WEBVTT - The Science of Dune: Technology 0:00:03.120 --> 0:00:06.000 Welcome to Stuff to Blow Your Mind from how Stuff 0:00:06.000 --> 0:00:23.360 Works dot Com. Hello, this is Edric, your gul navigator speaking, 0:00:23.520 --> 0:00:26.520 just letting you know that we've begun our approach to 0:00:26.600 --> 0:00:30.280 our minimal safe departure for our one way jaunt to 0:00:30.400 --> 0:00:34.560 the planet Aracus. This is of course just a precaution, 0:00:34.640 --> 0:00:37.960 as the Spacing Guild currently holds an impeccable record of 0:00:38.320 --> 0:00:43.080 Holtzmann enabled space fabric distortion travel. And as always you 0:00:43.159 --> 0:00:46.239 can rest assured that no making machine has taken your 0:00:46.320 --> 0:00:51.120 life through its care, but rather the prescient Milange augmented 0:00:51.200 --> 0:00:54.959 powers of the human mind. So set back, enjoy our 0:00:55.040 --> 0:00:59.400 in flight presentation of mar deep conversations and our flight 0:00:59.440 --> 0:01:10.120 attendant toward check in. Hey, you welcome to Stuff to 0:01:10.120 --> 0:01:12.200 Blow Your Mind. My name is Robert Lamb and I'm 0:01:12.280 --> 0:01:15.000 Joe McCormick, and uh, I want to thank a musician 0:01:15.120 --> 0:01:17.680 or Raleigh Porter for that bit of music there. That's 0:01:17.720 --> 0:01:21.080 the lack xoo off his two thousand and eleven album Aftertime, 0:01:21.160 --> 0:01:24.960 released by Subtext Recording, and you'll find a link on 0:01:25.000 --> 0:01:27.360 the landing page for this episode to learn more about 0:01:27.400 --> 0:01:29.840 that work. But it's the title of this episode and 0:01:29.920 --> 0:01:33.959 our our intro narration um UH Presents. We were, of 0:01:34.000 --> 0:01:38.400 course talking about the Done universe in this week's episodes, 0:01:38.680 --> 0:01:41.440 so we've probably heard us talking about Dune on recent 0:01:41.480 --> 0:01:44.200 episodes of the show. I've mentioned several times that I've 0:01:44.240 --> 0:01:47.800 been reading it. I finally finished reading it. I loved 0:01:47.880 --> 0:01:51.680 this book. Yeah, I'm about halfway through my my reread 0:01:51.720 --> 0:01:53.560 of it, and this I think this will be the 0:01:53.600 --> 0:01:55.920 third time I've read it, and it's it's a book 0:01:55.960 --> 0:01:58.560 that has a special place in my heart as well. 0:01:58.720 --> 0:02:01.440 It's very straight inched to me that a book written 0:02:01.640 --> 0:02:03.880 fifty years ago. That's one of the reasons we're doing 0:02:03.920 --> 0:02:07.800 this is that this year in it's the fiftieth anniversary 0:02:07.840 --> 0:02:11.320 of the publication of Done. That a book this old 0:02:11.480 --> 0:02:16.360 can feel so fresh and imaginative. So much science fiction 0:02:17.200 --> 0:02:21.440 is disturbingly familiar when you when you go to it. 0:02:21.480 --> 0:02:23.639 I don't know. When I went into the world of Done, 0:02:23.680 --> 0:02:27.239 I was constantly surprised by what I encountered. Yeah, it's 0:02:27.280 --> 0:02:30.120 so unlike, you know, anything that had come before it, 0:02:30.200 --> 0:02:32.720 and and and unlike. Even though it's it's had a 0:02:32.800 --> 0:02:36.440 huge impact on the genre. Um, there's nothing quite like 0:02:36.560 --> 0:02:38.800 it to this day. I mean, it's uh you have 0:02:38.960 --> 0:02:43.840 this space age feudalistic society and it's full of you know, 0:02:43.880 --> 0:02:48.480 you have profits, you have fabulous creatures, you have strange science, 0:02:48.800 --> 0:02:53.520 strange technology that's changing the shape of life. Yeah. So 0:02:53.560 --> 0:02:57.280 to describe the influencer in terms of the influenced, a 0:02:57.320 --> 0:02:59.840 young person approaching Done today might want to think of 0:02:59.840 --> 0:03:02.320 it as sort of like Game of Thrones in space. 