589
00:32:03,720 --> 00:32:05,719
Speaker 1: in here, because if anyone could just see Mark Latter's,

590
00:32:05,760 --> 00:32:10,160
Speaker 1: former special assistant to UH President Trump and Vice Vice

591
00:32:10,160 --> 00:32:13,240
Speaker 1: President Mike Pensis, former Press secretary run into a microphone

592
00:32:13,240 --> 00:32:15,760
Speaker 1: to make to deliver that punchline. But seriously, in all

593
00:32:15,760 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 1: seriousness of all, who are you most concerned about? I

594
00:32:18,920 --> 00:32:20,440
Speaker 1: don't know if I'm concerned. I think it's gonna be

595
00:32:20,480 --> 00:32:22,520
Speaker 1: interesting to see who comes out, because I mean, right now,

596
00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:24,200
Speaker 1: they're going to have to run as far to the

597
00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:27,840
Speaker 1: left towards socialism as they possibly can. We saw that

598
00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:31,360
Speaker 1: last night with Kamala Harris literally saying, well, for the

599
00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:34,480
Speaker 1: hundred and seventy seven million people who love their health

600
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:38,440
Speaker 1: insurance through their employer, and eighty five percent say it's

601
00:32:38,480 --> 00:32:41,720
Speaker 1: good or excellent, we're going to eliminate that because government

602
00:32:41,840 --> 00:32:44,360
Speaker 1: is better at it than than the private sector. What

603
00:32:44,400 --> 00:32:47,240
Speaker 1: do you think of Howard Chart. That's gonna be very

604
00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:49,720
Speaker 1: interesting to see how they handle that. How how Will?

605
00:32:49,760 --> 00:32:52,120
Speaker 1: How Will? I mean Jeff Lake says he's not running

606
00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:54,719
Speaker 1: as an independent. He said on CBS this morning, he's

607
00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:57,200
Speaker 1: not going to run as a Republican. But I mean,

608
00:32:57,280 --> 00:33:00,680
Speaker 1: are you are Republicans at all concerned about the notion

609
00:33:00,800 --> 00:33:04,960
Speaker 1: of some type of candidate emerging who appeal off Republicans

610
00:33:05,000 --> 00:33:07,160
Speaker 1: who are uneasy with with President Trump? Well, and I

611
00:33:07,160 --> 00:33:09,480
Speaker 1: think you would have just as many probably Democrats, if

612
00:33:09,520 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 1: not more, that are gonna especially as they as they

613
00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:15,520
Speaker 1: nominate and even further left candidate. I mean, I come

614
00:33:15,560 --> 00:33:17,760
Speaker 1: from the Midwest, where you know, we had we had

615
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:19,719
Speaker 1: a thing that used to be called blue dog Democrats

616
00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:24,000
Speaker 1: or Reagan Democrats, and even people who have friends with

617
00:33:24,120 --> 00:33:26,520
Speaker 1: or maybe sometimes campaigned against, but you know, we have

618
00:33:26,600 --> 00:33:30,320
Speaker 1: a camaraderie. A lot of them are saying if we

619
00:33:30,440 --> 00:33:33,960
Speaker 1: go so far going down this left progressive socialist route,

620
00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:36,240
Speaker 1: they're gonna lose a lot of people who are in

621
00:33:36,280 --> 00:33:39,440
Speaker 1: the middle, are just left of middle. Yeah. Well, Mark,

622
00:33:39,480 --> 00:33:40,840
Speaker 1: the one thing I would say, you mentioned the blue

623
00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:43,080
Speaker 1: dog Democrats, and there's now more of them actually than

624
00:33:43,120 --> 00:33:44,840
Speaker 1: there used to be. There's twenty seven, and a lot

625
00:33:44,840 --> 00:33:48,520
Speaker 1: of them represent districts once held by Republicans and that

626
00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:52,640
Speaker 1: once favored President Trump. So um, I think most Democrats

627
00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:54,200
Speaker 1: feel like, if this is the way things are going,

628
00:33:54,280 --> 00:33:56,880
Speaker 1: we're pretty happy with it, all right. Special thanks to

629
00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:00,280
Speaker 1: David Litt Mark Later. I'm Kevin Surali. That's that's it

630
00:34:00,320 --> 00:34:02,440
Speaker 1: for me. You can get us on iTunes now. Thanks

631
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:07,120
Speaker 1: for listening, Bloomberg m hm.