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Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Molly John Fast and this is Fast Politics,

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Speaker 1: where we discussed the top political headlines with some of

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Speaker 1: today's best minds. More than half of the performers at

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Speaker 1: Trump's Freedom two hundred and fifty celebration have pulled out

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Speaker 1: of their appearances. We have such a great show for

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Speaker 1: you today. Katie Fang joins us to talk about her

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Speaker 1: lawsuit to get more of the Epstein files released, as

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Speaker 1: well as the latest in Trump's vendetta against Egene Carroll.

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Speaker 1: And then we'll talk to Wired's Daniel Bogus Law about

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Speaker 1: the DOJ going after anti Data center activists.

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Speaker 2: But first the news, Miley, the slush fund. Everyone loves

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Speaker 2: the big, beautiful slush fund, except for this judge that

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Speaker 2: just blocked it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So here's what's going on. Donald Trump has a guy

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Speaker 1: called Todd Blanche who was his lawyer and now runs

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Speaker 1: the DOJ, and he is just making shit up for

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Speaker 1: my man, Donald Trump. And one of the things he's

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Speaker 1: made up so that there's going to be a seventeen

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Speaker 1: seventy six slush fund for people who Donald Trump wants

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Speaker 1: to get money to because he feels that they have

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Speaker 1: been victimized by woke woke being crimes they did. So anyway,

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Speaker 1: a judge has said no dice. And by the way,

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Speaker 1: what's going to happen. A lot of the stories we

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Speaker 1: have today are things that are going to go up

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Speaker 1: to different judges and eventually go to the Supreme Court,

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Speaker 1: where everyone but Alito and Thomas, or as we call

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Speaker 1: them Fox News and Fox News are going to vote

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Speaker 1: that they can't keep going so a slush fund. This

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Speaker 1: is just not how the law works, and I think

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Speaker 1: this is not going to go anywhere for Trump.

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Speaker 2: We were discussing this off air, but I think that

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Speaker 2: there's fartu many politicians who see this as their kingmaker

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Speaker 2: moment to get this slush fund killed. That somebody will

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Speaker 2: find a way to do the maneuver to make sure

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Speaker 2: this doesn't happen.

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Speaker 1: I mean, there are two things happening here. One is

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Speaker 1: that there's no president. All this stuff is just made

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Speaker 1: up shit, right, Like we're going to make a slush

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Speaker 1: fun for people we don't you know who have been victimized.

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's like these are Donald Trump sickophans trying

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Speaker 1: to get closer to their guy by cooking up insane

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Speaker 1: ways to help him. That may or may not be legal,

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Speaker 1: and this is one of those insane ways to help him.

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Speaker 1: And look, by the way, this could end up like

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Speaker 1: funding paramilitary I mean, it's just a crazy way to

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Speaker 1: do things. And I don't think it won't work for them.

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Speaker 1: I think even the Supreme Court will be like mm.

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Speaker 2: So we've all been baffled about why we rushed into

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Speaker 2: a war in the Middle East after apparently Donald Trump

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Speaker 2: was so against these wars he knew they were foolish.

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Speaker 2: We're starting to get another hint about what's happening here

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Speaker 2: as we're seeing that someone sees Aran as primarial estate.

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Speaker 2: Who do you think that person would be.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to go with the president's son in law,

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Speaker 1: who is very into building. So basically, Donald Trump's son

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Speaker 1: in law and his friend Steve Wikoff are negotiating these

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Speaker 1: peace treaties. Why no one knows it's totally again, this

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Speaker 1: is a completely you know, Donald Trump has just like

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Speaker 1: put his hand on a rock and said he could

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Speaker 1: do something. And Jared Kushner, by the way, does not

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Speaker 1: serve in the government, has no like State Department training,

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Speaker 1: nothing like that. And who also, you know, his training

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Speaker 1: is in real estate developer and having rich parents. So

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Speaker 1: since his training is in real estate developer and having

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Speaker 1: rich parents, he decided that he would like to include

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Speaker 1: in the Iranian peace deal real estate project. So again,

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Speaker 1: like Donald Trump really wants to get this war over,

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Speaker 1: and one of the ways he is doing it is

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Speaker 1: basically it's just going to pay the Iranians to make

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Speaker 1: a deal, and in it there is going to include

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Speaker 1: some real estate provisions for are the Trump baron?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: I mean, isn't that what we're talking about here? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: I mean it basically seems like this is as usual,

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Speaker 2: another way that they found scheme. I mean, I think

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Speaker 2: like even if this isn't why we entered the war,

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Speaker 2: what happens to everything in Trump's life is at some

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Speaker 2: point they go, how can we scheme with it? He

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Speaker 2: starts making stock trades whatever it is, it's how do

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Speaker 2: we keep scheming?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it is kleptocrat's got a cleft and this administration

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Speaker 1: loves to cleft. And so we have the presidents and

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Speaker 1: in law considering creating a massive investment fund for Iran.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, real putent playbook here.

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Speaker 1: Like this week we learned the Board of Peace has

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Speaker 1: no dollars and no sense. There's just so much bullshit

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Speaker 1: coming out of this administration. It's hard to keep it straight.

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Speaker 2: So a US judge is allowing Trump's mail and Voting

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Speaker 2: executive order to stand.

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Speaker 1: We talked about that offline, you and I because we're

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Speaker 1: talking about like this is another thing where it's going

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Speaker 1: to just go to a higher court and it's going

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Speaker 1: to go to another court. But I think it's important.

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Speaker 1: You know, so many of Trump's executive orders don't go anywhere,

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Speaker 1: don't do anything, or just like pr just like things

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Speaker 1: he does to get attention or you know, things he

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Speaker 1: does to make the base happy. Executive orders aren't you know,

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Speaker 1: there's just a lot of bullshit in them. But this

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Speaker 1: I think is important because basically what he wants is

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Speaker 1: in It's an order directed the administration to drop a

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Speaker 1: list of US citizens eligible to vote in each state

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Speaker 1: and deliver balots only to those on the list. So

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Speaker 1: again it's a solution without a problem. Non citizen voting

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Speaker 1: is like vanishingly rare, does not happen. But part of

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Speaker 1: it is to make it harder for people to vote.

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Speaker 1: And like there's always a there are any number of

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Speaker 1: errors could happen, right, you send it to the wrong person,

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Speaker 1: somebody's moved. I mean, the point here is to make

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Speaker 1: it harder to do mail and voting. I think what's

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Speaker 1: stupid about this is I'm not sure Donald Trump understands that.

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Speaker 1: A lot of time his people mail and vote just

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Speaker 1: as much as Democrats do. So I mean, I think

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Speaker 1: it's kind of stupid, but it definitely is. That's something

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Speaker 1: we're seeing. So the idea that if you're winning, you're

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Speaker 1: not making it harder for people to vote, Like the

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Speaker 1: fact that Trump is so committed to trying to make

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Speaker 1: it harder for people to vote, is a really good

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Speaker 1: sign that he knows he's losing.

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Speaker 2: Agreed. So one of the reasons Trump's losing is that

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Speaker 2: laser focus on affordability. He's just always thinking about delivering

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Speaker 2: for the American citizen. I mean, like, my.

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Speaker 1: Man just wants to deliver for the American people. That's

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Speaker 1: all he cares about.

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Speaker 2: So a clear sign of what a great job he's

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Speaker 2: doing on this delivering is that one of the jobs

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Speaker 2: that when somebody's dissatisfied with their career, they always go, Okay,

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Speaker 2: it's time for me to make money. I'm going to

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Speaker 2: go into real estate. Well guess what real estate to

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Speaker 2: day are quitting the housing market after for four years

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Speaker 2: it's not been going so well, but now it's gotten

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Speaker 2: so bad. Even the last holdouts are saying, mercy, yea,

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Speaker 2: this is.

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Speaker 1: The stuff we're seeing. This is like I remember the

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Speaker 1: two thousand and eight financial crisis, Like we are just

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Speaker 1: cruising towards a financial crisis and stuff like the real

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Speaker 1: estate market being soft, people quitting. And here's why people

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Speaker 1: are quitting the real estate stuff. It's because interest rates

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Speaker 1: are not going down. And you know why interest rates

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Speaker 1: aren't going down, It's because inflation is staying high. And

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Speaker 1: do you know why inflation is staying high Because Donald

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Speaker 1: Trump went to war in the Middle East and it

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Speaker 1: made gas prices a dollar and a half more per gallon,

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Speaker 1: and so everything is more expensive still, and that is

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Speaker 1: why we are here in this insane inflationary moment. And

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Speaker 1: so it is, you know, it's drag on the economy.

