WEBVTT - Ep. 803: Mindsets of the Whitetail Masters: Tony Peterson 0:00:01.320 --> 0:00:04.640 Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, your guide to 0:00:04.680 --> 0:00:09.400 the whitetail woods, presented by First Light, creating proven versatile 0:00:09.480 --> 0:00:13.399 hunting apparel for the stand, saddle or blind. First Light 0:00:13.880 --> 0:00:18.759 Go Farther, Stay Longer, and now your host, Mark Kenya, 0:00:19.239 --> 0:00:22.200 Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast. 0:00:22.360 --> 0:00:25.160 This week on the show, we are continuing our series 0:00:25.280 --> 0:00:30.040 exploring the habits, mindsets, routines and methods of the best 0:00:30.120 --> 0:00:33.160 deer hunters in the world. And today's guest is mister 0:00:33.240 --> 0:00:43.240 Tony Peterson. All right, welcome to the wir Ton Podcast, 0:00:43.360 --> 0:00:48.879 brought to you by First Lights. And today on that note, 0:00:49.600 --> 0:00:52.880 historically we've talked about First Light bringing you this podcast 0:00:52.960 --> 0:00:55.360 and their camera for Conservation initiative and all that kind 0:00:55.360 --> 0:00:57.920 of good stuff, which is still ongoing. But today we 0:00:58.080 --> 0:01:02.160 also have some different excited First Light whitetail news that 0:01:02.720 --> 0:01:05.000 I want to quickly tell you about before we get 0:01:05.040 --> 0:01:09.039 to this Mindsets of the whitetail Masters podcast and in 0:01:09.080 --> 0:01:12.920 a special edition of our Mindsets of the whitetail Masters podcast. 0:01:12.959 --> 0:01:15.280 Because the guy who's on here today, I wouldn't call 0:01:15.319 --> 0:01:17.360 him a white tail master. He's more of a knucklehead. 0:01:17.360 --> 0:01:21.120 But somehow he slipped his way in here. But I'm kidding. 0:01:21.400 --> 0:01:25.360 I'm kidding. But before we get to that, and while 0:01:25.400 --> 0:01:30.360 I still have Tony on mute, we have to talk 0:01:30.440 --> 0:01:34.200 about first Lights brand new as of just a couple 0:01:34.280 --> 0:01:39.720 of days ago, launch of are revamped, completely new white 0:01:39.720 --> 0:01:44.399 tail system. Three new whitetail systems have launched as of 0:01:44.520 --> 0:01:48.680 July thirtieth, twenty twenty four. Tony and I both got 0:01:48.680 --> 0:01:53.160 to be a part of that process, you know, prototyping 0:01:53.160 --> 0:01:57.360 this gear for like three years. I've been involved in 0:01:57.840 --> 0:02:00.520 kind of conference calls and zoom meetings and back and 0:02:00.560 --> 0:02:04.000 forth feedback sessions discussing what we liked about the old stuff, 0:02:04.040 --> 0:02:06.800 what we didn't like about the old stuff, what are 0:02:06.800 --> 0:02:09.200 all the little things and changes that we would like 0:02:09.280 --> 0:02:11.600 to see made. You know, I think something that Tony 0:02:11.639 --> 0:02:14.079 and I have talked a lot about within our deer 0:02:14.160 --> 0:02:17.800 hunting kind of world is the importance of the little details, 0:02:18.040 --> 0:02:20.680 the tiny tweaks, all these little one percent things that 0:02:20.760 --> 0:02:23.280 stack up and end up making a big difference in 0:02:23.320 --> 0:02:26.560 the end. That's the approach that we've tried to take 0:02:26.600 --> 0:02:30.400 with this new gear, and so that's that's at a 0:02:30.480 --> 0:02:33.160 very high level. What's now dropped there is the new 0:02:33.320 --> 0:02:39.880 phase system, the core system and the thermic system. The 0:02:39.919 --> 0:02:43.480 phase is going to be well, you know, Tony, do 0:02:43.520 --> 0:02:46.079 you wanna do you wanna run through any thoughts or 0:02:46.120 --> 0:02:49.280 sharing quick thoughts before I walk through a quick system overview? 