WEBVTT - Together Review, Sunset Boulevard at 75, AngelHeaded Hipster 0:00:03.880 --> 0:00:05.720 What kind of a show you guys. 0:00:05.440 --> 0:00:06.360 Putting on here today? 0:00:06.480 --> 0:00:07.600 You're not interested in art? 0:00:07.720 --> 0:00:07.840 Now? 0:00:08.080 --> 0:00:09.719 No, Look, we're going to do this thing. We're going 0:00:09.760 --> 0:00:14.880 to have a conversation from Chicago. This is Film Spotting, 0:00:15.000 --> 0:00:19.280 celebrating our twentieth year. I'm Josh Larson and I'm Adam Kempinar. 0:00:19.800 --> 0:00:23.239 We spend our lives in search of the other half. 0:00:24.280 --> 0:00:27.960 If you think you've found that, don't be so quick 0:00:28.000 --> 0:00:28.480 to let it go. 0:00:30.280 --> 0:00:33.200 What a comforting thought. That's from the trailer for director 0:00:33.240 --> 0:00:36.239 Michael Shanks together with Alison Brie and Dave Franco as 0:00:36.280 --> 0:00:40.480 a couple whose relationship undergoes an unsettling transformation. We've got 0:00:40.479 --> 0:00:40.920 a review. 0:00:41.159 --> 0:00:45.760 Speaking of unusual relationships, how about Joe Gillis and Norma Desmond. 0:00:46.040 --> 0:00:49.760 We'll talk Billy Wilder's Sunset Boulevard to mark it's seventy 0:00:49.760 --> 0:00:51.880 fifth anniversary, that and more. 0:00:52.120 --> 0:00:54.320 All Right, mister demil, I'm ready for my close. 0:00:54.200 --> 0:00:55.840 Up ahead on Film Spotting. 0:01:05.720 --> 0:01:08.360 This episode is brought to you by Peloton break through 0:01:08.360 --> 0:01:10.800 the busiest time of year with the brand new Peloton 0:01:10.880 --> 0:01:14.560 Cross Training tread Plus powered by Peloton Iq with real 0:01:14.640 --> 0:01:17.679 time guidance and endless ways to move you can personalize 0:01:17.680 --> 0:01:20.920 your workouts and train with confidence, helping you reach your 0:01:20.920 --> 0:01:25.080 goals in less time. Let yourself run, lift, sculpt, push 0:01:25.200 --> 0:01:28.440 and go. Explore the new Peloton Cross Training tread plus 0:01:28.560 --> 0:01:30.480 at one Peloton dot com. 0:01:30.840 --> 0:01:34.040 Welcome to film Spotting, Josh, if you count dating, certainly, 0:01:34.120 --> 0:01:37.440 we have both been with our wives for over thirty 0:01:37.520 --> 0:01:39.919 years and still no fusing of the flesh. It seems 0:01:39.959 --> 0:01:41.880 the movies have lied to us yet again. 0:01:43.200 --> 0:01:46.600 Well speak for yourself, Adam. This eyeball on my shoulder, 0:01:46.720 --> 0:01:48.000 that's stubby. 0:01:50.120 --> 0:01:52.640 We do have a review of the new Relationship Body 0:01:52.680 --> 0:01:56.400 horror movie together. We'll also get to our second Billy 0:01:56.440 --> 0:02:00.120 Wilder classic of the Summer Sunset Boulevard, which is seventy 0:02:00.120 --> 0:02:02.120 five this year. Plus I will have a few thoughts 0:02:02.160 --> 0:02:06.240 on Angel Headed Hipster, the documentary about glam rocker Mark Bolan, 0:02:06.720 --> 0:02:09.919 and we will have a new deeply flawed film spotting poll. 0:02:10.000 --> 0:02:12.600 Is there any other kind? We're asking you to re 0:02:12.800 --> 0:02:16.839 litigate the nineteen seventy six Best Picture race, the rare 0:02:16.880 --> 0:02:20.960 case where all five nominated films are legit masterpieces, but 0:02:21.080 --> 0:02:25.200 first together, a long time but unmarried couple make a 0:02:25.240 --> 0:02:27.200 move to the country, which puts a strain on a 0:02:27.240 --> 0:02:30.799 relationship that has already entered a state of complacency. Things 0:02:30.880 --> 0:02:34.440 soon get weird. Notably, their body is becoming one. Here's 0:02:34.440 --> 0:02:38.480 a scene that has them considering drastic measures to free themselves. 0:02:38.760 --> 0:02:41.520 I'd imagine what you're about to do actually happening, and 0:02:41.560 --> 0:02:43.480 tell me that's not going to make things way worse. 