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Speaker 1: now at career builder dot com. That time you got

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Speaker 1: home from a week of double shifts and your dog

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Speaker 1: didn't recognize you. He hates me? Hates me? Do you

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Speaker 1: want to treat? You want to treat? You knew it

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Speaker 1: was time for something new, Let's drop it up. At

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Speaker 1: apply to multiple jobs in just one click. Start your

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Speaker 1: search at career builder dot com. Hi everyone. I'm Katie

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Speaker 1: Couric and I'm Bozma st. John and this is Back

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Speaker 1: to Biz with Katie and Bose. So this is it.

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Speaker 1: It's our first episode of Back to Biz. We've been

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Speaker 1: talking about it for some time now, and it's really happening.

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Speaker 1: I'm super jazz to get this party started. I know

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Speaker 1: me too, and it feels like it's the perfect time

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Speaker 1: to do it. Um. I'm still looking forward to all

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Speaker 1: the conversations that we're gonna have here. You know, we've

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Speaker 1: got ten episodes to interview leaders in business, tech, public policy,

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Speaker 1: as well as entrepreneurs, pop culture, trailblazers and just all

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Speaker 1: around huge big thinkers. Well, and we could really use

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Speaker 1: some big thing ers at this moment in our nation's history. Bows,

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Speaker 1: and we're gonna be talking to them about how they're

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Speaker 1: responding to these big societal shifts the pandemic has brought about,

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Speaker 1: about how they're adjusting to this new way of life,

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Speaker 1: often not just through adaptation, but innovation too. In many ways, Bose,

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Speaker 1: I think this has been a terrible thing, but it's

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Speaker 1: also a time for reassessing, recalibrating, and in some cases,

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Speaker 1: I think rethinking everything that's right that's right. And our

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Speaker 1: first guests I think really sets the tone for this

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Speaker 1: series as someone who's forward thinking and innovative and just

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Speaker 1: all around so cool. She's so in demand, you know,

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Speaker 1: I mean, she's a tech journalist. Kara Swisher, Kara, al Right,

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Speaker 1: I'm here, Yeah, I'm here, I'm here here. Hold on,

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Speaker 1: Oh are you cranky? No, not cranky. I'm tired. I've

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Speaker 1: had days. Let me get my hold little one. Sec

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Speaker 1: here you are, and the sunglasses, the aviators come on,

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Speaker 1: I mean gonna I'm gonna sleep during the internet. Wait,

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Speaker 1: let me be the picture in your Kara is I

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Speaker 1: think the personification of the modern media Maven and very

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Speaker 1: good at alliteration too, because bos this woman is everywhere.

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Speaker 1: She's a columnist for The New York Times. She's founder

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Speaker 1: and editor at large of the tech site Recode. When

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Speaker 1: she's not writing, she's podcasting, the co host of the

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Speaker 1: award winning Pivot podcast. She's the host of Recode Decode,

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Speaker 1: and she's also cooking up a new podcast for The

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Speaker 1: New York Times, which is still unnamed right now, that's

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Speaker 1: set to release this fall. I don't know how she

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Speaker 1: does it. And on top of that, she's a mother

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Speaker 1: of three, two high schoolers and a relatively new baby.

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Speaker 1: She's quarantining in Washington, d C. I love Kara. She's

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Speaker 1: such a badass, and more importantly, bows she thinks I'm

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Speaker 1: a badass. But I know you got to know Kara

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Speaker 1: recently in one of your latest gigs, right, yeah, that's right.

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Speaker 1: Well you know what, We're about to be a trio

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Speaker 1: of badasses. I'll tell you that because I've known Kara

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Speaker 1: for some time. I met her at first when I

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Speaker 1: was the chief brand officer at Uber and I had

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Speaker 1: just stepped into a big pile of it, and she

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Speaker 1: wanted me on stage at Recode, which is our conference.

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Speaker 1: It was September sev and I went in really prepared

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Speaker 1: to face the fire. You know, I knew she was

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Speaker 1: really going to give it to me. So I was

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Speaker 1: prepared for Kara, But you know who I wasn't prepared

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Speaker 1: for her Mama, her mother, who I met backstage before

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Speaker 1: I even got on stage, and she gave it to

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Speaker 1: me good. I mean, she was just giving me all

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Speaker 1: the questions and Kara, Yes, Kara had to come and

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Speaker 1: break us up. You know, I think she was probably

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Speaker 1: stealing some of Kara's questions. So well, I guess the

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Speaker 1: apple doesn't fall far from the tree, right, those That's

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Speaker 1: exactly right, because I think Kara is an amazing journalist

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Speaker 1: and she's really feared but also revered and that's a

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Speaker 1: tough combination. And we thought that she was the perfect

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Speaker 1: way to kick off our debut podcast together her. She

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Speaker 1: has her finger on the pulse, not just a Silicon valley,

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Speaker 1: but I think the business world in general, and the

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Speaker 1: world of pop culture like you do, Bows right, and

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Speaker 1: fashion because you know what, her affinity for aviators makes

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Speaker 1: a lot more sense. Now I'll tell you that. Ye

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Speaker 1: all right, last show or a movie that you loved.

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Speaker 1: Oh god, there's so many um I think I liked

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Speaker 1: um Oh gosh. That's while I was waiting for Top

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Speaker 1: Gun Too, So I don't know what to say. I

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Speaker 1: love Top Gun to. I was so excited for the

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Speaker 1: sequel and Wonder Woman too. I know it sounds crazy,

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Speaker 1: I'm a big Top Gun fan. Anyway, let's get to it,

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Speaker 1: Kara Swisher. I am super excited because you are our

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Speaker 1: debut guest on Bound Biz with Katie and Bows get

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Speaker 1: it Bows. Oh my god, Like the pandemic has gotten

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Speaker 1: to you. Katie, Oh my god, let me look at

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Speaker 1: Let me look at your bookshelves for those Emmys and

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Speaker 1: those Emmys back there. What's going on? Just if you Kara,

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Speaker 1: just there, just but you and those know each other already,

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Speaker 1: don't How did you guys get to know each other?

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Speaker 1: Of all things? Arianna Huffington's introduced us um At at

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Speaker 1: a graduation she was speaking at in San Francisco for

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Speaker 1: a private girls school and and she, uh, she was

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Speaker 1: she was hiring you to run marketing for or to

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Speaker 1: do marketing for uber Um. And so we met there

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Speaker 1: while Arianna was addressing the young lady the young rich

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Speaker 1: ladies of San Francisco essentially, And I think your daughter

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Speaker 1: went there eventually at some point we're going to do it,

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Speaker 1: but then never moved up to Sanaa anyway. So we

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Speaker 1: met and but at uber and I listened. She had

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Speaker 1: nothing to do with the disaster that was uber. She

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Speaker 1: tried her best, Uh, sort of got sucked into a

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Speaker 1: really really toxic situation. I think that you came in

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Speaker 1: post I think post when everything was already headed downhill exactly.

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Speaker 1: But you know, it's like the I was telling Katie

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Speaker 1: that you were the first person that I talked to

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Speaker 1: when I decided to leave. Ah, oh, that's rightly. I

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Speaker 1: wrote the story inside. Yeah, you know interesting. I talked

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Speaker 1: to Francis Free the other day, who was also another

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Speaker 1: pry excuse me the other day when who was another person?

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Speaker 1: It was a Harvard Business School professor. You know, all

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Speaker 1: these women came in to try to clean up that mess,

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Speaker 1: and uh, and we're not successful. And of course Dark

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Speaker 1: Coaster Shaw Heat today had to lay off I think

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Speaker 1: three thousand people. It's some enormous number of people that

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Speaker 1: people have been laid off, and they're closing down some

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Speaker 1: businesses like freight. Um. It was at the time then

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Speaker 1: everything was going great, and there was it was a

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Speaker 1: culture problem that was born of the CEO, Travis klink

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Speaker 1: and and the people he hired and trying to turning

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Speaker 1: around a success, turning around a success into toxicity. And

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Speaker 1: so you were trying to do that, and to me,

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Speaker 1: it was like putting lipstick on I don't know what,

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Speaker 1: on a coronavirus or something. It was just not good.

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Speaker 1: That's not to make a joke about, but really you

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Speaker 1: were trying to market something that had a fundamental issue

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Speaker 1: with its business and now of course it's because of

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Speaker 1: real issues of health and other things. Well, we're excited

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Speaker 1: to talk to you, Kara, because a lot of the

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Speaker 1: columns you've been writing in the New York Times or

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Speaker 1: precisely some of the things we want to address as

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Speaker 1: we go about this quote unquote new normal or new

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Speaker 1: new future is ray Dalia said, that's right. That's really

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Speaker 1: how how technology has been affected and how technology can

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Speaker 1: help or in cases when it hurts. But before we

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Speaker 1: talk about business, I know we wanted to talk about education. Sure, yes, well,

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Speaker 1: I mean that's the thing. I mean, we're all adjusting, right.

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Speaker 1: You mentioned you have a you know, kids who are

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Speaker 1: looking towards graduation, et cetera. What what do you think

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Speaker 1: is going to happen? Um? In terms of college, I

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Speaker 1: mean virtual college or you thinking of gap years? Like

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Speaker 1: what what do we do or what does what does

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Speaker 1: your your child do? I'm leaving it up to him.

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Speaker 1: He's gotten into two schools and he's gonna be going

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Speaker 1: to n y U and so of course that's hot

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Speaker 1: spots Central um. And I don't know. I'm going to

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Speaker 1: leave it up to him. He every every day is different.

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Speaker 1: He's like, I don't know if I want to do

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Speaker 1: school on zoom. I think it's gonna gonna have to

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Speaker 1: and there's gonna be definitely different. It's not gonna be

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Speaker 1: the freshman experience that that everybody got to have. Um,

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Speaker 1: And so I'm going to leave it up to him.

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Speaker 1: And although I don't know what schools are going to

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Speaker 1: do in terms of everybody taking a gap yere people

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Speaker 1: take a gap year, that changes all the dynamics to

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Speaker 1: the school. UM. So I'm going to let him decide.

