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Speaker 1: don't understand you never know stories of things we simply
Speaker 1: don't know the answer too. Hey guys, it's Thinking Sideways
Speaker 1: the podcast. I'm Devin, joined this week by my special
Speaker 1: guest co hosts and Steve special guests this week. Yeah yeah,
Speaker 1: And this week we're going to talk about a mystery.
Speaker 1: It's gonna be a little one. It's a it's this
Speaker 1: is like literally, this is the jokes I've been hearing
Speaker 1: all week. This is going to be a jo Yeah. Well,
Speaker 1: what if we're not careful? You mean, if we're careful. Yes,
Speaker 1: it's about a tiny alien. I just gave it away
Speaker 1: mane this week. As you know, because you probably read
Speaker 1: the title, uh and maybe even the description. We're going
Speaker 1: to talk about the ata Comma skeleton, also often referred
Speaker 1: to as the ata Comma humanoid or alien or I
Speaker 1: don't know, or proof proof for aliens, yes, proof for
Speaker 1: the little green guy, literally, the little green Yeah, that's plains.
Speaker 1: Why we haven't seen there? You let their saucers because
Speaker 1: they must be tiny garbage. Well yeah, yeah, it's crazy.
Speaker 1: Actually it makes sense. That's why we were all convinced
Speaker 1: by a hubcap for a while. Ye's right size. Okay,
Speaker 1: we're done. Okay, so our story, just to briefly do
Speaker 1: a quick little overview here. Briefly quickly, Yep, in two
Speaker 1: thous three, I'm pretty sure that was the year that
Speaker 1: this was discovered, but it's it's hard to tell because
Speaker 1: some of the stories are different. But we're going to
Speaker 1: say in two thousand three, but a token quote quote
Speaker 1: unquote collector made a very interesting discovery and a pouch
Speaker 1: in the Ottacama Desert, which is mostly in chili Um.
Speaker 1: It's about forty one thousand square miles, which, for you
Speaker 1: people who are not civilized, is a hundred and five
Speaker 1: thousand square kilometers. There's very little population there. It's mostly
Speaker 1: just deserted desert towns from the nitrate era. Yea, they
Speaker 1: closed down the minds and the towns. I was going
Speaker 1: to ask, did not you mean because it was nitrate mining? Yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: that's got it. No, from the I've never heard of
Speaker 1: the nitrate. I never heard of that. You must have
Speaker 1: just forgotten slipped. Yeah, and obviously have one some wine
Speaker 1: clothes down. You really don't to stick around because there's
Speaker 1: no water in the desert, in that particular desert, Yeah,
Speaker 1: there's no right, we were talking earlier. It's the is
Speaker 1: it the driest place on earth? It is the driest
Speaker 1: place on earth. So take that everyone who thought that
Speaker 1: you know where it was. So this guy while scavenging
Speaker 1: found it was he was in a church. He was
Speaker 1: kind of digging around he used to find he was
Speaker 1: trying to find things that were like worth money. I
Speaker 1: think I I in one version of this that I heard,
Speaker 1: he was it was actually he actually found it in
Speaker 1: a graveyard next to the church, which was in an
Speaker 1: abandoned town. Yeah, or she might have even been like
Speaker 1: grave robbing. Basically, you're called he's described as a token collector,
Speaker 1: but really he's just a scavenger. Yeah, oh yeah, totally,
Speaker 1: just a scavenger, just just raiding these deserted towns for
Speaker 1: anything that might be worth anything, which I mean, they're
Speaker 1: deserted town so it's not like anybody's gonna get upset
Speaker 1: about it. But he's scavenging yeah, pretty much so Barry
Speaker 1: just slightly under the ground. I don't think it was
Speaker 1: very deep. He found a white off that was tied
Speaker 1: with a violet ribbon. Violet the color ribbon, uh, and
Speaker 1: it contained a skeleton that was about six inches long,
Speaker 1: with a slightly elongated skull and only ten ribs. To
Speaker 1: to make this story a little weirder, I'm just gonna
Speaker 1: throw a quick little thing in here and then we'll
Speaker 1: talk a little bit about it more. In records that
Speaker 1: are dating back to I think it was three, a
Speaker 1: similar six inch tall humanoid skeleton was featured in ripley
Speaker 1: Believe It or Not, the Ripley's Believe It or Not
Speaker 1: book that came out then, and it was also, you know,
Speaker 1: like I said, a six inch tall humanoid skeleton. He
Speaker 1: was called Atta Boy because he was found believe it
Speaker 1: or not, in the Atacama Desert, not far from where
Speaker 1: Atta was found, which is what they called. This new
Speaker 1: skeleton's speculated and probably all kinds of these things floating
Speaker 1: around the Atacama Desert. Yeah, probably there is so dry,
Speaker 1: you know, Yeah, things get momified. Yeah. I was going
Speaker 1: to say, is that it's uh that desert it's going
Speaker 1: to suck the moisture out and preserve things obscenely quickly. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: and really well usually too. Okay, So, as we said,
Speaker 1: this guy his name was Oscar Munez, and I can't
Speaker 1: find anything about him except for, as I said, I
Speaker 1: think he's just he was just a scavenger. But the
Speaker 1: skeleton was eventually sold to the current owner. His name
Speaker 1: was Ramon Naviasorio and he's a Spanish businessman. Not was
Speaker 1: is sorry, he is currently still living, still owns the skeleton.
Speaker 1: It's not in his hands so these days, right, did
Speaker 1: he get it back or did he you know he did?
Speaker 1: He got it back? Um, he never was without it.
Speaker 1: It was when it was examined. It was examined in Spain,
Speaker 1: in Barcelona, where he is. So it's my understanding that
Speaker 1: he's never not had possession of it. What is Why
Speaker 1: would you want this creepy little thing and kind of cool?
Speaker 1: I don't know, I kind of it. I would take one, Yeah, totally,
Speaker 1: would you not? Do you also collect those weird dolls
Speaker 1: that have the eyes that follow you? Though? No, I
Speaker 1: don't those scary. No. We had those when I was
Speaker 1: a kid and I did not like them. Yeah, I
Speaker 1: don't remember that toy. They actually followed you around. No, No,
Speaker 1: they just appeared to, you know, like paintings do. Yeah, somehow,
Speaker 1: And I don't totally know how, because Ramon had this
Speaker 1: thing for a long time, and until two thousand nine
Speaker 1: it had kind of just been this obscure thing that
Speaker 1: he owned. He didn't really talk about it that much.
Speaker 1: But a guy by the name of Stephen Greer found
Speaker 1: out about this skeleton in a He was at a
Speaker 1: conference and somebody off handedly mentioned it to him, this
Speaker 1: tiny little skeleton that they knew, some guy who owned
Speaker 1: knew some guy who owned. That's that's better. That's more better.
