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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, your home for

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Speaker 1: deer hunting news, stories and strategies, and now your host,

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Speaker 1: Mark Kenyon. Welcome to the Wired to Hunt Podcast. I'm

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Speaker 1: your host, Mark Kenyan, and this is episode number two.

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Speaker 1: Today in the show, we're joined by Steve Bartilla, accomplished

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Speaker 1: outdoor writer and veteran deer hunter, and we're diving into

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Speaker 1: the details of patterning mature box. You are not going

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Speaker 1: to want to miss this one, so settle in and

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Speaker 1: let's go. All right, Welcome to the Wire to Hunt Podcast.

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Speaker 1: Today is a great day because fall is finally here,

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Speaker 1: and joining me and Dan today on the show is

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Speaker 1: a great guest, Steve bart Welcome to the show. Steve. Hey,

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Speaker 1: thanks guys, I really appreciate being here. Yeah, we're thrilled

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Speaker 1: to have you on the show as well. And how

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Speaker 1: you doing that afternoon. I'm doing real good, um, real good.

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Speaker 1: As you said, I'm probably in the minority in this.

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Speaker 1: I almost wish Paul was a couple more weeks away

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Speaker 1: yet myself because I've got so much stuff left to

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Speaker 1: do to get ready. But but it is. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I'll tell you what if you're a deer hunter and

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Speaker 1: you can't get excited about this time of year. Now,

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Speaker 1: there's something wrong. This is definitely the exciting time of year.

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Speaker 1: I can relate, though, to what you said about kind

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Speaker 1: of wishing you had some more time. I spent this

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Speaker 1: whole past weekend running around like a chicken on the

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Speaker 1: head cut off, trying to get all my final stand

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Speaker 1: prep done, trim all my final shooting lanes and whatnot,

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Speaker 1: and I think, knock on wood, I'm ready, But it

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Speaker 1: always seems I'm envious. Buddy, I've gotta I'm embarrassed to

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Speaker 1: admit this, but with all the extra work I've had

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Speaker 1: this year, I've got over a hundred and fifty tree

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Speaker 1: stands out and not one of them is ready to go.

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Speaker 1: I've got somewhere over a hundred and fifties trees to

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Speaker 1: climb yet, and times are running. Yeah, I guess that

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Speaker 1: I do not envy you on that workload right there,

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Speaker 1: The legs are going to be sore, I imagine. I

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Speaker 1: think that's a perfect segue to to the next thing

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Speaker 1: I want to ask you about. Steve Um. You know,

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Speaker 1: for those who are listening to that maybe aren't as

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Speaker 1: familiar with you and your work, could you share this

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Speaker 1: a little bit about your background, what exactly you're doing

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Speaker 1: in the outdoor hunting industry today. That might be why

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Speaker 1: you have a hundred and fifty tree stands, Hang I do.

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Speaker 1: I'm kind of I don't know exactly how to put this. UM.

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Speaker 1: I learned early on that if my my primary bread

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Speaker 1: and butter as as an outdoor writer. But frankly, to

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Speaker 1: do that full time, you can't afford disturn the kids.

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Speaker 1: There's just there's only especially in my niche is all

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Speaker 1: how to now, there's only so much house to stuff

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Speaker 1: to write, and there's only so much demand out Therefore

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Speaker 1: it gets decent paid per assignment. But to try to

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Speaker 1: make a living off of just that, you really can't.

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Speaker 1: So I do some I've got a tip segment on

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Speaker 1: every episode of Deer and Deer Huntings television show, and

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Speaker 1: also also do a bunch of interviews they actually have

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Speaker 1: three different television shows, do a bunch of interviews for

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Speaker 1: those shows, and then also work as a consultant where

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Speaker 1: I have it's either it changes, but it's almost always

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Speaker 1: either four or five properties that I have long term

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Speaker 1: management responsibilities on where these guys pay me to come

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Speaker 1: in and do all the habitat improvement in food, plot

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Speaker 1: and stand set up type work, and then actually come

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Speaker 1: up with hit lists of bucks that they that I

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Speaker 1: believe they should kill hip and as important, if not

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Speaker 1: more so, please don't kill this one. Key is a

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Speaker 1: fantastic He's a hundred and thirty two and a half

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Speaker 1: year old that's got unlimited potential written all over him.

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Speaker 1: And then taking it a final step for those guys,

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Speaker 1: it's okay, where should we hunt tonight, Steve, all right,

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Speaker 1: this is the buck you want to kill. This is

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Speaker 1: how I think you should go about doing it. Now.

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Speaker 1: Ultimately they're the owners. They can do whatever they want,

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Speaker 1: but they actually are pretty darn good, great guys. And

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Speaker 1: what I'll do, for the most part, there is work

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Speaker 1: on a property for about I tell the owners will

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Speaker 1: take me about five years, take me about five years

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Speaker 1: to get everything set up to the point where I

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Speaker 1: believe it's just just a self sustaining machine at this point,

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Speaker 1: and then go ahead and on some of them. At

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Speaker 1: that point we part ways and I go start over

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Speaker 1: on a new one. Wo much as I like killing deer,

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Speaker 1: I think the stuff that you're doing is what I

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Speaker 1: find is the most fun. So that sounds like you do.

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Speaker 1: Oh I am talk about it gives me opportunities that

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Speaker 1: I could would never ever ever have on my own.

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Speaker 1: I mean, the most land I've ever owned in my

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Speaker 1: life was a forty acre piece of ground that I

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Speaker 1: lived on for a while. And now I'm talking about

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Speaker 1: having clients that have some of them are dis your

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Speaker 1: average sized firms, but also at the same time, right now,

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Speaker 1: one of the properties I'm managing is and fifty contiguous acres. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you know, I mean, I'm honest. I mean, I almost

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Speaker 1: feel like I should be paying why I would pay

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Speaker 1: people to be willing to do with this kind of stuff. Hey,

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Speaker 1: don't cut yourself short exactly. Your customers might hear this. Well,

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Speaker 1: it's not much of a secret with them because they've

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Speaker 1: all all they all end up becoming friends over time,

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Speaker 1: and I've pretty much told them flat out that thank

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Speaker 1: you guys the amount the amount of stuff I've been

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Speaker 1: able to learn running And I mean these guys, obviously,

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Speaker 1: if you have fifty acres, you got pretty deep pockets. Okay,

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Speaker 1: So I mean, jeez, I'm running forty different trail cameras

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Speaker 1: all were Conics trail camera on this property. And to

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Speaker 1: be able to have. There was another four thousand acre

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Speaker 1: property that I worked on about eight years ago I

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Speaker 1: finally finished up on to be able to track individual

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Speaker 1: buck movements across that four thousand acres. You talk about

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Speaker 1: an eye opener and that that has helped me. As

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Speaker 1: I said, I should, I should be paying them to

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Speaker 1: be able to do this type of stuff. It is.

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Speaker 1: It's beyond fascinating. That sounds very cool. And to answer

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Speaker 1: your question, I agree this to me, this is I mean,

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Speaker 1: don't get me wrong, I love killing stuff as much

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Speaker 1: as the next guy, but that aspect of stuff is

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Speaker 1: a thrill, just absolute thrill to be able to manage

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Speaker 1: the ground that I could never have in my wildest dreams.

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Speaker 1: And I think those experiences that you've just described, described

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Speaker 1: that you've had, given the ability to monitor and learn

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Speaker 1: about these deer on all these different properties, is a

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Speaker 1: big part of what we want to talk about today

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Speaker 1: because I want to focus on patterning mature bucks. How

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Speaker 1: can how you can observe and collect data and information

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Speaker 1: to pattern a deer as best as possible. So that's

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Speaker 1: our main focus today. But before we dive into that,

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Speaker 1: we always do like to kick off the show with

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Speaker 1: a little bit of fun, a little lighter topic question.

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Speaker 1: And so, Dan, I think you've had something for Steve

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Speaker 1: that you that you wanted to ask him. Yeah, I'll

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Speaker 1: tell you what um. And what made me think about

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Speaker 1: this today was I drove all the way to work

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Speaker 1: and my wife text me that my coffee was still

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Speaker 1: on the counter. So my question to you, have you

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Speaker 1: ever pulled a bone head move and got all the

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Speaker 1: way up in your tree or can you provide us

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Speaker 1: with a short story of the time you've gotten all

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Speaker 1: the way up into the tree and then forgot a

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Speaker 1: key piece of equipment. I'm actually having a hard time

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Speaker 1: thinking of getting up in the tree and forgetting a

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Speaker 1: key piece. But when I have that. There was a

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Speaker 1: piece of ground that I'm I'm live in central Wisconsin.

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Speaker 1: There was a piece of ground that I used to

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Speaker 1: manage in u in southwestern Minnesota that was about a

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Speaker 1: just over a two hour drive there, and I thought

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Speaker 1: it was awesome because I could drive there and most

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Speaker 1: people are gonna think I'm nuts, but I could drive there,

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Speaker 1: hunt the afternoon and drive back home and sleep at

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Speaker 1: home and get up with the kids next morning. It's

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Speaker 1: really disheartening when you make that drive and realize he

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Speaker 1: didn't bring your bowl? Do that is? That? Is? Okay?

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Speaker 1: I only did it once, but wow, did I ever

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Speaker 1: remember that? So what did you do when you got

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Speaker 1: there and realized I don't have my bow? I turned

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Speaker 1: around and drove home. It was a beautiful It was

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Speaker 1: a beautiful drive. Can imagine. I wasn't upset drive at

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Speaker 1: home at all. It was just I was happy and

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Speaker 1: saying the local rock music station and just a great moved.

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Speaker 1: How about you, Dan, if you pulled a bone head

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Speaker 1: moved before, dude, I pulled a bone head moved every

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Speaker 1: I'm just so excited. I My mind is thinking, Okay,

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Speaker 1: I'm am, I going to see this buck tonight. I

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Speaker 1: gotta keep an eye out for all my you know,

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Speaker 1: I know that the historically there's a rub or a

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Speaker 1: scrape here. I'll probably you know, I gotta avoid even

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Speaker 1: sent in that area. Blah blah blah. And then I

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Speaker 1: get up, I get to the tree, and I'm my

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Speaker 1: mind isn't what I should be doing, but on what

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Speaker 1: events might happen that night? And uh, I've I've left

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Speaker 1: my bow or or my harness back in the truck.

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Speaker 1: I've set up a tree stand in a tree that

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Speaker 1: earlier that summer, I trimmed it out. I got all

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Speaker 1: the way up into the tree, and I'm like, man,

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Speaker 1: it doesn't look like I trimmed out this at all.

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Speaker 1: And and I look over to a tree to the

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Speaker 1: next to me, and there's my bow hooks from from

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Speaker 1: the summer where it was one tree over where I

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Speaker 1: trimmed that tree out, and I stood up on the

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Speaker 1: other one. If you want to talk bowing head moves

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Speaker 1: like that, I mean, man, I can talk. I mean

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Speaker 1: the bucket I'll spare is the entire story. Because I

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Speaker 1: tried to write it a couple of days after I

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Speaker 1: was done. It came in over seven thousand words. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: put it in perspective, long articles. Um, but here you

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Speaker 1: got Mr how to expert, and oh man, I got

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Speaker 1: this figured out. There's this food plug A picture after

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Speaker 1: picture of the six and a half year old buck

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Speaker 1: that I've tracked since he was three and a half.

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Speaker 1: And man, he's killable. I'm going there and I'm gonna

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Speaker 1: kill him. But I'm so smart. I'm gonna walk down

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Speaker 1: the creek because from the creek they won't be able

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Speaker 1: to see me in the now Bear ridge If I

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Speaker 1: walk through the food pot will stick oh, like a

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Speaker 1: turn in the punch bowl. And I get about oh

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Speaker 1: thirty yards down that and all of a sudden the

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Speaker 1: water runs out and it's nothing but about two ft

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Speaker 1: deep worth a cottonwood leaves. Wow are they allowed? And

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Speaker 1: every step is just and so I I got to

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Speaker 1: get out of here. Might as well walk through the

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Speaker 1: food pot now, because every dyer up there and knows

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Speaker 1: go the stand. I wanted to hunt and prepped it

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Speaker 1: early in the year. I'd hunted at one time. Climb

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Speaker 1: up in the stand and woa do you ever stick

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Speaker 1: out like a turn in the punch bowl? Now that

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Speaker 1: all these leaves are gone, you aren't gonna be able

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Speaker 1: to And the way I've got a position, I'm not,

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Speaker 1: And I got no one to every stand I ever hunt,

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Speaker 1: I end up scouting and hanging myself. So I got

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Speaker 1: no one to blame but myself here, you know, for

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Speaker 1: if it's before three o'clock, I'm getting down moving to

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Speaker 1: the other stands three thirty forget it, I'm going now

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Speaker 1: go over to the other one. And I mean, just

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Speaker 1: one mishap after another after another after another, and somehow

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Speaker 1: ended up accidentally killing him. Yeah, yeah, I did. I

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Speaker 1: should have killed him three times, but the first two

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Speaker 1: times I messed up. Yeah, I mean just I don't

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Speaker 1: care who you are. If you do this stuff enough,

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Speaker 1: you're gonna make yourself look like a silly school And

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Speaker 1: anybody who says they don't, they either have too much ego,

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Speaker 1: they don't hunt much, or they're just flat. Ohbs, there's

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Speaker 1: a lot of shoot to that, dear. Definitely have a

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Speaker 1: way of making us look stupid. That's the truth. I

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Speaker 1: don't know if I've got a story as good as

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Speaker 1: either one of yours. I Um, I did have a

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Speaker 1: little bit of a bad spell last year at the

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Speaker 1: beginning of last season, and I had a hunt. Um.

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Speaker 1: I went out to new property, got all the way

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Speaker 1: out there, got into my tree stand, and I filmed

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Speaker 1: all my hunts as you know, as Dan, as you know.

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Speaker 1: And I got out there and I had forgotten my

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Speaker 1: camera arm or the fluid head for the camera arm.

