Speaker 1: Alright, ba fam, we are so excited to introduce you
Speaker 1: to this week's guest. Les Alfred is an award winning
Speaker 1: podcast host. She's a speaker of content creator. I've been
Speaker 1: a huge fan of hers for a long long time,
Speaker 1: and my most favorite thing about less is that she
Speaker 1: hosts one of my favorite podcasts, Balanced Black Girl. It
Speaker 1: is a chart topping weekly podcast, and she facilitates thoughtful
Speaker 1: interviews and incredible solo episodes as well, where she just
Speaker 1: shares everything about sort of building that building, that well
Speaker 1: rounded life where you are living your best version of yourself. Tiffany,
Speaker 1: how do you feel about our combo with Balanced Black Girl?
Speaker 1: That was your first time meeting her?
Speaker 2: It what although I'm following her on social because of
Speaker 2: course my brain was like, of course you are me
Speaker 2: and I had already liked pictures, So our conversation with
Speaker 2: our conversation with Leus was really awesome. And what I
Speaker 2: really love is that to be a balanced Black girl
Speaker 2: is not to have it all together. It is the
Speaker 2: It is the journey, not the destination, which you will
Speaker 2: hear us talk about. So you're gonna enjoy this episode,
Speaker 2: Zen out, chill out. If you're going for this is perfect,
Speaker 2: About to wash the dishes, about to do laundry, about
Speaker 2: to go for a walk.
Speaker 3: Episode, So do something to self care.
Speaker 2: Yes, add this to your self care today.
Speaker 1: Now, Tiffany, I have a follow up from the show
Speaker 1: actually because you talked about self care this summer. But
Speaker 1: it was like a bunch of like traveling and about
Speaker 1: mem and like all the family and stuff that, like
Speaker 1: when it's just you, what are you doing to if
Speaker 1: you're anxious about something or you're having a tough time,
Speaker 1: like what are you turning to?
Speaker 3: Well at that moment, I.
Speaker 2: Am excited because I just finally I've been dragging my feet.
Speaker 2: Book the movers to come on Friday.
Speaker 1: Okay, we've rescheduled last week.
Speaker 2: Right, Yes, they're finally coming. Just like no next week, No,
Speaker 2: next week and the next some I'm like, so I
Speaker 2: will officially by the time we tape again be in
Speaker 2: my new place. And I think that I just want
Speaker 2: to get a moment because I've not lived alone for
Speaker 2: a long time, and so I think that self care
Speaker 2: is going to look like I don't know, like acclimating
Speaker 2: myself emotionally, mentally and physically to my new place, like
Speaker 2: just spending so every day I go there. I take
Speaker 2: a walk almost every day, and doctor Green suggested, take
Speaker 2: a walk, have lunch there, have breakfast there. Start to
Speaker 2: integrate it into your life. So it's not this big,
Speaker 2: big shock. And I think I'm going to mainly spend
Speaker 2: the summer outside of like, you know, these three trips
Speaker 2: that I kind of have, planing business things, just literally
Speaker 2: almost like getting on the frequency of my new place,
Speaker 2: if that makes sense, sitting on the couch and just
Speaker 2: looking out the window, you know, yeah, listening to music
Speaker 2: like my my boo bought me a record player and
Speaker 2: have all these amazing records, and listening to records in
Speaker 2: the place, you know, liking at home. Yes, And so
Speaker 2: I think that's the core thing, because it's a realignment,
Speaker 2: if you will. And so outside of like the moving
Speaker 2: and shaking, I'm really looking forward to like just connecting
Speaker 2: to my place and allowing it to be like this
Speaker 2: is where you this is home. Now home, offying it
Speaker 2: if you will.
Speaker 3: Yeah, like yes, hanging up some arts.
Speaker 2: Yes, Oh you know, we came over just a couple
Speaker 2: days ago. Kimberly remember from the she's the curator for
Speaker 2: Brooklyn Museum, one of the curates.
Speaker 3: Oh, that's right, you guys went to an art show
Speaker 3: that is so sexy, very rich.
Speaker 2: Well, she was in Newark to visit a studio. Do
Speaker 2: you want to come? And this is amazing artist Adama
Speaker 2: Adama Delphine, and she is amazing. As soon as I
Speaker 2: walked into her studio, which is in newk She's actually
Speaker 2: from Brooklyn and lives in Brooklyn, I was like, I
Speaker 2: feel like I've seen this work before.
Speaker 3: I have.
Speaker 2: This woman is like famous. I'm like, not you being
Speaker 2: a whole. She's like has stuff in the Smithsonian that
Speaker 2: I've seen in the portrait gallery in DC. I've seen
Speaker 2: her in Newark studio, I mean Nework Museum all over.
Speaker 2: Her stuff is so famous.
Speaker 3: I was like, girl, man, and but it.
Speaker 2: Was beautiful and there's like two pieces I really want.
Speaker 2: I don't know, it might be too rich for my blood,
Speaker 2: but I certainly put an offer into be like I'd
Speaker 2: love to purchase. So that was really awesome. And then
Speaker 2: I was like she was so awesome. I was like,
Speaker 2: do you want to come to the condo because Kimberly
Speaker 2: was gonna come anyway to give me some suggestions about
Speaker 2: what kind of art I can feel it with. And
Speaker 2: so she came and we had.
Speaker 3: Like a whole national artist, like I mean.
Speaker 2: She is all over the world. And I was like,
Speaker 2: so that was just that's the kind of thing I
Speaker 2: want to do more of this summer and to invite
Speaker 2: good energy, especially black and brown women into my home
Speaker 2: to create these amazing, beautiful memories with you know.
Speaker 3: So that's nice.
Speaker 1: Well I'm going to do since we're talking a little
Speaker 1: bit about weekends, I have to do a shout out
Speaker 1: to my brother.
Speaker 2: Drake, I said, look d on the red carpet.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and his lady friend, who I'm like very self
Speaker 1: conscious about not saying the wrong thing or too much things.
Speaker 3: I don't want to like step on any too's. But
Speaker 3: aren't they zo gue together?
Speaker 1: So she's a filmmaker and that's how they met. And
Speaker 1: you know, Alex has his own film production, but she
Speaker 1: if you guys, have you heard a Tribeca Film Festival's
Speaker 1: this big festival. It happens that every summer, New York.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So her film that she produced, they won a million
Speaker 1: dollar grant last year from AT and T and the
Speaker 1: film festival. I know, major, right, And they took this
Speaker 1: million dollars and they made a movie last fall and
Speaker 1: somehow they edited it and they premiered it like within
Speaker 1: less than a year, which is like bananas to me.
Speaker 1: And I got to go to the premiere, which was
Speaker 1: really cool. There was a carpet and it was at
Speaker 1: this really gorgeous historic theater, the Angelica Theater on Second
Speaker 1: Avenue in New York. Really beautiful, and the film itself,
Speaker 1: Oh my god. So if you're listening, you got to
Speaker 1: write down The Color Book. The Color Book is a
Speaker 1: feature film and it is everything that you everything that
Speaker 1: I think we all need in a film right now,
Speaker 1: but and also like nothing that you are worried it
Speaker 1: might be. So I went into this film because I
Speaker 1: knew it was about a black father and his son
Speaker 1: who has Down syndrome, and I think I went into
Speaker 1: this movie with like a sense of foreboding. I was
Speaker 1: telling Kaya, the producer about it, you know, just like
Speaker 1: a little bit of foreboding. You see a black man
Speaker 1: in a vulnerable state with a child who has special needs,
Speaker 1: and it's all in black and white. The film is
Speaker 1: very quiet and heart wrenching, and I just kept like
Speaker 1: I had this fear over me the whole time, like
Speaker 1: something bad is going to happen. To this kid and
Speaker 1: his dad, and you know what, I don't want to
Speaker 1: spoil the movie for you, but it just got to
Speaker 1: be a really beautiful love story between a dad and
Speaker 1: his son. And I realized how poignant that was and
Speaker 1: how powerful it was. It seems like such a quiet
Speaker 1: movie about just this relationship and at the same time,
Speaker 1: like so rare. When do we get to see that
Speaker 1: in a black father from his perspective, just being a
Speaker 1: good dad, struggling coping with grief, but also just being
Speaker 1: an amazing dad. And the actor who played the boy,
Speaker 1: the little boy Mason, his name is Jeremiah, so sweet.
Speaker 1: His whole family was there. Yeah, so just shout out
Speaker 1: the Color Book. I don't know if you can see it.
Speaker 1: It was at Tribeca, so probably it'll come to theater soon.
Speaker 1: But yeah, Hugh, shout out to Kaya who produced it.
Speaker 1: And then my brother, who directed and wrote his first
Speaker 1: short film, told me recently, actually I just foun out
Speaker 1: this weekend.
Speaker 3: I was so late.
