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Speaker 1: There's a monumental shift in power at work. Employees are

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Speaker 1: Go to get the Plan dot IDP dot com to

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Speaker 1: register for the work Interrupted Summit. What girls in the forest,

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Speaker 1: our imagination and our family bonds. The forest is closer

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Speaker 1: than you think. Find a forest near you and discover

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Speaker 1: the Forest dot org. Brought to you by the United

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Speaker 1: States Forest Service and the AD Council. We've all felt

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Speaker 1: left out, and for people who moved to this country,

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Speaker 1: that feeling lasts more than a moment. We can change that.

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Speaker 1: Learn how a belonging begins with us dot org. Brought

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Speaker 1: to you by the AD Council. My next guest is

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Speaker 1: Sakia Dalila Harris. She lives in Brooklyn and George writing

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Speaker 1: about her black culture, literature and oldies music. We really

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Speaker 1: got to get into that because she's on the thirties

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Speaker 1: and she's on the third of that oldis music. You know,

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Speaker 1: I don't know if there's the oldies go to the

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Speaker 1: new edition, or there's an old school beyond new additions,

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Speaker 1: because the oldies it's how older, my older might be different.

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Speaker 1: She holds her master's in Fine Arts and created writing

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Speaker 1: from the new school. She has made a splash with

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Speaker 1: her first novel, The Other Black Girl. It sets in

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Speaker 1: New York's publican world. The psychological thriller incorporates social commentary

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Speaker 1: and about diversity in the workplace and the challenges black

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Speaker 1: women often have to navigate. The Other Black Girl was

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Speaker 1: bid on by fourteen hear Me fourteen publishing offices before

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Speaker 1: landing a seventh figure deal for her first novel. So

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Speaker 1: you probably wonder why she's smiled. That's why she smiled

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Speaker 1: the seventh figure deal. She's not smiling because she's likes

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Speaker 1: from Sean McDonald. She smiled because she had a seventh

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Speaker 1: biggie deal and I know what that looks like. And

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Speaker 1: it's also said to become a big hit television series

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Speaker 1: on Hulu. That's another reason why she smiled. And uh

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Speaker 1: written alongside Rahisa Jone, which we don't joan with a

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Speaker 1: Quincy Jones daughter, very talented actress. She's on the show

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Speaker 1: to discussed building your dream please, working to mind and

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Speaker 1: making conversation Zakia Zechia, Delila Harris. How are you doing?

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Speaker 1: I'm doing great with that introduction you just gave me.

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Speaker 1: It was a little fun worked in today because of

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Speaker 1: the fact that you know, we should be happy. We

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Speaker 1: should you you're you're that age you call a millennial age,

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Speaker 1: you know, and you know you you jumped out there

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Speaker 1: and you put to use work in another job. And

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Speaker 1: why did you leave your job to introduce yourself in

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Speaker 1: the world of a novelist. Yeah, well, you know, I

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Speaker 1: gotta say I have loved writing since I was five,

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Speaker 1: or maybe even before then, whenever I first learned how

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Speaker 1: to write. So I've always wanted to be a writer.

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Speaker 1: My dad is a writer as well, so very early

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Speaker 1: on I saw that as a possible career trajectory for me. Um,

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Speaker 1: and as I got older, I kept writing. Um kind

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Speaker 1: of realized I'd have to do other things also because

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Speaker 1: it's hard to be a writer, hence publishing. But I

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Speaker 1: also loved breaking with writers and talking about structure and

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Speaker 1: writing on a micro level. So all of those things

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Speaker 1: kind of led me here. But ultimately for me, you know,

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Speaker 1: after a couple of years of working and publishing. I

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Speaker 1: just knew I couldn't work on my own writing if

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Speaker 1: I was putting myself into other authors. So I was like,

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Speaker 1: you know what, let me just invest in this, see

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Speaker 1: it through, um, leave this permanent, well paid, well not

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Speaker 1: well paying, but paying, and help stop. Yes, playing New

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Speaker 1: York and trying to figure this out and it worked out. Well,

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Speaker 1: let's let's slow it down a little bit. Because you

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Speaker 1: know your novelist and you're saying that you were watching

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Speaker 1: other people's work. Did that help you? Did it allow

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Speaker 1: you to see? You know, because a lot of books

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Speaker 1: get published, a lot of published don't get sold. Okay,

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Speaker 1: we know that for a fact. So and being a

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Speaker 1: person who getting to see and being able to critique

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Speaker 1: and being able to discuss work with other other people

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Speaker 1: in your position, what did you learn from that? Oh? Absolutely?

