1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:02,440 Speaker 1: Too Much Information is a production of I Heart Radio. 2 00:00:09,000 --> 00:00:11,800 Speaker 1: Hello everyone, and welcome to Too Much Information, the show 3 00:00:11,800 --> 00:00:14,640 Speaker 1: that brings you the secret histories and little known fascinating 4 00:00:14,680 --> 00:00:18,240 Speaker 1: facts and figures behind your favorite movies, music, TV shows 5 00:00:18,360 --> 00:00:22,480 Speaker 1: and more. We are your midnight Society of Microscopic Detail. 6 00:00:22,760 --> 00:00:25,759 Speaker 1: I'm Alex Hegel and I'm Jordan run Tug and Jordan's 7 00:00:26,120 --> 00:00:32,440 Speaker 1: Today we are talking about the outlier in Nickelodeon's nineties Cavalcade, 8 00:00:32,600 --> 00:00:34,760 Speaker 1: the show that taught a generation of children to fear 9 00:00:35,560 --> 00:00:40,400 Speaker 1: nestled as it was in the otherwise comedic bosom of 10 00:00:40,720 --> 00:00:45,040 Speaker 1: the networks snack programming block. That's right, we're talking about 11 00:00:45,040 --> 00:00:47,000 Speaker 1: Are You Afraid of the Dark Man? I used to 12 00:00:47,000 --> 00:00:49,839 Speaker 1: watch the show a lot. I still vividly remember the 13 00:00:49,880 --> 00:00:52,479 Speaker 1: Tale of the Water Demons. So the one in the 14 00:00:52,479 --> 00:00:55,360 Speaker 1: indoor swimming pool, it's the one with like the undead 15 00:00:55,360 --> 00:01:01,360 Speaker 1: sailors coming that's scared the ever loving piss out of me. 16 00:01:01,480 --> 00:01:03,320 Speaker 1: And then I only later did I realize it is 17 00:01:03,400 --> 00:01:05,959 Speaker 1: just basically the plot of the John Carpenter movie The Fog. 18 00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:08,960 Speaker 1: So it just all comes back to old j C 19 00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:13,240 Speaker 1: for me. Um. But I'm guessing this show would have 20 00:01:13,280 --> 00:01:15,600 Speaker 1: put a little too much starch into your card again 21 00:01:15,640 --> 00:01:19,920 Speaker 1: as a kid. No, I actually this was probably the 22 00:01:19,959 --> 00:01:24,640 Speaker 1: first example of mussy TV I ever had in my life. 23 00:01:23,440 --> 00:01:27,440 Speaker 1: I never missed this every weekday at either it's either 24 00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:30,120 Speaker 1: five or five thirty. I forget. I was in front 25 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:31,959 Speaker 1: of the TV watching this. I couldn't get enough. I 26 00:01:32,000 --> 00:01:34,399 Speaker 1: adored it so much. But you're right, I'm not a 27 00:01:34,400 --> 00:01:37,880 Speaker 1: big horror guy, but my taste do have a dark 28 00:01:37,959 --> 00:01:41,640 Speaker 1: streak that offsets my sunny exterior, which I feel like 29 00:01:41,640 --> 00:01:43,800 Speaker 1: i'ven't really gotten the show off much on this show, 30 00:01:43,880 --> 00:01:46,600 Speaker 1: but it will come. Yeah. I mean, I think I 31 00:01:46,640 --> 00:01:49,120 Speaker 1: liked You Afraid the Dark because it wasn't blood and gore, 32 00:01:49,240 --> 00:01:51,600 Speaker 1: which isn't really my thing, but it was just creepy 33 00:01:51,680 --> 00:01:54,480 Speaker 1: and eerie, which was more my speed. I mean. My 34 00:01:55,080 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 1: favorite episode was the one about the haunted jukebox, The 35 00:01:58,560 --> 00:02:01,760 Speaker 1: Tale of C seven, where the listener would hit C 36 00:02:01,960 --> 00:02:04,760 Speaker 1: seven and some old swing band song would play and 37 00:02:04,760 --> 00:02:07,400 Speaker 1: they'd be transported back in time to like this welcome 38 00:02:07,440 --> 00:02:09,919 Speaker 1: home party of a World War two soldier and your 39 00:02:09,960 --> 00:02:13,880 Speaker 1: time travel. I know, yeah, I know, explains a lot, 40 00:02:14,000 --> 00:02:16,760 Speaker 1: but I haven't seen that episode in probably like twenty years. 41 00:02:16,760 --> 00:02:21,079 Speaker 1: But I just remember being really like poignant and eerie 42 00:02:21,639 --> 00:02:24,960 Speaker 1: and sad, and it just it kind of introduced me 43 00:02:24,960 --> 00:02:28,079 Speaker 1: to the concept of stories that give you goose bumps, 44 00:02:28,400 --> 00:02:30,680 Speaker 1: which you would have thought I would have learned from 45 00:02:30,680 --> 00:02:34,440 Speaker 1: the goose Bumps series, but uh no, this was a 46 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:37,200 Speaker 1: huge show for me. And it was one that I 47 00:02:37,240 --> 00:02:39,360 Speaker 1: watched with my mom a lot, who was very disposition 48 00:02:39,400 --> 00:02:41,520 Speaker 1: a lee similar to me. She was very sweet and 49 00:02:41,560 --> 00:02:43,880 Speaker 1: sunny on the surface, but had a secret love of 50 00:02:43,919 --> 00:02:46,240 Speaker 1: the dark side. So I definitely have a soft spot 51 00:02:46,280 --> 00:02:50,720 Speaker 1: for it. Um, I kind of feel like it's underrated 52 00:02:50,840 --> 00:02:52,920 Speaker 1: or Memory Hold. I feel like it doesn't get the 53 00:02:52,960 --> 00:02:56,200 Speaker 1: props that like Legends and Hidden Temple does. Yeah, I mean, 54 00:02:56,240 --> 00:02:57,480 Speaker 1: we'll get into it, but I think a lot of 55 00:02:57,480 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 1: this is just because it wasn't on streaming for the 56 00:02:58,919 --> 00:03:01,119 Speaker 1: longest time. You had to watch it on like YouTube. 57 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:09,520 Speaker 1: Damn Canadians. Ah, but we'll get into it, don't worry. 58 00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:11,200 Speaker 1: But yeah, I think you're right. I think it has 59 00:03:11,200 --> 00:03:13,680 Speaker 1: been maybe Memory Hold a little bit. It's not whimsical 60 00:03:13,919 --> 00:03:19,480 Speaker 1: like Keenan and Kel or you know, groundbreaking maybe the 61 00:03:19,520 --> 00:03:24,240 Speaker 1: way that all that was, or or even it's just 62 00:03:24,280 --> 00:03:27,240 Speaker 1: it was like the weird outlier in Nickelodeon. But it 63 00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:30,120 Speaker 1: holds up. It does hold up. You know, it sticks 64 00:03:30,120 --> 00:03:34,359 Speaker 1: with you, It haunts you, it does well. So. From 65 00:03:34,360 --> 00:03:37,840 Speaker 1: the staggering roster of pre famed child actors who populated 66 00:03:37,880 --> 00:03:41,320 Speaker 1: the show, to creator dj McHale's burning hatred of both 67 00:03:41,440 --> 00:03:46,080 Speaker 1: the midnight society and Canadian television, to the show's groundbreaking 68 00:03:46,120 --> 00:03:50,000 Speaker 1: representation and diversity, here is everything you didn't know about? 69 00:03:50,080 --> 00:03:59,240 Speaker 1: Are You Afraid of the Dark? The show's creator, d 70 00:03:59,360 --> 00:04:02,040 Speaker 1: J mcale was an n y U film grad. Sorry 71 00:04:02,040 --> 00:04:05,120 Speaker 1: about that, Jordan's where that has a badge of honor? 72 00:04:06,680 --> 00:04:10,000 Speaker 1: My favorite shows? Who who? Told Vulture in he was 73 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:14,280 Speaker 1: getting nowhere writing screenplays Sam, but he had a day 74 00:04:14,360 --> 00:04:18,599 Speaker 1: job that involved traveling internationally making corporate and educational videos. 75 00:04:18,760 --> 00:04:20,880 Speaker 1: You didn't do that, did you. That's kind of what 76 00:04:20,960 --> 00:04:25,960 Speaker 1: this is educational. No travel though, But on the advice 77 00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:28,400 Speaker 1: of a friend, at some point he pivoted into writing 78 00:04:28,440 --> 00:04:31,200 Speaker 1: children's media. Uh. He actually got to start on ABC 79 00:04:31,320 --> 00:04:34,360 Speaker 1: after school Specials, which he mentions later helped him kind 80 00:04:34,360 --> 00:04:37,280 Speaker 1: of bring the gravitas of those shows with like quote 81 00:04:37,360 --> 00:04:39,760 Speaker 1: unquote real kids and like real problems, And that's how 82 00:04:39,760 --> 00:04:42,800 Speaker 1: he grounded all the stories of Are You Afraid of 83 00:04:42,800 --> 00:04:47,159 Speaker 1: the Dark into like real life kids. But then he 84 00:04:47,240 --> 00:04:51,920 Speaker 1: did episodes of Encyclopedia Brown for HBO, which I did 85 00:04:51,920 --> 00:04:54,880 Speaker 1: not know as a show called Criss Cross. But it 86 00:04:54,920 --> 00:04:57,480 Speaker 1: was on Encyclopedia Brown that he met his partner Ned Candle, 87 00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:00,359 Speaker 1: and they developed a pitch that he told Vulture was 88 00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:04,600 Speaker 1: bedtime stories for lazy parents that they wanted to do 89 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:07,560 Speaker 1: by quote, taking some old time actor who was out 90 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:10,800 Speaker 1: of work but whom everyone knew, sort of a how 91 00:05:10,880 --> 00:05:15,440 Speaker 1: Holbrook or who else George Kennedy would have been good 92 00:05:15,480 --> 00:05:19,440 Speaker 1: for that, Uh, Carl Malden, Carl Malden and put him 93 00:05:19,480 --> 00:05:21,480 Speaker 1: in an easy chair with a roaring fire and a 94 00:05:21,520 --> 00:05:24,719 Speaker 1: big book, and he'd tell fairy tales. We'd record them 95 00:05:24,720 --> 00:05:27,480 Speaker 1: and put a home video package together for parents who 96 00:05:27,520 --> 00:05:30,520 Speaker 1: wouldn't necessarily want to sit down and do this themselves 97 00:05:30,560 --> 00:05:32,960 Speaker 1: for their kids. That's a quote from him. I mean, 98 00:05:33,640 --> 00:05:36,400 Speaker 1: thus begins a recurring theme in this episode, which is 99 00:05:36,440 --> 00:05:38,080 Speaker 1: that the creator of Value for the Dark is a 100 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:41,400 Speaker 1: really low opinion of humanity. Yeah. I also didn't even 101 00:05:41,440 --> 00:05:44,120 Speaker 1: put any of the quotes he's given to multiple outlets 102 00:05:44,120 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 1: about how much he hates the state of children's television 103 00:05:47,360 --> 00:05:51,440 Speaker 1: Now and Disney in particular. UM. But it was while 104 00:05:51,480 --> 00:05:54,560 Speaker 1: experiencing writer's block as to what these tales would actually 105 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:57,280 Speaker 1: be that Michale realized the stories that he liked best 106 00:05:57,320 --> 00:05:59,560 Speaker 1: as a kid were the scary ones, and so they 107 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:02,200 Speaker 1: decided to do away with what he called the creepy 108 00:06:02,320 --> 00:06:05,400 Speaker 1: concept of having an old dude talk to kids and 109 00:06:05,480 --> 00:06:07,760 Speaker 1: just have the kids themselves do the work by telling 110 00:06:07,760 --> 00:06:10,279 Speaker 1: the stories around a campfire. I tried to look up 111 00:06:10,320 --> 00:06:12,600 Speaker 1: the trope of scary tales being told around a campfire, 112 00:06:12,600 --> 00:06:15,839 Speaker 1: and it literally like crashed the computer. It's it's like 113 00:06:16,000 --> 00:06:19,080 Speaker 1: so old. TV Tropes has an entry called around the 114 00:06:19,080 --> 00:06:22,719 Speaker 1: Campfire exposition, which is a term for like when characters 115 00:06:22,760 --> 00:06:25,480 Speaker 1: are sitting around a campfire talking and like divulging stories 116 00:06:25,480 --> 00:06:27,760 Speaker 1: from their past. I can stand by me with the 117 00:06:28,120 --> 00:06:31,400 Speaker 1: pie contest when Gordy tells like the short story and yeah, 118 00:06:31,480 --> 00:06:33,200 Speaker 1: and then in the same lot too when they're talking 119 00:06:33,200 --> 00:06:36,039 Speaker 1: about you know, four Revver and the story of the 120 00:06:36,040 --> 00:06:40,080 Speaker 1: bees uh kill Bill, when David Carratan tells the whole 121 00:06:40,120 --> 00:06:43,239 Speaker 1: story about anyway. So that's the bit that they decided 122 00:06:43,279 --> 00:06:45,599 Speaker 1: to do, and you know what you do, the bit 123 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:49,760 Speaker 1: you commit to the bit, and he did, against his 124 00:06:49,839 --> 00:06:52,600 Speaker 1: better judgment. He did. He grew to hate that bit. 125 00:06:53,960 --> 00:06:57,160 Speaker 1: We'll get back to that, because, I mean, I guess 126 00:06:57,160 --> 00:06:59,039 Speaker 1: it really shouldn't surprise me that the creative Are You 127 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:00,880 Speaker 1: for the Dark? Is a huge each missing throat? But 128 00:07:01,040 --> 00:07:04,640 Speaker 1: he's a salty dude. Yeah, I love it, d J McHale, 129 00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:07,640 Speaker 1: I love it so much. It's a quote machine, but yes, 130 00:07:07,680 --> 00:07:11,200 Speaker 1: perhaps on Surprisingly, Nickelodeon shot the show down when Michael 131 00:07:11,240 --> 00:07:14,920 Speaker 1: and Candle pitched it. Initially, the working title was scary 132 00:07:15,000 --> 00:07:18,120 Speaker 1: Tales upon on fairy tales. Get it. It's all about 133 00:07:18,120 --> 00:07:21,400 Speaker 1: how you emphasize it. Scary tales sounds lame. Scary tales, 134 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:26,280 Speaker 1: oh good idea, sorry tales? Yeah exactly. But in Matthew 135 00:07:26,320 --> 00:07:31,400 Speaker 1: Clickstein's incredible book, Slimed and Oral History of Nickelodeon's Golden Age, 136 00:07:31,680 --> 00:07:35,520 Speaker 1: it was explained that this title was actually already taken, 137 00:07:35,600 --> 00:07:37,640 Speaker 1: which kind of makes sense. That's a really good title, 138 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:42,400 Speaker 1: is it? Anyway? It is? Michael told Vulture there was 139 00:07:42,400 --> 00:07:44,640 Speaker 1: a scary story written by Dr Seuss called What Was 140 00:07:44,680 --> 00:07:47,400 Speaker 