Speaker 1: He got his film accepted into the Palm Springs Film
Speaker 1: Festival AMAZ, which is like not something that happens with
Speaker 1: your first ever film written and directed yourself. So it's
Speaker 1: called Thomasville it's based on my dad. Him and his
Speaker 1: family grew up in a neighborhood in Atlanta called Thomasville,
Speaker 1: and so it's a short film like that. Yeah, just
Speaker 1: calls back to my dad's upbringing and my uncle Mark
Speaker 1: and just really really really freaking proud of my brother too.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So happy to get to I don't I don't have
Speaker 1: that many moments where I just, especially recently worth gotten
Speaker 1: to connect with him and just celebrate something. It's been
Speaker 1: a very stressful year in our family, so to just
Speaker 1: like be there and to celebrate and see how happy
Speaker 1: they are and how they're doing what they love and
Speaker 1: they love each other, and there's so beautiful.
Speaker 3: It was.
Speaker 2: It's gonna get your girl.
Speaker 3: Listen.
Speaker 1: If you guys just go like his I'll tell you
Speaker 1: what he will forgive me. If you guys run to
Speaker 1: Pineapple Cut's Instagram page, that's his production company, and then
Speaker 1: you run to well, just we'll start there. Run to
Speaker 1: his his page and like follow him and leave a
Speaker 1: comment saying brand Ambition loves y'all, and then he will
Speaker 1: forgive me anything else Pineapple Cut, product cuts or I
Speaker 1: don't know, pine I think it's just with with with
Speaker 1: no s pineapple, how many pineapple cuts?
Speaker 3: I was there, Yeah, you'll be fine. And you know
Speaker 3: what he looks like? Just me? What less hair?
Speaker 2: Okay, he looks like Drake Chah. I literally because I
Speaker 2: saw it in your Instagram stories and I was showing
Speaker 2: my Pardner. I was like, oh my god, tell me
Speaker 2: you don't like Drake.
Speaker 1: You know, had to come up with a new thing, Tiffany.
Speaker 1: Every time it's Drake, Drake, Drake, Drake, Drake. Come how
Speaker 1: could it be a new thing with That's what I mean.
Speaker 1: He looked even more like Drake than ever before. I
Speaker 1: was like, with his hair out. I was like, come on, man.
Speaker 1: And I got recognized twice at that event. And then also, yeah,
Speaker 1: I went to see Michelle Buteau's comedy show and one
Speaker 1: of our fans, oh, and I thought I was gonna
Speaker 1: was there.
Speaker 2: She was like, maybe he was here. I would have
Speaker 2: seen there.
Speaker 3: So I got so many Deanstrim folks like I didn't
Speaker 3: know you were here.
Speaker 2: I was here too, my y.
Speaker 1: We were all out there for you were black and
Speaker 1: female and a millennial. You were at that you were
Speaker 1: at that Radio City show. It was really good. But yeah,
Speaker 1: one of our listeners she tossed up me in the
Speaker 1: line when I was getting a little drink drink. It's
Speaker 1: like give me the large blood katonic please, and well
Speaker 1: it's always nice running into ba fam. We love you guys. Yeah,
Speaker 1: all right, should we take a little breaky break, can
Speaker 1: come back with our interview with Less Balanced Black Girl.
Speaker 2: Let's do it.
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 3: I love that there, Lee.
Speaker 2: State Farm agents are small business owners too, so they
Speaker 2: know how to help you choose personalized policies that figure needs,
Speaker 2: like a good neighbor. State Farm is there. Talk to
Speaker 2: your local agent today. Hey, hey, hey, we're back. We're black,
Speaker 2: We're brown. Ambition ambition, ambition, ambition, ambition. The stew is
Speaker 2: extra brown today.
Speaker 1: Okay today, Yes, yeah, we have a guest. Welcome to
Speaker 1: the show Less. If y'all don't know about mine, can
Speaker 1: I call you my friend?
Speaker 3: I don't know. I feel like I text your less
Speaker 3: Alfred Less Alfred.
Speaker 1: She is the award winning podcast host of one of
Speaker 1: my actual favorite podcast, Balanced Black Girls, and I actually
Speaker 1: I've had to recently come up with like a list
Speaker 1: of things I can do for self care, just as
Speaker 1: like an emergency kit.
Speaker 3: You know, I'm going through a hard time. What is it?
Speaker 3: That relaxes me again.
Speaker 1: And I added Balanced Black Girl to the list because
Speaker 1: I just feel like there's always, like if it's not
Speaker 1: the most recent show, there's something in the top ten,
Speaker 1: like the next ten that I can sort of like
Speaker 1: put on and I'll feel a little bit better about
Speaker 1: myself or like I'll have a better perspective.
Speaker 3: So what better review for your show can there be? Then?
Speaker 1: Like it is on the list of ways to self sooth,
Speaker 1: right next to like a Pina Ben and Jerry's. It's like,
Speaker 1: am I gonna listen to Balance Black Girl or I'm
Speaker 1: not going to like stuff my face?
Speaker 4: Oh my gosh, that is the best compliment. I'm so honored.
Speaker 4: I mean, I'm also such a big fan of Brown
Speaker 4: Ambition and of both of you individually and together. So
Speaker 4: I'm so excited to be joining you. Yeah.
Speaker 1: So okay, So let's tell folks what was the origin
Speaker 1: of Bounce Black Girl? Because you're around you were coming
Speaker 1: up around the same time as us, right what your.
Speaker 4: Day launch I started in October of twenty eighteen was
Speaker 4: when the show launched.
Speaker 1: Okay, so a couple of years after yeah, and then
Speaker 1: at the time, like you were working nine to five
Speaker 1: up until like yesterday almost, I mean up until really recently. So, yeah,
Speaker 1: where were you working at the time? Why the podcast? Like,
Speaker 1: when did you start making money? Tell us everything?
Speaker 4: Oh my goodness, Okay, Well the podcast wouldn't be a
Speaker 4: thing without the initial blog that I started ten years ago.
Speaker 4: So I started a blog a decade ago that was
Speaker 4: a wellness fitness blog. I was working in corporate but
Speaker 4: I was also a personal trainer. I was really into
Speaker 4: nutrition and healthy recipes, and so I started blogging about
Speaker 4: that ten years ago. And that was when I started
Speaker 4: building a following online in a little bit of a community,
Speaker 4: I mean micro, micro, tiny. It was not major by
Speaker 4: any means, but I started building a little bit of
Speaker 4: a community, and I got really burned out. I did
Speaker 4: that for about four years, and I just got super
Speaker 4: burned out. I got really sick of it. I got
Speaker 4: really tired of fitness. I got tired of talking about fitness.
Speaker 4: I got tired of being in fitness spaces, and so
Speaker 4: I took a break from all of it, took a
Speaker 4: break from the Internet, from creating content, from the whole thing.
Speaker 4: And while I was away, I was getting messages and
Speaker 4: emails from people who followed me and they were like, hey,
Speaker 4: less I know you're taking a break, but when you're
Speaker 4: not posting, I don't see other black women or brown
Speaker 4: women posting about wellness in my feed, like can you
Speaker 4: come back? And I thought, Okay, maybe there's a way
Speaker 4: that I can introduce my audience to other black and
Speaker 4: brown women in wellness so that if I want to
Speaker 4: tap out, they're not just looking to me for that.
Speaker 4: And so that's a lot of pressure.
Speaker 3: For one.
Speaker 4: It was a lot of pressure story of my life.
Speaker 4: And so by this time it was twenty eighteen, late summer,
Speaker 4: early fall twenty eighteen, and I was working at a
Speaker 4: startup as a social media manager making zero dollars, which
Speaker 4: was a great experience. I'm being very sarcastic, it was. Yeah,
Speaker 4: I felmatic, very traumatic work experience. Lots of therapy from
Speaker 4: that from that job. But honestly, I was just sitting
Speaker 4: at work one day and I got the idea of
Speaker 4: start a podcast name it Balanced Black Girl Interview Black
Speaker 4: and Brown Women in Wellness. I went on Amazon, ordered
Speaker 4: a microphone, and launched the podcast a week later and
Speaker 4: have been going ever since.
Speaker 1: Hasy Peasy, Lemon Squeezy see just like Brown ambition. Let's
Speaker 1: just do this thing, all right?
Speaker 2: That's LIU. What happened? Did they go into a podcast?
Speaker 2: I'm like, what's a podcast? Okay?
Speaker 3: I don't know, but I have Amazon and you trust me,
Speaker 3: so come hang right? Oh man? So wait when you
Speaker 3: launched it, you were working at the startup. What were
Speaker 3: you doing? You said? Social media?
Speaker 4: Yeah, I was a social media okay. Sure.
Speaker 1: So do you tell at that point do they know
Speaker 1: that you're doing the podcast? At what point does it
Speaker 1: become a problem or it.
Speaker 4: Became a problem almost like immediately. I mean I didn't
Speaker 4: keep it a secret, but it you know, people could
Speaker 4: see it and they knew about it, and it became
Speaker 4: a problem. I would say probably about six months later,
Speaker 4: when it started kind of doing well and when I
Speaker 4: started getting opportunities and things started taking off. It it
Speaker 4: did become a problem.