0:02:43.760 --> 0:02:46.760 Whiskey for the pain, And as soon as we're separated, 0:02:46.800 --> 0:02:48.000 I'll sprint for the first aid kit. 0:02:48.040 --> 0:02:51.240 We have bandages, disinsect in everything we need. Uh, you're 0:02:51.320 --> 0:02:51.960 right handed? 0:02:52.000 --> 0:02:55.520 Oh God, actually maybe that's enough for that. 0:02:57.040 --> 0:02:58.320 I think I can fill yours. 0:02:58.800 --> 0:02:59.600 Is your right handed? 0:02:59.600 --> 0:02:59.960 Andrew? 0:03:00.840 --> 0:03:02.560 Remember when you said you weren't holding me off? 0:03:02.600 --> 0:03:04.320 Did? Do you think I want to do this? No? 0:03:05.400 --> 0:03:07.000 We are out of time. 0:03:07.400 --> 0:03:09.760 We need to system. 0:03:09.800 --> 0:03:12.240 We have to. We have to. If we don't split now, 0:03:12.280 --> 0:03:13.320 it'll be much harder later. 0:03:13.480 --> 0:03:15.320 There's gotta be another way. 0:03:16.000 --> 0:03:20.360 Body horror is an icky, tricky genre, Adam and not 0:03:20.520 --> 0:03:23.200 for the faint of heart. In my book Fear Not, 0:03:23.360 --> 0:03:25.960 I said that such films are often about what happens 0:03:26.000 --> 0:03:29.960 when the bathroom door is closed and locked. That's another 0:03:30.000 --> 0:03:33.120 way of saying they're extremely personal and our reactions to 0:03:33.160 --> 0:03:36.880 them are personal as well. For my part, I'm unnerved 0:03:36.920 --> 0:03:40.480 but oddly transfixed by body horror. That's not to say 0:03:40.600 --> 0:03:43.240 I love the genre uncritically, just that when I hear 0:03:43.280 --> 0:03:47.360 about a new body horror film, I'm usually queasily intrigued, 0:03:47.920 --> 0:03:51.839 and the good ones make me both physically repelled and 0:03:52.240 --> 0:03:56.840 intellectually invigorated. But what makes a good body horror film? 0:03:57.200 --> 0:03:59.960 This isn't your favorite genre, Adam, but there are movies 0:04:00.080 --> 0:04:02.600 in this mode that you've appreciated. You were a fan 0:04:02.920 --> 0:04:06.280 of Coraley Fargo's The Substance from last year, for instance. 0:04:06.880 --> 0:04:09.200 What makes a body horror movie work for you? What 0:04:09.320 --> 0:04:12.000 makes you glad you sat through the gruesomeness and gore 0:04:12.520 --> 0:04:14.560 and to get to the point, did you find that? 0:04:14.840 --> 0:04:18.239 In the new film Together. The movie stars James Franco 0:04:18.360 --> 0:04:21.880 and Ellison Brie as a longtime couple at an awkward 0:04:21.920 --> 0:04:26.159 moment in their relationship. Things get more awkward when, while hiking, 0:04:26.400 --> 0:04:29.920 they drink from a suspect pond and suddenly their bodies 0:04:29.960 --> 0:04:34.000 have the grotesque urge to merge. And that's not a euphemism. 0:04:34.360 --> 0:04:38.320 In fact, Franco's tim has been avoiding physical intimacy for 0:04:38.440 --> 0:04:41.960 quite a while. So what did you make of Together, Adam? 0:04:42.040 --> 0:04:44.799 In general and as a work of body horror. 0:04:45.800 --> 0:04:49.400 It's true I'm a little squeamish, so, to use your words, 0:04:49.839 --> 0:04:53.480 I'm more queasy than intrigued, I suppose when I hear 0:04:53.480 --> 0:04:56.400 about a new body horror film coming out. But what 0:04:56.440 --> 0:04:59.400 does Dan Levy say in Shit's Creek? I like the wine, 0:04:59.440 --> 0:05:02.400 not the label. It will always be about the movie, 0:05:02.440 --> 0:05:05.720 not the genre or whatever type of movie it is. 0:05:05.800 --> 0:05:08.200 For me, I can tolerate all sorts of unpleasantness if 0:05:08.240 --> 0:05:10.919 it has a purpose and it pays off. And certainly 0:05:10.960 --> 0:05:14.440 if it does in the end pay off, that's in 0:05:14.480 --> 0:05:18.200 the filmmaking, the storytelling overall. So there will always be 0:05:18.320 --> 0:05:21.880 body horror films I like and some I don't. I'll 0:05:21.920 --> 0:05:24.279 tell you a little story, though, Josh, about my experience 0:05:24.360 --> 0:05:28.839 watching Together. It was Monday, it was late afternoon. I 0:05:28.880 --> 0:05:33.160 had the entire theater to myself, and you know, those scarier, 0:05:33.279 --> 0:05:37.720 uncomfortable scenes that we involuntarily react to by covering our 0:05:37.760 --> 0:05:40.719 eyes or maybe watch with our eyes peeking through fingers. 