WEBVTT - The Disappearance of Tiffany Whitton : Part 1 0:00:08.400 --> 0:00:10.080 Do you place your left hand on the bay of 0:00:10.119 --> 0:00:12.520 Bible and raise your right hand and repeat after me. 0:00:13.280 --> 0:00:20.760 I solemnly swear. The jury trying it attended in Ferguson 0:00:20.880 --> 0:00:24.280 and around the country were resisting. You're not makes no sense. 0:00:24.440 --> 0:00:27.680 If it doesn't fit, you must equip judge. You are 0:00:27.720 --> 0:00:31.560 the last line of reason in this case. Every one 0:00:31.600 --> 0:00:35.080 of us took an all sap office and we're scorn 0:00:35.159 --> 0:00:39.960 to uphold the constitution for Tenderfoot TV in Atlanta, this 0:00:40.600 --> 0:00:46.800 is sworn. I'm your host, Philip Holloway. We got about 0:00:46.800 --> 0:00:49.000 a half full parking lot right now. What was it 0:00:49.080 --> 0:00:52.080 like all the night she disappeared? Very few cars. From 0:00:52.080 --> 0:00:55.440 the video that we acquired, you don't get to capture 0:00:55.560 --> 0:00:58.800 much of the parking lot, but descriptions or was that 0:00:58.880 --> 0:01:01.880 it was a quiet n I don't Walmart pretty much 0:01:01.920 --> 0:01:05.200 northwest and you can see the uh the backside of 0:01:05.200 --> 0:01:08.800 the Chick fil A. That's the last general vicinity that 0:01:09.360 --> 0:01:21.760 she was seen running from the Walmart. Hi, I'm your host, 0:01:21.920 --> 0:01:25.880 Philip Holloway, and today we're looking into a very different 0:01:25.959 --> 0:01:28.960 kind of missing person's case. As you may recall, at 0:01:29.000 --> 0:01:31.880 the end of the Wideman murders, I posed the question that, 0:01:32.360 --> 0:01:35.640 unlike in the Wideman murders, what would a cold case 0:01:35.680 --> 0:01:40.600 investigation look like if investigators really put their shoulders into solving. 0:01:41.680 --> 0:01:47.520 On September two, thousand thirteen, Tiffany Witten was caught shoplifting 0:01:47.640 --> 0:01:50.720 at a Walmart in Cobb County, Georgia. When she was 0:01:50.760 --> 0:01:54.000 stopped by the loss prevention officers, she ran away from 0:01:54.000 --> 0:01:57.800 the Walmart, never to be seen again. Or was she. 0:01:58.880 --> 0:02:01.880 We've just passed the four year mark and still there's 0:02:01.920 --> 0:02:04.960 no sign of Tiffany. We're going to be exploring what 0:02:05.160 --> 0:02:08.720 makes this case so hard to pin down, namely the 0:02:08.840 --> 0:02:12.280 lack of physical evidence, the lack of witnesses, the lack 0:02:12.320 --> 0:02:16.920 of cooperation, the delay in reporting, and the high possibility 0:02:17.280 --> 0:02:34.239 of foul play. This is sworn. So let's walk while 0:02:34.280 --> 0:02:35.880 we're talking. Let's take a look at I want to 0:02:35.880 --> 0:02:41.120 see for myself what these doors look like. Um, that 0:02:41.320 --> 0:02:47.119 she came out of. That's a that's a fairly typical 0:02:47.200 --> 0:02:50.519 Walmart sort of entrance and exit. But it is a 0:02:50.600 --> 0:02:55.440 large door, right and or they're surveillance video cameras right 0:02:55.480 --> 0:02:58.919 there at that door, uh manner from inside. Yes, there 0:02:58.919 --> 0:03:02.680 were cameras and the doors are those automatic you know, 0:03:02.800 --> 0:03:07.480 the motion centers, and you've come up Fort Belden. So 0:03:07.560 --> 0:03:10.200 how far out of the door did she get before 0:03:10.280 --> 0:03:14.760 she was apprehended by the store security. She wasn't out 0:03:14.800 --> 0:03:17.639 the door yet. She was at the door, um, and 0:03:17.760 --> 0:03:20.919 had not made her way out that that set of 0:03:21.000 --> 0:03:25.000 doors at the time that she was approached by security 0:03:25.520 --> 0:03:29.519 and they kind of got between her and the in 0:03:29.639 --> 0:03:33.240 the parking lot. This is John Dawes, the lead investigator 0:03:33.320 --> 0:03:36.200 of the cold case unit in Cobb County, Georgia, and 0:03:36.240 --> 0:03:40.040 now the lead investigator in the Tiffany Witten