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Speaker 1: So I ended up using a bunch of twine to

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Speaker 1: somehow attached the camera arm to the bottom of the

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Speaker 1: arm and then had swinging there just kind of somehow

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Speaker 1: to keep it horizontally level. But it was it was

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Speaker 1: pretty awful and then the next hunt out, this time

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Speaker 1: I didn't forget my camera arm. I forgot my camera

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Speaker 1: and so then I had to I got to my

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Speaker 1: stand before I figured that I had to run. I

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Speaker 1: literally kind of scurried around this cornerge all the way

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Speaker 1: back to my truck, got a camera out of there,

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Speaker 1: got back to the stand. Like fifteen minutes later. I

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Speaker 1: did have a d fifty four five year old buck

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Speaker 1: comes strolling by my way, so that was pretty cool.

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Speaker 1: Um made it back just just in time for him

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Speaker 1: to start moving. But I haven't forgot to buy it,

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Speaker 1: so I'm doing Okay, knock on wood, Yeah, true, knock

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Speaker 1: on the wood. But yeah yeah. So so with our

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Speaker 1: bone head stories out of the way, then let's bring

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Speaker 1: it back to our main topic, which is patterning bucks man.

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Speaker 1: As we allude to earlier. You know, with all of

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Speaker 1: your experience, Steve, with you tracking all these deer and

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Speaker 1: thousands of acres and probably thousands of trail camera pictures,

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Speaker 1: and all the observations and hunts and different pieces of

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Speaker 1: data you've been able to collect, I think you've got

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Speaker 1: some really interesting insight into how you can pattern a

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Speaker 1: mature deer. And so with that said, I was hoping

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Speaker 1: to kick things off if you could please explain to us,

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Speaker 1: in your opinion, what when you say pattern or dear,

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Speaker 1: what do you mean? What does that mean to you?

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Speaker 1: I was really hoping you were going to ask that question, um,

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Speaker 1: And if you hadn't, I would have derailed the conversation

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Speaker 1: and probably giving you the answer anyway in my opinion,

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Speaker 1: my opinion, there's so much I hope you don't mind

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Speaker 1: me being blunt but flat out bologny when it comes

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Speaker 1: to patterning bucks out there that it's beyond ridiculous. Um.

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Speaker 1: When I first started, a huge eye opener for me

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Speaker 1: was when I first started doing the consulting thing. Probably

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Speaker 1: she's twenty five years ago. I did a lot of

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Speaker 1: consulting for outfitters, and here you go ahead and you

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Speaker 1: lay out all this stuff, and then you know, Mr

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Speaker 1: Joe TV Star. And I'm not trying to rip on

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Speaker 1: the TV guys, as I said already, I do something.

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Speaker 1: I don't do a lot of film hunts, but do

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Speaker 1: a lot of TV stuff myself, and they're great guys.

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Speaker 1: But next thing you know, Joe TV Star comes out

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Speaker 1: there and he kills kills a buck out of one

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Speaker 1: of those stands and then you see it on TV.

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Speaker 1: I'm like, Wow, I had no idea he knew so

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Speaker 1: much about that property in that buck that he'd never

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Speaker 1: seen before. And a great way to build cred in

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Speaker 1: this industry is to pretend you did a lot more

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Speaker 1: than you really he did. Now, Um, I liked that.

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Speaker 1: I think most people see through it eventually. But but

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Speaker 1: the Dane. The only reason I'm jumping on the soapbox

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Speaker 1: for a second is the danger to this is your

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Speaker 1: average has believe it. And it's not it's not even

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Speaker 1: so much that they believe it, it's that they start questioning, well,

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Speaker 1: how come I can't do that? There is so much

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Speaker 1: going on out there in the fall, it's not funny.

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Speaker 1: You've got food sources changing very dynamically. You know, you've

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Speaker 1: got food sources that are plummeting. You've got such as

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Speaker 1: you know, you get a handful of frost that will

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Speaker 1: fel ful field no longer is as good. Or you

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Speaker 1: talk about the north Woods the aspen leaves fall. You

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Speaker 1: know those aspen leaves are a huge food source before

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Speaker 1: they drop. Um, you've got all these food sources going under,

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Speaker 1: and you've got acorns masked hired ends, soft um corn,

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Speaker 1: soybeans there, they went through that drying period. Now they're

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Speaker 1: now they're edible again. And so you've got the food

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Speaker 1: sources changing. And then you look at the red cycle. Now,

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Speaker 1: so much is changing through each red cycle. Of the

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Speaker 1: idea of getting on that buck and knowing what he's

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Speaker 1: doing throughout the entire season. If you can do that

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Speaker 1: outside of a pen, and you're doing a lot better

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Speaker 1: than I can now. Um And at the same time,

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Speaker 1: even when those quote unquote patterns are pretty stable, most

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Speaker 1: bucks don't have just one betting area. Most bucks don't

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Speaker 1: have just one food source now, so there's no guarantee

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Speaker 1: that you're going to end up being able to he's

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Speaker 1: betting here, he's traveling through there, he's feeding there. To me,

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Speaker 1: patterning a white tail is nothing more than knowing one

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Speaker 1: thing he can to do during legal shooting light. If

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Speaker 1: you know that one thing, all of a sudden, now

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Speaker 1: you've got a chance to kill him. But oftentimes, oftentimes

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Speaker 1: I don't know exactly where he's betting. I've got a

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Speaker 1: pretty good idea he's betting in this area over here,

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Speaker 1: but where exactly he's betting there, I couldn't tell you,

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Speaker 1: and to get that level of intel, you'd have to

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Speaker 1: be so incredibly intrusive that he's not going to keep

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Speaker 1: those patterns anyway, because he does. Booted him out of

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Speaker 1: there now. So what I look for is enough more

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Speaker 1: than that one thing he does someone consistently during daylight,

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Speaker 1: and then I try to put the rest together. I

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Speaker 1: try to put it together because if I can figure

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Speaker 1: out where he's betting, if he's not where, here's where

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Speaker 1: it comes in real hand. He's hitting this food source.

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Speaker 1: He's hitting this food source on average half hour hour

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Speaker 1: after dark. If I can figure out where he's coming from,

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Speaker 1: I should be able to find a spot between his

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Speaker 1: betting area and that food source that I can go

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Speaker 1: ahead and set up on him. But for the love

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Speaker 1: of Pepperoni pizza, when you find that one kink in

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Speaker 1: his armor, jump on it. Jump on it now. Because

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Speaker 1: patterns are not stable throats the entire season, food sources

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Speaker 1: are going to change on you. The ret cycle is

335
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Speaker 1: going to have it all of a sudden, that alfalfa

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Speaker 1: field or that clear cut regrowth isn't anywhere near is

337
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Speaker 1: interesting to him. Wants to do start coming in destros.

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Speaker 1: You know, at that point his priority, then his doze.

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Speaker 1: Before that, right before that, you've got scrapes. I want

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Speaker 1: to communicate scrapes and knocking out that position he's in

341
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Speaker 1: the buck hierarchy is very important to him, and that's

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Speaker 1: going to be one of his top priorities, and that's

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Speaker 1: gonna sub his if he ever even had a clockwork

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Speaker 1: feeding patterns. So I think one of the most important

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Speaker 1: things to realize is, no, you're not going to figure

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Speaker 1: out everything that buck does. Seven too. Once you figure

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Speaker 1: out a kink in his armor, jump on it, because

348
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Speaker 1: you don't know how long that's gonna last. Now, the

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Speaker 1: one other thing I would say about patterning deer right

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Speaker 1: off the top is gauge the amount of pressure the

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Speaker 1: area receives. That can be huge on the surfaces. May

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Speaker 1: seem like a bit of an oxymoron, but I spend

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Speaker 1: about of each season hunting public ground, and another is

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Speaker 1: hunting just what I consider normal ground, small fims that

355
00:20:55,720 --> 00:21:02,240
Speaker 1: numerous people have access to. The other hunt UTOPI Yeah,

356
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Speaker 1: but the heavier the pressure in general, the more reliable

357
00:21:08,160 --> 00:21:12,600
Speaker 1: those patterns are because that buck has actually found that

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Speaker 1: spot within that heavy pressure area where he feels safe

359
00:21:15,800 --> 00:21:21,040
Speaker 1: during daylight. He doesn't want to leave it. So he

360
00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:24,920
Speaker 1: is actually more of the exception to the rule when

361
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Speaker 1: it comes to patterning deer that he tends to be

362
00:21:28,080 --> 00:21:32,520
Speaker 1: much more consistent if you find that in to me,

363
00:21:32,640 --> 00:21:35,040
Speaker 1: the secret to getting off on a tangent, the secret

364
00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:39,320
Speaker 1: to hunting heavily pressured, dear public land, dear, is find

365
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Speaker 1: those pockets where no one else are going. And they

366
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Speaker 1: almost aught Why I shouldn't say that, in a surprisingly

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Speaker 1: high percent of land they exist. It's the other side

368
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Speaker 1: of that swamp. So I gotta slap on some hip boots.

369
00:21:55,160 --> 00:22:00,480
Speaker 1: It's that deep, nasty gorge that nobody wants to cross.

370
00:22:01,200 --> 00:22:04,720
Speaker 1: And you get up in northern Wisconsin or northern Minnesota,

371
00:22:04,960 --> 00:22:08,280
Speaker 1: up in Michigan, it's going that extra mile back in.

372
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Speaker 1: But or the other scenario, the buck I killed Wisconsin

373
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Speaker 1: just two years ago. Um, just some little tiny pocket

374
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Speaker 1: of cover right next to the road while everybody else

375
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Speaker 1: is heading to the bigger woods. But that's how, in

376
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Speaker 1: my opinion, dear s, the bucks survived to become mature

377
00:22:28,720 --> 00:22:32,320
Speaker 1: in those settings. They find those spots where other people

378
00:22:32,359 --> 00:22:36,040
Speaker 1: aren't going. When they find them, they relate, my experience

379
00:22:36,080 --> 00:22:40,200
Speaker 1: has when they relate very heavily to that location getting

380
00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:43,840
Speaker 1: them to leave there, but their own free will doesn't

381
00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:48,240
Speaker 1: happen often during daylight. Because of that, their patterns tend

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Speaker 1: to be much more consistent. The sort of almost answered

383
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Speaker 1: your question. I think somewhere and all that all right,

384
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Speaker 1: So to a lab right on what you've just said

385
00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:06,040
Speaker 1: about you know, anything within killable daylight, you know, whether

386
00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:10,760
Speaker 1: it's a trail camera picture or um. You know you've

387
00:23:10,760 --> 00:23:15,400
Speaker 1: seen him from a different tree stand. If you're let's

388
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Speaker 1: say you have a trail camera picture, uh, and it's

389
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Speaker 1: two hours after dark, but he's consistently at that spot

390
00:23:21,119 --> 00:23:25,439
Speaker 1: two hours after dark? What are you doing any type

391
00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:30,480
Speaker 1: of um, you know, like hypothesizing of where he's coming from,

392
00:23:30,520 --> 00:23:34,560
Speaker 1: where he's going and adjusting your hunting towards that, or

393
00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:37,320
Speaker 1: you just kind of staying away from that area until

394
00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:40,679
Speaker 1: there is daylight activity. It depends on what I believe

395
00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:44,520
Speaker 1: the scenario is. UM, take a take a bucket that

396
00:23:44,560 --> 00:23:48,399
Speaker 1: I killed, lass of another. It's just a small average

397
00:23:49,119 --> 00:23:53,520
Speaker 1: a property here in Wisconsin last year. You're describing to

398
00:23:53,560 --> 00:23:58,480
Speaker 1: a t what I had. It's surrounded completely by meat hunters.

399
00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:01,320
Speaker 1: God love him, there's nothing wrong with that. And public

400
00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:08,280
Speaker 1: land Okay, I believed that he was betting. I believed

401
00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:11,160
Speaker 1: I knew that he was betting on this point. That

402
00:24:11,359 --> 00:24:14,479
Speaker 1: was heck, only about a hundred yards away from this

403
00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:18,520
Speaker 1: little food plot I had. Because so yes, I do,

404
00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:21,960
Speaker 1: I do. Go ahead and hypothesize on where do I

405
00:24:22,000 --> 00:24:26,040
Speaker 1: believe he's coming from? Okay, if if I don't think,

406
00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:30,760
Speaker 1: I know, A really cool little trick is to try

407
00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:34,040
Speaker 1: to get his track. So let's let's say you get

408
00:24:34,160 --> 00:24:37,440
Speaker 1: a real good example. Let's say you get his track

409
00:24:37,520 --> 00:24:42,360
Speaker 1: on the edge of a corn, soybean or fresh clear cut. Hey,

410
00:24:42,359 --> 00:24:44,600
Speaker 1: when you got his camp, when you've got your scouting

411
00:24:44,640 --> 00:24:48,680
Speaker 1: camera out there, you measure that track, you measure its length.