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Speaker 1: People don't want to pay more for their mortgages. They

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Speaker 1: don't want to buy their buy and sell hal because

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Speaker 1: it costs more to get a mortgage, and so people

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Speaker 1: are quitting being real estate agents because the job gets

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Speaker 1: harder and harder. And this is a really good example

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Speaker 1: of how trump Ism has, like all these second order

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Speaker 1: effects like fucking up the economy, growing the debt, and

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Speaker 1: now doing a war for no reason, gets us to

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Speaker 1: where we are right now, which is this.

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Speaker 2: You know, Gladimir Prutin has this famous quote that says,

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Speaker 2: I don't understand the American economy. They just sell houses

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Speaker 2: to each other back and forth. Now we're not even

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Speaker 2: doing that anymore.

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Speaker 1: Yes, it's very sad. Katie Fang is the host of

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Speaker 1: the official Katie Fang YouTube channel. Welcome, Welcome, Katie Fang. Hello,

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Speaker 1: we're back. We're going I We're.

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Speaker 4: Back the dynamic too.

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Speaker 1: That's right. Let's start by talking about you and your lawsuit,

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Speaker 1: and then we'll talk about the law, which you know

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Speaker 1: a lot about and I know much less about. Tell

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Speaker 1: us about this lawsuit.

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Speaker 5: I sued Acting Attorney General Todd Lanch just a few

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Speaker 5: weeks ago, end of April, although it feels like it

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Speaker 5: was just a few weeks ago, but it's actually a

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Speaker 5: month ago.

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Speaker 4: And I sue.

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Speaker 5: It's the very first lawsuit ever pursuing into the Epstein

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Speaker 5: Files Transparency Act. If you look at the law, the

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Speaker 5: law itself has drafted doesn't provide for private causes of action.

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Speaker 5: But I've alleged that Todd Lanch the Department of Justice

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Speaker 5: and candidly have told people this before it was Todd,

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Speaker 5: it was Pami Joe with the bad hair, so her

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Speaker 5: name was the defendant until she got her ass fired.

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Speaker 5: And so I sued because as an independent journalist with

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Speaker 5: these illegal and improper reactions, I can't continue to report

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Speaker 5: to my fewer subscribers, readers, whatever. They can't get more

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Speaker 5: information if I can't get more information.

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Speaker 4: And it's very clear.

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Speaker 5: That the law didn't allow for the Department of Justice

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Speaker 5: to do the reactions that it has done, and a

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Speaker 5: lot of the machinations that it's jumped to do to

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Speaker 5: be able to protect the Epstein elite.

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Speaker 4: And then just right now breaking news.

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Speaker 5: Here at Fast Politics, I have filed a motion for

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Speaker 5: preliminary injunction, which is asking the judge in this case,

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Speaker 5: which is a federal accord in DC, to actually expedite

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Speaker 5: the timeline when it comes to five specific violations of

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Speaker 5: the Epstein Files Transparency Act, because they are some of

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Speaker 5: the most egregious violations on their face. Number one and

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Speaker 5: number two like truly indefensible.

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Speaker 1: But what can you explain what those five are.

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Speaker 3: Yeah.

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Speaker 5: Absolutely so the first one is, and I gave examples

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Speaker 5: as attachments are specific emails where the DOJ has redacted

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Speaker 5: the names of senders and recipients, right, okay, And if

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Speaker 5: you look at the law, they're not allowed to do

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Speaker 5: that at the DOJ. And I'm going to pull up

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Speaker 5: just a couple of examples that I think that you

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Speaker 5: would in folks tuning in, would understand why it is

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Speaker 5: so egregious. For example, there's a March eleventh, twenty fourteen

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Speaker 5: email to Jeffrey Epstein that says, quote, thank you for

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Speaker 5: a fun night.

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Speaker 4: Your littlest girl was a little naughty.

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Speaker 1: Right, I remember, that's just.

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Speaker 5: Disgusting, right, But why would Blanche, Why would the DOJ

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Speaker 5: redact the sender's name and email?

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Speaker 1: Right?

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Speaker 5: Why unless you're trying to protect that person and the

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Speaker 5: law explicitly says the Transparency Act, you can't spare somebody

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Speaker 5: the embarrassment. Maybe even this person is also a perpetrator,

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Speaker 5: Maybe they are a co conspirator.

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Speaker 4: But I don't know, Molly, do you No, No, we

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Speaker 4: don't know.

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Speaker 5: Because it's been improperly and illegally redacted by the DOJ.

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Speaker 5: And so that's just one example of the most egregious

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Speaker 5: violations when it comes to the improper redaction of senders

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Speaker 5: and recipients names and emails throughout the.

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Speaker 4: Course of the drop that they did. Right of all

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Speaker 4: these documents.

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Speaker 1: Another great that's a great example on its case. Right,

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Speaker 1: it's just because it's so clearly the even it so

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Speaker 1: clearly implies if not right, there's an implication of something untoward,

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Speaker 1: and so it's reacted with no reason. Yeah, exactly.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, And so the Polmary injunction is asking the court

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Speaker 5: on a speedier basis instead of like trying to wait

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Speaker 5: for the entirety of my lawsuit to kind of come

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Speaker 5: to conclusion, to like, hey, make Blanche at a minimum

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Speaker 5: have to address something like this.

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Speaker 4: Right that, that's an example.

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Speaker 5: And then another area of very obvious violations that should

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Speaker 5: be cured immediately is there's two internal Department of Justice

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Speaker 5: documents that were a part of the Southern District of Florida,

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Speaker 5: which chose elected intentionally not to prosecute Epstein and instead

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Speaker 5: he got that sweetheart plea deal he got that also

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Speaker 5: resulted in that non prosecution agreement. And in each of

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Speaker 5: these two internal DOJ documents, the first one is the

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Speaker 5: draft indictment that an Ausa Maria Viafana was pushing, pushing

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Speaker 5: Acosta to get And so this is.

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Speaker 1: The original ADA who had been working on the case

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Speaker 1: and who was hoping to find justice for these victims.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, and by all accounts, and even if you read

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Speaker 5: the Office of Professional Conduct and Responsibility kind of memo,

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Speaker 5: she really wanted to present this to the grand jury

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Speaker 5: and let the chips fall where they may, right, you know,

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Speaker 5: present this and see what a grand jury thought. And

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Speaker 5: it was a multi count, sixty something page indictment. And

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Speaker 5: in the draft indictment, the very first page, as you

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Speaker 5: and I and others know that are tuning in, it

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Speaker 5: clearly says United States of America right versus.

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Speaker 1: And then it.

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Speaker 4: Actually shows the names of a defend or defendants. And

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Speaker 4: in this instance you.

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Speaker 5: Have four names that are redacted from that cover page.

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Speaker 5: Why those are those would have been co defendants of

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Speaker 5: Jeffrey Epstein in the present in the presentment to the

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Speaker 5: grand jury, and yet the DJ has redacted those names.

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Speaker 5: Who are you sparing from exposure?

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Speaker 1: Why protecting?

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Speaker 4: Who are you protecting?

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Speaker 5: And then there was an accompanying legal memorandum that this

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Speaker 5: AUSA prepared that was also like seventy pages long and

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Speaker 5: went through all of the legal theories of how there

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Speaker 5: was exposure here and how there were criminal laws that

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Speaker 5: were violated federally by Epstein and others. And at the

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Speaker 5: very end there's a conclusion paragraph Molly, and it says,

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Speaker 5: and this is who should be charged, Jeffrey Epstein, and

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Speaker 5: then four blanked out names, four redacted names, and then

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Speaker 5: it goes on to say, Molly, and we should not

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Speaker 5: allow Epstein to have the opportunity to speak with our

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Speaker 5: office before we achieve this and obtain this indictment against him,

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Speaker 5: because he is an explicitly horrible flight risk. I mean,

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Speaker 5: how bad does this person have to be? And yet

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Speaker 5: he ended up getting that sweetheart plea deal. So part

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Speaker 5: of what I'm asking for is redact the names of

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Speaker 5: those codefendants that would have been part of this indictment

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Speaker 5: according to the Southern District of Florida. And then the

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Speaker 5: other example, which is also shoot very big, is we

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Speaker 5: know that there are allegations against Donald Trump that a

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Speaker 5: woman but then thirteen year old girl has alleged that

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Speaker 5: she was sexually assaulted and physically.

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Speaker 4: Battered by Donald Trump.

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Speaker 5: And there were four interviews done by the FBI with

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Speaker 5: this victim, and the four reports they're called three twos,

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Speaker 5: These interview.

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Speaker 1: Reports Ryane have disappeared.

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Speaker 4: They three of them.

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Speaker 5: One of them was dropped in December of twenty twenty five.

