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Speaker 1: Welcome to the solid verbal hell that for me. I'm

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Speaker 1: a man.

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Speaker 2: I'm for I've heard so many players say, well, I

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Speaker 2: want to be happy.

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Speaker 1: You want to be happy for a day? Eat a steak?

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Speaker 1: Is that? Woo whoo? And them and tie Dan Rubinstein,

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Speaker 1: it is time to do upset brackets part dumo. How

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Speaker 1: are you? I'm good? Ty? Are you a cottage cheese guy? No? No, no,

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Speaker 1: were you ever? No? No, no no.

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Speaker 2: I think I might have been when I was a kid.

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Speaker 2: I don't think I am now, but you know what,

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Speaker 2: I'm willing to give it another shot.

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Speaker 1: How does one become a cottage cheese guy?

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Speaker 2: I think you eat cottage cheese and you say I

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Speaker 2: like this, I'm a cottage cheese guy.

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Speaker 1: Do you know how cottage cheese is made?

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Speaker 2: I have.

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Speaker 1: I'm assuming it's made in a very nice cottage, but

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Speaker 1: otherwise no idea.

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Speaker 2: I don't think it's in reference to the building, the

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Speaker 2: structure in which it's made. Cottage cheese is made. Somebody

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Speaker 2: will be more in tune with this than I am.

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Speaker 2: But my knowledge of it is you have to add

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Speaker 2: an acid to milk and it curdles, okay, or heated

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Speaker 2: milk probably, and so I think it's either like lemon

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Speaker 2: juice or vinegar or something, and that separates and curdles

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Speaker 2: curds and way. You know, you've heard that phrasing, and

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Speaker 2: then you cool it down, maybe you salt it a

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Speaker 2: little bit and vollaye of cottage cheese. When we look

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Speaker 2: at the upsets that we're looking at today or upsets

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Speaker 2: in general, I now I'm thinking about cottage cheese a

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Speaker 2: little bit because even though it is heartbreaking, even though

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Speaker 2: if your team gets upset by a far lesser team

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Speaker 2: or in a horrible moment, sometimes it is the change

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Speaker 2: that you so desperately crave, whether it's your coach with

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Speaker 2: a seventy five million dollar buyout, you know, really starting

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Speaker 2: to feel the heat. Although I don't think Jimbo was

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Speaker 2: fired in the after the twenty two season, in the

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Speaker 2: twenty three season, correct, that's correct, But it starts that

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Speaker 2: that cottage cheese, you know, acid process. It was like, oh,

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Speaker 2: there's something so wrong right now that we lost to

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Speaker 2: this team giving up seventy points, and it can be

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Speaker 2: that catalyst for chain tie. So what I want to

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Speaker 2: do is spin this in a positive way, and as

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Speaker 2: we look at these upsets, did it help to bring

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Speaker 2: about a new coach, a new system, a new quarterback,

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Speaker 2: a new something with this team that we can spin

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Speaker 2: upsets positively. Sometimes sometimes you can't. I never would have

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Speaker 2: taken this in the Cottage Cheese direction. I gotta be

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Speaker 2: honest with you, Dan, How'd I do?

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Speaker 1: Though?

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Speaker 2: Did I bring it home?

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Speaker 1: You sold it? No? No, you always sell kind of

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Speaker 1: these high concepts. I like it. Thank you. I like it.

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Speaker 1: Let us know selid Verbo at gmail dot com your

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Speaker 1: thoughts takes opinions on Cottage Cheese as well as Part

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Speaker 1: two of the upset bracket we're going to get into today.

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Speaker 1: Go back and listen to part one that dropped on

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Speaker 1: Thursday's Part DUA, where we're going to go through twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty three and twenty twenty two, So the victors from

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty four and twenty twenty one that are going

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Speaker 1: to be playing against each other as we get a

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Speaker 1: little bit deeper into this episode. It's the Michigan upset

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Speaker 1: of Ohio State, which we happened back in November of

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Speaker 1: this past season, and then on top of it, if

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Speaker 1: we go back twenty one, it is the Kansas fifty

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Speaker 1: seven Texas fifty six upset which occurred late in the season.

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Speaker 1: Both teams were pretty bad. Kansas was way worse. But

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Speaker 1: you can go and listen to our rationale for going

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Speaker 1: through and picking those two to come out on that

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Speaker 1: side of the bracket. Dan was steering the ship last episode.

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Speaker 1: I'm going to steer it in this one because I've

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Speaker 1: got twenty three and twenty two right. Absolutely, we did

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Speaker 1: start getting some commentary from the verballerhood, people weighing in

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Speaker 1: some games that we did not bring up, some other

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Speaker 1: games that we did. People had a range of opinions

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Speaker 1: on it. So keep it coming. We appreciate it. Drop

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Speaker 1: the comments down below if you can, if you're listening

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Speaker 1: to this episode, if you're watching this episode out on

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Speaker 1: YouTube wherever, you can drop comments. Of course, the email

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Speaker 1: is out there social media as well. Hit fallow, hit

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Speaker 1: subscribe if you're new here. I think that goes without saying,

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Speaker 1: but love to have you with us the rest of

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Speaker 1: the way here in the offseason, and of course as

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Speaker 1: things start to build towards what is ahead in twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty five. Dan absolutely, yes, shall we dance? I'm ready?

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Speaker 1: It is March madness. We're recording this a little bit

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Speaker 1: ahead of time on Friday, I can tell you my

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Speaker 1: Thursday bracket is already busted. I already lost two entries

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Speaker 1: in the AFROC egin Body survivorpool. I went on our

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Speaker 1: bonus episode. I talked about how I was taking Louisville

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Speaker 1: and by survivor pick. I just wanted to get one

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Speaker 1: out of the way right away. Lo and behold I

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Speaker 1: did because they lost. They got hammered against Creighton.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I think I picked Clemson to beat McNeese, which

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Speaker 2: is an absolute just disaster on my part because I

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Speaker 2: love I don't know if you saw the video of

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Speaker 2: the McNeese state equipment manager leading the team out the

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Speaker 2: best credible and I didn't go with the vibes from that,

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Speaker 2: and I'm kicking myself.

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Speaker 1: I also picked Clemson another one of my entries, so

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Speaker 1: they're out as well. I got the Zags left, I

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Speaker 1: got Purdue left. But otherwise yeah, down too tough man.

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Speaker 2: I feel so bad for somebody who follows no college

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Speaker 2: basketball getting college basketball picks wrong.

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Speaker 1: Oh well, So here is again the format of this

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Speaker 1: Dan Rubinstein. We went through each of the last four

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Speaker 1: college football seasons. We picked out four upsets for each

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Speaker 1: calendar year. We put them in a bracket because brackets

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Speaker 1: are sort of in vogue at the moment. And now

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Speaker 1: we're talking through which upsets we think should move on

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Speaker 1: to face one another and then move on into our

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Speaker 1: final four. Agree, let's go back to twenty twenty three.

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Speaker 1: Do what a year I got four upsets here on

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Speaker 1: the list? Or are you ready? I'm ready? My number

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Speaker 1: one seed is Colorado forty five TCU forty two.

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Speaker 2: Okay, I disagree with that seeding.

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Speaker 1: Continue. My number two seed is New Mexico State thirty one,

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Speaker 1: Auburn ten. Okay. My number three seed is Virginia thirty one,

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Speaker 1: North Carolina twenty seven.

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Speaker 2: It's a good one.

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Speaker 1: And my four seed I had hard time fine in

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Speaker 1: a four seed. My four seed is Duke twenty eight,

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Speaker 1: Clemson seven.

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Speaker 2: So here is my issue with the seeding of number one,

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Speaker 2: not that it was an upset. Necessarily, when you have

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Speaker 2: a week one upset, I think there needs to be

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Speaker 2: more to it other than just this team was favored

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Speaker 2: by a bunch and lost because you don't fully know

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Speaker 2: what these programs are. Like app State as a very

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Speaker 2: good FCS team way back when beating Michigan in Week

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Speaker 2: one because of program size absolutely was an upset, even

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Speaker 2: though that year's Michigan team wasn't amazing. As it turns out,

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Speaker 2: the Week one upset where you don't know what Colorado

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Speaker 2: is going to be and you don't know what tc

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Speaker 2: was going to be. You knew Colorado was bad for

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Speaker 2: years leading up to it, and you knew TCU had

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Speaker 2: gone to the National Championship.

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Speaker 1: But one seed Week one, that's a one seed for me.

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Speaker 1: That's a one seed for me. And I can tell

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Speaker 1: you why. I can tell you why. There was so much,

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Speaker 1: so much anticipation for this game. So it was Dion's

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Speaker 1: first game, right, There was so much anticipation. Not only that,

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Speaker 1: but TCU was coming off in appearance in the National

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Speaker 1: Championship game.

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Speaker 2: They lost, They got to look, they lost a ton

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Speaker 2: of guys, lost.

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Speaker 1: A ton of guys. It was certainly not the same

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Speaker 1: TCU team. But what I remember, I think most fondly

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Speaker 1: from that Colorado game was the fact that as the

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Speaker 1: game war on, it was clear it was going to

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Speaker 1: be a fun game if you were watching it in

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Speaker 1: the moment. But as the game war on, the text

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Speaker 1: messages started coming in from people that I hadn't talked

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Speaker 1: to in forever, people wondering, what is what's the deal

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Speaker 1: with Colorado's Colorado going to be good this year? Dion

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Speaker 1: did the Dion experiment work. I think Dion and his

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Speaker 1: ability to kick up a bunch of dust, not just

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Speaker 1: when he got there and taken on all these transfers

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Speaker 1: and some of the comments that he made, but just

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Speaker 1: as the game was going on, people were kind of

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Speaker 1: opening their eyes to the fact that, oh, totally, this

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Speaker 1: could be a big story. So it wasn't so much

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Speaker 1: the power of the upset here as it was what

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Speaker 1: this did to the narrative moving forward.

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Speaker 2: But this isn't a narrative bracket.

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Speaker 1: It is for me maybe okay, maybe you're you're speak

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Speaker 1: for yourself, my friend.

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Speaker 2: That's your angle. Okay, what would you have put one

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Speaker 2: of these four New Mexico State Auburn even though it

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Speaker 2: wasn't a good Auburn team necessarily, I don't know what

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Speaker 2: the line going in was, and New Mexico State had

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Speaker 2: a good team that year. It's just a program size thing,

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Speaker 2: I believe it was. And the fact that this was

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Speaker 2: I assume a bye game of some kind, so paying

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Speaker 2: for a win and losing asual icy little flavor to it.

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Speaker 1: Twenty five and a half I have written down to

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Speaker 1: some point spread. I'd have to fact check that later

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Speaker 1: on in the season.

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Speaker 2: This is like a November sec By game special November eighteenth.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, this was a November November eighteenth, all right, So

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Speaker 1: let's let's start with this first one then and we

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Speaker 1: can go into the New Mexico State game. But Colorado

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Speaker 1: forty five TCU forty two against the number four seed

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Speaker 1: Duke twenty eight Clemson seven. I struggled with where to

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Speaker 1: put the Clemson loss here, and the reason for that

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Speaker 1: is Duke actually ended up being a pretty good team. Correct,

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Speaker 1: Duke ended up being pretty good, And this was kind

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Speaker 1: of Mike Elko's swan song with Duke. Remember they almost

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Speaker 1: went on to beat Notre Dame. This was Riley Leonard.

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Speaker 1: This was Duke with a pretty good defense, having what

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Speaker 1: amounted to a pretty good season. They went eight and five,

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Speaker 1: went to I've got written down the Birmingham Bowl. I mean,

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Speaker 1: it was just a good season. They had injuries that

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Speaker 1: they had to contend with, obviously with Riley Leonard, but

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Speaker 1: it was a good season and ultimately it's what got

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Speaker 1: Mike Elko the job down at A and M. Clemson

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Speaker 1: went on to I guess a Gator Bowl victory over Kentucky.

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Speaker 1: It was a nine to four season for them. This

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Speaker 1: was also the first game of the year. Much like

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Speaker 1: the Colorado TCU game, this was a Week one thing.

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Speaker 1: This was Duke coming off of I think a pretty

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Speaker 1: good season the year prior, but this was Clemson as well,

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Speaker 1: coming off of an ACC championship season. They went gone

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Speaker 1: eleven to three the year prior, favored healthily eleven and

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Speaker 1: a half points coming into this one. What I take

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Speaker 1: away from this one is that Duke sort of dominated

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Speaker 1: him sort of sort of.

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Speaker 2: I think Clemson, if I remember correctly, had like a

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Speaker 2: crazy amount of red zone struggles in this one.

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Speaker 1: This was Riley Leonard rushing for a long touchdown. This

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Speaker 1: was Duke playing defense, holding Clemson the seven points. This

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Speaker 1: was Dabbo after the game calling it an incredible disappointment.

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Speaker 1: And furthermore, this was Duke's first win over a top

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Speaker 1: ten team since nineteen eighty nine. Damn great job. This

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Speaker 1: is a big deal for Duke. This game was a

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Speaker 1: big deal, you know, I think we know now as

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Speaker 1: we look back. It wasn't exactly a top fifteen caliber duke.

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Speaker 1: But it was a very very solid program that again

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Speaker 1: helped get Elco that job at A and M What

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Speaker 1: what did Duke finish the season? Ranks? I don't believe.

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Speaker 1: So they have five losses.

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Speaker 2: Twenty twenty twenty. This is the twenty two, twenty three Dukes.

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Speaker 1: Twenty twenty three.

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Speaker 2: Okay, yeah, that's right. They're twenty twenty two team won nine.

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Speaker 1: They were nine in four and twenty twenty two. Yeah, okay,

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Speaker 1: fair enough, yep. But it was still a good team.

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Speaker 1: They were plucky, they had the defense, and again it

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Speaker 1: was I think the kind of case study on Mike

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Speaker 1: Elko as a coach being able to get a lot

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Speaker 1: out of the parts, right, the some being better than

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Speaker 1: the parts in many cases. They and a couple contributors

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Speaker 1: who may be transferred after the season.

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Speaker 2: Arguably even even bigger win the next week two for Duke,

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Speaker 2: that's right over Lafayette.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Fafayette, of course. But for me, the one that

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Speaker 1: goes through is Colorado forty two, forty five over TCU

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Speaker 1: forty two. This was such a monumental moment to start

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Speaker 1: off the twenty three season. Now, one of the interesting

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Speaker 1: things about the twenty three season. If you go back

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Speaker 1: and look at it, where were the upsets. There weren't

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Speaker 1: a whole lot of these monster upsets in twenty twenty three.

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Speaker 1: For my money, this is the one that kind of

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Speaker 1: got us started down the path of where we are now,

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Speaker 1: where the Dionne story is still a very big deal.

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Speaker 1: They had a good season this year, better than the

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Speaker 1: year before. They showed improvement. We're going to see what

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Speaker 1: happens obviously a little bit later on this year when

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Speaker 1: they kick things off again. But this was kind of

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Speaker 1: the start of the hype man.

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Speaker 2: But it was also you know the in retrospect a

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Speaker 2: four and eighteen beating a seven to five team to

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Speaker 2: open up the season, that it's not crazy in a vacuum,

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Speaker 2: Colorado want to shootout. Neither one of these teams could

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Speaker 2: really stop each other, especially in the second half. TCU

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Speaker 2: was starting over at a number of huge positions on

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Speaker 2: both sides of the ball. We didn't have a concept

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Speaker 2: at all for what Colorado was or wasn't. So you're

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Speaker 2: absolutely right that this launched a thousand hype ships.

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Speaker 1: But but yeah, I remember talking to you in the

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Speaker 1: moment right after this game, in the moment this was

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Speaker 1: an enormous college football story.

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Speaker 2: And you have to factor in the amount of doubt

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Speaker 2: there was about Deon Sanders and his ability at Colorado

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Speaker 2: to completely overhaul the roster and win games. Now, everybody

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Speaker 2: knew Travis Hunter was good, everybody most people figured Shador

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Speaker 2: Sanders would be good, but along the lines, there was

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Speaker 2: a ton of doubt that this team could play winning football.

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Speaker 2: And they immediately came out and beat the Big Twelve,

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Speaker 2: the raining Big Twelve runners up right, because HECU lost

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Speaker 2: to Kansas State in the championship game and beat Michigan

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Speaker 2: and lost to Georgia handily in the National Championship game. That,

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Speaker 2: like Colorado was not built to hang with a program

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Speaker 2: that just achieved those types of things.

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Speaker 1: And so there was a.