1: I Scared Of? And I always loved that story, So 141 00:07:47,440 --> 00:07:49,720 Speaker 1: I took that title and thought, well, I was afraid 142 00:07:49,720 --> 00:07:51,800 Speaker 1: of clowns, and I was afraid of the dark. And 143 00:07:51,840 --> 00:07:54,480 Speaker 1: that's where the title of our show came from, kind 144 00:07:54,520 --> 00:07:57,720 Speaker 1: of as an answer to that Doctor seush title, Mine is, uh, 145 00:07:58,720 --> 00:08:00,280 Speaker 1: do you ever think about how you're gonna be? Remember 146 00:08:00,280 --> 00:08:04,920 Speaker 1: it after you die? Yeah? That's the adult remake of 147 00:08:04,960 --> 00:08:09,240 Speaker 1: are you Afraid as it Dark? Do you think about 148 00:08:09,280 --> 00:08:11,840 Speaker 1: your bills, your ex your deadlines, or when you think 149 00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:17,960 Speaker 1: you're gonna die? Michael explained to Complex, we pretty much 150 00:08:17,960 --> 00:08:20,520 Speaker 1: pitched exactly what we ended up making, and they were 151 00:08:20,560 --> 00:08:23,600 Speaker 1: just like, no, you can't do this. You can't scare kids. 152 00:08:23,720 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 1: It's not going to fly. Um d J. Mchaele hates 153 00:08:28,120 --> 00:08:33,160 Speaker 1: Nickelodeon and Disney and children, but his is unabashed contempt 154 00:08:33,160 --> 00:08:37,680 Speaker 1: towards Nickelodeon is so hilarious to me. But he somehow 155 00:08:37,840 --> 00:08:40,040 Speaker 1: decided to just leave a three page treatment of the 156 00:08:40,040 --> 00:08:42,960 Speaker 1: show in their slush pile, I guess, in their submissions pile. 157 00:08:43,080 --> 00:08:46,640 Speaker 1: And in the year between that original pitch meeting and 158 00:08:46,679 --> 00:08:50,000 Speaker 1: then he and Candle returned to pitch another show, which 159 00:08:50,120 --> 00:08:53,120 Speaker 1: also did not get picked up. Nickelodeon hired an executive 160 00:08:53,200 --> 00:08:56,120 Speaker 1: named J. Mulvaney, who also had a hand in green 161 00:08:56,200 --> 00:08:58,960 Speaker 1: lighting The Adventures of Pete and Pete, which rules, and 162 00:08:59,000 --> 00:09:01,040 Speaker 1: that guy just kind of came across the treatment in 163 00:09:01,080 --> 00:09:05,280 Speaker 1: their submissions pile and he literally said, supposedly, why have 164 00:09:05,360 --> 00:09:08,680 Speaker 1: we not made this yet? And I've read that Terry Castle, 165 00:09:08,800 --> 00:09:13,000 Speaker 1: who is the daughter of the legendary low budget horror 166 00:09:13,000 --> 00:09:16,160 Speaker 1: flick director William Castle, she also worked on this show, 167 00:09:16,200 --> 00:09:19,040 Speaker 1: which gives it a sort of bona fide place in 168 00:09:19,120 --> 00:09:23,080 Speaker 1: the lineage of of of horror films. And William Castle's 169 00:09:23,160 --> 00:09:28,040 Speaker 1: the Smeellvision guy, right, all these multisensory things in the theaters. Yeah, 170 00:09:28,040 --> 00:09:30,880 Speaker 1: The Tingler was one where he had like joy buzzers, 171 00:09:30,920 --> 00:09:33,199 Speaker 1: like rigged into the seats of the of the theater, 172 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:35,959 Speaker 1: so he would be like, it's incredible that the movie 173 00:09:35,960 --> 00:09:38,760 Speaker 1: would stop, and they would broadcast an announcement the movie 174 00:09:38,800 --> 00:09:41,320 Speaker 1: was about this like little thing that like ran up 175 00:09:41,360 --> 00:09:44,680 Speaker 1: people's legs and like chop or whatever, and uh, the 176 00:09:44,760 --> 00:09:47,720 Speaker 1: movie would stop, and you would hear a voice broadcast 177 00:09:47,760 --> 00:09:50,679 Speaker 1: into the theater and someone go, ladies and gentlemen, this 178 00:09:50,760 --> 00:09:53,800 Speaker 1: is not a joke. The Tingler is loose in the theater. 179 00:09:54,320 --> 00:09:56,480 Speaker 1: Do not panic. And then they would electrify all the 180 00:09:56,600 --> 00:09:59,679 Speaker 1: seats and people would lose their He also had a 181 00:09:59,760 --> 00:10:02,880 Speaker 1: thing um that he would just run a ghost on 182 00:10:02,920 --> 00:10:05,000 Speaker 1: a on a wire from the back of the theater 183 00:10:05,040 --> 00:10:09,640 Speaker 1: to Yeah he was William Castle real uh in the P. T. 184 00:10:09,760 --> 00:10:14,319 Speaker 1: Barne mold of like classic American huckster um. Nickelodeon did 185 00:10:14,320 --> 00:10:17,160 Speaker 1: not want to commit to funding the whole thing despite 186 00:10:17,200 --> 00:10:19,440 Speaker 1: picking it up, and so Michael and Candell had to 187 00:10:19,760 --> 00:10:22,520 Speaker 1: check it across the border to the Bacony tundra of 188 00:10:22,640 --> 00:10:30,040 Speaker 1: Canada and the production company sign arm are crude neighbors 189 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:36,480 Speaker 1: to the north. I'm just gonna shown Canada this all time. 190 00:10:37,480 --> 00:10:42,120 Speaker 1: Sorry Canadian listeners Um, which as well discussed later complicated 191 00:10:42,160 --> 00:10:45,560 Speaker 1: the rights ownership situation to this SINAR is actually now defunct, 192 00:10:45,600 --> 00:10:48,400 Speaker 1: but they were responsible for beloved children's series of the 193 00:10:48,400 --> 00:10:52,480 Speaker 1: era like The Busy World of Richard, Scary Arthur, and Cayu. 194 00:10:53,200 --> 00:10:56,120 Speaker 1: So sinos agreement required that the show be shot in Canada, 195 00:10:56,679 --> 00:10:59,360 Speaker 1: which Michael told Vulture was partially due to the sorry 196 00:10:59,440 --> 00:11:02,760 Speaker 1: state of the Canadian film industry at the time. When 197 00:11:02,760 --> 00:11:06,120 Speaker 1: we first started shooting the show, the film industry in 198 00:11:06,160 --> 00:11:08,920 Speaker 1: Montreal was doing very badly. He said, we were the 199 00:11:08,960 --> 00:11:10,920 Speaker 1: only game in town. So we had the run of 200 00:11:10,960 --> 00:11:13,600 Speaker 1: the place, all this great stuff for a low budget show. 201 00:11:13,960 --> 00:11:16,200 Speaker 1: As the season's progressed in the film industry picked up 202 00:11:16,200 --> 00:11:21,160 Speaker 1: in Montreal, the offices weren't as nice anymore. Um, the 203 00:11:21,200 --> 00:11:24,000 Speaker 1: campfire scenes were shot in the soundstage. How about that 204 00:11:24,200 --> 00:11:26,880 Speaker 1: in Quebec? How about that? Do anything for you? You've 205 00:11:26,880 --> 00:11:29,400 Speaker 1: been to Quebec. What do you think about? Never been 206 00:11:29,440 --> 00:11:33,240 Speaker 1: to Quebec? With Vancouver very nice, very green, very lush, 207 00:11:33,480 --> 00:11:37,319 Speaker 1: like Canadian bacon. I bet you do like curling. I 208 00:11:37,480 --> 00:11:42,320 Speaker 1: bet you she's picture You're like curling, like putting the 209 00:11:42,440 --> 00:11:45,400 Speaker 1: U in color. You got like you got like a toke. 210 00:11:45,559 --> 00:11:49,400 Speaker 1: You've got the like little little hat with the little 211 00:11:49,440 --> 00:11:53,199 Speaker 1: bobby that's what they call the ski cap. To that 212 00:11:53,320 --> 00:11:55,240 Speaker 1: I've never heard. I think it's one of their's, Like 213 00:11:55,280 --> 00:11:56,679 Speaker 1: the hat the Pete wears and Pete and pee. It 214 00:11:56,720 --> 00:11:58,640 Speaker 1: look like the things that come down over the ears. No, 215 00:11:58,720 --> 00:12:01,960 Speaker 1: it's just like a ski hat. Were like a yeah, 216 00:12:01,960 --> 00:12:03,959 Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, it was like a beanie. It comes 217 00:12:03,960 --> 00:12:08,960 Speaker 1: from it's from the bastardized French. What is the French word? Man? Um, 218 00:12:09,080 --> 00:12:10,959 Speaker 1: your mom's a French teacher, so I assume this is 219 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:13,120 Speaker 1: all very near and dear to you well. Toky is 220 00:12:13,160 --> 00:12:17,600 Speaker 1: a from toka from Spanish meaning woman's head dress, from 221 00:12:17,600 --> 00:12:22,000 Speaker 1: Arabic from the old Persian tech meaning veil shawl um. 222 00:12:22,080 --> 00:12:25,480 Speaker 1: Tok is actually what you call the in the chef's uniform. 223 00:12:25,640 --> 00:12:30,440 Speaker 1: Took Blanche is the mushroom o chef's hat. But in 224 00:12:30,480 --> 00:12:32,880 Speaker 1: Canada they call beanies. What we would call a beanie 225 00:12:32,920 --> 00:12:36,760 Speaker 1: or a ski cap call him took. Anyway, production did 226 00:12:36,800 --> 00:12:39,560 Speaker 1: not want to repeatedly build and tear down this set 227 00:12:39,559 --> 00:12:41,720 Speaker 1: that they built for the campfire scenes. So that meant 228 00:12:41,720 --> 00:12:43,760 Speaker 1: that all the wrap around, all the framing devices for 229 00:12:43,760 --> 00:12:46,680 Speaker 1: an entire season had to be filmed over the course 230 00:12:46,679 --> 00:12:49,720 Speaker 1: of a couple of weeks, all the intros and out yep. 231 00:12:50,160 --> 00:12:52,400 Speaker 1: So it not only meant that first of all, they 232 00:12:52,400 --> 00:12:54,160 Speaker 1: would just have all these kids there for like two 233 00:12:54,240 --> 00:12:56,160 Speaker 1: or three weeks at a time, and then these kids 234 00:12:56,160 --> 00:12:58,600 Speaker 1: would never see each other again for the rest of 235 00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:01,720 Speaker 1: the year, but it meant that they while they didn't 236 00:13:01,720 --> 00:13:03,920 Speaker 1: have to have everything scripted in advance, they had to 237 00:13:03,960 --> 00:13:06,520 Speaker 1: have the whole season planned out. They had to know 238 00:13:06,679 --> 00:13:08,360 Speaker 1: for each and every episode what it was going to be, 239 00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:11,599 Speaker 1: so the kids could intro it and yeah, I'll the 240 00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:14,199 Speaker 1: kids have talked about this is like summer camp or 241 00:13:14,200 --> 00:13:16,240 Speaker 1: an acting camp, because they would see each other for 242 00:13:16,280 --> 00:13:18,480 Speaker 1: like a maximum of three weeks, and then I've heard 243 00:13:18,800 --> 00:13:21,280 Speaker 1: I've heard that they crammed a season's worth of these 244 00:13:21,320 --> 00:13:24,800 Speaker 1: into one week, which seems insane, but I've also heard 245 00:13:24,800 --> 00:13:26,560 Speaker 1: it took up to three so I mean it's like 246 00:13:26,679 --> 00:13:29,679 Speaker 1: three minute intros and like a sixty second outro. Though 247 00:13:29,720 --> 00:13:32,760 Speaker 1: I feel like, yeah, yeah, I mean, they're childre they're 248 00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:37,280 Speaker 1: children actors, so you know, you gotta great curve here. 249 00:13:38,720 --> 00:13:41,040 Speaker 1: I mean, I mostly feel bad for the show's creator, 250 00:13:41,160 --> 00:13:43,840 Speaker 1: t J. McHale, because he's talked about what a massive 251 00:13:43,920 --> 00:13:47,640 Speaker 1: stress or this was making sure that the stories were, 252 00:13:47,880 --> 00:13:50,760 Speaker 1: if not completely scripted, at least fleshed out enough to 253 00:13:50,840 --> 00:13:55,160 Speaker 1: have details in this intro, and he wrote, or at 254 00:13:55,320 --> 00:13:59,200 Speaker 1: very least seriously rewrote every single one of these shows 255 00:13:59,240 --> 00:14:02,240 Speaker 1: for the first evan seasons, a total ninety one episodes. 256 00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:04,240 Speaker 1: Just the thought of that makes me want to break 257 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:07,840 Speaker 1: out in hives. That definitely seems like some situation i'd 258 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:10,559 Speaker 1: get myself mixed up in. But what actually helped this 259 00:14:10,679 --> 00:14:13,120 Speaker 1: horrific scenario as far as writers were concerned, was that 260 00:14:13,200 --> 00:14:16,680 Speaker 1: Nickelodeon was still really wary of selling children horror and 261 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:19,560 Speaker 1: suspense stories, so they told Michale, but are you afraid 262 00:14:19,560 --> 00:14:21,880 Speaker 1: of the Darkhead? To draw some of its inspiration from 263 00:14:21,880 --> 00:14:25,120 Speaker 1: the world of literature, basically the sort of shield against 264 00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:28,520 Speaker 1: complaints from parents. Uh that way, this is what McHale 265 00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:31,480 Speaker 1: told complex. If somebody complained, we could say, what are 266 00:14:31,480 --> 00:14:34,960 Speaker 1: you talking about? That's classic fiction, that's Dafty Dumarier, that's 267 00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:37,960 Speaker 1: Edgar Allan Poe. For example, they do an episode that's 268 00:14:37,960 --> 00:14:40,880 Speaker 1: basically the W. W. Jacob short story The Monkeys Paul, 269 00:14:41,640 --> 00:14:43,840 Speaker 1: The Tale of the Phone Police had echoes of George 270 00:14:43,960 --> 00:14:47,320 Speaker 1: or and season two is The Tale of the Dream 271 00:14:47,320 --> 00:14:50,400 Speaker 1: Machine as common ground with Stephen King's short story Word 272 00:14:50,440 --> 00:14:55,000 Speaker 1: Processor of the Gods. But aside from the aforementioned fog 273 00:14:55,160 --> 00:14:57,200 Speaker 1: rip Off episode, they also had one that was a 274 00:14:57,280 --> 00:15:00,360 Speaker 1: riff on nous ferato. So they didn't hold to get 275 00:15:00,360 --> 00:15:03,960 Speaker 1: here just literature only. But yeah, they definitely made sure 276 00:15:04,000 --> 00:15:05,320 Speaker 1: a lot of times that they want my stories that 277 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:07,960 Speaker 1: had a precedent, so that they could fall back on that. 278 00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:10,800 Speaker 1: But it sounds like nobody really complained. I was gonna say, 279 00:15:10,800 --> 00:15:13,840 Speaker 