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Speaker 4: The other three we knew existed.

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Speaker 5: It took a lot of people like Roger Sollenberger and

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Speaker 5: other in the media to say, hey, where are they?

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Speaker 5: We eventually got those other three, But then Molly in the.

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Speaker 4: Epstein files, what I've seen is a list.

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Speaker 5: It was like a spreadsheet that shows what the United

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Speaker 5: States government turned over to the legal defense team for

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Speaker 5: Glenn Maxwell. And if you look at the allegations involving

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Speaker 5: this thirteen year old girl, there's the four three twos,

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Speaker 5: the four.

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Speaker 4: Times that she was interviewed.

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Speaker 5: But there's also four sets of interview notes by these

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Speaker 5: agents that accompanied and those have never been turned over

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Speaker 5: to the public.

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Speaker 1: But they have been turned over to Glaine Maxwell's which

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Speaker 1: is a little bit strange, right that they would be

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Speaker 1: turned over to Gallaine Maxwell's lawyers but not to the public, right.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, And there was nothing in the law that said that, oh, well,

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Speaker 5: if you gave it to Glenn Maxwell, we can't give

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Speaker 5: it to you, it doesn't exist. And then the last

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Speaker 5: two areas of my motion for preliminary injunction are really.

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Speaker 4: Obvious on their face.

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Speaker 5: Todd Blanche refused to translate or interpret foreign language documents

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Speaker 5: that were uncovered. But we know that Epstein had an

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Speaker 5: international sex trafficking ring, so why and you want to

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Speaker 5: always excuse it's just not practicable, so we're not going

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Speaker 5: to do it.

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Speaker 1: Right, easy for him, easy, busy.

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Speaker 4: And then the last one is very obvious too.

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Speaker 5: The law says that if you redact anything at the DOJ,

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Speaker 5: you have to actually create a log of everything that

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Speaker 5: you have redacted, and you actually have to record it

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Speaker 5: with the Federal Register. And Blanche and the DJ's never

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Speaker 5: done it. So I can't even tell you, Molly, what

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Speaker 5: is missing, because he'd never bothered to tell me what

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Speaker 5: was missing. I can only just see it with my

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Speaker 5: eyes when I see something blacked out. So those are

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Speaker 5: the five areas that I'm asking this federal judge to

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Speaker 5: force them at a minimum while this case is pending,

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Speaker 5: because they're very time sensitive, right, I'm like, hurry up

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Speaker 5: and make the DOJ do this.

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Speaker 4: And so I just filed that today.

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Speaker 1: That's amazing and I think important. And the truth is,

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Speaker 1: I wonder if Thomas Massey's office could be helpful with.

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Speaker 5: That too, you would think, especially now, right, I mean

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Speaker 5: especially now that he get zero FS to give. Right,

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Speaker 5: it's like him and Tillis and Cassidy and others on

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Speaker 5: their way out.

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Speaker 4: It's like, just drop the bomb and walk away to go.

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Speaker 1: So let's talk about there's a lot of malfeasance going

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Speaker 1: on in Trump world right now, a lot of stuff

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Speaker 1: that certainly seems like they're floating different revenge strategies. So

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Speaker 1: let's talk about Egene Carroll. Yes, yesterday I talked to

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Speaker 1: Egene Carroll World and I was told that they were

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Speaker 1: going after her, and that was the reporting that CNN

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Speaker 1: died too. Now it seems as if the Trump DOJ

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Speaker 1: is backing down.

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Speaker 4: Well, it's weird. I will say.

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Speaker 5: I saw the public statement that the US attorney in Chicago,

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Speaker 5: Molly He gave a public comment and it's and there's

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Speaker 5: a lot of US former prosecutors and lawyers were dissecting

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Speaker 5: it because we think it was carefully worded. And if

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Speaker 5: you look at that statement from Andrew Boutrose, who's the

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Speaker 5: US attorney in Chicago, who just lost that Broadview sixth

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Speaker 5: case because.

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Speaker 1: Of last week.

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Speaker 5: Yes, like he basically this week's wrongdoing is you know,

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Speaker 5: so is this guy just the.

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Speaker 1: Last week's case? What did he do to the jury

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Speaker 1: that constituted malfeasance or what was done?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 5: So, grand juries, as you know, have such a level

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Speaker 5: of confidentiality and secrecy that that remains sacricynct. In fact,

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Speaker 5: judges won't allow us to pierce that veil of confidentiality.

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Speaker 5: There's unless it's absent extraordinary circumstances. And yet on more

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Speaker 5: than one occasion with this Trump DOJ, a federal judge

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Speaker 5: has ordered that to happen. The first example was when

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Speaker 5: it was Lindsay Halligan in the Eastern District of Virginia

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Speaker 5: in the James Comy case, where we learned that when

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Speaker 5: she presented to the grand jury in order to secure

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Speaker 5: that then dismissed indictment against James Comy, she made affirmative

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Speaker 5: excuse me, misrepresentations.

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Speaker 4: About the law and about the facts.

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Speaker 5: And we only found out once a federal judge ordered

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Speaker 5: those grand jury transcripts to be revealed. Now, in Chicago,

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Speaker 5: for the broad View six a group of protesters they

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Speaker 5: got indicted for their protected conduct outside of Adalla.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Abidala is one of them, the woman who ran

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Speaker 1: for Congress.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, I call her kat Abu kat ab.

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Speaker 1: Yes, I have butchered her name yet again.

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Speaker 5: But anyway, So, she and others got illegally arrested and indicted,

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Speaker 5: and then on the literal eve of their jury trial

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Speaker 5: before that, some of the charges got dropped by the Feds,

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Speaker 5: and we're all kind of wondering, that's interesting. And then

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Speaker 5: the federal judge presiding over that case, Mollie said, I

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Speaker 5: want to see the entirety of the grand jury transcripts.

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Speaker 5: And she looked at them and she said, I have

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Speaker 5: never seen this level of prosecutorial misconduct.

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Speaker 4: In my career.

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Speaker 5: Yeah, And she said they were talking to the grand jurors.

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Speaker 5: They were striking grand jurors that didn't agree with the prosecution.

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Speaker 5: They were sitting there and making they were doing something

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Speaker 5: called vouching, meaning they were telling these grand jurors, don't worry,

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Speaker 5: the strength of this evidence is so great and there'll

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Speaker 5: be more evidence, et cetera, etc. Which is very similar

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Speaker 5: to what was happening in the Comy case.

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Speaker 1: Right, And you're really not allowed to do that.

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Speaker 5: Oh, my God, you're not supposed to talk to them

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Speaker 5: outside of the grand jury room. You're only allowed to

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Speaker 5: go in and make your presentment. And you know there's

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Speaker 5: that saying you can indict a ham sandwich, but this

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Speaker 5: DOJ clearly cannot. And even if they can't, they even

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Speaker 5: if they do, they can't get it across the finish line.

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Speaker 5: I mean, they literally cannot get a conviction of the

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Speaker 5: subway throwing, you know, sub sandwich guy.

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Speaker 4: But the thing with e Gene and this.

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Speaker 5: This US attorney though, that I want to make a

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Speaker 5: point on is he's like, we haven't quote opened a

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Speaker 5: criminal investigation. But that doesn't mean he didn't accept a

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Speaker 5: referral of an investigation that had already been opened at

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Speaker 5: Main Justice. And that's the reason why a whole bunch

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Speaker 5: of us are saying. That doesn't mean what people think

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Speaker 5: it may mean. When he says, oh, we didn't open one,

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Speaker 5: it doesn't mean that he didn't accept a referral on her.

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Speaker 1: And yesterday I was on Deadline White House with Carol Linik,

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Speaker 1: and Carol line was talking about how this may be

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Speaker 1: about a prosecution of a guy called read Hoffman and

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Speaker 1: not the and not actually about eging that she may

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Speaker 1: be part of an investigation into Read Hoffman.

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Speaker 5: Possibly, Yeah, so she could be the nexus or the

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Speaker 5: link between what the government wants and Read Hoffin. But

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Speaker 5: I said yesterday on my channel, I said, it's kind

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Speaker 5: of a bogo like when I go to publics, there's bogo,

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Speaker 5: buy one, get one free. In this instance, if you're

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Speaker 5: the Trump DOJ, you pat yourself on the back. You

430
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Speaker 5: can go after Eging Carroll, who is somebody who we

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Speaker 5: know just pisses off Donald Trump to know at veil,

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Speaker 5: especially because he's about to put your nineteen million fucking dollars. Yeah,

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Speaker 5: and then you can also go after Read Hoffman, who's

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Speaker 5: a huge Democratic funder and supporter and its been an

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Speaker 5: open Trump critic. And so you kind of like quote

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Speaker 5: win on both instances. But either way, it's still weaponization,

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Speaker 5: right because REDA. Hoffman hasn't done anything wrong either, it's.

