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Speaker 1: When I was in college, I was having the psychedelic

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Speaker 1: experiences during lecture.

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Speaker 2: Oh really you took you took psychedelics before class.

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Speaker 3: That's amazing, But what did that do for your learning experience?

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Speaker 1: The lecture lasted about seven hours longer than it actually

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Speaker 1: never did it again.

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Speaker 3: Oh that is a Remember.

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Speaker 1: I had an art history lecture that I went to

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Speaker 1: just like not like really fun, but I took. I

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Speaker 1: took a couple of bites of some mushrooms before I

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Speaker 1: went into class, and I could have swore the thing

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Speaker 1: was going like all day, that is amazing. And then

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Speaker 1: I was like this is not great. I'm not in

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Speaker 1: my mind for a yeah, but pardon me. Was like

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Speaker 1: do the fucking art role and like you're looking at

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Speaker 1: this art and like a trip in and ship and no,

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Speaker 1: I was, so this is so interesting.

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Speaker 4: My favorite class in college was called the Philosophy of

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Speaker 4: Art and Criticism, and we had a teacher who kind

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Speaker 4: of fucked with the student the very first day because

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Speaker 4: this student was very not about the debate version of class,

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Speaker 4: Like he had a very narrow mindset and he was

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Speaker 4: trying to tell us what art is and what it

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Speaker 4: isn't and the teacher was like, uh so, it's funny

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Speaker 4: how like you don't really notice anything until you point

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Speaker 4: out a flaw. And he's like, do you notice the

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Speaker 4: chair you're sitting in right now? And he's like no,

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Speaker 4: He's like yeah, because there's nothing wrong with it. He's like,

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Speaker 4: do you're not you're telling me what?

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Speaker 3: What is art?

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Speaker 1: What is an art? What makes that chair a chair?

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Speaker 4: And then he kind of just kept blowing this kid's

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Speaker 4: mind because every time he came up with some sort

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Speaker 4: of rule, he would like talk around it, and the

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Speaker 4: kid as he was leaving, he's like, I feel like

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Speaker 4: I fucked up?

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Speaker 1: Am I tripping or something? And he was just like

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Speaker 1: really questioning everything.

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Speaker 3: He was like, that's amazing. Yeah, he was just describing

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Speaker 3: what's psychedelic about going to school?

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Speaker 2: Yeah?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, And that's actually why people are mad at universities.

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Speaker 3: They're mad at universities because they're too expensive and that's legitimate. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: And then conservatives are mad at universities because we actually

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Speaker 3: make people understand that there isn't one way.

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Speaker 2: No no, no, no, no, you need to knock that

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Speaker 2: shit off. We really did no understanding. That's actually, but

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Speaker 2: what did your profess understanding by the way. Just speaking

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Speaker 2: of experiencing art on psychedelics. My friend had just sent

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Speaker 2: me a picture from when we took mushrooms and went

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Speaker 2: and saw the Vango Museum. And I've talked before about

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Speaker 2: the size of my khakis at this point in my life,

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Speaker 2: and I just need to I just need.

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Speaker 5: To show you, yo Jack taking up space.

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Speaker 1: Were like, that's fashionable, bro.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, so we got big.

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Speaker 1: I got like two or three pairs of pants, probably

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Speaker 1: that big.

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Speaker 3: You were taking up space.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, you were wearing barrels version of man spreading.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, but I was wearing I was wearing those like that.

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Speaker 2: They weren't designed like that. I was wearing like size forty,

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Speaker 2: like size forty khakis. If my belt broke, I was fucked. Like, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I need to find a barrel to wear for the

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Speaker 2: rest of your day.

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Speaker 6: Oh my god, my god, Hello the Internet, and welcome

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Speaker 6: to Season for twenty two, Episode three of dir daily Zeitgeist,

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Speaker 6: a production of iHeartRadio.

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Speaker 2: This is a podcast where we take a deep dive

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Speaker 2: into America's shared conscious through the day's news and culture.

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Speaker 2: We also have a new weekly history version of the

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Speaker 2: show dropping most Monday mornings, where we do a deep

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Speaker 2: dive into the history of a different icon. We just

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Speaker 2: did Elvis this pastor the Monday before with Chris Crofton.

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Speaker 2: We got Marilyn Monroe coming up on Monday. That's a

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Speaker 2: super fun episode with Blair Saki. You can look for

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Speaker 2: those episodes on Mondays with Icon in the title they

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Speaker 2: never get old. You can listen to them anytime. It

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Speaker 2: is Thursday, January twenty second, twenty twenty six.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's National Pope Day, National sanctity If hold on,

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Speaker 1: let me make sure this isn't like a pro life thing, yep,

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Speaker 1: it is. Never mind. See, I know how to clock them.

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Speaker 2: I know what.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, of human life.

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Speaker 3: Like that.

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Speaker 1: I don't like that where we go.

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Speaker 2: Into human life, not that kind of human life.

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Speaker 1: Only you've been clocked. Sorry. It's also, hey, I can

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Speaker 1: get behind this National Blonde Brownie Day. Okay, there we go.

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Speaker 1: Let's keep it too dots and baked goods. Shout out

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Speaker 1: to those.

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Speaker 2: Shout out to those. Shout out the blondie man, because

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Speaker 2: because the blondie sometimes they will they'll get real creative.

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Speaker 2: They'll get you'll get a ribbon of caramel in there.

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Speaker 2: Yeah yeah, yeah, chunks of chocolate. They feel like they

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Speaker 2: need to overcompensate for the fact that it's blonde, and

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Speaker 2: I'm here for it.

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Speaker 1: Mm hmm.

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Speaker 2: My name is Jack O'Brien aka Potatoes O'Brien, and I'm

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Speaker 2: thrilled to be joined as always by my co host,

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Speaker 2: mister Miles.

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Speaker 1: Grass Miles Gray Hey, the show gun with no gun,

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Speaker 1: the Lord of Lankersham North Alle. It's very own Hitdayoh noh,

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Speaker 1: thank you so much for having.

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Speaker 2: Me rotating the show done.

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Speaker 1: With no rotator cuff. Yeah, my rotator cuff is. Look again,

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Speaker 1: this is what I do because this is what I

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Speaker 1: gig's good for, because we all have like physical issues,

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Speaker 1: just some I just need some some just some good

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Speaker 1: shoulder routines. You know. My scapula rotator cuff area feeling tight. Okay,

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Speaker 1: so send me your send me your fucking tips and tricks.

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Speaker 2: I will need some help with the scap Yeah exactly.

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Speaker 2: I'm Miles and I we're comparing notes on sleeping sleeping injuries.

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Speaker 2: Yeah from sleep, you know what I mean.

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Speaker 1: I'm the scap man, bitty bit.

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Speaker 2: Miles. We're thrilled to be joined in our third seat

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Speaker 2: by an English professor at the University of Wisconsin Madison,

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Speaker 2: where he teaches courses in queer and feminist theory, American

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Speaker 2: cultural studies, and LGBTQ literature. He's the author of The

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Speaker 2: New Mutants, Superheroes and the Radical Imagination of American Comics

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Speaker 2: and Queer Forms, and the host of the podcast Nerd

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Speaker 2: from the Future. It's Ramsey for Wow.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to be here.

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Speaker 3: Thank you so much for having me. And you got

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Speaker 3: that down to a t.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I did.

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Speaker 3: I No, Oh my god, it was gorgeous.

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Speaker 1: What that see, Jack? I told you.

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Speaker 3: People already get stuck at queer So the fact that

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Speaker 3: we got all the way through that, they're like, we're

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Speaker 3: a feminist.

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Speaker 1: What?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? So I love that, love that gorgeous pleasure.

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Speaker 2: To have you.

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Speaker 3: Thank you.

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Speaker 2: How are you doing? Where are you coming to us from?

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Speaker 3: You know what I'm doing all things considering. Yeah, I'm

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Speaker 3: in Wisconsin. It's about one degree here.

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Speaker 1: That's good.

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Speaker 3: Right, I've started the year off right, like you just said,

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Speaker 3: forty day too. It's gorgeous. I can go out. I

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Speaker 3: can go out now with practically shorts in this weather.

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Speaker 3: And I used to make fun of.

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Speaker 1: The students who did that. He's like, you guys are nuts.

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Speaker 3: And now thirteen years and I'm like, I get it. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: you just gotta like sometimes you're like I gotta get

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Speaker 3: to the store, Like I have to go. I have

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Speaker 3: to go to the gym. And the idea of layering

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Speaker 3: nineteen pieces of clothing and then having to remove all

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Speaker 3: of it is so onerous that you're just like, you

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Speaker 3: know what, I'm just gonna brave it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I didn't realize. I always wondered because as somebody

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Speaker 1: who grew up in California and goes to these places

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Speaker 1: and like seeing like people in shorts in Boston, like

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Speaker 1: what's wrong with these white walker people? I didn't realize

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Speaker 1: you can become one of them as well, because you're

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Speaker 1: from California.

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Speaker 3: Number one and number two. You need to protect your

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Speaker 3: heart and your neck, like that's what you wanted to

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Speaker 3: do to protect so and the core and so if

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Speaker 3: you have like a huge puffer jacket and some decent shoes,

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Speaker 3: I wouldn't sit. I wouldn't recommend wearing shorts. But like

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Speaker 3: in a pinch, yeah you're good. You can get neck

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Speaker 3: and heart, neck and heart face. You want to cover

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Speaker 3: like all of.

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Speaker 1: This your blood in Yeah, so your blood that's flowing.

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Speaker 3: You get really good at that you get really good

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Speaker 3: at like not releasing the heat off of your central

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Speaker 3: body like you want to tech that. That's essentially what

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Speaker 3: you're doing.

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Speaker 2: And that was talking about all those years ago. We

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Speaker 2: made the same exact joke at the same time Dolly Parton, however,

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Speaker 2: about protecting your heart not she says that, you know,

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Speaker 2: you just gotta let it out, you know, be that

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Speaker 2: freely incorrect. You've got Ramsey saying you got to protect

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Speaker 2: your heart.

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Speaker 3: Yea, yeah, yeah, about protect your heart and it's one

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Speaker 3: degree out.

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Speaker 2: That's yeah, okay, yeah, fair enough. Well, we're thrilled to

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Speaker 2: have you here. We're going to get to know you

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Speaker 2: a little bit better in a moment. First, we're going

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Speaker 2: to tell listeners a couple of things we're talking about.

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Speaker 2: We are going to, of course, what anytime we have

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Speaker 2: someone on who interacts with kids these days on a

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Speaker 2: regular basis, we do to just check in how they doing.

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Speaker 2: And also the rights attempt to take Star Trek for themselves.

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Speaker 2: They just they really they really want.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes they want it and don't want it. It's a

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Speaker 1: very odd relationship.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and then we'll talk about Donald Trump's Tuesday press conference,

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Speaker 2: his press conference in Davos, got a lot of the attention,

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Speaker 2: but he uh, right before that, Right before that one

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Speaker 2: was one that's also worth just like keeping an eye on,

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Speaker 2: because it seems like it caught the attention of a

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Speaker 2: lot of people who are wondering whether he is fit

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Speaker 2: for office. Amazingly, finally getting to that, Yeah, we're finally

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Speaker 2: getting to all of that plenty more. But first, Ramsey,

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Speaker 2: we do like to ask our guests, what is something

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Speaker 2: from your search history that is revealing about who you are?

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Speaker 3: How did they do that bear mauling scene in the Revenant.

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Speaker 3: I'm having a moment with Leonardo DiCaprio. It's sort of

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Speaker 3: my personal revenge against Timothy Schallomey's popularity is annoying me

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Speaker 3: because I think he's incredibly talented but also sort of

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Speaker 3: an annoying dude bro. And I love that Leonardo DiCaprio

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Speaker 3: is sort of like Timothy Chalomey, humble and with like

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Speaker 3: a long history. And so I'm just going back as

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Speaker 3: a media scholar and I'm like rewatching all of Leo's shit,

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Speaker 3: and he's astounding. I cannot believe that he did not

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Speaker 3: win the Academy Award for Once upon a Time in Hollywood.

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Speaker 3: So I went and I watched The Revenant, which destroyed

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Speaker 3: my life. I don't think I could ever watch that

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Speaker 3: movie ever again. And I was just I kept watching

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Speaker 3: him get maulled by a bear with my hands in

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Speaker 3: front of my eyes, and then I just I needed

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Speaker 3: to know how that was done, immediately followed by Leonardo

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Speaker 3: DiCaprio shirtless, because obviously I needed to see the body

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Speaker 3: that was maulled by the bear. You also really just

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Speaker 3: needed to be reminded that what I love about him

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Speaker 3: is that he's like a normal person who looks like

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Speaker 3: a normal middle aged man who does not look like

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Speaker 3: a bodybuilder in Hollywood, which got me to respect him

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Speaker 3: even more, and like, the guy is just like a person.

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Speaker 3: And I was just I was amazed. So that's my

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Speaker 3: recent search history.

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Speaker 2: You have to assume how they accomplish it was they

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Speaker 2: just had a bear mall somebody who was less famous

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Speaker 2: and beautiful.

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Speaker 3: I mean that I wish, I mean, which they had

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Speaker 3: done that, because then it would be really really realistic. No,

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Speaker 3: they actually they had a stut man covered in all

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Speaker 3: of these electro whatever these things that like you know

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Speaker 3: that they do when you're doing Avatar physically assault him Wow.

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Speaker 3: They used cgi to make him look like a bear. Wow,

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Speaker 3: which is why. And apparently the guy who did it's

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Speaker 3: like a fame. It's like a famous stunt person and

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Speaker 3: like every like, there was so many articles about it

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Speaker 3: when the movie came out that.

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Speaker 1: He is that stunt person's name. Yes, amazing from British Columbia.

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Speaker 1: Shout out the Canadians for malling us on.

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Speaker 2: The movie industry will just randomly like find a skill,

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Speaker 2: like I'm really good at being a bear, like the bear.

