WEBVTT - Round Three: EVs with John Voelcker 0:00:15.316 --> 0:00:22.676 Pushkin. The Germans used to do this. They would charge 0:00:22.996 --> 0:00:27.236 like ten thousand dollars for horsepower, you know, to get 0:00:27.276 --> 0:00:29.836 the big engine. You'd have to spend sometimes double the 0:00:29.916 --> 0:00:32.196 price of the car. And it was just come on, man, 0:00:32.556 --> 0:00:35.836 Americans don't do that. Like you check a box on 0:00:35.956 --> 0:00:37.916 your Chevy Nova and you get the big engine and 0:00:37.956 --> 0:00:42.716 it's fifty bucks. And to me, that seems totally Unamericanand 0:00:42.956 --> 0:00:48.116 used to tell me about those days. They predate me. 0:00:48.796 --> 0:00:51.476 But I still think that value is a really big 0:00:51.516 --> 0:01:01.116 part of the American vehicle equation. John Vulker is the 0:01:01.196 --> 0:01:04.876 founding editor of a hybrid and electric car website, Green 0:01:04.996 --> 0:01:09.076 Car Reports. He's also a frequent contributor to Car and Draw. 0:01:10.316 --> 0:01:12.476 John has agreed to help me sort the wheat from 0:01:12.476 --> 0:01:15.356 the chaff when it comes to electric vehicles, and his 0:01:15.516 --> 0:01:18.436 thoughts on EVS are as well informed as they come. 0:01:22.036 --> 0:01:25.036 On this special season of Car Show, we're putting cars 0:01:25.036 --> 0:01:29.196 in four brackets to the test. This week it's EVS. 0:01:30.916 --> 0:01:33.676 At the end of our series of highly subjective tests 0:01:33.676 --> 0:01:37.556 and debates, we will crown a winner, the greatest award 0:01:37.596 --> 0:01:40.436 in the history of this business, the Car Show Car 0:01:40.476 --> 0:01:51.716 of the Year. I'm your host Eddie alternate. The four 0:01:51.756 --> 0:01:55.596 cars in our EV bracket are as follows the five 0:01:55.716 --> 0:01:59.636 hundred and eighty horsepower three hundred miles of range Ford 0:01:59.756 --> 0:02:03.756 F one fifty Lightning, starting at fifty four thousand dollars 0:02:03.796 --> 0:02:08.956 and escalating steeply from there. Then there's the BMWi four, 0:02:09.596 --> 0:02:13.716 specifically in the five hundred and thirty six horsepower sixty 0:02:13.756 --> 0:02:17.436 eight thousand dollars and fifty high performance trim with an 0:02:17.436 --> 0:02:20.876 EPA range rating of two hundred and twenty seven miles. 0:02:22.836 --> 0:02:27.276 Third up the Hyundai Ionic five, starting at forty three 0:02:27.316 --> 0:02:30.116 thousand dollars and giving up to three hundred and twenty 0:02:30.156 --> 0:02:33.396 horse power or three hundred and three miles of EPA 0:02:33.516 --> 0:02:38.716 rated range. Finally, and this one's less expensive than you'd 0:02:38.756 --> 0:02:42.196 guess from looking at it, the sixty three thousand dollars 0:02:42.276 --> 0:02:45.876 Cadillac Lyric with its three hundred and forty horsepower and 0:02:45.996 --> 0:02:49.236 three hundred and twelve miles of range in single motor guys, 0:02:50.556 --> 0:02:53.316 and at the end of the episode will take you 0:02:53.356 --> 0:02:59.116 for a drive in the winter, So stay tuned. Okay, 0:02:59.316 --> 0:03:11.716 let's accelerate quickly. No sound, But first, a definition of 0:03:11.836 --> 0:03:14.836 terms that are important for EV owners and even would 0:03:14.836 --> 0:03:19.596 be ev owners. Well, probably the first one is kilowat hours. 0:03:21.236 --> 0:03:24.636 A kilowatt hour is just a measure of energy, and 0:03:25.356 --> 0:03:30.276 you can say a gallon of gasoline has roughly thirty 0:03:30.476 --> 0:03:36.716 kilowat hours of energy in it. The car battery in 0:03:36.796 --> 0:03:40.156 an electric car, a modern one, not a high end one, 0:03:40.236 --> 0:03:44.716 but a modern electric car of VWID four or one 0:03:44.716 --> 0:03:49.316 of the ones from Hyundai or Kia, etc. Has sixty 0:03:49.356 --> 0:03:52.596 to seventy kilowat hours of energy. And my rule of 0:03:52.716 --> 0:03:56.636 thumb has always been that on average, and of course 0:03:56.796 --> 0:03:59.636 this depends on how you drive, how fast you drive, 0:04:00.036 --> 0:04:03.036 what the temperature is, and so forth. You're looking at 0:04:03.076 --> 0:04:08.236 about three miles of range per kilowat hour plus or minus. 