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Speaker 1: Welcome to the Wired to Hunt Foundations podcast, your guide

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Speaker 1: to the fundamentals of better deer hunting, presented by first Light,

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Speaker 1: creating proven versatile hunting apparel for the stand, saddle or blind.

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Speaker 1: First Light, Go Farther, Stay Longer, and now your host

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Speaker 1: Tony Peterson.

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Speaker 2: Hey, everyone, welcome to the Wire to Hunt Foundation's podcast,

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Speaker 2: which is brought to you by First Light.

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Speaker 3: I'm your host, Tony Peterson.

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Speaker 2: In today's episode is all about how I'm taking a

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Speaker 2: fresh look at my late season hunt and why you

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Speaker 2: might want to as well.

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Speaker 3: Look, I know that a lot of people.

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Speaker 2: Who listen to this show are about ready to hang

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Speaker 2: up their deer gear and think about something else. As

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Speaker 2: much as the late season gets a lot of love

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Speaker 2: from some folks, it's mostly just a slog for a

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Speaker 2: lot of us. The weather usually kind of sucks. The

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Speaker 2: hunting is as difficult as it will be all season,

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Speaker 2: and once the rut has come and gone, it's just

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Speaker 2: a little tougher to keep the fire lit and burning.

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Speaker 2: But there's still some season love, and that means it's

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Speaker 2: at least worth a shit filling a tag before it's

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Speaker 2: too late.

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Speaker 3: That's what I'm going to talk about. Right now.

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Speaker 2: There is a concept called learned helplessness in psychology that

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Speaker 2: can be applied pretty well to hunting deer in many

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Speaker 2: different situations, but really well when it comes to late

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Speaker 2: season hunting. You see, you've been fed mostly horseshit about

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Speaker 2: the late season from folks who have much much better

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Speaker 2: hunting than you. Back in my magazine editing and writing days,

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Speaker 2: we ran a lot of late season stories from folks

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Speaker 2: who would be so bold as to make the claim

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Speaker 2: that the late season is the best time to kill

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Speaker 2: a big buck. And look, we all know why. Those

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Speaker 2: old mature deer have run themselves right into a state

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Speaker 2: of disrepair and they need calories to get back on

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Speaker 2: track before real winter sets in. So they have no

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Speaker 2: choice but to hit the food sources well before dark,

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Speaker 2: and that's when you can kill them, easy peasy. But

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Speaker 2: anyone who has hunted the late season knows that the

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Speaker 2: mature bucks aren't always willing to go on, you know,

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Speaker 2: full suicidal mode with their movements just because they're pretty

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Speaker 2: hungry after the rut. It doesn't work that way. A

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Speaker 2: hungry deer is still a deer that doesn't want to

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Speaker 2: die from an arrow or a bullet, and they will

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Speaker 2: generally prioritize that over everything else. Maybe the good part

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Speaker 2: about getting bad deer hunting advice is that it can

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Speaker 2: talk us into huntingmore, and that's not so bad. But

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Speaker 2: if you do hunt December and January deer a lot,

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Speaker 2: you're likely to get your butt kicked. Mostly that can

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Speaker 2: lead to the earlier mentioned learned helplessness. This tends to

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Speaker 2: solidify in our dumb brains after we repeatedly face tough

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Speaker 2: situations that feel kind of like no matter what we do,

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Speaker 2: we can't change the outcome for the better. Does that

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Speaker 2: mean the situations are beyond hope and we truly can't do.

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Speaker 3: Anything to affect our trajectory inside of them.

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Speaker 2: Nope, No, it just means that we stop believing we

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Speaker 2: can do just that, so we stop trying. We might

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Speaker 2: still do that thing, but we will do it with

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Speaker 2: minimal effort, and then when the results show up as predicted,

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Speaker 2: we get that warm and fuzzy feeling of absolutely being right.

