WEBVTT - Betrayal LIVE! on Virgin Voyages 0:00:01.040 --> 0:00:04.680 Hi everyone, it's Andrea. This week, we're doing something a 0:00:04.680 --> 0:00:11.720 little different. My producer Monique and I spent last week 0:00:11.840 --> 0:00:15.880 at sea with Virgin Voyages, where we produced Betrayal's first 0:00:16.000 --> 0:00:19.960 ever live show. Stacy, Tyler and Michaela from Betrayal Season 0:00:19.960 --> 0:00:22.440 three joined us, as well as Caroline and her kids 0:00:22.440 --> 0:00:23.319 from season four. 0:00:24.160 --> 0:00:26.120 If you listen to our show, you know that. 0:00:26.160 --> 0:00:29.840 Stacy's husband, Justin pled guilty to sexual abuse of a minor, 0:00:30.280 --> 0:00:33.280 including his abuse of his step son Tyler, and in 0:00:33.320 --> 0:00:36.400 season four, Caroline's husband Joel was caught having sex in. 0:00:36.440 --> 0:00:37.520 His police patrol car. 0:00:38.080 --> 0:00:41.440 He had carried on multiple affairs during their marriage, including 0:00:41.440 --> 0:00:44.440 some that happened while he was on duty. Together, we 0:00:44.560 --> 0:00:48.960 had an incredible conversation about Survivor Center true Crime and 0:00:49.000 --> 0:00:51.120 what it's like to have your real life turned into 0:00:51.159 --> 0:00:55.000 a true crime podcast. It's an emotional and in depth 0:00:55.040 --> 0:00:57.760 conversation about the kind of work we do and what 0:00:57.800 --> 0:01:00.360 it means to the people who are at the center it. 0:01:01.120 --> 0:01:15.760 We hope you enjoy. 0:01:20.080 --> 0:01:23.400 Hi everyone, I'm Andrea Gunning. I'm the host and producer 0:01:23.720 --> 0:01:24.760 of Betrayal. 0:01:27.480 --> 0:01:30.440 I'm Monique, I'm a producer on Betrayal. I'm going to 0:01:30.480 --> 0:01:34.520 be moderating tonight so that Andrea can really be in 0:01:34.520 --> 0:01:38.560 the conversation because she has poured her soul into this show, 0:01:39.040 --> 0:01:41.520 and she's also been a leader in the podcast industry 0:01:41.560 --> 0:01:45.800 bringing this show to TV, which we're on season three. 0:01:45.880 --> 0:01:47.840 A betrayal on Hulu. 0:01:47.880 --> 0:01:52.040 Just came out last month. When I started this show 0:01:52.120 --> 0:01:55.680 in twenty nineteen, I didn't know if one person would listen, 0:01:55.920 --> 0:01:59.600 if two people would listen. I could have never imagined 0:01:59.680 --> 0:02:03.040 being on a cruise doing our first live show. 0:02:03.200 --> 0:02:08.320 I know, it's really crazy for those of you that 0:02:08.480 --> 0:02:10.160 don't know what Betrayal is. 0:02:10.480 --> 0:02:14.600 It's a project where we focus on families whose lives 0:02:14.639 --> 0:02:19.000 have been upended due to devastating betrayal, and we focus 0:02:19.000 --> 0:02:22.080 on the crime and the aftermath, but it's really a 0:02:22.160 --> 0:02:26.880 show about strength and resilience. Yeah, and so tonight we're 0:02:26.919 --> 0:02:30.520 going to focus on two families. The family from season three, 0:02:30.800 --> 0:02:35.040 which is Stacy Tyler and Mikaela's story, and the family 0:02:35.040 --> 0:02:38.560 from season four about Caroline Brega and her kids. 0:02:39.160 --> 0:02:41.120 For a lot of the survivors we're going to bring 0:02:41.160 --> 0:02:45.400 out tonight, this is their first ever time talking about 0:02:45.440 --> 0:02:48.920 their story to a live audience, and It's a little 0:02:48.960 --> 0:02:52.320 strange to be on stage clapping and cheering for some 0:02:52.360 --> 0:02:54.720 of the worst things that have ever happened to someone. 