0:02:49.480 --> 0:02:52.680 Yeah, man, I think I think it might just help. 0:02:53.440 --> 0:02:56.440 You know, you you've mentioned that we helped kind of 0:02:56.720 --> 0:02:58.840 r and D this stuff and work on it. But 0:02:58.880 --> 0:03:01.880 I think that's sort of a throwaway statement. I don't 0:03:01.880 --> 0:03:07.359 think people understand what goes into revamping three different lineups 0:03:07.440 --> 0:03:11.000 for you know, basically any part of the season, you know, 0:03:11.040 --> 0:03:13.560 whether whether you're hunting early or you hunt down south 0:03:13.760 --> 0:03:17.880 or through right up to Canada horrible late December type 0:03:17.880 --> 0:03:20.560 of weather. But what I thought was so cool about 0:03:20.560 --> 0:03:23.400 this process. You know, we spend time sitting around a 0:03:23.480 --> 0:03:26.600 table with the people who actually put this stuff together, 0:03:26.919 --> 0:03:30.240 and you know, in July and Idaho three years ago 0:03:30.320 --> 0:03:33.320 or whatever, it was talking about what we want to see, 0:03:34.000 --> 0:03:38.040 and these things go through iterations and you know, they 0:03:38.680 --> 0:03:40.920 they do a lot of behind the scenes stuff and 0:03:40.960 --> 0:03:43.160 it bounces back and forth with us where we get 0:03:43.200 --> 0:03:45.640 to try this stuff out in the field and it's 0:03:45.680 --> 0:03:49.320 amazing to be a part of that and go hunt 0:03:49.960 --> 0:03:53.680 really nasty conditions and then be able to text somebody 0:03:53.800 --> 0:03:56.640 or email somebody from a tree stand and be like, hey, 0:03:56.840 --> 0:03:59.240 this little thing is not working for me, or like 0:03:59.400 --> 0:04:01.400 I love this or I hate this or whatever, and 0:04:01.440 --> 0:04:04.240 you can you can affect change, like in real time 0:04:04.840 --> 0:04:07.480 while you're actually hunting with this stuff. And there's you know, 0:04:07.480 --> 0:04:09.480 it's not just you and I working on this right Like, 0:04:09.480 --> 0:04:12.360 there's so we had so many people out testing this 0:04:12.400 --> 0:04:15.880 stuff out on actual hunts that people can watch, you know, 0:04:15.960 --> 0:04:17.719 coming up here pretty soon that we filmed for the 0:04:17.760 --> 0:04:21.400 last few years. It's pretty incredible process. There's so I 0:04:21.720 --> 0:04:25.720 didn't know what really went into that until being involved 0:04:25.800 --> 0:04:26.919 in this latest wave. 0:04:28.120 --> 0:04:31.360 Yeah, yeah, you're right, and I think an important thing. 0:04:31.480 --> 0:04:34.760 And I guess I have some assumptions about how other 0:04:34.800 --> 0:04:39.160 folks do this. I can't say with real perspective, but 0:04:39.200 --> 0:04:42.960 I have assumptions that the other folks do not have 0:04:43.160 --> 0:04:47.240 the team of people that we had, you know, ground 0:04:47.320 --> 0:04:49.640 troothing this stuff, back checking this stuff, putting it through 0:04:49.640 --> 0:04:52.400 the paces. I mean, you were out there. I was 0:04:52.440 --> 0:04:56.200 out there, Levi Morgan, Andy May, Taylor Chamberlain, the guy 0:04:56.240 --> 0:04:59.479 has from Hartlan Bowhunter. You know a lot of people 0:04:59.560 --> 0:05:03.159 that take this stuff really really serious, put this stuff 0:05:03.200 --> 0:05:06.480 through the paces, and you know, we would reach out 0:05:06.520 --> 0:05:08.000 to our buddy Greg at First Light and the other 0:05:08.000 --> 0:05:10.280 guy's working on say hey, this thing sucks or this 0:05:10.320 --> 0:05:12.240 thing didn't work, or this thing needs to be changed 0:05:12.360 --> 0:05:15.960 or whatever, and we would get changes made, which is 0:05:16.200 --> 0:05:19.000 like you said, it's encouraging, it's exciting. And what we 0:05:19.080 --> 0:05:21.760 have now is a set of products that I think 0:05:21.760 --> 0:05:24.560 we're pretty stoked to be using and excited that the 0:05:24.600 --> 0:05:27.719 rest of the world now gets to see and use. 0:05:28.279 --> 0:05:32.159 And like I mentioned, as of July thirtieth, it's out there. 