1
00:00:00,880 --> 00:00:02,559
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace.

2
00:00:07,520 --> 00:00:14,360
Speaker 2: I cannot believe this. What is wrong with the system,

3
00:00:14,920 --> 00:00:21,000
Speaker 2: the primary, the soul, the chief suspect in the kidnapp

4
00:00:21,400 --> 00:00:25,520
Speaker 2: and I believe murder of three year old Mattie McCann

5
00:00:26,040 --> 00:00:31,479
Speaker 2: has walked free. Oh, the words just stuck in my

6
00:00:31,840 --> 00:00:38,080
Speaker 2: throat like a lump of coal. Walk free. I'm Nancy Grace,

7
00:00:38,200 --> 00:00:39,280
Speaker 2: this is Crime Stories.

8
00:00:39,320 --> 00:00:41,200
Speaker 1: I want to thank you for being with us.

9
00:00:43,240 --> 00:00:48,080
Speaker 2: UK police say the forty nine year old suspect remains

10
00:00:48,840 --> 00:00:53,080
Speaker 2: the primary suspect in the disappearance of little Mattie McCain,

11
00:00:53,960 --> 00:01:01,280
Speaker 2: but for reasons I don't understand, the suspect, Christian Bruckner,

12
00:01:02,000 --> 00:01:10,240
Speaker 2: has walked free. I can't believe it. This guy has

13
00:01:10,240 --> 00:01:16,120
Speaker 2: been the chief suspect since twenty twenty. Dear Lord in heaven,

14
00:01:16,640 --> 00:01:20,160
Speaker 2: please make this not so okay? Why do I think

15
00:01:20,240 --> 00:01:25,560
Speaker 2: Christian Bruckner murdered three year old Maddie mccannn This is why.

16
00:01:25,640 --> 00:01:30,040
Speaker 3: What happened to Maddie joining me an all star panel

17
00:01:30,080 --> 00:01:31,120
Speaker 3: to make sense of what we know?

18
00:01:31,360 --> 00:01:31,959
Speaker 1: Right now?

19
00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:36,039
Speaker 3: High profile lawyer joining me out of the Atlanta jurisdiction,

20
00:01:36,160 --> 00:01:39,880
Speaker 3: former prosecutor of felony crimes just like this one now.

21
00:01:39,959 --> 00:01:41,960
Speaker 1: Defense attorney Darryl Cohen.

22
00:01:42,400 --> 00:01:46,000
Speaker 3: Doctor Angel Arnold, renowned psychiatrist, joining us, also from the

23
00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:50,440
Speaker 3: Atlanta jurisdiction, and you can find her at her website.

24
00:01:50,720 --> 00:01:53,400
Speaker 1: Doctor ANGELA. Arnold, MD dot com.

25
00:01:53,720 --> 00:01:58,160
Speaker 3: Special Deputy Sheriff Johnson County Sheriff's Office, Executive Director of

26
00:01:58,160 --> 00:02:00,720
Speaker 3: the Kelsey Smith Foundation, Greg Smith.

27
00:02:00,880 --> 00:02:01,360
Speaker 4: Joining us.

28
00:02:01,600 --> 00:02:06,760
Speaker 3: First to Charlie Langston, Editor Dailymail dot com. Charlie, thank

29
00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:10,919
Speaker 3: you for being with us. Charlie, what a long time

30
00:02:11,040 --> 00:02:15,000
Speaker 3: we've waited for justice and then Maddie McCann disappearance, or

31
00:02:15,280 --> 00:02:17,880
Speaker 3: should I just call it like it is, Charlie, the

32
00:02:17,960 --> 00:02:21,919
Speaker 3: Maddie McCann murder, This little girl just three years old

33
00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:23,600
Speaker 3: when she was abducted.

34
00:02:23,960 --> 00:02:28,360
Speaker 5: I mean, the incredible interest that remains in this case

35
00:02:28,440 --> 00:02:32,000
Speaker 5: and in all of its developments just go to show

36
00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:35,960
Speaker 5: how much of a sensational crime this was. It was

37
00:02:36,040 --> 00:02:39,600
Speaker 5: devastating to the entire country, to the entire world to

38
00:02:39,639 --> 00:02:43,120
Speaker 5: see this three year old girl disappear without a trace,

39
00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:47,880
Speaker 5: and to see her parents year after year begging the authorities,

40
00:02:48,200 --> 00:02:51,280
Speaker 5: begging the public to help them try and find out

41
00:02:51,680 --> 00:02:53,200
Speaker 5: what has happened to their child.

42
00:02:53,360 --> 00:02:59,000
Speaker 3: You're right, Charlie, just seeing the McCanns crying and begging,

43
00:02:59,080 --> 00:03:02,680
Speaker 3: and of course under the circumstances where little baby man

44
00:03:02,720 --> 00:03:06,959
Speaker 3: he went missing, they were first suspected, which tore them

45
00:03:07,040 --> 00:03:09,399
Speaker 3: up all the more guys, who.

46
00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:13,760
Speaker 1: Is this guy that is now the suspect? Finally he's

47
00:03:13,880 --> 00:03:16,919
Speaker 1: been in their cross heres for a long time. I

48
00:03:16,919 --> 00:03:17,520
Speaker 1: don't know what.

49
00:03:17,639 --> 00:03:21,320
Speaker 3: Has taken them so long to name him an official suspect.

50
00:03:21,360 --> 00:03:23,600
Speaker 3: Taking listen to oraka three are friends at sky.

51
00:03:23,639 --> 00:03:27,320
Speaker 6: But Madeleine McCann's parents there's still hope she's alive. But

52
00:03:27,520 --> 00:03:31,720
Speaker 6: prosecutor hands Christian Vultures says he's leading a murder investigation.

53
00:03:32,320 --> 00:03:35,440
Speaker 6: Madeline's parents still believe she could be alive. Why do

54
00:03:35,600 --> 00:03:37,480
Speaker 6: you call it a murder investigation?

55
00:03:38,400 --> 00:03:43,320
Speaker 7: So so many effects that she's dead, so there's no

56
00:03:45,120 --> 00:03:49,480
Speaker 7: Muclicut opportunity, opportunity that she is still living.

57
00:03:50,160 --> 00:03:53,680
Speaker 6: The case against the new suspect, Christian Bee, is circumstantial.

58
00:03:54,240 --> 00:03:58,559
Speaker 6: He's a convicted child sex abuser. He lived along Portugal's

59
00:03:58,560 --> 00:04:01,880
Speaker 6: Algarve coast for twelve years. His last home was in

60
00:04:01,960 --> 00:04:05,480
Speaker 6: prior to Loge. When Madeline vanished. His phone was used

61
00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:09,120
Speaker 6: outside the mccoun apartment the night she disappeared.

62
00:04:08,920 --> 00:04:12,320
Speaker 7: With the AMNISTI Laija from Melon mckinn begin Abo half

63
00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:13,360
Speaker 7: an hours does he taught.

64
00:04:13,280 --> 00:04:16,560
Speaker 8: Us We don't have Madeline mcken's buddy, but we expect that.

65
00:04:16,680 --> 00:04:19,680
Speaker 8: She said. We have some evidence that the suspect has

66
00:04:19,720 --> 00:04:22,719
Speaker 8: done the deed, but we need more information from people

67
00:04:22,920 --> 00:04:25,279
Speaker 8: places he has lived, so we can target these places

68
00:04:25,360 --> 00:04:27,760
Speaker 8: especially and search there for Madeline.

69
00:04:28,040 --> 00:04:31,479
Speaker 3: You know, I find it really interesting out to Greg Smith,

70
00:04:31,640 --> 00:04:35,880
Speaker 3: us special deputy shriff joining us justin County. You of

71
00:04:36,040 --> 00:04:40,440
Speaker 3: all people know the power of the ping. Okay, the

72
00:04:40,480 --> 00:04:44,359
Speaker 3: power of a cell phone ping. Did I just hear

73
00:04:44,520 --> 00:04:50,840
Speaker 3: Greg Smith that this guy cell phone pin just outside

74
00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:58,159
Speaker 3: Maddy mccannon's apartment. The it was like an Airbnb where

75
00:04:58,240 --> 00:05:01,040
Speaker 3: they were staying at this plush resort.

76
00:05:02,120 --> 00:05:03,440
Speaker 1: They didn't know that before.

77
00:05:03,560 --> 00:05:07,680
Speaker 9: Now, well it depends on how they did it. I mean,

78
00:05:08,200 --> 00:05:12,880
Speaker 9: there is a way to get live location data, you know,

79
00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:14,600
Speaker 9: at the time of the crime. That type of thing,

80
00:05:15,839 --> 00:05:18,240
Speaker 9: the stuff that I work on all the time. There's

81
00:05:18,279 --> 00:05:21,119
Speaker 9: also a way to get that data though, from historical data,

82
00:05:21,120 --> 00:05:23,960
Speaker 9: from what's known as c drs, are called detailed records.