0:02:54.919 --> 0:02:57.480 It can kind of feel like that, you know, true 0:02:57.480 --> 0:03:02.760 crime cruise. But we're really here to celebrate the survivors 0:03:02.919 --> 0:03:06.760 and the bravery and courage of these families to tell 0:03:06.760 --> 0:03:09.959 their stories, and that's what we're celebrating. 0:03:11.080 --> 0:03:23.720 So, without further ado, let's all welcome Stacy, Tyler, and Mikayla. 0:03:24.360 --> 0:03:25.959 Hey, y'all, how you doing. 0:03:26.480 --> 0:03:32.720 How you feeling good? Good, amazing, A little nervous. 0:03:32.919 --> 0:03:37.160 You know, Stacy, the documentary came out a month ago. 0:03:37.760 --> 0:03:39.600 It seems like a lot of people here are already 0:03:39.600 --> 0:03:41.920 familiar with your story, are listeners of Betrayal. 0:03:42.680 --> 0:03:44.400 So I want to start with what it was like for. 0:03:44.440 --> 0:03:48.280 You to see your I see. 0:03:48.000 --> 0:03:50.720 Your emotional right now, what it was like to see 0:03:51.360 --> 0:03:53.960 your life played back on a true crime documentary. 0:03:54.440 --> 0:03:56.360 I don't think it was something that I ever thought 0:03:56.360 --> 0:04:00.560 would happen. It was just a little different seeing it. 0:04:00.600 --> 0:04:03.080 I know, me and Tyler have had conversations like it 0:04:03.160 --> 0:04:05.440 wasn't our story, Like we were like, oh, what's gonna 0:04:05.440 --> 0:04:10.960 happen next? Like we didn't know, But yeah, there were 0:04:11.000 --> 0:04:13.200 some moments that were tough. I think when they went 0:04:13.320 --> 0:04:16.839 back to the good times or the good times that 0:04:16.880 --> 0:04:21.000 we thought were they were a little hard. We were 0:04:21.080 --> 0:04:24.520 lucky to kind of sit through each other's interviews, so 0:04:24.680 --> 0:04:28.000 the things that we talked about were not new to 0:04:28.120 --> 0:04:29.839 us when the documentary come out because we got to 0:04:29.839 --> 0:04:31.520 sit and be a part of that with each other. 0:04:32.560 --> 0:04:34.240 So that was good. I think that helped us to 0:04:34.320 --> 0:04:37.120 kind of prepare for what was going to be on TV. 0:04:38.240 --> 0:04:40.240 Yeah, Tyler, what about for you? What was it like 0:04:40.320 --> 0:04:42.320 to see it all together watch it back? 0:04:42.720 --> 0:04:44.479 I mean kind of just like similar to what my 0:04:44.520 --> 0:04:47.160 mom said, a lot of just like ooh, this looks good, 0:04:47.320 --> 0:04:50.920 like it isn't our story. But really the biggest thing 0:04:51.000 --> 0:04:54.000 for me was just finally seeing it in person, and 0:04:54.080 --> 0:04:57.479 like knowing that people would see my face with me 0:04:57.600 --> 0:05:00.800 being so young and everything I'd been through. Is really 0:05:00.800 --> 0:05:02.800 big to me that I get my story out there 0:05:02.800 --> 0:05:04.640 and I show a lot of other young men that 0:05:04.920 --> 0:05:07.920 this is not so uncommon and a lot of other 0:05:07.960 --> 0:05:10.320 men go through these struggles. So it was a really 0:05:11.040 --> 0:05:13.520 good moment for me. I was really happy to see 0:05:13.520 --> 0:05:14.279 it in real time. 0:05:15.040 --> 0:05:17.800 Yeah, and you've already experienced people reaching out to you 0:05:18.000 --> 0:05:19.000 after the documentary. 0:05:19.320 --> 0:05:22.360 Yeah, I mean it's when it first came out, it 0:05:22.400 --> 0:05:24.800 was I couldn't even keep up with all the messages. 0:05:24.839 --> 0:05:28.040 I mean there was hundreds a day, and still what 0:05:28.160 --> 0:05:30.719 two months later? At this point, I probably get at 0:05:30.800 --> 0:05:32.800 least five to ten to day, which is still like 0:05:33.000 --> 0:05:38.360 pretty crazy. I've had businesses hit me with job offers 0:05:38.440 --> 0:05:41.279 to work at a gym as a personal trainer. I've 0:05:41.320 --> 0:05:44.480 had some pretty big celebrities hit me up to continue 0:05:44.480 --> 0:05:46.320 telling my story and do some pretty big things. 