0:05:40.760 --> 0:05:42.520 I don't know if you do that. I do that. 0:05:43.120 --> 0:05:45.640 It's not just a cliche. I do that well. I 0:05:45.680 --> 0:05:48.840 didn't have to maintain any public decorum. I could just 0:05:48.880 --> 0:05:51.320 act like I was in my living room. When I 0:05:51.360 --> 0:05:55.560 got scared or uncomfortable, I could basically fling myself forward 0:05:55.680 --> 0:05:59.120 and cover my entire face with my hands. There was 0:05:59.200 --> 0:06:02.480 one jump scared early on. I think you'll know which 0:06:02.480 --> 0:06:04.279 one I'm referring to here, in a moment during a 0:06:04.400 --> 0:06:07.480 nightmare that Tim is having that got me so bad. 0:06:07.560 --> 0:06:11.400 It's a face with yellow eyes, and longtime listeners will 0:06:11.400 --> 0:06:14.600 know the yellow eyes and movies and horror movies always 0:06:14.760 --> 0:06:18.159 get me. It so unnerved me that, even though I 0:06:18.240 --> 0:06:20.840 knew I was alone, I swear to you that I 0:06:21.600 --> 0:06:24.000 looked over both my shoulders just to make sure that 0:06:24.080 --> 0:06:25.920 nobody saw me freak out for a second. I was 0:06:25.960 --> 0:06:27.680 so embarrassed by how I reacted. 0:06:28.279 --> 0:06:28.920 But there was. 0:06:29.000 --> 0:06:34.120 Only one scene that really flung me forward that for 0:06:34.320 --> 0:06:40.040 the entire run time of that scene, I couldn't watch 0:06:40.680 --> 0:06:43.480 or I couldn't watch without looking through my fingers. And 0:06:43.520 --> 0:06:46.760 I'll give you a hint. It didn't involve any blood 0:06:47.520 --> 0:06:51.760 or stuck body parts. It's the end of the party 0:06:51.839 --> 0:06:55.320 scene where we meet our main characters Tim and Millie, 0:06:55.480 --> 0:06:57.680 and I'm not going to spoil it for those who 0:06:57.680 --> 0:06:59.920 haven't seen it yet, I'll just let you go into 0:06:59.920 --> 0:07:03.320 it and navigate your own discomfort. It turns out I'm 0:07:03.360 --> 0:07:07.680 more averse to people unintentionally humiliating themselves than I am 0:07:07.720 --> 0:07:12.680 body horror, especially well intentioned people humiliating themselves. But that's 0:07:12.720 --> 0:07:15.080 all around about way of saying or trying to illustrate 0:07:15.120 --> 0:07:19.440 that although I might be as conflicted about my relationship 0:07:19.480 --> 0:07:23.000 to this movie as Tim is about his relationship to Millie, 0:07:23.080 --> 0:07:26.440 it's quite subdued as body horror. Even when the knives 0:07:26.480 --> 0:07:28.600 come out, even when it gets a little bloody, the 0:07:28.680 --> 0:07:32.480 gore really is left to the imagination. And while that 0:07:32.600 --> 0:07:36.600 might disappoint fans of the genre expecting more blood and 0:07:36.640 --> 0:07:40.960 guts and conventional thrills, I'm, of course in the other camp, 0:07:41.040 --> 0:07:46.400 And instead of overindulging in the potential gross out elements, 0:07:46.960 --> 0:07:50.520 I do think this movie sincerely wants to reckon with 0:07:50.600 --> 0:07:52.880 the conundrum that a lot of couples that have been 0:07:52.920 --> 0:07:57.320 together a while face. Do we want each other, do 0:07:57.360 --> 0:07:59.520 we love each other? Or have we just gotten used 0:07:59.560 --> 0:08:02.520 to each other? Are we together out of convenience and 0:08:02.560 --> 0:08:07.200 to some degree comfort, Have we developed a kind of codependency, and, 0:08:07.240 --> 0:08:12.400 as horror often does, Together takes a very real, universal 0:08:12.440 --> 0:08:17.960 anxiety and amplifies it to its most absurd degree codependency. Well, 0:08:18.000 --> 0:08:21.640 what happens if we remove the co and you know Milly? 