case. Mason 0:03:40.080 --> 0:03:41.920 and I decided to go down with John to the 0:03:41.920 --> 0:03:45.120 Walmart where Tiffany was last seen in order to get 0:03:45.120 --> 0:03:50.200 a better feel for the area. Yeah, what was described 0:03:50.200 --> 0:03:55.200 by Walmarts that she was going, uh, pretty much northwest 0:03:55.240 --> 0:03:57.880 and you can see the uh, the backside of the 0:03:57.960 --> 0:04:01.920 Chick fil A. That's the last general vicinity that that 0:04:02.000 --> 0:04:08.560 she was seen running from the Walmart head headed towards 0:04:08.560 --> 0:04:10.200 the back side of Chick fil A. And where she 0:04:10.240 --> 0:04:14.280 went in you can see there's tree growth now, um, 0:04:14.320 --> 0:04:17.440 so you could lose sight of her pretty quickly. Is 0:04:17.480 --> 0:04:19.159 that I hope that we're looking at up there on 0:04:19.160 --> 0:04:21.400 the top of the hills down where she worked. She 0:04:21.920 --> 0:04:23.880 used to work at that I hoop. It's actually on 0:04:23.920 --> 0:04:26.080 the other side of Cop Parker from here, but yes, 0:04:26.160 --> 0:04:29.719 that's the eyehop for the people who are listening to this, John, 0:04:29.760 --> 0:04:34.120 can you describe what co Parkway is and how big 0:04:34.160 --> 0:04:38.080 it is? Uh? Cup Parkway is uh two lanes south 0:04:38.160 --> 0:04:42.480 and two lanes north with a center turn lane between. Uh. 0:04:42.600 --> 0:04:47.440 So it's a wide state route that comes through Marietta 0:04:48.720 --> 0:04:52.000 and normally there's there's a good bit of traffic on 0:04:52.480 --> 0:04:55.279 on Cob Parker. Part of the case that would have 0:04:55.320 --> 0:04:59.479 been really really good to have is all the video 0:04:59.560 --> 0:05:02.800 from all the his neighboring businesses. UM. I was sure 0:05:02.920 --> 0:05:04.560 that most of them, if not all of them, have 0:05:04.720 --> 0:05:09.120 their own systems. Uh. You're talking about probably twenty twenty 0:05:09.200 --> 0:05:12.120 businesses that we could have gotten footage from, including Chick 0:05:12.160 --> 0:05:15.479 fil a. UM. But the problem that we had is 0:05:15.520 --> 0:05:18.760 the delay in reporting. This happened in mid September and 0:05:18.960 --> 0:05:22.960 was reporting in January, so UH, that time frame pretty 0:05:23.040 --> 0:05:26.680 much absolves the opportunity to get video from these commercial businesses. 0:05:29.160 --> 0:05:32.280 John Dawes brings up one of the biggest obstacles in 0:05:32.279 --> 0:05:36.400 this case, several months went by before Tiffany was actually 0:05:36.440 --> 0:05:40.160 reported missing by her mother, and this created lots of 0:05:40.200 --> 0:05:43.480 different problems for law enforcement in terms of creating an 0:05:43.520 --> 0:05:49.000 accurate timeline and in obtaining surveillance footage from businesses before 0:05:49.160 --> 0:05:52.400 it's erased. So you may be wondering, if a young 0:05:52.440 --> 0:05:56.640 girl ran out towards Cole Parkway, a major thoroughfare in 0:05:56.680 --> 0:05:59.960 a suburb just north of Atlanta, and was never seen again, 0:06:00.400 --> 0:06:03.480 why did it take so long to report her as missing? 0:06:04.560 --> 0:06:08.599 Lisa Daniels, My daughter is Tiffany Witten, who disappeared in 0:06:08.680 --> 0:06:14.600 Marietta from the Walmart on Cole Parkway on September. So 0:06:14.680 --> 0:06:17.719 we just passed the four year mark since anyone last 0:06:17.720 --> 0:06:20.039 saw Tiffany. How oh was your daughter at the time 0:06:20.080 --> 0:06:23.920 for her disappearance? She was where she well, she lived 0:06:23.920 --> 0:06:27.359 in Marietta at the time, um or Powder Spring I 0:06:27.360 --> 0:06:29.440 think it might have been Powder Springs area. It's kind 0:06:29.440 --> 0:06:36.640 of hard to say. She was a little nomadic. She 0:06:37.000 --> 0:06:40.599 was a drug addict, so she moved around, stayed where 0:06:40.600 --> 0:06:43.840 she could. I think was kind of the way most 0:06:43.839 --> 0:06:48.160 of