0:05:46.320 --> 0:05:47.360 So I'm excited for that. 0:05:48.680 --> 0:05:50.720 Yeah, we're all so excited for you. 0:05:50.800 --> 0:05:51.400 I'm proud of you. 0:05:51.920 --> 0:05:56.200 I want to talk about updates since the documentary came out. 0:05:56.600 --> 0:05:59.760 Uh yeah, So my stepfather, who you all saw in 0:05:59.800 --> 0:06:06.000 this documentary, he is currently suing me for defamation. Yeah, yeah, 0:06:06.200 --> 0:06:10.960 defamation made it all up. Yeah, suing me for defamation 0:06:11.080 --> 0:06:13.720 because everything I said was a lie. I wish I 0:06:13.760 --> 0:06:15.839 could show you all the papers. It's a bunch of bullshit. 0:06:17.120 --> 0:06:19.000 I'm gonna be real, I'm blunt. 0:06:19.080 --> 0:06:24.560 I'm not gonna hide who I am. 0:06:24.800 --> 0:06:25.480 Thank you guys. 0:06:25.680 --> 0:06:27.960 Yeah, but he he wants to sue me for coming 0:06:27.960 --> 0:06:29.520 out and talking. But I hope he knows. All that 0:06:29.560 --> 0:06:31.039 does is motivate me to keep coming. 0:06:34.240 --> 0:06:35.880 Yeah, Andrea, do you want to talk about that a 0:06:35.880 --> 0:06:40.839 little bit? About the defamation lawsuit and like the ways 0:06:40.920 --> 0:06:43.360 that we see those being used, I think to manipulate 0:06:43.720 --> 0:06:46.200 a lot of times storytellers and try to silence people 0:06:46.200 --> 0:06:47.760 from telling their stories survivors. 0:06:48.120 --> 0:06:50.839 Yeah, I just think it was a scare tactic to 0:06:50.920 --> 0:06:53.400 try to keep Tyler from speaking. 0:06:53.880 --> 0:06:56.480 And you know, oftentimes. 0:06:55.800 --> 0:07:00.680 We see perpetrators try to control this story, and I 0:07:00.720 --> 0:07:02.839 think he was used to being in control for a 0:07:02.880 --> 0:07:07.040 really long time. And you know, you've got a great 0:07:07.040 --> 0:07:09.640 attorney and you're working on it. 0:07:10.080 --> 0:07:10.320 Yep. 0:07:11.440 --> 0:07:14.320 You know, his lawyer told me, you have to have 0:07:14.440 --> 0:07:18.880 character to say a defamation of character, and we've clearly 0:07:19.040 --> 0:07:25.400 proven that you don't have character. So you know, everybody's 0:07:25.440 --> 0:07:29.000 a jail house lawyer, so we knew this was going 0:07:29.080 --> 0:07:33.840 to happen. He's filing appeals as well, because he's throwing 0:07:33.880 --> 0:07:36.920 anything at the wall to make it stick and whatever. 0:07:38.280 --> 0:07:42.600 He's trying to appeal his sentence because it was too long. Boohoo. 0:07:44.080 --> 0:07:45.680 We know that this is something that we're probably going 0:07:45.760 --> 0:07:47.480 to have to deal with for the rest of our lives. 0:07:47.520 --> 0:07:50.600 Because that is his right, I've been told. But you know, 0:07:50.640 --> 0:07:54.280 in the end, he just constantly keeps bearing himself because 0:07:54.280 --> 0:07:57.040 the district attorney told me, the more appeals you file, 0:07:57.840 --> 0:08:00.760 the more it looks like you show no remorse. So 0:08:00.800 --> 0:08:03.080 she said, every time he does this, it's another nail 0:08:03.120 --> 0:08:05.920 in his coffin. So we fully intend that he's going 0:08:06.000 --> 0:08:08.239 to put himself there for his maximum sentence. 0:08:08.800 --> 0:08:10.960 We're going to bring your oldest daughter, Mikaela in in 0:08:11.000 --> 0:08:13.320 a second. But I want to talk about the family 0:08:13.360 --> 0:08:17.040 decision to participate in first the podcast and then the 0:08:17.080 --> 0:08:19.000 Hulu documentary. 