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Speaker 1: Pushkin. Let's play a game. Line up Americans in a row,

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Speaker 1: all of them by how likely they are to start

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Speaker 1: a revolution. At the front of the line, you might

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Speaker 1: put let's say, a student activist, or an energetic member

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Speaker 1: of some aggrieved interest group, or some evil genius with

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Speaker 1: a knack for computer programming. At the back of the line,

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Speaker 1: you'd put who who among us is least likely to

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Speaker 1: go to the trouble of trying to change the world.

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Speaker 1: I don't know a lot of us are complacent, but

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Speaker 1: somewhere near the end of the line, I think we

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Speaker 1: can all agree we'd find the golf and tennis coaches

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Speaker 1: of America's country clubs. When I hired on to be

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Speaker 1: a tennis pro as a middle class country club in Seaside, California.

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Speaker 1: Tim Galway is the name of the board tennis pro

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Speaker 1: in this story. He's in his eighties now, but was

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Speaker 1: in his thirties when the story begins. It was four

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Speaker 1: o'clock in the afternoon. I've been teaching all day, not coaching,

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Speaker 1: and it keeps a little boring telling people where the

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Speaker 1: weight on their foot should be and where they should

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Speaker 1: hit the ball on the racket on the afternoon In question.

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Speaker 1: Tim was teaching a guy with a slice backhand who

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Speaker 1: wanted to learn how to hit topspin. The guy was

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Speaker 1: taking his racket back too high. Ordinarily, Tim Galway would

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Speaker 1: just have told the man, hey, don't take the racket

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Speaker 1: back too high, but he lost interest in the sound

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Speaker 1: of his own voice and pretty much everything else, so

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Speaker 1: he just kept quietly tossing balls at the guy's backhand.

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Speaker 1: Three or four minutes a strange thing had he was

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Speaker 1: hitting topspin back end and said nothing. But then I

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Speaker 1: said something in my head, you lazy bum, you missed

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Speaker 1: your chance. If you had only taught him before, then

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Speaker 1: you would have gotten the credit for his toss spin

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Speaker 1: back in. I said, wow, And this was maybe the

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Speaker 1: key point. I'm more interested in teaching than I am

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Speaker 1: in this student learning. That was the moment that Tim

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Speaker 1: Galway had an idea, because I just said, Okay, I'm

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Speaker 1: going to see how much improvement I can see in

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Speaker 1: front of me with how little teaching for reversing your

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Speaker 1: usual approach. How little can you tell them rather than

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Speaker 1: how much can you tell them exactly? So you have

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Speaker 1: this inside about yourself and your teaching methods, and you

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Speaker 1: just you're gonna do it a different way. You're going

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Speaker 1: to see how littlely you can say. How long do

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Speaker 1: you do that before you start to think I'm onto

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Speaker 1: something my next lesson. His next lesson is with a

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Speaker 1: complete beginner. She doesn't even know how to hold a

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Speaker 1: tennis racket. Goalie thinks maybe he shouldn't try out this

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Speaker 1: new idea coaching by not saying anything. Then he thinks, nah,

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Speaker 1: screw it, let's try this again. How can I start

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Speaker 1: a beginner without telling the fundamentals? And so I said,

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Speaker 1: I'll just drop a few and hit them so they'll

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Speaker 1: see me. They'll see me. I did that five or

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Speaker 1: six times, and she said, I noticed the first thing

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Speaker 1: you did was turned your right foot sideways. He said, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I don't worry about and just take these balls and

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Speaker 1: the do it. No, I did say shut your eyes

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Speaker 1: and see yourself hitting the ball. I didn't say like

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Speaker 1: I did. And this is the absolute She hit like this. This,

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Speaker 1: I mean everything I would have told. She didn't know

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Speaker 1: any different. Her foot didn't move. So the one thing

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Speaker 1: she consciously thought about, she didn't do exactly everything that

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Speaker 1: she was just kind of unconscious. She did said, oh

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Speaker 1: my god, not the one when did she do everything

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Speaker 1: without instruction, but she didn't do the one thing she

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Speaker 1: decided herself she should do. In the history of coaching,

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Speaker 1: this is a revolutionary moment. Who put chocolate in my

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Speaker 1: peanut butter moment. Galli discovers that performance is all about focus.

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Speaker 1: Focus on the wrong thing, and you'll do the wrong thing.

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Speaker 1: What shocks me what was to see Tennes's improving without

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Speaker 1: the student trying to improve. All I would do is

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Speaker 1: ask them awareness questions or give them awareness instruction. Awareness

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Speaker 1: instructions meaning saying stuff that caused them to focus on

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Speaker 1: what was useful, like where the ball was when it

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Speaker 1: hit the racket. People love Galway's weird tennis lessons. He

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Speaker 1: offered no criticism, no praise, hardly any talk at all,

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Speaker 1: just to nudge here and there, to silence the voices

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Speaker 1: inside their heads, the voices that caused them to tense up.

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Speaker 1: One day, one of the country club students blurted out,

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Speaker 1: you should write a book. Kim Galway had zero literary ambition,

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Speaker 1: but he did it. He wrote a book about how

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Speaker 1: to coach tennis. His text was one part Eastern mysticism

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Speaker 1: and one part practical advice on how to crush your

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Speaker 1: opponent on a tennis court. He thought about calling it

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Speaker 1: Yoga tennis. He wound up calling it The Inner Game

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Speaker 1: of Tennis. In the fall of nineteen seventy four, right

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Speaker 1: before his book came out, Galway asked his publisher how

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Speaker 1: many copies they hope to sell. Twenty thousand, they said two.

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Speaker 1: Three quarters later, I had got my third royalty statement

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Speaker 1: and I had gone from forty thousand to eighty thousand

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Speaker 1: to hundred thousand. And I went back to Random House

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Speaker 1: and I said, how come it was so wrong in

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Speaker 1: your estimates? And he said, well, we thought it was

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Speaker 1: a tennis book. The Inner Game of Tennis is not

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Speaker 1: a tennis book. It's something else, which is why it's

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Speaker 1: now sold something like two million copies. And Galway is

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Speaker 1: inundated with requests from people who want his help, because

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Speaker 1: inner voices torture all of us, not just country club

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Speaker 1: tennis players. I get asked to give a lecture about

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Speaker 1: the Inner Game to the Houston Philharmonic. I played no

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Speaker 1: classical instruments. At the end, they applaud politely, except for

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Speaker 1: the conductor who comes up and says, I'm not going

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Speaker 1: to believe this till I see it. And next thing

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Speaker 1: he says is who's going to volunteer for some coaching

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Speaker 1: from tim as Faye would have it. One tuba player

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Speaker 1: volunteered alone. Galway did the same thing with the tuba

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Speaker 1: player that he did on the tennis court. Sir, what

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Speaker 1: do you find most difficult in performing at your level

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Speaker 1: with the tuba? That's the one question that doesn't ruffle

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Speaker 1: the ego. You just say what's the hardest thing? Now,

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Speaker 1: things are, but what's the most difficult thing your level?

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Speaker 1: And so he says articulation in the upper range. Never

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Speaker 1: heard the phrase. And I say it was so hard

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Speaker 1: about that? Galway has not the first clue about playing

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Speaker 1: a brass instrument. He doesn't even know the words you

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Speaker 1: need to talk touba. It's all he can do to listen. Well,

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Speaker 1: you go, and uh it sounded good to me. I said,

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Speaker 1: so how is that in terms of clean articulation? He says, uh,

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Speaker 1: not so good. He said, so there was it was

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Speaker 1: dirty to some extent. How did you know, as mass Well,

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Speaker 1: I can't hear it because Bella the tube is too far,

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Speaker 1: but I can feel it in my tongue. My tongue

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Speaker 1: gets dry and it's towards feeling thick. Galway tells the

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Speaker 1: tuba player to stop trying to hear his own sounds

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Speaker 1: and to focus on his tongue. So I said, don't

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Speaker 1: try to keep it change. Just notice the changes and moisture.