0:03:02.960 --> 0:03:05.600 There's a lot of political intrigue, yeah, but also with 0:03:06.080 --> 0:03:11.520 with a lot of philosophical commentary. And I have to say, 0:03:11.560 --> 0:03:15.000 this is the most ecological novel I've ever read. I've 0:03:15.040 --> 0:03:19.400 never read anything as concerned with ecology and the conservation 0:03:19.440 --> 0:03:22.800 of resources. Yeah, A tremendous amount of thought went into 0:03:22.840 --> 0:03:27.440 the creation of this, this alien ecosystem, an alien ecosystem 0:03:27.520 --> 0:03:31.000 that is not only intrinsically interesting, but but plays an 0:03:31.160 --> 0:03:34.640 enormously important role in the plot. Right, So we're gonna 0:03:34.639 --> 0:03:37.920 do two episodes about the science of Dune, talking about 0:03:38.480 --> 0:03:41.800 the world imagined by Frank Herbert In in his novel 0:03:41.880 --> 0:03:44.560 Dune and in the larger Done universe, but then also 0:03:45.360 --> 0:03:48.600 real world parallels to this science and how doone has 0:03:48.640 --> 0:03:51.560 influenced science fiction. Yeah, So we're gonna be discussing some 0:03:51.600 --> 0:03:54.280 of the science fiction some of the actual science. But 0:03:54.400 --> 0:03:56.440 one of the reasons that they that the sci fi 0:03:56.520 --> 0:04:00.200 aspects of Frank Herbert's done, you know, continues to sate 0:04:00.280 --> 0:04:02.960 so well is, first of all, it's set a tremendously 0:04:03.120 --> 0:04:05.800 long period of time in the future, and he does 0:04:05.800 --> 0:04:09.600 a great job about giving you some details but leaving 0:04:09.600 --> 0:04:13.119 a lot of the details a bit ambiguous and unexplained, 0:04:13.160 --> 0:04:15.000 and you're just sort of left to fill in fill 0:04:15.000 --> 0:04:17.160 in the blanks in your own mind, right, and if 0:04:17.200 --> 0:04:19.880 you know how sci fi fans work, they will fill 0:04:19.920 --> 0:04:23.599 in those blanks. Yes. So two of our primary resources 0:04:23.680 --> 0:04:27.520 here um are, first of all, a fabulous new publication 0:04:27.640 --> 0:04:31.120 titled The Science of Doone, edited by Kevin R. Grazier 0:04:31.240 --> 0:04:35.160 ps PhD uh. It's an unauthorized exploration into the real 0:04:35.200 --> 0:04:38.440 science behind Frank Herbert's fictional universe. And it's a series 0:04:38.480 --> 0:04:41.280 of essays all you know, by experts in their in 0:04:41.320 --> 0:04:46.760 their field, planetologist, cosmologists, etcetera. It's a fabulous book. We'll 0:04:46.760 --> 0:04:48.560 have a link to where you can pick up a 0:04:48.560 --> 0:04:51.400 copy on the landing page. For this episode. We also 0:04:51.880 --> 0:04:55.960 dug in a little bit into the Dune Encyclopedia which 0:04:56.000 --> 0:04:59.360 came out in It's long out of print, but there 0:04:59.360 --> 0:05:02.480 are used copies out there available for purchase. And this 0:05:02.520 --> 0:05:06.880 was compiled by Dr Willis E. Nick Nelly and uh. 0:05:06.920 --> 0:05:11.040 This also involved a number of different freelance writers and 0:05:11.320 --> 0:05:15.200 and some scientists weighing in on not only the science 0:05:15.480 --> 0:05:19.600 potential science underlying the details of Herbert so a Universe, 0:05:19.640 --> 0:05:23.160 but also some of just the cultural aspect as well. Right, 0:05:23.200 --> 0:05:26.800 it's got recipes for frem and flatbread. Yes, I was. 0:05:27.600 --> 0:05:30.720 You pointed that out yesterday and I was very fascinated 0:05:30.720 --> 0:05:34.280 by the topic. They're also lyrics to songs. There's as 0:05:34.360 --> 0:05:37.640 well as some some some science into how say, you know, 0:05:37.760 --> 0:05:41.679 sandworms or faith dancers may have worked. You know, thinking 0:05:41.720 --> 0:05:45.279 about the recipe for frem and flatbread, I wonder why 0:05:45.320 --> 0:05:49.320 the fremen would cook anything, because cooking is almost always 0:05:49.360 --> 0:05:52.400 the cause of much evaporation and loss of moisture. Well, 0:05:52.400 --> 0:05:54.920 perhaps they have a special oven, like a still oven 0:05:55.000 --> 0:05:57.800 that cat captures all that moisture. Yes, so they seal 0:05:57.880 --> 0:06:00.640 off the kitchen and no moisture can escape and then 0:06:00.680 --> 0:06:03.240 you can cook. Yeah, indeed, that makes sense. Now, I 0:06:03.279 --> 0:06:06.400 also just wanna don't want to preface here too that 0:06:06.440 --> 0:06:11.240 they were dealing primarily with the nineteen