1
00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:14,120
Speaker 1: Crime stories with Nancy Grace. I need to require by

2
00:00:14,640 --> 00:00:17,319
Speaker 1: admitting it's just something that you never think that would

3
00:00:17,320 --> 00:00:20,960
Speaker 1: happen in this community. It's it's something that you never

4
00:00:21,000 --> 00:00:23,279
Speaker 1: want to do. Joe Hepner made the call to the

5
00:00:23,320 --> 00:00:26,800
Speaker 1: Sheriff's office that he walked into the house and went

6
00:00:26,840 --> 00:00:30,360
Speaker 1: back out and he was gone, and Jonathan to walk away.

7
00:00:30,680 --> 00:00:33,159
Speaker 1: The last time Jonathan Menard was seen was at a

8
00:00:33,200 --> 00:00:36,000
Speaker 1: home in New Harrisburg and the last thing the family

9
00:00:36,040 --> 00:00:39,159
Speaker 1: heard was that Jonathan took a break complaining of a

10
00:00:39,200 --> 00:00:42,560
Speaker 1: toothache after working on a farm nearby. He didn't call

11
00:00:42,640 --> 00:00:46,800
Speaker 1: home and he didn't return. I haven't shot my my

12
00:00:46,960 --> 00:00:49,839
Speaker 1: porch flight off. It's been nearly a week since Jonathan

13
00:00:49,880 --> 00:00:54,480
Speaker 1: went missing. Hundreds showed up to search for the team.

14
00:00:54,600 --> 00:00:59,280
Speaker 1: Earlier this week, the Sheriff's office launched a criminal investigation,

15
00:00:59,560 --> 00:01:03,000
Speaker 1: calling the missing case suspicious. They're also talking to a

16
00:01:03,000 --> 00:01:06,520
Speaker 1: person of interest, but stop short of releasing details. Family

17
00:01:06,520 --> 00:01:09,800
Speaker 1: members don't believe that Jonathan would have run away. You know,

18
00:01:09,880 --> 00:01:14,840
Speaker 1: he's not one to take off. He's a good kid.

19
00:01:15,080 --> 00:01:17,160
Speaker 1: He was going around the neighborhood in del Whare. I

20
00:01:17,200 --> 00:01:19,040
Speaker 1: ask him people if they he can mow their yards

21
00:01:19,240 --> 00:01:21,479
Speaker 1: and he wouldn't even charge them. The family is still

22
00:01:21,480 --> 00:01:24,440
Speaker 1: holding on to hope that Jonathan will make it home.

23
00:01:25,040 --> 00:01:28,720
Speaker 1: I just want to hear his voice say I'm home,

24
00:01:28,840 --> 00:01:32,600
Speaker 1: I'm safe. Detective say they are still actively working on

25
00:01:32,640 --> 00:01:35,720
Speaker 1: this case, and family and friends say they are searching

26
00:01:35,760 --> 00:01:38,200
Speaker 1: on the ground level, putting up some flyers like this

27
00:01:38,240 --> 00:01:40,640
Speaker 1: as well as doing their own searches. You're hearing our

28
00:01:40,680 --> 00:01:45,559
Speaker 1: friend Amani Abraham at wk YC Channel three. How did

29
00:01:45,680 --> 00:01:50,080
Speaker 1: a boy go missing in a rural area with a

30
00:01:50,120 --> 00:01:55,480
Speaker 1: practically zero crime rate. I am talking about this little boy,

31
00:01:55,640 --> 00:02:00,520
Speaker 1: Jonathan Menard, missing from his home in Carroll County. Seen

32
00:02:00,800 --> 00:02:04,960
Speaker 1: in Carrollton, told a friend he would return home afterwards,

33
00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:10,400
Speaker 1: complaining of a toothache. Over one hundred volunteers family friends

34
00:02:10,480 --> 00:02:14,919
Speaker 1: out combing the area within a six mile radius. I mean, see, Grace,

35
00:02:15,040 --> 00:02:17,600
Speaker 1: this is crime stories. Thank you for being with us.

36
00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:20,440
Speaker 1: I don't understand how he goes missing with me an

37
00:02:20,440 --> 00:02:24,079
Speaker 1: all star panel, Mark Class, founder of Class Kids Foundation.

38
00:02:24,600 --> 00:02:28,600
Speaker 1: Joe Scott Morgan, Professor Forensics, Jacksonville State University, author of

39
00:02:28,600 --> 00:02:33,839
Speaker 1: Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon. Renowned defense attorney Randy Kessler,

40
00:02:33,840 --> 00:02:38,200
Speaker 1: Professor at Emory law school doctor, Daniel Bober forensics psychiatrist,

41
00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:43,000
Speaker 1: and John Linley Crime online dot Com investigative reporter John Linley.

42
00:02:43,120 --> 00:02:45,280
Speaker 1: Where was he supposed to be? I mean, when I

43
00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:47,160
Speaker 1: look at this kid, he reminds me so much of

44
00:02:47,200 --> 00:02:51,280
Speaker 1: my son John David. But Jonathan volunteered to help out

45
00:02:51,320 --> 00:02:54,280
Speaker 1: a friend, a twenty nine year old dairy farmer, at

46
00:02:54,320 --> 00:02:58,240
Speaker 1: a neighboring farm there in New Harrisburg, Ohio. At this

47
00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:02,640
Speaker 1: dairy Okay, wait a minute, wait a minute, So this

48
00:03:02,680 --> 00:03:07,359
Speaker 1: little boy lives in the middle of dairy farms. Correct, yes, yes,

49
00:03:07,480 --> 00:03:11,000
Speaker 1: I mean Mark Klass. I grew up in the middle

50
00:03:11,360 --> 00:03:15,600
Speaker 1: of dairy farms and farms in general. It's not like

51
00:03:16,080 --> 00:03:21,320
Speaker 1: there are predators sneaking around the cow pasture, all right.

52
00:03:21,720 --> 00:03:25,440
Speaker 1: That's telling me a lot right there, Mark Klass. He

53
00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:28,880
Speaker 1: lives on a farm. You know how big a dairy

54
00:03:28,919 --> 00:03:32,680
Speaker 1: farm is, of nothing but pasture for the cows and

55
00:03:32,720 --> 00:03:38,000
Speaker 1: their barns, their milking facilities. That's not a high traffic area.

56
00:03:38,120 --> 00:03:40,640
Speaker 1: It's not a quote bad area. It's not a high

57
00:03:40,680 --> 00:03:47,000
Speaker 1: crime area, you know, Nancy. I'm I'm an urban, suburban guy.

58
00:03:47,240 --> 00:03:50,720
Speaker 1: I don't really know much about rural America. I've never

59
00:03:50,760 --> 00:03:54,360
Speaker 1: lived there, but everything I hear about Jonathan is is

60
00:03:54,440 --> 00:03:58,800
Speaker 1: very positive that he would help absolutely anybody at any time,

61
00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:02,400
Speaker 1: for absolutely any reason. He was loved in his community,

62
00:04:02,440 --> 00:04:05,080
Speaker 1: and he seemed to love his community. So it just

63
00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:09,240
Speaker 1: deepens the mystery even more. The thing is, you don't

64
00:04:09,320 --> 00:04:13,120
Speaker 1: know where the predators are. The vast majority of people

65
00:04:13,160 --> 00:04:16,359
Speaker 1: are great people, but there's a bad apple, probably in

66
00:04:16,400 --> 00:04:20,480
Speaker 1: every community in America, and sometimes we never find out

67
00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:23,120
Speaker 1: who they are. Sometimes we find out who they are

68
00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:27,000
Speaker 1: through tragic circumstances. Well, you know what. I don't know

69
00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:28,760
Speaker 1: if you remember this s Mark class, but you were

70
00:04:28,760 --> 00:04:32,920
Speaker 1: the one that told me about looking up six predators

71
00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:35,760
Speaker 1: by zip code, and that was years ago. I didn't

72
00:04:35,800 --> 00:04:38,000
Speaker 1: even believe it or not did not know you can

73
00:04:38,080 --> 00:04:40,080
Speaker 1: look up predators by zip code. That had to be

74
00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:43,760
Speaker 1: over ten years ago. You told me that you can

75
00:04:44,000 --> 00:04:48,159
Speaker 1: find known registered sex offenders in your zip code in

76
00:04:48,240 --> 00:04:51,760
Speaker 1: zip codes around you. But just because there this only

77
00:04:51,800 --> 00:04:56,400
Speaker 1: shows known registered and I mean, Joe Scott Morgan, you're

78
00:04:56,440 --> 00:05:03,240
Speaker 1: the forensics expert. We know that Moless commit molestations about

79
00:05:03,320 --> 00:05:07,000
Speaker 1: seventy I can't remember how many times before they're caught

80
00:05:08,240 --> 00:05:11,520
Speaker 1: well up toward or over a hundred times they've molested

81
00:05:11,560 --> 00:05:15,479
Speaker 1: before they're caught even once to be a registered sex offender. Yeah,

82
00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:18,119
Speaker 1: this is something that they're thinking and planning over period

83
00:05:18,160 --> 00:05:20,280
Speaker 1: of time, and then they begin to act on it

84
00:05:20,400 --> 00:05:24,360
Speaker 1: very subtly, and then at some point they'll get sloppy

85
00:05:24,400 --> 00:05:26,359
Speaker 1: about what they're doing and that's how they wound up

86
00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:31,279
Speaker 1: getting caught. What happened to this little boy, Jonathan Minard.

