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Speaker 1: You're listening to the Buck Sexton Show podcast, make sure

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Speaker 1: you subscribe to the podcast on the iHeartRadio app or

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Speaker 1: wherever you get your podcasts. Why is Gavin Newsom letting

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Speaker 1: men beat women in track and field? This is a

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Speaker 1: violation of Title nine. It's a violation of common sense.

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Speaker 1: And our next guest knows exactly how absurd this stuff

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Speaker 1: can get. Paulus Scanlon is with us now. She is

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Speaker 1: a senior fellow at the American Principals Project and a

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Speaker 1: former Division one swimmer who liked Riley Gaines had her

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Speaker 1: own experience with a transman or trans woman. I know,

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Speaker 1: I just know the transpart. I forget what we're supposed

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Speaker 1: to say a guy saying he's a girl. Tell everybody

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Speaker 1: a little bit about your background, how you came into

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Speaker 1: this sports debate situation. Men and women should be separate.

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Speaker 1: All that.

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Speaker 2: Well, I'm sure everyone knows who the wonderful six foot

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Speaker 2: four and a half giant Leah Thomas is.

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Speaker 3: He was my teammate.

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Speaker 2: He went on and obviously tied Riley at the NCAA Championship,

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Speaker 2: which everyone saw the ridiculous photo of them together on

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Speaker 2: the podium stand. But he was my teammate and my university,

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Speaker 2: the University of Pennsylvania, told us if we ever spoke

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Speaker 2: out against him being on the team, that we would

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Speaker 2: never be able to find a job, that we would

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Speaker 2: be painted as a hateful, disgusting bigot for the rest

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Speaker 2: of our lives. They even compared not wanting to undress

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Speaker 2: in the locker room with him eighteen times per week

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Speaker 2: as not wanting to undress with someone based on the

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Speaker 2: race in the nineteen sixties.

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Speaker 1: So that was said to you by employees of U

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Speaker 1: University Pennsylvania.

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Speaker 3: Yes, they said, this is the next civil rights movement.

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Speaker 2: You don't want to be known as those bigots in

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Speaker 2: the nineteen sixties that wanted to segregate locker rooms based

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Speaker 2: on people's race. And I'm sitting there, I'm like, there's

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Speaker 2: no way you genuinely believe this. And then it gets better.

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Speaker 2: At the end of this meeting, they said, Okay, if

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Speaker 2: everything we've said and screamed at you for the last

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Speaker 2: twenty minutes is not enough for you, here's the representative

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Speaker 2: from student psychological Services. Please go make an appointment because

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Speaker 2: you are the problem and you need help. And the

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Speaker 2: man on our team who's trying to pretend to be

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Speaker 2: a woman. He didn't have to come to this meeting,

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Speaker 2: he didn't have to go to the counselor, and he

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Speaker 2: was told that he was completely in the right and

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Speaker 2: he was totally valid in his identity, and go on.

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Speaker 3: And go forth.

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Speaker 1: Ah, that's that's not I've heard some of this from

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Speaker 1: Riley Gains the side of it, but I hadn't heard

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Speaker 1: from you as a teammate. That's pretty astonishing stuff. We're

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Speaker 1: going to get into this ab Hernandez case in a second.

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Speaker 1: It's a high school state track championship. And I don't

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Speaker 1: know if you managed to see some of what CNN's

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Speaker 1: Brianna Keeler was saying over the weekend about this, but'

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Speaker 1: the usual A lot of the arguments that you'll hear

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Speaker 1: around this, and I'll have you address them as somebody

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Speaker 1: who had who had to swim with and against a man?

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Speaker 1: Was was he? So you did have to change with him? Right?

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Speaker 1: I mean not to get too deep into this, but right, yes.

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Speaker 2: Eighteen times per week for a year, because we have

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Speaker 2: nine practices every single week, and you change in and

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Speaker 2: change out of your swimsuit every practice, so he's eighteen

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Speaker 2: times completely naked per week in front of this.

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Speaker 1: Grown man and this guy Thomas. Was he attracted to women?

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Speaker 1: I mean not again, Like this is the thing that

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Speaker 1: I think is no, really like is he is he trands?

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Speaker 1: But but you know, biologically heterosexual, because like that would

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Speaker 1: seem to be even I don't know, it's it's crazy

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Speaker 1: stuff across the board is yes, what what do you think?