0:04:08.716 --> 0:04:12.596 So you may see the statistic in the brochure or 0:04:12.716 --> 0:04:16.476 online that says, okay, this car has sixty five kilo 0:04:16.516 --> 0:04:20.316 one hours of usable energy in its battery. Well, what 0:04:20.436 --> 0:04:23.916 does that mean? Basically multiplied by three and you get 0:04:23.956 --> 0:04:27.676 to that car having two hundred or more miles of range. 0:04:28.156 --> 0:04:35.436 So the next one is EPA range. Like gasoline cars, 0:04:35.876 --> 0:04:42.076 the EPA has effectively an efficiency rating for these cars, 0:04:42.476 --> 0:04:46.556 and it's the same metrics as a gasoline car. It's 0:04:47.196 --> 0:04:52.396 roughly half and half urban and highway now on electric 0:04:52.436 --> 0:04:58.756 car because there's so much more efficient. Highway miles takes 0:04:58.756 --> 0:05:03.876 a bigger hit on range because you're pushing airside. So 0:05:04.156 --> 0:05:08.316 driving around town the range is much higher the EPA 0:05:08.476 --> 0:05:11.516 range driving on the highways. If you do nothing but 0:05:11.596 --> 0:05:13.596 seventy five miles an hour on the highway for the 0:05:13.596 --> 0:05:16.636 whole battery, you won't get that range. The EPA range 0:05:17.036 --> 0:05:20.676 is an average, and so you know a conventional internal 0:05:20.676 --> 0:05:23.436 combustion car is going to get better highway mileage than 0:05:23.476 --> 0:05:26.636 it does in the city. A battery electric will get 0:05:26.676 --> 0:05:29.956 better mileage in the city, and it does on the highway. Well, 0:05:30.036 --> 0:05:31.836 what I like to point out is that part of 0:05:31.836 --> 0:05:35.716 it with a gasoline car is that they're enormously inefficient, 0:05:35.756 --> 0:05:38.556 so they waste about three quarters of all that energy 0:05:38.596 --> 0:05:42.236 in your gasoline. If you took the energy in a 0:05:42.276 --> 0:05:45.556 twelve gallon tank of gasoline, which is about average, and 0:05:45.716 --> 0:05:49.476 put it in an electric car, because battery cars are 0:05:49.516 --> 0:05:51.756 so much more efficient, you'd have over a thousand miles 0:05:51.756 --> 0:05:55.116 of range. You get three hundred in that gas car 0:05:55.116 --> 0:05:57.996 because seventy five percent of that energy gets wasted as 0:05:58.036 --> 0:06:01.716 heat or noise. Gotcha, And let's talk about charging for 0:06:01.756 --> 0:06:06.476 a second. The new sort of buzzword is eight hundred 0:06:06.596 --> 0:06:12.116 volt architecture. What does an eight hundred volt architecture mean 0:06:12.196 --> 0:06:15.676 and why is it important? In one sentence, it means 0:06:15.716 --> 0:06:23.356 that your battery pack can charge at twice the voltage 0:06:24.076 --> 0:06:27.516 of the four hundred vold architecture that's been standard pretty 0:06:27.596 --> 0:06:30.276 much for all high voltage packs since the first Toyota 0:06:30.276 --> 0:06:34.356 Prius plus or minus. So you get reduced charging time 0:06:34.916 --> 0:06:39.556 in part because of reduced internal resistance. However, the reason 0:06:39.596 --> 0:06:43.076 that not everybody has done this is because it was 0:06:43.196 --> 0:06:47.716 a brand new concept five years ago. There isn't the 0:06:47.796 --> 0:06:50.796 parts infrastructure out there that automakers can go to and 0:06:50.836 --> 0:06:52.876 say I need an electric air conditioner and so on, 0:06:53.676 --> 0:06:57.276 and you have to have more powerful charging stations to 0:06:57.396 --> 0:07:01.036 take advantage of that. So it's really the kil awot 0:07:01.116 --> 0:07:05.836 rate that is the speed at which you can charge 0:07:06.236 --> 0:07:11.196 that shoppers buyers should pay attention into. So what's sort 0:07:11.236 --> 0:07:13.676 of the state of our charging time? Like how long 0:07:13.716 --> 0:07:17.356 should it take to get from twenty percent charge to 0:07:17.796 --> 0:07:21.076 eighty or ninety percent charge? Like what are the fastest 0:07:21.156 --> 0:07:25.716 charging cars doing on the hottest rigs? Well, we have 0:07:26.156 --> 0:07:30.036 the Porsche Taikon, and then a couple of new evis 0:07:30.076 --> 0:07:34.796 from Hundai and Kia and Genesis. And note to shoppers, 0:07:34.956 --> 0:07:38.156 you will see carmakers quote times for ten to eighty 0:07:38.196 --> 0:07:43.516 percent or fifteen to eighty percent. They are under optimal circumstances, 0:07:43.516 --> 0:07:46.836 the right temperature, a battery pack that's already warmed up 0:07:46.876 --> 0:07:49.996 so it can take energy, and so on. But to 0:07:50.236 --> 0:07:53.116 get from ten to eighty percent of a pack, which 0:07:53.276 --> 0:07:57.156 may be as much as two hundred more miles, it 0:07:57.236 --> 0:08:01.276 could be as little as eighteen minutes as compared to say, 0:08:01.596 --> 0:08:05.196 half an hour or forty minutes for one hundred and 0:08:05.276 --> 0:08:09.916 fifty kilowat charging, maybe even more depending on Again, Watson 0:08:09.996 --> 0:08:14.316 asked Risks, gotcha, Well, let's move into the cars themselves. 0:08:14.356 --> 0:08:20.636 Now that's the short version of one hundred eight slide presentation. Well, 0:08:20.636 --> 0:08:25.676 we'll do that way. That'll be a detours episode. The 0:08:25.716 --> 0:08:28.716 first TV we're going to discuss is the electrified version 0:08:28.756 --> 0:08:31.756 of the four f one fifty full size pickup truck. 0:08:36.076 --> 0:08:40.596 So let's start with the biggie. The biggest news probably 0:08:40.876 --> 0:08:44.876 in the category since the Tesla models, and that is 0:08:45.556 --> 0:08:48.916 the Ford F one fifty Lightning. Now, the Ford f 0:08:48.996 --> 0:08:52.796 one fifty. The truck is sort of a car company 0:08:52.956 --> 0:08:56.116 unto itself. They sell more of these things than any 0:08:56.156 --> 0:09:00.756 other vehicle in the US, and so there's room within 0:09:01.716 --> 0:09:06.996 the f one fifty universe four things like a raptor 0:09:07.556 --> 0:09:11.116 four things like a lightning, because there's no real average 0:09:11.156 --> 0:09:14.996 flyn fifty buyer. And so I found it's sort of 0:09:14.996 --> 0:09:19.996 fascinating brand management that they decided to go into a 0:09:20.116 --> 0:09:24.156 category that's historically, you know, the average American truck buyers 0:09:24.676 --> 0:09:29.476 historically a little hostile to evs, and they like towing capability, 0:09:29.556 --> 0:09:32.036 and they like big vas and stuff like that. So 0:09:32.356 --> 0:09:36.316 I found it really interesting to see Ford make this move. 0:09:36.676 --> 0:09:40.076 And what happened was they're getting new sorts of buyers. 0:09:40.076 --> 0:09:42.876 They're getting a lot of women buyers. They're really over 0:09:42.956 --> 0:09:46.516 indexing on women buyers because a lot of women buyers 0:09:46.556 --> 0:09:49.636 claim that they hate gas stations, they feel vulnerable there, 0:09:49.996 --> 0:09:52.236 and so they'd rather charge this thing at home. So 0:09:53.356 --> 0:09:56.596 really really interesting vehicle. What's your take on the fund 0:09:56.636 --> 0:10:01.596 fifty Lightning. I think it's fascinating that Ford decided to 0:10:01.636 --> 0:10:05.916 go that way after introducing their first real EV, the 0:10:06.036 --> 0:10:11.956 Mustang Makie. They dived right into their crown jewel line. 0:10:11.516 --> 0:10:15.116 The F series line makes for a prodigious amount of 0:10:15.156 --> 0:10:18.596 money and they make a million ish of them every year. 0:10:19.716 --> 0:10:23.956 The fact that they were able to make an F 0:10:24.156 --> 0:10:29.676 one fifty that is both a believable F one fifty truck, 0:10:30.756 --> 0:10:33.396 and if I heard one thing in the launch over 0:10:33.476 --> 0:10:37.836 and over, it was it can't be weird. They've made 0:10:37.836 --> 0:10:39.716 a truck that isn't weird. You look at it and 0:10:39.756 --> 0:10:43.476 you go, yep, that's an F one fifty. But it 0:10:43.556 --> 0:10:48.556 has an electric powertrain, It has range that is real 0:10:48.756 --> 0:10:53.396 and reasonable for the way Americans use. They have towing capability, 0:10:54.156 --> 0:10:58.556 but most important, it is in many ways a better 0:10:59.076 --> 0:11:02.516 F one fifty than anything else in the line. It 0:11:02.556 --> 0:11:06.276 has the is it called the power front Mega trunk? 