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Speaker 2: It's a nice blanket to wrap ourselves in, and it's

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Speaker 2: a great way to not achieve what are likely to

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Speaker 2: be achievable goals. For most of my deer hunting life,

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Speaker 2: I did this in the late season, and you know what,

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Speaker 2: it worked, which is not as cool as it sounds,

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Speaker 2: because the times that I did put in some real

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Speaker 2: effort in the last few weeks of the season are

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Speaker 2: the times where I usually ended up with some close

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Speaker 2: encounters or some actual, honest to God filled tags. Now

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Speaker 2: keep in mind those tags were not filled one hundred

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Speaker 2: and seventy inch deer, but I was never hunting them

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Speaker 2: to begin with. They were does in small box and

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Speaker 2: sometimes ok bucks and that was really good considering what

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Speaker 2: I expected. But mostly I had a little pity party

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Speaker 2: about the late season, went out, froze my ass off

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Speaker 2: and didn't shoot anything. But you know what, I knew

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Speaker 2: that I was phoning it in. Instead of hanging a

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Speaker 2: set over a fresh trail, I'd sit on the ground

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Speaker 2: and mostly get busted, just because sitting on the ground

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Speaker 2: was easier. Or instead of hanging a fresh stand, I'd

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Speaker 2: go sit some ladder, standard box, blind or whatever that

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Speaker 2: had been up all season, and the deer were very

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Speaker 2: wise to but it was easier than going in and

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Speaker 2: doing what I should have done in the last couple

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Speaker 2: years with my daughters having you know, buck tags in

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Speaker 2: Minnesota and Wisconsin and enough dough tags to keep us

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Speaker 2: in the woods pretty much anytime we wanted to go.

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Speaker 2: I've started to pay way more attention to the late season,

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Speaker 2: partially because they have big Christmas breaks where they could

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Speaker 2: usually hunt with me without conflicts.

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Speaker 3: Of sports and other activities.

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Speaker 2: So last year we did just that in Minnesota, and

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Speaker 2: I managed to put my daughter on one of the

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Speaker 2: biggest late season bucks I've ever seen, and it was

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Speaker 2: a total heartbreaker to watch her shoulder shooting. It was

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Speaker 2: a bit of a relief to bump into him later

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Speaker 2: in the season and see that, you know, while you

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Speaker 2: had a pronounced limp, he at least had a shot

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Speaker 2: of surviving. He looked like he was doing pretty well

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Speaker 2: that year, probably would have gone right around one hundred

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Speaker 2: and thirty inches, which to us at the time and

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Speaker 2: on that property, was like seeing a two hundred inchro

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Speaker 2: walk in in some places. This year, both my daughters

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Speaker 2: and I are tagged out in Minnesota hunt bucks. We

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Speaker 2: are almost all tagged out in Wisconsin on bucks too,

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Speaker 2: but one of my daughters is sitting on an archery

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Speaker 2: buck tag. Now keep in mind, we don't need a

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Speaker 2: buck tag to go hunt in December. It just helps

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Speaker 2: We will definitely do some dough only sits, but for

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Speaker 2: now we're working on that last stubborn buck tag. So

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Speaker 2: I'm doing things differently. I know that the December year

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Speaker 2: where we hunt are not likely to should their hands

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Speaker 2: too much with extra movement. I also know that my

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Speaker 2: December is bonkers busy, and I can't really get out

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Speaker 2: and scout as much as I'd like, so I'm leaning

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Speaker 2: pretty heavy on trail cameras to start with. This is

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Speaker 2: the first year in a long time I went all

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Speaker 2: in on trail cameras, mostly because of how my hunt

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Speaker 2: schedules shook out. I just had two really good opportunities

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Speaker 2: this year to try to figure things out with cameras,

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Speaker 2: and to be honest, it's the first time that trail

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Speaker 2: cameras for sure help me kill a big buck, and

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Speaker 2: maybe even can be attributed pretty well to killing two

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Speaker 2: big ones. Now, we're not looking for big bucks over

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Speaker 2: there in or central Wisconsin. We're looking for bucks, any bucks,

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Speaker 2: and I'm hoping to dial in a few, even if

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Speaker 2: they are spikes, so that when we go over there

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Speaker 2: to hunt, we have an outside chance of running into one.