412
00:24:48,720 --> 00:24:52,680
Speaker 1: It's with you get his fingerprint. Now, granted, all four

413
00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:56,200
Speaker 1: hooves aren't going to be identical, but they're gonna be

414
00:24:56,280 --> 00:24:59,719
Speaker 1: close enough that you've got a pretty darn good idea. Okay,

415
00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:03,639
Speaker 1: So now I know he's feeding in the soybean, corn

416
00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:07,760
Speaker 1: or clear cut. I don't know where he's coming from

417
00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:11,520
Speaker 1: though from the trail camera picture. Let's say I have

418
00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:14,800
Speaker 1: got him for one thing. You seeing a mature buck

419
00:25:14,840 --> 00:25:17,840
Speaker 1: do something once is not a pattern. I need to

420
00:25:17,880 --> 00:25:22,080
Speaker 1: see it at least twice. Okay, um, but okay, I've

421
00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:24,560
Speaker 1: got this picture here a couple of times I know

422
00:25:24,680 --> 00:25:28,280
Speaker 1: he's feeding here. Where's it coming from? Well, okay, he's

423
00:25:28,280 --> 00:25:33,000
Speaker 1: getting here an hour after dark. He's approaching each time

424
00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:37,080
Speaker 1: from the right. That means he's coming somewhere from over

425
00:25:37,080 --> 00:25:40,400
Speaker 1: in that direction. Well, I'm going to go out there

426
00:25:40,840 --> 00:25:42,720
Speaker 1: if I can't, if I don't have a pretty good

427
00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:45,440
Speaker 1: idea already where he's coming from, I'll go out there

428
00:25:45,480 --> 00:25:50,800
Speaker 1: midday or rubber boots treated clothing with a garden rake,

429
00:25:52,400 --> 00:25:56,160
Speaker 1: and every one of those trails are entering that clear

430
00:25:56,200 --> 00:26:00,200
Speaker 1: cut or bean field or whatever. I'm gonna go ahead

431
00:26:00,240 --> 00:26:03,639
Speaker 1: and rake about the three foot section of dirt, and

432
00:26:03,680 --> 00:26:06,040
Speaker 1: I will as long as as long as it's not

433
00:26:06,200 --> 00:26:09,200
Speaker 1: too far back in. I'm going to go to where

434
00:26:09,200 --> 00:26:13,479
Speaker 1: those trails split, and I'll rake one on each of

435
00:26:13,480 --> 00:26:16,720
Speaker 1: those as well, right up from the split. Now, you

436
00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:19,879
Speaker 1: go ahead and you give it anywhere from a couple

437
00:26:19,880 --> 00:26:21,480
Speaker 1: of days to a week. You come back with a

438
00:26:21,560 --> 00:26:23,760
Speaker 1: stand on your back, and you let you let what

439
00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:25,920
Speaker 1: I call track catchers tell you where he's coming from,

440
00:26:25,920 --> 00:26:28,840
Speaker 1: and set up and hunt right there on the spot. Steve,

441
00:26:28,880 --> 00:26:30,560
Speaker 1: is that something that you can pull off? Even on

442
00:26:30,640 --> 00:26:33,520
Speaker 1: heavily pressured land. Um, you know, going in there a

443
00:26:33,560 --> 00:26:36,240
Speaker 1: time or two extra to put down that track catcher

444
00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:38,960
Speaker 1: or is that something that you're typically seeing working better

445
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:42,680
Speaker 1: in the lower pressure situations heavily pressured land. I am

446
00:26:42,760 --> 00:26:46,280
Speaker 1: all about doing absolutely nothing to draw any attention to

447
00:26:46,320 --> 00:26:49,480
Speaker 1: me whatsoever. If I can find that pocket, I got

448
00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:54,359
Speaker 1: a good chance to killing that deer. Um. Because in

449
00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:58,000
Speaker 1: most settings, most setting, some areas, as I said, you

450
00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:02,159
Speaker 1: talked in northern west of some bigwood settings, that'd be

451
00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:05,320
Speaker 1: more than happy to try that now. But in more

452
00:27:05,440 --> 00:27:13,600
Speaker 1: your normal, more your normal normal hunting public land situations,

453
00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:16,680
Speaker 1: I've really rather not because they don't have the habitat

454
00:27:16,760 --> 00:27:22,959
Speaker 1: out there. But now again it depends, Um, I love it.

455
00:27:23,520 --> 00:27:28,000
Speaker 1: I hope there's a ton of big buck sign outside

456
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:32,840
Speaker 1: of that little pocket that he's living in, because those

457
00:27:32,880 --> 00:27:37,199
Speaker 1: are the areas everybody else's hunting. And every time he

458
00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:40,399
Speaker 1: decides to make a scrape, freshen up that scrape or

459
00:27:40,440 --> 00:27:43,520
Speaker 1: make another rub at four o'clock in the morning, that's

460
00:27:43,560 --> 00:27:47,200
Speaker 1: awesome because the guys who are hunting, they're they're reinvigorated.

461
00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:48,800
Speaker 1: Today is going to be the day I'm going to

462
00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:53,560
Speaker 1: see him. Now, if I can't find that pocket that

463
00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:56,560
Speaker 1: he's living in in those situations, that wouldn't hesitate to

464
00:27:56,560 --> 00:27:59,960
Speaker 1: do that. But once I find that pocket that he's

465
00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:03,600
Speaker 1: that's undisturbed, you know it's either, as I said, either

466
00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:07,439
Speaker 1: so thick and nasty or a massive, massive pain to

467
00:28:07,480 --> 00:28:10,520
Speaker 1: get too. At that point, I in my mind, I

468
00:28:10,600 --> 00:28:14,080
Speaker 1: got what I need. I know he's in this pocket.

469
00:28:14,119 --> 00:28:17,120
Speaker 1: They're generally not huge, it's I mean, if I had

470
00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:19,679
Speaker 1: it's impossible to come up with an average on this.

471
00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:22,679
Speaker 1: But if I had to say, I'd say they're an

472
00:28:22,800 --> 00:28:24,760
Speaker 1: average of I mean, if you can find a fifty

473
00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:30,040
Speaker 1: acre pocket that's undisturbed, you're doing good. Now, Um, usually

474
00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:32,240
Speaker 1: it's far less than that. I mean, it's well, the

475
00:28:32,840 --> 00:28:36,040
Speaker 1: one that I killed, the one out of that when

476
00:28:36,040 --> 00:28:37,720
Speaker 1: I was telling you it was just a little pocket

477
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:39,680
Speaker 1: right next to the road, I mean, heck, that was

478
00:28:39,720 --> 00:28:43,720
Speaker 1: two acres aground. Now you're not gonna be able to

479
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:47,920
Speaker 1: get away with something like that there. Obviously I'm talking more.

480
00:28:48,920 --> 00:28:52,400
Speaker 1: I used this technique more on the moderate to low

481
00:28:52,480 --> 00:28:59,440
Speaker 1: pressure situation, So taking taking a step back as I

482
00:28:59,480 --> 00:29:02,000
Speaker 1: sit and correct me. If if there's something additional, we'd

483
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:04,360
Speaker 1: add to this. But as I understand it, and as

484
00:29:04,440 --> 00:29:07,080
Speaker 1: I've seen it seems to be that there's three major

485
00:29:07,160 --> 00:29:09,720
Speaker 1: tools you can use to help develop some kind of

486
00:29:09,760 --> 00:29:13,960
Speaker 1: pattern our deer. That being, you know, actual observation data,

487
00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:15,960
Speaker 1: whether that be from the stand or scouting from a

488
00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:20,320
Speaker 1: distance or something trail cameras or on the ground sign

489
00:29:20,400 --> 00:29:23,440
Speaker 1: like you mentioned, tracks, scrapes, rubs, et cetera. So a

490
00:29:23,520 --> 00:29:26,000
Speaker 1: question for you is, first, is there any other tool

491
00:29:26,640 --> 00:29:29,000
Speaker 1: or a factor that you're using to pattern deer? I

492
00:29:29,040 --> 00:29:31,160
Speaker 1: guess that's that's my first question. Is there anything else?

493
00:29:32,120 --> 00:29:35,200
Speaker 1: In a weird way, I'm going to say yes, And

494
00:29:35,280 --> 00:29:38,440
Speaker 1: that is one of the things that really really really

495
00:29:38,480 --> 00:29:41,520
Speaker 1: helped me is and I still do it to this day,

496
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:43,480
Speaker 1: and I'm still learning to this day. I mean, if

497
00:29:43,520 --> 00:29:44,920
Speaker 1: it ever gets to the point where I think I

498
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:47,080
Speaker 1: know it all, I hope somebody slaps me because I'm

499
00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:53,040
Speaker 1: I've gotten stupid. Um is during the off season, when

500
00:29:53,080 --> 00:29:56,080
Speaker 1: I find that box bed, I go ahead and I

501
00:29:56,680 --> 00:29:58,920
Speaker 1: hunker down, and I don't wait down. When I squat

502
00:29:58,960 --> 00:30:02,000
Speaker 1: down and look around, why is that buck betting in

503
00:30:02,040 --> 00:30:07,960
Speaker 1: this one location here? Now? What makes this spot one

504
00:30:07,960 --> 00:30:10,360
Speaker 1: of the spots where he feels safe enough to lay

505
00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:13,880
Speaker 1: down on and you do that enough and you start

506
00:30:13,880 --> 00:30:17,480
Speaker 1: getting the field, you start getting it doesn't take long

507
00:30:17,640 --> 00:30:20,120
Speaker 1: for you to learn that, oh, geez, bucks really like

508
00:30:20,280 --> 00:30:23,719
Speaker 1: betting on knobs off her ridges, and you know, just

509
00:30:23,880 --> 00:30:27,960
Speaker 1: on what's called around the military crest of a ridge

510
00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:32,480
Speaker 1: where it really starts dropping off hard. Now, if you're

511
00:30:32,480 --> 00:30:36,400
Speaker 1: looking at any type of wet lands, if there's any

512
00:30:36,480 --> 00:30:39,800
Speaker 1: type of a peninsula dry land that goes into that swamp,

513
00:30:41,280 --> 00:30:43,360
Speaker 1: real good chance he's betting on the end of that.

514
00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:48,000
Speaker 1: If there's islands out in that swamp, real good chance

515
00:30:48,080 --> 00:30:51,880
Speaker 1: he's been there. Okay, So you're dealing with a flat,

516
00:30:52,480 --> 00:30:56,720
Speaker 1: big wood setting and you don't have an area without

517
00:30:56,920 --> 00:31:01,600
Speaker 1: squat for swamps and doesn't have any training. Where was that?

518
00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:04,440
Speaker 1: Where's that five six seven year old clear cut that's

519
00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:08,520
Speaker 1: growing up all thick and nasty as chances that are

520
00:31:08,560 --> 00:31:11,440
Speaker 1: in that setting, he's better than the nastiest stuff, thickest

521
00:31:11,440 --> 00:31:14,280
Speaker 1: stuff you can find. So so part of it is

522
00:31:14,360 --> 00:31:17,800
Speaker 1: just always and I mentioned we did that other interview

523
00:31:17,880 --> 00:31:20,120
Speaker 1: the other day and I mentioned this, and they're always

524
00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:24,520
Speaker 1: ask why don't be content with this finding deer sign?

525
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:29,560
Speaker 1: Ask why they made it there? What's the motivation, what's

526
00:31:29,560 --> 00:31:32,000
Speaker 1: the odds of it happening again, Where is he coming from?

527
00:31:32,000 --> 00:31:35,080
Speaker 1: Where is he going to? The more of that stuff

528
00:31:35,120 --> 00:31:39,200
Speaker 1: you generate over the year, you almost build up database

529
00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:43,520
Speaker 1: of experiences that you can then start to apply to

530
00:31:43,640 --> 00:31:47,760
Speaker 1: other locations. But so part of it's just intuitive. You

531
00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:50,800
Speaker 1: get a feel for it after. The more you do anything,

532
00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:53,480
Speaker 1: the better of a feel you get for it. Um

533
00:31:53,680 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 1: and the rest those I'll tell you what. Trail cameras

534
00:31:56,800 --> 00:32:01,760
Speaker 1: are tough to be. Trail cameras and observations. Yeah, dear sign.

535
00:32:02,160 --> 00:32:06,840
Speaker 1: Dear sign helps a lot too, especially deer tracks. Those

536
00:32:07,360 --> 00:32:12,280
Speaker 1: those track catchers are beautiful. I use them a lot.

537
00:32:12,880 --> 00:32:16,520
Speaker 1: They are a great tool. Perhaps the most ignored bit

538
00:32:16,560 --> 00:32:18,800
Speaker 1: of sign left out in the woods are deer tracks.

539
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:23,120
Speaker 1: And now they'll tell you, especially in snow, they'll tell

540
00:32:23,120 --> 00:32:25,760
Speaker 1: you exactly where you're he was coming from and exactly

541
00:32:25,760 --> 00:32:29,280
Speaker 1: where he's going to. I think you're right to That's

542
00:32:29,320 --> 00:32:32,080
Speaker 1: something that doesn't get a whole lot of play in

543
00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:34,040
Speaker 1: the media or when people are talking about you know,

544
00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:36,280
Speaker 1: how to understand dear The tracks are kind of one

545
00:32:36,320 --> 00:32:39,480
Speaker 1: of those underlooked pieces of the puzzle. UM, And I

546
00:32:39,480 --> 00:32:41,280
Speaker 1: want to dive a little deeper into that, and some

547
00:32:41,320 --> 00:32:43,560
Speaker 1: of the other thoughts on signed. But first I want

548
00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:45,440
Speaker 1: to focus on what you just said before that, and

549
00:32:45,480 --> 00:32:48,520
Speaker 1: that being the power of trail cameras. Can you give

550
00:32:48,600 --> 00:32:51,440
Speaker 1: us some some real meatia detail on how you're specifically

551
00:32:51,520 --> 00:32:54,240
Speaker 1: using trail cameras to try to figure out these specific

552
00:32:54,280 --> 00:32:56,680
Speaker 1: deer weather it be for your clients or for yourself.

553
00:32:56,880 --> 00:32:59,080
Speaker 1: You know, where are you putting those cameras at certain

554
00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:02,000
Speaker 1: times of the year, often checking them? What are your

555
00:33:02,040 --> 00:33:06,320
Speaker 1: real goals there that? Well, my for clients, my goals

556
00:33:06,360 --> 00:33:09,720
Speaker 1: are twofold. I need an inventory of what they got

557
00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:13,080
Speaker 1: out there, and I need to hopefully get enough information

558
00:33:13,320 --> 00:33:15,760
Speaker 1: and I'm not saying I pull this off every time,

559
00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:18,960
Speaker 1: but hopefully enough information that if they want to kill

560
00:33:19,040 --> 00:33:23,160
Speaker 1: that deer, I can at least put them in the ballpark. Okay.

561
00:33:23,320 --> 00:33:25,600
Speaker 1: That okay? That the stand that I've got up over

562
00:33:25,680 --> 00:33:30,720
Speaker 1: here with this wind under these conditions, that's that's from

563
00:33:30,720 --> 00:33:34,080
Speaker 1: what I can gather your highest odds location. And I

564
00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:35,720
Speaker 1: Am going to go off on a little bit of

565
00:33:35,720 --> 00:33:39,840
Speaker 1: a tangent here for a second, and that is everything's

566
00:33:39,920 --> 00:33:44,360
Speaker 1: tendencies there this plane. Are not these cut and dried

567
00:33:44,480 --> 00:33:49,120
Speaker 1: rules of dear behavior, if they exist, I don't know

568
00:33:49,200 --> 00:33:52,200
Speaker 1: what they are. Now. The best we can hope for

569
00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:57,880
Speaker 1: is he tends to do this under these circumstances. But

570
00:33:58,160 --> 00:34:03,160
Speaker 1: by definition attended, he means there's plenty of times he doesn't. Frankly,

571
00:34:03,200 --> 00:34:04,840
Speaker 1: I think that's part of the fun. If they did

572
00:34:04,880 --> 00:34:08,880
Speaker 1: everything that we believe they're supposed to under each condition,

573
00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:14,040
Speaker 1: well what's the thrill um. But so the big The

574
00:34:14,080 --> 00:34:17,520
Speaker 1: two biggest things I'm using trail cameras for are an inventory.