Speaker 2: How do they articulate that it was a problem. Oh,
Speaker 2: I mean, let me be messy.
Speaker 4: I'm like, it was pretty messy. I mean, at that
Speaker 4: time through quite a bit of cattiness, which is like,
Speaker 4: I don't want to throw anybody under the bus. But
Speaker 4: it was a super small company and so you know,
Speaker 4: I would get texts from the founder like unhappy about
Speaker 4: what I was doing and so stuff like that. I
Speaker 4: didn't stay on odd job for much longer because it
Speaker 4: just wasn't really worth it. But yeah, it was rough.
Speaker 4: It was a rough time.
Speaker 3: Love I hate no, I love no boundaries.
Speaker 2: No.
Speaker 1: That is like when people talk about the startup and
Speaker 1: working for a startup, like that is such a broad term.
Speaker 1: It sounds like it's very specific, but there are so
Speaker 1: many different versions of startups, and it sounds like you're
Speaker 1: at one of those ones where it's tiny and toxic.
Speaker 2: Oh not the TNT, tiny and toxic.
Speaker 1: It's like Napoleon complex and startups and because they're so tiny,
Speaker 1: they like everything is so like it's people are they're
Speaker 1: hyper aware of what each employee is doing. And then
Speaker 1: there's this sense of like I need to Like you're
Speaker 1: so anxious about the company and like what's happening that
Speaker 1: you feel like you need to control everything and everybody.
Speaker 1: And you don't get that as an employee. You don't
Speaker 1: get that freedom to just like not feel like all
Speaker 1: eyes are on you, you know, because they're just putting
Speaker 1: so much outsize pressure. I'm I feel spoiled because when
Speaker 1: Tiffany and I launched brown ambition. I was working at
Speaker 1: a big brand like Yahoo, and we could sneak around
Speaker 1: and go unnoticed, you know, like it wasn't a huge deal.
Speaker 1: I was just like one of a gajillion, you know,
Speaker 1: employees with the really famous CEO of the time, and
Speaker 1: in some regard that gave me like a little bit
Speaker 1: of a level of ymity and like, you know, do first,
Speaker 1: ask permission later. So I just want to acknowledge that
Speaker 1: that's rough. But then you got it out.
Speaker 3: Of there, I did, Yeah, right, yeah, And when did.
Speaker 2: You feel did you have a satin it like, did
Speaker 2: you have money saved or were you just like did
Speaker 2: you have another job?
Speaker 4: I ended up getting another job. Yeah. So at the time,
Speaker 4: I was doing some freelancing. I was doing some freelance writing,
Speaker 4: some freelance you know, marketing for other businesses. So I
Speaker 4: was able to do that to sustain myself for a
Speaker 4: few months, and then I ended up getting another full
Speaker 4: time job pretty quickly after.
Speaker 1: What is your relationship with money in general, Like, is
Speaker 1: it something that you've learned a lot growing up? When
Speaker 1: you launch Balance Black Girl, were you thinking, oh, this
Speaker 1: can be a source of extra income for me, because
Speaker 1: you're thinking ahead talk a little bit about that.
Speaker 4: My relationship with money has always been really tricky. I've
Speaker 4: always aired on the side of being very frugal, of
Speaker 4: pinching every penny really tight, because I grew up in
Speaker 4: an environment where that was not modeled, where spending even
Speaker 4: when we didn't have it was kind of the norm,
Speaker 4: and I saw the repercussions of that, and it freaked
Speaker 4: me out, and so I very quickly just wanted to
Speaker 4: do the opposite of what I saw, and that was
Speaker 4: save safe, save cheap, cheap, cheap. And I'm still working
Speaker 4: to dismantle that a bit because I think, of course,
Speaker 4: there is a time to be, you know, very conscientious
Speaker 4: about your saving and to do these things, and there's
Speaker 4: also a time to live. And I had gotten to
Speaker 4: a point where I did start doing better financially, and
Speaker 4: I was working really hard, and I was still like
Speaker 4: holding on to every little thing and like forcing myself
Speaker 4: to be really small, and so I've had to do
Speaker 4: quite a bit. You're in a safe space, yeah, a
Speaker 4: lot of unlearning.
Speaker 2: So so the ANI and I can can attest like
Speaker 2: you know, especially don't know if many I you're quite
Speaker 2: as cheap as I am or.
Speaker 1: What, But yeah, something about having kids and seeing the
Speaker 1: dollar signs that go with just the basic things like daycare.
Speaker 1: It's it's created a sense like I definitely spend.
Speaker 3: So much more.
Speaker 1: It's easy to justify anything when you're like, oh, what's
Speaker 1: for of the kids. I have a lot of understanding
Speaker 1: of people who go into bankruptcy when they have children,
Speaker 1: Like I get it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So in therapy, what are some of the things
Speaker 2: that you unearthed about your financial like link like for example,
Speaker 2: for me, it was a sense of unworthiness. That's what
Speaker 2: was driving me not wanting to spend, and it was like, oh,
Speaker 2: working on the feeling of oh you are deserving, you
Speaker 2: are worthy, you know, that helped to unlock you know,
Speaker 2: my ability to look at money in a healthy way
Speaker 2: as a tool that I can use to make my
Speaker 2: life better. But so for you, I mean, you don't
Speaker 2: tell us all your business, but sometimes people don't know
Speaker 2: tells business that money is not always just about money, right,
Speaker 2: there's this underlying kind of like, oh, this is the
Speaker 2: current underlying my choices.
Speaker 4: I think a lot of it for me has just
Speaker 4: always been around safety and feeling like my only backup,
Speaker 4: and I mean my life is still this way is myself.
Speaker 4: I don't have financial support outside of myself. And it's
Speaker 4: pretty much been that way, you know, since I was
Speaker 4: pretty young, and so feeling like if I run out
Speaker 4: or if I try something and I fail, I have
Speaker 4: no help. There's no way out of that. Not there's
Speaker 4: no way out, but like I don't have any support
Speaker 4: outside of myself for that, which is still something that
Speaker 4: I struggle with because that is still true, and so
Speaker 4: it's something that I'm constantly dismantling. Is Okay, I may
Speaker 4: not necessarily have external help outside of myself, but if
Speaker 4: need be, I can get creative. I'm smart, I can
Speaker 4: always make something shake, I can always make something work.
Speaker 4: Me being able to take care of myself doesn't only
Speaker 4: have to look one way.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, life is and it only gets more stressful.
Speaker 1: The stakes get even higher, even if you're you know,
Speaker 1: you don't have anyone but yourself to support in a way,
Speaker 1: like the stake seems so much higher. The bills get
Speaker 1: more expensive, you know, like even supporting a life. Now
Speaker 1: you move from the West coast to the East coast,
Speaker 1: which are both I mean, you were in LA before, right,
Speaker 1: we're around roundabouts, and now you're in New York City.
Speaker 1: It's expensive in these areas. So yeah, when did you
Speaker 1: get to the point where you're like, Okay, I am
Speaker 1: ready to pick up, I'm ready to move, you know,
Speaker 1: take the risk and go full time with balanced black girls.
Speaker 1: Some people would do one of those things at a time,
Speaker 1: but you were like, no, I'll do both things.
Speaker 3: At the same time. What was that, Like, how has
Speaker 3: it been with that transition?
Speaker 4: So I would say me going full time into content
Speaker 4: creation with a long time coming from the time I
Speaker 4: launched that first blog ten years ago. That was always
Speaker 4: my intention. I did not love my corporate experience, even
Speaker 4: though I did it for thirteen years. I did it
Speaker 4: out of survival. But once I learned that people could
Speaker 4: make money online, I was like, oh, I want to
Speaker 4: do that. And so that was always, you know, my intention,
Speaker 4: and a lot of it was me kind of moving
Speaker 4: the goal post of what would help me feel safe
Speaker 4: enough to do it. It was you know, when I
Speaker 4: make a certain amount, then i'll quit. When I you know,
Speaker 4: pay off my student loans, then I'll quit when I this,
Speaker 4: when I that, And so I had gotten to a
Speaker 4: point where those those milestones that I had set for myself,
Speaker 4: I had done it. I had, you know, paid off
Speaker 4: my student loans, I'd reached a certain amount in savings
Speaker 4: and investments, I had you know, increased my earnings for
Speaker 4: my business year over year and surpassed my corporate salary
Speaker 4: for a certain number of years where I was like, Okay,
Speaker 4: this is a clear upward trajectory where I feel comfortable
Speaker 4: doing this. So it was many years coming, but it
Speaker 4: took about a decade to truly feel comfortable enough to
Speaker 4: do it.
Speaker 1: I mean it's a good thing you started young, because
Speaker 1: you're still really young.
Speaker 4: Oh I don't. I'm not feeling very young on a
Speaker 4: decades down so long.
Speaker 3: I know. Well, you have a big birthday. Was it
Speaker 3: a big birthday? You're turning thirty five?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Is that right?
Speaker 2: Use a baby?
