Speaker 1: You know, people sometimes want to compliment me and say, wow, you,
Speaker 1: how did you do that character? And I'm like, I
Speaker 1: was doing you your How I did that character? You know,
Speaker 1: it's it's not as crazy or complex as people would think.
Speaker 1: If you can have the fearlessness and specificity to to
Speaker 1: dive into those things that you've experienced. This is Paul
Speaker 1: Walter Houser and I am a liberal and a Christian.
Speaker 1: Hi again, listeners, and welcome to a brand new spanking
Speaker 1: episode of Off the Beat. I'm your host, Brian Baumgartner.
Speaker 1: As you just heard, Paul Walter Houser is on the
Speaker 1: program today. I am so excited about this. I'm a huge,
Speaker 1: huge fan of his work. Never had met him before,
Speaker 1: but I think you're going to enjoy this deep dive
Speaker 1: into his career. Now, to give you an idea of
Speaker 1: Paul's range, let me just list some of the characters
Speaker 1: he's taken on during his career so far. Bodyguard Sean
Speaker 1: Eckert in I Tanya, a white supremacist in Black Klansman,
Speaker 1: the unexpected and wrongfully accused hero in Richard Jewel, the
Speaker 1: eccentric Stingray in Cobra Kai, one of Cruela's henchman in
Speaker 1: Cruella and the incredibly creepy serial killer in a show.
Speaker 1: I recently became a very, very big fan of Blackbird.
Speaker 1: I admire Paul so much. He has this ability to
Speaker 1: take on the physicality and the voices of the characters
Speaker 1: he portrays. It's stunning and you never know what he's
Speaker 1: gonna pull out of the bag next. So I was
Speaker 1: excited to dive into his journey as an actor, as
Speaker 1: a writer, and as an overall stand up guy. I'm
Speaker 1: not gonna make you wait any longer. Are you excited?
Speaker 1: I sure as hell am. Paul Walter Houser. Everybody, Bubble
Speaker 1: and Squeak. I love it, Bubble and Squeak on Bubble
Speaker 1: and Squeaker, cooking it every month, left over from the Nabole.
Speaker 1: What's up, Paul? Bryan? How are you, dude? I'm all right.
Speaker 1: How are you? I'm good, really good to see you.
Speaker 1: I I my buddy Ryan Zachary, who I haven't seen
Speaker 1: in a bit. Yeah. Yeah. He told me he was
Speaker 1: doing your podcast and said you should come on. I
Speaker 1: was like, are you kidding me? In two seconds, let's
Speaker 1: do it. I appreciate it so much. I'm a huge
Speaker 1: fan of yours and your work, particularly Blackbird, that comedy
Speaker 1: I did Blackbird. Yeah, yeah, you're you're a You're a
Speaker 1: real stand up comedian that somehow has totally changed the
Speaker 1: course of your career, which I definitely want to talk about.
Speaker 1: You grew up in a place I'm going this week,
Speaker 1: Grand Rapids. I'm going this week. I think technically I
Speaker 1: will end up in Big Rapids. Farrish State University, Farris
Speaker 1: State University. I know it. Well. I almost went there,
Speaker 1: you did, I almost went there. Yeah, I heard you
Speaker 1: only went to college for like ten minutes though. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I was not long for the university life. I never
Speaker 1: liked school. I just liked extracurriculars and socializing. So I
Speaker 1: went to a little parochial Christian college in River Forest,
Speaker 1: Oak Park, Illinois, like near Chicago, and that that was
Speaker 1: fun for two and a half semess years, and then
Speaker 1: I dropped out and tried to do the Hollywood thing. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you grew up in Michigan. When did you realize that
Speaker 1: performing was something you want to do? I know you
Speaker 1: started stand up very early, but when when? When? When
Speaker 1: when did you first realize you may want to go
Speaker 1: in that direction? I think I always liked performing, and
Speaker 1: I had kind of a fearless social thing where I
Speaker 1: I would get up in front of company at my
Speaker 1: house and do impersonations of family members or recite Saturday
Speaker 1: Night live sketches. Remember being like eight or nine years old,
Speaker 1: ten years old doing impersonations of Jack Nicholson and Jimmy
Speaker 1: Stewart in the mirror. And that was the beginning. And
Speaker 1: then I did a bunch of theater and I think
Speaker 1: I did ten plays in my four years of high school.
Speaker 1: It was almost like being a two sport athlete, but
Speaker 1: for artistic endeavors, you know. And then UH started doing
Speaker 1: stand up comedy and writing screenplays at sixteen and its
Speaker 1: bought a bunch of books on screenwriting from Barnes and
Speaker 1: no Bole and devoured it. I wrote two features before
Speaker 1: I graduated high school. I was doing local shows at
Speaker 1: colleges and bars and churches in my hometown area. And
Speaker 1: then it wasn't until I auditioned to be a background actor,
Speaker 1: like an extra in this indie film with Jennifer Connelly
Speaker 1: and Ed Harris called Virginia. And I went to be
Speaker 1: an extra, but I saw the filmmaker, the writer director there,
Speaker 1: this guy Dustin Lance Black, who won the Oscar for
Speaker 1: writing the movie Milk, and I just said to him.
Speaker 1: I was like, hey, man, you know, I loved your film.
Speaker 1: It was really touching and moving, and loved your Oscar
Speaker 1: speech when he said God doesn't hate the gay youth
Speaker 1: of the world. Like I. I'm a professed Christian and
Speaker 1: kind of conservative, but I'll tell you, I I think
Speaker 1: more people need to say that and live that, and
Speaker 1: and thank you for speaking up and saying that. So
Speaker 1: it was like a minute conversation wasn't long. But whatever
Speaker 1: I said or did, he brought me back for an audition,
Speaker 1: and I booked number six on the call sheet, and
Speaker 1: I'm doing scenes with Ed Harris and his wife Amy
Speaker 1: Madigan and Jennifer Connelly. It was it was a crazy
Speaker 1: first job to get and I got to move to
Speaker 1: Hollywood with dollars and this really cool, you know thing
Speaker 1: on my resume. That's awesome. I mean, you you said
Speaker 1: you were writing. I hear you have dozens of scripts
Speaker 1: that are written. Were you more focused early on on
Speaker 1: the performing aspect of it or I mean it sounds
Speaker 1: like you were interested in everything, was it performing or writing.
Speaker 1: I loved all of it. Man, I really I was
Speaker 1: fascinated by casting. I was fascinated by production design. I
Speaker 1: loved directing short films and high school and college. I
Speaker 1: even do it now. So I was just trying to
Speaker 1: break into the business. I thought maybe if I do
Speaker 1: all these things, one of them will hit. It's kind
Speaker 1: of like playing Roulette, right. I was just like stand
Speaker 1: up comedy, screenwriting, acting, acting in drama and comedy. You know,
Speaker 1: at some point I would have just had a bake
Speaker 1: sale outside of Warner Brothers. And because I was pretty
Speaker 1: undeterred and pretty obsessed with trying to break in. You know, yeah,
Speaker 1: that experience that you had in Virginia. Do you think
Speaker 1: that that shaped you as at least a person in
Speaker 1: the business later on? I mean it shaped me in
Speaker 1: the sense that I knew that there were good people
Speaker 1: in Hollywood. That was the vibe I got, because you know,
Speaker 1: when you grow up in a ultra conservative setting and
Speaker 1: you're highly religious, it's it's easy to fall into this
Speaker 1: thing of believing that Hollywood is, uh, is this really
Speaker 1: an awful place with all these awful people? And it's like,
Speaker 1: I think it's a place full of a bunch of
Speaker 1: real regular people. But it just so happens that egos
Speaker 1: and greed and things play in a little bit more
Speaker 1: aggressively in our business. Then say, people that work for
Speaker 1: Turbo tax, you know, it's it just happens. Be an
Speaker 1: environment that plays on the the generational, you know, cyclical
Speaker 1: sins we as humans all incur and then sometimes rewards
Speaker 1: them or doesn't slap risks for some of them, and
Speaker 1: and that's its own thing. But yeah, no, I I
Speaker 1: would say that I learned that you can work with
Speaker 1: wonderful people in Hollywood. I learned to not be afraid
Speaker 1: to improvise. My whole thing was I'm not gonna ask permission,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna ask forgiveness. At that time especially, I was
Speaker 1: obsessed with the Christopher Guests mockumentaries like Waiting for Goffman,
Speaker 1: and my whole thing was, I'm gonna be one of
Speaker 1: those actors. I'm not gonna try to be Robert de Niro.