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Speaker 2: How I'm doing that is by running cameras in the cover. Now,

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Speaker 2: I know this isn't available for everyone, and it's not

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Speaker 2: the only thing I'm going to do, but this year

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Speaker 2: I ran a handful of cameras in the swamps over there,

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Speaker 2: you know swamps I've hunted quite a bit, and the

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Speaker 2: interesting thing about it was how often cruising bucks walked

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Speaker 2: by all of the cameras I had in one specific swamp,

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Speaker 2: while also noting that a lot of the does didn't

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Speaker 2: do that. And it was also interesting how after the

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Speaker 2: rut and the main gun season was over, nearly all

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Speaker 2: of the deer I got on camera walked by some

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Speaker 2: of the swamp cameras, but almost none of those deer

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Speaker 2: seemed to walk out in front of my cameras that

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Speaker 2: are anywhere near fields or openings. The movement just appeared

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Speaker 2: to tighten way up, and I doubt it'll loosen up

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Speaker 2: much in the next month or so. So the goal

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Speaker 2: is to draw a bead on a few bucks in

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Speaker 2: the thick stuff, try to make some connections on you know,

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Speaker 2: just when they should move, and then thread the needle

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Speaker 2: while hunting with a fourteen year old girl in late season,

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Speaker 2: cold ass conditions. It won't be easy, but the camera

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Speaker 2: data will help a lot with the confidence aspect, which

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Speaker 2: is important when you've gone pretty deep on the learned

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Speaker 2: helplessness side of these things. The thing about this is

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Speaker 2: that I'm going to have to make sure I stay

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Speaker 2: on top of the trail camera data for a few

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Speaker 2: weeks before we go. This is going to involve a

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Speaker 2: couple long drives over to Wolf Country to change batteries

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Speaker 2: and move cameras around. That already seems like a little

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Speaker 2: bit more effort than it'll probably be worth. But I

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Speaker 2: also really want to get my daughter out because she's

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Speaker 2: dying to go and the clock is ticking. I also

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Speaker 2: selfishly just want to see if we can get it done.

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Speaker 2: In the past, I've had a defeated attitude about this

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Speaker 2: late season stuff, and it's one of those deep rooted

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Speaker 2: beliefs about myself that isn't so easy to ferret out

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Speaker 2: and send on its way. I don't want my daughters

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Speaker 2: to learn this, because it's a lie, and they've already

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Speaker 2: had some really good late season success, including my daughter

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Speaker 2: who hit that big buck last year and lost it.

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Speaker 2: Toward the end of the season, she kept hunting and

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Speaker 2: she managed to shoot a big old loan dough in

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Speaker 2: late December, which is some kind of trophy for sure,

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Speaker 2: even if it doesn't have antlers. So that's the first

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Speaker 2: step towards trying to not really screw up the last

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Speaker 2: few weeks of this season. Now, keep in mind, I

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Speaker 2: have permission on a couple of properties where the girls

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Speaker 2: can shoot does and they are, by all accounts, candy

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Speaker 2: land hunts. It's really not a challenge at all on

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Speaker 2: either one most of the time, and that's great in

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Speaker 2: some ways. But I'm also terrified that my daughters will

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Speaker 2: learn only how to go where deer can easily be shot,

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Speaker 2: but not really ever learn how to hunt for deer,

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Speaker 2: if that makes any sense at all. I'm going to

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Speaker 2: take them on some dough missions where the chances of

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Speaker 2: success are very high, but I want them to also

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Speaker 2: understand that the deer hurdles we face can't all be

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Speaker 2: cleared by calling in a favor from someone who has

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Speaker 2: a really good property and is looking to thin the

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Speaker 2: hurt a little bit. I'm going to look at our

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Speaker 2: setups differently as well. Normally I leave some ground blinds

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Speaker 2: up all season, and if the snow doesn't crush them,

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Speaker 2: then that's kind of usually what we sit for our

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Speaker 2: late season hunts. Sometimes it works, but I've noticed that

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Speaker 2: if we have a blind up, we will almost always

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Speaker 2: hunt it, unless the cameras are the observations, or you know,

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Speaker 2: just the instinct says it's time to go somewhere else.

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Speaker 2: The girls are competent enough now with their crossbows and

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Speaker 2: their ability to sit pretty tight, that we are going

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Speaker 2: to hunt some ladder stands and some natural ground blinds.

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Speaker 2: I like natural ground blinds when we have a lot

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Speaker 2: of snow, because I can use some snow cameo, you know,

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Speaker 2: either with us wearing it or just draping it in

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Speaker 2: front of us and then brushing in, and it's pretty

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Speaker 2: dang effective. I have a few spots in mind for this,

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Speaker 2: but I'm waiting to see exactly where we need to

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Speaker 2: set up to get things really going. The good news

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Speaker 2: is they don't need to be within twenty yards anymore.