83
00:05:25,000 --> 00:05:27,840
Speaker 9: You can go back and get the information on which

84
00:05:27,960 --> 00:05:31,440
Speaker 9: powers a phone contacted and their software you can put

85
00:05:31,480 --> 00:05:33,240
Speaker 9: that into and it'll map that out and you can

86
00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:37,520
Speaker 9: actually see where that phone has traveled. So it would

87
00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:41,560
Speaker 9: be interesting to know when they got that information, how

88
00:05:41,600 --> 00:05:44,239
Speaker 9: how long ago did they get it? Is it something

89
00:05:44,279 --> 00:05:46,760
Speaker 9: they just recently said, Hey, we can do this. I mean,

90
00:05:47,120 --> 00:05:50,760
Speaker 9: you know, there's a lot of questions here a long time, you.

91
00:05:50,720 --> 00:05:53,680
Speaker 3: Know, Charlie Linkston, I don't understand that. Charlie Langston joining

92
00:05:53,720 --> 00:05:56,240
Speaker 3: us before with dailymail dot com. She's the editor of

93
00:05:56,400 --> 00:05:58,200
Speaker 3: Female f E.

94
00:05:58,080 --> 00:06:00,800
Speaker 1: M A I L. I don't understand it.

95
00:06:00,839 --> 00:06:04,719
Speaker 3: If he is linked outside where our parents were staying

96
00:06:05,080 --> 00:06:07,520
Speaker 3: at the time, why has it taken.

97
00:06:07,240 --> 00:06:08,159
Speaker 1: Them so long?

98
00:06:08,360 --> 00:06:11,479
Speaker 5: You know, this whole case has just been filled with

99
00:06:12,040 --> 00:06:15,760
Speaker 5: error after error after error, starting right from the jump

100
00:06:15,800 --> 00:06:20,360
Speaker 5: when Maddie disappeared. The Portuguese police came under huge criticism

101
00:06:20,360 --> 00:06:24,160
Speaker 5: at the time because they failed to take any action immediately,

102
00:06:24,560 --> 00:06:28,640
Speaker 5: which we now believe allowed this suspect, this man to

103
00:06:28,839 --> 00:06:32,080
Speaker 5: get out of Portugal. As soon as the media fraw

104
00:06:32,240 --> 00:06:36,240
Speaker 5: began around the Maddie McCann case, this guy slipped out

105
00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:39,440
Speaker 5: of Portugal and we believe went back to Germany. None

106
00:06:39,440 --> 00:06:41,719
Speaker 5: of the borders were locked down, none of that stuff

107
00:06:41,800 --> 00:06:44,640
Speaker 5: was put into place, and that allowed him to walk

108
00:06:44,760 --> 00:06:48,440
Speaker 5: right out of the country. So to even know that

109
00:06:48,520 --> 00:06:51,839
Speaker 5: he was there at the time, we would perhaps have

110
00:06:52,080 --> 00:06:55,120
Speaker 5: identified him as being in Portugal. Nobody knew at the

111
00:06:55,160 --> 00:06:58,520
Speaker 5: time because he was allowed to flee before anyone could

112
00:06:58,560 --> 00:06:59,960
Speaker 5: even raise him as a suspect.

113
00:07:00,120 --> 00:07:03,839
Speaker 3: And at that time, Darryl Cohen, he was already a

114
00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:11,000
Speaker 3: sex offender. He had been molesting little girls, boggling them,

115
00:07:11,360 --> 00:07:16,280
Speaker 3: just a long, long history. How he was moving so

116
00:07:16,640 --> 00:07:19,400
Speaker 3: freely from one country to the next.

117
00:07:19,800 --> 00:07:23,280
Speaker 4: Nancy, you have to wonder where the police were, where

118
00:07:23,320 --> 00:07:26,000
Speaker 4: their eyes were, where their head was, and their hands

119
00:07:26,000 --> 00:07:27,560
Speaker 4: weren't moving the way they should have.

120
00:07:27,760 --> 00:07:30,920
Speaker 3: Well, obviously I know where their heads were up their

121
00:07:30,960 --> 00:07:35,080
Speaker 3: rear ends, because this guy was allowed to wander around

122
00:07:35,640 --> 00:07:39,840
Speaker 3: right there where this child was staying. And there are

123
00:07:39,880 --> 00:07:43,920
Speaker 3: now other cases a rape of a US citizen in

124
00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:47,440
Speaker 3: the area, and a sex attack on another elderly lady,

125
00:07:48,080 --> 00:07:50,000
Speaker 3: another young girl.

126
00:07:49,760 --> 00:07:52,160
Speaker 1: Who goes missing not too too far.

127
00:07:52,040 --> 00:07:57,840
Speaker 3: Away around the age and very physically similar to Maddy McCann.

128
00:07:58,200 --> 00:08:00,600
Speaker 1: And he's connected to all these things that I know.

129
00:08:01,280 --> 00:08:03,280
Speaker 1: I know, Daryl Cohen that you.

130
00:08:03,240 --> 00:08:06,400
Speaker 3: Would scream bloody murder at trial if I did this,

131
00:08:06,880 --> 00:08:10,560
Speaker 3: But don't you think it's quite the coincidence that where

132
00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:15,080
Speaker 3: the elderly woman is raped, where the US citizen is raped,

133
00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:17,880
Speaker 3: where the other little girl goes missing, that looks like

134
00:08:18,080 --> 00:08:23,760
Speaker 3: Maddie McCann. Where Maddie goes missing, he's always in the area,

135
00:08:23,880 --> 00:08:26,560
Speaker 3: he's always right there, a couple of blocks away. That

136
00:08:26,600 --> 00:08:27,520
Speaker 3: doesn't bother you.

137
00:08:27,960 --> 00:08:31,120
Speaker 4: I absolutely admit it is not a coincidence, because I

138
00:08:31,160 --> 00:08:35,439
Speaker 4: don't believe in coincidences, But I am very concerned about

139
00:08:35,480 --> 00:08:40,520
Speaker 4: the lack of appropriate police fork and their investigation would

140
00:08:41,080 --> 00:08:44,880
Speaker 4: dead end until finally and maybe now we'll have justice,

141
00:08:45,120 --> 00:08:45,800
Speaker 4: just maybe.

142
00:08:46,160 --> 00:08:48,280
Speaker 3: Guys, I want you to take a listen now to

143
00:08:48,360 --> 00:08:51,520
Speaker 3: our cut eighteen our friends at Sky News, and this

144
00:08:51,679 --> 00:08:55,840
Speaker 3: is about the possibility that some of Madeline baby Madda

145
00:08:55,920 --> 00:09:00,960
Speaker 3: McCann's clothes were found in an area. I don't know

146
00:09:00,960 --> 00:09:03,520
Speaker 3: if you guys have this, but in a lot of areas,

147
00:09:03,960 --> 00:09:09,280
Speaker 3: especially densely populated areas, there are patches of ground where

148
00:09:09,280 --> 00:09:13,920
Speaker 3: people can plant a garden, they can have.

149
00:09:14,720 --> 00:09:18,160
Speaker 1: A structure there. That is what this.

150
00:09:18,040 --> 00:09:22,840
Speaker 3: Guy had, this Christian Bruckner, And it is there that

151
00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:26,720
Speaker 3: we believe there's a possibility that some of Maddie's clothes

152
00:09:27,000 --> 00:09:27,800
Speaker 3: were buried.

153
00:09:28,160 --> 00:09:28,800
Speaker 1: Take a listen.

154
00:09:29,040 --> 00:09:31,320
Speaker 6: Do you still have the same suspect you had three

155
00:09:31,320 --> 00:09:31,840
Speaker 6: months ago?

156
00:09:32,120 --> 00:09:35,160
Speaker 7: Yes, we have only one suspect, only Christian me.

157
00:09:35,800 --> 00:09:37,880
Speaker 6: How much information has you been sent?

158
00:09:38,640 --> 00:09:41,719
Speaker 7: We got hundreds of hints. Of course, there are some

159
00:09:41,880 --> 00:09:47,359
Speaker 7: hins which are only rubbish, but there are some hins

160
00:09:47,960 --> 00:09:54,360
Speaker 7: we are hopeful that can make our investigation more successful.

161
00:09:55,160 --> 00:09:59,719
Speaker 6: Three months ago, you said you needed good evidence for

162
00:09:59,760 --> 00:10:03,120
Speaker 6: an evidence. Have you found that yet?

163
00:10:03,280 --> 00:10:06,960
Speaker 7: We have no forensic evidence. But it's not necessary to

164
00:10:07,080 --> 00:10:08,640
Speaker 7: have forensic evidence.

165
00:10:08,280 --> 00:10:09,920
Speaker 8: To charge our suspect.

166
00:10:10,080 --> 00:10:14,439
Speaker 7: But we need some more evidence, maybe a witness, maybe

167
00:10:14,440 --> 00:10:15,920
Speaker 7: a photo or a video.

