1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:03,800 Speaker 1: This is the Ben and Ashley I Almost Famous podcast 2 00:00:03,840 --> 00:00:04,640 Speaker 1: with iHeartRadio. 3 00:00:05,840 --> 00:00:08,559 Speaker 2: Hey guys, welcome to the Almost in his podcast, it's Ashley. 4 00:00:08,600 --> 00:00:11,520 Speaker 2: I'm flying solo today and I'm very excited to talk 5 00:00:11,560 --> 00:00:14,080 Speaker 2: to somebody who I think is one of the people 6 00:00:14,120 --> 00:00:18,239 Speaker 2: from the Bachelor franchise who she's just meant to be 7 00:00:18,280 --> 00:00:20,680 Speaker 2: a reality star. And I don't know that we've had 8 00:00:20,720 --> 00:00:24,840 Speaker 2: a ton of people like that lately, and she fills 9 00:00:24,920 --> 00:00:25,800 Speaker 2: that category. 10 00:00:25,880 --> 00:00:27,080 Speaker 3: It is kat Izzo. 11 00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:31,000 Speaker 2: She was actually you were, Hey, Kat, what's up? You're 12 00:00:31,120 --> 00:00:36,360 Speaker 2: ondio with Ben. Nice to be with you. You're with 13 00:00:36,400 --> 00:00:38,960 Speaker 2: Ben a couple months ago in person after a Bachelor 14 00:00:38,960 --> 00:00:41,559 Speaker 2: in Paradise wrapped. But now, of course we have a 15 00:00:41,560 --> 00:00:45,159 Speaker 2: breakup that we have to dive into and got to 16 00:00:45,200 --> 00:00:48,560 Speaker 2: ask off the top. You must be like a little 17 00:00:48,600 --> 00:00:52,280 Speaker 2: nervous about breaking into the in the breakup because Dale 18 00:00:52,400 --> 00:00:55,920 Speaker 2: has sent you a cease and desist about it. 19 00:00:56,040 --> 00:00:59,840 Speaker 4: Yes, you got that right, he did, no word. But yeah, 20 00:01:00,320 --> 00:01:01,120 Speaker 4: it's different. 21 00:01:02,680 --> 00:01:03,800 Speaker 3: How does he legally? 22 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:07,039 Speaker 2: How are you legally able to send somebody a season 23 00:01:07,080 --> 00:01:11,040 Speaker 2: desist when it's a relationship and not like you breaking 24 00:01:11,120 --> 00:01:13,640 Speaker 2: a contract that we have, say for the Bachelor. 25 00:01:14,240 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 4: You know, I don't know the answer to that. 26 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:18,720 Speaker 5: You're gonna have to ask the men, because that is 27 00:01:18,880 --> 00:01:21,560 Speaker 5: like just something that I will never understand. 28 00:01:22,600 --> 00:01:24,760 Speaker 4: I mean, I guess if I was like running. 29 00:01:24,480 --> 00:01:27,480 Speaker 5: Around at the time and like saying like crazy things 30 00:01:27,520 --> 00:01:30,280 Speaker 5: and like it was affecting his business and income and 31 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:32,960 Speaker 5: some capacity. But I hadn't even said anything yet, So 32 00:01:33,160 --> 00:01:34,280 Speaker 5: it was really interesting. 33 00:01:35,640 --> 00:01:38,959 Speaker 2: Yeah, that's so crazy, that's what he said, after before 34 00:01:39,000 --> 00:01:40,600 Speaker 2: you did any podcast interviews. 35 00:01:41,240 --> 00:01:42,600 Speaker 3: You're a brave woman for being here. 36 00:01:43,360 --> 00:01:45,160 Speaker 4: No, because honestly, it was the fact that he sent 37 00:01:45,200 --> 00:01:46,840 Speaker 4: me it that it was like, I'm gonna. 38 00:01:46,600 --> 00:01:50,200 Speaker 5: Now go say everything, because like you're not gonna like 39 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:51,520 Speaker 5: try to make me silent. 40 00:01:51,880 --> 00:01:52,600 Speaker 4: That's crazy. 41 00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:53,360 Speaker 2: Uh. 42 00:01:53,800 --> 00:01:56,960 Speaker 5: But it came from the fact that he that he 43 00:01:57,040 --> 00:01:58,960 Speaker 5: went to Preston said that we broke up because we 44 00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:01,600 Speaker 5: were I guess they're off his friends, is how he 45 00:02:01,680 --> 00:02:03,919 Speaker 5: worded it. When they reached out to me, as Weekly 46 00:02:03,960 --> 00:02:07,320 Speaker 5: did for a comment, I gave them the truth. I 47 00:02:07,440 --> 00:02:10,799 Speaker 5: believe that was sent to his team and they never 48 00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:12,920 Speaker 5: published it. And then I got that letter like I 49 00:02:12,919 --> 00:02:16,200 Speaker 5: think the next day of the day of so it 50 00:02:16,480 --> 00:02:18,359 Speaker 5: just and I wasn't even gonna say anything. I wasn't 51 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:19,960 Speaker 5: even even going to do podcasts about the ring up. 52 00:02:20,000 --> 00:02:21,640 Speaker 5: I was just gonna let people like wonder and they 53 00:02:21,800 --> 00:02:23,200 Speaker 5: were like, let it move on it when we move 54 00:02:23,240 --> 00:02:23,840 Speaker 5: on in my life. 55 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:25,840 Speaker 4: But it was because that was sent to me that 56 00:02:25,880 --> 00:02:26,280 Speaker 4: I was like. 57 00:02:26,280 --> 00:02:29,440 Speaker 5: Well, now I'm gonna now now I'm definitely gonna talk 58 00:02:29,440 --> 00:02:32,760 Speaker 5: about it, because if you try to silence me, I 59 00:02:32,880 --> 00:02:34,359 Speaker 5: probably will not like that. 60 00:02:35,000 --> 00:02:37,680 Speaker 3: Yeah, have you watched her on TV? 61 00:02:38,200 --> 00:02:40,240 Speaker 4: I'm like, yeah, just a screen latter. 62 00:02:41,200 --> 00:02:44,040 Speaker 3: Oh my gosh, that that is crazy. 63 00:02:44,840 --> 00:02:47,639 Speaker 2: I want to go back in time a little bit 64 00:02:47,760 --> 00:02:51,840 Speaker 2: before we jump into Paradise. Did you watch Dale's season 65 00:02:52,080 --> 00:02:55,560 Speaker 2: of Bachelorette back then the claritation days? 66 00:02:55,760 --> 00:02:55,799 Speaker 6: No? 67 00:02:56,360 --> 00:02:59,239 Speaker 2: Did you know anything about his reputation going into Paradise. 68 00:03:00,240 --> 00:03:00,320 Speaker 6: No. 69 00:03:00,360 --> 00:03:03,040 Speaker 5: I just knew he was like an attractive older guy 70 00:03:03,120 --> 00:03:07,600 Speaker 5: that dated Claire and that they got engaged right away. 71 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:10,480 Speaker 5: But I didn't follow him on social media or anything 72 00:03:10,480 --> 00:03:14,080 Speaker 5: like that. I didn't know like what his story was really. 73 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:14,359 Speaker 4: Like at all. 74 00:03:15,080 --> 00:03:17,200 Speaker 2: So you really went into Paradise with like a fresh 75 00:03:17,400 --> 00:03:19,320 Speaker 2: slate in your mind about him? 76 00:03:19,520 --> 00:03:20,200 Speaker 4: About everybody? 77 00:03:20,280 --> 00:03:20,480 Speaker 2: Yeah? 78 00:03:20,680 --> 00:03:21,799 Speaker 3: Yeah, about everyone? 79 00:03:22,240 --> 00:03:24,600 Speaker 4: Yeah, I did not see anyone. If I was gonna 80 00:03:24,639 --> 00:03:26,560 Speaker 4: do it again, I had to do it differently. Than 81 00:03:26,560 --> 00:03:27,160 Speaker 4: the first time. 82 00:03:27,200 --> 00:03:29,760 Speaker 5: I knew everything about everyone and I was on the 83 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:30,400 Speaker 5: beach with all my. 84 00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:33,919 Speaker 4: Best friends, and I think that was not to my benefit. 85 00:03:34,120 --> 00:03:35,880 Speaker 5: So I was like, I'm going to go in with 86 00:03:35,960 --> 00:03:39,640 Speaker 5: like a clean slate and just not have any judgments prior. 87 00:03:40,240 --> 00:03:43,920 Speaker 4: And it actually was so much better that way. Interesting 88 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:45,960 Speaker 4: because I feel like if it's not working, like you 89 00:03:46,080 --> 00:03:48,760 Speaker 4: leave like you're fine, you don't have to Like before, 90 00:03:48,800 --> 00:03:51,240 Speaker 4: I felt like, you're like, well, I set this idea 91 00:03:51,240 --> 00:03:52,880 Speaker 4: of what I was supposed to leave with, so now 92 00:03:52,920 --> 00:03:54,840 Speaker 4: I'm going to do all these crazy things to leave with. 93 00:03:54,920 --> 00:03:58,440 Speaker 2: That that makes a lot of sense. I went in 94 00:03:58,480 --> 00:04:01,440 Speaker 2: with that mentality to the second season, and I abandoned 95 00:04:01,440 --> 00:04:02,400 Speaker 2: it immediately. 96 00:04:06,080 --> 00:04:09,240 Speaker 4: Conditions made it really easy to abandon yourself, Like these 97 00:04:09,280 --> 00:04:11,880 Speaker 4: cos were so much better. You feel like ground and 98 00:04:11,920 --> 00:04:13,840 Speaker 4: like journal and like go to bed and and air 99 00:04:13,840 --> 00:04:15,160 Speaker 4: conditioning so much better. 100 00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:18,800 Speaker 3: Oh that's so true. I mean that been. 101 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:24,880 Speaker 2: The what I was was called that area. When we 102 00:04:24,920 --> 00:04:29,120 Speaker 2: lived outside in the glamping, that really did make for 103 00:04:29,600 --> 00:04:33,640 Speaker 2: us going crazy, like you can't even it's kind of 104 00:04:33,680 --> 00:04:34,919 Speaker 2: fun to go crazy too, you know. 105 00:04:35,839 --> 00:04:38,760 Speaker 4: I don't mean I much rather go crazy with air conditioning. 106 00:04:38,960 --> 00:04:42,120 Speaker 3: With air conditioning Okay, yeah, that was It's that takes. 107 00:04:41,920 --> 00:04:44,120 Speaker 4: It to a whole other level of like fight or 108 00:04:44,160 --> 00:04:46,880 Speaker 4: flight that I never want to again. 109 00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:50,680 Speaker 3: It's so perfectly said like that. 110 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:55,719 Speaker 2: So when you were dating him the first week or 111 00:04:55,720 --> 00:04:58,800 Speaker 2: so in Paradise, there was something that came up and 112 00:04:58,839 --> 00:05:01,720 Speaker 2: now I'm sorry I don't remember exactly what it was, 113 00:05:02,000 --> 00:05:04,159 Speaker 2: but it was an argument I believe about how he 114 00:05:04,360 --> 00:05:05,160 Speaker 2: spoke to you. 115 00:05:05,920 --> 00:05:08,479 Speaker 3: And you have to refresh my memory. What was that 116 00:05:08,600 --> 00:05:09,720 Speaker 3: first argument. 