575
00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:20,880
Speaker 1: I need to know what's out there, and then to

576
00:34:20,960 --> 00:34:23,360
Speaker 1: try to zero in a little bit more on where

577
00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:29,360
Speaker 1: he is. My first golden rule, and this was I

578
00:34:29,360 --> 00:34:32,319
Speaker 1: I've been using trail isn't gonna date me here, but

579
00:34:32,400 --> 00:34:35,600
Speaker 1: I've been using trail cameras all the way since since

580
00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:40,560
Speaker 1: when Trailmaster first came out. I don't blame you guys

581
00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:42,400
Speaker 1: if you have no clue what I'm talking about. But

582
00:34:42,480 --> 00:34:45,920
Speaker 1: it was a transmitter and a receiver and a camera.

583
00:34:46,960 --> 00:34:50,640
Speaker 1: You know, you actually had three different units that you

584
00:34:50,719 --> 00:34:53,320
Speaker 1: had to set up in order to be able to

585
00:34:53,360 --> 00:34:57,320
Speaker 1: get a picture of a gear. I learned the hard

586
00:34:57,360 --> 00:35:00,200
Speaker 1: way that your number one golden rule when it comes

587
00:35:00,239 --> 00:35:03,920
Speaker 1: to trail cameras is do no harm These things are

588
00:35:03,960 --> 00:35:11,200
Speaker 1: supposed to help you, so I I can't say I

589
00:35:11,360 --> 00:35:15,640
Speaker 1: never do, but the overwhelming majority of the cameras that

590
00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:21,399
Speaker 1: I use are in very low impact locations. Frankly, when

591
00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:24,520
Speaker 1: it comes to the public land hunting, I almost never

592
00:35:24,560 --> 00:35:29,279
Speaker 1: put a trail camera out there now. Almost never is

593
00:35:29,360 --> 00:35:35,080
Speaker 1: mainly by default because I don't want any more disturbance

594
00:35:35,440 --> 00:35:40,080
Speaker 1: than I can I want. I need to minimize my

595
00:35:40,200 --> 00:35:44,400
Speaker 1: disturbances to the maximum, if that makes any sense. And

596
00:35:44,480 --> 00:35:48,359
Speaker 1: going out there to check trail cameras, first you got

597
00:35:48,400 --> 00:35:51,080
Speaker 1: the risk of them getting stolen, obviously on public ground,

598
00:35:51,400 --> 00:35:55,120
Speaker 1: and then other even more importantly, you know I'm making

599
00:35:55,120 --> 00:35:57,960
Speaker 1: a disturbance every single time I go out there, especially

600
00:35:57,960 --> 00:35:59,440
Speaker 1: if I'm going to get to a spot where I

601
00:35:59,440 --> 00:36:02,960
Speaker 1: believe he gonna be He's going to be active, so

602
00:36:03,080 --> 00:36:06,600
Speaker 1: on that ground, it's all signed. It's all trying to

603
00:36:06,640 --> 00:36:09,400
Speaker 1: find that location no one else will going to, and

604
00:36:09,400 --> 00:36:12,439
Speaker 1: then look for some big tracks or big rubs or

605
00:36:12,480 --> 00:36:15,719
Speaker 1: even small rubs that are just the trees just trashed.

606
00:36:17,239 --> 00:36:19,160
Speaker 1: I know I'm dealing with a mature buck here on

607
00:36:19,239 --> 00:36:24,279
Speaker 1: public lands. My my goal is a three and a

608
00:36:24,320 --> 00:36:26,399
Speaker 1: half are better. I don't even care what that three

609
00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:29,400
Speaker 1: and a half year old looks like if it's a

610
00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:31,359
Speaker 1: hundred inch three and a half year old, I'm going

611
00:36:31,400 --> 00:36:33,160
Speaker 1: to kill him. And I'm gonna be proud of heck,

612
00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:36,960
Speaker 1: because he was. He was tougher than that hundred and

613
00:36:36,960 --> 00:36:39,839
Speaker 1: sixty And sure I killed on that two thousand acre

614
00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:42,680
Speaker 1: piece of ground that had ten that only had ten

615
00:36:42,800 --> 00:36:45,840
Speaker 1: hundreds the entire year and has been managed for five years.

616
00:36:47,000 --> 00:36:51,520
Speaker 1: No um. But so I'm not using trail cameras in

617
00:36:51,560 --> 00:36:56,480
Speaker 1: those situations on the average to low pressure ground. I

618
00:36:56,520 --> 00:36:59,800
Speaker 1: am using them. And my number one rule is low impact.

619
00:37:00,440 --> 00:37:04,000
Speaker 1: Not Now. Everybody talks about the cool low impact is

620
00:37:04,040 --> 00:37:07,880
Speaker 1: the cool term these days, but a few people actually

621
00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:10,840
Speaker 1: ever go into any detail on what low impact is.

622
00:37:11,920 --> 00:37:14,040
Speaker 1: They can't see you, they can't smell you, they can't

623
00:37:14,040 --> 00:37:18,480
Speaker 1: hear you. If I can consistently get in out without

624
00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:22,759
Speaker 1: one of those three things happening, it's a low impact location,

625
00:37:23,480 --> 00:37:27,240
Speaker 1: and that every bit is important getting in and out

626
00:37:27,920 --> 00:37:32,839
Speaker 1: without them seeing, smelling, or hearing me. Okay, So right

627
00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:35,200
Speaker 1: off the top, I'm not going to say I never

628
00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:40,280
Speaker 1: do any higher impact locations, because quite honestly, I do. UM,

629
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:48,839
Speaker 1: but it's for professional reasons. If I'm for hunting, it's

630
00:37:48,840 --> 00:37:51,320
Speaker 1: going to be someplace I can get in. And a

631
00:37:51,960 --> 00:37:55,759
Speaker 1: really cool little trick that I've been using lately is

632
00:37:57,200 --> 00:38:01,560
Speaker 1: picture a picture about a five acre inlet going into

633
00:38:01,560 --> 00:38:04,200
Speaker 1: the woods. Now, you've got a big field out here,

634
00:38:04,560 --> 00:38:07,400
Speaker 1: and here's this, here's this little inlet. A field that

635
00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:11,120
Speaker 1: goes in sucks up into the woods a while. Well,

636
00:38:11,600 --> 00:38:14,800
Speaker 1: go ahead and put that back half acre so into clover,

637
00:38:16,239 --> 00:38:19,600
Speaker 1: and then put the rest of that inlet into corn.

638
00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:23,840
Speaker 1: Then have soybeans out on the main field. Now, obviously

639
00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:27,040
Speaker 1: these aren't all my crops. I've just worked with the

640
00:38:27,080 --> 00:38:31,080
Speaker 1: farmer to have this set up. Okay, Then go ahead

641
00:38:31,080 --> 00:38:34,560
Speaker 1: and make a little a TV trail Now going from

642
00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 1: the soybeans back to the clover. You're gonna catch every

643
00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:44,080
Speaker 1: single dear that's going between the clover and the soybeans

644
00:38:44,120 --> 00:38:46,640
Speaker 1: on that trail, and you can set that camera right

645
00:38:46,680 --> 00:38:49,839
Speaker 1: out on the main field. Now, granted, you're not gonna

646
00:38:49,840 --> 00:38:52,480
Speaker 1: be getting you're not gonna be getting those buck pictures

647
00:38:52,520 --> 00:38:56,040
Speaker 1: most off until after dark. But you know what, they're

648
00:38:56,080 --> 00:38:59,040
Speaker 1: wasting time back in that little inlet back there, and

649
00:38:59,120 --> 00:39:02,560
Speaker 1: you have natural greening, and they feel safe as as

650
00:39:02,640 --> 00:39:06,240
Speaker 1: if they're in the middle of the woods. But that's

651
00:39:06,320 --> 00:39:09,600
Speaker 1: a great little trick that when I have that level

652
00:39:09,640 --> 00:39:14,560
Speaker 1: of control, I use a lot corn is a corn

653
00:39:15,040 --> 00:39:17,920
Speaker 1: trail through the corn or actually when Disney's along the

654
00:39:18,000 --> 00:39:20,960
Speaker 1: edge of the woods, where you take down about one

655
00:39:21,080 --> 00:39:26,120
Speaker 1: row of corn, um really really so dear to use

656
00:39:26,200 --> 00:39:29,279
Speaker 1: that like crazy um. But what I'm doing is I'm

657
00:39:29,320 --> 00:39:32,440
Speaker 1: setting them up. What I view is all my high odds,

658
00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:38,080
Speaker 1: low impact locations. Another great trick for for relatively young

659
00:39:38,239 --> 00:39:43,759
Speaker 1: clear cuts, meadows or or fields that are too big

660
00:39:43,800 --> 00:39:47,239
Speaker 1: to cover, or you don't have that great spot to

661
00:39:47,360 --> 00:39:50,800
Speaker 1: set up a cam set up on last year's scrapes.

662
00:39:51,800 --> 00:39:55,520
Speaker 1: I'm talking this time of year, I get a ton

663
00:39:55,920 --> 00:39:59,680
Speaker 1: of pictures of I mean, nothing like you, nothing like

664
00:39:59,760 --> 00:40:03,919
Speaker 1: you that last week of October. But I get a

665
00:40:03,960 --> 00:40:07,960
Speaker 1: ton of velvet pictures every year. A buck's working scrapes.

666
00:40:08,640 --> 00:40:11,640
Speaker 1: What you're looking for, you're looking you're looking for that

667
00:40:11,760 --> 00:40:14,880
Speaker 1: licking branch that serves as a communication hub year round,

668
00:40:15,280 --> 00:40:18,719
Speaker 1: which tends tends to be one of the one or

669
00:40:19,120 --> 00:40:22,080
Speaker 1: several of the most heavily used scrapes in the area.

670
00:40:22,520 --> 00:40:24,799
Speaker 1: When when you don't have that, what I'll do is

671
00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:27,920
Speaker 1: I'll go ahead, and I'll go ahead and I really

672
00:40:27,960 --> 00:40:30,799
Speaker 1: like to use young oaks for this because they will

673
00:40:30,880 --> 00:40:33,560
Speaker 1: ask me for four years. But go ahead and cut

674
00:40:33,560 --> 00:40:37,080
Speaker 1: a tree down boat with a diameter anywhere from a

675
00:40:37,200 --> 00:40:41,920
Speaker 1: soda to a coffee can diameter that I'm gonna go

676
00:40:41,920 --> 00:40:45,560
Speaker 1: ahead and plant twenty yards out into that opening right

677
00:40:45,600 --> 00:40:47,960
Speaker 1: in front of my camera, which happens to be right

678
00:40:47,960 --> 00:40:52,720
Speaker 1: in front of my stand. That brings in the Sorry, Steve,

679
00:40:53,120 --> 00:40:55,439
Speaker 1: one quick, one quick foul question what you're saying there?

680
00:40:56,120 --> 00:41:00,080
Speaker 1: You mentioned putting these fake scrape trees in front of

681
00:41:00,160 --> 00:41:02,959
Speaker 1: your camera which is in front of your stand. And

682
00:41:03,200 --> 00:41:05,160
Speaker 1: my question to you, and this is something I'm always

683
00:41:05,360 --> 00:41:08,920
Speaker 1: um questioning when I'm outsetting my cameras and whatnot, is

684
00:41:08,960 --> 00:41:12,160
Speaker 1: how the presence of a camera, even if you're not

685
00:41:12,200 --> 00:41:14,040
Speaker 1: going and checking at all the time, but just purely

686
00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:17,480
Speaker 1: the presence of that camera might affect dear and possibly

687
00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:19,879
Speaker 1: spook them. Are you concerned at all about spooking dear

688
00:41:20,000 --> 00:41:22,000
Speaker 1: just with the pure presence of a camera there and

689
00:41:22,080 --> 00:41:24,759
Speaker 1: the flash or the infrared glow or anything like that.

690
00:41:25,360 --> 00:41:30,879
Speaker 1: It depends one on what kind of camera I'm using. Now,

691
00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:33,880
Speaker 1: that's where it's really nice to be spoiled and average

692
00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:39,960
Speaker 1: clients because I mean on on those hyper Fire or

693
00:41:40,040 --> 00:41:43,360
Speaker 1: Conics six hundreds and hopefully on the new ones as well.

694
00:41:43,680 --> 00:41:48,120
Speaker 1: I'm not worried about one bit with a flash camera though,

695
00:41:48,320 --> 00:41:51,760
Speaker 1: or what's even more important, you can debate flash either

696
00:41:51,800 --> 00:41:55,560
Speaker 1: side a flash all day long, and I believe that

697
00:41:55,719 --> 00:41:58,680
Speaker 1: my own personal opinion is that the majority of dear

698
00:41:58,760 --> 00:42:03,239
Speaker 1: don't care. Well, if the minority happens to be the

699
00:42:03,280 --> 00:42:05,600
Speaker 1: buck you want to kill, you really don't care. If

700
00:42:05,640 --> 00:42:11,440
Speaker 1: the majority of them don't care, But um, camera noise

701
00:42:11,560 --> 00:42:14,360
Speaker 1: is the killer. You know, you'll get a lot of

702
00:42:14,400 --> 00:42:19,239
Speaker 1: deer that are very accepting of a flash, but if

703
00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:23,439
Speaker 1: they hear that we're click of a camera coming out

704
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:27,239
Speaker 1: of sleep mode, they don't much care for that. What

705
00:42:28,080 --> 00:42:30,360
Speaker 1: I used to do, I mean, I'll be honest with you,

706
00:42:30,400 --> 00:42:32,360
Speaker 1: I don't use them anymore. But what I used to

707
00:42:32,440 --> 00:42:35,680
Speaker 1: do with cameras like that that I found that worked

708
00:42:35,719 --> 00:42:37,759
Speaker 1: for me was go ahead and set them in a

709
00:42:37,800 --> 00:42:40,839
Speaker 1: single shot mode and set them at least seven ft

710
00:42:40,880 --> 00:42:44,719
Speaker 1: off the ground, so now they're angled down to what

711
00:42:44,800 --> 00:42:48,440
Speaker 1: you're trying to cover and you've got one shot that's done.