168
00:10:16,720 --> 00:10:20,200
Speaker 6: I asked the prosecutor what evidence he has that makes

169
00:10:20,280 --> 00:10:24,320
Speaker 6: him certain that Madeline is dead. He won't say, but

170
00:10:24,440 --> 00:10:26,000
Speaker 6: he is aware of rumors.

171
00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:30,160
Speaker 7: Someone told me that we have found the clothes of Maddie.

172
00:10:30,200 --> 00:10:31,360
Speaker 6: He has the pajamas.

173
00:10:31,520 --> 00:10:33,520
Speaker 8: Yeah, but it's not true.

174
00:10:33,679 --> 00:10:36,319
Speaker 7: If we found something like that, it would be.

175
00:10:36,280 --> 00:10:50,200
Speaker 2: Great crime stories. With Natty Grace, the primary suspect in

176
00:10:50,280 --> 00:10:54,800
Speaker 2: the kidnap and murder little Maddie McCann, her disappear at

177
00:10:54,840 --> 00:11:01,560
Speaker 2: sparking a world wide search, was free. What in the world,

178
00:11:01,760 --> 00:11:05,840
Speaker 2: why would he be allowed to walk free. As you know,

179
00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:09,520
Speaker 2: little Maddie goes missing on vacation with her family and

180
00:11:09,640 --> 00:11:15,280
Speaker 2: Priya Deluze. It sparked a frantic search across the world.

181
00:11:15,320 --> 00:11:17,240
Speaker 2: She's never been found.

182
00:11:17,559 --> 00:11:19,920
Speaker 3: Take a listen now our cut nineteen our friends at

183
00:11:19,960 --> 00:11:20,920
Speaker 3: Inside Edition.

184
00:11:21,520 --> 00:11:26,359
Speaker 10: Peter van Sentd questioned prosecutor Hans Christian Vaulters about the investigation.

185
00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:31,080
Speaker 7: We have strong evidence that Christian being killed Maddie mckenn.

186
00:11:31,480 --> 00:11:35,200
Speaker 11: But you don't have a body, correct, there's nobody.

187
00:11:34,840 --> 00:11:37,400
Speaker 7: No, we have no forensic evidence.

188
00:11:37,679 --> 00:11:40,319
Speaker 1: Then how can you be so certain we have out

189
00:11:40,400 --> 00:11:41,480
Speaker 1: the evidence.

190
00:11:41,000 --> 00:11:45,360
Speaker 12: And may I speculate that that evidence may include photographs

191
00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:46,319
Speaker 12: or video.

192
00:11:46,200 --> 00:11:47,199
Speaker 4: Of Mattie McCann.

193
00:11:47,400 --> 00:11:49,080
Speaker 7: Hugh May's Regulated.

194
00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:51,559
Speaker 10: Forty eight Hours reports that a search of an abandoned

195
00:11:51,600 --> 00:11:55,280
Speaker 10: warehouse that once belonged to the suspect turned up USB

196
00:11:55,520 --> 00:11:59,160
Speaker 10: drives that contain pictures and videos of child abuse. The

197
00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:03,040
Speaker 10: prosecutor wouldn't confirm if images of Madeline were on the drives.

198
00:12:03,440 --> 00:12:07,679
Speaker 3: Let me go out to doctor Angela Arnold, renowned psychiatrists

199
00:12:07,760 --> 00:12:09,040
Speaker 3: joining us, Doctor Angie.

200
00:12:09,679 --> 00:12:15,520
Speaker 1: It's one thing to molest a child, it's another thing

201
00:12:16,000 --> 00:12:19,000
Speaker 1: to video it. Because if in.

202
00:12:19,120 --> 00:12:24,439
Speaker 3: Fact Bruckner had video or photos of Maddie McCann, he

203
00:12:24,480 --> 00:12:27,120
Speaker 3: would have to have made them himself, because at that

204
00:12:27,320 --> 00:12:29,000
Speaker 3: time Maddie.

205
00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:29,760
Speaker 1: Was not public.

206
00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:32,920
Speaker 3: There were not pictures and video of her online. He

207
00:12:33,040 --> 00:12:36,320
Speaker 3: would have to have made it, which means it would

208
00:12:36,320 --> 00:12:40,120
Speaker 3: have been most likely video of him raping or torturing

209
00:12:40,200 --> 00:12:41,440
Speaker 3: this three year old little girl.

210
00:12:41,640 --> 00:12:44,840
Speaker 11: Well, and the horrific thing is if you video something

211
00:12:45,040 --> 00:12:46,840
Speaker 11: so that you can watch it over and over again

212
00:12:47,160 --> 00:12:49,800
Speaker 11: because you get some sort of thrill out of doing

213
00:12:49,880 --> 00:12:53,360
Speaker 11: it and watching it over again, it also means that

214
00:12:53,480 --> 00:12:56,120
Speaker 11: this had some planning on his part.

215
00:12:56,400 --> 00:12:56,800
Speaker 6: Doesn't it.

216
00:12:57,760 --> 00:12:59,720
Speaker 11: The thing that just gets me is that asking if

217
00:12:59,760 --> 00:13:03,120
Speaker 11: there's still a lot, if she's still up, maybe if

218
00:13:03,160 --> 00:13:05,200
Speaker 11: they had have done their work in the beginning, if

219
00:13:05,280 --> 00:13:07,080
Speaker 11: she was still alive, they could have found her.

220
00:13:07,200 --> 00:13:07,360
Speaker 4: Then.

221
00:13:07,600 --> 00:13:09,200
Speaker 11: I don't know why they think that all of a sudden,

222
00:13:09,240 --> 00:13:12,880
Speaker 11: she's going to be still alive fifteen years later. How

223
00:13:12,960 --> 00:13:14,080
Speaker 11: are they ever going to find her?

224
00:13:14,280 --> 00:13:17,199
Speaker 1: Well, I don't know that anyone has said that she

225
00:13:17,679 --> 00:13:18,800
Speaker 1: is still alive.

226
00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:20,599
Speaker 11: And that's not his mo.

227
00:13:20,920 --> 00:13:22,400
Speaker 4: Apparently he's you know, he.

228
00:13:24,200 --> 00:13:27,080
Speaker 11: If he did it, he raped her, he abused her,

229
00:13:27,160 --> 00:13:30,640
Speaker 11: he filmed it, And because of all the bumbling around

230
00:13:30,760 --> 00:13:33,120
Speaker 11: in this in this in the police in this country.

231
00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:35,120
Speaker 11: He's gotten away with it for this long.

232
00:13:35,240 --> 00:13:39,400
Speaker 3: It's horrible what happened the night that this little girl

233
00:13:39,720 --> 00:13:44,280
Speaker 3: seemingly vanishes into thin air while on vacation with her family.

234
00:13:44,600 --> 00:13:45,760
Speaker 1: Take a listen to our friends at the.

235
00:13:45,720 --> 00:13:48,360
Speaker 13: Sky A three year old British girl has gone missing

236
00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:51,439
Speaker 13: in the Algave in Portugual. Of course we can speak

237
00:13:51,480 --> 00:13:53,640
Speaker 13: now to Dan Mason, who's a journalist who works in

238
00:13:53,720 --> 00:13:55,640
Speaker 13: that area. Dan, thanks for johinning us on Sky News

239
00:13:55,640 --> 00:13:58,119
Speaker 13: Sunrise this morning. What are the details that you've gleaned.

240
00:13:57,880 --> 00:14:02,160
Speaker 12: So far, Tullia. All I basically know is that the

241
00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:07,319
Speaker 12: child was obviously saying a mark Corner establishment and was

242
00:14:07,400 --> 00:14:12,160
Speaker 12: reported missing around pm last night. She's three years old

243
00:14:13,120 --> 00:14:16,640
Speaker 12: and she's still the name of Madeline or Maddie for

244
00:14:16,840 --> 00:14:22,560
Speaker 12: her and most of the people within the area were

245
00:14:22,600 --> 00:14:25,280
Speaker 12: searching through to about four o'clock in the morning yesterday,

246
00:14:26,640 --> 00:14:32,560
Speaker 12: obviously through hedges and down the beach etc. To novelle

247
00:14:32,560 --> 00:14:34,640
Speaker 12: and I've just been down this morning to the club

248
00:14:34,680 --> 00:14:36,360
Speaker 12: again to see if at any more. News in the

249
00:14:36,440 --> 00:14:37,760
Speaker 12: situation is basically the same.

250
00:14:38,080 --> 00:14:41,960
Speaker 3: Straight out to Charlie Lengthy joining us on Dailymail dot com. Charliegain,

251
00:14:42,040 --> 00:14:43,080
Speaker 3: thank you for being with us.

252
00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:48,160
Speaker 1: Exactly what happened surrounding her disappearance.