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Speaker 2: Good amount of doubt given their schedule, given their opponents

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Speaker 2: that they were playing, you know, Kayleb Williams and playing

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Speaker 2: Oregon like it was just going to be.

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Speaker 1: A tough road.

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Speaker 2: There was a lot of doubt about Colorado heading into

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Speaker 2: the year, and they immediately win a game in front

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Speaker 2: of I don't know what the ratings for this game,

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Speaker 2: where I assume it was somewhere around ten million people watching.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, TCU was ranked seventeenth coming into this one. Like

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Speaker 1: we said a couple times now, they played for the

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Speaker 1: title of the year before. And there was also I

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Speaker 1: think a fair amount of of a fair amount of

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Speaker 1: skepticism with regard to Shardoor Travis Hunter stepping up and

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Speaker 1: playing at the FBS level. Now both were recruited, Travis

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Speaker 1: Hunter was the number one overall. Lot hold on, but

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Speaker 1: there is a caveat here.

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Speaker 2: Okay, but I think your first part's wrong.

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Speaker 1: What's my first part?

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Speaker 2: That there was doubt about Travis Hunter playing at the

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Speaker 2: power of Conference level.

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Speaker 1: Here is what I'm trying to say. I'm not saying

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Speaker 1: there was doubt about him playing at this level. There

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Speaker 1: was doubt about would they hit the ground running the

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Speaker 1: team that they have put around them collectively, collectively, and

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Speaker 1: then secondly, how much could they realistically rely on these

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Speaker 1: pieces order to get the job done. In this one,

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Speaker 1: Travis Hunter came out of the gates pretty hot. Eleven catches,

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Speaker 1: one hundred and nineteen yards, obviously played both ways. Chador

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Speaker 1: threw for five ten and four touchdowns. It was clear

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Speaker 1: these guys came out ballfire. They only added, i think

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Speaker 1: to the are of what was Colorado in year one,

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Speaker 1: now Colorado went four and eight. Like you said, this

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Speaker 1: didn't end up being a good team. There were a

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Speaker 1: lot of things they did poorly. Took a big step

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Speaker 1: forward this year. I'm not going to rehash that again.

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Speaker 2: There was doubt by the way Travis Hunter about his

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Speaker 2: ability to hold up playing both ways. Oh, absolutely that

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Speaker 2: you're right about.

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Speaker 1: That was a story the whole way through. So this

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Speaker 1: was just a lot of newness I think associated with

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Speaker 1: Colorado that made it a thing. And I know I'm

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Speaker 1: not wrong because I remember you and I talked about

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Speaker 1: on the podcast. It wasn't just the text messages that

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Speaker 1: we were getting throughout the course of the game from

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Speaker 1: people that we didn't know, or not that we didn't know,

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Speaker 1: but that we hadn't talked to you in a while

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Speaker 1: in some cases that we didn't know I guess. But

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Speaker 1: also like our discorder, I remember our discord averbawlers dot

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Speaker 1: Com was on fire. This is a very very big deal.

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Speaker 1: So for me, this goes through. For me, I just

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Speaker 1: think what this did from a narrative perspective. Granted we're

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Speaker 1: not talking about top ten caliber teams in twenty twenty three,

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Speaker 1: but just this singular moment that we had was so

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Speaker 1: meaningful and it is still kind of with us. I

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Speaker 1: got to put this one through.

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Speaker 2: So this one over which Duke Clemson over Duke Clemson. Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 2: Douke Clemson was either on a was it a Sunday

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Speaker 2: night or a Monday night?

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Speaker 1: I want to say it was a Sunday night game. Okay,

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Speaker 1: it was the Sunday Monday, that's for sure.

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Speaker 2: So the really the great thing that that game had

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Speaker 2: going for it was it was the only show in

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Speaker 2: town that night.

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Speaker 1: So okay, the Colorado game is on September the second.

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Speaker 1: I remember that game fondly a Saturday. This one was

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Speaker 1: on the Duke Clemson game was September the fourth, so

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Speaker 1: it must have been on.

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Speaker 2: Monday, Monday night, so Labor Day night. So in terms

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Speaker 2: of vibes about the upset specifically, Douke Clemson was very

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Speaker 2: strong because nobody was watching, you know, a Pac twelve game,

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Speaker 2: recip peace, nobody was watching a Big twelve game, nobody's

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Speaker 2: watching a Big ten game.

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Speaker 1: Whatever.

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Speaker 2: This was the show, and so the upset became more pronounced.

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Speaker 2: There is a certain grouping of people of college football,

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Speaker 2: people who kind of enjoy seeing Dabbah get run through

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Speaker 2: it a little bit, and so that was fun for

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Speaker 2: a select group of people. And Duke is like this

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Speaker 2: just like overlooked basketball school that I don't think anybody

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Speaker 2: feels anything strong about Duke football. And they come out

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Speaker 2: and they play great defense, and they pull off the upset,

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Speaker 2: getting stops in the red zone and you know, not

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Speaker 2: a huge stadium, not any household names on the roster,

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Speaker 2: but they get it done. You know, Clemson has these

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Speaker 2: blue chip guys on both sides of the ball, and

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Speaker 2: Duke just was better. They made more plays when it counted.

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Speaker 2: And so I almost feel like because even though this

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Speaker 2: Duke team was what'd you say, like seven and five.

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Speaker 1: This is a yeah, they won the ballgame to go

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Speaker 1: eight and five, but they were a seven to five team.

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Speaker 2: That they were a decent but not great ACC team.

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Speaker 2: Clemson finished above them in the ACC standings. Clemson's this

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Speaker 2: recent power there. To me, it's more of a classic

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Speaker 2: upset Duke over Clemson. I would agree with that, and

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Speaker 2: so I might in the spirit of how I'm viewing

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Speaker 2: this bracket as upset bracket, I would put it through.

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Speaker 2: But this is your side of the bracket to decide

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Speaker 2: I'm putting Colorado through point taken. Let's talk about the

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Speaker 2: other matchup though, because I think these are maybe a

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Speaker 2: little bit more conversation worthy with respect to upsets. The

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Speaker 2: New Mexico State Auburn game was mind blowing. Okay, this

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Speaker 2: is a good New Mexico State team that went on

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Speaker 2: to finish with ten wins. Yes, but they were not

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Speaker 2: ranked coming into this one, and they were a twenty

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Speaker 2: five and a half point dog coming into this one

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Speaker 2: against Auburn.

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Speaker 1: This is an Auburn team that was Bowl eligible. They

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Speaker 1: were six and four, they were coming off a win,

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Speaker 1: they were playing at home.

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Speaker 2: Dan, Yes, and by the way, was a bye game.

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Speaker 2: One point eight five million dollars is the figure that

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Speaker 2: Auburn paid to New Mexico State. Do you have a

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Speaker 2: guess a range of where you think Jerry Kill's salary

389
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Speaker 2: was in twenty twenty three for New Mexico State, Like,

390
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Speaker 2: if you just had to throw out a number.

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Speaker 1: Seven hundred and sixty eight thousand dollars, you're pretty close.

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Speaker 1: It's listed at six hundred k. Okay, so triple the

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Speaker 1: amount of Jerry Kill's salary was paid to New Mexico

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Speaker 1: State to beat Auburn. The final score was thirty one

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Speaker 1: to ten. And what I think I remember most of

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Speaker 1: this game is that it was kind of a dominant

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Speaker 1: effort for New Mexico State. Ran right through them. They

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Speaker 1: ran through them. This was Diego Pavia. Two hundred and

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Speaker 1: one passing yards and three touchdowns. As a collective, they

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Speaker 1: out gained Auburn by two hundred yards. There were no

401
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Speaker 1: turnovers in this game, so you're not going to point

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Speaker 1: to this one look back and say, oh, there was

403
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Speaker 1: a Fluke moment that led to thirty one to ten.

404
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Speaker 1: Is thirty one to ten. Yeah, so this is a

405
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Speaker 1: good New Mexico State team. Interestingly about New Mexico State,

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Speaker 1: they finished with the record of ten and five. They

407
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Speaker 1: had an extra game in there because they played Hawaii

408
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Speaker 1: on the road. They went to the Conference USA title game.

409
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Speaker 1: They ended up losing to Liberty. Then they lost in

410
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Speaker 1: New Mexico Bowl to Fresno, and Auburn ended up six

411
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Speaker 1: and seven. They went to a bowl game. They lost

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Speaker 1: that bowl game to Maryland. But the jokes that followed

413
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Speaker 1: this game in Hugh Freeze's first season were pretty great

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Speaker 1: on the internet, not if you're an Auburn fan, but

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Speaker 1: for the rest of us. The jokes that came along

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Speaker 1: with losing to New Mexico State. Now, at that point

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Speaker 1: in time, I think the legend of Diego Pavia was

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Speaker 1: just starting to take for him. Right, we didn't know

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Speaker 1: that Diego Pavia was this giant killer. I think we

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Speaker 1: came to know that a lot more now this past season,

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Speaker 1: New Mexico State beating Auburn in Jordan Hare was something

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Speaker 1: else her. Yeah, you said it would have been your

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Speaker 1: number one seed. I understand the logic behind that.

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Speaker 2: Well, and well, here's the other thing you need to remember.

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Speaker 2: You must remember this, which is the name of a podcast.

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Speaker 2: I believe Auburn in twenty twenty three got kind of

427
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Speaker 2: creative in big games. They were on the doorstep team

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Speaker 2: that just got shelled by New Mexico State that tied

429
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Speaker 2: described how it happened against both Georgia and Alabama. Crazy, right,

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Speaker 2: So they were tied against Georgia. I forget where that

431
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Speaker 2: game was. I think it was at Auburn, but you

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Speaker 2: can fact check me on that. They ran quarterback stuff

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Speaker 2: a ton against this Georgia defense that couldn't really figure

434
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Speaker 2: out how to stop the run for long stretches in

435
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Speaker 2: this game, couldn't really get their own offense going. I

436
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Speaker 2: think they needed a touchdown with two or three minutes left,

437
00:21:27,800 --> 00:21:31,480
Speaker 2: the long brock Bowers touchdown to beat Auburn. Georgia did,

438
00:21:32,000 --> 00:21:35,280
Speaker 2: and then, as I'm sure Auburn fans don't need to

439
00:21:35,280 --> 00:21:38,880
Speaker 2: be reminded, that Jalen Milroe play fourth and thirty one

440
00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:41,160
Speaker 2: whatever it was, in the corner of the end zone,

441
00:21:41,600 --> 00:21:46,600
Speaker 2: down three or four and complete the pass to win

442
00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:49,960
Speaker 2: the Iron Bowl. So you're talking about the twenty twenty

443
00:21:50,000 --> 00:21:53,199
Speaker 2: three season. So Georgia is right on the edge of

444
00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:57,160
Speaker 2: the playoff and is left out, and Alabama is in

445
00:21:57,200 --> 00:22:00,960
Speaker 2: the playoff and takes the eventual national champs to overtime

446
00:22:01,320 --> 00:22:04,560
Speaker 2: in the Rose Bowl, and New Mexico State beat This

447
00:22:04,680 --> 00:22:08,199
Speaker 2: is very transitivev But New Mexico State beat that team

448
00:22:08,680 --> 00:22:11,159
Speaker 2: and paid one point eight five million dollars for their

449
00:22:11,200 --> 00:22:12,400
Speaker 2: efforts by three.

450
00:22:12,280 --> 00:22:15,720
Speaker 1: Touchdowns insane two of ten on third downs for Auburn

451
00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:19,119
Speaker 1: in this game, and they couldn't really run the ball.

452
00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:21,679
Speaker 2: So that's why that would be my one seed. And

453
00:22:21,720 --> 00:22:24,639
Speaker 2: obviously it's been proven in retrospect that Diego Pavia totally

454
00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:29,479
Speaker 2: capable SEC quarterback, but at the time the feel of

455
00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:34,960
Speaker 2: a bye game going that specific way.

456
00:22:35,080 --> 00:22:39,240
Speaker 1: That would be my number one. So the Virginia win

457
00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:44,720
Speaker 1: over North Carolina in late October October twenty first, twenty

458
00:22:44,760 --> 00:22:48,520
Speaker 1: twenty three, I think is very easy to overlook. I

459
00:22:48,560 --> 00:22:53,080
Speaker 1: agree the ingredients here with this upset, both what it

460
00:22:53,160 --> 00:22:55,680
Speaker 1: meant in the moment and what I think it meant

461
00:22:55,720 --> 00:23:00,399
Speaker 1: moving forward are pretty significant. So the contact does this.

462
00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:05,160
Speaker 1: Virginia won twenty or thirty one to twenty seven over

463
00:23:05,240 --> 00:23:08,680
Speaker 1: North Carolina. In North Carolina, Virginia was a two and

464
00:23:08,760 --> 00:23:13,920
Speaker 1: five team, were't a good team. Meanwhile, Carolina was six

465
00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:16,399
Speaker 1: and oh they were ranked tenth. They were favored by

466
00:23:16,400 --> 00:23:19,280
Speaker 1: twenty three and a half points coming into this one.

467
00:23:19,480 --> 00:23:23,080
Speaker 1: And it's meaningful because after this loss you could make

468
00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:25,320
Speaker 1: a pretty good case. And not only did North Carolina

469
00:23:25,440 --> 00:23:28,399
Speaker 1: season spiral out of control, they ended up losing for

470
00:23:28,600 --> 00:23:30,720
Speaker 1: their next six, including the bowl game the Duke's Male

471
00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:33,720
Speaker 1: Bowl against West Virginia. Yeah, you can also argue that

472
00:23:33,800 --> 00:23:35,200
Speaker 1: this was the beginning of the end for the mac

473
00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:39,760
Speaker 1: Brown era. Ten to agree. Yeah, right, this was a

474
00:23:39,800 --> 00:23:42,919
Speaker 1: game that Carolina shouldn't have lost. It didn't feel like

475
00:23:43,040 --> 00:23:46,720
Speaker 1: Carolina was ever able to pick itself back up after

476
00:23:46,760 --> 00:23:49,600
Speaker 1: this loss. As I said, they sputtered the remainder of

477
00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:53,160
Speaker 1: the season. We know Mac was out after this past

478
00:23:53,200 --> 00:23:56,760
Speaker 1: campaign in twenty four. Yeah, you can make a pretty

479
00:23:56,800 --> 00:23:58,960
Speaker 1: strong case that it started with this one here.

480
00:23:59,080 --> 00:24:00,719
Speaker 2: It's not a bad point. I'm I'm looking at what

481
00:24:00,760 --> 00:24:03,840
Speaker 2: North Carolina season was heading into that moment. So they

482
00:24:03,840 --> 00:24:07,040
Speaker 2: beat South Carolina by a couple touchdowns, app State and

483
00:24:07,119 --> 00:24:12,360
Speaker 2: doubt Minnesota comfortably pit Syracuse, Miami.

484
00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:14,560
Speaker 1: These are not nothing teams.

485
00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:19,080
Speaker 2: No, this is top ten North Carolina and the other

486
00:24:19,119 --> 00:24:21,520
Speaker 2: context that's important. So this is Tony Elliott's first year

487
00:24:21,520 --> 00:24:23,880
Speaker 2: of Virginia, correct, right, So you're willing to give him

488
00:24:23,920 --> 00:24:26,000
Speaker 2: space and wiggle room to figure things out. And it

489
00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:28,440
Speaker 2: was not, as you mentioned, a great season three and nine.

490
00:24:28,440 --> 00:24:30,920
Speaker 2: They don't end up in a bowl game. They quietly

491
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:35,480
Speaker 2: had a sneaky, interesting, effective defense.

492
00:24:35,760 --> 00:24:37,679
Speaker 1: They did. And by the way, we didn't expect that.

493
00:24:37,840 --> 00:24:39,880
Speaker 1: We thought with Tony Elliott coming over that he would

494
00:24:39,920 --> 00:24:43,080
Speaker 1: do some renovation work to the offense and that we

495
00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:45,720
Speaker 1: would see the lift there. We didn't really expect it

496
00:24:45,760 --> 00:24:48,240
Speaker 1: on the defensive side of the ball. But you're right,

497
00:24:48,280 --> 00:24:49,960
Speaker 1: it wasn't a bad Virginia defense at all.

498
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:53,240
Speaker 2: Yeah, and that offensive coordinator for North Carolina is now

499
00:24:53,280 --> 00:24:57,880
Speaker 2: going to be running things at Michigan. Michigan the offense

500
00:24:57,920 --> 00:25:01,040
Speaker 2: for Virginia was Atroci that season.