Speaker 4: Oh, thank you.
Speaker 1: I'm only thirty six, So I too too, baby, I
Speaker 1: will be thirty seven and two months though, because.
Speaker 3: We're both we're both Leo's right.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Is that what we discovered?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 3: So how do you?
Speaker 1: Because I mean, it's it's one thing to say like
Speaker 1: balance black girl. You have so much knowledge about like
Speaker 1: and you have so many great experts on your show
Speaker 1: talking about everything from like mental health to astrology, to
Speaker 1: nutrition and like and healthy dieting and exercise and all
Speaker 1: of that, but I want to know, there's something so
Speaker 1: much more, like the pressure in your thirties to be
Speaker 1: you know, still really hot, but like also make a
Speaker 1: lot of money and then sort of like if you're
Speaker 1: if you're being single, be single the best, you know,
Speaker 1: be the best kind of single where you're like loving
Speaker 1: yourself and you're still having an active social life, but
Speaker 1: like your family not having a family, and if you
Speaker 1: do have a family, it's like you gotta be the
Speaker 1: perfect mom.
Speaker 3: Blah blah blah blah blah. How do you help us?
Speaker 1: Like, how do you help yourself even get to a
Speaker 1: point where you can like accept where you are, and
Speaker 1: how do you balance that with like wanting to be
Speaker 1: sometimes it's okay to be like a better version of
Speaker 1: yourself or do things a little bit better.
Speaker 4: Yeah, for a long time, I was super goal oriented,
Speaker 4: and I was very focused on all of these external
Speaker 4: achievements of if I make a certain amount of money
Speaker 4: or pay off my debt, or have a certain amount
Speaker 4: of listeners or a certain number of followers. I was
Speaker 4: doing those things because I thought that people would respect
Speaker 4: me more. I thought that it would mean that I
Speaker 4: was just you know, this this great, disciplined or whatever
Speaker 4: successful person, and I am in a different place now
Speaker 4: where it's not that I don't necessarily want those things,
Speaker 4: but it's almost a sense of curiosity of like, I
Speaker 4: wonder if I could do that, if I launched this business,
Speaker 4: how will it go? Like, let me just try it,
Speaker 4: let me kind of do it for the plot a
Speaker 4: little bit, and how many experiences. Yeah, I'm like, let
Speaker 4: me just have as many experiences as possible, like moving
Speaker 4: to New York. Sure, why not? Sure, let me try
Speaker 4: it and see what happens. And that has been really
Speaker 4: freeing for me because I feel like I am still
Speaker 4: growing as a person, but there's not necessarily this pressure
Speaker 4: to do it in a certain way or by a
Speaker 4: certain time. It's like, I'm just my vibe right now
Speaker 4: is living life. There's like a Courtney Kardashian mim where
Speaker 4: she says that that I've been sharing a lot and
Speaker 4: every time somebody asks me like what are your intrinsic goals?
Speaker 4: What is your purpose in this lifetime? I troll them
Speaker 4: and I'm like, my vibe right now is living life.
Speaker 2: Like I love it.
Speaker 4: I'm just I'm just here. I'm just curious to see
Speaker 4: if I can, you know, I just want to see,
Speaker 4: like if I try something, if I apply myself to it,
Speaker 4: will it work out? And if it doesn't, that's okay,
Speaker 4: then I'll do something else. But I think right now,
Speaker 4: I'm just in such a place of exploration. And I
Speaker 4: do think that for women, there is a lot of
Speaker 4: pressure around things like, you know, having children and having
Speaker 4: a certain family life. And I mean, maybe this is
Speaker 4: going to sound really bad, but I've kind of not
Speaker 4: to say, given up on that, but I have accepted
Speaker 4: that if that is going to happen, then it will happen,
Speaker 4: and if it does not happen, that I can find
Speaker 4: so many other sources of joy and fulfillment outside of it.
Speaker 4: And that has also relieved a lot of pressure and
Speaker 4: made my life a little bit more enjoyable than feeling
Speaker 4: like I need to be on the hunt.
Speaker 1: I'm curious why were you a little self conscious of
Speaker 1: saying that, or like you said, it could sound.
Speaker 4: Bad, because I don't, because I think oftentimes people go
Speaker 4: to the internet and they listen to conversations like this
Speaker 4: to help them validate their choices, and so I think
Speaker 4: if somebody has made different choices than what I have made,
Speaker 4: then me talking about how I've done something different can
Speaker 4: make them feel self conscious about their their choices. Or
Speaker 4: if someone is maybe in a similar position to me,
Speaker 4: but maybe they feel bad about it, Like maybe they're
Speaker 4: in their mid thirties as well, and they you know,
Speaker 4: are single and don't have kids, but they so want that.
Speaker 4: I don't ever want anybody to feel a certain way
Speaker 4: just because I'm making different choices. So I like to
Speaker 4: have those disclaimers of like, I'm not here to validate
Speaker 4: or invalidate anyone's experience. I'm just here to share what
Speaker 4: my experience has been so far, and who knows, something
Speaker 4: could be totally different. I could walk outside and like
Speaker 4: meet my husband this afternoon and have a baby in
Speaker 4: a year. I don't know. I'm doing it all for
Speaker 4: the plot, we'll see.
Speaker 2: And also too, I think sometimes the way people dangle
Speaker 2: marriage and like family as if it will fix all
Speaker 2: the things. That's how it's like, you know, I mean,
Speaker 2: has somebody who was happily married, you know, but like, oh,
Speaker 2: you know, like if you don't like, I'll this is
Speaker 2: what Like, you know, every man with the microphone and
Speaker 2: the red pill. Then it's like, you don't get married,
Speaker 2: you don't have kids, You're gonna die along with a cat.
Speaker 2: I'm like, what's guess, you know, But that's the sense
Speaker 2: that like, oh, that you do it because for the
Speaker 2: for the desired outcome, which is at least you'll have
Speaker 2: someone to take care of you. And I'm just saying
Speaker 2: that that's not the reason to get like, you know,
Speaker 2: like the fear of like, well, what will it look
Speaker 2: like when I'm eighty, that's not the reason to ideally
Speaker 2: partner because there's no guarantee that your partnering on my
Speaker 2: husband past, there's no guarantee. So you can have all
Speaker 2: the things you could be like, oh my gosh, I've
Speaker 2: found this person, they're so great. There's no guarantee at
Speaker 2: the end that it's going to look like that. And
Speaker 2: so that's why ideally, you know, you partner, because because
Speaker 2: that's the right partner for you. You know that, you know.
Speaker 2: So I always think that when I tell like young
Speaker 2: women that I talk to, I'm just like, you can
Speaker 2: have all the great things, you can have best partner,
Speaker 2: All the things are in line and still you know,
Speaker 2: so it's just best to just choose from a place
Speaker 2: of this is what's right for me, you know, because
Speaker 2: you know or you know, I mean, there's just yeah,
Speaker 2: there's just so many ways that like twists and turns
Speaker 2: and you know, always trying your best to live in
Speaker 2: alignment is really the only way you can kind of
Speaker 2: look up and say, so glad I made that choice,
Speaker 2: you know, I love.
Speaker 1: I mean, I wanted to stand up if I wasn't like,
Speaker 1: I'm not actually wearing like proper attire on my lower
Speaker 1: half right now.
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna lie.
Speaker 1: The same very short short time, but like I would
Speaker 1: stand up, but we post on YouTube, so I'm not
Speaker 1: gonna do that. But when you said less, like, oh,
Speaker 1: I just wanted to capture that because it's so crucial.
Speaker 1: And I think because you are a content creator and
Speaker 1: you are an influencer. You have a podcast, people do
Speaker 1: and I think Tiffany and I too, people turn to
Speaker 1: us for advice and guidance and all of that. But
Speaker 1: it's almost like you really care about the listen. Not
Speaker 1: almost like you definitely care about your listener. You care
Speaker 1: about how you're coming across, not in a way that
Speaker 1: makes you self conscious, but that makes you like like
Speaker 1: almost like just protective of your audience. And I think
Speaker 1: it's really fucking wise, Like if you guys were listening
Speaker 1: what you said about how when you're listening to someone's story,
Speaker 1: it doesn't have to like that doesn't have to be
Speaker 1: the way that you validate your own feelings, your own desires.
Speaker 1: And I think we are in such a culture now
Speaker 1: where you want like you live in an echo chamber
Speaker 1: and you collect voices that sort of like echo what
Speaker 1: it is that you want to hear what you want
Speaker 1: for your life, and it's like always you know, validating.