253
00:14:48,560 --> 00:14:53,920
Speaker 5: So, the disappearance happened while Maddie's parents and their friends

254
00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:57,280
Speaker 5: were out at a restaurant in Portugal. They were dining

255
00:14:57,360 --> 00:15:00,280
Speaker 5: at a place about one hundred and eighty feet from

256
00:15:00,720 --> 00:15:03,920
Speaker 5: where they were staying. Throughout the night, the parents went

257
00:15:04,040 --> 00:15:07,720
Speaker 5: back checked on the children, and at ten PM, Kate

258
00:15:07,880 --> 00:15:11,600
Speaker 5: went back Maddie's mum to find that Maddie had disappeared

259
00:15:11,640 --> 00:15:15,560
Speaker 5: from her bed. Obviously, as any mother would, she flew

260
00:15:15,640 --> 00:15:19,480
Speaker 5: into a blind panic, alerted as many people as she

261
00:15:19,560 --> 00:15:24,160
Speaker 5: possibly could. They then spent the entire night hunting for Maddie,

262
00:15:24,680 --> 00:15:29,080
Speaker 5: but couldn't find her anywhere. Now, Portuguese authorities did not

263
00:15:29,240 --> 00:15:32,400
Speaker 5: issue They didn't even issue a description of Maddie until

264
00:15:32,520 --> 00:15:36,080
Speaker 5: around twenty four hours after she had disappeared. They didn't

265
00:15:36,160 --> 00:15:39,320
Speaker 5: lock down any kind of entrance or exit from the

266
00:15:39,440 --> 00:15:42,200
Speaker 5: town where the family was staying, And it really was

267
00:15:42,400 --> 00:15:47,480
Speaker 5: just a horrific comedy of errors that continued right up

268
00:15:47,600 --> 00:15:51,240
Speaker 5: until the point when Maddie's parents, Kate and Jerry, were

269
00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:56,360
Speaker 5: named as official suspects. Because Portuguese police accused them of

270
00:15:57,000 --> 00:16:00,480
Speaker 5: killing their daughter in some tragic accident in the and

271
00:16:00,600 --> 00:16:04,400
Speaker 5: then trying to cover it up. So years later we

272
00:16:04,560 --> 00:16:07,520
Speaker 5: have a man being named as an official suspect for

273
00:16:07,600 --> 00:16:11,640
Speaker 5: the very first time since Mattie's own parents were accused

274
00:16:11,720 --> 00:16:12,840
Speaker 5: of killing that child.

275
00:16:13,600 --> 00:16:16,200
Speaker 3: I think that there was a lot of public outrage

276
00:16:16,760 --> 00:16:21,200
Speaker 3: that the parents left her and her siblings in the

277
00:16:21,400 --> 00:16:23,800
Speaker 3: hotel room while they went to have dinner.

278
00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:26,520
Speaker 1: True it was only one hundred feet away.

279
00:16:27,080 --> 00:16:30,880
Speaker 3: True they had nothing to do with her disappearance, but

280
00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:33,840
Speaker 3: still it was a real witch burning.

281
00:16:33,960 --> 00:16:38,080
Speaker 4: Daryl Cohen, go after the people who were closest to

282
00:16:38,600 --> 00:16:43,080
Speaker 4: what appears to be a victim, easier than going after

283
00:16:43,640 --> 00:16:48,760
Speaker 4: the real investigation, Easier than saying, don't have a suspect.

284
00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:55,640
Speaker 4: Suspects yet, we're looking carefully, Easier than looking at trouging

285
00:16:55,800 --> 00:17:00,680
Speaker 4: this net and finding this guy who was a convicted

286
00:17:00,840 --> 00:17:04,560
Speaker 4: child molester. Who finding this guy who went after a

287
00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:08,280
Speaker 4: girl that looked like that. I mean, this is outrageous.

288
00:17:08,520 --> 00:17:11,399
Speaker 3: You know another thing about it? To you, Greg Smith,

289
00:17:11,680 --> 00:17:15,720
Speaker 3: I agree with Daryl Cohen. The fact that they focused

290
00:17:15,880 --> 00:17:19,119
Speaker 3: so much on the parents at the get go really

291
00:17:19,520 --> 00:17:23,320
Speaker 3: delayed the search for Maddie's abductor.

292
00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:27,920
Speaker 1: And another thing, Greg Smith. Greg, the very first thing

293
00:17:28,680 --> 00:17:29,800
Speaker 1: when a woman or.

294
00:17:29,800 --> 00:17:34,639
Speaker 3: A child goes missing, you look for sex predators in

295
00:17:34,840 --> 00:17:41,000
Speaker 3: the area and who is in the area unmonitored Christian Bruckner,

296
00:17:41,400 --> 00:17:42,200
Speaker 3: they did nothing.

297
00:17:42,920 --> 00:17:47,439
Speaker 9: Yeah, that's standard procedure, Nancy, you immediately checked. I mean,

298
00:17:47,520 --> 00:17:50,280
Speaker 9: here in Kansas we have the sex svender registry, so

299
00:17:51,520 --> 00:17:53,520
Speaker 9: that was done. In Kelsey's case, that was one of

300
00:17:53,560 --> 00:17:55,520
Speaker 9: the first things that was done. We'll see who's in

301
00:17:55,640 --> 00:17:59,440
Speaker 9: the area, who could have been in the area, interview them,

302
00:17:59,520 --> 00:18:04,000
Speaker 9: talk to them. And while in a lot of these

303
00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:08,280
Speaker 9: cases it turns out that there's a family member involved there,

304
00:18:08,600 --> 00:18:12,119
Speaker 9: and there's a tendency for police to focus on that.

305
00:18:12,320 --> 00:18:14,480
Speaker 9: You've got to be aware of the big picture and

306
00:18:14,920 --> 00:18:18,159
Speaker 9: be open minded and figure out that you know, they

307
00:18:18,240 --> 00:18:20,560
Speaker 9: may not be the suspect, and you can't just hone

308
00:18:20,600 --> 00:18:24,760
Speaker 9: in with a preconceived notion that this is what you've got. So, yeah,

309
00:18:24,840 --> 00:18:25,879
Speaker 9: that's that's problematic.

310
00:18:26,160 --> 00:18:28,360
Speaker 1: And not only that, do you Trollie Langston.

311
00:18:28,840 --> 00:18:33,640
Speaker 3: It's my understanding that this announcement comes nearly fifteen years

312
00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:37,960
Speaker 3: to the day that Maddie goes missing.

313
00:18:38,400 --> 00:18:41,720
Speaker 1: Do you find that odd at all? Fifteen years to

314
00:18:41,920 --> 00:18:42,360
Speaker 1: the day.

315
00:18:42,680 --> 00:18:47,560
Speaker 5: It's actually not odd because Portugal has a fifteen year

316
00:18:47,920 --> 00:18:52,960
Speaker 5: statute of limitation on crimes that would call for a

317
00:18:53,160 --> 00:18:56,720
Speaker 5: ten plus year sentence. So I think the timing is

318
00:18:56,800 --> 00:18:59,760
Speaker 5: actually in no way coincidental or strange. I think the

319
00:19:00,000 --> 00:19:04,600
Speaker 5: timing is very, very purposeful because Portuguese authorities know that

320
00:19:04,880 --> 00:19:08,879
Speaker 5: if they don't do something right here, right now, then

321
00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:12,760
Speaker 5: it may well be too late to ever punish whoever

322
00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:17,200
Speaker 5: perpetrated this horrific crime and to ever find any kind

323
00:19:17,240 --> 00:19:21,200
Speaker 5: of justice or at least answers for Kate and Jerry McCann.

324
00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:25,720
Speaker 1: Well, you're right. What Charlie Langston is telling you is

325
00:19:25,840 --> 00:19:27,040
Speaker 1: absolutely correct.

326
00:19:27,560 --> 00:19:30,240
Speaker 3: I think that this is just the authorities trying to

327
00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:33,120
Speaker 3: save their own skin in this case.

328
00:19:33,160 --> 00:19:36,680
Speaker 1: Take a listen to Araka twenty seven. Our friend Simon.

329
00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:39,440
Speaker 14: Jens Madeline went missing from a holiday apartment on the

330
00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:42,359
Speaker 14: third of May two thousand and seven while her parents

331
00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:45,880
Speaker 14: were having dinner at a nearby restaurant. In July twenty thirteen,

332
00:19:46,200 --> 00:19:49,120
Speaker 14: the met Police opened its own investigation, saying it had

333
00:19:49,240 --> 00:19:52,040
Speaker 14: new evidence and new witnesses, and it was in June

334
00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:55,520
Speaker 14: twenty twenty that German police first revealed they had a suspect.