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Speaker 1: That was that was huge for me, um being on Well,

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Speaker 1: first of all, I should say before I went into publishing,

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Speaker 1: I did my fe and nonfiction writing, so I was

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Speaker 1: very used to having people um critique my my world

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Speaker 1: and my life. I was literally writing personal essays about

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Speaker 1: my own insecurities and my own questioning of you know,

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Speaker 1: who I was and where I'm from from Connecticut. Um,

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Speaker 1: So all of those things. Having eyes in my work

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Speaker 1: in that way helped, and then being eyes on someone

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Speaker 1: else's work character when I was working editorial, because yeah,

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Speaker 1: you're so right, Like, there are so many great stories

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Speaker 1: out there that never get a publisher for various reasons,

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Speaker 1: and there are so many hurdles, um. And I was

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Speaker 1: aware of all of those things. But I also thankfully

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Speaker 1: knew how to navigate this world and knew all of

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Speaker 1: the steps that go into it. And you know, for me,

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Speaker 1: that was really empowering to be able to be like, Okay,

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Speaker 1: here is the function that an agent is supposed to have.

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Speaker 1: I want to find the right person who will represent

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Speaker 1: me and be someone who is understanding what I'm trying

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Speaker 1: to do and advocate for me in the way that

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Speaker 1: I need to be advocated for. It also allows me

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Speaker 1: to advocate for myself. You know what I mean? Absolutely? Um,

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Speaker 1: I'm speaking with the author of the very popular book

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Speaker 1: The Other Black Girl is going to become a television

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Speaker 1: serious or Hulu Zakia, Zakia. When you talk about writing,

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Speaker 1: what makes a good writing you know what writer or

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Speaker 1: what makes a good storyteller? Because I just look background

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Speaker 1: on me. I started out in Hollywood is a sitcom

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Speaker 1: writers series like Sister Sister gooda oldies all. You know,

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Speaker 1: that's me, Sister Sister Jamie. You know, Parenthood the Parker,

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Speaker 1: that was me, That was me and so and that

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Speaker 1: was a different style of writing and now and I

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Speaker 1: we are not in the same class. Okay, because it's

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Speaker 1: storytelling that you're doing. Allows you to even talk about

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Speaker 1: looking at the thread in your clothing as you talk

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Speaker 1: about you at the beginning of the book, you know,

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Speaker 1: and looking over your shoulders. It comes you go to

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Speaker 1: the joke, to go to the moment, Go to the joke,

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Speaker 1: go to the moment. But in your world, because I

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Speaker 1: have a lot of listeners who want to be writers

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Speaker 1: or who want to get their stuff published, material published,

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Speaker 1: what makes a good story writer or storyteller? And what

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Speaker 1: is good writing? Mm, that's such a good question. Um.

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Speaker 1: I think that it depends on who the person is.

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Speaker 1: But I know for me, uh, being just engaged in

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Speaker 1: the world, UM was really helpful. UM. I love people watching.

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Speaker 1: I also love meeting new people. I've worked a lot

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Speaker 1: of jobs that required me to talk to people very

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Speaker 1: different backgrounds from me. UM, and just understanding people or

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Speaker 1: trying to understand people. I think that both such a

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Speaker 1: long way when you're trying to write a story. UM.

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Speaker 1: I would also say reading, just reading makes a good storyteller. UM.

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Speaker 1: I was really into reading as a kid, and I

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Speaker 1: will say, like I kind of fell off in high

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Speaker 1: school because I was required to read a lot of

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Speaker 1: things that I didn't want to have to read. UM.

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Speaker 1: But I did find other writers. In college I took

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Speaker 1: I majored in English literature, so I was also taking

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Speaker 1: classes on a Russian literature class. I took a class

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Speaker 1: and Black literature, a lot of which I'd never heard

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Speaker 1: of authors that I've never been introduced to in high school,

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Speaker 1: like Niki Giovanni and and um Bell Hooks and so

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Speaker 1: all of those kind of things. I think that comes

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Speaker 1: with being introverted, um, but also being extroverted UM as

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Speaker 1: much as possible. It's it's hard now, I think, especially

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Speaker 1: this is the world is where it is you used

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Speaker 1: or introverted. I'm looking at you now, we was introversion.

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Speaker 1: I would just make up a word. We was introversion

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Speaker 1: in your life? Okay, I'm saying it's very beautiful. Smile kid.

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Speaker 1: I have to say the word magnetic personality and I've

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Speaker 1: just seen you on a screen zoom screen here. So

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Speaker 1: when did introverted party become boy five years old? Six years?

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Speaker 1: It wasn't recent, It was not recent. Okay, talk to

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Speaker 1: me about that. Turned Did you just threw out in

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Speaker 1: front of the in the middle of this interview? You know,

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Speaker 1: I am pretty I call myself an introverted extrovert. Where

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Speaker 1: I was like, let me get the order, because I

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Speaker 1: am I am someone whom I mean, this isn't necessarily

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Speaker 1: an introvert, but I am someone who is in my

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Speaker 1: head a lot, and that helped me with this book

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Speaker 1: because Nella is in her head all the time, and

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Speaker 1: it can be hard to be in her head. Sometimes

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Speaker 1: you want to get out. And that's why I have

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Speaker 1: the other characters partly, um and why we see her

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Speaker 1: in her her world with Malake, outside of the suppressive environment.