0:11:06.356 --> 0:11:08.836 I forget they have some brand name for this. CHI 0:11:09.196 --> 0:11:12.596 thought the front. Actually I avoid using the F word, 0:11:12.676 --> 0:11:17.236 but as you wish, but this, you know, open the 0:11:17.236 --> 0:11:20.876 hood and there's this gigantic space that's lockable so you 0:11:20.876 --> 0:11:23.036 can put tools in it that you can't leave in 0:11:23.076 --> 0:11:26.996 the bed. And it has all independent suspension, so it 0:11:27.116 --> 0:11:29.876 rides far better than any other F one fifty And 0:11:30.236 --> 0:11:33.356 people don't look at you weird because it's not a 0:11:33.476 --> 0:11:38.956 weird truck. And there are ancillaries to being a large 0:11:38.956 --> 0:11:42.956 battery pack on wheels, like you can power your house again, 0:11:43.036 --> 0:11:46.276 a lot of asterisks there. But Ford, I think was 0:11:46.316 --> 0:11:51.756 really surprised how much people took to this notion of oh, 0:11:51.796 --> 0:11:55.596 if I have an EV, I actually have backup energy 0:11:56.516 --> 0:11:59.516 as a swap out for my Honda generator. And I 0:11:59.596 --> 0:12:01.996 know some of you in Michigan have told me fairly 0:12:02.036 --> 0:12:04.436 frequently that the power goes off there. I have the 0:12:04.476 --> 0:12:07.676 same problem up the mountain and the Catskills. And so 0:12:08.116 --> 0:12:11.756 that's a material benefit of an EV that doesn't come 0:12:12.156 --> 0:12:16.836 from a gasoline vehicle. So they have not only made 0:12:16.836 --> 0:12:21.916 an F one fifty that is electric believable and desirable, 0:12:23.636 --> 0:12:26.876 they have gotten a bucket load of people buying them, 0:12:27.396 --> 0:12:32.716 and the new buyers some of their existing buyers. But fleets, 0:12:33.516 --> 0:12:38.236 because the lifetime cost per mile of an electric vehicle 0:12:38.436 --> 0:12:42.996 is so much lower than gasoline and especially diesel, that 0:12:43.116 --> 0:12:45.916 a lot of fleets are looking hard and saying, you 0:12:45.956 --> 0:12:48.716 know what, No, for the truck that goes from San 0:12:48.716 --> 0:12:52.996 Francisco to New Orleans can't do electric right now. But 0:12:53.796 --> 0:12:57.356 all of our local fleets think a utility truck or something. 0:12:57.836 --> 0:13:01.436 All of those they know how long they drive. The 0:13:01.516 --> 0:13:05.036 F one fifty electric is perfect there, and Ford has 0:13:05.076 --> 0:13:10.036 been swamped with demand. Oh yeah, we're going forty five 0:13:10.076 --> 0:13:13.036 miles in a day. There's so much excess capacity in 0:13:13.076 --> 0:13:17.836 that battery, you know, and that energy cost versus gas 0:13:17.876 --> 0:13:20.116 in that scenario or a lot a lot lower. But 0:13:20.156 --> 0:13:22.476 it must be said that if you want to buy 0:13:22.476 --> 0:13:25.916 the big battery pack in this F one fifty, it's 0:13:25.956 --> 0:13:29.436 really expensive. It's like another ten grand. We had one 0:13:30.156 --> 0:13:33.436 here to test and it was ninety four thousand dollars. 0:13:33.516 --> 0:13:36.196 And if I'm going to spend ninety about the price 0:13:36.236 --> 0:13:39.516 of a King Ranch, right, yeah, but the King Ranch 0:13:39.636 --> 0:13:42.356 doesn't have that play school interior. You know. That's like 0:13:42.876 --> 0:13:45.956 you know, off gassing, and it's the interior on these 0:13:46.156 --> 0:13:48.956 on these vehicles is like not a ninety four thousand 0:13:48.956 --> 0:13:52.956 dollars interior. And you know, I think four interiors are 0:13:52.996 --> 0:13:56.556 a real week point. And I would be pissed if 0:13:56.596 --> 0:14:00.116 I spent ninety four grand on an F one fifty 0:14:00.156 --> 0:14:04.156 and I had that you know, like lego style interior 0:14:04.196 --> 0:14:06.676 that they got going there. I'm curious to see overtime 0:14:06.796 --> 0:14:09.636 the knicks of truck buyers who by it for the 0:14:09.676 --> 0:14:13.916 cool points, the advanced technology, you know, first electric truck 0:14:13.916 --> 0:14:17.676 in their subdivision, that kind of thing, and how many 0:14:17.956 --> 0:14:22.036 expect luxury commends rate with the price point in a 0:14:22.116 --> 0:14:27.156 gasoline car. Tesla was able to do it. Ford arguably 0:14:27.436 --> 0:14:30.756 may be able to translate that into the truck world too. 0:14:30.796 --> 0:14:33.716 We'll see, Yeah, there's a lot of will see and 0:14:34.436 --> 0:14:36.876 we'll see what the second buyer set is for that 0:14:36.956 --> 0:14:40.156 if they continue to really go gangbusters or if there's 0:14:40.196 --> 0:14:42.476 just a lot of excitement about it. But you know, 0:14:42.516 --> 0:14:45.636 the interesting thing about evs is when you drive a 0:14:45.636 --> 0:14:48.076 lot of them back to back, you sort of get 0:14:48.076 --> 0:14:51.956 the feeling that the ones you're driving are essentially obsolete 0:14:52.076 --> 0:14:56.236 because the next generation of the vehicle that you're driving 0:14:56.316 --> 0:14:58.636 is going to have more range, it's going to charge 0:14:58.676 --> 0:15:02.596 more quickly, so you're still on the sort of sharp 0:15:02.716 --> 0:15:06.316 part of the curve with a lot of EV tech, 0:15:06.516 --> 0:15:08.836 I would agree with that. You know, the analogy is 0:15:09.156 --> 0:15:12.236 where between a conventional automobile and a phone. I think 0:15:12.276 --> 0:15:15.996 how often we replace our phones. But it is my 0:15:16.236 --> 0:15:20.956 hope that some of that advance comes if and when 0:15:20.996 --> 0:15:24.636 the car industry stabilizes after the shortages resolve, and we've 0:15:24.676 --> 0:15:27.996 been saying this for three years now, that some of 0:15:28.036 --> 0:15:30.036 that advance will be used to bring the price down 0:15:31.516 --> 0:15:34.556 so that in fact, instead of sort of a I 0:15:34.596 --> 0:15:37.476 don't know, fifty thousand dollars average or something for an EV, 0:15:37.996 --> 0:15:42.236 it might be thirty five. And certainly GM has aspirations 0:15:42.316 --> 0:15:47.116 toward that. We'll see when and how it happens. Before 0:15:47.116 --> 0:15:49.316 we get to the GM product, I want to talk 0:15:49.316 --> 0:15:52.956 about another vehicle that I found super great, super interesting, 0:15:53.276 --> 0:15:57.476 and another sort of under the radar EV if you will. 0:16:01.276 --> 0:16:05.996 That would be the BMWi four electric sedan, available in 0:16:06.076 --> 0:16:09.556 two single motor rear wheel drive trims that E Drive 0:16:09.636 --> 0:16:13.196 thirty five and the E Drive forty, and one dual 0:16:13.276 --> 0:16:16.636 motor all wheel drive trim, my favorite I four, the 0:16:16.916 --> 0:16:31.196 M fifty. That's when we come back. The BMW I 0:16:31.556 --> 0:16:37.156 four exists within the body of the BMW four series 0:16:37.196 --> 0:16:40.076 Grand coupe, so it looks just like a sort of 0:16:40.116 --> 0:16:44.716 normal four door coupe whatever that means that BMW makes. 0:16:44.796 --> 0:16:49.876 But this thing is proof that all the great engineers 0:16:49.916 --> 0:16:53.996 of BMW have been transferred to their electric vehicles because 0:16:53.996 --> 0:16:56.876 this thing is it rides better than an M three, 0:16:56.996 --> 0:17:01.356 it's quicker than an M three in the M forty trim, 0:17:01.356 --> 0:17:03.596 and it gets decent range. In this car I think 0:17:03.756 --> 0:17:06.916 is so well executed and so great it makes me 0:17:06.956 --> 0:17:11.556 like BMW's again. What's what's your take on the I four? Historically, 0:17:11.676 --> 0:17:16.676 BMW's interesting because their first EV was this massively complicated, 0:17:16.836 --> 0:17:21.876 highly engineered, extremely efficient car that Americans never really wanted 0:17:21.876 --> 0:17:27.796 to buy, which is a small hatchback the three, based 0:17:27.836 --> 0:17:30.236 on the bet the batteries were going to stay expensive forever. 