335
00:19:55,920 --> 00:20:01,240
Speaker 14: There have been searches in Portugal, but no breakthrough. In

336
00:20:01,359 --> 00:20:04,480
Speaker 14: less than two weeks, a statute of limitations would take effect,

337
00:20:04,800 --> 00:20:07,680
Speaker 14: meaning under Portuguese law it would no longer be possible

338
00:20:07,800 --> 00:20:11,240
Speaker 14: to make someone a person of interest. But it's understood

339
00:20:11,280 --> 00:20:14,239
Speaker 14: this latest development is driven not by timing, but by

340
00:20:14,320 --> 00:20:18,359
Speaker 14: strong indications that a crime has taken place. There have

341
00:20:18,480 --> 00:20:21,479
Speaker 14: been many false dawns in the investigations into what happened.

342
00:20:21,760 --> 00:20:25,080
Speaker 14: The police in Germany had previously worn their inquiry, like

343
00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:30,000
Speaker 14: the others, could end without a charge, but Madeline's parents

344
00:20:30,040 --> 00:20:32,520
Speaker 14: have always said they need to know what happened so

345
00:20:32,640 --> 00:20:33,639
Speaker 14: they can find peace.

346
00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:39,560
Speaker 3: So bottom line is now or never, and the Portuguese

347
00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:43,800
Speaker 3: authorities are still, in my opinion, sitting on their thumb.

348
00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:46,920
Speaker 3: They botched the case at the get go, and now

349
00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:50,760
Speaker 3: the only way they may be able to prosecute this

350
00:20:50,920 --> 00:20:54,160
Speaker 3: three year old little girl's killer is if they somehow

351
00:20:54,680 --> 00:20:56,240
Speaker 3: produce a witness.

352
00:20:56,880 --> 00:21:00,400
Speaker 1: They've blurted out publicly that they don't have any forensic

353
00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:03,480
Speaker 1: evidence that hurt the case. But now I'm.

354
00:21:03,440 --> 00:21:06,320
Speaker 3: Understanding Charlie Langston is joining us from dallymail dot com

355
00:21:06,680 --> 00:21:08,359
Speaker 3: that they are claiming.

356
00:21:08,440 --> 00:21:09,400
Speaker 1: They've got a witness.

357
00:21:09,720 --> 00:21:13,440
Speaker 5: Now supposedly, yes, they are saying that they have a

358
00:21:13,560 --> 00:21:17,320
Speaker 5: witness who may be able to come forward and link

359
00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:21,080
Speaker 5: Christian B. Christian Bruckner to the crime. But I should

360
00:21:21,160 --> 00:21:24,399
Speaker 5: also point out that a TV special is due to

361
00:21:24,480 --> 00:21:28,280
Speaker 5: air in which four witnesses are understood to be coming

362
00:21:28,400 --> 00:21:33,040
Speaker 5: forward to corroborate an alibi for Christian B, which would

363
00:21:33,400 --> 00:21:38,960
Speaker 5: once again, potentially, you know, completely ruin this whole case

364
00:21:39,280 --> 00:21:42,639
Speaker 5: before it's even really got off the ground. So it

365
00:21:42,680 --> 00:21:45,840
Speaker 5: will be interesting to see what happens tomorrow when these

366
00:21:45,960 --> 00:21:49,520
Speaker 5: four people who are named, who supposedly have no connection

367
00:21:49,640 --> 00:21:53,480
Speaker 5: to Christian B whatsoever, no reason to defend him, come

368
00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:57,280
Speaker 5: forward and corroborate whatever alibi it is that he plans

369
00:21:57,359 --> 00:21:57,680
Speaker 5: to offer.

370
00:21:57,920 --> 00:22:00,880
Speaker 3: Well, you know what, Charlie Langston, just burn that bridge

371
00:22:00,920 --> 00:22:03,840
Speaker 3: when I get there. Because I've had a lot of

372
00:22:03,960 --> 00:22:06,200
Speaker 3: cases where the defense claims.

373
00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:08,760
Speaker 1: I've got an eyewitness to say fill.

374
00:22:08,640 --> 00:22:10,960
Speaker 3: In the blank, and you know what I say to

375
00:22:11,040 --> 00:22:16,360
Speaker 3: that b s, I'll stand on my own witnesses, because

376
00:22:17,480 --> 00:22:20,720
Speaker 3: very often I've had witnesses come on for the defense.

377
00:22:21,600 --> 00:22:25,600
Speaker 3: I remember one, very notably Darryl Cohen, that came on

378
00:22:26,160 --> 00:22:28,680
Speaker 3: trying to tell me he saw what he saw the

379
00:22:28,800 --> 00:22:31,240
Speaker 3: night of a murderer. I guess the defense did not

380
00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:35,280
Speaker 3: count on me going to the scene and pointing out

381
00:22:35,720 --> 00:22:39,880
Speaker 3: that that point of view was absolutely impossible because there's

382
00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:44,080
Speaker 3: a thick hedge of bushes about six feet tall between

383
00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:50,120
Speaker 3: the eyewitness and the murder. Impossible unless he flew over

384
00:22:50,200 --> 00:22:51,960
Speaker 3: the hedge and looked down.

385
00:22:52,040 --> 00:22:52,920
Speaker 1: To see the murder.

386
00:22:53,240 --> 00:22:57,000
Speaker 3: So I don't believe any eyewitness until they're tested by

387
00:22:57,080 --> 00:22:58,040
Speaker 3: cross examination.

388
00:22:58,119 --> 00:23:00,080
Speaker 1: And as a matter of fact, Darryl.

389
00:23:00,640 --> 00:23:04,520
Speaker 3: And the black and white letter of the law, eyewitnesses

390
00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:08,440
Speaker 3: can be tested as to their vision, the lighting, the

391
00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:11,520
Speaker 3: distance at which they saw what they claimed to have seen.

392
00:23:11,720 --> 00:23:15,200
Speaker 3: I mean, it's laid out in black and white how

393
00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:18,840
Speaker 3: a so called eyewitness can be cross examined.

394
00:23:19,200 --> 00:23:20,280
Speaker 1: So I'd like to get a.

395
00:23:20,280 --> 00:23:23,359
Speaker 3: Hold of those eyewitnesses myself and see what's left of

396
00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:24,560
Speaker 3: them after I finish.

397
00:23:24,800 --> 00:23:28,600
Speaker 4: I'd like to know what these eyewitnesses have to say.

398
00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:31,280
Speaker 4: I would like to be able to cross examine them.

399
00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:34,919
Speaker 4: I'm with you, but let's assume their testimony is impeccable.

400
00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:39,040
Speaker 4: It doesn't stop the police, it doesn't stop the prosecutor

401
00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:42,760
Speaker 4: the courts from trying this guy. And if the statue

402
00:23:42,760 --> 00:23:46,159
Speaker 4: of limitations is running out. I would rather have some

403
00:23:46,520 --> 00:23:52,400
Speaker 4: prosecutoral time incarceration than nothing at all. And if somehow

404
00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:54,119
Speaker 4: he does this again, we'll get him.

405
00:23:54,280 --> 00:23:55,440
Speaker 1: Explain what you're talking about.

406
00:23:55,560 --> 00:23:57,520
Speaker 4: Him and I both know. There are times we know

407
00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:00,480
Speaker 4: a person is guilty as a prosecutor, we don't have

408
00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:04,440
Speaker 4: enough evidence, and the statute of limitations is running And

409
00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:06,760
Speaker 4: in our country we wouldn't have to worry about a

410
00:24:06,840 --> 00:24:11,520
Speaker 4: murder statue limitations. It doesn't exist, but there in Portugal

411
00:24:11,680 --> 00:24:15,760
Speaker 4: it apparently does. So they can arrest him, they can

412
00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:19,240
Speaker 4: try him and keep him incarcerated and keep the case

413
00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:22,560
Speaker 4: running as long as possible, and if he is acquitted,

414
00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:28,320
Speaker 4: so be it. But he's spent time in jail, in prison,

415
00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:33,360
Speaker 4: and also his name, his likeness, his face is all

416
00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:36,240
Speaker 4: over the media, all over the press, and that's all

417
00:24:36,320 --> 00:24:38,800
Speaker 4: he has to do is breathe again, and they've got

418
00:24:38,880 --> 00:24:41,720
Speaker 4: him for something else. Sometimes you have to get even

419
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:45,200
Speaker 4: more than getting him the way you really want to.

420
00:24:45,600 --> 00:24:48,520
Speaker 3: Let me just say, officially, I don't know what you're

421
00:24:48,520 --> 00:24:51,960
Speaker 3: talking about. Charlie Langston joining us from dailymail dot com.

422
00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:58,399
Speaker 3: This guy is a child sex predator? What is his record?

423
00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:01,760
Speaker 1: Why has he been labeled already a child.

424
00:25:01,640 --> 00:25:05,440
Speaker 3: Six predator at the time he was skulking around Maddy

425
00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:06,720
Speaker 3: McCann's airbnb.

426
00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:09,800
Speaker 5: I mean this man is not just a child sex predator.

427
00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:12,520
Speaker 5: He I mean he was described by a woman he

428
00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:15,600
Speaker 5: used to be in a relationship with as a human pig.