117 00:05:09,400 --> 00:05:11,560 Speaker 4: About, you mean the deb edit argument? 118 00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:16,120 Speaker 3: Yea, the dead edit. Yeah, the one that he said 119 00:05:16,120 --> 00:05:16,760 Speaker 3: that he deaded. 120 00:05:17,520 --> 00:05:21,159 Speaker 5: Yes, yeah, Well it originally came from like, you know, 121 00:05:21,200 --> 00:05:23,560 Speaker 5: we were so early, we decided we wanted to like 122 00:05:23,560 --> 00:05:25,279 Speaker 5: we're still going to explore other people. I was like, 123 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:27,680 Speaker 5: just like be honest with me, Like we're living in 124 00:05:27,720 --> 00:05:31,120 Speaker 5: the same quarters. Like, so in this I would say 125 00:05:31,200 --> 00:05:33,680 Speaker 5: setup was much more private, like you could go off 126 00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:36,320 Speaker 5: and like not see people, so like if something happens 127 00:05:36,400 --> 00:05:38,680 Speaker 5: or you're interested in someone else, like just have open communication. 128 00:05:38,800 --> 00:05:41,240 Speaker 4: And I was constantly like, do you like Ali, do 129 00:05:41,279 --> 00:05:42,919 Speaker 4: you like Licia? Do you like anyone? And at the 130 00:05:42,920 --> 00:05:44,960 Speaker 4: time it was Ali, Joe or Zoe. 131 00:05:45,000 --> 00:05:46,560 Speaker 5: It was like trying to like make sure that I 132 00:05:46,720 --> 00:05:48,560 Speaker 5: was aware because I didn't want to like find out 133 00:05:48,680 --> 00:05:52,479 Speaker 5: watching it back because that's like so horrible. And I 134 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:54,800 Speaker 5: kept trying to press for like just it and he's like, no, 135 00:05:54,880 --> 00:05:56,400 Speaker 5: like you're annoine number one, like I don't like my 136 00:05:56,440 --> 00:05:57,000 Speaker 5: eyes are only for. 137 00:05:57,040 --> 00:05:57,839 Speaker 4: You, blah blah blah. 138 00:05:57,880 --> 00:06:01,720 Speaker 5: And then like eventually, like after Roasse ceremony and everything happened, 139 00:06:01,760 --> 00:06:03,440 Speaker 5: that next day was when he told me he actually 140 00:06:03,440 --> 00:06:06,240 Speaker 5: did kiss Ali Joe, and I was like, not upset 141 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:06,840 Speaker 5: about the kiss. 142 00:06:06,880 --> 00:06:08,760 Speaker 4: I was like, but why didn't you like tell me, 143 00:06:08,880 --> 00:06:10,960 Speaker 4: like what is going on? And that could have just 144 00:06:10,960 --> 00:06:13,279 Speaker 4: been an opportunity for him to say, like I should 145 00:06:13,320 --> 00:06:15,440 Speaker 4: have like I wasn't thinking and like I'm sorry, I'm 146 00:06:15,480 --> 00:06:17,920 Speaker 4: like we're done. But of course he minimized it. 147 00:06:18,120 --> 00:06:22,560 Speaker 5: He's the term dead edit to you know, uh, emphasize 148 00:06:22,720 --> 00:06:24,880 Speaker 5: whatever he was trying to emphasize at the time, and 149 00:06:24,920 --> 00:06:27,400 Speaker 5: it just felt like really dismissive. And then I sat 150 00:06:27,440 --> 00:06:31,080 Speaker 5: with it more. Yeah, extremely dismissive. And then the Rose 151 00:06:31,080 --> 00:06:34,800 Speaker 5: ceremony argument was where I was like, oh, I think 152 00:06:34,880 --> 00:06:37,640 Speaker 5: you don't know how to communicate very healthy because it 153 00:06:37,720 --> 00:06:40,720 Speaker 5: was kind of the same thing of like, you know, 154 00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:43,680 Speaker 5: I'm want I don't want to understand your feelings. I 155 00:06:43,680 --> 00:06:46,360 Speaker 5: want you to just you know, feel like I'm not wrong. 156 00:06:46,880 --> 00:06:49,520 Speaker 5: But by doing so, he was like using like manipulative 157 00:06:49,560 --> 00:06:51,960 Speaker 5: tactics that at this point I know right, like like 158 00:06:52,040 --> 00:06:54,240 Speaker 5: it's it's a book, like it's a formulate book when 159 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:56,680 Speaker 5: it comes to me, like I've been dated a lot 160 00:06:56,680 --> 00:07:00,000 Speaker 5: of different versions of men, one of them mostly being manipulators, 161 00:07:00,480 --> 00:07:03,279 Speaker 5: and so I've studied it, and so I kept seeing 162 00:07:03,320 --> 00:07:05,680 Speaker 5: these characteristics. And then he also brought up like my 163 00:07:06,000 --> 00:07:08,479 Speaker 5: background of my family, which is like triggering for me. 164 00:07:09,160 --> 00:07:10,080 Speaker 3: Oh there was that. 165 00:07:10,480 --> 00:07:13,520 Speaker 5: Yeah, it was just really unhealthy and really red flaggy, 166 00:07:13,680 --> 00:07:14,600 Speaker 5: like I just don't. 167 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:16,680 Speaker 3: Really saying my family wouldn't do that. 168 00:07:16,920 --> 00:07:20,480 Speaker 4: My maybe it's our backgrounds, like I have no idea, 169 00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:23,920 Speaker 4: but like it was just not I wasn't spoken to 170 00:07:24,000 --> 00:07:25,640 Speaker 4: in the way that like you want to be spoken to, 171 00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:28,120 Speaker 4: and so there was like really like I was like, oh, 172 00:07:28,240 --> 00:07:30,720 Speaker 4: I I don't know what's going on, Like I don't 173 00:07:30,760 --> 00:07:31,080 Speaker 4: like this. 174 00:07:31,280 --> 00:07:35,720 Speaker 5: And in Paradise or in Raality TV, you want to 175 00:07:35,760 --> 00:07:40,000 Speaker 5: try to see how they handle conflict and adversity, and 176 00:07:40,080 --> 00:07:42,080 Speaker 5: I think that says a lot. The only thing that 177 00:07:42,120 --> 00:07:44,640 Speaker 5: really saved us was that next morning we had a 178 00:07:44,640 --> 00:07:46,400 Speaker 5: dead day, like the next day we had. 179 00:07:46,200 --> 00:07:48,840 Speaker 4: Like no, we were just like we had a filming 180 00:07:50,680 --> 00:07:52,480 Speaker 4: we had a chill day, so we didn't really talk. 181 00:07:52,520 --> 00:07:53,880 Speaker 4: So it gave us like a day to cool off. 182 00:07:54,360 --> 00:08:00,040 Speaker 5: And then he, uh, you know, apologized and whatnot. But 183 00:08:01,440 --> 00:08:04,400 Speaker 5: and I get it, like it's I understand being defensive, 184 00:08:04,400 --> 00:08:07,680 Speaker 5: but it was probably my first like red flag of 185 00:08:07,760 --> 00:08:10,200 Speaker 5: like he might not communicay very well. 186 00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:11,080 Speaker 2: I know. 187 00:08:11,200 --> 00:08:13,040 Speaker 6: So when I was watching that, I was like, oh 188 00:08:13,080 --> 00:08:14,840 Speaker 6: my god, she's so too good for him, Like I 189 00:08:15,080 --> 00:08:20,560 Speaker 6: don't want this to get reconciled ended up being better, 190 00:08:20,600 --> 00:08:22,080 Speaker 6: and I was like, oh, I don't want her to 191 00:08:22,120 --> 00:08:24,760 Speaker 6: take him back after he behaved like that around her. 192 00:08:24,840 --> 00:08:27,600 Speaker 5: Now, I mean, everybody has low character moments, like we're 193 00:08:27,600 --> 00:08:29,400 Speaker 5: not always going to be in our bestselves. Like being 194 00:08:29,440 --> 00:08:32,880 Speaker 5: able to recognize that, recognize that we have those parts 195 00:08:32,880 --> 00:08:34,360 Speaker 5: and like try to do better next time. 196 00:08:34,400 --> 00:08:36,440 Speaker 4: It's like what I always look for. But it was 197 00:08:36,440 --> 00:08:38,680 Speaker 4: still really too early to see if he was capable 198 00:08:38,679 --> 00:08:38,959 Speaker 4: of that. 199 00:08:39,080 --> 00:08:41,760 Speaker 2: So yeah, I think it's because a lot of the 200 00:08:41,760 --> 00:08:43,720 Speaker 2: audience was looking at him through the lens of like 201 00:08:43,720 --> 00:08:47,240 Speaker 2: what we've seen publicly throughout the past, like five six years, 202 00:08:47,240 --> 00:08:49,560 Speaker 2: like we were looking at him as a character, right, 203 00:08:49,800 --> 00:08:52,079 Speaker 2: because we were like, oh, we've seen this pattern before. 204 00:08:52,160 --> 00:08:55,840 Speaker 2: Basically it feels like Claire has mentioned. Yeah, because we 205 00:08:55,920 --> 00:08:58,560 Speaker 2: know that the Claire thing didn't go well, and I'm 206 00:08:58,600 --> 00:09:02,679 Speaker 2: sure there's play any of yucky on both sides, but 207 00:09:03,760 --> 00:09:07,040 Speaker 2: just from talking to Claire, I always like see the 208 00:09:07,080 --> 00:09:08,880 Speaker 2: red flag looking at Dale. 209 00:09:09,440 --> 00:09:11,960 Speaker 5: That's funny you say that, because when I was watching 210 00:09:11,960 --> 00:09:14,040 Speaker 5: it back and then even in real time, I was 211 00:09:14,120 --> 00:09:17,440 Speaker 5: kind of having similar experiences and I remember like googling 212 00:09:17,480 --> 00:09:20,640 Speaker 5: like what Claire had said and being. 213 00:09:20,480 --> 00:09:23,679 Speaker 4: Like, oh, I think I'm still dealing with that. 214 00:09:24,160 --> 00:09:28,520 Speaker 5: And it's like five years later, like why Yeah, And 215 00:09:28,559 --> 00:09:32,719 Speaker 5: I wasn't perfect, I mean, but I still just say, 216 00:09:32,760 --> 00:09:33,200 Speaker 5: I don't know. 217 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:35,600 Speaker 4: It was just it was interesting to see the correlation. 218 00:09:35,760 --> 00:09:38,280 Speaker 3: Still, did you ever want to reach out to Claire. 219 00:09:39,800 --> 00:09:41,080 Speaker 4: No, I just didn't want. 220 00:09:41,160 --> 00:09:43,360 Speaker 5: I know that he was really triggering for her, so 221 00:09:43,480 --> 00:09:46,959 Speaker 5: I didn't want any like bad memories like of her past. 222 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:49,800 Speaker 4: So I never wanted to like yeah, yeah, and like 223 00:09:50,200 --> 00:09:53,640 Speaker 4: it's not it's really what I'm like dealing with in 224 00:09:53,679 --> 00:09:55,520 Speaker 4: real time that matters to me. 225 00:09:55,640 --> 00:09:58,960 Speaker 2: So yeah, that's a good point, and that's very kind 226 00:09:59,000 --> 00:10:02,079 Speaker 2: of you to not want to put the memory of 227 00:10:02,160 --> 00:10:05,000 Speaker 2: him back on her in this really wonderful spot of life. 228 00:10:05,120 --> 00:10:07,720 Speaker 5: She's she's ready be her best life, like there's no 229 00:10:07,800 --> 00:10:11,000 Speaker 5: reason and yeah, no things have changed. 