these people, um live is wherever they can find 0:06:48.160 --> 0:06:52.880 a place. She would say to me that she wanted 0:06:52.880 --> 0:06:55.279 to get clean, that she wanted to do better, she 0:06:55.360 --> 0:06:59.440 wanted to be a better person. Um. But she also 0:06:59.560 --> 0:07:01.840 stated to me that the only time she felt normal 0:07:02.279 --> 0:07:04.960 is when she was high, and that was sad to 0:07:05.000 --> 0:07:07.040 me because it made me feel like there was probably 0:07:07.080 --> 0:07:10.840 some underlying mental illness there um that we weren't aware of. 0:07:11.640 --> 0:07:14.560 But we as a family did everything we could to 0:07:14.600 --> 0:07:18.080 try to help her get clean, rehab and just everything 0:07:18.120 --> 0:07:22.000 that we could possibly think of, and nothing seemed to work. 0:07:22.080 --> 0:07:24.880 She get clean for a little while, and then as 0:07:24.920 --> 0:07:27.200 soon as she would run into somebody that had a supply, 0:07:27.440 --> 0:07:34.080 she'd be right back into it. What was her drug 0:07:34.120 --> 0:07:37.760 of choice meth and heroin. I thinks she started out 0:07:37.960 --> 0:07:41.120 like a lot of people do with the opioids. UM, 0:07:41.200 --> 0:07:44.400 it was oxy and then I don't know who introduced 0:07:44.400 --> 0:07:46.720 her to meth, but at some point she was introduced 0:07:46.760 --> 0:07:52.440 to heroin and UM that became probably her primary. So 0:07:52.560 --> 0:07:57.840 what happened that caused the delay in reporting her disappearance, Well, 0:07:57.960 --> 0:08:00.400 like I said, she was nomadic and she did not 0:08:00.480 --> 0:08:03.000 always stay in touch with us, so when she was using, 0:08:04.120 --> 0:08:06.360 we wouldn't hear from her. It could be weeks, it 0:08:06.360 --> 0:08:11.240 could be a couple of months. So initially was I worried, Yeah, 0:08:11.240 --> 0:08:13.720 I worried about her every day, but I wasn't worried 0:08:13.800 --> 0:08:16.560 that she was missing or that something had happened to her. 0:08:16.600 --> 0:08:18.840 I was used to not hearing for her from her 0:08:18.880 --> 0:08:21.400 for a couple of months. But when the holidays came 0:08:21.440 --> 0:08:23.960 around and I didn't hear from her at all, that 0:08:24.080 --> 0:08:28.200 was not That was not normal. And um so after 0:08:28.240 --> 0:08:31.400 the holidays we did go down and follow missing person's report. 0:08:32.559 --> 0:08:37.160 To Lisa, this was an abnormal behavior. Admittedly, she'd got 0:08:37.200 --> 0:08:39.600 as long as two months without hearing from Tiffany before, 0:08:40.200 --> 0:08:42.800 but after that time had gone by and the holidays 0:08:42.800 --> 0:08:45.520 came and went, Lisa felt this had escalated past typical 0:08:45.600 --> 0:08:49.760 drug user behavior. Tiffany was last seen in September. Lisa 0:08:49.800 --> 0:08:55.320 reported her missing in January. It's bizarre. It's bizarre. Pretty 0:08:55.360 --> 0:08:58.199 much my entire high school has either you know, I'm 0:08:58.200 --> 0:09:02.760 graduating class is either guy d of whole in some 0:09:02.880 --> 0:09:06.840 sort of treatment or recovery or legal consequences. But no 0:09:06.920 --> 0:09:11.200 one's ever just disappeared. This is Aaron Warren, a close 0:09:11.240 --> 0:09:14.000 friend of Tiffany's. You know a few of us have 0:09:14.120 --> 0:09:16.920 gone missing from time to time, because we're out there 0:09:16.920 --> 0:09:21.480 in active addiction. I did myself, but you eventually reach surface. 0:09:22.760 --> 0:09:25.080 She's known Tiffany for a long time and could offer 0:09:25.120 --> 0:09:28.520 perspective on the drug addiction that apparently ran Tiffany's life. 0:09:29.280 --> 0:09:32.240 Aaron can talk about Tiffany's addiction because she can relate. 0:09:32.800 --> 0:09:36.160 But when the time came and Aaron got clean, Tiffany didn't, 0:09:36.760 --> 0:09:39.200 and that caused them to drift apart. So I've known 0:09:39.280 --> 0:09:44.640 Tiffany actually since middle school, and we've been you know, friends, 0:09:44.640 --> 0:09:47.760 on and off throughout middle school. And when I say 0:09:47.800 --> 0:09:52.920 on an office, you know, I'm I'm in recovering myself. 