0:05:32.279 --> 0:05:35.400 You can see him over at first light dot com. 0:05:35.800 --> 0:05:38.600 There's the three sets. Like I mentioned, We've got the 0:05:38.640 --> 0:05:43.960 Phase system, which is going to be the kind of 0:05:44.080 --> 0:05:47.720 soft shell replacement in the past. We put the catalyst 0:05:47.800 --> 0:05:51.440 in this bucket, so if anyone's used the catalyst, this 0:05:51.480 --> 0:05:55.000 is kind of within that use case bucket. It is 0:05:55.080 --> 0:06:02.599 a wind proof, incredibly silent soft ship all jacket and bib. 0:06:03.600 --> 0:06:06.279 It's got a light flea sexterior. That's something that a 0:06:06.279 --> 0:06:08.599 lot of people have wanted. People really like that flea 0:06:08.680 --> 0:06:12.159 sex tier because it's so quiet. We finally now have 0:06:12.320 --> 0:06:15.919 that and it's the quietest wind proof soft shell out there. 0:06:17.200 --> 0:06:19.360 That's the phase that's gonna be something you can wear 0:06:19.400 --> 0:06:21.960 earlier in the year, or you could wear it later 0:06:21.960 --> 0:06:23.280 into the year if you layer a whole bunch of 0:06:23.279 --> 0:06:25.960 stuff underneath it, but it's not heavily insulated, it's more 0:06:25.960 --> 0:06:28.320 of that outer shell and light fleece insulation. 0:06:29.160 --> 0:06:34.120 Then you bump in reverstile system. Yeah, yeah, I. 0:06:34.080 --> 0:06:37.360 Think that's the key thing there, versatility. The next one 0:06:37.440 --> 0:06:40.479 is the Core, and that is you know, called the 0:06:40.520 --> 0:06:42.680 Core because it's for the core of your season. That is, 0:06:42.920 --> 0:06:45.920 it fills the bucket that the Solitude used to So 0:06:45.960 --> 0:06:48.000 we were wearing and talking about the Solitude is like 0:06:48.000 --> 0:06:50.400 that peak of the rot kind of kit. Now we 0:06:50.480 --> 0:06:53.000 have the Core for the core of the season. It 0:06:53.160 --> 0:06:56.599 is a new insulation package in there, so it's it's 0:06:56.640 --> 0:07:00.400 actually warmer than the Solitude was, but it's significantly and 0:07:00.440 --> 0:07:04.640 more packable. And then the exterior is the same as 0:07:04.640 --> 0:07:08.800 what we have on the Source jacket. So everyone who's 0:07:08.880 --> 0:07:10.920 used the Source loves the Source. Right, that's our white 0:07:10.920 --> 0:07:15.320 tail puffy, very silent, but still heavy duty and puffy 0:07:15.360 --> 0:07:18.320 and packable. Well, now you essentially have that but built 0:07:18.360 --> 0:07:22.520 out with you know, improved, you know, white tail specific 0:07:22.560 --> 0:07:25.600 feature set with a new kit link pass through system, 0:07:25.680 --> 0:07:29.560 with new removable hoods, new fit and feel with the collar, 0:07:29.720 --> 0:07:34.120 fit and feel with the wrists, a whole bunch of things. 0:07:34.240 --> 0:07:36.680 I won't go through every single little feature set right now, 0:07:37.480 --> 0:07:40.280 but I will say that all of these feature improvements 0:07:40.360 --> 0:07:44.160 are across all three systems Phase, Core, and Thermic, So 0:07:46.120 --> 0:07:49.280 that is the same. You'll just have a different fabrics, 0:07:49.800 --> 0:07:52.600 different insulations for each kit. So there's the Phase, like 0:07:52.640 --> 0:07:55.520 we talked about, versatile or earlier than the Core, which 0:07:55.560 --> 0:07:59.160 is like you're, you know, twenty degrees through forty degrees, 0:07:59.240 --> 0:08:01.200 kind of like the sweet spot for the core, you know, 0:08:01.240 --> 0:08:05.680 that rut, hopeful rut temperatures. And then there's the Thermic, 0:08:05.800 --> 0:08:08.080 which is like that you're never going to be cold again, 0:08:08.600 --> 0:08:13.600 super late season, super nasty blizzard, freezing, freezing, freezing cold temperatures, 0:08:14.200 --> 0:08:19.120 very burly late season suits, and that again has the 0:08:19.160 --> 0:08:22.960 same feature set, but a ton of insulation, a very thick, 0:08:23.080 --> 0:08:29.000 like heavy piled fleece interior even in there. So if 0:08:29.040 --> 0:08:30.920 you're looking to be super duper cozy and you hunt 0:08:30.920 --> 0:08:34.079 in North Dakota or northern Minnesota or Canada or whatever 0:08:34.120 --> 0:08:39.920 it is. That's a great option. So I guess I 0:08:39.920 --> 0:08:41.559 don't want to spend too much time on it and 0:08:41.840 --> 0:08:44.800 bore folks. But that's that's I think the high level. 