429
00:25:16,280 --> 00:25:21,679
Speaker 5: He has perpetrated so many sex crimes against children, against

430
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:24,920
Speaker 5: women ranging in ages from as you said, a seventy

431
00:25:25,040 --> 00:25:28,840
Speaker 5: two year old American citizen who he has understood to

432
00:25:28,960 --> 00:25:32,840
Speaker 5: have raped in Portugal in two thousand and five. Now,

433
00:25:32,920 --> 00:25:36,680
Speaker 5: he was not convicted of that crime until twenty nineteen.

434
00:25:36,840 --> 00:25:38,080
Speaker 1: Seven year jailsen.

435
00:25:38,359 --> 00:25:40,800
Speaker 3: Hold On, hold on, you know what, Charlie, you know

436
00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:42,960
Speaker 3: the fact so well listening to us like drinking from

437
00:25:42,960 --> 00:25:44,720
Speaker 3: the fire, hydshant is too much too fast.

438
00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:47,480
Speaker 1: Lets did you hear what Charlie likeson just said.

439
00:25:47,880 --> 00:25:51,480
Speaker 3: This guy, Christian Brickner serving a seven year sentence on

440
00:25:51,560 --> 00:25:56,119
Speaker 3: a two thousand and five rate of an elderly woman

441
00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:02,000
Speaker 3: in Portugal, same place is where Maddie was stolen. That's

442
00:26:02,119 --> 00:26:06,600
Speaker 3: a seven year sentence and it started the event happened

443
00:26:06,680 --> 00:26:10,800
Speaker 3: in two thousand and five. So you've got that, then

444
00:26:10,880 --> 00:26:13,680
Speaker 3: you've got him being connected to the rape of an

445
00:26:13,800 --> 00:26:19,399
Speaker 3: Irish tour represented in two thousand and four, exposing himself

446
00:26:19,480 --> 00:26:21,400
Speaker 3: to children on a playground.

447
00:26:21,720 --> 00:26:23,240
Speaker 1: But there's another little.

448
00:26:23,200 --> 00:26:26,280
Speaker 3: Girl where he was near her at the time she

449
00:26:26,480 --> 00:26:29,280
Speaker 3: goes missing, and she looks so much like Maddie what

450
00:26:29,440 --> 00:26:30,320
Speaker 3: about that case?

451
00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:34,199
Speaker 5: So much so that she was actually nicknamed German Maddie

452
00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:37,359
Speaker 5: in the media. This was in twenty sixteen, and this

453
00:26:37,600 --> 00:26:42,960
Speaker 5: is actually the first case that made people connect Christian

454
00:26:43,000 --> 00:26:46,520
Speaker 5: Bruckner to the Maddie McCann case, because the similarities between

455
00:26:46,560 --> 00:26:50,639
Speaker 5: the two were so astounding that it didn't seem plausible

456
00:26:50,760 --> 00:26:54,080
Speaker 5: that he couldn't have been connected to the Madeline McCann case.

457
00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:58,480
Speaker 5: But it's not until six years later that we're actually

458
00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:00,880
Speaker 5: hearing for the very first time that he's been named

459
00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:01,440
Speaker 5: a suspect.

460
00:27:01,600 --> 00:27:03,600
Speaker 1: Doctor Angie, Hold the thought.

461
00:27:03,720 --> 00:27:05,760
Speaker 3: Hold the thought, because I want to hear it, but

462
00:27:05,880 --> 00:27:08,360
Speaker 3: I want to analyze what you just said, Doctor Angie.

463
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:13,760
Speaker 3: With me is renowned psychiatrist, doctor Angela Arnold. Doctor Angie,

464
00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:16,600
Speaker 3: I remember a case. You might remember it too, Darryl Cohen.

465
00:27:18,200 --> 00:27:21,200
Speaker 3: It's the case I tried this guy's serial killer. I

466
00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:26,760
Speaker 3: got him on one and his victim will forever be

467
00:27:27,359 --> 00:27:28,160
Speaker 3: a Jane Doe.

468
00:27:28,720 --> 00:27:31,200
Speaker 1: She has never been identified. That's really hard to prove

469
00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:33,480
Speaker 1: that kind of case because you can't if you don't

470
00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:35,560
Speaker 1: know the victim. You don't know who they hung out with,

471
00:27:35,680 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 1: where they're from, who was their last boyfriend.

472
00:27:38,600 --> 00:27:44,160
Speaker 3: Anyway, she's found strangled, rape out in a field. Long

473
00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:48,840
Speaker 3: story short. I got a bead on the purp, so

474
00:27:48,920 --> 00:27:52,320
Speaker 3: I started looking for people that knew the perp. I

475
00:27:52,480 --> 00:27:56,119
Speaker 3: found his girlfriend, the mother of his child, who had

476
00:27:56,200 --> 00:28:01,439
Speaker 3: kicked him out for trying to strangle her. Found another

477
00:28:01,560 --> 00:28:03,800
Speaker 3: woman he tried to strangle in the Fulton No, she

478
00:28:03,880 --> 00:28:05,240
Speaker 3: was in the Gwnett County jail.

479
00:28:05,560 --> 00:28:05,879
Speaker 4: Darryl.

480
00:28:07,520 --> 00:28:11,040
Speaker 3: I had a reconstructionist draw the picture of what the

481
00:28:11,119 --> 00:28:13,399
Speaker 3: dead victim would have looked like in life.

482
00:28:14,480 --> 00:28:16,080
Speaker 1: Guess who she looked like?

483
00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:21,520
Speaker 3: Almost identically, they looked like twins his girlfriend that had

484
00:28:21,640 --> 00:28:25,399
Speaker 3: rejected him and thrown him out of the house. And

485
00:28:25,520 --> 00:28:28,600
Speaker 3: I put those two pictures, those two sketches, up in

486
00:28:28,720 --> 00:28:33,080
Speaker 3: front of the jury and argued, who would have killed

487
00:28:33,440 --> 00:28:37,800
Speaker 3: this woman other than the man who was rejected by

488
00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:38,560
Speaker 3: this woman?

489
00:28:39,560 --> 00:28:41,000
Speaker 1: Did you hear what.

490
00:28:41,200 --> 00:28:46,200
Speaker 3: Charlie Langston just said that German Mattie looks just like

491
00:28:46,760 --> 00:28:49,640
Speaker 3: Mattie McCann dictor Angie, what.

492
00:28:49,800 --> 00:28:53,120
Speaker 11: About it, Dancy. The fact of the matter is, I

493
00:28:53,240 --> 00:28:56,440
Speaker 11: don't understand why all of this information is being ignored

494
00:28:57,040 --> 00:29:01,560
Speaker 11: because we have known for a very long time that, unfortunately,

495
00:29:02,080 --> 00:29:06,880
Speaker 11: sexual predators do not change their stripes, and they will

496
00:29:07,000 --> 00:29:11,240
Speaker 11: continue and continue their behavior until they are stopped, which

497
00:29:11,320 --> 00:29:13,840
Speaker 11: is why in the United States we have sexual predator

498
00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:17,560
Speaker 11: list that we put them on. Nancy. They are they

499
00:29:17,600 --> 00:29:20,000
Speaker 11: are incapable of being rehabilitated.

500
00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:20,920
Speaker 1: Doctor Angie.

501
00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:24,400
Speaker 3: Everything you just said is correct, but that is not

502
00:29:24,760 --> 00:29:29,000
Speaker 3: responsive to the question I asked. I asked you about

503
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:31,600
Speaker 3: the physical similarities in victims.

504
00:29:32,080 --> 00:29:33,800
Speaker 1: Why the perpetrators do.

505
00:29:33,960 --> 00:29:38,880
Speaker 11: That, because they're playing out their fantasy, whatever it is,

506
00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:41,680
Speaker 11: they're playing it out through another person that looks just

507
00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:45,560
Speaker 11: like that person's It's right out there, Nancy.

508
00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:46,720
Speaker 12: It's it's simple.

509
00:29:47,280 --> 00:29:50,000
Speaker 11: We're not looking for a zebra. They are acting it

510
00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:52,880
Speaker 11: out on someone who looks just like the other person.

511
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:56,360
Speaker 11: They're acting out that that violent fantasy that they.

512
00:29:56,400 --> 00:30:10,040
Speaker 1: Have crime stories with. Nancy Grace, I'm in shock. I

513
00:30:10,160 --> 00:30:10,880
Speaker 1: am in shock.