1: supposedly they did not get one complaint from parents about 280 00:15:13,840 --> 00:15:16,000 Speaker 1: this show, which is just I guess, a testament to 281 00:15:16,480 --> 00:15:19,320 Speaker 1: how well they want the line of and not being 282 00:15:19,880 --> 00:15:23,360 Speaker 1: explicit and gory but still scaring these kids, but not 283 00:15:23,440 --> 00:15:27,280 Speaker 1: actually featuring anything that objectionable because I remember being terrible. Yes, 284 00:15:29,280 --> 00:15:32,760 Speaker 1: it's it's so great anyway. As part of his herculean efforts, 285 00:15:32,800 --> 00:15:37,600 Speaker 1: Mikail Location scouted all over Montreal for eerie, spooky places 286 00:15:37,640 --> 00:15:40,480 Speaker 1: to shoot. They were granted permission to film in cemeteries, 287 00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:42,880 Speaker 1: but there were laws against showing the real names on 288 00:15:42,920 --> 00:15:47,720 Speaker 1: the headstones the duly departed on television, so their solution 289 00:15:47,760 --> 00:15:50,240 Speaker 1: was to card in a bunch of fake foam tombstones 290 00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:52,560 Speaker 1: that they would set up that they would to strategically 291 00:15:52,600 --> 00:15:55,080 Speaker 1: block the names of the people from the shots. Uh 292 00:15:55,080 --> 00:15:57,240 Speaker 1: and the fake ones all have different like Easter egg 293 00:15:57,280 --> 00:16:00,480 Speaker 1: references to members of the production staff. There's a guy 294 00:16:00,560 --> 00:16:03,320 Speaker 1: named Paul Doyle who's a story editor on the show, 295 00:16:03,320 --> 00:16:06,040 Speaker 1: and he told the Globe and Mail that he remembered 296 00:16:06,040 --> 00:16:09,320 Speaker 1: seeing one late at night in the editing bay, like 297 00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:11,440 Speaker 1: doing his edits, and he saw one that said here 298 00:16:11,480 --> 00:16:15,880 Speaker 1: lies blind Paul, which he assumed was a shot at 299 00:16:15,960 --> 00:16:20,120 Speaker 1: his editing skills. But he said to this day, DJ 300 00:16:20,280 --> 00:16:24,600 Speaker 1: denies he was commenting on my editing with that and 301 00:16:24,640 --> 00:16:27,200 Speaker 1: for the scenes that were set in the deep dark woods, 302 00:16:27,440 --> 00:16:30,000 Speaker 1: DJ Michhill said that they secured permission for an arbor 303 00:16:30,120 --> 00:16:32,960 Speaker 1: retum to shoot there, but because of the protected animals 304 00:16:32,960 --> 00:16:36,440 Speaker 1: and wildlife, he says, quote, you couldn't use any insecticides 305 00:16:36,480 --> 00:16:38,880 Speaker 1: to kill the mosquitoes which swarm that place like a 306 00:16:38,920 --> 00:16:42,400 Speaker 1: freaking horror movie. The crew would have these beekeeper outfits, 307 00:16:42,400 --> 00:16:45,160 Speaker 1: good lord and gloves because it was just so vicious. 308 00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:48,040 Speaker 1: And I remember the actress Mia Kirshna doing a soliloquy 309 00:16:48,160 --> 00:16:51,320 Speaker 1: playing this possessed girl and this mosquito landed on her 310 00:16:51,320 --> 00:16:53,800 Speaker 1: nose and she tried so hard to stay in character 311 00:16:54,160 --> 00:16:58,320 Speaker 1: and then just said, I can't take this anymore. Oh man, 312 00:16:58,560 --> 00:17:01,480 Speaker 1: that's sad. There was a location that he picked, a 313 00:17:01,600 --> 00:17:04,679 Speaker 1: water purification plant dating back in the thirties that had 314 00:17:04,680 --> 00:17:07,960 Speaker 1: a bunch of these enormous tanks that the location scout 315 00:17:08,000 --> 00:17:10,119 Speaker 1: took him to and it inspired the episode The Tale 316 00:17:10,119 --> 00:17:12,919 Speaker 1: of the Hatching, which is about a private boarding school 317 00:17:12,960 --> 00:17:15,480 Speaker 1: that turns out is run by lizard people. That that's 318 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:19,560 Speaker 1: the one with the terrifying skull monster thing. In the 319 00:17:19,600 --> 00:17:22,800 Speaker 1: indoor pool. My sister was afraid of indoor pools. She 320 00:17:22,920 --> 00:17:25,720 Speaker 1: might still be to this day because of watching That's 321 00:17:25,760 --> 00:17:27,640 Speaker 1: the one I was thinking of we're talking earlier. Yeah, 322 00:17:27,640 --> 00:17:30,960 Speaker 1: that one's terrifying. Yes, yes, funnily enough, this is the 323 00:17:31,119 --> 00:17:36,200 Speaker 1: second most famous water purification plant in Canada. Um, there's 324 00:17:36,240 --> 00:17:40,159 Speaker 1: one called the RC Harris water Treatment plant that is 325 00:17:40,240 --> 00:17:43,439 Speaker 1: famously used in a bunch of different movies because it 326 00:17:43,480 --> 00:17:47,040 Speaker 1: looks like this. It is a big, imposing like public 327 00:17:47,080 --> 00:17:50,679 Speaker 1: works building. Um. It has been used in Half Baked. 328 00:17:51,080 --> 00:17:53,120 Speaker 1: It has been used in John Carpenter and the John 329 00:17:53,119 --> 00:17:56,399 Speaker 1: Carford movie In the Mouth of Madness. It is played 330 00:17:56,440 --> 00:18:00,440 Speaker 1: a mental institution in Strange brew Uh. It played in 331 00:18:00,440 --> 00:18:04,480 Speaker 1: the Silent Sane Asylum in RoboCop the television series. It 332 00:18:04,520 --> 00:18:08,480 Speaker 1: plays a children's hospital in the cockroach themed horror movie 333 00:18:08,720 --> 00:18:13,960 Speaker 1: mimic Um, and it is just recently featured in Nightmare Alley, 334 00:18:14,280 --> 00:18:17,920 Speaker 1: the other Giarma Dotro movie. So you do. You could 335 00:18:17,960 --> 00:18:20,760 Speaker 1: do a tour of Canadian water treatment plants that have 336 00:18:20,840 --> 00:18:24,160 Speaker 1: been featured in horror media and it would be two 337 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:28,240 Speaker 1: stops long. But what a rewarding afternoon that would be anyway, 338 00:18:28,480 --> 00:18:31,600 Speaker 1: Writer director Ron Oliver did explain that there were some 339 00:18:31,640 --> 00:18:34,960 Speaker 1: growing pains involved in shooting this thing in Canada. He said, 340 00:18:35,000 --> 00:18:38,240 Speaker 1: even though DJ had assembled a really good, smart crew, 341 00:18:38,600 --> 00:18:41,320 Speaker 1: they were primarily French, so it was a little bit 342 00:18:41,320 --> 00:18:45,919 Speaker 1: tricky sometimes and we'd have communications breakdowns here there. I 343 00:18:46,000 --> 00:18:49,000 Speaker 1: love that. Um. But yes, as many people have surmised 344 00:18:49,000 --> 00:18:51,439 Speaker 1: over the years, the submitted for your approval line was 345 00:18:51,480 --> 00:18:54,240 Speaker 1: in fact a direct nod to the Twilight Zone for 346 00:18:54,280 --> 00:18:56,760 Speaker 1: those of you who are not familiar. Uh. That was 347 00:18:56,840 --> 00:19:01,320 Speaker 1: how host and creator Rod Serling would introduce these shows segments, Um, 348 00:19:01,440 --> 00:19:03,560 Speaker 1: can you do a Sertling? I almost need like the 349 00:19:03,600 --> 00:19:06,040 Speaker 1: rhythm of I can't do his voice, but submitted for 350 00:19:06,080 --> 00:19:09,080 Speaker 1: your approval? Submitted for your approval of the now? Yeah 351 00:19:09,080 --> 00:19:11,560 Speaker 1: I can. I'm doing the kid from from Your Fair 352 00:19:11,600 --> 00:19:14,880 Speaker 1: of the Dark? Yeah, no, I don't think I can. Uh. Well. 353 00:19:14,920 --> 00:19:17,520 Speaker 1: The Twilight Zone was an important tonal reference for Michale. 354 00:19:17,600 --> 00:19:19,240 Speaker 1: He described Are You Fair to the Dark as a 355 00:19:19,280 --> 00:19:22,560 Speaker 1: mix of Twilight Zone and of course Alfred Hitchcock presents 356 00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:26,520 Speaker 1: feeling that it slotted more into the suspense category rather 357 00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:28,760 Speaker 1: than horror. Yeah. I agree with that. I mean that 358 00:19:28,840 --> 00:19:31,520 Speaker 1: distinction is really interesting to me. D J McHale has 359 00:19:31,560 --> 00:19:34,560 Speaker 1: talked a lot about the psychology of horror and how 360 00:19:34,680 --> 00:19:38,240 Speaker 1: people with the most intense imaginations often react the strongest 361 00:19:38,280 --> 00:19:40,800 Speaker 1: to it because it's less about what you're actually seeing 362 00:19:40,800 --> 00:19:43,480 Speaker 1: on the screen and more about what you might see, 363 00:19:43,880 --> 00:19:46,960 Speaker 1: And that's sort of the first rule of Hitchcock in suspense, 364 00:19:47,160 --> 00:19:50,160 Speaker 1: the implication of what's behind the door is much scarier 365 00:19:50,160 --> 00:19:53,000 Speaker 1: than you actually seeing it. And Spielberg did the same thing, 366 00:19:53,119 --> 00:19:56,359 Speaker 1: although by necessity in Jaws, you know, you rarely see 367 00:19:56,400 --> 00:19:59,040 Speaker 1: the shark, and honestly, when you do, it's kind of 368 00:19:59,040 --> 00:20:02,760 Speaker 1: a leftown. Whatever is your head is scarier. Um. McHale 369 00:20:02,760 --> 00:20:05,840 Speaker 1: has also talked about being traumatized by scary visuals as 370 00:20:05,880 --> 00:20:08,119 Speaker 1: a kid. He said, I'd see a horror movie and 371 00:20:08,119 --> 00:20:10,080 Speaker 1: I don't even remember what the horror movie was about. 372 00:20:10,359 --> 00:20:13,080 Speaker 1: I just remember the face of some horrible thing. I'd 373 00:20:13,119 --> 00:20:15,800 Speaker 1: have nightmares about that face. So in the beginning, I 374 00:20:15,840 --> 00:20:18,880 Speaker 1: was thinking, I don't want to present any seeding horrible 375 00:20:18,920 --> 00:20:21,800 Speaker 1: image that may stick with a kid. But then he 376 00:20:21,920 --> 00:20:26,800 Speaker 1: sort of slipped and put in stuff like that horrifying clowns. Yeah, yeah, 377 00:20:26,880 --> 00:20:29,320 Speaker 1: And I mean for me, it was the little girl 378 00:20:29,440 --> 00:20:31,520 Speaker 1: in the Tale of the lonely ghost. Remember that like 379 00:20:31,760 --> 00:20:34,040 Speaker 1: little girls, like the little girl from the Ring. But 380 00:20:34,119 --> 00:20:37,320 Speaker 1: she's in this room where me all over the wall 381 00:20:37,440 --> 00:20:43,840 Speaker 1: like good guys. As you meditate on that, we'll be 382 00:20:43,920 --> 00:20:47,000 Speaker 1: right back with more too much information after these messages. 383 00:20:56,560 --> 00:20:59,520 Speaker 1: Speaking of children, now we must get to the Midnight Society, 384 00:20:59,560 --> 00:21:02,520 Speaker 1: a key element of the show that McHale innovated and 385 00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:07,040 Speaker 1: then quickly decided he hated. Just I love how apathetic 386 00:21:07,080 --> 00:21:09,680 Speaker 1: he seems towards these kids, and he admitted that because 387 00:21:09,680 --> 00:21:11,800 Speaker 1: they only filmed for like a week or two each season, 388 00:21:11,800 --> 00:21:14,399 Speaker 1: they didn't really bond like most casts do. Like you 389 00:21:14,440 --> 00:21:17,320 Speaker 1: mentioned earlier. In an interview with Vox, he talks about 390 00:21:17,359 --> 00:21:19,600 Speaker 1: how the one and only team bonding trip that they 391 00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:23,760 Speaker 1: ever took backfired on him terribly. Said, I took them 392 00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:25,879 Speaker 1: all bowling one night, and I hurt my back that 393 00:21:26,040 --> 00:21:28,879 Speaker 1: night bowling. To this day, it still bothers me. I 394 00:21:28,920 --> 00:21:31,159 Speaker 1: took the Midnight Society bowling, and now I have a 395 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:35,520 Speaker 1: bad back. Sign up. Who do you think hated kids more? 396 00:21:35,720 --> 00:21:38,800 Speaker 1: Richard Donner, the director of the Goonies, or DJ McHale, 397 00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:42,040 Speaker 1: Are you in front of the doc I mean Richard 398 00:21:42,080 --> 00:21:47,440 Speaker 1: Donner had to deal with Corey Feldman film Fair Fair. 399 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:50,840 Speaker 1: Anthology shows are really tough to do, and they're really 400 00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:53,480 Speaker 1: tough to get popular because people watch their favorite TV 401 00:21:53,520 --> 00:21:55,760 Speaker 1: shows to see what's going to happen to their favorite characters. 402 00:21:55,840 --> 00:21:59,199 Speaker 1: Michale told Complex, what's the continuing story, what's going to 403 00:21:59,240 --> 00:22:02,520 Speaker 1: happen to build this week? Well, anthology shows don't have that. 404 00:22:02,640 --> 00:22:05,240 Speaker 1: It's a different cast every week. So I said, Okay, 405 00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:07,160 Speaker 1: we need a lynch pin that will tie this thing 406 00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:10,000 Speaker 1: together every episode. We needed the same kids every week, 407 00:22:10,040 --> 00:22:12,800 Speaker 1: who obviously would be the show's answer to Rod Serling. 