87
00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:35,440
Speaker 1: I want to go to doctor Daniel Bober, forensic psychiatrist

88
00:05:35,520 --> 00:05:39,600
Speaker 1: and child psychiatrist. This is really striking a chord with me,

89
00:05:39,760 --> 00:05:42,520
Speaker 1: this little boy Jonathan Minard, because he reminds me so

90
00:05:42,640 --> 00:05:46,200
Speaker 1: much of John David. If I want anything done, I

91
00:05:46,200 --> 00:05:49,160
Speaker 1: asked John David, no offense to my little Lucy, who's

92
00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:52,320
Speaker 1: a precious flower. But she'll just sit right there and

93
00:05:52,440 --> 00:05:56,719
Speaker 1: read her story on her iPad. If I asked John Davis,

94
00:05:56,720 --> 00:06:01,040
Speaker 1: he'll jump up and do anything. He helps everybody. He's

95
00:06:01,080 --> 00:06:04,200
Speaker 1: all stressed out this week because of his Steam project.

96
00:06:04,240 --> 00:06:07,360
Speaker 1: He's in a group and I read some messages some

97
00:06:07,440 --> 00:06:10,240
Speaker 1: of the other group members since saying I'm not doing it.

98
00:06:10,480 --> 00:06:12,000
Speaker 1: I know it's a group Gray, but if you want

99
00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:13,920
Speaker 1: it done, John Davy, you're gonna have to do mine too,

100
00:06:14,960 --> 00:06:17,840
Speaker 1: And you know what, he doesn't want to tell the teachers.

101
00:06:18,560 --> 00:06:20,800
Speaker 1: He doesn't want to make a big fuss. He's just

102
00:06:20,839 --> 00:06:23,680
Speaker 1: stressing out, trying to do it all for the whole group.

103
00:06:24,160 --> 00:06:28,680
Speaker 1: That's just him. He will do anything for anybody. That's

104
00:06:28,720 --> 00:06:35,200
Speaker 1: just his personality, Doctor Bober. It just hurts me that

105
00:06:35,400 --> 00:06:39,680
Speaker 1: those are the children that get taken advantage of. Back

106
00:06:39,680 --> 00:06:41,960
Speaker 1: to John Limley, what more can you tell me about

107
00:06:42,000 --> 00:06:45,279
Speaker 1: the day he disappeared? Well, on this Saturday, the day

108
00:06:45,360 --> 00:06:51,000
Speaker 1: that Jonathan returned to this new Harrisburg dairy farm. During

109
00:06:51,040 --> 00:06:56,440
Speaker 1: the day, the dairy farmer says that Jonathan began to

110
00:06:56,520 --> 00:06:59,680
Speaker 1: complain of a toothache, and apparently it just only got

111
00:06:59,760 --> 00:07:03,600
Speaker 1: worse throughout the day, to the point that Jonathan wanted

112
00:07:03,640 --> 00:07:05,520
Speaker 1: to call his mom to come pick him up. He

113
00:07:05,600 --> 00:07:08,440
Speaker 1: was fourteen years old, of course, not driving yet, and

114
00:07:08,480 --> 00:07:11,880
Speaker 1: so the two of them, according to the dairy farmer,

115
00:07:11,920 --> 00:07:15,360
Speaker 1: went into the man's home to place the call. The

116
00:07:15,440 --> 00:07:18,440
Speaker 1: key here, though, is that the mother states that she

117
00:07:18,600 --> 00:07:22,360
Speaker 1: never received a phone call from the team, and she

118
00:07:22,480 --> 00:07:26,160
Speaker 1: has not seen or heard from him since he left

119
00:07:26,240 --> 00:07:34,400
Speaker 1: the house that Saturday morning. This morning, as proximately ten fifteen,

120
00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:40,640
Speaker 1: the body of judn Hole was found buried in a

121
00:07:40,320 --> 00:07:46,200
Speaker 1: farm and worship been ushi. Jonathan's discovery is just the

122
00:07:46,280 --> 00:07:50,320
Speaker 1: first step in gathering evidence answered me, I answered questions

123
00:07:50,360 --> 00:07:53,920
Speaker 1: that we have led us to this moment. Investigations like

124
00:07:54,000 --> 00:07:57,080
Speaker 1: this same time in this case is no exception and

125
00:07:57,160 --> 00:08:01,240
Speaker 1: the many dedicated La unfortunate professionals and art Even as

126
00:08:01,280 --> 00:08:05,000
Speaker 1: we speak this juncture, we're in the early stages of

127
00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:10,560
Speaker 1: the investigation. The opposite prosecuted are not comments or speculating

128
00:08:10,680 --> 00:08:14,120
Speaker 1: any evidence or all Jenny specifics while the investigation is

129
00:08:14,160 --> 00:08:19,800
Speaker 1: cont continuing La Corner I lived at the scene and

130
00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:24,679
Speaker 1: Joss body and mind transform into the Kago the County

131
00:08:24,760 --> 00:08:29,040
Speaker 1: Horror's office for complete autopsy, a witting toxicology. I do

132
00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:33,400
Speaker 1: anticipate and meaning more information or results. For seven weeks

133
00:08:45,760 --> 00:08:53,920
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace, we begin to night with

134
00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:57,800
Speaker 1: breaking news out of Carroll County where missing teenager Jonathan

135
00:08:57,880 --> 00:09:01,200
Speaker 1: Lenard has been found dead, his body buried in his

136
00:09:01,240 --> 00:09:05,120
Speaker 1: shallow grave. Amanny Abraham has been following this story all week,

137
00:09:05,240 --> 00:09:08,160
Speaker 1: joins us in Carroll County Live tonight and Amanny, this

138
00:09:08,280 --> 00:09:12,520
Speaker 1: is just such a sad report, really heartbreaking news from

139
00:09:12,520 --> 00:09:15,440
Speaker 1: the sheriff today learning that Minard was found at a

140
00:09:15,520 --> 00:09:19,600
Speaker 1: farm in Washington Township. He was reported missing over the weekend.

141
00:09:19,880 --> 00:09:22,920
Speaker 1: His family expected him to come home. He never showed up.

142
00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:26,200
Speaker 1: Today it was words the family and friends did not

143
00:09:26,320 --> 00:09:33,120
Speaker 1: want to hear. This juvenile was found buried on a

144
00:09:33,200 --> 00:09:37,760
Speaker 1: farm in Washington Township. Carroll County Sheriff Dale Williams broke

145
00:09:37,800 --> 00:09:40,520
Speaker 1: the news that the fourteen year old, who had hundreds

146
00:09:40,559 --> 00:09:44,000
Speaker 1: searching and hoping for his return, was found buried in

147
00:09:44,040 --> 00:09:47,200
Speaker 1: a shallow grave at a farm, but details as to

148
00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:50,720
Speaker 1: what or where it happened were not released. I'm not

149
00:09:50,760 --> 00:09:56,080
Speaker 1: going to comment. I'm not going to comment on anything

150
00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:59,840
Speaker 1: to jeopardize this investigation. Earlier this week, william said Minard

151
00:09:59,880 --> 00:10:02,320
Speaker 1: was last seen in New Harrisburg, but was working at

152
00:10:02,320 --> 00:10:05,880
Speaker 1: a farm nearby on Mobile Road in Washington Township. A

153
00:10:05,960 --> 00:10:10,080
Speaker 1: Sheriff's vehicle was spotted leaving the property around eleven this morning,

154
00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:14,280
Speaker 1: an hour after Minard's body was found, but Williams would

155
00:10:14,360 --> 00:10:17,720
Speaker 1: not confirm if Minard was found at that farm where

156
00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:20,679
Speaker 1: he'd been working. Detective said there was a person of

157
00:10:20,679 --> 00:10:22,960
Speaker 1: interest in the case, but would not comment on the

158
00:10:23,000 --> 00:10:27,720
Speaker 1: man's identity or whether they have any suspects. The sheriff

159
00:10:27,840 --> 00:10:31,400
Speaker 1: was very careful in releasing any details, including whether or

160
00:10:31,440 --> 00:10:34,280
Speaker 1: not this case has been listed as a homicide. You're

161
00:10:34,320 --> 00:10:39,559
Speaker 1: hearing from our friend Amani Abraham at wk YC Channel three.