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Speaker 1: Um So, so i'd say that's that's where. And I

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Speaker 1: can also be shy, and I can also kind of

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Speaker 1: sometimes takes me time or especially as a younger person.

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Speaker 1: But this is something now that I am in affair

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Speaker 1: and I do have this platform unfortunate enough to have

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Speaker 1: the space to speak on certain things. Um. But I

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Speaker 1: know when I was in publishing starting out, I just

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Speaker 1: went with the flow um and felt like that was

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Speaker 1: what I had to do because I was one of

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Speaker 1: very few people there, and I felt just lucky to

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Speaker 1: be there. It's finally here, the season of celebration, and

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Speaker 1: no matter how you celebrate with family and friends, whether

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Speaker 1: you're preparing for Reis Magos or Karamu lighting the Manura,

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Speaker 1: are going to midnight mass, Coals has just what you

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Speaker 1: from Coals or Coals dot Com and We're live here

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Speaker 1: outside the Perez family home, just waiting for the and

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Speaker 1: there they go, almost on time. This morning, Mom is

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Speaker 1: coming out the front door strong with a double arm

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Speaker 1: kid carry. Looks like Dad has the bags. Daughter is

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Speaker 1: bringing up the rear. Oh but the diaper bag wasn't closed.

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Speaker 1: Diapers and toys are everywhere. Oh but mom has just

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Speaker 1: nailed the perfect car seat buckle for the toddler. And

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Speaker 1: now the eldest daughter, who looks to be about nine

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Speaker 1: or ten, has secured herself and the booster seat. Dad

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Speaker 1: zips the bag clothes and they're off. Ah, but looks

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Speaker 1: like Mom doesn't realize her coffee cup is still on

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Speaker 1: the roof of the car, and there it goes. That's

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Speaker 1: a shame that mug was a fan favorite. Don't sweat

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Speaker 1: the small stuff. Just nailed the big stuff, like making

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Speaker 1: sure your kids are buckled correctly in the right seat

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Speaker 1: to Smokey Bear dot com to learn more about wildfire prevention.

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Speaker 1: Brought to you by the U. S. Forest Service, your

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Speaker 1: state Forrester and the AD Council. Well, you know, luck

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Speaker 1: and talent. It's gonna be real. You know, I'm talking

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Speaker 1: to the key, you know, the other black girl. That's

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Speaker 1: tough book. New York Times best Selling out the best

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Speaker 1: selling book, name most anticipated book of twenty one by

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Speaker 1: Time Magazine, to Washington Post, here did Harper's Bizarre, Herald,

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Speaker 1: Entertainment Weekly, Bustle, BuzzFeed, Parade, good Reads, Fortune, and BBC.

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Speaker 1: They've they've described your book as get Out meets the Devils,

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Speaker 1: where it's proud of this. You know, that's their version

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Speaker 1: of it. You know my version of the book was

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Speaker 1: that I've worked in a corporate environment, uh and where

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Speaker 1: I was maybe the one of the few blacks in

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Speaker 1: the on the floor, great working environment because they it

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Speaker 1: was our diversity, it was diversified. So I wasn't like

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Speaker 1: this character who was hoping and wishing that they will

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Speaker 1: see somebody like them, just somebody walked through the door.

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Speaker 1: They can be there so she can communicate and feel

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Speaker 1: a sense of wholeness and that that really is the

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Speaker 1: core of the story. Now, when you start developing a

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Speaker 1: story like this, to kill what said it to your mind?

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Speaker 1: Because like you said, you're in your head and this

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Speaker 1: story is kind of uh. I want to use the

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Speaker 1: word Stephen King type or Jordan's Peel type. So because

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Speaker 1: I want to go back a little bit because when

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Speaker 1: you your reference, you reference twilights on you ever lost

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Speaker 1: off my age? You know what I'm saying. You reach

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Speaker 1: the old music. You mentioned green in your book, and

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Speaker 1: you gotta One of your character's name is Hazel. I

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Speaker 1: don't know you, Hazel. I don't care who you are.

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Speaker 1: I don't know no millennial name Hazel. Now my age,

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Speaker 1: I went to your school with a girl named Hazel,

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Speaker 1: so I know that's an old name. So let's talk

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Speaker 1: about being in your head and the fun the fundness

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Speaker 1: of these characters. They're fully fleshed out and the process

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Speaker 1: of coming together and laying out that this book became

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Speaker 1: so anticipated and not playing out as a well read

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Speaker 1: novel and eventually be a television series on Who the

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Speaker 1: Floor Is Yours? Miss introverted Well, I first got to say, um, Hazel,

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Speaker 1: the name comes from um one of my Well, I'm

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Speaker 1: just gonna say my favorite aunts. I'm telling your old name.