Speaker 1: I'll never be DeNiro. I can't be DeNiro, but you
Speaker 1: bet your ass. I can be ed Begley Jr. You
Speaker 1: bet your ass. I can be Fred Willard. And I
Speaker 1: went into it like that, and I was rewarded for it.
Speaker 1: Lance Black, who had an Oscar for writing is telling
Speaker 1: me he loves my improv So like that gave me
Speaker 1: a lot of confidence and let me know my my
Speaker 1: true north as a performer will always be to go
Speaker 1: with my gut instincts. I mean, you talked early on
Speaker 1: about standing up and doing impressions of family members or
Speaker 1: big movie stars of the day, Jack, etcetera. Do you
Speaker 1: feel like that influenced you in terms of creating characters,
Speaker 1: making vocal and physical choices. Is that something that was
Speaker 1: always interesting to you? Yeah, I I was. I was
Speaker 1: sitting a brunch today with our buddies. My wife and
Speaker 1: I were sitting with Ray and deb Ji Ratana. They're
Speaker 1: they're like a power couple of of they do everything
Speaker 1: from visual effects to directing to their daughters and actress
Speaker 1: like wonderful people. And we're talking and they said, how
Speaker 1: did you pick up on all these weird characteristics and
Speaker 1: choices to make for playing Larry Hall and Blackbird? You know?
Speaker 1: The answer I gave him was just I love watching people.
Speaker 1: If I'm in an airport and I have already five
Speaker 1: minutes to wait around for my flight, I'm not really
Speaker 1: begrudging or bemoaning it. It's an opportunity for me to
Speaker 1: pause and watch total strangers. This guy pulls out his
Speaker 1: sandwich from Arby's and he starts eating. Oh I noticed
Speaker 1: he's eating with the rapper half on the sandwich because
Speaker 1: he doesn't want to get his hands dirty. But then
Speaker 1: he gets arb sauce on his fingers, licks his fingers
Speaker 1: and wipes him on his pants. So clearly being sanitary
Speaker 1: doesn't matter to him, you know. It's it's about finding
Speaker 1: all the little things and all the little people and
Speaker 1: making up stories in your head of that old improv rule.
Speaker 1: If this is true, what else is true? And and
Speaker 1: those characterists that speak the greater things, both about humanity
Speaker 1: or the person in particular. So I, once again, that's me,
Speaker 1: that's me kind of ranting, but also saying that being
Speaker 1: analytical about the pieces that make up people. You know,
Speaker 1: it's just being a journalist. If you could be a
Speaker 1: journalist of humanity and then try to emulate those things,
Speaker 1: you're a great actor. It doesn't mean you're Daniel day
Speaker 1: Lewis or Violet Davis. It means that you pay attention,
Speaker 1: and any of us have that ability. It's not like
Speaker 1: it's a messing. It's it's a human thing. Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: what I feel like a huge part of my job
Speaker 1: is understanding and observing human behavior, and that being able
Speaker 1: to unlock that behavior can very often unlock the physicality,
Speaker 1: the voice, that everything of a character. There's something really
Speaker 1: communal about the experience of watching film and TV. You know,
Speaker 1: people sometimes want to compliment me and say, wow, you,
Speaker 1: how did you do that character? And I'm like, I
Speaker 1: was doing you your How I did that character? You know,
Speaker 1: it's it's not as crazy or complex as people would think.
Speaker 1: If you can have the fearlessness and specificity to to
Speaker 1: dive into those things that you've experienced that role Tom
Speaker 1: Cruise played and topic Thunder. People are obsessed with that,
Speaker 1: you know, the man Tom Cruise, and it's like he's
Speaker 1: really he's doing what Dwayne Johnson did in the w
Speaker 1: w E, where he's taking some piece of him and
Speaker 1: then amplifying it to a psychotic degree that makes it entertaining.
Speaker 1: Tom Cruise, like many humans, has any ego. What if
Speaker 1: you took that anger and ego and amplified it to
Speaker 1: a billion you have less grossman. You know, doesn't mean
Speaker 1: times a bad guy. It means that we all have
Speaker 1: some ugly and some sin and some truth and reality
Speaker 1: to us. And if we choose to go ninety on
Speaker 1: a detour, that's what less Grossman looks like. You're going
Speaker 1: ninety miles an hour on a curvy detour exit. You know. Yeah.
Speaker 1: You bring up something else too that I think is
Speaker 1: is especially true. I've talked to a bunch of people
Speaker 1: about specificity and that unlocking the key to a character,
Speaker 1: unlocking a believability. People think it's about being universal, right,
Speaker 1: you create a universal character that more people will can
Speaker 1: relate to, But ultimately it's about finding those specific things.
Speaker 1: The guy who wraps the sandwich but then wipes it
Speaker 1: licks and wipes on his pants. Those two things don't
Speaker 1: go together, but they do because you saw it and
Speaker 1: it exists within him. Right, Oh, you just said everything, dude.
Speaker 1: It's it's that idea of I wrapped the sandwich as
Speaker 1: to not get my hands dirty, and then I get
Speaker 1: my hands dirty and I unconsciously I'm wiping them on
Speaker 1: my clothing, which is the very thing I uh seemed
Speaker 1: to protest or promulgate, you know. And that contradiction is
Speaker 1: is man, is that everywhere I did the show Kingdom
Speaker 1: with Frank Grillo about m M A Fighters and I
Speaker 1: was just a recurring guest star. But man, there was
Speaker 1: a day where I had seen with Matt Laurea in
Speaker 1: season one, and while I'm doing it, I thought, wouldn't
Speaker 1: it be funny if when I get at it Matt
Speaker 1: Laura's character, if I say this is fucking BS, so
Speaker 1: I'm abbreviating the word bullshit by saying BS, but then
Speaker 1: I'm saying this is fucking bs. Um. I just thought
Speaker 1: it was super funny, and I did it, and it
Speaker 1: cracks me up to this day thinking about it, because
Speaker 1: it's like the sandwich thing. I'm going to have the
Speaker 1: wrap around, but I'm gonna wipe my hands and my pants.
Speaker 1: And you know that that that's just sort of a
Speaker 1: hallmark of behavior. Is contradiction, being hypocritical, you know. And
Speaker 1: I think most things if you juxtapose and you bring
Speaker 1: comedy to drama, or you bring drama to comedy, or
Speaker 1: you bring calm and a horror film, or you bring
Speaker 1: a horror in a calm film, It's like contradiction is
Speaker 1: always going to be interesting, isn't it. That's right? Um.