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Speaker 1: He's a he's a fine young man and he will

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Speaker 1: figure out what he wants. He's definitely handling it better

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Speaker 1: than most people. Yeah, yeah, but I know that the

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Speaker 1: you know, it's interesting. There are all kind of creative

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Speaker 1: solutions that educators are going to create, right and I

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Speaker 1: guess to engage their students. I mean, you said in

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Speaker 1: a recent column, I know of no parents, including those

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Speaker 1: living and what are considered good school districts, who are

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Speaker 1: happy with their children's online classes terrible. So so what happens?

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Speaker 1: I mean, what are the innovative ways you think that

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Speaker 1: educators are going to be able to gauge? I don't

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Speaker 1: think I think it teaches us that analog learning is

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Speaker 1: so important. I mean, I think they've been trying with

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Speaker 1: these zoom classes, but they're not engaging at all, and

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Speaker 1: they're not They're trying. I have friends who are teachers

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Speaker 1: and they're trying their best. Um, but I think it's

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Speaker 1: very hard to engage people without the one on one that.

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Speaker 1: That's what it shows to me, like that, it's some

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Speaker 1: things are not able to be digitized, and this is

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Speaker 1: one of them. You think education would have gotten a

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Speaker 1: lot further. Um. I think for adults it's a little better.

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Speaker 1: Tons of people are taking webinars and classes and learning

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Speaker 1: to like, I don't know, like cut hair, but not

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Speaker 1: just that, but like play the banjo and those those

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Speaker 1: work okay because adults can take it. But I think

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Speaker 1: young kids you really need to engage them on a

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Speaker 1: one to one level. And I don't know, it just

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Speaker 1: it makes me think that, like how good are schools really? Right?

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Speaker 1: And but I think they have to be one on

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Speaker 1: one and have that social element. Are you surprised, care though,

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Speaker 1: that schools didn't adapt more? You know, you have the

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Speaker 1: con Academy. You would think that they would be a

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Speaker 1: little more forward thinking about digital learning in general and

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Speaker 1: perhaps come up with ways to make it more engaging

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Speaker 1: and more effective. I guess yeah, But think about the

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Speaker 1: equipment you need if you want to do VR. That

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Speaker 1: would be the solution. Right now. First of all, a

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Speaker 1: lot of kids are getting completely lost. Your talk about

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Speaker 1: digital divide. It's crazy. It's crazy, like not having internet access,

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Speaker 1: not having a great device, not just they're just not

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Speaker 1: going to school. They're not which is even worse. You know, Commmit, now,

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Speaker 1: if you get into the VR area, the equipment, you know,

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Speaker 1: it's just not there. It's just not there. And it's

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Speaker 1: not it's pricey, it's it doesn't work that well, that

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Speaker 1: would be the I suppose the thing. But what what

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Speaker 1: does How do you do an engaged curriculum on a screen?

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Speaker 1: You know, you can do it with entertainment, you can

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Speaker 1: do it with chat. But I don't think it translates

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Speaker 1: necessarily because they've been working on educational stuff for a

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Speaker 1: long time online and they thought it was gonna take

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Speaker 1: over everything, and I just I just don't I don't know. Well,

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Speaker 1: let's talk about business. Um, obviously this has upended everything,

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Speaker 1: so we're going to break it down. First. Big tech,

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Speaker 1: your confident places I read like Apple, Facebook, and of

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Speaker 1: course Amazon are going to survive, and I guess, in

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Speaker 1: the case of Amazon, even thrive. They're all I think

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Speaker 1: you talked about how they were larded. I like that

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Speaker 1: word used in your column, larded with enough cash. So

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Speaker 1: what they're too big to fail? Uh, they're not too

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Speaker 1: They're not too big to all. They're too rich to fail.

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Speaker 1: Why should they fail? They have so much money, Like,

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Speaker 1: that's the the issue. They have all this money. Some

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Speaker 1: of them are doing rather well, like the Amazon's stock

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Speaker 1: is really is doing really well because they're providing services

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Speaker 1: right now and everyone else can't keep up. That's the

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Speaker 1: real issue. Is that already, except it's already accelerating trends

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Speaker 1: that have started to happen. Retails already been under duress

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Speaker 1: from companies like mostly Amazon essentially, So now it's not

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Speaker 1: they're not under dress. They're under darressed and they've been

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Speaker 1: closed and they're financially at a disadvantage, and they're not

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Speaker 1: getting VC money. They're not getting like you know, the

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Speaker 1: Delhi or any stores are not getting that. And so

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Speaker 1: so the big companies, not just Amazon, by the Walmart

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Speaker 1: is going to be doing really well because you can

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Speaker 1: go to Walmart's nown essential store, but they also sell

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Speaker 1: like as Stephanie Rule just point out surfboards, like, so

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Speaker 1: what happens to the surfboard guy? Right? He can't? You know,

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Speaker 1: everybody gets used to and doing well in this time here,

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Speaker 1: and they don't have these cushions that these tech companies have.

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Speaker 1: They don't have this technology that the tech companies have

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Speaker 1: to really figure it out. And so say your Google

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Speaker 1: and Facebook and advertising, they're only going to get stronger.

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Speaker 1: Well everybody else look at their layoffs and all the

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Speaker 1: media companies. Google has maybe a little bit of a

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Speaker 1: downturn in the advertising, but when this is over, where

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Speaker 1: people going to go? Google and Facebook? Which is why

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Speaker 1: I assume the government's investigating. Well, also where's the government

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Speaker 1: going to go to get cash? If you also write

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Speaker 1: they're coming after those big, big industries, those big companies

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Speaker 1: because they are so rich and they're going to be

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Speaker 1: paying for a lot of the stuff that we need,

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Speaker 1: right exactly, they're gonna be the company's making money. And

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Speaker 1: so the issue is there's no how can you innovate

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Speaker 1: and how can you keep small businesses alive in this environment?

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Speaker 1: I think the government is doing a very good job

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Speaker 1: of it. As you know, so many stories I mean,

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Speaker 1: the amount of stories of misuse of funds there's going

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Speaker 1: to be in newspaper for for years to come. Um

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Speaker 1: and And I think the issue is that these companies

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Speaker 1: they're they're not just rich, they're rich. There are they

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Speaker 1: can put. Look at all the tech companies like Twitter

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Speaker 1: told his companies employees just to stay home forever. You know,

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Speaker 1: if you want to Google, they can work from home.

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Speaker 1: Facebook they can work from home. It's not ideal, but

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Speaker 1: they certainly have environments where that doesn't hinder their businesses.

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Speaker 1: Big tech had recently been so scrutinized for monopolies, for

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Speaker 1: uh tech addiction, for misinformation and all kinds of things.

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Speaker 1: Now they're bigger fish to fry. So they are probably

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Speaker 1: breathing a bit of a sigh of relief on that front, too,

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Speaker 1: aren't they. Although you know, Bill Bill bar just was

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Speaker 1: talking about that. There's two stories in the journal, and

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Speaker 1: I think there are times about the Google being the

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Speaker 1: case against Google moving forward, the investigation against Schoogle moving forward,

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Speaker 1: and so this is an advertising and so I think

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Speaker 1: it's that was a little bit of a shot across

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Speaker 1: the bowl, like we haven't forgotten. I think the issue

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Speaker 1: is there's less appetite in dis lative areas to do

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Speaker 1: like privacy bill. You know, when they're doing these other things,

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Speaker 1: they can't agree on lunch there, they can't agree. They

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Speaker 1: can't agree on pandemic relief right, like think about it,

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Speaker 1: Like they're not going to agree on what privacy is.

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Speaker 1: Now that's said. Look, you have like Elizabeth Warren and

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Speaker 1: Congresswomen up um AOC is working on this anti merger

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Speaker 1: build during the pandemic. You've got Josh Holly over on

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Speaker 1: the right working with Elizabeth Warren on the bigness of

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Speaker 1: big text. So there are a lot of interesting coalitions

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Speaker 1: forming around that. And they've used the pandemic to redeem themselves.

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Speaker 1: You know, we're not we were we we got rid

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Speaker 1: of those anti vaxers, we did this, we stopped misinformation

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Speaker 1: about that. It only underscores that they can do it.

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Speaker 1: And so when it comes to political stuff they don't

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Speaker 1: do it. But here they've done it. So I think

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Speaker 1: they're using it as a bid for um maybe we're

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Speaker 1: not so bad. But even if they do good, doesn't

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Speaker 1: mean they're not too big. And I think that that'll

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Speaker 1: be their issue going forward. I mean, you you have

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Speaker 1: been talking about some of these Darling's selfcon Valley, but

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Speaker 1: they're they're facing challenges too. You know, we talked about

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Speaker 1: Uber a little bit, um Airbnb. There there's so many

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Speaker 1: who are facing challenges, and obviously, as a marketer, i'd

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Speaker 1: love to talk about, you know, perception, brand perception. What

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Speaker 1: is happening in press that affects those businesses. What are

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Speaker 1: your thoughts? Well, I think of the Uber ads, they're

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Speaker 1: I'm glad you're not driving. I'm glad you know, It's

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Speaker 1: like it's like sort of Wendy saying I'm glad you're

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Speaker 1: not eating and eating it's not such a hot thing.

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Speaker 1: I was fascinating, you know, there was that whole thing

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Speaker 1: together of all the words they use. Now you know,

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Speaker 1: we're here to help family, hope, stay home, stay safe,

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Speaker 1: We're here for you, We're here for you. Um. I

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Speaker 1: was really fascinated by the Uber ones with the tinkling music.

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Speaker 1: I'm not sure if it worked that I liked them

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Speaker 1: any better. I don't know why they spent money on

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Speaker 1: it telling me not to get in a car. I

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Speaker 1: don't know what did you think? Well, it's it's it's

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Speaker 1: actually funny because there are so many different ways to

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Speaker 1: present the same idea, right, right, And and so what

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Speaker 1: brands need to do is figure out actually how to

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Speaker 1: just take that idea of comfort and make it sound

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Speaker 1: like it's coming from them, but not also destroy your business,

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Speaker 1: you know, on top of it. But what's the use

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Speaker 1: of a marketing ad that says, please don't get in

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Speaker 1: a car if you're a car rental, you know, a

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Speaker 1: car sharing company. I just don't. I don't get it.