0:08:19.160 --> 0:08:22.880 When they reached out to me about the podcast, I 0:08:22.880 --> 0:08:26.160 immediately talked to Mikaela and Tyler about it because it's 0:08:26.240 --> 0:08:29.400 not my story, it's all of our stories. I wasn't 0:08:29.400 --> 0:08:32.000 going to exploit my child by going out and speaking 0:08:32.040 --> 0:08:35.080 without his knowledge. So I told him, if we do this, 0:08:35.160 --> 0:08:38.720 we do it all together. And it was just something 0:08:38.800 --> 0:08:41.640 that we felt, I think that we needed to do 0:08:42.400 --> 0:08:45.760 for healing, and just we wanted to take something like 0:08:45.800 --> 0:08:49.200 this and turn it into something good, and we knew 0:08:49.200 --> 0:08:50.520 that that was the only way that we could do 0:08:50.559 --> 0:08:52.640 it was to just make for people more aware because 0:08:52.679 --> 0:08:55.880 I think when you first have this happen to you, 0:08:55.880 --> 0:08:58.000 you have so many people come up to you and say, 0:08:58.080 --> 0:08:59.920 oh my gosh, you know that that happened to me, 0:09:00.120 --> 0:09:02.120 or that happened to my brother or this, and you don't. 0:09:02.320 --> 0:09:05.679 You have no idea how many people you know that 0:09:05.920 --> 0:09:08.000 have dealt with the same thing. I think we have 0:09:08.040 --> 0:09:10.240 a lot of broken people in this world, and I 0:09:10.240 --> 0:09:12.200 think it's because a lot of people say silent about 0:09:12.240 --> 0:09:15.200 these things. So I think our hope was that we 0:09:15.280 --> 0:09:18.280 could reach a lot more hurting men and just change 0:09:18.320 --> 0:09:18.679 the world. 0:09:19.400 --> 0:09:23.720 Uh yeah, pretty much second that. But yeah, going into 0:09:23.760 --> 0:09:26.040 all this, it was just about I knew what I 0:09:26.040 --> 0:09:30.200 had been through, you know, searching the web looking things 0:09:30.280 --> 0:09:32.760 up as a child, going through all this, I genuinely 0:09:32.800 --> 0:09:34.840 thought I was the only boy in the world who 0:09:34.960 --> 0:09:36.920 knew what this was like. And I thought I was 0:09:36.920 --> 0:09:39.000 the only boy in the world who had went through 0:09:39.000 --> 0:09:40.680 something like this. And that was a big part of 0:09:40.720 --> 0:09:44.240 the reason why I never talked. I never I never 0:09:44.280 --> 0:09:46.480 did anything to make a change because I thought this 0:09:46.640 --> 0:09:48.319 was just my life, this is where I was stuck. 0:09:48.360 --> 0:09:51.800 No one would understand me. But as I've gone throughout 0:09:51.800 --> 0:09:54.960 this journey, I've shared my story talk to endless people. 0:09:55.240 --> 0:09:59.240 I've realized it's an epidemic. To be honest, it's crazy, 0:09:59.280 --> 0:10:01.200 the amount of men that I've realized to have went 0:10:01.200 --> 0:10:03.959 through the exact same things I have. They say it's 0:10:04.000 --> 0:10:06.360 one in six, but with all the people I've talked to, 0:10:06.480 --> 0:10:09.319 it's probably even higher than that. I wouldn't be surprised 0:10:09.320 --> 0:10:11.120 if it was more one in four one in three. 0:10:12.000 --> 0:10:13.920 You're not alone if you're a man who'd been through 0:10:13.920 --> 0:10:17.479 something like this. And when I was represented the opportunity 0:10:17.520 --> 0:10:20.319 to come through, do this, use my story to give 0:10:20.440 --> 0:10:22.839 other men what I didn't have. I couldn't pass it up. 0:10:27.400 --> 0:10:31.959 Andre, you've worked on the story now two years more almost, 0:10:32.080 --> 0:10:35.400 so you know a big part of production we spend 0:10:35.679 --> 0:10:37.920 hours and hours and hours and hours. A lot of 0:10:37.920 --> 0:10:40.800 those moments never make it to air. Especially with the 0:10:40.880 --> 0:10:43.400 Hulu documentary, you're filming a lot of things that never 0:10:43.400 --> 0:10:46.439 make it to air. So can you tell me about 0:10:46.720 --> 0:10:47.680 some of those moments? 