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Speaker 1: Still malicious prosecution according to her lawyers. But also I

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Speaker 1: think more importantly, I think there's a scenario where all

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00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:21,639
Speaker 1: of this was opened to as a float, to float

441
00:23:21,680 --> 00:23:24,840
Speaker 1: it to see what the pushback was, and that now

442
00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:28,199
Speaker 1: it seems as if politically going after an eighty two

443
00:23:28,320 --> 00:23:31,400
Speaker 1: year old who you owe money to may not be

444
00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:34,479
Speaker 1: the smartest move, and it may perhaps mess him up

445
00:23:34,480 --> 00:23:36,679
Speaker 1: with it. Remember he's still trying to get the Supreme

446
00:23:36,720 --> 00:23:39,120
Speaker 1: Court to do any number of things for him. Well.

447
00:23:39,320 --> 00:23:42,800
Speaker 5: Yeah, and when it comes specifically to Egen, the Supreme

448
00:23:42,840 --> 00:23:46,600
Speaker 5: Court has deferred taking his appeal on twelve separate occasions.

449
00:23:46,680 --> 00:23:47,199
Speaker 1: Molly right.

450
00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:50,560
Speaker 5: So the Supreme Court's been like, yo, yo, we don't

451
00:23:50,560 --> 00:23:54,399
Speaker 5: really want to touch this, right because it really is dicey,

452
00:23:54,480 --> 00:23:55,320
Speaker 5: and he's lost.

453
00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:55,960
Speaker 4: This is the thing.

454
00:23:56,240 --> 00:24:00,440
Speaker 5: He's lost every step of the way. Troupoort's appel. The courts,

455
00:24:00,440 --> 00:24:03,640
Speaker 5: they've all been like, buddy, these were clean trials, two

456
00:24:03,720 --> 00:24:06,399
Speaker 5: separate ones, and we're not touching them. And even the

457
00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:09,360
Speaker 5: Supreme Court's like, yeah, oh, I'm.

458
00:24:08,720 --> 00:24:11,359
Speaker 4: Sorry, squirrel, I see a squirrel. They don't want to

459
00:24:11,400 --> 00:24:14,400
Speaker 4: go anywhere near this. And so I'm sure as crazy,

460
00:24:14,440 --> 00:24:14,639
Speaker 4: you know.

461
00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:17,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, And this is Trump's Supreme Court, right. Three of

462
00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:21,120
Speaker 1: the people in it have been appointed by him. Two

463
00:24:21,160 --> 00:24:25,199
Speaker 1: of them, the two ones who who came before, Thomas

464
00:24:25,200 --> 00:24:29,840
Speaker 1: and Alito, are basically, you know, Maga cheerleaders. So the fact,

465
00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:32,520
Speaker 1: and they tended to want to do whatever Trump wants.

466
00:24:32,600 --> 00:24:36,359
Speaker 1: But because we've seen a lot of times they've dissented

467
00:24:36,400 --> 00:24:39,119
Speaker 1: when the other justices won't pick something up. They're the

468
00:24:39,160 --> 00:24:41,199
Speaker 1: people who if Donald Trump wants to say I'm a

469
00:24:41,240 --> 00:24:44,480
Speaker 1: God King, they will be like, let's go, you know,

470
00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:45,080
Speaker 1: I mean.

471
00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:48,720
Speaker 5: Yeah, And that's why I think this is less Scotus

472
00:24:48,760 --> 00:24:52,679
Speaker 5: and more Todd Blanche, who really is so thirsty for

473
00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:55,360
Speaker 5: the job of Attorney General because right now if he's

474
00:24:55,400 --> 00:24:59,000
Speaker 5: the acting age. And I also think it's bullshit that

475
00:24:59,080 --> 00:25:03,439
Speaker 5: there's the media reporting a mainstream that Todd Blanche has

476
00:25:03,560 --> 00:25:07,159
Speaker 5: quote recused himself from the Jean Carroll because he was

477
00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:10,320
Speaker 5: the private lawyer for that he or you know, for

478
00:25:10,400 --> 00:25:11,480
Speaker 5: Trump and all that stuff.

479
00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:12,640
Speaker 4: Look, you and I both.

480
00:25:12,480 --> 00:25:14,959
Speaker 5: Know that there's no real wall that is put up

481
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:18,240
Speaker 5: between Blanche and this department, and so I find that

482
00:25:18,359 --> 00:25:20,240
Speaker 5: to also just speak her to it is bullshit coming

483
00:25:20,280 --> 00:25:20,640
Speaker 5: from that.

484
00:25:20,600 --> 00:25:24,680
Speaker 1: Offense, right But I mean, I think he probably smartly

485
00:25:25,480 --> 00:25:29,280
Speaker 1: wanted that out there so that people had to report it.

486
00:25:29,960 --> 00:25:33,840
Speaker 1: But it does meaningless. And again this DJ, like historically,

487
00:25:33,920 --> 00:25:37,400
Speaker 1: the DJ is meant to be completely separate from the ADMIN.

488
00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:41,159
Speaker 1: What Trump has done has created I mean, remember in

489
00:25:41,240 --> 00:25:44,440
Speaker 1: Trump one point zero, anyone who didn't who didn't serve

490
00:25:44,480 --> 00:25:49,359
Speaker 1: at his pleasure, ended up getting largely getting fired, I

491
00:25:49,400 --> 00:25:54,159
Speaker 1: mean fired or his ire I mean, do you remember, uh,

492
00:25:54,600 --> 00:25:58,080
Speaker 1: what's his name from Alabama? The senator from Alabama? Uh

493
00:25:58,280 --> 00:26:02,760
Speaker 1: not Tuberville especially sentence right, Yes, Donald Trump is one

494
00:26:02,800 --> 00:26:05,720
Speaker 1: of Donald Trump's first supporters, and Trump one point now

495
00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:10,360
Speaker 1: ended up getting you know, wanting to put together I mean,

496
00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:11,920
Speaker 1: let's talk about Jeff Sessions.

497
00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:15,639
Speaker 5: Yeah, And here's the thing, Like, the optics on this

498
00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:19,920
Speaker 5: are also horrific, as you aptly noted, right, because she's

499
00:26:19,960 --> 00:26:22,840
Speaker 5: eighty two, which by the way, is just for her,

500
00:26:23,000 --> 00:26:27,359
Speaker 5: for egene and in yeah, she's like one of my

501
00:26:27,400 --> 00:26:29,760
Speaker 5: closest friends, so like, and I understand, but I also

502
00:26:29,840 --> 00:26:31,080
Speaker 5: like to say, it doesn't mean that I can't sit

503
00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:32,439
Speaker 5: her and call it the bullshit for what it is.

504
00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:35,679
Speaker 5: She's incredibly spry and she's great for eighty two. So whatever,

505
00:26:35,760 --> 00:26:37,680
Speaker 5: that's just an age. But what it does, though, it

506
00:26:38,280 --> 00:26:42,600
Speaker 5: brings back to the surface a lot of really bad shit, right,

507
00:26:42,960 --> 00:26:47,240
Speaker 5: like the allegations of sexual abuse, which were by a

508
00:26:47,359 --> 00:26:50,920
Speaker 5: jury of his peers. They agreed that he sexually abused

509
00:26:50,920 --> 00:26:53,120
Speaker 5: her in a dressing room at Burndoff, And it kind

510
00:26:53,119 --> 00:26:57,800
Speaker 5: of leads to the whole other line of victims slash

511
00:26:57,840 --> 00:27:01,440
Speaker 5: survivors of Donald Trump's sexual misconduct, and then it all

512
00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:05,520
Speaker 5: dovetails with him being a part of the Epstein elite,

513
00:27:05,600 --> 00:27:06,600
Speaker 5: and it all kind of.

514
00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:09,000
Speaker 4: Just stinks, and it's so dumb.

515
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:12,399
Speaker 5: It's such a self own for Trump to want to

516
00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:15,480
Speaker 5: do this because it also brings back the access Hollywood

517
00:27:15,480 --> 00:27:17,479
Speaker 5: tape to grab him by the pussy stuff, like it

518
00:27:17,560 --> 00:27:22,960
Speaker 5: was all a part of the eging Carol story. And

519
00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:26,720
Speaker 5: you know, at a time when he'd rather have people

520
00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:29,639
Speaker 5: looking at some dumbass UFC shit going on at the

521
00:27:29,640 --> 00:27:33,040
Speaker 5: White House next month, No, people are talking about him

522
00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:36,760
Speaker 5: vindictively prosecuting eging Carol, right, Like that's the way that

523
00:27:36,760 --> 00:27:38,520
Speaker 5: people are driving this conversation now.