0:08:21.720 --> 0:08:24.760 You think you're sure? Emphasis on think, because the cracks 0:08:24.800 --> 0:08:27.600 are clearly there right from the beginning, and she's aware 0:08:27.640 --> 0:08:29.560 of them. You think you're sure you want to spend 0:08:29.560 --> 0:08:31.240 the rest of your life with Tim. You can't wait 0:08:31.240 --> 0:08:34.120 to be secluded with him out in the countryside. You 0:08:34.240 --> 0:08:37.800 just wish that he was tethered to you as emotionally 0:08:37.960 --> 0:08:40.680 and physically as you seem to be to him. Guess 0:08:40.760 --> 0:08:44.360 what your wish is? Granted, Tim, you're not sure you 0:08:44.360 --> 0:08:46.040 want to spend the rest of your life with Milly. 0:08:46.360 --> 0:08:49.280 You're seeking clarity. You need something that will give you 0:08:49.320 --> 0:08:53.560 that certainty, give you that direction. Guess what your wish is? 0:08:53.600 --> 0:08:54.040 Granted. 0:08:54.559 --> 0:08:57.760 That's that's the premise, that's the concept this movie is 0:08:57.800 --> 0:09:01.240 playing with. And on that level, we'll get into the 0:09:01.280 --> 0:09:04.280 reasons why I'm conflicted about my response. But on that level, 0:09:04.840 --> 0:09:06.839 that's how Together worked for me. 0:09:07.679 --> 0:09:09.679 And I think it would have worked for me similarly 0:09:09.920 --> 0:09:12.840 if it had been more than a premise. But I 0:09:12.880 --> 0:09:17.840 didn't find a progression beyond that in Together, which is 0:09:17.960 --> 0:09:22.040 why I probably began as mixed but ended up negative 0:09:22.080 --> 0:09:24.680 on this film. You said it, Adam, it has a 0:09:24.679 --> 0:09:27.800 purpose and it pays off. I think the movie has 0:09:27.880 --> 0:09:33.760 that clear potent allegory at the start, this anxiety, a 0:09:33.800 --> 0:09:37.400 specific anxiety it sets out to explore or wants you 0:09:37.559 --> 0:09:41.280 to think it's going to explore. I wish it had 0:09:41.400 --> 0:09:45.600 done the work to excavate that throughout, and for me, 0:09:46.000 --> 0:09:49.000 a lot of it had to do with beyond that 0:09:49.120 --> 0:09:52.720 scene you mentioned, which I won't spoil either. Before this 0:09:52.880 --> 0:09:57.199 couple moves to the countryside, we don't get much about 0:09:57.200 --> 0:09:59.840 their relationship, or I didn't get a sense of who 0:09:59.840 --> 0:10:02.960 the they were together, or even a part they were 0:10:03.240 --> 0:10:06.960 probably thinly but effectively sketched. At the start, you get 0:10:07.000 --> 0:10:10.720 the broad outlines as you described, of Tim being quite 0:10:10.760 --> 0:10:15.200 not as committed and Millie perhaps being over committed for 0:10:15.800 --> 0:10:20.960 the situation. And beyond that, I felt the film got 0:10:20.960 --> 0:10:25.680 out in the countryside and became more interested in setting 0:10:25.760 --> 0:10:29.920 up these set pieces of gore. You're right, there isn't 0:10:30.000 --> 0:10:33.800 out and out gore. It's not necessarily what the movie 0:10:33.840 --> 0:10:36.120 wants to spend all its time on, but it wants 0:10:36.160 --> 0:10:39.200 to spend significant sections on and we know we're going 0:10:39.280 --> 0:10:41.880 to get it, and I felt a disconnect between the relationship. 0:10:41.920 --> 0:10:44.600 Perhaps it's the performances. For me, I found both of 0:10:44.600 --> 0:10:48.959 these performances to be pretty flat. In the case of Brie, 0:10:49.520 --> 0:10:51.360 I'm not all that familiar with her. I mostly know 0:10:51.480 --> 0:10:53.800 her from mad Men, where you know she had a 0:10:53.800 --> 0:10:56.880 bit of a school my arm quality, and that's doubled 0:10:56.920 --> 0:10:59.360 down on here. You know, her telling Tim when he 0:10:59.400 --> 0:11:02.360 should show, or that he's using too much data on 0:11:02.440 --> 0:11:06.120 their phone plan, these sorts of things. Again, that's that's 0:11:06.120 --> 0:11:09.520 more of a a repeating of what we've learned at 0:11:09.520 --> 0:11:12.720 the start, and Tim, you know, this idea that