408 00:22:13,119 --> 00:22:15,439 Speaker 1: They're the closest thing to continuing characters we'd have on 409 00:22:15,440 --> 00:22:18,400 Speaker 1: the show. But the fact is he continued. The whole 410 00:22:18,400 --> 00:22:20,640 Speaker 1: time I was making that show, I cared so little 411 00:22:20,680 --> 00:22:24,919 Speaker 1: about the midnight Society. It was an annoyance to me. 412 00:22:25,080 --> 00:22:27,840 Speaker 1: The midnight society was never the interesting part about that show. 413 00:22:28,200 --> 00:22:30,280 Speaker 1: The interesting part was the little movies that we made. 414 00:22:30,480 --> 00:22:32,280 Speaker 1: It used to crack me up when people would say 415 00:22:32,320 --> 00:22:35,240 Speaker 1: I like this midnight society better than that midnight society, 416 00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:37,880 Speaker 1: or I like this kid in the midnight society better 417 00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:40,600 Speaker 1: than that kid. I was always like, who cares, That's 418 00:22:40,600 --> 00:22:43,040 Speaker 1: not what the show is about. He was right. Yeah, 419 00:22:44,160 --> 00:22:47,160 Speaker 1: but admirably he did not half asset when it came 420 00:22:47,200 --> 00:22:50,439 Speaker 1: to casting this crew, which he'd grow to hate. Despite 421 00:22:50,440 --> 00:22:53,000 Speaker 1: living in Los Angeles, mchael embarked on what he actually 422 00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:57,640 Speaker 1: called the Magical Mystery Tour, hitting Vancouver, Toronto, New York, 423 00:22:57,640 --> 00:23:01,199 Speaker 1: and Montreal for casting sessions, and each those cities for 424 00:23:01,240 --> 00:23:05,520 Speaker 1: a new cast of kids every season. And this grueling 425 00:23:05,600 --> 00:23:08,879 Speaker 1: circuit had its drawbacks. Uh, he said. There was one 426 00:23:08,960 --> 00:23:11,320 Speaker 1: year when I hit Montreal, I started feeling sick. I 427 00:23:11,359 --> 00:23:13,480 Speaker 1: had a fever. I came out of the shower in 428 00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:15,359 Speaker 1: the hotel one day and I saw a red dot 429 00:23:15,359 --> 00:23:18,320 Speaker 1: on my chest and thought, oh no. So I called 430 00:23:18,320 --> 00:23:20,159 Speaker 1: the production doctor and I said, I think I have 431 00:23:20,280 --> 00:23:23,760 Speaker 1: chicken pox. I've never had chicken pox. We traced it back. 432 00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:26,720 Speaker 1: I would see thousands of kids to some audition in Vancouver. 433 00:23:27,200 --> 00:23:29,560 Speaker 1: That's how I got chicken pox. I was quarantined for 434 00:23:29,600 --> 00:23:32,840 Speaker 1: ten days in Montreal while prepping for the show, he said, 435 00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:36,760 Speaker 1: the worst part of his quarantinem's Canadian television. But he 436 00:23:36,840 --> 00:23:39,920 Speaker 1: was happy that both the Nicks he was He's in 437 00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:41,960 Speaker 1: New Yorker, he said, but both the Knicks and the 438 00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:43,880 Speaker 1: Rangers were in the playoffs that year, so he got 439 00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:47,199 Speaker 1: to watch them rather than curling, which was what was 440 00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:51,440 Speaker 1: usually on to hold up watching sports and like Kids 441 00:23:51,440 --> 00:23:55,320 Speaker 1: in the Hall, oh Man, Despite his vicious dislike for 442 00:23:55,359 --> 00:23:59,000 Speaker 1: these children, McHale realized their value for the show, Uh, 443 00:23:59,160 --> 00:24:01,320 Speaker 1: telling Vulture at this is the thing that's separated are 444 00:24:01,320 --> 00:24:03,560 Speaker 1: you Afraid of the Dart? From other shows. A writer 445 00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:05,720 Speaker 1: would come and say that they had this idea for, say, 446 00:24:05,840 --> 00:24:08,480 Speaker 1: a haunted car, and I would say, that's cool, but 447 00:24:08,520 --> 00:24:10,800 Speaker 1: who were the kids. I want a story about a 448 00:24:10,800 --> 00:24:12,479 Speaker 1: couple of kids that have something going on in their 449 00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:14,479 Speaker 1: lives that is real and has a real kind of 450 00:24:14,520 --> 00:24:17,000 Speaker 1: conflict that we would be interested in watching even if 451 00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:20,200 Speaker 1: we didn't find the haunted car. We had real kids 452 00:24:20,200 --> 00:24:23,280 Speaker 1: with real interesting stories that intersected with whatever the spooky 453 00:24:23,320 --> 00:24:26,960 Speaker 1: thing was that week. It's more interesting storytelling something beyond 454 00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:30,720 Speaker 1: whoa the Boogeyman is scary? Yeah, I mean getting more 455 00:24:30,760 --> 00:24:34,280 Speaker 1: into his whole psychology of you know what, actually, what 456 00:24:34,560 --> 00:24:37,399 Speaker 1: kind of scary stories affect people? That's really interesting to me. 457 00:24:37,480 --> 00:24:39,280 Speaker 1: He said. He didn't want to do things for the 458 00:24:39,280 --> 00:24:42,960 Speaker 1: sake of a metaphorical explosion, but rather something that was 459 00:24:43,040 --> 00:24:46,439 Speaker 1: kind of more insidious the emotional component. Yeah. In an 460 00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:50,240 Speaker 1: interview with Complex, Michail explained how the writers quote rarely 461 00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:53,080 Speaker 1: played the horror for laughs. There was some humor in there, 462 00:24:53,080 --> 00:24:54,800 Speaker 1: but we didn't go the goose bumps route of the 463 00:24:54,840 --> 00:24:57,399 Speaker 1: over the top silly scenes. We tried to make it 464 00:24:57,440 --> 00:25:01,040 Speaker 1: feel real, to make the characters feel real. And there 465 00:25:01,080 --> 00:25:03,320 Speaker 1: is a really interesting piece and Mashable a few years 466 00:25:03,359 --> 00:25:06,760 Speaker 1: back by Jess Jojo called how We faced much more 467 00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:08,680 Speaker 1: than the Dark and Are You Afraid of the Dark? 468 00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:11,680 Speaker 1: And in this piece she speculated why these stories struck 469 00:25:11,680 --> 00:25:14,120 Speaker 1: a chord for young people, especially at this time when 470 00:25:14,119 --> 00:25:16,880 Speaker 1: they're entering puberty, when they sort of felt alienated from 471 00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:19,520 Speaker 1: their own bodies. I like to quote some of it. 472 00:25:19,600 --> 00:25:22,560 Speaker 1: She said. Kids were both the tellers and subjects of 473 00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:25,320 Speaker 1: the tales, uniquely grounding Are You Afraid of the Dark? 474 00:25:25,359 --> 00:25:28,560 Speaker 1: And teen perspectives and an important time in their maturation. 475 00:25:29,080 --> 00:25:31,639 Speaker 1: That's why it had such a lasting impact on our generation. 476 00:25:32,040 --> 00:25:36,040 Speaker 1: From oral traditions to cognitive behavioral therapy, communal narratives serve 477 00:25:36,119 --> 00:25:38,840 Speaker 1: a powerful function in society, and Are You Afraid of 478 00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:41,840 Speaker 1: the Dark gave that power of storytelling the kids, helping 479 00:25:41,880 --> 00:25:45,520 Speaker 1: them confront the real horrors of teen life with its plots, villains, 480 00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:48,239 Speaker 1: and moral resolutions. Many of the tales and Are You 481 00:25:48,240 --> 00:25:50,480 Speaker 1: Afraid of the Dark can be seen as mixed metaphors 482 00:25:50,520 --> 00:25:53,560 Speaker 1: for the sense of displacement wrought by puberty, making things 483 00:25:53,760 --> 00:25:58,040 Speaker 1: used to like now seemed childish and repulsive. Dark but 484 00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:02,120 Speaker 1: it gets darker. The show also captured an even uglier, 485 00:26:02,240 --> 00:26:05,840 Speaker 1: darker reality from the coming of age experience Only You 486 00:26:05,880 --> 00:26:09,479 Speaker 1: Can Save Yourself adults who are regularly portrayed as so 487 00:26:09,560 --> 00:26:12,119 Speaker 1: comically ineffectual that they needed to be saved by the 488 00:26:12,200 --> 00:26:15,760 Speaker 1: kids whom they previously disregarded. That's why we love horror 489 00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:18,040 Speaker 1: and why it's been a mainstay since the first stories 490 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:21,159 Speaker 1: were ever told. We use scary stories to reconcile with 491 00:26:21,200 --> 00:26:23,480 Speaker 1: the unknowable, and in the case if Are You Afraid 492 00:26:23,480 --> 00:26:30,000 Speaker 1: of the Dark, it's the unchartered fears of youth, like rejection, isolation, neglect, powerlessness, 493 00:26:30,040 --> 00:26:33,119 Speaker 1: and the loss of innocence. Crucially, Are You Afraid of 494 00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:35,600 Speaker 1: the Dark was also willing to let those heroes fail. 495 00:26:36,040 --> 00:26:38,280 Speaker 1: Not every story told by the Midnight Society, and it 496 00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:42,320 Speaker 1: happily sometimes protagonists fell victim to an eagle too big 497 00:26:42,359 --> 00:26:47,840 Speaker 1: for them to overcome. Just like life. It's perhaps no 498 00:26:47,960 --> 00:26:51,359 Speaker 1: accident that DJ Mhill's own daughter couldn't watch this show 499 00:26:51,400 --> 00:26:53,840 Speaker 1: as a kid because she found that just too terrifying. 500 00:26:54,520 --> 00:26:57,960 Speaker 1: He later told Vulture, my daughter is a very vivid imagination, 501 00:26:58,000 --> 00:27:00,439 Speaker 1: so even at eight years old, watching Afraid of the 502 00:27:00,480 --> 00:27:03,320 Speaker 1: Dark was just too scary for her. I keep trying 503 00:27:03,320 --> 00:27:05,199 Speaker 1: to get it to watch, but she wants nothing to 504 00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:10,119 Speaker 1: do with it anyhow. Back to the kids that they cast. 505 00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:13,520 Speaker 1: So the results of these grueling casting auditions, which yielded 506 00:27:13,560 --> 00:27:17,359 Speaker 1: mostly Canadian actors mandated since this was Canadian production, was 507 00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:20,120 Speaker 1: a bumper crop of young talent, many of whom would 508 00:27:20,119 --> 00:27:24,760 Speaker 1: become huge stars, including Ryan Gosling. Michael wanted to cast 509 00:27:24,800 --> 00:27:27,280 Speaker 1: the budding heart Throb, but he turned down Are You 510 00:27:27,320 --> 00:27:29,720 Speaker 1: Afraid of the Dark in favor of doing the famous 511 00:27:29,800 --> 00:27:34,040 Speaker 1: version of Mickey mouse Club. That one crazy year when 512 00:27:34,080 --> 00:27:37,800 Speaker 1: Mickey mouse Club had Ryan Gosling, Christina Aguilera, Justin Timberlake 513 00:27:37,840 --> 00:27:40,920 Speaker 1: and Britney Spears in the cast on that cast and 514 00:27:40,960 --> 00:27:44,240 Speaker 1: not one of those people. How much of that suck 515 00:27:44,359 --> 00:27:48,720 Speaker 1: these days? The Pete best of the Mickey mouse Club. Uh, 516 00:27:48,760 --> 00:27:51,920 Speaker 1: that took two years in Florida, but Michael snagged Ryan 517 00:27:51,960 --> 00:27:55,119 Speaker 1: Gosling when he journeyed back up to Canada after Mickey 518 00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:58,240 Speaker 1: Mouse Club wrapped nev Campbell. Just a few years before 519 00:27:58,280 --> 00:28:01,680 Speaker 1: her star making turns in The Crab and Scream, Campbell 520 00:28:01,720 --> 00:28:05,960 Speaker 1: appeared Insode I am not making this up The Tale 521 00:28:06,040 --> 00:28:11,040 Speaker 1: of the Dangerous Soup as the hostess of a restaurant 522 00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:16,240 Speaker 1: called the Wild Boar, a restaurant renowned for its green, huge, 523 00:28:16,560 --> 00:28:20,480 Speaker 1: dangerous soup priced at a hundred dollars a bowl in 524 00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:24,760 Speaker 1: which the secret ingredient is fear. The secret ingredient is love. 525 00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:32,920 Speaker 1: Damn it. Yeah. Hayden Christiensen pre Anakin Skywalker. Christensen played 526 00:28:33,000 --> 00:28:36,800 Speaker 1: Kirk in theisode of the Tale of Bigfoot Ridge. He's 527 00:28:36,800 --> 00:28:38,720 Speaker 1: also in the a from the afore Mentioned in the 528 00:28:38,760 --> 00:28:41,600 Speaker 1: Mouth of Madness by John Carpenter. I just have I 529 00:28:41,640 --> 00:28:44,440 Speaker 1: mentioned John Carpenter in every single episode of Too Much Information, 530 00:28:44,520 --> 00:28:47,720 Speaker 1: because if I haven't, I'm not working hard enough. Maybe 531 00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:53,120 Speaker 1: not The Spice Girls, but uh. Future American Pie star 532 00:28:53,320 --> 00:28:55,560 Speaker 1: Eddie Kay Thomas had his first ever screen role in 533 00:28:56,360 --> 00:29:00,000 Speaker 1: episode The Tale of the Curious Camera, Firefly and Surrender 534 00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:02,880 Speaker 1: that he starred. Jewels State appeared in the season three 535 00:29:02,880 --> 00:29:06,080 Speaker 1: episode The Tale of Watchers Woods and the Tale of 536 00:29:06,120 --> 00:29:10,120 Speaker 1: the Unfinished Painting in season four, and Alicia Cuthbert was 537 00:29:10,160 --> 00:29:13,080 Speaker 1: in this Well, I guess when d J mckel auditioned 538 00:29:13,120 --> 00:29:14,959 Speaker 1: her to be in the second incarnation of the Bid 539 00:29:15,040 --> 00:29:17,920 Speaker 1: Night Society, he completely forgot that she had already been 540 00:29:17,960 --> 00:29:20,360 Speaker 1: in an episode already The Tale of the Night Shift 541 00:29:20,920 --> 00:29:24,040 Speaker 1: and asked her who directed her, at which point she replied, 542 00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:30,120 Speaker 1: you did, auburn. Yes. It was Cuthbert's first ever roll 543 00:29:30,200 --> 00:29:33,600 Speaker 1: on camera apparently, but the real M v P of 544 00:29:34,480 --> 00:29:37,840 Speaker 1: A Y A O T D. I owed. That's harder 545 00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:40,560 Speaker 1: to say than Are You Afraid of the Dark? To me, no, 546 00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:47,920 Speaker 1: J Barachel Judd Apatow stock cast players, skinny, Yeah, he right, 547 00:29:48,000 --> 00:29:49,600 Speaker 1: co writes at all. He's the skinny kid with the 548 00:29:49,600 --> 00:29:52,120 Speaker 1: black hair. He was in four episodes of Are You 549 00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:54,840 Speaker 1: Afraid of the Far for which I believe makes him 550 00:29:54,840 --> 00:29:57,600 Speaker 1: the most cast kid, and in his first one they 551 00:29:57,680 --> 00:30:02,200 Speaker 1: drowned him to death in a pool. So he's a 552 00:30:02,240 --> 00:30:04,200 Speaker 1: different Is he a different character? And everyone does he 553 00:30:04,240 --> 00:30:09,680 Speaker 1: just keep coming back as ghost Kid, ghost kid, just 554 00:30:09,760 --> 00:30:13,920 Speaker 1: spinning here, just were developing, Yeah, The Tale of Ghost Kid. 555 00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:19,840 Speaker 1: More established guest stars included Melissa Joan Hart, who was 556 00:30:19,960 --> 00:30:22,760 Speaker 1: four seasons into starring in close explains at all when 557 00:30:22,760 --> 00:30:25,840 Speaker 1: she appeared in the Tale of the Frozen Ghost, Tea 558 00:30:25,880 --> 00:30:28,240 Speaker 1: and Tomorrow Maori, who had been on Sister Sister for 559 00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:31,720 Speaker 1: three seasons, they appeared in the Tale of the Chameleons. 