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Speaker 2: The girls are very comfortable with like thirty yard shots,

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Speaker 2: which with a crossbow and a good rest is so

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Speaker 2: doable for them. Now, that's an extra ten yard cushion

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Speaker 2: we might need because the late season is often so

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Speaker 2: dang quiet, and the deer are often very very cagy.

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Speaker 2: So far, I'm guessing my strategy sounds a hell of

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Speaker 2: a lot like any old deer hunting strategy, where you

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Speaker 2: have to put in the effort and try to find

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Speaker 2: the reward, which I guess is totally true. But I

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Speaker 2: also know something else about the late season. It's just

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Speaker 2: like early season hunting that no one will tell you

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Speaker 2: to go hunt in the mornings. The usual advice is

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Speaker 2: that it's just a lost cause and you'll do more

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Speaker 2: harm than good. You guys know how I feel about that.

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Speaker 2: I have quite a few early season bucks on the

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Speaker 2: wall that were killed during morning sits, but for some reason,

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Speaker 2: I've mostly not hunted mornings in the late season. My

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Speaker 2: goal this year is to find a few spots where

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Speaker 2: I can make that happen with the girls, so that

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Speaker 2: when we do have time to hunt, we can wring

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Speaker 2: the most out of each and every day. The wild

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Speaker 2: card is just getting to those spots without getting busted.

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Speaker 2: But the truth is, as long as the snow isn't

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Speaker 2: overly crunchy, it's usually doable, and even if it is,

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Speaker 2: there are some ways to get around it with access.

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Speaker 2: Either way, I'm going to push away the notion that

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Speaker 2: hunting mornings is just universally dumb this time year, and

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Speaker 2: try to fit figure out a way to hunt them

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Speaker 2: when they head back to bed without screwing up our

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Speaker 2: evening chances. This is going to be mostly a travel

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Speaker 2: route thing in the cover, and it's not going to

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Speaker 2: be easy. But again, cameras can really help with this,

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Speaker 2: and so can just looking at trails, tracks and just

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Speaker 2: general deer sign The good news about late season dear

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Speaker 2: is that they are usually pretty predictable, even if the

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Speaker 2: movement we can accurately predict isn't all that likely to

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Speaker 2: happen in daylight. Nature isn't all about wasting calories when

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Speaker 2: it doesn't have to, and at least here in Canada South,

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Speaker 2: they aren't going to burn precious energy for no reason.

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Speaker 2: I would guess that's a different thing for a lot

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Speaker 2: of Southern hunters, but maybe there is some truth to

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Speaker 2: it down there too. Up here and in a lot

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Speaker 2: of the white Tail range, they're just not going to

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Speaker 2: do a lot of movement that doesn't directly put calories

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Speaker 2: in their bellies. This is a long winded way of

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Speaker 2: saying that I'm working on a couple of different private

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Speaker 2: and public properties so that i have options for both

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Speaker 2: morning and evening hunts, no matter what direction the wind

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Speaker 2: will be blowing.

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Speaker 3: From when we get to go.

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Speaker 2: This is something that has plagued me in the past

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Speaker 2: and has gotten me into trouble. Instead of working different

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Speaker 2: pockets of deer, I'd find a food source that was

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Speaker 2: good enough, backtrack it, and burn it right to the

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Speaker 2: ground because that was all I had going on. You know,

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Speaker 2: there's like sort of a gopher broke mentality that comes

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Speaker 2: into play when you think your odds are very low,

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Speaker 2: and that's what I have mostly done with my late

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Speaker 2: season hunts. This is bad for a lot of reasons,

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Speaker 2: but being too cavalier with your setups on deer that

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Speaker 2: have clearly had enough of Hunter's bullshit for a couple

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Speaker 2: of months is such a great way to take a

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Speaker 2: spot that could deliver some good hunts and totally set

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Speaker 2: fire to it as quickly as possible. I'm going to

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Speaker 2: try to take the same care with these last ditch

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Speaker 2: efforts as I do with the rest of my season