novel Dune, with 0:06:11.440 --> 0:06:14.600 some discussion of details that may pop up in Frank 0:06:14.640 --> 0:06:17.920 Herbert's later novels. We don't really get into any of 0:06:17.960 --> 0:06:21.800 the more recent works by by Brian Herbert. Brian Herbert 0:06:21.839 --> 0:06:24.160 is of course the son of Frank Herbert, and he 0:06:24.800 --> 0:06:28.000 continued the saga, did some prequels and a number of 0:06:28.080 --> 0:06:32.600 legends of done books with with his collaborator. But I 0:06:32.680 --> 0:06:34.240 have personally not read them. I know a lot of 0:06:34.240 --> 0:06:37.400 people enjoy them, so um, yeah, we would love to 0:06:37.440 --> 0:06:39.920 hear from anyone who who has read those books, who 0:06:39.920 --> 0:06:43.160 has additional information they want to share based on their 0:06:43.240 --> 0:06:46.960 enjoyment of that sort of continued universe. Right, But these 0:06:47.000 --> 0:06:49.440 two episodes we're doing are going to be primarily the 0:06:49.480 --> 0:06:53.240 first novel, Dune, and then our wonderful supplementary materials. Yeah, 0:06:53.279 --> 0:06:54.920 the kind of stuff that I think, for the most part, 0:06:54.960 --> 0:06:57.320 people even who haven't read the book might be familiar 0:06:57.320 --> 0:07:01.800 with from either the of course, the Dave Lynch film adaptation, 0:07:01.920 --> 0:07:05.080 Oh and we got to talk about that. Oh yeah, 0:07:05.120 --> 0:07:07.800 the Sci Fi Channel mini series from several years back, 0:07:08.040 --> 0:07:11.960 or just sort of the general cultural residents of the series. Um, 0:07:12.040 --> 0:07:14.320 and we're gonna try and make sure it's not too deep. 0:07:14.320 --> 0:07:16.280 So if you have little or no understanding of the 0:07:16.320 --> 0:07:19.480 Dune Universe, we'll hold your hand through the stands. So 0:07:19.600 --> 0:07:21.560 we mentioned it's going to be a two part episode. 0:07:21.560 --> 0:07:24.720 This first episode today is going to be about primarily 0:07:24.760 --> 0:07:28.920 the technology of the Dune Universe, and then the next 0:07:28.960 --> 0:07:31.160 episode we do or we're going to try to focus 0:07:31.160 --> 0:07:34.960 on the organic components, the biology and the ecology of 0:07:35.000 --> 0:07:38.280 the Done universe. But before we get into the meat 0:07:38.280 --> 0:07:40.960 of today's episode, I think we we should just give 0:07:40.960 --> 0:07:44.760 a very very brief cursory plot synopsis to people who 0:07:44.840 --> 0:07:47.520 haven't read the book but want to be able to 0:07:47.640 --> 0:07:49.640 have a basic idea of what's going on. So what 0:07:49.760 --> 0:07:52.960 happens in the novel Dune, Well, essentially you have a 0:07:53.000 --> 0:07:56.240 space opera in which you have a galactic civilization spread 0:07:56.280 --> 0:08:00.000 across various planets right right, and there is one precious 0:08:00.160 --> 0:08:04.480 key resource in the universe that everybody wants and sort 0:08:04.520 --> 0:08:08.320 of controls all trade, and that resources the spice milange. 0:08:08.880 --> 0:08:12.320 It comes from one planet in the entire universe, and 0:08:12.360 --> 0:08:15.920 that planet is a racous also known as Doune Yeah, 0:08:16.000 --> 0:08:19.840 it's the stuff that really makes uh, ultimately travel between 0:08:19.840 --> 0:08:24.720 planets possible. It makes the interplanetary economy possible. So everything 0:08:24.800 --> 0:08:27.000 is hinging on this one precious commodity. It's kind of 0:08:27.040 --> 0:08:30.520 the It's essentially the oil of the done universe, right, 0:08:30.560 --> 0:08:33.679 and you can't get it anywhere else. So the characters 0:08:33.760 --> 0:08:35.640 that come in on this story that there are two 0:08:35.640 --> 0:08:39.240 main houses in the story. There's House of Tradees and 0:08:39.240 --> 0:08:42.679 there's House Harconan. The Tradees are it's it's kind of 0:08:42.720 --> 0:08:45.040 manniche and I guess the the Tradees are the good 0:08:45.040 --> 0:08:49.559 guys and the Harconans are very very bad guys. Yeah, 0:08:49.800 --> 0:08:52.720 I mean the Harconans are they're they're they're a product 0:08:52.760 --> 0:08:54.920 of the environment to to a certain extent, but yeah, 0:08:54.920 --> 0:08:58.559 they're they're pretty villainous. Yeah, and they are essentially competing 0:08:59.240 --> 0:09:03.640 for roll of the planet that produces spice. And there's 0:09:03.640 --> 0:09:08.000 a lot of warfare and backstabbing and treachery and double 0:09:08.040 --> 0:09:12.720 crossing and and tests of loyalty. But ultimately the main 0:09:12.840 --> 0:09:16.920 thrust of the story is the adventure of Paula Trades, 0:09:17.000 --> 0:09:21.079 the young son of House of Trades, and his mother Jessica. 