0:09:53.000 --> 0:09:56.599 So you know, addiction takes you different places and you 0:09:56.640 --> 0:10:00.120 don't always hang around the same group of people. But HM, 0:10:01.280 --> 0:10:04.400 any time we were hanging out throughout middle school and 0:10:04.480 --> 0:10:08.120 high school, we were definitely partying together, which I always 0:10:08.160 --> 0:10:12.360 involved alcohol drugs. And then I got sober in TWN 0:10:13.200 --> 0:10:16.440 and not too long after that I reconnected with Tiffany. 0:10:17.800 --> 0:10:21.319 She had gotten out of prison and um, you know 0:10:21.320 --> 0:10:25.280 it was was sober for a period of time, and 0:10:25.360 --> 0:10:30.079 so we attended meetings together and we're once again a 0:10:30.120 --> 0:10:33.520 part of one another's lives, but in a more healthier 0:10:33.720 --> 0:10:39.800 place for each of us. So when she relapsed, you know, 0:10:39.880 --> 0:10:44.679 I I'm still sober today. So I tried to you know, 0:10:44.720 --> 0:10:47.360 and see her at meetings, meet her at meanings and 0:10:47.520 --> 0:10:50.680 tried to talk to her, but she was so strung 0:10:50.720 --> 0:10:53.520 out on meth again, you just couldn't get through to her. 0:10:53.960 --> 0:10:56.440 I don't remember if she you know, maybe she went 0:10:56.480 --> 0:11:00.160 through our side in prison, but I don't recall her 0:11:00.200 --> 0:11:03.600 going to rehab and when she got out, you know, 0:11:03.960 --> 0:11:06.600 at that point, I don't know why she couldn't go 0:11:06.640 --> 0:11:09.800 back home, you know, if she lost custody of her daughter. 0:11:09.840 --> 0:11:13.680 But she was actually living with a a mutual friend 0:11:14.520 --> 0:11:18.000 for a period of time before she relapsed, mutual friend 0:11:18.320 --> 0:11:21.440 that we also went to school with, and then he 0:11:21.720 --> 0:11:24.640 was a member of you know, recovery also at the time. 0:11:25.440 --> 0:11:29.080 I don't think it was that long before her disappearance. 0:11:29.120 --> 0:11:31.839 I'm not sure. I saw her at a at a 0:11:31.920 --> 0:11:37.120 a a meeting and that that that was literally our last, 0:11:37.720 --> 0:11:40.560 my last contact with her. She was so strong out, 0:11:41.480 --> 0:11:44.920 you know, high at that time, very emaciated and finn 0:11:46.640 --> 0:11:51.240 um and and just telling me some crazy story. I 0:11:51.360 --> 0:11:53.760 just asked her, like, do you want help? Are you ready? 0:11:53.800 --> 0:11:56.560 To like come off of the stuff again, because you know, 0:11:56.760 --> 0:11:59.160 I'll help you do that, but I can't like enable 0:11:59.240 --> 0:12:02.120 you because she was needing somewhere to stay. No, was 0:12:02.200 --> 0:12:04.319 kind of the crisis at the moment that she was 0:12:04.360 --> 0:12:08.240 back on drugs. But turns out she's like stolen stuff 0:12:08.280 --> 0:12:11.160 from her roommate who was also a co worker, and 0:12:11.480 --> 0:12:15.000 that's why her her roommate kicked her out. That's the 0:12:15.040 --> 0:12:18.439 same coworker she worked with it uh at I hop 0:12:19.440 --> 0:12:23.240 that's actually been interviewed several times for her story. You know, 0:12:24.160 --> 0:12:27.120 the police report and all that she got fired from 0:12:27.120 --> 0:12:29.719 I Hot for stealing from there too, So you can 0:12:29.760 --> 0:12:32.360 just kind of see her pattern with this. We also 0:12:32.440 --> 0:12:35.800 asked Aaron about Ashley Coddle, Tiffany's boyfriend at the time 0:12:36.160 --> 0:12:38.040 and the last person she was with on the night 0:12:38.160 --> 0:12:41.160 that she disappeared on the surveillance tape footage from Walmart. 