501
00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:02,640
Speaker 1: This is Tony Musket in this game.

502
00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:05,000
Speaker 2: I believe, Okay, it's a Tony Musket, so it's not

503
00:25:05,280 --> 00:25:07,960
Speaker 2: other Tony in Calandra finish one hundred and twenty fourth

504
00:25:08,040 --> 00:25:11,280
Speaker 2: in points per drive minus garbage time on the year.

505
00:25:11,560 --> 00:25:16,679
Speaker 2: So in a sea of many ineffective acc offenses, the

506
00:25:16,720 --> 00:25:21,240
Speaker 2: biggest wave belonged to those. Yeah, not a good Virginia

507
00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:23,199
Speaker 2: team and pulled it off. I don't know if they

508
00:25:23,200 --> 00:25:25,280
Speaker 2: were overlooked. I don't know if this was a sandwich game.

509
00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:27,000
Speaker 2: You're can have the schedule in front of you. But

510
00:25:28,680 --> 00:25:32,440
Speaker 2: incredible moment for Virginia and they lost to North Carolina

511
00:25:32,480 --> 00:25:35,160
Speaker 2: loses to Georgia Tech in a shootout the following week

512
00:25:35,200 --> 00:25:36,520
Speaker 2: in Bobby Dot Yeah.

513
00:25:36,600 --> 00:25:40,240
Speaker 1: What I like about the four in this bracket. The

514
00:25:40,320 --> 00:25:46,040
Speaker 1: Colorado win definitely launched Travis hunter Chador to some extent,

515
00:25:46,160 --> 00:25:50,359
Speaker 1: certainly Dion into like legendary status right away. It became

516
00:25:50,680 --> 00:25:53,159
Speaker 1: a big time narrative that is still with us. The

517
00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:56,800
Speaker 1: duke went over Clemson, Like I said, you can make

518
00:25:56,840 --> 00:25:58,520
Speaker 1: a case that got Elcho the job at A and

519
00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:01,199
Speaker 1: M or help get the job right at A and M.

520
00:26:01,720 --> 00:26:06,200
Speaker 1: New Mexico State winning obviously that launched Diego Pavia as

521
00:26:06,280 --> 00:26:09,720
Speaker 1: like this folk hero and Virginia knocking off North Carolina.

522
00:26:10,119 --> 00:26:12,000
Speaker 1: I don't know if it created any kind of legend

523
00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:15,159
Speaker 1: status for Tony Elliott, but it definitely helped get rid

524
00:26:15,200 --> 00:26:18,600
Speaker 1: of Mac Brown. So these are all upsets that had

525
00:26:19,280 --> 00:26:22,480
Speaker 1: longer lasting repercussions. I think New Mexico State goes through,

526
00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:25,040
Speaker 1: but I do feel like we need to shout out

527
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:28,040
Speaker 1: Virginia and what they did here to North Carolina. Yeah.

528
00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:30,240
Speaker 2: The other big thing as I'm watching it back now

529
00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:33,600
Speaker 2: is this game because we mentioned the hail Mary type

530
00:26:33,600 --> 00:26:38,760
Speaker 2: play the long pass in Jacksonville State Florida State correct,

531
00:26:39,119 --> 00:26:42,360
Speaker 2: So one, this is future. What was Drake maypicked two

532
00:26:42,480 --> 00:26:45,240
Speaker 2: second overall something like that. It was a top five pick,

533
00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:48,919
Speaker 2: top three pick for the Patriots. This game ends with

534
00:26:49,040 --> 00:26:52,480
Speaker 2: North Carolina driving to try and win, and he gets

535
00:26:52,560 --> 00:26:55,240
Speaker 2: hit as he's thrown and throws a game seiling interception

536
00:26:55,320 --> 00:26:58,840
Speaker 2: for Virginia. So there is that big moment that seals

537
00:26:58,880 --> 00:27:02,960
Speaker 2: things for Virginia, which I include in like why something

538
00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,280
Speaker 2: feels like an especially meaningful upset.

539
00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:09,440
Speaker 1: So if we're putting Colorado and it's win over TCU

540
00:27:10,200 --> 00:27:12,680
Speaker 1: and New Mexico State and it's win over Auburn through

541
00:27:12,720 --> 00:27:17,840
Speaker 1: to play against one another, Yeah, I think your preference

542
00:27:17,880 --> 00:27:19,600
Speaker 1: is probably gonna be New Mexico State.

543
00:27:19,480 --> 00:27:22,480
Speaker 2: Right, I mean my preference would be New Mexico State

544
00:27:22,520 --> 00:27:25,960
Speaker 2: and Virginia probably to go through.

545
00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:27,760
Speaker 1: Well, they're playing each other, you got to pick one.

546
00:27:28,240 --> 00:27:29,600
Speaker 2: Oh yeah, yeah, you're right, You're right the way you

547
00:27:29,600 --> 00:27:31,880
Speaker 2: see it this okay, Yeah, New Mexico State and Colorado.

548
00:27:32,000 --> 00:27:33,760
Speaker 1: You're going to make the case for New Mexico State.

549
00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:35,919
Speaker 1: I kind of want to make the case for Colorado.

550
00:27:37,240 --> 00:27:39,480
Speaker 2: Well, okay, here you remember what this is again? This

551
00:27:39,600 --> 00:27:42,679
Speaker 2: was mine the things I use the in retrospect in

552
00:27:42,720 --> 00:27:46,040
Speaker 2: the moment program size disparity, was there a big upset

553
00:27:46,080 --> 00:27:49,119
Speaker 2: moment or ten rhythm of an upset? Now, there was

554
00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:51,840
Speaker 2: ten rhythm in Colorado TCU in that it was going

555
00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:54,800
Speaker 2: back and forth like it's a shootout. It's crazy that

556
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:59,399
Speaker 2: this is a highly entertaining game, whatever happens. I just

557
00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:06,760
Speaker 2: the upset was in terms of coach Prime being doubted

558
00:28:07,280 --> 00:28:09,720
Speaker 2: and this Colorado team being such a mystery because of

559
00:28:09,760 --> 00:28:11,119
Speaker 2: their unique construction.

560
00:28:11,480 --> 00:28:13,960
Speaker 1: It's a different kind of upset. If you're trying to

561
00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:19,560
Speaker 1: compare the two, it's structured differently. I give you that, absolutely, and.

562
00:28:20,920 --> 00:28:23,200
Speaker 2: The case against it also includes the fact that there

563
00:28:23,280 --> 00:28:27,920
Speaker 2: was no tape on Colorado at all. Like it's this

564
00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:32,640
Speaker 2: weird cauldron elixir of players who have never played together,

565
00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:35,720
Speaker 2: some of them hyper talented, some of them showing flashes

566
00:28:35,720 --> 00:28:38,720
Speaker 2: at major programs, but really having no concept of what

567
00:28:38,920 --> 00:28:41,719
Speaker 2: the offense or defense was going to look like with

568
00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:44,400
Speaker 2: these guys, So they were just a total mystery team,

569
00:28:44,800 --> 00:28:48,040
Speaker 2: whereas like North Carolina had plenty of tape on Virginia.

570
00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:51,080
Speaker 2: At that point, North Carolina was just a team that

571
00:28:51,240 --> 00:28:53,920
Speaker 2: beat Miami. I want to say it was another kind

572
00:28:53,960 --> 00:28:56,640
Speaker 2: of embarrassing. Miami was up at halftime and North Carolina

573
00:28:56,680 --> 00:28:59,160
Speaker 2: came back and comfortably won that game. Plenty of tape

574
00:28:59,160 --> 00:29:02,400
Speaker 2: on Auburn, plenty of tape on New Mexico State. I

575
00:29:02,440 --> 00:29:04,520
Speaker 2: just don't feel like it's a classic upset. I think

576
00:29:04,560 --> 00:29:09,560
Speaker 2: it's an upset of like proving doubters and haters greatly wrong.

577
00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:13,240
Speaker 1: It's an upset of expectations. Yeah, I think that's right.

578
00:29:14,600 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 1: I am putting Colorado through Dan over New Mexico State.

579
00:29:17,520 --> 00:29:21,160
Speaker 1: I'm putting Colorado through. It was a better game to watch,

580
00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:26,080
Speaker 1: for sure, depends if you are. Yeah. It was a shootout,

581
00:29:26,080 --> 00:29:29,320
Speaker 1: so there were at least more points on both sides

582
00:29:29,400 --> 00:29:31,480
Speaker 1: than ended up being the case in the New Mexico

583
00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:34,960
Speaker 1: State Auburn game, where Auburn only scored ten points. Obviously

584
00:29:35,000 --> 00:29:38,560
Speaker 1: there's a much bigger program disparity, but I just feel like,

585
00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:43,240
Speaker 1: I'm this is a personal anecdote here, that's okay. I

586
00:29:43,320 --> 00:29:48,080
Speaker 1: just remember doing the show after that Colorado win and

587
00:29:48,160 --> 00:29:52,440
Speaker 1: checking social media after that Colorado win, and I remember

588
00:29:52,560 --> 00:29:54,840
Speaker 1: it feeling like the biggest thing that had happened in

589
00:29:54,880 --> 00:29:56,000
Speaker 1: a long time in college.

590
00:29:56,240 --> 00:29:59,240
Speaker 2: I totally agree it was a bigger spectacle than New

591
00:29:59,280 --> 00:30:00,960
Speaker 2: Mexico State Auburn.

592
00:30:00,760 --> 00:30:03,200
Speaker 1: So kind of in the same way that we put

593
00:30:03,240 --> 00:30:09,520
Speaker 1: through the Vandy Alabama game, or almost put through the

594
00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:13,920
Speaker 1: Vandy Alabama game because it ran into a buzzsaw the

595
00:30:14,000 --> 00:30:17,480
Speaker 1: Michigan Ohio State game in our last episode. I just

596
00:30:17,520 --> 00:30:20,640
Speaker 1: feel like this launched so many storylines and gave us

597
00:30:20,640 --> 00:30:22,239
Speaker 1: so much to talk about that I got to put

598
00:30:22,280 --> 00:30:24,520
Speaker 1: it through. I totally agree. I just don't think it's

599
00:30:24,520 --> 00:30:27,080
Speaker 1: an upset. Fair enough, fair enough people can weigh in

600
00:30:27,120 --> 00:30:30,120
Speaker 1: solve reboltgmail dot com. And I want you to begin

601
00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:34,080
Speaker 1: your thought with I'm with Dan on this one. I

602
00:30:34,160 --> 00:30:37,680
Speaker 1: always like seeing that continue. Let's go over to twenty

603
00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:43,680
Speaker 1: twenty two. Then, okay, Number one seed is Marshall twenty six,

604
00:30:43,840 --> 00:30:46,520
Speaker 1: Notre Dame twenty one. Never thought I'd have to talk

605
00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:50,240
Speaker 1: about this game, again, but here we are. Their first

606
00:30:50,320 --> 00:30:54,440
Speaker 1: round opponent is Tulane seventeen, Kansas State ten great one.

607
00:30:55,840 --> 00:30:57,960
Speaker 1: On the other side of the bracket, we've got app

608
00:30:57,960 --> 00:31:02,800
Speaker 1: State seventeen, Texas A and m fourteen, and then the

609
00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:04,680
Speaker 1: three seed. Actually, we've got a bit of a play

610
00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:08,320
Speaker 1: in game here, a South Carolina play in game for

611
00:31:08,400 --> 00:31:12,720
Speaker 1: the rights to play against Appstate, and maybe we can

612
00:31:12,760 --> 00:31:13,280
Speaker 1: start there.

613
00:31:13,840 --> 00:31:15,440
Speaker 2: South Carolina against South Carolina.

614
00:31:16,120 --> 00:31:19,040
Speaker 1: It is South Carolina versus South Carolina. Because in twenty

615
00:31:19,080 --> 00:31:22,600
Speaker 1: twenty two we had back to back games for South

616
00:31:22,640 --> 00:31:26,840
Speaker 1: Carolina that many South Carolina fans consider to be the

617
00:31:26,880 --> 00:31:29,520
Speaker 1: greatest stretch of games maybe in the history of the program.

618
00:31:30,200 --> 00:31:33,760
Speaker 1: Two top ten upsets in back to back weeks. We

619
00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:38,040
Speaker 1: had two playoff teams who in effect had their playoff

620
00:31:38,080 --> 00:31:43,240
Speaker 1: hopes destroyed by South Carolina. I'm talking about Tennessee losing

621
00:31:43,280 --> 00:31:47,200
Speaker 1: on November the nineteenth in Williams Brice Stadium, and then

622
00:31:47,280 --> 00:31:52,880
Speaker 1: the following week Clemson losing at home Immemorial Stadium in

623
00:31:52,920 --> 00:31:58,400
Speaker 1: the Palmetto Bowl, subsequently losing their own rights to the playoff. Okay,

624
00:31:59,160 --> 00:32:02,480
Speaker 1: so we need to decide first and foremost which of

625
00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:04,720
Speaker 1: these two South Carolina upsets we want to put through

626
00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:09,880
Speaker 1: consecutive weeks. This was a South Carolina team ultimately that

627
00:32:10,000 --> 00:32:12,880
Speaker 1: when eight and five went to the Gator Bowl lost.

628
00:32:12,920 --> 00:32:15,480
Speaker 1: I believe Tyler Buckner and Notre Dame in the Gator Bowl.

629
00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:18,840
Speaker 1: But this is the second season for Shane Biemer, and

630
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:21,080
Speaker 1: it was a really good one. It was another season

631
00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:25,000
Speaker 1: in which he defied expectations. It was also Spencer Ratler's

632
00:32:25,000 --> 00:32:28,280
Speaker 1: first season was South Carolina. Remember he got some planted

633
00:32:28,280 --> 00:32:32,160
Speaker 1: at Oklahoma. Caleb Williams took over there, Spencer Ratler transfers

634
00:32:32,720 --> 00:32:37,240
Speaker 1: east to South Carolina. They also had like some actual talent.

635
00:32:37,280 --> 00:32:39,800
Speaker 1: It was Marshaun Lloyd. They had Juice Wells who had

636
00:32:39,840 --> 00:32:42,880
Speaker 1: a good season as wide receiver. Jaheen Bell was on

637
00:32:42,960 --> 00:32:46,440
Speaker 1: this team. Or boy Jordan Birch, yes, of course was

638
00:32:46,480 --> 00:32:50,720
Speaker 1: on South Carolina as well. So the first of these

639
00:32:50,760 --> 00:32:55,120
Speaker 1: two again occurred on November the nineteenth. South Carolina won

640
00:32:55,320 --> 00:32:59,480
Speaker 1: sixty three to thirty eight over Tennessee. Some things that

641
00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:02,880
Speaker 1: consider here is the big favorite, I'm ready or Tennessee

642
00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:05,080
Speaker 1: was a big favorite in this one on the road.

643
00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:07,120
Speaker 1: Favored by twenty two and a half points. They were

644
00:33:07,200 --> 00:33:09,840
Speaker 1: ranked number five. This was the game in which Hendon

645
00:33:09,880 --> 00:33:11,120
Speaker 1: Hooker blew out his ACL.

646
00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:14,800
Speaker 2: It was down eighteen with eleven minutes left. Tennessee lost

647
00:33:14,880 --> 00:33:16,880
Speaker 2: their heis mcallaughery quarterback for the year.

648
00:33:17,280 --> 00:33:19,920
Speaker 1: This was Spencer Rattler throwing for over four hundred yards

649
00:33:19,920 --> 00:33:23,480
Speaker 1: and six touchdowns. Correct they also ran for one fifty

650
00:33:23,520 --> 00:33:26,080
Speaker 1: three and three touchdowns as a team. Juice Wells had

651
00:33:26,120 --> 00:33:29,120
Speaker 1: eleven catches for one to seventy seven into rushing td

652
00:33:29,200 --> 00:33:33,880
Speaker 1: as well. This in effect, was sort of insult to

653
00:33:33,920 --> 00:33:36,840
Speaker 1: injury for Tennessee on its season. Not only did they

654
00:33:36,880 --> 00:33:40,320
Speaker 1: lose in very convincing fashion, but then you lose your

655
00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:45,280
Speaker 1: star quarterback right A bummer A bummer. So Tennessee went on.