0:10:48.200 --> 0:10:51.079 Yeah, I mean, there was one scene that we shoed 0:10:51.120 --> 0:10:54.040 Tyler and that was my favorite scene to do. 0:10:54.559 --> 0:10:56.800 I hate even calling it a scene, but it was. 0:10:57.600 --> 0:11:00.840 And we were just like working out talking. 0:11:00.559 --> 0:11:03.640 About life and where you are now and I've known 0:11:03.679 --> 0:11:07.679 you for two years and you've grown so much, and 0:11:07.720 --> 0:11:09.920 I think one of the things that you were working 0:11:10.000 --> 0:11:15.080 on is learning to stop thinking about life in the 0:11:15.120 --> 0:11:19.079 conditional way, like if I do this, then I'll be happy. 0:11:19.240 --> 0:11:22.920 If I get here, I'll be happy. If this happens, 0:11:23.000 --> 0:11:28.560 I'll be okay. Because that's what happens when survivors of abuse, 0:11:29.160 --> 0:11:34.839 they go through that, because that exchange is conditional, it's transactional. 0:11:35.720 --> 0:11:37.199 And I feel like you've. 0:11:37.040 --> 0:11:40.760 Come such a long way to just be present and 0:11:40.800 --> 0:11:43.880 figure out who you want to be and do what 0:11:43.960 --> 0:11:46.720 you want to do. And we talked about that in 0:11:46.800 --> 0:11:49.560 the scene and that was like my favorite, and it 0:11:49.600 --> 0:11:50.600 didn't make it to air. 0:11:51.400 --> 0:11:53.920 I think, Michela, you have a scene too that you love. 0:11:54.760 --> 0:11:56.160 Yeah, I had a scene. 0:11:57.040 --> 0:12:01.160 Tyler made a comment to me about how he was 0:12:01.280 --> 0:12:04.640 very thankful that I was like the stronghold for our 0:12:04.720 --> 0:12:08.959 family and that he was very sorry that I was 0:12:09.040 --> 0:12:11.880 kind of put on the back burner, Like it was 0:12:11.960 --> 0:12:17.600 just very sweet, very emotional moment that I think a 0:12:17.600 --> 0:12:20.240 lot of people needed to see. 0:12:20.280 --> 0:12:21.480 And that got cut too. 0:12:21.760 --> 0:12:25.959 Mikayla's kind of I don't want to say his silent victim, 0:12:27.160 --> 0:12:30.400 but I think that you know, all of the focus 0:12:30.559 --> 0:12:33.320 was really on like Tyler and his healing and what 0:12:33.480 --> 0:12:36.600 happened to him, And it was a really good moment 0:12:36.720 --> 0:12:38.319 for us to say to you that, you know, we 0:12:38.320 --> 0:12:43.120 were sorry that you kind of got faded into the 0:12:43.120 --> 0:12:46.079 background a little bit, because that's was never anyone's intention, 0:12:46.600 --> 0:12:48.679 you know, So it was it was a sweet moment 0:12:48.720 --> 0:12:51.400 between everybody, and we were really sad when the documentary 0:12:51.440 --> 0:12:54.480 came out. We were like, man, that was such a 0:12:54.480 --> 0:12:55.199 good moment. 0:12:55.920 --> 0:12:58.720 Yeah, like your mom was saying, you know, you're part 0:12:58.760 --> 0:13:02.400 of the story. Can sometimes get overshadowed, but if it 0:13:02.440 --> 0:13:04.520 was not for you, we might not be sitting here. 0:13:04.640 --> 0:13:07.000 So can you tell me a little bit about reporting 0:13:07.440 --> 0:13:09.560 to the police what that experience was for you. 0:13:09.800 --> 0:13:14.199 Yeah, So, for those of you that didn't listen, Tyler's friend, 0:13:14.280 --> 0:13:17.360 who is I guess we'll call him, for lack of 0:13:17.440 --> 0:13:21.560 better terms, the first victim. He reached out to me 0:13:21.880 --> 0:13:25.440 and disclosed to me that my stepdad had done this 0:13:25.480 --> 0:13:32.320 to him, and like full disclosure. I was driving and 0:13:32.840 --> 0:13:37.280 I opened the message and immediately started like bawling, and 0:13:37.400 --> 0:13:40.319 of course, like forty million things are going through my head, 0:13:40.400 --> 0:13:43.520 one thing being this is why you don't text and drive. 