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Speaker 1: I told you, thank you. And she was just such

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Speaker 1: a wonderful, wonderful soul, wonderful human. Um I was kind

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Speaker 1: of everybody baby, and I just love the name. And

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Speaker 1: so I was like, I want to write a character

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Speaker 1: who's has this name. So that's actually where anypol came from.

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Speaker 1: I let you brought that up. But yeah, I mean

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Speaker 1: so when I first started writing this story, I had

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Speaker 1: just the simple idea of Nella and Hazel, and something's

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Speaker 1: messed up about Hazel. I didn't know what it was

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Speaker 1: going to be. I just knew that they were going

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Speaker 1: to have a hard time because of this environment that

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Speaker 1: is very white and made up of a lot of

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Speaker 1: white people who are constantly watching them and assuming what

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Speaker 1: their relationship is going to be like. And then that

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Speaker 1: on top of what Nella assumes the relationship is going

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Speaker 1: to be like because she has this whole idea of like, oh,

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Speaker 1: we're both natural, we're both in this space. We must

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Speaker 1: have had similar experiences, we must have a similar outlook

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Speaker 1: on being black in this space. But we don't all

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Speaker 1: think the same thing. We all have an opinions, and

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Speaker 1: not everybody is out there to help everybody else, and

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Speaker 1: everyone has their own kind of boundaries and their own

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Speaker 1: idea of code switching, and their an idea of selling

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Speaker 1: out if I may say, um, and what makes this

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Speaker 1: thing different, if there is anything, And so all of

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Speaker 1: those are things with nell and Hazel that I was

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Speaker 1: thinking about, and then specifically in terms of Nella because

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Speaker 1: for me, while I was working in book publishing and

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Speaker 1: just in general too, people in my past who have

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Speaker 1: also gone through these things. So I talked to my dad,

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Speaker 1: who worked in a corporate environment in the nineties in

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Speaker 1: New York. I've talked to um other people in publishing

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Speaker 1: who worked in publishing years before it is what it

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Speaker 1: is now and their experiences. So I felt like with Nella,

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Speaker 1: there needed to be this beacon and the way that

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Speaker 1: Tony Morrison was for me working in book publishing because

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Speaker 1: she had also worked in editorial once spint a time.

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Speaker 1: I knew Nella would have that beacon as well, and

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Speaker 1: it came in the Diana. Now let's talk about the book.

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Speaker 1: You know, I've unfortunate with Steve Harvey. Three Noble one

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Speaker 1: bestselling books there were number one is really and then

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Speaker 1: not just a word that's that's a powerful word. And uh,

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Speaker 1: I remember the first book you Think like I'm In,

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Speaker 1: which eventually was sold more than three million copies. And

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Speaker 1: also it was translated in thirty different language, which I'm

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Speaker 1: sure this book is being translated as we speak, if

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Speaker 1: it hasn't already been done. Um, going in and senior book, okay,

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Speaker 1: in a store or at the airport, let's talk about that,

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Speaker 1: because I know I used to go in the store.

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Speaker 1: I should look, Oh, that is Steve there. We just

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Speaker 1: joke around and I take my book his book and

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Speaker 1: move it up and move it around, you know, going

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Speaker 1: to a store, you know, and say, hey, what why

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Speaker 1: is this book back there? Do you know? Do you

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Speaker 1: know the author named Steve Harvey? You know it's a comedian.

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Speaker 1: Has this a little book called thinking Like? Talk us

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Speaker 1: about that, because that's so much fun, you know, because

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Speaker 1: you work real hard and you're covered clearly as as

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Speaker 1: a statement covered the other black girl talk about that

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Speaker 1: part of it, and then allowing your family to experience

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Speaker 1: going out there and seeing it on the shields as well. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: that part has been so cool. It's been so cool,

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Speaker 1: I mean because you imagine what it's gonna be like

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Speaker 1: and you just can't possibly know. And to go into

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Speaker 1: the store and see this cover that UM had, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I mean, the the best possible story behind the cover,

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Speaker 1: because I know it is hard out there, especially for

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Speaker 1: black authors to get that representation UM in the cover itself.

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Speaker 1: And so for me, when I was writing this book,

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Speaker 1: I knew, of course going into it that as an author,

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Speaker 1: you you do have a say, but depending on your contract,

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Speaker 1: you can only say so much, and at the end

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Speaker 1: of the day, your team the publisher has a lot

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Speaker 1: more say generally UM. But when I went in to

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Speaker 1: those cover conversations, I knew I wanted to have a

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Speaker 1: black artist designed the cover, and my Asian and I

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Speaker 1: sat down and we created a list of black artists

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Speaker 1: that we found on Instagram online and one particular author

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Speaker 1: UM was Emmy Coker and he is a Nigerian born

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Speaker 1: artistic belief, and he created this gorgeous piece of artwork

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Speaker 1: for Twitter's June team last year. It's called and basically

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Speaker 1: the image of the cover. It's a little different, but

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Speaker 1: the thing I loved about it, I mean royalty a

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Speaker 1: profile view of her. You see her, she was looking legal. Um.