0:09:21.200 --> 0:09:24.520 While they're learning how to live on the planet Dune 0:09:24.800 --> 0:09:28.920 and eventually participating in a journey of cosmic discovery and 0:09:29.000 --> 0:09:33.160 revenge and drugs. Like at the heart, it's such a quintessential, 0:09:33.360 --> 0:09:36.880 like nineties sixties product, right because it's about a young 0:09:36.920 --> 0:09:42.360 man who takes an allucinogen and then save the calaxies. 0:09:43.800 --> 0:09:45.320 You know, I never thought of it that way, but 0:09:45.360 --> 0:09:48.720 that's that's pretty much right. We'll get way more into 0:09:48.760 --> 0:09:52.040 the drugs in the second episode, but today we wanted 0:09:52.080 --> 0:09:57.559 to talk about the the technological theater of the Dune universe. 0:09:57.760 --> 0:10:01.360 And I think one of the coolest concept that's created 0:10:01.360 --> 0:10:03.840 in the book that that Frank Herbert comes up with 0:10:04.440 --> 0:10:07.960 is the idea that this is a future scenario without 0:10:08.040 --> 0:10:11.760 computers or robots. Right, yeah, it is a post but 0:10:12.000 --> 0:10:16.800 Laryan jihad world. Uh So, basically, imagine that the singularity 0:10:16.920 --> 0:10:20.640 has occurred. We have thinking machines everywhere that are caring 0:10:20.640 --> 0:10:23.520 for is looking after us more of I tend to 0:10:23.520 --> 0:10:27.320 interpret more it's like the beneficial aspects of of a 0:10:27.360 --> 0:10:29.920 post singularity world in which your computers are not like, 0:10:30.000 --> 0:10:32.000 you know, enslaving you and making you weren't work in 0:10:32.000 --> 0:10:35.760 their salt minds, but they've just become such a ubiquitous 0:10:35.840 --> 0:10:40.079 aspect of our lives, and eventually humans rebel against that. Yeah. 0:10:40.320 --> 0:10:43.960 So there is in the past of this universe a 0:10:44.080 --> 0:10:47.600 great war against the machines, and it's it's referred to, 0:10:47.679 --> 0:10:50.120 as you said, by the name the but Larry and 0:10:50.200 --> 0:10:53.840 Jihad from the name Butler, but Larry and Jihad. And 0:10:53.960 --> 0:10:57.839 I like the idea that it invokes the concept of jihad. 0:10:57.960 --> 0:11:00.880 So it's not just like in the Terminator movies where 0:11:01.160 --> 0:11:03.880 there is a war for survival against the machines, or 0:11:03.920 --> 0:11:06.280 maybe like you might find in the Matrix or something 0:11:06.320 --> 0:11:09.120 like that, the machines take over, they decide they want 0:11:09.120 --> 0:11:11.520 to kill us or enslave us, and we fight back. 0:11:11.960 --> 0:11:14.960 There is there is that element, I think, but there 0:11:15.120 --> 0:11:18.960 is also a deeper, more spiritual element, which is where 0:11:19.040 --> 0:11:21.800 the concept of the jihad comes in. It's a physical struggle, 0:11:22.080 --> 0:11:27.280 but it's also a spiritual struggle for the soul of humankind. Yeah. Indeed, 0:11:27.320 --> 0:11:30.560 like some of the Herbert Frank, Herbert himself didn't really 0:11:31.080 --> 0:11:32.760 give you a lot of details on you lift it. 0:11:32.800 --> 0:11:34.040 You know, like a lot of the details in the 0:11:34.040 --> 0:11:37.000 den univers little ambiguous, and you're helping You're left to 0:11:37.040 --> 0:11:40.280 sort of um, you know, dwell on the philosophical implications, 0:11:40.280 --> 0:11:43.920 but just a few quotes from the fictional tons, such 0:11:43.960 --> 0:11:46.840 as the Orange Catholic Bible that play a prominent role 0:11:46.880 --> 0:11:49.719 in the universe. Thou shalt not create a machine and 0:11:49.760 --> 0:11:53.439 the likeness of a human mind, thou shalt not disfigure 0:11:53.640 --> 0:11:55.840 the soul. And then this is a great line from 0:11:56.480 --> 0:12:00.000 some of the appendix material uh in the sixty novel. 