Speaker 1: It's pretty close. Yeah, And so Mr Greer or seven,
Speaker 1: we'll just call him Stephen. He managed. Mr Greer managed
Speaker 1: to convince Ramone that he could investigate the skeleton. So
Speaker 1: in two thousand nine, that's when kind of this this
Speaker 1: whole story kind of started to hit the mainstream. Would
Speaker 1: you agree with that he is the one that raised
Speaker 1: all the attention? He sure did. And then when did
Speaker 1: the movie come out? Has two thousand twelve. Yes, I
Speaker 1: know we're going to get into that, but yeah, we'll
Speaker 1: talk about that in a little bit. So Mr Greer
Speaker 1: assembled a team of um, we're going to call them
Speaker 1: air quote respected scientists unquote. Some of the some of
Speaker 1: the people on the team I think are actually professionals
Speaker 1: in their fields. Well, I think some of them are
Speaker 1: actually good, like good scientists. Some of the research that
Speaker 1: I've read, I trust these people are competent as seven
Speaker 1: or maybe not so much. And some of the other
Speaker 1: people on his team maybe not so much. But we'll
Speaker 1: make sure to make note when we believe people and
Speaker 1: when we don't believe people, because you know us, we're
Speaker 1: good at that. Um so so yeah. Mr Greer and
Speaker 1: his team went to Barcelona in two thousand and twelve
Speaker 1: to kentuct extensive research on the skeleton. The team was
Speaker 1: headed up by Dr Gary Nolan, who, after some googling,
Speaker 1: you know, he's a lot of UFO stuff for this guy.
Speaker 1: He's definitely upologist's into it, Yeah Nolan, Dr Nolan. But
Speaker 1: he is also a geneticist at Stanford, same same guy. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so I guess he's probably not a total hack. I
Speaker 1: don't know, It's hard to tell with these people sometimes,
Speaker 1: right Yeah, yeah, probably yeah. Uh so, anyway, um, we'll
Speaker 1: we'll talk a little bit more about the other members
Speaker 1: of the team, or at least one other member. Okay, later,
Speaker 1: but I do want to just first start out by
Speaker 1: describing the skeleton. I know that we have some listeners
Speaker 1: that you know, listen us while they're driving things like that.
Speaker 1: So let's talk about what the skeleton looked like and
Speaker 1: what makes it so strange other than the fact that
Speaker 1: it's six inches tall. Um, So let's go with that.
Speaker 1: The team examined atta atta ata um and they took
Speaker 1: DNA samples from the distal ends of the anterior ribs,
Speaker 1: which is the fancy way of saying that they took
Speaker 1: samples from the front ends of the ribs, which should
Speaker 1: have been connected to the stern um. There's no stern
Speaker 1: um on this skeleton, which isn't really that weird to me,
Speaker 1: I guess, and the run I don't think so. I'm
Speaker 1: not sure how well formed the stern um is young age, yeah,
Speaker 1: I think that's well, at what age that's the question. Well, yeah,
Speaker 1: that is a big question on this, but it doesn't
Speaker 1: really I mean, you, in a human fetus, the sternham forms,
Speaker 1: it's there. I think the sternham forms in like the
Speaker 1: fourth or fifth month. Once the rib cage firms up
Speaker 1: and all the organs have developed. Then it kind of
Speaker 1: because you know, it shouldn't create too early because it
Speaker 1: could make the cavity too small. So I think that
Speaker 1: that's one of the reasons that it waits longer right there.
Speaker 1: But there is a big dispute about this critters, Yeah,
Speaker 1: there is, yeah, And well, we are absolutely going to
Speaker 1: get into that at a minute. But so that's where
Speaker 1: they took the bone the DNA samples from. And there
Speaker 1: was bone marrow in the skull as well, so they
Speaker 1: took a little bit of that for testing. And I've
Speaker 1: seen I've seen a lot of hubbub about if you
Speaker 1: see photos of this and you see the back of
Speaker 1: the head, there's a hole in it, and they say
Speaker 1: that's because they punched that hole to get the d
Speaker 1: N A. Yes, But you also hear a lot of
Speaker 1: people on the internet say, oh, no, that's obviously the
Speaker 1: cause of death. Okay, So actually I can clarify this.
Speaker 1: They took CT scans and X rays before they started
Speaker 1: to do anything exploratory, and you can see in the
Speaker 1: CT scans there's a fracture at the back of the head.
Speaker 1: It's not a huge hole in the back of the
Speaker 1: head where they had to cut through. But there is
Speaker 1: a visible fracture in the back of the skull. That
Speaker 1: that's what they're talking about when they say that's the
Speaker 1: cause of death. Well, I've seen somewhere. Or I guess
Speaker 1: misinformed is probably a better way of saying. It's their misinformed.
Speaker 1: That big hole. As far as I can tell, they
Speaker 1: did cut it to get to extract started material out. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I am not of the impression that that whole existed
Speaker 1: prior to the test with that, but there was there
Speaker 1: was a fracture. Yeah, there was actually a photograph to
Speaker 1: from from prior where there was not where ye. Um,
Speaker 1: But that's good. So, like I said, they took X
Speaker 1: rays and CT scans of the tiny skeleton to make
Speaker 1: sure that they could evaluate the body for any abnormalities
Speaker 1: before they did any again exploration. So they were they
Speaker 1: were following good procedures. They were following actually they're falling
Speaker 1: exceptional procedure. Yeah, everything was done in a totally sterile environment. Um.
Speaker 1: Everything was documented. People were taking pictures and filming the
Speaker 1: entire time, which is really important also so you can
Speaker 1: document if somebody happened to do something that caused damage
Speaker 1: to it. You could come back later and say, Okay,
Speaker 1: did one of us do this while we were exploring
Speaker 1: or did not? So this isn't like when they did
Speaker 1: all the testing on the dinosaur bones and determined that
Speaker 1: they were part ostrich. Yeah, no, not like that. Okay, no,
Speaker 1: So at least during this part, during the examination, the
Speaker 1: procedures were they were very well followed. So ada. As
Speaker 1: I've mentioned again and again, six inches long, which is, um,
Speaker 1: we're tall. You referred to as six inches tall? Yeah, tall, long, tall,
Speaker 1: which is uh. I think it's fifteen centimeters is what
Speaker 1: I see. That's about about equal. One place I saw
Speaker 1: it described as a hundred and fifty millimeters, which I
Speaker 1: thought was silly at more accurate breaking into millimeters, I
Speaker 1: don't know. Maybe yeah, anyway, so it's about that size
Speaker 1: again for our not in non American measurers measures. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's got a goofy looking a head though it's very elongated.
Speaker 1: It's kind of you know, what it reminds me of
Speaker 1: is the crystal skull from Indiana Jones was terrible movie,
Speaker 1: you know what you're talking about. So it's a very
Speaker 1: long oval skulls. Yeah, and you can see, there's some
Speaker 1: bone abnormalities, just like in the formation of it um,
Speaker 1: so it doesn't seem as though the skull was crushed
Speaker 1: postmortem to be that like squeezed collapsed on itself a
Speaker 1: little bit. I see what you're Yeah, And like I said,
Speaker 1: there's a fracture on the back right side of the skull,
Speaker 1: which is often ruled as the cause of death. There's
Speaker 1: a tooth in the jaw. Actually, I don't know if
Speaker 1: you guys actually got a chance to look at this
Speaker 1: or not. It's kind of interesting. There's an actual tooth
Speaker 1: in the jaw. It's not like little infant you know, Newblin's.
Speaker 1: It's like an actual They describe it as a mature tooth,
Speaker 1: which is interesting. Yeah, you know again interesting. Yeah, it's unusual.