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Speaker 1: And you also have that earring which is an Afro

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Speaker 1: pick with our black power fist, which is the kind

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Speaker 1: of pick that I actually got the first time I

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Speaker 1: went natural a few years ago. And it's also a

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Speaker 1: pick that my dad happened to have growing up back

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Speaker 1: when we had hair still so he don't be laughing

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Speaker 1: at your dad and me. Okay, okay, I had the pig.

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Speaker 1: Now I had the pick. We just the same ate

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Speaker 1: summer right now. My dad is like, um. But the

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Speaker 1: fact that you know, this artwork happened. And my designer,

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Speaker 1: who Jimmy Akabelly, who is at Term and Schuster, took

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Speaker 1: that design and made into this cover and the artist

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Speaker 1: of course was so lovely about it too. Tummy Cooker

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Speaker 1: was like, absolutely, we need more black women authors. Um

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Speaker 1: excited to be a part of it. And this is

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Speaker 1: all connected to the pick. It just felt so right

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Speaker 1: and it's so exciting to me that young black people

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Speaker 1: will go into the store, go into Walmart, into that

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Speaker 1: independent bookstore, Barnes and Noble, Google, play whatever and see

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Speaker 1: this image and see just blackness in this way in

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Speaker 1: your face. I just love it. What grows in the

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Speaker 1: forest trees, sure, No what else grows in the forest,

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Speaker 1: Our imagination, our sense of wonder, and our family bonds

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Speaker 1: grow too, because when we disconnect from this and connect

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Speaker 1: with this, we reconnect with each other. The forest is

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Speaker 1: closer than you think. Find a forest near you and

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Speaker 1: start exploring. I discover the forest dot org brought to

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Speaker 1: you by the United States Forest Service and the AD Council.

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Speaker 1: If I could be you and you could be me

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Speaker 1: for just what hour, If you could find a way

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Speaker 1: to get inside each other's mind. Walk a mile in

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Speaker 1: my shoes, wacome mile in my shoes, walcome shoes. We've

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Speaker 1: all felt left out, and for some that feeling lasts

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Speaker 1: more than a moment. We can change that. Learn how

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Speaker 1: it belonging begins with us. Dot org brought to you

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Speaker 1: by the AD Council. Welcome out in the Machine. Adoption

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Speaker 1: of teams from foster care is a topic not enough

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Speaker 1: people know about and we're here to change that. I'm

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00:20:50,440 --> 00:20:54,120
Speaker 1: April Dennuity, host of the new podcast Navigating Adoption, presented

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Speaker 1: by adopt Us Kids. Each episode brings you compelling, real

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Speaker 1: life adoption stories told by the family that lived in

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00:21:00,520 --> 00:21:04,360
Speaker 1: with commentary from experts. Visit adopt us Kids dot org.

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Speaker 1: Slash podcasts are subscribed to Navigating Adoption presented by adopt

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Speaker 1: Us Kids, brought to you by the U. S Department

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Speaker 1: of Health and Human Services, Administration for Children and Families

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Speaker 1: and the Council. Well, you should love it, and you

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Speaker 1: and it's a blessing to see that happened. And you know,

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Speaker 1: when I when I look at the genres like this

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Speaker 1: to go into that horror it was alway several years

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Speaker 1: ago when you saw horror. On horror movie, we always

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Speaker 1: in a black character. You always do the black character

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Speaker 1: is gonna die first. You always say that was just

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Speaker 1: running joke. The black character's gonna die for. I don't

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Speaker 1: know what that brother, Oh, we got paid he did

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Speaker 1: that clone. But the other black girl. You know, it

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Speaker 1: combines all these extraordinary genres. Is a dark comedy, it's

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Speaker 1: horror as a thriller, plays with your mind, is science

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Speaker 1: fiction and more how were you able to mix all

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Speaker 1: these the same blend them altogether comfortably? Because one thing

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Speaker 1: I want to just say this about you, the kid,

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Speaker 1: is that you are so descriptive in your writing. I mean,

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Speaker 1: it's very detailed and it's on which allows me to

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Speaker 1: really visualize the moment of the scene that you're trying

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Speaker 1: to create, which is a gift in itself, and I

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Speaker 1: feel that's what really kind of got everybody excited because

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Speaker 1: they could feel your experience, They could almost smell your

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Speaker 1: experience and also could emotionally be engaged in your experience

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Speaker 1: from the description of the hair or the big ear

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Speaker 1: rings when y'all are laughing together or sitting at the

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Speaker 1: account and the sun coming through you mean, you even

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Speaker 1: you even wrote balled up the paper, the paper and

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Speaker 1: threw it in the trash. Even you even wrote that

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Speaker 1: in your in your in your language of your book,

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Speaker 1: and it was like, Wow, she is really really on

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Speaker 1: point here talk about weaving all those things together. And

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Speaker 1: that's a strong compliment because, like I said, that's something

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Speaker 1: I can't do, and that's a gift and the blessing

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Speaker 1: that you have. Oh, I really appreciate that so much.