Speaker 1: You book a few other things after traveling to Hollywood,
Speaker 1: including a show. You were allegedly a fan of Always
Speaker 1: Sunny in Philadelphia. Uh, oh man, Yeah, you're a fan
Speaker 1: of that show. I love that show. There's a big
Speaker 1: deal for me to go from like to go from
Speaker 1: watching It's Always Sunny in my underpants with four of
Speaker 1: my guy friends in college drinking watered down natural light
Speaker 1: type of beer cans to a year later getting the
Speaker 1: part and hanging out with Charlie Day and Glenn and
Speaker 1: Rob Like, that'surreal, man, that's like some weird, real life
Speaker 1: magic stuff. It was a big deal for me. And
Speaker 1: it's funny you bring that up because I had not
Speaker 1: seen Glenn Howardson or Charlie Day since I shot the show,
Speaker 1: like May June, And in the last week I have
Speaker 1: run into Glenn Howardson and Charlie Day both for the
Speaker 1: first time in twelve years. And it was such a funny, chummy,
Speaker 1: cozy little reunion of like, it's so fun to get
Speaker 1: to be giddy and catch each other up on our
Speaker 1: lives and to thank them properly for giving me a
Speaker 1: great gig. That meant a lot to me. And you know,
Speaker 1: those residuals matter. Now are times where I was waiting
Speaker 1: tables and had no money and all of a sudden
Speaker 1: residual for your episode of Sonny and that helps you
Speaker 1: pay your rent that month. I mean that I never
Speaker 1: forget that stuff. Man. Yeah, as you just alluded to you, well,
Speaker 1: the jobs dry up a little bit and you moved
Speaker 1: back to Michigan. Is that right? That sucked? And what
Speaker 1: was the decision there? You just you didn't have money
Speaker 1: or or what? Oh dude, man, thank god I persevered
Speaker 1: because that I couldn't easily given up, like given up
Speaker 1: giving up. In my first year in Hollywood, I did
Speaker 1: two independent films, an independent film with Aaron Paul and
Speaker 1: Jeff Daniels. I did that indie with Jennifer Connelly and
Speaker 1: Ed Harris. I had a lead role series Regular and
Speaker 1: a pilot presentation at CBS with Larry Charles and Aunt Hines. Wow.
Speaker 1: I had the guest star on It's Always Sunny and
Speaker 1: I had a co star on Community. So I booked
Speaker 1: five jobs in fourteen months, and I thought I was
Speaker 1: Mr Cool. I thought I was the next Jonah Hill.
Speaker 1: And true to form, you know, God humbled me and
Speaker 1: I couldn't. I couldn't find a day job out there.
Speaker 1: I applied to sixty seventy places on Craigslist. I couldn't
Speaker 1: get a job at Subway McDonald's, but I could get
Speaker 1: a guest star opposite Danny de Vito on It's Always Sunny.
Speaker 1: I mean, this is the world I was living in.
Speaker 1: I think I had a callbacker two for Bones. I
Speaker 1: went out for a guest star in some episode of
Speaker 1: Bones where I would play like a guy at a
Speaker 1: bowling alley or something that would have saved my ass.
Speaker 1: I needed that five hundred or five thousand dollar guest
Speaker 1: star on Bones to stay in l A. I was
Speaker 1: down to so I was sleeping on the floor of
Speaker 1: my buddy Matt Ryan's apartment. So things were getting bad.
Speaker 1: I remember I went on a date with a female
Speaker 1: friend of mine and I had two fifty bucks left
Speaker 1: in my name, I think, and I found out I
Speaker 1: didn't get Bones, so I took her out on a
Speaker 1: date to get sushi and go see this movie Source
Speaker 1: Code with Jake Killenhal And as we're saying goodbye in
Speaker 1: the arc Light parking lot area, she goes, let's go
Speaker 1: get protein shakes and go for a walk or hang
Speaker 1: on next week, and I I said her, I go,
Speaker 1: I can't she goes, why. I go up, I'm broke.
Speaker 1: I have to move home. And she goes, why did
Speaker 1: you take me out on a date and spend all
Speaker 1: that money. I go, I guess I wanted to go
Speaker 1: out of the bank, and I hugged her goodbye. I
Speaker 1: walked on Hollywood Boulevard. I walked past the Improv Olympic
Speaker 1: Io Theater, which I was a big fan of, and
Speaker 1: some guy sees me, this guy, Jeremy. He goes, Paul,
Speaker 1: what are you doing. I go, hey man, I'm like
Speaker 1: trying not to cry. I'm in a bad play emotionally.
Speaker 1: And he looked at me. He goes, you're going the
Speaker 1: wrong way, and he means, you're going the wrong way,
Speaker 1: like in prov Olympic. You're walking away from the theater.
Speaker 1: Come on in. But you know it's resonating with me,
Speaker 1: like you're going the wrong way, like you're leaving town.
Speaker 1: I crossed the street and I run into Tony Hawk
Speaker 1: and I'm like crying. My face is all blotchy. Tony
Speaker 1: Hawk is literally just walking side by side next to me.
Speaker 1: I look over and see him and I go, hey, man,
Speaker 1: I don't have anything to say about your skateboarding, but
Speaker 1: I just saw a source code. It was pretty good.
Speaker 1: He goes, Yeah, my nephew saw that. He said, that
Speaker 1: was pretty good. I gotta see that. Like just I'm
Speaker 1: talking the most surreal, weird moment of my life, crying
Speaker 1: saying goodbye to a woman I have this like affection for,
Speaker 1: and I'm saying goodbye to the city. I have a
Speaker 1: hundred thirty bucks to my name, and I think I
Speaker 1: flew home the next week, and I worked at a
Speaker 1: bowling alley. I worked, by the way, that's funny. I
Speaker 1: auditioned to play a guy in a bowling alley, and
Speaker 1: six months later, I'm working at a bowling alley in
Speaker 1: my hometown. And I worked at a grocery store in
Speaker 1: a bowling alley. I moved to Detroit to become a
Speaker 1: mortgage banker for seven weeks for Quicken Loans in one
Speaker 1: reverse mortgage for Dan Gilbert, the owner of the Cleveland Cavaliers. Yeah,
Speaker 1: so wait, you were given up, you were done. I
Speaker 1: just went home. I didn't have any money and I
Speaker 1: was sleeping on the floor, right, So it was just
Speaker 1: it was an untenable situation, right right, right. I just
Speaker 1: met being a mortgage broker that sounds like you're changing careers. No,
Speaker 1: that was just to make some money. Just to make
Speaker 1: some money, I thought, I'll do this for a year.
Speaker 1: I'll save up twenty grand, thirty grand, I'll move back
Speaker 1: to Alan, I'll be financially fiscally responsible, because you know,
Speaker 1: I was also just bad with money, man, due to
Speaker 1: regular day for me. I'd wake up at nine ten am,
Speaker 1: walk down to Solar Dick Colanga or cafe etcetera, Kids
Speaker 1: in four or Groundworks Coffee. It was like the Klanga strip,
Speaker 1: and I would just sit around all day eating like
Speaker 1: club sandwiches and drinking coffee and eating scones while like
Speaker 1: writing screenplays and running into comedians and people I admired.
Speaker 1: That was like every day in my life. I'm just
Speaker 1: dropping fifty six on diner food and chilling, and then
Speaker 1: at night I'm going to somebody's improv show and I'm
Speaker 1: getting drinks after and we're getting in and out. Like
Speaker 1: I was burning through money just being a slobby, you know, idiot,
Speaker 1: And uh, it caught up with me and I had
Speaker 1: to learn a hard lesson for sure. What brought you
Speaker 1: back to Los Angeles? A friend of a friend said, Hey,
Speaker 1: I read a pilot. He wrote, I watched your demo reel.