0:12:41.280 --> 0:12:47.600 They walk around the store together. He like pulled up 0:12:47.679 --> 0:12:50.240 that night outside of the meeting when I was trying 0:12:50.320 --> 0:12:52.320 to talk to her and ask her she wanted help, 0:12:53.280 --> 0:12:56.800 and he picked her up. Um. I mean I heard 0:12:56.880 --> 0:13:00.320 from people that ran with them that he had very 0:13:00.320 --> 0:13:06.080 bad temper. Sketch absolute sketch. I mean, they're both strung 0:13:06.120 --> 0:13:10.160 out on meth. And you know, anytime anybody's on math, 0:13:10.200 --> 0:13:18.760 they're sketchy, they're flighty shifty. You get this feeling, I'm 0:13:18.800 --> 0:13:21.040 trying to describe it, like when someone's on the math 0:13:21.160 --> 0:13:23.680 and they're in the same room as you. Yeah, it's 0:13:23.720 --> 0:13:27.640 like being around someone who's possessed, Like you instantly feel 0:13:28.480 --> 0:13:30.880 I've got to get away from this person. It's scary, 0:13:30.880 --> 0:13:35.880 it's it's un it's unsettling. And on the inside, if 0:13:35.920 --> 0:13:39.720 you are locked up in Cobb County gel they're always 0:13:39.800 --> 0:13:42.120 a group of tweakers that are locked up in there, 0:13:42.160 --> 0:13:45.280 and all of the gossip, you know what I mean, 0:13:45.320 --> 0:13:47.240 in latest news that goes on in the in the 0:13:47.280 --> 0:13:52.360 meth underworld. So the fact that nobody has come forward 0:13:52.440 --> 0:13:57.200 with information, I mean, I feel like she she she 0:13:57.360 --> 0:14:01.640 has to be dead. I was arrested many times when 0:14:01.640 --> 0:14:05.280 I was an active addiction, and but I would be 0:14:05.360 --> 0:14:08.520 in there with a bunch of the you know, the 0:14:08.520 --> 0:14:11.920 the column tweakers. You know, one time in particular, they 0:14:11.920 --> 0:14:14.920 were talking about, oh, she knows something about the body 0:14:14.960 --> 0:14:18.439 that was done somewhere. Now this is unrelated to Tiffany, 0:14:19.040 --> 0:14:23.320 but you hear you hear the gossip in jail. You 0:14:23.360 --> 0:14:26.040 know what I mean because I've heard it myself as 0:14:26.080 --> 0:14:35.600 an innate. I mean, somebody knows something. It's like, Okay, 0:14:35.680 --> 0:14:38.520 was she picked up in sex traffic? I feel like 0:14:38.600 --> 0:14:41.400 that and and and you know, being killed or the 0:14:41.440 --> 0:14:47.040 two most likely outcomes. Okay. The IHP waitress, the one 0:14:47.040 --> 0:14:51.240 in Marietta that Tiffity worked out, got fired from forestaing. 0:14:52.560 --> 0:14:56.680 I spoke with her, um like, face to face. I 0:14:56.720 --> 0:14:59.080 can't tell you where or when. I mean, it was 0:15:00.280 --> 0:15:03.880 that closer to the times disappeared. And I mean she 0:15:04.000 --> 0:15:08.359 told me straight up, like Ashley came there after her disappearance, 0:15:08.560 --> 0:15:14.720 looking visibly shaken, you know what I mean, like distraught, shifty, 0:15:15.120 --> 0:15:17.760 what you would expect for someone that's til meth. But 0:15:17.840 --> 0:15:21.280 she said like more so and was acting really weird, 0:15:22.400 --> 0:15:28.360 so I mean just her. And then you know, it 0:15:28.480 --> 0:15:30.960 was reported that she said, well, why don't you call 0:15:31.040 --> 0:15:33.000 Tiffany and he pulled out her cell phone and said, 0:15:33.040 --> 0:15:37.640 because I have it. So then if a message wasn't 0:15:38.640 --> 0:15:42.440 a month later to her brother whoever, for Happy Birthday? Okay, 0:15:42.480 --> 0:15:45.840 why the funking that being investigated? Had they looked at 0:15:45.880 --> 0:15:48.080 her phone records, you know what I mean, Like, why 0:15:48.080 --> 0:15:51.720 isn't this stuff being tracked? The birthday message that Aaron 0:15:51.800 --> 0:15:54.000 is referring to is a message that was sent from 0:15:54.000 --> 0:15:59.760 Tiffany's Facebook to her half brother Blake around January. According 0:15:59.800 --> 0:16:02.760 to an interview Blake did in two thousand sixteen, Tiffany 0:16:02.800 --> 0:16:05.520 also called him around his birthday that year, using her 0:16:05.560 --> 0:16:09.600 special nickname for him, Mudbug. Keep in