Speaker 1: But it's okay for us to sit with people and
Speaker 1: hear their stories and experiences and not have to like
Speaker 1: judge it against ourselves, but just sit with it and
Speaker 1: be like, oh, that's a story, that's that's that person's story,
Speaker 1: and how about that? Like I wish we would just
Speaker 1: bring back that like Midwestern say my grandma always to
Speaker 1: say how about that? Or like the Southern like bless
Speaker 1: her heart, like that kind of thing. You know, like
Speaker 1: we just either we're like we can't be present with
Speaker 1: someone when they're speaking because either we're comparing ourselves to
Speaker 1: them or we're judging them so harshly for the decisions
Speaker 1: that they've made, and like, if that wasn't an advertisement
Speaker 1: for balanced black girl, I don't know what is, because
Speaker 1: it's such like that little If people could just get
Speaker 1: that which where you can just like be okay listening
Speaker 1: to someone else and not need them to validate yourself,
Speaker 1: then you'd be so much happier.
Speaker 3: Yeah, oh, I really validate me. I just love you validate.
Speaker 4: No, Mandy, I think you just articulated so much better
Speaker 4: my intention. That's exactly it. So thank you I've received.
Speaker 2: Yeah, hey, b a fan, We're going to take a
Speaker 2: quick break and we'll be right back.
Speaker 1: Okay, well let's talk about Okay, so we are thirty,
Speaker 1: you're turning thirty five, got a big birthday coming up,
Speaker 1: and you have posted about this. What's on your list
Speaker 1: of what are you calling it?
Speaker 3: Like? Thirty five dirty? What was it?
Speaker 4: Thirty thirty five hotter?
Speaker 3: Why did I say thirty five dirty? Dirty?
Speaker 4: Thirty five thirty.
Speaker 3: I'm like glitching, all right, go ahead, thirty five hotter?
Speaker 3: What does that look like for you?
Speaker 4: So I over the past probably like a year or so,
Speaker 4: and maybe this is I'm noticing. I'm having a realization
Speaker 4: right now, I'm having an epiphany with you too. I
Speaker 4: think there's something in my brain about ages that end
Speaker 4: in five, because when I was twenty five, oh, you're
Speaker 4: not alone on twenty five. For some it messed with
Speaker 4: my head. I had this whole thing around turning twenty five,
Speaker 4: and I made this list. I called it the twenty
Speaker 4: five by twenty five of twenty five things I wanted
Speaker 4: to do by my twenty fifth birthday to get me
Speaker 4: out of a punk. And I'm realizing, I think this
Speaker 4: is like my the next iteration of that, because I'm
Speaker 4: not doing thirty five thirty five things is a lot
Speaker 4: of things. Not making a list of thirty five things
Speaker 4: to do. But I was feeling this complex around turning
Speaker 4: thirty five, even more so than I felt around turning thirty.
Speaker 4: I was pretty indifferent about thirty actually, and I just
Speaker 4: wanted to instead of feeling all this anxiety around what
Speaker 4: I you know, quote unquote haven't done in my life.
Speaker 4: I want to walk into thirty five feeling the best
Speaker 4: that I've ever felt mentally, physically, emotionally, and so a
Speaker 4: lot of the things that I'm focusing on currently or
Speaker 4: like going back to therapy just for maintenance, not because
Speaker 4: it's like nine to one one something's wrong. You know,
Speaker 4: in the past, I would go to therapy if I
Speaker 4: was having like really bad anxiety, or if I was,
Speaker 4: you know, experienced someone passing and was in the depth
Speaker 4: of grief. But I'm having my first experience going to
Speaker 4: therapy just to like process. We'll touch up old stuff. Yeah,
Speaker 4: just stuff that I've been carrying, you know, from my
Speaker 4: teens and twenties, and I'm like, I just don't want
Speaker 4: to take this into the next chapter. So it's it's
Speaker 4: almost nice to be in therapy without the alarm bells
Speaker 4: going off. Changing up fitness because my relationship to fitness
Speaker 4: has changed a lot. Fitness is a big part of
Speaker 4: my story, but a lot of what I did in
Speaker 4: my twenties just doesn't make sense now because I'm in
Speaker 4: a totally different place in my life. My body needs
Speaker 4: different things as I get older. I just don't need
Speaker 4: to be jumping around doing all the burpies and crazy stuff.
Speaker 4: I mean ten years ago. It just doesn't not serve me.
Speaker 4: My knees are exactly Oh my gosh, no. I walked
Speaker 4: the whole borough of Manhattan on Saturday, and oh wow,
Speaker 4: I got to about Chelsea, and I was like, I'm
Speaker 4: feeling real over thirty right now, my knees and my hips.
Speaker 4: And I was like, oh, this is this is an adventure.
Speaker 3: But did you do the round trip or you just
Speaker 3: want like, no, no, we.
Speaker 4: Just started from the top and went to the bottom.
Speaker 3: Oh, okay, gotcha. Oh that's fun.
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 3: Is it? No? I don't know what you do.
Speaker 4: It was.
Speaker 2: It was fun.
Speaker 4: It was long. I don't know if I need to
Speaker 4: do it again, but it was fun.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 4: It was a fun way to see the city as
Speaker 4: like a new person here. But yeah, But thirty five
Speaker 4: Potter is just me being really intentional about the months
Speaker 4: leading up to my thirty fifth birthday, pouring into myself
Speaker 4: and feeling as good as I can feel entering, you know,
Speaker 4: the second half of my thirties.
Speaker 1: How do you know, because for me sometimes I can
Speaker 1: get stressful stetting that kind of goal. How do you
Speaker 1: know when you get there that you did it.
Speaker 4: Well, we'll see how I feel when I wake up.
Speaker 2: On my birthday.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you're gonna be like wow.
Speaker 4: I mean yeah, having the date of the deadline helps
Speaker 4: I but yeah, and I also think the process, it's
Speaker 4: like the process of it has felt really good. I've
Speaker 4: actually enjoyed the things that I've been doing, Like I've
Speaker 4: been more intentional about taking more steps each day or
Speaker 4: trying new workout classes, going back to therapy. Doing those things,
Speaker 4: I've actually felt really good. Also during that I think like, uh,
Speaker 4: that's the point, you know, the what is it like?
Speaker 4: The journey is the destination? Yeah?
Speaker 2: Good this morning?
Speaker 3: Yeah hm. I keep thinking about oh uncle ahead to.
Speaker 2: I was gonna say, because this comes up a lot
Speaker 2: late lately, especially for young black women that I've been
Speaker 2: mentoring of teaching them to ask for help. What does
Speaker 2: it look like when you ask for help? Like how
Speaker 2: do you reach out and you're like I can't quite
Speaker 2: do this? Are you a good help asker? Or is
Speaker 2: it something that.
Speaker 4: Kind of it depends? You know. I've been in a
Speaker 4: position where I have been the first in a lot
Speaker 4: of ways. I was I've been the first, you know,
Speaker 4: woman in my lineage who was not mom first, you know,
Speaker 4: generation college graduate, first corporate person now, first full time entrepreneur.
Speaker 4: And you know, I had a lot of friends who
Speaker 4: have podcasts now, but they didn't back when I was starting.
Speaker 4: It's like, I'm I'm in so many areas where I
Speaker 4: am the first and the people around me, as incredible
Speaker 4: and as well intentioned as they are, they just don't
Speaker 4: have it to help me. They they don't they don't
Speaker 4: have it. They either don't have the resources, they don't
Speaker 4: have the knowledge. It's like they don't know. And so
Speaker 4: I when I ask for help, just get met with
Speaker 4: a lot of like, well I don't know, or like
Speaker 4: I'm sorry, there's not a whole lot I can do.
Speaker 4: That is that has been what asking for help has
Speaker 4: looked like for me. My whole life so still a
Speaker 4: work in progress. It's hard.
Speaker 1: Well, I mean, are you saying that in the sense that, like,
Speaker 1: have you had to build you know, your circle? I
Speaker 1: think as you your life goes in different directions, just
Speaker 1: has to expand and include more people to lift you
Speaker 1: up and to feel supportive and in that way, and
Speaker 1: like I can give an example, when we were all well,
Speaker 1: a lot of people were losing their minds about some
Speaker 1: algorithm change with iTunes and how that impacts or Apple
Speaker 1: and how that impacts podcast numbers.
Speaker 3: They were worried about that. Last year, while.
Speaker 1: I was in the throes of like postpartum, like joy,
Speaker 1: I was just like loving my baby and then whatever
Speaker 1: life was lifing, and then I woke up in twenty
Speaker 1: twenty four and I'm like, what the hell has happened here?
Speaker 3: Well, what's going on?
Speaker 1: And I texted you last year one of the few
Speaker 1: people I texted because like, when you know, the past
Speaker 1: couple of years, I've just tried to add more voices
Speaker 1: who do know what I'm going through, so that I
Speaker 1: can turn to someone and like get a little bit
Speaker 1: of support in those moments. Do you have you find
Speaker 1: that you've something that you've struggled with or like, you
Speaker 1: know when I say it like that, do you think
Speaker 1: that it's something that you're thinking about more?
Speaker 4: Yeah? It is definitely something I'm thinking about more, But
Speaker 4: I can't say that I've been able to fully grasp
Speaker 4: it or that I feel like I've I've built that
Speaker 4: type of community where I would feel yeah, quite yet
Speaker 4: it's like a work in progress. That's what I'm working on,
Speaker 4: but haven't yet figured it out.