Speaker 1: It is unusual. There's a fracture on the right arm,
Speaker 1: just above the elbow. The skeleton has just ten ribs,
Speaker 1: which is weird. You know, humans have twelve ribs. Everybody
Speaker 1: knows that, and after two months in utero, a human
Speaker 1: fetus well developed all twelve ribs, mentioning usually yeah, and
Speaker 1: almost every circumstance. Yeah, yeah. The during the CT scan,
Speaker 1: it was revealed that there are there are lungs in
Speaker 1: the this mummy skeleton thing, or or were well remains
Speaker 1: of the and quote what appears to be the remains
Speaker 1: of a heart structure unquote. And this has caused the
Speaker 1: team at Stanford and also pretty much every researcher to
Speaker 1: look at this stuff to believe that it's it's a
Speaker 1: real skeleton of a real living thing. It's not just
Speaker 1: a little it's not just a hoax, not just a
Speaker 1: little curved If this is If this is a hoax,
Speaker 1: this is the best hoax. And I saw a very
Speaker 1: tongue in cheek thing recently when I was reading about this.
Speaker 1: I think it was actually just like an hour or
Speaker 1: two ago that said the quote was this couldn't be
Speaker 1: a hoax unless it was hoaxed by aliens like God.
Speaker 1: Of course you would go there a sense of humor. Yeah. Really.
Speaker 1: There's also a fairly pronounced curve to the spine. Both
Speaker 1: there's a hump like, but I think that's just from
Speaker 1: the way it was preserved. Yeah, hump near the shoulders
Speaker 1: kind of. But also the spine curves like in a
Speaker 1: serious curve to it. Yeah, well, I don't think it's
Speaker 1: an ass curve. I don't think it ever curves back,
Speaker 1: is the thing. It's just to see it just curves
Speaker 1: the one way. And again, I we don't know. I
Speaker 1: don't know certainly if it's just from the mummiphization, the
Speaker 1: mummifizing of it, and also being wrapped, being wrapped up
Speaker 1: in the cloths and the breast while there's still moisture
Speaker 1: in the body and dries out, it's gonna stiffen in
Speaker 1: whatever position it's at. Yeah, and there's one more thing
Speaker 1: to mention, Well, I guess there's a few more things
Speaker 1: to mention. I want to mention how tiny the little
Speaker 1: feet are, tiny, tiny little feet and yeah, but yeah,
Speaker 1: smaller than mine, but also like proportionately tiny, right would you?
Speaker 1: I would say you can almost miss them, almost at
Speaker 1: the little bottom of the legs. I didn't. I didn't
Speaker 1: find them to be out of proportion, But then again,
Speaker 1: it is so small to begin with. That that's why
Speaker 1: I don't find them to be disproportionately small. That's fair.
Speaker 1: The other the other thing that I have to mention,
Speaker 1: shin is the knees. And knees, it turns out, for
Speaker 1: those of you who don't know, are pretty good way
Speaker 1: of determining determining age, early years in life in humans. Yeah,
Speaker 1: because when we're born, we don't really have knee caps,
Speaker 1: which is a misnomer. We do have knee caps, they're
Speaker 1: just all cartilage and then they harden over time. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but you but when you're born, you basically don't have
Speaker 1: knee caps. And you can look at the X rays
Speaker 1: of knees. It's very interesting. There's like, no, they don't
Speaker 1: look like knee basically when you're an infant, they just
Speaker 1: don't um and it's hard to describe. So I would
Speaker 1: encourage you guys to go out and google this because
Speaker 1: it is kind of fascinating. I didn't really know this
Speaker 1: about me. Bies look like it basically just looks like
Speaker 1: there's two leg bones and there's like a little there's
Speaker 1: little little balls of bones on either side, but there's
Speaker 1: no there's no noticeable joint and there's no cap or
Speaker 1: anything like that. Formed babies are weird. Babies are really weird. Yeah,
Speaker 1: So they stay car large until you're about three, and
Speaker 1: then they cause file all the way up until you're
Speaker 1: about six to eight, depending on you know, your own
Speaker 1: personal development. But apparently, and I know Steve has some
Speaker 1: things to say about this that will tackle in the
Speaker 1: theories sections. But apparently Adda had fully formed kneecaps, which
Speaker 1: again it's hard to tell because he's so tiny that
Speaker 1: it's really hard to see what's going on. And I
Speaker 1: haven't I haven't seen anything that looks like a knee
Speaker 1: cap to me. It's interesting, right, It's it's hard. Like
Speaker 1: I said, it's hard to tell. And we will, we'll
Speaker 1: grab onto this a little bit more in the We're
Speaker 1: going to come back to um but but you will
Speaker 1: see that around and again it's it's hard. I'm kind
Speaker 1: off on it, like I don't know. I'm also not
Speaker 1: a scientist, so I can't look at that and be like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: totally that's a knee cap. I don't really can you. Yeah,
Speaker 1: of course I got knees. I know what they look
Speaker 1: like the inside you Sam, in the inside of your knees, right, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I'm thinking. Yeah. So people go ahead
Speaker 1: and say that the with the knees and the presence
Speaker 1: of a developed tooth, that would put this being at
Speaker 1: having lived for some time at least to hear outside
Speaker 1: outside of the can't be. It can't be. The sculet
Speaker 1: of a fetus. Right, that's the that's the thing that
Speaker 1: you draw, that's the conclusion that you would draw from
Speaker 1: this information. Again, we're going to talk about all this
Speaker 1: stuff in the theory. So, like everybody stopped yelling at me, please, yeah,
Speaker 1: because there's another really big twist. It's a really big twist,
Speaker 1: and that is you remember I said they took DNA
Speaker 1: from the ribs and they tested that as well as
Speaker 1: the bone marrow found in the skull. And apparently the
Speaker 1: report is that ADA only share there's one percent of
Speaker 1: its DNA with humans. Don dune done for comparison, for comparison,
Speaker 1: we share about our DNA with cats, with cows and
Speaker 1: with bananas. So I shouldn't cos I guess no, I
Speaker 1: guess not. Yeah. And there's there's some variants. There's there's
Speaker 1: variants between humans, right, that's that's an actual thing. There's
Speaker 1: genetic variants. But it's about point five percent variants. Yeah,
Speaker 1: half percent variants between any Homo sapien. One last thing,
Speaker 1: I keep saying that, right, I keep saying, Oh, on
Speaker 1: one last thing I have to mention. But one last thing,
Speaker 1: it's fine, this is you you have now gone to
Speaker 1: the same level as TV News, which is we're going
Speaker 1: to drop the story, but first we're going to tell
Speaker 1: you about this. We're gonna come back with this main story.
Speaker 1: But now we're going to go to the weather. So
Speaker 1: that's what she's that's it's not annoying when they do
Speaker 1: that means brilliant, brilliant. Okay, we'll be back after this
Speaker 1: word from our sponsors. Yeah, one last thing again, I
Speaker 1: was actually the second to last thing, um, and then
Speaker 1: we'll talk about the weather in Edinburgh. Yeah, if you
Speaker 1: can say all the names. Yeah, Well, nobody really knows
Speaker 1: how old this thing is. Obviously when they first found it,
Speaker 1: they thought, oh my god, this thing is like millennia
Speaker 1: because because it was mommified and it didn't look like
Speaker 1: anything we knew about, and they were like, well, maybe
Speaker 1: it's some like pre homo sapien type thing, Maybe it's
Speaker 1: a Neanderthal, maybe it's you know, who knows. And they've
Speaker 1: come to the conclusion since then that it's like a
Speaker 1: couple of decades old, not the most Yeah. Yeah, um.
Speaker 1: But as I mentioned, Ripley of Ripley's Believe it or not,
Speaker 1: his name is Robert Robert Ripley. He's involved in the case,
Speaker 1: Like I said, I'm sorry he was he was sort
Speaker 1: of involved, kind of in a way. You guys know,
Speaker 1: Ripley was obsessed with shrunken heads. Yeah, like obsessed, which
Speaker 1: I kind of think shunken heads are awesome. You know
Speaker 1: how many times I have found myself in front of
Speaker 1: the computer at twelve o'clock at night, drunk and googling
Speaker 1: shrunken heads and trying to figure out if the website
Speaker 1: that says I can buy one is legit or not.