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Speaker 1: I don't get I was sort of sort almost wrote

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Speaker 1: to her because you're hating, was like, okay, alright, like

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Speaker 1: please please don't do what we do. I also feel

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Speaker 1: like there's so many of those ads going on now,

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Speaker 1: you guys, they all kind of blur together. For me.

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Speaker 1: Of course, they all wore my herd and I'm like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: but I can't remember who's doing what. They all start

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Speaker 1: to feel pretty duplicative to me, and and then I

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Speaker 1: start feeling like you're just jumping on this band and

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Speaker 1: kind of get turned off. Yeah, but that's the whole point,

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Speaker 1: is that they should be melding and molding their conversation

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Speaker 1: in this way, but affecting their own business, you know.

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Speaker 1: So I would love an add that this sucks. We

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Speaker 1: had a late pop all off and you're not getting

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Speaker 1: in cars like, hey, come back to us when things

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Speaker 1: are better, we'll give you. Everyone gets a mask or

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Speaker 1: something that's that's more helpful for me what I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. It's interesting that that uber is advertising.

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Speaker 1: I didn't see one from Airbnb, which of course is

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Speaker 1: really talk about a company that's really terrific, has a

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Speaker 1: great product, and it's really strained at every aspect of

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Speaker 1: their business. Was has set to go public? I mean,

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Speaker 1: can you I'm interviewing Brian Chowsky later this week about that.

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Speaker 1: But it's just like that one is really like what

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Speaker 1: do you do? There's nothing to be said except you're

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Speaker 1: in the wrong business at this moment in time. I

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Speaker 1: think their eventually people will be fine. They'll be a vaccine.

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Speaker 1: People will go back to it because it's a good product,

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Speaker 1: right like you have the differential between the good products.

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Speaker 1: It's just because of this particular pandemic and the actual

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Speaker 1: structural things those there's not cyclical, they're sort of pandemical.

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Speaker 1: And then there's things like gyms that you may not

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Speaker 1: go back to. A movie theaters is a really good thing.

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Speaker 1: Movie theaters are already on the down swing, right except

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Speaker 1: for like an Alamo drafthouse that had an experiential kind

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Speaker 1: of element to it, and so movie theaters are already

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Speaker 1: on the downtown. That's why you're seeing all these stories

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Speaker 1: whether Amazon's going to buy a MC or Disney would

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Speaker 1: buy one of them, because they don't matter anymore, like

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Speaker 1: they don't there. It's it's an opportunity for those companies

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Speaker 1: and it's a business that people stopped doing, and so

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Speaker 1: that's the issue. Are you a structural problem. You have

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Speaker 1: a structural problem where people aren't doing the same thing

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Speaker 1: with with retail like there was just was a specialties.

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Speaker 1: Specialties was a fifties store. Is not a huge business,

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Speaker 1: but they have a lot in San Francisco. It started

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Speaker 1: in San Francisco, great sandwich store. It was a great chain.

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Speaker 1: It was doing great. It's closing down. It doesn't have

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Speaker 1: the financial resources to stay in business, and it doesn't

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Speaker 1: know when people are going to be the whole structural

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Speaker 1: change of people being at the office. It's not just

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Speaker 1: for the pandemic. People are going to be going to

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Speaker 1: the office as much and therefore the businesses all around it.

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Speaker 1: Parking garages, delis things like that, they're all going to

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Speaker 1: be impacted, and so I think people don't think about

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Speaker 1: that the community around these companies and how much they'll

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Speaker 1: be hurting. But let's just go through some other sectors. Kara,

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Speaker 1: what about the future of airlines and travel and the

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Speaker 1: whole leisure kind of vacation industry. Well, I'm always fascinated

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Speaker 1: by There was a story that that cruises have open

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Speaker 1: and there have never been more full, Like right, everyone's

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Speaker 1: dying to it. So there is an element of people

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Speaker 1: who take cruises are going to take cruises, and they've

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Speaker 1: got to just put in practices into place that are

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Speaker 1: going to keep people safer because you know, in this

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Speaker 1: whole thing, the whole the whole idea of what's happened

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Speaker 1: here is analog has struck back pretty hard, and we

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Speaker 1: realize how much analog stuff we do. I don't think

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Speaker 1: people are suddenly not going to be on planes. There's

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Speaker 1: just gonna be different practices going on planes are gonna

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Speaker 1: be much more aware of things. And the person who

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Speaker 1: was on your plane that was always marrying a mask

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Speaker 1: isn't weird anymore, right, And maybe they'll hand them out

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Speaker 1: and they'll have Jet Blue on the front or whatever

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Speaker 1: the heck they'll have. But I think it's like if

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Speaker 1: if you were I don't know if you're old in

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Speaker 1: the buzz, but I know Katie and I are. When

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Speaker 1: we used to go. When I was a kid, we

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Speaker 1: used to go through airports right to the gate if

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Speaker 1: there was no security. Like I was telling my kid that,

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Speaker 1: I was trying to make them feel better. Of course,

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Speaker 1: it didn't about not being in school. I was like, oh,

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Speaker 1: what we used to go. Things change and they don't

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Speaker 1: go back, and so we had security. Used to walk

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Speaker 1: through the gates. Then we had a level of security.

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Speaker 1: Now we have enormous security. Over time, it's the same

424
00:21:09,720 --> 00:21:11,560
Speaker 1: thing with it. It's going to be a different experience

425
00:21:11,560 --> 00:21:14,560
Speaker 1: and everyone will adjust to it. You'll get on later,

426
00:21:14,640 --> 00:21:17,840
Speaker 1: you'll get on. It'll be slower, you'll have masks, there

427
00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:21,240
Speaker 1: might be you know, all kinds of things. Now. Interestingly, airlines,

428
00:21:21,280 --> 00:21:23,320
Speaker 1: they flow the air pretty quickly in those things, so

429
00:21:23,359 --> 00:21:27,560
Speaker 1: I think people will feel better. We'll go back to

430
00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:30,320
Speaker 1: that much quicker than you think. Can I just mention

431
00:21:30,400 --> 00:21:33,399
Speaker 1: one thing you guys on airlines while we're on this topic,

432
00:21:34,119 --> 00:21:37,040
Speaker 1: I've heard about these flights where they're packed in like sardines,

433
00:21:37,640 --> 00:21:40,880
Speaker 1: And I'm like, what what is going on here? Why

434
00:21:40,920 --> 00:21:43,840
Speaker 1: aren't they taking this more seriously? And yes, I've heard

435
00:21:43,880 --> 00:21:47,679
Speaker 1: about the air recirculating too, but it seems to me

436
00:21:47,800 --> 00:21:51,399
Speaker 1: that they're not taking proper precautions. What is that all about?

437
00:21:51,480 --> 00:21:53,359
Speaker 1: If they want to get people back? Right? So they

438
00:21:53,440 --> 00:21:55,840
Speaker 1: so that because these loads, when they load these airlines,

439
00:21:55,880 --> 00:21:58,120
Speaker 1: they should have these middle seats empty. Even then though

440
00:21:58,160 --> 00:21:59,800
Speaker 1: you know what I mean, Like you can do all

441
00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:02,040
Speaker 1: you want, there's people in an enclosed space and this

442
00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:05,360
Speaker 1: is like, hello, hello virus, that kind of thing, even

443
00:22:05,400 --> 00:22:07,600
Speaker 1: when there's just a regular virus or a cold, everybody

444
00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:09,520
Speaker 1: get Yet You've been on lots of planes, you know that.

445
00:22:09,920 --> 00:22:12,160
Speaker 1: And so I think it'll be really interesting to see

446
00:22:12,200 --> 00:22:14,720
Speaker 1: how they're going to play it. I think probably people

447
00:22:14,720 --> 00:22:16,640
Speaker 1: will go back to it's just at a different level

448
00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:19,240
Speaker 1: and they can find different reasons not to fly. And again,

449
00:22:19,520 --> 00:22:22,000
Speaker 1: digital means have made it so you don't have to.

450
00:22:22,119 --> 00:22:25,400
Speaker 1: Like I was talking to a big broadcast network. You've

451
00:22:25,400 --> 00:22:28,800
Speaker 1: worked for all of them? Is that correct? I? Okay,

452
00:22:28,880 --> 00:22:31,199
Speaker 1: thank goodness, Okay, that wasn't that one, but it was

453
00:22:31,240 --> 00:22:32,919
Speaker 1: one of the ones you work for, Katie, And they

454
00:22:32,960 --> 00:22:35,480
Speaker 1: were talking about those those those upfronts that they would

455
00:22:35,520 --> 00:22:37,439
Speaker 1: go to and stuff. And this guy was like, Oh,

456
00:22:37,480 --> 00:22:39,480
Speaker 1: we'd pay a lot of money. We fly first class,

457
00:22:39,560 --> 00:22:41,800
Speaker 1: we get in the town cars, we go to the hotels,

458
00:22:41,800 --> 00:22:43,760
Speaker 1: we've had the dinners. You've been to a million of those.

459
00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:45,719
Speaker 1: And he's like, we did it all in two hours

460
00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:48,639
Speaker 1: on the phone, like the decisions it needed to be made,

461
00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:51,520
Speaker 1: and so why would we do it that way again?

462
00:22:51,600 --> 00:22:53,800
Speaker 1: Why would we spend all that money again? It's like

463
00:22:53,800 --> 00:22:57,040
Speaker 1: the three martini lunch. Yeah, right, and they that stopped

464
00:22:57,040 --> 00:22:59,119
Speaker 1: and it was replaced by something else, And so I

465
00:22:59,160 --> 00:23:02,439
Speaker 1: think that but will begin to reconsider. If you're not

466
00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:05,440
Speaker 1: a business person, you're not reconsidering all costs and thinking

467
00:23:05,440 --> 00:23:08,520
Speaker 1: about what you can digitize, you're not really good business person.