712
00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:54,320
Speaker 1: Doing that, I can't honestly say I know I spooked

713
00:42:54,360 --> 00:42:58,560
Speaker 1: any deer The other thing I should say is the

714
00:42:58,560 --> 00:43:03,080
Speaker 1: the times that I that cameras by stands are actually

715
00:43:03,120 --> 00:43:08,000
Speaker 1: in the minority. It's only on those really low impact,

716
00:43:08,200 --> 00:43:12,480
Speaker 1: right on the edge of a field type situations because otherwise,

717
00:43:12,840 --> 00:43:15,520
Speaker 1: and dear, I don't know how much more of a

718
00:43:15,560 --> 00:43:17,840
Speaker 1: tangent I should get off on here, but do have

719
00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:23,480
Speaker 1: different tolerance levels in different areas. Don't tolerate a decent

720
00:43:23,520 --> 00:43:27,080
Speaker 1: amount of human disturbances around the field edge because they're

721
00:43:27,120 --> 00:43:30,680
Speaker 1: used to it. Now, the farmers going through, they're checking

722
00:43:30,680 --> 00:43:34,360
Speaker 1: his crops, he's out there spreading manure on his sulfa field,

723
00:43:34,400 --> 00:43:37,719
Speaker 1: he's doing all this stuff. They're used to disturbances there.

724
00:43:37,800 --> 00:43:40,440
Speaker 1: You start getting back in the woods and all of

725
00:43:40,480 --> 00:43:44,280
Speaker 1: a sudden they're tolerance for disturbances start to plummet. Okay,

726
00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:47,880
Speaker 1: so on a field edge, I'm willing to have a

727
00:43:47,960 --> 00:43:52,160
Speaker 1: camera right next to my tree stand. I almost never

728
00:43:52,239 --> 00:43:54,080
Speaker 1: do if it's not on the edge of a field.

729
00:43:54,440 --> 00:43:57,200
Speaker 1: And one one other thing I'm going to mention quick

730
00:43:57,200 --> 00:43:59,600
Speaker 1: on a tangent here, if you don't mind, is on

731
00:43:59,640 --> 00:44:03,600
Speaker 1: those hammers that have flash or make noise, you can

732
00:44:03,680 --> 00:44:08,040
Speaker 1: use them to actually help focus deer activity around your stand.

733
00:44:09,160 --> 00:44:12,520
Speaker 1: I've yet I've yet to spook a deer to the

734
00:44:12,560 --> 00:44:17,439
Speaker 1: point where they leave this area. Okay. What they'll do, though,

735
00:44:17,520 --> 00:44:24,680
Speaker 1: often is they'll avoid that camera location, so you're covering.

736
00:44:24,719 --> 00:44:28,560
Speaker 1: Ah oh, let's say a pinch in the field that

737
00:44:28,680 --> 00:44:32,399
Speaker 1: seventy yards wide. I'll about you, guys, but I ain't

738
00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:37,240
Speaker 1: taking a seventh yeard bowshot. But what I'll often do

739
00:44:37,920 --> 00:44:41,320
Speaker 1: is I'll go ahead that One of the older conics

740
00:44:41,440 --> 00:44:43,560
Speaker 1: is that I use you know that have the red

741
00:44:43,600 --> 00:44:48,799
Speaker 1: globe on the other side of that, and the deer

742
00:44:48,880 --> 00:44:51,600
Speaker 1: still go through that neck, only now they cheat over

743
00:44:51,640 --> 00:44:57,600
Speaker 1: towards me. That works. That's a nice little trick that

744
00:44:57,719 --> 00:45:00,359
Speaker 1: you're not going to use often, but when you use

745
00:45:00,480 --> 00:45:02,560
Speaker 1: it works, so you're really happy and you think you're

746
00:45:02,600 --> 00:45:08,200
Speaker 1: all sorts of smart. That's a neat idea. But anyway,

747
00:45:08,239 --> 00:45:10,520
Speaker 1: I'm sorry for I can't even at this point, I

748
00:45:10,560 --> 00:45:16,719
Speaker 1: can't even remember what your question was. If you can't tell,

749
00:45:16,800 --> 00:45:20,000
Speaker 1: I tend to get off on tangents, good stuff. I'm

750
00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:23,359
Speaker 1: fine with the tangents. Is there some fascinating topics we're

751
00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:29,239
Speaker 1: talking through here? Dan? What are you thinking about all this? Yeah?

752
00:45:29,280 --> 00:45:32,239
Speaker 1: I liked little tips and tricks um as far as

753
00:45:32,360 --> 00:45:35,000
Speaker 1: using you know, I really like the I know I

754
00:45:35,080 --> 00:45:41,000
Speaker 1: know another guy who uses you mentioned about like basically

755
00:45:41,000 --> 00:45:43,600
Speaker 1: cutting down a tree and burying it vertically in front

756
00:45:43,640 --> 00:45:47,239
Speaker 1: of your stand. I know a guy who does that. Um. Basically,

757
00:45:47,280 --> 00:45:51,000
Speaker 1: he makes a horse you know where you tie up horses,

758
00:45:51,520 --> 00:45:53,520
Speaker 1: and he makes one of those out in the woods

759
00:45:53,680 --> 00:45:56,799
Speaker 1: and he uh um, all the bucks in the area

760
00:45:56,880 --> 00:45:59,160
Speaker 1: come and use it on on his property. He has

761
00:45:59,200 --> 00:46:03,000
Speaker 1: a very low pressure property though. But um, I got

762
00:46:03,040 --> 00:46:08,759
Speaker 1: a question about October lulls and in patterning deer. In

763
00:46:10,360 --> 00:46:14,880
Speaker 1: me my opinion, I believe that the October lull is

764
00:46:14,960 --> 00:46:19,719
Speaker 1: a myth um because at some point deer are out there.

765
00:46:20,239 --> 00:46:23,160
Speaker 1: Whether they're not moving in front of you, they're moving

766
00:46:23,200 --> 00:46:26,960
Speaker 1: at some point, whether it's not turnal. You know. If

767
00:46:27,000 --> 00:46:29,440
Speaker 1: that's the case, all of October should be a lull.

768
00:46:30,280 --> 00:46:34,600
Speaker 1: But my my question to you is is it during

769
00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:37,920
Speaker 1: that so called loll is there something that you're doing

770
00:46:38,040 --> 00:46:43,160
Speaker 1: different as opposed to preseason or they're up Are you

771
00:46:43,200 --> 00:46:47,240
Speaker 1: talking hunting wise, yeah, hunting wise or trying to pattern

772
00:46:47,520 --> 00:46:51,160
Speaker 1: dear It all depends on pressure. I mean, I agree

773
00:46:51,200 --> 00:46:53,239
Speaker 1: and disagree with you at the same time, both the

774
00:46:53,360 --> 00:46:57,600
Speaker 1: low being a myth, I mean, I don't. I think

775
00:46:57,600 --> 00:47:04,279
Speaker 1: of my experience in low pressure situations, there is no law.

776
00:47:05,960 --> 00:47:08,319
Speaker 1: The dear feel safe, they're moving. I mean, heck, one

777
00:47:08,320 --> 00:47:10,359
Speaker 1: of the spots. I mean, this is going to make

778
00:47:10,400 --> 00:47:13,000
Speaker 1: me look like such a spoiled baby. One of the

779
00:47:13,040 --> 00:47:16,600
Speaker 1: spots the first week in October. If I don't get

780
00:47:16,719 --> 00:47:19,960
Speaker 1: hunters up into their trees by one o'clock in the afternoon,

781
00:47:20,120 --> 00:47:25,200
Speaker 1: they're too late. They're going to be kicking deer out now.

782
00:47:25,560 --> 00:47:28,440
Speaker 1: Just because we trained dear, I am. I hope you

783
00:47:28,480 --> 00:47:29,759
Speaker 1: know my I'm gonna get off on a little bit

784
00:47:29,760 --> 00:47:31,640
Speaker 1: of a tangent and then try to circle back to you.

785
00:47:32,080 --> 00:47:34,560
Speaker 1: I have no doubt in my mind whatsoever that we

786
00:47:34,680 --> 00:47:37,040
Speaker 1: trained dear just as effectively as we train our dog

787
00:47:37,080 --> 00:47:40,919
Speaker 1: at home. A cheesey analogy that I use a lot

788
00:47:40,960 --> 00:47:43,759
Speaker 1: in seminars is go ahead and set out, and obviously

789
00:47:43,840 --> 00:47:46,680
Speaker 1: don't really do this, but set out a dog dish

790
00:47:46,680 --> 00:47:49,279
Speaker 1: at home. You stand and fill it up. Can you

791
00:47:49,360 --> 00:47:53,880
Speaker 1: keep that thing full? And from seven o'clock in the

792
00:47:53,920 --> 00:47:56,480
Speaker 1: morning till six o'clock at night you're standing over that

793
00:47:56,520 --> 00:47:59,160
Speaker 1: dog dish, and every single time that that dog comes

794
00:47:59,160 --> 00:48:00,640
Speaker 1: to take a bit of the would you kick him

795
00:48:00,640 --> 00:48:02,399
Speaker 1: in the butt as hard as you can across the room.

796
00:48:02,440 --> 00:48:04,160
Speaker 1: How long is it going to be before he doesn't

797
00:48:04,160 --> 00:48:08,160
Speaker 1: start feeding until after six? You can't take him long.

798
00:48:09,080 --> 00:48:11,680
Speaker 1: That's what we're doing the deer out there, and in

799
00:48:11,760 --> 00:48:15,520
Speaker 1: my opinion, the low for the most part, is actually

800
00:48:16,000 --> 00:48:20,080
Speaker 1: self induced. It's October is a beautiful time to be

801
00:48:20,120 --> 00:48:23,760
Speaker 1: out in the woods, and everybody and their brother and sister,

802
00:48:23,920 --> 00:48:26,160
Speaker 1: whether it's going out to just go for a walk,

803
00:48:26,840 --> 00:48:31,280
Speaker 1: cut some cut some firewood before winter, do some bird hunting,

804
00:48:31,360 --> 00:48:34,200
Speaker 1: some squirrel hunting, whatever. All of a sudden, we've invaded.

805
00:48:35,239 --> 00:48:39,279
Speaker 1: And I think that more than anything causes this law

806
00:48:40,400 --> 00:48:44,640
Speaker 1: you um is our own, our own doing. UM. But

807
00:48:44,719 --> 00:48:48,200
Speaker 1: if we're dealing with high pressure situations, I'll be honest

808
00:48:48,239 --> 00:48:50,120
Speaker 1: with you. For the most part, I'm leaving it alone.

809
00:48:51,239 --> 00:48:54,680
Speaker 1: I want to in the high pressure situation, the scenario

810
00:48:54,840 --> 00:48:58,440
Speaker 1: I talked about where I'm hunting, that I'm hunting what

811
00:48:59,239 --> 00:49:01,759
Speaker 1: it is its core area, but as importantly it's that

812
00:49:01,880 --> 00:49:04,480
Speaker 1: area no one else is getting to. I'm gonna wait

813
00:49:04,600 --> 00:49:07,600
Speaker 1: until I'm gonna wait till right on that last week

814
00:49:07,640 --> 00:49:10,400
Speaker 1: of October, early November, on a good weather day, and

815
00:49:10,400 --> 00:49:11,640
Speaker 1: I'm going to go in there and try to kill

816
00:49:11,680 --> 00:49:13,719
Speaker 1: them the very first time because I got virtually no

817
00:49:13,800 --> 00:49:19,280
Speaker 1: wiggle room for error. Um in uh, in low pressure situations,

818
00:49:21,760 --> 00:49:25,719
Speaker 1: for the most part, I'm hunting the food. With the

819
00:49:25,800 --> 00:49:29,960
Speaker 1: exception of I'll be more than happy to spend a

820
00:49:29,960 --> 00:49:32,879
Speaker 1: couple of days hunting the down wind sides of low

821
00:49:32,960 --> 00:49:38,919
Speaker 1: impact dopetting areas on good weather days. Again, by good

822
00:49:38,960 --> 00:49:43,399
Speaker 1: weather days, I mean at worst, it's not overly hot,

823
00:49:43,480 --> 00:49:46,600
Speaker 1: it's not overly windy. You know. Um, I don't be

824
00:49:46,680 --> 00:49:49,279
Speaker 1: honest with you. I don't pay squad of attention to

825
00:49:49,320 --> 00:49:53,719
Speaker 1: the moon as far as hunting goes. Um, but perfect

826
00:49:53,960 --> 00:49:58,279
Speaker 1: I want that. I want that stretch or I'm just

827
00:49:58,320 --> 00:50:02,160
Speaker 1: going to make up these numbers. But it's seven mid

828
00:50:02,280 --> 00:50:05,919
Speaker 1: seventies for the past week, Boom, the bottom falls out.

829
00:50:06,360 --> 00:50:09,920
Speaker 1: The high for next Thursday is going to be forty

830
00:50:09,960 --> 00:50:13,439
Speaker 1: eight degrees. That's a great as long as you don't

831
00:50:13,440 --> 00:50:15,719
Speaker 1: have really stiff winds. That's a great day to be

832
00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:19,640
Speaker 1: out hunting those those first couple of days, right after

833
00:50:19,680 --> 00:50:24,480
Speaker 1: the bottom falls on the temperatures. Um, that's when I'm

834
00:50:24,480 --> 00:50:27,719
Speaker 1: going to go in to hunt those dopetting areas. And

835
00:50:27,760 --> 00:50:30,759
Speaker 1: the reason I'm going to is because there. We try

836
00:50:30,880 --> 00:50:34,600
Speaker 1: so hard to go ahead and put the rut in

837
00:50:34,640 --> 00:50:39,040
Speaker 1: this neat little ten fourteen day window. As far as

838
00:50:39,120 --> 00:50:43,320
Speaker 1: breeding goes, it's not. There's some does that come in early.