0:12:00.640 --> 0:12:04.080 Then came the Butlerrian Jihad, two generations of chaos, the 0:12:04.200 --> 0:12:07.600 god of machine logic was overthrown among the masses, and 0:12:07.720 --> 0:12:11.880 a new concept sept raised man may not be replaced. 0:12:12.640 --> 0:12:15.000 I've been thinking a lot about this um just in 0:12:15.040 --> 0:12:18.400 my daily life, you know, about not even with like 0:12:18.440 --> 0:12:21.080 thinking machines, but just the use of Facebook in your 0:12:21.160 --> 0:12:23.800 daily life, you know, the the use of social media, 0:12:24.120 --> 0:12:27.000 the use of all these gadgets. And so for me, 0:12:27.160 --> 0:12:30.360 when I think of the Spottlerian Jihad, it's it seems 0:12:30.360 --> 0:12:32.960 as much rebellion against that as it is against you know, 0:12:33.200 --> 0:12:35.640 some robot with a with a laser gun. Sure, and 0:12:35.840 --> 0:12:40.839 it's not unusual for our technology to change us, right, 0:12:40.840 --> 0:12:43.760 I mean, it doesn't just make our lives easier it 0:12:44.080 --> 0:12:47.719 changes the way we we prioritize things and the way 0:12:47.760 --> 0:12:49.640 we we go about our lives. One way of looking 0:12:49.679 --> 0:12:52.160 at this might be something like agriculture. I mean, that's 0:12:52.160 --> 0:12:54.680 a technology that I think a lot of people would 0:12:54.720 --> 0:12:59.080 argue fundamentally change the human animal Homo sapiens is not 0:12:59.200 --> 0:13:02.760 the same anymore or after we invented agriculture. And you 0:13:02.800 --> 0:13:06.360 could probably look at the rise of thinking machines of 0:13:06.400 --> 0:13:09.679 computers and perhaps the same way it is changing us 0:13:09.720 --> 0:13:12.520 in a very fundamental way. I mean, who knows what 0:13:12.640 --> 0:13:15.560 that look like ten thousand years in the future, as 0:13:15.600 --> 0:13:19.720 as the doone universe imagines, But it's doing something to 0:13:19.800 --> 0:13:25.560 our brains. When we can have vast computational power, vast 0:13:25.559 --> 0:13:29.960 power of storage of information, and as imagined by this 0:13:30.040 --> 0:13:34.240 sort of singularity, future decision making power that we can 0:13:34.280 --> 0:13:36.520 outsource two machines. Yeah, I just think of all the 0:13:36.559 --> 0:13:38.760 things we outsourced already, all the things we no longer 0:13:38.840 --> 0:13:41.600 bother to remember because the machine remembers it for us. 0:13:41.960 --> 0:13:44.640 So yeah, like you said, your your interpretation of this 0:13:44.760 --> 0:13:47.520 coming in, I agree with this about the butlery and jihad. 0:13:47.679 --> 0:13:50.719 It having something to do with the way humans are 0:13:50.800 --> 0:13:55.520 changed by our dependence on machines. So either way, we 0:13:55.600 --> 0:13:58.040 end up with a situation in these these books, in 0:13:58.080 --> 0:14:01.520 this world where we've kicked out the computers, which humans one, 0:14:01.640 --> 0:14:04.199 the humans one. But now the humans have to do 0:14:04.280 --> 0:14:07.200 all the things of the machines were doing beforehand. So 0:14:07.280 --> 0:14:09.920 what do you do when suddenly, uh, you know, just 0:14:09.960 --> 0:14:11.960 think about a business, so you can't depend on accounting 0:14:11.960 --> 0:14:14.480 software anymore, you need what do you do? You have 0:14:14.520 --> 0:14:16.559 to turn to the human mind to deal with all 0:14:16.559 --> 0:14:18.360 that accounting. What do you do when it comes to 0:14:18.440 --> 0:14:20.680 navigational concerns? I mean, even in our own lives will 0:14:20.720 --> 0:14:24.040 become dependent on these like things like Google maps and 0:14:24.080 --> 0:14:25.680 ways right to tell us how to get from point 0:14:25.680 --> 0:14:28.200 A to point B. If we throw that out the window, 0:14:28.320 --> 0:14:30.480 suddenly we have to look at maps. Suddenly we have 0:14:30.560 --> 0:14:33.440 to know which way is north and south. It falls 0:14:33.480 --> 0:14:35.520 to the human to know how to navigate. Yeah, and 0:14:35.520 --> 0:14:37.560 it gets even tougher of course when you're in space. 