560 00:30:31,760 --> 00:30:35,000 Speaker 1: I remember that one figures getter Tara Lepinski started in 561 00:30:35,040 --> 00:30:38,240 Speaker 1: the Tale of the Lootar Locusts and Boy Meets World. 562 00:30:38,320 --> 00:30:41,000 Speaker 1: Star will friedle appeared in the Tale of the Long 563 00:30:41,040 --> 00:30:43,600 Speaker 1: Ago Locket. That sounds like one of the ones that 564 00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:45,440 Speaker 1: would have been into that sounds like a sad like 565 00:30:45,840 --> 00:30:51,720 Speaker 1: fifties throwback thing. Also, Bombcat Goldthwaite and Gilbert Godfried front 566 00:30:51,720 --> 00:30:57,320 Speaker 1: of the Bobcat Goldthwaite guests started in the Tale of 567 00:30:57,320 --> 00:30:59,880 Speaker 1: the Final Wish and the Tale of Station One of 568 00:31:00,320 --> 00:31:03,440 Speaker 1: nine point one, respectively. Godfried I didn't know this. He 569 00:31:03,480 --> 00:31:06,920 Speaker 1: was a horrbuff um Ron Oliver who directed and wrote 570 00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:08,400 Speaker 1: some of these some of the already Fred of the 571 00:31:08,440 --> 00:31:12,520 Speaker 1: Dark Stuff Total site called Gaily dreadful Um that his 572 00:31:12,560 --> 00:31:16,000 Speaker 1: bud Tony Timponi, who is editor of Fangoria magazine throughout 573 00:31:16,000 --> 00:31:18,800 Speaker 1: its glory years, h that guy said Gilbert would just 574 00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:21,400 Speaker 1: come into the star log and Fangoria offices in New 575 00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:24,320 Speaker 1: York and just spend hours reading their back issues, which 576 00:31:24,360 --> 00:31:28,360 Speaker 1: is adorable. Apparently, Bobcat just ripped his vocal cords to 577 00:31:28,560 --> 00:31:31,360 Speaker 1: shreds while playing the Sandman in the Tale of the 578 00:31:31,400 --> 00:31:33,720 Speaker 1: Final Wish because he just had to keep saying these 579 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:35,640 Speaker 1: limericks over and over again. They had nothing to do 580 00:31:35,720 --> 00:31:39,200 Speaker 1: with the plot whatsoever. They were complete non sequiturs, and 581 00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:41,520 Speaker 1: so we had no cues. So he kept flubbing his 582 00:31:41,600 --> 00:31:43,960 Speaker 1: lines because there was just nothing to like spark whatever 583 00:31:43,960 --> 00:31:45,680 Speaker 1: the next line would be for him, and so we 584 00:31:45,720 --> 00:31:48,240 Speaker 1: had to do them take after take after take over 585 00:31:48,320 --> 00:31:51,320 Speaker 1: and over and over, and it's just his voice was 586 00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:53,840 Speaker 1: shot and he just was pounding honey and lemon and 587 00:31:53,920 --> 00:31:56,040 Speaker 1: tea to preserve what was left of it, which is 588 00:31:56,040 --> 00:31:59,280 Speaker 1: just hilarious considering he speaks ninety percent of the time 589 00:31:59,440 --> 00:32:05,560 Speaker 1: as Yeah, so this is what broke him. That's my 590 00:32:05,720 --> 00:32:09,440 Speaker 1: that's my Bobcat Cold. Rachel Blanchard, who was at the 591 00:32:09,520 --> 00:32:11,520 Speaker 1: end at the time five years older than the rest 592 00:32:11,520 --> 00:32:15,120 Speaker 1: of the society, appeared for three seasons. Her character trademark 593 00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:18,040 Speaker 1: was I'm always in a bad mood. She went on 594 00:32:19,400 --> 00:32:22,800 Speaker 1: the cat. Maybe that's why she's like old enough to drink, 595 00:32:22,840 --> 00:32:25,920 Speaker 1: she's hanging out with like teenagers. Uh. She wanted to 596 00:32:25,920 --> 00:32:29,000 Speaker 1: start in the Clueless TV series and Seventh Heaven and 597 00:32:29,040 --> 00:32:32,400 Speaker 1: as Sally in Flight of the Concord. Yeah, she's the 598 00:32:32,440 --> 00:32:35,520 Speaker 1: most beautiful girl in the room. That's right. I used 599 00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:37,880 Speaker 1: to play that song at parties and hope that the 600 00:32:37,880 --> 00:32:40,400 Speaker 1: most beautiful girl in the room would assume I was 601 00:32:40,400 --> 00:32:42,440 Speaker 1: playing it about her and be flattered and come over 602 00:32:42,480 --> 00:32:45,560 Speaker 1: and talk to me. And that worked exactly zero times. 603 00:32:46,080 --> 00:32:49,960 Speaker 1: Um I got Playing acoustic guitar at parties in college 604 00:32:50,080 --> 00:32:54,200 Speaker 1: was such a massive fail. It's yeah, I know. I mean, 605 00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:56,560 Speaker 1: piano at least gave you a little bit more mystique 606 00:32:56,600 --> 00:32:59,160 Speaker 1: as like the quiet, sensitive guy, and it was louder, 607 00:32:59,200 --> 00:33:01,240 Speaker 1: so it was harder to a nor. But it also 608 00:33:01,280 --> 00:33:03,760 Speaker 1: meant that you were mostly facing the walls you played, 609 00:33:03,920 --> 00:33:06,719 Speaker 1: whereas with guitar you couldn't help but look around, like 610 00:33:06,760 --> 00:33:09,480 Speaker 1: hopefully and see who was noticing you. It was It 611 00:33:09,560 --> 00:33:11,840 Speaker 1: was bad. Did you ever do that? Uh? No? I 612 00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:14,000 Speaker 1: knew a guy who used to play Blackbird two girls 613 00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:18,240 Speaker 1: at party. Well, no, there's a twist. He would he 614 00:33:18,280 --> 00:33:20,040 Speaker 1: would walk up to and be like, hey, I you know. 615 00:33:20,040 --> 00:33:22,720 Speaker 1: I'm sorry. I really don't usually do this, but that's 616 00:33:22,720 --> 00:33:25,239 Speaker 1: a terrible start right there. Yeah, well I saw you 617 00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:26,880 Speaker 1: standing there and I just I had to write. I 618 00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:30,480 Speaker 1: wrote this and he wouldn't sing it. He wouldn't say 619 00:33:30,520 --> 00:33:32,320 Speaker 1: but he would just play like the fingerpicking bar that 620 00:33:32,360 --> 00:33:34,320 Speaker 1: everyone could play it. And his reasoning was that if 621 00:33:34,360 --> 00:33:38,160 Speaker 1: any girl didn't recognize Blackbird, they deserved to be scammed 622 00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:41,600 Speaker 1: on by him. I mean, would they laugh if they did? 623 00:33:42,600 --> 00:33:48,400 Speaker 1: This is stupid? This is did he read the game? Is? No? 624 00:33:48,520 --> 00:33:50,800 Speaker 1: This is pre the game. That was my party piece too. 625 00:33:50,840 --> 00:33:52,600 Speaker 1: That was like the most probably this day, the most 626 00:33:52,640 --> 00:33:54,880 Speaker 1: complicated guitar part I know how to play. I got 627 00:33:54,880 --> 00:33:56,840 Speaker 1: bad news for your buddy. It's not that's not that 628 00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:03,240 Speaker 1: it's not that complicated. Oh oh, this is being mean 629 00:34:03,280 --> 00:34:06,800 Speaker 1: to Jordan again. Charles S. Dutton guest starred Charles as 630 00:34:06,880 --> 00:34:09,799 Speaker 1: friend of the Pod. Charles Dutton, who appeared in the 631 00:34:09,800 --> 00:34:12,600 Speaker 1: tail of Cutter's Treasure, has a glowing review of the 632 00:34:12,600 --> 00:34:15,799 Speaker 1: show in Clicksteen's book Slimed. He said, without a doubt 633 00:34:15,840 --> 00:34:18,520 Speaker 1: it was very, very, very well produced. It wasn't like 634 00:34:18,560 --> 00:34:21,480 Speaker 1: anything you would see on Saturday morning, those rather inexpensive 635 00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:24,680 Speaker 1: kind of half hearted children's programs. I never looked at 636 00:34:24,680 --> 00:34:26,759 Speaker 1: it as a kids show. I didn't leave their thinking 637 00:34:26,800 --> 00:34:29,239 Speaker 1: we had done anything amateurish. I looked at it as 638 00:34:29,280 --> 00:34:32,800 Speaker 1: if we were doing a small movie. Uh. Frank Gorsch, 639 00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:38,120 Speaker 1: famous as the Riddler on the sixties, Adam West, Batman, 640 00:34:38,360 --> 00:34:42,400 Speaker 1: and Robin Show guested in the Tale of the Carved Stone. 641 00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:45,320 Speaker 1: That's a good get. That's a really good get. I 642 00:34:45,360 --> 00:34:46,960 Speaker 1: feel like we got to give a special shout out 643 00:34:47,040 --> 00:34:49,120 Speaker 1: to a guy by the name of Ross Hall, who 644 00:34:49,160 --> 00:34:52,920 Speaker 1: played what I assume was the leader of the Midnight Society, 645 00:34:52,960 --> 00:34:54,640 Speaker 1: since he's the only guy I can really remember, the 646 00:34:54,640 --> 00:34:58,120 Speaker 1: one with the glasses. Uh. Ironically, for later seasons, he 647 00:34:58,160 --> 00:35:00,359 Speaker 1: had to take the lenses out of said glasses because 648 00:35:00,440 --> 00:35:03,400 Speaker 1: the glass was reflecting off the studio lights. They do 649 00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:06,480 Speaker 1: that for everybody that Joe Deschanel hasn't had in all 650 00:35:06,520 --> 00:35:08,440 Speaker 1: those episodes of New Girl, she doesn't have any anything 651 00:35:08,480 --> 00:35:11,920 Speaker 1: in her. That always surprised me because I feel like 652 00:35:11,960 --> 00:35:14,480 Speaker 1: you could you must be able to tell when it 653 00:35:14,600 --> 00:35:17,520 Speaker 1: just goes straight through there's no glass or plastic. Yeah, 654 00:35:17,640 --> 00:35:20,919 Speaker 1: but I mean it's it's easier than rotoscoping out every 655 00:35:20,960 --> 00:35:25,040 Speaker 1: individual reflection. Uh. If you were to ask me to 656 00:35:25,120 --> 00:35:27,239 Speaker 1: describe this guy, I'd say he looks like a TV 657 00:35:27,360 --> 00:35:29,920 Speaker 1: weather man, and funnily enough, that's exactly what he grew 658 00:35:30,000 --> 00:35:32,640 Speaker 1: up to be. Ross Hall is a meteorologist for the 659 00:35:32,640 --> 00:35:35,560 Speaker 1: Canadian Weather Network, and he says that I don't know 660 00:35:35,600 --> 00:35:37,400 Speaker 1: why I find this as funny as I do. D J. 661 00:35:37,520 --> 00:35:40,880 Speaker 1: McHale would help direct the campfire scenes by keeping his 662 00:35:40,960 --> 00:35:44,120 Speaker 1: voice low and spooky, like he was a member of 663 00:35:44,120 --> 00:35:46,840 Speaker 1: the Midnight Society, just to like keep everyone in the mood, 664 00:35:46,920 --> 00:35:51,359 Speaker 1: which is creepy but also kind of cute. It's cute. Yeah, 665 00:35:51,520 --> 00:35:53,200 Speaker 1: he wanted to get him in the get in the spirit. 666 00:35:54,000 --> 00:35:59,840 Speaker 1: Despite episodes which featured children, um you know, dying uh m. 667 00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:02,440 Speaker 1: Kale has said repeatedly there was very little pushback from 668 00:36:02,520 --> 00:36:05,440 Speaker 1: Nickelodeon about episode or as he had feared initially, parents 669 00:36:05,480 --> 00:36:08,520 Speaker 1: writing in with concerns about the show's content. Yeah, this 670 00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:11,400 Speaker 1: is really surprising to me, considering the kids died in 671 00:36:11,480 --> 00:36:15,960 Speaker 1: a really spectacular spectrum of ways, including but not limited to, 672 00:36:16,680 --> 00:36:19,560 Speaker 1: a love struck kid is violently drowned in the school 673 00:36:19,600 --> 00:36:21,880 Speaker 1: pool by a swamp monster. That's the tale of the 674 00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:23,800 Speaker 1: dead Man's Float. Maybe that's the one I was thinking 675 00:36:23,800 --> 00:36:27,400 Speaker 1: of earlier in the Pool, a teen is haunted by 676 00:36:27,560 --> 00:36:30,279 Speaker 1: the trauma of his dead best friend whose life he 677 00:36:30,320 --> 00:36:33,360 Speaker 1: failed to save. That's the Tale of the Shiny Red Bicycle. 