0:13:43.720 --> 0:13:43.880 But. 0:13:45.440 --> 0:13:49.400 I mean, so I pulled over, had like a two 0:13:49.480 --> 0:13:51.520 minute cry, and then I was. 0:13:51.559 --> 0:13:52.760 Like work mode. 0:13:53.320 --> 0:13:56.760 At the time, I worked at an outpatient psychiatry office, 0:13:57.400 --> 0:14:01.800 so I was like a mandated reporter, and so I 0:14:01.800 --> 0:14:04.800 immediately went to work mode and was like, Okay, these 0:14:04.840 --> 0:14:07.200 are the steps I need to do, and I'm going 0:14:07.280 --> 0:14:09.600 to do them. I do not care that he is 0:14:09.679 --> 0:14:12.840 my stepdad. I don't care who the fuck he is. 0:14:13.400 --> 0:14:18.520 And now the scary part, I guess for me was 0:14:18.600 --> 0:14:23.360 that this was different. At work, I just make a report, 0:14:24.040 --> 0:14:28.479 but here he was already under investigation for the cameras, 0:14:28.960 --> 0:14:32.480 and so I was like, okay, I feel like I 0:14:32.520 --> 0:14:35.120 need to talk to a detective or something like. 0:14:35.200 --> 0:14:35.680 I don't know. 0:14:36.640 --> 0:14:39.920 It was just like something in my brain didn't care 0:14:40.080 --> 0:14:42.680 that he was a father figure to me. It was like, 0:14:43.480 --> 0:14:45.720 let's get this done, let's do the right thing. 0:14:46.880 --> 0:14:49.800 And then that next few hours moved really quickly. 0:14:50.440 --> 0:14:55.120 Yeah, So I drove about an hour and a half 0:14:55.280 --> 0:14:59.280 or so to the police station, and then when I 0:14:59.320 --> 0:15:02.520 got there, I gave them my phone. They took all 0:15:02.520 --> 0:15:06.480 the evidence off of it, all the messages with his friend, 0:15:07.040 --> 0:15:09.840 and then they were like, oh, well, while you're here, 0:15:10.600 --> 0:15:15.960 let's go through this binder. And they opened it and 0:15:16.040 --> 0:15:21.760 it was photos of friends, family, anything you can think of. 0:15:22.640 --> 0:15:27.880 In the bathroom, they had me identify everybody, and then 0:15:28.440 --> 0:15:32.200 they whipped out another binder, and that binder was all me. 0:15:33.440 --> 0:15:34.920 I saw my husband on some. 0:15:34.880 --> 0:15:37.480 Photos, and then. 0:15:37.440 --> 0:15:38.640 After that I left. 0:15:38.960 --> 0:15:40.960 I called mom immediately. 0:15:41.040 --> 0:15:43.680 She's like, I don't know what I'm doing, but I'm 0:15:43.760 --> 0:15:44.280 leaving work. 0:15:44.280 --> 0:15:47.440 I'm grabbing my kids and we're going. And I was like, well, 0:15:47.880 --> 0:15:48.240 I have. 0:15:48.160 --> 0:15:52.000 A tiny, little one bedroom apartment, but you could stay 0:15:52.040 --> 0:15:56.680 with me. Poor Tommy he didn't even know any of 0:15:56.720 --> 0:16:00.120 this because it was like so fast everything's happening that 0:16:00.160 --> 0:16:03.200 I didn't get time to tell him until he was 0:16:03.200 --> 0:16:05.360 already off work. And I was like, hey, by the way, 0:16:05.520 --> 0:16:08.160 mom and the kids are coming to our tiny little guys, 0:16:08.840 --> 0:16:12.760 right like our tiny little nine hundred square foot one 0:16:12.800 --> 0:16:16.200 bedroom apartment. I worked from home for a few days, 0:16:16.440 --> 0:16:18.440 try to help mom with the kids, try. 0:16:18.280 --> 0:16:20.080 To figure life out. 0:16:20.200 --> 0:16:23.280 And then Tyler came forward, Yeah, we're going to talk 0:16:23.320 --> 0:16:25.560 more about that time period and kind of like survival 0:16:25.600 --> 0:16:29.080 mode and how that gets represented in true crime stories. 