mind, this was 0:16:09.640 --> 0:16:12.760 just about four months since she was last seen. More 0:16:12.760 --> 0:16:16.440 on this later. When you have two drug addicts in 0:16:16.480 --> 0:16:21.800 a relationship, the codependence is so strong that you're not 0:16:21.840 --> 0:16:25.240 going to separate no matter what. So for the fact 0:16:25.320 --> 0:16:28.200 that actually claims she just disappeared into the night, I 0:16:28.240 --> 0:16:34.480 don't fucking believe. You know, toxic codependent relationships just as 0:16:34.520 --> 0:16:38.040 strong as drugs and alcohol. The effect is the same 0:16:38.080 --> 0:16:42.360 for someone, you know what I mean. So if you're 0:16:42.360 --> 0:16:45.080 in that type of relationship and you have to have 0:16:45.320 --> 0:16:48.320 that person to be okay, you're not gonna let them 0:16:48.320 --> 0:16:55.320 wander off into the night. There's just not Because humans, individually, 0:16:55.440 --> 0:17:02.600 we're we're can be unpredictable to an extent, But when 0:17:02.640 --> 0:17:06.600 you add drugs into the months, there's no way to 0:17:06.600 --> 0:17:10.560 predict outcomes. When Lisa found out that her daughter was 0:17:10.600 --> 0:17:13.520 shoplifting for the Walmart at the time she disappeared, her 0:17:13.560 --> 0:17:16.320 first thought was that maybe she was laying low knowing 0:17:16.359 --> 0:17:19.080 she was in trouble. It didn't seem like such a 0:17:19.119 --> 0:17:22.639 crazy idea, especially given the crowd Tiffany ran with and 0:17:22.680 --> 0:17:26.320 her obvious drug usage. On that night, Mason Paine and 0:17:26.359 --> 0:17:28.879 I went to visit Lisa and talk with her about 0:17:28.880 --> 0:17:32.080 her daughter's case. As part of Lisa's effort not to 0:17:32.160 --> 0:17:35.040 let this case rest, she never turns down any interview 0:17:35.280 --> 0:17:39.640 or opportunity to speak about Tiffany. There's no evidence that. 0:17:39.720 --> 0:17:45.520 I mean, initially, my thought was I was suspicious of him. Initially, however, 0:17:46.359 --> 0:17:50.760 I did think, well, you know, she she did get 0:17:50.760 --> 0:17:53.560 caught shop loveding. She knows she's going to be in trouble. 0:17:54.880 --> 0:17:57.560 So my initial thought, like I said to you before, 0:17:57.720 --> 0:18:01.320 was she's laying low, she's out with one of her friends. 0:18:02.720 --> 0:18:05.920 She just she doesn't want to face the music. Um. 0:18:06.080 --> 0:18:10.239 Then I started thinking, what has something happened? What if 0:18:10.240 --> 0:18:14.200 she ran behind behind Sam's and she fell, she got hurt, 0:18:14.480 --> 0:18:17.400 she you know, hit her head, something happened back there. 0:18:18.240 --> 0:18:22.560 And but they've searched all back there and nothing. So, um, 0:18:22.640 --> 0:18:26.280 I don't think that any anything happened in that immediate area. 0:18:26.680 --> 0:18:31.320 I do believe and have always believed, that they somehow 0:18:31.480 --> 0:18:34.399 met back up that night, whether it was you know, 0:18:34.560 --> 0:18:38.639 around that area, maybe at one Stein's. He lived close by. 0:18:38.880 --> 0:18:40.879 She knew a lot of people in the area. You know. 0:18:40.920 --> 0:18:43.360 I told Tom when we first met, and I think 0:18:43.400 --> 0:18:45.440 the first day that we met, you know, I said, 0:18:45.720 --> 0:18:47.240 you look out that one I said, look out that 0:18:47.280 --> 0:18:49.160 window right behind us. What do you see out there? 