678 00:36:33,640 --> 00:36:35,680 Speaker 1: A girl gets locked in a room and forgotten until 679 00:36:35,719 --> 00:36:38,000 Speaker 1: she starves to death. That's the Tale of the Lonely Ghost, 680 00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:41,640 Speaker 1: which features that the little girl in the room where 681 00:36:41,640 --> 00:36:45,640 Speaker 1: she just wrote helped me all over the walls. Yeah. Scary. Uh. 682 00:36:45,680 --> 00:36:48,440 Speaker 1: And then there's another where a ghost boy freezes to 683 00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:50,640 Speaker 1: death after hiding in the woods to get away from 684 00:36:50,640 --> 00:36:53,520 Speaker 1: a criminal, the Tale of the Frozen Ghost. So yeah, 685 00:36:53,560 --> 00:36:55,239 Speaker 1: it's not just that they it's not just that the 686 00:36:55,360 --> 00:37:02,520 Speaker 1: show featured death, but really kind of sobriety, Yeah, exactly. Yeah, 687 00:37:02,640 --> 00:37:04,800 Speaker 1: but there was one thing that the network did mandate 688 00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:08,080 Speaker 1: in uh ninety one episodes of the show, all of 689 00:37:08,120 --> 00:37:11,080 Speaker 1: which featured a campfire. Only once do you see a 690 00:37:11,160 --> 00:37:14,880 Speaker 1: child light a match? I have heard twice, But we 691 00:37:14,960 --> 00:37:18,680 Speaker 1: will come back to that. Well, he said, you couldn't 692 00:37:18,680 --> 00:37:21,239 Speaker 1: show kids striking a match because they didn't want to 693 00:37:21,280 --> 00:37:23,600 Speaker 1: teach kids how to do that and risk some kids 694 00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:27,959 Speaker 1: accidentally burning down their homes. There's one that did slip through, 695 00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:30,880 Speaker 1: he said, an episode I directed. Mia Kirshner was to 696 00:37:30,920 --> 00:37:32,839 Speaker 1: star in that episode, and in the scene she had 697 00:37:32,880 --> 00:37:35,200 Speaker 1: to light a lantern and she didn't know how to 698 00:37:35,280 --> 00:37:37,600 Speaker 1: strike a match. He said, we practically had to fake 699 00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:40,040 Speaker 1: it because she was like, I've never done this before, 700 00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:43,319 Speaker 1: which I guess maybe gives credibility to Nickelodeon's theory that 701 00:37:43,360 --> 00:37:47,120 Speaker 1: we didn't want to teach kids how to light a match. Um, 702 00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:49,799 Speaker 1: it might have also been a fire hazard because they 703 00:37:49,920 --> 00:37:52,759 Speaker 1: used real foliage to dress these interior sets where they 704 00:37:52,760 --> 00:37:54,799 Speaker 1: shot the campfire scenes, and because they would shoot them 705 00:37:54,800 --> 00:37:58,040 Speaker 1: in these marathon sessions without striking the set in between. 706 00:37:58,440 --> 00:38:00,799 Speaker 1: By the end of it, like we two or three, 707 00:38:00,840 --> 00:38:03,120 Speaker 1: the whole thing would basically be a dried up tinder 708 00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:06,600 Speaker 1: box that could go up at the proverbial strike of 709 00:38:06,600 --> 00:38:09,960 Speaker 1: a match. He said they nearly got shooting shut down 710 00:38:10,000 --> 00:38:14,000 Speaker 1: at one point because the the fireman came to the 711 00:38:14,000 --> 00:38:16,440 Speaker 1: set and we're like, you got a lot of a 712 00:38:16,480 --> 00:38:19,680 Speaker 1: lot of dead foliage and branches and stuff lying around, 713 00:38:19,760 --> 00:38:22,919 Speaker 1: and you're shooting your fire a camp Yeah, sitting around 714 00:38:22,960 --> 00:38:27,840 Speaker 1: your campfire seeing malties coming in. Yeah, your hoser. I 715 00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:31,200 Speaker 1: read that there was another match incident that slipped through 716 00:38:31,800 --> 00:38:34,920 Speaker 1: UH during one episode when the Midnight Society we're trying 717 00:38:34,920 --> 00:38:37,479 Speaker 1: and failing to light the fire. They lit a match, 718 00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:40,439 Speaker 1: but the logs wouldn't burn, which is maybe the worst 719 00:38:40,520 --> 00:38:43,440 Speaker 1: lesson to show kids like, don't worry, nothing will happen. 720 00:38:43,960 --> 00:38:46,120 Speaker 1: But then one of the other kids succeeds in lighting 721 00:38:46,120 --> 00:38:49,280 Speaker 1: the fire by rubbing two sticks together, the old caveman method. 722 00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:51,719 Speaker 1: You're an eagle scout. Did you ever succeed in doing 723 00:38:51,760 --> 00:38:53,719 Speaker 1: that by rubbing the two sticks together starting to fire? 724 00:38:53,719 --> 00:38:56,720 Speaker 1: I've never seen anyone do it, not a single person. 725 00:38:56,920 --> 00:38:58,920 Speaker 1: For one of the levels. You have to light a 726 00:38:59,000 --> 00:39:01,880 Speaker 1: fire successfully with all you get our two matches, and 727 00:39:01,880 --> 00:39:04,560 Speaker 1: then you if you go over, you flunk. So it's 728 00:39:04,600 --> 00:39:06,319 Speaker 1: just like you have to make sure you're a really 729 00:39:06,360 --> 00:39:09,440 Speaker 1: well constructed tinder situation. I've seen people do with lynnon, 730 00:39:10,040 --> 00:39:13,240 Speaker 1: but I've never seen the rubbing the two sticks together thing. Um. 731 00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:16,800 Speaker 1: Speaking of campfires, as no doubt the listenership of this 732 00:39:16,840 --> 00:39:20,400 Speaker 1: show has been waiting for with the big moment, bated breath, 733 00:39:20,880 --> 00:39:24,040 Speaker 1: the true nature of the mysterious dust sprinkled on the 734 00:39:24,080 --> 00:39:27,680 Speaker 1: campfire at the beginning of each episode, drum roll, please 735 00:39:28,480 --> 00:39:31,200 Speaker 1: punch that in might give us a drum roll. Uh, 736 00:39:31,600 --> 00:39:35,239 Speaker 1: it's powdered non dairy creamer and glittering. Give me a 737 00:39:35,360 --> 00:39:39,800 Speaker 1: thousand guesses. I never would guess that. Um, that stuff's 738 00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:43,799 Speaker 1: petroleum based and it actually burns, MacHale told Vulture. Then 739 00:39:43,840 --> 00:39:46,279 Speaker 1: we added some pire technics in the fire itself. But 740 00:39:46,400 --> 00:39:50,400 Speaker 1: CREMERA does burn and gives off a little smoke, he said, Crema. 741 00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:54,319 Speaker 1: But involved in the Vulture article, they actually right. He 742 00:39:54,360 --> 00:39:56,560 Speaker 1: may have been using it as people refer to clean 743 00:39:56,800 --> 00:39:59,440 Speaker 1: X for tissues. It was not the actual brand Crema, 744 00:39:59,560 --> 00:40:02,560 Speaker 1: because actor Daniel De Santos said in a different interview 745 00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:04,800 Speaker 1: to The Globe and Mail, I came on the third season, 746 00:40:04,840 --> 00:40:07,080 Speaker 1: was so excited for the magic dust using the fire, 747 00:40:07,440 --> 00:40:09,720 Speaker 1: But it's just a bag of coffee, mate and glitter. 748 00:40:10,280 --> 00:40:12,120 Speaker 1: So if you were a loved one worked on the 749 00:40:12,160 --> 00:40:13,520 Speaker 1: set of Are You Afraid of the Dark, and you 750 00:40:13,560 --> 00:40:17,800 Speaker 1: can confirm the brand of non dairy creamer used to 751 00:40:17,880 --> 00:40:21,319 Speaker 1: make the fire do its thing. Well, venmo you five 752 00:40:21,360 --> 00:40:28,160 Speaker 1: bucks my eternal offer anyone gives you what you want. 753 00:40:31,600 --> 00:40:33,600 Speaker 1: We're going to take a quick break, but we'll be 754 00:40:33,719 --> 00:40:36,520 Speaker 1: right back with more too much information in just a moment. 755 00:40:47,400 --> 00:40:52,479 Speaker 1: Speaking of what we'll loosely call special effects the SFX chief, 756 00:40:52,520 --> 00:40:53,960 Speaker 1: and Are You Afraid of the Dark is a guy 757 00:40:54,040 --> 00:40:57,200 Speaker 1: named Steve Kolback, who later went on to win a 758 00:40:57,239 --> 00:41:00,360 Speaker 1: whole bunch of Emmy's for Game of Thrones. You just 759 00:41:00,480 --> 00:41:04,120 Speaker 1: italicized Game of throats. No one's gonna read a script 760 00:41:04,120 --> 00:41:07,000 Speaker 1: that we're reading right now? Is you going through on 761 00:41:07,040 --> 00:41:12,320 Speaker 1: the Google die? I have a disease. Let me work 762 00:41:14,080 --> 00:41:17,120 Speaker 1: as Heigel's copy editing my script, but no one will 763 00:41:17,120 --> 00:41:20,799 Speaker 1: ever see um. Special effects guy has talked about how 764 00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:22,800 Speaker 1: Are You Afraid of the Dark was an important training 765 00:41:22,800 --> 00:41:25,439 Speaker 1: ground for him because, in his words, they could never 766 00:41:25,480 --> 00:41:29,200 Speaker 1: afford to fake things. For example, the twisted claw that 767 00:41:29,280 --> 00:41:31,759 Speaker 1: was used in one episode that was just a petrified 768 00:41:31,800 --> 00:41:35,919 Speaker 1: turkey claw, which is gross. That's the monkeys episode. Yeah, 769 00:41:35,920 --> 00:41:38,080 Speaker 1: you're right, you're right, yes, yes, yes, but without you know, 770 00:41:38,480 --> 00:41:41,000 Speaker 1: budget or technology for c g I, they had to 771 00:41:41,040 --> 00:41:43,480 Speaker 1: get creative. And he's talked about how in the episode 772 00:41:43,480 --> 00:41:45,640 Speaker 1: The Tail of the Headless Horseman, he had to figure 773 00:41:45,680 --> 00:41:47,880 Speaker 1: out a way to show a boy getting chased across 774 00:41:47,880 --> 00:41:50,680 Speaker 1: a bridge and then the horse and its writer bursting 775 00:41:50,680 --> 00:41:54,120 Speaker 1: into flames. And ironically, for the last season a Game 776 00:41:54,160 --> 00:41:56,640 Speaker 1: of Thrones he had the workout a similar effect based 777 00:41:56,640 --> 00:41:58,399 Speaker 1: on what he learned on Are You Afraid of the Dark, 778 00:41:58,520 --> 00:42:01,440 Speaker 1: which I think is funny. And speaking of ways, the 779 00:42:01,440 --> 00:42:03,920 Speaker 1: influence of All for the Dark has lived on I 780 00:42:04,040 --> 00:42:06,319 Speaker 1: heard a rumor I wasn't able to confirm this that 781 00:42:06,520 --> 00:42:09,680 Speaker 1: m Night Shamalan was supposedly inspired to make the sixth 782 00:42:09,719 --> 00:42:12,160 Speaker 1: sense from a season three episode of Value for You 783 00:42:12,280 --> 00:42:14,840 Speaker 1: the Dark call the Tale of the Dream Girl. And 784 00:42:14,880 --> 00:42:18,120 Speaker 1: this episode centers around a boy who's ignored by everyone 785 00:42:18,160 --> 00:42:20,680 Speaker 1: around him except for a girl who turns out to 786 00:42:20,680 --> 00:42:23,600 Speaker 1: be a ghost. I guess he's the right demographic for that. 787 00:42:24,360 --> 00:42:26,239 Speaker 1: I just love to imagine this guy, Steve Colbeck on 788 00:42:26,280 --> 00:42:28,600 Speaker 1: the set of Game of Thrones and they're like, oh God, 789 00:42:28,600 --> 00:42:30,239 Speaker 1: how are we gonna set this horse on fire? And 790 00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:34,440 Speaker 1: he takes a long dragon of a cigarette and he's like, kid, 791 00:42:34,719 --> 00:42:37,200 Speaker 1: a story to tell you. I'll get your flaming horse 792 00:42:37,280 --> 00:42:42,280 Speaker 1: with you want flaming noise, I'll get your noise. Uh. 793 00:42:42,320 --> 00:42:45,520 Speaker 1: Interestingly enough, and this ties into our next BIB. Writer 794 00:42:45,640 --> 00:42:49,040 Speaker 1: director Ron Oliver remembers a specific episode that nicol Nan 795 00:42:49,160 --> 00:42:52,279 Speaker 1: did have notes on the Werewolf yarn the Tale of 796 00:42:52,320 --> 00:42:56,280 Speaker 1: the Full Moon, which he said he heard studio chatter 797 00:42:56,520 --> 00:43:00,000 Speaker 1: that it was a bit to quote John Waters meets 798 00:43:00,040 --> 00:43:05,040 Speaker 1: David Lynch, which rules um. He added that he thought 799 00:43:05,080 --> 00:43:07,719 Speaker 1: that one in particularly was banned in Britain because two 800 00:43:07,800 --> 00:43:10,399 Speaker 1: kids break into the werewolves house and the British didn't 801 00:43:10,400 --> 00:43:13,920 Speaker 1: want to seem like they were condoning breaking and entering. Um, 802 00:43:13,960 --> 00:43:17,279 Speaker 1: because there's so proper people die. How many people die 803 00:43:17,280 --> 00:43:20,400 Speaker 1: in the serious The children drowning is fine, it's the 804 00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:23,000 Speaker 1: it's the b andy we're really worried about. Um. But 805 00:43:23,080 --> 00:43:26,719 Speaker 1: that particular episode was written by Oliver Ron Oliver to 806 00:43:26,800 --> 00:43:30,800 Speaker 1: have a specific emotional subtext. It was his first script 807 00:43:30,840 --> 00:43:33,200 Speaker 1: for the show, and as a gay man. He said, 808 00:43:33,320 --> 00:43:35,719 Speaker 1: it is definitely about a family dealing with how to 809 00:43:35,800 --> 00:43:39,160 Speaker 1: tell their kid that this uncle is gay. In our case, 810 00:43:39,320 --> 00:43:42,400 Speaker 1: I just made him a werewolf. But the rest of 811 00:43:42,440 --> 00:43:45,239 Speaker 1: it is the same. As the father says, there are 812 00:43:45,360 --> 00:43:49,839 Speaker 1: lots of different kinds of families. Jed, this is ours, um, 813 00:43:49,880 --> 00:43:51,440 Speaker 1: and then he added, I do know a couple of 814 00:43:51,440 --> 00:43:53,560 Speaker 1: our kid actors came to me many years later, having 815 00:43:53,560 --> 00:43:55,239 Speaker 1: come out as gay and thank me for being a 816 00:43:55,280 --> 00:43:58,080 Speaker 1: positive influence as an out gay man in the industry. 817 00:43:58,320 --> 00:44:00,920 Speaker 1: As far back as the late eighties. So I'm proud 818 00:44:00,960 --> 00:44:03,120 Speaker 1: of that. And this dies into the next part, which 819 00:44:03,120 --> 00:44:05,399 Speaker 1: is where we continually talk about as we talk about 820 00:44:05,400 --> 00:44:08,680 Speaker 1: all these Nickelodeon shows of this era, of how progressive 821 00:44:08,680 --> 00:44:11,000 Speaker 1: they were in their in their casting. There were two 822 00:44:11,120 --> 00:44:15,120 Speaker 1: big mandates with casting, Michale told Vox in two thousand fifteen. 