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Speaker 1: I mean, it's does he date women or men?

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Speaker 2: Well, he was actually dating a member of the women's

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Speaker 2: team prior.

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Speaker 3: To transitioning to Will.

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Speaker 2: But then his current partner is actually another man that

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Speaker 2: says he's a woman. So maybe both men and women

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Speaker 2: and also people who are also confused. I don't know,

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Speaker 2: but look, to be honest to me, it doesn't matter.

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Speaker 2: The entire thing is this person is clearly not well

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Speaker 2: and they should not be on a women's sports team.

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Speaker 3: End of story.

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Speaker 1: I think that's a that's a perfectly straightforward and sane

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Speaker 1: approach to this. So with that, you must have seen

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Speaker 1: a big story near times, all these different papers covering it.

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Speaker 1: Trans Athlete ab Hernandez got first place in the high jump,

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Speaker 1: first place in the triple jump in the California High

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Speaker 1: School Championship, and then we're supposed to cheer because he

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Speaker 1: and of course they all call this person she he

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Speaker 1: shared the podium with, you know, with the girls, Like

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Speaker 1: this is supposed to be some kind of a concession

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Speaker 1: to ab Hernandez's magnanimity or something. It strikes me is

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Speaker 1: this whole thing is insane.

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Speaker 2: I think the guitar thing is just ridiculous that he's

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Speaker 2: even there. I mean, we're seeing CNN and all these

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Speaker 2: other news outlets trying to hype this up to be

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Speaker 2: a good thing. I think, honestly, Trump is in a

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Speaker 2: really good position right now stepping into this, continuing to

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Speaker 2: put pressure on these states. California should be just not

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Speaker 2: just defunded sports and Title nine wise, I think we

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Speaker 2: should just defund the entire state of California. And unfortunately,

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Speaker 2: in this situation, what we're seeing is these left wing states,

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Speaker 2: Blue states are pushing this, and the Southern states and

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Speaker 2: the conservative states have figured out and they're like, no,

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Speaker 2: men don't belong on women's sports teams yet, California, And

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Speaker 2: this is happening every weekend.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, there's a number of states that are defying the

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Speaker 1: Trump administration on this issue, and they're in doing so

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Speaker 1: jeopardizing federal funds, which it's interesting to me, Paula, that

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Speaker 1: has always been the mechanism used to get compliance with

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Speaker 1: Title nine, and we never heard a peep about it

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Speaker 1: before then, and now it's, oh my gosh, what will

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Speaker 1: happen to all the people affected by their withdrawal of funds?

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Speaker 1: Like well, if you were a university and you didn't

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Speaker 1: have parody in spending between men's and women's sports, you

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Speaker 1: risk your Title nine funding. So that's what they got

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Speaker 1: rid of, all these men's wrestling programs and crew programs

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Speaker 1: and all this at different schools. So it used to

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Speaker 1: be fine, but now this is a tool that we're

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Speaker 1: told we can't use it anymore. It feels pretty arbitrary

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Speaker 1: and obviously political.

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Speaker 3: It's the entire situation is just completely ridiculous.

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Speaker 2: I mean, even on the women's swim team at Penn,

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Speaker 2: before Leah Thomas was competing on it, our coach had

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Speaker 2: told us we had to have more women on the

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Speaker 2: women's roster or men would have to get cut, and

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Speaker 2: every single season it would be up to the number

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Speaker 2: of girls he'd recruited, or even if a girl chose

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Speaker 2: to quit, it would cut another boys spot.

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Speaker 3: Off our team.

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Speaker 2: I mean, this is something we dealt with in all

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Speaker 2: of college and now it's like, well, actually, the men,

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Speaker 2: if they get cut from the men's program, they can

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Speaker 2: just hop onto the women's team, and for some reason

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Speaker 2: now it adds them another female athlete to the university.

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Speaker 2: And also they're allowed to compete and beat all of

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Speaker 2: these women in any sport that they want to. I mean,

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Speaker 2: it's just completely ridiculous. And again this guy, oh great,

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Speaker 2: he shared the podium with a woman. He should not

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Speaker 2: be there. Go compete in the men's category. No one's

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Speaker 2: kicking you out of sports. Yet, it's a narcissism thing.