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Speaker 2: They'll find him and be like, buddy, do we have

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Speaker 2: the job for for him? This guy all he does

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Speaker 2: Apparently he was just studying bear movie. I mean, like

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Speaker 2: all the great performers do, like Andy Serkis was doing

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Speaker 2: that with like apes and things like that. So of

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Speaker 2: course you're gonna get the bear gig. You're gonna look

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Speaker 2: at some tape.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Do you think though, because of the era, right, because

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Speaker 1: of social media, we get way more Shalow May than

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Speaker 1: maybe we want a lot of the time. Sure, and

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Speaker 1: because of the time, what do you think, because like

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Speaker 1: you know, recently, Shallo May was in that wrapper video

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Speaker 1: with sd Kid. He was like wrapping with the sisty

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Speaker 1: Maybe over Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Like give us a break, honey, you give us a break.

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Speaker 3: We'll talk about this later, but you want to talk

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Speaker 3: about something that was overrated. Is just like celebrity culture.

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Speaker 3: It's like a board. So we have to live in

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Speaker 3: a world where like ninety nine percent of us are

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Speaker 3: like meaningless, nobody's regardless of what we've done, and then

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Speaker 3: there's like zero point zero zero zero two percent of

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Speaker 3: the people on this planet.

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Speaker 1: Are there lots? Yeah?

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Speaker 3: Right, we have to like constantly follow their life and

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Speaker 3: what do they have to say, and we're gonna quote them,

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Speaker 3: And then there's entire Instagram feeds that are about like,

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Speaker 3: you know, Jacob Elordi saying this random quote out of

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Speaker 3: context and like this is what he said about how

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Speaker 3: he drank Coca cola the other day. And it's like,

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Speaker 3: can you leave these people alone? Can I just like

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Speaker 3: watch a movie and enjoy it without a fucking press tour,

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Speaker 3: like as somebody who loves art and media, like leave

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Speaker 3: us out of it.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, do you think we celebrity like going back to

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Speaker 2: the idea that we like have these obsessions with like

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Speaker 2: star Trek and star Wars and stuff like that because

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Speaker 2: religion has gone away. Do you think we have obsession

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Speaker 2: with celebrity culture because we don't have like gossip about

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Speaker 2: our neighbors anymore, Like, oh, that's so interesting lonely.

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Speaker 3: And I think I'm gonna make a This is a

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Speaker 3: really big statement. I actually think what we do is

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Speaker 3: we yo yo in this culture between fantasies of democratic belonging,

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Speaker 3: like what is the X Men? What are star Trek?

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Speaker 3: These are stories about democratic belonging. They're about groups of

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Speaker 3: people who are incredibly diverse looking at each other and saying,

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Speaker 3: let's work together through our differences to change the world

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Speaker 3: for the better. And all of us, deep down we

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Speaker 3: love the idea of being connected to community with people

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Speaker 3: who are not like us. It is celebratory, it's beautiful,

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Speaker 3: it's amazing. It's also terrifying. It also requires a lot

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Speaker 3: of work, so it's really hard, it's really painful, And

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Speaker 3: celebrity culture is a kind of psychological compensation for the

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Speaker 3: difficulties of living that way. That says, but what if

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Speaker 3: instead of being in a collective, I was a god

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Speaker 3: above everyone and I was so special that everyone could

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Speaker 3: go fuck themselves. And I think, like we yo yo

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Speaker 3: between these two impulses where we're like we want to

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Speaker 3: be in community but also screw everybody, and by uplifting

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Speaker 3: certain people to the level of godhood, we get to

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Speaker 3: have like a projective fantasy that's like maybe I could

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Speaker 3: become like one of those people one day. Maybe, and

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Speaker 3: then we that we're democratizing it through social media, like

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Speaker 3: maybe I could become a social media influencer, et cetera.

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Speaker 3: And like it's an unsustainable, self destructive, awful process, and

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Speaker 3: it's much more fun to be in communion with others

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Speaker 3: where each of us can be special in our own

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Speaker 3: way at different moments, but where no single person is

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Speaker 3: elevated to the point of being everything. And so that's

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Speaker 3: kind of how I read it. But that's also because

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Speaker 3: I'm a democratic political theorist, Like, so I think of

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Speaker 3: everything in terms of, like how do we want to

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Speaker 3: arrange ourselves in public life? Like that's what we're talking

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Speaker 3: about when we're talking about democratic life. And so I

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Speaker 3: think like celebrity culture really reeks of our discomfort with

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Speaker 3: the idea that we live in a world with lots

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Speaker 3: of other people and maybe none of us are that special,

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Speaker 3: and so like we have to negotiate living with others

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Speaker 3: and we're like, but what if we could just escape

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Speaker 3: all of that.

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Speaker 2: I don't know. I haven't seen any negative consequences of

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Speaker 2: turning a single person into a god.

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Speaker 3: I mean, we talk about how it usually works out exactly.

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Speaker 2: It's really fun, Ramsey. What is something you think is underrated?

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Speaker 3: Growing up? Grow up? Everybody in this culture is a

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Speaker 3: baby child person. We really like the privilege of being

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Speaker 3: an American today is the idea of like, I don't

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Speaker 3: wanna like I don't want to grow up. I don't

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Speaker 3: want to mature. I don't have to change. Fuck off.

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Speaker 3: And I mean, like, aren't we all miserable? Aren't we exhausted?

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Speaker 3: Like he is so underrated to literally change and grow

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Speaker 3: and evolve in relationship to external stimuli, Like I would

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Speaker 3: love to encounter more adults who are fucking emotionally regulated,

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00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:38,359
Speaker 3: who like know how to communicate, who are not conflict avoidant,

336
00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:41,560
Speaker 3: like grow up. I just it is so we talk

337
00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:45,640
Speaker 3: constantly about therapy, culture, about optimization. Everybody's watching the Kuberman

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Speaker 3: Lab while literally not changing at all. And I'm like, girl,

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Speaker 3: if you can take an ice bath every day, maybe

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00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:56,480
Speaker 3: you could also be more emotionally kind to people. Maybe

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Speaker 3: you could grow and be like less jealous and less comptrolling.

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Speaker 1: Is I like to do these things because the internal

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Speaker 1: work is too daunting for me?

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Speaker 6: Yeah?

345
00:17:04,600 --> 00:17:05,439
Speaker 1: Just soak an.

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Speaker 3: So you know what, don't talk to people about it,

347
00:17:07,680 --> 00:17:09,720
Speaker 3: Like that's fine, Like if that's what you want to do, Like,

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00:17:09,800 --> 00:17:12,480
Speaker 3: don't talk about it, don't influence about it, like go

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Speaker 3: sit in your iback I bat. But I'm really coming

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Speaker 3: to a point where I'm like, you know what I

351
00:17:16,160 --> 00:17:18,719
Speaker 3: want to see. I want to see people in my

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Speaker 3: life and in the culture literally changing. Like I want

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Speaker 3: to see someone I don't see them for three years

354
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Speaker 3: and they come back and I'm like, wow, you really

355
00:17:26,560 --> 00:17:30,360
Speaker 3: did evolve, Like that's amazing. I think Americans collectively are

356
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Speaker 3: like we don't ever have to evolve. An I'm just like, okay, whatever.

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Speaker 1: Proof argument, Well, oh so what I'm going to be

358
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Speaker 1: a dinosaur and then turn into a chicken.

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Speaker 2: From dude, nobody calls miles of chicken crab. Yeah. I

360
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Speaker 2: like the point about like therapy culture, like Huberman Lab.

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Speaker 2: It's that there's an old joke about like somebody was

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Speaker 2: like telling their friend not to do cocaine because they

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00:18:03,720 --> 00:18:05,960
Speaker 2: had a bad personality, and so it was just going

364
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Speaker 2: to be like more of that exactly, and like I

365
00:18:08,560 --> 00:18:11,119
Speaker 2: feel like a lot of what people are doing is

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Speaker 2: just like optimizing their productivity of bad vibes. I am

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Speaker 2: off the charge to my ability to produce the selfish,

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Speaker 2: off putting energy.

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Speaker 3: I mean, we've talked about this a little bit, but

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Speaker 3: like I write about, my current research is about psychedelics

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00:18:27,520 --> 00:18:29,800
Speaker 3: and psychedelic healing and transformation. And I have a friend

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Speaker 3: who said something who works at a wellness institute, who said, honestly,

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Speaker 3: I'm very suspicious of the psychedelic renaissance because I know

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Speaker 3: a million people who've been doing LSD therapy for twenty

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Speaker 3: years and they're still total assholes. And like that's like

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Speaker 3: I thought that was such a beautiful statement because I

377
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Speaker 3: was reminded like, oh yeah, like the will to actually

378
00:18:51,560 --> 00:18:57,240
Speaker 3: transform has nothing to do with performative bullshit about optimizing

379
00:18:57,280 --> 00:19:00,280
Speaker 3: yourself and going to therapy and all of the those

380
00:19:00,400 --> 00:19:06,000
Speaker 3: tools only work if you're actually sincerely doing them in

381
00:19:06,200 --> 00:19:09,440
Speaker 3: order to evolve. And I think the fact that as

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00:19:09,440 --> 00:19:11,520
Speaker 3: a culture we're not able to look at ourselves and

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Speaker 3: be like, wow, we're really bad at actual behavioral change.

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Speaker 1: Look to me.

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Speaker 3: For me, this goes back to like I always say

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Speaker 3: this story, like I remember very very distinctly the first

387
00:19:21,080 --> 00:19:23,680
Speaker 3: time I went back to therapy in adulthood. I had

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Speaker 3: the first three sessions of this amazing gay mal therapist

389
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Speaker 3: and he looked at me. Brian Gill in Washington, DC.

390
00:19:28,960 --> 00:19:31,879
Speaker 3: If anyone's in DC, you should go. You need a therapist,

391
00:19:32,000 --> 00:19:34,560
Speaker 3: go to Brian Gil. He said to me something that

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00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:39,720
Speaker 3: was so powerful. He said, Wow, you are so smart

393
00:19:40,280 --> 00:19:44,520
Speaker 3: about your problems and you have so much insight and

394
00:19:44,560 --> 00:19:48,879
Speaker 3: you do so little action. He's like, you just learned

395
00:19:49,080 --> 00:19:52,080
Speaker 3: so much about your issues. Yeah, but he's like, when

396
00:19:52,080 --> 00:19:54,640
Speaker 3: are you going to actually match that with behavioral changes?

397
00:19:54,640 --> 00:19:56,919
Speaker 3: And I that struck me so deep because I was like,

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00:19:57,200 --> 00:20:01,160
Speaker 3: that goes against my values to only be thinking about

399
00:20:01,200 --> 00:20:03,439
Speaker 3: something and not doing something about it. Like, I don't

400
00:20:03,520 --> 00:20:05,520
Speaker 3: like that idea. And that was the beginning of a

401
00:20:05,600 --> 00:20:07,240
Speaker 3: huge journey for me where I was like, okay, girl,

402
00:20:07,320 --> 00:20:09,240
Speaker 3: like it's time for you to have learned to lesson

403
00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:13,959
Speaker 3: and to actually behave differently. So I think that's underrated.

404
00:20:14,720 --> 00:20:20,440
Speaker 2: Amazing, Wow, well said you like here like structure, and.

405
00:20:20,880 --> 00:20:22,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's because I'm a professor.

406
00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:23,199
Speaker 2: That's what we do.

407
00:20:23,240 --> 00:20:25,200
Speaker 3: That's why people should listen to us more often we

408
00:20:25,280 --> 00:20:26,160
Speaker 3: actually have a flow.

409
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Speaker 1: You talk like a teacher, like a book or something.

410
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Speaker 2: I can't believe, Brian, did you like that three three in?

411
00:20:37,440 --> 00:20:40,119
Speaker 3: I know, right, yeah, he was just like wow, he

412
00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:41,399
Speaker 3: was a hand gesture too.

413
00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:45,520
Speaker 1: It was since you were ready for that message though too.

414
00:20:45,840 --> 00:20:47,320
Speaker 1: Because of it, it's like, oh, you're not going to

415
00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:48,840
Speaker 1: be like and now I'm not going to go to

416
00:20:48,880 --> 00:20:52,040
Speaker 1: therapy for You're gonna talk about you know.

417
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Speaker 3: The thing is, guys, is like something that's fundamental about me.

418
00:20:55,040 --> 00:20:57,879
Speaker 3: Since you're getting to know me, I cannot live in

419
00:20:57,960 --> 00:21:01,159
Speaker 3: denial like that is something that's deeply ingrained in me.

420
00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:06,520
Speaker 3: Like any time I'm sitting there and I'm compulsively shopping online,

421
00:21:06,560 --> 00:21:08,800
Speaker 3: like I know it's a problem.

422
00:21:08,680 --> 00:21:09,679
Speaker 2: Right, Like you know what I mean.

423
00:21:09,720 --> 00:21:11,520
Speaker 3: I'm not saying I'm not allowed to shop, but I'm

424
00:21:11,520 --> 00:21:13,520
Speaker 3: like when it's compulsive, I'm like, this is a problem.

425
00:21:13,640 --> 00:21:17,440
Speaker 3: I will need to confront this issue soon soon, but

426
00:21:18,040 --> 00:21:21,119
Speaker 3: right now, yeah, Like I just like I'm aware that

427
00:21:21,200 --> 00:21:24,160
Speaker 3: things need to be dealt with. I'm not conflict avoidant

428
00:21:24,160 --> 00:21:25,560
Speaker 3: because I think that that it's going to come back

429
00:21:25,600 --> 00:21:26,919
Speaker 3: and blow up in my face and to me, like

430
00:21:27,000 --> 00:21:30,680
Speaker 3: growing up is essentially not living in denial and being

431
00:21:30,720 --> 00:21:32,920
Speaker 3: able to say like, wow, okay, everything has a time

432
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Speaker 3: and place, but like I got to wake the fuck

433
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Speaker 3: up and I have to confront this thing. And I

434
00:21:36,920 --> 00:21:39,560
Speaker 3: do think that we I mean, of course, we live

435
00:21:39,560 --> 00:21:43,480
Speaker 3: in a society that is obsessed with denial and it's

436
00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:46,760
Speaker 3: exhausting and boring and like we gotta move move forward.

437
00:21:47,160 --> 00:21:49,119
Speaker 2: What if this was a conversation that somebody had with

438
00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:50,600
Speaker 2: Donald Trump, like just once.

439
00:21:50,920 --> 00:21:53,639
Speaker 1: Just this is you tune it out so quick.

440
00:21:56,200 --> 00:21:57,680
Speaker 2: And then have this conversation with them.