230 00:10:11,080 --> 00:10:11,120 Speaker 1: You. 231 00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:15,280 Speaker 2: Do you think that Dale went on Paradise because the 232 00:10:15,320 --> 00:10:17,800 Speaker 2: producers may have said, like, we need to reintroduce you 233 00:10:17,880 --> 00:10:20,280 Speaker 2: to the audience, and this would be a good first 234 00:10:20,320 --> 00:10:22,680 Speaker 2: step in you becoming the bachelor one day. 235 00:10:23,160 --> 00:10:25,559 Speaker 4: Oh, I don't know. I don't know, yah, know you 236 00:10:25,600 --> 00:10:28,760 Speaker 4: not what they talk about. I mean, I can't imagine 237 00:10:28,800 --> 00:10:31,520 Speaker 4: he would be the bachelor because he doesn't really like 238 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:35,679 Speaker 4: speak in full sentences all the time. I feel like 239 00:10:35,720 --> 00:10:37,800 Speaker 4: you kind of have to do that, like you kind 240 00:10:37,800 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 4: of have to like see people and stuff. I mean, 241 00:10:40,520 --> 00:10:43,160 Speaker 4: he has moments where he guys, but like not consistently. 242 00:10:43,840 --> 00:10:46,160 Speaker 4: So I don't know if that was it, but who 243 00:10:46,200 --> 00:10:50,360 Speaker 4: knows what goes through their head. I I think it 244 00:10:50,520 --> 00:10:53,679 Speaker 4: worked out where he could potentially meet someone but also 245 00:10:53,720 --> 00:10:55,400 Speaker 4: like get exposure at the same time, which is kind 246 00:10:55,400 --> 00:10:57,520 Speaker 4: of like what a lot of people do in this space. 247 00:10:58,880 --> 00:11:00,920 Speaker 4: But I don't think they promised any of that. But 248 00:11:01,040 --> 00:11:04,880 Speaker 4: I'm a that I know, But maybe that was what 249 00:11:05,000 --> 00:11:06,080 Speaker 4: he was thinking, I don't. 250 00:11:05,840 --> 00:11:19,480 Speaker 2: Know what was your relationship like once you got off 251 00:11:19,559 --> 00:11:22,319 Speaker 2: the show, which, well, let's actually address the fact that 252 00:11:22,520 --> 00:11:25,200 Speaker 2: there wasn't a lot of pressure this time around to 253 00:11:25,400 --> 00:11:28,680 Speaker 2: be leaving in a committed relationship. There was no real 254 00:11:28,760 --> 00:11:32,600 Speaker 2: engagement on the table, which is kind of relieving. Yes, 255 00:11:33,280 --> 00:11:36,760 Speaker 2: So did you guys leave with like the thought that 256 00:11:36,800 --> 00:11:39,199 Speaker 2: maybe you would date in real life or that you'd 257 00:11:39,200 --> 00:11:40,960 Speaker 2: be boyfriend and girlfriend in real life. 258 00:11:41,280 --> 00:11:45,880 Speaker 4: Yeah, we left a couple and we continue to date 259 00:11:45,960 --> 00:11:49,160 Speaker 4: as a couple. I think everywhere, every time in this space, 260 00:11:49,200 --> 00:11:52,079 Speaker 4: you never know how people are going to be when 261 00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:56,559 Speaker 4: they leave because like work, family, priorities, everything, life comes 262 00:11:56,559 --> 00:11:58,839 Speaker 4: into play and you really see how that the person 263 00:11:58,840 --> 00:12:01,040 Speaker 4: fits in that space, and I think that's what really 264 00:12:01,040 --> 00:12:03,720 Speaker 4: makes or breaks a relationship. Then you add airing like 265 00:12:03,760 --> 00:12:07,760 Speaker 4: watching yourself back, bringing up old old experiences, dealing with 266 00:12:07,800 --> 00:12:10,319 Speaker 4: public responses, stuff like that is how you can really 267 00:12:10,360 --> 00:12:13,960 Speaker 4: see if the person is going to be your partner 268 00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:16,199 Speaker 4: or not. But we did leave with the idea that 269 00:12:16,240 --> 00:12:19,040 Speaker 4: we're going to stay as a couple, and that I 270 00:12:19,080 --> 00:12:20,760 Speaker 4: felt like this time around, we had a lot of 271 00:12:20,800 --> 00:12:24,839 Speaker 4: experiences in Paradise to see, okay, this could actually work. 272 00:12:24,880 --> 00:12:27,880 Speaker 4: Like we had those really unique challenges. We had some adversity. 273 00:12:28,520 --> 00:12:30,240 Speaker 5: Then I had all this stuff with my ex and 274 00:12:30,280 --> 00:12:31,960 Speaker 5: all that nonsense come up, but I was able to 275 00:12:31,960 --> 00:12:34,440 Speaker 5: see him through that, so I felt like I had 276 00:12:34,559 --> 00:12:36,600 Speaker 5: enough to go off of to feel safe, like leaving 277 00:12:36,880 --> 00:12:40,439 Speaker 5: boyfriend or girlfriend. So came off and we were still 278 00:12:40,480 --> 00:12:42,440 Speaker 5: like trying to see each other, but he was really 279 00:12:42,480 --> 00:12:44,840 Speaker 5: like strict about us not going on. 280 00:12:44,880 --> 00:12:47,199 Speaker 3: Public okay because he didn't want to get in trouble 281 00:12:47,200 --> 00:12:51,040 Speaker 3: with the show, right, yeah, Oh you think there's more 282 00:12:51,160 --> 00:12:51,360 Speaker 3: to that. 283 00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:54,760 Speaker 4: No, it felt really weird, Like I don't know, it 284 00:12:54,760 --> 00:12:57,920 Speaker 4: felt really weird. I've just never experienced it to that 285 00:12:58,000 --> 00:13:01,280 Speaker 4: extent before, you know, but who knows. I don't know. 286 00:13:01,400 --> 00:13:03,400 Speaker 4: It just felt like not getting it just felt weird. 287 00:13:03,880 --> 00:13:06,440 Speaker 4: Like we could go to okay, like no one, there's 288 00:13:06,440 --> 00:13:10,520 Speaker 4: not paparazzi. Okay, yeah, yeah, we could walk into a 289 00:13:10,559 --> 00:13:13,679 Speaker 4: store together like you know whatever. 290 00:13:13,880 --> 00:13:16,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, worse that's gonna happen is like a fan takes 291 00:13:16,760 --> 00:13:18,720 Speaker 2: a picture and it's. 292 00:13:19,480 --> 00:13:24,280 Speaker 4: Like yeah, at it right, Like like we're like. 293 00:13:24,240 --> 00:13:26,600 Speaker 2: It's not like you were the lead of a show 294 00:13:27,240 --> 00:13:30,160 Speaker 2: going out in public, which obviously is a huge no no. 295 00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:34,240 Speaker 2: But like Bachelor people hanging out together that may have 296 00:13:34,320 --> 00:13:35,480 Speaker 2: possibly been on Paradise. 297 00:13:35,520 --> 00:13:36,960 Speaker 3: It's probably not that big of a deal. 298 00:13:37,000 --> 00:13:38,720 Speaker 2: But I also want to give him the benefit of 299 00:13:38,720 --> 00:13:39,440 Speaker 2: the doubt, like he. 300 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:42,319 Speaker 4: Had experienced that with her, and I was trying to 301 00:13:42,360 --> 00:13:44,520 Speaker 4: tell him, like it is not the same. I'm also 302 00:13:44,520 --> 00:13:46,640 Speaker 4: we're not even age, like, we're not deep. We don't 303 00:13:46,679 --> 00:13:48,959 Speaker 4: even go to like you know what I mean. But whatever, 304 00:13:49,120 --> 00:13:49,680 Speaker 4: it was just weird. 305 00:13:49,760 --> 00:13:53,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, So when you did hang out together for 306 00:13:53,920 --> 00:13:55,760 Speaker 2: the first time off camera, what did it feel like. 307 00:13:56,200 --> 00:13:58,679 Speaker 5: Honestly, it felt fine. He came to seeing it like 308 00:13:58,760 --> 00:14:02,600 Speaker 5: right away. I worked, you know, my normal Monday through 309 00:14:02,640 --> 00:14:04,840 Speaker 5: Thursday schedule. He would like be at my house and 310 00:14:04,880 --> 00:14:08,560 Speaker 5: it was really like easy and like nice. But we 311 00:14:08,640 --> 00:14:11,560 Speaker 5: didn't really have like the opportunity to like do stuff 312 00:14:11,600 --> 00:14:14,960 Speaker 5: outside of my house, so it was kind of just 313 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:15,440 Speaker 5: like chill. 314 00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:17,679 Speaker 4: I felt like we were still in paradise almost. 315 00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:20,160 Speaker 3: Did it feel like the connection was still very strong? 316 00:14:20,360 --> 00:14:22,840 Speaker 5: I don't know if the connection was ever like extremely 317 00:14:23,560 --> 00:14:26,600 Speaker 5: like there was like I was really like letting things 318 00:14:26,680 --> 00:14:30,040 Speaker 5: move naturally, and if I'm being honest, like it's always 319 00:14:30,080 --> 00:14:32,320 Speaker 5: stayed kind of like in the middle, never been like, 320 00:14:32,360 --> 00:14:33,960 Speaker 5: oh I'm so in love or he's one hundred percent 321 00:14:34,080 --> 00:14:36,560 Speaker 5: my husband, like this is my person forever. I've definitely 322 00:14:36,560 --> 00:14:40,080 Speaker 5: experienced that before, and I think because I didn't really 323 00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:42,120 Speaker 5: create people in my mind anymore, like I allowed them 324 00:14:42,160 --> 00:14:42,760 Speaker 5: to really show me. 325 00:14:42,840 --> 00:14:45,480 Speaker 4: I was like it was just kind of like medium, 326 00:14:45,760 --> 00:14:47,760 Speaker 4: you know. I liked him. 327 00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:49,920 Speaker 5: I was still really excited for a future and like 328 00:14:50,000 --> 00:14:52,000 Speaker 5: at that time, like I was like, Okay, this could 329 00:14:52,000 --> 00:14:54,560 Speaker 5: be like something that grows into something great, but it 330 00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:55,440 Speaker 5: was still really early. 