656
00:33:45,320 --> 00:33:46,880
Speaker 1: They had a good season. They ended up winning the

657
00:33:46,920 --> 00:33:50,520
Speaker 1: Orange Bowl eleven and two. Ended up playing Clemson, who

658
00:33:50,520 --> 00:33:52,800
Speaker 1: were going to talk about next, but did not go

659
00:33:52,800 --> 00:33:55,600
Speaker 1: to the College Football Playoff doing a large part because

660
00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:56,360
Speaker 1: of this laws.

661
00:33:56,920 --> 00:34:02,080
Speaker 2: So both of these games have very compelling arguments to

662
00:34:02,240 --> 00:34:08,640
Speaker 2: be the bigger deal upset. So going into the Tennessee game,

663
00:34:09,000 --> 00:34:13,680
Speaker 2: South Carolina got absolutely demolished by Florida, crushed. So there

664
00:34:13,800 --> 00:34:17,200
Speaker 2: was no reason, no real reason, I think it was

665
00:34:17,239 --> 00:34:20,760
Speaker 2: thirty eight to six, no real reason for South Carolina

666
00:34:20,800 --> 00:34:23,839
Speaker 2: fans in Williams Brice to feel like, oh, we've got

667
00:34:23,840 --> 00:34:28,520
Speaker 2: a shot against this super explosive Tennessee team. There was

668
00:34:28,560 --> 00:34:30,479
Speaker 2: no truth. And that was the Tennessee team that beat

669
00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:33,719
Speaker 2: Bama in the shootout, right, yep ye, the Scar game.

670
00:34:33,880 --> 00:34:40,240
Speaker 2: So the shock in awe of South Carolina and Spencer

671
00:34:40,360 --> 00:34:44,520
Speaker 2: Rattler going at a good but not great Tennessee defense

672
00:34:44,680 --> 00:34:49,440
Speaker 2: and man handling them, you know, passed around, over under whatever.

673
00:34:49,840 --> 00:34:53,160
Speaker 2: That the crowd was electric because they were as surprised

674
00:34:53,200 --> 00:34:56,080
Speaker 2: as anybody that this was happening. This was also a

675
00:34:56,160 --> 00:34:59,160
Speaker 2: South Carolina team that there was still divisions then that

676
00:34:59,239 --> 00:35:04,520
Speaker 2: also got demolished, absolutely railroaded by Georgia in Week two.

677
00:35:04,960 --> 00:35:08,720
Speaker 2: So there's no reason to think that South Carolina truly

678
00:35:08,800 --> 00:35:11,719
Speaker 2: had what it was going to take. If that's the

679
00:35:11,719 --> 00:35:15,000
Speaker 2: proper way to use English tenses to hang with the

680
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:18,319
Speaker 2: best of the SEC East. There's no reason to think that.

681
00:35:19,320 --> 00:35:24,440
Speaker 2: And yet everything was working. Everything was working. There were

682
00:35:24,480 --> 00:35:28,400
Speaker 2: receivers running open everywhere. Tennessee had no answer. They couldn't

683
00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:31,200
Speaker 2: get to Spencer Rattler. It was just incredible, I believe

684
00:35:31,320 --> 00:35:37,320
Speaker 2: night in Columbia, South Carolina. The case for the Clemson

685
00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:41,600
Speaker 2: game is they lost seven in a row to Clemson,

686
00:35:42,760 --> 00:35:46,600
Speaker 2: hated rival. Obviously, they lost the previous two by a

687
00:35:46,600 --> 00:35:49,600
Speaker 2: combined score. Again fact check me here, sixty eight to three.

688
00:35:49,719 --> 00:35:51,920
Speaker 1: Yeah, not ideal.

689
00:35:52,160 --> 00:35:54,200
Speaker 2: Doesn't feel good to lose two years in a row

690
00:35:54,280 --> 00:35:56,640
Speaker 2: sixty eight to three, especially when it's the team you

691
00:35:56,680 --> 00:35:59,880
Speaker 2: hate most in state. Not only did they beat the

692
00:36:00,239 --> 00:36:03,160
Speaker 2: years Clemson team again, as you mentioned, top ten team,

693
00:36:04,000 --> 00:36:05,680
Speaker 2: they beat him in Clemson.

694
00:36:06,000 --> 00:36:08,439
Speaker 1: They beat him in Clemson, they beat him on the road.

695
00:36:08,680 --> 00:36:12,040
Speaker 1: I think this one is a little bit more impressive

696
00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:12,279
Speaker 1: to me.

697
00:36:12,800 --> 00:36:16,000
Speaker 2: There's that spicy honey that just gives you a little bit,

698
00:36:16,040 --> 00:36:18,360
Speaker 2: that little extra punch at the end of your bite.

699
00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:23,839
Speaker 2: And they did so in a clear not they were

700
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:28,600
Speaker 2: looking past Clemson, but a letdown spot after the emotions

701
00:36:28,640 --> 00:36:31,000
Speaker 2: that were let out after the win over Tennessee.

702
00:36:31,239 --> 00:36:33,120
Speaker 1: I think that's what I find impressive about it. So,

703
00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:35,399
Speaker 1: first off, anytime you win on the road, it's hard

704
00:36:35,400 --> 00:36:37,520
Speaker 1: to do in college football. Doesn't matter if it's a rivalry, games,

705
00:36:37,520 --> 00:36:40,040
Speaker 1: doesn't matter regardless, it's tough to win on the road.

706
00:36:40,040 --> 00:36:42,600
Speaker 1: It just is. Yeah. But not only do they go

707
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:45,319
Speaker 1: on the road a week after, as you said, this

708
00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:48,080
Speaker 1: emotional high of knocking off the number five team in

709
00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:48,960
Speaker 1: the country tennis.

710
00:36:48,800 --> 00:36:50,239
Speaker 2: It's on the road, not terribly far away.

711
00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:53,160
Speaker 1: It's not terribly far away, but still tough to play

712
00:36:53,360 --> 00:36:55,799
Speaker 1: in course any opponent's environment.

713
00:36:55,760 --> 00:36:58,800
Speaker 2: Going to Death Valley. Yeah, to follow up.

714
00:36:58,719 --> 00:37:03,040
Speaker 1: What they did on November the nineteenth with this win

715
00:37:03,280 --> 00:37:07,799
Speaker 1: on November the twenty sixth, seven days later, is incredible.

716
00:37:08,160 --> 00:37:10,960
Speaker 1: And this was a very close game. This is thirty

717
00:37:10,960 --> 00:37:14,839
Speaker 1: one thirty that demands a certain amount of focus, that

718
00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:18,400
Speaker 1: demands a certain amount of emotional energy to get yourself

719
00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:21,640
Speaker 1: back up and to play this one the full way through. Agree.

720
00:37:22,480 --> 00:37:24,560
Speaker 1: They win it on a thirty five yard field goal

721
00:37:24,640 --> 00:37:27,239
Speaker 1: with about ten and a half left from former Notre

722
00:37:27,320 --> 00:37:29,360
Speaker 1: Dame kicker Mitch Jeter, who was done was still a

723
00:37:29,400 --> 00:37:31,440
Speaker 1: South Carolina and a half minutes. Yeah, Yeah, ten a

724
00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:34,239
Speaker 1: half minutes left. Yeah, this is a good Clemson team

725
00:37:34,239 --> 00:37:38,080
Speaker 1: that ended up winning the ACC title. Right, they beat

726
00:37:38,160 --> 00:37:42,560
Speaker 1: North Carolina. They played, as we said, Tennessee in the

727
00:37:42,600 --> 00:37:45,120
Speaker 1: Orange Bowl. Lost that game to Joe Milton in the

728
00:37:45,120 --> 00:37:48,919
Speaker 1: Orange Bowl. But two good teams on back to back

729
00:37:48,960 --> 00:37:51,839
Speaker 1: weeks that South Carolina knocked off here ended both their

730
00:37:51,840 --> 00:37:55,439
Speaker 1: playoff hopes. Again, as I said at the top, many

731
00:37:55,560 --> 00:37:57,759
Speaker 1: regard this as the greatest two game stretch in the

732
00:37:57,800 --> 00:38:00,959
Speaker 1: history of the program, knocking off to top ten teams. Yes,

733
00:38:01,280 --> 00:38:06,080
Speaker 1: I think I go this one. This Clemson win, okay

734
00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:09,360
Speaker 1: over the Tennessee win, and I put that one through

735
00:38:10,160 --> 00:38:12,719
Speaker 1: to square off against the app State, Texas A.

736
00:38:12,680 --> 00:38:17,960
Speaker 2: And M game Clemson. People may say it was a

737
00:38:18,040 --> 00:38:23,120
Speaker 2: DJU game, DJ, you got a bench after this game

738
00:38:23,200 --> 00:38:27,279
Speaker 2: like or he got bench. But during the ACC Championship game,

739
00:38:27,640 --> 00:38:29,280
Speaker 2: did Kate Clubnick come in in relief?

740
00:38:29,719 --> 00:38:32,400
Speaker 1: Please don't. I don't have that at the ready.

741
00:38:32,840 --> 00:38:36,440
Speaker 2: Okay, DJU is not especially good in this game South Carolina.

742
00:38:36,520 --> 00:38:39,239
Speaker 2: For large stretches, they were not especially good in this game.

743
00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:42,160
Speaker 2: Spencer Ratler was they couldn't run the ball at all.

744
00:38:42,200 --> 00:38:45,640
Speaker 2: South Carolina. Will Shipley had a really nice game for Clemson.

745
00:38:46,600 --> 00:38:49,719
Speaker 2: I think it's this one just because almost there is

746
00:38:49,800 --> 00:38:52,959
Speaker 2: such an what did you say, an energy release from

747
00:38:52,960 --> 00:38:56,640
Speaker 2: South Carolina and their ability to take that momentum from

748
00:38:56,680 --> 00:39:00,160
Speaker 2: beating Tennessee and take it on the road to Death Valley.

749
00:39:01,320 --> 00:39:04,359
Speaker 2: So it's it's not an upset in the sense of

750
00:39:05,040 --> 00:39:08,200
Speaker 2: nobody was expecting it. They became suddenly a hot pick

751
00:39:08,239 --> 00:39:10,200
Speaker 2: to win that game because of what they did the

752
00:39:10,200 --> 00:39:12,160
Speaker 2: week before, but even still.

753
00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:14,920
Speaker 1: They were about a fourteen and a half point dog.

754
00:39:16,480 --> 00:39:19,320
Speaker 1: To say it wasn't expected at all, it was still

755
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:20,600
Speaker 1: very much an upset.

756
00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:22,280
Speaker 2: What was the Tennessee line?

757
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:24,880
Speaker 1: If you have that in front of you, The Tennessee

758
00:39:25,000 --> 00:39:28,320
Speaker 1: line was twenty two and a half points in favor

759
00:39:28,320 --> 00:39:28,880
Speaker 1: of Tennessee.

760
00:39:29,480 --> 00:39:32,879
Speaker 2: Oh man, this is really tough for me. I think

761
00:39:32,920 --> 00:39:37,839
Speaker 2: I'm more impressed with the Clemson win, but feel like

762
00:39:37,880 --> 00:39:41,200
Speaker 2: the Tennessee game was a bigger upset because of the

763
00:39:41,239 --> 00:39:44,719
Speaker 2: Tennessee vibes coming in and the South Carolina vibes coming in.

764
00:39:45,200 --> 00:39:46,040
Speaker 2: Does that make sense?

765
00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:49,359
Speaker 1: It does. This is why I did the play in game.

766
00:39:49,400 --> 00:39:51,840
Speaker 1: I couldn't pick. I know, I had a hard time picking.

767
00:39:52,040 --> 00:39:54,520
Speaker 1: How about this since I am picking the winners here

768
00:39:54,520 --> 00:39:59,399
Speaker 1: and since you obviously disagreed with my first Colorado pick. Yeah,

769
00:39:59,440 --> 00:40:03,359
Speaker 1: you get to pick solely the playing game here.

770
00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:05,560
Speaker 2: All right, I'm going to Tennessee. I think that that's

771
00:40:05,600 --> 00:40:09,080
Speaker 2: a bigger spirit of an upset coming off of that

772
00:40:09,239 --> 00:40:11,879
Speaker 2: loss to Florida, where I'm sure people were like, Shane

773
00:40:11,880 --> 00:40:14,439
Speaker 2: Beemer's not the guy. Okay, sjamme, Beemer's not the guy.

774
00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:20,040
Speaker 2: And then to drop sixty on a highly ranked team

775
00:40:20,440 --> 00:40:24,839
Speaker 2: with a Heisman caliber quarterback who had beaten Alabama.

776
00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:27,919
Speaker 1: I think I'm going there. Yeah, all right, So now

777
00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:32,319
Speaker 1: let me ask you this. Okay, do you put this

778
00:40:32,360 --> 00:40:35,839
Speaker 1: one through against app State versus Texas A and M.

779
00:40:36,680 --> 00:40:39,040
Speaker 1: Because I don't. I don't.

780
00:40:40,000 --> 00:40:43,520
Speaker 2: This is great for a couple of reasons. I want

781
00:40:43,560 --> 00:40:46,120
Speaker 2: you to steer this ship, but I want I want

782
00:40:46,120 --> 00:40:48,120
Speaker 2: to make sure I'm able. Of course, I'm able to

783
00:40:48,160 --> 00:40:51,439
Speaker 2: jump in with some of my own thoughts. So tell

784
00:40:51,480 --> 00:40:54,600
Speaker 2: me why you think app State, Texas A and M

785
00:40:55,200 --> 00:40:57,520
Speaker 2: one is just compelling to you as an upset, and

786
00:40:57,640 --> 00:41:02,160
Speaker 2: two is more compelling than South Carolina laying the lumber

787
00:41:02,160 --> 00:41:03,200
Speaker 2: against Tennessee.

788
00:41:03,480 --> 00:41:07,080
Speaker 1: Okay, So first and foremost, I'll use some of your

789
00:41:07,120 --> 00:41:11,840
Speaker 1: own rubric here. Okay, app State well known G five power.

790
00:41:11,960 --> 00:41:14,880
Speaker 1: They've been very good for a good long time. Still

791
00:41:15,120 --> 00:41:19,359
Speaker 1: pretty big talent disparity, at least on paper between app

792
00:41:19,360 --> 00:41:21,560
Speaker 1: State and what they've got on the roster and Texas

793
00:41:21,600 --> 00:41:23,280
Speaker 1: A and M. And I don't care if it's Jimbo

794
00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:26,319
Speaker 1: A and M or A Mike Elco, A and M

795
00:41:26,600 --> 00:41:30,480
Speaker 1: or Dennis FRANCIONI like there should always be a pretty

796
00:41:30,480 --> 00:41:34,160
Speaker 1: big talent disparity between these two schools. Agree. I agree. Okay,

797
00:41:34,200 --> 00:41:36,960
Speaker 1: so we had that. The second thing is it goes

798
00:41:36,960 --> 00:41:40,960
Speaker 1: without saying huge point spread, huge point spread seventeen and

799
00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:42,640
Speaker 1: a half in favor of A and M, who, by

800
00:41:42,640 --> 00:41:45,759
Speaker 1: the way, was playing at home in Kyle Field. This

801
00:41:45,920 --> 00:41:50,359
Speaker 1: was early in the season. They were the number six team,

802
00:41:51,560 --> 00:41:56,000
Speaker 1: and I think on top of it, there was this

803
00:41:56,080 --> 00:42:00,239
Speaker 1: expectation that this might be the year when we would

804
00:42:00,239 --> 00:42:04,440
Speaker 1: see Jimbo turn some stuff around, right, because you look

805
00:42:04,480 --> 00:42:08,040
Speaker 1: at the talent on this team, all right, I already

806
00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:10,320
Speaker 1: called out there was a disparity, But there were names

807
00:42:10,400 --> 00:42:13,799
Speaker 1: dog on this team. There was Haynes King, he was

808
00:42:13,800 --> 00:42:16,919
Speaker 1: the quarterback then for A and M, Devin a Chain,

809
00:42:17,360 --> 00:42:20,960
Speaker 1: Evan Stewart, and Nias Smith out wide. He had done

810
00:42:21,000 --> 00:42:25,440
Speaker 1: a really good job assembling this roster. Right, you consider

811
00:42:25,480 --> 00:42:28,759
Speaker 1: the fact that app State was already zero to one.