524
00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:41,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think it's I think I think it's

525
00:27:41,600 --> 00:27:44,840
Speaker 1: a real problem for him, especially when he's so unpopular

526
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:47,040
Speaker 1: and he can't I mean, there are just so many

527
00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:50,160
Speaker 1: issues here, Katie. I hope that you will come back,

528
00:27:50,520 --> 00:27:54,560
Speaker 1: Oh any time talk. I miss you, I miss you,

529
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:55,440
Speaker 1: I miss you.

530
00:27:55,560 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 5: And I hope you know everybody he's tuning in is

531
00:27:58,960 --> 00:28:02,240
Speaker 5: is doing great. And yeah, I love being there anytime,

532
00:28:02,280 --> 00:28:03,880
Speaker 5: anytime you want to chat about whatever.

533
00:28:03,960 --> 00:28:05,360
Speaker 4: I'm going to che I would love it.

534
00:28:06,320 --> 00:28:10,800
Speaker 1: Daniel Bogaslov is an investigative reporter for outlets like Wired, Vice,

535
00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:16,000
Speaker 1: The Intercept, Welcome, Welcome, Too Fast Politics.

536
00:28:16,080 --> 00:28:17,440
Speaker 3: Daniel, thanks for having me.

537
00:28:17,560 --> 00:28:20,520
Speaker 1: So let's talk about this. I read this piece earlier

538
00:28:20,560 --> 00:28:26,280
Speaker 1: this week and was like, oh, amazing. So Americans are

539
00:28:27,600 --> 00:28:30,320
Speaker 1: yes three days ago, which was like ten years ago

540
00:28:30,440 --> 00:28:34,280
Speaker 1: for May. Okay, So let's talk about this, the anti

541
00:28:34,400 --> 00:28:39,480
Speaker 1: tech extremism as AI hatred growth. And so this comes

542
00:28:39,480 --> 00:28:42,800
Speaker 1: from the Department of Homeland Security. So give us sort

543
00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:45,000
Speaker 1: of give us this information, where you got it from

544
00:28:45,040 --> 00:28:46,080
Speaker 1: and what it means.

545
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:49,040
Speaker 3: Okay. So the top line is there's the Department of

546
00:28:49,040 --> 00:28:51,160
Speaker 3: Homeland Security, there's the FBI at the federal level, and

547
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:53,360
Speaker 3: then they have all these post nine to eleven outposts

548
00:28:53,400 --> 00:28:56,280
Speaker 3: called fusion centers. There's eighty across the country. Wow. These

549
00:28:56,320 --> 00:29:00,400
Speaker 3: are like growths on state police organizations where the FEDS

550
00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:03,200
Speaker 3: are able to shoot information into these fusion centers, gets

551
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:05,760
Speaker 3: all mixed up with state and local police that goes

552
00:29:05,800 --> 00:29:07,680
Speaker 3: back to the FED. So it's like this whirlpool.

553
00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:09,720
Speaker 1: Is this good or bad?

554
00:29:10,040 --> 00:29:13,280
Speaker 3: It's not good. It's definitely very bad. You know, we

555
00:29:13,760 --> 00:29:16,040
Speaker 3: have this thing called the Constitution. We have these things

556
00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:19,880
Speaker 3: called states' rights, and basically after nine to eleven they

557
00:29:20,160 --> 00:29:24,200
Speaker 3: fused all these intelligence apparatuses right into the States. So

558
00:29:24,640 --> 00:29:27,719
Speaker 3: what is circulating is this idea of a new anti

559
00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:31,360
Speaker 3: tech extremism category, This idea that people that oppose AI,

560
00:29:31,480 --> 00:29:35,400
Speaker 3: people that oppose data centers in their backyards are now

561
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:39,760
Speaker 3: extremists on par with al Qaeda or neo Nazi groups.

562
00:29:39,760 --> 00:29:43,080
Speaker 3: You know, this is the same extremist mentality that is

563
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:45,880
Speaker 3: used to frame other types of domestic threats.

564
00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:47,280
Speaker 1: Say more about this.

565
00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:52,520
Speaker 3: So this is not a new phenomenon per se. Whether

566
00:29:52,600 --> 00:29:55,600
Speaker 3: it was you know, the kind of broad based fear

567
00:29:55,760 --> 00:30:00,320
Speaker 3: of radical Islamic violence in the immediate afterm the nine

568
00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:02,240
Speaker 3: to eleven, or whether it's you know, things like the

569
00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:04,880
Speaker 3: green scare, which in the early two thousand was this

570
00:30:04,920 --> 00:30:08,000
Speaker 3: criminalization of environmental activism. This idea that this was a

571
00:30:08,080 --> 00:30:10,440
Speaker 3: huge domestic you know, terrorist threat.

572
00:30:10,400 --> 00:30:12,760
Speaker 1: That seems like more of a one to one is

573
00:30:12,840 --> 00:30:18,040
Speaker 1: like climate activists, you know, the people who were protesting

574
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:20,000
Speaker 1: the pipelines.

575
00:30:19,760 --> 00:30:22,680
Speaker 3: Yep, yep, the Dakodak rite that seems closer. Also, Black

576
00:30:22,720 --> 00:30:24,960
Speaker 3: lives matter too. At one point there was a black

577
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:29,720
Speaker 3: identity extremist threat category in the first Trump administration. But

578
00:30:30,200 --> 00:30:33,320
Speaker 3: what's different, what's really new with this is the fact

579
00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:36,000
Speaker 3: that according to all the polls, you know, and what

580
00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:39,480
Speaker 3: we've just seen on the ground, seventy percent of Americans

581
00:30:39,560 --> 00:30:41,840
Speaker 3: do not like the AI companies and they do not

582
00:30:41,960 --> 00:30:45,960
Speaker 3: like data centers being built in their communities. So historically,

583
00:30:46,000 --> 00:30:48,160
Speaker 3: the government has kind of tried to pit people against

584
00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:52,880
Speaker 3: each other with these threat categories, right, environmentalists versus you know,

585
00:30:53,200 --> 00:30:57,040
Speaker 3: people blue want blue collar extraction jobs, you know, Trump

586
00:30:57,120 --> 00:31:00,960
Speaker 3: supporters versus Black Lives Matter. But what we're seeing now

587
00:31:01,000 --> 00:31:02,920
Speaker 3: is they're trying to create a new threat category that

588
00:31:03,000 --> 00:31:06,400
Speaker 3: is just like a huge swath of the American public,

589
00:31:06,600 --> 00:31:09,280
Speaker 3: and they're doing it by criminalizing speech. If you look

590
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:12,000
Speaker 3: at the reports that are circulating between DHS and these

591
00:31:12,040 --> 00:31:16,040
Speaker 3: fusion centers, they're they're pulling out YouTube comments, they're pulling

592
00:31:16,040 --> 00:31:19,040
Speaker 3: out tweets of people saying, you know, screw this data center,

593
00:31:19,080 --> 00:31:22,040
Speaker 3: and they're saying that's a threat. You know, that's a

594
00:31:22,360 --> 00:31:24,240
Speaker 3: you know, people saying, you know, I hope, I hope

595
00:31:24,240 --> 00:31:25,320
Speaker 3: this thing explodes.

596
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:25,520
Speaker 1: Right.

597
00:31:25,520 --> 00:31:26,640
Speaker 3: I don't want to I don't want to look at

598
00:31:26,680 --> 00:31:27,320
Speaker 3: it anymore.

599
00:31:27,640 --> 00:31:29,760
Speaker 1: Wow, you know, the more.

600
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:32,720
Speaker 3: That this stuff circulates. The more that you know it

601
00:31:32,760 --> 00:31:36,000
Speaker 3: goes out to these think tanks that are doing extremism research,

602
00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:38,240
Speaker 3: the more that they inject that in. But the other

603
00:31:38,320 --> 00:31:40,960
Speaker 3: piece of this that I think is a way into

604
00:31:40,960 --> 00:31:43,240
Speaker 3: the way this whole system works is the fact that

605
00:31:43,400 --> 00:31:45,880
Speaker 3: these companies have a front row seat to the FBI,

606
00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:50,360
Speaker 3: to DHS, right, they have information sharing networks. I know,

607
00:31:50,720 --> 00:31:52,760
Speaker 3: sounds like I'm putting on my tinfoil hat now, but

608
00:31:53,000 --> 00:31:56,120
Speaker 3: this is all well documented. You know, there's things called

609
00:31:56,560 --> 00:31:59,280
Speaker 3: h SIN, there's things called d SAC. You know these

610
00:31:59,320 --> 00:32:03,680
Speaker 3: acronyms that represent basically like portals, basically a slack channel

611
00:32:03,800 --> 00:32:07,960
Speaker 3: between corporate security offices and FBI and Homeland Security. And

612
00:32:08,000 --> 00:32:11,960
Speaker 3: guess what, these companies don't like protesters calling out their

613
00:32:12,080 --> 00:32:12,760
Speaker 3: data centers.