0:08:44.840 --> 0:08:46.400 Is there any other quick thing you want to make 0:08:46.400 --> 0:08:47.240 sure relief folks with? 0:08:47.280 --> 0:08:49.880 On that note, you kind of touched on it, but 0:08:49.920 --> 0:08:52.559 I think you know, I know that Andy May drove 0:08:52.880 --> 0:08:55.719 Greg Nutts for years about our collars and a few 0:08:55.840 --> 0:08:58.160 like the little like a feel of the like a 0:08:58.200 --> 0:09:00.880 few of the little fit things that you kind of 0:09:00.920 --> 0:09:02.520 you know, you look at them on a shelf for 0:09:03.040 --> 0:09:04.959 shopping online, you would never know and then you put 0:09:04.960 --> 0:09:06.599 them on and you're like, oh, this is you know, 0:09:06.720 --> 0:09:08.880 works for some people, doesn't work for others. Like man, 0:09:09.360 --> 0:09:12.600 they did a good job addressing that stuff, you know, 0:09:12.600 --> 0:09:15.160 and when you say you like the core is sort 0:09:15.160 --> 0:09:19.040 of the heart of the rut type of of system. Dude. 0:09:19.080 --> 0:09:22.320 I wore that sucker sitting all day in a blizzard 0:09:22.400 --> 0:09:24.480 in North Dakota, just because I didn't think I was 0:09:24.520 --> 0:09:27.400 going to be dealing with weather that bad. And this 0:09:27.640 --> 0:09:31.400 was like weather that would call for thermic on paper 0:09:31.720 --> 0:09:34.440 all day long. And we sat out there all day 0:09:35.080 --> 0:09:37.520 in that prairie wind killed the buck at last light, 0:09:37.640 --> 0:09:41.800 and it was it was gnarly and that was our 0:09:41.920 --> 0:09:44.120 mid layer system, but it was you know, when you 0:09:44.160 --> 0:09:46.920 start blocking the wind and dealing with some of the 0:09:46.960 --> 0:09:50.640 materials they've put in there, it's just it's amazing what 0:09:50.720 --> 0:09:53.160 a good job they've done. And how much more like 0:09:53.760 --> 0:09:55.040 I don't know if you feel this way, but like, 0:09:55.040 --> 0:09:58.440 how much more form fitting our stuff has gotten like 0:09:58.480 --> 0:10:00.640 this this new these new releases are awesome. 0:10:01.720 --> 0:10:05.920 Yeah, the core especially is very noticeable compared to the Solitude. 0:10:05.960 --> 0:10:10.239 So it's just much lighter, much more packable, much there's 0:10:10.400 --> 0:10:13.680 less insulating fabric in it. It feels like it's much less bulky. 0:10:13.720 --> 0:10:16.600 You can stuff it down into your backpack much more easily, 0:10:16.640 --> 0:10:17.960 like if you don't want to wear that jacket in 0:10:18.080 --> 0:10:21.600 hiking to the stand. But because it's premium Loft gold, 0:10:21.600 --> 0:10:25.240 it's a it's a higher quality insulating material. You actually 0:10:25.280 --> 0:10:32.280 get significantly higher insulating value in this lighter, packable, seemingly 0:10:32.360 --> 0:10:35.120 lighter weight garment, which which I which I really like. 0:10:35.360 --> 0:10:37.360 And it's all all three of these systems are all 0:10:37.400 --> 0:10:41.200 one wind proof, so you know you're gonna have no 0:10:41.240 --> 0:10:44.439 wind problems no matter which version you decide it is 0:10:44.520 --> 0:10:46.840 right for your setup or for where you're You know, 0:10:46.880 --> 0:10:50.199 your region of hunting is the most So yeah, I 0:10:50.200 --> 0:10:52.840 guess I'll leave it at that. I'd say go to 0:10:52.960 --> 0:10:55.360 first light dot com, dive into the details on this 0:10:55.400 --> 0:10:58.040 stuff if you're interested. We'll have a lot more on 0:10:58.080 --> 0:11:01.320 this in the future, lots to share as far as 0:11:01.360 --> 0:11:04.240 you know, our