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Speaker 1: On the Bechdel cast.

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Speaker 2: The questions asked if movies have women and them, are

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Speaker 2: all their discussions just boyfriends and husbands or do they

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Speaker 2: have individualism? It's the patriarchy, zephim fast, start changing it

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Speaker 2: with the Bechdel cast.

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Speaker 1: Railro and welcome to the rectal cast, not the rectal cast. Yes, Caitlin,

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Speaker 1: the rectal cast.

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Speaker 3: That's disgusting.

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Speaker 1: Rye ram is rait Lynn.

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Speaker 3: You said the rectal cast.

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Speaker 1: Yes, I am familiar and I'm aware.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, okay, we're welcome to the rectel cast. My ram

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Speaker 4: is ramy raptus. And I resent how Scooby would introduce

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Speaker 4: us the rectal cast, the rectal.

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Speaker 3: Cast, which you know, so be it so be it.

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Speaker 1: Scoobysh celet Scooby it Scooby it? Which celebrity thought that

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Speaker 1: the Bechdel test was called the rectal test?

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Speaker 3: Did that happen?

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Speaker 1: It was someone? Yes, whoa let me look it up.

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Speaker 3: You know who's been on Scooby who Joey Chestman?

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Speaker 4: Wait what that doesn't pass the rectal test, but actually,

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Speaker 4: anything involving Joey does pass the rectal test due to

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Speaker 4: how many hot dogs he eats, but it does not

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Speaker 4: pass the Bechdel Test due to the fact that he's

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Speaker 4: a man. Anyways, Yeah, he was in uh, he was

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Speaker 4: in an episode of Scooby Doo. It was a thrilling

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Speaker 4: day for me as a Scooby fan and most importantly

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Speaker 4: as Joey's wife.

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Speaker 1: Of course, it was Diane Lane who accidentally called the

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Speaker 1: Bechtel test the rectal test.

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Speaker 4: I've got to be honest, I do feel like she's

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Speaker 4: well within her rights, and I hope that no one

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Speaker 4: corrected her. That's pretty iconic. Okay, So the Joey episode

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Speaker 4: actually came out in the last.

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Speaker 3: Couple of years.

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Speaker 4: It's a new Scooby venture called Scooby Doo and guess who?

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Speaker 3: And guess who joe.

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Speaker 4: Joey Tesmutt who passes the rectal test with flying covers

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Speaker 4: colors every fourth of July.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, of course. Well, speaking of hot dogs, there's that

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Speaker 1: part in this movie where Shaggy is like, hey, that

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Speaker 1: reminds me of the time that I tried to eat

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Speaker 1: the guy in the hot dog costume.

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Speaker 4: Started on this, I also was thinking, what was my

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Speaker 4: all Right, we have to introduce the show because this

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Speaker 4: is the main feed episode.

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Speaker 3: Welcome to the Vexel Cast. What was the rectal rest retrod.

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Speaker 4: Where are we saying rectal unprecedented levels this week?

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Speaker 1: It's true. My name is Jamie Loftus, my name is

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Speaker 1: Caitlin Derunte, and this is our show where we examine

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Speaker 1: movies through an intersectional feminist lens using the rectal rest.

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Speaker 4: Which is the rio retrick prevented by Ralis and Rechdel,

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Speaker 4: sometimes called the real.

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Speaker 3: If this is your first.

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Speaker 4: Episode, you should probably pick a different episode to listen

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Speaker 4: to the first time.

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Speaker 3: Uh.

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Speaker 4: There's a lot of different versions of the rectal test,

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Speaker 4: but we use our our very own special version.

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Speaker 3: But Kaitlyn, what, what the fuck is it?

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Speaker 1: Well? Our version is that two characters of a marginalized

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Speaker 1: gender must have names. They must speak to each other Scooby,

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Speaker 1: doesn't you know, Shaggy their boys. But if Velma and

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Speaker 1: Daphne talk to each other about something other than a man,

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Speaker 1: they can't be talking about something other than Scooby. Then

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Speaker 1: it passes.

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Speaker 3: I think we should we should make our test more.

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Speaker 3: I can feel a chaotic episode coming on, I really can.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I think we should make a special exception for today,

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Speaker 4: or just maybe a general addition to our version of

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Speaker 4: the rectal rest, where nowhere it does pass if you're

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Speaker 4: talking about Scooby.

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Speaker 1: Oh, okay, so like an Alfred Molina kind of thing.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly Did I ever tell you about my like?

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Speaker 3: I like, there's a lot of.

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Speaker 4: Like stale Jamie bits that are going to be connected

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Speaker 4: to this episode. First of all, Matthew Lillard. I was

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Speaker 4: trying to remember what the fuck I was saying about Matthew.

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Speaker 4: I think I was pretending to be his assistant. Was

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Speaker 4: that it?

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Speaker 3: Or I would be like Willard, No, he was my assistant.

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Speaker 4: Matthew Lillard was my assistant in my in my little

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Speaker 4: fantasy life. And I was making him bring me I

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Speaker 4: think tuna on crackers. It could have been, oh, or

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Speaker 4: maybe soup. I kind of remember this was this, Oh,

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Speaker 4: I think Lillard was bringing me soup and he was

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Speaker 4: dropping this soup and I was yelling at him.

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Speaker 1: Was this on the Scream episode? Maybe I forget why

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Speaker 1: wee would have I.

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Speaker 3: Believe that that would have been. It could have also been,

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Speaker 3: and I think it maybe made a comeback.

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Speaker 4: In the what's that one on a Rider movie where

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Speaker 4: they're just complain and complain and complain, And he's in

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Speaker 4: that one too.

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Speaker 3: We covered it last year.

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Speaker 1: I swear to god reality bites. Yes, no he's not

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Speaker 1: in that is he?

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Speaker 3: Wait?

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Speaker 4: No a m I no, no, because no, I'm thinking

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Speaker 4: of Steve's on But.

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Speaker 1: He is in Hackers. I think he is in Hackers.

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Speaker 4: How long has it been since we've covered a Lillard

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Speaker 4: original and we haven't done SLC Punk and we should

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Speaker 4: at some point we should. I've only seen that movie

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Speaker 4: once and it was the only time I've done Molly,

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Speaker 4: and I was like, why would you do Molly and

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Speaker 4: then watch SLC Punk alone? Not alone, to be clear,

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Speaker 4: not alone with a friend.

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Speaker 1: Oh okay, congrats.

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Speaker 3: Thank you, thank you.

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Speaker 4: There was the bit about matth Miller being my assistant,

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Speaker 4: and you're right making me soup. I think I'm going

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Speaker 4: to bail on it. I think I'm going to bayl

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Speaker 4: on it for two. But I do have another Scooby,

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Speaker 4: but I'd like to share.

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Speaker 3: This is a longer term one.

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Speaker 1: Okay.

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Speaker 4: I used to have this dream, not like a but

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Speaker 4: like a wish, a cherished wish it kind of dream

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Speaker 4: in which, at every pivotal point in my life, I

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Speaker 4: thought it would be really funny if there was someone

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Speaker 4: wearing a Scooby costume, just also in the room in

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Speaker 4: a way that would feel so bizarre that I would

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Speaker 4: want people to feel like they were dreaming if they attended.

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Speaker 4: So I'm talking about like a wedding that is a

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Speaker 4: very standard wedding, but someone in the audience or the

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Speaker 4: not the audience, god depressing.

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Speaker 3: The pews or whatever the states, is wearing.

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Speaker 4: A Scooby costume and like no attention is brought to it.

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Speaker 4: I'm talking I'm giving birth delivery room.

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Speaker 1: Ohoa, Scooby, this Skuby be there.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, all the way through my funeral, when I've you know,

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Speaker 4: shuffled off this mortal coil.

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Speaker 3: I think it would be fun for there to be

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Speaker 3: just someone in a Scooby suit. Now each important turn

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Speaker 3: in my life?

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Speaker 1: Is this a like a lifelong dream you've had or this.

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Speaker 4: Has been something I've been talking about since high school?

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Speaker 1: Oh? Whoa, Yeah, okay I have if I were.

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Speaker 4: I'm not at my apartment at the moment, but if

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Speaker 4: i were, I could show you. An illustration that I've

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Speaker 4: done of me is a self portrait.

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Speaker 3: There's two Jamie's.

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Speaker 4: It's much like the Free to call it Self portrait

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Speaker 4: where she's sitting across from another Freedom.

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Speaker 3: It's that but it's me and.

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Speaker 4: Between us is a Scooby interesting So it has been

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Speaker 4: a cherished wish for a long time. And I'll say

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Speaker 4: it's not too late because the very arbitrary life quote

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Speaker 4: unquote accomplishments I was listing, none of them have happened.

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Speaker 4: And so not too late for Scooby at the wedding,

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Speaker 4: not too late for Scooby in the delivery room, not

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Speaker 4: too late for.

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Speaker 3: Or Scooby at the funeral. Yeah, Scooby at the funeral. Wait,

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Speaker 3: what is that? Is a sun Dance movie waiting to happen?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? Okay, so you should write it.

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Speaker 4: I guess all right, I'm not going to talk for

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Speaker 4: the rest of the episode.

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Speaker 3: Is that okay?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I'll take overs. We should talk.

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Speaker 4: About the Matreon because this this episode is happening in

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Speaker 4: this way, Yes, due to the fact that our listener

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Speaker 4: base has really gone off the rails.

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Speaker 1: It's true, run off the rails, like it?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, exactly.

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Speaker 1: So we are covering Scooby Doo two thousand and two

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Speaker 1: because we had put a request out to our matrons

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Speaker 1: on the Matreon asking what horror movies that we have

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Speaker 1: not yet covered that they would like us to cover

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Speaker 1: for the month of October, and not.

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Speaker 4: To be fair, should we have put Scooby Doo two

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Speaker 4: thousand and two under horror movies we haven't covered?

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Speaker 1: Some might say, now, well, well here's what happened. So

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Speaker 1: eventually it became a poll that the matrons voted on,

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Speaker 1: but before that we were just submitting any request.

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Speaker 3: And you sickos.

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Speaker 1: Maybe it was my fault with the wording of the

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Speaker 1: original post because I just said spooky movie rather than

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Speaker 1: like a horror movie.

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Speaker 4: I would say that, yeah, that does pretty closely, and

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Speaker 4: you got the double oh, sounds like it's Scooby Doo.

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Speaker 1: More like spooky Doo.

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Speaker 4: It's giving Scooby, it's giving Scooby.

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Speaker 3: Okay, sorry, I'm listening.

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Speaker 1: Okay. So I remember the requests flooded in and there

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Speaker 1: were six that ended up on the pole, the most

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Speaker 1: frequently requested movies, and one of them was Scooby Doo

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Speaker 1: two thousand and two. So we put it on the pole.

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Speaker 1: I thought it would be like maybe somewhere in the middle,

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Speaker 1: towards closer to the last place. Unbelievable response by a landslide.

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Speaker 4: I think did a lap around the closest competitor, Like, yeah,

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Speaker 4: I don't know what are you all every listener on

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Speaker 4: this show the exact same age, like what, I don't

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Speaker 4: understand what the but I do think that I mean,

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Speaker 4: well whatever, twenty year cycles, right, people have Scooby Doobe

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Speaker 4: Doo two thousand and two on the brain and they're

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Speaker 4: also I will shout out one of my favorite YouTubers

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Speaker 4: of all.

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Speaker 3: Time, Mike's Mike did a barn burner of a video

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Speaker 3: about Scooby Dobe Doo two thousand and two just last year.

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Speaker 4: Another YouTuber who I really like, named bread Sword, did

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Speaker 4: a very popular Scooby Doo video in the last couple

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Speaker 4: of years where he watched forty four Scooby Doo movies

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Speaker 4: Scooby Scooby's.

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Speaker 3: Got his paw on the pulse again, let's just say

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Speaker 3: that he got.

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Speaker 4: Joey, he got Joey or you Joey Chestnut and Joey Chess,

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Speaker 4: not another person who's got his paw on the pulse while.

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Speaker 1: We're talking about it. So apparently, I don't know if

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Speaker 1: this is an animated Scooby Doo movie or just maybe

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Speaker 1: the name of an episode of a Scooby series. I

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Speaker 1: think it actually might be a movie, though, there's something

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Speaker 1: called Scooby Doo in the Curse of the Thirteenth Ghost

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Speaker 1: that came out in twenty nineteen with Matthew Lillard voicing Shaggy.

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Speaker 1: Matthew Lillard is also in a movie called Thirteen Ghosts,

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Speaker 1: so is this a crossover kind of thing?

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Speaker 4: Well, and then also there's been Scooby Doo by Drama

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Speaker 4: Oh in the last couple of years, because I think

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Speaker 4: we talked about this on the podcast at the time,

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Speaker 4: which is wild because I have no idea what the

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Speaker 4: conversation would have can I to do?

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Speaker 3: But one of I think the enduring of the many

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Speaker 3: enduring elements of Scooby do two thousand and two, this

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Speaker 3: like Matthew Lillard Shaggy specifically became Cannon Cannon. He still

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Speaker 3: does Shaggy to this day.

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Speaker 4: He's done Shaggy one, two, three in three different series

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Speaker 4: this year alone. He is the canonical Shaggy. That has

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Speaker 4: not been true for anyone else in this cast. Not

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Speaker 4: to say that they weren't wonderful, but like usually voice

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Speaker 4: casting is.

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Speaker 3: Pretty fluid, but not so.

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Speaker 4: I mean, I think Lillard really just nailed it so

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Speaker 4: much that.

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Speaker 1: He cornered that market.

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Speaker 3: And God bless but if you recall, there was a

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Speaker 3: bit of drama.

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Speaker 1: Oh it's be a drama, Scoob. Yes, right, yes, the movie, Scoob.

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Speaker 4: Thank you for remembering the drama surrounding Scoob. Yes, they

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Speaker 4: replaced Matthew Lillard. People were furious they were losing it.

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Speaker 4: Will Forte Shaggy. I love will Forte, but it was wrong.

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Speaker 4: It was wrong, and Lillard I think in a way

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Speaker 4: that I was like, all right, this is maybe a

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Speaker 4: bit much. He publicly responded and he was like, I'm

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Speaker 4: very disappointed to not have been cast in Scoop.

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Speaker 3: It hurts, it feels bad.

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Speaker 4: And the fans were outraged because Lillard's canon Shaggy.

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Speaker 3: He loves being Shaggy. And I'm thrilled to report that.

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Speaker 4: It really has appeared to have course corrected, because.

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Speaker 3: You know that Scuba is twenty twenty.

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Speaker 4: I remember watching it and early locked down and being like,

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Speaker 4: this is the worst thing that's going to happen in

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Speaker 4: twenty twenty. No, like, that's that's how you know that.

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Speaker 4: You know the world is in utter disarray. Lillard's not

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Speaker 4: even doing Shaggy.

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Speaker 3: It's a mess.

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Speaker 4: Unfortunately, within the year it was the fans they got

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Speaker 4: what they fucking wanted and he's.

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Speaker 3: You know, he is our Shaggy again.

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Speaker 1: Thank goodness.

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Speaker 4: None of this passed the Bechtel test, but it is relevant,

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Speaker 4: and that is how Scooby would say that word.

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Speaker 3: He would say relevant.

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Speaker 1: I think he actually would say relevant or zoinks?

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Speaker 3: Can I just say zoinx?

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Speaker 1: You can?

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Speaker 3: Oh God, bless this movie. What a treat.

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Speaker 4: So anyways, if you're listening to this episode and you've

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Speaker 4: voted for Scooby Doo on the Matreon, this.

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Speaker 1: Is your faults.

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Speaker 4: I hope you're happy, because I'm actually quite happy that

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Speaker 4: we are covering this movie. Same But if you're not

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Speaker 4: a member of the Matreon, here's a plug for it,

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Speaker 4: because I mean, we couldn't be more biased. But it's

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Speaker 4: a treat. It's a treat for five bucks a month,

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Speaker 4: you can get two bonus episodes. It's just me and Caitlin.

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Speaker 4: It's a little more, you know. It's like a lighthearted,

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Speaker 4: fun vibe. Over on the Matreon, we usually choose a

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Speaker 4: theme every month. This month it's popular horror requests we

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Speaker 4: haven't gotten too.

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Speaker 1: And so the reason that we shifted Scooby Doo over

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Speaker 1: to the main feed is because it won by such

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Speaker 1: a landslide, and we're like, well, if this many matrons

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Speaker 1: want it, surely this many people in general want it.

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Speaker 1: So then on the Matreon this month we are covered

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Speaker 1: bring I Guess like second and third place, which basically

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Speaker 1: tied two votes apart.

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Speaker 4: It felt it felt right, it felt right to do it,

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Speaker 4: so we're doing it. Follows in Barbarian, which both also

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Speaker 4: take both take place in the Greater Detroit area and

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Speaker 4: are kind of more independent movies, so it feels like

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Speaker 4: a more appropriate match up over there. And if you

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Speaker 4: would or if you're interested in those episodes or hell,

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Speaker 4: the like one hundred and fifty episodes of backlog we

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Speaker 4: have over in the Matreon, it is a mere five

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Speaker 4: dollars a month. It's a very fun community and as

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Speaker 4: you can tell by the episode we're doing right now,

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Speaker 4: they're absolute menaces over there.

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Speaker 3: They're always making us do all sorts of I think,

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Speaker 3: I truly, I'm trying to think of.

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Speaker 4: Like for me, for me on the Matreon, I think

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Speaker 4: it's it's the Pinocchio Wars for me. That's where we

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Speaker 4: can really let our worst instincts fly free. We did

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Speaker 4: do a theme earlier this year that was every adaptation

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Speaker 4: of Pinocchio that came out in twenty twenty two, which

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Speaker 4: was three of them, including the poly sharp Pinocchio. So

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Speaker 4: if you really want some some deep cuts and some

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Speaker 4: fun discussions, that is where you can find them.

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Speaker 3: But today serious discourse.

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Speaker 4: On the main feed Scooby Doo two thousand and two. Now, Caitlin,

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Speaker 4: what is your history with this movie?

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Speaker 3: And I would also say Scooby canon.

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Speaker 1: Of course, I had never seen this movie before, no way, really,

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Speaker 1: it's true, and I had never seen its sequel either,

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Speaker 1: nor had I really seen any Scooby Do intellectual property.

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Speaker 1: I fascinated where of the characters. You know, it has

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Speaker 1: permeated pop culture, you know, the zeitgeist if you will.

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Speaker 1: So I just knew through cultural osmosis who all the

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Speaker 1: and maybe i'd like it was on in the background

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Speaker 1: at some point, but I never like actively sat down

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Speaker 1: and watched any Scooby show or anything like that. But

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Speaker 1: I you know, obviously you know Scooby and Scrappy and

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Speaker 1: Shaggy and Fred and Velma and Daphne.

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Speaker 4: They're very Yeah, they're like peak cultural osmosis stuff.

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Speaker 1: Yes, so, but yeah, I had never seen this movie

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Speaker 1: or I feel like sick much in the way of

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Speaker 1: any other Scooby Doo property. But I was, you know,

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Speaker 1: keeping my eye on the pole and saw that Scooby

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Speaker 1: Doo was taking the lead by a lot. I was like, well,

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Speaker 1: I'll watch it. So I watched it a few weeks

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Speaker 1: ago with our friend Bryant, and then I watched it

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Speaker 1: two more times to prep for this episode.

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Speaker 4: Well, I mean, you've got to be ready. You've got

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Speaker 4: to be ready because there's a lot going on in

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Speaker 4: this movie. And I'm like, kind of serious.

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Speaker 1: I knew. I told you. Remember, we were like, You're like,

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Speaker 1: I don't know if there's anything to say, and I

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Speaker 1: was like, there's some stuff to say, and we'll say it.

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Speaker 1: And then I also watched Scooby Doo two two thousand

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Speaker 1: and four Monsters Unleashed.

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Speaker 4: I haven't seen that movie, I don't think since it

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Speaker 4: came out out. So I'm thrilled to.

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Speaker 1: Hear Jamie, what is your relationship with Scooby.

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Speaker 3: Oh, you know, I love it. I love it. I

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Speaker 3: love it. Maybe will not shock long time listeners of

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Speaker 3: the show know that I love Scooby Doo.

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Speaker 4: I think that like it was maybe in like arrogant

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Speaker 4: child brain. It was maybe one of the first cartoons

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Speaker 4: I got burnt out on as a kid, because I

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Speaker 4: really loved Mainline. I mean, they would show reruns on

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Speaker 4: Cartoon Network. I'd watch them with my cousins. But it

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Speaker 4: was you know, very, very formulaic, which I think is

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Speaker 4: commented on quite brilliantly at the beginning of Scooby Doo

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Speaker 4: two thousand and two, where it's a ghostly mystery, but

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Speaker 4: also like I mean, in the deeper into Scooby canon

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Speaker 4: you got, there's a lot of kind of questions of like,

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Speaker 4: in the Scooby Doo world, is magic real? Is the

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Speaker 4: supernatural force in this movie? I think it is equally

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Speaker 4: ambiguous and confusing and equally written off and dismissed.

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Speaker 3: Which I guess is true to canon.

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Speaker 4: But also it's like it's always like, oh, oh no,

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Speaker 4: it's not you know, ghosts aren't real. It's just some

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Speaker 4: some horny old guy. Yeah, it's you know, like in

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Speaker 4: a very predictable way.

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Speaker 3: And so it was like as a kid, I remember

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Speaker 3: loving it.

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Speaker 4: And then being like, oh my god, I think I

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Speaker 4: know how every episode's going to end, and then abandoning

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Speaker 4: the Scooby ship for a while.

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Speaker 3: I'll be honest I saw this movie in theaters.

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Speaker 4: I remember loving it, thinking it was a little raunchy,

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Speaker 4: really being fixated on Sarah Michelle Geller's outfits, and being

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Speaker 4: I think I've mentioned this on the show before, being

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Speaker 4: I like there, I didn't like practical effects.

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Speaker 3: Or CG animals when I was.

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Speaker 4: A kid, and I think a particularly gnarly time to

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Speaker 4: be a kid and be witnessing effects because I, with

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Speaker 4: all due respect to you know, to the Scooby Hive,

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Speaker 4: to the denizens of the Mystery Machine.

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Speaker 3: Scooby looks busted in these movies. He freaks me out.

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Speaker 4: He freaks me out, and yeah, Scooby Doo two thousand

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Speaker 4: and two. Even as a kid, I was like, this

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Speaker 4: is not this.

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Speaker 3: Is not my Scooby. I don't you know, this is

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Speaker 3: not hashtag not my Scooby.

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Speaker 4: I was.

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Speaker 3: I was a little freaked by the Scooby But I

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Speaker 3: loved this movie. I thought it was so funny. And

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Speaker 3: I also am just like, as a.

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Speaker 4: Grown person interested in Scooby discourse, Scooby Dooby discourse as

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Speaker 4: we call it in the community. I'm not a part

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Speaker 4: of the community. Let maybe I just but I am

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Speaker 4: interested because I feel like there is a lot of

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Speaker 4: because it's been you know, as a property that's been

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Speaker 4: around for I believe, let me check, I did know

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Speaker 4: off the top of my head. Yeah, over half a century.

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Speaker 4: These damn kids have been ripping masks off of old

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Speaker 4: guys heads. And I think that there is like a

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Speaker 4: really interesting legacy around the way that Peo fans.

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Speaker 3: Have perceived these characters. I think there's a huge queer.

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00:21:05,880 --> 00:21:09,160
Speaker 4: Reading of the Scooby Doo expanded universe that is very

401
00:21:09,240 --> 00:21:12,119
Speaker 4: unique and very cool and also ties into this movie

402
00:21:12,200 --> 00:21:16,520
Speaker 4: directly for the sake of like I don't know, there's

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Speaker 4: if you're a listener, there's a lot.

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Speaker 3: Of Scooby Doo content.