162
00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:42,120
Speaker 1: We are learning that the body of this little boy

163
00:10:42,200 --> 00:10:47,800
Speaker 1: who helped everybody who wouldn't hurt a fly, has been found.

164
00:10:48,000 --> 00:10:51,840
Speaker 1: With me doctor Daniel Bober, forensic psychiatrist, Randy Kessler, defense lawyer,

165
00:10:52,120 --> 00:10:55,920
Speaker 1: Mark Class, founder of Class Kids Foundation, Joseph Scott Morgan,

166
00:10:56,080 --> 00:10:59,520
Speaker 1: author of Blood Beneath My Feet on Amazon, John Linley,

167
00:10:59,559 --> 00:11:04,480
Speaker 1: Crime ane Com investigative reporter, after an extensive, exhaustive starge

168
00:11:04,480 --> 00:11:08,400
Speaker 1: with hundreds of volunteers, tell me how and where and

169
00:11:08,520 --> 00:11:12,600
Speaker 1: what condition was this child's body found. As has been

170
00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:15,560
Speaker 1: pointed out in some of those reports, police are being

171
00:11:15,720 --> 00:11:18,959
Speaker 1: very careful not to divulge details in this case for

172
00:11:19,120 --> 00:11:22,840
Speaker 1: fear of jeopardizing the investigation. However, we do know that

173
00:11:22,880 --> 00:11:28,120
Speaker 1: it was a neighboring farm where investigators finally found Jonathan

174
00:11:28,200 --> 00:11:31,480
Speaker 1: Menard's body in a shallow grave. Well. Of course, the

175
00:11:31,559 --> 00:11:36,319
Speaker 1: first place you start to Mark Class founder Class Kids Foundation,

176
00:11:36,880 --> 00:11:41,960
Speaker 1: that's where he last was. It's my understanding, this little

177
00:11:41,960 --> 00:11:45,680
Speaker 1: boy who worked on a dairy farm, was at a

178
00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:50,480
Speaker 1: neighboring farm helping out milking cows. So that's where I

179
00:11:50,559 --> 00:11:53,040
Speaker 1: get if you can establish that's where he really was,

180
00:11:53,960 --> 00:11:55,880
Speaker 1: not just where they thought he was, but where he

181
00:11:55,960 --> 00:11:59,679
Speaker 1: really was, that's where you'd start, right well, absolutely, that's

182
00:11:59,679 --> 00:12:02,439
Speaker 1: where you start. And as has already been mentioned, the

183
00:12:02,559 --> 00:12:07,800
Speaker 1: massive disconnect in this story is this, in this timeline

184
00:12:07,960 --> 00:12:10,720
Speaker 1: is that he went with his twenty nine year old

185
00:12:10,840 --> 00:12:17,120
Speaker 1: friend to the farmhouse to call his mother and and

186
00:12:17,400 --> 00:12:19,880
Speaker 1: and report his toothache and ask her to come and

187
00:12:19,880 --> 00:12:22,640
Speaker 1: pick him up. But that never occurred. You never received

188
00:12:22,640 --> 00:12:25,120
Speaker 1: that phone call. So from that point on, this is

189
00:12:25,160 --> 00:12:27,920
Speaker 1: a complete and total mystery, and it seems like the

190
00:12:27,960 --> 00:12:30,760
Speaker 1: person that has the answer to that mystery might very

191
00:12:30,800 --> 00:12:33,160
Speaker 1: well be the last person he was seen with, the

192
00:12:33,280 --> 00:12:36,160
Speaker 1: individual of a friend on the farm. To Justice Scott

193
00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:39,079
Speaker 1: Morgan and forensics expert author of Blood Beneath My Feet.

194
00:12:39,160 --> 00:12:42,600
Speaker 1: You know, I thought long and hard before I gave

195
00:12:42,640 --> 00:12:47,800
Speaker 1: the twins a phone, and they do not have social profiles,

196
00:12:48,040 --> 00:12:52,880
Speaker 1: were not there. But cases like this made me realize

197
00:12:52,920 --> 00:12:56,240
Speaker 1: I had to bite the bullet and get them a phone.

198
00:12:56,400 --> 00:12:59,400
Speaker 1: I want you to listen to this. This is Jonathan

199
00:12:59,400 --> 00:13:03,080
Speaker 1: Perez this morning, the desperate search continues for fourteen year

200
00:13:03,080 --> 00:13:11,000
Speaker 1: old Jonathan Minard, missing since Saturday, subject himself. Over a

201
00:13:11,080 --> 00:13:14,400
Speaker 1: hundred volunteers joining the Carroll County Sheriff's Office Tuesday to

202
00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:17,559
Speaker 1: search for the boy, combing through wooded areas and farm

203
00:13:17,640 --> 00:13:21,319
Speaker 1: fields spanning about six miles. His aunt and uncle a

204
00:13:21,440 --> 00:13:24,840
Speaker 1: part of the search efforts, describing what the boy's parents

205
00:13:25,080 --> 00:13:30,600
Speaker 1: are going through. They're devastated. They're they're lost, they're his

206
00:13:30,679 --> 00:13:32,960
Speaker 1: mom's ready to have a breakdown. His dad is too.

207
00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:35,760
Speaker 1: They're and they can't do and they feel helpless because

208
00:13:35,760 --> 00:13:38,400
Speaker 1: they can't do anything. According to police, he was staying

209
00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:41,079
Speaker 1: with friends over the weekend and working at a nearby farm.

210
00:13:41,360 --> 00:13:44,800
Speaker 1: On Saturday, Minor, complaining of a toothache, said he was

211
00:13:44,880 --> 00:13:47,680
Speaker 1: going to walk home and call his mother. His mother

212
00:13:47,920 --> 00:13:51,880
Speaker 1: never received that phone call. I am actually hopeful that

213
00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:56,520
Speaker 1: he is alive, yes, because he's like I said, he's

214
00:13:56,559 --> 00:13:59,720
Speaker 1: a good kid, Police saying they've interviewed a person of interest,

215
00:13:59,760 --> 00:14:02,720
Speaker 1: but no charges have been filed at this time. You

216
00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:06,120
Speaker 1: are hearing the very latest the search. The search for

217
00:14:06,240 --> 00:14:09,320
Speaker 1: him resulted in the discovery of his body, but you

218
00:14:09,440 --> 00:14:13,680
Speaker 1: hear where the mom said she expected him to call,

219
00:14:14,240 --> 00:14:17,960
Speaker 1: but he never called. That should have been the beginning

220
00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:22,360
Speaker 1: of the time line to John Linleycrime online dot Com

221
00:14:22,440 --> 00:14:24,920
Speaker 1: investigative reporter, what do we know now? In that report,

222
00:14:24,960 --> 00:14:28,280
Speaker 1: we heard about the hundreds of residents that were assisting

223
00:14:28,560 --> 00:14:32,360
Speaker 1: law enforcement with the search for Jonathan and very interesting.