Speaker 1: I feel like I need to have a conversation with
Speaker 1: you about your adult, mature choices that you're making mid
Speaker 1: night and you're choosing to google shrunken heads, which makes
Speaker 1: me a little concerned about you. That's a really weird
Speaker 1: And what I want to know about these websites is
Speaker 1: how does it work? Do you like, do you have
Speaker 1: to cut somebody's head off and mail it to them
Speaker 1: and they shrink it for you? But is it also
Speaker 1: like are there like hot shrinking? They're authentic, They're authentic
Speaker 1: from natives. I don't know. I was drunk. Can we
Speaker 1: keep going? Please? Very concerned? Actually we're gonna have an
Speaker 1: intervention later. Well, we wrapped this up I'm gonna go
Speaker 1: out in the eBay and see if there's anything out there.
Speaker 1: I'm sure there is. Yeah, probably is. Yeah. Anyway, on
Speaker 1: on Ripley's Shrunken Heads Quest for the Shrunken Head, which
Speaker 1: is an actual book by the way, it's Ripley's Quest
Speaker 1: for the Shrunken Head. I almost bought it. I came
Speaker 1: closer than I ever have to buying a book for
Speaker 1: the podcast. So there's that. Um, he found this tiny
Speaker 1: skeleton in nineteen in the nineteen thirties, early nineteen thirties,
Speaker 1: he found this tiny skeleton he called at a Boy.
Speaker 1: He found his in Peru. But the at a common
Speaker 1: desert does actually go all the way up into Peru.
Speaker 1: It's like I said, it's really really big dessert. So um, yeah,
Speaker 1: Ripley called the skeleton at a boy. And that's that.
Speaker 1: They look vaguely kind of similar, not really, not really
Speaker 1: actually at all. So they're boys. They are both three.
Speaker 1: Tall boy looks more akin to a shrunken head in
Speaker 1: terms of the shape and the texture in the photos
Speaker 1: that I've seen. I think atta boy is kind of cute,
Speaker 1: not like the skeleton, but I think it's cute that
Speaker 1: Ripley called him that. Yeah, I think it's kind of
Speaker 1: a cute name. Yeah, so an Atta boy does look different.
Speaker 1: They don't really look the same Atta Boy and Adda they. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think it's true that the resemblance pretty much ends
Speaker 1: at their height. I would say that. Yeah, Okay, theories
Speaker 1: were there. I guess we are aliens. Let's start with hoax. No,
Speaker 1: I don't think so. I actually don't think that there's
Speaker 1: anybody who seriously thinks the hoax, except for the anonymous
Speaker 1: forum user here and there who says, no, that's a hoax.
Speaker 1: Didn't you know it's easy to think it's a hope.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, I thought it was a hoax he first
Speaker 1: started to read about it, and then once I saw
Speaker 1: the stuff about the CT scans, I knew, okay, right there,
Speaker 1: that proves it's not actually carved woodn't figuring. Yeah, so yeah,
Speaker 1: it's not a hoax. Yeah. Also, probably not a cryptod,
Speaker 1: but you'll see that around. Is this a fairy? No,
Speaker 1: it could be. No wing structure, wings would have wings,
Speaker 1: have to have bones in them, actually have wings. So yeah,
Speaker 1: we don't know that. We don't know anything else. Could
Speaker 1: it be? Could it be a smurf? It could be.
Speaker 1: It could be, uh, the South American version of a
Speaker 1: Leprichn's South American Bigfoot. It could Yeah. Yeah, I wish,
Speaker 1: I wish you guys were in the studio to see
Speaker 1: with how much sincerity Joe just said that there was
Speaker 1: no laugh in his face for a moment. It was good.
Speaker 1: It's totally dead. Okay, So those two out the window. Cool,
Speaker 1: that the scene of our theories. Okay, it's not okay.
Speaker 1: Next I guess is aliens? Yeah there, Uh, they're obviously
Speaker 1: that theory has been put out there. So we have
Speaker 1: to talk a lot. Yeah, quite a bit. Yeah, a
Speaker 1: lot of people think this is like the remains of
Speaker 1: an alien. Well, and one of the things I will
Speaker 1: mention is there is a strong history of reported UFO
Speaker 1: activity around the Ottacama Desert. There's a strong history of
Speaker 1: reported UFO activity around most places. Steve, Yeah, I'm just
Speaker 1: putting it in perspective. Also, the theory is is, uh,
Speaker 1: you know that this thing is an alien? It kind
Speaker 1: of frankly, it looks really alien. It does the shape
Speaker 1: of the skull in the size, you know, to conceptualize
Speaker 1: of something being that size and like living is crazy. Well,
Speaker 1: you know, there's many creatures on our planet that are
Speaker 1: that are timing. But that's the problem is is that
Speaker 1: unless maybe there's an alien race and they figured out
Speaker 1: a way to save space on the interstellar trips to
Speaker 1: shrink themselves go down to six inches tall. Well, no,
Speaker 1: this is this thing is much like was it the
Speaker 1: first or the second Men in Black where there was
Speaker 1: the little guy that drove the human sized robot? Ye,
Speaker 1: I mean that's that's exactly what this would be. You mean,
Speaker 1: how long could you really survive if you're that size? Though?
Speaker 1: Would you? My big question stators would all eat you.
Speaker 1: I mean you'd be snacks. Owls will be snatching you
Speaker 1: out of the skies or whatever. The equipment. Well, I guess.
Speaker 1: I mean the argument would be that you might be
Speaker 1: from a planet that was so high gravity that everything
Speaker 1: was small, you know, so you could feasibly be the
Speaker 1: largest thing you could think. It could be a race
Speaker 1: of shrimpkins from Futrauma, you guys, remember that. Yeah, so
Speaker 1: when Bender becomes God and then meet God, they're just
Speaker 1: tiny little humans that live on him. It could have
Speaker 1: been that. I mean, yeah, and I guess this is
Speaker 1: probably a good time to mention um doctor Greer. Mr Greer,
Speaker 1: he's a doctor. He's a doctor. He was a medical doctor.
Speaker 1: He was an e R doctor. He's actually he was
Speaker 1: a practicing doctor. And then he sort of went off
Speaker 1: the deep end and he left a nice way of
Speaker 1: saying it. Yeah, he left his practice. He did leave
Speaker 1: his practice. U g our listeners may be familiar with
Speaker 1: The Serious, the documentary Serious, which is basically tries to
Speaker 1: prove that aliens are real. It's about an hour long.
Speaker 1: We talked about Gary McKinnon episode. Yeah, it's actually forty
Speaker 1: eight minutes long. I found it on YouTube. Okay, eight
Speaker 1: minutes in fifty something seconds. You're welcome to all minister commercials. Yeah,
Speaker 1: that's perfect. Uh. And Dr Greer's the guy who's in
Speaker 1: charge of that thing. Well, he's he is in control
Speaker 1: of c STEA, which stands for the Center for the
Speaker 1: Study of Extraterrestrial Intelligence. And he started ad in the
Speaker 1: mid two thousands, I want to say, and then it
Speaker 1: was sometime I think it was the late two thousands
Speaker 1: or two thousand tens somewhere in there. He then began
Speaker 1: the Disclosure Project, which is the one where it's all
Speaker 1: the ex government employees testifying to him on camera about aliens. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's a major uthologist. He is, he is, he is.