331 00:14:55,880 --> 00:14:58,360 Speaker 2: So when it wasn't super early, but like when it 332 00:14:58,400 --> 00:15:03,480 Speaker 2: started airing, so like two months into after, like you 333 00:15:03,520 --> 00:15:08,080 Speaker 2: guys left Paradise, did you go into that press thinking 334 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:10,000 Speaker 2: that you were like a strong couple or were you 335 00:15:10,080 --> 00:15:11,800 Speaker 2: worried that you were going to present yourself as a 336 00:15:11,800 --> 00:15:15,200 Speaker 2: couple and it didn't feel very good? Which time when 337 00:15:15,400 --> 00:15:18,280 Speaker 2: you started doing like the wrap up press like after 338 00:15:18,320 --> 00:15:19,880 Speaker 2: a finally, Well. 339 00:15:19,600 --> 00:15:22,800 Speaker 4: So at that time I was going through everything with 340 00:15:22,920 --> 00:15:25,960 Speaker 4: like Alicia and Sean and all the things that were 341 00:15:25,960 --> 00:15:28,320 Speaker 4: coming from that, and he was really supportive, so I 342 00:15:28,360 --> 00:15:31,080 Speaker 4: felt like actually like very taken care of or at 343 00:15:31,160 --> 00:15:34,400 Speaker 4: least like understood, and like like last time I did 344 00:15:34,400 --> 00:15:37,680 Speaker 4: Paradise and I went through all like the public hate 345 00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:39,200 Speaker 4: and all the things with that, I didn't have as 346 00:15:39,280 --> 00:15:43,640 Speaker 4: much support for my partner that I think I just 347 00:15:43,640 --> 00:15:45,440 Speaker 4: did it because he wasn't really capable of that. 348 00:15:45,760 --> 00:15:47,720 Speaker 5: So it felt really good to have someone that was 349 00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:50,400 Speaker 5: like there and like not letting outset opinion adjust their 350 00:15:50,440 --> 00:15:53,520 Speaker 5: opinion of me. But it was also really focused on 351 00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:54,920 Speaker 5: that because it was bringing up a lot of like 352 00:15:54,960 --> 00:15:56,680 Speaker 5: traumatic memories of two years ago. 353 00:15:57,200 --> 00:16:00,520 Speaker 4: So it was I felt pretty good at that time. 354 00:16:00,640 --> 00:16:03,520 Speaker 4: And then I think when it was done wrapping and 355 00:16:03,880 --> 00:16:06,680 Speaker 4: we were living our life as a normal couple, like 356 00:16:06,960 --> 00:16:08,640 Speaker 4: we can go out in public, we can live life, 357 00:16:08,840 --> 00:16:10,320 Speaker 4: we can do all the things. Is when I was 358 00:16:10,360 --> 00:16:15,400 Speaker 4: like still unsatisfied and feeling just like there's still more 359 00:16:15,400 --> 00:16:17,120 Speaker 4: than I needed and I wasn't getting and it was 360 00:16:17,200 --> 00:16:20,720 Speaker 4: just weird. And so that's when you could really see 361 00:16:21,240 --> 00:16:23,240 Speaker 4: if there was any longevity with it. 362 00:16:23,560 --> 00:16:25,640 Speaker 2: And you were just on Bachelor Happy Hour where you 363 00:16:25,680 --> 00:16:28,400 Speaker 2: talk about kind of the demise of the relationship happens 364 00:16:28,520 --> 00:16:32,400 Speaker 2: at a fight in Vegas where you had to skip 365 00:16:32,440 --> 00:16:34,640 Speaker 2: Fashion Week in New York, which you were looking forward 366 00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:36,800 Speaker 2: to because he convinced you that it'd be fun to 367 00:16:36,840 --> 00:16:39,560 Speaker 2: go to Vegas for this fight and then you get 368 00:16:39,560 --> 00:16:42,800 Speaker 2: there and you realize, like this is breg upworthy that 369 00:16:42,840 --> 00:16:45,160 Speaker 2: you have to live in an influencer house for. 370 00:16:45,120 --> 00:16:49,920 Speaker 4: A content with all men, with literally all men. I 371 00:16:49,960 --> 00:16:52,640 Speaker 4: have never put on boxing clubs in my life. Like 372 00:16:52,880 --> 00:16:54,800 Speaker 4: it was the day before we were leaving and I 373 00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:58,080 Speaker 4: saw the itinerary and I was like, what are these workouts? 374 00:16:58,080 --> 00:16:59,800 Speaker 4: And what am I doing? And I thought we were 375 00:16:59,800 --> 00:17:03,360 Speaker 4: saying in hotel and like why are we doing? This 376 00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:05,960 Speaker 4: is not like what I thought it was gonna be. 377 00:17:06,960 --> 00:17:09,000 Speaker 4: But at the same time, I'm like, Okay, maybe it'll 378 00:17:09,040 --> 00:17:11,720 Speaker 4: be fun, like he'll like still like it'll just be still, 379 00:17:11,760 --> 00:17:14,199 Speaker 4: like we can have time together and like still like 380 00:17:14,280 --> 00:17:17,960 Speaker 4: spend our time together. And when we were there, like 381 00:17:18,560 --> 00:17:21,879 Speaker 4: I still felt so alone, like chased more. Uh. 382 00:17:22,080 --> 00:17:23,800 Speaker 5: I was having more fun with him and hanging out 383 00:17:23,800 --> 00:17:25,159 Speaker 5: with him, and he was talking to me more than 384 00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:28,520 Speaker 5: my own boyfriend. It was like so strange. So and 385 00:17:28,560 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 5: then like I'm like upstairs and like not like I 386 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:35,320 Speaker 5: he doesn't even like come to He's was like he 387 00:17:35,440 --> 00:17:36,879 Speaker 5: just did not care if I was there or not. 388 00:17:36,960 --> 00:17:38,280 Speaker 5: It just felt like I was like kind of an 389 00:17:38,320 --> 00:17:42,000 Speaker 5: accessory and I don't I'm not an accessory to anybody. 390 00:17:41,640 --> 00:17:42,840 Speaker 3: Like we sorry. 391 00:17:43,040 --> 00:17:45,399 Speaker 5: So it felt very and then at the time, obviously 392 00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:46,960 Speaker 5: it was already in my head, so like things were 393 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:48,000 Speaker 5: really heightened, I think. 394 00:17:48,400 --> 00:17:52,320 Speaker 4: But yeah, I know that was so not me. 395 00:17:52,480 --> 00:17:54,800 Speaker 5: And like, let's say I brought him to an influencer 396 00:17:54,840 --> 00:17:58,239 Speaker 5: house for like a beauty thing whatever, and like, you know, 397 00:17:58,280 --> 00:18:00,920 Speaker 5: they're bringing all the people. I would know that he's 398 00:18:00,960 --> 00:18:02,560 Speaker 5: out of his space, so I would try my best 399 00:18:02,560 --> 00:18:03,800 Speaker 5: to make sure that he's comfortable. 400 00:18:03,840 --> 00:18:05,400 Speaker 4: And I just did that, so. 401 00:18:05,320 --> 00:18:07,080 Speaker 5: I like kind of compared to how I would move 402 00:18:07,119 --> 00:18:09,000 Speaker 5: and I was not getting that. And that was like 403 00:18:09,040 --> 00:18:11,920 Speaker 5: when I was like, wow, I'm literally like just here. 404 00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:14,160 Speaker 4: So it was just so weird. 405 00:18:15,480 --> 00:18:18,320 Speaker 2: I go to the fight and then he leaves to 406 00:18:18,359 --> 00:18:20,640 Speaker 2: get a drink for like an hour, and you knew 407 00:18:20,680 --> 00:18:23,240 Speaker 2: that he just ended up chatting and doing business and 408 00:18:23,359 --> 00:18:24,680 Speaker 2: leaving you in the seat alone. 409 00:18:25,040 --> 00:18:26,040 Speaker 4: Couldn't tell what he was doing. 410 00:18:26,080 --> 00:18:28,919 Speaker 5: But I called him and I was like, all right, 411 00:18:29,000 --> 00:18:30,320 Speaker 5: like I think I'm going to like he did he 412 00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:33,120 Speaker 5: like forwarded my call and I was like, Okay, I'm 413 00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:36,119 Speaker 5: sitting there in these stands like by myself, and uh, 414 00:18:36,560 --> 00:18:37,600 Speaker 5: He's like I was like. 415 00:18:37,520 --> 00:18:40,720 Speaker 4: I think I'm going to go, and he's like I'm 416 00:18:40,760 --> 00:18:43,760 Speaker 4: getting a drink like relax, like blah blah blah, and 417 00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:46,520 Speaker 4: was like really mean to me and did not handle 418 00:18:46,560 --> 00:18:50,160 Speaker 4: that well, and I was like actually going to leave. 419 00:18:50,160 --> 00:18:51,800 Speaker 5: I was like a calling where I could care less 420 00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:53,879 Speaker 5: for the fight or not, but he was you know, 421 00:18:53,960 --> 00:18:55,840 Speaker 5: came back to the stands and then was kind of 422 00:18:55,880 --> 00:18:58,960 Speaker 5: just like being unkind, but like the guy who ran 423 00:18:59,080 --> 00:19:01,040 Speaker 5: who like set everything up, was like to my right, 424 00:19:01,080 --> 00:19:02,880 Speaker 5: and then Dale is like to my left, and he's 425 00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:05,919 Speaker 5: just like this fight is literally starting and he's like 426 00:19:05,960 --> 00:19:07,959 Speaker 5: going on and on and on, and I'm like, well, 427 00:19:08,000 --> 00:19:09,760 Speaker 5: I can't fight with him because then it's going to 428 00:19:09,800 --> 00:19:12,240 Speaker 5: look bad in front of the sky, and also like 429 00:19:12,280 --> 00:19:13,960 Speaker 5: I don't want to like escalate it. 430 00:19:14,000 --> 00:19:15,040 Speaker 4: But that's when he said. 431 00:19:14,800 --> 00:19:16,560 Speaker 3: The light yeah I know. 432 00:19:17,600 --> 00:19:19,440 Speaker 4: And then he was like if you want someone that's 433 00:19:19,480 --> 00:19:20,879 Speaker 4: going to be like obsessed with you, like it's not 434 00:19:20,920 --> 00:19:22,320 Speaker 4: going to be me this. 435 00:19:23,040 --> 00:19:25,480 Speaker 3: I heard you say this and the other interview, and. 436 00:19:25,400 --> 00:19:29,520 Speaker 2: I'm like, oh my goodness, that is the moment I 437 00:19:29,560 --> 00:19:30,919 Speaker 2: think I just get up. 438 00:19:31,880 --> 00:19:35,840 Speaker 4: I couldn't. But also when you're in those moments and 439 00:19:35,880 --> 00:19:37,160 Speaker 4: someone is saying that to you. 440 00:19:36,960 --> 00:19:39,360 Speaker 5: You're not thinking, like like I was like, oh, my god, 441 00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:41,760 Speaker 5: I'm like I'm too much, Like I'm asking for too much. 442 00:19:41,920 --> 00:19:43,040 Speaker 4: I am too much. 443 00:19:42,960 --> 00:19:46,120 Speaker 5: Like somebody Like I had that like insecurity deep down, 444 00:19:46,160 --> 00:19:47,919 Speaker 5: so like in that moment, and I wasn't thinking like 445 00:19:48,000 --> 00:19:51,199 Speaker 5: that's really unkind to say and like rude and maybe 446 00:19:51,240 --> 00:19:54,920 Speaker 5: like I am wanting too much. When I process it, 447 00:19:55,040 --> 00:19:57,919 Speaker 5: I was like, no, like that's I'm asking for the 448 00:19:57,920 --> 00:20:00,480 Speaker 5: bare minimum, Like I'm really asking for the bear minimum, 449 00:20:00,520 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 5: and like I'm okay to ask for things that I 450 00:20:02,800 --> 00:20:04,960 Speaker 5: need or want, and like it should it shouldn't be 451 00:20:05,040 --> 00:20:08,840 Speaker 5: this like hard, you know, But that's I felt like 452 00:20:08,960 --> 00:20:11,920 Speaker 5: was a pattern with the communication. And then, like I said, 453 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:14,080 Speaker 5: I felt like, are you like the way that he 454 00:20:14,200 --> 00:20:16,000 Speaker 5: argued kind of brought up parts of myself that I 455 00:20:16,000 --> 00:20:17,679 Speaker 5: didn't really like very much. 456 00:20:18,920 --> 00:20:20,639 Speaker 4: That I've worked really hard to not be. 457 00:20:21,320 --> 00:20:23,520 Speaker 5: And you never want your partner to bring out a 458 00:20:23,560 --> 00:20:27,719 Speaker 5: worse version of you, So I yeah, I don't think 459 00:20:27,760 --> 00:20:29,639 Speaker 5: I was like probably being healthy at that moment, but 460 00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:32,760 Speaker 5: that fight was to me like something's got to change, 461 00:20:32,760 --> 00:20:35,199 Speaker 5: like I need something different. And then he brought up 462 00:20:35,240 --> 00:20:37,680 Speaker 5: like my past relationships and like trying to turn to 463 00:20:37,840 --> 00:20:38,120 Speaker 5: it was. 464 00:20:38,119 --> 00:20:41,120 Speaker 4: Just really like just let's I don't like being. 