812
00:42:28,800 --> 00:42:32,600
Speaker 1: They had lost. That was a crazy overtime game, or

813
00:42:32,600 --> 00:42:34,040
Speaker 1: maybe it didn't go to all the time, but it

814
00:42:34,080 --> 00:42:38,160
Speaker 1: was sixty three sixty one against North Carolina. That was

815
00:42:38,320 --> 00:42:41,279
Speaker 1: in week one. This is in week two, right, So

816
00:42:41,920 --> 00:42:44,319
Speaker 1: I remember talking about this one saying to you, like,

817
00:42:45,680 --> 00:42:48,759
Speaker 1: I mean, we like app stayed as a program, but

818
00:42:49,600 --> 00:42:51,439
Speaker 1: what do they got in the tank after this game?

819
00:42:52,040 --> 00:42:54,239
Speaker 1: Huge letdown moment. Yeah, we don't think they're going to

820
00:42:54,280 --> 00:42:57,600
Speaker 1: play much defense. They just gave up sixty three points.

821
00:42:57,640 --> 00:42:59,600
Speaker 1: So what's going to happen to them now? A week

822
00:42:59,640 --> 00:43:02,800
Speaker 1: after this emotional game against North Carolina, going on the

823
00:43:02,880 --> 00:43:05,560
Speaker 1: road to Kyle Field, the number six team, all this talent,

824
00:43:05,640 --> 00:43:11,560
Speaker 1: Jimbo Fisher out for blood. App State wins what what?

825
00:43:11,800 --> 00:43:13,239
Speaker 1: Seventeen to fourteen? What?

826
00:43:15,280 --> 00:43:17,960
Speaker 2: By the way, added context, app State and a losing effort,

827
00:43:17,960 --> 00:43:22,239
Speaker 2: scored forty points in the fourth quarter against North Carolina. Yeah,

828
00:43:22,400 --> 00:43:25,879
Speaker 2: they were down twenty in the second half. Yeah, so yes,

829
00:43:25,960 --> 00:43:27,600
Speaker 2: a wild rollercoaster.

830
00:43:27,160 --> 00:43:27,600
Speaker 1: Of a game.

831
00:43:28,520 --> 00:43:30,480
Speaker 2: Here's your connective tissue is Chase Brice.

832
00:43:30,520 --> 00:43:35,400
Speaker 1: Obviously Chase Price was a quarterback former. Yeah, so you

833
00:43:35,440 --> 00:43:39,120
Speaker 1: know you would say, well, after that upset or after

834
00:43:39,160 --> 00:43:41,680
Speaker 1: that near upset of North Carolina, after giving up all

835
00:43:41,719 --> 00:43:44,720
Speaker 1: those points and a valiant comeback effort but still falling

836
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:47,400
Speaker 1: a little bit short, it'd be very easy to just

837
00:43:47,480 --> 00:43:49,520
Speaker 1: lose your focus, much like we just described with that

838
00:43:49,600 --> 00:43:52,160
Speaker 1: South Carolina game. Yeah, you know, there's a little bit

839
00:43:52,200 --> 00:43:56,879
Speaker 1: of similarity there. App State dominated, Dude, they dominated. They

840
00:43:56,920 --> 00:43:59,440
Speaker 1: had forty one and a half minutes of possession. They

841
00:43:59,480 --> 00:44:03,040
Speaker 1: held a to one hundred and eighty total yards. They

842
00:44:03,040 --> 00:44:05,960
Speaker 1: were crazy good on third downs, they were crazy good

843
00:44:05,960 --> 00:44:10,400
Speaker 1: on fourth downs. They didn't commit any turnovers here. I

844
00:44:10,400 --> 00:44:12,319
Speaker 1: think if you look at it from that perspective, it

845
00:44:12,360 --> 00:44:15,279
Speaker 1: becomes very impressive from the app State side. If you

846
00:44:15,320 --> 00:44:17,480
Speaker 1: look at it from the A and M side of things,

847
00:44:17,880 --> 00:44:22,480
Speaker 1: they only scored seven points on offense in this game. Right.

848
00:44:22,560 --> 00:44:26,719
Speaker 1: Wasn't there a punt return situation or a pixing kickoff return? Yeah? Yeah, yeah, yeah,

849
00:44:26,840 --> 00:44:30,279
Speaker 1: kickoff and ah Jane, Yeah, this was the beginning of

850
00:44:30,320 --> 00:44:33,320
Speaker 1: the end, the beginning of the end for Jimbo Fisher

851
00:44:33,320 --> 00:44:35,160
Speaker 1: in Texas. Yeah.

852
00:44:35,480 --> 00:44:39,160
Speaker 2: Oh, I totally agree. The other thing you must remember

853
00:44:39,160 --> 00:44:42,080
Speaker 2: this twenty twenty two is that Texas A and M

854
00:44:42,120 --> 00:44:45,640
Speaker 2: recruiting class the all time greatest res what I'm.

855
00:44:45,480 --> 00:44:48,040
Speaker 1: Saying, man, when we're talking about talent disparities here you.

856
00:44:48,840 --> 00:44:51,080
Speaker 2: Those are true freshmen. Those are true freshmen in that class.

857
00:44:51,160 --> 00:44:54,480
Speaker 2: But just in terms of where and I'm just agreeing,

858
00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:58,000
Speaker 2: I'm yes ending you, the Texas A and M roster

859
00:44:58,880 --> 00:45:02,319
Speaker 2: was a very specific news story that you couldn't go

860
00:45:02,560 --> 00:45:06,040
Speaker 2: into a twenty twenty two Texas A and M game

861
00:45:06,560 --> 00:45:09,960
Speaker 2: without an announcer or a pregame show mentioning the like

862
00:45:10,680 --> 00:45:13,000
Speaker 2: what jimbo is doing to this roster with this kind

863
00:45:13,080 --> 00:45:15,040
Speaker 2: of historic recruiting class.

864
00:45:14,760 --> 00:45:18,200
Speaker 1: If I remember correctly, wasn't it at the time the

865
00:45:18,320 --> 00:45:20,160
Speaker 1: best recruiting class ever? As ever?

866
00:45:20,400 --> 00:45:25,440
Speaker 2: Yes, So just in terms of like how the A

867
00:45:25,560 --> 00:45:29,840
Speaker 2: and M roster was appraised, it was just like it's

868
00:45:29,880 --> 00:45:33,880
Speaker 2: another world. Obviously, it broke something in Nick Saban's brain,

869
00:45:34,600 --> 00:45:37,960
Speaker 2: Like it was just the story in terms of like

870
00:45:38,080 --> 00:45:41,920
Speaker 2: roster construction and recruiting and you know, the blue chips

871
00:45:41,960 --> 00:45:44,839
Speaker 2: and the haves whatever in college football. As we were

872
00:45:44,920 --> 00:45:47,840
Speaker 2: ushered into the nil era, that Texas A and M

873
00:45:47,960 --> 00:45:51,400
Speaker 2: was like one of the poster child programs of being

874
00:45:51,560 --> 00:45:54,960
Speaker 2: advantaged and having just like a crazy amount on both

875
00:45:55,000 --> 00:45:56,200
Speaker 2: sides of the ball of talent.

876
00:45:56,719 --> 00:45:58,560
Speaker 1: So app State, to.

877
00:45:58,600 --> 00:46:02,240
Speaker 2: Their credit, they won ten games in twenty twenty one.

878
00:46:02,320 --> 00:46:05,160
Speaker 2: They played in the conference championship game. App State was

879
00:46:05,200 --> 00:46:08,920
Speaker 2: a known G five quote unquote G five level power.

880
00:46:09,719 --> 00:46:11,719
Speaker 2: This was not and it was a by game, but

881
00:46:11,920 --> 00:46:17,160
Speaker 2: it was not a out of nowhere little giant scrappy like,

882
00:46:17,480 --> 00:46:18,839
Speaker 2: this is not a nothing team.

883
00:46:19,040 --> 00:46:20,120
Speaker 1: No, no, no, no, no no.

884
00:46:20,200 --> 00:46:22,520
Speaker 2: This was a team that just the previous week showed

885
00:46:22,560 --> 00:46:25,680
Speaker 2: it could go toe to toe with a team with

886
00:46:25,719 --> 00:46:26,360
Speaker 2: no defense.

887
00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:29,840
Speaker 1: So you see, it wasn't it wasn't a nothing team.

888
00:46:30,120 --> 00:46:31,439
Speaker 1: They did go six and six.

889
00:46:31,960 --> 00:46:34,479
Speaker 2: Yeah, Cameron Peoples and DeShawn Davis like these are good

890
00:46:34,640 --> 00:46:35,600
Speaker 2: football player names.

891
00:46:35,680 --> 00:46:38,239
Speaker 1: Yeah. Interestingly enough, though, they did not make a bowl

892
00:46:38,280 --> 00:46:39,360
Speaker 1: at six and six.

893
00:46:39,360 --> 00:46:41,600
Speaker 2: No, because they played two FCS teams, right, I remember

894
00:46:41,719 --> 00:46:44,520
Speaker 2: f CS teams, and so they won two FCS games.

895
00:46:44,640 --> 00:46:47,560
Speaker 1: Yeah, they didn't even have the opportunity to go to

896
00:46:47,640 --> 00:46:50,839
Speaker 1: a bowl on that point. A and M went five

897
00:46:50,880 --> 00:46:52,560
Speaker 1: and seven and missed a bowl. It was their first

898
00:46:52,640 --> 00:46:57,640
Speaker 1: losing season since two thousand and nine. They didn't fire

899
00:46:57,719 --> 00:47:00,719
Speaker 1: Jimbo after this season. There was a lot of that

900
00:47:00,760 --> 00:47:03,360
Speaker 1: they might. They held on to him for the twenty

901
00:47:03,400 --> 00:47:06,560
Speaker 1: three campaign. You know the story there, only made it

902
00:47:06,600 --> 00:47:09,880
Speaker 1: ten games before they fired him shortly before the season concluded.

903
00:47:10,760 --> 00:47:13,799
Speaker 1: I think this has to go through. I think this

904
00:47:13,880 --> 00:47:14,200
Speaker 1: has to be.

905
00:47:14,400 --> 00:47:17,440
Speaker 2: The vibes were so down after this game for A

906
00:47:17,560 --> 00:47:20,520
Speaker 2: and M. But I do remember some A and M

907
00:47:20,560 --> 00:47:23,040
Speaker 2: people saying like, this is a good thing, guys, because

908
00:47:23,040 --> 00:47:26,240
Speaker 2: they already were kind of done. But once the recruiting

909
00:47:26,280 --> 00:47:27,840
Speaker 2: class came in, They're like, all right, let's see what

910
00:47:27,880 --> 00:47:31,239
Speaker 2: these guys can do. But the specific manner in which

911
00:47:31,280 --> 00:47:34,640
Speaker 2: they lost this game, which was complete and utter offensive

912
00:47:34,640 --> 00:47:38,360
Speaker 2: ineptitude of just three and outs and not being able

913
00:47:38,400 --> 00:47:42,120
Speaker 2: to figure out how to string together first downs, and

914
00:47:42,360 --> 00:47:43,880
Speaker 2: I mean they lost this game. I think it was

915
00:47:43,920 --> 00:47:47,960
Speaker 2: a forty five plus yard field goal attempt near the

916
00:47:48,040 --> 00:47:50,120
Speaker 2: end of the game, and app state it was able

917
00:47:50,160 --> 00:47:54,799
Speaker 2: to kneel it from there. But there was something about

918
00:47:55,360 --> 00:48:01,480
Speaker 2: the manner in which the offense couldn't do anything, And

919
00:48:01,520 --> 00:48:03,719
Speaker 2: I think it was Haines King, right, was King? He's

920
00:48:03,760 --> 00:48:05,200
Speaker 2: King who I'm sure.

921
00:48:05,120 --> 00:48:05,840
Speaker 1: A and M fans.

922
00:48:05,840 --> 00:48:07,120
Speaker 2: I don't know if they turned on him, but they

923
00:48:07,160 --> 00:48:09,080
Speaker 2: were just like, he's not the guy, He's not the dude.

924
00:48:09,120 --> 00:48:11,239
Speaker 2: Obviously now in retrospect, You're like, they're just running the

925
00:48:11,280 --> 00:48:13,719
Speaker 2: wrong system and they were, you know, using him improperly.

926
00:48:14,000 --> 00:48:15,520
Speaker 2: Georgia Tech has figured out a way to run a

927
00:48:15,560 --> 00:48:20,719
Speaker 2: successful offense with Haines King with lesser talent. So I

928
00:48:20,760 --> 00:48:24,120
Speaker 2: think there is something pretty great about the spirit of

929
00:48:24,160 --> 00:48:27,160
Speaker 2: this upset, and so I'm I'm going to put it

930
00:48:27,200 --> 00:48:27,759
Speaker 2: through as well.

931
00:48:28,280 --> 00:48:32,040
Speaker 1: An upset by some accounts and active charity by others

932
00:48:32,360 --> 00:48:36,000
Speaker 1: on the road. Yeah, app State goes through.

933
00:48:36,520 --> 00:48:38,880
Speaker 2: Yeah, and got paid for their efforts handsomely.

934
00:48:39,960 --> 00:48:43,080
Speaker 1: This brings us to the final first round matchup. Okay,

935
00:48:44,040 --> 00:48:46,680
Speaker 1: I swore off this game many years ago, wished I

936
00:48:46,719 --> 00:48:48,640
Speaker 1: would never have to talk about it again. But last

937
00:48:48,680 --> 00:48:50,680
Speaker 1: year we are. We do it in the name of content.

938
00:48:50,800 --> 00:48:54,799
Speaker 1: In the college football off season September tenth, twenty twenty two,

939
00:48:54,880 --> 00:48:58,279
Speaker 1: Notre Dame Stadium, South in Indiana, Marshall twenty six, Notre

940
00:48:58,360 --> 00:49:03,480
Speaker 1: Dame twenty one. Oh my y, this is great. Speak

941
00:49:03,520 --> 00:49:04,160
Speaker 1: for yourself.

942
00:49:05,160 --> 00:49:07,600
Speaker 2: Well, this was great for a couple of reasons, but

943
00:49:07,640 --> 00:49:09,200
Speaker 2: I'll let you the floor is yours.

944
00:49:09,960 --> 00:49:13,800
Speaker 1: Marshall's opponent is Tulane. Tulane knocked off k States seventeen

945
00:49:13,840 --> 00:49:17,560
Speaker 1: to ten on September seventeenth, twenty twenty two, Bill Snyder

946
00:49:17,640 --> 00:49:21,200
Speaker 1: Family Stadium a week later. Yeah, after this game, let

947
00:49:21,280 --> 00:49:25,920
Speaker 1: me start here. This was, first and foremost a good

948
00:49:26,040 --> 00:49:30,080
Speaker 1: Twulane team. This is a Tulane team that won the AAC.

949
00:49:30,880 --> 00:49:33,640
Speaker 1: They went twelve and two, They beat sc Right, they

950
00:49:33,680 --> 00:49:37,600
Speaker 1: won the Cotton Bowl forty five over USC. This is

951
00:49:37,600 --> 00:49:41,000
Speaker 1: a good team. This is Michael Pratt. This is a

952
00:49:41,080 --> 00:49:43,440
Speaker 1: really good Tulane team. But they were yours next to

953
00:49:43,480 --> 00:49:46,920
Speaker 1: him in the J Spears. Yeah. Absolutely, but they were

954
00:49:46,920 --> 00:49:49,760
Speaker 1: two and zero coming into this one. At the time,

955
00:49:49,840 --> 00:49:51,959
Speaker 1: we were unsure of what to make of the fact

956
00:49:52,000 --> 00:49:54,920
Speaker 1: that they had a ninety four to ten point differential

957
00:49:55,000 --> 00:49:58,320
Speaker 1: coming into this game. Sure, okay, so that's obviously good,

958
00:49:58,960 --> 00:50:02,239
Speaker 1: but now you're gonna play can the State. They entered

959
00:50:02,239 --> 00:50:05,640
Speaker 1: this one as a thirteen and a half or fourteen

960
00:50:05,680 --> 00:50:10,000
Speaker 1: point dog, right, Tulane, they were full on good. But

961
00:50:10,040 --> 00:50:13,319
Speaker 1: this was kind of a two way clunker. Okay, So

962
00:50:13,480 --> 00:50:15,800
Speaker 1: I think we came to respect Tulane a lot after

963
00:50:15,840 --> 00:50:18,680
Speaker 1: this win and obviously what they did the remainder of

964
00:50:18,680 --> 00:50:21,759
Speaker 1: the season, But this was kind of like a rock fight.