Speaker 1: I think you're really talented. You want to come crash
Speaker 1: on my couch for like a few hundred bucks. So
Speaker 1: I took this guy up on that, and I moved
Speaker 1: back to l A. I had done two levels of
Speaker 1: io theater and stand up in Chicago for six months
Speaker 1: while working at a Starbucks for like forty hours a week,
Speaker 1: so I had a little bit of money. I moved
Speaker 1: to l A January and I'll have been back ten
Speaker 1: years this January. And I took a bunch of odd jobs.
Speaker 1: I did everything from story producing for Food Network to
Speaker 1: stand up comedy to uh waiting tables and working at
Speaker 1: five Guys in Ventura Boulevard in Studio City. I mean,
Speaker 1: I jumped all over the place. And then eventually Kingdom,
Speaker 1: that show with Frank Grillo, that was my break. Season two.
Speaker 1: They said, hey, we're gonna bring you back. Instead of
Speaker 1: paying you a thousand bucks an episod, so we'll give you,
Speaker 1: you know, or six thousand, and we'll give you like
Speaker 1: ten or twelve episodes. And I was like, whoa, I
Speaker 1: get to quit my day job. Holy crap, and I
Speaker 1: I haven't had a day job since March of you
Speaker 1: do seven episodes of Kingdom, and then shortly around that
Speaker 1: time you book Tanya tell me about the audition. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I had a fun little streak in the autumn of
Speaker 1: where man, it's so fun to think about. I'm just
Speaker 1: grateful to God that I got the opportunity. Yeah. Sorry,
Speaker 1: Sometimes I just have a moment where I realized how
Speaker 1: blessed I am, and it's absurd. It's humbling. Man. I
Speaker 1: was running out of money fall of. I was wondering
Speaker 1: if I needed to get another day job. I was
Speaker 1: waiting on Kingdom to have me back for season four,
Speaker 1: I think it was, And sure enough, around my birthday
Speaker 1: October fifteen, I book an under five line on Superstore, UM,
Speaker 1: a small role in super Troopers too because I had
Speaker 1: become friendly with Kevin Heffernan. And then I book a pilot,
Speaker 1: a series regular role in a pilot for Lifetime where
Speaker 1: I'm playing opposite like legitimate actors like Eric Balfour and
Speaker 1: Dominic Kamanahan and um all these wonderful people. So I
Speaker 1: booked like three jobs in a month, and I was like, wow,
Speaker 1: you know, thank God, I'm I'm back in it. And
Speaker 1: I go shoot this pilot in Vancouver, and while I'm there,
Speaker 1: must have been the last like three days of filming.
Speaker 1: I was about to leave, like mid November, and I
Speaker 1: get an email about Titania and they say the script
Speaker 1: was on the Blacklist. It's a true story. They got Mario,
Speaker 1: Robbie and Alison Janney and it's the guy who directed
Speaker 1: Lars and the Real Girl. I'm like, dude, I'm used
Speaker 1: to like going out for guests stars on Two Broke Girls,
Speaker 1: and that's that's a good that's a good month for me. Like,
Speaker 1: what the hell is this? So I read the script
Speaker 1: and I'm laughing my ass off, and I'm like, this
Speaker 1: is like David o' russell and Christopher guests had some
Speaker 1: psychotic child. You know, this is so funny but heartbreaking
Speaker 1: and crazy but true. And I look at a picture
Speaker 1: of the real guy and I go, this is a
Speaker 1: very specific looking guy. There are not many men in
Speaker 1: Hollywood who can act at that level who looked like
Speaker 1: this slavish dude. Right, So I already know. I'm like,
Speaker 1: you know, if I if I grow the mustache out
Speaker 1: a little bit and I and I drill this, maybe
Speaker 1: I have a shot. So I go into audition, I
Speaker 1: think just before Thanksgiving, and there's a lot of different
Speaker 1: guys in in the room. It's like Haley, Joel Osmond
Speaker 1: and some massive pound dude and then Neil Casey from
Speaker 1: Upgrade Citizens Brigade. So it's like it's a real Hodge positive,
Speaker 1: just different looking white dudes. And I'm like, I don't
Speaker 1: know that they even know what they want, and I
Speaker 1: think they're kind of casting a big net. So I
Speaker 1: go up and and I do the scene that goes well,
Speaker 1: and I'm having a lot of fun. I'm not improvising.
Speaker 1: I'm just really trying to honor what's there and make
Speaker 1: everybody happy. And the next day my reps call me.
Speaker 1: They go, hey, man, you have a callback on Tuesday.
Speaker 1: And I always ask who the callback is with because
Speaker 1: I figure it's down to me and two or three
Speaker 1: other guys. That's what a callback is, right, And they
Speaker 1: see to me, they go, it's just you. I said,
Speaker 1: that doesn't sound like a callback. That sounds like something else.
Speaker 1: They go, we think they have an offer out to
Speaker 1: another actor. I go, oh, it's got to be like
Speaker 1: Josh Gadd or somebody really reputable who's gonna get it.
Speaker 1: That afternoon, they come back to me. They go, Hey,
Speaker 1: it's Josh Gadden, and I'm like, you's no freaking way
Speaker 1: I'm getting this. Josh has got frozen and he's worked
Speaker 1: with Kevin Hart and all these big people and and uh.
Speaker 1: Come to find out, it was like a scheduling thing.
Speaker 1: They wanted Josh, but he was also doing Kenneth Brana's
Speaker 1: murder on the Orient Express movie, I think, and it
Speaker 1: was in the middle of that whole deal. So I'm
Speaker 1: really nervous and I want the part so bad. The
Speaker 1: night before, mind you, I'll be a year sober from
Speaker 1: pot and alcohol October twenty six of this year. Don't
Speaker 1: vilify it, but it wasn't for me. Had to get
Speaker 1: away from it. So at this time I was smoking
Speaker 1: a lot of weed, and I'm like, you know what,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna get really high and I'm gonna get really stoned,
Speaker 1: and I'm gonna chill out about this thing. But I
Speaker 1: get really wickedly stoned the night before, and then the
Speaker 1: next morning I have a residual high where I'm almost
Speaker 1: high for the second audition, and I come in with
Speaker 1: a cookie and a coffee in a track suit and
Speaker 1: I'm literally sitting on the floor because there are no
Speaker 1: seats in the lobby, and all the people around me
Speaker 1: taking up the seats are little kids with dark hair
Speaker 1: who are all cursing to their parents and guardians because
Speaker 1: they're auditioning to play young Scarface. So I'm like borderline
Speaker 1: high and I'm like, this is the weirdest thing in
Speaker 1: the world, Like I'm just cracking up laughing. Uh. And
Speaker 1: and I hear somebody upstairs screaming, like an angry guy screaming,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, who the hell is that? And then
Speaker 1: he walks down. That's Aaron Paul auditioning for Galulee. And
Speaker 1: he walks past Billy Magnus and who's got a mustache
Speaker 1: to play Galulee. And it, once again it adds to
Speaker 1: the weirdness because I hadn't seen Aaron in years, and
Speaker 1: he looks like he's ready to kill somebody. And this
Speaker 1: other guy's got a mustache and looks exactly like Jeff Galulee.