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Speaker 1: It's only a few measures. Sounds about the same to me.

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Speaker 1: The whole orchestra gets up on their feet and gives

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Speaker 1: us standing ovation, and you can tell the different. So

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Speaker 1: I said, oh my god, this is easy. I know

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Speaker 1: nothing about tubeas nothing about classical music. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: And I got everything from him as I needed, and

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Speaker 1: it seemed like magic. Because now this is new. The

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Speaker 1: coach doesn't need to know the first thing about what's

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Speaker 1: being coached. All the coach needs is a gift for

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Speaker 1: playing around with people's minds. Two things follow from this.

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Speaker 1: Anyone can coach anything, and anyone doing anything now needs

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Speaker 1: a coach. I'm Michael Lewis, and this is Against the Rules,

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Speaker 1: a show about various authority figures in American life. This

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Speaker 1: season is about the rise of coaches, and this episode

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Speaker 1: is about the inner game. The first big leap that

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Speaker 1: game coaching makes is into the business world. Tim Galway

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Speaker 1: starts getting requests from corporations to help them figure out

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Speaker 1: how to coach their executives. In the early eighties, the

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Speaker 1: Bell telephone monopoly was being broken up. The new head

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Speaker 1: of AT and T Corners Galway on a tennis court.

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Speaker 1: He says, the people of AT and T now need

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Speaker 1: to learn how to compete. Just a few years earlier,

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Speaker 1: Galway had been nothing more than the local club tennis pro.

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Speaker 1: Now the head of one of the world's largest corporations

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Speaker 1: is inviting him to try to fix one of the

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Speaker 1: world's largest corporate cultures. He started out just saying everything

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Speaker 1: to change. So at the end of the two minutes,

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Speaker 1: summarize in everything from the top level to the bottom

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Speaker 1: level to change. He said, So, Tim, what's the problem?

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Speaker 1: Galway told him, point plank you the problems you your

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Speaker 1: whole bossing people around management style. A monopoly could get

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Speaker 1: away with being autocratic, but now that AT and T

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Speaker 1: had to compete in the marketplace, well, everyone needed to

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Speaker 1: stop listening to the boss's voice in their heads. The

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Speaker 1: leader is the interference. Tiffany Gaskell is director of coaching

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Speaker 1: and leadership at a British company called Performance Consultants International.

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Speaker 1: Tim Gaway helped to create the company thirty five years ago,

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Speaker 1: after all these corporations started asking him for advice. When

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Speaker 1: you're on the tennis court, you're in your head. That

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Speaker 1: voice is the one that's saying, oh, no, you're not

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Speaker 1: good enough to do this. In organizations, because the leader

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Speaker 1: is the one that knows the way, then the other

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Speaker 1: people don't know the way. Performance consultants is still at

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Speaker 1: the center of coaching the executive mind, but the inner

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Speaker 1: game has become an industry. Gaskell guesses there are roughly

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Speaker 1: a quarter million of these coaches worldwide, helping business people

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Speaker 1: deal with the voices in their heads that make them

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Speaker 1: worse at their jobs. I was working with the managing

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Speaker 1: director of a waste company, waste management company, and every

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Speaker 1: month they were missing their recycling targets, and so we

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Speaker 1: sat down and he said, okay, so what's going on here?

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Speaker 1: We're missing our recycling targets. And he explored his own

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Speaker 1: beliefs around recycling and realized that he just didn't believe

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Speaker 1: in it because he said, you know, we're just sending

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Speaker 1: it on a boat to China. It's not really solving

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Speaker 1: the problem. Here. We have a common source of interference,

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Speaker 1: not really wanting to do the thing you were meant

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Speaker 1: to be doing because you don't believe in it. The

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Speaker 1: performance coach helped the waste management boss created a recycling

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Speaker 1: program that he could be proud of, and from then

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Speaker 1: on they hit their recycling targets. That's interesting. I mean

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Speaker 1: one response to this would be just to quit the

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Speaker 1: waste management business. But he didn't do that. He found

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Speaker 1: a better way to recycle. Yeah, and finding a better

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Speaker 1: way to recycle eliminated this interference he had that he

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Speaker 1: hadn't fully acknowledged that the whole thing was pointless. Yes, exactly.

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Speaker 1: So It's like, as we become aware of stuff, then

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Speaker 1: we can we have a choice and responsibility to do

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Speaker 1: something about it or not about now. I can hear

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Speaker 1: Bobby Knight throwing a chair across the room. I mean,

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Speaker 1: what is this bullshit? It all started on some country

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Speaker 1: club tennis court. And these mind coaches or performance coaches,

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Speaker 1: or wherever you want to call them, they've only got

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Speaker 1: a few simple ideas that they repeat over and over.

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Speaker 1: The voice inside your head needs to be managed. Screw that.

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Speaker 1: I don't have time for headcases. Criticism and praise are

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Speaker 1: equally counterproductive, as they both amplify the inner critic. Suck

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Speaker 1: it up, you whimp. Focus your attention on things you

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Speaker 1: can control rather than the things you cannot. Work your

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Speaker 1: ass off, and you'll control everything. On the other hand,

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Speaker 1: Bobby Knight might be shocked by who's finding this stuff useful?

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Speaker 1: Before the Break, I talked about how coaches are now

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Speaker 1: being brought in to help people who've never had coaches before.

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Speaker 1: We are what we repeatedly do excellence that has done

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Speaker 1: an act, but a habit. So we don't rise to

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Speaker 1: the occasion. We sing to our training. Right. You gotta

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Speaker 1: put together effective routines to operate well under pressure. There's

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Speaker 1: a mental game of firefighting huge. That's Jason Bresler, former

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Speaker 1: baseball player at the US Naval Academy, lieutenant in the

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Speaker 1: Marine Corps. Fought in the Battle of Fallujah, fought other

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Speaker 1: battles in Afghanistan. In between battles, he joined the New

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Speaker 1: York City Fire Department, where he now fights fires, among

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Speaker 1: other things. To challenge that our generation has is one

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Speaker 1: is the complexity of these events that we go to.

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Speaker 1: They're just ever increasing into complexity because there's the active

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Speaker 1: shooter threat, there's terrorism, there's transportation accidents, there's biological exposure.

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Speaker 1: All these like, it's we do far more than just

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Speaker 1: go to fires. No, two emergencies are the same, but

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Speaker 1: they all have one thing in common, an inner game.

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Speaker 1: All right, more stressful at time? Hopefully what do we

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Speaker 1: think stressful? Why? By my heart rate was elevated, I

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Speaker 1: was I esk guys like, do you ever have a

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Speaker 1: negative conversation with your with yourself? You know, like in

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Speaker 1: a moment where you're just like, don't suck, right, or

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Speaker 1: now you make a mistake and you're like, I freaking suck.

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Speaker 1: And universally, every single guy, particularly the most experienced guys

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Speaker 1: that have been to so many fires, and they say

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Speaker 1: yeah all the time. Jason fights fires himself, but he

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Speaker 1: also helps to run the training programs for firefighters, and

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Speaker 1: he noticed that firefighters didn't usually dwell on their inner states.

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Speaker 1: They fought fires, and they didn't talk about the conversations

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Speaker 1: they had with themselves when they did it. And at

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Speaker 1: first they looked at me like I was kind of crazy, right,

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Speaker 1: I'd say, well, hold on a second, hold on a second,

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Speaker 1: do you recognize that conversation isn't at least bit helpful?

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Speaker 1: And everyone would say yeah, I'm like, well, is it

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Speaker 1: easy to change that conversation? And they're like hell No.

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Speaker 1: All of them were game to be coached about a

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Speaker 1: thing they hadn't ever really put into words. So Jason

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Speaker 1: brought in a twenty nine year old mind coach named

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Speaker 1: Ben Oliva. One of the things we're trying to do

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Speaker 1: here is speed up the path to being an expert.