0:17:30.996 --> 0:17:34.116 That turned out to be absolutely not true. BMW in 0:17:34.196 --> 0:17:37.836 twenty sixteen totally corrected and said right, no more specialized 0:17:37.876 --> 0:17:41.556 cars were just going to make it as a power train. 0:17:41.996 --> 0:17:45.396 It may have a battery, but otherwise it's totally, completely, 0:17:46.076 --> 0:17:52.476 absolutely just like your gasoline car. Other makers from other 0:17:52.516 --> 0:17:56.116 places don't do that so much necessarily. I like the 0:17:56.196 --> 0:18:00.156 I four For whatever reason, I found it much more 0:18:00.196 --> 0:18:05.716 convincing as an EV in its higher end two motor trim, 0:18:05.796 --> 0:18:10.156 the fifty, rather than the forty. Maybe it's because I've 0:18:10.236 --> 0:18:16.876 driven so many evs. The forty didn't feel significantly better 0:18:16.916 --> 0:18:19.636 than a bunch of sort of midrange evs to me, 0:18:19.756 --> 0:18:25.356 But the fifty was clearly the BMW you mentioned single 0:18:25.356 --> 0:18:28.116 motor versus dual motor. If you want to make an 0:18:28.156 --> 0:18:31.676 EV all wheel drive, you just put a motor on 0:18:31.716 --> 0:18:35.676 an axle, right, So these ifs are rear wheel drive, 0:18:35.916 --> 0:18:39.156 rear motored vehicles in their kind of entry level forms, 0:18:39.196 --> 0:18:42.516 the thirty five and the forty, and then you make 0:18:42.556 --> 0:18:45.396 it all wheel drive by putting another motor on the 0:18:45.436 --> 0:18:50.516 front axle. Absolutely convenient. And it actually one piece of 0:18:50.556 --> 0:18:53.836 trivia which I'll keep to one sentence, is there's an 0:18:53.876 --> 0:18:57.236 EV coming out that has a front wheel drive version, 0:18:57.476 --> 0:19:00.756 a rear oil drive version, and an all wheel drive version. 0:19:00.916 --> 0:19:04.356 You can put the motor on either both ends, and 0:19:04.636 --> 0:19:08.036 there are reasons for doing each of those things. Evs 0:19:08.076 --> 0:19:11.156 are interesting because people are rearranging the shape of the 0:19:11.276 --> 0:19:16.076 car and taking advantage of the smaller power train with 0:19:16.236 --> 0:19:18.516 a battery under the cabin. Or some of them are 0:19:18.756 --> 0:19:23.156 BMW is not BMW has the exact same proportions as 0:19:23.156 --> 0:19:31.396 the gasoline car, but I like the I four the 0:19:31.396 --> 0:19:34.796 The German approach to evs has been interesting because they 0:19:34.836 --> 0:19:37.316 were really late to the game, so were the Americans, 0:19:37.436 --> 0:19:42.076 but there were some some expeditions on the American side, 0:19:42.636 --> 0:19:45.636 with the exception of Tesla, but that's its own show, 0:19:45.636 --> 0:19:50.676 if not its own series. Oh yeah, absolutely, But no, 0:19:50.756 --> 0:19:53.876 it's a great driver. It does what a BMW should 0:19:53.916 --> 0:19:58.396 do and has the benefit of being really quiet, silky smooth, 0:19:59.396 --> 0:20:02.076 just all the things that you want a luxury car 0:20:02.116 --> 0:20:07.196 to do. Low noise, very very quick acceleration. You know, 0:20:07.596 --> 0:20:11.556 luxury and performance are sort of intertwined now in the 0:20:11.636 --> 0:20:15.556 public mind, I think the buying mind and the ipord 0:20:15.636 --> 0:20:19.556 does that really really well? Agreed. Yeah, you know, you 0:20:19.596 --> 0:20:22.956 also raised a good point about the package itself, Like 0:20:23.436 --> 0:20:26.556 you don't have big engine up front with a transmission 0:20:26.716 --> 0:20:31.676 attached to it, the battery, the energy storage is really 0:20:31.676 --> 0:20:35.676 in the floor and situated between the axles, so you 0:20:35.716 --> 0:20:38.916 have this really nice low center of gravity height that's 0:20:38.996 --> 0:20:42.836 great physically for the car. It helps it handle really 0:20:42.876 --> 0:20:49.836 really well. So the sort of packaging scenario, the envelope 0:20:49.836 --> 0:20:51.596 of the car, even though it might be the same, 0:20:52.236 --> 0:20:57.076 is really really different underneath, and that allows certain manufacturers 0:20:57.076 --> 0:21:00.116 to really