468
00:23:08,920 --> 00:23:11,520
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, I mean, but speaking of the three martini lunch,

469
00:23:11,720 --> 00:23:14,080
Speaker 1: what happens to restaurants? You know, what happens to that

470
00:23:14,359 --> 00:23:18,919
Speaker 1: decimated dining experience? Even after you think yeah, because I

471
00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:21,000
Speaker 1: think speaking of Uber, one of the bright spots has

472
00:23:21,000 --> 00:23:23,359
Speaker 1: been Uber eats, right, and so what and they're talking

473
00:23:23,440 --> 00:23:26,439
Speaker 1: there was rumors of them being buying Grubhub. Well, they

474
00:23:26,440 --> 00:23:29,080
Speaker 1: would have of the delivery market in the United States,

475
00:23:29,119 --> 00:23:31,040
Speaker 1: I'm not counting New York because there's so much delivery

476
00:23:31,040 --> 00:23:33,119
Speaker 1: in New York and that's sort of a it's already

477
00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:37,520
Speaker 1: a system in place most restaurants, but you know, they'd

478
00:23:37,520 --> 00:23:40,880
Speaker 1: have their I think George ash would have, Uber would

479
00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:44,520
Speaker 1: have that's a crazy amount of control over the market, right,

480
00:23:44,800 --> 00:23:48,520
Speaker 1: And so people like that, like the delivery experience. If

481
00:23:48,560 --> 00:23:50,320
Speaker 1: they that, they get around and get used to it,

482
00:23:50,359 --> 00:23:52,600
Speaker 1: and so even if a small portion of it moves

483
00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:55,760
Speaker 1: from going to a restaurant to using these availing themselves,

484
00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:58,920
Speaker 1: that really can hit these restaurants hard. Um. And and

485
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:01,159
Speaker 1: you know you talked to a restaurant person, this was

486
00:24:01,200 --> 00:24:04,600
Speaker 1: already a problem. These delivery fees that these companies take

487
00:24:05,440 --> 00:24:08,160
Speaker 1: off the top, this is gonna kill them. Same thing

488
00:24:08,160 --> 00:24:10,640
Speaker 1: with grocery stores. And after Amazon can deliver, if only

489
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:15,000
Speaker 1: a small amount of people now like delivery by by Amazon,

490
00:24:15,920 --> 00:24:18,480
Speaker 1: they're gonna use it. People people start to get used

491
00:24:18,520 --> 00:24:20,639
Speaker 1: to things, and so once it's it's I hate to

492
00:24:20,680 --> 00:24:22,680
Speaker 1: say it, but it's been a real marketing event for

493
00:24:22,800 --> 00:24:27,240
Speaker 1: things like streaming, like Disney streaming or um or anything.

494
00:24:27,320 --> 00:24:29,840
Speaker 1: It's been a marketing event for for for a lot

495
00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:32,000
Speaker 1: of these people because people get introduced to the product.

496
00:24:32,640 --> 00:24:35,040
Speaker 1: I think. I think the restaurant business, though, care has

497
00:24:35,040 --> 00:24:38,199
Speaker 1: got to come back. People, I mean, their social lives

498
00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:41,919
Speaker 1: revolve around meeting friends at restaurants. Maybe not right away,

499
00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:44,840
Speaker 1: but don't you think they didn't come back. I don't.

500
00:24:44,880 --> 00:24:46,880
Speaker 1: I think it's gonna be. It's it's already been a tray.

501
00:24:47,080 --> 00:24:49,720
Speaker 1: Same thing with retail. I mean certain retails certainly, but

502
00:24:50,080 --> 00:24:54,800
Speaker 1: in general that any trends that were present are accelerated.

503
00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:56,080
Speaker 1: And that's what you have to think about it. If

504
00:24:56,119 --> 00:25:00,720
Speaker 1: it's accelerated, it's it's act. And then how by tech

505
00:25:00,960 --> 00:25:03,480
Speaker 1: you're really you're really You could go around from industry

506
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:06,680
Speaker 1: to industry and look at this streaming entertainment like people

507
00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:09,040
Speaker 1: have been using these look at Netflix never been more

508
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:12,120
Speaker 1: useful and people never been bigger usage. Now I think

509
00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:14,000
Speaker 1: people are going to stay in those zones. And they

510
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:17,200
Speaker 1: were already doing home theaters, they were already the technology

511
00:25:17,200 --> 00:25:20,040
Speaker 1: availed itself getting these screens and the ease of use

512
00:25:20,040 --> 00:25:22,240
Speaker 1: and stuff like that. And so I do like Disney

513
00:25:22,320 --> 00:25:26,199
Speaker 1: launching the streaming platform and speaking which Kevin Marriage is

514
00:25:26,240 --> 00:25:29,240
Speaker 1: left to go to TikTok to b ceo, TikTok, those

515
00:25:29,280 --> 00:25:31,160
Speaker 1: kind of things are going to do really well because

516
00:25:32,080 --> 00:25:34,560
Speaker 1: this this stuff has people have gotten used to and

517
00:25:34,560 --> 00:25:37,000
Speaker 1: are trying now. Not everything's gonna work. You saw Quimby.

518
00:25:37,400 --> 00:25:41,399
Speaker 1: I was going to say, what happened to Quimby? But

519
00:25:41,520 --> 00:25:43,440
Speaker 1: we'll see, We'll see. It's a lot of money spent.

520
00:25:43,520 --> 00:25:45,600
Speaker 1: It's certainly they collect I think a hundred and thirty

521
00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:48,360
Speaker 1: billion dollars. Uh, it's a lot of money. And it's

522
00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:51,200
Speaker 1: a question they were hoping for commuters right that people

523
00:25:51,240 --> 00:25:53,840
Speaker 1: were on. So that's the issue is that I don't

524
00:25:53,840 --> 00:25:56,200
Speaker 1: think some of the product isn't good, and I think

525
00:25:56,200 --> 00:25:57,600
Speaker 1: some of the product is quite good. And it's an

526
00:25:57,600 --> 00:26:00,639
Speaker 1: interesting idea. It's just there's a lot of options out there. Well,

527
00:26:00,720 --> 00:26:03,919
Speaker 1: let's talk about TikTok. Yeah. Yeah, because my daughter, I

528
00:26:03,920 --> 00:26:07,400
Speaker 1: mean almost eleven year old, she has an account. She

529
00:26:07,760 --> 00:26:10,720
Speaker 1: posts a video. Hell, I don't know, a hundred times

530
00:26:10,720 --> 00:26:13,800
Speaker 1: a day she's begging me to join. I've seen so

531
00:26:13,840 --> 00:26:18,159
Speaker 1: many of those videos, you know, these is TikTok. This

532
00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:21,280
Speaker 1: is a TikTok. This is TikTok, and she loves it,

533
00:26:21,440 --> 00:26:24,040
Speaker 1: you know. But also, I mean we've seen other platforms

534
00:26:24,040 --> 00:26:26,280
Speaker 1: that are doing so well, like Zoom, you know, we've

535
00:26:26,280 --> 00:26:29,240
Speaker 1: been thinking about that and how much that's increase in use.

536
00:26:29,600 --> 00:26:33,000
Speaker 1: So what about those platforms is as ways to recover

537
00:26:33,400 --> 00:26:35,640
Speaker 1: maybe some of the central company, And I think it's

538
00:26:35,640 --> 00:26:37,160
Speaker 1: going to fall off once this is over. I don't

539
00:26:37,160 --> 00:26:39,400
Speaker 1: think Zoom is good, and Zoom was under stress because

540
00:26:39,400 --> 00:26:40,919
Speaker 1: of the privacy and security. I don't know if you've

541
00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:43,280
Speaker 1: gotten zoom bomb, but I certainly did. I wanted to

542
00:26:43,320 --> 00:26:48,159
Speaker 1: be Zoom. Let me just tell you. You do not

543
00:26:48,200 --> 00:26:50,359
Speaker 1: want to be Zoom. Trust me. It was what detends

544
00:26:50,400 --> 00:26:53,359
Speaker 1: what they're bombing me. They're never bombing it was good

545
00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:58,280
Speaker 1: good porns. It's always real dirty gross porn. Okay, right,

546
00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:01,679
Speaker 1: not cood point. We don't want that. We don't want.

547
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:04,200
Speaker 1: You know, you have to select your porn, Katie, as

548
00:27:04,240 --> 00:27:06,399
Speaker 1: you know, as if I have a user of porn.

549
00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:10,600
Speaker 1: I mean you have to choose it and to promise. Okay, anyway,

550
00:27:11,160 --> 00:27:14,920
Speaker 1: let's are we too old to get on TikTok? No? No,

551
00:27:15,280 --> 00:27:18,040
Speaker 1: you're wrong? Yes, Okay, you get the yes because it's

552
00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:22,240
Speaker 1: not you're wrong. You're completely wrong. Tell me why. Oh

553
00:27:22,320 --> 00:27:25,680
Speaker 1: my god, it's it's like when it's like when all

554
00:27:25,760 --> 00:27:30,080
Speaker 1: the adults got on Facebook and ruined it. Now because

555
00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:32,800
Speaker 1: it's so the algorithms are so good, you get the

556
00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:34,760
Speaker 1: things you want to get, and so I don't think

557
00:27:34,760 --> 00:27:37,080
Speaker 1: it's quite like that. I don't think it's so apparent

558
00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:41,280
Speaker 1: they use algorithmic selection so well compared to everybody else,

559
00:27:41,280 --> 00:27:43,560
Speaker 1: knowing what you want and feeding you what you want

560
00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:45,399
Speaker 1: and so you can stay in your little zones. What

561
00:27:45,480 --> 00:27:47,240
Speaker 1: I think is interesting. I've interviewed a lot of people

562
00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:49,640
Speaker 1: and I think they did one podcast with Gary Vaynerchick

563
00:27:49,680 --> 00:27:53,000
Speaker 1: and a lot of business people are trying out TikTok

564
00:27:53,480 --> 00:27:55,800
Speaker 1: and so is There was a great story in the

565
00:27:55,840 --> 00:27:57,760
Speaker 1: time to say about a vegan chef who was an

566
00:27:57,760 --> 00:27:59,719
Speaker 1: actress who was sort of a didn't do very well

567
00:27:59,760 --> 00:28:02,080
Speaker 1: and actress and now has been doing these lovely videos

568
00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:05,600
Speaker 1: on TikTok and now she's a big hit shaded like

569
00:28:05,720 --> 00:28:09,000
Speaker 1: so like there you see how it looks really thin.