614
00:32:13,000 --> 00:32:15,640
Speaker 1: I want to like bring this to stuff I've seen

615
00:32:15,720 --> 00:32:21,200
Speaker 1: in real life. Mister Wonderful, ironically titled Canadian Citizen wants

616
00:32:21,200 --> 00:32:24,959
Speaker 1: to build a forty thousand acre data farm in Utah.

617
00:32:25,280 --> 00:32:28,479
Speaker 1: He goes on Fox News. He says that the people

618
00:32:28,480 --> 00:32:31,600
Speaker 1: who are trying to stop him are Chinese spies. The

619
00:32:31,720 --> 00:32:35,120
Speaker 1: women of Elevate Utah. They came on this podcast. There

620
00:32:35,120 --> 00:32:39,520
Speaker 1: are two women from Utah. They're not Chinese spies. They're

621
00:32:39,560 --> 00:32:43,440
Speaker 1: women from Utah who are not Chinese. They're just Utah women,

622
00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:47,000
Speaker 1: and they do not work for any government. So he

623
00:32:47,160 --> 00:32:50,640
Speaker 1: calls them out by name. Is that what this is

624
00:32:51,040 --> 00:32:53,440
Speaker 1: sort of looking like? Is that what the goal here is?

625
00:32:53,760 --> 00:32:57,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that just mirrors the presidential directives that we've

626
00:32:57,640 --> 00:32:59,800
Speaker 3: seen come down from the White House. You know, one

627
00:32:59,840 --> 00:33:01,560
Speaker 3: thing that I talked about in that piece that my

628
00:33:01,600 --> 00:33:04,360
Speaker 3: colleague Ken Klippenstein has written a lot about is this

629
00:33:04,640 --> 00:33:08,280
Speaker 3: presidential director called National Security Presidential Memo seven. And what

630
00:33:08,320 --> 00:33:12,240
Speaker 3: this does is this instructs the entire federal law enforcement apparatus,

631
00:33:12,280 --> 00:33:16,400
Speaker 3: the FBI, DHS, to surveil these huge threat categories like

632
00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:21,760
Speaker 3: anti Americanism, anti Christianity, anti capitalism. He basically blasted out

633
00:33:21,800 --> 00:33:24,720
Speaker 3: to everyone, go and investigate anything related to these groups.

634
00:33:24,720 --> 00:33:26,920
Speaker 3: And that's basically what mister Wonderful is doing too, Right,

635
00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:31,520
Speaker 3: He's just saying these people oppose my project and therefore

636
00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:33,480
Speaker 3: they must be spies. You know who else said that

637
00:33:33,520 --> 00:33:35,960
Speaker 3: a lot, a senator named McCarthy. I mean, this is

638
00:33:36,080 --> 00:33:39,960
Speaker 3: literally just red scare baiting all over again. But if

639
00:33:39,960 --> 00:33:42,160
Speaker 3: you look carefully at what he said, he didn't just

640
00:33:42,200 --> 00:33:44,760
Speaker 3: say that these women are Chinese spies. He also said,

641
00:33:45,040 --> 00:33:48,680
Speaker 3: I reported them to the FBI. I reported them to

642
00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:52,000
Speaker 3: federal law enforcement, and you know, they're not Chinese spies.

643
00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:54,240
Speaker 3: But that doesn't mean that the FBI can't make a

644
00:33:54,280 --> 00:33:56,480
Speaker 3: case to subpoena them. That doesn't mean that the FBI

645
00:33:56,520 --> 00:33:58,560
Speaker 3: can't go knock on their door and scare the shit

646
00:33:58,640 --> 00:33:59,080
Speaker 3: out of them.

647
00:33:59,240 --> 00:34:02,440
Speaker 1: And the whole point here with the Trump administration is

648
00:34:02,720 --> 00:34:07,760
Speaker 1: that they win when they're able to make your life hell,

649
00:34:08,080 --> 00:34:09,600
Speaker 1: when they're able to make it so you have to

650
00:34:09,640 --> 00:34:13,000
Speaker 1: hire a lawyer when you're there. So yeah, yeah, so.

651
00:34:13,120 --> 00:34:16,040
Speaker 3: And so it's a chilling effect. And I'm glad he

652
00:34:16,120 --> 00:34:19,399
Speaker 3: said that publicly because it shows what's going on all

653
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:21,600
Speaker 3: the time under the surface. I mean, these companies are

654
00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:26,800
Speaker 3: in constant communication with federal law enforcement, and sometimes they're

655
00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:29,239
Speaker 3: the ones right putting their thumb on the scale. I mean,

656
00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:30,759
Speaker 3: if we go back and we look at some of

657
00:34:30,800 --> 00:34:33,880
Speaker 3: the documents that came out after Occupy Wall Street, you

658
00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:39,040
Speaker 3: know there were Wall Street firms flagging protesters to the

659
00:34:39,080 --> 00:34:43,160
Speaker 3: Feds and saying that these constitutionally protected assemblies are a

660
00:34:43,160 --> 00:34:43,920
Speaker 3: physical threat.

661
00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:45,479
Speaker 1: The one thing I would say is it's a little

662
00:34:45,480 --> 00:34:50,240
Speaker 1: different like they're outside their offices, right, So you could

663
00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:53,160
Speaker 1: see how if you work at Goldman Sacks and you

664
00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:56,960
Speaker 1: have somebody protesting Goldman Sachs right outside that you could

665
00:34:57,160 --> 00:34:59,239
Speaker 1: make a case. It may not be true, true, but

666
00:34:59,280 --> 00:35:01,440
Speaker 1: you could make a case is that your physical safety

667
00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:04,320
Speaker 1: are the people work in your office's physical safety is

668
00:35:04,360 --> 00:35:08,279
Speaker 1: being jeopardized? I guess, But I mean it's it's ridiculous,

669
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:12,040
Speaker 1: but at least it sort of hangs together, whereas like,

670
00:35:12,440 --> 00:35:15,280
Speaker 1: these people are opposing my data center that I haven't

671
00:35:15,280 --> 00:35:18,279
Speaker 1: even built, and there's no right and you have to

672
00:35:18,280 --> 00:35:18,840
Speaker 1: go after that.

673
00:35:19,440 --> 00:35:21,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, But I mean, one thing I'm hoping to do

674
00:35:21,920 --> 00:35:24,920
Speaker 3: more reporting on is the arrests at city council meetings

675
00:35:25,160 --> 00:35:29,040
Speaker 3: where counselors are voting on different types of stuff, exam

676
00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 3: so things where these people get up and they'll like

677
00:35:31,640 --> 00:35:34,400
Speaker 3: talk for like thirty seconds over their allotted time, and

678
00:35:34,400 --> 00:35:37,320
Speaker 3: then they'll immediately get arrested and called out of these meetings.

679
00:35:37,400 --> 00:35:39,640
Speaker 1: That's a freedom of speech violation for sure.

680
00:35:39,760 --> 00:35:41,720
Speaker 3: That's a freedom of speech violation. And there's a question

681
00:35:41,760 --> 00:35:44,640
Speaker 3: in my mind, which is are these local police stations

682
00:35:44,680 --> 00:35:47,120
Speaker 3: getting these threat bulletins saying you know, these people are

683
00:35:47,200 --> 00:35:50,319
Speaker 3: a domestic security threat. You know, are these police being

684
00:35:50,360 --> 00:35:53,319
Speaker 3: indoctrinated by some of these reports that I've obtained? But

685
00:35:53,600 --> 00:35:55,480
Speaker 3: you know, going back to the to the occupy thing,

686
00:35:55,520 --> 00:35:58,200
Speaker 3: I mean, look, these companies they have the red phone, right,

687
00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:00,640
Speaker 3: those protesters don't have a red phone. Today FBI saying

688
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:02,800
Speaker 3: these companies are poisoning my water supply.

689
00:36:03,160 --> 00:36:07,400
Speaker 1: Clearly, companies are being treated like people, right, and people

690
00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:10,200
Speaker 1: are being treated like nothing. But I think it's a

691
00:36:10,239 --> 00:36:14,440
Speaker 1: really good example of the way in which the administration

692
00:36:15,239 --> 00:36:17,280
Speaker 1: is protecting companies over people.