play with it because if all your energy 0:21:00.156 --> 0:21:02.316 storage is in the flour and you have these two 0:21:03.636 --> 0:21:07.356 motors on the axles, you can change the interior dimensions 0:21:07.356 --> 0:21:10.276 of the vehicle. You can play with the space and 0:21:10.316 --> 0:21:13.556 the proportion of the thing. And the next vehicle I 0:21:13.596 --> 0:21:16.156 want to talk about, I think, does that really really well. 0:21:18.396 --> 0:21:21.916 I'm talking about the Hyundai Ionic five. And there are 0:21:21.916 --> 0:21:25.756 three ways to get it. Single motor rear drive format, 0:21:26.556 --> 0:21:29.836 two motor all wheel drive trim, or with the long 0:21:29.956 --> 0:21:33.196 range single motor setup good for more than three hundred 0:21:33.276 --> 0:21:38.316 miles on a full charge. Now, if you look at 0:21:38.316 --> 0:21:40.996 it in pictures, it looks like it's the size of 0:21:40.996 --> 0:21:43.836 a VW Golf. And I think vehicles that are really 0:21:43.876 --> 0:21:47.876 really well proportioned look smaller in photos than they do 0:21:47.956 --> 0:21:52.276 in real life. And conversely, vehicles with bad proportions, bad 0:21:52.276 --> 0:21:56.316 stylistic proportions look bigger in photos than they do in 0:21:56.356 --> 0:22:01.556 real life. So this Hyundai Ionic five, this thing has 0:22:01.556 --> 0:22:05.316 a wheelbase that's larger than the Palisade three row suv. 0:22:05.796 --> 0:22:09.316 It looks like a small compact, but it's really really 0:22:09.356 --> 0:22:12.716 interestingly packaged, and it's styled in a really really cool way. 0:22:12.916 --> 0:22:15.276 It sort of looks like if you know, the launch 0:22:15.316 --> 0:22:19.876 a Delta integrally hatchback from your it looks like a 0:22:19.916 --> 0:22:23.996 Minecraft version of that. It's sort of like a it 0:22:24.036 --> 0:22:26.476 was sort of the future we were promised in the eighties, 0:22:26.596 --> 0:22:29.476 you know, very very cool sort of eight bits styling, 0:22:30.716 --> 0:22:33.916 really really tremendous road presence. When you see this thing 0:22:33.916 --> 0:22:35.756 in the road, like what the hell is at and 0:22:35.836 --> 0:22:38.556 it's big inside, and it's quick, and it's got that 0:22:39.036 --> 0:22:43.276 eight hundred volt charging architecture that we talked about earlier. 0:22:43.556 --> 0:22:45.996 This thing, to me is just such a home run 0:22:46.476 --> 0:22:50.236 all the way around, even if the interior, in keeping 0:22:50.276 --> 0:22:54.116 with the eighties theme, looks like one of those cubical firms. 0:22:54.716 --> 0:22:57.716 You know, I don't think the interior is quite that bad, 0:22:57.756 --> 0:22:59.956 but you drive a lot more high end cars than 0:22:59.996 --> 0:23:03.716 I do. Let's got that like, you know, that grayish 0:23:03.796 --> 0:23:06.516 fabric and it just sort of looks like you're you're 0:23:06.556 --> 0:23:10.436 working for IBM. Well, there is there is this trope that, oh, 0:23:10.476 --> 0:23:13.476 you're driving electric car, it has no emission, so you 0:23:13.516 --> 0:23:17.036 have to use all sustainable materials, and a lot of 0:23:17.356 --> 0:23:21.276 a lot of vehicles, regardless of electric or gasoline, do 0:23:21.396 --> 0:23:26.476 actually use sustainable materials? Gotcha? Now you hear a lot 0:23:26.516 --> 0:23:31.396 of EV skeptics say, well, yeah, the cars themselves are 0:23:31.516 --> 0:23:35.836 zero emissions, but the round trip on the energy is 0:23:35.836 --> 0:23:39.676 pretty dirty because in this country, two thirds of our 0:23:40.516 --> 0:23:44.516 electricity is produced from coal or natural gas. So if 0:23:44.516 --> 0:23:48.796 you're driving the EV, you're driving a coal or natural 0:23:48.796 --> 0:23:52.156 gas powered car two thirds of the time. We call 0:23:52.276 --> 0:23:56.556 this the coal tailpipe argument. It is categorically false. And 0:23:56.676 --> 0:24:00.396 here's why. In the US, with the latest data from 0:24:00.436 --> 0:24:04.676 the Department of Energy, coal is only twenty percent of 0:24:04.716 --> 0:24:09.196 our generation