965
00:50:22,239 --> 00:50:25,880
Speaker 1: This wasn't a great game to watch. Case State was

966
00:50:26,000 --> 00:50:30,279
Speaker 1: one of five on fourth downs. Collectively, these teams were

967
00:50:30,360 --> 00:50:34,160
Speaker 1: three of twenty seven on third downs. Both teams finished,

968
00:50:34,160 --> 00:50:37,400
Speaker 1: interestingly enough, with three hundred and thirty six total yards exactly.

969
00:50:37,760 --> 00:50:42,520
Speaker 1: I appreciate that. Yeah, this is a case a team

970
00:50:42,560 --> 00:50:45,520
Speaker 1: that had a lot of talent too. It was Adrian Martinez,

971
00:50:45,760 --> 00:50:48,080
Speaker 1: whatever you think of Adrian Martinez, but they Adduced Fawn

972
00:50:48,120 --> 00:50:52,160
Speaker 1: and DJ Giddens Knowles were on that Teamlprooks. This was

973
00:50:52,200 --> 00:50:56,040
Speaker 1: definitely an upset. What I think comes to mind in

974
00:50:56,080 --> 00:50:59,879
Speaker 1: retrospect is the fact that this was genuinely a good

975
00:50:59,840 --> 00:51:02,080
Speaker 1: two lane team. We just didn't know it as much

976
00:51:02,120 --> 00:51:04,400
Speaker 1: at the time. Does that compute for you?

977
00:51:04,800 --> 00:51:08,719
Speaker 2: In twenty twenty one, Tulane finish two to ten, right,

978
00:51:09,400 --> 00:51:13,000
Speaker 2: so down year in I mean, Willie Fritz had been

979
00:51:13,000 --> 00:51:16,960
Speaker 2: there for a while. So here's a couple things that

980
00:51:17,040 --> 00:51:20,560
Speaker 2: I remember about early Kansas State twenty twenty two. And

981
00:51:20,600 --> 00:51:22,440
Speaker 2: by the way, this is taking up space in my

982
00:51:22,480 --> 00:51:25,840
Speaker 2: brain where so many more important things in my life

983
00:51:26,320 --> 00:51:29,640
Speaker 2: should sit front of mind. I just looked it up.

984
00:51:29,640 --> 00:51:31,320
Speaker 2: It was South Dakota. I knew it was a Dakota.

985
00:51:31,360 --> 00:51:35,280
Speaker 2: I didn't remember which one that it was. Adrian Martinez

986
00:51:35,280 --> 00:51:38,480
Speaker 2: transferring in yep. He takes over the starting job, and

987
00:51:38,520 --> 00:51:42,040
Speaker 2: it's South Dakota and it's Missoo. They beat both of

988
00:51:42,040 --> 00:51:45,520
Speaker 2: these teams handily, but there was kind of no passing game,

989
00:51:45,960 --> 00:51:48,560
Speaker 2: and like it was kind of a struggle, and if

990
00:51:48,560 --> 00:51:51,480
Speaker 2: you watched, you're like, well, I'm a Kansas State fan,

991
00:51:51,520 --> 00:51:53,680
Speaker 2: I'm happy they won this game thirty whatever to nothing.

992
00:51:53,760 --> 00:51:58,080
Speaker 2: I'm happy they shelled Miszoo, But it was kind of

993
00:51:58,120 --> 00:52:01,239
Speaker 2: all douce fun and you watch Asian Martinez and he's just.

994
00:52:01,200 --> 00:52:04,880
Speaker 1: Like, I don't know if he's I don't know, I

995
00:52:04,960 --> 00:52:05,359
Speaker 1: don't know.

996
00:52:05,560 --> 00:52:07,680
Speaker 2: The score is one thing, but you watch him throw

997
00:52:07,719 --> 00:52:09,600
Speaker 2: and I don't know, Like you just get a little

998
00:52:09,640 --> 00:52:13,680
Speaker 2: bit tight in the larynx talking about Asia Martinez early

999
00:52:13,719 --> 00:52:17,640
Speaker 2: on in twenty twenty two. Obviously, whatever injury issues, whatever

1000
00:52:17,680 --> 00:52:19,080
Speaker 2: performance issues.

1001
00:52:19,000 --> 00:52:19,840
Speaker 1: He's not the quarterback.

1002
00:52:19,880 --> 00:52:22,359
Speaker 2: Will Howard takes over, is electric and leads this team

1003
00:52:22,360 --> 00:52:25,000
Speaker 2: to a big twelve crown. So kind of hard if

1004
00:52:25,040 --> 00:52:27,799
Speaker 2: you're a Kansas State fan, you're saying, this wasn't the

1005
00:52:27,880 --> 00:52:32,480
Speaker 2: fully realized twenty twenty two Kansas State program because the

1006
00:52:32,560 --> 00:52:35,240
Speaker 2: all conference caliber quarterback was sitting on the bench.

1007
00:52:35,400 --> 00:52:37,800
Speaker 1: For sitting on the bench, and you bring up another

1008
00:52:38,360 --> 00:52:40,880
Speaker 1: really interesting point about this K State team. This is

1009
00:52:40,960 --> 00:52:44,279
Speaker 1: a crazy season for k State. Correct. They ended up

1010
00:52:44,280 --> 00:52:47,319
Speaker 1: going ten and four. They won the Big Twelve in

1011
00:52:47,480 --> 00:52:51,200
Speaker 1: overtime over TCU, who, as you said earlier, ended up

1012
00:52:51,239 --> 00:52:53,799
Speaker 1: making the playoff. They win a game, they get to

1013
00:52:53,800 --> 00:52:56,239
Speaker 1: the National Championship game, didn't win, but I was a.

1014
00:52:56,200 --> 00:52:58,560
Speaker 2: Really fun by the way, Big Twelve Championship game.

1015
00:52:58,640 --> 00:53:01,279
Speaker 1: Oh it was crazy. Stay yeah, absolutely great. But K

1016
00:53:01,440 --> 00:53:05,400
Speaker 1: State in addition to losing to Tulane lost at TCU

1017
00:53:05,480 --> 00:53:08,760
Speaker 1: the first time they played, they lost at home against Texas,

1018
00:53:09,239 --> 00:53:11,320
Speaker 1: and then they lost in the Sugar Bowl. That was

1019
00:53:11,360 --> 00:53:14,880
Speaker 1: their next loss against Alabama. Right, So a ten and

1020
00:53:14,920 --> 00:53:18,719
Speaker 1: four season accomplished a lot. Did not get the win

1021
00:53:18,800 --> 00:53:23,320
Speaker 1: here against Tulane in something of an ugly game. Tulane,

1022
00:53:23,360 --> 00:53:24,880
Speaker 1: like I said, ended up being full on good. We

1023
00:53:24,960 --> 00:53:27,800
Speaker 1: just didn't know it at the time. It's going to

1024
00:53:27,840 --> 00:53:29,520
Speaker 1: be hard to beat Marshall Notre Dame tie.

1025
00:53:31,160 --> 00:53:35,239
Speaker 2: This was a really impressive win for Tulane. In retrospect,

1026
00:53:35,239 --> 00:53:37,560
Speaker 2: it makes a lot more sense when you consider how

1027
00:53:37,560 --> 00:53:40,560
Speaker 2: good Tulane was the rest of the year and that

1028
00:53:40,719 --> 00:53:45,640
Speaker 2: Adrian Martinez wasn't the guy for K State. So you

1029
00:53:45,680 --> 00:53:47,880
Speaker 2: can't look back on it with like it being like,

1030
00:53:48,040 --> 00:53:50,160
Speaker 2: can you believe that just for one magic week?

1031
00:53:50,239 --> 00:53:52,640
Speaker 1: Tulane, like you kind of cant let me, let me,

1032
00:53:52,760 --> 00:53:55,520
Speaker 1: let me stop you right here. Okay, we both agree

1033
00:53:55,600 --> 00:53:59,040
Speaker 1: that we're just going to put Marshall through to app state, well.

1034
00:53:58,840 --> 00:54:01,120
Speaker 2: You're going to have to provide. I had a compelling

1035
00:54:01,560 --> 00:54:05,280
Speaker 2: recap of Marshall's win over Notre Dame to be thorough

1036
00:54:05,440 --> 00:54:06,319
Speaker 2: and complete us.

1037
00:54:06,400 --> 00:54:10,200
Speaker 1: I mean, this has to go through. It has to

1038
00:54:10,200 --> 00:54:13,480
Speaker 1: go through, it has to go through. Why don't we

1039
00:54:13,520 --> 00:54:15,600
Speaker 1: save everybody a little bit of time. Let's save everybody

1040
00:54:15,640 --> 00:54:19,120
Speaker 1: five minutes I can do. I'll do the recap of

1041
00:54:19,160 --> 00:54:21,160
Speaker 1: the game, I promise. Okay, I'll do the recap of

1042
00:54:21,200 --> 00:54:24,719
Speaker 1: the game. But can we just sort of like acknowledge

1043
00:54:24,719 --> 00:54:28,839
Speaker 1: here unanimous consent that we're going Marshall through Tokay, Yes,

1044
00:54:31,000 --> 00:54:33,320
Speaker 1: twenty six to twenty one is the final of this game.

1045
00:54:35,280 --> 00:54:38,200
Speaker 1: The byproduct of this Notre Dame loss was a viral

1046
00:54:38,320 --> 00:54:42,279
Speaker 1: video that I posted out there online. That was the

1047
00:54:42,360 --> 00:54:46,200
Speaker 1: lasting takeaway in the culture. I agree. I remember getting

1048
00:54:46,239 --> 00:54:50,440
Speaker 1: messages from people about that video. I was fit to

1049
00:54:50,440 --> 00:54:53,200
Speaker 1: be tied after this one, Dan, I was fit to

1050
00:54:53,200 --> 00:54:57,560
Speaker 1: be tied. Because now consider the context here. Brian Kelly

1051
00:54:57,680 --> 00:55:01,840
Speaker 1: leaves on a whim before the bowl game the year prior,

1052
00:55:02,960 --> 00:55:05,319
Speaker 1: so at the end of twenty twenty one December, he

1053
00:55:05,440 --> 00:55:09,920
Speaker 1: decides he's leaving. Marcus Freeman takes over in the Fiesta

1054
00:55:09,960 --> 00:55:11,799
Speaker 1: Bawl against Oklahoma State. It was a good game, it

1055
00:55:11,840 --> 00:55:13,839
Speaker 1: was close, but Marcus Freeman lost that game.

1056
00:55:14,320 --> 00:55:15,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, bad second half.

1057
00:55:15,960 --> 00:55:20,960
Speaker 1: Then what happens, new season, hope springs eternal. Notre Dame

1058
00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:24,000
Speaker 1: goes up against Ohio State. They lose that game against

1059
00:55:24,000 --> 00:55:27,640
Speaker 1: Ohio State. Yeah, Marcus Freeman now zero to two is

1060
00:55:27,640 --> 00:55:33,720
Speaker 1: a head coach. Marcus Freeman lost this game. He became

1061
00:55:33,800 --> 00:55:36,560
Speaker 1: the first coach in Notre Dame history to lose his

1062
00:55:36,600 --> 00:55:41,120
Speaker 1: first three games. Not off to a great start. Suddenly

1063
00:55:41,160 --> 00:55:42,879
Speaker 1: you want to talk about the throat getting a little

1064
00:55:42,880 --> 00:55:49,160
Speaker 1: bit tight, feeling angsty. Suddenly the question of is Marcus

1065
00:55:49,200 --> 00:55:53,280
Speaker 1: Freeman the guy? Is this? Is this the guy? Right?

1066
00:55:54,040 --> 00:55:56,960
Speaker 1: Suddenly people are talking about that and he's only two

1067
00:55:57,000 --> 00:55:59,600
Speaker 1: games into his first full regular season, three games into

1068
00:55:59,640 --> 00:56:04,120
Speaker 1: his ten right, That I think is meaningful. Also meaningful

1069
00:56:04,200 --> 00:56:06,280
Speaker 1: is the fact that this was a pretty good Marshall team.

1070
00:56:06,600 --> 00:56:08,680
Speaker 1: This is not to say they should have beaten Notre Dame.

1071
00:56:08,760 --> 00:56:10,960
Speaker 1: Notre Dame really doesn't have a great excuse for losing.

1072
00:56:11,560 --> 00:56:13,919
Speaker 1: But this is a Marshall team that went nine and four.

1073
00:56:14,520 --> 00:56:17,840
Speaker 1: They won their bowl game, had a pretty good defense

1074
00:56:17,880 --> 00:56:19,239
Speaker 1: this year. I think you mentioned I had.

1075
00:56:19,160 --> 00:56:20,280
Speaker 2: A very bad offense.

1076
00:56:20,320 --> 00:56:23,320
Speaker 1: By the way, though, Henry Columby offense.

1077
00:56:24,080 --> 00:56:29,200
Speaker 2: Colombie colombie whatever, I've pronounced that name wrong at three

1078
00:56:29,239 --> 00:56:32,320
Speaker 2: different places, at Utah State, at Texas Tech, and at Marshall,

1079
00:56:32,440 --> 00:56:33,520
Speaker 2: so let's keep it going.

1080
00:56:33,520 --> 00:56:36,080
Speaker 1: But it ended up being a nine win Marshall team. Yes,

1081
00:56:36,280 --> 00:56:43,960
Speaker 1: that being said, Notre Dame was plunged into just overwhelming

1082
00:56:45,640 --> 00:56:49,680
Speaker 1: uncertainty because of this loss. They ended up going nine

1083
00:56:49,680 --> 00:56:51,600
Speaker 1: to four. They ended up winning the Gator Bowl against

1084
00:56:51,920 --> 00:56:54,960
Speaker 1: South Carolina, the aforementioned South Carolina, So it wasn't a

1085
00:56:55,000 --> 00:57:01,000
Speaker 1: bad season. But this is a Drew Pot season by

1086
00:57:01,040 --> 00:57:04,600
Speaker 1: and large because Tyler Buckner, who started this game against Marshall,

1087
00:57:05,520 --> 00:57:08,000
Speaker 1: threw two picks, one of which went back for a touchdown,

1088
00:57:08,520 --> 00:57:10,640
Speaker 1: ended up hurting his shoulder. He missed the rest of

1089
00:57:10,680 --> 00:57:13,000
Speaker 1: the game and the rest of the regular season. He

1090
00:57:13,040 --> 00:57:15,719
Speaker 1: did come back for the Gator Bowl, but this was

1091
00:57:15,800 --> 00:57:19,600
Speaker 1: Pine time. We had Drew Pine Notre Dame was stuck

1092
00:57:19,640 --> 00:57:21,080
Speaker 1: in the mud for a good chunk of this game,

1093
00:57:21,080 --> 00:57:24,560
Speaker 1: and it just felt very, very frustrating. I talked about

1094
00:57:24,560 --> 00:57:27,120
Speaker 1: it on the previous episode, where there are some of

1095
00:57:27,160 --> 00:57:29,040
Speaker 1: these games that you just have to watch, you have

1096
00:57:29,120 --> 00:57:32,800
Speaker 1: to endure. I talked about it with the Northern Illinois loss. Great,

1097
00:57:32,800 --> 00:57:35,040
Speaker 1: we're talking about Notre Dame upsets twice now in two

1098
00:57:35,040 --> 00:57:38,439
Speaker 1: episodes where you just yell at the screen and say

1099
00:57:38,560 --> 00:57:42,920
Speaker 1: do something, right, do something? What are we doing? My

1100
00:57:43,080 --> 00:57:45,040
Speaker 1: video after this one, I said, you just you can't

1101
00:57:45,080 --> 00:57:49,080
Speaker 1: lose the Marshall. I agree, yeah, guy, you can't lose

1102
00:57:49,080 --> 00:57:50,760
Speaker 1: the Marshall. If you want to be the egg Coacher, notarity,

1103
00:57:50,840 --> 00:57:53,440
Speaker 1: you can't lose to can't lose the frig of Marshall,

1104
00:57:53,640 --> 00:57:57,520
Speaker 1: no disrespect to Marshall. Can't lose to Marshall. This was

1105
00:57:57,560 --> 00:58:03,000
Speaker 1: so confounding and maybe in retrospect, so expected given what

1106
00:58:03,040 --> 00:58:06,560
Speaker 1: Notre Dame was rolling with on offense. It was just maddening,

1107
00:58:07,520 --> 00:58:10,280
Speaker 1: absolutely maddening for me as a Notre Dame fan. I'm

1108
00:58:10,280 --> 00:58:11,840
Speaker 1: not even going to go through the stats. I don't

1109
00:58:11,840 --> 00:58:14,160
Speaker 1: even want to pull up the box score. It's gonna

1110
00:58:15,320 --> 00:58:16,280
Speaker 1: give me PTSD.