favorite pieces or our setups and our 0:11:04.320 --> 0:11:06.800 kits and what we're using in different situations. But for now, 0:11:07.480 --> 0:11:12.200 you're where it's out, it's exciting worth checking out. And 0:11:12.280 --> 0:11:15.000 with that, the one other thing that's out now and 0:11:15.040 --> 0:11:17.240 exciting and worth checking out is a thing that you 0:11:17.280 --> 0:11:20.320 and I Tony have been working on closely, which is 0:11:20.320 --> 0:11:25.559 our new white Tail edu video series. You want to 0:11:25.559 --> 0:11:26.320 tell folks about that. 0:11:26.440 --> 0:11:29.680 Yeah, we're on the the Meat Eater YouTube clips channel. 0:11:30.400 --> 0:11:36.600 We've been dropping some new content where we have addressed 0:11:37.640 --> 0:11:40.640 like the some of the really common questions we get 0:11:40.800 --> 0:11:45.640 that don't have simple answers, you know, like just as 0:11:45.640 --> 0:11:47.760 an example, the one, you know, the first one we 0:11:47.880 --> 0:11:50.880 dropped was about what do deer really eat and when? 0:11:51.679 --> 0:11:54.360 Because it's kind of if if you took a brand 0:11:54.400 --> 0:11:57.439 new hunter and they were like, hey, what a deer eat. 0:11:57.840 --> 0:12:01.120 You could answer that so many different ways. And we 0:12:01.240 --> 0:12:03.520 realized as we were kind of conceptualizing this thing that 0:12:03.559 --> 0:12:06.720 there's a lot of these sort of universal questions that 0:12:06.800 --> 0:12:09.720 we get that just need sort of a deep dive 0:12:09.840 --> 0:12:14.720 answer that's not just super regionally specific, that covers everybody. 0:12:14.840 --> 0:12:17.840 And you know, so in that one, just to just 0:12:18.360 --> 0:12:21.080 kind of lay it out, you know, yeah, we talked 0:12:21.120 --> 0:12:24.599 about egg and destination, food sources and food plots, but 0:12:24.640 --> 0:12:28.960 you get pretty deep into soft mask hard masked brows 0:12:29.080 --> 0:12:31.640 and the entirety of the white tail's diet, no matter 0:12:31.679 --> 0:12:34.160 where you're hunting, and whether you're on public or private, 0:12:34.240 --> 0:12:36.560 or you're in the big woods up north or some 0:12:36.840 --> 0:12:40.040 real egg heavy section of Middle America, and it's just 0:12:40.240 --> 0:12:44.280 every topic is like that. So deer tracks, rubs, stuff 0:12:44.320 --> 0:12:47.480 that sounds pretty basic, and maybe somebody who's been you know, 0:12:47.520 --> 0:12:50.600 bow hunting for forty five years, maybe you know, maybe 0:12:50.640 --> 0:12:54.120 it's not entirely for them as much, but for most 0:12:54.200 --> 0:12:56.000 of the white tail audience we hear from, it was 0:12:56.040 --> 0:12:58.920 just kind of a way to get this this educational 0:12:59.360 --> 0:13:02.400 piece out there, this series and cover so many of 0:13:02.440 --> 0:13:05.160 these fundamental, fundamental questions we get asked all the time. 0:13:06.320 --> 0:13:08.480 Yeah, and I think and I think a key thing 0:13:08.480 --> 0:13:10.840 that we tried to do was with every one of 0:13:10.880 --> 0:13:14.640 these major topics, which we always get questions about, is 0:13:14.679 --> 0:13:17.600 that we try to establish a foundation, so making sure like, 0:13:17.640 --> 0:13:19.839 no matter who you are, you are going to now 0:13:19.960 --> 0:13:23.000 understand the language and the context of what we're talking about. 0:13:23.040 --> 0:13:25.080 So if you listen to a future Wired Hunt episode 0:13:25.520 --> 0:13:27.760 after watching these videos, now all of a sudden, you'll 0:13:27.840 --> 0:13:30.400 understand what we're talking about. You get you'll get what 0:13:30.440 --> 0:13:33.240 we're getting at. But then also we would we would 0:13:33.320 --> 0:13:36.120 try to end with that next level of how do 0:13:36.160 --> 0:13:38.400 you use this? How do you interpret this? How do 0:13:38.679 --> 0:13:41.280 how do we get from just identifying deer tracks to 0:13:41.400 --> 0:13:44.400 then identifying the little nuances that deer tracks tell us, 0:13:44.440 --> 0:13:46.400 to then also thinking about how do we connect all 0:13:46.440 --> 0:13:49.160 these dots to formulate a hunting strategy. I think we 0:13:49.240 --> 0:13:51.160 tried to do that with each of these different topics. 