693
00:36:17,440 --> 00:36:21,719
Speaker 3: It's fascinating to see the response to the story. Again, Historically,

694
00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:24,920
Speaker 3: these threat categories have been used to divide people and

695
00:36:24,960 --> 00:36:27,080
Speaker 3: to force one group to target another group. And I

696
00:36:27,080 --> 00:36:30,240
Speaker 3: mean I tweeted that out, so you know, Marjorie Taylor

697
00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:34,880
Speaker 3: Green re retweeted it. I mean, these things are really unpopular,

698
00:36:34,920 --> 00:36:37,920
Speaker 3: and to me, it's an inspiring thing to see normal

699
00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:40,840
Speaker 3: working class people on both sides of the political spectrum

700
00:36:40,880 --> 00:36:43,840
Speaker 3: saying screw it, we're going to come together and oppose

701
00:36:44,239 --> 00:36:47,040
Speaker 3: these corporations and stop fighting with each other.

702
00:36:47,360 --> 00:36:51,040
Speaker 1: Well, it speaks to the larger issue that we're seeing

703
00:36:51,239 --> 00:36:54,840
Speaker 1: on the populace side, right, that is, on both sides

704
00:36:54,880 --> 00:36:58,759
Speaker 1: Democrats and Republicans giving up on people taking a more

705
00:36:58,800 --> 00:37:03,360
Speaker 1: corporate friends attitude, and people hate that. And like, you know,

706
00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:05,879
Speaker 1: it's funny because I think there's a there's this sort

707
00:37:05,880 --> 00:37:09,760
Speaker 1: of ongoing war between some of Trump's advisors. And again,

708
00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:12,200
Speaker 1: I am in no way a Trump or in any

709
00:37:12,239 --> 00:37:14,120
Speaker 1: stretch of the imagination, but there are some of Trump's

710
00:37:14,120 --> 00:37:17,960
Speaker 1: advisors who truly wanted him to tack to a more

711
00:37:18,040 --> 00:37:21,880
Speaker 1: populist antie. I mean, those people were out of their minds.

712
00:37:21,960 --> 00:37:23,960
Speaker 1: He was never going to do that, but you know,

713
00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:27,919
Speaker 1: he pretended to do that, whereas sometimes Democrats wouldn't even

714
00:37:27,960 --> 00:37:31,239
Speaker 1: pretend to do that. And so you know, now we're

715
00:37:31,280 --> 00:37:36,319
Speaker 1: seeing candidates who are running as up versus down, right,

716
00:37:36,480 --> 00:37:40,600
Speaker 1: versus left versus right, which is clearly the mistake we've

717
00:37:40,600 --> 00:37:44,520
Speaker 1: seen with Democrats unable to catch that populous wave is

718
00:37:44,560 --> 00:37:47,000
Speaker 1: that they would not say this kind of stuff right.

719
00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:50,520
Speaker 3: And as much as as people might disagree with Trump

720
00:37:50,600 --> 00:37:54,000
Speaker 3: and be repulsed by him, just running against him doesn't

721
00:37:54,000 --> 00:37:56,879
Speaker 3: address people's quality of life. And that was a huge

722
00:37:56,880 --> 00:37:59,960
Speaker 3: mistake right in all the messaging we saw for you know,

723
00:38:00,040 --> 00:38:02,680
Speaker 3: the past several years. I also think, like with my reporting,

724
00:38:02,760 --> 00:38:05,040
Speaker 3: a lot of people are like, Okay, well, you know,

725
00:38:05,120 --> 00:38:08,680
Speaker 3: people still have that fear of terrorism in their minds.

726
00:38:08,680 --> 00:38:11,600
Speaker 3: You know, people still don't like fully understand why the

727
00:38:11,600 --> 00:38:14,359
Speaker 3: federal government has all this overreach. So that's something I've

728
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:16,200
Speaker 3: heard from people. But I also think there's a populist

729
00:38:16,239 --> 00:38:19,000
Speaker 3: messaging there, which is like, you know, the FBI used

730
00:38:19,040 --> 00:38:23,560
Speaker 3: to have incredible, incredibly well staffed white collar crime unit,

731
00:38:23,800 --> 00:38:25,360
Speaker 3: and that's gone gone.

732
00:38:25,560 --> 00:38:29,399
Speaker 1: White crime crimes are like not really crimes according to Trump, right.

733
00:38:29,480 --> 00:38:31,200
Speaker 3: Well, but even before Trump, I mean, I mean, really

734
00:38:31,200 --> 00:38:33,560
Speaker 3: it was nine to eleven where those guys all got

735
00:38:33,560 --> 00:38:37,160
Speaker 3: pulled into counter terrorism. But you know, I think Democrats,

736
00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:39,839
Speaker 3: you know, there was a push with Biden to try

737
00:38:39,880 --> 00:38:42,480
Speaker 3: to really push him into this corporate crime enforcement, and

738
00:38:42,520 --> 00:38:44,320
Speaker 3: it had some success with Lena Khan and some of

739
00:38:44,360 --> 00:38:47,600
Speaker 3: the anti trust busters, but I think, you know, revitalized,

740
00:38:47,719 --> 00:38:49,600
Speaker 3: you know, showing people that the government you know, isn't

741
00:38:49,640 --> 00:38:51,960
Speaker 3: just a boogeyman coming and knocking at their door and

742
00:38:51,960 --> 00:38:54,520
Speaker 3: telling him to stop protesting, could actually be used to

743
00:38:54,560 --> 00:38:59,040
Speaker 3: go after the corporations and CEOs, you know, miserating people.

744
00:38:59,520 --> 00:39:02,960
Speaker 3: Is There's another interesting tac that hasn't been tried, and

745
00:39:03,000 --> 00:39:03,520
Speaker 3: that was the.

746
00:39:03,480 --> 00:39:06,640
Speaker 1: Big crime of the two thousand and eight financial crisis

747
00:39:06,719 --> 00:39:11,319
Speaker 1: was that nobody went to jail. All of this privatized gain,

748
00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:15,040
Speaker 1: subsidized losses and nobody went to jail. And I think

749
00:39:15,160 --> 00:39:17,360
Speaker 1: when you look at it in America, where there's so

750
00:39:17,520 --> 00:39:21,080
Speaker 1: much wealth inequality, and you have the wealth, these people saying,

751
00:39:21,120 --> 00:39:24,480
Speaker 1: you know, I mean that Bezos interview was a great example.

752
00:39:24,640 --> 00:39:27,719
Speaker 1: You know, while I shouldn't pay more taxes because obviously

753
00:39:27,719 --> 00:39:30,279
Speaker 1: there's a woman in Queens who pays. I mean, that

754
00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:33,080
Speaker 1: was an insane you know, they're making a case, but

755
00:39:33,120 --> 00:39:35,319
Speaker 1: if I pay more taxes, it won't do anything. Well,

756
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:36,800
Speaker 1: let's just try you know.

757
00:39:37,320 --> 00:39:39,719
Speaker 3: Yeah, I just think those are better targets. You know,

758
00:39:39,719 --> 00:39:42,080
Speaker 3: I feel like we're entering into this spiral where it's

759
00:39:42,080 --> 00:39:44,960
Speaker 3: like every four years one side is prosecuting the other.

760
00:39:45,040 --> 00:39:47,000
Speaker 3: You know, right now Trump is like going after all

761
00:39:47,040 --> 00:39:49,759
Speaker 3: of his enemies. You know, we had we've had the

762
00:39:49,840 --> 00:39:54,239
Speaker 3: ongoing you know, January sixth investigation that went on and

763
00:39:54,280 --> 00:39:56,359
Speaker 3: on past the point where it seems like normal people

764
00:39:56,360 --> 00:39:57,880
Speaker 3: were kind of like, Okay, this was really bad, but

765
00:39:57,920 --> 00:40:00,399
Speaker 3: can we get back to kitchen table issues. I think

766
00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:04,600
Speaker 3: if the next Democratic administration is able to prosecute corporate

767
00:40:04,640 --> 00:40:07,799
Speaker 3: criminals who are who are the constant you know that

768
00:40:08,400 --> 00:40:11,120
Speaker 3: you can really shift the focus away from the rabbis.

769
00:40:11,360 --> 00:40:15,239
Speaker 1: Are there any Democrats pushing back on these nsp M

770
00:40:15,440 --> 00:40:16,480
Speaker 1: eights now?