224
00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:35,440
Speaker 1: On the night of April fifteenth, he had been missing

225
00:14:35,480 --> 00:14:38,200
Speaker 1: about forty eight hours. At this point, the Carroll County

226
00:14:38,280 --> 00:14:43,520
Speaker 1: Sheriff's Office issued a very specific alert asking residents to

227
00:14:43,600 --> 00:14:48,160
Speaker 1: pay special attention to the area around Baxter's Ridge Church

228
00:14:48,280 --> 00:14:52,520
Speaker 1: in Harrison Township. Residents were also advised to check their

229
00:14:52,520 --> 00:14:56,280
Speaker 1: own garages and any other structures they might have on

230
00:14:56,320 --> 00:14:59,280
Speaker 1: their property. This being a rural area, there were also

231
00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:02,400
Speaker 1: lots of a band in cabins and sheds and other

232
00:15:02,440 --> 00:15:06,960
Speaker 1: places to search. Locals were asked to meet at Delroy

233
00:15:07,200 --> 00:15:11,600
Speaker 1: Firehouse for instructions before combing through about six miles of

234
00:15:11,720 --> 00:15:14,680
Speaker 1: woods and farms as they hunted for the boy. Now,

235
00:15:15,040 --> 00:15:20,080
Speaker 1: in an unusual move, authorities abruptly called off the search

236
00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:25,760
Speaker 1: for Jonathan on April seventeenth. On Wednesday, saying that a

237
00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:32,640
Speaker 1: criminal investigation had started and the sheriff Sheriff Williams said

238
00:15:32,680 --> 00:15:36,920
Speaker 1: that we're not doing any more physical searches. We're working

239
00:15:36,960 --> 00:15:40,520
Speaker 1: on the case from a completely different angle. Okay, that's

240
00:15:40,760 --> 00:15:44,000
Speaker 1: never good when they say they're calling off the search.

241
00:15:44,440 --> 00:15:47,600
Speaker 1: And I want to go to Randy Cussler, renowned defense attorney,

242
00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:52,880
Speaker 1: professor of trial tactics at Emory Law School. First, I

243
00:15:52,960 --> 00:15:56,880
Speaker 1: want you to hear this, Randy Kessler. This was the

244
00:15:56,960 --> 00:15:59,880
Speaker 1: news that many people here in Carroll County feared. Six

245
00:16:00,080 --> 00:16:03,800
Speaker 1: days after Jonathan Manard disappeared, his body was found in

246
00:16:03,840 --> 00:16:07,200
Speaker 1: a shallow grave, devastating news for his parents, several other

247
00:16:07,240 --> 00:16:10,600
Speaker 1: family members, and the community itself. At a news conference

248
00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:13,360
Speaker 1: they wrapped up a short time ago, Sheriff Jie Williams

249
00:16:13,360 --> 00:16:15,880
Speaker 1: revealed the fourteen year old boy's body was discovered around

250
00:16:15,920 --> 00:16:18,720
Speaker 1: ten fifteen this morning in that grave on a farm

251
00:16:18,760 --> 00:16:22,920
Speaker 1: in Washington Township here in Carroll County. Investigators say last Friday,

252
00:16:23,000 --> 00:16:25,360
Speaker 1: Jonathan was picked up by a family friend and taken

253
00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:27,520
Speaker 1: to a different farm in New Harrisburg where he did

254
00:16:27,560 --> 00:16:30,840
Speaker 1: work milking cows, But on Saturday he vanished, setting off

255
00:16:30,840 --> 00:16:33,880
Speaker 1: several large searches this week over a six mile area.

256
00:16:34,040 --> 00:16:37,040
Speaker 1: His family desperately asked for any leads. Today, the sheriff

257
00:16:37,080 --> 00:16:39,560
Speaker 1: would not say the exact location where the body was

258
00:16:39,560 --> 00:16:42,880
Speaker 1: found or how they were led to Jonathan. Investigators are

259
00:16:42,920 --> 00:16:45,600
Speaker 1: also not commenting any further on something they said earlier

260
00:16:45,600 --> 00:16:47,800
Speaker 1: this week that there is a person of interest in

261
00:16:47,800 --> 00:16:51,080
Speaker 1: the case who has been interviewed twice, agreed to a polygraph,

262
00:16:51,240 --> 00:16:55,320
Speaker 1: but then changed his mind. Jonathan's discovery is just the

263
00:16:55,360 --> 00:16:59,480
Speaker 1: first step in gathering evidence to answer many unanswered questions

264
00:16:59,520 --> 00:17:01,560
Speaker 1: that we had that have led us to this moment.

265
00:17:02,200 --> 00:17:05,760
Speaker 1: Investigations like this take time. In this case, there's no exception.

266
00:17:06,359 --> 00:17:09,960
Speaker 1: I know there are many dedicated law enforcement professionals working hard.

267
00:17:10,320 --> 00:17:12,959
Speaker 1: Even as we speak to you, Randy cass Or you're

268
00:17:13,080 --> 00:17:16,040
Speaker 1: the defense attorney. When somebody says, yes, I'll take a polygraph,

269
00:17:16,080 --> 00:17:18,720
Speaker 1: and then they go, you know what, never mind not

270
00:17:18,880 --> 00:17:21,040
Speaker 1: so much. That's not good. That's not good. But I

271
00:17:21,080 --> 00:17:23,160
Speaker 1: wouldn't read that much into it, because lawyers tell people

272
00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:25,000
Speaker 1: all the time not to take a polygraph because it's

273
00:17:25,000 --> 00:17:28,440
Speaker 1: a subjective test that the person administering the test has

274
00:17:28,480 --> 00:17:30,199
Speaker 1: a decision to make. Do I think that they're long

275
00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:32,359
Speaker 1: or not, and that's up to that human being's decision.

276
00:17:32,440 --> 00:17:34,200
Speaker 1: So I've told people not to take a load of

277
00:17:34,240 --> 00:17:37,800
Speaker 1: take a test that's not the guilt or innocence criteria.

278
00:17:37,960 --> 00:17:40,679
Speaker 1: Well wait, wait, wait, wait, why would you tell your client,

279
00:17:40,760 --> 00:17:43,040
Speaker 1: if they're innocent, not to take a poly because I

280
00:17:43,080 --> 00:17:45,000
Speaker 1: don't trust polygraph a test and I've seen them come

281
00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:47,120
Speaker 1: back positive when they should have been negative and vice versa.

282
00:17:47,400 --> 00:17:49,520
Speaker 1: It is a subjective test. It is not pure science.

283
00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:52,120
Speaker 1: There's a reason they're not admissible in a court of law,

284
00:17:52,240 --> 00:17:54,119
Speaker 1: and that's the reason. Okay, so you've never had a

285
00:17:54,160 --> 00:17:56,200
Speaker 1: client take a poly Is that what you're trying to

286
00:17:56,200 --> 00:17:57,879
Speaker 1: tell me, because I know that's not true. No, I

287
00:17:57,960 --> 00:17:59,600
Speaker 1: have had them, but I've told people that I oppose

288
00:17:59,640 --> 00:18:01,480
Speaker 1: it because I'm not sure how it's going to come

289
00:18:01,520 --> 00:18:04,280
Speaker 1: out based on the person administering the test. And that

290
00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:06,440
Speaker 1: then you have people like Nancy Grace. You say you

291
00:18:06,680 --> 00:18:09,480
Speaker 1: failed the polygraph, you must be guilty. It's not a

292
00:18:09,600 --> 00:18:11,800
Speaker 1: yes or no, right or wrong. I would not say

293
00:18:12,000 --> 00:18:16,159
Speaker 1: you must be guilty, but it is. Let me just

294
00:18:16,320 --> 00:18:21,800
Speaker 1: say a signpost. It's a directional in an investigation. And

295
00:18:21,920 --> 00:18:24,560
Speaker 1: when somebody goes out on a limit says yes, I'll

296
00:18:24,600 --> 00:18:27,560
Speaker 1: take a polygraph off full of bravado, and then they go,

297
00:18:28,440 --> 00:18:30,800
Speaker 1: you know what, I don't think so I mean, come on,

298
00:18:30,960 --> 00:18:35,160
Speaker 1: just Scott Morgan, Randy Kessler's not fooling anybody. He backed

299
00:18:35,160 --> 00:18:37,280
Speaker 1: out of it because he was worried about the results. Oh,

300
00:18:37,359 --> 00:18:39,639
Speaker 1: come on, Nancy, you're talking to a defense attorney. Of

301
00:18:39,720 --> 00:18:42,240
Speaker 1: course he's gonna say that you got you gotta stand

302
00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:46,360
Speaker 1: and delivery if you if you feel certain in your innocence,

303
00:18:46,440 --> 00:18:48,480
Speaker 1: then there's no problem. Why don't you come forward and

304
00:18:48,680 --> 00:18:53,000
Speaker 1: do the polygraph? It raises suspicion for me. There is

305
00:18:53,040 --> 00:18:54,959
Speaker 1: a person of interest in the case who has been

306
00:18:55,040 --> 00:18:58,440
Speaker 1: interviewed twice, agreed to a polygraph, but then changed his mind.