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Speaker 4: We're mostly going to be sticking to the movie, but

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Speaker 4: you know, in the context of who these characters have meant,

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Speaker 4: I think, especially with like Daphne and Velma and a

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Speaker 4: little bit of Fred, there's a lot to talk about.

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Speaker 4: I think it's an interesting and wholesome kind of property.

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Speaker 4: And I do remember there was something of a shit

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Speaker 4: storm surrounding, like discourse around the Mindy Kaling Velma series

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Speaker 4: that came out last year. I'm gonna say I'm not

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Speaker 4: touching that. I'm not touching that I didn't watch it.

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Speaker 3: I don't know. The only dull.

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Speaker 1: Thing I will say that I think is relevant to

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Speaker 1: our discussion is that the cast of Scooby Doo has

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Speaker 1: for a very very long time been white, just a

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Speaker 1: bunch of white people. And then Velma, the HBO Max

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Speaker 1: or whatever, just Max whatever, it's HBO, what trying to

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Speaker 1: make Max happen?

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Speaker 4: Anyway, I know the world is going to be incinerated

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Speaker 4: in ten years.

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Speaker 1: Nothing matters. Yeah, but the animated series Velma starring and

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Speaker 1: I think like executive produced by Mindy Kaling. Mindy Kaling

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Speaker 1: plays Velma. There's also Constance Wu plays Daphne and Sam

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Speaker 1: Richardson plays Shaggy, as well as Glenn Howardton playing Fred.

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Speaker 1: So three of the four main cast are people of

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Speaker 1: color in the series. So it, you know, course corrects

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Speaker 1: this problem of you know, Scooby Doo being extremely white. Unfortunately,

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Speaker 1: audiences hated that series and the creative liberties it took right,

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Speaker 1: which I from my recollection of it, was not connected

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Speaker 1: to the Scooby Doo gang not being white.

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Speaker 4: It was more connected to just like the writing and

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Speaker 4: how the series ended up.

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Speaker 3: I don't yeah, I again, I didn't watch it because

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Speaker 3: it just seemed so nuclear. Maybe it was good. I

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Speaker 3: don't know.

438
00:23:12,240 --> 00:23:15,960
Speaker 4: I yeah, I remember like there being an initial wave

439
00:23:16,000 --> 00:23:19,120
Speaker 4: of excitement of like, oh, this historically like white group

440
00:23:19,160 --> 00:23:23,080
Speaker 4: of teenagers. Like they're like they're diversifying this cast in

441
00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:26,159
Speaker 4: a way that makes total sense. But then I do

442
00:23:26,280 --> 00:23:30,520
Speaker 4: remember there being conversation around handling the queerness of the

443
00:23:30,560 --> 00:23:33,320
Speaker 4: group was considered to be fumbled all this other stuff

444
00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:36,560
Speaker 4: We didn't but that's not what we're talking about today.

445
00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:38,560
Speaker 4: But all I have to say the fact that there

446
00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:42,320
Speaker 4: was a massive wave of Scooby Dooby discourse within the

447
00:23:42,400 --> 00:23:47,240
Speaker 4: last calendar year. These characters people care, they don't care

448
00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:51,320
Speaker 4: about what's going on with these damn kids. Yeah, I

449
00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:53,919
Speaker 4: think that this was in conclusion, I think this was

450
00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:59,560
Speaker 4: a movie that was was formative and also one where

451
00:23:59,760 --> 00:24:04,920
Speaker 4: I just like the women are they're really they're really

452
00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:07,320
Speaker 4: doing something, They're really doing something cool in this movie.

453
00:24:07,359 --> 00:24:11,800
Speaker 4: I just remember being like, Wow, Linda Cardliniewater interesting, interesting,

454
00:24:12,280 --> 00:24:16,399
Speaker 4: and I'm thinking about it, all right, let's talk about

455
00:24:16,960 --> 00:24:20,040
Speaker 4: and also like for because I think we will be

456
00:24:20,080 --> 00:24:24,920
Speaker 4: talking about this at length within the conversation after the recap.

457
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:29,320
Speaker 4: This is directed by Rajah Gosnell and screenplay and story

458
00:24:29,440 --> 00:24:34,000
Speaker 4: by James Gunn, who has spoken about this movie extensively.

459
00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:37,760
Speaker 4: He is later famous for doing Guardians at the Galaxy.

460
00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:45,440
Speaker 3: He's currently in charge of that. Master Yeah has encountered

461
00:24:45,440 --> 00:24:46,960
Speaker 3: his you know share of.

462
00:24:48,440 --> 00:24:51,480
Speaker 4: You know, public humiliation in the way that I feel

463
00:24:51,480 --> 00:24:55,560
Speaker 4: like anyone who gets remotely near superhero properties does. But

464
00:24:55,880 --> 00:24:58,520
Speaker 4: in general it seems to be a pretty beloved writer

465
00:24:58,760 --> 00:25:03,400
Speaker 4: and certainly loves talking about Scooby doo So we're gonna

466
00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:05,920
Speaker 4: be getting into that Scooby Dooey discourse.

467
00:25:06,560 --> 00:25:09,560
Speaker 1: But first, yes, first a break, and then we will

468
00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:20,000
Speaker 1: come back for the recap, and we're back.

469
00:25:21,800 --> 00:25:25,119
Speaker 4: Is there any is rot Row, It's Scooby Dooey Doo,

470
00:25:25,200 --> 00:25:31,639
Speaker 4: It's zoinks and for me it'sinks. Okay, h zoinks? What

471
00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:32,960
Speaker 4: happens in this movie? Case?

472
00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:38,720
Speaker 1: Okay? Well, first of all, we are in Coolsville, USA.

473
00:25:39,320 --> 00:25:42,040
Speaker 1: M ever heard of it?

474
00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:48,320
Speaker 3: I just like it's so Scooby Doobe goofy. I just

475
00:25:48,920 --> 00:25:52,760
Speaker 3: love how like brain Dead some of it is. I

476
00:25:52,800 --> 00:25:55,480
Speaker 3: love Yeah, Colesville, Yes, perfect.

477
00:25:56,000 --> 00:25:59,960
Speaker 1: We open on Mystery inc aka like the Scooby Game,

478
00:26:00,480 --> 00:26:04,800
Speaker 1: solving a group of bisexual teenagers, Yes, and their large

479
00:26:04,840 --> 00:26:09,240
Speaker 1: dog who can talk. They are solving a mystery at

480
00:26:09,400 --> 00:26:13,600
Speaker 1: a toy factory. Of course, it's Shaggy played by Matthew Lillard.

481
00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:19,159
Speaker 1: Fred is Freddy Prince Junior, Velma is Linda Cardellini, Daphne

482
00:26:19,200 --> 00:26:22,719
Speaker 1: is Sarah Michelle Geller, and of course Scooby Doo and

483
00:26:22,760 --> 00:26:24,399
Speaker 1: he's voiced by Neil Fanning.

484
00:26:24,800 --> 00:26:27,040
Speaker 4: Yeah, who is not our normal Scooby. I think we

485
00:26:27,040 --> 00:26:35,440
Speaker 4: would normally have Oh gosh, Frank, not your normal Scooby.

486
00:26:37,320 --> 00:26:42,679
Speaker 1: Yes, okay, So they stop this guy, old man Smithers,

487
00:26:43,040 --> 00:26:47,840
Speaker 1: who is pretending to be a ghost, and he's like,

488
00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:50,159
Speaker 1: I would have gotten away with it too, if it

489
00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:52,200
Speaker 1: weren't for you meddling kids.

490
00:26:52,760 --> 00:26:57,000
Speaker 4: Cloud yet another phrase intrinsically connected to the Scooby universe.

491
00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:00,159
Speaker 1: And then a bunch of people show up. What do

492
00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:04,520
Speaker 1: you think, Pamela Anderson? God, And it's quote unquote her

493
00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:07,280
Speaker 1: fault that old man Smithers did this whole thing to

494
00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:09,680
Speaker 1: begin with because she wouldn't go out with him.

495
00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:10,440
Speaker 3: Frank.

496
00:27:10,600 --> 00:27:14,960
Speaker 4: So now, welker, Frank, oh, welker. And I only say

497
00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:16,960
Speaker 4: that because we've talked about him on the show before.

498
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:20,960
Speaker 4: He's like a legendary voice actor. Yes, And I love

499
00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:24,200
Speaker 4: voice actors. Okay, Frank Walker, but this is not Frank

500
00:27:24,240 --> 00:27:26,480
Speaker 4: weldcler Let's go back to the discussion.

501
00:27:27,080 --> 00:27:30,760
Speaker 1: Yes, okay, So Pamela Anderson is there because it's her

502
00:27:30,920 --> 00:27:32,720
Speaker 1: toy factory question mark.

503
00:27:32,960 --> 00:27:35,320
Speaker 3: Okay, not sure she's a girl boss to get the

504
00:27:35,320 --> 00:27:35,840
Speaker 3: toy factory.

505
00:27:35,840 --> 00:27:39,280
Speaker 1: It's great, yeah, yeah, And so everyone's like, wow, good job,

506
00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:40,560
Speaker 1: mystery inc.

507
00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:43,240
Speaker 4: This was a This was a big thing for movies

508
00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:45,199
Speaker 4: of two thousand and two, because if we're talking about

509
00:27:45,240 --> 00:27:48,960
Speaker 4: like goofy children's movies of two thousand and two, unavoidable

510
00:27:49,119 --> 00:27:53,840
Speaker 4: or avoidable until I'm forcing the discussion, is a Master

511
00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:57,440
Speaker 4: of Disguss starring Dana Carvey comes out in this same

512
00:27:57,560 --> 00:28:00,199
Speaker 4: stretch of time, We've got Scooby Doo coming out in June.

513
00:28:00,600 --> 00:28:04,600
Speaker 4: Master's Disguise on its heels August second, two thousand and two,

514
00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:09,639
Speaker 4: and that movie also opens with a nostalgic to children,

515
00:28:09,960 --> 00:28:12,920
Speaker 4: meaningless reveal of a famous woman.

516
00:28:13,000 --> 00:28:13,760
Speaker 3: In Master of.

517
00:28:13,760 --> 00:28:18,720
Speaker 4: Disguise, it's Bo Derek rips off a rubber mask with

518
00:28:18,880 --> 00:28:23,000
Speaker 4: James Brolin, and she's Bo Derek, and that's you know,

519
00:28:23,200 --> 00:28:25,960
Speaker 4: that's for parents. I guess this is I think that

520
00:28:26,000 --> 00:28:29,320
Speaker 4: we're getting kind of a lot of and I have

521
00:28:29,359 --> 00:28:30,680
Speaker 4: a quote for this.

522
00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:32,680
Speaker 3: Later in the episode.

523
00:28:32,720 --> 00:28:37,719
Speaker 4: But this movie, I think you can very clearly trace

524
00:28:37,840 --> 00:28:41,880
Speaker 4: its lineage too, coming off the success of Shrek.

525
00:28:42,320 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 3: Shrek changed everything.

526
00:28:44,360 --> 00:28:46,160
Speaker 4: We know this to be true. I really do feel

527
00:28:46,160 --> 00:28:47,480
Speaker 4: like it comes up on the show at least once

528
00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:51,600
Speaker 4: a month. Shrek changed everything because now you have to

529
00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:54,800
Speaker 4: have jokes for parents as well, and that becomes like

530
00:28:54,920 --> 00:28:57,440
Speaker 4: very inherent to what popular children's media is.

531
00:28:57,720 --> 00:28:58,640
Speaker 3: And I think that you can.

532
00:28:58,520 --> 00:29:02,160
Speaker 4: Really really see that reflected in Scooby Doo, which comes

533
00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:05,400
Speaker 4: out the following year, and James Gunn, Oh god, he

534
00:29:05,600 --> 00:29:08,880
Speaker 4: used this very funny turn of phrase.

535
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:12,480
Speaker 3: Oh he said in the heat of Shrek. That's what

536
00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:18,000
Speaker 3: he said. There, excuse me, in the heat of Shrek.

537
00:29:18,400 --> 00:29:20,240
Speaker 3: It's like in the heat of the kind of movie.

538
00:29:20,360 --> 00:29:21,959
Speaker 1: It's in the heat of Shrek.

539
00:29:22,400 --> 00:29:25,160
Speaker 3: In the heat of Shrek. But there is I think

540
00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:25,800
Speaker 3: that that's.

541
00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:28,640
Speaker 4: Like there are there's a quality to these like children's

542
00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:31,560
Speaker 4: movies of the early two thousands that are like a

543
00:29:31,600 --> 00:29:34,680
Speaker 4: little raunchier than than they even are now.

544
00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:37,720
Speaker 3: Due to the heat of Shrek.

545
00:29:40,320 --> 00:29:44,280
Speaker 1: Wow, and and Trek makes me feel like I'm in heat,

546
00:29:44,560 --> 00:29:46,000
Speaker 1: so you know.

547
00:29:48,240 --> 00:29:51,400
Speaker 3: What, so awesome, I'm sorry.

548
00:29:53,560 --> 00:29:57,440
Speaker 4: Okay, okay, sorry, sorry, sorry sorry.

549
00:29:57,440 --> 00:29:58,760
Speaker 3: We're in the first scene of the movies.

550
00:29:59,000 --> 00:30:03,640
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, okay, So mystery Ink solves the mystery. Everyone's like, wow,

551
00:30:03,720 --> 00:30:08,200
Speaker 1: good job, and Fred is like, yeah, I basically did everything,

552
00:30:08,960 --> 00:30:12,959
Speaker 1: and so Velma is upset with Fred for taking credit

553
00:30:13,000 --> 00:30:15,600
Speaker 1: for her plan, and she decides to quit.

554
00:30:15,880 --> 00:30:20,080
Speaker 4: I really like the choice of dynamics between characters.

555
00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:22,840
Speaker 3: I think there's room for more. We'll talk about it.

556
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:24,520
Speaker 3: But I kind of.

557
00:30:24,440 --> 00:30:26,360
Speaker 4: Because I'd seen this movie a bunch of times, but

558
00:30:26,640 --> 00:30:30,000
Speaker 4: easily not in at least like five years, and I

559
00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:34,160
Speaker 4: kind of forgot that, like Fred and Velma have a

560
00:30:34,200 --> 00:30:36,000
Speaker 4: bit of a power struggle, but it makes sense with

561
00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:38,480
Speaker 4: their characters, and I liked it.

562
00:30:38,680 --> 00:30:44,240
Speaker 1: Yeah, so yeah, so Velma quits. Then Daphne, who does

563
00:30:44,280 --> 00:30:47,560
Speaker 1: not like that she's the one who's always getting kidnapped

564
00:30:47,600 --> 00:30:51,880
Speaker 1: and damseled, also quits okay, and then Fred quits because

565
00:30:51,880 --> 00:30:56,680
Speaker 1: everyone else is quitting, So now it's just Shaggy and Scooby.

566
00:30:57,520 --> 00:31:00,840
Speaker 1: We cut to two years later. Shaggy and Scooby are

567
00:31:00,880 --> 00:31:04,520
Speaker 1: living on the beach. They're just chilling, you know, they're

568
00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:05,960
Speaker 1: just vamping.

569
00:31:06,240 --> 00:31:07,840
Speaker 3: Maybe they're vamping.

570
00:31:08,760 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 1: Isn't that what you would used to what.

571
00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:19,160
Speaker 3: No, there was a phrase that.

572
00:31:19,120 --> 00:31:21,640
Speaker 1: You have said on the podcast, like probably honestly seven

573
00:31:21,720 --> 00:31:22,160
Speaker 1: years ago.

574
00:31:22,640 --> 00:31:25,840
Speaker 3: They're very Actually, I couldn't have said that. What was it?

575
00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:26,320
Speaker 1: Okay?

576
00:31:26,480 --> 00:31:29,480
Speaker 3: What was I trying to express at that time? Like

577
00:31:29,640 --> 00:31:32,760
Speaker 3: just chilling lamping? Lamping lamp.

578
00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:38,640
Speaker 4: And even that now makes me sound ancient, crusty dead.

579
00:31:38,880 --> 00:31:39,320
Speaker 3: That's so.

580
00:31:40,080 --> 00:31:41,800
Speaker 4: Yeah, that was like what you would say if you

581
00:31:41,800 --> 00:31:43,520
Speaker 4: were like hanging out with your friends in.

582
00:31:43,440 --> 00:31:44,200
Speaker 3: Two thousand and nine.

583
00:31:44,400 --> 00:31:47,320
Speaker 4: It's because and that's from a movie that we haven't covered,

584
00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:49,600
Speaker 4: and I.

585
00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:51,960
Speaker 3: Don't think we ever need to Napoleon Dynamite. That's where

586
00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:54,480
Speaker 3: that comes from. Oh, I am.

587
00:31:54,400 --> 00:31:57,520
Speaker 1: Not realize that was the source of it. Okay, So

588
00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:00,800
Speaker 1: I love lamp lamping. Is that vamping is just like

589
00:32:00,840 --> 00:32:03,240
Speaker 1: what you do when you're on stage and you need

590
00:32:03,280 --> 00:32:03,960
Speaker 1: to kill ten.

591
00:32:03,840 --> 00:32:08,160
Speaker 3: The nice comedian is still not arrived, right.

592
00:32:08,400 --> 00:32:11,560
Speaker 4: Vaping is what they would have been doing if you

593
00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:13,880
Speaker 4: could show that in the movie took place twenty years later.

594
00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:16,160
Speaker 3: What they are doing is smoking weed in a van

595
00:32:16,200 --> 00:32:16,640
Speaker 3: for two.

596
00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 4: Years, but that they're not allowed you know, you're not

597
00:32:18,960 --> 00:32:19,800
Speaker 4: allowed to show it.

598
00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:22,240
Speaker 3: But in the heat of Shrek, you can imply it.

599
00:32:22,840 --> 00:32:24,680
Speaker 3: In the heat of shrug. You can imply it, you

600
00:32:24,760 --> 00:32:25,520
Speaker 3: just can't show it.

601
00:32:25,920 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 1: Yes, okay, so they're not vamping. They're lamping. Well, they

602
00:32:29,880 --> 00:32:32,360
Speaker 1: are kind of just killing time until the rest of

603
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:34,360
Speaker 1: mystery something happens.

604
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:39,920
Speaker 4: Yeah, they're really like the Yeah, they're eating, they're snacking.

605
00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:45,520
Speaker 1: But they're not detectives any more until they're approached by

606
00:32:45,600 --> 00:32:48,840
Speaker 1: someone who wants them to come to an amusement park

607
00:32:49,560 --> 00:32:54,400
Speaker 1: called Spooky Island because there's a mystery at the park

608
00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:55,640
Speaker 1: that needs solving.

609
00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:59,120
Speaker 4: Another brainless title for a location, and you're like, mmm,

610
00:32:59,560 --> 00:33:01,880
Speaker 4: the only way this could get better is if mister.

611
00:33:01,800 --> 00:33:06,440
Speaker 3: Bean was on the island. Well, guess what.

612
00:33:06,360 --> 00:33:09,560
Speaker 4: Baby, But first we go, we go to the airport

613
00:33:09,640 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 4: and we see the gang reunite, which is important and

614
00:33:12,240 --> 00:33:16,360
Speaker 4: formative because of Daphne's suitcases matching her dress.

615
00:33:16,840 --> 00:33:20,920
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, yes, the other members of Mystery Ink have

616
00:33:21,240 --> 00:33:25,160
Speaker 1: also received letters inviting them to Spooky Island. None of

617
00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:27,920
Speaker 1: them know that the other members of the group were

618
00:33:27,960 --> 00:33:30,560
Speaker 1: going to be there, and so they kind of reluctantly

619
00:33:31,120 --> 00:33:36,000
Speaker 1: bored the flight to Spooky Island. On the plane, Shaggy

620
00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:40,400
Speaker 1: meets a woman named Mary Jane lay By Isle of Fisher.

621
00:33:40,800 --> 00:33:45,680
Speaker 4: Incredible that that is what she's doing in this movie,

622
00:33:46,680 --> 00:33:47,200
Speaker 4: Mary Jane.

623
00:33:47,280 --> 00:33:50,120
Speaker 3: Again, we're in the heat of Shrek and these things

624
00:33:50,120 --> 00:33:50,640
Speaker 3: will happen.

625
00:33:52,400 --> 00:33:55,960
Speaker 1: And Mary Jane and Shaggy have a lot in common,

626
00:33:56,080 --> 00:33:59,360
Speaker 1: and they're flirting, they're vibing, they're lamping.

627
00:33:59,360 --> 00:34:02,160
Speaker 3: Maybe even we have to get it. We have to

628
00:34:02,160 --> 00:34:03,360
Speaker 3: stop saying it. We have to.

629
00:34:05,400 --> 00:34:09,240
Speaker 1: Okay. So they arrive on Spooky Island and meet Emil

630
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:13,799
Speaker 1: Mondavarius ka Rowan Atkinson aka mister Bean.

631
00:34:14,480 --> 00:34:17,719
Speaker 3: We do quick? Have I mentioned this on the show?

632
00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:21,640
Speaker 4: I think about it frequently as a big James A

633
00:34:21,800 --> 00:34:22,359
Speaker 4: castor fan.

634
00:34:22,400 --> 00:34:26,440
Speaker 3: Do you know where I'm going with this? Oh? Yes, okay.

635
00:34:26,680 --> 00:34:31,920
Speaker 4: I love James a Caster. He whatever he's doing right now,

636
00:34:32,000 --> 00:34:35,520
Speaker 4: I wish him well. He released an amazing special and

637
00:34:35,560 --> 00:34:38,080
Speaker 4: I think, like twenty twenty or twenty twenty one, I

638
00:34:38,080 --> 00:34:41,919
Speaker 4: think calls like called like cold Lasagna in nineteen ninety eight,

639
00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:46,239
Speaker 4: want to kill myself, something like that. The thrust of

640
00:34:46,400 --> 00:34:55,080
Speaker 4: this thrust Caitlin, the thrust of the special involves him

641
00:34:55,239 --> 00:34:58,680
Speaker 4: after like years, I think, close to a decade, disclosing

642
00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:03,160
Speaker 4: that his one time fiance left him for mister Bean,

643
00:35:03,719 --> 00:35:06,680
Speaker 4: and how as a comedian it was a very challenging

644
00:35:06,800 --> 00:35:09,319
Speaker 4: secret to keep due to the fact that it was

645
00:35:09,360 --> 00:35:12,640
Speaker 4: a devastating to his life and b being left for

646
00:35:12,760 --> 00:35:16,160
Speaker 4: mister Bean is kind of the funniest way to be

647
00:35:16,239 --> 00:35:21,799
Speaker 4: abandoned by someone you love, to be like, sorry, I've

648
00:35:21,840 --> 00:35:24,000
Speaker 4: fallen in love with mister Bean. I'm pregnant with mister

649
00:35:24,000 --> 00:35:24,960
Speaker 4: Bean's baby.

650
00:35:25,680 --> 00:35:32,759
Speaker 1: Gregmand with mister mister Greg Bean, and anyways, I wish

651
00:35:32,880 --> 00:35:33,399
Speaker 1: them the best.

652
00:35:33,480 --> 00:35:37,560
Speaker 4: Mister Bean still married to I'm not gonna give her

653
00:35:37,560 --> 00:35:41,120
Speaker 4: government name, you know, like, but I just remember, I mean,

654
00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:42,919
Speaker 4: it's a great special And I also was like, wow,

655
00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:46,359
Speaker 4: James Acaster, classy for keeping that under your hat for

656
00:35:46,400 --> 00:35:48,880
Speaker 4: ten years. I don't think I would have been that

657
00:35:48,960 --> 00:35:53,120
Speaker 4: successful if if, if my beloved had had run out

658
00:35:53,200 --> 00:35:57,880
Speaker 4: on me from one mister Bean. Anyways, mister Bean's on

659
00:35:57,880 --> 00:36:00,600
Speaker 4: the island, yes, and he's not acting stilly, and so

660
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:01,920
Speaker 4: we're like, something's up.