he's 0:11:12.760 --> 0:11:18.000 a little unsure about the relationship. It almost reverses after 0:11:18.040 --> 0:11:22.520 this curse falls upon them, where the relational allegory for 0:11:22.640 --> 0:11:26.760 me gets confused because then he becomes I don't think 0:11:26.800 --> 0:11:28.880 this is a spoiler, but he becomes the needy one 0:11:29.400 --> 0:11:34.160 and she starts to become the somewhat distant one. Again, 0:11:34.160 --> 0:11:37.280 there's that a progression. It's to me, it's more of 0:11:37.360 --> 0:11:41.560 a flipping. That doesn't make sense because I don't really 0:11:41.559 --> 0:11:44.600 demand a lot of logic for my horror films, but 0:11:45.120 --> 0:11:49.840 I did find myself wondering, why is Millie not similarly affected? 0:11:51.160 --> 0:11:55.200 If that, if this fundamental curse, which has biological rooting, 0:11:55.280 --> 0:11:58.839 it's related to, you know, this pond water, like, why 0:11:58.920 --> 0:12:04.040 suddenly is she not as compelled to be close to him. 0:12:04.960 --> 0:12:07.640 There's just little things like the first set piece we get, 0:12:07.640 --> 0:12:10.199 which I think counts as body horror, because he's injuring himself. 0:12:10.240 --> 0:12:12.880 Tim is in the shower and Millie is driving away 0:12:13.480 --> 0:12:16.400 and he's suddenly violently thrown about by the turns in 0:12:16.440 --> 0:12:20.000 her car. I didn't quite understand the dynamics there. And again, 0:12:20.200 --> 0:12:23.559 these are minor things, but it was difficult to feel 0:12:23.559 --> 0:12:27.480 the movie was really rooted in this exploring of the 0:12:27.559 --> 0:12:30.920 idea of it as a central relationship. As it went on, 0:12:31.200 --> 0:12:33.800 I thought maybe there were other interesting things that could 0:12:33.840 --> 0:12:37.520 have been examined. I mentioned the physical intimacy Tim's lack 0:12:37.559 --> 0:12:40.760 of physical intimacy with MILLI does the curse represent a 0:12:40.760 --> 0:12:43.200 fear of sex? There's a very simple idea. If the 0:12:43.240 --> 0:12:45.920 movie had committed to and spent more time on that 0:12:46.000 --> 0:12:49.560 might have worked. You mentioned that dream sequence, which I 0:12:49.679 --> 0:12:53.080 agree is very effective. The jump scare there that's related 0:12:53.120 --> 0:12:55.720 to a story we learn about Tim's trauma and his 0:12:55.800 --> 0:12:58.880 mother's mental illness. Might there be a connection to the 0:12:58.920 --> 0:13:03.359 curse there, maybe kind of we get a cult subplot 0:13:03.480 --> 0:13:07.679 here too. There is a lot that for me hinted 0:13:07.840 --> 0:13:14.679 at other movies Together could have been. And really, I'm 0:13:14.679 --> 0:13:16.560 not demanding much from a horror movie like this. I 0:13:16.679 --> 0:13:19.560 just I want exactly what you said at the top, 0:13:19.720 --> 0:13:22.720 a potent allegory. I want a specific anxiety it's going 0:13:22.760 --> 0:13:24.599 to be explored. I just want one idea and it 0:13:25.320 --> 0:13:28.320 to really give service to that. And for me, Together 0:13:28.520 --> 0:13:32.080 was a little bit more going for the gore scenes, 0:13:32.240 --> 0:13:36.200 the body horror scenes, eventually really going off the deep 0:13:36.280 --> 0:13:39.240 end in that direction speaking of the substance, but not 0:13:39.280 --> 0:13:41.199 doing any of the work that I like to see 0:13:41.200 --> 0:13:42.360 put in beforehand. 