771
00:40:16,920 --> 00:40:22,560
Speaker 3: There's been some news hits. Actually, surprisingly Senator Slotkin from Michigan,

772
00:40:22,600 --> 00:40:26,239
Speaker 3: who herself is a former CIA case officer, I think

773
00:40:26,280 --> 00:40:28,560
Speaker 3: she actually kind of has the understanding of the national

774
00:40:28,600 --> 00:40:31,399
Speaker 3: security apparatus to like finally get what's going on, even

775
00:40:31,440 --> 00:40:34,080
Speaker 3: though she's not great on other civil liberties issues.

776
00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:37,160
Speaker 1: Right, But that's great that she understands it.

777
00:40:37,160 --> 00:40:38,399
Speaker 3: You know. I think it's one of those things where

778
00:40:38,400 --> 00:40:40,880
Speaker 3: it's chugging along kind of quietly under the surface. We

779
00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:44,600
Speaker 3: know that the FBI has opened NSPM seven related investigations

780
00:40:44,640 --> 00:40:47,960
Speaker 3: in almost every state, but it's secretive stuff. It's all

781
00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:50,600
Speaker 3: going on under the surface because the way our federal

782
00:40:50,680 --> 00:40:54,240
Speaker 3: statutes are written, there's no federal crime for domestic terrorism,

783
00:40:54,280 --> 00:40:57,480
Speaker 3: which means that these statutes people can get charged for

784
00:40:57,520 --> 00:41:00,960
Speaker 3: all kinds of crimes without ever realizing that investigations were

785
00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:06,200
Speaker 3: opened using the NSPM seven directive. Tax you know, tax problems,

786
00:41:06,280 --> 00:41:13,040
Speaker 3: you know, going after people's Nonprofitsah. So I think I've

787
00:41:13,080 --> 00:41:14,399
Speaker 3: been trying to sound on the alarm. I no, Ken

788
00:41:14,440 --> 00:41:15,719
Speaker 3: has been trying to sound the alarm. But it's a

789
00:41:15,840 --> 00:41:17,800
Speaker 3: it's a it's hard to get people to pay attention

790
00:41:17,880 --> 00:41:23,759
Speaker 3: because it is such a sneaky, undercover, you know, thing

791
00:41:23,800 --> 00:41:24,680
Speaker 3: that's chugging along.

792
00:41:25,000 --> 00:41:28,040
Speaker 1: One of the things I'm struck by is that all

793
00:41:28,080 --> 00:41:30,919
Speaker 1: of these attacks on civil liberties, they seem to come

794
00:41:30,960 --> 00:41:35,120
Speaker 1: from things that were opened after nine to eleven, Right,

795
00:41:35,280 --> 00:41:39,279
Speaker 1: emergency powers that were never then taken back. Is that

796
00:41:39,320 --> 00:41:39,840
Speaker 1: true with this?

797
00:41:40,320 --> 00:41:44,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, I would say this is a natural evolution from that.

798
00:41:44,200 --> 00:41:47,560
Speaker 3: I mean, I think that you could imagine this directive

799
00:41:47,680 --> 00:41:48,280
Speaker 3: still happening.

800
00:41:48,360 --> 00:41:48,480
Speaker 1: Right.

801
00:41:48,520 --> 00:41:51,840
Speaker 3: It's a presidential decree basically, there's it doesn't rely on

802
00:41:51,880 --> 00:41:54,759
Speaker 3: the Patriot Act or any of the post nine to eleven.

803
00:41:54,520 --> 00:41:56,480
Speaker 1: Legislation, but it's the same idea.

804
00:41:56,840 --> 00:41:58,880
Speaker 3: Yeah, And the institutions that are carrying this out, the

805
00:41:58,880 --> 00:42:03,400
Speaker 3: fusion centers were justified, right because after nine eleven they said,

806
00:42:03,560 --> 00:42:05,960
Speaker 3: how could we have missed this? It was an intelligence

807
00:42:06,040 --> 00:42:08,520
Speaker 3: sharing failure. The FBI had intel, the CIA had intel,

808
00:42:08,600 --> 00:42:11,520
Speaker 3: So let's create a bunch more intelligence agencies in every state.

809
00:42:11,719 --> 00:42:15,799
Speaker 3: But instead of actually helping to produce and share good intelligence.

810
00:42:15,840 --> 00:42:18,480
Speaker 3: What it created was a bunch of really garbage intelligence

811
00:42:18,480 --> 00:42:21,120
Speaker 3: and an apparatus for the president to say some stuff

812
00:42:21,200 --> 00:42:23,720
Speaker 3: like go after all my enemies, and a million different

813
00:42:23,760 --> 00:42:27,160
Speaker 3: state agencies clicking their heels and saying yes, sir, So

814
00:42:27,440 --> 00:42:30,000
Speaker 3: I do think it's it is all downstream from the

815
00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:31,160
Speaker 3: sort of nine to eleven Panic.

816
00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:34,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, thank you so much for joining us, Daniel, really

817
00:42:34,680 --> 00:42:35,279
Speaker 1: appreciate you.

818
00:42:35,320 --> 00:42:42,840
Speaker 3: No, thanks for having me, No mo, Jesse Cannon.

819
00:42:42,920 --> 00:42:46,960
Speaker 2: So Molly. The Trump administration is having to defend itself

820
00:42:47,040 --> 00:42:51,520
Speaker 2: because it turns out the administration that loves NEPO. And

821
00:42:51,560 --> 00:42:54,520
Speaker 2: I know we're very kind to NEPO at this podcast. Look,

822
00:42:55,760 --> 00:42:57,280
Speaker 2: this is where it gets a little shady.

823
00:42:57,640 --> 00:43:00,560
Speaker 1: The record show that I am being abused by my producer.

824
00:43:00,960 --> 00:43:05,280
Speaker 2: Continue, this is where NEPO gets pretty dicey. We'd see

825
00:43:05,719 --> 00:43:09,520
Speaker 2: Samuel Alito's son working inside the Trump administration.

826
00:43:09,920 --> 00:43:13,040
Speaker 1: Justice Alito, or does we like to think of him

827
00:43:13,360 --> 00:43:17,120
Speaker 1: Maga two point zero, Trump's favorite Fox News host, I

828
00:43:17,120 --> 00:43:20,280
Speaker 1: mean Supreme Court justice. His son works for Trump. Who

829
00:43:20,320 --> 00:43:23,800
Speaker 1: could have seen it? Philip Alito quietly joined the Trojury

830
00:43:23,840 --> 00:43:27,800
Speaker 1: Department as a political appointee early last year. Wait a second,

831
00:43:27,920 --> 00:43:32,160
Speaker 1: so the Supreme Court justice who always sides with Donald Trump,

832
00:43:32,200 --> 00:43:36,320
Speaker 1: has a son who works in his administration. It can't

833
00:43:36,360 --> 00:43:40,319
Speaker 1: be who to sun kid, I am shocked. I am

834
00:43:40,480 --> 00:43:45,880
Speaker 1: shocked that Justice Alito, who is known to be such

835
00:43:46,200 --> 00:43:51,680
Speaker 1: a straight shooter, a neighbor of Donald Trump, that fucking

836
00:43:51,760 --> 00:43:55,680
Speaker 1: guy has his son, Philip working in the Trump administration.

837
00:43:55,920 --> 00:44:01,240
Speaker 1: Good for notice? Notice is this new news outlet funded

838
00:44:01,360 --> 00:44:05,279
Speaker 1: by one of the very few good billionaires left and

839
00:44:05,600 --> 00:44:08,600
Speaker 1: who created Politico and is a good guy. And here

840
00:44:08,640 --> 00:44:11,840
Speaker 1: we are. So now we have just a really important

841
00:44:11,840 --> 00:44:16,160
Speaker 1: scoop that Justice Alito's son works in the Trump administration.

842
00:44:16,760 --> 00:44:20,280
Speaker 1: Wah wah wah. By the way, like so many members

843
00:44:20,320 --> 00:44:24,759
Speaker 1: of Skotis either like worked in Republican administrations or had

844
00:44:24,840 --> 00:44:27,920
Speaker 1: parents who worked in Republican administrations, it's kind of amazing.

845
00:44:28,280 --> 00:44:29,440
Speaker 2: It really is true.

846
00:44:30,120 --> 00:44:34,600
Speaker 1: That's it for this episode of Fast Politics. Tune in

847
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:40,240
Speaker 1: every Monday, Wednesday, Thursday and Saturday to hear the best

848
00:44:40,320 --> 00:44:44,640
Speaker 1: minds and politics make sense of all this chaos. If

849
00:44:44,680 --> 00:44:47,720
Speaker 1: you enjoy this podcast, please send it to a friend

850
00:44:48,160 --> 00:44:51,400
Speaker 1: and keep the conversation going. Thanks for listening.