Speaker 1: I'm not making fun of him when I say this.
Speaker 1: He has bought in quite heavily to the belief and
Speaker 1: he's very committed to it. But that makes me question
Speaker 1: him quite a lot. Yeah, and it makes me question
Speaker 1: with things like this just because they think there's that
Speaker 1: confirmation bias um, particularly something like this that is kind
Speaker 1: of open to interpretation. There. It is hard to know
Speaker 1: what this thing is for sure. But the fact that
Speaker 1: you know, you I guess, I don't know, it's hard.
Speaker 1: It's yeah, it's hard when you're you're hearing a uthologist
Speaker 1: constantly saying, oh, it's obviously an alien, it's proof constantly,
Speaker 1: never never once saying I don't know what probably isn't
Speaker 1: an alien. Well. The other thing about guys like Greer
Speaker 1: is they, you know, they tend to be a magnet
Speaker 1: for lunatics who coming to them with crazy stories and
Speaker 1: people who are like minded. Yeah yeah, yeah, no, I mean,
Speaker 1: but also, like, that's not to say that everybody who
Speaker 1: believes in UFOs or aliens is a lunatic, because right,
Speaker 1: that's what mind it in terms of I believe in
Speaker 1: or want to, but there's a broad spectrum of that.
Speaker 1: There are crazy people in all walks of life, yes,
Speaker 1: and there are extra crazy people in some walks of life.
Speaker 1: Which are you know this one is one of them? Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: So that's a problem already. And I my one concern
Speaker 1: with Greer being involved involved as he is in this
Speaker 1: because he was you only have one concert well, no,
Speaker 1: this is this is one of my big concern is
Speaker 1: that the story of how Ada was found and all
Speaker 1: of this stuff, I've never been able to find the
Speaker 1: source of it. In other words, you always hear the story,
Speaker 1: but you never find anything from the origin of that
Speaker 1: where it actually began in the early accountings of it
Speaker 1: reported anywhere anything. It's just it popped up and it
Speaker 1: popped up on the radar. From what I found, there's
Speaker 1: a the guy that actually found it. You can find
Speaker 1: the first the first publication of talking about this in
Speaker 1: the media at all um and it was around the
Speaker 1: time when the that scavenger found it. But it was
Speaker 1: when was that again, thou three ish, But it was
Speaker 1: in a tabloid in Chile that was the first announcement.
Speaker 1: So again, you know, it's one of those things where
Speaker 1: it's like, Okay, you can confirm that it did happen
Speaker 1: at a time, but the equivalent of the weekly World
Speaker 1: News reported on it and not that boy Yeah yeah,
Speaker 1: but which which is kind of a bummer because we
Speaker 1: do know what exists and we do know it's real.
Speaker 1: But they were the only ones who didn't cry hoax immediately,
Speaker 1: so they printed it. And then but and I guess
Speaker 1: to that point, Greer never tells the whole story. He
Speaker 1: always just says, oh, a token hunter, token collect he's got,
Speaker 1: he's got a very sanitized but he doesn't ever say
Speaker 1: like he was robbing graves in the church. He you know,
Speaker 1: he doesn't say anything about that. They always say it
Speaker 1: in this kind of amorphous like pouch. He never says
Speaker 1: it was in a white cloth, it was this velvet tot.
Speaker 1: You know, all of the kind of nitty gritty details
Speaker 1: that almost humanize it he doesn't ever talk about. So
Speaker 1: I think to that point he is, I mean, he's
Speaker 1: he's trying to sew it a little more towards If
Speaker 1: you're just saying, well, it was found in a pouch
Speaker 1: just in the desert, that sounds way more like an
Speaker 1: alien died or got dropped off. The remains of an
Speaker 1: alien got dropped off then because they have a very
Speaker 1: original and pouches. I don't know, it just more than
Speaker 1: like it was found in a grace in a church,
Speaker 1: wrapped in what in white and purple? You know, It's
Speaker 1: that sounds way more human than it was found in
Speaker 1: a pouch in the desert. You see what I'm saying. Yeah,
Speaker 1: all right, well that's I'm going to let the Greer
Speaker 1: issue go that. I mean, it's really that's just I
Speaker 1: really really question whenever he's involved. Yeah, well that's fair,
Speaker 1: and um the alien stuff. Do you have anything else
Speaker 1: to add to the alien theory? To that? He the well,
Speaker 1: if it is an alien, then how does how does
Speaker 1: this happen? Human DNA? Okay, well, actually that's a good
Speaker 1: segue into our next theory, which is that it's an
Speaker 1: alien human hybrid um. But that goes down the crazy
Speaker 1: rabbit hole because the it's mostly it's mostly Greer being
Speaker 1: a proponent or being the most vocal proponent of this theory.
Speaker 1: This is his theory actually is that it's a hybrid,
Speaker 1: and it's it goes kind of from what if it's
Speaker 1: an alien human hybrid to what if we are all
Speaker 1: alien human hybrid that's what we are. That's how I
Speaker 1: means existed, That's how we came about. So then we
Speaker 1: would share N one. We're not actually alien human hybrids
Speaker 1: because we're humans. So whatever our ancestor wasn't made right
Speaker 1: that we're alien I don't know, Neandredthal hybrids or something. Okay,
Speaker 1: you know the things that we branched off from that
Speaker 1: they went off to die, but they were very humanoid.
Speaker 1: They were you know, we were like them. Uh, and
Speaker 1: then we changed somehow and the aliens came in, came
Speaker 1: to Earth, they were slumming with Neanderthals, and then they
Speaker 1: went home. Yeah, so Earth is what like the dance
Speaker 1: club of It's okay, I guess we can kind of
Speaker 1: go into this. Um. I don't want to make this
Speaker 1: whole episode about this, but the theory there are two
Speaker 1: theories on this. Won't You're looking at me like I'm
Speaker 1: crazy person, but I'm just gonna keep talking. Um. One
Speaker 1: of the theories is that it was it's a controlled
Speaker 1: experiment that aliens who are hyper intelligent came to Earth
Speaker 1: and wanted to It's like controlled evolution, that they altered
Speaker 1: the DNA of Neanderthals to create Homo sapiens and now
Speaker 1: they're watching the experiment play out. Yes, the other theory
Speaker 1: is that's along game. The other theory is that aliens,
Speaker 1: I guess there's a lot more than that. Aliens, in
Speaker 1: order to survive, came an inter there. Yeah, so in
Speaker 1: order to elongate their species had to kind of alter
Speaker 1: what their species was. So they came to intermingle their
Speaker 1: people with our people and that totally changed and progressed
Speaker 1: into Homo sapiens. Or yeah, nightclub like they were curious
Speaker 1: Sea took off again. Uh yeah, So those are the
Speaker 1: three like main theories of the alien hybrid human hybrid theory.