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Speaker 1: Um that means a lot to me. Yeah, I mean

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Speaker 1: for me blending everything, I'm not gonna stay with it

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Speaker 1: because it took a lot of eyes on my work.

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Speaker 1: It took um people that I met during my bad

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Speaker 1: school days. It took my dad, it took my agents

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Speaker 1: and my editor, a lot of people. Um. But for

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Speaker 1: me it was easy in a lot of ways. It's

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Speaker 1: just in the sense of knowing that's what I wanted

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Speaker 1: to do, because I do feel like so much of

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Speaker 1: the Black experience is often humor and fun and joy,

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Speaker 1: but then also there's like a bitterness that we have

428
00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:29,200
Speaker 1: to often navigate through, and there's a horrifying nature, especially

429
00:23:29,280 --> 00:23:31,719
Speaker 1: just as black people. Day to day you get up

430
00:23:32,359 --> 00:23:35,760
Speaker 1: and see the news, see what's happening to us, and

431
00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:39,120
Speaker 1: then have to go to work or create, and how

432
00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:41,639
Speaker 1: do you manage all of those things. It's it's horrified,

433
00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:46,159
Speaker 1: and so really getting that down and showing what was

434
00:23:46,280 --> 00:23:50,600
Speaker 1: at stake for Nella's experiences, but also seeing Nella having fun,

435
00:23:50,960 --> 00:23:53,640
Speaker 1: showing her living her full life outside of work, that

436
00:23:53,760 --> 00:23:57,800
Speaker 1: was that was a really crucial part of the writing

437
00:23:57,800 --> 00:23:59,960
Speaker 1: process for me. And I guess that doesn't really answer

438
00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:03,000
Speaker 1: a question, but well answers my question. The sense that

439
00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:06,040
Speaker 1: you are. You know, I won't to say all over

440
00:24:06,080 --> 00:24:08,840
Speaker 1: the place, but with the system of story proper storytelling,

441
00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:11,560
Speaker 1: because I had to be able to you know, like

442
00:24:11,600 --> 00:24:14,280
Speaker 1: I said, I could relate to her insecurities because there

443
00:24:14,280 --> 00:24:17,359
Speaker 1: were This book is tied to insecurities. It's because she's

444
00:24:17,400 --> 00:24:20,200
Speaker 1: pushed along and some of the flaws that pop out

445
00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:22,600
Speaker 1: of some of the stakes she get into a tied

446
00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:27,200
Speaker 1: to taking bad suggestions or suggestions that she shouldn't, that

447
00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:29,440
Speaker 1: she should like lead with her first thought and then

448
00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:32,560
Speaker 1: it just stumbles and it just starts unraveling. And that's

449
00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 1: just the part of it that really catches your eye,

450
00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:38,280
Speaker 1: makes it relatable because we all have been there. And

451
00:24:38,320 --> 00:24:40,520
Speaker 1: so I'm talking to the author of the incredible book

452
00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:42,760
Speaker 1: The Other Black Girls, the Other Black Girl, the New

453
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:45,040
Speaker 1: York Times best seller names because it's a kid. Before

454
00:24:45,040 --> 00:24:48,080
Speaker 1: we wrap up, I've mentioned her name earlier on Rashida

455
00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:51,399
Speaker 1: Jones Uh And the book is being Um, is she

456
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:53,879
Speaker 1: gonna start in the or she just gonna take an

457
00:24:53,920 --> 00:24:56,920
Speaker 1: executive producer role in the Hulu series that the book

458
00:24:57,000 --> 00:25:02,400
Speaker 1: is being adapted for. Yeah, we're still in the early stages, um,

459
00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:06,520
Speaker 1: but right now we are co writing the pilot UM episode.