0:16:29.360 --> 0:16:31.480 But I also want to talk about your position as 0:16:31.520 --> 0:16:32.520 the eldest daughter. 0:16:32.320 --> 0:16:33.520 And Tyler's big sister. 0:16:33.920 --> 0:16:36.200 Can you tell me from your perspective what it's been 0:16:36.280 --> 0:16:39.960 like to watch Tyler's journey of coming forward and then 0:16:40.160 --> 0:16:42.000 getting to the place where he is today. 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:42.680 Yeah. 0:16:42.720 --> 0:16:43.320 Absolutely. 0:16:44.480 --> 0:16:49.320 Just watching him help other people is something that I 0:16:49.360 --> 0:16:53.320 can't even explain to anybody, what kind of feeling that 0:16:53.480 --> 0:16:57.040 is inside as somebody who was his caretaker for a 0:16:57.080 --> 0:16:57.520 long time. 0:16:58.200 --> 0:17:00.000 Yeah, yeah, well thank you. 0:17:00.440 --> 0:17:04.000 What about for you, Stacy, watching Tyler go on this 0:17:04.080 --> 0:17:07.000 journey over the past few years with the show, what 0:17:07.040 --> 0:17:09.920 has that been like for you as a mom? 0:17:10.040 --> 0:17:14.920 I don't think anybody can never understand what betrayal did 0:17:14.960 --> 0:17:17.480 for us. You know, we had a lot of people 0:17:17.520 --> 0:17:19.600 say things like, you know, gosh, why would you want 0:17:19.600 --> 0:17:21.359 to share that? Or why do you want to go 0:17:21.480 --> 0:17:24.160 national with that? And this and that? And I had 0:17:24.160 --> 0:17:28.040 those moments, especially when people can be very cruel online 0:17:28.119 --> 0:17:34.600 and judge. But I think seeing him grow and also 0:17:34.880 --> 0:17:38.520 just seeing the men that have came behind him and said, 0:17:39.320 --> 0:17:42.400 you know, I'm fifty some years old and I've never 0:17:42.480 --> 0:17:46.159 told anybody this in my life. There are people that 0:17:46.240 --> 0:17:49.119 are free because of you, And I'm incredibly proud to 0:17:49.119 --> 0:17:53.399 be your mother, and I don't care what anybody says. 0:17:53.480 --> 0:17:57.280 And I don't care. You know, if someone thinks I 0:17:57.320 --> 0:18:00.359 did something wrong, I think I did things wrong. If 0:18:00.359 --> 0:18:02.280 I was watching my documentary, I would have been like 0:18:02.520 --> 0:18:08.359 m girl. I would have talked about myself. It's true. 0:18:08.520 --> 0:18:10.720 You know, when you're in those kind of moments, you 0:18:10.760 --> 0:18:13.800 know you're just coming from a place of just sheer chaos. 0:18:13.840 --> 0:18:17.000 But I'm just incredibly proud to be your mom. 0:18:17.640 --> 0:18:18.560 Well, thank you guys. 0:18:20.240 --> 0:18:24.560 He still don't take the trash out enough, though, we 0:18:24.600 --> 0:18:25.199 could work on that. 0:18:26.359 --> 0:18:27.040 She's lying. 0:18:43.480 --> 0:18:44.160 Welcome back. 0:18:44.440 --> 0:18:46.920 We took a short break to bring out Caroline Barrega 0:18:47.000 --> 0:18:50.280 from season four, along with her two kids. Her daughter 0:18:50.400 --> 0:18:53.520 Nicole was on stage and her son participated from the 0:18:53.560 --> 0:18:55.480 audience to protect his anonymity. 0:18:56.480 --> 0:18:58.280 Thank you all so much for being here. 0:18:58.520 --> 0:18:59.480 Thank you for having us. 0:19:00.160 --> 0:19:02.920 Caroline, you know I want to hear a little bit 0:19:02.920 --> 0:19:05.960 in your words about what you went through. 0:19:06.880 --> 0:19:09.159 It was an infamous Monday afternoon. 