Speaker 1: And I'm like, this is such a circus. So I
Speaker 1: go upstairs and I literally I acted like I didn't
Speaker 1: even care. I did the part really well, but like
Speaker 1: I was very much like I think my parting words
Speaker 1: were you. Guys, this project is awesome. Whether you choose
Speaker 1: me or not, You're about to have a lot of fun.
Speaker 1: I'm excited for you, guys. So if I don't see it,
Speaker 1: if I don't see you enjoy the film. Man kind
Speaker 1: of went out with one of those every time I've
Speaker 1: said that in audition, I get the part. I don't
Speaker 1: know what it is. There's something to it because it's
Speaker 1: worked every time. And I got the part. And were
Speaker 1: you proud of the movie when it when you saw it?
Speaker 1: I I kind of loved the movie because it does
Speaker 1: a lot of things I like in my entertainment that
Speaker 1: I watch. I cared about the characters. I laughed out loud.
Speaker 1: I felt like it handled dark comedy really well, kind
Speaker 1: of like the Cohen Brothers do or David or Russell.
Speaker 1: And I thought I did a good job. Like I
Speaker 1: I enjoyed my own performance and thought like, way to go,
Speaker 1: PAULI you did it, buddy. Yeah. I was just proud
Speaker 1: to be coming off the bench and showing up with them.
Speaker 1: And and it did provide a lot of new opportunities
Speaker 1: and and new relationships which helped. Yeah, And once again,
Speaker 1: it didn't change my life, right, away. It really didn't.
Speaker 1: I I shot the film, and I had some money
Speaker 1: in my pocket, but it wasn't a lot of money.
Speaker 1: It got me through the year, and then you know,
Speaker 1: Black Klansman was was a nice thing where I came
Speaker 1: back from Tiff where IONI did really well, and I
Speaker 1: auditioned for Black Clansmen, and I just I had a
Speaker 1: lot of confidence because I Tany did so well at
Speaker 1: Tiff that it kind of propelled my confidence to walk
Speaker 1: in and do a director session with Spike Lee and
Speaker 1: just be myself and improvised and do all the things
Speaker 1: I do. And Spike asked for my cell phone number,
Speaker 1: and he was like totally on board, Like I totally
Speaker 1: get who you are. I totally get what you do.
Speaker 1: Let's do this. He asked for your cell phone number
Speaker 1: in the audition? Is that right? Yeah? Which is nuts?
Speaker 1: I mean, who's That's never happened to me? And so
Speaker 1: there I am with itania coming out Black Clansmen in
Speaker 1: post production, but I still you know, I did New
Speaker 1: New York local higher for Black Plans. I think I
Speaker 1: made like ten grand and after I tied to my
Speaker 1: church and I give to my agents and managers and
Speaker 1: taxes or whatever. I probably only made like six grand
Speaker 1: on Black Clansmen. So I borrowed ten grand from my
Speaker 1: parents retirement fund January just to get by and not
Speaker 1: have to get a day job again. And then I
Speaker 1: signed up CIA and things started. The ball started rolling
Speaker 1: between having great agents and having Spike in Margo in
Speaker 1: my corner. You know that gets around, and and I
Speaker 1: did like five jobs and it just spiraled and rolled,
Speaker 1: and I started working and doing stuff I was really
Speaker 1: proud of. Yeah, um, you finished two big movies and
Speaker 1: then you are cast as the title character in Richard Jewel.
Speaker 1: Now I have to tell you something I don't know.
Speaker 1: I'm assuming you don't know this. I was in Centennial
Speaker 1: Park when the bomb went off. Oh I did not
Speaker 1: know that. Yeah, this is before cell phone, so this
Speaker 1: is ninety s. And I went in the House of
Speaker 1: Blues alone, had three buddies I was meeting and couldn't
Speaker 1: find them, and I went outside to a pay phone
Speaker 1: in Centennial Park, called my parents and said, hey, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna get on. They call it Martha, the subway stop
Speaker 1: that went out towards my parents house. But that I
Speaker 1: was still going to need to be to be picked
Speaker 1: up from there and I hung up the phone and
Speaker 1: the bomb went off, and I still remember the sensation.
Speaker 1: What I didn't experience was allowed sound like a bomb.
Speaker 1: My overall experience was like it was devoid of sound,
Speaker 1: Like it was like it went off, and then it
Speaker 1: was that right afterward, it was almost like the sound
Speaker 1: all of the sound got sucked out of everything. And
Speaker 1: I just immediately went to the subway station to try
Speaker 1: to get the hell out of there. It was very
Speaker 1: clear what had happened. And I will never forget this
Speaker 1: that I got to an escalator to go down to
Speaker 1: get on the subway and I go through. I'm alone
Speaker 1: to granted, with no cell phone. And by the way,
Speaker 1: what are my parents doing at home? They're watching Olympic coverage,
Speaker 1: so they see they know where I am, and they
Speaker 1: see that this bomb has gone off, and there's no
Speaker 1: way for me to communicate. I just had to get
Speaker 1: out of there. Yeah, Ce, I go down the escalator
Speaker 1: and they stopped the people right behind me, and in
Speaker 1: conversations with some other police officers at the bottom. The
Speaker 1: reason they did that is if you're really trying to
Speaker 1: hurt people, I guess you put a bomb off and
Speaker 1: then you put off bombs where people are going to
Speaker 1: go shortly after that, and everything at that point, you know,
Speaker 1: was fine. I met, but I had very nervous and
Speaker 1: worried parents who for forty five minutes to an hour
Speaker 1: or whatever, had no idea where I was or what
Speaker 1: actually had happened as they were watching it unfold. So
Speaker 1: my point being, this movie I was very much looking
Speaker 1: forward to because I lived it. Yeah, I was there. Um,
Speaker 1: I'm told that your photo was on the board in
Speaker 1: the production office and they said that they were looking
Speaker 1: for someone that looked like this. Is that true? Yeah? Man,
Speaker 1: it was so weird how that happened. So apparently Jeff
Speaker 1: mcclad is the casting rector for Eastwood and they were
Speaker 1: trying to figure out who could play Richard Jewel. Now,
Speaker 1: mind you, at the time it was supposed to be
Speaker 1: Leo and Jonah. They were hot off of Wolf Wall
Speaker 1: Street and wanted to work together again, and Joan was
Speaker 1: gonna play Richard, Leo was gonna play the attorney Watson Bryant,
Speaker 1: and you know, Eastwood was considering like who else could
Speaker 1: play it, I guess, and Jeff mcclatt and Jessica Meyer,
Speaker 1: they showed him a photo of me that that they
Speaker 1: put up as a sample, and Eastwood just looks at
Speaker 1: the photo and he pauses. He goes, who is that guy?
Speaker 1: And then he pauses and he goes, yeah, I think
Speaker 1: that's the guy. And they're like, what do you what
Speaker 1: do you mean you think that's the guy. He's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I think that's the guy. And they're like, well, we'll
Speaker 1: bring you some tape on him, so you know what
Speaker 1: you're getting. And they showed him my demo reel with
Speaker 1: scenes from Kingdom and Ionia and Black Klansman, and he goes, yeah,
Speaker 1: he could do it, and like said it nonchalantly, like
Speaker 1: he can do it. That's the guy. So I'm in
Speaker 1: Thailand shooting to five Bloods, this war film for Spike,
Speaker 1: which would prove to be, you know, one of Chadwick
Speaker 1: Boseman's last films and one of Spike's greatest. I think
Speaker 1: I'm kind of going through a rough patch where I'm
Speaker 1: alone in a country I've never been. I'm trying to
Speaker 1: be sober and and I'm kind of depressed and not
Speaker 1: in a good place. And I got offered the TV
Speaker 1: version of Richard Jewell for a lot of money. More
Speaker 1: than I had ever made, that's for sure. And then
Speaker 1: three days later I get this call saying Cling Eastwood
Speaker 1: wants to play Richard Jewel in the movie. I told
Speaker 1: Cia and my manager Brian Walsh, I'm like, guys, am
Speaker 1: I getting offered the same character and opposing projects seventy
Speaker 1: two hours like between each other, Like what the hell
Speaker 1: is going on? Ever ever happened in the history of Hollywood.