307
00:18:59,400 --> 00:19:03,680
Speaker 1: Jonathan's discovery is just the first step in gathering evidence

308
00:19:03,720 --> 00:19:06,440
Speaker 1: to answer many unanswered questions that we have that have

309
00:19:06,600 --> 00:19:10,080
Speaker 1: led us to this moment. Investigations like this take time.

310
00:19:10,280 --> 00:19:13,080
Speaker 1: In this case is no exception. We're talking about a

311
00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:18,440
Speaker 1: little boy, Jonathan Menard, who goes missing. We now know

312
00:19:18,600 --> 00:19:21,280
Speaker 1: his body has been found in a shallow grave. You

313
00:19:21,359 --> 00:19:24,480
Speaker 1: were hearing our friend Bob Jones at w e WS

314
00:19:24,920 --> 00:19:29,159
Speaker 1: News five talking about that poy person of interest who

315
00:19:29,200 --> 00:19:31,200
Speaker 1: said to take a polygraph and then change his mind.

316
00:19:31,480 --> 00:19:34,560
Speaker 1: To John Limley, John, I guess the poy person of

317
00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:36,960
Speaker 1: interest is the twenty nine year old neighbor friend. That

318
00:19:37,240 --> 00:19:40,280
Speaker 1: is what a lot of people are assuming. But as

319
00:19:40,359 --> 00:19:43,720
Speaker 1: far as officials go, they're remaining tight lipped. We don't

320
00:19:43,800 --> 00:19:47,320
Speaker 1: know that for a fact. In fact, to quote Sheriff

321
00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:51,480
Speaker 1: Williams when asked by a reporter that very same question,

322
00:19:51,560 --> 00:19:53,600
Speaker 1: he says, I'm not going to go there. Take a

323
00:19:53,680 --> 00:19:58,440
Speaker 1: listen to our friend at wk y C, Andrew Harnsky.

324
00:19:58,520 --> 00:20:00,320
Speaker 1: So we do not know whether he was found on

325
00:20:00,359 --> 00:20:02,639
Speaker 1: the farm where he once worked, or who even found him,

326
00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:05,280
Speaker 1: how he even died. While the investigators are refusing to

327
00:20:05,320 --> 00:20:07,560
Speaker 1: answer perhaps the biggest question of all in all of this,

328
00:20:08,320 --> 00:20:11,119
Speaker 1: was it a murder? The picture that once graced a

329
00:20:11,240 --> 00:20:15,520
Speaker 1: missing person poster is now part of an obituary. Jonathan Minard,

330
00:20:15,640 --> 00:20:20,520
Speaker 1: just fourteen, described today as energetic and outgoing, often making

331
00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:24,560
Speaker 1: his family the target of good natured pranks gone too soon.

332
00:20:25,040 --> 00:20:28,560
Speaker 1: I think the whole community is still in shock of

333
00:20:29,040 --> 00:20:32,040
Speaker 1: hearing the news. This is something that you don't think

334
00:20:32,119 --> 00:20:36,639
Speaker 1: would happen in Kill County. Superintendent David Kotroki new Menard

335
00:20:36,800 --> 00:20:39,800
Speaker 1: is a seventh grader in his district, while Brendan Maylee

336
00:20:39,880 --> 00:20:42,640
Speaker 1: knew him as a friend, would make everyone's day better.

337
00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:44,560
Speaker 1: If he saw someone having a bad day, then he

338
00:20:44,600 --> 00:20:47,120
Speaker 1: would go talk to him, see how they're feeling. Their

339
00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:51,720
Speaker 1: heartbreak now only worsened by the mystery. On Wednesday, investigators

340
00:20:51,760 --> 00:20:55,160
Speaker 1: had a person of interest, but never named them. Then Friday,

341
00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:58,199
Speaker 1: after days of searching, Minard turned up in a shallow

342
00:20:58,280 --> 00:21:00,920
Speaker 1: grave on a farm in Washington Town, own Ship. There

343
00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:03,400
Speaker 1: were no other details. I'm about going to call man

344
00:21:04,359 --> 00:21:09,080
Speaker 1: on anything to jeopardize this investigation, an investigation that continues

345
00:21:09,160 --> 00:21:13,080
Speaker 1: tonight as a concerned community remains in the dark, and

346
00:21:13,240 --> 00:21:16,680
Speaker 1: that is at the time of little Jonathan's funeral, and

347
00:21:16,840 --> 00:21:20,320
Speaker 1: still nobody knows anything. To John Limley, Crime online dot

348
00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:23,360
Speaker 1: Com investigative reporter helped me out, has it advanced any

349
00:21:23,400 --> 00:21:26,680
Speaker 1: further than saying we don't know anything? I mean, well, wait, wait, wait,

350
00:21:26,800 --> 00:21:30,879
Speaker 1: John Limley, hold on Kestler Kessler. Is it a murder?

351
00:21:31,720 --> 00:21:33,560
Speaker 1: What what do you want any think he had an

352
00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:36,880
Speaker 1: accident and fell into a shallow grave and put dirt

353
00:21:36,960 --> 00:21:40,960
Speaker 1: on top of himself. A murder? What else could it be? Yeah?

354
00:21:41,000 --> 00:21:42,240
Speaker 1: I mean I think the grave is sort of a

355
00:21:42,320 --> 00:21:43,960
Speaker 1: hard fact to overcome. And it makes it harder to

356
00:21:44,080 --> 00:21:46,320
Speaker 1: defend it. If you say, oh, someone was politely just

357
00:21:46,440 --> 00:21:48,200
Speaker 1: bearing the body because they wanted to do a favor

358
00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:51,200
Speaker 1: for the soul. That doesn't fly. That's your I gotta

359
00:21:51,200 --> 00:21:54,680
Speaker 1: agree with you once today. I mean, John Limley, I

360
00:21:54,800 --> 00:21:57,159
Speaker 1: gotta have more than just telling me we don't know

361
00:21:57,280 --> 00:21:59,360
Speaker 1: anything else. Of course, they have to know something else.

362
00:21:59,400 --> 00:22:01,919
Speaker 1: What are they telling the family? Well, as far as

363
00:22:02,080 --> 00:22:06,040
Speaker 1: the sheriff goes in his department, we're not getting more information.

364
00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:09,280
Speaker 1: We don't know what information the family is receiving because

365
00:22:09,400 --> 00:22:12,720
Speaker 1: they are not speaking with reporters. However, we do have

366
00:22:13,000 --> 00:22:17,120
Speaker 1: a statement from Carroll County Coroner Mandel Hass. He has

367
00:22:17,160 --> 00:22:20,320
Speaker 1: told us that he was on the scene when Minard's

368
00:22:20,400 --> 00:22:24,399
Speaker 1: body was discovered. Has stated that the boy's remains have

369
00:22:24,600 --> 00:22:29,200
Speaker 1: been sent to Cuyahoga County Medical Examiner for autopsy, this

370
00:22:30,160 --> 00:22:33,680
Speaker 1: is just north of the area and toxicology testing. He

371
00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:37,119
Speaker 1: says all of this information from the autopsy may not

372
00:22:37,240 --> 00:22:41,439
Speaker 1: be available for several weeks. Did you say toxicology, Let

373
00:22:41,520 --> 00:22:43,040
Speaker 1: me go to Joe Scott Morgan, what does that mean,

374
00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:45,639
Speaker 1: Joe Scott, Well, what that means, Nancy, is that at

375
00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:49,200
Speaker 1: autopsy they have taken They have taken blood samples and

376
00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:52,600
Speaker 1: urine samples and other fluids for testing. They're going to

377
00:22:52,640 --> 00:22:55,200
Speaker 1: see if this kid has anything in his system that

378
00:22:55,359 --> 00:22:57,680
Speaker 1: could have led to his death. And listen, that doesn't

379
00:22:57,720 --> 00:23:01,320
Speaker 1: mean that something nefarious still might not have happened, because

380
00:23:01,440 --> 00:23:04,320
Speaker 1: if that comes back positive for something like fentnel. Keep

381
00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:06,800
Speaker 1: in mind this area of the country in particular, even

382
00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:11,400
Speaker 1: though it's rural, they have a horrible opioid problem up there.

383
00:23:11,760 --> 00:23:15,160
Speaker 1: If he was exposed to anything, given anything, that'll turn

384
00:23:15,280 --> 00:23:18,439
Speaker 1: up in the toxicology. That's why they're being very very careful.