839
00:50:43,400 --> 00:50:46,279
Speaker 1: There's some dose that come in late. And I'm not

840
00:50:46,360 --> 00:50:49,719
Speaker 1: talking about being skipped because the buck door ratios a

841
00:50:49,719 --> 00:50:52,640
Speaker 1: lot of whack I can honestly say, I've never seen

842
00:50:52,719 --> 00:50:56,720
Speaker 1: that happen. Um but and they have hunted some really

843
00:50:56,800 --> 00:51:01,920
Speaker 1: whacked out ratios. But but some dose that aren't healthy

844
00:51:01,960 --> 00:51:04,760
Speaker 1: are naturally going to come in later. Some super healthy

845
00:51:04,800 --> 00:51:06,480
Speaker 1: dose are going to come in early. And then you've

846
00:51:06,520 --> 00:51:10,520
Speaker 1: got the doll fons. Even even in northern Wisconsin on

847
00:51:10,560 --> 00:51:13,480
Speaker 1: a decent year, five to ten percent of do fons

848
00:51:13,480 --> 00:51:17,320
Speaker 1: are bred their first year. But they have to reach

849
00:51:17,400 --> 00:51:21,680
Speaker 1: certain physical and physiological thresholds in order to do that,

850
00:51:21,800 --> 00:51:24,120
Speaker 1: and it takes them longer. They end up having a

851
00:51:24,600 --> 00:51:27,960
Speaker 1: coming in tests later. So I'll actually hunt, I'll try

852
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:29,960
Speaker 1: to catch some of that action. They've had pretty good

853
00:51:30,080 --> 00:51:33,399
Speaker 1: luck with it. Um hunting do betting areas a couple

854
00:51:33,400 --> 00:51:36,680
Speaker 1: of times in mid October as long as the weather

855
00:51:36,760 --> 00:51:41,560
Speaker 1: is cooperating. Because Mr Big he's a different animal, he

856
00:51:41,600 --> 00:51:45,360
Speaker 1: knows what's going on. Out there. I'm not saying he's

857
00:51:45,680 --> 00:51:47,920
Speaker 1: anywhere near as smart as we try to give him

858
00:51:47,920 --> 00:51:52,799
Speaker 1: credit for, but he's experienced, he's one ahead, and he's

859
00:51:52,840 --> 00:51:56,320
Speaker 1: seen that. Oh jeez, every year there's some early and

860
00:51:56,480 --> 00:52:01,480
Speaker 1: some late breeding opportunities, and he's driven to perpetuate his species.

861
00:52:01,520 --> 00:52:03,480
Speaker 1: And he's going to be one of the very first.

862
00:52:03,760 --> 00:52:06,360
Speaker 1: Him and the really stupid young ones will be the

863
00:52:06,480 --> 00:52:09,440
Speaker 1: very first year to be out there looking for dolls.

864
00:52:10,640 --> 00:52:12,440
Speaker 1: And every once in a while you can get lucky

865
00:52:12,480 --> 00:52:17,600
Speaker 1: in mid October, especially in Wisconsin Minnesota. I've had real

866
00:52:17,719 --> 00:52:21,160
Speaker 1: good luck mid October with the Coal Front catching Mr

867
00:52:21,200 --> 00:52:24,759
Speaker 1: Big Check in one of those dough betting areas. I

868
00:52:24,760 --> 00:52:26,839
Speaker 1: think that's some some good advice for us to I'll

869
00:52:26,840 --> 00:52:29,799
Speaker 1: try out this coming mid October. I'm sure I'll be

870
00:52:30,239 --> 00:52:32,960
Speaker 1: thinking through something that is for sure. Well, the one

871
00:52:33,000 --> 00:52:35,360
Speaker 1: thing I would I would say for sure is that

872
00:52:35,520 --> 00:52:38,280
Speaker 1: better be low impact, because you don't want to blow

873
00:52:38,440 --> 00:52:42,880
Speaker 1: your best spots before they're good. You know, um that

874
00:52:42,880 --> 00:52:47,000
Speaker 1: that is a very important consideration now and then time

875
00:52:47,040 --> 00:52:49,920
Speaker 1: up with the weather. I think I already said this,

876
00:52:50,000 --> 00:52:53,040
Speaker 1: but for me, hunting is all about stacking odds in

877
00:52:53,080 --> 00:52:56,640
Speaker 1: your favor now, and I want those odds stacks. So

878
00:52:56,680 --> 00:52:58,839
Speaker 1: when I go in there, there's plenty of stands. I've

879
00:52:58,880 --> 00:53:02,319
Speaker 1: got that our hundred more than once or twice, okay,

880
00:53:02,320 --> 00:53:04,600
Speaker 1: but I want to make it so that each time

881
00:53:04,680 --> 00:53:07,439
Speaker 1: I crawl into that stand, I believe today is as

882
00:53:07,560 --> 00:53:10,000
Speaker 1: high odds as the stand's going to have for producer

883
00:53:10,120 --> 00:53:13,960
Speaker 1: for me, and that's worked out really well for me.

884
00:53:15,840 --> 00:53:18,680
Speaker 1: So continue a few of those thoughts about stacking the

885
00:53:18,680 --> 00:53:22,279
Speaker 1: odds and using multiple factors to make a decision about

886
00:53:22,320 --> 00:53:24,680
Speaker 1: stand site and kind of tying into what we had

887
00:53:24,719 --> 00:53:26,560
Speaker 1: talked to us a little bit ago. We talked through

888
00:53:26,600 --> 00:53:29,520
Speaker 1: how you're specifically using those trail cameras as a tool

889
00:53:29,960 --> 00:53:32,399
Speaker 1: to better understand what the odds are for specific time.

890
00:53:32,800 --> 00:53:36,120
Speaker 1: Can you elaborate a little more on sign We talked

891
00:53:36,120 --> 00:53:38,120
Speaker 1: a little bit about tracks, but can you talk about

892
00:53:38,200 --> 00:53:40,640
Speaker 1: if at all you use reb lines or scrapes as

893
00:53:40,719 --> 00:53:46,120
Speaker 1: part of this overall puzzle. Reb Lines for me, are

894
00:53:46,400 --> 00:53:51,880
Speaker 1: very beneficial in bigwood settings, but in more your average

895
00:53:52,000 --> 00:53:56,560
Speaker 1: Midwestern property. It takes a better mind than me to

896
00:53:57,120 --> 00:54:01,120
Speaker 1: piece them together. I can count, I can count on

897
00:54:01,120 --> 00:54:06,600
Speaker 1: one hand the number of quote unquote rub lines, but

898
00:54:07,239 --> 00:54:10,880
Speaker 1: that what I would consider a rub line. In the

899
00:54:10,960 --> 00:54:15,160
Speaker 1: more Midwestern fire belt settings, you talk about bigwood settings,

900
00:54:15,520 --> 00:54:19,120
Speaker 1: that's a different animal. You don't have the you don't

901
00:54:19,200 --> 00:54:26,120
Speaker 1: have the density of mature box. So you can tend

902
00:54:26,160 --> 00:54:29,960
Speaker 1: to piece their rubs together a lot better. But just

903
00:54:30,000 --> 00:54:31,960
Speaker 1: because the buck is big doesn't mean he's rubbing on

904
00:54:32,000 --> 00:54:37,759
Speaker 1: big trees. Now, I get every bit is excited by

905
00:54:37,840 --> 00:54:41,920
Speaker 1: seeing that sapling about the diameter of my index finger thumb.

906
00:54:42,320 --> 00:54:47,960
Speaker 1: That is absolutely trashed. I mean trash. There is nothing

907
00:54:48,120 --> 00:54:51,320
Speaker 1: left to that thing. It's a twisted up, a little

908
00:54:51,440 --> 00:54:54,239
Speaker 1: mess of a tree that stands no chance of survival.

909
00:54:55,040 --> 00:54:57,479
Speaker 1: I see something like that, I think odds are pretty

910
00:54:57,520 --> 00:55:01,640
Speaker 1: good A mature buck did this. I you see that

911
00:55:01,640 --> 00:55:07,040
Speaker 1: that rubbed that's about the diameter of a popcam. You

912
00:55:07,080 --> 00:55:10,439
Speaker 1: know that's got a oh, I don't know, let's say

913
00:55:10,600 --> 00:55:16,440
Speaker 1: twelve eighteen inch shine to one side. I got no

914
00:55:16,560 --> 00:55:19,839
Speaker 1: clue who did that. It might have been Mr Big.

915
00:55:20,800 --> 00:55:22,920
Speaker 1: It could have been a yearling buck with a nasty

916
00:55:22,960 --> 00:55:27,000
Speaker 1: attitude that day too. Um And when it comes to

917
00:55:27,000 --> 00:55:29,520
Speaker 1: the big trees, even on the big trees, I mean

918
00:55:29,520 --> 00:55:34,879
Speaker 1: I've seen I've seen spikes rubbed telephone poles. You didn't

919
00:55:34,920 --> 00:55:38,600
Speaker 1: do a lot of damage to it. But they actually

920
00:55:38,640 --> 00:55:41,920
Speaker 1: came up to that telephone pole and rubbed the antlers

921
00:55:42,000 --> 00:55:44,440
Speaker 1: up and down, even on big trees. I want to

922
00:55:44,440 --> 00:55:48,480
Speaker 1: see damage if I see what I do every time

923
00:55:48,520 --> 00:55:50,640
Speaker 1: when it comes to rubs. What I do is I

924
00:55:50,719 --> 00:55:52,479
Speaker 1: walk up to him and look at it and say,

925
00:55:52,800 --> 00:55:56,200
Speaker 1: do I believe an immature buck could have made this

926
00:55:56,360 --> 00:56:01,879
Speaker 1: level of could have trashed the tree to this end? Now?

927
00:56:02,280 --> 00:56:05,399
Speaker 1: If I don't believe he kind of, that's when I

928
00:56:05,440 --> 00:56:10,680
Speaker 1: tend to I tend to believe it was a mature book. Um.

929
00:56:10,719 --> 00:56:14,520
Speaker 1: But the problem I have is ow. Okay, so I've

930
00:56:14,560 --> 00:56:18,799
Speaker 1: got a really good rub over here. I gotta you know, man,

931
00:56:18,840 --> 00:56:22,399
Speaker 1: it's a thigh sized tree that shredded. I believe that's

932
00:56:22,400 --> 00:56:25,560
Speaker 1: a great book. Okay. Now a hundred and fifty yards

933
00:56:25,600 --> 00:56:31,880
Speaker 1: to the east, there's a sapling that's absolutely shredded. Okay,

934
00:56:32,120 --> 00:56:35,799
Speaker 1: I believe that's a good book. But it's the same one.

935
00:56:38,960 --> 00:56:43,680
Speaker 1: I can't swear it is. So I used to me

936
00:56:44,760 --> 00:56:50,360
Speaker 1: rubs and scrapes are valuable, valuable pieces of intel, especially

937
00:56:50,400 --> 00:56:53,839
Speaker 1: the size of tracks and scrapes. Um. That's what I'm

938
00:56:53,880 --> 00:56:59,680
Speaker 1: really paying attention to when I'm looking at scrapes. Um.

939
00:56:59,719 --> 00:57:01,520
Speaker 1: But I think we try to make more out of

940
00:57:01,560 --> 00:57:06,239
Speaker 1: them than they really are. Now, Um, I mean I've

941
00:57:06,239 --> 00:57:11,760
Speaker 1: had I've had rub lines in the north Woods where okay,

942
00:57:11,960 --> 00:57:16,080
Speaker 1: geez over a string of over a string of two

943
00:57:16,440 --> 00:57:22,560
Speaker 1: and fifty yards between the swamp in this clear cut regrowth.

944
00:57:23,480 --> 00:57:28,480
Speaker 1: I've got eight different RUPs and all eight of them,

945
00:57:28,720 --> 00:57:32,280
Speaker 1: or seven of eight, happened to be pointing back towards

946
00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:36,920
Speaker 1: that swamp. Okay, that's telling me in this case that

947
00:57:37,040 --> 00:57:39,600
Speaker 1: I've got a good book and there's you know, the

948
00:57:39,680 --> 00:57:42,360
Speaker 1: rubbs are the trees are pretty trashed. I mean, I

949
00:57:42,400 --> 00:57:44,760
Speaker 1: believe this is a big one in that case. I

950
00:57:44,800 --> 00:57:46,920
Speaker 1: believe that Okay, I've got a good buck Betton in

951
00:57:47,000 --> 00:57:51,440
Speaker 1: that swamp, and he is using this route predominantly to

952
00:57:51,560 --> 00:57:53,760
Speaker 1: get to the food, to get to his food source,

953
00:57:53,800 --> 00:58:00,280
Speaker 1: which is that this clear cut regrowth. Um, it's a

954
00:58:00,360 --> 00:58:05,560
Speaker 1: clue that they're all pointing back towards the swamp. But

955
00:58:05,840 --> 00:58:08,440
Speaker 1: because I mean, that's lazy walking when he comes up

956
00:58:08,440 --> 00:58:10,560
Speaker 1: to the tree. But then you look down its tracks

957
00:58:10,600 --> 00:58:14,480
Speaker 1: and up Okay, the majority tracks are headed towards that

958
00:58:14,560 --> 00:58:17,960
Speaker 1: clear cut. Okay, I've got enough pieces of intel now

959
00:58:18,360 --> 00:58:22,080
Speaker 1: to actually believe this is the case. But I mean,

960
00:58:22,120 --> 00:58:24,280
Speaker 1: I've heard plenty of people talk about how you can

961
00:58:24,320 --> 00:58:28,120
Speaker 1: tell the direction a buck was going from which direction

962
00:58:28,280 --> 00:58:32,000
Speaker 1: the rub faces. Now, I've seen an awful lot of

963
00:58:32,040 --> 00:58:34,520
Speaker 1: buck circle of tree before they went ahead and made rubs.

964
00:58:35,560 --> 00:58:37,880
Speaker 1: I've seen a lot of trees are angled one way

965
00:58:37,960 --> 00:58:42,720
Speaker 1: or another, or have branches on one location that encourages

966
00:58:42,800 --> 00:58:45,800
Speaker 1: them to make rubs in a completely different direction. I

967
00:58:45,920 --> 00:58:48,720
Speaker 1: sent through a seminar. Every time I give seminars, I

968
00:58:48,800 --> 00:58:51,560
Speaker 1: listened to other speakers. I'm not going to mention his name,

969
00:58:51,640 --> 00:58:55,160
Speaker 1: but I I sat through a seminar last year or

970
00:58:55,200 --> 00:58:57,440
Speaker 1: two years ago that I heard this guy going on

971
00:58:57,520 --> 00:59:02,600
Speaker 1: about how only mature don that bucks make rubs in

972
00:59:02,640 --> 00:59:06,360
Speaker 1: the woods. Immature bucks will go ahead and make them

973
00:59:06,400 --> 00:59:08,640
Speaker 1: on the edge of the field, but if you find

974
00:59:08,640 --> 00:59:12,000
Speaker 1: a rub in the middle of the woods, it's guaranteed

975
00:59:12,040 --> 00:59:16,200
Speaker 1: it was a mature bucket. Next, you can go ahead

976
00:59:16,400 --> 00:59:20,360
Speaker 1: and look at the shining side. That's going to tell

977
00:59:20,440 --> 00:59:25,440
Speaker 1: you the wind direction for that day. It's the wind

978
00:59:25,520 --> 00:59:28,680
Speaker 1: was coming exact opposite direction of the shining side of

979
00:59:28,720 --> 00:59:32,240
Speaker 1: the tree, okay, meaning that buck is always walking straight

980
00:59:32,280 --> 00:59:35,080
Speaker 1: into the wind. Now turn your back to that tree.