mix, and it is being replaced by a 0:24:09.276 --> 0:24:13.516 mix of renewables or far far, far more efficient and 0:24:13.516 --> 0:24:19.076 lower carbon natural gas generation. Even on the dirtiest grid 0:24:19.236 --> 0:24:22.596 in North America. An electric car has the carbon footprint 0:24:22.636 --> 0:24:26.596 of a forty mile per gallon passenger car, and you 0:24:26.636 --> 0:24:29.396 will notice that we sell very few of those these days. Yeah, 0:24:29.436 --> 0:24:32.836 that's true, but that's not exactly apples to apples, because 0:24:32.876 --> 0:24:38.876 the well to wheel on an EV includes the mining energy, 0:24:39.876 --> 0:24:44.756 which is significant and done properly. Those wells to wheels 0:24:44.756 --> 0:24:48.876 comparisons include not only the energy, but also the manufacturing 0:24:48.916 --> 0:24:52.876 burden of the car. So an EV definitely has more 0:24:52.996 --> 0:24:57.516 what they call embedded carbon to build it, but that 0:24:57.836 --> 0:25:02.996 is fairly quickly offset depending on the vehicle, how big 0:25:02.996 --> 0:25:06.636 its battery is and so forth. It's from fifteen to 0:25:06.836 --> 0:25:11.876 forty thousand miles where you cross, and because it's using 0:25:12.076 --> 0:25:17.316 so much less energy per mile, everything after that is great, 0:25:17.796 --> 0:25:21.276 and so we're drying the dirtiness down. Yeah, exactly. So 0:25:21.556 --> 0:25:25.196 no question that battery electric cars have more carbon embedded. 0:25:25.476 --> 0:25:30.156 But as the grids that they are charging decarbonize, an 0:25:30.156 --> 0:25:33.076 electric car gets cleaner per miyath. And you can't say 0:25:33.076 --> 0:25:36.636 that about gasoline. Grids all over the world are moving 0:25:36.676 --> 0:25:39.796 to more renewables. They're swapping out coal for natural gas, 0:25:40.836 --> 0:25:45.796 and so electric cars over their lifetime get continually cleaner. 0:25:46.156 --> 0:25:48.916 But what I will say is I think Hyundai has 0:25:48.996 --> 0:25:56.436 hit a good balance between completely duplicating a conventional interior 0:25:56.436 --> 0:26:00.236 set of controls and going off on the far end, 0:26:00.356 --> 0:26:02.676 as Tesla has done with the Model three and Model 0:26:02.876 --> 0:26:06.276 Y and some of the other startups have where in fact, 0:26:06.316 --> 0:26:09.356 to do very simple, basic quick things you have to 0:26:09.436 --> 0:26:15.476 go into menus and screens and sort of expand or 0:26:15.556 --> 0:26:18.116 drop down or find an option, which I think is 0:26:18.916 --> 0:26:22.636 not only annoying and adiotic, but dangerous. I think Hunday 0:26:22.716 --> 0:26:26.516 hit the right balance in terms of it's got knobs 0:26:26.516 --> 0:26:30.636 for the thing you expect knobs for. My grumble about 0:26:30.636 --> 0:26:34.436 the Rivian is that you can't adjust the air events 0:26:35.116 --> 0:26:39.796 without going which I just ridiculous, idiotic. So you can 0:26:39.836 --> 0:26:41.436 adjust the air events on the hunday and so on. 0:26:41.876 --> 0:26:45.516 But it has a lot of the features that you 0:26:45.556 --> 0:26:49.396 will use less or you will need to find in 0:26:49.916 --> 0:26:52.756 a decent menu structure to my way of things. Yeah, 0:26:52.876 --> 0:26:57.236 it does have great user interface and Hyundai Kia Genesis products. 0:26:57.276 --> 0:26:59.036 If you want to get to the map, there's a 0:26:59.076 --> 0:27:00.636 button for the map. If you want to get to 0:27:00.636 --> 0:27:02.916 the radio, there's a button for the radio. There's a 0:27:02.996 --> 0:27:06.076 volume knob, there's a seek button. And one of the 0:27:06.116 --> 0:27:11.036 coolest adaptations from a convention no internal combustion car to 0:27:11.316 --> 0:27:15.076 the Ionic five are the so called shift panels on 0:27:15.116 --> 0:27:19.556 the steering wheel. Now in Antic five they don't control 0:27:19.676 --> 0:27:22.756 any gear set, but what they do is increase the 0:27:22.836 --> 0:27:27.756 amount increase or decrease the amount of regenerative braking. And 0:27:27.836 --> 0:27:31.236