Speaker 1: And it got to the point where the casting director
Speaker 1: is like, well, now I heard Paul might do Eastwoods movie,
Speaker 1: and I'm like, I don't even have an offer. I'm
Speaker 1: just like getting a horrible confirmation from my reps. So
Speaker 1: it got down to the wire and they're offering me
Speaker 1: more money than any one of my family's ever made
Speaker 1: in a year to do Richard Julu TV show. And
Speaker 1: then verbally Clint goes, come to my movie. But Clint,
Speaker 1: the project was at Fox, Disney bought Fox, and Clint
Speaker 1: only works with Warner Brothers. So there's a whole fiasco
Speaker 1: behind the scenes about getting the rights to the movie
Speaker 1: that has not been ironed out yet. So it comes
Speaker 1: down to the wire and my reps go, you gotta choose,
Speaker 1: and I said, man, you can only operate out of
Speaker 1: fear of love. The Bible talks about perfect love casting
Speaker 1: fear out. Fear would tell me to take the paycheck
Speaker 1: for the show. Love would tell me to work with
Speaker 1: Clint Eastwood. Tell him I'm working with Clint Eastwood. So
Speaker 1: my reps are ecstatic. And then I had to sit
Speaker 1: with that decision for three more weeks in Thailand for
Speaker 1: I get back to the States and hope to God
Speaker 1: that the movie's happening. So I turned down like seven
Speaker 1: eight hundred thousand dollars for a movie that might happen
Speaker 1: with no offer on the table from Eastwood. Unbelie, I
Speaker 1: go back to l A. I meet with Clint on
Speaker 1: the Warner lot. Sure enough, he got the rights, and
Speaker 1: that journey making that movie was the best job I've
Speaker 1: ever had. I met my wife via a dating app
Speaker 1: while I was filming the movie. We now have a
Speaker 1: son together. Like that movie changed my life and and
Speaker 1: I'm forever grateful that Clint took a chance on me,
Speaker 1: because I think the studio wanted a movie start, and uh,
Speaker 1: they got me instead. You know, well, I think you're
Speaker 1: a movie start now, my friend. I'm just gonna I'm
Speaker 1: just gonna point that out, So I think they ended
Speaker 1: up getting you and a movie start. Did you spend
Speaker 1: any time with Bobby richards mom? I met her on
Speaker 1: the Warner lot with Watson Bryant, the attorney, and they
Speaker 1: were so easy going, They were so supportive, both huge
Speaker 1: fans of Clint, which it helps one the boss is
Speaker 1: there to shake hands, kissed babies, take selfies. I asked
Speaker 1: some questions about Richard. I said, what kind of food
Speaker 1: did he eat? What kind of movies did he watch?
Speaker 1: Like I wanted all the day to day particulars because
Speaker 1: all the dramas in the script, I don't have to
Speaker 1: ask them. Was Richard afraid when they pinned the bombing
Speaker 1: on it? Like I don't need to ask about the bombing,
Speaker 1: I need to ask about who he was as a man.
Speaker 1: And you know, it seemed like he was a bit
Speaker 1: of a teacher's pet to his own detriment, where he
Speaker 1: wanted to people please and love people and serve people,
Speaker 1: but um also felt undermined and underutilized and kind of
Speaker 1: hurt by the comments and jokes of other people. And
Speaker 1: I think it also made him an angry, sort of
Speaker 1: unrestful creature. So that's what I last onto and getting
Speaker 1: their sign off, you know, like I I tell people
Speaker 1: in interviews, I say, I got on the red carpet
Speaker 1: and was going to the premiere for Richard Jewel in November,
Speaker 1: and Bobby Julian Watson Bryant told me watching you was
Speaker 1: like having Richard back for two hours. And I was like,
Speaker 1: That's how arrogant and ego filled and stupid would it
Speaker 1: be to care about awards season or the tomato meter
Speaker 1: on Rotten Tomatoes When the people who loved him and
Speaker 1: knew him best felt they got to experience him again
Speaker 1: through our story. We told like, nothing's better than that, Like,
Speaker 1: are you kidding me? So I was really proud of
Speaker 1: the film and it made me a better actor, and
Speaker 1: it I made such great friends from it, where Sam
Speaker 1: Rockwell and I now will text each other YouTube videos,
Speaker 1: and you know, to think I got to work with
Speaker 1: one of my heroes and I got to bring some
Speaker 1: piece of even minute closure to the Jewel family in
Speaker 1: that community that that means the world to me. It's
Speaker 1: got to be like a Hollywood first. I don't know
Speaker 1: if it's a first, but that you have played now
Speaker 1: in your really young career. Three iconic roles where you're
Speaker 1: playing real, live people, like people that existed before. I
Speaker 1: was talking to um Kevin Pollock, who was amazing stand
Speaker 1: up comedian. It was talking about finding the key and
Speaker 1: that once you find the key to a person, then
Speaker 1: the impersonation, if you will, becomes very simple. But it's
Speaker 1: about finding that key. Are you looking for a key? Yeah?
Speaker 1: I think I think the key is knowing who they
Speaker 1: are as a person, rather than who they are as
Speaker 1: some constructed life event. You know, when you go to
Speaker 1: play a serial killer, you got to learn who they
Speaker 1: are because if you're just watching serial killer documentaries or
Speaker 1: YouTube clips that Charlie Manson, It's like that's like that's
Speaker 1: like saying I'm gonna learn how to be a chef
Speaker 1: because I spent a lot of time at restaurants, Like
Speaker 1: they just doesn't really make sense. Uh So with Larry
Speaker 1: Hall and Blackbird, it was all about what does he
Speaker 1: want and what are his defects? With Sean Eckhart and
Speaker 1: itonia same thing. Richard Jewel, It's like these guys are
Speaker 1: broken people who have probably misconstrued the heart of masculinity,
Speaker 1: which is responsibility, and they think that masculinity is something
Speaker 1: where you you're in charge, or you're an authority, or
Speaker 1: your exacting revenge on those who would hurt you, or
Speaker 1: your ideology. And so I think I've gotten to explore
Speaker 1: that and make it honest. And you know, if I'm saying,
Speaker 1: what is the key to those guys, he to Shawan
Speaker 1: Eckhard is the spirit of religion. He has bought into
Speaker 1: this thing so much that if you showed him the
Speaker 1: truth in plain sight, he wouldn't know it. With Richard Jewell,
Speaker 1: it's all about duty. You're in a place of service
Speaker 1: and duty. A lot of that duty was not breaking
Speaker 1: down and crying all the time. You know. My greatest
Speaker 1: joy with Richard Jewel was how do I try to
Speaker 1: hold back the tears until the diner scene and then
Speaker 1: let it all, let the damn break and let the
Speaker 1: flood flow. So yeah, I think religion, duty. And then
Speaker 1: with Blackbird Larry Hall, the key to him is deception.