981
00:59:35,800 --> 00:59:37,840
Speaker 1: Now put the shining side right in the middle of

982
00:59:37,880 --> 00:59:41,320
Speaker 1: your back. You take a hundred and fifty paces in

983
00:59:41,360 --> 00:59:45,640
Speaker 1: that direction, you're gonna find his bed. So now every

984
00:59:45,720 --> 00:59:48,120
Speaker 1: single time the wind is out of that direction, you

985
00:59:48,160 --> 00:59:54,640
Speaker 1: know exactly where that buck is betting seriously, and he

986
00:59:54,760 --> 00:59:59,760
Speaker 1: was felling a fifty book, you know, and I'm like, Wow,

987
01:00:00,040 --> 01:00:02,560
Speaker 1: these people know so much more. And then some other

988
01:00:02,600 --> 01:00:05,919
Speaker 1: guy on TV I heard going on about how how

989
01:00:06,320 --> 01:00:10,240
Speaker 1: you know there's three different categories of rubs. Velvet shedding

990
01:00:10,320 --> 01:00:15,320
Speaker 1: rubs they mean nothing, another category out called rage robs,

991
01:00:15,360 --> 01:00:19,640
Speaker 1: they mean nothing. And then there's the territorial boundary marking

992
01:00:19,760 --> 01:00:22,760
Speaker 1: rubs that apparently a mature buck is going to go

993
01:00:22,840 --> 01:00:27,280
Speaker 1: around his territory every other day and mark trees to

994
01:00:27,360 --> 01:00:32,040
Speaker 1: scare off all the other bucks. Was this guy trying

995
01:00:32,080 --> 01:00:36,480
Speaker 1: to sell you the acorn crunch or two? I don't know.

996
01:00:36,520 --> 01:00:39,560
Speaker 1: I turned it off at that point and like, yeah,

997
01:00:39,640 --> 01:00:42,840
Speaker 1: you gotta be kidding me. Guys, So we try to

998
01:00:43,080 --> 01:00:46,520
Speaker 1: I mean, I apologize for going way off course here,

999
01:00:46,960 --> 01:00:50,000
Speaker 1: but we try to put so much more meaning in

1000
01:00:50,040 --> 01:00:53,360
Speaker 1: the stuff. So often when it comes to mature bucks

1001
01:00:53,400 --> 01:00:56,480
Speaker 1: that are really there. Now, I mean, I do have

1002
01:00:56,520 --> 01:00:58,880
Speaker 1: no doubt in my mind that some rubs are made

1003
01:00:58,880 --> 01:01:02,640
Speaker 1: for communication. Per this is now you tend to see him.

1004
01:01:03,000 --> 01:01:05,040
Speaker 1: They tend to be those ones where you can see

1005
01:01:05,320 --> 01:01:09,440
Speaker 1: the different layers of bark that has just been used

1006
01:01:09,640 --> 01:01:12,600
Speaker 1: year after year after year. It's kind of like that

1007
01:01:12,680 --> 01:01:15,560
Speaker 1: scenario you were describing earlier about that guy putting in

1008
01:01:15,640 --> 01:01:19,160
Speaker 1: that uh, that uh, fake rub out in the woods.

1009
01:01:19,920 --> 01:01:23,680
Speaker 1: Now that that gear are just drawn there naturally to communicate.

1010
01:01:24,680 --> 01:01:27,920
Speaker 1: And sometimes there happens to be a buck over there

1011
01:01:27,960 --> 01:01:30,640
Speaker 1: that he doesn't like, and he's getting all main mean

1012
01:01:30,680 --> 01:01:33,120
Speaker 1: and mad, so he's going to trash this tree that

1013
01:01:33,200 --> 01:01:36,360
Speaker 1: he happens to be standing next to right now because

1014
01:01:36,360 --> 01:01:40,400
Speaker 1: he's trying to intimidate that book in Another time, I

1015
01:01:40,440 --> 01:01:42,280
Speaker 1: believe they do it just for the heck of it.

1016
01:01:43,560 --> 01:01:45,560
Speaker 1: Other times they're doing it to try to I don't

1017
01:01:45,560 --> 01:01:48,320
Speaker 1: even I'm not pretending to consciously think this, but to

1018
01:01:48,400 --> 01:01:52,120
Speaker 1: try to build up their neck muscles. Now that there

1019
01:01:52,240 --> 01:01:55,760
Speaker 1: isn't always just like is there always a great reason.

1020
01:01:55,920 --> 01:01:57,800
Speaker 1: I'm sure there is for you to But for me,

1021
01:01:58,080 --> 01:02:01,600
Speaker 1: there isn't always a slam great reason I do something.

1022
01:02:02,160 --> 01:02:04,040
Speaker 1: Sometimes I do it just for the heck of it,

1023
01:02:04,720 --> 01:02:08,000
Speaker 1: or because I'm bored or because I wasn't thinking, why

1024
01:02:08,000 --> 01:02:12,680
Speaker 1: are dear any different? It's a great point. It's something

1025
01:02:12,720 --> 01:02:17,240
Speaker 1: I think you make a very interesting observation that we

1026
01:02:17,280 --> 01:02:20,680
Speaker 1: really do sometimes read a little too much into some

1027
01:02:20,720 --> 01:02:22,480
Speaker 1: of these things and then come to these kind of

1028
01:02:22,480 --> 01:02:25,000
Speaker 1: far off conclusions that can lead us down a wormhole.

1029
01:02:25,280 --> 01:02:29,040
Speaker 1: So a lot of truth to that. Well, we try,

1030
01:02:29,400 --> 01:02:32,280
Speaker 1: As I said, there's so much mystique around mature box,

1031
01:02:32,520 --> 01:02:36,240
Speaker 1: and we've got so many people in this industry trying

1032
01:02:36,280 --> 01:02:40,160
Speaker 1: to make names for themselves as well. But between the two,

1033
01:02:40,280 --> 01:02:44,840
Speaker 1: we try so desperately hard to put profound meaning to everything,

1034
01:02:46,240 --> 01:02:49,040
Speaker 1: and there really isn't too a lot of stuff. I mean,

1035
01:02:49,160 --> 01:02:52,960
Speaker 1: dear are dear are simple animals. They care about survival

1036
01:02:53,960 --> 01:02:59,200
Speaker 1: and perpetuating their species, and virtually every everything in one way,

1037
01:02:59,240 --> 01:03:05,160
Speaker 1: shape or form revolves around one of those two things.

1038
01:03:05,200 --> 01:03:09,160
Speaker 1: So true, so true. So this perfectly segues into my

1039
01:03:09,280 --> 01:03:12,040
Speaker 1: final question for you, Steve, because we are coming up

1040
01:03:12,040 --> 01:03:15,000
Speaker 1: on here on time. I'm curious, and maybe you've already

1041
01:03:15,000 --> 01:03:17,920
Speaker 1: mentioned it, but what do you believe the biggest mistake

1042
01:03:18,040 --> 01:03:22,000
Speaker 1: is the hunters make when thinking about patterning deer or

1043
01:03:22,000 --> 01:03:25,720
Speaker 1: when trying to pattern deer um? What is that big mistake.

1044
01:03:27,640 --> 01:03:30,720
Speaker 1: I would try to say. My knee jerk is to say,

1045
01:03:30,720 --> 01:03:34,200
Speaker 1: trying to get too much into now you should never

1046
01:03:34,600 --> 01:03:38,960
Speaker 1: whether it's as I mentioned about using scouting cams or

1047
01:03:39,080 --> 01:03:43,640
Speaker 1: getting out there scouting itself. Now, the trick to pull

1048
01:03:43,760 --> 01:03:46,080
Speaker 1: the stuff off is to be able to get enough

1049
01:03:46,120 --> 01:03:50,840
Speaker 1: information to make an educated guess, but not but not

1050
01:03:51,080 --> 01:03:54,320
Speaker 1: ruining your area in doing so. And I mean, if

1051
01:03:54,320 --> 01:03:56,640
Speaker 1: you're going out there every single even if you get

1052
01:03:56,720 --> 01:04:00,120
Speaker 1: it in low impact locations, you know, going out or

1053
01:04:00,160 --> 01:04:03,520
Speaker 1: every single day to swap chips on your camera is

1054
01:04:03,640 --> 01:04:07,240
Speaker 1: not a good idea. Again, I know because I used to.

1055
01:04:08,320 --> 01:04:11,080
Speaker 1: It was just like, yeah, I get to draw your

1056
01:04:11,240 --> 01:04:13,840
Speaker 1: it feels like you're a kid on Christmas Day. You

1057
01:04:13,960 --> 01:04:17,120
Speaker 1: can't wait to get those pictures and check them now.

1058
01:04:17,560 --> 01:04:21,680
Speaker 1: But show and to answer a question that I didn't earlier,

1059
01:04:22,160 --> 01:04:25,880
Speaker 1: generally that there's exceptions. But generally speaking, two weeks to

1060
01:04:25,960 --> 01:04:30,080
Speaker 1: a month between swift between chips swaps, that's how much

1061
01:04:30,120 --> 01:04:33,400
Speaker 1: time I give them. Now. Um, there will be exceptions.

1062
01:04:33,440 --> 01:04:36,480
Speaker 1: You know, let's say swap chips last week and the

1063
01:04:36,520 --> 01:04:40,120
Speaker 1: owners are coming down now this week to hunt, Well,

1064
01:04:40,160 --> 01:04:43,680
Speaker 1: I probably will go out there and swap them right then.

1065
01:04:43,680 --> 01:04:45,480
Speaker 1: And there, so I have the most up to date

1066
01:04:45,520 --> 01:04:49,240
Speaker 1: intel on what to one before I should send them

1067
01:04:49,240 --> 01:04:53,920
Speaker 1: and stuff. But um, but don't don't trash the place

1068
01:04:54,440 --> 01:04:57,800
Speaker 1: or remember somebody years and years ago. I apologize. I

1069
01:04:57,800 --> 01:05:00,720
Speaker 1: can't remember who told me this, and they deserve credit

1070
01:05:00,760 --> 01:05:02,440
Speaker 1: for it because it was one of the more profound

1071
01:05:02,520 --> 01:05:05,240
Speaker 1: things I think I've ever heard. You can go ahead

1072
01:05:05,240 --> 01:05:06,960
Speaker 1: and take your woods and you can divide it into

1073
01:05:06,960 --> 01:05:10,520
Speaker 1: two sections. One you own, the other part the deer owns.

1074
01:05:11,200 --> 01:05:15,600
Speaker 1: You guys are going to share. Well, give the deer

1075
01:05:15,760 --> 01:05:18,320
Speaker 1: as much as you can give them, and you will

1076
01:05:18,480 --> 01:05:22,000
Speaker 1: see more dear over the long run. It's when you

1077
01:05:22,080 --> 01:05:24,640
Speaker 1: sit there and continually kick that dog in the butt

1078
01:05:24,720 --> 01:05:27,560
Speaker 1: every time it comes up to the food bowl. That's

1079
01:05:27,640 --> 01:05:30,600
Speaker 1: when that's when all of a sudden, your deer sightings

1080
01:05:30,600 --> 01:05:35,200
Speaker 1: they start going down. Now, So to just just use

1081
01:05:35,240 --> 01:05:37,720
Speaker 1: your head about this stuff. The other thing is is

1082
01:05:38,120 --> 01:05:42,000
Speaker 1: common sense is your best friend. You know none of

1083
01:05:42,360 --> 01:05:46,640
Speaker 1: nothing when it comes to white tails. The more you

1084
01:05:46,720 --> 01:05:51,480
Speaker 1: think about it, nothing is overly profound. It's if it

1085
01:05:51,560 --> 01:05:55,480
Speaker 1: does not if it does not make sense to you,

1086
01:05:55,480 --> 01:05:58,400
Speaker 1: you know what, it probably ain't happen. So somebody's probably

1087
01:05:58,400 --> 01:06:00,640
Speaker 1: trying to sell you a bill of goods one reason

1088
01:06:00,720 --> 01:06:04,800
Speaker 1: or another. You use common sense, use your mind. Your

1089
01:06:04,840 --> 01:06:08,000
Speaker 1: best weapon, by far is your mind and it's power

1090
01:06:08,120 --> 01:06:13,160
Speaker 1: to analyze situations, get the pieces you can safely, and

1091
01:06:13,200 --> 01:06:16,960
Speaker 1: then try to connect them. Now it's like, Okay, I

1092
01:06:17,080 --> 01:06:19,919
Speaker 1: get his picture on this food plot here, I get

1093
01:06:19,920 --> 01:06:22,360
Speaker 1: his picture in this metal over here. I get his

1094
01:06:22,480 --> 01:06:29,280
Speaker 1: picture on this clear cut regrowth over there. Where's he

1095
01:06:29,360 --> 01:06:33,480
Speaker 1: coming from? Well? Each time, if I look at how

1096
01:06:33,480 --> 01:06:36,480
Speaker 1: he's entering the frame, he appears to be coming from

1097
01:06:36,560 --> 01:06:40,000
Speaker 1: the same general area. There's a ridge in that same

1098
01:06:40,040 --> 01:06:43,600
Speaker 1: general area there. You know what, if he bets him

1099
01:06:43,600 --> 01:06:47,280
Speaker 1: the knob of that ridge, he can use his eyes

1100
01:06:47,360 --> 01:06:52,160
Speaker 1: to scan the entire valley below him for um, just

1101
01:06:52,320 --> 01:06:56,160
Speaker 1: shy A three D and sixty degrees. And if he's

1102
01:06:56,160 --> 01:06:58,920
Speaker 1: got a wind coming down that ridge that winds covering