0:13:51.200 --> 0:13:52.959 So there's gonna be a little bit something for that 0:13:53.400 --> 0:13:56.520 beginner all the way to you know, that more experienced 0:13:56.520 --> 0:13:58.840 deer hunter who's just trying to shore up their foundation, 0:13:59.200 --> 0:14:02.240 get some good remind and maybe get an interesting aha 0:14:02.440 --> 0:14:05.880 moment or two. Throughout But the idea here was to 0:14:05.960 --> 0:14:08.960 get anyone who listens to the Wired Hunt podcast who's 0:14:09.000 --> 0:14:11.680 been jumping in and maybe sometimes feels like, man, they're 0:14:11.679 --> 0:14:13.760 talking about a few things here that I'm not exactly 0:14:13.800 --> 0:14:15.920 sure what they're getting at, Like it's a little over 0:14:15.960 --> 0:14:19.440 my head. If you follow along with this edu series, 0:14:19.880 --> 0:14:21.880 you shouldn't have that problem in the future. So if 0:14:21.920 --> 0:14:24.400 you're new if you have newer friends, if you've got 0:14:24.440 --> 0:14:26.880 folks who are you know, a little bit earlier in 0:14:26.920 --> 0:14:28.760 their journey than you are, you know, if you're a 0:14:28.840 --> 0:14:31.600 forty five years in, guy, pass these along to them, 0:14:31.960 --> 0:14:35.160 check them out yourself. I imagine we're going to continue 0:14:35.200 --> 0:14:37.720 to do more of these as we get feedback and 0:14:37.800 --> 0:14:40.240 get you know, more ideas about the other topics that 0:14:40.280 --> 0:14:43.120 folks have questions about that want this kind of treatment on. 0:14:44.360 --> 0:14:47.480 But yeah, that's that's the idea. So the first one 0:14:47.520 --> 0:14:52.320 came out in July. There's probably three or four of 0:14:52.360 --> 0:14:55.520 them out by now when this episode drops, So check 0:14:55.560 --> 0:14:59.360 out out over at the Meat either Clips YouTube channel, 0:14:59.440 --> 0:15:02.440 so that's Meat Eater Clips C l I p s 0:15:03.560 --> 0:15:06.000 and subscribe there so you'll see all the new episodes 0:15:06.000 --> 0:15:10.080 when they drop. I'll say there was one of these 0:15:10.120 --> 0:15:11.880 episodes that I don't know if it'll make it into 0:15:11.880 --> 0:15:14.360 the cut, but I literally cried. I was laughing so 0:15:14.440 --> 0:15:17.760 hard while we were trying to film it. So I 0:15:17.800 --> 0:15:19.760 don't know if that's gonna see the lighted day or not. 0:15:19.960 --> 0:15:22.720 But but there is a moment where I'm crying and 0:15:22.880 --> 0:15:26.520 Tony called me an asshole or something. So with that 0:15:26.600 --> 0:15:29.040 only pretty pretty rich if it makes it out, then. 0:15:30.640 --> 0:15:32.040 I was crying for a different reason. 0:15:32.080 --> 0:15:41.560 Why, Yeah, one of the dumbest things I've ever done. Anyways. Anyways, 0:15:42.360 --> 0:15:44.480 with with all that kind of housekeeping out of the way, 0:15:45.200 --> 0:15:48.080 I do want to get you, Tony, to uh to 0:15:48.280 --> 0:15:52.360 run through this series I've been doing and and I 0:15:52.480 --> 0:15:55.040 joked at the beginning that you were not qualified for this, 0:15:55.160 --> 0:15:58.160 but I, in all seriousness and at lack or at 0:15:58.240 --> 0:16:01.520 risk of blowing up your head too much, I do 0:16:01.880 --> 0:16:04.640 truly view you as one of the best white tail 0:16:04.680 --> 0:16:08.400 hunters in the world. And I say that begrudgingly, but. 0:16:08.800 --> 0:16:11.880 Well, I appreciate that, buddy. It warm It warms my 0:16:12.000 --> 0:16:14.440 heart to hear you have to just pull that out 0:16:16.240 --> 0:16:20.960 and say that, yeah, I know it does. That's gonna 0:16:21.000 --> 0:16:24.000 that's gonna carry