514
00:30:12,000 --> 00:30:19,000
Speaker 2: The Mattie McCann chief suspect Christian Bruckner celebrates his release

515
00:30:19,080 --> 00:30:24,960
Speaker 2: from prison with a burger and a cigarette. It's not

516
00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:29,320
Speaker 2: known where he was headed after he went to McDonald's,

517
00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:34,880
Speaker 2: but I would hide my children under the bed if

518
00:30:34,960 --> 00:30:40,400
Speaker 2: I lived in that jurisdiction. Yes, Bruckner celebrated with a

519
00:30:40,520 --> 00:30:46,480
Speaker 2: fast food breakfast of chicken nuggets and a McDonald's burger

520
00:30:46,960 --> 00:30:50,960
Speaker 2: after being smuggled out of jail near Hanover. Hidden in

521
00:30:51,000 --> 00:30:54,320
Speaker 2: the back of his lawyer's car. He somehow managed me

522
00:30:54,600 --> 00:30:59,520
Speaker 2: to avoid being filmed or even photographed by the paparazzi

523
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:02,400
Speaker 2: who had been waiting for several days. But a footog

524
00:31:03,040 --> 00:31:06,720
Speaker 2: did catch him as he went into a McDonald's.

525
00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:08,560
Speaker 1: Now catch this.

526
00:31:09,760 --> 00:31:12,760
Speaker 2: Many of the outlets are calling him Christian b b

527
00:31:13,160 --> 00:31:17,000
Speaker 2: as in brother as in Bruckner. There he cannot be

528
00:31:17,080 --> 00:31:23,840
Speaker 2: fully identified under German privacy laws. Really, Maddie got no privacy.

529
00:31:24,080 --> 00:31:28,480
Speaker 2: Mattie's dead. He stood outside of McDonald's, smoked cigarette before

530
00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:34,880
Speaker 2: eating his food, and dressed sportingly in a lilac shirt,

531
00:31:35,200 --> 00:31:39,760
Speaker 2: beige pants, and tennis shoes. He didn't seem to have

532
00:31:40,120 --> 00:31:43,560
Speaker 2: a care in the world. He left the restaurant and

533
00:31:43,680 --> 00:31:48,120
Speaker 2: police blocked the street for him to allow him to

534
00:31:48,360 --> 00:31:52,640
Speaker 2: leave without interference. He was driven off in a black

535
00:31:52,720 --> 00:32:00,800
Speaker 2: OUTI wow according to prosecutors, they claimed to have quote

536
00:32:00,920 --> 00:32:04,160
Speaker 2: almost enough evidence to charge him in Maddie's disappearance, but

537
00:32:04,280 --> 00:32:13,000
Speaker 2: not quite enough really, after all this time, according to

538
00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:17,720
Speaker 2: the prosecutor, evidence against Brookner in the case is circumstantial.

539
00:32:18,200 --> 00:32:21,800
Speaker 2: His cell phone nearby her apartment at the time she vanished.

540
00:32:22,040 --> 00:32:25,520
Speaker 2: He's a convicted child six abuser. He allegedly confessed to

541
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:31,440
Speaker 2: a friend and had re registered his car the day after. Hmmm,

542
00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:33,560
Speaker 2: that sounds pretty good to me.

543
00:32:33,920 --> 00:32:37,960
Speaker 3: The fingerprint crime like another little girl the same age,

544
00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:43,160
Speaker 3: with strikingly similar physical attributes, stolen in the same way,

545
00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:47,840
Speaker 3: raped and murdered that way. At least in this country,

546
00:32:48,200 --> 00:32:51,400
Speaker 3: that evidence can come in. Normally, under the constitution, a

547
00:32:51,480 --> 00:32:54,760
Speaker 3: defendant cannot have past crimes or bad acts come before

548
00:32:54,760 --> 00:32:56,600
Speaker 3: a jury because they are to be judged on on

549
00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:59,480
Speaker 3: their reputation or they're pastor on that particular case.

550
00:33:00,040 --> 00:33:03,720
Speaker 1: But when the cases are so similar, they are allowed explain.

551
00:33:04,240 --> 00:33:07,640
Speaker 4: When they are similar transactions, the girls look alike, the

552
00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:11,240
Speaker 4: crime is probably similar, if not the same, then you

553
00:33:11,360 --> 00:33:14,360
Speaker 4: can in this country, at least you can enter that

554
00:33:14,600 --> 00:33:18,400
Speaker 4: into evidence and have the triers of fact, the judge,

555
00:33:18,480 --> 00:33:22,240
Speaker 4: the jury listen to it, and pay attention to it

556
00:33:22,680 --> 00:33:27,640
Speaker 4: because it is exactly the same. You just transpose one

557
00:33:28,040 --> 00:33:31,840
Speaker 4: person for another, but the circumstances are the same, so

558
00:33:31,960 --> 00:33:36,040
Speaker 4: that is absolutely admissible here. I cannot speak for Portugal.

559
00:33:36,160 --> 00:33:38,000
Speaker 1: I am sorry, Charlie Langston.

560
00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:42,920
Speaker 3: It has been reported that prosecutors are quote one hundred

561
00:33:43,000 --> 00:33:48,200
Speaker 3: percent sure that Christian Bruckner is the part that took Maddie.

562
00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:51,880
Speaker 1: Why now, and what do you think the evidence is?

563
00:33:52,680 --> 00:33:57,920
Speaker 5: I mean, I think the evidence is all constantial in

564
00:33:58,040 --> 00:34:03,280
Speaker 5: times of he is just a truly horrendous man who

565
00:34:03,360 --> 00:34:07,640
Speaker 5: has perpetrated crime after crime after crime against women and children.

566
00:34:08,160 --> 00:34:13,480
Speaker 5: He has a history of perpetrating crimes exactly like that

567
00:34:13,600 --> 00:34:16,320
Speaker 5: one in the Maddie McCann case. Now, we said earlier

568
00:34:16,760 --> 00:34:21,400
Speaker 5: it wasn't his mo typically to you know, murder one

569
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:24,680
Speaker 5: of his victims. However, I think it's important to remember

570
00:34:25,160 --> 00:34:30,400
Speaker 5: the media fraw around this case was so extraordinary that

571
00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:34,600
Speaker 5: there would have been no way for someone to perpetrate

572
00:34:34,719 --> 00:34:39,680
Speaker 5: this crime and not be charged with it. Had she

573
00:34:39,880 --> 00:34:43,000
Speaker 5: returned to her parents, had she been found, had the

574
00:34:43,040 --> 00:34:45,640
Speaker 5: police managed to you know, track her down in one

575
00:34:45,719 --> 00:34:48,879
Speaker 5: way or another. There's no way that the person who

576
00:34:48,960 --> 00:34:53,799
Speaker 5: committed this crime wouldn't have been found. So I think tragically.

577
00:34:54,440 --> 00:34:57,840
Speaker 5: While I understand how important it was to her parents

578
00:34:57,920 --> 00:35:02,000
Speaker 5: to call attention to this case, I think the enormous

579
00:35:02,040 --> 00:35:07,359
Speaker 5: public interest in it may well have sealed Maddie's death.

580
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:10,160
Speaker 5: And that, to me is the most horrendous thing about this.

581
00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:14,600
Speaker 5: It took the police so long to begin properly investigating

582
00:35:14,680 --> 00:35:19,240
Speaker 5: this case that Maddy could have survived had they actually

583
00:35:19,480 --> 00:35:21,680
Speaker 5: pulled their thoughts up and gotten on with things in

584
00:35:21,800 --> 00:35:22,800
Speaker 5: the you know, from the get go.

585
00:35:23,000 --> 00:35:25,680
Speaker 3: I understand what you're saying if she has still been alive,

586
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:29,520
Speaker 3: but Greg Smith joining us a special Deputy sheriff, the

587
00:35:29,640 --> 00:35:34,080
Speaker 3: reality is when children are taken at this age, typically

588
00:35:34,239 --> 00:35:37,080
Speaker 3: they are killed within the first seventy six hours.

589
00:35:37,160 --> 00:35:40,680
Speaker 9: Yeah, absolutely, Nancy, that's uh. I mean, that's the modus

590
00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:45,439
Speaker 9: operandi for young children, you know. And and I don't

591
00:35:45,480 --> 00:35:49,279
Speaker 9: know that media attention is a bad thing. Maybe maybe

592
00:35:50,640 --> 00:35:54,040
Speaker 9: a double edged sword, but Kelsea's case had a heck

593
00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:56,359
Speaker 9: of a lot of media attention. We were on every

594
00:35:56,440 --> 00:35:59,879
Speaker 9: news outlet in the United States and even international. Uh.

595
00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:02,759
Speaker 9: And while Kelsey didn't come home alive, she came home.

596
00:36:02,880 --> 00:36:03,440
Speaker 9: We found her.

597
00:36:03,960 --> 00:36:06,279
Speaker 1: Take a listen to our cut twenty eight, our friend

598
00:36:06,440 --> 00:36:07,360
Speaker 1: Alison Roberts.

599
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:13,399
Speaker 15: Yesterday they issued a statement saying that on Wednesday an

600
00:36:13,440 --> 00:36:16,920
Speaker 15: individual had been named as an official suspect. That was

601
00:36:17,239 --> 00:36:21,520
Speaker 15: an international request from Portugal to the German authorities to

602
00:36:21,680 --> 00:36:23,640
Speaker 15: inform that person of interest that.