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Speaker 2: This isn't even about athletics anymore. These are narcissistic, mentally

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Speaker 2: unwell people that just want to rob opportunities away from

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Speaker 2: others and enjoy doing that.

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Speaker 1: by Paradigm Press. PAULA. Yeah, so you might have seen

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Speaker 1: on CNN there was the anchor arguing with this conservative

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Speaker 1: legal you know, sort of legal activist, and one of

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Speaker 1: the things I said is, we don't know if men

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Speaker 1: have an advantage over women biologically, we need more study.

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Speaker 1: What do you say to that as somebody who swam

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Speaker 1: division ie as a.

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Speaker 2: Female, I think the situation is just completely insane and

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Speaker 2: CNN is losing their minds. We do not need science

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Speaker 2: degrees to even see this. Have you watched any of

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Speaker 2: the years of the Olympics. And actually, when I was

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Speaker 2: researching this very early on, when I was dealing with

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Speaker 2: this four years ago, I actually found a New York

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Speaker 2: Times article talking about the differences between male and female

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Speaker 2: athletes and comparing how all of the male champions in

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Speaker 2: every single Olympic event were better than the female champions.

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Speaker 2: I don't I'm trying to give them research or studies,

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Speaker 2: but it's not about that. It's they've perpetuated fake news

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Speaker 2: and every single thing that they've ever talked about, so

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Speaker 2: it's not surprising that they're magically losing touch with reality

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Speaker 2: and saying men and women just, oh, we need to

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Speaker 2: see more science. I don't think you need to see anything.

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Speaker 2: Watch the Olympics, watch NCAA basketball, watch I don't even

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Speaker 2: I don't even know anything. High school basketball team. You

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Speaker 2: can see the difference.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, It's it strikes me as very clear, though CNN

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Speaker 1: also took the position with this anchor, But I know

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Speaker 1: the Democrats more broadly will take this position that gender

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Speaker 1: is the sex you're assigned at birth, or rather that

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Speaker 1: sex assigned at birth is what people refer to, not gender.

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Speaker 1: It's they keep changing these definitions. But as if doctors

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Speaker 1: look at it and make some determination that isn't based

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Speaker 1: on the most obvious things imaginable.

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Speaker 2: I I again, it's like I want to give them

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Speaker 2: scientific research, and I tried to do that.

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Speaker 3: I would look at facts, I would look at information.

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Speaker 2: I would say, oh, here, the you know, tistaschon doesn't

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Speaker 2: actually suppressing your disashone doesn't get rid of all these

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Speaker 2: other factors that make you physically different. And we would

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Speaker 2: try to reason with these leftist activists on these issues,

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Speaker 2: and they didn't want to hear us. And so at

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Speaker 2: this point, I don't really know what else I can say.

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Speaker 2: All I know is I'm watching these track meets. I'm

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Speaker 2: watching all of these events that male athletes are competing in,

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Speaker 2: and it does not take a very intelligent person to

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Speaker 2: see that men and women are different. And I think

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Speaker 2: human society has known men and women are different for

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Speaker 2: thousands of years and I don't know why in the

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Speaker 2: year twenty twenty five, somehow that's just forgotten and doesn't

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Speaker 2: exist anymore.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it is getting increasingly and obviously insane, and the

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Speaker 1: Democrats aren't backing off of this. I'm just wondering when

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Speaker 1: you were dealing with this at University Pennsylvania or swimming,

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Speaker 1: there were any of the girls, to your knowledge, like

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Speaker 1: on board for all of this, the ones who were

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Speaker 1: competing themselves, were some of them actually brainwashed enough to

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Speaker 1: think that this was normal? Or was everyone just like

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Speaker 1: this is crazy?

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Speaker 3: There were a few girls that absolutely stood by it.

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Speaker 3: They would talk about it, they would write letters. There

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Speaker 3: was actually something.

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Speaker 2: That they had released to the NCAA, a letter saying,

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Speaker 2: US athletes on the team support Thomas.

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Speaker 3: You can go find that that was something that happened.

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Speaker 2: Yes, there were absolutely girls who bought into this, were

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Speaker 2: brainwashed and truly believed that Leah Thomas was a woman

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Speaker 2: simply because he said so.

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Speaker 1: That's craziness. All right, Well, thank you Paula Scalen for

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Speaker 1: being with us, and we'll talk to you again soon.

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Speaker 3: Thank you.

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