me for a long time buddy. I'm 0:16:24.000 --> 0:16:28.760 gonna live off that ship, so moving on. 0:16:30.080 --> 0:16:32.000 No, I really do think that what I was, what 0:16:32.040 --> 0:16:33.920 I was trying to achieve with this series, as I've 0:16:33.920 --> 0:16:36.920 talked about over the last few weeks, is trying to 0:16:37.080 --> 0:16:40.400 better understand how the best of the best deer hunters 0:16:40.920 --> 0:16:43.160 do what they do. But I'm not as I'm not 0:16:43.200 --> 0:16:45.960 as concerned with like, oh, you know, do you set 0:16:46.040 --> 0:16:47.760 up on rubs or do you set up on scrapes. 0:16:47.800 --> 0:16:49.680 It's not that kind of stuff I'm interested in. It's 0:16:49.720 --> 0:16:54.840 the the mechanics, like the decision making, the mental models, 0:16:55.240 --> 0:16:57.840 the way these people think, the way these people deal 0:16:57.880 --> 0:17:01.239 with adversity, adversity, the way these people deal with success, 0:17:01.760 --> 0:17:04.040 all that kind of stuff. I want to understand that 0:17:04.160 --> 0:17:07.560 kind of behind the curtains kind of thing. And you know, 0:17:07.800 --> 0:17:09.680 you and I have talked about the nuts and bolts 0:17:09.680 --> 0:17:14.159 of deer hunting at Nausen for years now, but I 0:17:14.200 --> 0:17:16.040 don't think we've covered some of this stuff with you. 0:17:16.520 --> 0:17:22.240 And you obviously are very thoughtful, analytical, and I think 0:17:22.240 --> 0:17:23.640 you're gonna have a lot to share on this one. 0:17:23.680 --> 0:17:25.639 So I'm excited to run you through with this series 0:17:25.640 --> 0:17:41.600 of questions I'd say the only kind of thing I 0:17:41.640 --> 0:17:46.000 would tell you is the more that you can tell 0:17:46.080 --> 0:17:50.000 me and us about your internal dialogue when you think 0:17:50.000 --> 0:17:52.160 about this stuff or when you're in these moments, the 0:17:52.160 --> 0:17:54.720 more interesting it is. I think that's been Like the 0:17:54.760 --> 0:17:56.280 thing I've tried to get to all of our guests 0:17:56.359 --> 0:17:58.399 is like, what's going on in your head when this 0:17:58.440 --> 0:18:01.000 thing happens? What do you say to yourself or what 0:18:01.000 --> 0:18:03.199 do you what are the demons you're wrestling with? And 0:18:03.240 --> 0:18:04.840 I know you've got some demons, Tony, so this one 0:18:04.880 --> 0:18:08.880 should be good man. 0:18:09.000 --> 0:18:10.879 Let's go. Yeah, here we go. 0:18:11.800 --> 0:18:16.080 So are you? Are you gamed for that? All right? 0:18:16.160 --> 0:18:18.119 So we're gonna kick it off here with a with 0:18:18.160 --> 0:18:21.680 a high level understanding of how you view success and failure. 0:18:22.000 --> 0:18:26.639 So how would you define for you, dear hunting success. 0:18:29.200 --> 0:18:34.560 I would say. I would say I started out as 0:18:34.560 --> 0:18:36.840 a hunter, viewing success is just being able to kill 0:18:36.840 --> 0:18:38.600 a deer. And it took me a long time to 0:18:38.600 --> 0:18:41.359 get there. I went through the whole stages and then 0:18:41.400 --> 0:18:44.760 it was killing you know x dear wy deer all 0:18:44.760 --> 0:18:50.639 the way up. But really, for me, now, if I 0:18:50.680 --> 0:18:52.679 do the work to put myself in a position to 0:18:52.720 --> 0:18:57.159 have a chance that really matters to me. Think it's 0:18:57.280 --> 0:19:01.080 very satisfying for me at this point in my life 0:19:01.320 --> 0:19:05.000 to you know, encounter a new situation whatever that is, 0:19:05.240 --> 0:19:06.680 you know, even if it's a place I've been hunting 0:19:06.680 --> 0:19:08.600 a long time, but there's new people there, you know, 0:19:09.359 --> 0:19:12.000 new crop rotation, whatever, I don't I don't care. Or 0:19:12.000 --> 0:19:15.080 if it's going someplace to public land hunt for four days, 0:19:16.040 --> 0:19:18.679 putting myself in a position like doing the work to 0:19:18.720 --> 0:19:21.520 get into