570
00:28:09,680 --> 00:28:11,720
Speaker 1: Now you've got a few strips, But you know what

571
00:28:11,880 --> 00:28:13,520
Speaker 1: you want more than this? Do there because there should

572
00:28:13,520 --> 00:28:16,239
Speaker 1: be business. You're gonna use some liquid smokes, you know.

573
00:28:16,440 --> 00:28:19,160
Speaker 1: And look at Sarah Cooper, who's amazing. She's a she's

574
00:28:19,160 --> 00:28:21,119
Speaker 1: a comic. She left Google. I had done a cod

575
00:28:21,160 --> 00:28:22,639
Speaker 1: passed with her when she left Google to be a

576
00:28:22,680 --> 00:28:25,480
Speaker 1: comic a long time ago, and now she does the

577
00:28:25,520 --> 00:28:29,160
Speaker 1: Trump She does the Trump voice with her acting it out.

578
00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:32,240
Speaker 1: It's wonderful and she's become like a real sensation. I

579
00:28:32,240 --> 00:28:34,200
Speaker 1: think she's going to parlay that into something there because

580
00:28:34,200 --> 00:28:36,960
Speaker 1: she's so talented. Not only that, but Gara there was

581
00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:41,160
Speaker 1: also a Washington Post reporter who's doing critical reporting. He's

582
00:28:41,240 --> 00:28:44,600
Speaker 1: kind of young, and he's getting younger people. He's for

583
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:48,600
Speaker 1: educating them, making them more knowledgeable, and really engaging them. Hello,

584
00:28:48,680 --> 00:28:51,320
Speaker 1: old have you recently downloaded the op TikTok but you're

585
00:28:51,320 --> 00:28:53,480
Speaker 1: not quite sure what it's for. Well, I'm here with

586
00:28:53,480 --> 00:28:56,480
Speaker 1: a self proclaimed expert on TikTok, David Jorgenson. Dave, tell

587
00:28:56,560 --> 00:28:59,080
Speaker 1: us what TikTok is. It's like a viral video app.

588
00:28:59,280 --> 00:29:01,480
Speaker 1: And what is the or you page. It's kind of

589
00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:03,080
Speaker 1: like your news feed. You're probably on it right now.

590
00:29:03,600 --> 00:29:09,560
Speaker 1: And tell me why is the Washington Post on TikTok? Uh? So,

591
00:29:09,800 --> 00:29:12,400
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go with kar on this. Bows I think

592
00:29:12,400 --> 00:29:16,440
Speaker 1: that business ignore TikTok at their own peril, and I

593
00:29:16,480 --> 00:29:20,000
Speaker 1: think it's you know, I'm a big believer in you

594
00:29:20,120 --> 00:29:22,480
Speaker 1: just have to be on as many platforms as you can.

595
00:29:22,600 --> 00:29:25,640
Speaker 1: Mass media is now an oxymoron and you just have

596
00:29:25,760 --> 00:29:30,560
Speaker 1: to consider aggregate viewers, aggregate listeners, you know, And I

597
00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:33,360
Speaker 1: think Karra has done an incredible job at that. Yeah,

598
00:29:33,360 --> 00:29:35,000
Speaker 1: I don't thinking of TikTok all the time now after

599
00:29:35,040 --> 00:29:36,880
Speaker 1: I did this interview with Karri v Intertrik, because he's

600
00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:39,080
Speaker 1: doing advice, Like if you you could like there's no

601
00:29:39,160 --> 00:29:42,080
Speaker 1: real there's there should be a really important business element

602
00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:45,600
Speaker 1: giving business advice on TikTok. It's a much more flexible

603
00:29:45,640 --> 00:29:47,880
Speaker 1: platform than in Instagram, which is sort of seen as

604
00:29:48,040 --> 00:29:51,080
Speaker 1: entertainment right. TikTok is not yet formed, and so it

605
00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:54,160
Speaker 1: can do a lot of things. You're listening to the

606
00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:57,720
Speaker 1: debut episode of Back to Biz with Katie and Bows.

607
00:29:57,840 --> 00:30:01,160
Speaker 1: When we return, Kara talks about how we all have

608
00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:15,720
Speaker 1: to view essential workers in an entirely new light, whether

609
00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:19,120
Speaker 1: your event needed one room or an entire conference center.

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634
00:31:49,160 --> 00:31:52,200
Speaker 1: to Biz with Katie and Bows. Let's get back to it.

635
00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:57,000
Speaker 1: Let's return to our conversation. With Kara Switcher. Of all

636
00:31:57,040 --> 00:32:01,120
Speaker 1: things that this has shown is how many people are exposed,

637
00:32:01,240 --> 00:32:04,040
Speaker 1: especially because of the gig economy, which was fueled by

638
00:32:04,080 --> 00:32:08,280
Speaker 1: tech companies like Uber. Everybody, all of them use use contractors.

639
00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:10,200
Speaker 1: And I think I had a really good podcast with

640
00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:12,640
Speaker 1: Nicole Hannah Jones, who is who who did the sixteen

641
00:32:12,720 --> 00:32:15,240
Speaker 1: nineteen projects. She writes about inequality for The New York Times,

642
00:32:15,640 --> 00:32:17,920
Speaker 1: which was all about this idea of we call them

643
00:32:18,040 --> 00:32:21,400
Speaker 1: essential workers now when in fact, before this we treated

644
00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:24,280
Speaker 1: them as if they were not essential, not in essential

645
00:32:24,280 --> 00:32:25,959
Speaker 1: in terms of how we paid them, or kind of

646
00:32:25,960 --> 00:32:29,960
Speaker 1: healthcare or any kind of benefits. They're sacrificial workers then.

647
00:32:30,040 --> 00:32:32,719
Speaker 1: And it creates this sort of with New York magazine

648
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:36,040
Speaker 1: called Rich Corona, Poor Corona. Right, there's these lords and

649
00:32:36,080 --> 00:32:38,800
Speaker 1: the serfs, and we're seeing that. We're seeing that in

650
00:32:38,840 --> 00:32:40,920
Speaker 1: real time with people who are not protected, and we've

651
00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:44,520
Speaker 1: got to really start to think hard about focus on people,

652
00:32:44,600 --> 00:32:47,360
Speaker 1: not corporations. And well, I guess the question is you

653
00:32:47,400 --> 00:32:50,000
Speaker 1: talked all these big mockers. I mean, do you think

654
00:32:50,000 --> 00:32:52,680
Speaker 1: they have the stomach and the will to say we're

655
00:32:52,680 --> 00:32:55,920
Speaker 1: gonna start treating these essential workers better. You have had

656
00:32:55,920 --> 00:33:00,320
Speaker 1: that nightmare story for Amazon. You know, Walmart workers didn't

657
00:33:00,320 --> 00:33:03,400
Speaker 1: get mass for the longest time. I mean, do you

658
00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:06,000
Speaker 1: think there's going to be a real shift in attitude? Well,

659
00:33:06,040 --> 00:33:08,600
Speaker 1: look at that Amazon story was interesting because one of

660
00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:10,880
Speaker 1: the stories I read was like they happened after Jess

661
00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:13,600
Speaker 1: Bezos saw it and visited a warehouse, not until then.

662
00:33:13,760 --> 00:33:16,080
Speaker 1: So I don't think they're in the presence of mind

663
00:33:16,080 --> 00:33:18,880
Speaker 1: to think of these workers as anything but sacrificial. They're not.

664
00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:21,360
Speaker 1: They haven't they do. The idea of what an employee

665
00:33:21,400 --> 00:33:24,440
Speaker 1: is has to change right very drastically because in this

666
00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:26,880
Speaker 1: economy a lot of people are contractors, and so what

667
00:33:27,080 --> 00:33:29,480
Speaker 1: is an employee? Do they how do they get benefits?

668
00:33:29,480 --> 00:33:31,680
Speaker 1: How do they get child childcare? Look at look at

669
00:33:31,680 --> 00:33:34,240
Speaker 1: the issues around childcare right now. Anyone who has a

670
00:33:34,440 --> 00:33:39,480
Speaker 1: young kids, no matter what they're they're monetary wealth right

671
00:33:39,520 --> 00:33:42,080
Speaker 1: now unless you can force someone to work for you

672
00:33:42,160 --> 00:33:44,040
Speaker 1: and fly them to I don't know, kirk Turks and

673
00:33:44,120 --> 00:33:48,880
Speaker 1: cages wherever you live. Everyone is now understands the childcare

674
00:33:48,920 --> 00:33:51,200
Speaker 1: crisis in this country because they don't have childcare all

675
00:33:51,240 --> 00:33:53,400
Speaker 1: of a sudden, And I think that's the kind of

676
00:33:53,400 --> 00:33:55,000
Speaker 1: thing we have to think about these workers is that

677
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:57,240
Speaker 1: they're not paid enough. They don't they aren't able to

678
00:33:57,280 --> 00:33:59,880
Speaker 1: make a living wage, and we're taking we're feeling it

679
00:34:00,080 --> 00:34:04,000
Speaker 1: is a tiny bit in in inconvenient ways. Yeah, but

680
00:34:04,040 --> 00:34:06,360
Speaker 1: speaking of the employees, you know, this is such an

681
00:34:06,400 --> 00:34:10,319
Speaker 1: interesting topic around you know, sacrificial workers. By the way,

682
00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:14,839
Speaker 1: that just blew my mind with amazing I love it.