Speaker 1: So then this theory would be that this was a
Speaker 1: subset that went a little wrong but has survived, maybe
Speaker 1: in the desert, or maybe they are they're the ones
Speaker 1: who were the initial ones, and that they bred with
Speaker 1: Neanderthals and so were the size basically of Neanderthals. But
Speaker 1: the problem if that is the case, then it would
Speaker 1: have to be much much much older, unless it was
Speaker 1: coming to check up on us. So if it was
Speaker 1: the controlled so like if the if the base there,
Speaker 1: your theory was that it's a controlled evolution the long
Speaker 1: game basically, right, you come and check on your long game. Right,
Speaker 1: you observed them. So if he this thing, this alien
Speaker 1: in this theory died while observing us, then yeah, ten
Speaker 1: years whatever. They're very tiny aliens, the wardens are. It'sy bitsy, yeah,
Speaker 1: I think. Um. I still though, I still don't buy
Speaker 1: that this thing was an alien because DNA. I agree,
Speaker 1: But so those are hybrid that's impossible too, because our
Speaker 1: for example, cats and dogs. Candidate read that's true, you know,
Speaker 1: and so we'd be a little further humans and bananas
Speaker 1: cannot interbreed. That's true. Yeah, No, I mean, I think
Speaker 1: that's a valid interesting point. The other thing I guess
Speaker 1: we should probably bring up at this very moment in
Speaker 1: time is that it's not that we only share of
Speaker 1: the DNA. It's that it was like eight or nine
Speaker 1: percent of the DNA wasn't was unable to be read
Speaker 1: from the samples that they got from autumn um, which
Speaker 1: doesn't so it doesn't mean that they didn't match. It
Speaker 1: just meant that they couldn't because it was too correctly unreadable,
Speaker 1: which it's not uncommon for that to happen in DNA
Speaker 1: samples to have a portion of it. Yeah, particularly post
Speaker 1: word on DNA. So this is this is why Greer
Speaker 1: bothers me so much, because he's the one who says
Speaker 1: it's human DNA, but we don't know what the other
Speaker 1: eight Well, no we don't. We kind of probably do.
Speaker 1: But it's not unusual. Of the DNA that was readable
Speaker 1: was human. It's just of the total sample was unreadable.
Speaker 1: Their credit, you know, on almost all of the websites
Speaker 1: that you read about this DNA, they do. They do
Speaker 1: add the caveat that research on the DNA is ongoing.
Speaker 1: Of course that they will they will reveal more as
Speaker 1: they know it, which at least that better DNA out
Speaker 1: of him. It's possible. And also the this is one
Speaker 1: of the reasons that because I used to think it
Speaker 1: was kind of old and now they've taken no more
Speaker 1: than two decades, just because the the DNA has degraded somewhat,
Speaker 1: but there's still viable. Exactly if it was a lot
Speaker 1: older than there'd be a lot less read. Yeah. So
Speaker 1: next is the theory that it's human. And this is
Speaker 1: again typical Devon style. We've got a couple of different
Speaker 1: bullet points here, Yes we do. So let's start with
Speaker 1: Human Comma Shrunken. Oh but Ripley, Yeah, we come back
Speaker 1: to Ripley here. Um. Ripley was very he was a
Speaker 1: very honest showman. He he liked to kind of discount
Speaker 1: these like weird sideshow things that he found a lot.
Speaker 1: He was very famous for it. Like he would go
Speaker 1: around and find these you know who was a mermaid
Speaker 1: man skeleton and display it. But say, this is the
Speaker 1: part that's the monkey skeleton, and this is the part
Speaker 1: that's the fish skeleton. It's not real, but it's interesting nonetheless, right. Uh.
Speaker 1: And so he was one of the first people despite
Speaker 1: his which is why I believe it or not. You
Speaker 1: can believe it if you want or not or not.
Speaker 1: In here your reason to like not. I remember watching
Speaker 1: that show and did that all the time. We watched
Speaker 1: it too, And he goes, believe it or not? Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: then what what wasn't the guy from Star Trek on
Speaker 1: it at one point when they tried to resurrect it,
Speaker 1: the guy who played Will Riker Star Trek Next Generation
Speaker 1: wasn't he wasn't he the host for it? I don't know.
Speaker 1: I'd have to look it up enough for me to
Speaker 1: look it up. Jack remember that that was the old one. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you know it is at the end of it. Are
Speaker 1: not because they had that weird voice. Yeah. So shrunken heads,
Speaker 1: just briefly, if you guys don't know how they made.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think everybody in this room knows made,
Speaker 1: but it's possible. What you do is you run them
Speaker 1: through the dryer too long and you get it wet.
Speaker 1: You put it back in its Yeah it's perfect. Yeah,
Speaker 1: less itchy though a little bit. Yeah. So shrunken heads.
Speaker 1: The way they do it is they cut a hole
Speaker 1: in the back of the skull or back of the head,
Speaker 1: the scalp, thank you. They pull all the bones out,
Speaker 1: They put little red berries where the eyes should be,
Speaker 1: and so them shut. And then they put a woodball
Speaker 1: all the orifice. Close your nostrils, your eyes, your mouth.
Speaker 1: The mouth is held in place by three palm fronds.
Speaker 1: Apparently it's the traditional thing. Who came up with this idea,
Speaker 1: I don't know. I still think they're interesting. But then
Speaker 1: the skin is put around a ball and then pulled
Speaker 1: tight after it's boiled. Yeah, after it's boiled, shrink it. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And then it's put there and so it looks like
Speaker 1: it's on a skull, and so that's how that happens.
Speaker 1: So h Ripley said that his Atta boy was just
Speaker 1: a shrunken whole body, shrunken thing, which I guess I
Speaker 1: kind of believe because it doesn't really look like there
Speaker 1: are any bones in there. It just kind of looks
Speaker 1: like it's leathery skin. That's the impression. I mean there
Speaker 1: there does appear to be possible protrusions, but bones, but
Speaker 1: they could be pieces of wood. Yeah, yeah, absolutely, but
Speaker 1: that didn't start contrast to what Adda actually looks like. Um,
Speaker 1: And so as as we in this room, I think
Speaker 1: can all agree that Atta is ada Autumn I'm sorry,
Speaker 1: is not a shrunken something because it's mostly bones and
Speaker 1: internal organs. There's not skin and a thin coating yeah
Speaker 1: the other yeah, which I don't really know what is
Speaker 1: holding it together. It's skin. Weird, it's a very very thin,
Speaker 1: leathery layer of skin. I suppose that. I mean that
Speaker 1: the stuff at tendants are probably still present right on
Speaker 1: the skeleton. Yeah, it kind of just looks like bone,
Speaker 1: but it is what was a fleshy membrane at one
Speaker 1: time surrounding everything and what is dry and desiccated now
Speaker 1: that's what's holding it together, right, Yeah, so the cat
Speaker 1: gut almost like what cat gut? You know, the stuff
Speaker 1: that you can sew with. Haven't you heard a cat gut?
Speaker 1: That's what they used to use for surgery, to sit
Speaker 1: to stitch people up. I'm not making this up. You
Speaker 1: know what, Joe, do you remember what cat gut is
Speaker 1: made from cat guts? It's made from it's intestines of
Speaker 1: animals like owls or cheese and well, but it's it's
Speaker 1: very tough and it's very stringing. But you used it
Speaker 1: to close wounds. Well, they originally did. They haven't been
Speaker 1: doing that for a while people. Yeah, I know that
Speaker 1: the majewelry and stuff out of it. You yeah, no,
Speaker 1: it's it's very tough stuff, but it's that's why it
Speaker 1: reminds me of cat gut, because it's very, very tough.
Speaker 1: But it's an organic material. Okay, that's fair. I guess
Speaker 1: creep factor seventeen for Devon, thank you? Yeah, okay, so,
Speaker 1: but I think we can all agree it's not at
Speaker 1: a scut bones. Yeah, actually it's mostly bones, so it's
Speaker 1: not a drunken body, but still kind of interesting. Nonetheless, Okay,
Speaker 1: uh next up is human comma premature, prematurely worn baby,
Speaker 1: prematurely worn baby, normal human normal, totally normal human baby,
Speaker 1: which all you have to do is really look at
Speaker 1: the skeleton to know it's not a totally normal baby.