465 00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:45,240 Speaker 5: Mean and to your partner when you're having like disagreements, 466 00:20:45,240 --> 00:20:48,400 Speaker 5: you should never try to hurt them, Like you can 467 00:20:48,520 --> 00:20:50,960 Speaker 5: be defensive and disagree, but like to say things that 468 00:20:51,000 --> 00:20:52,720 Speaker 5: you know are going to hurt their feelings is like 469 00:20:52,800 --> 00:20:53,160 Speaker 5: such a. 470 00:20:53,160 --> 00:20:57,119 Speaker 3: No go for me, of course. Yeah, yeah, it's not right. 471 00:20:57,960 --> 00:21:00,160 Speaker 3: I'm so sorry that you felt that way. 472 00:21:00,280 --> 00:21:00,960 Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm okay. 473 00:21:01,240 --> 00:21:03,280 Speaker 5: It was just that was like a glimpse of like 474 00:21:03,359 --> 00:21:05,080 Speaker 5: something probably needs to change. 475 00:21:05,720 --> 00:21:07,600 Speaker 3: Yeah, and you're like, you know what, I'm not even 476 00:21:07,600 --> 00:21:08,280 Speaker 3: that into him. 477 00:21:08,320 --> 00:21:11,240 Speaker 2: So this has been a couple months of my life 478 00:21:11,280 --> 00:21:13,000 Speaker 2: and it is time to put it into an end. 479 00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:13,240 Speaker 4: Now. 480 00:21:13,480 --> 00:21:15,440 Speaker 3: Would you guys say that the breakup was mutual? 481 00:21:16,280 --> 00:21:17,040 Speaker 4: I mean it wasn't. 482 00:21:17,160 --> 00:21:18,920 Speaker 5: It was just like when you're not feeling like the 483 00:21:19,000 --> 00:21:21,679 Speaker 5: relationship's progressing, like how into it could you be? And 484 00:21:21,720 --> 00:21:23,879 Speaker 5: I kept trying to see like where we were going 485 00:21:23,920 --> 00:21:28,520 Speaker 5: to go next, and eventually was like, well, he's not 486 00:21:28,600 --> 00:21:30,200 Speaker 5: even going to move to Sant Diegor to feel like 487 00:21:30,240 --> 00:21:32,080 Speaker 5: he was going to anytime soon. I never really got 488 00:21:32,080 --> 00:21:35,600 Speaker 5: a full answer, So yeah, I was like, I think 489 00:21:35,680 --> 00:21:38,360 Speaker 5: we're just not meeting each other's needs, Like you're. 490 00:21:38,280 --> 00:21:40,840 Speaker 4: Not meeting mine. I'm clearly not meeting yours. 491 00:21:40,560 --> 00:21:45,879 Speaker 5: Because I'm probably needing too much, and uh it felt mutual. Yeah, 492 00:21:45,920 --> 00:21:47,680 Speaker 5: like we I mean I put this on a break 493 00:21:48,240 --> 00:21:50,439 Speaker 5: after his birthday so I could just like process my 494 00:21:50,480 --> 00:21:54,280 Speaker 5: emotions without any distractions while still talking like maybe once 495 00:21:54,320 --> 00:21:56,679 Speaker 5: a week. And then we saw each other when he 496 00:21:56,720 --> 00:21:59,280 Speaker 5: came here for San Diego, and he did reflect, like 497 00:21:59,320 --> 00:22:01,480 Speaker 5: he did take some time to assess where he was 498 00:22:01,480 --> 00:22:03,960 Speaker 5: like probably not showing up like best with his work 499 00:22:04,000 --> 00:22:07,960 Speaker 5: and like prioritizing appropriately for what I needed. So when 500 00:22:07,960 --> 00:22:09,719 Speaker 5: he was like I want to make this work or 501 00:22:09,760 --> 00:22:12,200 Speaker 5: like I love you and I miss you, I thought 502 00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:16,040 Speaker 5: something would change, but it didn't. So after those two weeks, 503 00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:18,359 Speaker 5: I gave him a. 504 00:22:18,240 --> 00:22:19,720 Speaker 4: Call and I was like, I think it's best that 505 00:22:19,760 --> 00:22:22,480 Speaker 4: we just like can vomp with our life and like 506 00:22:22,560 --> 00:22:25,640 Speaker 4: it's okay and like no bad blood and he's like, yep, 507 00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:28,879 Speaker 4: I agree, Like everything's good on my end blah blah blah. 508 00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:30,720 Speaker 4: But then I got the hay Gurly text after that, 509 00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:31,840 Speaker 4: so that's when I. 510 00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:34,240 Speaker 3: Was like, oh, we got the what girl? Like what, 511 00:22:34,520 --> 00:22:35,000 Speaker 3: hey girly? 512 00:22:35,200 --> 00:22:37,240 Speaker 4: You know, like when someone's like hey, girly, so like 513 00:22:37,280 --> 00:22:38,720 Speaker 4: I don't know if you know, have you ever seen 514 00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:40,040 Speaker 4: that like on Instagram or. 515 00:22:40,000 --> 00:22:43,120 Speaker 2: Like yeah, like I'm going to say this because I'm 516 00:22:43,119 --> 00:22:44,800 Speaker 2: going to try to soften the blow that's to come. 517 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:47,639 Speaker 4: Yeah, pretty much like I picked up with your man 518 00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:49,440 Speaker 4: kind of thing, like hey, girly. 519 00:22:49,359 --> 00:22:52,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, okay, So you you got this text a couple 520 00:22:52,440 --> 00:22:54,159 Speaker 2: of days after this conversation. 521 00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:56,919 Speaker 5: No, like in like the moment I got off the 522 00:22:56,960 --> 00:22:59,680 Speaker 5: phone with him, we got no yeah, no, it was 523 00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:00,639 Speaker 5: divine intervention. 524 00:23:00,720 --> 00:23:03,600 Speaker 2: It was okay, So tell everybody I know what this is, 525 00:23:03,640 --> 00:23:05,080 Speaker 2: but tell everybody else it doesn't know. 526 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:07,639 Speaker 5: Oh yeah, So I got a text from my girlfriend 527 00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:10,359 Speaker 5: who gets a text with someone else that's like I 528 00:23:10,359 --> 00:23:12,720 Speaker 5: don't know if like I want this to get to 529 00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:14,600 Speaker 5: cat sooner, but I don't know for her in jeler together. 530 00:23:14,640 --> 00:23:17,160 Speaker 5: But he one hundred percent like suck with someone last night, 531 00:23:17,280 --> 00:23:19,639 Speaker 5: and like I just thought she should know. And I 532 00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:22,440 Speaker 5: called him back immediately and I said, I just got 533 00:23:22,440 --> 00:23:24,520 Speaker 5: this text, like did you hook up with someone last night? 534 00:23:24,520 --> 00:23:27,040 Speaker 4: And he's like, no, someone was trying, but like I 535 00:23:27,080 --> 00:23:30,640 Speaker 4: never actually did. And I think he was like going 536 00:23:30,640 --> 00:23:32,239 Speaker 4: into his house or something, so he was like his 537 00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:33,800 Speaker 4: hands were full and he's like I'll call you back. 538 00:23:33,840 --> 00:23:35,880 Speaker 4: So it's like okay. Then I reached out to the. 539 00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:38,360 Speaker 5: Girl, and like it just kept going and like more 540 00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:40,359 Speaker 5: and more kept coming out, and I kept trying to 541 00:23:40,359 --> 00:23:42,600 Speaker 5: give him opportunity because at one point she was like, 542 00:23:42,600 --> 00:23:44,000 Speaker 5: there's a picture and stuff like. 543 00:23:44,040 --> 00:23:47,679 Speaker 4: That, and he's like, well, we did hook up, but 544 00:23:47,760 --> 00:23:50,840 Speaker 4: we didn't like fully, like go all the way sex. 545 00:23:51,200 --> 00:23:52,560 Speaker 4: And I said, well, why didn't you tell me you 546 00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:54,280 Speaker 4: hooked up the first time? He'said, well, I thought you 547 00:23:54,320 --> 00:23:56,680 Speaker 4: meant sex. It was just like all this like run 548 00:23:56,720 --> 00:24:02,600 Speaker 4: around nonsense. And eventually I spoke to the girl herself 549 00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:05,480 Speaker 4: and found out all the like intricacies of how he was, 550 00:24:05,720 --> 00:24:07,520 Speaker 4: how he lied and lied to me for about like 551 00:24:07,560 --> 00:24:09,639 Speaker 4: two hours straight about things. 552 00:24:09,680 --> 00:24:11,159 Speaker 3: So they actually did sleep together. 