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Speaker 1: So this coach wears jeans and a hoodie with a

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Speaker 1: kangaroo pouch. He'd never fought a fire. He'd never been

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Speaker 1: in a fire. He might have started a fire to

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Speaker 1: roast marshmallows or something. He knows fires the way Tim

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Speaker 1: Galway knew tubas. But he's talking to a group of

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Speaker 1: firefighters who seemed to believe he could make them better

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Speaker 1: at their jobs. I think is the difference between routines

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Speaker 1: and superstitions. Okay, so I'm going to suggest that there

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Speaker 1: is a difference. Ben has a laptop and a power point.

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Speaker 1: The firefighters sit in a semicircle around him. Firefighters always

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Speaker 1: seem like they're waiting for something to happen. Okay, So

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Speaker 1: if you're you're a superstition. If you don't do it,

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Speaker 1: you can't perform well. Yea like a lapse of your

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Speaker 1: routine is going to throw you off right, kind of

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Speaker 1: like they're tied together. What if this happens, some this

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Speaker 1: won't happen. You're pointing to an important point here, which

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Speaker 1: is that superstitions often give us the impression that we

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Speaker 1: cannot be successful if we don't do them, whereas routines

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Speaker 1: are more flexible. Ben studied astrophysics and psychology at Williams College,

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Speaker 1: where he also played baseball and football. That Williams, he

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Speaker 1: noticed that some of his teammates were just way better

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Speaker 1: in practice than they were in games. Why was that

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Speaker 1: he left Williams and got a masters in sports psychology.

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Speaker 1: Now he coaches the minds of players for the Boston

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Speaker 1: Red Sox and the New York Giants. Also a bunch

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Speaker 1: of lawyers and doctors and some actors and singers you've

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Speaker 1: heard of. Bene Leavitt does the same work with firefighters

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Speaker 1: that he does with everyone else, starting with trying to

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Speaker 1: eliminate interference distractors. One are the things that pop in

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Speaker 1: your head. They end up posing on that you don't

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Speaker 1: have full control. Decisions that a fire that already have

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Speaker 1: been made in executy, past decisions, other people's readiness, other

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Speaker 1: people's readiness. Okay, so like other people's performance. Yeah yeah,

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Speaker 1: other people time of year. So external factors in the environment,

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Speaker 1: whether excellently. That throws so many apps up. Oh it's gold.

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Speaker 1: I can't play well. One of the guys had girls.

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Speaker 1: That one gets me a lot. There's one, a really

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Speaker 1: big one that I'd like to point out that we

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Speaker 1: haven't hit yet. Past mistakes, past mistakes. I can sort

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Speaker 1: of understand baseball players getting hung up that way, they're

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Speaker 1: all head cases. But firefighters tactical technique. He's not going

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Speaker 1: to make us a better firefighter. Jason Bressler Again, he

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Speaker 1: says he can see the effect mind coaching has on

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Speaker 1: the way that fires get fought. In the course of

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Speaker 1: adopting these techniques and applying them, we're likely to become

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Speaker 1: a better version of ourself, which then inevitably is going

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Speaker 1: to make us a better firefighter. Who doesn't want to

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Speaker 1: accomplish that. Plus, it's like you're nobody unless you have

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Speaker 1: a mine coach. That's gonna be part of this, right,

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Speaker 1: I mean, if everyone else has a mind coach and

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Speaker 1: you don't, how can you compete? How do I compete? Hey,

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Speaker 1: Michael hold up? Just need to adjust your mic rolling

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Speaker 1: in Berkeley. So I've just made you performance coach against

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Speaker 1: the rules. You are our podcast performance coach, and I

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Speaker 1: bring you in for the first conversation and you come

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Speaker 1: sit in our studio. What are the things you ask

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Speaker 1: me to try to figure out? Try to diagnose? And Okay, so, um,

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Speaker 1: should we should we do this? Should we do? Like? Um, yes,

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Speaker 1: let's do this. Tiffany Gaskell of Performance Consultants International. I

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Speaker 1: just finished interviewing her and was about to let her go.

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Speaker 1: But you can't talk to one of these mine coaches

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Speaker 1: for long before you start thinking about new uses to

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Speaker 1: which they might be put. Yeah, because none of the

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Speaker 1: people who've worked on the podcast have improved in any way.

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Speaker 1: So they're just trapped in their own little worlds. And

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Speaker 1: I just think, I think what I think of them,

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Speaker 1: and but nobody's made any progress at all. So it

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Speaker 1: would be nice if we could go somewhere I don't

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Speaker 1: know where, so help us. So I'm just putting my

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Speaker 1: hand on my head because um, there was um. So

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Speaker 1: they come from, right, That's the first thing that's really port.

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Speaker 1: The first thing is that it is not a remedial thing.

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Speaker 1: So Michael Um, in terms of me coaching you, then

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Speaker 1: it's like I'm going on a journey with you and

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Speaker 1: walk walking down a path. So what I would ask

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Speaker 1: is that essentially we work on you, not all the

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Speaker 1: people around you. See what I mean? All right? The leaders,

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Speaker 1: the interference I almost forgot. Okay, so let's start this. So, Michael,

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Speaker 1: if you had something you wanted to be coached on,

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Speaker 1: what would that be? You mean, how would I like

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Speaker 1: to improve? Is that the question? Um? Yes, that's a

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Speaker 1: good one. Here's here's one. It's it's not huge, but

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Speaker 1: it's noticeable. I don't like the way I am can

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Speaker 1: be distracted by small irritations. A microcosm of this is

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Speaker 1: just driving. My ideal state as a driver is detached

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Speaker 1: amusement at the poor habits of other drivers. I have

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Speaker 1: trouble staying in that ideal state and not not descending

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Speaker 1: into bitterness and fury on the road. So that's just

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Speaker 1: an example. But I assume if I'm that way in

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Speaker 1: the car, I'm that way with other things, and I

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Speaker 1: don't see any benefit to the bitterness and anger I

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Speaker 1: feel towards others when they are inept. Okay, that's a

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Speaker 1: great thing for us to work on. Okay, you're ready

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Speaker 1: to go. Yes, So um, Let's imagine that you are

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Speaker 1: sitting in the car. We're doing your dream scenario. Now, Okay,

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Speaker 1: I've got my eyes closed, great, me too. You're sitting

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Speaker 1: in the car and everything is just as you'd love

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Speaker 1: it to be. Tell me about what that feels like.

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Speaker 1: It feels like being in a sensory deprivation chamber where

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Speaker 1: I'm alone with my thoughts and the car is almost

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Speaker 1: just driving itself. So you are enjoying being with yourself,

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Speaker 1: moving along, getting to where you're going to m And

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Speaker 1: in terms of like our goal for the end of this,

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Speaker 1: let's say that something happens outside of your little bubble.

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Speaker 1: How is it you stay in your bubble? How would

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Speaker 1: I stay in my bubble if I was trying to

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Speaker 1: stay in my bubble? Well, if I'm in a good

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Speaker 1: state of mind, I laugh. I see someone run a

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Speaker 1: four way stop, or someone tailgating me, or an ancient

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Speaker 1: person going three miles an hour, and I think different

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Speaker 1: strokes for different folks. Isn't it got detachment? The detachment?

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Speaker 1: You're detached. I'm detached, That's the way I Otherwise I

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Speaker 1: start to get upset. And when you get upset, what's

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Speaker 1: there instead m a desire to reek reek vengeance and

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Speaker 1: a kind of fury that is just inexplicable given what's happened. Okay,

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Speaker 1: I desire to let them know just how awful they

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Speaker 1: are as human beings. Okay, so we got judgment right there.

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Speaker 1: Right there, you go a lot of judgment. Okay, So

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Speaker 1: there's the detached happy place. There's the judgment hell place.

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Speaker 1: Is that right? Yeah? True? Okay, yea. So um, let's

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Speaker 1: just get back into your detached happy place. I mean,

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Speaker 1: I'm there. Great. Just tell me about this bubble. What's

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Speaker 1: going on inside the bubble? Yeah? What's the bubble? Like

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Speaker 1: the bubbles playful? You could also be seriously playful in

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Speaker 1: the bubble. I'm thinking about uh famla, or I'm thinking about,

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Speaker 1: more commonly, something i'm working on, like this long scene

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Speaker 1: in the middle of this episode. I could be thinking

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Speaker 1: about whether to let this tape just play or insert

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Speaker 1: some narration to break it up. But I'm not because

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Speaker 1: of the noise in my head. Okay. So have you

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Speaker 1: got your feet on the ground toes? Yes? Great, So

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Speaker 1: just putting your feet on the ground, do you feel

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Speaker 1: that connection with the ground and staying in the bubble

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Speaker 1: and just really feeling this positivity and the bubble around you.

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Speaker 1: What color is a bubble? Blue? Light blue, kind of

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Speaker 1: a sky blue, and so you've got that all around you.

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Speaker 1: It could be pink too. What's the feeling in this bubble?

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Speaker 1: It's warm and cozy. Great, no negativity? Yeah, no negativity.

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Speaker 1: And on a scale of one to ten, how strong

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Speaker 1: are you feeling this right now at this very moment, yes,

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Speaker 1: call it an eight. So what we want to do

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Speaker 1: now is find a point on your body which you

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Speaker 1: can associate this feeling with. So you've got your feet

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Speaker 1: flat on the ground and you can feel this is

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Speaker 1: resonating around you, isn't it the bubble? Mhmm? Sometimes blue,

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Speaker 1: sometimes pink, but yes, it's resonating. And so where's the

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Speaker 1: place on your body that you can, like, for example,

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Speaker 1: your chest, to access this feeling. If you keep mentioning

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Speaker 1: my chest, it's hard for me to think of anything

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Speaker 1: but my sorry about I'm feeling. Yes, I feel like

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Speaker 1: I am being led to my chest where it might

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Speaker 1: be who knows where it might be, my tip of

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Speaker 1: my nose or my little toe could be anywhere for it. Um,

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Speaker 1: I would actually say, my toes great, and to tell

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Speaker 1: me about that, tell me about your toes, And well,

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Speaker 1: normally your toasts take your toes for granted, right unless

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Speaker 1: they're injured or they're unsightly and you don't have shoes on.

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Speaker 1: But otherwise you don't really think about your toes. They're

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Speaker 1: in your shoes. But when you're really aware of your

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Speaker 1: body and you wiggle your toes inside your shoe, it's

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Speaker 1: a it's a very distinct sensation, and it's a it

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Speaker 1: makes you feel very self aware. So I'm wiggling my

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Speaker 1: toes inside my shoes and it's giving me pleasure. Can

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Speaker 1: that give you access to the bubble? It might? It might.

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Speaker 1: It might also cause me to hit the accelerator a

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Speaker 1: little fast in the car. But but it's it's um

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Speaker 1: But yes, absolutely, I could work on connecting the feeling

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Speaker 1: of the wiggly toes to the bubble. So my request

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Speaker 1: to you is that next time you aren't driving, that

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Speaker 1: this is what you do, all right, when your face

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Speaker 1: with a situation that could get you into that judgment place,

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Speaker 1: I promise I will do it. It seemed like such

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Speaker 1: a simple request, but the inner game is not as

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Speaker 1: easy as it looks I came to this episode with

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Speaker 1: one question, why why are these inner game coaches now everywhere?

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Speaker 1: I mean, they used not to exist, and it's not

424
00:29:42,916 --> 00:29:46,236
Speaker 1: as if they required some new technology to make them possible.

425
00:29:47,076 --> 00:29:49,916
Speaker 1: Leonardo da Vinci could have had this kind of coaching. Now.

426
00:29:49,916 --> 00:29:52,996
Speaker 1: There was a guy with interference issues, hardly finished anything

427
00:29:52,996 --> 00:29:56,116
Speaker 1: he started. Maybe if he'd had a mind coach, Saudi

428
00:29:56,196 --> 00:29:58,396
Speaker 1: Princes would not have to shell out four hundred and

429
00:29:58,396 --> 00:30:01,716
Speaker 1: fifty million dollars for fake Leonardo's because there'd be so

430
00:30:01,756 --> 00:30:04,916
Speaker 1: many real ones to choose from. Anyway, here's a thought.

431
00:30:05,476 --> 00:30:09,036
Speaker 1: This explosion in mind coaching first required that a scide

432
00:30:09,276 --> 00:30:13,916
Speaker 1: give itself over entirely to markets. It needed life to

433
00:30:13,956 --> 00:30:18,156
Speaker 1: be seen as one giant winner take all competition. It

434
00:30:18,276 --> 00:30:26,916
Speaker 1: needed a new kind of anxiety. So you feel like

435
00:30:26,956 --> 00:30:29,116
Speaker 1: you've put a ton of time into the physical side,

436
00:30:29,196 --> 00:30:33,196
Speaker 1: but the mental side you haven't had that much direction.

437
00:30:33,276 --> 00:30:36,916
Speaker 1: In training, Ben Oliva trainer of pro baseball players and

438
00:30:36,956 --> 00:30:40,756
Speaker 1: Wall Street traders and New York City firefighters. He spends

439
00:30:40,756 --> 00:30:44,556
Speaker 1: a shocking amount of his time coaching young people, teenagers

440
00:30:44,996 --> 00:30:48,196
Speaker 1: who have somehow become swept up in our general performance

441
00:30:48,236 --> 00:30:52,356
Speaker 1: anxiety and so you're interested in figuring out, Yeah, what

442
00:30:52,436 --> 00:30:55,036
Speaker 1: you can do to get better from that? I know

443
00:30:55,156 --> 00:30:58,756
Speaker 1: about you from what your dad told me. But here's

444
00:30:58,796 --> 00:31:01,716
Speaker 1: the thing. I work with lots of high school athletes

445
00:31:01,756 --> 00:31:07,556
Speaker 1: and parents are kind of unreliable source. Yeah, so I'm

446
00:31:07,596 --> 00:31:10,996
Speaker 1: not going to fully rely on what he was telling me. Okay,

447
00:31:12,316 --> 00:31:15,516
Speaker 1: the girl is a seventeen year old high school softball player.

448
00:31:16,116 --> 00:31:18,636
Speaker 1: She's hoping to be recruited to play at elite colleges.

449
00:31:19,556 --> 00:31:22,276
Speaker 1: She thinks her father can't help her. But that's not new.

450
00:31:22,676 --> 00:31:25,436
Speaker 1: Teenagers have always found their parents to be mostly useless.

451
00:31:26,036 --> 00:31:29,516
Speaker 1: What's new is their urgent need to optimize their performance.

452
00:31:30,076 --> 00:31:32,796
Speaker 1: We're going to refocus like we're training a puppy. If

453
00:31:32,836 --> 00:31:34,916
Speaker 1: we're going to train your mind like we train a

454
00:31:34,916 --> 00:31:38,676
Speaker 1: puppy all time us for two minutes, my suggestion is

455
00:31:38,676 --> 00:31:41,956
Speaker 1: you close your eyes. You do not have to on

456
00:31:42,116 --> 00:31:47,396
Speaker 1: your marks. Good, said guy. I'll do it. These sessions

457
00:31:47,436 --> 00:31:50,156
Speaker 1: are usually confidential, but he's made an exception here because

458
00:31:50,156 --> 00:31:53,556
Speaker 1: the girl is my daughter, Dixie. A lot of the

459
00:31:53,676 --> 00:31:57,516
Speaker 1: time when I go to bed, I have a bunch

460
00:31:57,516 --> 00:32:00,396
Speaker 1: of things on my mind. So I was like, well,

461
00:32:00,876 --> 00:32:03,276
Speaker 1: this is kind of a form of meditation. Let's see

462
00:32:03,276 --> 00:32:06,196
Speaker 1: if I can. Because when we did it, like, all

463
00:32:06,236 --> 00:32:08,516
Speaker 1: I really had to focus on was that I wasn't

464
00:32:08,516 --> 00:32:11,316
Speaker 1: thinking about the test I just studied for, or like

465
00:32:11,956 --> 00:32:15,476
Speaker 1: the practice SUCH just had. So I definitely had to

466
00:32:15,516 --> 00:32:20,876
Speaker 1: restart a lot. We live in Berkeley, California, so a

467
00:32:20,916 --> 00:32:24,316
Speaker 1: lot of Dixie's teachers already make her meditate. If they

468
00:32:24,356 --> 00:32:28,996
Speaker 1: gave Olympic medals and meditation, we might just sweep. We'd

469
00:32:29,036 --> 00:32:33,156
Speaker 1: also win recycling. Okay, So when you got distracted and

470
00:32:33,196 --> 00:32:37,116
Speaker 1: then brought your attention back. Yeah. One of the other

471
00:32:37,156 --> 00:32:40,436
Speaker 1: pieces of this is noticing if you judge yourself right,

472
00:32:40,556 --> 00:32:45,116
Speaker 1: distracted right, because one of the bigger themes here is

473
00:32:45,276 --> 00:32:48,036
Speaker 1: trying to manage our self judgment, usually in a way

474
00:32:48,076 --> 00:32:52,436
Speaker 1: that's actually helpful for us rather than unhelpful. Yeah. I

475
00:32:52,556 --> 00:32:54,916
Speaker 1: know she's my child because when she's told to meditate,

476
00:32:55,036 --> 00:32:57,716
Speaker 1: her first reaction is to win at it. She may

477
00:32:57,756 --> 00:33:00,876
Speaker 1: never have heard of Bill Parcels, the legendary football coach,

478
00:33:01,836 --> 00:33:05,076
Speaker 1: but she'd agree with his most famous line, you are

479
00:33:05,436 --> 00:33:08,796
Speaker 1: what your record says you are. Okay, So what's the

480
00:33:10,196 --> 00:33:16,076
Speaker 1: problem with judging our success based on outcomes? Well, we

481
00:33:16,116 --> 00:33:19,236
Speaker 1: get into a mindset where we think we're supposed to

482
00:33:19,236 --> 00:33:24,796
Speaker 1: get on base every time one and that's like, are

483
00:33:24,836 --> 00:33:27,716
Speaker 1: you kind of a perfectionist in that way? Well, that's

484
00:33:27,756 --> 00:33:31,676
Speaker 1: the thing. It's like, I don't like that's definitely how

485
00:33:31,716 --> 00:33:34,276
Speaker 1: I am a lot more in high school. So that's

486
00:33:34,316 --> 00:33:37,156
Speaker 1: the problem of judging ourselves based on outcomes is that

487
00:33:37,676 --> 00:33:40,596
Speaker 1: we lose track of the things that get us the

488
00:33:40,596 --> 00:33:44,356
Speaker 1: best outcomes. So by focusing all our energy on the outcomes,

489
00:33:44,916 --> 00:33:47,796
Speaker 1: we end up getting worse outcomes. Yeah, it's really kind

490
00:33:47,836 --> 00:33:52,276
Speaker 1: of twisted. It's even more twisted than that. My child

491
00:33:52,356 --> 00:33:55,636
Speaker 1: has been engaged in this insane competition for the attention

492
00:33:55,636 --> 00:33:59,676
Speaker 1: of college coaches since she was thirteen years old. The

493
00:33:59,716 --> 00:34:03,436
Speaker 1: pressure on her grows every year. She has the sense

494
00:34:03,476 --> 00:34:05,996
Speaker 1: that any given at bat might cause a coach to

495
00:34:06,076 --> 00:34:08,956
Speaker 1: love her or to hate, and thus determine the course

496
00:34:08,956 --> 00:34:13,116
Speaker 1: of life. Every weekend, Dixie travels with your club softball team.

497
00:34:13,796 --> 00:34:15,436
Speaker 1: It's one of the best teams in the country, and

498
00:34:15,476 --> 00:34:18,756
Speaker 1: it plays against the other best teams. Wherever they play,

499
00:34:18,876 --> 00:34:21,836
Speaker 1: college coaches gather to watch, but only because they are

500
00:34:21,916 --> 00:34:24,956
Speaker 1: one of the best teams. If they started losing all

501
00:34:24,996 --> 00:34:26,796
Speaker 1: the time, they wouldn't be invited to play against the

502
00:34:26,796 --> 00:34:28,316
Speaker 1: best teams, and no one would want to see them

503
00:34:28,316 --> 00:34:32,036
Speaker 1: play except maybe their parents. Lose, and the coach from

504
00:34:32,036 --> 00:34:35,436
Speaker 1: your dream school might never see how good you really are.

505
00:34:38,116 --> 00:34:39,956
Speaker 1: To get a sense of what it feels like to

506
00:34:39,996 --> 00:34:43,676
Speaker 1: be inside my child's dugout, probably also inside her head.

507
00:34:44,076 --> 00:34:46,676
Speaker 1: We stuck a wire on her coach, who was reacting

508
00:34:46,676 --> 00:34:49,316
Speaker 1: to some screw up by one of Dixie's teammates. That

509
00:34:49,316 --> 00:34:51,356
Speaker 1: one wasn't even any of dirt, and you missed it.

510
00:34:51,476 --> 00:34:55,116
Speaker 1: Get around the fucking blood. Don't be positivity. Shut up,

511
00:34:55,196 --> 00:34:59,756
Speaker 1: so I'll give you positivity. I know you want to

512
00:34:59,756 --> 00:35:03,076
Speaker 1: call child Protective Services. And if Dixie's coach said this

513
00:35:03,116 --> 00:35:05,996
Speaker 1: sort of stuff inside of an institution a high school, say,

514
00:35:06,076 --> 00:35:08,996
Speaker 1: or college, some parent would complain and should be FI.

515
00:35:11,316 --> 00:35:13,076
Speaker 1: But you know who'd be the most upset if that

516
00:35:13,156 --> 00:35:17,036
Speaker 1: happened her players. Well, when you know her, you don't

517
00:35:17,076 --> 00:35:21,636
Speaker 1: take any of that really seriously, like if that makes sense,

518
00:35:21,716 --> 00:35:25,916
Speaker 1: like that's just her, Like it's not you don't you

519
00:35:26,036 --> 00:35:29,076
Speaker 1: just can't take it personally, is it was it harder

520
00:35:30,556 --> 00:35:33,036
Speaker 1: to sort of keep your mind in the right place

521
00:35:33,876 --> 00:35:37,636
Speaker 1: when you had a coach that you were intimidated by.

522
00:35:38,596 --> 00:35:41,796
Speaker 1: That's me obviously talking with Dixie in the car after

523
00:35:41,836 --> 00:35:44,796
Speaker 1: a softball practice. I mean I was intimidated by her

524
00:35:44,836 --> 00:35:47,796
Speaker 1: in the beginning, like the very beginning, but it was

525
00:35:47,876 --> 00:35:51,716
Speaker 1: more I just really didn't want to disappoint her. If

526
00:35:51,716 --> 00:35:53,916
Speaker 1: she's not yelling at you, then you're doing something wrong.

527
00:35:53,996 --> 00:35:57,236
Speaker 1: If she's not noticing you, then that's a bad sign.

528
00:35:57,596 --> 00:35:59,876
Speaker 1: Why is that? Because she's not paying attention to you.

529
00:35:59,996 --> 00:36:03,236
Speaker 1: She's like, she doesn't care what you're doing. She If

530
00:36:03,276 --> 00:36:05,236
Speaker 1: she's paying attention to you and yelling at you, it

531
00:36:05,236 --> 00:36:13,236
Speaker 1: means she cares. And that's the most important part. Oh

532
00:36:13,276 --> 00:36:19,356
Speaker 1: my god, we're living this fucking team here. We have

533
00:36:19,396 --> 00:36:21,796
Speaker 1: a paradox. Why don't you try to seeing them all?

534
00:36:21,916 --> 00:36:24,676
Speaker 1: That will be a good strategy is to actually look

535
00:36:24,716 --> 00:36:27,676
Speaker 1: at it. Play at the highest levels of any competitive sport,

536
00:36:28,076 --> 00:36:29,996
Speaker 1: you'll hear a lot of this sort of critical voice.

537
00:36:30,836 --> 00:36:32,956
Speaker 1: You might even sense that you need to hear this

538
00:36:33,076 --> 00:36:36,116
Speaker 1: voice to push you to places that you never push yourself.

539
00:36:37,156 --> 00:36:40,036
Speaker 1: The paradox is that you also need to silence that voice,

540
00:36:40,476 --> 00:36:43,956
Speaker 1: at least inside your own head. This comes up over

541
00:36:44,076 --> 00:36:47,556
Speaker 1: and over again in Dixie sessions with Ben, how much

542
00:36:47,596 --> 00:36:50,876
Speaker 1: she cares about her coaches, but how hard it is

543
00:36:50,916 --> 00:36:54,196
Speaker 1: to stay calm in their presence and how hard it

544
00:36:54,236 --> 00:36:56,796
Speaker 1: is to play well when you're not calm. I'm really

545
00:36:56,836 --> 00:37:00,316
Speaker 1: hard on myself for some reason, like on that team

546
00:37:00,356 --> 00:37:03,076
Speaker 1: with the coaches that I had, Like it's almost like

547
00:37:03,116 --> 00:37:05,356
Speaker 1: I had like so much respect for them that I

548
00:37:05,396 --> 00:37:10,156
Speaker 1: didn't want to let them down because like and my coaches.

549
00:37:10,756 --> 00:37:14,156
Speaker 1: And then another thing I do definitely when I'm nervous

550
00:37:14,756 --> 00:37:18,316
Speaker 1: is like I don't know, like my eyes almost like

551
00:37:18,436 --> 00:37:24,756
Speaker 1: freeze and it's really stressful because I have like naturally

552
00:37:24,876 --> 00:37:28,596
Speaker 1: really good hand eye coordination, and so I'll still hit

553
00:37:28,676 --> 00:37:31,916
Speaker 1: the ball, but I know if my eyes were on it,

554
00:37:32,116 --> 00:37:34,436
Speaker 1: I would have hit it a lot better. Right, So

555
00:37:34,556 --> 00:37:37,116
Speaker 1: think about that. That means your attention is somewhere in

556
00:37:37,156 --> 00:37:41,196
Speaker 1: the future on what if this happens, what if that happens,

557
00:37:41,316 --> 00:37:45,276
Speaker 1: rather than on the present moment actually on trying to

558
00:37:45,316 --> 00:37:47,916
Speaker 1: pick that ball up right out of her view. So

559
00:37:48,076 --> 00:37:50,876
Speaker 1: let's do an exercise just to show you that you

560
00:37:50,956 --> 00:37:55,836
Speaker 1: have control of your attention when you are aware of it. Right,

561
00:37:55,876 --> 00:37:59,836
Speaker 1: So what's your attention talking to you? Right? I would

562
00:37:59,836 --> 00:38:01,956
Speaker 1: hope that it's on me at least for the most part.

563
00:38:03,196 --> 00:38:05,836
Speaker 1: But if we want to write, I can tell you

564
00:38:05,836 --> 00:38:08,636
Speaker 1: to shift your attention to the way that the seat

565
00:38:08,716 --> 00:38:12,476
Speaker 1: feels underneath you, the way that your weight feels on

566
00:38:12,476 --> 00:38:18,596
Speaker 1: that seat. That's really a weird thing to pay attention to, right, Yeah,

567
00:38:18,636 --> 00:38:20,556
Speaker 1: And it would be weird if you were sitting here

568
00:38:20,596 --> 00:38:24,356
Speaker 1: talking to me paying attention to that sensation. Yeah, that

569
00:38:24,556 --> 00:38:28,716
Speaker 1: would be like a really weird thing to be doing. Yet.

570
00:38:29,396 --> 00:38:31,356
Speaker 1: But you can do it if you want to, right,

571
00:38:33,076 --> 00:38:36,156
Speaker 1: Or you can just wiggle your toes. The point is

572
00:38:36,156 --> 00:38:38,676
Speaker 1: that Dixie can learn to pay attention to the things

573
00:38:38,676 --> 00:38:41,636
Speaker 1: that are useful, to pay attention to her breath, for example,

574
00:38:41,836 --> 00:38:44,196
Speaker 1: or the ball as it leaves the pitcher's hand. Just

575
00:38:44,236 --> 00:38:46,596
Speaker 1: as the tuba player can stop trying to listen to

576
00:38:46,636 --> 00:38:52,156
Speaker 1: his own music and focus on his tongue, Dixie needs

577
00:38:52,156 --> 00:38:54,676
Speaker 1: to find the thing that helps to focus on. I

578
00:38:54,716 --> 00:38:58,076
Speaker 1: don't know what the right focused cues are. This is personal,

579
00:38:58,596 --> 00:39:01,836
Speaker 1: it's individualized. There's there's not focused cues that are best

580
00:39:01,876 --> 00:39:03,916
Speaker 1: for everybody. But you just told me you hit your

581
00:39:03,916 --> 00:39:07,916
Speaker 1: best when you're aggressive and loose. That sounds like a

582
00:39:08,036 --> 00:39:13,916
Speaker 1: killer focused kid. Ben and Dixie spoke over Skype every

583
00:39:13,916 --> 00:39:17,236
Speaker 1: week for months, just the two of them. We taped

584
00:39:17,276 --> 00:39:19,036
Speaker 1: only a few of these sessions, and even then we

585
00:39:19,076 --> 00:39:22,156
Speaker 1: didn't listen in. But one day, when I was driving

586
00:39:22,196 --> 00:39:24,596
Speaker 1: her home after softball practice, I asked her how it

587
00:39:24,636 --> 00:39:26,956
Speaker 1: was going, and she told me that when she stepped

588
00:39:26,956 --> 00:39:29,396
Speaker 1: into the batter's box, she now had a phrase in

589
00:39:29,476 --> 00:39:34,676
Speaker 1: her head, loose and aggressive. And is it like, how

590
00:39:34,716 --> 00:39:36,396
Speaker 1: do you say it the way you would say it

591
00:39:36,476 --> 00:39:39,276
Speaker 1: to yourself? Like you hear it in your head? Loose

592
00:39:39,356 --> 00:39:44,476
Speaker 1: and aggressive, loose and aggressive. Loose and aggressive. So it's light,

593
00:39:44,876 --> 00:39:51,116
Speaker 1: it's not loud. Yeah, what would have been in your

594
00:39:51,116 --> 00:39:55,716
Speaker 1: head before you did those drills with him? Don't swing

595
00:39:55,756 --> 00:40:01,836
Speaker 1: and miss, you have to move the runner, don't fuck up,

596
00:40:03,636 --> 00:40:09,036
Speaker 1: don't look at your coach. Typically things that started with

597
00:40:09,236 --> 00:40:17,596
Speaker 1: don't get rid of the don't That's what Ben had

598
00:40:17,636 --> 00:40:20,996
Speaker 1: been teaching her. The new strategy gets this trial run

599
00:40:20,996 --> 00:40:24,516
Speaker 1: into tournament being inspected by roughly fifty college softball coaches.

600
00:40:25,516 --> 00:40:28,276
Speaker 1: The opposing team's pitcher has already signed with the University

601
00:40:28,276 --> 00:40:32,716
Speaker 1: of Texas. She lights out, her dropball drops, her rise

602
00:40:32,796 --> 00:40:35,076
Speaker 1: ball rises, and her fastball comes in at sixty five

603
00:40:35,116 --> 00:40:37,236
Speaker 1: miles an hour, which is the equivalent of a ninety

604
00:40:37,236 --> 00:40:40,796
Speaker 1: four mile an hour fastball and baseball Dixie's teammates all

605
00:40:40,796 --> 00:40:43,956
Speaker 1: have trouble dealing with it. Everyone's striking out, her swinging late.

606
00:40:44,716 --> 00:40:48,836
Speaker 1: Everything feels like it's happening too fast. Dixie now comes

607
00:40:48,876 --> 00:40:50,956
Speaker 1: to the plate. There we go next day, Get on time.

608
00:40:51,316 --> 00:40:54,316
Speaker 1: The first pitch is a fastball, high and inside, just

609
00:40:54,436 --> 00:40:57,156
Speaker 1: extremely hard to react to quickly enough to hit hard.

610
00:40:57,836 --> 00:41:01,076
Speaker 1: A month earlier, she'd have been frozen by it. Oh,

611
00:41:02,836 --> 00:41:05,836
Speaker 1: you did it. That's the sound of it. Hit. It's

612
00:41:05,836 --> 00:41:08,756
Speaker 1: a rocket down the left field line. She didn't just

613
00:41:08,836 --> 00:41:13,236
Speaker 1: not freeze, she was ahead of it. She never reacted

614
00:41:13,236 --> 00:41:17,116
Speaker 1: so quickly to a pitch in her entire life. After

615
00:41:17,116 --> 00:41:18,756
Speaker 1: the game, I didn't say anything about it. I'd read

616
00:41:18,796 --> 00:41:20,676
Speaker 1: the inner game of Tennis, and the last thing my

617
00:41:20,756 --> 00:41:23,676
Speaker 1: daughter needed was another voice in her head. She'd been

618
00:41:23,676 --> 00:41:28,116
Speaker 1: coached to stop thinking and trust her reactions, which can

619
00:41:28,156 --> 00:41:32,276
Speaker 1: be hard for a smart person to do. But eventually

620
00:41:32,316 --> 00:41:34,836
Speaker 1: I debriefed her, asked her what she thought had happened.

621
00:41:35,556 --> 00:41:39,476
Speaker 1: I developed a routine that acted kind of like a

622
00:41:39,516 --> 00:41:42,076
Speaker 1: safety net for me, Like knowing that I had a

623
00:41:42,076 --> 00:41:45,236
Speaker 1: plan made me know if I executed it or not,

624
00:41:45,636 --> 00:41:48,476
Speaker 1: and so having that as my goal instead of focusing

625
00:41:48,476 --> 00:41:52,556
Speaker 1: on the outcome it made it a lot easier to

626
00:41:52,596 --> 00:41:54,276
Speaker 1: not be hard on myself because I was like, well,

627
00:41:54,556 --> 00:41:57,356
Speaker 1: I executed my plan, I did everything I was supposed

628
00:41:57,356 --> 00:42:00,396
Speaker 1: to do, and it just didn't work out. And that's

629
00:42:00,436 --> 00:42:02,596
Speaker 1: how this game works. So I just have to let

630
00:42:02,596 --> 00:42:05,716
Speaker 1: it go and do the same thing next time. And right,

631
00:42:06,036 --> 00:42:08,076
Speaker 1: you know, like because it made me realize that I

632
00:42:08,156 --> 00:42:14,276
Speaker 1: cannot control everything. Right, my daughter is saying I cannot

633
00:42:14,276 --> 00:42:17,676
Speaker 1: control everything of her own free will. And I'm sitting

634
00:42:17,676 --> 00:42:21,156
Speaker 1: in the driver's seat about to drive home from softball practice,

635
00:42:21,436 --> 00:42:24,516
Speaker 1: wiggling my toes at every intersection instead of screaming at

636
00:42:24,516 --> 00:42:28,676
Speaker 1: the other drivers. And yet there's still a part of

637
00:42:28,676 --> 00:42:31,116
Speaker 1: me that thinks there is just no way this shit

638
00:42:31,236 --> 00:42:35,676
Speaker 1: can work. Explain to me why people didn't figure this

639
00:42:35,716 --> 00:42:38,036
Speaker 1: out five hundred years ago. Yeah, it's interesting, isn't it.

640
00:42:38,316 --> 00:42:42,196
Speaker 1: Tiffany Gaskell again, creator of my pink road rage bubble.

641
00:42:42,676 --> 00:42:45,916
Speaker 1: People have cared about performance for a long time. Why

642
00:42:46,036 --> 00:42:51,116
Speaker 1: wasn't Sir Lancelot when he was jousting, Why wasn't he

643
00:42:51,196 --> 00:42:55,196
Speaker 1: wiggling his toes or clenching his abs or I don't understand.

644
00:42:56,156 --> 00:43:00,036
Speaker 1: I'm thinking about the evolution of humankind, and I'm thinking

645
00:43:00,076 --> 00:43:02,516
Speaker 1: that we are in a place now where we are

646
00:43:03,076 --> 00:43:06,116
Speaker 1: you know Maslow's hierarchy of human needs. There you go

647
00:43:06,396 --> 00:43:09,356
Speaker 1: so basically like once you've got various stuff to can

648
00:43:09,356 --> 00:43:12,356
Speaker 1: care of, so that's like survival, than we're going relationships,

649
00:43:12,396 --> 00:43:15,916
Speaker 1: than we're going up to relationships with other and then

650
00:43:15,996 --> 00:43:18,116
Speaker 1: we can go into the place where we can self actualize.

651
00:43:18,156 --> 00:43:21,556
Speaker 1: And I think that a lot of the developed world

652
00:43:21,716 --> 00:43:24,796
Speaker 1: is in that place right now. Are you just smuggling

653
00:43:24,836 --> 00:43:27,316
Speaker 1: therapy into people's lives by calling it coaching and making

654
00:43:27,316 --> 00:43:32,036
Speaker 1: them feel better about it? Well, actually, therapy is more

655
00:43:32,076 --> 00:43:34,876
Speaker 1: about things that have happened to you in the past

656
00:43:35,116 --> 00:43:37,996
Speaker 1: that you're trying to deal with, and coaching is really

657
00:43:38,036 --> 00:43:41,276
Speaker 1: about okay, going forward. You know, there's a saying which

658
00:43:41,396 --> 00:43:43,956
Speaker 1: is therapy is a path of tears and coaching is

659
00:43:43,956 --> 00:43:51,156
Speaker 1: the path of laughter. There was one other surprise in

660
00:43:51,196 --> 00:43:54,516
Speaker 1: all this. It occurred to me as I watched Dixie play.

661
00:43:54,676 --> 00:43:56,756
Speaker 1: It had taken me longer to notice, and I was

662
00:43:56,796 --> 00:43:59,156
Speaker 1: more hesitant to credit her inner game coach for it,

663
00:43:59,756 --> 00:44:05,076
Speaker 1: even though the change was entirely in her mind. It

664
00:44:05,236 --> 00:44:08,116
Speaker 1: seemed like she was aggressive there. Then had come to

665
00:44:08,116 --> 00:44:10,596
Speaker 1: Southern California on other business and I dragged him out

666
00:44:10,636 --> 00:44:13,236
Speaker 1: to see Dixie play. He said he didn't usually do

667
00:44:13,276 --> 00:44:15,276
Speaker 1: this because he got so wrapped up in outcomes and

668
00:44:15,316 --> 00:44:19,076
Speaker 1: started doing stuff that was counterproductive to his coaching, like cheering.

669
00:44:19,556 --> 00:44:22,476
Speaker 1: Praise was bad because it was still judge. Anyway, we

670
00:44:22,476 --> 00:44:24,836
Speaker 1: were standing along the left field fence, surrounded on all

671
00:44:24,876 --> 00:44:29,036
Speaker 1: sides by college scouts and anxious parents and screaming coaches.

672
00:44:29,836 --> 00:44:31,636
Speaker 1: Me trying not to care too much about what was

673
00:44:31,676 --> 00:44:35,196
Speaker 1: going on on the field. Ben actually not caring too much.

674
00:44:36,156 --> 00:44:39,156
Speaker 1: Since she started talking to you, she's been the two

675
00:44:39,196 --> 00:44:43,516
Speaker 1: things I've noticed. One is she's been much more aggressive

676
00:44:43,516 --> 00:44:46,636
Speaker 1: in the zone without losing her discipline. So her at

677
00:44:46,636 --> 00:44:49,556
Speaker 1: bats have been very good. The outcome has not always

678
00:44:49,596 --> 00:44:51,716
Speaker 1: been what she'd hope, but it's been fine. I mean,

679
00:44:51,756 --> 00:44:55,436
Speaker 1: she's hit well pretty well. But the other thing is

680
00:44:56,116 --> 00:45:00,116
Speaker 1: I think she's starting to learn not to be hard

681
00:45:00,116 --> 00:45:05,796
Speaker 1: on herself. It's our focus, and where I notice it

682
00:45:05,876 --> 00:45:09,076
Speaker 1: is it when she's hard on herself, it's an express

683
00:45:09,356 --> 00:45:11,996
Speaker 1: have a more general trait, which is she's very judgmental.

684
00:45:11,996 --> 00:45:14,916
Speaker 1: She's hard on a lot of people. She's critical, and

685
00:45:14,956 --> 00:45:17,116
Speaker 1: so she will sit there and be meant. She won't

686
00:45:17,156 --> 00:45:19,196
Speaker 1: say it, but she'll have thoughts about her, critical thoughts

687
00:45:19,196 --> 00:45:22,876
Speaker 1: about her teammates, and of course critical thoughts about her

688
00:45:22,876 --> 00:45:29,636
Speaker 1: parents and m and learning to take that off herself.

689
00:45:30,596 --> 00:45:34,476
Speaker 1: She's been noticeably nicer to me, like like all of

690
00:45:34,516 --> 00:45:37,676
Speaker 1: a sudden, Tabitha turn to me a couple of weeks

691
00:45:37,676 --> 00:45:40,516
Speaker 1: ago and said, who is this child? And so it's

692
00:45:40,956 --> 00:45:43,156
Speaker 1: I don't want to give you that much credit yet,

693
00:45:43,476 --> 00:45:45,596
Speaker 1: and who knows how long last. And I've not said

694
00:45:45,636 --> 00:45:47,796
Speaker 1: a word to her about any of this, but it's

695
00:45:47,796 --> 00:45:53,556
Speaker 1: been it's been really surprising to see just a little

696
00:45:53,556 --> 00:45:58,796
Speaker 1: bit of hesitation before she goes into the critical negative mode.

697
00:46:00,756 --> 00:46:06,476
Speaker 1: Winnings great, so's kindness. That kindness might help you to win. Well,

698
00:46:06,516 --> 00:46:12,116
Speaker 1: you gotta love that. It looks like we're playing fucking

699
00:46:12,236 --> 00:46:14,596
Speaker 1: a B tenant under team and it's two to nothing.

700
00:46:15,476 --> 00:46:18,276
Speaker 1: They are like seven hundred softball coaches in Northern California

701
00:46:18,276 --> 00:46:20,476
Speaker 1: that Dixie could have played for. There's a reason she

702
00:46:20,556 --> 00:46:24,596
Speaker 1: insists on playing for this particular coach. It's not always

703
00:46:24,596 --> 00:46:27,436
Speaker 1: easy or pleasant, but there's a point to it. Tim

704
00:46:27,476 --> 00:46:32,116
Speaker 1: Galway might say the coach was creating interference. Dixie would too,

705
00:46:32,396 --> 00:46:35,996
Speaker 1: but she thinks the interference is important to have you

706
00:46:36,156 --> 00:46:41,796
Speaker 1: know that's bullshit. That's a bullshit approach to life. We

707
00:46:41,876 --> 00:46:45,796
Speaker 1: can benefit from interference. We need coaches who teach us

708
00:46:45,796 --> 00:46:48,156
Speaker 1: how to be comfortable being uncomfortable in a way our

709
00:46:48,156 --> 00:46:51,516
Speaker 1: parents don't and probably shouldn't do. You need to stop

710
00:46:51,556 --> 00:46:53,556
Speaker 1: being a lazy piece of shit and get around the

711
00:46:53,596 --> 00:46:55,956
Speaker 1: ball and get your ass up and block and work

712
00:46:55,996 --> 00:46:59,396
Speaker 1: for your picture or I'm going to kick your ass.

713
00:46:59,436 --> 00:47:03,436
Speaker 1: Got its? The trick is to let their voice into

714
00:47:03,476 --> 00:47:06,516
Speaker 1: your head and then let it out again, use it,

715
00:47:07,036 --> 00:47:10,596
Speaker 1: learn from it, then learn to mute it. Yeah, Miya's

716
00:47:10,636 --> 00:47:18,636
Speaker 1: going to get ahead in account and throw so fast, Stayley,

717
00:47:18,756 --> 00:47:36,156
Speaker 1: so fast, luc agressive, blue senecrest. Oh, I'm Michael Lewis.

718
00:47:36,916 --> 00:47:40,516
Speaker 1: Thanks for listening to Against the Rules. Against the Rules

719
00:47:40,636 --> 00:47:43,996
Speaker 1: is brought to you by Pushkin Industries. The show's produced

720
00:47:44,036 --> 00:47:48,436
Speaker 1: by Audrey Dilling and Katherine Gerardo, with research assistance from Lydia,

721
00:47:48,516 --> 00:47:53,276
Speaker 1: Jane Cott, and Zooe Wynn. Our editor is Julia Barton.

722
00:47:53,996 --> 00:47:58,436
Speaker 1: Mia Lobell is our executive producer. Our theme was composed

723
00:47:58,436 --> 00:48:03,076
Speaker 1: by Nick Brittell, with additional scoring by Stellwagon Symphonette. We

724
00:48:03,196 --> 00:48:06,676
Speaker 1: got fact checked by Beth Johnson. Our show was recorded

725
00:48:06,676 --> 00:48:10,396
Speaker 1: by Tofa Ruth and Trey Schultz at Northgate Studios in Berkeley.

726
00:48:10,796 --> 00:48:13,476
Speaker 1: We got recording helped this episode in Milwaukee from Jaw

727
00:48:13,556 --> 00:48:18,196
Speaker 1: Media and Neo Soul Productions. Special thanks to Deputy Chief

728
00:48:18,276 --> 00:48:22,356
Speaker 1: Dan Lipski and Eric Nurnberg of the Milwaukee Fire Department

729
00:48:22,476 --> 00:48:26,516
Speaker 1: and Jason Brasler, Christopher g iSER, and Ralph Longo of

730
00:48:26,556 --> 00:48:31,036
Speaker 1: the New York City Fire Department. As always, thanks to

731
00:48:31,116 --> 00:48:34,636
Speaker 1: Pushkin's founders, without whom I would not exist, Jacob Weisberg

732
00:48:34,716 --> 00:48:40,276
Speaker 1: and Malcolm Gladwell. My dad is totally oblivious to it too,

733
00:48:40,316 --> 00:48:42,236
Speaker 1: Like he's just working out in the other room where

734
00:48:42,236 --> 00:48:44,756
Speaker 1: I was originally setting up recording. He's like, no, no, no,

735
00:48:44,796 --> 00:48:46,796
Speaker 1: you have to get out here. I'm working out, And

736
00:48:46,836 --> 00:48:49,756
Speaker 1: I was like, Dad, I'm doing this for you. Also

737
00:48:49,996 --> 00:48:55,316
Speaker 1: like I have this Mica, but yeah, I just switch

738
00:48:55,396 --> 00:49:09,676
Speaker 1: around everything. What are you doing? That's hilarious. No,