0:18:49.720 --> 0:18:52.280 He said, trees? Woods, And I said, you know what 0:18:52.400 --> 0:18:56.200 I see somewhere? My daughter could be everywhere I look 0:18:56.280 --> 0:18:59.200 every time I go to the lake, you know, I'm i'm. 0:18:59.280 --> 0:19:00.800 We went to the lake one day. This was the 0:19:00.840 --> 0:19:03.520 first summer that we had our boat, and we were 0:19:03.560 --> 0:19:05.800 in a cove close to Bethany Bridge as a matter 0:19:05.800 --> 0:19:08.159 of fact, and we were pulling up anchor to go 0:19:08.240 --> 0:19:11.239 back to the marina, and the anchor was stuck and 0:19:11.280 --> 0:19:13.840 so my husband's you know, pulling and tugg and he said, oh, 0:19:13.840 --> 0:19:17.680 there's something on the anchor. And then my daughter says, um, 0:19:18.320 --> 0:19:22.399 I hope it's not a body. And immediately I thought, 0:19:23.240 --> 0:19:29.800 would that be the craziest thing. I mean, crazy doesn't 0:19:29.800 --> 0:19:32.640 even begin to describe it. But I cannot even tell 0:19:32.640 --> 0:19:34.879 you how sick I felt when he was pulling on 0:19:34.960 --> 0:19:37.320 that rope to see what was at the other end. 0:19:37.600 --> 0:19:40.040 It was an anchor. It was another anchor that we 0:19:40.160 --> 0:19:42.440 pulled up with, you know, part of a rope on it. 0:19:42.560 --> 0:19:44.879 But my gut tells me that she hit out for 0:19:44.880 --> 0:19:47.639 a little while until the police were gone. You know, 0:19:47.760 --> 0:19:50.680 she ran over behind Sam's. They did not give chase, 0:19:50.760 --> 0:19:52.760 They did not take off after her. They had her first, 0:19:52.760 --> 0:19:56.840 they knew who she was. So my gut instinct is 0:19:56.880 --> 0:19:59.600 that she hit out for a while until you know 0:19:59.680 --> 0:20:02.920 that he was off, so to speak. And then when 0:20:03.320 --> 0:20:05.840 Ashley came back to get that truck, she was she 0:20:05.960 --> 0:20:08.320 was in it or buy it or near it, or 0:20:09.800 --> 0:20:13.040 she was there. They they hooked back up that night. 0:20:13.080 --> 0:20:16.400 I have no doubt about that. The truth never changes. 0:20:16.960 --> 0:20:20.400 So if, if truly she ran out of that Walmart 0:20:20.520 --> 0:20:23.200 and he never laid eyes on her again, why he 0:20:23.320 --> 0:20:26.480 told people, Oh yes, she got arrested, Oh yes, she 0:20:26.520 --> 0:20:29.640 went to rehab. Oh yeah, we were arguing and she 0:20:29.880 --> 0:20:32.240 you know, she walked off and I don't know where 0:20:32.280 --> 0:20:38.040 she went. There's no reason to lie unless something happened 0:20:38.040 --> 0:20:39.800 that he doesn't want anyone to know about. There's no 0:20:39.840 --> 0:20:42.320 other reason to lie. I mean, if he had, if 0:20:42.320 --> 0:20:45.439 he had stuck with the same story that I swear 0:20:45.520 --> 0:20:49.000 to you, she ran out the door. I did not 0:20:49.119 --> 0:20:52.960 see her again period. So you can ask me, you know, 0:20:53.640 --> 0:20:56.280 any way you want, or try to trip me up 0:20:56.359 --> 0:20:59.080 or I never saw her again. He but he hasn't 0:20:59.119 --> 0:21:03.760 done that. He hasn't done that. I mean he's kind 0:21:03.760 --> 0:21:07.119 of doing that now because he's on the hot seat. 0:21:07.200 --> 0:21:09.760 But he didn't do that in the beginning. I did 0:21:09.840 --> 0:21:12.000 not get a lot of cooperation in the beginning on 0:21:12.040 --> 0:21:15.840 this case. And you probably saw that with Chase Master's 0:21:15.880 --> 0:21:19.360 case as well. It was the yeah, so if you're 0:21:19.400 --> 0:21:22.080 not a if you're not a you know, blonde hair, 0:21:22.160 --> 0:21:26.479 blue eye, co ed um or a child obviously you know, 0:21:26.520 --> 0:21:29.560 any child, they're gonna go looking for. But the bottom line, 0:21:29.560 --> 0:21:31.400 and it was the same thing I had told my mom, 0:21:31.400 --> 0:21:33.600 And what mom, you know, I don't know about following 0:21:33.600 --> 0:21:37.800 a missing person report. She's gone off the grid like 0:21:37.920 --> 0:21:40.520 this before for a couple of months where she didn't 0:21:40.640 --> 0:21:42.919 when she's using she didn't want to talk to her family. 