823 00:44:15,440 --> 00:44:19,200 Speaker 1: Besides good diversity was a big one in the oral 824 00:44:19,280 --> 00:44:23,399 Speaker 1: history Slimed. The actor Jason Ala Sherrian told Clickstein DJ 825 00:44:23,520 --> 00:44:25,839 Speaker 1: McHale was way ahead of his time in making sure 826 00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:29,080 Speaker 1: that his show represented all kids, not just white kids. 827 00:44:29,440 --> 00:44:32,960 Speaker 1: There was absolutely no problem with their being interracial relationships 828 00:44:32,960 --> 00:44:37,439 Speaker 1: on the show. And again, this wasn't commonplace. They didn't 829 00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:39,880 Speaker 1: think it was even worthwhile to comment on it. Instead, 830 00:44:39,920 --> 00:44:41,719 Speaker 1: they just played like it was normal, which is the 831 00:44:41,719 --> 00:44:46,560 Speaker 1: greatest testament to representing diversity on a show. And hilariously, 832 00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:50,280 Speaker 1: Michale told Vox that quote often a kid got nixed 833 00:44:50,280 --> 00:44:54,360 Speaker 1: by Nickelodeon because they were too Disney, apple pie, freckles, cute, 834 00:44:54,400 --> 00:44:56,560 Speaker 1: over the top acting. They were like, this is a 835 00:44:56,600 --> 00:44:58,920 Speaker 1: Disney kid, get rid of him. He got to Sigott 836 00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:03,160 Speaker 1: Shopic examp as knee kids, and I think that this 837 00:45:03,280 --> 00:45:04,960 Speaker 1: is seems talking. I think this is one of the 838 00:45:04,960 --> 00:45:08,160 Speaker 1: things that made Nickelodeon so great. If it's smacked of Disneyanna, 839 00:45:08,520 --> 00:45:11,400 Speaker 1: they wouldn't do it, and their efforts resulted in an 840 00:45:11,480 --> 00:45:16,279 Speaker 1: n double, a CP Award nomination, and gender wise, Ron 841 00:45:16,320 --> 00:45:20,000 Speaker 1: Oliver added in the slimed oral history, I'd like to say, 842 00:45:20,040 --> 00:45:21,799 Speaker 1: Are You Afraid of the Dark was a boys show, 843 00:45:22,040 --> 00:45:23,640 Speaker 1: but I have a feeling that it was split down 844 00:45:23,640 --> 00:45:26,319 Speaker 1: the middle because we'd switch off every episode with there 845 00:45:26,400 --> 00:45:29,160 Speaker 1: being a girl protagonist or a boy protagonist. They were 846 00:45:29,239 --> 00:45:31,520 Speaker 1: quite conscious of that at Nickelodeon. We were one of 847 00:45:31,560 --> 00:45:33,960 Speaker 1: the first shows that actually tried to straddle the middle 848 00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:36,799 Speaker 1: line and succeeded at it. Front of applause for Aren't 849 00:45:36,840 --> 00:45:41,600 Speaker 1: Afraid of the Dark, um that iconic theme music speaking 850 00:45:41,800 --> 00:45:45,920 Speaker 1: of nothing in particular segue Incredibly for a show of 851 00:45:45,960 --> 00:45:48,840 Speaker 1: this nature and one produced in the cut rate, poutine 852 00:45:48,920 --> 00:45:52,440 Speaker 1: drenched wasteland of Montreal, Are You Afraid of the Dark 853 00:45:52,520 --> 00:45:56,600 Speaker 1: had an original score for every episode. Uh Michael told 854 00:45:56,680 --> 00:45:59,680 Speaker 1: Vulture we scored each show individually like there were short films, 855 00:45:59,680 --> 00:46:03,440 Speaker 1: which necessary because each show was so different with spooky stories. 856 00:46:03,680 --> 00:46:07,040 Speaker 1: Music plays a huge part uh the show's music director 857 00:46:07,040 --> 00:46:10,040 Speaker 1: and composer Jeff Zon explained to art of the title 858 00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:12,560 Speaker 1: dot Com. I thought it best to bring in about 859 00:46:12,560 --> 00:46:14,879 Speaker 1: ten writers and have them write samples of their work, 860 00:46:14,960 --> 00:46:17,960 Speaker 1: and I would direct the process. We found two fabulous 861 00:46:17,960 --> 00:46:20,760 Speaker 1: composers to share the load. At some point we discussed 862 00:46:20,760 --> 00:46:22,799 Speaker 1: the opening sequence, but I don't remember if they gave 863 00:46:22,800 --> 00:46:25,680 Speaker 1: me any footage or a script first, or if I 864 00:46:25,680 --> 00:46:27,840 Speaker 1: wrote the music alone. I'm pretty sure I wrote a 865 00:46:27,920 --> 00:46:30,360 Speaker 1: music piece about one minute long with just the outline 866 00:46:30,360 --> 00:46:32,440 Speaker 1: of the series in my head, and they edited the 867 00:46:32,520 --> 00:46:35,120 Speaker 1: visuals to that. It turned out to be the horror 868 00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:38,000 Speaker 1: of commercial air travel in Canada that inspired the theme. 869 00:46:38,600 --> 00:46:41,080 Speaker 1: I was actually sitting in door Vile air part in 870 00:46:41,160 --> 00:46:44,080 Speaker 1: Montreal and I started singing theme awaiting for my planes 871 00:46:44,120 --> 00:46:48,040 Speaker 1: on continued. I just thought about the series about mystery hauntings, 872 00:46:48,200 --> 00:46:52,319 Speaker 1: scary supernatural things, thrillers and kids, and it came to me. 873 00:46:52,520 --> 00:46:54,360 Speaker 1: I didn't have music paper, so I scribbled out the 874 00:46:54,400 --> 00:46:56,480 Speaker 1: notes on a napkin. I really liked it and kept 875 00:46:56,520 --> 00:46:58,560 Speaker 1: singing it. Then when I played it on piano, the 876 00:46:58,600 --> 00:47:01,000 Speaker 1: important countermelody came to me, which I used as an 877 00:47:01,040 --> 00:47:03,920 Speaker 1: introduction and for linking material it's funny to me. In 878 00:47:03,920 --> 00:47:05,680 Speaker 1: that interview, they keep asking him, They're like, what do 879 00:47:05,719 --> 00:47:07,880 Speaker 1: you think is like makes a successful TV theme? And 880 00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:11,799 Speaker 1: multiple time he brings up the Sopranos opening credits Alabama 881 00:47:11,840 --> 00:47:14,960 Speaker 1: threes woke up this morning, so that's what he considers it. 882 00:47:15,480 --> 00:47:17,880 Speaker 1: It's great, it's great, but a song whips that was 883 00:47:17,920 --> 00:47:20,640 Speaker 1: my dad's workout song for the longest time. I will 884 00:47:20,680 --> 00:47:24,600 Speaker 1: always be fused with my dad on the elliptical machine. Uh, 885 00:47:24,680 --> 00:47:27,920 Speaker 1: you know, it's funny. I I just listened to the 886 00:47:28,000 --> 00:47:31,239 Speaker 1: ru Pha of the Dark theme as we started this episode, Like, 887 00:47:31,719 --> 00:47:34,319 Speaker 1: how do you even hum that piece of music? Yeah, 888 00:47:34,360 --> 00:47:38,520 Speaker 1: it's like it does not have a particularly stirring melody. No, No, 889 00:47:38,600 --> 00:47:40,560 Speaker 1: I mean it's just it's it's a it's an amazing 890 00:47:40,680 --> 00:47:43,919 Speaker 1: sound design. But like, yeah, I so he's talking about 891 00:47:43,960 --> 00:47:45,839 Speaker 1: like singing it to himself at the airport. I'm just 892 00:47:45,960 --> 00:47:48,800 Speaker 1: I can't imagine that. But but the way it pairs 893 00:47:48,840 --> 00:47:51,480 Speaker 1: with the visuals is so good. That opening sequence is 894 00:47:51,520 --> 00:47:54,120 Speaker 1: incredible because, I mean, pretty much across the board, it 895 00:47:54,280 --> 00:47:57,600 Speaker 1: manages to avoid cliche. It's not like, you know, a 896 00:47:57,719 --> 00:48:00,320 Speaker 1: coughin and all like tales from the Trick type stuff. 897 00:48:00,320 --> 00:48:03,080 Speaker 1: It's like a rowboat bobbing on the water at night, 898 00:48:03,360 --> 00:48:08,040 Speaker 1: or like thrusted creaking swing sets. Stuff that's scary. But 899 00:48:08,400 --> 00:48:12,320 Speaker 1: I can't articulate why. It just is all unsettling and unnerving. 900 00:48:12,360 --> 00:48:16,319 Speaker 1: It's so good. Um. Once a debut, the show was 901 00:48:16,400 --> 00:48:19,759 Speaker 1: basically a lynch pin of the Snake programming block, but 902 00:48:20,000 --> 00:48:23,840 Speaker 1: the placement actually kind of came after they had everything 903 00:48:23,880 --> 00:48:26,600 Speaker 1: in hand. The ratings were really really high, Michael said, 904 00:48:27,320 --> 00:48:28,839 Speaker 1: I don't know who the guy or woman was who 905 00:48:28,840 --> 00:48:30,120 Speaker 1: came up with the idea, but they said, you know, 906 00:48:30,120 --> 00:48:32,279 Speaker 1: there's a group of people on Saturday night are too 907 00:48:32,360 --> 00:48:34,120 Speaker 1: young to be on date and too old to be 908 00:48:34,160 --> 00:48:37,120 Speaker 1: in bed, and they're watching TV. And that's when they 909 00:48:37,120 --> 00:48:40,440 Speaker 1: created Snake. It was as much Snake as Are You 910 00:48:40,480 --> 00:48:43,279 Speaker 1: Afraid of the Dark? If not more. That became a phenomenon. 911 00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:46,640 Speaker 1: He continued, I really tipped my cap to Nickelodeon for 912 00:48:46,719 --> 00:48:49,120 Speaker 1: putting the right shows on at the right time, which 913 00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:52,600 Speaker 1: nobody had done before. Nobody had ever programmed Saturday nights 914 00:48:52,600 --> 00:48:55,880 Speaker 1: for kids. Usually it was just Saturday morning programming for kids. 915 00:48:56,040 --> 00:48:59,080 Speaker 1: But Nickelodeon had the foresight to program Saturday nights as well. 916 00:48:59,280 --> 00:49:02,160 Speaker 1: That was really in so the first Snake line up 917 00:49:02,200 --> 00:49:05,160 Speaker 1: went from eight to ten pm with four half hour shows. 918 00:49:05,480 --> 00:49:07,960 Speaker 1: The eight pm show is a sitcom. Closer explains it 919 00:49:08,000 --> 00:49:10,719 Speaker 1: all Melson Joan Hart. The eight thirty pm shows a 920 00:49:10,760 --> 00:49:13,719 Speaker 1: comedy variety show roundhouse. Then the nine pm show is 921 00:49:13,760 --> 00:49:15,440 Speaker 1: really what they built the whole thing around that was 922 00:49:15,480 --> 00:49:17,840 Speaker 1: Rent and Stimpy, which was the huge breakout hit at 923 00:49:17,880 --> 00:49:20,440 Speaker 1: the time, and then if you were staying up that 924 00:49:20,560 --> 00:49:22,520 Speaker 1: late to see the latest thing that was Are You 925 00:49:22,560 --> 00:49:26,200 Speaker 1: Afraid of the Dark at nine thirty. Yeah, the sequencing 926 00:49:26,239 --> 00:49:29,040 Speaker 1: on Snick was really brilliant, like a good album. I mean, 927 00:49:29,400 --> 00:49:31,120 Speaker 1: the rent and snipy humor really put you in the 928 00:49:31,200 --> 00:49:34,839 Speaker 1: right head space for are You Afraid of the Dark? Um. Yeah, 929 00:49:34,880 --> 00:49:36,480 Speaker 1: and I never really thought about the fact that it 930 00:49:36,520 --> 00:49:38,560 Speaker 1: was on later weeded out some of the younger kids 931 00:49:38,560 --> 00:49:41,440 Speaker 1: who probably shouldn't be watching that anyway. There's sort of 932 00:49:41,440 --> 00:49:44,239 Speaker 1: a bizarre continuity to this show that we alluded to 933 00:49:44,239 --> 00:49:47,640 Speaker 1: a little bit earlier because of the rights situation um, 934 00:49:47,680 --> 00:49:50,880 Speaker 1: which is best explained in McHale's words. He said, when 935 00:49:50,920 --> 00:49:54,920 Speaker 1: we finished our run, after we had done sixty five episodes, 936 00:49:55,239 --> 00:49:58,160 Speaker 1: and sixty episodes was the golden number back then I 937 00:49:58,200 --> 00:50:00,239 Speaker 1: went back and did a deal with Disney for some 938 00:50:00,320 --> 00:50:02,960 Speaker 1: other things. The reason I went back to Nickelodeon to 939 00:50:03,000 --> 00:50:04,520 Speaker 1: do two more seasons of Are You Afraid of the 940 00:50:04,600 --> 00:50:06,680 Speaker 1: Dark was not because of the network. It was because 941 00:50:06,680 --> 00:50:08,680 Speaker 1: of the Canadian producer who had the rights to the 942 00:50:08,680 --> 00:50:11,439 Speaker 1: show all around the world. All of their five year 943 00:50:11,480 --> 00:50:13,880 Speaker 1: licenses on the show we're running out, so they wanted 944 00:50:13,920 --> 00:50:17,360 Speaker 1: foreign broadcasters to re license the show and to sweeten 945 00:50:17,400 --> 00:50:19,600 Speaker 1: the pop They said, how about if we make new episodes? 946 00:50:19,719 --> 00:50:24,320 Speaker 1: So I agreed to do more, as always agreed, he 947 00:50:24,360 --> 00:50:27,880 Speaker 1: said Vulture. Nickelodeon played a lesser role in the second 948 00:50:28,080 --> 00:50:31,440 Speaker 1: group of episodes because they weren't the primary broadcaster anymore, 949 00:50:31,800 --> 00:50:34,120 Speaker 1: but they still wanted the show and aired all the episodes. 