441
00:21:59,359 --> 00:22:01,480
Speaker 3: But the thing is is that the Donald Trumps of

442
00:22:01,520 --> 00:22:05,879
Speaker 3: the world would not exist if early enough people intervened

443
00:22:05,880 --> 00:22:09,440
Speaker 3: and said, stop acting a fucking fool. Yeah, stop trying

444
00:22:09,480 --> 00:22:12,040
Speaker 3: to control people, stop behaving in this way. Like if

445
00:22:12,080 --> 00:22:15,480
Speaker 3: people did actually grow up together in this country where

446
00:22:15,480 --> 00:22:17,159
Speaker 3: we looked at each other, we're like, girl, like I

447
00:22:17,240 --> 00:22:20,040
Speaker 3: love you, but this is like not okay, this behavior

448
00:22:20,119 --> 00:22:23,359
Speaker 3: is crazy. The enabling of each other has brought us

449
00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:26,160
Speaker 3: to this place and none of us are happy, including

450
00:22:26,200 --> 00:22:28,280
Speaker 3: the people in power. So it's like, at what point

451
00:22:28,280 --> 00:22:30,879
Speaker 3: do we just go like, okay, girl, it's time to

452
00:22:30,960 --> 00:22:31,480
Speaker 3: get grown.

453
00:22:32,000 --> 00:22:34,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, but that's why they got to do psychedelics. Now

454
00:22:34,320 --> 00:22:36,120
Speaker 1: that's yeah, you know what I mean.

455
00:22:36,960 --> 00:22:41,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, it being a tool that you can use for

456
00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:45,240
Speaker 2: that like the fact that Silicon Valley billionaire has like

457
00:22:45,359 --> 00:22:48,600
Speaker 2: been doing journey work, oh my god, a decade and

458
00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:53,280
Speaker 2: like gotten to a place where they're like, so bunker.

459
00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:57,000
Speaker 3: The cumanon Shaman, that guy with the horns or whatever

460
00:22:57,119 --> 00:22:59,400
Speaker 3: and the painting on his face from January sixth, he's

461
00:22:59,440 --> 00:23:00,600
Speaker 3: like obsessed with LC.

462
00:23:00,920 --> 00:23:03,919
Speaker 1: Yeah, and he's running for governor. So hey, goob bless well,

463
00:23:03,960 --> 00:23:04,360
Speaker 1: there we go.

464
00:23:04,560 --> 00:23:06,119
Speaker 2: Let's take you a quick break. We'll come back. We'll

465
00:23:06,119 --> 00:23:20,320
Speaker 2: get your overrated and get into some stories. And we're back.

466
00:23:20,440 --> 00:23:21,000
Speaker 1: We're back.

467
00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:24,440
Speaker 2: And Ramsey, you've already given us the celebrity culture is overrated, but.

468
00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:26,280
Speaker 3: Let's add a layer.

469
00:23:26,880 --> 00:23:29,360
Speaker 2: I get the feeling that you got more. What's something

470
00:23:29,400 --> 00:23:30,280
Speaker 2: you take is overrated?

471
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:36,600
Speaker 3: The fantasy romance plot of heated rivalry okay, bad for us,

472
00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:39,600
Speaker 3: bad for us. I'm sorry. Everybody needs to get their

473
00:23:39,600 --> 00:23:43,360
Speaker 3: shit together. The idea of pursuing an emotionally avoidant slash

474
00:23:43,440 --> 00:23:46,239
Speaker 3: almost abusive person for ten years because they might end

475
00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:48,800
Speaker 3: up becoming your boyfriend in the last ten days is

476
00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:52,919
Speaker 3: psychotic and if you are grown to go back to

477
00:23:52,960 --> 00:23:56,840
Speaker 3: my first point about being grown underrated, you grow out

478
00:23:56,840 --> 00:23:59,440
Speaker 3: of the idea of pursuing people who are not available

479
00:23:59,480 --> 00:24:02,440
Speaker 3: and gay men and struggle with this more than anybody.

480
00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:04,880
Speaker 3: We're just like, oh my god, he's so hot, I'm

481
00:24:04,920 --> 00:24:09,080
Speaker 3: so digmatized, and I guess I'll just maybe have sex

482
00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:11,200
Speaker 3: with him twice a year and maybe one day we'll

483
00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:15,840
Speaker 3: get married. That's fully unhinged. It does not happen. If

484
00:24:15,880 --> 00:24:19,520
Speaker 3: it does happen, you will be divorced later. Like that

485
00:24:19,680 --> 00:24:21,960
Speaker 3: is like to me, I'm like, what's gonna happen after

486
00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:24,400
Speaker 3: season one? Real life is going to intervene if you're

487
00:24:24,400 --> 00:24:27,520
Speaker 3: gonna unfold the story over four seasons, like I'm sorry.

488
00:24:27,760 --> 00:24:30,000
Speaker 3: Like now they're gonna be at circuit parties, they're gonna

489
00:24:30,000 --> 00:24:32,200
Speaker 3: be doing drugs, they're gonna be dealing with people trying

490
00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:35,159
Speaker 3: to steal their man, like I'm sorry. Like the fantasy

491
00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:39,840
Speaker 3: plot is so praised, and it's like it's not serving us.

492
00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:42,720
Speaker 3: If the reason we're all obsessed with that romance fantasy

493
00:24:42,840 --> 00:24:45,919
Speaker 3: is because the dating pool sucks. That show is not

494
00:24:46,080 --> 00:24:50,320
Speaker 3: helping make the dating pool better. It's making people crazier

495
00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:53,360
Speaker 3: to believe in things that don't exist so that when

496
00:24:53,359 --> 00:24:55,760
Speaker 3: we go back into the dating pool, we keep behaving badly.

497
00:24:56,080 --> 00:24:57,520
Speaker 3: So I'm like, I was watching that show and I

498
00:24:57,560 --> 00:25:00,320
Speaker 3: was like, ah, you're not getting me. I was like, yes,

499
00:25:00,359 --> 00:25:04,639
Speaker 3: this is hot. I was like, but I'm not. I

500
00:25:04,680 --> 00:25:07,199
Speaker 3: am not, You're not. I was like fighting it. I

501
00:25:07,280 --> 00:25:09,199
Speaker 3: was like, you are trying to drag me back to

502
00:25:09,280 --> 00:25:13,600
Speaker 3: my little twenty two year old gay baby self wanting

503
00:25:13,680 --> 00:25:16,479
Speaker 3: things I cannot have that are bad for me. And

504
00:25:16,520 --> 00:25:17,640
Speaker 3: I was like, I will not do this.

505
00:25:17,920 --> 00:25:22,200
Speaker 1: Nope, you had the wisdom, You're the one persons on board.

506
00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:24,680
Speaker 3: No, I'm literally writing an essay about it. By the way,

507
00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:26,879
Speaker 3: it's a joke between my brother and I. He used

508
00:25:26,920 --> 00:25:28,040
Speaker 3: to actually make fun of me. He was like, why

509
00:25:28,040 --> 00:25:29,480
Speaker 3: don't you write an essay about it? And now it's like,

510
00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:30,760
Speaker 3: I'm like, I made living out of it.

511
00:25:32,680 --> 00:25:40,000
Speaker 5: About checking out, all right, let's uh, let's just talk

512
00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:43,800
Speaker 5: briefly about uh, well, what we refer to as kids

513
00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:44,440
Speaker 5: these days.

514
00:25:44,720 --> 00:25:50,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, learning in the world, chad GPT, phone and social

515
00:25:50,359 --> 00:25:54,199
Speaker 2: media addiction, porn addiction, the manisphere. I'm just curious to

516
00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:57,800
Speaker 2: hear from you as somebody who is in touch with

517
00:25:57,840 --> 00:26:02,040
Speaker 2: them on a regular basis. How they doing. We talked

518
00:26:02,200 --> 00:26:05,800
Speaker 2: hopefully earlier this year about like the phone ban in

519
00:26:06,160 --> 00:26:11,320
Speaker 2: high schools seeming to change people's behavior learning environments in

520
00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:15,119
Speaker 2: New York State. What do you say on your end Listen?

521
00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:18,280
Speaker 3: So many of the students I work with are the coolest,

522
00:26:18,440 --> 00:26:22,200
Speaker 3: most amazing, most inspiring, loving, amazing. I mean, I'm watching

523
00:26:22,200 --> 00:26:25,800
Speaker 3: my students get into law school at Harvard, become doctors,

524
00:26:26,320 --> 00:26:29,919
Speaker 3: go off and work for nonprofits direct rape crisis. I mean,

525
00:26:29,960 --> 00:26:34,359
Speaker 3: they're amazing. I'm just I'm amazed. This generation is a

526
00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:39,000
Speaker 3: really beautiful mixture of deeply socially and politically conscious and

527
00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:42,040
Speaker 3: also like good to themselves. They're like better to themselves,

528
00:26:42,440 --> 00:26:44,720
Speaker 3: they take care of themselves better, they rest, Like those

529
00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:48,440
Speaker 3: things I think are amazing. I think the problem is

530
00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:51,320
Speaker 3: is that they don't know the things that are bad

531
00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:54,720
Speaker 3: for them, and they don't actually know how to take

532
00:26:54,760 --> 00:26:57,439
Speaker 3: a break. I said once recently to someone that like

533
00:26:58,119 --> 00:27:01,240
Speaker 3: social media is like that abuse a boyfriend that you

534
00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:02,920
Speaker 3: know is not going to give you what you want,

535
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:04,560
Speaker 3: but every once in a while he's nice to you,

536
00:27:04,600 --> 00:27:06,320
Speaker 3: so you're like, oh my god, that felt so good,

537
00:27:06,359 --> 00:27:08,520
Speaker 3: so let me keep going back to it. And I

538
00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:13,080
Speaker 3: think as a generation they are responding in a dopamine

539
00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:15,800
Speaker 3: driven way to a variety of things that are bad

540
00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:18,600
Speaker 3: for them in the culture like AI. I will sit

541
00:27:18,640 --> 00:27:20,359
Speaker 3: and have a conversation with my students where I'm like,

542
00:27:20,359 --> 00:27:23,640
Speaker 3: why are you using AI? Like, let's be honest, You're

543
00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:26,639
Speaker 3: literally just allowing a machine to do your thinking for you,

544
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:29,680
Speaker 3: which is making you dumber, which is making you less

545
00:27:29,680 --> 00:27:32,679
Speaker 3: able to make like basic judgments about things like fucking groceries,

546
00:27:33,080 --> 00:27:36,239
Speaker 3: like that's a that's bad, And they honestly are like,

547
00:27:36,520 --> 00:27:38,920
Speaker 3: I kind of don't know. I don't know. It makes

548
00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:40,720
Speaker 3: me feel like I'm saving time. I'm like doing what

549
00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:44,480
Speaker 3: did you write a fucking book? What are you doing.

550
00:27:46,240 --> 00:27:49,320
Speaker 2: Writing or something? And watching the Huberman Lab to find

551
00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:51,080
Speaker 2: out more ways that I could save time.

552
00:27:51,400 --> 00:27:53,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, I was going out into sunlight.

553
00:27:53,560 --> 00:27:58,440
Speaker 1: Like cortisol right now exactly.

554
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:01,679
Speaker 3: And so what's is that when you actually have honest

555
00:28:01,680 --> 00:28:03,840
Speaker 3: conversations with them about like what are you doing? Like

556
00:28:03,840 --> 00:28:06,040
Speaker 3: look at your life, look at your choices, you know,

557
00:28:06,080 --> 00:28:08,040
Speaker 3: like what are you doing, They're just like, I actually

558
00:28:08,080 --> 00:28:10,320
Speaker 3: don't know why I'm doing that, And now that I

559
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:12,200
Speaker 3: think about it, like maybe it doesn't make that much sense.

560
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:16,520
Speaker 3: They are like they're very quick to be aware. But

561
00:28:16,640 --> 00:28:18,520
Speaker 3: this is not good for them. I don't know that

562
00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:21,960
Speaker 3: they have models of how not to do it because

563
00:28:22,000 --> 00:28:24,080
Speaker 3: the rest of us who are not grown to go

564
00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:27,480
Speaker 3: back to my old point, are not modeling for them

565
00:28:27,480 --> 00:28:32,119
Speaker 3: what it's like to actually make good decisions about taking

566
00:28:32,160 --> 00:28:34,199
Speaker 3: care of our mental well being in the face of

567
00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:36,879
Speaker 3: these things. So I think like they're stuck between a

568
00:28:36,960 --> 00:28:39,080
Speaker 3: rock and a hard place where they're sort of like

569
00:28:39,640 --> 00:28:41,800
Speaker 3: entering a society that's telling them like, you're never going

570
00:28:41,880 --> 00:28:43,600
Speaker 3: to get any of the things that you want. You're

571
00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:45,320
Speaker 3: not going to get a house, you're not going to

572
00:28:45,360 --> 00:28:46,960
Speaker 3: get more money, You're not gonna get all these things,

573
00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 3: and so of course you would want to turn to

574
00:28:49,120 --> 00:28:52,800
Speaker 3: social media and chat, GPT whatever for little moments of

575
00:28:52,960 --> 00:28:57,040
Speaker 3: joy when the really big goals feel out of reach.

576
00:28:57,760 --> 00:28:59,880
Speaker 3: So they are. It's not so much that the kids

577
00:28:59,880 --> 00:29:02,040
Speaker 3: are not all right. It's like the it's what gobor

578
00:29:02,120 --> 00:29:05,880
Speaker 3: Mate says, right, the holistic medical expert, like the culture

579
00:29:05,960 --> 00:29:07,480
Speaker 3: they're in is toxic.

580
00:29:07,800 --> 00:29:08,080
Speaker 2: Yesh.

581
00:29:08,160 --> 00:29:11,160
Speaker 3: Yeah, So they're trying to navigate that and they're doing

582
00:29:11,160 --> 00:29:15,440
Speaker 3: it in as best conditions as they can. But I

583
00:29:15,480 --> 00:29:18,560
Speaker 3: think what they're lacking the most truly like where they're

584
00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:23,720
Speaker 3: really really at a disadvantage. They need more intergenerational exchange

585
00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:28,680
Speaker 3: with smart, wise people like that is why they need

586
00:29:28,720 --> 00:29:31,080
Speaker 3: to go to school. That is why they need to

587
00:29:31,120 --> 00:29:34,880
Speaker 3: be in different kinds of social programs where they have

588
00:29:35,080 --> 00:29:38,000
Speaker 3: mentors who are older. They need to be in conversation

589
00:29:38,080 --> 00:29:39,880
Speaker 3: with people that have gone through what they've gone through

590
00:29:39,920 --> 00:29:43,040
Speaker 3: and said here's another path, right, here would be another way,

591
00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:45,680
Speaker 3: and we need to be talking to them because they

592
00:29:45,680 --> 00:29:48,479
Speaker 3: also have great ideas about social media addiction.

593
00:29:48,920 --> 00:29:51,360
Speaker 2: I know they were the first ones who, like, I

594
00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:54,400
Speaker 2: have younger cousins who were like, yeah, I've taken a

595
00:29:54,400 --> 00:29:56,560
Speaker 2: break from social media at a time when I was like,

596
00:29:56,680 --> 00:30:05,200
Speaker 2: oh what, huh w because it's an addictive exactly. Oh correct, Yeah,

597
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:06,960
Speaker 2: they knew it before other people.

598
00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:08,960
Speaker 1: Yeah, why do you think that because to your point

599
00:30:09,000 --> 00:30:11,240
Speaker 1: about like needing those interactions, why do you think that's

600
00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:14,520
Speaker 1: lack of what's the difference in terms of like, because

601
00:30:14,560 --> 00:30:18,320
Speaker 1: I think back of my own career professionally, personally, I

602
00:30:18,440 --> 00:30:21,600
Speaker 1: had those intersections and interactions with people that helped fucking

603
00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:24,200
Speaker 1: change my thing. But what is the difference? Is it

604
00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:28,440
Speaker 1: just because it's everything is so less person to person

605
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:30,880
Speaker 1: that that's going by the wayside or just culturally for them,

606
00:30:30,960 --> 00:30:34,880
Speaker 1: it's less of an interest to interact with older people.

607
00:30:34,920 --> 00:30:37,880
Speaker 3: And no, right, I think it's that's a great question.

608
00:30:38,080 --> 00:30:41,400
Speaker 3: My premonition based on what I see is that it

609
00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:45,080
Speaker 3: has a lot to do with the insolarity of digital worlds.

610
00:30:45,600 --> 00:30:47,760
Speaker 3: So like what they are on social media and in TikTok,

611
00:30:47,760 --> 00:30:54,120
Speaker 3: they're interacting with very limited demographics of viewership or people

612
00:30:54,120 --> 00:30:57,280
Speaker 3: of their own generation that like certain things. Yeah, and

613
00:30:57,360 --> 00:31:00,360
Speaker 3: combine that with an amazing amount of social anxiety. Like

614
00:31:00,440 --> 00:31:03,480
Speaker 3: most young people in gen Z believe that the majority

615
00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:05,880
Speaker 3: of their interactions with adults are interactions where they are

616
00:31:05,920 --> 00:31:09,840
Speaker 3: being judged on their performance, Like the amount of work

617
00:31:09,880 --> 00:31:11,800
Speaker 3: you guys, that I have to do in a classroom

618
00:31:12,080 --> 00:31:14,200
Speaker 3: to remind my students that the grade that they're going

619
00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:18,520
Speaker 3: to get at the end really means nothing. Like the

620
00:31:18,760 --> 00:31:22,360
Speaker 3: experience of meeting in a group once a week for

621
00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:24,680
Speaker 3: two and a half hours and talking about ideas will

622
00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:29,440
Speaker 3: transform their cellular being and at the end, if you

623
00:31:29,600 --> 00:31:31,920
Speaker 3: like put in the effort, you will most likely get

624
00:31:31,920 --> 00:31:35,400
Speaker 3: a good grade. But the idea that like, they're concerned

625
00:31:35,440 --> 00:31:37,040
Speaker 3: that if I don't give them the grade they want

626
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:38,960
Speaker 3: that their life will be ruined. Some of them have

627
00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:43,160
Speaker 3: fucking suicidal ideation about grades. Unless you're going to go

628
00:31:43,240 --> 00:31:46,000
Speaker 3: get a medical degree or a PhD, nobody cares what

629
00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:48,840
Speaker 3: your grades are as an undergrad, Like, you should be

630
00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:51,240
Speaker 3: excited to do well because you want to do well,

631
00:31:51,280 --> 00:31:53,200
Speaker 3: because you're paying a lot of money and you want

632
00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:55,680
Speaker 3: to put in the effort, et cetera, not because someone's

633
00:31:55,760 --> 00:31:59,120
Speaker 3: judging you. So I think there is this perception that

634
00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:04,320
Speaker 3: adults exist to judge them, and they're afraid of interacting

635
00:32:04,360 --> 00:32:10,320
Speaker 3: with us and revealing stupidity, lack of knowledge, lack of wisdom,

636
00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:13,240
Speaker 3: et cetera. And I have to do so much. I

637
00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:15,920
Speaker 3: have to be a therapist basically, where I tell my

638
00:32:15,960 --> 00:32:19,360
Speaker 3: students I am not here to be judgmental towards you.

639
00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:23,360
Speaker 3: I'm here to help you practice good judgment. So sometimes

640
00:32:23,400 --> 00:32:26,760
Speaker 3: I'm gonna say, hmm, do you really believe that? Where

641
00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:29,040
Speaker 3: did that idea come from? Right? It doesn't mean I

642
00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:30,719
Speaker 3: think less of you. It doesn't mean I think that

643
00:32:30,720 --> 00:32:35,560
Speaker 3: you're worthless. So there's so much of a block towards

644
00:32:35,720 --> 00:32:38,880
Speaker 3: talking to older people because of a fear of being judged.

645
00:32:39,360 --> 00:32:44,440
Speaker 2: That makes sense, which is how social media operate completely

646
00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:48,600
Speaker 2: feel yes, totally. All right, we're gonna get back into

647
00:32:49,200 --> 00:32:53,520
Speaker 2: just sort of pop cultural stuff, specifically with regards to

648
00:32:54,200 --> 00:32:57,640
Speaker 2: the right, trying to take some of our comic books,

649
00:32:57,760 --> 00:33:00,880
Speaker 2: some of our sci fi things. But we do want

650
00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:04,720
Speaker 2: to just touch on this Trump press conference real quick,

651
00:33:05,040 --> 00:33:08,760
Speaker 2: because he really let his unfit for office flag fly.

652
00:33:09,440 --> 00:33:13,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, just continue to prove the haters right. So he

653
00:33:13,280 --> 00:33:15,840
Speaker 1: gave a press conference and by that he just went

654
00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:18,800
Speaker 1: up on stage with somewhat of a plan rhetorically, and

655
00:33:18,840 --> 00:33:21,640
Speaker 1: then after he got the first rehearsed sort of sentenced out,

656
00:33:22,040 --> 00:33:25,280
Speaker 1: he immediately went into Trump jazz and just started doing

657
00:33:25,320 --> 00:33:28,720
Speaker 1: some sundown improv baby. And the main point of this

658
00:33:28,840 --> 00:33:31,560
Speaker 1: pressure was to pump his own dick up about all

659
00:33:31,600 --> 00:33:35,320
Speaker 1: the accomplishments he's had one year into the second term.

660
00:33:35,320 --> 00:33:38,160
Speaker 1: And he starts off with a big pile of papers

661
00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:43,680
Speaker 1: he's holding that literally says accomplishments on it, the proof, Yeah,

662
00:33:43,720 --> 00:33:47,000
Speaker 1: to prove how much good has been done because he

663
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:50,240
Speaker 1: has a melted brain that could only work in literal terms. Now,

664
00:33:50,560 --> 00:33:52,840
Speaker 1: So this is like the let me just play it.

665
00:33:53,080 --> 00:33:55,120
Speaker 1: I'm gonna give a few moments where you can see

666
00:33:55,560 --> 00:33:58,800
Speaker 1: where this was headed and where it went. So first,

667
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:03,880
Speaker 1: this is him just again starting off somewhat coherent, being like, look, guys,

668
00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:06,440
Speaker 1: I've done a lot in a year and more than anybody,

669
00:34:06,440 --> 00:34:08,640
Speaker 1: even though that's not true. But again that's what he's

670
00:34:08,680 --> 00:34:10,200
Speaker 1: trying to sell to people.

671
00:34:10,440 --> 00:34:11,560
Speaker 2: Individual things.

672
00:34:12,239 --> 00:34:13,960
Speaker 7: I could stand here and read it for a week

673
00:34:14,000 --> 00:34:15,240
Speaker 7: and we wouldn't be finished.

674
00:34:15,760 --> 00:34:16,120
Speaker 1: It's just.

675
00:34:18,719 --> 00:34:21,680
Speaker 7: Done by far, and in terms of military, in terms

676
00:34:21,760 --> 00:34:23,399
Speaker 7: of ending wars, in terms of.

677
00:34:23,520 --> 00:34:25,279
Speaker 2: Okay, so low energy, you can tell he's kind of

678
00:34:25,280 --> 00:34:28,480
Speaker 2: like ending. He keeps like kind of closing his eyes.

679
00:34:28,840 --> 00:34:31,040
Speaker 2: They keep telling me.

680
00:34:31,040 --> 00:34:34,080
Speaker 1: To say this stuff. Okay, so I'll fucking say that part.

681
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:37,000
Speaker 1: Then it starts going off the rails, like in this

682
00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:40,120
Speaker 1: part he begins to like cast doubt on like the

683
00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:44,920
Speaker 1: sincerity of protesters in Minnesota based on how well people

684
00:34:44,960 --> 00:34:48,160
Speaker 1: were screaming shame at ICE agents paid.

685
00:34:49,360 --> 00:34:51,719
Speaker 7: You know, when the wall and was shot and I

686
00:34:51,719 --> 00:34:56,480
Speaker 7: felt terribly about that the well was shot. I understand

687
00:34:56,480 --> 00:35:01,000
Speaker 7: both sides of it. But when she was shot, another

688
00:35:01,040 --> 00:35:04,560
Speaker 7: woman that was screaming shame, shame, shame, shame, Right, you

689
00:35:04,640 --> 00:35:10,000
Speaker 7: said so loud like a professional opera singer. She was

690
00:35:10,120 --> 00:35:16,239
Speaker 7: so loud, it so professional, she was Wow, there was hurt, like,

691
00:35:16,800 --> 00:35:22,160
Speaker 7: oh my heart's injured. She was a professional. Shame shame,

692
00:35:22,360 --> 00:35:25,880
Speaker 7: she's screaming. Shame shap I said, that's not a normal person.

693
00:35:25,960 --> 00:35:27,680
Speaker 7: That's that's a professional.

694
00:35:28,480 --> 00:35:33,880
Speaker 1: Okay, so professional with anything again, because everything is like

695
00:35:33,960 --> 00:35:36,280
Speaker 1: the outrage is not real because what's.

696
00:35:36,080 --> 00:35:38,879
Speaker 2: Happening is people who disagree with me aren't real. They're

697
00:35:38,920 --> 00:35:42,720
Speaker 2: paid exactly. So then you're like, you can't yell shame

698
00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:45,319
Speaker 2: like that. Well, by the way, that woman's voice was

699
00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:49,920
Speaker 2: quivering with rage, Yeah yeah, yeah, well, which because she

700
00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:52,239
Speaker 2: had just witnessed somebody her neighbor be murdered.

701
00:35:52,280 --> 00:35:56,600
Speaker 3: By the way, the interpretation of this person's statement means nothing.

702
00:35:57,239 --> 00:35:58,879
Speaker 3: I mean, this is what I think we've arrived at,

703
00:35:58,880 --> 00:36:03,520
Speaker 3: where like, whatever his statement about anything in the world is,

704
00:36:03,760 --> 00:36:06,520
Speaker 3: it doesn't really matter what his interpretation is. If you

705
00:36:06,560 --> 00:36:09,680
Speaker 3: live in a democracy, the people get to say what

706
00:36:09,719 --> 00:36:12,440
Speaker 3: they think and what they believe, and if mass groups

707
00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:15,040
Speaker 3: of people are saying we don't like this, it doesn't

708
00:36:15,040 --> 00:36:17,359
Speaker 3: matter whether you thought one protester was fake or not.

709
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:20,640
Speaker 3: It doesn't well, yes, that's beside the point. So I mean,

710
00:36:20,680 --> 00:36:23,880
Speaker 3: that's what's so amazing is the amplifying of these minute

711
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:27,440
Speaker 3: details that really are like missing the forest for the trees.

712
00:36:27,800 --> 00:36:30,560
Speaker 1: Right. Then he goes on to talk about how the

713
00:36:30,600 --> 00:36:35,080
Speaker 1: binder clip that's holding all of his accomplishment papers together

714
00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:38,000
Speaker 1: pinched his thingies. But you know what, I don't I'm

715
00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:39,920
Speaker 1: not a big boy, and I don't cry is essentially

716
00:36:40,000 --> 00:36:40,479
Speaker 1: what he says.

717
00:36:41,880 --> 00:36:46,000
Speaker 7: Accomplishments and this is something. Oh I'm glad my finger

718
00:36:46,080 --> 00:36:47,000
Speaker 7: wasn't and that's good.

719
00:36:47,800 --> 00:36:49,080
Speaker 3: That could have done some damage.

720
00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:50,759
Speaker 1: But you know I would the pain.

721
00:36:51,280 --> 00:36:53,239
Speaker 3: I can't. I where have we arrived to?

722
00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:55,719
Speaker 7: That was this?

723
00:36:57,040 --> 00:36:59,719
Speaker 1: Okay? But I wouldn't have showed the pain. Like when

724
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:02,080
Speaker 1: I got my shots the other day, I didn't cry.

725
00:37:02,200 --> 00:37:03,880
Speaker 1: The doctor did give me a lollipop.

726
00:37:04,360 --> 00:37:09,440
Speaker 2: It was nice. Then again, it was late year on

727
00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:12,239
Speaker 2: it buzz late. You're a good friend of mine, said

728
00:37:12,400 --> 00:37:13,640
Speaker 2: very nice things about me.

729
00:37:14,480 --> 00:37:18,720
Speaker 1: Further down the drain. Now he just starts meandering, rambling.

730
00:37:19,960 --> 00:37:22,880
Speaker 3: What happened to sleepy Joe? What happened to the sleepy

731
00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:23,920
Speaker 3: Joe accusation?

732
00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:26,960
Speaker 1: Well, now he's making fun of his cancer diagnosis. Seems

733
00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:29,280
Speaker 1: to be what Trump has been doing, and people were like, Jesus,

734
00:37:29,360 --> 00:37:32,040
Speaker 1: what the fuck? So this is him? Now he says

735
00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:34,480
Speaker 1: something about DC's safe and now your lover isn't going

736
00:37:34,560 --> 00:37:38,120
Speaker 1: to be killed anymore. I don't love her with your

737
00:37:38,160 --> 00:37:39,640
Speaker 1: loved one, with your lover.

738
00:37:41,480 --> 00:37:42,640
Speaker 3: That word coming out of his mouth.

739
00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:43,879
Speaker 1: Listen this part.

740
00:37:43,920 --> 00:37:45,680
Speaker 7: He just lover is not going to be killed, and

741
00:37:45,760 --> 00:37:47,799
Speaker 7: they know, so he can act like a real lover.

742
00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:50,359
Speaker 2: And then what but you.

743
00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:52,239
Speaker 7: Can be You can walk right through the middle of

744
00:37:52,280 --> 00:37:56,120
Speaker 7: the town and DC is beautiful again too.

745
00:37:56,160 --> 00:38:00,960
Speaker 1: You know, Wow, Amen, lover is not going to be

746
00:38:01,040 --> 00:38:03,680
Speaker 1: killed anymore, and you can act like real lovers. Then

747
00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:06,120
Speaker 1: he does more racist ship. We don't We've already heard

748
00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:09,759
Speaker 1: it some all these bad Minnesota He's like, Minnesota actually won.

749
00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:13,560
Speaker 1: You lost that straight three times, So again miss us

750
00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:16,680
Speaker 1: with your fake reality, and then wraps the whole thing

751
00:38:16,760 --> 00:38:21,160
Speaker 1: up with an exasperated gesture at his pile of papers

752
00:38:21,320 --> 00:38:25,360
Speaker 1: aka accomplishments to be like I mean, like, look, I

753
00:38:25,360 --> 00:38:27,800
Speaker 1: think he at that point doesn't know what to say anymore,

754
00:38:27,800 --> 00:38:30,000
Speaker 1: but he knows he has this big pile of papers

755
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:32,560
Speaker 1: to prove how much he's done, and this is the

756
00:38:32,600 --> 00:38:33,400
Speaker 1: most he can get up.

757
00:38:35,640 --> 00:38:39,279
Speaker 7: Here's the book up things. I'm going to read a

758
00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:40,800
Speaker 7: few of the samples, but look at this.

759
00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:44,200
Speaker 2: The whips it for the microphone, that each line is

760
00:38:44,200 --> 00:38:45,040
Speaker 2: something we did that.

761
00:38:45,000 --> 00:38:49,480
Speaker 7: Before and it did what to look, we have the

762
00:38:49,520 --> 00:38:56,640
Speaker 7: hottest country in the world.

763
00:38:52,560 --> 00:38:56,520
Speaker 1: Throws it up. So yeah, this was the beginning.

764
00:38:56,560 --> 00:38:58,799
Speaker 2: He gets big stuff too, of.

765
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:01,760
Speaker 1: I think everyone in dav being like, oh, this guy's

766
00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:04,520
Speaker 1: about to pull up and talk call Greenland, Iceland.

767
00:39:04,800 --> 00:39:07,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think it is. And there's stuff actually living

768
00:39:07,760 --> 00:39:08,320
Speaker 2: on the pages.

769
00:39:08,360 --> 00:39:13,000
Speaker 1: This big each line and accomplishment give me a corner, Daddy.

770
00:39:13,360 --> 00:39:17,240
Speaker 2: Nobody's ever done that before. Nobody's ever done what before written.

771
00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:20,799
Speaker 1: I know nobody has been this out of sorts and

772
00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:25,319
Speaker 1: president at the same time. Uh so again, this is like,

773
00:39:25,480 --> 00:39:28,840
Speaker 1: you know, I think all part of the slow, slow,

774
00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:32,919
Speaker 1: sort of percolating headlines or I guess now because money

775
00:39:33,000 --> 00:39:34,760
Speaker 1: is at stake, people are like, I think this guy's

776
00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:37,080
Speaker 1: because president, because.

777
00:39:36,840 --> 00:39:39,400
Speaker 2: Wall Street has started to feel the pain, like suddenly

778
00:39:39,440 --> 00:39:41,560
Speaker 2: there might be some consequences.

779
00:39:41,000 --> 00:39:47,360
Speaker 3: Yeah, are tolerance for this level of insanity and incompetence,

780
00:39:47,440 --> 00:39:51,320
Speaker 3: like the incapacity to put together a sentence, like the

781
00:39:51,480 --> 00:39:56,040
Speaker 3: production of an entire political regime based on random gestures

782
00:39:56,680 --> 00:40:01,080
Speaker 3: and exclamatory statement like that's so wild to me, right,

783
00:40:01,160 --> 00:40:02,920
Speaker 3: because part of it is that he knows that the

784
00:40:02,960 --> 00:40:06,719
Speaker 3: content doesn't matter. It's a certain kind of performance of

785
00:40:06,760 --> 00:40:10,520
Speaker 3: your great grandfather at the head of the thanksgiving table

786
00:40:11,080 --> 00:40:14,359
Speaker 3: being like you just have to respect me because fuck off. Yeah,

787
00:40:14,680 --> 00:40:16,840
Speaker 3: and people are like, we know this is awful and

788
00:40:16,880 --> 00:40:20,440
Speaker 3: we hate this, but we will sit quietly and endure,

789
00:40:21,160 --> 00:40:22,680
Speaker 3: you know. And then there are people who are sort

790
00:40:22,719 --> 00:40:25,439
Speaker 3: of like I enjoy this because it means I don't

791
00:40:25,480 --> 00:40:28,920
Speaker 3: have to make sense. If the most powerful person on

792
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:31,840
Speaker 3: the planet does not need to make sense, then the

793
00:40:31,880 --> 00:40:34,480
Speaker 3: rest of us don't and you don't have to explain ourselves.

794
00:40:34,520 --> 00:40:36,880
Speaker 3: And I think there's a certain kind of like almost

795
00:40:36,920 --> 00:40:41,000
Speaker 3: like erotic fantasy around like yes, like I could be

796
00:40:41,080 --> 00:40:45,000
Speaker 3: this unhinged and I don't have to explain myself to anyone,

797
00:40:45,200 --> 00:40:47,960
Speaker 3: and like it's just it's that's wow.

798
00:40:48,560 --> 00:40:52,480
Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah. The like you were talking about the celebrity

799
00:40:52,520 --> 00:40:55,920
Speaker 2: culture is like part of it is us dreaming of

800
00:40:56,000 --> 00:41:00,319
Speaker 2: being better than other people by assuming. So in this case,

801
00:41:00,360 --> 00:41:03,680
Speaker 2: it's like people are getting out of this seeing him

802
00:41:03,800 --> 00:41:08,560
Speaker 2: go up there and just rambling coherently, and because they're

803
00:41:08,640 --> 00:41:12,040
Speaker 2: I guess insulated from the consequences, they're just like that

804
00:41:12,040 --> 00:41:14,719
Speaker 2: that makes me feel good. It's like he's like that's cool.

805
00:41:14,880 --> 00:41:17,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think that's right. He's well, he's like I

806
00:41:17,200 --> 00:41:19,799
Speaker 1: think really at this one, he's like the peak sort

807
00:41:19,840 --> 00:41:25,440
Speaker 1: of like manifestation of infallible white male power.

808
00:41:25,600 --> 00:41:29,280
Speaker 3: I was just gonna say it's about failing upward to affinity.

809
00:41:29,000 --> 00:41:31,200
Speaker 1: But I really do. But I think for him to

810
00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:33,880
Speaker 1: be a white like you could only be a white

811
00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:39,600
Speaker 1: man and be so transparently out of sorts, so obviously senile,

812
00:41:40,120 --> 00:41:43,480
Speaker 1: and no one says anything about it, and people say yes, sir, yes, sir,

813
00:41:43,560 --> 00:41:45,080
Speaker 1: you're like, now, that's some shit.

814
00:41:45,280 --> 00:41:49,440
Speaker 2: His continued existence in a position of power is the

815
00:41:49,520 --> 00:41:53,120
Speaker 2: ultimate statement of like the world done by white supremacy

816
00:41:53,400 --> 00:41:55,040
Speaker 2: to just be like yeah, yeah.

817
00:41:55,080 --> 00:41:57,520
Speaker 3: There are many ironies to this, and one of them

818
00:41:57,719 --> 00:41:59,840
Speaker 3: is is that people who claim to be as supporters

819
00:41:59,880 --> 00:42:02,400
Speaker 3: are obsessed with the American family and the nuclear family

820
00:42:02,440 --> 00:42:05,439
Speaker 3: and having kids, And the very reason that people are

821
00:42:05,480 --> 00:42:09,040
Speaker 3: not getting married and not having children and not wanting

822
00:42:09,080 --> 00:42:11,600
Speaker 3: to do all of that stuff is because that is

823
00:42:11,640 --> 00:42:14,960
Speaker 3: the dominant mode of the masculinity in this country, and

824
00:42:15,000 --> 00:42:18,200
Speaker 3: people are like, there, you might celebrate that on TV,

825
00:42:18,719 --> 00:42:22,080
Speaker 3: in people's inner personal life, many of the people that

826
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:24,360
Speaker 3: adore him would never want to sit at a dinner

827
00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:29,600
Speaker 3: table with him would find him absolutely insufferable. The charisma

828
00:42:29,800 --> 00:42:33,160
Speaker 3: is not innate to him. It is what you just said,

829
00:42:33,600 --> 00:42:37,200
Speaker 3: which is that it's appealing to watch someone be this

830
00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:42,640
Speaker 3: unhinged and to be like they still keep winning. That's

831
00:42:42,760 --> 00:42:45,160
Speaker 3: almost such a mind fuck to people that that's the

832
00:42:45,320 --> 00:42:48,040
Speaker 3: entertainment is to be like, oh my god. And at

833
00:42:48,040 --> 00:42:51,160
Speaker 3: what point do people collectively say, this is now destroying

834
00:42:51,160 --> 00:42:53,960
Speaker 3: our lives so much that we must put a stop

835
00:42:54,000 --> 00:42:55,800
Speaker 3: to it. And I think our tolerance in this country

836
00:42:55,840 --> 00:42:59,640
Speaker 3: has become almost infinite, Like that is crazy.

837
00:43:00,040 --> 00:43:04,680
Speaker 1: The limit is when it affects my stock portfolio really bad, apparently,

838
00:43:04,760 --> 00:43:08,040
Speaker 1: because it wasn't enough when like marginalized people were just

839
00:43:08,160 --> 00:43:11,360
Speaker 1: tossed to the side and being killed and kidnapped. Yeah,

840
00:43:11,400 --> 00:43:14,360
Speaker 1: it's just now because because again everything with America's like

841
00:43:14,400 --> 00:43:16,920
Speaker 1: it has to fucking be right in your face, smashing

842
00:43:16,960 --> 00:43:19,560
Speaker 1: this shit out of your face for the rest of

843
00:43:19,600 --> 00:43:21,480
Speaker 1: America to get it, because it's not enough when the

844
00:43:21,480 --> 00:43:24,600
Speaker 1: people in the margins have warn everybody about it. It's like, well,

845
00:43:25,120 --> 00:43:26,680
Speaker 1: I need to kind of get hit by the train

846
00:43:26,760 --> 00:43:29,319
Speaker 1: head off before you tell me there's I'll believe you

847
00:43:29,360 --> 00:43:32,640
Speaker 1: then that a train was coming well, And also, like, you.

848
00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:34,840
Speaker 3: Know what mystifies me, you guys, as somebody who studies

849
00:43:34,880 --> 00:43:38,160
Speaker 3: American culture, like I studied the period after World War Two,

850
00:43:38,239 --> 00:43:40,440
Speaker 3: so like I study the Cold War, so much of

851
00:43:40,480 --> 00:43:44,200
Speaker 3: what's happening now has happened before. Yeah, McCarthy, is the

852
00:43:44,239 --> 00:43:47,239
Speaker 3: internment camps for Japanese people, Like this is It's not

853
00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:48,719
Speaker 3: like all of this is totally new.

854
00:43:48,920 --> 00:43:49,920
Speaker 1: No, none of this are.

855
00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:52,480
Speaker 3: There are new versions of it that are more extreme,

856
00:43:52,520 --> 00:43:56,239
Speaker 3: that are more horrible than whatever. Yeah, But what fascinates

857
00:43:56,320 --> 00:43:59,840
Speaker 3: me is the inability of Americans, left right and so

858
00:44:00,440 --> 00:44:03,680
Speaker 3: to simply accept that certain policies and ways of doing

859
00:44:03,760 --> 00:44:07,880
Speaker 3: things are ineffective. One could sit in a room with

860
00:44:07,920 --> 00:44:11,040
Speaker 3: ten people who all agree that immigration is a problem

861
00:44:11,200 --> 00:44:15,000
Speaker 3: and needs to be addressed. Is this particular way of

862
00:44:15,120 --> 00:44:21,440
Speaker 3: doing it effective besides making people miserable collectively? It's not,

863
00:44:22,080 --> 00:44:25,400
Speaker 3: because it's not actually about solving the problem of immigration.

864
00:44:26,120 --> 00:44:29,160
Speaker 3: It's about creating a vibe. It's about creating a vibe

865
00:44:29,360 --> 00:44:32,200
Speaker 3: of constant threat and danger. But so like to me,

866
00:44:32,400 --> 00:44:35,880
Speaker 3: the inability of people of any political persuasion to just say,

867
00:44:36,400 --> 00:44:37,880
Speaker 3: I get what you're trying to do, but I just

868
00:44:37,960 --> 00:44:42,040
Speaker 3: don't think it works right, Like that is just so

869
00:44:42,280 --> 00:44:44,600
Speaker 3: mind boggling to me. It's so simple to just say

870
00:44:44,640 --> 00:44:47,880
Speaker 3: this is a not effective way of accomplishing something.

871
00:44:48,200 --> 00:44:51,399
Speaker 1: Yeah, Unfortunately, like all these people, especially for people who

872
00:44:51,680 --> 00:44:54,959
Speaker 1: say that these ICE agents are correct and these raids

873
00:44:55,000 --> 00:45:00,000
Speaker 1: are necessary, they've used the term immigration to sort of mass.

874
00:45:00,200 --> 00:45:03,200
Speaker 1: They're just deeper desires for like a white Ethno state.

875
00:45:04,760 --> 00:45:07,759
Speaker 2: The Minneapolis Police Department just came out and was like,

876
00:45:07,920 --> 00:45:11,839
Speaker 2: our off duty officers keep being targeted by ICE and

877
00:45:12,280 --> 00:45:15,520
Speaker 2: all of them happened to be people of color. So yeah,

878
00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:19,200
Speaker 2: they're just rolling up on off duty officers with guns

879
00:45:19,280 --> 00:45:23,480
Speaker 2: drawn and saying like, show us your papers, and they're like,

880
00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:26,080
Speaker 2: what papers? I live I've lived here my.

881
00:45:26,040 --> 00:45:26,920
Speaker 3: Whole life exactly.

882
00:45:27,040 --> 00:45:30,239
Speaker 2: And then yeah, the chief of police that I wish

883
00:45:30,239 --> 00:45:32,960
Speaker 2: I could tell you that this was an isolated incident.

884
00:45:33,280 --> 00:45:35,759
Speaker 2: If it is happening to our officers, pains me to

885
00:45:35,800 --> 00:45:38,480
Speaker 2: think about how many of our community members are being victims.

886
00:45:38,520 --> 00:45:42,400
Speaker 1: Speaking of Overton police, Yeah, speaking of Overton windows and

887
00:45:42,440 --> 00:45:46,640
Speaker 1: the opportunity that presents God the cops, man, somebody's being

888
00:45:46,640 --> 00:45:48,759
Speaker 1: your pr team, Like we might be able to kind

889
00:45:48,760 --> 00:45:50,759
Speaker 1: of win hearts and minds back if we kind of

890
00:45:50,760 --> 00:45:53,319
Speaker 1: stand for something. But yeah, that's never going to happen

891
00:45:53,320 --> 00:45:55,040
Speaker 1: because that whole thing is rotten to the core.

892
00:45:55,480 --> 00:45:57,560
Speaker 2: All right, let's take a quick break. We're gonna come back.

893
00:45:57,560 --> 00:45:59,399
Speaker 2: We're going tucks and pop culture. We'll be right back,

894
00:46:09,920 --> 00:46:10,680
Speaker 2: and we're back.

895
00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:11,320
Speaker 1: We're back.

896
00:46:11,640 --> 00:46:13,799
Speaker 2: And William Shatner has been in the news a lot

897
00:46:13,880 --> 00:46:17,280
Speaker 2: this week, and not just because he was photographed eating

898
00:46:17,400 --> 00:46:19,759
Speaker 2: a bowl of cereal while driving.

899
00:46:20,040 --> 00:46:22,680
Speaker 1: A ceramic bowl too, not even ram bowl.

900
00:46:22,960 --> 00:46:25,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, of cereal while driving.

901
00:46:25,480 --> 00:46:27,720
Speaker 1: That's great. That reminds me of simpler times.

902
00:46:27,880 --> 00:46:31,600
Speaker 3: That's very appropriate for him. That feels very like that tracks.

903
00:46:32,000 --> 00:46:33,200
Speaker 1: He's ninety four.

904
00:46:33,520 --> 00:46:34,400
Speaker 3: Good for him.

905
00:46:35,040 --> 00:46:37,560
Speaker 2: The milk is gonna maybe get on your clothes, but like,

906
00:46:37,600 --> 00:46:40,040
Speaker 2: that's when you're wearing a bathroom I'm surprised.

907
00:46:40,080 --> 00:46:42,760
Speaker 1: Now, I got I got neighbors. I got elderly neighbors

908
00:46:42,800 --> 00:46:45,040
Speaker 1: who actually shouldn't be driving, you know what I mean?

909
00:46:45,480 --> 00:46:50,880
Speaker 1: And four year old no doing look my no, hell.

910
00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:54,680
Speaker 3: I'm like in La you know how to drive?

911
00:46:54,719 --> 00:46:55,200
Speaker 2: No hands?

912
00:46:55,440 --> 00:46:58,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, ninety four, I'm like, can we can we test

913
00:46:58,120 --> 00:46:58,720
Speaker 1: your driving?

914
00:46:58,760 --> 00:46:59,359
Speaker 3: Gangster? Though?

915
00:46:59,400 --> 00:46:59,799
Speaker 2: Real quick?

916
00:47:00,040 --> 00:47:01,080
Speaker 1: Are you still you still got it?

917
00:47:01,280 --> 00:47:03,160
Speaker 2: But he was also dragged in to the Zeitgeist by

918
00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:07,759
Speaker 2: Stephen Miller, who took a break from outright Nazism to

919
00:47:07,840 --> 00:47:11,160
Speaker 2: complain about a new streaming sci fi show. He shared

920
00:47:11,160 --> 00:47:15,640
Speaker 2: a video from the end Wokeness account complaining about the

921
00:47:15,840 --> 00:47:19,680
Speaker 2: new series Star Trek Academy. Because the clip featured three

922
00:47:19,719 --> 00:47:25,320
Speaker 2: women talking. I think that's it, honestly.

923
00:47:26,080 --> 00:47:26,640
Speaker 1: Yeah. Wow.

924
00:47:26,680 --> 00:47:29,080
Speaker 2: So he called on Paramount to hand the rans of

925
00:47:29,080 --> 00:47:32,239
Speaker 2: the franchise over to the ninety four year old Chatner. Oh,

926
00:47:33,560 --> 00:47:36,439
Speaker 2: we keep having good results when we hand things over

927
00:47:36,480 --> 00:47:40,520
Speaker 2: to people who have aged out of being safe on

928
00:47:40,560 --> 00:47:40,959
Speaker 2: the road.

929
00:47:41,080 --> 00:47:43,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, even not even in space. Bro, I don't

930
00:47:43,560 --> 00:47:46,400
Speaker 1: even think they fucking let him comp command a ship

931
00:47:46,560 --> 00:47:47,200
Speaker 1: at that age.

932
00:47:47,360 --> 00:47:50,680
Speaker 2: He responded by joking that Miller was alluding to the

933
00:47:50,719 --> 00:47:53,840
Speaker 2: fact that one of the characters was using wearing glasses.

934
00:47:54,120 --> 00:47:56,480
Speaker 2: He was like, come on, we haven't we haven't solved

935
00:47:56,960 --> 00:47:58,959
Speaker 2: near sightedness.

936
00:47:59,360 --> 00:48:01,840
Speaker 3: Steven Miller probably was like, you can't show disabled people

937
00:48:01,880 --> 00:48:02,520
Speaker 3: on Yeah.

938
00:48:02,680 --> 00:48:09,359
Speaker 1: True, I didn't even notice that I can't see for ship,

939
00:48:09,400 --> 00:48:11,080
Speaker 1: but I don't wear glasses because I don't want to

940
00:48:11,120 --> 00:48:11,760
Speaker 1: show weakens.

941
00:48:12,000 --> 00:48:14,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like this is the level of that logic.

942
00:48:14,880 --> 00:48:19,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, but why would Shatner be able to rid Star

943
00:48:19,320 --> 00:48:23,040
Speaker 2: Trek of this phantom wokeness. Well. As a kid, Stephen

944
00:48:23,080 --> 00:48:25,800
Speaker 2: Miller was reportedly obsessed with Star Trek. He used to

945
00:48:25,880 --> 00:48:29,000
Speaker 2: dress up as Kirk, seeing him as a macho, alpha

946
00:48:29,040 --> 00:48:34,920
Speaker 2: male ideal. Elon Musk has similarly misogynistically ripped on the show,

947
00:48:35,760 --> 00:48:39,080
Speaker 2: and he and Peeks Pete Hegseth suggested that it's time

948
00:48:39,120 --> 00:48:43,680
Speaker 2: to make make Star Trek real. They're using Hell yeah,

949
00:48:44,200 --> 00:48:48,960
Speaker 2: they're They're They're on a tour named after Arsenal of Freedom,

950
00:48:49,320 --> 00:48:52,200
Speaker 2: which is a Star Trek. The Next Generation episode about

951
00:48:52,200 --> 00:48:56,920
Speaker 2: an AI powered weapons system and it's automated salesman which

952
00:48:57,000 --> 00:49:00,520
Speaker 2: destroys an entire civilization and eventually threatened the crew of

953
00:49:00,560 --> 00:49:03,080
Speaker 2: the USS Enterprise groundbreaking.

954
00:49:03,239 --> 00:49:03,560
Speaker 1: Wow.

955
00:49:03,840 --> 00:49:08,360
Speaker 2: So they're again just like to have completely lost the

956
00:49:08,440 --> 00:49:11,640
Speaker 2: message of anything that they're consuming, and it's just gestures.

957
00:49:12,120 --> 00:49:14,040
Speaker 3: Well, this is what I said earlier, which is like

958
00:49:14,120 --> 00:49:18,600
Speaker 3: every great popular culture invention of the late twentieth century

959
00:49:18,760 --> 00:49:23,239
Speaker 3: is in some way about hanging together, making friends with

960
00:49:23,239 --> 00:49:25,400
Speaker 3: people who are not like you. The X Men is

961
00:49:25,440 --> 00:49:29,120
Speaker 3: fundamentally about the idea of like elective affinity, of like, oh,

962
00:49:29,160 --> 00:49:31,400
Speaker 3: I just ended up with these people, and I'm figuring

963
00:49:31,400 --> 00:49:34,360
Speaker 3: out how to create an alternative family, you know, like

964
00:49:34,440 --> 00:49:36,720
Speaker 3: this is what that's what everybody loves, is the idea

965
00:49:36,719 --> 00:49:38,439
Speaker 3: of right.

966
00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:42,080
Speaker 2: Of course, she just claimed that they were.

967
00:49:42,840 --> 00:49:45,839
Speaker 3: It actually sucks to be the norm. It's boring. It's

968
00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:48,840
Speaker 3: also not true. You live in a state of constant

969
00:49:48,880 --> 00:49:53,399
Speaker 3: denial about your own specialness. And people love marginality because

970
00:49:53,440 --> 00:49:57,440
Speaker 3: they know that technically everybody is marginal, like nobody actually

971
00:49:57,440 --> 00:50:02,000
Speaker 3: fits in. Nobody is the norm, the of the whatever,

972
00:50:02,040 --> 00:50:04,600
Speaker 3: this white ethno state that people want, the narrowness of

973
00:50:04,600 --> 00:50:09,040
Speaker 3: who counts in It is like practically nobody. As one

974
00:50:09,040 --> 00:50:10,440
Speaker 3: of my friends were saying, like you can never have

975
00:50:10,480 --> 00:50:12,680
Speaker 3: been divorced, you could never have had a bad thought.

976
00:50:12,719 --> 00:50:14,759
Speaker 3: You can never I mean, that's not any human being

977
00:50:14,800 --> 00:50:15,400
Speaker 3: that exists.

978
00:50:15,840 --> 00:50:16,760
Speaker 2: So wel.

979
00:50:17,920 --> 00:50:24,759
Speaker 3: Absolutely create those cultural objects like the X Men, like

980
00:50:24,800 --> 00:50:28,160
Speaker 3: Star Trek that make them feel like outsiders so that

981
00:50:28,239 --> 00:50:31,080
Speaker 3: they can claim to also be cool. And the thing

982
00:50:31,080 --> 00:50:33,560
Speaker 3: about Star Trek. Star Trek is so dorky for a

983
00:50:33,680 --> 00:50:36,799
Speaker 3: very particular reason. It's so beautiful because it is like

984
00:50:37,360 --> 00:50:41,120
Speaker 3: a post World War two fantasy of going out into

985
00:50:41,160 --> 00:50:43,719
Speaker 3: the cosmos and meeting people who are not like you

986
00:50:44,160 --> 00:50:48,160
Speaker 3: and doing absolutely nothing but interacting with them. Non violently.

987
00:50:48,640 --> 00:50:50,759
Speaker 3: That's literally what the whole show is about. It's not

988
00:50:50,800 --> 00:50:53,800
Speaker 3: about imperialism, it's not about control, it's not about domination.

989
00:50:54,320 --> 00:50:59,120
Speaker 3: It's about the joy of finding people and being like,

990
00:50:59,160 --> 00:51:01,359
Speaker 3: who are you and what are you like? I mean,

991
00:51:01,400 --> 00:51:03,480
Speaker 3: that's the idea of the Prime directive that if you

992
00:51:03,520 --> 00:51:06,760
Speaker 3: meet a civilization that doesn't have your technology, you don't

993
00:51:06,840 --> 00:51:10,160
Speaker 3: make them into a version of yourself. So of course

994
00:51:10,200 --> 00:51:12,880
Speaker 3: Star Trek is going to piss these people off because

995
00:51:12,920 --> 00:51:17,280
Speaker 3: its fundamental values are so against the culture as it stands.

996
00:51:17,280 --> 00:51:19,080
Speaker 3: I mean, if you watch the show all the way

997
00:51:19,080 --> 00:51:22,720
Speaker 3: through every series, this period of the twenty first century

998
00:51:22,719 --> 00:51:26,080
Speaker 3: that we're living in is considered like the worst moment

999
00:51:26,120 --> 00:51:29,600
Speaker 3: in humanity. Many of the characters time travel. There's a

1000
00:51:29,600 --> 00:51:32,040
Speaker 3: famous episode in Voyager where they go back to la

1001
00:51:32,440 --> 00:51:35,239
Speaker 3: in like a twenty five and they're just like, this

1002
00:51:35,280 --> 00:51:38,560
Speaker 3: is how people live. There's homeless people, that people can't eat,

1003
00:51:39,120 --> 00:51:42,880
Speaker 3: and so the ideas that humanity survived by working through

1004
00:51:42,920 --> 00:51:47,960
Speaker 3: this period and growing up and becoming egalitarian. So they

1005
00:51:48,000 --> 00:51:50,719
Speaker 3: can't stand that. But they also are sort of like

1006
00:51:50,760 --> 00:51:52,360
Speaker 3: the Stephen Miller's of the world are like, but we

1007
00:51:52,400 --> 00:51:52,879
Speaker 3: also want.

1008
00:51:52,800 --> 00:51:54,680
Speaker 1: To be including it is.

1009
00:51:54,800 --> 00:51:56,400
Speaker 3: But I also want to be on a ship and

1010
00:51:56,440 --> 00:51:58,440
Speaker 3: I also want to find and it's like, well, girl,

1011
00:51:58,520 --> 00:52:02,719
Speaker 3: you could be included if you such a fucking asshole. Yeah, like,

1012
00:52:02,800 --> 00:52:05,840
Speaker 3: if you didn't want to annihilate everybody and kill everybody

1013
00:52:05,880 --> 00:52:08,279
Speaker 3: and put everybody in prison, and if you actually had

1014
00:52:08,360 --> 00:52:11,319
Speaker 3: humility enough to engage with the world, like you could

1015
00:52:11,360 --> 00:52:14,280
Speaker 3: also be part of the universe.

1016
00:52:14,400 --> 00:52:16,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, but I just think there's just something still appealing

1017
00:52:16,600 --> 00:52:17,320
Speaker 1: about the Borg.

1018
00:52:17,680 --> 00:52:21,799
Speaker 2: You know, that's just the only episode he watches over

1019
00:52:21,840 --> 00:52:22,439
Speaker 2: and over again.

1020
00:52:23,400 --> 00:52:26,319
Speaker 1: Get on board, dude. Resistance is futile, dude, I know,

1021
00:52:26,440 --> 00:52:28,160
Speaker 1: that's what he basically says to people.

1022
00:52:28,280 --> 00:52:32,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, the premise of Star Trek could be very much

1023
00:52:32,120 --> 00:52:36,000
Speaker 2: a colonial tale, but you're right, they have the prime directive,

1024
00:52:36,280 --> 00:52:39,959
Speaker 2: which wasn't that. You know, the original show came out

1025
00:52:40,120 --> 00:52:43,680
Speaker 2: during Vietnam and they were like, we don't want to

1026
00:52:43,719 --> 00:52:48,600
Speaker 2: support that sort of colonialism, and so we had to

1027
00:52:48,640 --> 00:52:51,040
Speaker 2: create this law that was like, yes, we go out

1028
00:52:51,040 --> 00:52:54,680
Speaker 2: there and just exist and learn from you, don't intervene,

1029
00:52:54,920 --> 00:52:56,520
Speaker 2: and we don't extract resources.

1030
00:52:56,680 --> 00:52:59,840
Speaker 3: Let's also remember, I mean, first of all, the show

1031
00:52:59,880 --> 00:53:01,960
Speaker 3: is in the sixties, was one of the most gender

1032
00:53:01,960 --> 00:53:05,000
Speaker 3: and racially diverse shows in the history of American media.

1033
00:53:05,080 --> 00:53:06,279
Speaker 2: First Kiss.

1034
00:53:06,800 --> 00:53:09,800
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it's unbelievable what they were doing. It's also

1035
00:53:09,880 --> 00:53:14,560
Speaker 3: incredibly playful and fun. It imagines exploration, like you said,

1036
00:53:14,600 --> 00:53:18,440
Speaker 3: not as a colonial project, but as joy and creativity.

1037
00:53:18,640 --> 00:53:20,759
Speaker 3: But I would remind people this is how deep the

1038
00:53:20,760 --> 00:53:23,680
Speaker 3: show is when they revamped the show in the Next

1039
00:53:23,680 --> 00:53:27,040
Speaker 3: Generation and Voyager and Deep Space Sign, which is my favorite.

1040
00:53:27,080 --> 00:53:28,520
Speaker 3: It used to be Voyager and then I watch Deep

1041
00:53:28,520 --> 00:53:32,120
Speaker 3: Space Sign and it's it's incredible. The Borg is so

1042
00:53:32,320 --> 00:53:37,000
Speaker 3: brilliant because the Borg is what happens when democracy eats

1043
00:53:37,040 --> 00:53:40,480
Speaker 3: itself alive. Like the villain of the show is the

1044
00:53:40,520 --> 00:53:43,399
Speaker 3: flattening of difference. It's the idea of like, what if

1045
00:53:43,440 --> 00:53:47,240
Speaker 3: we democratized everything to the point where nobody was different

1046
00:53:47,280 --> 00:53:50,120
Speaker 3: than anybody else. And the show is saying, like, if

1047
00:53:50,160 --> 00:53:52,880
Speaker 3: you really want to hang on to radical democracy, you

1048
00:53:53,200 --> 00:53:57,960
Speaker 3: have to keep alive the meaningfulness of the fact that

1049
00:53:58,000 --> 00:54:02,080
Speaker 3: people are not the same. You have to keep negotiating differences.

1050
00:54:02,080 --> 00:54:04,280
Speaker 3: So the show is so smart that it actually offers

1051
00:54:04,280 --> 00:54:08,480
Speaker 3: a critique of democracy itself and some of its pitfalls,

1052
00:54:08,840 --> 00:54:12,640
Speaker 3: while also still celebrating the idea of democratic life. Like

1053
00:54:12,680 --> 00:54:16,200
Speaker 3: that's so that's so deep, but like that's so beyond

1054
00:54:16,360 --> 00:54:19,759
Speaker 3: anything that this administration can even think through at this point,

1055
00:54:20,600 --> 00:54:23,600
Speaker 3: and he's so antithetical to all of their values that

1056
00:54:23,640 --> 00:54:26,120
Speaker 3: of course they're but basically like watching it and having

1057
00:54:26,160 --> 00:54:28,400
Speaker 3: like a paroxysm about.

1058
00:54:28,239 --> 00:54:35,000
Speaker 2: It actually, and right, getritt of that stupid They're.

1059
00:54:34,880 --> 00:54:36,759
Speaker 1: Just like, well, what if like everyone was more like

1060
00:54:36,840 --> 00:54:40,080
Speaker 1: seven of nine maybe to kind of soften it up

1061
00:54:40,120 --> 00:54:40,640
Speaker 1: a little bit.

1062
00:54:41,040 --> 00:54:44,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh my god, I love that character's so great.

1063
00:54:44,040 --> 00:54:47,680
Speaker 1: Fun fact, I did Jerry Ryan's kid's birthday two years

1064
00:54:47,760 --> 00:54:50,520
Speaker 1: and I was so starstruck when she pulled up. I

1065
00:54:50,600 --> 00:54:53,560
Speaker 1: was like, it's seven or nine, nine, seven to nine,

1066
00:54:54,120 --> 00:54:56,239
Speaker 1: seven or nine kid's birthday.

1067
00:54:56,760 --> 00:54:58,560
Speaker 2: But yeah, I just feel I feel like this is

1068
00:54:58,880 --> 00:55:01,600
Speaker 2: as religion kind of it's relevance and goes the way

1069
00:55:01,640 --> 00:55:04,120
Speaker 2: of like the Greek gods in terms of its functional

1070
00:55:04,200 --> 00:55:07,279
Speaker 2: role in people's lives. I feel like people are more

1071
00:55:07,280 --> 00:55:10,560
Speaker 2: and more filling that with movie universes that they get

1072
00:55:10,600 --> 00:55:13,600
Speaker 2: meaning from and prefer to exist in, and like the

1073
00:55:13,760 --> 00:55:17,399
Speaker 2: Right just doesn't have one that they can call their own.

1074
00:55:17,560 --> 00:55:21,080
Speaker 2: You know. That's that's why they were so mad when

1075
00:55:21,120 --> 00:55:25,279
Speaker 2: Star Wars changed, and why they they're just trying. They're like,

1076
00:55:25,719 --> 00:55:29,080
Speaker 2: would you be my friend Star Trek And it's like, no,

1077
00:55:29,320 --> 00:55:33,720
Speaker 2: fuck you, we think you're weird. You're like, you could

1078
00:55:33,800 --> 00:55:39,000
Speaker 2: be a bad guy from our show. Like, okay, avatar

1079
00:55:40,160 --> 00:55:41,000
Speaker 2: probably doesn't work.

1080
00:55:41,160 --> 00:55:46,000
Speaker 1: Okay, well, well, which part do you think you are?

1081
00:55:46,080 --> 00:55:48,000
Speaker 3: You guys like the what is the what do we

1082
00:55:48,160 --> 00:55:52,439
Speaker 3: what is that fucking word conservatism to conserve to keep

1083
00:55:52,440 --> 00:55:56,800
Speaker 3: people things the same? Yeah, it doesn't that logic. Conservatism

1084
00:55:56,800 --> 00:55:59,879
Speaker 3: as a logic does not lend itself to good storytelling

1085
00:56:00,360 --> 00:56:04,160
Speaker 3: because the outcome is always the same. It's essentially keeping

1086
00:56:04,200 --> 00:56:06,640
Speaker 3: the universe the way you want it to look like,

1087
00:56:07,239 --> 00:56:10,120
Speaker 3: So that ends up being propaganda. That can also be

1088
00:56:10,239 --> 00:56:13,399
Speaker 3: left wing. Right. There are left wing versions of conservatism

1089
00:56:13,600 --> 00:56:15,640
Speaker 3: where you want the story to end up the same way,

1090
00:56:15,920 --> 00:56:19,320
Speaker 3: where you want a narrative to always have the same message.

1091
00:56:19,680 --> 00:56:24,920
Speaker 3: There's a reason why conservatives feel often at odds with

1092
00:56:25,000 --> 00:56:28,640
Speaker 3: popular media because whether or not popular media is liberal

1093
00:56:28,719 --> 00:56:31,879
Speaker 3: or conservative, and the fact is it's run by conservative billionaires.

1094
00:56:32,760 --> 00:56:37,279
Speaker 3: It needs to be driven by innovation and exploration and

1095
00:56:37,440 --> 00:56:41,240
Speaker 3: growth and expansion. You can't keep telling the same story

1096
00:56:41,280 --> 00:56:43,800
Speaker 3: in exactly the same way forever. You can go quite

1097
00:56:43,800 --> 00:56:44,960
Speaker 3: far fast and fear.

1098
00:56:45,719 --> 00:56:47,520
Speaker 1: They're still trying, they're still doing right, but.

1099
00:56:47,440 --> 00:56:50,720
Speaker 3: At some point something has to change because people change

1100
00:56:50,719 --> 00:56:54,640
Speaker 3: and the world changes whatever. And so conservatism is fundamentally

1101
00:56:54,680 --> 00:56:59,560
Speaker 3: at odds with a really generative media industry. I mean,

1102
00:56:59,600 --> 00:57:01,839
Speaker 3: this is why the Nazis essentially had to take over

1103
00:57:01,960 --> 00:57:06,279
Speaker 3: every single organ of media in Germany because the only

1104
00:57:06,320 --> 00:57:08,640
Speaker 3: way they could get their message across was to literally

1105
00:57:08,800 --> 00:57:12,640
Speaker 3: be the people who run everything. And by the way,

1106
00:57:12,719 --> 00:57:14,600
Speaker 3: have that work out.

1107
00:57:15,280 --> 00:57:19,200
Speaker 5: Not a historian, but it work out really well.

1108
00:57:19,520 --> 00:57:27,560
Speaker 3: It really work out really well for anybody. And and

1109
00:57:28,080 --> 00:57:32,280
Speaker 3: so it's just and it's boring and wrote and so yeah,

1110
00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:34,280
Speaker 3: it makes sense that there is this kind of like

1111
00:57:34,440 --> 00:57:37,480
Speaker 3: wanting to take over these franchises, but also not knowing

1112
00:57:37,800 --> 00:57:40,440
Speaker 3: how their version of politics fits in because it just

1113
00:57:40,520 --> 00:57:43,360
Speaker 3: doesn't align with good storytelling.

1114
00:57:43,720 --> 00:57:45,120
Speaker 2: And they don't know anything about that.

1115
00:57:45,320 --> 00:57:47,520
Speaker 3: By the way, to be a total dork for a second,

1116
00:57:47,720 --> 00:57:51,320
Speaker 3: the point that you're making, Jack is there's an amazing

1117
00:57:51,360 --> 00:57:54,919
Speaker 3: book people should read by the historian Michael Saylor called

1118
00:57:55,080 --> 00:57:59,560
Speaker 3: as If on the literary prehistory of virtual Reality, and

1119
00:57:59,600 --> 00:58:01,880
Speaker 3: it makes it exactly the argument that you just made,

1120
00:58:02,320 --> 00:58:06,880
Speaker 3: the history of the way in which starting with Sherlock Holmes.

1121
00:58:06,960 --> 00:58:11,720
Speaker 3: In the nineteenth century, people didn't abandon religion. They became

1122
00:58:11,840 --> 00:58:17,160
Speaker 3: spiritually inclined towards fictional universes, and they became obsessed with

1123
00:58:17,240 --> 00:58:21,520
Speaker 3: the internal logics of those worlds, and they believed they

1124
00:58:21,600 --> 00:58:24,480
Speaker 3: that one could perform the same kind of ethics that

1125
00:58:24,560 --> 00:58:28,200
Speaker 3: religion gave you in those worlds. That they saw Sherlock

1126
00:58:28,280 --> 00:58:31,520
Speaker 3: Holmes as a person who was fundamentally good and wanted

1127
00:58:31,560 --> 00:58:35,040
Speaker 3: to understand the world and was open to the world's mysteries.

1128
00:58:35,400 --> 00:58:37,200
Speaker 3: And so they believed in the idea that, like the

1129
00:58:37,280 --> 00:58:41,080
Speaker 3: fans were like, you should cultivate a spirit of openness

1130
00:58:41,520 --> 00:58:43,160
Speaker 3: to this mystery. And the same is true of The

1131
00:58:43,320 --> 00:58:46,520
Speaker 3: X Men and Star Trek. These are cultural franchises that

1132
00:58:46,640 --> 00:58:50,120
Speaker 3: millions of fans watch them and say, this show is

1133
00:58:50,200 --> 00:58:53,280
Speaker 3: teaching me how to be more open to difference, to

1134
00:58:53,320 --> 00:58:56,560
Speaker 3: be more open to be to explore no wonder people.

1135
00:58:56,760 --> 00:58:59,920
Speaker 3: Conservatives want to try and control that narrative. That's danger

1136
00:59:00,240 --> 00:59:00,720
Speaker 3: to them.