Speaker 1: Even is not going to be six inches long. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it has to be really premature, but you can look
Speaker 1: at Actually, this is one of the most interesting comparisons
Speaker 1: I saw was there was a scan uh fetus at
Speaker 1: two months old, and they're about six inches long or so,
Speaker 1: and then compared to the scan of the ata skeleton
Speaker 1: at a at a boy, and they look they look
Speaker 1: totally different. So, I mean, there's the thing. I mean,
Speaker 1: part of it is you know, ribs, part of it
Speaker 1: is head shaped, part of it is just typical bones.
Speaker 1: So the thing is is that I've the research that
Speaker 1: I've seen said that this was if it was a
Speaker 1: human fetus, it was twelve or sixteen weeks, which is
Speaker 1: the first trimester, the end of the first trimester, beginning
Speaker 1: of the second trimester, and the typical fetus at that time.
Speaker 1: There's always this thing on the internet what sizes my baby,
Speaker 1: and it's about the size of an apple at that point.
Speaker 1: But a lot of things have formed. At that point,
Speaker 1: all of the bones will have formed. The you know,
Speaker 1: the head is going to have formed though, And this
Speaker 1: is why I bring this up. The bones of your
Speaker 1: skull of ukranium, those are not are still not connected
Speaker 1: because your brain hasn't grown in yet and they've got
Speaker 1: to stay loose to allow that to happen. So if
Speaker 1: this is a premature child, that would explain why the
Speaker 1: head is misshapen, because they would have collapsed on each
Speaker 1: other and set into this kind of pointy shape instead
Speaker 1: of what was around shape. If you follow that line
Speaker 1: of thinking. The other thing is like it's very very
Speaker 1: soft material. And the other thing that I will bring
Speaker 1: up is that you had you has been a good
Speaker 1: amount of time talking about the kneecaps. Okay, kneecaps are
Speaker 1: present at that time, but their cartilage, Like we said,
Speaker 1: cartilage is something that hardens when it's outside of the body.
Speaker 1: It'll harden in the right environment. I mean, it's like
Speaker 1: if you find a mummy that's been in this desert,
Speaker 1: it's the nose will probably be there because it's mummified.
Speaker 1: But but but you know what your nose is cartilage
Speaker 1: And so what I looked at this as is that
Speaker 1: what was the infant placeholder cartilage kneecaps is just the
Speaker 1: stuff that it hardened it, you know, it actually set
Speaker 1: in place, so it looks like bone. What about the tooth,
Speaker 1: the twoth, I can't explain, Okay, I don't know. I
Speaker 1: don't know why the hell there's a tooth there. But
Speaker 1: I can explain the cranium being misshapen, and I can
Speaker 1: explain the knee caps, which is why why I still
Speaker 1: feel that this is very much premature birth. Yeah, well, well,
Speaker 1: which is why it would have such a ceremonial burial.
Speaker 1: I feel differently about it, but we'll talk about in
Speaker 1: a minute, because I know Joe wants to say somethings,
Speaker 1: say something yeah, yeah, yeah, I guess or whatever. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was reading the blog of this guy named Polo,
Speaker 1: this guardian who who works at the Grant Museum of
Speaker 1: Zoology and the University and University College London. He has
Speaker 1: a fairly lengthy posting on it with a lot of big, long,
Speaker 1: huge comment threats from a lot of scientific types. And
Speaker 1: I don't know if you read that one or not. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and so he says that it looks to him just
Speaker 1: pretty much exactly like uh an aborted fetus. He says
Speaker 1: he's seen other ones mommified ones in museums and collect
Speaker 1: and various collections of fourteen to sixteen weeks. He estimates
Speaker 1: as far as at the shape of the skull, partly
Speaker 1: what you were what you were saying, might have something
Speaker 1: to do with it. He thinks it might. Also he
Speaker 1: thinks it was aborted, and he thinks that perhaps during
Speaker 1: the procedure the head was you know, sort of pulled
Speaker 1: out damage and put That might also explain the odd shape.
Speaker 1: He also said that he's as far as some of
Speaker 1: the misreadings of the age or the thing, they found
Speaker 1: greater calcification in the bones and you would expect in
Speaker 1: a fetus, but he said that that's actually an artifact
Speaker 1: of the mommification process. He says he's seen it in
Speaker 1: other mummies when they tried to like he actually wrote
Speaker 1: a paper on the whole thing. Yeah, I've seen something
Speaker 1: about the fact that when they try to x ray
Speaker 1: them and do all these certain scans, those young bones
Speaker 1: look like they should be much older just because of
Speaker 1: the process that's involved in the scan. Yeah, exactly. And
Speaker 1: you can't read into that too heavily yeah, so as
Speaker 1: far as it being like sixty eight years ago old
Speaker 1: or a year old or anything. And also he said
Speaker 1: he looked at the the cat scans and everything. He
Speaker 1: says he's evidence of teeth whatsoever. He says that there's
Speaker 1: a piece of exposed mandible that looks like a tooth,
Speaker 1: looks especially like a tooth. But he said that a
Speaker 1: good I haven't seen these cat scans and he's he's
Speaker 1: talking about but that he says, and he sounds like
Speaker 1: he's pretty objective and pretty smart, pretty knowledgeable guy. He
Speaker 1: says there's no teeth, so he's he's on board with
Speaker 1: the it's just a premature premature or more likely an
Speaker 1: aboarded fetus. Yeah. Yeah, Well, and there's a lot of
Speaker 1: social conditions in that country that would explain potentially why
Speaker 1: that would happen, you know, because like unwed sex is
Speaker 1: not okay, an abortion it's kind of hard to get right.
Speaker 1: So you know, if you're with somebody and something happens,
Speaker 1: you've got to take care of it. Yeah, I um,
Speaker 1: you know what, this is one of the sad things
Speaker 1: that has been It would be nice to find the
Speaker 1: quote unquote token collector or wherever that goes and find
Speaker 1: find out precisely what grave, because if it was found
Speaker 1: in the graveyard, I'd like to know what grave you
Speaker 1: founded in because that would be kind of interesting because
Speaker 1: imagine somebody going back to this village where they have
Speaker 1: family buried and and sort of like, you know, digging
Speaker 1: up a few witches of dirt and burying it there.
Speaker 1: You know, we kind of you might be able to
Speaker 1: actually find out who the mother of you know, the
Speaker 1: Atacama skeleton is. Yeah, that's a premature birth, I think.
Speaker 1: Walk through that thing, yeah, and so wanted Yeah. Uh.
Speaker 1: And then the last kind of theory here is that
Speaker 1: that it was a human being that was born likely
Speaker 1: but with a genetic disorder and that just grew to
Speaker 1: six inches tall. Yeah, or you know, didn't really survive
Speaker 1: out of the womb for two terribly long But obviously
Speaker 1: there aren't an extended period of time though. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: so there obviously aren't any genetic disorders that we know
Speaker 1: of that cause a actual human being to only grow
Speaker 1: to six inches tall. That's not a thing. You wouldn't
Speaker 1: live very long, you would not. It's going to step
Speaker 1: on you. Yeah. Yeah, And you know, on top of
Speaker 1: that shortest recorded person in history was only what two
Speaker 1: ft tall something like that's still like like three or
Speaker 1: four times as tall as them than this skeleton, thank
Speaker 1: you wrong, But yeah, it is kind of um this this. Yeah,
Speaker 1: but added to that, you know, they did this genetic
Speaker 1: testing on the skeleton and there they couldn't find any
Speaker 1: markers for common things like dwarfism or anything like that. Yeah. Well,
Speaker 1: plus this would be a real one off disorder, because
Speaker 1: there is such a thing as dwarfism. There is. But
Speaker 1: how many how many six install human beings have we
Speaker 1: produced so far? None? None? Yeah, yeah, that we know of.