Speaker 1: I've always said that evil's highest honor is deception. You know,
Speaker 1: It's it's this prank with dire consequences for the victim,
Speaker 1: and my character had been deceived, and then he chose
Speaker 1: to deceive. It's just a very sad, dark thing to
Speaker 1: partake in. And you know, I'm glad there isn't a
Speaker 1: season two of that show because I couldn't do it.
Speaker 1: I couldn't play that guy another Even when people asked
Speaker 1: me to do the voice to make them laugh and
Speaker 1: can you do the high pitched voice, It's like, I
Speaker 1: don't mind doing it for them for a second, but
Speaker 1: it's like, I'm not looking to even joke about that guy.
Speaker 1: I don't love joking about him because it it was
Speaker 1: a real thing that happened. Yeah, I heard that you
Speaker 1: actually lowered the octave of his voice because his was
Speaker 1: even higher. Is that true? Oh my goodness. There was
Speaker 1: nothing to research Brian. Like Richard Jewel and Sean Eckhart,
Speaker 1: I had all his video footage. It was like cheating.
Speaker 1: I literally felt like I was cheating where I could
Speaker 1: just imitate and and try to live in those things
Speaker 1: they were doing. But with Larry Hall, there was nothing
Speaker 1: but a twelve second audio clip and some random news
Speaker 1: documentary about the killings, and in it his voice was
Speaker 1: slower and at times just like psychotically high. I thought
Speaker 1: to myself, I'm like, well, if I do this for
Speaker 1: six episodes, At some point the audience is going to
Speaker 1: have some fatigue. Worst case scenario, it could turn into
Speaker 1: like an SNL mad TV character, right, So I thought,
Speaker 1: I'll lower the register, and then Dennis Lehane helped me
Speaker 1: figure out that we can raise the register and make
Speaker 1: it higher pitch when the character is lying or trying
Speaker 1: to put on this character. I noticed that. That's amazing,
Speaker 1: and you know, I couldn't have done that without Dennis's help.
Speaker 1: We discovered that together, and he helped me play clean
Speaker 1: up and find a way to use the voice to
Speaker 1: to our advantage. And I really hope it's not distracting.
Speaker 1: I apologize to people if it is. But you know,
Speaker 1: mahrshe l Ali in Green Book The Real Guy, he
Speaker 1: played that doctor and the musician. He apparently his voice
Speaker 1: was cartoonishly distractingly high and he had to kind of
Speaker 1: cut cut it down and dilute it. The best thing
Speaker 1: to do for any actors listening is try to find
Speaker 1: a real way to present that voice. And if you
Speaker 1: end up and elating or imitating something cerebral or spiritual
Speaker 1: about the person, it will come off as though you're
Speaker 1: imitating them perfectly, rather than look at me raising my
Speaker 1: eyebrow the way they raised their eyebrow. You know. It's
Speaker 1: it's not always about the exactitude of a visual, it's
Speaker 1: about the exactitude of the intention. If that makes sense. Yes,
Speaker 1: if anyone hasn't seen it, Blackbird streaming now, Paul gives
Speaker 1: just a brilliant performance. I'll call it brilliant. I I
Speaker 1: was really taken with what we talked about before, the
Speaker 1: dichotomy within the character, his level of I guess knowing.
Speaker 1: I don't know. I don't know how to say it,
Speaker 1: his level of of um. Are you trying to get
Speaker 1: at the cognizance the character was like self aware coming unaware. Yes, yes,
Speaker 1: I think that's it. I think that that dichotomy between yes,
Speaker 1: what he was aware of of, how he was perceived,
Speaker 1: how he perceived himself, his deception. I mean, it's really
Speaker 1: hard to play dumb, right, like they they say, that's
Speaker 1: that's one of the most difficult things, is to play
Speaker 1: dumb and not be dumb. You know, to what degree
Speaker 1: as as you're watching the story unfold, how much he
Speaker 1: is aware and his is not the puppet but the
Speaker 1: puppet master. I don't know. I don't know if I'm
Speaker 1: saying it in any articulate way, but no, you're you're
Speaker 1: You're getting at all of it with the contextual clues here,
Speaker 1: which is this idea of balancing um truth with fabrication,
Speaker 1: knowing when to be truthful or fabricated based on who
Speaker 1: you're around or what you're trying to get at, and
Speaker 1: then also playing the character as someone who is kind of,
Speaker 1: you know, in sort of a disease state where sometimes
Speaker 1: you're not aware how sick you are. That is a
Speaker 1: weird thing to play to try to balance that and
Speaker 1: make decisions on what the characters thinking or how they're feeling,
Speaker 1: you know. And I hope I encapsulated that with whatever
Speaker 1: the hell I just said. Maybe I made it more. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I might have been like, so I think I think
Speaker 1: I was like, let me take you out of this
Speaker 1: labyrinth and put you in a spider's web. I apologize, Um,
Speaker 1: I think a lot of it, man is layering thoughts.
Speaker 1: And I'll give you exactly what this is if you
Speaker 1: and I go out to brunch, which I sure as
Speaker 1: I'll hope we do sometimes. But when you and I,
Speaker 1: when you and I go out to brunch, we can
Speaker 1: hold the conversation while I still have these monitors up.
Speaker 1: You know, Jay Moore talked about how he used to
Speaker 1: go on stage and the word monitors. I'm looking at
Speaker 1: her cleavage while clocking the fact that the air conditioning
Speaker 1: is on way too high and I'm freezing cold. While
Speaker 1: on stage someone's laughing with their laughter is distracting. It's
Speaker 1: too loud. Are they mocking me? Like you and I
Speaker 1: can have a conversation a brunch and I'm still thinking
Speaker 1: of seventeen different things, not because I'm not listening to you,
Speaker 1: because I'm a human. So I think with Larry it
Speaker 1: was always about layering your thoughts, layering your intentions, and
Speaker 1: sewing in joy or pain to every moment. Anybody can
Speaker 1: do it. But it's also like it's kind of like
Speaker 1: the drummer who sings with the microphone next to the symbol.
Speaker 1: You know, you can do it. Anybody could if they practice,
Speaker 1: but you are having to play two instruments at once.
Speaker 1: For that type of character, you have to drum and
Speaker 1: do the kick pedal and use your hands while singing. Not,
Speaker 1: thank god, not every characters like that, or I'd probably
Speaker 1: go nuts. But I can do it once a year,
Speaker 1: once every year and a half where you gotta do
Speaker 1: a character like that. I can't believe you just use
Speaker 1: that example. I've said this before, but I'm going to
Speaker 1: tell you, Um, the nerdiest writer room joke on the
Speaker 1: office is what you just said. That they made Kevin
Speaker 1: Malone the lead singer and drummer of a police cover
Speaker 1: band because the singing is not on the beat of
Speaker 1: the drums. So in order to be the lead singer
Speaker 1: and drummer of a police cover band, you would have
Speaker 1: to be a musical savant and a genius. But that's
Speaker 1: why they that was there, like they thought that was hilarious.
Speaker 1: That was their inside joke that nobody, of course ever got,
Speaker 1: but that Kevin Malone was a musical genius. But that's
Speaker 1: what you're talking about, Yes, having to do having to
Speaker 1: do that. Um, what do you think that Larry's greatest
Speaker 1: need was? Well, what a question. I've done so many interviews.