Speaker 1: What do you feel like when you is it like
Speaker 1: the fear of Yeah, what do you have? Is this
Speaker 1: something that you're afraid of, Like that people won't be
Speaker 1: supportive or that they'll judge you if you ask certain things.
Speaker 4: No, I just feel like the people who like could
Speaker 4: be helpful. I'm like, they're too busy. Oh okay, I
Speaker 4: don't want a bug them. People have lives, they have children,
Speaker 4: they have I mean me, I'm just like vibing out
Speaker 4: by myself. It's like I have all the time in
Speaker 4: the world for people to ask me stuff. But I'm
Speaker 4: like everybody else, like they have partners, they have kids,
Speaker 4: they have real life stuff going on. They're busy.
Speaker 3: That's what you're telling yourself before you text.
Speaker 2: Oh okay, that's the story, but I don't like I
Speaker 2: guess doct agree in my therapist so well, she'll say,
Speaker 2: is that true? And even if it's so, it's like
Speaker 2: one part it might be true that people are busy,
Speaker 2: but is that the only truth available. People are busy,
Speaker 2: but not so busy that they would not be there
Speaker 2: for you. So it's like those two things can go okay,
Speaker 2: you know. And even just hearing when you just said
Speaker 2: you're the first to not be a team mom, first
Speaker 2: to go to college for you know, you sound like
Speaker 2: in front of my mind who's a bit of a survivalist,
Speaker 2: she survived this environment that she was not meant to
Speaker 2: survive and so oftentimes survivalists are like these rugged individuals,
Speaker 2: and so it's very difficult for a rugged individual because
Speaker 2: it's like that environment it was not conduce for me
Speaker 2: to get out. I had to figure it out, and
Speaker 2: so you take that I have to figure it out
Speaker 2: with you into adulthood. I've seen it in her because
Speaker 2: I'm like, girl, yeah, you're not out here by yourself,
Speaker 2: and she's just like, but that's the thing that brought
Speaker 2: her out of that space was to learn to lean
Speaker 2: on herself and see it through. And so she's working
Speaker 2: through in therapy now how to like open herself up
Speaker 2: that there are people that will show up for you.
Speaker 2: We know that was true, but that's not necessarily true
Speaker 2: now you know you actually don't because it's not possible
Speaker 2: really to go through life successfully all by yourself. That like,
Speaker 2: there are people you can trust, there are people you
Speaker 2: can lean on. Yes, people are busy, but not so
Speaker 2: busy that they can't lean on and love on you,
Speaker 2: because that's just how you know, that's how it goes.
Speaker 2: It's like, you know, Mandy has imagined you know, Mandy's
Speaker 2: got beautiful rio and imagine Remy comes along. She's like sorry, sir,
Speaker 2: we tapped out over here. No, what happens with love.
Speaker 2: Love is expansive that when you add someone else, you
Speaker 2: actually grow to capacity to absorb them in. Like ask
Speaker 2: any parent. It wasn't like Mandy was like, well I
Speaker 2: don't know about.
Speaker 3: This baby, words in my mouth.
Speaker 2: You don't know how to you know what I mean?
Speaker 4: Yeah?
Speaker 2: Instead, literally her capacity to love just expanded and so like,
Speaker 2: So I just hope that you take care with you
Speaker 2: that like there are people who would love on you,
Speaker 2: care for you, look after you, that even though they
Speaker 2: are busy, because you're part of their life, they will
Speaker 2: expand to their capacity to welcome you in that you're
Speaker 2: not out here by yourself.
Speaker 1: You know, people who have kids wish some mo would
Speaker 1: call us who's not a doctor or a daycare or
Speaker 1: a fucking like teachers saying you forgot their water bottle again.
Speaker 3: I would love.
Speaker 1: Making friends in your thirties is so crucial, and I
Speaker 1: have had I have had to, Like I mean, I'm
Speaker 1: one of my best friends now that I met a
Speaker 1: couple of years ago. I literally just saw her in
Speaker 1: a parking lot and I rolled my window. I pulled
Speaker 1: the story before roll my window down. And just like
Speaker 1: be my friend please. That's just like the only other
Speaker 1: black mom. Yeah, And I'll give you a second just
Speaker 1: to respond to what Tiffany said last, I'm curious, like
Speaker 1: how that hit for you?
Speaker 4: No, I do. I it does hit a lot, And
Speaker 4: I think that in so many ways, that's what I want.
Speaker 4: And I think a lot of something that I'm also
Speaker 4: working on in therapy and it has changed how I've
Speaker 4: showed up in my work a little bit, is that
Speaker 4: a lot of my relationships that I did have were
Speaker 4: very dependent on people meeting me and feeling like, oh,
Speaker 4: I have to do you know, I have to be
Speaker 4: like everybody's big sister and always happy answer in order
Speaker 4: for people to find value in me. And I do
Speaker 4: think some of my relationships have reflected that. So a
Speaker 4: lot of it is me like establishing new bonds with
Speaker 4: people that aren't dependent on that. And I do think
Speaker 4: that being in new cities and new spaces has definitely helped. Okay,
Speaker 4: And so now as I'm going about building community here
Speaker 4: that it's looking and feeling a little bit different.
Speaker 2: I love that. Just like I tell Mandy sometimes I'm
Speaker 2: like Mandy, girl, I love you because I love you.
Speaker 1: Yeah, no, and not someone I need to hear that
Speaker 1: because I am like very similar in the sense that
Speaker 1: if I don't feel like I have a purpose for someone,
Speaker 1: I'm like, so when are they going to realize there's
Speaker 1: not much to like hang out for not that interesting,
Speaker 1: which is a very disordered way of thinking and it's
Speaker 1: not healthy. I would not recommend zero out of ten.
Speaker 1: But also finding like being vulnerable enough to tell the
Speaker 1: people in your community. I had to be a big
Speaker 1: girl this year and tell people like Tiffany and good
Speaker 1: friends of mine, like what I need, Like I actually
Speaker 1: really love having conversations and having phone calls and checking
Speaker 1: in on me and spending some time like I actually
Speaker 1: am struggling and I really need that. Could you help
Speaker 1: me with that need? And it's just so like it's
Speaker 1: so uncomfortable sometimes to be the person who's asking for
Speaker 1: that of someone else. But the only like for me
Speaker 1: the other side of that was like, well, what else
Speaker 1: I'm going to?
Speaker 3: Like what?
Speaker 1: Just be in a deep depression all the time because
Speaker 1: I'm just like this shriveled up little like you know,
Speaker 1: like just starved being who's not being poured into And listen,
Speaker 1: I love a good hot bath and like going for
Speaker 1: a nature walk and putting on less on my on
Speaker 1: my on my headphones to take care. But community and
Speaker 1: like sisterhood and being seen by another human being. I
Speaker 1: mean biology wins every time, like we're humans and that's
Speaker 1: just what Yeah, it's what it's about, right, It's like
Speaker 1: that connection. But yeah, it does get more challenging the
Speaker 1: older you get to put yourself out there and admit
Speaker 1: that you need it, not wanting.
Speaker 2: To kids make friends at the park. They're like, Hi,
Speaker 2: that's your ball. Yeah, I'm gonna play. Yeah, I know.
Speaker 2: And then and then like they're like that's my bestie.
Speaker 2: I'm like, oh, what's her name?
Speaker 4: Cat?
Speaker 2: I'm just like ah. I wish it was so easy
Speaker 2: for adults like Hi, you seem cool. Thanks.
Speaker 1: You would have be like, Okay, what's on the list
Speaker 1: of you're you're thirty five in a new city almost
Speaker 1: thirty five, sorry, thirty four thirty four point nine and
Speaker 1: a very new city. How are you making friends and
Speaker 1: new connections here? Did you have any like baseline, did
Speaker 1: you know anybody in New York?
Speaker 3: First?
Speaker 4: I did? I knew a few people here, and then honestly,
Speaker 4: the main way that I've been meeting people at just events. Thankfully,
Speaker 4: because of work, I get invited to a lot of events,
Speaker 4: whether that's creator events or getting invited to speak places,
Speaker 4: and so usually when I go to events, my goal
Speaker 4: is always to connect and exchange information with one new person,
Speaker 4: which also as an introvert, just feels a lot less overwhelming.
Speaker 4: Oh yes, and so with that, I that has been
Speaker 4: my strategy and it's been helpful so far.
Speaker 2: I love that.
Speaker 1: Oh that's such a great especially for introverts, like just
Speaker 1: one person. It's okay to just talk to one person. Yes, yeah,
Speaker 1: I'm very much in.
Speaker 2: The bathroom, girl, love your shoes. That's like my favorite.
Speaker 2: Like when I'm trying to break that, you know, I'll
Speaker 2: be in the bathroom, you know, because the bathroom is
Speaker 2: is like the great equalizer. You just washing your hands.