0:14:38.800 --> 0:14:43.600 So without the aid of advanced computer computation, Um, they 0:14:43.640 --> 0:14:46.880 have to turn to human capabilities. Uh, and they have 0:14:47.000 --> 0:14:53.120 to essentially breed and train uh, special classes of humans 0:14:53.560 --> 0:14:58.080 to to to take on these varying taxing tasks, right, 0:14:58.120 --> 0:15:00.600 and so some of these classes that you encounter in 0:15:00.640 --> 0:15:04.920 the Dune universe, well, one of them, the most straightforward 0:15:05.440 --> 0:15:08.080 upgrading of the human mind to replace computers would be 0:15:08.080 --> 0:15:11.800 the mentats. There are several characters in the book who 0:15:11.880 --> 0:15:17.280 are explained to be mentats. And this is pretty straightforwardly 0:15:17.360 --> 0:15:21.560 a human computer. It's a person whose mind has been 0:15:21.640 --> 0:15:26.080 trained and I think in some ways stimulated by drugs. Yeah, 0:15:26.120 --> 0:15:30.480 they're constantly consuming some variation with some wine type like 0:15:30.640 --> 0:15:32.800 SA sort of supercharge them. It's kind of like a 0:15:32.800 --> 0:15:35.360 red bull. Yeah. It talks about their purple stained lips. 0:15:36.560 --> 0:15:39.520 And these mentats really do in some ways fulfill the 0:15:39.560 --> 0:15:43.200 function of computers. And otherwise they're sort of like advisors. 0:15:43.280 --> 0:15:47.120 They're they're sort of the perfect computer human hybrid. They 0:15:47.120 --> 0:15:50.520 can do computation, they can store vast amounts of information. 0:15:50.800 --> 0:15:54.480 They seem to pretty much remember everything like that. They 0:15:54.520 --> 0:15:57.560 do not ever forget any details, or at least as 0:15:57.600 --> 0:16:00.360 far as I can tell from the first novel um. 0:16:00.400 --> 0:16:04.800 But then also they are attuned to human nuance. It's 0:16:04.840 --> 0:16:07.720 something that's not true the computers today. They might be 0:16:07.800 --> 0:16:11.320 more replacement for the kind of you know, superhuman artificial 0:16:11.360 --> 0:16:15.760 intelligence that we imagine in the post singularity world. Yeah, 0:16:15.840 --> 0:16:17.280 and it's interesting too that they have kind of an 0:16:17.320 --> 0:16:21.000 ethical guideline to them, and if you want one that's twisted, 0:16:21.560 --> 0:16:24.960 you have to essentially it's like a jail broken iPhone. Yeah, 0:16:25.960 --> 0:16:29.000 I want to order a sociopathic mentap. Yeah, in that case, 0:16:29.040 --> 0:16:31.280 you have to go to the Relaxa and they will 0:16:31.320 --> 0:16:33.400 provide you with one. And of course one of them 0:16:33.440 --> 0:16:35.280 is a is a major character in the early goings 0:16:35.280 --> 0:16:37.920 of the novel. Yeah, that's true. And then of course 0:16:37.920 --> 0:16:40.440 there's the Spacing Guild. These are the individuals who handle 0:16:40.480 --> 0:16:43.960 in your planetary travel, and this is a very complex, 0:16:44.040 --> 0:16:48.480 dangerous arrangement. So you have Guild navigators, individuals who have 0:16:48.520 --> 0:16:54.480 been specially bread trained and to varying degrees engineered to 0:16:54.760 --> 0:16:59.280 make the kind of advanced navigational computations necessary to get 0:16:59.320 --> 0:17:03.000 from planet A planet B without just popping out of existence. Yeah. Now, 0:17:03.040 --> 0:17:05.480 we mentioned that the mentats rely on some kind of 0:17:05.560 --> 0:17:10.200 drug that stains their lips purple. The Guilt Navigators definitely 0:17:10.280 --> 0:17:12.480 rely on a drug, and that drug is the drug 0:17:12.520 --> 0:17:15.840 we talked about of the opening spice, and that'll will 0:17:15.880 --> 0:17:18.119 go more into the spice and the effects of Spice 0:17:18.119 --> 0:17:21.600 in the second episode, but it's a key part of 0:17:21.720 --> 0:17:26.119 their outlook of their abilities is not just this computational power, 0:17:26.119 --> 