0:13:43.080 --> 0:13:45.079 I think it did more of the work than you're 0:13:45.120 --> 0:13:47.720 giving it credit for. We'll get into some of the 0:13:47.760 --> 0:13:50.280 ways it may go off the deep end here in 0:13:50.320 --> 0:13:55.600 a bit. But I saw the characters, the performances and 0:13:55.720 --> 0:13:59.880 just the screenwriting and the storytelling around those characters have 0:14:00.160 --> 0:14:02.960 more depth than I think that you're giving them credit for. 0:14:03.120 --> 0:14:06.280 Even with Millie, I never saw her as that kind 0:14:06.320 --> 0:14:10.240 of authoritative or I suppose, kind of mom like figure 0:14:10.320 --> 0:14:13.480 that's scolding the character. And we can talk about a 0:14:13.520 --> 0:14:16.320 couple of lines that you mentioned in particular. But even 0:14:16.320 --> 0:14:19.040 though she's the one who, as I said, is more 0:14:19.120 --> 0:14:22.080 tethered in some ways to him and he has the 0:14:22.200 --> 0:14:26.640 more clear doubts, she is also someone who, from the 0:14:26.760 --> 0:14:29.680 very beginning we see is spiraling a little bit about 0:14:29.680 --> 0:14:32.520 their relationship. And I think the whole premise there as 0:14:32.560 --> 0:14:35.000 well is tied to the fact that it's like the 0:14:35.000 --> 0:14:38.120 struggling married couple who and we hear so many of 0:14:38.120 --> 0:14:41.280 these stories, right who decide that we're really struggling, So 0:14:41.320 --> 0:14:42.840 what are we going to do to save this marriage? 0:14:42.880 --> 0:14:43.680 We're gonna have a baby. 0:14:44.200 --> 0:14:46.280 They think that somehow they're going to solve their problem 0:14:46.320 --> 0:14:49.800 and become closer as a couple by moving out to 0:14:49.840 --> 0:14:52.400 the middle of nowhere and only having each other. This 0:14:52.480 --> 0:14:54.600 is a bit of a last ditch effort. And I 0:14:54.680 --> 0:14:56.760 see in the performance, and I see in the writing 0:14:57.120 --> 0:15:00.400 that Bree's character knows that. So I don't see them 0:15:00.480 --> 0:15:04.160 quite as one dimensional. I think is maybe that you do. 0:15:04.320 --> 0:15:06.880 And I really felt like I understood who they were 0:15:07.000 --> 0:15:10.480 as individuals and as a couple from that opening scene, 0:15:10.520 --> 0:15:12.400 I'm so glad they just kind of threw us into 0:15:12.440 --> 0:15:15.200 it based on the way they talked about each other, 0:15:15.720 --> 0:15:19.160 the way, in Millie's case she's always having to defend 0:15:19.800 --> 0:15:23.040 Tim to her best friend, and in Tim's case, the 0:15:23.080 --> 0:15:25.800 way he's really not talking about her much at all, 0:15:26.000 --> 0:15:29.040 He's just talking about himself and his failed music career. 0:15:29.680 --> 0:15:33.000 That told me enough about who they really are as 0:15:33.040 --> 0:15:35.120 people and how they maybe feel about each other. And 0:15:35.160 --> 0:15:37.640 the way even that they interact with each other Josh 0:15:37.680 --> 0:15:40.360 at the party from across the room and then when 0:15:40.400 --> 0:15:43.800 they're together, the smiles, the gestures. This may be where 0:15:43.840 --> 0:15:47.920 some of the Brie Franco extra textual stuff comes into 0:15:47.960 --> 0:15:50.720 play and really serves the story, where you I got 0:15:50.720 --> 0:15:53.840 the sense that they know each other really well. There's 0:15:53.880 --> 0:15:57.240 a built in familiarity with the way that these two 0:15:57.360 --> 0:16:00.480 characters interact with each other, and I I got that 0:16:00.600 --> 0:16:04.400 sense that, yes, they know each other. There's an intimacy 0:16:04.480 --> 0:16:07.720 where you not only understand that they love this about 0:16:07.760 --> 0:16:09.880 each other, that they know each other so well, but 0:16:09.920 --> 0:16:12.520 it also could be taking its toll on each other. 0:16:12.600 --> 0:16:15.280 So I'm really grateful that we didn't get any more 0:16:15.720 --> 0:16:18.000 fleshing out if you will, to these characters. 0:16:18.080 --> 0:16:20.640 I think it did what good narratives do, thrust us 0:16:20.720 --> 0:16:23.960 right in. Yeah, I agree, the opening section does good 0:16:24.000 --> 0:16:26.120 work in the ways you're describing. I guess I just 0:16:26.160 --> 0:16:28.640 wanted more of that. It's kind of like the movie felt, Okay, 0:16:28.640 --> 0:16:30.720 we did that, now we don't have to do any 0:16:30.760 --> 0:16:32.880 more of it. And it's so funny you mentioned, you 0:16:32.920 --> 0:16:36.240 know the fact that Bri and Franco are off screen 0:16:36.520 --> 0:16:39.600 an offscreen couple, because for me, it's a case of 0:16:40.360 --> 0:16:43.240 that working against them. And I didn't know this until 0:16:43.240 --> 0:16:44.960 after I'd seen the film and had written up a 0:16:45.000 --> 0:16:47.800 review about it and then saw it on social media somewhere. 