553 00:24:11,480 --> 00:24:14,880 Speaker 4: They did end up sleeping together fully and like he 554 00:24:15,000 --> 00:24:16,960 Speaker 4: was the one that was pursuing her, he was one 555 00:24:17,000 --> 00:24:18,679 Speaker 4: that kicked her, or she was one that kicked him 556 00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:20,680 Speaker 4: out of the room, like that's why he slept in 557 00:24:20,720 --> 00:24:23,240 Speaker 4: his own bed stuff like that, and so I think 558 00:24:23,240 --> 00:24:24,720 Speaker 4: you made it very clear. I was like, I won't 559 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:26,280 Speaker 4: be mad if you hook up with someone. I just 560 00:24:26,280 --> 00:24:28,879 Speaker 4: like want you to be honest with me, and I 561 00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:30,720 Speaker 4: don't want to keep finding any things out like this 562 00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:32,399 Speaker 4: should have come from you to begin with, Like we 563 00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:34,520 Speaker 4: never set boundaries, but like we should have. You need 564 00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:37,520 Speaker 4: to communicate with me like these things. And it honestly 565 00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:38,600 Speaker 4: felt a lot about. 566 00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:40,840 Speaker 5: Like it felt like the dead conversation where he's like 567 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:44,399 Speaker 5: minimizing it and then being like, what, it's not happening, 568 00:24:44,440 --> 00:24:47,760 Speaker 5: and it didn't happen, but like it did so just 569 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:50,800 Speaker 5: so many things. I think back now to the relationship 570 00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:52,840 Speaker 5: where I wonder what was honest or not because his 571 00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:57,560 Speaker 5: capacity to be dishonest was insane, and that's what that's 572 00:24:57,600 --> 00:24:59,399 Speaker 5: what made me the most upset. 573 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:01,760 Speaker 2: I'm assuming that you thought back on a lot of 574 00:25:01,800 --> 00:25:04,280 Speaker 2: times where possibly he was hooking up with other girls 575 00:25:04,320 --> 00:25:07,560 Speaker 2: when it was kind of understood that you were dating. 576 00:25:08,119 --> 00:25:10,480 Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, there were some like blind things that came 577 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:13,640 Speaker 4: out on the internet that and I just felt like anytime, 578 00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:17,480 Speaker 4: like he I ever asked him a lot of times 579 00:25:17,480 --> 00:25:18,840 Speaker 4: and every time, but like a lot of times and 580 00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,040 Speaker 4: I would bring things up to him, it was always like, 581 00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:24,320 Speaker 4: let me flip it on you in some way for 582 00:25:24,359 --> 00:25:26,879 Speaker 4: you to feel like crazy first asking to begin with. 583 00:25:27,040 --> 00:25:30,360 Speaker 4: But I will say I had the most fun in 584 00:25:30,400 --> 00:25:33,520 Speaker 4: this in this breakup because when he was trying to 585 00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:33,960 Speaker 4: call me. 586 00:25:33,960 --> 00:25:35,920 Speaker 5: Back because after I spoke to the girl, I like 587 00:25:35,960 --> 00:25:37,520 Speaker 5: would not talk to him. I was like, you will 588 00:25:37,560 --> 00:25:39,480 Speaker 5: never have this to communicate with me again. So he 589 00:25:39,560 --> 00:25:41,399 Speaker 5: was calling me back and like it would answer, and 590 00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:43,680 Speaker 5: I was just sending him links to like better help therapy, 591 00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:47,560 Speaker 5: you get yours. 592 00:25:47,520 --> 00:25:50,800 Speaker 4: Together and leave me alone. And then he was like, 593 00:25:50,920 --> 00:25:53,680 Speaker 4: I did tell you we hooked up like like that 594 00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:54,840 Speaker 4: from that last call. 595 00:25:55,080 --> 00:25:57,520 Speaker 5: And I'm like I wrote in CHATGYBT. I was like, 596 00:25:57,520 --> 00:25:59,520 Speaker 5: what does it mean when someone tells you something happened 597 00:25:59,520 --> 00:26:03,119 Speaker 5: that didn't have and there was like a definition of gaslighting. 598 00:26:03,240 --> 00:26:03,800 Speaker 4: So I sent it. 599 00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:07,440 Speaker 5: And then like the next day when he's trying to 600 00:26:07,440 --> 00:26:09,520 Speaker 5: get more information about what I know, I told him 601 00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:11,600 Speaker 5: like the only person should be calling is your therapist. 602 00:26:11,720 --> 00:26:13,520 Speaker 4: Like I was having fun. I was having fun. 603 00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:16,560 Speaker 3: Oh my goodness, gracious, And then you post. 604 00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:20,359 Speaker 2: Then you posted on TikTok to really like make it 605 00:26:20,359 --> 00:26:21,600 Speaker 2: official that you were like. 606 00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:22,840 Speaker 3: All those guys that were in my. 607 00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:25,879 Speaker 2: TM for the past like seven months. So I'm going 608 00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:26,720 Speaker 2: to revisit this. 609 00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:31,600 Speaker 4: No, I don't, I know. I was I'm traumatized. I 610 00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:34,520 Speaker 4: was traumatized woman. But yeah, I. 611 00:26:34,520 --> 00:26:38,240 Speaker 5: Just felt like he just he has a lot of 612 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:40,080 Speaker 5: growing to do in my opinion, I mean, we all do. 613 00:26:40,359 --> 00:26:43,240 Speaker 4: But it felt really like it was very obvious. 614 00:26:43,440 --> 00:26:45,919 Speaker 2: I feel like he's a character in a rom com, 615 00:26:45,960 --> 00:26:47,960 Speaker 2: you know what I mean. Like he's like the guy 616 00:26:48,040 --> 00:26:51,320 Speaker 2: in a rom com that's just like brings you in 617 00:26:51,359 --> 00:26:55,560 Speaker 2: with the green eyes, and like he's just very obviously 618 00:26:55,880 --> 00:27:01,320 Speaker 2: like beautiful man and then yeah, you're else does this 619 00:27:01,560 --> 00:27:03,879 Speaker 2: and then at the end of the day, the girl 620 00:27:03,960 --> 00:27:08,440 Speaker 2: finds somebody troots her well, and we've heard that maybe 621 00:27:08,440 --> 00:27:09,520 Speaker 2: you're dating somebody. 622 00:27:09,720 --> 00:27:11,000 Speaker 4: Now I am dating someone. 623 00:27:11,200 --> 00:27:15,560 Speaker 5: Yes, it's it's really new, but very kind to me, 624 00:27:15,960 --> 00:27:21,680 Speaker 5: very smart, very present, laughs at all my jokes, and 625 00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:24,840 Speaker 5: like just feels really like easy, like I've never I 626 00:27:25,040 --> 00:27:29,040 Speaker 5: feel like, typically I am trying to pull like emotion 627 00:27:29,240 --> 00:27:32,560 Speaker 5: out of people, yeah, or they're like somewhat present, but 628 00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:35,000 Speaker 5: not He's very present, emotionally available. 629 00:27:35,440 --> 00:27:37,560 Speaker 4: So I'm really excited to see where this can go. 630 00:27:39,040 --> 00:27:41,679 Speaker 4: But he's probably the nicest I've never had someone be 631 00:27:41,720 --> 00:27:42,520 Speaker 4: like so kind to me. 632 00:27:42,920 --> 00:27:44,200 Speaker 7: Oh my gosh, that's so sweet. 633 00:27:44,240 --> 00:27:45,639 Speaker 3: I'm so happy for you. 634 00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:48,760 Speaker 5: Really sweetly. Yeah, So that's been really refreshing. It's still early, 635 00:27:48,840 --> 00:27:50,400 Speaker 5: so who knows he is still breaking heart. 636 00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:54,240 Speaker 3: But how did they how'd you guys meet? 637 00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:56,960 Speaker 4: We met at like a housewarming praty we have a 638 00:27:57,040 --> 00:27:58,639 Speaker 4: mutual friend so in the wild. 639 00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:02,040 Speaker 3: Oh wow, that's also so rom coming. 640 00:28:02,359 --> 00:28:05,000 Speaker 4: I'm so fare I know, I know, yes, And I 641 00:28:05,040 --> 00:28:07,600 Speaker 4: was like still dealing with some emotional stuff in the beginning, 642 00:28:07,640 --> 00:28:10,479 Speaker 4: like I didn't want to not be present enough, so 643 00:28:10,560 --> 00:28:12,040 Speaker 4: I was really honest about that. And he loves to 644 00:28:12,040 --> 00:28:14,040 Speaker 4: tell me how difficult I was, which we have to. 645 00:28:16,040 --> 00:28:19,880 Speaker 5: Yeah, it's just fun like to see like what you can, 646 00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:22,080 Speaker 5: like what it really should feel like. Like every time 647 00:28:22,080 --> 00:28:24,800 Speaker 5: I describe the relationship, everyone's like, well, I'm supposed to 648 00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:26,840 Speaker 5: feel like I'm like, deep, see my dating history. 649 00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:31,480 Speaker 4: Okay, I'm just like this is so crazy new to 650 00:28:31,520 --> 00:28:33,880 Speaker 4: me that this is what everybody actually gets to experience. 651 00:28:33,920 --> 00:28:35,040 Speaker 4: Like this is so beautiful. 