460
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:12,719
Speaker 1: We have been you know, talking a lot over the

461
00:25:12,800 --> 00:25:16,439
Speaker 1: last year now, I guess well, um, just about the

462
00:25:16,560 --> 00:25:21,119
Speaker 1: shape um outline, how the characters are going to be

463
00:25:21,160 --> 00:25:24,639
Speaker 1: different in the show versus the and what we do

464
00:25:24,760 --> 00:25:29,439
Speaker 1: want to keep because the conversations about blackness and diversity

465
00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:34,560
Speaker 1: have changed, that's in the last year. So exploring that

466
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:38,480
Speaker 1: and how to make your show feel as relevant as

467
00:25:38,600 --> 00:25:41,440
Speaker 1: it could be feeling at the time, that's that's been

468
00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:44,919
Speaker 1: really interesting and fun because again also we all have

469
00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:50,159
Speaker 1: the yeas of just progress in the best way to

470
00:25:50,280 --> 00:25:53,760
Speaker 1: purvey those insecurities you mentioned, those anxieties and all of

471
00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:57,639
Speaker 1: those things, um, because I come from a very different

472
00:25:57,640 --> 00:26:02,440
Speaker 1: background Rashida instead, we have worked so well together and

473
00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:06,000
Speaker 1: she's just wonderful and took me under her way. That's

474
00:26:06,000 --> 00:26:08,840
Speaker 1: been the most amazing. I would tell you this is

475
00:26:08,840 --> 00:26:11,520
Speaker 1: a key. You know, Yes, there have been a lot

476
00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:15,400
Speaker 1: of outward changes, okay, but it hasn't changed. Okay. So

477
00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:17,960
Speaker 1: that's why your book was very relatable. So don't try

478
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:20,920
Speaker 1: to don't try to fit it in because you know, no, no, no,

479
00:26:22,440 --> 00:26:27,840
Speaker 1: actually gotten more instidious that idea of um, you know,

480
00:26:27,960 --> 00:26:32,159
Speaker 1: especially with the Twitter, the performative aspect of what we

481
00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:36,480
Speaker 1: saw last year in company, being like, oh yeah, we're

482
00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:41,400
Speaker 1: whatever now actually got me even maybe worse. That's maybe

483
00:26:41,440 --> 00:26:44,560
Speaker 1: a little but I don't know, because it's a brilliant book.

484
00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:46,719
Speaker 1: And before Lee, I wanted to teach you about you know,

485
00:26:46,800 --> 00:26:51,240
Speaker 1: this old soul, this drifting inside your head, this introverted

486
00:26:51,320 --> 00:26:55,840
Speaker 1: head here, you know, the twilight Zone references. I'm going like,

487
00:26:56,080 --> 00:27:00,680
Speaker 1: really really trilight Zone she references old you seeking all

488
00:27:00,680 --> 00:27:04,080
Speaker 1: this stuff. Talk about you in general. So you seem

489
00:27:04,119 --> 00:27:07,359
Speaker 1: so relatable, you see, like a genuine person that I

490
00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:10,199
Speaker 1: could really and continually talk to and laugh at it.

491
00:27:10,480 --> 00:27:12,320
Speaker 1: I can take you the comedy club and might ask

492
00:27:12,400 --> 00:27:13,560
Speaker 1: you for a day. I just say, I could take

493
00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:15,879
Speaker 1: you to a comedy collect tak your jazz concert. I

494
00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:18,240
Speaker 1: can take you to a Frankie Beverly and May's concert,

495
00:27:18,680 --> 00:27:21,480
Speaker 1: that type of thing. Think at yes, look at it.

496
00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:24,680
Speaker 1: And so I just feel that this book allows you

497
00:27:24,760 --> 00:27:28,240
Speaker 1: to have those those levels and incredibility and writing it.

498
00:27:28,320 --> 00:27:31,119
Speaker 1: So it is that was that tied to just your upbringing,

499
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:34,040
Speaker 1: your parents putting the music on. Talk about you mentioned

500
00:27:34,040 --> 00:27:36,960
Speaker 1: your aunt Hazel, one of the characters is named after that.

501
00:27:37,280 --> 00:27:40,520
Speaker 1: Talk about that and also telling writers. How like you said,

502
00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:42,199
Speaker 1: read a lot, read a lot, read a lot, but

503
00:27:42,320 --> 00:27:46,560
Speaker 1: also about sharing your honest story lifestyle in this book

504
00:27:46,760 --> 00:27:51,960
Speaker 1: and be animated, authentic correct. Definitely. Well, the music thing

505
00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:57,160
Speaker 1: absolutely comes from my parents. I grew up so many

506
00:27:57,240 --> 00:28:00,679
Speaker 1: kinds of music in the household, mostly I mean, on

507
00:28:00,720 --> 00:28:05,040
Speaker 1: my dad's side, I had Aretha Franklin, I had Jerry Butler,

508
00:28:05,200 --> 00:28:10,359
Speaker 1: the Spinners, all of the fifties, sixties, seventies, UM R

509
00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:13,040
Speaker 1: and B and soul Um. And my mom's side, I

510
00:28:13,080 --> 00:28:16,800
Speaker 1: had um a lot of Jackson five and a lot

511
00:28:16,840 --> 00:28:20,320
Speaker 1: of um different artists, I mean Rod Stewart too. Like

512
00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:24,280
Speaker 1: I also come from a very diverse music background as well,