Speaker 2: I think it's in the bathroom. Oh my god, girl,
Speaker 2: I love your shoes, you know, yeah, or whatever. And
Speaker 2: then afterwards, you know, you might, you know, you might
Speaker 2: make eye contact and then you start tit chatting, you know.
Speaker 2: So that's like a good it's breaker for me, like
Speaker 2: love your shoes or your curls popping or whatever, like
Speaker 2: specifically because I'm shired, than people think, and so like
Speaker 2: that's kind of like a little like I'm like, when
Speaker 2: I go to bath and wash my hands, I'm sure
Speaker 2: they're gonna be some beautiful brown woman in there. I'll
Speaker 2: be able to compliment her well lack eyes across the room,
Speaker 2: and then I'll be able to tit chat and then
Speaker 2: and ease my nervousness.
Speaker 1: Do you feel that sense like when I see another
Speaker 1: woman of color, I just feel so at home, Like
Speaker 1: I don't. It's so I have gotten so much more
Speaker 1: reliant on this. I think there's like this fatigue of
Speaker 1: being in corporate where you're just so starved of having
Speaker 1: other people who kind of get you. And it's just
Speaker 1: something I look for in every room I go in. Now,
Speaker 1: I'm like, where are my people? And maybe it's like
Speaker 1: a little but I've just chosen to be optimistic. I'm
Speaker 1: just like, if there's a woman of color in the room,
Speaker 1: we are going to be a friend, We're going to chat.
Speaker 1: It's gonna be a relaxing space. I went to the
Speaker 1: pool and my one of my one of my good
Speaker 1: friends invited us to the pool, and like, I live
Speaker 1: in Westchester, which is like, you know, outside of Manhattan,
Speaker 1: and all that where the old suburban ladies go to
Speaker 1: live and die and anyway. The pool was like so
Speaker 1: not diverse. It was just like full of we're like
Speaker 1: the only people of color there. Not only that, but
Speaker 1: like body type was wise. I was like very I
Speaker 1: stood out like a sour thout, I realized, and like,
Speaker 1: I'm someone who like, once you have a kid, you
Speaker 1: don't get to be self conscious about getting in a pool.
Speaker 1: You just got to get in that water because I'm
Speaker 1: not about to ruin his summer because I don't like
Speaker 1: the way.
Speaker 3: That I look.
Speaker 1: But it was such a deeply uncomfortable like afternoon for
Speaker 1: me that when I got home and I was journaling,
Speaker 1: I was like, that did not feel good. I don't
Speaker 1: think I want to go back to that place where
Speaker 1: you know, I'm just like sticking out in that way,
Speaker 1: and it's yeah, I'm hat like what would you say
Speaker 1: to someone when they're feeling like that last because I
Speaker 1: just in my mind, I'm like, trust your anxiety a
Speaker 1: little bit in this situation.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah. I mean, so I grew up in Seattle
Speaker 4: and I lived there my entire life up until age thirty,
Speaker 4: and it was like I couldn't go anywhere without that feeling.
Speaker 4: When I was still there, it was just like, ugh,
Speaker 4: like I do not belong here. There is this coldness,
Speaker 4: is just this discomfort, And I do feel like that
Speaker 4: is your intuition telling you something. And yes, I have
Speaker 4: picked up and moved a few times, and I don't
Speaker 4: think everybody necessarily needs to do that, but I do
Speaker 4: think that understanding you know, when you don't necessarily feel comfortable,
Speaker 4: or when something doesn't feel like your happy place, that's
Speaker 4: important information. But it's also good to know, okay, well,
Speaker 4: what would be your happy place? What would help you
Speaker 4: feel more comfortable? And get specific about that so that
Speaker 4: we can seek out the spaces that we do feel
Speaker 4: better in.
Speaker 1: Not that bowl, not never again. So summer is upon us.
Speaker 1: How are you guys taking care of yourselves this summer?
Speaker 1: Tif me, I want to hear have you thought it through?
Speaker 3: Miss travel everywhere and do everything?
Speaker 2: I am? Well, my aim for this summer is there's like,
Speaker 2: you know, a few I'm like learning from. Like kids
Speaker 2: are like the best, like teachers. So my niece and
Speaker 2: nephew they kind of dictate the Auntie, are we going
Speaker 2: to do the beach house again? So for the last
Speaker 2: four or five summers. I've rented a house down New
Speaker 2: Jersey like the Shore, which is great because it's fairly
Speaker 2: inexpensive for how many people you could pack in there.
Speaker 2: In the last two years, I've done like three groups
Speaker 2: of people. So like my neighbors who I'm really close with,
Speaker 2: they come for the first few days, then my sisters
Speaker 2: and kids come for the last few days, and then
Speaker 2: the last few days. I used to spend by myself,
Speaker 2: but now that I'm dating someone, he's coming the last
Speaker 2: few days.
Speaker 4: I am.
Speaker 2: Now he's gonna be so geek. He got mentioned before,
Speaker 2: no I.
Speaker 3: Have not, but we'll make a big deal about it.
Speaker 3: We don't make a big deal about.
Speaker 2: It because he listens.
Speaker 3: Said, that's how he knows he likes you.
Speaker 2: I know. So so that's been great. So I'm like, Okay,
Speaker 2: the beach. And then I have a sister that lives
Speaker 2: in Chicago that we don't get to see as much.
Speaker 2: I have five sisters, four sisters, and so we're going
Speaker 2: to make our way to Chicago, likely in August. And
Speaker 2: then I promised Amelia, my niece that lives in New Jersey,
Speaker 2: that we would go to the White House because she
Speaker 2: was like, I saw you went to the White House,
Speaker 2: and because we went to Washington, DC with them, but
Speaker 2: she wasn't allowed to go to the White House. And
Speaker 2: she was like why, I said, you can't just go
Speaker 2: and see the president. She's like, you did, That's it,
Speaker 2: you know what. She ain't long. So I reached out
Speaker 2: to like the liaison at the White House. They're like, yeah,
Speaker 2: let us know, we'll do a tour for you. She
Speaker 2: was like like I thought she's six man and so like,
Speaker 2: so those are like, you know, so I'm planning. I'm
Speaker 2: trying my best to release my inner younger Tiffany like
Speaker 2: planning my summer the way a little kid would, which
Speaker 2: is connection, excitement. And so so far those are like
Speaker 2: my three quote unquote trips, and I have some business
Speaker 2: trips kind of flowing in. But I'm really looking forward
Speaker 2: to this summer. I don't want to spend as much
Speaker 2: time with family and friends as possible. That's just what
Speaker 2: it looks like. I'm moving into my condo, my new
Speaker 2: condo soon, and I want to have like a housewarming,
Speaker 2: and so yeah, I'm just like other what other things
Speaker 2: can I do to create connection? So that's my summer.
Speaker 4: I love it.
Speaker 1: Play outside till the street lights come home and really
Speaker 1: serotonin boosts.
Speaker 3: I'd be out there to watch Rio.
Speaker 1: I'm playing soccer. I'm like, okay, why haven't I kicked
Speaker 1: a ball? This is fun up and down the asphalt, Like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's fun, all right, let's what about you. I know
Speaker 1: we talked a little bit about dirty again, Dirty thirty five, thirty.
Speaker 4: Five, but tell me, yes, I honestly, I'm on a
Speaker 4: similar way as Tiffany. I realize that I have not
Speaker 4: had what I would consider a fun summer since about
Speaker 4: twenty eighteen, of just spending time outside, spending time with friends,
Speaker 4: being enjoyed, going out, maybe a little bit of a
Speaker 4: hot girl summer. I just have not done that in
Speaker 4: several years. And so that's my intention for this year
Speaker 4: is to just have fun and enjoy my first summer
Speaker 4: in New York. And so yeah, it's gonna be a
Speaker 4: lie little more like unserious, and I think I am
Speaker 4: the rest of the year and exploring the city, like
Speaker 4: things like walking Manhattan were part of my you know,
Speaker 4: summer bucket list of like doing all the things, seeing
Speaker 4: the sites, seeing the parks, going to the parties. From
Speaker 4: a work standpoint, I'm actually going to be doing a
Speaker 4: summer of solo episodes. So I'm not going to be
Speaker 4: having any guests on the podcast over the summer, honestly,
Speaker 4: just because I want to have a little bit more
Speaker 4: of a relaxed schedule and so, you know, with booking
Speaker 4: guests and all of that, it just gets a little
Speaker 4: bit more stressful just with bringing people into the fold,
Speaker 4: and so I'm just taking a break and it's just
Speaker 4: going to be meat recording when I want to record
Speaker 4: and making it easy. Yay.
Speaker 3: As a listener, I'm like, yay, you don't have to
Speaker 3: have a guess all the time.
Speaker 4: Yeah. Yeah, And so I'm excited for that. I'm excited
Speaker 4: for a more relaxed summer of fun summer. I traveled
Speaker 4: so much last year that I kind of burned myself
Speaker 4: out on travel. So I don't have any trips planned
Speaker 4: currently and I'm just going to be in the city
Speaker 4: enjoying and having.