Speaker 1: I don't think anybody's asked me that. Notice I'm usually
Speaker 1: rocket fire and rant you with these answers. This is
Speaker 1: clearly when I haven't been asked. Uh. I think his
Speaker 1: greatest need is something we all need, which is um,
Speaker 1: self love and self forgiveness. If he was really cutting
Speaker 1: off fingers, to take rings off dead bodies and graveyards
Speaker 1: as a child, Pretty sure you carry that into adulthood
Speaker 1: and feel like there's something fundamentally wrong with you and
Speaker 1: that you're bad. You pair that with some social awkwardness
Speaker 1: and maybe even the medical issue of having been a
Speaker 1: twin and having the other twin get more nutrients or
Speaker 1: whatever they think might may have happened. That's a cocktail
Speaker 1: for for disaster, not serial killer disaster. He had to
Speaker 1: make choices to go down that route. But some people
Speaker 1: are putting a disadvantage and he absolutely was. And had
Speaker 1: he found God or found relationships that were purest and
Speaker 1: found some acceptance for self and acceptance communally, had he
Speaker 1: found self love and self forgiveness. Uh, And I in
Speaker 1: no way think you would have been a serial killer.
Speaker 1: I just don't think so. And it's been proven. You know,
Speaker 1: I'm raising a son right now. I have a sixteen
Speaker 1: and a half month old son named Harris. And you
Speaker 1: gotta be careful. You raised boys, man, not just kids,
Speaker 1: I mean boys. It is so easy to just let
Speaker 1: them fall into this world of pornography and video game
Speaker 1: marathons and junk food behavior and and suddenly they think
Speaker 1: being a man is having freedom and being loud or
Speaker 1: having secrets or whatever this is. And and I think
Speaker 1: Larry Hall is just this completely fucked story of a
Speaker 1: young man who never had a chance. And it's sad. Man,
Speaker 1: he was a baby. He was a baby like the
Speaker 1: rest of us. And then X amount of circumstances and
Speaker 1: lack of guidance or two to ledge your love, you
Speaker 1: got a serial killer. So it's a I think you
Speaker 1: needed love and forgiveness, is my guest, which is something
Speaker 1: we all need. Yeah, um, Cobra Kai, Yeah, let's bring
Speaker 1: it up. Let's bring it back up. Cobra kai Is.
Speaker 1: Season five is out and uh Stingray is alive and well,
Speaker 1: I hope people watch him. I read that most people
Speaker 1: stop you about the last couple of weeks. I've run
Speaker 1: into producers like Brian Grazer and Jerry Bruckheimer. None of
Speaker 1: them know who the hell I am. And I don't
Speaker 1: say that like the grudgingly or negatively. I just like, factually,
Speaker 1: there's a massive amount of people in Hollywood and our
Speaker 1: industry who have no idea who I am. But people
Speaker 1: on the street like freak out and yell stingray from
Speaker 1: three blocks away, and like if I if I see.
Speaker 1: I was at Santa Bar with my wife and my
Speaker 1: son and we saw this this kid wearing a Cobra
Speaker 1: Kai shirt, and I just walked up to him and
Speaker 1: surprised him and said, hey, it's sting right, you know,
Speaker 1: not because I'll feel good if I'm recognized. It's just
Speaker 1: this thing of like if I were that kid, and
Speaker 1: I were a Cobra Kai fan, and a cast member
Speaker 1: from the show just showed up on my vacation and
Speaker 1: took a photo of me and high five me like
Speaker 1: I would, it would be like magic or something, you know.
Speaker 1: And there's nothing I like more than giving people those moments.
Speaker 1: And that's that's been the fun of all this is
Speaker 1: I make a living being creative, and it's it's wonderful.
Speaker 1: But it's also I get to give back in effortless ways.
Speaker 1: It cost me nothing to take two minutes to make
Speaker 1: a nine year old feel like a million dollars. You know.
Speaker 1: That's really fun. That's awesome. People ask me, they're like,
Speaker 1: why do you do you you were the star of
Speaker 1: a Clue Eastwood movie. Why would you do Cobra Kai.
Speaker 1: It's like, because it's fun, I need money, and it
Speaker 1: makes people happy like that. Those are three very good
Speaker 1: reasons to do something. You know, I might be in
Speaker 1: Cobra Ki season twelve. I have no idea, but I
Speaker 1: do know what pays. I have fun and it makes
Speaker 1: people happy. That's awesome. Um, your favorite charity, serv l A.
Speaker 1: Tell me a little bit about that and why it's
Speaker 1: so important to you, dude. Thanks for bringing that up.
Speaker 1: Serve l A is a wonderful organization in the heart
Speaker 1: of Hollywood. What they do is they they serve and
Speaker 1: feed the homeless community in Hollywood in particular, so they
Speaker 1: serve two people a day. They do a breakfast in
Speaker 1: a dinner. They give out free showers and free clothing
Speaker 1: to people, and they learned their names and they greet them,
Speaker 1: and they they have waiters and waitresses in a cafeteria
Speaker 1: setting like they're at a restaurant, and they're given real
Speaker 1: silverware like metal forks and spoons and knives and plates,
Speaker 1: so that there's some dignity. They're not just being given
Speaker 1: a cellophane wrap sandwich and sent on their way and
Speaker 1: told they can't use the bathroom because of a COVID law.
Speaker 1: That's what attracted me to them, and you know, I'm
Speaker 1: just trying to raise awareness and hopefully raise some money.
Speaker 1: My birthday is next month. I turned thirty six and
Speaker 1: I'm also celebrating one year sobriety. So for my birthday,
Speaker 1: I'm gonna put on a little fundraiser to raise awareness.
Speaker 1: And normally people are like, can I buy you a
Speaker 1: drink or buy a shot for your birthday? It's like
Speaker 1: I have something else. I'd love people to give their
Speaker 1: time or money or effort too, and I hope they'll
Speaker 1: check it out and go to the website or something.
Speaker 1: UM Serve l A is is doing grassroots loving on
Speaker 1: the homeless community and they do it with a lot
Speaker 1: of dignity. Dude, you're awesome. Yeah, I'm gonna I'm gonna
Speaker 1: buy you a drink next month through UM through Serve
Speaker 1: l A. Thanks man, that's awesome. Yeah, dude, you're awesome.
Speaker 1: I'm such a big, big fan of yours and now
Speaker 1: getting to chat with you, truly you're an even better person.
Speaker 1: So God bless you, and thank you so much for
Speaker 1: coming on and talk to me. I appreciate it so much.
Speaker 1: Thanks for enteritaining me for so many years. Man, God
Speaker 1: bless you. Thank you dude. Thanks Paul, it was so
Speaker 1: great talking to you today. Thank you for swinging by
Speaker 1: and having this conversation with me. I am a huge
Speaker 1: fan and I will be watching anything and everything that
Speaker 1: you come out with. Next to everyone else who came
Speaker 1: along today's journey. Thank you as always, we couldn't do
Speaker 1: it without you. Why would we make sure to follow
Speaker 1: us on at Off the Beat, share some of your
Speaker 1: ideas of who we should have on the pod, and
Speaker 1: I will be back next Tuesday with another episode that
Speaker 1: I think you might like. Yeah, yeah, I think you
Speaker 1: might like it a lot. And that's all I'm gonna say.
Speaker 1: Have a great week. Everybody. Off the Beat is hosted
Speaker 1: an executive produced by me Brian Baumgartner, alongside our executive
Speaker 1: producer Langley. Our producers are Diego Tapia, Liz Hayes, Hannah Harris,
Speaker 1: and Emily Carr. Our talent producer is Ryan Papa Zachary,
Speaker 1: and our intern is Sammy Cats. Our theme song Bubble
Speaker 1: and Squeak, performed by my great friend Creed Bratton