1111
00:58:16,680 --> 00:58:23,640
Speaker 2: It's So this is Charles Huff's second year at Marshall. Correct,

1112
00:58:24,360 --> 00:58:28,280
Speaker 2: Notre Dame had lost to but I would say acquitted

1113
00:58:28,320 --> 00:58:31,360
Speaker 2: itself reasonably well. They lost to Ohio State.

1114
00:58:31,200 --> 00:58:31,800
Speaker 1: The week before.

1115
00:58:31,800 --> 00:58:35,800
Speaker 2: Definitely Tyler Buckner, he completed a couple of long passes,

1116
00:58:35,840 --> 00:58:38,640
Speaker 2: but he didn't throwny picks. You know, he wasn't atrocious.

1117
00:58:38,680 --> 00:58:41,760
Speaker 2: He just wasn't a huge factor.

1118
00:58:41,920 --> 00:58:44,480
Speaker 1: No. And by the way, because they, as you said,

1119
00:58:44,480 --> 00:58:47,720
Speaker 1: acquitted themselves pretty well against Ohio State, that made this

1120
00:58:47,840 --> 00:58:49,680
Speaker 1: loss all the more frustrating.

1121
00:58:49,480 --> 00:58:51,800
Speaker 2: Right, I mean it's called ten points. It wasn't amazing,

1122
00:58:51,920 --> 00:58:53,200
Speaker 2: I know, but but yeah.

1123
00:58:53,080 --> 00:58:55,440
Speaker 1: My point, Yeah, you're thinking, Okay, they can kind of

1124
00:58:55,440 --> 00:58:58,800
Speaker 1: hang with Ohio State, so should be able to take Marshall.

1125
00:58:58,920 --> 00:59:03,360
Speaker 2: Right, I also think you're overlooking you talk about the

1126
00:59:03,360 --> 00:59:06,240
Speaker 2: takeaway from this game. It was like, oh is Marcus Freeman,

1127
00:59:06,560 --> 00:59:09,800
Speaker 2: you know, what's the guy? What is Tyler Buckner's future

1128
00:59:09,800 --> 00:59:11,760
Speaker 2: after getting hurt and throwing a couple of I mean,

1129
00:59:11,800 --> 00:59:13,959
Speaker 2: by the way, the throws empic. Quarterback of this show

1130
00:59:16,640 --> 00:59:20,240
Speaker 2: that throws leading to big losses throws empic. This game

1131
00:59:20,320 --> 00:59:25,120
Speaker 2: also gave me the ability to be snotty and I

1132
00:59:25,160 --> 00:59:27,480
Speaker 2: don't know, if anybody likes hearing me do this bit,

1133
00:59:27,680 --> 00:59:30,920
Speaker 2: but I like it. There's probably three people the dan

1134
00:59:31,040 --> 00:59:33,880
Speaker 2: heads out there, who like, oh here here comes, here

1135
00:59:34,000 --> 00:59:36,800
Speaker 2: comes that I got to say and probably will continue

1136
00:59:36,840 --> 00:59:39,960
Speaker 2: to say. Anytime a win or an upset like this

1137
00:59:40,040 --> 00:59:42,760
Speaker 2: happens with Notre Dame, I was like, yes, this was

1138
00:59:42,800 --> 00:59:45,360
Speaker 2: an ugly loss for Notre Dame. It was an ugly

1139
00:59:45,400 --> 00:59:49,040
Speaker 2: ass loss for the Irish. But please don't forget. Notre

1140
00:59:49,120 --> 00:59:50,680
Speaker 2: Dame was right there with Marshall.

1141
00:59:51,200 --> 00:59:52,040
Speaker 1: You love that giant.

1142
00:59:52,200 --> 00:59:54,480
Speaker 2: Notre Dame was right there with niu Ty, you love

1143
00:59:54,520 --> 00:59:57,520
Speaker 2: that line. Just a couple more plays, they were right there.

1144
00:59:58,360 --> 01:00:01,320
Speaker 2: So respect put some respect on Marcus Freeman's Irish.

1145
01:00:01,560 --> 01:00:05,360
Speaker 1: So here's my question though, Yeah, the Marshall winner of

1146
01:00:05,360 --> 01:00:08,280
Speaker 1: the app State win. They happened on the same week.

1147
01:00:08,160 --> 01:00:10,280
Speaker 2: Early in the season, which is tough because you don't

1148
01:00:10,280 --> 01:00:11,760
Speaker 2: have a concept of what they're going to be later

1149
01:00:11,760 --> 01:00:14,080
Speaker 2: on in the season. I always prefer a November upset

1150
01:00:14,080 --> 01:00:16,320
Speaker 2: because it just has that feel of shock and like

1151
01:00:16,720 --> 01:00:20,680
Speaker 2: completely throwing a season's team into the toilet. Expectations are

1152
01:00:20,720 --> 01:00:26,640
Speaker 2: now dashed, which to me is the more enduring upset.

1153
01:00:26,800 --> 01:00:30,040
Speaker 2: Marshall over Notre Dame or app State over Texas A

1154
01:00:30,080 --> 01:00:30,760
Speaker 2: and M.

1155
01:00:31,200 --> 01:00:33,800
Speaker 1: I feel like this could just be my own personal

1156
01:00:34,680 --> 01:00:36,120
Speaker 1: you know, my frame of reference.

1157
01:00:36,240 --> 01:00:37,200
Speaker 2: This is a tough one.

1158
01:00:37,440 --> 01:00:40,520
Speaker 1: It is tough. It's a good matchup. I feel like

1159
01:00:40,600 --> 01:00:43,720
Speaker 1: in terms of the enduring upset, the one that people

1160
01:00:43,800 --> 01:00:45,400
Speaker 1: still talk most about.

1161
01:00:45,200 --> 01:00:46,120
Speaker 2: It's probably Marshall.

1162
01:00:46,120 --> 01:00:47,040
Speaker 1: It's Marshall Notre Dame.

1163
01:00:47,200 --> 01:00:50,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, because Marcus Freeman's still there. It's like a data

1164
01:00:50,480 --> 01:00:54,240
Speaker 2: point in Marcus Freeman's tenure at Notre Dame. I think

1165
01:00:54,240 --> 01:00:58,480
Speaker 2: it is more pronounced that Marshall was the team. There

1166
01:00:58,480 --> 01:01:00,400
Speaker 2: was a good Marshall team, not a great Marshal team.

1167
01:01:00,400 --> 01:01:02,400
Speaker 2: This was not a good A and M team in

1168
01:01:02,480 --> 01:01:04,520
Speaker 2: twenty twenty two. What do you say they finished twenty

1169
01:01:04,600 --> 01:01:06,240
Speaker 2: or excuse me, five and seven seven?

1170
01:01:06,640 --> 01:01:06,840
Speaker 1: Right?

1171
01:01:07,360 --> 01:01:10,760
Speaker 2: I think the funnier outcome is probably app State, Texas

1172
01:01:10,760 --> 01:01:16,120
Speaker 2: A and M. But the more enduring upset is Marshall

1173
01:01:16,280 --> 01:01:18,960
Speaker 2: over Notre Dame because it was I mean, there were

1174
01:01:19,000 --> 01:01:21,680
Speaker 2: both home losses. I don't know what Notre Dame paid Marshall.

1175
01:01:21,840 --> 01:01:25,920
Speaker 2: There was a number there, but uh, I think you

1176
01:01:26,000 --> 01:01:28,120
Speaker 2: have the pick six, you have the inability to get

1177
01:01:28,120 --> 01:01:30,240
Speaker 2: off the field. It was Marshall just running them down

1178
01:01:30,240 --> 01:01:31,200
Speaker 2: the throat, right.

1179
01:01:31,400 --> 01:01:34,200
Speaker 1: Yeah. Notre Dame was all on the ground basically bye

1180
01:01:35,160 --> 01:01:39,200
Speaker 1: a Marshall running back named Kaitln Labourne. Yeah, not Kaalen

1181
01:01:39,240 --> 01:01:43,240
Speaker 1: de bor but off brand, Yeah, off brand, Kaylen de Borr.

1182
01:01:43,360 --> 01:01:46,280
Speaker 1: This is Kaylin Lebourne one hundred and sixty three yards

1183
01:01:46,280 --> 01:01:46,960
Speaker 1: in a touchdown.

1184
01:01:47,320 --> 01:01:49,280
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm gonna go.

1185
01:01:49,480 --> 01:01:52,720
Speaker 1: I go Marshall here. I think I do too. It

1186
01:01:52,760 --> 01:01:54,000
Speaker 1: pains me the six close.

1187
01:01:54,640 --> 01:01:56,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, I wish one of these games happened in late

1188
01:01:56,840 --> 01:01:58,680
Speaker 2: October early November kind of thing.

1189
01:01:58,680 --> 01:02:02,880
Speaker 1: Which means we've got marsh and it's win over Notre

1190
01:02:03,000 --> 01:02:08,720
Speaker 1: Dame versus Colorado and it's win over TCU in the

1191
01:02:08,720 --> 01:02:09,280
Speaker 1: final four.

1192
01:02:09,360 --> 01:02:11,320
Speaker 2: Yeah, it's no brain er Marshall. To me, that's the

1193
01:02:11,360 --> 01:02:13,600
Speaker 2: easiest matchup. It's much harder for me to decide between

1194
01:02:13,640 --> 01:02:15,640
Speaker 2: Marshall and app State.

1195
01:02:15,840 --> 01:02:18,280
Speaker 1: Sometimes you have that in March madness. You know, the

1196
01:02:18,320 --> 01:02:20,600
Speaker 1: Elite eight game tens to be easier than the Final four.

1197
01:02:20,680 --> 01:02:21,080
Speaker 1: We never know.

1198
01:02:21,240 --> 01:02:22,680
Speaker 2: Well, I think this is just because of your seating.

1199
01:02:22,720 --> 01:02:27,640
Speaker 2: But yeah, and our difference and viewpoint about Colorado TCO.

1200
01:02:28,120 --> 01:02:31,520
Speaker 1: On the other side of things now, are other two

1201
01:02:31,560 --> 01:02:35,520
Speaker 1: final four teams or final four upsets we have Michigan thirteen,

1202
01:02:35,560 --> 01:02:39,680
Speaker 1: Ohio State ten from this past season, and we've got

1203
01:02:39,760 --> 01:02:44,000
Speaker 1: Kansas fifty seven, Texas fifty six the overtime game from

1204
01:02:44,040 --> 01:02:45,080
Speaker 1: back in twenty twenty one.

1205
01:02:45,280 --> 01:02:48,160
Speaker 2: We're doing, but we're doing I feel like we should

1206
01:02:48,200 --> 01:02:51,600
Speaker 2: be mixing these, maybe mixing eras. I guess you set

1207
01:02:51,680 --> 01:02:52,880
Speaker 2: up your bracket how you set it up?

1208
01:02:52,960 --> 01:02:53,640
Speaker 1: Yeah?

1209
01:02:53,840 --> 01:02:56,760
Speaker 2: So am I taking Kansas over Texas? So am I

1210
01:02:56,800 --> 01:02:58,720
Speaker 2: taking Kansas? Or am I taking Michigan?

1211
01:02:59,240 --> 01:03:01,320
Speaker 1: Yeah? I mean the other thing that we could do,

1212
01:03:01,920 --> 01:03:05,040
Speaker 1: if you wanted, we could rank, we could seed these

1213
01:03:05,080 --> 01:03:08,560
Speaker 1: final four just in order of interest.

1214
01:03:09,920 --> 01:03:14,880
Speaker 2: I'm going to take Michigan over Kansas just because of

1215
01:03:14,920 --> 01:03:18,280
Speaker 2: the opponent, just because of the emotion involved. Now, as

1216
01:03:18,280 --> 01:03:23,240
Speaker 2: people have rightfully pointed out, Michigan is the defending national

1217
01:03:23,320 --> 01:03:25,360
Speaker 2: champion and already beat in Ohio State three years in

1218
01:03:25,360 --> 01:03:28,200
Speaker 2: a row, so that goes against it. But because of this,

1219
01:03:28,600 --> 01:03:30,720
Speaker 2: like if you were going to take seasons as their

1220
01:03:30,760 --> 01:03:35,880
Speaker 2: own unique ecosystem, that their own living, breathing thing, the

1221
01:03:35,880 --> 01:03:39,880
Speaker 2: twenty twenty four Michigan team, because of the coaching staff,

1222
01:03:39,920 --> 01:03:44,480
Speaker 2: because of quarterback, because of lines, bared very little resemblance

1223
01:03:44,520 --> 01:03:47,440
Speaker 2: to twenty twenty three bore.

1224
01:03:47,520 --> 01:03:51,000
Speaker 1: Very little resemblance probably boor Right or Baird. What do

1225
01:03:51,000 --> 01:03:52,680
Speaker 1: you think is poor? Poor?

1226
01:03:54,080 --> 01:03:57,000
Speaker 2: Excuse me on that. I hope young children learning the language.

1227
01:03:57,280 --> 01:03:58,520
Speaker 2: Muff You can just hear muffet.

1228
01:03:58,520 --> 01:04:01,600
Speaker 1: It's fine. That's intent, intention, intent, whatever.

1229
01:04:02,680 --> 01:04:06,280
Speaker 2: End of the season specific twenty twenty four Michigan team,

1230
01:04:06,480 --> 01:04:09,760
Speaker 2: the number ninety three ranked offense in America.

1231
01:04:10,920 --> 01:04:16,560
Speaker 1: Michigan team. That to me is like Texas, what was

1232
01:04:16,600 --> 01:04:17,320
Speaker 1: what in that year?

1233
01:04:17,320 --> 01:04:21,720
Speaker 2: What did we say? It was a five and seven year? Yeah, yeah, yeah, Michigan.

1234
01:04:21,960 --> 01:04:26,320
Speaker 2: I think Michigan just because and it's in Columbus. Yeah,

1235
01:04:26,440 --> 01:04:29,800
Speaker 2: ninety three offense, thirty one defense. Ohio State finished the

1236
01:04:29,880 --> 01:04:33,840
Speaker 2: year number three offense, number three defense. Michigan needed a

1237
01:04:33,880 --> 01:04:36,240
Speaker 2: short field, like you get that freak thing right, the

1238
01:04:36,280 --> 01:04:39,640
Speaker 2: short field touchdown after the interception, they seal the game

1239
01:04:39,960 --> 01:04:43,200
Speaker 2: with a drive on the ground, Like, I think it's

1240
01:04:43,200 --> 01:04:45,200
Speaker 2: Michigan for me as much as I love that Kansas

1241
01:04:45,200 --> 01:04:47,600
Speaker 2: game and the Kansas story and the years of ineptitude

1242
01:04:47,720 --> 01:04:50,280
Speaker 2: and not having any other that to me is a

1243
01:04:50,320 --> 01:04:53,440
Speaker 2: great feather in Kansas cap. Not having any other FBS

1244
01:04:53,480 --> 01:04:57,320
Speaker 2: wins that season, but by a slim margin because of

1245
01:04:57,360 --> 01:05:00,160
Speaker 2: the emotion, because of everything involved in the twenty twenty

1246
01:05:00,160 --> 01:05:04,240
Speaker 2: four season National champs going down at home will Michigan.

1247
01:05:04,360 --> 01:05:06,520
Speaker 1: Also keep in mind, this is an Ohio State team

1248
01:05:06,520 --> 01:05:09,000
Speaker 1: that won four playoff games and was scoring something like

1249
01:05:09,080 --> 01:05:11,880
Speaker 1: thirty five points a game. Yeah, of course, but again

1250
01:05:12,000 --> 01:05:13,480
Speaker 1: against much better teams.

1251
01:05:13,640 --> 01:05:16,640
Speaker 2: This, what you could argue, was Ohio State's cottage cheese game,

1252
01:05:16,760 --> 01:05:19,600
Speaker 2: bringing it full circle. This was the acid and the

1253
01:05:19,640 --> 01:05:24,680
Speaker 2: heated milk tie that brought about much needed change and

1254
01:05:25,000 --> 01:05:26,920
Speaker 2: you know, structural improvement.

1255
01:05:27,480 --> 01:05:30,560
Speaker 1: I would put Michigan through, I would put Notre Dame through,

1256
01:05:31,000 --> 01:05:33,200
Speaker 1: and as I kind of gave away the game in

1257
01:05:33,240 --> 01:05:36,120
Speaker 1: the first episode, but Michigan's the winner of this. For me,

1258
01:05:36,920 --> 01:05:40,160
Speaker 1: maybe I am a prisoner of the moment and I

1259
01:05:40,240 --> 01:05:46,800
Speaker 1: am experiencing some recency bias. Yeah, it was so unexpected.