0:16:48.320 --> 0:16:50.920 And it can go both ways, right, Sometimes offscreen couples 0:16:50.960 --> 0:16:54.720 bring that chemistry that you found, and it's absolutely why 0:16:54.760 --> 0:16:57.640 their performances work together. In this case, for me, it 0:16:57.680 --> 0:17:00.320 was the other way. Once they got out to the countryside, 0:17:00.480 --> 0:17:03.240 I felt like, in fact, some of their scenes together 0:17:03.280 --> 0:17:06.239 were awkward when they're discussing you know, what would your 0:17:06.280 --> 0:17:10.440 last social media post be if you died that there 0:17:10.560 --> 0:17:15.199 was In my experience, I felt I would have guessed 0:17:15.200 --> 0:17:19.560 that these two performers were deeply uncomfortable with each other 0:17:19.760 --> 0:17:21.280 on screen. It was the opposite. 0:17:21.359 --> 0:17:24.600 Yeah, And they had one of these cirstic, cynical sense 0:17:24.600 --> 0:17:27.320 of humor that only people who know each other's sense 0:17:27.359 --> 0:17:30.680 of humor really well would understand. That scene lit to 0:17:31.200 --> 0:17:33.720 you talked about it's here again. I think maybe you're 0:17:33.720 --> 0:17:37.240 seeing Breed through a prism that I don't see her through. 0:17:37.359 --> 0:17:39.440 And I haven't seen mad Men, so I definitely don't 0:17:39.480 --> 0:17:44.160 see her through that that lens. But those lines you mentioned, 0:17:44.160 --> 0:17:48.160 I remember them very vividly, because there's certain line readings 0:17:48.200 --> 0:17:50.520 that I remember pretty vividly in this film, like when 0:17:50.560 --> 0:17:53.320 she she says to him that that maybe he should 0:17:53.320 --> 0:17:55.919 take a shower, and the fact that they are running 0:17:55.920 --> 0:17:58.440 out of data, and I just think there's more to it. 0:17:58.440 --> 0:18:01.680 It isn't a case where it is just about her 0:18:02.000 --> 0:18:05.240 being someone who's chiding him, who has to be telling 0:18:05.320 --> 0:18:08.080 him what to do. That moment with the shower is 0:18:08.119 --> 0:18:12.000 one where it's just followed him. She's gotten out of 0:18:12.040 --> 0:18:14.800 the shower and he's rubbing her back and he actually 0:18:14.840 --> 0:18:18.000 really hurts her. It's a really it's a really weird 0:18:18.600 --> 0:18:23.000 physical exchange, and he wants to go with her, or 0:18:23.200 --> 0:18:26.199 asks if he can go with her, and she really 0:18:26.600 --> 0:18:31.320 clearly wants some distance from him. And the way she says, 0:18:31.400 --> 0:18:34.280 like take a shower is kind of like if you 0:18:34.320 --> 0:18:37.040 were saying to someone like, no, you know you can 0:18:37.080 --> 0:18:39.640 clean the garage, like you've got other things to do. 0:18:39.720 --> 0:18:42.280 It's not so much like take a shower, you smell bad. 0:18:42.320 --> 0:18:45.560 That's that's how I interpreted it. And even even the data, Josh, 0:18:45.600 --> 0:18:48.720 the data is another example of them it. I think 0:18:48.760 --> 0:18:51.359 it's adding to the to the character because it's in 0:18:51.400 --> 0:18:56.040 their relationship, because it's another example of him just casually 0:18:56.560 --> 0:18:59.840 without thinking. She's not saying, don't do that, how dare 0:18:59.880 --> 0:19:03.159 you you? She's just pointing out, we only have so 0:19:03.320 --> 0:19:06.639 much and it's about gone. And what's he doing yet again? 