603
00:36:23,640 --> 00:36:25,320
Speaker 1: They had been made an official suspect.

604
00:36:25,719 --> 00:36:29,080
Speaker 15: As your previous interviewees said, this is always a significant

605
00:36:29,120 --> 00:36:31,920
Speaker 15: step because it means effectively that someone is being or

606
00:36:31,960 --> 00:36:35,160
Speaker 15: will soon be questioned under caution. That's the same questions

607
00:36:35,200 --> 00:36:38,120
Speaker 15: maybe that could incriminate them, which gives them the right

608
00:36:38,440 --> 00:36:41,360
Speaker 15: not to answer, of course, So it's actually a status

609
00:36:41,480 --> 00:36:44,560
Speaker 15: to protect that individual. But it is always significant as

610
00:36:44,600 --> 00:36:47,600
Speaker 15: it's a necessary prelude to charges at some point, although

611
00:36:47,640 --> 00:36:51,280
Speaker 15: there is no sign of that just yet, no sign.

612
00:36:51,080 --> 00:36:54,440
Speaker 3: Of official charges after he has been named a suspect.

613
00:36:54,719 --> 00:36:56,040
Speaker 1: What does that mean, Charlie.

614
00:36:56,080 --> 00:36:58,520
Speaker 3: He has been named an official suspect, so why won't

615
00:36:58,640 --> 00:37:00,400
Speaker 3: charges naturally follow?

616
00:37:00,800 --> 00:37:04,399
Speaker 5: Well, what I think is the next most obvious step

617
00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:08,280
Speaker 5: is that he will be extradited from Germany to Portugal,

618
00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:11,879
Speaker 5: and that is when charges may well be brought against him.

619
00:37:12,280 --> 00:37:15,160
Speaker 5: But right now I think what is going on behind

620
00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:18,920
Speaker 5: the scenes is that Portuguese authorities in conjunction with German

621
00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:23,200
Speaker 5: authorities are scrambling to try and get as much evidence

622
00:37:23,280 --> 00:37:27,600
Speaker 5: as humanly possible, to try and get some witnesses who

623
00:37:27,640 --> 00:37:30,680
Speaker 5: will come forward and at least say I saw him

624
00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:33,200
Speaker 5: at this place, I saw him here. I know that

625
00:37:33,320 --> 00:37:37,480
Speaker 5: he is a sex offender, whatever it may be. And

626
00:37:37,680 --> 00:37:40,320
Speaker 5: right now I think the most important thing is that

627
00:37:41,040 --> 00:37:44,200
Speaker 5: he has been named as a suspect again, the first

628
00:37:44,280 --> 00:37:49,000
Speaker 5: official suspect in fifteen years, which marks at least a

629
00:37:49,200 --> 00:37:52,080
Speaker 5: step forward in a case that has been dragging on

630
00:37:52,840 --> 00:37:54,000
Speaker 5: for more than a decade.

631
00:37:54,040 --> 00:37:58,560
Speaker 3: Now, Charlie, were Maddy's parents ever named official suspects.

632
00:37:58,719 --> 00:38:02,560
Speaker 5: Yes, they were named as official persons of interest way

633
00:38:02,680 --> 00:38:07,440
Speaker 5: back in two thousand and seven, and interestingly, at the

634
00:38:07,560 --> 00:38:11,240
Speaker 5: time they had a huge amount of public criticism aimed

635
00:38:11,280 --> 00:38:15,239
Speaker 5: at them. They were accused of neglect. Portuguese authorities suspected

636
00:38:15,360 --> 00:38:18,320
Speaker 5: that Madeleine had died in a tragic accident in the

637
00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:20,799
Speaker 5: apartment that her parents had then tried to cover up.

638
00:38:21,280 --> 00:38:25,719
Speaker 5: Now they stopped being official suspects in two thousand and eight,

639
00:38:26,239 --> 00:38:30,640
Speaker 5: when Portuguese authorities dropped the case completely because there was

640
00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:34,320
Speaker 5: a lack of evidence. Ever since then, not a single

641
00:38:34,440 --> 00:38:36,640
Speaker 5: official suspect has been named until now.

642
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:40,240
Speaker 1: Take a listen to Araka twenty nine our friend Martin Brandt.

643
00:38:40,640 --> 00:38:43,920
Speaker 6: It's hardly been a secret. The German drifter has been

644
00:38:43,960 --> 00:38:47,080
Speaker 6: the main suspect in the Madeline McCann case for three

645
00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:51,759
Speaker 6: years or more, but now it's official. Christian B is

646
00:38:51,800 --> 00:38:56,640
Speaker 6: suspected of abducting and killing Madeline. German prosecutors are leading

647
00:38:56,719 --> 00:39:00,959
Speaker 6: the investigation, but haven't charged him. Jish girl was three

648
00:39:01,200 --> 00:39:04,920
Speaker 6: when she vanished from the family's holiday apartment in Portugal

649
00:39:04,960 --> 00:39:08,959
Speaker 6: in two thousand and seven, fifteen years ago. This week,

650
00:39:09,120 --> 00:39:12,799
Speaker 6: the suspect had visitors to the German prison where he's

651
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:17,319
Speaker 6: serving a rape sentence. He was told that Portuguese prosecutors

652
00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:21,560
Speaker 6: had made him an arguido, a formal suspect. He was

653
00:39:21,680 --> 00:39:25,320
Speaker 6: questioned for the first time but refused to answer that it's.

654
00:39:25,200 --> 00:39:30,040
Speaker 3: Rlie Langston being named a formal suspect there in that jurisdiction.

655
00:39:31,200 --> 00:39:34,600
Speaker 1: That's the first time cops could question him.

656
00:39:34,719 --> 00:39:38,440
Speaker 5: Yes, the first time, and he remained entirely silent throughout.

657
00:39:38,960 --> 00:39:44,200
Speaker 5: He refused to answer a single question. But interestingly, a

658
00:39:44,320 --> 00:39:47,680
Speaker 5: woman that he was in a relationship with previously, she

659
00:39:47,920 --> 00:39:51,160
Speaker 5: came forward last week and she said that he told

660
00:39:51,280 --> 00:39:55,600
Speaker 5: her in twenty thirteen, I know what happened to little Maddie.

661
00:39:56,239 --> 00:39:59,000
Speaker 5: She also suggested that he may have been the abductor,

662
00:39:59,239 --> 00:40:02,239
Speaker 5: the abuser, and that he may have passed Maddie off

663
00:40:02,719 --> 00:40:07,200
Speaker 5: to someone else. So there are still an extraordinary number

664
00:40:07,239 --> 00:40:11,000
Speaker 5: of questions surrounding this case. However, the mere fact that

665
00:40:11,120 --> 00:40:14,040
Speaker 5: he's been named as an official suspect. I really can't

666
00:40:14,160 --> 00:40:19,200
Speaker 5: overstate what a key step forward that is in this case,

667
00:40:19,520 --> 00:40:23,000
Speaker 5: especially given that he's only the third person when you

668
00:40:23,080 --> 00:40:25,920
Speaker 5: look at Kate and Jerry McCann, only the third official

669
00:40:26,000 --> 00:40:29,160
Speaker 5: suspect to ever be named by Portuguese authorities.

670
00:40:29,680 --> 00:40:34,279
Speaker 2: Let me remind everyone that Bruckner has multiple convictions for

671
00:40:34,400 --> 00:40:38,520
Speaker 2: sex offenses, including against children, and a really long record

672
00:40:38,600 --> 00:40:43,760
Speaker 2: of petty crimes. He's just completed a seven year prison

673
00:40:43,880 --> 00:40:47,840
Speaker 2: sentence for raping a seventy two year old American woman

674
00:40:48,560 --> 00:40:52,640
Speaker 2: who was in Portugal. While prosecutors in the Maddie McCann

675
00:40:52,960 --> 00:40:59,600
Speaker 2: disappearance case claim they did not have quite enough evidence

676
00:41:00,280 --> 00:41:06,160
Speaker 2: to win at trial, many disagree this Taking the forefront.

677
00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:12,680
Speaker 2: As Christian Bruckner walks free, he could be gone out

678
00:41:12,719 --> 00:41:16,239
Speaker 2: of the jurisdiction living in hiding for the rest of

679
00:41:16,320 --> 00:41:21,000
Speaker 2: his life. In no time will there ever be a

680
00:41:21,080 --> 00:41:25,359
Speaker 2: prosecution in the kidnap and murder of three year old

681
00:41:25,520 --> 00:41:26,400
Speaker 2: Mattie McCann.

682
00:41:27,640 --> 00:41:29,799
Speaker 1: We wait as justice unfolds.

683
00:41:30,520 --> 00:41:33,279
Speaker 2: Nancy Grace signing off good night friend,