1260
01:05:46,920 --> 01:05:49,760
Speaker 1: It is inconceivable that a team like Ohio State that

1261
01:05:49,800 --> 01:05:52,160
Speaker 1: won the title playing the manner they did the last

1262
01:05:52,200 --> 01:05:55,280
Speaker 1: four games of the season, even in the games leading

1263
01:05:55,360 --> 01:05:58,280
Speaker 1: up to this Michigan game. The fact that they would

1264
01:05:58,360 --> 01:06:01,440
Speaker 1: turn their own game plan on its ear try to

1265
01:06:01,480 --> 01:06:05,640
Speaker 1: win in the manner that they did, go nowhere, spin

1266
01:06:05,720 --> 01:06:08,760
Speaker 1: their wheels for sixty minutes and only manage ten points

1267
01:06:09,480 --> 01:06:12,160
Speaker 1: against a Michigan team that was this limited and this

1268
01:06:12,920 --> 01:06:17,680
Speaker 1: well known. It was not a secret. Everyone knew that

1269
01:06:17,720 --> 01:06:19,640
Speaker 1: they were going to be very, very limited. They could

1270
01:06:19,680 --> 01:06:22,160
Speaker 1: barely throw the ball. The fact that they were able

1271
01:06:22,200 --> 01:06:24,720
Speaker 1: to do this, on top of the fact that they

1272
01:06:24,720 --> 01:06:29,440
Speaker 1: had already won three straight against Ohio State, so much

1273
01:06:29,520 --> 01:06:32,720
Speaker 1: of this is just mind blowing to me that, yes,

1274
01:06:32,800 --> 01:06:36,000
Speaker 1: there is a hilarity that goes along with Notre Dame

1275
01:06:36,040 --> 01:06:40,360
Speaker 1: losing to Marshall. Certainly, the Kansas game, the Kansas win

1276
01:06:40,440 --> 01:06:43,600
Speaker 1: over Texas was a very big deal, you know, in

1277
01:06:43,640 --> 01:06:47,720
Speaker 1: our discord circles and people who follow Kansas football and

1278
01:06:48,920 --> 01:06:52,120
Speaker 1: their kind of path up and obviously, you know, I

1279
01:06:52,160 --> 01:06:54,760
Speaker 1: talked about Colorado and TCU and how that launched a

1280
01:06:54,800 --> 01:06:58,920
Speaker 1: million narratives. But the significance of this one to me,

1281
01:06:59,200 --> 01:07:02,240
Speaker 1: and just the un expected nature of it. And on

1282
01:07:02,320 --> 01:07:04,920
Speaker 1: top of all of that, it was two helmet schools,

1283
01:07:05,000 --> 01:07:08,240
Speaker 1: two name brand schools, playing the biggest rivalry in the sport.

1284
01:07:08,440 --> 01:07:12,480
Speaker 2: But does that that almost detracts from It doesn't for me.

1285
01:07:12,880 --> 01:07:13,560
Speaker 1: It doesn't for me.

1286
01:07:14,000 --> 01:07:17,640
Speaker 2: The case for Marshall is really easy, even over this game.

1287
01:07:17,920 --> 01:07:20,520
Speaker 2: The case for Michigan is it's so unexpected Ohio State

1288
01:07:20,560 --> 01:07:23,360
Speaker 2: wins the National Championship. We're also talking about a roster

1289
01:07:23,480 --> 01:07:26,520
Speaker 2: that is a Michigan roster at basically everywhere but quarterback.

1290
01:07:27,920 --> 01:07:30,800
Speaker 2: Like the offensive line wasn't great, but on all three

1291
01:07:30,880 --> 01:07:33,760
Speaker 2: levels of the defense, this was a high level Big

1292
01:07:33,840 --> 01:07:38,160
Speaker 2: ten defense. Like, it wasn't a great defense. It was

1293
01:07:38,200 --> 01:07:42,840
Speaker 2: a decent defense with all Big ten caliber players on

1294
01:07:42,920 --> 01:07:43,640
Speaker 2: multiple levels.

1295
01:07:43,640 --> 01:07:48,600
Speaker 1: But look, should it not stand for something that for

1296
01:07:48,680 --> 01:07:52,480
Speaker 1: whatever reason, and maybe it was three consecutive losses, sure

1297
01:07:53,080 --> 01:07:57,160
Speaker 1: Michigan was able to get in Ryan Day's head totally. No, No,

1298
01:07:57,200 --> 01:08:00,200
Speaker 1: that stands for something here, Dan. In many of these

1299
01:08:00,240 --> 01:08:03,320
Speaker 1: other instances that were kind of pitting against one another,

1300
01:08:04,000 --> 01:08:06,280
Speaker 1: that wasn't the case. You just had a team that

1301
01:08:06,560 --> 01:08:10,200
Speaker 1: took a week off or had some injuries and things

1302
01:08:10,240 --> 01:08:12,960
Speaker 1: went south. They couldn't get it going. They were, you know,

1303
01:08:13,280 --> 01:08:16,000
Speaker 1: terrible on third downs whatever. There was really a moment.

1304
01:08:16,600 --> 01:08:20,479
Speaker 1: But in this game, in particular, a big takeaway is

1305
01:08:20,520 --> 01:08:23,360
Speaker 1: the fact that Ryan Gate did Ryan They did not

1306
01:08:23,520 --> 01:08:25,920
Speaker 1: play his game plan at all, not the one that

1307
01:08:25,960 --> 01:08:28,360
Speaker 1: we saw that won him the National Championship. They tried

1308
01:08:28,400 --> 01:08:31,960
Speaker 1: to be something else. I think because of the scar

1309
01:08:32,040 --> 01:08:34,120
Speaker 1: tissue from the previous three games.

1310
01:08:34,600 --> 01:08:38,800
Speaker 2: The case for Marshall is they were a Sun Belt

1311
01:08:38,880 --> 01:08:43,439
Speaker 2: team who immediately lost to Bowling Green after beating Notre

1312
01:08:43,560 --> 01:08:47,760
Speaker 2: Dame in South Bend. The lost Bowling Green, Louisiana and

1313
01:08:48,280 --> 01:08:51,479
Speaker 2: Troy in three of the four next weeks, so they

1314
01:08:51,520 --> 01:08:56,280
Speaker 2: really struggled after a huge win like that. The talent

1315
01:08:56,360 --> 01:09:01,439
Speaker 2: discrepancy is more pronounced with Marshall against Notre Dame than

1316
01:09:01,479 --> 01:09:05,120
Speaker 2: it is with Michigan Ohio State. Okay, there is a

1317
01:09:05,400 --> 01:09:10,000
Speaker 2: the gilded nature of Michigan football and their roster. Gilded

1318
01:09:10,040 --> 01:09:13,400
Speaker 2: is probably too strong a word, but this is a

1319
01:09:13,439 --> 01:09:16,360
Speaker 2: Michigan team with Michigan players who are rotation guys on

1320
01:09:16,400 --> 01:09:22,840
Speaker 2: a national championship team. That it's not David versus Goliath, which,

1321
01:09:22,880 --> 01:09:26,280
Speaker 2: by the way, I think is Goliath may have been blind?

1322
01:09:26,280 --> 01:09:27,160
Speaker 1: Have you like Red Rip?

1323
01:09:27,439 --> 01:09:32,439
Speaker 2: Okay, anyway, I'm too far afield. That's the case that

1324
01:09:33,040 --> 01:09:37,120
Speaker 2: if March madness is defined by like the quote unquote

1325
01:09:37,160 --> 01:09:41,879
Speaker 2: Cinderella nature of certain teams, Marshall fits that more than Michigan,

1326
01:09:41,960 --> 01:09:44,240
Speaker 2: even with Michigan's twenty twenty four struggles.

1327
01:09:44,720 --> 01:09:47,559
Speaker 1: Is that fair? That totally fair? Here is how I

1328
01:09:47,600 --> 01:09:50,880
Speaker 1: would rank these final four. Okay, I would put Michigan

1329
01:09:50,920 --> 01:09:54,400
Speaker 1: over Ohio State one. I would put Marshall over Notre Dame. Two,

1330
01:09:55,000 --> 01:09:57,760
Speaker 1: I would put Kansas over Texas. Three, I would put

1331
01:09:57,760 --> 01:10:01,000
Speaker 1: Colorado over TCU four. Okay, I appreciate you doing that

1332
01:10:01,080 --> 01:10:03,680
Speaker 1: for me, even if it wasn't for me.

1333
01:10:04,439 --> 01:10:06,760
Speaker 2: I'm going to go Marshall one, and I'm going to

1334
01:10:06,800 --> 01:10:09,799
Speaker 2: go Michigan two, and I'm going to go Kansas three,

1335
01:10:10,439 --> 01:10:13,680
Speaker 2: and I'm going to go Colorado four because this is

1336
01:10:13,720 --> 01:10:14,320
Speaker 2: the final four.

1337
01:10:14,360 --> 01:10:18,080
Speaker 1: I've been dealt. I just want to be I want

1338
01:10:18,080 --> 01:10:20,240
Speaker 1: to know. My protest has been filed with the League

1339
01:10:20,280 --> 01:10:25,040
Speaker 1: office on the Colorado thing. Yes, okay, So you would

1340
01:10:25,040 --> 01:10:27,000
Speaker 1: have put in New Mexico State, How would you have

1341
01:10:27,040 --> 01:10:28,840
Speaker 1: ranked in Mexico State if they were in the final four.

1342
01:10:29,680 --> 01:10:33,759
Speaker 2: I would put New Mexico State or maybe even app

1343
01:10:33,760 --> 01:10:39,479
Speaker 2: State over Colorado TCU, and that's it. Probably I think

1344
01:10:39,560 --> 01:10:43,080
Speaker 2: they would be four. I think you have to include

1345
01:10:43,080 --> 01:10:46,479
Speaker 2: the the scar tissue and baggage of Kansas ahead of

1346
01:10:46,520 --> 01:10:51,320
Speaker 2: that with so many losing seasons and like having stories

1347
01:10:51,439 --> 01:10:55,479
Speaker 2: at I believe legit platforms be like should Kansas actually

1348
01:10:55,680 --> 01:10:56,880
Speaker 2: think about folding foot?

1349
01:10:56,960 --> 01:11:00,679
Speaker 1: Should they full football after the David Batty era? Right?

1350
01:11:01,479 --> 01:11:03,200
Speaker 2: And It's not just David. It was David Baty, it

1351
01:11:03,240 --> 01:11:05,320
Speaker 2: was Charlie Weiss, it was Turner Gill. Like there's a

1352
01:11:05,479 --> 01:11:08,920
Speaker 2: string of guys who less miles. Less miles was Thiss Miles.

1353
01:11:08,960 --> 01:11:12,519
Speaker 2: Of course, there was a string of people who had

1354
01:11:12,600 --> 01:11:17,200
Speaker 2: success elsewhere and other roles going to Lawrence, Kansas and

1355
01:11:17,320 --> 01:11:20,520
Speaker 2: having no idea how to get to a bowl game whatsoever.

1356
01:11:21,920 --> 01:11:25,759
Speaker 2: So that plays a heavy role in like Kansas's doormat

1357
01:11:25,840 --> 01:11:29,200
Speaker 2: status again, not beating an FBS team, with beating Texas,

1358
01:11:29,200 --> 01:11:31,040
Speaker 2: not a great Texas team, a very average, if not

1359
01:11:31,080 --> 01:11:35,479
Speaker 2: below average Texas team on the road, that one special

1360
01:11:35,479 --> 01:11:39,920
Speaker 2: week that I think holds a little bit more than

1361
01:11:40,240 --> 01:11:43,280
Speaker 2: a double digit win New Mexico's state team winning or

1362
01:11:43,880 --> 01:11:48,240
Speaker 2: a an APP State team who was average but Texas

1363
01:11:48,280 --> 01:11:48,920
Speaker 2: A and M had so.

1364
01:11:50,640 --> 01:11:55,120
Speaker 1: You wanted to put Marshall through over the app State. Yeah,

1365
01:11:57,520 --> 01:11:58,840
Speaker 1: right right, I'm good with that.

1366
01:11:58,920 --> 01:12:02,719
Speaker 2: I'm saying I think those are two top level twenty

1367
01:12:02,720 --> 01:12:03,719
Speaker 2: twenty two is crazy.

1368
01:12:04,000 --> 01:12:09,360
Speaker 1: Yeah all right, So way in soliverbo at gmail dot com.

1369
01:12:09,439 --> 01:12:11,960
Speaker 1: A lot to chew on here. We appreciate everybody bearing

1370
01:12:12,040 --> 01:12:14,639
Speaker 1: with us over these last two episodes. It was fun

1371
01:12:14,680 --> 01:12:18,760
Speaker 1: to do this clip stop I guess it depends on

1372
01:12:18,840 --> 01:12:22,000
Speaker 1: your perspective. My champion, my upset champion over the last

1373
01:12:22,200 --> 01:12:27,719
Speaker 1: four years is Michigan thirteen, Ohio State ten and yours. Yes,

1374
01:12:27,840 --> 01:12:30,000
Speaker 1: we know that there has been a grievance filed with

1375
01:12:30,040 --> 01:12:33,160
Speaker 1: the League office, but you've got Marshall twenty six, Notre

1376
01:12:33,240 --> 01:12:35,920
Speaker 1: Dame twenty one. You know the email. Please write in

1377
01:12:36,040 --> 01:12:37,600
Speaker 1: let us know your thoughts. You can also hit us

1378
01:12:37,680 --> 01:12:40,240
Speaker 1: up on social media wherever you can leave a comment,

1379
01:12:40,280 --> 01:12:42,080
Speaker 1: we would encourage you to do so, be it out

1380
01:12:42,120 --> 01:12:44,800
Speaker 1: on YouTube or any of the podcast apps that let

1381
01:12:44,840 --> 01:12:46,880
Speaker 1: you do that. There are more of them starting to

1382
01:12:46,880 --> 01:12:49,920
Speaker 1: filter out there now, so we get around reading all

1383
01:12:49,920 --> 01:12:52,800
Speaker 1: of it. I promise you don't always do it right away,

1384
01:12:52,840 --> 01:12:55,280
Speaker 1: but if you put a comment out there, we would

1385
01:12:55,280 --> 01:12:57,400
Speaker 1: love to read it. Of course, you can always go

1386
01:12:57,400 --> 01:13:00,200
Speaker 1: out to for bowlers dot com. That is our patreoon on.

1387
01:13:00,640 --> 01:13:03,920
Speaker 1: You can jump into the discord and have this conversation

1388
01:13:04,080 --> 01:13:08,360
Speaker 1: with other reballers who, no doubt we'll have fiery takes

1389
01:13:08,880 --> 01:13:11,840
Speaker 1: on all of these upsets and let us know their opinions. Dan,

1390
01:13:12,600 --> 01:13:14,800
Speaker 1: that's all I have. So look, you're gonna be in

1391
01:13:14,840 --> 01:13:17,400
Speaker 1: California next week or this week, I guess as people

1392
01:13:17,439 --> 01:13:21,799
Speaker 1: are listening to this on Monday, I will be recording

1393
01:13:21,800 --> 01:13:25,080
Speaker 1: with a friend Matt Brown, doing the annual business Update

1394
01:13:25,840 --> 01:13:29,559
Speaker 1: on Wednesday Thursday, So won't want to miss that. Not

1395
01:13:29,640 --> 01:13:32,000
Speaker 1: the sport, not the solid verbal about the sport, Yeah no,

1396
01:13:32,080 --> 01:13:33,840
Speaker 1: not about the show. We don't want to put people

1397
01:13:33,880 --> 01:13:36,920
Speaker 1: to sleep. But we'll be doing that thing with Matt

1398
01:13:36,920 --> 01:13:39,840
Speaker 1: a little bit later on this week, and we'll be

1399
01:13:41,400 --> 01:13:44,280
Speaker 1: I guess fully recharged when you return of to hear it.

1400
01:13:45,000 --> 01:13:47,519
Speaker 1: Enjoy your time out in California. For that guy over there,

1401
01:13:47,560 --> 01:13:49,600
Speaker 1: Dan Rubenstein, for myself, Hi Hillarbry. We will talk to

1402
01:13:49,640 --> 01:13:51,719
Speaker 1: you all soon. Stay solid, peace,