385
00:23:18,560 --> 00:23:21,520
Speaker 1: Maybe somebody got scared and buried him after this kid

386
00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:24,760
Speaker 1: suddenly died. Nancy, let me frame this very quickly. This

387
00:23:24,960 --> 00:23:27,480
Speaker 1: is a very rural area. John mentioned that the body

388
00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:31,760
Speaker 1: went to Cuyahoga County. Coakoga County is actually the Cleveland

389
00:23:32,080 --> 00:23:35,800
Speaker 1: Medical Examiner's office. This area is so isolated they can't

390
00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:38,359
Speaker 1: even do their own autopsies there. If that frames it

391
00:23:38,480 --> 00:23:40,640
Speaker 1: for you. They're not used to this kind of thing,

392
00:23:41,000 --> 00:23:43,359
Speaker 1: so they're trying to be very very careful. It's not

393
00:23:43,480 --> 00:23:45,640
Speaker 1: like Cleveland. They don't get a lot of these deaths,

394
00:23:45,680 --> 00:23:48,080
Speaker 1: so they're taking their time with this case. Okay to

395
00:23:48,200 --> 00:23:51,800
Speaker 1: Mark Class joining me Special Gas, founder of Class Kids Foundation.

396
00:23:52,520 --> 00:23:57,560
Speaker 1: Here is where the witnesses diverge. And as you know, Mark,

397
00:23:57,720 --> 00:24:00,560
Speaker 1: I had one of the greatest judges her that I

398
00:24:00,680 --> 00:24:04,520
Speaker 1: worked for, Judge Alverson, and one of the charges he

399
00:24:04,560 --> 00:24:10,359
Speaker 1: would give every jury is about credibility. And he charged

400
00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:13,080
Speaker 1: every jury that it is your duty, jurars, to make

401
00:24:13,160 --> 00:24:17,760
Speaker 1: every witness speak the truth and impune perjury on no one.

402
00:24:17,920 --> 00:24:21,639
Speaker 1: In other words, witnesses can see things from different angles

403
00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:26,639
Speaker 1: or different lighting conditions, they can hear things differently, but

404
00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:30,480
Speaker 1: they can all be telling the truth. For instance, you

405
00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:33,000
Speaker 1: see a car crash, one witnesses says, I didn't see

406
00:24:33,000 --> 00:24:35,480
Speaker 1: the break lights, and the other witness says, oh yeah,

407
00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:38,520
Speaker 1: I saw the break lights. Why because the first witness

408
00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:40,520
Speaker 1: was in the front of the crash and the second

409
00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:43,280
Speaker 1: witness was behind the crash. That's how that works. They're

410
00:24:43,280 --> 00:24:46,800
Speaker 1: both saying something different, but they're both telling the truth.

411
00:24:47,040 --> 00:24:49,760
Speaker 1: But I have a problem where the witnesses diverge in

412
00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:54,920
Speaker 1: this case because this family friend tells investigators he went

413
00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:59,000
Speaker 1: with Jonathan to make the call to the mom that

414
00:24:59,119 --> 00:25:01,040
Speaker 1: he had a toothache, could she come pick him up?

415
00:25:01,280 --> 00:25:06,320
Speaker 1: But Jonathan's mother never got the call. That can't both

416
00:25:06,520 --> 00:25:10,640
Speaker 1: be true or can it? Well, certainly, Natthew, his mother

417
00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:14,320
Speaker 1: is not going to be stating mistruth at all is

418
00:25:14,920 --> 00:25:18,480
Speaker 1: regarding the whereabouts the first son or the mystery surrounding

419
00:25:18,520 --> 00:25:21,480
Speaker 1: her son. And this kind of stops with this other person,

420
00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:23,879
Speaker 1: this twenty nine year old friend, because one thing we

421
00:25:23,960 --> 00:25:28,199
Speaker 1: do know with certainty, Jonathan didn't bury himself. The search

422
00:25:28,520 --> 00:25:32,280
Speaker 1: for Jonathan was exhaustive, all efforts for May to make

423
00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:34,600
Speaker 1: sure he had not been hit by a car while

424
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:42,080
Speaker 1: walking home. They included hundreds of law enforcement officers, volunteers, drones, aircraft,

425
00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:48,840
Speaker 1: all sorts of equipment. The body found in a shallow grave. Now,

426
00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:52,720
Speaker 1: the man who last saw Jonathan has not been named

427
00:25:52,760 --> 00:25:57,719
Speaker 1: by authorities, but there are reports that he has been

428
00:25:57,760 --> 00:26:01,520
Speaker 1: considered a person of interest simply because he was the

429
00:26:01,600 --> 00:26:05,040
Speaker 1: last one to see Jonathan that we know of. Okay,

430
00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:09,240
Speaker 1: he has nothing in his past such as a violent act,

431
00:26:10,080 --> 00:26:14,920
Speaker 1: but he allegedly has a criminal record drug related offenses.

432
00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:19,080
Speaker 1: Jo Got Morgan way in Listen, you have to consider

433
00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:21,720
Speaker 1: all of the facts in this case, Nancy. I find

434
00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:25,879
Speaker 1: it very interesting that there is a grave to begin with,

435
00:26:26,080 --> 00:26:28,639
Speaker 1: that means that somebody put forth effort in order to

436
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:31,840
Speaker 1: not bury the body. But I think conceal the body.

437
00:26:32,200 --> 00:26:35,080
Speaker 1: This is a concealed event. Now, whether or not drugs

438
00:26:35,119 --> 00:26:38,359
Speaker 1: are involved or some type of specific violence will have

439
00:26:38,440 --> 00:26:40,200
Speaker 1: to wait and see. But they're playing it very close

440
00:26:40,280 --> 00:26:42,320
Speaker 1: to the vest, and hey, I applaud them for that,

441
00:26:42,440 --> 00:26:45,680
Speaker 1: because they need to make sure that no stone is

442
00:26:45,800 --> 00:26:48,040
Speaker 1: left unturned. Now, when I think about this little boy,

443
00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:53,399
Speaker 1: Mark Lass, he would make silly selfies and put him

444
00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:57,480
Speaker 1: on his grandfather's work phone. He was spotted all around

445
00:26:57,600 --> 00:27:00,760
Speaker 1: riding his bicycle through the village of Delroy, where he

446
00:27:00,800 --> 00:27:04,320
Speaker 1: would stop and visit with friends and neighbors, help out

447
00:27:04,440 --> 00:27:09,040
Speaker 1: whoever needed him, and everybody called on him. He loved

448
00:27:09,400 --> 00:27:13,959
Speaker 1: animals and in almost every picture you know, Mark, how

449
00:27:14,119 --> 00:27:17,000
Speaker 1: Princess Diana would always be looking down and kind of

450
00:27:17,080 --> 00:27:20,640
Speaker 1: look up. She's very very shy. That's how he looks.

451
00:27:20,760 --> 00:27:23,679
Speaker 1: It's just it's just breaking my heart. It just seems

452
00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:29,080
Speaker 1: like the very very best, most loving people turn out

453
00:27:29,119 --> 00:27:32,160
Speaker 1: to be the victims because they let their guard down.

454
00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:35,919
Speaker 1: He seems like a natural eagle scout. He just seems

455
00:27:35,960 --> 00:27:39,000
Speaker 1: like the best boy possible, a wonderful son and it

456
00:27:39,160 --> 00:27:42,000
Speaker 1: just breaks your heart to think that this kind of

457
00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:45,159
Speaker 1: violence would overcome him and enter his short life. And

458
00:27:45,240 --> 00:27:47,199
Speaker 1: you know, John Linley, we're not hearing a lot from

459
00:27:47,240 --> 00:27:52,040
Speaker 1: the family. They've apparently are just devastated about this turn

460
00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:56,040
Speaker 1: of events. The only person that has spoken with reporters

461
00:27:56,320 --> 00:28:00,640
Speaker 1: is Jonathan's aunt, and we've we've learned a lot about Jonathan.