652 00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:37,480 Speaker 5: I'm so fun and amazing and it makes you so 653 00:28:37,560 --> 00:28:40,760 Speaker 5: excited for the future. And I know that it's coming 654 00:28:40,760 --> 00:28:42,640 Speaker 5: from a healthier place because before I would feel that 655 00:28:42,680 --> 00:28:45,320 Speaker 5: it's a prefrontal like low it. 656 00:28:45,400 --> 00:28:47,640 Speaker 4: Was not enough to be saying that stuff. So now 657 00:28:47,680 --> 00:28:49,880 Speaker 4: I'm like, okay, I still go to therapy every other week, 658 00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:53,280 Speaker 4: Like I feel like I know, but I want who 659 00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:54,200 Speaker 4: he is, so we'll. 660 00:28:54,040 --> 00:29:05,960 Speaker 7: See your ex. 661 00:29:06,720 --> 00:29:10,440 Speaker 2: John seems very sweet though he seemed like he treated 662 00:29:10,520 --> 00:29:11,360 Speaker 2: you well. He did. 663 00:29:11,560 --> 00:29:14,440 Speaker 5: He actually like probably the most, like like he's still 664 00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:15,560 Speaker 5: my friend, like we still talk. 665 00:29:15,640 --> 00:29:21,320 Speaker 4: Yeah, but emotionally, like emotional availability, we were disconnected in 666 00:29:21,320 --> 00:29:23,840 Speaker 4: that space. So yeah, he was like really sweet to 667 00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:26,720 Speaker 4: me and like never felt like any of those like 668 00:29:26,800 --> 00:29:29,080 Speaker 4: toxic things at all in that relationship. But I would 669 00:29:29,120 --> 00:29:33,320 Speaker 4: say the emotional capacity we were like at two different parts, 670 00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:34,440 Speaker 4: if that makes that makes sense. 671 00:29:34,520 --> 00:29:35,360 Speaker 3: Yeah, that makes sense. 672 00:29:35,880 --> 00:29:38,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm sorry I forgot to ask this question when 673 00:29:38,040 --> 00:29:41,760 Speaker 2: you said it. But Dale did say that. He said 674 00:29:41,800 --> 00:29:43,640 Speaker 2: I love you, did you guys exchange? 675 00:29:43,680 --> 00:29:44,600 Speaker 3: I love yous? 676 00:29:44,920 --> 00:29:48,280 Speaker 4: Yeah, I mean he said that like pretty early on too. 677 00:29:48,440 --> 00:29:49,920 Speaker 4: I didn't say it for a while, and. 678 00:29:51,480 --> 00:29:54,520 Speaker 5: I don't think I ever really fully said it back 679 00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:56,920 Speaker 5: or like like I wasn't like I'm so with you 680 00:29:57,040 --> 00:29:59,480 Speaker 5: like and I don't think he really meant it that 681 00:29:59,480 --> 00:29:59,960 Speaker 5: way either. 682 00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:03,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, it was more like as a person, I love you. 683 00:30:03,240 --> 00:30:05,680 Speaker 5: Yeah, because I feel like we cared a lot about 684 00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:08,360 Speaker 5: each other, you know, when you you developed this like 685 00:30:08,440 --> 00:30:11,440 Speaker 5: bond in those settings of Paradise and like Bachelor World. 686 00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:14,240 Speaker 5: So I feel like there's like you can confuse like 687 00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:20,600 Speaker 5: care and with love in a way. But I was 688 00:30:20,760 --> 00:30:23,080 Speaker 5: very like every time everyone asked me if he was 689 00:30:23,120 --> 00:30:24,880 Speaker 5: the one, I was like, I don't know, and like 690 00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:28,400 Speaker 5: I've never said, I usually am like, yeah, one hundred percent, 691 00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:28,720 Speaker 5: he's my. 692 00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:32,600 Speaker 4: Asset, But there's nothing that I could really. 693 00:30:32,960 --> 00:30:35,240 Speaker 5: I was truly just like seeing where it went, and 694 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:38,160 Speaker 5: when it didn't go to that direction, I was like, 695 00:30:38,160 --> 00:30:39,960 Speaker 5: well then I don't want to do it anymore. 696 00:30:40,720 --> 00:30:45,040 Speaker 4: So yeah, I don't know. It takes time, but I 697 00:30:45,120 --> 00:30:47,840 Speaker 4: don't have god blood. I just want like my story 698 00:30:47,920 --> 00:30:50,160 Speaker 4: to be told of the situation. I don't think he 699 00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:52,680 Speaker 4: was like intentionally trying to hurt anybody. I just think 700 00:30:53,080 --> 00:30:58,880 Speaker 4: people that have not connected enough with themselves accidentally hurt 701 00:30:58,880 --> 00:31:01,520 Speaker 4: other people. And and I think it's time that we 702 00:31:01,920 --> 00:31:02,600 Speaker 4: recognize that. 703 00:31:03,080 --> 00:31:06,200 Speaker 2: I think you're coming across very maturely. I think you're 704 00:31:06,200 --> 00:31:09,880 Speaker 2: coming across also kind. I don't know why there be really, 705 00:31:09,960 --> 00:31:11,560 Speaker 2: honestly a season desist about this. 706 00:31:11,720 --> 00:31:14,960 Speaker 3: You're not painting him to be this evil villain. 707 00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:17,520 Speaker 2: You're literally like, I think so therapy could help this 708 00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:23,520 Speaker 2: man deal with relationships better. So I mean, if the 709 00:31:23,560 --> 00:31:25,840 Speaker 2: worst thing you have to say is that, like he 710 00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:28,400 Speaker 2: took you to an awful influencer event and that, but 711 00:31:28,440 --> 00:31:31,520 Speaker 2: then the comment he made was pretty crappy. And I 712 00:31:31,680 --> 00:31:34,120 Speaker 2: completely agree that the man has showed a lot of 713 00:31:34,440 --> 00:31:36,760 Speaker 2: flaws publicly and the way he navigates relationships. 714 00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:38,760 Speaker 3: But like, I don't think you're slandering him. 715 00:31:39,320 --> 00:31:42,000 Speaker 5: No, I just don't think he wanted his I just 716 00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:45,120 Speaker 5: think he really cares what people think, and he takes 717 00:31:45,160 --> 00:31:46,400 Speaker 5: it too far sometimes as. 718 00:31:46,200 --> 00:31:48,440 Speaker 4: We all care. But like you don't have that is 719 00:31:48,480 --> 00:31:52,280 Speaker 4: not necessary, And I think he also has a little 720 00:31:52,320 --> 00:31:55,360 Speaker 4: bit of trauma, maybe from his previous relationship and publicly 721 00:31:55,400 --> 00:31:58,960 Speaker 4: with that. But like do better, like just be a 722 00:31:59,000 --> 00:32:01,320 Speaker 4: better person, like don't take. 723 00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:04,640 Speaker 5: The time to be a president partner, and you wouldn't 724 00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:06,800 Speaker 5: have to worry about that or own your mistakes, Like 725 00:32:06,840 --> 00:32:09,680 Speaker 5: it's not that hard. It's really not that hart to 726 00:32:09,800 --> 00:32:12,560 Speaker 5: just own like moments of flawed character. 727 00:32:12,960 --> 00:32:16,920 Speaker 3: Definitely that it would be good for his public image. 728 00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:20,920 Speaker 5: I don't think he's like I don't I don't even 729 00:32:20,960 --> 00:32:23,840 Speaker 5: think he knows himself, Like that's my opinion. I feel 730 00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:26,240 Speaker 5: like he really lacked that connection with himself, so it's 731 00:32:26,240 --> 00:32:28,920 Speaker 5: really hard to be like present and connecting with another 732 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:31,000 Speaker 5: person when you like don't even know yourself. 733 00:32:32,480 --> 00:32:35,200 Speaker 2: Yeah, talking about connecting with another person. Do you think 734 00:32:35,200 --> 00:32:36,760 Speaker 2: he's connecting with Kelly Flann. 735 00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:40,400 Speaker 4: Again, No, I think that's like straight for clout fully. Yeah. 736 00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:43,160 Speaker 4: I mean he's best friends with Peter, so I don't 737 00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:46,520 Speaker 4: know why that would be like a. 738 00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:50,480 Speaker 5: Thing, but I do know that he definitely like does 739 00:32:50,680 --> 00:32:53,160 Speaker 5: social stuff with people that will give him engagement. 740 00:32:53,800 --> 00:32:54,680 Speaker 4: I also think the. 741 00:32:54,640 --> 00:32:57,400 Speaker 5: Timing of all of it like is careless with everything 742 00:32:57,400 --> 00:33:00,000 Speaker 5: else that's going on in the world, Like people don't 743 00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:01,880 Speaker 5: need to see you trying to be a bad actor 744 00:33:02,120 --> 00:33:04,280 Speaker 5: on social media, like you need to be using your 745 00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:05,480 Speaker 5: platform for good right now. 746 00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:07,080 Speaker 4: But that's just my opinion. 747 00:33:08,080 --> 00:33:13,480 Speaker 3: So I just yeah, I'm wondering how Peter feels about 748 00:33:13,520 --> 00:33:14,120 Speaker 3: all this now. 749 00:33:15,360 --> 00:33:17,040 Speaker 4: They probably all love it because his name is being 750 00:33:17,080 --> 00:33:18,600 Speaker 4: said too, Like I feel like they all just love 751 00:33:18,640 --> 00:33:20,080 Speaker 4: the attention. It's really interesting. 752 00:33:20,680 --> 00:33:23,600 Speaker 5: I want I don't want that attention at all, Like 753 00:33:23,840 --> 00:33:27,040 Speaker 5: that's like, I don't know, it's just weird. 754 00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:28,880 Speaker 4: And it also. 755 00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:31,400 Speaker 5: Me and him a very different content styles, like you 756 00:33:31,440 --> 00:33:34,280 Speaker 5: will never see me like do like fake stuff on 757 00:33:34,400 --> 00:33:35,000 Speaker 5: social media? 758 00:33:35,080 --> 00:33:38,200 Speaker 2: He like exactly stuff, which is I can't fault him 759 00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:38,719 Speaker 2: for any of it. 760 00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:41,760 Speaker 3: We do lots of cheesy on Instagram. 761 00:33:41,800 --> 00:33:45,880 Speaker 4: So yeah, but you normal, I keep saying. 