Speaker 2: My It's like fifteen countries in that city, right.
Speaker 4: It is, especially for my first summer. You know, I'm
Speaker 4: gonna have my version of like a hot girl summer
Speaker 4: and I'm looking forward to it.
Speaker 3: Yeah. The city will have you, It will have you.
Speaker 1: Really like being like I need a break from outside
Speaker 1: sometimes because there's so much to do and so much
Speaker 1: to see.
Speaker 3: That sounds fun, I'm like, yeah, some are fun. Hell yeah.
Speaker 1: I don't think I ever had more fun in New
Speaker 1: York than the summer I got let go from my
Speaker 1: job and I had like unemployment for a few months,
Speaker 1: and I just like benefits, you know, like I got
Speaker 1: a little check early when that could like buy stuff,
Speaker 1: and I had.
Speaker 3: So much fun. I just like volunteered, I biked everywhere.
Speaker 3: It was great, all right.
Speaker 1: So for me, this is the summer of it sounds
Speaker 1: like a lot of work, but I've kind of told myself,
Speaker 1: I'm getting a I'm getting a diploma in my own
Speaker 1: mental health because I have done therapy and I've done
Speaker 1: that for so long, but like I'm doing some group
Speaker 1: therapy for the first time, two different groups.
Speaker 4: Now.
Speaker 1: I'm gonna a CBT for anxiety group therapy, and i
Speaker 1: also have a group for dialectical therapy, which I'm in,
Speaker 1: which sounds so it's just like sounds so much, but
Speaker 1: actually it's just about right. I love it. Like I'm
Speaker 1: loving being in a group setting, a small group where
Speaker 1: we are like not just kind of like talk therapy,
Speaker 1: but we're actually like, so how are we coping? And
Speaker 1: like that's why I talked about like basically putting your
Speaker 1: podcast on the list of ways to soothe me when I'm,
Speaker 1: you know, feeling anxious and just do something that makes
Speaker 1: me feel a little bit better. So that's a big thing.
Speaker 1: And then I'm not going to put pressure on as
Speaker 1: like I can just achieve it this summer. But I
Speaker 1: was listening to Balance Black Girl less again as I do,
Speaker 1: And did I.
Speaker 3: Text you about this?
Speaker 4: Uh?
Speaker 1: You had a dietitian Culina Health founder on your show, Vanessa.
Speaker 1: It was the same week where I had just had
Speaker 1: my first meeting with a diet with a nutritionist and
Speaker 1: I have found her through my insurance and like it
Speaker 1: was fine, but it wasn't like really clicking for me.
Speaker 1: But because of that episode, I went and looked up
Speaker 1: Kulina and then I filled out there long sort of
Speaker 1: like entry form and now I have a whole dietitian
Speaker 1: and I've been seeing her for I think this is
Speaker 1: the fifth week coming up.
Speaker 3: And really the key for me was.
Speaker 1: Like this is now an ad for cooling and that's fine,
Speaker 1: is that you can find a nutritionist who specializes in
Speaker 1: like your dysfunction with food, and so my dysfunction is
Speaker 1: around anxiety induced eating and like soothing with food, and
Speaker 1: she this dietitian. It has been already like really like
Speaker 1: the first time I'm thinking so differently about my relationship
Speaker 1: with food and it has nothing to do with dieting
Speaker 1: and exercise. And it's really been an eye opening experience.
Speaker 1: And I have, you know, balanced Black Girl to thank
Speaker 1: for connecting me with that with that nutritionist company. So
Speaker 1: those are the two things. I'm just like wellness but
Speaker 1: like in my mind trying to heal some of this
Speaker 1: crap that I have going on, and then just like
Speaker 1: building better skills so I can cope with the muchness
Speaker 1: of life. And the the plot. The plot sometimes is
Speaker 1: a little too It's like giving like Steve and King
Speaker 1: over here, and I'm hoping for like more, i don't know,
Speaker 1: like more of a Nicholas Sparks kind of plot, Like
Speaker 1: I'm like that for my life right now.
Speaker 4: Hey, Mandy, I love that. I'm so glad that you
Speaker 4: were able to meet with a dietician from Cleena and
Speaker 4: that it's been helpful.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they're great, I mean ten out of ten and
Speaker 1: spiritual and my insurance covers fifty sessions. I was like, cool,
Speaker 1: ye everyone, Yes, that's one of the things she talked
Speaker 1: about was how people don't think that their insurance will
Speaker 1: cover it. But yeah, fifty sessions. I don't even have
Speaker 1: a copey, And I'm just like it, is.
Speaker 2: This your personal show or through your business? Is this
Speaker 2: like through your husband Mandy's insurance?
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, I have my my husband's insurance. Yes,
Speaker 1: shout out to the government. You're good for something.
Speaker 2: The government.
Speaker 1: Sure, yes, it's nice. Okay, all right, Less, should we
Speaker 1: wrap up? There a need like final thought? Where can
Speaker 1: we find y'all? Where can people connect?
Speaker 2: Yes?
Speaker 4: Okay, wait, one more thing I was going to say
Speaker 4: about your mental health excursion, Mandy that I love is
Speaker 4: that sometimes just talk therapy, one on one talking to
Speaker 4: a therapist can be great. And I do think a
Speaker 4: lot of us reach a point where we're like, do
Speaker 4: you got anything stronger? Like I know exactly what happened
Speaker 4: when I was seven, That makes me do x y
Speaker 4: Z what am I going to do about it? And
Speaker 4: so similarly, in my go round of therapy this time around,
Speaker 4: I am with a therapist who specializes in EMDR and
Speaker 4: somatic practices, so like I did help me to process it, yes,
Speaker 4: and work through traumatic experiences.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 4: So also just want to say that for people like
Speaker 4: if just talking, if you feel like you've you've made
Speaker 4: progress with just talking, but you need something else. There's
Speaker 4: so many other forms of therapies out there, so don't
Speaker 4: be afraid to seek those out.
Speaker 3: Skills based therapy.
Speaker 2: I was stuck and them my therapist she actually does
Speaker 2: do that because she's a trauma based therapist, and so
Speaker 2: I was like what And I was like this is
Speaker 2: dumb because I was like, oh, thuse are on the surface,
Speaker 2: it feels very woo woo, but I mean we are lacked, Okay.
Speaker 2: I was like, wow, well that was powerful.
Speaker 1: It's like when we people ask us, like Tiffany when
Speaker 1: we do shows, and it's like above the four oh
Speaker 1: one K, like the four one K is the most
Speaker 1: basic form of investing in retirement savings and we're like, no,
Speaker 1: let's get to some real like how do people really
Speaker 1: make money? Like how are we really impacting our mental health?
Speaker 1: And I truly believe it's that like more nuanced skills
Speaker 1: based like niche down form of therapy. I'm so glad
Speaker 1: that people are like I think the pandemic played a
Speaker 1: big role in that, like these virtual versions of therapy,
Speaker 1: people are getting much more like aware of it and
Speaker 1: using it. But I think a lot of people will
Speaker 1: need that next level and need to know where to
Speaker 1: go from them, so where to go from there? So
Speaker 1: I'm glad that you brought up is it E M
Speaker 1: D R. Yeah, okay, awesome. And I brought up dialectical
Speaker 1: behavioral therapy and I had not heard of that ever,
Speaker 1: but highly recommend ten out of ten.
Speaker 2: I just love the therapy has just become commonplace for
Speaker 2: brown people. Yes, you know what I mean, that just
Speaker 2: wasn't the case that help it is. No, No, it's
Speaker 2: become because I mean it just I mean I just
Speaker 2: almost everyone who I talk to, they're like my therapist said,
Speaker 2: oh yeah, I'd opened to therapy, whereas before it's like
Speaker 2: you need Jesus, oh yeah, you know yeah, or because
Speaker 2: even even pastors and things I'm seeing them say that yes, certainly,
Speaker 2: pray on it, but therapy is also a tool. And
Speaker 2: I'm like, okay, I love that it's just becoming not
Speaker 2: this like this scary woo woo, Like you know, if
Speaker 2: you prayed you would need it thing and so because
Speaker 2: we need it, especially if you are a black or
Speaker 2: brown person living in the US of a child. Lord knows,
Speaker 2: it's just trauma and just your birth, so just therapy.
Speaker 3: So yes, ma'am with.
Speaker 2: That ask for help, y'all.
Speaker 4: Thank you Less for coming on, Thank you for having me.
Speaker 4: Oh my gosh, I had such a good time talking
Speaker 4: to the two of you.
Speaker 1: Good. I feel calmer already. All Right, you guys, go follow, subscribe,
Speaker 1: leave a review for Balanced Black Girl and you can follow.
Speaker 1: I'll do your promo for you so you can follow
Speaker 1: Less on Instagram at balance Less. You can see her
Speaker 1: incredible new cover art for her podcast when she relaunched
Speaker 1: What Dear Media. And Yeah, I can't say enough great
Speaker 1: things about you Lass, thanks for joining the show.
Speaker 4: Thank you so much.