661
00:36:02,640 --> 00:36:06,440
Speaker 1: So he believes he runs the amusement park Spooky Island,

662
00:36:06,640 --> 00:36:09,279
Speaker 1: and I think the island is also called Spooky I'm

663
00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:09,720
Speaker 1: not sure.

664
00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:10,960
Speaker 3: Anyway, we don't know.

665
00:36:11,320 --> 00:36:15,919
Speaker 1: He believes that someone is casting a magic spell on

666
00:36:16,200 --> 00:36:19,440
Speaker 1: the college students who go to the park for spring break,

667
00:36:20,320 --> 00:36:25,920
Speaker 1: and he believes this because they arrive all lively and excited,

668
00:36:26,160 --> 00:36:30,360
Speaker 1: but when they leave, they're like kind of zombie esque.

669
00:36:30,440 --> 00:36:33,839
Speaker 1: They're like just you know, dull and quiet.

670
00:36:33,719 --> 00:36:36,320
Speaker 3: Just kind of like boring, boring.

671
00:36:36,480 --> 00:36:39,759
Speaker 4: Right, Yeah, they don't leave, they're like I think the

672
00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:43,000
Speaker 4: subtext to is like they arrive slutty, they leave.

673
00:36:43,719 --> 00:36:46,600
Speaker 1: Not slutty, they're not horny.

674
00:36:48,400 --> 00:36:52,640
Speaker 3: Just like interesting, what a quandary for mister Bean.

675
00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:57,520
Speaker 1: Right, So the Scooby Gang gets to work on solving

676
00:36:57,640 --> 00:37:04,640
Speaker 1: the mystery. Velma goes to an event I'm not sure where.

677
00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:10,160
Speaker 1: This guy nagu Tauna is pissed at a Meal for

678
00:37:10,239 --> 00:37:16,280
Speaker 1: building his park on this land and disturbing and displacing

679
00:37:16,920 --> 00:37:22,320
Speaker 1: these like creatures slash ancient beings who lived on the island,

680
00:37:22,880 --> 00:37:27,920
Speaker 1: and the island is a thoroughfare to a supernatural realm.

681
00:37:28,560 --> 00:37:33,880
Speaker 1: And we'll talk all about that representation, yes, in a bit.

682
00:37:33,840 --> 00:37:37,440
Speaker 4: At of the major weaknesses of a fine movie.

683
00:37:37,600 --> 00:37:37,920
Speaker 3: Yes.

684
00:37:38,800 --> 00:37:43,439
Speaker 1: So, now Nagoo is a suspect on a different part

685
00:37:43,440 --> 00:37:48,040
Speaker 1: of the island. Daphne is investigating and runs into this

686
00:37:48,160 --> 00:37:53,600
Speaker 1: man who is doing a quote unquote voodoo ritual. We

687
00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:58,000
Speaker 1: will also talk about how that is represented. And he's like,

688
00:37:58,760 --> 00:38:04,440
Speaker 1: definitely do not go into the Spooky Island Castle, and

689
00:38:04,520 --> 00:38:09,280
Speaker 1: so she's like, well, obviously I have to go there now. Meanwhile,

690
00:38:09,480 --> 00:38:13,520
Speaker 1: Scooby is being lured into the creepy forest with the

691
00:38:13,560 --> 00:38:17,560
Speaker 1: promise of a bag of hamburgers, and while he's there,

692
00:38:17,600 --> 00:38:22,600
Speaker 1: he gets attacked. Scooby, Yes, he gets attacked by some

693
00:38:22,719 --> 00:38:27,560
Speaker 1: kind of monster and he escapes and rushes over to Shaggy,

694
00:38:28,239 --> 00:38:33,640
Speaker 1: who again is still flirting and vibing with Mary Jane.

695
00:38:33,760 --> 00:38:36,080
Speaker 1: And then Daphne also shows up and she's like, Okay,

696
00:38:36,080 --> 00:38:39,359
Speaker 1: we got to go check out this castle. So they

697
00:38:39,360 --> 00:38:42,359
Speaker 1: go to the castle. Fred and Velma are already there

698
00:38:42,400 --> 00:38:44,839
Speaker 1: scoping things out, and it turns out to be this

699
00:38:45,280 --> 00:38:50,359
Speaker 1: ride that's closed for maintenance, and the group splits up

700
00:38:50,400 --> 00:38:55,360
Speaker 1: to search the castle for clues. Now, Fred and Velma

701
00:38:55,400 --> 00:39:01,240
Speaker 1: find what appears to be a brainwashing facility for a cult. Yeah,

702
00:39:01,280 --> 00:39:06,480
Speaker 1: Shaggy and Scooby find the set of a TV show

703
00:39:06,640 --> 00:39:10,800
Speaker 1: and then they have a burping and farting contest there. Also,

704
00:39:10,880 --> 00:39:13,440
Speaker 1: does that set ever come back in any way?

705
00:39:13,920 --> 00:39:16,680
Speaker 4: Not that I could tell, No, And I do think,

706
00:39:16,760 --> 00:39:20,000
Speaker 4: I mean, I guess that that is just like again,

707
00:39:20,080 --> 00:39:25,520
Speaker 4: I mean and I mean it is maybe creatively foolish

708
00:39:25,600 --> 00:39:30,399
Speaker 4: to have Scooby and Norvil shaggy rogers, you know, like

709
00:39:30,520 --> 00:39:32,200
Speaker 4: in the mix and not.

710
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:35,440
Speaker 1: Farting farts and burps. Yeah.

711
00:39:35,560 --> 00:39:37,879
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's kind of their whole their whole thing came.

712
00:39:38,080 --> 00:39:41,120
Speaker 1: Well, all come on and in the heat of trek

713
00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:45,040
Speaker 1: and the of people and.

714
00:39:45,000 --> 00:39:49,560
Speaker 4: Farting booming for a burping and farting extravagance. In fact,

715
00:39:49,640 --> 00:39:53,440
Speaker 4: I'm on IMDb right now, brack Wow.

716
00:39:53,960 --> 00:39:55,040
Speaker 3: Going to the.

717
00:39:54,920 --> 00:39:57,480
Speaker 4: Tags, the tags for Scooby you two thousand and two.

718
00:39:58,000 --> 00:40:02,800
Speaker 4: First tag farting contest. Wow, second tag two thousand's, third

719
00:40:02,840 --> 00:40:06,600
Speaker 4: tag strong female Character, fourth tag fart.

720
00:40:08,560 --> 00:40:10,319
Speaker 1: Okay, so.

721
00:40:11,960 --> 00:40:15,040
Speaker 4: You know there's a lot of which I mean, if

722
00:40:15,120 --> 00:40:17,840
Speaker 4: you if those aren't shreky in tags as well.

723
00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:21,480
Speaker 1: I mean you could argue that you could. Yes, you

724
00:40:21,560 --> 00:40:26,080
Speaker 1: certainly could. Okay, So the farting contest is happening. Meanwhile,

725
00:40:26,239 --> 00:40:30,840
Speaker 1: Daphne finds this little like pyramid shaped relic of some kind,

726
00:40:31,680 --> 00:40:34,600
Speaker 1: and so they all leave the castle and start doing

727
00:40:34,680 --> 00:40:39,480
Speaker 1: further research. Velma goes to some kind of like restaurant

728
00:40:39,680 --> 00:40:43,799
Speaker 1: lounge place to study the relic, which she thinks is

729
00:40:43,840 --> 00:40:48,600
Speaker 1: something called the Damon Ritis, and this guy approaches her

730
00:40:48,680 --> 00:40:51,719
Speaker 1: who's gonna kind of be her love interests sort of,

731
00:40:51,760 --> 00:40:55,040
Speaker 1: but we never learn his names. Guy, I don't think.

732
00:40:55,400 --> 00:40:59,719
Speaker 4: He couldn't be more script notes if he tried. This

733
00:40:59,760 --> 00:41:02,279
Speaker 4: is a guy who wanders out of the ether he

734
00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:05,320
Speaker 4: may not even be alive, and tries to force Velma

735
00:41:05,360 --> 00:41:06,960
Speaker 4: Dinklely into like it's.

736
00:41:06,840 --> 00:41:08,920
Speaker 3: Like Gillie, it's like Jeelie.

737
00:41:09,000 --> 00:41:13,879
Speaker 4: What he's doing, He's he's just he's like, no canonically gay,

738
00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:16,440
Speaker 4: you know, since clarified canonically gay.

739
00:41:16,360 --> 00:41:18,839
Speaker 3: Character, you are my girlfriend.

740
00:41:18,880 --> 00:41:25,600
Speaker 1: And she's like, oh, okay, boo boo to the nameless

741
00:41:25,640 --> 00:41:31,759
Speaker 1: script notes guy. Yeah, Well she tells him about Mystery Inc.

742
00:41:31,920 --> 00:41:35,759
Speaker 1: And we get this flashback of the Scooby Gang in

743
00:41:35,840 --> 00:41:40,200
Speaker 1: the Mystery Machine and Scrappy Doo is there and.

744
00:41:40,239 --> 00:41:44,480
Speaker 4: He and now and now I'm really booing because I

745
00:41:44,880 --> 00:41:45,920
Speaker 4: do you hate Scrappy do?

746
00:41:46,120 --> 00:41:47,680
Speaker 3: Can we all agree he hate Scrapy?

747
00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:52,600
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, I do, I do d o O. He's

748
00:41:53,160 --> 00:41:58,080
Speaker 1: a b I T th WHOA okay anyway, he pisses

749
00:41:58,080 --> 00:42:02,480
Speaker 1: all over Daphne. Yeah, so they kick him out of

750
00:42:02,480 --> 00:42:02,840
Speaker 1: the group.

751
00:42:03,080 --> 00:42:06,600
Speaker 3: He pisses all over Did you hear that sentence? Yeah,

752
00:42:06,640 --> 00:42:09,880
Speaker 3: Scrappy Doo huge ooh I hate.

753
00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:12,600
Speaker 4: Scrappy Doo and even as a kid, I think kids

754
00:42:12,600 --> 00:42:17,880
Speaker 4: find Scrappy Doo grating obnoxious. He tucks in his little well,

755
00:42:18,680 --> 00:42:22,640
Speaker 4: he's Scooby Doo is his uncle, and he's disrespectful to him.

756
00:42:22,680 --> 00:42:26,440
Speaker 1: See, I, I guess have mixed feelings because while the

757
00:42:26,520 --> 00:42:30,720
Speaker 1: character is you know, annoying and not a good person,

758
00:42:30,760 --> 00:42:31,360
Speaker 1: not a good.

759
00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:34,960
Speaker 3: Dog, bad dog, bad dog.

760
00:42:34,800 --> 00:42:38,040
Speaker 1: But it's revealed that he has he's not a puppy,

761
00:42:38,160 --> 00:42:41,400
Speaker 1: which I think is maybe commonly assumed that he is

762
00:42:41,480 --> 00:42:44,680
Speaker 1: because he's small. But it's like, but they're like, he's

763
00:42:44,680 --> 00:42:48,160
Speaker 1: not even a puppy. He has a gland disorder. And

764
00:42:48,200 --> 00:42:51,080
Speaker 1: then all the characters laugh at him for it. They're

765
00:42:51,120 --> 00:42:54,000
Speaker 1: like making fun of him for something he can't help.

766
00:42:54,320 --> 00:42:57,719
Speaker 4: So that I, again, I canonically choose to believe that

767
00:42:57,719 --> 00:43:01,520
Speaker 4: that was a script note to make Scrappy more sympathetic

768
00:43:01,719 --> 00:43:05,400
Speaker 4: to audiences because he is I because I do. I

769
00:43:05,440 --> 00:43:09,920
Speaker 4: mean that on its face absolutely ablest. Yeah, but that

770
00:43:10,040 --> 00:43:12,480
Speaker 4: is not canonical to the character Scrappy Do. What is

771
00:43:12,520 --> 00:43:14,319
Speaker 4: cononical to the character Scrappy Do is.

772
00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:19,799
Speaker 3: Being annoying and I, oh, oh, he just pisses me off.

773
00:43:20,000 --> 00:43:23,400
Speaker 4: And I have a specific when he gets jacked at

774
00:43:23,400 --> 00:43:26,640
Speaker 4: the end of the movie spoiler alert when he gets jacked,

775
00:43:26,680 --> 00:43:29,520
Speaker 4: that CG has never sat well.

776
00:43:29,400 --> 00:43:32,880
Speaker 1: It's so scary, honestly, some of the worst CG that

777
00:43:33,000 --> 00:43:36,000
Speaker 1: two thousand and two had to offer. And I was like, oh,

778
00:43:36,120 --> 00:43:38,600
Speaker 1: maybe it's just because they had a low budget. But

779
00:43:38,640 --> 00:43:40,680
Speaker 1: this had an eighty four million dollar budget.

780
00:43:40,800 --> 00:43:43,960
Speaker 4: No, they they could have and they didn't, and it

781
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:47,759
Speaker 4: requires it requires there should there should have been a

782
00:43:47,800 --> 00:43:49,279
Speaker 4: federal investigation about it.

783
00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:51,120
Speaker 3: Yeah.

784
00:43:51,160 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 1: Anyway, so we learn about we meet you know, Scrappy

785
00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:57,040
Speaker 1: Doo on screen in this movie for the first time,

786
00:43:57,400 --> 00:43:59,439
Speaker 1: and he gets kicked out of the group. We cut

787
00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:04,600
Speaker 1: back to the present and suddenly monsters attack and abduct

788
00:44:04,760 --> 00:44:05,720
Speaker 1: Fred and Velma.

789
00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:08,080
Speaker 3: Because monsters are real question.

790
00:44:07,760 --> 00:44:14,160
Speaker 1: Mark, We don't no, but I think yes, I don't know.

791
00:44:14,280 --> 00:44:18,120
Speaker 4: I think in this world yes, which is you know,

792
00:44:18,400 --> 00:44:22,080
Speaker 4: we don't have time to get into it, debate amongst yourselves.

793
00:44:23,400 --> 00:44:26,879
Speaker 1: So Fred and Velma have been abducted, so now it's

794
00:44:26,960 --> 00:44:30,600
Speaker 1: up to Daphne, Shaggy Scooby, and also Mary Jane is

795
00:44:30,640 --> 00:44:33,840
Speaker 1: there to solve the mystery and save their friends.

796
00:44:34,040 --> 00:44:36,160
Speaker 4: Also Mary Jane is there. It does sort of some

797
00:44:36,320 --> 00:44:38,040
Speaker 4: of how that character is treated throughout the.

798
00:44:38,000 --> 00:44:42,400
Speaker 3: Movie, right, she's there also, she is there.

799
00:44:42,840 --> 00:44:46,600
Speaker 1: But the next day, after they've like all passed out

800
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:50,360
Speaker 1: on the beach for some reason, everything seems back to normal,

801
00:44:50,480 --> 00:44:53,560
Speaker 1: as if there was no monster attack. And then Sugar

802
00:44:53,680 --> 00:44:57,520
Speaker 1: Ray is there putting on a concert and nineties icon

803
00:44:57,760 --> 00:44:59,160
Speaker 1: Mark McGrath.

804
00:44:58,800 --> 00:44:59,680
Speaker 3: He's up to start.

805
00:45:01,600 --> 00:45:04,560
Speaker 1: He starts singing to Daphne, but then she notices that

806
00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:07,760
Speaker 1: his eyes have this green glow.

807
00:45:07,840 --> 00:45:12,680
Speaker 4: Because he has supernatural powers to doy, oh, I forgot

808
00:45:12,719 --> 00:45:17,279
Speaker 4: about that cameo. What a treat for Mark McGrath to

809
00:45:17,400 --> 00:45:21,240
Speaker 4: have his eyes start glowing green, trying to get Sarah

810
00:45:21,280 --> 00:45:25,799
Speaker 4: Michelle Gellar to fall for his little tricks, Like just

811
00:45:25,960 --> 00:45:30,719
Speaker 4: really unbelievable stuff. I really enjoyed it.

812
00:45:31,239 --> 00:45:36,120
Speaker 1: So his eyes are green, which is the color of Shrek.

813
00:45:36,600 --> 00:45:39,799
Speaker 1: You know, I bet originally in the heat of Shrek, Shrek,

814
00:45:39,840 --> 00:45:41,200
Speaker 1: you're gonna want to make things green.

815
00:45:41,239 --> 00:45:44,280
Speaker 3: Bet it was red originally. But they're like, no, no, no, green.

816
00:45:44,400 --> 00:45:47,560
Speaker 4: Green is green is the warmest color in two thousand

817
00:45:47,560 --> 00:45:48,840
Speaker 4: and two in the Heat of Shrek.

818
00:45:50,160 --> 00:45:50,600
Speaker 3: Forget it.

819
00:45:50,960 --> 00:45:56,880
Speaker 1: Okay, So Shaggy finds Fred, whose eyes are also glowing green. Oh,

820
00:45:57,320 --> 00:45:59,880
Speaker 1: along with basically all the other people on the island

821
00:46:00,280 --> 00:46:03,960
Speaker 1: because they're possessed, and then they're also talking in a

822
00:46:04,000 --> 00:46:07,720
Speaker 1: way that feels very culturally appropriative. Yes, for some reason.

823
00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:08,960
Speaker 3: We will get back to that too.

824
00:46:09,040 --> 00:46:14,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, but they are also trying to possess Shaggy and Scooby,

825
00:46:14,600 --> 00:46:19,759
Speaker 1: who escape on a pair of four wheelers and they

826
00:46:19,880 --> 00:46:23,120
Speaker 1: link back up with Mary Jane, but oh no, Scooby

827
00:46:23,160 --> 00:46:26,359
Speaker 1: sees that she has green eyes too, and when he

828
00:46:26,440 --> 00:46:31,160
Speaker 1: tries to tell Shaggy about it, Shaggy doesn't believe him,

829
00:46:31,640 --> 00:46:34,440
Speaker 1: and so they kind of like have a fight, and

830
00:46:34,480 --> 00:46:38,400
Speaker 1: then they all end up in this cave where Shaggy

831
00:46:38,560 --> 00:46:41,839
Speaker 1: finds this like well type thing.

832
00:46:42,040 --> 00:46:44,440
Speaker 3: There's a lot of plot. There's a lot of plot

833
00:46:44,520 --> 00:46:46,319
Speaker 3: in this area, and you're just sort of.

834
00:46:46,239 --> 00:46:46,759
Speaker 4: Like, h.

835
00:46:48,719 --> 00:46:51,719
Speaker 1: So, there's this well where all of the possessed, the

836
00:46:51,760 --> 00:46:57,560
Speaker 1: people who have been possessed, they're like spirits slash souls

837
00:46:57,840 --> 00:47:04,480
Speaker 1: slash protoplasms or swimming around, and Shaggy finds Velma's spirit

838
00:47:04,560 --> 00:47:06,720
Speaker 1: and releases it so it can return to her body,

839
00:47:07,640 --> 00:47:12,520
Speaker 1: and then the monster that was possessing Velma's body is

840
00:47:12,600 --> 00:47:15,400
Speaker 1: kind of like forced out and explodes in the sunlight.

841
00:47:15,640 --> 00:47:20,240
Speaker 1: So she realizes that these monsters need human bodies to

842
00:47:20,560 --> 00:47:23,719
Speaker 1: survive and like walk around in the sunlight, which is

843
00:47:23,760 --> 00:47:28,239
Speaker 1: why they're possessing all of these college kids. Shaggy then

844
00:47:28,320 --> 00:47:33,080
Speaker 1: also saves Fred and Daphne, and then there's this body

845
00:47:33,160 --> 00:47:38,840
Speaker 1: swap scene where the protoplasms returned to the wrong bodies

846
00:47:39,560 --> 00:47:40,520
Speaker 1: and it.

847
00:47:40,200 --> 00:47:43,480
Speaker 3: Is well, I mean, I'm sure we'll circle back to

848
00:47:43,480 --> 00:47:44,040
Speaker 3: that scene as.

849
00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:48,879
Speaker 4: Well, but like the it felt very of the era

850
00:47:49,080 --> 00:47:54,719
Speaker 4: where whenever one of the men's spirits would be transported

851
00:47:54,760 --> 00:47:59,319
Speaker 4: into a woman's body, you would hear it just was

852
00:47:59,440 --> 00:48:03,799
Speaker 4: very like prescriptive, where it's like the men's spirits would

853
00:48:03,800 --> 00:48:08,000
Speaker 4: always be like, hey, this is my personality. But when

854
00:48:08,040 --> 00:48:09,920
Speaker 4: it was the women's spirit, when it was a man

855
00:48:10,000 --> 00:48:13,720
Speaker 4: spirit going into one of the into Daphnie or Velma's bodies,

856
00:48:13,760 --> 00:48:17,839
Speaker 4: it was like, look at my boob, I'm gonna like.

857
00:48:17,840 --> 00:48:20,640
Speaker 3: It's just it was very like creepy, or.

858
00:48:20,640 --> 00:48:24,600
Speaker 1: Like, Daphne, don't you eat anything? What's wrong?

859
00:48:25,480 --> 00:48:29,440
Speaker 4: That was like, oh, my god, saying that to a

860
00:48:29,560 --> 00:48:31,879
Speaker 4: young woman in two thousand and two, are you that's

861
00:48:31,960 --> 00:48:36,040
Speaker 4: not it's not funny. One of the most fucking evil

862
00:48:36,120 --> 00:48:40,480
Speaker 4: times for talking about women's bodies in the last you know, century,

863
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:45,960
Speaker 4: it's just it's just very ugly behavior. Yeah, that whole sequence, well,

864
00:48:46,000 --> 00:48:48,680
Speaker 4: I think that there were interesting opportunities for that sequence

865
00:48:49,040 --> 00:48:50,719
Speaker 4: sure fell flat for.

866
00:48:50,719 --> 00:48:54,759
Speaker 1: Me, I agree. Also reminded me of a similar sequence

867
00:48:54,960 --> 00:48:57,080
Speaker 1: in Jumanji Welcome to the Jungle.

868
00:48:57,480 --> 00:48:59,759
Speaker 3: Yes, yes, and it was also.

869
00:49:01,360 --> 00:49:04,400
Speaker 4: A little bit freaky Friday, although that's you know, just

870
00:49:04,440 --> 00:49:08,919
Speaker 4: between mother and a duaa. But just if there's any

871
00:49:08,920 --> 00:49:12,640
Speaker 4: body swap with a person with breasts, they're going to

872
00:49:12,680 --> 00:49:18,040
Speaker 4: grope themselves. Yes, and the implications will be complicated and

873
00:49:18,080 --> 00:49:20,040
Speaker 4: it will not be very fun to watch.

874
00:49:21,200 --> 00:49:22,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, that seemed it was a bit of a mess.

875
00:49:23,239 --> 00:49:29,040
Speaker 1: Yeah. So eventually everyone ends up in the right body

876
00:49:29,280 --> 00:49:33,200
Speaker 1: and Velma figures out that the creatures are about to

877
00:49:33,360 --> 00:49:41,239
Speaker 1: perform the Dark copp Lips Ritual, another incredible naming convention. Yep,

878
00:49:41,400 --> 00:49:47,000
Speaker 1: great turn of phrase, where the leader, whoever the leader is,

879
00:49:47,440 --> 00:49:53,280
Speaker 1: needs to absorb a purely good soul to complete the ritual,

880
00:49:53,719 --> 00:49:57,880
Speaker 1: and once the ritual is performed, the creatures will rule

881
00:49:57,920 --> 00:49:59,640
Speaker 1: the world for ten thousand years.

882
00:50:00,239 --> 00:50:03,560
Speaker 3: Who's got a pure soul? Ah?

883
00:50:03,600 --> 00:50:06,239
Speaker 1: Well, of course it's Scooby Dooby.

884
00:50:05,960 --> 00:50:09,840
Speaker 4: Doo, even though he did bully his nephew but outside

885
00:50:09,840 --> 00:50:10,960
Speaker 4: of that pretty pure.

886
00:50:11,040 --> 00:50:16,239
Speaker 1: M hmmm hmmm. And they realized that a Meal Mondavarius

887
00:50:16,320 --> 00:50:19,160
Speaker 1: must be behind the whole thing since he invited Scooby

888
00:50:19,680 --> 00:50:24,239
Speaker 1: and the gang to the island. So they go back

889
00:50:24,320 --> 00:50:28,160
Speaker 1: to the cave to try to stop the ritual and

890
00:50:28,200 --> 00:50:32,359
Speaker 1: save Scooby Doo, who has been kidnapped. But they get

891
00:50:32,400 --> 00:50:36,880
Speaker 1: caught and Scooby's spirit gets plucked out of his body,

892
00:50:37,600 --> 00:50:42,480
Speaker 1: but Shaggy saves him and he knocks over a Meal Mondavarius.

893
00:50:42,600 --> 00:50:45,919
Speaker 4: When we're at the point in the movie where it's like, oh,

894
00:50:45,960 --> 00:50:48,400
Speaker 4: the steaks are Scooby Doo's very soul.

895
00:50:49,440 --> 00:50:52,440
Speaker 3: Yeah, the soul, the eternal soul of do.

896
00:50:53,120 --> 00:50:58,040
Speaker 4: I was just like, this movie is like unbelievably great.

897
00:50:58,160 --> 00:51:02,719
Speaker 4: I had a list of things that happen in order

898
00:51:02,760 --> 00:51:04,880
Speaker 4: of intensity and how much they shocked me.

899
00:51:06,120 --> 00:51:09,080
Speaker 3: Mister Bean wants Scubert to take advantage of his pure soul.

900
00:51:09,440 --> 00:51:11,479
Speaker 3: That's the meeting that takes place, and there's a great

901
00:51:11,520 --> 00:51:12,200
Speaker 3: shot where.

902
00:51:12,040 --> 00:51:15,920
Speaker 4: Scooby Doo is smiling at a picture of himself, yes

903
00:51:16,360 --> 00:51:20,640
Speaker 4: and laughing. Next, mister Bean wants Scooby to sacrifice himself

904
00:51:20,840 --> 00:51:25,320
Speaker 4: to God. Basically, then mister Bean wants to absorb Scooby

905
00:51:25,320 --> 00:51:26,399
Speaker 4: Doo's soul so.

906
00:51:26,320 --> 00:51:27,240
Speaker 3: He can live forever.

907
00:51:28,239 --> 00:51:32,399
Speaker 4: And then what we're about to get to Freddie Prince

908
00:51:32,480 --> 00:51:35,719
Speaker 4: Junior pulls off mister Bean's face to reveal that he's

909
00:51:35,719 --> 00:51:37,760
Speaker 4: a chucky cheese animatronic robot.

910
00:51:38,239 --> 00:51:42,920
Speaker 1: Yes, and the person inside or the being inside is

911
00:51:43,760 --> 00:51:44,600
Speaker 1: scrappy Do.

912
00:51:45,400 --> 00:51:51,520
Speaker 4: Crappy Do, and where like mister Bean was scrappy Do?

913
00:51:52,160 --> 00:51:55,759
Speaker 3: And what does that mean in the context of the

914
00:51:55,840 --> 00:51:57,160
Speaker 3: James A. Caster story?

915
00:51:57,680 --> 00:52:00,560
Speaker 1: Whoa Well? And then it's I'm getting ahead of myself here,

916
00:52:00,600 --> 00:52:03,640
Speaker 1: but it's revealed that there is actually a guy named

917
00:52:03,719 --> 00:52:08,600
Speaker 1: Emil Mondavarius and Scrappy Do had been like hiding him

918
00:52:08,600 --> 00:52:11,080
Speaker 1: in a dungeon for the past two years.

919
00:52:12,760 --> 00:52:17,200
Speaker 4: Unlike, we can't even talk about the political implications of

920
00:52:17,200 --> 00:52:19,759
Speaker 4: what took place on Spooky Island, like.

921
00:52:20,360 --> 00:52:25,480
Speaker 3: It is just absolutely it's sick. It's sick what was done?

922
00:52:26,080 --> 00:52:29,279
Speaker 1: M hmm, Okay, So Scrappy Doo turns out to be

923
00:52:29,320 --> 00:52:32,120
Speaker 1: the bad guy and he has absorbed enough souls to

924
00:52:32,239 --> 00:52:37,640
Speaker 1: turn into this big muscular monster dog thing and he's

925
00:52:37,719 --> 00:52:42,560
Speaker 1: trying to kill Scooby and the others. But meanwhile, Daphne

926
00:52:42,600 --> 00:52:46,760
Speaker 1: has escaped and she like goes up onto the mountain

927
00:52:47,520 --> 00:52:51,319
Speaker 1: and opens the vents to let the sunlight in. But

928
00:52:51,480 --> 00:52:55,360
Speaker 1: there's this luchador guy who I forgot to mention earlier,

929
00:52:55,880 --> 00:53:00,319
Speaker 1: but he's friends with Nagua and he shows up up

930
00:53:00,760 --> 00:53:03,480
Speaker 1: and so she fights him because she's no longer the

931
00:53:03,560 --> 00:53:07,960
Speaker 1: damsel in distress. She's it's cheap, the cheap move.

932
00:53:08,239 --> 00:53:12,160
Speaker 3: It's a cheap move, but you know, yes, we're cheering.

933
00:53:12,800 --> 00:53:17,920
Speaker 1: So she's fighting him, and she opens up the vent

934
00:53:18,000 --> 00:53:21,239
Speaker 1: and the light comes in, and then down below the

935
00:53:21,360 --> 00:53:25,200
Speaker 1: others are able to stop Scrappy Doo. This is when

936
00:53:25,200 --> 00:53:30,040
Speaker 1: they find the real a meal Mandavarius. Everyone reunites, some

937
00:53:30,080 --> 00:53:35,319
Speaker 1: people kiss each other or they're like canoodling, and the

938
00:53:35,480 --> 00:53:38,439
Speaker 1: possessed college kids go back to normal and the day

939
00:53:38,640 --> 00:53:42,080
Speaker 1: is saved. And then the movie ends with Shaggy and

940
00:53:42,440 --> 00:53:46,280
Speaker 1: Scooby eating a big meal the end.

941
00:53:46,880 --> 00:53:49,239
Speaker 3: Like them do do.

942
00:53:50,239 --> 00:53:55,640
Speaker 4: We're gonna take a quick break, but we'll rewright.

943
00:54:03,040 --> 00:54:05,000
Speaker 1: And we're rack.

944
00:54:05,440 --> 00:54:05,959
Speaker 3: We're rack.

945
00:54:07,000 --> 00:54:11,279
Speaker 4: With your permission, I would like to start this discussion, yea,

946
00:54:11,640 --> 00:54:17,400
Speaker 4: with the discussion of queerness within the Scooby universe, please,

947
00:54:18,040 --> 00:54:22,399
Speaker 4: So there's quite a bit to discuss here. I think

948
00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:27,520
Speaker 4: like as we sort of alluded to earlier in the episode,

949
00:54:27,520 --> 00:54:28,759
Speaker 4: there is a fair amount of.

950
00:54:30,239 --> 00:54:33,080
Speaker 3: Just like lore as far as it goes.

951
00:54:33,840 --> 00:54:38,040
Speaker 4: I think the characters who have been most famously queer

952
00:54:38,160 --> 00:54:40,279
Speaker 4: coded in the crew, I think Velma is the most

953
00:54:40,280 --> 00:54:45,240
Speaker 4: popularly discussed one. Going back to the show's initial release,

954
00:54:46,440 --> 00:54:48,960
Speaker 4: there was always, I guess, sort of an undercurrent of

955
00:54:49,239 --> 00:54:51,600
Speaker 4: questioning what her sexuality was.

956
00:54:53,520 --> 00:54:56,480
Speaker 3: You know, I think it's reasonable in a children's cartoons.

957
00:54:56,160 --> 00:55:00,440
Speaker 4: Like it wasn't addressed, and I don't think at the

958
00:55:00,520 --> 00:55:03,719
Speaker 4: time it would have ever been. I think that the

959
00:55:03,840 --> 00:55:08,680
Speaker 4: main certainly not and what you did know, And I

960
00:55:08,680 --> 00:55:12,279
Speaker 4: think because you have in this group, you have like

961
00:55:12,480 --> 00:55:17,200
Speaker 4: four very specific types that make sense for nineteen sixty nine.

962
00:55:17,239 --> 00:55:19,840
Speaker 4: You have a stoner, you have a quote unquote like

963
00:55:20,160 --> 00:55:22,799
Speaker 4: nerdy girl, you have a popular girl, and you have a.

964
00:55:22,840 --> 00:55:25,480
Speaker 3: Jock, all very typed characters.

965
00:55:25,520 --> 00:55:28,000
Speaker 4: But what I think is cool is like you don't

966
00:55:28,040 --> 00:55:32,080
Speaker 4: usually see these characters as like being close friends. However,

967
00:55:32,239 --> 00:55:34,960
Speaker 4: inside of that, the quote unquote cool guy and cool

968
00:55:34,960 --> 00:55:38,319
Speaker 4: girl friend Daphne, they're always paired together. That is very

969
00:55:38,440 --> 00:55:41,560
Speaker 4: much implied within this movie as well, to the point

970
00:55:41,560 --> 00:55:44,360
Speaker 4: where they cast a married couple as Fred and.

971
00:55:44,400 --> 00:55:47,120
Speaker 1: Daphne right, and then they kiss at the end, and then.

972
00:55:47,080 --> 00:55:48,919
Speaker 3: They kiss at the end. I mean, it's and that's

973
00:55:49,000 --> 00:55:52,560
Speaker 3: very inherent to who those characters have been speculated to be.

974
00:55:53,640 --> 00:55:55,520
Speaker 4: But I think that Scooby Doo two thousand and two

975
00:55:56,280 --> 00:56:00,600
Speaker 4: and Scooby dooee scholars I'm sure could trace this earlier.

976
00:56:00,640 --> 00:56:03,680
Speaker 3: But starting in Scooby Doo two.

977
00:56:03,960 --> 00:56:07,320
Speaker 4: This at least was attempted to be like these long

978
00:56:07,480 --> 00:56:11,880
Speaker 4: discussions because there also was discussion of potential queer coding

979
00:56:12,160 --> 00:56:13,280
Speaker 4: for Fred.

980
00:56:14,560 --> 00:56:15,799
Speaker 3: This was sort of the first.

981
00:56:15,520 --> 00:56:22,600
Speaker 4: Time that this was even attempted to be addressed in

982
00:56:22,680 --> 00:56:24,560
Speaker 4: the Scooby Doo be universe.

983
00:56:25,800 --> 00:56:28,200
Speaker 3: So what that means?

984
00:56:28,520 --> 00:56:32,040
Speaker 4: And James Gunn addressed this in a twenty twenty Twitter thread.

985
00:56:32,480 --> 00:56:37,560
Speaker 3: Because he just the man loves to talk. There were

986
00:56:37,600 --> 00:56:38,760
Speaker 3: two characters who.

987
00:56:38,680 --> 00:56:45,600
Speaker 4: Were planned to be explicitly queer to some extent. Fred's

988
00:56:45,680 --> 00:56:47,279
Speaker 4: character is a little more complicated, so we'll get to

989
00:56:47,280 --> 00:56:50,080
Speaker 4: that in a second. But James Gunn says in twenty twenty,

990
00:56:50,400 --> 00:56:53,000
Speaker 4: in two thousand and one, Velma was explicitly gay in

991
00:56:53,040 --> 00:56:55,719
Speaker 4: my initial script, but the studio just kept watering it

992
00:56:55,760 --> 00:56:58,720
Speaker 4: down and watering it down, becoming ambiguous. The version shot,

993
00:56:59,080 --> 00:57:03,280
Speaker 4: then nothing released version, and finally having a boyfriend the sequel,

994
00:57:03,320 --> 00:57:05,680
Speaker 4: although I would argue that she's basically given a boyfriend

995
00:57:05,680 --> 00:57:07,320
Speaker 4: in the original as well.

996
00:57:07,400 --> 00:57:11,040
Speaker 1: Right, and then the sequel, Seth Green shows up and

997
00:57:11,200 --> 00:57:12,160
Speaker 1: he becomes her.

998
00:57:12,160 --> 00:57:15,920
Speaker 3: Love interest, and you know, and I have no comment.

999
00:57:16,920 --> 00:57:19,600
Speaker 4: I have no comment to my dear friend Seth Green,

1000
00:57:20,680 --> 00:57:23,280
Speaker 4: and later, like Linda Cardelini, would also comment on this,

1001
00:57:23,320 --> 00:57:25,720
Speaker 4: all of the actors. I think that the difference between

1002
00:57:26,320 --> 00:57:30,440
Speaker 4: I feel like there is this tendency for writers creators

1003
00:57:30,440 --> 00:57:34,880
Speaker 4: in general, to like course correct their work in retrospect,

1004
00:57:34,920 --> 00:57:37,600
Speaker 4: to be like, oh well, I actually like I think

1005
00:57:37,640 --> 00:57:39,439
Speaker 4: that the most popular example from one of the worst

1006
00:57:39,440 --> 00:57:42,280
Speaker 4: people of all time was when JK. Rowling originally was like,

1007
00:57:42,360 --> 00:57:46,360
Speaker 4: actually Dumbledore was gay. I just didn't write it down,

1008
00:57:46,800 --> 00:57:50,000
Speaker 4: but I meant too, and you're just like, okay, Evil,

1009
00:57:50,080 --> 00:57:53,480
Speaker 4: be quiet. But I think that this story is actually

1010
00:57:53,560 --> 00:57:57,440
Speaker 4: different because the actors all corroborated this, and there was

1011
00:57:57,480 --> 00:57:58,240
Speaker 4: stuff shot.

1012
00:57:58,480 --> 00:58:00,840
Speaker 3: It was written in the heat of Shrek.

1013
00:58:01,720 --> 00:58:05,440
Speaker 4: I think that James Gunn's script was approved as a

1014
00:58:05,560 --> 00:58:08,000
Speaker 4: more I mean problematic in its own ways, but even

1015
00:58:08,080 --> 00:58:12,760
Speaker 4: just an attempt at LGBT representation at all. In two

1016
00:58:12,760 --> 00:58:14,800
Speaker 4: thousand and two in a kid's movie would have been

1017
00:58:15,400 --> 00:58:19,120
Speaker 4: you know, different, and it would have meant something, but

1018
00:58:19,240 --> 00:58:21,800
Speaker 4: it was all cut out and mister script notes was

1019
00:58:21,840 --> 00:58:26,000
Speaker 4: added and on all of this. Linda Cardilini has also

1020
00:58:26,040 --> 00:58:29,240
Speaker 4: commented on this. She said, Velma has been around since

1021
00:58:29,280 --> 00:58:32,240
Speaker 4: nineteen sixty nine. I just went trick or treating with

1022
00:58:32,240 --> 00:58:34,080
Speaker 4: my daughter and there were a lot of Velmas out there,

1023
00:58:34,120 --> 00:58:36,160
Speaker 4: and so I love that she still has this place

1024
00:58:36,200 --> 00:58:38,040
Speaker 4: in culture that is always.

1025
00:58:37,720 --> 00:58:39,160
Speaker 3: Sort of active for decades.

1026
00:58:39,600 --> 00:58:41,520
Speaker 4: I think her being a lesbian has been hinted at

1027
00:58:41,560 --> 00:58:43,560
Speaker 4: so many times, and I think it's great that it's

1028
00:58:43,600 --> 00:58:47,120
Speaker 4: finally out there, which is in response to the first

1029
00:58:47,320 --> 00:58:52,320
Speaker 4: time that Velma Dinkley was explicitly stated as a queer

1030
00:58:52,400 --> 00:58:57,160
Speaker 4: character is in twenty twenty two, like exactly a year

1031
00:58:57,200 --> 00:59:00,680
Speaker 4: ago to the day we're recording this happy coming out

1032
00:59:00,720 --> 00:59:05,880
Speaker 4: anniversary to Velma. In a TV movie called Trigger treat

1033
00:59:06,000 --> 00:59:10,280
Speaker 4: Scooby Doo, she's depicted as a queer woman who has

1034
00:59:10,320 --> 00:59:12,720
Speaker 4: a crush on a character named Coco Diablo.

1035
00:59:12,840 --> 00:59:16,680
Speaker 3: Because of course, sure we're not covering that movie. And

1036
00:59:16,720 --> 00:59:19,560
Speaker 3: then in the in the Mindy Kaling.

1037
00:59:19,800 --> 00:59:24,120
Speaker 4: Iteration, I believe she's bisexual and I believe in the

1038
00:59:24,120 --> 00:59:27,080
Speaker 4: Mindy Kaling version, Daphne is also bisexual.

1039
00:59:27,760 --> 00:59:30,280
Speaker 1: I couldn't say don't know anything about.

1040
00:59:29,960 --> 00:59:34,600
Speaker 4: It again Scooby dooe scholars sound off, but I think

1041
00:59:34,640 --> 00:59:38,120
Speaker 4: that like the fact that truly like it's an interesting

1042
00:59:38,280 --> 00:59:41,680
Speaker 4: kind of yardstick to measure what is considered quote unquote

1043
00:59:41,720 --> 00:59:46,120
Speaker 4: acceptable in widespread children's media. That it was literally just

1044
00:59:46,240 --> 00:59:52,120
Speaker 4: last year that Velma was.

1045
00:59:50,480 --> 00:59:52,920
Speaker 3: Was a queer character in a way that like was

1046
00:59:52,960 --> 00:59:56,800
Speaker 3: not challenged, but there were I think.

1047
00:59:56,680 --> 00:59:58,680
Speaker 4: That Scooby Doo two thousand and two is kind of

1048
00:59:58,680 --> 01:00:04,959
Speaker 4: the earliest meaningful attempt from what I was able to gathera.

1049
01:00:05,520 --> 01:00:08,800
Speaker 3: Fred was also written to be a queer character.

1050
01:00:09,400 --> 01:00:11,880
Speaker 4: Freddie Brince Prince Junior has stated in interviews that that

1051
01:00:12,000 --> 01:00:13,720
Speaker 4: was what he was told when he took the part,

1052
01:00:13,800 --> 01:00:18,960
Speaker 4: and so his performance was that was his performance.

1053
01:00:18,520 --> 01:00:22,520
Speaker 3: And then the way that it was edited didn't honor that.

1054
01:00:22,760 --> 01:00:27,400
Speaker 4: But I do think it's interesting that the actors were

1055
01:00:27,440 --> 01:00:30,200
Speaker 4: playing queer characters, but the movie would not let them

1056
01:00:30,920 --> 01:00:34,760
Speaker 4: actually be those characters. The scene that was shot and

1057
01:00:34,800 --> 01:00:40,120
Speaker 4: cut the I think most explicitly, there was a kiss

1058
01:00:40,120 --> 01:00:46,200
Speaker 4: between Daphne and Velma. Apparently in this scene Daphne and

1059
01:00:46,240 --> 01:00:49,400
Speaker 4: Fred are together and they run into drunk Velma when

1060
01:00:49,440 --> 01:00:55,760
Speaker 4: she's at the bar, and she's I guess, like flirting ambiguously,

1061
01:00:55,880 --> 01:01:00,160
Speaker 4: and it seems like she's actually flirting with Daphne. That's

1062
01:01:00,200 --> 01:01:02,440
Speaker 4: what got shot. There was a kiss written into the

1063
01:01:02,440 --> 01:01:08,640
Speaker 4: script that never got shot. And to conclude, Sarah Mitchell

1064
01:01:08,720 --> 01:01:12,160
Speaker 4: Geller also commented on this all the way back in

1065
01:01:12,200 --> 01:01:13,240
Speaker 4: two thousand and two, like, this.

1066
01:01:13,200 --> 01:01:15,080
Speaker 3: Is very inherent to this movie.

1067
01:01:15,280 --> 01:01:17,760
Speaker 4: Sarah Michell Geller told sci Fi Wire in two thousand

1068
01:01:17,760 --> 01:01:20,960
Speaker 4: and two that a Velment and Daphnie kissing scene was

1069
01:01:21,000 --> 01:01:21,960
Speaker 4: cut out from the film.

1070
01:01:22,240 --> 01:01:23,920
Speaker 3: Quote, it wasn't just like for fun.

1071
01:01:24,000 --> 01:01:26,320
Speaker 4: Initially, in the soul swapping, velmentt and Daphnie could not

1072
01:01:26,320 --> 01:01:28,160
Speaker 4: seem to get their souls back together in the woods,

1073
01:01:28,160 --> 01:01:29,760
Speaker 4: and so the way they found was to kiss, and

1074
01:01:29,760 --> 01:01:31,040
Speaker 4: the souls went back into.

1075
01:01:30,880 --> 01:01:32,800
Speaker 3: The proper alignment unquote.

1076
01:01:33,360 --> 01:01:36,440
Speaker 4: So that soul swapping scene that we discussed as not

1077
01:01:36,720 --> 01:01:41,880
Speaker 4: loving was also initially difference, and I guess significantly rewritten.

1078
01:01:42,040 --> 01:01:43,840
Speaker 3: So I think it is interesting.

1079
01:01:44,560 --> 01:01:49,040
Speaker 4: I will sort of leave it to individual listeners to decide,

1080
01:01:49,320 --> 01:01:52,640
Speaker 4: but I mean, I do think that that would have

1081
01:01:52,760 --> 01:01:56,520
Speaker 4: made a difference and certainly would have impacted the direction

1082
01:01:56,680 --> 01:02:01,640
Speaker 4: that this Goopy franchise took for there if James Gun's

1083
01:02:01,640 --> 01:02:06,760
Speaker 4: original script had been honored. But I think it's just

1084
01:02:06,920 --> 01:02:13,160
Speaker 4: very frustrating and telling that this like simple choice that

1085
01:02:13,280 --> 01:02:18,040
Speaker 4: seemed like it would have been pretty consistent with who

1086
01:02:18,280 --> 01:02:21,480
Speaker 4: the general public thought these characters to be wouldn't be

1087
01:02:21,480 --> 01:02:24,120
Speaker 4: honored for another twenty years.

1088
01:02:24,760 --> 01:02:25,160
Speaker 3: Wild.

1089
01:02:26,720 --> 01:02:34,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, And there's like additional coding with Velma's character and

1090
01:02:34,800 --> 01:02:40,440
Speaker 1: then kind of how she's compared to Daphne, because, as

1091
01:02:40,440 --> 01:02:43,320
Speaker 1: you were saying the whole, you know, these characters are

1092
01:02:43,440 --> 01:02:47,960
Speaker 1: very stereotyped as being you know, one's the jock, one's

1093
01:02:48,040 --> 01:02:52,640
Speaker 1: the smart girl, one's the hot girl, one's this stonor

1094
01:02:53,440 --> 01:02:59,960
Speaker 1: This movie honors those like very archetypal type of character

1095
01:03:01,200 --> 01:03:05,520
Speaker 1: pretty in a way that's like not at all challenged.

1096
01:03:06,320 --> 01:03:09,680
Speaker 1: And I think it's just because, like, you know, Daphne

1097
01:03:09,720 --> 01:03:13,080
Speaker 1: is like the hot one quote unquote who's like always

1098
01:03:13,520 --> 01:03:17,600
Speaker 1: being damseled, and she's depicted as being not as smart

1099
01:03:17,720 --> 01:03:21,520
Speaker 1: as Velma because Velma is the smart one, and she

1100
01:03:22,440 --> 01:03:29,040
Speaker 1: therefore cannot be hot also by the movies logic, and well.

1101
01:03:28,960 --> 01:03:31,720
Speaker 4: I feel like that was a little like complicated in

1102
01:03:31,760 --> 01:03:34,240
Speaker 4: the scrape of the movie, because it's like the movie

1103
01:03:34,440 --> 01:03:38,400
Speaker 4: acknowledged because it's like, obviously these the girls are hot,

1104
01:03:38,440 --> 01:03:41,120
Speaker 4: like they're both right, well.

1105
01:03:41,000 --> 01:03:44,440
Speaker 3: Be serious, stop joking around, stop fucking with me.

1106
01:03:45,360 --> 01:03:48,880
Speaker 4: But the way that I thought that was addressed because

1107
01:03:48,880 --> 01:03:53,120
Speaker 4: it's like, I mean, Velma, I feel like is very peak, like.

1108
01:03:53,320 --> 01:03:55,520
Speaker 3: You would be so beautiful if you take of your

1109
01:03:55,560 --> 01:03:56,560
Speaker 3: glasses girl.

1110
01:03:57,160 --> 01:03:59,040
Speaker 4: And that has always been true, like she's always been

1111
01:03:59,080 --> 01:04:02,360
Speaker 4: like an adorable character. And the way that it's addressed

1112
01:04:02,360 --> 01:04:06,200
Speaker 4: in this movie is that Fred at one point says

1113
01:04:06,280 --> 01:04:10,080
Speaker 4: to Velma like that, He's like, no, I get it.

1114
01:04:09,960 --> 01:04:12,720
Speaker 3: Like you're you're also hot.

1115
01:04:12,840 --> 01:04:16,800
Speaker 1: He says, dorky girls like you turn me onto Yeah,

1116
01:04:16,840 --> 01:04:19,480
Speaker 1: you're like scoffs at it, and he's like, what it's

1117
01:04:19,520 --> 01:04:20,800
Speaker 1: a compliment.

1118
01:04:21,520 --> 01:04:23,680
Speaker 3: That that was a disaster.

1119
01:04:23,720 --> 01:04:25,600
Speaker 4: I think that as close as the movie comes to

1120
01:04:25,680 --> 01:04:28,880
Speaker 4: acknowledging that, like these women are both gorgeous, but yeah,

1121
01:04:29,000 --> 01:04:33,400
Speaker 4: like like you're saying, like plays into the stereotypes surrounding

1122
01:04:33,480 --> 01:04:36,360
Speaker 4: the stock characters that I don't know, I mean, I

1123
01:04:36,520 --> 01:04:40,320
Speaker 4: I think that the movie did better than I was

1124
01:04:41,000 --> 01:04:45,200
Speaker 4: expecting it to off of memory, just in the I

1125
01:04:45,200 --> 01:04:48,400
Speaker 4: don't know, the weird middle place where I felt I

1126
01:04:48,440 --> 01:04:52,440
Speaker 4: had feelings about this surrounding the recent Barbie movie as well,

1127
01:04:52,920 --> 01:04:58,080
Speaker 4: where it felt like the movie had a real vested

1128
01:04:58,120 --> 01:05:03,880
Speaker 4: interest in commenting on the perception of a long standing

1129
01:05:04,040 --> 01:05:08,760
Speaker 4: character more so than presenting this is who this character

1130
01:05:08,920 --> 01:05:12,320
Speaker 4: is and they're fully realized. It's more like very like

1131
01:05:12,440 --> 01:05:15,200
Speaker 4: self aware kind of writing where you're like, well, I

1132
01:05:15,280 --> 01:05:18,920
Speaker 4: know how everyone thinks of Barbie as like a bimbo

1133
01:05:19,040 --> 01:05:22,080
Speaker 4: who can't do anything, So I'm going to present that

1134
01:05:22,240 --> 01:05:24,760
Speaker 4: image and then challenge it throughout the course of the movie,

1135
01:05:25,200 --> 01:05:27,840
Speaker 4: or like with I think that that is.

1136
01:05:27,760 --> 01:05:31,400
Speaker 3: Like pretty I guess more so with Daphne.

1137
01:05:30,800 --> 01:05:33,680
Speaker 4: But like presents Daphne as like, well, we all think

1138
01:05:33,760 --> 01:05:35,439
Speaker 4: of Daphne as this damsel.

1139
01:05:35,160 --> 01:05:38,000
Speaker 3: In distress, but what if she had a problem with.

1140
01:05:37,920 --> 01:05:40,880
Speaker 4: That, and then that's her that's her journey throughout the movie,

1141
01:05:40,920 --> 01:05:42,440
Speaker 4: which I don't really have a problem with it, just

1142
01:05:42,480 --> 01:05:45,640
Speaker 4: it seems like it's like a step towards being able

1143
01:05:45,680 --> 01:05:48,320
Speaker 4: to do something more with that character. Is like addressing

1144
01:05:49,080 --> 01:05:51,200
Speaker 4: I don't know, there's more, there's plenty of ways to

1145
01:05:51,240 --> 01:05:55,000
Speaker 4: handle that, but like addressing the public perception, pushing the

1146
01:05:55,080 --> 01:05:58,080
Speaker 4: character through that public perception and.

1147
01:05:58,040 --> 01:06:02,080
Speaker 3: Then hopefully moving them onto something cooler. But I don't know.

1148
01:06:02,360 --> 01:06:06,080
Speaker 4: Daffey's story I thought was interesting. I think it's like

1149
01:06:06,400 --> 01:06:10,160
Speaker 4: tricky because she is still presented as like not as

1150
01:06:10,480 --> 01:06:13,200
Speaker 4: smart as the rest of the group at different moments.

1151
01:06:14,040 --> 01:06:17,760
Speaker 4: But I was, you know, in the heat of Shrek,

1152
01:06:18,160 --> 01:06:23,080
Speaker 4: I was, I guess, like gently impressed at how she

1153
01:06:23,880 --> 01:06:27,480
Speaker 4: did sort of like tackle people's assumptions about her fairly

1154
01:06:27,560 --> 01:06:30,760
Speaker 4: head on. And you know, by the end of the movie,

1155
01:06:31,520 --> 01:06:35,280
Speaker 4: had you know, dismantled that view of her, where like

1156
01:06:35,520 --> 01:06:37,320
Speaker 4: when the first time she says she has a black belt,

1157
01:06:37,360 --> 01:06:39,160
Speaker 4: it's sort of implied that no one believes her.

1158
01:06:40,200 --> 01:06:42,520
Speaker 3: And then at the end she fights.

1159
01:06:42,240 --> 01:06:48,400
Speaker 4: A lucha door so okay, right, which.

1160
01:06:47,440 --> 01:06:51,640
Speaker 1: Mirrors the evolution of her character and how it went

1161
01:06:52,320 --> 01:06:58,360
Speaker 1: in the various like series where in the original animated

1162
01:06:58,440 --> 01:07:02,520
Speaker 1: series that you know premier in the late sixties, she

1163
01:07:02,680 --> 01:07:06,760
Speaker 1: was very much just like danger prone, you know, she

1164
01:07:07,680 --> 01:07:10,320
Speaker 1: didn't seem to have a lot to contribute, and she

1165
01:07:10,440 --> 01:07:14,640
Speaker 1: was always the one getting kidnapped. But then later versions

1166
01:07:15,040 --> 01:07:18,600
Speaker 1: of the show made a change to her character, so

1167
01:07:18,800 --> 01:07:21,160
Speaker 1: like versions that came out in the nineties and two

1168
01:07:21,200 --> 01:07:26,400
Speaker 1: thousands had her knowing martial arts and like being able

1169
01:07:26,480 --> 01:07:32,640
Speaker 1: to defend herself. So cool movie recognized that and was like, Okay,

1170
01:07:32,640 --> 01:07:35,120
Speaker 1: we're gonna like kind of show that whole arc in

1171
01:07:35,680 --> 01:07:40,400
Speaker 1: this movie. So yeah, she opens up being damseled, Like

1172
01:07:40,480 --> 01:07:43,760
Speaker 1: in that opening scene, she's not only been kidnapped but

1173
01:07:43,840 --> 01:07:46,680
Speaker 1: also the ghost. I think it's implied that it keeps

1174
01:07:46,680 --> 01:07:48,680
Speaker 1: like touching her butt, and.

1175
01:07:49,080 --> 01:07:51,320
Speaker 3: Yes it is, and you're just like.

1176
01:07:52,800 --> 01:07:55,400
Speaker 1: And it's presented in a very like jokey way, so

1177
01:07:55,520 --> 01:08:00,880
Speaker 1: that's yeah, like of course, right, and then she's fed

1178
01:08:01,000 --> 01:08:04,120
Speaker 1: up with always being the damsel in distress. So in

1179
01:08:04,240 --> 01:08:09,040
Speaker 1: the two years where the group has disbanded, she has

1180
01:08:09,120 --> 01:08:14,080
Speaker 1: learned martial arts, and but then throughout a big chunk

1181
01:08:14,080 --> 01:08:17,960
Speaker 1: of the movie, she's still I guess it's a matter

1182
01:08:18,000 --> 01:08:20,599
Speaker 1: of her, you know, being like I can do this.

1183
01:08:20,960 --> 01:08:24,440
Speaker 1: I'm not gonna get captured again. Oops I did get captured,

1184
01:08:24,479 --> 01:08:25,479
Speaker 1: And so there's like this.

1185
01:08:25,720 --> 01:08:28,720
Speaker 4: It's definitely stop and go, and I like and I

1186
01:08:28,760 --> 01:08:31,120
Speaker 4: feel like there's a lot of ways to view it.

1187
01:08:31,920 --> 01:08:35,719
Speaker 4: I yeah, I was struggling with that because you're like, Okay,

1188
01:08:35,760 --> 01:08:40,000
Speaker 4: they're not really like, you know, Mary suing her, but

1189
01:08:40,320 --> 01:08:44,120
Speaker 4: also it felt like it was playing her recapture is

1190
01:08:44,120 --> 01:08:44,879
Speaker 4: more of a joke.

1191
01:08:44,720 --> 01:08:47,559
Speaker 3: Than anything else. I don't know. I think that if,

1192
01:08:47,680 --> 01:08:50,360
Speaker 3: like if this storyline.

1193
01:08:49,840 --> 01:08:52,240
Speaker 4: For Daphne was presented in a movie that came out today,

1194
01:08:52,320 --> 01:08:55,479
Speaker 4: I would be really exhausted by it because she's.

1195
01:08:55,320 --> 01:08:58,280
Speaker 3: Like, I'm not a damsel in distress, uh.

1196
01:08:59,000 --> 01:09:02,439
Speaker 4: Which I think at this is like pretty overdone and

1197
01:09:02,479 --> 01:09:04,000
Speaker 4: hackneyed and blah blah blah.

1198
01:09:04,080 --> 01:09:06,360
Speaker 3: But for the time I think.

1199
01:09:06,160 --> 01:09:09,759
Speaker 4: That it was like it's it's at least an interesting

1200
01:09:09,800 --> 01:09:13,240
Speaker 4: way to kind of publicly course correct the character. As

1201
01:09:14,120 --> 01:09:16,200
Speaker 4: I don't know, I think that they could have done

1202
01:09:16,200 --> 01:09:19,719
Speaker 4: more to be like, she's actually a very competent person,

1203
01:09:19,880 --> 01:09:22,960
Speaker 4: and there's a way. I think that the Barbie boovie

1204
01:09:22,960 --> 01:09:27,680
Speaker 4: does this far more effectively of saying like hyper femininity

1205
01:09:28,400 --> 01:09:32,240
Speaker 4: or even just traditionally feminine qualities and aesthetics does not

1206
01:09:32,720 --> 01:09:37,320
Speaker 4: equal weakness, does not equal incompetence, does not equal being

1207
01:09:37,520 --> 01:09:40,800
Speaker 4: lesser that which it. Like the Daphne character, I think

1208
01:09:40,840 --> 01:09:43,200
Speaker 4: that that is like that's where that is headed.

1209
01:09:43,360 --> 01:09:45,200
Speaker 3: And I like that they.

1210
01:09:44,960 --> 01:09:48,840
Speaker 4: Don't, you know, they don't sacrifice, like what makes what

1211
01:09:48,960 --> 01:09:53,360
Speaker 4: is important? Like she likes wearing purple, and she likes

1212
01:09:53,720 --> 01:09:57,040
Speaker 4: having cool outfits and like I love that for her,

1213
01:09:57,560 --> 01:09:57,960
Speaker 4: and I.

1214
01:09:57,920 --> 01:09:59,840
Speaker 3: Like that, you know, as she's proving that that.

1215
01:10:00,040 --> 01:10:02,360
Speaker 4: It's not like I feel like sometimes you get sort

1216
01:10:02,400 --> 01:10:06,920
Speaker 4: of when when women are you know, asked to like

1217
01:10:07,240 --> 01:10:10,120
Speaker 4: step up and become leaders, they have to, they're asked

1218
01:10:10,160 --> 01:10:13,600
Speaker 4: to shed elements of who they are, and it's like,

1219
01:10:13,680 --> 01:10:15,519
Speaker 4: if that's something that you want to do, great, but

1220
01:10:15,560 --> 01:10:19,759
Speaker 4: it feels almost like the way to be taken seriously

1221
01:10:19,840 --> 01:10:22,880
Speaker 4: is to present more masculine, and Daphne does not do that.

1222
01:10:24,160 --> 01:10:27,880
Speaker 3: Barbie does not do that right. It's it's like, I think,

1223
01:10:27,920 --> 01:10:33,000
Speaker 3: a worthwhile message, but yeah, the way that she's characterized

1224
01:10:33,240 --> 01:10:36,439
Speaker 3: is very kind of It was hit and miss for

1225
01:10:36,560 --> 01:10:37,479
Speaker 3: me Seene to see.

1226
01:10:37,720 --> 01:10:41,320
Speaker 1: For me, I didn't mind the arc of you know,

1227
01:10:41,520 --> 01:10:44,800
Speaker 1: deciding she basically she quits because she doesn't like that

1228
01:10:44,840 --> 01:10:49,880
Speaker 1: she's always being damseled or that that's like it almost

1229
01:10:49,920 --> 01:10:53,200
Speaker 1: feels like a commentary on the just the idea of

1230
01:10:53,360 --> 01:10:55,000
Speaker 1: being damsel.

1231
01:10:54,760 --> 01:11:00,000
Speaker 3: Does somebody say commentary?

1232
01:10:59,000 --> 01:11:02,920
Speaker 1: And you know, she decides to take matters into her

1233
01:11:02,920 --> 01:11:06,799
Speaker 1: own hands, but then applying the skills that she learned

1234
01:11:06,840 --> 01:11:10,080
Speaker 1: obviously is going to take some time to get used to,

1235
01:11:10,600 --> 01:11:14,080
Speaker 1: and so she still is you know, she's she's working

1236
01:11:14,120 --> 01:11:16,880
Speaker 1: out the kinks as the story goes, but then by

1237
01:11:16,880 --> 01:11:20,799
Speaker 1: the end her arc is fully realized with that fight

1238
01:11:21,000 --> 01:11:24,679
Speaker 1: with the luchador who is in the movie for some reason,

1239
01:11:25,360 --> 01:11:30,640
Speaker 1: and she kicks his ass, and you know, it's very

1240
01:11:31,280 --> 01:11:34,200
Speaker 1: a two thousand and two way to handle all of that.

1241
01:11:34,400 --> 01:11:36,759
Speaker 1: But yeah, I didn't mind it terribly.

1242
01:11:36,800 --> 01:11:40,240
Speaker 4: I think a valiant attempt for two thousand and two

1243
01:11:40,479 --> 01:11:45,519
Speaker 4: in this arena. Yeah, I was pleasantly surprised. And I

1244
01:11:45,520 --> 01:11:49,000
Speaker 4: think that like the downside of that, which based on

1245
01:11:49,080 --> 01:11:52,280
Speaker 4: James Gunn's James Gunn's characterization, so we you know whatever,

1246
01:11:52,800 --> 01:11:55,960
Speaker 4: We can't say for totally sure, but it seems like

1247
01:11:56,240 --> 01:12:00,000
Speaker 4: the you know, Fred kiss at the end, I would

1248
01:12:00,120 --> 01:12:03,200
Speaker 4: guess that that's studio notes because that felt pretty unconnected

1249
01:12:03,240 --> 01:12:05,080
Speaker 4: to what her journey throughout the movie was.

1250
01:12:06,400 --> 01:12:07,960
Speaker 3: You don't even really see her.

1251
01:12:07,840 --> 01:12:11,800
Speaker 4: And Fred interacting very much like Fred's main story very

1252
01:12:11,880 --> 01:12:15,840
Speaker 4: much has to do with this like ego ego deaf

1253
01:12:15,920 --> 01:12:18,800
Speaker 4: in like acknowledging that Velma is a person who is

1254
01:12:18,800 --> 01:12:22,040
Speaker 4: smarter than him, so his story is unconnected to Daphne.

1255
01:12:22,080 --> 01:12:24,719
Speaker 3: So its just I think that like more so they're like, oh.

1256
01:12:24,560 --> 01:12:27,240
Speaker 4: We need we need a series of heterosexual moments because

1257
01:12:27,280 --> 01:12:30,160
Speaker 4: it's the end of the movie and these two characters

1258
01:12:30,200 --> 01:12:33,759
Speaker 4: are already publicly associated as husband and wife and also.

1259
01:12:33,840 --> 01:12:36,360
Speaker 3: Cartoon boyfriend girlfriend brant makeup kiss.

1260
01:12:36,920 --> 01:12:40,080
Speaker 4: But even that, that felt like I liked that Daphne's

1261
01:12:40,080 --> 01:12:43,000
Speaker 4: main story was, you know, like it is like a

1262
01:12:43,040 --> 01:12:45,799
Speaker 4: proto like but for a kids movie in two thousand

1263
01:12:45,800 --> 01:12:46,120
Speaker 4: and two.

1264
01:12:46,400 --> 01:12:47,840
Speaker 3: I think it works. And I.

1265
01:12:49,760 --> 01:12:56,840
Speaker 4: Enjoyed Sarah Michelle Galler's performance. And did I enjoy the outfits?

1266
01:12:57,560 --> 01:13:01,479
Speaker 3: Yes, I did? I love those? Damn it? Any other

1267
01:13:01,560 --> 01:13:05,360
Speaker 3: any other thoughts on Diffney, Oh, you're wearing your Flubber

1268
01:13:05,600 --> 01:13:06,599
Speaker 3: Mambo T shirt?

1269
01:13:08,560 --> 01:13:12,000
Speaker 1: Yes, I sure am in the heat of flubber.

1270
01:13:12,040 --> 01:13:12,960
Speaker 3: In the heat of flubber.

1271
01:13:14,080 --> 01:13:18,640
Speaker 4: Another another huge green influencing I mean, what a decade

1272
01:13:18,880 --> 01:13:23,800
Speaker 4: for the color green Flubber track Jim Carrey Grinch on

1273
01:13:23,840 --> 01:13:28,240
Speaker 4: the same five year span incredible three year span ninety eight,

1274
01:13:28,240 --> 01:13:29,479
Speaker 4: two thousand, two thousand and one.

1275
01:13:29,520 --> 01:13:34,879
Speaker 1: Way flump wow, hm, mind blowing Kermit's impact.

1276
01:13:36,520 --> 01:13:40,400
Speaker 3: Yes, well, let's talk about dak Alright, let's talk about Velma.

1277
01:13:40,960 --> 01:13:48,920
Speaker 1: Yes, I similarly like that her arc is being frustrated

1278
01:13:49,160 --> 01:13:53,200
Speaker 1: that a man is taking credit for all of her

1279
01:13:53,280 --> 01:13:59,880
Speaker 1: work because she's like recognizably the best at solving mysteries.

1280
01:14:00,760 --> 01:14:06,320
Speaker 1: She is doing a lot of deductive reasoning. She understands

1281
01:14:06,400 --> 01:14:09,320
Speaker 1: what a lot of clues mean. She's doing a lot thing.

1282
01:14:09,720 --> 01:14:10,439
Speaker 1: It's her whole thing.

1283
01:14:10,479 --> 01:14:13,639
Speaker 3: She's always been the smartest person in the group.

1284
01:14:15,720 --> 01:14:20,040
Speaker 4: I will say the detail that she in the two

1285
01:14:20,160 --> 01:14:24,960
Speaker 4: year interim was kind of military industrial complexing.

1286
01:14:25,000 --> 01:14:26,680
Speaker 3: They say she was developing.

1287
01:14:26,600 --> 01:14:31,080
Speaker 4: Missiles for NASA, right, and you're like, now, that is

1288
01:14:31,120 --> 01:14:34,599
Speaker 4: a misapplication of Velma Dinkley's powers.

1289
01:14:34,680 --> 01:14:38,320
Speaker 3: I like to think that she is. She is a leftist.

1290
01:14:38,880 --> 01:14:42,360
Speaker 4: I was like, why is she making missiles for the government.

1291
01:14:42,960 --> 01:14:45,640
Speaker 4: Imagine being getting so mad at Freddy Prince Junior that

1292
01:14:45,680 --> 01:14:49,320
Speaker 4: you pivot to making missiles for the government. I know,

1293
01:14:49,760 --> 01:14:52,640
Speaker 4: I also making missiles for NASA. That also feels like

1294
01:14:52,640 --> 01:14:55,800
Speaker 4: a mismatch, because you're like, what is missiles to.

1295
01:14:55,840 --> 01:14:59,479
Speaker 1: Like fireing for aliens in outer space?

1296
01:15:00,000 --> 01:15:02,320
Speaker 4: It felt weird that they said she was making missiles

1297
01:15:02,640 --> 01:15:07,439
Speaker 4: for NASA. For NASA, hey, astronaut gangs. Now, I'm sure

1298
01:15:07,560 --> 01:15:09,760
Speaker 4: a lot of like people with doctorates listen to this

1299
01:15:09,800 --> 01:15:13,760
Speaker 4: show because we're so intellectual. So fucking yeah, we're just

1300
01:15:13,800 --> 01:15:16,880
Speaker 4: a really well educated show and That's why this.

1301
01:15:16,920 --> 01:15:21,120
Speaker 1: Master's degree well in screen writing from Boston University. Not

1302
01:15:21,160 --> 01:15:22,920
Speaker 1: that I'd ever mention it.

1303
01:15:23,200 --> 01:15:26,360
Speaker 4: I'm just saying that people that are geniuses want to

1304
01:15:26,400 --> 01:15:30,920
Speaker 4: listen to Scooby Doo for two hours. But she was

1305
01:15:30,920 --> 01:15:35,679
Speaker 4: like bad practice for Alma developing missiles in her off time.

1306
01:15:36,760 --> 01:15:39,479
Speaker 3: We will won't give it a past this time.

1307
01:15:39,640 --> 01:15:44,360
Speaker 4: But in the yeah, in the heat of nine to eleven,

1308
01:15:46,160 --> 01:15:49,600
Speaker 4: she's developing missiles, and I'm just like, these are I

1309
01:15:49,640 --> 01:15:51,439
Speaker 4: don't hold I think they're supposed to be in like

1310
01:15:51,520 --> 01:15:53,000
Speaker 4: I think you're supposed to be like college aged.

1311
01:15:53,360 --> 01:15:55,639
Speaker 3: So you're like, did Velma vote for Bush?

1312
01:15:56,360 --> 01:16:00,679
Speaker 4: Oh, she's developing missiles, Caitlin, I mean, I mean Daphnie.

1313
01:16:00,720 --> 01:16:04,920
Speaker 3: I would say Daphney. I think Daphne votes blue. No matter.

1314
01:16:07,000 --> 01:16:08,720
Speaker 3: I don't want to get into the politics of it.

1315
01:16:09,360 --> 01:16:12,240
Speaker 4: Shaggy's a libertarian, though that much is obvious.

1316
01:16:12,280 --> 01:16:13,880
Speaker 3: Shaggy Oh, he's.

1317
01:16:13,760 --> 01:16:16,040
Speaker 4: An independent thinker, which but like he doesn't know what

1318
01:16:16,040 --> 01:16:17,599
Speaker 4: he's talking about, which is very libertarian.

1319
01:16:17,640 --> 01:16:19,880
Speaker 1: Cut No, if Funny one it's a libertarian. I think

1320
01:16:19,880 --> 01:16:23,639
Speaker 1: it's Fred. I think Shaggy is green Parky.

1321
01:16:23,640 --> 01:16:29,960
Speaker 4: Shaggy doesn't vote. He doesn't vote, and Spooby. Scoopy is

1322
01:16:29,960 --> 01:16:33,240
Speaker 4: an anarchist. Well, yeah, Scooby wants to burn it all

1323
01:16:33,280 --> 01:16:34,559
Speaker 4: down because they don't let.

1324
01:16:34,560 --> 01:16:36,280
Speaker 3: Him vote, they don't let him voote.

1325
01:16:36,320 --> 01:16:41,200
Speaker 4: It's also Scooby gender non conforming icon in this movie.

1326
01:16:41,200 --> 01:16:44,439
Speaker 3: Before we get development because she's developing missiles, she has

1327
01:16:44,479 --> 01:16:47,200
Speaker 3: to wait for a second. Scooby.

1328
01:16:47,720 --> 01:16:49,519
Speaker 4: I don't have much to say about Scooby other than

1329
01:16:50,479 --> 01:16:51,920
Speaker 4: I mean, check this guy out.

1330
01:16:52,240 --> 01:16:54,960
Speaker 3: He looks a little scary in this movie, but that's.

1331
01:16:54,840 --> 01:16:58,000
Speaker 1: Not his fault. That's the fault of the bad CGI

1332
01:16:58,120 --> 01:16:58,599
Speaker 1: at the time.

1333
01:16:58,920 --> 01:17:01,280
Speaker 4: And Scoopy is you know, Scooby is a part of

1334
01:17:01,320 --> 01:17:03,599
Speaker 4: our lives, whether we like it or not.

1335
01:17:03,640 --> 01:17:04,840
Speaker 3: Scooby is a part of our lives.

1336
01:17:05,560 --> 01:17:10,000
Speaker 4: And you know, Scooby does where a dress. Scooby is

1337
01:17:10,560 --> 01:17:13,360
Speaker 4: in Grandma Drag during the plane scene.

1338
01:17:13,800 --> 01:17:17,960
Speaker 3: And you know, I didn't hate it. I didn't hate it.

1339
01:17:19,040 --> 01:17:22,439
Speaker 4: I think what was interesting about that scene is it

1340
01:17:22,439 --> 01:17:23,439
Speaker 4: Scooby's and Gradma drag.

1341
01:17:23,520 --> 01:17:27,280
Speaker 3: First of all, everyone on at the airport thinks falls

1342
01:17:27,320 --> 01:17:28,880
Speaker 3: for it, falls for it.

1343
01:17:29,000 --> 01:17:32,559
Speaker 1: Dan thinks it's hot. They're like this thing that's very

1344
01:17:32,640 --> 01:17:34,920
Speaker 1: visibly a dog in a dress.

1345
01:17:34,960 --> 01:17:35,200
Speaker 4: Dog.

1346
01:17:35,520 --> 01:17:38,560
Speaker 1: They're like a woogah.

1347
01:17:38,600 --> 01:17:44,720
Speaker 4: And then I think most interestingly, Scooby punches Fred in

1348
01:17:44,800 --> 01:17:50,320
Speaker 4: the face in Grandma Drag and it is never commented on.

1349
01:17:50,439 --> 01:17:55,639
Speaker 3: It doesn't come back Fred, there's no consequence. Fred just goes, oh.

1350
01:17:55,040 --> 01:17:59,280
Speaker 1: Well, he initiates the violence. He flicks Scooby on the nose. Scooby,

1351
01:17:59,520 --> 01:18:01,439
Speaker 1: I will sco punching him.

1352
01:18:01,880 --> 01:18:05,040
Speaker 3: That was out of pocket from Scooby. Ye, not that

1353
01:18:05,120 --> 01:18:05,840
Speaker 3: it was like, you.

1354
01:18:05,800 --> 01:18:08,360
Speaker 4: Know, this flicks certainly an invasion of personal space. But

1355
01:18:09,040 --> 01:18:14,120
Speaker 4: Scooby really dex Fred. And I'm sure I was laughing

1356
01:18:14,280 --> 01:18:17,360
Speaker 4: when I was when I was a child. Sure I'm

1357
01:18:17,439 --> 01:18:19,680
Speaker 4: laughing with Scooby punch his friend in the face. So

1358
01:18:19,720 --> 01:18:21,479
Speaker 4: I just wanted to give a quick shout out to

1359
01:18:22,240 --> 01:18:27,120
Speaker 4: Scooby gender nonconforming icon, Scooby self confidence icon, because when

1360
01:18:27,120 --> 01:18:29,320
Speaker 4: he's told he's pure of hearts, Scooby's not fighting it.

1361
01:18:29,479 --> 01:18:32,120
Speaker 3: He's like, yeah, that tracks, that makes sense.

1362
01:18:32,560 --> 01:18:35,799
Speaker 4: Scooby, you know, has some work to do as an uncle,

1363
01:18:36,400 --> 01:18:39,559
Speaker 4: but he's on the journey. I love Scooby, and I

1364
01:18:39,600 --> 01:18:42,960
Speaker 4: really I don't really have anything to it's not relevant

1365
01:18:43,000 --> 01:18:46,720
Speaker 4: to our discussion commenting on how much I like the

1366
01:18:46,760 --> 01:18:52,240
Speaker 4: scene between Matthew Lillard and Scoopy when he's like, Scooby,

1367
01:18:52,280 --> 01:18:53,320
Speaker 4: you're my best friend.

1368
01:18:53,520 --> 01:18:56,120
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna let mister Bean do this to you.

1369
01:18:56,479 --> 01:18:58,880
Speaker 3: But I teared up. I thought it was really nice.

1370
01:18:58,920 --> 01:18:59,879
Speaker 3: And I think their friendship.

1371
01:19:00,000 --> 01:19:04,280
Speaker 4: I mean, Scooby and Shaggy they're special together. They're special together,

1372
01:19:05,320 --> 01:19:10,080
Speaker 4: and I love them. All Right, let's go back to Velma.

1373
01:19:10,520 --> 01:19:14,719
Speaker 1: Yes, so Velma is fed up with this man taking

1374
01:19:14,760 --> 01:19:19,680
Speaker 1: credit for her work. Yep, and she quits. Then Fred's

1375
01:19:19,840 --> 01:19:27,200
Speaker 1: arc becomes about learning to respect Velma and recognize and

1376
01:19:27,280 --> 01:19:32,839
Speaker 1: acknowledge her contributions to the group, and to stop taking

1377
01:19:32,880 --> 01:19:36,439
Speaker 1: credit for her work. The bar is very low here,

1378
01:19:36,640 --> 01:19:39,400
Speaker 1: and yet but that is his arc. And yet we're

1379
01:19:39,560 --> 01:19:41,160
Speaker 1: cheering and we're clapping when it happens.

1380
01:19:41,560 --> 01:19:44,960
Speaker 4: Yes, we're like yay, Yeah, we are really conditioned to

1381
01:19:45,040 --> 01:19:48,519
Speaker 4: accept very little from Fred here, because I like found

1382
01:19:48,520 --> 01:19:51,760
Speaker 4: myself on my first watch congratulating Fred on things that

1383
01:19:51,800 --> 01:19:53,040
Speaker 4: were like nonsensical.

1384
01:19:53,040 --> 01:19:57,400
Speaker 3: I'm like, wow, he acknowledged that Velma is an attractive person,

1385
01:19:58,479 --> 01:20:01,519
Speaker 3: And you're just like, why am I giving Fred credit

1386
01:20:01,560 --> 01:20:02,160
Speaker 3: for nothing? Yeah?

1387
01:20:02,160 --> 01:20:04,479
Speaker 4: But yeah, his arc is that he like learns to

1388
01:20:04,520 --> 01:20:08,000
Speaker 4: conceive some of the credit. I don't really remember within

1389
01:20:08,880 --> 01:20:11,280
Speaker 4: I don't know. I guess I just never had. Hopefully

1390
01:20:11,280 --> 01:20:14,479
Speaker 4: Scooby fans won't take this personally. I never had a

1391
01:20:14,640 --> 01:20:17,960
Speaker 4: very vested interest in Fred. I would say, if I'm

1392
01:20:18,040 --> 01:20:23,360
Speaker 4: ranking the characters, he is dead last. Wait, rank them,

1393
01:20:23,479 --> 01:20:25,400
Speaker 4: ranked them really quick and include Scooby.

1394
01:20:25,720 --> 01:20:28,960
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, Well go it's important.

1395
01:20:29,960 --> 01:20:33,559
Speaker 3: Scooby number one, good, good, good, keep going.

1396
01:20:33,600 --> 01:20:38,680
Speaker 1: I would say, with Alma, number two, daph Name number three, Shaggy,

1397
01:20:39,640 --> 01:20:40,320
Speaker 1: and maybe this.

1398
01:20:40,360 --> 01:20:42,680
Speaker 3: Is still great, but he is he.

1399
01:20:42,760 --> 01:20:44,200
Speaker 1: I find him kind of irritating.

1400
01:20:44,600 --> 01:20:46,200
Speaker 3: Are you ranking Fred above Shaggy?

1401
01:20:46,320 --> 01:20:50,400
Speaker 1: No? But Fred is last. But I just don't have

1402
01:20:50,479 --> 01:20:54,160
Speaker 1: a lot of respect for Shaggy. Although I do relate.

1403
01:20:54,280 --> 01:20:58,280
Speaker 4: You're like Shaggy needs to get his ass up at work.

1404
01:20:59,360 --> 01:21:01,880
Speaker 3: Shaggy, I do relate.

1405
01:21:03,520 --> 01:21:07,639
Speaker 1: To his interest in food. I like that he's always hungry.

1406
01:21:07,640 --> 01:21:08,680
Speaker 1: I'm always hungry.

1407
01:21:08,720 --> 01:21:13,240
Speaker 4: Wow, you're like Shaggy lazy, lazy.

1408
01:21:13,439 --> 01:21:20,320
Speaker 1: It's more that I I don't know. Would I want

1409
01:21:20,320 --> 01:21:23,320
Speaker 1: to date Shaggy? Noe? Do I want to date Fred?

1410
01:21:23,640 --> 01:21:27,040
Speaker 3: That's not what's on. I'm not what's on. But how

1411
01:21:27,120 --> 01:21:32,320
Speaker 3: fuckable as Shaggy to you? No one asked? No one asked.

1412
01:21:32,640 --> 01:21:34,720
Speaker 5: Although I think I have dated a kind of a

1413
01:21:34,800 --> 01:21:39,040
Speaker 5: serious of shaggy tests, to the point where first time

1414
01:21:39,160 --> 01:21:41,320
Speaker 5: currently dated dating showed up to my house the other

1415
01:21:41,400 --> 01:21:45,000
Speaker 5: day accidentally, you know, like accidental minion, when someone's wearing

1416
01:21:45,080 --> 01:21:48,520
Speaker 5: yellow top and jeans, accidental shaggy.

1417
01:21:48,479 --> 01:21:51,680
Speaker 1: Oh, green shirt, green shirt, corduroy pants.

1418
01:21:51,680 --> 01:21:53,320
Speaker 3: Scary, wow, scary awesome.

1419
01:21:53,880 --> 01:21:56,920
Speaker 1: But well maybe he was trying to look like Shrek.

1420
01:21:58,560 --> 01:22:00,599
Speaker 4: But then you're gonna need to get a vest, and

1421
01:22:00,640 --> 01:22:03,120
Speaker 4: for someone to have a vest it is just so

1422
01:22:03,720 --> 01:22:05,320
Speaker 4: Shrek intentional.

1423
01:22:05,320 --> 01:22:08,680
Speaker 1: So Shrekian, if you will, yes.

1424
01:22:08,960 --> 01:22:14,920
Speaker 4: In the Shrekian heat. My my writings are the same

1425
01:22:14,960 --> 01:22:16,000
Speaker 4: as yours, except.

1426
01:22:15,800 --> 01:22:18,440
Speaker 3: I am swapping Daphnie and Palma.

1427
01:22:18,600 --> 01:22:22,599
Speaker 4: Okay, but yeah, obviously Scooby number one, let's not play around.

1428
01:22:22,680 --> 01:22:24,800
Speaker 1: I love a talking animal Paddington.

1429
01:22:25,080 --> 01:22:28,799
Speaker 3: Hello, I don't even like a talking animal. I love

1430
01:22:29,479 --> 01:22:32,040
Speaker 3: Scoopy Ruby Ruby Roo. And I think it's only because

1431
01:22:32,080 --> 01:22:37,240
Speaker 3: he like he talks. Scooby. Hmmm, that's a character in

1432
01:22:37,280 --> 01:22:38,440
Speaker 3: this tone poem.

1433
01:22:38,760 --> 01:22:42,559
Speaker 4: Scooby only speaks when he has something to say, he's

1434
01:22:42,600 --> 01:22:46,800
Speaker 4: not just running his map. I really appreciate that, and

1435
01:22:46,920 --> 01:22:49,200
Speaker 4: a character I appreciate.

1436
01:22:48,720 --> 01:22:50,840
Speaker 3: When he's he is careful.

1437
01:22:50,880 --> 01:22:54,000
Speaker 6: He he can speak English as a dog.

1438
01:22:54,080 --> 01:22:57,760
Speaker 4: He can speak English, but he's not you know, he's

1439
01:22:57,800 --> 01:22:59,600
Speaker 4: not waxing.

1440
01:22:59,160 --> 01:23:02,360
Speaker 1: Poems his words very carefully.

1441
01:23:02,800 --> 01:23:04,639
Speaker 4: And that's not to say he doesn't have a very

1442
01:23:04,760 --> 01:23:08,840
Speaker 4: rich interior life, because you know he does. You know,

1443
01:23:08,920 --> 01:23:11,719
Speaker 4: there's a lot going on in that big old dog

1444
01:23:11,880 --> 01:23:12,760
Speaker 4: cranium of his.

1445
01:23:13,240 --> 01:23:17,640
Speaker 1: Although there is one thing he says that I did

1446
01:23:17,720 --> 01:23:20,640
Speaker 1: not like one bit, and it's when he's trying to

1447
01:23:20,680 --> 01:23:25,840
Speaker 1: convince Shaggy that Mary Jane is actually a monster, and

1448
01:23:25,920 --> 01:23:30,200
Speaker 1: Shaggy is like, nah, I don't believe you, first of all,

1449
01:23:30,680 --> 01:23:36,960
Speaker 1: believe Scooby's. Secondly, Scooby's response to that is saying, you're whipped.

1450
01:23:37,400 --> 01:23:39,479
Speaker 3: Yeah. And I was like, first of all, who told

1451
01:23:39,520 --> 01:23:41,040
Speaker 3: Scooby what that means?

1452
01:23:41,080 --> 01:23:41,840
Speaker 1: Who taught him that?

1453
01:23:42,320 --> 01:23:43,840
Speaker 3: And you know, maybe not.

1454
01:23:43,760 --> 01:23:46,360
Speaker 4: To call Shaggy out as a bad you know, parent,

1455
01:23:46,439 --> 01:23:50,160
Speaker 4: slush friend. I bit Shaggy taugh him that there.

1456
01:23:50,280 --> 01:23:52,559
Speaker 3: You think Scooby learned that on the beach where.

1457
01:23:52,600 --> 01:23:54,360
Speaker 1: I think Scooby learned it from Fred?

1458
01:23:54,760 --> 01:23:58,800
Speaker 4: Ah, very possible, very possible. Yeah, And I think that

1459
01:23:58,800 --> 01:24:01,559
Speaker 4: that is I'm grateful. I mean, I not that I

1460
01:24:01,600 --> 01:24:05,760
Speaker 4: think that the concept of being quote unquote whipped has

1461
01:24:06,840 --> 01:24:10,280
Speaker 4: made its way out of media entirely.

1462
01:24:10,479 --> 01:24:11,280
Speaker 3: I do think that.

1463
01:24:11,240 --> 01:24:14,960
Speaker 4: Phrase has has sort of gone the way gone the

1464
01:24:15,000 --> 01:24:15,840
Speaker 4: way of Jim Carrey.

1465
01:24:15,840 --> 01:24:17,360
Speaker 3: Grinch's not around anymore.

1466
01:24:21,520 --> 01:24:24,920
Speaker 1: It did, but I haven't heard it in over a decade.

1467
01:24:24,960 --> 01:24:26,599
Speaker 4: I think, I think, yeah, and I think I think

1468
01:24:26,640 --> 01:24:30,640
Speaker 4: that that is that's you know, that's something. I was

1469
01:24:30,720 --> 01:24:32,639
Speaker 4: kind of jarred to hear that phrase because I was like, oh,

1470
01:24:32,720 --> 01:24:34,160
Speaker 4: I know, I kind of forgot that was a thing,

1471
01:24:34,200 --> 01:24:36,720
Speaker 4: And why is Scooby Doo saying it? And why was

1472
01:24:36,760 --> 01:24:38,200
Speaker 4: it really so pervasive that.

1473
01:24:38,160 --> 01:24:41,400
Speaker 3: Scooby Doo could say it and the Shaggy would be

1474
01:24:41,439 --> 01:24:42,000
Speaker 3: insulted by it?

1475
01:24:42,000 --> 01:24:44,720
Speaker 4: Because I think something that is nice about Shaggy in

1476
01:24:44,920 --> 01:24:50,360
Speaker 4: general is that he is a and also, you know,

1477
01:24:50,439 --> 01:24:53,080
Speaker 4: I'm ranking him four out of five, but the first

1478
01:24:53,120 --> 01:24:55,360
Speaker 4: three are so strong. I like Shaggy a lot, and

1479
01:24:55,439 --> 01:24:59,719
Speaker 4: I think that like he is a very emotionally generous

1480
01:24:59,760 --> 01:25:03,439
Speaker 4: and that a character in ways that men are not

1481
01:25:03,560 --> 01:25:08,240
Speaker 4: often depicted as being. He is effusive in all of

1482
01:25:08,280 --> 01:25:11,880
Speaker 4: his friendships with people of all genders, and in this

1483
01:25:12,000 --> 01:25:14,519
Speaker 4: relationship with Mary Jane, while she is a non character,

1484
01:25:14,520 --> 01:25:18,519
Speaker 4: as we'll get to, is like he's like openly liking her.

1485
01:25:18,640 --> 01:25:21,880
Speaker 3: He's not playing the fred game, he's not nagging her.

1486
01:25:21,880 --> 01:25:23,479
Speaker 3: He's like and so yeah.

1487
01:25:23,520 --> 01:25:25,400
Speaker 4: Again, for like the whipped thing to be introduced and

1488
01:25:25,400 --> 01:25:27,680
Speaker 4: for Shaggy to be insulted, it also just felt like

1489
01:25:27,720 --> 01:25:29,120
Speaker 4: out of character because you're.

1490
01:25:29,000 --> 01:25:32,040
Speaker 3: Like, I don't think Shaggy both of them gives a ship. Yeah, Like,

1491
01:25:32,280 --> 01:25:36,400
Speaker 3: what's getting into these boys? There's there's there's such nice guys.

1492
01:25:36,800 --> 01:25:39,759
Speaker 1: Well, it's these creatures that it's the monster.

1493
01:25:40,400 --> 01:25:44,439
Speaker 3: It's the monsters that were unleashed. Yeah.

1494
01:25:44,479 --> 01:25:47,599
Speaker 4: So that that I found to be That was not

1495
01:25:47,680 --> 01:25:52,000
Speaker 4: Scooby's best moment, but I have to believe that he

1496
01:25:52,520 --> 01:25:57,960
Speaker 4: grew from it. And I oh, Scoopy.

1497
01:25:57,360 --> 01:26:02,240
Speaker 3: All right, velma okay, so velma. Yeah. I do also

1498
01:26:02,360 --> 01:26:03,800
Speaker 3: like and it feels very of.

1499
01:26:03,760 --> 01:26:07,320
Speaker 4: The time and in that same sort of like mission

1500
01:26:07,360 --> 01:26:09,200
Speaker 4: that it seems like James Gunn had that we've been

1501
01:26:09,240 --> 01:26:15,040
Speaker 4: talking about of addressing just like the popular tropes or

1502
01:26:15,080 --> 01:26:18,080
Speaker 4: the popular opinions around this character and attempting to challenge them,

1503
01:26:18,200 --> 01:26:22,599
Speaker 4: which it seems like having her be explicitly queer in

1504
01:26:22,800 --> 01:26:27,040
Speaker 4: this movie was an extension of that mission, but barring that,

1505
01:26:27,120 --> 01:26:30,800
Speaker 4: like addressing like how she is always been considered to

1506
01:26:30,800 --> 01:26:32,400
Speaker 4: be the smartest person of the group but is.

1507
01:26:32,360 --> 01:26:33,799
Speaker 3: Not considered to be the leader.

1508
01:26:33,960 --> 01:26:36,880
Speaker 4: And why is that and like exploring that through the

1509
01:26:36,920 --> 01:26:38,840
Speaker 4: story I think is a really smart move.

1510
01:26:39,720 --> 01:26:40,439
Speaker 3: And I.

1511
01:26:41,920 --> 01:26:43,600
Speaker 4: Like, I mean, I don't know. I still think that

1512
01:26:44,439 --> 01:26:47,320
Speaker 4: Fred ends up a little bit too on top for

1513
01:26:47,439 --> 01:26:52,519
Speaker 4: my taste towards at the end of the movie, and that, Yeah,

1514
01:26:52,520 --> 01:26:55,360
Speaker 4: the conclusion of this movie just in general is tricky

1515
01:26:55,400 --> 01:26:59,479
Speaker 4: because I like Filma's journey. I obviously don't like scriptnotes boyfriend,

1516
01:26:59,840 --> 01:27:02,120
Speaker 4: but he's barely there. He kind of is just there

1517
01:27:02,160 --> 01:27:04,280
Speaker 4: to like set up a flashback and then comes back

1518
01:27:04,320 --> 01:27:06,640
Speaker 4: at the end. And I also don't I mean at

1519
01:27:06,680 --> 01:27:10,360
Speaker 4: the beginning in a way that I think that even

1520
01:27:10,400 --> 01:27:14,800
Speaker 4: though you don't get you know they intended I guess

1521
01:27:15,240 --> 01:27:19,360
Speaker 4: undercurrent that was intended Between Daphne and Velma. I think

1522
01:27:19,400 --> 01:27:22,520
Speaker 4: they have like a kind of a smaller but interesting

1523
01:27:22,560 --> 01:27:24,519
Speaker 4: story going on as well, where at the beginning of

1524
01:27:24,520 --> 01:27:27,960
Speaker 4: the movie, Velma is kind of on the like, I

1525
01:27:28,000 --> 01:27:31,879
Speaker 4: don't take Daphne seriously train like she says, you practically

1526
01:27:31,960 --> 01:27:34,679
Speaker 4: come with your own ransom note, Like she's very much

1527
01:27:34,800 --> 01:27:38,400
Speaker 4: on the side of Fred when it comes to Daphne

1528
01:27:38,479 --> 01:27:43,719
Speaker 4: standing up for herself and she and Daphne later on,

1529
01:27:43,720 --> 01:27:48,920
Speaker 4: once the monsters are unleashed, have that scene together where

1530
01:27:49,120 --> 01:27:53,360
Speaker 4: they figure something out together, and it's like, by the

1531
01:27:53,439 --> 01:27:56,080
Speaker 4: end of the movie, Velma I think has come around

1532
01:27:56,160 --> 01:28:00,160
Speaker 4: on not taking Daphne seriously and challenging her own assumption

1533
01:28:00,760 --> 01:28:05,720
Speaker 4: about her friend. And it's like, okay, so kiss, but

1534
01:28:06,479 --> 01:28:07,240
Speaker 4: it didn't happen.

1535
01:28:07,520 --> 01:28:08,760
Speaker 3: But I did appreciate that.

1536
01:28:08,800 --> 01:28:11,720
Speaker 4: I mean, it was like a smaller arc, but that

1537
01:28:11,880 --> 01:28:14,720
Speaker 4: Velma starts sort of I mean, it's like you see

1538
01:28:14,720 --> 01:28:18,000
Speaker 4: those dynamics in real life of like there are you know,

1539
01:28:18,040 --> 01:28:20,920
Speaker 4: two women in this group and one is turning on

1540
01:28:20,960 --> 01:28:23,360
Speaker 4: the other to try to gain favor of the shitty

1541
01:28:23,800 --> 01:28:25,000
Speaker 4: men that they're surrounded by.

1542
01:28:25,040 --> 01:28:26,639
Speaker 3: It's a dynamic that definitely exists.

1543
01:28:26,680 --> 01:28:29,439
Speaker 4: It sucks, but it exists, and it feels like that

1544
01:28:29,600 --> 01:28:32,000
Speaker 4: is sort of hinted at within this group. And then

1545
01:28:32,080 --> 01:28:35,800
Speaker 4: Velma to some extent realizes.

1546
01:28:35,800 --> 01:28:40,080
Speaker 3: The error of her ways, and I like that. I

1547
01:28:40,200 --> 01:28:44,920
Speaker 3: like and like Linda Cardalini is a great Velma true.

1548
01:28:44,920 --> 01:28:47,720
Speaker 4: Trope that is addressed in a way that I did

1549
01:28:47,720 --> 01:28:49,760
Speaker 4: not think was productive and was just like showing the

1550
01:28:49,800 --> 01:28:51,320
Speaker 4: thing was you'd be.

1551
01:28:51,240 --> 01:28:52,800
Speaker 3: So pretty if you took off your glasses.

1552
01:28:53,439 --> 01:28:57,760
Speaker 4: The sequence in which Filma's glasses are off, she's more

1553
01:28:57,920 --> 01:28:59,880
Speaker 4: sexualized immediately.

1554
01:29:00,120 --> 01:29:03,000
Speaker 1: Well, and this happens to an even greater extent in

1555
01:29:03,280 --> 01:29:08,280
Speaker 1: the sequel where she's trying to impress Seth Green. So

1556
01:29:08,640 --> 01:29:12,400
Speaker 1: Velma takes off her glasses, she suddenly has hair that's

1557
01:29:12,439 --> 01:29:14,960
Speaker 1: twice as long. I don't know if she put in

1558
01:29:15,040 --> 01:29:19,080
Speaker 1: some extensions or something. And then she's wearing this like

1559
01:29:19,760 --> 01:29:25,000
Speaker 1: pleather red, like very squeaky outfit that's like very form fitting,

1560
01:29:25,520 --> 01:29:28,400
Speaker 1: and she's doing this to impress Seth Green because that's

1561
01:29:28,400 --> 01:29:30,920
Speaker 1: what she thinks he's going to like. Yeah, the lesson

1562
01:29:30,960 --> 01:29:34,439
Speaker 1: she learns, well, the lesson she learns is that he

1563
01:29:34,520 --> 01:29:37,200
Speaker 1: didn't like and he never liked that. He liked her

1564
01:29:37,240 --> 01:29:41,519
Speaker 1: the way she was originally, and she's like, oh, okay,

1565
01:29:42,360 --> 01:29:45,800
Speaker 1: that's nice and I'll just be that way. And then

1566
01:29:46,200 --> 01:29:48,400
Speaker 1: they get together at the end, even though for half

1567
01:29:48,479 --> 01:29:51,719
Speaker 1: the time he's like kind of a villain or something.

1568
01:29:51,800 --> 01:29:54,200
Speaker 1: I don't know, I wasn't fully paying attention, but he's

1569
01:29:54,280 --> 01:29:56,680
Speaker 1: like maybe just a red hairring. I don't know, but.

1570
01:29:57,320 --> 01:29:59,160
Speaker 3: He's definitely a red hairring.

1571
01:30:00,280 --> 01:30:02,200
Speaker 1: The end that he has red hair.

1572
01:30:05,120 --> 01:30:07,920
Speaker 3: Did you think you know what when Fred was possessed

1573
01:30:07,920 --> 01:30:09,200
Speaker 3: by the monster. He very much.

1574
01:30:09,439 --> 01:30:12,240
Speaker 4: And I feel like I'm bringing up the Barbie Movie

1575
01:30:12,280 --> 01:30:15,280
Speaker 4: a lot also because we're kind of preparing to cover

1576
01:30:15,320 --> 01:30:17,840
Speaker 4: the Barbie Movie. And I saw the Barbie Movie. I

1577
01:30:17,880 --> 01:30:19,040
Speaker 4: have a lot of issues with it, but I saw

1578
01:30:19,120 --> 01:30:22,160
Speaker 4: four times in theaters. I have two Barbie Halloween costumes

1579
01:30:23,000 --> 01:30:23,719
Speaker 4: and I'm wearing.

1580
01:30:23,479 --> 01:30:24,879
Speaker 3: My Barbie crocs right now.

1581
01:30:26,120 --> 01:30:29,200
Speaker 4: Fred when he's possessed by the monster looks like Beach

1582
01:30:29,280 --> 01:30:30,479
Speaker 4: can see.

1583
01:30:30,520 --> 01:30:35,960
Speaker 1: I think that Freddie Prince Junior as Fred is he's giving,

1584
01:30:36,439 --> 01:30:39,960
Speaker 1: He's giving Ken Ken Ryan Goslins as the Barbie movie.

1585
01:30:40,040 --> 01:30:45,040
Speaker 3: Yes, I also made that, except that he is. I mean,

1586
01:30:45,080 --> 01:30:47,879
Speaker 3: I guess that. Well, we'll talk about the Barbie episode.

1587
01:30:48,080 --> 01:30:48,559
Speaker 3: Ryan Goslin.

1588
01:30:48,640 --> 01:30:51,479
Speaker 4: Ken is also absolved to a degree that I found

1589
01:30:51,640 --> 01:30:55,400
Speaker 4: to be a little silly, as is Fred. Because you know,

1590
01:30:55,520 --> 01:30:58,400
Speaker 4: these issues, they're cyclical. We just have to keep forgiving

1591
01:30:58,680 --> 01:31:00,479
Speaker 4: men with certain kinds of hair.

1592
01:31:01,320 --> 01:31:03,200
Speaker 3: But what were we talking about?

1593
01:31:04,800 --> 01:31:07,679
Speaker 4: Who can say, Oh, we were talking about how Velma

1594
01:31:07,720 --> 01:31:09,559
Speaker 4: is treated in the sequel. Well that I mean that

1595
01:31:09,600 --> 01:31:13,640
Speaker 4: that is nice, but also again an over rewarding of

1596
01:31:13,680 --> 01:31:17,479
Speaker 4: the male character to be like, wow, he liked so well.

1597
01:31:17,640 --> 01:31:20,200
Speaker 3: Woman for being a person.

1598
01:31:20,600 --> 01:31:22,479
Speaker 1: And then the reason I brought it up is because

1599
01:31:23,200 --> 01:31:28,640
Speaker 1: it's Daphne's idea for Velma to dress like that, and

1600
01:31:28,680 --> 01:31:32,840
Speaker 1: they have this really bizarre conversation where she's like, I'll

1601
01:31:32,880 --> 01:31:35,920
Speaker 1: help you pick out an outfit, and and before that,

1602
01:31:36,040 --> 01:31:38,479
Speaker 1: Velma's like, I don't know how to get him to

1603
01:31:38,640 --> 01:31:41,720
Speaker 1: like me. I'm not hot, and then Daphne's like, I'm

1604
01:31:41,720 --> 01:31:45,200
Speaker 1: not hot either. Anyway, let's go change our outfits. And

1605
01:31:45,240 --> 01:31:48,280
Speaker 1: it's just like, WHOA who wrote this exchange?

1606
01:31:48,479 --> 01:31:49,080
Speaker 3: I'm bombed.

1607
01:31:49,120 --> 01:31:54,000
Speaker 4: I have had that exact exchange with women friends like

1608
01:31:54,520 --> 01:31:56,360
Speaker 4: I look like shit, No, I look like shit.

1609
01:31:56,520 --> 01:32:00,400
Speaker 3: Well I'm gonna change my shirt. But this is children's media,

1610
01:32:00,479 --> 01:32:02,360
Speaker 3: you know. Don't do that. Don't do that.

1611
01:32:02,880 --> 01:32:03,240
Speaker 1: Do that.

1612
01:32:03,520 --> 01:32:04,800
Speaker 3: Ultimately, with Vamma.

1613
01:32:05,800 --> 01:32:09,720
Speaker 4: I appreciate that this is her story, Like her main

1614
01:32:09,840 --> 01:32:13,519
Speaker 4: story is challenging friends, being an asshole.

1615
01:32:13,840 --> 01:32:16,280
Speaker 3: The story is very clearly on her side.

1616
01:32:16,760 --> 01:32:19,439
Speaker 4: I think that there is a marked difference with how

1617
01:32:20,400 --> 01:32:22,240
Speaker 4: I don't think that well.

1618
01:32:22,360 --> 01:32:24,960
Speaker 3: Vilma is damseled at one point, but then.

1619
01:32:24,960 --> 01:32:29,240
Speaker 4: Is rescued by Daphne and like giving Daphne this big

1620
01:32:29,320 --> 01:32:32,559
Speaker 4: moment of agency and challenging how Shaggy viewed her to

1621
01:32:32,600 --> 01:32:35,200
Speaker 4: not be an active member of the group, and like

1622
01:32:35,360 --> 01:32:37,760
Speaker 4: we get moments with Daphnie and Shaggy where they're sort

1623
01:32:37,760 --> 01:32:40,599
Speaker 4: of presented as like the less effective members of the group,

1624
01:32:40,600 --> 01:32:41,439
Speaker 4: and Daphne is like.

1625
01:32:41,600 --> 01:32:43,000
Speaker 3: No, we have to do this.

1626
01:32:43,720 --> 01:32:46,640
Speaker 4: I think that the way that Vilma is quote unquote

1627
01:32:47,000 --> 01:32:50,040
Speaker 4: damseled but like I would say, more just captured generally

1628
01:32:50,560 --> 01:32:53,160
Speaker 4: that with the exception of that one, I think that

1629
01:32:53,280 --> 01:32:56,040
Speaker 4: like even towards the end, she and Fred are captured

1630
01:32:56,200 --> 01:32:59,520
Speaker 4: simultaneously and are equally active.

1631
01:32:59,240 --> 01:33:00,400
Speaker 3: In getting out of the sea situation.

1632
01:33:00,520 --> 01:33:02,639
Speaker 4: So to me, that's like not even really a damseling.

1633
01:33:02,720 --> 01:33:06,400
Speaker 4: That's just you know, that's just monsters when they're unleashed.

1634
01:33:06,920 --> 01:33:09,040
Speaker 1: I mean, they're going to be capturing people.

1635
01:33:09,439 --> 01:33:12,360
Speaker 4: One thing about monsters. Don't unleash them. You're to be

1636
01:33:12,400 --> 01:33:12,680
Speaker 4: in a.

1637
01:33:12,800 --> 01:33:17,200
Speaker 3: World of trouble. Yes, So those are our gals. Yea,

1638
01:33:18,360 --> 01:33:19,320
Speaker 3: let's talk about we.

1639
01:33:20,120 --> 01:33:23,960
Speaker 4: Hinted this, but they're the this movie and this franchise,

1640
01:33:24,200 --> 01:33:26,760
Speaker 4: and this movie does not move the needle on this

1641
01:33:26,840 --> 01:33:30,960
Speaker 4: really at all is a very very white franchise. And

1642
01:33:31,000 --> 01:33:34,120
Speaker 4: the way that this movie handles any even a hint

1643
01:33:34,479 --> 01:33:38,600
Speaker 4: at a non white, non American culture is handled I

1644
01:33:38,600 --> 01:33:40,160
Speaker 4: think pretty poorly, real.

1645
01:33:40,120 --> 01:33:40,679
Speaker 3: Real bad.

1646
01:33:41,760 --> 01:33:50,320
Speaker 1: So one example is the group of people who, first

1647
01:33:50,320 --> 01:33:52,680
Speaker 1: of all, they're it's very vague, but they seem to

1648
01:33:52,680 --> 01:33:57,880
Speaker 1: be coded as Polynesian in the most like generic stereotyped

1649
01:33:57,920 --> 01:33:58,599
Speaker 1: way possible.

1650
01:33:58,840 --> 01:34:01,400
Speaker 4: It's like almost impossib the comment on because you're like,

1651
01:34:01,439 --> 01:34:03,240
Speaker 4: I don't even know to the extent that the writer

1652
01:34:03,439 --> 01:34:05,400
Speaker 4: knows what they're even saying.

1653
01:34:05,680 --> 01:34:09,560
Speaker 1: Right, It's almost as if he just like took existing

1654
01:34:09,680 --> 01:34:11,639
Speaker 1: troupes and stereotypes, and.

1655
01:34:11,840 --> 01:34:16,080
Speaker 4: Which, to be fair, if I'm remembering correctly, are present

1656
01:34:16,200 --> 01:34:20,680
Speaker 4: in the Scooby universe. But it's two thousand and two,

1657
01:34:20,800 --> 01:34:22,800
Speaker 4: and you don't have to do that, even in the

1658
01:34:22,800 --> 01:34:23,479
Speaker 4: heat of Shrek.

1659
01:34:23,560 --> 01:34:29,000
Speaker 1: Don't even racist, Like come on, yes, yes, so there's

1660
01:34:29,000 --> 01:34:33,960
Speaker 1: so there's like this just this vague coding. The character

1661
01:34:34,000 --> 01:34:37,360
Speaker 1: of Nagoo, who by the way, is played by a

1662
01:34:37,680 --> 01:34:43,280
Speaker 1: white British actor named Stephen Grives or Grieves Okay. He's

1663
01:34:43,479 --> 01:34:51,519
Speaker 1: explaining that he and the other people are upset that

1664
01:34:51,680 --> 01:35:00,360
Speaker 1: Emil Mandavarius displaced ancient creatures. There's no mention of displace seeing,

1665
01:35:01,080 --> 01:35:05,360
Speaker 1: you know, people, which is the thing that happens when

1666
01:35:05,400 --> 01:35:10,640
Speaker 1: colonizers come in and steal land from indigenous people.

1667
01:35:10,560 --> 01:35:12,880
Speaker 4: Which I mean, and this feels like, especially in the

1668
01:35:13,080 --> 01:35:16,720
Speaker 4: cartoony universe of Scooby Doo, like an actual opportunity to

1669
01:35:16,720 --> 01:35:20,320
Speaker 4: comment on it, because you're theoretically you'd be displacing people

1670
01:35:20,800 --> 01:35:23,400
Speaker 4: to start a shitty theme park, like it is like

1671
01:35:23,439 --> 01:35:28,280
Speaker 4: a cartoonish situation and feels like a missed opportunity.

1672
01:35:28,040 --> 01:35:31,960
Speaker 1: Right, But instead they seem to be primarily upset that

1673
01:35:32,360 --> 01:35:38,000
Speaker 1: these ancient creatures which are also monsters. And there's references

1674
01:35:38,080 --> 01:35:44,120
Speaker 1: to like the island being this like thoroughfare to this

1675
01:35:44,320 --> 01:35:49,960
Speaker 1: like mystical realm, so there's all this like mysticism attributed

1676
01:35:50,000 --> 01:35:57,080
Speaker 1: to this indigenously coded people. There's also that luchador character

1677
01:35:57,280 --> 01:36:01,560
Speaker 1: named Zarkos, and it's like, Okay, why do these Polynesian

1678
01:36:01,600 --> 01:36:05,160
Speaker 1: coded people have a why is there like a cultural

1679
01:36:05,240 --> 01:36:06,320
Speaker 1: thing from Mexico?

1680
01:36:07,080 --> 01:36:07,280
Speaker 3: Right?

1681
01:36:07,760 --> 01:36:10,439
Speaker 4: It is just like treating like this movie. And I

1682
01:36:10,439 --> 01:36:13,800
Speaker 4: think that the Scooby Doo universe in general, and a

1683
01:36:13,840 --> 01:36:17,120
Speaker 4: lot of media that dates especially because like this is

1684
01:36:17,640 --> 01:36:21,200
Speaker 4: it almost feels like if you want to make a lazy,

1685
01:36:21,280 --> 01:36:24,800
Speaker 4: racist writing choice, then for sure adapt a property that

1686
01:36:24,880 --> 01:36:26,439
Speaker 4: came out forty years ago.

1687
01:36:26,800 --> 01:36:28,719
Speaker 3: And then and it's like, oh.

1688
01:36:28,600 --> 01:36:32,000
Speaker 4: Well, that property is likely already deeply raisist in the

1689
01:36:32,040 --> 01:36:35,360
Speaker 4: way it's portrayed any other culture, and like it's it's

1690
01:36:35,680 --> 01:36:38,880
Speaker 4: really frustrating and like, yeah, just over the top cartoonish

1691
01:36:38,880 --> 01:36:41,640
Speaker 4: to the way that this movie and this franchise in

1692
01:36:41,720 --> 01:36:48,800
Speaker 4: general up until more recently treats every culture that is

1693
01:36:48,880 --> 01:36:53,120
Speaker 4: not white Midwestern Americans as a monolith.

1694
01:36:54,160 --> 01:36:54,679
Speaker 3: It's wild.

1695
01:36:55,160 --> 01:37:00,439
Speaker 1: And then there's also the representation of voodoo, where there's

1696
01:37:00,479 --> 01:37:04,400
Speaker 1: a character whose name we never learn, everyone just calls

1697
01:37:04,479 --> 01:37:08,719
Speaker 1: him Voodoo Man. He is played by an actor named

1698
01:37:08,840 --> 01:37:10,599
Speaker 1: miguel A Nunez Junior.

1699
01:37:11,280 --> 01:37:14,320
Speaker 3: We really hope he was paid well, because of course

1700
01:37:14,320 --> 01:37:15,360
Speaker 3: he was not for this.

1701
01:37:15,920 --> 01:37:18,320
Speaker 4: I know, I know, but I have to say it

1702
01:37:18,360 --> 01:37:21,280
Speaker 4: out loud and to keep optimism alive.

1703
01:37:21,479 --> 01:37:25,920
Speaker 1: Sure, we see him in I believe, two scenes. Both

1704
01:37:26,000 --> 01:37:31,280
Speaker 1: times he's trying to conduct again a quote unquote voodoo ritual,

1705
01:37:31,960 --> 01:37:37,280
Speaker 1: but again it's nothing that resembles actual practices of the

1706
01:37:37,360 --> 01:37:40,880
Speaker 1: Voodoo religion. We talked about this a lot on the

1707
01:37:40,920 --> 01:37:44,599
Speaker 1: Princess and the Frog episode, Yeah, where if you're interested

1708
01:37:44,600 --> 01:37:47,000
Speaker 1: to hear more detail, like.

1709
01:37:46,960 --> 01:37:51,320
Speaker 4: The full history of appropriation and that because that's also Yeah, in.

1710
01:37:51,280 --> 01:37:52,120
Speaker 3: The Princess and the Frog.

1711
01:37:52,160 --> 01:37:56,360
Speaker 4: It's appropriation within the context of New Orleans specifically, and

1712
01:37:56,479 --> 01:37:59,120
Speaker 4: I mean there's it's it's a very deep history.

1713
01:37:59,360 --> 01:38:02,920
Speaker 1: Yes, so in this movie it just just presented as

1714
01:38:03,040 --> 01:38:05,599
Speaker 1: like a gag. I don't even know. You could write

1715
01:38:05,640 --> 01:38:08,320
Speaker 1: that character out of the movie and it would not

1716
01:38:08,479 --> 01:38:11,920
Speaker 1: really make much of a difference. He's only there to

1717
01:38:12,040 --> 01:38:15,800
Speaker 1: suggest something about the castle. But like that could have

1718
01:38:15,880 --> 01:38:18,920
Speaker 1: just happened to different, like the whole thing, both the

1719
01:38:18,960 --> 01:38:23,200
Speaker 1: representation of voodoo of the indigenous coded people.

1720
01:38:23,560 --> 01:38:26,400
Speaker 4: Yeah, I even hesitated to call it representation, like it's

1721
01:38:26,439 --> 01:38:30,560
Speaker 4: like it's just like saying shit in a way that's offensive.

1722
01:38:30,920 --> 01:38:34,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like it's Yeah, the presence of it, I guess

1723
01:38:34,680 --> 01:38:39,679
Speaker 1: is like it all reads as no thought or research

1724
01:38:39,760 --> 01:38:44,120
Speaker 1: went into anything. It's just relying, relying on and reinforcing

1725
01:38:44,240 --> 01:38:48,120
Speaker 1: existing stereotypes. The filmmakers, it just seems like they're like, well,

1726
01:38:48,120 --> 01:38:51,599
Speaker 1: who cares, only white people are going to see this anyway,

1727
01:38:52,920 --> 01:38:53,559
Speaker 1: and sit.

1728
01:38:53,400 --> 01:38:57,679
Speaker 4: Like that, you know, again, deeply untrue and uh yeah

1729
01:38:57,800 --> 01:39:02,760
Speaker 4: that's super I mean I I honestly, I'm gonna be

1730
01:39:02,840 --> 01:39:05,720
Speaker 4: honest and say I've seen a single damn Guardians of

1731
01:39:05,760 --> 01:39:06,719
Speaker 4: the Galaxy movie.

1732
01:39:07,120 --> 01:39:09,479
Speaker 3: And furthermore, I don't plan to.

1733
01:39:09,800 --> 01:39:12,080
Speaker 1: I bravely have seen all three.

1734
01:39:12,880 --> 01:39:16,040
Speaker 4: Well, I guess that's my question, not that it in

1735
01:39:16,080 --> 01:39:21,799
Speaker 4: any way excuses the way that he handles a.

1736
01:39:20,560 --> 01:39:24,080
Speaker 3: Series of cultures throughout this movie.

1737
01:39:24,560 --> 01:39:27,040
Speaker 4: Is this something that in James Gunn's body of work

1738
01:39:27,080 --> 01:39:31,080
Speaker 4: there's been movement on from what you've witnessed or I'm

1739
01:39:31,080 --> 01:39:34,920
Speaker 4: always curious in like how someone course corrects or doesn't

1740
01:39:34,960 --> 01:39:35,960
Speaker 4: throughout the course of their career.

1741
01:39:36,160 --> 01:39:43,719
Speaker 1: Right, I have not watched those movies through that lens.

1742
01:39:43,880 --> 01:39:47,360
Speaker 1: The main thing that comes to mind is zoeis sol Donna,

1743
01:39:48,320 --> 01:39:52,240
Speaker 1: another example of her, you know, not being allowed to

1744
01:39:52,280 --> 01:39:57,599
Speaker 1: show her actual skin and instead she's much like Shrek.

1745
01:39:58,120 --> 01:40:00,559
Speaker 1: She's green, he's green.

1746
01:40:00,800 --> 01:40:02,439
Speaker 3: She is green in those movies.

1747
01:40:02,720 --> 01:40:05,360
Speaker 4: And even I know that as someone who is really

1748
01:40:06,080 --> 01:40:09,880
Speaker 4: like kind of like absurdly avoided not those movies specifically,

1749
01:40:09,920 --> 01:40:10,720
Speaker 4: but just like.

1750
01:40:13,080 --> 01:40:13,960
Speaker 3: They make me tired.