762 00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:48,400 Speaker 5: I keep saying he's a millennial on a boomer's body, 763 00:33:48,640 --> 00:33:52,400 Speaker 5: like it's he's a boomer and a millennial's body, like 764 00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:56,640 Speaker 5: it's so interesting, Like I don't get it. 765 00:33:57,040 --> 00:33:58,280 Speaker 4: I don't. I don't think that's. 766 00:33:58,200 --> 00:34:01,160 Speaker 5: Like really good because it looks fake in my opinion, 767 00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:02,960 Speaker 5: Like if you're good at. 768 00:34:02,880 --> 00:34:07,040 Speaker 4: It, like Kat Stickler, she like I think she's good 769 00:34:07,080 --> 00:34:09,400 Speaker 4: at it, I haven't seen you're very good. Yeah, Like 770 00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:12,279 Speaker 4: if you're good at it, hell yeah yeah, but like 771 00:34:12,320 --> 00:34:14,960 Speaker 4: if it's entertaining, but it's not entertaining to me, or 772 00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:17,760 Speaker 4: maybe because I know so just ingenuous that it pisses 773 00:34:17,800 --> 00:34:19,920 Speaker 4: me off and I'm just like being normal. 774 00:34:22,560 --> 00:34:24,279 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's probably because you know them too well. 775 00:34:24,320 --> 00:34:26,400 Speaker 2: When you know people and then you watch their social 776 00:34:26,440 --> 00:34:28,400 Speaker 2: media and it doesn't match to who they are in 777 00:34:28,440 --> 00:34:30,839 Speaker 2: real life, that's when you're like, oh, this is make 778 00:34:30,920 --> 00:34:33,959 Speaker 2: I can't look at social media because now I'm gonna 779 00:34:33,960 --> 00:34:35,960 Speaker 2: feel totally different way when I see him in real life. 780 00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:38,000 Speaker 4: So I feel like if I ever saw a man 781 00:34:38,120 --> 00:34:41,279 Speaker 4: dance with his shirt on and his pants off, like 782 00:34:41,360 --> 00:34:43,680 Speaker 4: and putting his shirt on first, like on with a 783 00:34:43,719 --> 00:34:46,680 Speaker 4: tripod setup, I would always like be grossed out. 784 00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:49,680 Speaker 3: But you dated the guy who does that. That's why 785 00:34:49,719 --> 00:34:51,719 Speaker 3: I have to look at their socials before you date them. 786 00:34:51,760 --> 00:34:52,880 Speaker 3: In Paradise did. 787 00:34:52,760 --> 00:34:54,839 Speaker 4: Not do that take it down. 788 00:34:54,840 --> 00:34:56,840 Speaker 5: I would have made him take it off like the 789 00:34:57,040 --> 00:35:00,560 Speaker 5: se And that's why I said I will never date 790 00:35:00,560 --> 00:35:02,600 Speaker 5: a man that owns a tripod again, because. 791 00:35:02,440 --> 00:35:06,040 Speaker 4: Like you literally need it, not how to use the phone, 792 00:35:06,160 --> 00:35:08,399 Speaker 4: like you know how to use your camera to take 793 00:35:08,400 --> 00:35:10,319 Speaker 4: pictures of me. You know how to use the lighting 794 00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:12,160 Speaker 4: in the angles. That's how you know how to operate. 795 00:35:12,200 --> 00:35:15,080 Speaker 4: But like the imagine a man literally like setting up 796 00:35:15,080 --> 00:35:17,200 Speaker 4: a tripod, putting up a ring light and like doing 797 00:35:17,239 --> 00:35:19,320 Speaker 4: a skincare teen like that's for the girls, Like that 798 00:35:19,520 --> 00:35:23,600 Speaker 4: is not loud, and I it's so bad. I hated it. 799 00:35:24,320 --> 00:35:24,759 Speaker 4: I hated it. 800 00:35:25,040 --> 00:35:27,480 Speaker 2: I tell Jared to like, you know, do more social 801 00:35:27,520 --> 00:35:32,360 Speaker 2: stuff because obviously for business, but you're right, it is 802 00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:34,279 Speaker 2: far more attractive if they don't. 803 00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:37,279 Speaker 3: But I guess when you're already married to him. But yeah, 804 00:35:37,840 --> 00:35:40,080 Speaker 3: he's not. He's also doing like movie reviews. He's not 805 00:35:40,200 --> 00:35:42,080 Speaker 3: like trying to matter. 806 00:35:42,160 --> 00:35:43,520 Speaker 4: Like if you're talking about like stuff't matter. 807 00:35:43,560 --> 00:35:46,080 Speaker 5: It's like sure, but also he was so not present 808 00:35:46,200 --> 00:35:47,840 Speaker 5: with me in real life, Like I think I mentioned 809 00:35:47,880 --> 00:35:50,800 Speaker 5: the Prodrey's game where we literally didn't talk and he 810 00:35:50,960 --> 00:35:52,120 Speaker 5: did it for social. 811 00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:54,279 Speaker 4: Like it seemed like and he wasn't. 812 00:35:54,680 --> 00:35:56,879 Speaker 5: We were doing these things together and it wasn't even fun, 813 00:35:57,000 --> 00:36:00,400 Speaker 5: So it's not very fun to like then you're acting 814 00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:02,880 Speaker 5: also like fun and like normal and real life, but 815 00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:03,720 Speaker 5: like you didn't even. 816 00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:04,400 Speaker 4: Have a conversation with me. 817 00:36:04,880 --> 00:36:08,400 Speaker 5: I literally was making up questions about baseball that I 818 00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:09,640 Speaker 5: already knew answers to, just. 819 00:36:09,680 --> 00:36:11,960 Speaker 4: So we can have like some type of conversation, like 820 00:36:13,480 --> 00:36:15,440 Speaker 4: like what many are in it? Like I know how 821 00:36:15,480 --> 00:36:17,000 Speaker 4: many names are in it, but like I don't know. 822 00:36:17,080 --> 00:36:19,719 Speaker 4: Guys like to like teach you stuff, So let me 823 00:36:19,800 --> 00:36:20,480 Speaker 4: give you something. 824 00:36:20,560 --> 00:36:22,560 Speaker 3: No, I don't dumb yourself down for a man. 825 00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:25,879 Speaker 4: No, but like it's sports, like I don't really care. 826 00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:28,880 Speaker 4: I know, but it was just like but that's how 827 00:36:28,960 --> 00:36:30,960 Speaker 4: desperate I was to just get some type of connection. 828 00:36:31,920 --> 00:36:35,160 Speaker 2: This brings up a point that our producer made before 829 00:36:35,200 --> 00:36:37,640 Speaker 2: you got on here. She said that when we were 830 00:36:37,719 --> 00:36:40,000 Speaker 2: doing the interview, when Ben was there doing the interview 831 00:36:40,080 --> 00:36:44,239 Speaker 2: for the finale, that people on our iHeart team saw 832 00:36:44,760 --> 00:36:49,640 Speaker 2: you guys fighting over doing tiktoks. There was like bickering 833 00:36:49,760 --> 00:36:53,880 Speaker 2: over tiktoks, which I can relate. It isn't easy to 834 00:36:53,960 --> 00:36:54,680 Speaker 2: do as a couple. 835 00:36:55,360 --> 00:36:57,400 Speaker 4: Think you wanted me to do this that we're TikTok 836 00:36:58,480 --> 00:37:01,680 Speaker 4: which one I don't know where he's like dancing or something. 837 00:37:02,040 --> 00:37:04,560 Speaker 3: I hated it and you were just like, ew, no, things, 838 00:37:04,600 --> 00:37:05,160 Speaker 3: don't dance. 839 00:37:05,480 --> 00:37:07,120 Speaker 4: He wasn't even like it was just felt like he 840 00:37:07,200 --> 00:37:09,760 Speaker 4: really needed to get this TikTok out. But like before 841 00:37:09,840 --> 00:37:11,880 Speaker 4: that he was barely talking to any like it just 842 00:37:11,960 --> 00:37:14,600 Speaker 4: fe I don't know, I don't like, I don't like it. 843 00:37:15,200 --> 00:37:17,160 Speaker 4: I don't remember. I probably was just like I don't 844 00:37:17,160 --> 00:37:18,600 Speaker 4: want to do this weird dance, Like what are you 845 00:37:18,719 --> 00:37:19,280 Speaker 4: talking about? 846 00:37:19,680 --> 00:37:25,279 Speaker 2: So it's needless to say your new boyfriend or guy 847 00:37:25,320 --> 00:37:27,960 Speaker 2: you're dating, yeah, doesn't own a tripod. 848 00:37:28,400 --> 00:37:30,680 Speaker 4: He doesn't own a tripod, but he actually it's really 849 00:37:30,719 --> 00:37:33,960 Speaker 4: good at taking like scenic photos and stuff. I was like, wow, 850 00:37:34,000 --> 00:37:36,320 Speaker 4: that looks so good. He like knows the angles with that, 851 00:37:36,440 --> 00:37:37,200 Speaker 4: so that was really cool. 852 00:37:38,400 --> 00:37:40,480 Speaker 3: He's a very lucky man dating. 853 00:37:40,480 --> 00:37:44,000 Speaker 2: He's a beautiful, lovely lady and as I like said 854 00:37:44,000 --> 00:37:46,360 Speaker 2: in the beginning a woman who. 855 00:37:46,280 --> 00:37:47,399 Speaker 3: Was born to be a reality star. 856 00:37:48,719 --> 00:37:50,040 Speaker 4: Yeah, you really really were. 857 00:37:50,280 --> 00:37:53,080 Speaker 3: You have the best funniest takes. 858 00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:59,920 Speaker 2: You're so honest, You're so funny intentionally and non intention 859 00:38:00,360 --> 00:38:02,560 Speaker 2: I've always been a fan, so it's really sweet. 860 00:38:02,600 --> 00:38:05,480 Speaker 4: I mean, it's if you're just yourself, it's so much 861 00:38:05,520 --> 00:38:07,440 Speaker 4: easier to be on camera. I feel like it's like 862 00:38:07,440 --> 00:38:11,520 Speaker 4: when people try to overthink it. But yeah, it's been 863 00:38:11,640 --> 00:38:13,759 Speaker 4: it's been interesting being in this space. Hopefully no more 864 00:38:13,840 --> 00:38:16,440 Speaker 4: dating shows, but I'm happy to go be a personal 865 00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:18,600 Speaker 4: emails in another in another space. 866 00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:21,600 Speaker 3: Alrighty, well do you think Dale's gonna listen to this? 867 00:38:22,560 --> 00:38:29,000 Speaker 4: I don't know, maybe probably probably Hey Dal, okay, alerts 868 00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:30,440 Speaker 4: for his name coming on my god. 869 00:38:32,320 --> 00:38:35,680 Speaker 2: All right, Kat, thanks for joining us. Until next time, 870 00:38:36,239 --> 00:38:37,040 Speaker 2: I've been Ashley 871 00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:42,160 Speaker 1: By Follow the Ben and Ashley I Almost Famous podcasts 872 00:38:42,200 --> 00:38:45,480 Speaker 1: on iHeartRadio or subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts.