1
00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:17,320
Speaker 1: Crime Stories with Nancy Grace. A renowned chef is murdered.

2
00:00:18,360 --> 00:00:21,280
Speaker 1: But who did it? Of course that's the question. I'm

3
00:00:21,320 --> 00:00:24,160
Speaker 1: Nancy Grace, this is Crime Stories. Thank you for being

4
00:00:24,160 --> 00:00:28,080
Speaker 1: with us here at Fox Nation. And Sirius XM one eleven,

5
00:00:28,800 --> 00:00:31,520
Speaker 1: who is he? Listen to this? It's him. The last

6
00:00:31,600 --> 00:00:34,000
Speaker 1: thirty five years, I've had about one hundred and fifty

7
00:00:34,040 --> 00:00:38,760
Speaker 1: ventrom of gardens death by fineapple chutney, peach chutney, rubarb

8
00:00:38,840 --> 00:00:42,239
Speaker 1: ketchup team. I feel if people work with more ingredients,

9
00:00:42,280 --> 00:00:47,040
Speaker 1: they have a fuller understanding or what to do with them. Well,

10
00:00:47,120 --> 00:00:50,760
Speaker 1: that's our secret. That's a very secret process. One cuisine

11
00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:53,480
Speaker 1: for the rest of my life. Would I would opt

12
00:00:53,560 --> 00:00:57,320
Speaker 1: for Time cuisine? I think I would look some more way.

13
00:00:57,360 --> 00:01:02,040
Speaker 1: Who was great on that need? Something beside the letters

14
00:01:02,120 --> 00:01:06,400
Speaker 1: post to exit. I'd like to see the students compete

15
00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:09,200
Speaker 1: and the pure pressure that comes along from being in

16
00:01:09,319 --> 00:01:12,560
Speaker 1: a kitchen. I think we have done a kind of

17
00:01:12,600 --> 00:01:15,920
Speaker 1: a fun job of translating into the classroom. Kill look

18
00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:20,720
Speaker 1: more professional. You've got that diameter of chicken breast all

19
00:01:20,760 --> 00:01:24,280
Speaker 1: the way around, nice internal garnish scattering there, you know,

20
00:01:24,400 --> 00:01:26,800
Speaker 1: the eye catches all that color and shape is being

21
00:01:27,120 --> 00:01:31,440
Speaker 1: more flavorful. Toasting that crutime will give another dimension of

22
00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:35,200
Speaker 1: texture to this that the soft just reread won't. That

23
00:01:35,400 --> 00:01:39,320
Speaker 1: may sound like a cooking video like the ones I

24
00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:42,160
Speaker 1: see when I'm trying a new recipe, But what you're

25
00:01:42,280 --> 00:01:48,160
Speaker 1: actually hearing, in addition to analysis of various recipes, you're

26
00:01:48,240 --> 00:01:55,600
Speaker 1: hearing the voice of Daniel Brophy murdered. Not only was

27
00:01:55,680 --> 00:01:59,320
Speaker 1: he a renowned chef, he was a professor as well.

28
00:02:00,640 --> 00:02:04,560
Speaker 1: So how does he end up murder? No question about it.

29
00:02:04,640 --> 00:02:08,080
Speaker 1: He's murdered and who did it? Listen our fens at

30
00:02:08,160 --> 00:02:12,400
Speaker 1: koi n This is how most people remember Daniel Brophy.

31
00:02:12,760 --> 00:02:17,640
Speaker 1: A teacher, a chef, someone who cared about treating animals humanely.

32
00:02:20,560 --> 00:02:24,240
Speaker 1: Dominique Boza says she wouldn't have graduated the Oregan Culinary

33
00:02:24,400 --> 00:02:29,760
Speaker 1: Institute without his help. He was really tough. He was

34
00:02:29,840 --> 00:02:34,840
Speaker 1: really hard. He would call out some of the flaws

35
00:02:34,880 --> 00:02:37,320
Speaker 1: that you had so you can correct them. There was

36
00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:40,120
Speaker 1: a big flood that came down here and it buried

37
00:02:40,200 --> 00:02:43,480
Speaker 1: a bunch of things. She shared with us this video

38
00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:47,880
Speaker 1: of Brophy in his element knowledge, knowledge beyond belief. You

39
00:02:47,960 --> 00:02:50,840
Speaker 1: think you come into culinary school like wide eyed with

40
00:02:51,040 --> 00:02:54,120
Speaker 1: like the stream of being a chef, and he realizes, like,

41
00:02:54,160 --> 00:02:55,960
Speaker 1: you can do that. But there's a lot of things

42
00:02:56,000 --> 00:02:58,160
Speaker 1: you needed to know in between that. Just this weekend,

43
00:02:58,320 --> 00:03:01,240
Speaker 1: my son John David, and I were at a Greek

44
00:03:01,320 --> 00:03:06,760
Speaker 1: pastry shop and the lady was getting John David ordered

45
00:03:06,800 --> 00:03:08,840
Speaker 1: way too much, and the lady was getting it all

46
00:03:08,960 --> 00:03:13,239
Speaker 1: for him. And right beside her register was a big

47
00:03:13,360 --> 00:03:17,280
Speaker 1: picture of her And who I found out was her

48
00:03:17,400 --> 00:03:24,040
Speaker 1: son and a chef, and her son had won the

49
00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:32,560
Speaker 1: presidential award at the Culinary Institute. And I said, who

50
00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:34,880
Speaker 1: is that? And she said, that's my son, and she

51
00:03:35,120 --> 00:03:41,280
Speaker 1: was so proud. It was the epitome of years and

52
00:03:41,600 --> 00:03:47,880
Speaker 1: years at the best culinary institute in the world. And

53
00:03:48,160 --> 00:03:52,360
Speaker 1: here you see this chef beloved by all of his students,

54
00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:56,720
Speaker 1: or was he somebody didn't love him because he ends

55
00:03:56,800 --> 00:03:59,600
Speaker 1: up dead. So how did it all go down? Take

56
00:03:59,600 --> 00:04:10,080
Speaker 1: a listen, our cut four, our fancy kaight know exactly? Yeah,

57
00:04:12,680 --> 00:04:15,760
Speaker 1: a students, colleagues and loved ones gathered at the Oregon

58
00:04:15,840 --> 00:04:20,000
Speaker 1: Culinary Institute tonight to remember beloved chef Dan Brofy. He

59
00:04:20,120 --> 00:04:22,640
Speaker 1: was shot and killed over the weekend. Police still don't

60
00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:26,000
Speaker 1: know who killed him. Chef Dan Brophy ran Southless, Portland's

61
00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:29,560
Speaker 1: Oregon Culinary Institute. Students arriving for class the morning of

62
00:04:29,640 --> 00:04:33,159
Speaker 1: June second found Brofy dead inside the school. Is killer

63
00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:37,200
Speaker 1: nowhere to be found? Later that day, Nancy Crampton Brophy

64
00:04:37,400 --> 00:04:42,480
Speaker 1: appeared at a vigil. He was a person who he

65
00:04:42,600 --> 00:04:50,560
Speaker 1: loved teaching of fresh rooms. Nancy Crampton Brofy posted on

66
00:04:50,640 --> 00:04:53,120
Speaker 1: her Facebook page the next day a message announcing the

67
00:04:53,240 --> 00:04:56,600
Speaker 1: sad news of her husband's murder and added, I'm struggling

68
00:04:56,640 --> 00:04:59,000
Speaker 1: to make sense of everything right now. I'm just thinking

69
00:04:59,080 --> 00:05:02,440
Speaker 1: about how pri the owner of the pastry shop, was

70
00:05:02,600 --> 00:05:05,760
Speaker 1: that both she and her son, who will take over

71
00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:11,640
Speaker 1: the business someday, had graduated from Licourdon Blue, And thinking

72
00:05:11,640 --> 00:05:16,520
Speaker 1: about this chef taking all that time to teach his students,

73
00:05:16,640 --> 00:05:20,520
Speaker 1: take time with them, work with him, only for it

74
00:05:20,640 --> 00:05:25,080
Speaker 1: to end like this with me an all star panel

75
00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:28,120
Speaker 1: to make sense of what we know right now. Wendy Patrick,

76
00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:32,840
Speaker 1: California prosecutor, author of Red Flags, host of Today with

77
00:05:33,400 --> 00:05:36,599
Speaker 1: Doctor Wendy CASEYBQ and you can find her Wendy Patrick,

78
00:05:36,680 --> 00:05:40,279
Speaker 1: PhD dot com. Renowned psychologists joining us from the New

79
00:05:40,400 --> 00:05:44,920
Speaker 1: York Jurisdiction Karen is Stark at Karen Stark dot com.

80
00:05:45,240 --> 00:05:49,240
Speaker 1: Karen with a C. Lisa Daddio, former police lieutenant in

81
00:05:49,320 --> 00:05:53,040
Speaker 1: New Haven, now director of the Center for Advanced Policing

82
00:05:53,440 --> 00:05:59,040
Speaker 1: University New Haven's Forensic Science department. Doctor Tim Gallagher the

83
00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:03,039
Speaker 1: medical examine for the State of Florida. He has lecturer

84
00:06:03,200 --> 00:06:07,760
Speaker 1: University of Florida Medical School Forensic Medicine, and the founder

85
00:06:08,360 --> 00:06:13,120
Speaker 1: the International Forensic Medicine Death Investigation Conference. You can find

86
00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:16,040
Speaker 1: them at Pathcareman dot com. But first I want to

87
00:06:16,080 --> 00:06:22,359
Speaker 1: go to Zane Sparling, reported with The Oregonian and Oregon Live. Zane,

88
00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:24,520
Speaker 1: thank you for being with us. Let's start with the

89
00:06:24,680 --> 00:06:29,120
Speaker 1: discovery of the body of the chef Daniel Brothy. Tell

90
00:06:29,200 --> 00:06:32,160
Speaker 1: me about it. Yeah, this was a really horrific and

91
00:06:32,400 --> 00:06:35,240
Speaker 1: traumatic event for these students who were coming in for

92
00:06:35,480 --> 00:06:38,400
Speaker 1: their live fire day. That's the day where Chef Brothy

93
00:06:38,480 --> 00:06:43,840
Speaker 1: would have simulated an actual kitchen, shouting out orders, actually

94
00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:47,080
Speaker 1: getting these tickets done in a timely fashion. So everyone

95
00:06:47,240 --> 00:06:49,600
Speaker 1: was actually arriving early that day that they were so

96
00:06:49,760 --> 00:06:54,120
Speaker 1: excited for this live fire presentation. Instead, they come into

97
00:06:54,200 --> 00:07:00,760
Speaker 1: this classroom and really discover Brothy's body. Proud on the ground.

98
00:07:00,839 --> 00:07:03,960
Speaker 1: He's been shot twice once and the first shot was

99
00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:06,640
Speaker 1: from the back, so someone shot him from behind, and

100
00:07:06,760 --> 00:07:09,120
Speaker 1: then he was shot again after he fell over, and

101
00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:12,080
Speaker 1: one shot him again in the chest. And these students

102
00:07:12,120 --> 00:07:16,200
Speaker 1: are coming in. They're trying to perform CPR, but there's

103
00:07:16,280 --> 00:07:19,280
Speaker 1: there's blood seeping out of the wounds. They think maybe

104
00:07:19,320 --> 00:07:21,920
Speaker 1: they've broken one of these ribs. And one of his

105
00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:25,200
Speaker 1: fellow instructors is trying to squeeze his hands and maybe

106
00:07:25,240 --> 00:07:27,840
Speaker 1: he'll squeeze back, but of course he doesn't. About what

107
00:07:28,000 --> 00:07:30,200
Speaker 1: time of the morning was that, Zane Sparling, Yeah, this

108
00:07:30,320 --> 00:07:32,560
Speaker 1: was pretty early before class. I want to say it

109
00:07:32,680 --> 00:07:37,040
Speaker 1: was around eight thirty am. So if we know his

110
00:07:37,160 --> 00:07:40,280
Speaker 1: custom and habit, we know what time he typically got

111
00:07:40,400 --> 00:07:45,240
Speaker 1: to class. Guys were talking about the murder of very

112
00:07:45,280 --> 00:07:50,240
Speaker 1: well known chef Daniel Brothy, not only in his own right,

113
00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:54,440
Speaker 1: but he was also a professor, a professor at the

114
00:07:54,560 --> 00:07:59,840
Speaker 1: Oregon Culinary Institute, doctor Tim Gallagher. How can we determine

115
00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:04,680
Speaker 1: and based on the discovery of the body, how long

116
00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:08,840
Speaker 1: he's been dead? Well, good question, Nancy. One of the

117
00:08:08,960 --> 00:08:13,320
Speaker 1: things that we can do is to determine his body temperature.

118
00:08:13,560 --> 00:08:17,400
Speaker 1: So the body loses one degree per hour for every

119
00:08:17,640 --> 00:08:20,800
Speaker 1: hour that it's dead. Another thing we could determine his

120
00:08:21,120 --> 00:08:24,160
Speaker 1: rigor so or rigga mortis is the stiffening of the body.

121
00:08:24,640 --> 00:08:27,640
Speaker 1: So the body will start to stiffen about an hour

122
00:08:27,760 --> 00:08:32,240
Speaker 1: to ninety minutes after death. If the body is not

123
00:08:32,400 --> 00:08:34,719
Speaker 1: in riga mortis, then we know that the death has

124
00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:39,240
Speaker 1: occurred sooner than one hour's time. Once the body starts

125
00:08:39,280 --> 00:08:42,280
Speaker 1: cooling down, does the body then stay at the ambyond

126
00:08:42,320 --> 00:08:45,760
Speaker 1: temperature of the room or does it decrease from that temperature?

127
00:08:46,120 --> 00:08:48,840
Speaker 1: It could only stay at the ambyond temperature of the room.

128
00:08:48,960 --> 00:08:52,120
Speaker 1: So if the room is a seventy two degrees, the

129
00:08:52,200 --> 00:08:55,040
Speaker 1: body will cool down one degree per hour until it

130
00:08:55,120 --> 00:08:58,319
Speaker 1: reaches seventy two degrees and then if the cooling process

131
00:08:58,360 --> 00:09:00,480
Speaker 1: will stop right there. What do you think about this

132
00:09:00,880 --> 00:09:05,000
Speaker 1: mode of death? Of course, there is the cause of death,

133
00:09:05,440 --> 00:09:09,880
Speaker 1: which would be gunshot wound. The manner of death would

134
00:09:09,880 --> 00:09:14,120
Speaker 1: be let's say I think they're five. There's accident, there's

135
00:09:14,320 --> 00:09:19,360
Speaker 1: natural causes which obviously this is not natural causes. There

136
00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:27,000
Speaker 1: is undetermined, and there's homicide. Am I missing one? Suicide? Yes, suicide,

137
00:09:27,360 --> 00:09:30,120
Speaker 1: so obviously it's not suicide. Because he was shot in

138
00:09:30,160 --> 00:09:34,800
Speaker 1: the back. Obviously it's not accident, because there's no weapon

139
00:09:34,920 --> 00:09:39,000
Speaker 1: around when these students get there. Obviously it's not natural causes.

140
00:09:39,320 --> 00:09:43,400
Speaker 1: So that only leads me homicide. It does right, and

141
00:09:43,480 --> 00:09:45,760
Speaker 1: once all the other modes of death or manners of

142
00:09:45,880 --> 00:09:48,240
Speaker 1: death are removed, the one that you are left with

143
00:09:48,520 --> 00:09:52,079
Speaker 1: is the one that you are required to put on

144
00:09:52,160 --> 00:09:54,679
Speaker 1: the death certificate. Let me ask you a question. This

145
00:09:54,960 --> 00:09:58,360
Speaker 1: is more of an anecdotal question, doctor Tim Gallagher. I've

146
00:09:58,440 --> 00:10:02,360
Speaker 1: seen people managed to met suicide with a long gun before,

147
00:10:02,880 --> 00:10:07,080
Speaker 1: where they rigged the gun, for instance, with a string

148
00:10:07,320 --> 00:10:10,880
Speaker 1: attached to their toe, and they hold the gun pointed

149
00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:15,360
Speaker 1: to them and they manage in some fantastical way to

150
00:10:15,400 --> 00:10:19,200
Speaker 1: commit suicide. That's few and far between. You ever seen

151
00:10:19,240 --> 00:10:23,000
Speaker 1: a suicide where the victims shot themselves in a back

152
00:10:23,160 --> 00:10:26,040
Speaker 1: I am not. Oh. The only one I've seen was

153
00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:29,640
Speaker 1: where some female had shot themselves in the back of

154
00:10:29,760 --> 00:10:34,119
Speaker 1: the head because they wanted their face to be presentable

155
00:10:34,280 --> 00:10:37,920
Speaker 1: during their funeral. But how did she do that? How

156
00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:39,560
Speaker 1: does she shoot herself in the back of the head.

157
00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:42,320
Speaker 1: You mean the direct back of the head or at

158
00:10:42,360 --> 00:10:45,480
Speaker 1: an angle. This was a direct back of the head

159
00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:48,760
Speaker 1: and she used a very small snub nosed twenty two

160
00:10:48,840 --> 00:10:51,520
Speaker 1: caliber gun to do so, so it was very easy

161
00:10:51,559 --> 00:10:55,400
Speaker 1: to do that. But no, as far as suicide goes,

162
00:10:56,160 --> 00:10:58,640
Speaker 1: typically they're on the side of the head, sometimes in

163
00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:01,360
Speaker 1: the forehead, under the chin, in the mouth, but very

164
00:11:01,480 --> 00:11:03,800
Speaker 1: very rarely. And I believe that was my only case

165
00:11:04,400 --> 00:11:06,800
Speaker 1: of a gunshot wound to the back of the head.

166
00:11:07,160 --> 00:11:09,360
Speaker 1: And I would not have known that if the gun

167
00:11:09,520 --> 00:11:12,640
Speaker 1: wasn't laying there. And she wrote a suicide note detailing

168
00:11:12,720 --> 00:11:16,719
Speaker 1: what she wanted after she expired. Let me thank The

169
00:11:16,880 --> 00:11:21,480
Speaker 1: question was, have you ever seen a suicide where someone

170
00:11:21,640 --> 00:11:26,959
Speaker 1: was shot in the back, where a suicide victim shot

171
00:11:27,040 --> 00:11:29,800
Speaker 1: themselves in the back? I mean, I can't even figure

172
00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:33,360
Speaker 1: out how they would do that without some sort of contraption, right,

173
00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:34,920
Speaker 1: that would be a novel one to me, I have

174
00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:50,120
Speaker 1: not seen that, nor have I heard that time stories

175
00:11:50,160 --> 00:11:54,199
Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace. Okay, we're going off on a tangent.

176
00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:57,080
Speaker 1: And I was the one that took us there, because

177
00:11:57,559 --> 00:12:00,360
Speaker 1: if there had been a suicide in that matter, the

178
00:12:00,480 --> 00:12:04,680
Speaker 1: contraption would still be there. So needless to say, okay, there,

179
00:12:05,320 --> 00:12:08,480
Speaker 1: I went off on this for a reason. To Lisa Daddio,

180
00:12:09,160 --> 00:12:13,480
Speaker 1: think about it. He's obviously shot first in the back

181
00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:19,520
Speaker 1: because he's found lying on his back, face up. Then

182
00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:23,920
Speaker 1: he shot in the chest. It's as if somebody wanted

183
00:12:23,920 --> 00:12:27,679
Speaker 1: to make sure he's dead, but they didn't want to

184
00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:32,360
Speaker 1: shoot him in the head in the face. Interesting, right, absolutely?

185
00:12:33,679 --> 00:12:35,520
Speaker 1: You know, I would think that the first shot to

186
00:12:35,640 --> 00:12:40,199
Speaker 1: the back was probably maybe initially as an attempt so

187
00:12:40,400 --> 00:12:43,920
Speaker 1: that he didn't see who was shooting him, and then

188
00:12:44,000 --> 00:12:46,000
Speaker 1: the second shot would have been to make sure that

189
00:12:46,160 --> 00:12:49,719
Speaker 1: he in fact was deceased. Now, let's think about that.

190
00:12:50,040 --> 00:12:53,160
Speaker 1: Think about it, Karen Stark, I think we need a shrink, Karen,

191
00:12:53,800 --> 00:12:58,559
Speaker 1: think about the mindset required to shoot somebody in the

192
00:12:58,640 --> 00:13:05,120
Speaker 1: back and then walk over, turn them over and gahoo,

193
00:13:06,400 --> 00:13:09,640
Speaker 1: I'm not sure he's really dead. Kind of make sure

194
00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:14,880
Speaker 1: he's really really really dead, as they say in the

195
00:13:14,920 --> 00:13:18,959
Speaker 1: Wizard of Oz, is she really really truly dead? So

196
00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:22,920
Speaker 1: then with the guy probably looking them in the face,

197
00:13:25,120 --> 00:13:28,640
Speaker 1: put another cap on them. Total disregard for the person

198
00:13:28,760 --> 00:13:33,439
Speaker 1: that's being killed. Absolutely know, maybe at first, shooting from

199
00:13:33,520 --> 00:13:36,640
Speaker 1: behind that makes sense. You don't want them to see you,

200
00:13:37,679 --> 00:13:40,560
Speaker 1: you have some feelings, But then you turn them over

201
00:13:41,360 --> 00:13:44,800
Speaker 1: and think maybe they're alive. So you shoot them again.

202
00:13:45,320 --> 00:13:51,280
Speaker 1: You could care less about this person. No feelings, Nancy,

203
00:13:51,880 --> 00:13:55,360
Speaker 1: absolutely no connection to this person that they killed. So

204
00:13:55,480 --> 00:13:58,400
Speaker 1: I guess the very first thing is ain't sparling joining us?

205
00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:00,680
Speaker 1: Oh hold on, they't let me throw this. Wendy Patrick,

206
00:14:00,760 --> 00:14:04,480
Speaker 1: California Prosecutor. I guess the first thing they would do,

207
00:14:04,920 --> 00:14:09,040
Speaker 1: cops would be to close down the campus, close down

208
00:14:09,080 --> 00:14:13,120
Speaker 1: the building. If the killer still in the building, you

209
00:14:13,200 --> 00:14:17,440
Speaker 1: would want to trap them in there. And it's bringing

210
00:14:17,520 --> 00:14:20,840
Speaker 1: to mind the case I believe. Would you look the

211
00:14:20,880 --> 00:14:26,880
Speaker 1: subject Anna Lee? Yeah, Lisa Daddio, you worked on that case,

212
00:14:27,560 --> 00:14:33,600
Speaker 1: Wendy Patrick. Anna Lee went into the building at her

213
00:14:33,720 --> 00:14:37,960
Speaker 1: university where she was a researcher, super smart, and she

214
00:14:38,120 --> 00:14:41,560
Speaker 1: never came back out. And one of the first things

215
00:14:41,640 --> 00:14:45,240
Speaker 1: they did was start cold everybody in the building find

216
00:14:45,280 --> 00:14:49,000
Speaker 1: out who was there. Then they started using keycard evidence

217
00:14:49,040 --> 00:14:51,040
Speaker 1: to figure out who had gone in and out of

218
00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:55,720
Speaker 1: the building. So I guess in this case. Oh and

219
00:14:55,800 --> 00:14:57,560
Speaker 1: by the way, she never left the building. The killer

220
00:14:57,680 --> 00:15:00,800
Speaker 1: put her in a wall. Isn't that right, Lisa Daddio, Yes,

221
00:15:00,880 --> 00:15:04,120
Speaker 1: it is Nancy. So in this case, Wendy Patrick, I

222
00:15:04,160 --> 00:15:06,080
Speaker 1: guess the very first thing I would do is stop

223
00:15:06,240 --> 00:15:09,200
Speaker 1: anybody from leaving that building, Pronti, and in fact the

224
00:15:09,240 --> 00:15:13,400
Speaker 1: whole campus. Yeah. Absolutely, that's absolutely the number one best

225
00:15:13,440 --> 00:15:15,840
Speaker 1: way to make sure that God forbid at the shooter

226
00:15:15,960 --> 00:15:18,400
Speaker 1: is still there, still arm dangerous, that we make sure

227
00:15:18,480 --> 00:15:20,880
Speaker 1: that we get him or her. You know, I was

228
00:15:20,920 --> 00:15:23,880
Speaker 1: thinking about the way this came down a little differently.

229
00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:26,080
Speaker 1: You know, we don't know that the shooters shot in

230
00:15:26,160 --> 00:15:28,600
Speaker 1: the back and then turned the body over. It could

231
00:15:28,640 --> 00:15:30,720
Speaker 1: be the shooter shot in the back to disarm and

232
00:15:30,840 --> 00:15:34,560
Speaker 1: disable this beloved chef and professor, and then the professor

233
00:15:34,720 --> 00:15:36,720
Speaker 1: ended up trying to get up turning over, and then

234
00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:39,880
Speaker 1: of course the final kill shot was administered. So just

235
00:15:40,160 --> 00:15:43,760
Speaker 1: looking at the positioning and the original scene, obviously, yes,

236
00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:45,760
Speaker 1: of course you're going to do all the lockdown, but

237
00:15:45,960 --> 00:15:48,920
Speaker 1: then we're going to have to really start out from

238
00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:52,440
Speaker 1: there trying to decide how exactly this happened and how

239
00:15:52,520 --> 00:15:54,760
Speaker 1: exactly because that's going to help us not only find

240
00:15:54,800 --> 00:15:56,920
Speaker 1: the suspect, but find motives. I gotta tell you, just

241
00:15:57,000 --> 00:16:01,520
Speaker 1: maybe thank something, Wendy Patrick. I remember the Fulton County

242
00:16:01,560 --> 00:16:07,320
Speaker 1: courthouse shooting. They're multiple victims. They had to rope off

243
00:16:07,400 --> 00:16:11,080
Speaker 1: the courtroom where several of my friends were shot dead.

244
00:16:12,200 --> 00:16:16,520
Speaker 1: It took them literally days to process the crime scene.

245
00:16:17,400 --> 00:16:19,840
Speaker 1: And I remember one of my best friends in the office,

246
00:16:19,920 --> 00:16:25,960
Speaker 1: al co prosecutor with me, was called in to help

247
00:16:26,200 --> 00:16:31,600
Speaker 1: the medical examiners, investigators homicide process the scene and it

248
00:16:31,760 --> 00:16:35,400
Speaker 1: was excruciating for him to have to process the scene

249
00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:38,880
Speaker 1: where our friends were murdered. And I'm just thinking about

250
00:16:39,080 --> 00:16:43,360
Speaker 1: all the students there as they're processing the scene like

251
00:16:43,480 --> 00:16:46,720
Speaker 1: you just described. Zane Sparling joined me from the Oregonian

252
00:16:46,840 --> 00:16:50,480
Speaker 1: and Oregon Live dot com. Zane, what was the first

253
00:16:50,560 --> 00:16:53,560
Speaker 1: thing cops did to try to identify the shooter? Nswer?

254
00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:55,520
Speaker 1: They did a couple of things. First, they were looking

255
00:16:55,560 --> 00:16:58,080
Speaker 1: to see whether this could have been a random robbery

256
00:16:58,120 --> 00:16:59,920
Speaker 1: and burglary, and they were able to rule that out

257
00:17:00,120 --> 00:17:03,720
Speaker 1: pretty quickly because they noticed that chef Dan Bropy still

258
00:17:03,760 --> 00:17:06,240
Speaker 1: had his wallet, had his keys, had his phone. There's

259
00:17:06,240 --> 00:17:10,600
Speaker 1: some valuable kitchen supplies and equipment there in the Colonna institude,

260
00:17:10,600 --> 00:17:13,280
Speaker 1: and all that stuff was essentially untouched. They found all

261
00:17:13,280 --> 00:17:15,679
Speaker 1: of that remaining at the scene. And the next thing

262
00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:18,479
Speaker 1: they were really doing is looking first to get these

263
00:17:18,520 --> 00:17:21,040
Speaker 1: students away from the crime scene. They had them all

264
00:17:21,080 --> 00:17:23,080
Speaker 1: at a separate room, and they had their put their

265
00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:24,880
Speaker 1: hands on top of the table so that they could

266
00:17:25,600 --> 00:17:28,760
Speaker 1: interview these people separately. And they're also looking for surveillance

267
00:17:28,800 --> 00:17:32,400
Speaker 1: footage and what they their hands on top of the table. Yeah,

268
00:17:32,600 --> 00:17:34,360
Speaker 1: I can tell you why they did that in case

269
00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:36,879
Speaker 1: the part was still there and had a gun, and

270
00:17:37,640 --> 00:17:41,200
Speaker 1: to try and preserve their hands in case one of

271
00:17:41,240 --> 00:17:44,680
Speaker 1: them was a shooter, so they could get GSR gunshot

272
00:17:44,760 --> 00:17:48,120
Speaker 1: residue off their hands or the cuffs of their shirts.

273
00:17:48,840 --> 00:17:50,600
Speaker 1: And I mean almost all it takes is for you

274
00:17:50,680 --> 00:17:54,760
Speaker 1: to go rub your hands. It's like baby powder. It's gone.

275
00:17:55,359 --> 00:17:59,480
Speaker 1: So I'm sure they wanted all their hands visible. Okay,

276
00:17:59,560 --> 00:18:01,680
Speaker 1: go ahead. The only other thing that they were able

277
00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:04,359
Speaker 1: to pull is that there were no crime There were

278
00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:09,840
Speaker 1: no surveillance cameras in the institute either inside. There no camera,

279
00:18:10,040 --> 00:18:14,720
Speaker 1: no footage, and no witnesses. Okay, wait a minute, that's

280
00:18:14,840 --> 00:18:19,960
Speaker 1: on my list to ask you were there surveillance cams

281
00:18:20,000 --> 00:18:22,560
Speaker 1: and you're saying no, there were no cameras. They were

282
00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:26,040
Speaker 1: able to pull some footage from nearby streets because there

283
00:18:26,080 --> 00:18:29,520
Speaker 1: are some light rail train stations in the area and

284
00:18:29,640 --> 00:18:33,040
Speaker 1: those have cameras, but nothing showing people going in and

285
00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:36,680
Speaker 1: out of the building itself, or what happened inside. I

286
00:18:36,840 --> 00:18:40,159
Speaker 1: know you'd think this day and age saying that they

287
00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:45,320
Speaker 1: would have security cams out the ying Yang. Another question

288
00:18:45,359 --> 00:18:47,760
Speaker 1: to you, doctor Tim Gallagher. I'm thinking about time of death,

289
00:18:47,800 --> 00:18:51,679
Speaker 1: which is so crucial here. Okay, so the dead body

290
00:18:51,920 --> 00:18:55,160
Speaker 1: is lying there, it goes into rigor. Let's just say

291
00:18:55,520 --> 00:18:59,200
Speaker 1: hour to ninety minutes after it goes into rigor, after

292
00:18:59,280 --> 00:19:03,520
Speaker 1: a certain stiffening, After a certain time in rigor, do

293
00:19:03,800 --> 00:19:08,560
Speaker 1: the limbs then loosen up on their own? Yes, they do, Nancy.

294
00:19:08,720 --> 00:19:11,640
Speaker 1: A rigor depending on of course, the ambient temperature will

295
00:19:11,720 --> 00:19:15,359
Speaker 1: last from about twenty four to about thirty six hours

296
00:19:15,480 --> 00:19:20,040
Speaker 1: or so, and then after that the muscles will relax,

297
00:19:20,280 --> 00:19:27,360
Speaker 1: the body will become again floppy, and then riggor would

298
00:19:27,400 --> 00:19:30,840
Speaker 1: have already passed. So if there's no rigor, it will

299
00:19:30,960 --> 00:19:33,440
Speaker 1: usually mean that the body has not been dead longer

300
00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:36,200
Speaker 1: than an hour, or the body has been dead longer

301
00:19:36,280 --> 00:19:39,680
Speaker 1: than thirty six hours to go beyond the rigor. The

302
00:19:39,800 --> 00:19:41,440
Speaker 1: reason I'm asking is, I'm trying to set up a

303
00:19:41,480 --> 00:19:44,159
Speaker 1: timeline here. But we know it hadn't been twenty four

304
00:19:44,200 --> 00:19:46,479
Speaker 1: hours because he was seen the night before. All right.

305
00:19:46,760 --> 00:19:50,440
Speaker 1: So the case progresses in Zane sparling, they get nothing

306
00:19:50,560 --> 00:19:56,399
Speaker 1: from the students, No secret love affair, no anger between

307
00:19:56,480 --> 00:20:01,280
Speaker 1: the students and Professor Brothy, nothing like that. Correct, that's correct.

308
00:20:01,320 --> 00:20:04,400
Speaker 1: He was beloved. You know, when you find out a professor,

309
00:20:04,520 --> 00:20:09,280
Speaker 1: a male professor, has been gunned down at school, many

310
00:20:09,320 --> 00:20:12,320
Speaker 1: people immediately think h's having an affair with a student

311
00:20:12,359 --> 00:20:16,520
Speaker 1: and all went wrong. That there was nothing like that here,

312
00:20:17,000 --> 00:20:22,680
Speaker 1: but they did notice this. Take a listen to our

313
00:20:22,800 --> 00:20:27,800
Speaker 1: cut eighteen. This is Lindsay natrid AKGW eight. Nancy has

314
00:20:27,800 --> 00:20:30,879
Speaker 1: written several novels, and in twenty eleven also wrote an

315
00:20:30,960 --> 00:20:34,119
Speaker 1: essay called how to Murder Your Husband. In it, she writes,

316
00:20:34,280 --> 00:20:36,760
Speaker 1: I find it as easier to wish people dead than

317
00:20:36,840 --> 00:20:39,560
Speaker 1: to actually kill them. I don't want to worry about

318
00:20:39,600 --> 00:20:43,480
Speaker 1: blood and brains splattered on my walls, and really I'm

319
00:20:43,560 --> 00:20:46,080
Speaker 1: not good at remembering lies. But the thing I know

320
00:20:46,160 --> 00:20:48,800
Speaker 1: about murder is that every one of us has it

321
00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:54,480
Speaker 1: in him or her when pushed far enough. Zane, who

322
00:20:54,600 --> 00:21:00,800
Speaker 1: is Nancy? Nancy is chef Daniel Brokey's wife of many years.

323
00:21:01,119 --> 00:21:06,840
Speaker 1: You know what's interesting. I've seen a lot of homicide scenes,

324
00:21:07,000 --> 00:21:11,320
Speaker 1: and I've written a lot of books about murders murder mysteries,

325
00:21:11,920 --> 00:21:16,840
Speaker 1: but I've never actually even thought once, even once until

326
00:21:16,920 --> 00:21:21,480
Speaker 1: right now, about having blood quote blood and brains splattered

327
00:21:21,560 --> 00:21:25,680
Speaker 1: on my walls. Now, I will tell you this. When

328
00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:32,080
Speaker 1: I write murder mysteries, my husband David, of course, it's

329
00:21:32,119 --> 00:21:37,640
Speaker 1: forced to read them. And in one scene, I had

330
00:21:37,800 --> 00:21:43,480
Speaker 1: a victim killed at Gatorland, and as it just so

331
00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:48,640
Speaker 1: happened that following summer, we took the twins to Gatorland

332
00:21:48,720 --> 00:21:51,879
Speaker 1: or gator World or whatever it's called. And my husband,

333
00:21:51,880 --> 00:21:55,440
Speaker 1: before he got out of the car, asked me, was

334
00:21:55,520 --> 00:21:58,160
Speaker 1: this a setup? Of course it was not. He's still

335
00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:01,359
Speaker 1: alive and with us. But you know, that's a pretty

336
00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:05,640
Speaker 1: damning thing for his wife to write and then how

337
00:22:06,359 --> 00:22:12,320
Speaker 1: to murder your husband, and then her husband ends up murdered. Right,

338
00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:15,960
Speaker 1: So who brought that to the attention of police? I'm curious. Well,

339
00:22:16,040 --> 00:22:19,240
Speaker 1: it's actually something that we reported first in the Oregonian,

340
00:22:19,680 --> 00:22:24,800
Speaker 1: and so you came up with and congratulations, congratulations a

341
00:22:24,840 --> 00:22:27,160
Speaker 1: different reporter. But I can't take all the credits. I'm

342
00:22:27,200 --> 00:22:29,320
Speaker 1: just still giving you the credit. That's very modest of

343
00:22:29,440 --> 00:22:35,280
Speaker 1: Usane's barling. So the Oregonian first dug it up. Well,

344
00:22:35,800 --> 00:22:42,840
Speaker 1: it wasn't just her novels full of sex and romance

345
00:22:43,000 --> 00:22:48,640
Speaker 1: with steamy, hot body scenes, but there was more. Take

346
00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:53,359
Speaker 1: a listen to our Fancy Katu. Two investigators say Nancy

347
00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:57,080
Speaker 1: Brophy lied about where she was the morning her husband's

348
00:22:57,119 --> 00:23:00,600
Speaker 1: body was found here at the Oregon Culinary Institute. They

349
00:23:00,680 --> 00:23:04,000
Speaker 1: also say she lied about life insurance. This is the

350
00:23:04,200 --> 00:23:07,560
Speaker 1: article Portland police say Nancy Brophy wrote and posted in

351
00:23:07,640 --> 00:23:11,720
Speaker 1: twenty eleven entitled how to Murder your husband. Daniel and

352
00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:15,119
Speaker 1: Nancy shared a joint iTunes account and that someone on

353
00:23:15,240 --> 00:23:18,840
Speaker 1: it had recently bookmarked an article titled ten ways to

354
00:23:19,000 --> 00:23:23,480
Speaker 1: cover up a murder. Okay, Wendy Patrick to self, do

355
00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:28,440
Speaker 1: not share it account with murder victim. Well, not only that,

356
00:23:28,800 --> 00:23:30,920
Speaker 1: you know, you have to think about why somebody would

357
00:23:30,960 --> 00:23:33,760
Speaker 1: be researching these things to begin with. Now her out

358
00:23:33,840 --> 00:23:36,360
Speaker 1: would be well, I'm a novel as they create fiction.

359
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:40,359
Speaker 1: But that may be true, but still the interest in

360
00:23:40,520 --> 00:23:44,000
Speaker 1: some of these topics gets a little dark, especially when

361
00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:47,600
Speaker 1: thinking that everybody feels this way, as you just mentioned.

362
00:23:47,680 --> 00:24:03,280
Speaker 1: So that's a big that's a big clue. Crime stories

363
00:24:03,320 --> 00:24:10,280
Speaker 1: with Nancy Grace Karen start Wendy Patrick has a point.

364
00:24:10,359 --> 00:24:12,920
Speaker 1: If you were to look at my laptop, you would

365
00:24:12,920 --> 00:24:18,119
Speaker 1: see all sorts of searches about poisons and bodies and

366
00:24:18,680 --> 00:24:25,040
Speaker 1: just all sorts of info related to murder. So a

367
00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:29,680
Speaker 1: computer searches not a murder case. Make that that's true, Nancy,

368
00:24:30,240 --> 00:24:33,399
Speaker 1: and I guess if you are writing a novel or

369
00:24:33,720 --> 00:24:36,760
Speaker 1: about that, you would find that. But if you keep

370
00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:42,600
Speaker 1: finding specific things about murdering a husband and your husband

371
00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:48,840
Speaker 1: is murdered, then then you have to wonder what's going

372
00:24:48,960 --> 00:24:52,879
Speaker 1: on that this person is looking for twenty ways to

373
00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:59,200
Speaker 1: murder your husband or a murder. I don't agree. I

374
00:24:59,640 --> 00:25:02,240
Speaker 1: think that the reason why she would write that everybody

375
00:25:02,359 --> 00:25:07,080
Speaker 1: is capable of murder if pushed fly enough, because that

376
00:25:07,400 --> 00:25:12,439
Speaker 1: is not true, absolutely not true. So somewhere in her

377
00:25:12,640 --> 00:25:15,959
Speaker 1: brain she knew she was capable of murder and projected

378
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:18,800
Speaker 1: it onto everybody else. Well, put Karen Stock and I

379
00:25:18,880 --> 00:25:21,520
Speaker 1: agree with you, to doctor Tim Gallagh or how long

380
00:25:21,680 --> 00:25:24,120
Speaker 1: since this was not a shot in the head, how

381
00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:28,159
Speaker 1: long do you think Chef Brothy would have lain there died. Well,

382
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:30,040
Speaker 1: getting shot by a rifle is a lot different than

383
00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:32,679
Speaker 1: getting shot by a handgun. A rifle has a more

384
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:36,720
Speaker 1: powerful bullet and it causes a lot more damage. When

385
00:25:36,760 --> 00:25:39,680
Speaker 1: the bullet went entered into his body, most likely it

386
00:25:39,800 --> 00:25:43,199
Speaker 1: broke a rib or another bone. That those bones charge

387
00:25:43,240 --> 00:25:46,159
Speaker 1: went into the lungs, they went into the heart. The

388
00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:48,119
Speaker 1: bullet continued through the rest of the body and did

389
00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:51,760
Speaker 1: even more damage. I would estimate that he was probably

390
00:25:52,080 --> 00:25:56,119
Speaker 1: conscious no longer than thirty seconds. You know after the

391
00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:59,040
Speaker 1: initial gunshot. Will thirty seconds is long enough to lay

392
00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:03,640
Speaker 1: in the floor. And now you're you know, so it's

393
00:26:03,800 --> 00:26:08,000
Speaker 1: you zaying sparling at the Oregonian and Oreganlive dot com.

394
00:26:08,720 --> 00:26:12,080
Speaker 1: You guys got in the ball rolling when you dug

395
00:26:12,400 --> 00:26:17,800
Speaker 1: up the wife's article on how to murder your husband

396
00:26:18,200 --> 00:26:21,639
Speaker 1: her essay. But it's not just the article, it's not

397
00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:25,920
Speaker 1: just her novels about sex and murder. Take a listen

398
00:26:25,960 --> 00:26:29,400
Speaker 1: to our cut twenty our Fancy Katu Tube. Investigators say

399
00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:32,399
Speaker 1: Nancy told them she'd bought a nine millimeter pistol at

400
00:26:32,440 --> 00:26:36,080
Speaker 1: a gun show in February twenty eighteen. They say the

401
00:26:36,160 --> 00:26:39,880
Speaker 1: two bullets that hit Daniel Brophy did not match that gun,

402
00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:43,240
Speaker 1: but investigators say they later discovered Nancy had bought a

403
00:26:43,359 --> 00:26:47,360
Speaker 1: kit online from ghostguns dot Com to make a similar,

404
00:26:47,520 --> 00:26:51,040
Speaker 1: untraceable version of the pistol. They also say she bought

405
00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:54,159
Speaker 1: gun parts like a slide barrel online and that the

406
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:58,439
Speaker 1: gun end accessories match the bullets that hit Daniel. Police

407
00:26:58,480 --> 00:27:01,359
Speaker 1: also say Nancy lied to about her location the morning

408
00:27:01,440 --> 00:27:04,119
Speaker 1: Daniel was found. They say she told them she was

409
00:27:04,160 --> 00:27:07,560
Speaker 1: at her Beavergeon home when surveillance videos showed her driving

410
00:27:07,600 --> 00:27:11,640
Speaker 1: her minivan on Jefferson outside the Culinary Institute the four

411
00:27:11,760 --> 00:27:15,800
Speaker 1: Daniel's body was found. Investigators also saying Nancy told them

412
00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:18,920
Speaker 1: she'd taken out a forty thousand dollars life insurance policy

413
00:27:19,000 --> 00:27:21,760
Speaker 1: on Daniel. They say they later discovered she was a

414
00:27:21,880 --> 00:27:25,000
Speaker 1: beneficiary of several policies valued at more than three hundred

415
00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:29,159
Speaker 1: and fifty thousand bucks three hundred and fifty thousand dollars. Okay,

416
00:27:29,520 --> 00:27:35,480
Speaker 1: the lying Zane Sparling joining us from The Oregonian. When

417
00:27:35,640 --> 00:27:41,000
Speaker 1: someone lies, it paints every other thing they do with

418
00:27:41,240 --> 00:27:47,560
Speaker 1: a nefarious stroke. Why would she lie and what exactly

419
00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:52,040
Speaker 1: is a ghost gun? Explain it to us, Zane sure

420
00:27:52,160 --> 00:27:56,439
Speaker 1: will Now, the defense attorney for Nancy Brokey is going

421
00:27:56,520 --> 00:27:58,719
Speaker 1: to bring an argument in court right now in these

422
00:27:58,760 --> 00:28:02,680
Speaker 1: coming days that due to the trauma she'd experienced. That

423
00:28:02,880 --> 00:28:06,399
Speaker 1: Nancy Brophy had gaps in her memory. But what the

424
00:28:06,560 --> 00:28:09,600
Speaker 1: prosecution is talking about is that Nancy had access to

425
00:28:09,720 --> 00:28:12,240
Speaker 1: multiple guns. There was that glock pistol that was mentioned

426
00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:15,399
Speaker 1: just a moment ago. Now they found that gun in

427
00:28:15,560 --> 00:28:17,959
Speaker 1: the house, but they noticed that the barrel had been

428
00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:21,440
Speaker 1: replaced right the barrels, which gives those markings that forensic

429
00:28:21,560 --> 00:28:24,160
Speaker 1: experts can use to match the bullet to the gun.

430
00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:27,359
Speaker 1: The barrel had been replaced inexpert bly, it was not

431
00:28:28,320 --> 00:28:30,680
Speaker 1: the same barrel that hadn't been put on right. And

432
00:28:31,240 --> 00:28:33,239
Speaker 1: she had actually bought a ghost gun too, right, that's

433
00:28:33,280 --> 00:28:37,240
Speaker 1: an untraceable, no serial number, no federal tracking. You just

434
00:28:37,440 --> 00:28:39,720
Speaker 1: put in your credit card online and someone sends you

435
00:28:39,800 --> 00:28:42,640
Speaker 1: a kit to build a gun. But it's actually very

436
00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:45,880
Speaker 1: complicated to build a ghost gun, and Nancy, who was

437
00:28:45,880 --> 00:28:48,560
Speaker 1: a writer, did not have the tools or the skills

438
00:28:48,640 --> 00:28:51,280
Speaker 1: necessary to actually build it. So the gun was found.

439
00:28:51,520 --> 00:28:54,360
Speaker 1: The ghost gun was recovered by police, but it was

440
00:28:54,440 --> 00:28:58,560
Speaker 1: never assembled, And the defense attorneys are actually claiming that

441
00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:01,040
Speaker 1: she bought it for research, right, because she's a romance

442
00:29:01,080 --> 00:29:03,840
Speaker 1: and crime novelist, so they're saying this was just part

443
00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:09,280
Speaker 1: of her writing process. Buying a ghost gun. Specifically, a

444
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:15,480
Speaker 1: ghost gun is designed to avoid all gun laws. They

445
00:29:15,560 --> 00:29:21,880
Speaker 1: are untraceable, they are unserialized, like on your car, for instance,

446
00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:25,320
Speaker 1: you've got a vin v I N number. It's like

447
00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:29,160
Speaker 1: a fingerprint to your car, and they're very hard to remove.

448
00:29:29,360 --> 00:29:36,520
Speaker 1: They're engraved on metal and really drilled into your car.

449
00:29:36,680 --> 00:29:38,840
Speaker 1: You have to really work hard to get that vennumber out.

450
00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:45,120
Speaker 1: Guns have serialized numbers as well. You can get a

451
00:29:45,160 --> 00:29:48,440
Speaker 1: ghost gun without any type of a background check. It's

452
00:29:48,560 --> 00:29:54,760
Speaker 1: totally secret. So the fact that a ghost gun is

453
00:29:54,840 --> 00:29:59,680
Speaker 1: coming into play is very, very disturbing. I want you

454
00:29:59,720 --> 00:30:05,120
Speaker 1: to take a listen to what neighbors think. Our cut seven,

455
00:30:05,640 --> 00:30:08,600
Speaker 1: our Francy ko I n I think it's a surprise

456
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:11,479
Speaker 1: to everybody in the neighborhood. As an author, she's been

457
00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:16,960
Speaker 1: writing steamy romance novels filled with murder mysteries. Her neighbors say,

458
00:30:17,120 --> 00:30:20,120
Speaker 1: if there were troubles in the marriage, they never knew it.

459
00:30:20,560 --> 00:30:24,840
Speaker 1: Totally quiet, more naring people from what I could observes

460
00:30:25,000 --> 00:30:28,280
Speaker 1: Christmas well, she may have been tight lipped with neighbors.

461
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:32,720
Speaker 1: Nancy expressed her fillings on Facebook shortly after Daniel's deaph,

462
00:30:33,240 --> 00:30:37,000
Speaker 1: calling him her best friend in the months since her husband,

463
00:30:37,080 --> 00:30:40,600
Speaker 1: beloved chef Daniel Brofy was killed. So explain to me

464
00:30:40,760 --> 00:30:44,760
Speaker 1: the nature of their relationship, Zanes Parling deep been married

465
00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:50,640
Speaker 1: more than twenty years. Nancy and Daniel Brofy seemed on

466
00:30:50,720 --> 00:30:54,920
Speaker 1: the surface to have the perfect marriage. Nancy wrote once

467
00:30:55,000 --> 00:30:58,880
Speaker 1: that the reason she married Daniel is because she was

468
00:30:58,960 --> 00:31:01,280
Speaker 1: in the tub expect him to come join her, and

469
00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:05,280
Speaker 1: he calls out, Sure, but let me finish the Hondavors verse. Right,

470
00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:08,680
Speaker 1: she's serving him, he's serving her food. He was a

471
00:31:08,840 --> 00:31:13,200
Speaker 1: very talented chef. And again, the defense has produced a

472
00:31:13,320 --> 00:31:16,440
Speaker 1: number of letters and voicemails suggesting that they had a

473
00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:19,960
Speaker 1: very happy relationship, at least on the surface. There really

474
00:31:21,040 --> 00:31:23,720
Speaker 1: weren't a lot of problems except for money troubles. They

475
00:31:23,800 --> 00:31:27,880
Speaker 1: were in serious trouble with their mortgage, credit card debt,

476
00:31:28,280 --> 00:31:31,640
Speaker 1: and we're really looking to sell part of their home

477
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:34,000
Speaker 1: because self part of their land, because of how much

478
00:31:34,240 --> 00:31:36,120
Speaker 1: money troubles they were in. How in the world did

479
00:31:36,160 --> 00:31:39,800
Speaker 1: they give to so much money trouble? You know it, well,

480
00:31:39,840 --> 00:31:42,680
Speaker 1: it's it's a very interesting thing. Nancy Brothy her day

481
00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:46,720
Speaker 1: job was to sell life insurance policies, and as we

482
00:31:46,880 --> 00:31:50,640
Speaker 1: heard earlier. She actually had one point four million in

483
00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:54,120
Speaker 1: that she stood to collect from Daniel's death, and that

484
00:31:54,240 --> 00:31:56,479
Speaker 1: meant that every month, even the months they couldn't pay

485
00:31:56,520 --> 00:31:59,480
Speaker 1: their mortgage, she was paying over a thousand dollars to

486
00:31:59,640 --> 00:32:02,840
Speaker 1: keep up all these premiums on these life insurance policies.

487
00:32:04,640 --> 00:32:08,880
Speaker 1: Lisa Daddy O money. The love of money, the root

488
00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:11,719
Speaker 1: of all evil. It's been said a million times. They

489
00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:17,080
Speaker 1: had a fine marriage, no problem, They just had money problems.

490
00:32:17,600 --> 00:32:19,920
Speaker 1: When she wouldn't pay other bills, she would pay that

491
00:32:20,120 --> 00:32:23,360
Speaker 1: life insurance policy a thousand dollars a month. Did you

492
00:32:23,560 --> 00:32:27,400
Speaker 1: hear that? I did? It's one of those wows, right,

493
00:32:28,720 --> 00:32:31,880
Speaker 1: talk about circumstantial. Those types of things are going to

494
00:32:31,920 --> 00:32:37,240
Speaker 1: be interesting as the case proceeds to find out all

495
00:32:37,320 --> 00:32:44,080
Speaker 1: these details leading up to motives guys. Nancy Brophy steamy

496
00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:48,240
Speaker 1: romance novelist, also the author of an essay on how

497
00:32:48,680 --> 00:32:53,120
Speaker 1: to Murder your husband. That's her title, not mine. Now

498
00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:57,120
Speaker 1: in the crosshairs of prosecutors who believe she is the

499
00:32:57,200 --> 00:33:00,200
Speaker 1: one who murdered her husband, and for what read an

500
00:33:00,200 --> 00:33:04,360
Speaker 1: According to Zane Sprawling with or The Oregonian, it's about money.

501
00:33:05,160 --> 00:33:08,960
Speaker 1: So what were they spending their money on Zane. What

502
00:33:09,040 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 1: do we know. Did they live extravagantly. They certainly didn't

503
00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:17,080
Speaker 1: have an extravagant lifestyle. Prosecutors haven't shown evidence as shuts,

504
00:33:17,400 --> 00:33:22,760
Speaker 1: there was overspending, and it's worth noting that Chef Brokey

505
00:33:22,960 --> 00:33:27,360
Speaker 1: was looking to retire. He had actually shifted just to work.

506
00:33:27,400 --> 00:33:29,320
Speaker 1: He on weekends and he was working in a care

507
00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:34,520
Speaker 1: facility too, So they were trying to and Nancy had

508
00:33:34,600 --> 00:33:37,280
Speaker 1: really was not earning money. She had previous times, but

509
00:33:37,360 --> 00:33:40,120
Speaker 1: she didn't She wasn't earning in the years leading up

510
00:33:40,160 --> 00:33:43,320
Speaker 1: to her husband's death, so they didn't have a lot

511
00:33:43,360 --> 00:33:47,240
Speaker 1: of income. They lived on a very large lot in Beaverton,

512
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:49,920
Speaker 1: so they had those property taxes deal with. There was

513
00:33:50,080 --> 00:33:52,400
Speaker 1: some splurging on the credit card bills, they had credit

514
00:33:52,440 --> 00:33:55,880
Speaker 1: card debt, and of course, really again all these life

515
00:33:55,920 --> 00:33:59,680
Speaker 1: insurance fault these ten different policies one point five million

516
00:34:00,040 --> 00:34:03,680
Speaker 1: it'll payout if Chef Daniel Brofy were to die. You know,

517
00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:08,719
Speaker 1: they were using all their money to pay off credit cards,

518
00:34:08,800 --> 00:34:12,280
Speaker 1: just make monthly payments. They must have been living really

519
00:34:12,440 --> 00:34:15,880
Speaker 1: high on the hog. But I find it really almost

520
00:34:16,000 --> 00:34:19,719
Speaker 1: laughable and I just can't wait to find out. Oh

521
00:34:20,520 --> 00:34:25,799
Speaker 1: the reaction to this, She actually says that Brofy bought

522
00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:29,919
Speaker 1: a ghost gun kit to put together a ghost gun

523
00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:34,840
Speaker 1: and viewed it as a jigsaw puzzle, like it was

524
00:34:34,920 --> 00:34:39,279
Speaker 1: a game to her to put together. I believe an

525
00:34:39,320 --> 00:34:48,000
Speaker 1: automatic weapon. That's just a fantastical Lisa Daddio as we

526
00:34:48,120 --> 00:34:53,080
Speaker 1: call it in the law bs gable technical terms, that's

527
00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:56,839
Speaker 1: a load of horse crap right there, bought a gun,

528
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:00,919
Speaker 1: an automatic weapon as a kind of like a parlor game,

529
00:35:01,440 --> 00:35:04,680
Speaker 1: a jigsaw puzzle. Really, it just none of it makes

530
00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:07,239
Speaker 1: sense in that way, and it leads you to like

531
00:35:07,440 --> 00:35:11,040
Speaker 1: kind of scratch her head and be like, well, what

532
00:35:11,800 --> 00:35:14,480
Speaker 1: type of person does that unless there's some other type

533
00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:16,880
Speaker 1: of motive or carry a motive to all of it,

534
00:35:17,160 --> 00:35:20,440
Speaker 1: and just there's other things you can do if if

535
00:35:20,560 --> 00:35:23,239
Speaker 1: that's the way you want to kind of you know,

536
00:35:23,400 --> 00:35:27,720
Speaker 1: like yeah, exactly, you know, get a cross rod puzzle,

537
00:35:27,760 --> 00:35:30,960
Speaker 1: get a jigsaw puzzle, exactly, take less an hour, cut

538
00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:33,960
Speaker 1: six our friends at ABC thirteen. Day after his murder,

539
00:35:34,080 --> 00:35:38,440
Speaker 1: Brothy's wife, Nancy Crampton Brophy posted a statement on Facebook.

540
00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:41,240
Speaker 1: It read, in part, I have sad news to relate

541
00:35:41,560 --> 00:35:44,439
Speaker 1: my husband and best friend, chef Dan Brophy was killed

542
00:35:44,520 --> 00:35:47,680
Speaker 1: yesterday morning. I'm struggling to make sense of everything right now.

543
00:35:48,000 --> 00:35:51,640
Speaker 1: While I appreciate your loving responses, I am overwhelmed. We

544
00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:55,040
Speaker 1: now know Nancy was arrested Wednesday at her home in Beaverton,

545
00:35:56,600 --> 00:35:59,600
Speaker 1: and today appeared for the first time in court. According

546
00:35:59,680 --> 00:36:02,920
Speaker 1: to the DA's office, she's facing one charge of murder

547
00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:07,120
Speaker 1: with a firearm, constituting domestic violence. This news has shocked

548
00:36:07,160 --> 00:36:10,160
Speaker 1: their community. The couple's neighbor tells us they were pretty

549
00:36:10,239 --> 00:36:13,879
Speaker 1: quiet and never really saw them together very often. While

550
00:36:13,960 --> 00:36:17,279
Speaker 1: Dan Todd at OCI, Nancy worked from home. She's the

551
00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:21,440
Speaker 1: author of several romance novels, including one titled The Wrong Husband.

552
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:24,719
Speaker 1: On her website, she relays stories about her marriage, calling

553
00:36:24,800 --> 00:36:28,840
Speaker 1: her husband mister Wright and writing, can you imagine spending

554
00:36:28,880 --> 00:36:32,360
Speaker 1: the rest of your life without a man like that? Who? So?

555
00:36:32,640 --> 00:36:34,920
Speaker 1: Is it money or sex? I'm trying to figure that

556
00:36:35,040 --> 00:36:38,040
Speaker 1: one out. But again, the state never has to prove motive.

557
00:36:38,280 --> 00:36:41,759
Speaker 1: To Zane Sparling, Let's talk about something concrete, not just

558
00:36:42,000 --> 00:36:45,880
Speaker 1: our speculation or what a jury may speculate upon. What

559
00:36:46,320 --> 00:36:51,560
Speaker 1: does the surveillance videos show about her? Nancy provis van

560
00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:58,000
Speaker 1: the morning of the shooting, In particular, an eighteen minute disappearance.

561
00:36:58,760 --> 00:37:02,400
Speaker 1: That's right. So the surveillance footage from those nearby traffic

562
00:37:02,440 --> 00:37:06,640
Speaker 1: cameras shows a vehicle that matches the descriptions of Nancy

563
00:37:06,719 --> 00:37:10,400
Speaker 1: Brothy's vehicle cruising around. The word prosecutors have used the

564
00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:14,680
Speaker 1: vision is staking out the property that Oregon Culinary Institute

565
00:37:14,719 --> 00:37:17,239
Speaker 1: where the murder occurred. So you see this vehicle, this

566
00:37:17,560 --> 00:37:21,640
Speaker 1: gold colors, uh, you know, minivan cruising around the streets.

567
00:37:22,320 --> 00:37:25,000
Speaker 1: You don't quite see it parking, and then you see

568
00:37:25,000 --> 00:37:29,160
Speaker 1: it leaving. And there's that that crucial gap that prosecutors

569
00:37:29,200 --> 00:37:31,560
Speaker 1: have matched to the time of death early in the

570
00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:35,600
Speaker 1: morning in twenty eighteen. And it what it matters is

571
00:37:35,680 --> 00:37:40,600
Speaker 1: that when detectives went to do a death notification with

572
00:37:40,960 --> 00:37:43,759
Speaker 1: Nancy Brosey and tell her that her her husband was dead,

573
00:37:44,040 --> 00:37:46,440
Speaker 1: which at this point she wasn't a suspect. When they

574
00:37:46,480 --> 00:37:49,120
Speaker 1: went to tell her, Nancy was perfectly happy to talk.

575
00:37:49,239 --> 00:37:51,759
Speaker 1: She recounted her whole day. She said her husband got up,

576
00:37:51,840 --> 00:37:54,279
Speaker 1: took a shower, left, that she just sat in bed

577
00:37:54,680 --> 00:37:58,759
Speaker 1: and never left her home. And yet now the prosecutors

578
00:37:58,840 --> 00:38:01,360
Speaker 1: in court this very day are making the case that

579
00:38:01,960 --> 00:38:05,680
Speaker 1: there are these telltale dents in the vehicle that Nancy owned,

580
00:38:05,719 --> 00:38:08,920
Speaker 1: and in the vehicle shown in the traffic footage, which

581
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:12,440
Speaker 1: proves that her car was apparently circling the murder scene

582
00:38:12,960 --> 00:38:15,600
Speaker 1: just minutes before it occurred. Now, isn't it true at

583
00:38:15,640 --> 00:38:18,040
Speaker 1: one point she or her longer stage she was at

584
00:38:18,080 --> 00:38:21,479
Speaker 1: a Starbucks at the time he was murdered. She didn't

585
00:38:21,480 --> 00:38:23,880
Speaker 1: claim that she went to got her usual order at

586
00:38:23,920 --> 00:38:26,160
Speaker 1: the Starbucks drive through, so that she would have left

587
00:38:26,400 --> 00:38:30,560
Speaker 1: her home for a few minutes. But Beaverton and downtown

588
00:38:30,680 --> 00:38:33,319
Speaker 1: Portland are not at all close together. It would take

589
00:38:33,360 --> 00:38:35,520
Speaker 1: you about, you know, thirty to forty minutes to get

590
00:38:35,600 --> 00:38:38,759
Speaker 1: downtown from their location in Beaverton, So there's no way

591
00:38:38,840 --> 00:38:41,319
Speaker 1: that a quick trip to the coffee shop would take

592
00:38:41,600 --> 00:38:43,840
Speaker 1: that long. There's nothing quick about Starbucks. I don't know

593
00:38:43,840 --> 00:38:45,920
Speaker 1: if you know that or not. My daughter is taken

594
00:38:45,960 --> 00:38:49,600
Speaker 1: to some exotic Starbucks drink. I mean I had to

595
00:38:49,680 --> 00:38:52,160
Speaker 1: write it down so I could say the drive through

596
00:38:52,560 --> 00:38:56,040
Speaker 1: it's never fast, Wendy Patrick, don't you just love it

597
00:38:56,719 --> 00:39:00,439
Speaker 1: when suspects change or embellish their story to a point

598
00:39:00,560 --> 00:39:03,320
Speaker 1: is completely unbelievable. First, she stayed home all day and

599
00:39:03,400 --> 00:39:05,320
Speaker 1: then oops, I was at a Starbuck when this happened.

600
00:39:05,560 --> 00:39:09,200
Speaker 1: But why is her car her van circling the crime scene? Yeah,

601
00:39:09,239 --> 00:39:12,560
Speaker 1: that's true. Credibility counts. That's the understatement of the day.

602
00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:14,759
Speaker 1: I mean, you talk about a jigsaw puzzle that does

603
00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:17,920
Speaker 1: fit together. It sounds like that's what we're learning regarding

604
00:39:17,960 --> 00:39:21,359
Speaker 1: where she was the morning of the murder. And yes,

605
00:39:21,520 --> 00:39:25,799
Speaker 1: that not only fits together perfectly circumstantially, but as a timeline.

606
00:39:26,280 --> 00:39:28,920
Speaker 1: And you're right, I love Starbucks too, and that story

607
00:39:29,160 --> 00:39:32,439
Speaker 1: doesn't fit this. I don't love Starbucks because why would

608
00:39:32,440 --> 00:39:34,879
Speaker 1: I pay five dollars for a cup of coffee? But hey,

609
00:39:35,239 --> 00:39:37,600
Speaker 1: you can go ahead and throw all your a money away.

610
00:39:37,640 --> 00:39:40,359
Speaker 1: You cannot live in a Starbucks cup when you're seventy five.

611
00:39:40,480 --> 00:39:44,240
Speaker 1: Just keep that in mind. Guys. The defense is painting

612
00:39:44,400 --> 00:39:48,760
Speaker 1: them as a couple madly in love, that she nurtured

613
00:39:48,840 --> 00:39:52,399
Speaker 1: their relationship, and the defense has just scored a big

614
00:39:52,800 --> 00:39:56,719
Speaker 1: win in court. To Zane Sparling joining us from The Oregonian,

615
00:39:57,040 --> 00:39:59,839
Speaker 1: what can you tell me about the fate of how

616
00:40:00,160 --> 00:40:03,480
Speaker 1: to Murder your husband? The essay? Well, the jury ever

617
00:40:03,600 --> 00:40:05,920
Speaker 1: see that it will never see the light of day.

618
00:40:05,960 --> 00:40:08,919
Speaker 1: Of course, the jury is forbidden from following any news

619
00:40:09,080 --> 00:40:13,920
Speaker 1: coverage or listening to this podcast about what has been

620
00:40:14,120 --> 00:40:16,400
Speaker 1: excluded in court. And the judge in this case in

621
00:40:16,480 --> 00:40:19,319
Speaker 1: Multima County Circuit Court has ruled that because this essay

622
00:40:19,400 --> 00:40:22,880
Speaker 1: was written back in twenty eleven when Nancy Brothy was

623
00:40:23,239 --> 00:40:26,280
Speaker 1: joining a writer's group, he says it doesn't have probitive value,

624
00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:29,919
Speaker 1: that it could mislead the jury. That's prosecutors that hope

625
00:40:29,920 --> 00:40:32,080
Speaker 1: to bring it up in their opening statement, but they

626
00:40:32,160 --> 00:40:34,839
Speaker 1: had to take it out because right before the jury

627
00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:37,239
Speaker 1: came into the room, the judge ruled, you've got to

628
00:40:37,400 --> 00:40:39,640
Speaker 1: strike this essay and it is and the how to

629
00:40:39,760 --> 00:40:42,640
Speaker 1: murder your husband essay will not be heard before the jury.

630
00:40:42,920 --> 00:40:45,680
Speaker 1: A major boo boo by the judge. It clearly goes

631
00:40:45,800 --> 00:40:51,160
Speaker 1: to her frame of mind. Okay, we wait for that

632
00:40:51,320 --> 00:40:55,479
Speaker 1: jury verdict. Nancy Grace Crime Story signing off, Goodbye friend,