0:21:43.080 --> 0:21:44.679 She didn't want to talk to anybody who was going 0:21:44.760 --> 0:21:47.320 to try to push her to rehab or you know, 0:21:47.400 --> 0:21:52.080 try to do anything to get her off of that path. So, um, 0:21:52.119 --> 0:21:55.680 maybe two months, maybe two months. So you know that 0:21:55.680 --> 0:21:57.720 that part of it was not out of the ordinary, 0:21:57.760 --> 0:22:00.119 and it wasn't really until we got those letters we 0:22:00.240 --> 0:22:04.080 found out that, you know, the Walmart incident had happened, 0:22:04.560 --> 0:22:07.440 that we really began to think, Okay, there's something more 0:22:07.480 --> 0:22:12.000 to this. But even still, I'm thinking, Okay, she's on parole, 0:22:12.440 --> 0:22:16.520 she just got cop shoplifting. Put two and two together, 0:22:17.080 --> 0:22:18.880 and I said, if I go, if I go down 0:22:18.880 --> 0:22:21.440 to the police department and follow this in person report, 0:22:21.480 --> 0:22:24.480 they are gonna laugh me out the door. And um, 0:22:24.560 --> 0:22:26.960 and you know, of course I did feel that way. 0:22:26.960 --> 0:22:30.080 And of course I look back on it now and think, God, 0:22:30.160 --> 0:22:32.520 your dumbass. You know, maybe if you had gone sooner, 0:22:32.600 --> 0:22:34.680 they would have video from the parking lot that. I mean, 0:22:34.680 --> 0:22:37.440 I'd beat myself up every day for that. I can't 0:22:37.480 --> 0:22:40.240 but I can't change that, so I have to move 0:22:40.280 --> 0:22:42.679 on from that. But when I did go, and then 0:22:42.720 --> 0:22:45.880 when I did press the detective, and and the detective 0:22:45.880 --> 0:22:48.000 call and said, yeah, We're we're not even gonna open 0:22:48.320 --> 0:22:50.600 We're not going to open an investigation on this. She's 0:22:50.640 --> 0:22:57.879 just hiding out. She'll she'll turn up. Correct. That was 0:22:58.040 --> 0:23:06.000 in UM. It was in Janue, weary of fourteen, well, September, October, November, December, 0:23:06.040 --> 0:23:12.960 jam four months. You know, she she's on paroll, she 0:23:12.960 --> 0:23:16.760 she was shoplifting, She's in trouble, she's just hiding out. She'll, 0:23:16.840 --> 0:23:20.840 she'll turn up. Yeah. I started calling people. I just 0:23:20.880 --> 0:23:23.440 started calling. I went up the chain at Mary Att 0:23:23.440 --> 0:23:27.800 a p D. And UM was actually called the Chief's 0:23:27.800 --> 0:23:30.680 office and his assistant was amazing and gave me every 0:23:30.760 --> 0:23:32.480 name and number of people I needed to call, and 0:23:32.520 --> 0:23:34.520 she said, if you don't get any satisfaction there, then 0:23:34.560 --> 0:23:36.800 you call me back and I'll make sure that you 0:23:37.040 --> 0:23:40.600 get to talk with Chief Flynn and UM. So I 0:23:40.840 --> 0:23:42.520 went up the chain, and then I got a call 0:23:42.720 --> 0:23:49.439 from a major who UM who basically was not was 0:23:49.480 --> 0:23:55.359 not very nice. He basically told me, we don't even 0:23:55.400 --> 0:24:00.280 know that UM who has jurisdiction on this. And I said, 0:24:00.000 --> 0:24:02.840 and I know who has jurisdiction because it's the last 0:24:02.840 --> 0:24:06.320 place that she was seen and it was in your city. Well, 0:24:06.520 --> 0:24:09.240 she was in our city committing a crime. I really 0:24:09.280 --> 0:24:11.679 don't care what she was doing. Um, she was in 0:24:11.720 --> 0:24:15.840 your city and she's missing. It does not matter what 0:24:15.880 --> 0:24:18.119 she was doing when she went missing. The fact is 0:24:18.200 --> 0:24:22.000 she's missing, and it is your jurisdiction. And um. During 0:24:22.000 --> 0:24:24.240 the course of the conversation, I realized he had mentioned 0:24:24.240 --> 0:24:27.359 that he had a daughter, and I think he has 0:24:27.480 --> 0:24:29.960 to actually, but he had mentioned something about having a daughter, 0:24:30.000 --> 0:24:32.120 and I said, I said, so, I'm just gonna ask 0:24:32.119 --> 0:24:35.680 you this. Um, you mentioned you have a daughter. I said, 0:24:35.720 --> 0:24:39.320 if she went missing, regardless of the circumstances, would you 0:24:39.359 --> 0:24:42.560 not move heaven and earth to find her? And it 0:24:42.680 --> 0:24:46.160 was just complete silence, and he said, I'll be back 0:24:46.200 --> 0:24:48.359 in touch with you. Then he hung up the phone. 0:24:48.400 --> 0:24:50.600