1751
01:40:14,200 --> 01:40:17,240
Speaker 4: I got so depressed after I saw Doctor Strange in

1752
01:40:17,280 --> 01:40:19,880
Speaker 4: the Multiverse of Madness. I was like, wow, like a

1753
01:40:19,960 --> 01:40:23,559
Speaker 4: Sam Raimi superhero movie, We're so back, and then it

1754
01:40:23,760 --> 01:40:29,200
Speaker 4: just absolutely sucked so hard and I fell asleep, and

1755
01:40:29,240 --> 01:40:32,240
Speaker 4: then I was just like, I'm done with these motherfuckers.

1756
01:40:32,600 --> 01:40:35,800
Speaker 4: I'm done I'm not seeing them anymore. They don't even

1757
01:40:35,880 --> 01:40:38,000
Speaker 4: let Sam Raimi make a good one. He made Spider

1758
01:40:38,000 --> 01:40:40,280
Speaker 4: Man two. I know what kind of joke is this.

1759
01:40:40,520 --> 01:40:43,719
Speaker 3: I think that Alfred Molina could have played the Mister

1760
01:40:43,720 --> 01:40:45,240
Speaker 3: Bean character. Just for the record.

1761
01:40:45,439 --> 01:40:48,200
Speaker 1: Oh sure, yeah, of course, yeah yeah.

1762
01:40:47,960 --> 01:40:50,679
Speaker 3: But he was in Freedom this year, so he couldn't read.

1763
01:40:50,760 --> 01:40:56,280
Speaker 1: He was busy. I don't think I have anything else

1764
01:40:56,479 --> 01:41:00,519
Speaker 1: to talk about. Do you do you d o? O?

1765
01:41:01,040 --> 01:41:05,000
Speaker 4: Jamie Scooby, do you do you?

1766
01:41:05,000 --> 01:41:07,600
Speaker 3: No? I don't, I I uh, I do not.

1767
01:41:08,160 --> 01:41:10,040
Speaker 4: I think that that is all I have to say

1768
01:41:10,080 --> 01:41:13,200
Speaker 4: about Scooby Doo two thousand and two. But I will

1769
01:41:13,240 --> 01:41:17,920
Speaker 4: say that I I was pleasantly surprised by how much

1770
01:41:18,040 --> 01:41:20,680
Speaker 4: of this movie held up better than I thought it was.

1771
01:41:21,280 --> 01:41:29,360
Speaker 3: However, Caitlin Darante, does this movie pass the Bechdel test? Sorry?

1772
01:41:29,479 --> 01:41:34,440
Speaker 1: First of all, my name is Caitlin Dante.

1773
01:41:33,840 --> 01:41:35,720
Speaker 3: D o O huh.

1774
01:41:36,640 --> 01:41:40,160
Speaker 1: And secondly, I think it does right. I forgot to

1775
01:41:40,200 --> 01:41:41,679
Speaker 1: pay attention as per usual.

1776
01:41:41,720 --> 01:41:43,519
Speaker 3: Oh, I thought you were gonna say the rectal rest?

1777
01:41:46,320 --> 01:41:54,000
Speaker 3: Does this movie rest? Yes? It does? It does? Yeah?

1778
01:41:54,000 --> 01:41:55,400
Speaker 3: Between Velmont and Daphne.

1779
01:41:55,479 --> 01:41:57,680
Speaker 5: Uh, there there's a few ext I mean there's some

1780
01:41:57,760 --> 01:41:58,960
Speaker 5: exchanges that are about you.

1781
01:41:58,920 --> 01:42:02,720
Speaker 4: Know, characters I for example, Scooby Doo, but usually when

1782
01:42:02,720 --> 01:42:05,200
Speaker 4: they're talking they I think one stood out to me

1783
01:42:05,360 --> 01:42:09,840
Speaker 4: was Daphne protesting to Velma, characterizing her as helpless.

1784
01:42:11,000 --> 01:42:14,960
Speaker 3: But they also talk about ghosts.

1785
01:42:14,360 --> 01:42:16,360
Speaker 4: And monsters, who I think, in the context of this

1786
01:42:16,439 --> 01:42:20,960
Speaker 4: movie are presented as relatively genderless, and so would I

1787
01:42:21,000 --> 01:42:24,320
Speaker 4: would have that count Well we didn't. Oh, actually, really quick,

1788
01:42:24,320 --> 01:42:25,320
Speaker 4: we didn't talk about.

1789
01:42:25,120 --> 01:42:28,120
Speaker 3: Mary Jane, oh right.

1790
01:42:27,560 --> 01:42:30,680
Speaker 4: Who I think is Like it's frustrating because I think that,

1791
01:42:30,760 --> 01:42:33,600
Speaker 4: like Daphne and Velma.

1792
01:42:33,280 --> 01:42:35,840
Speaker 3: Are the best characterized of the four.

1793
01:42:36,160 --> 01:42:39,160
Speaker 4: I think that the women are given more precedents and

1794
01:42:39,920 --> 01:42:42,679
Speaker 4: more significant arc than the men of the story.

1795
01:42:42,880 --> 01:42:44,360
Speaker 3: That's rare, that's cool.

1796
01:42:44,960 --> 01:42:46,280
Speaker 4: And then we have Mary Jane, who I think is

1797
01:42:46,320 --> 01:42:51,080
Speaker 4: very much presented as a girlfriend character in a more

1798
01:42:51,160 --> 01:42:52,360
Speaker 4: kind of stock character way.

1799
01:42:52,520 --> 01:42:56,920
Speaker 3: We get depth to her in that she is possessed, but.

1800
01:42:57,840 --> 01:43:00,960
Speaker 4: I would ultimately say that she's a possessed girlfriend character

1801
01:43:02,760 --> 01:43:06,120
Speaker 4: and a waste and I don't like seeing people waste

1802
01:43:06,160 --> 01:43:07,200
Speaker 4: Isle of Fisher's time.

1803
01:43:08,240 --> 01:43:11,599
Speaker 3: I think is is what I believe to be true.

1804
01:43:11,880 --> 01:43:12,680
Speaker 3: So that's uh.

1805
01:43:12,800 --> 01:43:16,080
Speaker 4: But anyways, this movie does pass the rectal rest and

1806
01:43:16,160 --> 01:43:19,960
Speaker 4: the Bechfel test. But what about the most important metric

1807
01:43:20,240 --> 01:43:20,920
Speaker 4: of all time?

1808
01:43:21,240 --> 01:43:23,920
Speaker 1: If you're referring to the ripple rail.

1809
01:43:25,160 --> 01:43:28,920
Speaker 3: God, it sounds so gross when you when we scoobyfy

1810
01:43:29,120 --> 01:43:32,759
Speaker 3: any of the like vernacular associated with the show. Yes,

1811
01:43:32,880 --> 01:43:35,160
Speaker 3: the rectal test and the ripple rail.

1812
01:43:35,600 --> 01:43:41,120
Speaker 1: Oh aka the nipple scale, on which we rate the

1813
01:43:41,160 --> 01:43:45,040
Speaker 1: movie zero to five nipples based on examining it through

1814
01:43:45,120 --> 01:43:50,880
Speaker 1: an intersectional feminist lens. Yeah, I'll give this movie, I guess,

1815
01:43:50,880 --> 01:43:57,800
Speaker 1: two nipples. I think that while it does rely on

1816
01:43:58,520 --> 01:44:04,720
Speaker 1: some pretty tropey ideas of female characters and like the

1817
01:44:04,720 --> 01:44:10,480
Speaker 1: way they are designed, the way they are presented feels

1818
01:44:10,920 --> 01:44:18,200
Speaker 1: rather tropy at times, rather ropy rather ropey. I do

1819
01:44:18,320 --> 01:44:24,639
Speaker 1: appreciate that they are given the bar is low here,

1820
01:44:24,680 --> 01:44:28,960
Speaker 1: but they're given narrative significance. They're given interesting arcs that

1821
01:44:29,520 --> 01:44:33,439
Speaker 1: for two thousand and two feel kind of feminist in

1822
01:44:33,479 --> 01:44:35,639
Speaker 1: a two thousand and two way, where one of them

1823
01:44:35,960 --> 01:44:40,120
Speaker 1: is tired of being damseled and so she takes matters

1824
01:44:40,160 --> 01:44:43,720
Speaker 1: into her own hands. She learns how to fight and

1825
01:44:43,800 --> 01:44:45,880
Speaker 1: defend herself, and then we see her doing that by

1826
01:44:45,880 --> 01:44:46,719
Speaker 1: the end of the movie.

1827
01:44:46,960 --> 01:44:48,960
Speaker 4: Yes, and it actually follows through, because I feel like

1828
01:44:49,040 --> 01:44:51,479
Speaker 4: so often in this era you would get the beginning

1829
01:44:51,520 --> 01:44:53,240
Speaker 4: of that message and it would bear out in no

1830
01:44:53,360 --> 01:44:57,439
Speaker 4: significant way. So I do think ups On actually having

1831
01:44:58,000 --> 01:44:59,920
Speaker 4: the vague feminist statement.

1832
01:45:00,000 --> 01:45:06,760
Speaker 6: Results in something wow, crumbs, crumbs. And also that scene

1833
01:45:06,760 --> 01:45:10,599
Speaker 6: where she fights is I mean, for me, it's it's

1834
01:45:10,640 --> 01:45:11,000
Speaker 6: a sleigh.

1835
01:45:11,040 --> 01:45:13,160
Speaker 3: It's great, it's good, it's it's fun.

1836
01:45:13,160 --> 01:45:16,000
Speaker 1: And speaking of sleigh, it's kind of giving Buffy the

1837
01:45:16,080 --> 01:45:17,080
Speaker 1: vampire sleigh.

1838
01:45:17,439 --> 01:45:21,840
Speaker 4: Or if we're saying this, the the vernacular is dead,

1839
01:45:23,400 --> 01:45:25,160
Speaker 4: and if it's if it's arrived at.

1840
01:45:25,120 --> 01:45:29,479
Speaker 3: Us, you know, it's well Jamie don't.

1841
01:45:30,000 --> 01:45:32,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was gonna ask if you want to come

1842
01:45:32,120 --> 01:45:39,240
Speaker 1: over and lamp with me later, something that hasn't been

1843
01:45:39,320 --> 01:45:42,719
Speaker 1: said in decades. And also I never even heard it,

1844
01:45:42,920 --> 01:45:43,519
Speaker 1: I don't.

1845
01:45:43,560 --> 01:45:46,240
Speaker 4: I was like, it's very possible that that was like

1846
01:45:46,479 --> 01:45:51,080
Speaker 4: reaching New England parlance in my area. After we saw

1847
01:45:51,360 --> 01:45:54,080
Speaker 4: Napoleon Dynamite five years after it came out.

1848
01:45:54,680 --> 01:45:58,240
Speaker 3: Really don't know, we really don't know what what all

1849
01:45:58,320 --> 01:45:58,880
Speaker 3: that was.

1850
01:45:59,000 --> 01:46:01,600
Speaker 1: Then we should come for Napoleon Dynamite.

1851
01:46:01,720 --> 01:46:04,120
Speaker 3: But I said earlier, I never want to.

1852
01:46:04,520 --> 01:46:07,240
Speaker 1: Oh, sorry, okay, but I had to take it back.

1853
01:46:07,680 --> 01:46:11,040
Speaker 3: But why did I say that. I don't know. I

1854
01:46:11,120 --> 01:46:12,800
Speaker 3: think I just don't want to watch it.

1855
01:46:13,240 --> 01:46:17,800
Speaker 1: Oh well, our job, Jamie, is to watch every.

1856
01:46:17,600 --> 01:46:21,759
Speaker 3: Movie we wanted to watch. We wanted to watch Scoopy.

1857
01:46:22,200 --> 01:46:28,000
Speaker 1: Yeah it's true anyway, Okay, okay, So that is Daphne's storyline.

1858
01:46:28,240 --> 01:46:32,920
Speaker 1: Velma's storyline is being frustrated that a man is taking

1859
01:46:32,960 --> 01:46:37,320
Speaker 1: credit for her work, a very familiar thing and.

1860
01:46:37,320 --> 01:46:38,360
Speaker 3: We've both been there.

1861
01:46:38,600 --> 01:46:42,760
Speaker 1: We've both been there, and the end of the movie,

1862
01:46:43,000 --> 01:46:46,280
Speaker 1: the situation is that. So really it's kind of like

1863
01:46:46,280 --> 01:46:50,479
Speaker 1: a redemption for Fred, which is kind of annoying, yes,

1864
01:46:50,560 --> 01:46:56,360
Speaker 1: but it is Velma being acknowledged and recognized publicly, like

1865
01:46:57,000 --> 01:47:00,120
Speaker 1: in front of the press, on the news, on the news,

1866
01:47:00,360 --> 01:47:04,760
Speaker 1: for her work. And then he also like again the

1867
01:47:04,800 --> 01:47:06,559
Speaker 1: bar is so low here, but he gives her the

1868
01:47:06,600 --> 01:47:10,640
Speaker 1: space to like tell the story for herself and say, like,

1869
01:47:10,760 --> 01:47:14,519
Speaker 1: here's what happened. Although we cut away almost immediately, well

1870
01:47:14,520 --> 01:47:16,960
Speaker 1: it is presented, is like he lets her and you're like,

1871
01:47:17,080 --> 01:47:20,360
Speaker 1: he lets her do it exactly, So that's like but

1872
01:47:20,520 --> 01:47:26,880
Speaker 1: still still nothing not nothing. So there's those pretty cool

1873
01:47:26,920 --> 01:47:29,639
Speaker 1: things I would have liked to see. I think more

1874
01:47:29,680 --> 01:47:35,040
Speaker 1: of a relationship and friendship between Daphne and Velma. I

1875
01:47:35,120 --> 01:47:37,840
Speaker 1: would have liked to see Mary Jane be more of

1876
01:47:37,880 --> 01:47:45,160
Speaker 1: a realized character, you know, and also let Velma be gay.

1877
01:47:45,840 --> 01:47:47,240
Speaker 3: He tried, He tried.

1878
01:47:47,560 --> 01:47:48,920
Speaker 1: It was two thousand and two, so.

1879
01:47:49,479 --> 01:47:51,599
Speaker 3: I appreciate the attendant, right.

1880
01:47:51,600 --> 01:47:54,920
Speaker 1: Yes, So you know, maybe I'll bump it up to

1881
01:47:54,960 --> 01:47:59,639
Speaker 1: two and a half even and I'll give one to Elma,

1882
01:48:00,240 --> 01:48:05,720
Speaker 1: one to Daphne, and one to Ruby Ruby Rue or

1883
01:48:05,720 --> 01:48:06,120
Speaker 1: one half.

1884
01:48:06,320 --> 01:48:08,400
Speaker 4: I'm gonna give two and a half to the version

1885
01:48:08,680 --> 01:48:11,760
Speaker 4: that or not I'm gonna give. I'm gonna give two

1886
01:48:11,800 --> 01:48:14,040
Speaker 4: and a half to the version that came out on three,

1887
01:48:14,160 --> 01:48:17,960
Speaker 4: to the version that James Gunn intended. I think that

1888
01:48:18,080 --> 01:48:22,000
Speaker 4: the the racism in this movie is pretty.

1889
01:48:22,000 --> 01:48:27,680
Speaker 3: Uh obviously fucked up. Not that there's any obvious way

1890
01:48:27,720 --> 01:48:30,360
Speaker 3: to do that, but it's pretty flagrant, I guess, is

1891
01:48:30,360 --> 01:48:30,960
Speaker 3: what I'm saying.

1892
01:48:32,000 --> 01:48:34,559
Speaker 4: The way that a number of cultures are not only

1893
01:48:34,560 --> 01:48:36,880
Speaker 4: turned into a monolith, but insulted on top of that,

1894
01:48:37,760 --> 01:48:39,280
Speaker 4: and on top of that, just like a lot of

1895
01:48:39,360 --> 01:48:43,800
Speaker 4: missed opportunities for inclusivity that the franchise takes. We know

1896
01:48:43,960 --> 01:48:47,160
Speaker 4: now with the benefit of time decades to course correct

1897
01:48:47,200 --> 01:48:50,880
Speaker 4: on I was interested to learn about the history of

1898
01:48:51,560 --> 01:48:55,479
Speaker 4: trying to include queer characters in this franchise and the

1899
01:48:55,600 --> 01:48:59,160
Speaker 4: very of the time way that that was prevented from happening.

1900
01:49:00,160 --> 01:49:02,719
Speaker 4: But I am you know, I'll hand it to James

1901
01:49:02,720 --> 01:49:05,080
Speaker 4: Gunn for really pushing for it and to the point

1902
01:49:05,120 --> 01:49:07,759
Speaker 4: where the actors on set were like.

1903
01:49:07,680 --> 01:49:10,559
Speaker 3: This is my character for two thousand and two. That

1904
01:49:10,680 --> 01:49:11,839
Speaker 3: is fairly impressive.

1905
01:49:11,880 --> 01:49:14,160
Speaker 4: And then to piggyback on what you were saying, I

1906
01:49:14,160 --> 01:49:17,160
Speaker 4: think that, yeah, the I wouldn't have expected of this

1907
01:49:17,240 --> 01:49:21,400
Speaker 4: era for the two characters of the five to be

1908
01:49:21,520 --> 01:49:26,120
Speaker 4: most focused on would be the two women, and that yes,

1909
01:49:26,280 --> 01:49:31,360
Speaker 4: at their core, they are kind of like simple feminist messages,

1910
01:49:32,280 --> 01:49:35,799
Speaker 4: but in the context of a kid's movie at this time,

1911
01:49:36,200 --> 01:49:40,920
Speaker 4: the fact that those messages are said and acted on

1912
01:49:40,960 --> 01:49:41,759
Speaker 4: within the story.

1913
01:49:42,479 --> 01:49:43,080
Speaker 3: I thought it worked.

1914
01:49:43,080 --> 01:49:47,960
Speaker 4: I thought it was good, and I wish they had kissed. Yeah,

1915
01:49:48,000 --> 01:49:51,280
Speaker 4: And so I'm gonna give Yeah two and a half,

1916
01:49:51,439 --> 01:49:54,439
Speaker 4: two or three, depending on which version of it we're

1917
01:49:54,479 --> 01:49:55,040
Speaker 4: talking about.

1918
01:49:55,600 --> 01:49:58,200
Speaker 3: I'm gonna give one to dafh.

1919
01:49:58,720 --> 01:50:01,160
Speaker 4: These suitcases I'm gonna give only I'm not giving mine

1920
01:50:01,160 --> 01:50:05,240
Speaker 4: to people a Dafty suitcases at the airport. I'm giving

1921
01:50:06,439 --> 01:50:13,960
Speaker 4: one to Scooby's Grandma Drag and I'm giving the half to.

1922
01:50:15,479 --> 01:50:17,639
Speaker 3: The animatronics inside of Mister Bean.

1923
01:50:19,920 --> 01:50:20,360
Speaker 1: Wonderful.

1924
01:50:20,400 --> 01:50:25,080
Speaker 7: And there you go, you sickos, the hundreds and hundreds

1925
01:50:25,080 --> 01:50:28,439
Speaker 7: of people that said no, no, we want them to

1926
01:50:28,479 --> 01:50:30,479
Speaker 7: cover Scooby Doo, Well guess what we did.

1927
01:50:30,520 --> 01:50:31,479
Speaker 3: And we had a great time.

1928
01:50:32,040 --> 01:50:34,600
Speaker 1: I hope you're happy, had a blast.

1929
01:50:34,880 --> 01:50:40,600
Speaker 3: I had arrest with you raitlan Verante.

1930
01:50:41,160 --> 01:50:41,559
Speaker 1: Wow.

1931
01:50:41,680 --> 01:50:44,800
Speaker 4: And just a reminder, if you want to, you know,

1932
01:50:44,920 --> 01:50:47,760
Speaker 4: force us to do things that are ultimately fun for us,

1933
01:50:48,680 --> 01:50:52,160
Speaker 4: you can subscribe to our Patreon aka Matreon right now

1934
01:50:52,640 --> 01:50:57,639
Speaker 4: five dollars a month to listen to two additional bonus

1935
01:50:57,680 --> 01:51:00,400
Speaker 4: episodes with just Caitlin and me every single month on

1936
01:51:00,520 --> 01:51:03,840
Speaker 4: a theme that I would say at least every other month.

1937
01:51:04,320 --> 01:51:08,200
Speaker 4: We give the Matreon community a chance to choose either

1938
01:51:08,200 --> 01:51:10,040
Speaker 4: what the theme is or we come up with the

1939
01:51:10,040 --> 01:51:13,160
Speaker 4: theme and you vote on the movies. Occasionally we will

1940
01:51:13,160 --> 01:51:16,080
Speaker 4: cancel democracy and be like it's the Pinocchio Wars and

1941
01:51:16,080 --> 01:51:17,519
Speaker 4: you have to deal with it. But it's just kind

1942
01:51:17,520 --> 01:51:20,240
Speaker 4: of a chaotic energy over there.

1943
01:51:20,920 --> 01:51:23,519
Speaker 3: We have fun over there, and if you like the

1944
01:51:23,600 --> 01:51:24,040
Speaker 3: vibe of.

1945
01:51:23,960 --> 01:51:26,599
Speaker 4: Today's episode, that's kind of what the vibe is like

1946
01:51:26,760 --> 01:51:28,479
Speaker 4: over on the Matreon so check it out.

1947
01:51:28,720 --> 01:51:33,479
Speaker 1: So true, and that's at patreon dot com slash Bechdel Cast.

1948
01:51:33,720 --> 01:51:34,880
Speaker 3: You can go to the rectal Cast.

1949
01:51:35,280 --> 01:51:37,439
Speaker 4: Don't go, we don't We can't vouch for whatever is

1950
01:51:37,439 --> 01:51:40,559
Speaker 4: that pat patreon dot com slash the rectal Cast.

1951
01:51:40,760 --> 01:51:48,479
Speaker 1: But spin off podcast. No okay fine, so yes Patreon

1952
01:51:48,520 --> 01:51:51,200
Speaker 1: dot com slash Bechdel Cast. You can also go to

1953
01:51:51,360 --> 01:51:55,320
Speaker 1: te public dot com slash the Bechdel Cast for all

1954
01:51:55,360 --> 01:52:00,000
Speaker 1: of your merchandising needs, which are designed by Jamie Loftus.

1955
01:52:00,120 --> 01:52:02,280
Speaker 1: Sorry Raimi Rough.

1956
01:52:03,400 --> 01:52:07,719
Speaker 4: Yeah, tis the season to get your just to show

1957
01:52:07,760 --> 01:52:11,040
Speaker 4: where you stand on the political spectrum and get merch.

1958
01:52:11,120 --> 01:52:13,679
Speaker 3: That says I think beatles juice comes wet.

1959
01:52:13,520 --> 01:52:18,600
Speaker 4: Scabs and or dry scabs, and yeah, people love to

1960
01:52:18,720 --> 01:52:20,160
Speaker 4: wear the merchant public.

1961
01:52:20,160 --> 01:52:20,559
Speaker 3: Just kidding.

1962
01:52:20,560 --> 01:52:23,320
Speaker 4: I think the entirety of like it is, if you

1963
01:52:23,360 --> 01:52:26,040
Speaker 4: want a shirt to wear only inside your house, you

1964
01:52:26,200 --> 01:52:30,320
Speaker 4: gotta get the scabs merch. Anyways, we love you so

1965
01:52:30,439 --> 01:52:33,920
Speaker 4: much we're yanking the mask off your face at being like, wait,

1966
01:52:35,360 --> 01:52:36,679
Speaker 4: you're just you're just some guy?

1967
01:52:37,040 --> 01:52:37,639
Speaker 3: What the fuck?

1968
01:52:38,120 --> 01:52:42,000
Speaker 1: Yeah? And I would have gotten no way with it

1969
01:52:42,040 --> 01:52:47,760
Speaker 1: if it weren't for you middling podcasters.

1970
01:52:47,520 --> 01:52:51,000
Speaker 4: Exactly whatever, exactly, And I think we really stuck the

1971
01:52:51,080 --> 01:52:54,440
Speaker 3: Landing and we're gonna bye, goodbye,