the position where I'm like, I have a 0:19:21.600 --> 0:19:24.639 real shot, like it might not I might not get one, 0:19:24.800 --> 0:19:28.359 it might not work out, but seeing that deer, or 0:19:28.400 --> 0:19:31.560 putting myself in a position where I'm like, I believe 0:19:31.760 --> 0:19:34.520 I did what it takes to get here, and a 0:19:34.600 --> 0:19:36.720 lot of times it doesn't break your way, but for me, 0:19:37.760 --> 0:19:40.919 it really It bothers me to not fill tags, but 0:19:40.960 --> 0:19:44.400 not like it used to. It bothers me more than 0:19:44.480 --> 0:19:47.760 anything to feel like I settled at any level, Like 0:19:47.800 --> 0:19:51.040 I just I don't like that feeling. I like feeling 0:19:51.080 --> 0:19:55.400 like you scouted, you put the work in, however that 0:19:55.480 --> 0:19:58.960 may go for whatever hunt I'm on, and just getting 0:19:58.960 --> 0:20:01.560 to the point where it's like he's there, but he 0:20:01.600 --> 0:20:03.640 didn't come in or he came in and he shot him, 0:20:03.800 --> 0:20:06.000 or he got down windy and he winded you, but 0:20:06.040 --> 0:20:08.080 it was you know, he was at forty yards. Like 0:20:09.320 --> 0:20:13.080 those are like successful moments to me, you know. And 0:20:13.000 --> 0:20:15.000 and of course I like filling tags, but I like 0:20:15.560 --> 0:20:19.080 feeling like I just I did everything I could to 0:20:19.119 --> 0:20:19.520 get there. 0:20:21.480 --> 0:20:25.080 Are you able to feel that way in the moment, 0:20:25.560 --> 0:20:29.520 like are you able to judge it? Or what am 0:20:29.560 --> 0:20:31.800 I trying to say here? Are you able to recognize 0:20:31.800 --> 0:20:34.879 that success a non tag feeling success in the moment 0:20:35.080 --> 0:20:37.520 or is it months later after the season when you 0:20:37.560 --> 0:20:39.840 can look back on it and say, Okay, yeah I 0:20:39.880 --> 0:20:42.600 didn't fill the tag here, or yeah I muffed that opportunity, 0:20:42.800 --> 0:20:46.399 but it was successful because of ab and C. I 0:20:46.480 --> 0:20:50.159 say this just because I feel this. I say the 0:20:50.200 --> 0:20:52.280 same thing you're saying, and I'm trying to get there, 0:20:52.320 --> 0:20:54.760 But I also struggle with it being easier said than 0:20:54.800 --> 0:20:57.000 done sometimes in the moment when there's all this like 0:20:57.040 --> 0:20:59.000 in season pressure and expectations. 0:20:59.160 --> 0:21:04.320 So it depends, it depends what happens. Like if I 0:21:04.320 --> 0:21:06.080 whiff on a big one, it'll take I'll have a 0:21:06.080 --> 0:21:08.520 little pity party, right or if you know, just if 0:21:08.560 --> 0:21:12.879 I just make a dumb mistake. But I'm pretty good 0:21:13.080 --> 0:21:17.600 now at recognizing in the moment when when it's when 0:21:17.640 --> 0:21:20.159 I feel like it's come together for me, you know 0:21:20.200 --> 0:21:23.240 what I mean? And so and the other part of 0:21:23.280 --> 0:21:27.520 that is the thing that drives me to keep doing 0:21:27.600 --> 0:21:32.119 this stuff is when I don't fill those tags. You 0:21:32.160 --> 0:21:39.800 know that that looks like failure on paper. The places 0:21:39.800 --> 0:21:42.280 I head back to and the new places I hunt 0:21:42.440 --> 0:21:44.440 and that you know they're trying to hunt at different 0:21:44.440 --> 0:21:47.200 times of the season or trying new stuff out almost 0:21:47.320 --> 0:21:50.879 always stems from me getting my ass kicked somehow, and 0:21:50.960 --> 0:21:54.640 so it instead of like dwelling on it and being like, man, 0:21:54.640 --> 0:21:57.000 I paid for this non resident tag and I ate 0:21:57.040 --> 0:22:00.239 it and that sucks a lot of that stuff just 0:22:00.240 --> 0:22:02.919 makes me really want to go back next year, you know. 0:22:02.960 --> 0:22:06.960 And anybody who's who's elk hunted, you know, like the 0:22:07.000 --> 0:22:09.200 first time yell hunt like it, it takes you one 0:22:09.240 --> 0:22:11.439