0:19:09.240 --> 0:19:12.119 I was at work and I opened my laptop and 0:19:12.160 --> 0:19:16.000 I was in an online meeting, and I saw my 0:19:16.119 --> 0:19:18.280 phone go off. There was a chime, and I saw 0:19:18.320 --> 0:19:20.959 that there were cameras around our house, and that there 0:19:21.000 --> 0:19:24.119 was some movement, and as I looked at it, I 0:19:24.680 --> 0:19:27.760 noticed that my now ex husband was dragging up the 0:19:27.760 --> 0:19:30.120 trash cans, and I thought to myself, Oh, that's strange 0:19:31.400 --> 0:19:33.240 what he's doing home so early. Maybe he was out 0:19:33.240 --> 0:19:35.840 on an investigation or something happened and he just ran 0:19:35.880 --> 0:19:38.320 by to grab some lunch. And I continue to watch, 0:19:38.800 --> 0:19:40.880 and then it dawned on me, where's his take home 0:19:40.960 --> 0:19:45.359 cop car? The take home cop car wasn't in the driveway, 0:19:45.560 --> 0:19:47.440 and so I texted him and I said, hey, is 0:19:47.480 --> 0:19:51.240 everything okay? And he didn't respond, and hey, is everything okay? 0:19:51.320 --> 0:19:53.280 I noticed that you're home really early, and I just 0:19:53.359 --> 0:19:56.960 continued to watch the little dots the three ellipses on 0:19:57.000 --> 0:20:01.560 my phone bounce, and finally he respond and he said, no, 0:20:01.680 --> 0:20:02.760 everything's not okay. 0:20:03.000 --> 0:20:05.040 I fucked up the worst I've ever fucked up in 0:20:05.080 --> 0:20:05.520 my life. 0:20:05.560 --> 0:20:09.160 You're going to want to divorce me. And I was scared, 0:20:09.200 --> 0:20:12.080 and I thought, you know what happened, And so after 0:20:12.359 --> 0:20:16.600 several attempts, he finally answered the phone, and he was 0:20:16.720 --> 0:20:19.240 very stoic about it and just let me know what 0:20:19.320 --> 0:20:22.520 he did. And I was able to maintain my composure. 0:20:22.840 --> 0:20:26.240 I gently closed my laptop and then I walked out 0:20:26.240 --> 0:20:28.480 and I made it to a street corner before I 0:20:28.600 --> 0:20:31.960 just completely lost it and I said, what have you done? 0:20:32.040 --> 0:20:35.920 And he just emphasized repeatedly, I'm sorry. I'm so sorry, Caroline. 0:20:35.960 --> 0:20:37.720 You have to tell the kids. Reporters are going to 0:20:37.800 --> 0:20:39.720 start calling the house. You have to tell the kids. 0:20:40.960 --> 0:20:42.040 And I didn't know what to do. 0:20:42.680 --> 0:20:43.720 I drove home. 0:20:43.960 --> 0:20:49.320 I don't remember driving home, and when I got to 0:20:49.400 --> 0:20:52.760 the house, I was just kind of pacing. And Nicole 0:20:52.920 --> 0:20:55.639 came home and she was very jovial, her typical self, 0:20:55.720 --> 0:20:58.280 and she said, Hey, who doing my job for me? 0:20:58.320 --> 0:21:01.959 Who brought the trash up today? I mean, it's ironic, 0:21:02.040 --> 0:21:05.040 the stuff you remember in times of trauma. And I 0:21:05.160 --> 0:21:09.080 just sat there staring at her, and she said, are 0:21:09.119 --> 0:21:09.639 you okay? 0:21:09.680 --> 0:21:12.159 And I said no, and she said, is daddy okay. 0:21:12.920 --> 0:21:14.919 I didn't even know how to respond, and I just 0:21:14.960 --> 0:21:16.000 said no. 0:21:17.640 --> 0:21:20.160 And she got kind of this shock, because when you're 0:21:20.240 --> 0:21:23.120 a cops kid, you live in fear that something happens 0:21:23.160 --> 0:21:23.760 to your dad. 0:21:24.880 --> 0:21:26.440 And the next. 0:21:26.200 --> 0:21:29.280 Words out of her mouth were, did he get caught 0:21:29.320 --> 0:21:36.679 cheating on you? And I just stared at her. And 0:21:36.720 --> 0:21:38.720 for those of you who have listened to the podcast. 0:21:38.800 --> 0:21:41.960 I can assure you my son graduated with honors from 0:21:42.160 --> 0:21:47.680