462
00:28:00,840 --> 00:28:05,720
Speaker 1: Threw her about he was the epitome of an old

463
00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:09,960
Speaker 1: soul that when people were around him, they felt comfortable,

464
00:28:10,440 --> 00:28:14,160
Speaker 1: They felt like they were with a grandparent, more than

465
00:28:14,359 --> 00:28:17,159
Speaker 1: a fourteen year old child. We wait as Justice and

466
00:28:17,280 --> 00:28:36,680
Speaker 1: False Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. We heard today from

467
00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:40,040
Speaker 1: mister mccraney's attorney, David Harrison. We also heard from mister

468
00:28:40,160 --> 00:28:43,640
Speaker 1: mccraney's wife, Jeanette. She described her husband as being a

469
00:28:43,800 --> 00:28:47,680
Speaker 1: family man and multiple times proclaimed his innocence. I would

470
00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:49,320
Speaker 1: like to say that what he has been accused of

471
00:28:49,480 --> 00:28:52,800
Speaker 1: is a horrible time. However, everyone that knows my men

472
00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:55,320
Speaker 1: of God knows that this is only a test and

473
00:28:55,400 --> 00:28:57,680
Speaker 1: it's just a challenge of our faith. Agree for the

474
00:28:57,760 --> 00:29:00,640
Speaker 1: families of the young ladies. However, I'm here to let

475
00:29:00,680 --> 00:29:02,960
Speaker 1: you know that the man is talking behind those bars.

476
00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:06,360
Speaker 1: He's innocent and our family, Colly has always been our stronghold.

477
00:29:06,640 --> 00:29:08,280
Speaker 1: We may be broken at this point where you just

478
00:29:08,440 --> 00:29:11,640
Speaker 1: know that we're gracefully broken. I proclaim my husband's innocence

479
00:29:11,800 --> 00:29:13,560
Speaker 1: and I am here to be his voice. And I

480
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:15,800
Speaker 1: can already tell you that's the expiration date on all

481
00:29:15,880 --> 00:29:17,920
Speaker 1: of this. For those times when my family feels like

482
00:29:18,040 --> 00:29:20,200
Speaker 1: the road is rough, I'm going to be their friends alone,

483
00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 1: and I asked you to do the same. I'm not

484
00:29:21,960 --> 00:29:24,280
Speaker 1: afraid of an enemy. However, the enemy might better be

485
00:29:24,320 --> 00:29:26,320
Speaker 1: afraid of me. You're hearing from our friend at w

486
00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:31,320
Speaker 1: dh N ABC eighteen Dophin Alabama, reporter Tanya Prue. It's

487
00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:38,200
Speaker 1: speaking with the suspect, fifty four year old Coley mccraney's wife, Jeanette.

488
00:29:38,240 --> 00:29:41,200
Speaker 1: And you know what. People may be laughing at her

489
00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:43,880
Speaker 1: for standing up for him, referring to the enemy as

490
00:29:43,880 --> 00:29:47,320
Speaker 1: if the state the prosecutor is Satan, but I feel

491
00:29:47,360 --> 00:29:51,480
Speaker 1: bad for her. I feel bad for her because, just

492
00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:54,200
Speaker 1: like doctor Bethany Marshall has told us in the past,

493
00:29:55,880 --> 00:30:01,440
Speaker 1: these people masquerade as normal. They can lead an entire

494
00:30:02,040 --> 00:30:05,960
Speaker 1: double life, including pulling the wool over the eyes of

495
00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:09,120
Speaker 1: their family, their children, their neighbors, people sitting on the

496
00:30:09,200 --> 00:30:11,440
Speaker 1: pew next to them at their synagogue or their church

497
00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:16,160
Speaker 1: or their mosque. Nobody knows but them. But I'll tell

498
00:30:16,160 --> 00:30:22,320
Speaker 1: you something else. DNA doesn't lie straight out to Robin Lensky,

499
00:30:22,360 --> 00:30:26,040
Speaker 1: Crime online dot Com investigative reporter, Can we not talk

500
00:30:26,160 --> 00:30:29,600
Speaker 1: for a moment about the well respected father who has

501
00:30:29,640 --> 00:30:33,720
Speaker 1: his wife out there speaking for him and taking the

502
00:30:33,800 --> 00:30:36,560
Speaker 1: hits with the press. Can we talk for one moment

503
00:30:36,840 --> 00:30:45,040
Speaker 1: about Tracy Hollett and jay B Beasley, just seventeen years old.

504
00:30:46,320 --> 00:30:51,239
Speaker 1: What happened? Well, Nancy, these are two beautiful seventeen year

505
00:30:51,240 --> 00:30:54,160
Speaker 1: old girls. They were friends and they were out at

506
00:30:54,200 --> 00:30:57,600
Speaker 1: a party, as seventeen year old girls go to parties,

507
00:30:57,640 --> 00:31:01,040
Speaker 1: and they were in Ozark, Alabama. And this is many

508
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:03,960
Speaker 1: many moons ago before you had the little GPS on

509
00:31:04,080 --> 00:31:07,520
Speaker 1: your phone. And they were on their way home and

510
00:31:07,680 --> 00:31:10,480
Speaker 1: they got lost. So back in the day, you got

511
00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:14,280
Speaker 1: to rewind your mind to the days where you didn't

512
00:31:14,320 --> 00:31:16,080
Speaker 1: have your phone and it tells you where to go,

513
00:31:17,040 --> 00:31:20,160
Speaker 1: and they stopped as you would at a gas station.

514
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:25,400
Speaker 1: The next thing you know, they are shot once in

515
00:31:25,480 --> 00:31:28,840
Speaker 1: the head and police say one of the girls was raped.

516
00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:32,960
Speaker 1: I mean you know you're at a loss for work.

517
00:31:33,080 --> 00:31:35,600
Speaker 1: Did you just say shot in the head. I thought

518
00:31:35,640 --> 00:31:39,880
Speaker 1: I heard you say that. Yep. Each of each seventeen

519
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:44,000
Speaker 1: year old suffered one bullet fatal shot to the head

520
00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:47,640
Speaker 1: each bang bang. Take a listen to our friend at

521
00:31:47,840 --> 00:31:52,400
Speaker 1: wh N ABC thirteen Death and Reporter. What was your

522
00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:55,680
Speaker 1: reaction when you first found out the knees? Oh? First,

523
00:31:55,760 --> 00:31:58,240
Speaker 1: I was didn't believe in it. Still don't believe that

524
00:31:58,400 --> 00:32:00,720
Speaker 1: he's guilty. Head. We believe that God has gone to

525
00:32:01,480 --> 00:32:05,040
Speaker 1: change all this round. I know everybody looking at it, however,

526
00:32:05,280 --> 00:32:08,280
Speaker 1: but God has the last seek A preliminary hearing has

527
00:32:08,320 --> 00:32:11,520
Speaker 1: been set for this case for April third at two pm,

528
00:32:11,960 --> 00:32:14,200
Speaker 1: and of course, over the coming days and weeks, we

529
00:32:14,240 --> 00:32:16,840
Speaker 1: will bring you more details as this case is obviously

530
00:32:16,960 --> 00:32:19,840
Speaker 1: still developing. A suspect fifty four years old arrested in

531
00:32:19,880 --> 00:32:23,680
Speaker 1: the cold case murders of two teen girls found shot

532
00:32:23,960 --> 00:32:28,000
Speaker 1: dead in the trunk of their car twenty years ago

533
00:32:28,160 --> 00:32:32,320
Speaker 1: after they get lost on back roads of Alabama. Now,

534
00:32:33,000 --> 00:32:37,880
Speaker 1: as it turns out, one of this guy, Colley mccranney's relatives,

535
00:32:38,440 --> 00:32:44,120
Speaker 1: submitted DNA to you know a genealogy website, and that

536
00:32:44,680 --> 00:32:49,200
Speaker 1: case wide open. Now, according to police, we learn that

537
00:32:49,920 --> 00:32:54,440
Speaker 1: traces of DNA were found at the same one of

538
00:32:54,480 --> 00:32:57,320
Speaker 1: the girls rate they've been at a party on their

539
00:32:57,360 --> 00:33:01,920
Speaker 1: way home, got lost, one of them raped, both of

540
00:33:01,960 --> 00:33:05,880
Speaker 1: them shot in the head. Now, remember they're seventeen twenty

541
00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:10,960
Speaker 1: years ago. This guy, Colly McCraney now fifty four. Twenty

542
00:33:11,040 --> 00:33:14,360
Speaker 1: years ago, he was thirty four years old. What is

543
00:33:14,480 --> 00:33:21,720
Speaker 1: he doing out trolling around for two teen girls? Precious girls?

544
00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:26,040
Speaker 1: It's Colly McCraney arrested from the murders of Tracy Hollett

545
00:33:26,120 --> 00:33:31,000
Speaker 1: and JB. Beasley, found dead in the trunk of JB's car.