1103
01:06:58,920 --> 01:07:02,400
Speaker 1: his backs, I bet to that to where he's been. Now,

1104
01:07:02,400 --> 01:07:08,080
Speaker 1: how is he getting between those locations? I can't tell

1105
01:07:08,120 --> 01:07:10,360
Speaker 1: you how he's getting to the metal or the clear cut,

1106
01:07:10,480 --> 01:07:16,560
Speaker 1: but there is there is that nasty ditch that separates

1107
01:07:16,600 --> 01:07:19,480
Speaker 1: him from that point that runs between that point in

1108
01:07:19,640 --> 01:07:24,240
Speaker 1: that that food plot. There happens that ditch is just

1109
01:07:24,480 --> 01:07:28,720
Speaker 1: a major pain to cross, except for that one spot

1110
01:07:28,760 --> 01:07:32,520
Speaker 1: where it's got that low sloping gentle bank, you know,

1111
01:07:32,560 --> 01:07:33,760
Speaker 1: And I bet you I can set up there, and

1112
01:07:33,800 --> 01:07:38,400
Speaker 1: I bet you can kill that deer. You know. That's

1113
01:07:38,560 --> 01:07:42,400
Speaker 1: that's the that's the type of thought process I try

1114
01:07:42,440 --> 01:07:46,080
Speaker 1: to go through every situation. He might be real tough

1115
01:07:46,120 --> 01:07:48,360
Speaker 1: to kill off that metal, he might be real tough

1116
01:07:48,400 --> 01:07:54,080
Speaker 1: to kill off that off that clear cut, but that

1117
01:07:54,160 --> 01:07:59,280
Speaker 1: one spot over there, he's vulnerable. And yeah, now just

1118
01:07:59,360 --> 01:08:02,240
Speaker 1: playing the eye adds two out of three times he's

1119
01:08:02,280 --> 01:08:04,640
Speaker 1: not gonna be going through there. But if I can

1120
01:08:04,640 --> 01:08:07,840
Speaker 1: get in and out of that location safely, if I

1121
01:08:08,000 --> 01:08:11,560
Speaker 1: use my head on the wind, as long as I

1122
01:08:11,680 --> 01:08:13,880
Speaker 1: make it so he doesn't know I'm hunting them there,

1123
01:08:14,520 --> 01:08:17,759
Speaker 1: you know what you want? One out of three ain't

1124
01:08:17,760 --> 01:08:21,320
Speaker 1: bad odds because that means I sit here three times,

1125
01:08:21,760 --> 01:08:23,679
Speaker 1: and odds are in my favorite one of those times,

1126
01:08:23,680 --> 01:08:25,000
Speaker 1: he's going to come through and I'm gonna have a

1127
01:08:25,080 --> 01:08:30,240
Speaker 1: chance to kill him. This is a I love this

1128
01:08:30,360 --> 01:08:33,559
Speaker 1: mindset of how you're using those different pieces and then

1129
01:08:33,600 --> 01:08:35,840
Speaker 1: looking at the overall situation from a higher level and

1130
01:08:35,920 --> 01:08:37,720
Speaker 1: finding out where that weakness is. I think that's a

1131
01:08:37,760 --> 01:08:41,320
Speaker 1: great way to think through what can sometimes be an

1132
01:08:41,320 --> 01:08:43,240
Speaker 1: overwhelming amount of data. I think when a lot of

1133
01:08:43,320 --> 01:08:45,599
Speaker 1: hunters look at they've got all these pictures, they've got

1134
01:08:45,640 --> 01:08:47,880
Speaker 1: all these observations, they've seen all these different pieces of

1135
01:08:47,880 --> 01:08:51,559
Speaker 1: a sign. And I think, personally, I've felt this at times.

1136
01:08:51,600 --> 01:08:55,559
Speaker 1: There's information overload, and because you're so overwhelmed, you then

1137
01:08:55,600 --> 01:08:59,040
Speaker 1: don't do anything smart with that data. Um when really

1138
01:08:59,080 --> 01:09:02,160
Speaker 1: you need to narrow it down, take a look at

1139
01:09:02,160 --> 01:09:04,639
Speaker 1: it smartly, find out where that one piece of data

1140
01:09:04,680 --> 01:09:07,200
Speaker 1: that you can take action on is, and then focus

1141
01:09:07,200 --> 01:09:11,080
Speaker 1: your efforts there. Yeah, it doesn't It doesn't matter if

1142
01:09:12,080 --> 01:09:15,840
Speaker 1: of your data you can't capitalize on if you can

1143
01:09:15,880 --> 01:09:20,839
Speaker 1: find that. For me, it's I said all about stacking

1144
01:09:20,840 --> 01:09:25,240
Speaker 1: odds and looking for that one kink in his armor. Now, yeah,

1145
01:09:25,400 --> 01:09:28,960
Speaker 1: I can't. I can't do anything effectively as a matter

1146
01:09:28,960 --> 01:09:30,920
Speaker 1: of fact, if I try to hunt him on that

1147
01:09:31,000 --> 01:09:35,280
Speaker 1: clear cut you know what, without having enough in towel

1148
01:09:35,280 --> 01:09:38,960
Speaker 1: and without and knowing he's hitting that after dark? Why

1149
01:09:39,000 --> 01:09:42,400
Speaker 1: am I hunting there? What? What? What? What? What can

1150
01:09:42,439 --> 01:09:45,759
Speaker 1: I get from that stand? He's not coming until after dark.

1151
01:09:46,760 --> 01:09:48,840
Speaker 1: All I can do is let him know, Hey, dummy,

1152
01:09:48,880 --> 01:09:51,760
Speaker 1: I'm over here. I'm trying to kill you. And I

1153
01:09:51,840 --> 01:09:55,360
Speaker 1: have no doubt in my mind whatsoever that we educate

1154
01:09:55,560 --> 01:09:57,640
Speaker 1: far more dear from the odors we leave in the

1155
01:09:57,680 --> 01:10:00,559
Speaker 1: woods after we're gone than we ever do while we're

1156
01:10:00,560 --> 01:10:04,879
Speaker 1: in it. Now, So look for look for that weakness.

1157
01:10:05,120 --> 01:10:09,240
Speaker 1: And man, I just I cannot stress enough when you

1158
01:10:09,320 --> 01:10:13,280
Speaker 1: go into I have two classifications of stands that I hunt.

1159
01:10:14,200 --> 01:10:16,880
Speaker 1: I have what I consider fund stands, and I have

1160
01:10:17,080 --> 01:10:19,760
Speaker 1: buck stands. Now, I'm not saying I can't kill a

1161
01:10:19,800 --> 01:10:22,360
Speaker 1: buck off of a fund stand, but this is a

1162
01:10:22,400 --> 01:10:24,840
Speaker 1: stand where you know it's real, low impact. I can

1163
01:10:24,920 --> 01:10:26,960
Speaker 1: hunt the snot out of it. Well, I want to

1164
01:10:26,960 --> 01:10:29,639
Speaker 1: go out and shoot a doll or I want to gloat,

1165
01:10:29,720 --> 01:10:31,960
Speaker 1: but the odds aren't in my favor of killing a buck.

1166
01:10:32,000 --> 01:10:33,479
Speaker 1: I'm gonna go to one of these because I'm going

1167
01:10:33,520 --> 01:10:37,280
Speaker 1: to minimize my disturbances, the damage that I do to

1168
01:10:37,320 --> 01:10:41,400
Speaker 1: this place when I go to when I go to

1169
01:10:41,560 --> 01:10:44,960
Speaker 1: hunt a buck stand, I have a reason. I believe

1170
01:10:45,040 --> 01:10:48,200
Speaker 1: I'm going to kill that buck there that day, and

1171
01:10:48,280 --> 01:10:50,280
Speaker 1: I am not going to climb up in that stand

1172
01:10:50,400 --> 01:10:54,120
Speaker 1: until that happens. Now, that might be the phase of

1173
01:10:54,120 --> 01:10:57,280
Speaker 1: the season. It's like, Okay, we're looking at that first

1174
01:10:57,280 --> 01:10:59,760
Speaker 1: week of November. Right now, the bucks are running around

1175
01:10:59,840 --> 01:11:02,639
Speaker 1: like crazy. You know, this is a good funnel between

1176
01:11:02,680 --> 01:11:05,920
Speaker 1: two old betting areas. Man, now's my time to go in.

1177
01:11:06,880 --> 01:11:11,040
Speaker 1: Or maybe I'm getting pictures of him on that food plot.

1178
01:11:12,760 --> 01:11:15,240
Speaker 1: It's a half hour after dark. But I bet you

1179
01:11:15,280 --> 01:11:17,560
Speaker 1: a hundred yards back in the woods at that crossing

1180
01:11:17,960 --> 01:11:20,479
Speaker 1: between that point in that food plot, I can catch him.

1181
01:11:20,840 --> 01:11:24,720
Speaker 1: You give yourself a reason to believe you are going

1182
01:11:24,760 --> 01:11:27,120
Speaker 1: to kill a buck out of your buckstands when you

1183
01:11:27,200 --> 01:11:32,200
Speaker 1: go in, and taking that approach has done amazing things

1184
01:11:32,200 --> 01:11:36,439
Speaker 1: to my success rates. This is this is awesome. I

1185
01:11:36,479 --> 01:11:41,520
Speaker 1: think you have just dropped an absolute wealth of information

1186
01:11:41,520 --> 01:11:44,640
Speaker 1: and wisdom ones Steve, and I personally would love to

1187
01:11:44,720 --> 01:11:46,920
Speaker 1: keep talking with you for probably another two hours, but

1188
01:11:47,600 --> 01:11:51,280
Speaker 1: we are coming up on time here, So Steve, I

1189
01:11:51,320 --> 01:11:53,280
Speaker 1: want to thank you so much for spending the last

1190
01:11:53,320 --> 01:11:56,520
Speaker 1: hour with us and really sharing all this really interesting.

1191
01:11:58,040 --> 01:12:01,599
Speaker 1: Your different opinions and ideas on all this about patterning mature, dear,

1192
01:12:01,600 --> 01:12:03,080
Speaker 1: and I'm going to be sure to be taking notes

1193
01:12:03,120 --> 01:12:04,519
Speaker 1: on this when I listen to it again. I think

1194
01:12:04,520 --> 01:12:06,479
Speaker 1: a lot of our listeners have to, So thank you,

1195
01:12:06,520 --> 01:12:10,519
Speaker 1: Steve for your time. Oh my, absolutely my pleasure once.

1196
01:12:10,560 --> 01:12:13,599
Speaker 1: I mean, if anybody needs to be thanking anybody, it's

1197
01:12:13,680 --> 01:12:18,160
Speaker 1: me thanking you and your listeners height because you guys

1198
01:12:19,200 --> 01:12:24,000
Speaker 1: read the make gazines I right for because you've accidentally

1199
01:12:24,040 --> 01:12:26,559
Speaker 1: watched one of the tips I've given. Because you want

1200
01:12:26,600 --> 01:12:29,400
Speaker 1: to say, I get to live my dream job, and

1201
01:12:29,479 --> 01:12:36,120
Speaker 1: I could not possibly do it without all you people. Impossible,

1202
01:12:36,320 --> 01:12:40,719
Speaker 1: and I will forever be grateful for that. So trust

1203
01:12:40,760 --> 01:12:42,920
Speaker 1: me when I say it's the least I can do

1204
01:12:42,960 --> 01:12:47,200
Speaker 1: in my absolute pleasure. Well, it's the same goes both ways, Stephen,

1205
01:12:47,280 --> 01:12:49,519
Speaker 1: and good luck this season, and hopefully we can hear

1206
01:12:49,520 --> 01:12:51,959
Speaker 1: from you again soon later down the road on the podcast,

1207
01:12:52,000 --> 01:12:55,679
Speaker 1: and we'll be hearing about your success. Is fall sounds good?

1208
01:12:55,880 --> 01:12:57,879
Speaker 1: Make sure you send me some pictures of the slobs

1209
01:12:57,880 --> 01:13:00,240
Speaker 1: you kill this year. That sounds a good plan. We'll

1210
01:13:00,280 --> 01:13:06,639
Speaker 1: talk to you then, Steve, alright, sounds good. Thanks bye bye. Well.

1211
01:13:07,000 --> 01:13:09,439
Speaker 1: I don't know about you, but my mind is racing

1212
01:13:09,479 --> 01:13:11,559
Speaker 1: a little bit right now. There was so much great

1213
01:13:11,560 --> 01:13:14,120
Speaker 1: information packed in that last hour. Now we're just going

1214
01:13:14,200 --> 01:13:16,160
Speaker 1: to figure out a way to store all up and remember.

1215
01:13:16,800 --> 01:13:19,559
Speaker 1: But I hope that you guys found this episode equally

1216
01:13:19,560 --> 01:13:22,400
Speaker 1: as helpful too, as always, if you did, if you

1217
01:13:22,479 --> 01:13:24,240
Speaker 1: find the time, it would be great. If you leave

1218
01:13:24,280 --> 01:13:27,600
Speaker 1: us a rating review on iTunes, it would be greatly appreciated.

1219
01:13:27,960 --> 01:13:30,160
Speaker 1: Speaking of appreciation, would of course like to thank our

1220
01:13:30,160 --> 01:13:32,880
Speaker 1: partners to help make this show possible. Big thanks to

1221
01:13:32,960 --> 01:13:37,599
Speaker 1: Sick Gear, Trophy, Ridge Bear Archery, Redneck Blinds, Carbon Express Arrows,

1222
01:13:37,760 --> 01:13:41,400
Speaker 1: Hunt Soft Lacrosse Boots, Big and J Long Range Attractants,

1223
01:13:41,439 --> 01:13:44,800
Speaker 1: and the White Tail Institute of North America. Finally, be

1224
01:13:44,880 --> 01:13:48,280
Speaker 1: sure to visit wird hunt dot com slash episode to

1225
01:13:48,360 --> 01:13:51,719
Speaker 1: view the show notes and links from today's episode that said,

1226
01:13:52,000 --> 01:13:54,160
Speaker 1: thank you so much for being here with us today

1227
01:13:54,200 --> 01:13:57,880
Speaker 1: on the Wired Hunt Podcast. Until next week, Stay weird

1228
01:13:58,000 --> 01:14:09,519
Speaker 1: Hunt stup.