1137
00:59:00,920 --> 00:59:04,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, sounds like a smart guy. Michael Saylor, like Mark,

1138
00:59:04,440 --> 00:59:07,000
Speaker 2: I love him, Sherlock Holmes. We're gonna have to do

1139
00:59:07,040 --> 00:59:09,080
Speaker 2: Sherlock on the Icon episode of Icons of.

1140
00:59:09,440 --> 00:59:13,080
Speaker 3: Such a good idea or the right Arthur Conan Doyle

1141
00:59:13,480 --> 00:59:16,720
Speaker 3: who invented him and then became the fans hated him

1142
00:59:16,760 --> 00:59:18,000
Speaker 3: and loved Sherlock Holmes.

1143
00:59:18,400 --> 00:59:22,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, that makes sense that America.

1144
00:59:23,000 --> 00:59:25,280
Speaker 3: Today, that's like heated rivalry. People are like, we love

1145
00:59:25,320 --> 00:59:26,840
Speaker 3: the characters on the show, but don't be real.

1146
00:59:27,280 --> 00:59:30,120
Speaker 2: Well, Ramsey, it's been such a pleasure having you daily.

1147
00:59:31,240 --> 00:59:34,480
Speaker 2: Where can people find you? Follow you all that?

1148
00:59:34,800 --> 00:59:39,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, so people can go to my website Ramseyfawas dot com.

1149
00:59:39,560 --> 00:59:43,360
Speaker 3: You can find information about all my books, about my work,

1150
00:59:43,400 --> 00:59:46,200
Speaker 3: and also about my retreats. I teach at the Esslon

1151
00:59:46,320 --> 00:59:50,040
Speaker 3: Institute every year, which is a huge beautiful consciousness raising

1152
00:59:50,080 --> 00:59:52,840
Speaker 3: retreat in Big sur, California. I'm going to teach a

1153
00:59:52,880 --> 00:59:56,760
Speaker 3: seminar there this year called the Thrill of Groundlessness Flowing

1154
00:59:56,800 --> 00:59:59,640
Speaker 3: through Life without Absolutes. So if you like my vibe

1155
00:59:59,680 --> 01:00:02,600
Speaker 3: and you to learn about the kind of living without

1156
01:00:02,640 --> 01:00:05,280
Speaker 3: it with less anxiety, that's what we'll be doing. You

1157
01:00:05,320 --> 01:00:08,840
Speaker 3: can also find me on Instagram at nerd from the Future,

1158
01:00:09,000 --> 01:00:10,920
Speaker 3: and of course you can follow my podcast. We'll be

1159
01:00:11,160 --> 01:00:13,520
Speaker 3: putting out our second season later in March.

1160
01:00:14,040 --> 01:00:17,320
Speaker 2: Amaze and is there a work of media that you've

1161
01:00:17,320 --> 01:00:17,880
Speaker 2: been enjoying.

1162
01:00:18,760 --> 01:00:23,000
Speaker 3: Oh I have, Yeah, I have been reading this book

1163
01:00:23,040 --> 01:00:28,000
Speaker 3: called The Light Eaters by Zoe Schlanger. She's a journalist.

1164
01:00:28,080 --> 01:00:31,200
Speaker 3: It's a national bestseller. It's a blowing my mind. It's

1165
01:00:31,240 --> 01:00:35,760
Speaker 3: all about plant intelligence and about what we're learning about plants. Basically,

1166
01:00:35,840 --> 01:00:40,800
Speaker 3: human beings are stupid. Plants are geniuses. They're like species

1167
01:00:40,840 --> 01:00:42,880
Speaker 3: that have learned how to survive without having being able

1168
01:00:42,960 --> 01:00:44,480
Speaker 3: to move. And then one of my favorite parts of

1169
01:00:44,480 --> 01:00:47,440
Speaker 3: the book is basically that it's all about scientists fighting

1170
01:00:47,480 --> 01:00:49,720
Speaker 3: with each other about whether or not plants are actually

1171
01:00:49,720 --> 01:00:52,880
Speaker 3: intelligent and the idea that people's like careers have been

1172
01:00:52,960 --> 01:00:55,520
Speaker 3: ruined over this is insane to me because it's so

1173
01:00:55,560 --> 01:00:58,600
Speaker 3: obvious that plants are smart, and it's just it's a

1174
01:00:58,600 --> 01:01:01,240
Speaker 3: beautiful book and it will make it will humble you,

1175
01:01:01,280 --> 01:01:03,080
Speaker 3: like in a world where we need to step out

1176
01:01:03,080 --> 01:01:04,680
Speaker 3: of ourselves for a minute. It is a book that

1177
01:01:04,720 --> 01:01:06,440
Speaker 3: you'll just you'll leave it and be like, Wow, my

1178
01:01:06,520 --> 01:01:08,280
Speaker 3: hydranger outside is smarter than me.

1179
01:01:11,360 --> 01:01:11,560
Speaker 1: Yeah.

1180
01:01:12,720 --> 01:01:15,080
Speaker 2: I feel like we're very bad at respecting the intelligence

1181
01:01:15,080 --> 01:01:17,360
Speaker 2: of anything that is not us.

1182
01:01:17,960 --> 01:01:22,000
Speaker 3: It's so boring, which means that we're dumb, which means

1183
01:01:22,040 --> 01:01:24,520
Speaker 3: actually that we're I mean, right, Native and indigenous people

1184
01:01:24,600 --> 01:01:29,280
Speaker 3: call human beings the younger brother of creation. Like we're

1185
01:01:29,280 --> 01:01:32,240
Speaker 3: the youngest species on the planet. How could we ever

1186
01:01:32,360 --> 01:01:35,800
Speaker 3: possibly think that, just because we have self consciousness as

1187
01:01:35,800 --> 01:01:38,480
Speaker 3: far as we know, right, that we could actually be smarter.

1188
01:01:38,600 --> 01:01:41,040
Speaker 3: I mean, there's a just a little factoid before we

1189
01:01:41,080 --> 01:01:43,040
Speaker 3: conclude today. She has a moment the book where she

1190
01:01:43,080 --> 01:01:46,040
Speaker 3: talks about there are plants that, when they are touched

1191
01:01:46,200 --> 01:01:50,000
Speaker 3: more than three times in one hour, will rearrange their

1192
01:01:50,520 --> 01:01:55,959
Speaker 3: entire DNA structure so that when their cells reproduce, they're

1193
01:01:56,080 --> 01:02:00,760
Speaker 3: stronger because they recognize that they're being assaulted. Yeah, like

1194
01:02:01,160 --> 01:02:03,080
Speaker 3: that's insane.

1195
01:02:03,000 --> 01:02:07,440
Speaker 2: Right, Get the fuck off. I know, every plant.

1196
01:02:07,680 --> 01:02:11,000
Speaker 1: Every time that's Michael Jordan losing to the pistons and

1197
01:02:11,040 --> 01:02:13,760
Speaker 1: then starting to lift weights in the off season. It's

1198
01:02:13,840 --> 01:02:15,760
Speaker 1: like not again, not again.

1199
01:02:16,080 --> 01:02:20,240
Speaker 3: Like that literally, and it happens within seconds. It's wild awesome.

1200
01:02:20,280 --> 01:02:22,720
Speaker 2: Miles, where can people find you as their workimedia you've

1201
01:02:22,760 --> 01:02:23,720
Speaker 2: been enjoying.

1202
01:02:23,560 --> 01:02:26,440
Speaker 1: Find me everywhere at Miles of Gray. I talk ninety

1203
01:02:26,480 --> 01:02:29,200
Speaker 1: day fiance on four to twenty day fiance and if

1204
01:02:29,200 --> 01:02:32,960
Speaker 1: you like English football in the Premier League and European

1205
01:02:33,000 --> 01:02:35,480
Speaker 1: football at large, check out the new show Ain't It

1206
01:02:35,640 --> 01:02:39,560
Speaker 1: Footy comedic comedy show with myself, Jamal Johnson and Chris Martin.

1207
01:02:40,320 --> 01:02:42,760
Speaker 1: Works in media. First one is from at Internet Hippo

1208
01:02:43,560 --> 01:02:45,520
Speaker 1: because I don't know if the Trump at the sort

1209
01:02:45,520 --> 01:02:47,960
Speaker 1: of Davos thing was like I'm not gonna I'm not

1210
01:02:47,960 --> 01:02:50,840
Speaker 1: gonna use force, but it was implied and like a

1211
01:02:50,840 --> 01:02:53,520
Speaker 1: lot of the head but we will use force well.

1212
01:02:53,560 --> 01:02:56,520
Speaker 1: And then a lot of headlines are like Trump says right,

1213
01:02:56,640 --> 01:02:58,920
Speaker 1: use of force is off the table. So based off

1214
01:02:58,920 --> 01:03:02,040
Speaker 1: of that Internet Hippobos and Mafia Goon, nice house you

1215
01:03:02,080 --> 01:03:05,160
Speaker 1: got here, it'd be a shame if something happened to it.

1216
01:03:05,440 --> 01:03:09,320
Speaker 1: Media outlets Mafia Goon rules out use of force, expresses

1217
01:03:09,400 --> 01:03:13,400
Speaker 1: regret at the mere thought of it amazing. And then

1218
01:03:13,440 --> 01:03:16,440
Speaker 1: another one pixelated boat just because we're talking about William Shaddow.

1219
01:03:16,480 --> 01:03:19,280
Speaker 1: This is perfect pixelated boat posted The New York Times

1220
01:03:19,280 --> 01:03:21,520
Speaker 1: reports that Air Force one has turned around due to

1221
01:03:21,520 --> 01:03:24,960
Speaker 1: a situation officials are describing as creature on the wing.

1222
01:03:29,400 --> 01:03:34,040
Speaker 2: Oh nice. Uh, I have been sleeping, so I don't

1223
01:03:34,080 --> 01:03:36,600
Speaker 2: have a working media A little under the.

1224
01:03:36,400 --> 01:03:38,280
Speaker 1: Weather, so sorry.

1225
01:03:38,320 --> 01:03:41,600
Speaker 2: Joe Namath doing the James Cameron once was like I

1226
01:03:41,640 --> 01:03:44,360
Speaker 2: don't watch streaming. I got the best streaming channel in

1227
01:03:44,400 --> 01:03:47,200
Speaker 2: the world up here. Every night when I go to bed,

1228
01:03:47,280 --> 01:03:49,040
Speaker 2: it's my dreams six.

1229
01:03:51,840 --> 01:03:52,560
Speaker 1: Yeah exactly.

1230
01:03:52,600 --> 01:03:54,400
Speaker 2: They're all Avatar, every one of those.

1231
01:03:54,880 --> 01:03:56,479
Speaker 3: He's really all about that world.

1232
01:03:58,160 --> 01:04:01,480
Speaker 2: You can find me on Twitter, Jack Underscore, Brian, Blue Sky,

1233
01:04:01,560 --> 01:04:05,840
Speaker 2: JACKO b the number one Instagram Jack Underscore, Oh Underscore Brian.

1234
01:04:05,920 --> 01:04:07,880
Speaker 2: You can find us on Twitter and Blue Sky at

1235
01:04:07,960 --> 01:04:11,200
Speaker 2: Daily Zeitgeist. We're at the Daily Zeigeist on Instagram. You

1236
01:04:11,200 --> 01:04:13,160
Speaker 2: can go to the description of this episode wherever you're

1237
01:04:13,160 --> 01:04:15,040
Speaker 2: listening to it, and they're at the bottom. You will

1238
01:04:15,080 --> 01:04:17,880
Speaker 2: find the footnotes, which is where we link off to

1239
01:04:17,920 --> 01:04:20,120
Speaker 2: the information we talked about in today's episode. We also

1240
01:04:20,200 --> 01:04:23,040
Speaker 2: link off to a song that we think you might enjoy.

1241
01:04:23,120 --> 01:04:25,480
Speaker 2: Mild Is there a song that you think the people

1242
01:04:25,600 --> 01:04:26,400
Speaker 2: might enjoy?

1243
01:04:26,760 --> 01:04:30,640
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, yes, uh. Super producer editor Justin put me

1244
01:04:30,720 --> 01:04:34,800
Speaker 1: onto this Italian rapper named Marte m A r t E.

1245
01:04:35,000 --> 01:04:38,600
Speaker 1: The track is called Part and I guess that means

1246
01:04:38,640 --> 01:04:41,120
Speaker 1: I just did a quick search. That means natural birth.

1247
01:04:41,840 --> 01:04:46,120
Speaker 1: The instrumental she's wrapping on is dope. It like reminds

1248
01:04:46,160 --> 01:04:48,800
Speaker 1: me of like two thousand and four. There's something like

1249
01:04:48,880 --> 01:04:51,840
Speaker 1: really playful about the samples, but it's still fucking knocks.

1250
01:04:52,240 --> 01:04:56,360
Speaker 1: Check this one out. Yeah yeah, so this is Pardo

1251
01:04:56,480 --> 01:04:59,520
Speaker 1: n by Marte. So check this one out.

1252
01:05:00,080 --> 01:05:02,480
Speaker 2: Link after that in the footnotes for Daily zeitgeis is

1253
01:05:02,480 --> 01:05:05,120
Speaker 2: the production of iHeartRadio. For more podcasts from my Heart Radio,

1254
01:05:05,200 --> 01:05:07,360
Speaker 2: visit the heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you

1255
01:05:07,360 --> 01:05:09,360
Speaker 2: listen to your favorite shows. That's going to do it

1256
01:05:09,400 --> 01:05:11,800
Speaker 2: for us this morning. We are back this afternoon to

1257
01:05:11,840 --> 01:05:14,120
Speaker 2: tell you what is trending and we will talk to

1258
01:05:14,400 --> 01:05:16,320
Speaker 2: y'all then bye bye.

1259
01:05:17,080 --> 01:05:19,800
Speaker 3: The Daily Zeit Guys is executive produced by Catherine Long,

1260
01:05:20,160 --> 01:05:22,320
Speaker 3: co produced by Bee Wang.

1261
01:05:22,400 --> 01:05:24,680
Speaker 2: Co produced by Victor Wright, co

1262
01:05:24,760 --> 01:05:28,880
Speaker 3: Written by j M mcnapp, Edited and engineered by Justin

1263
01:05:28,960 --> 01:05:29,280
Speaker 3: Conner