Speaker 1: That's true. Maybe they're hiding. They might be hiding right here. Yeah,
Speaker 1: they're so little, you don't know. Yeah, that's why you
Speaker 1: keep hearing those weird banging noises in your pipes. Um.
Speaker 1: But there is a theory out there that it's kind
Speaker 1: of a duel. It's a dual theory. I guess. Uh.
Speaker 1: It's a combination of genetic disorder and a premature birth
Speaker 1: or aborted birth situation because a lot of their well,
Speaker 1: a lot of women who are pregnant with babies who
Speaker 1: have progeria often have miscarriages with these babies and Progeria
Speaker 1: is something that I guess I knew about because I
Speaker 1: listened to uh Diet and Aunt. Would you guys know them?
Speaker 1: It's okay, I wouldn't expect you to. It's like a ow,
Speaker 1: it doesn't matter. Yeah. Anyways, there's a there was a
Speaker 1: guy by the name of Leon Botha who collaborated with them. Um,
Speaker 1: he was a DJ. They're a group or a group yeah,
Speaker 1: out of South Africa. They do rap mostly kind of
Speaker 1: it's hard to explain performance art. It's awesome. So I
Speaker 1: know who's got well Leon Botha did. He died a
Speaker 1: few years ago. He was twenty six when he died,
Speaker 1: which is actually a very long lifespan for somebody with perugia.
Speaker 1: Usually they progeria, I'm sorry, they don't usually live often
Speaker 1: people who have this live thirteen fourteen years the most.
Speaker 1: Because it's it's rapid aging. Well it's not actually rapid aging.
Speaker 1: It signs it appeared to look like rapid age. It
Speaker 1: causes you to look like you are rapidly aging. Yeah.
Speaker 1: It's a founding about one in every eight million live births,
Speaker 1: but the instances are higher, but I didn't write down
Speaker 1: the number. I'm sorry of stillborn or premature births. The
Speaker 1: defining features of somebody with this disorder are I'm just
Speaker 1: gonna quote here, limited growth, full body alopecia, alopecia, so
Speaker 1: hair loss, and a distinctive appearance that includes a small
Speaker 1: face with a shallow, shallow, recessed jaw, and a very
Speaker 1: pinched nose. And often their face looks small on their
Speaker 1: head in proportion to the head. Yeah. Um, and the
Speaker 1: heads are you know, often kind of more elongated. So,
Speaker 1: I mean, I think it's it's a fair theory to
Speaker 1: say that it's possible that Otta had this disorder in
Speaker 1: utero and was born prematurely that it accounts for the
Speaker 1: way that he looks with this skull. I mean, as
Speaker 1: does your theory of you know, kind of aborted fetus situation.
Speaker 1: Their skulls look oversized. They look oversized, but they don't
Speaker 1: usually look pointy like that, but they do often in
Speaker 1: um fetuses with progeria. I'm sorry, I don't know why
Speaker 1: I can't say that word, but you know, again, it's
Speaker 1: it's hard to tell. And then scientists are also saying
Speaker 1: that they also haven't found any of the genetic markers
Speaker 1: for um progeria, so it's probably not, So I don't know.
Speaker 1: I don't have a good answer. Really. I think it's
Speaker 1: probably a human um. I think it's probably a premature
Speaker 1: what whichever way it happened, If it happened that there
Speaker 1: was some genetic disorder that caused the fetus to look
Speaker 1: this way, if it was just a premature birth. It's
Speaker 1: also hard to tell because it is a mummy and
Speaker 1: it looks at it looks much too thin to be
Speaker 1: a normal fetus, but to me, but again, it's a mommy,
Speaker 1: so it's hard to tell. It's it's a mummy. As
Speaker 1: as it as it dries out, the skin streaks streaks up,
Speaker 1: and it draws the rib tip exactly, and that's that's
Speaker 1: part of it. Yeah, if you look at those ribs,
Speaker 1: they almost looked like they should have broken from the pressure. Yeah. Yeah,
Speaker 1: although you know, still the question is is there should
Speaker 1: be more ribs than there are? But well, apparently that
Speaker 1: the two missing ribs are the lower floating ribs, which
Speaker 1: you know, form the last it's entirely possible. They would
Speaker 1: have to have been really early though well, I mean
Speaker 1: they because fully formed, and so they may not have
Speaker 1: you know, when when everything dried out and pulled in.
Speaker 1: They may not have been enough substance to them. They
Speaker 1: may have been mostly fleshy instead of bony. You can,
Speaker 1: I mean the in the X rays of it two
Speaker 1: month old fetus. There they are ribs. They are alls,
Speaker 1: all twelve, all twelve of them. Yeah, but it's possible.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's possible that it was a younger fetus.
Speaker 1: It's possible that there was some birth effect that caused
Speaker 1: them to not have, you know, ribs. I don't know,
Speaker 1: but you never know. We could if you go back
Speaker 1: to that area, you know, check up on the people.
Speaker 1: Maybe that maybe there's a whole subset of people that's
Speaker 1: good that have a genetic defect. You know. I've been
Speaker 1: passing it along. Floating rib. Yeah, yeah, I don't even
Speaker 1: know what is the purpose at the floating rib? Does
Speaker 1: anybody know? I think it's just one more rib to
Speaker 1: get broken. I think that's a I always figured it
Speaker 1: was the one that pinches when you get a pinch
Speaker 1: in your side. This is always weird. I don't know either.
Speaker 1: It's maybe a little extra electra protection for those for
Speaker 1: your kidneys or something like that. I don't know. So, yeah,
Speaker 1: they go it's the outa comma skeleton or humanoid, probably
Speaker 1: not alien, probably not probably on alien. Probably just a
Speaker 1: very very sad story, a very small story. Yeah, tiny,
Speaker 1: but you know, actually digging around up there, you might
Speaker 1: find a lot of these things. Yeah. It is a
Speaker 1: little weird, you know too, would be found in the desert,
Speaker 1: but I guess not really that weird. Yeah, because the
Speaker 1: conditions are such that you know they're gonna get naturally mummified.
Speaker 1: Yeah that's true. Yeah, luckily in the Comma desert there's
Speaker 1: probably so dry. I mean no, no four legged scavengers
Speaker 1: really exist out there to come along and eat it,
Speaker 1: you know, so it just lays their undisturbed and just
Speaker 1: you know, becomes mumified. Yeah, yeah, absolutely, Yeah, until the
Speaker 1: two two legged scavenger comes along and you guys have
Speaker 1: anything else? I don't story. Yeah, and that really we'll
Speaker 1: have to go down there and check it out one
Speaker 1: of these days soon as our listeners fund our trips. Yeah, yeah, thanks, guys.
Speaker 1: Just kidding. I'm just kidding everyone, I'm just kidding. Uh.
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Speaker 1: that having been said, I think that I'm just going
Speaker 1: to get out of here real quick. Yeah I get
Speaker 1: out here too. Yeah. Sweet bye guys,