683
00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:17,799
Speaker 1: A sacrificial workers. I'm going to use that from now

684
00:34:17,840 --> 00:34:20,279
Speaker 1: on because that is absolutely the truth. Thing gets the

685
00:34:20,320 --> 00:34:23,160
Speaker 1: center of it. Um, but you've talked about you know,

686
00:34:23,480 --> 00:34:27,040
Speaker 1: w f H working from home right, and um, what

687
00:34:27,200 --> 00:34:29,319
Speaker 1: that's going to be like? So what do you think

688
00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:31,879
Speaker 1: of that? I mean, what what happens? Because Twitter right

689
00:34:31,960 --> 00:34:36,760
Speaker 1: just announced that couple from home like indefinitely, what happens?

690
00:34:36,880 --> 00:34:39,480
Speaker 1: How does that affect a lot of people can't work

691
00:34:39,520 --> 00:34:42,279
Speaker 1: from home? They can't they have analog jobs, people who

692
00:34:42,360 --> 00:34:44,600
Speaker 1: work for the m T A say, or people who

693
00:34:44,760 --> 00:34:49,040
Speaker 1: you know, public transit, anyone who works delivery. Lots of

694
00:34:49,040 --> 00:34:50,840
Speaker 1: people can't work from home. And so what are we

695
00:34:50,880 --> 00:34:54,000
Speaker 1: gonna do for those people? You know, it's very it's

696
00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:56,520
Speaker 1: easy for people knowledge workers to do this, you know,

697
00:34:56,600 --> 00:34:58,879
Speaker 1: so Twitter like doesn't matter where they are doing their

698
00:34:58,880 --> 00:35:00,760
Speaker 1: coding it doesn't that they have a they're not connection

699
00:35:00,760 --> 00:35:03,359
Speaker 1: in their computer. They're just fine like that kind of thing.

700
00:35:03,360 --> 00:35:04,799
Speaker 1: And so what we've got to think about that this

701
00:35:04,880 --> 00:35:08,000
Speaker 1: country is is more than just knowledge or else we

702
00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:10,400
Speaker 1: make everyone a knowledge worker, which isn't going to have right,

703
00:35:10,480 --> 00:35:13,200
Speaker 1: you know. I mean it's a really interesting questions. How

704
00:35:13,239 --> 00:35:15,719
Speaker 1: do we how do you work from home? And we

705
00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:17,719
Speaker 1: do it in such a way that people can have

706
00:35:17,880 --> 00:35:22,120
Speaker 1: good childcare, good health care um and and a good

707
00:35:22,120 --> 00:35:24,480
Speaker 1: working wage. I mean, when they say they're going to

708
00:35:24,560 --> 00:35:27,720
Speaker 1: give two more dollars to people for you know, combat pay, essentially,

709
00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:30,480
Speaker 1: it's sort of that it's so insulting to me, you

710
00:35:30,520 --> 00:35:33,000
Speaker 1: know what I mean. Like or teachers, how are they

711
00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:35,839
Speaker 1: going to deal with not having been trained in technology

712
00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:38,080
Speaker 1: and now having to teach courses and make them interesting.

713
00:35:38,960 --> 00:35:40,919
Speaker 1: They're just sort of here's a zoom, like good luck,

714
00:35:41,239 --> 00:35:43,920
Speaker 1: Like what like, excuse me? This is how we're educating

715
00:35:43,960 --> 00:35:46,719
Speaker 1: our kids. And so I think I think we have

716
00:35:46,760 --> 00:35:49,120
Speaker 1: to have a real public private partnership on this stuff,

717
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:51,960
Speaker 1: because look, this administration has been incompetent on every aspect.

718
00:35:51,960 --> 00:35:54,280
Speaker 1: You can't I can't imagine they're thinking for the future

719
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:56,719
Speaker 1: of like what do we do next, you know, or

720
00:35:56,719 --> 00:35:59,920
Speaker 1: how do we return? Who are you impressed by? I mean,

721
00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:03,279
Speaker 1: if we ever needed some leader great leaders and and

722
00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:07,600
Speaker 1: thoughtful leaders and thought leaders and all of the above,

723
00:36:07,760 --> 00:36:10,480
Speaker 1: it's now. So who do you think is providing that

724
00:36:10,600 --> 00:36:13,240
Speaker 1: kind of leadership, whether it's in the in the world

725
00:36:13,239 --> 00:36:16,000
Speaker 1: of tech or outside of tech cacra. Well, you know,

726
00:36:16,080 --> 00:36:18,439
Speaker 1: there's different people that have different voices. You know, Look,

727
00:36:18,480 --> 00:36:20,880
Speaker 1: you can't help. But someone who was who I've been

728
00:36:20,960 --> 00:36:23,200
Speaker 1: very tough on over the many years, Bill Gates, But

729
00:36:23,239 --> 00:36:25,920
Speaker 1: I think they've been He's been really prescient about this

730
00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:27,960
Speaker 1: thing and what are we gonna do next around healthcare?

731
00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:31,160
Speaker 1: And his wife Melinda Gates is really interesting. I think

732
00:36:31,520 --> 00:36:33,520
Speaker 1: I'm just thinking tech leaders. I think Mark bennie Off

733
00:36:33,680 --> 00:36:35,560
Speaker 1: has been one of the most outspoken about the idea

734
00:36:35,560 --> 00:36:38,480
Speaker 1: of compassionate capitalism and how to get there and how

735
00:36:38,560 --> 00:36:40,440
Speaker 1: you have to you have to figure out a new

736
00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:44,920
Speaker 1: ways of treating workers, um and creatively educating them and

737
00:36:45,000 --> 00:36:47,840
Speaker 1: creatively caring for them. I think that he's talked about

738
00:36:47,880 --> 00:36:51,160
Speaker 1: a lot of stuff. Um. You know, there's some politicians

739
00:36:51,160 --> 00:36:53,440
Speaker 1: you can't help but admire. Elizabeth Warren. In terms of

740
00:36:53,480 --> 00:36:55,719
Speaker 1: some of them, I think she's the only politician I'll

741
00:36:55,719 --> 00:36:57,720
Speaker 1: tell you a big tech is nervous about the idea

742
00:36:57,719 --> 00:37:01,880
Speaker 1: of Vice President Elizabeth Warren has got them wedding because

743
00:37:01,960 --> 00:37:04,719
Speaker 1: you know, she's she's super thoughtful about what we need

744
00:37:04,760 --> 00:37:06,520
Speaker 1: to do, and she's been talking about this issue for

745
00:37:06,640 --> 00:37:09,759
Speaker 1: the plight of workers and the average person for a

746
00:37:09,880 --> 00:37:13,400
Speaker 1: long time. Um. And even even the Medicare for All debate,

747
00:37:13,560 --> 00:37:15,880
Speaker 1: like that may not be like all of a sudden

748
00:37:15,960 --> 00:37:19,319
Speaker 1: like oh yeah, maybe so um And you know not

749
00:37:19,440 --> 00:37:21,400
Speaker 1: everyone's going to get this not you know that. I

750
00:37:21,440 --> 00:37:23,319
Speaker 1: do see the push pull of people wanting to get

751
00:37:23,320 --> 00:37:25,359
Speaker 1: back to work. Of course they think I like not

752
00:37:25,840 --> 00:37:29,640
Speaker 1: having stores closed, the people like not working. I just

753
00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:32,840
Speaker 1: think it's this push pull of what average citizens have

754
00:37:32,920 --> 00:37:35,440
Speaker 1: to realize they have to sacrifice, and it's something Americans,

755
00:37:35,760 --> 00:37:39,600
Speaker 1: the twitchy American electric doesn't like to do. When we

756
00:37:39,680 --> 00:37:42,440
Speaker 1: come back, Kara Swisher finds a positive note for us

757
00:37:42,440 --> 00:37:53,960
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758
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764
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786
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804
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Speaker 1: You're listening to Back to Biz with Katie and Boats.

805
00:40:26,960 --> 00:40:29,799
Speaker 1: And before we finished our conversation with Kara, we asked

806
00:40:29,800 --> 00:40:33,640
Speaker 1: her for the inside scoop on what tech innovations were

807
00:40:33,719 --> 00:40:36,880
Speaker 1: really impressing her right now. Well, I think two areas

808
00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:38,560
Speaker 1: are really big and I've written about them. One is

809
00:40:38,560 --> 00:40:40,920
Speaker 1: climate change tech. I think there's some This is an

810
00:40:40,960 --> 00:40:42,760
Speaker 1: area we're going to have talk about the next crisis

811
00:40:42,800 --> 00:40:45,080
Speaker 1: we're gonna face. Climate change is an ongoing crisis that

812
00:40:45,120 --> 00:40:47,160
Speaker 1: we have to figure out, and technology has to play

813
00:40:47,160 --> 00:40:49,200
Speaker 1: a big part in it. Not just getting rid of

814
00:40:49,200 --> 00:40:51,960
Speaker 1: the carbon in the atmosphere, because that's just cleaning trash, right,

815
00:40:52,040 --> 00:40:54,560
Speaker 1: that's just so what how can we make food? Like

816
00:40:54,640 --> 00:40:57,520
Speaker 1: some of the food tech stuff is really interesting, you know,

817
00:40:57,680 --> 00:41:01,640
Speaker 1: how we make food available, healthy food with less a

818
00:41:01,680 --> 00:41:04,000
Speaker 1: tax on the planet. Some of the autonomous car stuff

819
00:41:04,040 --> 00:41:06,200
Speaker 1: is really great. I visited a couple of companies right

820
00:41:06,239 --> 00:41:09,040
Speaker 1: before this actually that I was really heartened by, like

821
00:41:09,080 --> 00:41:11,640
Speaker 1: some of the stuff that's happening there and the idea

822
00:41:11,800 --> 00:41:14,600
Speaker 1: of of saving energy in that way. Um, some of