0:17:28.600 but also sort of the ability to see the future, 0:17:28.680 --> 0:17:31.760 which Spice gives them. Yeah, at least a very limited amount, 0:17:31.840 --> 0:17:35.280 just so you can see where your various choices will 0:17:35.320 --> 0:17:37.680 take you, and you can, at least in the next 0:17:37.720 --> 0:17:41.480 few seconds, avoid the ones that will destroy you. Yeah, 0:17:41.600 --> 0:17:43.879 and therefore sort of feel your way through the dark, 0:17:44.440 --> 0:17:46.919 uh safely from point A to point B. Yeah. And 0:17:46.960 --> 0:17:49.520 then there's a third group of these sort of advanced 0:17:49.600 --> 0:17:53.679 humans that I think is is maybe the most interesting 0:17:53.720 --> 0:17:57.000 of the three, and also the hardest to pin down 0:17:57.080 --> 0:18:00.159 and define. But they're the Binni jesster It. So, the 0:18:00.200 --> 0:18:03.840 main character of the novel Poul Traits. His mother is Jessica, 0:18:03.920 --> 0:18:07.160 and she's a Binny jesser At trained woman. The Benny 0:18:07.280 --> 0:18:14.000 jesser At are a female order of super smart, very perceptive, 0:18:14.880 --> 0:18:20.280 highly trained priestesses of some kind who haven't they haven't 0:18:20.320 --> 0:18:22.800 they have an aptitude for politics for one. Thing like that. 0:18:22.960 --> 0:18:26.399 They are tuned into all the finer points of human 0:18:26.480 --> 0:18:30.040 expression that we miss every day. There's sort of human 0:18:30.200 --> 0:18:33.639 lie detectors. They can tell what people are thinking and 0:18:33.680 --> 0:18:36.720 what they're gonna do by micro expressions on their faces, 0:18:36.880 --> 0:18:40.359 tonal shifts in their voices, and that they command a 0:18:40.440 --> 0:18:44.520 sort of supreme knowledge of the human animal and how 0:18:44.560 --> 0:18:47.560 it works. And they play a fascinating long game too, 0:18:47.600 --> 0:18:54.760 of manipulating mythology, um mnemonics and UH and culture to 0:18:54.920 --> 0:18:58.080 their benefit. Yeah. One of the most interesting examples of 0:18:58.119 --> 0:19:00.240 this that comes up in the novel is the of 0:19:00.280 --> 0:19:04.359 them is it the called the Missionary of Protectiva, which 0:19:04.400 --> 0:19:08.760 is this fascinating idea that the this order goes throughout 0:19:08.800 --> 0:19:15.119 the galaxy, seeding planets with mythology that later members of 0:19:15.160 --> 0:19:18.040 the order can rely upon if they're in a pinch. 0:19:18.680 --> 0:19:20.960 So it says, if you went to every city in 0:19:21.000 --> 0:19:25.679 the country you live in, spreading rumors about I don't know, 0:19:25.880 --> 0:19:28.840 prophecies about someone who would come to your community and 0:19:28.880 --> 0:19:32.280 save it from poverty and and and everything, and then 0:19:32.400 --> 0:19:35.320 you tell all your friends exactly what to do to 0:19:35.400 --> 0:19:39.280 fulfill those prophecies. Yeah. Yeah, So it's a FACTULSS fail safe. 0:19:39.320 --> 0:19:41.399 And also they were going laying the grounds for future 0:19:41.440 --> 0:19:44.560 manipulation uh. And of course at their heart they also 0:19:44.600 --> 0:19:47.400 have a breeding program, Yeah, which has some I think 0:19:47.440 --> 0:19:52.040 some creepy similarities to eugenics programs. Yeah, Andy, there's definitely 0:19:52.080 --> 0:19:55.320 a eugenic vibe to it. They're trying to breed a 0:19:55.400 --> 0:19:59.320 specific person what they call the quizstat's hat iraq um, 0:19:59.320 --> 0:20:03.480 a term signifying one who can be many places at once. 0:20:03.680 --> 0:20:06.560 I thought the translation of that term was the shortening 0:20:06.640 --> 0:20:09.200 of the way. Yes, that right, Yeah, I believe, Yeah, 0:20:09.240 --> 0:20:12.800 that is also invoked as well. But according to the 0:20:12.840 --> 0:20:16.040 Don Appendix, in simpler terms, what they saw it is 0:20:16.119 --> 0:20:20.399 quote a human with mental powers permitting him to understand 0:20:20.480 --> 0:20:23.240 and use higher order dimensions. So they're trying they're essentially 0:20:23.240 --> 0:20:27.120 trying to breed a superman tat, a human supercomputer with 0:20:27.840 --> 0:20:32.679 from some precientabilities found in the Guild Navigators, but without 0:20:32.920 --> 0:20:37.200 necessarily without the without necessarily having to imbue the spice. Yeah. Yeah, 0:20:37.280 --> 0:20:39.679 So in a sense, they're trying to to get to 0:20:39.720 --> 0:20:43.880 that next phase of evolution. Uh, in terms of human thinking, 0:20:44.680 --> 0:20:47.080 the human thinking apparatus. I don't think you can make 0:20:47.080 --> 0:20:51.160 evolution happen, just got await on it. They're determined them. 0:20:51.200 --> 0:20:52.760 And then on top of that, you have the beneath 0:20:52.760 --> 0:20:57.640 a Laxu who have continued to refine human form and function, 0:20:57.680 --> 0:21:00.960 often in ways that push the envelope of a sceptabilities though, 0:21:01.160 --> 0:21:03.639 and this you see that, you know, that post human conundrum, 0:21:03.720 --> 0:21:06.280 like how much can you change a human and it 0:21:06.400 --> 0:21:10.080 still be a human? Yeah? I love this aspect of 0:21:10.080 --> 0:21:13.520 the universe, that it's so fresh and interesting that they 0:21:13.560 --> 0:21:17.600 imagine a future without robots and computers, because robots and computers, 0:21:17.640 --> 0:21:21.000 of course are ubiquitous and uh in science fiction, and 0:21:21.040 --> 0:21:22.960 I think a lot of times with good reason, because 0:21:22.960 --> 0:21:25.600 that it certainly does seem to be the trend in 0:21:25.720 --> 0:21:29.120 human history is outsourcing all of our capabilities to machines 0:21:29.280 --> 0:21:32.280 that can do them better or at least do them cheaper, 0:21:32.640 --> 0:21:35.879 or I don't know, a greater scale. But here we 0:21:36.000 --> 0:21:42.080 have human technology. It is really the wet ware future 0:21:42.200 --> 0:21:45.760 universe where all of the things that computers used to do, 0:21:46.440 --> 0:21:48.679 or even that you know they can't do for us 0:21:48.720 --> 0:21:51.359 today but we only imagine they could do, are all 0:21:51.359 --> 0:21:55.560 replaced by human perfection. Yeah, you know, and it all 0:21:55.760 --> 0:21:58.320 makes me think two of our episodes in Techno Religion, right, so, 0:21:58.520 --> 0:22:01.919 particularly some of the can ndrums of how do I 0:22:02.320 --> 0:22:05.919 create a refrigerator that will operate in keeping with the 0:22:05.960 --> 0:22:09.240 laws of the status. Right, You're you're having to advance 0:22:09.280 --> 0:22:13.800 your technology, but do so within search certain religious frameworks 0:22:13.800 --> 0:22:16.480 and religious guidelines. Right. Oh, yeah, because we don't want 0:22:16.480 --> 0:22:18.720 to lose sight of that. It is dictated in the 0:22:18.760 --> 0:22:21.600 Orange Catholic Bible. And it's not just that people sort 0:22:21.600 --> 0:22:24.359 of frown on computers. The Bible says you shall not 0:22:24.480 --> 0:22:27.880 do it, right, It's it's blasphemy to do this sort 0:22:27.880 --> 0:22:29.800 of thing, so you have to you have to work 0:22:29.840 --> 0:22:34.240 around it. Yeah. So the sort of upgraded advanced human 0:22:34.440 --> 0:22:37.720 brain technology is a larger feature of the Dune universe, 0:22:38.480 --> 0:22:40.560 and if we want to try to relate that to 0:22:40.640 --> 0:22:44.960 real technology, I can't see that there's all that much 0:22:45.040 --> 0:22:47.359 we could say about it, except that, of course people 0:22:47.400 --> 0:22:51.359 can There are some people with exceptional mental abilities. People 0:22:51.560 --> 0:22:55.600 can hone their their skills in certain areas. But I 0:22:55.960 --> 0:22:57.960 don't know if there's a wine you can drink that 0:22:58.000 --> 0:23:00.159 will make you a ment at And I'm doubtful we 0:23:00.200 --> 0:23:03.080 will ever discover such a thing because I tend to 0:23:03.119 --> 0:23:06.119 assume that the human mind is already operating probably a 0:23:06.200 --> 0:23:10.080 pretty close to its capacity. I don't buy into this 0:23:10.119 --> 0:23:12.119 whole like, you know, we only use ten percent of 0:23:12.119 --> 0:23:14.880 our brains. No, yeah, yeah, that that tend to throw 0:23:14.920 --> 0:23:16.359