546
00:33:31,280 --> 00:33:35,360
Speaker 1: To you, doctor Bethany Marshall will renown California's psychoanalyst to

547
00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:40,400
Speaker 1: leave the bodies in the back in the trunk of

548
00:33:40,520 --> 00:33:45,440
Speaker 1: a car. I'm just a trial lawyer. You're the shrink.

549
00:33:46,200 --> 00:33:50,200
Speaker 1: What does that treatment of these dead girls bodies say

550
00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:56,760
Speaker 1: to you, Nancy? That he was so callous, whole blooded, heartless.

551
00:33:57,040 --> 00:34:01,360
Speaker 1: I mean, you know how beautiful seventeen year old girls are, vulnerable,

552
00:34:02,000 --> 00:34:06,400
Speaker 1: excited about life, their whole lives ahead of them. He's

553
00:34:06,680 --> 00:34:10,759
Speaker 1: just fifteen years older, puts a bullet in each of

554
00:34:10,840 --> 00:34:13,080
Speaker 1: their heads, throws them in the trunks of the car

555
00:34:13,719 --> 00:34:17,000
Speaker 1: and leaves them there. Now, something even scarier to me

556
00:34:17,280 --> 00:34:20,759
Speaker 1: as I was learning more about this story. Guess what

557
00:34:20,920 --> 00:34:24,200
Speaker 1: this perpetrator has done for a number of years. He's

558
00:34:24,239 --> 00:34:27,880
Speaker 1: been a truck driver, Nancy. A truck driver. That tells

559
00:34:27,920 --> 00:34:32,480
Speaker 1: me that he chose a profession that may have allowed

560
00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:37,520
Speaker 1: him to accommodate to his perversions and to his offending style.

561
00:34:38,160 --> 00:34:40,440
Speaker 1: I wouldn't be surprised if we find that there are

562
00:34:40,560 --> 00:34:43,360
Speaker 1: more victims out there. He also has an online ministry,

563
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:47,160
Speaker 1: so he's a quote unquote man of God. As many

564
00:34:47,239 --> 00:34:49,920
Speaker 1: sociopaths are. They killed and find religion all at the

565
00:34:50,000 --> 00:34:55,800
Speaker 1: same time. Bathonyathany, bathany You know how I feel about that.

566
00:34:55,960 --> 00:34:58,879
Speaker 1: Please do not drag God into this. Okay. I don't

567
00:34:58,880 --> 00:35:00,920
Speaker 1: think he signed up for the all right, all right,

568
00:35:01,160 --> 00:35:03,319
Speaker 1: but you are right. This guy was a truck driver

569
00:35:03,520 --> 00:35:08,120
Speaker 1: and a preacher. He even founded his own church. Okay,

570
00:35:08,760 --> 00:35:11,759
Speaker 1: So I think you have really hit the nail on

571
00:35:11,840 --> 00:35:16,520
Speaker 1: the head. Cheryl McCullum regarding the possibility of other victims.

572
00:35:16,560 --> 00:35:20,120
Speaker 1: A truck driver. No, oh wait, wait, let me clear

573
00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:23,480
Speaker 1: something out real quick. My grandfather drove a bus, a bus,

574
00:35:23,800 --> 00:35:27,440
Speaker 1: school bus. Okay, he was a farmer, he dug wells,

575
00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:30,320
Speaker 1: he drove a school bus, he drove an ice truck.

576
00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:34,880
Speaker 1: So this is not about him being a driver of

577
00:35:35,000 --> 00:35:38,440
Speaker 1: any kind of vehicle, all right. What this is about

578
00:35:38,680 --> 00:35:40,920
Speaker 1: is the fact that as a truck driver, particularly a

579
00:35:41,000 --> 00:35:43,960
Speaker 1: long haul truck driver, he's all over the country. There

580
00:35:44,000 --> 00:35:46,400
Speaker 1: could be victims all over the country. He had one

581
00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:51,200
Speaker 1: of the perfect jobs for driving around and looking for victims,

582
00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:55,279
Speaker 1: for driving around and knowing where to potentially go when

583
00:35:55,320 --> 00:35:58,120
Speaker 1: he found victims. And I'll tell you something, Nancy, when

584
00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:01,640
Speaker 1: my sister Shelley now brand our late teens, we were

585
00:36:01,719 --> 00:36:05,040
Speaker 1: coming back from a similar event and we got lost,

586
00:36:05,600 --> 00:36:07,760
Speaker 1: and not only did we stop and ask for directions,

587
00:36:07,800 --> 00:36:10,640
Speaker 1: and with a knife man who said, hey, I will

588
00:36:10,760 --> 00:36:14,080
Speaker 1: lead y'all and follow y'all back, or y'all could follow

589
00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:17,200
Speaker 1: me to the highway. And we went twists and turns

590
00:36:17,239 --> 00:36:20,240
Speaker 1: and left and right, and at one point we joked

591
00:36:20,760 --> 00:36:22,960
Speaker 1: and said, we're in this dude taken us like we

592
00:36:23,040 --> 00:36:25,520
Speaker 1: could be going to the middle of nowhere. I can

593
00:36:25,680 --> 00:36:29,040
Speaker 1: understand how these girls could be in a situation where

594
00:36:29,040 --> 00:36:33,040
Speaker 1: they would follow someone. And unfortunately this is what we

595
00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:35,279
Speaker 1: see that he murdered them and raised one of them.

596
00:36:35,360 --> 00:36:40,440
Speaker 1: But again the truck driver, we've seen it before. You know,

597
00:36:40,560 --> 00:36:45,920
Speaker 1: he's got the perfect gig. Speaking of DNA, I want

598
00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:49,719
Speaker 1: you to take a listen. It's WSFA twelve news and

599
00:36:49,920 --> 00:36:52,800
Speaker 1: this is the Ozark Police Chief Marlos Walker and the

600
00:36:52,920 --> 00:36:56,279
Speaker 1: DA Kirk Adams. Last fall, I sought the services of

601
00:36:56,360 --> 00:37:01,120
Speaker 1: Parabonnno Labs, a DNA technology company in Virginia, to assist

602
00:37:01,239 --> 00:37:04,520
Speaker 1: us in the investigation. Law enforcement agencies across the country

603
00:37:04,840 --> 00:37:08,279
Speaker 1: used the company as the Snapshot DNA analysis service to

604
00:37:08,360 --> 00:37:13,320
Speaker 1: advanced investigations. When traditional DNA methods failed to produce any results,

605
00:37:13,440 --> 00:37:17,239
Speaker 1: we employed nearly all of their DNA tests. Phonotyping gave

606
00:37:17,360 --> 00:37:21,640
Speaker 1: us a description of an unknown suspect. Genetic genealogy helped

607
00:37:21,719 --> 00:37:25,200
Speaker 1: us to identify the family from which he descended, and

608
00:37:25,320 --> 00:37:29,160
Speaker 1: kinship testing ultimately narrowed the suspect lists down to a

609
00:37:29,320 --> 00:37:33,160
Speaker 1: single individual. We collected the DNA sample from the suspect

610
00:37:33,280 --> 00:37:36,520
Speaker 1: and our state crime lab confirmed that it matches. It

611
00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:39,920
Speaker 1: matched the DNA from the crime scene. The genetic generotyping

612
00:37:40,040 --> 00:37:43,200
Speaker 1: yielded a match to the DNA sample again taken from

613
00:37:43,280 --> 00:37:45,799
Speaker 1: the crime scene in nineteen ninety nine. Well they're hearing

614
00:37:45,840 --> 00:37:48,280
Speaker 1: the law enforcement speak. But one thing that's really burning

615
00:37:48,360 --> 00:37:50,360
Speaker 1: me up and this or two of course, the murders

616
00:37:50,400 --> 00:37:54,040
Speaker 1: of the two girls, as that he's putting his wife

617
00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:57,480
Speaker 1: out there and his family to speak for him, to

618
00:37:57,840 --> 00:38:01,239
Speaker 1: argue the DNA is not accurate. We also know that

619
00:38:01,360 --> 00:38:04,040
Speaker 1: this guy, Colin and Cranny lived in the area where

620
00:38:04,040 --> 00:38:05,880
Speaker 1: the girl's bodies were found. He's now moved to a

621
00:38:05,960 --> 00:38:10,319
Speaker 1: different city. He's got them out there doing his dirty work.

622
00:38:11,600 --> 00:38:15,279
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace Crime Story is signing off goodbye friend,