823
00:41:14,600 --> 00:41:17,200
Speaker 1: the stuff around energy is cool. Like how we can

824
00:41:17,200 --> 00:41:19,360
Speaker 1: build homes, Like the way we build homes right now

825
00:41:19,480 --> 00:41:22,959
Speaker 1: is artisanal. It's ridiculous waste of of of all kinds

826
00:41:23,000 --> 00:41:25,880
Speaker 1: of them that it contributes enormous amounts to greenhouse gases

827
00:41:25,920 --> 00:41:29,439
Speaker 1: construction does so, Or what are we gonna do with

828
00:41:29,520 --> 00:41:31,520
Speaker 1: if we're not going to have cars like I talked

829
00:41:31,520 --> 00:41:33,440
Speaker 1: about not cars, or if we're not going to have

830
00:41:33,520 --> 00:41:36,040
Speaker 1: so many commercial office businesses, maybe we could turn them

831
00:41:36,040 --> 00:41:39,200
Speaker 1: into homes so people could live more affordably. Like there's

832
00:41:39,200 --> 00:41:41,799
Speaker 1: all kinds of like Like there's a great book by

833
00:41:41,840 --> 00:41:44,160
Speaker 1: Brad Smith, he's the president of Microsoft, of all people

834
00:41:44,200 --> 00:41:45,960
Speaker 1: Microsoft used to which used to be sort of the

835
00:41:45,960 --> 00:41:48,960
Speaker 1: evil Empire. He's written amazing book called Tools and Weapons

836
00:41:49,040 --> 00:41:51,759
Speaker 1: and the same thing. It's about tech. But it can

837
00:41:51,760 --> 00:41:53,400
Speaker 1: neither be a it's like a knife. It can be

838
00:41:53,480 --> 00:41:55,400
Speaker 1: a tool or a weapon. Which one do we want

839
00:41:55,440 --> 00:41:57,640
Speaker 1: to use it for? And I think that's like there's

840
00:41:57,680 --> 00:41:59,719
Speaker 1: all these kind of stuff that we can take and

841
00:42:00,040 --> 00:42:02,040
Speaker 1: start to think about and what's a better way of

842
00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:03,759
Speaker 1: doing it? And I have to say all and if

843
00:42:03,800 --> 00:42:05,800
Speaker 1: you want out a positive I think young people really

844
00:42:05,840 --> 00:42:08,600
Speaker 1: do get this. What younger people do. My son is

845
00:42:09,000 --> 00:42:12,400
Speaker 1: my son like he calms me down so much. He

846
00:42:12,440 --> 00:42:15,319
Speaker 1: gets it, he understands it. I don't think he's particularly

847
00:42:15,840 --> 00:42:18,799
Speaker 1: one way. He's just like, just take a second, like

848
00:42:18,920 --> 00:42:21,399
Speaker 1: we can figure this out. Like they're much more. They don't.

849
00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:24,520
Speaker 1: They're not cynical, and yet they they do. I think

850
00:42:24,960 --> 00:42:27,319
Speaker 1: I think they're frustrated with all them We've given them

851
00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:30,200
Speaker 1: a terrible future with all this debt we've just piled

852
00:42:30,200 --> 00:42:34,720
Speaker 1: on right now. Um, there's no choice here, unfortunately. But

853
00:42:34,719 --> 00:42:37,319
Speaker 1: but I think and there's who can say viruses a virus,

854
00:42:37,360 --> 00:42:40,160
Speaker 1: like there's nothing to be done about something like this. Um.

855
00:42:40,200 --> 00:42:42,920
Speaker 1: But I think they feels that they're much more I

856
00:42:42,920 --> 00:42:45,839
Speaker 1: don't want to say hopeful, but they're more pragmatic about things.

857
00:42:45,960 --> 00:42:48,120
Speaker 1: And I feel like, whenever I talk to young people,

858
00:42:48,120 --> 00:42:51,399
Speaker 1: I feel much better about the world because I think

859
00:42:51,400 --> 00:42:54,680
Speaker 1: they've grown up in this tech environment. They see it

860
00:42:54,719 --> 00:42:57,399
Speaker 1: for what it is, and they're not fool the way

861
00:42:57,440 --> 00:43:00,279
Speaker 1: we are. And and that doesn't panick them. It isn't

862
00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:03,040
Speaker 1: you know, it doesn't upset them quite as much. And

863
00:43:03,080 --> 00:43:06,520
Speaker 1: they're not afraid, I think to give their opinions sometimes

864
00:43:06,600 --> 00:43:09,120
Speaker 1: I have to say without portfolio. But I think they

865
00:43:09,560 --> 00:43:14,200
Speaker 1: they feel very liberated to to say what's wrong too.

866
00:43:14,280 --> 00:43:18,399
Speaker 1: Sometimes our embarrassment because I feel like we have done

867
00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:21,000
Speaker 1: a really shitty job and a lot of departments. But

868
00:43:21,080 --> 00:43:24,760
Speaker 1: I love the fact that they they care so much

869
00:43:24,840 --> 00:43:27,200
Speaker 1: and they let you know they care and what they're

870
00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:29,080
Speaker 1: going to do about it. And I think it's really

871
00:43:29,080 --> 00:43:32,480
Speaker 1: refreshing to do. You find that bows as well? Yeah,

872
00:43:32,520 --> 00:43:34,480
Speaker 1: I mean I think that there's so much to be

873
00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:38,759
Speaker 1: said for this coming sort of generation right there, innovating

874
00:43:38,800 --> 00:43:41,239
Speaker 1: in a way that we never had to or generations

875
00:43:41,280 --> 00:43:43,719
Speaker 1: before them really haven't had to innovate in this way.

876
00:43:43,760 --> 00:43:47,200
Speaker 1: Certainly there have been, you know, terrible moments in history

877
00:43:47,280 --> 00:43:50,200
Speaker 1: where generations have had to overcome what their parents did.

878
00:43:50,280 --> 00:43:53,279
Speaker 1: But you know, even talking about Karay, your son, you know,

879
00:43:53,719 --> 00:43:56,279
Speaker 1: going off to college and then coming out of it,

880
00:43:56,320 --> 00:43:58,319
Speaker 1: you know, what work is he going to do? How

881
00:43:58,400 --> 00:44:00,000
Speaker 1: is he going to do it? If he's not stressed

882
00:44:00,040 --> 00:44:03,160
Speaker 1: that about it, he's feeling hopeful about what will become.

883
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:06,359
Speaker 1: I just think it's a very positive way to look

884
00:44:06,400 --> 00:44:09,360
Speaker 1: at the future because although we've saddled them with perhaps

885
00:44:09,360 --> 00:44:15,600
Speaker 1: what is a really detrimental, horrible burden. Uh, if he's hopeful,

886
00:44:15,760 --> 00:44:17,640
Speaker 1: that makes me hopeful. Well, also, you have to have

887
00:44:17,640 --> 00:44:19,719
Speaker 1: a historical perspective. And I think I just did a

888
00:44:19,719 --> 00:44:21,680
Speaker 1: great podcast John met Jim, who has written lots of

889
00:44:22,040 --> 00:44:24,279
Speaker 1: loves of people. He's amazing and one of the things

890
00:44:24,280 --> 00:44:27,319
Speaker 1: that I think we have lost historical sense in the

891
00:44:27,360 --> 00:44:30,160
Speaker 1: way our society is built so so tech forward and

892
00:44:30,200 --> 00:44:33,799
Speaker 1: so digital forward, and that like someone the other day was,

893
00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:36,280
Speaker 1: you know, this is just terrible. I'm like, well, slavery

894
00:44:36,360 --> 00:44:39,320
Speaker 1: was terrible, the Civil War was terrible, the Whiskey Rebellion

895
00:44:39,360 --> 00:44:42,920
Speaker 1: was terrible, McCarthyism was terrible, Salem which trouser. Like, we

896
00:44:43,000 --> 00:44:46,439
Speaker 1: have an ability to overcome things. It's just my only

897
00:44:46,480 --> 00:44:49,399
Speaker 1: worry is that because we're so jacked into the tech

898
00:44:49,520 --> 00:44:52,680
Speaker 1: system that it's taken over our brains in that addictive way.

899
00:44:52,680 --> 00:44:57,480
Speaker 1: And it's really the communications platforms are so invasive and

900
00:44:57,640 --> 00:45:00,480
Speaker 1: toxic that it may be the things that's pushed us

901
00:45:00,480 --> 00:45:04,920
Speaker 1: over the edge. But we've overcome so much horrible history

902
00:45:05,040 --> 00:45:07,560
Speaker 1: and for for lots of people and reached for some

903
00:45:07,600 --> 00:45:10,680
Speaker 1: really big goals like them. I was watching for some reason,

904
00:45:10,760 --> 00:45:13,400
Speaker 1: I was watching the speech that Kennedy gave about the

905
00:45:13,440 --> 00:45:16,920
Speaker 1: moon landing, and I was like, oh, remember that was great,

906
00:45:17,239 --> 00:45:19,319
Speaker 1: Like there we can the minute we have a leader

907
00:45:19,320 --> 00:45:20,960
Speaker 1: that's like that, I think it appeals to our best

908
00:45:21,080 --> 00:45:25,200
Speaker 1: nature and it pulls us away from from all of this. Well,

909
00:45:25,239 --> 00:45:27,560
Speaker 1: maybe we just need to get out of the way, Yeah,

910
00:45:27,719 --> 00:45:31,600
Speaker 1: or just just let people. I'll end on. I'll end

911
00:45:31,640 --> 00:45:34,319
Speaker 1: you a happy note. I live in this neighborhood in

912
00:45:34,440 --> 00:45:37,399
Speaker 1: DC right now with my kids in Shaw. And one

913
00:45:37,440 --> 00:45:39,319
Speaker 1: thing that's great. If you walk around a city at

914
00:45:39,400 --> 00:45:40,880
Speaker 1: least I don't know what it's like in the suburbs.