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Speaker 2: on public Land, which is where I just try to

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Speaker 2: hammer down on the little details to see if everything

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Speaker 2: will work in my favor. I don't know if it will,

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Speaker 2: but I know a couple of things. When we put

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Speaker 2: in some real time and effort into something something I

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Speaker 2: don't know, like hunting jaded late season deer, we usually

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Speaker 2: learn something valuable about the deer, and we almost always

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Speaker 2: learn something valuable about ourselves. I'm sure that sounds like

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Speaker 2: woo woo stuff, but I believe it. I've hunted a

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Speaker 2: lot of different ways, in a lot of different states,

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Speaker 2: and with a lot of different expectations, and the hardest

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Speaker 2: haunts just generally provide the best opportunity to level up

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Speaker 2: and really learn. They are often not as successful in

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Speaker 2: the measurement of dead critters as some other hunts, but

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Speaker 2: you can kill a lot of deer, even big mature deer,

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Speaker 2: and never really learn a whole lot. I don't think

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Speaker 2: that's how this will go, and I like the thought

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Speaker 2: of putting in some real effort in a way that

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Speaker 2: has generally been totally unappealing to me in the past.

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Speaker 2: I also know, at the very least then, I have

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Speaker 2: one daughter who's really itching to get back in the woods,

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Speaker 2: and if I do the work I plan on, it'll

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Speaker 2: be a far better experience for both of us, not

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Speaker 2: only because we have a better chance to actually have

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Speaker 2: a fork.

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Speaker 3: You walk in.

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Speaker 2: But also because she and I can talk through what's

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Speaker 2: going on, we can look at the trail camera images

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Speaker 2: every morning and then decide on what setups we should

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Speaker 2: have in place, how we are going to hunt them

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Speaker 2: all that Jazz, I think that will be important for her,

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Speaker 2: and I know it'll be important for me. I don't

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Speaker 2: know why it is, but just workshopping ideas with your

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Speaker 2: hunting partner, even if you do ninety three percent of

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Speaker 2: the work, is a good way to visualize what needs

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Speaker 2: to happen and how things should go, and to just

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Speaker 2: bond over the process.

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Speaker 3: I like the thought of that because.

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Speaker 2: In some ways my daughters live vicariously through me as

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Speaker 2: a hunting guide, and in some ways I live vicariously

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Speaker 2: through them as young hunter is looking to get better

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Speaker 2: at something that's truly difficult. So the upshot of all

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Speaker 2: this is this, think about how you approach the late season.

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Speaker 2: What's your effort level like and would it be beneficial

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Speaker 2: to put in some more effort, even if you're only

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Speaker 2: working on filling an antalylyst tag. What could you do

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Speaker 2: to put yourself in a better late season position. The

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Speaker 2: answer might go way beyond just finding a good destination

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Speaker 2: food source and posting up on it. When the temperatures

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Speaker 2: begin to truly dip, there might be more you can do,

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Speaker 2: and if so, oh you should consider it. The worst

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Speaker 2: thing that happens is that you eat a tiger.

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Speaker 3: Two.

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Speaker 2: The best thing that happens is well you don't, or

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Speaker 2: if you do, you learn a hell of a lot

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Speaker 2: about how to approach things next season. It could be worse,

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Speaker 2: even if it definitely won't be all that easy. That's

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Speaker 2: it for this week. I'm Tony Peterson and this has

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Speaker 2: been the Wired to Hunt Foundation's podcast, which is brought

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Speaker 2: to you by first Light. Thank you, thank you, thank

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Speaker 2: you so much for all your support. Mark and I

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Speaker 2: here at Wired to Hunt truly appreciated. All of us

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Speaker 2: at meat Eater really appreciate it. Without you, guys, we're nothing,

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Speaker 2: So thank you for that support. If you're bored, maybe

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Speaker 2: on Christmas break and you're sick of listening to your

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Speaker 2: family argue about politics or whatever, you can go to

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Speaker 2: the medeater dot com and find a hell of a

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Speaker 2: lot of content to educate yourself a little bit and

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Speaker 2: entertain yourself a lot and just have some fun podcasts, films, articles, recipes,

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Speaker 2: You name it, Go to the medeater dot com check

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Speaker 2: it out.

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Speaker 3: Thanks again,