950 00:50:34,520 --> 00:50:36,439 Speaker 1: For the most part, though there were no changes made 951 00:50:36,480 --> 00:50:39,360 Speaker 1: other than to cast a new midnight Society. The biggest 952 00:50:39,400 --> 00:50:42,000 Speaker 1: difference in this second stretch of shows is that McHale 953 00:50:42,120 --> 00:50:44,200 Speaker 1: was just not as involved as he had been in 954 00:50:44,239 --> 00:50:46,560 Speaker 1: the first run. He was not physically in Montreal for 955 00:50:46,600 --> 00:50:48,960 Speaker 1: the filming. He was not involved in the day to 956 00:50:49,040 --> 00:50:51,680 Speaker 1: day production except to kind of offer comments from afar. 957 00:50:52,080 --> 00:50:54,399 Speaker 1: He didn't direct any more episodes, but he did work 958 00:50:54,400 --> 00:50:57,080 Speaker 1: on the scripts from home. I worked with the editors 959 00:50:57,080 --> 00:51:01,880 Speaker 1: and the and the music supervisors. Um again d J. 960 00:51:02,000 --> 00:51:04,600 Speaker 1: McHale quote machine, he said, So if you like the show, 961 00:51:04,719 --> 00:51:07,080 Speaker 1: you can congratulate me. If you didn't like the show, 962 00:51:07,200 --> 00:51:10,239 Speaker 1: it was also my fault. Um. But by the time 963 00:51:10,280 --> 00:51:12,919 Speaker 1: the second incarnation of the show hit, Nickelodeon, he said, 964 00:51:13,000 --> 00:51:16,120 Speaker 1: was already moving away from doing dramas, which is a 965 00:51:16,160 --> 00:51:19,520 Speaker 1: decision that he puts down primarily to budget. Comedies are 966 00:51:19,600 --> 00:51:22,680 Speaker 1: much cheaper to do, he said, and kids love comedies, 967 00:51:22,920 --> 00:51:25,640 Speaker 1: so they went with the lowest common denominator. They figured 968 00:51:25,640 --> 00:51:27,400 Speaker 1: they had a better chance of getting a hit with 969 00:51:27,440 --> 00:51:30,360 Speaker 1: a comedy than drama. The networks just want to go 970 00:51:30,440 --> 00:51:33,160 Speaker 1: the easy route, which is comedy. And then he added 971 00:51:33,160 --> 00:51:36,200 Speaker 1: that he actually developed another horror show from nick following 972 00:51:36,200 --> 00:51:37,759 Speaker 1: Are You Afraid of the Dark in two thousand or 973 00:51:37,760 --> 00:51:40,520 Speaker 1: two thousand one. He said, it took two years for 974 00:51:40,560 --> 00:51:43,440 Speaker 1: this show to develop until they finally said, you know, DJ, 975 00:51:43,920 --> 00:51:46,279 Speaker 1: we're just not doing dramas anymore. We just don't want 976 00:51:46,280 --> 00:51:48,160 Speaker 1: to do them. It's a shame because this show actually 977 00:51:48,160 --> 00:51:51,560 Speaker 1: seems pretty cool. It's called The Strange Legacy of Cameron 978 00:51:51,719 --> 00:51:54,120 Speaker 1: Cruz and it was about a psychic kid who was 979 00:51:54,160 --> 00:51:57,640 Speaker 1: solved ghost stories and other supernatural cases. And they actually 980 00:51:57,640 --> 00:51:59,880 Speaker 1: made a pilot of this with Jesse McCartney, which is 981 00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:05,400 Speaker 1: just yeah. But McHale really never felt like the network 982 00:52:05,480 --> 00:52:07,759 Speaker 1: was all in for All You Afraid of the Dark, 983 00:52:08,080 --> 00:52:10,319 Speaker 1: probably stemming from the fact that they originally passed on 984 00:52:10,400 --> 00:52:13,680 Speaker 1: his pitch the first time around, and this sense continued 985 00:52:13,760 --> 00:52:16,359 Speaker 1: even after the show became a big hit. He later said, 986 00:52:16,640 --> 00:52:18,319 Speaker 1: I've always felt that since Are You Afraid of the 987 00:52:18,360 --> 00:52:21,960 Speaker 1: Dark ended, I've never felt the love from Nickelodeon. Maybe 988 00:52:21,960 --> 00:52:24,040 Speaker 1: it's the whole comedy thing since they've been getting away 989 00:52:24,040 --> 00:52:26,800 Speaker 1: from dramas, but I never felt like they thought, Wow, 990 00:52:27,080 --> 00:52:29,560 Speaker 1: we really have this gem that we have the complete 991 00:52:29,640 --> 00:52:32,560 Speaker 1: rights to. We can show it until the magnetic particles 992 00:52:32,640 --> 00:52:35,040 Speaker 1: fall off. It really it did, like I mean, it's 993 00:52:35,040 --> 00:52:36,560 Speaker 1: just what you said. It did kind of just go 994 00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:40,480 Speaker 1: away after a while. Yeah. There was, however, very nearly 995 00:52:40,520 --> 00:52:42,600 Speaker 1: and Are You Afraid of the Dark feature film back 996 00:52:42,600 --> 00:52:45,319 Speaker 1: in the late nineties, Michael said, I did write an 997 00:52:45,320 --> 00:52:47,320 Speaker 1: Are You Afraid of the Dark movie called The Tale 998 00:52:47,360 --> 00:52:50,000 Speaker 1: of the Wicked Gift for Paramount. It was an original 999 00:52:50,040 --> 00:52:53,160 Speaker 1: story about the Boogeyman, who was conjured centuries before by 1000 00:52:53,160 --> 00:52:56,040 Speaker 1: an ancient tribe as a means to discipline children who 1001 00:52:56,920 --> 00:52:59,600 Speaker 1: part The project never really went anywhere because the folks 1002 00:52:59,600 --> 00:53:01,800 Speaker 1: who ran Paramount at the time didn't get that you 1003 00:53:01,840 --> 00:53:05,200 Speaker 1: could make a movie like that, meaning horror light. They 1004 00:53:05,239 --> 00:53:07,960 Speaker 1: felt that horror to either be true horror or Scooby 1005 00:53:08,000 --> 00:53:10,520 Speaker 1: Doo funny. It's too bad. I went back and read 1006 00:53:10,560 --> 00:53:13,960 Speaker 1: that script recently and it's really good. It's never too late. Meanwhile, 1007 00:53:13,960 --> 00:53:16,280 Speaker 1: I was announced in November two eleven that a film 1008 00:53:16,280 --> 00:53:19,399 Speaker 1: adaptation of the series wasn't worked at the Paramount from 1009 00:53:19,440 --> 00:53:21,840 Speaker 1: a guy who would go on to write it, Gary Doberman, 1010 00:53:22,120 --> 00:53:25,520 Speaker 1: and producer Matt Kaplan, who did to All the Boys 1011 00:53:25,520 --> 00:53:30,560 Speaker 1: I've loved before with extreme workman like director DJ Caruso, 1012 00:53:31,560 --> 00:53:35,720 Speaker 1: who did Disturbia and Triple X, Return of Xander Cage 1013 00:53:36,440 --> 00:53:39,200 Speaker 1: on the big screen, episodes of The Shield, Smallville and 1014 00:53:39,320 --> 00:53:43,520 Speaker 1: Dark Angel on TV would have been directing, so the 1015 00:53:43,560 --> 00:53:47,080 Speaker 1: movie certainly would have had a director who would have 1016 00:53:47,280 --> 00:53:52,839 Speaker 1: directed it. The film originally had October two nine release date, 1017 00:53:52,960 --> 00:53:57,080 Speaker 1: but eight months before that, Paramount just quietly removed it 1018 00:53:57,120 --> 00:53:59,840 Speaker 1: from their schedule, which is a bummer and sadly this 1019 00:53:59,920 --> 00:54:01,480 Speaker 1: is as good at time as anything to delve into 1020 00:54:01,560 --> 00:54:03,600 Speaker 1: why the show took so long to make it to streaming. 1021 00:54:03,920 --> 00:54:08,160 Speaker 1: As Michael explained, it's absence on streamers to complex, saying 1022 00:54:08,480 --> 00:54:12,040 Speaker 1: the show is co owned by Viacom Nickelodeon on one side, 1023 00:54:12,080 --> 00:54:16,000 Speaker 1: and then this Canadian company Signar, who were the show's finances. 1024 00:54:16,760 --> 00:54:19,520 Speaker 1: They have complete control over it. Um So for a 1025 00:54:19,560 --> 00:54:22,560 Speaker 1: long time you could only watch it on like YouTube essentially. 1026 00:54:22,800 --> 00:54:25,960 Speaker 1: Now I think it's on Paramount Plus, uh maybe even 1027 00:54:26,080 --> 00:54:31,200 Speaker 1: on Netflix. Jordan's I'm still seeing it on YouTube quite 1028 00:54:31,200 --> 00:54:35,240 Speaker 1: a bit. I don't know. I mean seemingly like illegal versions. 1029 00:54:35,320 --> 00:54:40,080 Speaker 1: Not to blow up anybody's spot. But anyway, as Michael 1030 00:54:40,080 --> 00:54:43,319 Speaker 1: had moved into Young The Realm of y, a young 1031 00:54:43,360 --> 00:54:46,520 Speaker 1: adult fiction, I mentioned a complex. I actually have a 1032 00:54:46,560 --> 00:54:49,000 Speaker 1: pitch out to Amazon now to do a similar series, 1033 00:54:49,600 --> 00:54:52,440 Speaker 1: and I am waiting to hear back from them. Now 1034 00:54:52,440 --> 00:54:55,680 Speaker 1: it's online companies who are doing interesting things. It's Netflix 1035 00:54:55,680 --> 00:54:58,040 Speaker 1: and Amazon. If Amazon doesn't want to do the spooky 1036 00:54:58,080 --> 00:54:59,759 Speaker 1: show I've pitched, I'm going to do it as a 1037 00:54:59,800 --> 00:55:05,799 Speaker 1: book series. So obviously that didn't happen. Yeah, I think 1038 00:55:05,840 --> 00:55:08,879 Speaker 1: he has a book series now called pen Dragon. Yeah, 1039 00:55:08,960 --> 00:55:12,560 Speaker 1: he's a successful like fantasy author. At this point, I 1040 00:55:12,560 --> 00:55:16,320 Speaker 1: can't imagine Michale warmed much to Nickelodeon when the network 1041 00:55:16,520 --> 00:55:18,840 Speaker 1: brought Are You Afraid the Dark back for a reboot 1042 00:55:18,840 --> 00:55:22,839 Speaker 1: in twenty nineteen and didn't ask him to participate. This 1043 00:55:22,880 --> 00:55:26,160 Speaker 1: is according to an article on dennive Geek. Apparently this 1044 00:55:26,360 --> 00:55:28,720 Speaker 1: left some bitter feelings in bad blood with the network, 1045 00:55:28,800 --> 00:55:31,440 Speaker 1: but at least he was complimentary about this reboot, or 1046 00:55:31,480 --> 00:55:34,080 Speaker 1: at least the first of the three seasons. He told 1047 00:55:34,120 --> 00:55:35,960 Speaker 1: Don of Geek. One of the things I said that 1048 00:55:36,000 --> 00:55:38,560 Speaker 1: the producer was be careful because you're making a show 1049 00:55:38,600 --> 00:55:41,359 Speaker 1: that people who are in their thirties have great memories of, 1050 00:55:41,719 --> 00:55:43,440 Speaker 1: and chances are you're not going to live up to 1051 00:55:43,480 --> 00:55:46,120 Speaker 1: those memories, and those memories are probably better than the 1052 00:55:46,120 --> 00:55:48,960 Speaker 1: show was. Frankly, you're not really making a show for them, 1053 00:55:49,040 --> 00:55:51,560 Speaker 1: because they've moved on. You're really making a show for 1054 00:55:51,600 --> 00:55:53,799 Speaker 1: the same age group that we made it for, and 1055 00:55:53,840 --> 00:55:55,880 Speaker 1: they did. I think they hit just the right tone. 1056 00:55:56,320 --> 00:55:58,560 Speaker 1: I think they've done the show a good service. I'd 1057 00:55:58,600 --> 00:56:01,000 Speaker 1: be really upset if they somehow ruined it, but they didn't, 1058 00:56:01,120 --> 00:56:06,560 Speaker 1: so that's good. Nudging accepted. Did you know there's a 1059 00:56:06,560 --> 00:56:11,040 Speaker 1: book series? Didn't? Undoubtedly to compete with the Goose Bump 1060 00:56:11,120 --> 00:56:15,480 Speaker 1: series created by John Peel. Unfortunately not the iconic British 1061 00:56:15,560 --> 00:56:18,800 Speaker 1: DJ the same name, but a different John p a 1062 00:56:18,840 --> 00:56:23,400 Speaker 1: different British John Peel who specializes in TV series tie 1063 00:56:23,400 --> 00:56:27,640 Speaker 1: ins and novelizations. Oh my god, wait, I think he 1064 00:56:27,680 --> 00:56:31,120 Speaker 1: did one for the Avengers movie with Ray Fines and 1065 00:56:31,320 --> 00:56:37,719 Speaker 1: Uma Thurman. Written under John Vincent or Nicholas Adams. It 1066 00:56:37,760 --> 00:56:39,600 Speaker 1: was John Peel because I remember thinking, wait a minute, 1067 00:56:39,640 --> 00:56:43,000 Speaker 1: m A Peal is a movie and John Peel? Yeah? 1068 00:56:43,160 --> 00:56:46,200 Speaker 1: Did you read his Carbon San Diego, Doctor Who or 1069 00:56:46,280 --> 00:56:49,640 Speaker 1: Star Trek novelizations? No? None were English enough for me. 1070 00:56:49,800 --> 00:56:52,840 Speaker 1: What about his series James Bond Jr. Oh that is 1071 00:56:52,880 --> 00:56:56,640 Speaker 1: English enough for me. But I didn't read that. Uh 1072 00:56:56,680 --> 00:57:01,520 Speaker 1: there was an argue afraid of the Dark board game? Huh? 1073 00:57:01,600 --> 00:57:03,680 Speaker 1: What was there? A video game? Kind of shocked there wasn't, 1074 00:57:04,160 --> 00:57:07,120 Speaker 1: or like an educational computer game or like a Doom 1075 00:57:07,239 --> 00:57:12,239 Speaker 1: related like no, okay, well, I'd like to throw in 1076 00:57:12,280 --> 00:57:15,360 Speaker 1: a quick it belongs in the museum segment. The clown 1077 00:57:15,440 --> 00:57:17,880 Speaker 1: doll from the season three episode The Tale of the 1078 00:57:17,920 --> 00:57:22,280 Speaker 1: Crimson clown was put on eBay and sold for five 1079 00:57:22,800 --> 00:57:26,640 Speaker 1: nine dollars, and it was later resold apparently for half 1080 00:57:26,680 --> 00:57:30,560 Speaker 1: a million dollars. I have not been able to confirm this, 1081 00:57:30,680 --> 00:57:34,160 Speaker 1: but it's shown up on various trivialisticals So make of 1082 00:57:34,240 --> 00:57:36,360 Speaker 1: that what you will. I just found that interesting, well, 1083 00:57:36,400 --> 00:57:40,120 Speaker 1: you know, for a Y A O T D fans um. 1084 00:57:40,160 --> 00:57:44,000 Speaker 1: The show's second revival began in October was renewed for 1085 00:57:44,120 --> 00:57:47,439 Speaker 1: a second and third season, the most recent of which 1086 00:57:47,480 --> 00:57:52,320 Speaker 1: premiered just this year July of two. So there you go. 1087 00:57:52,640 --> 00:57:54,240 Speaker 1: That's fun. They get you got that going for you? 1088 00:57:54,320 --> 00:57:57,640 Speaker 1: Which is which is nice? I am afraid of jinxing 1089 00:57:57,640 --> 00:57:59,880 Speaker 1: what has been one of our shorter episodes on a 1090 00:58:00,040 --> 00:58:06,480 Speaker 1: sway without detours into international maritime law. But to be honest, 1091 00:58:07,160 --> 00:58:09,760 Speaker 1: and to be more to the point, as just a 1092 00:58:09,760 --> 00:58:12,680 Speaker 1: horror nerd, you know, I have nothing but good things 1093 00:58:12,720 --> 00:58:14,880 Speaker 1: to say about Are you afraid of that dark? I'm 1094 00:58:15,160 --> 00:58:18,200 Speaker 1: I'm happy that there was nothing creepy, like like actually 1095 00:58:18,240 --> 00:58:20,200 Speaker 1: creepy lurking under the hood here, and that it was 1096 00:58:21,320 --> 00:58:25,640 Speaker 1: a well made series made with love that people are 1097 00:58:25,680 --> 00:58:29,120 Speaker 1: still getting joy from. So allow me to close this 1098 00:58:29,200 --> 00:58:32,200 Speaker 1: out by saying submitted for the approval of the Midnight Society. 1099 00:58:32,200 --> 00:58:35,760 Speaker 1: This has been the Tale of Too Much Information. I'm 1100 00:58:35,760 --> 00:58:38,560 Speaker 1: Alex Hegel and I'm Jordan run Talk. We'll catch you 1101 00:58:38,640 --> 00:58:46,120 Speaker 1: next time. Too Much Information was a production of I 1102 00:58:46,200 --> 00:58:49,440 Speaker 1: Heart Radio. The show's executive producers are Noel Brown and 1103 00:58:49,520 --> 00:58:52,600 Speaker 1: Jordan run Talk. The supervising producer is Mike John's. The 1104 00:58:52,640 --> 00:58:55,640 Speaker 1: show was researched, written, and hosted by Jordan run Talk 1105 00:58:55,680 --> 00:58:58,760 Speaker 1: and Alex Hegel, with original music by Seth Applebaum on 1106 00:58:58,800 --> 00:59:01,360 Speaker 1: the Ghost Funk Orchestra. If you like what you heard, 1107 00:59:01,440 --> 00:59:04,160 Speaker 1: please subscribe and leave us a review. For more podcasts 1108 00:59:04,160 --> 00:59:06,479 Speaker 1: on I heart Radio, visit the I heart Radio app, 1109 00:59:06,600 --> 00:59:09,520 Speaker 1: Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.