915
00:45:41,239 --> 00:45:44,600
Speaker 1: Everyone's on their porches talking to each other. It's really

916
00:45:44,800 --> 00:45:47,120
Speaker 1: people are sick of the screens, like they've gotten outside.

917
00:45:47,160 --> 00:45:50,000
Speaker 1: They and and this. You just go by and meet.

918
00:45:50,000 --> 00:45:52,280
Speaker 1: I've met. I know all my neighbors now, which is incredible,

919
00:45:52,320 --> 00:45:54,000
Speaker 1: which I which I've moved into a new house, but

920
00:45:54,040 --> 00:45:55,800
Speaker 1: I did, I would have taken me forever, would have

921
00:45:55,840 --> 00:45:59,560
Speaker 1: been closed inside. And there was this family across right

922
00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:01,759
Speaker 1: on the owner for me, and they were all outside

923
00:46:01,920 --> 00:46:06,040
Speaker 1: doing the electric slide of all things. And I was

924
00:46:06,080 --> 00:46:09,239
Speaker 1: like the electric slide that these kids were loving it.

925
00:46:09,320 --> 00:46:11,799
Speaker 1: There's little kids in name of course, Like I was like,

926
00:46:11,880 --> 00:46:13,960
Speaker 1: this is an awful dance, but it's not. It's not.

927
00:46:14,040 --> 00:46:16,879
Speaker 1: It's a great dance. And you know, and they moved

928
00:46:16,920 --> 00:46:19,360
Speaker 1: to the macarena and it was like it was just

929
00:46:19,400 --> 00:46:22,560
Speaker 1: a lovely night and I was like, oh, okay, you

930
00:46:22,600 --> 00:46:24,080
Speaker 1: can be like this, you know what I mean? There

931
00:46:24,120 --> 00:46:26,359
Speaker 1: was a there was a real sense of community that

932
00:46:26,480 --> 00:46:28,719
Speaker 1: was had been lost and I'd forgotten about. And I

933
00:46:28,719 --> 00:46:30,400
Speaker 1: thought that was I hope you. I hope you have

934
00:46:30,560 --> 00:46:33,360
Speaker 1: video of yourself doing the macarina. I did not. I

935
00:46:33,400 --> 00:46:35,560
Speaker 1: was socially distanced and I am I could not do

936
00:46:35,640 --> 00:46:40,120
Speaker 1: the electric slide to this day, I tried. I can't, No,

937
00:46:41,280 --> 00:46:43,880
Speaker 1: I can't talk. I think I want some try to

938
00:46:43,920 --> 00:46:49,439
Speaker 1: teach you to do the body roll. So we made

939
00:46:48,160 --> 00:46:52,360
Speaker 1: I was, well, we're going to be successful in electric slide. No,

940
00:46:52,680 --> 00:46:55,320
Speaker 1: that's not happening. I can I will do it so badly.

941
00:46:55,320 --> 00:46:58,560
Speaker 1: You'll be like I cannot believe someone dances quite so bad.

942
00:46:58,880 --> 00:47:01,359
Speaker 1: It's really depressed. And I have to learn to dance

943
00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:04,480
Speaker 1: because I'm getting married again. I think about hope over experience,

944
00:47:05,000 --> 00:47:08,640
Speaker 1: um and uh, and it's a triumph of hope over.

945
00:47:09,239 --> 00:47:12,560
Speaker 1: And my my girlfriend is an amazing UM. She does

946
00:47:12,640 --> 00:47:14,680
Speaker 1: tango and she's like, if you know, dance on our

947
00:47:14,680 --> 00:47:17,120
Speaker 1: freaking wedding. I'm going to divorce you right afterwards, and

948
00:47:17,120 --> 00:47:18,880
Speaker 1: I was like, how, I've got to learn to dance.

949
00:47:18,880 --> 00:47:20,920
Speaker 1: So I'm going to get onto YouTube and learn how

950
00:47:20,920 --> 00:47:23,160
Speaker 1: to dance. It's all right, but we can. We can

951
00:47:23,200 --> 00:47:25,560
Speaker 1: do a zoom and bow and I teach you because

952
00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:30,240
Speaker 1: I'm a pret I've seen you. You get down, Katie Couric,

953
00:47:30,560 --> 00:47:33,040
Speaker 1: you pat down, blow like I saw one picture of you.

954
00:47:33,120 --> 00:47:36,640
Speaker 1: I was like, girl, what's happened there? Jesus stripes? I

955
00:47:36,760 --> 00:47:43,799
Speaker 1: drop like it's hot, drop it like it's what? Oh

956
00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:47,759
Speaker 1: it is hot, Katie? What can you say? It was

957
00:47:47,800 --> 00:47:50,200
Speaker 1: hot to start with, it remains hot. It will always

958
00:47:50,239 --> 00:47:56,359
Speaker 1: be with Katie Kirk. Kara, thank you for doing that. Yeah,

959
00:47:56,400 --> 00:47:58,840
Speaker 1: who's who's next? Who are you having up? What is

960
00:47:58,880 --> 00:48:01,120
Speaker 1: what is this? What do you try to do? Find hope? Right?

961
00:48:01,640 --> 00:48:06,080
Speaker 1: We're just we're just talking too smart forward looking people

962
00:48:06,280 --> 00:48:09,200
Speaker 1: who were you know, thoughtful and interesting and fun to

963
00:48:09,239 --> 00:48:11,759
Speaker 1: talk to you? But I would tell you, but then

964
00:48:11,800 --> 00:48:14,279
Speaker 1: I'd have to kill you. Carol. Well, good, that's a

965
00:48:14,280 --> 00:48:16,720
Speaker 1: good discussion to have because we can we can change

966
00:48:16,760 --> 00:48:18,320
Speaker 1: things for the better and get rid of the shooty

967
00:48:18,360 --> 00:48:25,719
Speaker 1: things for sure. Like that. Thanks Kara, thank you, thank well.

968
00:48:25,760 --> 00:48:29,040
Speaker 1: That was it the very first episode Back to Biz

969
00:48:29,239 --> 00:48:33,800
Speaker 1: with Me, Katie and Me so Bose, what did you think?

970
00:48:34,080 --> 00:48:36,279
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, I'm about to pop the champagne. That

971
00:48:36,400 --> 00:48:39,279
Speaker 1: was fun and we're gonna do ten. So there's a

972
00:48:39,280 --> 00:48:42,239
Speaker 1: lot more to come. We'll be talking to CEOs, entrepreneurs,

973
00:48:42,280 --> 00:48:47,120
Speaker 1: political leaders, cultural trailblazers, gosh and so many more. So

974
00:48:47,239 --> 00:48:49,759
Speaker 1: stay tuned, everybody. The next one will be coming the

975
00:48:49,800 --> 00:48:53,320
Speaker 1: first week of June, and new episodes land every Thursday

976
00:48:53,320 --> 00:48:56,680
Speaker 1: after that. You can find Back to Biz episodes in

977
00:48:56,800 --> 00:49:00,840
Speaker 1: the next Question feed or by searching Apple Podcast, the

978
00:49:00,920 --> 00:49:03,680
Speaker 1: I Heart Radio app, or wherever you listen to your

979
00:49:03,719 --> 00:49:07,520
Speaker 1: favorite shows. And if you like what you've heard, spread

980
00:49:07,560 --> 00:49:10,200
Speaker 1: the word. Let us know. Come find us on social media.

981
00:49:10,480 --> 00:49:14,480
Speaker 1: We're on Instagram and Twitter and TikTok. What do you

982
00:49:14,560 --> 00:49:17,040
Speaker 1: think bows, are you going to do it? Oh? Hell no,

983
00:49:17,160 --> 00:49:19,480
Speaker 1: I'm not getting on TikTok. They can find you on TikTok.

984
00:49:20,080 --> 00:49:23,439
Speaker 1: I might do TikTok. I'm an early adapter woman, so

985
00:49:23,840 --> 00:49:27,400
Speaker 1: you might find me doing a few very strange dances.

986
00:49:27,440 --> 00:49:30,600
Speaker 1: So tell Layel your daughter, she's got to join me

987
00:49:30,640 --> 00:49:33,360
Speaker 1: and follow me at least on TikTok. So I have

988
00:49:33,560 --> 00:49:36,040
Speaker 1: somebody following me this all right, Well, the next show

989
00:49:36,040 --> 00:49:40,840
Speaker 1: will be Katie and Lael. Okay. Meanwhile, I'm Katie Kuric

990
00:49:41,120 --> 00:49:43,759
Speaker 1: and I'm Boa St John And this is Back to

991
00:49:43,800 --> 00:49:54,760
Speaker 1: Biz with Katie and Bows. Thanks for listening, everybody, Okay bye.

992
00:49:57,360 --> 00:49:59,720
Speaker 1: Back to Biz with Katie and Bows is a production

993
00:49:59,760 --> 00:50:03,000
Speaker 1: of I Heart Radio and Katie Currik Media. The executive

994
00:50:03,000 --> 00:50:06,720
Speaker 1: producers are Katie Currk, bozmas St John, and Courtney Litz.

995
00:50:07,120 --> 00:50:10,920
Speaker 1: The supervising producer is Lauren Hansen. The associate producers are

996
00:50:10,960 --> 00:50:15,400
Speaker 1: Derek Clements, Eliza Costas and Emily Pinto. Editing by Derek

997
00:50:15,440 --> 00:50:19,960
Speaker 1: Clements and Lauren Hansen, Mixing by Derrek Clements. Special thanks

998
00:50:20,000 --> 00:50:23,840
Speaker 1: to Adriana Fasio. For more information about today's episode, go

999
00:50:23,880 --> 00:50:26,720
Speaker 1: to Katie Kirk dot com. You can also follow Katie

1000
00:50:26,760 --> 00:50:30,759
Speaker 1: Kurrik and bozmas St John on Twitter and Instagram. For

1001
00:50:30,800 --> 00:50:33,359
Speaker 1: more podcasts for my Heart Radio, visit the I Heart

1002
00:50:33,440 --> 00:50:36,399
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