513
00:28:25,119 --> 00:28:29,640
Speaker 1: so that was really fun to play on and reference

514
00:28:29,840 --> 00:28:36,080
Speaker 1: people who would catch those africas. So I appreciate, yes, um,

515
00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:40,840
Speaker 1: but yeah, I think making sure when you are writing

516
00:28:40,840 --> 00:28:45,120
Speaker 1: your story, just don't worry too much about what's coming

517
00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:46,960
Speaker 1: down the line. I mean, of course you're going to

518
00:28:47,240 --> 00:28:49,840
Speaker 1: I know I did, and I was kind of sometimes

519
00:28:49,880 --> 00:28:51,640
Speaker 1: I fell into those moods of like, oh, well, if

520
00:28:51,680 --> 00:28:53,600
Speaker 1: I keep it in the publishing world and you know,

521
00:28:53,680 --> 00:28:55,959
Speaker 1: what's what's what are we gonna say? Or oh if

522
00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:59,200
Speaker 1: I if I get too much into the kitchen of

523
00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:01,880
Speaker 1: this black woman care like but like, you know what,

524
00:29:01,920 --> 00:29:04,360
Speaker 1: I need to just tell this story the way that

525
00:29:04,600 --> 00:29:06,800
Speaker 1: is true for me, and I think if you do

526
00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:10,320
Speaker 1: that it will You're learning and have a braid on

527
00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:13,400
Speaker 1: the via YouTube that's authentic to me. I'm just gonna

528
00:29:13,520 --> 00:29:15,720
Speaker 1: let you know I've just read the book, my friend,

529
00:29:15,760 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 1: and there's a brilliant book. Thank you for allowing me

530
00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:20,720
Speaker 1: to come into your world. The other black girl, Tequilla,

531
00:29:21,080 --> 00:29:23,880
Speaker 1: the Leila Harris, thank you for coming on Money Making Conversation.

532
00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:26,920
Speaker 1: You're fantastic. Oh by that gut you know this is

533
00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:30,200
Speaker 1: so much fun. And tell your dad you know I

534
00:29:30,280 --> 00:29:33,680
Speaker 1: got it going on. You know I got it going on. Okay,

535
00:29:33,720 --> 00:29:35,560
Speaker 1: thank you for coming on Money Making Conversation. If you

536
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:37,120
Speaker 1: want to hear any of my interviews, I'll see in

537
00:29:37,240 --> 00:29:39,520
Speaker 1: my interviews of money Making Conversations, please go to money

538
00:29:39,520 --> 00:29:43,200
Speaker 1: Making Conversation dot com. I'm Rashan McDonald, I am yours.

539
00:29:44,400 --> 00:29:47,120
Speaker 1: In this season of giving, Cools has gifts for all

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Speaker 1: and shame moisture. And in this spirit of giving, Coals

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Speaker 1: Give with all your heart this season with great gifts

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Speaker 1: from Coals or Coals dot com. A man called Those

547
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Speaker 1: Miller of the eighty five South Show and do men favors.

548
00:30:16,800 --> 00:30:19,320
Speaker 1: Make sure you check out The Black Market, hostly by

549
00:30:19,440 --> 00:30:22,760
Speaker 1: me only on the eighty five South Show. Fee Subscribe

550
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Speaker 1: to the eighty five South Show to here and tune

551
00:30:25,400 --> 00:30:29,800
Speaker 1: into the black Market here amazing interviews with entrepreneurs, creatives,

552
00:30:29,920 --> 00:30:32,960
Speaker 1: and thought leaders, people who are doing amazing things in

553
00:30:33,000 --> 00:30:36,160
Speaker 1: the black community. Listen to The Black Market on my

554
00:30:36,400 --> 00:30:40,920
Speaker 1: Heart Radio, app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to podcasts.

555
00:30:43,960 --> 00:30:46,600
Speaker 1: Adoption of teams from foster care is a topic not

556
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Speaker 1: enough people know about, and we're here to change that.

557
00:30:49,160 --> 00:30:52,600
Speaker 1: I'm April Dinuity, host of the new podcast Navigating Adoption,

558
00:30:52,680 --> 00:30:56,360
Speaker 1: presented by adopt us Kids. Each episode brings you compelling,

559
00:30:56,440 --> 00:30:59,520
Speaker 1: real life adoption stories told by the families that lived them,

560
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:03,360
Speaker 1: with comment Harry from experts. Visit adopt us Kids dot org,

561
00:31:03,400 --> 00:31:07,200
Speaker 1: slash podcast, or subscribe to Navigating Adoption presented by adopt

562
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Speaker 1: us Kids, Brought to you by the U. S. Department

563
00:31:09,480 --> 00:31:12,280
Speaker 1: of Health, that Human Service as Administration for Children and Families,

564
00:31:12,280 --> 00:31:13,240
Speaker 1: and the Act Council