0:19:07.240 --> 0:19:09.640 He's just not thinking about it and he's using it. 0:19:09.840 --> 0:19:11.879 I think it's the I think it's the yet again 0:19:12.000 --> 0:19:15.040 for me, though it's slid up of micro aggressions that 0:19:15.160 --> 0:19:17.480 dip their toll. For me, it's the yet again of 0:19:17.520 --> 0:19:20.040 it is like I knew that about them. I knew 0:19:20.119 --> 0:19:22.679 like she's in this slot, he's in this slot. And 0:19:22.680 --> 0:19:25.520 then yes, the curse seems to reverse that a little bit, 0:19:25.520 --> 0:19:29.400 which you think would be interesting except for the illogical 0:19:30.160 --> 0:19:33.280 nature of it, and that's where I got hung up 0:19:33.680 --> 0:19:36.080 a little bit as well. And maybe as far as 0:19:36.080 --> 0:19:38.479 Brie is concerned, it's just, you know, a brief thing 0:19:38.560 --> 0:19:41.359 for me. I know, people really appreciate her as an actress. 0:19:41.359 --> 0:19:43.520 And again I haven't seen all that much and it's 0:19:43.520 --> 0:19:45.360 not fair to just bring mad men into this if 0:19:45.359 --> 0:19:47.520 that's all I've seen, but it is a quality where 0:19:47.960 --> 0:19:52.520 I don't know, there's there's just like a low energy 0:19:53.880 --> 0:19:59.600 lack of engagement in the performance that seems at odds 0:19:59.640 --> 0:20:02.040 a little bit with the premise and at odds with 0:20:02.040 --> 0:20:03.840 what Franco is trying to do too. I wanted to 0:20:03.840 --> 0:20:05.600 ask you this, and I don't know how this played 0:20:05.720 --> 0:20:10.199 in your alone viewing in the theater, but at what 0:20:10.400 --> 0:20:16.960 point did you find this purposely funny? Unsure whether it 0:20:17.040 --> 0:20:22.399 wanted to be funny or not funny. You shouldn't be laughing, 0:20:22.640 --> 0:20:26.080 but you were. And it relates to Franco because the 0:20:26.160 --> 0:20:29.919 level of shouting he's frequently doing here to me feels 0:20:29.960 --> 0:20:32.719 a little bit like sweaty trying to make something funny. 0:20:33.119 --> 0:20:35.399 And it works in one scene the clip I believe 0:20:35.440 --> 0:20:41.200 we heard where they're contemplating with this SASA actually having 0:20:41.280 --> 0:20:44.600 to cut their own flash. This isn't spoiling anything, I 0:20:44.600 --> 0:20:49.480 don't think. And he notices you're right handed, and I 0:20:49.480 --> 0:20:51.199 think she's got it. She has to have it in 0:20:51.240 --> 0:20:53.879 the other hand, and that to me felt like, Okay, 0:20:54.040 --> 0:20:57.360 that's a good line. He delivers it with like exasperation. 0:20:57.480 --> 0:21:00.679 It's the ridiculousness of this situation, and can laugh. In 0:21:00.800 --> 0:21:04.560 terms of release. There are a couple other moments, though, 0:21:05.160 --> 0:21:10.200 one involving her hair, which struck me as unintentionally funny. 0:21:10.520 --> 0:21:13.040 I wasn't sure how to how to gauge his performance, 0:21:13.440 --> 0:21:16.240 and I will say too, I think some of the effects, 0:21:16.280 --> 0:21:19.880 the special effects, although they're practical and I always appreciate that, 0:21:20.240 --> 0:21:23.200 were a bit dodgy to me, And that was fell 0:21:23.240 --> 0:21:25.639 into the same bucket of should I be laughing at this? 0:21:25.720 --> 0:21:27.600 Am I meant to be laughing at this? Is it 0:21:27.640 --> 0:21:29.760 because of how it looks? And it shouldn't look that way? 0:21:30.200 --> 0:21:32.879 But anyways, in general, where did you land on, you know? 0:21:32.920 --> 0:21:33.960 Together as a comedy. 0:21:34.400 --> 0:21:37.560 I didn't have any issues with unintentional humor, and I 0:21:37.560 --> 0:21:42.640 didn't have any issues with bad special effects until one 0:21:42.920 --> 0:21:46.080 moment near the end of the film, and without getting 0:21:46.080 --> 0:21:49.080 into spoilers, and I promise we won't. I will mention 0:21:49.200 --> 0:21:51.440 something else about that scene, so you'll know what I'm 0:21:51.600 --> 0:21:53.560 referring to at least there, Josh, and I think other 0:21:53.640 --> 0:21:57.280 listeners who have seen the film will know what I'm referencing. 0:21:57.720 --> 0:22:00.520